the fallacy of infants baptisme discovered. or, five arguments, to prove that infants ought not to be baptized. delivered in private by captain hobson, who should that day (with master knowls, and some others;) have discussed the thing in publike with master callamy, and master cranford, &c. and now published for the benefit of those that seeke the truth in love. hobson, paul. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a86419 of text r200461 in the english short title catalog (thomason e311_18). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 37 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 12 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a86419 wing h2272 thomason e311_18 estc r200461 99861201 99861201 113329 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a86419) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 113329) images scanned from microfilm: (thomason tracts ; 51:e311[18]) the fallacy of infants baptisme discovered. or, five arguments, to prove that infants ought not to be baptized. delivered in private by captain hobson, who should that day (with master knowls, and some others;) have discussed the thing in publike with master callamy, and master cranford, &c. and now published for the benefit of those that seeke the truth in love. hobson, paul. s. s. [6], 2, 15, [1] p. [s.n.], london. : printed in the yeer of discoveries. 1645. editor's note "to the courteous reader" signed: s.s. page numbers 1-2 repeated. annotation on thomason copy: "decemb: 10th". reproduction of the original in the british library. eng infant baptism -early works to 1800. a86419 r200461 (thomason e311_18). civilwar no the fallacy of infants baptisme discovered. or, five arguments, to prove that infants ought not to be baptized.: delivered in private by ca hobson, paul. 1645 6737 6 0 0 0 0 0 9 b the rate of 9 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the b category of texts with fewer than 10 defects per 10,000 words. 2008-10 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2008-12 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2009-01 scott lepisto sampled and proofread 2009-01 scott lepisto text and markup reviewed and edited 2009-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the fallacy of infants baptisme discovered . or , five arguments , to prove that infants ought not to be baptized . delivered in private by captain hobson , who should that day ( with master knowls , and some others ; ) have discussed the thing in publike with master callamy , and master cranford , &c. and now published for the benefit of those that seeke the truth in love . col. 2.23 . which things have indeed a shew of wisdome in will worship . isai. 1.12 . who hath required this at your hands ? london , printed in the yeer of discoveries . 1645. to the courteous reader . reader , i who am one that waits upon truth , desiring to know truth , but am not to be considered under any of those names of distinction , as a member of any independent congregation , or one that they call an anabaptist , but a friend to them and others , so far as they are one with the truth : i having by a providence , had an oportunity to hear one captain hobson ( with two ministers more ) in private , who should have disputed in publike with master callamy and some others , about the point of baptisme , having taken the heads of what captain hobson delivered , and conceiving that the good which i received by it , should engage me to communicate it to others , i was therefore willing to put it forth in print . but i desire you ( christian reader ) that you would consider that it is but the heads of what hee delivered , as i tooke it from him in short-hand , and therefore if there be any broken expressions in it , attribute it not to him , but to me , who am not so well skild ( as in understanding , so ) in writing syllogismes , which ( i understand ) he was enjoyned so to speak , had he spoke in publike , and he seemed to be willing to speake in private , as he should have done there . there was two ministers more who exercised also , whose arguments were worthy the printing , could i have taken them so as to bring them out but not taking of them so perfectly , i was loath to dishonour that truth that i believe was in them . my desire is , that neither i nor you , may so look upon this , under the consideration of that division that seems to be amongst men of presbyterians and anabaptists , and separatists , but that these names of distinction may bee laid down , and that we may all as sonnes of truth , try every thing by the rules of truth , and love each other in truth , which i know is that which would put an end to that great confusion and trouble that i see abroad . and i hope when you have read this , you will see ( as well as i ) that we have for a long time been led in blindnesse , taking that upon trust , which now i see is contrary to scripture , even infants baptisme . so desiring you to passe by infirmities in it , and make a good construction of it , i leave you to truth , desiring you not to have any prejudiciall thoughts against him that spake it , notwithstanding any infirmities you may see in him that writes it . yours in the lord jesus , s.s. the fallacy of infants baptisme discovered . dearest freinds : seeing a providence hath brought us together at this time , i shall therefore endevour , according to the intent of our meeting to declare my selfe , and so declare my selfe , that i may not only answer your expectations , but directly our intentions , in speaking to the point in hand , which this day should have been discussed in publike : but seeing a providence hath prevented us ; and wee who thought to have been in publike , are now prevented by the civill magistrate , whom wee much honour ; and with all willing subjection , are willing to obey in all things that crosse not the lord jesus christ : and truly here is that which stayes our spirits , though wee were willing to declare our judgments in publike , to the view of many ; yet if god will have it other wayes , herein is our joy that the truth knowes how best to make out it selfe ; and it god by our silence , will cause truth to speake , wee rejoyce : or if the time is not yet come to have things brought to a publike view , wee desire to wayte upon god , knowing that his time is best to make out truth to the sons of men . but before i addresse my selfe to what i intend to speake , i desire that you would give mee leave to speake to two or three things : first , to desire you not to thinke it strange that not onely one , but two , or three should speak to one , and the same thing . secondly , that you would not think it strange for us to trade so much in the shadow , in breaking up the shell , and not a little to trade in the kernell ; my meaning is , that wee should speake so much of the outward ordinance ; and not enter into the unfolding of the sweet , and glorious mystery of god in christ , wrapt up in the ordinance , which is the life as of the ordinance , so of saints while they are observing it . thirdly , i desire that you would not thinke it strange for mee to speake to you , contrary to my wonted practice , which i shall at this time doe , onely speaking in a syllogisticall way ; for the truth is , i shall here endeavour to declare my selfe in private , as i did intend , to declare my selfe in publike ; and the same grounds i intended to lay downe in publike , i shall lay downe here against the baptizing of infants . and the reason of my speaking syllogistically , is because it was an injunction laid upon us so , to speake , had we met in publike . but before i come to lay downe my reasons , i shall take a portion of scripture , and draw a conclusion , which conclusion shall be as a ground , from whence i purpose to build all my following discourse , the scripture is . matth. 28.20 . teaching them to observe all things whatsoever i have commanded you . in the words there are these two things considerable : an exhortation , and a sweet direction . the exhortation doth arise from the words considered in reference to the words before , ( verse 19. ) go●e therefore and teach all nations . the direction in these words , teaching them to observe whatsoever i have commanded you . in the exhortation ( if we had time ) we might observe : first , the party exhorting ; that 's christ . secondly , the parties exhorted ; that was the disciples , or apostles , who were taught of christ . thirdly , the matter exhorted to , go teach . from all which you may observe this conclusion . that it is the duty of all those who are taught of christ , to declare to other what they enjoy from christ . but this is not that which i intend to build my following discourse upon . therefore i passe it over . and i come to the direction , in which we may observe . first , the party directing . secondly , the parties directed . and thirdly , the direction it self . firt , the party directing ; that 's christ . secondly , the parties directed , that is the aposles , on the disciples in this word ye . and thirdly , the direction it self , in these words , go and teach them to observe whatsoever i have commanded you . that which i shall at this time speak of , is in the direction it self ; and from thence briefly observe with me these things . doct. 1 first , that the teachings of the apostles concerning our duty to christ , are the command of christ : in these words , teach them to observe whatsoever i command you . so that their teaching duty to christ , was the command of christ . the second conclusion is from these words , teach them to observe whatsoever i command . doct. 2 thence observe , that the commands of christ ought to be observed . i might be large in speaking of this ; first , because i see men are apt rather to observe the commands of men then the commands of christ ; and so do exceedingly slight and undervalue the commands of christ . secondly , because i apprehend that men are apt to mistake in the commands of christ , and to take that for a command that is not ; and to make that no command that is . but i shall not at this time speak of that . the third conclusion doth arise from something included in these words , teach them to observe what i command . implying not onely that we should observe christs commands ; but in observing any thing as a duty to christ , it must be in reference to a command of christ , from thence observe this conclusion . doct. 3 that all that we are to observe as a duty to christ , must not arise from supposition , but it must answer a command given out from christ . and at this time this is the conclusion i shall speak to ; explaining the terms , and confirming the proposition ; being that which i intend to build my following discourse upon . and in opening the terms , i shall be very brief : first , to shew you what is meant by the law of christ , or the commands of christ . secondly , what i mean by observation . thirdly , what i mean by supposition . fourthly , the reasons why we are to observe nothing as a duty to christ , but that which answers a law given forth by christ . 1 first , by the commands of christ , my meaning is , not the ceremonial law , which was a type of christ , and did in a dark way hold forth christ . nay , by the laws of christ , or the commands of christ , i do not intend the moral law considered in the hand of moses : though i must tell you , first , i own the authority of that law : secondly , i own the materials of that law : but the obligement of that law , do and live ; ( for so it was considered in the hand of moses ) so it is not to be considered in the hand of christ to us ; for now we are not to do for life ; but because we live : but consider the authority of god , and the materials of the law handed to us in christ , so i own it , and desire all saints may do so . but by the commands of christ , my meaning is , all those commands that christ gave as he was a prophet , priest , and king of his church ; either concerning our beleeving in god , or of our worshiping or walking with god . and so much of that thing . 2 secondly , my meaning by observation , in a word is , actually , and truely , and really to do and conform to what christ commands . 3 and what i mean ( in the third place ) by supposition : by that i mean a doubtful apprehension that men gather up consequentially , by the strength of reason and art , and have no plain word for it . now in such a case , supposition of one side , is as strong as of the other : and if it be a duty to observe a thing under such a supposed consequence , then if there be a supposed consequence for the contrary , it is also a duty to observe a thing contrary to that . but a duty doth not consist in answering a supposition , but a command ; and that it doth , i will prove from these reasons . first , because nothing is a duty , but as it answers a command , luke 17.10 . reason 1 reason 2 secondly , every thing that we observe , doth directly answer that light which doth present the thing to us to be observed . if it be a supposed light , it is but a supposed duty ; if a civil light presents to a civil man any truth of god , in his observation of it , it is but civil in reference to him ; if a legal light presents an evangelical truth , to a legal person , in his observation of it , it is legal in reference to him in his observing ; if a self light present a real duty to an hypocrite , he observes it for self-ends . this you may see , zach. 7.5 , 6. where he saith , when ye fasted , did ye as all fast unto me , even to me ? so then if a man observes a thing onely from supposition , and not a command , at the best , it is but a supposed duty . reason 3 but thirdly , the will of christ is , that as his members are to beleeve in light , so they should do in light , or obey in light , ephes. 5.8 . but if we observe any thing barely from supposition , and not from a command , it is observed in darknesse , and not in light : therefore not as a duty to be observed . reason 4 fourthly , we are so to observe things that we present to christ , that not onely the manner , but the matter should not come under the reproofs of christ ; but if we observe any thing as a duty to christ , and have no command for it from christ , it comes under the reproof of christ ; and he will one day say , who hath required this as your hands ? the gospel forbids will-worship . now , will-worship is not onely to do a thing contrary to a command ; but to do a thing that is thought right or good by the wisdom of man ; as worship without a command , which the apostle condemns , col. 2. reason 5 fifthly , christ doth not only hold forth his laws so as to declare duty ; but so as that they may be sufficient to stop the mouths of them that oppose duty , matth. 5.16 . but to observe any thing as a duty , and not from a command of christ , but from supposition ; that is not sufficient to stop the mouths of them that oppose duty : therefore ought not to be done ; for you must know suppositions ( as i said before ) are as strong of one side as of the other . reason 6 sixthly , the sixth reason i shall draw from those words , rom. 15.4 . where he saith , what is written , is written for our learning : i shall form my reason thus , that which is written the saints should learn ; but it is no where written that we should observe any thing as a duty , in reference to supposition , but to answer a command therefore to observe any thing as a duty to christ , without a command , is not a doctrine for saints to learn . reason 7 in the seventh place , i might give you one reason more , and that thus , that which answers the love of christ , and our friendly relation with christ , that 's duty and nothing else ; but to observe any thing not from supposition , but to answer a law or command of christ ; that 's that which answers to the love of christ , and our friendly relation with christ , and therefore duty , john 14.23 . and 15.14 . these reasons ( dearest friends ) i have given to you to confirm what before i spake , which was , that we are to observe nothing as a duty to christ , but that which answers a law given forth by christ . i might here draw divers uses , which might be useful for us ; but at this time i shall onely speak of a use of reproof ; to reprove those that will observe things , and in their observing , plead for it as a duty to christ , and yet have no command for it from christ : amongst the rest , this is that which i shall here reprove , the baprizing of infants ; which is the very point in controversie : and because i desire to speak directly to the question as it was stated ; i shall here rehearse to you what the question was , and what they were to prove and what we were to prove . the question was whether infants of beleeving parents were to be baptized , ye● , or no ? they were to prove that it was their duty , and they ought to do it . we were to prove that they ought not to do it . i shall not at all go about to meddle with the justifying of our practice concerning the baptizing of beleevers ; for that is not the point in hand . though i must tell you , it had been but a reasonable thing for them by scripture to endeavour to justifie their practice ; and we by scripture to justifie ours ; and then neither of us would have been put upon the proof of a negative , which every rational man knows is the worst and of the staff . but seeing it was so , i shall therefore direct my speech to give forth my judgement concerning that thing . the reasons that i shall at this time lay down ( according to time and strength ) why children ought not to be baptized , are these : argum. 1 the first is this : that which doth ( not onely accidentally , but ) directly deny christ to be come in the flesh , that ought not to be done : but the baptizing of infants doth directly deny christ to be come in the flesh ; therefore ought it not to be done . i know that no man can deny the major , which is so clearly confirmed , 1 john 4.3 . with divers other places . but at this time i will prove the minor , that baptizing of infants doth directly deny christ to be come in the flesh ; and that i prove thus : that which doth keep on foot that which was before christ , and ended by christ , considered come in the flesh ; that denies christ to be come in the flesh : but the baptizing of infants doth keep on foot that which was before christ , and ended by christ , as come in the flesh ; and therefore it denies christ to be come in the flesh . for the proof of this , first , i shall unfold to you what i mean by that which was before christ , and ended by christ come in the flesh . that which was before christ , was , that god made a covenant with abraham , which covenant ran in the flesh , and was intail'd to generation ; and not upon condition of regeneration . and this you may see , gen. 17.7 , 12. and this was that covenant that circumcision of children had a reference to ; and whosoever was a childe of abraham , considered as a son of the flesh , had a right to it , and might , and did plead for priviledges by it . but when christ came , the natural branches were cut off rom. 11.20 , 21. and no man is now considered a son of abraham , or the seed of abraham , but as he beleeveth , gal. 3.7 , 9 , 14 , 22 , 28 , 29. and now there is no promise that runs forth to any considered in referened to a carnal generation ; but a spiritual regeneration , john 3 , 5. therefore when they came to john ( matth. 3.7 , 8 , 9. ) to be baptized . he takes them off from pleading their priviledge considered in the flesh , and tells them , say not in your heart , you have abraham to your father , and so plead for baptism . but he exhorts them to believe and repent . and by this you see what i mean by that which was before christ , which was , the promises and covenant running in a natural line ; but it is now ended , and runs in a spiritual but now to baptize children because their parents beleeve , and upon this ground , because it was the same ( as they say ) with circumcision ; in so doing they go about to make the promises to run in a natural line , which was ended by christ ; and therefore in the observing of it , deny christ to be come in the flesh . secondly , that which doth directly take from christ that which the holy ghost gives to christ , considered come in the flesh ; that denies christ come in the flesh . but the baptizing of infants doth directly take from christ that which the holy ghost gives to christ considered come in the flesh . therefore it denies christ come in the flesh . and for the proof of this , i shall declare to you what i mean by that which the holy ghost gives to christ considered come in the fl●sh . the holy ghost gives to christ a pre-eminence above all others that were before him in his prophetical and kingly office . in his prophetical office , that neither moses nor the prophets were to be compared with him , but far inferiour to him , and his office ; so inferiour , that he was not to be expounded by them ; but in giving out his minde considered come in the flesh , he was to expound and unfold them . but now men in their going about to plead for the baptizing of infants , do exceedingly undervalue christ's prophetical office in this , that they make the old testament expound the new ; whereas the new should expound the old ; christ should , and doth expound moses ; but there is no warrant for us to bring christ under the exposition of moses ; and men do undervalue the lord christ , in making moses speak that which christ speaks not , or bringing moses to christ , as a greater light to unfold the lesser ; they do ( i say ) exceedingly undervalue christ , and that thus . the light unfolding or the wisdom unfolding , must be greater then the matter unfolded : and therefore he that goeth about to make moses mouth to speak out christ's minde , in things that concern christ as come in the flesh , sets up moses above christ ; and denies christ to be come in the flesh . secondly , they exceedingly take from christ's kingly office ; whereas the holy ghost sets up christ a king in his church , and a law-giver , as equal to , so transcending all others that were before him : but that men in the baptizing of infants do undervalue the kingly office of christ , in giving laws to his people . that 's clear in these two things . first in this , that they say it is a duty to baptize infants , and answers the minde of christ , and yet cannot shew a command from christ ; whereas the apostle saith , christ was as faithful in his house , as moses . and you know the faithfulnesse of moses did consist in this , that he gave laws and commands to the israelites , to declare their duty : and layes nothing upon them as a duty , but what they had a command for . and it he gave them laws for every thing they were to observe , and christ was as faithful in his house as he ; i will leave this to the judgement of you , whether or no that this doth not undervalue the kingly office of christ , to say , that baptizing of infants is a duty that they owe to christ ; and yet can shew no command for it from christ . secondly , they undervalue the kingly office of christ , in giving laws to his church in this ; that they go about to perform ( as they say ) a duty to christ , but can shew no command for it from christ ; but must use there own art and reason to make christs law strong enough to hold it out to be a duty . and whether the joyning of mans art , policy , and reason to the laws of christ , doth not exceedingly undervalue christ , as though his laws were not perfect enough for his people , i leave you to judge . and in so doing they do exceedingly take ( as before i said from the prophetical , so here in the kingly office of christ ) that honour and preheminence from him , which the holy ghost gives to him , considered as come in the flesh : and therefore so to do , denies christ as come in the flesh . secondly , that which is no part of righteousnesse , that as a duty to christ , ought not to be observed . but , the baptizing of infants is no part of righteousnesse ; and therefore it ought not to be observed . the major proposition none can deny , i will prove the minor , and that thus . whatsoever is considered as a part of righteousnesse , was seen either in the person or practice of jesus christ . but neither in the person nor practice of jesus christ , is the baptizing of infants seen or held forth . therefore it is not part of righteousnesse . and that whatsoever is a part of righteousnesse , was seen in the person or practice of jesus christ , is clear from this scripture , matth. 3.15 . and jesus said , suffer it to be so : for thus is becometh us to fulfil all righteousnesse . if all righteousnesse , then there was no righteousnesse but was confidered either in the person or practice of christ . and that the baptizing of infants is not-held out in the person or practice of christ , i leave to you to judge . he himself was not baptized when he was an infant , though he might plead the same priviledge as they do who say they are children of beleevers : had it been a part of righteousnesse , christ would ; nay , christ should have done it . object . if you object , and say , there was none to baptize him before : answ . i answer , had it been a part of righteousnesse , god in a providence would have provided one before , as well as then ; for he was to fulfil all righteousnesse . and for his practice ( though he baptized not , but his disciples , john 4.2 . ) yet , in all their baptizing where christ was , you never hear that ever they baptized any infant , or gave any command for it ; and therefore it is no part of righteousnesse , and ought not to be done . thirdly , that which is not the baptism of christ , that ought not to be done . but the baptizing of infants is not the baptism of christ ; and therefore ought not to be done ( we are now speaking of the baptism of christ , considered in an external way . ) and that the baptism of infants , is not the baptism of christ so considered ; i prove thus . first , that which doth not answer the commission of christ , that is not the baptism of christ . but , the baptism of infants doth not answer the commission of christ ; therefore it is not the baptism of christ . that it doth not answer the commission of christ , it is clear from the commission it self , matth. 28.19 , 20. mark 16.15 , 16. where you shall see these things in the commission , go teach , discipling , and baptizing . and they that were to be baptized , were such as must first be taught , and discipled , and being beleevers , must be baptized , mark 16.16 . and that an infant in the first place , is capable to be taught the mystery of the gospel , and so to be taught as to be made a disciple of christ , and a beleever in christ . it is clear that it cannot be ; and therefore the baptizing of them , doth not answer the commission of christ . every man that professes to act by a commission , most not onely do things because there is not an express command against it : but if they observe any thing as a duty ; they must have a command for it , in , and by it ; or else it will come under the reproof of him that gives the commission ; as those come under the reproof of christ ( collos●…i● ) who by the wisdom of men , went to present a will-worship to god . and so you see the baptizing of infants doth not answer the commission of christ ; and therefore it is none of christs baptism , and ought not to be done . secondly , christs baptism is a baptism of faith , and a baptism of repentance . but , the baptism of infants cannot be a baptism of faith and a baptism of repentance . therefore it is not the baptism of christ ; and ought not to be done . argum. 4 fourthly , that which causeth inconveniences in the church , that ought not to be done . but , the baptizing of infants doth cause inconveniences in the church ; therefore it ought not to be done . i must tell you ( dear friends ) for this argument , i borrowed it from them that oppose the thing , who laid down this as an argument for baptizing of infants ; and that thus : that which causeth inconveniences in the church , that ought not to be done : but , ( say they ) the denying of childrens baptism , causeth inconveniences in the church ; and therefore it ought not to be 〈◊〉 . and to prove this , they go to prove a supposition by a supposition ; and that thus : it will make the children of beleevers ( say they ) to be no other wayes then the children of heathens ; and so they go about to prove a consequence by a consequence ; which is but 〈…〉 upon . but that the baptizing of infants doth cause inconvenience in the church , i will prove from scripture : and that thus ; that which doth not onely , present one , but make one a member of a church ; before being called of god , that is inconvenient : but , the baptizing of infants makes them members of their church , before they are called of god ; and therefore it is inconvenient , and contrary to these scriptures , 1 cor. 1.1 . and 2 cor. 1.1 . secondly , that which intails mercies and priviledges to generation , which alone is to be intail'd upon men in reference to regeneration , that is inconvenient . but the baptizing of infants , doth intail mercies and priviledges to them in reference to generation , and not regeneration ; and therefore it is inconvenient , and contrary to this scripture , john 3.5 . gal. 3.9 . with many other places , as 2 cor. 1.1 . where he doth declare that all those that were in the church of christ , and impriviledged with the ordinances of christ , they were fanctified by christ . thirdly , that which causeth a separation , and distraction in christs conjunction ; that 's inconvenient . but , the baptizing of infants , doth make a separation , and distraction in christs conjunction ; and therefore it is inconvenient . by christs conjunction , i mean the onenesse that is between the ground that christ layes down for men to be baptized , and the ground he layes down for men to break bread ; which is one and the same thing : he that beleeves , and knows , and discerns christ , he is to be baptized , acts 8.37 . and he that doth so , is to break bread , in remembrance of christ , 1 cor. 11. now , those that plead so much for the baptizing of infants , by the same ground they would baptize infants upon , they will not admit them nor others to break bread ; and therefore as christs ground is one , theirs is two : and under that consideration , they make a separation in that which christ makes a onenesse ; and that is inconvenient in the church of christ , and ought not to be done . argum. 5 fifthly , that which doth directly crosse the proceedings in the time of the law , and in the time of the gospel . that ought not to be done . but , the baptizing of infants , doth directly crosse the proceedings in the time of the law , and in the time of the gospel ; and therefore it ought not to be done . by that , i mean , that no man in the time of the law , and in the time of the gospel was to do any thing by the vertue of a right , without a rule ; but whatsoever they did as a duty , it was to answer a rule . had abraham been circumcised by the vertue of a right , as he was a beleever , and not by the vertue of a rule ; then lot might have pleaded for the same priviledge , for he was a beleever as well as abraham ; yet god did not make choice of lot , but of abraham . and then , ishmael should not have been circumcised , but onely isaa● ; but though ishmael was a son of the flesh , and cast out by god , and not a beleever in god ; yet he must be circumcised : and therefore this was not by the vertue of a right , but by the vertue of a rule . the same thing also was in the time of the gospel , where it is clearly discovered that christ owns nothing as a duty , but as it answers a law ; and they were to do nothing pleading a right , without a rule ; but to do all things by the vertue of a rule : therefore under that consideration , will-worship was condemned . now if there be any rule , or any command in the scripture for infants to be baptized , i desire they would shew it : here is the word of truth , which justifies all things sutable to it self ; and owns nothing else to be a truth . and i do exceedingly wonder that any men should go about to plead for a thing by the vertue of a right , without a rule . i have much more to say to you in this thing , had i time and strength : but , i hope these five grounds that i have here laid down , will clearly discover to you , that infants ought not to be baptized . i am not here now to prove to you the baptizing of beleevers ; that 's not the controversie in hand , though a thing clear by scripture ; and that which i should be glad if i had an occasion to speak of . not onely to speak of baptism in the letter , but baptism in the spirit , which was the mystry of the gospel , and the glorious excellency of christ in the spirit , held out in the administrations of christ considered in the flesh ; which administrations in the flesh , are as so many signes to declare the mystery of the spirit ; though i know none can understand it , but they that do injoy it ; for none can unletter the letter , but the spirit : but i cease from that , and cease giving you any further reasons ( at this time ) to prove that which we were to have proved in publike , had we had liberty ; which was , that infants ought not to be baptized . but i leave them and you so to the truth ; desiring that we may all be taught by the truth ; and sweetly made one in the truth ; and carried out from thence , to walk up in an acknowledgement of the truth , sutable to the rules of it self . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a86419e-520 doct. 1 what the law of christ or the commands of christ is . 2 what is meant by observation . 3 what is meant by supposition . the reasons why we are to observe nothing as a duty , but that which answers a law , or command of christ . isal. 1.12 . vse . col. 1.18 . phil. 2.9 . joh. 6.68 . matth. 11.9 . luke 24.19 . matth. 5.21 , 22 , 27 , 28. isai. 9.6 , 7. revel. 15.3 . heb. 3.2 , 3. dy. 3. acts 8.37 . mark 16.16 . acts 8.12 . acts 2.38 . acts 28.8 . isai. 8.20 . a defense of infant-baptism in answer to a letter (here recited) from an anti-pædo-baptist / by john wallis ... wallis, john, 1616-1703. 1697 approx. 37 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 15 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a67377) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 56509) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 904:12) a defense of infant-baptism in answer to a letter (here recited) from an anti-pædo-baptist / by john wallis ... wallis, john, 1616-1703. [2], 24 p. printed by leon. lichfield, for henry clements, oxford : 1697. reproduction of original in huntington library. advertisement: p. 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( with the author 's good leave ) for the benefit of others ; omitting the name of him , who proposed the question ; because i do not know , whether or no he be willing to have it made publick . a letter from an anti-paedo-baptist , to doctor wallis . reverend sir , i have read the first part of your discourse concerning the christian sabbath , and liked it so well , that i was very eager to get the second : in reading whereof , i could not but admire at the large measure of understanding , which the lord , out of his goodness , has been pleased to bestow upon you , above many other pious and learned men , that have formerly treated of the sabbath , and disputed against the jewish sabbath , with so much weakness , that the sabbatarians have been greatly thereby incouraged in their errour . and coming in pag. 91. to these words of yours , you would have had — so much modesty , as to think , the mistake may possibly be on your side , rather than on the whole body of christians ( some very few excepted ) who religiously observed the lord's day ; i did reflect on my self , who am perswaded , that believers infants are not to be baptized in their infancy , contrary to the opinion of so many learned paedo-baptists in christendom , yea the generality of christians ; and it made me to think , the mistake might possibly be on my side , rather than on the body of christians ( some few excepted ) who conscientiously maintain infant-baptism . and supposing you , worthy sir , by your communion , to maintain paedo-baptism , i took courage and boldness , to write unto your self , for to know your grounds from scripture , on which you satisfy your conscience in that point . the main reason , which satisfies me against paedo-baptism , is , because i can find no where in scripture , either in express terms , or by any natural or necessary consequence , that it is the will of god , that believers infants are to be baptized in their infancy : i cannot find any precept to baptize them , nor so much that ever iohn the baptist , or christ , or his disciples ( that appears ) did baptize any of them . i know indeed , what dr. hammond , dr. light-foot , and the athenian society presume ( as to an institution ) from a custom among the iews , of their baptizing the infants of proselytes , as if christ out of condescension to the iews , to win them , did include infants in his precept of baptizing all nations , children being a part of them . but i cannot find in holy writ any such custom recorded , or that it had a divine institution . and if those writings from whence they would prove , that there was such a custom in our saviour's time amongst them , were of undoubted authority , yet i cannot see any reason to conclude , that christ would institute infant-baptism to gratify infidel iews , who were but the least part of all nations , ( if intended there by nations . ) as iohn's baptism was from heaven , and was so singular a thing , that the iews , ioh. 1. 25. wondring at it , asked him , why baptizest thou then , if &c. so the baptism christ instituted , was not from any jewish tradition , or rudiment of the jewish world , but from heaven , and differing from any jewish baptism . that iohn baptist , and our lord first made disciples , and then baptized those disciples , i think is plain from ioh. 4. 1. but i cannot find , that they also baptized the children of those disciples , as if they had been the children of new proselytes . as our lord did thus among the iews , by his apostles , so he did by them among the nations ; and i can no where in scripture find , that believing gentiles were counted and called proselytes , because christians , and that their children were baptized for that reason . the doctor doubtless can certify me , whether or no it was a custom among the iews and other nations , for great masters to initiate their disciples by baptism ; and if so , there would be more probability , that christ instituted baptism from that custom , if from any , and that as they did not baptize the children of those disciples too , until themselves became disciples , so the children of the disciples of christ , the great prophet of god , and our master , are not to be baptized , until themselves also become disciples . go ye , and teach all nations , is explain'd , mar. 16. 15. go ye into all the world , and preach the gospel to every creature ; and thus it is by several of the fathers understood . and by baptizing them , viz. all nations , there is no necessity to understand it of baptizing all persons absolutely , for we have the words [ all nations ] in other texts of scripture , where they do not mean all persons absolutely , but of a capable condition , as adorate eum omnes gentes , & psallitate deo omnes nationes , &c. and if baptism was the way of discipling persons , as some would have it , then the apostles needed not have first required of them repentance and faith , as previous dispositions and qualifications for baptism , but rather have exhorted them to be baptized , in order to their being taught faith and repentance , with other things commanded by christ to his apostles . but as it plainly appears from other scriptures , that our saviour here excludes from being baptized , those persons of all nations , that are not yet qualify'd for it , i. e. not yet become disciples , or repenting believers , tho' capable of faith and repentance ; so it does not appear to me , that infants disciples are here included , tho' neither qualify'd nor capable , as disciples should be . thus when , col. 2. the apostle tells gentile believers , that they were compleat in christ , seeing they were circumcised in him by his circumcision , and buried and risen with him in baptism , &c. some will from hence assert , that circumcision came in the room of baptism , * and consequently that infants are to be baptized , as before they were to be circumcised , which i can no ways see : nor was ever any such thing pleaded by the apostles , against the christian iews , that were zealous for circumcision . iohn , and christ by his apostle , administred baptism among the iews , while circumcision was still a duty to the iews and their children . i grant , that it may be proved from hence , that circumcision was a figure of the circumcision made without hands , in the putting off the body of the sins of the flesh , but not that circumcision figured baptism : which if it could be proved from hence , yet there does not necessarily follow a necessity of observing this circumstance of age , any more than many other circumstances of the type , as that of the eighth day , of the male sex only , &c. but the analogy will hold thus more properly : as infants in the latter were circumcised , so spiritual infants or babes in christ , that are become like one of these little ones , shall be baptized . therefore that argument from the circumstance of age , being but a meer conjecture , proves nothing . the argument which is taken from the action of christ's blessing infants , does not prove to me , that it is the will of god , that infants are to be baptized , but rather the contrary , in as much as we cannot learn , but that christ dismissed them without baptism . as for that saying of christ , except a man be born again , &c. it does no more infer a necessity of infant 's baptism , than that other of his , except ye eat the flesh of the son of man , &c. does infer a necessity of their partaking at the lord's table . the gospel speaks to persons of years and discretion , and it is they whom it ties to baptism for their salvation , and the baptism which saves them , is the answer of a good conscience towards god in their obedience to the gospel-requirings , which infants are uncapable to discharge . and for the salvation of infants , god is able still to bestow saving mercies upon infants now immediately , as he did before the institution , either of circumcision or baptism . even as it is in the case of faith , he that believeth not , shall be damned : now , because children are no more able to give assent to the gospel , than to dissent therefrom , shall we from thence infer their damnation ? and if the want of faith does not damn them till they are capable of faith , then much more the want of baptism will not damn them , till then , and may therefore be rationally deferr'd till then . as to the promise of the holy ghost to the iews and their children , i cannot understand it , but conditionally , viz. to them , if they should repent and be baptized , ( according to peter's exhortation to them , ) and also to their sons and daughters , of the same capacity to receive the holy spirit 's effects on their natural faculties , upon their repentance and obedience of faith : for , as the word [ children ] in scripture , does not always mean infants , else it would follow , that there were no adult persons in all israel ; so i see no necessity to take it here of infants . as for the holiness of the children of a believer , spoken of 1 cor. 7. 14. ( whatever that holiness be ) it does no more necessarily prove , that infants of believers are for that reason to be baptized , than the holiness of the unbelieving parent there spoken of , will prove , that such an infidel is for that reason to be baptized . for , that holiness of the children , is derived to them from their believing parent , as it is to the unbelieving parent , and not from the gift of the holy ghost . and whereas for an apostolical precedent , there is one pretended from baptizing of stephanas's houshold , it is but a bare conjecture , first , that there were little babes in the family , and secondly , that they were baptized . it is said of the ruler at capernaum , that he believed , and all his house , but it does not thence follow , that there were infants in his house , and that they believed as well as he . one seems just as probable as the other . now , good sir , seeing i can find no certainty or domonstration , and i may say , no probability , in these arguments , that are usually brought from scripture for infant-baptism ; if you can produce any arguments that carry more weight and demonstration in them , for that which you believe to be the truth , and against that which you believe to be an errour , and i ( at present ) a truth , i do earnestly and humbly entreat you , for my soul's sake , and as you are in christian duty and conscience bound to god , to be so good as to impart them to me , for to save my soul from such an errour . and as your so doing may make much , not only for my spiritual , but also for my temporal benefit , so you will thereby greatly oblige , reverend sir , london , feb. 25. 1696. your very humble , and affectionate servant , c. c .......... pray sir , will you be pleased to favour me with some lines , and to direct your letter for me , to be left with mr. — at the — in st. paul's church-yard , and there i will call for it , three weeks hence , and pay for it . vale. to the reverend john wallis , d. d. and professor of geometry in the university of oxford . an answer to the fore-going letter . sir , oxford , feb. 28. 1695 / 6 i received last night , from i know not whom , a letter ( concerning infant-baptism ) dated feb. 25. and signed c. c .......... whether this be a true name , or but a feigned one , i am not certain . but guess it to be the latter ; because i do not remember that i have ever heard of any man of that name . and , as i do not know from whom ; so , neither do i know , how qualify'd : whether with a modest desire to be informed ; or a captious humour , to quarel or cavil at a received truth , as being prepossessed with a prejudice to the contrary . if the latter ; i might answer as the apostle doth in a like case ; if any man list to be contentious , we have no such custome , nor the churches of god. and the scripture seems to me to be written in such a stile , not as to gratify the nicely captious , but to give a reasonable satisfaction to such as are modestly willing to be taught . if any man will do his will , he shall know of the doctrine , whether it be of god. and , the meek he will teach his way . and i do not find that christ thought fit to comply with those who would be curiously inquisitive for a sign from heaven ( when and in what manner they pleased ) to confirm his doctrine : or , with the rich glutton , who would have one sent from the dead to warn his brethren : but would take his own time , and his own way , to satisfy those who were willing to be taught . and , in matters of fact , we must content our selves with a moral certainty , though we have not always a mathematical demonstration . and if , then , any doubt remain , as to matter of fact , we must content our selves with such reasonable satisfaction , as god thinks fit to give us , what is most likely to be true . but i am willing to understand the writer in the other sense ; as content ( without cavilling ) with a reasonable satisfaction . and then , as to this question , concerning matter of fact ; whether christ and his apostles , or the church in their time , did baptize infants : 't is clear , on the one hand , that we cannot be certain that they did not , ( there being no intimation to that purpose ; ) and it is much more reasonable to think they did ; and to practise accordingly . i shall parallel this with another question of like nature . whether women did then , and ought now , to partake of the other sacrament . if it be objected ; that christ at first did celebrate it with men only , ( the twelve apostles ; ) and the apostle directs , let a man ( not woman or child ) examine himself , ( not her self ) and so let him ( not her ) eat of that bread , and drink of that cup. nor do we any where , in scripture , find any express mention of women receiving it . yet i am satisfy'd , notwithstanding this objection , ( and so , i hope , are you ) that they did then , and ought now to receive it . because there is no intimation of the contrary ; and there seems to be the same reason for the women , as for the men , and the like benefit to each ; and women were baptized ( though not formerly circumcised ; ) and did ( as we have reason to presume , though i do not remember that it is expresly said so ) eat of the pass-over ( notwithstanding it be expresly said exod. 12. 48. no vncircumcised person shall eat thereof ; ) the words house and houshold being reasonably supposed to include women and children also ; and that the whole family is to be reputed as a circumcised family , wherein all the males are circumcised . and , the practice of the church , ( which is a great presumption ) hath been always consonant , to admit women , as well as men , to the lord's table . and , in many other cases , particular circumstances may be presumed to be supplied ( from the reasonableness of the thing , and parallel cases , ) though not distinctly expressed in the history of the fact ; as may be amply shewed , if that were necessary . now ( to apply this to the present case ) we are first to consider , what baptism is . it is a solemn rite , appointed by christ , for the solemn admission or incorporation , of the person baptized , into the christian church ; ( as circumcision was , into that of the iews ; ) and , a consecration or dedication of the person baptized , to the service or worship of the father , son , and holy-ghost . and consequently , those who have right to be so admitted , and so dedicated , have right to the solemn rite of such admission , and dedication . next we are to consider , that the children of christians now , have as well a right to be reputed members of the christian church , as the children of iews , of the jewish church ; and consequently to be solemnly received into it : that is , into god's visible church , both of them ; and both a like obligation to be offered or dedicated to the service of the true god. and it is not reasonably to be supposed , that god would so often , and so emphatically make promises to the righteous , and their seed , if there was not somewhat of peculiar preference intended them , beyond those of the wicked , or those that are out of god's visible church . for if no more be intended , than such a conditional promise , if they repent and believe ; this is equally true of the children of the most profligate ; and of heathens , as of jews or christians . how great that is , i will not now dispute ; but what preference did then belong to the jews , i think is now common to christians . otherwise , christ's coming would render the condition of children , worse than before . and particularly , those very children , who in the jewish church were members of the visible church of god , must have ceased to be so , when the christian church took place . contrary to what christ seems to intimate , in that of , suffer little children to come unto me , and forbid them not , for of such is the kingdom of heaven . which intimates a capacity in children of an interest in heaven hereafter , and in the visible church here ; ( especially if by kingdom of heaven , be here meant , the gospel church . ) as likewise to that of , else were your children unclean , but now are they holy . which implies a certain holiness , as to the children of one , though not of both , believing parents ; which they would not have , if neither of the parents were believers . which seems to me so clear an evidence , of some relative holiness , or interest in the visible church , or dedication to the service of god ; as is not easy to be avoided . and that slight evasion , as if it were meant as to bastardy , is so weak , as ( with me ) bears no weight at all . for , though both parents were heathen , the child would not be a bastard . and it is to be considered , that , in all religions , the children are reputed as of the same religion with the parents ( while under their care ) till they do by some act of their own manifest the contrary . the child of a jew is reputed a jew ; of a christian , a christian ; of a heathen , a heathen ; of a papist , a papist ; and so of others . now what belongs to a church , as a church , doth equally belong to the jewish and christian church , and needs no new institution : and consequently , that of having their children in the visible church-communion with themselves ; and the blessing appertaining to that visible communion ; as that of , i will be a god of thee , and of thy seed : and this blessing of abraham , is come upon the gentiles also . and though it is true , that this doth not presently intitle them to heaven ( unless their life be answerable , as neither did that of being the seed of abraham , ) yet it is to be reputed a real advantage , as putting them into a fairer prospect of heaven , and in a greater probability of obtaining saving grace , than if out of the church . and this advantage of the iew above the gentiles which they then had ; the apostle tells us , is much every way : ( yet not so , but that a believer , though not a jew , might be saved by faith ; and an unbeliever , though a jew , would be damned without it . ) and what advantage was then to the jews , ( as god's visible church , ) is now common to the gentiles also . so that the right of believers children , to be within the church , is not a new institution , ( as if we should now look for a distinct institution of infant-baptism , beside that of baptism ; ) but as old as adam , for ought i know ; but the solemn rite of admission into this church , ( to which the child hath a right to be admitted ) is a new institution ; then by circumcision , appointed to abraham ; and now , by baptism , upon a new institution , appointed by christ. by being believers children , they have ius ad rem ; and by being baptized , they have ius in re ; whatever be the priviledge of being within the pale and promise of the visible church . and so long as , by our fault , we debar them from baptism ; we do , so much as in us lyeth , debar them of that advantage , whatever it be . nor is it only a priviledge of the children ( to be thus early admitted into the visible church , with the benefits thereto appertaining , and thus dedicated to the service and worship of god ; ) but a duty of parents , and other superiors , thus to dedicate them , and ( so far as in them lyeth ) give them up to god. and we need not doubt , but that the parent hath a natural right over the child of so doing . and we do not know how soon the effect of such dedication ( upon god's acceptance ) may operate . samson , before he was born , was devoted by manoah , to be a nazarite . and samuel was , by his mother , vowed before he was born , and after presented while an infant , to the special service of god : ieremy is said to be sanctified from his mothers womb ; and paul likewise ; and iohn the baptist , while yet unborn ; and timothy , from a child . and we have no reason to doubt , but many children very early , and even before their birth , may have the habits of grace infused into them , by which they are saved , though dying before the years of discretion . my meaning is , that god may , by his grace , so pre-dispose the soul , to an aptness for good ; as ( by our natural corruption ) we are supposed to be habitually inclined to evil , though not yet in a capacity to act either . for as the habits of corruption , which we call original sin , by propagation ; so may the habits of grace , by infusion , be inherent in the soul , long before ( for want of the use of reason ) we are in capacity to act either ; as is also the rational faculty , before we are in a capacity to act reason . and we may have incouragement to expect , or hope for , such work from god on the heart of a child , from our early devoting him to god's service . and the proper way , by christ appointed , for thus devoting , or offering up persons to god , is baptism , into the name , and to the service of the father , son and holy ghost . i am loth to charge it , as a just judgment of god , for such neglect ; when we see the unbaptized children , of faulty parents , prove lewd and debauch'd persons ; though we have reason to fear , it may be an effect of not devoting them to god by baptism , and a neglect of suitable education . for as we find corruption doth , so ( through god's blessing ) grace may begin to act very early ; and if we may do it , certainly we ought to do it . and as persons , when they be come to age , ought themselves , to give up themselves , and ( as it were ) enter into a sacred covenant with god ; ( and renew it , from time to time ; ) so may the parents ( and ought to do it , so far as in them lyeth ) give up their children to god , and ingage them in such a covenant with him . we know , amongst our selves , a child by his guardians , or his parents , may be put into the possession of an estate , and engaged to the homage and fealty thereunto appertaining , before himself do understand what is done . and in such a covenant we find the israelites to enter ( deut. 29. 10. &c. ) in the name of themselves , their wives , and their little ones , and even of those then present , and those not present at that day . and of a like tenour we suppose to be those mention'd of ioshua , asa , iehojada , iosiah , that god should be a god to them , and they a people to him . which is the same , for substance , which a person of age makes for himself , and the parent for the child in baptism . and if children be thus capable , or their parents for them , of entering thus into covenant with god ; why not of receiving the seal of such covenant ? and why not that of baptism now , as well as of circumcision before ? for the child is passive in both . and , if capable , you admit it to be a duty . for your exception is , that it is to be understood of persons in a capable condition . now , that infants are capable of being admitted members of god's visible church ; and capable of being dedicated to god's service , i think is no question ; which are the business of baptism . i know it is objected , that it is said matth. 28. 19. go teach all nations , baptizing them &c. and therefore they are first to be taught ( which child●en cannot be ) before they are baptized . and others ( who put a greater force upon the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) chose rather to render it , go make disciples all nations , baptizing them &c. and therefore ( say they ) they are to be made disciples ( by faith and repentance ) before they are baptized . now i can well enough admit , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 may there be rendered by make disciples ( and perhaps better than teach ; ) but their inference from thence , is a great mistake . for , go make disciples by faith and repentance ; will not be good sense . for faith and repentance are to be works of the persons baptized , not of the baptizer . and 't is preposterous to think faith and repentance intended in the word matheteusate . for christ is here speaking to his apostles ; instructing them , what they are to do in planting a christian church . ( not what each respective christian is to do in a church thus planted : for that is to come-in after , amongst the things that are to be taught . ) and the words lie plainly thus ; go , disciple all nations , ( that is , gather disciples of all nations , or indifferently of any nation , jews or gentiles , all the world over , ) baptizing them in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost ; teaching them to observe all things whatsoever i have commanded you . or thus , ( those who are here called disciples , being after called christians ; the disciples were called christians first in antioch , act. 11. 26. ) make christians of all nations , baptizing them — and teaching them — . and , ( if we would lay stress upon the order of the words , baptizing is to go before teaching . ) the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ( make disciples ) is here a verb imperative , or preceptive ; and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ( baptizing and teaching ) are participles , exegetical or declarative , how that precept is to be discharged . and it is in a like form as this , ( if the founder of a free-school should thus give instructions to him that he makes school-master , ) make latinists of any parish in london , taking them into the school , and there teaching them the latin tongue . or , in the language of the university ( to the governours there ) make scholars , or learned men , of any county in england , admitting them into the vniversity , or a college , and teaching them what is to be there learned . or , in the language of the city ( to the governours , suppose , of the merchants company ) make merchants of any country ; taking apprentices ; and teaching them the trade . ( for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a disciple , signifies the same as a scholar , a learner , an apprentice . ) would any man now think , that the boy must first be a latinist , before he may be taken into the school ? or , the academick must be a philosopher , or learned man , before he may be admitted in the university ? or , the citizen a skilful merchant , before he may be bound apprentice ? no ; but the quite contrary . so here , he is to be entered a scholar in christ's school , in order to be farther instructed in the christian religion , according to the capacity wherein he is . but , whether one do put himself an apprentice ( if a man , and at his own disposal ) or be put an apprentice by his parents or guardians ( at whose disposal he is ) if a child , is all one , as to learning a trade : and it is all one , whether ( before he be thus put an apprentice ) he have some little skill in the trade , or none at all . and so here ; whether he be of such years ( if not the child of a christian , or have been before neglected ) as to have been taught somewhat of christianity ; or yet an infant , and to know nothing of it . and whether ( as in the former case ) he offer himself to baptism ; or ( as in the latter ) he be tender'd to it by his parents ; he is to be baptized , and to be instructed , each according to the capacity wherein he is . but why it should be neglected , when it may be had sooner , i see no reason ; at least if it be allowed to be a thing desirable , and advantageous . now this , for the most part , was the case of the apostles , when they converted jews or heathens to the christian faith. it was not to be expected , that men at age , and at their own disposal , and brought up in another religion , would be willing to declare themselves christians , and be baptized as such , before they knew somewhat of it ; ( and therefore i would not lay so much stress upon the order of words , as if a person unbaptized might not be taught , if capable of it . ) but when they were so perswaded as to themselves , they did ( with themselves ) bring in those who were under their power . as lydia , and all her houshold ; the iaylor , and all his ; the houshold of stephanas , cornelius , and all his ; and the like , i suppose , of others . and to this purpose i understand that of act. 2. repent , and be baptized every one of you , whether jews or gentiles , ( this being a mixture of many nations ) for the remission of sins , — for the promise is to you , and to your children , ( as well as to abraham , and his children , ) and to as many as our lord shall call , ( and to their children ; for this i suppose to be understood . ) for , though i know that children doth not always signify infants ; yet , if no more were meant of their children , than of all the world beside , there was no occasion of naming children , but the sense had been as full without it . now it cannot reasonably be supposed , but that there were children in some of those houses ; ( at least it is more likely that there were in some , than that there were none in any of them ; ) and therefore that children were then baptized , as well as others ; especially when there is no intimation to the contrary . and in such cases , where there is a silence in matter of fact ; it is reasonable to think , it was so , as was most likely to be ; especially when nothing appears to the contrary , and great presumptions of it . i know there is sometime mention of faith , in order to being baptized ; but it is of grown persons . nor is it always meant of saving faith , and a cordial conversion ; but a profession of faith , or a professed willingness to be baptized , and declaring themselves christians . for 't is said , simon himself believed also , and was baptized : which cannot be meant of saving faith , and a real conversion ; for we find him afterward , in the gall of bitterness , and bond of iniquity . and when so many thousands were baptized in one day , we cannot think they were all singly examined , so as to give ( at least a probable ) evidence of saving grace : but , their willingness to be baptized , was a sufficient evidence of their declaring themselves christians , or professing christianity . and when all ierusalem , and all iudea , and all the region about iordan ( that is , great multitudes from all those parts , ) went out to iohn baptist , and were baptized of him , confessing their sins ; it cannot be supposed that such multitudes were all singly examined , and made particular confessions of their sins ; but , the verbal expressions of many , with the silent consent of the rest , and the concurrent actings of all , was an evident declaration of their common sentiments . and it can hardly be thought , that they did not ( many of them ) bring children with them ; since we know they had then an opinion , that children were capable of benefit from the benediction of prophets , and persons extraordinary ; as appears by their bringing of little children to christ , ( such as to be taken up in arms ) for him to lay his hands on them and bless them . now if each of these considerations be not , singly , convictive : yet so many together , of which each is highly probable , and when as nothing ( so much as probable ) doth appear to the contrary : it seems to me so great an evidence ( in matter of fact , ) that children were then baptized ; that i do not at all doubt , but that we are rather to think , that infants were then baptized , than that they were not . to which we may add , the continual concurrence of the churches practice , for near sixteen hundred years ; which , in matter of fact , is a great evidence . for i do not know , that in any age of the church , it was ever so much as questioned , or at all doubted , ( but that the children of christians might be lawfully baptized , ) till that about 100 years since ( in our grandfathers time ) the anabaptists in germany did ( amongst many other extravagant notions ) begin to cavil at it . when as , in all the former ages of the church , nearer to the apostles time , i do not know that any history doth mention , that it was ever questioned . whereas a thing of such daily practice , if at any time , in any part of the christian church , it had received any considerable opposition ; it could not be , but that some history would have taken notice of it . and , in such a case , a constant silence is , to me , a sufficient evidence , that it hath been a constant practice ( even from the apostles time ) without any opposition . and , if so , no doubt , but by them also . and i do not know of any thing alleged , with any shew of evidence , why we should think the contrary . if any ( who were not the children of christians , but converted from heathenism ) have defer'd their baptism too long ; i think they were faulty in so doing . but if any will obstinately think , that paul and peter had not , each of them , two hands , and on each hand five fingers , because it is no where in scripture ( that i know of ) said that they had so : and , that therefore , we are rather to think they had not , than that they had ; i cannot help it . these are my thoughts , hastily drawn up ; and i pray god they may ( through his blessing ) be effectual to your satisfaction . yours , iohn wallis . for mr. c — to be left with mr. — at the — in st. paul's church-yard , till it be called for . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a67377-e200 * perhaps he meant to say , baptism came in the room of circumcision . a dialogue between a pædo-baptist and an anti-pædo-baptist containing the strength of arguments offered on both sides at the portsmouth disputation, with the addition of a few more arguments then ready to be offered in vindication of infant baptism / by samuel chandler and william leigh. chandler, samuel. 1699 approx. 54 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 15 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a31661) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 103948) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1588:33) a dialogue between a pædo-baptist and an anti-pædo-baptist containing the strength of arguments offered on both sides at the portsmouth disputation, with the addition of a few more arguments then ready to be offered in vindication of infant baptism / by samuel chandler and william leigh. chandler, samuel. leigh, william. 27, [2] p. printed for a. chandler ... and sold by a. baldwin, london : 1699. reproduction of original in the british library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism. 2003-07 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2003-07 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2004-01 judith siefring sampled and proofread 2004-01 judith siefring text and markup reviewed and edited 2004-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a dialogue between a paedo-baptist , and an anti-paedo-baptist : containing the strength of arguments offered on both sides at the portsmouth disputation : with the addition of a few more arguments , then ready to be offered , in vindication of infant-baptism . by samuel chandler , and william leigh . london printed for a. chandler , at a glover's shop , over against the white-hart-inn , in aldersgate-street , and sold by a. baldwin . 1699. to the reader . because dr. russel , or some friend of his , did a while since disgrace the press , with some scraps of their narrative , stuff'd with nonsense and partiality ; nay , and by its title did delude the vulgar with an imagination , that it contained the true state of the portsmouth disputation ; and the same , how unjust soever , being cheap , hath been scatter'd throughout most parts of the kingdom : therefore by advice of our brethren , from various parts , we have offered ( so far as this small tract would admit ) the strength of arguments then urged on both sides , omitting names and personal reflections , apprehending this way may be most grateful to persons seriously inquisitive . we have also annex'd a few arguments , which with others , were then ready to be urg'd , had the company 's satisfaction requir'd , and the approaching evening , admitted . if this fall into the hands of the learned , we request them to remember , that it is designed for persons of meaner capacities , that neither understand , ornaments of speech , nor affect terms of logick . if it fall into hands more illiterate , yet willing to receìve divine truths , we request of them , that they would weigh it in the balance of scripture and sanctified reason ; yea , and we request of god , that they may . sam. chandler , will. leigh . question i. whether , according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ , adult believers only , are the proper subjects of baptism , and not infants ? asserted by anti-paedo-baptists . the controversy is , whether christ's ministers ought ( 1. ) to deny baptism to the infants of professed christians . ( 2. ) to baptize those at mature age , who by vertue of descent from professed christians , were baptized with a small quantity of water , in infancy ? the first argument offer'd at the disputation by the anti-paedo-baptists , i consider last , because there it will come to be more fairly answered . anti-poedo-baptist . i prove then , that no infants can be the subjects of baptism according to christ's commission . argument 1. no infants can be made disciples by the ministry of men ; therefore no infants can be the subjects of baptism , according to christ's commission , mat. 28. 19. go teach , &c. ( or , disciple ) all nations , &c. paedo-bapt . i deny your whole argument ; and ( 1. ) i assert , if they could not be made disciples by the ministery of men , yet this text would not exclude them from baptism . and then , ( 2. ) i assert , that they be made disciples by the ministery of men. anti-paed . christ puts teaching before baptism ; therefore it goes before , and consequently infants are excluded . paedo-bapt . this is a weak way of arguing . the word is placed before in scripture , therefore the thing signified must go before . were this true , then baptism must go before confession of sin in the adult , because it 's said , they were baptized , confessing their sins ▪ mat. 3. 6. nay , sanctification and preservation in christ , must go before calling , iude 1. but the contrary is evident to all . but farther , infants may be disciples , and therefore , by your own argument , may be baptized ; they may be taught in their parents , as well as the kohathites keep the charge of the sanctuary in their parents , from a month old , numb . 3. 28. or levi pay tithes in abraham , heb. 7. 9. or the israelites in david's time rejoice in their ancestors on the banks of the red sea , ps. 66. 6. there did we rejoice . &c. i. e. as considered in our parents . anti-paed . but how can this be by the ministery of men ? paedo-bapt . ( 1. ) by the preaching of men , parents may be constrain'd to resign their all to god , and so their infants . ( 2. ) they are immediately discipled by men's ministery , when parents and ministers concur in their solemn dedication to god by baptism . anti-paed . but teaching and learning , make the relation between master and scholar . paedo-bapt . the contrary is most true ; the master doth care for and command ; the scholar is subject , in order to instruction ; and resignation of the scholar , or his parents for him , and acceptance of the master , constitutes the relation ; and by virtue hereof , the scholar is as much obliged to submit to his master , according to his capacity , before he touches a book , as when he hath learned seven years . if teaching were the ground of this relation , then persons long since dead , might be our governors . iob 8. 8 ; 10. the former age , and their fathers shall teach thee . nay the beasts of the field may be our masters too , iob 35. 11. who teacheth us more than the beasts of the earth , &c. we may learn of them , and yet be our own governors ▪ but christ's disciples are resigned to him , in order to their being both governed , taught , and disposed of by him , according to their capacity . anti-paed . argum. 2. paul did declare the whole counsel of god , and yet did never declare the baptism of infants ; therefore infant-baptism is no part of the counsel of god. paedo-bapt . neither ever did paul declare , that the baptism of believers children ought to be delay'd , till they can personally profess their faith ; therefore thir practice being such , is no part of the counsel of god. take the argument to your self , and make the most of it . 2. but i hope to prove infant-baptism from paul's words . 1 cor. 7. 14. rom. 11. but pray , is nothing part of the counsel of god , but what stands on record as delivered by paul ? anti-paed . nothing ; and therefore not infant-baptism ? paedo-bapt . if nothing , then how great a part of the history of the old world , of the succeeding patriarchs , of the ceremonial law , of prophecies , gospel-history , and other sacred matters in holy writ , is no part of the counsel of god ? the truth therefore is , paul might declare infant-baptism an hundred times , in his vast number of sermons and pious discourses , and yet the holy ghost might not see fit to insert it , as delivered by him , this doctrine being sufficiently established in other new-testament texts . but farther , these words were spoken to the church of ephesus : and all that remains on record of what he spake to them in two years , acts 19. 9 , 10 , 11. is but the epistle to the ephesians , and this in acts 20. and dare any say , that he never declared it to them , because it 's not herein contained . here , because some anabaptists , from dr. russel's false narrative do report , that we pretended at the disputation , that six leaves of paul's writings containing infant-baptism , may be lost , therefore we will ( tho otherwise 't were impertinent ) give a true representation of that matter . the doctor 's weak evasions , did force us to make our answers evident beyond all contradiction : and thus we argued . if there were a controversy , whether such an author did use such an expression , and his writings were produc'd , if six leaves of these writings were lost , none could determine that he had no such expression , because it might be contained in those six leaves . the controversy is , whether paul ever did by preaching , writing , or discourse , declare infant-baptism . we cannot say we have all his writings ; we dare say , we have not the hundredth part of his sermons and discourses : who can then determine , that he never did any way declare infant-baptism to these ephesians . anti-paed . arg. 3. christ's commission doth expresly shew , who are to be baptized : but it doth not expresly shew that infants are to be baptized : therefore infants are not to be baptized . paedo-bapt . 1. pray take your argument back again , and get rid of it as well as you can . christ's commission doth expresly shew , who are to be baptized : but it doth not expresly shew , that adult persons , if baptized in infancy , are to be baptized again : therefore adult persons , if baptized in infancy , are not to be baptized again . but , 2. i deny that infants or adult persons , are distinctly expressed in mat. 28. 19. for both are included in the word nations . anti-paed . but the commission doth express disciples ; baptizing them , i. e. disciples . the greek word for nations , is of the neuter gender , and the word for them , is masculine ; therefore disciples being masculine , must be understood . * paedo-bapt . 1. if they must be understood ; then they are not express'd . you have confuted your self . 2. but i assert , that them , tho masculine , may refer to nations , tho neuter . for instance , let the learned see acts. 15. 17. acts. 21. 25. and elsewhere . the greek informs a school-boy the reason hereof . 3. but suppose disciples were understood , i have proved , that infants may be disciples , in answer to your first argument , and shall yet more fully do it , when i take the opponency . anti-paed . but , mark 16. 16. believers are the only subjects of baptism ; therefore infants are not . p. bapt. the text says no such thing : and if it did , infants may as well be believers , imputatively in their parents , as the kohathites infants keep the charge of the sanctuary , or levi pay tithes in abraham , num. 3. 28. heb. 7. 9. anti-p . i deny that the parent 's faith was ever imputed to the child . p. bapt. parents faith may be imputed to infants , for their enjoying external privileges , as well as the parents coming corporally , may be imputed to them for christ's blessing , mat. 19. 14. suffer little children to come unto me , &c. when others ( probably parents ) brought them . yea , the parents faith also , we find imputed to infants , heb. 11. 29. compar'd with exod. 14. 22. by faith the children of israel , ( without limitation ) being 600000 men , besides children , ( and many thousand children there must be ) passed through the red sea. all the children of israel , passed by faith ; i. e. the faith of miracles ; and therefore infants , their parents faith being imputed to them . anti-p . but it might be moses his faith , not their own . p. bapt. no , see heb. 11. 27 , 28. moses his faith is expressed as distinct from theirs , just before ; and here theirs as distinct from his . anti-p . but why may not the parents baptism be imputed to infants , as well as their faith ? p. bapt. 1. for the same reason that the baptism of the israelitish parents in the cloud and in the sea , was not imputed to their infants ; all that were under the cloud ( and therefore infants ) were baptized , 1 cor. 10. 1 , 2. this was a type of the gospel-baptism . 2. because infants are capable of baptism , the subject being therein passive . but they are not capable of a personal act of faith ; if they were , it would be expected . but further ; you may as well conclude , that no infant shall be saved , because believing goes before the word [ saved ] , as that no infant must be baptized , because believing goes before the word [ baptized . ] but the weakness of this argument , drawn from placing the words , i have shewn before . anti-p . a person already taught , must profess his faith before he be baptized ; therefore an infant that cannot profess his faith , must not be baptized . says philip to the eunuch , acts 8. 37. if thou believest with all , &c. p. bapt. this instance shews indeed , that an adult jewish proselyte must confess his faith before baptism ; but neither this , nor any one word of god , doth shew , that infants must be deny'd baptism , because they cannot do what is required of adult persons . * this eunuch was probably a proselyte of the covenant , and therefore a member of the jewish church . the infants of all such proselytes ( if they had any ) were church-members with themselves . now , must these poor infants , immediately upon their parents faith and baptism , be shut out of god's church , of which they were members before , because they make no profession of their faith , which is impossible for infants to do ? anti-p . arg 4. if the apostles never did baptize infants , then the baptism of infants is not according to christ's commission . p ▪ bapt. 1. i shall quickly shew , that the scripture doth authorize the practice of infant-baptism , and thence 't will follow , that they did baptize infants ; and they might baptize thousands , tho the scripture ( which contains not the hundredth part of what they did ) doth not expresly tell us so . 2. but this argument also will fall on your selves . thus , the scripture doth not tell us , that the apostles did deny baptism to any christian's infant , or administer it to any adult person descending from a christian , ( tho from the death of christ , to the death of st. iohn , was near 60 years ; in which time , thousands of christian infants must become adult , ) therefore your practice being such , is not according to christ's commission . 3. but we have some probable instances of baptizing infants : whole housholds were baptized . i only consider the jailor , acts 16. 33. he and all his were baptized straitway . all his , upon his believing . anti-p . but all his house believed . p. bapt. the original is , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and he rejoiced in , with , or through all his house , he having believed in god. * not a word of any believing but himself , yet he and all his are baptized . anti-p . but the word was preached to all that were in his house , which of necessity supposeth them able to hear . p. bapt. 1. no more than those words , mark 16. 15. go preach the gospel to every creature , supposeth stones able to hear , because stones are creatures . all in one place , and every in the other , is to be understood with limitation , according to the capacity of the subject . 2. but i add , it might be preached to some as included in their parents . pray give me the like probable instance for your practice . anti-p . christ himself was the son of a believer , yet not baptized till adult . p. bapt. but the virgin mary was a jewish , not christian believer , in christ's infancy . the very first commission for christian baptism , was not then given : christ himself was born a jew ; and we all assert , that jews tho never so pious , ought not to be baptized , till they profess the christian faith ▪ christ , as to the time of baptism , was not imitable by us : if he were , then none , how pious soever , must be baptized till about thirty ; nor baptized at all , unless circumcised at eight days old. anti-p . you demand of us , a prohibition of infant-baptism ; i demand of you a prohibition of salt , cream , oil and spittle , such as the papists use . p. bapt. when you can shew , that these are as plainly included in the word [ baptize ] as infants are in the word [ nations ] we shall farther consider what you say . now according to my promise , i consider the doctor 's first argument , which will fairly introduce the opponency . anti-p . arg. 5. christ hath no where required any of his ministers to baptize infants , therefore the baptism of infants , is not according to his commission . p. bapt. i assert , christ hath required his ministers to baptize the infants of professed christians . and now taking the opponency , i argue , from mat. 28. 19 , 20. teach all nations , baptizing , &c. arg. 1. those of nations ought to be baptized , that are not expresly or consequentially excluded by the word of god ; therefore the infants of professing christians ought to be baptized . you have not been able hitherto to prove them excluded ; therefore my argument stands good against you . anti-p . what is not expresly commanded in an institution , is consequentially forbidden . p. bapt. 1. then the baptism of adult persons descending from christians , not being expresly commanded , is consequentially forbidden . 2. i deny , that all things pertaining to an ordinance , must be express'd in the institution for that ordinance . the institution for the passover doth not express the cup , which yet was piously used by christ himself , luke 22. 17. because good consequence did warrant it . your selves acknowledge previous examination and stated prayer necessary to the right administration of baptism , and have recourse to good consequence for your warrant : nay , consequence it is that doth oblige you to baptize an adult person ; you do not count these forbidden , because not express'd in the institution , why then should you count infant-baptism forbidden , because not express'd , when we offer good consequence for it . p. bapt. arg. 2. some infants are members of the gospel-church visible , therefore they ought to be baptized . anti-p . all members of the gospel-church visible , are made so by baptism ; therefore , unless you will admit of re-baptizing , they ought not to be baptized . p. bapt. baptism is the solemn investing sign ; the infants of believers , are church-members before baptism , but by baptism , they are publickly owned as such . the infants of the iews , were church-members before circumcision : the israelites while in the wilderness , tho uncircumcised , are called the church , acts 7. 38. yet they must be recognized as such by circumcision . a king is king before he is crowned , but at coronation , he is 〈◊〉 as such . anti-p . the pharisees were church-member● , yet 〈◊〉 denies them baptism ; therefore church-membership gives no right to baptism . p. bapt. these were members of the jewish church ▪ such , without credible profession of faith and repentance ▪ were not to be baptized . but we speak of members of the christian church . anti-p . infants are not christian church-members p. bapt. i prove they are , from mat. 19. 14. suffer little children to come unto me , for of such is the kingdom of heaven . if by the kingdom here , must be meant the christian church * visible , then little children must be part of it . anti-p . i deny that the christian church visible , is there meant . p. bapt. if the kingdom of heaven here , signify neither the laws nor promises of the gospel , nor the graces , nor heaven's glory , then it must signify the christian church visible . but it cannot signify either of the former ; therefore the last , i. e. the christian church visible . anti-p . it signifies the kingdom of glory . p. bapt. then it must either signify the happiness , or subjects of it . if the happiness , then the words must run thus ; of such little children is the happiness of heaven , which is nonsense . if the subjects , then the words must run thus ; of such little children , are the subjects of the kingdom of glory . which cannot be , because every infant that goes to heaven , immediately upon his expiration , his infancy is drop'd , and he enters perfect into glory . [ here the anti-pedo-baptists had not a word to answer for a considerable time , tho the whole company did earnestly wait for it : and they were provok'd to give it . ] at last , this reply was given . anti-p . this text hath not a word of baptism in it . p. bapt. we before proved , that members of the christian church have a right to baptism , and now have proved . that believers infants are such members . the conclusion is easy ; therefore such infants ought to be baptized . anti-p . when were any , who were baptized in infancy , excommunicated upon their apostacy , tho so many prove wicked ? p. bapt. we are not discoursing how baptized persons ought to be managed , but who ought to be baptized . yet , to answer directly , as infants grow up , their infant state ceaseth , and so their infant church-membership with it : and if , when they become adult , by vicious practice they renounce adult church-membership , they are no more church-members than excommunicated persons : and such need no excommunication . anti p. if infants without understanding , may be disciples by the ministery of men , the beasts of the field may . p. bapt. i have shewn before , how infants may be disciples , and by the ministery of men , in answering your first argument . pray shew me how beasts may ; have beasts the seeds of reason ? are they capable to be justified , sanctified , glorified ; nay , to keep the charge of the sanctuary ? were they fit to be brought to christ for his blessing ? but i proceed further to prove them disciples . argum. 3. the infants of believers , are called disciples , acts 15. 10. therefore they ought to be baptized . why tempt ye god to put a yoak upon the necks of the disciples , &c. the yoak was circumcision : upon infants as well as others , according to moses his law v. 5. and custom v. 1. * would they have put this yoak ; therefore infants , as well as others , are here called disciples . anti-ped . infants cannot be meant , because those that ▪ are here called disciples , are called brethren , and such as are taught . p. bapt. and if infants are church-members , ( as i have proved ) they are brethren , and may be taught in their parents . but ( 2. ) i deny , that all who are here called disciples , are called brethren v. 1. or are said to be taught . those on whom the yoak was like to be put , according to moses his law , v. 5. and custom , v. 1. are here called disciples . now , you know moses's law and custom , did require the circumcising of infants . nay , this custom , especially of circumcising infants , is expresly contended for by judaizing christians , acts 21. 21. the word for custom , is the same with that acts 15. 1. anti-p . but how do you know any infants were among these ? p. bapt. from v. 22 , 23. which tell us , that the christians of antioch , syria , and cilicia , ( and therefore a great number who must have infants ) were concerned in this matter . anti-p . but v. 9. they are said , to have their hearts purified by faith. p. bapt. and cannot god give infants the seed of faith , and purifie their hearts by so doing ? may he not purge out old principles by putting in new ? ( 2. ) but those v. 9. are the gentiles of caesarea , not those at antioch , and therefore not the disciples here meant , as the context will shew . anti-p . but circumcision cannot be the yoak here intended , because infants did bear circumcision ; but this neither they , nor their fathers , were able to bear . p. bapt. this expression signifies no more , than that it was a very burdensome yoak . thus prov. 30. 21. for three things the earth is disquieted , and for four , which it cannot bear ; and yet you may see in the context , that they are such as the earth hath born to this day ; but it is burdened with them . so prov. 18. 14. anti-p . but circumcision binds to keep the whole law , therefore the whole law is here intended . pedo-bapt . then i am sure circumcision , one of the prime and most painful parts of the law , and the only part particularly mention'd ▪ must be intended , and therefore infants must be some of those disciples on whom they would impose this yoak . question ii. whether , according to our lord's commission , baptism ought to be administred by dipping , plunging , overwhelming only , and not otherwise ? anti-p . i affirm and offer this argument : christ hath appointed it so to be administred only : therefore it must . i prove this , first , from the signification of the word baptize . lexicographers , say , it signifies to dip. p. bapt. they say , it signifies also to wash ; and this is the usual scripture sense of the word : and scripture is its own best expositor . now , to say , it signifies to dip in those texts where the ordinance is mentioned , and which are especially the subject of our present controversy , is but barely to assert , and not to prove the thing in question . therefore let us first go to those places where the word is mentioned , and the ordinance not intended , and consider other texts afterwards . anti-p . i say , the scripture sense of the word is to dip. p. bapt. i have seven places at hand wherein the word is used , and the ordinance not meant ; in none of which is dipping necessarily included . ( 1. ) . mark 7. 4. except they wash , ( greek , be baptized ) they eat not . were they dip'd over head and ears when they did eat ? no , they were zealous for the traditions and customs of their elders , and therefore did imitate their two great prophets , elijah , and elisha . see 2 kings 3. 11. it was elisha's custom , to pour water on the hands of elijah . therefore , in all probability , they had water poured on their hands . and why may not a person be baptized with pouring water on his face , as well as with pouring water on his hands ? ( 2. ) in the same verse , they hold the washing ( greek , baptisms ) — of tables , or beds , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . did they plunge their tables or beds into water ? ( 3. ) v. 8. washing ( greek , baptisms ) of cups , i. e. from ceremonial pollution . burial is not the thing here intended , but washing . and washing the hands was commonly us'd to cleanse from ceremonial pollution : therefore pilate , in compliance with the iews custom , washeth his hands , when he would declare himself pure from the blood of christ. ( 4. ) luke 11. 38. the pharisee wondred that christ had not first washed : greek , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , was not first baptized . did he wonder , that christ was not plunged over head and ears before dinner ? the greek word , to a letter , is the same with that mark 1. 9. and pray , why may it not signify applying a little water , in mark 1. 9. as well as in luke 11. 38 ? ( 5. ) heb. 9. 10. diverse washings : ( greek , baptisms . ) such as those , exod. 30. 19 , 20 , 21. aaron and his sons are bid to wash ; i. e. their hands and feet . num. 19. from the 8th to the 19th . the word in the original , signifies purely to wash , yet th● apostle calls these baptisms . if washing the hands or feet be baptism , why may not washing ▪ the head ? ( 6. ) baptized in the cloud , and in the sea , 1 cor. 10. 2. not dipped , be sure , for they went through the sea as on dry ground . is any dipp'd in the sea , when he hath dry land under him , and only the droppings of the rain and sea ▪ upon him . i must take ▪ liberty to dissent from the reverend author of the english annotations , in this matter ; i never heard , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , much less 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , did signify plunging under water , unless the water were applied , not by drops , but in a great quantity . ( 7. ) acts 1. 5. i will baptize you with the holy ghost , and with fire . is it proper to say , i will dip you with the holy ghost and with fire ? anti-p . but acts 2. beginning . the holy ghost came upon them , and there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind , and filled the house , &c. so that they were as in a fish-pond , ( says causabon ) overwhelmed with the holy ghost . p. bapt. but it was the sound that filled the house : the resemblance of the holy ghost , were the cloven tongues of fire , and certainly they could not be overwhelmed with these . and may not a man be baptized with water , when poured on him , as well as with fire , when descending only in cloven-tongues upon him . here are seven places , ( and more might be added ▪ ) where the word is used , and not one of them doth necessarily include dipping . anti-p . but it signifies to dip , in scripture : he that dippeth with me in the dish , mat. 26. 23. p. bapt. the word there is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : and pray remember , the holy ghost never expresseth the ordinance by the word bapto , but always by baptizo . anti-p . but in those places where the ordinance is mentioned , the word must signify to dip ; as mark 1. 9. christ was baptized of iohn in iordan , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , into iordan . he could not be washed into iordan ; therefore he must be dipped . see various places , where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies into , 1 tim. 1. 15. iohn 3. 17. luke 4. 16. p. bapt. i shewed before , that the greek word there for baptized , to a letter , signifies in luke 11. 38. washing , and that when applied to the hands only . and now , whereas you produce three places , where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies into , i can produce more than three times three , where it signifies in . see mat. 2. 23. mat. 10. 41. mark 3 ▪ 16. luke 11. 7. mark 5. 34. &c. therefore the words may ▪ be fairly render'd , he was washed of john in jordan . anti-p . but compare with this , mat. 3. 16. christ , when he was baptized , went up out of the water ; therefore he must be dipped . p. bapt. the greek preposition for out of , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , may be render'd from : see mat. 24. 31. luke 1. 78. mat. 12. 42. and those words , mat. 3. 16. may be render'd , christ went up from the water . now , i offer a fair paraphrase of these texts , consistent with our way . iohn preached in the wilderness near iordan ; ierusalem and all iudea came to him , and christ among others . the multitude being so great , he goes to iordan ( as he did another time to enon ) takes a step into the water ; those that are baptized , do the like , ( it being refreshing rather than afflicting in that hot country . ) and there iohn doth baptize or wash them , by pouring water on them , and then they go up out of or from the water , which alway runs in a lower place . this is much more probable , than that iohn or the apostles , acts 2. should dip ( according to your way ) hundreds , it may be thousands in a day : that person had need have sinews of brass , that could ( according to your custom ) bear the weight of , lay down , and raise up so many in so little time : besides his limbs and body must be soundly soak'd . i am sure the words will well bear our sense . and probability is much stronger on our side , than yours . anti-p . but the eunuch is a clear instance for us , acts 8. 38 , 39. they came to a certain water , went both down into , and came up out of the water . p. bapt. this instance doth you not the least service . the greek prepositions for to , into , out of , may be render'd fairly ▪ by , to , from. and without the least violence , the text may be thus translated . [ they came by a certain water , and went both down to the water , and came up from the water . anti-p . but could not water be brought to them in the chariot , if a little were sufficient ? p. bapt. do you think there was convenient room in the chariot to place themselves in a praying posture , or that they were so irreligious , as not to pray at all ? anti-p . but baptism doth represent a burial , rom. 6. 4. col. 2. 12. buried with him in baptism , &c. therefore it must be administred by dipping . p. bapt. it is one thing to be buried with christ in baptism , and another for baptism to represent a burial . a person is obliged in baptism , to die and be buried with christ , to sin and the world ; but it 's not necessary that baptism should represent these . in the lord's supper we are obliged to this burial ; doth it therefore follow , that the lord's supper must represent a burial ? ( 2. ) but supposing , ( not granting ) that baptism must represent a burial , pouring water on the face , the most remarkable part of the body , doth represent a person 's being under water , and raising him up ; represents the resurrection . anti-p . this is like burying with a turf on the head. p. bapt. what then ? a person may be buried as well with a turf on the head , as * feast abundantly at the lord's supper , with a bit of bread , and a sup of wine ; a small quantity of the element is sufficient for its sacramental use . anti-p . but let us keep strictly to the significancy of a burial . p. bapt. then i am sure , the baptized person must not go into the water to his wast . do dead men walk into the grave , half bury themselves , and wait for the sexton to bury their head and shoulders ? anti-p . but the whole body is under water , when a person is baptiz'd in our way . p. bapt. but the administrator dips but one half . and , doth he speak truth , when he tells the world , that baptism is dipping the whole body under water , and that he doth , according to his sense of the word , baptize , i. e. dip the whole body under water , when he dips but one half ? and dare he to affix the name of father , son , and holy ghost , to an untruth ? do you think , iohn the baptist and the apostles , did so ? and if not , then you have not the least precept or example , for your practice . is our way attended with this inconvenience ? but further , baptism is designed to signify the pouring out of christ's blood , spirit , and blessing ; the application of this blood , which is expressed by sprinkling * to signify and excite to a submissive frame of spirit . is your way so well adapted to all these ends ? can any be thrust into the spirit or blessing of christ , or are persons like to be so composed ( supposing them adult ) when striving for life , especially in frost and snow , as when a little water only is poured on them ? anti-p . but many learned paedo-baptists acknowledge , that our way is most agreeable to scripture . p. bapt. 1. will you stand by the authority of these men in other matters ? if not ▪ why would you have us in this ? ( 2. ) do any of these say , that to wash , is not the new-testament sense of the word ? or , do they prove us in the wrong ? we take not men's opinions upon trust , but tryal . ( 3. ) who of those authors have not adhered to that , mat. 12. 7. i will have mercy and not sacrifice , to justify their baptizing with a little water in these cold countries . ( 4. ) will not the opinion and practice of your brethren in holland , argue as strongly against you , as the opinion of these men , had their practice been dipping also , do against us . ( 5. ) will not the opinion and practice of so many thousand men , great for learning and piety , at this day , argue more strongly for us , than these mens opinion only , without their practice , do against us . anti-p . but all you can pretend to for your way , is probability ; it may be so , and it may not . p. bapt. we acknowledge , the new-testament hath not fixed the quantity of water , and therefore we must have recourse to a moral precept , mat. 12. 7. i will have mercy , and not sacrifice : and this carries us beyond probability , even to a certainty ; which is this ; that we must so administer it as shall consist with the safety of the subject . christ , v. 2 , 3. justifies david's eating the shew-bread , from these words , tho a positive ritual law were therein broken . then certainly christ will justify the practice of applying a little water in these cold countries , where life might be endanger'd by dipping , especially when neither gospel precept , nor example , doth in the least oppose us . nay , and knowing that christ hath appointed for the strongest christians , a sacrament as pleasant as eating and drinking , we cannot imagin , that he would appoint one so very sharp , as plunging in frost and snow , for the weakest . i proceed to offer an argument or two more . p. bapt. i argue from 1 cor. 7. 14. else were children unclean , but now are they holy . arg. the infants of believers , are holy , therefore they have a right to baptism . anti-p . legitimacy is there meant by holiness , and therefore this doth not entitle them to baptism . p. bap. legitimacy cannot descend from believers , as believers , but from married persons , as such , whether they believe or no. but this holiness descends from believers , as believers , and therefore it cannot be legitimacy . ( 2. ) i deny that ever the word holy is so used in all the new-testament , tho we have it many hundred times , and therefore you force this sense upon it to serve a turn . ( 3. ) if legitimacy were meant , then the apostle would speak false . the words would run thus [ if the unbelieving wife be not sanctified by the believing husband , your children would be bastards . ] no , their being husband and wife , would secure their children from bastardy : nay , and then all the idolaters and murderers in the world , if legitimate , would be holy. anti-p . but holiness is not a ground of baptism , if it were , then horses bells must be baptized , &c. zech. 12. 20. p. bapt. when you can shew , that bells were once church-members , that they have immortal souls , capable of pardon , through the blood and merits of christ , of going to heaven , &c. then we will baptize bells too . anti-p . but children are pure , or holy , as all things else , that a believer hath , are pure , i. e. for enjoyment . to the pure all things are pure . p. bapt. then i am sure legitimacy is not here meant , because , if a person that hath a bastard , be converted and he truly penitent , that bastard is also sanctified to his enjoyment , because all things are . but you ought to shew , that pure and holy are the same ; holy doth imply a dedication to god. but meat , which the apostle there speaks of , might be clean , as many creatures under the law , which yet were not dedicated to god. in short , the word holy is taken , as commonly it is in other places , and it includes a visible separation for god , and relation to him . thus the body of israel * and afterward of a gospel-church , are called holy * in many places . arg. 2. from acts 2. 39. the promise is to you , and to your children , &c. this promise the infants of penitent persons have a right to ; therefore they have a right to baptism ; v. 38. be baptized , &c. anti-p . the context doth exclude infants from the promise , and therefore from baptism . the promise is confin'd to those that the lord shall call. p. bapt. if 't were so , then peter just upon receiving extraordinary wisdom from heaven , would speak impertinently : whereas , he says , the promise is to you and to your children , and to all that are afar off , even to as many as the lord our god shall call : he might have left out their children , and they would easily have understood , that their children if once called , should be comprehended in those words , as many as the lord shall call . and farther , supposing your sense to be true , this paraphrase may justly be put on the words : [ you grown jews , and ye gentiles , when called , have a right to church-privileges ; but your poor infants , who for many hundred years past have had the same , are now through the gracious efficacy of christ's death , strip'd of it , tho they ( poor hearts ! ) never did the least to forfeit it . ] do you think this would have been a good plaister for their wounded hearts ? and can we imagine , that neither these , nor any tender parents of all the jewish converts , would have put in the least plea to god or man on the behalf of their poor abject infants ; or if they had , that the scripture would have quite buried it in silence , when we have their contests about circumcising infants , recorded ? anti-p . but children are not impertinently mention'd , for the jews had brought the guilt of christ's blood upon their children as well as themselves ; his blood be on us and our children . he drops a word of comfort to them , with relation to these children . p. bapt. yes , all these children , and therefore their poor infants , on whom they had brought the curse , as well as an those of riper years . say they , his blood be upon our children , whom we have a right in , and are concerned for . this they spake to spit their venom against christ , and the apostle chargeth these jews with it , v. 23. 36. now , the apostle makes the plaister as broad as the wound , and assures them , that upon their repentance , the promise , and therefore church-privileges would belong to their children , with themselves , even all on whom they brought the curse . supposing the church-membership of our infants , to be the main thing opposed by you , i offer this argument to prove it . arg. 3. the infants of converted jews were not cast out of god's church ; therefore the infants of converted gentiles , are not kept out . i prove that god did not cast out the former , therefore neither doth he keep out the latter . arg. 1. god did not cast out those infants in judgment to them , nor in mercy ; therefore not at all . not in judgment : for , how is it consistent with infinite grace to inflict so great a judgment , as deprivation of church-membership on those who never did the least to forfeit it themselves , and whose parents are god's peculiar favourites ? nor yet in mercy to those infants ; for how could he in mercy deprive them of so great a blessing * except he gave them a greater in its room ? but where 's that greater blessing vouchsafed to infants ? 2. not one privilege of the covenant of grace , was ever taken away by the death of christ , in whom all the promises were , yea and amen . therefore the church-membership of jewish infants , was not taken away by the death of christ : and if not by his death then not at all . i prove , that church-membership is a privilege of the covenant of grace . it must be of the covenant of grace , or of works ; but it cannot be of works ; therefore it must be of grace . no other covenant but that of grace , hath set up a church in the world , since the fall of man , or admitted any into it . anti-p . have all church-members then a right to the covenant of grace ? p. bapt. they have a visible right to it . we ought so in charity to judge , while they are rightful members ? none could justly exclude those jewish infants that were regularly circumcised from a visible right , to the promises of the covenant of grace : because circumcision made them debtors to the whole ceremonial law , gal. 5. 3. and god never yet divided the promises from the precepts of that law , and these together made up the covenant of grace . those who are visibly under the preceptive part of this covenant , have visibly a right to the promissive part of it . but the jewish infants were to be manag'd by it , and ( as they grew up ) obedient to it , and so were under the preceptive part of it . therefore , &c. now , if no part of the covenant of grace , and so neither this privilege , which the infants of the jewish converts had , were ever taken away , then such converts were never cast out of gods's church , upon christ his death , or their parents believing . and from hence we may conclude ▪ 2. that the infants of gentile converts , are not kept out : because jews and gentiles have the same privileges in christ. this , i suppose , no anti-paedo-baptist will deny ▪ col. 3. 11. other arguments might be offered , as the reader may observe in the abridgment of mr. chandler's sermons prefix'd to our impartial account . but a design of brevity forbids here to add them . anti-p ▪ but after all , the best arguments you can offer for infant-baptism , are but consequential . let us have somewhat express . p. bapt. shew me where an adult person is expresly commanded to be baptized . anti-p . adult persons making a credible profession of faith , are disciples of christ ; therefore brought to be ba●●●zed . p. bapt. and what is this but consequence ? such a one is a disciple , therefore , by consequence , he ought to be baptized . this argument is convincing . i add , a believer's infant is , in a scripture sense , holy ; a church member hath a visible right to that promise , acts 2. 39. a disciple , therefore he ought to be baptized . is not this arguement as convincing as the other ? pray , how would you clear up your right to future happiness ? anti-p . i would endeavour to prove myself a believer an holy person . and finding eternal life made over to such , and not finding upon the most strict enquiry , one word in all the book of god , to exclude such from it , i should conclude my right to future happiness , unquestionable . p. bapt. well then , i have proved the infants of believers , holy persons , church-members , disciples , and this in a scripture sense ; such i have proved entituled to baptism . and not finding upon the most strict enquiry , one word in all the book of god , to exclude them from it , i conclude their right to baptism unquestionable . arguments for the baptism of an unbaptized professing christian , nay , for the true christian's salvation , are consequential , and yet most convincing . why then should arguments for the baptism of believers infants be slighted , because consequential , when they are so many , and so clear from scripture ? postscript . reader , to prevent unjust reflections , our design in this dialogue , was not strictly to confine our selves to the words of the disputation , but to present thee with the strength thereof ; therefore something then omitted on both sides , are here inserted , others more intelligibly express'd ; and we think nothing of weight then deliver'd , is here concealed . and whereas other arguments here totally passed by , might be urged to good purpose ; particularly from rom. 11. ( some hints of which , are given in our impartial account , page 4. second edit . ) we hope , necessary confinement to brevity , will be a sufficient excuse to the ingenious . books printed for abr. chandler . an impartial account of the portsmouth disputation ; with some just reflections on dr. russel's pretended narrative . by samuel chandler , william leigh , and benjamin robinson . with an abridgment of those discourses that were the innocent occasion of that disputation ; and an healing preface to the sober anabaptists : the second edition ; with a postscript . price 1 s. the young scholar's guide through the english to the lattin or writing-school : wherein the nature and use of vowels , consonants , diphthongs , &c. are demonstrated by plain tables ; and the rules for dividing long words into syllables , made useful to children , by sutable examples to each rule ; by which , a child , that hath learned his letters , may be speedily taught to read english exactly , &c. with some useful observations in orthography . price stitch'd , 3 d. sacramental discourses on several texts , before and after the lord's-supper . by mr. iohn shower . of the duty of grace : or a discourse concerning the possibility and fear of its being past before death : shewing the groundless doubts and mistaken apprehensions of some , as to their being finally forsaken and left of god : with the dangerous symptoms and approaches of others to such a sad state : in four sermons ; from psalm 81. 11 , 12. by mr. iohn shower . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a31661-e290 * see our account p. 70 , 71. for further answer . * see our account pag. 74. see our account . * see our account , p. 73 , 74. * i refer it to the learned , whether this be not the fairest translation of the words . * thus the 〈◊〉 taken , mat. 13. 47. 48 ▪ 49. comp . with v 41 ▪ mat. 11. 11. mat. 25 ▪ 1. mat. 5. 19. see our impartial account , p. 32 , 33 , 34 , 35 , 36 , 37 , 38 , 39 , 40. see our account , page 37 , 38. see our account , p. 75 , 76 , 77. the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , may well be rendred custom . notes for div a31661-e4290 see our account , p. 81. see our account , p. 78 , 79. * 1 cor. 5. 8. can't . 5. 1. * isa. 44. 3. heb. 12. 24. 1 pet. 1. 2. notes for div a31661-e6800 * deut. 7. 6. * 1 cor. 3. 17. * the great advantages of infant church-membership , see in our account , p. 8. a briefe answer to a discourse, lately written by one p.b., to prove baptisme under the defection of antichrist, to be the ordinance of iesus christ, and the baptizing of infants to be agreeable to the word of god wherein is declared ... that true baptisme and a false church are inconsistent, and cannot stand together : and also maintained, that the baptizing of infants hath no authority from the scriptures / by r. barrow. barrow, robert, d. 1697. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a31094 of text r12474 in the english short title catalog (wing b967). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 61 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 13 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a31094 wing b967 estc r12474 11692397 ocm 11692397 48218 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a31094) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 48218) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 10:24) a briefe answer to a discourse, lately written by one p.b., to prove baptisme under the defection of antichrist, to be the ordinance of iesus christ, and the baptizing of infants to be agreeable to the word of god wherein is declared ... that true baptisme and a false church are inconsistent, and cannot stand together : and also maintained, that the baptizing of infants hath no authority from the scriptures / by r. barrow. barrow, robert, d. 1697. [6], 18 p. [s.n.], london : 1642. "p.b." is praisegod barbon. reproduction of original in union theological seminary library, new york. eng barbon, praisegod, 1596?-1679. -discourse tending to prove the baptisme in, or under the defection of antichrist to be the ordinance of jesus christ. infant baptism. a31094 r12474 (wing b967). civilwar no a briefe answer to a discourse lately vvritten by one p.b. to prove baptisme under the defection of antichrist, to be the ordinance of iesus barrow, robert 1642 10668 18 0 0 0 0 0 17 c the rate of 17 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the c category of texts with between 10 and 35 defects per 10,000 words. 2006-04 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2006-07 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2006-09 celeste ng sampled and proofread 2006-09 celeste ng text and markup reviewed and edited 2007-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a briefe answer to a discourse lately written by one p. b. to prove baptisme under the defection of antichrist , to be the ordinance of iesus christ , and the baptizing of infants to be agreeable to the word of god . wherein is declared ( from his owne grounds ) that true baptisme , and a false church are inconsistent , and cannot stand together : and also maintained , that the baptizing of infants hath no authority from the scriptures . the simple beleeveth every word : but the prudent man looketh well to his goings . prov. 14.15 . by r. barrow . london , printed in the yeere , 1642. to the reader . although divers of the learned have declared the baptisme of infants to be but a humane tradition ; as p. b. confesseth in his epistle , page 3. yet notwithstanding , there be many that have , and doe take upon them , to countenance the same by the word of god , wherein they commit a double offence ; one in seducing the people , and leading them to disobedience against christ , mat. 28.19 . mar 16.15 , 16. whom they are to heare in all things , acts 3. the other in taking the word of christ , and putting it as a sword into the hands of men to defend and maintaine themselves in such their disobedience against him ; amongst whom , one p. b. hath lately taken part in publishing a booke to proove the baptisme of infants to be agreeable to the word of god , but ( as many times it falleth out when men undertake to defend an evill cause ) he hath so bewrayed the error of that doctrine , that in the judgement of any , who are but indifferently acquainted with the scriptures , there needs no more be said to discover the falsity thereof , and sinfulnesse of his owne practice in the same things wherein unadvisedly hee accuseth others . one instance j shall give thereby to cause the reader in pursuing his discourse , to take notice therin hee fighteth against himselfe , and in that thing most of all whereupon his whole building standeth , which is the perpetuity of the visible church under the new testament , page 1. and so by consequent of baptisme , whereby the matter of the church is differenced , page 3.4 . wherein hee maketh baptisme to depend upon the church ; whence then it must needs follow , that unlesse hee can finde such a church which hath successively continued from the first planting , untill these dayes , hee cannot assure himsefe that his baptisme received , is the ordinance of christ . but pag. 2.3 . he confesseth that he knoweth not where any such church hath continued , nor doth hee believe that any can be found that can make such a continuance of the church to appeare : therefore hee received not his baptisme from any such church , nor is it then by his owne argument , the baptisme of christ , but a counterfeit , or idoll come out of the bottomelesse pit , as hee himselfe speaketh , page 6. having thus destroyed his foundation , and impeached his owne baptisme , and the baptisme of the church of england , derived from the church of rome , a false state the mother of fornications , &c. as he affirmeth in the 3. page of his epistle to the reader , his whole building must needs fall to the ground , which thing being considered , i know it may be thought , that an answer to such a discourse should be altogether unnecessary ; for hee that impeacheth himselfe , needs no other to accuse him ; yet neverthelesse , hearing that some not well acquainted with the state of this controversie have by his mis-applying the scriptures in the handling of the same , been prejudiced against the truth , by him evill spoken of ; for their sakes therefore is this briefe answer made , wherein not regarding to follow him to and fro , in all his vaine wandering and tautologies ( wherewith his booke is stored ) i have reduced his whole discourse into such particular heads , as doe either concern the perpetuity of the visible church , the baptisme of the church of rome , or the baptisme of infants , &c. which hee undertaketh to prove ; for answer , i have made use of little , save onely what i have found in his owne writing , wherein indeed , is sufficient to discover the vanity of his opinion in these particulars , and to satisfie any that thereby have taken offence againg the truth ; but all that is said , will appeare to thee ( courteous reader ) in the following answer , and therefore i shall referre thee thereunto , and also unto the grace and guidance of christ our redeemer , in whose service i am alwayes thine , r. barrovv . a breife ansvver to a discourse , lately written by one p. b. &c. first , he saith , that the visible church of christ hath had a perpetuall continuance in the world from the first plantation thereof by christ and the apostles , and shall so continue unto the end of the world ; this he saith was prophesied , esa. 9.7.59.21 . witnessed , luke 1.33 . acts 5.29 . and confirmed , matth. 16.18.28.20 . and these scriptures are stable and true , and so to be accounted by all the saints , page 1. i answer , that these scriptures , and all other , being delivered by the spirit of god , 2 pet. 1.21 . are stable and true , and so to be accounted of all the world , acts 3.22.23 . and yet are not therefore the severall glosses and understandings of men given upon these or other scriptures alwayes stable and true , nor so to be accounted of any man . before wee give credit therefore to his construction of these scriptures ; wee will a little examine how he makes the truth thereof to appeare : he saith , that the perpetuity of the visible church was prophesied , esay 9.7.59.21 . and the word is yea and amen , &c. whereupon then it must needs follow , that if the visible church of christ hath not had a perpetuall uninterrupted succession in the world ever since the first plantation thereof , untill these dayes , though this prophesie in it selfe be true , yet his understanding and interpretation thereof must needs be false . this rule the lord himselfe hath given us , thereby to distinguish the true prophet from the false , deutron . 18.22 . hee saith , when a prophet speaketh in the name of the lord , and if the thing follow not , nor come to passe , that is , not the thing which the lord hath spoken , but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously . now , as hereby wee are taught to distinguish the true prophets from the false , so likewise are wee by the same rule taught , to know the true interpretation of every prophesie from the false , and therefore when any interpretation of any prophesie is given , and accordingly the thing follow not nor come to passe that is , not the thing which the lord hath spoken in that prophesie , but it 's a false interpretation , and he is a false prophet that hath given the same , of whom wee are taught to beware , matth. 7.15 . from which imputation , we shall now see how well he acquitteth himselfe . first , he telleth us , that the defection and falling away under antichrist was very generall and marvellous universall ; and this he proveth , rev. 13.8 , 16. ( to which also he might have added the 3.4 . and 7. verses ) and unlesse the defection under antichrist had beene thus universall , he saith the waldenses , who appeared in the dawne of the day , could not truly have beene called the first fruits unto god , as he conceiveth they were , pag. 2. we say so too , and also firme that the visible church could not continue under that defection , because it 's said , it was given to him to make warre with the saints , and to overcome them , and if to overcome them , they could not continue , for if they had not continued , then he did not overcome them and kill them with the sword , as it is said hee did , rev. 13.7.10 . compared with dan. 7.21.25 . moreover , it is said , that those which worshipped the beast , were such , whose names were not written in the lambs booke of life ; therefore the visible church could not continue under that defection . but if it did not there continue , yet haply it might continue under the greekes ? to this he answereth , that indeed the greekes did not alwayes subject themselves to the romane power , yet were they very little short in defection , in so much , that according to the measure whereby the romanists are measured , they will stand and fall together ; well but i demand ( although the church did not continue under the defection of antichrist , nor yet under the greekes ) whether he doe not conceive that some man may be found able ( though hee cannot himselfe ) to make it appeare that the the visible church hath continued elsewhere in the world ? vnto this he answereth , that he believeth none can be found able to make any such continuance of the church to appeare , page 3. if any could , he would thanke god for such a discovery . and who then can believe his exposition of esay 9.7.59.21 . &c. seeing that his owne mouth testifieth that no man can be found able to make the truth thereof to appeare ; and therefore it must needs follow , that he hath given a false interpretation of the scriptures by him alledged to prove the perpetuity of the visible church ; neither will he himselfe , nor any other ▪ be able to cleare him from the imputation of a false prophet , and one that hath spoken presumptuously in the name of the lord , deut. 18.22 . therefore having thus confuted himselfe in this point , i thinke it a needlesse thing for mee to spend any more time in the confutation of it . but seeing hee confesseth that none can be found able to make any such continuance of a visible church ( as he speaketh of ) to appeare , why are we by him blamed for not believing such a continuance , page 4. and why are we so often charged for not believing the continuance thereof under the defection of antichrist , pag. 3.4.5 . and 9. and why also are we accused for making christ a widower , in not believing a perpetuall succession of the visible church of christ , seeing he himselfe believeth no man can prove the perpetuall succession thereof ? what , would he have us believe that which he cannot believe himselfe ? herein hee is much more uncharitable then the pope ; who requireth none to believe what hee and his church believeth not . if christ must be a widower , except he hath alwayes a visible church in the world , then there is no salvation out of the visible church , because none can be saved which are not first united to , and made one with christ , ( and then what shall become of those believers which in all ages have appeared , such as ierome of prague , iohn hus , &c. who lost their lives for the testimonie of jesus , and were never members of any true visible church : i hope p. b. will not say that they perished in their sins ) and if they were saved , then were they espoused unto and united to christ ; and if so , then christ hath , and so may have a spouse , although no visible church , but p.b. i conceive , was so studious when he wrote his booke , to bring absurdities upon us , that he altogether forgot himselfe . furthermore , seeing hee cannot believe that any can be found able to make the continuance of the visible church to appeare , and that as hee saith , the administration of baptisme doth so depend thereupon , that by no meanes possible it can be had elsewhere , without a speciall commission given from heaven for that purpose , such as iohn the baptist had , page 4. & 6. i demand where , or of whom p. b. received his baptisme : from the visible church he received it not , for he knoweth not where any such church is , neither doth hee believe that any man can make any such church to appeare to have continued in the world , if any could , he would blesse god for such a discovery , page 3. & 4. belike then hee received it from one that had a speciall commission like to that of iohn the baptists , at least by his discourse he would have us to thinke so , but i know it will appeare that it was but a bull . but being unwilling to receive this confutation from himselfe , or having begun a discourse , so quickly to finish it , hee proceeds , and tells us , that seeing he believes that none can make it appeare that the visible church hath continued from under the defection of antichrist , then it is more then probable , that it hath continued under that defection , page 3. but i demand how that can be probable , seeing that but a little before he told us , and also proved , that the defection and falling away under antichrist , was very great , and marvellous universall , and therefore were the waldenses , who appeared in the dawning of the day , not unfitly called the first fruits unto god ; for they could not be the first , if there had beene a continuance , page 2. but he saith , 2 thes. 2.4 . it is said , that the sonne of perdition who exalteth himselfe above all that is called god ; or that is worshipped , sitteth in the temple of god , shewing himselfe that he is god , and therefore the church hath continued under the defection of antichrist , what is this , but i sir , no sir . but i answer , that the temple here spoken of , wherein the man of sinne sitteth , and is worshipped , cannot be taken to be the church of god , or that temple of the living god . whereof iesus christ is the head , ephes. 1.22 and wherein god himselfe dwelleth and walketh , 2 cor. 6.16.17 . the reason is , because that in 3. verse of this chapter it is said , that the man of sinne is not revealed untill first there be a falling away , and therefore his comming is said , verses 9. & 10. to be withall deceivablenesse ; in whom ? ( not in the church , but in them that perish , who , because they received not the love of the truth , that they might be saved , therefore god sent them strong delusions , that they should believe lies , that all they might perish , who received not the truth , but had pleasure in unrighteousnesse verse 9.10.11.12 . whereupon it must needs follow , that that temple or societie wherein antichrist sitteth and is worshipped ; consisteth of persons departed from the faith , verse 3. who are by god justly for that cause given up to believe lies , that so they may perish and be damned ; and therefore not in any wise to be esteemed the church of christ , or temple of the living god . and this must needs be so from his owne ground , seeing that by antichrist here spoken of , he understandeth the beast mentioned , rev. 13. as apeareth by his applying this scripture against antichrist , pag. 2. now , for as much as those that wonder after the beast , and worship him , are said to be such , whose names are not written in the lambs book of life , rev. 13.8 he cannot therfore understand the same to be the temple of god , where antichrist sitteth and is worshipped ( unlesse he conceive that the church of christ consisteth of such persons , whose names are not written in the booke of life , which i suppose hee doth not ) and therefore i conclude from his own grounds , that the temple spoken of in the 2 thes. 2.4 . is no more the temple of god , then antichrist , who sitteth therein , and is worshipped , is god himselfe , nor is otherwise to be esteemed , nor hath hee any reason more to affirme the one , then he hath to affirme the other ; from hence therefore it cannot be made to appeare probable that the visible church hath continued under the defection of antichrist , but it must stand as p. b. at first affirmed , page 2. that under the defection of antichrist it could not continue . but suppose it were probable , that the church had continued under that defection , then he saith pag. 3. that baptisme by which the matter of the church is differenced , hath there likewise continued , and there also it will be probable , that his baptisme derived from thence is the baptisme of iesus christ . ( here we may take notice by way ) that the best ground he hath for his faith in this particular , is but a probability : well , but seeing that he holdeth that baptisme dependeth upon the true church , then where no true church is there can be no true baptisme . now , i need not here demand whether conceives the church of rome to be a true church , because in his epistle to the reader , page 5. he desireth that none should thinke so of him , for there he saith , that he holds that state to be the mother of fornications , the great whore , sodome and egypt , &c. therfore it must needs hence follow , that the church of rome hath not christs baptisme ; for thus he reasoneth , if the church hath continued , then baptisme by which the matter of the church is differenced hath continued , page 3. but the church of rome hath not continued the church of christ , but is become the mother of fornications sodome and egypt , as he faith in his epistle , page 5. therefore the baptisme of christ by which the matter of the church is differenced , hath not continued in the church of rome ; whereas therefore , page 5. hee desireth those which hold that the church and baptisme hath not continued under the defection of antichrist would shew him the error and absurdity of such an opinion ; he may easily discover the error and absurdity hereof himselfe , if he will but take notice of what hee hath herein written , viz. that baptisme differenceth the true matter of the church from the false , pag. 3.4 . whence it will necessarily follow , that if the baptisme of the church of rome be the baptisme of christ which differenceth the true matter of the church from the false , then rome the false matter must thereby be differenced from it selfe , and become a true church ; as when at first shee received christs baptisme , and then shall rome be no longer rome , but a true church and state , differenced from a false by her baptisme which differenceth the true matter from the false ; and therefore for any to hold the church of rome to be a false church , as p. b. doth , and withall to maintaine that she retaineth the baptisme of christ , whereby the true matter of the church is differenced from the false , is as much as if a man should affirme even as he doth , that rome is the mother of fornications , and also that rome is the true spouse of iesus christ , which is both absurd and contradictory . i will therefore conclude this point thus , seeing that true baptisme differenceth the true matter of the church from the false , as p.b. saith , and yet the baptisme of the church of rome doth not difference her from the false matter , as he also affirmeth in his epistle , page 5. therefore the baptisme of the church of rome is not that baptisme of christ , which differenceth the true matter from the false , page 3.4 . secondly , that church which hath no other baptisme then the baptisme of rome , which differenceth not the true matter from the false , cannot thereby be differenced from the false church ; but p.b. and his church have no other baptisme then the baptisme of the church of rome which differenceth not the true matter from the false , therfore , p. b. and his church , are not yet differenced from the false church . whether therefore christ will owne the same for his spouse , or reject her as a harlot sprung from the mother of fornications and harlos , may very well be a question without question . but he saith , page 6. if the visible church hath not continued , then baptisme is ceased , and being ceased without a speciall commission , such as iohn the baptist had at first to baptize , it can never be againe obtained . to this i answer , that although baptisme were ceased , as hee intends it , viz. that there were no baptized persons in the world to be found , yet so long as baptisme the ordinance of god is found in the word , with a commission serving to the end of the world for believers or disciples to make and baptise disciples , as mat. 28.19.20 . baptisme may be againe obtained without any such speciall commission as that which at first was given to iohn the baptist ; for it will not follow , that because iohn the baptist might not baptise before baptisme was instituted & he commanded to baptise , that therefore believers after baptisme is instituted and commanded to make and baptise disciples may not lawfully baptise such as are made disciples , no more then it will follow , that because abraham might not circumcise himselfe and his males , before circumcision was instituted , and he commanded so to doe ; that therefore the israelites after circumcision was instituted , and they commanded to observe the same , might not , without a speciall commission , such as abraham had , lawfully circumcise their males . it was necessary indeed , that iohn the baptist should have a speciall commission to baptise , baptisme being not before instituted nor yet he , nor any other person required to baptise ; as it was necessary to the first building of the temple , that a patterne should be given , chron. 28.11.12 . but as then another patterne was not expected as necessary for the rebuilding therof at the peoples returne out of captivity , who performed all things according to the first appointment and ordination , ezra 3. so neither is it requisite , now baptisme being ceased , that a new commission should be obtained for the raising of it up againe . but that according to their example in the former instance all be done according to the first institution and ordination of jesus christ , mat. 28.19 . if it be objected as in page 8. that the commission was given to baptised persons , such as had received their baptisme from iohn , and therefore it intendeth none that are unbaptised ; i answer , that this commission requireth all such persons , who by the preaching of the gospell , either are or shall be made disciples unto the end of the world to be baptised , and christs voyce must be obeyed in all things whatsoever he saith , act. 3.22 . and that without delay , as acts. 22.16 . therefore there lies a necessity upon all believers to be baptised . what is now to be done in this case ? baptised persons from whom they may receive the same as in a right line , p. b. believeth none can be found , pag. 2.3 . for if none can make it appeare that the visible church hath continued , as he believeth none can , then can none make it appear that there are any baptised persons to be found in the world , and therfore ought cannot be had from any such , how then ? why in the 2 tim. 2.16 . & 17. the apostle telleth us ; that the scripture is profitable , and serveth for instruction in all righteousnesse , that the man of god may be perfect and throughly furnished unto all good workes , and if unto all , then unto this of baptisme ; whereupon therefore i confidently affirme , that as at first , iohn the baptist , at the command of god baptised others , though he himselfe was unbaptised : even so now ( according to his example ( which amongst other things was written for our learning , that we thereby might be taught what to doe in the like case of necessity ) rom. 15.4 . may a disciple at the command of jesus christ , matth. 28.19 . having made disciples by the preaching of the gospel baptise them for the remission of their sins . act. 2.38 . if it further be objected , that this example is extraordinary , and therefore not exemplary ; i answer , that every approved example , though extraordinary , serveth for our instruction and direction in the like extraordinary case ; and this is warranted by christs owne testimony , matth. 12.3.4 . where he declareth , that although in ordinary cases it was unlawfull for any to eate the shew bread , save onely the priest , yet in case of necessity it was lawfull and warrantable , both for david , and also for souldiers to eate thereof , whereby he justifieth his disciples , who in the like case of necessity , were enforced to doe that which otherwise was not lawfull to be done on the sabbath day . this is our case , and hereby wee justifie our practice in the point in hand , and by all which it doth appeare , that although baptisme were ceased in that sense wherein he speaketh , yet seeing that that there is a commission already given for baptisme , which by christ himselfe is extended to the end of the world , there is no need of a new commission for the raising of it up againe ; and therefore , from that which p. b. speaketh concerning nadab and abihu , their offering of strange fire , which the lord commanded not lev. 10. hee might more fitly have applyed against his strange baptisme , viz. the baptisme of infants , of which the lord hath never spoken , then against the baptising of believers at his command , and according to his owne institution , matth. 28.19 . but for want of better matter to fill up his booke , he was , it seemes , inforced to make use of vaine words . but this is not all for although it be proved that there is commission and authority for disciples to baptise , though they themselves be unbaptised in the case before declared ; yet there is another thing whereat p. b. is greatly offended , and that is the manner in which this new baptisme ( as he calleth it ) is administred ( which according to the institution ) is by dipping the whole man in water or burying the whole man under the water , col. 2.12 . rom. 6. this although the lord command the same , mat. 28.19 . and examples both of christ himselfe , mar. 1.9 . mat. 3.16 . iohn the baptist , ioh. 3.23 . philip and the eunuch , act. 8.38.39 . all of them giving witnesse therunto , yet he cannot believe it to be so necessary , as that a person who is onely sprinkled with water , should be esteemed unbaptised , p. 12. but what are his reasons that perswade him thus to judge ? he saith , at the most , sprinkling can be but a defect in the quantity of the element , and it 's wonderfull that a nullity should follow thereupon . i answer , that it 's wonderfull that any should esteeme that to be an ordinance of christ , which christ hath never ordained ; but christ never ordained sprinkling for his baptising but dipping mat. 28.19 . therefore sprinkling is none of christs ordinance and so by consequence must needs be a nullity ; but he saith , by thus urging the text , we place the substance of an ordinance in the criticknesse of a word , page 13. i answer , that we doe place the substance of every ordinance in it's conformity to the word of god , which alone giveth being thereunto , and for any to doe otherwise , it is very strange : but belike , he that by the word baptise will not understand to sprinkle , and accept the same for christs ordinance in baptisme , which is as much as if by the word ( circumcise ) the iewes should have understood to prick the finger ▪ & should so have practised and owned the same for the ordinance of circumcision in the judgement of p.b. he is a meere criticke , and placeth the substance of an ordinance of a high nature in the criticknesse of a word , as he speaketh . and whereas it is said that baptisme resembleth our buriall and resurrection with christ , which sprinkling cannot import , rom 6. col. 2.12 he answereth , that sprinkling or powring water on the face doth hold forth both buriall and resurrection , page 14. for those ( he saith ) that are sprinkled are under the water and buried , if not so , then he demandeth how they were baptised unto moses in the cloud ▪ and in the sea , when not so much as a hayre of their head was wet . i answer , that by this reason as they should not be dipped in baptisme , so neither should they be sprinkled , and yet shall they be under the water , and buried neverthelesse ; this sure is one of the mysteries which hee speaketh of , that cannot easily be perceived , page 10. but seeing he thus urgeth the baptisme of the cloud and of the sea in this and divers other places desiring that it may be well minded , as page 14.29.30 . i desire to know , whether thereby he understandeth the baptisme instituted by jesus christ , mat. 28.9 . if he doe not , then i demand , why he so often urgeth the same for an example in this point ? if he doe , then further demand why contrary thereunto in baptising his infants ( as hee would have it esteemed ) he sprinkleth water in their faces ? this practice of his to sprinkle water in the face , if persons may be baptised without water , must needs be a point of voluntary religion , as he speaketh of the surplise , and baptised garments , page 15. and hereby any may see how pertinently he allegeth the scripture . but he saith , that whilest we thus urge baptisme to hold forth buriall and resurrection ▪ we lose that which it holdeth forth equally therewith ( namely ) the sprinkling of the conscience in the blood of christ . esay . 52.15 . heb. 10.22 . ezek. 36.25 . heb. 12.24 . and the laver of regeneration and our washing in the blood of christ , that blessed fountaine , acts 22.16 . heb. 10.22 . 1 cor. 6.11 . rev. 1.5 . to which i answer , and deny that sprinkling in the blood of christ is required to be holden forth in baptisme , or that any of the scriptures by him aledged , doe prove any such thing , or make any mention at all of baptisme , and therefore are not to be applied thereunto being onely metaphors borrowed from those sprinklings used under the law , heb. 10.19.20.21 , 22. which , although the matter thereof might or did set forth the blood of christ , and the nature of it , being applied by faith , as 1 iohn 1.7 . yet did not the same at all set forth the manner of baptisme , which onely is to be found in the institution , matth. 28.19 . and those examples which the scripture affordeth us thereof , marke 1.9 . matth. 3.16 . acts 8.38.39 . together with that conformity and agreement with it , hath with death , buriall and resurrection whereunto the lord is pleased to resemble and compare the same , rom. 6.4 . 1 cor. 15.29 . col. 2.12 . and hee that shall affirme that that act of sprinkling , used under the law , is to be observed in baptisme , because the matter thereof did set forth the blood of christ , the matter of our cleansing may by as good reason maintaine that all those particular actions required to be used under the law for the cleansing of the leaper ( namely ) the applying of the blood of his sacrifice to the thumbe of his right hand , to the tip of his right care , and to the great toe of his right foot , ought also to be observed in baptisme , seeing , that the matter thereof pointed out the blood of christ as well as that did , which was used in sprinkling then which nothing more absurd can be imagined . as concerning our washing in the blood of christ , that blessed fountaine , the other particular in which he instanceth , and saith , that we lose by urging baptisme , to hold forth buriall and resurrection . i answer , that he is much mistaken therein ; for as dipping in the judgement of the spirit of god is washing , 2 king. 5.14 . compared with 10. so likewise unto washing by dipping is necessarily required much water , as is seene , iohn 3.23 . whereupon it doth follow , that like as dipping of the whole man in water , and his rising againe forth of the same , doth lively hold forth and represent his death , buriall and resurrection with christ , according to rom. 6.3.4.5 . col. 2.12 . so likewise his dipping or washing in much water , must needes be a full resemblance of his washing in that blessed fountaine , the blood of christ , set open to wash in for sinne and for uncleannesse , zach. 13.1 . we therefore by urging baptisme to hold forth buriall and resurrection , lose not that which ought equally to be holden forth therewith ( namely ) our washing in the blood of christ , &c. but p. b. himselfe , who for baptisme useth sprinkling , loseth both buriall and resurrection , and that which ought equally to be holden forth with them both also , to wit , our washing in the fountaine of the blood of christ , for that sprinkling hath neither similitude , nor any proportion with any of them . but he saith that a thing that is dipped in water , is not therefore washed and made cleane ; to which i answer , that then much lesse is that which is onely sprinkled with water therefore washed and made cleane , but i have proved before that dipping is washing , and therefore he that is dipped , is washed , and consequently made cleane so farre forth as the ordinance of baptisme doth require , that alone serving fully to demonstrate our death , buriall , resurrection with christ , and the washing away and cleansing us from all filthinesse in the fountaine of his blood zach. 13 1. yet this will not suffice , therefore he further urgeth , that in those countries where baptisme first begun , they dipped often , and also rubbed thereby to cleanse pag. 14. i answer that they dipped in those countries , where baptisme first began , is most certaine , and accordingly do we practise ; and when p. b. can prove that they dipped often , &c. and also justifie their practice by the word of god , wee shall therein also follow their example . but seeing that he conceiveth they dipped , and not onely so but also dipped often , &c. why then doth he accuse us ▪ who dip but once , as though that were too often ? and moreover if they used to dip where baptisme first began , then is dipping the old , and so consequently the good way , ier. 6.16 . and why then doth he reproach the same as a new way , pag. 3. and doth not rather , as he would teach his reader in the frontice-piece of his booke , walke in the old and good way , that he may finde rest ? ier. 6.16 . but it appeares that he loves to wrangle , and therefore , now contrary to dipping often , and rubbing to cleanse , he saith , that a little water serveth to set forth our washing in the blood of christ intended in baptisme as well as a great deale , and the washing of a part , as the face , according to the present custome as well as washing of the whole man as appeareth by christs washing of peters feet , iohn 13.10 . i answer , that a little water serveth not so fully to set out our washing in the blood of christ as a great deale doth , and therefore , when the lord himselfe would set forth this thing unto us , he doth it not under the resemblance of a little water , but of a fountaine of water , zach. 13.1 . and hence it was , that his messenger baptised in much water , iohn 3.23 . neither doth the washing of a part set forth the cleansing of us from all filthinesse . 2 cor. 7.1 . like as the washing of the whole man doth , and therefore , that we might draw neere in full assurance it 's required ( not our faces or feet ) but that our bodies should be washed in pure waters , heb. 10.22 . christs washing of peters feet he applyeth that as well as he doth the baptisme of the cloud and of the sea , and therefore , as i answered him in that , so i shall also in this ; if hee conceive that christ by washing of peters feet would set forth unto us the manner of baptisme . i demand then , why contrary thereunto , he useth to sprinkle his infants faces , when he christeneth them ? and why he doth not rather in a bason of water wash their feet ? i suppose therefore , that he knoweth well enough , that christ by washing of peters feet , would teach all his disciples humility , iohn 13.15 . and not to wash a part in baptisme contrary to his owne institution , matth. 28.19 . and example marke 1.9 . mat. 3.16 . but his great objection against the dipping of the whole man , is this ( he saith ) that it 's hard to determine how it can stand with modesty and shamefastnesse , and yet in the countries where baptisme first began , hee urgeth against us , that they dipped often , and also rubbed , thereby to cleanse , page 14. now , if he cannot determine how dipping once may be performed with modesty , &c. how will he determine how dipping often , and rubbing to cleanse ( as he instanceth ) could be performed with modesty and shamefastnesse ? surely he will conclude that they put on a linnen garment . but there it will follow , that they baptise the garments , &c. haply he will say not the garments but the persons in the garment , because that when he sprinkleth his infants he doth not strip them naked out of their clothes ; neither yet will he say , that therefore he baptiseth their garments into the death and resurrection of christ , but the infant that are therein . but if it must needs follow that they baptise the garments , &c. ( in their behalfe , i know though not in ours ) he will determine , that it was but an error in respect of the subject , like to the baptisme of an infant in the stead of a believer ( as he pleadeth , page 12. ) and therefore not worthy to be blamed or taken notice of . having thus spoken his minde against the ordinance of christ ( to wit ) the baptising or dipping of believers ▪ which in derision he calleth the new baptisme , page 3. hee returnes againe to the former argument the baptisme of infants , page 10. which , hee saith began many yeeres before christ died , or at least , before the apostles left the world , which indeed , must needs be true , if it be the baptisme which was instituted by iesus christ , as hee pretends to prove by these reasons that follow . his first ground is from the covenant of god made with abraham , gen. 17. which covenant , he saith was neither part of the new , nor yet of the old , chap. 17.18 . because it was neither confirmed with the blood of bulls , nor with the blood of christ ▪ which thing he saith , may seeme new , but yet he desires to see the error that attends its . i answer , marvelling that he should urge infants , being in a covenant not confirmed with the blood of christ , to prove their interest in baptisme , and so by consequent in the blood of christ ; the blood of christ is the blood of the new testament , mat. 26.28 . now , if that infants be not in this covenant confirmed with the blood of christ , then can they have no interest in baptisme which serveth ( as he saith page 14. ) to set forth our washing and sprinkling with the blood of christ ; there needs not therefore any more words be used to shew the errour that attends this new conceit urged to prove infants right to baptisme , when it not onely excludes them from baptisme , but also from salvation by christ . but infants being a part of the church and members thereof before christ , what doth let them from being so still ? seeing ( as hee saith ) the lord hath never spoken one word thereof , but the contrary . i answer , that although infants were of the church before christ yet the lord hath manifestly declared , that they should not be so now , christ the true promised seed being once come , as is seene , gal. 4.22 . &c. where the apostle thus speaketh . it is written ( saith hee ) that abraham had two sonnes , the one by a bond-maid , the other by a free woman , 23. but he that was borne of the bond-woman was borne ●fter the flesh , but hee of the free woman was borne by promise , 24. which things he saith , was an allegorie , verse 25.26 . the bond maid hagar shadowing out the old covenant or testament and her sonne ishmael which she bore to abraham after the flesh , or by carnall generation , shadowing out all the fleshly and carnall israelites which should proceed from abraham in after generations . the free woman , sara , pointing out the new covenant or ierusalem , which is from above and teaches her son appointing out christ , the promised seed as gal. 3.16 . and believers borne from above ▪ or by promise , as isack was the spirituall seed of abraham , as gal. 3.29 . and therefore he saith verse 28. we brethren , as isacke was , are the children of promise ; after this , to close up the full intent of the spirit of god in this thing , in the 29. & 30. verses , he sheweth that by the carnall and fleshly seed ishmael ▪ his persecuting of him which was borne by the promise ( to wit isaack ) whereupon hee and his mother , was by the command of god , both of them together , cast out of abrahams house , the church , gen. 21.10 . thereby was foreshowne , that when christ the true isaack should be borne , gal. 3.16 . and the barren woman the new covenant or gospell , should bring forth and beare sons unto god ( as verse 27. ) then should the bond woman , the old and carnall covenant , with all the carnall ordinances thereof . heb. 9.10 . together all her sonnes , the carnall and the fleshly seed be cast out of the house ( so saith the text , verse 30. ) cast out the bond woman and her sonne ; for the sonne of the bond woman shall not be heire with the sonne of the free woman , ioh. 7.35.26 . and therefore , although children carnally begotten were admitted members of the church before christ , yet are they not so now , but are with their mother the old and carnall covenant , with all the appurtenances thereof ▪ are to be rejected ( as was said before ) and so also is p. b. his exposition of this script ▪ page 22. which by the sonnes of the bond woman onely noteth such who have actually refused and rejected grace , as ioh. 7.35.36 . and thereby became bound ( as though by nature , before they had rejected grace , they had been free ) which is a manifest contradiction to the apostle , who by the children of the bond woman understandeth all that are borne , as ishmael was by fleshly generation , or all those who are not as isaake , who was by promise ( as before ) col. 4.27.28 . with 3 29. his next ground to prove the baptisme of infants is this , because the apostle exhorteth parents to bring up their children in admonition of the lord , therefore they were of the church , and so by consequent were baptised ; but how doth hee prove that they were of the church ? thus ▪ because the apostle , who had nothing to doe with those who are without , 1 cor. 5. exhorts their parents to bring them up in the admonition of the lord . to this i answer , that the apostle did not write this exhortation to the children who were without , but to their parents who were within ; besides where the apostle saith , that hee hath nothing to doe with those that are without , 1 cor. 5.12 . it 's manifest , that hee doth not meane that he hath nothing to doe to exhort those that are without , to know and feare the lord ; for hee was sent to preach the gospell to those that were without , that thereby they might be brought within , act. 26.17.18 . and hee acknowledgeth himselfe a debtor to all men to the unwise as well as to the wise rom. 1.14 , when he saith , therefore that hee hath nothing to doe with those that are without , his meaning is , that he hath nothing to doe to censure and deale with them that are without , for their evills of incest , whoredomes , thefts , &c. he was not by christ made a judge over men in those matters , 1 cor. 5.12.13 . no more then christ himselfe was , luke 12.14 . from this reason of his to prove infants to be of the church , and therefore baptised , ( viz. ) because the apostle exhorts their parents to bring them up in the nurture of the lord ▪ &c. it will follow , that because the apostle peter exhorts believing wives to be in subjection to their husbands , that so ( although by the word they could not , yet ) by their good conversation they might be won ▪ 1 pet. 3.1.2 . that therefore their unbelieving husbands were of the church , and baptised , or else the apostle medled with those with whom he had nothing to doe . but he saith , it 's an uncomfortable doctrine to hold that children are not of the church ; for if they are not borne members of the church , then they are brought forth children to the divell , pag. 25. i answer , that by nature we are all alike the children of wrath , ephes. 2.3 . our being of the church depending upon our new birth and generation , iohn 3.3 . and if all that were not borne members of the church shall be damned , then by p. b. his judgement , seeing hee cannot prove any true visible church to be in the world , page 3. ( and therefore no children to be borne in church ) there shall none at all be saved . is not this doctrine of his a very comfortable doctrine , for else what end doth he conceive was the preaching of the gospell ordained ? matth. 28.19 . acts 26.18 . he hath yet another argument which must needs be answered , for in it there is great confidence placed , and it 's this , the children of believers are holy and therefore may be baptised , 1 cor. 7.14 . to which i answer ▪ that the apostle doth not say , that the children of believers are holy , but he saith , that the unbelieving wife is sanctified to the believing husband , ( that is ) lawfull for his use so that he may lawfully abide with her , and needs not for her unbeliefe sake put her away , ( as was scrupled , verse 10.11 , 12. ) or else , if that shee were not , then the children which he should beget of her were uncleane or unholy , whereas being sanctified , or lawfull to his use , they are cleane , or holy ( that is , legitimate ) for the holinesse of the children here spoken of , is not concluded from the faith of parent , but from the lawfull use which the believing husband hath of his unbelieving wife ; for so are the words , the unbelieving husband is sanctified by , or to the believing wife , and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by , or to the believing husband , or else were your children uncleane , but now are they holy . this scripture therfore proves no more holinesse in the children of believers then in the children lawfully he gotten in the honourable estate of marriage by unbelievers , hebr. 13.4 . and so by consequence yeeldeth no better warrant for the baptising of the one , then it doth for the baptising of the other ; but i intend brevity , and therefore for further answer in this point , i referre him to a. r. his booke lately printed , wherein the same is handled at large . these are the best reasons that p. b. can shew to prove the baptisme of infants to be according to the word of god , which in regard they cannot give satisfaction to some , but they still notwithstanding doe sticke at the mater , ( as they well may ) and desire a precept , or an example to warrant the same , and therefore he promiseth to shew both , page 29. but first hee desireth that wee would give him an example of an unbaptised persons his baptising of others , and of the refusing of infants from being of the church both which being before sufficiently declared , we will now take notice how he performeth his promise : first he saith , there are examples of baptising of housholds , as the iaylers and lydias , acts 16. and the house of stephanus , and questionlesse divers others , pag. 29. but i demand an example for the baptising of infants , and not of baptising housholds of believers , such as the iaylors , act. 16.34 . and stephanus . 1 cor. 16.16 . and crispus , acts 18.8 . and questionlesse divers others . this is a bad example , ( for an example he will have it called though it be none at all ) to prove that the baptisme of infants which must be thus declared : housholds were baptised , but in some housholds there are infants , therefore infan●s have been baptised . this is as plaine an example to prove the baptisme of infants , as this that followeth is to prove the baptising of notorious drunkards swearers , thieves , murtherers , &c. whole housholds have beene baptised , but in some houses there are notorious drunkards , swearers , thieves , murtherers , &c. therfore the apostles baptised such , and such may be baptised . who seeth not your folly ? another example as plaine as this followeth , the whole church of colosse were buried with christ in baptisme , but children were a part of the church , therefore infants were baptised , col. 3.20.21 . i answer , that the whole church of colosse were buried with christ in baptisme , and that there were children in that church to whom the apostle wrote and exhorted to obey their parents in all things , col. 3.20 . but our question is about infants , and not children in generall , some wherof are grown to yeers of understanding , as these were to whom the apostle wrote : for sure p. b. will not say he wrote to infants , which could not understand what he saith . in gen. 43.14 . when iacob sent his sonne benjamine into egypt , he useth these words concerning him and ioseph : if i am bereaved of my children , i am bereaved . now , by his reason , benjamine , who was about seventeene yeeres old , and ioseph , who was about thirty yeeres of age , should both of them be infants because their father called them children ; these examples will yeeld as little satisfaction to any that question the baptising of infants , as his reasons before answered . but although these examples faile , yet page 31. he saith , there is a plaine command of iesus christ for the baptising of infants ; and it appeareth thus , many nations appeare to be abrahams , and to have him for their father ; now , all these nations in which there must needs be some children , by the expresse command of iesus christ , mat. 28.19 . are to be baptised . i answer , abraham was to be a father of many nations , some whereof were his naturall and carnall seed , borne after the flesh , as ishmael and the iewes , who for unbeliefe , were rejected , and cast off , with the old and carnall covenant or testament , as was shewed before ; others were so to be reputed in respect of their faith , and walking in his steps , as it is written , rom. 4.11.12 . where it is said , that he received the signe of circumcision , the seale of righteousnesse of faith , which he had before he was circumcised , that hee might be the father , marke of whom ( viz , ) of all them that believe and walke in the steps of that faith , which he had before he was circumcised , according to which therefore it is said , gal. 3.29 . if yee be christs , then are yee abrahams seed and heires , according to promise . these later , his spirituall seed by the expresse command of iesus christ , mat. 28.19 . are to be baptised , goe yee ( saith he ) and make disciples , or believers all nations , and baptise them , and he that believeth ( as abraham the father of all that believe did , rom. 4.11 . gal. 3.29 . and is baptised , shall be saved marke 16.15 . but what is all this to prove the baptisme of infants which believe not , and therefore are none of abrahams seed , who onely are to be baptised ? no more then that which followeth which is nothing at all ; being the same in effect with this . the nations that are made abrahams seed , the nations that are saved , the kingdomes which shall become the kingdomes of our lord must needs receive christs badge . this is granted , but proveth nothing lesse then the baptising of infants , seeing none are made abrahams seed but those which are first made christs , gal. 3.29 . that wake in his steps , rom. 4.12 . and doe his workes , iohn 8.36 . neither doe any kingdomes become the kingdomes of the lord , but those that feare and serve him , that kisse the sonne , psal. 1.10.11.12 . heare his voyce , acts 3.22.23 . and have him to raigne over him , luke 19 27. nor doth the scripture declare the salvation of any more then those onely which believe , he that believeth on the sonne , hath everlasting life , but hee that believeth not shall not see life , but the wrath of god abideth on him , iohn 3.36 . therefore in refusing to baptise infants who believe not , we curtaile not the nation that are made abrahams seed , &c. i should have thought ( but that he denyeth a nationall church , page 39. ) that he would have all nations of people to be baptised , but seeing hee denyeth the former , i cannot charge him with the later but by this that is said , it appeareth how hee hath proved the baptisme of infants from matth. 28.19 . and other his instances then which nothing could possibly be alledged more opposite thereunto , but herein hee doth not seeme strange to mee , finding his whole discourse not onely ( weake , emptie and impertinent ) but so repugnant and contradictions to it selfe ; so that a man in the reading thereof ▪ may very well judge , that he wrote the same intending to desert and render the cause evil and naught which he pretendeth to maintaine , or else desiring to obtaine to himselfe a name amongst those vaine janglers , mentioned 1 tim. 6 who desire to be teachers , when they neither know what they say , nor whereof they affirme , verse 7. and so i leave him and the consideration of that which is said to those for whose sakes it was first intended , desiring that it may accomplish it's proposed end . col. 2.8 . beware lest any man spoyle you through philosophy and vaine deceit , after the traditions of men , after the rudiments of the world , and not after christ . jerem. 10.3 . the customes of the people are vaine . 2 thes. 2.15 . therefore brethren , stand fast , and hold the traditions which yee have beene taught , whether by word , or our epistle . finis . page . line . scapes . correction . 2 15 for firme , affirme . 2 18 for had not continued , had continued . 5 9 for there also it will , then also it will . 5 10 for by way , by the way . 5 14 for whether conceives , whether he conceives . 6 18 for be a question without question , may very well be a question . 6 32 for and commanded , and they commanded . 7 22 for ought cannot , it cannot . 7 41 for souldiers , for his souldiers . 8 5 for that that there is a that there is a. 8 33 for his baptising , his baptisme . 9 21 for further demand , further i demand . 10 3 for with it hath , which it hath . in the preface . page . 2. line 9. for pursuing , reade perusing , in the same line , for notice therein , reade notice how therein . the ministration of publick baptism of infants to be used in the church, or, a disswasive from baptising children in private by edm. arwaker ... arwaker, edmund. 1687 approx. 54 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 20 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2005-10 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a25966 wing a3900 estc r23012 12492569 ocm 12492569 62403 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a25966) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 62403) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 303:9) the ministration of publick baptism of infants to be used in the church, or, a disswasive from baptising children in private by edm. arwaker ... arwaker, edmund. [5], 44 p. printed by j. leake for edward poole ..., london : 1687. reproduction of original in union theological seminary library, new york. errata: p. 44. marginal notes. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism. 2003-04 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2003-05 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-03 judith siefring sampled and proofread 2005-03 judith siefring text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the ministration of publick baptism of infants to be used in the church . or , a disswasive from baptising children in private . by edm. arwaker , m.a. despise ye the church of god ? 1 cor. 11. 22. london , printed by j. leake , for edward poole , at the ship over against the royal exchange in cornhil . 1687. imprimatur . jo. battely rrmo p. ac dno dno wilhelmo archiep. cant. à sacris domesticis . july 12 , 1686. ex aedib . lamb. to the right honourable and right reverend father in god henry lord bishop of london . my lord , among the unhappy irregularities that crept into our church in the licentious days of vsurpation , none has proved so difficult to be reformed as that of baptizing children in private houses , when there is no necessity requiring it ; and that too with the publick form of administration . for not only they who are dissenters from us in the main , but ( alas ! ) too many who profess themselves of us , and would take it ill not to be reputed very good sons of the church of england , persist obstinately in this error ; and what is worse , are apt to express a high resentment , if the clergy deny to comply with them , while they at the same time refuse to hear the church . but it is our happiness , that their obstinacy , tho' great , cannot exceed or tire the pious industry and unwearied diligence of the religious prelacy , to reduce us to that primitive decency and order for which our church has been ever as venerable as eminent . of this your lordship is a very signal instance , whose zeal to free our church from this vile corruption is proportionate to that authority which you deservedly bear in it , and has gone a great way so successfully in the cure of that part which you more immediately adorn and govern , that we are almost assured to see it perfected there by your lordship's hand ; as we are encouraged to hope it will be through the kingdom , by the healing applications of its chief and worthily most reverend metropolitan . and since what is acted by our governours in a higher sphere , commands our imitation in our inferior stations ; i , who am not in circumstances of manifesting my obedience in a reformation , can only testifie my good inclinations towards it , in a weak endeavour of another kind , the following treatise that takes sanctuary under the vmbrage of your lordship's name . for which , while i offer it to your lordship , as an humble acknowledgment of former favours , i must beg the additional one of your pardon ; and i cannot despair of that for any thing that wishes well to a design you have still been forward to promote : and in that have added to many others , one more grand evidence of our happiness in your presidency over us , which labors to reduce our practice to the purity and splendor of those rules that ought to influence and direct it . but , my lord , i fear to offend as much by a tedious apologie , as by the unworthy present i would excuse ; and shall make only this for the imperfections of this piece , that the author has so much of the cares , and so little else of the world , as not to be supplied with leisure and books for an elaborate performance , such as might be fit to offer to the churches service , and your lordship's patronage ; than which there is nothing more in the ambition of , my honoured lord , your lordship 's most dutiful son , and most devoted servant , edm. arwaker . ministration of publick baptism of infants to be used in the church . as it is an affliction that through a strange deservency of the primitive zeal , in the exteriour worship of our god , so solemn and eminent a part thereof , as the publick celebration of the sacrament of baptism , should be so much neglected ( not to say oppos'd ) as to stand in need of patronage and assertion ; so it is an advantage to engage in the defence of a practice as antient as christianity it self , and as generally received ( till of late ) without contradiction or dispute . since therefore that devout and excellent office labours under such unhappy circumstances , and that no other pen has been purposely employed to redress the grievance : one of the meanest of its admirers , has ventur'd to expose his weakness for its cause , rather than suffer it by appearing friendless , to fall into more contempt . let him not be thought herein to presume on his own abilities ( which he is conscious how small they are ) since he espouses a cause so arm'd with truth , antiquity and reason , that it cannot be a sufferer , ev'n by the weakest management : which makes him imitate the hebrew champion , accosting the philistin giant , and despise the armour of fallacious sophistry , as sufficiently guarded and secur'd by the nakedness of that truth which he maintains . and he cannot doubt , but that the better it is discern'd , it will have the greater prevalency , and in spite of opposition , become more than conqueror . for the conviction then of such who refuse to bring their children into the place of publick worship , the church , to receive their initiation into the christian religion , by the sacrament of baptism , there in the face of the congregation ; but either through obstinacy , pride , or ignorance , contend to have that office perform'd within their houses : it may perhaps be pertinent to proceed in this method , and propose to their consideration . first , the rubrick of our church prefix'd to the office of publick baptism of infants . secondly , the consent in this particular , between the eastern and western churches . thirdly , the ground of this rubrick , upon what strength of antiquity and reason it relys . fourthly , the power of the church to make this injunction , and the indispensable obligation that lies on them to obey it . and lastly , to answer the most material objections , that are usually made against the performance of this duty . but here while the necessity of bringing children to the church , to receive their baptism , is asserted , it must be understood to mean it with a supposition of their being in a condition fit to be carried abroad ; for in case of sickness and extream necessity , where there is danger of their dying unbaptiz'd , the church has allow'd (g) st. john the baptist performing it in publick , and the apostles afterwards , when they were at liberty so to do : for it was done in the assemblies of the people , for the most part , which is one main thing requisite to make any performance publick ; and then it was done too in the publick places of worship , such as were consistent with the state of christianity at that time , the other great requisite to compleat a publick office. thus justin martyr , who flourish'd (h) early in the church , speaking of the manner of administring baptism , says , (i) they ( meaning the persons to be baptized ) are carried by us to the place where the water is , and are regenerated the same way that we had been before : and again he says , the name of the god and father of all things is mention'd , and we invoke that alone ; leading the person to be baptiz'd to the (k) laver or place of washing ; by which laver if he does not mean the baptistery or font ; yet he intimates the publick performance of the office , and is elsewhere positive , that baptism was administer'd in the publick assemblies , as we shall hereafter find him cited by the magdeburgenses , which sufficiently makes for the purpose of this discourse . for if in his time there were no public fonts , it was because the church was not then in a setled state ; and the church by performing those offices of baptism , and the like , in the places , and at the times of their more solemn meetings , did sufficiently declare those times and places to be the properest for such administrations . and that in the settlement of the church , they were determin'd to them , will be manifest from (l) st. athanasius who flourish'd in the year 340. who making an admiration of the villany of those times , says , was ever the like fact committed , even in time of war and persecution ? and this unparallel'd wickedness was the burning the churches and baptisteries : by which it appears , not only that fonts for publick baptism were then in use , but that they had been of much antienter standing ; for had there not been such places long before , how ridiculous had it been for the father to say , that the like wickedness had never been committed ( for the interrogation here is much stronger than a negative ) and to wonder at it as a new and unheard of thing . neither was the use of fonts unknown in the latin church , for (m) tertullian , of earlier date than athanasius by above a hundred years , (n) says , that going to the font , they ( the persons to be baptiz'd ) first made in the church , and under the hands of the chief ruler or hierarch , as (o) dionysius calls him , an open renunciation of the devil , &c. and (p) la cerda in his notes upon that place , says , it was not impertinently said by tertullian in the church : for this abrenunciation was not made at the font , but in the church , and then they went to the font ; which , as we shall have occasion to observe hereafter , was sometimes built without the church . and that this may not seem an objection against bringing children to be baptiz'd in the church , let it be remember'd , that though the baptism was sometimes administer'd without the church ; yet the examination and abrenunciation were always made within it . and st. greg. nazianzen in the fourth century tells us , that the person baptiz'd was led to the altar , saying , the (q) station in which we presently stand after our baptism , before the (r) great and holy place , represents the glory of our future life . and st. ambrose , a latin father of that century too , has much to the same purpose , thus , (s) afterwards the holy of holies is open'd to you . and in another place (t) that you may understand what is the second tabernacle , into which the priest introduced you , &c. to conclude this quotation of the fathers with st. chrysostom , much of the same age , we find him telling the persons to be baptiz'd , (u) that tho' they who at their death are initiated by the sacred mystery of baptism , might obtain equal favor and grace with those who did not defer their regeneration ; yet they had not an equal will and inclination , neither was their preparation ( which he much insists on ) equal . for , as he goes on , the first were made partakers of that sacrament in their beds , the others receiv'd it in the arms and bosom of the church ; where we find he directly opposes the baptism in the church to the clinick baptism , superstitiously used by some . which sort of baptism was so detested in the primitive times , that he who receiv'd it , was never , to be admitted into holy orders ; and it was objected to (w) novatus after his surreptitious consecration . and this will give us the true sense of that (x) council , where after mention of easter and pentecost for the administration of baptism , it follows : therefore we command all men , reclaim'd from their errors or ignorance , by these present admonitions , to wait with their infants at the church , that they may injoy the festivity of the lawful time ( meaning easter , &c. ) and be regenerated by the holy sacrament of baptism ; whereby they may , if they live , be capable of the honour of executing the priestly office. if these are not sufficient instances of this kind , (y) cocceius will afford the enquiring reader more . to proceed then from the fathers to the councils , we shall find in the third council of (z) constantinople , in the year 680. this express prohibition of baptizing any , not only in private houses , but even in the oratories in them . thus baptism must by no means be administer'd , in any private oratory within a house : but let those who being purg'd from their impurities , are thought worthy of illumination , be brought to the catholick churches , and there let them injoy this benefit : and the non-observation of this is punish'd with deposition of the clergy , and with separation in the laity . which canon is agreeable to that novel in the authenticks of * justinian , wherein he says , that it was establish'd by an antient law , that no one should perform divine offices [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] in a private house : which law the emperor there confirms with a new interdiction , making both the owners of such houses liable to a penalty , and the houses themselves to publick taxes . and he obliges the patriarch to see this law put in execution under the forfeiture of fifty pounds in gold ; and he gives the reason of the penalty , because it was a matter about which the emperor was studiously careful , as tending to preserve the unity of the church , and to prevent clandestine doings . tho' afterwards the emperor leo in his (a) constitutions allows baptism to be administer'd in private oratories , ( which oratories however were consecrated places ) but not elsewhere . and in another (b) council in 845. 't is decreed , that no priest should presume to baptize any where , but in the baptismal churches , and at the times appointed , unless in case of sickness or extream necessity . however it may not be impertinent to strengthen what has gone before , by some testimonies , which because they come from persons either indifferent , or profest enemies to any thing that had an appearance of superstition , will be unquestionable . (c) cassander the pacifick catholick , a man of much moderation and indifferency , who in one part of his writings , professes , it is his business to avoid partiality (d) and enquire into the truth of things ; tells us , that with general consent it was receiv'd in all churches , that only at certain times , ( that is easter and pentecost ) baptism was solemnly administer'd , and that only in the church by the bishop and priests , & c. and neither children nor the adult were baptiz'd in private , but in imminent danger of death , and when by reason of sickness , they could not without hazard of their lives be brought abroad . and (e) hospinian , who has given sufficient proof of his not being superstitiously affected , acknowledges that histories bear witness that the christians , after the apostles time did meet together , especially in times of persecution , in coemiteries , that is , places set apart for the interment of the martyrs , and that there they celebrated their religious assemblies . and he tells us out of (f) theodoret , that in the persecution under george of alexandria , when the adversaries of christianity prevail'd , and had got the churches into their possession , the christians were forced to meet in the coemiteries to perform their devotions ; and cites (g) onuphrius , who says , that because the primitive fathers were wont to assemble at the tombs of the martyrs of sacred memory , on the anniversary day of their suffering , the large and capacious places of prayer for their publick assemblies , lying near those burial places , were call'd coemiteries also . and he adds of himself , that the roman pontifices or bishops , were wont to celebrate stations , that is , all publick acts of their episcopacy , among the sepulchers of the martyrs ; and therefore , says he , these coemiteries were to the christians as temples and places of prayer , in which the bishops call'd their synods , and administer'd the sacraments . and to confirm his assertion , he tells us of an edict of (h) galienus , who lived in the year 256. extant , wherein the son commands the coemiteries which valerian , the father , had taken from the christians , to be restor'd to them , that they might meet to perform their religious worship there . so that whoever denies the antient custom of publick administration of baptism , must either make baptism no sacrament , or yield that there are more than two , or disprove this great authority , as well as several others . for (i) chamier , as little a friend to novelty , or superstition as hospinian , acknowledges this laudable practice of baptizing all persons in publick , and cites st. (k) ambrose saying that the catechumens being dismiss'd , he gave the (l) badge of their profession to some who desired it , or rather who were qualified for it , ( as some have critically distinguish'd between the catechumens and the competentes ) in the baptistery or font of the church . and the same author cites vasquez , saying . we use no other ceremony in giving the name , only to ask the sponsors by what name the person brought to the church to be baptiz'd , is called ? and again he quotes (m) st. cyrill , mentioning the baptistery , and telling his auditors that they and 7th century ; and they quote (y) paul the deacon , alledging that their baptism in private houses was very rare , and that only when necessity compell'd them to it . and this was continued down to the 13th century , as whoever pleases to peruse those writers , may be satisfied . this might be reasonably hoped to suffice for the antiquity on which our rubrick is grounded ; as to the matter of fact , that baptism was from the first institution still administer'd in public , that is in the publick congregation , and the publick place of worship , the two (z) essentials requisite to make the baptism publick ; and that as soon as the church began to be settled , and to obtain places for religious worship ; there were still set apart and erected places for the peculiar administration of baptism , according to that of (a) walafridus : the honour of religion encreasing through length of time , and success of affairs , the splendor of ecclesiastical constitutions grew to a just hight : and the cebration of the mystical laver of baptism became more solemn , and therefore spacious fonts were set up in which the priests did administer that sacrament of faith , with very splendid ceremonies : and tho' it was the custom at first to build these fonts without the church , as (b) paulinus says , severus did ; yet afterwards , says (c) durantus , they began to be brought (d) into the churches , near the porch . and accordingly (e) greg. turonensis shews , that the font in which clodoveus was baptiz'd by rhemigius , was placed in the church . this is the antiquity that gives occasion to our rubrick , and the reasons are as prevalent . two we have mention'd in the rubrick it self , and even those are by the wise and serious consideration of the church , thought sufficient to procure an admonition to the people , that it is (f) most convenient that baptism should not be administer'd but upon sundays and other holy-days , when the most number of people come together : ( which still argues the place of administration to be the church ) the first reason respects the parties baptiz'd , that they may have witnesses of their initiation ; the latter , the persons present , that they may be reminded of their own profession and vow made to god. the first has been ever thought so necessary by the church , that in such cases of necessity wherein it allows of private baptism , yet it still injoyns the children so baptiz'd to be brought afterward into the church , and there to be received in publick , upon sufficient testimony of the validity of their private baptism in the use of all the essentials to it . and it must certainly be a great satisfaction to any so baptiz'd in private , upon necessity , and consequently in haste , to be assured that nothing essential to his baptism was then omitted , and that the church had such satisfaction thereof , that it added those exteriour rites and accidentals that are the ornaments and appendages of a due administration of that holy sacrament : the omission of which rites the church never did allow , but upon some urgent necessity ; and not then upon any account but the uncertainty of their future state who leave the world without this badge of their christianity . and for this reason 't is , that the primitive fathers did so press the dispatch of baptism , that the persons to be baptiz'd , whether adult or infants , should be brought to church , lest sickness should deny them the happy opportunity of coming thither , and allow them only an office , as well homely for the insolemnity , as for the privacy of its performance . wherefore , says (g) st. greg. nazianzen , let us be baptiz'd to day , lest to morrow it be the effect of force ; let us not defer a blessing , as if it were an injury , till sickness or some other danger compel us to embrace it : and a great deal more he has to the same purpose . wherefore we may conclude this with that of (h) durantus ; parents are therefore to be admonish'd and exhorted , that as soon as they can without danger they bring their children to the church , and take care that they be baptiz'd with the solemn ceremonies thereof ; especially since by reason of their tender age they are in infinite hazard of being prevented by an early death . which argues , that besides the benefit of having the congregation present to testify their being received into the number of christ's church , it is an honor and advantage of it self , to have so decent and solemn a reception . the second advantage mention'd in the rubrick is that of the congregation's being put in mind of their baptismal vow , by hearing it repeated , and it is not a small help to the performance of a promise to have frequent memorandums of it . how readily , not to say how willingly , we forget our vows of obedience and new life , is but too obvious in our daily violations of them ; and it is an act of the highest charity in those who remind us of them . so that whoever with-holds his child from the publick baptism , deprives the congregation of a charitable office , which might perhaps have an influence on some or other there , in order to amendment and salvation . but besides these reasons , there are others of no less weight and moment hinted in the office of publick baptism of infants , tho' not mention'd in the rubrick ; and those are , first , the veneration due to the sacrament it self , as a main part of god's holy worship : and , secondly , the just regard and deference due to the churches , as places set apart and consecrated to his service . that baptism is a great and solemn part of god's holy worship , it is to be hoped , will not need much proof to any one who has had the honor and advantage to receive it . they who hold more sacraments than two , have yet allow'd in the title of the (i) entrance and in-let to the rest . 't is that sacred office wherein we solemnly dedicate our selves to god : wherein we enlist our selves souldiers under the banner of our saviour , and receive that (k) military badge that distinguishes us from his enemies , and take those (l) oaths that oblige us to fight his battels manfully . 't is the solemn celebration of god's worship wherein we express our esteem of it to be such , that we dare bid defiance to the devil for its sake : that we renounce the pomps and glories of the world , and neglect the pleasures and allurements of the flesh , the gratifying our appetites and inclinations to embrace it . 't is that solemnity wherein we declare our unfeigned belief of , and assent to all the articles of the christian faith ; and wherein we stipulate and vow to perform a ready and sincere obedience to all the commands of our creator . and sure an act of such general concern and universal benefit , an act of so much piety and perfection , should be performed in the solemn and religious manner : and solemnity we know is never perfect but in publick ; neither does religion tend so much either to the glory of god , or the edification of our brethren , when retir'd and private , as when conspicuous and eminent . besides , if we consider the nature of this sacrament of baptism ( the only rule , according to an (m) eminent person in our church ) whereby to determine the manner and circumstances of any action , we shall find never to be performed properly but in publick , because it is of a publick nature , as it concerns the whole society of christians ; and therefore is as well to be done in the presende , as by the authority of the church , when the celebration may be most publick and awful . for where can it be so but in the midst : of the great congregation ? the publick assemblies for religious worship held by the authority of the church in places separated by of all sacred offices . among which , * walafridus strabo tells us that it has a more than ordinary claim to that of baptism , which , saies he , is more properly celebrated there ; because we read , that before the tabernacle stood the (x) laver , and before the temple the (y) brazen sea , and the ten lavers , in which both the priests that were to offer , and the flesh of the sacrifices , were washed ; and it is very becoming those who enter into the profession of christianity to be regenerated in the temple of christ their saviour . none being fit to enter into the church , saies (z) another , who is not first cleaned in the water of baptism . not without great ground and reason therefore did the council of (a) ilerda , in the year 524. decree that every priest that could not procure a font of stone , should have a convenient vessel for the administration of baptism only , which should not be at all carried out of the church . nor with less discreet consideration , nor without great authority of fathers and councils , is it prohibited in the (b) clementins ; to any priests ; to dare to administer the sacrament of baptism in any halls or chambers , or other private houses , but only in the church , in which there , are fonts particularly for the purposes . unless to the children of kings , or upon such an emergent necessity , by reason of which the persons cannot , without certain danger , be brought to church to receive it . and then if we weigh this seriously , (c) and take tertullian's maxim with us , that in those things which the scripture neither commands nor prohibits , that is to be observed , which custom has confirmed , as proceeding from unquestionable tradition ; we shall not condemn our church for enjoyning , but our selves for slighting a duty so primitive and practicable ; a duty which 't is sure was never opposed by any church , nor by any sect that own'd the sacrament it self : but has ever been esteem'd decent and convenient by those who would not allow it to be requisite or of moment . but if it were neither an ancient , a religious , nor usefull practice ; if it were novel , indifferent and insignificant , yet being enjoyn'd by our mother the church , the holy catholick church in general , as well as the church of england in particular , it is obligatory to us who are members of the whole , and especially of that part : to some of whom ( with shame we must let the reader know it ) this paper is design'd , since it of late appears too usual with some of those to dispute the commands of the church , in this particular , and obstinately refuse obedience to them . wherefore it will be requisite to proceed to shew the churches power to make injunctions of this kind , and the indispensability of our obedience to them . in the catholick doctrine of the church of england contain'd in the 39 articles , it is asserted , (d) that the church hath power to decree rites and ceremonies , not repugnant to the word of god. now that the bringing of children to be baptiz'd in the church , has no such repugnancy , is undeniable , and will be thought so , till it appears wherein ; and then the churches authority to enjoyn it , will be evident from the practice of the apostles ( for from the beginning it was so ) in forbidding men to be (e) cover'd in the church , and obliging women to keep silence there ; in rejecting prayer in an unknown tongue ; and commanding all things to be done decently and to edification ; and several other instances , among which were those things , of which st. paul says , the rest will i set in order when i come . and we have an harmony of (f) confessions among all the protestant churches acknowledging the same . and the learned (g) chamier answering the objection of vasquez , that the protestants did some things which had no mention or command in the scripture ; as for instance , their custom of bringing their children on sundays , or other publick days , to be baptiz'd at church when the congregations were assembled ; defends the practice , and calls it an honest and decent circumstance of celebrating that sacrament : in things of which kind , says he , quis negavit ecclesiae extra scripturam licere ? now this power being granted , it will necessarily follow , that what our mother does so lawfully command , we must readily and submissively obey ; for in refusing , we sin as much against heaven that has given this commission to the church , as against its delegate , our grave and reverend mother ; and however we may arrogate to our selves the specious title of her sons , are no longer worthy to be called so . for by our refractory and stubborn carriage , we destroy her being as a church , whence we derived our own as christians . there is no body can subsist without oeconomy , nor oeconomy without subordination : for as there is variety of offices to be performed , so there are different parts and agents adapted to the several imployments and operations ; some for the authoritative , and others for the executive part. for as st. paul (h) says , if the whole body were an eye , where were then the hearing ? so ( 't is sure they should ) be the more afraid to alienate the property , and sacrilegiously rob god of his interest to transfer it to another : and when they meet with any that were witnesses of their dedication , they cannot without shame and confusion let them see how they have contradicted the good intentions of their parents , broke all the promises of their sureties , and frustrated all the prayers of the congregation made in their behalf . the third instance is in the prayer of consecration ; where it is no small argument to prevail for god's assent to the petitions offer'd in behalf of the child to be regenerated , that he would regard the supplications of his congregation , and comply therewith in sanctifying the water to the mystical washing away of sin , and in granting that the child ready to be baptiz'd therein , may receive the fullness of his grace , and ever remain in the number of his faithful and elect children . where we see the church has a great opinion of the prevalency of the prayers of the congregation ; esteeming its united force a kind of holy violence , that does as it were wrest blessings from the almighty , as an ancient (l) author intimates the design of the assembly to intend : telling us , that the whole sacred assembly is gathered to assist at , and celebrate the safety and deliverance of the person baptiz'd , and to return thanks for it to the divine beneficence . but still this congregation whose prayers are thought thus efficacious , must be such an assembly of which the minister may safely and truly say , thy congregation ; for there can be no validity in the prayers of any but god's congregation ; and that is none of his , which is not assembled in the place which the church has appointed , and by its allowance and authority . now private houses were never allow'd of by the church , much less commanded to be the places of publick baptism ; and they who so illegally assemble there , are as much guilty of disorder in the church , as they who meet in prohibited numbers or places , are of a riot in the state. the fourth instance is the receiving the child ; when the minister , having first named and baptiz'd him , and still holding him in his arms , uses these words , as it were of matriculation , we receive this child into the congregation of christ's flock , &c. which reception does not only mean the whole body of the universal church , but as well that representative part thereof then present , and consenting to it as proxy for the whole . and the minister's embracing the child , is for the same end as the imposition of hands in baptism was of old ; which (m) durantus tells us signified the reconciliation , by which he that was without the church , a child of wrath , according to our catechism , was in the church received into the church's favour , and made a child of grace . and besides all this , our church for farther prevention of the performance of this publick office in private , has in cases of necessity , prepared and injoyn'd a private form of baptism , to be administred to those , who by reason of sickness cannot be brought abroad without peril of their lives . which we find by an antient (n) council to be an indulgence , only on supposition of invincible necessity ; and rather than such who cannot be safely brought to church , should die unbaptiz'd , they may have this sacrament administred to them at home ; but this still with an injunction , that if they out-live their sickness , as soon as they are fit to be carried abroad , they should be brought to (o) church , that those prayers and rites which were before omitted in the office , may be there publickly supplied : which is a most convincing argument of the church's sense in this matter , as well as of its determination ; and should be sufficient of it self to oblige every genuine and obedient son to acquiesce therein . but since , by sad experience , we find many refractory and undutiful ; the next and last thing will be to enquire into their objections against this duty , or pleas for not performing it . as for objections against it , there are truly none ; for to urge that st. john the baptist , and the apostles baptiz'd their converts every where , in lakes , and ponds , and rivers , in houses , fields and prisons , does not at all make against the administration of baptism now in churches only . for what they did then in the infancy of the church , was suited to its circumstances , and it was then impossible to have large assemblies , and much more churches for that purpose , till christianity gain'd ground and obtain'd in the world ; and to argue that baptism ought not to be administred in churches , because it was not so at first , is as ridiculous , and inconsequent , as 't would be to say , that we should not live in houses now , because 't is known the israelites , who were god's people , dwelt at first in tents . for their not having churches and fonts for baptism , was not because they were unfit , or unnecessary , but because they could not have them ; as (p) beda says of the ancient britains , that in the beginning of christianity there , where their churches could not be so soon erected , the people were generally baptiz'd in rivers ; but we find that quickly discontinued , and fonts provided for that purpose . to all which there needs only this be added , that (q) he who said every day was the lord's , and every hour and time fit and convenient for baptism , yet did not affirm the same hability of place ; for he could not so well say of place as of time , if it is conducing to the solemnity , it is insignificant as to the grace conferr'd ; for tho' it does not tend to the esse , yet it does to the bene esse of the sacrament . for it has been generally allowed , that god is more immediately present , upon general occasions , in the places of his publick worship than elsewhere ; his presence being there in st. augustin's opinion , sacratior & commendatior : who likewise affirms it to be a very convenient providence , that god should confer his favours in that place where his name is praised ; and that man should receive them there where he does praise it . but not to insist longer on this point , let us proceed to consider the other reasons pretended for baptising children at home ; or rather why their parents are unwilling to bring them to the church . and indeed , among the richer sort we find it to be nothing but a piece of state . for if their children , by reason of indisposition of body , cannot be brought abroad , as some pretend , why are they not then contented to have the private office of baptism administered to them , according to the direction and practice of the church ? which certainly they would desire , if that were the true or only reason . and if they think there is no significancy or virtue in the ceremony of the publick office , why do they then so eardestly contend to have it used in private ? by which they sufficiently discover , that not the indisposition of their childrens bodies , but of their own minds makes them neglect the church , celebrate a sacrament at home , for which the publick is the only proper place . that they ought not to be complied with herein is certain ; because god is no respecter of persons : and tho' we find it sometimes indulged to the children of kings , it was only on supposal of their having consecrated chapels in their palaces . and for all this , we find both princes themselves and their children baptiz'd in the church : many examples whereof are cited by (r) paul the deacon ; particularly advaldus . son of agilulfus , king of the longobards , baptiz'd by the bishop of modoctia , in the church of st. john the baptist ; and the son of heraclius , baptiz'd by sergius , in the (s) blacerne at byzantium ; of which son of heraclius (t) zonaras relates , that the whole senate of constantinople was invited to his christening : but the fond mother still more tender than her infant , dares not trust her darling with the god that gave it her ; but thinks its being carried to the church to its baptism , would occasion its speedier exportation thither to its funeral . how cowardly she is in this , and how much the weakness of her faith resembles that of her sex , let st. (u) greg. nazianzen tell her . and it would be happy if all parents would weigh the great advantage of having their children early consecrated to god , before wickedness can obtain a prepossession in them , against the seeming inconveniency , which the tenderness of their age may suffer . but that which is state and indulgence in the great , changes shape , and pretends to be shame in those of meaner rank and fortune ; and they usually alledge their backwardness in bringing their children to be baptiz'd in the church , to proceed from their inability to have things in decorum , as to their own apparel , and the entertainment of the company , as is usual . or else that they would not be thought at so low an ebb as not to have wherewithal to gratifie the minister for his attendance ; which by the discourse of several of them appears to be the received notion of their circumstances who bring their children to church to be baptiz'd , as if they did it to save charges , since for that there are no fees due . to answer the first there needs little else be said , than that the prodigality of some ought not to oblige others , nor be proposed for their imitation ; much less be a reflection on them for avoiding it , than which nothing can more justifie their prudence and sobriety . that such treats and entertainments were disapproved of by the church , we have the testimony of st. (w) greg. nazianzen ; who thus informs his auditory : 't is ill to say , where is the gift that i shall offer for my baptism ? where are my new cloths ? where shall i have provision for the entertainment of my gossips ? do not in a matter of such moment as that sacrament , regard things so minute and trivial . suffer not your self to be withdrawn from it by an affection so base and abject . this sacrament is above those things that lye within the prospect of the eye : make your self your offering : put on christ for a garment , and nourish me with an honest and praise-worthy conversation . thus i , thus god desires to be entertain'd . there is nothing in esteem with god which is not in the power of a poor man to bestow upon him : that even in this , those of meaner fortune should not be discouraged , as not having wherewithal to vie with the great and wealthy . indeed , in other things there is disparity between riches and poverty ; but in this , he that is readiest and chearfullest , is still the richest and the most acceptable . there might several councils be produced wherein to avoid levity , and intemperance (x) baptism is forbid to be administered in the afternoon , but in case of extream danger ; and where 't is likewise forbid to make great feasts and banquets after it ; which even in 1549. was censured as a heathen custom , and they that used it were termed parum christiani ; and wherein 't is expresly said (y) , that a due reverence may be shewn to that great mystery , it is earnestly advised , that baptism may not be administered in the afternoon , when men are charged with wine and delicacies ; but in the morning , in the time of divine service , and that with great sobriety and devotion : and 't is there recommended to the civil magistrate to suppress all feasts and banquets afterwards , or at least to reduce them to a moderation becoming christians . so that not to follow this ill fashion , is so far from being a disgrace to any one , that 't is as well our prudence as our duty to avoid it . then for the other excuse , of being unwilling to be thought unable to pay the minister , 't is idle and impertinent : because nothing can or ought to be demanded for the administration of baptism , according to the rules of the church . nor should the clergy accept of any fees for baptizing children in private houses , since if it is any part of their office or duty , as in cases of necessity , they are both by religion , and reason , and express (z) canons forbid to receive any thing : and if it is no part of their office ; ( as where there is no necessity ) the performance is incanonical and unjustifiable , and therefore so far from meriting a reward , that it incurs a reproof . tho' it has been objected to some , who argued for the baptism of infants with the publick office , to be administred in the church , and refused the administration of it in private houses , but in great necessity , and then in the private form ; that several good and eminent divines were not so strict and scrupulous , but did often condescend , upon request , to administer baptism in the publick form in private houses , and to children under no indisposition of body , and consequently no necessity to be baptiz'd at home . made out , till there are more sufficient reasons given on that side than there can be produced to the contrary : and it will be hardly found , that ever the bishop was permitted to tolerate the administration of baptism in private , unless in case of necessity ; and then not in the publick form , but where there were (b) oratories to do it . and if some eminent divines transgress this rule , that should be no argument for others to follow them in an error , any more than the defects and infirmities of men of quality should be for their equals or inferiors to endeavour to resemble them . but their being taken notice of , and urged so unhappily by the vulgar , should put them in mind of a speedy reformation . and that the people may not expect this compliance , nor the clergy use them to it , let it be seriously consider'd , that this expectation has been still imputed to the pride and contemptuousness of the laity ; and their compliance , to the flattery and obsequiousness of the clergy . let it be consider'd how great an indecorum it is to perform a publick office , that is of publick nature , in private ; and a private office in the publick form. let the late date of this custom in our church be look'd into , and the occasions of it . it proceeded either from the scruples and disputes about ceremonies , when to avoid them , those who were no lovers of them had their children baptiz'd at home by such conscientious conformists as could dispence with their rule , says (c) dr. sherlock ; or else it ows its original to the fatal time of usurpation and impiety , when there was no king in our israel ; and when all god's solemn worship was interdicted as prophaneness : then the orthodox , who would not comply with that prevailing schism , were forced to retire and perform those acts in private , which they could not be allow'd to do in publick . and sure the very remembrance that this use was introduced by such means , should make it odious and abominable to all who have the honesty , the loyalty , or the religion to abhor the practice of those days . then let us not contend for a custom begun on so unhappy an occasion : let not that be our choice now , which was then the effect of tyranny and compulsion ; but let us consider how great an affliction it was to the sons of the church to be denied the priviledge of performing that office as well as others publickly ; and how gladly they would have done it if permitted . and if even in these our days we were interdicted the administration of publick baptism , and driven from the church and the congregation , how would we grieve and complain , what an injury and injustice should we think were offer'd us , and how zeaous would we be to injoy the benefit which now we slight ? but if neither god's glory , nor our own advantage quicken us in this duty , let at least emulation move us , that we may not be out-done by our neighbours of the french and dutch congregations ; whose zeal in this particular of bringing their children to their churches to be baptiz'd , tho' at great distance from them , will rise in judgment against us for our neglect . no length of way , nor scarce any indisposition , can prevail with them in scotland to keep their children from the church , but they carry them several miles to be baptiz'd , that it may be done in publick ; and they thought it an inexpressible favour when a toleration was granted them for private baptism in case of great necessity . that it was usual heretofore for mothers when they found their children ill , to run with them to the church that they might be baptiz'd , we find by st. (d) augustin's question , where proving the guilt of original sin derived from parents to their children , he says , if infants are wholly innocent , why then do their mothers run with them to the church when they are sick ? 't is sure the learned grotius takes it for granted , that baptism always was or ought to be publickly administered , by that question and answer in his (e) catechetical institutions ; where the catechumen being ask'd the place of his baptism , affirms it to be the place of religious assemblies , meaning the church : and he calls the administration of it there , an antient (f) custom , a law establish'd and confirm'd by old and long observance , as the original words import . all which consider'd , we see how justly the church injoyns the (g) curates of every parish to warn the people , that without great cause and necessity , they procure not their children to be baptiz'd at home in their houses , and there to use a form distinct from that of publick baptism . this then being so lovely , and of so good report , if there be any virtue , if there be any praise , if there be any zeal for god's glory , and the edification of his church , let us think thereon . to recommend which to the serious consideration of the people , that they may not persist in their unreasonable expectation of compliance from their ministers , against such prohibitions , obligations , and engagements to the conorary , nor conceive a prejudice against them for refusing it ; but that both of them may yield a ready and chearful obedience to the church in performing its commands , and celebrating the great and venerable sacrament of baptism with all due grandeur and solemnity , is the whole design of this small tract : which if it may conduce in any thing to the end intended , will by that success become a most ample and agreeable compensation to the author . finis . errata . pag. 10. lin. i. r. coccius . p. 16. l. 19. r. walafridus strabo . p. 20. i. 22. r. 't is that . p. 21. i. 8. r. the most solemn . p. 35. i. 15. r. and celebrate . i. 27. r. modoetia . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a25966-e400 (g) st. matt. 3.6 (h) an. dom. 150. (i) apol. 2. pro christianis : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. (k) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . (l) epist ad omnes orthodoxos . (m) anno dom. 203. (n) de coron . mil. cap. 3. (o) de hier. eccles. (p) nec otiosè praemissum à tertulliano in ecclesia . (q) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. orat. 40. in sanctum bap. (r) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . ibid. (s) de initiandis , cap. 2. post haec reserata tibi sunt . sancta sanctorum . (t) lib. 4. de sacrament . cap. 1. (u) homil. 19. catech. ad illuminandos : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 (w) euseb. hist. eccles. lib. 6. cap. 42. (x) concil matisconense , can. 3. (y) thesaur . cathol . artic. 11. baptisteria . (z) can. 59. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. * collat. 5. tit. 13. nov. 58. praefat. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. anno 552. (a) constitut. 15. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. (b) concil . meldense , can. 48. (c) expos. de authorit . consuet . baptisand . infant . &c. pag. 694. (d) lib. de officio pii viri , & c. (e) de orig. templorum , cap. 6. (f) lib. 2. cap. 14. (g) appendice ad platinam de coemiteriis . (h) baron annal . hist. eccles. (i) panstrat . cathol . tom. 4. iib. 5. cap. 15. (k) epist. 33. (l) symbolum . (m) cyrill , hierosol . cat. mystagog . 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. (y) lib. 18. reium roman . (z) sherloch . rel. assem . part 2. chap. 4. pag. 289. (a) walafrid . strab. lib. de reb . eccles. cap. 6. (b) epist. 12. ad sulp. severum . (c) lib. 1. de rit . eccles. cap. 19. (d) prope 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . (e) hist lib. 1. cap. 21. (f) rubrick before publick baptism . (g) orat. in sanct. bapt. (h) de rit . eccles. cathol . lib. 1. cap. 19. (i) sacramentorum janua . (k) tesseram militarem . (l) signa juratoria . (m) sher rel. assemblys . p. 291. * lib de reb . eccles. cap. 10. (x) exod. 30.18 . (y) 1 king. 7. 39. (z) isidor . cap. 7. in cant. canticor . (a) apud gratian , de consecrat . distinct. 4. (b) de baptis . & ejus effectu . tit : 15. (c) tertul. de corona militis (d) art. 20. (e) 1 cor. 11. 4 , 7 , 14. (f) confess . helv. art. 13. cap. 22 , 23 , 24. basil. art. 10. bohem cap. 15 , 17. gal. art. 32. belg. art. 32. aug. art. 4 , 57. 15. sax. art. 20. soev . cap. 8. 14. wittemb . cap. 27. 31. (g) cham. panstrat . cathol . tom. 4. lib. 5. cap. 15. (h) 1. cor. 12. (l) dionys. areop . lib. de ecclesiast . hierarch . (m) durant de ritib. eccles. cathol . lib. 1. cap. 19. (n) concil . vernense . capit . 7. tent . 756. (o) rubr. in the office of private baptism , & rituale romanum , ordo supplendiomissa super baptisatum . (p) lib. 2. angl. histor. cap. 14. (q) terful . carthag . (r) de gestis longobardor . (s) a place where a church was built to the blessed virgin. (t) tom. 3. pag. 68. (u) orat. in sanct. baptisma . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 (w) orat. in sanct. baptis . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 &c. (x) concil . colon. 2. cap. 15. censora pro abus . reformand . (y) concil . mogunt . 4. cap. 16. (z) capit. herardi archiep. turonen . cap. 31. (b) concil . constantinop . 3. can. 3. (c) concil . provin . colon. cap. 7. de administrat . sacrament . concil . colon. 2. decret . 15. (d) aug. in psal. 51. enarratio . (e) grot. mystagog . (f) ibid. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; (g) rubr. before the office of private baptism . philadelphia: or, xl. queries peaceably and inoffensively propounded for the discovery of truth in this question, or case of conscience; whether persons baptized (as themselves call baptism) after a profession of faith, may, or may not, lawfully, and with good conscience, hold communion with such churches, who judg themselves truly baptized, though in infancy, and before such a profession? together with some few brief touches about infant, and after-baptism. by j.g. a minister of the gospel of jesus christ. goodwin, john, 1594?-1665. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a85408 of text r207109 in the english short title catalog (thomason e702_7). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 81 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 17 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a85408 wing g1189 thomason e702_7 estc r207109 99866180 99866180 118444 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a85408) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 118444) images scanned from microfilm: (thomason tracts ; 108:e702[7]) philadelphia: or, xl. queries peaceably and inoffensively propounded for the discovery of truth in this question, or case of conscience; whether persons baptized (as themselves call baptism) after a profession of faith, may, or may not, lawfully, and with good conscience, hold communion with such churches, who judg themselves truly baptized, though in infancy, and before such a profession? together with some few brief touches about infant, and after-baptism. by j.g. a minister of the gospel of jesus christ. goodwin, john, 1594?-1665. 32 p. printed by j.m. for henry cripps, and lodowick lloyd, and are to be sold at their shop in popes-head alley, london, : 1653. j.g. = john goodwin. annotation on thomason copy: "june. 22.". reproduction of the original in the british library. eng baptism -early works to 1800. infant baptism -early works to 1800. a85408 r207109 (thomason e702_7). civilwar no philadelphia: or, xl. queries peaceably and inoffensively propounded for the discovery of truth in this question, or case of conscience;: w goodwin, john 1653 14643 21 30 0 0 0 0 35 c the rate of 35 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the c category of texts with between 10 and 35 defects per 10,000 words. 2007-09 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-09 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2007-10 elspeth healey sampled and proofread 2007-10 elspeth healey text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion philadelphia : or , xl . queries peaceably and inoffensively propounded for the discovery of truth in this question , or case of conscience ; whether persons baptized ( as themselves call baptism ) after a profession of faith , may , or may not , lawfully , and with a good conscience , hold communion with such churches , who judg themselves truly baptized , though in infancy , and before such a profession ? together with some few brief touches about infant , and after-baptism . by j. g. a minister of the gospel of jesus christ . i thank god that i baptized none of you , but crispus and gaius . — and i baptized also the boushold of stephanas : besides , i know not whether i baptized any other . for christ sent me not to baptize , but to preach the gospel . 1 cor. 1. 14 , 16 , 17. for ye are all the children of god by faith in christ jesus . gal. 4. 26. for in jesus christ , neither circumcision availeth any thing , nor uncircumcision , but faith which worketh by love . gal. 5. 6. circumcision is nothing , nor uncircumcision is nothing ; but the keeping of the commandments of god . 1 cor. 7. 19. deus nobis imperavit congregationem : sibi servavit separationem . august . in mat. 13. 47. infantibus minime negandus baptismus , quos deus adoptat , & filii sui sanguine abluit . calvin . harm. p. 253. london , printed by j. m. for henry cripps , and lodowick lloyd , and are to be sold at their shop in popes-head alley . 1653. queries about lawfulness of communion , with churches deemed unbaptized ; as also about infant and after-baptism . i. whether is there any precept , or example in the gosp●l , of any person , how duly soever baptized , who disclaimed christian communion , either in church fellowship , or in any the ordinances of the gospel , with those , whom he judged true beleevers , upon an account only of their not having been baptized , especially after such a manner , as he judged necessary for them to have been ? or in case there be neither precept , nor example found in the scriptures to warrant such a practise , upon what ground are the consciences of such men , who practise it , satisfied or emboldened , in their way ? or if it be replyed , that there were no beleevers in the apostles days , who were not baptized , and that truly , and consequently , that there was no occasion of scrupuling communion with any beleever in these days ; 1. how can this ever be proved , ( viz. that there were no beleevers unbaptized in the apostles days , ) the contrary being apparant ( as may be touched hereafter ? ) 2. be it granted , that there were no beleevers unbaptized , or unduly baptized , in the apostles days , upon what ground notwithstanding can the practise now queried , be justified , or maintained , unless the practisers certainly know , and can satisfie themselves , that in case there had been such beleevers in these times ( i mean , who had been un-baptized , or unduly baptized ) those duly baptized would have declined such communion with them , as that specified ; especially considering that positive actions ( such is a declining , or withdrawing from , communion with the saints in church-fellowship ) cannot be justified upon negative grounds , at least not further then in point of meer lawfulness , or indifferency , no nor thus far , in case of scandal ; which is the case of those , who withdraw from church-communion to the offence , both of that church from which they withdraw , and of many others ? ii. whether can it be proved from the scriptures , or by any argument , like , or meet , to satisfie the conscience of any tender and considering christian , that the apostles or other christians in their days , would have declined church-communion with , or denyed church-communion unto , such persons , whom they judged true beleevers in christ , and partakers of like precious faith with themselves , only because they had not been baptized or dipped in water , after a profession of their beleeving ; especially in case they had been baptized , and solemnly consecrated by washing with water , unto the service of jesus christ before , considering that the apostle paul expresly saith , that in jesus christ [ i. e. under the gospel , or profession of christ in the world ] neither circumcision availeth any thing , nor vncircumcision , but faith which worketh by love a : and again ; that circumcision is nothing , nor vncircumcision is nothing , but the keeping of the commandments of god b ? meaning , that under the gospel , and profession thereof , neither did the observation of any external rite or ceremony [ circumcision , by a synecdoche speciei , being put for all kind of external rites , or ceremonies ] avail or contribute any thing towards the commending of any person unto god ; nor yet the want of any such observation , discommend any man unto god , or prejudice his acceptation with him : but that which was all in all unto men , and which availed any thing , in , and under the gospel , that which being sound in men , rendered them accepted and approved of god , and the want of it , disapproved , was such a kind of faith [ not such , or such , a kind of ceremony , or such or such a kind of baptism ] which by the mediation or interveening of that heavenly affection of love , uttereth and expresseth it self in keeping the commandments of god , [ viz. so far as they are made known unto them , and as humane infirmity will well bear and admit . ] or is it to be beleeved , that either the apostles , or other christians taught by them , would have rejected those from their communion , who were weak in the faith , and were not convinced of every thing that was in any degree necessary for them to know , and to do , only for want of such an external observance , of the lawfulness whereof they were unconvinced , and which , had they submitted unto it , would have availed them little or nothing ? iii. whether can it be proved by any text , or passage of scripture , either directly , or by any tolerable consequence , that christian churches were ( in the apostles days ) constituted by baptism , or that none were reputed members of churches , or admitted into christian communion with those who were baptized , but only such who were baptized likewise ; considering that that text acts 2. 41. [ commonly , and only , as far as i know , pretended for proof of such a thing ] doth not so much as colour , much less cotton , with such a supposal , or conclusion ; the tenor of the place being only this , then they that gladly received his word , were baptized : and the same day there were added unto [ them ] about three thousand souls ? for , 1. it is not here said , that all they that gladly received the word , were baptized ; but indefinitely only , they that gladly received , &c. now indefinite expressions in scripture are not always equipollent to universals , but sometimes to partitives , or particulars . when the apostle , speaking of beleevers under the old testament , saith , that they stopped the mouths of lions , quenched the violence of fire , &c. [ hebr. 11. 33 , 34. ] he doth not mean , that they all did either of these ; nor indeed that many of them did either . see mat. 27. 34. compared with vers . 48. ( to omit an hundred instances more of like import . ) yea many times universal expressions themselves are to be understood with limitation and restraine . these things are sufficiently known to persons any thing conversant in the scriptures . 2. neither is it here said , nor is it a thing in it self much probable , that only they who were baptized , were added unto them , [ i. e. to the pre-ex●stent number of disciples , ] but only and simply that there were the number of three thousand added the same day . within which number it is the probable opinion of some , that the children , and families , of those , who are said to have gladly received the word , are comprehended ; it being no ways likely , scarce possible , that 3000 men should distinctly hear the voyce of a man speaking : especially unless we shall suppose , that these 3000 stood nearest unto him that spake , and with the best advantage to hear , there being many thousands more present ; which can hardly be the supposition of any considering man in the case in hand . nor , 3. is it said , or so much as intimated or hinted in the least , that any of the whole number of the three thousand who were added unto them , were added by means , or upon the account , of their being baptized , although this addition be not mentioned till after their baptizing . it is ten degrees more probable , that their beleeving , or discipleship , which according to the principles of those brethren themselves with whom we now argue , were precedent to their baptizing , and not their being baptized , were the reason and ground of luke's saying , they were added unto the church , or former number of disciples ; considering , 1. that the original , main and principal foundation of the holy brotherhood amongst the saints , and that which makes them fellow-members , or members one of another , is , not the ceremony of their external baptism , but their fellowship and communion in the divine nature , and inward relation unto the same christ by one and the same precious faith . 2. that it cannot be demonstratively proved from the scriptures , that those hundred and twenty disciples [ act. 1. 15. ] unto which it is here said that three thousand were added , were , or had been , all of them baptized , in as much as ( as will presently appear ) there were divers members of churches in the apostles days , who were unbaptized ; no , nor can it any whit more be proved from scripture , that the apostles themselves mentioned act. 1. 13. had been baptized , then that john the baptist was baptized . 3. ( and lastly , ) that had the church , or persons , unto whom these three thousand are said to have been added , been estimated by their having been baptized , ( which must be supposed , if those who are added to them , are said to have been added upon the account of their being baptized , ) their number must needs have far exceeded an hundred and twenty , considering the great numbers and vast multitudes of persons , that had been baptized by john , mat. 3. 5 , 6. compared with mark 1. 5. luk. 3. 7 , 21. as also by christ himself and his disciples , joh. 3. 22 26. yea had the church been estimated , or constituted , by baptism , the evangelist luke , intending ( questionless , act. 4. 4. ) to report the increase of the church and progress of the gospel , with as much advantage as truth would afford , had prevaricated with the cause , which he intended to promote , in reporting their number to have been about five thousand only ; when as , upon the said supposition , and the tenor of the late premisses , he might with as much truth have reported them about forty thousand , yea and many more . howbeit many of them which heard the word , beleeved : and the number of the men were about five thousand . in which passage , the increase of the church , or addition unto the former saints , is with much more pregnancy of intimation ascribed unto their beleeving , then in the other place it is unto their being baptized . therefore both men and women , who are indeed tender of conscience in things appertaining unto god , had need have a better foundation to bear them out in their practise of rending and tearing churches [ or , if this name will not pass , of rending and tearing holy societies and fellowships of saints ] then any thing that can be so much as tolerably inferred from the text now argued , act. 2. 41. iv. whether did not the church of christ at rome in the apostles days , and so also the churches in galatia , hold church-communion with some , who were not baptized , considering , 1. that the apostle to the former writeth thus : know ye not , that so many of us as were baptized into jesus christ , were baptized into his death ? rom. 6. 3. and to the latter ( after the same manner ) thus : for as many of you as have been baptized into christ . gal. 3. 27. 2. that this particle , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , as many as ( used in both places ) is , in such constructions as these , always partitive , distinguishing or dividing the entire number of persons spoken of , some from others , by the character or property specified , or at least supposeth a possibility of such a distinction . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , as many as touched [ the hem of his garment ] were made whole , ( mat. 14. 36. ) this clearly supposeth , either that there were some , or at least that there might be some , who did not thus touch . so again : they brought in all as many as they found , &c. mat. 22. 10. so , as many [ i. e. as many men and women ] as are of the works of the law , are under the curse . gal. 3. 10. see also mark 3. 10. & 6. 11 , 56. luk. 4 40. ioh. 1. 12. act. 3. 24 ( with others more of like tenor and import , almost without number . ) therefore is it not without controversie and dispute , that the apostle saying to the church at rome , and to those in galatia , as many of you as have been baptized , &c. supposeth , either that there actually were , or at least that ( for ought he knew to the contrary ) there might be , sundry of their members , who had not been baptized ? and if he had either known , or so much as by conjecture supposed , that all the members of these churches had without exception been baptized , is it credible that he would have expressed himself thus unto them ( respectively , ) as many of you as have been baptized , and not rather , you having all been baptized , or the like ? v. whether did not the church at corinth ( in the apostles days ) entertain members , and hold communion with those , who had not been baptized ; considering that he demandeth thus of this church : else what shall [ or , what will ] they do , which are baptized for the dead , if the dead rise not at all ? why are they then baptized for the dead c ? or doth not this imply , that there was a corrupt and superstitious practise on foot in this church , to baptize one or other of the surviving kindred , or friends , in the name of such persons ( respectively ) who dyed unbaptized , and that this church thought and supposed , that such baptism was available for good unto the deceased in such a case ; which practise and opinion of theirs the apostle here insisteth on as inconsistent with that most dangerous and pernicious error of denying the resurrection of the dead , which had now gotten head amongst them ? and if there were such a practise as this in this church , i mean to baptize some of the living members , in the name and stead of some that were dead , is it not a plain case that there were some of these members , who lived and dyed unbaptized ? vi . whether , when paul , soon after his conversion , assayed to joyn himself to the church and disciples at jerusalem ( act. 9. 26. ) did this church make any enquiry after his baptism , as whether he had been baptized , or no , in order to his reception amongst them ; or did they know that he had been baptized ? or did barnabas , in giving satisfaction to the apostles and church concerning his meetness to be admitted into communion with them , so much as mention his being baptized , but only declared unto them how he had seen the lord in the way , and that he had spoken to him , and how he had preached boldly at damascus in the name of jesus ? acts 9. 27. vii . whether , upon a supposal , that it cannot be proved from the scriptures , that any unbaptized , or unduly baptized person , was ever admitted into church-communion by christians in the apostles days , or that any duly baptized person held communion with a church , the greatest part of whose members he deemed either unbaptized , or unduly baptized , is such a defect of proof sufficient to justifie a withdrawing of communion by a person , who conceiveth himself duly baptized , from such a church , the generality of whose members he supposeth are either not baptized , or unduly baptized ; considering that very many things may be matter of duty , and necessary to be done , which are not warranted for so much as lawful , by any example in the scriptures of like action in all circumstances ? it is the duty of churches , and of every member respectively , to admit their women-members to the lords table ; yet cannot this practice be warranted by any example recorded in the scriptures . yea in case at the time of this sacramental administration in a church , all the men-members should occasionally be absent , except only the administrator , and ( it may be ) a deacon or two , and only the women-members present , there is little question to be made , but that the administration ought to proceed notwithstanding , and the elements be administred unto this female congregation , though there be no example of such an administration as this in the scriptures . there is no example in scripture of any person worshiping the holy ghost : yet it is a great duty lying upon christians to worship him . when david , and the men with him , entred into the house of god , and did eat the shew-bread a , he had no scripture-example to justifie his action ; no more had the disciples to justifie theirs , when they plucked the ears of corn as they passed through the fields on a sabbath day : yet were both these actions lawful , and ( to a degree ) necessary . the reading of the scriptures translated out of the original languages into english , welch , dutch , french , &c. is not only lawful , but necessary , in the christian churches in these nations ; yet is there no example extant in scripture of any such practice in the primitive times , no nor so much as of any translation of the scriptures at all . it were easie to add more instances of like consideration . viii . whether is an action or practice , suppose in matters relating to the service or worship of god , upon this account evicted to be unlawful , because it hath neither precept [ i mean , no particular or express precept , and wherein the action or practice it self , with all the circumstances under which it becomes lawful , is named , ] nor example , to warrant the lawfulness of it ? or hath the practice of admitting women to the lords table , any such , either precept , or example , to justifie it ? or in case a minister shall preach to a congregation consisting of young men only , and from rev. 22. 3 , or 4 ▪ &c. would such an act as this be unlawful ? or is there any such precept , as that mentioned , or example in scripture , for the warrant of it ? or when david , and those that were with him , went into the house of god , and , contrary to the letter of an institution , eat the shew-bread , had they either such a precept , as that mentioned , or any example , to bear them out in such a practise ? or doth not our saviour in the gospel justifie that action of theirs notwithstanding ? or if the case , or law of necessity , or of peril , either of health , or life , be pleadable for the justification thereof ; is not the same law altogether as , yea & much more , pleadable , on the behalf of such persons , who being of tender , weak , and sickly constitutions , dare not tempt god , or expose themselves to the imminent hazard of health or life , by being doused in their apparel over head and ears in the water ; especially considering that god hath testified from heaven his dis-approbation of the practice , by suffering some to be grievously afflicted in their bodies , and some also to miscarry in life it self , by means ( in all likelyhood ) of the temptation ? or hath not god sufficiently and plainly enough declared his mind and pleasure in all such cases as this , in saying , i will have mercy , and not sacrifice a ? or if it be pleaded , that all danger of miscarrying in either kind , may be prevented , by chusing a warm room , and warm water , for the transacting of the baptismal dipping , is it not queryable hereupon , whether this be not to alter and change , to new-mold , shape , and transform the ordinance of god , as men please , and this under a pretext of observing it ? or is there not as much difference between hot water , and cold , as is between a child , and a man ? ix . whether , when god hath by faith purified the hearts of a people walking in a christian brotherhood and fellowship together , hath he not sanctified them ? and in case any person shall now despise , or decline their fellowship , as unholy , doth he not sin against that heavenly admonition delivered by special revelation unto peter ; what god hath cleansed [ {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , i. e. sanctified , or purified ] call not thou [ or , make not thou ] common a ? or can a man ( lightly ) call , or make , that common , which god hath sanctified , in a more opprobrious and contumelious way , then by fleeing from it , as polluted or unholy ? x. whether doth , or needs , a man contract any guilt of sin before god , by walking in such a society of men , who being otherwise confessedly christian and holy , have only some practice amongst them in the judgment and conscience of this man not approvable , in case , 1. he shall at any time openly declare his dislike of this practice ; and , 2. be no ways constrained , or solicited to communicate in this practice ? or , when men may separate that which is precious from that which is vile , and enjoy it thus separated , and apart , without suffering any inconvenience by that which is vile , is it a point of wisdom in them to deprive themselves of the enjoyment of what is precious , because there is somewhat , which they suppose to be vile , near to it ? xi . whether may persons , who are weak in the faith , be rejected by a church from communion with them , in case they desire it , only because they question , or dissent from , the sence of the generality of this church , in some one point of doubtful disputation ? or is not the practice of a man , who pretends to be strong in the faith , in renouncing communion with a church ( or , which is the same , in rejecting a church from his communion ) which he judgeth weak in the faith , only because they more generally dissent from him in a matter of doubtful disputation , a practice much more unchristian and unwarrantable , then the former ? or is not the practice , especially the necessity , of dipping , after infant-ablution , or infant-baptism , a matter of doubtful disputation ; unless ( haply ) by matters of doubtful disputation , we mean , not whatsoever is questioned , opposed , or denyed by any man , or any sort of men , being asserted and held by others ; but only such things , which are controverted and disputed with good probability on either side , by men of gravity , worth , soberness of judgment , throughly versed and expert in the scriptures ? &c. and whether , in this sence or notion of matters of doubtful disputation , is the necessity of the said practice of after-baptism so much as matter of doubtful disputation , the generality of christians so qualified , as hath been expressed , unanimously agreeing in the non-necessity , yea and ( which is somewhat more ) in the irregularity of it ? xii . whether did the lord christ , pointing to any river , or water , say , vpon this water will i build my church ? or did he not , speaking either of himself , or of that great truth , viz. that he was the son of the living god , which peter had confessed , say , vpon this rock will i build my church a ? or is there the softest whisper , or gentlest breathing in the scripture , of any such notion , or opinion , as this , that a true church of christ cannot be constituted , or made , no not of the truest and soundest believers in the world , unless they have been baptized after their believing , how , or after what manner soever , they have been baptized before ? xiii . whether is an error , or mistake , about the adequate or appropriate subject of baptism , of any worse consequence , or greater danger , then an error or mistake about melchisedec's father , as viz. in case a man should suppose him to have been noah ( which he must be , in case melchisedec were the same person with sem ) when as he was some other man ? if so , how , or wherein doth the excess of the danger , or evil of the consequence appear ? if not , whether is it christian , or any ways becoming the spirit of the gospel , to abandon communion with such churches , which ( being interpreted ) is to proclaim them polluted , hated and abhorred by christ , only because a man supposeth them to lie under the guilt of such an error , or mistake ? xiv . whether may not the importune contest , or question , about the appropriate subject of baptism , as it is stated by the brethren of new baptism , in opposition to the judgment and practice ( almost ) of the whole christian world , justly be numbered amongst those questions , which the apostle calls foolish , and unlearned , and adviseth both timothy and titus to avoyd , as being questions which ingender strife a , and are unprofitable and vain b ; considering , 1. that the experience of many years in the reformed churches abroad , and of some years amongst our selves at home , hath abundantly taught and informed us , that the said question hath yielded little other fruit unto those that have set their hearts to it , yea and unto others also , but contention , strife , emulations , evil surmizings , distractions , confusions , alienations of mind and affections amongst christian brethren , evil speakings , vilifyings , revilings , needless and wastful expence of time , loss of many precious opportunities for matters of greatest consequence , unprofitable disturbings and turmoylings of weak consciences , shatterings , scatterings , rendings , and teerings of such churches , and christian societies , who , till this root of bitterness sprang up amongst them , walked in love , and with the light of gods countenance shining on them , holding the unity of the spirit in the band of peace , edifying one another in their most holy faith , &c. 2. that the said question , in the nature and direct tendency of it , leadeth unto very little that is considerable , or of much consequence for christians to know ; and that what is brought to light ( of moment and consequence ) by occasion of the ventilation of it , is nothing but what might arrive at the knowledg of christians , in a more peaceable , and less troublesom way : and , 3. ( and lastly ) that those who are most confident that they have found the treasure of truth , which the question we speak of , seeketh after , are no ways , as far as any ways appeareth , or can be discerned , spiritually enriched by it , but rather impoverished ( at least the generality of them ) losing by degrees , that christian sweetness , meekness , humility , love , patience , soberness of mind , fruitfulness of conversation , &c. which were observable in them before ; as if their new baptism had been into a new , or another jesus , altogether unlike unto him , whom paul preached ? xv . whether is any member of a christian church , or society , at any more liberty , or under any greater necessity , to excommunicate , cut off , or separate this church , or all the members of it , from his communion , only upon his private conceit or perswasion , suppose according to truth , that they walk not in all things according to gospel-rule , then this church is to excommunicate him , upon a true and certain perswasion , that he walketh not in every thing according to the rule of the gospel ? or if churches either be at liberty , or under an obligation by way of duty , to excommunicate every of their members ( respectively ) because they judg them not to walk in all things according to the gospel , are they not at liberty , or bound in duty and conscience , thus to cast out all their members one after another ; considering , that not in some things only , but even in many things ( as the apostle james speaketh ) we offend all ? or hath any single member of a church any more liberty , or authority , to adjudg and determine without the scriptures , upon what grounds or occasions , his departure from a church is justifiable , then a church hath to make laws and constitutions of her own for the ejecting of her members ? or is it anywhere a case adjudged in the scriptures , that if a church in any part of the world , suppose under the frozen zone , shall not practice dipping after sprinkling , or other washing , in the name of jesus christ , every member thereof stands bound in conscience , yea or is so much as at liberty , to reverse , or disoblige himself from , his solemn and sacred engagements to it ? xvi . whether did not paul and barnabas hold christian communion with those christian converts which they made at antioch , acts 13. 43 , 48 , 52. and with those also , which they made soon after in great numbers at iconium , acts 14. 1 , 4 ? or doth it any ways appear from the scripture , that these converts , during the continuance of paul and barnabas with them , yea or at any time after , were baptized ? if not , is it any ways necessary that we should believe , or ought it to be any article of our faith to believe , that they were baptized ? if it be not necessary , then we are at liberty to believe , that paul and barnabas did hold christian communion with unbaptized christians ; especially considering , that the tenor of the history diligently consulted , especially concerning those , who were converted to the faith at antioch , and the short abode of paul and barnabas with them after their conversion , together with the troublesom oppositions which the jews of the place made all the while against them , makes it probable in the highest , that they were not baptized , at least whilest these men continued with them ? xvii . whether , in case any member , one or more , of any christian church , or society , which he judgeth faithful in the main , and willing and ready to walk up to their light , shall verily think and be perswaded , that he hath discovered some defect , or error in this church , may such an one lawfully and with a good conscience give himself a discharge from all care & service otherwise due from him unto it , by renouncing the communion thereof upon such a pretence , or occasion ; especially before , or until , he hath with all long-suffering and meekness , and with the best of his understanding , endevored the information of this church in the truth , and the rectifying the judgments of the members thereof ; considering , that as in the natural body , so in the spiritual or church-body , the members ought to have the same care one for another , and if one member suffereth , all the members to suffer with it a , ( as the apostle speaketh , ) and consequently no one member , being healthful and sound , ought to desert its fellow-members being sickly and weak , especially whilest there is yet any hope of their cure and healing ? xviii . whether ought a company of true believers , concerning whose lawful church constitution there can no other thing with reason and truth be objected , to be vilified , or separated from , as a false church , or no church of christ at all , only because , either , 1. they do not practice contrary to their judgment and conscience , such things , one , or more , which some men conceive it meet they should practice ; or , 2. because , either god hath not enlightened them to see every thing , which some other men see ; or else because satan hath not blinded them , so as to make them ignorant of such truths , one , or more , whereof some others are ignorant , judging them to be errors ? xix . whether is it reasonable or christian , that a company of true believers , who have met together in the simplicity of their hearts in the fear of god , in the name of jesus christ , mutually engaging themselves , as in the presence of god , to walk together in all the ordinances of the gospel , as far as they shall from time to time be revealed unto them , and walking accordingly , should be infamously stigmatized as no church , no true church of christ , and consequently be esteemed but as a rabble rout of the world only pretending churchship , and this by some one , or a few persons , only because they cannot see with their eyes , or practice that as necessary , the necessity whereof , after much and earnest prayer unto god , after much enquiry and search , and this with all diligence and impartialness , in order to their conviction and satisfaction , doth no ways to them appear ? xx . whether is it christian , or meet , for any one person , man , or woman , to bid defiance unto an whole church or fellowship of saints being many , and who are otherwise sober , grave , and conscientiously faithful in all their walking , onely because they cannot with a good conscience say amen to every notion and conceit , which these persons themselves judg worthy of reverence and honour , and particularly , because they cannot , against the sence , judgment and practise , as well of all christian antiquity , as of all the reformed churches ( very few , if any , excepted ) in the christian world , thus spiritually court their private apprehensions about the time and manner of an external administration ; especially considering , that they neither have , nor can , either shew precept , example , or any competent ground otherwise , from the scriptures , to commend these their apprehensions unto the conscience of any man ? or is there any precept , which injoyns baptizing , or dipping , in the name of christ , after a baptizing in infancy into this name ? or is there any example in scripture of any baptized after profession of faith , who had been baptized , or who judged themselves , and were generally so judged by others , to have been baptized , before ? if neither , is it not a clear case , that here is neither precept , nor example in scripture , which reacheth home to the case , or which warranteth the practice , of the children of after-baptism amongst us ? and as for any competent ground otherwise to justifie the practice , hath such a thing ever seen the light of the sun hitherto ? xxi whether do not they , who magnifie the ceremony or external rite of baptism to such an height , as to estimate christianity by it , or to judg them no true or sound christians , who are without it , stumble at the same stone of danger and peril of soul , at which the jews stumbled , when they practiced and urged circumcision as necessary for justification ; to whom , upon this account , paul testified ; behold , i paul say unto you , that if ye be circumcised , [ meaning , with an opinion of a necessity of your being circumcised for your justification before god , ] christ shall profit you nothing a ? considering , 1. that circumcision was an ordinance of god , yea as great and solemn an ordinance , as baptism ; and 2. that when paul threatened those who so magnified it ( as was said ) with lofing their part and portion in christ , it was as lawful , though ( haply ) not so necessary ( and yet in some cases it was necessary too ) as baptism it self ; yea and the apostle himself administred it , as well as he did baptism , yea and pronounced it profitable , ( rightly understood and practiced ? ) rom. 3. 1. 2. or might not the same threatening ( i mean , of losing the great blessing of justification and salvation by christ ) have been with altogether as much truth and necessity , administred upon a like occasion and account , unto persons so opinionated of circumcision , as the galathians were , even when , and whilst , the use and practice of it was every whit as necessary ( or rather more necessary ) as the use of baptism now is ? xxii . whether is there any precept , or example in the scriptures , of any person baptized after many years profession of the gospel , or after any considerable measure of assurance of the pardon of sin obtained , or at any other time , save at , or about , their first entrance upon a profession of christ ? or is there any competent ground , either in reason , or religion , why either such a thing should have been practised by christians in the apostles days , or why it ought to be practised by any in these days ; considering , 1. that it is uncomely , and contrary to the law , which god hath established , both in nature , and in grace , to return or fall back from perfection to imperfection , from that which is more spiritual , to that which is more carnal ; and , 2. that types and figures , which are not rememorative ( as the passover was , and the lords table now is ) but either only significative , or obsignative ( as baptism is ) should be used , after the substance of the things typified and figured by them , have been of a long time exhibited unto , received , and enjoyed by those , who use them ; 3. that a profession of the name and faith of christ by an holy and blameless conversation for many years together in the world , by a long continued course of mortification , self-denyal , fruitfulness in well doing , &c. is the truth and substance , the heart , life , and soul of that profession , which is made by being externally baptized ; 4. ( and lastly ) that that which is a duty at one time , in respect of such and such circumstances , may cease to be , or may not be , a duty at another time , when circumstances are changed , many instances whereof might be readily given ? xxiii . whether ought not the law of edification [ 1 cor. 14. 26. ] to over-rule all laws and precepts concerning spiritual and church-administrations , as the law of salus populi ought to umpire and over-rule all politique laws and constitutions , in their respective executions ? if so , ought not the administration of baptism to be rather appropriated unto infants , then unto others , considering , 1. that god himself adjudged the administration of the ordinance of circumcision ( an ordinance the same with baptism , though not in the shape and form of the letter , yet in strength and substance of the spirit , as evidently appeareth from rom. 4. 11. well understood , and diligently compared with mark 1. 4. luk. 3. 3 , &c. ) unto infants , to be most edifying in the church of the jews ; otherwise it must be said that he ordered the administration of it to the spiritual detriment and loss of those , to whom he gave it ; and , 2. that there can no reason , nor colour of reason be given , why , or how , the administration of baptism unto infants in christian churches , should not as well be more edifying unto these , then an after-administration of it would be , as the like administration of circumcision was unto the jews ; 3. ( and lastly ) that whatsoever the wisdom of men may pretend and plead colourably and plausibly to the contrary , ought to give place to the determination and resolution of god himself ? be silent , o all flesh , before the lord , zech. 2. 13. the lord is in his holy temple ; let all the earth keep silence before him , habak. 2. 20. although it be demonstrable enough , even by clear grounds and principles in reason , that to baptize in infancy , must needs be more edifying to the church , then to transfer the administration to maturity of years . xxiv . whether is not the baptizing of children , by the apostles and other baptists appointed by them in their days , sufficiently signified and implyed in those passages ( especially in conjunction with the known law and custom of circumcising children amongst the jews ) where they are recorded to have baptized housholds , or families , without exception of any person in any one of them ? as act. 16. 33. 1 cor. 1. 16. act. 16. 15. &c. or can there any arguments or conjectures be levyed from the scriptures to prove the contrary , which will balance or hold weight against these ; considering , 1. that it is at no hand probable , that god , who had made a law against him , that should open or dig a pit in his field , and not cover it d , would , not only have left the precept and perpetual example of circumcising infants by the jews , as a pit uncovered for believers , both jews and gentiles under the gospel , to fall into , by baptizing their children , without giving the least notice of the alteration of his mind in this behalf , but also have digged this pit yet broader , deeper , and wider , by causing the baptizing of several families to be recorded in the new testament , without the least mention or intimation of the passing by children in the administration ; 2. that that which is commonly replyed to disable these passages as to the proof of infant-baptism , is extreamly weak , and no ways satisfactory ; viz. that it is elsewhere said of whole housholds and families that they believed , which ( say the replyers ) doth not imply , that children are here included , or that they believed , this ( i say ) is unsatisfactory ; in as much as , 1. children may in a sence ( and this very frequent in the scriptures ) be said to believe , i. e. to be in the state and condition of believers , in respect of the love and favor of god , in title to the kingdom of heaven , &c. yea and are by christ himself ( in these respects ) expresly said to believe , mat. 18. 6. and , 2. were it granted , that children are in no sence capable of believing , and in this respect cannot be included , when it is said of whole houses , that they believed ; yet are they as capable of being baptized , or ( as our brethren will needs have it ) of being dipped ( yea in some respect more capable hereof ) as men ; and consequently can upon no tolerable account be thought to be excluded , when it is said of whole houses or families that they were dipped ; as ( for instance ) because , when johns disciples said , and all men come unto him , [ joh. 3. 26. ] children must needs be excluded , and not contained in the word , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , all men , in as much as they were in no capacity of coming ; it doth not follow from hence , that therefore when the apostle saith , that christ by the grace of god tasted death for all men , [ heb. 2. 9. ] and so again , that it is appointed for men ( meaning , all men ) once to dye , [ heb. 9. 27. ] children must be here excluded also , and not be comprehended in the general term , all men ; in as much as they are as well capable as men , of such a grace , as christs dying for them imports , and so of dying themselves , though they are not capable of coming unto any man to be baptized : 3. considering , that men ought not to contend with god , or to reject any part of his counsel or will , because it is only somewhat sparingly , and with some scantness of evidence , discovered in his word , but to rest satisfied with that measure or degree of revelation of things , which he judgeth meet to vouchsafe unto them , until further light shall shine : 4. that they who are dissatisfied with that discovery , which learned paedobaptists make unto them from the scriptures , of the will and mind of god for the baptizing of infants , do readily embrace and entertain many other notions and opinions upon far weaker , and less lightsom grounds of conviction , as viz. the common doctrines or tenents concerning original sin , admission of women to the lords table , the observation of the sabbath on the first day of the week ( yea some of them on the last day , ) the reception of the soul into heaven , and happiness , immediately upon death , ( with many other things , which we shall not now mention , ) not that i mention these with dislike of the common opinion about them all , but only to shew , that as the generality of the jews rejected the true messiah notwithstanding all the true and real miracles which he wrought amongst them , and yet entertained false messiahs one after another , with their counterfeit and lying miracles ; so do the generality of anti-paedobaptists reject infant-baptism , notwithstanding the many real and substantial proofs , by which it is commended and confirmed unto them , in the mean time bowing down their judgments and consciences to such doctrines , which have little but hay and stubble to support them . 5. ( and lastly ) that god doth expect , that men should dig for the treasure of truth , and of his counsel , even where it lies much deeper under-ground , then infant-baptism doth in several of those texts of scripture , which have been argued by learned men of that judgment , in proof thereof ; yea and hath reproved men for their unmanlike oscitancy , and neglect in this behalf ? peruse and consider diligently these texts and passages at your leasure ( because it would be too long to argue them , ) mat. 12 3 , 4 , 5 , 7. mat. 23. 16 , 17 , 18 , 19 , &c. mat. 22. 29 , 31 , 32 , &c. luk 24. 25 , 26. acts 7. 25 , 26. ( to omit others . ) xxv . whether is the practise of demanding , or submitting unto , a baptismal dipping , after a solemn dedication unto the service of jesus christ by a baptismal sprinkling , or ablution , anywhere countenanced in the scriptures , or enjoyned , either by particularity , or expressness of precept or example ? if not , is not the practise of it traditional , and the product of humane discourse , as well , and as much , as the baptizing of infants ? and do not they who practise it , presume every whit as much , or rather far more , upon their own judgments and understandings , in making infant-baptism to be a meer nullity or nothing , the scripture no where giving any such sentence , nor any syllable , letter , or tittle of any such sentence , against it , as they who make it an ordinance of god , or rather ( to speak more properly ) a meet and necessary administration of an ordinance of god ? considering , 1. that baptism it self , i. e. the external act of baptism , rightly so called , ( whether it be dipping , washing , or sprinkling , is not material to the case now in hand , infants being alike capable of them all ) is by expressness of scripture , an ordinance , or appointment of god ; and 2. that infants ( at least , of beleevers ) not onely , are no where excluded by god from part and fellowship in the administration , but are in several places and passages more then overtured as the most proper and meet subjects of it ? xxvi . whether , was not a dying the death of the uncircumcised c under the law , and so a being punished with the uncircumcised d , matter of threatning , and an intimation of anger and displeasure in god ; importing , that the lives of uncircumcised persons in the world , were nothing so precious in his sighte , nor so tenderly watched over , nor so carefully protected and preserved by him , as the lives of those who were circumcised ? yea did not the threatning of the uncircumcised man-child , that his soul should be cut off from his people , because he had broken gods covenant , ( gen. 17. 4. ) plainly signifie , that children uncircumcised , were much more obnoxious unto the stroke of death from the hand of god , then they would have been , or need to have been , if circumcised ? if then it be supposed , that baptism is altogether as necessary , or of as high esteem with god , under the gospel , as circumcision was under the law , can it reasonably be judged , or thought , that he is as tender and providentially watchful , over the lives of children or others , unbaptized , as he is over the lives of those who are baptized ? and if so , do not they who neglect or refuse , the baptizing of their children , reject the counsel of god against their lives and preservations , depriving them of that interest in the speciall providence of god for their peace and safety , which they might , and ought to , intitle them unto by baptizing them ? and when children unbaptized are taken away by any sudden or strange hand of death , have not the parents just cause to question , whether they were not accessary to their death , by leaving them amongst the unbaptized ones of the world ? xxvii . whether were not the children of israel , notwithstanding the express and strict institution and command of god for the circumcising of the males amongst them on the eight day , blameless under their non-circumcision for forty yeers together , upon the account of that bodily inconvenience and danger , whereunto circumcision , during their journying and travel through the wilderness , would in the eye of reason have exposed them ? or had they not sinned , by tempting the providence of god , if under a pretence , or plea , of the commandment of god for their circumciseing , they had caused either themselves , or their children , to be circumcised , during such their travel , how long soever it had continued ? if so , do not they sin by tempting the providence of god who are authors , either to themselves or others , of being dipped over head and eares in water , where , and when , and whilst , such dipping cannot , both according to the principles of reason , the natural course and operation of second causes , yea , and frequent experience it self , but endanger either their healths , or lives , or both ; yea though this be upon a pretext , or plea , that such dipping is the institution , or command of god ? xxviii . whether doth the requiring of faith , or a profession of faith to be made by men and women in order to their being baptized , by any better consequence prove , that infants without such faith , or profession of faith , ought not to be baptized , then pauls injunction , which he commended to the thessalonians , viz. that if any would not work , neither should he eat a , proveth , that neither ought children to eat , unless they work too , as well as men or women , who are healthfull and strong , and so capable of working ? or then this prohibition of god of old concerning the eating of the paschal lamb , no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof b , proveth , that his intent was , that no person of woman kind , whether yong , or old , though daughters of abraham , and otherwise sanctified , should eat thereof ? xxix . whether , if dipping , or a disposing , or conveying of the whole body under water , be of the essence and necessity of baptism , are not they rather se-baptists , or self-baptisers , then baptised ( according to the order of christ ) by others , who themselves convey or dip under water their whole bodies , leaving onely their heads above the water to be bowed down , forced , or thrust under water , by the baptizer ? or is there either vola or vestigium , little or much of such a practise as this to be found in the scriptures , where they speak of baptism ? or can he in any tolerable sence or construction be said to be the architect , or builder of a turret , or steeple , who onely setteth the weather-cock on the top of it , and not rather he , who buildeth the rest of the body and fabrick hereof ? xxx . whether , is there any particular or express institution of baptism to be found in the scriptures ; i mean , any such institution , as there is of circumcision , and the passover in the old testament , or of the lords supper in the new ; or which prescribeth and determineth all circumstances essentiall unto baptism , as all the other do prescribe and determine all circumstances essentially requisite to their administrations respectively ? if not , do not they {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , make themselves wise above that which is written , & ( constructively ) obtrude upon the consciences of men an institution of their own , in the name of the ordinance and institution of god , who undertake to prescribe and determine , either particularity of subject , or manner of administration , in baptism ? xxxi . whether did not they amongst us , ( or at least the generality , and far greater part of them ) who have accepted and entred into the way of new-baptism , and at present walk in it , receive that precious faith from god , together with all those graces or fruits of the spirit , whereby they are , whatsoever they are in christ , and towards god ; did they not ( i say ) receive all this blessedness from god , under the dispensation of their infant-baptism ? or is there one of a thousand of those ingaged in this new way , who have added so much as the breadth of the least hair of their heads unto their former growth and stature in christ , i do not say , by vertue or means of this their new ingagement , but since , or after it ? or is there not a visible and manifest change for the worse in very many of them , and this ( in all probability ) occasioned by an overweening conceit , that by means of their new baptizing , they are more excellent then their neighbours , and too holy and near unto god to suffer themselves to be numbred amongst the members of other churches ? or do such things as these any way favour or strengthen the claim , which their way of baptizing makes of being a divine ordinance , yea the onely true baptism of god ? xxxii . whether , amongst men and women , whose consciences have at any time been surprized with a religious conceit of a necessity of new baptism , and have accordingly submitted to it , have not the most christianly-meek and humble on the one hand , and the most judicious and learned on the other hand , upon a little experience of this way , grown cool , and very indifferent in their thoughts about it ? yea and many of them repented of their surprizal and weakness in this kind , as johannes o●colampadius , johannes denkius , johannes gaster , men of great learning , worth , and humility , ( with several others ) about luthers dayes ; yea and some of like character , of late amongst our selves , who might be named , if it were necessary or meet ? xxxiii . whether , because baptism is termed the baptism of repentance {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , i. e. for , or towards , the remission of sins , ( mar , 1. 4. ) doth it a whit more follow that children ought not to be baptized , either because they cannot repent , or because they have no sins to be remitted unto them , then it doth , that children ought not to have been circumcised ; considering that circumcision , the nature of it , and counsell of god in it , considered , may as truly be called , the circumcision of repentance , for the remission of sins , as baptism , the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins ; yea , the apostle paul himself giveth a definition of circumcision , for substance and import of matter , the same with that of baptism , when he calleth it , the seal of the righteousness of faith , ( rom. 4. 11. ) and however , children are altogether as uncapable of faith , as they are of repentance ; and have no more need of the righteousness of faith , then they have of remission of sins , these being but one and the same thing ? xxxiv . whether , when the apostle peter speaketh thus to his new converts , acts 2. 38 , 39. repent , and be baptized every one of you in the name of jesus christ for the remission of sins , and ye shall receive the gift of the holy ghost : for the promise is to you , and to your children , &c. doth he so much enjoyn or exhort them to repent in order to their being baptized , as encourage them both unto the one duty , and the other , upon the account of the promise relating both to them , and their children , and the certainty of its being fulfilled and made good unto them both , upon their repentance , and submission unto baptism , respectively ? and if their title unto , and interest in , the promise , be a ground or motive unto them [ the parents ] to be baptized ; is not the like title and interest , in the children , a ground and motive also why they should be baptized ? xxxv . whether doth god smell the assemblies [ or , in the assemblies ] of those , who judg themselves the onely baptized persons under heaven , with any such pleasure or delight , as he smelleth many the assemblies of those , who are called unbaptized , by the other ? or are the church-meetings of the former filled with the glory and presence of god at any such rate , or to any such degree , as many the holy assemblies of the latter are ? or are there any such manifestations of the spirit , either in gifts , or in graces , in the tabernacles of the baptized , as there are amongst those , who bear the reproach of vnbaptized ? or are the powers of the world to come any wayes so busie , active and stirring in the churches , which call themselves baptized , as they are in many the congregations , which are cast out to the gentiles , as unclean and un-baptized ? or is not that good word of god , ( the scriptures , ) as a sealed book in many the assemblies of the former , whereas even the deep things of god contained in it , are by the holy ghost revealed in many churches of the latter ? or are such differences as these , of no authority , interest , or import , to umpire or decide the controversie depending between the two baptisms ? xxxvi . whether are not children oft-times in scripture comprehended under , or with , their parents , men and women , &c. where they are not expresly mentioned , or named ; and particularly jos. 25. 26. 1 cor. 10. 1 , 2 * even as subjects are under the names of their kings , and families and descents , under the names of their heads ? &c. yea , are not both women and children to be understood , where men only are named ? ( see mark 6. 44. joh. 6. 10. compared with mat. 14. 21. ) if so , doth not this argument or plea against infant-baptism , halt right-down ; in the scriptures we find no mention of the baptizing of children , either by christ , or his apostles , or any others : therefore no children were baptized by them ? indeed if we could here find no mention of the baptizing either men , or women , then the non-finding any mention neither of children baptized , were an argument of some authority and credit to prove , that there was none of this capacity , or age , baptized . xxxvii . whether , in case it could be proved ( which yet hath not been proved , nor , i am full of belief , ever will be , the proofs lying much more strong and pregnant for it , then against it ) that there were no children baptized during the apostles days , doth it by any whit better consequence follow from hence , that therefore children ought not now to be ( or might not then , as to point of simple lawfulness , have been ) baptized , then from the non-circumcising of the jewish children for forty years together ( jos. 5. 5. ) viz , during the whole time of their journeying through the wilderness , it follows , that neither ought they to have been circumcised afterwards , especially considering , 1. that there may be many more , and more weighty , reasons ( though possibly unknown unto us ) why neither christ , nor his apostles , should baptize children in their days , though the lawfulness , yea and necessity of their baptizing , at other times , and in some cases , be supposed , then there was why the israelites should omit the circumcising of their children for those forty years together , which were specified ; and , 2. that the apostle paul saith , that he was not sent to baptize , but to preach the gospel ; [ meaning , that baptizing , whether personally , or by commissioning or delegating others hereunto , was not only not the principal , but not any considerable end of his sending , but the publishing and preaching of the gospel , ] for if he was not sent to baptize [ meaning , neither one age , nor one sex , or other , ] neither could he be sent to baptize children ; and if he was not sent to baptize , either one , or other , [ in the sence declared , ] neither was the lord christ himself , nor the rest of the apostles sent about this work ( in such a sence , ) what marvel then is it , that persons sent about matters incomparably greater and more weighty , should not be so throughly intent upon things of a secondary and lighter consequence , as to prosecute them to the uttermost of what they lawfully might , yea and in case of a lighter burthen upon their shoulder in those more important affairs , had been bound to do ? or are there not many cases , wherein a man may break a law , [ i. e. a standing law , or a law provided for ordinary cases ] and yet be blameless ? yea and some cases , wherein he may do it with commendation ? see mat. 12. 3 , 4 , 5. 2 cor. 11. 17 , 18 , 21. 1 joh. 3. 16. xxxviii . whether is not that principle , or humor , in the children of new baptism , of making such sacred treasure hereof as generally they do , estimating christianity it self , and acceptance with god , by it , counting all persons unclean and unholy , and not meet for church-communion , who submit not unto it &c. thus making gods nothing , their all things ; is not this humor ( i say ) the express character of such persons in all ages , who have unduly , and without cause , broken the bands of unity , love , and peace , wherein they had been sometimes bound up in a sweet bundle of christianity with other churches , to walk in some crooked and by-way of particular choyce by themselves , to the offence , grief , and reproach of those churches , from which , upon such an account , they rent themselves ? or did not eunomius the heretique , who maintained this doctrine ( by way of dissent from the churches of christ ) that the son of god is altogether unlike the father , and the holy ghost unlike the son , notwithstanding the groundlessness and erroneousness of it , yet attribute this high and sacred priviledg unto it , that whosoever believed it could not possibly perish , how wickedly soever he lived a ? or did not the donatists ascribe all christian worth and excellency to their sect and opinions , denying that there was any true church of christ in all the world , but only amongst them , and despising all other christians , but themselves , and yet giving entertainment to most vile and wicked men in their communion b , as if the giving of the right hand of fellowship unto them in their way , rendered men religious and holy , in the midst of the practice of all wickedness ? or did not theophanes attribute so much to the use of images in religious worship , that he censured constantine the emperor ( by-named , copronymus ) as an apostate from god , for opposing images , and idol-worship c ? or did not some jewish teachers labor to possess men with such an high opinion of their tradition and practice of washing hands before meat , as that they ought to look upon him , who should neglect or not observe it , as one that lieth with an harlot d ? or did not the author and abettors of that hideous doctrine , that god seeth no sin in persons justified , pronounce all those traytors to the blood of christ , that held the contrary e ? or did not the monks , who ( generally ) were the compilers of the histories of this nation in former times , place so much of the very essence ( as it were ) of religion , in reverencing bishops and monks of these times , that ( as daniel , a late english historian observeth ) they personated all their princes , either religious , or irreligious , as they humored , or offended , the bishops rochet , and the monks belly f ? or did not theodore the abbot , give this advice to a monk , who ( as himself informed the said abbot ) was threatened by the devil , that he would never cease vexing and molesting him by temptations unto fornication , until he left worshiping the image of the blessed virgin ; did not ( i say ) this abbot give this advice to the monk in his case , that it were better that he frequented all the stews in the city , then not to worship christ and his mother in an image g ? or do not all these instances ( with many more that might be added unto them , of like consideration ) plainly shew and prove , that to conceit and speak glorious things , of any private opinion , or by-practice , is an argument of very great probability ( at least ) that this , both opinion , and practice , are mens own , or from themselves , and not from god , or agreeable unto his word ? or are there not several grounds , and these near at hand , very material and weighty , to strengthen this conjecture ? yea and when the apostle peter saith , that those that are unlearned and unstable , pervert , or wrest , the scriptures , to their own destruction , doth not this great danger or misery arise from hence , that they who do wrest the scriptures , are inordinately conceited of , and confidently rest and build upon , such notions , sences , and opinions , which are engendered and begotten in their minds or consciences , by this scripture-wresting ? xxxix . whether , is not the testimony of that worthy , zealous , and learned martyr mr john philpot ( recorded in a letter written by him to a freind of his , a prisoner in newgate at the same time ) worthy credit and beliefe , wherein he affirms , that auxentius , an arrian heretique , ( with his adherents ) was one of the first that denyed the baptism of children , and next after him , pelagius the heretique ? or can augustin be suspected , at least by those who have any competent knowledg of his unparallel'd candor and ingenuity , to speake any thing but the truth , when he saith that the baptizing of infants was a custom of the christian church in his days , salubriter firmata , wholsomely ratified and confirmed a : in another place , that the universal church of christ always held , or retained the custom of baptizing children even from the apostles , and that it was not instituted by any council ; and that no christian would say that children were impertinently , or in vain baptized b ( with much more to like purpose . ) or is not the testimony of ierome worthy to be received , who affirmeth , that he ( with the orthodox christians in his days ) held one baptism , which they affirmed ought to be administred in the same sacramental words unto infants , and those of riper years . c xl . whether can it proved from the scriptures , or by any argument whatsoever , that either faith , or a profession , of faith , is either the only , or the best ground , either divisim or conjunctim , whereon to build a baptismal administration ? or whether did not the apostles and those who baptized by their direction and order in their days , insist upon believing , and profession of believing , with men and women , who were willing , or desirous , to be baptized , onely for want of better , and of better assured grounds , whereon to proceed to the baptizing of such persons ? or did they insist upon either of these qualifications , in reference to the said administration , simply and meerly , as , or because , they were such , or in respect of their positive and absolute nature , and not rather , in respect of their relative natures , or properties , viz. as they were significative , or declarative unto them [ the baptizers ] and unto others , of the happy estate of those in whome they were found , as being persons in grace and favour with god ? otherwise , how could the lord christ himself , having no such faith , as that which the apostles and their baptists required ( together with the profession of it ) in those , whom they baptized , be a meet or duly qualified subject of this administration ? or will any man presume to say , that he was baptized , either contrary unto , or besides , the rule , or mind of god , touching persons meet to be baptized , especially when as himself renders this account why he submitted himself unto , and desired , biptism , viz. that it became him to fulfil all righteovsnes a ? and besides , is it not altogether irrational to imagine or think , that faith should be required in order unto baptism , simply for faiths sake ? or profession of faith , meerly for this professions sake ? or that god , or christ , should enjoyn a requirement of them upon such a slender account as this ? or that they would ever have been nominated by them for qualifications unto baptism in men and women , unless they had been so significative or declarative , as hath been said , i mean , of the gracious acceptance of such persons , in whom they are , with god ? yea or unless they had been declarative in this kind , upon the best terms , whereof persons newly converted from ways of sin unto god , are capable , there being no other way , or means , more effectual or proper for such persons to make known their standing , or being , in the favor of god , unto others , then by a profession of their believing in jesus christ ; how ever it be most true , that even such declarations as these , many times deceive those , who accept of them , and trust to them , though without sin in those , who are so deceived ? now then , if faith , and profession of faith , qualifie for baptism , meerly in respect of their relation , and as they report ( with such credit as appertains to them , and is meet to be given them by men ) the persons in whom they are , and from whom they proceed , to be in an estate of grace and favor with god , is it not as evident as the sun at noon day , that all persons of mankind , who are , or may be known by more assured testimonies and declarations , then any mans own profession of his own faith amounts unto , to be in the same , or like grace and favor with god , to be every whit as regularly , and as compleatly qualified for baptism , as the greatest and loudest professors of their faith under heaven ? if so , are not infants and children before the commission of actual sin , to whom god himself hath given a loud and express testimony from heaven , that they are in grace and favor with him , and that to them , and such as they are , belongeth the kingdom of heaven , &c. are they not ( i say ) upon this account fully declared to be , not only or simply , regular and meet subjects of baptism , but subjects in this kind of the highest , and most unquestionable qualifications ? for by one spirit [ not by one , or the same , water , or dipping ] we are all baptized into one body . 1 cor. 12. 13. what therefore god hath joyned together , let no man put asunder . matt. 19. 6. baptismus sine impietatis scelere contēmni nequit : & gravissimam reprehensionem coràm deo & hominibus merentur , qui tantum beneficium differunt , vel sibi , vel suis liberis accipere . b●za opusc. p. 334. tingimus pueros , tingimus provectioris aetatis : — nullam aetatem praecepit baptismo christus , sed neque ullam vetuit , ecclesiae norlingensis pastores . scultet . annal. anno 1525. finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a85408e-340 a gal ▪ 5. 6. b 1 cor. 7. 19. c 1 cor. 5. 29. v● . cameron . myroth . p. 229. & ambross●m in locum . i know the place is much vexed with interpreters and interpretations , but certain i am that the sence here supposed and argued upon , is the m●st grammatical , and best comporting with the propriety of he words and phrase● . a 1 sam. 21. 6 a matt. 12. 7 a acts 10. 15 a matt. 16. 18 a 2 tim. 2. 23 b tit. 3. 9. a 1 cor. 12. 25 a gal. 5. 2. u●de multi post baptismum proficientes , & maxime qui infantes vel pueri baptizati sunt , &c. aug. de baptismo contra donatistas lib. 4. c. 14. d exod. 21. 33 34 similia similium occupait nomina . hur . grot. in act. 13 33. multa offi●mantur simpliciter & formaliter , quae per equivalentiam seu comparationem tantum sunt intelligenda : vid. ●ai , 66. 3. 1 tim. 5. 8 matt. 19. 12 rom. 11 , 15 , &c. c ezek. 28. 10. 31 , 18. 32. 19. 21. d jer. 9. 25. ezek. 32 19. ●1 sam. 17. 26 , 36. a 2 thes. 3. 10. b exod. 12. 48. vide scultet . annal. anno 1521 , & 1525 , &c. * see also mat : 4 : 4 : & 12 : 12 : ( besides many others . ) a eunomius — defendit hanc haeresin , dissimilem per omnia pa●r● asse●ens filium , & filio spiritum sanctum . fertur etiam usque adeo fuisse bonis moribus inimicus , ut asseveraret , quod nihil cuique obesset quorumlibet perpetratio ac perseverantia peccator rum , si hujus , quae ab il o docebatur , fidei particeps effet . aug. de haeres . c. 54 b nam illi [ donatistae ] dicebant universum orbem christianum ecclesiam non habere — deinde , qui prae le omnes alios christianos condemnabant , severitatem censurae in suos relaxaverant , & in suis coetibus homines impurissimos , ut optato● , gildoniano● , primianosque patiebantur . p. mar●y● , loc. class. 4. c. 5. sect. 15. c theophanes miscel. . l. 21. c. ult , & joseph mede , apostacy of latter times . p. 131 d ainsworth in levit. 15. 12 e p. gunter , sermon of justification , printed anno 1615. preface to the reader , p. 3. f smectymnuus vindicat. p 8. g mede , apostacy of latter times , p. 140 a de peccatonum meritis &c. lib. 3. c. 13. b quod traditum cenet universitas ecclesi●… . cum parvuli infantes baptizantur , nullus christianorum dixerit eos inaniter baptizari . et si quisquam in hac re authoritatem divinam quaerat , quanquam quod universa tenet ecclesia , nec conciliis institutum , sed semper retentum est , non nisi authoritate apostolica traditum rectissime creditur , tamen veraciter continere possumus quid valeat in parvulis baptismi sacramentum ex circumcisione carnis , quam prior populus accepit , &c. aug. de baptismo contra donat. l. 4. c. 23. c baptisma unum tenemus , quod iisdem sacramenti verbis in insantibus , quibus etiam in majoribus , asserimus esse celebrandum . hieron. t. 4. symboli explan. . ad dama●um . a mat. 3. 15 that children are in favor with god , and so declared , see briefly redemp. . redeemed , p. 330 , 516 , 517. infant baptism god's ordinance, or, clear proof that all the children of believing parents are in the covenant of grace and have as much a right to baptism the now seal of the covenant, as the infant seed of the jewes had to circumcision, the then seal of the covenant / by michael harrison ... harrison, michael, minister at potters-pury. 1694 approx. 85 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 33 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2009-10 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a45681 wing h905 estc r9581 11809580 ocm 11809580 49497 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a45681) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 49497) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 534:6) infant baptism god's ordinance, or, clear proof that all the children of believing parents are in the covenant of grace and have as much a right to baptism the now seal of the covenant, as the infant seed of the jewes had to circumcision, the then seal of the covenant / by michael harrison ... harrison, michael, minister at potters-pury. [6], 58 p. printed for thom. cockerill ..., london : 1694. reproduction of original in cambridge university library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism. 2008-06 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2008-07 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2009-01 emma (leeson) huber sampled and proofread 2009-01 emma (leeson) huber text and markup reviewed and edited 2009-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion infant baptism god's ordinance : or , clear proof that all the children of believing parents are in the covenant of grace ; and have as much a right to baptism the now seal of the covenant , as the infant seed of the jews had to circumcision , the then seal of the covenant . rom. 16. 17 , 18. i beseech you brethren mark them which cause divisions and offences , contrary to the doctrine ye have learned , and avoid them : for they that are such , serve not our lord jesus christ , but their own belly ; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple . by michael harrison , minister of the gospel in p's p. london : printed for thom. cockerill , at the three legs in the poultrey , over-against the stocks-market . 1694. to all into whose hands this may fall ; especially those who sit under my ministry . dear friends , there are two things which do most evidently prove man by nature a lost creature . the one is the exceeding propensity and inclination in the heart of every man to actual sin , psal . 58.3 . job 15.16 . though every man is not actually guilty of every sin , yet is there not a sin in the world , but is seminally and vertually in every one's nature . the other is that strange infatuation the vnderstanding lieth under , and its proneness to mistake darkness for light ; damnable and deformed errors for beautiful and saving truths : and that which is saddest of all , a tenacious adherence to , and a resolved perseverance in , these by-paths of error , is very oft a mournful consequence that follows them . now as these two things do shew the fearful ruines and miserable condition of all by nature : so there are two things which all gospel-ministers should vehemently urge upon their people as effectual remedies against so dangerous and pernicious a malady . the one is the absolute and indispensible necessity of the new birth ; joh. 3.3 . except a man be born again , he cannot see the kingdom of god. this new birth is no less than a renovation of all the powers and faculties of the soul , a putting off the old man , and a putting on christ ; a changing that heart into a new gracious tender heart , that was by nature an old unbelieving stony heart ; any thing that persons rest in short of this new birth , is short of salvation . the other is , soundness of judgment in the doctrine of christ ; it is not like that the life should be holy , if the vnderstanding be corrupt ; there are damnable principles as well as damnable practices , 2 pet. 2.1 . indeed all erroneous opinions are not alike dangerous ; such as strike at the fundamental articles of christianity are most deadly ; such as err in lesser points , are not in so much danger . therefore , as the more fundamental and noble a doctrine is , the more earnestly should we contend for it ; so the more directly any erroneous opinion subverts same fundamental truth , the more zeal and indignation we should shew against it ; as also the greater care to antidote our selves and others against it . now amongst those erroneous doctrines that have been like pricking briars , and wounding thorns , ever since the beginning of the reformation , to the protestant churches , those wild and erroneous doctrines that have been broached by the antipedo baptists , on anabaptists , have not created the least trouble to the church of christ , but have been a perpetual vexation and trouble to all our godly reformers , as is evident by the sad complaints of those godly men in their books , as who will but read the works or lives of calvin , luther , zuinglius , melancton , oeculampadius , musculus , &c. and our english divines , may be abundantly satisfied . the danger many of you were in of being sucked in among the anabaptists , or at least to join with them in excluding your infants from baptism , the seal of the covenant , was that which first put me upon preaching upon this subject ; and it is the earnest request of several of you , that makes me consent to the printing of it . the sermons you have lately heard upon this text , have been ( glory to free grace ) of admirable use to establish and settle those of you that were staggering in this doctrine ; that whereas there was many scruples in many persons about infant baptism , yet now there are very few , if any , of those that constantly frequent this congregation , but have attained great satisfaction . as god that knows my heart , can testify for me , that it is not yours , but you , that i seek , your present holiness and eternal happiness ; so my greatest joy amongst you will be to find that my labour is not in vain ; that you are gained to christ , and joined to him by so firm a faith as the gates of hell may never prevail against . i bless god for that encouragement i have had amongst you , many of you that sprung from parents of the opposite persuasion , having so chearfully listed your selves in christ's service , and by receiving christ's press-money , have more solemnly engaged your selves to be his servants for ever . and that so many of you , and many even of adult age , have thought it their honour to be catechised in the publick congregation , which , i hope , will be followed by many others . in short , your exceeding willingnss to wait on the ministry with those saving impressions which , i hope , god hath made on many of your hearts , are to me a ground of hope , that what is so hopefully begun amongst you , will be as comfortably finished in the glory of god , and your eternal salvation . if any demand a reason , why one who willingly acknowledges himself to be the unfittest of a thousand , hath attempted this work , which hath been so well performed by several abler pens ? i only answer , that what others have done , being either too voluminous , or answers to other books , were therefore not so proper : besides , they that know my circumstances , the confident repeated challenges , the restless insinuations of the anabaptists , together with the various attempts that the persons of that persuasion have made to ensnare and draw away my hearers ( though i bless god with no success ) to their own way ; will see that i lay under a kind of necessity for what i have done . christian , study thy own heart , love all that fear god , though differently persuaded in some lesser things . and pray for him who desires to serve thee in our common saviour , michael harrison . infant baptism god's ordinance . gen. 17.7 . and i will establish my covenant between me and thee , and thy seed after thee , in their generations , for an everlasting covenant , to be a god unto thee , and thy seed after thee . god having in gen. 12.3 . promised abraham , that in him all nations should be blessed ; comes now in this 17th chapter in a more express and formal manner to establish his covenant with abraham : in which observe three things . 1. the persons covenanting . 1. ex parte dei ; god stands on the one side of the covenant : o the infinite condescention of the great god , to take any notice of lost sinners ! that when we had broken the first covenant , that he should condescend to make a second covenant , a covenant of grace with lost sinners ! 2. ex parte abrahami ; abraham and his seed stand on the other side of the covenant ; with thee and thy seed after thee : this seed of abraham is to be limited according to scripture ; not in ishmael , nor his seed by ketura , but in isaac shall thy seed be called , gen. 21.12 . abraham had a two-fold seed . 1. a natural seed by generation , which are abraham's seed by promise ; rom. 9.7 , 8. neither because they are the seed of abraham , are they all children , but in isaac shall thy seed be called . 2. a spiritual seed ; and these were either the proselited gentiles under the law , who did believe in , and worshipped the god of abraham ; and so were by circumcision , the then seal of the covenant , taken into abraham's family ; or else all believers under the gospel ; who though they are not of abraham's natural posterity , are yet abraham's spiritual seed ; rom. 4.16 . therefore it is of faith , that the promise might be sure to all the seed , not only that which is of the law ( viz. the jews ) but to that also which is of the faith of abraham , who is the father of us all ; i. e. the gentile believers . so gal. 3.29 . by both which places the apostle assureth the gentiles , that if they are by faith transplanted into christ , then were they abraham's seed , and might claim all the promises and priviledges of the covenant made with abraham , as if they had been abraham's natural seed by generation from isaac . 2. here is the duration of this covenant ; an everlasting , a perpetual , or an eternal covenant ; a covenant to last for evermore ; so the hebrew word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 gnolam properly signifies : this covenant was not to be taken down by moses , no nor by christ , but was that everlasting covenant which was ratified and sealed with the blood of christ , heb. 13.20 . 3. here are the conditions of this covenant ; on god's part , i will be to thee a god , which carries in it all manner of temporal , spiritual , and eternal blessings ; as pardon , sanctification , and eternal life , psal . 144.14 , 15. and on abraham's part ; he and his seed were to be the lord 's peculiar people , to walk before god in holiness , and sincere obedience , gen. 15.1.17.8 , 9 , 10. doct. that covenant of grace which god made with abraham , of which circumcision then was , and baptism now is the seal ; is a covenant in which all believers and their children are comprehended . in speaking to this doctrine , i shall by divine assistance do these five things . 1. briefly shew you the nature of the covenant of grace . 2. prove this covenant made with abraham to be a covenant of grace . 3. that circumcision then was , and baptism now is , a seal of this covenant . 4. all believers are in it . 5. that all the infants of believing parents are in this covenant , and have as much a right to the now seal of the covenant , which is baptism , as the infants of the jews had to the then seal of the covenant , which was circumcision . 1. the nature of the covenant of grace . the covenant of grace is god's gracious promise of delivering from a state of sin and death , and bringing into a state of salvation by jesus christ , all that by faith fly to , and lay hold on him . in which covenant we may take notice , 1. the parties in covenant ; god is on the one part of the covenant , and believers and their children on the other part , as has been proved . 2. that on our part christ is the principal head and representative in this covenant ; for this covenant was made with christ as the second adam , and in him with all the elect , as his seed , gal. 3.16 . rom. 5.15 . to the end . isa . 53.10 , 11. 3. jesus christ is the mediator of this covenant , 2 tim. 2.5 . 4. herein god promises life and salvation to all believers , 1 john 5.11 , 12. 5. the condition of the covenant on our part is faith , mark 16.16 . 6. herein the holy spirit is absolutely promised to work faith and all other graces in us , prov. 1.22 . ezek. 36.27 . and the first graces of conversion is absolutely promised us without any respect to the will of man , ezek. 36.25 , 26. this covenant god made with abraham was a covenant of grace ; it must either be a covenant of works , or a covenant of grace ; but a covenant of works it is not , for that requires personal perfect obedience from all ; and in case of sin lays the sinner under an curse , gal. 3.10 , 12. rom. 10.5 . it is a covenant of grace , as is evident . 1. this phrase , i will be thy god , and you shall be my people , is never found but in a promise of the covenant of grace ; as gen. 15.1 . exod. 29.45 . jer. 24.7.31.33.32.37 , 38 , 39. ezek. 11.18 , 19 , 20.34.22 , 23 , 24 , 25.37.23 . zech. 8.8 . 2 cor. 6.16 . rev. 21.3 . 2. it was the covenant of grace ; for it 's an everlasting covenant , which is a property of the covenant of grace , 2 sam. 23.5 . heb. 13.20 . 3. it 's a covenant of grace ; for we find that in all after-discoveries and repetitions of the covenant of grace , the spirit of god hath respect to this ; as deut. 29.10 , 11 , 12. psal . 105.42 . acts 2.39 . 4. it was a covenant of grace ; for circumcision , the seal of it , was a gospel-ordinance ; rom. 4.11 . it was a sign and seal of the righteousness of faith , i. e. of christ . 5. it 's a covenant of grace ; for that phrase , i will be to thee a god , contains all gospel-blessings in it , heb. 11.9 , 10 , 13 , 14. gal. 3.18 . 6. many scriptures testify it was so ; micha 7.19 , 20. luke 1.72 , 73 , 74. 3. that circumcision then was , and baptism now is , the seal of this covenant : that circumcision then was a seal , is evident , gen. 17.10 . rom. 4.11 . whoever would be a visible church-member must be circumcised . circumcision is now abolished by christ , eph. 2.15 . 1 cor. 7.19 and baptism now serves to the same purpose ; whoever will be a member of the christian church , must be baptised ; there 's no change in the covenant , only the rite of admitting members is changed , matth. 28.18 , 19. acts 2.41 . col. 2.10 , 11 , 12. 4. all believers are in this covenant ; this is abundantly evident , rom. 4.11 , 12 , 13 , 14 , 15. gal. 3.29 . the covenant was made with abraham as a believer , and with all believers as well as him . persons may be said to be in covenant in a twofold respect . 1. internally and invisibly ; as united to christ , living branches , knit to christ by a vital union ; and thus only the elect are in covenant : the covenant thus considered is not the ground of baptism ; if we must baptize none but such as are vitally in christ , then must we baptize none ; because tho we see the outward profession , we do not know who belong to the election of grace . 2. persons are externally and visibly in covenant , deut. 29.10 , 11 , 12 , 13. thus all who profess christ , tares and wheat , wise virgins and foolish , matth. 25.1 , 2 , 3 , 4. this is the ground of baptism ; we do not baptize persons as the elect of god , or infants as the infants of the elect , but as making a visible and credible profession of religion ; so the apostles did presently baptize such as did profess repentance towards god , and faith towards our lord jesus christ ; act. 2.41 . simon magus , in barely professing to believe in christ , was baptised . thus all those who visibly profess christianity , and are baptised in the name of christ , and do not scandalous sins , notoriously contradict their profession , are to be accounted believers in covenant , and their children to be baptised , ezek. 16.20 , 21. 3. that all infants of such believing parents are in the covenant of grace , and have as much a right to baptism , the now seal of the covenant , as the infants of the jews had to circumcision , the then seal of the covenant . this is the principal thing designed from this text. there are , you know , a sort of restless people amongst us , who are perpetually letting fly , and with great indignation spurning at infant baptism ; telling you , your infants have no right to the seal of the covenant , and thereby tempt you to be cruel to the children of your own bowels , setting them among pagans and infidels . therefore i hope it will be an acceptable service to plead the cause of your poor infants , who cannot yet speak a word for themselves ; to assert and prove their right to the covenant , and the initiating seal thereof , which is baptism . i hope to find very few amongst you who will join with the enemy of infants , but rather put to a helping hand to restore them those priviledges god allows them . in speaking to this , i shall 1. lay down some conclusions to clear the doctrine of infant baptism . 2. prove the doctrine by several arguments . 3. shew the dangerous consequence of denying infant baptism . 4. answer objections . 5. prove that dipping over head in baptizing in these cold countreys , is no ordinance of god , but a grievous sin. chap. i. containing five introductory considerations , very needful for the right understanding the controversy of infant baptism . 1. consider , that a doctrine or practice may be proved to be of god two ways . 1. by the express words of scripture ; as the resurrection of the dead may be proved from such a text as cannot be denied by any that own the scripture to be god's word ; as john 5.28 . all that are in the grave shall come forth . 2. or from evident consequences drawn from scripture ; then have we the mind of christ , when we have the right meaning of scripture ; thus christ proves the resurrection to the sadduces , luke 20.37 , 38. now that the dead are raised , even moses shewed at the bush , when he calleth the lord , the god of abraham , the god of isaac , and the god of jacob ; god is not the god of the dead , but of the living . now this scripture doth not prove the resurrection in direct terms , but remotely , and by consequence . how little satisfaction would this text have given our modern anabaptists , if they had been present at the dispute between christ and the sadduces ; would they not have reprov'd christ for his impertinence ? we will not believe the dead will rise , unless we have a plain text ; would not these men have reported abroad that christ could could not prove the resurrection ? thus they deal with us at this day ; we challenge you , say they , to prove infant baptism to be god's ordinance ; bring us a plain text , and we will believe . now if we prove infant baptism as plainly as christ proved the resurrection , then it is certainly god's ordinance ; and we are bound to own it . most we believe nothing but what we have totidem verbis , in just so many words in scripture ? then how shall we prove the first day of the week to be the christian sabbath ? that a woman may come to the lord's table ? that a christian may be a magistrate ? 2. observe , that a mind prepossessed with error and prejudice , that is , not seeking truth , but only something to defend their present embraced opinions , will not be satisfied , let the text be never so clear , or the argument never so firmly built upon scripture ; but will still be inventing some shift or other to ward off the force of any text or argument . this is evident in the example of the sadduces beforementioned ; we find indeed christ silenced them , but we do not find so much as one of them convinced , and brought off to a sound mind . men are generally so fond of their errors , that when they are beaten out of one hold , they fly to another . 3. those doctrines which were clearly revealed , and fully confirmed in the old testament , though little or nothing be said of them in the new testament , and were never repealed , are yet to be owned , received and believed , as if much had been said of them in the new testament ; the whole scripture is god's word , and what need of proving the same thing twice , unless the authority of the old testament were questioned ? this is evident in the lawfulness of a christian magistracy , in an oath before a magistrate , and making war upon a just occasion : there is so little said of these things in the new testament , many of the anabaptists have denied them ; yet these being fully setled and confirmed by god in the old testament , are to be owned , though little be said of them in the new. now this is the case of infant baptism . the question is not by what sign , but at what age , persons are to be admitted into the visible church ? now this was fully determined in the old testament , that infants at eight days old were to be admitted members of the visible church ; and suppose little be said of it in the new testament , it is because there was no need of it ; this truth having been once setled in the old testament , and never repealed . 4. those doctrines which were once throughly setled in the old testament , and never called in question by any in the new , there was no occasion given to speak of them again . we find , that what was but darkly hinted in the old testament , and much questioned in the new , is fully cleared ; and much is said of it , as that glorious doctrine of justification by the imputation of the righteousness of christ : this was very darkly hinted in the old testament , and very much opposed by legal preachers in the new testament , therefore much is said in the new testament to clear it . but infants right to the covenant , or to church-membership , there was much said of it in the old testament , and it was neve● denied or called in question by any in the apostles days ; they were setled , and had had peaceable possession of their priviledges ever since abraham's time . had any in the apostles days scrupled in infants right , very much would have been said of it ; for the jews , who tenaciously adhered to their old priviledges , would never so silently have suffered their children to be cast out of covenant , without taking notice of it . a doctrine may be very clear , the scriptures brought to prove , and the argument thence deduced clear and convincing ; and yet it may remain dark to one that is uncapable of discerning it . an object may be very obvious , and yet not well discerned , by reason the eye is clouded . how plain are the doctrines of the trinity ; the divine nature of christ ; justification by imputed righteousness , &c. and yet many are so blind as not to see these things ? so the matter in debate , viz. that the infants of believing parents have a right to baptism , is as clear to me as the other , yet many will not see it . the generality of christians are but babes in knowledge , have but dark and confused apprehensions of the clearest truths in religion , and must needs be much more at a loss in what hath not that clearness and perspicuity in it . chap. ii containing the first argument for infant baptism . if god doth own the infant seed of believers as his , then they ought to receive the token of his so owning of them . but god doth own the infant seed of believers as his , therefore they ought to receive the token of his so owning of them , which is baptism . now that god doth own the infant seed of believers as his , i prove by these four arguments . 1. if the children of believing parents are god's children , their sons and daughters his sons and daughters , then god owns them . but the children of believing parents are god's children , as is evident , ezek. 16.20 , 21. moreover , thou hast taken thy sons and thy daughters , whom thou hast born unto me , and these hast thou sacrificed to be devoured : thou hast slain my children and delivered them to pass through the fire for them . these idolatrous israelites were at this time much degenerated , but yet god had not given them a bill of divorce , the covenant was not dissolved ; and therefore these children born within the covenant , were god's children ; and his , not merely by right of creation , so all are his but by right of covenant . there was little reason to believe the parents were gracious ; but however , being visibly in covenant , god claims their children as his own , as belonging to his church and family by a covenant-right . 2. if the children of such parents , who are one or both of them believers , are federally holy , then god owns them : but the former is true , 1 cor : 7.14 . therefore the latter , else were your children unclean ; but now are they holy ; the question was , whether when the husband was a believer , and the wife an unbeliever ; or the wife a believer , and the husband a pagan , they might yet continue to live with the unbeliever : to this the apostle answers , they might , and gives this reason for it , viz. the unbeliever is sanctified by the believer : sanctified in scripture usually signifies either 1. savingly sanctified by grace and spiritual life infused into the soul by the spirit of god : or , 2. setting persons apart for some holy use or office ; as the priests , sabbath , tabernacle , and all the utensils thereof , and all the people of israel who were circumcised ; but the unbelieving husband or wise here were sanctified in neither of these respects ; therefore it 's otherwise to be understood . candidatus est fidei , say some , they are in a fair way of being won over to the faith of christ , or prepared by god for such a use ; so sanctified signifies in isa . 13.3 . but the meaning is plainly this : that in regard that all the faithful are heirs of the covenant of grace , gen. 17.1 . i will establish my covenant between me and thee , and thy seed after thee , in their generations , for an everlasting covenant , to be a god unto thee , and to thy seed after thee . acts 2.39 . the promise is to you , and to your children : this promise being to believing parents , and their infants , this covenant the unbelieving party cannot undo by his or her unbelief ; hence their children were holy . 1. not merely legitimate ; for so they would have been , had both the parents been pagans ; to say as the anabaptists do , they are not bastards ; is , saith doctor featly , a bastard exposition . 2. nor can it be meant , that they are saved , justified and sanctified by the holy ghost , ( though if that were the sense , it would not contradict but confirm the doctrine of infant baptism ; for whoever hath justification and sanctification , the thing signified by baptism , hath undoubtedly a right to the sign and seal . 3. then by holy must unavoidably be meant federally holy ; i. e. within the covenant ; as the infants of the jews were a holy seed , and had a right to circumcision ; so the infants of christian parents , though but one of them a believer , had a federal holiness and a right to be baptised , as if both the parents had been believers . 4. if the kingdom of heaven belongs to little children , then christ owns them ; but the kingdom of heaven doth belong to them , matth. 19.13 , 14. then were there brought little children unto him , that he should put his hands on them , and pray , and the disciples rebuked them ; but jesus said , suffer little children , and forbid them not to come unto me , for of such is the kingdom of heaven . here christ declares the kingdom of heaven belongs to them . by the kingdom of heaven is meant , either the kingdom of glory in the next world , or the kingdom of grace here ; the latter is most probable , for so the church is called , matth. 22.1 , 2. now be it the one , or the other , its evident christ owned them as his . 5. if the promise of the covenant of grace may be made to the infant seed of believers , then christ owneth them ; but the promise of the covenant of grace is to the infant seed of believers , as well as to their believing parents ; gen. 17.7 . i will establish my covenant between me and thee , and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant , to be a god unto thee , and thy seed after thee . and this promise the apostle recites as belonging to all believers , acts 2.39 . the promise is to you , and to your children . now from all it 's abundantly evident , that god doth own the children of believing parents as his : therefore they ought to receive the token of his so owning them , which is baptism . the conclusion is unavoidably ; if it be evident god owns a person , that person ought to be baptized ; let him shew , that can , any reason why a person so owned by god should not be admitted into the church by baptism . chap. iii. containing the second argument for infant baptism . if the infants of believing parents ought to be received and admitted visible church-members , then such infants ought to be baptized ; but the infants of believing parents ought to be received and admitted visible church-members , therefore they ought to be baptized . now that such infants ought to be received into the visible church as visible church-members , i prove by these arguments . argument 1. if by the merciful gift and appointment of god , not yet repealed , some infants were once to be admitted members of the visible church by vertue of the covenant of grace ; then 't is certain some infants are still to be so admitted : but the former is true , therefore the latter . two things must here be done to shew , 1. that some infants were once admitted members of the visible church . 2. that this church-membership was never repealed . 1. some infants were once so admitted by vertue of the covenant of grace . if any deny this , thus it is proved . 1. infants were part of them that entered into covenant with the lord god , and into his oath , that he might take them to be a peculiar people to himself ; deut 29.10 11 , 12 , 13 , 14 , 15. ye stand this day all of you before the lord your god ; your captains of your tribes , your elders with your officers , with all the men of israel . 11. your little ones , your wives , &c. 12. that thou shouldest enter into covenant with the lord thy god , and into his oath which the lord thy god maketh with thee this day . 13. that he establish thee to day for a people unto himself ; and that be may be unto thee a god , as he hath said unto thee ; and as he hath sworn unto thy fathers , to abraham , to isaac , and to jacob. 14. neither with you only do i make this covenant , and this oath ; but v. 15. with him that standeth here with us this day before the lord your god ; but with him that is not here with us this day . this was not a new covenant , but a renewing the covenant made with abraham , as v. 13. into this covenant their little ones present were taken , and their little ones yet unborn . 2. infants were engaged to god by the seal of the covenant , which was circumcision , gen. 17.10 . circumcision was not a meer politick rite , as some frantick anabaptists have dreamed ; but a seal of the covenant of grace , rom. 4.11 . he received the sign of circumcision as a seal of the righteousness of faith : that is , circumcision was 1. a sign ; of what ? of the circumcision of the heart by the spirit of christ ; of the mortifying and killing the old man ; of the sad effects of sin , both original and actual ; and the way of recovery by jesus christ . 2. it 's a seal of the righteousness of faith ; that is , of the righteousness of christ imputed to the believer , and received by faith ; this is a periphrasis of the covenant of grace , wherein righteousness is promised , and made over to us in a way of believing . 3. infants were baptized to moses in the cloud , and in the sea , 1 cor. 10.1 , 2 , 3. and stephen calls that assembly , whereof they were members , the church in the wilderness . from hence it is evident beyond rational contradiction , that infants were sometimes taken into the visible church , as visible church-members , by vertue of the covenant of grace . secondly , that this infant church-membership was never repealed . for if infant church-membership be repealed , then that repeal must be either in mercy or judgment ; but it was in neither , therefore it was never repealed . 1. infant church-membership was never repealed in judgment ; for god never revokes his covenant to any people , till first that people break covenant with him , which infants never did ; therefore being once taken into covenant , 't is certain god did never cast them out . now it was a mercy to have infants taken into covenant , deut. 29.10 , 11 , 12. therefore if this privilege be revok'd , it must be in judgment ; for as it is a great mercy to be in the visible church , so 't is a sore judgment to be out of it , to be cast out of covenant . now if infant church-membership be repeal'd , then the infants of believers under the gospel are in a much worse condition than before christ's incarnation ; certainly christ did not come to make our children miserable , or to put them into a worse condition than they were in before ; this would make christ a destroyer , who is the only saviour . but certainly the church is now in a much better condition , and her privileges more ample and larger than they were before ; she hath lost none of her privileges , but gained many more , heb. 8.6 . a more excellent ministry , better promises , rom. 5.15 , 16 , 17. 't is certain infants are not thrown out of covenant , for that would much darken the grace of god received in the gospel . 2. nor is infant church-membership repeal'd in mercy ; for it can be no mercy to take away a mercy , unless it means to give a greater mercy in the room of it . now let the anabaptists shew what greater mercy god hath given in the room of infant church-membership ; there is none : therefore it was never repealed . 2. if that covenant , by vertue whereof infants were received into the visible church , was the covenant of grace , then 't is certain it was never repeal'd . but that covenant , by vertue whereof they were taken in , was the covenant of grace , therefore it was never repealed . but that covenant , by vertue whereof they were taken into the visible church , was the covenant of grace , as is most evident , deut. 29.10 , 11 , 12. and so the covenant made with abraham , whereof circumcision was a seal , gen. 17.7 , 10. as the apostle clearly proves , rom. 4.11 . now the covenant of grace is an everlasting covenant , 2 sam. 23.5 . never was , nor ever will be repeal'd . infant church-membership was no ceremony , neither was it any part of the ceremonial law ; if any say it was , let them shew what it typified under the gospel . if it were a ceremony , then the materials of the church would be a ceremony , and so the church it self , which would be very absurb to affirm . neither was it part of the moral law , the covenant of works , whatever pains some of the opposite persuasion have taken to prove it ; for the covenant of works knows no mercy ; neither was it any part of the judicial law , for church-membership was not a piece of meer policy ; the church is one thing , and the commonwealth another . 3. if there be no mention or record of the repeal of infant church-membership in any part of the new testament , then it is most certain it was never repealed . but there is no record of any such repeal in any part of the new testament , therefore it was never repealed ; if any say it was , let them shew where that repeal is recorded . 't is true circumcision is ceased , because it was a ceremonial type ; but infant church-membership being no type or ceremony , is not ceased . argument 2. if an infant was head of the visible church , then an infant may be a member of the visible church . but an infant was head of the visible church ; for who will deny , but that jesus christ was head of the visible church in his infancy ? what honour was done to christ in his infancy both by angels and men ? hence it appears , 1. that the nonage of infants doth not make them uncapable of being church-members , supposing god's will. 2. it shews , that it is the will of god that it should be so ; because christ passed through each age to sanctify it to us . thus irenaeus , who lived about an hundred and fifty years after christ , these are his words ; ideo per omnem venit etatem , & infantibus infans factus , &c. therefore christ passed through every age ; for infants he was made an infant , sanctifying infants ; in little children , being a little child , sanctifying them that have that very age ; here 's clear proof from antiquity of infant church-membership . argument 3. if infants are federally holy , then they have a right to visible church-membership ; but infants are federally holy , 1 cor. 7.14 . as we have before shewed , and all sound interpreters tell us . argument 4. if infants belong to the kingdom of heaven , then they belong to , and are members of the visible church ; but infants do belong to the kingdom of heaven , therefore they belong to the visible church . now some infants do belong to the kingdom of heaven , matth. 19.14 . suffer little children to come unto me , and forbid them not , for of such is the kingdom of heaven . by the kingdom of heaven here , must needs be meant , either the kingdom of grace , that is , the gospel-church here ; and then the meaning is , that the gospel church , which is christ's kingdom on earth , is made up of infants , as well as adult persons ; and this is most likely to be the meaning : and so the thing in question is clearly proved . or else by the kingdom of heaven must be meant the kingdom of glory : that is , children shall go to heaven as well as grown persons . if so , still the consequence is clear ; if infants are members of the invisible church , then have they an undoubted right to be members of the visible church . i grant a person may be a member of the invisible church , and yet no member of the visible : yet whoever is a member of the invisible church , hath a right to visible church-membership . argument 5. if infants are to be received in christ's name , then they do undoubtedly belong to christ's church : but we are commanded to receive infants in christ's name , mark 9.36 , 37. — he that receiveth one such child in my name , receiveth me , &c. doth christ take them into his arms , and would he have them cast out of his church ? are we to receive them in christ's name , and do they not belong to christ , nor to his church ? see mark 10.13 , 14 , 15. did christ say all this to deceive us ? certainly they are visible members of the visible church . now if this be so , that some infants were sometimes admitted by god's own appointment , and that by vertue of the covenant of grace , visible church-members ; then undoubtedly they ought to be baptized ; for baptism is the only rite that jesus christ , who is head of the church , hath appointed for the admitting members into his church , matth. 28.18 , 19. all that are , or will be christ's disciples , must be baptized in his name ; if any know any other , let them shew it . now these two arguments are abundantly sufficient to prove the infants right to baptism , and it is needless to name any other : but yet because some think a thing never proved , unless much be said , and many arguments be brought ; i shall therefore add some other arguments ; though i shall not dwell , nor enlarge on them , because the right understanding of these already mentioned , will give light to what remains . chap. iv. containing the third , fourth , fifth , sixth , seventh , eighth and ninth arguments for infant baptism . argument iii. if any infants are christ's disciples , then those infants ought to receive the badg of a disciple , which is baptism ; but some infants are disciples , act. 15.10 . why lay you a yoke upon the necks of the disciples . now this yoke was circumcision , as v. 1. and v. 5. there were some that would impose circumcision on the disciples of christ . now this must needs be understood of infants as well as others , because that circumcision was most commonly administred to infants ; therefore if infants are not only meant , they are chiefly intended ; now that all disciples of christ ought to be baptized ; there is a plain command for it ; and so a command for infant baptism , matth. 28.19 . go therefore teach all nations ; but in the greek it is , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , go disciple all nations , baptizing them ; infants are disciples , as before , therefore ought to be baptized . argument iv. if it hath been the constant custom of the church of christ all along from the apostles days to baptize infants , none never denying it till some hundreds of years after ; then we may rationally conclude it was the practice of the apostles to baptize infants ; but the former is true , therefore the latter . now that infant baptism was practised in the primitive times by the whole universal catholick church , is evident . irenaeus , who had seen policarpus , st. john's disciple , and therefore lived very near the apostles days , saith , christ came to save and sanctify all sorts ; qui per eum venascuntur in deum infantes , &c. all that are born to god , infants , little ones , and children — born to god in the ecclesiastical phrase , is but the same with infant baptism . tertullian , who lived about the year of redemption 200. moved some scruples about baptism , yet never denied the lawfulness of it : and in case that the infant was in danger of death , did vehemently urge it . origen , who lived but little after him , speaks again and again of the baptizing little children , and saith , they received it by tradition from the apostles . about 150 years after the death of st. john , there was one fidus , who raised a doubt , whether infants might be baptized before they were eight days old , because circumcision was not to be administred till then . therefore cyprian , bishop of carthage , and 66 more , met to consider this case ; and agreed , that infants , recens nati , new born , might be baptized . and thus we might cite testimonies of athanasius , chrysostom , augustin , and many others , that it was the constant custom of the church to baptize infants . which custom is still continued in all the churches of christ all the world over ; as appears in all the confessions of all the protestant churches : as helvetia , bohemia , belgia , auspurg , saxony , wittenberg , swedeland , france and peidmont ; and histories tell us 't is practised by the russians , muscovites , and all the christians in india , syria , cyprus , mesopotamia , babylon , palastine ; and in every part of the world where there be any christian churches planted . argument v. the fifth argument for infant baptism is this : if the infants of believing parents be in the covenant of grace , and the promise of the covenant do belong to them ; then they may , and ought to be baptized . but such infants are in covenant , and the promise of the covenant doth belong to them , therefore they ought to be baptized . that they are in covenant as well as their parents , is undeniably evident from the tenure of that covenant made with abraham , which was a gospel-covenant , gen. 17.7 as we have abundantly proved ; and that the promise of the covenant is to them , is as evident , act. 2.39 . the promise is to you , and to your children ; he means the promise of god to abraham ; the promise of salvation by christ , which was promised both to jews and gentiles ; but to the jews in the first place : or suppose the apostle hath respect unto jer. 31.33 , 34. or to joel 2.28 . it alters not the case , for those were all branches of the covenant of grace , and explications of what was virtually contained in that first promise to abraham , gen. 17.7 . argument vi. the sixth argument for infant baptism is this : if the infants of one or both of the believing parents be federally holy , then they ought to be baptized ; but the former is true , therefore the latter , 1 cor. 7.14 . by the holiness of children there , is not meant legitimacy ; i.e. not bastards ; so they would have been , if both the parents had been pagans . nor is it meant that they are savingly sanctified , but federally holy ; that is , in the covenant of grace ; and so had an undeniable right to the seal of the covenant , which is baptism . argument vii . the seventh argument for infant-baptism is this : if the kingdom of heaven belong to infants , then they ought to be baptized ; but the kingdom of heaven doth belong to some infants , matth. 19.14 . suffer little children to come to me , for of such is the kingdom of heaven . 1. suppose by the kingdom of heaven , is meant the kingdom of glory ; little children when they die shall go to heaven ; this sense the anabaptists cannot disallow ; for they say , all children dying in infancy , are saved ; the infants of turks , pagans , infidels , papists , all sorts : then if they are heirs of glory , this must be by vertue of their interest in , and union with christ ; for there 's no other way to heaven , but by jesus christ , john 14.6 . i am the way , the truth , and the life ; no coming unto the father but by me : there 's no name under heaven , whereby we can be saved , but only jesus christ . now if infants have a right to glory by vertue of their union with , and interest in christ , then have they a right to be baptized ; if they have a right to heaven by christ , then to receive the badge of a disciple of christ , which is baptism ; no person can have any plea for heaven , that had not a right to be baptized , acts 2.47 . the lord added to the church such as should be saved . this adding to the church was by baptism , v. 41. and let them shew that can , what right those have to heaven , that are not , or at least have not a right to be so added to the visible church . 2. but by the kingdom of heaven is oft understood the gospel-church : so mat. 22.1.13.47.8.20 , 21.11.12 and in most of our saviour's parables : and this is most likely to be the meaning of this text , of such is the kingdom of heaven ; that is , the gospel-church takes infants as well as adult persons to be visible members in it : and then the consequence is unavoidable , the visible church and kingdom of christ is made up of infants as well as adult persons ; baptism is the door into the visible church , therefore they must needs be baptized . argument viii . the eighth argument for infant baptism is this : if infants are to be received in the name of christ , they are to be baptized in the name of christ ; but infants are to be received in the name of christ , mark 9.36 . whoso receiveth one such child in my name , receiveth me ; to receive them in the name of christ , is to receive them as the disciples of christ ; or , because they belong to christ : and if they ought to be thus received in christ's name , as the friends and disciples of christ , then they ought to receive the badge of a disciple , to have the name of christ named over them in baptism . argument ix . if in our saviour's time the head and master of a family was never baptized , but his whole family was baptized with him , then children and infants ought to be baptized , for they are a considerable part of families . but we never read of any head or master of a family baptized , but his or their whole houshold were baptized with them ; as is evident in cornelius , acts 10. and lydia , and the jailer , acts 16. so 1 cor. 1.14 . &c. object . but there 's no mention of any infants in any of these families . answ . no more is there of any of riper years : and it 's much more likely that there was infants in those families , than otherwise ; there is no mention in scripture of children of believing parents baptized at adult age . i shall multiply no more arguments ; by these the unprejudiced reader will be abundantly satisfied , that infant-baptism is god's ordinance . chap. v. shewing that the doctrine of the anabaptists , in excluding infants from baptism , and shutting them out of the visible church , makes all infants to be of the visible kingdom of satan , and so leaves us no well-grounded hope of the salvation of any dying in infancy ; and is therefore to be justly abhorred as false doctrine . argum. 1. that doctrine that makes all infants to be of the visible kingdom of the devil , is false doctrine . but to deny infants baptism , is to deny them to be of the visible church of christ ; and if they are not visibly in the church of christ , they are visibly out of it , and of the kingdom of the devil ; there is no third or middle state on earth between the visible kingdom of christ , which is his church , and the kingdom of the devil ; and all men and women , and infants too , are visible members of the one or the other . if any know of any middle state , let them show it ; christ and satan share the whole world between them ; and if infants are not visibly in the kingdom of christ , they are visibly in the kingdom of the devil ; the consequence is unavoidable : what barbarous usage is this to our poor infants ! christ commands us to bring them to him , and tells us , of such is the kingdom of god ; and the anabaptists perversely thrust them away from christ , and from the church of christ , set them among pagans and infidels , who are of the visible kingdom of the devil . argument 2. that doctrine that leaves us no well-grounded hope of the salvation of any infants dying in infancy , is certainly false doctrine : but the anabaptists in denying infant baptism to the seed of believers , leave us no well-grounded hope of the salvation of any such dying in infancy . i do not say , that the anabaptists do positively assert the damnation of all infants dying in infancy , for they do the direct contrary , assert the certain salvation of all infants , even turks , pagans , and jews . but i say , they leave us no well-grounded hope of the salvation of any such ; for if infants ought not to be baptized , then are they out of the visible church ; all who belong to the visible church , have a right to baptism ; therefore in denying infants baptism , they throw them out of the visible church : and let him shew , that can tell how , what grounds there are to hope , or expect , the salvation of any out of the visible church . i grant a person may want the engaging sign , and yet have a right to church-membership , yea , to salvation ; so an elect infant dying unbaptized is saved ; though it have not the sign , yet it had a right to it . now without a promise we can neither believe nor hope , rom. 15.4 , 13. eph. 1.18 . eph. 4.4 . col. 1.5 , 23 , 27. heb. 6.18 , 19. again , such as god intends to save , he adds to the church , acts 2.47 . 't is the visible church there spoken of ; and such who are not so added , or have not a right to be so added , let them shew , that can , what ground there is to hope for their salvation . and thus all well-grounded hope of the salvation of any infant dying in infancy , is taken away by the anabaptists . for thus they argue from mat. 28.18 , 19. none but those who are taught , are disciples ; infants cannot be taught , therefore are not disciples ; and that this is the only way to make church-members ; and may we not on the same ground say , they cannot be saved because they cannot believe ? mark 16.16 . he that believes not , shall be damned . i appeal to all unbiassed persons , whether there is not on their own bottom , the same reason to say , they are uncapable of salvation , as of baptism ; but there is great reason to believe and hope for the salvation of some infants ; for as we have shewed they are in the covenant of grace , gen. 17.7 . acts 2.39 . deut. 29.10 , 11 , 12 , 13. they are to be joined in standing church-ordinances , 2 chron. 20.13 . joel 2.16 . from all which , and much more might be said , it 's evident some infants are saved , though the anabaptists by their erroneous doctrine take away all well-grounded hope of the salvation of any infants dying in infancy . chap. vi. objections of anabaptists answered . obj. 1. if it be god's will infants should be baptized , why is there no command for it , as there was for their circumcision ? 1. the general command includes children , therefore there was no need of any particular mentioning of them . 2. the promise is as express to children , as to parents , acts 2.39 . the promise is to you and to your children . 3. it had been absurd to have given a new command for children , seeing they were in the actual possession of their priviledg , and had been so ever since abraham's time , none had ever questioned their right and title to the covenant . there was no anabaptists in the apostles days , nor of many hundred years after . obj. 2. but that covenant , gen. 17.7 . was a covenant of works . indeed some weak anabaptists have said so . but it was not a covenant of works , for that knows no mercy to fallen sinners ; but there is mercy in that covenant , that god will be a god to his people , and to their seed : it was a covenant of grace , and that the apostle proves , rom. 4.11 . as hath been abundantly proved before . obj. 3. though infants were then church-members , it doth not follow they are so now ; the church is now built on another foundation . thus a preacher among the anabaptists lately urged to me . ans . 1. if this be true , then the church of christ under the old testament , had a different foundation from the church now under the new testament : the foundation is now jesus christ ; but what was it then ? what will not proud and ignorant men say to maintain an errour ! 2. the foundation of the church then was christ , and the covenant of grace was the same then as now ; only then was but the dawning of the day , the darker appearances of the son of righteousness ; but now the sun shines in his full strength . heb. 10.1 . rom. 4.3 , 11. obj. 4. but though infants were then visible church-members , and had a right to the sign of the covenant , god has now cast off the jews , and so infant church-membership is ceased . ans . the apostle assures us , that church-membership , and all other priviledges , are as sure and ample now to the believing gentiles , as they were before to the jews , rom. 11.17 . and if some of the branches be broken off , and thou being a wild olive tree , wert grafted in amongst them , and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree . obj. 5. but circumcision is abolished , therefore infant church-membership . ans . circumcision and infant church-membership , were two things ; circumcision was but the rite of admitting visible members ; the rite is changed , but not church-membership ; baptism comes in the room of circumcision , col. 2.10 , 11 , 12. obj. 6. infants are not capable of the ends of baptism , for it 's an engaging sign , and signifies the washing away sin , both guilt and stain ; infants being uncapable of the use of reason , must be so of baptism . ans . baptism hath more ends than one : 1. it 's christ's listing sign for admitting soldiers into his service , or disciples into his school , or subjects into his kingdom ; and this is what infants are capable of . 2. it 's an engaging sign , wherein they are by parents , or other , engaged to god , and this they are capable of also . 3. the inward grace thereby signified , as pardon , justification , sanctification , adoption , these infants are capable of , otherwise they could not be saved , and if these are not , the sacrament may be without them . 4. a lease for years , with a covenant to a child that understands it not , may be of great use : so baptism , though at present the child understands nothing of it , yet it may be , and to converted believers is of great use afterwards , and godly parents at present have the comfort : for god herein hath provided for the comfort of parents . 5. a person may be baptized that is not capable of all the ends of baptism ; one end of baptism is to wash away sin , &c. this was an end jesus christ was not capable of , and yet he was baptized . 6. those infants christ took into his arms and blessed , and those circumcised at eight days old , knew no more of the benefits they received , than ours do now ; they were no more capable of faith and repentance , than ours are ; and yet they entered into the covenant of grace , rom. 4.11 . obj. 7. but we have no express command in the new testament to baptize infants . ans . i have shewn there needed none ; their priviledg had been setled many ages before , and never questioned by any , nor repealed by christ ; their former right continuing firm , acts 2.39 . the general command includes them . obj. 8. but if they had a right , we might expect to find some examples of their baptizing . ans . 't is manifest that believers housholds were baptized with them , acts 10. acts 16.15 , 16 , 33. and if no infants are mentioned , so neither any children of believing parents baptized at age ; and we have much more reason to believe there were infants in all , or some of those families , than any have to think there was none . obj. 9. the baptism of believers is come in the room of infant church-membership . ans . it hath been abundantly proved , that infant church-membership was no ceremony , or type ; if any say it was , let them prove it : therefore as it was never abolished , nor infants never unchurched , nothing can be said to come in the room of it . 2. that baptizing adult believers should exclude infants , is as if the receiving and circumcising the gentile proselytes into the church of israel , had been a means to have unchurched their infants , which for any to affirm , would be extremely ridiculous . obj. 10. how can infants covenant with god , or be engaged by this sign ? or where doth god engage parents to promise any thing for their children ? answ . that parents may , and ought to covenant for their children , plainly appears , 1 : from nature , lex naturae est , lex dei ; may not parents take a lease for their children ? who buyeth lands , and not for himself and heirs ? are not children bound by those ties ? and then much more to god. 2. from scripture , deut. 29.10 , 11 , 12 , 13. here you may see the parents covenant , not only for their children then present , but unborn , and they were by circumcision to enter them into covenant , so deut. 26.17 , 18. and hath the gospel taken away the parent 's right in his child ? obj. we promise what we cannot perform . ans . we promise to educate this child for god , to instruct him in gospel truths ; leaving the renovation and sanctification of the heart to god , who works when , on whom , and by what means he pleaseth . may not a man covenant for himself and heirs to pay a yearly rent ? and what follows in case it be not paid , but forfeiture of his lease , and that from the person that should have paid it ? obj. 11. if infants must be baptized , why may they not as well receive the lord's supper ? 1. if there were that scripture-proof to administer the lord's supper to infants , as there is for baptizing them , we would do it , when they have as clearly proved the one , as we have the other . 2. baptism is the initiating seal of entering into the church , which infants being disciples of christ , are capable of ; the lord's supper is the confirming seal to be administred only to grown christians ; therefore infants have a right to the one , but not to the other . obj. 12. if infants ought to be baptized , why is it left so dark in the new testament ? ans . 1. it 's not dark , which admits of such clear proof as you see this doth . 2. that all christ's disciples ought to be baptized , is not dark , matth. 28.19 . infants are disciples ; therefore 't is plain they ought to be baptized . obj. 13. the baptizing persons before they know , occasions much gross ignorance . ans . 1. christ is the occasion of the ruin and damnation of thousands , for he was set for the fall , as well as the rising of many in israel , luke 2.3 , 4. but had it been better the world had had no christ ? 2. the gospel is the savour of death to many ; had it been better then we had had no gospel ? what will not the wicked take hurt by ? 3. let them shew what in baptism tends to breed ignorance ; is the entring a boy 's name in the school the way to breed him in ignorance ? if a child's name be put into a lease , is this like to hurt him ? what harm is it to be in christ's family from our youth ? nay , the contrary is the way to breed ignorance and prophaneness ; for how many sad examples have we among the anabaptists , who refusing to dedicate their infants to christ , they are ignorantly and bruitishly brought up , live and die like pagans . thus it hath been proved abundantly , that infant baptism is god's ordinance ; that the infant seed of believers were once taken into the church as visible church-members ; that christ owns them , &c. therefore they ought to be baptized ; that it 's a false and dangerous doctrine to deny them church-membership and baptism . enough hath been said for the satisfaction of those who are seeking truth ; such who wilfully shut their eyes , it 's in vain to set light before them , because seeing they see , but do not understand ; and hearing they hear , but do not perceive . there 's one thing more remaining , viz. the right manner of baptizing ; that shall next be dispatched . chap. vii . shewing that washing , pouring , or otherwise applying water to the body , is the right way of baptizing ; and not dipping , as now used by the anabaptists . when the anabaptists speak of baptizing , as 't is now done generally by all the reformed churches , they do it with much scorn and contempt , and can scarcely do it in any other terms , than sprinkling ; they say we may as well sprinkle a lamb , nay a dog , or a cat , as an infant ; what christian ear doth not abhor such language ! our protestant divines usually define baptism thus ; it is a washing in , or of water , or an applying water to the baptized : or by sprinkling the baptized in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost . none , say the anabaptists , are rightly baptized , but such as are dipped or plunged over head in the water . to this i answer three things . 1. that which is a plain breach of the sixth commandment , thou shalt not kill , is no ordinance of god , but a most heinous sin ; but dipping over-head in cold water in these cold countreys , is a plain breach of the sixth commandment , thou shalt not kill ; which forbids the taking away of our own life , or the life of our neighbour unjustly , or any thing that tends thereunto : now dipping in cold water tends to the taking away life , as many have found by experience , who have contracted such distempers in dipping as have hastened their deaths : therefore the so doing is a great sin. 2. the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , though it be derived from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to dip or plunge , yet it 's taken for any kind of washing or cleansing , where there is no dipping , mat. 3.11 . mark 7.4 . and it sometimes signifies sprinkling , yea to baptize by sprinkling , 1 cor. 10.2 . they were all baptized unto moses by the cloud in the sea ; all the world knows a cloud doth but sprinkle , heb. 9.10 . divers washings or baptisms , 't is evident the apostle means the sprinkling of blood , exod. 29.20 , 21. and the law of cleansing the leper , lev. 14.4 , to 9. 3. washing , sprinkling , or pouring water upon the body , aptly represents the thing signified , and the sign need not exceed the thing signified . the washing away sin by the blood of christ is the thing signified in baptism , and this the holy ghost delights to express by washing , sprinkling , or pouring out water , psal . 51.7 . ezek. 36.25 . zec. 12.10 . 1 cor. 6.11 . tit. 3.5 . 1 pet. 1.2 . heb. 9. and 12.24 . quest . but did not the apostles baptize by dipping ? did not philip and the eunuch go down into the water ? ans . 1. it was never yet proved that persons were then dipped . as for philip's baptism , act. 8.38 . the particular manner is not exprest , neither can it be collected ; neither doth the greek preposition 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , necessarily signify going into , but rather unto the water , as it 's frequently rendered in other places , matt. 15.24 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , unto the lost sheep : so in all these and many other places , matth. 26.10 . john 6.9.13.1 . 1 cor. 10.2 . 2 pet. 4.7 . so that into , and out of the water , seems to be no more than unto , and from the water . travellers tell us it was in the village bethsara , where was a very small fountain , not sufficient to dip in . 2. the multitude john and the apostles baptized , it 's highly probable it was never done by dipping , matth. 3.5 , 6. nay almost impossible it should , for these two reasons . 1. the extream scarcity of water ; water was extream scarce in those hot countreys , that there was not water to dip such multitudes in ; enon , where john was baptizing , there was not much water ; 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is but oculus , an eye , a very little fountain ; none in probability to dip a multitude in . and so likewise acts 2.41 . when three thousand persons were baptized ; st. peter began to preach about the third hour of the day , which was about nine of the clock ; these three thousand were converted by this sermon , and were all baptized the same day ; it must needs be for on before they began to baptize , and there was no river near jerusalem but the brook cedron , which travellers tell us , was in summer but a dry ditch , therefore 't is highly improbable that either john or the apostles baptized by dipping . 2. from the multitude of people that were baptized : we do not find john had any to help him to baptize , and is it likely he could dip such multitudes ? and is it to be imagined that three thousand persons could be converted ; prepared for , and be baptized , by dipping , in a few hours . 3. if they were dipped , it must be either naked , or in their cloaths . 1. it 's very unlikely they were dipped naked , for this would be very immodest for ministers to baptize women and maids naked ; a means to stir up lust and unclean affections , and so a breach of the seventh commandment , thou shalt not commit adultery ; which forbids all unchast thoughts , words and actions ; now to look on a woman's nakedness is an unchast action , expresly forbidden , lev. 20.17 . and for this reason god would not have the priest go up to the altar by steps , gen. 28.42 . besides , there was a mixt multitude of men and women baptized together ; and if they were naked , they must see one another's nakedness , which would have been an horrible reproach to religion . 2. if they were dipped in their cloaths , it was either in all their cloaths , or some provided for the purpose . if in all their cloaths , is it at all likely that they should go up and down in the wet cloaths ; and that would not be dipping , to speak properly , but soaking . or was it in some cloaths only ? as some light under garment , or something provided for the purpose ? there would be much immodesty in it , and it would be little better than naked : besides , where must this multitude have cloaths for the purpose ? must they go home and fetch them , and provide them ? for they designed no such thing when they came together , nay , many of them lived at a very great distance . let mens imaginations work which way soever , it will appear extreamly unlikely that there was any dipping in their baptizing ; that which is most probable , is , that john the baptist , and the apostle , went unto the water , or it may be , into it , with their feet , wearing nothing but sandals , and so with their hands did take up water and sprinkle , or pour on the persons to be baptized . and how much less probability is there , that in the baptizing of housholds , as the jailor's in the night , lydia , cornelius , and others , that there was any dipping ? 4. if it were clearly demonstrated , which never was yet done , that persons were baptized by dipping ; yet would it be proved but occasional in those hot countreys . there is no precept or command for it ; and therefore it would be no way binding to us , no more than our lord's administring his last supper in an inn , and in an upper room , in the evening , to none but men and ministers , doth oblige us to do so ; christ having no-where appointed the quantity of water in baptism , no more than the quantity of bread and wine in the lord's supper . 't is neither the quantity of water in the one , nor of bread and wine in the other , that gives efficacy to the ordinance . obj. but if it be god's way , we must do it , whatever be said against it . ans . this is but to beg the question ; moreover , we have proved it is not god's way . obj. but say they , the significancy is not sufficiently exprest , unless we are dipped in the water , rom. 6.4 . we are buried with him by baptism into death ; which place the anabaptists produce to prove baptism by dipping , as also the necessity of it ; whereas neither can be hence proved . the apostle's design there , is to engage christians to forsake and put off sin , as is evident , v. 1. the argument he uses to enforce this is , that in their baptism they were baptized into christ , into the likeness of his death , and were so buried with him in baptism , v. 3 , 4. so that as christ dyed for sin , by their covenant-engagement they were to dye to sin , and rise to newness of life : so that what the apostle here argues from , is our baptismal covenanting with god , which doth not necessarily suppose dipping . obj. but the apostle alludes to the custom of going under the water . ans . how doth that appear ? they must prove the custom , before they can prove this is an allusion to the custom ; so that this text doth not prove the custom ; and the apostle's discourse may be well understood without it : and if the custom be owned , yet the necessity of dipping doth not thence follow . other scriptures allude to sprinkling ; we may as well thence infer , the absolute necessity of the custom of sprinkling , as 1 cor. 10.2 . where it 's said , that the children of israel were all baptized unto moses in the cloud , and in the sea , or as the words may be read together , with moses by the cloud in the sea , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sometimes being so rendered , luke 4.1 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , by the spirit ; so they were baptized by sprinkling ( for a cloud doth but sprinkle ) ; by the cloud , i. e. by christ who was this cloud , or else appeared in this cloud , as is evident from exod. 13.21 , 22. this was at least a figure and type of baptism ; and in several other texts . application . is this so , that that covenant of grace made with abraham , whereof circumcision then was , and baptism now is the seal , is a covenant which comprehends all believers , and all their children ? here is then a fourfould use to be made of it : 1. of information . 2. examination . 3. exhortation . 4. consolation . 1. use shall be of information in three things . 1. this informs us of the infinite condescention and goodness of god , that when the first covenant of works was violated , and the way to heaven for ever barr'd up against the sinner , there being no possibility of ever getting to heaven that way , it should please the lord to make a new covenant , a covenant of grace , a new and living way to the father : o what love and grace is this ! john 3.14 , 15 , 16. now the infinite grace of god in this second covenant , appears in these two things . 1. that herein god doth not stand on the old terms , do this and live ; the law required perfect personal obedience ; but now in this new covenant god is pleased to accept of the obedience and righteousness of another in our stead , even jesus christ , 2 cor. 5.21 . he hath made him to be sin for us who knew no sin , that we might be made the righteousness of god in him . 2. that god doth not only command few and easie things , as the condition of this new covenant , viz. repentance towards god , and faith towards our lord jesus christ , acts 20.21 . but doth freely promise his holy spirit to work these and all other covenant-qualifications in us , ezek. 36.25 , 26 , 27. 2. this informs us of the infinite mercy of god to us , that we live under the new covenant , that god should offer christ and salvation in a covenant-way to us : o let us admire grace ! what are we that god should reveal himself to us , and not to the world ! matt. 11.25 , 26. i thank thee , o father , — that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent , and hast revealed them to babes : even so father , for so it seemed good in thy sight . 3. this informs us what a fearful condemnation will befall those who refuse to accept of christ and salvation on covenant-terms , heb. 10.28 , 29. he that despised moses law , dyed without mercy ; of how much sorer punishment shall he be thought worthy , who hath trodden under foot the son of god , and counted the blood of the covenant wherewith he was sanctified , an unholy thing , and hath done despite to the spirit of grace . 2. use of examination , is there a covenant of grace ? then examine your selves what interest you have in it ; if you are in this covenant , you are a happy people ; then every promise in the covenant belongs to you ; but if you are out of this covenant , your case is dreadful . quest . how may i know whether i am in covenant or no ? ans . 1. have you done all those things that are necessary to an external visible covenanting with jesus christ ? and these are 1. knowledg in , and acquaintance with the gospel-covenant ; you can never covenant with jesus christ , until you know the terms , john 17.3 . this is life eternal , to know thee the only true god , and jesus christ . 2. have you entered your selves into this covenant by baptism ? have you put your hand to the plow , and owned christ in that seal of the covenant ? 3. do you live in an awful discharge of such external and visible duties the covenant requires , such as prayer , eph. 6.18 . sanctifying the lord's day , attendance on god in all ordinances , &c. 2. have you those internal graces , and do you perform those internal invisible duties the covenant requires ? if you have , then you are certainly in covenant , and all the promises in the covenant belong to you , isa . 57.15 . to this man will i look , which is of an humble and contrite spirit , and trembles at my word . john 3.16 . matt. 11.28 . come to me you that labour and are heavy laden . have you that new heart , promised ezek. 36.26 . those graces mentioned mat. 5.3 , 4 , 5 , 6. if you have these in truth , then are you in covenant . 3. use of exhortation , is there a covenant of grace in which believers and their chidren are comprehended ? then be exhorted , 1. to bless and admire free-grace that hath given you such a covenant ; o what mercy is this to us and our children ! that god will call our children his children ; and our sons and daughters , his sons and daughters , ezek. 16.20 , 21. 2. live and act as those who are in covenant , phil. 1.27 . only let your conversation be as becomes the gospel of christ . 3. secure your interest in it , and be often calling your selves to an account whether or no you have an interest in it . 4. learn to live upon this covenant ; fetch all your comforts and encouragements from it in all distresses , heb. 13.5 . be content with such things as you have , for he hath said , i will not leave thee nor forsake thee . 5. are your children in covenant ? then dedicate them to christ in the covenant , has god taken them in ? gen. 17.7 . acts 2.29 . then do not you cast them out , but do as hannah did , first beg a child from the lord , and vow a vow to dedicate this child to god , 1 sam. 1.10 , 11. god calls them his , ezek. 16.20 , 21. and will you dare to withhold from god his own ? how will you answer it at his tribunal another day ? 6. o pray down covenant-mercy on your children as hannah did , and as monica , austin's mother did : o pray hard for your children . 4th . use of consolation ; is there a covenant-grace which comprehends all believers , and all their actions ; o soul ! art thou in this covenant ? then for thy eternal comfort be it spoken , 1. thou shalt never want any temporal good thing , there is food and and raiment , provision and protection in the covenant , heb. 13.5 . be content with such things as you have , for he hath said , i will never leave thee nor forsake thee . 2. thou shalt never finally lose thy grace , or be cast out of covenant , prov. 8.18 . phil. 1.6 . 1 pet. 1.23 . jer. 32.40 . and i will make an everlasting covenant with them , that i will not turn away from them , to do them good , but i will put my fear into their hearts , that they may not depart from me . 3. heaven and eternal glory is thine as sure by this covenant , as if thou wast already in it , 1 john 5.11 , 12. this is the promise he hath promised us , eternal life . the end ▪ the quæries examined, or, fifty anti-queries seriously propounded to the people called presbyterians occasioned by the publication of fifty queries, gathered out of the works of mr. rich. baxter. by j. b. wherein the principal allegations usually brought to support infant-baptism are discovered to be insufficient. by t. g. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. 1676 approx. 92 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 28 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2009-03 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a41786 wing g1543a estc r223637 99833926 99833926 38404 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a41786) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 38404) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1833:1) the quæries examined, or, fifty anti-queries seriously propounded to the people called presbyterians occasioned by the publication of fifty queries, gathered out of the works of mr. rich. baxter. by j. b. wherein the principal allegations usually brought to support infant-baptism are discovered to be insufficient. by t. g. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. [2], 43, [1] p. [s.n.], london : printed in the year of our lord 1676. t. g. = thomas grantham; j. b. = john barret, whose work is being attacked by the author. quire f is a cancel. reproduction of original in the british library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng barret, john, 1631-1713. -fifty queries, seriously propounded to those that question, or deny infants right to baptism -early works to 1800. baxter, richard, 1615-1691 -early works to 1800. infant baptism -controversial literature -early works to 1800. baptists -controversial literature -early works to 1800. salvation theology -early works to 1800. 2007-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-11 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2008-02 robyn anspach sampled and proofread 2008-02 robyn anspach text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-09 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the quaeries examined , or , fifty anti-queries seriously propounded to the people called presbyterians . occasioned by the publication of fifty queries , gathered out of the works of mr. rich. baxter . by j. b. wherein the principal allegations usually brought to support infant-baptism are discovered to be insufficient . by t. g. prov . xix . 21. there be many devices in a mans heart , nevertheless the council of the lord that shall stand . mr. baxter more reas . p. 69. the true method of one that would arrive at certainty , and not deceive himself and others , is to begin at the bottom , and discern things in their nearest and most certain evidences , and afterward to try the by-objections as he is able : and not t● por●first upon the objected difficulties , and judge of all the cause by those . london , printed in the year of our lord 1676. the quaerist examined . or , fifty anti-queries seriously propounded to the people called presbyterians , &c. presbyterian . query 1. whether under the covenant of works , if adam had not sinned , innocents should not have been holy to god , and so members of the innocent church or kingdom of god ? baptist . antiquery 1. whether this be not a groundless and unlearned query ? for seeing the word church , as used in the holy scriptures , signifieth a people called out , namely , from another people , out of what people should they have been called , had the whole world been in the state of innocency ? and seeing no man can tell whether any man should have had authority committed to him in matters of religion , or whether god should immediately have exercised his own government ; neither yet in what capacity children should have come into the world , whether endowed with knowledge or otherwise ; whether therefore it concern or become any man , to let his fancy rove about in such an unknown and unknowable case . and thereupon , 1. suggest how infants should be concern'd or not concern'd in matters of religion ? and how can any thing be concluded from such an imagination , as imitable for us about infant church-membership ? and whether we are not like to have a bad superstructure , when the foundation is a meer fancy ? presbyterian . query 2. whether god was any more obliged to order it so , that the children of righteous parents should have been born with all the perfections of their parents , and enjoyed the same priviledges , than he was obliged in making the covenant of grace , to grant that infants should be of the same society with their parents , and have the immunities of that society . baptist . antiquery 2. more obliged : whether it be not in vain to suppose , that god was obliged at all in either of those cases , seeing he is absolutely free to do whatsoever he pl●aseth with his own ? and what ground have you to believe , that some infants were more concern'd then others in m●tters of religion , by vertue of any covenant made with adam ? and what society was infants capable of with adam , by vertue of any covenant made with him after his fall ? c●rtis the scripture is silent as to these matters , presbyterian . query 3. whether we have any reason , when the design of redemption is the magnifying of love and grace , to think that love and grace are so much less under the gospel to the members of christ , then under the law to the members or seed of adam , as that then all the seed should have partaken of the same blessings with their righteous parents , and now they shall all be turned out of the society , whereof the parents are members ? baptist . antiquery 3. whether you your selves do not lessen the magnifying love of god in mans redemption , whilest in respect of infants you would restrain it to the seed of such parents as are in covenant with god , yea to such infants as partake with them in practicals of religion , which you seem to intend by the blessings you speak of . but who denies any blessing to infants under the gospel , which was their portion under the law made with adam ? and how were infants members of the society of the seed of adam , more then of the society of the baptists ? shew the difference if you can . presbyterian . query 4. whether though our innocency be lost , parents be not parents still , and have not as much interest in children , and whether god have reversed this natural order ? and if god change not his order therein , whether parents be not as capable of consenting to grace for their children , as they were of being innocent for them ? baptist . antiquery 4. whether there be any that question whether parents be parents still , or what need of such enquiries ? or what do you mean by gods natural order ? if you mean natural religion , then shew us what infants are bound ro in matters of religion by natu●e , or what this natural order ties parents to do to their infants , upon the account of practicals in religion , which we omit ? and whether parents could be innocent for their infants , if their infants were not innocent as well as they ? and if not , how should their consenting to grace be the childs consent ? and whether it will not as well hold retro , that the parents consenting to wickedness is the childs consent ? and whether this do not give the parents the power to save or damn their infants ? and can such councils stand with the wisdom , justice , or mercy of god ? presbyterian . query 5. whether infants be not included in the first edition of the covenant of grace made with adam ? ( gen. 3. 15. ) whether unless it can be proved that infants are none of the womans s●ed , we must not take that fundamental promise to extend to infants ? and was she not thereby obliged to l●st her self , and all her infant-progeny in the redeemer's army , against the proclaimed enemy , and to teach her posterity to do the like ; and did they not continue visible members of christs army and kingdom , till such time as they violated that fundamental obligation , and as the seed of the serpent , fought against christ and his kingdom , for satan and his kingdom ? baptist . antiquery 5. whether the baptists do not as clearly assert infants right to the grace of god in the first edition of the covenant , made with adam , as any whatsoever ? and if by the seed of the woman you understand all that are saved , who then questions infants belonging to that seed ? but where is the woman bound to list her infants in the redeemers army , or where shall we finde them visible members of christs army in the first edition of the covenant ? are not these meer words without authority of scripture ? or where did infants ever fight for , or against the serpent ? and if not , why do you make them the seed of the serpent , and fighters against the kingdom of christ ? and if you say , you speak not these things of infants quatalis ; then whether you have not transferr'd the question , and so it is impertinent ? presbyterian . query 6. vvhether in that first proclamation of grace to fallen man , or in the first promise of redemption to sinners , gen. 3. 15. an infant of the vvoman be not promised to be general , and head of the church ? and whether the promise of an infant head , doth not declare gods mind , that he will have infants members , because the head is the principal member , &c. baptist . antiquery 6. whether christ in his infancy was not as truly god as man ? and whether there be any parity between the infants you speak of and christ , seeing he was able even then to vanqu●sh the greatest adversary ? and if by the redeemed church , you mean the whole number of the saved , who doubted but infants were of the redeemed church ? but how doth it follow , that all that are to be saved , ought to be mitted to practical ordinances in the visible church ? seeing then all infants ( for ought you know ) have the same right , which yet you d●ny ; but why so ? are you sure they are not within the verge of christs redemption ? and though christ was once an infant , yet where do you finde tha● he was then a member of the gospel church ? was he not born under the l●w ? gal. 4 4. and born king of the jews , mat. 2 2. and according to the state of the jew●sh church , an infant migh be both a member and a prince ; and was not the ki●gly office in israel a type of christ ? but what is this to he order and state of the church under the gospel ? and fur●her , tho●gh christ an infant was bo●n head of the church as aforesaid , yet in 〈◊〉 infant st●te , he did not intermeddle with the exercise of the least par● of h●s authority . and then whether it be not more r●tional to say , that seeing christ the head of the church did not act●ally poss●ss , or at least not use any part of that power , as an infant , or while he was an infant ? it s therefore unreasonable , th●t infants ( supposn ●h●y were as truly bo●n memb●rs of his church , as he wa● born king of the jews ) should be concern'd in the actual possession of ordi●ances in infancy ? and what if we grant that infants may be disciples by designation , a christ was king , priest and prophet by designation , ( ●ho●gh the cases not al●ke easie to prove ) yet seeing christ was not a prophet ( as you confess ) in actu exercito , how came you to be so bold to bring infants to the ex●rcise of baptism ? and why can you not rather content your selves with the designation or ded●ca●ion of your infan●s to god by prayer , and make them disciples in actu exercito , when they are able ? and whether you may not as well repute th●m thus among disciples , and as safely conclude them to be in the covenant of grace , and of the redeemed church without baptism , as without the lords supper ? sith it s said , except ye eat of the flesh of the son of god , and drink his blood , ye have no life in you ; as well as it is said , except a man be born again of water , &c. he cannot enter in●o the kingdom of god. and whether dr. taylor , a learned pedobaptist do not ingeniously confess , that the wit of man is not able to shew a difference in these cases ? presbyterian . query 7. why are those two titles put on those two distinct generations . ( sc●l . the posterity of cain , and the p●st●rity of seth ) calling one the sons of god , ●nd the others the daughters of men , gen. 6. 2. but that the one was a generation s●parated from the church from their birth , ( their progenitors being cast out before them ) when the other was the seea of saines not cast out , &c. baptist . antiqu. 7. whether this text gen. 6. 2. be not ambiguous , insomuch that your own doctors are not agreed about the exposition thereof ? but supposing it to respect the posterities of cain and se●h , yet whether it can be meant of infants , seeing they committed none of these si●s , in taking wives , &c. and whether your exposition do not damn all infants proceeding from cain●s posterity , and consequently all the infants of all nations which profess not the true religion ? and supposing that the infants of godly parents are in some sense more immediately related to the church , then the infants of pagans by reason of the prayers and designation of their parents , and the opportunities of education ? yet what makes this for any actual participation of ordinances in the church , and what one ordinance did the infants of these sons of god partake of ? and sith the scripture is wholly silent of any such thing , whether this do not more strongly conclude against infant-baptism then for it ? and whether it be needful to say any thing to the latter part of this query , seeing we grant all , and somthing more then this text will prove , though we deny them actual right to ordinances ? and whether the common or equal overthrow of these generations , in respect of the infants of both , do not evidently shew , that as to the business of their salvation , they were in the same condition ? and then whether it be safe for us to conclude , that the wickedness of any progenitors have any further effect upon the infant-ch●ldren then to expose them to external calamities , seeing christ died to redeem them from the condemnation brought upon them by adam ? rom. 5. 18. presbyterian . query 8. whether it was not the same church be●or● , and after abrahams time ; that was called the tents of sem ? gen. 19. 27. was not the jewish church denominated the tents of sem ? a●d does it not hence appear , that the church-priviledges of that people did not begin with or from abraham , but that they were b●for● ? and how was it the same church that was of s●m , and of abraham , if it had not the same sort of members or materials ? &c. baptist . antiqu. 8. though it be true , that the church is the same in some sence , from the beginn●ng of the world to the end ; yet whether it may not truly be said also , not to be the same in divers respects ? and whether the cov●nant as made with no●h , gen. 9. do not differ from the cov●nant as ma●e w●th adam , though both was made with all mank●nd , and is affirmed to be the c●venant of grace by mr. baxter . and whether there was not yet a further difference b●tween these and the covenant as made with abraham ? gen. 17. the former being made with all manking , and never yet abrogated , ( as saith mr. baxter ) . the other was made with abraham and his seed , distinct from the rest of mankind , but as they should be profelited thereto ? and though the church may be denominated the tents of shem , b●th before and after abraham , yet whether this conclude there was to be no alteration of the state of the church under these times respectively ? and whether in any of the tents of shem , before abrahams time , so much as any one infant can be found admitted to the practical part of any ordinance in the church , which was peculiar to her as such ( for as touching prayer , it is a moral duty , and to be made for all men . ) and whether thus boldly to suppose a thing without the least shew of proof , be not a plain begging the main thing in question ? and though it be never so true , that the universal redeemed church consist of the same materials in all ages , yet whether it be not evident that that god made a difference , as to the time of dispensing ordinances to them ? as first no practical ord●nance or 〈◊〉 dispensed to any infant that we read of till abrahams time ; and though then circumcision was ordained for males , yet not for all the male children , for all under eight days of age were prohibited , and yet you grant th●y were in that covena●t , nor any rite at all for the females , who yet were of the same church ? and whether under moses they were not admitted to other rites also , as the pass●over , sacrifices and other holy feast , of the jews ? we therefore ask you why the infants of converted gentiles are not in as good a condition , without any rite or ceremony , as the infants of all the faithful from adam to abraham ? and whether those infants before abraham were not a happy as the infants of abraham ? and then doth it not follow , that the infants of faithful gentiles , are as happy without circumcision , or any other rite or ●eremony whatsoever , as abrahants was under a ceremony , seeing god hath not ohliged them to any in the days of the gospel , o● since the ab●ogation of the law and circumcision ? presbyterian . query 9. whether if we could shew no written law or promise at first constituting the duty , or granting the priviledge of church-member ship , it were the least disparagement to our cause , as long as we can shew those following , laws which presuppose this ? if moses at the end of that 2000 years the church of god had bin without any written law , found all the infants of church-members in possession of this b●n●fit 〈◊〉 what n●ed was there of a new law about it ? or why should god promise it as a new thing ? baptist . antiqu. 9. whether if there be any such law , you would not have she wed us where it is , longere this day ? and whethen you do not now grant in effect there is no such written law ? and what n●ed you thus to query , seeing we deny no lawful thing to infants , to be done for them by their godly parents , but only oppose your doing that for which you have no law ? presbyterian . query 10. whether there being certain proof in scripture of infants church-membership , but none except that before , alledged from gen. 3. that makes any mention of the beginning of it , but all speaking of it as no new thing ; we have not great reason to assign its beginning , which from gen. 3. is before spoken of ? baptist . antiqu. 10. why do you say that gen. 3. 15. makes mention of infants church-membership , ( otherwise then what we allow ) is here the least hint of your mode of making infants church-members , that is , doth this place bid you admit them to any ordinance ? as for the gracious covenant here made with adam . do we not grant that it extends to infants , yea , we say with mr. baxter , it was never abrogated ? presbyterian . query 11. is it not unquestionable , that the covenant of grace made to abraham the father of the faithful , comprehended infants for church-members ? and was 〈◊〉 not the same with that gen. 3. 1. 5. but in some things clearlier opened ? were not both these the covenant of grace and free justification by faith in the redeemer ? and did not the covenant made to abraham and his seed , comprehend infants ? and should not the same promise , expressed more concisely be expounded by the same expressed more sully ? baptist . an. 11. though it be unque stionable that the covenant of grace did extend to infants , gen. 3. 15. as well as in abrahams time , yet there was a vast difference in respect of ceremonies . and whether the difference between the baptists and p●dobaptists be not chi●fly ( if not only ) about imposing ceremonies upon infants ? and whether it be not evident that what ceremonies the word of god did even assign to infants , we allow them , respecting the time of their duration , and only oppose your imposing ceremonies upon infants , for which you can assign no authority in the holy scriptures , as is confessed by many pedobaptists . see mr. baxters cure p. 7. presbyterian . query 12. whether ( though the hebrews had their peculiarities ) it be at all credible , that the infants of that one small countrey only should be so differently de●lt with by god , from all the world else , even enoch's , noah'● , sem's , and all from adam to the end of the world , that these infants only should be church-members , and n● others . baptist . antiqu. 12. whether this query ( as indeed almost all the rest ) do not mis the true state of the case , seeing the baptists may and do in a good sence acknowledge infants to be related to the churc● . viz. by redemption , pious dedication to god. &c. and seeing you grant the hebrew , had their peculiarities , in what thing could it be but in external rites and ceremonies , especially concerning infants ; and shew us , if you can , any one nation under heaven , from the beginning of the world to this day , to whom god gave any law to bring their infants to any rites either legal or evangelical . and sith circumcision was forcibly put upon infants , we ask whether you be able to prove , that any person whatsoever are to be forced to baptism , which augustine tells us . infants do strive against with great crying , from whence he infers they have no faith. lib. de pe●cat . mer. & remis . chap. 28. presbyterian . query 13. what can be more absurd , then to maintain a transient fact ( as mr. t. hath done ) making infants church-members , without any law , promise , ●r covenant-gra●t of god giving them r●ght ? whether a gift that was never given be not a contradiction ? ( v. p. 32 , 35 ▪ 39 44 , 45 , 151. ) and if there was any such promise , or covenant-grant of infant 's church-membership , when , or where was it revoked ? baptist . antiqu. 13. whether these things be surely suggested against mr. t , and whether you ought not to have set down his opinion in his own words ? and whether he doth not mainly oppose himself against mr. baxter's pretended law for infant church-membership and baptism , whiles yet he denies not infants a saving promise , or the promise of saving prepriety in god. antipedobapt . 3. part. p. 33. and whether that book was ever answered by mr. baxter , or ever will by any other ? presbyterian . query 14. was it only the infants of the hebrews , or of those that were at their absolute dispose , that were church-members ? vvere not the infants of free proselites church-members too ? baptist . antiqu. 14 , what need of this query ? who doubts but that as many others as became jews by being proselited to the law , were circumcised according to the law ? but where do yo● find , that any , either jews or gentiles , when they were baptized , had any , obligation to baptize their children and servants also ? presbyterian . query 15. vvas it not then the duty of all the nations round about , that could have informati●n of the jewish religion , to engage themselves , and their children to god by circumcision ? and did not many of the people in hester's time become jews , hest . 8. 17. who yet were not under their government ? and is it not well known , that this was to be circumcised , they and their little ones , ( as the proselites were ) and so to keep the law of moses ? and whether the circumcised servants of israel , sold away to another nation , and so separated from the civil state of israel , did eo nomine cease to be church-members , though they for sook not god ? and ●o of the infants , if they were sold in infancy ? and so whether infants might not be church-members , that were not of the jews common-wealth ? baptist . antiqu. 15. although other nations had the liberty to become jewes , yet whether they were under such an obligation , as that they must become jewes , or else not be saved , is worthy consideration ; and whether the contrary will not be found true , when the case of cornelius , act. 10. and of the gentiles , rom. 2. are duely considered , whereas the one is accepted as fearing god and working righteousness , as much as the jew upon the account of his jewish worship ? and the other gentiles generally , who did by nature the things contained in the law , were counted the circumcision , so as to judge the jew , who only had the circumcision in the flesh ? and not only so , but so as to be accepted of god , as far ( at least ) as the righteousness of the law would avail the jew ? and whether the infants of these devout gentiles was not free from any obligation to circumcision , or any other external ceremony ? and whether there be not an evident difference between the law and the gospel in this , the one being fitted to the jewish nation only , so as to be capable of an orderly observation there only ? and the gospel fitted sor the observation of all nations equally , and consequently all nations equally obliged to the full and orderly profession thereof ? presbyterian . query 16. vvere not the israelites children members of the universal visible church , as well as of the congregation of israel ? as he that is a member of the city is a member of the kingdom and a part of a part , is a part of the whole ; so was not ever member of the jews church also a member of gods universal church ? baptist . ant. 16. whether it be well said to call the universal church visible , and whether the universal church did not contain many thousands such , as job , cornelius , &c , who were neither jews by nature nor religion ? and whether no infants might be said to be members of the universal church , who were not members of the jewish church ? and if not , how shall they be saved , seeing christ is only the saviour of his body finally ? presbyterian . query 17. was there ever any true church , or ecclesiastical worshipping society appointed by god in all the world since the fall , but the church of christ ? were not infants therefore either members of christs church , or of no church of gods institution ? was not moses christs vsher , and moses church and christ's church one according to god's institution ? baptist . antiqu. 17. whether this query be not either captious , or else impertin●nt ? for though it should be granted , that the church of christ was the same in some sence from the beginning , yet who knows not that the time and way for admission of the members thereof to external ceremonies , was not always the same ? and who doubts but the church was always of gods institution ? but doth it therefore follow , that the ordinances instituted therein , belongs to infants ? might they not have the passeover , as well as circumcision , in the mosaical church , and yet have neither the lords supper nor baptism in the christian church ? you deny them the one , why may not we as well deny the other ? baptist . query 18. whether was abraham made a member of the church by circumcision , or circumcised because a member of the church ? the like of infants born in his house ? and how can the ceasing of circumcision prove infants church-membership ceased , any more then it can prove their church-membership began with circumcision ; or that women were not church-members , because not circumcised ; or that all israel was unchurched in the vvilderness , when they were uncircumcised for fourty years ? baptist . antiqu. 18. although abraham was in the church of god essentially by faith , yet whether formally in that church-st●te , vvhich god was then about to settle , till circumcised , vvill not , i suppose , be hastily affirmed ? and how can infants be said to be in the church , as abraham then was , seeing they have no faith as he had ? and whether the jewish church-state did not cease de jure , when circumcision so ceased ? and then whether that state of infant church-membership did not also cease ? and like as the ceasing of the passeover de jure , was the ceasing of infants right to any such ordinance , even so we ask why the ceasing of circumcision de jure , is not as truly the ceasation of infants right to any such ordinance ? certainly , if gods word assign any ordinances in lieu of the former , the place where 't is written would have b●en known to this day ? presbyterian . query 19. vvhether the blessing of abraham consists not chiefly in this , that god promised to be a god in covenant with him , and his seed ? and how are the believing gentiles blessed with faithful abraham , and heirs of the same promise , if their infants are not also comprehended in the same covenant ? baptist . antiqu. 19. whether the blessing of abraham , ( if you understand it of eternal life ) were not the blessing of the fathers that were before him ? and whether that blessing did not belong to their infants ? and whether their infants were partakers with them in any rites or ceremonies of instituted worship ? and if not , then , why may not the infants of the gentiles partake of the blessing of abraham , though not concern'd in rites or ceremonies ? or whether you think the blessing of abraham is confined to ceremonies in respect of infants , if so , shew us what ceremonies these are ? presbyterian . query 20. whether in that great promise , gen. 12. 3 tribes , kindreds , families , do not most certainly comprehend infants ? as it was to such families that the promise was made before christ , as to the jewish church ? vvhat warrant have we to understand families or tribes otherwise , when the same promise is made to the gentiles ? baptist . antiq. 20. whether you ought not to distinguish in this great promise , the things which are eternal from the things that were but for a time ? and then whether you can ima●in● , that all the temporal blessings , rites and ceremonies , ●oncern●d any nation , as it concerned the seed of abraham after the flesh ? but if by this promise you understand it as the apostle paul doth , gal. 3. 16. th●n we doubt not but all the kindreds of the earth are con●●●n'd in it ; and then whether we do not sufficiently comprize the ●●ntiles therein ? but how can abrahams rites and c●remonie● be part of this blessing to the gentiles , which are abrogated long ago ? presbyterian . query 21 , whether the second commandment , exod. 20 , 5 , 6. doth not contain a standing promise , and discove●y of gods resolution , concerning the children of all that love him , whether jews or gentiles , to whom this commandment belongs ? whether god meaneth not that his retribution to parents that love or hate him , shall extend to their children as such ; unless they interrupt it at age by their own acts ; and if to their children qua tales , then whether not to infants ? baptist . ant. 21. whoever doubted but that infants are advantaged many ways , in the blessings which god bestows on them that fear him ? and accordingly greatly disadvantaged by the wickednefs of their pa●●nts , even so as to bear their fathers iniquities many times , as is evident in the overthrow of the old world , the cities of sodom and samorrah , &c. yet whether the blessing or mercy of eternal life to ●nfants , depend upon the parents love to god ? and whether the ●amnation of infants depend on the wickedness of their parents ? ●nd whether the bless●ngs of the second commandment belong 〈◊〉 to the church as such , or whether all men that follow the ●ules of morality , are not within the reach of these blessings also ? ●nd then how should infant church membership and baptifm be 〈◊〉 blessings of the second commandment seeing this law concerns 〈◊〉 men as m●n being part of the moral law , and is not proper to ●he church only ? presbyterian . query 22. vvhether any without the church are secured of gods mercy by p●omise ? and whether mercy be not promised to the children of the f●ithsul as such ? ( see p●al . 102. 28. and 103. 17. prov. 20. 7. isa . 61. 8 , 9 and 65 23 &c ) ? baptist . antiqu. 22. whether god hath not said that his ways are all equal ? and whether this do not secure infants of gods mercy , though not baptized ? ( for otherwise we say infants are of the redeemed church ? when god saith , that the son shall not bear the iniquity of the father , and every one shall bear his own iniquity , whether this be not a promiss of mercy to infant children , and that in respect of etern●l life ? and whether the query be not near a kin to that position of the papists when they say , out of the church there is no salva●ion , restraining that word church to visible or actual professors only ? and why must these five quotations be applied to infants only , sith the things spoken of these children , seed , or off-spring , are mostly such as are exclusive of infants ? presbyterian . query 23. whether these promises in the making of them were limited to a certain time when they were to cease ? or whether they have been since revoked ? baptist . suppose these promises yet remain , as we doubt not but they do , sith they are not entail'd upon the jewish nation , ( at least the three first quotations , ) how will this avail to the point in hand ? are all the blessings of god to the infant off-spring of those that fear him , &c. bound up in your supposed church-membership and baptism ? presbyterian . query 24. if it was on the jews rejection of christ , that they were broken off from being gods people , were those thousands of jews that believed in christ so broken off ? if not , then whether were not the children of all believing jews church-members in infancy ? or otherwise , was it not somewhat else then vnbelief that brake them off ? baptist . antiqu. 24. whether was those that cried , his blood be upon us and our children , thereby rejecting the great mess●nger of the covenant , ●ustly broken off ? and whether the renting of the vail of the temple , did not shew the abrogation of the covenant and the legal ministry ? whether was saul broken off when he persecuted the church causing many to blaspheme ? and how could the jews lawfully be married to christ , if moses was not now removed , without being called an adulteress ? and then whether those thousands of jews which believed were not first broken off , so as to plead no longer upon this issue , we are abrahams children , we are free-born , &c. and to look upon circumcision and whatsoever was gain to them on a legal acco●nt , to be loss for christ ? or is there any other way to be graffed in to the church of christ , but by faith ? nowtherefore seeing the jews were in no better case then th● gentiles , circumcision being now nothing , even as uncircumcision was nothing , b●ta new creature ? then whether all the infants of the jews now ceas●● to be m●mbers of any visible church , seeing ●heir parents had de jure lost their memb●rship ? presbyterian . query 25. were not the infants of the christian jews the day before their conversion members of the jewish church , and of gods universal church , ( of which the jews were but a part ? and doth it not sound strengely , that such infants as were the day before members of the jewish church , and of gods universal church , should be put out of the jewish and the whole visible church , by the faith of their parents , or without unbelief ? either it was a mercy to be a member , of the church , or not : if it was no mercy , then will it not follow , that the unbelieving jews lost nothing by being broken off ? if it was a mercy , how did the christians children forfeit it ? baptist . antiqu. 25. whether we have not sufficiently shewed , that the infants of the jews were now no members of the jewish church , that being now abrogated , and the gospel church state confirmed by the death of christ , and the pouring out of the holy ghost ; neither could two distinct church states stand together de jure . and then whether it be not a great mistake for the q●aerist to suppose the jews were a part of gods universal church , when in truth they were no church at all ? and therefore whether the wonder which he makes about the jews infants which believed , be not groundless ? and yet whether the infants of the believing jews were not in a far better estate , then when their parents were unbelievers , sith the curse they then had imprecated , was now removed ? also whether it was not a mercy , that both parents and infants were set free from circumcision , which whatever it was before , now ceased to be a mercy to any man , because it was an obligation to the yoke of bondage , and rendred christ unprofitable to such as should now receive it ; and consequently a release from that church-membership according to the law , was a great mercy to infants , who still retain membership in the invisible church , as they did before circumcision was in being ? presbyterian . query 26. whether it be credible , that he who came not to cast out jews , but to bring in gentiles , breaking down the partition-wall , and making of two one church , would have a chureh of so different form and constitution , that the church at jerusalem should have infant-members , and the church at rome should have none ? that the jews infants should be members , and not gentiles ? if the jews were broken off by unbelief , should they not be graffed in again upon their repentance of faith ? and so should not every repenting believing jews infants be church-members ? or otherwise how would their graffing in answer to their breaking off , should they be but in part graffed in ? baptist . antiqu. 26. whether it be not a great mistake to say , that christ came to make the jew and gentile one church , otherwise then by taking away the jewish church , and making all things new , 2 cor. 5. 17. &c. and whether this might not be done without setling any of the practical ordinances upon infants as under the law ? if otherwise , why have you not shewed us where christ hath required parent● to get their infants baptized ? and where he forbade them to be brought to imposition of hands , the table of the lord , &c. if the denial of the first make our infants no members of the church , doth not your denial of the other two , which do as generally pertain to members of the church , make yours none also ? and if the church at jerusalem , rome , &c. had any infant-members therein , in the sence wherein you would have them members , why do you not name some one infant so made a member , sith you know it would suffice , wherher if the jews grafting in , must in all points answer to their breaking off , their infants must not come to other ordinances as well as baptism ? or will you say infants cannot partake with their parents of salvation without baptism ? or whether was the infants of the jews exposed to damnation by their parents unbelief ? and if so , what is become of all their infants ever since ? presbyterian . query 27. was not christ church spiritual before his incarnation ( when it took in infants ) and gathered in a spiritual way ? was not ●he visible frame of the jewish church set up and erected by the father of spirits , and were not spiritual duties commanded then ▪ upon promises of spiritual blessings , even lise eternal ? how will any prove that it was a blemish to the old frame , that infants were members ? what was the church the worse for infants rights ? if it be no blemish , why must it be done away ? baptist . antiqu. 27. though it be true , that christs church was always spiritual in some measure , and his services such also ; yet whether it be not also true , that the church under the law of moses was carnal , in respect of the spirituality of the church under the gospel ? does not the apostle say , 2 cor. 3. these two ministrations differ as much as letter and spirit differeth ; and that the glory of the one had no glory in respect of the glory which excelleth ? and is it not then rational , that the churches concern'd under these ministrations respectively should differ aecordingly ? and though it was no blemish to the jewish church , to have infants partakers of their ordinances , which are called carnal , yet whether it be not a more perfect state , when the church do al● know god , from the least to the greatest of them ? and whether this be not the state of the church under the gospel , according to gods appointment ? heb. 8. 10 , 11 , 12 , 13. and whether that which is less perfect ought not to vanish away when that which is more perfect is come . in that he saith a new covenant , he hath made the first old , now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away , heb. 8. 13. presbyterian . query 28. in what regard were the new frame better , supposing the casting out of infants , which were in the old ? how doth infants relation detract from its spirituality ? do not the adult come in by ●he same kind of consent for themselves , as they make for their infants ? and do not the adult blemish the church with more carnal sins then infants do ? would any kingdom be more excell●nt , if all infants were disfranchised ? does not nature teach all kingdoms on earth , to take them f●r members , though but infant-members ? baptist . antiqu. 28. whether it be necessary to say infants are cast out of that whereof they were never possessed , to wit , the use of ordinances in the new frame of the church ? or how can infants be said to be a spiritual seed ? how are they living stones , built up a spiritual house ; to offer spiritual sacrifices in a gospel sense ? or how are your infants a more spiritual seed then our infants ? and whether any other are by christs order to partake in gospel-ordinances , then such as therein worship god spiritually ? and whether hence it be not clear , that the way of making infants church-members do not detract from the spirituality of the new frame of the church ? also where hath god required the adult to consent for their insant church m●mbership in this new frame ? and whether the comparison between an earthly kingdom and the ghurch of christ be any way fitting , seeing infants have as much need of the priviledge of humane laws , for the preservation of their lives and rights as grown persons ? but how stand they in need of the laws of the church , ( and particularly baptism ) for the preservation of their souls . and whether this similitude may not be emproved against you , seeing infants , though members of kingdomes , yet are excused from all duties personal wbatsoever , and then why may they not be reputed of the kingdom of god , and yet exempt from the duties of his kingdom ? or how come they to be concern'd so much in that one duty of baptism , and no other whatsoever ? presbyterian . query 29. whether any jew at age was a member of the old church without professing faith , ( in the articles then necessary to salvation ) repentance and obedience ? and wherein the supposed new call and frame doth in this differ from the old , save only that a more full and express revelation of christ requireth a more full express faith ? is it not evident , that they were to profess consent to gods covenant , which who so denied asa would put to death ? and was not circumcision a covenanting act ? and did they not thereby prosess to take god for their god ? or would god else have taken them for his people ? and would not renouncing god have cut them off ? baptist . antiqu. 29. what is become now of your infant church-membership ; if when grown up they cease to be members upon that account ? were the jews infants twice made members of their church ? or is every renewing the covenant , ( as in the case of asa , ) making men members of the church ? but where did the church ever admit one member to her communion by baptism without profession ? or where did she ever decree , that those who would not submit to her new frame should be put to death ? and whether in this the new frame of the church do not greatly differ from the old ? presbyterian . query 30. whether gods law obligeth not persons to devote themselves , and their infants to god , by consenting to gods covenant for themselves and them ? whether it was not the duty of the israelites to engage and devote their children to god in covenant ? whether this be not evident from the penalty ( even to be cut off from his people ) annexed for the non-performance ? ( and whether this be not as much our duty still ? ) does not the law of nature bind us to give to every one his own due ? and are not infants god's own due ? does not the law of nature bind parents to give them up to god by acknowledging his right , with a free resignation and dedication of the inf●n● to god as his own ? baptist . antiq. 30. where are christian parents required to devote their children by consenting to any covenant for them ( or in their stead , as the jews were in matters of religion : and what penalty hath god imposed on them that devote not their insants by sprinkling them as you do ? and whether we do omit the duty of devoting our children to god in any thing wherein the law of god or nature obligeth us , ( abating us all what must be abated ) ? and who denies infants to be capable of infant-relation , obligation or right , or who opposes their being devoted to god in their capacity ? and whether this be not a meer noise of words , as if all that do not as you do , do lay a side their care and duties towards infants ? and where is the institution of your publick way ? have we not a more certain instituted way to devote them to god by prayer , and to educate them in his fear , as they are capable , then you have to cross or sprinkle them ? presbyterian . query 31. whether anabaptists themselves , all of them that are truly pious , do not vertually ( though not actually ) devote their children to god , and consent to their covenant-relation , while they vehe●ently plead against it ? baptist . antiqu. 31. whether you do not greatly wrong your self , and those you call anabaptists , in saying , they vehemently plead against devoting their children to god ; yea sure , they do it actually as far as gods word requires ? and can you believe , that there is no way to devote children to god but in your way ? how then did adam , enoch , scth , noah , &c. devote their children to god ? and it would do well also if you could shew us how they consented to any covenant for their infants , more then we do ? or prove if you can , that you your selves do consent to the covenant of grace for your infants , more then we whom you call anabaptists ? does not eusebius pamphilius count christianity as old as adam ? l. 1. c. 1. and doth not tertullian say , enoch justissimum non circumcisum nec sibbatizantem , &c. enochan upright man was translated by god , though he were not circumcised , neither yet did observe the sabba●h . -- vt aeternitas candidatis , &c. to the end , that he who did aspire to eternity might shew us , that we might please god without the burthen of moses law. and what law ( save the la● of circumcision ) did ever require infants to be brought to practical ordinances in the church of god ? presbyterian . query 32. is it not a desperate undertaking , and dare any adventure on it , to justifie all the world before christs incarnation , except the jews , from the guilt of not dedicating their children to god ? and do not they that say there is no law in this case , say there is no transgression ? a●d dare any in like manner undertake to justifie at the bar of god all the vvorld since christs incarnation from the guilt of sin , in not dedicating their children'to christ , and entring them into his covenant as members of his church ? dare any maintain that all the world is sinless in this respect ? baptist . antiq. 32. whether this be not a very unwise query ? as if none of the fathers did dedicate their infants to god , unless they brought them to some practical ordinance in the church , which is the only thing you do so complain of ? and how , i pray you , did abraham , isaac and jacob dedicate their female infants to god , sith we finde no practical ordinance for them in infancy ? or who goes about to justifie the world , if they do not as the law of god and nature wills them to do for their infants ? and may we not well justifie all men , for not doing that which the law of god never required ? presbyterian . query 33. is it not a great benefit and priviledge to be a visible church-member of christ as head of the church , and of his church as visible ? is it not abenefit in it self ( besides the consequents ) to be visibly united and related to christ and his body ? is not such a relation to god the father , son and holy ghost , and to the church , an honor ? and how great is the misery of a contrary state ? and if infant church-membership were no benefit , then how were they that had it , ( when they came to age , or their parents in the mean time ) obliged to any thankfulness for it ? will any say , that neither they nor their parents were obliged to thankfulness upon this account ? baptist . antiqu. 33. what benefit is it to bring infants to that which god requires not of them ? or whether it be any loss to them till god requires it ? and seeing you make your pedo-rantism this all in all , shew us what benefit or priviledge you had when sprinkled , more then the infants of a pious baptist ? and what is that benefit that all who are sprinkled by the papists ▪ do receive , which you ratifie for good baptism ? or how are their infants church-members more then ours ? and whether our children when grown up , have not a fairer way to the purity of christianity , in that they are not entangled with such traditions ? presbyterian . query 34. is it not certain that infants are capable of this benefit , if god deny it not , but will give it them as well as the aged ? and is it not certain , that they are actually members of all the commonwealths in the world ? ( perfecte , sed imperfecte membra ) and does not nature seem actually to have taught most people on earth , to repute their infants in the same religiou● society with themselves , as well as in the same civil society ? baptist . antiqu. 34. that infants are capable of what god will give them is very true ; and we therefore ask , whether infants be not as capable of the lords supper as baptism , if the lord will give it them ? and as far as gods will is , that infants should be related to his church , we doubt not of their capacity for it . and why is the order of commonwealths so much insisted on in this case ? are we to fetch our rules for dispensing ordinances in the church , from the civil policie of nations ? we desire you still to show us what the law of nature obligeth us to do for our infants , which we do not ? is both the law of god and nature broken by all that bring not their infants to be crossed or sprinkled as you do ? sure you can never make this good . baptist . query 35. whether according to the tenour of the covenant of grace , god will not vouchsafe to be their god , and take them for his people , ( that are in a natural , or law-sense ) willing to be his people , and take him for their god ? and whether the infants of believing parents are not thus willing ? when infants cannot be actually willing themselves in a natural sense , must not the reason and will of another be theirs in law-sense , that is , of the parents , have the full dispose of them , and are warranted by the law of nature to choose for them ( for their good ) till they come to the use of reason themselves . whether in gods acceptance the child doth not thus truly consent by the believing parents , and doth not covenant with god , as a child covenanteth and consenteth reputatively among men , who by his parents is made a party in contract , as in a lease for his life , or the like ? and so granting the relation of church-membership , to be founded in a mutual contract , covenant or consent betwixt god and us , yet must not this consent on our part differ according to the different age and capacity of infants , and the adult ? were not the israelites infants church-members , who consented not actually in their own persons , but virtually , and reputatively ? baptist . antiqu. 35. we still require you to shew where this law is , that obligeth christians to will the baptizing of their infants , and that will warrant the baptizing of one person by vertue of anothers will ? and why may not a reputative baptism serve as well as a reputative covenant , sith the covenant is greater then baptism ? and whether this be an advised speech , that the parent hath the whole disposal of his child in matters of religion ? and who must judge what is good for his infant in religious matters ? must not gods word do this ? and shew us what command we have omitted , in not bringing our infants to the font as you do ? or do you think that your instance of a lease , is sufficient to rectifie mens consciences in matters of this nature ? and what if some of the jews had failed to consent for their children , were they therefore not in covenant ? sure it was the law , not the parents consent , that regulated these matters . neither do we finde , that the israelites were bound to repent and believe in the person of the child , and accordingly to make profession in his name , when circumcised , as you do at the font when you pretend to baptize your infants , when yet you baptize them not , seeing sprinkling cannot be truly called baptism ? presbyterian . query 26. whether it be not the duty of parents by the law of nature , to accept of any allowed or offered benefit for their children ? the infant being not sui juris , but at his parents dispose in all things that are for his good , have not the parents power to oblige their children to any future duty or suffering , that is certainly for their own good ? and so may they not enter them into covenants accordingly ? and is it not unnaturally sinful for a parent to refuse to do such a thing , when it is to the great benefit of his own child ? and doth it not deserve to be called the unthankful error , that opposeth childrens rights , and blessings ? baptist . antiqu. 36. whether this query be not the same in effect , which we have had again and again ? and we would know what offered benefits the infant of the pedobaptists meet with , among the papists , or your selves either , which we received not , meerly for this cause of not doing to our infants , as they and you are pleased to do ? and whether it were not as reasonable for parents to be baptized in the childs stead , as to profess faith and repentance for him ? and whether it be reasonable for a parent to oblige his infant to be of his opinion and practice , and to suffer for the same ? and what law of god requires this , and whether this may not be called the unreasonable errour ? presbyterian . query 37. vvhether it may be thought , or any dare maintain , that the covenant of grace giveth no conditional right to any infant in the world ? are they all excluded ? and why ? are they worse then their parents ? if it give any right to infants conditionally , as it doth t● parents , must it not be on a condition to be performed by the parents , or such as are so far entrusted ? or can this be called a covenant , for god only to say [ i will save all such infants as i elect ] and yet offer salvation to none of them in the world on any condition , nor give a title to any person that can be known by themselves or others ? would it not be to confound the decree of god with his covenant ? and what right or hope doth this give to christians for their children more then to pagans ? baptist . antiqu. 37. whether it may be thought that god should require the conditions of the covenant of grace on them , which he knows can observe none at all ; or whether it be his will , that the grace of that covenant should depend upon others observation of the conditions for them ? and whether this be not to put the salvation of infants out of his own hand , and into the hand of such as commonly neglect their own ? and is not this to expo●e poor infants to ruine , whose parents generally are so far from keeping , that they are strangers to the conditions of this covenant ? and where are we taught to doubt the salvation of the infants of pagans ? or to conclude ours only are in the state of salvation ? and is it not much more secure to hope the salvation of infants on the ground of christs dying for them , and rising again for their justification ▪ then upon any practical in religion ? and where did god ever since the beginning of the world , give any ordinance to be necessary to the salvation of any infant in the world ? can you believe that the cutting off of the uncircumcised man-child , was a cutting off from salvation ? how then were all the infants saved which were born to the israelites for fourty years together , such of them , i mean , as died during that time ? and why may not infants as well be made righteous without any thing done on their part , as they were made sinners without any thing done on their part ? will not the second adams obedience salve the first adams disobedience ? and may not poor infants better plead in the day of judgement what christ did for them , then what your godfathers or proparents did for them ? presbyterian . query 38. though all that are saved , are saved by the meritorious righteousness of christ , by way of free gift ; yet whether the condition be not a suteable acceptance ? and why may not a parent accept a donation for his child , who hath no will to accept it for himself ? shall he be certainly shut out unto damnation ? or shall he have that gift absolutely which is conditional to all others ? or is he not concerned in the donation at all ? and have not infants guilt and misery from their parents ? and though life and pardon be by christ only , yet is it not congruous , that the meer condition of acceptance may b● performed by the parents , ( while they cannot accept for themselves ? ) baptist . antiq. 38. whether the meritoriousness of christ is not as available to save infants without any mans acceptance thereof for them ▪ or whether hath god ty'd the salvation of any person to the acceptance of another ? and whether these be not unreasonable and unscriptural conceits ? and whether it be not for want of better grounds for infant-baptism , that you thus continually tautologize , varying little from that which you have said once and again ? presbyterian . query 39. ( whether it be no advantage for children to be under an early engagement to god , and jesus christ ? ) whether to dedicate them betimes to god , doth not tend to secure god's right and childrens good , and to prevent their sin and misery ; they being thus under a double obligation , which they may be minded of betimes , and which may hold them more strongly to their duty , and disadvantage the tempter that would draw them off from god , &c ▪ baptist . antiqu. 39. who is against as early an engagement of children to god as can lawfully be made ▪ and do not the baptists engage their children to god as soon as they can , by prayer and supplication whiles infants ; and then by the best education they are able when docible ? but whether any thing be done to purpose in your judgement ( when yet all is done that can be done ) unless it be rantized in your way ? and whether it be not b●tter to leave the event of their accepting baptism to the wise dispose of god , then to do it per force in infancy , without precept from god ? also whether the infant-baptism be such a means to propagate religion as you suppose , may be seen , when you consider how in the darkness of popery , pedobaptism was more common then now , but christianity much less ? and name one if you can , that was bettered in christian vertue by pedobaptism ? we think we can name one , and that your self , which is worse for it , for had you not that to rest on , you would probably desire to put on christ in baptism ? whether it be not the fittest time to be buried with christ in baptism , when we are dead with him from the rudiments of the world , or whether it be reasonable to bury sinners therein till they be dead to sin ? and whether it can profit any person to be baptized , unless he have the answer of a good conscience , by the resurrection of christ from the dead , 1 pet. 3. therein ? presbyterian . query . 40. whether it can be proved , that ever there was one age or church ( particular ) on earth since adam , till about 200 years ago , that the anabaptists rose , wherein infants de facto were not members of the church ? baptist . antiqu. 40. whether in your sense of making infants members of the church de facto , it can be proved there was any one so made a member from the beginning of the world till abrahams time ? and whether john baptist , christ , or any by his order , did receive infants into the church de facto . and whether the baptist do not better prove the antiquity of their faith and practice in baptism then any aedo baptist in the world ? and doth not your conscience tell you , that the baptism of men and women , upon profession of faith and repentance , is beyond the reach of contradiction ? whilest m. baxter himself confesses infant-baptism to be so difficult , that many of its assertors , both protestants and papists , are forced to confess it cannot be proved by the scriptures ? see his cure p. 7. and seeing you and we are generally agreed , that our way both for subject and manner is out of dispute , clear in the scriptures ; and you confess by the pen of mr. baxter , that yours is very difficult , is it not reason the difficult way should give place to the clear and evident way ? presbyterian . query 41. vvhether it can be proved , that ever there was any one i●fant of true church-members , that was not rightfully a church-member himself from the creation till christ's days ? or from the creation till this day ; except the anabaptists , who reject the benefit , whose case we will not presume to determine ? baptist . antiqu. 41. whether this query be not the same we had before ? and whether what is said to it , may not also suffiee to this ? presbyterian . query 42. seeing that infants have been de facto church-members from the creation to this day ( as far as any records can lead us ) is it likely , that the lord , and head , and all-sufficient governour of his church , would have permitted his church till now , to be actually made up of such subjects , as in regard of age be disallowed , and suffered his church to be wrong framed till now ? or is it a reasonable , modest and lawful undertaking , to go about now in the end of the world to make god a new framed church . as to the age of the subjects ? and is it not more modest and safe , to live quietly in a church of that frame , as all the saints of heaven lived in , till the other day , as a few anabaptists did attempt an alteration ? baptist . antiqu. 42. whether it be not utterly untrue , that infants were members of the church de facto , i.e. to be brought to partake of ordinances practical in the church , save only from abraham to the end of the law ? and whether all the pedobaptists in the world have not hitherto been unable to shew any one instance before abraham , or since the law was abrogated , so much as one infant admitted to any such ordinance in the church of ●od , according to what the scriptures afford in thi● 〈◊〉 ? and ●●●her it be not as modest in us to labour to restore ●●ptism to its pure use in the church , both in respect of the subject and manner of administration thereof , as it was for the protestants to do the like in respect of the lords supper ? also whether your pretending the authority of the universal church , be not the same figment , with which the papists deceived themselves and others ? and how can you pretend the universal church , when the primitive church is on our side ? presbyterian . query 43. whether considering christs own infant-mem●●rship , and his kind reception of infants , and his chiding those that would have kept them off , and his offers of taking in all the jewish nation , ( matth. 23. 37. ) and that they were broken off by unbelief , and consequently the seed of believers broken off from the church vniversal , and that whole housholds are oft said to be baptized , and that paul pronounceth believers children holy , and that christ ( mat. 28. ) commanded his ministers , as much as in them lieth , to disciple all nations baptizing them , & c ? baptist . antiqu. 43. whether christs infants church-membership did not pertain to the jewish church only , gal. 4. 4. born under the law only , &c. and whether he was not about 30 years when he entred in our profession , heb. 3. 3. the apostle and high priest of our profession christ jesus . see luke 3. and then whether his example be not flat against you ? also whether christs only praying for infants , and not baptizing them though brought to him , neither ordering any other to do it that we reade of , do not shew us that infants may be under the blessings of christ without baptism ? and whether you may not tremble to presume to do more then he did , or appointed to be done ? are you wiser then he ? also whether it lies within the power of any minister to disciple an infant ; or shew us one infant with you , or any pedo-baptist ever made a disciple ? or be pleased to come and make my infants disciples if you can , and i promise you i will assist you what i can in the baptizing them ? and not only so , but do my best to employ you elsewhere , i speak it seriously . and whether this would not do more to decide the controversie , then all the books that are written by any of you ? and if you cannot do this , how will matth. 28. 19. warrant you to baptize infants , sith its plain that discipling goes before baptizing ? and how disciples are to be made we think it best to learn of jesus , john 4. 3. how think you ? do you indeed believe , that any person being of the nation , entitles them to● b●ptism ? why then who is not a fit subject , seeing all infants ●nd men too are of one nation or another ? and if there be other qualifications necessary , whether to be taught be not one of the chief of them ? and why do you say we take infants away from christs church , because we baptize them not ; are they in it before baptized ? if so , how do we take them away ? presbyterian . query 44. in summ , whether 1. god would not have parents devote their children to him , and enter them according to their capacity in his covenant ? 2. whether also he doth not accept into his covenant all that are faithfully thus devoted to him , and be not peculiarly their god , that such children are holy ? 3. whether they are not as certainly members , according to an infant-capacity , of the visible church , as they are of all kingdoms under heaven ? 4. whether there be not far more hope of their salvation , then of those without ? 5. whether the covenant doth not make their salvation certain , if they so die ? 6. whether the invest●ure and solemnization of their covenant with christ should not be made in infancy , & c ? baptist . antiqu. 44. in summ , 1. whether we do not as much to our infants ( in our capacity ) as christ did to the infants which were brought to him ? and will not that sati●fie , unless we go from him to follow you ? and as to the business of the covenant , let us hear what mr. baxter saith , more r●●s . p. 86. all mankind is brought by christ under a covenant of grace , which is not vain or repealed by god , but as their abuse of the grace of the covenant may cast them out ; for as a covenant of entire nature was made with all mankind in innocent adam ; so a covenant of grace was made with all mankind in lapsed adam , gen. 3. 15. in the promised seed ; and renewed again with all ma●kind in noah , &c. and now we ask whether our infants according to this account of the covenant of grace be not in it without bapti●m , fith they have not abused the grace of the covenant ? and whether baptism be not far more proper , when after they have corrupted themselves by sin , they come to humiliation , and so to enter into this covenant upon the termes of the gospel ? whether your exposition of the universal church , upon mat. 28. 19. do take in the practice of the apostles in pursuance of that commission to the acts of the apostles , and the exposition of the baptists ? and if not , then you either deny us to be of the universal church , or else you have not the exposition of the church universal ? presbyterian . query 45. how inconsiderable a part of the universal church do the anabaptists hold communion with ? and do they not unchurch almost all the churches on earth ? ( may we not think , that they rob christ of more them nine parts of ten of his kingdom , or church universal ? v. p. 305. ) baptist . antiqu. 45. whether upon luthers revolt from the pope , you were not upbraided with holding communion with an inconsiderable part of the universal church ? why do you take up the papists weapons ? did not that pious man that succoured athanasius in the time of the arrian persecution answer the objection well , when he said , the cause of truth is not therefore empaired , because i am alone ; -- glory not therefore in multitudes , for it is not the multitude but the cause that justifieth or condemneth ? also whether we may not also conclude , that many are of the universal church , which do not communicate with us or your selves ? and yet whether the separation from many pedobaptists will not justifie our separation from you more clearly ? presbyterian . query 46. whether they can possibly hop● , that ever the church on earth will unite upon their terms , of rejecting all their infants from the visible church , and renouncing all our infant-rights and benefits conferred by the baptismal covenant of grace ? baptist . antiqu. 46. whether this be in effect to say , what will these feeble jews do ? and why may we not hope that this great mistake of yours may vanish , as well as that great mistake of austin , and the generality of men prosessing christianity , who brought infants also to the lords table , and that for many hundreds of years together , and defended it by as plaufible reasons as any you have for baptizing them ? could god reform so great and general an errour , forced on by learning and authority of eminent men ; and shall we think this thing only too hard for god ▪ our small number shall not make us doubt , for we know god doth great things by small means . and what baptismal grace do we desire you to renounce , when we only defire you to mend an errour ; did the twelve disciples , acts 19. renounce any baptismal grace , when ( according to the interpretation of the ancients ) they were baptized again ? surely reformation is no errour . presbyterian . query 47. and whether if they continue to the worlds end to separate from almost all the churches and unchurch them , their employment will not be still to serve the great enemy of love and concord , against the lord of love and peace , and against the profperity of faith and godliness , and against the welfare of the church and souls , and to the scandal and hardning of the ungodly ? baptist . antiqu. 47. whether the separation is not justly chargeable upon those which cause divisions and offences , by asserting and maintaining such errours , as being admitted , the way of god must be corrupted , or laid aside ? and whether these are not the men , that ( at least unawares ) serve the design of the great enemy , and whether you are not guilty of the fault wherewith you would charge us ? p●esbyterian . 48. whether too many well-meaning , but weak christians , are not disaffected to lawful and warrantable things in the worship of god , meerly because they see such as are ungodly use and own them ? and whether if god should but let us have a king and other rulers , that were against infant-baptism , and singing of psalmes , &c. and would make laws for their own way , and impose it on others , so that the ungodly multitude should fall in with them , it would not presently cure many that are now for such opinions ? baptist . antiqu. 48. whether many , but weak christians , would hold to the errou● of infant-sprinkling , but meerly because j. b. and mr. baxter , &c. do so . and whether this be not as much weakness of the one hand , as the case put by you on the other ? and whether both ought not to be amend●d ? and whether the latter part of this query do not shew , that to follow the greatest number is not always the best way ? and why then would you discourage us by our paucity ? and whether such confiderations might not have discouraged the apostles , seeing they were to alter the state of religion in the jewish church , yea , throughout the whole world ? presbyterian . query 49. whether mr. baxter in the second and third part of that his second defence of our infants rights , have not sufficiently detected the great and notorious untruths in fact and history , wherewith mr. h. d. treatise of baptism , and reply to mr. willes is fully stuffed . baptist . antiqu , 49. whether mr. d. and mr. tombes have not sufficiently detected mr. baxters mistakes in many of his works 〈◊〉 infant-baptism . and particularly in mr. tombes his felo de se . also whether mr. wills exceptions against mr. d. are not well foiled by mr. d. in his twofold defence of his treatise of baptism ; and whether mr. baxter did ever yet , or ever will accept of mr. tombes his serious challenge lately made in these words . i challenge him to set down distinctly his theses , concerning the grace he meanes , the covenant of grace , what and whose it is , how it is bap , iswal , what are the rights and benefits conferred to infants by it , using words in their proper sence and genuine notions , and then without questions , exclamations , flirts , suppositions improved , set down his scriptures , and form his arguments substantially -- and then i doubt not but learned and accurate disputants will see his folly , &c. postscript to mr. d. second reply p. 267. presbyterian . query 50. whether the anabaptists schism , or separation from communion with our churches be not worse yet then their simple opinion ? and whether it be not desirable , and possible , that some may be found out , and terms laid down , in which good and sober men on both sides would agree and hold communion ? baptist. antiqu. 50. whether the papists may not on fairer grounds query thus with the protestantt , then you can do with us , especially when the cause you manage against us is so doubtful in the judgement of its best friends ▪ as we shewed in our preface ; and here we shall further add what mr. y. notes in his first reply , p. 126. mr. chillingworth ( saith he ) in his answer to knot 's charity maintain'd , part . 1. c. 3. § . 44. p. 152. saith , the doctrine of infant-baptism is of that sort , of which the scripture is silent . and the oxford-divines , in their reasons os the present judgement of the university , &c. june 1. 1674. do. sect . 4. p. 9. say , that without the consent , judgment and practice of the universal church , ( which they distinguish from the scriptures ) they should be at a loss when they are called upon for proof of the baptizing infants . now this considered with what dr. taylor saith , dissuasive from popery , p. 118. that it is certain , there is no universal or prime tradition for baptizing infants , then whether you may not more securely forbear baptizing your infants , till endowed with knowledge and faith , then to do it without . and in the mean time retain your opinion about their being in the covenant of grace , and let christs ministers or your selves pray for them after the example of christ . and whether this might not be a more likely way for a lasting peace between the baptists and the pedobaptists , and more consonant to the scriptures then the way propounded by you ? and seeing it shall come into your hearts to make some overtures for peace , we desire you would prosecute that needful work. and whether it may not better be done by personal conference in a friendly and christian manner , then by writing books one to another . and whether the baptists have not offered this , and bin rejected by you in such their tenders of friendship ? may these queries and antiqueries have an effectual tendency to the increase of love and chirstian friendship , and if not , whether it had not been better they had been unwritten ? finis . the postscript . shewing that infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . receiving lately in writing a proposition from a minister of the church of england , to which i sent him certain arguments , to prove what is denied in the said proposition ; i shall here offer the same to consideration . the proposition is this , prop. infant-baptism is not contrary to the command of christ . contra. infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . arg. 1. if infant-baptism be not contrary to the command of christ , then it is of divine institution , but infant-baptism is not of divine institution , ergo , infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . the major is true , because there is only one baptism instituted by christ . the minor is true , because no man can shew any divine institution of infant-baptism . arg. 2. if infant-baptism be not contrary to the command of christ , then it agrees with christs commission for the perpetuity of baptism , mat. 28. 19. but infant-baptism is not agreeable to the commission from the perpetuity of baptism , mat. 28. 19. ergo , infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . the major is true , because christ commanded nothing contrary to his own commission . the minor is true , sith no man can shew any agreement between the commission and infant-baptism . arg. 3. if infant baptism be not contrary to the command of christ , then it is agreeable to the practice of the apostolical churches , but infant-baptism is not agreeable to the practice of the apostolical churches . ergo , infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . the major i● true , because the apostolical church did observe all that christ commanded in the case of baptism . the minor is true , because no man can shew , the apostolical churches did baptize so much as one infant . arg. 4. if infant-baptism be not contrary to the command of christ , then it is the baptism of repentance for remission of sin . but infant-baptism is not the baptism of repentance for remission of sins ; ergo , infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . the major is true , because christ commanded no baptism , but the baptism of repentance for remission of sins , acts 2. 38. and eph. 4. 5. the minor is true , because infants have all the remission needful in infancy , without repentance , else they can have no remission . arg. 5. that which hath in a great measure , and naturally tends wholly to make void the baptism commanded by christ , is contrary to the command of christ . but infant-baptism hath in a great measure , and naturally tends wholly to make void the baptism commanded by christ . ergo , infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . the major is true , because christ commands nothing to make void his own command . the minor is true , for where infant-baptism is generally rcceived , there believers baptism ceaseth . arg. 6. if infant-baptism be as unreasonable , as to baptise persons when they are asleep or dead , then it is contrary to the command of christ . but infant-baptism is as unreasonable as to baptize persons when they are asleep or dead . ergo , infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . the major is true , because christ commanded nothing that is unreasonable , i mean , that which is really so according to truth , and not in mans judgement only . the minor is true , first becaufe those who baptize infant● do usually do it when they are a●leep ; secondly , because the grounds usually insisted on for infantbaptism , will as well justifie the baptizing persons asleep or dead ; ● mean , such only as have known and believed in the lord jesus ; yea , the scripture may seem ( according to interpreters , to hint some such thing to have been done in the christian church , and he not approve it ) but no such intimation touching any infant . arg. 7. that practice which renders the practice of christ and his true followers , ( who were baptized in rivers , or much water ) superfluous or ridiculous , and which agreeth not with the word baptize , when used in the new testament to express the act done in that ordinance , is contrary to the command of christ . but the sprinkling of infants now used by the presbyterians , renders the practice of christ and his true followers , ( who were baptized in rivers or much water ) supersluous or ridiculous , and agreeth not with the signification of the word baptize , when used to express ( according to the new testament ) the act done in that ordinance . ergi , infant-baptism is contrary to the command of christ . t●e major is evident , because christ would command nothing to reflect dishonour upon his own practice , the minor is true , because if sprinkling a little water on the face only be su●ficient , then immersion or dipping in the river must needs be superfluous , &c. neither can the word baptize and rantize , with any equity of speech or good sence , be used to ezpress the same action . thus , though we justly refuse infant-baptism , because no man can prove it commanded by christ , yet that we may more effectually perswade our countreymen , to admit of the restoration of this ordinance to pristine integrity , we have offered these arguments to shew how contrary to christs command is that darling tradition os pedobaptism . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a41786-e7880 from the institution of baptism . from the institution of bapt●sm from the practice of the first church . from the necessity of repentance , where sin is washed away baptismally . from the ill consequence of infant-baptism . for the unreasonableness therof . from the dishonour i● offereth to christs practice . a contention for truth: in two several publique disputations. before thousands of people, at clement dane church, without temple barre: upon the 19 of nevemb. [sic] last: and upon the 26 of the same moneth. betweene mr gunning of the one part, and mr denne on the other. concerning the baptisme of infants; whether lawful, or unlawful. gunning, peter, 1614-1684. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a85777 of text r202279 in the english short title catalog (thomason e963_1). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 100 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 27 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a85777 wing g2234 thomason e963_1 estc r202279 99862623 99862623 114788 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a85777) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 114788) images scanned from microfilm: (thomason tracts ; 143:e963[1]) a contention for truth: in two several publique disputations. before thousands of people, at clement dane church, without temple barre: upon the 19 of nevemb. [sic] last: and upon the 26 of the same moneth. betweene mr gunning of the one part, and mr denne on the other. concerning the baptisme of infants; whether lawful, or unlawful. gunning, peter, 1614-1684. denne, henry, 1606 or 7-1660? [6], 46 p. printed by j. moxon, for francis smith, and are to be sold at his shop, in flying horse court in fleetstreet, neer chancery lane end. and by john sweeting, at the signe of the angel, in popes head alley, london : 1658. running title reads: whether infant baptisme be lawfull, or unlawfull. annotation on thomason copy: "decemb: 18th"; "xber 18". reproduction of the original in the british library. eng infant baptism -early works to 1800. a85777 r202279 (thomason e963_1). civilwar no a contention for truth:: in two several publique disputations. before thousands of people, at clement dane church, without temple barre: up gunning, peter 1658 17778 19 160 0 0 0 0 101 f the rate of 101 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the f category of texts with 100 or more defects per 10,000 words. 2007-04 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-04 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2007-06 robyn anspach sampled and proofread 2007-06 robyn anspach text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a contention for truth : in two several publique disputations . before thousands of people , at clement dane church , without temple barre : upon the 19 of nevemb . last : and upon the 26 of the same moneth . betweene mr gunning of the one part , and mr denne on the other . concerning the baptisme of infants ; whether lawfvl , or vnlawfvl . the inspiration of the almighty , giveth vnderstanding . great men are not alwayes wise ; neither do the aged understand judgement . job . 32. 8 , 9. london . printed by j. moxon , for francis smith , and are to be sold at his shop , in flying horse court in fleet-street , neer chancery lane end . and by john sweeting , at the signe of the angel . in popes head alley . 1658. to the reader . is there no end of writing books ? have not our ears been filled , and our eyes wearied with hearing and reading , touching this subject , both pro and contra ? are not the later writers in behalfe of infants baptisme , very many , viz. cardinal bellarmine , and a great number of the sons of the church of rome : who have in this point , dealt as ingeniously , as pithily , as ever any that took up the defence of it could do ? have we not often heard of it from the pens of the reformers ; in the infancy of their reformation ? viz. luther , melancthon , calvin : with a great number of late doctors and masters : viz. featly , marshall , goodwin , fuller , baxter , audley , with others ? have we not had also many who have laboured not a little on the opposite party ? and both by their pens and suffrings testified against the baptisme of infants : as morton , with some others contemporary ; the ministers of transylvania : and since of later years , blackwell , tombes , cornwall , fisher , lamb senior , lamb , junior , writer , haggar , with many others , who will not be offended because they are not named ? have the protestants of late said any thing more then the papists before them ? or will this book tell us one thing more then either protestant or papist , hath not formerly declared ? on the other hand , what can be said more effectually to prove the baptisme of infants to bear an humane stamp , and superscription , and not divine , then hath been said over , and again ? what need then of this book ? patience good reader , and know it is neither any conceit of the impotency of those that have written before , or of the excellency of any thing herein contained , above what hath been before written ; that hath occasioned me to shew this to the world : but that the importunity of friends might be satisfied , and the mouths of lying adversaries might be stopped , that they may be shamed out of those slanderous reports , whereof they have been coyners . thou hast here the relation of the discourses that passed between mr. gunning , and my self . i cannot warrant it in every tittle perfect , but as fully , impartially , as i am able to give thee : this i will affirm , that willingly i have omitted nothing , that might conduce to the making his arguments , or answers seem valid . indeed i did wish , i could have shewed thee this discourse in a more perfect form then it is ; and i did wish it heartily : and for the same purpose i did write unto mr. gunning , declaring mine intentions to send my papers to the press ; and intreating his favour to come to my house ( in regard i was not able to stir abroad ) and to put to his file : if any thing were omitted , it should be inserted : if any thing were inserted , that was not spoken , it should be expunged : declaring also that i would wait for him four or five daies . i did wait twelve daies ; and at last i received from him ( not by writing , but by word ) that he could not come ; if i pleased , i might proceed : and if i did any injury to him , hee would let the world know of it . thus when i could not do as i would , i was forced to do what i was able to do . i have here propounded to thy consideration , the matter as well as i can . read , and in the presence of the lord , ( setting prejudice aside ) consider what mr. gunning hath produced that is of greater weight then those arguments men have formerly written : i leave thee to the perusall of the book ; at the latter end whereof , thou hast an account of some arguments that i had intended for to have urged at that time . consider them also with the rest , and let the readers ( that can ) pray unto the god of peace , that hee would cause the sun of righteousness to arise ; that divisions may cease : and all that fear the lord may be of one lipp , and of one heart serving the lord in godly simplicity , and sincerity . amen . a conference between a and b : wherein is contained an impartiall relation of a disputation holden at clement danes , two several dayes . viz. on the 19th day of november , and on the 26th day of the same moneth : between mr. gunning , and mr. denne . concerning the lawfulness or unlawfulness of children baptisme . a my dear friend , i rejoyce very heartily to see you in health , and to enjoy your society this day : and so much the more , because i have heard that you were present at a dispute , two several dayes at clement danes , concerning the baptisme of infants ; whether it be to be accounted lawful , or unlawful . concerning which dispute i have heard reports so different , that i find it a matter of difficulty to find a ground for credence ; i desire your gentleness not to deny my request , but to grant me so much favour as to make me partakers of your apprehensions of the whole matter . that by your impartiall relation of the transactions of both dayes , i may find some good assurance of confidence . b it is no wonder that you should hear various and uncertain reports , both of this , or other disputes of like sort : seeing that unto such like meetings as these are , the greatest part come with prejudice upon their spirits , judging before they have heard , and determining the whole matter before it begin . some bringing with them hearts fraught with envy , anger , and malice : insomuch that if they could , they would not , and if they would they could not , sincerely discern the truth of matters propounded . if it may prove a thing acceptable in your eys ; i will not refuse to relate unto you the sum of the matter : so far as my memory can comprehend : i shall not willingly omit any thing material . as for words which might well have been spared on both sides , i shall take no notice of them at all . a i pray begin , and i shall lend an attentive ear . b i will first declare unto you the occasion of this dispute , which was this : a gentlewoman , who had ( through mercy ) set her heart seriously to seek the lord and his face , with resolution to walk in his wayes , was not a little troubled in spirit about the many differences in and about worship , amongst those that profess the name of the lord : shee looked upon her former wayes as evill , and to be forsaken ; but what to embrace shee knows not ; forasmuch as so soon as shee had passed through the doctrine of repentance from dead works , and faith towards god ( in which the present differences of the men of these times have created no smal difficulties ) shee meets with a great controversie about the doctrine of baptisme , which drives her into a strait ; and shee remains divided in her thoughts ; not being able to resolve her self , whether her infant baptisme were of god , or whether it were contrary to truth , being none other but tradition of men , a will worship , and by consequence vain and unprofitable . while thus shee remains uncertain , not knowing to which part to adhere whether to those who professing the faith of the lord jesus do maintain and uphold the baptisme of infants , or whether it were not her duty to repair to a baptised congregation , to require baptisme at their hands . if shee make her addresses to counsellours , one sayeth thus : fear not your baptisme is good and valid . another tels her that her infant , baptisme is not of god : both these use arguments , and demonstrations and reasons , which captivate her understanding , that shee discerns not in her self , what to imbrace , or what to eschew : and finding at present no way to deliver her self from this condition , is very desirous a conference may be had between parties on both sides , about this matter ; to the end that what shee could not be throughly perswaded of in her mind when shee heard them speaking asunder , might ( through grace ) be happily obtained by hearing them speak friendly together . this was the occasion of the meeting : and mr. gunning ( whether solicited by intreaty of others , or moved voluntarily , i know not certainly ) was pleased to take the business upon himself , on the one part , to defend the lawfullness of infants baptisme ; and mr. denne on the other part , yeelded himself to oppugn the baptisme of infants . two dayes were appoynted for this conference : the first day was on the 19th of november last , when they met at the place before appoynted : and mr. denne whose part it was that day to be the respondent , stood up in the pulpit , and intreating the multitude to be silent , and to behave themselves civilly , and orderly , and craving attention he spake . res . one there is who desireth to be informed whether the baptisme of infants be lawfull , or unlawfull : i declare that the baptisme of infants is vnlawfull . b after him stood up mr. gunning , in an opposite gallery , and spake . oppo . i will prove the baptisme of infants to be lawfull ; thus , that which the supream lawgiver of the church hath given in command to his immediate officers in the church , by a perpetual sanction , and unalterable decree , to be by them practised , is lawfull : but the baptisme of infantsis by the supream lawgiver of the church given in command to his immediate officers , by a perpetual sanction , and unalterable decree , to be by them and their successors practised : therefore the baptisme of infants is lawfull . a this is a very long syllogisme : i wonder a learned man should use so many words , which must needs procure more disadvantage then advantage ; for most times in multitude of words there is error . b indeed many of his syllogismes were long , and shard to be repeated : therefore i cannot promise to rehearse them verbatim , only i will not willingly leave out any word which is materiall , or may be for the opponents advantage . a i think the sum of this may be gathered into fewer words , thus : that which christ hath commanded to be practised is lawfull : but christ hath commanded baptisme of infants to be practised , therefore baptisme of infants is lawfull : but let me hear the answer . res . i deny the minor , and do say , christ never commanded baptisme of infants to be practised , either by his immediate officers , or any other of their successors . opp. i will prove that it is the will and command of the supream lawgiver that infants should be baptised . if the supream lawgiver would have infants to be saved , and they cannot be saved without baptisme ( or desire of baptisme in parents or friends , ) then is it his will and command that they should be baptised : but the supream lawgiver would have infants to be saved , and they cannot be saved without baptisme . therefore it is his will that they should be baptised : for he that willeth the end , willeth also the means conducing to that end . res . the minor i answer in the first place , freely granting that it is the will of jesus christ that infants should be saved : but saying that infants may be saved without baptisme , or without desire of baptisme in their parents , or any other for them . a doe you think that the opponent speaketh his own thoughts ? or doth he speak it for disputation sake , when he sayth children cannot be saved without batisme ? b questionless he speaketh his own thoughts , even as he is perswaded in heart , that no infant can be saved without baptisme , or desire ( at least ) of the parents or friends to have the child baptised . but hear his proof whereby he proves infants cannot be saved without baptisme , or desire of baptisme . oppo . john . 3. 5th . verily , verily i say unto thee , except any one be born again of water and of the spirit ▪ he cannot enter into the kingdome of god . these are christ words to nicodemus a ruler of the jews , who came to christ to enquire of the way of god : and they are confirmed with an oath doubled , except any one : that is man woman or child , none are excepted , be born again of water , that is baptisme : and of the spirit , not water alone without the spirit , or spirit alone without water , but of water and of the spirit : the spirit working by water , he cannot enter into the kingdome of god ; that is he cannot be saved . none can possibly be saved except they be baptised . res . the place of scripture you have brought is allegorical , and therefore not so proper to be a ground for faith : not having one word in it to the matter in hand to be proved : which is that infants canot be saved without baptisme : now here is in this text , neither the word infant , nor baptisme , nor saved : ( if your gloss be layd aside : ) but i have three things in answer to this text , and your gloss or exposition : the first is a general rule , which will serve to answer not only this , but other arguments , that peradventure may be brought . that scriptures must be considered to whom , and of whom they speak ; and not to be applyed to any other , concerning whom it doth not speak . so you find in the quoted place , that nicodemus a ruler of the jews , comes to christ to learn the way of god , that so he might work the workes of god : to this man , christ makes answer , except a man be born again , &c. speaking neither of children , nor to children : the second answer is this : that by being born again of water , is not meant baptisme , but a mistical not a litteral water : as in many other places of scripture spoken of . thirdly , if it were granted that the text , did include children , and that by water were meant baptisme ; yet will it not follow that children can not be saved without baptisme , because here is only mention made of entering into the kingdome of god : you know that the kingdome of god hath manyfold exceptions in the scripture : sometimes it is taken for gospel preaching , sometimes for a visible church state ; mat. 13. sometimes for that happiness which men and women ( and not infants ) do enjoy through beleeving rom. 14. 17. the kingdom of god is not meat or drink ; but righteousness , and peace , and joy in the holy ghost . this kingdom infants do not enter into , although they should be baptised ; neither can they enter so long as they continue infants . now if water here do mean baptisme , it will infer no more but this ; that except any one be baptised he cannot enter into a church state , or he cannot enjoy righteousness and peace , and joy , in the holy ghost . these are three answers i have for this text . oppo . i will prove your first answer to be insufficient . res . take notice that if you can prove two of them insufficient , yet if the third stand good , it sufficiently answers your argument . oppo . i will prove in the first place , that children are here meant and included . the text sayth {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} except any one ; it comprehends all : none exempted . res . we find many propositions in scripture , spoken as generally as this , where the scripture speakes only to men : and you your self will confess that children are not included : as mat. 16. 24. if any one will come after me , let him take up his cross : &c. mark 8. 34. and mat. 10. 38. he that taketh not up his cross , and followeth me ; is not worthy of me . these and many more places you will confess are not spoken of children : john 3 , 36. he that beleeveth on the son , hath everlasting life : and he that beleeveth not the son , shall not see life . oppo . have you a greek testament ? i pray look the place : as i remember the word in that place is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , he that rejecteth or rebelleth against the gospell of jesus christ , which children do not . res . i do confess the word is so indeed , and i do acknowledge a difference between {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} a child cannot be called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} but a child may be sayd to be {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} not a beleever : therefore i refer you to the 18 vers . of that chap. he that beleeveth not , is condemned already ; and unto 1. john 5. 10. he that beleeveth not , hath made him a lyar : in both which places children are not included . opp. it is true that children are not included in these texts : but here are many reasons in the context , whereby it may evidently be proved that they are not meant of children , but of men and women of years of discretion : but you are not able to prove by the context in the third of john that children are not included in the word any man . res . it s not my duty to prove any thing at this time ; it is my part to answer , and your part to prove , or disprove : when i am to be the opponent i shall prove that children cannot be here included : for the present it is sufficient for me to deny it . oppo . for your second answer , i will prove that by water ( in this place alledged ) is meant litteral water : it is plain , the scripture cals it water , plain water : besides in the 22th vers . is rehearsed , christ tarrying with his disciples , and baptising ; and in the 23 vers . john also was baptising in enon near to salim ; because there was much water there : here by water is meant literal water , and plain water : and where can you find in the scripture , especially in the new testament , that by water is meant any other thing but literal water , unless the text doe declare it to be allegorical ? as out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water : where presently the text adds , this spake he of the spirit ? besides , the constant tradition of the church , and the unanimous consent of the fathers , did interpret this place of literal water , and of baptisme : even tertullian himself , who is the man that is principally urged by you , doth interpret this text in the same manner , except any one be baptised with water and the spirit , he cannot be saved . res . i answer first of all , it is no reason that it should be meant literall water here in the first vers because literall water is spoken of in the 22 and 23 verses : for those words are a report of what was done at another time , and in another place : and hath no reference to this matter at all . secondly that the scripture is frequent in using the word water allegorically , is very plain , as esay . 51. 1. come to the waters . john 4. 10. he would have given thee living water . and as i deny not but in the places alledged by you , water is taken literally : so may it be evidenced that it is very frequent in the scriptures to take water mistically , and the sence in this place will be very good , with this interpretation . thirdly , whereas you say that all ancient writers were of this mind , even tertullian himself . i say that cannot be , that tertullian should be of your mind , that infants could not be saved without water baptisme : for he himself ( who was the first that ever mentioned infants baptisme in writing ) doth reprove it . oppo . tertullian was not the first that mentioned infants baptisme , for justin martyr makes mention of it , in his apologie : and you can never find in all tertullian that he sayth infants baptisme is vnlawfull . res . justin martyr never once mentioned infants baptisme : for tertullian , i do not say he sayth in so many words , that infants baptisme is unlawfull : but in a sermon of his , intituled qui sunt baptizandi , who are to be baptised : he indeavours to perswade parents to keep their children from baptisme , untill they were capable of it : you will not sayth he , trust them with earthly treasures , untill they know how to use them ; why then will you trust them with the heavenly ? ( speaking of baptisme : ) and sayth he fiant christiani cum christum nosse potuerint : let them be made christians when they are able to know christ : and one thing more i must tell you , that when i did first read this sermon of tertullian , i met with one passage which i did not understand ; neither could i make any sence of it : wherefore i consulted one that had written notes upon tertullian , and he plainly confesseth that those words were added by him to this end : vt authoris sententiam mitigarem , that might qualifie the opinion of the authour , concerning baptisme : where you see what fair dealing we have had with the writings of the ancients : when an index expurgatorius hath passed upon them , and expunged ( by confession ) many hundred sentences : and who knows how many they have inserted ? oppo . i can make it plain out of tertullian , that he alloweth the baptisme of infants , in case of necessitie , and danger of death : besides it is known tertullian was an heretique and died an heretique . but i shall refer to the auditors what hath been said unto this argument . you have said any one , doth not include all , and that water is not literall water : i will proceed to another argument , to prove the lawfullness of infant baptisme . a there was yet nothing spoken to the third answer of the respondent , which is of as great consequence as any of the other : and if the other were of no force , yet if that stand good , the argument is of no force : it was this , that supposing the text alledged , did speak of baptising ; yet by entring into the kingdome of heaven , is meant no other thing then a state of happiness , which beleevers do attain unto here in this life , through faith in christ jesus , viz. righteousness , and peace , and joy in the holy ghost . b i suppose the opponent had forgotten to refell it : and the answerer , had also forgotten to call for it . let us hear the opponent prosecuting a second argument . oppo . that which is no sin for parents to require , and for ministers to perform being required , is lawfull . but it is no sin for parents to require baptisme for their infants ▪ neither for ministers to perform it being required : therefore the baptisme of infants is lawfull . res . i deny the minor . it is a sin for parents to require , and for ministers to administer baptisme to infants . oppo . that which is confirmed by an everlasting law , and standing commission , not to be altered to the end of the world , is no sin for parents to require , or for ministers to perform . but the baptisme of infants is confirmed by an everlasting law , and standing commission , not to be altered to the end of the world : therefore it cannot be sin in parents to require , or in ministers to performe , being required . res . i deny the minor , and say , there is no commission authorizing parents to require , or ministers to administer baptisme to infants , being required . oppo . the commission is mat. 28. 18 , 19 , 20. all power is given to me in heaven and in earth ▪ go ye therefore , and make disciples of all nations , baptizing them in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost : teaching them to observe all things that i have commanded you : and lo , i am with you always , even unto the end of the world . amen . here the apostles are commanded to make diciples of all nations , baptising them , and then teaching them . here it is plain baptising , after teaching . res . i do not deny that teaching should follow baptisme , but i deny that baptisme should go before all teaching : moreover here is not one word of parents requiring baptisme for infants ; or one word of infants being baptised : and whereas you seem to imply that the apostles should make disciples , by baptising of them . i demand of you before this assembly whether you beleeve that by vertue of this commission , by you alledged , the apostles or their successors either had , or have authority to take all nations and baptise them , whether they will or no ? whether they consent or not ? opp. no , i do not imagin so : but that they were first to make those ( that where of years of discretion ) willing , by preaching ; and then to baptise them : and those that were not of years to make them disciples , by baptising of them . res . now you say something , first make them willing ▪ and then baptise them . but you have not exprest in the commission any thing of children who are not willing : how willing children are , appears by their crying and strugling at the font . oppo . i will prove children are not unwilling , for as ignoti nulla cupido , there can be no desire or will to a thing we do not know , so neither can there be any vnwillingness to that which is unknown : now children knowing nothing of baptisme , it is not possible they should be vnwilling , seeing they know not any thing of the matter . res . you might have spared this labour : for i did not say children were unwilling : but i said they were not willing : your duty had been to prove they were willing : there is a vast difference between unwilling , and not willing : you know how willing constantinus copronymus was to be baptised , when he was an infant ; and how he came to have the name of copronymus : i can tell you the story , but i will not in this auditory . i desire you to frame a silogisme out of the text alledged , concluding that here is a commission ▪ either to baptise infants , or to require their baptisme . oppo . i will , the apostles are here commanded to make disciples of all nations : now infants who are part of the nations , cannot be made disciples any other way then by baptisme : therefore they are here commanded to make disciples by baptisme . res . first i say , you cannot prove that this commission under the title of all nations , extendeth any more to infants then that in mark 16. go preach the gospel to every creature , extendeth to infants : you will confess you have no warrant for to preach to an infant in the cradle , from this place . secondly , i deny that baptisme maketh disciples , it manifesteth one to be a disciple , it doth not make him one ▪ i pray prove if you can , that baptisme maketh any one a disciple : it is written john . 4. 1. jesus made , and baptised more disciples then john . it is one thing to make , another thing to baptise a disciple . oppo . i had thought it had been a matter of conscience , your deniall of the baptisme of infants : but now i perceive you go about to deny all baptisme . i will prove it is no sin for parents to require baptisme for their infants . where there is no law , there is no transgression ; for sin , is the transgression of a law : but there is no law forbidding parents to require baptisme for their infants , or forbidding ministers to administer baptisme to infants : therefore it is no sin either to require , or administer baptisme to infants . res . there is a law forbidding it , and that under a severe punishment . oppo . shew where that law is to be found . res . i will , deut. 18. 20. here moses prophesieth of christ in these words . a prophet shall the lord your god raise up unto you , &c. but the prophet that shall presume to speak a word in my name , which i have not commanded him &c. even that prophet shall die . mark this , one word ▪ and prover . 30. 6. add not thou to his words , lest he reprove thee , and thou be found a liar . so that until you be able to prove a command , there must needs lye a prohibition in the way . oppo . i have proved a command already , and i will further prove it . all church members may lawfully be . baptised : infants are church members , therefore infants may lawfully be baptised . res . i deny the minor . infants are no church members . oppo . the minor is thus proved ; if infants belong to the body of christ , as members of his body , then are they church members . but infants belong to the body of christ , as members of his body , therefore infants are church members . res . i deny the consequence , though they be members of christ body , yet are they not to be accounted church members . opp. if all the body of christ be church members ; then if they be of the body of christ , then are they church members : but all the body of christ are church members : therefore infants are church members . res . i deny the minor , all the body of christ are not church members . oppo . the minor is proved : ephe. 1. 23. and hath given him to be head over all things , to the church , which is his body . the father hath given christ to be head over all things to the church ▪ or in the church , which is his body . res . you do now dishonour me , in seeking to deceive my understanding : the thing you were to prove , was , that all that did belong to the body of christ , are church members : and you bring me a text to prove that all the church is the body of christ . oppo . where lyes the difference , of these two propositions ? res . the difference is very great between these two propositions . all the church is his body , and all his body is the church . as much as if i should say ; all that are in this place are freemen of london ; and all freemen of london are in this place . if you have a text that sayth , all that belong to his body are church members , let us hear that , oppo . i will prove that infants are church members . all that are called , are church members : but infants are called , therefore infants are church members . res . i deny the minor , infants are not called . oppo . all that are predestinated are called , but infants are predestinated ; therefore infants are called . res . i deny the major : all that are predestinated are not called . opp. the major is proved rom. 8. 29 , 30. vvhom he did foreknow , them he did predestinate to be conformed to the image , &c. that he might be the first-born among many brethren . moreover , whom he did predestinate , them also he called : and whom he called , them he also justified : and whom he justified , them he also glorified . out of this text it follows , that if infants be predestinate , then they are called : for whom he did predestinate , them also he called . res . the apostle speaks of such , and to such to whom he wrote this epistle . here cannot be proved that all the predestinate are called : neither do you your self beleeve it . he hath called the predestinate romans , to whom he wrote : but he hath not called all the predestinate . oppo . i will prove that infants are gods servants , and that he owns them for his servants , and calls them his servants ; and therefore they must necessarily be baptised , in regard they can do him no service at all , but by being baptised . the proof of this is levit. 25. 42. they are my servants which i brought forth of the land of egypt . that is the children , as well as men , and women : for here the lord renders a reason of his command , viz. that in the year of jubile the bondman should go free himself , and his wife , and children also . and this reason is rendred , for they are my servants , whom i brought out of the land of egypt . he speaks of reall service , such as bondmen do perform towards their masters : now if it be required in a servant to do his master service , and infants can do no other service ; then it will follow , that infants must and ought to be baptised . res . i pray you produce your syllogisme , concluding what you ought to conclude , and i shall give you answer . oppo . thus i argue , all gods servants may lawfully be baptised : children are gods servants : therefore they may lawfully be baptised . res , i deny the major ; all gods servants may not lawfully be baptised . oppo . if a servant be one who doth service , and they can do him no other service , then either they may be baptised , or else they can do god no service at all : yet god calls them servants . res . i answer in two propositions : first , infants do not perform any service to god , by being baptised . secondly , infants are gods servants , though unbaptised , or before they come to be baptised . oppo . what service do unbaptised infants do to god ? give an instance . res . they are very faithfull servants , performing all things that god requireth of them , to be performed by them . oppo . that is just nothing , they eat and drink and sleep ; this is all they perform , and all the service they can do . res . it is good service for a servant to be quiet and do nothing , when and where nothing is required : it is disservice to be busy and doing when the master requires nothing : whereas you say they eat and drink &c. i say therein they are gods servants , and that is the service god requires of them . oppo . god speaks of real service , such as bondmen require from servants : will any imagin a bondman serves his master , that eats and drinks and doth nothing else ? this is strange service . kes . surely eating and drinking by infants is a reall service ; such as masters do require , and all that they do require of their infant-servants : and this proveth very advantageous for the masters profit . suppose i buy a servant an infant for ten shillings , this infant eats and drinks , and thereby grows in stature , and i sell him for ten pound : was not his eating and drinking reall service ? doth not the ox in the pasture do the master as reall service ( though he do nothing but eat and drink ) as the ox that laboureth dayly at the plough ? there will not be any thing gained by this argument , untill you can make it appear that the eating and drinking which is performed by infants is no service of god . oppo . i will proceed to another argument : 2. cor. 5. 14 , 15. if one dyed for all , then were all dead : and that he dyed for all , that they which live , should not henceforth live unto themselves , but unto him who dyed for them , and rose again . it is plain from hence that all infants were dead , if christ dyed for them : for thus the apostle reasons : if christ dyed for all , then were all dead : but he dyed for all , and therefore for infants , as well as others ; therefore infants were dead as others . res . i confess all were dead : but what this makes to the purpose to grant unto you that infants were dead , i do not perceive as yet . oppo . if infants were dead , and it be the will of christ they should be made alive again , then may they lawfully be baptised : but infants were dead , and it is the will of christ they should be made alive again ; therefore they may lawfully be baptised . res . i deny this consequence : though they were dead , and it be the will of christ they should be made alive again ; yet may they not lawfully be baptised . oppo . he that willeth the end , must needs will the means to accomplish that end . now of christ would have infants to be made alive again , and there be no other means whereby they can be made alive , but by baptisme ; then he willeth their baptisme . but christ would have them live , and there is no other means for them to be made alive but by baptising : therefore christ willeth their baptisme . res . i deny the minor , there is other means for children to be made alive , though not by baptisme . opp. assigne that other means whereby children may be made alive . res . children are made alive without any ministerial applycation at all . being sanctified by the bloud of the covenant , shed once for all . god applying the vertue of the death , and of the resurrection of jesus christ unto them . oppo . then there needeth not any ministeriall applycation , to make children partakers of the bloud of christ , shed for them . you do undervalue baptisme , as if it were of no use at all . res . i do beleeve the baptisme of infants to be of no use at all . i do acknowledge the baptisme of beleevers to be of good use . yet not to make dead men alive : baptisme is for the living , not for the dead . oppo . another argument : that the father hath given infants to christ , cannot be denied . for. all that the father giveth me , commeth unto me , john 6. 37. and if infants be given by the father to christ , then they must needs come to christ : and if they come to christ , it must be either by faith , repentance , or baptisme : for there can be no other way assigned , whereby any should come unto christ . res . do you not remember that i gave you a general rule , in the answer to your first argument , very necessary for the right understanding of scripture ? namely , that we must consider of whom , and to whom , the scripture speaks ? and you will find that in this place alledged , the scripture speaks of those persons to whom ( at that time our saviour speak those words ; and cannot be applyed to any persons at any time . in the 36th vers . jesus said unto them , ye have seen me , and beleeve not : all that the father giveth me , will or shall come unto me . if you think this answer sufficeth not , frame a syllogisme from the place . oppo . if infants come unto christ , then they ought to be baptised : but infants come unto christ : therefore infants are to be baptised . res . i deny the consequence , though infants do come unto christ ( in some sence ) though not in the sence of that place alledged ) yet need they not therefore to be baptised . oppo . if there be no other way for them to come , but by baptisme , then if they come they must needs be baptised . but there is no other way for them to come to christ but by baptisme . therefore if they come they must needs be baptised . res . i deny the minor . there is another way for infants to come to christ , then by baptising . oppo . if there be no other way to come unto christ , but by faith , repentance , or baptisme ; and infants cannot come unto christ by faith , or repentance : therefore they must needs come by baptisme , or not at all . res . i deny the minor ▪ there is some other way to come unto christ , then by faith , repentance , or baptisme . oppo . assigne another way for children to come unto christ . res . christ jesus is the second adam , the heavenly adam : as truly as all infants where dead in the loyns of the first and earthly adam , so truly are all infants spiritually in the loyns of the second and heavenly adam . in the first adam they were by a naturall union : in the second by a spirituall union : by vertue whereof they are sanctified by the bloud of the covenant , and made partakers of grace and favour with god , without any ministeriall application ; and so made alive in the second adam . oppo . you cannot prove what you say to be true . res . it sufficeth me at this time that you cannot prove it false : it is my duty now to answer : when it falls to my lot to prove , i shall prove what is or may be required of me . oppo . i will urge you with what is writen in the 1 corinth . 10. chap. 1 , 2 , 3. vers. all our fathers were under the cloud ; and all passed thorow the sea : and were all baptised unto moses in the cloud , and in the sea : and did all eat the same spirituall meat : and did all drink the same spirituall drink : ( for they drank of that spirituall rock that followed them : and that rock was christ . ) but with many of them god was not well pleased ; for they were overthrown in the wilderness . now these things were our examples , or types or figures , and in the 11. vers. all these things hapned unto them for types . here you see their baptisme was a type of our baptisme . in that baptisme men women and children were baptised unto moses : therefore in our baptisme men women and children ought to be baptised . res . first i say , the text doth not say men women and children , but all our fathers . secondly it may be made plain by the text , that infants were not baptised unto moses in the sea : for it is said , they did all eat and drink the same spiritual meat , &c. you cannot affirm that infants did eat and drink spiritually . the text speaks not of children . thirdly , it is not the apostles intent to declare that their baptisme was a type of ours : but that their punishments were figures and types , and written for our admonition . oppo . he saith in the 6th vers . these things happened unto them for examples , and in the 11. vers. all these things happened unto them for types . res . yea all their punishments , for look in the 6th vers . these things were our examples ( he saith not to the intent that we should baptise infants , as they baptised them ) but to the intent we should not lust . it is no mo●● in effect but this . no priviledges how great soever can exempt men ( that are sinfull , and depart from the lord ) from suffering of punishment : christ hath given you great and many priviledges , as he did to the people of the jews ; yet do not you presume , for as they did not escape when they sinned ; no more shall you . oppo . 2 thess. 2. 15. brethren stand fast , and hold the traditions which yee have been taught ; whether by word , or our epistle . the apostle gives command to the church that they should hold the traditions ; nor that i do approve of vain traditions , which are the commandements of men ; but such traditions as are apostolical ; delivered by the apostles themselves , are to be held by the church : even as those things which were delivered in writing . as apostolical traditions are to be kept and hold ; and so lawfull . but the baptisme of infants is an apostolical tradition . res . i deny the minor , baptisme of infants is no apostolical tradition . oppo . augustin saith that the church always held it from the apostles times : meaning the baptisme of infants : the same is generally acknowledged by the ancients ; whose severall testimonies i can produce here . res . this was austins opinion . and yet notwithstanding erasmus who laboured much in austin : and ludovicus vives , who was very well skilled in his doctrine ; neither of these beleeved the thing to be true ; neither were they convinced by his opinion : but both of them thought the contrary , moreover you know what i have told you before out of tertullian , and gregory nazianzen : i think it needless to repeat the same things again . b after this there followed another argument , which was altogether the same with the first : and therefore i shall not repeat it unto you . thus ended the dispute of the first day of meeting : it was then concluded that they should meet again the next week , upon the same day . b on the second day being the 26th day of november , the disputants met together again : at which time , mr. denne was the opponent , and mr. gunning the respondent : who having taken his place , began to speak . res . one who desires to be informed touching the baptisme of infants , whether it be lawfull or unlawfull : i affirm the baptisme of infants to be lawfull . oppo . i will prove the baptisme of infants to be vnlawfull . if the baptisme of infants be lawfull ; it is either for some reasons delivered by you , or some other : but not for any reason delivered by you , or any other : therefore the baptisme of infants is not lawfull . res . the minor is denied : infants baptisme is lawfull , for reasons by me delivered . oppo . if it be lawfull for reasons by you delivered ; then it is either for the reasons delivered from tradition , or from scripture : but neither for the reasons from tradition , nor from scripture : therefore it is not lawfull for any reasons delivered by you . res . for both , namely , both from tradition , and from scripture . oppo . if one of these reasons overthrow the other , then it cannot be lawfull for both : but one of these reasons overthrow the other : therefore it cannot be lawfull for both . res . i deny the minor , one of them doth not overthrow the other . oppo . if tradition overthrow your scripture reasons , then one overthrows the other : but tradition overthrows your scripture reasons . therefore one overthrows the other . res . tradition doth not overthrow scripture reasons . oppo . it is generally held by the tradition of the ancients that baptisme of infants cannot be proved by scripture : and the most part of those that maintained the baptisme of infants , did acknowledge that it could not be proved by scripture , but tradition . res . i deny it , for tertullian and austin , do both prove it by scripture : for tertullian interpreting these words of st. john , except a man be born again of water , and of the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven : sayth , that to be born again of water and of the spirit , is to be baptised : except a man be baptised , he cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven . and st. austin sayth the same , in divers places . oppo . as for tertullian , he is not to be reckoned among the men that maintained the baptisme of infants ▪ for without doubt he opposed it : and you your self did say when i alledged tertullians words , that he was an heretique : as for austin , it was his authority that i intended to alledge : who hath these words : take away tradition , and the baptisme of infants will fall to the ground . the like may be found in most authors of former ages . you know this to be true . res . they did not hereby deny the validity of the scripture , to prove infants baptisme : but their meaning was , that without tradition the sence and meaning of the scripture could not appear : as , except a man be born again of water and of the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of god : we could not have known , that to be born again of water , had meant to be baptised , unless tradition had given this interpretation of that text . oppo . then you grant that without interpretation beyond the letter , infants baptisme is not to be found in scripture . i will leave this , and come to your scripture reasons . and first for your great piller john 3. i argue thus . if infants cannot be born again of water and of the spirit ( while they remain infants ) then this reason of yours is voyd : but infants , while they remain infants , cannot be born again of water and of the spirit . therefore this reason of yours is voyd . res . infants can be born again of water and of the spirit . opp. if infants be born again of water and of the spirit ; then are they spirit , and born of god : but infants are not spirit , neither born of god : therefore are they not born again of water , and of the spirit . res . i deny the minor : infants are spirit , and born of god . oppo . first , i will prove infants are not spirit . in every one that is spirit or born of the spirit , there is some evident demonstration and alteration whereby they may be known to be born of the spirit : but in infants there is no alteration nor evident demonstration whereby they may be known to be born of the spirit , or to be spirit : therefore they are neither spirit , nor born of the spirit . res . that infants are born of the spirit , is de fide , a matter of faith ; and that is far above all demonstration : it is not necessary that there should be a demonstration , whereby every one that is born of the spirit should be manifested so to be . oppo . then are they not like the wind : which though we know not whence it comes , nor whether it goes ; yet we hear the sound , and feel the effect : and the text saith , so is every one that is born of the spirit . res . we know not whence the wind commeth , nor whether it goeth : so we know not the manner how , but yet we have it de fide faith without ground is but fancy , and no faith : oppo . but i will prove in the next place , that infants are not born of god , though i account them the happiest of living creatures . if infants be born of god , then they overcome the world : but infants do not overcome the world : therefore they are not born of god . res . it sufficeth that infants are not overcome by the world : the world doth not combate with them : name your text . opp. if there be no combate ; there can be no conquest . but the text saith 1. john 5. 4. whatsoever is born of god , overcommeth the world . &c. res . it appeareth by the context , that this is not to be understood of children , but of men and women ; of such as love god and keep his commandements , of such as beleeve in god , and by faith have victory over the world : who is he that overcommeth the world , but he that beleeveth that jesus is the son of god ? oppo . these words are not to the purpose , i do not say they are meant of children . but i say they are meant of every thing that is born of god : every thing that is born of god , overcommeth the world ▪ children do not overcome the world . therefore they are not born of god . res . every thing in the text must be extended no further then to such to whom the apostle wrote . oppo . i say the same thing : this answers not the force of the argument at all . i will prove by another argument that children cannot be born again , &c. if infants be born of water and of the spirit , then are they church members , and sons and daughters of the new covenant : but infants are not church members , nor sons and daughters of the new covenant . therefore they are not born again of water , &c. res . the minor is denyed : infants are church members , and sons of the new covenant . opp. if infants be church members , and sons of the new covenant , then they so know the lord as not to need any teacher : but infants do not so know the lord as not to need a teacher : therefore infants are not church members , nor sons of the new covenant . res . the consequence is denyed . oppo . if all the church members and children of the new covenant do so know the lord , as not to have need to be taught to know the lord : then the consequence is true . but all church members , and the children of the new covenant , do so know the lord , as not to have need to be taught to know the lord : therefore the consequence is true . res . the minor is denyed ; all the church members and children of the new covenant do not so know the lord , as not to need to be taught to know the lord . oppo . the minor is proved , heb. 8 ▪ 8 , 9 ▪ 10 , 11. verses : jer , 31. 33 , 34. verses : this is the covenant that i will make with the house of israel , after those dayes saith the lord . i will put my laws into their mind , and write them in their hearts , and i will be to them a god , and they shall be to me a people : and they shall not teach every man his neighbour , and every man his brother ; saying know the lord : for all shall know me , from the least to the greatest . res . they shall not teach every man his neighbour , and every one his brother ; that is , they shall not be all teachers , james 3. my brethren be not many masters . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , that is teachers : every one should not be a teacher , to run before he be sent , and intrude into the office without a lawfull call : for no man taketh this office upon him , but he that is called of god , again we know that not only children , but beleevers , men , and women need teaching . oppo . i am ashamed of your interpretation of this text , so far from the truth , ( and i am perswaded ) from your own conscience . would you not have christians to teach , and exhort , and edifie one another ? what manner of spirit is this ? you say all need teaching : so say i also : but there are some things that the children of the new covenant need not be taught , ye need not that any man teach you : 1. john 2. 27. and that is to know the lord , which is rendred a reason of the first words ; they shall all know me , from the least to the greatest . res . this word all , doth not include children infants . oppo . i do not say it doth , but it includes all church members , and children of the new covenant , from the least to the greatest : least and greatest and middle ; and all church members . res . you insist much upon the word all , all . when the word all hath his restriction in many places of scripture , 1. cor. 15. 27. it is manifest that he is excepted , which did put all things under him . oppo . i do not marvil that you so much except against me for insisting upon the word all : and whereas you say the word all hath restriction in scripture : i do not deny it : but to prevent a restriction in this place , there is added ; from the least to the greatest . i leave this to consideration and proceed . if children be born of water , and of the spirit , and be made church members ; then are they disciples : but children are not , nor cannot be disciples : therefore they cannot be born again of water , and of the spirit , &c. res . the minor is denyed ▪ infants may be disciples , and are disciples . oppo . if all disciples must hate father and mother , and life , for christ , and take up their cross , and follow christ : then infants who are not able to do these things , cannot be disciples but all disciples must hate father and mother , and life , for christ ; and must take up their cross , and follow christ . therefore infants cannot be disciples . res . the minor is denyed , it is not required in every disciple to hate father and mother , and life ; or to take up his cross and follow christ : but of such disciples as are of years . oppo . the minor is proved in every part of it , by plain text of scripture ; mat. 16. 24. luke 14. 26 , 27. if any man come unto me ( here is your {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} so often alledged ) and hate not his father , and mother , and wife and children , and brethren and sisters ; yea and his own life also , he cannot be my disciple : and whosoever doth not bear his cross , and come after me ; cannot be my disciple , many texts of the like kind there are . res . if any one and whosoever , doth not include children , but the multitudes that went with him , to whom he spake , vers. 25th . and in the 28th . vers. which of you , intending to build a tower , &c. he speaks of all them that are capable to hear him , and to understand him . oppo . take notice that this is a weapon of your own , that i do oppose you with : and consider how strange a thing you presented it to the people , that i should restrain that place of the third of john , except any one be born again . and you your self are forced to restrain this , where the very same word is used . i demand whether the proposition laid down in the text be true . res . you did restrain it , but you gave no reason of your restraining it : but i have good reason in the context why it should be restrained . do you shew as good reason as i have done already . oppo . i have shewed reasons equal with yours . you say christ spake to the multitudes which followed him : i say christ spake to nicodemus , who come to him , to enquire of the wayes of god for himself . besides , be pleased to remember that the restraint of the word was not my sole answer : but i gave you answer taking it in the largest sence : i gave you three answers ; you give only this . another argument . if it be a sin in parents to require baptisme for , or in the behalf of their infants ; then the baptisme of infants is vnlawfull ; but it is a sin in parents to require baptisme in the behalf of their infants . therefore the baptisme of infants is vnlawfull . res . it is not a sin in parents to require baptisme for their infants . but a thing commendable , and good . opp. if parents have no command nor commission from god to require baptisme for infants ; then it is a sin in them to require it for infants : but parents have neither command nor commission from god to require it for their children : therefore it is a sin in parents to require baptisme for their infants . res . parents have a commission from god , to require baptisme for their infants . oppo . shew us a commission . res . mat. 28. 19. make disciples of all nations , baptising them in the name of the father , and of the son and of the holy ghost . teaching them to observe all things that i have commanded you ; and lo i am with you always , even to the end of the world , oppo . here is no commission to parents ; but only to the apostles . res . the apostles are here commanded to teach them to observe all things which christ commanded them ; they are sent into the world to teach those that are of years : and make them willing and then to baptise them : and as for children , to make them disciples by baptising of them , and to teach the parents to require baptisme for their children , that thereby they may be made disciples , though they be not capable of teaching . oppo . you have often urged me with antiquity : and charged me with novelty , i do now justly charge you with a novel interpretation of the scripture : not above twenty years old at the most , viz. that the meaning of the text alledged should be this , make them disciples by baptising them . res . this is ancient and the fathers did understand this text so . but as for your opinion it was not heard of , little above 500 years ago . then there rose up on henricus that denyed the baptisme of infants ; they that followed him were called henricians , and he and his followers were condemned for heretiques , and excommunicated for their heresie . a have patience i pray you , and bear with me a little . i desire to understand the whole matter of these heretiques , and heresies ; and by whom they were comdemned and excommunicated : for this will give me satisfaction in some things . b i will declare the matter from the beginning of it . about the year 1047. there reigned in germany henry , the third king ; who held two grand heresies ( as the pope and his followers were pleased to stile them ) the one was detected , viz. that church lands , and church-men were subject to his jurisdiction . a this was his detected heresie : what was the other suspected ? b de baptismo parvultorum perperam sonsisse creditur . he was suspected to have an evill opinion of the baptisme of infants , from this henry the third , king ; who was afterward emperour the second of that name , began the henrician heresie . after him succeeded ( not in the empire , but ) in opinion : peter de bruis . his opinions laid to his charge , were , 1. that infants could not be saved by baptisme : 2. that the faith of other men could not stand them in stead , that had no faith of their own . 3. that crosses were to be pluck down , and burned . 4. that the body and bloud of christ was not really or corporally present in the sacrament . 5. that the sacrament was not a sacrifice to be offered to god . 6. that prayers and alms made , and given by the living , did not profit the dead . 7. that christians had no need of consecrated places to worship god in , neither need they to build any . 8. vpon the lords day before easter , he invited much people to a feast , and dressed his meat with a fire made of woodden crosses . after this man in the year 1147. there arose one henricus a monk , ( which is the man spoken of by the answerer ) who was accused of heresieby his adversaries : his heresies ( as they termed them ) were these . first , infants are not to be baptised . 2. the cross of christ is not to be worshipped . 3. the body of christ is not in the sacrament of the eucharist . 4. it is in vain to pray for the dead . 5. god is provoked to wrath , by church musick . this was the henrician heresy in the full : they who did condemn and excommunicate these men , were the pope , his cardinalls , andcouncell ; and bernard , the fairest flower among them . a surely , i beleeve the same persons would have comdemned , this answerer also : forasmuch as he also is guilty of some of their opinions , for which they were condemned . b that is true enough : i therefore wonder why he did instance in these persons . but i will return to the disputation . oppo . i will prove that this interpretation of the place alledged , cannot be true : viz. to make disciples by baptising : first by the grammaticall construction of the place . secondly by the general consent of translators . thirdly , by the ●cripture compared with this place . and fourthly by the practice of the apostles ; who were the persons executing this commission : make disciples of all nations , baptising them : {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} i demand what is the antecedent to the relative {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} if {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} not understood in the word {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . res . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} nations is the anticedent . oppo . that cannot be : for then the commission should be this : make the nations disciples , by baptising them : and you have granted , that this commission doth not extend to all in the nations ; but only to such as are willing . secondly {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} is the newter gender , and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} the masculine ; how do they agree ? res . it is a figure called synthesis , wherein one gender is put for another : which is frequent in the new testament . oppo . i do not remember any place , neither do i beleeve any parallel place can be shewed out of the new testament . res . although i do not carry a concordance in my head , yet i can shew you one place in john 14. 26. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} and here the relative {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} hath for his antecedent {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} oppo . it is nothing so , for the anticedent is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} in the beginning of the vers . and the words between {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} are a parenthesis , and may be omitted without breaking the sence . res . is the parenthesis noted in your book ? opp. no , but your consience tells you it ought to be . res . i will give you another place , ephesi . 1. 13 , 14. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} here {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} hath , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} for his antecedent , this is a plain synthesis . oppo . it is so , because of the word {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} understood . what is the earnest of the inheritance ? res . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} the spirit of god . a here the respondent speaketh not punctually , according to the truth : for here the relative {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} comming between two words of different genders , it may accord with either : so that according to rule , it may be either {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , and in my judgement , this is as little to the purpose as the other : for here is no synthesis in either of these two places . oppo . i will prove that the commission in the 28th . of mat. cannot be a warrant for parents to require baptisme for their children . if the text do require teaching before baptising , then it can be no warrant to baptise children who cannot be taught : but the text requires teaching before baptising . therefore that can be no warrant to baptise children , or require baptisme for them , before they can be taught . res . i deny the minor , the text in the 28th . of mat. go disciple all nations , doth not require teaching before baptising , in all persons : indeed in those that are of years of discretion , and capable of understanding , the apostles were first to teach them , and to make them willing by teaching ; and afterward to baptise them but for infants they were first of all to make them disciples , by baptising of them , and afterward to teach them , when they are capable of understanding . oppo . i have to oppose unto you : the translators and translations of all sorts , in all languages , from the first to the last , ( so far as i know ) translated it teach , without any doubt or scruple . res . do you know what is the ethiopick word ? oppo . no i do not . next compare scripture with scripture : there being no better interpreter : this text being compared with mark 16. 15. go ye into all the world , preach the gospel to every creature . these commissions are the same indifferent words , matthew saith , go disciple , or teach all nations . mark saith , go preach the gospel to every creature . res . i deny them to be the same , neither given at the same time , nor at the same place : for the one was given in galilae , in a mountain where jesus had papointed them : the other was given to them when jesus appeared to them as they sate at meat . oppo . time and place doth not alter the commission , or prove them to be two : how doth it appear by your words that these words were spoken at several times , and in two places ? was it possible they might sit at meat in the mountain of galilae ? the next thing i have to urge you with , is the practice of the apostles , who best knew the meaning of the commission . they in the execution of this commission , did preach the gospel , and when the people beleeved , they baptised them , both men and women ; but not a word of children ( acts 9. 12. ) in the city of samaria : were there no children there ? res . philip baptised both men and women , under which children are comprehended ; which is usual in scripture : for josua 8. 25. it is said that josua destroyed all the inhabitants of ai . and so it was that all that fell that day both of men and women , were twelve thousand : even all the men of ai . here children are comprehended under men and women ; for they also were destroyed : for he utterly destroyed all the inhabitants of ai : and children were part , it may be , a great part of the inhabitants of ai . oppo . this is not much to the purpose : the text doth not say that there were no more inhabitants but twelve thousand ; but the men and women were twelve thousand , and that they were all , the men of ai . it is possible , notwithstanding that text , that the inhabitants of ai might be twenty thousand , the children being accounted . i leave your answer to consideration , and proceed to another argument . if baptisme of infants be lawfull , then it is of god : but it is not of god : therefore it is not lawfull . res . baptisme of infants is of god , and an ordinance of god : oppo . whatsoever is of god is to some good use or purpose . but baptisme of infants is to no good use or purpose . therefore baptisme of infants is not of god . res . baptisme of infants is to very good purpose ; namely to wash away their original sin , that so they may be made the children of god ; without which they cannot be saved : except any one be born of water , and of the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of god . opp. i will prove that baptisme cannot wash away the sin of infants . if all the sin that infants are or can be guilty of , be taken away before baptisme ; then baptisme cannot wash it away : but all the sin that infants are , or can be guilty of , is washed away before baptisme : therefore baptisme cannot wash away sin of infants . res . the sin of infants is not washed away before baptisme . oppo . if infants have no other sin but the sin of the world : whereof they are guilty , then all their sin is taken or washed away before baptisme . but infants have no other sin but the sin of the world , therefore all their sin is washed away before baptisme . res . i deny the consequence . oppo . if the sin of the world be taken away before baptisme ; then the consequence is true . but the sin of the world is taken away before baptisme : therefore the consequence is true . res . i deny the minor , the sin of the world is not taken away before baptisme : i know your scriptures . oppo . if christ took the sin of the world away by his death , when he died ; then it is taken away before baptisme . but christ jesus took away the sin of the world by his death : therefore it was taken away before baptisme . res . christ did not actually take away the sin of the world by his death . oppo . john 1. 29. behold the lamb of god that taketh away the sin of the world . 1. pet. 2. 24. who himself bare our sins , in his own body , on the tree . heb. 9. 28. christ was once offered , to bear the sins of many : with a multitude of places . deut. 9. 24. to finish sin , and make an end of transgression , &c. res . christ did not actually take away the sin of the world , but only potentially , in procuring a possibility of pardon upon conditions performed : namely of faith , repentance , and baptisme , in those that are of years of discretion ; and of baptisme in infants : and as they who are of years of discretion cannot have sin taken away without repentance faith and baptisme , no more can infants without baptisme . opp. i will prove that christ did actually take away the sin of the world , by his death : that which was not imputed , was actually taken away : but the sin of the world was not imputed : therefore it was actually taken away . res . the sin of the world was imputed before baptisme . oppo . 2. cor. 5. 19. god was in christ reconciling the world to himself ; not imputing their trespasses unto them . coll. 1. 20. and having made peace through the bloud of his cross , by him to reconcile all things to himself . heb. 10. 14. by one offering , he hath perfected for ever , them that are sanctified esa. 53. the lord laid on him the iniquity of us all . a multitude of witnesses might be produced . res . this is none other but what was said before : he did not impute them virtually , ( not but that he did impute them actually ) until the performance of the conditions afore named . oppo . i will leave these places to consideration , and prove that the sin of infants was taken away wholly before baptisme , by another argument : if the law whereby they were held guilty , was wholy taken away , then the sin was wholy taken away . but the law whereby they were held guilty was actually and wholely taken away . res . the law whereby they were held guilty was not actually taken away . oppo . if the covenant that god made with man before his fall , be wholely and actually taken away , then the law whereby they were held guilty , is taken away : but the covenant that god made with man before the fall , is actually taken away : therefore the law whereby they were held guilty , was taken away . res . the major is denyed , the law or covenant made before the fall of man , is not actually and wholely taken away . oppo . if that christ have established a new covenant , then the old one is taken away : but christ hath established a new covenant . therefore the old and former covenant is taken away . res . i deny the consequence ; both remain . oppo . if two covenants cannot stand together , then the consequence is true ; but two covenants cannot stand together , but the second makes voyde the first : therefore the consequence is true . res . two covenants may stand together . oppo . heb. 8. 13. heb. 10. 9. he taketh away the first , that he might establish the second . heb. 9. 15. res . the author speaks not of the covenant made with adam : but of that which god made with the children of israel . oppo . i urge the reason of the apostle , which if it hold good in that it will also hold good in this : if the covenant made with israel must be disanulled ; then also must the covenant made with adam , before his fall , be much more disanulled ; in asmuch as it hath as great an oposition . i shall easily prove that covenant to be taken away : if no man in the world neither is nor shall be judged by that covenant , then it is wholely taken away : but no man either is or shall be judged by that covenant : therefore it is taken away . res . persons shall be judged by that covenant made with adam . oppo . if infants shall be judged by that covenant made with adam , then infants dying unbaptised shall be shut out of heaven : but infants dying unbaptised shall not be shut out of heaven . therefore infants shall not be judged by that covenant . res . infants unbaptised , ( where there is no desire of their baptisme in their parents or friends ) shall be shut out of heaven . oppo . if unbaptised infants be shut out of heaven , then god punisheth some creatures for that which they cannot help ; but god punisheth no creatures for that which they cannot help : therefore unbaptised infants are not shut out of heaven . res . i deny the consequence . oppo . then shutting out of heaven is no punishment . b here the auditors ( some of them ) brake order , some crying out bear witness : he sayth , it is no punishment to be shut out of heaven : because of the denyall of this consequence : some also affirm he plainly said so , in so many sillables , which they can witness . res . the minor also may be questioned , for god may do what he will with his own , having all power in his hand , as the potter hath power over his clay , to use it at his pleasure . oppo . i do not say what god might or may do , but what he doth . now we know that god cannot do contrary to his oath : but to punish creatures , for that they cannot help , is contrary to his oath ; therefore god cannot do it . moreover thus i argue ; if god punish creatures for that they cannot help : then he doth not leave all the world without excuse . but he will leave all the world without excuse ; therefore he will not punish any creature for that which they cannot help . b this the opponent repeated three or four times over , and received no answer at all : no notice was taken of it : the respondent complaining of the injury done unto him by the disorder of the auditors ; which the opponent confessed , and said it was his sorrow , and altogether without his approbation . and then he spake as followeth , and departed . oppo . although i have many things to propound , yet considering the time allotted and agreed upon is spent : and my own infirmities begin to press me . i shall at this time cease . a i pray declare to me what success this disputation had . b surely , according to the different affections ( rather then judgements ) of some men and women : although christ himself preached church gospel of the kingdome , yet some beleeved , and some beleeved not ; some spake evill , and some well : some cryed victory on the one side , and some on the other . a the censure of the vulgar , that know nothing , is not worthy of the least account in the world ; their approbation is very near to disgrace : and the censure of the learned , who want conscience , is as little to be esteemed : it was wisely spoken by one of old , to a lewd person , who commended him highly : i am afraid ( said he ) i have done something amiss : because thou speakest well of me . but i desire to hear how it was resented by those that were truly both judicious , and consciencious : especially what resolution the gentlewoman●ound , for whose satisfaction the dispute ( as you said at first ) was appointed . b i am not able to render a particular account of every one ; but as touching the gentlewoman , the event was thus . the dispute was ended the 26th . day of november , and shee ( as i have heard ) was baptised the first day of december . a her practice declares her satisfaction : but i remember that day was very cold , and sharp ; it seemes strange that a gentlewoman should endure it at that season of the year , and in such weather to go into the water , and to be dipt all over . b you know that fantasticall ladies have a proverb : that pride feels no cold ; and their naked necks and breasts , and arms , even in the coldest weather , declare the truth of it : know that faith is stronger in christian women , who serve the lord jesus , then pride is in vain ones , who serve the prince of darkness . take therefore this for a maxime : that faith , and zeal , feel no cold : peter will adventure to walk upon the water , if jesus say come . and tender women will not be afraid to go under water , when jesus bids go : very hardly will that person follow christ , into the fire , who scruples to follow him into the water . but is it not very prejudiciall to the health of such persons who have not been accustomed to wet their feet in water ? i remember mr. baxter writes , that it is very dangerous ; and many thereby are likely to perish , if they should not miraculously be preserved . b i acknowledge mr. baxter to be a learned man in many things ; but herein he betrayes his science : and i am afraid , his conscience likewise : as touching science , it is easy to prove that dipping of beleevers , is not so dangerous , as dipping of infants : yet dipping of infants was not only commanded by the church of england , but also generally practised in the church of england , till the year 1600. yea in some places it was practised untill the year 1641. untill the fashion altered . again , i can make it manifest that dipping either infants or beleevers , is not so dangerous as sprinkling of infants : and yet they sprinkle them at all times , night and day , and winter and summer . and had m. baxter known this to be true , he would have told where and when any beleever was killed , and by whom ; that so he might have brought an odium upon the practise : but he gives us not one instance that i know . but on the contrary , i shall tell you my observation of many hundreds , that i have known baptised ; of both sexes , of all sorts : old , young , feeble persons , women great with child : i never knew any that had the least harm , or suffered any damage in respect of health . i have heard many confess they received much benefit in respect of their bodies ; but i never heard any complain , neither did i ever know any ( i speak it to the praise of the providence of god ) that died within one year after they were baptised : excepting one mayd in essex , who died within a few weeks ; and mr. baxters brethren instigated , and spurred the magistrate , untill the person baptising her , was sent to prison for murther , laid in irons , arrainged at the bar , at the assizes holden at chelmford . and although witnesses came in ( the one whereof was her mother ) and testified that shee was in better health , then shee had been , for some years before , for divers dayes ; and that shee walked comfortably abroad ; yet the jury was informed that he was guilty of wilfull murder . and had not his appeal stood him in stead , he had been in danger of his life . but when he had appealed , neither priest , nor people durst prosecute him any more . if therefore mr. baxter and his brethren could prove what they affirm to be true ; how great the cry would be , you may proportionably judge , by this one story : the whole matter whereof , with all the circumstances , are worthy to be committed to the press : ad perpetuam rei memoriam : that after ages may take notice what manner of persons we live in the midst of ; who preach , write , and print ; that the anabaptists are bloudy . i have a little more to speak to mr. baxter : that if there were such danger in the dipping of beleevers as he pretends : it must needs be that the administrator must be in greater perill then the receiver : forasmuch as the baptised goeth into the water but once , the baptist often : where many times he stayes the time untill divers persons are baptised , if the danger be so great , it need not to be feared that the sect should greatly increase : by reason that the teachers , will soon destroy themselves . but i can shew mr. baxter an old man in london , who hath laboured in the lords poole many years ; converted by his ministry ( as an instrument in the hand of the lord ) more men and women then mr. baxter hath in his parish ; yea , when he hath laboured a great part of the day in preaching , and reasoning , his refection hath been ( not a sack-possit or a cawdle ) but to go into the water , and baptise converts : and he liveth , when younger and wary persons have gone to the grave before him . i wonder that mr. baxter should forget what he hath read in authours , which he deems authentike : who write , that ethelbert king of kent , with ten thousand men and women , were baptised in canterbury ; upon the 25th . day of december , in the year 597. a the providence of god appears to be very great in this case : as if the lord did puropsely intend to stop the mouths of clamorous adversaries : yet i beleeve he will not acknowledge it to be any miracle , for he will not willingly grant , that god works miracles among the anabaptists . but did not the opponent declare that he had more arguments ; which he intended to have urged ? i would willingly hear them . b you shall hear them : that doctrine which leaveth power in the hands of men to kill soules , without their own consent , cannot be of god : but the doctrine , of infants baptisme ( as the respondent layes it down ) leaveth power in the hands of men to kill soules without their consent : therefore the doctrine of infant baptisme , laid down by the respondent , is not of god . a i think the major cannot be denyed , in regard the scripture saith , men are not able to kill the soule math. 10. 28. the minor therefore remains to be proved . b if men have power by his doctrine to deprive soules of salvation ; then they have power to kill soules . but by this doctrine , men have power to deprive soules of salvation : therefore ( by this doctrine ) men have power to kill soules : the minor is proved , by the grounds which are laid down , viz. baptisme is so absolutely necessary to salvation , that no child can be saved without it . now we see many parents can and do withhold baptisme from their children , and thereby ( according to his doctrine ) they kill the soules of their children : for he that depriveth us of the meanes , doth deprive us of the end . a i will not undertake the answer of this argument : because i know not what to say to it ; i leave it for them that can : i pray you proceed to another argument . b that doctrine which maketh the commands of christ to be more obscure , then the commands delivered by moses ; is not of god : but the doctrine of infant baptisme maketh the commands of christ more obscure then the commands delivered by moses . therefore the doctrine of infant baptisme is not of god . that christ speaks more plain then moses , these scriptures testifie , john 1. 16 , 17. heb. 2. 3. chapters , 2. cor. 3. from the 6th to the 15 verse . now it evidently appears that moses delivered ordinances plainly and evidently , even in the smallest things : he was very punctuall according to all the form shewed in the mount . if then the baptisme of infants be a thing of so great weight , so absolutely necessary to salvation of them ; how can it be imagined that it should have been wholly left out of the scripture , and not a word of it to be found : as the defenders themselves confess ? but only by consequence ; and this age is ashamed of the consequences , that pleased former ages : and bring new and unheard of sequels , to confirm what they cannot find in plain terms delivered . a third argument is this : that doctrine and practise which begets questions that cannot be answered ; and is upheld by practises which are ridiculous , is not of god : but such is the doctrine and practise of infant baptisme : therefore it is not of god . the questions and doubts are these chiefly . 1. how long time may a child be kept vnbaptised without sin ? 2. whether the children of vnbeleevers may be baptised ? 3. whether the faith of the grandfather may give a child right to baptisme . 4. how far may we go back in a right or collaterall line to derive the right of children to baptisme . 5. whether sureties can perform faith and repentance for the child . 6. whether that child be truly baptised ; whose sureties were unbeleevers . the practises that are ridiculous are these . 1. the priest demandeth of the child whether it do beleeve in god ? whether it do forsake the divell ? &c. whether he or shee desire to be baptised ? the godfather answers , yea : for this child : when the child hath not any desire . this is so ridiculous , that our new reformers are quite ashamed of it , and have sent the antique fashion out of dores : and cashired the godfathers and godmothers . there were of old ( even of the same antiquity with infants baptisme : ) men that did not spare to baptise dead men : so great a superstition did possess the minds of some in the second and third centuries : the mode was thus ; the dead man lieth upon the bed : a living man creeps under the bed : the priest demands of the dead man , whether he repents ? whether he desire to be baptised ? the living man answers from under the bed , for the dead man ; yea , i do repent , i do beleeve ; i desire to be baptised ; after which they proceeded to baptise the dead man : and scripture they alledged for the collouring of this absurdity , 1. cor. 15. 29. why are they then baptised for the dead : and peradventure they might say , it was as plain as any could be brought for the baptisme of infants . this was about the year 180. so soon had men perverted the commands of christ , and were become strangers to his wayes . i will leave all these things to your judgement , to try by the touchstone what price is to be set upon them . the lord give the reader and hearers understanding hearts . finis . errata . page 7. line ult. reade {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . likewise p. 8. l2 . p. 10 , l. 4. supply i. p. 18. l. 5. now instead of for , p. 24. l. 25. faith without ground , is to begin the opponents speech , p. 30. l. 5. r. parvulorum . p. 31. l. 23. r. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . p. 32. l. 18. for responent r. opponent l. 19. for {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} r. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} p. 33. l. 1 ▪ r ▪ by p. 33. l. 26. r. was it not possible p. 35. l. 17 r. dan. 9. p. 38. l. 28. for church r. the much in a little, or, an abstract of mr. baxters plain scripture-proof for infants church-membership or baptism with a few notes upon the anti-queries of t.g. / by the same hand that wrote the fifty queries. barret, john, 1631-1713. 1678 approx. 97 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 42 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2006-06 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a26961 wing b1314 estc r14073 12390242 ocm 12390242 60979 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a26961) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 60979) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 268:12) much in a little, or, an abstract of mr. baxters plain scripture-proof for infants church-membership or baptism with a few notes upon the anti-queries of t.g. / by the same hand that wrote the fifty queries. barret, john, 1631-1713. baxter, richard, 1615-1691. plain scripture-proof of infants church-membership and baptism. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. quaeries examined. [4], 70, [4] p. printed for tho. parkhurst ..., london : 1678. preface signed: j.b. attributed to john barret. cf. bm. advertisement on p. [1]-[4] at end. reproduction of original in british library. marginal notes. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism. 2005-07 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-08 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2006-01 jonathan blaney sampled and proofread 2006-01 jonathan blaney text and markup reviewed and edited 2006-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion much in a little : or , an abstract of mr. baxters plain scripture-proof for infants church-membership or baptism . vvith a few notes upon the anti-queries of t. g. by the same hand that wrote the fifty queries . london . printed for tho. parkhurst at the bible and three crowns the lower end of cheapside near mercers-chappel . 1678. reader , what artifices and assaults the devil hath made and used to supplant the weightiest principles , to darken the most clear and comfortable truths , and to break the peace and concord of the church , is grown too evident to require proof . and how he hath perplexed this present doctrine of the church-membership , and baptism of infants , with controversies , we need not now insist upon . but surely , were not our little ones as well concerned and interested in the covenant of grace , as their parents are , your strange and deep compassions towards them ( so rooted in nature , and cultivated and enlarged by grace ) would become their dreadful torment and distress . and why infants should feel the smart 〈◊〉 dreadful punishments of the violated law 〈◊〉 covenant of innocent nature , ( as is evident in their early diseases , pains and death ) and not be capable of redress and pardon by a gracious covenant , i am yet to learn. and what their capacity should be for , if not to be answerably treated and regarded , ( supposing what god by his son and in his gospel hath prepared and tendred to us ) i cannot understand . all laws consider infants at in their parents , until maturity make them capable of chusing and acting for themselves . and why we should exclude them from covenant redresses , seeing god once took them in by an act or law of grace not yet repealed , i am not able to conjecture ▪ were they excluded from gospel-grace , their parents would want , 1. that cogent argument which now they have to be devoted unto god themselves , and to be true to such a dedication , as ever they regard the present and eternal welfare of their infant-seed . and 2. a soveraign antidote against their griefs and fears , when their children are removed in their infancy . for if god hath no-where promised to save our little ones by his son , to pardon them , and to adopt them into his family , what can perswade us , that they belong not to the devil , and that they are not gone to dwell with him when they are dead ? and then with what dejected hearts and looks must mournful parents follow their deceased infants to their graves ! but i shall ( and need ) not say any more , seeing this abstract of mr. baxters larger and elaborate treatise , comes on this errand to its reader , who is desired to take notice , that it was ready many months agone , soon after the publication of the anti-queries , though its own publication hath been obstructed until now . peruse , and judge impartially . a few notes upon the querist examined . your anti-queries , very lately sent me by one of your party , as [ a full answer to the fifty queries , ] i have considered impartially , i hope ; and cannot think them worthy of a book in answer : yet that you might not take my silence either for consent , or for a contempt , i have written these few pages here . now in the first place i must tell you , those fifty queries will remain unanswered , until that book of mr. baxters be answered , to which every query refers , which , for ought i know , you never yet lookt into . * and whether your anti-queries , so far as they concern the main point in question , be not cut off , and answered again and again in that book , and divers other extant , and common , i leave to the judgment of indifferent readers . further i might tell you of your playing upon the word , [ church , ] antiq. 1. p. 1. which is immediately explained in my first query , by kingdom of god , which prevents your exception . and i might take notice of your newcovn'd term , [ practical ordinance , ] which you have so often , as if there were some other ordinances , speculative , or not practical . i might take notice of your illogical distinction , of being a member of the church essentially , and being a member formally , anti. 18. p. 14. and your not allowing an universal visible church , antiq. 16. p. 12. i might take notice how you misunderstand , or misapply those texts , except ye eat the flesh of — ( joh. 6. 53. ) and , except a man be born of water — ( joh. 3. 5. ) as if the former spake of the lords supper , and the latter of baptism , ( vid. antiq. p. 5. ) again , i might take notice of your shooting short , in many of your antiqueries . as because there was a time when infants within the church were not devoted to god by any such engaging sign , as circumcision , or baptism , no such engaging sign being then instituted ; therefore infants are not to be so solemnly devoted to god , when such an engaging sin is instituted , and belongeth to all within the church . and your shooting wide is plain in some others . i might tell you , how you have the same things over and over again . though you accuse me of continual tautologizing , antiq. 38. p. 30. i am willing , the impartial reader should judge , whether of us be most guilty here . turpe est doctori , &c. i take notice of your citing mr. baxters cure of church-divisions , p. 7. no less than thrice , ( soil . in preface , and p. 10. and p. 32. ) yet a man may turn thrice to p. 7. in that book of mr. baxter for that which you refer unto , and lose his labour . so i take notice of your vain flourishing , and braving it with mr. t 's confident challenge , both in the end of your preface , [ and know this , &c. ] and again , antiq. 49 p. 38 , 39. ( when also you shoot wide , not one word to my query . ) as concerning mr. baxter , i may say , know this , that others that are sober and judicious , tell him , he hath clear'd those points sufficiently , that any further debate concerning them is needless . further i might take notice of the many [ et caetera's ] you have put to my queries , sometimes leaving out what was most lively to pinch ; yea , you cut off the chief part of fiftieth and last query , without so much as an &c. unless it was the printers fault . again , i might take notice where you are not very consistent with , but rather contradict your self one or two places i may have occasion to observe . but i must take notice of your fair concessions , and i thank you for them . i will not dispute it with you , whether these of yours be properly called , antiqueries ? let the preposition 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be either pro or con , with you , i should not spend time in criticising on the word . but whether in composition , the word of an apostle or messenger of the churches , ( as i have heard , some do call you ) should be both yea and nay , may be a question . now , what do these following queries o● yours imply , [ antiq. 5. p. 4. whether the baptists do not as clearly assert infants right to the grace of god in the first edition of the covenant made with adam as any whatsoever ? antiq. 10. p. 9. as for the gracious covenant made with adam , do we not grant that it extends to infants ? yea , we say with mr. baxter , it was never abrogated . antiq 19. p. 14. whether the blessing of abraham ( if you understand it of eternal life ) was not the blessing of the fathers that were before him ? and whether that blessing did not belong to their infants ? ( which is not at all opposite to my 19 query . and in what follows there , you plainly shoot short , as i noted before . ) and antiq. 23. p. 17. you fairly grant , that promises made to the seed of the righteous , to the children of them that love god , &c. are unrevoked , you doubt not but these promises yet remain . ( though i confess , i do not well understand what you mean by those words , antiq. 21. p. 16. whether all men that follow the rules of morality , are not within the reach of these blessings also ? these you speak of , are either righteous , and such as love god , or they are not . if they be such , then certainly they belong to the universal church , and are real members of it ; if they are not such , then they have not an interest in the promise made to such as love god , neither can they lay claim to blessings promised . ) but to go on with your concessions : antiq. 11. p. 9. and whether the difference between the baptists and paedobaptists , be not chiefly ( if not only ) about imposing ceremonies upon infants ? antiq. 12. p. 10. seeing the baptists may and do in a good sense acknowledge infants to be related to the church , viz. by redemption , pious dedication to god , &c. antiq. 30. p. 23. and who denies infants to be capable of infant-relation , obligation , or right ? or who opposeth their being devoted to god in their capacity ? antiq. 31. p. 24. whether you do not greatly wrong your self , and those you call anabaptists , in saying , they vehemently plead against devoting their children to god ? yea , sure they do it actually , as far as gods word requires . — prove if you can , that you your selves do consent to the covenant of grace for your infants , more than we , whom you call anabaptists . ] here we have ( as you say in your preface ) your concessions in respect of infants . relation to god , by vertue of the covenant of grace , and the devotion of his people , &c. i shall be very glad , if i may know you are all agreed in these things . and here ( methinks ) you offer as fair , as any of your way , i have ever met with to end our difference about infant-baptism . if the premises be granted , the conclusion will follow . if you grant our infants within the covenant , then they have right to the investing sign . to whom the promise belongs , to them baptisme belongs , acts 2. 38 , 39. if you yield our infants church members , then you should not deny their right to solemn admission by baptism . ( see mr. baxters plain scripture-proof , &c. p. 23. &c. ) and mr. t. your champion , yielded , this would follow . you grant , antiq. 6. p. 4. and antiq. 22. p. 16. that infants are of the redeemed church . and in the close of antiq. 25. p. 19. that infants still retain member-ship in the invisible church . and antiq. 16. p. 13. they are members of the universal church ( invisible , you mean , for you like not of an universal church visible . ) and otherwise ( as you say ) how shall they be saved , seeing christ is only the saviour of his body . only i query whether it be not a contradiction , when you say , antiq. 28. p. 21. how can infants be said to be a spiritual seed : are any but a spiritual seed , members of the invisible church ? are not they a spiritual seed that are of christs body , and saved by him ? but if infants be not members of the visible church , how can you prove they are members of the invisible church ? to be probably members of the invisible church , is to be members of the visible church , or visible church-members . further , you say , the baptists do in a good sense acknowledge infants to be related to the church , viz. by redemption , pious dedication to god , &c. ( antiq. 12. pag. 10. before-cited ) now do but make sense of it , and i have enough . either these infants visibly belong , to the kingdom of christ , or to the kingdom of satan : ( for these two kingdoms divide and share the whole world , that such as are not of the one , are certainly of the other ; and such as are not visibly of the one , are visibly of the other ) and will you say , that such as are of the redeemed-church , related to the church by redemption , and further related by pious dedication to god , &c. are visibly the seed of the serpent , and of the kingdom of satan . but this [ pious dedication ] leads me to another of your self-contradictions . antiq. 30. p. 23. where are christian parents required to devote their children , by consenting to any covenant for them ? ( though you grant there , the jews were required to covenant for their children in matters of religion . ) and yet under the next anti-query , p. 24. you say , prove if you can , that you your selves do consent to the covenant of grace for your infants , more than we . how properly may these be called anti-queries ? or to get off , will you say , you consent to the covenant of grace for the infants ? but not as a thing required ? i gave you thanks before , for some things granted concerning infants , and i here promise more thanks , if you will prove the same of all infants . this you insinuate , p. 5. seeing then all infants ( for ought you know ) have the same right — but i doubt , your proof of this point will be as lame and weak , as your sentence there is imperfect , and abrupt . you should not wrong us , to say , we restrain the love and grace of god to such infants as ( in your new phrase ) partake with parents in practicals of religion , ( antiq. 3. p. 2. ) as if we held , that no infant ( dying unbaptized ) could be saved , is a charge , you cannot prove . antiq. 4. p. 3. whether the parents consent to wickedness is the childs consent ? ] peruse mr. baxter of original sin. you your self do not deny , ( antiq. 7. p. 6. ) but the wickedness of parents may expose their infant-children to external calamities . yea , antiq. 21. p. 16. whoever doubted , but that infants are — greatly disadvantaged by the wickedness of their parents , even so as to bear their fathers iniquities many times , as is evident in the overthrow of the old world , &c. ) now god is not injust in what he inflicts on such children . if they bear the fathers iniquities , they are some way guilty with their parents . you enquire further , antiq. 4. p. 3. and whether this do not give the parents power to save , or damn their infants ? but you will not say , i suppose , that you are your own saviour , when you perform the condition of the covenant , to which salvation for christs sake is graciously promised . neither will we say , that any infants perish purely for anothers sin , or the parents sin only imputed ; but for their own contracted . ( as mr. baxter of original sin , p. 135. ) the overthrow of both those generations in the deluge , ( spoken of gen. 6. ) is a strange medium to prove the salvation of all their infants , which you hint at , antiq. 7. p. 6 and rom. 5. 18. which you there cite , will no more prove , that all infants ( that die infants ) are saved ; then that all men are saved . the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life . this [ all ] must be limited to all in christ . antiq. 22. p. 16. whether god hath not said , that his ways are all equal ? and whether this do not secure infants of gods mercy — when god saith , that the son shall not bear the iniquity of the father , and every one shall bear his own iniquity , whether this be not a promise of mercy to infant-children , and that in respect of eternal life ? ] here you imply , that gods ways are not equal , if he shew not mercy on all infants , if he give not eternal li 〈◊〉 e unto all that die infants . and if you take these words [ every one shall bear his own iniquity ] to be a promise of eternal life to all infants , as such ; you must hold , that no infant hath any iniquity to bear , and so wholly deny the doctrine of original sin , ( which i perceive you do ; though you will never be able to answer the arguments , and scripture-evidence brought to prove it . ) but you misapply the scripture . what is spoken of the adult , you apply to infants , ( a very common mistake of those of your way and perswasion . ) in the 18. of ezek. the lord pleads with men that had too good a conceit of themselves , and would cast the blame on others , if they suffered , as if they themselves were guiltless , vers . 2. the fathers have eaten sour grapes , and the childrens teeth are set on edge . ] q. d. our fathers have sinned , and we their children smart , and suffer for it . now the lord , to shew that his ways are equal , declares , that he that is righteous , shall live , vers . 5. &c. but if such a one hath a son that proves wicked , that son shall die , vers . 10. &c. again , if the son of a wicked man sees , and abhors his fathers wicked courses , if he be righteous , he shall live , and shall not bear his fathers iniquity , v. 14. &c. yea , if a man have been never so wicked , yet if he repent , and turn , he shall surely live , vers . 21. &c. but in all this there is no promise of eternal life to all the infant-seed of the wicked . antiq. 37. p. 29. and where are we taught to doubt the salvation of the infants of pagans ? ] sometimes we are troubled at some of your way , that they seem to allow us no more ground of hope , concerning the seed of the faithful , then concerning the seed of the heathen and pagans . but if it be so clear , that none are to doubt the salvation of the infants of pagans , we should rest satisfied , and think it enough that the children of the faithful are put into so good a condition . but i told you ( in my treatise of the covenants , p. 359. ) that to assert the salvation of all that die in infancy , seems to imply , that gods destroying the old world , and sodom , &c. were eminent acts of mercy , rather then of justice ; wherein such multitude of souls were sent to heaven together , who if they had lived , had probably ( at least the greatest part of them ) gone to hell. i desire you would remove this doubt of mine . so likewise i cannot yet reconcile your opinion with that reason the lord gives for his sparing nineveh , jonas 4. 11. ( which i also there took notice of . ) had there not been more mercy , suppose the lord had taken away above sixscore thousand little ones , that were not come to the use of reason , if then they had all been undoubtedly saved ; then in sparing them with the city , whereupon probably not one of very many of them was saved . help me over this doubt . and if the salvation of pagans-infants is not to be doubted , ( as you suggest ) then suppose the french king should have power to over-run all the pagan countries in the world , though he spoiled , plundered , fired all the towns where he came ; yet provided he did but withal slay all their little ones , then will it not follow , that he might be looked upon as a greater blessing than scourge to the world ? had the world your light and knowledge , they must conclude , that they ought not to be so sorry for the spoiling of their countries , ( a temporal calamity ) as they should rejoyce , ( have cause of rejoycing indeed ) that all their little ones were undoubtedly saved , certainly sent to heaven . and then what shall we make of eph. 2. 3. and were by nature the children of wrath , even as others ? and v. 12. that all that time ye were without christ , being aliens from the common-wealth of israel , and strangers from the covenants of promise , having no hope , and without god in the world . having no hope . ] if there be no ground to doubt of the salvation of their infants ? is not here some hope ? but have you not forgotten that you told us , you do not doubt , but the promises made to the seed of the righteous , and the promise of shewing mercy to the children of them that love god , &c. remain unrevoked ? how are those promises made to their seed , as such , if as great mercy be ensured , and secured , procured by the death of christ , to and for all infants that die infants , ( as you intimate antiq . 37. p. 14. and in other places ? and when you would have the blessing of abraham ( understanding it of eternal life ) to belong to the infants of the gentiles , ( as antiq. 19. p. 14. ) if you understand , and take in the infants of the unbelieving , as well as believing gentiles ; then do not you forget that expression , gal. 3. 14. that the blessing of abraham might come on the gentiles . as to their infants , you here suppose it to have been on them all along , and not to come on them , by their parents receiving the promise through faith . according to your opinion , all infants are , and ever were blessed with faithful abraham , notwithstanding many of the parents have been , and are pagans , infidels , and such as the word pronounces under a curse . now , how may divers of your own party ( such as you call baptists ) justly object that to you , which without ground they are wont to object against us ? you would make the promise of salvation run unto a fleshly line indeed , ( as mr. baxter notes in his review , p. 33. ) and who can forbid water , ( now that baptism is the initiatory sign and seal of the covenant ) to any dying infant of a pagan , since he may be confident the blessings of the covenant belong to it ? you query ubi supra , ( antiq. 37. p. 29. ) will not the second adams obedience salve the first adams disobedience ? and antiq. 38. p. 30. whether the meritoriousness of christ is not as available to save infants , without any mans acceptance thereof for them ? ] i doubt not , but the second adams obedience and merits are available , so far as was intended , and agreed betwixt the father and him . but it lies on you to prove , that it was so intended and agreed , that all infants , so dying , shall absolutely be saved . antiq. 37. p. 29. whether it be his will , that the grace of that covenant should depend upon others observation of the condition for them ? and whether this be not to put the salvation of infants out of his own hand ? ] infants are not saved by the covenant of grace , which is [ to believers and their seed ; ] if they neither be believers , nor the seed of such . only that i be not misunderstood , i add , if any that enjoy not the gospel , that never heard that joyful sound , come up to the terms of the covenant of grace made with adam and noah , i rank not them and their seed with infidels . to what you say of gods , [ putting the salvation of infants out of his own hand : ] i need say but this , you might as well query , whether god put not the salvation of the adult out of his own hand , if their salvation be suspended on performance of the condition required . one thing more i cannot but observe , ( wherein i suppose you are a little singular also ) in antiq. 26. p. 19. you make your imposition of hands as generally pertaining to members of the church , as baptism . ( where i might note , that you seem to grant , baptism generally pertains to the members of the church . ( but that by the way . ) now elsewhere * you tell us , that [ in this holy ordinance of prayer and imposition of hands , we are in a solemn manner ushered into the promise of the holy spirit . ] you go on , [ imposition of hands doth put us in a better capacity to seek daily for the gifts and graces of the spirit ; because now solemnly interested in the promise , by that very way the primitive saints were interested therein , act. 8. 15 , 17. act. 19. 2 , 6. 2. tim. 1. 6. heb. 6. 1 , 2. — what shall i say ? the scriptures ( or , these scriptures ) are evidence sufficient , that this crdinance is of divine institution , is from heaven ; the promise which it leads to , is perpetual , and universal , it belongs to the whole body . there is one body , and one spirit , &c. this is the conclusion of the sermon , ( p. 96 , 97. ) and what gifts of the spirit you speak of is very plain , throughout the sermon . for brevity , i will mention but one place , ( p. 77. ) thus you see the church being under perpetual exhortations , to seek for spiritual gifts [ without any restriction , ] necessarily infers her perpetual right to them , and every of them ; which consideration alone is sufficient ( as i conceive ) to satisfie any christian , that the promise of the spirit ( even the same that was given to the first churches ) in respect of gifts as well as graces , belongs to the church of christ throughout all ages . now if imposition of hands generally pertains to all the members of the church , and solemnly interesteth them in the promise of the spirit , methinks it should follow , that all such members , on whom you lay your hands , ( supposing you have right to do it , as you take up the practice , if i be not mis-informed ) should have some extraordinary gifts of the spirit . and i have reason to think , you encourage your followers to submit to this imposition , by working in them such a perswasion and expectation . for ( p. 88. of the forecited sermon ) you have these words , as the promise of gifts ( as well as graces ) [ pertains to us as we are the called of god ] we ought to stir one another up , to seek with all diligence , and [ full assurance ] for the spirit of promise . and p. 95. 't is well known ( and i think granted on all hands ) that they ( i. e. the primitive churches ) used the solemn ordinance of prayer and imposition of hands , for obtaining the promised spirit , at least with respect to these gifts . — then seeing these gifts are promised to us as well as unto them , and are attainable , and in part ( at least ) attained by many , what should hinder the churches , but that now they should tread in this path , with faith , and [ full assurance ] that a blessing is in it ? but while you call for full assurance here , i am full of doubt , that you have no such promise , nor commission for your practice [ of imposition of hands , for conferring the gifts of the holy ghost . ] take heed of pretending a commission from heaven ; take heed of counterfeiting heavens seal . oh , be afraid of taking gods name in vain . will you herein imitate the apostles ? may it not be said of you , you know not what spirit you are of ? may you not as well take upon you , to lay hands on the sick to heal them ? because of that , mark 16. 18. they shall lay hands on the sick , and they shall recover : or , anoint them with oyl in the name of the lord , because of what you read , mark 6. 13. jam. 5. 14. i dare not limit god or his holy spirit : and i desire , that you may not tempt him . when you have pleaded all you can for the continuance of those extraordinary gifts , and for the promise of them being perpetual universal to the whole body , and pertaining to us as we are the called of god , ( whereupon it follows , that they should pertain to all that are called of god ) yet experience will confute you , and prove , they are not so ordinary . when you make prayer and imposition of hands , the means ordained of god to obtain those gifts , ( ser. p. 94. 95. ) i might retort some of your own words , antiq. 33. p. 25. shew us what benefit , &c. and antiq. 39. pag. 31. name one — name one that hath received those gifts of the holy ghost , by the laying on of your hands . if the gift of healing , &c. was seen to follow , these might draw in more to you then your writing or disputing . and i wish you would be advised , ere you encourage all your hearers to seek for spiritual gifts , without any restriction ; lest women seek to prophesy ; or men seek new revelations , and so turn enthusiasts , and think themselves above mans teaching . there is enough to be said against your imposition of hands ; though i have nothing to say against confirmation , being duly and orderly performed ; but have long wisht for the restoring of it . so i have nothing against imposition of hands , in setting apart persons that are proved , and fitted to the work of the ministry . but this pertains not to every member of the church . i can pass by what you say of me , that i am worse for my baptism in infancy , as resting upon that , &c. antiq. 40. p. 32. doth not your conscience tell you , that the baptism of men and women upon profession of faith and repentance , is beyond the reach of contradiction ? ] the baptising of such as were without the church , or were first of the jewish church , and to be afterwards admitted into the christian church , upon the profession of faith and repentance , is plain in scripture , not to be contradicted . but this contradicteth not the baptising of the infants of such , being also to be acknowledged church-members . neither can you shew in all the new-testament one instance of any baptised upon their profession , who deferred their childrens baptism ( if infants ) till they were grown up , and able to make the like profession . but to come a little nearer to you ; would you have none but men and women baptised ? then do you not forget your self again ? and what you said , antiq. 39. p. 31. who is against as early an engagement of children to god , as can lawfully be made ? ] now this one concession of yours , that you are for as early an engaging them to god , as can lawfully be , will prove your way not so certain , not altogether clear , ( as you would perswade your readers in your preface ) not beyond the reach of contradiction , but full of doubts , full of difficulties . if the children of christians are not to be engaged , and devoted to god in their infancy , you can none of you tell , ( how then are you like to agree ) at what age they are to be so engaged , and devoted to god ? what think you ? is it not sinful to neglect and put it off , when once it might lawfully be done ? now what word , what example can you produce out of scripture , to satisfie conscience how early you may do it ? what was the youngest age that ever any christians child was baptised at ? and if you could tell us the minimum quod sic , and quod non , the youngest age at which any child was baptised , and under which age none might be baptised , it would be some guide to us . because you put the matter to my conscience , i would speak seriously . and so i must say , was i off from the grounds of infant-baptism , i cannot see , how conscience would be well satisfied about the time of baptizing my own children . to defer it after they are come to make a visible profession , by your own principles , should be concluded sinful , against the rule of the gospel ; but how soon a childs profession may be taken for a sufficient visible profession , i should not know how to resolve , or how to determine . i have one request to you , that you would take into your more serious thoughts that part of the last query which you left out . think how much of it you have granted unto . and let us study the things that make for peace , and whereby we may edifie one another . what you seem to hide from your readers , i shall give you the substance of ( more briefly ) out of mr. baxters review , p. 27. that if you would be contented your selves , to satisfie your own consciences to be rebaptized , ( as one that doubted whether he were well married , would secure it , by being married over again ) and would afterwards live peaceably in communion with your brethren , and not appropriate church-communion to your sect : and if you would not deny our infants part in the covenant of grace , the promise of pardon , and life by christ , and our infants church-membership , and only deferred the baptismal investiture , as tertullian desired , for the more solemn inauguration and obligation ; though i should not be of your mind , i should live in as loving forbearance and communion with you , as with other christians . the lord direct all his professing people into the way of truth , and peace , so prays your friend j. b. after this brief reply to your antiqueries , i would propound to you these following queries out of mr. b's first defence , or plain scripture-proof , &c. desiring your serious thoughts upon them . if you say , they are answered already in mr. t s writings , then it will be more easie for you to return an answer , which if clear and succinct , may more befriend your cause than greater volumes . preparatory enquiries . 1. is not the scripture more sparing in such cases as these ? 1. in speaking of those to whom it speaks not , as concerning the heathen , and concerning infants ? 2. in lesser points ? 3. in points not then questioned ? 4. does not the new-testament speak more sparingly of that which is more fully discovered in the old ? and is not this the very case here ? the main question not being [ by what sign members are to be admitted into the church , ] or [ whether by a sign , or without ? ] but [ at what age they are to be admitted members ? ] which is as fully determined in the old testament , as most things in the bible ; and therefore what need any more ? 2. will the difficulty of a point , that it is not so easie or clear as we would have it , prove , that it is not truth ? the apostle peter tells us many things are hard to be understood , even in pauls epistles ; yet are they not truths for all that ? are there not many weighty controversies more difficult than this ? ( and should it not be considered , whether the contrary hath not far less evidence and likelihood of truth ? ) 3. if never so clear evidence of truth be produced , will it not still be dark to them that are uncapable of discerning it ? and is not this the case of many , even of the godly , that are but children in knowledge ? 4. when the case is so difficult that we cannot attain to a clearness and certainty , must we not follow the more probable way ? and though there should be far more said against infant-baptism than hath been said ; yet if far more may be said against your way of baptism , should not this stop you ? 5. and is it not a spirit of rashness and headiness , that runs men presently upon new untried ways , upon every doubting about the old ? would not tender consciences , who know errors to be dangerous , wait , and pray , and enquire of those that are likely to inform them , &c. before they venture ? 6. is the overthrow of a mans former weak grounds , the overthrow of the truth which he held ? or is the overthrow of other mens weak arguments a weakning of the truth which they maintain ? 7. is not one found argument enough to prove any thing true ? what if all the texts that are brought were put by , save one , is not that enough ? 8. should not the former and present customs of the holiest saints and churches , be of great weight with humble moderate christians in cases controverted , and beyond their reach ? 9. are not evident consequences , or arguments drawn by reason from scripture , as true proof , as the very express words of a text ? if it be proved , [ that all church-members must be admitted by baptism . ] and then proved , [ that infants are church-members : ] is not this as much , as to prove , they must be baptized ? will you allow of such an argument for infant-baptism as christ brought for the resurrection ? ( mat. 22. 31 , 32. ) or will you call that weak arguing , which is like his ? 10. is this controversie in it self considered , of so great moment , as some make it ? is it a fundamental point , and duty , of absolute necessity to salvation , ( why then was not baptism in the creed called the apostles ? ] mark. 16. 16. saith only , he that believeth not is condemned ; not , he that is not baptised . doth not the apostle speak of baptizing , as a small part of his work , in comparison of preaching , 1 cor. 1. 14 , 17. though all christs commands , both great and small , must be obeyed , so far as we know them ; yet if christians make that which is comparatively so small a point , a chief part of their study and conference , and lay out at least one half of their zeal about it , are not such deluded ? and if they were in the truth here , yet is not that truth a snare to them ? 11. tho the point of infant-baptism be comparatively of less moment ; yet whether the grounds on which it stands and which are usually denied with it , be not of great moment ? now to the question , [ whether some infants ought not to be baptized ? ] ( 1. ) ought not all christs disciples ordinarily to be baptized ? ( mat. 28. 19. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , make ye disciples , baptizing them , ) and are not some infants christs disciples ? may not the word [ disciple ] be taken in a larger sense , relatively ; for one that is of the number of those that belong to christ , as master and king of the church , and devoted to his oversight and rule , and teaching for the future : as well as in a narrower sense , for those who are actual learners ? and ( 1. ) doth not the holy ghost call them disciples ? acts 15. 10. is it not evident , that those on whose necks the false teachers would have laid the yoke , were disciples ? if you say , not all , but some of them are here called disciples , that is , only them at age ; then will it not follow , that it is but some only , whose circumcision the apostle and the synod doth conclude against , that is , those of age ? then for any thing the apostle saith , or this synod , all infants might be circumcised still : and is not this absurd ? 2. if no infants are disciples , what is the cause ? is it because they are not capable ? or because god will not shew them such mercy ? can you find out a third cause , which is not reducible to one of these ? and 1. if infants are capable of being servants of god , how can they be thought incapable of being disciples ? if you will make a difference , is not more required to a servant , than to a disciple ? yet is it not plain , that infants are capable of being gods servants ? lev. 25. 41 , 42. if god call infants his servants , though they are uncapable at present of doing him service , what forbids , but that we may call them disciples , tho at present they are uncapable of learning ? were not the jews and their infants called gods servants in a sense peculiar , as chosen and separated from all others ; that the gentiles at age were not so gods servants , as the jews infants were ? otherwise how could it be a reason for releasing them in the year of jubilee , any more than for releasing any other ? 2. are not infants capable of being subjects of christs kingdom ? and is not christs church both his kingdom and his school , and every member of it under him , both as king and prophet ? are not all subjects of christ in his visible kingdom or ( church ) christians ? and are not disciples and christians all one in the language of the holy ghost , act. 11. 26. again , can it be , that infants are not disciples , because god will not shew them such mercy ? were not infants in the jewish church servants and disciples of christ , ( tho not so fully , and explicitly as now ? ) was not christ then the king of the church , as mediator , upon undertaking to pay our debt ? and if infants in the jews church were servants , and disciples , doth not god shew as great and greater mercy to his church now under the gospel ? and to your common objection , that infants cannot learn. ( 1. ) yet can they not partake of the protection and provision of their master , and enjoy the priviledges of the family and school , and be under christs charge and dominion ? ( 2. ) and be devoted to learning , if they live , and consecrated to him as their master ? ( 3. ) and why should any be more vigorous with christ in this case , than with men ? is it not common to call the whole nation of the turks , both old and young , by the name of mahometans , or disciples of mahomet ? and what if infants cannot at first learn to know christ ? is that the first lesson ? is it not somewhat , if they can be taught any of the duty of a rational creature ? and doth not scripture require to teach children the trade of their life in the time of their youth ; ( as early , no doubt , as they are able to understand ) and to bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the lord ? and does not this nurture belong to them , as schollars of christ ? ( 2. ) ought not all ordinarily to be baptized , that ought to be admitted visible church-members ? since baptism was instituted , have we any precept or example of admitting visible members any other way ? will you not grant , that all visible church-members must be admitted by baptism ? now what plentiful proof may be brought , that some infants ought to be admitted visible church-members ? and does there need any more to prove , that they ought to be baptized ? ( 1. ) whether were not some infants once to be admitted members of the visible church , by the merciful gift and appointment of god , not yet repealed ? were not infants part of them that entered into covenant with the lord , that he might stablish them for a people to himself , and might be to them a god ? deut. 29. 10 , 11 , 12 , 13. and were not infants engaged to god by the seal of his covenant , [ circumcision ? ] if you say , that this merciful gift of god to infants , and ordinance for their church-membership is repealed , does it not lie on you to prove it ? yet how will you fail herein ; whereas it is easie to prove the contrary ? ( 1. ) if this ordinance and merciful gift be repealed and revoked , whether is it in mercy , or in justice ? whether is it for their good , or for their hurt ? dare you say , that god hath repealed infants church-membership to their hurt , in justice ? did he ever revoke his mercies in justice to the parties hurt , till they first brake covenant with him , and so procured it by their own desert ? now , were there not many jews that believed , and did not forsake the covenant of god ? how then could these or their infants , be put out of the church in justice to their hurt ? or can you say , that it is in mercy for their good ? how can it be a mercy to take away a mercy , except it be to give a greater mercy instead of it ? now , is there any greater mercy given to infants than church-membership ? those infants which were in the church before christ , had they not god engaged in covenant to be their god , and to take them for his peculiar people , deut. 29. 10 , 11 , 12. and those that were aliens to the common-wealth of israel , were they not strangers to the covenant of promise , and without hope , and without god in the world , eph. 2. 12. and is there any scripture that speaketh of delivering any from this sad estate , but church-members ? and when god addeth to the church such as shall be saved , can it be any known way of mercy , to be cast , or put out of the church ? did christ come in tho flesh to put infants out of his church in mercy ? will you say , he could more fitly save them out of his church , than in it ? and if it be no benefit to the catholick church to have infants kept out of heaven , nor any hurt to the church to see them there ; why should it be a benefit to the whole church to have them kept out on earth ? or any hurt to the church to see them members here ? and whatsoever it may be to strangers , yet how can it seem such a mercy to parents , to have their children put out of the church ? why then hath god made such promises to parents for their seed ; as if much of the parents comfort lay in their childrens welfare ? and hath god no mercy for infants ? or can he not shew mercy to the whole church in an easier way , than by casting out all their infants ? what great comfort would follow this conclusion , that all your infants are out of christs visible church ? can you prove , that christ will save those that are no christians ? not so much as visibly or seemingly subjects of his kingdom ? if some priviledges were taken away , as the release of the jews servants , &c. yet are there not far greater given in their stead ? ( 2. ) is it not evident from rom. 11. 17. that only some of the branches were broken off from the church : therefore to the rest that remained in , the gift was not repealed . doth not the apostle say it of that church , whereof infants were members with their parents , that but some were broken off from this church ? ( and how far is the whole church from being dissolved ? ) and who can imagine , that god should cast out the infant , ( that came in for the parents sake ) while the parents remain in the same church ? 3. is it not evident from rom. 11. 20. that none of the jews were broken off but for unbelief ? and consequently , that believers and their seed were not broken off ? will you say , that the apostle speaketh there of the invisible church ? doth he not speak of that church , whereof the jews were natural branches , ( v. 24. ) and was not that the visible church ? and if the breaking off was visible , ( such wherein gods severity was to be beheld by the gentiles , as v. 22. ) was it not from the visible church directly ? could there be a visible breaking off , or removal from an invisible term ? ( 4. ) if it be into their own olive , ( which they were broke off from , and of which they were natural branches ) that the jews shall be re-ingraffed at their recovery ; ( as rom. 11. 24. ) then how is gods ordinance for their infant church-membership repealed ? is not their own olive their own church ? and did not their own church ever contain infants , as members ? as it will , when it is but part of the catholick church ; tho they be not restored to the mosaical law , or covenant of peculiarity : but taken into the catholick church . ( 5. ) is it not the same olive , or church , which the jews were broken off from , that we gentiles are graffed into , as rom. 11. 17 , 19 , 24 ? and if their church admitted infant-members , and ours be the same , must not ours admit of infant-members also ? is it not plain from the text , that the olive , or church it self remained still , only some branches were broken off , and others of the gentiles ingraffed in their stead ? then how is it taken down any further than as to ceremonial accidentals ? ( 6. ) would not christ have gathered jerusalem , ( which is usually put for all judea , and the jewish nation ? ) mat. 23. 37 , 38 , 39. and is it likely that he would have unchurched all their infants , when he would have gathered to him whole jerusalem , or the whole nation ? ( 7. ) can ye suppose the believing jews children ( and so the parents in point of comfort ) to be in a worse condition since christ , than they were before ? did christ come to make believers or their children miserable , or bring them into a worse condition ? and is it not a far worse condition to be out of the visible church , than in it ? hath not christ made larger promises to his church visible , than to any in the world that are not of the church ? what promise is there to others , except the conditional upon their coming in ? 8. if the church of christ be not in a worse state now ( in regard of the childrens happiness , and the parents comfort ) than it was before christs coming , then will it not follow , that our children ought to be admitted church-members , and consequently that ordinance and merciful gift is not repealed ? ( 9. ) if the children of believers now be put out of the church , then are they not in a worse condition than the very children of the gentiles were before the coming of christ ? is it not the express letter of gods law , that any stranger that would come in , might bring his children , and all be circumcised , and admitted members of the jews church ? ( 10. ) was not the covenant , deur . 29. 10 , 11 , 12. ( which all the jews , with all their little ones , were enter'd into with god ) a covenant of grace , ( as distinct from the laws which was repealed ? ) how then is it , or their church-membership grounded on it repealed ? is not that a covenant of grace , wherein god taketh them to be his people , and engageth to be their god ? hath god entred into such a covenant with any since the fall , but in christ , and upon terms of grace ? is not that a covenant of grace , wherein the lord promiseth to circumcise their hearts , and the hearts of their seed , &c. see heb. 10. 16 , 17. and doth not the apostle paul cite those words of faith , rom. 10. 5 , 6 , 7 , 8. out of this very covenant ? compare deut. 30. 11 , 12 , 13 , 14. with the text last cited . ( 11. ) if infants then were entred and engaged church-members , by that circumcision , which was a seal of the rightcousness of faith , and was not given on legal grounds , ( as rom. 4. 11. ) how comes that church-membership of infants to be repealed ? is it any other than a shift , to say , that it was only such a seal of abrahams righteousness of faith ? is not the nature , end , and use of sacraments , or holy engaging signs and seals , the same to all , though the fruit be not alway the same ? ( 12. ) if the law of infants church-membership was no part of the ceremonial , or meerly judicial law , nor yet of the law of works , ( as such ) how can you say , that it is repealed , seeing no other laws are repealed ? will you say , it was part of the law of works , which knows no mercy to those who have once offended ? was not church-membership a mercy ? and if it was part of the ceremonial law , what was it a type of ? what is the antitype that hath succeeded it ? and how could this be part of the meerly judicial law , seeing infants were church-members long before the time of moses , when the jews were formed into a common-wealth , and the judicial laws given them ? and can you say , that this was proper to the jews ? was it given to them only ; that is , only to isaac and his seed , on whom the jewish priviledges were entailed ? were not many hundreds circumcised as church-members ( and among them many infants ) in abrahams family before isaac was born ; and so all the proselites ( with their infants ) afterwards that would come in ? ( 13. ) is it not clear , that there is an universal church visible ? and that every one that is a member of a particular church , is also a member of the universal ? and that the jews infants were members of the universal ? and that this universal church is not dissolved ? now , must not he that will affirm , the whole species of infants are cast out of the universal visible church , prove it well ? and since we find that they were once in it , what need we any more proof , that they remain in , till it can be shewn where it is revoked ? and is it any good consequence , that is fetcht from the removal of a particular church , or of the jews particular church to breaking off from the universal ? if a jew had been forced into a strange country , yet had not both he and his children there been members of the universal church ? ( 14. ) is not that false doctrine , which makes the children of the faithful to be in as bad , or a worse condition , than the curse [ deut. 28. 32 , 41. ] doth make the children of covenant-breakers to be in ? is it not said , ( v. 4. ) that those that keep the covenant are blessed in the fruit of their body ? and of covenant-breakers , ( v. 18. 32 , 41. ) cursed shalt thou be in the fruit of thy body : thy sons and thy daughters shall be given to another people : they shall go into captivity ? ] now , is it not a sorer curse to be put out of the whole visible church of christ , than to go into captivity ? to be in captivity is but a bodily judgment directly , but is it not directly a spiritual judgment to be out of the church ? ( 15. ) doth not the doctrine , which puts infants out of the visible church of christ , leave them in the visible kingdom of the devil ? doth not the world and the church contain all mankind , according to the ordinary scripture-distribution ? if you say , infants may be of the invisible church , is not the visible church wider than the invisible ; that ordinarily we may not judg any to be of the invisible church , who are not of the visible ? ( 16. ) and will you leave us no sound grounded hope of the justification , or salvation of any dying infants in the world ? can we have any true ground of christian hope that they shall be saved , who are not so much as seemingly ( or visibly ) in a state of salvation , and so die ? to judge a thing to be what it doth not any way seem , or appear to be , is it not likely actually , but alway virtually , and interpretatively , a false judgment . and if they that are not of the true church are not in a state of salvation , then will it not follow , that they that seem not to be of that church , do not so much as seem to be in a state of salvation ? ( 17. ) what a full plain text is that , 1 cor. 7. 14. are the children of believers holy in state ? then ought they not to be admitted visible church-members ? are not all divines agreed in the definition of the church , that it is a society of persons separated from the world to god ? will not this text prove children holy , by a stated separation to god ? is not the constant sense of the word [ holy ] a separation to god ? and were not the infants of the faithful church-members , and so holy , before christs time ? and is it not most probable that the apostle speaks of the same kind of holiness , which was the ordinary priviledge of the faithful before ? but utterly improbable that he should speak of no other holiness here but legitimation , ( which is common to the children of pagans ? ) and if to be holy in the apostles sense here , be no more than to be lawfully begotten , then may we not call all persons holy , that are not bastards ? then is not almost all the world holy ? because bastards are called clean , will it therefore follow , that the legitimate may be called holy ? the beasts that chewed the cud , and had cloven feet , were clean , will you therefore say , they were holy ? ( 18. ) when it is said , mark. 10. 14. of such is the kingdom of god , ] whether this be not more , than they may be visible church-members ? and whether these which christ took up in his armes , and blessed , were not members of his visible church ? are any visibly blest without the visible church ? and is it not considerable , that all the three former evangelists make full mention of these passages of christ ? is it not evident , that they were taken for doctrines of moment for the churches information ? and whether those words of christ so plain , and earnest , [ suffer little children to come unto me , and forbid them not ] be not a better plea at judgment for our admitting infants , than any that ever yet you have brought for refusing them ? turn over your bible , and see if you can find where christ or his apostles have said as much against our admitting infants church-members , and then consider , which way is safest . now to the common objections . ( 1. ) if these texts be objected , rom. 9. 8. they that are the children of the flesh , these are not the children of god , but the children of the promise are accounted for the seed , eph. 2. 3. we are by nature the children of wrath. ] to the first text , what is it the apostle mainly drives at , but that men are not therefore saved , because they are abraham's carnal seed , ( and consequently , not because they are the carnal seed of any other ? ) and is it their certain salvation , or their church-membership , that we dispute for ( in regard of individuals ? ) and further , doth the apostle speak one word against the priviledge of those infants , whose parents violated not gods covenant , nor fell away ? if a man should affirm , that all the infants of the faithful ( so dying ) are certainly saved , is there a syllable in the text against him ? were they not aged unbelievers that the apostle excludeth here ? and to eph. 2. 3. what though we are by nature the children of wrath ; doth it follow , that we may not be otherwise by grace ? again , may not children be visible church-members , and yet perhaps children of wrath too ? were not all the children of church-members among both jews and proselites church-members ? and yet were they not children of wrath by nature , as we are ? 2. if you object , that infants are not capable of the ends of baptism : to this , though infants are not capable of every benefit by baptism , as the aged are ; yet are they not capable of the principal ends ? may it not be a listing sign to enter them church-members , and solemnize their dedication to christ , and engage them to be his people , and to take him for their lord and saviour , and so to confer on them remission of sin , and what christ by the covenant promiseth to the baptised ; ( though yet themselves understand not this ; even as we put the names of infants in bonds and leases , which they can neither read nor know of ? ) and may it not be operative by its signification as soon as the child comes to the use of reason , ( which will not be so long as you use to defer baptism ? ) and in the mean time , as his interest is upon the ●●…dition of the parents faith , and as he is received as it were a member of them , so may not the parents have the present actual comfort of it , ( as the parent hath the actual comfort of a lease that assureth an estate to his child ? ) and was not christ himself baptized , when yet he was not capable of many of the great ends of baptism ? was baptism to christ a sign of the washing away of sin , or of purifying his soul , ( which was perfect before , ) or of being buried with christ , &c. and how uncapable were the infants that christ laid his hands on , and took up in his armes , of understanding the meaning of what he did ? shall we therefore say , that christ should have let it alone till afterwards ? and will you tell us , what operation circumcision had on the infants of church-members formerly ? was it not a seal of the righteousness of faith ? and yet , had they any more faith or knowledge of the significancy , than ours have now ? was it not an engaging sign ? and yet , were not they as uncapable of understanding either the significancy , or engagement , as ours are ? so , ( 3. ) if you object , how can an infant covenant with god , or be engaged by this sign ? and where doth god require the parent to engage his children , &c. to this , if only the aged are capable of engagement , may you not thence straitway conclude , that no infant was ever circumcised ? but may not that be the childs action morally , and in law-sence , which is onely the fathers action physically ? when a man puts his childs name in a lease , and binds himself and his heirs , is not the child thus entred into covenant and bond ? and does not the law take it as his act ? and is it not a plain natural duty of parents to covenant for their children , when it is for their good ? and doth not the scripture fully shew , that all the people of israel did ( by gods appointment ) enter their children into the covenant of god ? were they not to circumcise them , which god calleth [ his covenant ] and [ the sign of the covenant ? ] and is it not as plainly spoken , as the mouth of man can speak it , in deut. 29. 10 , 11 , 12 , 13. did not the parents there enter their children into the covenant , and not the infants themselves ? and doth not that shew , god hath given parents their interest and authority ? 4. another common objection is , if infants must be baptized , why may they not as well receive the lords supper ? to which , may not the very external nature of the several sacraments satisfie you ? hath not christ appointed the first to be such , as infants are capable of ? may not they be washed as well as the aged ? but is not the other such as they are , naturally incapable of in their first infancy ? and is not the former instituted plainly for all disciples ? but what scripture saith , that all disciples as such , should presently receive the lords supper ? is it not restrained to those , that can first examine themselves , and can discern the lords body , and keep in remembrance his death ? and if every burgess at age , as such , hath power to trade , &c. in the city ; will it therefore follow , that every infant may do so , that is born a burgess ? ( 5. ) it hath been objected , that if it be the will of christ that infants should be baptized , it is strange , that he hath left it so dark . to which , will you not grant , that all church-members must be admitted by baptism ? is this dark or doubtful ? and how many scriptures are there that prove infants must be admitted church-members ? can we say , the scripture is dark , or sparing in that ? again , the scripture speaks most fully in the controversies , which in those times were agitated : but was it any controversie then , whether infants were to be members of the visible church ? did not the jews take it for unquestionable , all their infants having actual possession , and that upon gods own grant and ordination ? now , if christ would have dispossessed them , should he not somewhere have discovered it ? and would it not have occasioned great disputes and debates ? [ v. epistle to bewdley , p. 5 , 6. ] further , what if it were more obscure than it is ? is not the new testament as silent about christian kings , or any christian magistrates , or about an oath before a magistrate , and about war , and about the prohibited degrees of marriage , and about the sabbath , &c. will you therefore say , these are not revealed ? it it not enough that they are revealed in the old testament ? and was not infants church-membership revealed clearly there ? ( 6. ) another objection is , the evil consequences of infant-baptism , as gross ignorance much occasioned by it , &c. to which , 1. is not the lord jesus himself the occasion of the ruine and damnation of multitudes , ( luk. 2. 34. ) had it been better therefore , the world had been without him ? and is not the gospel to many , the savour of death unto death , and to the jews a stumbling-block , and to the gentiles foolishness ? and must the gospel be blamed for this ? what is it that wicked men will not take hurt by , and make an occasion of their destruction ? and have not many said so about the religious education of children , that it is but the way to make them hypocrites ? point-blank against the will and word of god , deut. 6. 7. prov. 22. 6. and do not many make their belief of the scripture , and believing that christ died and rose again , and that he is the saviour of the world , and the profession of his name , to be the ground of their hopes of salvation , and thousands more , than that trust to their meer baptism ? and what if many amongst you think to be saved , because they are baptized again ? 2. can you shew ( any of you ) what there is in the nature of the thing , that should be hurtful to any ? if a child that cannot read , be entred into the school , that he may learn to read , is there any thing in this that tends to delusion ? if a childs name be put into a lease , is there any thing in this to do him hurt ? 3. was that the reason of the delusion , and gross ignorance of the jews , that they did not stay till they were at age ? shall we thus make god the deluder , and blinder of the jews , and accuse his sacred laws and institutions of errour ? if it was an high favour to them to be entred in infancy into the church and covenant , how comes it to be an hurt or wrong to us now ? 4. was the case of the proselites among the jews ( being entred at age ) so much better than the case of their own children , and of all the jews and their children ? and had the jews , gods own people , less mercy than those that were thus adjoyned to them ? 5. if all should profess their faith in christ before they were entred , how quickly might the multitude learn such a profession , as none of you could reject upon any scripture-ground ? and might it not become customary , formal , and consistent with great ignorance ? and they that will make no conscience of the solemn promise which their parents made in their names , is it likely that they will make ever the more conscience of it , if they had made it first in their own names ; seeing the violation of either will alike forfeit their salvation ? 6. do not ministers indeavour to take men off from such formality and self-delusions ? and let them know , that their meer baptism ( whether in infancy , or at age ) is not sufficient ? 7. what if this were done , that when children come to age , they must all solemnly , in the face of the congregation personally own , and renew their covenant ? why may not this engage them , as well as if they were baptized then ? was every man that was baptized at age in the apostles times , necessarily to profess , that he believed in christ with all his heart , ( which indeed containeth the sum of the covenant ) yet may we not be bound to these disjunctively , ( who by gods law are to be baptized in infancy ) that each duty should be performed , as we are capable of it ? 8. would your way of baptizing be likely to engage men half so solemnly , as such a course ; it being ordinarily in a manner private , and done in such manner , that persons of modesty will be so taken up with shame , that they will be less serious in the business . 9. if god would have infants to be church-members , and so entred by baptism , are not all these objections against god , and a carping at his way ? now ( having enquired about the grounds and proofs , and defence of the church-membership , and baptism of infants , ) next let us see , whether your practice of delaying baptism have as much warrant in gods word . ( 1. ) where do you find one word of precept or example in all the bible for deferring the baptism of the child of any one christian till years of discretion ? should not you bring some scripture for your way , who require such express proof from us ? now can you shew one word of command or example here ? if you cannot , how can you say that yours is the scripture-way ? ( 2. ) is not your way inconsistent with obedience to the rule ? is it not christs rule , that persons shall be baptised without delay , when they are first made disciples ? doth not this appear in the commission , mat. 28. 19 , 20. where christ adjoyneth baptizing immediately to discipling ? and from constant example in scripture , explaining the commission ? where do we find mention of any one person , that was baptized long after being discipled ? and from the end and use of baptism ? is not this the use of baptism , to be the sign of their first covenant with christ , and solemn admission into the church ? then is it not to be used at their first admission ? ( if any reason of necessity or convenience , cause it to be put off a few days ; yet this is not delaying it months and years , ( as you do ) though indeed there is no warrant in scripture for any delay at all , but as necessity may excuse it . ) now , though you yield the use of the sign to them when they come to age , yet what is it but an empty sign , quite beside christs institution , and void of the true end of baptism ? for how can it then be the initiating sign to those that have been long in the church before ? i the children of christians are disciples in their infancy , then how can you that baptise them not till they come to age , ( in so doing ) baptise them when they are first disciples ? and further , suppose this were not proved , that infants are disciples , yet if you cannot know when such children are first discipled ( except it be in their infancy ) how can you baptise them when they are first discipled ? taking discipleship at present in your own sense , and setting aside the consideration of meer relative infant-discipleship , how can you know it , since god useth to work such as are born and brought up of christian parents to the acknowledgment of christ by such insensible degrees , that the beginning of their true acknowledgment is ordinarily unperceivable ? again , seeing such do not usually know themselves when they were first disciples ( in this sense ) how much less can others know it ? ( 3. ) would not this practice ( of yours ) necessarily fill the church with perpetual contentions , as being about a matter , that cannot be determined by any known rule ? and can that be according to the mind and will of christ ? if the gospel occasioneth contentions , doth it any more than occasion them ? but would not this naturally , and necessarily produce them ? and that in the churches , and amongst the best ministers and christians ? when would the churches or ministers ever agree upon it , when their understanding , or seeming seriousness is arrived at that degree , which must satisfie ? whereas it is easily known to all , and can be no controversie , when a man begins to profess himself a disciple , who was before a pagan ; yet when one is born in the bosome of the church , and brought up in the profession of christianity , and so comes to it by insensible degrees , is not the case far different ? ( 4. ) when you pretend to ground your practice on mat. 28. 19 , 20. from whence you would infer , that none are to be baptised , but those that are first made disciples by teaching , ( though the truth is , that indirectly , and remotely , the discipling of the parent , is a discipling of his seed also ) would not your doctrine turn baptism , ( for the most part ) out of the churches of the saints ? according to you , only they that are made disciples by ministerial teaching directly , should by this rule be baptized , and in a well-ordered godly church would not these be few , or none ? taking [ disciple ] in your sense for a professor of christianity , hath not god appointed another primary , more ordinary way of making disciples of the children of the godly , viz. godly education ? hath not god commanded the use of this means to all parents , that they teach them the law of god , and bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the lord from their childhood ? and may we not conclude , that god appoints no means to be used , from which he will ordinarily withdraw his grace , or to which he will deny his blessing , if it be used aright ? ( though the word convert many that have neglected their parents , or have been neglected by them . ) and further , doth not experience confirm it , that god frequently blesseth this means ? now , according to you , how many thousands are there that should never be baptized , because they were not first made disciples by teaching , according to the sense of mat. 28. 19. which is ministerial teaching ? ( 5 ) your ordinary practice of baptizing by dipping over head in cold water , ( which you use as necessary ) is it not a breach of the sixt commandment , thou shalt not kill . being ordinarily and generally used , doth it not tend directly to overthrow peoples health and lives ? how vain is it to say , that many are appointed the use of bathing , as a remedy against diseases ? is it an universal remedy ? yea , how few diseases have cold baths appointed them ? and how many that have been tenderly brought up , and take but little of the cold air , that dipping in cold weather in cold water in the course of nature would kill , either presently , or by casting them into some chronical disease ? will you say , if it be gods way , he will prevent the danger , how great soever ? but hath god appointed any ordinance contradictory to his great moral commands ? hath he appointed any ordinance in his church , which will destroy men , except they be preserved by miracle ? will you say , he hath tied himself to a constant working of miracles , ( which he hath not done , except the doctrine of transubstantiation be true ? ) may we tempt god ? and have you duly considered what our saviour saith , mat. 12. 7. if you had learned what this meaneth , i will have mercy , and not sacrifice , ye would not have condemned the guiltless ? — if in case of danger , you should have , and allow of a warm bath , should not you that are wont to call for express scripture for infant-baptism , be required to bring express scripture for this warm bath ? — if you say , they may stay till the heat of summer , where have you any scripture for that ? farther , is it yet proved by any of you , that dipping was constantly used in the scripture-times . is it plain , or so much as probable , that the jaylor was dipt over head , who was baptized in the night in his house ? and does not the greek word signifie to wash , as well as to dip ? is it not so taken , when applied to other things , as mar. 7. 4 , 8 , &c. and is not the thing signified set forth by the phrase of washing or sprinkling ? and need the sign exceed the thing signified ? ( see isa . 44. 3. ezek. 36. 25. joel 2. 28. 1 cor. 6. 11. tit. 3. 5. heb. 10. 22. and 12. 24. 1 pet. 1. 2. ) and if it was otherwise , might it not be only occasional , from a reason proper to those hot countries ? where hath christ appointed the measure of water , or the manner of washing , any more than he hath appointed in the lords supper what quantity of bread and wine each must take ? may not a little signifie as well as much ; as a clod of earth doth in giving possession of much lands , &c. ( 6. ) is it not a breach of the seventh commandment , [ thou shalt not commit adultery ] to dip persons naked , or next to naked ? doth not the seventh commandment forbid all incitements to uncleanness , and all immodest actions ? and is it not such , to baptize women naked , or next to naked ? can that practice be of god , which would turn gods worship into contempt , and make it ridiculous , and bring a general reproach upon the christian profession among all the enemies of it , yea , among the most sober and discreet , and that upon so probable grounds ? and to dip persons cloathed , will it not overthrow the argument usually brought for the necessity of washing the whole body ? though the garment be washed , yet may it not hinder the washing of some parts of the body ? ( 7. ) ( what fruit of these things ? ) how many of you , that instead of labouring after the winning of souls from sin to god , make it the main scope of your endeavours in publick and private , to propagate your opinions ? how many of you make a great stir , till you have brought poor souls ( which is too easily done ) to place their religion , in being of your opinion here , and being re-baptized ? how many of you are great hinderers of the gospel , and of the work of converting souls , making it your business to bring the ministers of the gospel into contempt ? whether may not this be one thing that greatly confirmeth men in their enmity to the doctrine of the gospel , and the preachers thereof , when they hear those despise the ministry , that once were constant hearors ? yea , hear them perswading people , that ministers are seducers , false prophets , &c. ( as if the first thing they had to learn , was to sco●n their teachers . ) what way could be found out more effectual to make people disregard and despise the gospel , and so to ruin their own souls , than thus to teach them to vilifie the messengers of the gospel , and perswade them that it is a vertue to reproach and forsake their guides ? and whether the most of you do well , that have made your doctrine a ground of separation ? and that perswade people , that it is a sin to hear our pretended ministers , ( as they have been called ) because they were never baptized ? if you can make them believe , that the ministers are seducers , and that it is a sin to hear them , what good are they likely to receive by that ministry ? and what a case was the land in , if all did believe , as some of you teach ? and where the gospel before prospered , and christians spent their time and conference in the edifying of each others souls , and in heavenly duties , and lived together in unity and love , ( according to the great command of christ ) have not many of you ( when you have come ) turned this to vain janglings , and unprofitable disputes , and turned their unity into factions and divisions , and their amity into jealousies and contentions ? yea , how many a distracted family is there in england ( upon this account ) where one will pray , and the other will not pray with him , because he is unbaptized , who were wont to worship god in unity ? and here i would have ended . only there are two or three queries more which offer themselves , that i commend to your serious consideration . q. 1. whether it be at all credible that satan would be so charitable to believers infants , as to plead for their priviledges ; or would be a propagater of christs kingdom , and forward to engage and bring in subjects and disciples to him ? q. 2. whereas we tell sinners of the hainous aggravation of their sins , as being committed after baptism , and after their solemn vow and covenant made to god ; whether you that make infant-baptism a nullity , dare undertake to bear the burthen of this aggravation for them ? and whether you may tell sinners ( that we do but serve them , as some serve foolish children , fright them with bug-bears ) that there is no such matter , they were never baptized , and therefore never sinned against their baptism : they were never so engaged to god , and therefore never sinned against that engagement ? will you warrant them , that they never need to repent for their sinning against their baptism , and the covenant then made ? or will you bear the blame for them ? q. 3. whether it should not lie heavy on any tender conscience to add to gods word , holding the repeal of the ordinance of infants church-membership , which no scripture affirmeth ; to be guilty of the churches doleful divisions , and the great grief that hereby oppresseth the hearts of so many of gods people ; to censure ( if not unchurch ) all the churches of christ since the apostles times , or almost all — ? and all this in contending , that your own children are out of christs visible church ? how doleful is it , that any christians should be so zealous to dispute their own children out of christs church ; and to plead that they have no right to be admitted members , that they are no disciples of christ , no christians ? and whether they that are zealous in solliciting men not to engage their children in covenant with god , may not have as many thanks from christ , as the disciples had for keeping such from him ? finis . books printed for , and are to be sold by tho. parkhurst at the bible and three crowns in cheapside . sermons on the whole epistle of saint paul to the colossians , by mr. i. daille , translated into english by f. s. with dr. thomas goodwins , and dr. john owens epistles recommendatory . an exposition of christs temptation on matth. 4. and peters sermon to cornelius , and circumspect walking . by dr. tho. taylor . books 4 to . the door of salvation opened by the key of regeneration , by george swinnock , m. a. an antidote against quakerism , by steph. scandret . an exposition on the five first chapters of ezekiel , with useful observations thereupon , by william greenhil . the gospel-covenant opened , by peter bulkley . gods holy-mind touching matters moral , which he uttered in ten commandments : also , an exposition on the lords prayer , by edward eston , b. d. the fiery jesuit , or an historical-collection of the rise , encrease , doctrines and deeds of the jesuits . horologiographia optica , dyaling , universal and particular , speculative and practical ; together with a description of the court of arts , by a new method , by silvanus morgan . the practical divinity of the papist discovered to be destructive to true religion , and mens souls , by j. clarkson . the creatures goodness , as they came out of gods hand , and the good mans mercy to the bruit-creatures , in two sermons , by tho. hodges , b. d. certain considerations tending to promote peace and unity amongst protestants . mediocria , or the most plain and natural apprehensions which the scripture offers , concerning the great doctrines of the christian religion : of election , redemption , the covenant , the law and gospel , and perfection . the morning-lectures against popery , or the principal errours of the church of rome detected and confuted in a morning-lecture ; preached by several ministers of the gospel in or near london . four useful discourses : ( 1. ) the art of improving a full and prosperous condition for the glory of god ; being an 〈…〉 the art of contentment , in three sermons , on philip. 4. 12. ( 2. ) christian submission , on 1 sam. 3. 18. ( 3. ) christ a christians life and death is gain , on philip. 1. 21. ( 4. ) the gospel of peace sent to the sons of peace , in six sermons , on luke 10. 5 , 6. by jeremiah burroughs . a new copy-book of all sorts of useful hands . the saints priviledge by dying , by mr. soot . the unity and essence of the catholick church-visible , by mr. hudson . the intercourse of divine love between christ and the church , or the particular believing soul : in several lectures on the whole second chapter of cant. by john collins , d. d. large 8 vo . heart-treasure : or a treatise tending to fill and furnish the head and heart of every christian with soul enriching treasure of truths , graces , experiences , and comforts . the sure mercies of david ; or a second part of heart-treasure , by oliver heywood . heaven or hell here in a good or bad conscience , by nath. vincent . aesop's fables , with morals thereupon in english-verse . the young-mans instructor , and the old-mans remembrancer ; being an explanation of the assemblies catechism . captives bound in chains , made free by christ their surety ; both by tho. doolittle . eighteen sermons preached upon several texts of scripture , by william whitaker . sin the plague of plagues , or sinful sin the worst of evils ; by ralph venning , m. a. speculum sherlockianum , or a looking-glass in which the admirers of mr. sherlock may behold the man , as to his acuracy , judgment , orthodoxy . small 8 vo . a defence against the fear of death ; by zach. crofton . gods soveraignty displayed ; by w. gearing . the godly mans ark , or a city of refuge in the day of his distress , in five sermons ; with mr. moors evidences for heaven ; by ed. calamy . the almost-christian discovered , or the false-professor tried and cast , by m. mead. in small 12 s. the duty of parents towards their children . a little book for little children . a method and instruction for the art of divine meditation . all three by tho. white . the prisoners prayers . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a26961-e190 * in your title page you say , fifty queries gathered out of the works of mr. rich. baxter . * in serm. on 1 cor. 12. 1. p. 95. to which see something in my treatise of the covenants p 430 , &c. and more in mr. whistons priv. doct. of bapt. some queries out of mr. baxters plain scripture-proof for infant-baptism . v. p. 3. v. p. 4. v. p. 5. v. p. 6. v. p. 125. v. p. 2. v. p. 6. v. p. 7. v. p. 8. v. p. 9 , 10. v. p. 244. v. p. 11. v. p. 12. v. p. 15. v. p. 14. v. p. 15 v. p. 16. v. p. 18. v. p. 19. v. p. 20. v. p. 21. v. p. 22. v. p. 23. v. p. 24. v. p. 26. v. p. 27. v. p. 38. v. p. 99. v. p. 40. v. p. 42. ( v. epistle to bewdly , p. 7. ) v. p. 43. v. p. 44. v. p. 45. v. p. 46. v. p. 48. v. p. 49. v. p. 50. v. p. 51. v. p. 52. v. p. 53. v. p. 55. v. p. 56. v. p. 57. v. p. 251. v. p. 58. v. p. 59. v. p. 60. v. p. 61. v. p. 70. v. p. 71. v. p. 72. v. p. 74. v. p. 82. v. p. 83. v. p. 84. v. p. 105. v. p. 106. epistle to bewdley pag. 7. v. p. 110. v. p. iii. v. preface . p. 2 , 3. v. p. iii. v. p. 112. v. p. 253. v. p. 178 , 179. v. p. 113. v. p. 250. v. p. 115. v. p. 243. v. p. 115. v. p. 116. v. p. 117. v. p. 117 , 118. v. p. 118. v. p. 119. v. p. 124. v. p. 125. v. p. 126. v. p. 127. v. p. 341. v. p. 128. v. p. 130. v. p. 131. v. p. 132. v. p. 290. v. p. 133. v. p. 134. v. p. 136. v. p. 135. v. p. 136. v. p. 137. v. p. 138. v. p. 144. v. p. 146. v. p. 144. v. p. 145. v. p. 146. v. p. 149. v. p. 177. v. p. 174. v. p. 160. v. p. 161. v. p. 177. a vindication of that part of spira's despair revived which is challenged by the anabaptists, and shamefully callumniated by john wells, a baptist preacher : wherein also some things are handled relating to infant baptism and dipping in baptism : particularly it is evinced that dipping is not essential to the sacrament of baptism / by thomas james, author of spira's despair revived. james, thomas. 1695 approx. 99 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 21 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2007-10 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a46634 wing j437 estc r32366 12648054 ocm 12648054 65213 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a46634) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 65213) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1528:24) a vindication of that part of spira's despair revived which is challenged by the anabaptists, and shamefully callumniated by john wells, a baptist preacher : wherein also some things are handled relating to infant baptism and dipping in baptism : particularly it is evinced that dipping is not essential to the sacrament of baptism / by thomas james, author of spira's despair revived. james, thomas. james, thomas. spira's despair revived. 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ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng anabaptists -england -controversial literature. infant baptism. 2005-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-11 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2006-09 taryn hakala sampled and proofread 2006-09 taryn hakala text and markup reviewed and edited 2007-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a vindication of that part of spira's despair revived which is challenged by the anabaptists and shamefully callumniated by john wells , a baptist preacher . wherein also some things are handled relating to infant baptism , and dipping in baptism , particularly it is evinced , that dipping is not essential to the sacrament of baptism . by thomas james , author of spira's despair revived london : printed for john lawrence , at the angel in the poultrey , 1695. to those inhabitants of ashford and the adjacent parishes , who attend upon my ministry . beloved christians ; the dedication of these few sheets of my vindicatio● is due to you ; and it would be a crime to prefix any ●ther name or names : you are concerned with me in th● matters here spoken to ; and your concern is little le●● than that of my own ; yea upon some accounts it is evident●● greater : you have also some knowledge of these things ; yea som● of you do know the truth of what i write , to your exceedin● great grief and sorrow . this neighbourhood hath of a long tim● been the seat of many anabaptists ; and the stirs they have mad● have not been small ; witness that disputation held in the paris● church july 27. 1649. between fisher and several ministers , b●fore some thousands of hearers ( about three thousand , as th● printed relation telleth us it was guessed ) and a late one b●tween them and my predecessour ; and they have not come short 〈◊〉 my time , having urged me to the same , though i have answere● them only with contempt of their challenge . the reflection i made touching their troubling weak and unst●ble souls , and their practices of this kind , are matters well know● to many of you : every day discovers how restless they are 〈◊〉 turn some or other of you away from the faith you profess , an● to make you renounce your first baptism . vpon these account 〈◊〉 judge it a part of my ministry , which i have received in th● lord , to watch over you , and to preserve you from those seducer● and if i should not take all occasions to warn , to exhort , and i●struct you , i am afraid i should not fulfil the same . beware of ●hem therefore , and be not terrified and dismay'd at their bold and desperate speeches , cavilling at , and condemning infant-bap●ism as a new doctrine , a scriptureless thing , as antichristian ; which yet was practised many hundred of years before the name of anabaptists , or baptists ( being taken for a society of people opposing infant baptism ) was ever known in the world , and long before the man of sin was ever revealed . but why should ●ou be afraid to have your children baptized , when christ shewed his love to those lambs , by taking them in his arms and blessing them ; and the holy ghost makes no difference be●ween them and the oldest disciples , calling them holy , and saying , the promises equally belong to them ; and god to where in all his word forbids you to dedicate them in baptism , or refuseth them ? let them shew you that scripture , if they can , which forbids children to be baptized . what , hath god less love for your children than for those of his old people the jews ? is his mercy clean gone from our ●hildren ? is he not the god of the christians also ? yes ve●ily the same god in covenant ; for he is a god keeping cove●ant and mercy with his people ; whose people we are if we be●ieve on jesus christ his son ; and we are children of abra●am , to whom circumcision was given as a seal of the covenant ●od made with him and his seed ; to which baptism now answers ; christ changing the two old sacraments , circumcision and the passo●er , into baptism and the lord's supper , the subjects of them ●ho were to receive spiritual benefit and priviledge thereby ●eing still the same . many things i know they have written to ●isprove this ; but i seriously profess , that their distinctions and ●ub distinctions about circumcision being a seal to abraham , and ●ot to his seed ; the two covenants god made with him , & c. ●●re so handled by them in some of their books scattered among us , ●hat i can hardly understand them , and wonder how they could render ●●ich plain matters so intricate . but until they can shew you ●ow god makes a difference between children under the law and the gospel , taking theirs in , and leaving ours out , why should yo● keep your children back from the priviledge of so blessed a sacrament , or seek a new baptism for your selves ? as for the point of dipping , can you , dare you lay the stress of the efficacy of a sacrament wholly upon the quantity of water , as though the application of more , or in another way than sprinkling or pouring● could profit you so exceedingly ? or , must you needs be adult , and profess yo● faith , as though the vertue of the sacrament did wholly consist in what you do , and nothing in the grace of god 〈◊〉 cannot god bless his own ordinance to infants ? beware , i be●seech you , least you should provoke god , by limiting him after thi● manner , and scandalize your brethren , and all the reformed churches of christ , even the purest of them ( as that of the wa●denses , now commonly called vaudois , who were never tainte● with any corruption of antichrist , but certainly the most pur● and apostolical in the world ) who baptize infants , and generall● apply the element of baptism some other way than by dipping as by pouring it on , sprinkling , &c. but , i pray , what do yo● see in these men that you should think the word of god came only to them ? what power and demonstration of the spirit is ther● in their preaching ? what holiness and exemplariness in the●● lives more than others , to convince you that they are the peop●● of god above others ? i do not go about to set you against their persons , or societies , and therefore say nothing that may tend to the●● reproach , but i am shewing you how vain it is to believe eve●● word they say , to prevent your being insnared by their confident boasting of things they are never able to prove . let me speak 〈◊〉 some of you in the words of the apostle ; be no more childre● tossed to and fro , and carried about with every wind of doctrin● by the● slight of men , and cunning craftiness , whereby the he in wait to deceive : and i do earnestly exhort you all , to a●tend to that gospel precept , if it be possible , as much as ●●th 〈◊〉 you , live peaceably with all men ; live peaceably even wi●● these men ; as they are neighbours live in love ; let not the● questions and strivings about matters of this or any other natu●● imbitter your spirits , and provoke you to speak unadvisedly , much less to be guilty of any misbehaviour in your actions ; rather pity them , and pray for them : they are their own enemies-many ways , especially their childrens , whom they debarr of many blessed priviledges ; therefore pray for them , and be at peace with them : the strange divisions of the land of our nativity is a sorrowful consideration to all that fear god , and are by no means unnecessarily to be widened : i could upon this account be content most gladly to be silent ; but my own defence , and your security , will excuse my vndertaking : but truly i had rather appear among you in the pulpit than in print ; and had rather speak five words to edification than ten thousand in a way of endless controversie . as for you , my brethren , believe the promises , observe the institutions , and obey the words and commandments of our lord jesus christ , and keep your selves pure , that none may be able to speak evil of you , or to reproach your good conversation ; this will give you peace , and end in your everlasting happiness . for this i make my prayers to god for you ; as also that he would stablish , strengthen , settle you ; hoping to approve my self a faithful minister of christ unto you in all things , desiring and endeavouring your eternal salvation , as i am your friend and servant in the work of the ministry , thomas james . from my study , june 25 , 1695. a vindication , &c. on may 21. i received a letter with a printed book inclosed , being entituled , a reply to that part of spira's despair revived , in which the baptists in general are concerned ; but more especially those at ashford in kent . &c. upon reading of the same , i find it such as may , if unanswer'd , turn to my great disgrace and contempt ; yea , and not only so , but it may be a means to invalidate that evidence which i have brought in that spira revived for the truths of the blessed gospel , witnessing against the atheistical principles of this age : and yet further , this shameful reply ( for so it shall quickly be detected ) is dedicated to the honourable lord wharton , seeking patronage from so great and worthy a person , and so abusing of his name . these things have such weight with them , besides what else i shall offer toward the conclusion , that though some are for my silence altogether ( it being hardly worth while to answer such ignorant and clamorous persons , my own integrity , through the grace of god , being well known , and no ways obnoxious to their slanders , being not likely , i mean , to suffer any dimution in my credit and reputation here upon ) yet i cannot forbear , being so nearly concerned , and especially for the truth 's sake , to write a few lines , and publish a short answer in order to so just and necessary a vindication . now , that i may not be tedious , being indeed under a temptation thereto , writing in so just a cause , in defence of the truth and my credit , which are exposed in a shameful manner by that reply , i will confine my pen with in these narrow bounds , to write but of three things ; one concerning the person who makes the reply , and the manner of it ; th●● next concerning the charge which is brought against what i formerly published in that spira , so far as it respected the anabaptists which consists of two parts ; one concerning the poor melancholy distracted man , r. m. and his tragical end ; which gave me occasion to reflect on the anabaptists , as those that did him some wrong , troubling him with their notions about the necessity of rebap●●zation ( or being dipped ) which prov'd injurious to him in his weakness and strange confusion of mind : the other concerning what i have written of their practising the like upon many others in much like cases , troubling the weak and unsetled christians , eagerly urging them to be dipt , and , as i said , making it a salve for every sore . in doing this i will consider the most material passages in that piece , laying open the ignorance and injustice of the publisher , the several slanders , falshoods , and such other things as make it appear to the world , that what i wrote of the anabaptists , so far as i had knowledge of them , was true and sincere ; and that their reply is a mere slander , and bold and impudent denial and contradiction ; whereas they have nothing to object in truth and sobriety . the first thing which i consider , and is very material , is the person who makes the reply , and goes about to lay grievous matters to my charge , as though i had wickedly forged all i have written against the anabaptists . in the conclusion ( p. 23. ) he writes thus of himself and the matter : sir , i am a stranger to you , n. b. and to the whole matter , any otherwise than as i meet it in your book ( and some friends ●ear you gives some account ) which hath loaded us with a greater weight ●han is fit to be born . now surely this is a strange thing , and most unrighteous , unjust , and , it may be , unparalell'd , for a person who owns himself a perfect stranger to me ( as indeed he was , and is ) upon the reporting a matter to him , to write and print at ●his rate against me . what , a stranger to the whole matter , and yet to print at this confident rate , aspersing , and slandring me for what i have written ; and yet he knows not but it may be all true ; as indeed it is , and will be made appear ? but mr. wells , ( for i think he that is a preacher , and is entrusted to print on the behalf of his brethren , may deserve this title ; though what he is , or his quality or calling i know not ) was told what i had written was all false ; and of this some friends gave him an account : what then , is mr. wells's pen become mercenary ? and will he be a champion for his friends , right or wrong , though perchance he fight against the truth ? how is it otherwise than so , seeing he knew not the contrary , never hearing but one side ? but surely charity should have believed better , and ●oped better of a man of whom he knew nothing ; and i have reason to think that no crime was laid to my charge by his friends ( and mine adversaries ) save only , i charged them thus and thus ; and i cannot else imagine how he comes to give me that honest title of worthy sir. strange , that he should print against me , and declare peremptorily to the world , that i was guilty of all the evil he says of me , and not first vouchsafe to send a few lines , and enquire whether i could make any defence for my self , or had any thing to say before he pass'd sentence , and openly condemn'd me : what , did he think i had nothing indeed to say , not one word ; no evidences to be produced , nor any proofs of what i had alledged ? that good old sentence , audi alteram partem , which was ever esteemed so necessary a rule in judgment , is quite laid aside , and not at all regarded ; it seems mr. wells never thought of it , and , to speak the truth , i vehemently suspect he never knew it . should a judge sentence a man upon report only of his accusers , never examining him , nor hearing what he had to say for himself , it would , no doubt , be construed the greatest piece of injustice and cruelty : such as that of king james the first ; who coming out of scotland to london to take the crown of england , first discover'd his disposition to arbitrary government , saith my author at newark ; for being told that one had cut a purse in newark , the king , without any legal process , or the defence of the party , signed a warrant to the sheriff of lincolnshire to hang him , which was executed accordingly : and this , saith he , was a blot in the scutcheon of king james the first . the romans were so just as never to put any man to death in this manner . this is indeed against the very light of nature , to judge and condemn upon meer reports , without hearing the other side . not only life , but a good name are too precious to be cast away at this rate . one would think that mr. well 's never went to a latin school , or was read in such authors , or how could he but have called to mind that golden sentence of seneca , qui statuit aliquid parte inaudita altera , aequam licet statuerit , haud aequus fuerit ? had his sentence been just , yet without hearing first what i had to say for my self , it had been unjust from him . but still they were some friends gave him this account . were his friends therefore infallible ? could they not possibly misinform him ? what an implicite faith was this ? how just like the proceedings of the spanish inquisition ? the tribunal erected de propaganda fide ! wherein the accusers are examined in secret ; and the poor prisoner is a stranger to all that passeth , till they begin to thunder against him , and proceed to torture , and sentence , and execution . but might not these men , my accusers to mr. wells , after so many months running to and fro , and stirring in the matter , at last give in some false evidence ? i am sure they did , and that notoriously , as i will evince by and by ; and i will perswade my self , having so much charity for him , that mr. wells will own it . had but the letter he had sent me with his book , been sent but some months before , his pains and trouble might have been spared , and his credit saved ; whereas now , he hath brought himself into a snare , to gratifie his friends , who impos'd upon his credulity , so that he prints gross falsehoods , never seeking to clear the matters to himself , before he set pen to paper . how vain was it for him to write thus to me in his private letter ; worthy sir , it s very unpleasant to me to be troublesome to any , but i cannot well avoid giving you the trouble of these lines . alas ! the trouble of reading a letter is not much ; but surely it would trouble any christian to be thus slandered in print ; especially when writing a few lines a little sooner , and taking that small trouble , might have prevented so great calumnies : what was this but to shoot secretly at me , and also to wound me openly , and then to desire me not to be troubled , because he is so kind to tell me what he hath done ? like those rude persons , who cry , by your leave , sir , when they have first shewed you some incivility , or done a man some diskindness . but then he desires me not to take unkindly what he hath printed ; for , saith he , i have been as tender of you as the matter will bear ; but if you suppose ▪ me to be mistaken , assign wherein , and i shall , god , willing , labour to give you satisfaction , &c. great tenderness indeed ! and a wonderful care not to grieve me with what was printed : but wherein doth it appear ? resolved , it seems , he was , or his friends rather ( for he saith in his reply , p. last , he was sure he did it unwillingly ) or both were so resolv'd and eager to expose me in print . but what satisfaction shall i now have ? will mr. wells confess his fault as publickly , and declare himself in an errour ? yea , that he hath wronged an innocent person , and a stranger ? that he hath traduced me in a very shameful manner ? that he hath acted most unadvisedly , hand , over head , as we say ) and very unchristianly , not seeking out the truth , as he ought , and easily might , before he past sentence , and condemned me openly ? truly , at the first of my books coming forth , and the noise and speeches of the anabaptists about me , threatning grievously , i did expect something in print ( for what do they not dare to do of this nature , yea and delight in it also ? ) but when it had lain by so many months , i was a little surprized to find it done ; but especially to be managed by a stranger , whose name i know not , i ever heard before , i read it in his letters ; nay , i find , by their own confession , he is a stranger to those very men ( some at least , by the confession of one of them to me ) who set him on work ( i. e ) him , or any body else could be procured . if my neighbours could not write themselves ( and yet three of them are teachers , and one hath been offering at it , scribling out many sheets in the point of controversie ) nor find a man nearer than london , yet surely he should have considered better with himself , and not have been so hardy , as to have written in a case wherein he knew not one thing or other ; not the person accused , nor what defence he could make , and how he could justifie himself , and make good his charge , only being informed by those whose interest it was to blast what i had written . when the apostle paul had heard of the disorders in the church of corinth , how doth he write to them about it 〈…〉 why thus ; when ye come together in the church , i hear that there b● divisions among you ; and i partly believe it : he partly believed what he only heard by report ; but mr. wells roundly takes up the matter reported to him by his friends against me , and believes every word which the wise man brands for simplicity : the simple , saith he , believes every word . ah! mr. wells , had you acted mor● charitably , and cautiously , you had not discover'd your self so fa 〈…〉 nor done me this wrong ; your folly had not been manifested nor had i suffered so much as this groundless suspicion of evil doing , which you prompt the world to , as you have represented m● ▪ but i hope mr. wells will pardon me that i bear so hard upon him for my vindication doth not a little depend upon it , though yet have clear proofs to produce also . it was not only folly and injustice in mr. wells to do thus ; but it may be a sufficient argumen● to the world , that what he hath written against me is of n● value ; for they were my adversaries who gave him instruction● ( surely it was so , and he did not write of himself ) and he prin● only upon hear-say from such as bestirr'd themselves to throw o●● the charge was laid against them . but now if mr. wells thin● or pretend that i have done him wrong in all this , as though he ha● only written to enquire into the truth , as he saith in his preface ▪ his great end is to find out the offenders , and that this is his great enquiry , let him know that therein he doth abuse his readers , and suggest falsehoods in so saying : for his very title confutes him ; it is this ? a brief reply , &c. wherein the unjust charge of mr. thomas james against them ( i. e. the baptists ) is removed : n. b. is removed : what doth this imply , but that he hath clear'd the matter fully ? proved his party innocent ; convincing me of falshood in all i have written ; making me a slanderer , a lyar , and what not ? but more fully yet , after the preface to the reader , in the title again , a brief reply , &c. wherein he hath falsely charged them , n. b. as will appear in the following discourse . i pray in what page or line is this appearance found ? where are the proofs ? is there any thing shewed , but only confidently said , and a gainsaying of what i had written ? let impartial readers judge if mr. wells's book do not center in this , and all he brings be only a contradicting the matters i published , and averring that i wrote not a word of truth . if his title had run after this manner , ( and he had kept to it ) a challenge to mr. j. to prove what he hath printed against the anabaptists about ashford , it had been tolerable ; but to talk of making all appear , is like the rest of his piece . thus he stumbles in the threshold , and that is very ominous for him ; for he falls worse and worse ever after ( beginning with a very foul lye , as i shall shew by and by , and ending with a passage that overthrows all he writes . ) just so it is with his dealing with the text of scripture ; a text in the very next place , which he ●ets before the main work ( i hope he handles his texts to more purpose before his congregation , ) prov. 18. 17. he that is first in his own cause , seemeth just ; but his neighbour cometh and search●th him . a mighty search ! and because my neighbours gave him ●ome account , very pat to the case in hand no doubt : but for the ●earch , if mr. wells had come to ashford , he might have searched ●ut somewhat , enough i am sure to have stopp'd his hand ; but ●o search this matter at london was ridiculous . he search'd , it ●eems , with his friend's eyes , and ears ; and so he finds just as ●uch as they of the matter , ( i. e. ) whatever they would have . what , a stranger to the whole matter , and yet search it out ! for ●ame , mr. wells write to be believed ; i thought hearing a re●ort was not searching : at this rate we may search out many things 〈◊〉 these times of war , with a great deal of ease , what is done in ●landers , france , spain , turkey , and where not ? but if you trust reports , you may be miserably deceived , though the news be told as confidently as your friends could tell you this matter : one cries victory , and makes bonfires , and sings te deum ; and yet it may be comes off with the loss : another saith nothing was done ; and it may be it was a great action : i think when we search to know the truth , we do more than hear what parties in the case say , and interested persons say of it : not that i think it is impossible to know the truth by one party , and examining witnesses on one side ; but when life or credit are at stake , it is highly unjust to go this way , to believe all that is said , and then boldly tell the world in print , i have searched out the whole matter , and he is a slanderer , &c. there is one thing further concerning mr. wells's carriage , which i observe , and then dismiss this head ( sc . ) how unchristianly , how uncharitably he carried it . why should he , being a stranger to me , and the whole matter , believe his ashford friends against me altogether , when he saw my design in writing that little piece was good ; and that wherein i reflected on their carriage , it was done so candidly , as though i were unwilling to say what i said out of a respect to them ? let the reader consider it , if i did not write candidly , and express'd the matter with moderation . these are the words i began the reflection with ; 't is beside my purpose to make reflections upon persons of any opinion or persuasion in religion , besides atheists , who are its avowed enemies . the anabaptists ( or baptists , as they rather chuse to call themselves ) are men to whom i bear no such grudge , or envy , as to bring up any evil report upon them , as a calumny or unjust accusation : god forbid , that while i am writing for christianity , i should act so contrary to one of its principles , as to do thus : they are christians , and will , i doubt not , espouse this cause of our lord with my self ; and there are some of them my worthy good friends , pious , judicious persons ; but this i must publish upon this sad occasion ; and i pray god the guilty would consider it , &c. if this were not courteous , candid , charitable , what is ? yea , mr. wells doth own it sometimes , though he forgets what he writ at other times ; for he calls it flattery , and a meer pretence , p. 16 , 17. which shews what he could not but think of it , that it was very fair , only he judges my heart , and acts uncharitably , rendring me evil for good : for i seriously protest , i wrote this out of good will , and not fawningly . but because this is the proper place , i cannot but take notice of his ignorance also , in quarrelling , and thinking to fasten a reproach upon me for pretending christian friendship to the anabaptists , and stiling them my pious and judicious friends , and yet at the same time publishing such matters against them ; this he observes , p. 16 , 17. once and again . now this , i say , is gross ignorance in mr. wells , or worse , that he could not , or would not distinguish and see the difference i made between some and others of the anabaptists , between the innocent and guilty , and those who were my friends and others . i said plainly thus , they are christians , &c. and then i declare of some of them thus ; and there are some of them my worthy good friends , pious , and judicious persons then ; and i pray god the guilty would consider it : now all this he jumbles together , and makes all the anabaptists my worthy , pious , and judicious friends ; and then wonders that i dealt so by them , as to accuse them thus ; and is not this tragical , saith he , to cut the throat of your friends reputation ? but surely mr. wells is no logician , or the meanest ever known , who cannot distinguish , nor perceive a difference in so plain a case , not to apprehend that some hath others for its opposite ; yea , that some imports a few out of many in such sentences as these : but whether he knew it or no , he hath hapned upon an unlucky fallacy in logick ( which is his natural logick it seems , and i would not have him proud of it ) to compound what should be divided , to huddle all together , and so to impose a wrong sense ; whereas it is true taken distinctly and apart as it ●ought : and what is more common than to speak of a multitude , and not to mean every individual of them . what will he think of st. paul when he affirmed that to be true of the cretians , which one of their own poets had written of them : the cretians are always lyars , evil beasts , slow bellies ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . epimenides . ) this witness is true , saith he . what , every man , woman and child in crete lyars , beastly , and slothful , pagans and christians too ? no sure , but it was vitium gentis , an epidemical evil , a fault they were too much guilty of : as if i should say , the patriarchs were guilty of poligamy ; yet not all therefore , not isaac , &c. but what would mr. wells think at this rate of that place were it is said , the disciples had indignation at the ointment pour●d on christ's head ? would he condemn them all for judas , of whom it is written ? and calumniate the holy text , as je 〈…〉 me tells us some did in his days ( nescientes tropum qui vocatur 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , quo & pro uno omnes , & pro multis unus appellari soleat ) not knowing it was a figurative expression . however , to satisfie him and his friends , i will explain my self , and declare my own sense , though it be plain enough i called all of them christians , and some my friends , and some guilty ; i count the anabaptists in general christians , but some few of them i called my friends , pious and judicious persons ; but i will assure him , those whose practices i have known about ashford , and written against , i account none of this sort ; and whoever acts in like manner , as far as i have knowledge thereof , shall for ever be discharged by me of that character , pious and judicious . but it is time to leave mr. wells himself . come we now to the matters of fact : and here he urgeth wonderfully , to assign the person or persons guilty of what i charge the baptists with : thus in the epistle dedicatory , in the letter to me printed before the body of the reply , and in the reply it self , at every turn he urgeth this ; and if i should fail herein he commends it to my lord wharton to see that publick satisfaction be given ; and to my church to take a course with me . but now , what if the case do not require all this ? what if it be not necessary or convenient ? what , must a minister tell the anabaptists , and all the world , what every one in trouble discover'd to him ? must he publish the names of every one concerned ? it may be an husband or wife is concerned , parents and children , masters and servants , and the circumstances are such that it is no ways fit or meet to name or assign persons ; possibly it may breed variance and strife , and promote great disorders in families , and in the neighbourhood : it may be some nabals are concerned , some shimei's , who would trouble their own houses , and fill the town with raillery . may not a minister spare names in such a case , but he must be cryed down for one that spreads slanders ? but it seems mr. wells and his friends care not what becomes of any person , nor consider what is meet and fit , what mischief they pull down upon others heads , so they may but salve their own credit , as they would perswade themselves : but , i doubt not , the world will judge this an extravagant request , to urge the printing the names of private persons : and indeed i cannot conceive what good it will do those who know not these parts , to read the names of strange places and persons , which will sound as harsh as greek and hebrew perchance to mr. wells . as for those of their own party who did these evil things , i am sensible they have their evasions to cast off the reproach , ( and it is likely they lie upon the catch ) such an one is none of them ; such an one they own not ; though it may be a teacher , or an old anabaptist , persons certainly dipped , and baptists , or nothing . but so it is , many times they shift the matter off thus ; and , as the historian said of some enemies , difficilius est invenies quàm vincere . but is not this crying out for assigning persons a mere artifice , to be so impatient of this kind of proof , and so long a time laps'd since the matter was first published ; and since 〈◊〉 concerned to give their testimony are their own friends ? and who will doubt but that by this time they are taught their lesson , to speak but sparingly , not the whole truth , or so fully as to prejudice their own cause ? but i do but shew how vain it is for mr. wells to urge this assigning persons ; they need not encourage themselves to hope to escape by this stratagem : proofs i have to produce sufficient and abundant , and yet will be sparing of names , even of the most criminal . first , as for the case of that poor melancholy man , r. m. who made that tragical exit . the case , as far as i am conscerned , was this : one of the same name , and of his kindred , desired me to go and visit him upon the account of his deplorable condition ; and he importuned me not a little , using this as a special argument , that he was continually assaulted by the anabaptists , who in this weakness of body and mind were like to work their will upon him . upon this i went once ( and never more ) and my carriage was as i printed in the narrative of his condition ; and in discoursing with me , he did declare himself in such a manner , tht i was satisfied that the opinion of the anabaptists about rebaptization was a great trouble and vexation to him . it is now several years since my being with him at that time ( about five years since , his death was about four years and an half , and his trouble lasted about three quarters of a year , as i have learnt from his sister , a baptist , who lived all the time with him ; ) and so i think no wise man will expect i should be positive as to the words of our discourse ; truly my memory is not so happy ; yea , i am sorry the matter is so far gone from me ; for i am sure he spake so much as made that clear to me , which was a motive to carry me to him . ( sc . ) that he was troubled about the anabaptists doctrine of dipping ; and that his infant baptism was null ; and that he must be rebaptized . now , what if i could not find out one baptist had been with him ? can it be thought when his sister who kept his house was one of them , that in all his trouble none came near him ? no , not when he had follow'd them formerly , and now in his trouble return'd to hear them again , as mr. wells tells us , p. 15. and his own sisters owned to me . surely what i learn'd from himself was a thousand witnesses to me , and what was clear enough by other circumstances . but see how it pleaseth god to put them to shame , and to condemn them out of their own mouth . one of their teachers ( one of the three who was with me upon the account of my book , did own to us , that he was with him the same day , or the very next , after my being there , and that he discoursed with him of these matters , and that he urged believers baptism to him ( meaning dipping upon profession of faith. ) now supposing no more evidence could be produced ; yet upon this alone , how shameful was it for mr. wells to publish thus , p. 11. first , we observe , that you were the only man that visited , discoursed , and advised this poor man in his deplorable estate ; and p. 11. mr. james was the man chiefly concerned with him in his hurry and trouble of mind ; but to the end he may not be thought remiss , and the better to seem clear , he finds out some to be mentioned , that , he says , did so much wrong . o shameful ! was ever any matter turned so fouly against another ? what , when i was desired to visit him by one of his kindred , pitying his condition ; when a minister was carried to visit a poor disturbed man , must he therefore suffer in his reputation ; and have the odium of all cast upon him ? but , alas ! 't is too plain for them , that he was wounded by the anabaptists ; and i found him with an arrow shot in , sticking fast , and tormenting him ; and to keep him in their bonds , one of their teachers , as himself owned , and is certain , is with him the same day ( for so the woman , his baptist sister is positive , though he were not ) urging believers baptism : whether he were there accidentally or not , or upon design , i know not ; but there he was , and discoursed ; and advised him . yea , further , at another time , as the woman confessed to me in presence of a gentleman who accompanied me to her house , june 12. there was one f — another teacher among them , who visited him , and had private discourse with him about an hour which f — ; saith another sister , he was carried to hear preach , and shewed some uneasiness as he went , and , as she judged , she was dissatisfied ; but one of the neighbours , a baptist , and his sister , she found going along with him ; which neighbour had been at the house , and , she doubts not , brought him thither ; and out of pity to him in his condition she went along with him also , and heard the same man. yet mr. wells saith , we observe , that you were the only man that visited , discoursed , and advised this poor man in his deplorable estate : what will the world think of this ? what can they ? to begin his reply thus , first , we observe : truly , if you observe at this rate , you may observe first , secondly , thirdly , and infinitely , even as far as you please , or can invent . but , mr. wells , did you observe this at london by your selfe , or did your ashford friends give you these instructions ? if you did it alone , it was a wonderful observation indeed ; you had better eyes than lynceus , and more surely than argus ; but if your friends gave you this instruction , it was so much the worse : for one of them , ( as another confest to me ) whose hand was to the letter to get a reply set forth , was one who confest that he was with the man in his trouble , and discoursed , and advised him : so then here are two of your teachers found to be with him ; and who will not think but there were others also of your opinion in the space of about nine months of his illness ? but , again , i pray , mr. wells , how was i conversant with him , as you write , p. 14. when i never spake to him but that one time in my life ? never but once in his company , so as to be able to discourse with him ? i had thought , to be conversant , had implied a familiarity and frequenting a persons company ; so that this is no good english , and that is the best interpretation of it , or i know not how to excuse the same from a falshood . but i begin to grow weary of tracing our these slanders , and untruths ; i will take notice only of one thing more ( about the case of this r. m. ) and dismiss this head : and really it is a sad thing , to consider how these men strive and struggle , and are restless till they entangle themselves , and write and print at that rate that doth ill become christians , whom i was willing , and desire yet to own as such . pray , reader , now observe what follows in these words , p. 15. mr. james bestirs himself to persuade him , that his infant baptism was true baptism , n. b. and to go to town to board , and make use of a physician of his own way , and to bear him ; which was done : but the poor man grew weary , not liking the means that was used . and it seems , and as he told his sister , that they were in a consult what to do about him ( one day ) and , unexpected to them , he over-heard them ; and one said , he was in love ; and another said , he had not a dram of true grace ; but he , hearing this , it made an addition to his weak disturbed head , n. b. and gets away , and relates the matter to his sister , and so waxes worse and worse , till at last he ends his life . for my part , when i read and consider this i am amazed ; so many lyes in one story ! such falshoods sent forth so bare-fac'd ! if my neighbours gave these instructions to their brother wells , they are what i never took them to be ; if he printed it of himself , it is little better in him . did i design a large answer , here is a large field for it , and matter enough for one of no great parts to work upon , enough to wind and toss , and for ever shame mr. wells , and all his friends who have acted in this business : surely some body owed them an ill turn , and secretly wrought it this way . but however it were , and though my neighbours might deserve most , yet i must keep to mr. wells only ; and truly he hath discovered himself all along to be an unaccountable writer : once before , he observed that i was the only man was with r. m. during his trouble of mind ; this he saw , it seems , at london ; there he could tell who went in and out , and discoursed him ; and here he saw him at board at ashford ; which no creature in ashford ever saw , no , not any of his anabaptist friends ; since mr. wells sent out this strange relation , we have ask'd his friends here , and they are ignorant of the matter : when i discoursed his sister , the baptist , who was his house-keeper , she only said , she thinks he was one night at ashford at his cousins , r. m. ( the person who carried me over to visit him ) and her son who went with him , will say , he was : but the family deny it , and all say it was no such thing , and are certain he never lodged there one night , he dined indeed one day there ( as they tell me ) and went up into a chamber , and lay down on a bed to refresh him ; but never lay one night in their house . but suppose it , that he were one night in town ; what is this to boarding , and being there a time , consisting of some days at least ; and getting away from thence , as though he were under some confinement in the use of means for his recovery ? well , it seems mr. wells is good at invention , and that is a notable part of an orator ; but it is just as his natural logick i observed before : i dare say , no master of rhetorick did ever teach him to invent after this manner : aristotle , cicero , quintilian , &c ▪ would have been ashamed of it , though they were heathens : and though we may sometimes conceal truth , and this we have presidents in scripture for , yet neither the light of nature , nor the written word , will allow us to forge after this manner . but who made this officious lye i know not , only this i observe , that because they would print somewhat , and had little to go upon ( nothing in truth ) therefore they have set up all this sail , and run themselves a ground . mr. james bestirs himself , saith he ; strange , that one visit , and but a very short one , should be a bestirring a man's self , when it was but a few miles off , and the man lay so long in trouble , that i might have been there many scores of times for one , or as oft as some of my adversaries take occasion to talk with those they hope to bring over to their opinion . but what did i persuade him him to ? why , to go to town to board : just as much as to go to london ( or elsewhere ) to be dipt by mr. wells ; of whose name , at that time , i know not that i had ever heard : and , how should any know that i perswaded him to such a thing as this ? my friend with me , who heard all our discourse , is a perfect stranger to it ; and his sister declares , she heard nothing of all we said . but now , least i do them wrong , and give not the true sense and meaning of the words ; and to do mr. wells wrong , ( though indeed it would prove well for him if he had only written false english , and mistook in the sense ) i appeal to all englishmen , and desire every reader to say , if this be not the true meaning of the words , that i perswaded the man ( r. m ) to go to town to board , and make use of a physician of my own way , which was done ( i. e. the man took my counsel , and came to ashford to board ) and while he was here , after sometime ( longer or shorter it matters not , so it be allowed to be but some days , for so he writes , of one day ) while they were consulting together ( surely he means the physician and my self ; for he mentioned no other before , and his sense carries it this way ) he heard them say thus and thus ; and so he gets away . now if i have given his sense right , and understand his english ; which surely is even so , if mr. wells write intelligibly , then here is a wild romance , and a tale told , and a foul pack of lyes , and all to make me ridiculous . but i would fain know , who of all ashford town can say , that ever r. m. was here at board , during his melancholy ? what anabaptist can stand forth , and help mr. wells , or his friends , out of this mire ? in whose house did he board or lodge ? as for my own part , i protest i do not know , nor can i call to mind that ever i saw that poor man but once at his own house , and once or twice while i was in the pulpit : but that the doctor and my self should ever discourse of him thus , and he near enough to over-hear us , is too like some other passages in the reply . yea , if they would turn it upon his cousin r. m. and his wife , that they said so , and talked so foolishly ( as i find they harp upon it ) yet that will not serve their turn ; for they not only deny it , but mr. wells hath written and printed it ( as i think i have shewed ) quite otherwise . well ; upon this wonderful relation , he gravely proceeds : now if this be so , then all this stirr to bespatter the baptists , is to clear your self : but you are the more intangled , and are taken in the snare you laid ; and i could wish there had been no occasion to discover it . discover it ! a wonderful discovery indeed . i am perswaded when this vindication comes forth , mr. wells will wish indeed , with all his heart , there had not one been word written by him , and that his friends had been tongue-tied when they told him such a story . are these the bonds and fetters mr. wells and his friends have put upon me ? and do they think to bring me forth and expose me thus to make them sport ? alas ! i can as easily break them as sampson did his wit hs and cords ; and i am certain they themselves have pull'd down an house upon their heads . for shame let mr. wells write a retractation , though it be but for the sake of this single story ; and seeing it is resolved , that he or some other shall answer again , write what i will , as one of them told me ( it seems they are greatly in love with printing , and are proud of appearing such able persons ) by all means let them clear this foul matter , but let them take care least their stirring too far make it worse . but it is high time to come to other things ; and that , in the last place , to answer the accusations brought against me , as though i had slandered the baptists , in representing them as persons wh● are industrious to make proselytes , and in urging dipping , so a● to make it a salve for every sore . 't is needless to set down th● reply made to this charge ; and i am really afraid i shall tire m● reader in leading him up and down after mr. wells's defence 〈◊〉 his friends and party : though for brevity i repeat not his word● yet i will do him no wrong ( if i should it would appear , and not be to my advantage ; ) but i propound the case plainly , and answer it home . these are the things then he quarrels with me for , having reflected on the anabaptists as industrious to make proselytes ; and urging dipping , as though all religion did consist in going down into the water ; and , in short , he challenges me to assign the guilty , or else , he saith , p. 21. it must be concluded , you cannot ? and then in what a shameful case will you appear ? now , as to my assigning the criminals , i have already said a little in answer thereto ; it is not always fit and meet , nor is it material : cui bono ? to what good would it be ? i have named some to their teachers , and instead of taking a course with them , they thought to take a course with me , and promised one mr. wells to print against me for justifying my charge , and to tell the world confidently all was a slander . what should i name any persons to the world , when they have been named publickly enough , and they take no notice , ( not at least to be openly known of ) but shut their eyes , and stop their ears , and run upon me , and cry out , that i will give no proofs or satisfaction ? i appeal to those few present at that time , when they attended me ( to use mr. well's own words , ( p. 9. ) after the publishing my book , i appeal , i say , to the consciences of their three teachers , whether i did not name several guilty of the things i laid to their charge . but to clear all at once , and to satisfie their longing desires ( so far as is any ways meet and ●it ) of assigning persons , both those who were troubled and almost distracted by the anabaptists urging it upon them to be dipp'd , as ever they hoped to go to heaven , and be saved ; and those who did trouble them , laying this mighty stress upon dipping . i say , to put an end to all , that i may clear my self , and shew how able i am every way to vindicate my self from the foul slanders cast on me , and to make my charge good to a tittle ; let mr. wells know that i have several depositions of persons by me , which fully prove the matter in hand , subscribed freely , and which will be readi●y attested , and solemnly , upon just occasion . behold one in form , ●s i have it by me with so me others . i , n. n. do own and testifie , that n. n. hath divers times , and to my great vexation and disquietude , urged me to be dipped ; setting forth the absolute necessity thereof to salvation ; inveighing against those who practised infant baptism , as antichristian , and urging me to be dipped , as ever i expected to enter into the kingdom of god. witness my hand , n. n. but , alas ! should i go about to lay open the practises of the anabaptists ( about us ) and reveal what many poor weak christians have told me , with great bitterness of spirit , how burthensome their very life was to them by reason of their importunate sollicitations to bring them to be dipped , and their desperate speeches striking an horrour into their minds , vexing their souls continually , it would , i doubt , sound very strange to many readers : but so it is in truth ; and yet , forsooth , these persons would fain be counted innocent , and cry out of the wrong i have done them . one instance i cannot but produce , and that a little largely , it being so material ; and i am glad ( as the case is ) to take the opportunity to let the world know it , and judge thereof . and because mr. wells hath sprinkled here and there a little of the point of controversie , and his ashford friends make advantage of his reply ( such as it is ) to scatter their books among us ( and surely the like was never known : for to this book of his they have tack'd another ( stitch'd them together ) yea , and more than so , at the end of his reply there are these few lines printed to couple them together ; and , as to the point of baptism , we refer that to the following treatise , formerly written by another hand , intituled , the reason why , &c. good mr. wells , why did you not send me a perfect copy ? but i suppose you thought i should hardly be caught with your chaff , and therefore a few books were provided for my self , and such as could better judge what was written ; truly this was civilly done , not to trouble me with any more books than your own ; and now it seems i have nothing to do to answer any thing but your reply ; this is a kindness i acknowledge ( i say ) because mr. wells hath scattered up and down somewhat of controversie , i think it convenient to give a touch or two to the same , to prevent mistakes and error , and to send forth an antidote for others , as well as a vindication for my self . the instance by which i take occasion to write this , was this : a woman aged near forty years came to me to be baptized : upon instructing her in the principles of christian religion , and her answering to such questions about the same , as seemed to me necessary , ( first having consulted the practice of other churches in like cases ) and professing her faith and repentance , i baptized her on a lord's day in the evening before the communicants : now , quickly upon her being so baptized , the matter being noised abroad , she was set upon by the anabaptists , even as i have represented the too common practice of some of them ; and one of them in their communion ( which they cannot disown ) did exceedingly perplex this poor woman with questions and cavillings , asking her what faith she had in what was done , and speaking against it as no baptism , seeing she was not dipped : this really disturbed her , so that she lamented it to me ; not that she was unsetled , or believed them , but because they followed her with such discourses , giving her no rest : yea , at the very time of writing this ( which is now about two years since her being so baptized ) the design is carried on very busily to proselite her : she declares to me , how she is continually disquieted by that party ; she now tells it me with tears , that she is wearied by them , and hath desired them to let her rest , being well satisfied in her baptism . but that which is yet more considerable , is this : at the time when those three teachers were with me about about my book , among others whom they press'd me to name , and instance in , i named this woman , and represented the evil of this practice , in going about thus to disquiet a poor weak woman , who was baptized so authentickly ( as one would think all christians should allow ) being an adult person , having profess'd her faith and repentance before the administration of the sacrament . hereupon one of them had the confidence to tell me , it was indeed no baptism . monstrous doctrine ! what will become of christians at this rate ? and what hope can millions have , to whom it hath been applied in any other way than that of the baptists ? what , can a mode destroy the essence of the ordinance ? and shall the application of water in a less quantity render it altogether ineffectual , and destroy its end and efficacy ? when the name of the true god , father , son , and holy ghost , is put upon the person ; and the true element of water is used ; and the principal end of its application signified , which is washing the soul with christ's blood , and purifying it by the blessed spirit ; and all is done by a minister ordained to that office : is not this baptism ? o , but she was not dipped , and that is baptism , and that only . poor , ignorant , confident men , thus to cavil ! the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , chosen by christ , and the holy ghost , doth signifie to wash , as well as to dip ; it signifies a washing with water , not only a total immersion , but a partial ; not only a dipping , but other applications of water to wash : yea , it is certain , that some of those diverse washings under the law , spoken of by the apostle , heb. 9. 10. ( which he calleth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . ) were not total immersions , but partial , of one par● of the body , and another ; and even sprinklings , as at the consecration of the levites , numb . 8. 5 , 6 , 7. and at the cleansing o● a leprous person , levit. 14. 7. from the apostle i will lear● the meaning of this word , rather than from any baptist . but mr. wells , with his learning would teach us thus , p. 12. you cannot be ignorant but that baptiso is to dip , and is allowed , and approved to be so by the lexicons , dictionaries , and all approved authors that are orthodox ; ( 't is well he did not say only to dip for then i know what he had said , ) and 't is rare to find a schola● so weak as not for to allow it . truly 't is rare to find a baptist though he cannot read one word of greek , or understand latin , and yet not to talk and write of the sense of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as though they had consulted lexicons , dictionaries , and wha● not ? but is not this a fine begging of the question ? wh● ever denied dipping to be baptizing ? but mr. wells's friend● at ashford might be ashamed to say , that no other application o● water is baptizing ; and that this woman was not baptised for , i pray , what learned man ever rendred the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 only to dip , exclusively to all other significations ? i have no● search'd ( as before-times ) lexicons and dictionaries , and fin● the word rendred indeed to dip , but also to wash , yea , an● to sprinkle ; there comes in an item , làvo , abluo : and surely 〈◊〉 is a significant word , as well as imprimis : every tradesman knows this . indeed at the rate some baptists writ and report the words of the learned , they would perswade silly people all the learned men were almost anabaptists ; yea , and ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) self-condemned , being as they are in opinion , though of a contrary practice . they make some speak a few words , and say 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is to dip , to plunge in water ; but then , as it were , stop their mouths , and cry hold ; whereas good men , might they go on , they would add , to wash , to pour on water , to sprinkle : and their quotations are much of this kind , very deceitful , per saltum , and keeping back a material part , and so making them to speak very favourably for them ; the very thing we are upon proves this , mr. wells saith , baptiso is to dip , as lexicons , &c. say , as though that were all , and it is needless to make a digression to shew it by their quotations of zanchy , piscater , calvin , poole , &c. but i would fain know , who can prove our lord jesus christ himself was dipped , or plunged in his baptism ; or that any of those baptized ones spoken of in the new testament , were so dipped or plunged ? not a word that ever i yet read did prove , i say , soundly prove it : probability is no proof of this degree ; opinion is not faith. an immersion there might be , and yet not a total one ; or , it may be some other application , as by pouring on of water . that baptism was oft performed of old by dipping , i gainsay not ; but that there were other ways , is certain also . pray let mr. wells construe these words . fundere aquam , infundere , and sometimes javare , abluere , found oftentimes in the writings of the antients ; yea , and sometimes aspergere , for baptizing ? also let him unriddle , how they baptized some in prisons , and in their beds , sick of feavours , in sweats , &c. as augustine tells us at large of a friend of his ? if this were not done by some other way than by dipping the whole body , let mr. wells declare how that could be . but shall we call in question at this day the baptism of all those in former ages who were not dipp'd ? and strike so many saints and martyrs out of the roll of the baptized , who are now in heaven ? an horrible boldness to speak at this rate ! but let them take heed ; for how , as i said , can they prove our lord himself was so dipped ? i am sure one ancient writer was of another mind , ( and surely he was not alone ) even aurelius prudentius , who sings thus of it ( being a famous christian poet flourishing about thirteen hundred years since ) perfundit fluvio pastus baptista locustis . i. e. john the baptist poured some of the water of the river on him ; our baptist would teach him to say , immergit fluvio , &c. but it seems he knew better , or at least thought otherwise : and bernard ( a later writer by far , and yet not very late neither , for he lived about five hundred years ago ; and hath the honour , if i mistake not , to be called by some , the last of the fathers ) hath this notable expression , infundit aquam capiti creatoris creatura-nobilior , & dei verticem mortalis dextra contrectat & contingit ; i. e. john the baptist , that noble creature , poured water on the head of the creator , and the right hand of a man touched and handled the head of god. i do not produce these testimonies , as though i would maintain that our lord jesus was not dipped but only to shew the boldness of those persons , who cavil at the baptism of all such as are not plunged in water , and do , by crying up dipp'd or damn'd , trouble the weak , and drive them into a dangerous melancholy . yea , what if the eunuch went down into the water , acts 8. 38. or christ came up out of the water , matth. 3. 16 , mark. 1. 10. ( though by the way 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is only , he came up from the water , not out of it ) what doth this prove ? dipping a total immersion ? surely they that say this may say any thing . but now we are speaking of baptism , i cannot but take notice of mr. wells's confidence , to call infant baptism a scriptureless notion , p. 14. and p. 13 , 14. he saith , sprinkling of infants is a new doctrine , a scriptueless thing , that is not to be found from the beginning of genesis to the end of the revelations : what , a new doctrine ? let the famous calvin , be heard , whom i chuse to quote , because i have see● him quoted in their books as one that wrote for their opinion 't is in that chapter , which he calls his appendix to the forme of baptism , written on purpose against the anabaptists , as the title and the first words declare : the title this , poedobaptismum cu● christi institutione , & signi natura optimè congruere ( i. e. ) infan● baptism's agreement with christ's institution , and the nature of the sign . the first words are these , quoniam autem hoc s●culo phrenetici quidum spiritus ob poedobaptismum graves excitarunt i● ecclesia turbas , &c. ( i. e. ) whereas in this age some phrensical ( or enthusiastical ) persons have raised great stirs in the church about infant baptism , and do not cease at this day to cause the same tumults , i cannot but subjoin this appendix to restrain their fury . now the passage i would quote out of this notable chapter , is this : quod autem apud simplicem vulgum disseminaret , longam annorum seriem post christi resurrectionem praeteriisse , quibus incognitus erat poedobaptismus ; in eo foedissimè mentiuntur : siquidem nullus est scriptor tam vetustus , qui non ejus originem ad apostolorum seculum pro certo referat ( i. e. ) whereas they talk up and down among the silly people , that it was many ages after christ's resurrection before infant baptism was known , in that they tell a most foul lye ; forasmuch as there is no writer so ancient , who doth not for certain refer the original thereof to the apostles age. but why doth mr. wells tell us of genesis , and the old testament ? who thinks baptism was the sacrament then in use ? but verily he hath laid himselfe open by this unwary expression : for i can tell him of a multitude of children baptized within that time ( and that by sprinkling also , through the dropping of the cloud and the dashing of the waters , as many learned doubt not ) and prove it out of holy scripture . let him read 1 cor. 10. 2. and see if the apostle do not say , that all the congregation of israel which passed through the red-sea , were baptized unto moses in the cloud , and in the sea ; the word is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; which i leave to mr. wells to interpret . were there not many children , thousands of them , when the men alone were above six hundred thousand ? children of all ages undoubtedly ? though paul calls them all fathers in the first verse , yet i suppose that must be taken in this sense , that as the children came to age , they also were all fathers in israel , their fore-fathers : yea , and this was typical in some sense of our sacrament of baptism , as he sheweth in the next verses , that their drinking of the water of the rock , was of the lord's supper : but why is mr. wells so over-confident ? it is a dangerous case , sure , to declare against infant baptism at this ●ate , as a new doctrine , when justin martyr , irenaeus , tertullian , origen , and those ancients who lived in the very next age to the apostles , speak plainly of it , as a practice in their days , and write of it as no other than apostolical : or why is he so confident to call it a scriptureless thing ; when several households are said 〈◊〉 scripture to be baptized ; and all the strength of the anabaptists can never make it clear there were no children in them ? but surely if families might be without them , yet there must be children in nations , and they were to be made disciples and baptized by christ's commission to his gospel ministry : but we do not lay our stress on these things , and build only on probabilities . no , but we are sure , that infants are the subjects of baptism , because they were of old of circumcision ; the church of the old and the new testament being one , only the seals of the covenant altered ; washing being a more gentle way of initiating , than cutting of the flesh : if we had not this priviledge under the gospel to have our children visibly entred and taken into god's church , the jews were really in a far better state than we , unless we will despise god's sacraments and ordinances , and care not whither our children partake of them , or go without them : yea , 't is certain , we are concerned in god's covenant , which he made with abraham and his seed , as the holy ghost witnesses in divers places , and have the same spiritual priviledges : nisi fortè arbitramur , christum suo adventu patris gratiam imminuisse aut decurtasse , quod ex ecrabili blasphemia non vacat ; as saith calvin in the former place ; ( i. e. ) unless we think that christ by his coming cut short his father's love and grace , which thought cannot be excused from blasphemy it self . but where is the repeal of that priviledge ? where is it said , i did indeed receive their children , but as for yours i will not be so gracious to them ? alas ! christ declares quite the contrary : he shewed his love to little children both by words and actions : and that good shepherd who marked his lambs of old as well as his sheep , would have them now washed alike in the laver of regeneration . but i must remember i write a vindication , and it is not my work to meddle with the questions in debate between us ; only i have touched at these things , being led to them by mr. wells , and to shew the vanity and strange confidence of these men in these matters ; it being that whereby they take the unwary and undiscerning souls . but i grow weary of writing ; and indeed this is the great mischief mr. wells hath done me ; he hath created me some trouble , and many thoughts , whereas my hands are full enough of work , the work of my ministry ; not being so happy as many of them , to mind a flock , and a family , and a trade also , and yet find time for disputing , printing , and what not , upon every little pretence ? were it not that i were afraid least i should betray the truth , and the souls of some poor people , who , it may be , expect this , as well as stand in need of it , i could be very well content to be silent ; but forasmuch as i am set for a defence of the gospel , i cannot let such matters pass without taking some pains , in a case where so many round me are so deeply concerned : not so much that i need to fear my self as others ; i think nothing hath befallen me , but what hath happened to other ministers of the gospel far above me . i did but touch them , and they have kicked against me , and made a sad noise . but , thanks be to god , they have prevailed but little hitherto , in those endeavours they have used to make proselytes ; of which i had reason to complain , and did seriously warn them . in six years i have lost but one of my flock , and that a young man , who was but a little while under my care , and so suddenly gone , that i was scarce aware of it before his departure : it was but once i had opportunity to speak to him before his being dipped , and then he utterly refused my offer to discourse with those anabaptists in his presence for his sake , who had perverted him ; nay , nor would he be brought to read a little piece i would have put into his hands , but rashly he would be dipped , and renounce his first baptism : and who could have stopped so resolute a person ? misguided zeal did strangely transport him , and since his dipping he hath done me some wrong by misrepresenting some things i had said of baptism ; but i forgive him . surely mr. wells hath lost his wit ( and that is pity indeed , he sheweth so little all along ) in that expression , p. 17. alas ! 't is to be supposed you have lost some of your disciples ( which ) makes you so peevish , pettish , froward , and unkind to your friends . no , mr. wells , not some , but one ; and my place is not thinn'd , but much otherwise ; yea , rather than fail , your friends ( it seems ) have a strong desire of doing me that honour to be my hearers : one of them who lived and dyed of your communion , a zealous person in your way , hath oft spoke to me and others of being my hearer most gladly , but refrain'd lest it should give offence : and another , who it seems ( as one of your teachers told me ) had been inclined to your opinion many years , yet having been my hearer for some time , after her being dipp'd lamented it with tears , that she must leave such preaching . truly in this i am become a fool , in glorying , but ye have compelled me . one thing more , and i conclude : whereas mr. wells makes a challenge to dispute with me , in his reply , especially in his private letter , i am afraid it would be but a spending time idly , to argue with that man , who knows not how to put the questions fairly he would dispute upon : his second offer is this , secondly , we are ready to try the cause , whether dipping or sprinkling be most ancient ? but what , i pray , would this come to ? who speaks against the antiquity of dipping ? but was it a total immersion , a dipping the whole person , certainly , infallibly , without guesses , conjectures , and probabilities ? yea , but what if so ? if christ give his churches liberty to baptize by pouring on water , or other application ( as the word will bear , as mr. wells may see in lexicons , if he can read and understand them ) then this question is meerly trifling . dipping there might be in christ's time , yea , and that the best way of baptizing , but yet not the only necessary way ; not absolutely so ; if in case of necessity and mercy men might break the sabbath , and be blameless ; or on the same account they might eat the passover on another month and day then god instituted it ; surely then , in case dipping were used of old , yet it is not of that absolute necessity as our baptists pretend , but in case of weakness , &c. may be dispenc'd with ; and where we have our liberty , why should we not make use of it ? but then his fourth assertion is more frivolous : fourthly , we are ready to prove , that dipping is baptizing , and that it is according to christ's institution . this indeed will require no great proof , and mr. wells may manage it , no doubt ; but the question is , whether a total immersion , dipping all the body , be the only baptism of christ , and nothing less , nothing else ; whither it be exclusive of any other application of water ; and this we deny ; let who can prove it . only the third question is of any moment , thirdly , whether the sprinkling of infants be the baptism of christ ? this he roundly denies ; and this comprehends both the subject and manner of application of the water ; so that it is all in one , and must be divided to be rightly handled . but i think it will not be worth while to dispute with mr. wells , of whom i do not know , nor doth he make it appear , that he hath the least learning that might be a means to keep him in order , and repress clamorousness and confidence . but if mr. wells have so much leisure , and his zeal be so great as to bring him to ashford , and my circumstances fairly permit it , i will not say but i may meet him upon this score ; i do not think to hide my head , but to give him an answer : but still i must profess , i am yet afraid of this , and cannot but perswade my self , that if it should come to a tryal , mr. wells would argue much after the same manner he writes ( i. e. ) poorly , and foully ; not handsomly nor honestly , being over-confident of what he hath no ground for ; and so he would create abundance of trouble to me , and perplex the matter he takes in hand . upon the whole , i do forgive mr. wells the wrong he hath done me , only desiring him , not to act so rashly for the future , judging in a cause , and condemning a person he is wholly a stranger to . as for my neighbours , who stirred him up , and were so eager for some body to print against me , and gave such false witness , i freely forgive them also ; only desiring them to mind their own business and to be quiet ; above all , to beware how they be concerned in printing , least they prejudice their own cause , and bring shame and disgrace upon themselves and their brethren also . post-script . considering whom i have to deal with , and for whose sake , in a special manner , i do write , in all likelyhood i have been so short , that i have been too obscure . it may be some through ignorance may think mr. wells's reply is not fully answered ; and others through a design may pretend and boast the same , asserting , that many considerable passages in his book are pass'd over in a deep silence ; and this they may falsly interpret , as though i purposely let them alone , not being willing to take notice of them , because not able to answer them : therefore , to prevent and remedy all this , take an answer , but very short , to those places hitherto omitted in the former vindication ( which i was willing to make one continued discourse ) an answer just enough to serve the turn ; and in this i will follow my opponent , and answer orderly . in the epistle to the reader ( near the end ) there is a very sarcastical passage , reflecting upon the presbyterians in general : but though it be hard , yet being nothing to our purpose , only a piece of raillery , which it would be easie , but unchristian , to retaliate , let it pass ; only i am sorry that mr. wells , who ( as it seems by his private letter to me ) is an old man , and who in his reply shews a great desire of moderation , should make such a blot in the beginning . in the beginning of the letter to me . worthy sir , whatever your ends and aims were in setting forth those tragical instances in your book , we cannot but take notice , that some part of your matter was to ridicule , and represent the anabaptists to the world , as a very weak insipid people , and yet crafty and industrious to catch men in despair , to make a party . as for my ends and aims , in setting forth that book , they were good , even such as i express'd , to bear my testimony against the atheism of this age , and to employ some part of the talent god had given me that way . what need you say , whatever they were , when i declared they were such as these ? but my design was far from ridiculing the anabaptists in such a manner as mr. wells sets it forth : it was indeed to warn and advise them ; and who cannot see how it came in ? who will think , or suspect i wrote that piece to reproach the anabaptists ? no , it was far from my heart and thoughts ; but in writing , this came in , and it seemed to me not amiss to make use of it , hoping it might do good , and might be serviceable to good ends , not to cavillings , and contradictions as it proves : but the success i leave to god. 't is very hard and unkind to bespatter us all with the miscarriage of a person , or persons ( if any such be . ) how little need there is of this reflection may appear by what i have written in my vindication . surely none will think me so weak ( or malicious , which yet i am sorry mr. wells ever and anon suggests ) as to charge this evil upon every individual baptist in england , or the whole world , who are far enough out of my knowledge : my words import no such thing , as i have cleared them , and shewed it was his ignorance so to take them . but why that parenthesis ( if any fuch be ? ) verily i had not written so , if i had not known it , or could not have proved it : but if mr. wells would not believe me , it was uncivilly done in him to go about to perswade the world to do the like . we desire you to assign the guilty , that we may clear our selves of that foul scandal , or else we prefume all is a fiction of your own brain , and with a malicious design to bespatter and abuse us . for assigning the guilty i have already answer'd at large , and done enough toward that ( i doubt not ) to clear my self , that it was no fiction of mine , much less a malicious design : but is not this very ? unchristian in mr. wells to surmize thus , and suggest such foul things as these ever and anon ? even such as one would not suspect of any who are not very obnoxious upon some evil account or other ? what , to forge such matters as these ? to lay a malicious design to abuse a party ? this is sad indeed : i am sorry mr. wells could harbour such thoughts of me , and print them too ; but the best of it is , he had no reason , unless he were confident that all his friends and society , were pure and infallible . mr. james was the man chiefly concerned with him ( i. e. r. m. ) in his hurry and trouble of mind ; but to the end he may not be thought remiss , and the better to seem clear , he finds out some to be mentioned that he says did so much wrong . and to the same purpose : upon your ill success you raise a clamour upon others to clear you ; and having digged a pit for them , fall in your self , and must be exposed to open shame and reproach . the former answer may serve very well for this . for it is all of one piece ; still unchristian , uncharitable , surmising and judging my heart , and mis-judging . truly this is a very false and wicked aspersion ; and 't is strange to me that a man should dare to hint such a thing as this , which surely he could not expect that any reader ( but deeply prejudiced ) should believe , and not rather abhor his suggestion . i pray what was there that i should seek occasion to clear my self , or find out some to take off any reproach might fall upon me ? i was desired by a kinsman of r. m. to visit him , and to obviate ( what i could ) the designs of some anabaptists ; what hurt , i pray , in my consenting and going thereupon ? or what need i to fear any shame if he did not hearken to my advice and comply therewith ( yea , how knows mr. wells but he did ? ) but i was so far from looking after this , that after that one visit i never spake more to him . how vainly and wickedly then doth mr. wells suggest such slanders ? indeed he takes a liberty to write almost any thing in this matter . secondly , you do say , they presently sat in with him ; and told him his way to have peace and comfort was to be dipped : now this mr. james doth particularly charge upon them , and therefore 〈◊〉 must hear or see this done , or else he hath published he knows no● what . no man , i think , will understand me that i said they told him in totidem verbis , but in sensu , that they perswaded him to this 〈◊〉 a way to peace and comfort . now this i did hear , though no● spoken to him , yet by a kinsman of his , who , as i said , used 〈◊〉 as a special argument to induce me to visit him ; yea , and 〈◊〉 heard so much from his own mouth that satisfied me , that it was even so : and i have proved it ( a posteriori ) in the former vindication , that there were some who did act thus , advising him about dipping as the way to peace ( for surely they did it not to trouble him , as i told k. l. when he owned his discoursing with him , and advising him upon that head. ) but that dipping should be a new doctrine in your esteem , seems strange to us , or that any that pretends to be a minister of the gospel ( and especially a scholar ) should so affirm . the dipping those already baptized ( or if you will , such as were baptized in infancy ) is indeed a new doctrine , and that is the case before us . which of the ancients did ever do this ? who ever pleaded for it till of yesterday ? of very late years ? let this be shewed by any of the baptists . though dipping be a baptizing , yet dipping those already baptized ( though but in infancy , or by pouring on of water ) is a new doctrine . where was this practiced in primitive times ? in what volume do we read it ? indeed one or two ( and i never saw more quoted ) were against baptizing in infancy ( but for other reasons than our baptists ) some even deferring it to a death-bed ; but not one that i have met with did declare , that if a child were baptized it was nothing , and the person must be rebatized , when adult professing faith and repentance . it s very probable mr. james might very much puzzle his weak disturbed head , if he press'd him to believe his new doctrine of sprinkling infants , or that his infant baptism would yield him any spiritual profit or comfort . it was not my work to press him thus , only i told him , it was no time now to think of new baptism , and being dipped : i applied other remedies than mr. wells suggests ; but i thought it proper ( as the case stood ) to shew him that it was no ways necessary to have his thoughts working at this time about dipping , but to rest where he was as to that point , and to call upon god , and resist the devil , &c. but was this solid and suitable to his malady , to instruct him , and make him believe his infant baptism was comfortable and profitable to him ? i pray how doth mr. wells know that i did thus ? what trifling is it to write and print at this rate ? is this a reply ? to whom , or to what ? if he had matter enough to write , surely he would have spared such passages . just before he said , if he press'd him , and in the next page , if he alledged this ; but here he takes it for granted , that i took this course , and then saith , but was this solid , &c. thus mr. wells is of and on , and knows not what to write : but then he goes on boldly on this presumption , adding within a few lines , and thus he was hurried in his mind , and suffered ( it is probable ) not a little by that blind zeal of yours , or scriptureless notion . it is probable i hope to none but mr. wells : and who but he would look upon what i did as acted with blind zeal , when i did not run before i was sent ; nor sought occasion , but was invited , and importuried , and then how could i do less out of respect to my office , as a minister of jesus christ ? i went not with a design to make a proselyte ( as mr. wells hints , p. 10. saying , you could not prosclyte him ) yet if mr. wells's friends had not been with him presently after me , 't is probable my advice might have done more good ; but now it is in vain to guess at it 〈◊〉 for if i did him any good ; it seems they quickly marr'd it . if that salve of sprinkling in his infancy were applied to him for his spiritual sore , it might very well distract him . what if it were not applied ? then here is just nothing said , a reply to no purpose . but what a dreadful consequence doth mr. wells draw from thence ( supposing it were so ) then it might very well distract him : a dreadful reflection indeed a terrible charge against infant baptism . for my part , i reflected only upon the unadvised carriage of some baptists , and their rash zeal to promote their opinion , and to make proselytes ; their indirect and evil practices ; their bold and bitter speeches ; but i should have been ashamed to have branded their doctrine thus where mr. wells's moderation is i know not ; it doth not appear in his reply . but i hope he doth not mean a perfect distraction , but only a little hurry of mind , and that his next words are exegetical , and lessen the sense , as it follows , and he n● suffer a little by such inconsiderate and blind zeal : let it b● so taken , even in the best sense ; for the other is very foul an● grose . and that the world may be sure to know who you mean , you repeat the name anabaptists , as you falsely put upon them , and say , wh● they rather chose to call themselves baptists . good mr. wells , how did you read this ? methinks you read as badly as you writ : how could you say i repeated the name anabaptists ? what , did you mistake atheists in the lines before for anabaptists ? for i never repeated this word : read anabaptist twice if you can ; and surely anabaptist and baptist are not one and the same name ; for you write your self a baptist , yet say i falsely put the name anabaptist upon you . but why falsely put upon you ? 't is the proper name of those of your opinion , though it may be you like it not ; and if we call you baptists it is a favour , which favour i was willing to shew you ( i mean those of your opinion ) but you acknowledge it not ; but are angry ; yea , if we call you not anabaptists , we do in a sort disown our own baptism and principles about that point : for we say ( and doubt not we are able to prove it ) that infants are truly baptized , as well as the adult : but you baptize such as were so baptized in infancy , and therefore are anabaptists , and the name truly agrees to you , which signifies rebaptizers . for my part i am not for long and hard names ( sesquipedalia verba ) or else i had us'd that name of ca●apaedobaptists ; but i judged the other both proper , and best known ; and i do not see why it should be a matter of offence to you to use it ; i am sure 't is of no great moment ; however i used these two promiscuously ( anabaptist and baptist ) not designing to reproach you by the name ( no nor any otherwise seeking occasision so to do , as you have too oft suggested ) but only to write most properly ; which is according to common speech , and as may be best understood . finis . reader , i would desire thee to be so candid , as to correct the faults thou maist find , and not to censure me too hardly for the ●ame ; for i could not be present at the press ; and i am sensible , that as i have suffered in this kind already , so i may still suffer , notwithstanding all the care and precaution i have used . books printed for john john lawrence , at the angel in the poultrey . mr. lorimer's apology for the ministers who subscribed only unto the stating of the truths and errors in mr. williams's book , in answer to mr. tr●●ls's letter to a minister in the country . 4 to . an answer of mr. giles firmin to mr. grantham , about infant baptism . 4 to . some remarks upon two anabaptist pamphlets . by giles firmin . 4 to . mr. firmin's review of richard davis his vindication . 4 to . a proposal to perform musick , in perfect and mathematical proportions . by tho. salmon , rector of mepsal in bedfordshire . approved by both the mathematick professors of the university of oxford ; with large remarks . by john wallis , p. d. 4 to . mr. stephens's sermon before the lord mayor and aldermen of london , at st. mary le bew. jan. 30. 1693. mr. shower's winter meditations : or , a sermon concerning frost , and snow , and winds , &c. and the wonders of god therein . 4 to . mr. slater's thanksgiving sermon , octob. 27. 1692. 4 to . — his sermons at the funerals of mr. john reynolds , and mr. fincher , ministers of the gospel . 4 to . the jesuites catechism . 4 to . dr. burton's discourses of purity , charity , repentance , and seeking first the kingdom of god. published with a preface , by dr. john tillotson , late archbishop of canterbury . 8 vo . remarks on a late discourse of william lord bishop of derry , concerning the inventions of men in the worship of god : also a defence of the said remarke against his lordship's admonition . by j. boyse . 8 vo . the works of the right honourable henry , late lord d●●amere , and earl of warington ; consisting in thirty two original manuscripts under his lordship 's own hand . 8 vo . bishop wilkins's discourses of the gift of prayer , and preaching ; the better much inlarged . by the bishop of norwich , and dr. williams . 8 vo . mr. samuel slater's earnest gall to family religion ; being the substance of eighteen sermons . 8 vo . mr. addy's stenographia : or , the art of short writing compleated , in a fa● more compendious way than any yet extant . 8 vo . the london dispensatory reduc'd to the practice of the london physicians : wherein are contained the medicines , both galencial and chymical , tha● are now in use : those out of use omitted ; and those in use , and not in the latin copy , here added . by john peachey of the colledge of physicians in london . 12 o. mr. hamond's sermon at mr. steel's funeral . 8 vo . history of the conquest of florida 8 vo . mr. a●kins's english g●ammar : or , the english tongue reduced to grammatical rules . compored for the use of english schools . 8 vo . mr. john s 〈…〉 r's discourse of temp●ing christ . 12 o. — his discourse of family religion , in three letters . 12 o. mr. daniel burgess's discourse of the death , rest , resurrection , and blessed portion of the saints . 12 o mr. george hamond's , and mr matthew parker's discourses of family worship . written at the request of the united ministers of london . 12 o. miscellana sacra : containing scriptural meditations , divine breathings , occasional reflections , and sacred poems 12 o. monro's iustitutio grammaticae . 8 vo . sir jonas more 's mathematical compendium . the third edition 12 o. mr. william scoffin's help to true spelling and reading : or , a very easie method for the teaching children , or elder persons , rightly to spell , and exactly to read english , &c. 8 vo . the triumphs of grace : or , the last words , and edifying death of the lady margart de la musse , a noble french lady , aged but sixteen years , in may 1681 12o . the map of man's misery : or , the poor man's pocket-pook : being a perpetual almanack of spiritual meditations : containing many useful instructions , meditations and prayers , &c 12o . man's whole duty , and god's wonderful intreaty of him thereunto . by mr. dan. burges . 12o . advice to parents and children . by mr. daniel burges 12o . mr. gibbons's sermon of justification 4 to . scala naturae : or , a treatise proving both from nature and scripture , the existence of good genii , or guardian angels . 12o . graaf de succo , pancreatico : or , a physical and anatomical treatise of the nature and office of the pancreatick juice . 8 vo . dr. packs praxis catholica : or , the countryman 's universal remedy : wherein is plainly and briefly laid down , the nature , matter , manner , place , and cure of most diseases incident to the body of man. 8vo . english military discipline : or , the way and method of exercising horse and foot , according to the practice of this present time : with a treatise of all sorts of arms , and engines of war , &c. 8 vo . orbis imperantis tabelle geographico-historico-genealogico-chronologiae , &c. curiously engraven on copper plates . 8 vo . clavi's grammatica : or , the ready way to the latine tongue : containing most plain demonstrations for the regular translating english into latin ; fitted to help such as begin to attain the latin tongue . by f. b. 8 vo . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a46634-e390 〈…〉 tvvo treatises and an appendix to them concerning infant-baptisme. the former treatise being an exercitation presented to the chair-man of a committee of the assembly of divines. the later an examen of the sermon of mr stephen marshall, about infant-baptisme, in a letter sent to him. / by john tombes. b.d. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a94741 of text r200471 in the english short title catalog (thomason e312_1 e312_2). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 113 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 23 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a94741 wing t1825 thomason e312_1 thomason e312_2 estc r200471 99861205 99861205 113333 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a94741) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 113333) images scanned from microfilm: (thomason tracts ; 51:e312[1]; 51:e312[2]) tvvo treatises and an appendix to them concerning infant-baptisme. the former treatise being an exercitation presented to the chair-man of a committee of the assembly of divines. the later an examen of the sermon of mr stephen marshall, about infant-baptisme, in a letter sent to him. / by john tombes. b.d. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. excercitation about infant-baptisme. [10], 34, [2], 82, (75)-(82), 83-176, [10] p. printed for george whittington, and are to be sold at the signe of the blackmore in bishopsgate-streete., london, : december 15. 1645. a reply to: marshall, stephen. a sermon of the baptizing of infants (wing m775). the first leaf bears the permission to print. "an excercitation about infant-baptisme" has separate register and t.p. dated 1646, and was also issued separately (wing t1805). "an examen of the sermon of mr. stephen marshal, about infant-baptisme" (thomason e.312[2]) has separate dated t.p. and pagination; register is continuous. 2d4 is blank. the last four leaves (quire 2e) contain: latin passages englished in the second treatise. quire (p) (p. (75)-(82)) inserted between quire p and q. annotation on thomason copy: "decemb. 16". reproduction of the original in the british library. eng marshall, stephen, 1594?-1655. -sermon of the baptizing of infants. infant baptism -early works to 1800. a94741 r200471 (thomason e312_1 e312_2). civilwar no tvvo treatises and an appendix to them concerning infant-baptisme.: the former treatise being an exercitation presented to the chair-man of tombes, john 1645 19947 3 55 0 0 4 0 49 d the rate of 49 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the d category of texts with between 35 and 100 defects per 10,000 words. 2007-05 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-05 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2007-06 pip willcox sampled and proofread 2007-06 pip willcox text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion tvvo treatises and an appendix to them concerning infant-baptisme . the former treatise being an exercitation presented to the chair-man of a committee of the assembly of divines . the later an examen of the sermon of mr stephen marshall , about infant-baptisme , in a letter sent to him . by john tombes . b. d. prov. 23. 23. buy the truth , and sell it not . acts 8. 36 , 37 , 38. and the eunuch said , see here is water , what doth hinder me to be baptized ? and philip said , if thou believest with all thine heart , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , thou maist , or it is lawfull . and he answered , and said , i believe that jesus christ is the son of god . and he commanded the charet to stand still , and they went down both into the water , both philip and the eunuch , and he baptized him . bernard . serm. 66. in cantica . irrident nos quia baptizamus infantes , quòd oramus pro mortuis , quòd sanctorum suffragia postulamus . joan. lodovic . vives comment in augustin . tom. 5. de civit . dei . lib. 1. cap. 27. nemo olim sacro admovebatur baptisterio , nisi adulta jam aetate , & cum idem ipse & sciret quid sibi mystica illa vellet aqua , & se ablui illa peteret , nec semel peteret . cujus rei imaginem adhuc in nostris infantium baptismis videmus . nam rogatur etiam , num infans eo die natus , vel pridie , velitne baptizari , idque ter : pro quo susceptores respondent , velle . audio in quibusdā italiae urbibus morē veterē magna ex parte adhuc conservari . london , printed for george whittington , and are to be sold at the signe of the blackmore in bishopsgate-streete . december 15. 1645. the author of this examen being ( as i heare ) a godly man , and of the presbyterian judgement , though i am not of opinion with him ( notwithstanding any thing i have here read ) viz. that infants are not the subject of baptisme ; yet the end of his writing , as i conceive , being the provoking of others to write , that so his arguments being answered , himselfe and those that are of his minde may receive satisfaction , i permit it to passe the presse : not doubting but since now ( according to the desire of many ) it is knowne where the chiefe strength of the catapaedobaptists lies , some will be found out in due time to encounter with it . john bachiler . the contents of the first treatise . pag. 1. sect. 1. the first argument for infant-baptisme from the interest in the promise , gen. 17. 7. examined . pag. 5. sect. 2. the second argument for infant-baptisme , from the succession of baptisme to circumcision , examined . pag. 8. sect. 3. the third argument from the parity of grace in the new testament to that in the old , examined . pag. 9. sect. 4. the argument from acts. 2. 38 , 39. for infant-baptisme , examined . pag. 10. sect. 5. the argument from 1 cor. 7. 14. for infant-baptisme , examined . pag. 16. sect. 6. the arguments from matth. 19. 15. for infant-baptisme , examined . pag. 20. sect. 7. the argument from acts 16. 15. &c. for infant-baptisme , examined . sect. 8. the argument from generall promises for infant-baptisme , examined . sect. 9. the argument from isai. 49. 22. for infant-baptisme , examined . sect. 10. the argument from 1 cor. 10. 2. for infant-baptisme , examined . pag. 21. sect. 11. the argument from ephes. 5. 26. for infant-baptisme , examined . sect. 12. the argument from 1 pet. 2. 9. for infant-baptisme , examined . sect. 13. the argument from the churches failing , if infant-baptisme , be not lawfull , examined . pag. 22. sect. 14. the argument from heb. 6. 2. for infant-baptisme , examined . pag. 23. sect. 15. the argument from the institution of christ , matth. 28. 19. against infant-baptisme confirmed . pag. 26. sect. 16. the argument from john baptist and the apostles practise against infant-baptisme , confirmed . pag. 27. sect. 17. the argument from the practise in the age next the apostles against infant-baptisme , confirmed . pag. 28. sect. 18. the argument from the wrong originall of infant-baptisme , confirmed against it . pag. 29. sect. 19. the argument against infant-baptisme , from humane inventions , occasioned by it , confirmed . pag. 30. sect. 20. the argument against infant-baptisme , from the errors occasioned by it , confirmed . sect. 21. the argument against infant-baptisme from many abuses caused by it , confirmed . pag. 31. sect. 22. the argument from unnecessary disputes caused by it against infant-baptisme , confirmed . sect. 23. the argument against infant-baptisme , from the opposition to it in the middest of popery , confirmed . pag. 33. sect. 24. the argument against infant-baptisme , from assertors difference about the ground of it , confirmed . sect. 25. the argument against infant-baptisme , from it 's voyding the chiefe end of baptisme , confirmed . the contents of the second treatise . part. 1. concerning the antiquitie of infant-baptisme . pag. 1. sect. 1. the prologue of the occasion and end of this writing . pag. 3. sect. 2. of the stating the question , partition of the treatise , summe of the answer to the testimonies of antiquitie for infant-baptisme . pag. 4. sect. 3. of the pretended testimony of justin martyr . pag. 5. sect. 4. of irenaeus his testimony . pag. 7. sect. 5. of the supposed testimony of origen . pag. 8. sect. 6. of the testimonies of gregory nazianzen , and the greeke church . pag. 10. sect. 7. of the testimony of cyprian . pag. 12. sect. 8. of the testimony of augustine . pag. 17. sect. 9. of the testimonies of hierome , and ambrose . sect. 10. of the validitie of proofe by these testimonies , and of the evidences that infant-baptisme is an innovation . part. 2. concerning the prejudices against antipaedobaptists , from their miscarriages . pag. 19. sect. 1. of the fitnesse of placing the ●●●●ation of miscarriages of opposers of paedobaptisme . pag. 20. sect. 2. of the opposers of infant-baptisme afore baltazar . pag. 22. sect. 3. of baltazar pacimontanus . pag. 23. sect. 4. of rebaptizing . sect. 5. of the anabaptists in germany , and antiprelatists in england . pag. 25. sect. 6. of anabaptists opposing magistracy . pag. 26. sect. 7. of the hindering of reformation by anabaptisme . pag. 27. sect. 8. the antipaedobaptists principle overthrows not the lords day , the paedobaptists principle reduceth judaisme , and popish ceremonies , and addes to the gospel . pag. 31. sect. 9. of the evill of separating from the ministery and communion of christians , by reason of this opinion . pag. 32. sect. 10. of the condition into which the opinion of antipaedobaptisme puts the infants of believers , of originall sin , salvation out of the church and covenant of grace . part. 3. concerning the arguments from scripture for infant-baptisme . pag. 35. sect. 1. of the connexion between the covenant and the seale . pag. 39. sect. 2. of the first conclusion concerning the identity of the covenant of grace , for substance to jews and gentiles . pag. 40. sect. 3. of the meaning of the second conclusion . pag. 48. sect. 4. that the covenant of grace is not made to believers and their seede . pag. 54. sect. 5. it is not in gods church like other kingdomes . pag. 56. sect. 6. of the texts , which are acts 2. 38 , 39. luk. 19. 9. pag. 62. sect. 7. of the text , rom. 11. 16. pag. 69. sect. 8. of the text , 1 cor. 7. 14. pag. 83. sect. 9. of the succession of baptisme , into the place , roome and use of circumcision . pag. 95. sect. 10. of the notion under which and the reason for which persons were circumcised , shewing that all persons that were circumcised were not in the covenant of grace . pag. 99. sect. 11. of the priviledges of believers under the gospel , and whether the want of infant-baptisme , be want of a priviledge of the covenant of grace , which the jewes had . pag. 110. sect. 12. that the command to circumcise male infants , is not virtually a command to baptize infants . pag. 122. sect. 13. that matth. 28. 19. is not a command to baptize infants , but contrary to it . pag. 137. sect. 14. of examples in scripture of baptizing infants , particularly of baptizing housholds . pag. 142. sect. 15. of an infants capacitie of inward grace , the text , matth. 19. 14 and of the inconsequence of paedobaptisme thereon . part. 4. concerning the objections against infant-baptisme . pag. 151. sect. 1. of the first objection from institution , matth. 28. 19. and the practise of john baptist , and the apostles . pag. 156. sect. 2. of the second objection , and therein of the condition prerequisite to baptisme . pag. 157. sect. 3. of the third so called objection , and therein of the knowledge requisite concerning the person to be baptized . pag. 161. sect. 4. of the fourth objection , and therein of the stipulation as baptisme . pag. 163. sect. 5. of the fifth objection , and therein of the benefit that comes by infant-baptisme . pag. 167. sect. 6. of the sixth objection , and therein of infant-communion by vertue of their being in the covenant , and the lords supper succeeding the passeover . pag. 170. sect. 7. of the first use , and the anabaptists supposed blouds sentence . pag. 170. sect. 8. the epilogue , containing some expressions and motions of the author . the content of the appendix . pag. 173. that colos. 2. 11 , 12. proves not infant-baptisme . errata . treatise 1. pag. 7. line 24. rationals , read rationale , p. 9. l. 3. 17. r. 7. p. 10. l 20. minor , r. major . p. 16. l. 4. put such back . r. put back such p. 22. l. 30. dele ( ) p. 28. margin r. 18. p. 29. l. 24. baptisme , r. baptisme , may be supplied p. 34. l. 16. as well , r. as well as . treatise 2. p. 4. l. 29 . lived anno , r. lived about anno p. 10. l. 7. differing , r. differring . p. 20. their , r. them , p. 22. l 13. 40th r. cth p. 23. l. 2. 1622 r. 1522. l. 36. arian , r. aerian p 32 l. 25. character , r. charter . p. 40. l. 32. sectare , r sect p. 48. in the margin , sminati , r. seminati . l. 34 words , r. word . p. 52. l. 5. 8. r. 6. p. 58. l. 23. thee , r. bee . p. 61. in the margin , 36. r. 39. p. 63 l. 6. invsible , r. invisible l. 18. visible , r. invisible , p. ( 78. ) l. 15. believers , r. unbelievers . p. 93. l. 21. anology , r. analogy in some other thing p 97. l 24. sort of , r sort dele of p. 107. l. 28. second , r. first . p 111. l. 3 , 1. 1. r. 2. p. 114. l. 38. opposition , r. opposition p. 117. l. 5. which now r. which is now . p. 117. l. 39. 10. r. 20. p. 116. l. 29. due . r. the l 37. vented , r. vented a conceit p. 127. l 21. a rule , r a title p. 132 in the margin , baley , r. baylie p. 133. l. 12 17 r. 18. l. 15. 12 r. 11. p. 135 , l. 5. doth here , r. doth not here . p. 136. l. 13. 26. r. 28. p. 139. l. 33. 2. r. p. 142. l. 36. this r. the p. 163. l. 8. l. 4. r. 48. an exercitation about infant-baptisme ; presented in certaine papers , to the chair-man of a committee of the assembly of divines , selected to consider of that argument , in the yeers , 1643 , and 1644. with some few emendations , additions , and an answer to one new objection . translated out of latine , by the author . published according to order . london , printed by m. s. for george whittington , 1646. an exercitation concerning infant-baptisme . the present tenent , according to which infant-baptisme is practised , is , that the infants born of a believer , are universally to be baptized . this doctrine and practice conformable , is made doubtfull to me , by these arguments . arg. 1. that which hath no testimony of scripture for it , is doubtfull . but this doctrine of infant-baptisme , hath no testimony of scripture for it ; ergo , it is doubtfull . the minor is proved by examining the places that are brought for it , which are these : gen. 17. 7 , &c. acts 2. 38 , 39. 1 cor. 7. 14. mark . 10. 14. 16. acts 16. 15. 32. 1 cor. 1. 16. the argument from gen. 17. 7 , &c. is almost the first and last in this businesse ; and therefore is the more accurately to be examined ; but it hath so many shapes , that i may here take up that speech , with what knot shall i hold shape-changing proteus ? but in the issue , it falls into one or other of these forms : the first thus ; to whom the gospel-covenant agrees , to them the sign of the gospel-covenant agrees also . but to the infants of believers the gospel-covenant agrees ; therefore to them the sign of the gospel-covenant agrees , and consequently baptisme . the minor is proved from gen. 17. 7. where god promiseth to abraham , i will be a god to thee , and to thy seed after thee . i answer , that we may meet with this argument , divers things are to be examined , which are taken for granted : first , whether the gospel-covenant , and the covenant made with abraham be the same : secondly , what seed of abraham it is , of which it is said , i will be a god to thee and to thy seed : thirdly , whether there be the same reason of circumcision and of baptisme in signing the gospel-covenant : fourthly , whether these terms be convertible [ federate , and to be signed ] . of these , i say ; 1. the covenant made with abraham , is not a pure gospel-covenant , but mixt , which i prove ; the covenant takes its denomination from the promises ; but the promises are mixt , some euangelicall , belonging to those to whom the gospel belongeth , some are domestique , or civill promises , specially respecting the house of abraham , and policy of israel ; ergo . that was euangelicall which we reade , gen. 17. 5. i have made thee a father of many nations ; and that which we find , gen. 15. 5. so shall thy seed be ; in which it is promised , that there shall be of the nations innumerable that shall be abrahams children by believing , rom. 4. 17 , 18. it was euangelicall , which we find , gen. 12. 3. & gen. 18. 18. and in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed ; for in these is promised blessing to believers , of whom abraham is father , gal. 3. 8 , 9. and by christ , who is the seed of abraham , gal. 3. 16. acts 3. 25. domestique and civill promises were many ; of the multiplying the seed of abraham , the birth of isaac ; of the continuation of the covenant with isaac ; of the coming of christ out of isaac ; the bondage of the israelites in egypt , and deliverance thence ; of possessing the land of canaan , gen. 15. 13. 18. gen. 17. 7 , 8. 15. 16. act. 7. 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , 8. and many other places . yea , it is to be noted , that those promises which were euangelicall , according to the more inward sense of the holy ghost , do point at the priviledges of abrahams house , in the outward face of the words ; whence it may be well doubted , whether this covenant made with abraham , may be called simply euangelicall , and so pertain to believers , as such , although there be euangelicall promises in that covenant , pertaining to all believers , as believers . there were annexed to the covenant on mount sinai , sacrifices pointing at the sacrifice of christ , and yet we call not that covenant simply euangelicall , but in some respect . secondly , the seed of abraham is many wayes so called : first , christ is called the seed of abraham , by excellency , gal. 3. 16. secondly , all the elect , rom. 9. 7. all believers , rom. 4. 11 , 12. 16. 17 , 18. are called the seed of abraham , that is , the spirituall seed . thirdly , there was a naturall seed of abraham , to whom the inheritance did accrue ; this was isaac , gen. 21. 12. fourthly , a naturall seed , whether lawfull , as the sons of keturah , or base , as ishmael , to whom the inheritance belonged not , gen. 15. 5. but no where do i find , that the infants of believers of the gentiles are called abrahams seed , of the three former kinds of abrahams seed , the promise recited , is meant , but in a different manner thus : that god promiseth , he will be a god to christ , imparting in him blessing to all nations of the earth , to the spirituall seed of abraham in euangelicall benefits , to the naturall seed inheriting , in domestick and politicall benefits . 3. that the promise of the gospel , or gospel-covenant , was the same in all ages , in respect of the thing promised , and condition of the covenant , which we may call the substantiall and essentiall part of that covenant , to wit , christ , faith , sanctification , remission of sins , eternall life ; yet this euangelicall covenant had divers forms in which these things were signified , and various sanctions , by which it was confirmed : to adam , the promise was made under the name of the seed of the woman , bruising the head of the serpent ; to enoch , noah , in other forms ; otherwise to abraham , under the name of his seed , in whom all nations should be blessed ; otherwise to moses , under the obscure shadows of the law ; otherwise to david , under the name of a successor in the kingdome ; otherwise in the new testament , in plain words , 2 cor. 3. 6. heb. 8. 10. it had likewise divers sanctions . the promise of the gospel was confirmed to abraham by the sign of circumcision , and by the birth of isaac ; to moses by the paschall lamb , and the sprinkling of blood on the book , the rain of mannah , and other signs ; to david by an oath ; in the new testament , by christs blood , 1 cor. 11. 25. therefore circumcision signified and confirmed the promise of the gospel , according to the form and sanction of the covenant with abraham , baptisme signifies and confirms the same promise according to the form , sanction and accomplishment of the new testament : now these forms and sanctions differ many wayes , as much as concerns our present purpose in these : first , circumcision confirmed not only euangelicall promises , but also politicall ; and if we may believe mr. cameron , in his theses of the threefold covenant of god , thesi . 78. circumcision did primarily separate the seed of abraham from other nations , sealed unto them the earthly promise ; secondarily , it did signifie sanctification : but baptisme signifies only euangelicall benefits . secondly , circumcision did confirm the promise concerning christ to come out of isaac ; baptisme assures christ to be already come , to have been dead , and to have risen again , thirdly , circumcision belonged to the church , constituted in the house of abraham , baptisme to the church gathered out of all nations ; whence i gather , that there is not the same reason of circumcision and baptisme , in signing the euangelicall covenant ; nor may there be an argument drawn from the administration of the one to the like manner of administring the other . 4. that some there were circumcised , to whom no promise in the covenant made with abraham did belong ; of ishmael , god had said , that his covenant was not to be established with him , but with isaac ; and yet he was circumcised , gen. 17. 20 , 21. 25. rom. 9. 7 , 8 , 9. gal. 4. 29 , 30. the same may be said of esau : all that were in abrahams house , whether strangers , or born in his house , were circumcised , gen. 17. 12 , 13. of whom neverthelesse , it may be doubted , whether any promises of the covenant made with abraham , did belong to them ; there were other persons , to whom all , or most of the promises in the covenant pertained , that were not circumcised ; this may be affirmed of the females , coming from abraham , the infants dying before the eighth day , of just men , living out of abrahams house , as melchisedech , lot , job . if any say , that the females were circumcised in the circumcision of the males , he saith it without proof ; and by like , perhaps greater , reason it may be said , that the children of believers are baptized in the persons of their parents , and therefore are not to be baptized in their own persons . but it is manifest that the jewes comprehended in the covenant made with abraham , and circumcised , were neverthelesse not admitted to baptisme by john baptist , and christs disciples , till they professed repentance , and faith in christ . hence i gather , first , that the right to euangelicall promises , was not the adequate reason of crrcumcising these or those , but gods precept , as is expressed , gen. 17. 23. gen. 21. 4. secondly , that those terms are not convertible , [ federate and to be signed ] . whereupon i answer to the argument : first , either by denying the major , if it be universally taken , otherwise it concludes nothing : or by granting it with this limitation ; it is true of that sign of the covenant which agrees universally in respect of form and sanction , to them that receive the gospel , but it is not true of that sign of the covenant , which is of a particular form or sanctior of which sort is circumcision . secondly , i answer by denying the minor , universally taken , the reason is , because those children only of believing gentiles , are abrahams children , who are his spirituall seed , according to the election of grace by faith , which are not known to us , but by profession , or speciall revelation . the second argument is thus formed : to whom circumcision did agree , to them baptisme doth agree , but to infants circumcision did agree , therefore also baptisme . the major is thus proved : if the baptisme of christ succeed into the place of circumcision , then baptisme belongs to them that circumcision belonged to ; but the antecedent is true , therefore also the consequent . the minor is proved to be true , because , colos. 2. 11 , 12. it is said the colossians were circumcised , because they were buried with christ in baptisme . for answer : this argument supposeth baptisme to succeed in the place of circumcision , which may be understood many wayes . 1. so as that the sense be , that those persons be to be baptized , which heretofore by gods command were to be circumcised , and in this sense the argument must proceed , if it conclude to the purpose ; but in this sense it is false , for no females were to be circumcised , which yet are to be baptized , acts 16. 14 , 15. and believers out of abrahams house , as lot , melchisedech , job , were not to be circumcised , but believing gentiles are universally to be baptized . 2. it may be so understood , as if the rite of baptisme then began , when the rite of circumcision did , or was of right to end ; but this is not to be said : for john baptist and the disciples of christ baptized , joh. 4. 1 , 2. before circumcision of right ceased , and they who first were circumcised , were after baptized , being converted to the faith , as is manifest concerning paul , phil. 3. 5. acts 9. 18. 3. it may be understood , as if baptisme did succeed into the place of circumcision , in respect of its signification , which is true in some things : first , it is true that both signified the righteousnesse of faith , rom. 4. 11. rom. 6. 3. gal. 3. 27. 1 pet. 3. 21. secondly , it is true , both signified sanctification of the heart , and this is all that may be concluded out of the place alledged , col. 2. 11 , 12. to which i think meet to adde ; that if the text be looked into , that place speaks not of any circumcision , but of christs circumcision in whom we are compleat , and by whose circumcision we are said to put off the body of the sins of the flesh ; nor doth the text say , we are circumcised , because we are baptized ; but we are compleat in christ , because we are circumcised in him , and buried with him in baptisme , in which , or in whom , ye are also risen together , through the faith of the operation of god that raised him from the dead . in some things baptisme doth not succeed into the place of circumcision , in respect of signification : for , first circumcision did signifie christ to come of isaac , according to the flesh , gen. 17. 10. 21. but baptisme doth not signifie this , but points at the incarnation , death , and resurrection of christ . secondly , circumcision was a sign that the israelites were a people separated from all nations , rom. 3. 1. but baptisme signifieth , that all are one in christ , gal. 3. 28. thirdly , circumcision signified that moses law was to be observed , gal. 5. 3. but baptisme doth signifie that moses his law is made voyd , and the doctrine of christ to be retained , acts 10. 37. fourthly , circumcision did sign the promise of the land of canaan , baptisme eternall life by christ . from hence i answer to the argument : first , by denying the major of the fore syllogisme . secondly , to the conditionall syllogisme , by denying the consequence of the major , if the antecedent be understood of succession , in the third sense , in respect of some signification granted ; but if the succession be understood in the first , second , or third sense , in respect of other significations , the minor is denied ; the proof from col. 2. 11 , 12. is already answered . and indeed , if this argument be not warily , and restrainedly understood , an egge is laid , out of which manifest judaisme may be hatched , but if it be taken restrainedly , no more follows thence , but that baptisme and circumcision in some things , signifie the same , which is more plainly said of noahs flood , 1 pet. 3. 21. of the red sea , and the cloud that guided , 1 cor. 10. 2. and yet we say not that baptisme succeeded into their place , much lesse do we inferre any rite to be instituted in their stead , respecting the same persons ; yea verily it is to be seriously thought on . 1. that by such arguments drawn from analogies , not conceived by the holy spirit , but drawn out of our wit , a new kinde of instituting rites , to wit , from analogies , is brought in , besides our lords precepts and the apostles examples . 2. this being once laid , by like manner of argumentation , it will be lawfull to bring into the christian church , under other names and forms , the whole burthen of jewish rites ; yea , almost , out of what you will , to conclude what you will ; for who shall put a bound to mens wits faining analogie , when they go beyond the lords precepts , and the apostles examples ? it is well known , that the divine appointment of tythes to be paid , and many other things , in the writings of divines , are asserted by this kinde of argument , besides the rule of the lords precept and the apostles example . 3. hereby will the opinion of papists be confirmed , who affirm from 1 cor. 10. 11. the sacraments of the jewes , to be types of the sacraments of christians , which is rejected by divines that dispute against bellarmine . 4. this manner of arguing will countenance the arguments of the papists for an universall bishop , because there was an high priest amongst the jews ; for sacrificing priests , because the jews had such ; for a linen garment at masse , because there was such among the jews ; for holy water , purification of women , easter , pentecost , and many more such ceremonies , for which the papist do in like manner argue , as appears out of durandus rationals , and other interpreters of rituals among the papists ; yea , what hindreth , but we may give children the lords supper , if we argue this way , sith samuel , jesus christ under age , were partakers of the passeover , and of right , all the males were to appeare thrice in the yeer , before the lord ; and therefore it is certain they did eat the passeover ; and it shall be after shewed , that the place , 1 cor. 11. 28. will not avoyd this inconvenience , if the text , matth. 28. 19. may be shifted off , as paedo-baptists use to do . lest any man take this for a light suggestion , i will adde , that grave , godly and learned men , have often warned , that we are to take heed , that we do not rashly frame arguments from analogie : among others in their late writings , in the english tongue , john paget , in his defence of church-government , part . 1. chap. 3. pag. 8. and elsewhere , john ball in his reply to the answer of the new-england elders , unto the 9. positions , posit . 2. pag. 14. lastly , it is to be considered again and again , how by these argumentations , consciences may be freed from the danger of wil-worship and polluting so remarkable an ordinance of christ as baptisme is , specially this care lies on them , who by prayers , sermons , writings , covenants and oaths , do deterre christians from humane inventions , in gods worship diligently , and as is to be hoped sincerely . the third argument is thus framed . if baptisme be not granted to the infants of believers , then the grace of god will be more restrained in the new testament then in the old : but this is not to be affirmed ; therefore baptisme is to be granted to infants of believers . answ. 1. if this argument be of any weight , it will prove that the grace of god is straitened , because we give not the lords supper to children , to whom the passeover was given , as appears by that which was above said . 2. the grace of god is not tied to sacraments , neither do sacraments give grace by the work done , and therefore grace is not restrained , though sacraments be never granted , grace is not denyed to an excommunicated person , who is inhibited the lords supper , the grace of god is free , whether we understand it of the divine affection , or the effects of it ; nor can be made larger or narrower by our act . 3. yet it is not absurd to say , that in respect of some priviledges , the grace of god is more contracted in the new testament then in the old : for instance , no family hath now the priviledge that was granted to abrahams family , that out of it christ should be born ; no man besides abraham is called the father of the faithfull ; no woman besides one , the mother of christ ; neverthelesse , simply the grace of god is said to be larger in the new testament , by reason of the revelation of the gospel imparted to all nations , the more abundant communication of the holy spirit , and more plain manifestation of the mysterie of the gospel : i would have it weighed , whether those phrases of the apostle , rom. 11. 21. as the naturall branches , ver. 24. the wilde olive by nature , were 't graffed contrary to nature . these which be naturall branches , do not sufficiently imply , that the jewes children by their birth had a priviledge beyond the gentiles children . thereupon i answer to the argument : first , by denying the consequence of the major , for the reason given : secondly , by denying the minor , if it be understood of straitning the grace of god , in respect of some priviledge , although the assumption may be granted , if understood of the straitning gods grace simply . the summe of the answer to the arguments , drawn from gen. 17. 17. is this : the sacraments are not to be administred according to rules taken from our reasonings , but gods appointment . rightly doth mr. ball forenamed , in the book forenamed , posit. 3. & 4. pag. 38. say , but in whatsoever circumcision and baptisme , do agree or differ , we must look to the institution , and neither stretch it wider , nor draw it narrower then the lord hath made it , for he is the institutor of the sacraments according to his own good pleasure ; and it is our part to learn of him , both to whom , how , and for what end the sacraments are to be administred , how they agree , and wherein they differ , in all which we must affirm nothing , but what god hath taught us , and as he hath taught us . the argument from acts 2. 38 , 39. may be thus formed : to whom the promise is made , they may be baptized ; but to the infants of believers the promise is made , therefore they may be baptized . the minor is proved from the words of vers . 39. for the promise is made to you and to your children . that an answer may be fitted to this argument : 1. it is to be observed , that the promise made , is the sending of jesus christ , and blessing by him , as it is expounded , acts 3. 25 , 26. acts 13. 32 , 33. rom. 15. 8 , 9. 2. that the text saith , the promise was made to them he spake to , and their children , then to them that are afarre off , who , whether they be gentiles , who are said to be afarre of , ephes. 2. 12. or jewes , in future ages and generations , as beza thinks , are limited by the words closing the verse , as many as the lord our god shall call , which limitation plainly enough shewes the promise to appertain to them not simply as jewes , but as called of god , which is more expresly affirmed , acts 3. 26. to you , god having raised up his son jesus , sent him to blesse you , in turning away every one of you from his iniquity : or as beza , every one of you turning your selves from your iniquities ; therefore the promise here is not said to be made but with condition of calling , and faith , which may be confirmed aboundantly from rom. 4. 13 , 14. 16. gal. 3. 9. 14. 22. 3. that peter , vers. 38. doth exhort to repentance and baptisme together , and in the first place perswades to repentance , then baptisme , which shewes repentance to be in order before baptisme . 4. that mention is made of the promise , not as of it self , yeelding right to baptisme without repentance , but as a motive , inciting together , to repentance and baptisme . whereupon it is answered : 1. that the major is to be limited , to whom the promise is made , they may be baptized , to wit , when they are called , and have shewed signes of repentance ; if it be taken without limitation , it is to be denied . 2. by denying the minor , if it be universally taken of all infants of believers , of whose baptisme the question is ; as for the text , it speaks not expresly of infants , but of children indefinitely ; nor of the children of the gentiles at all , ( of whom we are ) but of the children of the jews , and therefore , if that promise be extended to infants , which doth not appear , the promise is to be expounded so , as to note something peculiar to the jews infants . the argument from the place , 1 cor. 7. 14. may be thus formed : they who are holy with covenant-holinesse , may be baptized : but the infants of a believer are holy , with a covenant-holinesse ; for it is said in the text , but now they are holy ; therefore they may be baptized . i answer : 1. the minor is not true , universally understood , as is manifest from rom. 11. 16. where it is said , if the first fruits be holy , so is the lump : if the root be holy , so are the branches . the sense is , that abraham is the first fruits , and holy root ; the elect israelites are the branches and lump ; so that it followes , that the elect of the israelites not yet called , are holy in respect of the covenant , and are not yet therefore to be baptized ; for although they may be said to be holy in regard of the covenant , of old entred into with abraham , and the gracious respect of god to them , to be manifested in opportune time , yet in their present state , before calling , they denying christ , neither infants nor grown men are to be baptized , unlesse we would have the branches broken off to be graffed into the church ; and therefore , although the sense were in the place of 1 cor. 7. 14. your children are holy with covenant-holinesse , by reason of gods gracious favour to be manifested in due time , yet it will not follow , that they are to be baptized , who have not yet yeelded any shewes of divine grace . 2. the minor is not proved from the place alledged : for it doth not speak of federall holinesse , but of holinesse , that i may so call it , matrimoniall , so that the sense is , your children are holy , that is , legitimate . whether any in the ages before , the age last past , expounded it , of federall holinesse , as they call it , i am not yet certain : as for the exposition of that place , of that holinesse , i called matrimoniall , of it the place is expounded by aquinas , in his commentary upon the place , and perhaps by others , whom i have not yet had time to look into , but i think best to set down the words of joachimus camerarius , about this matter , in his commentary on the new testament , lately printed at cambridge ; [ for the unbelieving husband hath been sanctified ] an usuall change of the tense , that is , is sanctified , in the lawfull use of marriage , for without this ( he saith ) it would be , that their children should be unclean , that is , infamous , and not legitimate , who so are holy , that is , during the marriage are without all blot of ignominy : moreover , melancthon in his commentary on the place , therefore paul answers , that the marriages are not to be pulled asunder , for their unlike opinions of god , if the impious person do not cast away the other ; and for comfort he addes as a reason , the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the believing wife , of which speech divers interpretations are made , but the true and naturall is this , as elsewhere , he saith , meat is sanctified , for that which is holy in use , that is granted to believers from god , so here he speaks the use of marriage to be holy , and to be granted of god , [ else were ] the interpretation of the sept. so speaks unclean , it calls unclean that which is prohibited ; as wee say swines flesh was unclean by the law of moses , that is , prohibited , or a woman brought to bed , is unclean , that is , whose touching is forbidden . the connexion of the argument is this : if the use of marriage should not please god , your children would be bastards , and so unclean ; but your children are not bastards , therefore the use of marriage pleaseth god : how bastards were unclean in a peculiar manner , the law shewes , deut. 23. let not a bastard enter into the congregation of the lord , to the tenth generation , that is , let him be admitted to no function in the church ; therefore this is the most plain meaning , children are not bastards , nor to be kept away , as the law of moses kept them away ; therefore also the use of marriage pleaseth god . musculus comment . on 1 cor. 7. 14. hath these words ; [ is sanctified ] this expresseth the reason of that which he saith , let him not put her away ; perhaps , the more unskilfull christians thought such dwelling together to be unclean and unlawfull ; and they did fear , lest they should be made one body with the yoak-fellow that was an idolater , as he that is joyned to an harlot , is made one body with the harlot , and so of the members of christ , should make them members of an idolater , which hath more sin then if they should make them the members of an harlot ; for this cause , he saith , for the unbeliever is sanctified , &c. that is , for the unbelieving husband in the wife , that is , in the conjunction of the wife , which is by marriage , even long ago hath been cleansed by vertue of marriage ; so that his conjunction and copulation , hath nothing unclean : so in like manner also , the unbelieving wife , by reason of lawfull wedlock , in which shee is joyned to the man , even long ago is cleansed , that the believer is not defiled , if she live together with him ; for the word holinesse here , is taken for the cleannesse of the marriage-bed which he hath by the tradition of god , therefore he saith , else your children should be unclean , but now they are holy ; he should have said , but now they are clean , if to be holy , and clean , in this place were not the same . therefore the most plain understanding of this place is , first , in that we understand not the word holinesse , of that holinesse which is by the covenant of god , or the spirit of faith , by which believers are sanctified , as a people of god , but of the holinesse of the conjugall bed , otherwise it will bring forth a troublesome dispute , how an unbelieving husband may be said to be sanctified . then , that we attribute this sanctification that is cleannesse , not to the faith of the believing yoak-fellow , but to the marriage , by reason of the appointment of god ; with hierome , who saith , because by gods appointment , marriage is holy ; and ambrose , who hath it thus , the children are holy , because they are born of lawfull marriage ; therefore , that in the wife and in the husband , is not to be read with the addition of believer , as the old interpreter hath it , but simply , as the greek hath it ; if any thing be to be added , it is better to be added , the lawfull wife or husband , that we may understand , that the unbelieving husband is cleansed in his lawfull wife , that is , by vertue of their lawfull marriage , is not unclean , but clean , as far as appertains to the law of cohabitation of marriage , although he be impure so far as appertains to the commerce of religion , of which the word of deacons in the church was , let the prophane depart , the holy draw neer . [ else your children ] ambrose so expounds this particle [ else ] that is , if thou the believing husband shouldst put away thy unbelieving wife , and marry another , your children should be unclean , because you should be made adulterers , but [ now ] that is , if thou retain thy unbelieving wife , they are holy , because they are born of a lawfull marriage . but it is more plain , that we understand the apostle , to have respect to the sanctimony of marriage , even of them who without the faith of christ , are conjoyned in marriage , as if he had said , unlesse marriage were holy and clean , even between unbelievers , what other thing would follow , then that all the children of infidels are bastards , and unclean ? but far be it from us to say so ; they are holy , for they are born of lawfull marriage . ambrose looks to that which he said , let him not put her away ; the other exposition to that which he said , the unbelieving husband is sanctified in the wife . i have sometimes abused the present place against the error of anabaptists , keeping back infants of christians from baptisme , thinking that speech , but now are they holy , to be the same , as , they are the people of god , by reason of the believing parents ; but although it be sure in it self , that the children of believers , are both holy , and pertaining to the people of god , by reason of the participation of the covenant , and so are partakers of baptisme , as the sign of the covenant , yet the present place makes nothing to this cause , in which the sanctimony of the covenant and people is not meddled with ; but the cleannesse of lawfull marriage even of infidels : for not only to children , to whom perhaps , the holinesse of a believing parent , may so appertain , that for it they may be partakers of the covenant , but also to unbelieving husbands and wives is sanctimony ascribed , although they oppose the christian faith ; nor is any other holinesse or cleannesse of children meddled with , then that which agrees also to unbelieving parents , for to them , no other agrees , then that which is by lawfull marriage . there 's other testimonies out of scripture , from whence the anabaptists may be convinced of error ; so that there is no need to use this place against them . thus far camerarius , melancthon , musculus . perhaps some one will object , that no where is holy , the same with legitimate : to which i answer , that holinesse is put for chastity , is manifested from 1 thes. 4. 3. 4. 7. and the word [ sanctified ] in this place , what doth it found else , then [ is lawfully coupled ] and [ is sanctified ] 1 tim. 4. 5. what else doth it signifie , then [ is lawfully used ] ? at which place beza hath these words , therefore meats are said to be sanctified , which we use lawfully , and with gods good leave ; he alludes to legall purifications , and the difference between clean and unclean meats : and why may not by a like allusion , unclean , be put for bastards , and holy for legitimate ? for the bastard is among the unclean , deut. 23. 2. to which i may adde what john calvin hath on mal. 2. 15. wherefore hath god made one ? to wit , seeking a seed of god ; a seed of god is here taken for legitimate , as the hebrewes do name that divine whatsoever doth excell , yea , they call that divine which is pure from any fault and spot : therefore he sought a seed of god , that is , appointed marriage ; from whence should be born a legitimate and clean off-spring . secretly therefore doth the prophet here shew , that they are all bastards , that shall be born by polygamy , because they neither can , nor ought to be counted legitimate sons , but they who are begotten according to gods institution , but where the husband violates the faith given to the wife , and takes to himself another , as he perverts the order of marriage , so also he cannot be a lawfull father . thus calvin , and in like manner cameron praelect. in mat. 19. 5. interprets that text . lastly , if the words of the text be weighed , this will seem the only and genuine sense ; for the question which the apostle resolves was , whether the conjunction was to be retained of the believing yoak-fellow , with the unbelieving ? the reason of doubting was , because that conjunction seems impure , by reason of the impurity of the unbelieving yoak-fellow ; the apostle answers , not so : for the unbelieving husband hath been sanctified in the wife . to draw out the sense of this place , it is to be noted , that [ the unbelieving husband ] sounds the same , as if he had said , [ the husband , though he be an unbeliever ] ; for the scope requires that this be the sense , the husband , though he be an unbeliever , yet is sanctified in the wife . 2. that it is not said , in the believing wife , nor in the believing husband ( though i deny not beza observed some such thing in the clermont copy , and elsewhere ) : for the copies do not so reade , and it seems the apostle of purpose so spake , that the reason of sanctification may be intimated to be taken , not from the faith of the yoak-fellow , but conjugall relation . 3. [ {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ] is not rightly rendred , [ by ] in the vulgar and our english translation , as if the sense were , that the faith of the wife , were the cause of sanctifying the unbelieving husband , for this sense cannot be fastened to this place ; for no man will say , the faith of the unbelieving wife , sanctifies the unbelieving husband federally ; so that the unbelieving husband should be capable of baptisme by his wifes faith , ( which yet , by the good leave of such men be it said , doth as well follow from this place , as that the son is federally holy , and capable of baptisme , for the faith of the parent ) neither can it be said , that the parent is sanctified with spirituall sanctification by the faith of the wife ; for how ever it be determined that faith is the cause of inward sanctification , yet it is certain that the faith of one is not the cause of the sanctification of another , i mean , the next and effectuall cause . nor doth this sense pertain hither , the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife , that is , is renued in the spirit of his mind , by the diligence of his wife , instructing him in the faith , as she is said to save , vers. 16. for this sanctification being put , the children may remain impure , and not holy ; the contrary whereof is here asserted : and this sanctification is contingent , it may be , or it may not be , as is manifest from vers . 16. for how knowest thou ? but in this place the sanctification is certain and necessary , else it should not take away the doubt , about the retaining the conjunction ; nor doth the sense pertain hither , the unbelieving husband is sanctified in the wife , that is , the wife , because she hath faith , hath used the unbelieving husband without all scruple of conscience ; for the contrary was the occasion of this discourse ; nor doth this belong a whit to the impurity or holinesse of the children ; therefore more rightly [ {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ] is rendred in latine in the dative , [ to the wife ] for the particle {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , is often so used , as gal. 1. 16. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , to me , 2 pet. 1. 5. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , to faith , acts 4. 12. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , to men ; and 1 cor. 7. 15. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , is rendred by beza unto peace : the sense then is , that the unbelieving husband is sanctified to the wife , that is , is not coupled as an unclean fornicator , but as a lawfull husband , and that copulation is holy , that is , remains chast , the unbeliever remaining a husband ; for an unbeliever is a husband , and therefore the use of him is chast , [ else ] the apostle proves what he had said , of the sanctification of the unbelieving husband , to the wife , and the order being turned , by an argument from an absurdity , which may be reduced unto this form : if the unbelieving husband be not sanctified to the wife , and the order turned , then your children should be unclean ; but your children are not unclean , but holy ; ergo . [ {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , else ] plainly shewes , that absurdity would follow , if this were not granted , that the unbelieving husband is sanctified to the wife , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , otherwise certainly , as beza renders it , your children are unclean , that is , your children which you have have hitherto begotten , should be unclean , that is , bastards , but now they are holy : [ but now ] beza rightly notes it , is not an adverb of time , but a conjunction , that is wont to be used in the assumptions of arguments , and the sense is , [ but now ] that is , but for as much as the unbelieving husband is sanctified to the wife , that is , in respect of the use of the wife , your children are holy , that is , lawfully begotten and born ; but if it be granted the sanctification is understood of lawfull and chast use , ( which is necessarily to be yeelded ) and yet the uncleannesse and holinesse be understood of that which they call federall , then this will follow , that the children born of wives superadded to the first , incestuous , concubines and harlots are not within the covenant , neither to be circumcised nor baptized , whereas not only ishmael by abraham , but also many sons of jacob , the sons of judah , pharez and zarah by thamar , were circumcised ; nor doth custome or canon put such back children from baptism ; but in very deed , this cannot be the sense , for only holines , which i call matrimoniall , of the children , followeth from matrimoniall lawfull copulation , which is here asserted , and only uncleannesse opposite to legitimation , follows illegitimate , and polluted copulation , and of these alone there was doubt amongst the corinthian christians , and therfore the apostles resolution . nor yet , as beza inferres , if this sense be put , should the apostle draw an argument from civill laws , to pacifie conscience , but he using his apostolicall authority , resolves the doubts in this chapter , and teacheth , that according to gods law , and christs precept , the marriage is not dissolved by the infidelity of either yoak-fellow , but that they may lawfully dwell together , and couple , according to gods institution of marriage . as for that which beza saith , no man hath ever said truly , that marriage is holy between two unbelievers , and that their children are holy , sith their meats are unclean to them , as being to be sanctified by the word , and giving of thanks ; it is true , if we speak of the sanctification of the heart , but it is manifest from that which is before said , that the apostle speaks of the sanctification and sanctity , that is in chastity , and legitimation , and in respect of it beza grants the marriage of infidels not to be accounted before god for fornication ; for marriage is honourable among all , even unbelievers , and the bed undefiled , but whoremongers and adulerers god will judge , heb. 13. 4. but honour and holinesse sound the same , 1 thes. 4. 4. the argument from mat. 19. 15. mar. 10. 14. 16. luke 18. 15 , 16 , 17. may be formed in divers manners : first thus ; they are to be baptized , whom christ commands to be brought to him , being moved with indignation towards his disciples , that repelled them . but christ commands infants to be brought to him . ergo . that this argument may be examined , it is to be considered : 1. who they were that brought these children . 2. what little children they were that were brought . 3. upon what motives . 4. to what end . 5. what time . 6. in what place they brought them . 7. for what cause the apostles did repell them . 8. for what cause christ being angry with the apostles , com in many of these , we have scarce any thing beside conjectures , which we may follow , neither have i leisure or books to look into all things which commentators have discoursed concerning these heads . as for the first , it it is supposed that the bringers were either parents , or other believers , who at least wished well to the little children ; which is probable from the end for which they brought them , to wit , that he might blesse them , and pray for them , for this shewed faith and love . as for the second , it is probable they were children of jews , because this was done in the coasts of judea , mat. 19. 1. mar. 10. 1. but whether the parents of the children believed in christ or otherwise , is not manifest . as for the third , concerning the motive , there is little certain , whether it were upon the sight , or hearing of that which christ did , mat. 18. 2. or from a custome among the jews , of seeking the blessing of prophets and holy men , for their little ones , as rebecca for jacob , joseph for his sons ; or from the fame of things done upon the praiers of christ ; or an instinct from god , that occasion might be given of teaching the things that christ taught upon this matter ; or some other motive . as for the fourth , the end is expressed by matthew , that he might put on hands and pray ; by mark and luke , tha the might touch them , which tends to impart a blessing . as for the fifth , matthew points at the time , by the particle [ then ] and both mark and matthew , put it after the dissertation , with the pharisees concerning divorce , and the answer to the disciples exception , which mark testifies was made in the house ; luke puts it after the parable of the publican and the pharisee , but he is wont to relate things out of their right place . but what the holy spirit doth intimate , by noting the time precisely , i guesse not , unlesse perhaps he would have it noted , that an occasion was opportunely ministred , of amplifying the argument concerning making a mans self an eunuch for the kingdome of heaven , though this reason doth not very much like me . as for the sixth , the place is intimated , mat. 19. 1. mar. 10. 1. in the coasts of judea , beyond jordan , in matthew ; by the farther side of jordan , in mark ; about which it availeth not to our present purpose to inquire . as for the seventh , the reason of repelling , is not known , but by conjecture , it is probable this bringing of little children , was troublesom to them , either because it did interrupt christs speech about marriage , and fitness to the kingdom of heaven , or because they sought rest in the house , or because they did think this bringing would be in vain . as for the eighth , christ without doubt , was angry with the disciple , because they hindred the occasion of doing good to men , whereas christ went about doing good , act. 10. 38. and in this business the faith of the bringers was to be cherished , and the power of blessing in christ was to be manifested , & the excellent doctrine to be delivered , concerning little childrens being capable of the kingdome of heaven , of the quality of them who receive the kingdome of heaven ; but whether christ would that this fact should remain , as a perpetuall rule for baptizing the infants of believers , is yet a question . it seems , scarce probable it should be so . 1. because baptisme of infants , being meerly positive , so obscure and doubtfull an institution , is without example and reason . 2. because we find no practice or hint in scripture , which may expound this fact to this sense . 3. because , if he had given a command to the apostles of baptizing infants , he had rather said , bring the little children to me , then suffer them to be brought to me . 4. he had declared whose infants he would have baptized , and not have spoken so indefinitely , it is certain , before the command , mat. 28. 19 , 20. there is no precept extant , concerning baptizing gentiles , much lesse concerning baptizing the infants of the gentiles . 5. the words , suffer & forbid not , and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , these little children , as beza reads , shew that christs words are meant only of those children . 6. if this fact pertain to baptisme , then we must say , that christ baptized , the contrary whereof is said , joh. 4. 2. as for that which is objected , that three euangelists rehearse this fact , that thence a perpetuall rule may be drawn , of bringing infants to christ by an outward ordinance , which is not done but by baptisme , it is weak : for , 1. three euangelists rehearse the bringing of the palsie man to christ , the accesse of the leprous person to christ , and many other things , from which yet no perpetuall rule is formed . 2. if any rule be hence to be formed , that is to be perpetually observed , this relation will serve more fitly to establish episcopall confirmation , by laying on hands , and praying , then presbyteriall baptisme . secondly , we must distinguish , concerning bringing to christ ; there is a bringing to christ , by locall admotion , there is another bringing to christ by spirituall instruction ; this bringing to christ , is the cause of baptisme , not the other : for many were brought by the command of christ , to christ , as the blind son of timaeus , and others , of whose baptisme , or conversion we reade not ; for not all that were corporally healed by christ , were also spiritually healed , as we are to say of the nine lepers . malchus and others . 3. the argument supposeth they may be baptized , whom christ commands to be brought , but neither is this true of spirituall bringing ; for not those whom he commands to be brought spiritually , are to be baptized , but those whom he hath brought ; as for that which is said , they are repelled from christ , that are repelled from baptisme , it is a light thing , for baptisme doth not bring men to christ , unlesse the persons be first in christ ; neither is therefore any man repelled from christ , because he is not baptized , but when he is kept back , being fit for baptism . to the argument therefore answer is made , by denying the major universally taken . secondly , the argument is thus formed : arg. those whom christ imbraced , laid his hands on , blessed , may be baptized ; but christ imbraced infants , &c. ergo . answ. i answer , this argument supposeth these acts of christ , to have been all one , as if he had baptized , but this is said without proof , in very deed , that act of blessing was more then baptisme , and yet it had not the same reason with baptisme ; it is manifest out of joh. 4. 2. that baptisme was an act of ministry , which christ did not exercise by himself , but his disciples , but that blessing was an act , by which he obtained some singular gift from god by prayers for those infants , upon whom he had laid his hands ; nor is this benefit said to be bestowed on them for the faith of their parents , but out of singular favour which christ bestowed upon many , as lazarus , with his sisters , john the apostle and others , therefore the major proposition is to be denied ; for there is no connexion between this act , which is extraordinary , and the act of ordinary ministery , which is to be fulfilled according to the lords prescription . the third argument is thus formed . arg. they may be baptized , whose is the kingdome of heaven ; but of infants is the kingdome of heaven ; ergo . answ. i answer , the major proposition is true , if it be understood of those whose is the kingdome of heaven , when it appears that the kingdome of heaven belongs to them , otherwise it is not true . secondly , it is not said in the text [ of infants is the kingdom of heaven ] but , of such is the kingdome of heaven ; and christ expounds what he means , mar. 10. 15. luke 18. 17. to wit , of them who in humility of mind , are like little children , as it is mat. 18. 3 , 4. but if [ of such ] be to be expounded , as beza would , annot. in mat. 19. 14. of these and the like , as above , 18. it is not proved from thence , that the kingdome of heaven pertains to all infants of believers , but to them whom he then blessed , and to those persons who either are so blessed , or are converted and humble as little children . whence it is answered ; first by denying the major , if it be expounded universally and unrestrainedly : secondly , by denying the minor , as it is put indefinitely , for the reasons above put . the argument from the place , act. 16. 15. 32. 33. act. 18. 8. 1 cor. 1. 16. is thus formed : if the apostle baptized whole housholds , then infants ; but the apostle baptized whole housholds , ergo . answ. this argument rests on a sleight conjecture , that there were infants in those houses , and that those infants were baptized , whereas the words of the text evince not these things , yea , those things which are said , acts 16. 32. he spake the word of the lord to him , and to all in his house ; and vers. 33. he rejoyced , believing god with all his house . act. 18. 8. crispus believed the lord with his whole house , do plainly prove , that under the name of the whole house , are understood those only that heard the word of god and believed . whence it is answered by denying the consequence of the major proposition . some other arguments occur , which make a number without strength . first , it is argued from generall promises , made to the godly and their seed , exod. 20. 6. psal. 112. 2 , &c. whence it is gathered , that god makes a difference betwixt the children of the godly and the wicked , that he promiseth blessing to those , not to these , therefore the children of the godly are to be baptized , not the other . answ. the promises recited , are first generall and indefinite ; secondly , for the most part concerning corporall good things ; thirdly , with the exception of free election ; fourthly , to be understood with the implyed condition of faith and repentance , and so they serve not to this purpose . secondly , from isai. 49. 22. it is foretold that gentiles should bring their sons in their arms , and their daughters on their shoulders , therfore the prophet foresaw in spirit , the baptisme of the little ones of the gentiles . answ. first , little ones might be brought for other ends then baptisme , as mat. 19. 15. secondly , i will use the words of francis junius in his annot. on the place , all these things are said allegorically , of the spirituall amplification of the kingdome of christ , as the prophets are wont , they are fulfilled in the perswasions in which the gentiles exhorted their children to imbrace christ . thirdly , from 1 cor. 10. 2. all our fathers were baptized , therefore also infants . i answer , first , if this verse prove that infants were baptized , the verses following will prove that they received the lords supper . 2. the sense is not that they were formally baptized , with the rite of baptisme , begun by john baptist , and ordained by christ ; but that by a like representation , the sea and the cloud signified salvation to them by christ as baptisme doth to us , and that they were in a like condition , as if they had been baptized . fourthly , from ephes. 5. 26. where it is said , that christ cleansed the church with the washing of water through the word , therefore infants either belong not to the church , and so are excluded from the benefit of christs death , or they are to be baptized . answ. if this argument be of force , the thief crucified with christ , and repenting on the crosse , infants , catechumeni , martyrs , and others , dying before baptisme , are excluded out of the church , and from the benefit of christs death ; we are therefore to say , that either the church is taken for the more famous part of the church , or that purification is to be understood of that , which is for the most part . fifthly , from 1 pet. 2. 9. believers are called a chosen generation , a holy nation , which things are said of the israelites , exo. 19. 5 , 6. therefore believers of the nations obtain the same birth-priviledges , which the israelites had , and therefore their children are within the covenant , and to be baptized as the children of the israelites were to be circumcised . answ. 1. if this argument proceed , it will follow , that there is some nationall-church among the gentiles , as of old among the jews , which is not to be granted , which i would have understood in this sense , there is now no such nationall-church , as amongst the israelites , so as that a person should be accounted a member of a church , in that he is an englishman , scot , dutchman , &c. in this speech i oppose not them which affirm the outward government of the church should be subject to nationall synods . 2. exod. 19. 5 , 6. god speaks not of a priviledge flowing from birth , but obedience . 3. the epistle was written to the dispersed jewes , and therefore the argument lies liable to exception , when it is drawn from that which is said of the jews , as if it were said of the gentiles . 4. but letting these things passe , the sense is , ye which believe , as it is vers. 7. whom god hath called out of darknesse , are a holy nation , whether jews or gentiles , by spirituall regeneration , as believers are called a family or kindred , ephes. 3. 15. the houshold of faith , gal. 6. 10. the house of god , 1 tim. 3. 15. a people , 1 pet. 2. 10. wherefore in this family , kindred , house , people , are only believers , whom not carnall birth , but spirituall causeth to be reckoned in that number . sixthly , the church of god fails not , but we must say , the church of god hath failed , if baptisme of infants be not lawfull , ergo . answ . 1. the church of god may consist without baptisme , as in the crucified converted thief , &c. secondly , neither perhaps , is it necessary to be said , that the baptisme of infants , because not lawfull , is therefore nall . thirdly , there was in the church baptisme of persons grown , in all ages . ludov. vives in his comment . upon aug. de civit. dei . lib. 1. cap. 27. hath these words , no man of old was brought unto * the place of holy baptisme unlesse he were of grown age already , and when the same person knew what that mysticall water meant , and desired to be washed in it , and that more then once , an image of which thing we see yet , in our baptisme of infants ; for as yet the infant , though born the same day , or the day before , is asked , whether he would be baptized , and that thrice ; for whom the sureties answer , that he would . i hear in some cities in italy , that the old custome , for a great part is yet preserved . seventhly , heb. 6. 2. the apostle speaks of the doctrine of baptismes , and laying on of hands ; now this is not likely to be understood of laying on of hands in healing sick persons , or bestowing the holy ghost , for these were extraordinary or miraculous , and therefore not to be put in the number of the principles of the oracles of god , the foundation , milk for babes , nor of imposition of hands for ordination to special function in the church , for that , though ordinary , yet not likely to be put among the principles , the foundation , milk for babes , therefore it remains , that it was the laying on of hands on children formerly baptized in infancy , which though corruptly made a sacrament by papists , and superstitiously abused , yet being freed from the abuse were very usefull , as being an apostolicall ordinance , from this text , and manifests that there was infant-baptisme in the apostles dayes , which is confirmed , because it is coupled with baptisme , and therefore seems to be a consequent upon it . answ. 1. there is great incertainty , what this imposition of hands mentioned , heb. 6. 2. served for , the reason to prove that it could not be either for healing , or giving the holy ghost , because they were miraculous or extraordinary , is not cogent ; for though they were by more then ordinary power , yet were they frequent in those times , and might well be put among the elements to be in those days first learned : nor is the reason cogent to prove it could not be the imposition of hands in ordination , for speciall function in the church ; for it is more likely that it should be meant , which it is certain was still in use , and to continue to be used , and therefore it was needfull to be taught younglings , as well as the doctrine of baptismes : then laying on of hands for confirmation of baptisme , of which there is no certainty ( though pretended examples ) in scripture , be brought to give some colour to it ; nor is imposition of hands in ordination unfitly coupled to baptisme , both being ordinances for initiation , the one into the pro 2. but if it were supposed that this imposition of hands , meant heb. 6. 2. were on the baptized ; yet this proves not the baptisme of infants in the apostles dayes , unlesse it could be proved that it was used after the baptisme of infants only , for a confirmation either of the baptisme , or baptized . or the contrary , it is apparent out of tertul. de corona militis , c. 3. that in the primitive times the baptisied did make his confession at baptisme , sub manu antistitis , that is , the minister laying hands on him . and to save labour in reciting testimonies , chamier may be seen , who in his pans . catholica , tom. 4. l. 4. c. 11. sec . 14. at large proves out of the ancients , that the imposition of hands , which after was made a distinct sacrament , called confirmation , was either a part or appendix of baptisme : and many passages he cites to shew , that it was when the baptized was to confesse the faith , and to renounce satan : and if hierom , tom . 2. in his dialogue against the luciferians , do assert that use of imposition of hands from scripture , yet he alleadgeth not heb. 6. 2. for it , but the examples of giving the holy ghost by laying on of hands , in the acts of the apostles . the second argument followeth : that which agreeth not with the lords institution of baptisme , that is deservedly doubtfull . but the rite of infant-baptisme agrees not with the lords institution of baptisme , ergo . the major is proved , because institution is the rule of exhibiting worship to god . the minor is proved from the words of insti●ution , mat. 28. 19. going therefore , disciple ye all nations , baptizing them . whence i gather thus : that rite agrees not with the lords institution of baptisme , according to which they are baptized , whom the lord appointed not to be baptized . but after the rite of infant-baptisme , they are baptized whom the lord appointed not to be baptized , ergo . the major is manifest of it self . the minor is proved : the lord appointed not infants to be baptized , ergo . the antecedent is proved ; those , and no other , the lord appointed to be baptized , who have been made disciples . but this cannot be said of infants . ergo . the argument is confirmed from john 4. 2. where it is said that jesus made more disciples , then , that he baptized : first it is said that he made disciples , then baptized . some one perhaps will say that baptisme of infants is elsewhere instituted , although not here . to which is answered , let he that can , bring forth that institution , and the doubt will be loosed . but infants may be disciples , for they may be sanctified by the spirit ? answ. it is true , infants may be sanctified by the spirit of god , purged by the blood of christ , saved by the grace of god , my minde abhorrs from the doctrine of them that assert , that infants not baptized , necessarily perish , or are deprived of the kingdome of god , nor do i doubt , but that the elect infants dying in infancy are sanctified , yea if it should be made known to us that they are sanctified , i should not doubt that they are to be baptized , remembring the saying of peter , act. 10. 47. can any man forbid water , that these should not be baptized , who have received the holy ghost as we ? then you will say [ make disciples ] in that place , may be so expounded , as that it may include infants ? answ. it follows not ; but this only follows , that in ease extraordinary , we may depart from the ordinary rule : but the ordinary rule is , make disciples , that is , by preaching the gospell , make disciples , as appears from mark . 16. 15. and baptize them , to wit , whom you have made disciples , and in the ordinary course of ministry , we must follow the ordinary rule . perhaps some one will except , that christ teacheth that such disciples should be baptized , but that the speech is not exclusive . refut . but it is meet he remember , who shall thus except , if institution be the rule of worship , it is necessary that he that shall administer the worship , binde himself to the rule , otherwise he will devise will-worship , and arrogate the lords authority to himself : surely the apostle in the businesse of the lords supper , insinuates this , when being about to correct the aberrations of the corinthians , concerning the lords supper he brings forth these words , 1 cor. 11. 23. for i have received of the lord , that which i also have delivered unto you . besides as christ mat. 19. 4. 8. argues from the institution of marriage , against divorce for a light cause , and polygamie , because it is said , two , not more then two shall be one flesh ; so in like manner it may be here argued , christ said baptizing them , and not others , therefore these and not others are to be baptized . but as for him who gathers from this place , infants are to be baptized , because christ commands all nations to be baptized , verily he is faulty . 1. in casting away that restriction that christ hath put . 2. by determining that all men whatsoever are to be baptized , so that this is not a priviledge of believers and their children , but common with them , to all infidels and their children . and in very deed , however assertors of infant-baptisme , crack of a priviledge of believers and their offespring , not only the usuall practise of baptising any little children offered , but also sayings prove , that men have gone far , not only from christs institution , but also from the principles , upon which , men at this day are busie to establish infant-baptisme . i shall prove this by some instances . in the 59. epistle of cyprian to fidus , from which augustine is wont in his disputations against the pelagians , to take his proof for infant-baptisme , and to which writers attribute much , although that i may say no worse , without cause , this reason is put , why it was not assented to bishop fidus , who thought that an infant was not to be baptized , afore the eighth day , according to the law of ancient circumcision , we all rather judged , that the mercy and grace of god is to be denied to none , that is born of men . by the answer of augustine to bonifacius , tom. 2. epist. 23. enquiring concerning the truth of sureties , in affirming the unknowne faith of little ones , and promising for them , it will appeare to the reader , that the baptisme of any little ones offered to baptisme , is defended by him , although they were not brought , that they might be regenerated to eternall life , by spirituall grace , but because they thinke by this remedy ( i use the words of augustine ) to retain or receive temporall health : john gerhard , loc. theolog. tom. 4. de cap. 7. sect. 4. defends the practise of the ancients baptizing the children of unbeleevers : and the words of mr. samuell rutherford , scot , in his booke lately put forth in the english tongue , intituled a peaceable and temperate plea , c. 12. arg. 7. seems to me to propend too much to this opinion , the words are these , if then the jewes in pauls time were holy by covenant , howbeit for the present the sons were branches broken off , for unbelief , much more seeing god hath chosen the race and nation of the gentiles , and is become a god to us and to our seed , the seed must be holy , with holinesse of the chosen nation , and holinesse externall of the covenant , notwithstanding the father and mother were as wicked as the jews , who slow the lord of glory . and the grave confutation of brownists , by rathband , part. 3. pag. 50. fourthly , children may be lawfully admitted to baptisme , though both their parents be profane , if those who are instead of parents to them do require baptisme for them , and give their promise to the church for their religious education , seeing they may lawfully be accounted within gods covenant , if any of their ancestors in any generation were faithfull . exod. 20. 5. lastly , if this argument be not of force , christ commandeth first to disciple , and then to baptize those that are discipuled ; to exclude infants from baptisme ; neither will the argument be of force , from 1 cor. 11. 28. let a man examine himself , and so let him eat , to exclude infants from the lords supper , for by the like clusion this argument may be rejected by saying , that the speech of the apostle is not exclusive , and is to be understood of receiving the lords supper by persons grown only , yea , verily , neither will the argument be of force from the institution of the supper , mat. 26. 26 , 27. therefore only believers are to be admitted to the lords supper . if any reply . but the apostle 1 cor. 10. & 11. hath declared , that the institution is exclusive , the same may be said of the institution of baptism , from the following argument . the third argument is taken from the practise of the apostles and john baptist , which is the best interpreter of our lords institution , from whence the argument is thus formed : that tenet and practise , which being put : baptisme cannot be administred as john baptist and the apostles did administer it , agrees not with the practise of john baptist and the apostles . but the tenet and practise of infant-baptisme being put ; baptism cannot be administred , as john baptist and the apostles administred it , ergo . the major is of it self manifest . the minor is proved ; before the baptisme of john even the jews did confesse sins , the apostles before baptisme did require shews of faith and repentance , but this cannot be done in the baptisme of infants : the major is proved by looking on these places , mat. 3. 6. luk. 3. 10. act. 2. 38. act. 8. 12 , 13. and ver. 37. when the eunuch had said to philip , what letteth me to be baptized ? philip answered , if thou believest with thy whole heart thou maist ; he implies the defect of faith to be an impediment of baptisme , act. 9. 18. act. 20. 47. act. 11. 17. 18. act. 16. 15 , 31 , 32 , 33. act. 18. 8. act. 19. 5. act. 22. 16. this argument is confirmed , for if it be rightly argued from 1 cor. 11. 28 that the lords supper is not to be granted to infants , because self-examination is pre-required , by like reason we may say baptisme is not to be yeelded to infants , because repentance and faith are pre-required , act. 2. 38. act. 8. 37. and that of those who are descended from abraham , and to whom the promise was . the fourth argument is taken from the practise of the next age after the apostles . that tenet and practise is doubtfull of which it cannot be proved that it was in force or use , in the next age after the apostles . but it cannot be proved that the tenet or practise of infant-baptisme was in force or use in the age next after the apostles , ergo . the major is of it self manifest . the minor is proved by the testimony of lodovicus vives above recited , to which vossius in thesibus historico theologicis , of infant-baptisme , joynes the testimony of vvalafridus strabo , and by the examining of places brought to that purpose , and by the continuation of questions propounded to the baptized in ages following , and other tokens from councils and ecclesiasticall writers , which in historicall businesse are wont to beget credit . the words of walafridus strabo , who lived about the year 840. in his book de rebus ecclesiasticis , chap. 26. are these , we are also to note , that in the first times the grace of baptisme was wont only to be given to them , who by integrity both of body and minde were already come to this , that they could know and understand what profit is to be obtained in baptisme , what is to be confessed and believed , what lastly , is to be observed of them that are born again in christ . the fifth argument : that which in succeeding ages , in which it was in use , was in force , 1. as a tradition not written ; 2. out of imitation of jewish circumcision ; 3. without universall practise ; 4. together with the error of giving infants the lords supper , and many other humane inventions , under the name of apostolicall traditions ; that is deservedly doubtfull . but in some ages after the first from the apostles , the tenet and practise of infant-baptisme was in use , 1. as a tradition not written , as appears from origen , hom. on rom. 6. of which book neverthelesse let me add the censure of erasmus on the homilies of origen upon leviticus , but he that reads this work , and the enarration of the epistle to the romans is uncertain whether he read origen or ruffinus . and the testimony fetched from these books for infant-baptisme , is so much the more to be suspected , because augustine , hierom , &c. rely ( so far as yet is manifest to me ) on no other testimony , then of cyprian and his fellow-bishops in the councel , of which mention is made epist. 59. ad fidum . secondly , out of imitation of jewish circumcision , as the doubt of fidus , in the 59. epistle of cyprian to fidus , intimates , though there were also other reasons of infant-baptisme ; as the opinion of the necessity of baptisme to salvation , and the greedinesse to increase the number of christians , and perhaps the imitation of heathenish lustration of little ones ; and some other . thirdly , without universall practise : for it is manifest that constantine , although born of helena his mother , a christian , was not baptized till aged , as eusebius in the life of constantine written by him . the same is manifest from the book of confessions of augustine , concerning augustine hmself , whose mother monica was a christian . the things which may be drawn out of theodoret , augustine , and others , concerning theodosius , alipius , adeodatus , and many others ( although my books , and notes out of them are wanting to me , by reason of the injury of the times ) unlesse i be deceived will evince that ( though in the churches of those times , little ones were baptized , yet ) many were not baptized , whose baptism its likely the church would sooner have dispatched , if the opinion of baptism that now obtains , had then obtained . fourthly , together with the error of giving the lords supper to infants , as is manifest out of the book of cyprian de lapsis , and others . and that many other inventions of men under the name of apostolicall tradition , out of a wrong liking of judaisme , did then prevaile , as the paschall solemnity , &c. is so obvious to him that reads fathers and ecclesiasticall writers , that no man will need proofe , ergo . and in very deed , as of old , because the rite of infant-baptisme seemed to be of so great moment against the pelagian heresie , and for the authority of the councell under cyprian , the councel of milevis , augustine , hierom , and others , rather then from any solid argument out of scripture , in former ages , infant-baptisme prevailed ; so in this last age , some modern men seem to imbrace this tenet of infant-baptism , out of horror of mind , lest they should go headlong into the pernicious errors of former anabaptists , and their mad furies , or lest they should seem to desert the leading men of the reformed churches , or move troubles in the church ; rather then from perspicuous foundation in the scriptures . which they will think that i have not said as one that dreams , who shall read what robert lord brook hath in the end of his treatise concerning episcopacie , daniel rogers in his treatise of baptisme , and others elswhere . the sixth argument follows : that which hath occasioned many humane inventions , partly by which infant-baptisme it self may be under-propped , partly the defect in the policy of the church , which in very deed is to be supplied by the lawfull use of baptisme , of that it is deservedly doubtfull whether it be not in it self weak and insufficient for its proper work . but the matter is so in the businesse of infant-baptisme , ergo . the minor is proved by instances : they are , 1. the use of sureties in baptisme , which is an humane invention , for a shadowy supplement , and i had almost said sporting , of that profession of faith which at first was made by the baptized in his own person . 2. episcopall confirmation , in which the bishop layes hands or anoints the catechized , that baptisme , or the baptized may be confirmed , and they made capable of the lords supper . 3. the reformed union , by examination , confession , subscription , of the received doctrine in the church , before the communion of the eucharist , of which parker of eccles. policie , l. 3. c. 16. 4. the church-covenant , as they call it , afore the admission of members into church-fellowship , of which the new-england elders in the little book in english , called church-covenant , which in very deed are devised to supply the place of baptisme ; for by baptisme , according to christs institution , a person is exhibited a member of christ and the church , 1 cor. 12. 13. gal. 3. 27. ephes. 4. 5. the seventh argument : that which hath occasioned many errors , that is deservedly doubtfull , whether it be right . but the practise of infant-baptisme hath occasioned either the birth or fostering of many errors , ergo . it is proved by instances : 1. that baptisme conferres grace by the work done . 2. that baptisme is regeneration . 3. that infants dying , are saved by the faith of their parents , faith of sureties , of the church receiving into her lap : which is to be ascribed alone to the grace of god by christ . 4. that some regenerate persons may utterly fall from grace . the eighth argument : that which hath caused many abuses and faults in discipline , and divine worship , and conversation of men , that is deservedly doubtfull . but infant-baptisme is such , ergo . it is proved by enumeration . 1. private baptisme . 2. baptisme by women . 3. baptisme of infants not yet brought into light . 4. baptisme of infants of uncertain progeny , whom we call children of the earth and world . 5. they are baptized in the name of the lord , who know not the lord , nor have ever consented , or perhaps will consent to the confession of the name of our lord . 6. it hath brought in the admission of ignorant and profane men into the communion of the church , and to the lords supper : for who can deny rightly , the right of the church to the baptized ? 7. it perverts the order of discipline , that first a man be baptized and after among the catechized . 8. the sacrament of baptisme is turned into a meer ceremony , yea into a profane meeting to feast together . 9. men forget baptisme , as if they were never baptized , so that it hath the force of a carnall rite , not of a spirituall institution . 10. it takes away , or at least diminisheth zoale , and industry in knowing the gospel . the ninth argument . that is deservedly doubtfull , that yeeldeth occasion to many unnecessary disputes , f●stering only contention , and which cannot be determined by any certain rule . but the tenet or rite of infant-baptisme is such , ergo . it is proved by instances . 1. of baptizing the infants of excommunicated persons . 2. of baptizing the infants of apostates . 3. of baptizing the infants of such parents as are not members in a gathered church . 4. of baptizing the infants of those , whose ancestors were believers , the next parents remaining in unbelief ; these things shew that men have departed from the rule , when they know not where to stay . the tenth reason of doubting is , that in the midst of the darknesse under the papacythe same men opposed infant-baptisme , who opposed invocation of saints , prayer for the dead , adoration of the crosse , and such like ; this is manifest out of the 66. sermon of bernard , on the canticles , where of the heretiques ( as he cals them ) who he said boasted themselves to be successors of the apostles , and name themselves apostolique , he hath these words , they deride us , because we baptize infants , because we pray for the dead , because we ask the suffrages of the saints , and in his 140. epistle to hildefonsus , earl of saint giles , he complains of henricus the heretique , formerly a monke , that he tooke away holy-dayes , sacraments , churches , priests , that the life of christ is stopped to the little ones of christians , while the grace of baptisme is denied , and they are not suffered to draw neer to salvation . from the epistle of peter abbat . cluniacensis , to three bishops of france , against peter de bruis , and henricus , holding errors , digested into five heads . 1. that little ones are not to be baptized . 2. that churches or altars ought not to be made . 3. that the crosse of our lord is not to be adored or worshipped , but rather to be broken and trodden under feet . 4. that the masse is nothing , nor ought to be celebrated . 5. that the good deeds of the living , nothing profit the dead ; that we are not to chaunt to god . he saith , that the heresie of the petrobrusians was received in the cities of gallia narbonensis . and from lucas osiander his epitome of the ecclesiasticall history , cent. 13. l. 1. c. 4. at the year 1207. where he accuseth the albigenses as consenting with the anabaptists . to which i adde , that in the ages neer the apostles , tertullian and gregory nazianzen disswade the baptisme of infants , unlesse the danger of death happen . the words of tertullian are in his book of baptisme , c. 18. therefore for the condition and disposition , also age of each person , the delaying of baptisme is more profitable : yet chiefly about little ones ; for what need that the sureties be also cast on danger , who themselves may by mortality be wanting to their promises , and be deceived by the comming forth of an evill disposition . the lord saith indeed , do not prohibite them to come to me ; let them come when they are grown , let them come when they learn , let them be taught when they come , let them be made christians when they can know christ . why doth innocent age hasten to the remission of sinnes ? shall it be done more warily in things secular , that to whom earthly substance is not committed , divine should ? let them know how to ask safety , that thou maist know to give to him that asketh . gregory nazianzen , in his 40. oration of holy baptisme : for which we are to use all diligence , that we misse not the common grace . some one will say , let these things be concerning them that seek baptisme : but what may you say concerning them that are yet babes , and neither perceive losse , nor grace ? shall we also baptize them ? yes by all means , if any danger urge ; for it is better that they be sanctified without perceiving it , then to go away unsealed or unaccomplished . and the reason of this , to us , is circumcision on the eighth day , being a certain typical seal , & offered to them that had not yet the use of reason ; as also the anointing of the posts , which by things without feeling preserved the first born . but for others , i give my opinion that they stay three yeares , or a little within this , or beyond it , when they may be able to heare and answer some mysticall points , if they cannot understand perfectly , yet being thus stamped , they shall sanctifie both soules and bodies with the great mystery of consecration . the eleventh reason of doubting , is , because the assertors of infant-baptisme little agree among themselves , upon what foundation they may build infant-baptisme . cyprian and others of the ancients draw it from the universality of divine grace , and the necessity of baptisme to salvation . augustine , bernard , and others , bring the faith of the church as the reason of baptizing infants : others , among whom is the catechisme in the english liturgie , put as the reason of infant-baptisme , the promise of the sureties , in the place of the faith and repentance of the baptized . the lutherans , the faith of the infant ; others , the holinesse of a believing nation ; others , the faith of the next parent ; others , the faith of the next parent in covenant in a gathered church . this difference of the maintainers of infant-baptism , deservedly causeth doubt concerning the thing it self . the last , and that a weighty reason of doubting is , because infant-baptisme seemes to take away one , perhaps the primary end of baptism ; for many things argue that it was one end of baptism , that it should be a signe that the baptized shews himself a disciple , and confesseth the faith in which he hath been instructed . 1. the requiring of confession by john baptist and the apostles , was wont to be before baptisme , luk. 3. 10. act. 8. 35. act. 16. 31. 2. the frequent manner of speaking in the new testament , which puts baptism for doctrine , act. 10. 37. act. 19. 3. shews this . beza in his annot. on act. 19. 3. the answer is most apposite , in which they signifie that they professed in baptism the doctrine propounded by john , and confirmed by use of baptisme with which they had been baptized , whereby they had acknowledged christ but very slenderly . 3. the form of christs institution , mat. 28. 19. compared with the phrase as it is used 1 cor. 1. 13. or , were you baptized into the name of paul ? implies the same . on which place beza , the third reason is taken from the form and end of baptisme , in which we give our name to christ , being called upon , with the father and holy spirit . 4. that which is said , joh. 4. 2. he made and baptized more disciples . and mat. 28. 19. going , make disciples in all nations , baptizing them ; intimate this . and if , as some affirme , baptism was in use with the jews , in the initiating of proselytes into the profession of judaisme ; this opinion is the more confirmed . but in infant-baptisme the matter is so carried , that baptisme serves to confirm a benefit , not to signifie a profession made : and so one , perhaps the chief end of baptisme is voyded . and here i think it is to be minded , that the usuall description of a sacrament , and such as are like to it , that it is a visible signe of invisible grace ; hath occasioned the misunderstanding of both sacraments , as if they signed a divine benefit , not our duty , to which in the first place the institution had respect . it seems to some , that infant-baptisme should be good , because the devil requires witches to renounce it . which reason , if ought worth , might as well prove baptisme of any infants , baptisme by a midwife , good ; because these the devil requires them to renounce , as well that which is of the infants of believers , by a lawfull minister . but the true reason why he requires the baptisme of witches to be renounced by them , is not because the baptisme is good in respect of the administration of it , but because the faith mentioned in the form of baptisme , is good ; and they that renounce not their baptisme , do shew their adherence to that faith in some sort , which cannot stand with an explicite covenant with the devil . nor is the assuming of baptisme in ripe yeares by those who were washed in infancy , a renouncing of baptisme , as some in their grosse ignorance conceit ; but indeed a firmer avouching of baptisme according to christs mind . this more likely might , be inferred from the devils practise in requiring . witches to renounce their baptisme ; that the profession of faith is the main businesse in baptisme , which should be before baptisme , if it were rightly administred after the first pattern . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a94741e-3500 §. 1. the first argument for infant-baptisme , examined from the interest in the promise , gen. 17. 7. §. 2. the second argument for infant baptisme from the succession of baptisme to circumcision , examined . §. 3. the third argument from the parity of grace in the new testament to that in the old examined . §. 4. the argument from act. 2. 38 , 39. for infant-baptisme examined . §. 5. the argument from 1 cor. 7. 14. for infant-baptisme , examined . mat. 17. 12. acts 7. 44. §. 6. the arguments from mat. 19. 15. for infant-baptisme exmined . §. 7. the argument from acts 15. 16. &c. for infant-baptisme examined . §. 8. the argument from generall promises for infant-baptisme examined . § 9. the argument from isa. 49. 22. for infant-baptisme examined . §. 10. the argument from 1 cor. 10. 2. for infant-baptisme ex §. 11. the argument from eph. 5. 26. for infant-baptisme examined . §. 12. the argument from 1 pet. 2. 9. for infant-baptisme examined . §. 13. the argument churches failing , if infant-baptisme be not lawfull examined . * sacro baptisterio admovebatur . §. 14. the argument from heb. 6 2. for infant-baptisme examined . arg. 2. §. 15. the argument from the institution of christ , mat. 28. 19. against infant-baptisme , confirmed . arg. 3. § 16. the argument from john baptist and the apostles practise against insant-baptism confirmed . arg. 4. §. 17. the argument from the practise in the age next the apostles against infant-baptism confirmed . arg. 4. §. 17. the argument from the wrong originall of infant-baptism , confirmed against it . arg. 6. §. 19. the argument against infant-baptisme , from humane inventions occasioned by it confirmed . arg. 7. §. 21. the argument against infant-baptism , from the errors occasioned by it , confirmed . arg. 8. §. 20. the argument against infant-baptism , from many abuses caused by it , confirmed . arg. 9. §. 22. the argument from unnecessary disputes caused by it against infant-baptisme , confirmed . arg. 10. § 23. the argument against infant-baptism from the opposition to it in the middest of popery , confirmed . arg. 11. §. 24 the argument against infant-baptism , from assertors difference about the ground of it , confirmed . arg. 12. a plea for anti-pædobaptists, against the vanity and falshood of scribled papers, entituled, the anabaptists anatomiz'd and silenc'd in a public dispute at abergaveny in monmouth-shire sept. 5. 1653. betwixt john tombes, john cragg, and henry vaughan, touching infant-baptism. by john tombes, b.d. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a62869 of text r206989 in the english short title catalog (wing t1811). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 107 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 24 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a62869 wing t1811 estc r206989 99866067 99866067 118327 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a62869) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 118327) images scanned from microfilm: (thomason tracts ; 113:e738[7]) a plea for anti-pædobaptists, against the vanity and falshood of scribled papers, entituled, the anabaptists anatomiz'd and silenc'd in a public dispute at abergaveny in monmouth-shire sept. 5. 1653. betwixt john tombes, john cragg, and henry vaughan, touching infant-baptism. by john tombes, b.d. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. [2], 44 p. printed by henry hills, and are to be sold at his house at the sign of sir john old-castle in py-corner, london, : 1654. annotation on thomason copy: "may. 26". reproduction of the original in the british library. eng tombes, john, 1603?-1676 -early works to 1800. cragge, john, -m.a. -early works to 1800. vaughan, henry, 1617 or 18-1661 -early works to 1800. anabaptists anatomiz'd -controversial literature -early works to 1800. infant baptism -early works to 1800. anabaptists -england -early works to 1800. a62869 r206989 (wing t1811). civilwar no a plea for anti-pædobaptists, against the vanity and falshood of scribled papers, entituled, the anabaptists anatomiz'd and silenc'd in a pu tombes, john 1654 20141 8 50 0 0 0 0 29 c the rate of 29 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the c category of texts with between 10 and 35 defects per 10,000 words. 2000-00 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2001-07 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2001-07 tcp staff (michigan) sampled and proofread 2001-07 tcp staff (michigan) text and markup reviewed and edited 2001-11 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a plea for anti-paedobaptists , against the vanity and falshood of scribled papers , entituled , the anabaptists anatomiz'd and silenc'd in a publique dispute at abergaveny in monmouth-shire sept. 5. 1653. betwixt john tombes , john cragg , and henry vaughan , touching infant-baptism . by john tombes , b.d. job ii. 2 , 3. should not the multitude of words be answered ? and should a man full of talk be justified ? should thy lies ( or devices ) make men hold their peace ? and when thou mockest , shall no man make thee ashamed ? london , printed by henry hills , and are to be sold at his house at the sign of sir john old-castle in py-corner , 1654. a plea for anti-paedobaptists against the vanity and falshood of scribled papers . sect. i. the reason of this writing is rendred . there came newly to my hands a pamphlet , wherein the intitler speaks like a vain braggadochio , as if the book had ript up the anabaptists ( as he terms them ) and like a prelate had silenced them , though there was but one whom with any face it could be pretended that he was anatomized or silenced , who yet speaks and writes for the truth , which these opponents do endeavour to disgrace , and rejoiceth that he lives to find that these men have no other thing to charge him with than his contending for a reformation of that prophane abuse of infant-sprinkling , and that they have no other encouragement from him to persist in their paedobaptism , but a fond hope of his returning to that sinful practice . the libel hath a frontispice , which pretends to shew the manner of the anabaptists dipping , but most falsly , sith it represents it to the eyes of the beholders as if they held persons by the heels when they baptize them , which is otherwise than their practice . the pretended manner of laying on of hands , and washing of feet , is unknown to me , if they do use it , yet they have such likely proofs from heb. 6. 2. and our saviours practice and command john 13. as might have deterred the author of this frontispice from exposing the ordinance of baptism , and those other rites , to contempt , had he any reverence to holy things , and regard to chrisis appointment . but the frontispice of dr. featlies book , and this , with the epistles and other passages , do give occasion to intelligent persons to conceive that this sort of men do make but a sport of christs ordinance , and that they have little mind to search for , or receive truth , but to expose them that are for believers baptism , and against infant-sprinkling , to the contempt of light and profane wits , and to the hatred of the ignorant and superstitious common people . and i conceive that this book is published by men of that spirit , who seek to make odious the endeavoured reformation of ignorance , superstition , profanenesse , and ungodliness , which abounds in those parts , and to uphold those either loose or formal pretended ministers , who take upon them to teach , but do indeed , as elymas the sorcerer acts 13. pervert the right way of the lord . surely did they seek the truth in love , they would not so insult over tender consciences as they do , encourage the looser sort , and deter the enquiring souls from the wayes of christ , for my self , as i have found from others , so i deprehend in these men the same unrighteous spirit , in their reporting my answers , and publishing them in print , without my revising of them , though it were proposed , and as i remember yielded , by one , that in a private way , i should have his arguments sent to me in writing , & for the other after 2 copies of his sermon sent me , yet i wrote to know whether he would own them , nor did publish any thing though i had sent some animadversions on the notes i received , of which i was told one copy was shewed to mr. cragg himself , and not disowned by him . and i do account it a shameful practice which these men , and another before have used towards me , that after i have been drawn to a verbal extemporary dispute , and no common notary agreed on , yet my answers are published by them without ever allowing me the sight of them , that i might either own them or amend them , afore the printing and publishing them . but i see , faction so prevails with them , that like as if they were of the romanists minds , they allow themselves liberty to use any arts as pious frauds to bear down the truth of antipaedobaptism . and this they do with so much insolency as may stir up the inconsiderate to trample upon their antagonist , and create prejudice against the truth . which hath necessitated me in this hast to write this . sect. ii. a view of the epistles is taken . who the j. t. p. or j. w. is i know not . what the first epistle saith of austins rule , it is neither true , for then the observation of an easter , and sundry other superstitious rites should be from the apostles , nor if it were true , is it true of infant-sprinkling that the whole church held it , sprinkling being not used in sundry ages instead of baptism , and infant-baptism , as it is now used , opposed by tertullian , and gregory nazianzen , and only the popish doctrine ( disclaimed by mr. cragg ) of the necessity of baptizing infants to their inheriting heaven , taught by the writers called fathers . as false it is that the baptizing believers ( called by these anabaptism ) had its spring and rise from nicolas stork , and others there named , it being commanded by christ , practiced by the apostles , continued in the first ages without any infant-baptism , and when infants were baptized , it was very rarely , onely in case of danger of the neernesse of death to the infant , and when reformation of other popish abuses was sought , the reformation of this was sought with the first , some hundreds of years afore luther . as vain is the assignation of the causes of anabaptism ( which is indeed true baptism ) whereas the true cause is the shining forth of light from the scriptures , and other authors , not discerned formerly as now . the true reason why our books and practice are permitted is , because they have at least so much appearance of truth as is sufficient to make wise men to let them alone , lest they haply should fight against god . the epistlers reasons are but his own ignorant surmises . though disputes are useful , yet such unworthy artifices as i find in and after them are a just reason for me to wave them , especially with such men as i have met with . what the successe hath been of the disputes mentioned its not so proper to me to enquire . the publishing of that at bewdley in so unbrotherly manner , hath , i imagine , diverted many from the truth , who if they had not been willing to be deluded , had never been caught with such a cheat as is the mock-titled book , plain scripture proof for infant-baptism . the rest of the disputes have not gained ( that i hear ) any credit to paedobaptism , but on the contrary , among the intelligent . it is true i was importuned to visit some friends at abergaveny , and did preach there , and some of the things the letter mentions i spake , and do still avouch . the two men mentioned were unknown to me , i slighted neither , though being wearied with preaching i did forbear to speak much , and was willing to get into a dry house from the rain . i was willing to have conference with mr. vaughan , who seemed modest and intelligent . the other opponent i found before to be a man of talk , who could not blush . that which the second epistle writes of my being wounded , and vaunting , is meerly fabulous , and i think the like of the short time of conceiving the dispute and sermon . it displeaseth me not , that the business should be truly stated , which is the end of this writing , though it displease me that such unworthy tricks are used to deceive people , as those which appear in the publishing this disputation and sermon . i intend not to lengthen the businesse by insisting on the falsity of the reports of my answer : it is not improbable i might in five hours dispute with one who talked so fast as to give no time to consider of what he said , answer not so cleerly as i would , had i had the arguments to view and examine deliberately . i presume it will be sufficient , for cleering truth , if either i shew how my answers are misreported , or how they are to be amended . sect. iii. mr. vaughans dispute is answered . to begin with mr. vaughans dispute . had it been framed into a syllogism it had been thus . they that were admitted lawfully into the covenant of grace by circumcision , may be admitted into the covenant of grace by baptism ; but infants were admitted lawfully into the covenant of grace by circumcision ; therefore they may be lawfully admited into the covenant of grace by baptism . to which had it been thus formed i should have said . 1. that it is false that either by circumcision or baptism infants or other persons are admitted into the covenant of grace , yea paedobaptists themselves suppose they are in the covenant of grace before , and therefore they are baptized : nor doth mr. vaughan shew how persons may be in congruous sense said to be admitted into the covenant of grace . 2. if it were true , yet it is certain that infants of unbelievers were admitted by circumcision as well as infants of believers , and so his medium proves as well the baptizing of unbelievers infants taken into a believers house , as believers . but in the manner he framed his reason i denied the consequence . and when he urged , it must be either because the covenant of grace made with abraham and his seed , is not the same in substance , withthat which is now actually in force with believers & their children , or secondly because baptism succeedeth not in the room of circumcision , i did rightly say i could deny your division . for there is another reason , viz. because there is not the same command of baptizing infants as there was of circumcising them , and yet that the disputation might proceed , i denyed the consequence , for both those reasons . and to what was replyed i answered rightly , that the covenant now in force according to gal. 3. 14. was not to the natural seed of abraham , but the spiritual ; nor is it true , that all the children of abraham were circumcised , for the females were not , or that they that were circumcised were consequently admitted into the covenant . for even mr. vaughan presently tells us , that ishmael though circumcised belonged not to the promise . now what is it to be admitted into the covenant , but to be admitted to the promise or participation of the covenant ? what he replyed further , that the covenant gen. 17. 7. was made alike , in the same extent and latitude , promiscuously with all the seed of abraham , even the natural , is most palpably false . for none but the spiritual seed of abraham , by believing , as he did , have the promise of righteousness , which is the covenant of grace , and ishmael is expiesly excluded gen. 17. 19 , 20 , 21. and he grants himself , none but the children of isaac were children of the promise , nor were the jewes , who were broken off because of their own unbelief , romans 11. 20. comprehended in the covenant of grace . romans 9. 8. proves cleerly that the covenant made to abraham and his seed as it was a covenant of evangelical grace was not made to all his natural seed , and so not to any of his natural seed , because they were by natural generation of him , but because elect of god . and it is false which mr. vaughan saith , the children of isaac ( he should have said isaac , and after him jacob ) are not called children of the promise in regard of any peremptory election , or aesignation to faith and salvation . for the contrary is manifest from verses 11 , 12 , 13. nor is it any thing contrary to the absolute decree of reprobation , that paul lamented , desired and prayed for the israelites , but his lamentation doth rather prove it that they were rejected , and desires and prayers may be even for that which may not be , as when christ prayed to have the cup passe from him . his reasons why the children of isaac are called children of the promise , are not to his purpose but against him . for 1. he doth thereby tacitly imply that none but the children of isaac were children of the promise , and therefore none but they in the covenant of grace . 2. if the reasons of the children of isaac their being called children of the promise were the inheritance of canaan , and the descent of christ , then only jacob was a child of the promise , not esau , and so it remains , the covenant gen. 17. 7. was not made to all the circumcised , nor they by circumcision admitted into the covenant gen. 17. 3. after his explication , it is cleer that the covenant of grace made with abraham and his seed is not the same in substance with that which is now actually in force with believers and their children , contrary to what he said before . 4. after this doctrine none are now children of the promise , sith there are none that inherit canaan according to that promise , nor from whom christ descends , and then if the promise be the same with the covenant of grace , none are now admitted into the same covenant , and consequently none to be baptized , according to mr. vaughans reasoning . what he saith he might have added , that if none but the elect and faithful can be admitted into the covenant , there is no subject left for the ordinance of baptism . i deny it . it goes upon this mistake , that none are to be admitted but those that are admitted into the covenant of grace , and known to be so : whereas persons that are disciples and believers by profession at least , are to be admitted to baptism , and no other ordinarily , whether they be admitted into the covenant of grace , or not . nor are we to baptize upon a judgement of charity , of thinking no evil , for then we must baptize turks infants as well as christians , nor upon a faith in the seed , or the parents actual faith , but their own profession . it is not true , no not according to mr. vaughan's own grant , that they were admitted into the same covenant by circumcision , into which we are now admitted by baptism , for we are not admitted into that covenant which hath the promise of the inheriitng the land of canaan , and descent of christ from us , which he before acknowledged to be promised in the covenant , gen. 17. neither need we say , that the circumcised had the righteousness of faith inherently in themselves , or that of their parents imputed to them , or that circumcision was a false seal . for neither is it said rom. 4. 11. of any mans circumcision but abrahams in his own person , nor of his , that it was the seal of the righteousness of faith to any but a believer . this was my answer , not as mr. vaughan mistook me , that circumcision was a seal onely of abrahams own faith in particular . nor is there a word rom. 4. 13. gen. 177. acts 2. 39. to prove that the covenant or promise was the same , and alike , to abraham and his seed , and to us believers , and to our children . nor is it true that 1 cor. 7. 14. is meant of covenant holiness of children , nor doth he bring any proof that it is so . for that which he dictates , that there is certainly some special privilege set forth to the children of believers , accruing to them from believing parents , is false , the text ascribing nothing to the faith of the one parent , but to the conjugal relation . and for that which he saith , it was no news to tell them that they might have the lawfull use one of another , i say , though they might not doubt whether they might lawfully use one another when both were unbelievers , yet it is manifest the believer doubted whether it might be so still , and therefore the apostles telling them it might , was an apposite resolution of their doubt , whether it be to be called news or no : and their not doubting of the legitimation of their issue is the very reason from whence the apostle by an argument ad hominem infers , the continuance of their lawfull copulation . and what i said of the use of the words sanctified and holy , 1 tim. 4. 5. 1 thess 4 3 4 7. was right ; nor do i think mr. vaughan would have urged that text , as he doth , if he had read what i have written in the first part of my antipaedobaptism , in which is an ample disquisition of the meaning of that text , to which i refer mr. vaughan , and other readers , who shall be willing to search out the truth . what i said , that if baptism succeeded circumcision , and thence infant-baptism be deduced , female infant-baptism could not be thence inferred , for they were not circumcised , is manifest , nor is it pertinent which mr. vaughan brings to infringe it . for though females be granted to be in the covenant of circumcision , yet they were not circumcised , and if in the eys of all laws whatsoever women are but as ignoble creatures , and so not circumcised , this confirms what i allege , that by virtue of baptisms succession to circumcision their baptism cannot be inferred . what he thought to have told me about the proselites of righteousness , and the baptizing of their infants , i conceive i have considered and answered in the second part of my antipaedobaptism or full review , now in the press , in which the feebleness of dr. hammonds proof is shewed . it is neither true that col. 2. 11 , 12. is an explanation of what is meant by the circumcision of christ , in these words , being buried with him in baptism nor any thing said of the analogy between circumcision and baptism , which mr. vaughan saith is so evident in this place , nor if it were doth it prove that our baptism succeeds the jewish circumcision . and what he grants , that col. 2. 12. rom. 6. 4 , 5. immersion and emersion in baptism are alluded to , as the custom then of baptizing ; and that which he saith , that indeed it seemed to him that for some centuries of years , that baptism was practiced by plunging ; for sprinkling was brought first in use by occasion of the chinicks , taking what further is manifest , and not denied , that sprinkling is not baptizing but rantizing , it is manifest that in infant-sprinkling now in use there is a mockery , when the minister saith , i baptize thee , and yet doth not baptize but sprinkle or rantize . and it was truly said by me that it is a nullity , it being done neither on persons , nor in the manner christ appointed to be baptized , as the spaniards baptizing the americans was a meer nullity and mockery . not do i know why mr. vaughan should say , [ this concludes our selves and all our ancestours , even all in the western churches for fifteen hundred years , under damnation ] unless he imagine with the papists infant-baptism necessary to salvation . that which mr. vaughan saith , p. 13. of the churches power to alter any thing from the form of christs institution to be confessed by all divines , and that he is none that denies it , is not true , except he account none divines but the papists . for i know none but papists that do acknowledg that the church hath power to alter christs institution . nor in my practice do i acknowledg it . i plainly tell mr. vaughan i do use to administer the lords supper in the evening , and though . i do not say it was instituted by christ to be in the evening , yet because it is called the lords supper , and the apostle takes notice of the time , 1 cor. 11. 23 , &c. and the administring of it in the morning occasions many to think they must take it fasting , and not a few that they are first to receive christs body in the popish sense , i think it very requisite the lords supper be administred in the evening . the love-feasts i finde not appointed by christ , and therefore might be altered . but in requital of mr. vaughans advice to me , i advise him to take heed of that erroneous and dangerous tenet which avoucheth a power in the church to alter christs institution , which serves to justifie popish corruptions , and to condemn the practice of all the reformed churches . i fear to embroil the church of god : they do it who oppose the truth . i am willing to submit to the judgment of the church when they agree with christ , but to none but christ , in what he hath appointed . it is neither true that the practise of infant-baptism , much lese of infant-sprinkling , hath been fifteen hundred years : nor , if it were , is it so strange a thing , that god suffered such an error as that is . i thank mr. vaughan for his ingenuous grant , and his modest carriage , and with expressions of my pity of his being misled by the conceit of the churches power ( by which , what is meant is hard to say ) conceiving i have answered him sufficiently , i take my leave of him and pass on to mr. cragg . concerning whom the reader is to be premonished , that by reason of his fast speaking , and many words , i was often uncertain what to apply an answer to at the dispute . sect. iv. mr. cragg's dispute is examined . as for his preface i let it pass . his first euthymene ; pag. 16 : some infants may not be baptized , therefore some infants may be baptized , is so frivolous , that i neither did then , nor do now think it worth any thing but contempt . for if the reasoning were good , it must be resolved into this syllogism , all that may not be baptized may be baptized , some infants may not be baptized , ergo , some infants may be baptized , there being no other way according to logick rules to make it good . any man of common sense might see the foolery of that argument . for if it be good he might in like manner say , some infants may not have the lords supper , therefore some infants may ; some boys are not to be ordained bishops , therefore some are . i denied the consequence , and mr. cragg not sensible of his folly prints a syllogism , which shews he proved not what was to be proved , which when i would have rectified by shewing what he should have concluded , he run on so fast in his vain prattle , that the reader may easily perceive i had reason to say , what would the man say ? the next argument is concerning the essence of baptism , which he saith , belonged to infants ; therefore they may be baptized , and then insinuates me to have been driven to absurdities in denying that baptism is a relation , and austins definition of a sacrament . to which i answer , 1. this proposition the essence of baptism belongs to infants , may have two senses , 1. that the baptism of infants is true baptism , that is , is according to transcendental verity such as hath the nature of baptism , and in this sense i grant the proposition is true , and so it is true that an infants eating bread and drinking wine is true eating and drinking the lords supper , it hath the essence of it ; but this i did not imagine he meant , and therefore denied his minor , till his next syllogism shewed he meant it , and then i perceived i should have denied the major . but his quickness and multiplying words would not permit me to recall my self . 2. the other sense is this , the essence of baptism , that is , that which is of the essence to right administration of baptism belongs to infants , in which sense i denied it , nor doth his argument from the definition prove it , for it is all one as to argue , infant-baptism is baptism , therefore it is right baptism . as for the absurdities he imputes to me , i deny them to be absurdities . for i take baptism to be either an action or passion , though christian baptism have a relation superadded , and so in the use is a sign , and the genus of it , which is of the essence , i should make an action . as for the other absurdity , i do confess that the term sacrament being but a term invented by latine fathers may be laid aside , nor is there any common nature of sacraments expressed in scripture . and i confess i take austins definition , if it be his , that a sacrament is a visible sign of invisible grace , to be but imperfect , sith it may be applied to the descent of the holy ghost as a dove , christs washing of his disciples feet , a persons kneeling and holding up his hands to pray , the kissing of the bible , and many other actions which are not sacraments , i confess i was weary of these quirks , and imagining that he used them onely to weary me , and blunt my attention , and to make some oftentation of himself , i replied not to his vain talk , but called for scripture-proof . as for that which he saith , i denyed all that were church-members were to be baptized , and yet affirmed it in my sermon : in both i said true , the former being understood of invisible , the latter of visible church-members . in the argument pag. 24. those whom god did promise before the law , foretell under the law , actually receive into covenant under the gospel , those god did appoint church-members under the gospel . but , &c. ergo . had not mr. craggs quickness hindered me , i had shewed the vanity of the major , as well as denied the minor . for if he mean by [ church-members ] visible church-members , and by [ actually receiving into covenant ] understand such an actual receiving as is without any act of faith or profession of the persons received into covenant , as i conceive he doth , i deny the major . but i also denied the minor . in the next proof he changeth the term [ of actually receiving ] into [ being in covenant ] now there is a manifest difference between them , sith a person may be in covenant , that is , have a covenant made to him , who is not yet born , as isaak , gen. 17. 21. but he is not actually received into covenant till he be born , and by some acts of his own engageth himself to be gods : receiving importing an offering , which is to be done by profession . as for his proof from gen. 17. 7. i had many exceptions against it . first , that if it be understood of the natural seed of abraham the everlastingness of it was but for a time , and that time afore the gospel , as in the next verse , the possession of canaan is promised to be everlasting , and yet the jews dispossessed now of it . which mr. cragg grants , and therefore must needs grant that the promise verse 7. though it be termed everlasting , yet it is to be understood onely of a limited time , as in other passages , exod. 21. 6. & 12. 24 &c. if meant of the natural seed of abraham . nor is he resieved by saying , they shall have canaan again , for however the possession was not everlasting , that is , at all times , particularly not in gospel-times . as for his proof of the continuance of the gospel covenant unto the end of the world , to abraham and his seed , the very text he allegeth , gal. 3. 8. doth manifestly express the thing promised to be justification , and that of the heathen , and that through faith , that had not the man a face which could not blush , he would have been ashamed to have urged it to prove , that abrahams natural seed were promised to be in covenant under the gospel . and his next allegation is as vain , that because deut. 29. 10 , 11. the whole congregation of israel are said to stand before the lord with their little ones , to enter into covenant , therefore the covenant gen. 17. 7. is to continue to infant natural seed of abraham to the end of the worlds whereas the speech is onely of a transient fact , not of a command , much less of a promise of something perpetually future , and what is said of the little ones is as well said of wives , hewers of wood , and drawers of water , and therefore if thence be concluded a continuance of covenant to infants , a continuance of covenant to wives and servants will be concluded . his allegation of heb. 8. 6. is as vain , for he brings it to prove , that if infants were in covenant under the law , they are in covenant under the gospel , whereas the meliority of the covenant is not placed in the extent to the sort of persons , for then it should be extended to more sorts than the covenant of the law was , but to the meliority of the promises , which were of better things , or better terms , then the promises of the law , but not to any other than elect and true believers , and so not to infants as the natural seed of believers . and for that which he saith , this unchurcheth the one half of christendome , and leaves them no ordinary means of salvation , if he mean by christendome all that are commonly called christians , i grant it , if the infants be the one half of them , and their unchurching be in respect of visible church-membership , but count it no absurdity . nor do know what ordinary means of salvation he conceives they are left without except baptism , which i take not to be an ordinary means of salvation without faith , and therefore think it no inconvenience to say that infants are without ordinary means of salvation , which are the preaching the word , &c. yet are saved by the election of god , redemption of christ , and work of his spirit . what i said , that the covenant under the gospel was made onely with the spiritual seed of abraham , was right , and determined so rom. 4. 11 , 12 , 16. rom. 9. 7 , 8. gal. 3. 29. john 8. 39. &c. nor is it true because the partition wall is broken down , therefore there is the same covenant national to the natural seed of believers as was to abraham , but that therefore as the apostle speaks ephes. 3. 6. the gentiles ( to wit believing gentiles , rom. 1. 16. ) should be fellowheirs , and of the same body , and partakers of his promise in christ by the gospel . nor is it ture , that the gospel covenant is made with the whole visible church , as the gospel covenant is expressed , heb. 8. 6 , 7 , 8 , 9 , 10 , 11 , 12. and if i denied the major pag. 29. in the first argument , i confess i was mistaken through inadvertency , whether by reason of mr. craggs fast speaking , or some humane infirmity , or some other occuirence now not remembred , i cannot tell . but i deny the minor understood of the gospel covenant , heb. 8. 10. and the whole visible church being taken without any synecdoche for every visible churchmember . but i perceive by mr. craggs words page 30. if the church in regard of outward administration of ordinances ( which is the question ) were only the elect , &c. that the terms church and covenant were so ambiguously used by him , that i knew not how to conceive of his meaning , and his fast speaking would not permit me deliberately to consider his words , and therefore no marvel i desired liberty to explain my self , and to enquire into mr. craggs meaning , it being impossible for me otherwise to answer appositely , and to make the disputation profitable for finding out truth . as for that which mr. cragg saith , that it was the question whether the church in regard of outward administration of ordinances were onely the elect , it doth untruly suggest as if i so conceived , who , though i hold the church invisible are the elect onely , and that the gospel covenant of grace , heb. 8. 10 , 11 , 12. is made to them only , yet have still granted that the church visible consists of others than elect persons , and that outward ordinances may lawfully be administred to them upon their profession of faith in christ . but mr. cragg by confounding these terms [ to be in covenant , to be subjects of baptism , &c. ] misleads unwary hearers and readers . the next text mr. cragg brought was isaiah 49. 22. whence he would prove that infants should be churchmembers under the gospel . to which my answer was at first ( though it was otherwise taken ) that it is a prophecy that the gentiles should bring back the jewes , not only infants but others , from captivity , which the words before verse 19 , 20 , 21. and after verse 24 , 25. do plainly evince ; and this is given as the meaning by the new annotations made by mr. gataker , who doth on verse 23. say , it was fulfilled in those persian potentates , cyrus , artaxerxes , darius , ahasuerus . nor is there in the contents of the chapter ( which mr. cragg without ground makes the judgement of the church of england ) any thing to the contrary , but the words , which are [ 18. the ample restauration of the church , 24. the powerfull deliverance out of the captivity ] do rather confirm this . if any people laughed at this , they shewed their ignorance , and mr. cragg shewed his heedlessness when he said , that it was an addition to the text that the gentiles should bring the lewes , when the very distinction of [ thy children ] from [ the gentiles ] shews it meant of the jewes , otherwise it should have been [ their children ] in the third person , not [ thine ] in the second ; nor can it be meant of gods children as his , for then it should be [ mine ] in the first person , for god speaks those words . though i deny not but the words may be accommodated to the times of the gospel , but not to mr. craggs purpose of bringing infants to baptism , which hath no colour from the text . which appears by considering mr. craggs answer to my questions put forth needfully to cleer the text . for 1. if by [ standard ] be meant [ baptism ] which the scripture never calls gods standard , and the bringing should be to baptism , then the sense should be that supreme magistrates as kings & and queens should bringinfants in their arms , and carrythem on shoulders to baptism , which no story ever mentions to have been done , and is too srivolous to be made the matter of that prophecy . 2. the terms [ nursing fathers , and nursing mothers ] shew it to be a metaphor , wch mr. cragg granting , though it follow not , that nothing could be gathered from it , yet it follows , that mr. craggs application , which is according to the proper sense of the words , is not right . what i said , that it was fulfilled in hesters time , i said rightly , and mr. gataker before me in those annotations of his which are taken for the most incomparably learned , and hester as a queen among the gentiles , might well be stiled a nursing mother to the jewes . i will not trouble my self to examine mr. craggs dictates , but refer the reader to the notes of mr. gataker . as for what i said , that though it should be understood of the times of the gospel , yet it might be meant of grown men perswaded by the preaching of the gospel , as junius in his annot. was true . nor doth the bringing in the bosome being a metaphor prove they were infants . and if so , the church is spoken to , and the children were both the gentiles children , and yet [ thy children ] that is the churches . and so there 's no interfering in my words . the next text was isaiah 65. 20. in reading which mr. cragg left out those words , nor an old man that hath not filled his daies , nor would read them , nor the words following , ver. 21 , 22. i perceived he meant nothing but fallacy , and yet he added impudence to it in accusing me as urging it to deceive the people , when his own course , in concealing what would have cleered the text , had a manifest shew of deceit , and mine of plain dealing . as for his interpretation , there shall be no more an infant of daies , that is , infants shall not be uncapable of the seal , it hath no proof but his dictate , and it is without all shew of probability , there being not a word of any such thing as ou●ward ordinances , but of peace , increase , possession , and long life , as the verses before and after shew . the like is to be said of his interpretation of the other part of the verse , the child shall dy an hundred years old , that is , as an hundred years old , or as well a churchmember as if he were a hundred years old , when the term [ as ] is added to the text . to which he replyed that i do put in [ as ] 1 cor. 10. 2. and rom. 11. 19. but this latter is false . i grant i do so interpret [ baptized 1 cor. 10. 2 ] because otherwise the proposition were not true , and the sense is plain according to this sense , were baptized , that is , their passage through the sea and under the cloud was to them as if they had been baptized , and so did grotius expound it , which is the same with that which others mean when they say , they were analogically baptized . but in isaiah 65. 20. there is no need of such an interpretation , and that i may use the words of mr. gataker annot. on isaiah 65. 20. the syntax is familiar , and as cleer as the day-light or sunshine : the child or youth ( that now is ) shall dy the son of an hundred years ; that is , shall be an hundred years old when he dyeth . nor is this contrary to the contents , which though they be intituled to the church of england , yet there is no canon or act of any synod which did ever make them so , and who ever framed them , yet i think it no disparagement to say that mr. gataker understood the text as well or better than he : and this text was rightly made by me answerable to zach. 8. 4. nor is there either absurdity or ●ntruth , or blasphomy in my interpretation : which might be shewed by transcribing mr. gatakers forementioned notes on isaiah 65. 17 , 19 , 25. were it not i am forced to be brief . what i said about dr. prideaux his use was true , that he would require the respondent afore he answered to read the text , and consider it , which is necessary in divinity disputes , however respondents be restrained in other disputes . and for my explosion at oxford it is a meer figment , and that neither dr. savage , nor the doctor of the chair , did avoid my argument by their answer is manifest enough from dr. savage his own recital of his answer in his printed book , and this had been shewed in print ere this but that the printer failed to print my answer in the fit time . the frivolous conceit of my fear of mr. craggs gunshot is foolish ; i do not count mr. craggs arguments to be of so much force as a squib . as for his argument from mat. 28. 19. i answered , that all nations or whole nations did not include every part , all nations being taken synecdochically for the disciples of all nations . as for his division i gave the genuine reason why infants are excepted from the precept of baptizing , because they are no disciples . nor was there any defect in logick when i did not reduce it to one of his members . for [ capable of baptism ] and [ disciples ] are not terms subordinate , but distinct , though without opposition . and though to be disciples made them capable , yet there is a difference between the terms . i presume mr. cragg thinks baptized persons already disciples , yet not capable of baptism . what he saith of me , that i found fault with him at rosse for translating {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} make disciples of all nations , i am as sure is his fiction , as that i spake any thing there to him . nor will , i think , any man believe i should do so , except he found me now crazed in my brain , that hath either read my examen par . 3. s. 12. or 13. or shall read that part of my review now in press , in which i often assert that translation , and largely answer objections to the contrary in the fifth , sixth , seventh , eighth , ninth , &c. of that book . in which book i shall at large answer all that mr. baxter hath said to prove infants disciples from acts 15. 10. as for what mr. cragg saith here , it is frivolous . for though v. 1. 5. there is mention of circumcision , yet not of circumcision as acted on infants , but as taught brethren , and when the apostles v. 6. did consider of the matter , they did not consider of circumcision as acted but as taught , and not only of circumcision , but also of imposing the whole law of moses as necessary , which was the putting the yoke v. 10. and it is ridiculous to conceive that those teachers mentioned verse 1. did attempt to do any thing to infants , and therefore it is a meer wrangling to contend that the disciples on whom they would have put the yoke , verse 10. were infants , contrary to the constant use of the term throughout all the new te●●ament some hundreds of time . as so : mr. craggs arguments from acts 2. 38 , 39. it is false that the apostles inference is as mr. cragg insinuated , unless his argument have four terms , that they may be baptized to whom is the promise . for the apostle expresseth a duty in the imperative mood , not a ●ight in the indicative or potential , it is [ be baptized ] not [ may be baptized ] as in mr. craggs conclusion . i excepted that those parents were not then believers , which mr. cragg co●●●●ied in saying , they were believers in fieri , though not perhaps in facto , which is all one as to say they were not yet believers , but in the way to it . as for his saying , they were believers by outward assent and disposition , though perhaps not by inward assent and habit . i reply 1. if they were by disposition , how were they not by inward assent ? 2. how doth he know they were believers by outward assent and not by inward ? doth he know they were hypocrites ? 3. what act did they shew which expressed outward assent to the acknowledgement of christ as their lord ? what mr. cragg saith he knows of me , and tells of a ministers rule , is a fault he chargeth me with as not pertaining to the dispute . what he saith , that acts 2. 38. repentance is not made a condition of being baptized , is in my apprehension manifestly false . for the requiring repentance as first to be done , and then baptism to be annexed doth make it a condition of baptism , as when it is said , believe and thou shalt be saved , belief is made a condition of salvation . his talk about incompleat repentance , because they were pricked in their hearts , as a sufficient qualification for baptism , doth make the apostles speech as idle , which requires that which they had already , if mr. cragg say true ; but who will believe mr. cragg that the apostle required no more to baptism but an incompleat repentance or pricking the heart , v. 38. which it is said they had before ? or that he took that as a sufficient qualification for baptism , and yet required more as previous to it ? or who will believe him that the 3000. jewes were baptized upon an incompleat repentance , when the text expressely saith , then they that gladly received the word were baptized ? or that there was no new act of peter , but a recapitulation of the heads of his sermon that he preached to them before they were pricked in conscience , or were exhorted to be baptized , when the text saith , with many other words he testified and exhorted ? or that there was any , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , putting that as done after , which was done before , when the text doth so expresly note the order of time , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , which our translatours render [ then ] and if it be rendred [ therefore ] it proves that which was done v. 41. to be consequent on that which was done before ver. 40. to the argument , to whom the promise of grace belonged , to them baptism belongs also : but the promise of grace belongs to believers and their children . ergo . to this i answered out of the text , when they are called , or are believers , not before , it neither belongs to fathers nor children without calling . to this mr. cragg replyed , 1. that the verb is in the indicative present tense , which implies , it is to them for the present , as well to your children as to you . 2. the opposition is between them and their children as near , to distinguish them as to whom the promise was at present from them to whom it was afar of , that is in the future , but all this is frivolous . for 1. the verb is in the indicative mood when it is said , the promise is to those that are afar off , as well as when it is said , the promise is to you and your children . 2. their being afar off is not in respect of time , but of place or dwelling , and the meaning is , they that are in the dispersion as it is called james 1. 1. or if it were meant in the sense that it is used ephe. 2. 15. ( not romans 2. 15. as mr. cragg miscites ) yet they are said to be afar off in respect of gods favour , or their affection to him , not in respect of time . lastly , it is frequent , even in speeches like this , to put the indicative mood present tense , by an enallage of tense , for the future , as matth. 5. 10 ; 12. i added , that by [ children ] is no necessity to understand infants , yet mr. cragg contrary to the common use , as ephe. 6. 4. col. 3. 20. would have [ children ] restrained to infants . 1. because of the notation of the word , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} is from {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} to bring forth , which i think he saith falsly is given sometimes to children in the womb , but if it be , then it overthrowes his notation , for then {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} is not from {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} to bring forth , for a child in the womb is not yet brought forth . but how doth it appear that {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} signifies properly a young child ? or that child is analogum to old and young ? i had hitherto thought child and parent had been relatives , and that child signifies as well an elder as a younger . to that of the verb of the present tense answer is before how doth mr. cragg prove that their children they had were young children ? it is vainly supposed that the promise is to them & their children , as the jews children were in covenant with their parents . the text makes it to belong neither to parents nor children , but those that god cals ? does mr. cragg think that the unbelieving jews had the promise ? and yet they were in covenant in his sense before , even the whole nation ? or doth he think that christs bloud was not avenged on them ? if it were , how was the remedy as large as the disease ? next mr. cragg argues thus , they that are holy with a covenant-holiness are capable of the outward visible part of blessing : but infants of believers are holy with a covenant-holiness ; therefore they are capable of the outward and visible part . of which syllogism i might have denied the major , there being a covenant-holiness according to election , which doth not always instate the person in that which he calls the outward visible part of the blessing , by which he means title to baptism . but i denied the minor , understanding it of the outward covenant-holiness as they call it , which i truly said , is gibberish , and however vossius , bullinger ( for grotius i think means otherwise ) conceive of it , or the assembly , yet it is a meer mistake , and that holiness of children which is mentioned 1 cor. 7. 14. is truly said by me to be onely matrimonial holiness , or legitimation . and his argument out of mr. baxter i justly retorted , that in six hundred times in which holy is used in scripture , in none of them it is found for outward covenant-holiness intituling to baptism : which is a right way of answering , though it be called indirect by the logicians . and as for that he replies that rom. 11. 16. i confessed at ross covenant-holiness is meant , i grant it , but not outward covenant-holiness intituling to baptism , but that real saving holiness which is according to the election of grace , according to which iews elected shall hereafter be graffed in again . i said , ezra 9. 2. holy seed is all one with a legitimate seed according to the law of moses . against this it is objected , that then the meaning should be , the holy seed , that is the lawfully begotten iews , have mingled themselves with the seed of these lands , that is the bastards of those lands but i deny this consequence . the sense is this , the holy seed , that is , those who were descended by lawfull generation of allowed women , these have taken to themselves of the daughters of the nations whom god forbad them to marry , which is plain out of the vers 1 , 2. so that the people of the land with whom they mingled themselves , are not considered as illegitimate in there birth , but as not allowed to the israelites , and yet the holy seed is that seed which by a right generation according to moses law was legitimate . as for what he saith , that iepthe was a saint and yet a bastard , it is true , he was holy in one respect as borne from above , yet unholy by naturall birth . and whereas he saith , moses had childeren by an ethiopian woman , and yet not unholy , i grant it : for the ethiopian woman was not forbidden : nor were rahab though a canaanitess , nor ruth a moabitess when they joyned themselves to the god of israel prohibited , or there children illegitimate : yet this is not the same with covenant-holiness , intituling to church-ordinances , but legitimation intituling to be reckoned in the genealogy and inheritance of israel . the last argument mr cragg used was this , they that christ took up in his arms , blessed , said , the kingdom of god belonged unto them , pronounced a curse upon those that despised , and would not receive them , are holy with a covenant-holiness ; but christ lock up little children into his arms , blessed them , said , the kingdom of god belonged unto them , pronounced a curse upon those that despised , and would not receive them : therefore little children are holy with a covenant-holiness . in this argument i denied the minor , after some debate about the way of forming of it , in which i imagined that fallacy i do not now upon fight deprehend , & particularly i denied , that christ pronounced a curse upon those that despised and would not receive them . then he alleged mat. 18. 2. whence he argued , they to whom belongs the kingdom of heaven are holy & in covenant : but to little children belongs the kingdom of heaven ; therefore little children are holy and in covenant . in which argument any reader may perceive he proved not what i denied , that christ pronounced a curse upon those that despised , and would not receive little children or infants , and yet that text he alleged did not say of little children , that to them belongs the kingdom of heaven , but those that were not to be offended , v. 6. despised , v. 10. were to be received in christs name , v. 5. were not little children in age , but little ones in spirit , which appeared in that they are said to be believers , v. 6. and to be converted , and become as little children . to which , as the relator himself sets it down , mr. cragg said , the meaning is not , that the little children are converted , which is a grant of what i alleged , that the little ones not to be offended , despised , but received , were not little children in age , but affection of humility . mr. cragg added , but it hath relation to the desciples in the first verse , who must be converted from their actual sins , and become as little children which have no actual sin . at which words it is true , i said , and that justly , o how unhappy are the people that are seduced with these toys , are you not ashamed ? to which he replied , and it seems is not ashamed that it is printed , i see nothing worthy of shame : whereas if this speech of his were true , then this is a truth , except men be converted from their actual sins , and become as little children , which have no actual sin , they shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven : for this is the meaning of christs words , matth. 18. 3. according to mr. craggs interpretation , which whosoever believes must of necessity despair of heaven , sith as james saith , chap. 3. 2. in many things we offend all : and john 1. epist. chap. 1. ver. 8. if we say that we have no sin , we deceive our selves , and the truth is not in us . that which mr. cragg added , that the disciples were believers which are meant matth. 18. 6. and not the children , and yet saith , his argument remains unanswered , hath more of impudence in it . for his argument being that christ pronounced a curse on them that despised and received not little ones in age , and yet confessing that this was meant not of little ones in age , but disciples , believers in him , it is the heighth of impudency to say his argument is unanswered , when his own confession answerd it . justly here , after five hours time , having promised but one , did i breakoff , and having had experience of mr. craggs meet cavilling at rosse and abergaveny , dwelling many miles from that town , and finding nothing in him , and those other paedobaptists i have answered , but a spirit of wrangling , i yielded not to any other dispute , nor shall for time to come , being now sufficiently taught by experience what dealing i am like to have , yield to such disputes . as for that which mr. cragg saith , he was hurried to that extemporal discourse through importunity , i do not believe it , being advertised before , that if i came to abergaveny he would oppose me . that the speech of him that said i answered nothing , was the speech of an impudent , brazen-faced fellow , i think any will judge who reads this my writing . for mr. baxter , whatever his worth be , yet how justly i might say ( though the words set down were not used as the relator expresseth them ) that i have answered all he saith against me , will appear in the review of the dispute between him and me , and others , of which part of it is printed , part in the press , and the rest ( if the lord permit ) shall not be slackned . mr. craggs arguments from john 3. 5. romans 11. and other places , if they be not in his sermon ( to the examining of which i now hasten ) yet are they in other books answered by me : i shall take some view of his sermon on which i had made some animadversions before , according to the imperfect copy i had then , and sent them to a ergaveny , but have them not now by me in london , yet however in this straight of time i think it necessary to write thus much . sect. v. mr. craggs sermon is examined . first he saith [ and is baptized ] pag. 72. to be a conditional qualification , and yet in the dispute he denyed that repentance is a condition of baptism acts 2. 38. his observation out of dr. buckeridge p. 73. is frivolous , for the apostle 1 cor. 12. 28. saith as well of apostles as of ordinary pastors and teachers , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} he for them , or , if he will , fixed them . but it seems mr. cragg hath a special tooth at itinerants , though his relator claw mr. cr. and mr. w. but what he saith , that it is too strict an interpretation to expound mark 16. 15. of men of age and understanding , excluding children , shews he little considers what he saith . for if it be so , then christ , commandeth the apostles to preach the gospel to infants , and sith mr. cragg is bound to do so , he sheweth that he sins against his own light , if he do not so . but how foolish it would be for him to attempt it , his own words shew , when he saith , infants are not capable to be taught of men . and when he saith , that infants only in actu primo are capable of the first seeds of understanding , of profession of faith , i would know , in what sense they are sensible of the benefit they have by christ . and whereas he grants , that baptism is necessary by necessi●y of precept if conveniently it may be had , it is all i assested in my sermen , when i said all that would be saved must be baptized after profession . if austin were a hard father to infants for holding they must be baptized or not see the kingdom of god , then mr. cragg cannot gather from john 3. 5. infants baptism . from mark 16. 16. is rightly gathered that believing is to be before baptism , and yet from mark 1. 4. it is not rightly gathered that we must be baptized , before we can hear the word preached or repent ; for the text doth not express that john baptized afore he preached , but recites these two as connexed , yet the latter is put first , not because first done , but because he was to set down more amply what he preached . though we cannot know that the person to be baptized hath a saving faith , yet a saving faith is the rule of baptism to the person baptized , he should not undertake that ordinance without a saving faith ; and in respect of the baptizer , so far as he can discern , he should require a saving faith of those he baptizeth . dipping over head , or baptizing over head , after profession of faith , is no invention of man , but the command of christ , practice of the apostles , and their successors for many ages , and infant-baptism was opposed many ages afore john of leyden , who though he were otherwise not to be justified , yet i do not remember that any hath written he ever confessed that he had that doctrine from satan . but mr. cragg saith , baptizing is in greek any washing whether by dipping or sprinkling . and he cites ravanel who hath made a dictionary according to the present use of terms . but he shews not out of any of the pillars , as he calls them , of the greek tongue , that baptizing in greek ever signifies to sprinkle . he confesses that casaubon in his notes on matth. 3. 6. distinguisheth between baptizing and rantizing or sprinkling , but saith , the whole state of the question is determined against me , because he addes , that their judgement is deservedly long since exploded , and trampled down , that would have baptizing to be by dipping , seeing the force and efficacy of this mystery consists not in that . but 1. by mr. craggs leave the question is plainly determined for me by casaubon , when he distinguisheth between baptizing and sprinkling , for that is the question , not wherein the efficacy and force of the mystery consists . 2. though casaubon were a very learned man , yet this speech of his is not right . for we are to observe what christ appoints , though the efficacy and force of the mystery of sacrament consist not in it , as we are to break bread , not take a wafer-cake down whole , drink wine in the lords supper , because of the institution , though the force and efficacy of the mystery consist not in it . mr. craggs speeches out of aquinas and dominicus à sato , are of no weight with them who know who those doctors were , to wit , papists , and very unskilful in the greek language . it is as vain which mr. cragg saith the israelites were baptized when their feet did but touch the water , for the text saith exo. 14. 29. they walked upon dry land in the middest of the sea , and the waters were a wall unto them on their right hand and on their left , and therefore their feet did not so much as touch the water , much less were they sprinkled with it . and if the israelites were baptized in the cloud , and yet no water upon them , then the text 1cor . 10. 2. doth not prove baptizing to be by sprinkling , but proves plainly that as hugo grotius said they were baptized , that is , they were as if they had been baptized , or as other , they were analogically baptized , that is in proportion , or likeness , not formally , that is according to what is meant by that term . it is without proof , yea false which mr. cragg saith , where is mention●●●●●● in the gospel of washing themselves , of cups , of vessels , of tables , this cannot be meant of plunging in water , so often , but rinsing . for water was not so scarce but that they might do it by dipping as well as sprinkling . he might have seen ainsworth on levit. 11. 32. who out of the hebrew canons tells us , all that are unclean , whether men or vessels , are not cleansed , but by dipping ( or baptizing ) in water : and wheresoever the law speaketh of washing a mans flesh , or washing of clothes for uncleanness , it is not but by dipping the whole body therein . me thinks mr. cragg should allow anabaptists to make consequences though they allow not his . and that john baptists and philips going down into the water , proves something me thinks mr. cragg should not deny , sith it cannot reasonably be imagined they should go down , not to the water , as mr. cragg would have it , but into the water , whereas for baptizing a person a man might easily have fetched or taken water out of any spring to baptize with , if it had been so to be done by sprinkling , and not by dipping . but if he please to see a book intituled of baptism , written by an eminent man in the state , he might see many of the prime writers , even leading protestants , gathering dipping thence , as used then in baptizing . the like they do from john 3. 23. of which whatever geographer or traveller saith , enon ( where john baptized ) was a little brook that one may stride over scarce knee deep , and therefore not capable of dipping ( which doth not follow ) deserves not to be believed in this . out of rom. 64 , we do not press a necessity of dipping , because of the resemblance , but from the resemblance alluded to shew the use then , ingenuously confessed by mr. vaugban , and therefore should be the use still . nor doth it follow , we must ly● three daies and nights in water , the resemblance of christs burial is to be continued though not the duration . whatever other resemblance there may be of our burial with christ , yet we are to follow the institution and practice set down in scripture , from which he that swerves ( as sprinkless do ) do sin against christs command , whatever any divines or assemblies of men say to the contrary . it is well mr. cragg confesseth , that if he were to baptize converted turks or pagans of ripe age he might baptize them by dipping : it shews that it is only for infants sake that the institution of christ is altered , and so one corruption hath brought in another . what he addes , provided their garments were not first baptized or washed , intimates he would have them naked , which mr. baxter would conclude to be against the sixth and seventh command , and he may do well to school mr. cragg for it . his reason is as foolish , though the garments be baptized in water , yet are not baptized with that use that the person is , but by accident , nor baptized as bells to drive away devils , nor is by baptizing the garment any worship done to it , as the church of rome doth to the image : for then the baptizing the body should be worshipping it , the garments and body are not worshipped at all by baptizing , and therefore foolishly is it compared to romish superstition and idolatry . he that affirms that baptizing without dipping is not lawful , that it is will-worship , that the sprinkling used is a nullity , that notwithstanding such pretended baptism , yet baptism remains a duty , speaks but truth . the decree of the senate of zurick was an unrighteous decree , which , whatever state follows , it will draw the guilt of murdering innocent persons on it , and mr. cragg by reciting it with seeming approbation , doth make it probable that he is a bloody-minded man , who would rejoice to see innocent men , who out of tenderresse of conscience follow the plain rule of christ , so put to death : which it s not unlikely to be the aim of his , or his complices printing this book against those he calls anabaptists , that he might stir up either magistrates or furious common people against them . mr. cragg saith , he hath resolved the former doubt , that baptizing is not dipping , and yet page 81. the authors he cites , and by citing approves , do all make dipping or dying one of the first of its significations . now he undertakes to prove that infants may , nay ought to be baptized . and he begins as an advocate for infants with this childish preface , that those poor souls cannot speak for themselves , as if in speaking for their baptism he spake for them , when he doth thereby rather speak for that which is to their hurt , and calls them poor souls , whom before he called saints . there is more in his pittyfull preface , he supposeth , if the apostles had been asked , why they did not put down infant-baptism in plainer terms , they would have answered , that they thought none would have denyed it . and i suppose they would have answered , that they thought none would have affirmed it , being quite against christs appointment , and their practice , who had then no such custome , nor the churches of god . the rest , as it is taken from mr. baxter , so it is answered in the answer to him now in the press sect. 3. le ts view mr. craggs arguments . his first is , those that are in covenant with god ought to have the seal of the covenant which is baptism ; but infants of believing parents are in covenant with god ; ergo . he saith , the former proposition is firm by the confession of all diviues , even our adversaries , and cites five , but not where they say it , nor is any one his adversary in this point . it is true ferus was a popish frier , though more ingenuous than most of them . but doth mr. cragg think we must take that for true , which protestants and papists do avow without any proof from scripture ? if so , then let us lay aside the scripture , and read their books . but he might know , and t is likely did know , that i ( though i will not take on me the name of a divine ) yet have denyed , yea and proved his former proposition to be false exam. par . 3. sect. 1. letter to mr. bayly sect. 3. anti-pae lob . or full review first part sect. 5. which shall be fully vindicated ( god assisting ) in the third part . yea were his arguing good , it would prove infants were wronged because they had not the communion . for i can as well from his own medium prove that they are to have it , as he baptism . the minor he takes on him to prove from genesis 17. 7. but there is not a word of infants of believing parents . but to prove it he ci es cornelius à lapide , a jesuit , for him , and yet had he not falsly translated his words , the words would have appeared to be against him . for whereas he renders them in , the spiritual seed to the faithful ( which mars his sense ) it is , in the spiritual seed the faithful . so likewise gal. 3. 8. though there be not the term abrahams seed , yet it is directly against him , for it asserts justification to the believing gentiles onely from abrahams promise , not a promise to them and their seed . i deny not but that isaac was in covenant with god , that is , a child of the promise , not onely when he was but eight days old , but also afore the seventh , yea afore he was born ; but when he saith , he had the seal ( meaning circumcision ) by virtue of the lamb to be slain , it is strange divinity to me , who never heard or read that any person was circumcised by virtue of christs death , but by reason of gods command . and that which he saith , much more the children of believing parents by virtue of the lamb that is already slain , which seems to intimate , that circumcision is due to them much more , and that by virtue of christs death , is a foppery like to the authors ingeny . he saith , deut. 29. 11. when all the people stood in covenant before the lord , their little ones are mentioned amongst the rest . and are not their wives , and servants , hewers of wood , and drawers of water ? are all these in covenant with god ? how doth he prove they were believers infants ? the words v. 4. seem to make to the contrary . it is no shift but a manifest truth , that those , acts 2. 38 , 39. to whom peter said , the promise is to you and your childdren , were not then believers in christ , when the words were spoken to them . for , 1. the apostle exhorts to repentance , therefore they had not yet repented , and so were not believers . mr. cragg himself , pag. 78. in this sermon saith , repentance is a fruit and effect of faith , therefore according to him , not before it . and in the dispute , pag. 52. he made them believers in fieri , with an incompleat repentance , though perhaps not believers in facto , 2 . v . 40. he exhorted them with more words , and then v. 41. some of them gladly received the word , and were believers . yet peter said to them before they were believers , the promise is to you and your children , nor is there a word in the text that makes it clear , that as soon as they were believers their children were in covenant with them , and to be baptized . his second argument is , such as were circumcised under the law may be baptized under the gospels : but infants of believers were circumcised under the law ; therefore they may be baptized under the gospel . he cites whitaker saying , all the anabaptists shall not be able to resist this argument . i answer , notwithstanding so learned a mans conceit , it hath not the force of a feather so as to need resistance . to it i answer , 1. indirectly by retortion . such as were circumcised under the law may be baptized under the gospel : but infants of unbelievers , as the males bought with abrahams money of the stranger , not of his seed , gen. 17 , 12 , 13 , 23 , 27. persons out of covenant as ishmael , gen. 17 , 19 , 21 , 25. were circumcised under the law : ergo . if the one be irresistible so is other . 2. directly , by denying the major if it be universal ; if not , the syllogism is naught , concluding from particulars . his proofs are vain . that from austin is of no force , unless it be supposed , 1. that by circumcising under the law , and baptizing under the gospel , the grace of god is conferred , which is a popish conccit . circumcision did binde to the keeping of the law , but never that i finde is the grace of god said to be either physically or morally conferred by the circumcision of each person rightly circumcised . 2. it supposeth , if infants be not baptized , the grace of god is straiter in the new testament than in the old . but that is false . for the grace of god is as much without sacraments as with it . above two thousand years before abrham was circumcised there was neither circnmcision nor baptism of infants , nor any other sacrament instead thereof ; shall we say that gods grace was straiter before abrahams time than since ? as bad as the schoolmen were , who gave too much to sacraments , yet they held , that the grace of god is not tied to sacraments . that question from heb. 8. 6. how were it a better covenant , if all poor infants that were in covenant under the law were out of covenant under the gospel , runs upon these common mistakes , that to be circumcised or baptized is all one as to be in covenant ; all that were in covenant were to be circnmcised or baptized ; all that were not , were out of covenant ; that the reason of the circumcising or baptizing a person is his being in covenant , which are all false , as i have proved exam. part. 3. sect. 1. letter to mr. baily , sect. 3. antipaed . part. 1. sect. 5. and shall part. 3. in many sections , if god permit . and to the question i answer from the next words , heb. 8. 6. the new covenant is a better covenant because it is established on better promises , though it were imagined never a poor infant ( as he childishly speaks ) which yet i do dot conceive , were in covenant . the next from tit. 2. 11. supposeth , if infants be not to be baptized , the grace of god appears not to them , which is of no force , unless that popish conceit obtain , that by it , and not without it , gods grace appears to all . but this is false , and not in the text . irenaeus words are not that christ was a little one , that little ones might be baptized from his example , for then he would have been baptized in infancy , whereas he was not baptized till about thirty years of age . we need not deny christs redemption of infants , because we deny their baptism , there 's no such connexion between them . his saying of little ones that they were the first martyrs that suffered for christ , is false . for how were they martyrs who testified nothing concerning christ ? that of the collect in the common prayer book on innocents day , that they witnessed onely by dying is vain ; for dying without some other expression doth not witness : nor did they suffer for christ whom they knew not , but because of herods beastly rage . this speech of mr. cragg smels rank of the common prayer book superstition in keeping innocents day , which it seems mr. cragg yet retains ; but is nothing to the proof of his major , nor any thing hitherto alleged . that which he saith last , hath most shew of proof , that baptism came in place of circumcision , the apostle clears it , col. 2. 11 , 12. ye are circumcised with circumcision made without hands , how is that ? buried with him in baptism : but it is not true that he saith , ye are circumcised with circumcision made without hands , in that ye are buried with him in baptism : these are predicated of the same persons , and so were conjoyned , but yet not so as to express how that the former was done by the latter , no more than by that which follows , that therein they were raised by the faith of the operation of god who raised christ from the dead : yea it had been false , so expounded : for how could it be true that they were circumcised without hands , in that they were buried in baptism with hands ? nor if this were granted , were it true , that it is cleared by the apostle that baptism comes in the room of circumcision : for there is not a word to that end , yea the scope is to prove that we have all in christ without circumcision , as v. 10. &c. shew , and that christ came in the place of circumcision , and the rest of the jewish ceremonies , as v. 17. is expressed . and therefore the apostle asserts the contrary , that no rite but christ came in the room of circumcision . if any ask why is v. 12. added , i have answered formerly , and the answer is not gainsaid by m. marshall , that it is to shew how persons come to be in christ , and so to be compleat in him , which he usually ascribeth to faith and baptism , gal. 3. 26 , 27. rom. 6. 3 , 4 , 5. and they are put together , col. 2. 12. so that if baptism be conceived thence to succeed circumcision , faith also is said to succeed it : which is more agreeable to the expressions , gal. 3. 23 , 25. i add the circumcision mentioned col. 2. 11. is either circumcision made without hands , or christs personal circumcision , therefore if the placing of baptism after v. 12. prove its succession to circumcision , it proves onely its succession to that made without hands , which was not the ceremony commanded , gen. 17. or to christs circumcision , not to the common circumcision of others . yet were a succession granted , this proves not , it must be in baptism as in circumcision , without a like command , as i prove antipaed : part. 2. sect. 2 , 3. no more than because the ministers of the gospel succeed the priests of the law , doth it follow , the ministers children must be ministers , anointed , &c. as it was in the law . so that mr. craggs irresistible argument is as easily blown away as a feather . and i hardly imagine any anabaptist so called to be so weak but that he is able to answer it , by telling mr. cragg that his first proposition is false , unless there were the like command to baptize infants as there was to circumcise them . if the third argument arise thence , it hath its answer thence , that it is frivolous talk in mr. cragg to speak as if denying infants baptism were putting out of the covenant , disfranchizing , and circumcising , supposed being in covenant , was a seal of the covenant of grace . his proof that the gospel puts not infants out of the covenant is true of the elect infants , and the covenant of grace expressed in the gospel . and yet his proofs are silly . new born babes desire milk , little childeren are humble , and are proposed herein as paterns to us , therefore they are in covenant ; whereas this is as true of infidels children as of christians , and therefore proves the one in covenant as well the other , and both these acts of little childeren are onely natural , not virtuous , and so give not evidence of their being in covenant ; nor doth the gospel give them large commendations beyond them of riper years , making them the rule of our perfection : for there is neither commendation of them , 1 pet. 2. 2. nor matth. 18. 3. nor making them the rule of our perfection , any more than sheep and doves , matth. 10. 16. but onely those virtuous qualities , which are resembled by their natural qualities are propounded to us as our rule . his testimony out of bellarmine intimates that bellarmine said , there is no impediment to infants baptism , because the case is clear , as if bellarmine would not have said it , had the case not been clear , whereas it is more likely to be false than true , because bellarmine a jesuit saith it ; yea it is manifestly false ; for the institution being onely to baptize disciples , prohibits baptizing of infants , which are not such , but for want of being disciples uncapable of baptism . but mr. cragg in his fourth argument will prove infant-baptism commanded , matth. 28. 19. because nations are commanded to be baptized . to this i answered before in the dispute , and my answer is , and was , nations are not commanded to be baptized without any other circumscription , but disciples of the nations , mr. cragg confessed , pag. 48. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} is , ye shall make disciples , and then baptizing is of disciples . his speech , infants are not uncapable of baptism , because they have not faith and repentance , because christ was baptized without repentance , is frivolous , for there is not the same end of christs baptism and ours , and therefore though repentance were not required of him , yet it is of us , and the want of it makes infants uncapable of baptism . it is false , that god requires no more of persons in covenant , and born of believing parents , to their baptism , but a meer objective power or receptability , as he cals it , as was in the world at its creation , or in the regeneration , which he new makes us . and it is meerly false , that upon any such account as he speaks of , many whole families were baptized , or that any infants were included . the very texts which speak of the baptizing of the housholds either there or elsewhere speak of their fearing god , acts 2. 2. that all the houseshould be saved by peters words , acts 11. 14. had repentance and the like gift with the apostles , v. 17 , 18. had the word spoken to them , acts 16. 32. believed , v. 34 , acts 18. 8. addicted themselves to the ministery of the saints , 1 cor. 16 , 15. which shew no infants were meant under the houshold , for they did none of these things . mr. cragg goes on argument 5. they that are capable of the kingdom and the blessing which is the greater , are capable of baptism which is the lesser : but infants are capable of the kingdom and the blessing which is the greater : therefore they are capable of baptism which is the lesser . to which i answer , the major is false : if it were true , it would follow infants are capable of the kingdom and the blessing , which is the greater , therefore they are capable of the lords supper , ordination to the ministery , church-discipline , which are the less . though into the kingdom of heaven infants be admitted by god who knows who are his without any visible expression , yet into the visible church persons are not admitted without visible testimony of their faith , of which sort were all added to the church acts 2. 47. not one of those texts mark 10. 13. to 17. mark 9. 14 , 36 , 37. mat. 18. 2 , 3 , 4. matth. 19. 13 , 14 , 15. luke 9. 14 15. luke 18. 15 , 16. severall , nor all joyntly prove , infants visible church-members . the kingdom of god , mark 10. 14. is not the visible church , for into it such as are not humble , as little children may enter , which our saviour denies , v. 15. but the same with the kingdom , v. 23 , 24 , 25. into which it is so hard and impossible for a rich man or one that trusts in riches to enter , which is called v. 17 , 30 eternal life . it is false , that christ saith , the angels of little ones in age see the face of his father which is in heaven ; but of little ones in spirit , who are converted and believe in christ , matth , 18. 3 , 6 , 10. for whose sake they are sent , heb. 1. 14. they are but paedebaptists dreams , that the three evangelists recorded christs blessing little ones to check antipaedobaptists , or to declare that which mr. cragg cals a precious truth , though it be a very ly , and may be gathered to be so even from the story . for sure if infants had been to be baptized , christ would have then appointed them to be baptized , and blamed his apostles for not doing it . and therefore mr. craggs questions are answered by questions . 1. doth christ take children in his arms . and would be have all put out of his visible church ? answ. doth christ no more but take them up in his arms , lay his hands on them , and bless them ? and shall we presume to do more without any warrant of his , even to admit them into his visible church by baptism ? 2. would he have us receive them in his name , and yet not receive them into his visible church , & c ? answ : where doth christ ever bid us receive little children in age ? where did he ever send them , that they might be received in his name ? must we make christs words to import that which we would in another censure as a spice of madnesse , when he hath told us plainly they are his apostles , and other preachers he hath sent whom we are to receive in his name mark 9. 41. luke 9. 48. though they are as mean and contemptible as a little child ? how should children be received but by providing nurses ? would christ have us provide nurses for little children ? our lord christ expresseth a cup of cold water to drink , as some part of the reception in his name mark 9. 41. is this a thing fit to entertain an infant with ? this is enough to answer mr. craggs frivolous questions . and in answer to the words of mr. baxter , who is the godly and reverend divine he means , i say for my part , seeing the will of christ is that i must walk by , and his word that i must be judged by , and he hath given so full a discovery of his will in this point , i will boldly adventure to follow his rule to baptize disciples professing faith , and had rather answer him upon his own incouragement for not admitting by baptism those he never appointed to be baptized , than to adventure upon the doing like uzzah upon mine own head that which doth prophane the ordinance of baptism , and corrupt the church of christ . mr. craggs sixt argument is ; infants are disciples ; therefore they may be baptized . the antecedent he would prove from acts 15. 10. in that it was circumcision which was the yoke , which he proves from ver. 5. but he confesseth it was not circumcision only , but the attendants , and that it is no shift , but a cleer truth , that it is not circumcision as acted on infants , but as taught , imposed on the consciences of believing gentiles , with the rest of moses his law , as necessary to salvation by some teachers ( which cannot be said of infants ) is so manifest from the text , that i dare boldly say , they that assert that by disciples acts 15. 10. are meant , do but wrangle against cleer light , and spit against the sun . that the text isai. 54. 13. is not meant of infants of believing parents , as such , but of such as having heard and learned of the father come to christ , is plain from those words of our saviour john 6. 45. alleged here by mr. cragg himself , as expounding the prophet . the seventh argument is , all that have faith may be baptized ; but some infants have faith ; therefore some infants may be baptized . but 1. the major is not true of faith onely in seed , or act secret , and not made known . 2. mr. cragg alters the conclusion , which should have been that all infants of believers may be baptized ; but then he durst not avouch the minor , that they all have saith , at least in semine the contrary being manifest from scripture and experience , he proves his minor . 1. from matth. 18. where he saith , christ expresly calls them believers . but christ calls not little children in age believers , ver. 6. it had been ridiculous to threaten so heavy a doom to the offending of little children in age , who are offended with none so much as nurses for dressing , or chiding them when they cry : but the apostles and other christian disciples are there meant . 2. they are said to receive the kingdome of god mark 10. that is , the grace of god , remission of sins , and life eternal ; now the kingdome is not received , but by faith in christ . but onely elect infants dying do receive the kingdom , either by faith in the seed , not in the act , or by faith in the act secret only , and yet are not to be baptized till they make profession , not are all or any children of believers , as theirs , elect . 3. saith mr. cragg , they please god , therefore christ blesseth them ; but without faith it is impossible to please god . answ. the like argument is urged by the remonstrants at the synod at dort , it is impossible to please god without faith , therefore election which supposeth pleasing of god presupposeth faith ; the answer is , that heb. 11. 6. the pleasing of god is meant of the works , as enoch pleased god walking with him , and so infants please not god , and therefore may be without faith , not of the persons , in which sense infants may please god , that is be beloved with a love of benevolence , though not of delight , without faith . 4. faith must be allowed them , or not salvation , for faith purifyeth the heart acts 15. 9. and no unclean thing shall enter into heaven . answ. faith in the seed is sufficient to make them clean , which is not denyed may be in infants , though neither isai. 65. 20. sayes any such thing , and austins words express nothing but his own conceit according to the language of his time , but faith in seed or act unknown doth not intitle to baptism . the eighth argument was answered before by denying the major and minor , and his calling those that expound 1 cor. 7. 14. of legitimation gross anabaptists doth but involve melancthon , camerarius , musculus , &c. in the same censure , and that it is no bastard , as dr. featley called it , but a genuine exposition is demonstrated at large in my anti-paedobaptism first part , and t is granted , that pagans children are holy in the apostles sense if lawfully begotten ; for the sanctifiedness of the yoke-fellow , and holiness of the children is not ascribed to the faith of the one parent , but to the conjugal relation between them . rom. 11. 16. the first fruits and root , are abraham , not every believer , the lump and branches are abrahams children by election and faith , not every believers , nor all abrahams natural children : and the holiness is meant of saving holiness , not meer outward visible holiness . the breaking off and grassing in rom. 11. 17. are meant of the invisible church , in which sense parents and children are not broken off or graffed in together . see my anti. paedobap . first part . nineth argument tells us of dangerous absurdities if infants should be out of covenant under the gospel . but this is not all one as to be baptized ; we may grant them to be in the covenant of grace , and yet not to be baptized , and to be baptized , and yet not in the covenant of grace . but let us view the absurdities . first , infants ( saith he ) would be losers by christs comming , and in a worse condition than the jewish infants were , they with the parents were admitted to the seal of the covenant , which was circumcision , and not parents with children to baptism . answ. 1. i rather think that by being not admitted to circumcision the condition of parents and children is the better by christs comming , sith as mr. cragg teacheth here page 100. circumcision is the yoke acts 15. 10. of which the apostle saith , neither we nor our fathers were able to bear it , and is so farr from being the seal of the covenant of grace , that ( they are mr. craggs own words ) circumcision was the seal or ordinance by which the jews were bound to observe the doctrine and the law , meaning of moses . 2. but were it imagined a pure evangelical privilege , yet sure it is not such a privilege , but parents and children did well without it , afore abrahams time , and all the females from abrahams daies till christs . i suppose what ever privilege it were , it was abundantly recompensed by christs comming without infant-baptism , except a meer empty title of visible church-membership , which yet will not stand them so much in stead , as to admit them to the lords supper , be such an inestimable treasure as is not recompensed with the glory of the gospel now exhibited to spiritual persons , in spiritual benefits by the spirit , instead of the carnall promises , ordinances , and church-state of the law . the second is answered already , though infants be not baptized , grace is larger under the gospel being extended to believers in all nations , then under the law to the israelites and some few proselytes . the third is a speech that hath neither truth , nor sobriety of expression , nor proof , it is but a bugbear to affright the ignorant people to make use of such as he is , and to make odious them that will not baptize infants , as counting them as vile as the children of turks , tartars , or canniballs , even as they make them odious that will not burie their dead , as not affording them christian burial ( though they are buried as christ was without a priest , ) but burying as dogs . but we know how to put a difference between believers and pagans children in regard of the love god bears to us , some promises he hath made to us concerning them , the hopefullnesse of them by reason of prayers , education , example , society , confirmed by many experiences that are comfortable , all which things we should be contented with and not complain for want of an imaginary privilege , which is indeed no privilege , but a dammage to our children . i for my part look upon the children of believers unsprinkled , as precious , and rather more hopeful than those that are . and i think mr. cragg , as hard a conceit as he hath of the anabaptists and their children , yet would he be ashamed to say as he doth here of them , that they are as vile as the children of turks , tartars , or cannibals . but that which he closeth with , sheweth he was minded to affright the poor ignorant people , as the popish priests did of old . fourthly ( saith he ) they would be without god , without christ , without hope in the world ; not the children of god , but would all be damned , for out of covenant and visible church ( ordinarily ) there is no salvation . answ. by covenant , he means doubtless no other than the outward covenant , which is not shewed to be any other than baptism , and indeed we do no otherwise put them out of the covenant than by denying them baptism ; which being presupposed , mr. craggs speech must needs imply , that denying baptism inferrs all this . which cannot be true without conceiving , that all that are unbaptized are without god , without christ , without hope in the world , not the children of god , but of the devil , will be all damned , have no salvation . which is not only more than what the epistler makes hainous in me , all that would be saved must be baptized after profession ( though it were understood by me onely of necessity of precept , which mr. cragg himself asserts to be imported mark 16. 16. ) but worse than austin sayes , whom mr. cragg himself called the hard father of infants , and saies went too far , worse than the papists themselves speak of the dying unbaptized . which shews that he preached this sermon with a bitter and furious spirit . his closing speech [ out of covenant and visible church ( ordinarily ) there is no salvation . ] if understood of the covenant of saving according to election , i grant , that neither ordinarily , nor extraordinarily is there salvation : if of the outward covenant ( as they call it ) that is , the outward administration of seals , it is certain there may be salvation , unless profane contempt or willfull neglect against conscience do hinder salvation . the speech , out of the church is no salvation , hath been interpreted by protestants of the invisible church . a person of years that believes , though he be joined to no particular visible church , if there be not prophane contempt , or wilful neglect against conscience , may be saved . but they that are only negatively or privatively out of the church visible , meerly for want of age to understand the faith , and ability to make profession , may ordinarily , if by it be meant frequently , constantly be saved , though they be not ordinarily saved as [ ordinarily ] notes ordinary means , preaching the word and profession of faith . his last argument is , that which hath continued since the apostles times with blessed success , must needs be lawful ; but infant-baptism hath continued with blessed success since the apostles times ; ergo . the minor is denyed . the blessed success he proves not . in my exercitation i shew many errours and corruptions which have come from it , not by accident in respect of some persons that imbraced it only , but even from the tendency of the practice it self . i may ruly say that paedobaptism hath been as cursed a root of corrupting the churches , and losing the gifts of the spirit conferred at first commonly at baptism by laying on of hands , as i think ( except some few ) any other corruption in the rites of christian religion . but mr. cragg thinks to draw it down from the apostles daies . he begins with words of dionysius areopagita , holy men have received a tradition of the fathers , which very words shew it was not dionysius areopagita mentioned acts 17. he would doubtless have said , i have received it from blessed paul , not have told what other holy men have received from the fathers , whom mr. cragg vainly conceives to be meant of the apostles . but the books that go under his name have been so often by so many learned men , papists and protestants proved to be meer counterfeits , that either it is much ignorance , or much impudence that this is produced as his . salmasius sundry times speaketh of them as certain , that the author of them was not till the fifth age . the apostolical constitutions appear by many observations of scultetus , and others , not to have been written by clement , but of much later time . irenaeus his words make nothing for mr. cragg , as he cites them , nor as they stand in his own works . origens speeches are in the latin books translated by ruffinus , into which many things were foisted by him , and these its probable were so as being so expresse against the pelagians , nor do i find he was ever alleged by austin , who gathered the most ancient testimonies he could for original sin and infant-baptism . therefore saith vossius in his theses of infant-baptism , we less care for origen , because they are not in greek . cyprians testimony is granted to be in the third century , and ambroses and austins , and the milevitan councils and innumerable more , but all upon the popish errours of giving grace , and the necessity to save a child from damnation . gregory nazianzen and tertullian before him disswade from it , except in case of danger of death in appearance near : out of which case the ancients did not baptize infants , and in that case the communion was given them : but otherwise they baptized not infants , no not of believing parents , till they came to years , and then they were first catechized in lent , and then solemnly baptized at easter and whitsuntide , as may be gathered even from the common prayer book in the rubrick before baptism . it is most false that all ages , all churches agree in infant-baptism . some churches never had it , some churches five hundred years ago of the most godly and learned that then were , did oppose it , and practice the baptism of believers only . if mr. fox , and others did account anabaptists hereticks , it was for other tenents than this . mr. baxter himself saith no sober divine did ever reckon the anabaptists as hereticks meerly for the errour of rebaptizing , plain scripture proof , &c. part 1. chap. 1. yet mr. cragg bespatters anti-paedobaptism thus , it robs the scripture of its truth , infants of their right , parents of their comforts , the church of its members , christ of his merits , god of his glory . sure he hath learned the art of him in the comaedian to calumniate boldly , imagining somewhat will be believed , though there be not a word true . but there is more of this venome behind ; that it is the mother of many other errours ; hence sprung the ranters , socinians , antitrinitarians , shakers , levellers , they that are above ordinances , antiscripturians . will any believe that from the tenet which doth so stifly maintain an ordinance should spring the errour of being above ordinances ? or that the errour of antiscripturians should spring from that tenet which doth so strictly insist on the scripture ? let mr. cragg shew any the least connexion between antipaedobaptism and the errours he names , and he saith something , else if only the persons , and not the tenet be guilty of these errours he doth but calumniate . he might with like reason say , the christian religion is the mother of many other errours ; hence sprung ebionites , cerinthians , nicolaitans , gnosticks , &c. such kind of criminations are most stinking and base slanders ; unworthy a sober minded man , much more a divine in a pulpit , speaking to many people who examine not but take all for true , which such rabbins talk with confidence . the like may i say of the judgements of god . those in germany were by war , the events that have happened in our daies should teach us to be sparing in our judging . mr. cottons speech was according to his prejudice . solomon eccles. 9. 1 , 2. christ luke 13. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5. teach us more sobriety than so easily to pronounce of gods judgements . if we should judge of men and tenents by outward judgements , job had been condemned justly . one man had his house burned that did not sprinkle his child , thousands have had their houses burned who did , and perhaps upon occasion of that abuse , by means of provision for the feast . may not we as well say . god thereby judged against infant-sprinkling ? thousands have prospered after their refusing to baptize infants , thousands have fain into calamities after they have baptized them . may not we this way as well decide for antipaedobaptists as against them ? divines that maintain the scriptures to be their rule should not thus judge of what is true or false by gods dealing with mens persons , which is often upon secret reason , not discemable by us , but by his word which is our rule , and wherein he hath revealed his mind . the rest of mr. craggs speech is as vain . doth this benefit come to parents , and children by infant baptism , that god is not ashamed to be called their god , and the god of their seed after them , heb. 11. 16. what a ridiculous conceit is this ? the text saith , that through the faith of the persons it is , that god is not ashamed to be called their god , not their god , and the god of their seed , much less a word of infant-baptism , as if such a benefit came by it . all the benefit he talks of that comes to infants is either a meer empty title , or else it comes to infants as well without baptism as with it . the devils dealing if it be , as mr. cragg saith , makes it appear the faith is good into which the pretended baptism is , but not that the baptism is right . enough of this frothy , unconcocted sermon , calculated for the ignorant and superstitious common people , and the profane loose gentry , who mind not godliness in earnest , and for the blind teachers of those parts , who know not the gospel , but mind their own profits more than the understanding of the truth . from whom the lord deliver the dark parts of this land , and provide teachers for the people after his own heart , that it be not as now it is in too many parts , the blind lead the blind , and both fall into the ditch . finis . presumption no proof, or, mr. petto's arguments for infant-baptism considered and answered and infants interest in the convenant of grace without baptism asserted and maintained : whereunto is prefixed an answer to two questions propounded by mr. firmin about infants church-membership and baptism / by thomas grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. 1687 approx. 118 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 24 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2008-09 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a41784 wing g1542 estc r27161 09677975 ocm 09677975 43974 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a41784) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 43974) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1332:7) presumption no proof, or, mr. petto's arguments for infant-baptism considered and answered and infants interest in the convenant of grace without baptism asserted and maintained : whereunto is prefixed an answer to two questions propounded by mr. firmin about infants church-membership and baptism / by thomas grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. [2], viii, 34 p. [s.n.], london : 1687. reproduction of original in the british library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng petto, samuel, 1624?-1711. -infant baptism of christ's appointment. infant baptism. 2007-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-11 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2008-01 elspeth healey sampled and proofread 2008-01 elspeth healey text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion presumption no proof : or , mr. petto's arguments for infant baptism , considered and answered . and infants interest in the covenant of grace without baptism , asserted and maintained . whereunto is prefixed an answer to two questions propounded by mr. firmin , about infants church-membership and baptism . by thomas grantham . the earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof , because they have transgressed the laws , changed the ordinance , broken the everlasting covenant . isa . 24. 5. now i praise you , brethren , that you remember me in all things , and keep the ordinances , as i delivered them to you 1 cor. 11. 2. london , printed in the year , 1687. to the reader . it appears by mr. pett's epistle to the reader , that he took hold of a very slight occasion to write against the baptized believers ; it was , because one ( without acquainting him with it ) came over to their communion . i could wish he had been more patient under so small a trial , and thereby saved me this labour : which whether it will end here i know not ; that may be as he pleases . i hold it no convenient time for dissenters to write one against another ; friendly conferences might do much better . but i have found men of mr. pett's principles very averse to that , when it has been offered . i have not answered each particular page in mr. pett's book , for that one and the same thing is very often repeated . i have chiefly dealt with his two main arguments , on which his whole discourse depends . what he says about the mode of sprinkling , i have not meddled with , nor is it needful . for we see that generally , such as are seriously convinced of their duty in the case of baptism , will not , if they might , receive it but in the way of immersion . they are presently apprehensive that no way can be so safe for them , as to follow christ himself , who it's certain was baptised so : for it is granted by the learned , that mark 1. 9. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , may be truly read , and was dipped of john into jordan . this account of our saviour's baptism is sufficient to decide this controversy , about the manner of baptism , if the highest and most perfect example that ever was be of any force at all . what i have offered on behalf of infants interest in the covenant of grace , may perhaps seem too full of charity in the judgment of mr. petto and some others . but if that offend thee , do but consider from whom this doctrine of infants damnation has proceeded , it 's either of god or man. i have searched the scriptures , but could never find his word ( that is truth it self ) declare such a dreadful sentence against any one infant , much less that the greatest part of dying infants are damn'd . could men be satisfied of the certainty of the salvation of their dying infants , the controversy about baptising them would come to an end ; for as far as i could ever learn , it came into the world upon this mistake , that they could not be sav'd without it . and tho mr. petto seems to dislike cyprian's judgment herein , yet what does he say less himself in p. 1. where he insinuates that those who deny the baptism of infants , exclude millions out of the great charter of heaven . but this may perhaps be found their fault , who exclude all but the infants of such as they count believers , when the reckoning comes to be truly stated . i never saw mr. firmin 's book till i had answered mr. petto . and at the request of some , as also for that his questions may seem to be serious and considerable , i thought it needful to give a serious and christian answer to them , which i hope i have done . and as i must commend christians in their enquiry , what evidence of god's love we have concerning infants , and therein be an enquirer as much as any , having children of my own ; so i think it needful to caution my self and others , that we set not up our own devices for such evidences , lest our hope be thereby lessened , seeing our imposing that upon infants which god has not required at our hands , is no sign of his love to them at all . tho. grantham . the preface . containing brief answers to two questions , propounded by mr. giles firmin , in his book called , the plea of the children of believing parents . because mr. firmin's questions bear date , four years before mr. petto's arguments , i will give them precedence in my answering them . their books are much of one quality , save that mr. firmin's abounds with more unhandsom reflections upon many , in which kind of dealing it were easy to give retaliation ; but that is not commendable . what he writes against mr. danvers , i leave to him to vindicate himself , as he has done against others , and that very well , either by justifying his authorities , or rectifying such over-fights , as might easily befal the most accurate writer in such a multitude of quotations ; and which i am persuaded would much satisfy mr. firmin himself , would he impartially read the controversies . mr. firmin being a wiser man than to engage closely in the question about the divine authority for infant-baptism , maintains his fight at a great distance , save that he plays a little with some arguments , rather of other mens devising than his own . he at last comprehends the whole strength of his discourse in two questions ; and only desires some answer to them , from those whom he is pleased constantly to call anabaptists . i know no such creature , yet i know that he means those christians who , according to god's word , heb. 6. 1 , 2. make baptism the third ( not the first ) principle of christ's doctrine . in which order the first and best of gospel-churches received it , even that which was founded by christ himself , in the exercise of his ministry , and which is therefore the mother of all churches christian ; in which church , consisting of believing jews , their children had as clear an interest in the covenant of grace as any can pretend to , and as great priviledges in the church christian as was , or is needful for any ; and yet whoever reads the plantation and progress of that church , or the epistle which was written to them on the occasion of some decays , which afterward befel them , shall never find so much as one infant baptised in that church , nor indeed in any other during the apostles days ; which consideration alone is enough to cause a modest enquirer to question the legality of infant-baptism . mr. firmin has got infant-baptism into a very little corner , it belongs only to children of believing parents [ in an independent or presbyterian sense ] so that a great part of the world called christendom , will have no right to it . and he makes it very insignificant to a great number of these two , for pag. 33. he does not make god to be indeed their god , till with his call he gives them faith to answer his call. and this is the reason ( i suppose ) why they deny these so pretendedly holy infants , whom they sprinkle , any priviledg in their church at the lord's table , till they covenant again , which is commonly 20 , 30 or 40 years after they have sprinkled them . for which strange practice they have not the least tittle in god's word to warrant it ; and where then they can find a rule for this practice i know not . i have been told that mr. firmin's questions are taken by some to be unanswerable : let us therefore view them in his words verbatim . the first is thus . mr. firmin's quest . i. since god was so gracious to make a covenant with abraham and his seed , and it did then consist with his wisdom to constitute his church of parents and children , while the parents did believe in the messiah to come ; why may it not consist with his grace to continue that covenant , and with his wisdom still to constitute his gospel-church of parents and children , the jews now believing in christ come ? answer . you must allow that the covenant of grace was not restrained to abraham and his seed , but did belong to many at that time both parents and children ; many holy patriarchs being then living , and some outlived abraham himself , and yet none of these were concerned in the covenant of circumcision , as made with abraham , gen. 17. but only in the covenant of grace as made with adam and noah , which had now continued more than 2000 years , during all which time no infant was concerned either in circumcision or baptism , and yet were as much of the church as was needful for their salvation . and hence a man may very well answer your question , by asking you another , thus : since god was so gracious to make a covenant with adam and noah and their seed , and it did then consist with his wisdom to constitute his church of parents to practise his ordinances , and of their children to partake of the grace of eternal life , without being concerned in the practice of ordinances in their infancy , for more than 2000 years before christ came : why may it not confist with his grace to continue that covenant of grace made with adam , noah ( and abraham himself 24 years before he was circumcised ) ? and with his wisdom still to constitute his gospel-church of parents to practise his ordinances , and of their children to partake of the grace of eternal life , without being concerned in the practice of his ordinances in their infancy , since christ is come ; especially considering that christ himself did not appoint those very infants who were brought to him , to have his ordinances imposed upon them ? if mr. firmin be not satisfied with this reply , then let me tell him it becomes no man , no not mr. firmin himself , to propound such an unlearned question , which is guilty of no more reason than this : since god was so gracious , and it did consist with his wisdom to give abraham a command to offer up his beloved son as a sign of christ to come , why may it not consist with his grace and wisdom , for us of our own heads without any command from god , to offer up every one his dearest child in remembrance that christ is come ? sir , what may , or may not consist with the wisdom of god in relation to his church-constitution , and our serving him in matters of religion , must not be concluded from the likeness which we fancy to be between his former institutions , and our own , or others inventions ; but from such directions as he has given us by the messiah , which was to teach us all things , john 4. both concerning our selves , and concerning our infants . and we do therefore know that it was not consistent with the wisdom of god to constitute his gospel-church , so as to impose gospel-ordinances upon infants ( although he did impose legal ordinances upon them ) because christ ( who is the wisdom of god ) hath revealed no such thing to his apostles , nor they to us . and like as ye know it to be inconsistent with the wisdom of god , to bring little children so into the church , as to partake of the lord's table , because god hath required faith and humiliation in every one that comes to that holy manducation : so we do know it to be inconsistent with the wisdom of god to bring infants so into his church , as to partake of holy baptism , because repentance , whereby sin is forsaken , and faith to believe god's promises , is required by him of those that he requires to be baptized . you see then that we do not deny infants to be of the church , in such sort as to obtain salvation , with them that shall be saved ; although we deny them to be in the church in your sence . but let us hear your second question . mr. firmin's quest . ii. if god hath repealed his covenant with the believing jews seed , turned their children out of the church , and deny them baptism , tho the jews truly believe in christ come ; what hath god left in the room of these , that carry any shew of his blessing , or good will towards their children during their infant-state ? answer . the words covenant and church , as used by mr. firmin , are ambiguous . i do not find that abraham , nor isaac neither , were out of the church till they were circumcised . it 's evident abraham's seed was in covenant before they were eight days old , even as it was a peculiar visible church-covenant , else all that were uncircumcised for forty years in the wilderness were out of the church and covenant . mr. firmin himself believes that infants are in the covenant , and in the church also , before they be sprinkled by him . for this is the minor of one of his arguments , p. 103. but children of believing parents are church members , and this before you sprinkle them . now , sir , if your doctrine be true ; then it is not our waiting for a fit time to baptize our children , which turns them out of the church , nor does god for our so doing turn them out of the church ; any whit more than your waiting a fit time , ( and you make it perhaps twenty , thirty , or forty years ) for your bringing your children to the lord's table , turns them out of the church . indeed if they live to years , and chuse sinful ways , they then turn themselves out of that relation they had to god and his people in their infancy , by virtue of god's gracious covenant ; and they thus turning his mercy into jndgment , shall perish whether yours or ours . the case is equal , i need say no more to a wise man. yet i add , that the believing jews , and their infants also , were now made free from the jewish church-state , gal. 5. 1. but neither they nor their infants were deprived of any place in the church , which was needful for them in their respective capacities ; yet the parents had many duties upon them which the infants had not , and of these the baptism of repentance was one ; they had also priviledges which the infants had not , of which the lord's table was one . yet the little children had these priviledges which the children of unbelievers had not . first to be devoted to god by the prayers of the church , warranted therein by the example of christ , who when little children were brought to him for prayer , did not refuse but perform it , and wills that little children be brought to him ; and accordingly we do dedicate our children to him from the womb , according to our capacity . 2. little children are also by this means ( i. e. of their parents conversion ) under the blessing of an early education in the christian religion ; by which means ( through god's blessing ) i have known some who were not sprinkled in infancy , attain to more true knowledg of christianity , and experience of the work of grace ( so far as man may judg ) at 7 or 8 years of age , than multitudes of those who were sprinkled in their infancy , have attained at the age of 70 or 80 years . 3. our gracious god by jesus christ hath left us an open declaration that the kingdom of heaven belongs to infants , in which declaration he has not excepted so much as one of them . this is more than circumcision , and more clear than any thing before declared concerning infants , tho there was evidence of god's love to them before . from all which you may see , that god hath left us in the room of circumcision , a far more excellent testimony of his saving pleasure concerning infants than that was , or any legal rite whatsoever . as for mr. baxter's argument which you borrow , 't is answered in what is said to your questions . howbeit , i have more particularly answered it in my examination of no less than five hundred queries , gathered by one of his admirers out of his voluminous works ; all which have been redargued by a proportionable number of anti-queries , in which all his devices for poedorantism , is in some measure discovered to be but the cunning craftiness of human subtilty , or a copious brain . of whose books on this subject , and dr. hammonds also , take thus the judgment of a learned doctor of the church of england now living : i have seen what my learned and worthy friend dr. hammond , mr. baxter , and others say in defence of [ infant baptism ] ; and must confess i do not a little wonder that men of so great parts should say so much to so little purpose ; for i have not yet seen any thing like an argument for it . dr. barlows letter to mr. tombs . thus much in answer to your questions . see more in the last part. one thing i take special notice of in your discourse of infants . you tie up the salvation of all infants that shall be saved , to their having faith some way ; yea , you say , else they must all perish . p. 90. and you allow faith to no more infants than are elected in your seme of election . the rest of infants , even of believing parents , are reprobate and damned , for all the noise which ye make of their covenant-interest , church-membership , holiness , &c. miserable infants ! if there be none to plead your cause better than mr. firmin has done , it 's uncertain whether so much as one of you shall be saved out of a thousand . and whilst his book may cause many weak readers to think that circumcision did , and that infant-baptism doth great things toward their saltion , it 's evident he can believe no such thing himself . for if they be elect , saved they shall be tho they be not baptised : and for those infants which are reprobated , damned they must be tho they be baptised . he is so far from making baptism of infants to be of that concernment which you may imagine from some passages in him , that he plainly tells you , p. 20. that he does not think that a sound believer dying without baptism shall be damned : and then how an innocent infant dying without baptism should be damned , is not easy to be imagined . but , by his favour , if such a believer had opportunity to be baptised , and neglected his baptism , he will hardly pass for a sound believer in the day of judgment ; because in this thing he believed not his lord , who told him , thus it becomes us to fulfil all righteousness , mat. 3. 15. deut. 1. 33. act. 3. 22 , 23. and i must in faithfulness tell mr. firmin , that such a sound believer i take him to be , for after all the improvement which he tells us he has made of his fathers covenant , ( which would make a well man sick even to see what pittiful work he makes with it , pag. 68 , 69 , 70 , 71. ) for after all his shifting from post to pillar , he only gets stomach to reject the counsel of god against himself , being not baptised with the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins , as some of the learned have done before him , luk. 7. 30. and seeing it is the known practice of infant-sprinklers to sprinkle them when they are fast asleep , and it is odds but mr. firmin was asleep when he was sprinkled and crossed , and therein these wonderful things done , which he talks of , without scripture or reason to warrant his conceits . i desire to know of him what ground any man hath , his parents or himself , to baptise any person when they are asleep ? this is no idle enquiry , but calls for the consideration of all serious christians . in these and the following pages you will find this to be mr. firmin's sense : that the covenant as it concerns infants , hath two parts , the inward , and the outward : that some infants have the outward part who are not concern'd in the inward part , and that the first sort of infants cannot fall , but the rest may and shall fall , because they have not seminal faith and regeneration , but only reputative faith. and yet sure this was not the infants fault , for it could not chuse of what seed it should be produced . and what the seminal faith is , i suppose mr. firmin may know as much as those infants do whom he supposes to have it . dr. hammond was a great man for infant-sprinkling , yet he rejects this fable of mr. firmin's : for he tells us , he must confess that faith is so necessarily founded in understanding , that he which hath not vnderstanding , cannot have faith. and dr. taylor confesses , whether infants have faith , is a question to be disputed by those who care not how much they affirm , and how little th●y prove . this damning all in●●●●● which have not faith , i take to be a very damnable doctrine , because it represents god to be so cruel , as to make millions 〈◊〉 infants on purpose to send them to hell , who could by no means help 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 want of faith. what man would kill his new-born child , because it does not call him father as soon as it is born ? and shall mortal man be more just than god , shall man be more righteous than his maker ? i am ashamed of the doctrine of our presbyterians and independents , which , as i am informed , teach that infants are yelling in hell , yea that infants of a span long are yelling in hell. i am also ashamed of mr. firmin's conceit , pag. 90. where from dr. ames he would have us believe , that an infant is as capable of a passive reception of christ and grace , as a man. now if this be true , that men are no more capable to suffer the grace of god to act upon their souls than infants , i am persuaded they would fare better than they are like to do . for it is certain if infants receive any thing of christ or grace , it is meerly by miracle , as in the case of john the baptist , when he was in the womb : and hence it must needs follow , that unless god will work a miracle upon every one at the beginning of his conversion , he is excusable ; according to this fancy of dr. ames and mr. firmin . is not this an adulterous generation , who without a miracle will not admit that any man can receive christ more than an infant , who it's certain cannot receive him without a miracle ? but let such vain disputers know , that the record which god hath given of his son , concerning his death and resurrection , will be sufficient to leave them without excuse if they believe it not , and that it is their duty ( not the duty of infants ) to receive christ as made known to them in his doctrine , which if they believe not , it shall judg them ( not infants ) in the last day . some indeed do abuse ephes . 1. 19 , 20. to uphold this false opinion , that none can believe without such a power as by which christ was raised from the dead . whereas it is evident , the apostle only shews that the faith of christians agrees with , or is according to the power of god , which he wrought in christ when he raised him up from the dead , i. e. they doubt not at all , but that the same god which had power to raise up christ from the dead , has power to do whatsoever he pleases , and so to raise us up also by his power , 1 cor. 6. 14. 2 cor. 4. 14. for the power by which christ was raised from the dead , being irresistable , all the power of men and devils cannot resist it . all that have true faith , do believe that no power shall be able to withstand god in the resurrection , but that his people shall be raised from death to life , and set with christ in glory , maugre the devil and all his power . but the power of god's grace by which god works in men in an ordinary way , is not irresistable ; ye do always resist the holy ghost , act. 7. 51. and 13. 46. christ marvelled at the unbelief of the jews , mar. 6. 6. because they had a sufficiency of means by which to believe , otherwise he could not have marvelled at their unbelief . but what needs many words ? unbelief shall be the condemning sin , john 3. 18 , 19. mark 16. 16. it follows therefore against all contradiction , that men perish not for want of an object of faith , but because they reject that object , and neglect that great salvation which god offers them , heb. 2. 1 , 2 , 3. otherwise it will follow that all which shall be damned , were created to be damned without any remedy . and how unlike this is to that god whose tender mercies are over all his works , and to that christ who wept for the destruction of his enemies , luk. 19. 41 , 42. let all men of reason judg , as they would judg in any case where justice and mercy must both stand inviolate . this strange doctrine of damning the greatest part of the world , and that before the world was , is so pernicious , that it makes god author of all sin for which damnation is due . for if he have destin'd the greatest part of the world , infants and grown persons , to a damned state , without any intention of their salvation , or means to prevent their destruction , because it was his pleasure to damn them . he that was thus author of their end , must also be author of that which conduces to the end : but far be this from god. and let it be far from us to think thus hardly of god , that he should be so unmerciful , as to send poor infants to hell-torments , who only had time in this world to cry and die , and sometimes too to die before they could cry . presumption no proof ; or , mr. petto 's arguments for infant-discipleship and baptism , considered and answered . part . 1. mr. petto entitles his book , infant-baptism of christ's appointment , and lays down this position , that it is the will of christ that some infants should be baptised : but why some , and not some ? are infants so diversified in the will of christ , as that he has excepted some of them ? it had been fit that the scripture which excludes some infants from baptism , and admits othersome had been produced . but alas , this is only man's invention , and none of christ's distinction : they are equally precious in his sight , yet he requires none of them to be baptised . two things you premise before you set down your arguments . 1. you complain that some call for plain scripture for infant-baptism , and speak slightly of scripture consequences . but this is your mistake : if they be scripture consequences rightly deduced ( as you seem to allow they must be such ) then you have no adversary . but perhaps you are displeased that your consequences are not taken for such as our saviour's was , for you quote mat. 22. 31 , 32. but his deductions are unquestionable , yours are not , and why may not our consequences be equally valuable with yours ? 2. you are pleased to tell us , there is no express scripture against infant-baptism , therefore infants may be baptised . and this argument is sufficiently answered , by saying , there is no express scripture for infant-baptism , therefore infant-baptism may be omitted . if you fly to consequences for it , 't is odds but we shall find as good consequences against it . but i will deny the consequence of your argument , and answer it by an author of your own , who writes thus : all things in god's worship must have a warrant out of god's word ; must be commanded . it 's not ●●●…ugh that it 's not forbidden , or what hurt is there in it ? but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 commanded , when any creature is raised in a religious way abov● 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 it hath by nature , if i have not scripture to warrant me , i am 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sup●●stitious . — we must be willing worshippers , we must not be will-worshippers . — you see how severe god was to nadab and abihu , but for taking other fire than that which god appointed , tho there was no direct command against it . — in matters of worship god stands upon little things . — for there is nothing wherein the prerogative of god does more appear than in worship . thus he . to which we add tertullian's rule : if it be said , it is lawful , because the scripture doth not forbid it : it may equally be retorted , it is therefore not lawful , because the scripture doth not command it . and truly by your argument ( as of all that 's brought it is the best ) you will never be able to withstand any innovation , which is not expresly forbidden in scripture . and then why do you disgust the common-prayer , with the rites and ceremonies there required , which are not expresly forbidden , more than your sprinkling infants ? nay , the church of rome will by this argument stand on equal terms with you , for many of her ceremonies which you disallow ; for admit one error , and a thousand will follow . thus , by your argument , men may run they know not whither , and return they know not when . i now come to your two main arguments , for this you seem not much to rest upon ; but you use it ad hominem . mr. petto's first argument for infant-discipleship . some infants are so discipled , as to have the name of the father , son , and holy spirit upon them . therefore by the will of christ they are to be baptised . answer . this argument supposes that some infants have the name of father , son , and spirit upon them before they be baptised . this i take to be the newest piece of doctrine in the world , and therefore must needs enquire what infants these are ? how mr. petto knows them from others ? and at what time before their baptism , and also by whom this name is put upon them , and in what manner it is done ? for all these things he ought to know , before ( according to his own logick ) he may baptise them . till he do this ( and he must do it well too ) i deny his antecedent : saying also , that no infants are discipled at all , much less so as to have the name of the father , son , and holy spirit upon them . my reasons are such as these . 1. god hath not made this distinction in gospel-times between some infants and other some , so as to disciple some of them , by putting the name of father , son , and holy spirit upon them . he has taken down the wall of distinction between jew and gentile , accounting the one as clean as the other , act. 10. 28. and has given the same order for discipling to all nations , matth. 28. 19. but not a word in that order to put his name , of father , son , and holy spirit upon any person before they be baptised . 2. no man has authority by the word of god to make infants disciples at all , much less by putting the name of father , son , and holy spirit upon them before baptism . but the only way assign'd by god to make disciples , is , first , by preaching the gospel to them , mark 16. 15. preach the gospel to every creature , which shews the true intent of our saviour in the verb , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to which you refer us : and our criticks do allow that it signifies an actual teaching both in the hebrew and greek . but the best interpreter of that verb , is the practice of our saviour and his apostles , who made disciples by actual teaching , john 4. 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , plainly evincing the truth of this . 3. if it could be proved that the name of the trinity were upon the infants of christians ; yet this would not bear your conclusion , that they must be baptised , any more than it will bear augustin's conclusion , that they ought to partake of the lord's table . dr. jer. taylor , and dr. barlow confess you may do both as well as either , and that the wit of man cannot shew a difference in the sanctions . and indeed all your arguments for infants church-membership and baptism ( if they were good ) might be improved against you concerning the other ordinance ; for admit one error , and another will follow . but let us examine your scriptures by which you would prove your antecedent . 1. you bring matth. 28. 19. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , disciple ye all nations . now if these words did oblige the apostles to put the name of father , son , and holy spirit upon all persons or nations before baptism , it quite spoils your argument , which would restrain it to some infants only . why do you thus abuse the word ? did the apostles put the name of the father , son , and holy spirit upon any one infant ? is not the scripture silent as to this ? or did they put the name &c. upon any to whom they preached , till they received their doctrine ? or did they do this before they baptised them ? in that solemn institution they did put the name of the father , son , and holy spirit upon all such as gladly received the word , act. 2. 40. act. 10. ult . and for this they had full authority , matth. 28. 19. mark 16. 15 , 16. even to preach to , and so to disciple all nations , baptising them , viz. mathet as subintelligitur in verbum mathetusate , as the practice of christ had directed them . john 4. 1. jesus made and baptised more disciples than john. and junius and tremelius adds the particle et : ite ergo , docete omnes populos , & baptisate eos , &c. 2. you tell us , they are disciples , not only who actually learn , but who are in the school of christ his church in order to their future learning . this is not true : 1. infants are not in the school or church of christ , as it is a school to learn any thing whilst they are infants . god has neither bound his ministers to teach them whilst such , nor enabled them to learn as such . if you say this future teaching respects not the time of their infancy ; then were you very fallacious in your argument : for this will prove all the infants in the world to be disciples , as well as any of them , seeing christ's church is the light of the world , and all that come to years of discretion , having opportunity , are bound to learn of her . 2. but yet it does not follow that all who are under present means of instruction , are therefore to be accounted disciples . for you know many heard christ preach , who yet were none of his disciples , but his persecutors ; many heard his apostles teach , who yet were not their disciples , for they put the word of god from them , and judged themselves unworthy of eternal life . i suppose also that all that hear mr. petto are not his disciples , how much less poor infants that never heard him at all . and here i require mr. p. to name one infant that he ever made a disciple according to matth. 28. and that will do more a great deal than his empty dictates . 3. you bring act. 8. 3. and 9. 1. which shews how saul made havock of the churches , entring into every house , haling men and women to prison , and that he breathed out slaughter against the disciples . sure you may blush to bring such texts to prove infants disciples ; nor will act. 15. 10. bear your inference . the false apostles would indeed have had the disciples among the gentiles to have been circumcis'd : but it does not follow at all , that every one were disciples whom they would have circumcised . this is just such a consequence as this ; you would have infants to be sprinkled : ergo , all are infants whom ye would have sprinkled . this consequence you will deny , because you would have others also sprinkled who are no infants . and for the same reason i deny your consequence , for the false apostles would have circumcis'd some who were no disciples , to wit , infants . you bring here gen. 17. ( but this we will consider anon ) and acts 21. 4 , 5. this place informs us , that the disciples told paul by the spirit that he should not go up to jerusalem . is it possible that * infants who are not mentioned here , should be of the number of these disciples . it is true , 't is said that the wives and children went with paul to the sea-shore , and kneeled down and prayed . but are all children infants ? or , if there were any infants , did they kneel down upon the sea-shore and pray with paul ? and if not , to what purpose has he brought these scriptures ? 4. he brings a cloud of other scriptures in figures , for had he read them his folly would have been seen with more ease . let us hear what these scriptures say ; 1 pet. 1. 15. as he which hath called you is holy , so be ye holy in all manner of conversation . heb. 7. 26. for such an high priest became us who is holy : what must these places prove ? i will set down your own words : as to the name of the trinity that of being holy is attributed often to father , son and holy spirit . and this very name of the lord [ holy ] he hath imposed upon the children of believers . but what a wretched consequence is here ? as if it would follow that all for whom christ offered up himself , or for whom he was god's high-priest , has thereupon the name of father , son , and holy spirit on them ? why according to this logick saul had the name of father , son , and holy spirit upon him , when he persecuted all that called on that name . and the scripture is very plain , that whilst we were enemies , christ died for us : but we had not then the name of father , son , and holy spirit imposed on us . and how follows it , that because christians are exhorted to be holy in all manner of conversation , that therefore infants are discipled , so as to have the name of father , son , and holy spirit upon them . might not a man by this kind of reasoning prove that all the infants in the world have the name of the father , son , and holy spirit upon them : i am sure that god is the god of the spirits of all flesh , and that all nations are in respect of his gracious providence , his people , and sheep of his pasture , and exhorted to enter into his ways with praise and thanksgiving , psal . 100. the places you bring from the epistle to the ephesians , cap. 1. 13. and 4. 30. informs us that after men believed , they were sealed with the holy spirit ; this shews these persons were no infants . rom. 11. 16. shews that an holy root has holy branches ; 1 pet. 2. 9. tells us christians are a chosen generation , a royal priest-hood , a holy nation , a peculiar people , that you should shew forth the praises of him that hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light. as for rom. 11. 16. it evidently refers to the great things which god will do when he calls the jews , which were cast off , and so it little concerns our question ; otherwise it were easy to shew that at that time , how holy soever abraham had been , yet his children were prophane enough . but mr. petto's drift is to make men believe that each of them ( whom he calls believers ) are as holy a root in respect of conferring church-priviledges , as abraham was , and so their children must needs be holy for baptism . but this is a very unlawful consequence ; seeing abraham never did , nor ever can confer that holiness upon so much as one of his offspring , which shall entitle them to baptism ; because every particular person 's repentance and faith is required as the true antecedents to baptism , as is granted by the church of england in her catechism . but how well she keeps to her doctrine therein , admits of consideration . upon 1 cor. 7. 14. you teach , that infants are holy by separation to god and his service . but , sir , can you tell us what service of god infants are fit for ? if other men may judg as well as you , then as they are not able to serve god in spiritual things , so god requires it not of them whilst infants . but so strangely are you transported here , that you tell us from mr. cotton , that sin it self is sanctified to believers . this is another strain of new doctrine ; and will it not follow from your doctrine that sin hath the name of father , son , and holy spirit upon it ? let mr. cotton look to it : you must have a care how you take up such notions . you will by no means admit the holiness here mentioned to be meant of a matrimonial or legitimate holiness . and yet i pray what sanctification of the unbeliever can that be but matrimonial , so as the believing husband and the unbelieving wife might cohabit together as husband and wife without sin ? the childrens holiness is derived from this sanctification of the unbeliever , ( as the word else , being rightly referred , does shew it doth . ) this holiness therefore in true construction of the place is most fitly interpreted ( as erasmus doth expound it ) of legitimacy , and so did the eminent man augustine of hippo ( long before erasmus ) take the sence ; for he tells us , whatsoever that holiness is , it is certain it is not of power to make christians , or remit sins . 5. the figures which you give us out of the old testament , are lev. 19. 2. and 20. 7. exod. 16. 6. deut. 7. 6. and 14. 2. and 26. 19. and 28. 9. all which do shew , that god was the lord ; that israel should know that he is the lord ; that he is a holy god ; and that they should be a holy people . but what is all this to your purpose ? god spake not these things to infants ; he tells us so himself : deut. 11. 2. and know you this day : for i speak not with your children , which have not known , and which have not seen the chastisement of the lord your god , his greatness , his mighty hand , and stretch'd out arm , &c. ver . 7. but your eyes have seen , &c. — therefore ye shall keep all the commandments , &c. sure you have not proved your argument by any thing you have yet brought for that purpose . for , by all that you have said , it appears not , that some infants are so discipled , as to have the name of the father , son , and holy spirit upon them . nor are you able to name so much as one such infant now in being , and consequently you can with no shew of reason baptise them . i consider again : who must do this previous work to infant-baptism ? must the same minister do both ? and what order have you to put the name of father , son , and holy ghost upon infants twice , once before you sprinkle them , and then again when you sprinkle them ? there is one thing remarkable from your self and others in these later times , who espouse this controversy . you all seem to be convinced that none are to be baptised but disciples , according to matth. 28. 19. and indeed the text is so very clear to that purpose , that it cannot be denied . but when i behold the miserable shifts you are put to , to prove infants disciples according to christ's commission , matth. 28. 19. i do with the greatest admiration bewail your unhappiness ; and cannot tell how to imagine that any wise men among you does really believe your selves in what you say on that account . and sure i am the papists have as strong a pretence from hoc est corpus meum , for their transubstantiation , as you have from matheteusaté for infant-discipleship . and to speak freely , they are both incredible things ; all sense and experience militates equally against both opinions . if they be truths , it must be because they are both miracles : but then they want the character of true miracles ; for they are no ways demonstrable that there is any miracle at all in either of them ; we are only told that they are so , i. e. that the bread in the eucharist is real flesh ; that the child in your rantism is born again of water and spirit , made a disciple of christ , &c. but no mortal man knows any of these things to be true . and what is it that we may not believe , if we must believe such things as these ? prayer for the dead , purgatory fire , &c. will come upon us armed with our own arguments , if we admit the former . and to conclude , as to your first argument , give me leave to say , if your hearers can receive your dictates , and ill-prov'd affirmations , i know not but they may believe you in whatsoever you will be pleased to tell them . what you say of the antiquity of infant-baptism , i shall here consider in few words ; for since you insist only upon cyprian's testimony , whose grounds for infant-baptism you confess to be unsound ; i need say little here , that which was built upon bad principles then by him , and stands upon as unsound ones now by you , does gain nothing by either of you . but will you know that it is plainly granted by some of the most learned of your way ; that there is neither precept nor practice in scripture for infant-baptism [ here it wants the best antiquity ] , nor any just evidence for it for about two hundred years after christ. — yet it came in upon a gross mistake of the scripture : that in what mr. baxter and dr. hammond has said for it , there is nothing that looks like an argument . dr. barlow . this is enough at present . part . ii. wherein is considered mr. petto's second argument , which he delivers in these words ; if some infants be visibly or externally in the covenant which god made with abraham , then by the will of christ they are to be baptized . but some infants are visibly or externally in the covenant which god made with abraham : therefore by the will of christ they are to be baptized . before i answer this argument , i shall consider a few things : and , 1. that ( as mr. petto grants ) god made the covenant of grace with abraham , twenty four years before he gave him the covenant of circumcision , see gen. 12. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4. with 17. 24. so that the covenant of grace had no external sign , as it was made with abraham , gen. 12. but when god was pleased to add to this covenant the promise of the land of canaan , &c. then it was that he gave him the law of circumcision : and these additional parts i take to be most properly , if not only that which is the covenant of circumcision . 2. it is to be understood that abraham was not the only person in the world , which was under the covenant of grace at this time , when god made covenant with abraham , gen. 17. 't is observed by some that salah lived after the covenant of circumcision was made about 50 years . arphaxad lived thirteen years after ; and that heber lived till jacob was about twenty years old , which was long after abraham died . now these with melchisedeck ( if he were not one of these ) with many others ( amongst whom was just lot ) were not only true worshippers of god , according to the covenant of grace , but some of them superiour to abraham himself , for melchisedeck blessed abraham , being the king of salem , and priest of the most high god. 3. and as neither these nor their posterity were liable to any loss of the covenant of grace , by their not being circumcised after the manner of abraham ; so neither job , nor other worthy men that were not of the seed of abraham according to the flesh , had any obligation to circumcision : from whence it must needs follow that god intended not the sign of circumcision to belong to persons as they were in the covenant of grace , but that it was appropriate for some great ends , respecting a special preservation to the family of abraham , as of the kindred from whom christ should proceed , and with whom he would presence himself , in a land of promise , by a distinct way of worship from all nations , who at that time were falling very fast into idolatry . 4. and besides this , it is certain that this sign of circumcision , was by god's appointment to be affixed to some to whom the covenant of grace might seem to have the least extent ( or at least they did forfeit all interest in it ) this was the case of ishmael and esau , who proved very wicked : and it is to be questioned whether the bondmen or slaves in israel had that ceremony as a badge of the covenant of grace . men may talk high of these things and prove little , or whether circumcision was a seal of the righteousness of faith to any person in the world save to abraham : and in what sence it was so to him ( who had so many things peculiar to him ) is not easy to be demonstrated . 5. our practice in religious institutes is not to be gathered from such uncertain conjectures , but to stand upon the clear direction of the instituter , or the practice of such as god hath thought fit to make precedents to us ; and it is certain we are not at all concerned in the law of circumcision , and for us to take our rules thence for the subjects of baptism , is very childish and reflects dishonour upon christ and his apostles , who never sent us to learn infant-baptism from infant-circumcision , nor indeed have they taught it at all . these things premised i answer to the argument by these ensuing distinctions . 1. if by covenant mr. p. means the covenant of circumcision ( as he does , for he quotes gen. 7. 9 , 10 , 11. to prove his assumption ) , and by some infants he means the infants of christians as such , as that is his meaning ; then i deny his minor. 2. or , if by covenant , he mean that covenant of grace , gen. 12. distinct from the covenant of circumcision ; and by some infants being in this covenant externally , he means infants are concerned in the outward profession or practice of worship ; still i deny the minor : for god by that covenant of grace , gen. 12. never required the performance of such duties of infants . 3. if by covenant , he mean the gracious pardon of original sin to some infants only , or the salvation of their souls dying such ; and by some infants he means that some few of them only are visibly in that estate , and all the rest in a visible state of damnation to hell torments ; still i deny his minor. for god has not said ( and therefore man ought not to say it ) that so much as one poor infant shall be damned ; but he is so far from that , that he has no pleasure in the death of the wicked , but rather that they turn and live ; and hath assured us that the son should not bear the iniquity of the father , which can only be true in respect of damnation , for all infants do bear the sin of their father adam , and sometimes in temporal punishments they bear the sin of their immediate parents . 4. if his arguments were so good natured , as to allow infants indefinitely to be in a visible state of salvation , ( viz. a declared right to the kingdom of heaven , as their dear saviour hath testified they have ) yet i would deny the consequence of his major , because the covenant of grace , considered as abstracted from the covenant of circumcision , never required the application of any ceremony to infants as a pledg of it , either before the law , or as it is now established by our saviour in the gospel oeconomy ; so that his conclusion is far from truth , which tells the world that by the will of christ some infants are to be baptized . now let us examine his proof . 1. he begins pag. 7. with gen. 17. which speaks not one word of baptism ; and himself tells us in the next page , that the covenant in gospel-times cannot be kept by circumcision ; for that , saith he , is abrogated , and ceased to be the token of it ; so that gen. 17. can be no proof for his minor. but he quotes act. 2. 38 , 39. and heb. 10. 16 , 17. and this ( he says ) is a full command to baptise all in covenant now . but for answer , consider that no more are commanded in this place to be baptised , than are first commanded to repent ; nor no more were baptised , than gladly received the word . and the promise is expresly of the pouring out of the holy ghost upon all parents and children , as god shall call them : but no command nor promise respecting baptism , and the gift of the holy ghost , before the lord shall call them , whether parents or children . again , these words , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to you and to your children , is not applicable to children in infancy , but to a succession or posterity qualified for the things required and promised . that text he brings out of heb. 10. tells us , that god will write his laws in the minds , and put them in the inner part of his people under the new covenant , and that he will remember their iniquities no more . this is not meant of infants , who as they have no iniquities for god to remember , but only original sin for him to pardon , as to the condemning nature of it , so he never did remember their iniquities . nor need they any laws to be written in their hearts during infancy , for they can understand none , and god speaks not with them about the observation of his laws , as he tells us deut. 11. 2. the second commandment is brought to prove infant-baptism , but mr. p. should know it does not command any particular form of worship at all . only this is true what god has elsewhere instituted , and never repealed , the second commandment may serve to enforce the performance of such things . but here he beggs the principle which he cannot prove , no not by gen. 17. let us hear the most learned of his way ( i mean in point of infant-sprinkling ) speak their judgments , and these be their words . * that promise gen. 17. 7. concerns literally peculiar protection , and worldly felicity , not the remission of sins and everlasting life . and another tells us , to argue from circumcision to infant-baptism is a cunning argument , by which it will follow that females are not to be baptized . mr. p. tells us there is no warrant to delay the application of baptism ; and i grant it . but then he should consider that where there is no authority nor capacity to dispense baptism , there is no delay . and this is the case of infants : nor does their being under the merciful covenant of salvation by christ , oblige them to duty in infancy , because they can perform none . and therefore your arguing from foederati to their being signati , is better rhyme than reason ; for if you follow that consequence , it will unavoidably bring infants to the lord's table , where you will not be pleased with them . and pray consider what multitudes were foederati before , and in , and after abraham's time , who yet in your own judgment were not signati ; such were the patriarchs before-mentioned , and those under their conduct ; such were the thousands of males who died before the eighth day in israel . such were all the females , who alone were one half of abraham's seed ; all these were foederati , yet were none of them signati . what you are pleased here to add of some that can , and some that cannot fall away . as it 's impertinent , so i think it far better for men to cease such idle disputes , and to exhort one another daily to take heed that they do not fall away . for my part i am far from thinking that any man can stand by his own strength , or do any thing in religion as he ought without the help of god : i likewise grant that god does much more for some , than he does for all men. yet all this gives us no occasion or authority to tell any person in the world , that it is impossible for him to fall , so as to perish . and if we may not tell another man this confident story , it 's bad venturing to tell our selves that we cannot fall so . i think it 's only proper to say of god , he cannot lie , and then it follows , all men may lie ; and this lie may be their ruin for ought they know ; rev. 21. 27. i will not dispute whether there be a state attainable in this world , in which men shall certainly be saved , i doubt it not : but when men have got to that degree , is so hard to be demonstrated , that i take him for no wise man , that will affirm it of himself , or any other in particular . it remains therefore the best way in the world to do as paul did , 1 cor. 9. 27. beat down the body , and bring it into subjection , lest while we preach to others , we become cast-aways . and if any confident gentleman shall here tell me the word only intends reprovable , i 'le make bold to tell him , he does neither understand the greek , nor his own heart much better than i do , and that is not very perfectly , i will assure him . i have done with mr. petto's two main arguments , we will now consider his auxiliaries . mr. petto 's third argument , pag. 39. some infants are visibly christ's , and so are abraham 's seed ; and hence he would infer their baptism . he has many words , and very often repeated , the substance of all has i think already been answered ; however seeing he talks here of a threefold seed of abraham , under the titles of natural , spiritual , and ecclesiastical seed , i will seriously consider the scriptures which he brings to prove infants to be the ecclesiastical seed of abraham . for the scriptures which he brings to describe the spiritual seed of abraham , speaks not one word of infants . gal. 3. 8 , 9. shews that god would justify the heathen through faith , and concludes thus ; so then they which be of faith , are blessed with faithful abraham . this is not spoken of infants , yet they shall be blessed . the texts he brings to prove infants to be the ecclesiastical seed of abraham , are many ▪ first , matth. 25. 1 , 2. where the kingdom of heaven is compared to wise and foolish virgins : but i suppose no wise man takes infants to be of either sort , for they are neither wise nor foolish , but they are innocent . two texts more we have , rom. 11. 20. john 15. 6. where we learn that the jews were broken off for vnbelief , and the gentiles stood by faith ; that some branches in christ not bearing fruit are taken away , and those which bear fruit are purged to bring forth more fruit : but what all this is to infants no man can tell . he quotes these over again , and with them matth. 19. 14. mark 10. 13 , 14. luke 18. 15. matth. 16. 18. rom. 16. 16. 1 cor. 12. 27. rev. 1. 12 , 13 , 20. now he that from these texts would prove infants to be abraham's ecclesiastical seed , must prove that in the three first texts , the word kingdom must needs signify the church-militant , and that christ admitted these infants into the church by baptism , or else that they have authority to do more than christ himself did : for if these very infants were not baptised , they must have very great confidence that can pretend from hence to find ground to baptise others . the next christ tells peter , that he would build his church upon a rock . but must all that are saved be abraham's ecclesiastical seed ? sure some infants may be saved who were never baptised for all this . rom. 16. 16. bids christians salute one another with an holy kiss , and tells them also that the church of christ salutes them . i see nothing from hence to prove infants visibly christ's , so as to be abraham 's seed ; sure his proposition will fail of proof . the apostle , 1 cor. 12. 27. tells the corinthians that they were the body of christ , and members in particular . but not one word to prove that there was one infant of this communion . yet all members of that one body were partakers of that one bread , in which their unity was demonstrated , rev. 1. 12 , 13 , 14. only describes the vision that john saw of the son of god , and the seven golden candlesticks . but no man can yet find in any of these candlesticks so much as one infant concern'd bearing up the light of truth in the profession of the gospel . now for his argument , i would know the meaning of this speech , some infants are visibly christ's . if he means some infants only are christ's by redemption ; how can he possibly know the redeemed from the damned ? ( for so they are supposed to be in this mans destiny . ) the work of redemption is visible , because god's word tells us who christ died for , and that is for every man , heb. 2. 9. and here infants are equally christ's visibly . but so long as mr. petto thinks that christ died but for some infants only , ( and those very few in comparison of the whole , he cannot name one for whom christ died , it being impossible ) for them to give any demonstration by which he may know such a thing , and therefore he can have but small comfort in baptizing any of them , if indeed it were lawful to baptize some infants , as he supposes . nay , were he as sure that christ died for some particular infants , as i am that he died for them all , yet would it not follow that they are abraham's ecclesiastical seed , so as to be baptized : for christ knew that the infants whom he took in his arms were his , and yet he did no such thing to them ; and i shall never think mr. p. wiser than our saviour , nor so kind to poor infants as he was . mr. petto argues thus : some infants are visibly of the faith , and so are abraham's seed . here i deny the antecedent . i say no infants are visibly of the faith. and mr. p. tells me in this very place , that he does not say that faith semenal , and habitual , or actual , is in all infants baptized ; for then ( saith he ) all of them must be saved , which they are not ; or else they might lose that special faith : but they are invisibly invested in the covenant or promise , which is the word of faith , and may bear that name , &c. i answer : here are two kinds of faith which the scripture knows nothing of , i. e. seminal , and habitual . however i perceive he knows not one infant that has any of these kinds of faith , he therefore has found out a fourth , and that is a reputative faith , or a thing which he says may bear that name . sure these are meer dreams and fancies , and so let them go . actual faith infants have none ; and this is all the faith that man can make judgment of by god's word . he does indeed grant all infants which are baptized have not this faith ; and if he dare affirm it ●f any of them , all the experience of the world will confute him , and so he has lost his argument , as a meer story without truth , and against all experience . for seeing faith comes by hearing , and hearing by the word of god ; he cannot without a miracle shew any infant to be visibly in the faith ; for the poor babe knows not its right hand from its left . he might as well say some infants are visibly in repentance , and i marvel why the poedobaptists do not insist upon that , as well as faith , to entitle their children to baptism . mr. petto tells us , if infants have not faith for the present , yet visibly they are under a promise of it , which promise baptism may be a sign and seal of ; it may seal a doctrine of faith , even where a principle of it is yet wanting . these and what follows , are meer dictates and presumptions , without proof . yet he brings deut. 30. 6. where god promises to circumcise the hearts of the israelites , and the heart of their seed , to love the lord with all the heart , and with all the soul . but god spake not this to infants , nor as a thing to be done to them in their infancy ; for when they should thus be circumcis'd , they should be able to know the lord very well , for they should love him then with all the heart and soul. now this promise is made to all men upon future contingencies , for god commandeth all men every where to repent , and wills that the gospel ( which contains this and many other precious promises ) should be preached to every creature ; and if baptism may be a seal of this doctrine , even there where there wants a principle of faith , as you tell us it may ; then we may go and baptise every creature , and not higgle as you do about some infants only : but should we do thus , god's word would trip up our heels , as it does yours , for tho he has proclaim'd peace to the world by the gospel , yet he makes faith necessary to the pledg of its reception ; he that believeth , and is baptised , shall be saved ; if thou believest with all thine heart thou mayst be baptised : when they believed , they were baptised , not one person admitted without ; and then what is mr. petto that will adventure to give baptism , even there where there is not faith , no nor so much as a principle of it ? how shall baptism be the answer of a good conscience without a principle of faith ? and what good will it do you without faith ? he quotes isa . 44. 3. i will pour water upon him that is thirsty , i will pour my spirit upon thy seed , &c. well , but not in infancy ; when was this done to any of your infants ? or , has not god made good this promise in the gospel ? men must be thirsty before this water be poured out upon them . you bring isa . 59. 21. which might have shewed you that these promises belong not to infants ; seeing they cannot understand either the word or spirit , which yet is here promised to be in the mouth of the church , and her seed for ever ; or , if you please , in the mouth of christ , and his seeds seed for ever . but infants are so called , saith augustin , à non fando , because they cannot speak . you bring psal . 25. 13. and 112. 2. where 't is said , the seed of good men shall inherit the earth , and be mighty upon earth , and be blessed . but i think these are unfitly applied to infants in infancy ; and yet if they concern'd them , here 's no proof that they are visibly in the faith during infancy . but what shall become of the infants of ill men by mr. petto's doctrine ? they are put by him in a condition contrary to that of the infants of good men , as if the infants blessing or cursing must be measured out , as the parents are believers , or otherwise . let us see his scriptures ; psal . 37. 28. — the seed of the wicked shall be cut off : but why must this be applied to infants ? sure he has mercy for them , so as not to turn them into hell. for he hath told us , if those children of wicked men which live to years do but turn from the wicked ways of their fathers , they shall not dy ; and so equal are god's ways , that if the son of a righteous man follow the ways of wicked men , he shall die : as to temporal judgments , i grant the infants do sometimes suffer for the sin of their parents , but our discourse is about their salvation . you bring rom. 11. again , and thence you infer that the infant-seed of the jews was broken off for the parents unbelief . but if this breaking-off be understood of an exclusion of infants to hells torments , it is a most false opinion , as i shall fully shew anon . that abraham by virtue of his faith which he had being uncircumcised , is a father of the faithful , both jew and gentile , is very true . but that any of them are his children , so as to be members of the church militant , to do and suffer for christ , without actual faith , is not true , nor does rom. 4. 10 , 11 , 12. prove the contrary ; let us hear your text : how then was it reckoned ? when he was in circumcision , or in vncircumcision ? not in circumcision , but in vncircumcision . and he re-received the sign of circumcision , a seal of the righteousness of faith , which he had being yet uncircumcised , that he might be the father of them that believe , though they be not circumcised , that righteousness might be imputed to them also . and the father of circumcision to them , who are not of the circumcision only , but also walk in the steps of that faith of our father abraham , which he had being yet uncircumcised . may the god of heaven give you a good understanding of this place , and then all your struggling for infant-baptism would soon vanish . for there is nothing more evident than this , that none but such as so believe , as to walk in the steps of that faith which abraham himself had ( which was true actual faith , ) are the children of abraham , in a visible church-state to worship god , either in baptism , or other ordinances . from pag. 48. you proceed to answer many objections , and in all you say this seems to be your great stick , that infant-interest in the covenant , gen. 17. is not cut off by any thing so objected , as you have set them down ; and unless this be shewed , all objections signify nothing to you . 1. to which i answer , infants had as good right to the covenant of grace before circumcision , and have the same right now which they ever had to that blessed covenant : of this more by and by . 2. no person 's right to circumcision did arise out of the covenant of grace , but did only issue from the command of god ; otherwise all good men then living must needs be circumcised , for they were in the covenant of grace as well as abraham . 3. as circumcision did not give abraham's seed an interest in the covenant of grace , so the abrogation of circumcision did not take that interest from them . nor did the omission of it , when in being , cut infants off from the covenant of grace : it only cut them off from the land of canaan , and the external priviledges of the jewish churchstate . for the delay of the circumcision of moses's child did not cut it off from the covenant of grace , nor did the omission of it fourty years in the wilderness , cut them infants off from the covenant of grace who died in that time , howbeit before they possessed the land of canaan they must be circumcised ; which evidently shews that the covenant of grace , and the covenant of circumcision are to be distinguished . and therefore though infants have now no part in the covenant of circumcision , yet they lose nothing by it ; because though it was very useful till christ came , for the ends for which it was ordained , respecting the church-state of the jews , and the birth of our saviour , of that seed according to the flesh ; yet the removal of it was a great mercy , whether we respect the severity of the service it self , or the obligation to which it bound all that were circumcised . neither does any man's right to the covenant of grace arise from the covenant of circumcision ; neither does his right to baptism arise from the covenant of grace , without a divine command appointing to whom , and how it should be performed . now the gospel being preached for the obedience of faith to all nations , rom. 16. 26. and that typical covenant of circumcision being made void , and the gospel appointing no ceremony for infants ( yet assuring them of heaven ) but making repentance and faith the two first principles of the christian religion , and baptism the third principle in order to a due profession of gospel-worship in a church-way , it is manifest that infant-baptism is an innovation , and makes a breach upon the sacred doctrine contained in st. paul's catechism , as set down , heb. 6. 1 , 2. and therefore all good men should labour that truth herein according to primitive crder may be restored . nevertheless that infants ( even all of them dying such ) have an undeniable right in the covenant of grace , to life and salvation , i hope to make very evident both from the scripture and right reason , in the last part of this treatise to which i now apply my self ; and though herein i shall not directly answer to mr. petto , yet i shall scarce fail to remove those things , which may seem to be of any moment , in his often and unnecessary repetitions . part . iii. in which infants interest in the covenant of grace , without baptism , is asserted and maintained . it is evident from the writings of many paedobaptists , both papists and protestants , that they do hold either absolutely , that no unbaptized infant can be saved , or at least that their salvation is very doubtful , and amongst those , mr. baxter , and from him mr. barret , and now mr. petto has not a little amused the minds of men about this matter . first , mr. baxter tells us ( and mr. barret also ) that infants are not so much as seemingly in a state of salvation without baptism . and secondly , mr. petto thinks they are cut out of the great charter of heaven . these are his words : it is the covenant-interest and baptism of the infant-seed , only of visible believers , that i plead for ; and there are such vast numbers ( even millions ) of these , that if men unduly exclude and raze out the names of so many out of that great charter of heaven , they will have a dreadful account to give thereof to god. in answer to these childish fears and undue reflections upon us , i shall take the pains to transcribe what i have formerly written upon this account , it being yet unanswered . this new art of pleading for infant-baptism by virtue of their church-membership , covenant-interest , &c. and not from the scriptures directly , but altogether by remote , obscure , and far-fetch'd consequences ; i say , considering these subtilties of mr. baxter and others , i perceive the controversy to rise very high , and questions thereupon to be multiplied , insomuch that i have had for my share not less than five hundred of them sent out by mr. barret abovenamed , which has been redargued in two books of antiqueries . hereupon i conceived it needful to consider this matter , for i perceived very wise and good men engaged on both sides ; and as i believe much more straining in the point of church-membership , or covenant-interest of infants than needed . by which the readers of the controversy , as handled between mr. baxter and mr. tombs , shall sooner fill their heads with amazement , than their hearts with satisfaction , in tracing the several meanders of their scholastick disputations . and though i am abundantly short of the accomplishments of either of these champions , yet standing to view till they engage , i hope i have thereby been led to the consideration of a medium , which if well considered and improved , will reconcile the difference about infants visible church-membership , and covenant-interest , and yet do not doubt at all that infant-baptism will be found unnecessary , and unlawful . to which purpose i shall lay down once more this position . that all infants ( as such ) are in a visible state of salvation by the covenant of grace , and so are of the universal church of god ; and cannot be put out of that blessed state , till by their voluntary departure from god , by chusing sinful ways , they destroy themselves . and the better to convince my present adversaries , i will make my enterance hereunto by a passage out of mr. baxter's book , of more proves , &c. pag. 8. where he saith , all mankind is brought by christ under a covenant of grace , which is not vain , nor repealed by god , but as their abuse of the grace of the covenant may cast them out . for as a covenant of intire nature was made with all mankind in innocent adam , so a covenant of grace was made with all mankind in lapsed adam , gen. 3. 15. in the promised seed ; and renewed again with all mankind in noah . now this doctrine being no more than plain truth , we shall apply it to the case in hand , by shewing , 1. that this covenant of grace was a visible church-covenant . 2. that it was made with all mankind , and takes place in their infancy . 3. that it was never repealed by god. 4. that no infant did ever abuse the grace of this covenant ; and that therefore no infant was ever cast out of this covenant . and then , fifthly , they all stand visible members of the catholick or universal church , by virtue of this covenant , however their parents do abuse or neglect it . and hence it will follow , no dying infant is damned , but are all in a visible state of salvation . these things i hope to shew to satisfaction . demonstration 1. that this covenant of grace , first expressed , gen. 3. 15. was either a church-covenant , or else there was no church-covenant in the world , that we read of from adam to noah ; this being indeed all the covenant which is found in scripture during these times , besides that covenant of intire nature made before the fall. and that covenant of nature being broken by adam , and in him by all his posterity , it being not a covenant of grace , could not afford means to justify the the offenders in the sight of god. there must therefore be some supervening act of grace or mercy from god , else adam , even whole mankind who were then in his loins , must have stood under condemnation for ever ; seeing no man could redeem his brother , nor give to god a ransom for him , psal . 49. 7. it is the received doctrine of christians that the visible church began in adam ; and that his family was the church , wherefore the whole world being then the church , and that church-covenant being made with the whole world , which was to proceed from adam , and this covenant yet remaining , it follows against all contradiction , that whole mankind , considered as they came into the world , in the several ages of it , are in that covenant , and so in a visible state of salvation , and therefore of the universal church of god. but whereas many did apostatize from the grace of god's covenant , by corrupting his way , gen. 6. 12. it was necessary that they should be ejected ; and therefore was the profession of this blessed covenant accommodated and appropriated to that part of the adult , who had not sinned themselves out of it . but still we do not find that the innocent was ejected with the guilty . for this is god's order , it is he only that sinneth , whom he will blot out of the book of life , exod. 32. 32 , 33. and therefore neither the method which god took with noah in setling the covenant of his grace ; nor yet that order which he observed with abraham , gen. 12. was exclusive of any infant in the world , as to the grace or mercy of eternal life , no more than the establishment of it by christ in the gospel , in a far more excellent way , for distinguishing the precious from the vile , is in any wise , no not in the least iota , exclusive of any dying infant of ill men : but contrary-wise the right of infants , without excepting any of them , is asserted by christ in this last and most ample edition of the covenant of grace . nor can any man shew either by scripture or reason , that god will shut out all the dying infants of wicked men , from life and salvation by christ , no nor so much as any one of them . for we are sure that the judgment of god is according to truth , that the judg of all the earth will do right : that the condemned shall all be judged according to the deeds done in the body . but as for poor infants , what evil have they done ? demonstration 2. that this covenant was made with all mankind , because it was made with adam , without the least intimation of the exclusion of any part of his posterity ( as they proceed from him ) to the end of the world. neither has god himself explained the covenant of grace to be exclusive of any , but for the cause of their own iniquity . and this was evident first in the case of cain , who not being faithful in his offering , was not accepted ; yet god was pleased to tell him how he might be accepted , gen. 4. 7. if thou dost well , shalt thou not be accepted ? it should seem god never rejected cain till now , neither did he now delight to reject him , but graciously expostulates with cain to convince him of his evil , and assures him of acceptance , if he did well . if then cain had an interest in the grace of god , who can we suppose to be shut out of it ? or how should infants be cast out of his favour , till they with cain shut themselves out of it ? evident it is that the covenant of grace extended to those rebels in the old world , because we read that the long-suffering of god waited in the days of noah upon them , and he gave them time of repentance , and sent a preacher of righteousness ( even the righteousness of faith ) among them . heb. 11. 7. 2 pet. 2. 5. therefore it is said christ went by his spirit and preached to them , 1 pet. 3. though none of them believed his word . now such acts on god's part are great evidences of his graciousness towards men , and shews that he remembers his covenant made in christ for them , even for them that rebel against him , and so perish . and then how should we think that he should not be gracious to poor infants , who never rebelled against him ? demonstration 3. the covenant of grace , gen. 3. 15. was never repealed by god. for if it be , there is now no covenant at all : nor can it be repealed to one man , but it must be repealed to all men. 't is true , men may forfeit the mercy of god held forth in that covenant , but the covenant cannot be repealed , for then there can be no certainty of mercy for sinners . christ our lord may as soon be made null , as this covenant : for what if some do apostatize , shall this make the grace of god without effect ? god forbid . when we continually see the covenant of god's grace displayed , making overtures of kindness to sinners , by beseeching them to be reconciled to god , 2 cor. 5. what shall we say ? has the chief of sinners this benefit by the covenant of grace ? and shall poor innocent babes have no benefit by it ? is he not worse than the chief of sinners , that is thus exposed to damnation ? sure there are better things with god for poor babes , and chiefly in this he has not given parents power to make void the covenant of his grace with respect to their infants : for he hath said , the son shall not bear the iniquity of the father : the soul that sinneth it shall die . demonstration 4. no infant did ever abuse the grace of the covenant made with them in adam ; therefore no infant was ever cast out of it . although it is most true that original sin is come upon infants , and death by sin : yet this is as true , that original sin was not committed against the covenant of grace . and therefore infants are not guilty of any sin committed against the covenant of grace , and consequently are not deprived of the benefit of it . otherwise if the sin of subsequent parents should make void the grace of the second covenant , as the sin of adam made his posterity guilty of the breach of the first covenant , we may then cry out , who then can be saved ? but therefore was our saviour the mediator of the new testament , for the redemption of the transgressions which were under the first testament . wherefore seeing infants stand acquitted from the trespasses committed by adam against the first testament or covenant , and having not sinned against the grace of the second testament , they cannot come in the condemnation of hellish torments . the church of rome , who make baptism as necessary for infants as any body does , yet they have so much kindness , as to condemn infants only to a state of loss , but not of torment : whilst those of calvin's spirit do send them ( by their doctrine ) to yell among the damned in hell-fire . sure this is no part of the gospel , i will not call it so : yet i will say those that reject that great salvation held forth in the gospel , are justly condemned ; but this is not the case of infants . demonstration 5. that all dying infants are members of that vast body of which christ is the saviour finally , and so of his church considered as universal , is evident , because they are in a visible state of salvation . and i think no man will deny the catholick church to contain the whole number of the saved . i have nothing more to do , but to prove all infants in a visible state of salvation ; which shall be done more particularly by answering such objections as i have met with , more especially from mr. barret . objection i. i gave you thanks for some things before granted concerning insants , and i here promise more thanks if you will prove the same of all infants . answ . when i speak of the right which infants have to life by christ , i intend it only of that right derived to them by the first edition of the covenant of grace , gen. 3. 15. wherein they are equally concerned , and so have the same or equal right . and i hope you cannot charge them with forfeiting the grace of that covenant , and then they cannot be damned . our saviour saith , it is not the will of his heavenly father , that so much as one of these little ones should perish , which is as true of infants , as of any persons in the world. object . ii. the overthrow of both these generations in the old world , is a strange medium to prove the salvation of all infants by . answ . the meer destroying of the infants of those who were called the sons of god , as well as the infants of others , gen. 6. and 7. i do not say is any evidence of god's saving any of them . but this is that which i say , it shews them to be in one state or predicament : and how shall any man prove the salvation of so much as of any one of them , better than i shall prove the salvation of them all : and shall we suffer it to enter into our hearts that god sent them all to be damned in hell ? by no means . when therefore we read , 2 pet. 2. 5. that god brought the floud upon the world of the vngodly ; and jude 7. 't is said of those who suffered the vengeance of eternal fire , that they were given over to fornication , and went after strange flesh . may we not perceive some light which may guide us to believe that god did not plead in such wrath against the infant-seed as he did against the wicked themselves ? and though it is true , god suffered the infants to die with the wicked parents , yet that is no argument of god's condemning them to hell. for did not the same god suffer his servant sampson to die with the fall of the theatre , among the wicked philistines ? and we see the righteous often taken away by the same common calamities which have befallen nations and cities . let us remember how tender the lord was of the infants of nineveh , and that may convince us that the same gracious god could not be cruel to the infants of the old world ; and he that made those little ones an argument to justify his sparing sinful nineveh , against the murmuring of jonah , would certainly make that an argument for us to believe , that had his judgments proceeded against that city , according to the prophesy of jonah ; yet he would have distinguished between the innocent and the nocent , in respect of future punishment and mercy : for it was not the sin of the infants , which cryed to heaven for vengeance , but of the grown persons . when we consider how hardly almighty god was drawn to inflict those judgments upon mens bodies in the old world , and in sodom , gen. 18. and frequently where we read of the execution of his judgments ; it might justly seem very strange that men should think that god can be so easily provoked to damn infants to hell : for him i say to damn poor infants to eternal fire , who was so unwilling to inflict on the babes in nineveh so much as a temporal judgment ; nay he is unwilling to destroy the very cattel for mans sin , jonah 4. which are only capable to suffer a short of death . and can it become any christian to think that god will send millions of poor dying infants to hell ? pray what have they done so highly to stirr up his wrath against them ? let any man shew a reason for it if he can . object . iii. to the text rom. 5. the free-gift abounded towards all men to justification of life . this [ all ] must be restrained to [ all in christ ] . answ . but by your favour there are none so out of christ in infancy , but that god hath mercy for them in christ : john 1. 29. so that here is no restraint to the justification here spoken of , till men abuse this mercy of god by sinning against their own souls . nor can your restriction which i suppose would limit this free-gift to the elect only , hold any agreement with the scope of the place . for seeing all mankind are personated as well in the second , as in the first adam , you can no more exclude any from the justification of life , as having abounded towards them by christ , than you can exclude them from the condemnation which abounded towards them by adam . for tell me how many came under condemnation by the sin of adam ? is there any one , or any infant that can plead impunity ? why even so ( saith the apostle ) the free-gift abounded towards all men to justification of life . and may we not safely conclude , that had mankind never been guilty of any other sin but that of adam's , i say upon a supposition that adam's posterity from the time of the promise , gen. 3. 15. had lived holily , and done no iniquity , would you not conclude with me , that none should have perished in hell-torments ? and if you grant this , then we must either find some man so concerned in the covenant of grace , as that if he sinned against this covenant , his posterity is damned with him eternally , as all adam's posterity was exposed to condemnation for his sin ; or else we must hold that no infant shall die eternally for adam's , nor for any other persons iniquity . if you name any man , thus concerned in the covenant of grace , you can name none so apt for the purpose as adam , seeing we were all in him when the covenant was made with him , and there is no doubt but that he sinned after the covenant was made gen. 3. 15. yet where do we find any sin which he afterward committed , imputed to any part of his posterity ? and seeing we cannot prove an universal resurrection from 1 cor. 15. 21 , 22. unless mankind be equally concerned in the death of christ , we must necessarily believe whole mankind to be interessed in him , and as interessed in him , they are in a saneable state , from that wrath which lay against them by reason of the sin of adam : so then infants being justified from the guilt of adam's transgression , by christ the lamb of god ; who shall lay any thing to the charge of poor infants , that may justly cast them into hell-fire ? sure it is but meet that men should be able plainly to convict them , before they thus condemn them . yea , you that hold the eternal damnation of infants , ought you not to bring substantial proof for so dreadful a doctrine ? and when you have done your worst that way , you have only destroyed your own hope concerning your own dying infants . for i am perswaded you are not so unwise to think ( whatever you make others believe ) that your infants are saved because of your pretended church-membership and baptism . nay mr. petto plainly tells us , that all infants that are baptised are not saved ; as i have shewed above . and it is impossible without a miracle for him to know this , or that any one of them is saved , unless he comes on this foundation that none of them shall perish . object . iv. to assert the salvation of all dying infants , seems to imply , that god's destroying the old world and sodom , &c. were eminent acts of god's mercy , rather than of justice , &c. help me over this difficulty . answ . although it is not unjust for god to take infants out of the world at any time , yet his justice in destroying them in the old world and sodom , lay not against the infants , as i proved in the precedent answer . but in justice he punished those wicked parents , in putting a period to their posterity . and did not god in the days of noah destroy the beasts and fowls of heaven , yet who so weak to think that he was offended with them ? was the lord angry with the beasts of the field ? god was just in taking away david's child , 2 sam. 12. 14. yet who so rash to say that god did this in justice against the child ? much less that the child was damned , or that god was angry with the child . david was far from such an opinion , for tho that child was conceived and born in sin , as much as any , yet david nothing feared the damnation of the child , but rather shews his confidence of its salvation , when he said , i shall go to it . for had it gone to hell torments , he would not have comforted himself with thoughts of going to it . object . v. we do not say that infants do perish purely for anothers sin , but for their own contracted . answ . i cannot see any agreement with god's justice in this objection , nor truth in it self . i can hear men talk big words against infants , as if they were very great sinners , yet i never saw any proof , that any infant had any sin of its own , for which you would here make them perish . the scripture saith sin is the transgression of a law , and tells us also where no law is , there is no transgression . you must therefore either shew some law to be given to infants , or else you cannot make them guilty of any sin of their own . and seeing you have granted that none shall perish purely for anothers sin , it remains for you , or some body else , to shew what sin has been committed by them , or any of them , for which they incur the damnation of hell. you may talk of infants contracting sin of their own ; but i am to learn how this can be said of those who neither act nor consent to sin at all . such scriptureless notions are fitter to be exploded than embraced . and though you seem to have some charity for those and their seed , who only come up to the covenant of grace made with adam and noah , though they never heard the gospel , whilst you say , you do not rank them with imsdels ; yet this is but a slender kindness : you do not say they shall be saved , and you are positive in this , that infants are not saved by the covenant of grace , if they be neither believers , nor the seed of such . how this doctrine will stand with the justice of a gracious god , i cannot conceive when i consider , that god hath not given to infants either capacity to believe , or liberty to choose whether they will be the seed of believers or unbelievers . will you yet say a gracious god will be more harsh in acts of justice , than the rules will bear which he hath given to men ? deut. 22. 25 , 26. here he will not have a damsel punished , though her body be defiled , because she could not help it . and yet you would have him send infants to hell for that which they cannot help ! it is not the part of a wise legislator ( saith one ) to recede from his own laws ; much less to destroy them , by acting contrary to them . it must be a fault then in you , thus unjustly to represent the god of justice . is the covenant of grace set upon such a little point , as that the greatest part of infants cannot possibly have any benefit by it ? so you teach , who affirm infants cannot be saved unless they be believers , or the seed of believers . why call you a covenant made with infants on such terms a covenant of grace ? sure such absolutely impossible terms in any covenant are not very gracious , when the non-observation of them is damnation without remedy , and that of the innocent too . you would condemn this in men ; you would abhor to hear or receive such terms of man ; yet thus you make many believe that god deals with the greatest part of poor infants . object . vi. according to your doctrine the taking away the infants of the old world and of sodom , was a great mercy , because had they lived to age , many of them might have been damned for wickedness . answ . the taking away by death of the infants of the old world and sodom , is neither an instance of justice nor mercy to infants in the main ; any more than the taking away thousands of infants daily by death throughout the world : for whenever they die , they are taken away from all evil to come , and so it is always a mercy ' and such was the mercy of god to infants in the old world and in sodom ▪ but whenever they are taken away , we know it is for sin , even that of adam . and sometimes their death is hastened for the sin of their parents , as in the case of david's child , and the old world , and sodom ; and thus their being taken away is always a judgment : and the judgment lieth much in this , that mens posterity is either quite cut off , or much weakened ; thus was the old world and sodom punished , their succession was cut off . and though it is true , if those infants in the old world and sodom had lived to age , many of them might have been damned for wickedness , yet ( not to insist upon the prescience of almighty god ) to ballance that , it is as true that a far greater multitude , in few generations , both of infants and others , which might have proceeded from them , might have been saved . so that though we have no ground to doubt of the salvation of these dying infants in the old world and in sodom , yet we may see a just judgment executed in both . object . vii . should the french king destroy all the infants of the pagans , would not this be a judgment ? sure had the world your light and knowledg , they ought not to be sorry for the spoiling of their cities , and depopulating their countries . answ . what if the french king should do thus ? it follows not that here is not a judgment in all this , neither yet that god hath no mercy for those murthered infants . but pray consider , whilst we all condemn such cruelty in tyrants , we must by no means think or say , that our gracious god , when the tyrant has murthered them , will take these infants and cast them into hellish torments : were not this to represent almighty god to be the worst of tyrants ? and let no man murmur against god for saving such infants ( or all infants ) , who when men have done their worst , he will prevent that which would be far worse to poor infants than the worst that man can do . and though i may be satisfied that my child or friend is gone to heaven , yet i may lawfully be sorry for both , so that i sorrow not as one without hope . object . viii . what shall we make of ephes . 2. 3 , 12. and were by nature children of wrath , even as others ? that at that time you were without christ , without hope . if there be no ground to doubt the salvation of their infants , is there not some hope ? answ . i grant that all adam's posterity with himself were children of wrath ; and take that wrath in as large a sense as you please , it hurts not my cause at all : seeing it is evident that christ abolished that wrath and death , and brought life and immortality to light by the gospel , which he preached to whole adam , gen. 3. 15. and then took whole adam into grace and favour ; so that till they , or any of them , become the serpents seed , they stand in a state of favour and grace , which shall deliver them from wrath and death . and it is most certain , no infant is the serpents seed , it being out of his power to beget them to be his off-spring , seeing they are out of the reach of his temptations during infancy . howbeit this place , ephes . 2. is best interpreted of the adult or grown persons , for these , of whom it was said they were without hope , &c. it is said , they were dead in trespasses and sins , and walked according to the course of this world , according to the prince of the power of the air , which now worketh in the hearts of the children of disobedience ; such as had their conversation in the lusts of their flesh , fulfilling the desires of the flesh , and of the mind : and s o were by nature the children of wrath. but what is all this to the innocent babes of the gentiles ? they were not thus the children of wrath , no nor out of the covenant of grace , as made with adam , having never abused the grace of that covenant . so that there was hope ( or ground of hope ) concerning the dying infants of the gentiles , whether their parents understood it or not : but no hope concerning themselves , considered in their wicked courses . neither could the hope of these gentiles ( when they believed ) concerning their infants , stand upon the same grounds on which their own hope was founded , seeing these were saved through faith , and built up an habitation of god through the spirit . only this is very true , they now understood the riches of god's grace to mankind , and that god had pitty for them , when they were dead in trespasses and sins . and therefore they could not rationally doubt of his good will towards their dying infants : for still his unwillingness to destroy the actual sinner , is argument enough that he will never destroy the innocent child eternally . what hope there is of all infants entring into heaven ( however it may be hid from the pagans . ) is evident enough from our saviour's speech ; except ye be converted , and become as little children , ye shall in no wise enter into the kingdom of heaven . now suppose i take the infant of a jew or pagan for my pattern , and labour that my conversation may answer to such a precedent , in point of innocency , humility , and simplicity ; will not this as well accord the intent of our saviour's words , as if i took the child of a christian for my pattern ? certes it would . and indeed our saviour here speaks as much for our comfort concerning all little childrens capacity , to enter into heaven , as for any one of them ; as also when the apostle exhorts us , as touching malice , to be as children ; does he not hereby justify the whole in that state of infancy to be devoid of that evil ? and why even of our selves do we not judg what is right ? could any man from the beginning to this day , bring the least charge against one infant more than another ? unless god by miracle shew some special power upon them , no difference can be seen in them in point of innocency . object . ix . but have you not forgotten that you told us you do not doubt but the promises made to the seed of the righteous , and the promises of shewing mercy to them that love god , remain unrevoked ? answ . i have not forgotten that , but still believe that there are many more blessings pertaining to the seed of the righteous , according to the texts by you alledged , than to others . and that they may be better considered , i will set that down in words which you write in figures ; psal . 102. 28. the children of thy servants shall continue , and their seed shall be established before thee . this had doubtless been the portion of the sons of god in the days of noah , had they not sinned with the rest of mankind : psal . 103. 17. the mercy of the lord is from everlasting to everlasting , to them that fear him , and his righteousness to childrens children , to them that keep his covenant , and remember his commandments to do them . prov. 20. 7. the just walketh in his integrity , his children are blessed after him . now what do these places prove ? sure nothing less than that no infants shall be saved , but the infants of believers , &c. and if not , how do they suit your case ? they prove indeed that god will bless the posterity of his faithful servants if they keep his covenant , and remember his commandments to do them : i think david well expounds this place in psal . 37. 25. and yet i grant , though you prove it not , that there are very many other blessings ( even in infancy ) does attend the seed of the righteous . they being a seed of many prayers , and devoted to god from the womb , as far as their pious parents has authority to do it ; whilst , god knows , others are destitute of these blessings , being crossed and exorcised among the paedobaptists , and offered to molech among the jews , and the like among the heathens . and yet for all this , i can see no ground to think that the righteous god will punish with hellish torments those dying infants for the wrong which their parents have done them . it being inconceivable how it can stand with his attributes , either of mercy or justice , both which must have effect upon them : his justice hath its effect on infants in diseases , sickness and death . now either his mercy must have effect upon dying infants in the next world , or not at all , if not in that world , how shall that saying be true ; his tender mercies are over all his works ? will he never shew tender mercy to infants , who only lived to cry and die in this world , and must they now die eternally in hell ? is this your tender mercy to infants ? o ye cruel paedobaptists ! object . x. if the blessing of abraham came upon the gentiles through faith , gal. 3. 14. how does it reach to the infants of the gentiles which do not believe ? answ . i told you that the blessing in respect of eternal life was not peculiar to abraham and his seed , but was made as well to adam and his seed , and so common to mankind , and may well be called the common salvation , being derived from christ promised , gen. 3. 15. ( before abraham was ) who is therefore the saviour of all men. indeed abraham , and so all believers , have many things in special or peculiar blessings , as a people engaged in the duties of religion : whilst unbelievers are under a wrathful sentence , because they neglect so great salvation . but all this concerns not dying infants , who neglect not this salvation , and so forfeit not their right to that common salvation obtained by christ for mankind . in gal. 3. 14. the apostle speaks of the promise of the spirit , which as it concerns the church under the gospel-frame , does not concern infants . it being understood of a greater measure of wisdom , and power to walk in the paths of righteousness , than was ordinary under the former testament ; 2 tim. 1. 6. gal. 3. 2 , 3 , 5 , 7. gal. 5. 25. nor can you with any shew of reason say , that i make the salvation of infants run in a fleshly line , seeing i derive it only from the free grace of god , manifested in the lamb slain from the foundation of the world , to take away the sin of the world. nor do i consider adam in a state of nature , but as under a covenant of grace , from whom the second adam must in time proceed as touching his flesh , and therefore his descent is reckoned from him , luk. 3. 23. to the end . in this second adam , the repairer of mankind , do i place the salvation of all men. and of the infant-race , i say , their title to this grace is not tyed to man's will , to sin them out of it at their pleasure , nor can the devil himself deprive them of this grace of life . and therefore they being thus written in the book of life , and not being under the sentence of the book of conscience , they cannot be hurt of the second death . to what you say about god's putting the salvation of infants out of his own hand . i say , that though he put the salvation of no creature out of his own hand according to my opinion ; yet when he stretched forth his hand to gain-sayers , as rom. 10. and gives them the word of life , and they put it from them , act. 13. 46. then men may truly be said to have a prize in their hands , and to put it from them , even the salvation of their souls . and then i pray consider , that if their putting salvation from themselves , be equally or really a putting it from their infants ( as that must be your opinion , or else we differ not ) then i say , according to your opinion , god suffers men to damn poor infants whom he would save . seeing , according to your doctrine , had the parents believed , their infants had been in the covenant of grace . but now for their fathers sin ( for what you say of their own contracted , is but a fable ) they are left by you in the kingdom of the devil to suffer with the devil and his angels for ever . now this dreadful doctrine can never be proved by the scriptures , though some have assayed to do it . i find indeed dr. fulk saying , that calvin holdeth all infants under the sentence of eternal damnation ; only he admits , that such infants as are elect and born again by the spirit of god , may be saved . but i find no proof , that any infant , dying so , is reprobate to eternal damnation : the scripture says no such thing . indeed diodate would have us believe that god cast esau ( even before he was born ) out of his love as a father : but here is no proof . for if we should admit his gloss upon rom. 9. 13. yet we are to consider that god knew what esau would be in time , and did here foreshew what in time should be done concerning him . esau lived to be a man , and a very sinful man. god knew all this before . esau is not to be ranked with dying infants , therefore the instance of esau is nothing to the purpose . and this instance failing , as it evidently doth , i am sure there is not the least shew of proof in the scripture for the damnation of dying infants . and therefore no man ought to believe such strange doctrine , nor trouble the world nor church of god with it . when our saviour denounces the dreadful sentence of hell's damnation , he directs his speech to hypocrites , and grievous sinners . but he has better things in store for poor infants ; testifying that to them belongs the kingdom of god. in his gracious arms therefore we shall leave all dying infants , for the obtaining that blessing of life , without which they are more wretched than the fallen angels ; for they had once a blessed state , but proudly fell from it . but here it is poor infants are above these angels ; infants have a redeemer , but the fallen angels have none . glory to god in the highest for his free grace towards all dying infants , and let all good christians say , amen . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a41784-e1940 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies offspring of growth or stature , but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies an infant . * manual of contro . p. 372 , to 377. s. n. antid . the ax laid to the root, or, one blow more at the foundation of infant baptism, and church-membership. part i containing an exposition of that metaphorical text of holy scripture, mat. 3. 10. : being the substance of two sermons lately preached, with some additions, wherein is shewed that god made a two-fold covenant with abraham, and that circumcision appertained not to the covenant of grace, but to the legal and external covenant god made with abraham's natural seed, as such : together with an answer to mr. john flavel's last grand arguments in his vindiciarum vindex, in his last reply to mr. philip cary, also to mr. rothwell's pædo-baptisms vindicatur, as to what seems most material / by benjamin keach ... keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. 1693 approx. 112 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 20 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2003-05 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a47391 wing k47 estc r39052 18207842 ocm 18207842 107120 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a47391) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 107120) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1125:20) the ax laid to the root, or, one blow more at the foundation of infant baptism, and church-membership. part i containing an exposition of that metaphorical text of holy scripture, mat. 3. 10. : being the substance of two sermons lately preached, with some additions, wherein is shewed that god made a two-fold covenant with abraham, and that circumcision appertained not to the covenant of grace, but to the legal and external covenant god made with abraham's natural seed, as such : together with an answer to mr. john flavel's last grand arguments in his vindiciarum vindex, in his last reply to mr. philip cary, also to mr. rothwell's pædo-baptisms vindicatur, as to what seems most material / by benjamin keach ... keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. rothwell, edward, d. 1731. paedobaptismus vindicatus. [4], 32 p. printed for the author, and are to be sold by john harris ..., london : [1693] imprint date suggested by wing. imperfect: cropped with loss of imprint date; best copy available for photographing. reproduction of original in the bodleian library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng flavel, john, 1630?-1691. -vindiciarum vindex. bible. -n.t. -matthew iii, 10 -criticism, interpretation, etc. infant baptism. 2002-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2003-01 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2003-02 judith siefring sampled and proofread 2003-02 judith siefring text and markup reviewed and edited 2003-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the ax laid to the root : or , one blow more at the foundation of infant baptism , and church-membership . containing an exposition of that metaphorical text of holy scripture , mat. 3. 10. being the substance of two sermons lately preached , with some additions . wherein is shewed that god made a two-fold covenant with abraham , and that circumcision appertained not to the covenant of grace , but to the legal and external covenant god made with abraham's natural seed , as such . together with an answer to mr. john flavel's last grand arguments in his vindiciarum vindex , in his last reply to mr. philip cary. also to mr. rothwell's paedo-baptismus vindicatur ; as to what seems most material . part i. by benjamin keach , pastor of a church of christ , meeting at horsly-down , southwark . rom. 9. 7. neither because they are the seed of abraham , are they all i hil dren , &c. — ver . 8. that is , they which are the children of the flesh , these are not the children of god. gal. 4. 24. which things are an allegory , for these are the two covenants . gal. 3. 29. and if ye be christ's then are ye abraham's seed . london , printed for the author , and are to be sold by john harris at the harrow in the poultrey 16●● the epistle to the reader . when i first entered on this text , i did not intend the publication of the sermons ; it was not at all in my thoughts : but after i had preached two of them , i was earnestly solicited by divers , to do it ; which , at last , i consented to do . yet , because some of the arguments about that two-fold covenant god made with abraham , being before publish'd , in my answer to mr. burkit , i was at a stand in my mind about it : yet meeting with mr. john flavell 's vindiciarum vindex , being ( as he says ) a full answer to mr. philip cary 's exceptions to his vindiciae legis & faedoris , together with a late treatise , wrote by mr. rothwell , called , paedo-baptismus vindicatus , i was resolved ( if the bookseller would take the copy ) to expose it to publick view , finding no person taking any notice of either of those late treatises , by way of answer . the former being so much cryed up , as a weighty piece , i thought it was necessary to examine and detect the seeming force of his chief arguments ; for tho' the author is deceased , yet i fear his writings on that subject , may do some wrong to the truth , by hindering such gracious persons reception of it , who are willing to be informed , because he was a man of great parts , learning , and ( i hope ) of piety : for , by sad experience , i perceive some people build their faith and belief of infant baptism , on the credit , and great veneration they have of the asserters of it , saying , how should such men be mistaken ? which is a poor argument ; and a great reproach it is to such persons : for their faith , it seems , stands in the wisdom of men , and not in the power of god , or certain testimony of his holy word — god may , reader , for some reasons known to himself , hide this and some truths , from some of his faithful servants , may be , as a rebuke to them for their over-valuing of humane learning , and to the people too upon the like account ; though the knowledge of the tongues i esteem in its place , and could wish , if the lord saw it good , all gospel ministers had the knowledge of the original languages ; but , ( as the apostle says ) god hath chosen the foolish things of the world , to confound the wise , 1 cor. 1. 27. and base things , and things that are despised hath god chosen , yea , things that are not to bring to naught things that are , ver . 28. that no flesh should glory in his presence , god makes use of men that are of no account , in the esteem of the learned world , to confound such who are of great repute . the truth is , that great author hath not missed the mark , only in asserting paedo-baptism , and in his dark notions , about the covenant of circumcision , but also in a point of far greater moment , viz. in asserting in this very book , the conditionality of the covenant of grace : these are his words , an antecedent condition , signifying no more than an act of ours , which , tho' it be neither perfect in every degree , nor in the least meritorious of the benefit conferr'd , nor performed in our own natural strength ; yet , according to the constitution of the covenant , is required of us , in order to the blessings consequent thereupon , by vertue of the promise ; and consequently , the benefits and mercies , granted in the promise , in this order , are , and must be suspended by the donor , or disposer of them , until it be performed : such a condition , we affirm faith to be , &c. this grand error ( for so i must call it ) the learned and reverend mr. chauncy ( whom god hath graciously raised up to defend his blessed truth , at this present time , and for whose labours we have great cause to praise the holy name of jehovah ) takes notice of , in his late treatise , which is newly come to my hand , before i wrote this epistle , tho' my copy is at the press , p. 128 , 129. mr. flavel ( saith he ) was a worthy man , but it may be , not without some hay and stubble : i wish it do not prove an attempting at another foundation , besides christ , &c. you tell us ( saith he ) what an antecedent condition is , that it signifies no more than an act of ours , and such is faith. i suppose you and he mean , in distinction from a consequent condition , the antecedent gains the estate , the lawyers reckon it the purchase-money ; the consequent condition keeps it , and it 's the quit-rent ; which , if it be not duely paid , the lord can enter and take the estate ; so that faith you 'll have , to be the antecedent : money , deposited and laid down , before you have any of your spiritual estate ; and you say , it signifies no more than an act of ours . i pray , whose should it be but ours ? if the condition be to be performed by us ; and , why is this put in ? it signifies no more , unless the meaning be , that christ's righteousness should be shut out , and it should be reckoned , under the nature of this condition , merely as an act of ours , without respect to christ , the author of it , and christ the true object of it : — see him at large . again ( he saith ) every faedoral condition is ex pacto meritorious , so that you may challenge your bargain upon performance , if it be but 20 guineys to purchase an 100 l. per annum , so that we have only your word for 't , that it is not meritorious , when it 's so in reality : the nature of the thing speaks it to the understanding of all men of sence . no , no , do not think to wheedle christ out of his merits , and god out of the honour of his free grace , and us , out of the comfort of both : you say , it 's not performed in our natural strength : no ; and yet a condition of a covenant made with man : a most unreasonable thing , to require a condition of a covenant of one , that we know hath no strength to perform it . if a rich man should offer an estate of 1000 l. a year to a poor man , that he knew was not worth a groat , provided he fetched him 20 l. of his own money , this act would be reckoned a mocking , and ridiculing this poor wretch . god did not require that small condition of adam , but that he actually had strength to perform it ; you will say , god will give him ability to perform : so he did to adam , previous to the covenant , &c. see his farther answer , p. 130. god will , in due time , bring down and abase the pride of man ; o what a doctrine do some men preach ! 't is time , indeed , now to lay aside our lesser differences , and make head against such capital errors . the foundation seems now to be struck at — reader , since i preached these sermons , i met with reverend mr. cotton on the covenant , who confirms the same thing , concerning the ax being laid to the root of the trees , speaking of that text , mal. 4. 1. the day cometh that shall leave them neither root nor branch : there are two things in the root , ( saith he ) 1st . the first is the root of abraham 's covenant , which this people much trusted upon , and that is it of which john the baptist speaks , now is the ax is laid to the root of the trees , &c. this is spoken in mat. 3. 9. after he had said , think not to say within your selves , we have abraham to our father , ver . 8. so that all their confidence they had in abraham 's covenant , temple , and tabernacle , and such things , is burnt up , and so they have no root left them to stand upon : but , 2dly , there is something more in it ; for , with this spirit of burning , the lord , by the power of this spirit , doth cut us off from any power of our own natural or spiritual gifts , whereby we thought to lay hold on jesus christ , and we are cut off hereby from all confidence that we have in our own sufficiency , &c. for there is an usual confidence that we have in our own state , tho' the lord hath cut us off from the righteousness of our parents , and from boasting of his ordinance ; yet we think there is some power left in us . cotton 's treaty of the cov. p. 177 , 178. again he saith , it is spoken of the ministry of john the baptist , which did burn as an oven , and left them neither the root of abraham 's covenant , nor the branches of their own good works . he cutteth them off from the covenant of abraham ; and so by cutting them off from the root , he leaveth them no ground to trust to , pag. 21 , 22. i hope , if this text be well considered , and our arguments , in the ensuing treatise , no wise and impartial person will find there is any ground for men to plead for infant baptism , from the covenant god made with abraham . i shall say no more , but leave what i have said to the blessing of the god of truth ( who is coming forth to shake all false foundations and states ; yea , both heaven and earth , that that which cannot be shaken , may remain ) and rest thy servant in the work of the gospel , from my house near horsly-down , southwark , this 6th . of march , 1693. benjamin keach . reader , my answer to mr. flavel and mr. rothwell , i find will not come into the first part ; but the second is going to the press , where you will have it . the ax laid to the root , &c. or , one blow more at the foundation of infant baptism , and church-membership . mat. iii. 10. and now also the ax is laid to the root of the trees , every tree therefore that bringeth not forth good fruit ; is hewn down and cast into the fire . this text is metaphorical ; there is no great difference between a metaphor and an express similitude ; and for the better understanding the mind of god therein , i shall 1. open the scope and coherence thereof . 2. explain the parts and terms therein contained . 3. i shall observe some points of doctrine reducable there-from . 4. shall improve the whole by way of application . first , from the scope and coherence of the place , 't is evident , that john baptist endeavours to take off the jews , particularly the pharisees and sadduces , from the external and legal covenant god made with abraham and his fleshly-seed , or off-spring . see vers . 7. but when he saw many of the pharisees and sadduces come to his baptism , he said unto them , o generation of vipers , who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come . historians tell us , that there were three more eminent religious sects amongst the jews , the first were called essenes , of whom we do not read in the holy scripture ; their main doctrine was fate ; they ( say our annotators ) ascribed all things to it . secondly , the sadduces were directly opposite to the essenes , they ascribed nothing to fate , but asserted the liberty and power of man's will , in the most largest sence , or in the extravagant height ; they denied the immortality of the soul of man , the resurrection , angels , &c. all which , the pharisees owned . see act. 23. 8. the pharisees , were outwardly a very zealous sort of people ; and , tho' they were tainted with that false opinion of the freedom of man's will to do good , yet they ▪ ascribed much to the providence and grace of god ; they were interpreters of the law , and separated themselves from others ; they spent much time in fasting and prayer : 1. they held , nevertheless , a righteousness by the works of the law , by which they thought they were justified and accepted of god , and so stumbled at the stumbling-stone , rom. 9. 32. 2. they gave a very corrupt interpretation of the law. 3. they held many un-written traditions of equal force with the law of god ; by which means , they made void the commandments of god. 4. they were a mere hypocritical sort of men in their practices , being very strict and zealous for the smaller matters of the law , and neglected the weightier things thereof . whether these pharisees and sadduces came with an intention to be baptized , or only out of curiosity , is hard to be resolved , since 't is said , they rejected the counsel of god against themselves , being not baptized by john. john however , sharply treates them both , calling them a generation of vipers , a sort of serpents , of whom 't is said , they make way into the world through the bowels of their dam. it may be upon this account , he gave them that name , or so called them , who thought through the bowels ( as i may so say of their ancestors ) or being the seed of abraham , or the off-spring of godly progenitours , to come to heaven ; who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come . what is the reason that you come to my baptism ? whereas some of you think there is no resurrection , no heaven , no hell , no angels , nor no spirits ; or , you , who think you are so righteous , as you need no repentance , and so need fear no wrath to come , from whence comes this to pass that you seem to fear , or to be afraid of future wrath , and the vengeance of an angry god ? bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance , ver . 8. o come now and put your selves among the crowd of poor sinners , and godly penitent persons ; repent of your false doctrines you have taught ; repent of the corrupt and wicked notions and opinions you hold , and of the vain and hypocritical lives you have led , and think not that a bear profession of this will do neither ; for you must bring forth fruits of true repentance , fruits of true holiness , from a thorough change of heart that must be wrought in you . but , ( as if he should say ) i know your thoughts , i have heard what a belief you are of , you think you are in covenant with god , and so are faedorally holy , and in a saved and safe condition , because you have abraham to your father , you conclude , that covenant god made with abraham , and his natural or fleshly seed , was the covenant of grace ; and so the promise is sure to you : and therefore , he adds , ver . 7. and think not to say within your selves , we have abraham to our father : for i say unto you , that god is able of these stones , to raise up children to abraham . you promise good to your selves , because you are the natural off-spring of believing abraham , you rest upon your descent from him . the very same plea we find they made to our blessed saviour , joh. 8. 33. we be abraham 's seed , and were never in bondage to any man. how sayest thou , yee shall be made free : we were never under the bondage of sin , as others are ; that covenant made with abraham being the covenant of grace , we are thereby set at liberty , and no man shall by his doctrine make us believe the contrary , we are a free people , in respect of our souls and spiritual privileges , ( for they could not mean otherwise , because they had often been in bondage to men , in respect of external liberty and freedom : first to pharaoh king of egypt , and then to nebuchadnezzar , and now were so in bondage under the romans ) i know ( saith our saviour ) that ye are abraham's seed , according to the flesh : they were his off-spring ; but that was no spiritual advantage to them , tho' it did give them right to legal privileges and ordinances under the law , yet it signify'd nothing now , it would not profit them under the gospel dispensation , they must be the spiritual seed of abraham , and do the works of abraham , and walk in his steps ; which they did not , and therefore the lord jesus told them , vers . 44. ye are of your father the devil , and the lusts of your father you will do . john baptist , intimates the same thing , when he called them a generation of vipers ; tho' they intituled themselves to the covenant of grace , ( like as some do now a-days ) upon that , in gen. 17. extended to abraham's seed , as well as to himself , and concluded , they were members of god's church , then on earth , and could not therefore be deny'd any privilege , or ordinance , that of right belonged to covenant children : but this great prophet knew how blind and deceived they were , not understanding , that there were two covenants made with abraham , and also a two-fold seed ( viz. ) a carnal or natural , and a spiritual seed : they thought that promise of god , made with abraham , must be made of none effect , if they should not be owned or allowed to be the seed of abraham ; but , ( saith the baptists ) god is able of these stones , to raise up children to abraham . if he should turn stones into men and women , who have abraham's faith , they would be certainly the true seed of abraham , and not such as they were , tho' they naturally proceeded from his loins , according to the flesh ; or , god could of the gentiles raise up children to abraham , and so make good his promise to him , who said , in thy seed , shall all the nations of the earth be blessed . and now farther to convince them , and so to take away , for ever , all their hope and pretences of right to gospel-ordinances , and church-membership , by vertue of the covenant made with abraham ; or , from the consideration of their being his natural or fleshly seed , he in the words i first read to you , says , and now also the ax is laid to the root of the trees , therefore every tree which bringeth forth not good fruit , is hewn down and cast into the fire , vers . 10. now , this now referrs to the time here in this place , sometimes it referrs to the matter or occasion of what is spoken , now the ax is laid to the root of the trees ; whatever is meant by the root of the trees , this is certain , the ax was not till now , or until this time so laid , or thus laid to the root : we cannot understand what the holy ghost intends hereby , unless we observe , and well consider the scope and coherence of the text , which do's clearly unfold the whole drift and purport of the baptists . he shew'd them before in the context , that their plea to gospel baptism , was not good nor pleadable , i. e. we are abraham's seed ; they might object , and say , obj. all the seed of abraham , were taken into covenant with god , and all that sprang from his loins , were members of the visible church ; and had right to the external rites , ordinances and privileges thereof . ans. this john baptist seems to grant , i. e. that it was so from abraham's time untill these days , or under the law or old covenant-dispensation ; they had , he denies not , a right to jewish church-membership , and legal ordinances : but what of that , now the ax is laid to the root of the trees ; that is , as abraham was the root , or common covenanting-father , as concerning the flesh , out of which root , all the jews , his natural off-spring , sprang ; and , upon which foundation , they and their natural church-state was founded : yet , now the ax is laid to this root , i. e. to this covenant , i. e. the legal , or external covenant made with abraham ; and down must the building fall , when the foundation is removed ; down goes the trees , when the root ( out of which they grew ) is cut down . so much as to the scope and coherence of the words . secondly , i shall explain the terms and parts of the text : 1. shew farther what is meant by the root . 2. what is intended by the trees . 3. what is meant by the ax. 4. what by laying the ax to the root of the trees , and by cutting down . 5. what by the fire , and casting into the fire . first , by the root is meant , that which bears up the branches , and on which the tree and branches stand and grow ; and 't is from hence , from this allusion , the baptists makes use of these words and expressions . now the root , whereof he speaks , ( as i conceive ) was that covenant god made with abraham , and his natural seed , or off-spring ; which covenant did , in a mystical sence , as clearly bear up the national church of israel , and all the trees , i. e. members or branches thereof , as a common natural root doth the tree , or trees that grow out of it . 2. and as by root may be meant that covenant made with abraham , and his natural seed , ( from whence the national policy , and church of the jews sprang , and was born up , and from whence it grew and was to abide ) untill the gospel dispensation came in , and was established ; so also by the root may be intended the foundation of all their hopes , confidence , and outward privileges : for that , they ( i mean the natural off-spring of abraham ) had great confidence in the flesh , by means of that legal or external ministration they were under , cannot be denied , and had many outward rights and privileges also , above all people then in the world ; and if so , ( i mean if this be granted , which i am sure cannot be denied ) then it follows there was some root , ground , or foundation , which they had , and upon which they built , and laid claim to those outward ecclesiastical and civil rights and privileges ; and that the ground root , or foundation of all this , was that covenant god made with abraham and his natural seed , is apparent to all who are not willingly blind ; for before those covenant-tranctions with abraham , we read not that the people , from whom abraham sprang , had any such rights or privileges granted to them , and what outward privileges god promised them afterwards by moses , 't is signify'd in divers places to be upon the account of the covenant made with abraham , &c. and according to the exact time , told by the lord to abraham , god brought his natural seed out of the land of egypt . this , from the scope and coherence of the words ; therefore i must affirm , is primarily , and chiefly intended by the root of the trees in this place : but , thirdly , by root , in a more remote sence , may be meant the state and standing of every ungodly , unbelieving and impenitent person ; let their hopes , expectation , and confidence , be what it will , if he be not a good tree , a believing and true penitent person , his root , or foundation on which he builds , let it be what it will , cannot secure him , for down he must go with all his vain hopes , works , expectation and confidence whatsoever with him , for now is the ax laid to the root of the trees . secondly , by trees are meant men and women , but chiefly the seed of the stock of abraham , according to the flesh ; of whom the national church of the jews was made up , and did consist ; as also , all wicked and unbelieving persons whatsoever , who embrace not the offers of grace , in the gospel , or believe not in jesus christ. for , as the church of god is compared to a good tree , and godly men , in particular , are called good trees , so is the adulterated church of the jews , compared to an evil tree ; and wicked and ungodly persons , called , evil and corrupt trees : yet it might be here noted , that they are in this place compared to fruit trees , tho' to such that bring not forth good fruit , as ( by the prophet ) the jewish church is compared to a vine , and an olive tree , tho' she brought forth sowre grapes , isa. 5. thirdly , as to the ax , we all know an ax is that instrument used by men to cut down trees , at the pleasure , or for the profit of the owner thereof ; by the ax here , may be intended divers things , by which god may be said to cut down impenitent sinners , or unfruitful churches , or bodies and souls of men. for cutting down may refer , 1. to the souls of men , &c. 2. to their outward rights and privileges . 3. to their bodies and souls both . 4. to their external , fleshly and corrupt church state. first , to the souls of sinners , which is done by an act of god's justice , when he cuts them off , from profiting by the means of grace , giving them up to unbelief and hardness of heart : and thus he in judgment dealt with the jews . 2. by giving them up to blindness of mind , when they have ears , and hear not ; eyes , and see not ; hearts , and understand not ; god utterly leaving them to a seared conscience , or gives them up to their own heart's lusts , and to walk in their own counsel . then they , in respect of their souls , may be said to be cut down in wrath for ever . 3. or , when he takes away the kingdom of god from them , i. e. the dispensation of the gospel . therefore shall the kingdom of heaven be taken from you , and given to another people , &c. secondly , it may referr to the cutting down their religious and civil rights , and privileges . 1. when god takes away all the external and spiritual immunities , blessings and favours , a people once enjoy'd . no gospel more preached to them , no ministers to preach it , the hedge of protection and preservation pluck'd up , and ravenous beasts let in to devour them ; like as god threatned the national church of israel , isa. 5. the sun to shine upon them no more , nor the clouds to rain upon them . this is a dismal cutting down . thirdly , their bodies left to be destroyed by mercyless enemies , or cut down by famine , or pestilence , as this very people were dealt with , when god brought in the romans upon them , and their souls cut off for their final unbelief and impenitency . fourthly , it may referr to the cutting down of their church-state , sacrifices , priest-hood , sabbaths , temples , and all taken away and overthrown , and another people , another seed , and more spiritual church , constituted and established in the room thereof . and thus god dealt with this people , i. e. the church of the jews also , they were broken off , or cut down , and the gentiles were grafted in , as the apostle shews at large , rom. 11. the ax , by which they are cut down , may be , first , the dispensation of god's providence , or time ; time is pictured with a sythe ; but then man is compared to grass , but it may be pictured with an ax , since men are compared to trees ; a syth is no fit instrument to cut down trees : men , as you have heard , are here compared to trees , and when once the time 's set for the jewish church to stand , or abide in the world , was expired , time , or the dispensation of god's providence , like an ax , cut it down for ever ; and so will the prefix'd time appointed by the lord , when 't is come , even cut down at the root , the bloody idolatrous church of rome , when the beasts 1260 years are expired , down she shall go with vengeance ; and unless time lays the ax at her root , and at the root of all other corrupt and national churches , there will be no cutting them down , nor will there be any , then able to save her or them : the standing of all humane and ecclesiastical states and constitutions , are determined by the almighty , who works all things according to the counsel of his own will. 2. the ax also may referr to the gospel : the word of god is an ax to hew and square some persons for god's spiritual building , and to cut down others also , as trees that are rotten , and bear no good fruit , therefore ( saith the lord ) i have hewn them by the prophets ; and what follows , mark it , i have slain them by the words of my mouth , hos. 6 , 5. the word of god either kills or cures ; 't is either a saviour of life unto life , or the saviour of death unto death , 2. cor. 2. 16. like as sweet-meats are to some pleasant and comfortable , and to others pernicious and deadly . the abuse of gospel grace cut the jews down , and so it will all others who slight and contemn it ; the word either softens , or hardens , like as the sun , who shining on the wax , it softens that ; but shining on the clay , it hardens that . when the word comes in judgment , then 't is like an ax in the hand of god's justice . i find one learned man speaking thus on this place , viz. the word of god , which is a spiritual ax , cutteth down spiritually wicked men , and hypocrites , like rotten and barren trees . this is it , which is elsewhere meant by plucking up , destroying , hardening , &c. some , ( saith he ) expound this , not of spiritual judgments , threatned in his word against impenitent sinners , but of the power of the romans , which were the instruments of god , to destroy utterly the unfaithful and wicked generation of the jews . the former is ( saith he ) the best exposition , but i conceive it may referr to both . 3. the ax may refer to men , whom god makes use of , as instruments in his hand , to cut down and destroy a wicked and god-provoking people : hence wicked rulers and kings , whom god raises up as instruments in his hand , to chastise and cut down a rebellious people , are called his sword , and the rod of his wrath and indignation , psal. 17. 14. arise , o lord , disappoint him , cast him down , deliver my soul from the wicked , which is thy sword. and thus the assyrian were an ax in god's hand , to use , as he pleased , and the romans afterwards , to the jews likewise . moreover , god's israel is called his ax , thou art my battel-ax , and weapons of war ; with thee i will break in pieces the nations , and with thee will i destroy kingdoms . god's people , in the last days , which are now very near , shall be his ax , by whom , as instruments in his hand , he will destroy babylon , jer. 51. 20 , 24. and i will render unto babylon , &c. all the evil they have done to sion , in your sight , saith the lord. reward her as she hath rewarded you , double to her double . rev. 18. 6. give her blood to drink , for she is worthy . the stone cut out of the mountains without hands , shall break to pieces all the powers of the earth , that oppose christ's kingdom , or , that stand in the way of its establishment , dan. 3. 34. 44. 4. by the ax , may in the general be meant god's wrath , however it is , or may be executed , or upon whom ; wrath will sooner , or later , cut down all the ungodly , both false churches , and tyrannical powers of the earth , and all who continue in unbelief and in rebellion against god. the laying the ax to the root , discovers the final fall and ruin of sinners , whether considered as a church , or as particular persons , dig up or cut down the root , and down falls the body and all the branches of the tree . fifthly , and lastly , therefore every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit , shall be hewn down and cast into the fire . now he draws a necessary inferrence and conclusion from the premisses . every tree , that is , every man and woman , or every corrupt church , be they who they will , either jew or gentile , babylonian or christian , if not plants of god's planting , if not fruitful to god , if they answer not his design and end , if they bring not forth good fruit , they shall be hewn down and cast into the fire of external and eternal wrath ; a fire saith the lord , is kindled in my anger , and it shall burn to the lowest hell. wrath ceases , and shall cease on them here ; but at last they shall be cast into hell-fire , where the worm dies not , and the fire is not quenched , mark. 9. 46. 1. the words being thus opened and explained , i shall take notice of two or three points of doctrine . 1. doct. now the dispensation is changed , to be of the natural root , or of the national church of the jews , or the seed of abraham , according to the flesh , as such is no ground of church-membership ; or , 't is no argument to be admitted into the gospel church , or to gospel-baptism . 2. doct. now in the times of the gospel god is , and will be , severe with all ungodly , unbelieving and impenitent sinners he strikes at their root , at the root of all their hopes , false faith , or fleshly confidence whatsoever . 't is the first of these propositions i shall in the first place insist upon and as i may be enabled , explain and prosecute amongst you ; but the time being near gone , let me now with a brief word or two , conclude at this season . 1. caution . take heed on what you build your hopes of justification and salvation , what is that which bears up your spirits : for if you are trees that grow not out of the true root , jesus christ , and the covenant of grace ; if you have not union with the lord jesus , or are not built on that foundation , or corner-stone god hath laid in sion , down you fall ; for now the ax is laid to the root of the trees . 2. enquiry . is not morality a civil and honest life , doing to all as you would be done unto , the ground or foundation of your hopes ? do you build upon this ? if it be so , tremble : remember christ saith , except a man be born again , he cannot see the kingdom of god. joh. 3. 3. if you have no other ground of hope , but from your own moral righteousness , when death comes with his ax , down you will go , and be cast into the fire . 3. consider , all you prophane and ungodly ones , what is that which bears your hopes up , what do you build upon ; is it not on the mere mercy of god , or death of christ : god ( say you ) is gracious , slow to anger , and we therefore have hopes , and do trust to that : christ dyed for sinners , &c. you say right , god is mercifull ; but what then , will you therefore presumptuously go on in ungodly and wicked courses , oh ! know he is just as well as gracious , and will in no wise clear the guilty . exod. 34. 7. except ye repent therefore , ye shall all likewise perish , luk. 13. 3. 5. shall the goodness of god , which should lead you to repentance be thus evilly improved ; i. e. to strengthen your hands , and encourage you to sin against him , and provoke him ? 't is i fear with you as solomon speaks . eccl. 8. 11. because sentance against an evil work is not executed speedily , therefore the hearts of the sons of men are fully set in them to do wickedly . christ 't is true , dyed for sinners , but you have no true faith in him , he dyed to save sinners from their sins , and that they might live to him . see my text , now the ax is laid to the root of the trees , if you believe not on christ , if you are not made new creatures , 1 cor. 5. 17. the ax will cut you down , and that with vengeance , and wrath will at last cast you into the fire : you must learn to know the way of salvation , and how the mercy of god shines forth in a mediator : christ hath satisfied his justice , and by him you must come to god out of christ , he is a consuming fire . abused mercy , o sinner ! will be turned at last into fury ; except you obtain an interest in jesus christ , you are undone ; for the wrath of god is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men , rom. 1. 3. or are you self-righteous persons ? do you build on your own righteousness , like the jews and hypocritical pharises ; you , may be , think your states good , because you are not swearers , drunkards , &c. may be , you read , pray , and hear sermons , and give to the poor , and do much good ; but if you build your hopes of heaven on these things ; down this ax will cut you also : except your righteousness exceed the righteousness of the scribes , and pharises , you shall in no wise enter into the kingdom of heaven , matth. 5. 20. nay , you must be found in the righteousness of christ , all ours is but dung , phil. 3. 8 , 9. you must in a word , bring forth good fruit , every soul of you , or perish , and this you cannot do , till your hearts are changed , and so you become good trees : make the tree good , and then the fruit will be good ; an evil tree cannot bring forth good fruit , &c. all works of unregenerate persons , yea their religious duties , are but dead works , not good fruits , nor can they bring forth good fruits , unless they are planted by faith into jesus christ : nay , i must tell you that gospel-holiness will not save us , it must be the righteousness of god by faith. sermon ii. mat. iii. 10. and now also the ax is laid to the root of the trees , every tree therefore that bringeth not forth good fruit ; is hewn down and cast into the fire . the proposition i am to prosecute , you may remember is this , considering the context , viz. now the dispensation is changed to be of the natural root or the seed of abraham according to the flesh , is no ground for church membership , or no argument to be admitted into the gospel church , or to gospel baptism . you say you have abraham to your father , or you are the children of believers , or you have believing parents : well , but what of this , ( as if john should say ) this will do you no good now , this will stand you now in no steed , this will give you no right to gospel ordinances , nor particularly to gospel baptism ; ' tho' it did to circumcision , and legal ordinances , and jewish church membership . for hager and her son are cast out , that are the old covenant , and the fleshly seed ; this old root and right , now in gospel days is struck at . the ax is laid to the roots of the trees , i. e. to your old standing on the old covenant root , as you are the lineal seed of abraham : the time is come now , that the old covenant , and covenant seed , are to be rooted up , the old house and constitution pulled down ; god is now about to build a new temple , and a more spiritual house , a spiritual temple of living stones ; and rather then he will want materials , he can of these stones raise up children unto believing abraham , and so make good the covenant of grace , or gospel covenant made with him : now you must be united to a living foundation , i. e. believe in christ , whose way i am come to prepare , and make ready fit matter for this new building , namely , the gospel church , which is not to be , by natural descent from abraham as such , but only those who have the faith of abraham ; yea , that faith he had not in circumcision , but in uncircumcision , or before he was circumcised . you must grow out of a spiritual root , i. e. be married to christ ( your first husband , i. e. the law or old covenant is just at the point of death ) that so ye may bring forth fruit to god , rom. 7. 4. but to proceed , i shall prove this proposition , viz. that the dispensation is now changed , to be of that natural root or national church of the jews , or the seed of abraham , according to the flesh , is no ground for church membership , no argument for admittance into the gospel church , or to gospel baptism . 1. because 't is positively said , that there is a change of the whole law , i. e. the levitical priesthood , legal ordinance , legal church , and legal church membership are changed and gone : that so the bettercovenant , and more spiritual church , and church membership might be established ; for the priesthood being changed , there is made of necessity , a change also of the law. heb. 7. 12. 't is so changed , as 't is abolished , to make way for this : ( as the late annotators observe , ) the mutation of the priesthood , indispensably requireth the change of the legal covenant , which hereafter i shall prove , was not the covenant of grace , but is directly called the old covenant ; the covenant of grace is but one , and that never changeth . this was made necessary by the decree of god ( as they note ) who determined , that both the priesthood and law should expire together like , ( say i , ) as an old will or testament doth , when the testator hath made and confirmed his last will and testament . when christ , the gospel high-priest , had ( saith our annotations ) in his own person and work , perfected all of it in heaven , he roots out that order of priesthood , and demolished the temple and city , to which he confined the administration , and scatters the people which would cleave to it ; so as all designs and endeavours of jews , or of apostate christian to repair or restore it , hath been ineffectual to this day . what can be more clear , sirs , then this ? that the old house , or right of church-membership , is overturned at the very root , for if the covenant , for incovenanting the fleshly seed is changed or abolished , and no new law or new precept is given forth for the bringing them in again , what ground is there left for any wise , seeing , and faithful man , to plead for infants church-membership ; but it is evident , the former is true , i. e. that covenant , by virtue of which , they had right to circumcision and church membership ; or out of which root that sprang is gone , changed , and abolished for ever , and no new law or precept is given forth , for the bringing them into the gospel-church , as such . to this text let me add another , which farther confirms it . 2. for if that first covenant had been faultless , then should no place have been sought for the second ; but finding fault with them , he saith , behold the days come , saith the lord , when i will make a new covenant with the house of israel , and the house of judah , heb. 8. 7 , 8. it was not faulty in it self , but holy , just , and good ; it requiring perfect righteousness of him that would be justified , and therefore , could not give life ; the creature being weak and unable to perform the requirements of it ; and therefore , paul saith , what the law could not do , in that it was weak , through the flesh , god sending his own son in likeness of sinful flesh , and for sin condemned sin in the flesh , rom. 8. 3. it discovers sin , and condemns for sin , but could not justifie the sinner in god's sight from sin : he that kept it not perfectly , yea continued not in doing all things written therein , was cursed by it : he that was circumcised , was bound to keep the whole law that rite obliged them , it seems to perform perfect obedience ; and yet some affirm , it was a precept of the gospel covenant ; but more of this by and by : but say some , was not circumsion a priviledge ? did it not profit them ? the apostle answers this question : for circumcision verily profiteth , if thou keep the law , but if thou be a breaker of the law , thy circumcision is made uncircumcision : see how the apostle brings in circumcision , vers 23. thou that makest thy boast of the law , through breaking the law , dishonourest thou god. he , it is evident , shews , that circumcision appertained to the law , to the old covenant , or covenant of works ; for circumcision profiteth if thou keep the law , &c. no profit , no advantage by circumcision , unless the circumcised keep the law ; that is , ( saith the late annotations ) perfectly , to which circumcision obligeth , gal 5. 5. now this being so , the first covenant being weak , and faulty , ( i. e. through the insufficiency and weakness of the creature , he being not able to answer its just demands ; god in his infinite mercy sent his own son , in our nature and stead , to fulfill the righteousness thereof ) he sought and found out the second covenant , and the first is gone , which brings me to the third proof of the point . 3. heb. 10. 9. he took away the first , that might establish the second . there is a first and second covenant , or an old , or a new , the first must not be confounded with the second , nor the second with the first , because quite different in their nature , design and end : the first covenant was made , 't is true , primarily with the first adam , and all mankind in him ; that was the first original , or beginning of it ; and then to him it did give life , whilst he stood by his obedience to it ; but that ministration of it , of which the apostle speaks , and calls the first covenant , was that which god gave to abraham's seed , according to the flesh , by moses . and to assure abraham , that unto his seed should be given that law , or the oracles of god , &c. he gave him the covenant or precept of circumcision , rom. 3. 1 , 2. it served as a pledge of the law , and obliged them to keep it ; therefore under this old covenant , or first covenant , 't is evident , came in circumcision , and the policy and national church of the jews , and all other legal and external rights and privileges whatsoever , both the national church and church-membership ; but when the root was struck at , i. e. the first covenant was took away , all its rights , laws , privileges and appurtenances whatsoever , went with it ; so that now we ( saith the apostle ) know no man after the flesh , 2. cor. 5. that is , we prefer or esteem no man better then others , upon the score of the first covenant , or fleshly privileges , i. e. being of the seed of abraham , or of the church of jews , old things being past away , and all things being become new , all types , sacrifices , priest , and priesthood , legal place of worship , legal time of worship , legal ministers , and legal maintenance of those ministers , the legal church , and legal church-membership , were all taken away , when the covenant was took away ; and thus the ax is laid to the root of the trees , by the establishing the gospel dispensation , the anti-type being come , and the heir come to full age , god deals with us now , no more , as with children in non-age ; but as with men who are come to knowledge and understanding . this i desire may be considered , that whatsoever was a type or shadow , did appertain to the old covenant ; and a great error or mistake 't is , for any to say , the shadows of the ceremonal law were gospel , because they pointed to the gospel ; which mistake i shall farther clear up hereafter , and proceed to the fourth proof . gal. 4. 30. cast out the bond-woman and her son. what is meant by the bond-women agar , and ishmael her son , you may see , if you read vers . 23 , 24 , 25. it is written , that abraham had two sons , the one by a bond-maid , the other by a free woman , vers . 22. but he , who was born of the bond-women , was born after the flesh ; but he of the free woman was by promise . by being born after the flesh , is opposed to him that was born by the promise , the meaning is ishmael ; tho' he was abraham's seed or son , according to the flesh , yet he was not his seed nor son according to the promise , or covenant of grace , god made with abraham . which things are an allegory ; for these are the two covenants , the one from mount sinai , which gendereth to bondage . ver . 24. an allegory , is that by which another thing or things are meant ; or it hath a mystical signification ; more is to be understood then is expressed litterally . i. e. agar held forth the first covenant god made with abraham's fleshly seed , and ishmael the children of the first covenant ; sarah signified the gospel , or the new covenant ; and isaac the children of the new covenant . nevertheless what saith the scripture ? cast out the bond-woman and her son ; for the son of the bond-woman shall not be heir with the son of the free woman . ver . 30. the drift and scope of the spirit of god in ●his place is ( as i conceive ) first , to shew that there were two covenan● made with abraham , ( which no doubt he himself , who is called the friend of god , well understood ) one with his natural seed as such ; the other with his spiritual seed as such . secondly , that the casting out of the bond-woman shews the abrogation of the first covenant , and all the external foederal and fleshly rights and privileges thereof , and the casting out of the seed of the bond-woman , shews the utter rooting out , and rejection of the external and political church-state of the jews . thirdly , that none of the fleshly seed as such , should be heirs and partakers with the true spiritual seed of abraham under the gospel , or have a being in abraham's true spiritual house or gospel church . these things being so , what reason there is for any to plead for infants church membership , by vertue of the covenant made with abraham , let all men consider . see heb. 8. 13. therefore from hence i argue , that whatsoever external rights or privileges the jews had under the old covenant , it signifies just nothing to us , under the dispensation of the gospel ; even no more then a legacy bequeathed in a former will , is pleadible , which is left out in the last will and testament , confirmed by the death of the testator . i would have all men consider , that whether there is any more ground for men from thence to plead for infant church-membership , then for others to plead for ministers to have the first fruits , and the tenths of every man's increase ; or for me to argue thus , every child of a christian is born a member of the christian church ; because under the law every child of the jews , were born members of their church ; ( and it must needs be so then , because theirs was a national church ; ) or for every ministers son to plead for a right to the ministry : for evident it is , that all the sons of the priests under the law , had a right to the priest-hood ; ( tho' they were not to enter into the ministry untill such an age : ) also particularly to dedicate all our first-born to the lord , because the jews were required so to do . nay , i may say more , by the covenant of circumcision abraham's natural off-spring had a right to possess the land of canaan : shall we from thence say , all our seed have an equal right to that promise ; if we could persuade our selves of this , we may think of another holy war , and get our seed their rightfull possession : the like , as touching our keeping their sabbath . lastly , and evident 't is , all that were circumcised had an undeniable right to eat the passover ( which they that assert circumcision was a type of baptism , say , also was a figure of the lord's supper ) and if so , then it follows by the same argument and parity of reason , all our children that are admitted to the ordinance of baptism , may , nay , must be also admitted to the ordinance of the lord's supper ( as indeed they were by the ancient fathers , who first brought in the practice of infant baptism , and so it continu'd for some hundred of years : see exod. 12. 45. all the whole family had a right to eat the passover , except foreigners , and hired servants . but in a word , the ax is laid to the root of the trees , all these jewish rights and privileges are gone with their national , external church state : for as the first covenant , i. e. the bond woman is cast out , so are all her children also . obj. how can this be , that the children of abraham , and so the children of believers , who are abraham's seed , should not have right to gospel privileges and baptism , seeing you cannot deny but that it was the covenant of grace that god made with abraham . answ. i have told you already , that there was two covenants made with abraham ; the covenant of grace was that covenant which is called the promise , which god made with him , and nothing can be more clear , then that the fleshly seed as such , ( tho' they proceeded from abraham's loins , ) were not concerned in that covenant or free promise of grace . 〈◊〉 since this is doubted of by some , and utterly denied by others , viz 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 was a two-fold covenant made with abraham , i shall endea 〈…〉 ke this very plain and evident , tho' indeed , what i have already sa 〈…〉 be sufficient to unprejudiced persons : but to proceed , i shall shew what promises and privileges appertained to the natural seed , as such , and what promises appertained to his true spiritual seed , and none else . first , i will begin with that covenant made with abraham's natural seed , as such , i never yet heard , but that the covenants take their denomination from the promises , and the promises are of two sorts , quite different in their nature , i. e. some domestick and civil promises , especially and absolutely respecting the house and natural seed of abraham and policy of israel . others only respecting those that are believers in christ , or evangelical ; belonging to them the gospel covenant belongeth . 1. the first that belonged to abraham's natural seed as such , that i shall mention , is that of his multiplying his natural seed by isaac . 2. the birth of isaac by sarah his wife , gen. 17. 16 , 19. 3. the continuation of his covenant , with all that should proceed from isaac , according to the flesh , gen. 17. 6. 4. the coming of christ out of isaac . 5. the bringing the natural seed of abraham , by isaac , out of egypt . 6. the promise of giving his natural seed the land of canaan for their possession , gen. 15. 8. now pray note two things : first , that as the covenant of grace bears the name of the promise of god , not a conditional , but an absolute promise ; so likewise say i , these promises , distinct from that free promise , contain the legal covenant made with abraham's natural seed . if you well mind the nature of these promises i have mentioned , you can't so much as once in the least imagine , any of them were made to his spiritual seed as such , i mean , that any of them do , or can concern us gentile believers . secondly , but to put the matter out of doubt , pray observe that the law of circumcision is expressly called gods covenant ; tho' i know some , to strengthen their bad cause , would have it be so called , only by a certain figure ; pray read gen. 17. and god said unto abraham , thou shalt keep my covenant , therefore thou and thy seed after thee , in their generations , vers . 9. this is my covenant which ye shall keep between me and you , and thy seed after thee , every male child among you shall be circumcised , vers . 10. and ye shall circumcise the flesh of your fore-skin , and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you : and that to this covenant was promised the land of canaan , 't is expressly said in vers . 8. and i will give unto thee , and to thy seed after thee , the land wherein thou art a stranger , all the land of canaan for an everlasting possession , and i will be their god. so in gen. 15. 8. in that same day god made a covenant with abram , ( not abraham ) saying , unto thy seed , have i given this land from the river of egypt , unto the great river euphrates . this covenant , and these promises i assert , cannot belong to the spiritual seed of abraham as such , but were blessings that belonged only to his carnal or natural seed , and directly agree with the covenant made with them by moses , viz. the land of canaan , riches , peace , plenty , and all other temporal and earthly blessings , if they kept god's covenant ( with their church state , and visible worship of god among them : ) now the new covenant it could not be , because that is established upon better promises , and no other people had any right to those outward blessings ; nor were they made only to the elect ones , who were of his natural off-spring , but to his fleshly seed as such , as well as they ; upon that condition , they kept the covenant of circumcision , and conformed themselves to the law god gave them , which they were obliged to do by the covenant of circumcision , as i shewed before . secondly , i shall now shew you , what those promises were , that respect the covenant of grace made with abraham , and his true spiritual seed , as such . 1. i have made thee a father of many nations , ( meaning gentile belie 〈…〉 2. in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed , gen. 12. 3. observe here what the apostle speaks , and the scripture foreseeing that god would justifie the heathen through faith , preached the gospel to abraham , saying , in thee shall all nations of the earth be blessed , gal. 3. 8. nay , and 't is for ever to be noted , that the holy apostle endeavours to do the very same thing in gal. 3. 16. which i am now about , viz. to prove , that the covenant of grace was not made with abraham's fleshly seed , as such ; read the text , now to abraham and to his seed was the promise made ; he saith , not to seeds , as of many ( meaning his fleshly seed , as such ) but to thy seed which is christ. and then in vers . 29. he concludes , and if ye be christ's , then are you abraham's seed , and heirs according to the promise . you must not reckon from abraham , but from christ : he must be blind that can't discern from hence , that there were two covenants made with abraham . compare these texts with that in rom. 9. 6 , 7 , 8. obj. but the jews might object ( they not seeing nor understanding this twofold covenant ) if we are rejected of god , and rooted out , god is unfaithfull and his promise made of none effect to abraham , and 't is his seed . 1. answ. the apostle answers , they are not all israel , which are of israel . vers . 6. 2. neither because they are the seed of abraham , are they all children , ver . 7. that is , though they be all the seed of abraham , according to the flesh , yet they are not all his spiritual seed , according to that covenant of grace made with abraham , all the true spiritual seed are the children of god , as isaac was , being begotten and brought forth as the product of almighty power , as fruit of god's free promise ; i will come , and sarah shall have a son : see the apostle's further answer , that is , they which are born after the flesh , these are not the children of god , but the children of the promise are counted for the seed , vers . 8. martin luther confirms the same great truth we contend for : paul therefore concludeth with this sentence ( saith he ) that they that are of faith , are the children of abraham ; that corporal birth , or carnal seed , make not the children of abraham before god ; as if he would say , there is none before god accounted as the child of abraham ( who is the servant of god , whom god hath chosen and made righteous by faith ) through carnal generation ; but such children must be given before god , as he was a father ; but he was a father of faith , was justified , and pleased god , not because he could beget children after the flesh , not because he had circumcision under the law , but because he believed in god. he therefore that will be a child of the believing abraham , must also himself believe , or else he is not a child of the elect ; the believing and the justified abraham , not the begetting abraham ; which is nothing else , but a man conceived , and born , and wrap'd in sin , without the forgiveness of sins , without faith , without the holy ghost , as another man is , and therefore condemned . such also , are the children carnally begotten of him , having nothing in them , like unto their father , but flesh and blood , sin and death ; therefore these are also damned : this glorious boasting then , we are the seed of abraham , is to no purpose . thus far luther , on gal. 3. p. 115. thus mr. perkins speaks also : the seed of abraham ( saith he ) is the seed , not of the flesh but of the promise ; and this seed is first christ , and then all that believe in christ ; for these are given to abraham by promise and election of god : moreover , the seed is not many ( as paul observeth ) but one . it is objected , that the word seed , is a name co-elective , and signifies the whole posterity of abraham . answ. it doth sometimes , ( saith he ) but not always ; for eve saith of seth , god hath given me another seed : again , ( he saith ) this one particular seed of abraham is christ jesus , here the name christ , first and principally the mediator , and then secondly , all jews and gentiles believing , that are fit and grafted into christ by faith : st. paul saith , the children of the flesh , those are not the children of god ; but the children of the promise , are the seed of abraham . thus mr. perkins . 2. now nothing is more evident then that by the promise is meant , the covenant of grace , the children of the promise , made with abraham , are children of the new covenant , and so generally owned by all , our true protestant writers ; and this promise or covenant we find , was only made with abraham's spiritual seed , as these two famous writers , and many more positively affirm . 3. yet also it is plain , there was a covenant made with abraham's natural seed , and that they were taken into an external , national church state , and covenant relation with god , and had divers peculiar immunities and privileges granted to them , as so considered ; all which fully evinces , that there was a two-fold covenant made with abraham : certainly none can suppose , but that their church state and legal rights were covenant blessings , and that they begun in abraham ; and that too , by those covenant transactings , god made him , is so clear , that nothing need to be said more unto it ; and i cannot but wonder that our eminent writers , should confound and jumble these two covenants together , as indeed i find generally they do . obj. but some will still object , that tho' this which i have said be granted , i. e. that there were two covenants made with abraham , yet say they , circumcision was a gospel covenant , or did appertain to the covenant of grace . answ. i answer , and positively affirm , that the covenant of circumcision was part of that legal , old , and external covenant , which is done away : and this in the next place i shall fully prove . 1. because the law , or covenant of circumcision , was , it appears , made in the design and end of it , to separate the natural seed of abraham in their national church , standing from all other nations of the world , and to give them the land of canaan , and to keep themselves pure , from mixing among the pople , from whom christ , according to the flesh was to come : and hence it was , that they were not to mingle themselves with the heathens , nor suffer any to join themselves to them , unless first circumcised . will any say that the covenant of grace , or gospel covenant , in the design of it , is to separate all true believers , and all their natural seed ( tho' some of them are the worst of men , i. e. vile and ungodly ) from all other people in the world , in a church state ? if they should affirm this , then the gospel church , for ever ceases to be congregational , but must be national as the jewish church was , which is contrary to the doctrine of the church of england ( whatever her practice is ) doth not she say , the church of god is a company of godly christians , among whom the word of god is truly preach'd , and the sacraments duely and truly administred ? and do not the godly independants say the same ? did christ ever , under the gospel , constitute any one nation , consisting of believers , and their carnal off-spring ( some godly , and some ungodly ) into a church ? read over the new testament , and see whether the direct contrary , is not apparent ; for they were only such , who believed were converted and professed faith in christ , and so were baptized , that were added to the church ; and of such only doth the gospel church consist . 2. but observe the other part of this argument , i. e. circumcision was a token to abraham's natural seed of god's giving unto them the land of canaan , see gen. 17. 7. and i will establish my covenant between me and thee , and thy seed after thee , in their generations , &c. and i will give unto thee , and to thy seed after thee , the land wherein thou art a stranger , all the land of canaan , &c. and ye shall circumcise the flesh of your fore-skin , and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you , vers . 11. the gospel covenant , the apostle tells us , is established upon better promises , not an earthly canaan , but heaven it self : what , tho' canaan was a type of heaven , that will not mend the matter , for then it follows that it belonged to the old typical and shadowing covenant : moreover , if that covenant was the gospel covenant , our children have an equal right to the land of canaan , with the natural seed of abraham ( as i said before ) and then how did that promise , viz. the possession of canaan belong then to the jews , as their peculiar right only . arg. 2. because there were some to whom the covenant of grace , or gospel covenant did not belong , were , nevertheless , commanded to be circumcised , as ishmael , esau , &c. doth the gospel covenant appertain to scoffing ishmaelites , and to prophane esau's ? no , god told abraham , his covenant should not be with ishmael . as for ishmael , i have heard thee , behold i have blessed him , but my covenant will i establish with isaac , gen. 17. 20 , 21. also , there were others who might be in abraham's family ; who , no doubt , might some of them be in the covenant of grace , that were not required to be circumcised , nor did it belong to them , viz. 1. all his male children , who dyed before eight days old . 2. all his female children . 3. there was also some other godly men , in the days of abraham , to whom circumcision of right did not belong , as melchisedec , lot , job , &c. doubtless , had circumcision been a law or precept of the covenant of grace , all these would god have required to have been circumcised as well as the others ; but the truth is , being in the covenant of grace , gave no right at all to any , no not to the male children of abraham , to circumcision ; but only god's express and positive command to him . arg. 3. 't is apparent , that the jews who were comprehended in that legal and external covenant , made with abraham's natural seed , and were accordingly circumcised , were nevertheless denyed gospel baptism , and their plea , we are abraham 's seed , was rejected by john baptist's . now had circumcision been a gospel-covenant , i see no reason why john should not admit them ; nay , and 't is plain also , that some godly ones of abraham's natural seed , who were circumcised , were nevertheless baptized . what , had they two seals of one and the same covenant ? for circumcision was in force at that time , when many of them were baptized ; for many subjected to that ordinance , before christ dyed , and abolished that rite with the old covenant . 1. from hence it appears , that circumcision was no gospel law , nor did it appertain to the covenant of grace ; but was part of the old legal covenant , which the ax was laid to the root of , and is gone . 2. it also follows from hence , that the covenant of grace , was not the adequate reason of circumcision , but the mere positive command of god to abraham , for the reasons and designs before-mentioned . from whence i argue thus , that covenant that was made with , or did of right belong unto the fleshly seed of abraham , as such , even to ungodly ones , as well as to the godly , was not the covenant of grace ; but the covenant or law of circumcision , was made with , or did of right belong unto the fleshly seed of abraham , as such , even unto ungodly ones , as well as to the godly : therefore the covenant of circumcision was not the covenant of grace . i have shewed you that circumcision did belong to ishmael and to esau , and to all isaac's natural seed , tho' ungodly , and to their male children also ; and i need not tell you what wicked men sprang from isaac's loins , according to the flesh , but let them be ungodly , and not have one dram of new covenant grace in them ; yet they were obliged to circumcise their male infants . this is enough ( one would think ) to convince our brethren , and all that differ from us , that circumcision did not appertain to the covenant of grace , or was no gospel covenant . also let them take heed ( who plead for pede-baptism , from the covenant of circumcision ) how they any more deny to baptize the children of ungodly parents , since the male infants of ungodly parents were circumcised . the truth is , it was not to be enquired , whether the parents were believers or not ? whether they had abraham's faith , or not ? were godly , or not , before their children were to be circumcised ? but were they the natural seed of abraham ? ( that was enough ) it was that according to the express and positive command of god to abraham , that gave their children , if males , a right to be circumcised . arg. 4. that circumcision was no gospel law , or covenant , appears yet further , because all in the gospel covenant , 't is expresly said , shall know the lord , jer. 31. 31. behold the days come , saith the lord , that i will make a new covenant with the house of israel , and with the house of judah , not according to the covenant that i made with their fathers , in the day that i took them out of the land of egypt ; which my covenant they break , although i was an husband to them , saith the lord. ver . 32. but this shall be the covenant that i will make with the house of israel after those days , saith the lord : i will put my law in their inward parts , and write it in their hearts , and i will be their god , and they shall be my people . ver . 33. and they shall teach no more every man his neighbour , and every man his brother , saying , know the lord : for they shall all know me from the least of them unto the greatest of them , saith the lord , &c. pray observe , in the old covenant infants were members , who did not ( when taken into that covenant , and made members of that legal church ) know the lord , nor indeed their right hand from their left . therefore they , when grown up , had need to be taught , saying , know the lord ; and thus , upon this account , every one had need to teach his neighbour and his brother ; but in the gospel covenant , god saith , it should not be thus , for that all , whom he would make that covenant with , should know him , before they were received as members of that church , tho' afterwards 't is granted , they stand in need of further teaching and in this respect , the gospel covenant , and gospel church state , differs , or is not according to the old legal and external covenant , and church state of the jews , as well as in other things ; that being a conditional covenant , the new covenant absolute , i will , and they shall , that was a covenant of works , this of grace , &c. they shall all know me from the least to the greatest ; not one infant then be sure is in it , as a member of the gospel church , they are now required to repent , to believe , to bring forth fruits meet for re●entance . they must be made disciples by teaching as appears by the great commission , mat. 28 , 19 , 20. before baptized ; who are to be members of the gospel church . arg. 5. the covenant of circumcision could not be the gospel covenant , because the terms of it runs according to the sinai covenant , which is said , not to be of faith , but ( 1 ) the man that doth those things should live in them , gal. 3. 22. ( 2 ) life was promised to obedience to it , and death threatned to disobedience . ( 3 ) the promise of the sinai covenant , was the land of canaan , riches , peace , and prosperity , to be blessed in the basket and store ; and so runs the covenant of circumcision , see gen. 17. 9 , 10 , 14. thou shalt keep my covenant , &c. and i will give unto thee , and to thy seed after thee , the land of canaan , &c. ver . 8. and the uncircumcised man-child , whose flesh of his fore-skin is not circumcised , that soul shall be cu● off from his people , he hath broken my covenant , ver . 14. thus ran the law and covenant of circumcision , it was life upon the condition of obedience , death upon disobedience , 't was do and live ; but thus runs not the terms of the new covenant , but directly contrarywise , believe , and thou shalt be saved , are the terms of the gospel covenant ; from whence i shall draw this argument . that covenant that was in the nature and quality of it , as much a covenant of works , as the sinai covenant , could not be the covenant of grace . but so was the law and covenant of circumcision . therefore circumcision was no gospel law or covenant . arg. 6. the covenant of circumcision was of the letter , and not of the spirit . this the apostle lays down , rom. 3. 29. but he is not a jew which is one outward ; and circumcision is that of the heart in the spirit , and not in the letter , whose praise is not of man but of god. doth he not clearly hereby intimate , that circumcision of the flesh was of the law , and not of the gospel ? for by letter , the law is meant , all expositors confess , in that paralell text , 2 cor. 5. who hath made us able ministers of the new testament , not of the letter but of the spirit , see our late worthy annotators , by the letter : here ( say they ) the apostle understandeth the law , or the law , is called the letter , rom. 2. 27. who by the letter and circumcision , doth transgress the law. the law ( say they ) in opposition to the gospel , is called the letter ; and again they say , the gospel is called the spirit , both in opposition to the carnal ordinances of the law , and because christ is the matter , subject , and argument of it . the law kills , but the gospel gives life ; yet some affirm , that law written in stones was the gospel , or a dark ministration of it : what law is it then that kills ? and what was the covenant of works , which as such is taken away ? but no more of that : here 't is plain , circumcision was not of the spirit , i. e. not of the gospel , but of the law. arg. 7. that covenant , in which faith was not reckoned to abraham for righteousness , was not the covenant of grace , or a gospel covenant : but the apostle shews us , that faith was not reckoned to abraham in circumcision , rom. 4. that faith was reckoned to abraham , for righteousness , vers 9. how then was it reckoned when he was in circumcision , or in uncircumcision , not in circumcision , but in uncircumcision ? ver . 10. what need was there for st. paul to argue thus against circumcision , if it were , as our brethren say , a gospel law , precept , or covenant ; and remarkable 't is , that the apostle puts , ( in this chapter ) the law and circumcision together , as being of one stamp , or of the same nature , and excludes them both from the free promise of god made to abraham , which i have shew'd was the pure gospel , or new covenant : reader , see mr. philip cory's solemn call , where thou wilt meet with this , and some other of these arguments largely opened , and his reply to mr. flavel , both worth thy reading . arg. 8. the law or covenant of circumcision , is ( as the said worthy writer observes ) contrary distinguished or opposed ) by the apostle , in rom. 4. ) to the covenant of faith , or gospel covenant , therefore could not be one , nor of the same nature , read 9 , 10 , 11 , 12 , 13 , and 14 , verse● . arg. 9. that covenant or precept that profited none , unless they kept the law , could not belong to the covenant of grace ; but so the apostle speaks of circumcision , for circumcision verily profiteth if thou keep the law , rom. 2. 25. that is , as i have observed , if thou keep the law perfectly , but if thou break the law , thy circumcision is made uncircumcision , that is of none effect . 't is strange to me that circumcision should be a gospel covenant , and yet not profit any , unless they perfectly kept the law , and also obliged them so to do , gal. 5. 3. could a man have perfectly kept the law of the old covenant , he might have thereby been justified in the sight of god , and then no need of a christ to have fulfilled the righteousness of it for us , and in our nature . — but doth a gospel precept oblige any to the perfect keeping of the whole law : how then could this be a gospel precept ? o see how the law and circumcision agree , and comport together in their nature , end , use and design , and never plead for it as a gospel precept any more , unless you have a mind to bring your selves and children under the old covenant , and the curse thereof ; compare this with gal. 5. 3. for i testifie to every man among you that is circumcised , that he is a debtor to do the whole law . not as a late writer says in his opinion , or in his intention that was circumcised , that he was such a debtor : for it may be justly doubted , whether they so thought or not : nay , by the apostle's words it seems otherwise , i. e. they did not think any such thing ( tho' they might seek to be justified by the law , and circumcision , yet not that they thought themselves obliged to keep the whole law perfectly ) but they who were circumcised , were verily obliged by circumcision , to do the whole law , when circumcision was in force . whatsoever mr. john flavel hath said in his late book to the contrary , notwithstanding , in answer to mr. cary : and indeed , the annotators agree with us herein ; thus i find they express themselves . object . but did not the fathers then , by being circumcised , acknowledge themselves debtors to the law. answ. yes , they did acknowledge themselves bound to the observation of the law , and to endure ( upon the breaking of it ) the curse of it , but they were discharged from this obligation , by believing in the lord , jesus christ , who was made a curse for them . arg. 10. the covenant of circumcision could not belong to the gospel covenant , because 't is called , in express terms , a yoke of bondage , act. 15. 10. gal. 5. 1 , 2. now therefore why tempt ye god to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples , which neither our fathers , nor we , were able to bear . i wonder any should call circumcision a privilege ; the yoke was circumcision , which those false teachers would have put on men , who were believers among the gentiles ; see vers . 1. if the jews had any profit , advantage or privilege by it , it was chiefly , because unto them were committed the oracles of god , or ten commandments , not chiefly , because unto them was given the covenant of grace ; for had it been a gospel covenant , or a rite thereof ( as our mistaken opposers affirm ) he would have said so ; see his words , what advantage then hath the jew ? and what profit is there in circumcision , rom. 3. 1. much every way , but chiefly , because unto them were committed the oracles of god , ver . 2. it did not seal to them the covenant of grace , nor assure them of the blessings thereof ; for so a seal doth all the blessings and privileges of that covenant , to which it is prefix'd , but the direct contrary , i. e. it assur'd them , that they should have the law given to them ; the oracles of god , i. e. the sinai covenant , which law shewed them what a kind of righteousness it was , god did require of all men that would be justified in god's sight ; it was not given to them to give life , or righteousness , but to shew the exceeding sinfulness of sin , and to regulate their lives , to put a curb upon their lusts so hateful to god ; as also , to discover unto them , that nothing short of a perfect and compleat righteousness , could justifie the creature in the sight of god ; and so the law , through the weakness of the flesh , lay'd all men under death and condemnation , exacting hard service , but gave no strength to perform its demands ; it killed , but could not give life : and therefore , as it was a covenant of works , ( do this and live , or the man that doth these things shall live in them ) which christ abolished it by the blood of his cross. and since it appears by what the apostle says , that circumcision obliged ( while it was in force ) to do all the whole law , which he that did not so do , was cursed by it ; 't is evident , that instead of its being a covenant of grace , or the seal thereof , it rather sealed the curses of the law upon them , for their disobedience ; and therefore , such a yoke of bondage , which they nor their fathers were able to bear . circumcision , it appears then , was an earnest to abraham's natural seed of the sinai covenant ; which law was , ( 't is evident comprehended as a covenant of works ) in circumcision , and so circumcision was a part or branch of it ; god then , and at that time , taking his natural seed into an external covenant relation with himself , was thereby , in his wisdom , obliged to give the said law in tables of stone to them , for the reasons , use and end , befo●e mentioned ; and as 't is by our apostle frequently in his epistles hinted , the apostle ( as a learned writer observes ) doth not here begin a discourse , nor to the number of privileges and advantages ; for he names but one in all , but to the quality of this privilege , viz. that it was not an evangelical , or gospel privilege , but only a legal or old covenant rite and privilege ; this is the chief of all the advantages the jews had by circumcision , i. e. there having thereby an assurance , that the law of god , on mount sinai , should be given to them : so much as to the proof and demonstration , that circumcision was no gospel-precept , or covenant . obj. but , perhaps , some may object , if infants as such , were not included in the covenant of grace god made with abraham , how can dying infants be saved ? 1. answ. i answer , must infants of believers be comprehended in that covenant god made with abraham ? or else , cannot any dying infants be saved ? how then were any dying infants saved before abraham's days , or before that covenant was made with him ? 2. i never said no infants were included in the covenant of grace , god made with abraham , but not as such : no doubt , all elect persons , both infants and the adult , were included in the covenant of grace , and had or shall have the blessings of christ's blood and merits ; but the covenant of grace may be considered two manner of ways , or under a two-fold consideration . 1st . the inward invisible blessings , grace , and privileges of it . 2d . the visible and outward administration , or privileges thereof . 1. now who they be , that are comprehended , or included in the inward , and invisible blessings , grace and privileges of it , are only known to god , not to us : but the gospel , or covenant of grace , as to the outward administration , and privileges thereof , only belong to such who know the lord , or profess faith in jesus christ ; and therefore , all that have a right to baptism , and gospel church membership , must first be made disciples , by being taught by the word and spirit of god , and so truly believe in the lord jesus christ , according to the great commission of our saviour , mat. 28. 19 , 20. and the practice of christ himself , joh. 4. 1 , 2. and of his apostles , act. 2. 37. act. 8. 14 , &c. act. 10. and act. 16 , &c. god hath many ways ( as dr. taylor observes ) to save dying infants , which we know not ; he can apply the benefit , and merits of christ's blood to them , in ways we are wholly ignorant of , and ought not to trouble our selves with it : secret things belong to god , but revealed things to us , and to our children . 3. but if we did know which infants would dye , who do belong to the election of grace , or are in covenant with god , yet we ought not to baptize them , because we have no command from jesus christ , so to do ; for it was not the right of infants to be circumcised , because they were in the covenant of grace ( for then all other godly mens children , who lived in abraham's days , would have had the same right that abraham's children had ; nor was it the right of abraham's infants ( whether considered as his natural seed , or spiritual seed , as such ) but it was their right only . by that mere express and positive command of god , to abraham , it was , that , i say , gave all his male infants a right to circumcision , and nothing else : now baptism is also a mere positive precept , as circumcision was then , — therefore none have a right thereto , but such whom christ commands to be baptized , namely believers ; was abraham's females , or his males , under eight days old , circumcised ? or , had they any right unto it , tho' they might be in the covenant of grace ? 11thly , all those that were in the covenant of grace , god made with abraham , had thereby an undoubted right to all the blessings of the said covenant , and also had the privileges , and blessings thereof , by the spirit of god sealed to them , and were made sure of eternal life ; but all those that were in the covenant of circumcision , god made with abraham , or were circumcised , had not , thereby , an undoubted right to all the blessings of the said covenant ; nor had they the privileges , and blessings thereof sealed to them , nor was eternal life made sure to them thereby : therefore , the covenant of circumcision was not the covenant of grace , nor the seal thereof . the major is clear from rom. 4. 16. therefore it is of faith , that it might be by grace , to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed . what seed doth the apostle mean ? certainly all abraham's seed , that the covenant of grace was made with ; and none will deny , but that the promise here comprehends all the blessings and privileges of the covenant of grace ; compare this with that in heb. 6. for , when god made promise to abraham , because he could not swear by no greater , he swear by himself , ver . 13. saying , surely blessing , i will bless thee ; and multiplying , i will multiply thee , ver . 14. and so after he had patiently endured , he obtained the promise , ver . 15. for men verily swear by the greater , and an oath of confirmation , is to them an end of all strife , ver . 16. wherein god is willing , more abundantly , to shew unto the heirs of promise , the immutability of his counsel , confirmed it by an oath , ver . 17. the promise here referrs to the promise , or covenant of grace made with abraham , and 't is as sure to all his seed comprehended in that same covenant , as possibly can be ; the very oath of god is added , besides his faithful word to confirm it ; as to the minor , sure none can dream , that ishmael , or esau , or the ungodly jews that sprung from 〈◊〉 loyns , in their generations , till christ came , had undoubted right to , and interest in all the blessings and privileges of the covenant of grace ; or eternal life , made sure to them : do not we read that some of them were called sons of belial ? and of some of them ( our saviour saith ) they were of their father , the devil . 12thly , all those that were in the covenant of grace , god made with abraham , had thereby a sure and strong ground of consolation , that is , spiritual consolation ; but many of them 〈◊〉 were comprehended in the covenant of circumcision , had not thereby a sure and strong ground of consolation , that is , spiritual consolation , therefore , the covenant of circumcision , was not the covenant of grace ; see heb. 6. 18. that by two immutable things , in which it was impossible for god to lye , we might have strange consolation , who have fled for refuge , to lay hold upon the hope set before us ; which hope we have , as the anchor of the soul both sure and stedfast , and which entereth into that within the veil . now certainly , no man can think , all that the covenant of circumcision did belong unto , had such sure and strong ground of consolation thereby ; for ishmael had none , esau had none , and multitudes more of abraham's natural seed . application . first , i may infer from hence , that they who bring infants of believers into the gospel covenant , or gospel church , err exceedingly , and are severely to be reprehended , there being not the least shadow of ground , for their practice herein from the covenant god made with abraham , secondly , it also appears from hence , that the main pillar of infants baptism , is rooted up , the ax is laid to the root of the trees , the external or natural off-spring of abraham , or by descent from an external faedoral , or covenant relation to him ; or as they are the carnal off-spring of believers . thirdly , from hence also i inferr , that the children of believing gentiles , as such , are not the seed of abraham , to whom the covenant of grace was made : nay , let me tell you , that it appears from hence , that the children of believing gentiles as such , are neither the natural seed of abraham , nor his spiritual seed ; which to open yet more fully , let us now consider all the distinct sorts of abraham's seed , which , i find , were fourfold . 1. christ , personally considered to abraham and his seed , was the promise made , he saith , not as of seeds as to many , but as of one , and to thy seed which is christ , gal. 3. 16. now as the promise referrs to christ , so the infants of believing gentiles , all will say are not abraham's seed . 2. all the elect , or whole body of believers , who have the faith of abraham , and walk in the steps of abraham , these are called abraham's seed : now none can be so blind , as once to suppose , the children of believing gentiles as such , are the seed of abraham . can infants believe in god , as abraham did ? or , can they walk in his steps ? or , which is more , are their natural off-spring as such , of the election of grace ? doth it appear so ? or , doth it not appear , to the contrary ? viz. do not many of their seed prove wicked and ungodly persons , and so liveand dye ? certainly , were they all as such elected , they should be all converted , we are chosen to be holy , &c. eph. 14. 4. and if you be christ's , then are you abraham 's seed and heirs according to the promise , gal. 3. 29. 3. there was another i. e. a natural seed of abraham , to whom the promise was made ; and that was isaac , gen. 21. 22. but the children of believing gentiles as such , or as so considered , are not isaac in that respect , they cannot be the seed of abraham ; isaac was begotten of abraham's natural body according to the flesh , and all spiritual isaac's are regenerated persons . gal. 4. 28. 4. we read yet of another natural seed of abraham , to whom the promise of grace did not belong , as ishmael , and the sons of keturah , gen. 15. 5. but as they were the seed of abraham , none will say the children of beliving gentiles are the seed of abraham : now i affirm , that there is no mention made of any other seed of abraham but these four sorts , if any man can shew a fifth sort , let him : from hence i shall again draw this argument , viz. if the children of the believing gentiles as such , are not the natural seed of abraham , nor the spiritual seed of abraham ; then they can have no right as such to baptism , nor to church-membership by vertue of being abraham's seed : nor are they any ways as such , concerned in that covenant-transaction god made with abraham ; but the children of believing gentiles as such are not the natural seed of abraham , nor the spiritual covenant of abraham : therefore they can have no right as such to baptism , nor to church-membership , by vertue of abraham's covenant ; nor are they any ways concerned in that covenant-transaction god made with abraham . obj. the athenian society in p. 2. of their athenian gazette affirm , that the children of believing gentiles are the spiritual seed of abraham , until by actual sin unrepented of , they are otherwise . answ. to which i answer , ( as i have once already ) that then some of the true spiritual seed of abraham may eternally perish ; for certainly , many children of believers , who when they grow up , proving to be prophane , unbelieving and impenitent persons , and so live and dye , are eternally lost . 1. which if so , the covenant of grace is not so well ordered in all things , and sure , as we believe it is , and the scripture proves it is . 2. 't is also directly contrary to what st. paul positively affirms in rom. 4. 16. therefore it is of faith , that it might be by grace , to the end , the promise might be sure to all the seed , not to that which is of the law , but to that which is of the faith of abraham , who is the father of us all . if this be well consider'd , the plea for our infants , as such , being abraham's , seed is gone for ever : for i from hence argue again , that all that are in that gospel covenant god made with abraham , or are his spiritual seed have the promise of eternal life sure to them : but all the seed of believing gentiles , as such , have not the promise of eternal life sure to them , therefore the children of believing gentiles as such , are not the spiritual seed of abraham . 3. all that are in the covenant of grace , i mean all the true spiritual seed of abraham , have the faith of abraham , and walk in the steps of abraham , and have also all the privileges of the gospel covenant god made with him ; but so have not the natural seed of believing gentiles as such , nor are they by birth , i. e. by being born of believing parents in a better condition than others as such , being all being born in sin , and in the covenant of works : indeed if believers children as such , were in covenant as soon as begotten or born , then they are born in the covenant of grace ; and if so , not the children of wrath by nature , and if in the covenant of grace , then their state is good enough without baptism ; nor doth baptism bring them into it , and if they say as some do , that the children are brought into the covenant of grace by baptism , and so made the children of god , members of christ , and inheritors of the kingdom of heaven , then it follows , they had it not by vertue of being in covenant with their parents ; and then also it would follow , that 't is in the power of men and women to bring their children into the covenant of grace , or keep them out of it ; and so through negligence or ignorance , the parents may damn their children ; and others have power to save theirs , by getting a minister to baptise them . but if they do not suppose their seed as such , are indeed , truly and really in the covenant of grace , what signifies that which they call the covenant , to whom the blessing of the covenant do not belong ? and if it seals not the blessings of the covenant , what doth it seal , or what spiritual advantage do their children receive thereby ? either they have the internal blessings or privileges sealed to them , or else the external privileges thereof , or none at all : now i can't believe they judge they have right ( as such ) to the internal blessings and privileges , for then they must all be saved ; unless those to whom the promise is sure , ( it being confirmed by the oath of god ) may eternally perish ; i know they whom i have to do with , are averse to the doctrine of falling from grace . and if it seals the external privileges of the covenant to them , why are they denyed those privileges ? is not breaking of bread , and church-fellowship , the chief external privileges of the gospel-church ? we know as to bearing the word , prayers of the church , our children enjoy those privileges as far forth , as theirs ; besides , if they be not absolutely in the covenant , but only conditionally i. e. if they believe they shall , &c. even what is that more than what the children of unbelievers have ? shall not they be received into the covenant also , if they believe , and close in with christ ? i cannot learn , that they can inform us of any benefit their children above ours have , who are not baptised , ( or other mens ) by their baptism ; or as they are their seed as such ; tho' 't is evident abraham's natural seed had a right to many external privileges under that dispensation as such ; but i shall now proceed to answer some grand objection made against what i have said . obj. 1. the first is this , viz. there is an exact parallel or parity betwixt circumcision and baptism ; therefore as jewish infants were circumcised , so the children of christian gentiles may be baptised ; thus they argue . ans. i must deny that there is such a parity , or clear parallel , as they intimate between circumcision and baptism ; but if there were , yet the argument is good for nothing : but to prove the first , i. e. and that there is no such parity , but in most things a disparity , will now clearly be evinced . 1. circumcision was a shadow of christ to come , by whom we receive the great antitype of circumcision , i. e. the circumcision of the heart , col. 2. 12 , 13. baptism is a sign that christ is already come ; d●ad , bury'd , and rais'd again . 2. circumcision was a sign of the covenant with abraham's natural seed , above all other nations , and a token to them of many external blessings and privileges : baptism is a sign of the inward and peculiar graces of the spirit the person baptized hath received , if a true subject of that holy ordinance . 3. circumcision only belonged to abraham's male children : baptism belongs to all that believe truly in christ , both males and females , who are all one in christ jesus , no difference in that respect , under the gospel-covenant . 4. circumcision belongeth neither to no male children , but those born in abraham's house , or such who were bought with his money , &c. it did not belong to any other godly man's male children that lived in his days , unless they joyned themselves to his family ; but baptism belongs to all the disciples of christ , or to all true believers in all nations , mat. 28. 19. 20. 5. circumcision was to be done precisely on the eighth day , not before nor after . but baptism is to be done at any time , and is not limited to any precise day . 6. circumcision made a visible impression on the body , which the party might perceive when he came to age of understanding . baptism leaves no impression on the body . 7. circumcision signified the taking away the sins of the flesh , ( or the circumcision of the heart ) baptism signifies the death , burial and resurrection of christ , which circumcision did not . what parity or parallel there is between them , i know not , unless they say that circumcision was the initiating rite under the law , and baptism is the initiating rite under the gospel ; to which i answer , if this should be granted , yet it did not initiate any but male children ; the females were initiated without it , and by the same parity of reason , as dr. taylor observes , no female infant should be baptized , because none but males were circumcised . if they say there is another parity , viz. none were to eat the passover , but those who were circumcised ; so none are to partake of the lord's supper , but such who are first baptized ( we are all baptized into one body , ) yet i must tell them , all those who are circumcised , had a right to eat the passover , and why do they not then follow the paralell and give their children the lord's supper ? as indeed , the first ancient fathers did ( in the declining state of the church ) for many years , they gave children the lord's supper , abusing that text , in the case of baptism , joh. 3. 5. unless a man be born again of water , and of the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven : they taking water there , to be meant of baptismal water , and thought baptism , did regenerate the children , and wash away original sin ; and accordingly , they abused ( and mistook ) that text , in joh. 6. 53. unless ye eat the flesh of the son of man , and drink his blood , ye have no life in you ; and from hence 't was , they gave infants the lord's supper , thinking ( as the papists do ) that our saviour intended the sacrament of the supper . i needed not have repeated these things , and that which follows , but that mr. roth-well of sussex , in his late treatise , still insists on this argument : you have the same in my answer to mr. burket . to this i might add a word or two of a reverend and learned person of our perswasion in this matter , they suppose baptism came in , or succeeded in the place , or room of circumcision ; which may ( saith he ) be understood many ways , as first , that those persons may be baptized , that were heretofore circumcised by god's appointment : and , in this sence , the argument must proceed , if it conclude , to the purpose ; but in this sence it is false , for females were not circumcised , which yet were baptized , act. 8. 12 , 13 , 14. and chap. 16. 14 , 15. and believers out of abraham's house , as lot , melchisedec , job , were not to be circumcised , but believing gentiles are universally to be baptized . 2. ( saith he ) it may be understood , as if the rite of baptism then began , when the rite of circumcision did , or was to end ; but this is not to be said neither ; for john baptist , and christ's disciples , baptized before circumcision , of right , ceased , joh. 4. 1. 2. 3. he answers , that of baptism , succeeding in the place of circumcision in signification ; which , as we have shewed in several respects , it doth not . but secondly , ( as i said ) if there were such a parity , or paralell , between circumcision and baptism , as they intimate , yet it would not do their business ; but thus to argue , as the said learned writer observes , may be very pernitious . for , ( saith he ) indeed if this argument be not warily , and restrainedly understood , an egg is laid , out of which manifest judaism , may be hatched ; but if it be taken restrainedly , it no more follows thence ; but baptism and circumcision , in some things , hold forth the same , which is more plainly said of noah's ark , 1. pet. 3. 22. and the red sea , and cloud , 1. cor. 10. 4. and yet we do not say , baptism succeeded into their place ; much less do we inferr any rite to be instituted in their stead , respecting the same person ; yea verily , it is to be seriously thought on . 1. that by such arguments , drawn from analogies , not conceived by the holy ghost , but drawn out of our wit ; a new kind of instituting r●tes , ( to wit from analogies , ) are brought in ; besides , our lord's precepts , and the apostles examples . 2. this being once said , by a like parity of reason and arguing , it will be lawful to bring into the church , under other names and forms , the whole burthen of jewish rites ; yea , almost out of what you will , to conclude what you will ; for , who shall put a bound to men's feigning analogies , when they go beyond the lord's precepts , and the apostles examples ? it is well known , that the divine appointment of tythes to be paid , and many other things , in the writings of divines , are asserted by this kind of argument ; besides , the rule of christ's precepts , and his apostles examples . 3. hereby will the opinion of the papists be confirmed , who affirm , from 1. cor. 10. 11. the sacraments of the jews , to be types of the sacraments of christians , which is rejected by divines , that dispute against bellarmine . 4. this manner of arguing , will countenance the arguments of the papists , for an universal bishop , because the jews had a high-priest , and justifie a linnen garment at mass , because there was such among the jews ; and for holy-water , purification of women , easter , penticoast , and many more such ceremonies , for which the papists do , in like manner , argue , as appears out of durandus's rationals , and other interpreters : yea , what hinders , but we may give children the lord's-supper , if we argue this way , since samuel , jesus christ , under age , were partakers of the passover ? and , of right , all males were thrice in the year to appear before the lord ; and therefore , it is certain they did eat the passover , &c. least any should take this for a light suggestion , i will add , that grave , godly , and learned men , have often warned , that we are to take heed , that we do not rashly frame arguments from analogies : among others , in their learned writings , in english , john pagit , in his defence of church-government , part 1. chap. 3. pag. 8. and else-where . john ball , in his reply to the answer of the new-england elders nine positions . posit . 2. p. 14. lastly , ( saith he ) it is to be considered , again and again , how by these argumentations , the consciences of men may be freed from the danger of will-worship , and polluting so remarkable an ordinance of christ , as baptism is ; especially this care lies on them , who by prayers , sermons , writings , covenants , and oaths , do deter christians from humane invention , in god's worship diligently , and 't is to be hoped sincerely : thus far this reverend divine . i now might proceed to answer divers others objections , as first , circumcision was a type of baptism . [ 2. ] infants were once in covenant , and never cast out . [ 3. ] circumcision was part of the ceremonial law , which was dedicated by blood ; therefore , no part of the covenant of works , or old covenant . [ 4. ] in circumcision god gave himself to abraham , to be his god , and the god of his seed . [ 5. ] circumcision was the seal of the righteousness of faith. [ 6. ] circumcision was an everlasting covenant . [ 7. ] there is but one covenant of works , and that was made with adam ▪ [ 8. ] paul circumcised timothy , therefore circumcision could not , in it self , oblige to the keeping of the whole law. [ 9 ] the root is holy , therefore the branches . [ 10. ] the privileges of the gospel are restrained , and narrower then the privileges of the law , if children are excluded . [ 11. ] the denying infant baptism , hinders the progress of the christian religion , mr. rothwell , p. 2. finis . the second part is in the press . the pædo-baptists apology for the baptized churches shewing the invalidity of the strongest grounds for infant baptism out of the works of the learned assertors of that tenent, and that the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins is a duty incumbent upon all sinners who come orderly to the profession of christianity : also the promise of the spirit [b]eing the substance of a sermon on i cor. 12, i, to which is added a post-script out of the works of dr. jer. taylor in defence of imposition of hands as a never failing ministery / by tho. grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. 1671 approx. 118 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 60 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2009-03 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a41783 wing g1541 estc r39521 18425811 ocm 18425811 107603 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a41783) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 107603) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1634:5) the pædo-baptists apology for the baptized churches shewing the invalidity of the strongest grounds for infant baptism out of the works of the learned assertors of that tenent, and that the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins is a duty incumbent upon all sinners who come orderly to the profession of christianity : also the promise of the spirit [b]eing the substance of a sermon on i cor. 12, i, to which is added a post-script out of the works of dr. jer. taylor in defence of imposition of hands as a never failing ministery / by tho. grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. taylor, jeremy, 1613-1667. [6], 112 p. s.n.], [london : 1671. place of publication suggested by wing. imperfect: cropped, tightly bound and slightly faded with some loss of print. reproduction of original in the british library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng bible. -n.t. -corinthians, 1st, xii, 1 -sermons. infant baptism. baptists -apologetic works. imposition of hands. 2007-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-11 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2008-02 john latta sampled and proofread 2008-02 john latta text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-09 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the paedo-baptists apology for the baptized churches , shewing the invalidity of the strongest grounds for infant baptism out of the works of the learned assertors of that tenent . and that the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins is a duty incumbent upon all sinners who come orderly to the profession of christianity . also the promise of the spirit ●eing the substance of a sermon on 1 cor. 12. 1. to which is added a post-script . out of the works of dr. jer. taylor in defence of imposition of hands as a never failing ministery . by tho. grantham . mr. perkins on gal. 3. 27. baptism alone is no mark of gods child , but baptism joyned with faith , for so must the text be consideres . all the galations that believe are baptized into christ . printed in the year . 1671. to the reader . friend , i have a few things to say before thou read this ensuing apology , and first , the occasion of it is from the late unkind usages which the baptized churches have received from the paedo-baptists , by violently dispersing their assemblies , by defacing and taking away their meeting places , by imprisoning their persons , seizing and wasting their estates , by injuring them in their trade by means of excommunications , by writs de capiendo and other penall proceedings both confining their persons and exposing them to great inconveniencies . and all this only ( as i conceive for their conscionable observance of the will of god in preaching the gospel to sinners ●●r the obedience of faith , and for adhearing to that form of doctrine once deli●ered to the saints heb. 6. 1 , 2. in which doct●ine and sufferings being through the mercy of god a pertaker with them , i thought i might lawsully write an apology for them , or at least for the truth professed by them . and that i might the ●ore effectually do this i chose to speak ●o their advers●ries by the learned ●ens of their own doctors . 2. my design in writing this apo●ogy , is to abate ( if it may be ) that great enmity which hath appeared generally between the parties concerned ; and more perticularly that spirit of opposition and disresp●ct which too much appears in the more refined sort of the paedo-baptists , against such as labor to reform ( or rather to restore ) the doctrine of baptism , to its first integrity and estimation among all that profess the name of our lord jesus christ , under what epethets or den●minations soever . and me thinks th● truth should prevail with all that do consider the authority and force thereof to be such that men are constrained ( as it were to speak for it though to the overthrow of their dearest errours , so that we may say their rock is net as our rock , our enemies being judges . 3. i have not injured the sense of my authours , and where i have added any thing for explycation of any word or passage , i have distingushed the same partly by a different letter , and partly by this character [ ] nor have i said much in the apology , as indeed it was not necessary , considering the evidence of the word of god for us , and the record which our opposers do bear in favour of our cause ; and beside they that will may see what may be further said in the case depending , if they please to peruse the learned works of those of our way , viz. denn his answer to dr. featley , tombs , his antipaedo-baptist , fisher his christianismus rediv●vous , and many others . 4. the second part intitled of the promise of the spirit , i though fit to be annexed , because acts 2. 38 , 39. such as are baptized with the baptism of repentance for remission of fins , have the promise of the spirit made to them , which being sought for in the way ordained of god , shall be received according to his will for he is faithfull that promised . thy servant in christ , tho. grantham , the paedo baptists apologie for the baptized churches , &c. there is no point of the christian faith , of greater importance in order to the composure of divisions among such as conscientiously profess the name of christ , then the doctrine of holy baptisme , in the name of jesus christ for the remission of sins ; for as many as have been baptixed into christ have put on christ . and where this foundation truth hath been neglected or essentially corrupted , there hath ensued great disorder in religion , because the being of the church ( as visible ) is so concern'd therein , that there can be no orderly proceeding in any church act , nor participation in any church priviledge , where sacred baptisme is not antecedent . and though reformation ( or rather the restoration ) of this truth be hard to accomplish , yet must we not be discouraged , but still pursue all lawful and probable wayes to effect it in this , as well as in other cases . and the way which i have chosen to help on this needful work at this time is to shew , that ( notwithstanding the discord in point of practice , yet ) there is a very great concord in doctrine , touching the main questions which concern this heavenly institution , between the paedo-baptists , and the baptized churces . the questions are these . 1. what are the qualifications required of all such as are to be bapt●zed . 2. what is the aue act or right form to be observed and done in this solemn rite of baptisme . touching the first , the doctrine of the baptized churches is well known , namely , that repentance toward god , and faith towards our lord jesus christ are prerequisites to the baptisme of every sinner . and to this agrees the holy scripture with full consent , ●aying , repent and be baptized every one of you . they were all baptized confessing their sins . when they beleived philip preaching the things concerning the kingdome of god &c. they were baptized both men and women , many of the corinthians hearing , believe'd and were baptised . and hence this holy ordinance is well called the laver of regeneration ; the baptisme of repentance , fo●th● r●mis●ion of sins . now let us hear the doctrine of the paedo-baptists touching this question . 1. the church of england both in her articles and vulgar catechism , delivers her mind clearly to this purpose , that such repentance whereby sin is forsaken , and such faith as by which the promises of god are stedfastly beleived , is required of persons ( meaning all persons ) which are to be baptized , and that in baptism faith is confirmed &c. 2. m● . perkins ) a learned son of ●he same church ) upon these words , ●each all nations baptizeing them . saith , i explain the words thus ▪ ( mark , first of all it is said teach them , that is make them my disciples by calling them to believe , and to repent . here we are to consider , the order which god observes in makeing with man the covenant in baptism , first of all he calls them by his word and commands them to beleive and repent , then in the second place god makes his promise of mercy and forgiveness ▪ and thirdly he feals his promise by baptism — they that know not , nor consider this order which god used in covenanting with them in bapti●m deal preprosterously , oversliping the commandment of repenting and b●leiving — this is the cause of of so much profaneness in the world — we see what is done in baptism , the covenant of grace is solemniz'd between god and the party baptized , and in this covenant something ▪ belongs to god , some to the party baptized , the actions of the party baptized is a certain stipulation , or obligation , whereby he bindeth himself to give homage to the father , son , and holy ghost . this homage standeth in faith , whereby all the promises of god are beleieved , and in obedience to all his commandements . the sign of this obligation , is that the party baptized willingly yeilds himself to be washed with water . 3. diodate on the same text , teaches that baptism is a sacrament of grace in remission and expiation of sins , and regeneration to a new life . and likewise for a token that they are bound on there side ( meaning such as are baptized ) to consecrate themse●ves to god , and to give themselves over to the conduct of 〈◊〉 spirit , and to confesse his name perpetually . [ thus these three witnesses do concurre with the truth and therein do hold a concord with the baptized churches . and one would think there should now be no place for such a conceit , as that infants are fit subjects for the sacred ordinance of baptism , because wholly uncapable of these qualifications . now whereas div●r● things are pretended as grounds for infant baptism , we shall briefly recount the particulars which are chiefly insisted on , and then show how the same are refelled or made void by some of the most learned asserters of paedo-baptism . the grounds pretended are these . 1. the covenant which god made with abraham and his seed , gen. 17. who were to be circumcised ( to wit the makes only ) in their infancy , this is thought to be a type of baptism , and hence 't is conceived that infants ought ●o be baptized . 2. christs permi●●ing infants to be brought to him , as persons to whom the kingdome belongs . 3. they being tainted with original sin , must be cleansed from it , which is supposed to be done by baptism . 4. because it is said except a man be born of water &c. he cannot enter into the kingdome of god. john 3. 5. because infants do not ponere obicem , and so are more fit for baptism then adult persons , as 't is thought . 6. because without baptism parents can not hope the salvation of dying infants ( as some think . ) 7. the promise of the holy ghost , acts 2. 39 , is thought to belong to infants , and so they ought to be baptized because they are said to be holy . 8. unless infants be baptized 't is thought god is worse to infants in the gospel , then in the law. 9. infants are a par● of all nations , and the command for baptizing is of extent to all nations . 10. 't is thought the apostles baptized infants because they baptized whole housholds , and 't is said , it hath descended to this very age as a tradition apostolical . to all which , doct. jer. taylor ( and others ) in behalf of the baptized churches , do give answer as followeth . that this is a goodly harangue , which upon strict examination will come to nothing ; that it pretends fairly , and signifies little ; that some of those allegations are false , some impertinent , and all the rest insufficient . for the argument from circumcision , is invalid ( or of no wright ) upon infinite considerations , figures and types prove nothing , unless a commandment go along with them , or some express ●o signifie such to be their purpose : for the deluge of waters and the ark of noah were a figure of baptism s●id pe●●r : and if therefore the circumstances of one should be drawn to the other , we should make baptism a prodigie , rather then a rite . the pascal lamb was a type of the eucharist which succeeds the other as baptism doth circumcision , but because there was in the manducation of the pascal lamb , no prescription of sacramental drink , shall we thence conclude that the eucharist is to be ministred but in one kind ? and even in the very instance of this argument supp●sing a correspondence of analogie betwen circumcision and baptism , * yet there is no correspondence of identity : for although it were granted that both of them did consign the covenant of faith , yet there is nothing in circumstance of childrens being circumcised that so concerns that m●stery , but that it might very well be given to children , and yet baptism to men of reason ; because circumcision left a character in the flesh , whi●h being imprinted upon infants did its work to them when they came to age , and such a character was necessary , because there was no word added to the sign ; but baptism imptints nothing that remains on the body , and if it leaves a character at all it is upon the soul to which also the word is added , which is as much a part of the sacrament as the sign it self is * for both wch reasons it is very requisite that the persons baptized should be capable of reason , that they may be capable of both the word of the sacrament and th● impress made upon the spirit . since therefore the reason of this pa●ity does wholly fail , there is nothing left to infer a necessity , of complying in this circumstance of age , any more then in the other anexes of the type : and the case is clear in the bishops question to c●p●iu● , for why should not infants be baptized just upon the eight day as well as circumcised , if the correspondence of the rites be an argument to infer one circumstance which is impertninent and accidental to the misteriousness of the rite , why should it not infer all [ especially such a material thing as the time of baptism , for if the eight day be not determined , no man is able to assign the day of baptism , which being delayed till the tenth or twentieth day , may by the same reason be deferred till the child have passed through its infancy , and become capable of e●udition ] and then also females must not be baptized because they were not circumcized , but it were more proper , if we would understand it aright , to prosecute the analogie of the type to the antitipe by way of letter and spirit , and signification , and as circumcision signifies baptism so also the adjuncts of circumcision shall signifie something spiritual in the adherences of baptism . and therefore as infants were circumcised , so spiritu●l infants shall be baptized , which ( according to some ) is spiritual circumcision [ which yet is better expounded by st. paul. phil. 3. where he makes the spiritual circumcision to be the mind and spirit renewed , and the putting of the body of the sins of the flesh ] for therefore babes had the ministery of the type to signifie that we must when we give our names to christ , become 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 children in malice , [ for unless you become like one of these little ones you cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven ] said our blessed saviour , and then the ●ye is made compleat , and this seems to have been the sence of the p●imative church , for in the ages next to the apostles , they gave to all baptized persons mi●k and hony to represent to them their duty , that though in age and understanding they were men , yet they were babes in christ , and children in malice . but to infer the sence of the paedo baptists , is so weak a manner of arguing , that augustin whose device it was ( and men use to be in love with their own fancies ) at the most pretended it but as probable [ lo here the newness of the argument , from infant circumcision , to infant baptism . [ as for the catholicks they hold it an absurd thing to argue as the protestants do , from the covenant made with abraham and his seed , gen 17. 7. thus they speak . that prom●se concerns literally pecuculiar pro●●ction , and ●orldly felicity , not the remission of sins and everlasting life , neither can we be sons of abraham by carnal generation , or by our carnal paren●s ( we are not jews but gentiles ) but only by spiritual generation ( to wit baptism ) by which we are born to god , and made the brothers of chr●●t● the sons of abraham , th●se ( saith st. paul ) are the sons of abraham , not who are the sons of the flesh but of faith rom. 4. 12. 13. again they deride the argument drawn from infants being circumcised in order to their being baptized , calling it a cunning argument by which it will follow that females are not to be baptized , &c. ] and as ill success will they have with the other arguments as with this for from the action of christs blessing infants to inser that they are to be baptize , proves nothing so much as that there is a great want of better arguments , the conclusion would be with more probability derived thus ; christ blessed children and so dismissed them , but baptized them not , therefore infants are not to be baptized , but let this be as weak as it's enemy , yet that christ did not baptize them , is an argument sufficient that christ hath other wayes of bringing them to heaven . he passed his act of grace upon them by benediction and imposition of hands . and therefore though neither infants nor any man in puris naturalibus can attain to a supernatural end without the addition of some instrument or means of gods appointing ordinarily , yet where god hath not appointed a rule nor an order , as in the case of infants , we contend he hath not , this argument is invalid ▪ and as we are sure that god hath not commanded infants t● be baptised , so we are su●e god will do them no injustice , nor damn them for what they cannot help . and therefore let them be pressed with all the inconveniences which a●e consequent to original sin , yet either it will not be laid to their charge , so as to be sussicient to condemn them ; or if it could , yet the mercy and absolute goodness of god will secure them , if he take them away before they can glorifie him by a free obedience . quid ergo fostivat innoceus alis ad remissionem p●ccatorum ? was the question of tertullian ( lib. de bapt . ) he knew no such danger from their original guilt , as to drive them to a laver of which in that age of innocence they had no need , as he conceived ▪ and therefore there is no necessity of flying to the help of others , for tongue , and heart , and faith , & predispositions to baptism ; for what need all this stir ? as infants without their own consent , without any act of their own . and without any exteriour solemnity , contracted the guilt of adams sin , and are lyable to all the punishment which can with justice descend upon his posterity who are personally innocent ; so infants shall be restored without any solemnity or act of their own , or any other for them , by the second adam by the redemption of jesus christ by his righteousness and mercies , applyed either immediately , or how , or when he pleases to appoint [ and to this agrees that saying of the apostle as in adam all dye , so in christ shall all be made alive ; and as by the disobedience of one many were made sinners , so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous ] and so austins argument will come to nothing without any need of god-fathers , or the faith of any body else . and it is too narrow a conception of god almighty , because he hath tyed us to the observation of ceremonies of his own institution , that therefo●e he hath tyed himself to it . many thousand ways there are by which god can bring any reasonable soul to himself : but nothing is more unreasonable , then because he hath tyed all men of years , and discretion to this way , therefore we of our own heads shall carry infants to him that way without his direction : the conceit is poor and low , and the action consequent to it , is too bold and ventrous , mysterium meum mihi & filiis domus meae . let him do what he please to infants we must not . only this is certain , that god hath as great care of infants as of others , and because they have no capacity of doing such acts , as may be in order to acquiring salvation , god will by his own immediate mercy bring them thither , where he hath intended them ; but to say that therefore he will do it by an external act and ministry , and that confin'd to a particular , viz. this rite & no other , is no good argument unless god could not do it without such means , or that he had said he would not : and why cannot god as well do his mercies to infants now immediately , as he did before the institution either of circumcision or baptism ? [ ●his query is worthy of serious consideration ] however there is no danger that infants should perish for want of this external ministry , much less for prevaricating christs precept , nisi quis renatus fuerit &c. for first the water and spirit in this place [ according to some learnéd expositers ] signifie the same thing : and by water is ment the ●ff●ct of the spirit clensing and purifying the soul , as appears in its parralel place of christs baptizing with the holy ghost and fire — ( but to let pass this advantage and to suppose it to be ment of external baptism [ as that is the most likely sense ] yet this no more infers a necessity of infants baptism , then the other words of christ infer a necessity to give them the holy communion , nisi comediritis carnem filii hominis , & brberitis sanguinem non introibitis in regnum ●aelorum ; and yet we do not think these words sufficient argument to communicate them ; if men therefore will do us justice , either let them give both sacraments to infants as some ages of the church did , or neither , for the wit of man is not able to shew a desparity in the sanction , or in the evergie of its expression ; and therefore they were honest , that understood the obligation to be parralel , and performed it accordingly , and yet because we say they were deceived in one instance , and yet the obligation ( all the world cannot reasonably say but ) is the same : they are as honest and as reasonable that do neither . and since the antient-church did with an equal opinion of necessity give them communion , and yet men now adays do not , why shall men be mor● burthened with a prejudice and nam● of obloquy for not giving the infant● one sacrament , more then they ar● disliked for not affording them the other . if anabaptist shall be ● name of disgrace , why shall not som● other name be invented for them that deny to communicate infants , which shall be equally disgraceful , or else both the opinions signifyed by such names , be accounted no disparagement , but receive their estimate according to their truth ? of which truth since we are now taking account from pretences of scripture , it is considerable the discourse of st. peter which is pretended for the intitleing infants to the promise of the holy ghost , and by consequence to baptism , which is supposed to be its instrument of conveyance , 't is wholly a fancy , and hath nothing in it of certainty or demonstration and not much probability . for besides that the thing it self is unreasonable and the holy ghost works by the heighting and improveing our natural faculties , and therefore is a promise that so concerns them , as they are reasonable creatures , and may have a tittle to it , in proportion to their nature , but no possession or reception of it , till their faculties come into act , besides this , i say , the words mentioned in s. p●t●rs ●rmon ( which are the only record of the promise are interpreted upon a w●a● mistake ; the promise belongs to you and to your children therefore infants are actually receptive o● it in that capacity , that 's the argument : but the reason of it is not yet discovered nor never will [ for indeed it is without reason ] to you and your children , i●s you and your posterity , to you and your children when they are of the same capacity in which you are effectually receptive o● the promise . [ beside the promise of the spirit in this place is refer'd to the gift● of the holy ghost , an● is therefore made t● those who had alread● received it in the quic●ning , or illuminating opperation of it , an● is the po●tion of beleivers as such , and i● consequent to baptism . acts 2 38 , 39 ▪ and is therefore wrongfully made an argument for the baptizing of infants , wh● ( what ever they may have of the g●aces of the spirit * yet ) have neither need of , nor any capacity to use the gifts of the spirit and therefore evident it is that this promise of the spirit belongs not to infants at all ] and for the allegation of st. paul , that infants are holy if their parents be faithful , it signifie nothing , bu● that they are holy by designation , — [ or according to erasmus they ( to wit infants born of such parents as the o●e being a christian the other not ) are holy leg●●●●ately ; for the conversion of either wife or ●●sband d●th not disso●ve the marriage which was made when both were in u●b●●eif . and however it is true , that au●tin was a great stick●er for paedo-bap●ism , yet he denys that any such thing can ●e deduced from the text in hand , his words ●re these . lib. 3 de pec . mer. remi● . it is to be held without doubling , whatsoever that sanctification was , it was not of power to make christians and remit sins . he might well say so considering that the holiness of the child is derived from the sanctity of the unbeleiver , as the word else being rightly refer'd doth evince , 1 co. 7. 14. ] and as the promiss appertains not ( for ought appears ) to infants in that capacity and consistance , — yet baptism is not the means of conveying the holy ghost , for that which peter sayes be baeptized and ye shall receive the holy ghost , signifies no more then this ; first be baptized and then by imposition of the apostles hands , ( which was another mistery and rite ) 〈◊〉 shall receive the promiss of the father and this is nothing but an infinuation of the rite of confirmation , a● to this sense expounded by diver● antient authors ; and in ordinary ministry , the effect of it is not bestowed upon any unbaptized persons , for it is in order next after baptism : and upon this ground peters argument in the case of cornelius was concluding enough , a mojori ad minus , thus the holy ghost was bestowed upon him and his family , which gift by ordinary ministry was consequent to baptism , not as the effect is to the cause , or to the proper instrument , but as a consequent is to an antecedent , in a chain of c●uses accidentally , and by positive institution depending upon each o●her ) god by that miracle did give testimony that the persons of the men were in g●eat dispositions towards heaven , and therefore were to be admitted to these rites which are the ordinary inlets into the kingdome of heaven . but then from hence to argue that where ever there is a capacity of receiving the same grace , there also the same sign is to be administred , and from ●ence to infer paedo-baptism , is an argument very fallatious upon several grounds ; first because baptism is not the sign of the holy ghost , but by another mistery it was conveyed ordinarily , and extraordinarily , it was convey'd independently from any mistery , and so the argument goes upon a wrong supposition . 2. if the supposition were true , yet the proposition built upon it is false , for they that are capable of the same grace , are not alwayes capable of the same sign , for women under the law of moses although they were capable of the righteousness of faith , yet they were not capable of the sign of circumcision , for god does not alwayes convey his graces in the same manner , but to some mediately , to some immediately ; and there is no better in●tance in the the world of it , then the gift of the holy ghost ( which is the thing now instanc'd in , in this cont●station . ) and after all this least these arguments should not ascertain their cause , they fall on complaining against god , and will not be content with god , unless they may baptize their children but take exceptions that g●d did more for the children of the jews , but why so ? because god made a covenant with their children actually as infants , and concin'd it by circumcision : well so he did with our children too in their proportion . he made a convenant of spiritual promises on his part , and spiritual and real services on ours ; and this pert●ins to children when capable , but made with them as soon as they are alive , and yet not so as with the jews b●bes , for as they rite consign'd them actually , so it was a national and temporal blessing and covenant , and a separation of them from the portion of the nations , a mark●ng them for a peculiar people , and therefore while they were in the wilderness and sep●rate from the commixture of all people they were not at all ci●cumcised but as that ri●e did seal the righteousness of faith , [ which whe●her it did any such thing to an● s●ve to ●braham only ●n m●ch doubten ] so by vertue of i●'s 〈…〉 , and remanem●y in their fl●sh , it did that work when the 〈◊〉 came to age , but in christian infants t●e case is otherwise , for the new covenant being estab●ished upon better promises , is not only to be●ter purposes , but also in a distinct manner to be understood , when their spirits are as receptive of a spiri●ual act or impress as the bodies of jewish children were of the sign of circumcision then it is to be consign'd ; but the business is quickly at an end by saying that god hath done no less for ours , then for their children , for he will do the mercies of a father and creator to them , and he did no more to the other , but he hath done more to ours , for he hath made a covenant with them and built it upon promises of the greatest concernment . — [ and note further we have as much ground of comfort concerning our dying infants , as the faithful had for the first two thousand years , during all which time , the covenant of grace reached to infants , though there was no external ceremony to consign it to infants . ] — for the insinuation of the precept of baptizing all nation , of which children are a part , does as little advantage as any of the rest , because other parallel expressions of the scri●ture do determine and expound themselves to a sence that includes not all persons absolutely , but of a capable condition as ado●ate ●um omnes gentes , & persallirae deo omnes nationes terra . [ and nation shall rise against nation , where infants are excluded ] and divers more . [ but erasmus hath well expounded this text , where he restrains the baptizing to such as are repentant of their former life . as for the conjecture concerning the family of stephan●s , at the best it is but a conjecture , and besides that it is not prov'd that there were children in the family ; yet if that were granted it follows not that they were baptized , because by [ whole families ] in scripture is ment all persons of reason and age within the familie , for it is said of the ruler at capernaum , that he beleived a●d all his house . now you may also suppose that in his house were little babes , that is like enough , and you may suppose that they did beleive too , before they could understand , but that 's not so likely ; and then the argument from baptizing stephen's family may be allowed just as probable : but this is unmanlike to build upon such slight and airy conjectures . but tradition by all means must supply the place of scripture , and there is pretended a tradition apostolical that infants were baptized : but at this we are not much moved , for we who rely upon the written word of god , as sufficient to establish all true religion , do not value the allegations of traditions ; and however the world goes none of the reformed churches can pretend this argument against this opinion , because they who reject t●adition when 't is against them , must not pre●end it at al● for them . but if we should allow the topick to be good , yet how will it be verified ? for so far as it can yet appear , it relies wholly upon the testimony of origen , for from him austin had it . now a tradition apostolical if it be not consign'd with a fuller testimony then of one person , whom all after ages have condemn'd of many errours , will obtain so little reputation among those that kn●w that thing , have upon greater authority pretended to derive from the apostles , and yet f●sly , that it will be a great argument that he is credulous and weak , that shall be de●ermined by so weak probation , in matters of so great concernment . and the truth of the business is , as there was no command of scripture to obliedge children to the susception of it , so necessity of ●ae●o-baptism was not determined in the church till the eight age after christ , but in the year 418. in the mileritan cou●cel ( a principal of a●r●ca , there was a cannon made for paedo bapt ▪ never till then , i grant it was practised in africa before that time , and they or some of them thought well of it , and though that be no argument for us to think so , yet none of them did ever before , pretend it to be necessary , none to have been a precept of the gospel , st. austin was the first that ever preach'd it to be abso●utely necessary , and it was in his heat and anger against pelag●us who had warm'd and chafed him so in that question ; that it made him innovate in other doctrines , possibly of greater concernment then th●s , and that although this was practic'd antiently in africa yet that it was without an opinion of necessity , and not often there , nor at all in other places , we have the testimony of a learned paedo baptist ludovicus vives who in his annotations upon augustin de civit. dei. l. 1. c. 27. afirms . neminem nisi adultum antiquitus sol●re baptizari . [ and because th●s testimony is of great import i will set down the very words of augustine and ludovicus vives , as i find them in the english edition of the said book of the city of god , cap. 26. where augustine puts forth this question . what is the reason then that we do spend so much time in our exhortations , endeavouring to annimate th●se whom we have bapt●zed , ei●her unto virginity , or c●●st widdow-●ood or honest and honourable marriage ; now upon these words [ ●hose whom we have baptiz●d ] vives comments t●us , least any man should mistake this place , understand tha● in times of old , no man was brought unto baptism , but he was of s●fficient years , to know what that mistical water meant , and to require his baptism , and that sundry times . — i hear that in some cityes of italy they do for the most part observe the antient custome as yet . and it is to be observed that in the margent are two notes , the 1. is that this is the old manner of baptizing . the 2 , that all this is left out in the paris edition , whence we may note how the writings of the antients are abused , and how ingeniously it is confessed , paedo-baptism is not the old manner of baptizing . and here we will insert some other testimonies from the learned paedo-baptists , touching the novelty of infant baptism . the first is out of robertus fabianus his chron. 4. part in fol. 107. where he brings in augustine the monk speaking thus to the brittain bishops ▪ since ye will not assent to my h●sts generally assent ye to me specially in three things , the first is that ye keep easter-day in due form and time as it is ordained the second , that ye give chris●endom to children , &c. but they would not thereof . this was about the fifth age after christ whence its remarkable that infant bap●ism was then opposed by ●he joynt consent of the brita●n bish●ps which were sent to the assembly to consul● the affairs of religion at that time . our next testimony is from the learned casuist hugo grotius who tells us , to defer baptism till ripe years was in old time left at liberty , now the observation is otherwise . plainly giving the case that paedo-baptism is not the old way but a new observation . but here we will again give place to doctor taylor , who saith . that besides that the tradition cannot be proved to be apostolical , we have very good evidence from antiquity that it was the opinion of the primitive church that infan●s ough● not to be baptized . and this is clear in the six●h cannon of the c●unsel of ne●●aesarea . the words * have this sence . a woman 〈…〉 may be baptized when she please ; for her baptism concerns not the child . the reason of the connection of the parts of that cannon is in the following words . because every one in that confession is to give a demonstration of his own choice and election , meaning plainly , that if the baptism of the mother did pass upon the child , it were not fit for a pregnant woman to receive baptism , because in that sacrament , there being a confession of faith which confession supposes understanding , and free choyce , it is not reasonable the child should be consign'd with such a mistery , since it cannot do any act of choice or understanding . the cannon speaks reason , and it intimates a practice which was absolutely universal in the church of interrogating the catechumens concerning the articles of the creed , which is one argument that either they did not admit infants to baptism , or that they did prevaricate egregiously , in asking questions of them , who themselves knew were not capable of giving answer . and to supply their incapacity by the answer of a godfather , is but the same unreasonableness acted with a worse circumstance ; and there is no sensible account can be given of it , for that which some imperfectly murmure concerning stipulations civil performed by tutors in the name of their pupils is an absolute vanity ; for what if by positive constitutions of the romanes such solemnities of law are required in all stipulations , and by indulgence are permitted in the case of a notable benefit acruing to minors . must god be tyed , and christian religion transact her misteries by proportion and complyance with the law of the romanes ? i know god might if he would have appointed godfathers to give answer in behalf of children , and to be f●de-jussors for them , but we cannot find any authority o● ground that he hath and if he had then it is to be supposed he would have given them comission to have transacted the solemnity with better circumsta●ces , and given answers with more truth ▪ and if the godfathers answer in the name of the child [ i do believe ] it is notorious they speak false and ridiculously : for the infant is not capble of be●ieving , and if he were , he were a so capable of dissenting , and how then do they know his mind and therefore tertullian gives advice that the bap●ism of infants 〈◊〉 be deferred till they could 〈◊〉 an account of their faith , and the same also is the counsel of * gregory bishop of naziazum , although he allows them to hasten it in case of necessity , for though his reason taught him what was fit , [ namely that none should b● baptized till they were of understanding yet he was overborn with the practi●● and opinion of his age which began to bear too violently upon him , and yet in another place he makes mention of some to whom baptism was not administred 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by reason of infancy . to which if we add that the parents of st. austin , st. jerome , and st. ambrose , although they were christian , yet did not baptize their children before they were thirty years of age it will be very considerable in the example , and of great efficacy for destro●ing the supposed necessity or derivation from the apostles [ and for further evidence we may well alledge in this place , that of theodosius the emperor born in spain his parents being both christians , and he from his youth educated in th● christian faith , who falling sick at thess●onica , was baptized and recovered of his sickness . but however ( paedo baptism ) it is against the perpetual analog● of christs doctrine to baptize infants , for besides that christ never gave any precept to bap●ize them , nor never himself nor his apostles ( that appears ) did baptize any of them , all that either he or his apostles said concerning baptism , requires such pretious dispositions to it , of which infants are not capable , and these are faith and repentance , and not to instance in those innumerable places that require faith before baptism , there needs no more but this one saying , he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved , but he that believeth not shall be damned . plainly thus , fai●h and baptism in conjunction will bring a man to heaven , but if he have not faith baptism shall do him no good . so that if baptism be necessary , then so is faith , and much more ; for want of faith damns absolutely , it is not said so of the want of baptism . now if this decretory sence be to be understood of persons of age , and if children by such an answer ( which indeed is reasonable enough ) be excused from the necessity of faith , the want of which regularly does damn , then it is sottish to say the same incapacity of reason and faith , shall not ●xcuse them from the actual susception of baptism which as less necessary , and to which faith and many other acts are necessary predispositions when it is reasonably and humanely ●eceived . the conclusion is that bap●sm is also to be defer'd till the time of ●aith , and whether infants have faith or no , is a question to be disputed by ●ersons that care not how much they 〈◊〉 ▪ nor how little they prove . 1. personal and actual faith they have none , for they have no acts of ●nderstanding , and besides how can ●ny man understand that they have , since he never saw any sign of i● neither was he told so by any o●● that could tell . 2. some s●y they have imputativ● faith , but then so let the s●cramen● be too , that is , if they have the parent faith or the churches , then so le● baptism be imputed by derivatio● from them also . — for since faith 〈◊〉 necessary to the susception of baptis● ( and they themselves confess it b● striving to find out new kinds of fait● to daub the matter up ) such as th● faith is , such must be the sacramen● for there is no proportion betwee● an actual sacramen , and an imputative faith , this being in immedia●● and necessary order to that , an● whatsoever can be said to take o● from the necessi●y of actual faith , a● that and much more may be said t● excuse from the actual ●usception 〈◊〉 baptism . 3. the first of these devices wa● that of luther and his schol ar● the 2 of calvin and his ; and yet there is a third device which the church of rome teaches , and that is , that infants have habitual faith , but who told them so ? how can they prove it ? what revela●ion , or reason teaches such a thing ? are they by this habit so much as disposed to an actual belief without a new master ? ●an an infant sent into a mahumetan province be more confident for christianity when he comes to be a , man , then if he had not been baptized , are there any acts precedent concomitant , or consequent to this pretended habit ? this strange invention , is absolutely without art , without scripture , reason or authority . but if there were such a thing as this abitual faith , then either all infants have ● or some only if all why do they deny bap●●sm to the infants which are horn of unbe●evers ? must the child bear the unbelief of 〈◊〉 parents ? * if s●me only have it , how know they these from 〈◊〉 rest , sith when they come to years , there found a like barrenness of this grace 〈◊〉 means be used to beget it ? but third where doth the scripture make an habit●● faith that which intitles any person to ba●tism ? surely according to these conc●●● no man can ever tell to whom , or when 〈◊〉 dispence baptism . ] but the men are ●● be excused unless there were bett●● grounds ; but for all these stratage● the argument now alleadged agai● infant baptism is demonstrable a● unanswerable . to which also this considerati●● may be added , that if baptism be ●●cessary to the salvation of infant upon whom is the imposition lai● to whom is the command give● to parents or to the children , not 〈◊〉 the children , for they are not cap●ble of a law ; not to the parents , 〈◊〉 then god hath put the salvation 〈◊〉 innocent babe● into the power of ●thers , and infants may then be damn●● for their parents carelessness or m●lice . it follows that it is not necessary at all to be done to them , to whom it cannot be prescribed by a law , and in whose behalf it cannot be reasonably intrusted to others with the appendant necessity , and if it be not necessary , it is certain it is not reasonable , and most certain it is no where in terms prescribed , and therefore it is to be presumed , that it ought to be understood and administred according as other precepts are with reference to the capacity of the subject , and the reasonableness of the thing . for i consider that the baptizing of infants does rush upon such inconveniences , which in other questions we avoid like rocks which will appear if we discourse thus . either baptism produces spiritual effects , or it produces them not : if it produces not any , why is such contention about it ? — but if ( as without all peradventure all the paedo-baptists will say ) baptism does a work upon the soul , producing spiritual benefits and advantages ; these advantages are produced by the externa● work of the sacrament alone , or b● that as it is helped by the co-operation and predispositions of the suscipien● . if by the external work of th● sacrament alone , how does this diffe● from the opus o●eratum of the papist● save that it is worse ? for they sa● the sacrament does not produce in effect , but in a suscipient disposed b● all requisites and due preparatives 〈◊〉 piety , faith , and repentance , thoug● in a subject so disposed they say th● sacrament by its own vertue does i● but this opinion says it does it of 〈◊〉 self without the help , or so much 〈◊〉 the coexistence of any condition bu● meer reception . but if the sacrament does not d● its work alone , but per modum recipien●es according to the predispofition● of the suscipient , then because infant can neither hinder it , nor do an● thing to further it , it does them no benesit at all . and if any man runs for succor to that , exploded 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that infants have faith or any other inspired habit of i know not what how , we desire no more advantage in the world then that they are constrain●d to an answer without rev●lation , against reason , common sence and all experience in the world . the sum of the argument in short , is this though under another rep●esentment . either baptism is a meer ceremony or it imploys a duty on our part , if it be a ceremony only , how does it sanctifie us or make the comers thereunto per●ect ? if it imploy● a duty on our part how then can children receive it who cannot do duty at all . and indeed this way of ministration makes baptism to be wholly an outward duty , a work of the law , a carnal ordinance it makes us adheare to the letter , without regard of the spirit , to be satissied with the shadows , to return to bondage . to relinquish the misteriousnes , the substanc● and spirituallity of the gospel , which argument is of so much the more consequence , because under the spiritual covenant , or the gospel of grace , 〈◊〉 the mistery goes not before the symbol ( which it does when the symbol● are seales and consignations of th● grace , as it is said the sacraments are ) yet it always accompanies it , bu● never follows in order of time , an● this is clear in the perpetual analogy of holy scripture . for baptisme is never propounded mentioned or enjoyned as a mean of remission of sins , or of eternal life , but something of duty choice or sanctity is joyned with it , in orde● production of the end so mentione● k●ow you not that s● many as are baptis● in●o ●hr●st jesus an● baptised into his death ? there i● the mistery and the symbol together and declared to be perpetually united 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . all of us who were baptised into one ▪ were baptised into the other , not only in the name of christ , but into his death also ; but the meaning of this , as it is explained in the following words of st. paul , makes much for our purpose : for to be baptised into his death , signifies , to be buried with him in baptisme , that as christ rose from the dead ; we also should walk in newness of life , that 's the full mistery of baptisme ; for being baptised into his death , or which is all one in the next words 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 into the likeness of his death , cannot go alone ; if we be so planted into christ we shall be pertakers of his resurrection , and that is not here instanced in precise reward but in exact duty for all this is nothing but cruc fiction of the old man , a destroying the body of sin , that we no longer serve sin . this indeed is truly to be baptized both in the symbol and the mistery what is less then this , is but the symbol only , a meer ceremony , an opus operatum , a dead letter , an empty shadow , an instrument , without an agent to manage ; or force to actuate it . plainer yet whosoever are baptized into christ have put on christ , have put on the new man. but to put on the new man , is to be formed in righteousness , holiness , and truth . this whole argument is the very words of st. paul. the major proposition is dogmatically determined , gal. 3. 27. the minor in ephes . 4. 24. the conclusion then is obvious . that they who are not formed a new in righteousness , holyness and truth , they who remaining in the present in incapacities , cannot walk in newness of life , they have not been baptized into christ , and then they have but one member of the distinction used by st. peter , they have that baptism which is a putting away the fi●th of the flesh [ if yet an human institute may be so called ] but they have not that baptism which is the answer of a good conscience towards god , which is the only baptism which saveth us , and this is the case of children and then the case is thus . as infants by the force of nature cannot put themselves into a supernaturall condition ( and therefore say the paedo baptists they need baptism to put them into it [ as if the ●●re ●e●e●ony of which only they are capa●'le could put them into a supernaturall con●ition ] so if they be baptized before the use of reason , before the works of the spirit , before the opperations of grace , before they can throw of the works of darknes , and live in ri●hteousness ond newness of life , they are never the nearer ; from the pains of hell they shall be saved by the mercy of god and their o●● innocence though they dye in puris naturalibus , and baptism will carry them no further for that baptism that saves us , is not the only washing with water , of which only infant are capable , but the answer of a good conscience towards god , of which they are not capable till the use o● reason , till they know to chuse the good and refuse the evill . and from thence i consider a new that all vows made by persons unde● others names stipulations made b● minors ▪ are not valid till they by ● supervening act , after they are of sufficient age do ratifie the same , wh● then may not infants as well mak● the vow de novo as de novo ratifie th●● which was made for them ab antiqu● when they come to years of choyce ▪ if the infant vow be invalid till th● manly confirmation , why were it 〈◊〉 as good they staid to make it till th● time , before which if they do ma●● it , it is to no purpose , this would 〈◊〉 considered . and in conclusion our way is the surer way , for not to baptise children till they can give an account of their faith is the most proportionable to an act of reason and humanity , and it can have no danger in it : for to say that infants may be damn'd for want of baptism ( a thing which is not in their power to acquire they being yet persons not capable of a law ) is to afirm that of god which we dare not say of any wise and good man. certainly it is very much derogatory to gods justi●e and a plain defiance to the infinite reputation of his goodness . and therefore who ever will pertinatiously persist in this opinion of the paedo-baptists , and practise it accordingly they polute the blood of the everlasting testament . they dishonor and make a pageantry of the sacrament . they ineffectually represent a sepulture into the death of christ , and please themselves in a sign without effect , making baptism like the figtree full-of leaves but no fruit , &c. thus far the anabaptists may argue , and men have disputed against them with so much weakness and conf●dence , that they have been eucouraged in their error [ alias in th● truth ] more by accidentiall [ alia● real ] advantages we have given them by our weak arguings , then by any truth of their cause or excellency o● of their wit [ so the dr. is pleased t● say but the evidences of our side sp●ak otherwise ] but the use i make of it as to our ppesent question ( saith the dr. ) is this , that since there is no● direct impiety in the opinion no● any that is apparently consequent to it , and they which so much p●obabillity , do or may pretend to true perswasion they are with all means , christian , fair , and human , to b● redargued , or instructed , but if they cannot be perswaded they must be left to god , who knows every degree of every mans understanding , all his weaknesses and strength's what impress each argument makes upon his spirit . and how unresistable every reason is , and he alone judges his in●oce●cy and sincerity : and for the question , i think there is so much to be petended [ he might say really urged ] against that which i believe to be truth that there is much more truth then evidence on our side [ a strange saying of so wi●e a man as if the truth in this case doth not wh●lly depend upon evidence , sith its a positive and no morall precept ] and therefore we may be confident as for our own particulars but not too forward premtorily to prescribe to others muchless damn , or kill or to persecute them that only in this particular disagree . thus far doctor taylor , for our appollogie . to whom to add any more witnesses ( though more might be brought ) would be superfluous . i therefore proceed to the next question , viz. what is the due act , or outward form to be used in this sollemn rite of holy baptism ? it may well be the admiration of every wise and good man how it should come into the mind of such as pretend to be followers of christ that holy baptism should be performed by aspertion , or casting a few drops of water upon the subject , by the fingers of the administrator . the scriptures every where teaching us that the originall form was by imversion in rivers or places of much water , ma●● . 1. john. 3. christ himse●f who surely would do nothing superfluous or in vain , was baptized in the river , by john the first baptist , who had his direction from heaven , and his approbation from on high in that very action mall . 3. and chuss who were under the immediate direction of the holy spirit the leader into all truth , found it necessary for the administrator and subject to go both into the water , for the due performance of this holy ordinance . add thereunto that the proper signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 when used to express the action done in this service , is to dip or imm●rge the party in the element as is confessed by the learned paedo-baptists themse●ves as we shall see in the sequel . and here we will still prefer the church of england who teacheth us that the outward sign or form in baptism , is water wherein the party baptized is dipped , &c. and though she add [ or sprinkled with it ] yet that her conscience tells her that is not the right way appeareth , in that she only assigns that by indulgence to such infants as are in danger of death , &c , the church of rome also confesseth by a learned pen , that she changed dipping the party baptized over the head and ears to a little sprinkling upon the face . erasmus paraphrasing on the words , baptizing them , mat. 28. saith thus , if they believe that which you teach them and begin to be repentant of their former life , &c. then dip them in water , &c. walfridus strabo de rebus eccl●s●●c 26. tells us , that we must know at ●h● fi●st believers were baptized simply in floods and fountains . the learned grotius tel's us in his judgement on infant baptism , that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies to dip over the head and ears . to whom we will joyn t●lenus whose testimony is in these words * baptism is the first sacrament of the new testament instituted by christ , in which with a most pat and exact analogy between the sign and the thing signified , those that are in covenant are by the minister washed in water . the outward rite in baptism is threefold immersion into the water , abiding under the water , and resurruction out of the water , the form of baptism , to wit internal and essential ▪ is no other then that analogical proportion , which the signs keep with the things signified thereby , for as the properties of the water in washing away the defilements of the body , do in a most suitable similitude , set forth the efficacy of christs blood in blotting out of sins , so dipping into the water doth in a most lively similitude set forth the mortification of the old man , and rising out of the water the virification of the new . — that same plunging into the water holds forth to us that horrible gulf of divine justice in which christ for our sins sake , which he took upon him , was for a while in a manner swallowed up . abode under the water how little a while soever , denotes his descent into hell , even the very deepest degree of livelesness , while lying in the sealed and guarded sepulchre he was accounted as one truly dead , rising out of the water holds out to us a lively similitude of that conquest , which this dead man got ●ver death , which he vanquished in his own den , as it were , that is the grave . in like manner therefore it is meet that we being baptized into his death , and buried with him , should rise also with him and so go on in a new life , rom. 6. 3. 4. col. ● . 12. th●● far tile●●s . bishop jewell in his defence , appol . ● . 5. p. 308. brings the councel of worms determining the manner of baptism ; thus , in aquas demersio in 〈◊〉 , & ●u●sus ab aquis ●emersio r●surrectio est . the dipping into the water is the going down into hell [ i. e. the grave ] the coming out from of the water is the resurrection . from all which testimonies ( and many more that might be brought ) it is evident beyond all doubt our opposers being judges ) that whether we respect the signification of the word baptizor the signification of the ordinance it self , or the consent of the primitive . churches in their practice of holy baptism , dipping the subject ( or party baptized ) in the element water , is the due form of baptism , and therefore sprinkling or crossing the face ; is an humane innovation . or , upon the whole matter these ten particulars are very apparent . first , that infant baptism was innovated , after the holy scriptures were written which appeareth both from the deep silence of the scripture in that case , and the confession of learned paedo-baptists themselves . 2. that it came in stealing ( as it were ) being for a considerable time left at liberty ( a sign it was not from heaven ) * and was disliked by the antients who therefore disswaded from it . 3. that which gave it its great advantage for a more general reception , was this false opinion , that without baptism none could be saved . this saith mr. perkins doth st. augustine every where assirm . 4. that the lords supper was as eagerly pressed , to be necess●ry sor infants as baptism , and they continued in use together about the space of six hundred years , this conceit was confirmed ( saith mr. perkins ) by the councel of toledo , can. 11. and augustine was so earnest for this also that he boldly sayes in vain do we promise infants salvation without it . aug ep : 23. & ep . 107. & contra ep . pelag . l. 1. c. 22. & contra . 〈◊〉 . l. 7. c. 2. l. 3. c. 12. 5. that divers in the greek church have all along to this day refused infant baptism . gro●ius his words are these ( as mr. t●mbs quotes them ) in every age many of the greeks unto this day keep the custome of deferring baptism to little ones till they could themselves make a confession of their faith. and the armenians are confessed by heylin in his macrocos . p. 575. to defer baptism to their children till they be grown to years of knowledge . 6. those foolish and sinful adjuncts , which the authors and promoters of infant baptism , were constrained to invent to make it look like baptism ( for example their device of godfathers , &c. ) do sufficiently declare it to be of an infirm and humane original . 7. the grounds upon which paedo-baptism was at first urged , are now in a manner wholly declined , and new grounds daily invented whereon to built it . which are no sooner laid , but raized again by some of it's own favorites . 8. that the stoutest assertors of infant baptism , hath ever met with as stout opposers ; thus agustine , met with the donatists and pelagius whose arguments he could not avoid but by running into greater absurdity , and though they are blamed ( and perhaps justly ) for holding some errours , so also is augustine and that not undeservedly . 9. that many of the learne● have much abused this age in telling them the anabaptists ( i. e. the baptized churches ) are of late edition a new sect , &c. when from their own writings the clean contrary is so evident . tenthly and lastly . observe how the baptism of repentance for remission of sins , which is that one and only baptism commanded in holy scripture hath been neglected , traduced ; and its affertors frequently abused , and that chiefly by thi● device of paedo-baptism which now hath so lost it 's first form , that it cannot with any shew of truth o● good sence be called baptism , and ought therefore to cease with its follow errors , viz. the giving the ●ords supper to infants , &c. that god may be justified in the submissi●n of all sinners to the baptism of repentance for remission of sins , luke 7. 39. the second part of the promise of the spirit . delivered in a sermon upon 1. cor. 12. 1. to which is added a post-script out of the works 〈◊〉 dr. jer. taylor , touching the layin● on of hands , chiefly declaring ho● religiously it was observed by th● antient christians , as it is now revived by divers of the baptize● christians of this age . 1 cor. 12. 1. now concerning spiritual gifts brethren i would not have you ignorant . there was never more need for th● church of god to seek and searc● for all those things which god hat● promised for her strength and encou●agement then now partly for that her ●pposers are men of exquisite parts by ●eans of all arts and sciences which ●●e not more profitable when used in 〈◊〉 way of subserviency to the truth , ●●en pernitious when used in opposi●●on to it ( as it often falleth out they ●re ) and partly for that ignorance of ●hat god hath promised for his churches comfortable subsistance , ●roves a great occasion and temptati●● to christians to trust to failing and ●●comfortable helps in the great bu●●ness of the ministry of the word and ●rayer , &c. now in the words which we have ●●osen the apostle shews his care for ●●e church at corinthus ( and in them 〈◊〉 all churches ) that they should not 〈◊〉 ignorant concerning spiritual gifts ●●d labours in three chapters toge●●er to instruct them fully in that point ●●der several considerations , and ●●●st , 1. by giving them a definition of those gifts , or shewing what they are , verse 8. 9. 10. viz. a word of wisdom , a word of knowledge , faith , the gifts of healing , the working of miracles , prophesie , discerning of spirits , divers kinds of tongues , interpretation of tongues , which definition or enumeration of gifts he seems to inlarge , chap , 13. 26. a psalm , a doctrine , &c. 2. by shewing that the church hath a perpetual right to , and interest in all these gif●s , chap. 14. 1. desire sor be zealous after spiritual gifts , chap. 12 ▪ 31. covet earnestly the best gifts chap. 14. 39. covet to prophesie and forbid not to speak with tongues . 3. by shewing whereto these gifts d●serve , or to what end they were given ▪ chap. 14. 12. forasmuch as ye are zealous of the spiritual gifts , seek tha● ye may excel to the edification of th● church , ver . 31. that all may learn , and all be comforted , eph. 4 12. fo● the perfecting the saints for the wor● of the ministry , for the edifying of the body of christ . 4. by distinguishing of gifts as they are more or less necessary and accordingly gives direction which to prefer in our asking them ( yet so as not to forbid the use of any of them , so it might be done with edification ) chap. 14. 1. desire spiritual gifts but rather that ye may prophesie . ver. 5. i would have ye all speak with tongues but rather that ye prophesied , for greater is he that prophesieth , then he that speaketh with tongues . ver. 5. he that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifyeth himself , but he that prophesieth edifyeth the church . 5. by shewing that all these gifts , how excellently soever any are endowed with them , yet therein he is not to rest satisfyed because there is yet a far more excellent way of receiving the s●irit , without which all gifts are as nothing . this more excellent way he refers to the fruit of the spirit , which he both distinguisheth by its several branches , 1 cor. 13. 4 , 5 , 6 , 7. compar'd with gal. 5. 22. 23. and also comprehends the whole in that excelling grace of charity follow after charity , chap. 4. 1. the greatest of these is charity . 6. by giving a notable rule to know who are indeed spiritual christians from such as only pretend to be so , chap. 14. 35. if any man think himself to be a prophet or spiritual , let him acknowledge the things i write unto you are the commands of the lord. those then are not truly spiritual , or true prophets who ( as many on the right hand ) do not only lay aside the commands of the lord , but prescribe to others their own traditions , neither those on the other hand , who prefer their poor conceits and notions , as if the word of god came out from them , when though ( perhaps ) it came to them , yet it came not to them only , ver . 36. thus much briefly to shew what the apostle means in this place by spiritual gifts , and in what respects he would not have the church to be ignorant concerning them . nor shall i insist upon all those particulars now , but only that which may be most needful to be demonstrated , and that is the second particular . for i find , it is not only a general conceit among the national churches , that the extraordinary gifts of the spirit were only temporary , and now ceased , but also very many in the baptized churches are doubtful ( at the least ) in this matter , as if that glorious promise of pouring out of the spirit according to the prophesie of joel , and the reception thereof by the primitive churches , were taken away long since from the churches which succeed them , and not to be so much as looked for in these days ! but that this is a very great mistake , and that the contrary , even that , that very promise of the spirit and every part of it , from the time of its first effusion upon the day of pentecost , acts 2. belongs to the church throughout all ages to the end of the world. i hope to evince to the satisfaction such as desire to see the truth in this matter . and first from the scope of the apostle , in these three chapters . where as it is his designed subject to discourse of the gifts of the spirit , so he informs us that god hath set them there , namely in his church , that is , he hath placed , setled or fixed , that one spirit in that one body , nor for a few days only , and then to leave her as a body without a spirit for ever after , in respect of spiritual gifts , but to abide there as in his temple * both by gifts and graces , even the same which christ by vertue of his assention obtained when he ascended on high , which gifts are given to the church for the work of the ministry , for the edification of the body till the whole be compleated . see to this purpose ephes . 4. from vers ▪ 4. to 16. again , the promise of the holy spirit is made by our lord himself to the church for ever . john 14. 16. i will pray the father and he shall give you another comforter that he may abide with you for ever &c. i say with the church , for it were a strange exposi●ion to restrain this for ever to the age of the apostles ( as some do ) for sith the apostles and first churches could neither pray nor prophysie as they ought , but as that spirit did help their infirmity , it were strange the subsequent should be able to do it though destitute of that distance , seeing prophysie is expresly one of those spirituall gifts , as before we have shewed . that great apostle peter , dates the promise of the holy spirit very largely , acts , 2. 38. &c. as descending to the very skirt , or last age of the church of god , even to as many as the lord our god shall call , and he here takes the promise in t●at sence wher● in jo●l meant it , and the church had then received it , which clearly intends both the gifts and graces of the spirit , for as 't is sure they received then very great gifts , so 't is said great grace was upon them all . act● . _____ this very p●omise of the father is by this apostle appropriated to all the called of the lord , even the servants and hand maids in th●se days . now these days must either be a few days at the beginning of the gospel , or it must be referred to the whole time of that glorious dispens●●ion if the first , then how shall all the called of the lord receive it ? or who will tell us when these days expired ? but we know that these days the latter days last time , and last days are used with some frequency in scripture , to point out the time of the gospel as it succeeded the time of the law. during all which time we are sure that the duties in generall ( and perhaps some difficult duties which were not formerly known ) which were imposed upon the first churches , are laid upon the churches to the end of the world , mat. 28. 20. teaching them to observe all things whatsoever i have commanded you , &c. must the churches now contend earnestly for the faith ( and that both against old and new errors ) must she be the salt of the earth , the light of the world must she strive to preach the gospel of the kingdom to all nations , must she keep her self in the love of god building up her self in her most holy faith , praying in the holy ghost ? surely , if these duties remain , and the lord requires that she should glorifie him in the faithful and constant discharge hereof as also in suffering for his sake ; it cannot reasonably be imagined that he should recall his holy spirit , in the gifts thereof from her who when she had them all , had nothing that was superfluous , but stood in need of all to furnish her for the work she stood ingaged to do , in these forementioned and other like considerations , sith then our god doth require the same service of his churches now , which he required of his churches in the first ages of the gospel , let us not imagine he will require the same brick , and not allow the same straw . that the gifts of the spirit here intendby our apostle are the portion of the church in every age ( as her right ) appeareth , from the nature of these exhortations she is under to ask them . luk. 11. 13. how much more shall your heavenly father give his holy spirit to them that ask it — ask and it shall be given unto you . vers , 10. how frequent is our apostle in these 3. chapters in his exhortations to this church ( and in them to all others ) to desire spirituall gifts , to covet earnestly the best gifts , to covet to prophesie , wishing that they may speak with tongues , and warning them not to prohibet that gift . now to what purpose is all this if these gifts be ceased and that the church may not now expect them ? i hope no man will say these exhortations are now out of date least in so doing he deprive us of the exhortation to charity , for they are so linked together as the one cannot cease as 't is an exhortation ) before the other . follow after charity and desire spiritual gifts and rather that ye may prophesie . thus we see the church being under perpetual exhortations , to seek for spiritual gifts without any restirction , necessarily infers her perpetual right to them and every of them , which consideration alone is sufficient ( as i conceive ) to satisfie any christian , that the promise of the spirit ( even the same that was given to the first churches ) in respect of gifts as well as graces belongs to the church of christ throughout all ages . let us now consider , whether the church of god do not even now injoy the promised spirit in the gifts and graces of it at this day , for the latter , i think there is none do●h question it , and yet should the graces or fruits of the spirit which now appear , be strictly considered by what did formerly shine forth in the churches , it might peradventure put us to some pause , yet not thence to conclude that we have not that spirit of grace , or that the graces thereof are ceased , but it would surely become a provocation , to cry mightily to god for an enlargement of what we have received in that behalf . and as i intend not to boast of the gifts of any , so i may safely presume that the gifts received in these days are far more then i can set down , or give you account of because the church is diffused through many nations , and her gifts there unknown to me ; i will then restrain my observations to the churches in this poor island , who may not vie with all churches , but rather in humility conclude themselves to be short of many concerning spirituall gifts . and yet , shall we say she hath none ( or may we not rather say she hath many that are endowed with a word of knowledge and that meerly by a gift from god , having otherwise , no capacity or fa●ulty more then others , but therein far short of many of their brethren ; only the gift of god , and no naturall faculty hath made the differance : how have men of knowledge in this world , been found to have no skill , and the foolish to attain knowledge , and some to excell so far , as to confound the wisdome of the wise and to bring to nought the understanding of the prudent , yet out of the mouth of babes hath our god ordained strength , and thereby hath sometimes stilled the enemy . and as wisdome is usefull to direct , so hath god given it to such as fear him ; who if we respect their education &c. could never have acquired it ; some by a word of wisdome here understand , the well ordering of affaires in the church , others the right or usefull applycation of the word &c. surely according to these expositions the church hath some , even by the gift of the spirit of god to go before here in these respects . neither is the gift of healings so abnegated , but that something of it hath appeared , as many living witness by experience have testified , and how far faith ( over and beside the common faith ) hath therein appeared , as also in some other memorable undertakings against sathan himself , or against his designs , with some good success , becomes others to consider more then it doth me to write ! as for me i rest satisfied , that miracles are not ceased as a gift to the church of god , though perhaps they are but rarely found , as being ( in the wisdom of god ) not so necessary now in many places as in times past . now for the gift of p●ophesie , which the apostle here intends , 't is certain the church enjoys it very gratiously in these days sith she hath them that by the gift of gods spirit ( and not by acquired arts ) do minister to her the word of life , by exhortation , to her edification and comfort ; which yet she could not have if the gifts were ceased seeing prophesie is not only one of the spirituall gifts but the very best of them , and the greatest of them all . nor is the spirit of our god removed in the gift of discerning of spirits ; for if it had false spirits had by their subtilty ere this day made havock of the churches , but through the grace of god , notwithstanding all their cunning craftiness they have been discerned , and their designs prevented ; and though perhaps charity for some time hath born with such , in hope of the best , yet this is no other thing then ought to be , as may be seen by the carriage of our lord toward judas , and his apostles towards fome others . the gifts of doctrine and praising our god with a psalme is not yet removed , our teachers ( as taught of god ) remaining in every church ; where also are some that are skillfull in praisiing the lord to the edification of the church ; as for revelations , there might perhaps sometimes be strange or hidden things made known by some speciall gift of god and why may not god do such things now ? however it is not unsafe to understand the revellations here ment , by chap. 14. 30. if any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by let the first hold his peace &c. which cannot so well be understood af a new oracle as of some further subject or more full explication of the matter treated on by him that spake first ; according to which interpr●tation we may say the church hath yet the gift of revellations . and thus far we seem to be got safe , not any thing so materiall intervening , as to conclude against the continuance of these spirituall gifts in the church to this day , so that the present repairers of the house or city of god may comfort themselves by the consideration of the words of the prophet , hagg. 2. 5. according to the word which i covenanted with you when you came out of egypt , so my spirit remaineth amo●g you , fear ye not . but now the g●ft of tongues and interpretation of tongues , these ! where shall we find them . doubtless these gifts are rarely if at all found in these days , and in this nation , so as to sute with those who frequently in some churches at first received those gifts ; the reasons are many ( but none such as conclude the church from under the promise of these gifts ) as first these gifts differ much from the rest , chiefly in this that they may be supply'd another way , for the conversion of persons of all languages , or such as can speak other languages and interpret the same to others , doth supply the absence of those gifts ; 2. the churche ( in this and i suppose other nations ) have very little need of these gifts , and therefore considering that they are not so necessary as the rest , the apostle leaves these with a forbid them not , whilst the rest he wills us to c●v●t earnestly . but 3 ? one great cause ( as i conceive ) why these g●fts are so much absent , and the other no more received , i● because we either ask them not at all , or else we ask them amiss . for many have been so ●ar from a king these gifts of the spirit , that in truth they have been arguing that these gifts are not attainable , and then t is no wonder they have not been received . again where there hath been some understanding of the interest we have in those gifts , there faith in asking hath been and is very low , and atended ( perhaps ) with great wavering , and then little can be expected at the hand of the almighty jam. 1. and here let me premonish you of one thing which ( by my little reading ) i perceive to have been a great provocation to the lord to wi●hdraw his gifts in times p●st ( and i fear it again ) and that was ●and and i doubt is ) an over curious performance , of that which god gave spirituall gifts for , to wit the ministering of the word , when the churches grew populous , and great personages came to her communion , the unwary pastours , let go the simplicity of th● gospell enclining so much to curiosities that some counsells decreed tha● a b●shop should not read heathen authors and gra●ian is said to have this passag● viz. doth not he seem to wa●k in vanit● and da●kness of mind , who vexing himself day a●d night in the studies of logick in the persuite of physicall specula●ion one while elevates himself above the highest heavens and afterward throws himself below the nethermost part of the earth true , the use that may be made o● reading is one thing , and the abuse another ; however let the least gift o● god be preferred in the ministry o● the word , above the greatest of human arts , otherwise we are in danger to incur the guilt of despising prophysyings ▪ lastly the truth in hand appeareth from the silence of scriptures , touching th● privation of any of the gifts of the spi●it till that which is perfect become , 1. ●or . 13. 8. 9. charity never faileth but whether there be prophesies they shall fail , whether there be tongues they shall cease , whether there be knowledge it shall vanish away , for we know in part and we prophe●●e in part . but when that which is perfect is come then that which is in part sha'l be done away . hence observe a finall determination of the matter in question , if any ask when the gifts of prophysie , knowledge and tongues &c. shall cease ? the apostles answer is , even then , when that which is perfect is come , or when we come to see face to face , or as we are seen . so then seeing the gifts of the spirit do yet remain to the church , and every of them ( as her need requires ) are attainable , it remains that we humbly consider our wants , and desire spirituall gifts , you ●ove● earnestly the best gifts . from these considerations i conclude , that howsoever it is too true that the gifts received by the present churches are but low ( and truly so are her graces ) yet thence we may not , we ought not to infer , that the gifts promised are ceased , or that the church hath now no interest therein . but contrarywise as the promise of gifts ( as well as graces ) pertains to us as we are the called of god , we ought to ●tir one another up , to seek with all dilligence and full assurance for the spirit of promise , which being received , will abundantly supply our wants , help our infirmities , convince the contrary minded by its powerfull evidence and demonstration in the ministry of the word and prayer . there be two things objected against that which is said , the first . ob : if the promise of the spirit do thus belong to the church , then this will follow , that the doctrines delivered by such gifted men must pass for oracles of god being the effects ●f the spirit of truth whose propertie it 〈◊〉 to lead into all truth . and hence ●ome have conceived the decrees ●f their counsells to be infallible , and ●thers have given out of their private ●tters or books that they were as in●allibly the word of god as the scrip●ure &c. ans . 1. those gifts do not argue ●he infallibillity of him that hath them , ●or then all the gifted brethren at co●inth had been infallible which yet they ●ere not , witness their great want of wisdom how to use their gifts to edi●ication , as also the apostles refer●ing what they delivered to tryal , telling ●s of gifted person in general ( and as ●uch not excluding himself ) that they ●ee but darkly , prophesie but in part , know but in part , so that perfection ●erein is not to be pretended . 2. that the apostles did deliver infallible and undoubted verities for all to submit to , as the very word of god &c. proceeded not hence , viz. because they were gifted men . but as being the chosen witnesses of god , purposely ordained to that very end , for which cause they saw that just one , heard the words of his mouth , and by infallible proves were assured of the resurrection of our lord and of his will concerning his kingdom , john 15 ▪ 16. ye have not chosen me , but i have chosen you and ordained you that you should go and bring forth fruit , and that your fruit should remain , that whatsoever ye shall ask the father in my name he may give it you , see acts 10. 40. 41. and acts 22. 14. 15. the god of o●r fathers hath chosen thee that thou should kn●w his will , and see that just one , and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth . for thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard . these are the fathers of the churches , the foundation layers , the master-builders in such an elevated consideration , as that the authority of one is to be valued above the authority of ten thousand subsequent teachers , which is a greater number then ever yet convened in a generall councell , 1. cor. 4. 15. 16. these were such fathers as laid up such a stock of doctrine for their children , as whoso bringeth not along with them is not to be received . 2. john. 8. 9 , 10. and whosoever corrupteth by adding takeing away or perverting is to be held accursed , to be nameless in the city of god and the book of life , the conclusion is this , gifted persons , on whom the holy ghost fell as it did on the apostles , were not thereby impowered , to propose new oracles , or to be the apostles competitors , and if any presume to these things ( as some did in the apostles dayes ) they shall fulfill that sentence , 2. tim. 3. 9. they shall proceed no further for their folly shall be made manifest to all men as theirs also was . ob. 2. if the gifts of the spirit , 1. cor. 12. have continued in the church as you teach , 't is strange we have no account of them since their days , unless we regard the papacy who have claim'd the gift of miracles in every age , which they urge as an undoubted proof that they only are the church of christ . ans . 1. it is true that people do pretend , as 't is said in the objection and it is now my business to examine the goodness of that pretence , only this i say they cannot find their church to have had a being in every age since christ , and therefore very unlikely to prove what they say in the case of miracles . but put case that since they have had a being in the world , some signs or wonders have been done among them , yet hence to infer the truth of their church state is very unsafe , sith before an equall judge others will be found to have as clear a claim to miracles as themselves . * mat. 7. 22. many w●ll say unto me in that day have we not prophesi●d in thy name , and in thy name have we cast out devils and in thy name have done many wondrous works . and then will i profess un●o them i never knew you , depart from me ye workers of iniquity , and though our saviour saith , no man can do a miracle in his name and lightly speak evil of him , yet that very speech supposes the thing possible . it doth not follow therefore that wheresoever miraculous gifts are there is the true church , but she is only known by her conformity to the doctrine of god our saviour , chiefly in the principles of religion , heb. 6. 1. 2. for we are his house if built upon that foundation of repentance , faith , &c ▪ and pa●takers of him , if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast to the end otherwise not . heb. 3. 6. 14. if any come unto you and bring not this doctrine receive him not to house , no , though he work miracles , for thus saith the lord. if there arise among you a prophet or a dreamer of dreams , and giveth thee asign or a wonder , and the sign or the wonder come to pass , whereof he spake unto thee [ now note if he do this ] saying let us go after other gods ( which thou hast not koown ) and let us serve them , thou shalt not hearken to the words of that prophet — for the lord your god proveth you to know whether you love the lord your god , with all your heart , and with all your soul. and hence learn this one thing that gods truth is not to give place to any gifts , but all gifts are to subserve to the furtherance of his truth . to conclude as we ought not to be ignorant of the gifts of the spirit , so neither of the means ordain'd of god to obtain those gifts . the primitive churches are herein our best guide as the word directs . t is well known ( and i think granted on all hand● ) that they used the solemn ordinance of prayer and imposition of hands for obtaining the promised spirit , at least with respect to these gifts . now be it so ( though i say for the graces or fruits also ) then seeing these gifts are promised to us as well as unto them , and are attainable , and in part ( at least ) attained by many , what should hinder the churches , but that now they should tread in this path , with faith and full assurance that a blessing is in it ? as in holy baptism we are placed ( as it were ) among those whose sins are washed away in the blood of the lamb. so in this holy ordinance of prayer and imposition of hands we are in a solemn manner ushered , into the promise of the holy spirit , and as the pardon of our sins signified in baptism doth not prevent , but better capaciate us to pray daily forgive us our ●●espasses , so imposition of hands doth put us into a better capacity to seek dayly for the gifts and graces of the spiri● , b●cause now solemnly intercessed in the promise , by that very way the primi●ive saints were intercessed therein , acts 8. 15 , 17. acts 19. 2. 6. 2 tim. 1. 6. heb. 6. 12. who when they were down prayed for them that they might receive the holy ghost , then laid they their hands on them and they receithe holy ghost . have they received of the holy ghost since the believed ? and when paul had laid his hand is on them , the holy ghost 〈◊〉 on them . wherefore i put th●e in rem●mb●ance that thou stir up the gift of god which is in thee by the putting o● of my hands . — the foundation of repentance , and of faith towards god of the d●ctrine of bap●ism and of laying on of hands , of the resurrection of the dead , and of eternal judgement . what shall i 〈◊〉 , the scriptures are evidence sufficient that this ordinance is of divine institution , is from heaven ; the promise which it leads to ●s perpetual , and universal , it belong , to the whole body . there is one body and one spirit even as ye are called i● 〈◊〉 hope of your calling . a post-script . taken out of the works of dr. jer. taylor , in defence of laying on of hands , as a never-failing ministery . we have seen the original [ of laying on of hands ] from christ the practice and exercise of it in the apostles , and the first converts in christianity , that which i shall now remark is , that this is established and passed into a christian doctrine . the waranty for what i say is the words of st. paul where the holy rite of confirmation , so called from the effect of this ministration , and expressed by the ritual part of it , imposition of hands is reckoned a foundamental point 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 not laying again the foundation of repentance from deas works , and of faith towards god , of the doctrine of baptism , and of laying on of hands , of resurrection from the dead and of eternal judgement ; here are six foundamental points of st. pauls catechism which he said as t●e foundation or beginning of the institution of the christian church , and amongst these imposition of hands is reckoned as a p●rt of the foundation and therefore they who deny it , dig up foundations . now that this imposition of hands is that which the apostles used in confirming the baptized and invocating the holy g●ost upon them rem●ins to be pro●●● . — absolution of penitents cannot be meant here , not only b●cause we never read that the apostles did use that ceremony in their absolutions , but because the apost●e speaking of the foundation in which baptism is . — there need●d no absolution but bap●ismal ; for they and we believi●g gone baptism for the rem●ssion of sins , this is al the absolution that can be at the first and in the foundation . the * other was secunda post 〈◊〉 frag●●m tabula . 〈◊〉 me in after when men had m●de shipwrack of their good conscienscience and were as st. peter saith — unmindful of the former cleansing . 2. it cannot be meant of ordination and this is also evident . 1. because the apostle saves he would thence forth leave to speak of the foundation and go on to perfection , that is to higher misteries . now in ri●uals of which he speaks , there is none higher then ordination . 2. the apostle saying he would speak no more of laying on of hands goes presentl● to discourse , of the misteriousness of the evangelical priest-hood , and the honor of that vocation , by which it is evident he spake nothing of ordination in the catechism , or narrative of foundamentals . 3. this also appears from t●e context , not only because laying on of hands is immediately set after baptism but also because in the very next words of this discourse , he does enumerate and apportion to baptism , and [ imp●sition of hands ] their proper and proportioned effects . to b●ptism il●umira●ion , — and to confirma●ion he reckons tasting the heavenly gift and being made par●akers of the holy ghost ▪ by the thing sig●ified declaring the sign , and by ●he miste●y the 〈◊〉 ▪ upon these words ●t chrisostom● discoursing sayes , that all these are foundamental articles : that it that ●e ought to repent from dead works ; to be baptized ●●to the faith of christ , and be made worthy of the gift of the spirit , who is given by imposition of hands and we are to be taught the misteries of the resurrection and eternal judgement . this catechism ( sayes he ) is perfect , so that if any man have faith in god , and being baptized is also confirmed and so tasts the heavenly gift , and partakes of the holy ghost , by hope of the resurrection tasts of the good things of the world to come , if he falls away from this state — digging down and turning up these foundations he shall never be built again , he can never be baptized again — confirmed again . god will not begin again , &c. he cannot be made a christian twice . — this is the full explication of this excellent place , and any other ways it cannot be reasonably exp●icated . — i shall observe one thing more out of this testimony of st. paul he cal●s it the doctrine of baptism and laying on of hands , by which it does not only appear to be a lasting ministry , because no part of the christian doctrine could change or be abolished but hence also it appears to be divine institution . for it were not st. paul had been guilty of that which our blessed savior reproves in the scribes and pharises , and should have taught for doctrines the commandements of men. which because it cannot be supposed , it must follow that this doctrine of confirmation , or imposition of hands is apostolicall and divine . the argument is clear , and not easily to be reproved . yea but what is this to us ? it belong'd to the days of wonder and extraordinary . the holy ghost breathed upon the apostle● and apostolicall men , but then he breath'd his last ; vecendente gratiae recessit disiplina ; when the grace departed we had no further need of the cerimony . in answer to this i shall 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by divers particulars evince plainly , that this ministry — was not temporary and relative only to the acts of the apostles , but was to descend to the church for ever . this indeed is done already in the proceeding sect in which it is clearly manifested , that christ himself made the baptism of the spirit necessary to the church ▪ he declar'd the fruits of this baptism , and did particularly relate it to the descent of the holy spirit upon the church at and after that glorious pe●tie●st . he sa●ctified it and commended it b● hi● example ; just as he sanctified the flood jordan , and all other waters to the misticall washing away of sin , viz. by his great example , and fulfi●ling this righteousness also . this doctrine the apostles first found in their own persons , and experience , and practised to all their converts , by a solemn , and externall rite ; and all this p●ssed into an evangelicall , doct●ine the whole mistery being signified by the externall rite in the words of the apostle , as before it was by christ expressing only the internall . so that there needs n● more strength to this argument . but that there may be wanting no moments to this t●uth which the holy scripture affords , i shall add more weight to it ; and , 1. the perpetuity of this rite appears , because this great gift of the holy ghost was promised to abide with the chu●ches for ever . and when the je●s hea●d the apostles speak with tongues at the first and miraculous d●s●ent of the spirit in pen●●c●st , to take of the stra●ge●ess of the wond●r , and the envy of the power . st. pe●er at that very time tells them plainly . re●●nt and be baptiz●d eve●y one of you — and 〈◊〉 shall rece●●e the gift of the holy ghost 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 not the meanest person among you all , but shall receive this great thing , which ye observe us to have received and not only you , but your children too , not of this ●eneration only , sed nati natorum et q●i n●centur ab illis , but your children for ever . for the promise is to you and to your children and to all that are affar off , even to as many as the lord your god shall call ▪ now then let it be considered . 1. this gift is by promise , by a promise not made to the apostles alone , but to all ; to all for ever . 2. consider here at the very first as there is a verbum , a word of promise , so there is a sacramentum too i use the word — — in a large sence only , and according to the stile of the primitive church ) it is a rite partly morall ; and partly cerimoniall , the first is prayer , the other is laying on of the hands : and to an effect that is but transient and extraordinary , and of a little abode , it is not easily to be supposed that such a solemnity should be appointed . i say such a solemnity ; that is , it not imaginable that a solemn rite , annexed to a perpetuall promise should be transient and temporary for by the nature of relatives they may be of equall abode , the cerimony or rite was anexed to the promise , and therefore also must be for ever . * 3 : this is attested by st. paul who reduces this argument to this mistery saying , in home after that you believed — ye were sealed with the holy spirit of promise . he spake it to the ephesians who well understood his meaning , by remembring what was done to themselves by the apostle , act. 19. 6. but a while before , who after he had baptised them did lay his hands upon them , and so they received the holy spirit of promise ; for here the very matter of fact is the clearest comentary on st. pauls words — — but fourthly . what hinders any man from a quick consent at the first representation of these plain reasonings and authorityes ? is it because there were extraordinary effects accompanying this ministration , and because now there are not , that we will suppose the whole oeconomy must cease ? if this be it , and indeed this is all that can be pretended in opposition to it , it is infinitely vain . 1. because these ex●raordinary effect , did continue even after the death of all the apostles . st. frenoeus saies they did continue even to his time , even the greatest instance of miraculous power . et infraternitate , sap●ssimc propter aliquid necessarium , &c. when god saw it necessary , and the church prayed and fasted much , they did miraculous things , even of reducing the spirit to a dead man. 2. in the days of the ap●stles the spirit did produce miraculous effects , but neither always , nor at all in all men , are all workers of miracles , &c. no , the spirit bloweth where it listeth , and as he listeth he gives gifts to all , but to some after this manner , and some after that . 3. these gifts were not necessary at , all times any more then to all persons , but the promise did belong to all and was made to all , and was performed to all . — and therefore if the grace be given to all , there is no reason that the ritual ministration of that grace should cease upon pretence that the spirit is not given extraordinarily . other arguments he hath ( many ) to the same purpose , and a● i conceive well worthy the consideration of all christians * specially those that are doubtfull in this principle of religion but i shall sh●t up all with a few of his citations out of the works of antient writers , in behalf of this point of faith . and first noteing how that originally it came from the apostles . in the second century he brings thophilus , antiochenus and ●ertullian , the latter saith thus , d● hinc manus imponitur , &c. after baptism the hand is imposed by blessing , calling , and inviting the holy spirit . — being cleansed by baptismal water , we are dispos'd for the holy spirit under the hand of the angel of the church , and to this effect the rest , &c. for the third century he brings origen , cyprian , dionis , and eusebius , the first testimony set down is out of cyprian who writing upon the passage in acts 8. 14. saith , which custome is also descended to us , that they who are baptized might be brought by the rulers of the church and by prayer and imposition of hands receive the lords signature , &c. for the fourth hundred he brings melchiades , optatus , civil , and others speaking very highly of the use of this ministration and then brings urba● the first , as more plainly setting down what the rest delivered more siguratively , in these words omnes fideles , &c. all faithful people ought to receive the holy spirit by imposition of the bishops hands after baptism . and having added yet more witnesses of this kind , he alleadges six counsells , to evince the same thing , viz. that this ordinance of prayer , laying on of hands were received together with the other principles by christians generally . the decree of one of these counsels ( concerning such as had received baptism in a regular form ) is in these words manus ●antum eiis imponatur ut accipiant spiritum sanctum . let there be imposition of hands that they may receive the holy ghost . afterwards the dr. concludes thus . so many fathers testifying the practice of the church and teaching this doctrine , and so many more fathers as it were assembled in six councells , all giving witness to this holy rite and that in pursuance of scripture are too great a blood of witnesses to be despised by any man that calls himself a christian . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a41783-e410 gal. 3. 27. heb. 6. 2. act. 2. 38. mark 1. 5. acts 8. 12 , acts 18 , 8. libert . proph● . p , 228. to pag. 246. * which yet the baptists do not grant . * it is a saying of augustin , de trahe verbum quid est aqua &c. take away the word and what is water , nothing but water joyn the word to the element and it is made a sacrament . this consideration is very concluding against paedo baptism , for to the infant , the word is as it were taken away from the element , a●d cons●quent y accordirg to aug. it can be no sacrament to them at all . ex manu controv● under the probation of divers of their doctors , professors and students in theology . p. 372. to 377. s. n. antid . se diod te . in act 2. * a thing wholy unknown that they have any such receit of the spirit . eras. parrap . ●n 1 cor. 7. eraz. par . on math. 28. ludovicus vives . fabian . hugo grotius anno 315. con ne●caes . * 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 tertul. lib. de bap. cap. 18. tertull. lib. de baptis . cap. 18. * 〈◊〉 . to quest . in ● . baptisma . mark 6. perseverence in faith must here be understood , with the fruits of faith a●so . * for they do ●●t only deny such infants the act , but the ●ight to baptism because the children of ●nbelievers . verse . 4. litturgy . marq. of worcest . certam . relig. * secundum ▪ fisher . * for gods ways are not to be left to mans will be commands and t is mans duty to obey . ex opp . perk. s●e the scholast . discourse against symbol with antichrist . notes for div a41783-e4610 the poynt to be proved . 1 from the apostles scope . * 1 cor. 3. 16. 2 cor. 6. 16. 2. from the extent of the promise . 3. from the nature of the duties of the church . 4. from the nature and perpetuity of the exhortations to seek for the spirit . 5. from the continuation of spiritual gifts in the church to this day . it is probable that paul made use of his education in speaking divers languages , as may be perceived by his discou●ses in the acts of the apostles , and by the epistles which he wrote to severall churches , useing therein ( as 't is confessed ) frequently the greek tongue . 6. from the silence of the scriptures , as to the privation of the gifts of the spirit &c , 1. cor. 2. 4. * which yet shall avail them nothing , because they wanted truth with their gifts . notes for div a41783-e6520 * me●ning that laying on of hands used by some at the absolving penetents . * [ i think this wi●l abide tryall , sith we may not expect a change of the dispensation we are under ; otherwise the promise might continue under some other rite or elce without it ] * who know how to read men without being scandi ized if they meet with phraises , and some nothing which are doubtful as its the case of most that write . ● con. arles . c. 8. the church-membership of children, and their right to baptisme according to that holy and everlasting covenant of god, established between himself and the faithfull ... cleared up in a letter, sent unto a worthy friend of the author ... / by thomas shepard ... shepard, thomas, 1605-1649. 1663 approx. 125 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 25 1-bit group-iv tiff 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a59660) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 96691) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 400:9) the church-membership of children, and their right to baptisme according to that holy and everlasting covenant of god, established between himself and the faithfull ... cleared up in a letter, sent unto a worthy friend of the author ... / by thomas shepard ... shepard, thomas, 1605-1649. [23], 26 p. printed by samuel green, cambridg : 1663. errata: p. 26. reproduction of original in university of michigan libraries. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism -early works to 1800. 2003-02 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2003-03 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2003-05 judith siefring sampled and proofread 2003-05 judith siefring text and markup reviewed and edited 2003-06 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the church membership of children , and their right to baptisme , according to that holy and everlasting covenant of god , established between himself , and the faithfull and their seed after them , in their generations : cleared up in a letter , sent unto a worthy friend of the avthor , and many yeares agoe written touching that subject ; by thomas shepard , somtimes pastor of the church of christ at cambridg in new-england . published 〈◊〉 the earnest request of many : for the consolation and encouragement , both of parents and children in the lord. genesis 17.7 . and i will establish my covenant between me and the● and thy 〈…〉 generations , for an everlasting ●●venant , to be a god unto thee , and to thy seed after thee . mark. 16.16 . he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved . acts. 2.39 . for the promise is unto you , and to your children , and to all that are a●●r● off , even as many as the lord our god shall call . 1 cor. 7.14 . else were your children unclean , but now are they holy. cambridg printed by samuel green. 1663. chemnitivs , that eminent light in the church of god in those elaborate workes of his against the papists ( exam : part 2. can : 14. de baptismo ) hath this memorable saying , viz. it is not to be left free , to the choice of those who have been baptized in infancy , when they come to be adult , whether or no they will have that confirmed , which was done in their baptisme ; as though the covenant of grace , & testament of peace , which is offered and sealed up to little children in baptisme , should then first begin to be established , when the consent of their will , when adult , is added thereunto : for from this wicked foundation , the anabaptists simply have taken away , and condemned paedobaptisme ; but such baptized little ones are to be admonished , as they grow up , what a covenant of grace , and testament of peace it is , which god hath entred into with them in baptisme : and by what promise of gratitude they have likewise obliged themselve 〈◊〉 obedience to god , with the renouncing of the devil ; and they are 〈◊〉 to be exhorted , that they render thanks to god for that wonderful great benefit , that they abide in that covenant of peace , and endeavour to fullfil that obligation , by mortifying sin , and setting upon newness of life , and that they do this freely , and sincerely : or if they shall , through unthankfullness , depart from that ▪ covenant , and ingagement , that then they repent , and return to the covenant , and subject themselves again to that stipulated obedience . but us for them that shall do otherwise , the most severe comminations of the wrath and indignation of god are to be heap't up , and set before them ; unto which [ saith he ] excommunication is to be added , for these are the weapons of our warfare . 2. cor. 10. a preface to the reader . christian reader , m●ght i have had mine own choice , and desires granted , some other should have performed the task of a preface to the following treatise of my precious and much honoured father ; but being put upon it , by divers worthy friends , whom i knew not how to deny , i shall therefore humbly premise a word or two , in tenderness to the truth , and out of unfained love to those especially of christ's poor sheep ( how ever feeble , or diseased ) that either have been , or may be in danger of going astray from so great a truth , as is the subject of the ensuing discourse : being sincerely desirous , that they may be restored , and from thence returned unto the shepherd , and bishop of our soules , and may in nothing be made a prey to him , who is our great adversary , the devil , who walketh about , seeking whom he may devour . for we should not be ignorant of his devices . the enmity put by the lord between the seed of the woman and the seed of the serpent , gen. 3.15 . soon began to work , even in the infancy of the church , in the family of our first parents , as we see gen. 4.8 . by the martyrdome of righteous abel . no small portion of that fixed hatred , and hostility of the old serpent , hath ever since been discovered against the young ones of christs little flock . the multiplication of the children of israel , is the occasion why pharaoh deals so wisely as we read ; endeavouring first by the midwives , secretly to destroy the male children : and after that , more openly by an edict , to drown them in his egyptian waters ; for which what ever his pretence might be , alleadged exod. 1.10 . yet no doubt ( as calvin on the place somewhat that way hint's ) satan had a design therein , to cut of the name and posteri●y of abraham ( who is the father of all them that beleive , even of us all : the father of many nation , rom. 4.11 , 16 , 17. ) and so to evacuate , and annihilate the promise of god , even that great promise of his everlasting covenant , to be a god to him , and to his seed for ever , in their generations . hence also afterward we find this spite of the great accuser of the brethren , vented against these poor little ones , in the forbidding them communion with the church of god in that worship which god had instituted , and which he had commanded his people by the hand of moses and aaron , to observe , exod. 10.3 . let my people goe , that they may serve me , saith the lord ▪ but hardhearted pharaoh seemes to scruple whether the young children are a part of the lord● people , as appears by his question verse 8. [ but who are they that shall go● ? ] moses pleads for the young , as well as the old ; for the sons , and the daughters , verse 9. but pharaoh is of another apprehension , and resolution , verse 10 , 11. he will let the men goe and serve the lord , but not the little ones . again haman the agagite we find is not satisfied with the destruction of the old generation of the iewes , but the little children of the church also are expresly mentioned , and designed to the same condemnation , and massacre with their fathers est● . 3.13 . and much more of the like nature might be alledged out of many records both ecclesiastical , and other , were it needfull : the satanicall delusions of those heretical cataphrygians , and pep●z●ans of o●d , who were wont to mingle the eucharist with the blood of an infant of a year old ( of whom austin speaks , tom. 6. do haeresibus ad quodvultde●m ) are not unknown . not here to insist on that instance of herods infanticide , mat. 2.16 , 17. we need not so much wonder at hazaels cruelty against the children of israel in sl●ying their young men with th● sword , and dashing their children , and r●pping up their women with child , 2 king. 8.12 . seing satan hath many times prevailed with those who were church-members , and of long standing in the house of god even the pare●● themselves , to murder and sacrifice their infants and little ones , which were the lords children , and born unto the lord , ezek. 16 , 20 , 21. &c. such an evil eye doth that great adversary of our comfort , and salvation ( seing himselfe shut out of the kingdom of heaven ) bear against these little ones , whom christ hath taken in to himselfe , and concerning whom our saviour professeth , that of such is the kingdome of god , luke 18.16 . so doth he envy to see them in the armes of christ and blessed by him , and to have any room in his house , or so much as an externall visible interest in the covenant , with the initiatory seal and livery thereof . baptisme being the seal to all christianity , 't is sathan's policy therefore to strike at that , that in cashiering it , he may have at all ; hereunto tend's his dealing with witches many times , ( of which divers have spoken ) in cau●ing them when they become first his prosely●es , solemnly to renounce the trinity ( into the name of which they have been baptised ) especially their salvation by christ , and saith cooper , in his book entituled , the mysterie● of witchcraft discovered . cap. 6. sec. 1. pag. 91. in token thereof to disclaim their baptisme . an ill office and work then surely are they imployed in , whose way and indeavours , shall center in the accomplishing of that which satan hath been so busily , and with such malignity , for so many ages undertaking , and no great thanks will such receive for that labour from the lord jesus another day . if christ was so much displeased , that his disciples rebuked those , who brought their children to him , mark 10.14 : and if the apostle peter received so severe a check as wee read mat. 16.22 , 23. for speaking that , which had a tendency to take the lord jesus off from ●aying down the price of r●●emption : how much more then will he be now displeased if ( after such rebuke and warning given ) any shall attempt to keep from him , and deprive him of , his redeemed , whom he hath purchased by so dear a price ? so many , i mean , of his purchased ones , as the number of the infants and children of believers ( de●d , and alive , and to be born , ) amount's unto ? why may we not believe , that an exceeding great multitude of the sheep that shall be seen standing at the right ha●d of iesus christ in the day of iudgment , shall be a company of these lambs ? as to withhold from christ so great a part of his purchase ( the labour of the anabapt●st ) must needs be no other then highly antichristian ; so to make good , and recover the interest of christ in such , and the glory which he obtaines by them , according to the enlarged grant of the charter of h●s new-testament ; the scope , and work of these few sheets ) is a seruice pleasing unto christ , who out of the mouthes of these ba●●s , and suck●●ngs even 〈…〉 , mat. 21.15 , 16. and so i trust will be acceptable to his people , who when as they must go down to the d●st and cannot keep alive their own soules , yet may be hold their seed succeeding them in the service & worship of god , being ●ccounted to th● lord 〈◊〉 ●●generation , psal. 22.28 , 29 , 30 , 31. ( 〈◊〉 r●vet in locum ) schismatically to refuse to hold ecclesiasticall communion with so great a part of the church of christ , as the children of believers are , ( in many places , the major part thereof ) is a rigid and sinfull separation , and gratifying the designe of the papists ( the greatest separatists in the world ) as by & by may be further seen . and indeed the lord ( avenging the quarrel of his covenant , wherin he hath alwayes been exceeding jealous ) hath manifested not a little of his anger , and displeasure against those who have troubled these baptismal waters of the sanctuary ; the awfull and tremendous passages of providence recorded in several histories , concerning the original and progress of anabaptisme : and relating to god's strange , judicial hand against so many of them that have been through-paced therin , in delivering them up to spiritual judgments , to believe lies ; and to fall , step by step , into almost all sorts of heresies , and to the commission of the most abhorred impieties , and loathsome wickednesses , and outrages , against the commands both of the first and second table , ( as luther , bullinger , calvi●● beza , and others generally and abundantly testifie ) they are very observable , and not to be passed over slightly ; and may make every honest & serious heart to tremble when ever he finds himselfe inclining to that path : to this purpose , and concerning anabaptism in this our age ( beside many o●ther authors i might cite ) read only baxter's plain scripture proof of infants church-membership , pag. 138 , 139 , 140 — 152. and as in the dawning of the reformation , begun by those worthies of christ in the last centurie , anabaptisme seem's to be the tr●j in h●rse whereby so great confusion did befall that israel , and was such a remora to that glorio●s work then begun in germanie , and other neighbouring countries ; so now in the further progresse of that reformation here in this our israel ▪ should anabaptisme likewise ( especially accompanied with dona●isme it 's wo●ded concubine ) brood and become the instrument or medium of our miseries and confusions , possibly then experience ( a flow , but many times a sure and severe instructer ) may help some at length to see farther into the mystery of this iniquity , then now they do . for in truth it is not improbable , that the man of sin seeing he could not openly & at once ruine the reformed churches in the dayes of those famous servants of christ before exprest , did attempt secretly , and gradually to do is this way ; viz. by first sending forth his emissaries among the churches , who might fill them with the smoake of anabaptisme , that so he might the more securely pass to and fro , being undiscerned in such a fog : whence what mischief was wrought , and what an hindrance those turbulent anabaptists were to the kingdom of jesus christ in that age ( for that was the first time of their swarming , as the most judicious have observed ) by vilifying , reproaching , and decrying the ministry ; crying up themselves as the most godly , spirituall , and perfect ; iudging the old-testament to be but as an almanack out of date ; denying scripture-consequences giving false interpretations of scripture , especially by allegories wresting the same to their own destruction ; makeing and fomenting schismes and factions in the churches ; denying the magistrates coercive power in matters of religion ; making their own fanatick spirit the supream judge unto all kind of disorder , &c. the writings of the godly learned in those times do abundantly even to amazement inform us . and indeed the great consent and harmony between the main tenets of the anabaptists , and papists in this point , giues not a a little ground for holy jealousie too sadly to suspect at what back-door it was that the anabaptist first crept forth . and hence it is that in the controversies between the protestants and the papists , we shall generally , and abundantly find , the papists denying the ho●●ness of the infants of beleivers before baptisme ; and how neer of kin this is to anabaptisme the reader may easily guess : and in like manner denying that great truth ( as is afterward shewed in this treatise ) viz. that the covenant of god with abraham under the old-testament , was the same for substance with what is now confirmed with us under the new-testament , &c. which ( t is known ) the anabaptists also generally assert : let me therefore propound a few instances this way , wherby we may see what patrons of anabaptisme the papists are , in regard of those principles ( i mean ) and radicall errours wherin the papists and an●baptists ( although by divers of them , upon the account of a diverse interest ) symbolize and unite against the orthodox , and speak herein , in a manner , the same thing ( distinguishing alwaies between the opinion , and the person ; and between some that are deceived , in other points orthodox and precious christians ; and others that are deceivers . ) the main pillars of anabaptisme being no better then some of the old rotten sl●●ds and principles of popery , fetcht at first from thence in all likelyhood , and so inclining thitherward again . the d●●lect of the anabaptist is generally ( and too much by some ) understood , and therefore i forbear quotations out of their own writings ; possibly some may not have so much taken notice of the l●k● from the papist , and therefore i shall briefly manifest the ●a●e , by shewing where we shall find some of the chief of those worthies that fought the lords battles against antichrist , opposing , and confuting them both , therein : i will cite a few particulars this way among many the like which m●ght be produced from severall other eminent author● , holy , burning , and shining lights in the churches of christ , who have been the lords witnesses against the darkness of that spirituall egypt ; and whose testimonie in this matter concludes as strongly against the anabaptists , having espoused those antichristian notions so neerly to themselves . 1. in those words of the covenant ( i will be a god to thee and thy seed after thee ) neither life eternall is promised nor remission of sins , but onely a certain peculiar temporall protection : saith b●ll●rmine ( agreeing therein with the ana●aptist ) against whom herein we find ●bam●er pleading for us , panstrat . tom . 4. li● . 3 cap. 3. parag. 9 , 10. &c. and ●ive . on gen. 17.11 . again , we read ( saith bellarmine , the great g●●ah of the papists ) that god promised unto abraham when he enjoyned him circumcision , earthly matters only , according to the letter : that is , the propagation of a posterity , and the land of palestine . read ames opposing him ; bellarm. 〈◊〉 . tom. 3. lib. 1 chap. 4. thes. 9. 2. touching the perverse and ca●abaptistic●ll intent and meaning of that expression of the papists , viz. that spirituall promises d●scend to us not by carnall generation ( as they call it : the very phrase of many anabaptists , used in a way of de●ision of the grace of god ) but by spirituall r●generation &c. ( they are the w●rds of bellarmine and other p●pists , c●ted & confuted by am●s & others ) read ames his answer thereto , b●● ener . ●om . 3. lib. 2. cap. 1. thes. 5. ( consonant to the judgment of the o●thoac● ) viz. we acknowledg indeed spirituall regeneration to be necessary to the solid participation of the promises ; but that that regeneration is part of the promises , and belongs in a singular manner to the children of believers , the very forme of the covenant manifestly declares . see likewise chamier largely replying for us against bellarmine , stapleton , and others of the papists . pa●stra● . tom . 4 lib. 5. cap. 10. parag . 24 , 25 , 26 , 27 , &c : 3. the sacraments of the old law ( or testament saith bellarmine● had no absolute promise of grace annexed , & the promises annexed to thos● old sacraments were fulfilled , although men did not believe . read ames against him . ibid. l. 1. cap. 4. the. 5 , 7. again , the papists [ saith chemnit . hold ; that god , by the sacraments of the old testament , which had eve● the word of promise annexed , did exhibite & conferr no grace to believers which [ saith he ] is maifestly false ; circumcision alone [ which , as he sheweth from scripture , is called the s●al of the righteousness of faith demonstrateth as much . and thereupon he sheweth the reason why the papists so much urge that difference between the sacraments of the old & new testament , viz. because they endeavour by any manner of meanes to defend and stablish the opinion they have of their opus operatum . chemnitij exam. par . 2. de sacram. sub canon . 2. what a forcible engine of the man of sin this is , and of what vast concernment as to his interest , i need not here express , and what arrows of anabaptisme , drawn out of this very quiver , have been shot against the orthodox in this point , is known unto not a few . moreover , as to the comparison in scripture made between the sacraments of the old and new testament , that in 1 cor. 10.1 — 4. ( among several other scriptures ) is cited by ames against bellarmine where the apostle speake's of our fathers being baptized in the sea &c : thereby intimating our sacraments to be the same for substance with theirs : or sacramental signes and seales of one and the same sqiritual grace , so that the covenant-mercies , or promises of spiritual good are the same to us as to them : bellarmine opposeth this [ as doth the anabaptist ] the fathers [ saith he ] are said to eat the same meat not because ours and theirs was the same , but because they themselves , all of them did eat the same : but that meat and drinke were not sacraments ; they had no promise anexed &c : bell● enerv . tom . 3. l. 1. c. 4. th . 10. and cham. panstrat . tom . 4. l. 3. c. 2. 4. the scripture no where call's circumcision a seal [ saith bellarmine to rom. 4. ] unless it be in this place , where abraham is spoken of , which is a manifest argument that circumcision was a seal unto abraham alone ames . ibid. c. 1. th . 12. by this weapon also fetcht out of the armory of antichrist , hath the anabaptist not a little gratifyed the common adversary . 5. the papists generally assert , that the baptisme of john was not the same for substance with the baptisme of christ , nor had the same efficacy , as the baptisme of christ hath . which tenet see confuted by cartwright on the new testament , mat. 3.11 . and by ames beller . 〈◊〉 . t. 3. l. 2. c. 5. th . 1 , 2. &c : and rivet cathol . orthod . tractat ▪ 3. qu. a. and chemnir . exam . part 2. de baptismo sub canon . 1. and chamier panstrat . t. 4. l. 5. c. 12. still we see the harmony between the papist and the anabaptist . and hence we find likewise the papist pleading for the rebaptizing of those who had received the baptisme of john. chamier ibid. cap. 13. paragr . 35. &c : 6. the papists assert , that laicks [ as they call them , i. e. those that are not in office in the church ] may in case administer baptisme : yea that not onely men but women may do it . read ames his confutation thereof , bell. enerv . tom . 3. l. 2. cap. 2. and rivet against baily the jesuit , cathol . orthod . tractat . 3. qu. 7. add thereto chamiers panstr . tom . 4. l. 5. cap. 14. de legitimo baptismi ministro . where , among other passages , citing the thesis of suarez the iesuit , viz : that any body whosoever , that 〈◊〉 speak , and wash , may be a sufficient minister of baptisme ; whether he be man or woman ; believer or unbeliever ; baptised or not baptized , if so be he know how to wash , and utter the words with a due mention , haec assertio ( saith the jesuit ) est omnino certa , but saith chamier in the name of the orthodox , we teach the contrary , viz. that the right of conferring baptisme belongs to those only who are publick officers in the church &c. which accordingly he there makes good against the papists . 7 baily the iesuite ( whom rivet encountereth ) to the question between the orthodox and the papist ; viz. whether the infants of believers are holy before baptisme ? he answereth roundly for them ; no . rivet . cath. orthod . tract . 3. q 3. and touching that famous place controverted between our selves and the anabap●●sts , in regard of their wresting , and perverting the sence of that scripture , 1 cor. 7.14 . [ ●ls● w●r● your children unclean , but now they are holy ] we may observe how they tread in ehe steps of the papists that have gone before them therein , ( as they likewiso do in that noted scripture col 2.11 , 12. not allowing baptisme to answer circumcision according to the mind and meaning of the holy-ghost : wherein see ames against them , bel. enerv. tom. 3. l 1. ca● . 4. thes. 13. and rivet in gen. 17 exercit : 88. pag. 340. &c. take a tast of that 1 cor. 7. as followeth ; baily ( the jesuit ) before cited , ibid : quest . 3. laboureth thus to avoid the dint of that text , the apostle ( saith he ) either speaks of a civil sanctification before men , that the infants should not be illegitamate or bastards : or else of an instrumental sanctification , because that one shall procure the salvation of the other , &c. the like we find of bellarmine's apprehention and judgment of the sence of that scripture ; such children ( saith he ) are said to be not ( unclean ) that is , infamous and bastards : but ( holy ) that is , legitimate , and free from civil ignominie : ames . ibid. lib. 2. c. 1. thes. 6. the rhemists also very perniciously abuse this scripture ( and are not therein , without their antipaedobaptisticall followers ) blessed cartwright excellently upon the place in his confutation of their annotations on the new-testament , defend's this cause of christ against their popish glosses : it is ( saith he ) one thing ( oftentimes in the scripture ) to be sanctified , and another to be holy : as for you , you err in both : for when it is said , the unbelieving party is sanctified by the believing , it is not only meant , as you say , that the marriage is an occasion of the sanctification to the infidel party , but that the use of the infidel party , in marriage company , is sanctified , or made holy and lawfull unto the believing party ; as meat and drink is said to be sanctified unto us by the word & prayer , 1 tim. 4.5 . and as your interpretation here is short , so in the exposition of the holiness of the children , which are begotten in this matrimony , it is utterly false : and first it is to be observed , that the apostle speaking of the children , doth not ( as you do ) apply one word of them to both , saying that they are sanctified , but saith that they are holy ; which is more then he had spoken before of the infidel party : for although our meat , and drink be sanctified unto us , and that the use of them is holy to those which are holy , yet the meats , and drinks themselves are not holy : if therefore you were short in the interpretation of sanctified , you fail much more , in giving the same exposition unto the holiness of the children ; for if the holiness here spoken of , be not in the children when they are begotten , and born of the parents , but come unto them afterward by baptisme and faith ; there groweth no sufficient comfort unto the faithfull party to continue in marriage with the infidel , consid●ring that occasion of holiness might come otherw●se then by marriage : for that which is able to uphold the faithfull in comfort , and strength to abide in marriage with the infidel , is the knowledg that the children begotten in that marriage are in covenant , and are children of gods favour , and grace , washed in christs bloud , and sanctified by his spirit : and if you will know what this holyness of children new-born is ; the apostle telleth you , gal. 2.15 . that it is [ through the covenant ] to be a iew by nature , or birth , and if you will yet further understand what the holyness of children is , the apostle , in the same place , telleth you ; that it is , not to be sinners by nature as those which are born of the heathen , for as much as their sins who are in covenant , are by christ not reckoned unto them . and this doctrine of the holyness of the children which are born of the faithfull , if you could not attain unto , it is so sensibly s●t forth unto you , that unless together with the knowledg of the truth , you are also bereaved of your common sence , you cannot be ignorant of it : for how can you but understand , that if the root be holy , the branch is holy , rom. 11.16 . and if the first fruits be holy , the whole crop is holy all which privilidges of children new-born , sometime being proper to the iewes , are now our priviledges , as well as theirs ; sithence we are grown int● one body w●th them , ephes. 2.15 . and ( being burgesse● of the same heavenly city that they are ] must needs have the same infranchisement , and prerogatives , t●●t they have : not that every one which is ●orn under the covenant is holy , but t●●t they are so to be taken of the church , until the contrary do manifestly appear , &c. by the premises we may see therefore whence [ even from that mother of harlots ] probably this illegitimate birth , this antichrist an fl●ud of anab●●t●●me hath issued forth ; yea and i also fear is l●ke to be ●●sed , and maintained ●n it's course , unt●l god hath dried up those breast , and rive●s of spiritual babylon , in the mean while , calvins admonition touching anabapt●sme , may not be unseasonable , meri ò debet nobis esse suspectum , quicquid à tali officina proa●erit . opuscu● : ●n psychopannychia . pag. 411. s. m. there are some who though they graunt the baptisme of some children , yet utterly deny the continuance of that covenant-mercy of god to their succeeding generations , though the church-society whereof they were members be not dissolved , nor the surviveing posterity so much as deserve to be , by the discipline of christ in his church excommunicated ; this seems in truth to arise f●om their not acknowledging sufficiently , or not abiding by the true genuine grounds of the baptisme of those whose right to baptisme is acknowledged by them . for the information ( therefore ) of the minds of the weak and stablishing their hearts in this truth of god , according to the scriptures , even in the doctrine of p●●dobaptisme ( a doctrine of so great concernment , and of so much comfort and incouragement , both to believing parents & their children not in life only but in death ; whence it is that they only can be preserved against sorrowing when they fall asleep , as others do , which have no hope ) this ensuing treatise is at the earnest request of many worthy freinds to the author of it ( of blessed memory ) now published , wherein we may see both ; 1. the membership of the children of church-members proved to be of divine institution , and likewise 2. ( among other things ] the continuance of the membership of those children , in particular churches , when they are grown up , even until they are excōmunicated , unless there be a dissolution of the person by death , or of the church-society : so that this latter is not a principle of innovation , and apostacy ; but as it was the judgment of the author of this following letter ( as is therein to be seen and to manifest which was one speciall end of the printing thereof ) so was it the light which others have held forth , who in their time were stars not of the smallest magnitude , whom we have here seen sometimes shining with him in christs right hand , but are now set , and shining with that sun of righteousness in another world. that there is no cessation of the membership of a person in this or that particular church ( the church whereof he i● a m●mber continuing in b●ing , together with the person himselfe ) unles it be by meanes of a church-act intervening , is a truth of no small importance ; and therefore as for that notion which doth obtain with some ; that in particular churches of christ , walking in the order of the gospel , there are such as become ecclesiastically felones de se , that is such church-members who by their scandalous sin , do become their own executioners ecclesiastically , cutting themselves off from the church , so as that they thereby become actually non-members , and that the church hath no more power over them , either ecclesiasticallly to admonish them , or excommunicate them ; this seem's unto me to be but an humane invention , and not of divine institution , yea in truth destructive to the order of the gospel . and therefore to apply it , ( as to members in full communion , so ) to these children of the church whom we now speak of , is not of god ; as may appear by these reasons following . 1. because it is unscriptural . in matters of gods worship , a negative argument is conclvsive ; if that which is asserted ; be not contained in the scripture , expresly , or 〈◊〉 the consequence therefrom , it is to be rejected . to the law and by the testimony . the scriptures alledged by som●●●d thought to favour this notion of felones de se , are only such as do but lay down before us the sinns of some church-members , and do not speak of the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , ( punishment or censure ) as 't is called , 2 cor. 2.6 . which in such cases is to be inflicted , and therefore are not ad rem : only that which seem's to have most weight in it , and to which therefore i shall breifly reply , is that in acts 8.21 . thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter : answer . i would not say that this text , propounded with reference the children of the church that are not in full cōmunion , is not apposite , because the text speak's of a member in full communion : though to say so much is accounted by some a sufficient answer to such scripture arguments , as conclude against felones de se , from church-members that are in full cōmunion ( quatenus church-members ) to such church members as are not in full communion : but yet having gained this fort ; that what is in scripture spoken of a member in full communion , is applicable ( as farr as meer membership reachet● ) to a member that is not in full cōmunion , we may now the more easily proceed in the after discourse . to this scripture ( then ) ●lledged for children of the church not in full communion ; by their sin , when adult , to become felones de se as above said , i answer : 1. that the objection from hence tend's as much to frustrate the church act , or censure of excommunication upon members infull communion : and makes that ordinance of christ vain , & needless to the parents in full cōmunion , as to these children . 2. these words of the apostle peter , were indeed a dreadfull admonition , and the apostle being a church officer , did judg this sinner to deserve it for his simonie ; so that he was not ( granting the cessation of his membership ) felo de se. 3. by [ this matter ] spoken of in the text , seem's most properly to be meant ( not church-membership , but ) the power of giving the holy ghost spoken of in the context , which power simon magus would have bought with money , and for which the apostle rebukes him : and therefore his not having part or lot in that matter , is to be understood directly with relation to that extraordinary power ; the apostle would have him k●ow , that he should not share in such a power or priviledge as that was : 4. i would ask whether , if a member of a church be discovered not to have his heart right in the sight of god , but to be in the gall of bitterness and bond of iniquity , stand conv●ct of simonie , and the wickedness be so grosly aggravated as this scandal of symon magus was ; i say whether the church is not bound to bear witness against such an offender by inflicting some church-censure ( properly so taken ) upon him ? if it be said ●oe ; then may it not be questioned , whether such a church would not as well tolerate any other pollutions and defilements in it whatsoever ? the wofull fruit whereof who is there that doth not easily perceive : on the other side if it be said yea , that the church is to censure and authoritatively to put away from among themselves such a wicked person by excommunication , i then demand ( if this notion of felo de se be right and sound ) how they can excommunicate one , who is a non-member before the church can pass the sentence of excommunication against him ? whether doth this scripture act. 8.21 . give the church power over him by it's discipline to censure him , who already ( as the objection speak's ) hath cut himself off from being a church-member ? or whether the church hath any part in him who hath no part or lot in them , or in these matters ? 2. scripture example lead's us , to what is contrary to this felon●● spoken of : witness , under the old-testament , ishmael's being cast out , by abraham who was the chief officer in that family church ▪ so the incestuous person under the new-testament is not felo de s● though guilty of such a sin as was not so much as named among the ge●●iles , 1 cor. 5.1 . but there is a church act intervening his sin and the cessation of his memberly-communion with that church , viz a delivering him [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 such a one ] unto satan . hence as the church of ephesus is commended for not bearing with them which are evill , rev. 2.2 . so the church of th●a●ira is rebuked for suffering that woman iezebel , verse . 20. 3. because this notion of felo de se takes away the use of a ministerial judge in the church , in case of the offences , and scandals of this or that particular member of the church , to determine of the same . supposing a person could ecclesiastically cut himself off from the church by his very act of sin , there would then he no room left for a competent judg to enquire into the crime whereof he is accused , and to make particular application of the rule to the case of the s●nning brother , and pass sentence according to the true desert , and nature of the offence . that god hath ordained a ministerial judge is plain , m●tth . 18.17 . [ if he neglect to hear the church ] the church is to be heard ; the phrase of our saviour christ implies judicial superiority on the churches part , and the inferiority and subjection of a part or member to that whole , &c. but now this felonie denieth this order which christ hath established . though a person deserve excommunication perhaps , yet it must appear that he do deserve it ▪ neither doth his wickedness for which he deserves excōmunication , render him a non-member till he be excommunicated ; and hence in this case is very considerable what is asserted by that deservedly famous divine , mr. cotton , in his book intituled [ the keyes of the kingdom of heaven ] viz. though the iury have given up their judgment , and verdict , yet the malefactor is not thereupon legally condemned , much less executed , but upon the sentence of the judge in l●ke sort here [ saith he ] though the brethren of the church do with one accord give up their vote and judgment for the censure of an offender , yet he is not thereby censured , till upon the sentence of the presbyterie . 4. because the binding and loosing , mentioned , mat. 16.19 . the opening and shutting of the doors of the church by the keyes of the kingdom of heaven , belong to the same power or subject : hence therefore as none may intrude himselfe , or can regularly be admitted or let into this or that particular church without a church-act intervening , so none can be shut out , and deprived of that membership therein ( as abovesaid , ) without an act of the same power intervening . ejusdem potestatis est ligare , & solvere ; claudere & aperire . mr. cottons keyes cap. 7. pag. 45. 5. taken from mat. 18.15 , 16 , 17 , 18. which command and institution , leaves churches under a solemn obligation of duty , that when this offending brother or church-member deserveth excommunication that censure be duly inflicted on him ; so as that thereby ( viz. the sentence or censure past against him , in case he will not hear the church ) he must be to the church as an he ▪ then man , and a publican . so that it is not a matter of ind●fferency , [ to be observed or not to be observed ] but after the steps taken [ mentioned in verses 15 , 16. ] and the brother remain obstinate , 't is christ's charge that then that publick process [ verse 17. ] be attended , whereby the offender become's ecclesiastically bound according to verse 18. christ therefore requires a church-act to intervene , as abovesaid , and so the offender is not felo de se. 6. because a scandalous member of a church , by virtue of christs institution , mat. 18.17 . is to be accounted not as an heathen and publican , but stil a church-brother if he will hear the church , this is clearly intimated in those words if he neglect to hear the church ) runing conditionally , which suppose , that if he will hear , he is not to be as an heathen i. e. his membership shall not cease notwithstanding the scandalous sin committed . therefore by his wickedness and offence he is not felo de se. 7. because this felonie objected tend's to render that ordinance of church-censure and adm●nition laid down mat. 18.15 . &c. vain and useless , for the felo de s● , by his sin becomeing a non-member and so no church-brother , hence let a private member of the church go to tell him his fault , in the sence of the text , which is in order to more solemn church-proceeding and iudicature , in case he will not hear ; or let the church require him in th● name of christ to hear , in such a church-way as is there spoken of ; he may tell them that he is no brother of the church , for he hath by his offence cut off himselfe , and therefore they have nothing to do with him : that that rule of christ concernes only the brother or the church-member , not one that is out of the church , as he is , being felo de se , and therefore may say ( according to 1 cor. 5.12 . ) what have you to do to iudge me that am without ? if his sin be not yet great enough to render him felo de se , & he suspect that therefore the church may have power over him & is going about to bind him on earth , so that ( being thereupon also bound in heaven ) he shall become bound from an orderly entrance in at the doores of other sister-churches , without repentance first held forth to the acceptance of the church which he offended ; 't is then but to commit another fault whereby he may be sure he shall be felo de se , and so he is beyond the churches reach , and this frustrates church-discipline , and renders vain that ordinance of christ above mentioned . 8. to deny the intervening of this church-act of excommunication is to deny unto , and withold from a person deserving to be cast out of the church , an ordinance , and meanes which may be for the saving of his soul , 1 cor : 5.4 , 5. it is not enough to say that the felo de se makes himself no member ; and so the church is freed from his communion which would pollute it , as fully as if he were excōmunicated ; for god's meanes are not empty or vain meanes , and to think to reach the full end , but not in gods way , and by observing his meanes ordained , is neither christian wisdome , nor gospel policy ; yea to deny the application of this ordināce of excōmunication to the offending brother is to deny a means for the salvation of his soule , and to deny a remedy for his repentance , and the healing , and gaining of our brother again . 9. because the holy ghost command's the church to iudge them that are within , 1 cor. 5.12 ▪ do you not judge them that are within ? all that are within , are subject to ecclesiasticall judicature , and therefore cannot by scripture-warrant be felones de se. 10. because this notion of felones de se evacuate's that power given of rebukeing before all , 1 tim. 5.20 . which is to be done without partiality ▪ ( whether they be young , or old , rich or poor &c. ) ver . 21 and so likewise takes away that authority given of reproving with all long-suffering , 2 tim. 4.2 . leaves no room for obedience to that command ( 2 thes. 3.15 . ) of admonishing the offender as a brother &c. add thereto that this notion of the felo de se supposeth some disobedience in a church-member of an open scandalous nature against which god hath not provided the remedy of spiritual revenge in an ecclesiastical way , contrary to that 2 cor. 10.6 , where the apostle saith , we have in readiness to revenge all disobedience &c. that this is spoken of church discipli●e is well cleared by that expression of worthy mr. cotton . viz. the apostles revenge of d●sobedience by way of reproofe in preaching doth not follow the peoples obedience , but proceedeth whether the people obey it or no ; it was therefore their revenge of disobedience by way of censure in discipline &c. 11. the notion of felo de se asserts the lawfulness of exclusion or sh●t●ing a church-member out of the kingdome of heaven by none of the keyes of the kingdome of heaven , viz. by the sin of this felon , or gives the managing of these keyes , in a case which concernes the whole to act in ( for such is the non-communion of a member with the church● into the hands solely of a private person : both wh●ch right reason doth plainly condemn . 12. because were the sin of a church-member of as h●gh and heinous a nature as h●resie , nay ( which is more ) though the brother of a church should turn heretick yet he is not immediately thereby a non-member , or felo de se : he is not presently to be rejected : but a first and second admonition must be applyed , and in case of incorrigibleness then follows the ecclesiastical rejection spoken of , tit. 3.10 . he must be rejected , but according to gods order , even the order of the gospel : for all things are to be done in order , 1 cor. 14.40 . so when the apostle required the corinthians to put away from among themselves that wicked person , it is to be understood of putting such away , and avoiding such , and withdrawing themselves from such , and haveing no company with such &c. all in due season , and all according to the order of christ , even accord●ng to that rule of delivering such an one unto sathan as is exprest , 1 cor. 5 and suiting with that other command of christ , mat. 18. according as the nature of the offence is more or less heinous , proportionably is the admonition to be applyed , either in case the offence be at first private , but growes publick and notorious by the impenitency and obstinacy of the offender ; or in case the offence be at first rise of it publick and notorious , still we have no allowance from scripture to entertain or admit of the opinion of this ecclesiastical felonie . having thus finished this discourse i shall now very briefly acquaint the reader , in a word or two further , touching the following treatise , viz. that it was written by the authors own hand : and not three months before the time of his dissolution , and sent to one who , before the receipt thereof , was not so clear in the point of infant-baptisme but was hereby recovered , and stablished in the truth , and dyed in the same faith as the letter did perswade him , ( to use m r. fox his phrase , in h●s book of martyrs , touching that excellent letter which philpot , that glorious martyr , a little before his death also , wrote to a friend of h●s , that was then a prisoner , upon this very subject of infant-baptisme ▪ who was thereby converted from the errour of his way , as is there to be seen . a le●ter exceeding wel worth the reading & serious perusal by any , such especially as hesitate in this matter . ) the reader may please further to mind , that ●his was not intended by the reverend author for the publ●ck view ; but was only a private answer sent to a speciall friend , for his particular satisfaction , relating to some doubts mentioned in a letter of his to my father concerning this subject : had he purposed to have written , and printed off his thoughts to the world touching this article of baptisme i question not but he would have been more polite and curious ; and the expectations of those who knew him throughly satisfied therein . i would not detain the reader by any further preface of mine : and therefore to conclude ; may this from one who is now in heaven , unto such as may have too farr engaged against god's covenant-meries toward his , and our poor children , sent indeed in a special manner unto such ; have a rich and effectual blessing from the fat●er of lights ●● mercies ; a better effect upon their hearts , then that famous letter had of elijah the prophet , upon jehoram to whom it was sent , 2 chron. 21.12 . ( written , 't is thought by divers , before his tra●slation to heaven , but concealed untill there was so fit a season for the presenting of it ) may this writing ( i say ) and in such a season also , have a better effect and fruit ; even to bring them from the errour of their way , into the paths of truth and peace , and settle them , and others , more and more therein ; that is the sincere desire of the publisher thereof , who is thin● to serve thee in our lord jesus . thomas shepard . i. thomas shepardivs anagr : paradisus hostem ? he● ! paradisus alit sanctis infantibus hostem ? q●os baptizar● praecip●● ipse deus ? q●os deus ambabus , clemens , amplectitur ulnis , non sinet in gremio tingur ille suo ? annon pro sanctis ecclesia ( mater ) habebit , quos sancti sanctos vox ait esse dei ? hoc deus av●●ia● . non sic shepardius olim , non sic , quae moriens scripta re●iquit , aiunt . non sic doctores celebrat quos sanclior atas , anglia quos celebrat prisca , simulque nova . his u●●nam sanctis deus ipse laboribus abnam e superis , clemens , suppeditaret opem ! quá sine , doctores non ulli , scripta nec ulla , errores possunt carnificare malos . ius confirmabas puerorum , christe , tuorum a gremio vellent cum revocare t●o ; s●rgito , lactentesque tuos defendito ab hoste q●i vellet lundes ( — cunque ) perire tuas . amen johannes wilsonus senior . ii. thomas shepard . anagr : ô a map's thresh'd . loe her 's a map , where we may see well thresh'd an heap of corn to be by thomas shepard's happy hand which from the chaffe pure wheat hath fan'd : the wheat is the church-members right ( both great and little ones ) to witt unto the seal of baptisme , all that are within the gospel call ; i mean believers and their seed ; to whom the lord hath promised , to be their god ; and doth reveal their right to 's covenant and the seal : on whom through grace the blessing came of his dear servant abraham . be they or iewes or gentiles , now no difference the lord doth know . the promise is to us and ours . as large , or larger : and god pour's his spirit now as much , or more then e're he did on them before . and if that they were circumcis'd . then we are now to be baptiz'd : our babes must now no less then theirs be seal'd ( as of his kingdome heires ) christ calleth them his little ones , and as his darlings he them owne's ▪ denouncing against them a woe , that are despisers of them , who ▪ offe●d the least of them , and such as do their interest in him grutch . crispus , with gaius , stephanas , with others , were not all through grace baptis'd that of their houshold were ? and children who will doubt were there ? then let us not to them deny , nor seem as if we did envy the priviledge which god from heaven hath through his grace and favour given . nor let us limit his good spirit in applycation of christ's merrit : whose bloud was shed for them , as well as those who them in age excell : if such be taught of god , who dare deny , they his disciples are ? iii. thomas shepard anagr : more hath po●s'd . more from this holy pen d●th ●ast'd the baptisme to defend 〈◊〉 infants 〈◊〉 at church members are ( if well you do attend ) then any anti-baptists can with solidness confute . i wish with all my heart that god will grant these labours fruit , as good or better then the paines by other godly taken . that thereby all his precious saints be would please to awaken . that none may any more oppose , with zeal preposterous , the truth which gods most holy word commendeth unto us ; that who were less convinced by this holy shepards voice , yet in his letter left behind they may ●●e more rejoyce . he was a shining light indeed , few other such are left , the lord vouchsafe we be not by our sinns of them bereft . and poure down of his spirit more upon his sons surviving ; that will be more and more unto truth 's lovers a reviving . iiii. thomas shepard anagr : arm'd as the shop . arm'd ( at the shop of god's good word ●oth weapons unto him afford ) ●●●●nd's the right of little ones , whom god in the church covenant ownes the child●e● of ●is church among , to whom 〈◊〉 kingdome doth belong , and there withall the seal thereof , through his free mercy , grace , and love. yet are there some which them forbid ( as once his weak disciples did ) to come to christ , and ●cruple make , whether therof they should partake ? but christ was very angry for it , as for such zeale he did abhor it ; oh come , said he , and welcom'd such , with tokens of affection much : as if that they and scarcely ●hy but such as they might chalenge any or part , or portion in his grace , ( so did his favour th●m embrace ) his babes , his lambs , his little creatures he call's them . as for such d●features , christ they defeat as well as them whom they presume so to contemn . this holy shepard is like david , from ly●●s mouth , and beare 's who saved that little kid ; whom god did crown with great and singular renown : and so this shepard hath ( no doubt ) a glorious crown his head about . for all his lab●urs , ( and for this ; ) in high and everlasting bli●s . and as the lord doth honour him ( for christ his sake ) so his esteem both is , and ought to be most rare , 'mongst them who christ hi● followers are ▪ and oh how should we bless his name that o●●is son he pour's the same good spirit that was in the father or doubles it upon him rather : lord ▪ these epistles do thou bless ! and as thy truth they do confess so make them precious in the eyes of all that do thy gospel prize . amen iohn wilson senior the church-membership of children cleared vp in a letter in answer to the doubts of a friend . when we say , that children are members by their parents covenant , i would premise three things for explication . 1. that children of godly parents come to the fruition of their membership by their parents covenant , but that which give 's them their right , and interest in this membership is gods covenant , whereby he engageth himselfe equally to be a god to them , and to their seed . this i suppose is clear . 2. that according to the double seed , viz. 1. elect seed . 2. church-seed ; so there is a double covenant , 1. exernal and outward : 2. internall and inward . and because the covenant makes the church , hence there is an inward , and outward membership , and church estate : there is an outward iew , & an inward iew , rom. 2.28 , 29. all are not israel ( i. e. the elect seed ) that are of israel ( i. e. the church-seed of in outward covenant ) to whom the apostle saith belong's the adoption , the covenants , and the promises , that is , the externall adoption whereby god account's them his children , or the children of his house , and family , the children of the church ; and accordingly have the promises belonging to them in respect of outward dispensation , although they be not children by internall adoption , to whom belongs the promises by effectuall and speciall communication of saving grace : it is clearer then the day , that many who are inwardly , or in respect of inward covenant , the children of the devil , are outwardly , or in respect of outward covenant , the children of god , isay. 1.2 . i have brought up children , and yet rebellions ; and in the next verse they are called [ my people ] ( i. e. by outward covenant ) and yet worse then the ox , or asse : deut. 32.19 , 20. they are called sons , and yet provokeing god to revengefull wrath ; and children ▪ and yet without faith. and look , as some may be externally dogs , and yet internally believers : ( as the woman of canaan , whom , in respect of outward covenant , christ calls a dog : and the iewes , who yet rejected him , children mat. 15.26 ) so many may be externally children , in respect of external covenant , and yet internally dogs , and evil men , and we see that the purest churches of christ are called saints , and faithful , & children of god and yet many among them hypocrites , and unbelievers ; because they that in respect of church estate , and outward covenant , and profession , are outwardly , or federally saints ; are many times inwardly , and really unsound : hence therefore it is , that when we say , that children are in covenant , and so church-members , the meaning is , not that they are alwaies in inward covenant , and inward church-members , who enjoy the inward , and saveing benefits of the covenant , but that they are in external , and outward covenant , and therefore outwardly church members , to whom belongs some outward priviledges of the covenant for their inward and eternall good . these things being clear , i the rather make mention of them , to undermine divers usual objections againts the membership , and covenant-interest of children ; as , that they have no saving grace many times ; and that they make no actuall profession of any grace ; and that many of them degenerate , and prove corrupt , and wicked &c. for suppose all these , yet god may take them into outward covenant ( which is sufficient to make them the church-seed , or members of the church ) although he doth not receive them into inward covenant , in bestowing upon them saving grace , or power to profess it , nay though they degenerate , and grow very corrupt afterward . 3. because you may question what this outward covenant is , to which the seales are annexed ; and under which we shall prove , children are comprehended ; and because the knowledg of it is exceeding usefull and very pleasant , i shall therefore give a short taste of it , as a light to our after-discourse , especially as it is considered in the largest extent of it . this outward covenant therefore consists chiefly of these three branches , or speciall promises : 1. the lord engageth himselfe to them , that they shall be called by his name , or is name shall be called upon them , as 't is isay. 63.19 . they shall be called the sons of god , hos. 1.10 . and the people of god , deut. 29.12.13 . thou becamest mi●e , ezek. 16.8 . they may not be his sons , and people really , and savingly , but god will honour them outwardly ( at least ) with this name , and priviledg : they shall bear his name , to be called so , and consequently to be accounted so by others , and to be reckoned as of the number of his visible church , and people ; just as one that adopts a young son , he tel's the father if he carry it well toward him when he is grown up to years , he shall possess the inheritance it selfe , but yet in the mean while be shall have this favour to be called his son , and be of his family , and houshold , and so be reckoned among the number of his sons : 〈◊〉 r●m . 9 4. 2. the lord promiseth that they shall , above all others in the world , have the meanes of doing them good , and of conveying of the speciall benefits of the covenant ; nay they shall be set apart above all people in the world , to enjoy these speciall benefits of remission of sins , power against sin , eternal life , &c. ●nd●● all certainly have these , by these meane , unless they refuse them : this is evident from these , and such like scriptures and examples ; 〈◊〉 priviledge hath the iew saith the apostle r●m . 3.1 . and what advantage by circumcision , if by nature under wrath , and sin for upon that ground the apostle make's the question he answers 't is much every way but co●sly because t● them were commi●ted the oracle of god : 1. ● . the word , promises , covenant which are the ordinary meanes of saving grace and eternall good : others hear the word but these in outward covenant enjoy ●●●● covenant , and promise ; and hence these in the first place , and principally are sought after by these meanes ; and therefore christ forbids his d●sciples at first to go preach in the way of the g●n●ile● ( persons out of covenant ) but to the l●s● sheep of ●h● h●use of israel , mat. 10.6 . and himselfe tells the woman of canaan , that he came not but to the last sheep of the house of israel , mat. 15.24 . and although he bid's his disciples go preach to all nation , yet acts 3.26 . it 's said unto you first hath he sent christ , because you are children of the promise and covenant , verse 25 : repent therefore , and be converted , verse 19. do not resist , or refuse christ , for he hath first sent christ to you to bless you , and turn you from your iniquities ; and the promise is full and fair , rom. 11.23 . if they abide not in unbeliefe , ( i. e. in refusing grace , and christ when offered ) they shall be graffed in , for god is able to do it , and will do it : and the reason why the lord gave his people up to their own counsells ; it was , because my people would no●e of me , after all the meanes god used for their good , psal. 81.11 , 12 , 13. and deut. 7.6 . the lord hath chosen you , above all people on the earth , to be a special people to himselfe , and thou art an holy people unto the lord : how a holy people ? by inward holiness ? no verily , for many of them were inwardly unholy , both parents and children , but thou art holy , i. e. thou art externally sanctified , and set apart by special meanes of holiness , to be a special people unto god. and therefore isay 5.7 . the men of iudah are called gods pleasant plant : i. e. planted into the root and fatness of the church , and therefore had all meanes used for their further special good , verse 4. what could bee done to my vineyard , that hath not been done ? and hence it is , that though the word may come to heathens as well as church-members , yet it comes not to them by way of covenant , as it doth to church-members ; nor have they any promise of mercy aforehand , as church-members have ; nor is it chiefly belonging to such , but unto the children of the covenant & the promise , as hath bee said . and hence also it follow 's that god never cutt's off the seed of his servants from the special benefits of the covenant until they have had the meanes thereunto , and they have positively rejected those meanes : and hence the jewes ( who are made the pattern of what god will do toward all gentile-churches , rom. 11. ) were never cast off till by positive unbelief they provoked the lord to break them off , by rejecting and refusing the meanes of their eternal peace 3. the lord promiseth , that the seed of his people ( indefinitely considered ) shall have this heart ( viz : which would refuse special grace , and mercy ) taken away , as well as meanes used for that end : this is evident from deut. 30.6 . the lord thy god will circumcise thy heart and the heart of thy seed , to love the lord : he will cut off the uncircumcision , and sin , and resistance of the heart against god ; he will take away the stony heart : not indeed from all , in outward covenant particularly ; but from these indefinitely ; so that there is no promise to do this for any out of the visible church , ( though god of his soveraignty , and free mercy somtimes doth so ) but the promise of this belongs indefinitely to those of his church , among whom usually , and ordinarily he worke 's this great work , leaving him to his own freeness of secret mercy , to work thus on whom he will , and when he will : in the mean while no man can exclude himself , or any others within this covenant from hope of this mercy , and grace , but may with comfort look and pray for it ; for this is gods covenant that the redeemer shall come out of sion , and turn away ungodlyness from iacob , rom. 11.26 , 27. for the covenant of god doth not only run thus ; if thou believe and receive grace thou shalt have it ; but thus also , i will circumcise your heart , i will take away the stony heart , i will turn away ungodliness form you , i will enable to believe : and hence these three things follow from these things thus opened . 1. that as the covenant run's not only thus , viz. if thou believest thou shalt be saved , but also i will enable to believe ; so a mans entrance into covenant is not only by actual and personal profession of faith [ as some say ] because god's covenant run's a peg higher , viz : to make and enable some to believe , and so to make that profession . 2. that the very outward covenant is not meerly conditional , but there is something absolute in it : and hence it follow 's , that it is a great mistake of some who think that circumcision , and baptism , seal only conditionally [ the outward covenant being ●say they ] meerly conditionall ] for those three things mentioned in the outward covenant you see are in some respect absolute , and if the covenant was only conditionall , then the lord was no more in covenant with church-members , than with pagans , and infidels , for it may be propounded conditionally to all such , that if they believe , they shall be saved , but assuredly god's grace is a little more extensive to the one , then to the other . 3 hence you may see what circumcision once did , and baptism● now seal's unto , even to infants the seal is to confirm the covenant : the covenant is , that god ( outwardly at least ) owne's them , and reckon's them among his people , and children , within his visible church and kingdome , and that here upon he will prune , and cutt , and dresse , and water them , and improve the means of their eternal good upon them , which good they shall have , unless they refuse in resisting the means ; nay that he will take away this refuseing heart from among them indefinitely , so that though every one cannot assure himself , that he will do it particularly for this or that person , yet every one , through this promise , may hope , and pray for the communication of this grace , and so feel it in time . these things thus premised , to clear up the ensuing discourse , i shall now do two things . 1. leave a few grounds and reasons to prove , that children are in church-covenant , and so enjoy church-membership by their parents . 2. i shall then answer your scruples . to the first ; the truth of it is manifest , by clearing up this proposition ; viz : that one and the same covenant which was made to abraham in the old testament , is for substance the same with that in the new ; and this under the new-testament , the very same with that of abraham's under the old . i say for substance the same , for it is acknowledged that there was somthing proper and personal in abraham's covenāt , as to be a father of many nations , but this was not of the substance of the covenant , which belong's to all the covenanters , and unto which the seal of circumcision was set : for all abraham's seed , neither in those , nor these dayes , are the fathers of many nations , nor did circumcision seal it . again it is confessed , that the external administrations of this one & the same covenant , are diverse ; but still the covenant for substance is the same : for that old covenant was dispensed with other external signes , sacrifices , types , prophesies , then this under the new . there was something typical in abraham's covenāt concerning canaan , a type of heaven , but yet the same covenant remaine's now with a more naked manner of dispensation , or promise of heaven . and hence it follow 's , that if it may appear , that the covenant it self is one and the same , now , as then ; then , as now ; then it will undeniably follow , that if the new covenant under the gospel be not a carnal covenant , no more was that : if the new-covenant be not proper to abraham's natural seed , no more was that which was made with abraham : if the substance of that covenant was , i will be a god to thee and thy seed , then this very covenant remaine's still under the gospel , it being one and the same with that ; if by vertue of that covenant , the children were made members of the church ; and hence had a church priviledge , and seal administred ; then the same covenant remaining the same , and in the same force , and benefit , our children also are taken into the like membership . it remaine's therfore to prove that which all our divines have long since made good against the papists , that the covenant then , and now , is for substance one and the same ; or that the covenāt made with abraham was a gospel-covenant , and this gospel-covenant the same that was made with abraham . 1. the covenant made with abraham is renewed in the gospel , as to the main thing in it , viz : i will be their god , and they shall be my people , heb. 8.10 . ier. 31.33 . and though the seed be not exprest , yet it s understood , as 't is gen. 17.8 . & if need be shall be proved hereafter . 2. because abraham's covenant is of gospel & eternal priviledges . not proper therefore to him , and his fleshly posterity . for righteousness by faith was sealed up by circumcision rom. 4.11 . which is a gospel priviledge , and is the ground of all other priviledges , and yet in gen. 17.7 . there is no expression of this righteousness by faith , but it is understood therefore in this , i will be their god : so the promise of eternal life , and resurrection therunto is wrapt up in this , i am the god of abraham , isaac and iacob . 3. because there was never any covenant , but it was either of grace ; or workes : that of workes on mount sinai , that of grace which was made with abraham : and hence gal. 3.17 . the covenant which was confirmed afore by christ , the law 430 years after cannot disanull : and what was that covenant before ? surely it was the covenant of grace , becaus it was confirmed by christ : and what was this covenant confirmed by christ , but the covenant made with abraham ? for of this the apostle speakes , verses 14 , 16. and he cal's it expressly by the name of gospel , or the gospel-covenant , verse 8 , 9. 4. because when god reneweth his promise and covenant made with abraham , with his people at the plaines of moab , deut. 30.6 . it run's in these words , viz : i will circumcise thy heart , and the heart of thy seed , now this is a gospel priviledg , and a gospel-covenant : as appeares by comparing this text with rom. 10.8 . wherin the righteousness of faith , or the gospel , is brought in speaking the words of this covenant , saying the word is nigh thee , in thy heart & mouth , deut. 30.11 , 12 , 13 , 14. now if that place , gen. 17.7 . should be said to be obscure concerning the promise [ i will be a god to thy seed ] yet here in this place god speak's plainly , which by comparing the scriptures is a gospel promise , and of a gospel priviledge and therefore to be preach't by ministers of the gospel , and to be believed by the professors of it . 5. because this promise [ i will be a god to thee and thy seed ] doth not belong to abraham & his seed as after the flesh , or as lineally descended of abraham : but as believers , and this is most evident rom. 11. wherein 't is said of the jews , 1. that they were broken off , ( made no people , no church ) by unbeliefe , verse 20. 2. that by faith they shall be graffed in again , verse 23. if therefore they were broken off the church by unbeliefe , then they stood as members of the church by faith : and if by faith they should be graffed in , then they stood by faith at first : again it is said in this rom 11.28 . that they are loved for the fathers sakes , surely not as natural fathers , but as spiritual by faith : and hence nehem. 9.8 . it is expressly said , that god found abraham faithfull before him , and made a covenant with him . again if the posterity of abraham were members upon this ground only or chiefly , viz. because they were lineally descended of abraham , then esau , ishmael , the iewes rom. 11.20 . could never have been cast off from being members of the church , because they were alway the natural off-spring & posterity of abraham . hence therfore it follow 's that if they were ingraffed in the church as believers ( the fathers as actually believing the children as sett apart by promise of god to be made to believe and in their parents faith accounted believers ) then all believers at this day have the same priviledg , and the covenant then being made only in respect of faith , must needs be gospel covenant , the same with god's covenant at this day . and hence also it follow 's that if they were members as believers , then not as members of that nation . they were not therefore members of the church , because they were descended of abraham , and were in a national church , and were by generation jews . circumcision was a seal of righteousness by faith , rom. 4. 11. therefore they were sealed as believers . thus much for the first argument , wherein i have been the larger , because much light is let in by it , to answer divers mistakes i shall name the rest with morerbrevity . argum : 2. if it was the curse of gentiles , to be strangers to the covenants of promise ( made with the iews ) before they became the churches of god ; then by being churches , this curse is removed ; and hence ephe. 2.12 , 13. the apostle saith they were strangers to the covenant , and common-wealth of israel , but are not so now . if you lay that the ephesians were in covenant , but not their seed , and so they were not strangers ? i answer that the apostle doth not set out their cursed estate meerly because they were without any covenant , but because they were strangers to that covenant of promise which the israelites had ; for if their children had it not , they were then as without covenant , so without god , and without hope , as pagans are , which is notoriously cross to the current of all scripture , as may afterward appear . argum : 3. the apostle expresly saith [ your children are holy ] 1 cor. 7.14 . and if federally holy , then of the church , [ for reall holyness cannot be here meant ] and in the covenant of it : even as 't is said deut. 7.6 . thou art an holy people unto the lord thy god : few of which number were really and savingly holy , but they were all so fed●rally , or by covenant , and so became gods special church or people . if you say , that this holiness is meant of matrimonial holiness , viz. that your children are not bastards , but legitimate : the answer is easy ; for upon this interpretation the apostle's answer should be false ; for then if one of the parents had not been a believer , and so by his believing sanctifyed his unbelieving wife , their children must have been bastards , whereas you know that their children had not been in that sence unclean or illegitimate , although neither of them were believers : for the apostle's dispute is plain , viz. that if the believing husband did not sanctify his unbelieving wife , then were your children unclean , ●●e say you bastards , but it 's evident t●at children may be , in this sense , clean , and yet no faith in either parent to sanctify one another to their particular use : unless you will say , that all children of heathens are bastards , because neither of the parents believe . argum. 4. rom. 11.17 . the iews are cut off from the fatness of the olive tree , and the gentiles put in , or ingraffed in their room : now this ingraffing is not into christ by saving faith , for it is impossible that such should ever be broken off , who are once in ; it must therefore he meant of their ingraffing into the external state of the visible church , and the fatness and priviledges thereof ; of which church christ is the external and political head , into whom ( in this respect ) they are ingraffed by external visible fa●●h 〈◊〉 covenant . hence thus i reason ; that if the iews and their 〈◊〉 were ingraffed members of the church , then the gentile 〈…〉 into the same state , and comming in their 〈…〉 with their children , members of the church : when the jews hereafter shall be 〈◊〉 , they shall be ingraff●d in as they were before ; them and their 〈◊〉 verse 23. in 〈◊〉 mean while , the apostle put 's no difference between the present ingraffing of the gentiles now , and of t●e●s past , or to come , and therfore they , and their seed are ingraffed members now . argum. 5. because there is ●he same inward cause , moving god to take in the children 〈◊〉 believing church-members into the church , and covenant now , to be of the number of his people , as there was for ●aking the iews and their children : for the only cause why the lord took in the jews and their children thus , was 〈◊〉 love , and f●●e grac● , and mercy de● . 4.37 . becaus● 〈◊〉 l●ved thy fathers , t●erfore ●● crose t●●ir seed , which choosing is not by eternal election or choosing to gl●●y , for many of their ●●ed never came to glory ; but unto this priviledg to be his people above all others , in outward covenant with him ; which is exceeding great love , if you remember what hath been said of the b●anches of this outward covenant , and visible church estate . and hence ●eu . 10.15 . ●e u● the lord had ●●●light in thy fathers , hence he chose their seed above all people , as at that day , viz. to be his people ●● so that i do from hence fully believe , that either god's love is in these dayes of his gospel less unto his people ; and servants , then in the dayes of the old testament , or if it be as great , that then the same love respects the seed of his people now as then it did . and therefore , if then , because he loved them , he chose their seed , to be of his church ; so in these dayes , because he loveth us , he chooseth our seed , to be of his church also . argum : 6. because our saviour speak's plainely of all children who are brought to him , that of such is the kingdom of heaven : and none are ordinarily heires of the kingdom of glory , but such as are of god's visible church and kingdom here . the objections against this place , i think not worth confuting , because i hope enough is said to clear up this first particular , to prove the children of confederate believers to be in covenant , and church-members . i now proceed to the second thing , viz : to answer your objectiōs object : 1. if children ( say you ) be members as it was in abraham's covenant , then wives and servants , and all the houshold are to be taken in ; for so it was , gen. 17. & gen. 3● . 2.3 . and then what churches shall we have ? but such as you fear , god will be weary of & angry wa● . answ. churches at first ( by your own confession ) were in families , where therfo●e god's grace did the more abound , by how much the less it did abound abroad● and hence abraham's family and houshold was a church of god ; but yet consider withall that all were not of this family church , meerly because they were of the family of houshold , but because they were godly , or the children of such as were godly in the family ; for abraham's servants and houshold , were such as he could and did command to keep the way of the lord , and so were obedient to god in him , gen. 18.19 . and we see they did obey , and did receive that new strange , & painfull signe of circumcision : about the nature and use of which , no doubt he first instructed them , and in the place you mention , gen. 35.4 . they gave to iacob all men strange gods , & eat●●ings to worship god more purely and it's evident , exod. 12.45 that every one in the family , had not to do with the seales of the church , & therefore now not of the church though of the family : for a foreigner , or hired servant was not to eat of the passeover nor was every one who was bought with money to eat oft untill they were circumcised , ver . 44. nor were 〈◊〉 such to be circumcised , until they were willing & desireous to eat the passeover , & that unto the lord ; then indeed they , & theirs were first to be circumcised , ver . 4● . and although this be not expresly set down , gen. 17. in abrahams family ▪ yet i doubt not , but that , as one scripture gives light unto another , so , this scripture in exo. shews the mind of god in the first beginning of the church , as well as in these times : if therefore the servants who were godly in the family , were only to be circumcised , and their children born in the house with them , then this example is no way leading to corrupt churches , as you fear it will ; but rather the contrary , that if prose●●te servants then , were received into the church tog●ther with their seed , much more are they received now : and if they did not defile the church then , neither should we think that they will do so now . and i beseech you consider of it , that god was then as carefull of keeping his church holy as in these dayes , especially in the first constitution of it , as in this of abrahams gen. 17. and hence god was as much provoked by their unholiness then , as by any unholiness now , 1 pet. 1 16. suppose therefore ( as you imagine ) that all the houshold , whether prophane or holy , were to be received into the covenant , and so to the seal of it , do you think that this course of admitting all prophane persons then , would not make the lord soon weary of , and angry with those family-churches , as well as of national , or congregational now , upon the like supposition ? if therefore any servants born in the house , or hired , were admitted , surely they were not such unholy ones , whom the lord could not but be as much angry with , then as now ; but they were godly and holy at least in outward profession , upon which ground the lord commanded them to be circumcised . i know there are some , and very holy & learned also , who think that if any godly man undertakes to be a● a father to an adopted pagan or indian , that such an one , not grown up to yeares , is from the example in gen. 17. to be received into the covenant of the church , and the ●eale of it ▪ and i confess , i yet see no convicting argument against it , if it could be proved that some servants bought with abraham's money were such , and were under years , but i see as yet no convicting argument for this assertion from this example ; and therefore i stick to the former answer , and see no reason , from any rule of charity , but to believe that all those in abrahams family , were either visibly godly , or the children of such ; to whom circumcision belong's : and consequently might as well partake of church-membership , as abraham himself ; which sort of servants in these dayes may as well be admitted to church-membership , without fear of defiling the church , as their masters themselves . object : 2. if children ( say you ) be members , then all children , good and bad , must be received , as iacob and esa● &c : answ. why not ? for if there be any strength in this argument , it holds as strongly against the admission of professing visible believers : where , though all are externally , and federally holy , yet some , yea many , yea the greatest part of such may be inwardly ●ad , and as prophane in their hearts , as esau : and must we therefore refuse them to be church-members because many of them may be inwardly bad ? verily there must then never be churches of god in this world . so 't is among children , they are all outwardly holy , yet many of them may be inwardly unholy , like esau , must we not therfore accept them to membership ? it is a miserable mistake to think that inward reall holyness is the only ground of admission into church-membership , as some anabaptists dispute , but it is federal holyness , whether externally professed as in grown persons , or graciously promised unto their seed . reply 1. but you here reply , if so , then they are of the church when they are grown up , and prophane , untill they are cast out : and to take in prophane , is sinfull , ezek. 44. answ. it is very true ; for 't is herein just as 't is in admitting professing believers , they may prove prophane , and continue so in church-membership , untill they are cast out ; but is this therefore any ground to keep out those who are personally holy by their own profession ? no verily , why then should such as are parentally , and federally holy be kept out from church-membership because they may prove prophane , and being prophane must remain church-members till they be cast out . reply 2 but then ( you say ) they must be church-members though their parents themselves , and the whole church be unwilling thereunto , even as ( say you ) a man that marrieth a woman , her children must be his , and he be a father to them , though he and she , and they should say ●e shall not be a father in law to them . answ. this similitude of marriage doth neither prove , nor illustrate the thing ; for the relation between father and such children is absolute & natural , and hence continues though they say he shall not be their father , and though he profess he will not ; but the relation founded upon church-covenant , between member and member , is not natural , not only , and allway absolute ; but also conditionall , which condition not being ●ept ▪ the relation may be , and is usually broken ; for look as the iews were not so absolutely god's people , but if they did in time reject the gospel , they were to be cast off , and indeed are so at this day , rom. 2.25 . hosea 2.2 . acts 13.46 , ●1 . so 't is with all gentile churches , and the members thereof : & as for that which you last say , that they may refuse their parents covenant at age , as well as own i● , and so may members go out at pleasure , which is disorder . i answer , that the like may be said of such members as come in by personal profession , for they may renounce their own covenant with god and the church , one may doe so , and so may twentie , yet though this be wickedness and disorder , yet the church may proceed against them , and so it may against their children , who are bound to own the covenant made with god , and of god with them in their parents , as well as any church-members are to own their own covenant by their own personal profession . what disorder therfore will come in as you conceive this way will come in by your own way , and what course you should take to heal the one , by the same you may heal the other . object . 3. if children ( say you ) be members ; then their seed successively , untill they be either dissolved , or excommunicated ; and if so , then what churches shall we have ? answ. 1. what churches shall we have ? truely not allway churches of angels and faints , but mixt with many chaffy hypocrites and oft times prophane persons . but still i say this objection holds as firm against gathering churches of visible professing believers ; for god knowe's what churches we may have of them , even heaps of hypocrites , and prophane persons , for i know not what can give us hope of their not apostatizing , but only gods promise to be a god to them , and to preserve them ; and truly the same promise , being made to their seed , gives me as much ground of faith to hope well of churches r●sing out of the seed of the godly , as of the professing , parents themselves . i know one may have more experimental charity concerning some few professing the fear of god , but my church-charity is equal about them , especially considering , that those whom god receiv's into church covenant , he doth not only take them to be a people to him , but to ●stablish them to be such , viz : for time to come . and hence god is said , to establish his covenant with isaac , not ishmael who was to be rejected , gen. 17.19 ▪ and god is said , to gather them into covenāt to establish them to be a people , both young & old , present posterity , and that which was to come , deut. 29.11 , — 15. 2. god was as holy , and as exactly requiring holiness from the jewish church , as well as from christian churches ; now do you think that the covenant which then wrapt up the iews children into church-membership , was an high-way of prophaness , and unholyness in the members thereof , & of defiling & polluting gods church ? or was it a way and meanes of holiness , and to keep them from being prophane ? to affirm the first is somthing blaphemous , and very false , for 't is expressly said ier. 13.11 . that as the girdle cleaveth to the loynes of a man , so he caused the whole house of israel ( not grown men only ) to cleave to him , that they might be to him a people ( which was by covenant ) and for a name , for a praise , and for a glory ; gods name , glory , praise was the end ; and the covenant was the meanes hereunto ; and therefore it was no way or meanes of unholyness in that church : but if you say , it was a meanes of holiness ; why then should we fear the polluting of churches by the same covenant , which we have proved , wraps in our seed also ? indeed they did prove universally prophane in the jewish church ; so they may in ours , but shall man's wickedness in abuseing god's grace , and forsaking h●s covenant tye the hands , or heart of god's free grace from taking such into covenant ; what ●●o●gh some did not believe ? saith th● apostle , rom. 3.3 , 4. ●●all their unbelief make the faith of god without effect ? god forbid . 3. suppose they do prove prophane , and corrupt churches ; yet even then , when they are corrupt , they are such churches , where ordinarily god gathers out his elect , and out of which ( till purer are gathered , or these wholly rejected ) there cannot be expected ordinarily any salvation : for so saith our saviour , salva●ion is of the iews , iohn 4.22 . even in that very corrupt , and worst estate of the church that ever it was in . object . 4. if children be members , then they must come to the lords supper , for you know no difference between member and member , in point of priviledge , unless they be under some sin . answ. 1. yes verily , there is a plain difference between member and member ( though professing believers ) in point of priviledge , though they lie under no sin : for , a man may speak and prophesy in the church , not women . a company of men may make a church , and so receive in , and cast out of the church , but not women though professing saints . 2. all grown men are not to be admitted ( though professing believers ) to the lords supper ; my reason is ; a man may believe in christ , and yet be very ignorant of the nature , use , and ends of the lords supper , now such may be baptized as soon as ever faith appeares , mark 16.16 . but they may not be admitted to the lords supper , because they will be guilty of the body and blood of the lord , if they through their ignorance , cannot discern the lord body . i know no reason but ignorant persons may be as well suspended from the use of this priviledge , though they be true believers ( for faith may consist with much ignorance ) as well as distracted persons , who notwithstanding may be believers also . 3. if therefore children be able to examine themselves and discern the lords body , they may then eat ; and herein there is no difference in this priviledge between member and member . 4. children not being usually able to examine themselves , nor discern the lords body , hence they are not to be admitted to the use of ●●is priviledge : and yet they may be such members as may enjoy the benefit of other priviledges even that of baptisme ▪ for baptisme seales up our first entrance into the covenant . this first entrance is not allway by pe●sonal profession of faith , but by gods promise of working , or of vouchsafeing the meanes of working of it , now children ( as is proved ) being under this covenant ( as we see all the posterity also of abraham was ) hence though children cannot profess faith , nor actually examine themselves , yet they may receive , and must receive baptisme , being allready under god● covenant ; but because the lords supper doth not seal up this first entrance , and first right to the covenant , but our growth and fruition of the covenant ; hence this act on our part is required to participate in this , which the apostle calls self-examination , and the act of takeing , and eating christ , and of discerning the lords body , and of doing this in remembrance of christ : which every baptised person , and church-member is not allway able to do . a child may receive a promise aforehand of a rich estate given him , and this promise sealed up to him , his father receiving it for him , but it is not fit that he should be put to the actual improvement , and fruition of that estate , untill he is grown up , understands himselfe , and knows how to do it : so 't is here , the sacrament of the lords supper requires ability , 1. to take christ as our own . 2. to eat christ , that is , to take fruition of him : the which acts of saith , god doth not require of all those immediately , who are wrapt up in covenant with him . object . 1. but here you say , that that examination 1 cor 1● is required of all that be members , and that at all times , as well as their first comming to the lords supper . answ. this examination is indeed required of all those members who should partake of the lords supper , but it is not required ( as you seem to say ) of every one to make him a member , so that none can be a member , but him that is able to examine himselfe ; for gods covenant to work faith , and to give power to examine one's selfe afterward , may make some as truely members as those who are able to act & express their faith . now i have proved that gods covenant is a forehand given to children : and to give them the seal of their first entrance into it many yeares after , is as vile a thing , as for them that are able , and fit to examine themselves , to have this sacrament of the lords supper denied , or delaied till many yeares after . object . 2. but you say , it 's left to every ones conscience to examine himself , not that others should examine them , and consequently if children be members , thou it must be left upon their conscience . answ. we know in our own consciences that children usually cannot examine themselves , now if the elders & the church are boūd to see christs rules observed by others , and if this examination be the rule that all must walk by who participate here , then they must not suffer such yong ones , no nor persons grown up , and entred in by personal profession , to receive this seal , as they know are unable thus to do : i think if churches should degenerate in these dayes , this course of discipline should be attended ( especially by the elders ) toward any of their members , which way soever they have entred , whether by their own , or by their parents covenant : and i have oft feared that there is some need already of it , even toward some who enter by their own covenant , and may have faith , but are miserably to seek in the nature , use , and ends of the lords supper , and consequently unfit to d●scern of christ's body , and so to come to that sacrament . object . 5. if children may be members , & yet not come to the lords supper : then it may come to pass that a whole church may be a church , and yet not have the lords supper , or ought not to have it . answ. 1. so there may , for a church may be a true church , & yet want the benefit of some one or more of gods ordinances , sometime pastors , sometime elders , sometime seales . 2. a church of professing believers may degenerate , and turn prophane , and sottish , and so have no just right to the seales ; and their officers may leave them , and so have no use of the seales : yet i suppose it is a church of christ still though degenerate , though unfit to enjoy seales ; will you therfore think the way of their membership unlawfull , viz. by professing their faith ? because such a rare thing as this may happen ? why then should you think the way of childrens membership unlawfull because of the like rarity in such a dark and gloomy state of them as you mention ? object . 6. if children be members , then there will be many in the church , who are not saints by calling , nor faithfull in christ iesus , which ought not to be if the church could see ●t , but these may be too plainly seen . answ. 1. i do think it 's true , that poor children may be ▪ and are look't upon with too too many dejected thoughts of unbelief , ●espising of them as children of wrath by nature , and not with such high thoughts of faith , as children , and sons of god by promise , as i have shewn . and i think herein is our great sin , as it was in christ's own disciples , who were the first , that we read of , that would not have little children brought unto him , for which he rebuked them , shewing their priviledge ; and for want of which faith in gods promise about our children , certainly god smites , and forsakes many of our children . 2. if therefore you think that church-members must consist only of saints by calling ; so that your meaning is , such saints as are so by outward and personal profession , from the call of the gospel , are only to be church-members ; this is an errour : for , 1. you know that they who define a church to be a number of visible saints , they usually put this phrase in , [ and their s●ed ] who may not profess faith perhaps as their fathers do : and you shall find that the israel of god under the old testament , are all of them said to be adopted , rom. 9.4 . chosen and called , isay 41.8 , 9. and faithfull , isai. 1.21 . and yet we know they were not all so by personal profession , but in respect of their joynt federation , and the outward covenant of god with them . 2. the outward covenant is not all way first entred into by personal profession of faith , but by gods covenant of promise to work , or to use the meanes to work faith : hence it undeniably follows ; that as many may be in church-covenant before they profess faith personally , so many may be members of the church without this profession of faith ; for this covenant of working faith ( as hath been formerly explained ) doth not only belong to the jews , but to gentile churches also , and believers ; as hath been proved , and might further be confirmed . object : but say you , if we saw hypocrites , we were to cast them out as well as prophane persons : and we see no grace in many children , and therefore they must not be received in . answ. 1. if you see children , of whom you cannot say that they are faithfull personally , yet they may be faithfull federally ( as hath been shewed ) for they may lie under gods covenant of begetting faith , by some meanes in them ; and then you are not to cast them out , but accept them , as god doth . 2. the children of godly parents though they do not manifest faith in the gospel , yet they are to be accounted of gods church , untill they positively reject the gospel , either in themselves , or in their parents ; and therefore god did never goe about to cast off ●he iews , and their seed , untill they put forth positive unbelief ; the lord promised to give them the means of faith , and did so : and when christ was come , and the gospel sent first unto them for their good , the lord herein fullfill'd his covenant-mercy , as toward his beloved people ; but when they rejected these meanes , and cast off christ , and his gospel , then rom. 11. they were broken off , and not before . now hypocrites are such as profess christ in words , and yet deny christ in deed , titus 1.16 . 2 tim. 3.5 . hence they are such , as positively refuse christ : hence the case of children in whom no positive unbeliefe appeares , is not the same with this of hypocrites , or prophane persons ; and when young ch●ldren shall grow positively such , i know not but they may be dealt with as any other members , for any such like offence . thus you see an answer to your six objections . in the end of your paper there are two qvestions , which i suppose may not a little trouble against their baptisme and membership . to these briefly . quest. 1. what good ( say you ) is it , either for a wicked , or an elect child , till he be converted , to be in the church ? or what good may any have by being in the church , till they can profit by what they enjoy ? answ. 1 the apostle put 's the like case , and gives you an answer rom. 3.1 , 2. what advantage hath the iew , and what profit is there of circumcision ? what use or profit could the infants then make of their church-covenant , membership , or seal , who understood none of these things ? do you think the lord exposed his holy ordinances then unto contempt ? and is more carefull that they may be profitably used now ? was there no good by circumcision ? yea saith the apostle , much every way . 2. what profit is it to persons grown up to yeares , and yet secretly hypocrites , who enter into the church by profession of the faith ? you will say there is good and profit in respect of the priviledges themselves , but they abusing them they had , in this respect , better have been without them , because they bring hereby upon themselves greater condemnation . the same say i of children , whom god receives into his church , by promise , and covenant of doing them good , although at present they may not be so sensible of this good . 3. to speak plainly , the good they get by being thus enriched is wonderfull : and here there is more need of a treatis● then of a l●tter , to clear up the benefits from all scruples , arising by being in outward covenant , in church fellowship , even unto infants : i confess i find little said by writers upon this subject , & i believe the doubts against childrens baptisme , as they arise by blindness in this particular ; so i think that god suffers that opinion to take place , that by such darkness he may bring out light in this particular . i will only hint unto you some few of my many thoughts , which have long exercised me for many yeares in this thing . the good by childrens membership , especially when sealed , is in four things . 1. in respect of god. god shews hereby the riches of his grace toward them , in taking them to be his people : in adopting them to be his children : in preventing them with many special promises aforehand of doing them good , by all which , the lord doth as it were prevent satan , in wooing their hearts as it were , so soon to draw them to him before he can actually stirr to draw their soules from him . so that i beseech you consider , suppose they cannot as yet understand , and so make profit by all this , yet is it not good for them , or for any of us to partake of gods grace , before we know how to make use of it ? is it not good for god to be good to them that are evil ? is it not good for god to glorifie & make manifest his grace to man , though man knowes not how to make use of his grace ? was it not rich grace for christ to wash peters feet , and yet he not know at present what it meant , only ( saith christ ) thou shalt know it afterward ? is it not good for god to give life to us , and to let us be born in such and such a place of the gospel where it is preached , and to lay in mercy aforehand for us , before we know how to be thankfull , or know how to use any of these outward mercies ? and is it no mercy or favour to have so much spiritual mercy bestowed on children aforehand , before they can be thankfull , or make use thereof ? deut. 7.6 , 7. the choosing of them to be his people , above all other people ( which you know was from the womb ) it 's called gods setting his love upon them , and the reason of this love , verse 8. is said to be , because god loved them , this love was not electing , & peculiar love , ( for thousands of these perished and went to hell ) but it was his externall adopting love to choose them to be his people , and to improve all means for their good , and to give them the good of all those means unless they refuse : and to give indefinitely among them , and particularly to many of them , such hearts as that they shall not be able to refuse the good of those meanes ( as hath been shewed formerly ) this is love , great love & mercy ; not shewn or promised to any who are not of the visible church throughout the whole world . by which god is glorified , & let him be so , though we cannot see how to profit by it , when it first break 's out ; have not you profited much by considering gods preventing grace , long before you understood how to make use of it ? hath not god received much glory from you for it ? hath this grace then think you , been unprofitably spent on gods part ? no verily : the case is the same here , david blesseth god , for being his god from his mothers belly , and from the womb , psal. 22.9 , 10. and gods grace is shewn through this expression , isai. 46.3 . 2. there is much good hereby in respect of the parents ; for , suppose the children cannot profit by it , yet parents may , and 't is in respect of them very much that god looks upon their children , thus to receive them into covenant , deut. 4.37 . for , 1. parents may hereby see , and wonder at the riches of gods grace , to become a god not only to themselves , but to take in their seed also , whose good they prize as their own , and as if done to themselves : hence abraham fell down upon his face , adoring god , when he heard of this covenant , gen. 17. see also how moses aggravates this love , in the eyes of all that had eyes to see , deut. 10.14 , 15. 2. hereby god gives parents some comfortable hope of their childrens salvation ; because they be within the pale of the visible church ; for as out of the visible church ( where the ordinary meanes of salvation be ) there is ordinarily no salvation , acts 2.47 . so if children were not of christs visible church and kingdome , we could not hope for their salvation , no more then of pagans , or turks ; for if they be without god , they are without hope , ephes. 2.12 . and to be without hope of such , to whom god hath made such promises of salvation , not given to pagans , nor proper to abraham , is very hard , and horrid to imagine ; for the promise run's universally , that the seed of the upright ( whether jews , or gentiles ) shall be blessed . psal. 112.1 , 2. prov. 20.7 . 3. hereby parents are stirred up the more earnestly to pray for them , because god's covenant and promise is so large toward them , at which prayer look's , and by which it wrestle's with god , and hence , we find that moses , and others , they use this argument in their prayers ; oh god of abraham , isaac , and iacob : &c : 4. hereby they may not only hope , and pray , but are incouraged to believe , concerning their children and the rest of those who are in covenant among them , that god will do them good , as they conclude mercy to the remnant , forgivness of their sins , with faith , upon this ground , thou wilt remember the truth to iacob , and thy mercy to abraham , sworn unto our fathers in dayes of old , micah 7.18 , 20. this indeed is the childrens faith for themselves , and their children : but so it may be a ground of parents faith : and if we pray for our children , why should we doubt ( leaving only secrets to god ) if we see them dy before they reject the gospel positively ; i see no reason for any man to doubt of the salvation of his child if he dyes , or that god will not do good to his child in time if he lives . 5. this stirrs up their hearts to be the more sincerely holy , and keep in with god , because of their children : and to educate them with more care , and watchfullness , because they are the lord's children as well as theirs ; they are not common , but holy vessels , and therfore let them see that they be not defiled ; and hence we find , that when god exhort's to any duty of holiness in scripture , he oft makes this the ground of it [ i am your god ] and hence god aggravates their sin in offering their children to molech , ezek. 16. because they were his children , that should have been better used . 3. in respect of themselves , the good is very great . 1. it is a special meanes to prevent sin , deut. 29. i make this covenant , not only with him that is present , but with your seed also , who are not here , verse 15 ▪ lest there should be among you man , or woman , family , or tribe , whose heart turnes away from god , and lest there should be a root of gall and wormwood : and indeed it mightily workes on the heart to think ; shall i whom god hath chosen to be his , be my own ; or be the divels , or be my lusts & c ? 2. 't is a strong motive & engagement upon them to forsake sin , even the uncircumcision and sin of their hearts , as is evident , deut. 10.15 , 16. the lord had a delight to choose the seed of your fathers , even you to be his people , as it is this day : what follow 's ? therefore circumcise the foreskin of your hearts , and be no more stiff-necked : 3. 't is a special help , as to avert their hearts from sin , so to convert & turn them to god , & to make them look toward god , that he would turn them , when perhaps they are without any hope ( in other respects ) of mercy , or of being able by any meanes they can use to turn themselves ; this is evident , acts 3.19 . with verse 25. repent and be converted , for you are the children of the covenant , which god made with our fathers ; this drawes their hearts , when they see , how god call's them to return , ier. 3.22 . come unto me ye back sliding children &c : we c●me unto thee , for thou art the lord our god. when backsliding ephraim could not convert himselfe , he cryes unto god , oh turn me ▪ and i shall be turned , for thou art the lord my god , ier. 31.18 . which places cannot be meant of being their god only by internal covenant , in giving to them the special benefits of the covenant , for then they should be in covenant with god and have remission of all their sins , &c : before they were turned , or before faith ? and therefore it 's meant of being a god in outward , and external church-covenant , which is no smal motive , and loadst one to believe . and although many do not believe , and will not be turned , yet this covenant is an high priviledge , and great favour , fitt in it self , to draw to god , though many believe not : and hence the apostle saith , that the priviledge of the iew is great , in having god's oracles ( which contain god's covenant ) committed to them , though some believe no● , which unbelief make's not ( he saith ) the faith of god , i. e. god's promise or covenant of none effect , or an uneffectual , and fruitless covenant : for this word of god's covenant shall take some effect among some such as are in it ; which therfore is a priviledge , though many perish , as is evident , rom. 9.4 , 6. 4. 't is a special meanes of binding them fast to god , when they are turned : ier. 13.11 . as the girdle cleaveth unto a man , so have i caused the whole house of israel , to cleave unto me , that they may be for a name , and glory . deut. 30.20 . thou shalt cleave unto him , because he is thy life , and the length of thy dayes : he was not their life spiritually , and savingly , ( for many thus exhorted , were dead , and in their sins ) but federally , or in outward covenant . 5. if they shall forsake , and break loose from god , and from the bond of his covenant , and have ( as much as in them lies ) cast themselves out of covenant , by their own perfidiousness , & breach of covenant , that one would think now there is no more hope ; yet it is a special meanes , to encourage their hearts to return again : even when they seem to be utterly cast off , and therefore it 's said ier. 3 1. though thou hast committed whoredome with many lovers ( wherby the covenant was broken ) yet return unto me : so deut. 4. if when you are scattered among the nations , and shall serve wood & stone , and be in great tribulation , if from thence thou seek the lord thy god , thou shalt find him , he will not forsake thee ; and what is the reason of it ? viz. his remembrance of the covenant with their fathers , for so 't is deut. 4.27 , 28 , 29 , 30 31. but i forbear to name more such things as these which come by outward covenant to inchurched members . 4. in respect of others their good is very great ; for , 1. now they may enjoy the special watch and care of the whole church , which otherwise they must want . 2. they hereby have the more fervent prayers of others for their good : and hence rom. 9.1 , 2 , 3. we see how paul upon this ground had great zeal in his prayers for the jews , not only because his countrymen , but especially because to them did belong the adoption , and covenants , & they had gracious fathers &c. so psal ▪ 89.49 . lord remember thy former loving kindnesses , which are sworn to david in truth . and hence we see moses oft pleads and prevailes with god in prayer , for the sinning israelites , viz. oh remember abraham , isaac , and iaco● ▪ now i pray you , lay all these things together , and then see whether you have any cause to say ; what profit is there by covenant and church-membership of persons not yet able to profess the faith of jesus christ ? quest. 2. you say , when families were churches , all of the family were of the church , and when a nation was a church , all that were of that nation were of that church ; but now believers being matter of the church , what if none were admitted , till they can hold forth visible faith , would not many of these things be more clear ? answ. in these words there is a threefold mistake . 1. that all of the family & nation in former times were of the church : this 〈…〉 for god never took ●●y to be his church , but 〈◊〉 they were believers , at 〈◊〉 e●ternally , in that nation ; i say believers : which either are professed believers : or promised believers , such as by outward covenant shall have the meanes to be made believers in y ● nation ; and hence you have heard , that the nation of the jews stood by faith , and were broken of by unbeliefe , and if any rejected the covenant : as ishmael , and esau , they were not of that church , though they did , and might dwell in y t nation , as doubtless thousands did . 2. you think that visible p●●sonal faith only , makes the church , and members of it ; which ●s an errour , as may appear from many thing● already said : for children may be in gods account professors of y ● faith parentally , as well as personally ; i. e. in the profession of their parents , as well as in their own ; and hence you shall find , that the covenant god entered into with the parents of church-members personally , the children are said , to have that covenant made with them many hundred yeares 〈◊〉 see for this purpose ▪ among hundreds , these few scriptures , hagga● 2.5 . in haggal's time god is said to make a covenant with them then when they came out of egypt ( which was not personally , but parentally ) so hosea 12.4 , 5. when god entred into covenant with jacob at bethel ; god is said to speak with us , who lived many yeares after ; and hence the children many yeares after , challenge gods covenant with them , which was made with their fathers for them , micah 7.19 , 20. hence also those children are said to come to christ ( who were not able to come themselves ) but only were brought in the armes of others to christ. it 's a known thing among men , that a father may receive a gi●● , or legacy given to him , and his heires , and he , and his heires are bound to perform the condition of the covenant , and promise by which it is conveyed , and that the child doth this in his father . 3. you think that if men only , grown up , and able to profess faith , should be of the church , then all things would be more clear abo●● children : truly i believe the quite contrary , upon y ● grounds before laid dow● ; for , 1. hereby pollution of church shall not be avoyded , but rather introduced , to exclu●● children from an holy-making covenant , as we have proved . 2. hereby that good and benefit of their covenant , should be lost , ( not gain'd ) by excluding them out of covenant , untill they can personally profess , and make use of the covenant : the wisdome of man ▪ furthers not the righteousness of god. and here let me conclude with the naked profession o● my faith to you in this point , which is ● bulwark of defence against all that is said by anabaptists against baptising of infants . 1. that the children of professing believers are in the same covenant god made with abraham ; abraham was a father of many nations , and not of one nation only , and hence the same covenant made with him , and the believing israel in that nation , the sa●● covenant is made with all his believing seed in all other nations . 2. that baptisme is a seal of our first entrance , and admission into covenant ; and therfore is to be immediately applyed to children of believeing parent , as soon as ev●●●hi● be in covenant , and that is as soon as they become the visible seed 〈…〉 faithfull , for so the covenant to abraham run's ( i will be thy god , and the god of thy seed ) not only his elect-seed , but church-seed , ( as hath been shew'd ) not only of his seed in that one nation , but in all nations . these two things i cann●●●ell how to avoid the light of , they are so clear ▪ and the ignorance of these makes so many anabaptists ( as they are called ) and i never , yet met with any thi●● written by them ( and much i have read ) that was of any considerable weight to overthrow these . but i forget my selfe , and trouble you : my prayer is and shall be , that the lord would g●ve you understanding in all these things . finis . errata preface , page 4. lin● 20. read wonted . p. 6. l. 7. r. y t have fought . p. 7. l. 28. r. spirit●●● page 18. li●● 29. for 〈◊〉 r. an● . in y e book page 11. line 34. for now r. were . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a59660-e460 instances hereof see in the p●eface to ●●e act of the synod held a● boston . 16●2 touching b●ptism & consociation of churches . cap. 4. pag. 14. keyes cha. 4 pag. 15. act. mon. vol 3. pag. 606 — 610. s. m. notes for div a59660-e8310 argum : 1. a publick dispute betwixt john tombs ... respondent, john cragge, and henry vaughan ... opponents, touching infant-baptism, the fifth of september, 1653 ... occasioned by a sermon preached the day before, by mr. tombs, upon st. mark 16.16 ... : also a sermon preached by mr. cragge, the next lords day following, upon the same text, wherein the necessity of dipping is refuted, and infant-baptism asserted. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a62871 of text r9749 in the english short title catalog (wing t1813). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 152 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 84 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a62871 wing t1813 estc r9749 13283223 ocm 13283223 98780 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a62871) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 98780) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 440:9) a publick dispute betwixt john tombs ... respondent, john cragge, and henry vaughan ... opponents, touching infant-baptism, the fifth of september, 1653 ... occasioned by a sermon preached the day before, by mr. tombs, upon st. mark 16.16 ... : also a sermon preached by mr. cragge, the next lords day following, upon the same text, wherein the necessity of dipping is refuted, and infant-baptism asserted. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. cragge, john, gent. vaughan, henry, sir, 1587?-1659? [21], 111 p. printed for h. twyford, n. brook, j. place ..., london : 1654. added engraved false t.p. there is some print show-through and some pages are marked; signature a2 has print faded in filmed copy. beginning-p. 15 photographed from bodleian library copy and inserted at the end. reproduction of original in british library. eng anabaptists -early works to 1800. infant baptism -early works to 1800. a62871 r9749 (wing t1813). civilwar no a publick dispute betwixt john tombs, b.d. respondent. john cragge, and henry vaughan, m.a. opponents, touching infant-baptism, the fifth of tombes, john 1654 27107 6 250 0 0 1 0 98 d the rate of 98 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the d category of texts with between 35 and 100 defects per 10,000 words. 2004-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2004-12 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-01 emma (leeson) huber sampled and proofread 2005-01 emma (leeson) huber text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the anabaptists anotamized and silenced in a publique dispute the man̄er of the anabaptists dipping their laying on of hands their washing of feete the disputation a publick dispute betwixt john tombs , b. d. respondent . john cragge , and henry vaughan , m. a. opponents , touching infant-baptism , the fifth of september , 1653. in the church of st. maries in abergavenie in monmothshire . occasioned by a sermon preached the day before , by mr. tombs , upon st. mark . 16.16 . he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved , but he that believeth not , shall be damned . also a sermon preached by mr. cragge , the next lords day following , upon the same text : wherein the necessity of dipping is refuted , and infant-baptism asserted . london , printed for h. twyford , n. brook , j. place , and are to be sold in vine-court middle temple , the angel in cornhill , and at furnivals-inn-gate in holborn . 1654. to his reverend friend , i. t. p. grace , mercy , and peace be multiplyed . sir , i received your letter , full of zeal , and christian piety , the contents whereof may be reduced to these six heads , wherein you desire resolution ; first , what my sense is of the anabaptists ; secondly , when was the spring and rise of them ; thirdly , what is the cause of this present growth , and increase of them ; fourthly , why they are permitted ; fifthly , what i think of disputes and conferences had with them ; sixthly , a true relation of that had with us of late , ( which you say is variously reported ) of all which briefly i 'le endeavour to give satisfaction . for the first , i referr you to the sermon , and conference here following , to the harmonies and confessions of the reformed churches , of all churches since the apostles , especially the western , where you shall find universalitie , antiquity , and succession ( besides many pregnant places of scripture ) pleading for infant-baptism ; and that ( as austin saies ) which the whole church holds , was never begun by any councel , but alwaies observed , cannot otherwise be believed , but that it came from the apostles . for the second , the spring and rise of anabaptism , as all errours , so it had its beginning after truth , the husbandman first sowed good corn , then the enemy tares ; no age was free : in the first hundred years arose the ebionites , chiliasts , and gnosticks ; in the second , the marcionites , valentinians , and montanists ; in the third , the novatians , sabellians , and manichees ; in the fourth , the arrians , donatists , and eunomians ; in the fifth , nestorians , eutychians , and patripassians ; in the sixth , jacobites , armenians , and monothelites ; in which time the mysterie of iniquity began more fully to work , which was first nascent , then crescent , then regnant , then triumphant . and no sooner appeared a reformation in luther's time , but there were herods that sought the life of this babe , dragons watching while the woman was travelling , to devour the child ; amongst whom the anabaptists of germany were most venemous ; the first author whereof was one nicholas stock , then phipher , knipperdoling , munster , with their tayler-king john beccold of leyden , who gave out that he had a commission from heaven to destroy all nations that would not submit to his gospel , and be rebaptized ; raging with sword and persecution , till he was taken , and being examined by exquisite tortures , confessed he received his doctrine from an impure spirit ; there you have the spring and rise of it . now for the third , the present growth , and increase of it , the reasons may be many ; 1. times of division , wherein the hedge of discipline is broken down ; liberty in religion is like free conversing without restraint , or watch in time of pestilence , one house easily infects a whole city . 2. satan's malice , like a river , the further it goes , the deeper , and fiercer . 3. the corruption of man's nature , more inclinable to errour than truth . 4. the fitness of the engin for devastation , and ruinating all former churches , under colour of first-baptisms nullity , gathering of new ones ( after their own mould ) out of the old ruins , by re-baptizing . 5. the pretence that children are uncapable of church-membership , or communion of saints , as if there were not the same capacity under the gospel , which was under the law . 6. false allegation that infant-baptism is occasion of loose living , as if the native jews that were sealed when infants , were more dissolute than the proselytes . 7. to limit it to ripe years , increases piety , as if jews , and turks , and their own rebaptized converts , were not more frequently guilty of apostasie and hyprocrisie . 8. not understanding that infants church-membership in the old testament , is not repealed , but confirmed in the new . 9. a carnal estimation that the covenant made with abraham was partly carnal , of which circumcision is a part , as if godliness in both testaments had not the promise of this life , and of the life to come 10. that circumcision was the seal of righteousness of faith to abraham , and not his posterity . 11. that the covenant was made with abraham , and his spiritual seed onely , and not with visible professors . 12. that there is no such thing as national churches , though christ saies , make disciples of all nations , and isaiah saies , all nations shall flow in , &c. yet ( they say ) all churches must be gathered by actual profession , as well in christian nations , as amongst turks and pagans . 13. because we have no particular instance in terminis , that any infants were baptized , and because they are not expresly named in the precept , as if generals did not include particulars , as well for infants as old men . 14. denying equivalencies , and necessary consequences from scripture . 15. a vilifying of the judgement and persons of all godly and learned men of this present , and former ages , building up their rotten foundations upon their ruins . 16. temporal interests of the lowest of the people , which while they dream it s countenanced by men in power , cry hosanna to day , and perhaps crucifie to morrow . 17. a pretending to the spirit of god ; numa pompilius feigned that he conversed with the goddess egeria , minos with jupiter in the cave , solon with the delphian apollo , mahomet with the angel gabriel ; montanus , and the shakers , with the holy ghost ; the white witches , with the spirit in the shape of a dove , and all but to palliate their unfound opinions and practises . let not his soul prosper that does not acknowledge and thirst after the true spirit of god , yet let us try the spirits , and not believe every lying spirit . 18. the learning , subtilty , and industry , of some anabaptists , to gain proselytes ; arrius , pelagius , marcion , were not wiser in their generation than they , to inveagle the poor simple people , especially women and inferiour tradesemen , which in seven years can scarce learn the mysterie of the lowest profession , think half seven years enough ( gain'd from their worldly imployments ) to understand the mysterie of divinity , and thereupon meddle with controversies , which they have no more capacity to pry into , than a batt to look up into the third heaven . these , and many more , are the causes of the increase of anabaptism . now , for the fourth , you enquire why they are permitted , and their books printed , and published , seeing those of arrius of old , dr. pocklington's , and mr. archer's of late ( more innocent ) were burned ? to satisfie you in this , something is to be imputed to the providence of god , something to the wisdome of the state . the providence of god , who suffers errours , 1. that truth by opposition may more diligently be searched out . 2. that the sincerity and constancy of the faithfull may be tryed . 3. that the impenitent , and proud in spirit , may be blinded and hardned . the wisdome of state , who like wise chirurgions , will not launce a turgid ulcer , till it be ripe ; a skilfull physician , that will not purge some floating humours , till they be setled . therefore the late parliament declared , that they would not have them cudgell'd , but perswaded out of their errours . the two lights of our goshen ( though they differ in judgment from them ) endeavour not to force them , but by sweet insinuations and arguments to win them ; besides , some of them have been esteemed godly , amongst which mr. tombs may be ranked ; who knows but that may be verified of him , that was of cyprian , non videt haec , ut videat meliora , he sees not these things , that he may see better things ? god , it may be , suffers him to fall , with peter , that his rise may be more glorious , tu conversus , confirma fratres , that being converted , he may strengthen his brethren ; will burn his stubble , hay , wood , with the spiritual fire of the word , or affliction , that his gold may be the purer . fifthly , you enquire whether it may be fit to dispute , and conferr with them , seeing their doctrine eats as a canker , for which cause the empress would not suffer her son theodosius to discourse with the heretick eunomius . to which i answer ; the sword of the spirit , which is the word of god , is the onely weapon to wound the hairy scalp of false teachers ; with this , christ confounded the sadduces ; st. peter , simon magus ; athanasius , the arrians ; austin the pelagians , and manichees . there are none that speak against seasonable disputes , but either those that understand them not , or with spiritual pride storm against those that are gifted with that faculty above them , or they that cannot endure that their errours be unmasked , and their soars galled ; camels , conscious of their deformity , trouble the water , foul faces love not the looking-glass . true it is , we ought to receive the weak in faith , not to doubtfull disputations ; but when false teachers have infused poyson , may we not apply an antidote ? when they have sowed darnel , and cockle , may not we weed them out ? this is to set towns and cities on fire , and to deny buckets to quench them ; to suffer invasions , and to permit none to rally together an army to resist them . the disputes at bewdly , hereford , and ross , have been successfull to astonishment ; and in this last at abergavenie ( though tumultuary , and on a sudden ) hath appeared the finger of god ; he that with spittle , and clay , opened the eyes of the blind , overthrew the walls of jericho with the sound of ramms-horns , with these weak means hath wrought strong effects , that no creature may glory in the arm of flesh . to the relation whereof ( in the last place ) and the occasion of it , i come now ; which was thus ; mr. tombs for several months together being importuned by letters and messengers , came at length to water that , which mr , miles , prosser , and others had planted , or ( as some think ) to confirm a child lately baptized in london ; when he entred the pulpit , great expectation was , what mountains would bring forth ; his text was mark . 16.16 . whence he concluded , that infant-baptism was a nullity , a mockery ; no baptism but by dipping , or plunging , was lawfull ; all that would be saved must be re-baptized , or baptized after profession ; that there was no such thing as infant-baptism in the primitive times , but that it came in with other corruptions , upon unsound grounds ; and challenged the whole congregation to speak , if they had any thing to say to the contrary . there were many well learned that heard him , especially two , mr. bonner a neighbouring minister , and mr. vaughan schoolmaster of the town , formerly a fellow of jesus college in oxford , who both for the present kept silence , onely mr. bonner closed with him in the way to his lodging , and told him , that he had delivered some things contrary to that he had read in the antients , and other things that grieved his spirit to hear , and desired therefore to conferr with him thereabout the next morning : he slighted the grave old gentleman , with as much contempt , as austin the monk did the british commissioners at bangor , yet told him , that he would tarry in the town till such an hour ; in the mean time , the greatest part of the people were offended , stagger'd , or scrupled , some not knowing what to think of their own , their children , and their ancestours salvation . the anabaptists that night , and especially the next morning , triumphed , saying , where are your champions now ? some of them are struck dumb , others dare not shew their faces , whil'st master tombs is in the town , naming mr. cragge , another neighbouring minister ; the report whereof being brought unto him , he repaired instantly to the town , and meeting with mr. bonner ; and mr. vaughan , they went all together to mr. tombs , where he was at a private house ; little was said there , by reason of the throng of people pressing in ; but it was agreed upon , that they should meet in the church , or publick meeting place , at one a clock , which was done accordingly ; mr: tombs took the pulpit , the opponents a seat over against it : mr. bonner was preparing to give the on●et , but a gentleman disswaded him , by reason of his age , and bodily infirmities , lest it should impair his health ; mr. vaughan began , mr. cragge succeeded , continuing the opposition betwixt them for almost five hours . when the dispute was ended , mr. cragge was desired by many godly persons to preach upon the same text mr. tombs had done , the lords day following , which he did accordingly ; i send you here enclosed the sum of all ; a copy of mr. vaughan's conference , which a friend procured me from his own hand , mr. cragge's sermon and dispute , i took from his own mouth by short-writing ; you have the disputations first , then the sermon ; the lord bless them to you , and you to his glory , which shall be the prayer of him , who is yours to serve you in the lord jesus , j. w. to the reader . courteous reader , to please my self , and perhaps thee , i shall displease many ; first , my friend , for making his private token a publick frolick . secondly , mr. tombs , for bringing him in this last catastrophe wounded in the heel by troilus and paris , who vaunts that in former scenes , ( like achilles , so far as he was dipped in the river by his mother thetis ) he hath been unpierced by the weapons of the stoutest hectors . thirdly , mr. cragge , and mr. vaughan , for exposing their disputes , conceived in an hour and an half , and the sermon contrived in a day and a half , to long censure . fourthly , the anabaptists ( as they will deem ) for too uncourteously galling their soars . fiftly , their adversaries the paedobaptists , for too courteously , or ( as they will fancy ) partially concealing mr. tombs harsh language , and his favourites incivilities . sixtly , the learned in general , for bringing these nilus-like hatched births in a moment into the open amphitheater with those elephants that have been ten years in conception . my apologie for the whole is as followeth ; the bulk of this manual is small , some may reach to the price of it , that cannot of those larger volumes ; may have time to read it , that cannot them . the method of this is facile , the language plain , some will understand this , that cannot them . besides , we naturally love the transactions of those , whose persons we know ; some heard them transiently as they were delivered , and would be glad deliberately to read them ; some heard them not , but at the second hand , as they were variously reported ( according to the judgement and affection of the relator ) who would be willing to know the business truly stated . if any of the parties cencerned find themselves aggrieved , and intend to bend their stile against me , i 'le answer them at the day of judgement , when the secrets of all hearts shall be disclosed : in the mean time , if truth may be advanced , errour discouraged , godliness countenanced , hypocrisie unmasked , thou edified , god glorified , i have mine ends . farewell . yours in the lord , i. t. p. a relation of a conference had between mr. john tombs b. d. and henry vaghan m. a. in st. maries church in abergevennie , sept. 5. 1653. touching infants baptism , briefly , and punctually set down to the sense of both . v. infants may lawfully be baptized ; for they may be admitted into the covenant of grace now by baptism , as they were before , and under the law , admitted into the same covenant by circumcision . t. i deny your consequence . v. you must deny it , either because the covenant of grace made with abraham , and his seed , is not the same in substance with that which is now actually in force with beleevers , and their children , or secondly , because baptism succeedeth not in the room of circumcision . t. i could deny your division : yet i say , to gratifie you , for both those reasons . v. for the former . that the covenant made with abraham , and his seed , is the same which is now actually in force with beleevers , appears by comparing genes . 17.2 . with galat. 3.14 . where it is clearly set forth , that the promise made to abraham , came unto the gentiles through jesus christ . t. here he distinguisheth of a towfold seed of abraham , the naturall , and spirituall , and saith , that the covenant was made with abrahams spirituall seed , and not the naturall . v. even all the children of abraham were circumcised , and consequently admitted into the covenant , not one excepted ; for every man-child was to be circumcised , gen. 17.10 . it appears by what hapned to moses for not circumcising his child , exod. 4.24 . even ishmael was circumcised , genes . 17.23 : who belonged not to the promise , but was of the naturall seed . t. ishmael , and the naturall children of abraham were admitted to the externall part , namely outward privileges , and temporall blessings , and not to the internall , or spirituall part thereof . by the internall part he must needs mean that part of it expressed gen. 17.7 . in these words , to be a god unto thee , and unto thy seed after thee , and in the end of v. 8. i will be their god . to justifie this his distinction , he referred us to rom. 9. and i think v. 8. where the children of the promise are contradistinguished from the children of the flesh , or the naturall children of abraham ; so that the covenant was made not to the naturall children of abraham , but to such of them as were elect , and faithfull . v. this covenant was made alike in the same extent , and latitude , promiscuously with all the seed of abraham ; and those that lost the promise , and the benefit of this covenant ( which men you call the naturall seed ) lost it not because they were not at first comprehended in the covenant , but because of their own unbeleef , rom. 11.20 . i confesse that the children of isaack are , rom. 9. called the children of the promise , not in regard of any peremtory election , or designation to faith , and salvation , or on the contrary ▪ of any absolute reprobation of the seed of ishmael . for if it had been pauls designe to declare the children of ishmael , yea the greatest part of the jewes , to have been rejected by a certain absolute decree , why should he v. 1.2 . so much lament their incredulitie ? wish himself accursed for their sakes , v. 3. and rom. 10. v. 1. desire , and pray for their conversion ? since upon such an absolute decree of reprobating them , all that happened to them was inevitable . but the children of isaack are called the children of promise , first , because they onely were to inherite the land of canaan ; and secondly , because christ according to the flesh was to descend from the progenie of isaack , not of ishmael . i might have added , that if none but the elect , and faithfull , can be admitted into the covenant , there is no subject left for the ordinance of baptism , it being impossible for man to know who are elect , spirituall , and true believers . neither can you baptize with right , or safety , all such grown persons as you baptize , since you cannot be assured that they are elect , spirituall , or true believers , ( revel. 2.17 . ) nor have any light to guide you , save that of charitable opinion , and conjecture . again , it being admitted that none but the spiritually , elect , and believing , can be baptized , the same charitie that swayes your judgment for grown persons , must much rather move you to hope the best of innocent infants , guiltie of no actuall sin , since it hopes all things , and thinks no evill , 1. cor. 13.2 . they may have faith ( in semine & habitu ) in the seed ( as they have the habit of principles , and reason ) tho they cannot exercise it till ripe years . 3. though they have not actuall faith , yet the faith of their parents may , and doth , put them into a capacitie of being admitted into the covenant , nor is it news that the parents faith advantageth the children . joh. 4.50 . t. i could wish you could prove that infants of believers might be admitted to baptism by virtue of their parents faith . v. they were admitted into the same covenant by circumcision , into which we are admitted now by baptism , but circumcision is a seal of the righteousness of faith , rom. 4.11 , 12. whence it will follow , that either they had the righteousness of faith inherently in themselves , or that of their parents imputed to them ( chuse you whether ) or else it will follow that circumcision was a false seal . t. it is not said there that circumcision was the seal of righteousness of the childrens faith , but onely of abrahams own faith in particular . v. but the covenant , or promise , was the same and alike to abraham , and his seed , rom. 4.13 . gen. 17.7 . and alike to us believers , and to our children , act. 2. 39. 2. this truth appears yet further from . 1. cor. 7 14. where we find that the faith of either of the parents makes the children holy , at least in that degree of holyness ( which is the meanest imaginable ) to be in capacitie of being admitted into the same covenant with their parents . t. the scope of the apostle here , is to satisfie a scruple of the corinth . viz. whether the believing yoak-fellow might live in the enjoying and use of the unbelieving yoak-fellow ? he resolves them in the affirmative , saying , the unbelieving husband is sanctifyed in ( as 't is in the greek ) or to ( not for , or by ) the wife , &c. that is , he may lawfully use , and enjoy her , and she enjoy him — and their children holy , that is , legitimate . v. but here is certainly some speciall privilege set forth to the children of believers accruing to them from the believing parents . besides , it had been no news to tell them they might have the lawfull use of one another , and that their children were legitimate , and no bastards . for where both husband , and wife were unbelievers , no man ever doubted but their enjoyment of one another was lawfull , and their issue legitimate . t. the case is meant where both parties at their entrance into marriage were unbelievers , but afterwards one of them happens to be converted , whether then they might cohabit , and enjoy the use of one another . v. though this were granted ( which i shall not contend about ) yet the apostles sense can not be of the lawfull use , and enjoyment of each other , for the word {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} sanctifyed , never denotes to be lawfull . or if ever you shew me that {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} which is render'd holy , signifies lawfull , i shall urge no further . t. ther 's that acception of the word 1. tim. 4.4 , 5. every creature of god is good , and not to be refused , if it be received with thanksgiving , for it is sanctified ( {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ) by the word of god , and prayer here sanctifyed is for lawfully used , as standing in opposition to that which is refused . v. the sense is , that such use of the creature is pleasing to god , as acknowledging him the authour , and sender ; for suppose a sinfull man eat his meat without invoking god for a blessing , hath he not a lawfull use of the creature ? t. his next instance was 1. thes. 4.3 , 4 , 7. where sanctification is used for chastitie , and might hear that sense in this place , 1 cor. 7.17 . in agitation . v. i deny it , for sanctification is there used in its full latitude , as appears by the context . but i will descend to prove the second ground of my consequence , at the beginning , which you denied , viz. that baptism succeeded in the room of circumcision . mr. tombs had told us that it was impossible , for then women should not be baptized , because they were not circumcised , [ which is bellarmines argument ] to which i answered , that indeed the males only were mentioned in the covenant of circumcision , for in the eyes of all laws whatsoever , the women are but as ignoble creatures , and therefore the usuall stile of laws , and covenants is , si quis and qui in the masculine [ except such as particularly respect their sex ] 2. that they are included in the word seed , and because descended from man , did partake of the privilege , and promise annexed to the covenant . [ i thought also to have told him , that i well knew that before christs time , baptism and circumcision were both practised on the proselites called proselitae justitiae ( as i could have shewed out of severall authours ) yet that hinder'd not , but that baptism now under the gospell should be the sole means to admit us into the same covenant , into which the jews were admitted by circumcision . even as the bread and wine were taken by the jews at the eating of the passeover , and now that the jewish passeover is abrogated , the bread and wine were only by christ retained to commemorate his passion , the true passeover . 1. cor. 5.7 . and in like manner when circumcision was abolished , yet was baptism retained to admit the infants of christians , as circumcision admitted them of the jews ; but the time , and his close manner of disputing not permiting this enlarging by recourse to the originall , and institution of baptism , which served more to illustrate than convince , i kept to the tedder allowed , and came at length to prove that proposition ] from col. 2.11.12 . where 1 the circumcision of christ is set in opposition to the jewish circumcisition made with hands . 2. an explanation of what is meant by the circumcision of christ in these words , being buryed with him in baptism . t. paul here disswades them from the use of jewish ceremonies ( which some would have introduced amongst them ) and particularly of circumcision , because all those were but shadowes , but the body and realitie was of christ . v. t' is confessed the apostle speaks here against imposers of jewish ( and also pythagorean ) doctrines , and practises : but see ye not here a double circumcision , and the circumcision of christ described by being buried with him in baptism . the word buried implyeth but the resemblance betwixt christs death , and resurrection , with what is done in baptism , where there is an immersion or plunging in the water , to shadow his buriall , and emersion or rising up out of the water , to represent his resurrection , which resemblance is more fully set forth rom. c. 6. t. here mr. tombs interrupted me , and desired the people to take notice of my ingenuous confession , that baptism was then practised by plunging . he read also a passage out of casaubons annot. on the new test. where he saith that {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} to baptise , denoteth a plunging of the whole body &c. had he read out the passage , he might have found how that great scholar affirmes this to be a slender argument against such as only sprinkle at baptism , for saith he , the vertue and efficacie of baptism consistes not in that , meaning the manner of washing . v. i shall satisfie the auditours herein anon , in the mean time i desire answer to my argument , the analogie between circumcision and baptism being so evident in this place ; but receiving none , i addressed my self to the people , according to promise , saying , that indeed it seemed to me that for some centuries of years , that baptism was practised by plunging : for sprinkling was brought first in use by occasion of the clinicks ( as cyprian epist : a magnum relates ) being men which deferred their baptism till some extremitie of sickness , who then in such case were only sprinkled with water , lest the plunging of their bodies might over-offend them in that feeble desperate condition . t. here take notice that sprinkling took its rise from a corrupt custome . v. though plunging be confessed the more antient way , yet is this no ground for that over-uncharitable speech of yours , in your sermon yesterday : that our baptism , meaning of infants , and by sprinkling , was but a nullitie , and mockery , which concludes our selves , and all our auncestours , even all in the western church for 1500. years , under damnation . for the church hath power upon the sight of any inconvenience , and for order and decencies sake , to alter the circumstantials and externalls of any ordinance . t. what have they to doe to alter any thing from the form of christs institution ? v. that they have such a power is confessed by all divines , and he is none that denies it , yea i believe it is acknowledged by your own practice . t. wherein ? v. in the administration of the lords supper , which was done by christ in the evening , and also then by his apostles after their love-feastes : the whole church of god , ( and your self i suppose ) take it in the morning , which custome hath taken place , and obtained every where for very many ages , even from their dayes who immediatly succeeded the apostles . thus advising him to be wise to sobriety , and cease to imbroyl the church of god ( so infinitly torn already ) and to submit to the judgment , and scarce-interrupted practise of the western churches , even for 1500. years , to which gods providence could not be so far wanting , as to suffer them to fall into such an errour of admitting and retaining a baptism ( which in his account was none ) we broke off , a relation of the dispute had between mr. john tombs b. d. respondent , and john cragge mr. a. opponent , in st. maries church in abergevennie , septemb. 5. 1653. touching infant-baptism . mr. cragge having briefly expressed that he was forced to undertake this task , on a sudden , and unprovided , against so experienced a champion ; desired , first , if he should fail , the cause might not suffer prejudice in mens opinions for his sake . 2. that libertie might be granted of a premeditate , and treatable dispute hereafter , not doubting that if he should but study the question so many hours as mr. tombs hath done dayes , so many dayes as he hath done weeks , so many weeks as he months , or so many months as the years , the truth was so evident on his side , he would not fear ( maugre all opposition ) to make it clear . in the mean time trusting to gods assistance , ( whose cause it was ) he would attempt it , beginning with this enthymema . c. some infants may not be baptized , therefore some infants may be baptized . t. having repeated , he denyed the consequence . c. which he proved thus , subcontrary propositions in a contingent matter may be both true . but these , viz : ( some infants may not be baptised , some infants may be baptized ) are subcontrary propositions in a contingent matter . therefore they may be both true . t. having repeated the syllogism , he said there were four terms in it . c. he enquired where ? t. he answered in these words ( may be both true ) in the premisses , and ( are both true ) in the conclusion . c. he returned , that was mr. tombs syllogism , none of his , reciting that distick of martial . quem recitas meus est ô fidentine logismus , sed male dum recitas , incipit esse tuus . t. repeating it over again after him , said that , c. which he took thus away ; that which proves the thing denied , is sufficient ; but that subcontrary propositions in a contingent matter may be both true , proves the thing denied , that some infants may not be baptized , some infants may be baptized ; therefore it is sufficient . t. he denyed the minor , tho it be an axiom , subcontrary propositions in a contingent matter may be both true , yet it was not consequent that these subcontrary contingent propositions ( some infants may not be baptized , some infants may be baptized ) may be both true . c. which was proved thus . that which is affirmed and predicated of the species , may , and is affirmed of every individuum , and particular under that species : but it is affirmed of the species , that subcontrary propositions in a contingent matter may be both true , therefore it may be affirmed of these particular propositions ( some infants may not be baptized , some infants may be baptized ) that they may be both true , t. he said it was a fallacy , he went about to entrappe him , in confessing that subcontrary propositions may be both true , where the subject is capable , but here the subject , ( to wit infants ) are not capable of baptism . c. then replyes he , they are not contingent ( which is here required ) but necessary propositions , in materiâ necessaria , if the subject be not capable , but we speak of contingent propositions , the predicate whereof may be affirmed or denied of the subject without contradiction ; which while he was framing into a syllogism , t. mr. t. interrupted him , saying , what would the man say if he could speak ? c. you love not to hear truth speak , but would strangle it in the birth , like the egyptian midwives ; but to give you further satisfaction , i will prove that they are actually both true , especially that some infants may be baptized , for of the other there is no controversie . which he did thus , to whom belongs the essence of baptism , they may be baptized ; but to some infants belongs the essence of baptism ; therefore some infants may be baptized . t. he denyed the minor , that the essence of baptism did belong to some infants . c. which was proved thus ; to whom belongs the definition of baptism , to them belongs the essence ; but to some infants belongs the definition of baptism ; therefore to some infants belongs the essence of baptism . t. he answered first to the major , ( to whom belongs the definition of baptism , to them belongs the essence , ) it was idem per idem , proving of the same thing by the same . c. to which was replyed , why then sayes aristotle , that {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the definition is a manifestation of the essence , and logicians describe a definition , to be explicatio rei essentiae , the expression of the essence of a thing , now that which expresses a thing ; and which is expressed , are two distinct things . then he denied the minor , which was proved thus . c , the definition of baptism , as of all other relations , is made up of the fundament , correlative , and termini . but all these three fundamentum , correlatum , & terminus , belong to infants ; therefore the definition of baptism belongs to infants . t. he denied the major , that baptism was a relation , or was made up of those ingredients . c. he replyed , that seemed strange to him , seeing all the divines , and logicians that he had read , affirmed baptism to be a relation , and it was evident , it could be put in no other predicament , ( as might be proved by induction , but that the people understood it not ) seeing the whole nature of baptism is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} in relation to another . t. he said he cared not for authorities , but bid him prove it . c. which he did thus ; every sacrament is a relation ; but baptism is a sacrament ; therefore baptism is a relation . t. he said he might deny both propositions , first the major , for any thing he knew , every sacrament was not a relation ; and the minor too , that baptism was a sacrament , for the word sacrament was an invention of man , not grounded upon scripture . c. which both propositions together were proved thus ; that which is an outward , and visible sign , of an inward , and invisible grace , is both a relation , and a sacrament ; but baptism is an outward and visible sign , of an inward , and invisible grace ; therefore it is both a relation , and a sacrament . t. he denyed the minor , that baptism was an outward , and visible sign , of an inward , and invisible grace . c. he told him , it was st. austens definition , avouched by learned men in succeeding ages , confirmed , and approved by the church of england in the old catechism . t. mr. tombs said he looked for artificiall or divine arguments , not humane testimonies , at which answer while mr. c. seemed to be astomished , he took occasion to triumph , contumeliously saying he never heard such an argument . c. to which he replyed , nor alexander ever saw such a knot , as the gordian , which made him cut it , when he could not untie it ; you teach me by experience to know that there is no disputing against them that deny all principles ; as where you think the people doe not understand , you make no scruple to deny clear truths in logick , and divinitie ; therefore i see i must goe to plain scriptures , that all the people may understand the absurdities . now that the definition of baptism ( which was the thing denyed ) belongs to infants , i prove thus . if god institute baptism for infants , christ merited it for them , and they stand need of it , then to infants belongs the definition of baptism ; but god instituted , christ meritted , and infants stand need of baptism ; therefore to infants belongs the definition of baptism . t. he denyed the minor , that god did not institute baptism for infants , christ did not merit it for them , nor infants stand in need of it . c. which he promised to prove in order , first that god did institute baptism for infants . he that appointed infants church-members under the gospell , did institute baptism for them ; but god appointed infants church-members under the gospell ; therefore god did institute baptism for infants . t. he said first the major might be questioned , because , to be church-members ( whereas he should have said church-members under the gospell ) and to be baptized , were not termini convertibiles . c. he confessed it , for infants under the law were church-members , and yet not baptized , but circumcised , and before the law church-members , and yet neither circumcised , nor baptized ; but under the gospell they were so convertible , that all that were baptized , were church-members , and all that were church-members were to be baptized , which is that which he affirmed now , and is a truth , a truth so clear , that mr. tombs confesses it all along in his books , and upon that confessed ground , mr. baxter goes in many of his arguments . t. he would have denyed it , till a gentleman told him , that he heard him affirm the same in his sermon the day before , then he denyed the minor , that god did institute infants church-members under the gospell . c. that i 'l confirm ( sayes he ) with a threefold cord , which will not easily be broken , before the law , under the law , under the gospell , which he framed into an argument thus those whom god did promise before the law , foretell under the law , actually receive into covenant under the gospell , those god did appoint church-members under the gospell ; but god did promise before the law , foretell under the law , and actually receive infants into covenant under the gospell ; therefore god did appoint infants church-members under the gospell . t. he denyed the minor , that god did not promise before the law , foretell under the law , and actually receive infants into covenant under the gospell . c. which was proved in order , first that god did promise before the law that infants should be in covenant under the gospell , thus . that which god did promise to abraham , was before the law ; but god did promise to abraham , that infants should be in covenant under the gospell ; therefore god did promise before the law , that infants should be in covenant under the gospell . the minor being denyed , he proved out of gen. 17.7 . i will establish my covenant between me , and thee , and thy seed after , thee , in their generations , for an everlasting covenant . to be a god unto thee , and unto thy seed after thee . thus framing his argument ; he that makes an everlasting covenant to abraham , and his seed after him in their generations , promised that infants should be in covenant under the gospell ; but god makes an everlasting covenant with abraham , and his seed after him in their generations ; therefore god promised that infants should be in covenant under the gospell . t. he denyed the major , saying , that everlasting signifyed onely a long time , not that it should be so under the gospell to the worlds end ; and was to be interpreted by the verse following , i will give unto thee the land of canaan for an everlasting possession , and yet the jews are now dispossessed of canaan . c. they are now dispossest , but shall be possessed of it again at their conversion , and so have an everlasting possession , in the type to the end of the world , in the antitype for ever , but that the covenant that god made with abraham is to continue to the end of the world appears in that it is a gospell covenant ; that which is a gospell covenant is to continue to the end of the world ; but the covenant that god made with abraham and his seed to all generations , is a gospell covenant , gal. 3.8 . and the scripture foreseeing that god would justifie the heathen , through faith , preached the gospell before to abraham , saying , in thee shall nations be blessed ; therefore it is to continue to the end of the world . t. without repeating , he confusedly answer'd thus , that it was an everlasting covenant , and to continue to the end of the world , but not to infants . c. he told him first that it was a denying of the conclusion , then took away his answer thus ; if god command infants to stand before him , in covenant , then it is to continue to infants ; but god commands infants to stand in covenant before him ; therefore it is to continue to infants . deut. 29.10 , 11. yee stand this day all of you before the lord , your god , your captains of your tribes , your elders , and your officers , with all the men of israel , your litle ones . t. he said that he should have proved that it should continue to infants to the worlds end , for he did not deny but that infants in some sense were in covenant under the law , but not under the gospell . c. yes under the gospell ; if christ hath obtained a more excellent ministrie , and is a mediator of a better covenant , which is established upon better promisses , then if infants were in covenant under the law , they are in covenant under the gospell ; but heb. 8.6 . christ hath obtained a more excellent ministry , was a mediator of a better covenant , which was established upon better promises ; therefore if infants were in covenant under the law , they are in covenant under the gospell . t. he denyed the consequence of the major , that tho the covenant of the gospell was a better covenant than that of the law , yet infants were not in covenant as well under the gospell , as under the law . c. which was thus taken away ; that which unchurches the one half of christendome , and leaves them no ordinary means of salvation , can not be a better covenant ; but to deny infants to be in covenant , unchurches the one half of christendome , and leaves them no ordinary means of salvation ; therefore it cannot be a better covenant . t. without repeating the syllogism , or denying either of the premisses , or formally applying any distinction , he said , the covenant under the gospell was made onely with the spirituall seed of abraham . c. which was thus disproved ; if the covenant was made in the same manner , and extent , to the gentiles , as to the jewes , then under the gospell it was not onely made to the spirituall seed ; but it was made in the same manner , and extent , to the gentiles , as it was to the jewes ; therefore under the gospell it was not onely made to the spirituall seed . t. he denyed the minor . c. which was proved by this enthymema : the partition wall is pulled down , and jewe and gentile are all one in christ-jesus ; therefore the covenant is made in the same manner , and extent , to the jew , and gentile . t. he denyed the consequent , that , tho the partition wall was taken down , and both jew and gentile are all one in christ-jesus , seeing the gospell was offered to all nations ; yet under the gospell the covenant was onely with the elect , and believers . c. which was confuted thus ; that which is made with the whole visible church , is not onely made with the elect , and true believers ; but the covenant is made with the whole visible church ; therefore not onely with the elect , and true believers . t. he denyed the major . c. which was proved thus ; that which is made to the kingdom of god upon earth , is not onely made to the elect ; but that which is made to the whole church visible is made to the kingdom of god upon earth ; therefore it was not onely made to the elect. t. he denyed the major , that , that which was made to the kingdom of god upon earth , is not onely made to the elect. c. which was proved thus ; in the kingdom of god , that is in the church militant , there are not onely elect , but reprobates , saints , but hypocrites , for all that are outwardly called , are of the kingdom of god in this sense , and many are called , but few chosen , the kingdom of god is compared to a field , where there are tares , as well as wheat ; a fould ; where there are goats as well as sheep ; to a noble mans house , where there are vessels of dishonour , as well as honour ; and if the church in regard of outward administration of ordinances ( which is the question ) were onely the elect , then it would follow that there were no visible church upon earth , the jewes had no more visible church than the heathens , the distinction of the church visible , and invisible , were frivolous , for no man , nor angell , knows who are elect , nor any but god . to which issue the first branch of the argument being brought , mr. c. referred the judgment of it to the people , and proceeded to the second , that god foretold under the law , that infants should be church-members under the gospell . t. mr. t. perceiving that the people apprehended that he was brought to an apparent absurdity , would have waded into a large discourse to wind himself out . c. but mr. c. told him , that it was his office ( being respondent ) to deny or distinguish , but not authoritatively to determine the question , as if he were the dr. of the chair ; and with much ado ( the anabaptistes crying let him have liberty to speak on ) brought him to dispute again , and to turn to esay . 49.22 . whence he framed this argument . he that foretold that he would lift up his hand to the gentiles , and set up a standard to the people , and that they should bring their sons in their armes , and their daughters shall be carryed upon their shoulders , foretold that infants should be church-members under the gospell ; but thus saith the lord god , behold i will lift up my hand to the gentiles , and set up my standard to the people , and they shall bring thy sons in their arms , and thy daughters shall be carryed upon their shoulders ; therefore god foretold that infants should be church-members under the gospell . t. he denyed the major ; and said the meaning was , that the jewes should bring the gentiles children . c. to which he replyed , god sayes i will lift up my hand to the gentiles , and they , that is the gentiles , shall bring thy sons , and mr. tombs says the jews shall bring thy sons ; then a gentleman read the words , and said it is the gentiles shall bring , &c. t. then mr. t. recollecting himself said , the meaning was , the gentiles should bring the jewes children from captivity ; and that it did not point at the time of the gospell . c. to which was replyed , the contents of the chapter sayes that it points at the time of the gospell ; mr. tombs sayes it points at the time of the jewes captivitie , whether shall we believe ? and repeated the contents : christ being sent to the jewes , complaineth of them to the 5. verse , he is sent to the gentiles to the 13. verse , gods love to his church to the end ; then the people laughed , &c. the pith of which was framed into an argument thus ; that which is the judgment of the church of england ought to be entertained before the groundles assertion of one private man ; but that it points at the time of the gospell is the judgment of the church of england ; therefore it ought to be entertained before the groundles assertion of one private man . t. he denyed that it was the judgment of the church of england . c. which was thus proved , if the church of england causes it to be printed , and commands it to be read before the chapter , then it is the judgment of the church of england ; but the church of england causes it to be printed , and commands it to be read before the chapter ; therefore it is the judgment of the church of england . t. mr. t. said it was not commanded to be printed , and read so before the chapter , for he knew not what kind of bible his was . c. he told him , it was the same with the great church bible , which was not onely authorised with a proclamation , but an act almost fifty years agoe , and will mr. tombs without giving of a reason condemn a whole nation to have slept in such an errour all that while ? then mr. abbets preacher resident there , one who hath been dipped , being in pulpit with mr. tombs , stood up and said , the words were , they shall bring thy sons in their arms ; to which mr. c. replyed , what then ? may they not be gods sons by adoption , and their own by naturall generation ? mr. tombs fell upon expounding the chapter from verse to verse . mr. c. told him , that they came not to hear him expound , but dispute , and repeating the last argument , wished him to answer ; at which abbets stood up again , and said the words of the text were , that they , that is , the gentiles , shall bring thy children , that is the jewes . to which mr. c. replyed , that was an addition to the text , for there is no mention of the jewes ; but grant it were , must it be therefore meant of the captivitie ? the 20. and 21. verses of this chapter confutes it , intimating that the jewes after christs comming shall lose their own naturall , and the gentiles children shall be adopted , and engrafted into their place ; they , that is the gentiles converted , shall bring thy sons , thine by a kind of adoption , and spirituall succession , for the gentiles children were ingrafted into the stock of the jewes children broke off ; and this is so clear from the context ( compared with rom. 11. ) that with reason it could not be denyed ; but he was to speak to mr. tombs who understood the nature of a dispute , and not to him , and if he would take upon him to moderat , it was fit that he should have another . t. mr. tombs asked mr. c. what he understood by standart , what by kings , what by nursing fathers , &c. c. he told him , that it was not his place to dispute socratically by asking of questions , but to answer ad appositum . but to give him satisfaction ( which he needed not ) by standart he understood some visible gospell ordinance , as baptism ; by kings supream magistrats , by nursing fathers , and nursing mothers , patrons , and protectours of the gospell . t. he said that it was a metaphoricall speech , and that nothing could be gathered from it . c. he replyed , that he would grant him that it was more than a metaphoricall speech , ( for a metaphor consisted but in one single trope ) but it was a continuation of severall tropes , and therefore allegoricall ; yet it does not follow , that nothing could be gathered from it , for then nothing could be gathered from any parable in the gospell ; nay nor any part of the new testament ; for there is scarce a sentence without some tropes in it . t. mr. t. said it was fulfilled in hesters time , which was a nursing mother to the jews : c. to which was answered ; hester was a jew , and a friend to the jews , what is this to the gentiles bringing children upon shoulders ? and tho that should be waved , and hester granted to be a nursing mother in the type , yet in the antitype it aymes principally at the times of the gospell , else grosse absurdities would follow ; for what kings , or queens in hesters-time did bow down to the jews with their face towards the earth , and lick up the dust of their feet ? verse 23. iles are summoned in the first verse , which must be meant of the time of the gospell : christ is promised to be given for a light for the gentiles , that he may be their salvation to the end of the earth . 6. kings shall see , and arise , princes also shall worships . 7. and the holy ghost , quotes verbatim , and applyes to the time of the gospell the 8. verse , and that expressely 2. cor. 6.2 . there is an implyed cutting off to the jews , 20. an ingrafting in of the gentiles , the children of the wild olive into the stock of the naturall olive , 21. and a bringing of children to visible ordinances , 22. all which he offered to frame into arguments . t. but mr. t. prevented it , saying , that though it should be understood of the times of the gospell , yet by sons in armes , and daughters upon shoulders , was meant grown men , for any thing he knew , and men women and of a hundred years of age might be carryed upon armes , and upon shoulders . which indeed is the same answer mr. t. gives in his scepticall exercitation ; ( like foxes , and badgers being beat out of one hole , hath another to fly unto : ) where ( as mr. hussey quotes him ) he uses the same words , that mr. abbets , and he found fault with in mr. c. major proposition , for these are his words , it is foretold that gentiles should bring their children in their armes , therefore the prophet foresaw the baptism of infants ; he might have seen the beam in his own eye , turpe est doctori , &c. but to return to mr. t. answer . c. which mr. c. took thus away ; them that they should bring in their bosomes were infants ; but it was foretold that they should bring them in their bosomes ; therefore they were infants . t. he enquired where it did appear that they should bring them in their bosomes . c. out of the text , for the word in the originall ( which is translated armes ) is bosome , and so the septuagints read it {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , intimating that they should bring sucking children hanging upon their breasts . t. then mr. tombs said it was an analogie , and performed when the gentiles perswaded their children to embrace christ . c. well then , it is their children , not thy children , oportet esse memorem ; but not that neither ; for that scripture which in the letter suites with many other scriptures , but in the pretended analogie with no other , can not be the meaning ; but to interpret it literally of bringing children to christ in the bosome , suites with many scriptures , and to perswade them to come to christ , with no scriptures ; therefore it can not be the meaning . t. mr. t. could not name one text of scripture , where to bring in armes , or bosome , was to perswade to come to christ . c. so mr. c. referred the judgment of it to the people , and named another text , es. 65.20 . there shall be no more thence an infant of dayes , &c. but the child shall die an hundred year old . t. mr. tombs bid him read the rest of the words , and the verse following . c. he said he had read as much as he intended to rayse his argument from . t. take notice ( sayes he ) he will not read that which makes against him . c. not so ; for nothing of it makes against me , but that an argument must be terminus simplex , and homogeneal , and that you know well inough , but that in place of solid satisfaction you must say something to deceive the people . the arguments i raise hence are two , the first is this , there shall be no more an infant of dayes , that is , infants shall not be uncapable of the seal , while their age is measured by dayes , as the jews infants that might not be circumcised till a week had passed over them ; therefore infants new born are capable of the seal ; the secund argument is this , the child shall dye an hundred year old , that is , as an hundred year old , or as well a church-member as if he were a hundred year old ; therefore children may be baptized under the gospell : t. mr: t. found fault with that interpretation , shall dye an hundred years old , that is as if an hundred years old . c. he answered , to take it literally would imply a contradiction , for it was impossible to be a child , and a hundred years old , and was better than his , and the anabaptistes exposition of 1 cor. 10.2 . they were baptized under the cloud , that is ( say you ) as if they were baptized under the cloud , when nothing hindred , but they were really baptized under the cloud . and rom. 11.19 . the branches were broken off ▪ that is ( say you ) as if they were broken off , when it was both possible , and apparent , that they were broken off . t. then mr. t. said it was not meant of the times of the gospell . c. to which was replyed ; mr. t. will still be wiser than the church of england ; and read the contents of the chapter ; the calling of the gentiles v. 1. the jews rejected 17. the blessed state of the new jerusalem to the end . t. mr: t. said it was verifyed zacha : 8.4 . thus saith the lord of hosts , there shall yet old men , and old women dwell in the streets of jerusalem , and every man with his staff in his hand for very age , and the streets of the citie shall be full of boyes , and girles playing in the streets thereof . c. to which was replyed ; what is this to an infant of dayes , or a child dying a hundred years old ? when it is apparent both from the contents , & text , that this of zachary is meant of the jews return from captivity , & more apparent that that of es. is meant of the state of christs kingdome under the gospell which i prove thus ; that interpretation that brings with it ▪ absurditie , untruth , blasphemie , is not to be admitted ; but to interpret it of the jews return from captivitie brings with it absurditie , untruth , blasphemie ; therefore it is not to be admitted . t. mr. tombs denyed the minor . c. which was proved in order ; first that it brought with it absurdity , to apply the 25. verse to the return from captivity was absurd , that the wolf and the lamb should feed together , and the lion should eat straw with the bullock , and dust should be the serpents meat ; therefore it brought with it absurdity . secondly that it brought with it untruth ; but to apply the 19. v. to the return from captivity brought with it an untruth , that the voice of weeping should be no more heard in jerusalem ; for it was twice destroyed after , once by antiochus , then by vespatian , and titus ; therefore it brought with it an untruth . thirdly that it brought with it blasphemie ; for to interpret the 17. verse , ( behold i create new heavens , and new earth , and the former shall no more be remembred , and come into mind ) of the second temple , is blasphemous ; therefore it brought with it blasphemie , for it crosseth st. peters interpretation 2. pet. 3.13 . wee according to his promise look for new heavens , and a new earth ; for can any rationall man think , that the new temple built at jerusalem in cyrus his time , was this new heaven , and new earth , that the former should be no more remembred ? when the antient men are said to weep , because the glory of the latter temple was short of the glory of the first , ezra . 3.12 . [ it was inferiour to solomons temple , first in respect of the building , that was lower , and meaner ; secondly , in respect of the vessels , before of gold , now of brasse ; thirdly , of five things that were lost , first the ark of god , secondly , the urim & thummim , thirdty , fire from heaven to consume the sacrifices , fourthly , the glory of god between the cherubims , fiftly , the gift of prophesie , for after the second temple there was no prophet . ] t. mr. t. fell to his wonted course of impertinent exposition , wherein mr. c. told him he violated the rules of dispute , and did lasciviously wanton it out into a wilderness of words , that the truth might be obscured or lost , and like a lapwing carry the hearers far from the matter . then c. p. an apothecary began to interpose , as he had done once before , till a gentleman of authoritie , told him , that it was not fit for a man of his place , and calling , to speak ; yet mr. tombs would not be satisfyed , but went on saying that dr. prideaux in oxford , when a place of scripture was cited , was wont to give a large exposition . c. mr. c. replyed ; that dr. prideaux was doctor of the chair , and judge of the controversie , and might do that which a respondent may not do , whose office is onely to repeat , deny , distinguish , and when a text is quoted , to give a brief exposition , that the opponent may have something to fasten upon ; and what dr. prideaux did , he knew not ; but what dr. collins , and dr. ward did , he could tell him ; but that it was not to the present purpose . and that his judgment in this , was but the same with his own university of oxford , as he knew of late by a sad experiment . t. mr. tombes asked what that was ? c. he told him an explosion , not for disability ( for his dispute was plausible inough ) but that he would neither be satisfied with d. salvage his answer , nor the doctor of the chaires determination ; but fell to repetitions , and extravagances , as now . mr. tombes launched into a tedious discourse to vindicate himself , till he had tyred the auditors , who cryed out this is but to waste time ; and a learned gentleman spake aloud , this is but to spend the time in parling , that he may avoid the gun-shot , for he is affraid the great thunderbolt is behind : and so with much adoe , he was brought to dispute again , where mr. c. falling upon the third branch of his argument , that god did actually receive infants to be church-members under the gospell , began thus . c. those whom christ commanded his disciples to baptize , they may be baptized ; but christ commanded his disciples to baptize infants ; therefore they may be baptized . the minor being denyed , was proved thus ; he that commanded his disciples to baptize all nations , commanded them to baptize infants ; but christ commanded his disciples ; matth. 28.19 . to baptize all nations ; therefore christ commanded them to baptize infants . t. mr. t. denyed the major . c. which was proved by this enthymema ; the whole includes every part ; infants are a part of nations ; therfore he that commanded to baptize all nations , commanded to baptize infants . t. he denyed the consequent , though the whole included every part , and nations were the whole , and infants were a part of nations , yet it did not follow that infants were to be baptized . c. he returned , that , that saying of aquinas ( posito toto generali , pars ejus negari non potest , a generall whole being granted , no part of it can be denyed ) was an axiome both in logick , philosophie , and divinity , as psalm 117.1 . prayse the lord all yee nations , is interpreted by another psalm , old men , and babes , young men , and maidens , prayse yee the lord . t. mr. t. said it was an axiome that the whole includes every part , where there is no exception , but here is an exception . c. he replyed , saint ambrose upon the place sayes there is no exception , qui dixit omnes , nullos exclusit , neque parvulos , &c. he that said baptize all nations , excepted none , no not infants . t. mr. t. pished at it , sleighting ambrose his authority . c. then said mr. c. whether we shall obey ambrose bishop of millain with scripture , or mr. tombes vicar of lemster against scripture , judge you . but that there is no exception thus i prove , if infants be excepted from baptism , it is either because they are not named in the text , or because we find no instance that any were baptized , or because they are not capable ; but for none of these three ; therefore infants are not excepted . t. mr. t. denyed the major , and said that a fourth reason might be given , because they were not disciples , c. he told him that in this answer he shewed himself to be no good logician ; for it is an axiome , that in no division , one member can be affirmed of another , because they are opposite , now to be disciples , and capable of baptism were not opposite but subordinate ; and to be disciples , if it made them not capable , it was no exception at all , if it made them capable , it was the same with the third , to which dilemma when he could receive no answer , he demanded where it was required that those that are to be baptized , must be disciples ? t. he said out of the text , for that which is translated teach all nations , is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} make disciples of all nations . c. he replyed ; at ross you found fault with me for that translation , asking me , was i wiser than the translators ? and now when it seemes to make for you , you urge it . quo teneam vultus mutantem protea nodo ? i confess it is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , in the aorist , ye shall make disciples , for it must be interpreted by the future , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , baptizing , or by baptizing in the present tense ; as if discipling were the end , and baptizing the means , and required no qualification before ( as learned men with great probability press ) but i will not insist upon that now , but that which you denyed , i prove , that infants may be disciples , from [ that place rom. 15.10 . compared with the 5. verse , for so mr. c. said , mistaking it for ] acts 15.10 . t. at which mr. tombes insulted , saying he was a good text-man . c. he replyed , he was in hast , and did not think of this before , but that his answer did drive him to it , and he in his elaborate books did oftentimes quote one place for another , then how much more might he , that was extemporall , it had been enough to have said , as our saviour to the tempter , it s written : but to leave these catches , and come to the proof . they upon whom the pharasies would have layd the yoak , were disciples , verse 10. why tempt ye god , to put a yoak upon the neck of the disciples ; but many of them were infants ; therefore infants are disciples . t. he denyed the minor , that many of them were not infants . c. which was proved thus ; the yoak was circumcision verse 5. the pharasies saying , that it was needfull to circumcise them ; but they upon whom the yoak was to be imposed by circumcision , were only infants amongst the jews , and infants together with parents amongst the gentiles ; therefore many of them were infants . t. he denyed the major , and said the yoak was not circumcision . c. he replyed it was apparent , by comparing the 5. and 10. with the foregoing verses . 1. verse certain men came down from judea , and taught the brethren , except ye be circumcised , after the manner of moses , ye cannot be saved ; where observe that circumcision is the subject of the question . in the 2. verse they determined that paul , and barnabas , and certain others of them , should go up to jerusalem unto the apostles , and elders , about this question , to wit circumcision . in the 5. certain of the sect of the pharasies said , that it was needfull to circumcise them . in the 6. the apostles came together to consider of the matter , that is circumcision , and when there had been much disputing , peter rose up in the 7. and determined the question in the tenth verse , why tempt ye god to put a yoak upon the neck of the disciples ? t. mr. t. said , that circumcision could not be the yoak , that neither they nor their fathers could bear . c. he returned , that it was a bloody , and a heavy yoak , therefore the israelites had a dispensation for 40. years in the wilderness ; moses neglected the circumcision of his child probably for this cause ; and his wife ( when the child was circumcised ) called him a bloody husband . the sichemites were slain , as unable to defend themselves , while they were sore of the wound of circumcision . t. mr. t. said , that the doctrine of moses was the yoak of which infants were not capable . c. he replyed ; that circumcision was principally meant , and the doctrine of moses onely as an appendix of it , and children were as capable of the doctrine then , as they were in abraham , and moses his time , when all in the moment of circumcision were tyed to the observation of the doctrine , tho they of ripe years ( to use vossius his distinction ) were taught the doctrine antecedenter , before circumcision , infants of eight days consequenter , after circumcision , when age made them capable ; i know ( sayes god ) abraham will teach his children ; so it is apparent all those upon whom circumcision with the doctrine of moses was to be imposed , were called disciples ; but some of these were infants , for onely infants were circumcised among the jews , and infants with the parents among the gentils ; therefore some infants are disciples . mr. t. without any distinct answer would have broke through the pales to rove abroad again . c. but he pressed him to keep within the lists , urging this argument . they to whom is the promise , they may be baptized , it s the apostles own inference , acts 2.28 . be baptized , for the promise is to you ; but to infants of believing parents is the promise , the promise is to you , and your children ; therefore infants may be baptized . t. he denyed the minor , that to infants of believing parents is the promise . c. he told him , it was the words of the text , the promise is to you , and your children . t. then mr. t. said they were not believers yet . c. mr. c. replyed , they were believers in fieri , tho perhaps not in facto . t. that 's latine ( sayes mr. t. ) what do you understand by it ? c. he said , i mean this , they were believers by outward assent , and disposition , sufficient to make them members visible ; but perhaps not believers by inward assent , and habit , to justify them . for i know you will not say that none are to be baptized but they that have a saving faith , which none but god is able to discern . ministers must act according to rule , which in adultis , is outward profession , or a willingness to receive the ordinance , and that they were thus qualified ( which is sufficient ) it is apparent . t. mr. t. denyed that they were sufficiently qualified . c. which was proved thus ; they whom the apostle commanded to be baptized , were sufficiently qualified ; but the apostle commanded them to be baptized ; therefore they were sufficiently qualified . t. then mr. t. without repeating the syllogism , or applying any distinction , inquired where the apostle commanded them to be baptized . c. he told him verse 38. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , be baptized every one of your . t. yes ( sayes mr. t. ) upon condition of repentance , repent and be baptized . c. that is a condition of your own making , and an adding to the word of god , for where dos the scripture , either expresly , or implyedly say , that repentance is a condition of baptism ? if it be meant of compleat repentance , true it is , it was their duty both to repent , and to be baptized , to repent in relation to crucifying of christ , to be baptized in relation to judaism , which they were to put off , and christianity which they were to put on ; but that they must have compleat repentance before baptism , it is not so much as hinted at . and if you mean incompleat repentance ( which is indeed all that is required ) they had that already , for they were pricked in conscience , saying , men , and brethren what shall we do ? t. mr. t. said that was not all that was required , nor was it a sufficient qualification for baptism . c. against which answer was concluded thus ; that upon which the apostles baptized three thousand the same day , was a sufficient qualification ; but the apostles upon that baptized 3000. the same day ; therefore it was a sufficient qualification . t. he denyed the minor , and gave his reason from the 40. and 41. verses , and with many other words did he testify , and exhort , saying , save your selves from this untoward generation , then they that gladly received the word were baptized , c. it was replyed , that this was but a recapitulation , or reciting of the heads of peters sermon that he preached to them , before they were pricked in conscience , or were exhorted to be baptized , and no new act ; which was a thing usual in scripture , as gen. 1. god having expressed the creation of man , and gods blessing of him , and all creatures to him , by a {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} recites the manner of his creation in the second chapter . but howsoever it made nothing against him , for whether it be taken thetically without any condition , or hypothetically upon condition of repentance , the children were to be baptized together with the parents , the promise is to you and your children , and that was all that he contended for ; from whence ariseth this argument , to whom the promise of grace belongs , to them baptism belongs also ; but the promise of grace belongs to believers and their children ; therefore baptism belongs to both . t. mr. t. said , the promise of grace belonged to believers , and their children , when their children actually believed , and not before . c. he replyed , there were two arguments in the text to overthrow that : the first might be drawn from the indicative predication in the present tense , the promise is to you , and your children , is , for the present , as well to your children , as to you . the second , from the opposition betwixt you and your children , and them that are afar off . they , and their children , which are , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , near ( as the greek scholiast , and the syrian interpreter saies ) are opposed to them that are {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , afar off . the jews were near , and in covenant , for to them is the promise in the present tense , but the gentiles were afar off , rom. 2.15 . ye who sometimes were afar off , are made nigh by the blood of christ , therefore it is expressed in the future tense , as many as god shall call ; so that to the jews being called , their children were in covenant with them ; when the gentiles shall be called , their children shall be in covenant with them . t. mr. t. said , he granted that children were in covenant , and might be baptized c. well then observe , good people , the dispute is at an end , he grants that children are in covenant , and may be baptized . t. yes , but by those children are not meant infants , but grown men . c. he replyed , there are many circumstances in the text overthrows that ; first , the word is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , which comes from {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , to bring forth , given sometimes to children in the womb , for the most part to them that are newly born , or young . t. mr. t. said , it was also given to men of ripe age . c. yes sometimes , by a figurative speech , ( as that of julius caesar to brutus in plutarch ) {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , and thou my child . and well might he call him his child , for he had adopted him the night before ; but properly it signifies a young child , and so it ought to be taken here , unless some convincing reason can be given to the contrary , according to that rule , omne analogum per se positum , stat pro famosiore significato . mr. t. gave no answer , but with a jeering eccho repeated the last words , pro famosiore significato . the second circumstance in the text , is the substantive verb {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , is , the promise is to you , and your children , not is to you , and shall be to your children ; now what children had they at this present , but young children ? unless mr. t. will imagine that they were all old men and women that were present , and their younger men and women were absent . the third circumstance in the text is the finis cui , the end to whom the promise is , to you , and your children ; the jews children under the law were in covenant with their parents , the charter is confirm'd under the gospel to them and their children . the jews when they crucified christ , called for a curse upon themselves , and upon their children , here the apostle gives them a remedy as large as the disease , the promise ( that is , of freedome from the curse ) is to you and your children . t. mr. t. still kept his conclusion in despight of the premisses , that it was to their children when they actually believed , and not before . c. yes , and before they actually believe , which i prove thus : the blessing is as large as the curse ; but the curse extended even to children , before they could actually believe ( his blood be upon us and upon our children ) therefore the blessing . t. mr. t. answered to the major thus : if by blessing was meant the inward and spiritual part of the covenant , it might be true ; but that was nothing to the present purpose , seeing it was not known to us : but if the outward , and visible part , he denied that infants were capable of the blessing , as well as liable to the curse . c. which distinction was took away thus : they that are holy with a covenant-holiness are capable of the outward and visible part ; but infants of believers are holy with a covenant-holiness ; therefore they are capable of the outward and visible part . t. mr. t. denied the minor , and said that covenant-holiness was gibberidge , which they that spoke did not understand themselves . c. mr. c. replyed , it was the language of learned men of all ages , amongst whom were vossius , bullinger , and hugo grotius ; and that children of believing parents were holy before baptism , and that baptism did not make , but declare them to be christians . then cryed out a cobler , [ i. e. ] ( that hath been dipped ) this is blasphemy . c. well , you discover of what spirit you are , and your ignorance ; are not these the words of the learned assembly of divines in the directory confirmed by ordinance of parliament ? that infants are christians , and federally holy before baptism , and therefore are they baptized [ pag 12. ] and that infants of believing parents are thus holy , with a federall , or covenant-holiness , i thus prove from , 1 cor. 7.14 . els were your children unclean , but now they are holy . t. that sayes mr. t. is meant of matrimoniall holynes , or a lawfull use of the marriage-bed , that they are no bastards . c. that answer i thus infringe . that which in scripture is taken almost six hundred times in a distinct sense , and not so much as once for matrimoniall holiness , cannot be so meant here ; but it is taken in scripture almost six hundred times in a distinct sense , and not once for matrimoniall holyness ; therefore it cannot be so meant here . t. that argument ( sayes mr t. ) i will retort upon you , that which in scripture is taken six hundred times in a distinct sense , and never once for covenant-holiness cannot be meant here ; but it is taken six hundred times in a distinct sense , and never once for covenant holiness ; therfore it cannot be meant here . c. to which was replyed , this is to invert the order of the dispute , you are to answer , and not to oppose . t. i may oppose by retorting of an argument , and i will answer anon . c. well , to satisfie you , i deny your minor , for it s taken oft in scripture for covenant-holiness . t. where ? c. the proof lyes upon you , that it is not , yet i le give give you one instance , or two , rom. 11.16 . if the first fruits be holy , the lump is also holy , and if the root be holy , so are the branches . t. that is not meant of a covenant-holyness . c. yes , it s as cleer as the light , and so you your self interpreted it at ross , as there are hundreds that will witness , which was upon this occasion . i pressed that if the immediat parents were holy , the children were holy with a covenant-holiness ; you denyed the inference , and said the meaning of it was , that abraham the father of the faithfull was the first fruits , and root that was holy , and therefore his posterity was holy , and in covenant [ and in this exposition , as he agreed with truth , so with beza , who sayes that children are holy , that is comprehended in covenant from the wombe , and with bowles who saith , that they are holy with outward holiness , by which they are judged to be in covenant ] but to return from whence , by your retortion , we have digressed . i am to prove that holyness is never taken in scripture for matrimoniall cleanness in opposition to illegitimation . not in that place ezra 9.2 . the holy seed have mingled themselves with the seed of those lands ; which is either your only , or principall hold , ( as far as i can gather out of your books ) therefore in no place . t. he denyed the antecedent . c. which was proved thus . if it be meant of matrimoniall cleanness , then this must be the meaning of the words ; the holy seed , that is the lawfully begotten jews , have mingled themselves with the seed of those lands , that is the bastards of those lands ; but that cannot be the meaning , for happily there were some bastards among the jewes , and in that sense not holy , and no bastards among the nations , but all , or the most legitimate , and therefore in that sense not unholy ; therefore it is not meant of matrimoniall holiness . t. he denyed the major , affirming that both jews , and nations , were holy before their mixture , but then , both they , and their children became unclean , because god had forbidden them to marry with the nations . c. to which was answered , they that are saints are not unholy ; but some saints have been begot by this mixture , or unlawfull bed , as jepthah , who hebr. 11. is said to be justified by faith ; therefore they are not unholy . t. he denyed the major , saying , they may be unholy by their naturall generation , and first birth , and yet holy by regeneration , and new birth . c. this strikes not home ; moses had children by his ethiopian woman , but they were not illegitimate ; therefore those that were begot by mixture with the nations were not illegitimate . t. mr. t. said , that was before the law was given . c. well , that answer will do you little service ; after the law was given , salomon had children by rahab , who was a cananitish , and boaz by ruth , who was a moabitish woman ; and yet they were not illegitimate , or unholy , as you would have it . t. they became proselites , and received the religion of the jews . c. well then , while they were not of the jews religion , tho no bastards , they were unholy , when they embraced the jews religion , ( by your own confession ) they became holy ; what is this but a covenant-holyness which you have opposed all this while , and now grant it ? t. mr. t. used many words to clear himself , but with little satisfaction to the greatest part of the hearers , and still denied that children were holy , and in covenant . c. which was further proved thus , they that christ took up in his arms , blessed , said , the kingdom of god belonged unto them , pronounced a curse upon those that despised , and would not receive , are holy with a covenant-holyness ; but christ took up little children into his arms , blessed them , sayd , the kingdom of god belonged unto them , pronounced a curse upon those that despised , and would not receive them ; therefore little children are holy with a covenant-holiness . t. mr. tombes began to be netled , as if something in this argument galled him , saying it was a fallacie , and that he went about to entrap him by sophistrie . c. what fallacie ? t. a heaping of many things together that belong to severall matters . c. i confess they were spoken upon severall occasions , but they all concenter in my conclusion , that children are holy , and in covenant ; i am in hast , and named them all together , but if you will have patience , i le prosecute them severally . t. i am willing to continue till midnight , but i like not this kind of arguing . c. you like it not , because it does jugulum petere , cut the throat of your tenet . t. no not so much as touch the skin of it , sayes he . c. well i beseech you in the spirit of meekness to answer . t. it is a fallacie of heaping many particulars together . c. i confess there is a fallacie they call {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . t. take notice , he confesses it is a fallacie . c. no such thing , for {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} is an asking of many questions , which is your usuall fallacie , socratically to ask , when you should solidly answer , but in my syllogism there is not so much as one question . t. it is a copulative proposition sayes mr. tombes , and if one member of it be false , the whole is false . c. it is not an explicit copulative proposition ( sayes mr. c. ) neither is any member of it false , ( for every branch of it is scripture , ) instance in any of the particulars that you think m●kes the least for me , and i le begin with that ; then he mentioned matth. 18.2 . which words being read , from thence he raysed this argument . they to whom belongs the kingdom of heaven , are holy , and in covenant ; but to little children belongs the kingdom of heaven ; therefore little children are holy , and in covenant . t. those little children were not infants . c. they are called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} of {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , because they could scarce speak . t. what are these called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ? c. if not here , elsewhere , and of other evangelists , and here they are called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , by the diminutive , which the great master of the greek hippocrates interprets , to signifie a child under seven years of age , and therefore not capable of actuall faith , when the apostles themselves were yet ignorant about fundamentalls . t. they were converted verse 3. except ye be converted , and become as little children , &c. c. the meaning is not that the little children are converted , but it hath relation to the disciples in the first verse , who must be converted from their actuall sins , and become as little children which have no actuall sin . t. o how unhappy are the people that are seduced with these toyes , are you not ashamed ? c. i see you have learned of that man in lucian to cry out {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , and to vilifie that argument you cannot answer , and besides that , i see nothing that is shame-worthy . he hath answered nothing at all ( sayes one under the pulpit ) but shifts and denyes all . t. thou art an impudent , brazen-faced fellow , whosoever thou art , i have answered all , confuted all my adversaries books , and amongst them one of my greatest antagonists , i have turned mr. richard baxter the most of his arguments against himself . c. sir , let that worthy man alone who is absent , you are now to answer me . t. here is nothing to answer , is it not in the sixt verse , who so shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me ? were they not believers ? c. yes , the disciples were believers , which are here meant , and not the children ; which the grammaticall construction will tell you , for it is in the masculin gender , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , one of these little ones , meaning {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} disciple , not in the neuter gender to answer to {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , little child ; so that my argument remains unanswered . t. i am weary of this pedantrie , and looking upon his watch , said , i promised but one houre , and it s above foure houres ; with that he clapped his book together . [ t. j. ] good mr. tombes ( says an anabaptist ) continue a little longer for satisfaction of the people ; he gave no answer , but put on his hat . c. well , sir , i will not press you any further now , i should have urged john 3.5 . rom. 11. and other places , to prove infants church-membership , and have come to the second and third branches of mine argument , that christ merited it for them , and infants stand in need of baptism ; but those i must leave to another opportunitie ; therefore i desire that we may have a set day about a month hence , seeing i was hurryed to this extemporall discourse through importunitie . t. no , i will have no more dealing with you , unless it be by writing , that what both of us shall set down , may be read in the publick congregation . mark . 16.15 , 16. 15. and he said unto them , go ye into all the world , & preach the gospel to every creature . 16. he that beleeveth , and is baptized , shall be saved , but he that beleeveth not , shall be damned . these two verses hold out the rich charter of the gospel , which our saviour delivered to the apostles after his resurrection ; the parts are two , first a precept , in the former verse , go ye into all the world , and preach the gospel to every creature ; secondly a promise , with a commination in the latter , he that beleeveth , and is baptized , shall be saved ; but he that beleeveth not , shall be damned . in the precept , we have two particulars , first a mission , he sends them , go ye into all the world ; secondly a commission , he authorizes them , and preach the gospel to every creature . in the latter verse , or promise , we have first the thing promised , layd down affirmatively , shall be saved ; secondly the qualification , and that either absolute , he that beleveth , or conditional , and is baptized ; he that beleeveth , and is baptized , shall be saved ; or a commination shall be damned , with a qualification negative , and absolutely without any limitation , he that beleeveth not , he that beleeveth not shall be damned . wee l only hint at the former verse for introduction to the latter . and he said , ( that is christ , ) observe , that it is only god , christ god and man , that can give mission , or commission to preach , and ordain sacraments . math. 28.18 . all power is given me in heaven and earth , go ye therefore , and teach all nations . go ye into all the world , there is the largeness of their commission , to all the world , as he , to all nations as matthew . hence observe , the apostles , and by them the evangelists , had an extraordinary commission which extended through the world , but our commission ordinarily is limited to certain places ; true it is , there may be itinerants upon special occasions , ( and they also confined within their verges , ) but as doctor buckeridge observes well when christ speaks to apostles , he says , go ye into all the world , but when to ordinary pastors , and teachers {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} he fixed some to be pastors , and some teachers . and preach the gospel to every creature , there is the commission , wherein we have first the act preach , that is proclame , secondly the object of the gospel , which in the original , and other languages signifies good news , or a good speech ; from the connexion between the mission and commission comming from the same authour christ , and extended to the same persons , the apostles , and their successours , observe , that none may preach as church officers , but they that are sent in a gospel way ; our adversary in the common cause spoke so home to this , that we need not press it further . the last thing is the extent of the commission , and that a very large one , unto every creature , as here , to all nations , as matthew . now the quaere will be , what is meant by every creature ? some limit it to every rational creature , angels , men , devils , as origen , & his misericordes doctores who held the devils and reprobates should be saved ; but that cannot be ; for 2. pet. 2.4 . they are cast down to hell , and reserved to judgement . some more strictly restrain it only to man , and that when he is come to age , and understanding , excluding children ; this is too strict , true it is , infants are not capable to be taught of men , but they may be taught of god ; they cannot actually understand the gospel , but they may actually receive the benefit of the gospel ; a noble mans child hath interest in his fathers patent , and pardon ; a sucking infant ( though he knows it not ) may be joined in a lease with the parents . some extend it , and it is conceived more fitly according to the letter , without any synecdoche , or figure , to every creature , as if he should say , go and proclame the benefit that comes by christ to every creature ; for as by the first adam all creatures were accursed , so by christ the second adam , all creatures shall be blessed , rom. 8.22 . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} every creature groans , desiring to be delivered into the glorious liberty of the sons of god , answerable to this , preach the gospel {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} to every creature , telling them , that they are now by christ to be delivered into the glorious liberty of the sons of god . object . but the creature cannot hear , nor understand . answ. it s true not properly , no more could john baptist in his mothers womb , and yet {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} the babe sprang for joy ; nay the holy ghost ascribes a hearing to the creature , hosea 2.21 . and it shall come to pass in that day saith the lord , i will hear the heavens , and they shall hear the earth , and the earth shall hear the corn , and the wine , and the oyl , and they shall hear jezreel . hence observe , that every creature in a sense is sensible of the benefit they have by christ ; but every one in their kind , men come to years , and discretion , are capable of actual understanding , actual profession , actual faith ; infants only in actu primo , are capable of the first seeds of understanding , of profession of faith , which will shew it self in the fruits when they come to years ; the rest of our fellow creatures as by a natural instinct they groan for the curse , so by an other instinct , they lift up their heads in expectation of the blessing , and that {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , with an earnest expectation , or a stretched out neck as the word in the original signifies , rom. 819. thus we have paraphrased upon the first verse for introduction to the second , wherein is first , a consolatory promise , he that beleeveth , and is baptized , shall be saved ; secondly a comminatorie curse , he that beleeveth not , shall be damned . in the former , we have first the qualification , and that either absolute , he that beleeveth , or conditional , and is baptized . q. now the quaere will be , what belief is here meant ? sol. first the event tells us , that belief that saves us , he that believes shall be saved . secondly the opposition , its contrary to that unbelief that damns ; observe that a saving faith is necessary to salvation , without faith it is impossible to please god , all they , and only they that have a saving faith shall be saved ; so that you see that faith is a necessary , and absolute condition . and is baptized , that is upon supposition , if baptism conveniently may be had ; hence observe , that baptism is not absolutely necessary by necessity of means ( as they call it ) as if none could be saved without it , but by necessity of precept , if conveniently it may be had . the israelites for forty years in the wilderness were not circumcised . bernard , that saw not all things could see this , that , non absentia sed contemplus sacramenti damnat , not the want , but the contempt of the sacrament damns : valentinian the emperour dyed , as he was going to be baptized in jordan , and ambrose being asked what he thought of him , answered , that he was baptizatus volo , & voluntate , etiamsi non reverà aquae lavacro , baptized inwardly with wish , and will , though not outwardly with the laver of water , austin is conceived here to be mistaken , who denyed salvation to infants un-baptized , hence he is called durus pater infantum , a hard father of infants ; and many of the doctors of the church of rome , who hold that infants that dye un-baptized , are kept in limbo infantum in a purgatory of infants , where they shall never behold the beatifical vision . object . but here is first placed beleeving , and then baptized , so that from the order of placing the words , some would gather that we are first to beleeve before we be baptized . answ. that will not follow ; for mark 1.4 . there is placed first baptizing , and then preaching , and repentance after , whence they might as well gather that we must be baptized , before we can hear the word preached , or repent ; repentance in scripture is oft placed before faith , and yet is a fruit , and effect of faith ; some of the evangelists place judas his receiving of the sop before the sacrament , some after it ; it is a rule in interpreting of holy writ , that scriptura nescit prius , & posterius , the scripture does not alwaies observe the precise order in which things were done . q. but i beseech you consider what faith it is that is here meant ? sol. a saving faith ; must then a saving faith be the rule of our baptism ? and must we baptize none , but of those we know have a saving faith ; then we must baptize none at all ; never any minister upon that ground had ever commission to baptize any , no not the apostles , for they did not infallibly know that those they baptized had a saving faith ; nay they actually baptized many that were hypocrites , as simon magus , alexander , hymeneus , philetus , and others ; hence observe , that no rule for baptizing in general can be gathered out of this text , and to say that none are to be baptized , but they that have a saving faith , which is the faith that is only here meant , or none but they which make an outward profession of faith ( which is not here meant ) is an untruth not gatherable from this scripture , and an adding to the word of god , against which he hath proclamed a solemn curse . the commination , or curse follows in the last words , he that beleeveth not , shall be damned ; he does not say , he that is not baptized shall be damned . for though the contempt of it is dangerous , yet a man may be saved without baptism ; he does not say that he that is not dipped over head is damned , that is a thing indifferent , any washing in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost , is baptism ; he does not say , that he that is not re-baptized , or baptized again , is damned , for that is the invention of man , never heard of ( in that sense ) before john of leydens time , who confessed at his execution , that he had that , and the rest of his poysoned doctrine from satan . hence observe , that all unbelievers , though baptised , shall be damned ; men beleeving though ( through invincible necessity ) un-baptized , shall be saved ; thus we have given you the lively meaning of the holy ghost in the text . having layd this foundation , wee 'l make further inquirie into two things which are in controversie , first what is meant by baptism , or baptizing , secondly whether infants ought to be baptized , or no . first , baptism in the original , signifies nothing but a washing , as pareus upon the hebrews says , baptismus graecis est quaevis ablutio , baptism is in greek any washing , whether by dipping , or sprinkling , to baptize is to dip , or sprinkle says , ravenel ; so says the churches old catechism dipped , or sprinkled in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost ; so the directory , baptize the child , by powring , or sprinkling of the water on the face of the child , without adding any further ceremony . and as many kinds there are of washing , so many there are of baptizing , whereof the pillars of the greek tongue , hesichius , budeus , stephanus , scapula , arius montanus , pasor , mention four ; first tingere , to die , or tincture , secondly mergere , to drown , or plunge , thirdly madefacere , to wet , or moysten , and lastly abluere , to wash , or clense . i confess there are some that distinguish betwixt {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} to rantise ( as they call it ) or sprinkle , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} which is to plunge to the bottom , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} which is to swim upon the top , and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , which is , as they criticise upon it , to swim betwixt the top , and bottom ; these three last are mentioned by casaubon in his notes upon the third chapter of st. mathew , as was quoted by our adversary , but with what fidelitie , or advantage to his cause , i leave it to the godly , and learned to judge , for he left out the last words , wherein the whole state of the question is determined by casaubon against him , for thus he concludes , horum sententia jampridem meritò est explosa , &c. the judgement of those men is deservedly long since exploded , and trampled down , that would have baptizing to be by dipping , and he gives a reason , quum non in eo posita sit mysterii hujus vis , & {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , seeing the force , and efficacy of baptism , this mysterie , consists not in that , that is the manner of washing . which is confirmed by aquinas , immersio non est de necessitate baptismi , dipping is not of the necessity of baptism , and dominico sotus , ablutio est de essentiâ baptismi , washing is of the essence of baptism , but the manner of washing , whether by dipping , powring , or sprinkling , is accidental . many places of scripture confirm this , 1 cor. 10.2 . there the israelites were baptized in the red sea , when their feet did but touch the water , not as if they were baptized , when they were not ( as the ana baptists gloss upon this place ) and that the egyptians were really baptized , for the egyptians were not baptized in their sense , but sunk to the bottom like stones . exod. 15.5 . baptized under the cloud , not that the egyptians were baptized , and the israelites as if they were ( as they descant ) under the cloud , for the egyptians were never under the cloud , for the israetites went before the egyptians , and the cloud , part of it was over the israelites , part of it went before them . there is mention made in the gospel of baptizing , or washing of themselves when they came from market , of cups , of vessels , of tables , which cannot be meant of plunging , in water , so often , where that element was so scarce , but rincing . johns baptizing in jordan , philips going down to the river with the eunuch proves nothing at all ; for what strange consequence would this be , especially from the anabaptists ( that must have express scripture for all things ) john baptized in jordan , philip went down into the water with the eunuch , therefore , they were dipped , seeing it might as well be by powring , or sprinkling of water upon them , for any thing that appears out of the text . object . john baptized in enon , because there was much water . answ. this will seem to be no wonder in those hot countries , where there are many miles without a spring of water , especially seeing geographers , and travellers tells us , that enon is a little brook that one may stride over , scarce knee deep , and therefore not capable of dipping . object . but baptism , say they , must resemble the death of christ , rom. 6.4 . we are buryed with him by baptism , which is not by sprinkling , but dipping . answ. i answer , the scope of the place is to shew , that one end of our baptism is to seal our communion with christ in his death , but to press a necessity of resemblance by descending into the water , and comming out again , we see no ground in text , and if our abiding under the water must answer christs burial in exact representation , then as christ lay three days , and three nights in the grave , so they must lye three days , and three nights under the water , which if it were put in execution , the dispute would quickly be at an end . but should we grant this resemblance , i appeal to any man , whether our powring on of water in baptism , does not more resemble our christian burial , which is by powring on of earth , or dust , than by plunging over head . thus you see it proved , that baptizing is any kind of washing , in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost ; we do not deny with master perkins , that if we were to baptize converted turks , or pagans of ripe age , in hot countries , we might baptize them by dipping , provided that their garments were not first baptized , or washed , for that is conceived to be no less superstition , than baptizing of bells ; baptism ( says vossius ) non est immersio vestium , sed humani corporis , is not a washing of the garments , but of the body ; we account the church of rome idolaters , for presenting that worship , first to the image , which is terminated in christ ; the garments are first washed , or dipped , and the body but at the most wet , or moystned through them . but to affirm that no baptism but that which is by dipping is lawful , is a will-worship , much more , that baptism otherwise is a nullitie , and those that are baptized so , ought to be baptized again , or re-baptized , which the senate of syrick understood well , when they made an act , that all that did presume to re-baptize such as were baptized before , should be drowned . so we have resolved the former doubt , that baptizing is not dipping , and come to the latter , that infants may , nay ought to be baptized . and ( brethren ) i beseech you to give me leave a little to speak for infants , those poor souls , that cannot speak for themselves . and before we come to the question , take with you these two considerations ; first , that those truths that were not in controversie in the primitive times , the apostles were not so punctual in pressing of them , seeing there was no need ; solon being asked why he made no law against murtherers of parents , answer'd , because he conceiv'd none would commit that unnatural act ; if the apostles had been asked , why they did not put down infant-baptism in plainer terms , i suppose they would have answered , that they thought none would have denyed it . secondly observe , that those things that are pressed often in the old testament , are mentioned more sparingly in the new , as the sabbath , and magistracy in the old testament , line upon line , and precept upon precept , but scarce a syllable for a christian sabbath , or a christian magistracie in the new . nothing is more clear then infants church-membership in the old testament , therefore not so clear in the new , and yet clear enough to those that have eyes to see it , as will appear by these reasons following . 1. arg. first , those that are in covenant with god , ought to have the seal of the covenant , which is baptism . but infants of beleeving parents are in covenant with god . therefore infants ought to have the seal of the covenant , which is baptism . the former proposition is firm by confession of all divines , even our adversaries , haec est fundamentalis ratio paedobaptismi ( sayes daneus ) this is the fundamentall reason of baptizing of infants , that they are in covenant , esse foederatum sufficit ad accipiendum signum foederis , sayes davenant , to be in covenant is sufficient to receive the signe , and seal of the covenant , omnes foederati sunt baptizandi , sayes wendel , all that are in covenant are to be baptized , si in foedere sunt , impiè agunt , qui eis signum foederis negant , saith ferus , if they be in covenant , they do wickedly that deny them the signe of the covenant ; in a civill contract ( sayes mr perkins ) the father , and the heir make but one person , and the covenant 's for himself and his posterity . the minor proposition that infants of believing parents are in covenant , is grounded on many scriptures , genes . 17.7 . where god establishes a covenant , not only with abraham , but with his seed after him in their generations , for an everlating covenant , everlasting , and therefore to last to the end of the world ; as cornelius à lapide sayes , absolutè aeternum est in semine spirituali fidelibus , it is absolutely everlasting in the spirituall seed to the faithfull . galat. 3.8 the scripture foreseeing that god would justifie the heathen through faith , preached before the gospel to abraham ; therefore if isaac was in covenant with his father when he was but eight dayes old , and had the seal by vertue of the lamb to be slain , much more the children of believing parents , by vertue of the lamb that is already slain . deutero . 29.11 . when all the people stood in covenant before the lord , their little ones are mentioned amongst the rest , which is further confirmed , acts 2.38 , 39. be baptized every one of you , for the promise is to you , and your children ; to say that they were not yet believers , is but a shift , the text makes it cleer , as soon as they were believers , their children were in covenant with them , and to be baptized . arg. 2. such as were circumcised under the law , may be baptized under the gospell . but infants of believers were circumcised under the law . therfore they may baptized under the gospel . huic argumento non omnes anabaptistae resistent ( sayes learned whitaker ) all the anabaptists shall not be able to resist this argument ; the minor , that infants under the law were circumcised , is confessed . the former proposition is onely questioned , that baptism under the gospel to infants , does not necessarily follow from circumcision under the law ; augustin is cleer for it , saying , mutatis signis manet eadem gratia sine aetatis discrimine , the outward visible signes being changed , the same grace remaines without any difference of age , and he gives a reason , because the grace of god is not straiter in the new testament than in the old ; therefore christ , hebr. 8.6 . is said to be mediator of a better covenant , but how were it a better covenant , if all poor infants that were in covenant under the law , were out of covenant under the gospel ? titus . 2 12. the grace of god hath appeared unto all , and therefore surely to infants ; as ireneus sayes , christus pro parvulis parvulus factus est , christ becam a little one , for little ones sake , that he might redeem the little ones . little ones were the first martyrs that suffered for christ , in rama , was a voice heard ; and that baptism came in place of circumcision , the apostle cleares it , coloss. 2.11 , 12. ye are circumcised with circumcision made without hands ; how is that ? buryed with him in baptism . hence arises another argument . arg. 3. those that were once in covenant , had the seal of the covenant , and were never disfranchized , and put out of covenant , have title to the covenant , and seal of it still . but infants were once in covenant , had the seal of the covenant , and were never disfranchized , and put out of covenant , therefore infants have title to the covenant , and seal of it still . let any man shew one syllable , one tittle in scripture , that ever infants were put out , and wee l yield the gantlet ; nay , the gospell is so far from expressing of them that they are put out , that it gives them large commendations beyond them of riper years , making them the rule of our perfection , as new born babes , receive the sincere milk of the word . unless you be as little children , ye shall not enter into the kingdom of god ; which is a case so cleer , that even bellarmine him self encludes , nullum est impedimentum , &c. there is nothing that hinders , but that infants may as well be baptized under the gospell , as they were circumcised under the law ; for neither hath god forbidden ministers to give them this sacrament , neither are they uncapable to receive it . arg. 4. that which god hath commanded may lafully be practised by the ministers of jesus christ . but god hath , commanded infant-baptism . therefore it may lawfully be practised by the ministers of jesus christ . that god hath ommanded it , appears , matth. 28.19 . go baptize all nations ; it s a generall command , and ( as aquinas sayes ) posito generali mandato pars ejus negari non potest , a generall command being given , no part of it can be denyed ; infants are a part of nations , and included in them . object . but here is no mention made of infants . answ. no , nor of them of age ; we might retort it upon our adversaries , there is no mention made of dippers , no , nor of them that are to be dipped , therefore they ought not to dip , nor be dipped . generals include particulars in all lawes ; psalm . 117. praise the lord all ye nations , nations includes old men , and babes , young men , and maids , all without exception , as another psalm interprets it . now if infants be excepted , contrary to that saying of saint ambrose , qui dixit omnes , nullum excepit , neque parvulos , &c. he that commanded all to be baptized , excepnone , no , not little ones . if ( i say ) they be excepted , it s either because they are not named , or because we never read in scripture that any infants were baptized , or , because they are not capable ; ( that fourth cavill , being the same with the third , i le take away anon ) but for none of these three ; therefore infants are not excepted from baptism . not for the first , because they are not named , for so neither old men , nor nobles , nor ministers are named . not because we read not of their baptism , so we neither read of the baptism of the apostles , nor of the virgin mary , yet we piously believe that they were baptized ; de negatione facti ad jus non valet consequentia , such a thing is not mentioned , that it was done ; therfore it was not done , or was not done , therefore it ought not to have been done , is no consequence ; christ did , and said many things that are not written ; so did his apostles . not for the third , because they are uncapable , which is denyed ; for if infants be uncapable , it is either because they have not repentance , and faith in act , which cannot hinder them ; christ was baptized , had not repentance , for he had no sin to repent of , had not faith , for faith presupposeth one lost in himself , that depends upon another for salvation , christ is that rock of salvation , upon whom all mankind being lost depends ; neither because they cannot hear the word preached ; then they that are born deaf should be excluded from baptism ; or because they are not otherwise qualified ; but that cannot hinder them , for god requires no more of them that are in covenant , and born of believing parents , but a pure capacity , and receptability , which divines call potentiam objectivam ; as god in the beginning created the world of nothing , so in the beginning of the new creature he does regenerat , and recreate us of nothing ; upon this account it is , that we read of many whole families baptized , not excluding , but rather including infants , cornelius was baptized with his houshold , acts 10.47 , 48. lydea , and her houshold , acts 16.15 . crispus , and all his house , acts 18.8 . and the houshold of stephanus , 1 corinth . 1.16 . the jayler {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , all that were his , acts 16.31 , 32. his servants , his children ; for can we imagine so many families without a child ? arg. 5. they that are capable of the kingdom , and the blessing , which is the greater , are capable of baptism , which is the lesser . but infants are capable of the kingdom , and the blessing , which is the greater . therefore they are capable of baptism which is the lesser ; forbid not ( sayes our saviour ) little children to come unto me , for unto such belongs the kingdom of god ; for surely , if the kingdom of heaven receive them , the church may not exclude them ; for the church must receive such as glory receives , acts 2.47 . there were daily added to the church such as should be saved . now for proof of this argument , take these places , mark . 10.13 . to 17. mark . 9.14.36 , 37. matth. 18.2 , 3 , 4. matth. 19.13 , 14 , 15. luke 9.14 , 15. luke 18.15 , 16. which tho they be spoken upon severall occasions , all prove infants to be church-members , and capable both of grace , and glory ; wee l instance in two , jesus called a little child unto him , the word is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , which ( as hippocrates in his distinction of ages sayes , and beza seconds him , ) signifies a child under seven years , and set him in the middest of them , and said , verily i say unto you , except ye be converted , and become as little children , that is , endevour to be free from actuall sin , as they are , ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven . the other is that of s. luke 18.15 . wherein observe , first a precept , suffer little children to come unto me . secondly , we have a prohibition , and forbid them not . thirdly , his displeasure against his disciples , for hindring them from coming to him , he looked on this act with indignation , and was much displeased at it . fourthly , he adds a reason why little ones should be brought to him , because to such belongs the kingdom of god , that is , the kingdom of grace here , and glory hereafter ; they are visible members of his church , and kingdom , and therefore none may hinder their access to him . fiftly , he confirmes this reason , à majori , from the greater to the less , gods kingdom doth not onely belong to them , but i tell you more , whosoever will come into this kingdom , must resemble infants in innocency , humility , simplicity . sixtly , he adds his benediction of them , he took them up in his arms , put his hands upon them , and blessed them ; and tells us that their angels alwayes see the face of his father , which is in heaven ; and the danger of them that offend one of these little ones ; and all this recorded by three evangelists , matthew , mark , luke , as if it were of purpose to check the sacrilegious insolencie of these latter times that denyes them the seal . christ is not more punctuall by his spirit , in declaring his own birth , passion , resurrection , than he is in this precious truth so much trampled under foot . and if any object , these were not young children , the text easily confutes them , they were {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . children under seven yeares of age , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , children that could scarce speak , they did not lead them , but {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , they carried them unto him ; christ is said twice in s. mark , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , to take them up in his armes , and embrace them ; christ was already instructing the people that were able to understand , the apostles were offended for bringing of children which could not understand . well then , doth christ take children in his armes , and would he have them all put out of his visible church ? would he have us receive them in his name , and yet not to receive them into his visible church , nor as his disciples ? how can infants be received in christs name , if they belong not visibly to him , and his church ? nay , doth christ account it a receiving of himself , and shall we then refuse to receive them , or acknowledge them the subjects of his visible kingdom ? will it not follow then that whosoever refuseth them , refuseth christ , and him that sent him ? for my part ( to use the words of a godly , and learned divine ) seeing the will of christ is that i must walk by , and his word that i must be judged by , and he hath given me so full a discovery of his will in this point , i will boldly adventure to follow his rule , and had rather answer him upon his own incouragement for admitting an hundred infants into his church , than answer for keeping out of one . argument 6. all disciples may be baptized . but infants of believing parents are disciples . therefore some infants may be baptized . the major , or former proposition , is granted by our adversaries , who translate that place , matth. 28.19 . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , go make disciples of all nations , which is in our last translation , go teach all nations , confessing , as soon as they are disciples they may be baptized . now for the minor , that infants are disciples , is evident from acts 15.10 . why , tempt yee god , and put a yoak upon the neck of the disciples ? this yoak was circumcision , and the attendants of it , as will appear by comparing it with the fift verse , and the context from the beginning of the chapter . now among the jews , children were only to be circumcised , and amongst the gentiles , children together with parents when they were converted , and became proselites . to say that not only circumcision , but the doctrine , and observation of the whole law , by the yoak is meant , is but a shift ; circumcision was the seal , or ordinance by which the jews were bound to observe the doctrine , and the law , and all those upon whom the yoak was layd by circumcision , are called disciples ; whereof infants were a great part . and if it be objected , that children are not capable of instruction , as it is nothing to the purpose , so it contradicts scripture , esay 54.13 . and all thy children shall be taught of the lord , and great shall be the peace of thy children . and if any one carnally interpret this of the jews return from captivity , as they do other places of esa. our saviour checks them , john 6.45 . and it is written in the prophets , and they shall all be taught of god . arg. 7. all that have faith may be baptized . but some infants have faith . therefore some infants may be baptized . the proposition none will deny , the minor may be proved by severall reasons . first , christ expresly calls them believers , matth. 18. he attributes humility to them , and faith ; and commands elders to imitate them ; and that you may see they were infants , mark 9.36 . tells us they were such as christ took up in his armes . secondly , they are said to receive the kingdom of god , mark 10. that is , the grace of god , remission of sins , and life eternall ; now the kingdom is not received , but by faith in christ . thirdly , they please god , therfore christ blesseth them ; but without faith it is impossible to please god . fourthly , either faith must be allowed them , or salvation denyed them ; but the latter is cruell , and impious ; therefore the former must be godly , and pious ; faith only purifies the heart , but no unclean thing shall enter into heaven . fiftly , tho infants cannot make actuall profession of faith , yet they may have inward roots of sanctification , and faith . john baptist and jeremie were sanctified in their mothers wombs ; let carnalists say what they will , that is the principal meaning of that place , esay 65.20 . there shall be no more an infant of days ; the jews thought they were not sanctified , unless a sabbath went over them ; the child shall dy an hundred year old , that is , as well in covenant with god , or a visible church-member , as if he were a hundred years old . therefore pareus sayes , infantes ecclesiae etiam ante baptismum censentur sideles ; infants of the church , even before baptism , are judged faithfull . hommius sayes , infants have faith , in semine , in the seed , tho not in messe , in the harvest ; beza sayes , they have faith {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , in power , tho not {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , in operation . faith ( says treleatius ) is twofold ; 1. active which the elder have by hearing the word . 2. passive , and by imputation , which infants have by vertue of the covenant , and divine promise . pelagius asks austin where he places infants baptized ? he answers , in numero credentium , in the number of believers , and addes , nec judicare ullo modo aliter audebis , si non vis esse apertè haereticus , neither may thou presume to judge otherwise , if thou wilt not be a plain heretick . wee l conclude this with that of vossius , as in naturals , so in supernaturals we must distinguish these three things , power , habit , and act ; there is the power of reasoning in infants , the habit in men sleeping , but the act , and exercise , in them that are waking ; the power answers the seed , the habit the tree , the act , and exercise , the fruit ; the seed of faith may be in infants , the habit in men of age , but the act , and exercise , in them that work according to the habit . 8. arg. those that are holy , with a covenant-holiness , may be baptized . but infants of beleeving parents are holy with a covenant-holiness . therefore infants of beleeving parents may be baptized . for the former proposition , foederatis competit signum foederis , ( says vossius ) the sign of the covenant belongs to them that are in covenant ; holiness is twofold ( says bullinger ) either of faith , or of the covenant . ezra . 9.2 . ye have mingled the holy seed , that is them in covenant , with the nations , that is them that are out of covenant . thus you see , that covenant-holiness is no gibberidge , but grounded upon scripture , and avouched by learned men : as shall more fully appear . the minor , that children of beleeving parents are holy with a covenant-holiness , is clear from 1 cor. 7.14 . else your children were unclean , that is , not in covenant , but now they are holy , that is , in covenant , thus ( besides the ancients ) sharpius , and peter martyr interpret it , and hugo grotius himself , non loquitur apostolus de sanctitate naturali , &c. the apostle ( says he ) speaks not of natural holiness , and inhering to the nature of children , but of an holiness adhering to them , that is , the holiness of the covenant , for the children of beleevers are comprehended in the covenant of grace , and therefore accounted holy of god . to interpret it ( as the gross anabaptists do ) that they are holy , that is , no bastards , is a new holiness not heard of in scripture , and as ( doctor featly says ) a bastard exposition ; and pareus gives the reason , if the children of beleevers be therefore holy , because they are no bastards , the children of pagans are as well holy , for they are also no bastards . if the first-fruits be holy , the lump is holy , and if the root be holy , so are also the branches . rom. 11.16 . the first fruits and the root , that is the parents ; the lump , the branches , that is the children , and posterity . and , rom. 11.17 . if the jews were broken off , and the gentiles graffed into their place , it will follow , that if the jews were broken off , parents with children , then the gentiles shall be graffed in , parent with children . but the jews were broken off parents with children . therefore the gentiles shall be graffed in , parents with children . 9. arg. if infants should be out of covenant under the gospel , many dangerous absurdities would follow . first , infants would be losers by the comming of christ , and be put in a worse condition than the jewish infants were ; they with the parents were admitted to the seal of the covenant , which was circumcision , and not children with parents to baptism . secondly , if infants should be in covenant then , and not now , grace would be larger under the law , than under the gospel . thirdly , there would be no difference betwixt the child of a christian , and of a pagan , but all the infants of christians would be as vile as the children of turks , tartars , or cannibals . fourthly , they would be without god , without christ , without hope in the world ; not the children of god , but of the devil ; would all be damned , for out of covenant , and visible church ( ordinarily ) there is no salvation . 10. arg. lastly , that which hath continued since the apostles times with blessed success , must needs be lawful . but infant-baptism hath continued with blessed success since the apostles times . therefore infant baptism is lawful . wee l begin with the first centurie , or hundred years after christ . dionysius the areopagite whom the apostles converted at athens , says , holy men have received a tradition from the fathers , that is the apostles , to baptise infants . clemens ( who is recorded by some of the antients to succeed peter in his ministry at rome ) says {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , baptise your infants . ireneus ( who lived in the second century ) says , christus pro parvulis parvulus factus est , christ became a little one for little ones sake , that little ones might be received into covenant . origen that lived in the begining of the third century says , the church received a tradition from the apostles to baptize infants , and gives a reason , because they are born in impurity of sin ; nay pelagius , a great scholar , who lived in the latter end of this century , though he denyed original sin , yet confessed infant-baptism , for when they pressed him with this argument , if infants had not original sin what need they baptism , he answered , that christ appointed , and the church practised infant-baptism , not to purge sin by past , but to prevent it for the time to come . cyprian in the fourth century confirms it in his epistle to fidus , and gives an account of a council of sixty six bishops that decreed that infants should be baptized . ambrose says , because every age is lyable to sin , therefore every age is fit for the sacrament of baptism . nazianzene says it is better to seal infants with baptism , ( though they know it not ) then to leave them unsealed . austen is conceived to go too far , who denyed possibility of salvation to them that dyed un-baptized , pressing that place john 3.5 . except a man be born of water , and of the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdom of god . the millevitan counsel in the fifth century decreed , that whosoever should deny that infants , even taken from their mothers wombs , might not be baptized , should be accursed . all churches , all ages since , agree in this ; the harmonies of confessions of all reformed churches , the church of england in the apologie , the old catechism , the twenty seventh article , the directory , the greater and lesser catechism composed by the assembly of divines , the late parliament by a further declaration , all confirm it ; the canons of our church did not only in former times declare , but the lawes of our land did punish anabaptists as hereticks . mr. fox in his acts and monuments approves of the albigenses , waldenses , wickliffists , lollards , poor men of lyons , brownists , barrowists , as members of the reformed churches , but wholly excludes the anabaptists , as erring fundamentally . i 'le say no more for confirmation of this polemicall discourse , but wind up all with a word of exhortation ; i beseech you brethren consider what a dangerous errour this is , that robbs the scripture of its truth , infants of their right , parents of their comforts , the church of its members , christ of his merits , god of his glory ; that is the mother of many other errours ; hence sprung the ranters , socinians , antitrinitarians , shakers , levellers , they that are above ordinances , antiscripturians ; an errour that god hath expressed many signall judgments against , as sleiden and gastius in germany , and some of our worthies in england have declared . as reverend mr. cotton tells one of his aposta●ed flock , that had his house burned , and his children in it , no wonder that fire seised upon his house , and god denyed water to quench it , who denyed that water should be brought to baptize his infants . secondly , consider that much benefit redounds both to parents , and children , by infant-baptism . first , much comfort comes hereby to the parents , when they consider gods free grace to them , and theirs , that he is not ashamed to be called their god , and the god of their seed after them . hebr. 11.16 . secondly , much benefit comes to infants by baptism , ( which the devill knowes well , when he causes witches to renounce their baptism , when they enter into covenant with him ) for they are thereby admitted into the bosome of the church , devoted , and consecrated unto god , his name is put upon them , they wear his royall badge , and by it they are distinguished from heathens . and this so clear from scriptures , truly , and spiritually understood , that the gates of hell shall not prevail against it . now the god of peace and truth , by his spirit , lead us into all truth , keep us pure , and unspotted in this houre of englands temptation , and triall , keep us faithfull to the death , that so we may receive a crown of life . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a62871e-320 and that by washing , as the proselytes and jews children were initiated . mr. cradock , and mr. walter . monmothshire . notes for div a62871e-14010 {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} or to the water . felo de se, or, mr. richard baxter's self-destroying manifested in twenty arguments against infant-baptism / gathered out of his own writing, in his second disputation of right to sacraments by john tombes. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a62868 of text r33836 in the english short title catalog (wing t1806). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 145 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 22 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a62868 wing t1806 estc r33836 13576588 ocm 13576588 100458 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a62868) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 100458) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1053:11) felo de se, or, mr. richard baxter's self-destroying manifested in twenty arguments against infant-baptism / gathered out of his own writing, in his second disputation of right to sacraments by john tombes. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. [5], 37 p. printed by henry hills ..., london : 1659. imperfect: pages stained. reproduction of original in the union theological seminary library, new york. eng baxter, richard, 1615-1691. infant baptism -early works to 1800. baptists -controversial literature. a62868 r33836 (wing t1806). civilwar no felo de se. or, mr. richard baxter's self-destroying; manifested in twenty arguments against infant-baptism, gathered out of his own writing tombes, john 1659 28019 83 45 0 0 0 0 46 d the rate of 46 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the d category of texts with between 35 and 100 defects per 10,000 words. 2004-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2004-12 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-02 mona logarbo sampled and proofread 2005-02 mona logarbo text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion felo de se. or , mr. richard baxters self-destroying ; manifested in twenty arguments against infant-baptism , gathered out of his own writing , in his second disputation of right to sacraments . by john tombes , b. d. psalm 64. 8 , 9. so they shall make their own tongues to fall upon themselves : all that see them shall flee away . and all men shall fear , and shall declare the work of god , for they shall wisely consider of his doings . london : printed by henry hills , next door to the sign of the peacock in aldersgate-steeet , 1659. to the christian reader . master richard baxter in his second disputation of right to sacraments , begins thus ; it may seem strange that after 1625. years use of christian baptism , the ministers of the gospel should be yet unresolved , to whom it doth belong ; yet so it is . and i observe that it is a question , that they are now very sollicitous about , and i cannot blame them , it being not onely about a matter of divine appointment , but a practical of such concernment to the church . the true reason hereof seems to be , that ministers have for many ages left the true baptism of believers which christ appointed , and like michal , instead of it have substituted an image or idol of their own , to wit , infant baptism , which being quite besides the rule of christ , matth. 28. 19. mark 16. 15. and the apostles practice throughout the acts of the apostles , they have been at a loss about the ground of it , and almost at daggers drawing about the use of it . as it happens to fellow-travellers , when they are all out of the right way , one conjectures this way they should go , another that , and sometimes they are at hot disputos and contentions about their way , and many by-ways are attempted , yet still the farther they go the more out of the way , till they come into the road again : so it hath been with baptizers of infants ; they are fallen into many new devices to maintain infant baptism , the ancients with the papists imagining that by it gods grace was given , and that it was necessary to save the child from perishing , the lutherans that by baptism a seed of faith and some relative grace was given to infants ( to which doctor samuel ward , bishop davenant , doctor cornelius burges , master thomas bedford , master james cranford , and others have of late much inclined ) others opposing these have fallen into as bad conceits of the covenant of gospel grace , as made to a believer and his seed , baptisms succession to jewish circumcision , and fetching a rule from thence , as others from the jewish baptism . master baxter having found these unsafe to rest on , sub they will bring the assertors to the avouching jewish tenets , hath devised another ( as he conceives ) more refined and subtile way , making infants disciples of christ mediately by the parents , or proparents ( as his new term is ) faith ( which he never proves ) and an imagined ordinance or law of infants visible church-membership ( no where extant ) unrepealed , and in following these by-ways , they have been at variance among themselves . tertullian , and gregory nazianzen onely allowing infant baptism in case of manifest danger of imminent death , others to take away original sin , baptizing all , weak or strong , believers or unbelievers children ; which had almost quite thrust baptism of believers out of the world , and under colour of christening , ( as they fasly term their infant baptism ) and making christian souls by throwing water on them , they have so polluted the churches of god with the dregs of the nations , i mean , innumerable ignorant , scandalous , prophane , superstitious haters , scorners , and persecutors of christianity , that nothing but the mighty power of god is sufficient to purge the churches of god of that loathsome and infectious filth , which these have brought into it . the papists themselves do in a sort confess that infant baptism is an aberration from the first rule , in that they count it not perfect till their mimical , and ludicrous sacrament of confirmation be added , which was used with some reformation in respect of the right , and disclaiming of some errours affixed to it , and with the appointment of catechizing by the late bishops , and from them termed bishopping , though without any remarkable emendation of the intrusion of ignorant , ungodly , unchristian persons into the society of christians and the lords supper . some of those who of late have sought reformation herein , begin to devise how they may remedy this evil , and yet keep the multitude in their communion , by refining that which is called confirmation . to this purpose , lately is published by master jonathan hanmer , an exercitation or confirmation , to which master george hughes , master richard baxter , and master ralph venning , have prefixed their epistles ; concerning which , how he is mistaken in the laying on of hands used by the ancients , and the application of heb. 6. 2. to confirmation after infant baptism , is perceptible by sect. 23. of the second part of my review , and sundry passages in his own book , in which many things besides are vented without proof , about difference between the church of infants and adult members , of the effect of confirmation , of compleat and incompleat visible church-members , &c. the errors of which it is unnecessary to refute , there being no proof of them offered , but his own and other divines mistakes , and the main of the design being to set up another humane inventi●n , which hath no precept or promise of god , that he may uphold or colour over an old corruption . it pleased god lately to begin to bring the truth concerning baptism of believers to light in this nation , which stirred up many to contend for infant baptism , and having , as they imagined ( though the three parts of my review now published do sufficiently shew they are deceived ) made that sure , they have of late fallen to dispute whose infants are to be baptized . mr. thomas hooker , mr. cobbet , mr. firmin , and others , pleading against the baptism of the infants of the national and parochial church-members , and some of them restraining it to infants of inchurched church-members , and those who are judged to be real visible saints , have been opposed by master rutherford , master cawdery , master blake , and others . master blake to maintain his tenet , hath asserted that a dogmatical faith intitles to baptism : to oppose which , master baxter , however in his letter to me he pretends the unpleasantness and non-necessity of meddling any more about the point of infant baptism , the want of time and health for work of greater moment , that he might decline ●●●●ing where his law of infants visible church-membership unrepealed is , and thinks a man cannot justifie it to lay out the hundreth part , or perhaps the thousandth part of his time , study , talk , or zeal , upon this question , yet here he blames not them that are sollicitous about it , being of divine appointment and practical , of such concernment to the church , and hath himself , besides his apology before this last year , published a large book of disputations concerning right ●o sacraments , the second whereof is against master blake ; which though it was intended onely to overthrow his tenet , yet indeed the middle terms and proofs of his arguments do beat down his own tenet of infant baptism , and direct into the right way of restoring believers baptism , to demonstrate which , that those who have adhered to mr. baxter may see how ill master baxter hath dealt with them , and may , if god give them wisdom to discern the truth , be brought into the right way of believers baptism , is this writing framed , in which thou hast presented to thee , a remarkable instance of gods providence , in clearing truth by the pen of its most eminent adversary , and of his he●●●le●● writing , not observing how his own arguments against another sight against himself . the urging thereof , is that way which logicians●●prove of , and against the person is ever counted a good plea to argue for his own condemnation out of his own mouth , and in this matter is good as to the thing , it being not onely asserted by him , but also largely proved . in the publishing hereof the●e is no more wrong done to him , then was done by bishop morton in his apology , in aliedging the romanists words in their writings , as an advoca●e for the protestants , against themselves , but much right to the truth and church of god ; nothing i●●ere set down as his but his own words , what is added be may discern'd by the different letor some other mark . his caution , that he means his propositions in the case of baptism of adult persons , and that he hath elsewhere proved infant baptism , are without wrong to him left out , sith his arguments do as strongly prove there should be none but adult baptism , as that none should be baptized upon the profession of a bare dogmatical faith ; for though his aim be onely to prove that the faith professed which intitles to baptism must be justifying , yet his arguments to prove this prove more , that none but such as profess such faith are to be baptized , and that this profession is to be by each baptized in his own person , and no other to be baptized . not one text he brings proves that a parents or proparents profession doth intitle to baptism ; what he hath disputed elsewhere for infant baptism is all now answered and published in the three parts of my review ; no where doth he prove ( though that is it be should chiefly have proved ) that in order to baptism a parents or proparents profession is by god allowed as the infants own , but still be supposeth it , which is the main point to be proved , which logicians know is of all fallacies the grossest , to wit , the begging of the question . yet lately master baxter hath printed a book about confirmation , in which he dictates many things which he should prove , of infant visible church-members and their priviledges , and repeats his ol● arguments for infant baptism , and acknowledging onely his sorrow for provoking words , saith he will give some account , and in his preface to his book of justification tells the reader , he shall yet vindicate his papers written to me , where he gives some reason also of printing my animadversions on his aphorisms of justification . his sorrow for his provoking words is some good sign of gods touching his heart , and so far as belong to my person i heartily forgive him , though they have been extreamly injurious to me , to the tr●th and church of god . and for my animadversions he hath now printed , he may understand that i intend ( if god vouchsafe me life , and strength , and leisure ) to shew the insufficiency of his answers . if he give an account and vindicate his papers , i expect he should do it otherwise then he did in his praefestinantis morator , and his usual fashion is . let him do that which becomes a replicant , set down mine own words to which he answer , and answer them fully and distinctly without interrogations & exclamations , proving such distinctions , definitions , assertions , expositions , as i deny , and making good by solid proof his arguments , which that learned man mentioned in my preface to the third part of my review counted not like an argument for infant baptism , and allows me to tell him , that if he will choose his best argument , he is ready to demonstrate his censure of his book to have been just . in the mean time i judge it necessary that this book be printed , that if god shall vouchsafe him such mercy he may understand his error from his own writing , and the reader may judge whether the lord doth not now abundantly refute infant baptism , and require him to practise that command of christ of being baptized after believing , which however now reproached , was by all christians observed heretofore with much zeal and conscience of their duty and honor , and is commended to him from christ and his apostles . remember the words of christ , john 14 ▪ 15. if ye love me keep my commandments . luke 6. 46. and why call ye me lord lord , and do not the things which i say ? matth. 15. 9. in vain do they worship me , teaching for doctrines the commandments of men . farewel . london , 12th . moneth , the 21. day , 1658. thine in our lord , john tombes . felo de se. master baxter of right to sacraments , disp. 2. pag. 53. argum. 1. if we must not baptize any who profess not true repentance , then must we not baptize any infants ; but the antecedent is true . therefore , &c. the consequence of the major , is manifest , sith this proposition on which it depends , infants profess not true repentance , is manifest by sense . the antecedent is easily proved from scripture , and i know not whether any protestant deny it . i prove 1. that repentance , 2. and such as is proper to the effectually called is necessary to be professed by all that we may baptize ; i will joyn the proof of both together . argum. 1. if john baptist required the profession of true repentance in men before he would baptize them , then so must we : but john did so , therefore the consequence is clear . 1. for either john● baptism and christs were the same , as most of our divines against the papists do maintain ( though zanchy , and some few more follow the judgement of the ancient doctors in this ) or as calvin institut , saith , the difference seems to be but this , that john baptized them into the messiah to come , and the apostles into the name of the messiah already come . 2. or if the difference be greater we may argue a fortiori , from the more forcible : if johns baptism required a profession of repentance , then much more christs ; for certainly christ required not less then john , not did he take the impenitent into his kingdom whom john excluded . the antecedent i prove . 1. from mark 1. 3 , 4. he preached , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the baptism of repentance unto the remission of sins . and doubless that repentance which is in remissionem pecatorum , unto the remission of sins , is true special repentance . one of our divines , and many of the papists have sound another evasion : that is , that john did engage them to repent , but not requiring a profession of repentance as foregoing baptism ; but this is against the whole current of expositors , ancient and modern , and 2. against the plain scope of the text . the words in matth. 3 6. are [ they were baptized of him in jordan , confessing their sins ] this confession was with , yea before their baptism ; and this confession was the profession of repentance that john required . maldonate on the text , having first railed at calvin and slandered him , as turning baptism into preaching , ( as if he had expounded johns baptizing , not of water baptism but preaching , when he onely shews that both should go together ) doth tell the protestants that they cannot prove by this text that confession went before baptism , because it is named after ; but that he might not seem utterly impudent , he confesseth that the thing is true , and that is the sense of the text , and this he confesseth because he must rather be a faithful expositor , then a subtile adversary . and if any should say that it 's onely confession that 's required , which is no certain sign of true repentance , i answer : when john saith ▪ if we confess our sins , he is faithfull and just to forgive us our sins ] he to●k that confession to be a sign of true repentance , and our expositors and the ancients befor them agree , that it was such a confession as was conjunct with a detestation and renouncing of the sin , and it is expounded by that of acts 19. 18. as grotius noteth , to have a special detestation of the sin accompanying it , where to the word {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} is added {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , confessing and shewing their deeds . and it may suffice that the baptism to which this confession was required , is the baptism of repentance . but it is objected that in the 11. vers. of matth. 3. it is said by john [ i baptize you with water to repentance ] therefore it is but an engagement of them to it for the future . answ. our expositors have fully shewed that this signifieth no more , but [ i baptize you upon your present profession of repentance , to newness of life ] for that this profession did go before is proved already , & then the rest can be no more , than the continuance of repentance and exercise of it in newness of ●ife , which they are engaged to for the future : onely if any falsly profess it at present his own confession is an engagement to it as a duty . grotius saith , that [ {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} potest non incommode exponi hoc modo , baptizo vos super professione paenitentiae quam facitis , unto repentance may commodiously be thus expounded ; i baptize you upon profession of repentance , which ye make . the plain meaning is in a word [ i do by baptism initiate you into the state of repentance , or of penitents ] but christ shall give the holy ghost ( as it was poured forth ) and so ( as pelargus speaks in matth. 3. against salm●ron ) we maintain johns baptism to be effectual , being the baptism of repentance to remission of sin : and that it was true repentance that he required appeareth further by the fruits of it , that he calleth from the ph●ri●ees , matth. 3. 6 , 7 , 8 , 9. lastly , i shall prove anon that god hath not appointed us to baptize any upon a promise of repentance or faith , before they profess actual faith and repentance , nor are they fit for such a covenant . argum. 2. for the proof of the necessity of a profession of repentance before baptism , is this : if jesus christ hath by scripture , precept , and example , directed us to baptize those that profess true repentance and no other , then we must baptize them and no other : but the antecedent is true , therefore to is the consequent . all that requireth proof is of the antecedent , which i prove from an ●numeration of those texts that do afford us this direction ( besides the fore-mentioned . ) 1. jesus christ himself did by preaching repentance prepare men for baptism , end for his kingdom , as john before began to do , matth. 4. 17. so matth. 1. 15. the kingdom of god is at hand , repent ye and believe the gospe● ; and to that end he sent his apostles and other preachers , mark 16. 12. acts 17. 30. luke 24. 47. repentance and remission is to be preached to all ●●tions in his name ▪ and baptism which is for the obsignation of remission of ●●n , according to the appointed order , comes after repentance . and when it is said by john . [ i baptize you with water to repentance , but he shall baptize you with the holy ghost ] matth. 3. 11. mark 1. 8. luke 3. 16. it implieth that christs baptism comprehended johns and somewhat more . in acts 2. 37 , 38. when the jews were pricked in their heart ( which was a preparatorie repentance ) and said to peter and the rest of the apostles [ men and brethren what shall we do ? ] peter saith to them , repent , and be baptized every one of you in the name of jesus christ for the remission of sins ] so that we must require and expect true evangelical repentance to be professed before baptism . for verse 41. it s added [ then they that gladly received his word were baptized ] so that he baptized none that to outward appearance did not gladly receive that word , which could not be without a profession of that repentance . and he that hence perswadeth to repent and be baptized for remission , doth in the next chapter , verse 19. require them to repent , and be converted , that their sins may be blotted out , shewing what kind of repentance it is that he meaneth ; and as the work of general preachers to the unbelieving world is sometimes called a disciplining of nations , which goeth before baptizing them , matth. 28. 19 , 20. so it is in other places called a preaching of repentance and commanding all men every where to repent , acts 17. 30. an opening of mens eyes and turning them from darkness to light , and from the power of satan unto god , that they may receive remission ( obsigned in baptism ) acts 26. 18. 1. repent and turn to god , verse 20. and if it was the sum of pauls preaching to the unbaptized [ repentance toward god , and faith toward the lord jesus christ ] acts 20. 21. so that it is apparent that they took the profession or appearance of both faith and repentance as prerequisite to baptism , and still this same repentance is it that hath the remission of sin connexed , acts. 5. 31. luke 24. 47. its repentance unto life , acts 11. 18. and when the apostles compare johns baptism with christs , they still acknowledge johns to be baptism of repentance , acts 13. 24. and 19. 4. and when the apostle doth purposely recite the principle of our religion he doth it in this order . heb. 6. 1 , 2. [ the foundation of repentance from dead works and saith towards god , of the doctrine of baptisms , &c. ] argum. 3. they that before they are baptized must renounce the world , the flesh and the devil , must profess true evangelical repentance ( i mean still such as hath a promise of pardon and salvation ) but all that are baptized must renounce the world , flesh and devil , of which we shall have occasion to say more anon . argum. 4. they that profess to be buried with christ in baptism , and to rise again , do profess true repentance ; but all that are baptized must profess to be buried with him and rise again , therefore , &c. the major is proved in that to be buried and risen with christ , signifieth , a being dead to sin and alive to god , and newness of life : and it is not onely an engagement of this for the future , but a profession also of it at the present . this with the rest we thus prove , col. 2. 11 , 12 , 13. in whom ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands , in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of christ , buried with him in baptism , wherein also you are risen with him through the faith of the operation of god , who hath raised him from the dead , and you being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh hath he quickened together with him , having forgiven you all trespasses . where note 1. that this is spoken to all the church of the colossians ▪ and therefore they are presumed to be what they profess and appear to be . 2. that the putting of the body under the water did signifie our burial with christ and the death and putting off of our sins ; and though we now use a less quantity of water , yet it is to signifie the same thing , or else we should destroy the being of the sacrament . so also our rising out of the water signifieth our rising and being quickned together with him . 3. note also that it is not onely an engagement to this hereafter , but a thing presently done . they were in baptism buried with christ , and put off the body of sin , and were quickned with him ; and this doth all suppose their own present profession to put off the body of sin , and their consent to be baptized on these terms . the like we have in rom. 6. chapter 4. 5. know ye not that so many of us as were baptized into jesus christ were baptized into his death ? therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death , that like as christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the father , even so we also should walk in newness of life ; for if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death , we shal be also into the likeness of his resurrection . here also it is evident , 1. that all the members of the visible church are supposed to be baptized into christ , and into his death , & so to be buried with him by baptism into death & planted together into the likeness of his death . 2. and that this is not supposed to be onely an engagement for the future , but a present entrance into the state of mortification and vivification wherein they were to proceed by newness of life ; and therefore verse 5 , 6 , 7 , 8 , 11. they are supposed to have the old man crucified with christ that the body of sin might be destroyed , and that henceforth they should not serve sin , and that they are so dead as to be freed from sin , as to the servitude thereof . and that they must reckon themselves dead to sin , but alive to god . he that readeth the whole chapter with judgement and impartialitie , will soon discern that true repentance and abrenuntiation of the service of sin , was to be professed by all that would be baptized ; and that thereupon they sealed their own profession and covenant by the reception of baptism , as christ sealed his part by the actual baptizing them ; and that hereupon they are by the apostles all called and supposed such as they professed themselves to be . argum. 5. if it be the very nature of baptism to signifie and seal both the present putting off the body of sin , and present putting on christ , then the profession of true repentance must needs precede or concur with baptism : but the former is certain ; of which more anon . i conclude then that both scripture , and the very signs themselves , and the common consent of the church do shew that true repentance and present repentance must be professed by all those that we may baptize . pag. 62. argum. 2. my first argument was from the necessity of a profession of true repentance . the 2. shall be from the equipollent terms , a description to the thing described , thus : we must baptize no man that first professeth not to believe in god the father , son , and holy ghost : but no infant professeth to believe in god the father , son , and holy ghost ; therefore we must baptize no infant : the minor is manifest by sense . the major is proved from matth. 28. 19. where this is made the form of the words in baptism , or at least the end , and that which we must insist on ▪ calvin on the words yields the anabaptists that faith is put justly before baptism , nam alioqui mendax essot , figuraque remissionem peccatorum & spiritus donum afferes incredulis , qui nondum essent christi membra . for otherwise he should speak false , and the figure should bring remission of sins , and the gift of the spirit to unbelievers , who were not members of christ . and that , non abs re , patris , filii & spiritus expressa hic fit mentio , quia aliter baptismi vis apprehendi non potest , quam si a gratuita patris miserecordia initium fiat , qui nos per filium sibi reconciliat , deinde in medium prodeat christus ipse cum mortis suae sacrificio , & tandem accedat etiam spiritus sanctus per quem nos abluit & regenerat ; denique suorum omnium bonorum consor●es faciat . not from the matter , here is express mention made of the father , son , and spirit , because otherwise the efficacie of baptism cannot be apprehended , but by beginning from the fathers free mercy , who reconciles us to himself by his son , and then that christ himself come between with the sacrifice of his death , and then at last the holy spirit also approach , by which he washeth and regenerates us , and last of all makes us partakers of his benefits . it appeareth by comparing matth. 28. 19. with rom. 6. 3. and 1 cor. 1. 13 , 14 , 15. and 10. 2. that to be baptized into the name of the father , son , and holy ghost , is not onely to be baptized by their authority , but also to be thus initiated into the relation which the church standeth in to them , and to be consecrated to the father , son , and holy ghost , as musculus , diodate , the assembly of divines annotations , and the generality of expositors do express . see doctor hammond , pract. catech. lib. 6. 5. 2. and especially on matth. 28. 19. grotius at large , and that it comprehendeth or presupposeth a profession of believing son and holy ghost . for no man can devote himself solemnly by our ministry to the holy trinity , that doth not first profess to believe in them : therefore the chuch over taught the catechumeni the creed first , in which they profess to believe in god the father , son , and holy ghost . and before they actually baptized them , they asked them whether they believed in god the father , son , and holy ghost ? to which they must answer affirmatively , or not be baptized . and all that are baptized must first profess to believe in his name , and so to receive him , and not onely promise to do it hereafter . i adde that the same faith that is mentioned in the ordinary creed in the church , is meant in the baptismal profession , and to be required before baptism ; this will be confessed . 1. because the creed it self hath been this 1300. years at least professed before baptism . 2. because the creed it self is but the 3. fundamental baptismal articles mentioned , matth. 28. 19. enlarged and explained on subsequent occasions ( as sandford , and parker , de descensu have learnedly and largley proved , and grotius in matth. 28. 19. proves out of tertullian , &c. that the creed was not then in the form of words as now , though the same doctrine was used in other words , to the same uses . pag. 68. argum. 3. the foregoing argument was taken from the prerequisite profession , the next shall be taken from the very work it self , viz. the presenting and offering our selves to be baptized , and willingly receiving baptism : thus , if it be the very nature or appointed use of the ex●eanal part of baptism it self ( yea essential to it ) to signifie and profess ( among other things ) the saving faith and repentance of the baptized , then true baptism cannot go without such a profession . but the baptism of infants is without such a profession , therefore the baptism of infants is not true baptism . the minor is manifest by sense . the antecedent ( which onely requireth proof ) i prove thus : it is of the instituted nature of baptism to be in general , a professing sign as well as an engaging sign , de futuro , for the future : this i premise , as granted by all christians that i know of that have written of baptism , and then let us consider of the several parts of the sign or external ordinance , with the signification of each ; that it is essential to it to be significant and obligatory on our part , as well as on gods part , is commonly confessed . and 1. the minister doth baptize him into the name of the father , son , and holy ghost ; and the party doth consent thereto , 1. voluntarily offering himself to be bapitzed , and then 2. voluntarily receiving that baptism . and his offer of himself hereto , goeth before the ministers baptizing him , and his reception of that baptism is essential to it : so that baptism essentially containeth on his part a signal profession of consent to that which is meant in the form used by the minister [ i baptize thee into the name of the father , son , and holy ghost ] and that is , that god the father , son , and holy ghost be mine , and i be theirs , in the relations in which they are offered in the gospel to mankind ; for all confess that it is a covenant that is here sealed , and so a mutual consent which the signs are instituted by christ to signifie . christ offereth himself to be related to me as my jesus christ ; and by offering my self to baptism , and by voluntary receiving it , i do actually profess my acceptance of his offer , that is of himself so offered . god the father offereth himself to be my god reconciled in christ , and so my chief good : and by voluntary receiving baptism i do signally profess my acceptance of him so offered . the holy ghost is offered to be my sanctifyer and guide ; and by voluntary reception of baptism into his name , i do signally profess my acceptance of him so offered : so that it is a most clear case , that baptism as baptism , according to it s instituted nature and use , doth contain the persons actual signal profession of present assent to the truth of the gospel , and acceptance of god the father , son , and holy ghost as therein offered . and it containeth ( as our divines commonly maintain ) an actual signal profession that we there presently consecrate or devote , or dedicate our selves to god the father , son , and holy ghost in the foresaid relations . 2. another part of baptism is , the ministers washing the person , and the person first offering himself to be washed , and after actually receiving it , doth thereby signally profess his consent . now this washing doth essentially signifie our washing from our former filth of sin , together with the guilt ; our putting off the old man which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts of the flesh . he that signally professeth his present consent to be washed by the blood of christ from his former filthiness and guilt , and to lay by the filthiness of flesh and spirit , doth co nomine profess saving faith and repentance . but all that are baptized with the baptism of christs institution , do by the very voluntary reception of baptism , so profess ; therefore they do thereby profess saving faith and repen● 3. quad modum as to the manner ; it s commonly confessed by us to the anabaptists ( as our commentators declare ) that in the apostles times the baptized were dipped over head in the water , and that this signifieth their profession , both of believing the bu●ial and resurrection of christ , and of their own present renouncing the world and flesh , or dying to sin and living to christ , or rising again to newness of life , or being buried and risen again with christ , as the apostle expoundeth in the forecited texts of col. 2. and rom. 6. and though we have thought it lawful to disuse the manner of dipping , and to use less water , yet we presume not to change the use and signification of it : so then , he , that signally professeth to die and rise again in baptism with christ , doth signally profess saving faith and repentance . but thus do all that are baptized according to the apostles practice : therefore , &c. pag. 74. argum. 4. if we must baptize none that profess not their consent to enter themselves presently into the covenant of grace with god in christ , then we must baptize no infant , but the former is true ; therefore , &c. the consequence is manifest , sith it is manifest even by sense , that infants profess not their consent to enter themselves into the covenant of grace with god in christ . the antecedent i think will be granted by many of the papists , and it is the common doctrine of the protestants ; and therefore as to them i need not prove it . i confess , some of the anbaptists , and some few others , do question whether baptism be a seal of the covenant of grace ; but the quarrel is mostly , if not onely , about the bare word [ seal ] for they confess that in sense which we mean by sealing ; and particularly they confess , that we do in baptism enter into the convenant of god , and that it is a professing and engaging sign on our part , as well as an exhibiting , notifying , confirming sign on gods part . it is confest it is the covenant of grace we are to enter , and that there is but one covenant of grace . this master blake acknowledgeth , for all the mention of an outward covenant : it is also a confessed thing on all hands that it is god that is the first author and offerer of the covenant , that it is he that redeemed us , who made the promise or covenant of grace upon the ground of redemption ; and that it is frequently called a covenant in scripture , as it is a divine law or constitution , without respect to mans consent , as grotius hath proved in the preface to his annotations on the evangelists : much more ( out of doubt ) is it , that it is called a covenant before man consenteth , as it is a covenant offered , and not yet mutually entred ; in the former sense the word is taken properly , but in another sense and for another thing then in the later . but in the later it is taken tropically , viz. synedochically , it being but a covenant drawn up and consented to by god conditionally , and offered to us for our con●ent . it is the same covenant that is offered to us and not another , that we are called to consent to or enter in , and we cannot be truly said to enter into covenant with god if we make a new one of our own , and lay by his ; for that 's none of the covenant of god : he never offered it , nor will he ever enter it . we are i hope agreed what the covenant of grace is , as offered on gods part ( or else its great pity ; ) viz. that on the title of cre●●●n first and redemption after , we being absolutely his own , it is offered to us , that god will be our god ( our chief good and reconciled father in christ ) that christ will be our saviour ( by propitiation teaching and ruling us ) even from the guilt , filth , or power of sin , that the holy ghost will be our indwelling sanctifier , if we heartily or sincerely accept the gift and offer , that god will consent to be our god , christ to be our jesus christ , and the holy ghost to be our in-dwelling sanctifier , if we will but consent . this is no doubt the gift or covenant so offered . these things being thus premised , i come to prove not onely the inseparability but even the identity of heart covenan●ing and saving faith , and of signal external covenanting and the profession of saving faith , without which we must not baptize any . pag. 79. argum. 5. we must not baptize any without the profession of that faith and repentance which are made the condition of remission of sins . but infants make no profession of that faith and repentance which are made the condition of remission of sins , therefore no infants are to be baptized ; the minor is manifest by sense , and the major i prove thus . if we must not baptize any but intentionally for present remission of sin , then must not we baptize any without a profession of that faith and repentance which is the condition of remission . but the former is true , therefore so is the ●uer ; the consequence is past all doubt , for else we should imagine that men may have present actual pardon without that faith and repentance which are the condition of it , which subverteth much of the gospel . the antecedent i prove thus : if god hath instituted no baptism , but what is intentionally for the present remission of sin , then we must not baptize any but intentionally for the present remission of sin : but the former is true , therefore so is the later . i say [ intentionally ] in contradistinction from [ eventually , or certainly and infallibly attaining that end ] where further note , that i speak not of gods absolute decrees , as if his intention in that sense could be frustrate ; but of his ends as legislator speaking of him after the manner of men , but principally of the instituted end of his ordinances ; that is , the ends which he requireth the minister and people to use them for , and so it is our intention principally that i mention . as the gospel it self is said to be intentionally to save men , and though it condemn most , that is besides the first intention and but by accident ; and though this be principally to be spoken of the prae-imposed intentions of their conversion and salvation ; yet christ is pleased in the word to ascribe such intentions to himself as attain not their ends , as professing that he came not into the world to condemn the world , but that the world through him migh be saved : that is , to condemn them is not his direct principal intent , but onely on supposition of their wilfull final rejecting of him ; and thus he speaks partly in the habit of a rector or promiser , and partly as man , or after the manner of men : and of the intention imposed on us there is no doubt . now i shall prove the antecedent ( for the consequence is past doubt : ) and first we are confirmed in this truth , because the opponent ( whom it concerneth ) hath not proved any other baptism instituted by god , but what is for present re●ission of sins . if they can shew us one text of scripture that speaketh of any other , we shall give up all the cause ; but yet they have not done it that i know of . in the mean time we shall prove the contrary , god hath instituted but one baptism : that one baptism is for the present remission of sins , therefore god hath instituted no baptism but what is for present remission . the major is proved from ephes. 4. 5. there is one baptism . in the minor we take the words [ for remission ] not to speak of somewhat accidental , or to be intended onely by the administrator , uncertainly or but sometime . and i prove it from scripture , acts 2. 38. repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of jesus christ for the remission of sins , and ye shall receive the gift of the holy ghost , as remission is here made the end of baptism so it is present remission . for 1. it is such as is the consequent of the repentance which peter exhorteth them to , but that was present remission . 2. it was to precede the giving of the holy ghost in the sense there mentioned , therefore it was present remission . beza in loc. upon the place , saith , [ in nomen christi ] id est dans christo nomen , cujus mortis , scpulturae ac resurrectionis simus in baptizo participes , cum peccatorum remissione , nec enim hoc declarat formulam baptismi s●d finem & scopum . in the name of christ , that is , giving our name to christ , of whose death , burial , and resurrection , we are made partakers in baptism , with the forgiveness of sins , for this doth not declare the form of baptism , but the end and scope . so deodate [ in the name ] viz. [ not onely for a mark of our profession of the gospel , but also to participate of his spiritual virtue in the washing away of our sins , with which he accompanieth and ratifieth the external ceremony in those who are his ] bullinger in loc. saith , baptiz●ri in nomine domini jesu christi , est baptismatis signo testari se christo credere ad remissionem peccatorum . to be baptized in the name of the lord jesus christ , is by the sign of baptism , to testifie that we believe in christ for the remission of sins . 1. mark , it is not onely an engagement to believe hereafter , but the profession of a present faith . 2. and that not a common faith , but that which hath remission of sin . 3. and this was not an accidental separable use of baptism ; but he makes this the very exposition of baptizari in nomine jesu christi , to be baptized in the name of jesus christ . and thus he expoundeth the covenant , [ est enim baptismus pactum seu foedus gratiae , quod init inter baptizandum nobiscum christus ] for baptism is an agreement or covenant of grace , which christ enters into with us , when we are baptized . and that it is a professing sign of our true repentance , he shews before [ & rectissime conjungitur paenitentia & baptismus , quia baptismus paenitentiae signum est ] and most rightly is repentance and baptism joyned together , between baptism is the sign of repentance . calvin in loc. upon the place , per baptismum ( ut paulus docet ) crucifigitur vetus homo noster , ut in vitae novitatem resurgamus , by baptism ( as paul teacheth ) our old man is crucified , that we may rise to newness of life . rom. 6. 4. 8. item indutmus christum ipsum , g●l . 3. 27. 1 cor. 12. & passim docet scriptura esse paenitentiae quoque symbolum . also we put on christ himself , and the scripture doth up and down teach it , to be also a badge of repentance . calvin on acts 22. 16. non dubium est quin fideliter rudimentis pietatis paulum imbuerit ananias ; neque enim ver● fidei expertem baptizasset , nor doubt but ananias did faithfully instruct pa●l in the rudiments of piety , neither would he have baptize● him ▪ if he had been void of true faith . john 3. 5. [ except a man be born of water and of the spirit , he shall not enter into the kingdome of god ] though we are agreed against the papists , that christ intendeth not here to place the same necessity in baptism , as there is in or of the new birth by the spirit ; yet it is by most acknowledged , that christ doth here speak of the new birth as signified by baptism , and so hath respect to baptism , as the ordinary confirming sign : and so the text fully sheweth us , that baptism is instituted to be the sign of our present regeneration , or else it could not be said that we must be born [ of water and the spirit . ] calvin saith , most are of chrysostomes mind , who took it to be meant of baptism : ( and so did the generality of ancient expositors ) and though himself and some more think otherwise , yet as long as they take it to be a metonymical expression , the sign being put for the thing signified , it doth as well acquaint us with the use of baptism , as if it were a proper speech . bullinger in loc ▪ upon the place , saith [ hanc christi sententiam omnes pene de baptismo interpretantur ] almost all interpret this scripture of christ to baptism . beza believeth , that the text speaketh of baptism either christs or some other , but rather christs , justly doth beza in mark 1. 4. fall upon erasmus sharply , for saying [ {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} [ in ] praep●sitio praeparationem significat , non effectum : the preposition in , signifieth a preparation , and not the effect : because repentance and remission ( saith beza ) cannot be separated ; so that he took it not to be a common preparatory repentance or baptism . piscator on mark . 14. saith , it s called the baptism of repentance for remission of sin , because john preached remission of sin to the penitent and believers , praecip iebatque ut inhujus rei testimontum atque professionem baptizarentur . he concluded that they should be baptized , in testimony and profession of this thing ; and that is called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} the baptism of repentance , id est , qui resipiscentiae testificandae atque profitenda adbibebatur : neque enim baptizabat nisi eos qui confessione peccatorum ●dita , resipiscentiam suam testatam reddebant : caeterum nomine resipiscentiae per synecdochen membri simul intelligenda est fides in christum , that is to say , was used to testifie and profess repentance ; neither did he baptize any but those who by confession of their sins testified their repentance , but by a synecdoche of a part for the whole , is also to be understood , faith in christ , and on matth. 3. 11. observe he shews that christs baptism and johns are the same , in that both have the same end and use , viz. obsignatio remissionis peccatorum & resipiscentiae , the sealing of remission of sins and repentance ; that is , as already extant , as his judgement is oft delivered ; as in his schol. on ver. 11. he expresly faith [ in resipiscentiam , id est in testimonium resipiscentiae ; ut nimi●um susceptione baptismi testatum faciatis vor resipuisse , & indies magis ac magis resipiscere velle : sed simul hic intelligendum , joannem baptizasse quoque in remissionem peccatorum , hoc est ut nimirum nomine dei testatum faceret resipiscentibus & in christum credentibus peccata ipsis remissa esse propter christum agnum dei ] unto repentance , that is , in testimony of repentance , viz. that by receiving of baptism you testifie that you have repented , and that you will daily renew your repentance more and more ; but withal we must here understand , that john did baptize also for the remission of sins , that is , that he might testifie in the name of god , to the penitents and believers in christ , that their sins were forgiven them for the sake of christ the lamb of god . and i pray mark his observation on mat. 3. 6. 8. 10 concluding our present question : [ baptismus nulli adulto conferendus est nisi prius ediderit confessionem peccatorum & fidei in christum , ac praterea promissionem sanctae vitae ] baptism is not to be administred to any of age , unless he first make confession of his sins , and of his faith in christ , and besides a promise of a holy life , which he proves . calvin on matth. 3. 6. saith [ ergo ut se rite ad baptismum offerant homines , peccatorum confessio ab illis requiritur , alioqui nihil quam inane esset ludicrum tota actio ] therefore that men may rightly offer themselves to baptism , confession of sins is required of men , otherwise the whole action would be nothing else but sport . if i had charged the guilty so of making the whole work of baptism ludicrous , they would have been highly offended ( and yet paedobaptists do so . ) paraeus on matth. 3. 5. shews that the order was that confession as a testimony of true repentance go first , and then baptism for remission of sins [ confessio postponitur ; sed {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} constructionis — confessi baptizabantur : pro , cum con●essi essent peccata , baptismum accipiebant sacramentum remissionis peccatorum : non prius baptizabantur , postea confitebantur — auditores igitur primo in testimonium resipiscentiae confitebantur sua peccata , deinde baptizabantur , tertio fide baptismi fructum suscipiebant remissionem peccatorum . docet hic locus varia . 1. quod baptismus sit sacramentum remissionis peccatorum , ex parte dei ; spondet enim deus ceu ju rejurande baptizatis remissionem gratuitam peccatorum propter christum . 2. quod sit etiam sacramentum resipiscentiae ex parte nostra ; restipulamur enim deo fidem & paenitentiam pro tanto beneficio . confession is put after , but in construction the first is to be last ; those who confessed were baptized , for when they confessed their sins , they received baptism , a sacrament of the forgiveness of their sins ; they were not baptized first , and confessed their sins after , the hearers then first confessed their sins in testimony of their repentance , then they were baptized , thirdly by faith they received the fruit of baptism ; the remission of sins : this place teacheth divers things . 1. that baptism is a sacrament of the forgiveness of sins , on gods part , for god promiseth as by an oath , to those who are baptized , a free pardon of sin for christs sake : 2. that it is also a sacrament of repentance on our part , for we again engage to god , faith and repentance , for so great a benefit ; that is , both profess it at present , and ingage to continue in it ; answering the interrogation credis ? with a credo , and not onely a credam . doest thou believe ; i do believe in the present tense , and not onely i will believe , in the future . ad sacramenta non esse admittendos impenitentes . hoc enim damus ( anabaptistis ) in ecclesiam suscipiendos & baptizandes non esse nisi praevia confessione fidei & paenitentiae : quem morem & vetus servavit ecclesia , & nostrae hodei observant , si vel judaeus vel turca adults baptismo sit ▪ initiandus . impenitents are not to be admitted to the sacraments : for this we grant to the anabaptists , that such are not to be required into the church , nor to be baptized , who have not first made confession of faith and repentance , which custom both the ancient church did observe , and ours observe at this day , if either a jew or a turk of age is to be admitted by baptism . and on verse 7. he saith , ex concione ipsa datur intelligi , multos illorum simulata paenitentia etiam baptismum petivisse : horum hypocrisin cum non ignoraret , non passus eos latere in turba , nec ad baptismum indignos admisit , sed acri objurgatione , hortatione & comminatione ad seriam resipiscentiam extimulat , & ad baptismum praeparat . from the sermon it self it s to be understood , many of them also required baptism by a feigned repentance , when as he understood their hypocrisie , he suffered them not to lurk in the croud , neither admitted he to baptism those that were unworthy of it , but stirs them up to a serious repentance , by sharp reprehension , exhorting and threatning , and so prepares them unto baptism ; after he shews , that there are hypocritae manifesti quos pastores admittere non debent sine examine , ne sacramenta prostituant , sibi & ecclesiae reatum attrahant , manifest hypocrites , whom pastors ought not to admit without examination , least they prostitute the sacraments , and contract guilt to themselves and the church . and pag. 56. against maldonate he proveth the baptism of christ and john all one ; and when maldonate saith , that john baptized in panitentiam , & baptismus praecedebat , paenitentia sequebatur , unto repentance , and that baptism went before , and repentance followed , ( confessing that in christs baptism repentance precedes ) he answereth [ that it is faise , nam etiam in joannis baptismo praecedebat paenitentiae , sequebatur baptismus ] for repentance did also precede in johns baptism , and baptism followed . 2 pet. 1. 9. it is said of the barren ungodly professor [ that he hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins , ] where i take it for a clear case , that it is the baptismal washing which the apostle there intendeth , wherein all profess to put off the old man , and to be washed from their former filthiness ; for i suppose we shall be loath to yield that it was an actual cleansing either of remission or mortification , which the apostle meaneth , lest we grant that men may fall from such a state ; and therefore it must be a sacramental washing , or cleansing , wherein the matter was appearingly and sacramentally transacted . from whence it is plain that the apostle took it for granted , that as all the baptized were visibly church-members , so were they all visibly washed from their old sins ; which sheweth both what was their own profession , and what was the stated end and use of the ordinance . the apostle saith not that [ he hath forgotten that he promised or engaged to be purged from his old sins ] but that [ he was purged ] from them . paraeus in locum , upon the place , saith , [ a veteribus peccatis purgatum , hoc est se esse baptizatum , seu se accepisse in baptismo purgationis signaculum . omnes enim baptizati debent purgari a peccatis , sicut dicuntur induere christum , gal. 3. mori cum christo , rom. 6. sensus est , qui se volutant in sceleribus , non recordantur se baptizatos esse , abnegant ergo baptismum suum ] that he was purged from his old sins , that is , was baptized , or had received in baptism the seal of purging , for all those who are baptized , ought to be purged from their sins , as they are said to put on christ , to die with christ , the meaning is , they which wallow in their sins , do not remember they were baptized , and therefore do renounce their baptism . 1 cor. 6. 11. the apostle saith of the visible church of corinth [ such were some of you , but ye are washed , but ye are sanctified , but ye are justified , &c. ] where it is evident , that all the visible members of the church are visibly washed , sanctified , justified : and i think it is clear that by washing here he hath some respect to their baptism . so that i conclude that there is no baptism to be administred without a profession of saving faith and repentance foregoing , because there is no baptism that ever christ appointed but what is for the obsignation of remission of sins , which is the consequent . master blake , pag. 171. reciteth some words of mine containing this argument , thus ; that faith to which the promise of remission and justification is made , must also be sealed to : or that faith which is the condition of the promise , is the condition in foro de● , in the court of god , of the title to the seal : but it is onely solid true faith that is the condition of the promise of remission ; therefore it is that which gives right in foro dei , in the court of god , to the seal . who would think now but master blake had given some substantial answer to this and other arguments , when himself and some others are so confident of the sufficiency of them ? his answer is this : [ to this i have answered , faith is not sealed to , but remission of sins or salvation upon condition of faith ; and when i come to speak of the sealing of sacraments , i shall ( god willing ) make this more evident , that the sacrament qua seal immediately respects our priviledges , not duties ] reply 1. is here one word of answer to any real part of this argument . is not this answer as little to the matter , as if he had talked of another subject . i think it my duty to say that ministers of the gospel do but proclaim to the church the matter of our common lamentation , and the enemies joy , when some confidently publish such kind of disputations , and others are satisfied with them ; and i must say if all were such , they should never be angred with one word of mine in opposition to their assertions , though they would maintain that the crow is white . 2. to that useless touch that he hath on a word ( whose following explication might have spared him his labour ) i may say that our divines have ordinarily maintained hitherto that there is a mutual covenanting between god and us , ( and no man more then master blake ) and that there is in the sacrament a mutual sealing ; the receiving being our seal , as the act is gods . pag. 88. argum. 6. if baptism be instituted to be a seal of the righteousness of that faith which we have yet being unbaptized , then must we baptize none that profess not a justifying faith . but no infants profess a justifying faith , therefore we must baptize no infants ; the minor is manifest by sense . the reason of the consequence is evident , in that we must use baptism onely according to its nature and to its instituted ends : the antecedent is proved thus : circumcision was instituted to be a seal of the righteousness of that faith which we have yet unbaptized . the consequence will not be denied by them whom we now deal with : because they confesse that baptism succeedeth circumcision . the antecedent is evident in rom. 4. 11. it being expresly said of abraham to whom circumcision was first given . i cannot imagine what they will say , unless it be by recourse to the anabaptists shift , to say that circumcision was instituted to this end indeed , to abraham himself , and others that were sincere , but not to all that had right to it ; but god here tells us the established use and end of his ordinance , and in such relations , the end is inseparable . and as god hath not made many sorts of baptisms or circumcisions : so neither many meer inconsistent ends ( or separable ) and we are likest to know the true end of the institution , where the institution and first example are reported to us . calvin in loc. saith , duae denique ut baptismi hodie sunt , ita olim circumcisionis erant partes , nempe , tam vitae novitatem , quam peccatorum remissionem testari : lastly , as there are two parts at this day of baptism , so of old there were two of circumcision , viz. to witness , as newness of life , so forgiveness of sins . saith piscator , in loc. upon the place , sicut olim circumcisio signum suit faeleris gratiae , & figillum quo credentibus obsignata fuit justitia fidei , hoc est , quo illi certiores sunt redditi , sibi remssa esse peccata , propter futuram satisfactionem christi , ac proinde se babere deam propitium ac foventem ; ita caetera quoque sacramenta , &c. similiter & finis seu scopus omnium sacramentorum unus idemque , viz. obsignatio justitiae fidei , quae vulgo dicitur fidei confirmatio . paraeus in loc. saith [ ita signum fuit dantis & accipientis respectu , &c. ] et [ justitia fidei est remissio peccatorum fide accepta propter redemptionem christi ] et [ sic sacramenta non sunt instituta justificandis , sed justificatis , hoc est non infidelibus sed conversis , non igiturnisi conversione & fide sumi debent : secus sigilla justitiae esse cessant : quid enim non babentibus fidem & justitiam obsignarent ? as circumcision was of old a sign of the covenant of grace , and a seal whereby was sealed the righteousness of faith to believers , that is to say , whereby they were certified that their sins were forgiven them , by receiving of the future satisfaction of christ , and therefore they had god propitious and favouring unto them , so also the other sacraments , &c. also the end or scope of all the sacraments is as one and the same , viz. the signing of the righteousness of faith , which is commonly called the confirmation of faith , so it was a sign both in respect of the giver , and receiver , &c. and the righteousness of faith is the forgiveness of sins by faith , received because of christs redemption , and so the sacraments are not instituted for those who are to be justified , but for the justified , that is , not for unbelievers , but for those which are converted , therefore are they not to be taken without conversion and saith , otherwise they were to be seals of righteousness , for what would it seal to them , who have not faith and repentance ? doctor willet , in loc. saith [ circumcision then did not confer upon him that grace which he had not , but did confirm and establish him in the grace and faith received : the sacraments then non instituta sunt justificandis , sed justificatis , are not instituted for those which are to be justified , but for them which are already justified parae . ] peter martyr is large , and makes these words rom. 4. 11. of paul to be the definition of a sacrament , to be a seal of the righteousness of faith . pag. 91. argum 7. we must baptize none but those that are first professed disciples of christ . but none are professed disciples of christ that profess not saving saith in christ , therefore we may not baptize any that profess not saving faith in christ : but no infant doth profess saving faith in christ , as is manifest by sense ; therefore no infant is a professed disciple of christ , nor must we baptize any . the major is proved from matth. 28. 19. go , disciple me all nations baptizing them ] as for those that say , they are discipled by baptizing , and not before baptizing , 1. they speak not the sense of that text . 2. nor that which is true or rational , if they mean it absolutely as so spoken , else why should one be baptized more then another ? 3. but if they mean that by heart-covenant or gods acceptance and promise they are disciples before , but not so compleatly till the covenant be sealed and solemnized , as a souldier is not so signally a souldier till he be listed , nor a king till he be crowned so fully a king , or a man and woman so fully maried till it be solemnized in the congregation ; in this sense they say the same that i am proving : men must be first disciples by the professed consent , before they are declared such by the seals or publick sacramental solemnization . and that onely the professors of saving saith are disciples , may appear by a perusal of the texts of scripture that use this word , and it will not onely by found that this which i maintain is the ordinary use of the word ( which should make it so also with us ) but that no text can be cited where any others are called the disciples of christ . for the major and minor both observe piscators definition of baptism [ on matth 28. 19. ] baptismus est sacrimentum novi testamenti , quo homines ad ecclesiam pertinentes ex mandato christi cultui veri dei , qui est pater , filius & spiritus sarctus per ministros verbi consecrantur , & in fide remissionis peccatorum & spe vitae aternae confirmantur . baptism is a sacrament of the new testament , by which those men who belong to the church , by the command of christ , are consecrated to the worship of the true god , which is the father , son , and holy spirit , by the ministers of the word , and are confirmed in the faith of remission of sins , and of hope of eternal life . and he proveth this description , per partes , by parts . 1. that is a sacrament . 2. that it belongeth to those that pertain to that church , and that onely must be baptized , qui ecclesiam fuerit ingressi , ac fidem evangelii prosessi , who are entred into the church , and have professed the faith of the gospel . which he proveth from mark 16. 16. he that believeth , and is baptized shall be saved . vult ergo ( saith he ) ut prius constet de alicujus fide quam baptizetur , unde act. 8. philippus evangelista non prius baptizare voluit eunuchum illum ethiopem quam is professus esse● fidem christi . he wills therefore , that his faith be manifested , before he be baptized , whence acts. 8. philip the evangelist would not baptize the ethiopian ennuch , before he had professed the faith of christ . calvin in loc. upon the place , saith [ bapti●●ri jubet christus qui nomen evangelii dederint , s●que professi fuerint discipulos , partim ut illis baptismus si● vitae aeternae tessera coram deo ; partim apud homines externum fidei signum : quem ad modum gratiam suam deus hoc sigillo nobis confirmat , ita quicunque se ad baptismum offerunt , vicissim quasi data syngrapha obstringunt s●am sidem ] christ commands them to be baptized , who have given up their names to the gospel , and have professed to be his disciples , partly that baptism might be to them a sign of eternal life before god , partly an external sign of faith before men , and as god confirms his grace to us by this seal , so whosoever offers himself to baptism , doth reciprocally engage his faith as it were by his bond . and after [ verum quia docere prius jubet christus quam baptizare , & tantum credentes ad baptismum vult recipi , videtur non rite administrari baptismus nisi fides pracesserit ] but because christ commands first to teach , then to baptize , and onely will have believers to be received to baptism , it seems that baptism is not rightly administred , unless faith doth precede . so that it is calvins judgement , that this very text which is the most notable copy of the apostolical commission for the baptizing of the disciple nations doth appoint that saving faith be professed before men be baptized . paraeus in locum , from mark 16. 16. sheweth that the order is , ●redere & baptizari , to believe and to be baptized . i agree with him and the rest in the main , that justifying faith must be an act of the will ( embracing or accepting an offered christ ) as well as of the understanding , and that the profession of it must go before baptism . but i shall further prove the minor from some other texts of scripture , viz. that they are not christs disciples that profess not saving faith . luke 14 26 , 27 , 33. [ if any man come to me and hate not his father and mother , and wife and children , and brothers and sisters ; yea , and his own life also , he cannot be my disciple : and whosoever doth not bear his cross , and come after me , cannot be my disciple : whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath , cannot be my disciple ] this is spoken of true disciples in heart ( the first significatum ) by him that knew the heart . from whence i argue thus : [ if none are christs disciples in heart , nor can be , but those that value him above all , and will forsake all for him if he require it , then none can be his disciples by external profession , but those that profess to esteem him above all , and to be willing to forsake all rather then forsake him : but the former is proved by the text ; the consequence is clear , in that the world hath hitherto been acquainted but with two sorts of christians , or disciples of christ ; the one such sincerely in heart , and the other such by profession , and the later are so called because they profess to be what the other are indeed , and what themselves are if they sincerely so profess . and it is the same thing professed which makes a man a professed christian , which being found in the heart doth make a man a hearty christian . john 13. 35. [ by this shall all men know that ye are my disciples , if ye love one another ] here christ giveth a certain badge by which his true disciples may be known . if onely those that love one another are true disciples in heart , then onely those that profess to love one another are disciples by profession . joh. 8. 31. if ye continue in my word then are ye ( that is you will approve your selves ) my disciples indeed ] if onely those are christs disciples indeed as to the heart , that have the resolution of perseverance , then onely those are his professed disciples that profess a resolution to persevere . but therefore all this i have said , is no more then we have ever practised , when in baptism we renounced the world , flesh , and devil , and promised to fight under christs banner to our lives end . saith piscator in john 13. 35. si pro christianis , id est , christi discipulis haberi volumus , oportet ut nos mutuo quam ardentisaime diligamus , &c. if we will be accounted christians , that is , christs disciples , we ought most ardently to love one another . object . any one is a disciple that is willing to learn of christ . answ. no such matter : in an improper sense you may so call them , but not in scripture sense ; where 1. a disciple and a christian are all one , acts 11. 26. but every one that is willing to learn of christ is not a christian , therefore not a disciple . 2. a disciple of christ is one that will take him for the great prophet of the church [ which whosoever heareth not shall be cut off from gods people ] and will learn of him as of the christ : but so will not all that will learn of him : for a man that taketh christ but for a common wise man , as socrates or plato may be willing to learn of him : and so may be his disciple in another sense , but not in the christian sense as a christian . pag. 96. argum. 8. we ought not to baptize those persons that do not so much as profess their forsaking of the childhood and kingdom of the devil : but no infant doth profess its forsaking of the childhood and kingdom of the devil , as is manifest by sense , therefore we ought to baptize no infant . the maior is proved thus : if we must baptize none but for present admission into the kingdom of christ , then we must baptize none but those that promise a present departure from the kingdom of the devil ; but the former is true , therefore so is the later . the antecedent is granted by those that i have to do with ; the reason of the consequence is evident , in that all the world is divided into these two kingdomes , and they are so opposite that there is no passing into one but from the other . the minor of the first argument i prove thus . all they are visiby in the kingdom of the devil , or not so much as by profession removed out of it , who profess not a removal from that condition in which the wrath of god abideth on them , and they are excluded by the gospel from everlasting life , but such are all that profess not a justifying faith . the major is proved , in that it is the condition of the covenant of grace performed that differenceth the members of christs kingdom from satans ; and so it is that condition profest to be performed that visibly differenceth them before men . it is the promise of grace that bringeth them out of satans kingdome , therefore it is onely done visibly to those that profess the performance of the condition : moreover to be out of satans kingdom visibly , is to be visibly from under his government , but those that profess not saving faith are not visibly from under his government . lastly , to be visibly out of satans kingdom , is to be visibly freed from his power , as the executioner of gods eternal vengeance ; but so are none that profess not saving faith . the minor is proved from john 3. 36. where it is plain , 1. that the unbelief spoken of is that which is opposed to saving faith , even to that saith which hath here the promise of everlasting life , 2. and that this leaves them visibly under the wrath of god . so in mark 16. 16. compared with matth. 27. 19. in the later christ bids them make him disciples , and in the former he describeth those that are such , and those that remain still in the kingdom of satan [ he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved , and he that believeth not shall be damned ] here it is evident that the unbelief threatned is that which is contrary to [ and even the privation of ] the faith that salvation is expresly promised to , and that all that profess not this saving faith are not so much as professedly escaped a state of damnation , and that this is the differencing character of christs disciples to be baptized [ of which yet more afterwards . ] pag. 98. argum. 9. if it be the appointed use of all christian baptism to solemnize our mariage with christ , or to seal or confirm our union with him , or ingraffing into him , then must we baptize none that profess not justifying faith [ because this is necessarily prerequisite , and no other can pretend to union , mariage or ingraffing into christ ] but no infant doth profess justifying faith , as is manifest by sense ; therefore we must baptize no infant . both the antecedent and consequent are evident in gal. 3. 27 , 28 , 29. for as many of you as have been baptized in christ , have put on christ : ye are all one in christ jesus , and if ye be christs then are ye abrahams seed , and heirs according to promise . here 1. we see that it is not an accidental or separable thing for baptism to be our visible entrance into christ , our putting him on , our admittance ( by solemnization ) into the state of gods children and heirs according to promise . for this is affirmed of all the baptized with true christian baptism . if we be truely baptized , we are baptized into christ , if we are baptized into christ , then we are christs , and have put on christ , and are all one in christ , and are abrahams seed , and heirs according to promise . if any object that the apostle speaks this but of some of them , even of the regenerate , because he saith [ as many of you ] i answer , it is manifest that he speaks of all , 1. because it was of all them that were baptized into christ , 2. he expresly saith as much in the next foregoing words [ ver . 26. for ye are all the children of god by faith in christ jesus ] to which the words recited are annexed as the proof [ for as many of you as have been baptized into christ , have put on christ ] the assumption is implied [ but you have all been baptized into christ ] therefore ye have all put on christ , and so in him are all the children of god . 2. note that they are the special gifts of saving grace that are here ascribed to all the baptized . 3. note also that all this is said and proved to be by faith . 4. note also that it is expresly said to be a justifying faith , before vers . 24. [ that we might be justified by faith . ] indeed this text affordeth us divers arguments . 1. the apostle supposeth all the baptized to profess a justifying faith , among the galatians , therefore so must we suppose of others , and expect that they do it . the antecedent is proved from vers . 24 , 25 , and 27. compared . 2. all the baptized are said to have put on christ , therefore they are supposed to profess that faith by which christ is put on : but that is onely justfying faith . 3. all that are duely baptized are baptized into christ , therefore they are supposed to profess that faith by which men are united , or ingraffed into christ , but that is onely justifying faith ; but the rest of the arguments here will be further touched on anon . master rutherford saith that scripture no where calleth christ the head of the visible church as such , as it is after cited . i conclude then that christ hath app●inted no baptism but what is for a visible mariage of the soul to himself ( as protestants ordinarily confess ) therefore he hath appointed no baptism but for those that profess to take jesus christ for their husband , and to give up themselves to him as his espouse : but this is a profession of justifying faith , for heartily to take christ for our head and husband is true saving faith , and proper to his own regenerate pecple if any thing in the world be so ; and no man can profess to be maried to christ that doth not profess to take him for a husband . therefore for my part i never intend to baptize any without profession of saving faith , amen . and let the lord god say so too , that mr. b●xter may baptize no more infants , nor defend so palpable an abuse , but may wipe away the reproach he hath cast on gods people and ordinance : he goes on thus . pag. 100. argum. 10. if paul account all the baptized saints or sanctified men dead with christ and risen with him , such as have put on christ , sons of god by adoption , abrahams seed , heirs according to promise and justified ; then they did all profess a true justifying faith . but no infant did profess a true justifying faith : if they did let it be sh●wed when , and where , and to whom : therefore no infant was then baptized , nor are now to be . the antecedent master blake confesseth , and i shall prove it by parts . the consequence is that which lyeth chiefly on me to prove , and i shall do both together . the apostle in the beginning of his epistle to the corinthians , and in many other places calls the whole church saints , 1 cor. 6. 11. he saith to them [ but ye are washed , ye are sanctified ] that part of the antecedent then is certain ; the consequene i prove thus . there are none called saints in all the new testament , but onely such as were in heart devoted to christ by a saving faith , or professed so much , therefore the word saint in this case must signifie onely such . if any will prove a third sort of saints , viz. such as profess a faith not saving , they must do that which i never saw done . the first and most famous signification of the word saints or sanctified in the new testament , is onely of them that are in heart devoted to christ by true faith ; therefore the borrowed , or analogical , or less proper signification ( call it what you list ) must be of that which hath the likeness or appearance of this , and that is onely the profession of it . profession maketh saints visible , or by profession , as hearty dedication to god by faith maketh real or heart saints . master blake addeth [ we read of churches of the saints , 1 cor. 14. 33. and they were taken to be church-members as soon as they made profession , as they ceased to be jews or pagans , and took them to the way of christianity , as we see , acts 2. acts 8. 12. 13. 38. ] answ. 1. they renounced the way of ungodliness , and wickedness in general by a profession of repentance , as well as the way of paganism and judaism in particular . there were no christians that professed not repentance towards god from dead works 2. we believe that there were churches of the saints , and therefore that none should be of the church that profess not to be true saints . but prove if you can that there was ever either church or church-member called saints in scripture , that had not either special sanctity or a profession of it . and as for those acts 8. you cannot prove that any of them were either called saints or baptized without a profession of a justifying faith : as shall further be shewed afterwards . the galatians i find not called saints , but to call them a church of christ or believers is equipollent : and what saints were they ? why they were all the sons of god by faith in christ jesus , having been baptized into christ , and put him on , and were all one in him , and were all abrahams seed and heirs according to the promise , gal. 3. 26 , 27 , 29. a church in scripture sense , is a society of men professing true saving faith . and thus we see what a church was , and what saints were , and what believers and disciples were supposed to be by the apostles , and what is the signification of these words in scripture , for they are all of the same extent . thus much i have said to prove that all the baptized are accounted saints , and therefore professed a saving sanctity . the second title which i mentioned follows ( of which i shall be more brief ) all the baptized are accounted to be dead and risen with christ , even dead to sin , and risen to newness of life ; therefore they all profess a saving faith . the proof of this is full in the two texts already cited , rom. 6. and col. 2. 11 , 12. rom. 6. 3. &c. how shall we that are dead to sin live any longer therein ? know ye not that so many of us as were baptized into jesus christ , were baptized into his death ? therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death , that like as christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the father , so we also should walk in newness of life . for if we have been planted together into the likeness of his death , we shall be also in the likeness of his resurection , knowing this that our old man is crucified with him , that the body of sin might be destroyed , that hence forth we should not serve sin ; for he that is dead is freed from sin . now if we be dead with christ , we believe that we shall also live with him . likewise , reckon ye also your selves to be dead indeed unto sin , but alive unto god through jesus christ our lord . here is a full report of the use of baptism , and the profession of all that are baptized , and the state they are supposed to be in . so that i cannot speak it plainlyer then the words themselves do . so col. 2. 11 , 12. which i shall not stay to recite , because it is to the same purpose , and before cited . the third title mentioned in the argument is this : all that are baptized have professedly put on christ ; therefore they have professed saving faith . the antecedent is expressed gal. 3. 23. [ for as many as have been baptized into christ have put on christ ] the consequence is proved in that to put on christ heartily , is to be made true partakers of him , and living members of him , therefore to profess this is inseperable from the profession of saving faith ; yea by that faith he is truly put on . putting on christ is the same with [ putting on the new man , which after god is created in righteousness and true holiness , being renewed in the spirit of our minds , ephes. 4. 20 , 21 , 22 , 23 , 24. col. 3. 10. it is putting on the new man which is renewed in knowledge according to the image of him that created him ] and putting on the lord jesus christ is put for the state of sanctity in opposition to a fleshly life , rom. 13. 13 , 14. saith calvin on this text [ induere christum bic significat virtute spiritus ejus undique nos muniri , qua idonei ad omnes sanctitatis partes reddamur : sic enim in nobis instauratur imago dei quae unicum est animae ornamentum . respicit enim paulus ad vocationis nostrae finem , quia deus nos adoptans in corpus unigenti filii sui inserit , & quidem hac lege , ut nos abdicantes priore vita fiamus in ipso novi homines . quare etiam alibi fideles dicit christum induere in baptismo , gal. 3. 27. ] to put on christ signifies here to be defended in all points with the virtue of the spirit , whereby we may be fit for all parts of holiness , for thus the image of god is renewed in us , which is the onely ornament of the soul , for paul hath respect to the end of our vocation , because god adopting us , hath ingraffed us in the body of his onely begotten son , and that upon those terms , if we deny our former life , and become new men in him : wherefore he saith elsewhere , that believers put on christ in baptism . and upon gal. 3. 27. he saith [ quum dicit , christum induisse , intelligit christo sic esse infitos ; ut coram deo nomen ac personam christi gerant , ac in ipso magis quam in seipsis censcantur . when he saith they have put on christ , he understands that they are so ingraffed in christ , that they carry that name and person of christ in the sight of god , and are rather reckoned in him , then in themselves . and he comes to the objection , how all that are baptized can be said to put on christ , when baptism is not effectual with all ? and he answereth in summe , that to hypocrites it is uneffectual , qui nudis signis superbiunt , who are proud with the bare signs . but then he saith , that the apostle speaking of these non resspicit dei institutionem , sed impiorum corruptelam . he hath no respect to gods institution , but to the corruption of the wicked . ( but doubtless it is gods institution that we must look to in our administration ) qaum autem fideles alloquitur , qui rite utuntur illa , tunc conjungit cum sua veritate , quam figurant . quare ? neque enim fallacem pompam ostentat in sacramentis , sed quae externa caremonia figurat , exhibet simul reipsa . hinc fit , ut veritas , secundum dei institutum , conjuncta sit cum signis ] but when he speaks to believers , who use it rightly , he joyns them with their truth , which they typifie . wherefore ? for he doth not make shew of a deceitful pomp in the sacraments , but what the external ceremony figures , he exhibites together in very deed . hence it comes to pass that truth , according to gods institution , is joyned with the signs . to the same purpose say other protestants . the next title mentioned in the argument was , sons of god . all that are baptized are the visible or esteemed sons of god by saith in christ ; therefore they all profess that justifying faith to which that real or special sonship is promised . the antecedent is expressed in gal. 3 , 26 , 27. [ for ye are all the sons of god by saith in christ jesus ] which he proveth in the next words [ for as many as have been baptized into christ , have put on christ ] what sons of god are in scripture sense may be seen , john 1. 12. rom. 8. 14 , 15. phil. 2. 15. 2 john 3. 1 , 2. gal. 4. 1 , 2 , 5 , 7. and rom. 8. 17. [ if sons , then heirs , heirs of god , and joynt heirs with christ ] was a good consequence in pauls judgement [ in this ( saith john ) the children of god are manifest from the children of the devils : whosoever doth not righteousness is not of god , neither he that loveth not his brother , 1 john 3. 10. see also john 11. 52. rom. 8. 16. 21. but master blake objecteth rom. 9. 4. [ to them pertained the adoption ] and gomarus his comment . answ. 1. gomarus saith not , that any were in either sense sons of god without a profession of a saving faith . 2. it was not after their unchurching or unbelief , that the adoption is said to pertain to them , but before , and then , let master blake prove [ if he can ] that any israelites were adopted without profession of that faith , which was then saving : i doubt not to prove the contrary anon . and 3. if he could prove that such there were among the israelites , yet he will never prove that they are called sons , though the nation were ; because the denomination was principally from the true sons , and next from the professed ones : none are visibly sons that be not visibly true believers . the next title mentioned in the argument is [ abrahams seed ] all that are baptized are called abrahams seed , gal. 3. 17 , 18 , 19. therefore they all profess a justifying faith . the consequence is proved , in that none are abrahams seed in gospel sense , but those cordially that are true believers , and those appearingly that profess true faith . this is proved , rom. 9. 4 , 6 , 7. rom. 4. 11. [ that he might be the father of all them that believe , that righteousness might be imputed to them also ] this therefore is a justifying faith , and the priviledge of the justified that is here mentioned . it s added vers . 12 , 13. [ and the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision , but also walk in the steps of the faith of our father abraham yet uncircumcised . for the promise that he should be heir of the world was not to abraham or his seed by the law , but by the righteousness of faith — therefore it is of faith that it might be by grace , to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed , even to that also which is of the faith of abraham the father of us all . ] so gal. 3. 6 , 7 , 8 , 9. [ even as abraham believed god , and it was accounted to him for righteousness : know ye therefore that they which are of saith , the same are the children of abraham ; and the scripture fore-seeing that god would justifie the heathen by faith preached before the gospel to abraham ; in thee shall all nations be blessed . so then , they which be of saith are blessed with faithful abraham ] so vers . 14. 16. [ that the blessing of abraham might come on the gentiles , through jesus christ , that we might receive the promise of the spirit through faith . now to abraham , and his seed were the promises made ; he saith not , and to seeds as of many , but as of one ; and to thy seed , which is christ , and so to those that are in him . it is hence most undeniable , that all abrahams true seed are justified , and have a justifying faith ; and all his professing seed do profess this faith . the next title mentioned in the argument is , [ heirs according to the promise . ] all the baptized were heirs according to the promise : none that profess not a justifying faith are heirs according to the promise ( either really or appearingly ) therefore none that profess not a justifying faith should be baptized . the major is expressed , gal. 3. 17 , 18 , 19. the minor ( of which is all the doubt ) is proved from rom. 8. 17. where there is an express concatenation of [ children , heirs of god , coheirs with christ , that suffering with him shall be glorified with him ] gal. 4. 1 , 6 , 7. the heir is lord of all and a son , and therefore hath the spirit of the son , by which they cry abba father . so tit. 3. 5 , 6 , 7. [ according to his mercy he saved us by the washing of regeneration , and renewing of the holy ghost which he shed on us , &c. that being justified by his grace , we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life ] the heirs then are regenerate , justified , and have the hope of eternal life . so ephes. 3. 6. the gentiles being made fellow-heirs , and of the same body are partakers of the promise in christ by the gospel , even the unsearchable riches of christ , heb. 6. 17. the heirs of promise have their salvation confirmed by gods oath . and heb. 1. 14. they are called the heirs of salvation . and heb. 11. 6. 9. it is true justified believers that have that title , and james 2. 7. [ they are called heirs of the promised kingdom ] and 1. pet. 3. 7. they are called coheirs [ of the same grace of life ] so that to be heirs in the first and proper notion is to be sons that have title to the inheritance of glory : and therefore to be heirs in the second analogical notion is to be such as seem such by profession of that faith which hath the promise of that glory . the last title that i mentioned in the argument was [ justified ] paul calleth all the baptized church of corinth justified ; none that profess not a justified faith are called justified , therefore none such should be baptized . the major i proved to master blake out of 1 cor. 6. 11. [ ye are washed , ye are sanctified , ye are justified in the name of the lord jesus , and by the spirit of our god . ] master blake doth not at all deny the major or the sense of the text alledged to prove it ; but darkly in generals intimateth a denial of the minor , silently passing over that particular title [ justified ] as if he durst not be seen to take notice of it . i confess its sad that good men should be so unfaithful to the truth , which is so precious , and is not their own , and which they should do nothing against ( as master baxter hath done ) but all they can for it . having gon thus far about titles , let me add another ; the title [ regenerate ] christ hath instituted no baptism , but what is to be a sign of present regeneration . but to men that profess not a justifying faith it cannot be administred as a sign of present regeneration ; therefore he hath instituted no baptism to be administred to such . the major i have proved already in the first argument , and its plain in john 3. 5. except a man be born of water and of the spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of god ] and so in tit. 3. 5. where it is called the laver of [ regeneration ] in both which though i am of their minde that think that the sign is put for the thing signified ; yet it may thence plainly appear what is the thing signified , even regeneration , or the new birth : yea so commonly was this acknowledged by all the church of christ , that there is nothing more common in the writings of the fathers then to take the terms [ regenerate , illuminate , &c. and baptized ] as signifying the same thing , or at least spoken of the same person , which occasioned one of our late antiquaries so stifly to plead that regeneration in scripture signifyeth meer baptism , and that all the baptized are regenerate . i grant that it oft falls out that baptism being misapplied sealeth not regeneration at present , and that the same person may afterward be regenerate , and his remembred baptism may be of use to him for the confirmation of his faith . but this is not the institutes commanded use of it , to be so administred at first , if the party profess not saving faith , though this review of it is a duty , where it was so abused at first . the minor i shall take for granted , while regeneration in scripture stands so connexed to salvation ; i know no regenerate ones , but the justified , or those that profess to have a justifying faith , nor hath he proved any more . pag. 118. argum. 11. all that are meet subjects for baptism , ( are after their baptism without any further inward qualification , at least without any other species of saith ) meet subjects for the lords supper : but no infant is a meet subject for the lords supper , as is acknowledged , therefore no infant is a meet subject for baptism : or thus , those whom we may baptize , we may also admit to the lords supper : but we may admit no infants to the lords supper , as is acknowledged by baptizers of infants , therefore we may baptize no infants . the major master blake will easily grant me , and if any other deny it i prove it thus . 1. it is the same covenant that both sacrament seal , one for initiation the other for confirmation and growth in grace ; therefore the same saith that qualifieth for the one , doth sufficiently qualifie for the other , for the same covenant hath the same condition . 2. they are the same benefits that are conferred in baptism and the lords supper to the worthy receiver . therefore the same qualification is necessary for the reception : the antecedents is commonly granted . baptism uniteth to christ , and giveth us himself first , and with himself the pardon of all past sins , &c. the lords supper by confirmation giveth us the same things ; it is the giving of christ himself , who saith by his minister , take , eat , drink ; offering himself to us under the signs , and commanding us to take himself by faith , as we take the signs by the outward parts . he giveth us the pardon of sin , sealed and procured by his body broken , and his blood shed . 3. a member of christs church , against whom no accusation may be brought from some contradiction of his first profession , must be admitted to the lords supper ; but the new baptized may be ordinarily such : therefore if he can but say , i am a baptized person , he hath a sufficient principal title to the lords supper , coram ecclesia , before the church . [ i mean such as we must admit ] though some actual preparation be necessary , unless he be proved to have disabled his claim on that account either by nulling and reverting that profession , or by giving just cause of questioning it . 4. the church hath ever from the apostles dayes till now without question admitted the new baptized at age to the lords supper , without requiring any new species of faith to intitle them to it . i take the major therefore as past denial : i must confess as much as i am against separation , i never intend to have communion with master blakes congregation , if they profess not saving repentance and faith , and if he exact not such a profession , i say still he makes foul work in the church , and when such foul work shall be voluntarily maintained , and the word of god abused for the defilement of the church , and ordinances of god , it is a greater scandal to the weak and to the schismsticks , and a greater reproach to the church , and sadder case to considerate men , then the too common pollutions of others , which are meerly through negligence , but not justified and defended . let master baxters own words judge him , who makes the same foul work in the ordinance of baptism by admitting infants to it upon a parents or proparents ( as he terms them ) profession , when all his proofs of the necessity of profession to go before baptism are of the profession of the party himself to be baptized , and this device of a parents or proparents profession instead of the infants , is his own invention that hath not any intimation in scripture , and by his own proofs makes infants capable of the lords supper , and perverts the nature of sacraments , which his own words do fully express , thus . pag. 123 , 124. the first argument of master gillespies 20. is from the nature of sacraments , which are to signifie that we have already faith in christ , remission of sin by him , and union with him . the sense of the argument is , that seeing sacraments , ( according to christs institution ) are confirming signs presupposing the thing signified both on our part and on gods ; therefore none should use them that have not first the thing signified by them . though i undertake not to defend all the arguments that other men use in this case , yet this doth so much concern the cause of baptism , which i am now debating , that i shall give you this reply to it . what divines are there that deny the sacraments to be mutual signs , and seals signifying our part as well as gods ? and how ill do you wrong the church of god by seeking to make men believe that these things are new and strange ? if it be so to you , it is a pity that it is so ; but sure you have seen master gataker's books against doctor ward , and davenant , wherein you have multitudes of sentences recited out of our protestant divines , that affi●m this which you call new . it is indeed their most common doctrine , that the sacrament doth presuppose remission of sins , and our faith , and that they are instituted to signifie these as in being . it is the common protestant doctrine , that sacraments do solemnize and publickly own and confirm the mutual covenant already entred in heart , as a king is crowned , a souldier listed , a man and woman maried after professed consent : so that the sign is causal as to the consummation and delivery ( as a key or twig and turff in giving possession ) but consequential to the contract as privately made , and the right given thereby ; so that the soul is supposed to consent to have christ as offered first [ which is saving faith ] and then by receiving him sacramentally delivered , to make publick profession of that consent , and publickly to receive his sealed remission . master cobbet [ cited by you ] might well say , that primarily the sacrament is gods seal ; but did he say that it is onely his , and not secondarily ours ? and in the next words you do in effect own part of the doctrine your self , which you have thus wondered at , as new and strange , saying ; [ i confess it is a symbol of our profession of faith . if you mean as you speak [ taking profession properly ] then 1. you yield that the sacrament is our symbol , and so declareth or signifieth our action as well as gods . 2. and it is not onely a sign of our profession , but a professing sign , and therefore a sign of the thing professed ; for the external sign is to declare the internal acts of the mind , which without signs others cannot know . as therefore the words and outwards actions 〈◊〉 ●wo distinct signs of the same internal acts , so are they two wayes of profess●●● my signal actions do not signifie my words ( which are plainer signs the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and therefore need not darker to express them ) but they both expre 〈…〉 mind ; so that they are not only symbols of our professi●● as you spea 〈…〉 t professing symbols 3. and if so , then they must be signs and professions of those internal acts , which correspond with them . the fourth argument of master gillespy is from rom. 4. 11. circumcision was a seal of that righteousness of faith ; therefore so is baptism , therefore it belongeth onely to justified believers . he that maketh it the instituted nature or use of circumcision to be a seal of righteousness of faith , which the person had before , doth make his circumcision a proof of his foregoing righteousness of faith . pag. 133. you cannot shew where ever the wicked are commanded to communicate with the church in the sacrament , but in this order ; first to be converted and repent , and so baptized , and so communicate , gillespy aarons rod blossoming , pag. 514 , 515. the assumption [ that baptism it self is not a regenerating ordinance ] i prove thus . 1. because we read of no persons baptized by the apostles , except such as did profess faith in christ , gladly received the word , and in whom some begun work of the spirit of grace did appear ( i say not that it really was in all , but somewhat of it did appear in all . ) baptism even of the aged must necessarily precede the lords supper . pag. 144. my twelfth argument is from matth. 22. 12. [ friend , how camest thou in hither , not having on a wedding garment ? and he was speechless ] to [ come in hither ] is [ to come into the church of christ . ] by the wedding garment is undoubtedly meant , sincerity of true faith and repentance , so that i may hence argue : if god will accuse and condemn men for coming into his church , or the communion of saints without sincere faith and repentance , then it is not the appointed use of baptism to initiate those that profess not sincere faith and repentance . but infants profess not sincere faith and repentance , as is manifest by sense , therefore it is not the appointed use of baptism to initiate infants . pag. 145. the thirteenth argument is this : we must baptize none that profess not themselves christians ; but no infants profess themselves christians , as is manifest by sense , therefore we must baptize no infants . the major is certain , because it is the use of baptism to be our solemn listing sign into christs army , our , initiating sign , and the solemnization of our mariage to christ , and professing sign that we are christians , and we do in it dedicate and deliver up our selves to him in this relation as his own . so that in baptism we do not onely promise to be christians , but profess that we are so already in heart , and now would be solemnly admitted among the number of christians ; the minor i prove thus . 1. no man is truely a christian that is not truly a disciple of christ [ that is plain act. 11. 26. ] no man is truly a disciple of christ that doth not profess a saving faith and repentance , therefore no man that doth not so profess is truly a christian . the minor i prove thus : no man is truly a disciple of christ that doth not profess to forsake all contrary masters , or teachers , and to take christ for his chief teacher , consenting to learn of him the way to salvation : but no man maketh this profession that professeth not saving faith and repentance ; therefore no man that professeth not saving faith and repentance is truly a disciple of christ . the major is evident in the nature of the relation , the minor is as evident , in that it is an act of saving faith and repentance to forsake other teachers , and to take christ for our sole or chief teacher in order to salvation . 2. no man is truly a christian that professeth not to take christ for his lord and king , forsaking his enemies : but no man doth this but the professors of a saving faith . therefore , &c. 3. no man is a true christian that professeth not to take christ for his redeemer , who hath made propitiation for sin by his blood , and to esteem his blood as the ransom for sinners , and to trust therein ; but none do this but the professors of saving faith , therefore none else are christians . the major of all these three arguments is further proved thus : no man is professedly a christian that professeth not to accept of christ as christ [ or to believe in christ as christ ] but no man doth profess to take christ as christ , that professeth not to take or accept him as his priest , teacher and king ; therefore . &c. the major is plain in it self : the minor is as plain , it being essential to christ to be the priest , prophet , and king , and from these essentials related to us and accepted by us , doth our own denomination of christians arise , and that a bare assent without acceptance doth not make any one a christian is past doubt , and shall be further spoken to anon . if baptism then be commonly called our christening , and so be our entrance solemnly into the christian state , then is it not to be given to them that are not so much as christians by profession . and furthermore if a faith defective in the assenting part about the essentials of its object , serve not to denominate a man justly a christian , then a faith defective in the consenting or accepting part above the essentials of the object serveth not to denominate a man a christian ; but the antecedent is true , therefore so is the consequent . the antecedent is proved , because else the turks are christians , because they believe so many and so great things of christ ; and else a man might be a christian that denied christs death , or resurrection , or other essentials of christianity . the consequence is good , for christianity is as truly and necessarily in the will as in the understanding ; consent is as essential an act of covenanting as any . so that i may conclude that as he is no christian that professeth not to believe that christ is the priest , prophet , and king , so he is no christian that professeth not to consent and accept him for his priest , prophet , and king . the fourteenth argument is this : our divines ordinarily charge wicked men with contradiction of profession which is made in baptism , and they expound many places of scripture , which the arminians take as favouring their cause , to be meant according to the profession of wicked men . but it chargeth not such contradiction on persons baptized in infancy , therefore it supposeth no profession or baptism of theirs : and if we must baptize none that profess not saving faith and repentance , we must not baptize infants , who make no profession . pag. 177. argum. 15. if all that are baptized must engage themselves to believe presently ( in the next instant ) yea , or at any time hereafter , with a saving faith , then must they profess at present a saving faith ; or if we must baptize none that will not ingage to believe savingly , then must we baptize none that will not profess a saving faith ; but no infant will profess a saving faith , as is manifest by reason and experience , therefore we must baptize no infant . the antecedent is master blakes doctrine ; who affirmeth , that it is not necessary that they that come to baptism do profess a present saving faith , but its sufficient that they engage themselves to believe by such a faith . the consequence is proved thus ▪ 1. it is not the beginning of saving faith which we are to engage our selves to in the sacraments , but the continuance , therefore the beginning is presupposed in that engagement , and so we must no more baptize without a profession of faith in present , then without an engagement to believe hereafter ; the antecedent is proved thus ; there is no one word in scripture either of precept or example where any person in baptism doth engage , or is required to engage to begin to believe with a saving faith , or to believe with a faith which at present he hath not . shew but one word of scripture to prove this ( if you can ) if you cannot , i may conclude , that therefore we must not require that which we have no scripture ground to require . let master baxter shew but one word in scripture to prove this ( if he can ) that any person in baptism doth engage or is required to believe , or profess to believe that another , an infant may be admitted to baptism by virtue of it ; if he cannot , i may conclude , that therefore we must not require that which we have no scripture ground to require , nor admit any infant or other , by reason of a parents , proparents , or sureties profession or promise to believe for an infant . pag. 149. argum. 16. if there can be no example given in scripture of any one that was baptized without the profession ( and that his own , by his own self and no other parents , proparent or surety ) of a saving faith , nor any precept for so doing , then must not we baptize any without it ; but , the antecedent is true , therefore so is the consequent , and therefore we must baptize no infant , who makes no such profession , as all examples in scripture of any baptized are of , and every precept for baptism requires . let us review the scripture examples of baptism , which might afford us so many several arguments , but that i shall put them together for brevity . 1. i have already shewed that john required the profession of true repentance ( by the baptized himself ) and that his baptism was for remission of sin . 2. when christ layeth down in the apostolical commission , the nature and order of his apostles work , it is first to make them disciples , and then to baptize them into the name of the father , son , and holy ghost ; and as it is a making disciples , which is first expressed in matth. so mark expoundeth who those disciples are by patting believing before baptism , and that we may know that it is a justifying faith ( of the disciple himself ) that he meaneth , he annexeth first baptism , and then the promise of salvation , math. 28. 19. mark 16. 16. [ he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved . this is not like some occasional mention of baptism , but its the very commission of christ to his apostles for preaching and baptism , and purposely expresseth their several works in their several places and order . their first task is to make disciples , which are by mark called believers . the second work is to baptize them , whereto is annexed the promise of their salvation . the third work is to teach them all other things , which are afterward to be learned in the school of christ . to contemn this order ( as master baxter doth in infant baptism ) is to contemn all rules of order : for where can we expect to find it , if not here ? i profess my conscience is fully satisfied from this text , that it is one sort of faith , even saving , that must go before baptism , and the profession whereof ( by the party himself to be baptized ; he that believeth and is baptized , not another then the believer , make disciples and baptize them , not others then the disciples made ) the minister must expect , of which see what is before cited out of calvin and i●scator . i shall be amazed reading this passage , at the blindness of master baxter , if he see not how unanswerably his own words overthrow infant baptism , or his hypocrisie , if being satisfied , as he saith , in conscience of his own exposition he do not deny infant baptism , and bewail his alledging of matth. 28. 19. in his book termed , plain scripture proof of infants baptism , part. 1. chap. 3. and i pray god to deliver me from such hardness of heart , be adds , that it was saving faith that was required of the jews and professed by them , acts 2. 38 , 41 , 48. is shewed already , and is plain in the text . acts 8. the samaritans believed and had great joy , and were baptized into the name of jesus christ , vers. 8. 12. whereby it appeareth that it was both the understanding and will that were both changed , and that they had the profession of a saving faith ( even simon himself ) acts 8. 37. the condition on which the eunuch must be baptized was [ if he believed with all his heart ; ] which he professed to do , and that was the evidence that philip did expect . paul was baptized after true conversion , acts 9. 18. the holy ghost fell on the gentiles , acts 10. 44. before they were baptized , and they magnified god . and this holy ghost was the like gift as was given to the apostles , who believed on the lord jesus ; and it was accompanied with repentance unto life , acts 11. 17 , 18. acts 16. 14 , 15. lydia's heart was opened before she was baptized , and she was one that the apostles [ judged faithful to the lord ] and offered to them the evidence of her faith , acts 16. 30 , 31 , 33 , 34. the example of the jaylour is very full to the resolution of the question in hand . he first asketh what he should do to be saved ; the apostle answereth him ; [ believe in the lord jesus , and thou shalt be saved and thy house ] so that it was a saving faith that is here mentioned . he rejoyced and believed with all his house , and was baptized that same hour of the night , or straightway . it is here evident that he professed that same faith which paul required , acts 18. 8. [ crispus the chief ruler of the synagogue believed on the lord with all his house● and many of the corinthians hearing , believed and were baptized ] here we have two proofs that it is saving faith that is mentioned , those in acts 19. 5. were baptized as believers in jesus christ . in a word , i know of no one word in scripture that giveth us the least intimation that ever man was baptized without the profession of a saving faith . there is constantly this order in the prescribed duty , that no man should seek baptism but a true believer , and no man should baptize any but those that profess this true belief , acts 8. 37. philip is determining a question , and giveth this in as the decision [ if thou believe with all thy heart thou mayest ] and to say that this is but de bene esse , meaning that it includeth not the negative , [ otherwise thou mayest not ] is to make philip to have deluded and not decided or resolved . use that liberty in expounding all other scripture , and you 'l make it what you please . a dogmatical faith is not the christian faith , nor anywhere alone denominateth men believers in scripture . i remember but one text , john 12. 42. where it is called believing on christ ; and but few more where it is simply called believing , but none where such are called believers , disciples or christians , or any thing that intimateth them , admitted into the visible church without the profession of saving faith . i conclude that all examples in scripture do mention onely the administration of it to the professors of saving faith , and the precepts give us no other direction ; and i provoke master blake ( as far as is seemly for me to do ) to name one precept or example for any other , and make it good , if he can . i conclude that all examples of baptism in scripture do mention onely the administration of it to the same persons who in their own persons were professors of saving faith ; and the precepts give us no other direction . and i provoke mr. baxter ( as far as is seemly for me to do ) to name one precept or example for baptizing any other , and make it good , if he can , and if not , by his own reason he ought to baptize no other , but must reject baptism of infants who do not in their own persons profess saving faith , and give over his vain plea of parents or proparents profession of saving faith , as entituling infants to baptism , which ( unless his violence and wilfulness of spirit blind him ) his own words and arguments will inforce to do . pag. 156. argum. 17. is from 1 pet. 3. 21. [ the like figure whereto even baptism doth also now save us : not the putting away the filth of the flesh , but the answer of a good conscience toward god ] whence i thus argue : if baptism be appointed for our solemn admission into a state of salvation , as noahs ark received men into a state of safety from the deluge , then none should be baptized but those that profess that faith which entereth them into a state of salvation ; but no infant professeth that faith which entereth them into a state of salvation , as is manifest by sense and reason , therefore no infant should be baptized . here it is implied plainly that this is quoad finem instituentis , as to the end of him that instituted it , the common appointed of baptism , which the text mentioneth , though eventually it prove not the common effect through the errours of the receivers : and this appeareth , 1. in that it was spoken plainly in the text of the very nature and appointed use of baptism , and so of baptism as baptism , without any exception , limitation , or distinction . therefore it is not spoken of any different use that it is appointed for to the elect , as distinct from its common use to others . it s spoken of that signification and common use to which baptism is appointed , viz. to save , else we shall never be able to understand the use of it , or any ordinance from scripture , if we shall take liberty to say [ it is this to one , but not to another ] when the scripture saith no such thing , but speaks of the nature and use of it without distinction . else when it saith , [ circumcision is a seal of the righteousness of faith ] we may say with the anabaptists , it was so to abraham , but not to all others [ and when the lords supper is said to be appointed for the remembrance of christ ] we may say , that is but to some , and not to others , when as the text plainly speaks of the stated use of the ordinances to all . 2 and in the type it is clear ; for it was not some onely , but all that entered noabs ark , that entered into a state of salvation from the deluge ; therefore so it is here as to the commanded use . 2. when baptism is said to save us , it s plainly meant of the state of salvation that baptism entereth us into and not of baptism ex opere operato , by the work done , effecting our salvation : and so baptism comprehendeth the state into which we are solemnly by it initiated . as a woman that is maried to an honourable man , or a souldier listed under an honourable commander , is said to be honoured , the one by mariage , the other by listing . where antecedent consent is the foundation on both sides of the honourable relations , and the subsequent state is the condition or state it self which is honourable , but the solemn signation is but the expression of the former , and passage to the later . 3. hereby it is apparent , that though the answer of a good conscience be the principal thing intended , and that saveth , yet the external baptism is here included as the sign and solemnization , so that when the apostle saith [ not the putting away of the filth of the flesh ] he means [ not the bare outward act of washing alone , or as such ] but baptism as it is entire , having the thing professed on ou● part , together with the professing sign . 4. it is therefore but by way of signification , obsignation and complemental exhibition , that baptism saveth , it being neither the fast or principal efficient or condition of it , but is valued as it is conjunct with the principal causes and condition for the attainment of these ends . 5. it is not a meer remote means leading towards a state of salvation that baptism is here affirmed to be , but an enterance or means of entrance into that state of salvation it self . as the heart-covenant or faith doth it principally , so baptism signally and complementally . this is plain . 1. because it is not said to help us towards a state of salvation , but expresly to save . 2. because the type which is here mentioned , viz. the ark , was such a means , that all that entered into it for preservation from the flood were actually saved from it . all this laid together doth confirm both the antecedent and consequence , of my argument . calvins words on the text signifie , 1. that no baptized men are excluded from salvation but hypocrites . 2. that they that are excluded from salvation for all their baptism are such as did dep●ave and corrupt it , and not justly use it . yet another argument may hence be raised , thus . argum. 2. if , according to the institution , the answer of a ●ood conscience must be joyned with baptism for the attaining of its end , then we must admit none that profess not that answer of a good conscience : but no infant doth profess that answer of a good conscience , as is manifest by sense : therefore we must admit no infant to baptism . but the former is certain from the text , for baptism is said to save ; that is , its appointed use , yet not the external washing , but the answer of a good conscience doth it ; therefore this is of necessary conjunction , and without it baptism cannot attain its end , but it is to be administred and received onely in order to the attainment of its end , and therefore never in a way by which the end is apparently not attainable . what this answer of a good conscience is , we shall further enquire anon . both the common exp●sitions fully confirm the point which i maintain . the assemblies annot. recit : both thus : [ hence by the answer of a good conscience we may understand that unfeigned faith , whereof they made confession at their baptism , and whereby their consciences were purified , and whereby they received the remission of their sin , &c. some understand by the answer of a good conscience , that covenant whereinto they entered at their baptism , the embracing whereof they testified by their unfeigned confession of their faith ] viz. such a faith as is aforesaid . pag. 160. argum. 18. no one may be admitted to baptism , who may not be addmitted a member of the church of christ . no one may be admitted to be a member of the church of christ without the profession of a saving faith ; therefore no one may be admitted to baptism without the profession of a saving faith . but no infant doth profess saving faith , as is manifest by sense , therefore no infant may be admitted to baptism . i speak of such admission to church membership as is in the power of the ministers of christ , who have the keys of his kingdom to open and let in , as well as to cast out . the major is past question , because baptism is our solemn entrance into the church , who were before entred by private consent , and accepted by the covenant of god . all the question is of the minor , which i shall therefore prove . 1. it is before proved that all the members of the church must be such as are visibly , solemnly , or by profession , sanctified from former sin , cleansed , justified persons of god , the heirs of the promise , &c. but this cannot be without the profession of a saving faith ; therefore , &c. 2. this is also before proved , where it was shewed , that no other are christians or disciples . 3. in acts 2. 41 , 42. &c. the many thousand that were added to the church were such as gladly received the doctrine of saving faith and repentance , and continued in the apostles doctrine and fellowship , and breaking of bread and prayer , and so far contemned the world as to sell all , and make it common . and doubtless no man continued in those ways ( of doctrine fellowship , prayer , &c. ) without the profession of saving faith and repentance , for the very use of these is such a profession , of which saith calvin in act. 2. 42. [ quaerimus ergo veram christi ecclesiam ; hic nobis ad vivum depicta est ●jus im●g● , ac initium qui●em facit a doctrina , quae veluti ecclesiae anima est , ( not as barely heard , but as professed and received ) nec quamlibet doctrinam nominat , sed apost●lorum ; hoc est quam per ipsorum nanus silius dei tradiderat : ergo ubicunque personat pura vox eva●gelii , ubi in ejus professione m●●nent homines , ubi in ordinario ejus auditu ad profectum se exercent , illic indubio est ecclesia &c. quare non temere haec quatuor recenset lucas , quum desserib●re vult nobis rite constitutam ecclesiae statum . et nos ad hunc ordinem eniti convenit , si cupimus vere censeri ecclesia coram deo & angelis , non inane tantum ejus nomen apud homines jactare ] therefore we seek out the true church of christ : its image is here painted to the life , and verily it begins from the doctrine , which is as it were the soul of the church , neither doth he name any doctrine , but of the apostles , that is to say , which the son of god had delivered by their hands , therefore wheresoever the pure voice of the gospel sounds , where men remain in the profession of it , where they exercise themselves to profit in the ordinary hearing of it , there undoubtedly is the church . wherefore luke mentions these four things not without just ground , when he would describe the duly constituted state of the church , and its convenient that we should endeavour to attain to this order , if we desire to be a true church in the sight of god and angels , and not onely to boast of the vain name thereof before men . and vers. 47. it is said that the lord added daily to the church such as should be saved . it describeth them that were added to the church viz. that they were such as should be saved , or as beza yieldeth to another reading [ and so grotius and many others ] such as saved themselves from that untoward generation [ qui sese quotidie servandos recipiebant in ecclesiam ] who daily added themselves to the church that they might be saved . the church is the body of christ , col. 1. 18. 24. and none are members of his body but such as either are united to him , and live by him , or at least seem to do so . the church is subject to christ , and beloved of christ , and cherished by him : we are members of his body , of his flesh , and his bones , ephes 5. 24. 25 , 30. and those that are against the general redemption , me thinks should be moved with the consideration , that it is the church that christ gave himself for , even the visible church which he purchased with his own blood , acts 20. 28. ephes. 5. 25. and he is the saviour of his body , vers. 23. but so he is not effectively the saviour of the professors of a faith that doth not justifie : {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} according to opinion , he is the effective savior of those that profess a justifying faith , and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} of the sincere : but of others neither way . hitherto divines have gathered from the plain texts of scripture , that there is but one church , one faith , and one baptism ; and those that had this faith really , were to be baptized , and were real members of the church , and that those that professed this faith , and so seemed to have it when they have it not , are visible members of the church , and are so taken , because their profession is sensible to us ; and by that they seem to have the thing prof●ssed ; but pae●obaptists , and chiefly master baxter are fallen into new conceits in these . 1. they feign a new christian faith to themselves , to wit , a believing immediate by the faith of a parent or proparent ; so that before there was but one christian faith , and now they have made two . 2. and so before , there was but one sort of real , serious , or sincere christians , consisting of such as had that real christian faith , ( in their own persons ) and now they have found out another sort of them , to wit , believers by anothers faith . 3. so they have feigned a new baptism , for the old baptism was for remission of sin , and burial and resurrection with christ , and to ingraffe men into the church , which is the body of christ , upon the profession of a saving faith : but now they admit to baptism , as they term it , infants without any profession of saving faith , made by them to seal an imaginary covenant of grace made by god to believing parents and their seed , without any covenanting or sealing by the baptized person , upon a pretended title of parents and proparents faith , and instead of baptizing [ as of old they did ] by putting under water and coming out again , so as to resemble christs burial and resurrection , and their conformity thereto , they call that baptism , and say falsly they baptize when they onely sprinkle or pour water on an infant without such dipping , as of old master baxter pag. 70. confesseth was used and expressed by the apostle , rom. 6. 4 , 5. 4. and they have feigned also a new kind of church : for the church of christs constitution is but one , which is called visible from mens profession , and invisible from the faith professed . but they have made a church which consisteth of a third sort of members ; that is , of men that neither have saving faith nor profess it , but onely are infants , whose parents or proparents have faith . 5. to this end they have confounded the church and the porch , the vineyard & the adjac●nt part of the wilderness : those that heretofore were not so much as catechumeni , o● men in preparation for the church , but onely designed to holiness , and hoped and expected to be in after time when they came to understand the christian faith , church-members , are now brought into it , and are annumerated to true christians , before they once profess themselves to be such . 6. and hereby [ by infant baptism ] also one of the two sorts of teaching , which christ distinguisheth , matth. 28. 19 , 20. is taken away , to wit , that teaching which draweth men to christ , and maketh them disciples , and perswadeth them to receive christ jesus the lord . for they take him for a disciple ( so master b●xter of baptism , part . 1. chap. 3. ) that is not learning to be a disciple , yea , though he do not so much as submit to learn , nor hath learned any preparatory truths , though yet he be not made a disciple indeed , nor profess to be . master baxter is deeply offended with master t. for denying infants to be christians or members of the church mediately , &c. but i shall say somewhat more concerning those infants that are asserted by him to be disciples , who do not so much as profess a saving faith , viz. that they are no members of the church at all , and are not so much as to be named christians , nor to be admitted into the visible church . no man can prove that ever one man was admitted a church-member in all the new testament , without the profession of a saving faith . otherwise we should have two distinct churches specially different , or two sorts of christianity , and christians differing tota specie , in the whole kind , because the profession by a parent and proparent which is made by him , their qualification doth make a difference specifical between such christians and church-members , and other christians and church members . when the jaylor acts 16. 30 , 32 , 33 , 34. was admitted into the church by baptism , it was upon the professing of such a believing , by which both he and his houshold might be saved , as is before shewed . and so of all others in those times . pag. 163. argum. 19. if we once admit men to baptism without their own personal profession , we shall be utterly confounded , and not be able to give any satisfactory resolution whose profession may be a sufficient qualification to entitle to baptism , and so never be able to practice the doctrine of pae●obaptism , as being utterly uncertain what infants to baptize . this might be manifest by considering the several conceits of paedobaptists , some whereof make the faith of the church sufficient , some the faith of albelieving nation , some of any ancestors , some of the sureties , some of the next parents , some of the parent inchurched , some of the parent or proparent , and this they claim by a covenant which they can extend to no other then the parent , who is believer , not onely by profession , but also really before god , which can be known to no administrator of baptism ordinarily . paedobaptists speak so much and purposely of this point , particularly master baxter of baptism , part. 1. chap. 29. that one would think we may expect an exact resolution of this point from him , if from any man , and yet he is uncertain what to fix upon , and if he resolve on any thing it is without proof , as is shewed by master t. review , part. 1. sect. 35. 37. exercit. argum. 9. 11. review part . 2. sect. 10. 12. 17. part. 3. sect. 50. &c. and i perceive that the stress of the differences between master baxter and master t. did rest much in this , and no wise man will leave his grounds till he see where he may have better ( especially when the grounds are so plain as those of the antipaedobaptists are from christs institution , matth. 28. 19. mark . 16. 15 , 16. and the apostles practice , which master baxter hath here so amply proved to be of the baptizing onely of persons who themselves profess a saving faith ) unless he mean to be for nothing , or of no religion . no man can tell where to fix , nor what we must consent to , to procure a title , if we once forsake the present ground of the persons own profession of saving faith who is to be baptized . what is said to the contrary is answered in the books forenamed , and it is not meet to be still writing for those lazie readers , that had rather erre then be at the pains of reading what is already written . none are disciples upon the account of your other faith , but of either saving faith or the profession of it ; none are christians on the account of your lower kind of faith , but onely of saving faith or the profession of it . once for all i let you know , that i take saving faith to be the constitutive or necessary qualification of a real or mystical member ; and profession of that faith to be the qualifying condition of visibility of membership . i confess still that the sealis to others besides believers , but though the promise be conditional , we must not seal to any but those that profess consent to the conditions ; and therefore not to any but those that profess to be true believers . pag. 190. i find by sad experience ( to my sorrow ) that a considerable part of some parishes , or villages are ignorant of the fundamentals . i have spoken with abundance that that know not christ is god or man , or either ( but they say he is a spirit ) nor that the holy ghost is god , nor why christ died , nor that any satisfaction is made for our sins , or any thing done , or necessary to their pardon , but our own repentance and amendment , and with some that know not that the soul goes to heaven before the resurrection , nor that the body shall ever rise again . now i would know of master blake whether all the children of these parents must be baptized again or not ? for certainly these have not a dogmatical faith , which is the thing that he saith entituleth to baptism . and then what certainty have we that any of our ancestors had a true dogmatical faith : and i would know of master baxter whether such children are not to be baptized agian ? sure if he say no , how can he allow that baptism which is without a profession of saving faith ? if he say yea , how can he assure himself that any of our ancestors had right baptism ? me thinks few that hold master baxters tenets should allow of the baptism of the greatest part of english people who are no better then those master baxter mentions , and yet neither master baxter nor other paedobaptists do baptize such when they come to profess understandingly the faith of christ . pag. 195. my twentieth and last argument is drawn from the constant practice of the universal church of christ . it hath been the constant practice of the catholick church from the apostles practice till now to require that profession of saving faith and repentance , as necessary , before they would baptize ; therefore it must be our practice also . but it is otherwise in infant baptism , as experience shews , therefore the practice of it is not right . for the proof of the churches practice , 1. i have already said enough about the apostles own practice and the church in their days . 2. the constant practice of the church since the apostles to this day is undoubtedly known . 1. by the very form of words in baptism , and 2. by the history of their proceedings therein . 1. it is certain that the church did ever baptize into the name of the father , son , and holy ghost . and as i have proved before , the voluntary seeking and reception of that baptism containeth the actual profession of saving faith . 2. it is certain that the persons to be baptized ( if at age ) did profess to believe in the father , son , and holy ghost . 3. it is also certain , that they did profess to renounce the flesh , the world , and the devil . 4. and it is certain that they promised for the future to live in new obedience , and thus they publickly entered the three stipulations ; credis ? credo : abrenuncias ? abrenuncio : spondes ? spondeo . doest thou believe ? i believe . doest thou renounce ? i renounce . doest thou promise ? i promise . it was the constant doctrine of the fathers and the church then , that faith and repentance ( given in vocation ) did go first , and that justification , adoption , and sanctification followed after . and so they took this justifying faith and repentance to be prerequisite to baptism , therefore they ever required before hand whether they believed in god the father , son , and holy ghost , and renounced the flesh , the world , and the devil ( as is aforesaid ) and caused them to profess this before they would baptize them . and as it is true of the ancient church , that they never baptized any without the profession of saving faith and repentance , so it is true of all the christian churches in the world that i can hear of to this day . the papists themselves do use the same words in baptism , as are before expressed , and require a profession . and though their false doctrine force them to misexpound their own words , yet custom hinders them from changing them ; and for the reformed churches it is past all question , by their constant practice , that they require the profession of a saving faith . the practice of the church of england till the late change , may be seen in the common prayer book , wherein all that is fore-mentioned is required , even from the infant , to whom the question is propounded , doest thou renounce ? doest thou believe ? wilt thou be baptized ? although they took the answer of the sureties as if it were the childes , and say in the catechism they now promise , and perform faith and repentance by their sureties . in the confession of faith of the assembly at westminster , cap. 28. and again in the shorter catechism , profession of faith in christ , and obedience to him is the thing required . they add also in the directory [ that all who are baptized in the name of christ do renounce , and by their baptism are bound to fight against the devil , the world and the flesh . ] calvin in acts 8. 37. saith [ quod non admittitur eunuchus ad baptismum , nisi fidem professus , hinc sumenda est universalis regula , non ante recipiendes esse in ecclesiam qui ab ea prius fuerant alieni , quam ubi testati fuerint christo se credere . est enim baptismus quasi fidei appendix : ideoque ordine posterior est . deinde si datur sine fide , cujus est sigillum , & impia & nimis crassa est prophanatio . ] that the eunuch was not admitted to baptism till he professed faith . hence this universal rule is to be gathered , that those are not to be received into the church , who before were strangers from it , till they first testifie they believe in christ : for baptism is as it were an appendix to faith , and therefore is later in order : then if it be given without faith , of which t is the seal , t is a wicked and too gross a prophanation . here note . 1. that baptism ( as received ) is the seal of our faith ( how much soever denied by master blake ) as it is the seal of gods promise as administred . 2. that the constant order is that baptism follow faith . 3. and that it is no better then an impious profanation of it , if it go without faith ; that is . 1. if the party seek it without the presence of faith . 2. if the pastor administer it without the profession of faith . to like purpose speak many more , but to salve infant baptism they say that gods promise to an infant , whom they imagi●●● be born in the church , is instead of profession , that for it they by a judgement of charity are taken to be regenerate , and that it is as much as we have of persons of age , and is sufficient warrant to baptize them . but 1. they prove none of these . 2. nor are they true . 3. nor were they true would they warrant infant baptism , when the institution is ( as they confess ) to baptize them who believe by the preaching of the gospel to them , matth. 28. 19. mark . 16. 16. whereby the inadvertency of the generality of protestant divines in this point may be discerned , and by the reading of this book all intelligent persons may perceive master baxters deceitfulness or heedlesness , and , if he perfist in defending , infant baptism , his unreasonable pertinacie in his conceit , and , if he do not declare his forsaking his doctrine in his book of baptism , his impenitencie and unrighteous dealing with the church of god which he hath injured . an appendix to the answer unto two athenian mercuries concerning pedo-baptism containing twenty seven syllogistical arguments proving infant-baptism a mere humane tradition : the gentlmen called the athenian society desiring in the last of the said mercuries to have syllogism / by b. k. keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. 1692 approx. 39 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 6 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2005-12 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a47371 wing k45 estc r2646 13663404 ocm 13663404 101137 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a47371) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 101137) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 792:6) an appendix to the answer unto two athenian mercuries concerning pedo-baptism containing twenty seven syllogistical arguments proving infant-baptism a mere humane tradition : the gentlmen called the athenian society desiring in the last of the said mercuries to have syllogism / by b. k. keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. [2], 8 p. printed for the author and sold by john harris ..., london : 1692. written by benjamin keach. cf. halkett & laing. reproduction of original in bodleian library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng athenian society (london, england) infant baptism -early works to 1800. 2005-04 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-05 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-08 jonathan blaney sampled and proofread 2005-08 jonathan blaney text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-10 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion an appendix to the answer unto two athenian mercuries , concerning pedo-baptism . containing twenty seven syllogistical arguments , proving infant-baptism a mere humane tradition . the gentlemen called the athenian society , desiring in the last of the said mercuries to have syllogisms . ephes . 4. 5. one lord , one faith , one baptism . by b. k. london , printed for the author , and sold by john harris at the sign of the harrow in the poultry . mdcxcii . price two pence . an appendix to the answer to two athenian mercuries , concerning infant-baptism , containing divers syllogistical arguments to disprove pedo-baptism , and to prove the baptism of believers . gentlemen , since you desire syllogisms , i have gratified you therein . arg. 1. if none are to be baptized by the authority of the great commission of our blessed saviour , matth. 28. but such who are first made disciples by being taught ; than insants , who are not capable to be taught , ought not to be baptized . but none are to be baptized by the authority of the great commission of our blessed saviour , but such who are first made disciples by teaching . ergo , little babes ought not to be baptized . arg. 2. if infant-baptism was never instituted , commanded , or appointed of god , infants ought not to be baptized . but infant-baptism was never instituted , commanded , or appointed of god. ergo , they ought not to be baptized . as to the major ; if one thing may be practised as an ordinance without an institution or command of god , another thing may also ; so any innovation may be let into the church . as to the minor ; if there is an institution for it , &c. 't is either contained in the great commission , matth. 28. mark 16. or somewhere else . but 't is not to be found in the commission , nor any where else . ergo. the major none will deny . the minor i prove thus . none are to be baptized by virtue of the commission , but such who are discipled by the word , as i said before , and so the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies . if any should say , christ commanded his disciples to baptize all nations , and infants are part of nations , therefore are to be baptized . i answer ; arg. 3. if all nations , or any in the nations ought to be baptized before discipled ; then turks , pagans , unbelievers and their children may be baptized , because they are a great part of the nations . but turks , pagans and unbelievers , and their children , ought not to be baptized . ergo. besides that , teaching ( by the authority of the commission ) must go before baptizing , we have proved ; which generally all learned men do assert : if the institution is to be found any where else , they must shew the place . arg. 4. faith and repentance are required of all that ought to be baptized . infants are not required to believe and repent , nor are they capable so to do . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . the major is clear , acts 2 , 8 , 10 , 16 chapters ; and 't is also asserted by the church of england . what is required of persons to be baptized ? that 's the question . the answer is , repentance , whereby they forsake sin ; and faith , whereby they stedfastly believe the promise of god made to them in that sacrament . the minor cannot be denied . arg. 5. that practice that tends not to the glory of god , nor to the profit of the child , when done , nor in after-times when grown up , but may prove hurtful and of a dangerous nature to him , cannot be a truth of god. but the practice of infant-baptism tends not to the glory of god , nor to the profit of the child when baptized , nor in after-times when grown up , but may prove hurtful and of a dangerous nature to him . ergo. see levit. 10. 1 , 2. where moses told aaron , because his sons had done that which god commanded them not , that god would be sanctified by all that drew near unto him ; intimating , that such who did that which god commanded not , did not sanctify or glorify god therein . can god be glorified by man's disobedience , or by adding to his word ; by doing that which god hath not required ? matth. 16. 9. in vain do you worship me , teaching for doctrine the commandments of men : and that that practice doth profit the child , none can prove from god's word : and in after-times when grown up , it may cause the person to think he was thereby made a christian , &c. and brought into the covenant of grace , and had it sealed to him , nay , thereby regenerated , for so these gentlemen in their mercury , decemb. 26. plainly intimate , and that infants are thereby ingrafted also into christ's church . sure all understanding men know baptism of believers is not called regeneration , but only metonymically , it being a figure of regeneration . but they ignorantly affirm also , that infants then have a federal holiness ; as if this imagined holiness comes in by the child's covenant in baptism , which may prove hurtful and dangerous to them , and cause them to think baptism confers grace , which is a great error . how can water , saith mr. charnock , an external thing , work upon the soul physically ? nor can it , saith he , be proved , that ever the spirit of god is tied by any promise , to apply himself to the soul in a gracious operation , when water is applied to the body : if it were so , then all that were baptized were regenerated , then all that were baptized should be saved , or else the doctrine of perseverance falls to the ground . some indeed , says he , say , that regeration is conferred in baptism upon the elect , and exerts it self afterwards in conversion . but how so active a principle as a spiritual life should lie dead and asleep so many years , &c. is not easily conceived . on regen . p. 75. arg. 6. if the church of england says , that faith and repentance are required of all that ought to be baptized , and in so saying , speak truly , and yet infants can't perform those things ; then infants ought not to be baptized . but the church of england says , that faith and repentance are required of all such , &c. and speak truly , and yet infants cannot perform these things . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . object . if it be objected , that they affirm they do perform it by their sureties . answ . if suretiship for children in baptism is not required of god , and the sureties do not , cannot perform those things for the child : then suretiship is not of god , and so signifies nothing , but is an unlawful and sinful undertaking . but suretiship in childrens baptism is not required of god , and they do not , cannot perform what they promise . ergo. do they , or can they cause the child to forsake the devil and all his works , the pomps and vanities of this wicked world , and all the sinful lusts of the flesh ? in a word ; can they make the child or children to repent and truly believe in jesus christ ? for these are the things they promise for them , and in their name . alas , they want power to do it for themselves , and how then should they do it for others ? besides , we see they never mind nor regard their covenant in the case : and will not god one day say , who has required these things at your hands ? arg. 7. if there be no precedent in the scripture , ( as there is no precept ) that any infant was baptized , then infants ought not to be baptized . but there is no precedent that any infant was baptized in the scripture . ergo. if there is any precedent or example in scripture that any infant was baptized , let them shew us where we may find it . erasmus saith , 't is no where expressed in the apostolical writings , that they baptized children . vnion of the church , and on rom. 6. calvin saith , it is no where expressed by the evangelists , that any o●e the infant was baptized by the apostles . instit . c. 16. book 4. ludovicus vives saith , none of old were wont to be baptized but in grown age , and who desired and understood what it was . vide ludov. the magdeburgenses say , that concerning the baptizing the adult , both jews and gentiles , we have sufficient proof from acts 2 , 8 , 10 , 16 chapters ; but as to the baptizing of infants , they can 〈…〉 no example in scripture . 〈…〉 l. 2. p. 469. dr. taylor saith , it is 〈◊〉 the perpetual analogy of 〈…〉 baptize infants : for besides that christ never gave any precept to baptize them , nor ever himself nor his apostles ( that appears ) did baptize any of them : all that either he or his apostles said concerning it , requires such previous dispositions of baptism , of which infants are not capable , viz. faith and repentance . lib. proph. p. 239. arg. 8. if whatsoever which is necessary to faith and practice is left in the holy scripture , that being a compleat and perfect rule , and yet infant-baptism is not contained or to be sound therein , then infant-baptism is not of god. but whatever is necessary to faith and practice , is contained in the holy scriptures , &c. but infant-baptism is not to be found therein . ergo. that the scripture is a perfect rule , &c. we have the consent of all the ancient fathers and modern divines . athanasius saith , the holy scriptures being inspirations of god , are sufficient to all instructions of truth . athan. against the gentiles . chrysostom saith , all things be plain and clear in the scripture ; and whatsoever are needful ▪ are manifest there . chrysost . on 2 thess. and 2 tim. 2. basil saith that it would be an argument of infidelity , and a most certain sign of pride , if any man should reject any thing written , and should introduce things not written . basil in his sermon de fide. augustine saith ▪ in the scriptures are found all things which contain faith , manner of living , hope , love , &c. let us , saith he , seek no farther than what is written of god our saviour , lest a man would know more than the scriptures witness . aug. in his 108 epistles to fortunat. theophilact saith , it is part of a diabolical spirit , to think any thing divine , without the authority of the holy scripture . lib. 2. paschal . isychius saith , let us who will have any thing observed of god , search no more but 〈◊〉 which the gospel doth give unto us . 〈…〉 16. on levit. 〈…〉 though the arguments of the anabaptists , from the defect of command or example , have a great use against the lutherans , forasmuch as they use that rite every where , having no command or example , theirs is to be rejected ; yet is it of no force against catholicks , who conclude the apostolical tradition is of no less authority with us than the scripture , &c. this of baptizing of infants is an apostolical tradition . bellarm. in his book de bapt. l. 1. c. 8. mr. ball saith , we must for every ordinance look to the institution , and never stretch it wider , nor draw it narrower than the lord hath made it , for he is the institutor of the sacraments according to his own pleasure ; and 't is our part to learn of him , both to whom , how , and for what end the sacraments are to be administred . ball , in his answer to the new-england elders , p. 38 , 39. and as to the minor , 't is acknowledged by our adversaries , it is not to be found in the letter of the scripture . and as to the consequences drawn therefrom , we have proved , they are not natural from the premises ; and though we admit of consequences and inferences if genuine , yet not in the case of an institution respecting a practical ordinance that is of meer positive right . arg. 9. if infant-baptism was an institution of christ , the pedo-baptists could not be at a loss about the grounds of the right infants have to baptism : but the pedo-baptists are at a great loss , and differ exceedingly about the grounds of the right infants have to baptism . ergo , 't is no institution of christ . as touching the major , i argue thus ; that which is an institution of christ , the holy scripture doth shew , as well the end and ground of the ordinance , as the subject and manner of it . but the scripture speaks nothing of the end or ground of pedo-baptism , or for what reason they ought to be baptized . ergo , 't is no institution of christ . the minor is undeniable ; some affirm , as we have shewed , p. 15. it was to take away original sin. some say it is their right by the covenant , they being the seed of believers . others say , infants ▪ have faith , and therefore have a right . others say , they have a right by the faith of their sureties . some ground their right from an apostolical tradition ; others upon the authority of scripture . some say , all children of professed christians ought to be baptized ; others say , none but the children of true believers have a right to it . sure , if it was an ordinance of christ , his word would soon end this controversy . arg. 10. if the children of believing gentiles , as such , are not the natural nor spiritual seed of abraham , they can have no right to baptism , or church-membership , by virtue of any covenant-transaction god made with abraham , but the children of believing gentiles , as such , are not the natural nor spiritual seed of abraham . ergo. arg. 11. if no man can prove from scripture , that any spiritual benefit redounds to infants in their baptism , 't is no ordinance of christ . but no man can prove from scripture , that any spiritual benefit redounds to infants in their baptism . ergo. arg. 12. that cannot be an ordinance of christ , for which there is neither command nor example in all god's word , nor promise to such who do it , nor threatnings to such who neglect it . but there is no command or example in all the word of god for the baptizing of little babes , nor promise made to such who are baptized , nor threatnings to such who are not . ergo. that the child lies under a promise who is baptized , or the child under any threatning or danger that is not baptized , let them prove it , since it is denied . arg. 13. if no parents , at any time or times , have been by god the father , jesus christ , or his apostles , either commended for baptizing of their children , or reproved for neglecting to baptize them ; then infant-baptism is no ordinance of god. but no parents at any time or times have been by god commended for baptizing of their children , &c. ergo , infant-baptism is no ordinance of god. this argument will stand unanswerable , unless any can shew who they were that were ever commended for baptizing their children , or reproved for neglecting it , or unless they can shew a parallel case . arg. 14. if men were not to presume to alter any thing in the worship of god under the law , neither to add thereto , nor diminish therefrom , and god is as strict and jealous of his worship under the gospel ; then nothing ought to be altered in god's worship under the gospel . but under the law men were not to presume so to do , and god is as strict and jealous under the gospel . ergo. the major cannot be denied . the minor is clear ; see thou make all things according to the pattern shewed thee in the mount , exod. 25. 40. and levit. 10. 1 , 2. see how nadab and abihu sped , for presuming to vary from the command of god , and vzzah , tho but in small circumstances as they may seem to us . how dare men adventure , this being so , to change baptism from dipping into sprinkling , and the subject , from an adult believer , to an ignorant babe ? add thou not unto his word , &c. arg. 15. whatever practice opens a door to any humane traditions and innovations in god's worship , is a great evil , and to be avoided : but the practice of infant-baptism opens a door to any humane traditions and innovations in god's worship . ergo , to sprinkle or baptize infants is a great evil , and to be avoided . the major will not be denied . the minor is clear , because there is no scripture-ground for it , no command nor example for such a practice in god's word . and if without scripture-authority the church hath power to do one thing , she may do another , and so ad insinitum . arg. 16. whatsoever practice reflects upon the honour , wisdom and care of jesus christ , or renders him less faithful than moses , and the new testament in one of its great ordinances , ( nay , sacraments ) to lie more obscure in god's word , than any law or precept under the old testament , cannot be of god. but the practice of infant-baptism reflects on the honour , care and faithfulness of jesus christ , and renders him less faithful than moses , and a great ordinance , ( nay , sacrament ) of the new testament , to lie more dark and obscure than any precept under the old testament . ergo , infant-baptism cannot be of god. the major cannot be denied . the minor is easily proved : for he is bold indeed who shall affirm infant-baptism doth not lie obscure in god's word . one great party who assert it , say , 't is not to be found in the scripture at all , but 't is an unwritten apostolical tradition : others say , it lies not in the letter of the scripture , but may be proved by consequences ; and yet some great asserters of it , as dr. hammond and others , say , those consequences commonly drawn from divers texts for it , are without demonstration , and so prove nothing . i am sure a man may read the scripture a hundred times over , and never be thereby convinced ; he ought to baptize his children , tho it is powerful to convince men of all other duties . now can this be a truth , since christ who was more faithful than moses , and delivered every thing plainly from the father ? moses left nothing dark as to matter of duty , tho the precepts and external rites of his law were numerous , two or three hundred precepts , yet none were at a loss , or had need to say , is this a truth or an ordinance , or not ? for he that runs may read it . and shall one positive precept given forth by christ , who appointed so few in the new testament , be so obscure , as also the ground and end of it , that men should be confounded about the proofs of it , together with the end and ground thereof ? see heb. 3. 5 , 6. arg. 17. that custom or law which moses never delivered to the jews , nor is any where written in the old testament , was no truth of god , nor of divine authority . but that custom or law to baptize proselytes either men , women or children , was never given to the jews by moses , nor is it any where written in the old testament . ergo , it was no truth of god , nor of divine authority : and evident it is , as sir norton knatchbul shews , that the jewish rabbins differed among themselves also about it : for , saith he , rabbi elizer expresly contradicts rabbi joshua , who was the first i know of who asserted this sort of baptism among the jews : for eliezer , who was contemporary with rabbi joshua , if he did not live before him , asserts , that a proselyte circumcised and not baptized , was a true proselyte . arg. 18. if baptism is of mere positive right , wholly depending on the will and sovereign pleasure of jesus christ , the great legislator : and he hath not required or commanded infants to be baptized : then infants ought not to be baptized : but baptism is of mere positive right , wholly depending on the will and sovereign pleasure of jesus christ , the great legislator , and he hath not required or commanded infants to be baptized . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . this argument tends to cut off all the pretended proofs of pedo-baptism , taken from the covenant made with abraham ; and because children are said to belong to the kingdom of heaven , it was not the right of abraham's male children to be circumcised , because they were begotten , and born of the fruit of his loins , till he received commandment from god to circumcise them . had he done it before , or without a command from god , it would have been will-worship in him so to have done . moreover , this further appears to be so , because no godly man's children , nor others in abraham's days , nor since , had any right thereto , but only his children , ( or such who were bought with his money , or were proselyted to the jewish religion ) because they had no command from god so to do , as abraham had . this being true , it follows , that if we should grant infants of believing gentiles , as such , were the seed of abraham ( which we deny ) yet unless god had commanded them to baptize their children , they ought not to do it ; and if they do it without a command or authority from christ , it will be found an act of will-worship in them . arg. 19. all that were baptized in the apostolical primitive times , were baptized upon the profession of faith , were baptized into christ , and thereby put on christ , and were all one in christ jesus , and were abraham's seed and heirs , according to promise . but infants , as such , who are baptized , were not baptized upon the profession of their faith , nor did they put on christ thereby , nor are they all one in christ jesus , also are not abraham's seed and heirs according to promise . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . mr. baxter confirms the substance of the major . these are his very words , i. e. as many as have been baptized have put on christ , and are all one in christ jesus ; and are abraham ' s seed , and heirs , according to the promise , gal. 3. 27 , 28 , 29. this speaks the apostle , saith he , of the probability grounded on a credible profession , &c. baxter's co●firm . reconcil . pag. 32. the minor will stand firm till any can prove infants by a visible profession have put on christ , are all one in christ jesus , are abraham's seed and heirs according to promise . evident it is , none are the spiritual seed of abraham , but such who have the faith of abraham , but such who have the faith of abraham , and are truly grafred into christ , by a saving-faith . if any object , we read of some who were baptized , who had no saving-faith , but were hypocrites . i answer ; had they appeared to be such , they had not been baptized , nor had they a true right thereto . arg. 20. baptism is the solemnizing of the souls marriage-union with christ , which marriage-contract absolutely requires an actual profession of consent . infants are not capable to enter into a marriage-union with christ , nor to make a profession of consent . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . the major our opposits generally grant , particularly see what mr. baxter saith , our baptism is the solemnizing of our marriage with christ . these are his words , p. 32. the minor none can deny : no man sure in his right mind , will assert that little babes are capable to enter into a marriage-relation with christ , and to make a profession of a consent : and the truth is , he in the next words gives away his cause , viz. and 't is , saith he , a new and strange kind of marriage , where there is no profession of consent ; p. 32. how unhappy was this man to plead for such a new and strange kind of marriage : did he find any little babe he ever baptized ( or rather rantized ) to make a profession of consent to be married to jesus christ . if any should object , he speaks of the baptism of the adult . i answer , his words are these , our baptism is , &c. besides , will any pedo-baptist say , that the baptism of the adult is the solemnizing of the souls marriage with christ , and not the baptism of infants . reader , observe how our opposits are forced sometimes to speak the truth , though it overthrows their own practice of pedo-baptism . arg. 21. if the sins of no persons are forgiven them till they are converted , then they must not be baptized for the forgiveness of them , till they prosess themselves to be converted ; but the sins of no persons are forgiven them till they are converted . ergo , no person ought to be baptized for the forgiveness of them , till they profess they are converted . mr. baxter in the said treatise lays down the substance of this argument also , take his own words , i. e. as their sins are not forgiven them till they are converted , mark 4. 12. so they must not be baptized for the forgiveness of them , till they profess themselves converted , seeing to the church , in esse , and non apparere is all one . repentance towards god , and faith towards our lord jesus is the sum of that preaching that makes disciples , acts 20. 21. therefore , saith he , both these must by a profession seem to be received , before any at age are baptized ; p. 30. 31. and evident it is , say i , from hence none but such at age ought to be baptized . philip caused the eunuch to profess before he would baptize him , that be believed that jesus christ is the son of god. saul had also , saith he , more than a bare profession before baptism , acts 9. 5 , 15 , 17. p. 28. the promise it self , saith he doth expresly require a faith of our own , of all the adult that will have part in the priviledges : therefore there is a faith of our own , that is the condition of our title ; mark 16. 16. p. 16. he might have added by the force of his argument ; therefore infants should not have the priviledges : for i argue thus , viz. arg. 22. if there is but one baptism of water left by jesus christ in the new testament , and but one condition or manner of right thereto : and that one baptism is that of the adult ; then infant-baptism is no baptism of christ . but there is but one baptism in water lest by christ in the new testament , and but one condition and manner of right thereto , and that one baptism is that of the adult . ergo , infant-baptism is no baptism of christ . mr. baxter saith , faith and repentance is the condition of the adult , and as to any other condition , i am sure the scripture is silent ; the way of the lord is one , one lord , one faith , one baptism , ephes . 4. 4. if profession of faith were not necessary , saith mr. baxter , coram ecclesiâ , to church-membership and priviledges , then infidels and heathens would have right ; also , saith he , the church and the world would be confounded . he might have added , but infidels and heathens have no right to church-membership , &c. ergo , 't is a granted case among all christians , saith he , that profession is thus necessary , the apostles and ancient church admitted none without it ; pag. 21. and if so , why dare any now adays admit of infants , who are capable to make no profession . he adds , yea christ in his commission directeth his apostles to make disciples , and then baptize them , promising , he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved , mark 16. 16. pag. 27. furthermore he saith , if as many as are baptized into christ , are baptized into his death , and are buried with him by baptism into death , that like as christ was raised from the dead , so we also should-walk in newness of life , &c. then no doubt , saith he , but such as were to be baptized , did first profess this mortification , and a consent to be buried , &c. in our baptism we put off the body of the the sins of the flesh , by the circumcision of christ , being buried with him , and raised with him through faith , quickned with him , and having all our trespasses forgiven , col. 2. 11 , 12 , 13. and will any mau ( says he ) yea , will paul ascribe all this to those that did not so much as profess the things signified ? will baptism , in the judgment of a wise man , do all this for an infidel , ( or , say i , for an infant ) that cannot make a profession that he is a christian ? pag. 31 , 32. he proceeds . arg. 23. the baptized are in scripture called men washed , sanctified , justified ; they are called saints , and churches of saints , 1 cor. 1. 2. all christians are sanctified ones : pag. 33. now let me add the minor. but infants baptized are not in scripture called men washed , sanctified , justified , they are not called saints , churches of saints , christians , nor sanctified ones . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . if any should say , why did you not cite these assertions of mr. baxter's whilst he was living ? i answer , more then twelve years ago i did recite and print these assertions , and many other arguments of his to the same purpose , to which he gave no answer . arg. 24. if there is but one way for all , both parents and children to be admitted into the gospel-church to the end of the world , and that it is upon the profession of faith to be baptized ; then both parents and children must upon the profession of their faith be baptized , and so admitted , &c. but there is but one way for all , both parents and children , to be admitted into the gospel-church to the end of the world , and that is upon the profession their faith to be baptized . ergo. arg. 25. that cannot be christ's true baptism wherein there is not , cannot be a lively representation of the death , burial and resurrection of jesus christ , together with our death unto sin , and vivification to a new life . but in the rantizing or sprinkling of an infant , there is not , cannot be a lively representation of christ's death , burial and resurrection , &c. ergo. arg. 26. that pretended baptism that tends to frustrate the glorious end and design of christ in his instituting of gospe-baptism , or cannot answer it , is none of christ's baptism . but the pretended baptism of infants tends to frustrate the glorious end and design of christ in instituting of gospel-baptism , ergo. that major will not he denied . as to the minor , all generally confes the end or design of christ in instituting the ordinance of baptism , was in a lively figure , to represent his death , burial , and resurrection , with the person 's death unto sin , and his rising again to walk in newness of life , that is baptized , as the sacrament of the supper was ordained to represent his body was broke , and his blood was shed . but that a lively figure of christ's death , burial , and resurrection , appears in sprinkling a little water on the face , i see not ; and as done to an infant , there can no death to sin , and rising again to walk in newness of life , be signified ; and therefore christ's design and end therein is frustrated . arg. 27. if baptism be immersion , as to the proper and genuine signification of the word baptizo , as also of those typical and metaphorical baptisms and the spiritual signification thereof ; then sprinkling cannot be christ's true baptism . but immersion is the proper and genuine signification of the word baptizo , and also of those typical and metaphorical baptisms spoken of , and the spiritual signification thereof . ergo , sprinkling is not christ's true baptism . 1. that the proper and genuine signification of the word baptizo is immersion , or to dip , &c. we have proved , which is also confessed by the learned in the language . 2. the figurative baptism was , 1st . that of the red sea , wherein the ●●thers were buried , as it were , unto moses in the sea , and under the cloud . pools annotations on 1 cor. 10. 2. others , saith he , more probably think that the apostle useth this term , in regard of the great analogy betwixt baptism ( as it was then used ) the persons going down into the waters , and being dipped in them ; and the israelites going down into the sea , the great receptacle of water , though the water at that time was gathered on heaps on either side of them ; yet they seemed-buried in the water , as persons in that age were when they were baptized , &c. the 2d . was that of noah's ark. see sir norton knatchb●ll : the ark of noah and baptism , saith he , were both a type and figure of the resurrection , not the sign of the washing away of sin , though so taken metonymically , but a particular signal of the resurrection of christ : of this baptism is a lively and emphatical figure , as also was the ark of noah , out of which he returned as from a sepulchre , to a new life . 3. metaphorical baptism is that of the spirit and of affliction : the first signifies not a sprinkling of the spirit , but the great effusion of the spirit , like that at pentecost , acts 1. 4 , 5. shall be baptized , &c. on which words casaubon speaks thus : see dr. d● veil on acts 2. the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is to dip or plunge , as it were to die colours , in which sense , saith he , the apostles might be truly said to have been baptized for the house in which this was done , was filled with the holy ghost ; so that the apostles might seem to have been plunged into it as in a large fish-pond . also 〈◊〉 on acts 2. saith , a wind filled the whole house , that it seemed like a fish-pond , because it was promised to the apostles , that they should be baptized with the holy ghost . and the baptism of afflic●●● are those great depths or overwhelming of afflictions , like that of our saviour's 〈◊〉 , i. e. no part free ; matth. 20. 22. 〈◊〉 you have the same greed word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and like that , of david , who saith , 〈…〉 him out of gr●●t waters . 4. the spiritual signification thereof ●● the death , burial and resurrection of christ and of our death to sin , and vivification 〈◊〉 a new life . this being so , it follows 〈…〉 sprinkling cannot be christ●● true 〈…〉 it must be immersion , and nothing else . and in the last place , finally , to 〈◊〉 that baptizo is to dip , both from the literal 〈◊〉 spiritual signification thereof , as also 〈◊〉 those typical and metaphorical baptism ●●●tioned in the scripture , i might add 〈…〉 that this evidently appears from the 〈…〉 of john baptist and the apostles of 〈◊〉 who baptized in rivers , and where 〈…〉 much water : and also , because the 〈…〉 baptized are said to go down into the w●●●● ( not down to the water ) and came 〈◊〉 of the water . john baptist is said to 〈◊〉 them into jordan , as the greek word 〈◊〉 it , which shews it dipping and not 〈◊〉 . would it be proper to say , he 〈…〉 them into jordan ? the lord open 〈…〉 those who see not , to consider these 〈…〉 finis . a discourse of baptisme, its institution and efficacy upon all believers. together with a consideration of the practise of the church in baptizing infants of beleeving parents: and the practise justified by jer: taylor d.d. taylor, jeremy, 1613-1667. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a95331 of text r203923 in the english short title catalog (thomason e682_2). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 166 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 33 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a95331 wing t315 thomason e682_2 estc r203923 99863699 99863699 115910 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a95331) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 115910) images scanned from microfilm: (thomason tracts ; 105:e682[2]) a discourse of baptisme, its institution and efficacy upon all believers. together with a consideration of the practise of the church in baptizing infants of beleeving parents: and the practise justified by jer: taylor d.d. taylor, jeremy, 1613-1667. [4], 60 p. printed by j. flesher for r. royston, at the angel in ivy-lane, london, : mdclii. [1652] annotation on thomason copy: "nou. 27.". reproduction of the original in the british library. eng infant baptism -early works to 1800. baptism -church of england -early works to 1800. a95331 r203923 (thomason e682_2). civilwar no a discourse of baptisme,: its institution and efficacy upon all believers. together with a consideration of the practise of the church in b taylor, jeremy 1652 30140 18 335 0 0 0 0 117 f the rate of 117 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the f category of texts with 100 or more defects per 10,000 words. 2007-02 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-02 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2007-03 jonathan blaney sampled and proofread 2007-03 jonathan blaney text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a discovrse of baptisme , its institution , and efficacy upon all believers . together with a consideration of the practise of the church in baptizing infants of beleeving parents : and the practise justified by jer : taylor d. d. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . suffer little children to come unto me , and forbid them not , &c. london , printed by j. flesher for r. royston , at the angel in ivy-lane . mdclii . to the reader . be pleased to take notice , that this discourse was not intended by the author to have been sent abroad thus by it self , but was fitted by him to the ayr and mode of other discourses , wherewith he had designed it to be joyned . but some persons of judgement , to whose perusal it was committed , supposing that if this should be kept in till those other could be finished , some disadvantage might arise to the cause which it asserts , wished and advised it might be published by it self . to whose desires the author ( against his first design ) hath condescended , upon this perswasion , that though it appears thus without some formalities and complements requisite to an intire treatise , yet , as to the thing it self , there is nothing wanting to it which he believed material to the question , or useful to the church . and as for those arguments which in the liberty of prophecying , sect. 18. are alleaged against paedobaptism , and in the opinion of some , do seem to stand in need of answering , he had it once in thought to have answered them : but upon these considerations he forbore , 1. because those arguments are not good in themselves , or to the question precisely considered : but onely by relation to the preceding arguments there brought for paedobaptism , they may seem good one against another , but these in the plea for the anababaptists , have no strength , but what is accidental ( as he conceives . ) 2. because in this discourse he hath really laid such grounds , and proved them , that upon their supposition all those arguments in the liberty of prophecying , and all other which he ever heard of , will fall of themselves . 3. because those arguments , to his sense , are so weak , and so relying upon failing and deceitful principles , that he was loath to do them so much reputation , as to account them worthy the answering . 4. but because there may be some necessities which he knows not of , and are better observed by them who live in the midst of them , then by himself , who is thrust into a retirement in wales , therefore he accounts himself at rest in this particular , because he hath understood that his very worthy friend dr. h : hammond hath in his charity and humility descended to answer that collection ; and hopes , that both their hands being so fast clasped in a mutual complication , will do some help and assistance to this question , by which the ark of the church is so violently shaken . a discourse of baptism . when the holy jesus was to begin his prophetical office , and to lay the foundation of his church on the corner-stone , he first temper'd the cement with water and then with blood , and afterwards built it up by the hands of the spirit : himself enter'd at that door by which his disciples for ever after were to follow him ; for therefore he went in at the door of baptism , that he might hallow the entrance which himself made to the house he was now building . as it was in the old , so it is in the new creation ; out of the waters god produced every living creature : and when at first the spirit moved upon the waters , and gave life , it was the type of what was designed in the renovation . every thing that lives now , is born of water and the spirit ; and christ , who is our creator and redeemer in the new birth , opened the fountains and hallowed the stream : christ who is our life went down into the waters of baptism , and we who descend thither finde the effects of life ; it is living water , of which whoso drinks , needs not to drink of it again , for it shall be in him a well of water springing up to life eternal . but because every thing is resolved into the same principles from whence they are taken , the old world which by the power of god came from the waters , by their own sin fell into the waters again , and were all drowned , and onely eight persons were saved by an ark : and the world renewed upon the stock and reserves of that mercy , consigned the sacrament of baptism in another figure ; for then god gave his sign from heaven , that by water the world should never again perish : but he meant that they should be saved by water : for baptism , which is a figure like to this , doth also now save us by the resurrection of jesus christ . after this , the jews report that the world took up the doctrine of baptisms , in remembrance that the iniquity of the old world was purged by water ; and they washed all that came to the service of the true god , and by that baptism bound them to the observation of the precepts which god gave to noah . but when god separated a family for his own especial service , he gave them a sacrament of initiation , but it was a sacrament of blood , the covenant of circumcision : and this was the fore-runner of baptism , but not a type ; when that was abrogated , this came into the place of it , and that consigned the same faith which this professes : but it could not properly be a type , whose nature is by a likeness of matter or ceremony to represent the same mystery . neither is a ceremony , as baptism truly is , properly capable of having a type , it self is but a type of a greater mysteriousness : and the nature of types is , in shadow to describe by dark lines a future substance ; so that although circumcision might be a type of the effects and graces bestowed in baptism , yet of the baptism or ablution it self , it cannot be properly ; because of the unlikeness of the symboles and configurations , and because they are both equally distant from substances , which types are to consign and represent . the first bishops of jerusalem , and all the christian jews for many years retained circumcision together with baptism ; and christ himself , who was circumcised , was also baptized ; and therefore it is not so proper to call circumcision a type of baptism : it was rather a seal and sign of the same covenant to abraham and the fathers , and to all israel , as baptism is to all ages of the christian church . and because this rite could not be administred to all persons , and was not at all times after its institution , god was pleased by a proper and specifick type to consign this rite of baptism , which he intended to all , and that for ever : and god , when this family of his church grew separate , notorious , numerous and distinct , he sent them into their own countrey by a baptism through which the whole nation pass'd : for all the fathers were under the cloud , and all passed through the sea , and were all baptized unto moses in the cloud , and in the sea ; so by a double figure foretelling , that as they were initiated to moses law by the cloud above and the sea beneath : so should all the persons of the church , men , women and children , be initiated unto christ by the spirit from above and the water below : for it was the design of the apostle in that discourse , to represent that the fathers and we were equal as to the priviledges of the covenant ; he proved that we do not exceed them , and it ought therefore to be certain that they do not exceed us , nor their children ours . but after this , something was to remain which might not onely consign the covenant which god made with abraham , but be as a passage from the fathers thorough the synagogue to the church ; from abraham by moses to christ : and that was circumcision , which was a rite which god chose to be a mark to the posterity of abraham , to distinguish them from the nations which were not within the covenant of grace , and to be a seal of the righteousness of faith , which god made to be the spirit and life of the covenant . but because circumcision although it was ministred to all the males , yet it was not to the females ; and although they and all the nation was baptized and initiated into moses in the cloud and the sea , yet the children of israel by imitation of the patriarchs the posterity of noah , used also ceremonial baptisms to their women and to their proselytes , and to all that were circumcised ; and the jews deliver , that sarah and rebecca when they were adopted into the family of the church , that is , of abraham and isaac , were baptized : and so were all strangers that were married to the sons of israel . and that we may think this typical of christian baptism , the doctors of the jews had a tradition , that when the messias would come , there should be so many proselytes that they could not be circumcised , but should be baptized . the tradition proved true , but not for their reason . but that this rite of admitting into mysteries , and institutions , and offices of religion by baptisms , was used by the posterity of noah , or at least very early among the jews , besides the testimonies of their own doctors , i am the rather induced to believe , because the heathen had the same rite in many places and in several religions : so they initiated disciples into the secrets of a mithra ; and the priests of cotyttus were called b baptae , because by baptism they were admitted into the religion ; and they c thought murther , incest , rapes , and the worst of crimes , were purged by dipping in the sea , or fresh springs ; and a proselyte is called in arrianus , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , intinctus , a baptized person . but this ceremony of baptizing was so certain and usual among the jews , in their admitting proselytes and adopting into institutions , that to baptize and to make disciples are all one ; and when john the baptist by an order from heaven went to prepare the way to the coming of our blessed lord , he preached repentance , and baptized all that professed they did repent . he taught the jews to live good lives , and baptized with the baptism of a prophet , such as was not unusually done by extraordinary and holy persons in the change or renewing of discipline or religion . whether john's baptism was from heaven , or of men , christ asked the pharisees . that it was from heaven , the people therefore believed , because he was a prophet , and a holy person : but it implies also , that such baptisms are sometimes from men , that is , used by persons of an eminent religion , or extraordinary fame for the gathering of disciples and admitting proselytes : and the disciples of christ did so too , even before christ had instituted the sacrament for the christian church , the disciples that came to christ were baptized by his apostles . and now we are come to the gates of baptism . all these till john were but types and preparatory baptisms , and john's baptism was but the prologue to the baptism of christ , the jewish baptisms admitted proselytes to moses and to the law of ceremonies ; john's baptism called them to believe in the messias now appearing , and to repent of their sins , to enter into the kingdom which was now at hand , and preached that repentance which should be for the remission of sins . his baptism remitted no sins , but preached and consigned repentance , which , in the belief of the messias whom he pointed to , should pardon sins . but because he was taken from his office before the work was compleated , the disciples of christ finished it : they went forth preaching the same sermon of repentance , and the approach of the kingdom , and baptized or made proselytes or disciples , as john did ; onely they ( as it is probable ) baptized in the name of jesus , which it is not so likely john did . a and this very thing might be the cause of the different forms b of baptism recorded in the acts , of baptizing in the name of iesus , and at other times in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost ; the former being the manner of doing it in pursuance of the design of john's baptism ; and the latter the form of institution by christ for the whole christian church , appointed after his resurrection : the disciples at first using promiscuously what was used by the same authority , though with some difference of mystery . the holy jesus having found his way ready prepared by the preaching of john , and by his baptism , and the jewish manner of adopting proselytes and disciples into the religion , a way chalked out for him to initiate disciples into his religion , took what was so prepared , and changed it into a perpetual sacrament . he kept the ceremony , that they who were led onely by outward things , might be the better called in , and easier inticed into the religion , when they entred by a ceremony which their nation alwayes used in the like cases : and therefore without change of the outward act , he put into it a new spirit , and gave it a new grace and a proper efficacy : he sublim'd it to higher ends , and adorned it with stars of heaven : he made it to signifie greater mysteries , to convey greater blessings , to consign the bigger promises , to cleanse deeper then the skin , and to carry proselytes further then the gates of the institution . for so he was pleased to do in the other sacrament ; he took the ceremony which he found ready in the custom of the jews , where the major domo after the paschal supper gave bread and wine to every person of his family ; he changed nothing of it without , but transferr'd the rite to greater mysteries , and put his own spirit to their sign , and it became a sacrament evangelical . it was so also in the matter of excommunication , where the jewish practise was made to pass into christian discipline : without violence and noise old things became new , while he fulfilled the law , making it up in full measures of the spirit . by these steps baptism passed on to a divine evangelical institution , which we finde to be consigned by three evangelists . go ye therefore and teach all nations , baptizing them in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost . it was one of the last commandments the holy jesus gave upon the earth , when he taught his apostles the things which concerned his kingdome . for he that believeth and is baptized , shall be saved : but , vnless a man be born of water and the holy spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven ; agreeable to the decretory words of god by abraham in the circumcision , to which baptism does succeed in the consignation of the same covenant and the same spiritual promises ; the uncircumcised childe whose flesh is not circumcised , that soul shall be cut off from his people ; he hath broken my covenant . the manichees , seleucus , hermias , and their followers , people of a dayes abode and small interest , but of malicious doctrine , taught , baptism not to be necessary , not to be used ; upon this ground , because they supposed that it was proper to john to baptize with water , and reserved for christ as his peculiar , to baptize with the holy ghost and with fire . indeed christ baptized none otherwise . he sent his spirit upon the church in pentecost and baptized them with fire , the spirit appearing like a flame : but he appointed his apostles to baptize with water , and they did so , and their successors after them , every where and for ever , not expounding , but obeying the praeceptive words of their lord , which were almost the last that he spake upon earth . and i cannot think it necessary to prove this to be necessary by any more arguments . for the words are so plain , that they need no exposition ; and yet if they had been obscure , the universal practise of the apostles and the church for ever , is a sufficient declaration of the commandment : no tradition is more universal , no not of scripture it self ; no words are plainer , no not the ten commandments : and if any suspicion can be superinduced by any jealous or less discerning person , it will need no other refutation , but to turn his eyes to those lights by which himself sees scripture to be the word of god , and the commandments to be the declaration of his will . but that which will be of greatest concernment in this affair , is to consider the great benefits are conveyed to us in this sacrament ; for this will highly conclude , that the precept was for ever , which god so seconds with his grace and mighty blessings ; and the susception of it necessary , because we cannot be without those excellent things which are the graces of the sacrament . 1. the first fruit is , that in baptism we are admitted to the kingdome of christ , presented unto him , consigned with his sacrament , enter into his militia , give up our understandings and our choice to the obedience of christ , and in all senses that we can , become his disciples , witnessing a good confession , and undertaking a holy life : and therefore in scripture {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , are conjoyn'd in the significations , as they are in the mystery : it is a giving up our names to christ , and it is part of the foundation or the first principles of the religion , as appears in s. pauls catechism ; it is so the first thing , that it is for babes , and neophytes , in which they are matriculated and adopted into the house of their father , and taken into the hands of their mother . upon this account baptism is called in antiquity , ecclesiae janua , porta gratiae , & primus introitus sanctorum ad aeternam dei & ecclesiae consuetudinem . the gates of the church , the door of grace , the first entrance of the saints to an eternal conversation with god and the church . sacramentum initiationis , & intrantium christianismum investituram , s. bernard calls it : the sacrament of initiation , and the investiture of them that enter into the religion ; and the person so entring is called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , one of the religion , or a proselyte and convert , and one added to the number of the church , in imitation of that of s. luke , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , god added to the church those that should be saved ; just as the church does to this day and for ever , baptizing infants and catechumens : {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , they are added to the church , that they may be added to the lord , and the number of the inhabitants of heaven . 2. the next step beyond this , is adoption into the covenant , which is an immediate consequent of the first presentation , this being the first act of man , that the first act of god . and this is called by s. paul , a being baptized in one spirit into one body , that is , we are made capable of the communion of saints , the blessings of the faithful , the priviledges of the church : by this we are , as s. luke calls it , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , ordained , or disposed , put into the order of eternal life , being made members of the mystical body under christ our head . 3. and therefore baptism is a new birth , by which we enter into the new world , the new creation , the blessings and spiritualities of the kingdome ; and this is the expression which our saviour himself used to nicodemus , vnless a man be born of water and the spirit : and it is by s. paul called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the laver of regeneration ; for now we begin to be reckoned in a new census or account , god is become our father , christ our elder brother , the spirit the earnest of our inhetance , the church our mother , our food is the body and blood of our lord ; faith is our learning , religion our imployment , and our whole life is spiritual , and heaven the object of our hopes , and the mighty price of our high calling . and from this time forward we have a new principle put into us , the spirit of grace , which besides our soul and body , is a principle of action , of one nature , and shall with them enter into the portion of our inheritance . and therefore the primitive christians , who consigned all their affairs and goods and writings with some marks of their lord , usually writing {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , iesus christ the son of god our saviour ; they made it an abbreviature by writing onely the capitals , thus : {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . which the heathens in mockery and derision made {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , which signifies a fish , and they used it for christ as a name of reproach : but the christians owned the name , and turned it into a pious metaphor , and were content that they should enjoy their pleasure in the acrostich ; but upon that occasion tertullian speaks pertinently to this article , nos pisciculi secundum {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} nostrum jesum christum , in aquâ nascimur . christ whom you call a fish , we knowledge to be our lord and saviour ; and we , if you please , are the little fishes , for we are born in water ; thence we derive our spiritual life . and because from henceforward we are a new creation , the church uses to assign new relations to the catechumens , spiritual fathers and susceptors ; and at their entrance into baptism , the christians and jewish proselytes did use to cancel all secular affections to their temporal relatives , nec quicquam prius imbuuntur quam contemnere deos , exuere patriam , parentes , liberos , fratres vilia habere , said tacitus of the christians : which was true in the sense onely as christ said , he that doth not hate father or mother for my sake , is not worthy of me ; that is , he that doth not hate them prae me , rather then forsake me , forsake them , is unworthy of me . 4. in baptism all our sins are pardoned , according to the words of a prophet : i will sprinkle clean water upon you , and ye shall be clean from all your filthiness . the catechumen descends into the font a sinner , he arises purified ; he goes down the son of death , he comes up the son of the resurrection ; he enters in the son of folly and praevarication , he returns the son of reconciliation ; he stoops down the childe of wrath , and ascends the heir of mercy ; he was the childe of the devil , and now he is the servant and the son of god . they are the words of ven. bede concerning this mystery . and this was ingeniously signified by that greek inscription upon a font , which is so prettily contriv'd that the words may be read after the greek or after the hebrew manner , and be exactly the same , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , lord wash my sin , and not my face onely . and so it is intended and promised , arise and be baptized , and wash away thy sins , and call on the name of the lord , said ananias to saul ; for , christ loved the church and gave himself for it , that he might sanctifie and cleanse it , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , with the washing of water in the word , that is , baptism in the christian religion : and therefore tertullian calls baptism lavacrum compendiatum , a compendious laver ; that is , an intire cleansing the soul in that one action justly and rightly performed : in the rehearsal of which doctrine , it was not an unpleasant etymology that anastasius sinaita gave of baptism ; {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , in which our sins are thrown off ; and they fall like leeches when they are full of blood and water , or like the chains from s. peters hands at the presence of the angel . baptism is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , an intire full forgiveness of sins , so that they shall never be called again to scrutiny . — omnia daemonis arma his merguntur aquis , quibus ille renascitur infant qui captivus erat — the captivity of the soul is taken away by the blood of redemption , and the fiery darts of the devil are quenched by these salutary waters ; and what the flames of hell are expiating or punishing to eternal ages , that is washed off quickly in the holy font , and an eternal debt paid in an instant : for so sure as the egyptians were drowned in the red sea , so sure are our sins washed in this holy flood : for this is a red sea too ; these waters signifie the blood of christ , these are they that have washed their robes , and made them white in the blood of the lamb , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . the blood of christ cleanseth us , the water cleanseth us , the spirit purifies us ; the blood by the spirit , the spirit by the water , all in baptism , and in pursuance of that baptismal state . these three are they that bear record in earth , the spirit , the water , and the blood , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , these three agree in one , or are to one purpose ; they agree in baptism , and in the whole pursuance of the assistances , which a christian needs all dayes of his life : and therefore s. cyril calls baptism {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the antitype of the passions of christ : it does preconsign the death of christ ; and does the infancy of the work of grace , but not weakly ; it brings from death to life ; and though it brings us but to the birth in the new life , yet that is a greater change then is in all the periods of our growth to manhood , to a perfect man in christ jesus . 5. baptism does not onely pardon our sins , but puts us into a state of pardon for the time to come . for baptism is the beginning of the new life , and an admission of us into the evangelical covenant , which on our parts consists in a sincere and timely endevour to glorifie god by faith and obedience : and on gods part , he will pardon what is past , assist us for the future , and not measure us by grains and scruples , or exact our duties by the measure of an angel , but by the span of a mans hand . so that by baptism we are consigned to the mercies of god . and the graces of the gospel ; that is , that our pardon be continued , and our piety be a state of repentance . and therefore that baptism which in the nicene creed we profess to be for the remission of sins , is called in the jerusalem creed , the baptism of repentance ; that is , it is the entrance of a new life , the gate to a perpetual change and reformation , all the way continuing our title to , and hopes of forgiveness of sins . and this excellency is clearly recorded by s. paul , the kindeness and love of god our saviour toward man hath appeared ; not by works in righteousness which we have done : that 's the formality of the gospel-covenant , not to be exacted by the strict measures of the law , but according to his mercy he saved us , that is , by gentleness and remissions , by pitying and pardoning us , by relieving and supporting us , because he remembers that we are but dust ; and all this mercy we are admitted to , and is conveyed to us , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , by the laver of regeneration , and the renewing of the holy ghost . and this plain evident doctrine was observed , explicated and urged against the messalians , who said that baptism was like a razor , that cut away all the sins that were past , or presently adhering , but not the sins of our future life ; {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . this sacrament promises more and greater things , it is the earnest of future good things , the type of the resurrection , the communication of the lords passion , the partaking of his resurrection , the robe of righteousness , the garment of gladness , vestment of light , or rather light it self . and for this reason it is , that baptism is not to be repeated , because it does at once all that it can do at a hundred times : for it admits us to the condition of repentance and evangelical mercy , to a state of pardon for our infirmities and sins , which we timely and effectually leave : and this is a thing that can be done but once , as a man can begin but once ; he that hath once entred in at this gate of life is alwayes in possibility of pardon , if he be in a possibility of working and doing after the manner of a man , that which he hath promised to the son of god . and this was expresly delivered and observed by s. austin . that which the apostle sayes , cleansing him with the washing of water in the word , is to be understood , that in the same laver of regeneration , and word of sanctification , all the evils of the regenerate are cleansed and healed : not onely the sins that are past , which all are now remitted in baptism ; but also those that are contracted afterwards by humane ignorance and infirmity : not that baptism be repeated as often as we sin , but because by this which is once administred , is brought to pass that pardon of all sins , not onely of those that are past , but also those which will be committed afterwards , is obtained . the messalians denyed this , and it was part of their heresie in the undervaluing of baptism ; and for it they are most excellently confuted by isidore pelusiot , in his third book , 195 epistle to the count hermin : whither i refer the reader . in proportion to this doctrine it is , that the holy scripture calls upon us to live a holy life , in pursuance of this grace of baptism . and s. paul recals the lapsed galatians to their covenant , and the grace of god stipulated in baptism : ye are all children of god by faith in iesus christ ; that is , heirs of the promise , and abrahams seed : that promise which cannot be disannulled , increased or diminished , but is the same to us as it was to abraham ; the same before the law and after . therefore do not you hope to be justified by the law , for you are entred into the covenant of faith , and are to be justified thereby . this is all your hope , by this you must stand for ever , or you cannot stand at all ; but by this you may : for you are gods children by faith ; that is , not by the law , or the covenant of works : and that you may remember whence you are going , and return again , he proves , that they are the children of god by faith in jesus christ , because they have been baptized into christ , and so put on christ . this makes you children , and such as are to be saved by faith , that is , a covenant , not of works , but of pardon in jesus christ , the author and establisher of this covenant . for this is the covenant made in baptism , that being justified by his grace , we shall be heirs of life eternal : for by grace , that is , by favor , remission and forgiveness in jesus christ , ye are saved . this is the onely way that we have of being justified , and this must remain as long as we are in hopes of heaven : for besides this we have no hopes , and all this is stipulated and consigned in baptism , and is of force after our fallings into sin and risings again . in pursuance of this , the same apostle declares , that the several states of sin , are so many recessions from the state of baptismal grace ; and if we arrive to the direct apostasie and renouncing of , or a contradiction to , the state of baptism , we are then unpardonable , because we are faln from our state of pardon . this s. paul conditions most strictly , in his epistle to the hebrews ; this is the covenant i will make in those days , i will put my laws in their hearts , and their sins and iniquities will i remember no more . now where remission of these is , there is no more offering for sin ; that is , our sins are so pardoned , that we need no more oblation , we are then made partakers of the death of christ ; which we afterwards renew in memory and eucharist , and representment . but the great work is done in baptism : for so it follows ; having boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of iesus , by a new and living way , that is , by the vail of his flesh , his incarnation . but how do we enter into this ? baptism is the door , and the ground of this confidence for ever : for so he addes ; let us draw near with a true heart , in full assurance of faith , having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience , and our bodies washed with pure water . this is the consignation of this blessed state , and the gate to all this mercy : let us therefore hold fast the profession of our faith ; that is , the religion of a christian ; the faith into which we were baptized : for that is the faith that justifies and saves vs ; let us therefore hold fast this profession of this faith , and do all the intermedial works , in order to the conservation of it , such as are assembling in the communion of saints , ( the use of the word and sacrament is included in the precept ) mutual exhortation , good example , and the like : for if we sin wilfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth , that is , if we sin against the profession of this faith , and hold it not fast , but let the faith and the profession go wilfully , ( which afterwards he cals a treading under foot the son of god , a counting the blood of the covenant wherewith he was sanctified , an unholy thing , and a doing despite to the spirit of grace ; viz. which moved upon these waters , and did illuminate him in baptism ) if we do this , there is no more sacrifice for sins , no more deaths of christ , into which you may be baptized ; that is , you are faln from the state of pardon and repentance , into which you were admitted in baptism , and in which you continue , so long as you have not quitted you baptismal rights , and the whole covenant . contrary to this , is that which s. peter calls making our calling and election sure ; that is , a doing all that which may continue us in our state of baptism , and the grace of the covenant . and between these two states , of absolute apostasie from , and intirely adhering to , and securing this state of calling and election , are all the intermedial sins , and being overtaken in single faults , or declining towards vitious habits ; which in their several proportions , are degrees of danger and insecurity ; which s. peter calls , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , a forgetting our baptism , or purification from our sins . and in this sense are those words , the just shall live by faith ; that is , by that profession which they made in baptism : from which , if they swerve not , they shall be supported in their spiritual life . it is a grace , which by vertue of the covenant consign'd in baptism , does like a centre , transmit effluxes to all the periods and portion of our life : our whole life , all the periods of our succeeding hopes , are kept alive by this . this consideration is of great use , besides many other things , to reprove the folly of those who in the primitive church deferr'd their baptism till their death-bed : because baptism is a laver of sanctification , and drowns all our sins , and buries them in the grave of our lord , they thought they might sin securely upon the stock of an after-baptism ; for unless they were strangely preventedly a sudden accident , a death-bed baptism they thought would secure their condition : but early some of them durst not take it , much less in the beginning of their years , that they might at least gain impunity for their follies and heats of their youth . baptism hath influence into the pardon of all our sins committed in all the dayes of our folly and infirmity ; and so long as we have not been baptized , so long we are out of the state of pardon , and therefore an early . baptism is not to be avoided , upon this mistaken fancy and plot upon heaven : it is the greater security towards the pardon of our sins , if we have taken it in the beginning of our dayes . 5. the next benefit of baptism , which is also a verification of this , is a sanctification of the baptized person by the spirit of grace : sanctus in hunc coelo descendit spiritus amnem , coelestique sacras fonte maritat aquas : concipit unda deum , sanctumque liquoribus almis edit ab aeterno semine progeniem . the holy ghost descends upon the waters of baptism , and makes them prolifical , apt to produce children unto god : and therefore saint leo compares the font of baptism , to the womb of the blessed virgin . when it was replenished with the holy spirit . and this is the baptism of our dearest lord : his ministers baptize with water ; our lord at the same time verifies their ministery , with giving the holy spirit : they are joyned together by s. paul , we are by one spirit baptized into one body ; that is , admitted into the church by baptism of water and the spirit . this is that which our blessed lord calls a being born of water and of the spirit ; by water we are sacramently dead and buried , by the spirit we are made alive . but because these are mysterious expressions , and according to the style of scripture , high and secret in spiritual significations , therefore that we may understand what these things signifie , we must consider it by its real effects , and what it produces upon the soul of a man . 1. it is the suppletory of original righteousness , by which adam was at first gracious with god , and which he lost by his prevarication . it was in him a principle of wisdome and obedience , a relation between god and himself , a title to the extraordinary mercies of god , and a state of friendship : when he fell , he was discomposed in all , the links of the golden chain and blessed relation were broken ; and it so continued in the whole life of man , which was stained with the evils of this folly , and the consequent mischiefs : and therefore when we began the world again , entring into the articles of a new life , god gave us his spirit , to be an instrument of our becoming gracious persons , and of being in a condition of obtaining that supernatural end which god at first designed to us . and therefore as our baptism is a separation of us from unbelieving people : so the descent of the holy spirit upon us in our baptism , is a consigning or marking us for god , as the sheep of his pasture , as the souldiers of his army , as the servants of his houshold : we are so separated from the world , that we are appropriated to god , so that god expects of us duty and obedience ; and all sins are acts of rebellion and undutifulness : of this nature was the sanctification of jeremy and john the baptist from their mothers womb ; that is , god took them to his own service by an early designation , and his spirit mark'd them to a holy ministery . to this also relates that of s. paul , whom god by a decree separated from his mothers womb to the ministery of the gospel : the decree did antedate the act of the spirit , which did not descend upon him until the day of his baptism . what these persons were in order to exterior ministeries , that all the faithful are in order to faith and obedience , consigned in baptism by the spirit of god , to a perpetual relation to god , in a continual service and title to his promises . and in this sense the spirit of god is called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , * a seal , in whom also after that ye believed , ye were sealed with that holy spirit of promise , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . the water washes the body , and the spirit seals the soul ; viz. to a participation of those promises which he hath made , and to which we receive a title to our baptism . 2. the second effect of the spirit , is light or illumination ; that is , the holy spirit becomes unto us the author of holy thoughts , and firm perswasions , and fets to his seal that the word of god is true ; into the belief of which we are then baptized , and makes faith to be a grace , and the understanding resigned , and the will confident , and the assent stronger then the premises , and the propositions to be believed , because they are belov'd , and we are taught the wayes of godliness after a new manner , that is , we are made to perceive the secrets of the kingdome , and to love religion , and to long for heaven and heavenly things , and to despise the world , and to have new resolutions , and new perceptions , and new delicacies , in order to the establishment of faith , and its increment and perseverance , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . god sits in the soul when it is illuminated in baptism , as if he sate in his throne ; that is , he rules by a firm perswasion , and intire principles of obedience . and therefore baptism is called in scripture , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , and the baptized , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , illuminated : call to minde the former dayes , in which ye were illuminated : and the same phrase is in the 6. to the hebrews , where the parallel places expound each other . for that which s. paul calls , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , once illuminated ; he calls after , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , a receiving the knowledge of the truth : and that you may perceive this to be wholly meant of baptism , the apostle expresses it still by its synonymas , tasting of the heavenly gift , and made partakers of the holy ghost , sprinkled in our hearts from an evil conscience , and washed in our bodies with pure water : all which also are a syllabus or collection of the several effects of the graces bestowed in baptism . but we are now instancing in that which relates most properly to the understanding , in which respect the holy spirit also is called anointing or unction ; and the mystery is explicated by s. john , the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you , and ye need not that any man teach you ; but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things . 3. the holy spirit descends upon us in baptism , to become the principle of a new life ; to become a holy seed , springing up to holiness , and is called by s. john , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the seed of god : and the purpose of it we are taught by him , whosoever is born of god ( that is , he that is regenerated and entred into this new birth ) doth not commit sin ; for his seed remaineth in him , and he cannot sin , because he is born of god . the spirit of god , is the spirit of life ; and now that he by the spirit is born anew , he hath in him that principle , which , if it be cherished , will grow up to life , to life eternal . and this is the spirit of sanctification , the victory of the world , the deletery of concupiscence , the life of the soul , and the perpetuall principle of grace sown in our spirits in the day of our adoption to be the sons of god , and members of christs body . but take this mystery in the words of s. basil ; there are two ends proposed in baptism , to wit , to abolish the body of sin , that we may no more bring forth fruit unto death ; and to live in the spirit , and to have our fruit to sanctification . the water represents the image of death , receiving the body in its bosome , as in a sepulchre . but the quickning spirit sends upon us a vigorous {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , power or efficacy , even from the beginning renewing our souls from the death of sin unto life . for as our mortification is perfected in the water , so the spirit works life in us . to this purpose is the discourse of s. paul ; having largely discoursed of our being baptized into the death of christ , he addes this as the corollary of all , he that is dead , is freed from sin * ; that is , being mortified , and buried in the waters of baptism , we have a new life of righteousness put into us ; we are quitted from the dominion of sin , and are planted together in the likeness of christs resurrection , that henceforth we should not serve sin . 4. but all these intermedial blessings tend to a glorious conclusion , for baptism does also consign us to a holy resurrection . it takes the sting of death from us , by burying us together with christ ; and takes off sin , which is the sting of death , and then we shall be partakers of a blessed resurrection . this we are taught by s. paul , know ye not that so many of us as are baptized into jesus christ , were baptized into his death ? for if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death , we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection . that declares the real event in its due season . but because baptism consigns it , and admits us to a title to it , we are said with s. paul , to be risen with christ in baptism ; buried with him in baptism , wherein also you are risen with him , thorough the faith of the operation of god , which hath raised him from the dead : which expression i desire to be remembred , that by it we may better understand those other sayings of the apostle , of putting on christ in baptism , putting on the new man , &c. for these onely signifie {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , or the design on gods part , and the endevour and duty on mans : we are then consigned to our duty , and to our reward ; we undertake one , and have a title to the other : and though men of ripeness and reason enter instantly into their portion of work , and have present use of the assistances , and something of their reward in hand ; yet we cannot conclude , that those that cannot do it presently , are not baptized rightly , because they are not in capacity to put on the new man in righteousness , that is , in an actual holy life : for they may put on the new man in baptism , just as they are risen with christ : which because it may be done by faith , before it is done in real event , and it may be done by sacrament and design , before it be done by a proper faith ; so also may our putting on the new man be . it is done sacramentally , and that part which is wholly the work of god , does onely antedate the work of man , which is to succeed in its due time , and is after the manner of preventing grace : but this is by the by : in order to the present article , baptism is by theodoret called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , a participation of the lords resurrection . 5. and lastly , by baptism we are saved ; that is , we are brought from death to life here , and that is the first resurrection , and we are brought from death to life hereafter , by vertue of the covenant of the state of grace , into which in baptism we enter , and are preserved from the second death , and receive a glarious and an eternal life : he that believeth and is baptized , shall be saved , said our blessed saviour ; and , according to his mercy he saved us , by the washing of regeneration , and renewing of the holy ghost . after these great blessings so plainly testified in scripture , and the doctrine of the primitive church , which are regularly consigned and bestowed in baptism , i shall less need to descend to temporal blessings , or rare contingencies , or miraculous events , or probable notices of things less certain : of this nature are those stories recorded in the writings of the church , that constantine was cured of a leprosie in baptism , theodosius recovered of his disease , being baptized by the bishop of thessalonica ; and a paralytic jew was cured as soon as he became a christian , and was baptized by atticus of c. p. and bishop arnulph baptizing a leper , also cured him , said vincentius bellovacensis . it is more considerable , which is generally and piously believed by very many eminent persons in the church , that at our baptism god assigns an angel guardian : for then the catechumen being made a servant and a brother to the lord of angels , is sure not to want the aids of them who pitch their tents round about them that fear the lord : and that this guard and ministery is then appointed , when themselves are admitted into the inheritance of the promises , and their title to salvation is hugely agreeable to the words of s. paul , are they not all ministring spirits , sent forth to minister to them who shall be heirs of salvation ? where it appears , that the title to the inheritance is the title to this ministery , and therefore must begin and end together . but i insist not on this , though it seems to me hugely probable . all these blessings put into one syllabus , have given to baptism many honorable appellatives in scripture , and other divine writers , calling it {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , sacramentum vitae & aeternae salutis . a new birth , a regeneration , a renovation , a charet carrying us to god , the great circumcision , a circumcision made without hands , the key of the kingdome , the paranymph of the kingdome , the earnest of our inheritance , the answer of a good conscience , the robe of light , the sacrament of a new life , and of eternal salvation . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . this is coelestial water , springing from the sides of the rock , upon the which the church was built , when the rock was smitten with the rod of god . it remains now , that we inquire what concerns our duty , and in what persons , or in what dispositions baptism produces all these glorious effects ? for , the sacraments of the church work in the vertue of christ , but yet onely upon such as are servants of christ , and hinder not the work of the spirit of grace . for the water of the font , and the spirit of the sacrament , are indeed to wash away our sins , and to purifie our souls : but not unless we have a minde to be purified . the sacrament works pardon for them that hate their sin , and procures grace for them that love it . they that are guilty of sins , must repent of them , and renounce them , and they must make a profession of the faith of christ , and give , or be given up to the obedience of christ , and then they are rightly disposed . he that believeth and is baptized , shall be saved , saith christ ; and s. peter call'd out to the whole assembly , repent , and be baptized every one of you . concerning this , justin martyr gives the same account of the faith and practise of the church . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , &c. whosoever are perswaded , and believe those things to be true , which are delivered and spoken by us , and undertake to live accordingly , they are commanded to fast and pray , and to ask of god remission of their former sins , we also praying together with them , and fasting . then they are brought to us where water is , and are regenerated in the same manner of regeneration , by which we our selves are regenerated . for in baptism , s. peter observes there are two parts , the body , and the spirit ; that is , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the putting away the filth of the flesh , that is , the material washing : and this is baptism , no otherwise then a dead corps is a man : the other is , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the answer of a good conscience towards god ; that is , the conversion of the soul to god , that 's the effective disposition in which baptism does save us . and in the same sense are those sayings of the primitive doctors to be understood , anima non lavatione sed responsione sancitur . the soul is not healed by washing , viz. alone , but by the answer the {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} in s. peter , the correspondent of our part of the covenant : for that 's the perfect sense of this unusual expression . and the effect is attributed to this , and denied to the other , when they are distinguished : so justin martyr affirms ; the onely baptism that can heal us , is repentance , and the knowledge of god . for what need is there of that baptism that can onely cleanse the flesh and the body ? be washed in your flesh from wrath and covetousness , from envy and hatred , and behold the body is pure . and clemens alexandrinus upon the proverbial saying , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , be not pure in the laver , but in the minde ; addes , i suppose that an exact and a firm repentance , is a sufficient purification to a man ; if judging and considering our selves for the facts we have done before , we proceed to that which is before us , considering that which follows , and cleansing or washing our minde from sensual affections , and from former sins . just as we use to deny the effect to the instrumental cause , and attribute it to the principal in the manner of speaking , when our purpose is to affirm this to be the principal , and of chief influence . so we say , it is not the good lute , but the skilful hand that makes the musick : it is not the body , but the soul that is the man ; and yet he is not the man without both . for baptism is but the material part in the sacrament , it is the spirit that giveth life ; whose work is faith and repentance begun by himself , without the sacrament , and consigned in the sacrament , and actuated and increased in the cooperation of our whole life : and therefore baptism is called in the jerusalem creed , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , one baptism of repentance for the remission of sins ; and by justin martyr , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the baptism of repentance and the knowledge of god , which was made for the sins of the people of god . he explains himself a little after , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , baptism that can onely cleanse them that are penitent . in sacramentis trinitati occurrit fides credentium & professio quae apud acta conficitur angelorum , ubi miscentur coelestia & spiritualia semina , ut sancto germine nova possit renascentium indoles procreari , ut dum trinitas cum fide concordat , qui natus fuerit saeculo , renascatur spiritualitèr deo. sic fit hominum pater deus , sancta sit mater ecclesia , said optatus . the faith and profession of the believers , meets with the ever-blessed trinity , and is recorded in the register of angels , where heavenly and spiritual seeds are mingled ; that from so holy a spring , may be produced a new nature of the regeneration , that while the trinity ( viz. that is invocated upon the baptized ) meets with the faith of the catechumen , he that was born to the world , may be born spiritually to god . so god is made a father to the man , and the holy church a mother . faith and repentance strip the old man naked , and make him fit for baptism ; and then the holy spirit moving upon the waters , cleanses the soul , and makes it to put on the new man , who grows up to perfection and a spititual life , to a life of glory , by our verification of the undertaking in baptism on our part , and the graces of the spirit on the other . for the waters pierce no further then the skin , till the person puts off his affection to the sin that he hath contracted ; and then he may say , aquae intraverunt usque ad animam meam , the waters are entred even unto my soul , to purifie and cleanse it , by the washing of water , and the renewing by the holy spirit : the sum is this , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , being baptized , we are illuminated ; being illuminated , we are adopted to the inheritance of sons ; being adopted , we are promoted towards perfection ; and being perfected , we are made immortal . quisquis in hos fontes vir venerit , exeat inde semideus , tactis citò nobilitetur in undis . this is the whole doctrine of baptism , as it is in it self considered , without relation to rare circumstances , or accidental cases : and it will also serve to the right understanding of the reasons why the church of god hath in all ages baptized all persons , that were within her power , for whom the church could stipulate that they were or might be relatives of christ , sons of god , heirs of the promises , and partners of the covenant , and such as did not hinder the work of baptism upon their souls . and such were not onely persons of age and choice , but the infants of christian parents . for the understanding and verifying of which truth , i shall onely need to apply the parts of the former discourse to their particular case ; premising first these propositions . part ii. of baptizing infants . baptism is the key in christs hand , and therefore opens as he opens , and shuts by his rule : and as christ himself did not do all his blessings and effects unto every one , but gave to every one as they had need , so does baptism . christ did not cure all mens eyes , but them onely that were blinde : christ came not to call the righteous , but sinners to repentance ; that is , they that lived in the fear of god , according to the covenant in which they were debtors , were indeed improved and promoted higher by christ , but not called to that repentance to which he called the vitious gentiles , and the adulterous persons among the jews , and the hypocritical pharisees . there are some so innocent , that they need no repentance ( saith the scripture ) meaning , that though they do need contrition for their single acts of sin , yet they are within the state of grace , and need not repentance , as it is a conversion of the whole man : and so it is in baptism , which does all its effects upon them that need them all ; and some upon them that need but some : and therefore as it pardons sins to them that have committed them , and do repent and believe ; so to the others who have not committed them , it does all the work which is done to the others , above or besides that pardon . 2. when the ordinary effect of a sacrament is done already by some other efficiency or instrument , yet the sacrament is still as obligatory as before , not for so many reasons or necessities , but for the same commandment . baptism is the first ordinary current , in which the spirit moves and descends upon us ; and where gods spirit is , they are the sons of god : for christs spirit descends upon none , but them that are his ; and yet cornelius , who had recieved the holy spirit , and was heard by god , and visited by an angel , and accepted in his alms , and fastings , and prayers , yet was tyed to the susception of baptism . to which may be added , that the receiving the effects of baptism before-haud , was used as an argument the rather to minister to baptism . the effect of which consideration is this , that baptism and its effect may be separated , and do not alwayes go in conjunction ; the effect may be before , and therefore much rather may it be after its susception ; the sacrament operating in the vertue of christ , even as the spirit shall move ; according to that saying of s. austin , sacrosancto lavacro inchoata innovatio novi hominis perficiendo perficitur in aliis citiùs , in aliis tardiùs . and s. bernard , lavari quidem citò possumus , sed ad sanandum multâ curatione opus est . the work of regeneration that is begun in the ministery of baptism , is perfected in some sooner , and in some later : we may soon be washed , but to be healed , is a work of a longcure . 3. the dispositions which are required to the ordinary susception of baptism , are not necessary to the efficacy , or required to the nature of the sacrament ; but accidentally , and because of the superinduced necessities of some men . and therefore the conditions are not regularly to be required , but in those accidents . it was necessary for a gentile proselyte to repent of his sins , and to believe in moses law , before he could be circumcised ; but abraham was not tyed to the same conditions , but onely to faith in god ; but isaac was not tyed to so much : and circumcision was not of moses , but of the fathers : and yet after the sanction of moses law , men were tyed to conditions , which were then made necessary to them that entred into the covenant , but not necessary to the nature of the covenant it self . and so it is in the susception of baptism : if a sinner enters into the font , it is necessary he be stripp'd of those appendages which himself sewed upon his nature , and then repentance is a necessary disposition . if his understanding hath been a stranger to religion , polluted with evil principles , and a false religion , it is necessary he have an actual faith , that he be given in his understanding up to the obedience of christ : and the reason of these is plain , because in these persons there is a disposition contrary to the state and effects of baptism ; and therefore they must be taken off by their contraries , faith and repentance , that they may be reduced to the state of pure receptives . and this is the sense of those words of our blessed saviour , vnless ye become like one of these little ones , ye shall not enter into the kingdome of heaven ; that is , ye cannot be admitted into the gospel-covenant , unless all your contrarieties and impediments be taken from you , and you be as apt as children to receive the new immissions from heaven . and this proposition relies upon a great example , and a certain reason . the example is our blessed saviour , who was nullius poenitentiae debitor , he had committed no sin , and needed no repentance ; he needed not to be saved by faith , for of faith he was the author and finisher , and the great object , and its perfection and reward , and yet he was baptized by the baptism of john , the baptism of repentance . and therefore it is certain , that repentance and faith are not necessary to the susception of baptism , but necessary to some persons that are baptized . for it is necessary we should much consider the difference . if the sacrament in any person may be justly received , in whom such dispositions are not to be found , then the dispositions are not necessary or intrinsecal to the susception of the sacrament ; and yet some persons coming to this sacrament , may have such necessities of their own , as will make the sacrament ineffectual without such dispositions : these i call necessary to the person , but not to the sacrament ; that is , necessary to all such , but not necessary to all absolutely . and faith is necessary sometimes where repentance is not , and sometimes repentance and faith together , and sometimes otherwise . when philip baptized the eunuch , he onely required of him to believe , not to repent . but s. peter , when he preached to the jews , and converted them , onely required repentance : which although in their case implyed faith , yet there was no explicit stipulation for it : they had crucified the lord of life , and if they would come to god by baptism , they must renounce their sin : that was all was then stood upon . it is as the case is , or as the persons have superinduced necessities upon themselves . in children the case is evident , as to the one part , which is equally required ; i mean , repentance : the not doing of which , cannot prejudice them as to the susception of baptism ; because they having done no evil , are not bound to repent ; and to repent , is as necessary to the susception of baptism , as faith is : but this shews , that they are accidentally necessary ; that is , not absolutely , not to all , not to infants : and if they may be excused from one duty , which is indispensably necessary to baptism , why they may not from the other , is a secret which will not be found out by these whom it concerns to believe it . and therefore when our blessed lord made a stipulation and express commandment for faith , with the greatest annexed penalty to them that had it not , he that believeth not shall be damned , the proposition is not to be verified or understood as relative to every period of time ; for then no man could be converted from infidelity to the christian faith , and from the power of the devil to the kingdome of christ , but his present infidelity shall be his final ruine . it is not therefore {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , but {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , not a sentence , but a use , a praediction and intermination . it is not like that saying [ god is true , and every man a lyar ] [ every good , and every perfect gift is from above : ] for these are true in every instant , without reference to circumstances : but he that believeth not shall be damned , is a prediction , or that which in rhetorick is called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , or a use , because this is the affirmation of that which usually or frequently comes to pass : such as this . he that strikes with the sword , shall perish by the sword ; he that robs a church , shall be like a wheel , of a vertiginous and unstable estate ; he that loves wine and oyle , shall not be rich : and therefore it is a declaration of that which is universally or commonly true ; but not so , that in what instance soever a man is not a believer , in that instant it is true to say he is damned ; for some are called the third , some the sixth , some the ninth hour , and they that come in , being first called , at the eleventh hour , shall have their reward : so that this sentence stands true at the day and the judgement of the lord , not at the judgement or day of man . and in the same necessity as faith stands to salvation , in the same it stands to baptism ; that is , to be measured by the whole latitude of its extent . our baptism shall no more do all its intention , unless faith supervene , then a man is in possibility of being saved without faith ; it must come in its due time , but is not indispensably necessary in all instants and periods . baptism is the seal of our election and adoption ; and as election is brought to effect by faith , and its consequents ; so is baptism : but to neither is faith necessary , as to its beginning and first entrance . to which also i adde this consideration , that actual faith is necessary , not to the susception , but to the consequent effects of baptism , appears , because the church , and particularly the apostles , did baptize some persons who had not faith , but were hypocrites , such as were simon magus , alexander the copper-smith , demas , and diotrephes ; and such was judas when he was baptized , and such were the gnostick teachers . for the effect depends upon god , who knows the heart , but the outward susception depends upon them who do not know it ; which is a certain argument , that the same faith that is necessary to the effect of the sacrament , is not necessary to its susception ; and if it can be administred to hypocrites , much more to infants ; if to those who really hinder the effect , much rather to them that hinder not . and if it be objected , that the church does not know but the pretenders have faith , but she knows infants have not . i reply , that the church does not know but the pretenders hinder the effect , and are contrary to the grace of the sacrament ; but she knows that infants do not . the first possibly may receive the grace , the other cannot hinder it . but beside these things , it is considerable , that when it is required , persons have faith : it is true , they that require baptism , should give a reason why they do : so it was in the case of the eunuch baptized by philip . but this is not to be required of others that do not ask it , and yet they be of the church , and of the faith : for by faith is also understood the christian religion , and the christian faith is the christian religion ; and of this a man may be , though he make no confession of his faith ; as a man may be of the church , and yet not be of the number of gods secrets ones : and to this more is required then to that ; to the first it is sufficient that he be admitted by a sacrament or a ceremony : which is infallibly certain , because hypocrites and wicked people ate in the visible communion of the church , and are reckoned as members of it , and yet to them there was nothing done but the ceremony administred ; and therefore when that is done to infants , they also ate to be reckoned in the church communion . and indeed in the examples of scripture , we finde more inserted into the number of gods family by outward ceremony , then by the inward grace : of this number were all those who were circumcised the eighth day , who were admitted thither , as the womans daughter was cured in the gospel , by the faith of their mother , their natural parents , or their spiritual : to whose faith it is as certain god will take heed , as to their faith who brought one to christ who could not come himself , the poor paralytick ; for when christ saw their faith , he cured their friend : and yet it is to be observed , that christ did use to exact faith , actual faith , of them that came to him to be cured [ according to your faith be it unto you . ] the case is equal in its whole kinde . and it is considerable what christ saith to the poor man that came in behalf of his son , all things are possible to him that believeth , it is possible for a son to receive the blessing and benefit of his fathers faith : and it was so in his case , and is possible to any ; for to faith all things are possible . and as to the event of things , it is evident in the story of the gospel , that the faith of their relatives was equally effective to children , and friends , or servants , absent or sick , as the faith of the interested person was to himself : as appears beyond all exception in the case of the friends of the paralytick , let down with cords thorough the tyles ; of the centurion in behalf of his servant : of the noble man , for his son sick at capernaum ; of the syrophoenician , for her daughter : and christ required faith of no sick man , but of him that presented himself to him , and desired for himself that he might be cured , as it was in the case of the blinde men . though they could believe , yet christ required belief of them that came to him on their behalf . and why then it may not be so , or is not so in the case of infants baptism , i confess it is past my skill to conjecture . the reason on which this further relies , is contained in the next proposition . 4. no disposition or act of man can deserve the first grace , or the grace of pardon : for so long as a man is unpardoned , he is an evemy to god , and as a dead person ; and unless he be prevented by the grace of god , cannot do a single act in order to his pardon and restitution : so that the first work which god does upon a man , is so wholly his own , that the man hath nothing in it , but to entertain it , that is , not to hinder the work of god upon him : and this is done in them that have in them nothing that can hinder the work of grace , or in them who remove the hinderances ; of the latter sort are all sinners , who have lived in a state contrary to god ; of the first are they who are prevented by the grace of god , before they can choose , that is , little children , and those that become like unto little children . so that faith and repentance are not necessary at first to the reception of the first grace , but by accident . if sin have drawn curtains , and put bars and coverings to the windows , these must be taken away ; and that is done by faith and repentance : but if the windows be not shut , so that the light can pass thorough them , the eye of heaven will pass in and dwell there . no man can come unto me , unless my father draw him ; that is , the first access to christ is nothing of our own , but wholly of god ; and it is as in our creation , in which we have an obediential capacity , but cooperate not ; onely if we be contrary to the work of grace , that contrariety must be taken off , else there is no necessity : and if all men according to christs saying , must receive the kingdome of god as little children , it is certain , little children do receive it ; they receive it as all men ought , that is , without any impediment or obstruction , without any thing within that is contrary to that state . 5. baptism is not to be estimated as one act , transient and effective to single purposes , but it is an entrance to a conjugation and a state of blessings . all our life is to be transacted by the measures of the gospel-covenant , and that covenant is consigned by baptism ; there we have our title and adoption to it , and the grace that is then given to us is like a piece of leaven put into a lump of dow : and faith and repentance do in all the periods of our life , put it into fermentation and activity . then the seed of god is put into the ground of our hearts , and repentance waters it , and faith makes it subactum solum , the ground and furrows apt to produce fruits : and therefore faith and repentance are necessary to the effect of baptism , not to its susception ; that is , necessary to all those parts of life in which baptism does operate , not to the first sanction or entring into the covenant . the seed may lye long in the ground , and produce fruits in its due season , if it be refreshed with the former and the latter rain , that is , the repentance that first changes the state , and converts the man , and afterwards returns him to his title , and recalls him from his wandrings , and keeps him in the state of grace , and within the limits of the covenant : and all the way , faith gives efficacy and acceptation to this repentance , that is , continues our title to the promise , of not having righteousness exacted by the measures of the law , but by the covenant and promise of grace , into which we entred in baptism , and walk in the same all the dayes of our life . 6. the holy spirit which descends upon the waters of baptism , does nor instantly produce its effects in the soul of the baptized ; and when he does , it is irregularly , and as he please : the spirit bloweth where it listeth , and no man knoweth whence it cometh , nor whither it goeth ; and the catechumen is admitted into the kingdome , yet the kingdome of god cometh not with observation : and this saying of our blessed saviour was spoken of the kingdome of of god that is within us , that is , the spirit of grace , the power of the gospel put into our hearts , concerning which , he affirmed , that it operates so secretly , that it comes not with outward shew , neither shall they say , lo here , or lo there : which thing i desire the rather be observed , because in the same discourse which our blessed saviour continued to that assembly , he affirms this kingdome of god to belong unto little children , this kingdome that cometh not with outward significations , or present expresses ; this kingdome that is within us . for the present , the use i make of it is this , that no man can conclude that this kingdome of power , that is , the spirit of sanctification , is not come upon infants , because there is no sign or expression of it . it is within us , therefore it hath no signification . it is the seed of god ; and it is no good argument to say , here is no seed in the bowels of the earth , because there is nothing green upon the face of it . for the church gives the sacrament , god gives the grace of the sacrament . but because he does not alwayes give it at the instant in which the church gives the sacrament , ( as if there be a secret impediment in the suscipient ) and yet afterwards does give it , when the impediment is removed ( as to them that repent of that impediment ) it follows , that the church may administer rightly , even before god gives the real grace of the sacrament ; and if god gives this grace afterwards by parts , and yet all of it is the effect of that covenant which was consigned in baptism : he that defers some may defer all , and verifie every part as well as any part . for it is certain , that in the instance now made , all the grace is deferred ; in infants it is not certain but that some is collated or infused : however , be it so or no , yet upon this account the administration of the sacrament is not hindred . 7. when the scripture speaks of the effects of , or dispositions to baptism , it speaks in general expressions , as being most apt to signifie a common duty , or a general effect , or a more universal event , or the proper order of things : but those general expressions do not supponere universalitèr , that is , are not to be understood exclusively to all that are not so qualified , or universally of all suscipients , or of all the subjects of the proposition . when the prophets complain of the jews , that they are faln from god , and turned to idols , and walk not in the way of their fathers ; and at other times , the scripture speaks the same thing of their fathers , that they walked perversly toward god , starting aside like a broken bow : in these and the like expressions the holy scripture uses a synecdoche , or signifies many onely , under the notion of a more large and indefinite expression ; for neither were all the fathers good , neither did all the sons prevaricate : but among the fathers there were enough to recommend to posterity by way of example ; and among the children , there were enough to stain the reputation of the age : but neither the one part nor the other was true of every single person . s. john the baptist spake to the whole audience , saying , o generation of vipers ! and yet he did not mean that all jerusalem and judea that went out to be baptized of him , were such ; but he under an indeterminate reproof , intended those that were such , that is , especially the priests and the pharisees . and it is more considerable yet , in the story of the event of christs sermon in the synagogue , upon his text taken out of isaiah , all wondred at his gracious words , and bare him witness . and a little after , all they in the synagogue were filled with wrath , that is , it was generally so ; but hardly to be supposed true of every single person , in both the contrary humors and usages . thus christ said to the apostles , ye have abidden with me in my temptations ; and yet judas was all the way a follower of interest and the bag , rather then christ : and afterwards none of them all did abide with christ in his greatest temptations . thus also to come nearer the present question , the secret effects of election and of the spirit , are in scripture attributed to all that are of the outward communion . so s. peter calls all the christian strangers of the eastern dispersion , elect , according to the fore-knowledge of god the father : and s. paul saith of all the roman christians , and the same of the thessalonians , that their faith was spoken of in all the world ; and yet amongst them it is not to be supposed , that all the professors had an unreproveable faith , or that every one of the church of thessalonica was an excellent and a charitable person : and yet the apostle useth this expression , your faith groweth exceedingly , and the charity of every one of you all towards each other , aboundeth . these are usually significant of a general custome or order of things , or duty of men , or design , and natural or proper expectation of events ; such are these also in this very question . as many of you as are baptized into christ , have put on christ ; that is , so it is regularly , and so it will be in its due time , and that is the order of things , and the designed event : but from hence we cannot conclude of every person , and in every period of time ; this man hath been baptized , therefore now he is clothed with christ , he hath put on christ : nor thus , this person cannot in a spiritual sense as yet put on christ , therefore he hath not been baptized , that is , he hath not put him on in a sacramental sense . such is the saying of s. paul , whom he hath predestinated , them he also called ; and whom he called , them he also justified ; and whom he justified , them he also glorified : this also declares the regular event , or at least the order of things , and the design of god , but not the actual verification of it to all persons . these sayings concerning baptism , in the like manner are to be so understood , that they cannot exclude all persons from the sacrament , that have not all those real effects of the sacrament at all times , which some men have at some times , and all men must have at some time or other , viz. when the sacrament obtains its last intention . but he that shall argue from hence , that children are not rightly baptized , because they cannot in a spiritual sense put on christ , concludes nothing , unless these propositions did signifie universally , and at all times , and in every person , and in every manner : which can no more pretend to truth , then that all christians are gods elect , and all that are baptized , are saints ; and all that are called , are justified ; and all that are once justified , shall be saved finally . these things declare onely the event of things , and their order , and the usuall effect , and the proper design , in their proper season , in their limited proportions . 8. a negative argument for matters of fact in scripture , cannot conclude a law , or a necessary , or a regular event . and therefore supposing that it be not intimated , that the apostles did baptize infants , it follows not that they did not : and if they did not , it does not follow that they might not , or that the church may not . for it is unreasonable to argue : the scripture speaks nothing of the baptism of the holy virgin-mother , therefore she was not baptized . the words and deeds of christ are infinite which are not recorded ; and of the acts of the apostles we may suppose the same in their proportion : and therefore what they did not , is no rule to us , unless they did it not because they were forbidden . so that it can be no good argument to say , the apostles are not read to have baptized infants , therefore infants are not to be baptized : but thus ; we do not finde that infants are excluded from the common sacraments and ceremonies of christian institution , therefore we may not presume to exclude them . for although the negative of a fact is no good argument , yet the negative of a law is a very good one . we may not say , the apostles did not , therefore we may not : but thus , they were not forbidden to do it , there is no law against it , therefore it may be done . no mans deeds can prejudicate a divine law expressed in general terms , much less can it be prejudiced by those things that were not done . that which is wanting cannot be numbred , cannot be effectual ; therefore , baptize all nations , must signifie all that it can signifie , all that are reckoned in the capitations and accounts of a nation . now since all contradiction to this question depends wholly upon these two grounds ; the negative argument in matter of fact , and the pretences , that faith and repentance are required to baptism : since the first is wholly nothing , and infirm upon an infinite account , and the second may conclude , that infants can no more be saved then be baptized ; because faith is more necessary to salvation then to baptism ; it being said , he that believeth not shall be damned ; and it is not said , he that believeth not shall be excluded from baptism : it follows , that the doctrine of those that refuse to baptize their infants is upon both its legs weak and broken , and insufficient . upon the supposition of these grounds , the baptism of infants , according to the perpetual practise of the church of god , will stand firm and unshaken upon its own base . for , as the eunuch said to philip , what hinders them to be baptized ? if they can receive benefit by it , it is infallibly certain , that it belongs to them also to receive it , and to their parents to procure it : for nothing can deprive us of so great a grace , but an unworthiness or a disability . they are not disabled to receive it , if they need it , and if it does them good ; and they have neither done good nor evil , and therefore they have not forfeited their right to it . this therefore shall be the first great argument or combination of inducements ; infants receive many benefits by the susception of baptism , and therefore in charity and in duty we are to bring them to baptism . 1. the first effect of baptism is , that in it we are admitted to the kingdome of christ , offered and presented unto him . in which certainly there is the same act of worship to god , and the same blessing to the children of christians , as there was in presenting the first-born among the jews . for our children can be gods own portion , as well as theirs ; and as they presented the first-born to god , and so acknowledged that god might have taken his life in sacrifice , as well as the sacrifice of the lamb , or the oblation of a beast : yet when the right was confessed , god gave him back again , and took a lamb in exchange , or a pair of doves . so are our children presented to god as forfeit , and god might take the forfeiture , and not admit the babe to the promises of grace : but when the presentation of the childe , and our acknowledgement is made to god , god takes the lamb of the world in exchange , and he hath paid our forfeiture , and the children are holy unto the lord . and what hinders here ? cannot a creeple receive an alms at the beautiful gate of the temple , unless he go thither himself ? or cannot a gift be presented to god by the hands of the owners , and the gift become holy and pleasing to god without its own consent ? the parents have a portion of the possession : children are blessings , and gods gifts , and the fathers greatest wealth , and therefore are to be given again to him . in other things we give something to god of all that he gives us ; all we do not , because our needs force us to retain the greater part , and the less sanctifies the whole : but our children must all be returned to god ; for we may love them , and so may god too , and they are the better our own , by being made holy in their presentation : whatsoever is given to god is holy , every thing in its proportion and capacity ; a lamb is holy , when it becomes a sacrifice ; and a table is holy , when it becomes an altar ; and a house is holy , when it becomes a church ; and a man is holy , when he is consecrated to be a priest ; and so is every one that is dedicated to religion : these are holy persons , the others are holy things ; and infants are between both : they have the sanctification that belongs to them , the holiness that can be of a reasonable nature , offer'd and destin'd to gods service ; but not in that degree that is in an understanding , choosing person . certain it is , that infants may be given to god ; and if they may be , they must be : for it is not here as in goods , where we are permitted to use all or some , and give what portion we please out of them ; but we cannot do our duty towards our children , unless we give them wholly to god , and offer them to his service and to his grace . the first does honour to god , the second does charity to the children . the effects and real advantages will appear in the sequel : in the mean time this argument extends thus far , that children may be presented to god acceptably , in order to his service . and it was highly praeceptive , when our blessed saviour commanded , that we should suffer little children to come to him : and when they came , they carried away a blessing along with them . he was desirous they should partake of his merits : he is not willing , neither is it his fathers will , that any of these little ones should perish . and therefore he dyed for them , and loves , and blessed them : and so he will now , if they be brought to him , and presented as candidates of the religion and of the resurrection . christ hath a blessing for our children , but let them come to him , that is , be presented at the doors of the church , to the sacrament of adoption and initiation ; for i know no other way for them to come . 2. children may be adopted into the covenant of the gospel , that is , made partakers of the communion of saints , which is the second effect of baptism ; parts of the church , members of christs mystical body , and put into the order of eternal life . now concerning this , it is certain , the church clearly hath power to do her offices in order to it . the faithful can pray for all men , they can do their piety to some persons with more regard and greater earnestness : they can admit whom they please in their proper dispositions , to a participation of all their holy prayers , and communions , and preachings , and exhortations : and if all this be a blessing , and all this be the actions of our own charity , who can hinder the church of god from admitting infants to the communion of all their pious offices , which can do them benefit in their present capacity ? how this does necessarily infer baptism , i shall afterwards discourse * but for the present i enumerate , that the blessings of baptism are communicable to them ; they may be admitted into a fellowship of all the prayers and priviledges of the church , and the communion of saints , in blessings , and prayers , and holy offices . but that which is of greatest perswasion and convincing efficacy in this particular , is , that the children of the church are as capable of the same covenant , as the children of the jews : but it was the same covenant that circumcision did consign , a spiritual covenant under a veil , and now it is the same spiritual covenant without the veil , which is evident to him that considers it ; thus : the words of the covenant are these [ i am the almighty god , walk before me , and be thou perfect ; i will multiply thee exceedingly . thou shalt be a father of many nations : thy name shall not be abram , but abraham . nations and kings shall be out of thee . i will be a god unto thee , and unto thy seed after thee ; and i will give all the land of canaan to thy seed , and all the males shall be circumcised , and it shall be a token of the covenant between me and thee : and he that is not circumcised , shall be cut off from his people . the covenant which was on abrahams part was , to walk before god , and to be perfect : on gods part , to bless him with a numerous issue , and them with the land of canaan ; and the sign was circumcision , the token of the covenant . now in all this , here was no duty to which the posterity was obliged , nor any blessing which abraham could perceive or feel , because neither he nor his posterity did enjoy the promise for many hundred years after the covenant : and therefore as there was a duty for the posterity which is not here expressed ; so there was a blessing for abraham , which was concealed under the leaves of a temporal promise , and which we shall better understand from them whom the spirit of god hath taught the mysteriousness of this transaction . the argument indeed , and the observation is wholly s. pauls , abraham and the patriarchs died in faith , not having received the promises , viz. of a possession in canaan . they saw the promises afar off , they embraced them , and looked through the cloud , and the temporal veil , this was not it ; they might have returned to canaan , if that had been the object of their desires , and the design of the promise : but they desired and did seek a countrey , but it was a better , and that a heavenly . this was the object of their desire , and the end of their search , and the reward of their faith , and the secret of their promise . and therefore circumcision was a seal of the righteousness of faith , which he had before his circumcision , before the making this covenant ; and therefore it must principally relate to an effect and a blessing , greater then was afterwards expressed in the temporal promise : which effect was forgiveness of sins , a not imputing to us our infirmities , justification by faith , accounting that for righteousness : and these effects or graces were promised to abraham , not onely for his posterity after the flesh , but his children after the spirit , even to all that shall believe and walk in the steps of our father abraham , which he walked in , being yet uncircumcised . this was no other but the covenant of the gospel , though afterwards otherwise consigned : for so the apostle expresly affirms , that abraham was the father of circumcision ( viz. by vertue of this covenant ) not onely to them that are circumcised , but to all that believe : for this promise was not through the law of works , or of circumcision , but of faith . and therefore as s. paul observes , god promised that abraham should be a father ( not of that nation onely , but ) of many nations , and the heir of the world ; that the blessing of abraham might come on the gentiles through jesus christ ; that we might receive the promise of the spirit through faith . and , if ye be christs , then ye are abrahams seed , and heirs according to the promise . since then the covenant of the gospel , is the covenant of faith , and not of works ; and the promises are spiritual , not saecular ; and abraham the father of the faithful gentiles , as well as the circumcised jews ; and the heir of the world , not by himself , but by his seed , or the son of man , our lord jesus : it follows , that the promises which circumcision did seal , were the same promises which are consigned in baptism ; the covenant is the same , onely that gods people are not impal'd in palestine , and the veil is taken away , and the temporal is passed into spiritual , and the result will be this , that to as many persons , and in as many capacities , and in the same dispositions as the promises were applied , and did relate in circumcision , to the same they do belong , and may be applied in baptism . and let it be remembred , that the covenant which circumcision did sign , was a covenant of grace and faith ; the promises were of the spirit , or spiritual , it was made before the law , and could not be rescinded by the legal covenant . nothing could be added to it , or taken from it ; and we that are partakers of this grace , are therefore partakers of it by being christs servants , united to christ , and so are become abrahams seed ( as the apostle at large and professedly proves in divers places , but especially in the 4. of the romans , and the 3. to the galatians . ) and therefore if infants were then admitted to it , and consigned to it by a sacrament which they understood not any more then ours do , there is not any reason why ours should not enter in at the ordinary gate and door of grace as well as they . their children were circumcised the eighth day , but were instructed afterwards , when they could enquire what these things meant . indeed their proselytes were first taught , then circumcised ; so are ours , baptized : but their infants were consigned first , and so must ours . 3. in baptism we are born again ; and this infants need in the present circumstances , and for the same great reason , that men of age and reason do . for our natural birth is either of it self insufficient , or is made so by the fall of adam , and the consequent evils , that nature alone , or our first birth , cannot bring us to heaven , which is a supernatural end , that is , an end above all the power of our nature as now it is . so that if nature cannot bring us to heaven , grace must , or we can never get thither ; if the first birth cannot , a second must : but the second birth spoken of in scripture , is baptism ; a man must be born of water and the spirit . and therefore baptism is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the laver of a new birth . either then infants cannot go to heaven any way that we know of , or they must be baptized . to say they are to be left to god , is an excuse , and no answer : for when god hath opened the door , and calls that the entrance into heaven , we do not leave them to god , when we will not carry them to him in the way which he hath described , and at the door which himself hath opened : we leave them indeed , but it is but helpless and destitute : and though god is better then man , yet that is no warrant to us , what it will be to the children , that we cannot warrant , or conjecture . and if it be objected , that to the new birth is required dispositions of our own , which are to be wrought by and in them that have the use of reason : besides that this is wholly against the analogy of a new birth , in which the person to be born is wholly a passive , and hath put into him the principle that in time will produce its proper actions : it is certain , that they that can receive the new birth , are capable of it ; the effect of it is a possibility of being saved , and arriving to a supernatural felicity . if infants can receive this effect , then also the new birth , without which they cannot cannot receive the effect . and if they can receive salvation , the effect of the new birth , what hinders them , but they may receive that that is in order to that effect , and ordained onely for it ; and which is nothing of it self , but in its institution and relation , and which may be received by the same capacity in which one may be created , that is , a passivity , or a capacity obediential . 4. concerning pardon of sins , which is one great effect of baptism , it is certain , that infants have not that benefit which men of sin and age may receive . he that hath a sickly stomach drinks wine , and it not onely refreshes his spirits , but cures his stomach . he that drinks wine and hath not that disease , receives good by his wine , though it does not minister to so many needs ; it refreshes him , though it does not cure him : and when oyle is poured upon a mans head , it does not alwayes heal a wound , but sometimes makes him a chearful countenance , sometimes it consigns him to be a king or a priest . so it is in baptism : it does not heal the wounds of actual sins , because they have not committed them ; but it takes off the evil of original sin : whatsoever is imputed to us by adams prevarication , is washed off by the death of the second adam , into which we are baptized . but concerning original sin , because there are so many disputes which may intricate the question , i shall make use onely of that which is confessed on both sides , and material to our purpose . death came upon all men by adams sin , and the necessity of it remains upon us , as an evil consequent of the disobedience . for though death is natural , yet it was kept off from man by gods favour , which when he lost , the banks were broken , and the water reverted to its natural course , and our nature became a curse , and death a punishment . now that this also relates to infants so far , is certain , because they are ▪ sick , and dye . this the pelagians denied not . but to whomsoever this evil descended , upon them also a remedy is provided by the second adam , that as in adam all dye , even so in christ shall all be made alive ; that is , at the day of judgement : then death shall be destroyed . in the mean time , death hath a sting and a bitterness , a curse it is , and an express of the divine anger : and if this sting be not taken away here , we shall have no participation of the final victory over death . either therefore infants must be for ever without remedy in this evil consequent of their fathers sin , or they must be adopted into the participation of christs death , which is the remedy . now how can they partake of christs death , but by baptism into his death ? for if there be any spiritual way fancied , it will by a stronger argument admit them to baptism : for if they can receive spiritual effects , they can also receive the outward sacrament ; this being denyed onely upon pretence they cannot have the other . if there be no spiritual way extraordinary , then the ordinary way is onely left for them . if there be an extraordinary , let it be shewn , and christians will be at rest concerning their children . one thing onely i desire to be observed , that pelagius denyed original sin , but yet denyed not the necessity of infants baptism ; and being accused of it in an epistle to pope innocent the first , he purged himself of the suspicion , and allowed the practise , but denyed the inducement of it : which shews , that their arts are weak that think baptism to be useless to infants , if they be not formally guilty of the prevarication of adam : by which i also gather , that it was so universal , so primitive a practise , to baptize infants , that it was greater then all pretences to the contrary : for it would much have conduced to the introducing his opinion against grace and original sin , if he had destroyed that practise which seemed so very much to have its greatest necessity from the doctrine he denyed . but against pelagius , and against all that follow the parts of his opinion , it is of good use which s. austine , prosper , and fulgentius argue ; if infants are punished for adams sin , then they are also guilty of it in some sense . nimis enim impium est hoc de dei sentire justitiâ quod à praevaricatione liberos cum reis voluerit esse damnatos . so prosper . dispendia quae flentes nascendo testantur , dicito quo merito sub justissimo & omnipotentissimo judice eis , si nullum peccatum attrahant , arrogentur , said s. austin . for the guilt of sin signifies nothing but the obligation to the punishment : and he that feels the evil consequent , to him the sin is imputed ; not as to all the same dishonour , or moral accounts , but to the more material , to the natural account : and in holy scripture the taking off the punishment , is the pardon of the sin ; and in the same degree the punishment is abolished , in the same god is appeased , and then the person stands upright , being reconciled to god by his grace . since therefore infants have the punishment of sin , it is certain the sin is imputed to them ; and therefore they need being reconciled to god by christ : and if so , then , when they are baptized into christs death , and into his resurrection , their sins are pardoned , because the punishment is taken off , the sting of natural death is taken away , because gods anger is removed , and they shall partake of christs resurrection : which because baptism does signifie and consign , they also are to be baptized . to which also adde this appendant consideration , that whatsoever the sacraments do consign , that also they do convey and minister : they do it , that is , god by them does it ; lest we should think the sacraments to be meer illusions , and abusing us by deceitful ineffective signs : and therefore to infants the grace of a title to a resurrection , and reconciliation to god by the death of christ is conveyed , because it signifies and consigns this to them more to the life and analogy of resemblance , then circumcision to the infant sons of israel . i end this consideration with the words of nazianzen , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . our birth by baptism does cut off every unclean appendage of our natural birth , and leads us to a celestial life : and this in children is therefore more necessary , because the evil came upon them without their own act of reason and choice , and therefore the grace and remedy ought not to stay the leisure of dull nature , and the formalities of the civill law . 5. the baptism of infants does to them the greatest part of that benefit which belongs to the remission of sins . for baptism is a state of repentance and pardon for ever . this i suppose to be already proved , to which i onely adde this caution , that the pelagians to undervalue the necessity of supervening grace , affirmed , that baptism did minister to us grace sufficient to live perfectly , and without sin for ever . against this s. jerome sharply declaims , and affirms , a baptismum praeterita donare peccata , non futuram servare justitiam : that is , non statim justum facit & omni plenum justitiâ , as he expounds his meaning in another place . vetera peccata conscindit , novas virtutes non tribuit ; dimittit à carcere , & dimisso , si laboraverit , praemia pollicetur . baptism does not so forgive future sins , that we may do what we please , or so as we need not labour and watch , and fear perpetually , and make use of gods grace to actuate our endevours , but puts us into a state of pardon , that is , in a covenant of grace , in which so long as we labour and repent , and strive to do our duty , so long our infirmities are pityed , and our sins certain to be pardoned upon their certain conditions ; that is , by virtue of it we are capable of pardon , and must work for it , and may hope it . and therefore infants have a most certain capacity and proper disposition to baptism ▪ for sin creeps before it can go , and little undecencies are soon learned , and malice is before their years , and they can do mischief and irregularities betimes ; and though we know not when , nor how far they are imputed in every moneth of their lives , yet it is an admirable art of the spirit of grace , to put them into a state of pardon , that their remedy may at least be as soon as their necessity . and therefore tertullian and gregory nazianzen advised the baptism of children to be at three or four years of age ; meaning , that they then begining to have little inadvertencies & hasty follies , and actions so evil as did need a lavatory . but if baptism hath an influence upon sins in the succeeding portions of our life , then it is certain , that their being presently innocent , does not hinder , and ought not to retard the sacrament ; and therefore tertullian's quid festinat innocens aetas ad remissionem peccatorum ? what need innocents hasten to the remission of sins ? is soon answered . it is true , they need not in respect of any actual sins , for so they are innocent : but in respect of the evils of their nature , derived from their original , and in respect of future sins in the whole state of their life , it is necessary they be put into a state of pardon before they sin , because some sin early , some sin later ; and therefore unless they be baptized so early , as to prevent the first sins , they may chance dye in a sin , to the pardon of which they have yet derived no title from christ . 6. the next great effect of baptism , which children can have , is the spirit of sanctification , and if they can be baptized with water and the spirit , it will be sacriledge to rob them of so holy treasures . and concerning this , although it be with them , as s. paul sayes of heirs , the heir so long as he is a childe differeth nothing from a servant , though he be lord of all ; and children , although they receive the spirit of promise , and the spirit of grace , yet in respect of actual exercise , they differ not from them that have them not at all , yet this hindres not but they may have them . for as the reasonable soul and all its faculties are in children , will and vnderstanding , passions , and powers of attraction and propulsion , yet these faculties do not operate or come abroad till time and art , observation and experience have drawn them forth into action : so may the spirit of grace , the principle of christian life , be infused , and yet lye without action till in its own day it is drawn forth . for in every christian there are three parts concurring to his integral constitution , body , and soul , and spirit ; and all these have their proper activities and times , but every one in his own order , first that which is natural , then that which is spiritual . and as aristotle said , a man first lives the life of a plant , then of a beast , and lastly of a man , is true in this sense : and the more spiritual the principle is , the longer it is before it operates , because more things concur to spiritual actions , then to natural : and these are necessary , and therefore first ; the other are perfect , and therefore last . and who is he that so well understands the philosophy of this third principle of a christians life , the spirit , as to know how or when it is infused , and how it operates in all its periods , and what it is in its beeing and proper nature ; and whether it be like the soul , or like the faculty , or like a habit , or how or to what purposes god in all varieties does dispense it ? these are secrets which none but bold people use to decree , and build propositions upon their own dreams . that which is certain , is , that * the spirit is the principle of a new life , or a new birth . * that baptism is the laver of this new birth . * that it is the seed of god , and may lye long in the furrows before it springs up . * that from the faculty to the act , the passage is not alwayes sudden and quick . * that the spirit is the earnest of our inheritance , that is , of resurrection to eternal life : which inheritance because children we hope shal have , they cannot be denied to have its seal and earnest , that is , if they shall have all , they are not to be denyed a part . * that children have some effects of the spirit , and therefore do receive it , and are baptized with the spirit , and therefore may with water : which thing is therefore true and evident , because some children are sanctified , as jeremy and the baptist , and therefore all may . and because all signification of persons is an effect of the holy ghost , there is no peradventure but they that can be sanctified by god can in that capacity receive the holy ghost : and all the ground of dissenting here , is onely upon a mistake , because infants do no act of holiness , they suppose them incapable of the grace of sanctification . now sanctification of children , is their adoption to the inheritance of sons , their presentation to christ , their consignation to christs service ▪ and to resurrection , their being put into a possibility of being saved , their restitution to gods favour , which naturally , that is , as our nature is depraved and punished , they could not have . and in short the case is this : * original righteousness was in adam after the manner of nature , but it was an act or effect of grace , and by it men were not made , but born righteous ; the inferior faculties obeyed the superior , the minde was whole and right , and conformable to the divine image , the reason and the will alwayes concurring , the will followed reason , and reason followed the laws of god , and so long as a man had not lost this ▪ he was pleasing to god , and should have passed to a more perfect state . now because this , if adam had stood , should have been born with every childe , there was in infants a principle which was the seed of holy life here , and a blessed hereafter ; and yet the children should have gone in the road of nature , then as well as now , and the spirit should have operated at natures leisure ; god being the giver of both , would have made them instrumental to , and perfective of each other , but not destructive . now what was lost by adam , is restored by christ , the same righteousness , onely it is not born , but superinduc'd , not integral , but interrupted , but such as it is , there is no difference , but that the same or the like principle may be derived to us from christ , as there should have been from adam , that is , a principle of obedience , a regularity of faculties , a beauty in the soul , and a state of acceptation with god . and we see also in men of understanding and reason , the spirit of god dwells in them , ( which tatianus describing , uses these words , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . the soul is possessed with sparks , or materials of the power of the spirit ) and yet it is sometimes ineffective and unactive , sometimes more , sometimes less , and does no more do its work at all times , then the soul does at all times understand . adde to this , that if there be in infants naturally an evil principle , a proclivity to sin , an ignorance and pravity of minde , a disorder of affections ( as experience teaches us there is , and the perpetual doctrine of the church , and the universal mischiefs issuing from mankinde , and the sin of every man does witness too much ) why cannot infants have a good principle in them , though it works not till its own season , as well as an evil principle ? if there were not by nature some evil principle , it is not possible that all the world should choose sin : in free agents it was never heard , that all individuals loved and chose the same thing , to which they were not naturally inclined . neither do all men choose to marry , neither do all choose to abstain : and in this instance there is a natural inclination to one part ; but of all the men and women in the world , there is no one that hath never sinned . if we say that we have no sin , we deceive our selves , and the truth is not in us ▪ said an apostle . if therefore nature hath in infants an evil principle , which operates when the childe can choose , but is all the while within the soul ; either infants have by grace a principle put into them , or else sin abounds where grace does not superabound , expresly against the doctrine of the apostle . the event of this discourse is , that if infants be capable of the spirit of grace , there is no reason but they may and ought to be baptized , as well as men and women ; unless god had expresly forbidden them , which cannot be pretended : and that infants are capable of the spirit of grace , i think is made very credible . christus infantibus infans factus sanctificans infantes , said irenaeus : christ became an infant among the infants , and does sanctifie infants : and s. cyprian affirms , esse apud omnes sive infantes sive majores natu unam divini muneris aequitatem . there is the same dispensation of the divine grace to all alike , to infants as well as to men . and in this royal priesthood , as it is in the secular , kings may be anointed in their cradles , dat ( deus ) sui spiritus occultissimam gratiam , quam etiam latentèr infundit in parvulis , god gives the most secret grace of his spirit , which he also secretly infuses into infants . and if a secret infusion be rejected , because it cannot be proved at the place and at the instant , many men that hope for heaven will be very much to seek for a proof of their earnest , and need an earnest of the earnest . for all that have the spirit of god cannot in all instants prove it , or certainly know it : neither is it yet defined by how many indices the spirits presence can be proved or signified . and they limit the spirit too much , and understand it too little , who take accounts of his secret workings , and measure them by the material lines and methods of natural and animal effects . and yet because whatsoever is holy , is made so by the holy spirit , we are certain that the children of believing , that is , of christian parents , are holy . s. paul affirmed it , and by it hath distinguished ours from the children of unbelievers , and our marriages from theirs : and because the children of the heathen when they come to choice and reason , may enter to baptism and the covenant if they will , our children have no privilege beyond the children of turks or heathens , unless it be in the present capacity , that is , either by receiving the holy ghost immediately , and the promises , or at least having a title to the sacrament , and entring by that door . if they have the spirit , nothing can hinder them from a title to the water ; and if they have onely a title to the water of the sacrament , then they shall receive the promise of the holy spirit , the benefits of the sacrament : else their privilege is none at all , but a dish of cold water , which every village nurse can provide for her new born babe . but it is in our case as it was with the jews children : our children are a holy seed ; for if it were not so with christianity , how could s. peter move the jews to christianity , by telling them the promise was to them and their children ? for if our children be not capable of the spirit of promise and holiness , and yet their children were holy , it had been a better argument to have kept them in the synagogue , then to have called them to the christian church . either therefore 1. there is some holiness in a reasonable nature , which is not from the spirit of holiness ; or else 2. our children do receive the holy spirit , because they are holy ; or if they be not holy , they are in worse condition under christ then under moses : or if none of all this be true , then our children are holy by having received the holy spirit of promise , and consequently nothing can hinder them from being baptized . and indeed if the christian jews , whose children are circumcised , and made partakers of the same promises and title , and inheritance and sacraments , which themselves had at their conversion to the faith of christ , had seen their children now shut out from these new sacraments , it is not to be doubted but they would have raised a storm , greater then could easily have been suppressed : since about their circumcisions they had raised such tragedies and implacable disputations : and there had been great reason to look for a storm ; for their children were circumcised , and if not baptized , then they were left under a burthen which their fathers were quit of , for s. paul said unto you , whosoever is circumcised , is a debtor to keep the whole law . these children therefore that were circumcised , stood obliged for want of baptism to perform the laws of ceremonies , to be presented into the temple , to pay their price , to be redeemed with silver and gold ; to be bound by the law of pollutions and carnal ordinances : and therefore if they had been thus left , it would be no wonder if the jews had complained and made a tumult : they used to do it for less matters . to which let this be added , that the first book of the new testament was not written till eight years after christs ascension , and s. marks gospel twelve years . in the mean time , to what scriptures did they appeal ? by the analogy or proportion of what writings did they end their questions ? whence did they prove their articles ? they onely appealed to the old testament , and onely added what their lord superadded . now either it must be said that our blessed lord commanded that infants should not be baptized , which is no where pretended ; and if it were ▪ cannot at all be proved : or if by the proportion of scriptures they did serve god , and preach the religion , it is plain , that by the analogy of the old testament , that is , of those scriptures by which they proved christ to be come , and to have suffered , they also approved the baptism of infants , or the admitting them to the society of the faithful jews , of which also the church did then principally consist . 7. that baptism ( which consigns men and women to a blessed resurrection ) doth also equally consign infants to it , hath nothing , that i know of , pretended against it , there being the same signature and the same grace , and in this thing all being alike passive , and we no way cooperating to the consignation and promise of grace : and infants have an equall necessity , as being lyable to sickness and groaning with as sad accents , and dying sooner then men and women , and less able to complain , and more apt to be pityed and broken with the unhappy consequents of a short life , and a speedy death , & infelicitate priscorum hominum , with the infelicity and folly of their first parents : and therefore have as great need as any , and that is capacity enough to receive a remedy for the evil which was brought upon them by the fault of another . 8. and after all this , if baptism be that means which god hath appointed to save us , it were well if we would do our parts towards infants final interest ; which whether it depends upon the sacrament and its proper grace , we have nothing to relye upon , but those texts of scripture which make baptism the ordinary way of entring into the state of salvation : save onely we are to adde this , that because of this law infants are not personally capable , but the church for them , as for all others indefinitely , we have reason to believe , that their friends neglect shall by some way be supplyed ; but hope hath in it nothing beyond a probability . this we may be certain of , that naturally we cannot be heirs of salvation , for by nature we are children of wrath , and therefore an eternal separation from god , is an infallible consequent to our evil nature : either therefore children must be put into the state of grace , or they shall dwell for ever where gods face does never shine . now there are but two wayes of being put into the state of grace and salvation ; the inward , by the spirit , and the outward , by water , which regularly are together . if they be renewed by the spirit , what hinders them to be baptized , who receive the holy ghost as well as we ? if they are not capable of the spirit , they are capable of water ; and if of neither , where is their title to heaven , which is neither internal nor external , neither spiritual nor sacramental , neither secret nor manifest , neither natural nor gracious , neither original nor derivative ? and well may we lament the death of poor babes that are {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , concerning whom if we neglect what is regularly prescribed to all that enter heaven , without any difference expressed , or case reserved , we have no reason to be comforted over our dead children , but may weep as they that have no hope . we may hope when our neglect was not the hinderance , because god hath wholly taken the matter into his own hand , and then it cannot miscarry ; and though we know nothing of the children , yet we know much of gods goodness : but when god hath permitted it to us , that is , offered and permitted children to our ministery , whatever happens to the innocents , we may well fear lest god will require the souls at our hands : and we cannot be otherwise secure , but that it will be said concerning our children , which s. ambrose used in a case like this , anima illa potuit salva fieri , si habuisset purgationem , this soul might have gone to god , if it had been purified and washed . we know god is good , infinitely good , but we know it is not at all good to tempt his goodness : and he tempts him , that leaves the usual way , and pretends it is not made for him , and yet hopes to be at his journeys end , or expects to meet his childe in heaven , when himself shuts the door against him , which for ought he knows is the onely one that stands open . s. austin was severe in this question against unbaptized infants , therefore he is called durus pater infantium : though i know not why the original of that opinion should be attributed to him , since s. ambrose said the same before him , as appears in his words above quoted in the margent . and now that i have enumerated the blessings which are consequent to baptism , and have also made apparent , that infants can receive these blessings , i suppose i need not use any other perswasions to bring children to baptism . if it be certain they may receive these good things by it , it is certain they are not to be hindred of them without the greatest impiety , and sacriledge , and uncharitableness in the world . nay , if it be onely probable that they receive these blessings , or if it be but possible they may , nay unless it be impossible they should , and so declared by revelation or demonstratively certain , it were intolerable unkindness and injustice to our pretty innocents , to let their crying be unpityed , and their natural misery eternally irremediable , and their sorrows without remedy , and their souls no more capable of relief , then their bodies of physick , and their death left with the sting in , and their souls without spirits to go to god , and no angel guardian to be assigned them in the assemblies of the faithful , and they not to be reckoned in the accounts of god and gods church . all these are sad stories . there are in scripture very many other probabilities , to perswade the baptism of infants , but because the places admit of divers interpretations , the arguments have so many diminutions , and the certainty that is in them is too fine for easie understandings , i have chosen to build the ancient doctrines upon such principles which are more easie and certain , and have not been yet sullied and rifled with the contentions of an adversary . this onely i shall observe , that the words of our blessed lord [ vnless a man be born of water and the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven ] cannot be expounded to the exclusion of children , but the same expositions will also make baptism not necessary for men : for if they be both necessary ingredients , water and the spirit , then let us provide water , and god will provide the spirit ; if we bring wood to the sacrifice , he will provide a lamb . and if they signifie distinctly , one is ordinarily as necessary as the other , and then infants must be baptized , or not be saved . but if one be exegetical and explicative of the other , and by water and the spirit is meant onely the purification of the spirit , then where is the necessity of baptism for men ? it will be as the other sacrament , at most but highly convenient , not simply necessary , and all the other places will easily be answered , if this be avoided . but however , these words being spoken in so decretory a manner , are to be used with fear and reverence ; and we must be infallibly sure by some certain infallible arguments , that infants ought not to be baptized , or we ought to fear concerning the effect of these decretory words . i shall onely adde two things by way of corollary to this discourse . that the church of god ever since her numbers are full ▪ have for very many ages consisted almost wholly of assemblies of them who have been baptized in their infancy : and although in the first callings of the gentiles , the chiefest and most frequent baptisms were of converted and repenting persons and believers , yet from the beginning also the church hath baptized the infants of christian parents ; according to the prophecy of isaiah , behold , i will lift up my hands to the gentiles , and set up a standard to the people , and they shall bring thy sons in their arms , and thy daughters shall be carried upon their shoulders . concerning which , i shall not onely bring the testimonies of the matter of fact , but either a report of an apostolical tradition , or some argument from the fathers , which will make their testimony more effectuall in all that shall relate to the question . the author of the book of ecclesiastical hierarchy , attributed to s. denis the areopagite , takes notice , that certain unholy persons and enemies to the christian religion , think it a ridiculous thing that infants , who as yet cannot understand the divine mysteries , should be partakers of the sacraments ; and that professions and abrenunciations should be made by others for them and in their names . he answers , that holy men , governors of churches , have so taught , having received a tradition from their fathers and elders in christ : by which answer of his , as it appears , that he himself was later then the areopagite ; so it is so early by him affirmed , that even then there was an ancient tradition for the baptism of infants , and the use of godfathers in the ministery of the sacrament . concerning which , it having been so ancient a constitution of the church , it were well if men would rather humbly and modestly observe , then like scorners deride it , in which they shew their own folly as well as immodesty . for what undecency or incongruity is it , that our parents natural or spiritual should stipulate for us , when it is agreeable to the practise of all the laws and transactions of the world , an effect of the communion of saints and of christian oeconomy ? for why may not infants be stipulated for as well as we ? all were included in the stipulation made with adam ; he made a losing bargain for himself , and we smarted for his folly : and if the faults of parents , and kings , and relatives , do bring evil upon their children , and subjects , and correlatives , it is but equal that our children may have benefit also by our charity and piety . but concerning making an agreement for them , we finde that god was confident concerning abraham , that he would teach his children : and there is no doubt but parents have great power , by strict education and prudent discipline , to efform the mindes of their children to vertue . joshua did expresly undertake for his houshold , i and my house will serve the lord : and for children we may better do it , because till they are of perfect choice , no government in the world is so great , as that of parents over their children , in that which can concern the parts of this question : for they rule over their understandings , and children know nothing but what they are told , and they believe it infinitely : and it is a rare art of the spirit , to engage parents to bring them up well in the nurture and admonition of the lord ; they are persons obliged by a superinduced band , they are to give them instructions and holy principles , as they give them meat ; and it is certain that parents may better stipulate for their children , then the church can for men and women ; for they may be present impostors and hypocrites , as the church story tells of some , and consequently are {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , not really converted , and ineffectively baptized : and the next day they may change their resolution , and grow weary of their vow : and that is the most that children can do when they come to age : and it is very much in the parents , whether the children shall do any such thing , or no ; — purus & insons [ vt me collaudem ] si & vivo carus amicis , causa fuit pater his — ipse mihi custos incorruptissimus omnes circum doctores aderat ; quid multa ? pudicum ( qui primus virtutis bonos ) servavit ab omni non solùm facto , verum opprobrio quoque turpi : — oh hoc nunc laus illi debetur , & à me gratia major . horat. for education can introduce a habit and a second nature , against which children cannot kick , unless they do some violence to themselves and their inclinations . and although it fails too often when ever it fails , yet we pronounce prudently concerning future things , when we have a less influence into the event , then in the present case , ( and therefore are more unapt persons to stipulate ) and less reason in the thing it self ( and therefore have not so much reason to be confident . ) is not the greatest prudence of generals instanced in their foreseeing future events , and guessing at the designs of their enemies , concerning which they have less reason to be confident , then parents of their childrens belief of the christian creed ? to which i adde this consideration , that parents or godfathers may therefore safely and prudently promise , that their children shall be of the christian faith , because we not onely see millions of men and women who not onely believe the whole creed onely upon the stock of their education ; but there are none that ever do renounce the faith of their countrey and breeding , unless they be violently tempted by interest or weakness , antecedent or consequent . he that sees all men almost to be christians , because they are bid to be so , need not question the fittingness of godfathers promising in behalf of the children for whom they answer . and however the matter be for godfathers , yet the tradition of baptizing infants passed through the hands of irenaeus , omnem aetatem sanctificans per illam quae ad ipsam erat similitudinem . omnes n. venit per semet ipsum salvare , omnes inquam qui per eum renascuntur in deum , infantes , & parvulos , & pueros , & juvenes , & seniores . ideo per omnem venit aetatem , & infantibus infans factus sanctificās infantes , in parvulis parvulus , &c. christ did sanctifie every age by his own susception of it , and similitude to it . for he came to save all men by himself , i say all who by him are born again unto god , infants , and children , and boyes , and yong men , and old men . he was made an infant to infants , sanctifying infants , a little one to the little ones , &c. and origen is express , ecclesia traditionem ab apostolis suscepit etiam parvulis dare baptismum . the church hath received a tradition from the apostles to give baptism to children . and s. cyprian in his epistle to fidus , gives account of this article : for being questioned by some lesse skilfull persons , whether it were lawfull to baptize children before the eighth day ; he gives account of the whole question , and a whole councell of sixty six bishops upon very good reason decreed , that their baptism should at no hand be deferred , though whether six , or eight , or ten dayes , was no matter , so there be no danger or present necessity . the whole epistle is worth the reading . but besides these authorities of such who writ before the starting of the pelagian questions , it will not be useless to bring their discourses , of them and others , i mean the reason upon which the church did it both before and after . irenaeus his argument was this ; christ tooke upon him our nature to sanctifie and to save it ; and passed thorough the severall periods of it , even unto death , which is the symbole and effect of old age ; and therefore it is certaine he did sanctifie all the periods of it : and why should he be an infant , but that infants should receive the crowne of their age , the purification of their stained nature , the sanctification of their persons , and the saving of their soules by their infant lord and elder brother ? omnis enim anima eousque in adam censetur donec in christo recenseatur : tamdiu immunda quamdiu recenseatur . every soul is accounted in adam till it be new accounted in christ ; and so long as it is accounted in adam , so long it is uncleane ; and we know no uncleane thing can enter into heaven ; and therefore our lord hath defined it , vnlesse ye be born of water and the spirit , ye cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven : that is , ye cannot be holy . it was the argument of tertullian ; which the rather is to be received , because he was one lesse favorable to the custome of the church in his time of baptizing infants , which custome he noted and acknowledged , and hath also in the preceding discourse fairely proved . * and indeed ( that s. cyprian may superadde his symbol ) god who is no accepter of persons will also be no accepter of ages . * for if to the greatest delinquents sinning long before against god , remission of sins be given when afterwards they beleive , and from baptisme and from grace no man is forbidden , how much more ought not an infant be forbidden , who being new born , hath sinned nothing , save onely that being in the flesh , born of adam in his first birth , he hath contracted the contagion of an old death . who therefore comes the easier to obtain remission of sins , because to him are forgiven not his own , but the sins of another man . none ought to be driven from baptism and the grace of god , who is mercifull , and gentle , and pious unto all ; and therefore much lesse infants , who more deserve our aid , and more need the divine mercy , because in the first beginning of their birth crying and weeping , they can do nothing but call for mercy and reliefe . for this reason it was ( saith origen ) that they to whom the secrets of the divine mysteries were committed , did baptize their infants , because there was born with them the impurities of sin , which did need material absolution as a sacrament of spiritual purification ; for that it may appear that our sins have a proper analogy to this sacrament , the body it self is called the body of sin : and therefore the washing of the body is not ineffectual towards the great work of pardon and abolition . indeed after this absolution there remains concupiscence , or the material part of our misery and sin : for christ by his death onely took away that which when he did dye for us , he bore in his own body upon the tree . now christ onely bore the punishment of our sin , and therefore we shall not dye for it , but the material part of the sin christ bore not . sin could not come so neer him ; it might make him sick and dye , but not disordered and stained . he was pure from original and actual sins ; and therefore that remains in the body , though the guilt and punishment be taken off , and changed into advantages and grace ; and the actual are received by the spirit of grace descending afterwards upon the church , and sent by our lord to the same purpose . but it is not rationally to be answered what s. ambrose sayes , quia omnis peccato obnoxia , ideo omnis aetas sacramento idonea : for it were strange that sin and misery should seize upon the innocent and most unconsenting persons ; and that they onely should be left without a sacrament , and an instrument of expiation . and although they cannot consent to the present susception , yet neither do they refuse ; and yet they consent as much to the grace of the sacrament , as to the prevarication of adam and because they suffer under this , it were but reason they should be relieved by that . and * it were better ( as gregory nazianzen affirms ) that should be consigned and sanctified without their own knowledge , then to dye without their being sanctified ; for so it happened to the circumcised babes of israel : and if the conspersion and washing the doore posts with the blood of a lamb , did sacramentally preserve all the first-born of goshen , it cannot be thought impossible or unreasonable that the want of understanding in children should hinder them from the blessing of a sacrament , and from being redeemed and washed with the blood of the holy lamb , who was slain for all from the beginning of the world . after all this it is not inconsiderable that we say the church hath great power and authority about the sacraments ; which is observeable in many instances . she appointed what persons she pleased , and in equal power made an unequal dispensation and ministery . the apostles first dispensed all things , and then they left off exteriour ministeries to attend to the word of god and prayer : and s. paul accounted it no part of his office to baptize , when he had been separated by imposition of hands at antioch , to the work of preaching and greater ministeries ; and accounted that act of the church , the act of christ , saying , christ sent mee not to baptize , but to preach the gospel : they used various forms in the ministration of baptism , sometimes baptizing in the name of christ , sometimes expressely invocating the holy and ever blessed trinity : one while [ i baptize thee ] as in the latine church , but in greek , [ let the servant of christ be baptized : ] and in all ecclesiastical ministeries the church invented the forms , & in most things hath often changed them , as in absolution , excommunication , and sometimes they baptized people upon their profession of repentance , and then taught them ; as it hapned to the jaylor and all his family ; in whose case there was no explicit faith afore hand in the mysteries of religion , so far as appears ; and yet he , and not onely he , but all his house were baptized at that hour of the night when the earthquake was terrible , and the fear was pregnant upon them , & this upon their masters account , as it is likely : but others were baptized in the conditions of a previous faith , and a new begun repentance * . they baptized in rivers or in lavatories , by dipping or by sprinkling ; for so we finde that s. laurence did as he went to martyrdom , and so the church did sometimes to clinicks , and so it is highly convenient to be done in northern countries according to the prophecy of isaiah , so shall he sprinkle many nations , according as the typical expiations among the jews were usually by sprinkling : and it is fairly relative to the mystery , to the sprinkling with the blood of christ and the watering of the furrows of our souls with the dew of heaven , to make them to bring forth fruit unto the spirit and unto holinesse . the church sometimes dipt the catechumen three times ; sometimes but once ▪ some churches use fire in their baptisms , so do the ethiopians , and the custome was antient in some places . and so in the other sacrament ; sometimes she stood and sometimes kneeled , and sometimes received it in the mouth , and sometimes in the hand : one while in leavened , another while in unleavened bread : sometimes the wine and water were mingled , sometimes they were pure ; and they admitted some persons to it sometimes , which at other times she rejected : sometimes the consecration was made by one forme , sometimes by another : and to conclude , sometimes it was given to infants , sometimes not : and she had power so to do ; for in all things where there was not a commandment of christ expressed or imployed in the nature and in the end of the institution , the church had power to alter the particulars , as was most expedient , or conducing to edification : and although the after ages of the church which refused to communicate infants , have found some little things against the lawfulnesse , and those ages that used it found out some pretences for its necessity ; yet both the one and the other had liberty to follow their own necessities , so in all things they followed christ . certainly there is infinitely more reason why infants may be communicated , then why they may not be baptized . and that this discourse may revert to its first intention ; although there is no record extant of any church in the world , that from the apostles dayes inclusively to this very day ever refused to baptize their children , yet if they had upon any present reason they might also change their practise , when the reason should be changed ; and therefore if there were nothing els in it , yet the universal practise of all churches in all ages , is abundantly sufficient to determine us , and to legitimate the practise , since christ hath not forbidden it . it is sufficient confutation to disagreeing people to use the words of s. paul , we have no such custome , nor the churches of god , to suffer children to be strangers from the covenant of promise , till they shall enter into it as jews or turks may enter , that is , by choise and disputation . but although this alone to modest and obedient , that is , to christian spirits , be sufficient , yet this is more then the question did need . it can stand upon its proper foundation . quicunque parvulos recentes ab uteris matrum baptizandos negat , anathema est . he that refuseth to baptize his infants , shall be in danger of the councel . the prayer . o holy and eternal iesus , who in thy own person wert pleased to sanctify the waters of baptism and by thy institution and commandment didst make them effectual , to excellent purposes of grace and remedy , be pleased to verify the holy effects of baptism to me and all thy servants whose names are dedicated to thee in an early and timely presentation , and enable us with thy grace to verify all our promises , by which we were bound , then when thou didst first make us thy own portion and relatives in the consummation of a holy covenant . o be pleased to pardon all those undecencies and unhandsome interruptions of that state of favour in which thou didst plant us by thy grace , and admit us by the gates of baptism : and let that spirit which moved upon those holy waters never be absent from us , but call upon us and invite us by a perpetual argument and daily solicitations and inducements to holiness ; that we may never return to the filthiness of sin , bnt by the answer of a good conscience may please thee and glorify thy name and doe honour to thy religion and institution in this world , and may receive the blessings and the rewards of it in the world to come , being presented to thee pure and spotless in the day of thy power when thou shalt lead thy church to a kingdome , and endless glories . amen . the end . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a95331e-250 §. 1. §. 2. joh. 4. 14. §. 3. 1 pet. 3. 21. §. 4. §. 5. vmbra in lege , imago in evangelio , veritas in coelo . s. ambr. §. 6. 1 cor. 10. 2. §. 7. §. 8. a tertull. de praescrip. . c. 40. b scholiast. . in ju. sat . 2. l. 2. c o nimium faciles qui tristia crimina caedis tolli stumineâ posse putatis aquâ . §. 9. john 4. 1. §. 10. audi quid scripturae doceant : johannis baptisma non tam peccata dimisit , quàm baptisma poenitentiae fuit in peccatorum remissionem , idque in futuram remissionē quae esset postea per sanctificationem christi subsequutura . hieronym . adv. luciferian . a vide suprà . sect. 9. n. 1. b acts 8. 16. acts 2. 38. §. 11. §. 12. mat. 28. 19. mark 16. 16. john 3. 5. gen. 17. 14. s. august ▪ haeres . 46. 59. §. 13. §. 14. heb. 6. 1. s. august . l. 2. c. 1. de cate. rudib . just . martyr . apol. 2. acts 2. 47. 15. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ▪ cyril . hierosol . catec . 2. 1 cor. 12. 13. acts 13. 48. §. 16. john 3 5. titus 3. 5. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . damasc . l. 4. orth . fid. c. 10. lib. de c. 1. lib. 5. hist. 17. ezek 36. 25. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . symb. nicen. lib. 1. c. 3. in johan . acts 22. 16. eph. 5. 26. lib 4. adv. marc. c 9. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . gr. pro , annon ita credimus quia omn● g●nus peccati cùm ad salutare lavacrum venimus aufertur ? o. igen . homil. 15. in jesu . ecce quicquid iniquitatum sempiternus ignis excoquere & expiare vix posset , subito sacro fonte submersum est , & de aeternis debitis brevissimo lavacri compendio cum indulgentissimo creditore transactum est . ambros. l. 1. c. 7. de poen . qui dicit peccata in baptismo non funditùs dimitti , dicat in mari rubro aegyptios non veraciter mortuos . s. greg. m. l. 9. ep 39. phavorin . arator . l. 2. hist. apostol. rev. 7. 14. 1 john 1. 7. acts 22. 16. tit. 3. 5. heb. 9. 14. 1 john 5. 8. §. 18. titus 3. 4 , 5. theodoret. ep. de divin. decret. cap. de lib. de nuptiis . cap. 23. & tract. 124. in johan . vide salmeron . tom , 13. p. 487. §. 19. gal. 3. 26. verse 29. heb. 10. 16 , &c. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , scil. a● futurum respiciens {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} 2 pet. 1. 9. vide part . 2. disc. 9. of repentance , num . 9. ad 31. §. 20. paulin. ep. 12. ad serenum . 1 cor. 12. 13. john 3. 5. s. basil . de spir. s. cap. 15. §. 21. * 2 cor. 1. 22. eph. 1. 13. 4. 30 john 6. 27. s. cyril hieros . catech. 3. §. 22. s. basil . in psal. 28. heb. 10. 32. heb. 6. 4. 1 joh. 2. 20 , 27. §. 23. 1 john 39. lib. de spir. s. c. 18. rom. 6. 7. ver. 5. 6. * {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , i. e. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . plutar. vide disc. 9. of repentance . n. 46. §. 24. rom. 5. 3 , 5. col. 2. 12. §. 25. mark 16. 16. tit. 3. 5. niceph. l. 7. c. 35. socr. l. 5. c. 6. idem lib. 7. c. 7. psal. 34. 7. heb. 1. 14. basil . theodor . epiphan , nazanz . col. 2. 2. cyril . heros . dionys . areop. . august . l. 2. c. 13. contra crescon. gram. §. 27. mark 16. 16. acts 2. 28. apol. ad anton. caes. 1 pet. 3. 21. tertull. de resur. cern . ad tryphon . jud. dial. cum tryph. lib. 2. adv. parm. clem. alex. lib. 1. paedag. . c. 6. §. 28. notes for div a95331e-5050 §. 1. §. 2. acts 10. 47. aug. de moribus eccles. cath. l. 1. c. 35. bern. serm. de coena dom. §. 3. acts 8. 37. acts 2. 38. acts 3. 15. §. 4. §. 5. mat 9. 28. mark 9. 23. mat. 8. 13. john 4. 50. mat. 9. 28. §. 6. john 6. 44. mark 10. 15. 7. §. 8. luke 17. 20 , 21. luke 18. 16. §. 9. luk. 4. 22 , 28. 1 pet. 1. 2. 2 thess. 1. 2. rom. 8. 30. eccles. 1. §. 11. §. 12. §. 13. * §. 25 , &c. §. 14. gen. 17. 2 , &c. heb. 11. 13. 14. 15. rom. 4. 11. 7. 12. §. 15. rom. 4 , 11 , 12. v. 17. v. 13. gal. 3. 14 , 29. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ▪ epiphan. l. 1. haeres . 8. scil. epicuraeor . §. 16. tit. 3. 5. §. 17. rom. 5. 17 , 18. vide august . l. 4. contra duas epistolas pelag. c. 4. l. 6. contr. iur. c. 4. prosper . contra collatorem . cap. 20. orat. 40. in s. §. 18. a lib. 3. adv. pelag. 6. lib. 1. in initio . lib. de c. 18. §. 19. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . dionys . areop. . eccles. hier. cap. 3. part . 3. vt quod perdideramus in adam , i. e. secundum imaginem & similitudinem esse dei , hoc in jesu christo reciperemus . irenaeus lib. 3. c. 30. 1 joh. 1. 8. ep. ad fiden . lib. 3. ep. 8. s. aug. lib. de pec . mer. & remiss . c. 9. §. 20. §. 21. §. 22. §. 23. §. 24. nisi qui renatus fuerit &c. utique nullum excipit , non infantem , non aliquā praeventum necessitate . ambr. de abrab . patr. lib. 2. c. 11. lib. 2. c. 11. de abrah . patriarc . §. 25. §. 26. §. 27. isa. 49. 22. §. 28. §. 29. l. 2. c. 39. vide etiam constit . clementis . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . lib. 5. ad ●om . c. 6. idem homil . 14. in lucam & lib. 8. hom 8. in . levitic . §. 30. §. 31. irenaeus . §. 32. tertullian . lib. de anima . c. 39. & 4● s. cyprian epist. ad fidum . * cyprian . origen . lib. 5. ad rom. c. 6. §. 33. s. ambrose . de abraham patriar. . l 2 c. 11. * s. greg. naz. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . orat. 40. in s. §. 34. * non ut delinquere desinant sed quia defierunt , as tertul. phraseth i● . isa. 52. 15. 1 pet. 1. 2. aqua refectionis & baptismi lavacrum quo anima sterilis ariditate peccati ad bonos fructus inferendos divinis muneribus irrigatur . cassidor . m. 23. ps. 2. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , dixit heracleon apud clem. alex. concil. mil●vit . can. 2. vindiciæ pædo-baptismi, or, a confirmation of an argument lately emitted for infants baptism in a letter to a reverend divine of the church of england / by r.b. ... burthogge, richard, 1638?-ca. 1700. 1685 approx. 101 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 44 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2005-10 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a30637 wing b6157a estc r40304 18831844 ocm 18831844 108397 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a30637) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 108397) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1663:29) vindiciæ pædo-baptismi, or, a confirmation of an argument lately emitted for infants baptism in a letter to a reverend divine of the church of england / by r.b. ... burthogge, richard, 1638?-ca. 1700. [2], 84 p. printed for thomas simmons ..., london : 1685. "books printed for, and sold by tho. simmons at the prince's arms in ludgate-street": p. 80-84. reproduction of original in the union theological seminary library, new york. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism. god -goodness. 2003-04 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2003-05 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-03 jonathan blaney sampled and proofread 2005-03 jonathan blaney text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion vindiciae poedo-baptismi : or , a confirmation of an argument lately emitted for infants baptism : in a letter to a reverend divine of the church of england . by r.b. m.d. london : printed for thomas simmons , at the prince's arms in ludgate street . 1685. sir , i was at the point of making a resolution before i receiv'd yours ( of june 9. ) wholly to neglect that libellous disputation ( as it is called ) between a doctor and an apothecary ; as a thing that doth not only betray the unsincerity , the artifices , the impotent passions of him that wrote it ; but that to a prudent and judicious reader , doth ( as is said of the viper ) carry in its own bowels , causes that in time will destroy it . but seeing you advise me that it may not be unfit that something be said to it ; and i know we ought not to have too good an opinion of the world , which generally , being malicious , and invidious , is apter to take impression from a witty calumny and detraction , than from the soundest and most solid reasoning and argument , on these and the like considerations , i now resolve to reply . but in doing so , that i resemble not my adversary , whom not only i , but many sober and indifferent persons do condemn for impertinence , for falsehood , for bitterness , for peremptoriness and presumption , and for such other courses as ( to use the expression of a noble person ) tend rather to rumor and impression in the vulgar sort , than to the likelihood of any good effect . for this reason , i am determined in replying to him , to propose unto my self for my example , that wise and religious bishop of whom when he returned answer to a pamphlet much ( it seems ) of a nature like to this before me . my lord bacon says , that he remembred that a fool must be answered , but not by becoming like unto him , and considered the matter which he handled , and not the person with whom he dealt . the points therefore that i will go upon , shall be only these : first , to shew nakedly and truly the occasion of my engaging with my adversary in this controversy . secondly , to shew the unfairness of his proceeding in the publick management of it , together with the motives , which ( as i suppose ) induced him to the unfairness . thirdly , to note but as it were in passing , and by the by , the undue aspersions which he casts upon me , in reference to my argument ; together with the malice is in them . fourthly , briefly again to state the argument i made , and to demonstrate , that as it is not a log ( as he calls it ) nor vncouth , so that he is still extreamly affrighted at it . ( for he dares not touch it ; ) and still hath cause to be so . as for my engaging with him ; the first occasion ( as i have said already ) was purely accidental , and it was drawn on i scarce know how ; he says , by the importunity of the lady , my readiness to comply with it , and his unwariness ; and let it be so . but a casual , passing , undesigned discourse it was ; a discourse that as it did begin , so i thought it would have ended in the same place ; for my part , i scarce had one thought of it afterwards . but as for any insulting upon him , of which he now complains , and never before that i know of ; and with which he thinks to bespeak the affections of his readers ( for indeed he needs them ) and to excuse his own acerbity ; he cannot produce one witness of any ; i am sure , by me : i can many , even of persons that were present at the whole discourse , to attest the contrary . but that he was insulted upon , and that ( in his own terms ) his sword was as it were broken over his head , and with triumph , you must believe it ; and yet all the while , the weapons on both sides , ( they ) were but words ; and you can hardly think , he lost his , then ; who , still , speaks swords and daggers . but you will tell me ; well : all this , hitherto , was but a transient accidental discourse , such as might happen every day , when persons meet who are of different perswasions , and there is an end. but how came it afterwards to be so solemn , and so deliberate , as from words that are but birds in the air , to become writings , which are as bears at the stake ? truly as to this , one would think , by what my adversary writes , and by the fashion in which he writes , in his epistle , and in pag. 16. 17. that nothing but resentment on his part , of the insolence and affront that then was offered him , and a motion of vanity on mine , to answer his challenge , drew on this second engagement ; little else can be inferred from what he hath written concerning it . but indeed , on my part it was nothing less than so , and nothing less on his neither , pretendedly ; for all was conscience , nothing but conscience and enquiry after further light , with which in a letter that he sent me above a year and half ( he calls it in his usual figure , sometime ) after , he importuned my answer , and prevailed . for who is there , but would have believed ( as then i did ) that it was conscience , pure conscience that acted him ; if he had received from him ( as i had ) a letter so concernedly penn'd , and with so much movement : with so much importunity , and so much seeming sincerity ; and if he knew him not any better than i did at that time ; for thus his letter , bearing date sept. 9. 1681. doth speak in so many words . upon this occasion honoured sir , ( and that occasion was a motion he made me , about perfecting the printing and publishing of a book of dr. worsley's ) i shall also take the boldness to remind you of a conference you were pleased sometime since to entertain with my self upon the subject of infants baptism , when you were pleased to insist upon the covenant made with abraham , wherein god promised to be a god to him and to his seed after him ; from whence you argued , that in as much as by vertue of that covenant both abraham and his seed after him were to receive the sign of circumcision ; and in as much as the apostle doth expresly tell us , that the blessing of abraham was to come upon the gentiles , through jesus christ ; it thence followed , that the believing gentiles and their posterity also , as being the spiritual seed of abraham , had a right to baptism , which is the seal of the same covenant under the new testament administration . having since that time therefore revolv'd this argument of yours in my thoughts over and over , i could not satisfie my conscience till i could either come to some satisfactory clearness in my own mind concerning the cogency thereof , or otherwise till i had drawn up something or other in writing , that might at least be a sufficient justification unto my self in the way of my present practice . and after many fervent addresses and petitions to heaven , that as i might not mistake my way , so that i might not oppose or neglect any part of the heavenly truth ; i have at length drawn up the inclosed paper , which i do therefore now humbly offer to your serious consideration , with this earnest desire , that if after all that i have now said , you shall yet judge me to be under a mistake in the present point in reference to my opinion about the spirituall seed of abraham , that you will please at least to suggest to me what you think may be substantially objected by way of opposition thereunto . i hope dear sir , that it is the investigation of truth that both you and my self also do aim at , which should be dearer to us than all the world besides ; and therefore if notwithstanding what i have now offered , you shall still apprehend that i have mist it in my present search and reasonings concerning it , i beseech you to endeavour my correction and better information therein . i have indeed drawn up the enclosed paper by way of postscript to a large discourse in reference to infant baptism , which i had before compiled , wherein i do consider and give answer to all the most material arguments which are usually insisted on for the justification of the practice of infant baptism . and therefore also in the present paper you will perceive that i do touch upon some other arguments than what you were pleased to insist upon in the formention'd conference , that i had with you upon this subject . i know dear sir , that you 'll not be offended with me for making thus bold with you , and that you will not reject what may be substantialy offered for the discovery of truth , though by never so mean a hand . now that god would be pleased at length to send forth his light and his truth , that all that love and fear him may serve and worship him with one heart and with one shoulder , according to the primitve pattern , is the earnest desire of your most affectionate and humble servant p c. now sir , is there in this whole letter the least insinuation of any resentment in him ? the least of any insulting over him ? or abuse put upon him ? in that which here himself calls but a conference ; the softest word in the world ? if he had any resentment at that time , how often hath the sun gone down on his wrath ! how deeplv was it dissembled ! how subtilly masked over with the fair pretences of conscience ! of enquiry after further light ! and of longing for satisfaction ! and all , how faced with seeking of god! — this letter was that which drew me on in this business ; which being a business of conscience , as i then believed it , ( and who in my circumstances but would ? ) i pursued it in my first reply , with all the fairness and candor imaginable : but was answer'd with so much presumption , asperity , and arrogance , that i must have been as void of sence , as he of civillity , and sincerity , not to have seen at last ( though somewhat of the latest ) that it was not conscience , and a willingness of receiving , or of giving further light , as was pretended ; but rooted malice , and a lust of revenge that inspir'd him . conscience was but the bait , the hook was uuder ; let him print his first , second , and third answers , as he sent them to me , and then let the world judge , if it went any less . and this reminds me of the second head on which i am to discourse to you , and that is , of the unfairness of his proceeding in the publick management of this business ; and of the motives , that ( as i suppose ) induced him to this unfairness . his unfairness is , that when it was but letters only that had been written by him to me on this occasion , and letters only that are referred to by me in those i published : as also , seeing i wrote not any but on this urgent importunity ; and when i printed what i wrote , i was so candid , so just , and so exact , that in the publication which i made , as i omitted nothing so i added nothing but what i put a mark upon , that all the world might note it . i say the unfairness is , that , for all this , this seeker of truth and one who as himself tells us , dayly prayeth for the desireable vnity of the spirit in the bond of peace , that he instead of publishing the letters which indeed he sent , and as he sent them , should print a base and fictious disputation that never was in reallity , as the sum of all the letters that went between us . where as indeed , he but presents the world with pieces , and patches , both of his own letters , and of mine ; and withal , in those patches ( he ) so industriously disguises , alters , and abuses the argument i manage , that t is as impossibly to see it in his libel in its true proportions and figure , as to believe , that base and barbarous methods ( such as these he uses ) are proper means , either of attaining unto the bond of peace , or , unto the vnity of the spirt . thus four letters , which are the main ones , are suppressed ; the first of which i even now repeated . this is his unfairness . the true motives , why he did not publish his three first responsory letters , his second , third , and fourth , as well as his fifth , and sixth , ( for why he supppessed the first of all that was sent , is evident enough , from what hath been declar'd already , ) may probably be presum'd to be these ( following . ) first , he did it , to hide from the observation of his readers , the just causes i had of making those complaints i did in my letters , of his unfairness , rudeness , and vanity ? of his bold assertions , without proofs , his cunning evasions , instead of direct answers ; his always partial , and often false pretended repetitions ; and his triumphs before the victory &c. which undue proceeding , used without any provocation or any examaple by me , and that too , by a man that breathed nothing but conscience , but desire of satisfaction , and seeking of light in the business , and all this after seeking of god ; should it be apparent in his letters , as undoubtedly it is , and i believe he is conscious it is ; as it would have had an aspect not very pleasing unto most others , so possibly it might awaken in some of his own party that mean well , and are truly conscientious , very strange apprehensions , not only of his humor , carriage , and conduct , but even of the main of his cause . this likely he foresaw . secondly , he chose to act his part by way of a dialogue , rather than of letters , to hide from the eyes of his own party , the strength and cogency of my argument ; which being harmonical , the force and power of it lyes in the joynts of it , and in the reference of its parts ; so that , either by the dividing and mangling of the parts , or by the hudling and confounding of them together , ( both which , at times , he hath done , in his dispute , ) the force thereof is unseen , and is lost . and indeed , as he hath managed the business , he might well hope to perswade his own party , whose hands likely would be as full of his books , as empty of mine , that i had said nothing in my argument but what he there repeats of it ; which is as true , as that the whole chapter of the first of genesis is in the contents of it ; he never giving but an imperfect summary ( and that too , many times , with a mixture of falshood ) in the report he makes of what i did propose to be prov'd ; but he mentions not the very proofs themselves , of what i proposed . this will appear most manifestly , by but comparing his pretended disputation , with my printed letters . had he only printed his letters , some of his own party probably , those of them that are just and prudent , would have had recourse also to mine . but now , his disputation speaking all on both sides , they may think , there is no need of that . thirdly , it was done to hide the advantage i had over him in the course of the argument ; how i gained ground , by what steps , and with what mediums ; as also , to conceal that tergiversation shifting and shuffling ; that declining the force of my argument ; and that insisting on little things that are by the by ; with other such like artificies , of which i accused him . all this is hinted in my letters , and he was not ignorant , it would be plain by his own : let him shew the contrary else , by publishing them . half an eye may easily discern , that the controversy was almost at an end , before his fifth letter was written ; which yet , is the first he publishes . and surely , what ever he says , more was in it then a bare respect and kindness to his reader , to whom ( as he tells us p. 66. ) he would not be burthensome ; ay , there was also some little mixture of kindness and respect unto himself , he knew the burthening of his reader ( for burthened certainly he would be , if judicious and considerate , with verbosity without sence ; with common placing without discretion ; with skirmishing about but words ; and with other such unseemly and impertinent artificies . ) he knew , such burthening of his reader in the consequence would be a renewing of that vexation and anguish which he had found so grievous , and which he bemoans so much both in his epistle , and in his book . p. 17. and here , seeing i dispair , with all the provocation i can give , to succeed in my design of induciug him to print entirely , and bonâ cum fide , the suppressed letters which he sent me , i will therefore take occasion , from his published animadversions , to make his other readers sensible ( for you are so already ) both of the credibility of the former motives , and of the truth of the charge imployed in them ; by observing ( to them ) out of many instances that do occur , but one or two for a taste . the first shall be of his candour and sincerity , the second , of his way and method in arguing . the first , which is of his candour and sincerity , shall be in the repetition which he makes of the first paragraph of my first letter , in which he purposedly , but ungratefully omits that part of the period that relates to the movement and importunity with which he solicited , and even compelled me into this business . for instead of adding ( and so importunate and iterated requests to give you the result of my most cool and serious considerations of what you have done in it . ) he knowing that a passage of that significancy , would make it plain he was the first aggressor , at least as to writing , and that i came not in but on his great solicitation ; and consequently , as it would detect his great ingratitude , so it would interfere with what he often insinuates , about the rise of the controversy . therefore , he craftily omits it , and only drawes a line ; which only notes , that something is wanting , but no body could divine , it was this ; the sense going on so smooth without it . the former , is one instance of his ingenuity and of his sincerity , but we have another which do's much resemble it , ( viz. ) that of publishing to the world his reflections on those little points ( for 〈◊〉 you may see them to be so ) in the first edition of my letter , which my self had altered and amended in the second ; for though he knew i had corrected and altered them ; yet he slily insinuates in the margen of his dispute , ( p. 28 & 32 ) as if he had not known it , and that the alterations are only in the print : whereas , i printed nothing in my letters but what i first sent him , except that in my last , of which i advertised the reader , and which i marked with an asterisme . this is so great an imposture on his readers , and so great an abuse , that ( p. 65. ) even himself doth offer something that might pass for an extenuation , if this meanness of his proceeding should ever chance to be noted . but this is one of his arts still ; he kn●w that many would observe the wound he gives in the margen , that would not much regard the balm he afterward applys , for the healing it ; and the less , because it is not applyed directly . so much for his ingenuity and candour . as for his method of arguing ; besides a gift he has of telling and applying of tales , and of capping of verses ; he uses to pervert the words of his adversary , and in things of little moment , to raise a dust , and make great a doe ; either to blind the eyes of those that shall consider him , or to divert them , from what is the main in the business ; for with this , especially if it be difficult , he is but seldom used to meddle , at all ; or if at all , not closely . to manifest this , i but desire his readers , that after the perusall of the title page of my book and of my advertisement , they would observe his reflections upon them ; both as to the matter of them ; as to the manner of them ; and as to the design of them . how that for the matter of them , they are made upon words only ; and for the manner of them , upon words distorted from the proper and genuine sence of their author ; and for the design of them , that they are made to expose , and abuse , and inodiate , and therefore some of them are often , and most maliciously inculcated ; and all this , without the least consideration of what is materiall , and substantial , and in confirmation of the argument . for , as he is witty enough in little matters , to pervert the sence of his adversary , to raise a calumny on him , and to make things soberly said to pass for ridiculous ; so he is as wise in greater matters , to avoid any touch of them ; and that for fear of his head , which , he well remembers ( page 17 ) once already was in danger , by having a sword as it were broken over it . this i say , is a truth , and very manifest . for in my advertisement , all that is done by way of argument ( and that 's no inconsiderable part of it , the whole consisting of but nine l●aves , and six of them are spent that way , under four considerations ) all this he wholly skips over : and , as if it was not , at all , his business , or in his design , at all , to reason and argue , but only to calumniate , expose , and abuse ; he that hath so many words for bad , or for impertinent purposes , hath not one word for that purpose , which only became him . one would think a man so much in pretentions of conscience , and of nothing but conscience in the case , who did only seek to give , or to receive satisfaction , should have judged it proper to have considered what was argumentative ; and that , whatever else he did , he should be sure not to have left undone the thing that most imported those ends . but of this not one word , but while he is dealing in his mint , annis , and cummin , ( and yet he is not for tything ) he leaves those greater matters undone . i beleive by this , that you will easily infer as i do , that really it was not conscience , as he at first pretended , in his letter to me ; but it was rouzed courage as he tells his reader , in the epistle to him , that made him so concerned , and so forward in this controversy . and he accordingly manages it , not as a serious matter , a matter of conscience , for light and information ; but as a business of quarrel , and of vanity ; only to recover ( if he can ) his lost credit , and that field , which ( as himself confesseth p. 17. ) once he fairly left me , and now he would unfairly regain . you see his unfairness in the publick management of the business between us which is the second head i propounded ; i now advance to the third , which is to note ( but briefly ) the unjust aspersions which he makes of contradiction and incoherence , and of ostentation and vanity , as he scents them in my discourse ; and those he runs upon , under two heads : the first , with respect to the harmony ; the second , to the novelty of it . as to the harmony , he says ; first that i affirm in my advertisement that in this controversy , there is no need of of exactness of critiscisme ; and yet , that i say , namely in one of my letters , that gen. 17. 9. 10. must be understood crittically : and that the apostle was as critical upon it as i , or any other can be . secondly , that i say in my advertisement , that i was concern'd to see the article of infants baptism to hang on wyres , and by geometry , and that i could not see it owner of sure and solid foundations , unless it be as in my letters i lay it ; and yet in my letters i applaud mr. baxter's argument for it . thirdly , that in one of my letters , i call the opinion of antipedo baptism a novelty ; and yet had said in another , that it is probable that those who would not suffer little children to come to christ to be bless●d , were of the perswasion of this anabaptist . these are his mountains births as to the harmony of my argument . really sir , i know not how , without blushing , and begging of your pardon , for giving you the trouble of so great imp●rtinencys , to enter into discourse of things so vain , so frivilous ; but since it must be done , i will endeavour to do it as little to your disturbance , that is , with as much sobriety and tenderness , and with as little amplification , as is possible : i will but touch on these matters , and note them , without insisting and staying upon them . to his first imputation then i say , that as one may understand a text made out and unfolded by a crittick , who himself is no crittick ; so , that i spake of exactness of crittiscism ; and of that too , as a part of humane learning ; as is evident by the coherence , where i spake of it . ay , and when in my advertisement i affirmed , that there was no need of exactness of critiscism , as to this business ; i then did and with a direct prospect unto what i had affirmed in my letter , both concerning gen. 17. 9. 10. and the apostle paul's being crittical upon it ; i say , i did add by way of limitation ( for the main ) that for the main of the controversy , there was no need of it . and indeed the controversy for the main of it , doth not depend on any crittiscism ; much less upon exactness of crittiscism , and least of all upon exactness of crittiscism as it is a part of humane learning ; one need not to be a great scholar , a great philosopher , or a great crittick ( as he must be , to be an exact one ) to understand that text , or the apostles crittiscism upon it ; which to , is not a humane crittiscism , but a divine . to the second , i grant i did say i was concerned , ( and so i was ) to see the article of infants baptism hang on wyres , and by geometry ; on which i did , and do believe it to be hung by all that do not find it ( as indeed it is , and as i find it is , and as many others before have found it ) inlay'd in the constitution of an instituted church , and in the harmony of the scriptures . those that lay it otherwise , do not lay it on its true foundations . but i never said as this wyre drawing man , whose only business is to put me under odium , and envy with all partys , would make me say ; that all before me hung it but on wyres ; for those did not , even according to that saying of mine , who founded it on abrahams covenat , and in the constitution of an instituted church ; as many did before me ; and as even mr. baxter must ; seeing the membership of children , which is the principal argument he goes upon cannot be understood but with relation to the constitution of a church ; and it is inlay'd in the covenant . and where now i pray you , sir , is that vanity or that contradiction which this lincey'd man that looks through stone walls hath espyed , or rather invented ? i say invented ; for when he affirms ( p. 3. ) that i said i could not see it ( meaning infants baptism ) to be owner of sure and solid foundations , vnless it be as i here lay it ; ) he imposes grosly ; i said no such words ; i only said , ( unless it were inlaid ( as i find it is ) in the very constitution of an instituted church , and in the harmony of the scriptures . ) and many to be sure , if not most now a dayes do take it to be so inlaid ; all do , that ground it on the covenant of abraham , though they do not all find it to be so in one way , and in the same method . as to his third exception ; give me leave to tell you , that in the last paragraph of my first letter , speaking of some that in our saviours time , did forbid little children to come unto him to be blessed , i said in a parenthesis , and as it were smilinglyly ; not by way of position as a thing on which i insisted , but only pleasantly ( that some ( it may be of your perswasion ) &c. ) but such is the judgment , the exactness of judgment of our great disputer , that he takes as spoken seriously , that which was but pleasantly spoken ; making it to contradict what other where i say , concerning the novelty of his perswasion . and to perswade his reader the better ( for none that is mine can think so , ) that he hath grounds for what he says ; he falsely represents my words , and makes me say ( pag. 3. ) that it is probable , those that would not suffer little children to come to christ were of his perswasion . is not this an honest disputant , or rather a cunning sophister ? i said ( some , it may be , of your perswasion . and , it may be , is but happily , and that at most , is but a possibility , and he hath made probability of it : in a word , hath made a serious matter of what was only intended for a divertive one . but of this i doubt not but i shall hear again , and be rhimed for it . in the mean time , i will ask him one hard question , ( viz. ) where it is that i do say , ( as he says i do ) to this purpose , ( that 't is probable , &c. ) sure he can never find it , but where he finds , that mahomet's tomb at mecca , to use his own expression ( pag. 5. ) is said to hang by geometry ; or that the licians suffered none to propose a new law but at his peril , ( pag. 5. ) and that is no where , but either in his own common-place-book , or ( to speak in his own most civil language ) within his own pericranium ; and there , magnetism and geometry , serious and pleasant , licians and locrians , scotus and sotus are all one : and not so much as mensa , as a table between them . i have ended with the reflexions which he makes as to the harmony of my argument , the which you see , are so rarely proper , and so judicious , that you may well believe ( though he say it himself pag. 64. ) that his reader will find ( namely in his book ) somewhat of brain as well as tongue : and somewhat of his brain you have already had , upon the harmony of the argument . now , you shall have somewhat too of his tongue , upon the novelty of it . and upon this head ; first , he gravely informs me , that innovators hear not well among the judicious ) ( p. 4. ) as if anabaptists were not innovators ; but all for antiquity , and the good old way . secondly ; he is again at his tales , that the licians ( he should have said the locrians ) suffered none to propose a new law but at his own peril ) ( p. 5. ) as if arguments were lawes ; or that infants baptisme were not setled by ours . in fine ; he adds , ( and you may think from pure love ) that the church of england ( by all means , he is much concerned for her ; ) and all other the assertors and advocates of infants baptism on the old foundations , are more concerned in one passage than he ) ( p. 5. ) as if all , of all orders , were fast asleep ; and all like to be lost , unless a goose a second time , should save the capitol . you see sir , his extraordinary courtesie for the church of england , as well as for other the advocates and assertors of infants baptism but i hope this church and those other advocates and assertors of infants baptism , will not , for all that , be wheedled into a mistake . you may be sure his courtesie is but polyphemus ' s ; now indeed , he fights against one ; but know , he hath a reserve for all ( you now must look to your old foundations ; he is principally ( p. 5. ) at present at least ) only concerned about the new one . ) mark that , ( at present at least . ) this church , no more then others , hath no entire security ( from him ; ) it is not a peace but only a cessation he grants . ( he is at present only concerned about the new one ; ) but time may come for the old ones too ; and really , he is provided already if such a time shall come ; for ( as you had it before , in his letter ) he hath a very large discourse which he had before compiled , in which he doth consider and give answer to all the most material arguments which are usually insisted on for justification of the practice of infants baptism , &c. the church of england it seems ( for all his kindness to her ) and all other the advocates and assertors of infants baptism ( though now he claws them ) might have heard of him sooner ; ay , and have felt him too before this ; but that , unluckily for my self , but luckily enough for this church , and for those other advocates and assertors , i did come in his way ; and now , the cry is novelty ! novelty ! truly i think it very needless , ( and i could wish that others thought so too ) to vindicate my self from his extravegancies upon his topick , and to tell you , that the title page of my book on which he principally grounds them , as it went from me , was nakedly this : an argument for infants-baptism deduced from the analogy of faith , and harmony of the scriptures . and what is added , if any imputation can be laid to it , of gaudiness or ostentation , it must be put on the book-seller , as the occasioner of it . i acknowledge it is said , that the method is wholly new , and that it certainly is ; but it is not said as this disputer doth report it , that the argument is wholly new. method and matter are very different things , and in the very title , where it is noted that the method is wholly new ; it is said of the grounds , and these are matter , not that they are wholly new , but that they are not commonly observed . implying , that they may have been , and are , by some , observed , though , happily , not by every body : and who will say they were ? and when i say , the argument as i do manage it , hath little authority ; 't is manifest i speak not of the argument as to the matter and grounds of it ; but as to the method and form of managing of it . i say not , the argument simply , but the argument as i do manage it : the method of management is mine , and is new ; but the grounds on which it is bottomed are not new ; but are as old as the church , and as the bible . in fine , to alter schemes , is not to innovate articles : schemes are but dispositions of matter , and may be exceeding various , and often are , even where the matter for the main is the same . but what if the argument were new , and all as new as the method ? would it to a man of conscience , a seeker of light , a lover of truth , go the less in value but for that , if it is good ? it is not antiquity any more than novelty : it is verity only , that ought to be considered by conscience , and indeed that is ; for , as old arguments are not entertained by it , only , because they are old . so new ones are not rejected , only , because they are new . dies diem docet : but i may not so much imitate the weakness of my adversary , as to fall a common placing , and therefore i say no more as to this . thus sir , i have followed my adversary in his prosecution of his two topicks , harmony and novelty , and have considered his reflections ; and now , should very gladly dismiss a subject so unpleasant ; and so little to edification : but that in a charge he makes upon me , both in his epistle to the reader , and in other places , there is another instance of his falshood , malice , and calumny , proper fruits of that distemper ( zeal you must believe it for the abused word of god ) which ( as himself tells you ) did put him out of his temper and warmed him . ) and this i might not omit , he sayes , ( he dares refer himself wholly to his reader , whither i have not with equal absurdity ( for so he modestly expresses it ) first , made abraham the representative of the carnal seed . secondly , included baptism in the 17 th . of genesis . and thirdly , excluded the first grand promise out of genesis . 3. 15 , &c. and he wonders ( for he is given to wondering , ) that i should see a command for infants baptism in genesis 17 th . and not discern a covenant of grace in the third of genesis . for this matter he dares refer himsef to the reader . ) and indeed it is a daring matter . for as to the first , that i should make abraham the representative of the carnal seed ) as he expresses it , simply and absolutely ; so , it is another calumny , and is maliciously said ; for in that very letter in which i do explain my self as to this particular , there ( p. 157. ) my words are these ; ( on the whole , it is not absurd , if duly weighed , to say ( which yet i do not peremptorily say , ) that in that part of the covenant in which abraham is joyned with the seed , he should stand for his natural posterity , as the seed doth for christ mystical . ) and now let the reader judge ; am i not so far from a possitive affirmation of what he says i make , that i say in terms , i do not possitively affirm it ? what i said , is evidently said not by way of position of what i did conceive as certain ; but by way of proposal , of what was yet uncertain to me , but which yet might merit consideration : and more is to be said for it , than happily this disputer can answer . indeed in genesis 17. 10. there , under the term ( ye ) abraham and ishmael and the rest of the family then present are comprehended , and those i take it , did represent and stand for the natural family . as to the second , namely baptism in genesis 17 ; ) i never said in terms that there was any immediate command for baptism in genesis 17. i knew the institution of baptism was long after . i only said , and still say , that an obligation is lay'd in genesis 17. 9. not only upon abraham himself , to keep the covenant , that is , the sign of the covenant , but upon his seed also ; and the apostle says , that this seed is christ , christ mysticall , or the believing gentiles . and is this an absurdity ? what i say , is in the letter of the text ; and what the apostle says , i hope is no absurdity . i take it for granted , because the apostle says it , that the seed is christ. to disprove that , is not to put the absurdity on me , but on the apostle . as for the third , which is concerning the covenant of grace in genesis 3. 15 ) i still affirm , and still believe i may without absurdity , that though by the seed of the woman in that text , our saviour christ be meant , and consequently , that he is predicted there , and was prefigured also in sacrifices ; yet , that nothing there doth pass by way of covenant , or is spoken of christ there by way of promise to adam ; all is by way of denunciation on the serpent . i say , all that is spoken there is spoken but to the serpent , not to adam ; and let him that thinks otherwise , but look into the text and see if it be not . i appeal from unwarie prejudices , unto common sense . but of this , as i have spoken somewhat in my printed letters , from page the 99 th . to page the 106. so i have discoursed more fully ( of it , ) with persons of a greater caracter , and of more integrity and candour , than our present disputer ; wherein , one day , the reader may receive satisfaction . but for my antagonist , he thought , this was a popular point , and that it would affect me , and therefore only he insists upon it , and so often inculcates it ; and is not this malicious ? why had he not argued it out ? as i expected he should , but that 't is much easier to exclaim and calumniate , than to demonstrate and argue . and now i am come ( and very glad i am , that i am come ) to the fourth thing i promised ; and that is , briefly to state again the argument i made , and to shew , how little he is in his reply unto that , who is so great , in callumniating , and in perverting . and the method i will take shall be , first , to lay down the grounds of the argument , and then to form it . the ground i go upon is this , that the covenant established by god with abraham , and with his seed , in genesis 17. 7 , 8 , 9. is the covenant of grace ; or that original grant , and great charter , by which believing gentiles always did , and do claim both heaven and earth , and all the promises they have title to ; as also , that abraham is the person by , from , and vnder whom they claim ; as being his seed . if christ's then abraham's seed , and heir's according to the promise . in this covenant , as in all others that are proper , there is , first , a promise on the one part , and then , secondly , a restipulation on the other : a promise on god's part ; and then a restipulation upon abraham's part , and upon his seed's . as for the promise that god doth make to abraham , and to his seed , it is ( vers. 7 , 8. ) that he will be a god to abraham , and to his seed , and will give to abraham , and to his seed , &c. and this promise made to abraham , in which almighty god doth give himself , and all he hath to him , is called by the apostle the blessing of abraham ; of which he says , that it doth descend on the gentiles , gal. 3. as for the restipulation , which is on the part of abraham , and of his seed , it is ( vers. 9. ) thou shalt keep my covenant therefore thou and thy seed ; in which restipulation , it being the main thing on which i do insist in reference to my argument , i shall ( in order to the making clear whatever any wise relates unto it , and so concerns our present purpose ) particularly consider , first , the nature of the duty in it , thou shalt keep my covenant , and shew what is imported in that expression . secondly , i will shew the propriety of this duty , that it is a duty bound on abraham by this covenant , as his proper duty , in reference to it , and to the blessing in it . thirdly , i will demonstrate , that the subjects in this restipulation and duty , or the persons upon whom the duty and incumbence is bound , are abraham and his seed , and that abraham's seed is , principally , the believing gentiles . as for the nature of the duty , or what is meant by keeping of the covenant . it was , at last , agreed between us ( and i in my argument , fol. 132. 133. abundantly have proved ) that to keep gods covenant , which is the duty injoyned , is to keep the sign of gods covenant ; and it must be granted also , that to keep the sign , is , for him that keeps it , not only to wear that sign himself , but to put it upon all his , in token , that as he himself , so that all he owns , is god's . this i proved in my first letter , from pag. 16. to pag. 23. and confirmed in my advertisement ; to which i add now another consideration to make it further manifest ; namely , that in the covenant , ( and the covenant for substance is but one and the same ) whereas god is pleased to say in genesis , 17. i will be a god to thee and thy seed , and will give to thee and thy seed , &c. and therefore thou and thy seed shall keep my covenant , and to keep his covenant , is to keep the sign of his covenant . i say , whereas he speaks so in genesis , 17. he saith in jer. 31. 17. ( where he repeats the same covenant , ) i will be their god , and they s●all be my people ; what in genesis is expressed by their keeping of the covenant or sign , is in jeremy expressed , by their being gods propriety , or own : so that , these are equivalent terms ; and the keeping of the covenant of god ( or his sign , ) is only to denote the propriety that those who are in covenant with god do all acknowledge , all own that he hath in them , and in all theirs . and thus it was interpr●ted to abraham ; who was not only to be circumcised himself , but to see that all his males , old and young were circumcised ; and in his males , who only were actually circumcised , and only capable of being so , the females also were reputed included . for ( as i said in my former discourse ) as the sign was directly given only to the males , so the promise also in terms , was only to the males , abraham and isaack ; but then , as the females were included in the males in the covenant ( for who will deny that ? ) so , by like reason , they were included also in the sign . it is but reason that concludes the former , and the same reason will conclude the latter . besides , who will say the females were excluded the passover ? were they not of the congregation of the lord , and members of the families , or houses , in which the passover was eaten , and by which ? are they excluded any where ? and is it not plainly intimated both by maimonides and by other rabbins , that even they also did celebrate that feast ; but yet , none uncircumcised might . well then , the duty bound upon abraham , and upon his seed by the covenant , is to keep the covenant or sign , by wearing of it themselves , and by putting of it upon all theirs , in token of gods propriety . the next thing is , to shew that this duty which is bound upon abraham , and upon his seed , by the covenant , is the proper duty of the covenant . and what can be more plain than that it is , seeing , first , it is bound upon them in reference to the promise , as a consequence of it ; i will be a god to thee and thy seed , and i will give to thee and thy seed ; there is the promise : thou shalt keep my covenant therefore , thou and thy seed ; there is the consequent duty . and 't is the only duty mentioned , as required by god by way of restipulation . and indeed , secondly , it is called keeping of the covenant , and therefore , must needs be bound upon them by vertue of the covenant , as the proper duty and incumbence of it . in fine , it is most highly reasonable that it should be so ; for as god in this covenant solemnly , by promise and by oath , doth give himself and all his to abraham , and to his seed ; is it not most fit , most proper , that , by way of correspondence , abraham and his seed should solemnly , ( and that is by some open and external rite , and act , and such an act and rite , signing is , ) give up themselves and theirs again to god ? and here , by the way , it is observable ; that , seeing the command to keep the covenant , is lay'd upon abraham , and upon his seed ; and seeing keeping of the covenant is keeping of the sign of it , in token of god's propriety ; it follows , that putting of the sign on children , and on servants , is not done , at least not principally , by vertue of any title , right , or priviledge which these children , or servants have , by vertue of their own immediate being in the covenant ; but it is done , in consequence of the duty and incumbence under which the parents and masters are , by vertue of the covenant in which they do restipulate , and so , take on them this duty . as for the subjects in the covenant , or those on whom the duty and incumbence in it is bound , which is the third thing to be demonstrated , they are abraham and his seed , or abraham and isaac ; and in isaac , christ mystical , or the believing gentiles , abraham's spiritual seed . and that christ mystical , or christ and believing gentiles are intended principally , by the seed ; i manifested in my first letter , ( p. 24. 25. ) in my second letter ( from p. 128. to 132. ) and in my last letter , from romans 4 th 13 , 16 , 17 ; which text doth put it out of all question , that isaac did not only typifie and figure the believing gentiles in the manner of his birth ( as my adversary would have it only do , ) but that he did also stand for them , and represent them in the covenant of promise . and if isaac represented the believinggentiles , and did stand for them ( as he did ) in the covenant of promise , then certainly whatever duty by virtue of that covenant , was bound upon him , that very duty , by virtue of the same covenant , was also bound upon them ; else , how could he stand for them and represent them in it ! this interpretation of that text is so plain , so evident , that even my adversary in his last letter ( p. 115. ) says , i well expounded romans 4. 13 , 16. 17. ) but what he adds ( viz. ) that i do so to this purpose , namely to prove isaac a type and figure of the believing gentiles in the way and manner of his super-natural birth , to which our regeneration in some sort corresponds . that 's another falshood , another impious fraud , and made on purpose to deceive his party ; that when he cannot answer me , he may yet impose upon them . for that i had no such purpose there as he insinuates , is plain ; for there i prove , that isaac represented the believing gentiles , or spiritual seed , not only in the promise ; but in the duty and obligation also , bound upon the seed by vertue of that promise ; and i appeal unto his own party , or to any man else that is of sence in all the world , that will comparehis letter and mine , if this be not so . this is the ground on which i state my argument , which thus i form. if the believing gentiles are under abraham's covenant , are abraham's seed , and are principally meant in the 17 th . genesis 9 th . then , the believing gentiles are to keep gods covenant : the consequence is evident , the text is plain for it ; thou and thy seed shall keep my covenant . and if to keep god's covenant there , be to keep the sign of his covenant , by wearing of it themselves , and putting it on all theirs , in token of gods propriety ; then if believing gentiles be to keep god's covenant , they are to keep the sign of it , by wearing of it themselves , and putting it on all theirs , in token of gods propriety , and title : ( themselves must be signed , and , all theirs also must be signed . ) now , the believing gentiles are under abraham's covenant , are abraham's seed , and are principally meant and intended in genesis 17.9 . as i have proved ; and to keep gods covenant there , is to keep the sign of god's covenant , by wearing of it themselves , and putting it on all theirs , in token of god's propriety in them , and title to them , as i have also proved before ; and therefore the believing gentiles are to keep god's covenant , god's sign , by wearing it themselves , and putting it on all theirs , in token of gods propriety in them , and title to them ; which sign must be , either baptism , or circumcision , or some other sign . but for the greater elucidation , i will break the argument abroad , into shorter sillogismes . abraham's seed must keep god's covenant ; the believing gentiles are abraham's seed ; therefore the believing gentiles must keep god's covenant . to keep god's covenant is to keep the sign of it ; the believing gentiles must keep god's covenant ; therefore the believing gentiles must keep the sign of it . to keep the sign of god's covenant , is to wear it themselves , and to put it upon all theirs , in token of god's propriety in them , and title to them ; the believing gentiles are to keep the sign of god's covenant ; therefore the believing gentiles are to wear it themselves , and to put it upon all theirs , in token of god's propriety in them , and title to them . abraham's seed must keep the covenant , and to keep the covenant is to keep the sign ; thou shalt keep my covenant therefore thou and thy seed . a sign of the covenant then , there must be in the time of the seed ; else , how shall the seed keep it ? they cannot keep the sign of the covenant , if the covenant have no sign . some sign then the believing gentiles , which are the seed , must keep , by wearing it themselves , and putting it on all theirs ; and if any , let this disputer tell ( as i said ) whither it shall be baptism , or circumcision , or what ; for i need to go no further . only here , as we go along , it may not be unfit , in order to the preventing of further calumny , to observe , that when i speak in reference to a sign , of taking it themselves , and putting it on all theirs , i mean nothing but their being signed themselves , and their seeing that all theirs be also signed ; without considering here , or intending to consider , who is the minister of the sign : but only who is the subject . this is my argument , which in my letter i did lay on four propositions . first , that the covenant or blessing of abraham , which is the promise of the spirit , is that covenant of god , under which believing gentiles , the spiritual seed of abraham , are : and is the blessing that doth descend on the gentiles . secondly , that all the seed of abraham , that hath the benefit and advantage , of the covenant and blessing of abraham , is under equal obligation , to the duty and incumbence of that covenant , of that blessing , as abraham himself . thirdly , that the duty or incumbence arising from the covenant , or blessing made to abraham , is , that , in token of his dedication of himself , and of all his unto god , he should take himself , and should put upon all his , the sign of the covenant : which is the mark and sign of god. fourthly , that from abraham's dedication of himself , and of all his unto god , there ariseth a distinction of holiness , into internal and external , absolute and relative ; and that this distinction is evangelical . from these grounds i drew the former conclusion : and you may take the argument from them briefly , thus. the blessing doth descend upon the believing gentiles , and therefore the proper duty of that blessing doth descend also : and this is the proper duty of that blessing , to see that both themselves , and all theirs be signed , in token of god's propriety : and the believer , that gives himself sincerely , is internally holy : and those that are given by him are externally so . 't is you see in the former four propositions , ( which even my adversary himself doth also acknowledge , pag. 25. ) that the main strength of my argument for infants baptism consists : and yet , it is plain , that , hitherto , there is no need of any criticism , much less of exactness of criticism , and least of all , of exactness of criticism as a part of humane learning : either to conceive , or to make it : but as it is , i pray you let us take a view of his reply unto it ; comparing what i say for infants baptism , with what he answers to that i say . but before we do so , give me leave to tell you , that his way of replying thrusts into my thoughts a story i have read long ago in keckerman , ( and i hope i may be pardoned if i shall tell one story , when he does many ) it is , that a certain respondent being non-plust by his opponent , and unable to conceive any sensible answer to return to him , makes use of two nonsensical , but strong words , to chouse him . if ( says he ) mr. opponent you do take it archepadial●ter , i grant it ; but if reflexive , i deny it : that is , if you take it nonsensicaly one way , i grant it ; if you take it nonsensicaly another way , i deny it : and thus i take it , my respondent deals with me ; and he may be sure , and i believe he knows it , that i have not been the only person who have said so of him , on this occasion . i hope , you will not think i go about to abuse him , it is the very truth i tell you ; for what distinct , what proper sence is there in what he says in answer ? or what application of it can be made to either proposition ? which yet , he would be thought to reply unto ; but , inded doth only elude : for , in answer to the several four forementioned propositions , he speaks thus. in your first proposition , i only allow the spiritual essence of the covenant to descend upon believing gentiles ; but that the additaments and appendages being variable things , and separable from it , do not necessarily descend with it i have elsewhere at large evinced unto you . here he should have told us , what is the essence , what the spiritual essence of the covenant , and what the additaments , and should have applyed it . in your second proposition , i allow that the seed of believing gentiles that have the benefit of abraham's covenant , and to whom it is made , are under an equal obligation unto those proper duties and services now required of them , as abraham was himself ; understanding it of the adult believing off-spring , and not the infants of believing gentiles . my second proposition speaks of the seed of abraham , ( viz. ) the believing gentiles : his answer of their children only . in your third proposition , i allow that the believing gentiles are obliged to dedicate themselves and all that is theirs to god , as abraham was . but in as much as there is a double dedication , the one by baptism , and the other by religious education and fervent supplication , this latter dedication i allow ; the former as it respects our infant seed , for the reasons i have elsewhere given you i deny . i say there , that signing is the proper duty of the covenant ; what is this to that ? in your fourth proposition concerning a twofold holiness , external and internal , absolute and relative , arising from the covenant , though i grant that so it was under the former administration , yet i have elsewhere proved that as for any external or relative holiness then arising from the covenant , it is now abolished . and as i have already also demonstrated that the first of cor. 7. 14. doth not at all prove the continuation thereof in the gospel-day , so neither is there any other scripture that i know of , that can be pertinently alledged , for the justification of such a notion . though i grant that there is an external and internal holyness now arising among gentile professors , the latter from the covenant , the former from a meer pretension to it . you see his demonstrations ( as he calls 'em ) his proofs which should be here , are all elsewhere . but what if they were here ? what in all this is to the business in hand ? for if the promise or blessing of abraham do descend upon his seed , the believing gentiles ; and the proper duty of that promise or blessing ( which descends ) doth also descend ; and to be signed themselves , and to see that all theirs be signed also , in token of gods propriety and title , is that proper duty : then let him talk of spiritual essence that doth descend , and of appendages that do not ; of proper duties and services now required of them , understanding it of adult believing off-spring , and not the infant seed of believing gentiles ; and that the dedication must be by religions education and supplication , not by baptism . i say , let him talk in this fashion as long , as long as he lives : it will certainly follow for all that ; that the proper duty now requir'd of believing gentiles , is to sign themselves , and t o see that all theirs ( their children also ) are signed ; which as i said , must either be with baptism , or with circumcision , or with some other sign ; let him tell which , or what . for mark it , shall the blessing descend , and not the proper duty of that blessing ? is not to keep the covenant , as much a duty bound upon the seed , as the promise , a blessing made to it ? ay! is not thou shalt keep my covenant therefore thou and thy seed , as plainly said , as i will be a god to thee and to thy seed , and will give to th●e and to thy seed ? and if to keep the covenant be , ( as it is agreed to be ) to keep the sign , let him distinguish as he will , ( with spiritual essence , and appendages ; with proper duty now , and then ; with dedication by religious education , and by baptism . that is , with archepodialiter and reflexive : certainly , to keep the sign , is as much the proper duty of the seed , and as much bound upon it , and all as fast , as the promise it self is made unto it : and if the gentiles that believe , are ( as i have proved , and as the apostle says they are ) that seed ; then , to keep the sign , is as much the proper duty of the gentiles , that believe , and as much bound on them , and all as fast , as the promise and blessing there , is made unto them . and this is not only high reason , but god's express will : thou shalt keep my covenant therefore thou and thy seed . it is god's mind , therefore it is to be done : and that this is a proper way of arguing , himself says , pag. 27. you may think it is impossible to speak more plainly , and more closely to any point , than here i have to this ; and that certainly the 17 th of genesis 9 th . is very much to purpose , as to an obligation upon gentile believers or abraham's seed , with reference to the keeping of some sign , and in the last result , to the keeping of baptism ; and happily you will think there needs no more than what is said already , to make it manifest , and beyond dispute . but sir , if these are your thoughts , they are not my adversaries ; he tells me plainly , that if i will find a rule as he spakes ) in genesis 17. or ( as my self do word it , ) if i will find any obligation there upon believing gentiles to keep the sign , in the way i have mentioned ; it will be incumbent on me to prove , first ; my three partys ( as he calls them ) in the covenant there mentioned . secondly , my two signs ; thirdly , that abraham represented the carnall seed only in circumcision , and isaac , the spiritual seed in baptism . ) i know it must exceedingly surprize you , to see me put on three new issues ; especially , seeing in his fifth letter ( p. 71. ) all was fairly and candidly agreed ( for so he speaks , ) to depend on two others , ( viz ) the duty and the subjects ; and seeing also , he might as well have put me upon proving that the pope is antichrist , that the earth is a planet , or that there is a world in the moon , as on proving the points he mentions ; so little they are to the purpose . for , whither three partys are in the covenant , or but two provided abraham's seed be included in one of them , and that seed be believing gentiles : and though but one sign be spoken of determinately and particularly , and no more , and that one be circumcision ; provided genesis 17. 9. be understood of signing generally : and though abraham represented not the carnall seed only in circumcision , nor isaac the believing gentiles at all in baptism , seeing he was never baptised : yet , if isaac represented the believing gentiles in the covenant , namely , in the promise verse the 7 th . and 8 th . and in the obligation and incumbence verse 9 th . though he did not represent them ( as certainly he did not ) in baptism ; ( yet ) it will as clearly follow , that the obligation and incumbence which was bound on isaac verse the 9 th . as he represented the beli●ving gentiles , was , in him , in that verse bound on most fast upon them ; as , that the promise and blessing which in verses 7. 8. was made to him , was in those verses , in him , made and confirmed also unto them ; and if that obligation and incumbence be to keep the covenant , and to keep the covenant be to keep the sign ; they must as surely keep the sign , by vertue of that covenant ; as , by vertue of it , hope for the blessing . the duty is as much bound on the seed , as , the promise is made to it ; thou shalt keep my covenant therefore thou and thy seed . this ( i must tell him again ) is as plainly said as , i will be a god to thee and to thy seed , and give to thee and to thy seed ; and the same seed is under the obligation , that is within the promise . these are not things that are barely said , but are abundantly proved before , and evident in the text. i know he says ( p. 50 ) that as to what concerns the obligation , there is nothing in the whole 17 th of genesis but what relates to abraham and his natural family ony , &c. god only then designing to signifie unto abraham together with his natural seed and family , what was their present duty under the then present administration ) and that god did signifie their present duty under that administration is beyond dispute ; for therefore he instituted circumcision , as that duty . but that in that whole chapter he should signify nothing as duty and incumbence , but with reference only unto abraham and to his natural seed and family , can no more be said , than that he signified nothing there as a blessing promise and priviledge , but unto abraham and to his natural seed and family , only . for , the same persons , plainly , are in the duty and incumbence , that are in the blessing an d promise , i will be a god to thee and to thy seed ; i will give to thee and to thy seed ; and therefore thou and thy seed shall keep my covenant . and who shall be believed ? the apostle that said , that that seed is christ , christ mysticall ; or this disputer that saith , no seed is meant there , but the natural seed and family . but shall the seed indeed be within the promise and blessing , and not under the duty and obligation ? when yet the same covenant , and god in the same continued speech , and to the same persons under the same denomination , ( viz. abraham and his seed ) doth both bind on the duty and make the promise : who , but such a tender man as this is will dare to say , that one must still abide , and the other be lay'd aside ; that we may take the blessing but leave the duty ? certainly they that will not look to the old testament , for new testament dutys , must not look to the old testament , for new testament priviledges . we must not claim by the old testament promise and blessing , if we will not be under the proper duty and service , of that promise and blessing . but to return to his three points , of which he says , it is incumbent upon me to prove them , if i will find believing gentiles any wise concerned in the 17 tth . of genesis , with reference to signing ; the first is , my three partys ; the second my two signs ; the third , abraham's standing for the carnal seed in circumcision , and isaac's for the spiritual in baptism . ) to the first , that the covenant is tripartite ; though still i say as i have said already , that , as to my argument , i need not stand thereon ; yet , it is evident enough , from what i urged in my last letter , ( p. 155. 156. ) to which i expect a distinct answer . and indeed , the three partys are distinctly noted , and are god , abraham and abraham's seed ; for first , the covenant is made between god , and abraham , singly and separately , in his own person , genesis 17. 2 , 4 , 5 , 6. but then , in verses 7 , 8 , 9. abraham's seed is taken in as well as abraham's self ; and so , the the covenant , which , had it been only between god and abraham , would have been but bipartite ; now , another party being taken in or added , namely , abraham's seed ; becomes tripartite . to this , his answer is in the sixth letter , in which he glorys as unanswered ; and there he says , ( p. 121. ) that there was a covenant between god the father and christ , and after that a covenant taking in all his seed , called the covenant of grace , and ( says he ) doth that make it tripartite ? are not christ and believers considered as one party ? ) you see how theologically and how divine-like he speaks ( if this be he that speaks and not some supervisor ) as if the covenant of redemption , which yet ( to note it by the by ) is never called , in express terms , a covenant , in all the scripture ; as if that covenant were the same ( covenant ) with the covenant of grace , and that what passed between god the father and the son before the worlds were , was the very same with what passed between god and abraham and his seed , in time . the covenant of redemption indeed was bipartite , it was between god and christ only : but the covenant of grace is tripartite , between god , abraham , and abraham's seed or christ , for isaac the seed , is christ. in the covenant of redemption are but two named , but in this covenant of grace are three partys . but on this , as being a logomachy and strife about words , i do not much insist . the second point to be proved , is , ( he says ) my two signs . and that baptism and circumcision are two signs , is not hard to be proved ; but doubtless , that is not his meaning ; he hath the confidence to say , that i do make two signs , not only under the two administrations , but two determinate particular signs in genesis 17. namely , baptism in the 9 th verse , which says , ( but falsly , ) i call the sign ; and circumcision in the 10 th for saith he ( p. 80. ) thus runs your own paraphrase upon the words ; therefore thou abraham and thy seed isaac in the letter and spirit , shall keep the sign of my covenant , that is , both he and they , and thou also must be baptised . ( p. 114 ) he says ; but say you though isaac was circumcised , and ishmael too , yet there are two signs in that text circumcision and baptism . ) and ( p. 115. ) he says , but that there is any such sign as baptism in genesis 17 th . and that isaac was signed by it as a type or figure of the gentile believers ( as you now seem to affirm , and your paraphrase imports ) i deny &c. ) you sir , who have perused my letters , know very well how false and how imposturous an imputation this is ; and bad is that cause , which cannot be upheld but with impostures , lyes , and forgeries . but ( for the rectifying of others , who happily have not seen those letters , and who , otherwise , may be too credulous to this inventor , ) i must say , i was so far from affirming any thing of any tendency to what he impudently fastens upon me in the former passages , that i never once thought it ; i only affirmed , that isaac ( abraham's seed ) did represent and stand for believing gentiles in the covenant , both as to the promise and blessing given to them and to the duty and incumbence put upon them ; this i did say , and but this ; and this , let him confute it if he can . nor did i ever say , that there were two determinate and particular signs , namely , circumcision and baptism , either instituted , or immediately intended in the seventeenth of genesis ; i said , that in the seventeenth of genesis , there was a double obligation , namely , first , a more general one , verse the ninth , imposed upon abraham and upon his seed , ( viz. ) isaac in the spirit principally ; and that was in general terms to keep the covenant ; and to keep the covenant , is to keep the sign of the covenant , which i said , must be understood generally , for keeping the covenant in the sign of it , whatever the sign at any time be : and not particularly and determinately , for keeping of it immediately in circumcision or in baptism , or in any other particular sign . secondly , the particular obligation is in verse the tenth , and this is laid upon abraham and his natural family , but not , in terms , upon abraham's seed : and it is an obligation unto circumcision : this being the particular sign of the covenant for that administration of it . but to this he tells me , ( pag. 58. ) you tax me ( and i believe by this , you see that i had reason to tax him ) for a bold abuse in saying , that you intimate that baptism is immediately intended in the ninth verse of genesis , seventeenth . mark your own word , not instituted , but intended : whence i argue , if baptism be neither there instituted nor intended , if it be not in the letter , nor intention of that text , it is not there at all. here this wyre-drawing man , instead of giving satisfaction to my first taxation ( as he calls it ) shamelesly incurs a second ; for his perversion of my words , in what he says , is so notorious , that truly it was for pitties sake i passed it over in my last letter , without a reply ; and yet he tryumphs in it , that this was never answered . i said , and do say , that baptism is not immediately intended in the seventeenth of genesis , ninth , and that the sense of that verse is general and indeterminate ; whereas , if baptism , or circumcision either , were immediately intended , it must have been determinate and particular , not speaking ( as it doth ) of signing in general , but of signing with this or that particular sign , which it doth not immediately . but i pray you sir , observe here his extraordinary skill in making of arguments , for thus he forms his : if baptism be neither instituted nor intended in the text , ( he should have said immediately intended , for so i did : ) and again , if baptism be neither in the letter nor in the intention ( for so he varies again , to tenter it unto his purpose , for i never said so . ) what then ? then it is not at all there ; well concluded : if it be not at all there , it is not at all there . i said , it is not immediately intended ; this he reports ; ( if it be not in the letter nor in the intention , ) and that you will say , is very wisely said of him ; as if the letter and the intention were opposites , and that that were not in the letter of a text , which is intended in it ; nor that intended in a text , which is in the letter of it ; whereas all other men , but he , do think that that is intended in a text , which is the sense of it ; and that to be intended is no more than to be meant . and may not that be mediately , i do not say remotely , as he doth , to make a quibble upon it ( ay , remotely enough ) may not that be mediately meant and intended , which is not so immediately ? and that secondarily , which is not so primarily ? yes , doubtless . and so all particular instances are intended and meant in general propositions ; not immediately and primarily , for so the sense is only general , else the proposition were not so ; but secondarily and mediately . and thus baptism may be intended in the seventeenth of genesis ninth , thou shalt keep my covenant , my sign , thou and thy seed : not immediately , for so the sence is but general and indeterminate , god not having yet discovered in what particular sign or covenant , either abraham , or his seed should keep it ; but it may be mediately intended , as it is a particular sign of the covenant . i do not say , that the sign of the covenant must be kept generally and indeterminately ; but i say , that those words verse the ninth . thou shalt keep my covenant ( or my sign ) therefore , thou and thy seed . ) must be understood generally , and indeterminately . but though the sense be general and indeterminate in the ninth verse , both as to abraham and to his seed , yet in the tenth it is determined , as to abraham and to his natural family ; though not as to his spiritual seed . and if determined but in the tenth , it was not yet determined in the ninth . i thought once to have said no more upon this particular , than what i had before ; my meaning and intention in it being so perspicuous , to prudent and understanding readers ; and his absurdity and grosness in opposing it , so plain and manifest . but the opinion of the many , with whom the last word is always a sufficient answer , hath made it necessary that i should say more . and therefore , once for all , to put my meaning out of doubt ( if it can be yet in any , ) i will here a little further illustrate it . and to this purpose ; it having pleased god to say in the 17 th . of genesis , 9. thou shalt keep my covenant therefore , thou and thy seed ; understanding , by keeping the covenant a keeping the sign ; let us suppose he should have added , in the tenth verse ; circumcision is the covenant or sign which thou abraham shalt keep , and baptism the conant or sign thy seed shall keep . would it not in this case , be very evident that keeping of the covenant or sign in the ninth verse , must be understood but generally , and indeterminately , not , as yet for a keeping either of circumcision , or of baptism in particular , but generally keeping gods sign be it what it will , when he shall please to institute it . now as god hath said , thu shalt keep my covenant therefore , thou and thy seed in the ninth verse , so he hath said partitively , this is the covenant that thou shalt keep , for so the seventy render it ; or , that you shall keep , ( distinguishing you from thy seed ) for so the hebrew . but though he say what covenant , or sign it was that abraham himself and his present family should keep , he leaves unsaid , as not proper yet to say , what sign or covenant the spiritual seed of abraham should keep ; for that seed being yet un-born , it was but reason that the covenant or sign it was to keep , should not yet be instituted . ishmael was at the institution of circumcision , isaac was not there . ishmael that stood for the natural family , he was there ; isaac that stood for the spiritual family , was then vn-born ; and this timing of the institution , of circumcision , as inoted before , should be insisted upon ; it signifies much . but , in regard my adversary will be apt to tell me , that the case i put is but supposition , and one may suppose any thing ; i shall therefore take the text as it lyes , and only ask him two or three questions , to which i do expect direct and categoricall answers . the first is , whither circumcision were actually instituted in the 9 th . verse ? for if it was not , ( as indeed it was not , for it was not instituted but in the 10 th . ) then certainly to keep the covenant in verse 9. could not be determinately to keep circumcision . i ask him again , if this proposition , circumcision is gods covenant , or gods sign , be an identick proposition , and do signify no more , than that circumcision is circumcision ? for if he say it signifies more ( as i should think he will , ) then the term covenant or sign , in it , must signify generally and largely . in fine , i would ask him if when it pleased god to say , this is my covenant which you shall keep , every man child among you shall be circumcised , he then said no more than what he had before in verse the 9 th . thou shalt keep my covenant therefore , thou and thy seed ? for if god do say no more , or no other in verse 10. than he had said before in verse 9. then he saith but the same again ; but if he do say other , or more , ( as undoubtedly he does , for now and not before , he tells what the covenant is , ) then keeping of the covenant verse the 9 th . must be understood but generally ; as certainly it must , and i have evincedit must ; in some measure in my first letter ( p. 25 , 26 , 27. ) but more expressly , in my second ; from ( p. 85. to 91. ) and most fully in my last , from ( p. 150. to 154. ) in these places you will see the vanity of his boast ( p. 62. ) ( viz. ) that the sence cannot be general and indeterminate , for a general indeterminate sence is no sence . ) thus , general and appellative expressions are nonsensicall to this man , and ( owe no man any thing but to love one another , ) at this rate , shall signifie nothing ; ( as indeed , it seemeth not to signifie much with him ; because it is not said owe not james , peter , john , or paul , but ( owe no man , ) nothing but love. and so much for his two signs ; ) a fiction of his own , which he would fasten on me ; whereas i never spoke , or thought of two particular signs , as actually instituted in the 17 th . of genesis , but only of signing generally , spoken of verse 9. and of a particular sign instituted in verse the 10 th ; thus i spoke , and still speak ; which no more doth signifie two signs , than when one shall say , ( god made man a reasonable creature , and peter is a man , ) he speaks of two men ; of one in the former proposition , and of another in the latter . as to the third point which he would put me upon , which is to prove , that abraham represented the carnal seed only in circumcision , and isaac the spiritual seed in baptism ) i have spoken abundantly what my sense is , as to the former , already : and , as to the latter , i have also already shewed it a calumny as to the implication that isaac was baptised , and in baptism was a type . but though he was not a representative or figure of the spiritual seed of abraham , the believing gentiles , in baptism ; seeing he never was baptised ; yet that he was a representative of them in the covenant of promise , and that as well in the duty and obligation , as in the priviledge and blessing of it , is , i think , by this , beyond all dispute . but of all this i have said enough before ; isaac was not a representative of the believing gentiles in baptism , but in the covenant . as to the 1 cor 7. 14. from which i prove there is an external relative holiness under the gospel , as well as an internal and absolute ; he roundly tells his reader ( p. 24. ( for he never told me so before ; ) that as he hath already demonstrated , it doth not at all prove the continuation of any external or relative holiness arising from the covenant . ) but sir , you must not be too easy in believing of him as to demonstration , for i assure you , after what i answered in my first letter , ( from p. 33. to 49. ) which once you thought beyond exception , and , i hope , still do , i never received the least reply in any of his letters as to that ; and therefore , what he speaks ( p. 24. ) of demonstration here , it is as what he says of it in many other places , and with reference to many other particulars ( viz. ) but a vision of his too much heated fancy , and a popular charm . the world must know that he hath done great things some where , but he cannot tell where himself . not that i would have you think too confidently , that here he is catcht ; for though he have affirmed , as you may see he hath , that he has already demonstrated , when indeed he has not ; you must not presently believe he cannot make it out : for this , as difficult as you or i would think it ; it is an easie atchivement to a man of his performance . he that can find a sign in genesis 17. 9 , as implyed in the sence , ( for so he speaks p. 105. ) when yet himself says , the text mentions no sign at all or gives the least hint of any ; he i say that can affirm , the text mentions no sign at all , nor gives the least hint of any , and yet can interpret what he sayes , ( as he does , ) that there is no such term , or a syllable of that sound in the text ; that is he that can say a thing is in the sence of the text , that is neither mentioned , nor hinted in the least , in the terms of it ; he may say what he will ; you must not think to hold him ; if you think you have him fast in the very terms , he will give you the slip by a syllable of the sound ; and salve his contradictions with nonsense . to be mentioned and hinted , which ( with all others ) is , to be express'd and imply'd in a text ; by this interpreter , shall be understood of sounds , and not of senses , ay , though it be said , no mention nor hint of any sign ; and he that says ( any sign ) cannot be understood to mean the sound ( sign . ) the mention of the 1 cor. 7. 14 ; reminds me of his amazement , ( p. 128. ) for he is often amazed ; amazed much he was , at my exposition of genesis 17. 9. 10. and now again amazed almost as much , at my interpretation of rom. 4. in my argument ( from p. 166. to 168. ) and indeed , nothing but a mazement can excuse his great mistakes ; as , that i should say the reward to abraham was personal and earthly , and was of canaan only ; and that my expressions have a sound that is harsh and dissonant to rom. 4. and 4. ) my design in touching on this text , was only to evince that abraham's receiving circumcision as a seal of the righteousness by faith ( which he had urged , was nothing contradictory to what i said concerning his standing with ishmael , and the rest of the family gen. 17. 10. in the business of circumcision ; how that they stood for and represented there the whole natural houshold . that canaan was the reward of abraham's faith , who but such a sophister , dares soberly to deny it ? the text is plain for it . genesis 15. 17. but that heaven also was not his reward , i did not say ; no more then the text doth , which though in the letter it doth but mention canaan , yet surely , it did not exclude heaven . and as for the danger , and dissonancy in my expressions to romans 4. 4. i ask him ; was not the reward given to abraham , for his believing ? how else was it that his faith was accounted unto him for righteousness ? for though the reward was infinitely much superior to any desert of his faith , and was a thing that god in justice , was no ways oblig'd to make ; yet a reward it was , and a reward ( in the very idea and notion of it ) is of and for something : a reward it was , but a reward of grace , not of debt ; god gave it as a gratuity , for what abraham did ; but abraham could not have demanded it as his due , or a debt . after this he tells me ( p. 129. ) that all that follows to the close ( namely , in my last letter from p. 169. to the end . ) is but strife about words ; in which he finds not any thing but what doth nauseate . ) but you sir , will find a vindication in it of that ( but ) incerted in my paraphrase ; and also a demonstration in it that ( ye ) in genesis 17. 10. even from his own concessions , cannot be understood of abraham and that his seed which is in verse the 9 th . but must be meant of abraham ishmael , and the rest of the then present family ; and consequently , that circumcision was not then enjoyned on the seed as it stands in the 9 th verse , for the believing gentiles ; but only on the natural family ; which was the main thing to be proved . i do not know i have omitted any thing of moment , ( for his scoffs , jears , gibes , &c. are of none ) among his reflections : no , nor any thing in his last letter , that is to the purpose ; except a sophister will think i should consider his logick ( p. 120. ) and , because stierius and sanderson , and indeed other logicians , generally , do say , ( and he must be a very mean one that doth not know so much , ) that members of a division must be opposite ; meaning not properly , that they must be enemies ; but that they must not interfere and be coincident ; that therefore , it must be concluded , that all distinction is opposition ; that disparates are opposites ; and that god , abraham , and his seed , cou'd not be distinct partys , if they were not opposites , and even enemies to one another . but if any think so , i leave him to the care of this apothecary , and to hellebore . you may be pleas'd to see what i have said in my argument ( p. 153 , &c. ) as to this. upon the whole , sir , you cannot but observe how little reason there is to trust my adversary in citations and how much cause i have to make you and all his readers this request , that you never believe that i affirm , or deny any thing which he , hereafter , though with never so much confidence shall report i do , unless you first consult my own writings , and see it there : and i would also desire of him , that seeing he is so much given to mistake my meaning , he would never report my sence , but in mine own terms ; and that is but a fair request . in fine , i am not much afflicted that my adversary gave me this occasion of writing again on this subject . i know that truth , like silver , will appear the brighter for being burnished . the more he presses this controversy , the more the subject of it will come in discourse ; and discourse , in time , will ripen and mellow notions in the minds of men , which at first , seem hard and harsh . nor will his pious frauds , his rayling upon arguments instead of answering of them , his unsober reflecting on his adversary instead of arguing with him ; his base hints ; or his direct scurrillitics , which even now dis-serve his cause with wise and good-men , uphold it long with any . these are mean , unmanly , and unchristian methods , and ( let him note it ) never used but in extremity , and when a case is deplor'd ; which his being , i hold it time to end this trouble from sir , your faithfull friend and servant . r. b bowdon . july 4. 1684 books printed for , and sold by tho. simmons at the prince's arms in ludgate-street . the history of the old testament methodized , according to the order and series of time wherein the several things therein mentioned were transacted . in which the difficult phrases are paraphrased , the seeming contradictions reconciled , the rites and customs of the jews , opened and explained : to which is annexed , a short history of the jewish affairs , from the end of the old testament , to the birth of our saviour ; and a map also added of canaan and the adjacent countries , very useful for the understanding of the whole history , by s. cradock , b.d. fol. the lives of sundry eminent persons in this latter age , in two parts . first , of divines , ( viz. ) mr. hugh broughton : mr. r. boid : dr. twist : mr. tho. wilson : dr. sam. bolton , mr. richard vines , mr. richard blacherhy , mr. ralph robinson , mr. john janeway , mr. john machia , dr. sam. winter , mr. thomas tregas , mr. rich. mathew , mr. john allein , dr. staunton , mr. samuel fairclough , mr. thomas wadsworth , mr. o. stochton , mr. t. gouge . to which are added , some remarkable passages in the lives and deaths of divers eminent divines in the church of scotland : ( viz. ) mr. john scringer , mr. robert blair , mr , and. stewart , mr. john weleb , mr. hugh kennedy , mr. robert brute , mr. davidson , and mr. patrick simpson : together with an account of several providences strange and extraordinary . secondly , of nobility and gentry of both sexes , ( viz. ) mr. philip sidney , sir charles coot , mr. john lamot , sir nath. barnadiston , mr. john rowe , sir matthew hale , mrs. mary hunter , lady alice lucy , lady mary vere , mrs. kath. clark , countess of warwick , mrs. margaret baxter , lady armine , lady langham , and countess of suffolk . by s. clark sometime pastor of bennet finek , london : to which is added , the life of the author . fol. the new testament of our lord and saviour jesus christ , with annotations , containing first , an interpretation of all difficult phrases and words . secondly , parallel scriptures , both as to matter and words , to which is annexed the harmony of the gospels . by samuel clark , i. f. 4 to . church history of the government of bishops and their councils abreviated , including the chief part of the government of christian princes and popes , and a true account of the most troubling controversies and heresies till the reformation . by richard baxter , a hater of false history . in 4 to . a treatise of episcopacy , confuting by scriptur-reasons , and the churches testimony , that sort of diocesian churches , prelacy and government , which casteth out the primitive church species , episcopacy , ministry and discipline , and confound the christian world by corruption , usurpation , schism and persecution : meditated in the year 1640. when the &c. oath was imposed , written 1671. and lastly published 1680. by the importunity of our superiors , who demand the reasons of our non-conformity . by rich. baxter , in 4 to . forgetfulness of god the great plague of mans heart , and consideration of the principal means to cure it . by w. d. m.a. once fellow of king's colledge cambridge , in octavo . londinum triumphans : or , an historical account of the grand influence the actions of the city of london haue had upon the affairs of the nation , for many ages past , shewing the antiquity , honour , glory , and renown of this famous city , the grounds of the rights priviledges and franchises , the foundation of the charter , the improbability of its forfeiture or seisure , the power and strength of the citizens , and the several contests that have been betwixt the magistracy and commonalty , collected from the most authentick authors , and illustrated with variety of remarks , worthy of the perusal of every citizen . by w. gouge . gent. 8● . the samaritan shewing that many unnecessary impositions are not the oyle that must heal the church , together with the way or means to do it , by a country gent. who goes to common prayer and not to meetings in octavo . the plea for children of believing parents , for their interest in abraham's covenant , their right to church-man ship with their parents , and consequently their title to baptism . the cause of publishing this discourse after so many learned men have laboured in this province is declared in the preface to the reader by giles freeman in octavo . peaceable resolution of crioscience touching our present imposition , wherein loyalty and obedience are proposed and setled upon their true foundation in scripture reason , and the constitution of this kingdom against all resistance of the present power , and for compliance with the laws so far as may be in order to union with a draught in specimen of a bill for accomodation , in octavo . moral prognostications , ( 1 ) what shall befall the church on earth till their concord , by the restitution of their primitive purity , simplicity , charity . ( 2. ) how that restitution is like to be made ( if ever ) and what shall besall them henceforth unto the end , in the golden age of love , written by richard baxten , when by the king's commission , we in vain treated for concord , 1661. and now publisht in 1680. finis . the infants advocate against the cruel doctrine of those presbyterians who hold, that the greatest part of dying infants shall be damned : in answer to a book of mr. giles firmin's entituled, scripture warrant, &c. / by tho. grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. 1688 approx. 83 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 17 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2008-09 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a41781 wing g1538 estc r43209 27021099 ocm 27021099 109913 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a41781) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 109913) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1718:16) the infants advocate against the cruel doctrine of those presbyterians who hold, that the greatest part of dying infants shall be damned : in answer to a book of mr. giles firmin's entituled, scripture warrant, &c. / by tho. grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. 32 p. printed by j.d. for the author, london : 1688. imperfect: stained, print show-through, and slight loss of text. reproduction of original in bodleian library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng firmin, giles, 1614-1697. -scripture-warrant sufficient proof. infant baptism -controversial literature. 2007-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-11 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2008-01 emma (leeson) huber sampled and proofread 2008-01 emma (leeson) huber text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the infants advocate , against the cruel doctrine of those presbyterians , who hold , that the greatest part of dying infants shall be damned . in answer to a book of mr. giles firmin's , entituled , scripture warrant , &c. by tho. grantham . exod. 32. 32 , 33. yet now , if thou wilt , forgive their sin ; and if not , blot me , i pray thee , out of thy book which thou hast written . and the lord said unto moses , whosoever hath sinned against me , him will i blot out of my book . matth. 18. 10 , 11 , 14. take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones ; for i say unto you , that in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my father which is in heaven . for the son of man came to seek , and to save that which is lost — even so it is not the will of your father which is in heaven , that one of these little ones should perish . london , printed by j. d. for the author . 1688. the preface . honest reader ; i could not have thought that a man reputed wise , an old professor , and one who so bears himself upon his father's covenant ( whom he will have to be a son of abraham , and so himself to be abraham's son also ) could have given such evident proof of the contrary , as by his book he has brought forth . sure i am , i answered his two questions in much love and faithfulness , according to my ability , being thereunto desired by some of his neighbours : and i hope no impartial reader will censure me to be a scoffer , as mr. firmin does : but truly i think he was pleased to throw that dirt , that he might have some pretence to give scope to his ill spirit , to exercise it self that way . i confess i use these words upon the occasion of his talking so high of his father's covenant [ that it would even make a well man sick , to see what pitiful work he makes of it . ] and here i will give thee an account of it , and then judg of me as thou pleasest . saith mr. f. when i could not tell where to lay hold ( meaning in his dismal temptations ) my parental covenant and infant baptism was a support to me . so that i bless god , 1. for abraham ' s covenant . 2. i bless god that i had godly parents . 3. i bless god my parents were no anabaptists , &c. only a word , some may think you had godly parents , mine were not so : it may be i had a godly grandfather , or a mother ; had you so ? no doubt but you may improve the covenant from him . the second commandment will help you — others may say , baptized i am , but my parents bad enough . well , art awake ? and art in earnest for christ and the saving blessings come by him ? you may improve your covenant . a woman putting a question , how she might know whether ever she had these qualifications ? mr. f. tells us , that whilst he was troubled about making out these qualifications , there comes a motion into my mind , ( saith he ) what say you to your father's covenant ? you know your parents were godly — will you stand to your father's covenant ? here my qualification was the choice of my father's god , who was mine before by an external covenant : but now to have him my god , my portion by an internal covenant , and efficacy , here i was pent up . will you chuse or refuse him ? &c. now whether this discourse will not almost make a well man sick ( i mean a serious christian troubled ) to hear a wise man talk at this rate ? and whether he does not lay his foundation upon his qualification ? for by that , saith he , was the choice of my father's god. and does he not also set up his will as high as ever any did , in chusing or refusing god to be his god , his portion by internal covenant and efficacy ? sure he doth . mr. f's great business is to abuse and disgrace me , by false and foolish stories , which have been told him by others , which i pass by as unworthy observation . and then he falls in with the papists against me , in the case of abstaining from , or eating blood , justifying himself and them in the latter . tho he confesses the believing gentiles were forbidden to eat blood by that decree , act. 15. 29. and when these decrees were repealed ; he cannot tell ; and whilst he makes us for observing them , such as do not believe the blood of christ to be our atonement ; and that we hold some things to be unclean of themselves ; he condemns also the primitive christians , who religiously abstain'd from blood for several hundred years after christ , and makes himself wiser than the apostles ; for had they known such to be the consequence , they would not have made them , nor have deliver'd them to be kept as they did , acts 16. 4. we know that that which goes into the man defiles not , and therefore blood defiles not , but acting against god's word defiled evah , even by eating that which was good for food ; and so may mr. f. defile himself , for he says he will eat blood puddings , s. a. by which he means , sir anabaptist : and indeed a scornful spirit breaths in many pages of his late books . he is pleased to throw dirt upon me very freely , about an escape of the pen or press , i am not sure which , and yet he being a scholar , and acquainted with such over-sights , could not but discern , unless malice blinded him , that it was an oversight . the passage is about the time when transubstantiation came into the world , and the book which he quarels has it thus : how rigidly do they impose the decrees of the trent-councils : where note , the word councils being plural , he might easily have supposed lateran , which was wanting ; for thus it stands in the catechism of the papists ( of which i give notice pag. 55. ) the lateran and trent councils , and from thence i took the date of transubstantiation . not but that i have read the same in other authors . but here he brands me with gross ignorance , and i grant i am not so well read as himself , if that will please him . and my rejoycing is this , that in simplicity and godly sincerity i wrote that book which he despises ; and i hope god will bless my endeavours , in which i trust , i have no other scope but his glory and the good of all men ; heartily desiring that all truth were restored to its primitive purity and simplicity . as to his three first chapters , i shall say little to them at present , being very well satisfied with my answers to his two questions , notwithstanding all that he has said to render them invalid . the chief thing which i design in this reply is , to maintain ( what in me is ) the mercy of god to all dying infants , against mr. f. and others , whose cruel doctrine sends them by millions to hellish torments , as appears by this book of mr. firmin's , p. 8. if all dying infants shall be saved ; there will be millions in heaven ( saith he ) in whom the spirit of god — had nothing to do in their salvation . i say , to maintain the salvation of all dying infants against those who would thus damn them , is especially my present undertaking . and if mr. f. be disposed to urge me further , it is a subject i am willing to debate with him , when and how he pleases , so that we may discourse in love ▪ as becomes christians . and as to the questions about sacred baptism , that work may perhaps be undertaken in a particular treatise by it self . in the mean time , let it be considered , that it has been granted both by papists and protestants , ( and those of the more learned sort too ) that there is no scripture for infant-baptism . that the scripture shews us no other way of baptizing , but by dipping . yea , i lately asked a * doctor of the church of england very seriously , whether he held infant-baptism to be of divine institution ? who very freely gave me this answer , no truly , i only look upon it as a church-rite . but then , whether the church have such power , as to make rites and ceremonies in religion , and particularly thus to alter the subject and manner of baptism , as has confessedly been done by the church of rome , and in part by the church of england , is the business for this present age to take into their most serious consideration . t. g. the infants advocate , against the cruel doctrine of those presbyterians , who hold , that the greatest part of dying infants are damned . division 1. mr giles firmin was pleased to print two questions , and desires those , whom he calls anabaptists , to answer them ; and at the request of some of his neighbours , i wrote a brief , and i hope , a modest answer to them , not for contention , but for satisfaction to such as desire to know the truth in the matters thereby put to the question by mr. f. who finds himself aggrieved , tho nothing is done but what he desired ; that is , his questions answered : and tho he says they are not , yet that shall not provoke me to say much to him concerning them . but seeing by this occasion we are unavoidably fallen upon the business of infants-salvation ; whether god almighty ordained baptism , or any other rite to be necessary to their salvation ? or , whether the greatest , or any part of dying infants shall be damned in hellish torments ? a question of great weight and importance ; i find my self concern'd to proceed in opposing that cruel doctrine , which would send millions of dying infants to hell torments . it was the judgment of austin , and many others , that unless infants were baptized , and received the lord's supper , they could not be saved : and mr. firmin seems to be of the same mind with respect to their baptism : and moreover , he holds that infants must have faith and repentance , as necessary to their salvation , or they must all perish . i will set down his own words . in pag. 90. of his plea , he speaks thus : to return to infants , they must be regenerate , and have faith some way , else they must perish . and in his book entituled , scripture warrant , &c. he speaks thus , pag. 76. they who are regenerate , have faith and repentance . but all infants saved , are regenerated : therefore all infants saved , have faith and repentance . and in pag. 21. he counts it an error in me for supposing , if isaac had died before he was eight days old , he might have been saved . so ( saith he ) this covenant ( meaning the covenant of circumcision ) might have been spared . and in pag. 40. the same ( saith he ) i may say for baptism , being christ's own institution , this is the hand of the spirit accompanying it , when and where he pleaseth , shall be the means to convey spiritual blessings to the hearts of some infants , and prove to them the washing of regeneration . so that , i think , i have done him no wrong in the account i have given of his opinion . to all which i answer . to intermit a little the business of infants faith and repentance , we will consider what he says of circumcision and baptism . he tells us , pag. 39. that he cannot conceive how it can consist with the wisdom , holiness , and goodness of god , to institute an ordinance in his church , for spiritual and saving ends , and strictly to command this ordinance to be administred to such subjects as children of eight days old — and he himself not work with his own institution , when and where he pleases , to the good and benefit of that subject to whom it is administred , this subject having need of the spiritual good , signified and sealed thereby . it doth implicitly charge the institution with vanity . to which i reply . 1. considering what mr. f. says of isaac dying before the eighth day , ( which i noted before ) his sense is this ; that from the time that circumcision was instituted , it makes that covenant of circumcision a vanity , to think any of abraham's seed ( tho but infants of eight days old ) could be saved if not circumcised : and then , i pray , what is like to become of all the world beside , who had no interest in the covenant of circumcision ? must they not all perish ? we shall hear more of that anon . 2. and besides this , tho he makes circumcision thus necessary to the salvation of infants , yet he does not believe that all infants that were circumcised were saved ; for these words of his [ when and where he pleases ] carry this sense in a presbyterian breast , that tho circumcision did by express order belong to all the males of abraham's seed , being eight days old , yet perhaps but few of many of them should be saved : which i evidently shewed in my answers to mr. f's question , and to mr. petto . now here i do profess to believe , that almighty god did not thus ordain circumcision to be absolutely necessary ; because they , to wit , infants , can neither understand his will herein , nor desire it , neither hinder it ; it wholly depends on others to do it for them , and why then they should perish if it be not done , no reason can be shewed : but that which is the hardest thing of all , is , that if isaac had died before the eighth day , he should not be saved , when yet it was not lawful to circumcise him . what is this ? does god damn infants for dying before they be eight days old ? or for not having that done to them which by god's law ought not to be done before the eighth day ? this is the cruelst doctrine that can be . and i will shew how contrary it is to the doctrine of learned protestants . one saith thus upon gen. 17. 14. it is no good reading to say the uncircumcised man-child , but [ zachar ] the male , &c. shall be cut off ; for the infant of eight days old , mentioned ver . 12. is of purpose omitted here . hence then it is inferred , that there was no such absolute necessity of circumcision , that children wanting it should be damned . again , this place cannot be understood of infants that are uncircumcised , 1. that addition , the eighth day , is used only by the septuagint , it is not in the hebrew . 2. the words are , qui non circumciderit , he which shall not circumcise . so readeth the original , the chaldee paraphrast , junius , &c. which sheweth that it must be understood of them that are adulti , and not of infants — . if infants be not circumcised it is the parents fault — as may appear in the example of moses , whom the lord punished , and not the child for neglecting it . 3. concerning baptism , i do believe it to be a very solemn ordinance , and also very useful in the church of god ; yet i do not find that it is the hand of the spirit to convey grace to the heart of any infant , seeing what it conveys , it doth it by faith and by its figure ; representing the death , burial , and resurrection of christ , and ours with him , &c. of all which infants know nothing , being sprinkled , as i formerly shewed , very often when they are fast asleep ; and if awake , they know nothing of the mystery of baptism . but mr. f. brought three scriptures to prove his doctrine , we shall now consider them ; ephes . 5. 26. christ loved his church , and gave himself for it ; that he might sanctify and cleanse it by the washing of water , through the word . i allow baptismal water to be here meant ; but then we see it does not cleanse but by or through the word , nor doth the word profit unless it be mixed with faith in them that hear it ; heb. 4. 1 , 2. the church is purified in obeying the truth through the spirit ; 1 pet. 1. 22. and baptism saves us , as it is the answer of a good conscience towards god , by the resurrection of christ . and to this agree his other two scriptures , tit. 3. 11. 1 pet. 3. 21. now infants being uncapable of being cleansed by baptism according to the sense of these scriptures , we may in no wise apply them to infant-baptism . divis . 2. and because it may be most convenient to treat of regeneration in this place , we will here consider mr. f's arguments to prove that infants have faith and repentance . his first argument is as followeth . arg. 1. if all , even adult persons , are passive in the work of regeneration , then infants are capable of regeneration . but the antecedent is true . answ . 1. here we are told that grown persons are passive ( that is , they do nothing at all ) in the work of regeneration ; this is the meaning of his antecedent . now if this be true , as he says it is , then if they do nothing , they neither hear the word , nor believe it , nor repent , nor hate nor turn from sin ; for these are at least some of the parts of the work of regeneration . now i would fain know who is active in all this , if the party regenerate be not ? st. paul tells us , with the heart man believeth unto righteousness , and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation , rom. 10. 10. when peter shewed the jews their sin , and preached christ to them , they were pricked to the heart : now observe , they came to hear the word , they gave audience , they gave credit to it , god blessed the word with power : now they cry out , what shall we do ? peter exhort them to repent , &c. and they gladly receive his word , and had the washing of regeneration the same day . now let god have the glory of this , and all conversions , who is the first mover in it , and the efficient cause of it ; yet he is absurd that will say , man is as passive as an infant that can neither hear , nor receive any instruction at all . and therefore i deny his antecedent , it is not true , the adult are some way active in the work of conversion ; yea all that know the work , do know what wrestling with corruption is , and how unable they are to overcome in the conflict with satan and flesh , without supernatural strength , or aid from heaven , but yet they act , and wait for help in all their actings . 2. men are commanded to hear , that their souls may live , isa . 55. if they hear and obey not , they sin against god , rom. 10. 16 , 17 , 18. we grant that the power converting , is not of the creature ; we are not sufficient of our selves to think any thing as of our selves . all our faculties are given us of god. it 's our duty to put these faculties into act ; to hear , repent , and believe , is man's duty . it is not the duty of infants to hear , repent , believe , &c. therefore they are not regenerated this way . what you urge from the shunamite's son and lazarus , being both dead , and so equally passive as to rise from death , is wholly impertinent , and being put into argument , is false ; for thus you must argue , if you say any thing , infants dead are as capable to rise as the adult , being dead . ergo , they are as capable of hearing , beleiving , and repenting as the adult . the consequence is false ; many instances we have of the adult , who hear , believe , and repent ; but no instance of one infant ever regenerated this way . 3. as for your captious demands about our being quickned , &c. you may well spare them , till you give better evidence of your own conversion ; for your books do evidently shew , that a jeering idle spirit has dominion in you . howbeit this we say ; the original cause of our conversion , is the love of god : the meritorious cause , is the blood of christ : the ministerial cause , is the evidence of truth , or the word of truth : the efficient cause , is the power of god's grace , john 1. 12. the formal cause , is believing and obeying the truth through the spirit : the final cause , is god's glory and our salvation ; to the obtaining of which all our faculties of hearing , understanding , will , and affection , are given us of god to be put into act. this is not required of infants ; and how they are sanctified by the spirit , god only knoweth . 4. but now , saith mr. firmin , i will not have him for my god , who cannot most omnipotently make me both will , and do what he will. but i reply , these are great swelling words of vanity , and nothing to the purpose : we dispute not what god can do ; for he can , of a stone in the street , make a better man than either of us . and we deny not , but god hath sometimes , and may still , if he please , convert some by miraculous operations . but to say that all conversions are miraculous , as mr. f. does , is very false . paul was converted miraculously , so was not lydia . what i say upon ephes . 1. 19 , 20. is mistaken by you , for i extend it further than to the resurrection of the body ; for i expresly say he has power to do whatsoever he pleases , and so to raise us up , &c. but if i was short or obscure , this is my meaning , the faith of christians is agreeable to the power which god shewed in christ when he raised him from the dead ; and i think 1 pet. 1. 3. doth very well explain ephes . 1. 19 , 20. blessed be the god and father of our lord jesus christ , which according to his abundant mercy , hath begotten us again to a lively hope , by the resurrection of christ from the dead . mr. firmin argues thus ; they who are regenerated , have faith and repentance : but all infants saved , are regenerated : therefore all infants saved , have faith and repentance . answ . 1. here is a fault in your logick , * your major should have been universal , or else you conclude nothing rationally . 2. therefore i deny the major , and say , some may be regenerated ( i mean cleansed from sin , renewed by christ , and made fit for heaven ) without faith and repenuance , namely , infants ; and sure i am mr. f. shall never be able to prove his major , being taken universally ; and if he like not to mend his major , i reject his argument , and retort it thus . 3. they that are regenerated , do continue in the apostles doctrine and fellowship , and in breaking of bread , and in prayers . but all infants saved are regenerated . ergo , all infants saved continue stedfastly in the apostles doctrine and fellowship , and in breaking of bread , and in prayers . now as this argument is fallacious , so certainly is yours . again , 4. you that make all conversion miraculous , how can you tie regeneration to faith and repentance , as it respects infants ? do not you contradict your self , mr. firmin , in this ? may not god sanctify infants what way he pleaseth , but must be limited to your methods ? sir , what he doth in the regeneration of infants is a secret , let it alone to him . 5. but let us hear dr. taylor , one of your own mind as to poedo-baptism , yet he saith , let infants be pressed with all the inconveniencies which are consequent to original sin ; yet it will not be laid to their charge , so as to condemn them : or if it could , yet the mercy and absolute goodness of god will secure them , if he take them away before they can glorify him by a free obedience — for as infants without their own consent — contracted the guilt of adam ' s sin , and are liable to all the punishments which can with justice descend upon his posterity , who are personally innocent : so infants shall be restored — by the second adam , by the redemption of jesus christ , by his righteousness and mercies , applied either immediately , or how , or when he pleases to appoint . and here mr. f. may learn from dr. taylor , how infants may be guilty of sin , and yet innocent ; which he would make a contradiction in me . mr. f. tells us his major ( last denied ) is clear from our own confession , in that we say faith and repentance are the two parts of regeneration : but he that grants this , extends it only to the adult , of whom these are things required ; and not to infants , of whom they are not required ; so that this is a meer caption , unbecoming a grave disputant . but let us hear how he proves his minor. they ( saith he ) who are born unclean , that are sinful and corrupt by nature , must be regenerated before they can be saved . but so are infants born . therefore , &c. answ . it is not denied by us that infants are born unclean , and we grant that before they come to heaven they must be cleansed , so that you might have spared this argument . the thing you are to prove is , that infants cannot be cleansed without faith and repentance . but this you cunningly slide over , and you will find it to be an undertaking too hard for you , and i think you are the first man that ever attempted it . it is not your telling us again of your seminal faith that will do it , which , as you refer it to infants , is a meer chimera of your own brain . but when you speak of the adult , you seem to speak sense in these words , when god regenerates an adult person , he doth first infuse the principles , seeds , habits of all the graces of the spirit . when the sower went out to sow , mat 13. 3. it was but the seeds of faith and repentance which he did sow , which was first received , and these seeds grew up , mark ▪ 4. 27. now , sir , if you will stand to this , and these texts to govern your speech , we may very well come to agree . what then is the seed here spoken of ? our saviour tells us , it is the word of god , which men hear preached unto them ; is this the seminal faith and repentance which you talk on ? then this seminal faith is not in infants , for as they cannot hear the word , so no sower , or preacher is sent to them . and i suppose you would not baptize an adult person , tho he has heard the word , unless you see some effect of it , at least that the tender blade appear : for persons are not made disciples or christians by being baptized ; but they are baptized because they are made disciples , john 4. 1. mat. 28. 19. mathetusate panta ta ethne baptizantes autous . and disciples may be called christians , acts 11. now with what conscience then can you baptize an infant , that never to your knowledg received this seed at all ? but mr. f. bids us twy-fallow and try-fallow our ground , and sow no seed , for according to your doctrine ( saith he ) you may have a crop without it . but by his favour this is not our case , but his own , for he sows no seed to infants , and yet he will have a crop of them ; for he will have them baptized asleep or awake by force . now baptism is an act of obedience springing from the word ( the seed ) sown ; acts 2. 38 , 40. act. 8. 12. nay more , he exacts this crop of infants not only before he sow any seed , or before any be sown by any other that he knows of , but also before he so much as twy-fallow , or plow at all . and thus whilst he thought to kick the husbandman on the breech , he hath kick'd up his own heels . mr. f. quotes 1 john 3. 9. it is the seed which remains . peter ' s faith failed sadly ( saith he ) as to the act , but the seed remained . this would lead us to another question [ as it is his manner to confound his discourses with diversities ] but i shall hold him to the parable of the sower , alledged by himself mat. 13. and then i may tell him the seed only remains in good and honest hearts , but not in every place where it is sown , nor in every place where it is received ; remember the high-way , and the stony and thorny ground . mr. f's arg. 2. no unclean person shall see god ; heb. 12. 14. but infants by nature are unclean . if the scripture be believed , they must bear the image in which they were created by god , that ever see the face of god. answ . should i retort this argument , i might shew the infirmity of its form . but i shall take your sense . i suppose by the major you mean no unclean or wicked person , as such , shall see god. and by the minor you mean that infants are born of sinful parents , polluted by original sin , and so under condemnation ; and therefore before they can come to heaven they must be cleansed from these pollutions , &c. if this be your sense i agree with you . but then your argument touches not the question , which is , whether infants are not made clean from their pollutions , and freed from condemnation , without having faith and repentance ? i say they may , because god requires not these things of infants . but you argue further . mr. f. all the members of the kingdom of heaven are holy : but children are members of the kingdom of heaven : not by birth , it is by regeneration . answ . first , here i think you have given your cause its deaths blow . it seems now that the infants of believers are no more holy by their birth of believing parents than others ; and whether they be regenerated you cannot tell , for you do not hold that all the children of believers are saved . what is now become of the birth-priviledg so much gloried in by mr. baxter , and others ? we have been told infants are holy by birth , if one parent be but a believer ; and that children of believers are holy by prerogative of seed . but now you confess the truth , and i grant infants are not holy by birth , let their parents be never so christian . and i have already granted that infants must be cleansed from all sin before they come to heaven . but yet you touch not the question , whether they cannot be cleansed from sin without they have faith and repentance ; one would think you begin to be afraid of the question , and i am sure you have cause so to be . arg. 3. mr. f. tells us , if adam had continued in innocency , his children had born the image of god from the birth : i never heard it denied . that which i infer hence is , that children are capable of the image of god , and receiving the seeds of all grace it was so then , why not now ? answ . what manner of the image of god infants should have born , had adam continued innocent , is unknown to man ; and 't is but vain to concern our selves about that which cannot be known : but this we know , it should not have stood in faith and repentance as now , because in both these we confess our selves sinners , and this is enough to shew the vanity of your question , if so then , why not now ? but you proceed thus ; mr. f. shall the sin of one person be so mischievous , to deprive adam and all his posterity of the image of god , and bring the seeds of all corruption into their nature , and shall the grace of god be denyed to renew his image in little children , when and where he pleaseth ? children being a great part of the world , shall the spirit of god have nothing to do in their hearts ? answ . i know no man more faulty than mr. f. in this matter ; for he will not allow the grace of god to have any thing to do with the greatest part of infants . i doubt not but god doth all things needful for them , to make them holy , by the blood of christ ; his grace and spirit . but all this shall be done without faith and repentance ; because god does not require it of infants ; if he does , name your text. mr. f. now tells us ▪ adam's disobedience far ▪ exceeds the obedience of christ , which he compares in justification , rom. 5. 16 , 17 , 18. for his disobedience could defile all his posterity , but christ's obedience doth not cleanse and regenerate one child . answ . come st. paul , thou hast told us that such as thou art by letters when absent , such thou wilt be indeed when present , 2 cor. 10. 11. wherefore i shall give place to thee to answer for thy self , by the very places which mr. f. has quoted out of thy epistle to the romans , chap. 5. 16 , 17 , 18. and not as it was by one that sinned , so is the gift : for the judgment was of one to condemnation ; but the free-gift is of many offences to justification . for if by the offence of one , death reigned by one much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness , shall reign in life by one , jesus christ . th●refore as by the offence of one , judgment came upon all men ▪ to condemnation ; even so , by the righteousness of one , the free-gift came upon all men unto justification of life . and whereas mr. f. boldly tells us , that christ's obedience doth not cleanse and regenerate one child . i ask him whose obedience then does cleanse infants ? let st. paul answer again , ver . 19. as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners : so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous . blessed paul , thou hast answered to the life . mr. firmin says , christ's obedience doth not cleanse and regenerate one child . thou sayst , christ's obedience made many righteous ; and they that are made righteous are clean and regenerated sufficiently . blessed apostle ! thou hast turned the wisdom of the wise into foolishness . what follows in this paragraph is answered before , and for his uncivil expressions in the close of it i shall pass them by . mr. firmin's arg. 4. if all children dying such are justified and saved , then there will be millions in heaven , in whom the spirit of god , as the third person in the blessed trinity , had nothing to do in their salvation . answ . first , i take notice that mr. firmin by this argument would have millions of infants damned , because in his judgment the spirit of god hath nothing to do with millions of them in the business of salvation . this , this is that wicked doctrine which i oppose . 2. but how will he prove that the spirit hath to do in the business of the salvation of any of them , more than i shall prove he hath to do in the salvation of all dying infants ? he would prove it by two things , ( 1. ) because the distinct subsistences have their distinct manner of working . ( 2. ) because regeneration is given to the spirit . now , suppose this be true , it does not prove that some infants have the assistance of the spirit , and some dying infants have no assistance from him . thus he beats ▪ the air , but proves not any thing at all relating to the point in question . 3. but i will prove that all dying infants have all that assistance of the spirit ( in the business of salvation ) which is any way needful for them . i do it thus : all those dying infants , for whom christ shed his precious blood , have sufficient assistance from the spirit , in the business of their salvation . but christ shed his precious blood for all dying infants : ergo , all dying infants have sufficient assistance from the spirit in the business of their salvation . the major is evident , because no dying infant does resist the holy ghost , and because god is no respecter of persons . the minor is evident because christ died for all , tasted death for every man ; he bought them that deny him , and bring upon themselves swift destruction : and seeing his tender mercies are over all his works , the holy spirit is not wanting to further the salvation of any dying infant . deut. 10. 17 , 18. 1 tim. 2. 6. heb. 2. 9. 2 pet. 2. 1. psal . 145. 9. come mr. firmin , let me come near you ; it may be you have had some children that died in their infancy as well as i. shew me a reason now why my dying infants might not have the application of christ's blood by the holy spirit , as well as yours ? as for the manner of the spirit 's operation herein , i suppose we know it both alike , that is , not at all . nevertheless i do believe the father , son , and holy spirit does what is needful in their respective operations , tho i know not in all points how it is done in the case of dying infants . it is enough that we have christ's testimony , that to them belongs the kingdom , that is , to all in that state , for he rejects not any one of them , neither in these words , nor in any other that proceeded from his sacred lips , nor from the pens of the writers of the holy scriptures ; and then what is mr. firmin that he should by this presumptuous argument send many millions of them to hell ? because in his conceit , the holy ghost has nothing to do with them in the business of their salvation ; the spirit 's operations being limited by him herein to the infants of believers only ; and if you look well to his notions , there is not a few of them too , who have no help from the holy spirit , for they being not all elect , must be damned for all their baptism ; and this is the kindness he has to write a plea for infants . divis . 3. wherein is considered , whether the covenant of grace was taken from the whole world , and appropriated only to abraham and his seed , from the time of the making the covenant of circumcision , gen. 17. mr. firmin , p. 20. ] now i come to my question , and shall make it appear your answer signifies nothing . you tell me of a covenant of grace made with the whole world in the promised seed to adam , &c. i tell you , while adam , noah , and abraham lived under that covenant made with the whole world , god was pleased to make a covenant with abraham , and with none other but abraham , to be his god , and the god of his seed , and sealed this covenant , by which covenant and seal , god did separate and divide all abraham's seed from the world , living under the covenant you speak of . answ . 1. it is evident , that either mr. firmin holds , that the covenant made with adam , noah , and abraham , before that mentioned gen. 17. was not the covenant of grace ; or else that covenant , gen. 17. was not the covenant of grace ; or that the covenant of grace was now taken from all the world , and appropriated and restrained to abraham and his seed only . the latter is clearly his sense , that god was now only the god of abraham and his seed in the covenant of grace , and of none other . but this doctrine is most false and absurd , as i evidently shewed to mr. petto , to this effect . we ought to understand that abraham and his seed was not the only persons in the world , which were under the covenant of grace , at that time when god made with abraham the covenant of circumcision , gen. 17. for ( as mr. broughton observes ) sem lived 50 years after the covenant of circumcision was made with abraham ; and divers other holy men lived long after the covenant of circumcision was made ; who were all true worshippers of god according to the covenant of grace : melchisedeck blessing abraham , ( from whence st. paul infers , that he was greater than abraham , heb. 7. 7. ) yet neither he , nor the rest of the patriarchs were concern'd in the covenant of circumcision . and as neither these , nor their infants or posterity , were liable to any loss of the covenant of grace , by their not being circumcised after the manner of abraham ; so neither job , nor other worthy men that were not of the seed of abraham , had no necessity at all to be concern'd in the covenant of circumcision : from whence it must needs follow , that god did not intend the sign of circumcision , as necessary to entitle men to the covenant of grace , nor that none could be saved who were not under the covenant of circumcision . but certain it is , the covenant of circumcision was appropriate to abraham , and to his seed , for very great ends , respecting special preservation to the family of abraham , as being now the family from whence christ should proceed according to the flesh : and with whom god would presence himself in a land of promise , by a distinct way of worship from all other nations , who were then falling very fast to idolatry . again , mr. f. telling us , that god made that covenant of circumcision with abraham , and none other . by this he has given a fatal blow to his cause , which he is so zealous to defend . because by this , it is evident , that the covenant made with abraham , gen. 17. considered as it was peculiar to him and his seed , and no other , no not of the patriarchs then living , it was therefore ( at least so considered ) not the covenant of grace . but it was only , so considered ; the covenant of circumcision , as it is also called , acts 7. 8. without any such adjunct as the covenant of grace ; as if all that were not in that peculiar covenant throughout the world , must be damn'd without mercy . no , no , god had his tender mercies for others , tho this covenant was peculiar to abraham . god was no such respecter of persons when he made the covenant with abraham , gen. 17. but in every nation , from the beginning even to the end of the world , all that feared the lord , and wrought righteousness , found acceptance with him . this old truth , peter himself ( being tinctured with this notion , that god had no grace for any but abraham's seed ) could not perceive , till god by miracle did reveal it to him ; no tho his commission , mat. 28. 19 , 20. did oblige him to teach all nations , and to preach the gospel to every creature , yet till now he durst not preach to the gentiles , acts 10. and therefore it is the less strange , that mr. firmin , and such as he , who take themselves to be abraham's seed , because they are born according to the flesh of such as they take to be believers , should be so cruelly dark in this glorious truth , that god is no respecter of persons . nor do i see any thing more liable to puff men up with pride , than this , that they were in the covenant of grace from their infancy , because their parents were believers , or at least one of them , or their grandfather , &c. was so ; as mr. f. words it . this opinion undid the jews generally , and i doubt it has spoiled many of the gentiles . our blessed saviour , john 8. has a long disputation to deliver the jews from this their vain confidence , which they built upon their being abraham's seed . and st. paul bent his stile against the same thing , rom. 2. 26 , 27 , 28 , 29. and chap. 3. ver . 19. to the end . but the more they laboured to undeceive these deceived jews ▪ the more they were hated by them ; and if we meet with the same measure , we must bear it . for indeed , scarce any so fierce against us , for extending the grace of god to all men , as being therein no respecter of persons , and yet shewing to sinners the necessity of actual repentance towards god , and faith towards our lord jesus christ , as necessary to their membership in the church militant , by the baptism of repentance for remission of sins ; i say , none so fierce against us , as those who boast they are abraham's seed , because descended from gentiles , who they suppose to be believers . but let me have a care , i must now answer for my self , for mr. firmin demands of me , page 21. by what scripture-warrant do you reduce our children , into the state of the children of adam , or noah , &c. since we are never called their children , but only abraham ' s , whose seed differ from theirs by a special covenant made with them , and sealed with them. to which of them did god say , i will be the god of thy seed , and i will seal it ? but i reply . these seem to me to be great swelling words of vanity , much worse in a gentile than in a jew . and i would know what special covenant hath god made with mr. f. and his seed , which he hath denied to tho. grantham and his seed ? but to the question . 1. i am far from denying abraham's fatherhood over the faithful christians ; but i deny that every believer that hath an infant , is the father of the faithful . and i deny many to have any right to that title , who boast much of it , because they do not the works of abraham , but despise those that worship god according to his will. thus did not abraham : but thus does mr. firmin . 2. i find that adam was the son of god , luke 3. whether called so meerly for his creation , or for that after the promise , gen. 3. 15. he walked with god , or for both , i will not dispute . and i find that christ's descent is reckoned from adam , and the saviour of the world was first promised to him , and to proceed from him ; and therein was the covenant of grace in the first place made with him , and in him with all mankind who then were in him : nor do i find that this gracious covenant was ever repealed , but is in force to this day , as is granted by mr. baxter . 3. i find that noah found grace in the sight of the lord , being righteous before god. and i know that mr. baxter , and other learned christians , acknowledg the covenant made with noah and his generations , to be a covenant of grace , and of perpetual duration , being indeed the renewal of the covenant made with adam . i find also , that noah became heir of the righteousness which is by faith , and that his faith did lead him to believe that which was as difficult to sense , as that abraham should have a son , viz. that the whole world should be drowned : his faith also was made perfect by works , for , whatsoever the lord commanded , that did noah . 4. i find that all men from the time of the flood , are the generations of noah , and that he was perfect in his generation , a just man , and one that walketh with god ; and as one of his sons proved wicked , so did one of the sons of abraham . i do also find in scripture , that we are all called the sons of adam ; to you , o men , i call , and my voice is to the sons of adam , or man , prov. 8. 4. and as the sons of adam , god shews them what is good , even to do justly , to love mercy , and to walk humbly with their god , mich. 6. now from these scripture-warrants , i honour my great grandfather adam , because to him was committed the first oracles of god , making known the covenant of grace : i honour my grandfather noah , because he was heir of the righteousness of faith , and had the second edition of the covenant of grace , extended to all his generations , till by sin they eject themselves . i likewise honour my father abraham , because he had the third edition of the covenant of grace , as a blessing to all nations , or to all the families of the earth , gen. 12. and also for that god was pleased to choose his posterity , as the people from whom men should look for their saviour , with respect to his descent according to the flesh , and of this covenant , as also of the land of promise was circumcision given as a sign to his posterity , that they might not mix with other nations , in life or religion ; but to abraham himself , as a seal of the righteousness of faith , which he had near 30 years before he was circumcised . but for all this , i know that in gospel-times , unless we crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts , we cannot be abraham ' s seed , nor heirs according to the promise , gal. 3. 29. and the seal of our sonship and right to the inheritance , is the holy spirit , ephes . 1. 13. gal. 4. 6. ephes . 4. 30. mr. firmin . now suppose that were true which is the great business of your pamphlet , to prove that all dying infants are saved . that thereby you may take off the odium which lies upon you for shutting the children of believers out of the church , and denying them baptism , they being under the covenant of grace made with adam , ( as you say ) tell me , is this covenant of god with abraham's seed in vain ? does the holy one make vain covenants ? as to his seed , they were well enough before : if isaac die before the 8th day , he is saved , so that this covenant might have been spared . answer . 1. i hav● said enough to shew that abraham's covenant , gen. 17. was not in vain ; but i am sure you here make a vain use of it . for had isaac died before he was eight days old , in your judgment he had not been saved , and consequently no male infants which died before they were circumcised were saved . this is that wretched doctrine which i oppose . and seeing you make baptism as necessary to salvation as circumcision was , and call it the seal of the covenant ; you either make infants which die unbaptized , saved by an unsealed covenant , ( as you speak ) or else you damn all infants which die unbaptized . no other sense can be made of your strange questions , p. 73. your question is this . are they all justified and saved ? then it must be by a covenant of grace . and shall they be under the covenant so , as to be in a justified and saved state by it , and not have the seal of the covenant ? as if the covenant of grace were of no use to poor infants , without the crossing , sprinkling , or ( as you ) pouring a little water on their forehead , for which you have no rule at all in the word of god. i cannot but admire your great blindness . 2. the covenant of circumcision might not now be spared , because god had now designed , to honour abraham's faith , and to make him and his posterity famous both for multitude , religion , and other excellencies , but chiefly to point out all nations from whence to look for a saviour ; which accordingly was foreknown and expected by many other nations , by means of the covenant made with abraham . but you add : if their seed die while little ones , i hope they are not further from salvation by this covenant , nor parents the less hope — two strings to a bow are good . but i answer : 1. you so string your bow of salvation for infants that you break it , and so kill more infants than you save , yea , an isaac himself cannot escape you , but must perish , if he die before the 8th day . pray , sir , what manner of doctrine is this ? is it in the power of infants to live till the 8th day ? and if god take them away before the 8th day , will god damn them because they were not circumcised , when yet by his own law they might not have it ? are these the comfortable strings you give parents to the bow of infants salvation ? 2. hence it is evident that it is you , not i , that make infants further off from salvation by the covenant of circumcision . for i say , ( though all the commands of god be good in their place and use ) yet he never ordained any rite , to be necessary to the salvation of poor infants . but according to your doctrine , if infants died before the covenant of circumcision was made , whether the first , second , third , fourth , fifth , sixth , or seventh day , their salvation was never the more doubtful for that . but now the case is very hard , for if isaac himself die before the 8th day he is lost , according to your sense of the covenant . what follows , i have answer'd before . mr. firmin . yet again , as to that notion wherein you so much glory , i have made five remarkable demonstrations , as you call them , to prove it ; you must make three more demonstrations , or else these five will not do the feat . 1. that god does save those that are under that covenant , without any condition in it . name that text , i pray . answ . 1. here observe again , mr. firmin is in good earnest , that no infants can be saved , unless they keep the condition of the covenant . and he makes heart-circumcision , and the circumcision of the flesh , both necessary conditions of the covenant , for infants salvation in the time of the law , or ever since abraham's time . and repentance , and faith , and baptism , the condition in the gospel . 2. i am to demonstrate the contrary , which with much ease ( by god's grace ) i shall do . i say then , almighty god made a covenant of grace with adam in the promised seed , gen. 15. in which covenant stood the salvation of all dying infants ; and yet no condition was there to be annexed on the part of infants ; howbeit , faith was necessary on adam's part , or else he had sinned in not believing the promise * . and its evident , abel had faith in this promise by his offering a lamb , a figure of christ the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. see diod. on gen. 4. to prove that god requires nothing of duty , as a condition of the covenant on the part of infants in order to salvation , i will set down two texts , deut. 11. 1. to 10. rom. 5. 14 , 18. and i also give you this argument : circumcision it self was not appointed to be a condition of the covenant of grace , necessary to the salvation of so much as one infant . ergo , there was never any thing imposed or required of infants as a necessary condition of the covenant , for the salvation of infants . the consequence i suppose will not be denied , because nothing can be pretended with so much probability this way , as circumcision : and for the major it is clear from the case of moses's child , exod. 4. 24 , 25. where we find that god sought not to kill the child , because it was not circumcised the 8th day , but he sought to kill moses ; which shews the child was not guilty of sin in this case . and that this note may be the more acceptable , i shall make some addition to the testimonies formerly given , and here shew the judgment of some learned writers in this case . cajetan ( a man no less zealous for infant-baptism than mr. firmin , yet ) writes thus : consentaneum est , &c. it is sit that none should be punished , but they which had committed the fault : but infants can commit no fault , therefore the punishment here assigned doth belong to the adult only , they only be rightfully punished , which only are justly blamed for the omission of circumcision . and saith a protestant doctor upon this sentence , put baptism ( meaning of infants ) in the place of circumcision , and this sentence is most true of the one , as well as of the other . yea , the ancients , quoted by the said doctor , tell us , circumcision did not profit the soul , but was only a sign of grace : for children when they understand not what is done to them , can reap no profit thereby to their souls , chrys . hom. 9. in gen. and irenaeus is alledged to say , circumcision was only given as a sign to the people . the conclusion is , that as it is certain that infants shall be cleansed and renewed , before they come to heaven ; so god hath not tied this mercy to any ritual , or thing to be done by us , but by the obedience of christ , and his free-grace , sanctifies them in a manner unknown to us . mr. firmin . 2. you must demonstrate ( saith he ) that by this covenant he saves those who have lost the image of god , and are corrupt by nature , for infant-regeneration , and heart-circumcision , is denied by you , and yours . answ . this demonstration also will easily be made , or else i am sure mr. firmin and my self , shall not be saved , for that we are as corrupt by nature , and have lost the image of god as much as any infant ; nay , we are sent to infants to learn the qualifications we want . and as all have sinned , and come short of the glory of god ; so they are justified freely by his grace , through the redemption which is in christ jesus ; rom. 3. 23 , 25. and tho christ is set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood , for the remission of sins that are past through the forbearance of god ; yet this faith is not required of infants , because they cannot believe on him of whom they have not heard , rom. 10. and tho you reply , that this is spoken of the adult , yet you are to know as it is the adult only to whom the gospel is preached , so it is the adult only who are required to believe . as for the way of the almighty in the business of infants regeneration , 't is a thing not revealed ; and therefore you do but vainly pretend to know it . and seeing it is said , that we know not the way of the spirit , nor how the bones do grow ▪ in the womb of her that is with child . it is strange that mr. firmin should know after what manner the hearts of infants are circumcised , and how they are regenerate . it is enough for us to know that they are redeemed by christ , and saved by grace ; for in knowing this , we know our gracious god will deny them no supplies which is needful for them . if this do not satisfie mr. f. then let him give some account to the world now he is grown up , how the spirit did work in the business of his regeneration in his infancy ; and if he can give no account of his own infant-regeneration , then , i think , it will be hard for him to give it of the manner of the regeneration of other infants . mr. firmin . 3. you must demonstrate , that tho infants have not actually sinned against the covenant of grace , yet they have not unbelief and impenitency seminally , which are quite opposite to the covenant of grace . answ . 1. i conceive nothing can be spoke more irrationally , nor unrighteously , than to suggest that poor infants have unbelief and impenitency in them . and yet so 't is , the seeds of those impieties at least mr. f. will have to be in them : and i demand of him , how he knows this ? and how he can tell when these sins against the covenant of grace , are purged from infants ? seeing he has told us they are not holy by their birth , i would know whether they be purged before their birth , or after ? but let us hear our saviour's judgment of little children , which all will grant to be more worth than mr. firmin's . he speaks of some just persons which need no repentance , whom he opposes to such as have gone astray . i will not presume , that this is only meant of infants , to whom our lord tells us the kingdom of heaven belongs ; but i humbly conceive , as it is true of them , so it does include them , as being of that number . again , he tells us , except we be converted and become as little children , we cannot see the kingdom of god. but if infants be guilty of vnbelief and impenitency , in such a degree , as these sins in them are quite opposite to the covenant of grace , we should have but little benefit by such conversion : and thus he reflects upon christ in his directions to his followers , as if christ gave not good counsel herein . st. paul exhorts christians , as touching malice , to be children ; in which speech he is directly contrary to mr. f. and st. peter would have us like new-born babes , i. e. to lay aside all malice , guile , hypocrisie , and evil speaking . but if unbelief and impenitency be in them seminally , these impieties are there also ; and then they are bad presidents , being as wicked as it is possible for them to be , in mr. f's judgment . however , mr. f. is compelled to confess , infants are not guilty of any actual sin against the covenant of grace . and then , who made you a judg of their hearts , sir ? sure this is an attempt too high for any man. but i must demonstrate that infants have not unbelief seminally . well , i will plead their cause as well as i can ; and i argue for them thus : they who have no object of faith propounded to them seminally , can have no unbelief seminally . but infants have no object of faith propounded to them seminally . ergo , they can have no unbelief seminally . if mr. f. deny the minor , i will hold him to his own law , affirmanti incumbit probatio . if he affirm that infants have an object of faith propounded to them seminally , let him prove it . as for the major , our saviour's words , john 15. 22. do establish it ; and indeed , this is the condemnation , that light is come — , and men love darkness . he that has no light cannot be blamed , because he cannot see . our lord charges not the sin of unbelief , till means to believe was rejected ; and will he be more unkind to the infant , than to the grown person ? who can have so vile an opinion of the almighty ! but i must demonstrate also , that infants have not impenitency seminally , yea , such impenitency as is quite opposite to the covenant of grace . well , i reply , first , by way of admiration , that ever such wild notions should issue from a learned head , that so he might have some specious pretence to damn poor infants : but god hath said , he will turn the wisdom of wise men backward , and make diviners mad , isa . 44. 25. 2. impenitency supposes the party charged , first , to be guilty of some sin committed , or desired , or conceived . but nothing of this can be justly charged against infants . consider them acquitted of original sin , by the mercy of god in their redeemer ; who shall lay any thing to their charge ? what have they done ? mr. firmin . do you ask what have they done ? did you never see revenge , wrath , pride , envy , rebellion against , and striking of parents , acting in little children ? answ . 1. these are not infants of eight days old , &c. but such who by the ill example of their tutors , quickly may learn these things . otherwise , if the child thinks it has cause to be angry , and to make defence , it does no more than you will vindicate in your own cause . and why does not charity make you think the best of infants , seeing you ought to think no evil of the weak actions of grown persons ? o , thou that canst see such beams , as revenge , wrath , pride , rebellion , &c. in the eyes of poor infants ! pluck these beams out of thine own , which evidently are thy distempers from the books which thou hast written , in which , not many pages are free from tincture of some of these diseases . but you add : blessed austin observed a sucking child , that was not able to articulate one word , look with a countenance even pale with envy , upon his fellow-suckling , which shared with him in the same milk ; which made the holy man cry out , ubi , domine ? quando , domine ? reply , how did austin know that the child was pale with envy ? suppose this good man himself had sat down to dinner , and another snatch it all away from him , perhaps he would have look'd pale also ; for such we must suppose the child's case to be , when another takes the breast , it thinks all is gone , for it yet understands not the rules of hospitality , or good-fellowship , being unsensible of the others necessity . the poor child attended its own preservation as nature taught it ; a poor ground on which to build so severe a charge . should the best of god's people be tried , how duly they make others sharers in their blessings , who have need of relief , they may perhaps be more justly charged than that sucking child ; judg no poor infants , lest ye be judged . to conclude : seminal faith , seminal repentance , seminal vnbelief , and seminal impenitency , are things of which we have no account in scripture . and though i would not offend mr. firmin , nor at all disparage his scholarship , which i acknowledg to be abundantly more than mine ; yet when i consider learning in saint paul's sense , 2 tim. 3. 14. i cannot but think these to be very wild and unlearned notions , which no man can be assured of , nor give a good account that he learned them of any of the master-builders , the holy apostles . and who ever asserts these things , shall never be able to prove them , viz. that some infants have faith and repentance seminally ; and others have vnbelief and impenitency seminally . and ( which is another impossibility ) no man can distinguish the infants one from another . nor can it ever be proved , that seminal faith and repentance ( if yet any body can tell what it is ) do give us any ground to baptize any body . for , suppose we take this seminal faith and repentance to be the faculties of credence and sorrow : or suppose some take them to be some secret inspirations of the spirit , yet sith they appear not to us , it is as if they were not . for that rule is good in this case , de● non apparentibus , & non existantibus eidem est ratio . it is the profession of faith and repentance , that qualifies a person ( in respect of us ) for sacred baptism ; the church is not judg of of hearts , they are only known to god infallibly . division 4. concerning original sin. it would even grieve a sober christian , to read the strange immaginations which men have published about original sin ; and the extreams they have run into on the right hand , and on the left , censuring one another very severely for their differing apprehensions in this matter . and it is remarkable , how cruelly censarious mr. firmin is against my self in particular , representing me as a master among the worst sort of anabaptists , who , he says , denies original sin. concerning which , he tells you , we are rotten . that the foundation of anabaptism lies in denying original sin. that in this we are given up to more blindness than the heathens , &c. to all which i answer : 1. if i be one of the worst of my brethren in this point , i hope the rest will be better thought of by men of moderation for my sake , when they have had ( what violent mr. firmin hath not ) patience to consider what i have published upon the account of original sin , ( and that long before i heard there was such a man in the world as mr. firmin ) in my christianismus primitivus , book 2. pag. 77 , 78. thus you read me . 2. for the better attaining to a powerful conviction of sin , and a sence of man's wretchedness by reason of sin , it is necessary to understate the general state of transgression , into which mankind is involved ; concerning which we find the scripture gives this testimony , that all have sinned , and come short of the glory of god , rom. 3. 23. and that by one man sin entred into the world , — for that all have sinned . and that the whole world lieth in wickedness ; which is also evident by common experience , every nation being greatly corrupted through the abounding of iniquity ; and the universality of the ways of sin does evince the same — that the apostle might well say , both jew and gentile are all under sin. 3. the sin of mankind is either original , or actual . the first is come upon all , even the very infant-state of mankind lie under it , of whom that saying is true , they have not sinned after the similitude of adam ' s transgression ; yet , death reigning over them , proves the transgression of adam to be upon them . this is that root-sin , called the sin of the world , john 1. 29. whereof none are free . nor is it convenient to extenuate or lessen this sin , either in its nature , or the punishment it brings with it ; it being indeed the filum certissimum , or leading-thred to all other iniquities , mankind being hereby corrupt ab origine , and wholly deprived of the glory of god , without the intervening mercy of a saviour . and hence we find david , when complaining of his sinful state , looks back to his corrupt original , amongst the rest of his iniquities , complaining , psal . 51. 5. behold , i was shapen in iniquity , and in sin did my mother conceive me . knowing as job saith , none can bring a clean thing out of an unclean one . so that they are not to be despised , who say , that in our humiliation for sin , we ought to bewail this our sinful original , which had been to adam's posterity like the sin of traytors , which bringeth with it corruption of blood to their off-spring , for which they must bear the shame of such transgressions . how do we find that the sin of progenitors was wont to be lamented by their off-spring among the israelites ? and is there not the same reason adam's children should do the like , as being sensible of the evil consequences thereof ? we also may say , our father hath sinned , and we have born his iniquity . 4. and hence i like the saying of irenaeus well , which i will give in english , because mr. f. is pleased to lock it up in latine . omnes enim venit , &c. christ came to save all by himself , all i say , who are born again in god ; infants , little ones , boys , and young men , and old men : but as for his , ideo per omnem venit aetatem , i let that alone , for i do not find that christ passed through the age of old men ; yet i say , he came to sanctifie every age , and therefore every age who do not profane the blood of christ by which they were sanctified ( as i am sure no infant doth ) they shall certainly be saved by him , and hence the salvation of all dying infants , is apparent enough . but how infants are born again in god , is a secret , and not to be demonstrated by mr. firmin , nor any other . surely had i written as irenaeus doth , he would have said i exclude the operation of the holy ghost ; for irenaeus says , he came to save all by himself , yet as 't is certain that the holy spirit is not wanting to the aged sinner , there is no ground to doubt of his care of poor infants . division 5. of free-will . concerning free-will , mr. f. calls it our diana , and an imperial majesty , representing us to deny god to be most blessed , because if his will be resisted , he failing of his end , is to want a degree of blessedness , &c. i answer : 1. then it seems , according to mr. f. all that god wills to be saved , must , and therefore shall be saved ; and the rest he wills to be damned , and they shall therefore be damned . but how he can reconcile his doctrines to these scriptures , i cannot tell , which saith , i live , i will not the death of the wicked . and that this is good in the sight of god , &c. who will have all men to be saved . 2. was it god's will , that when he brought israel out of egypt , that their carcases should fall in the wilderness ? if it were not , then he wanted a degree of blessedness . was it god's will that adam should fall , and bring himself and his posterity into so many miseries ? if not , god was not most blessed , because he failed of his end. if you say , it was god's will that adam should fall , and that israel must fall in the wilderness , you had as good tell us , that god has decreed all the evil actions that men do , and that they must do them , else god cannot be most blessed , because he should fail of his end , if these evil actions were not done . this is his logick , let him look to it . but , 3. what i conceive to be truth concerning free-will , i will give you a short account from what i have formerly published in a little catechism , where in page 21. i put these questions and answers following . — what mean you by the third part of repentance ? answ . i mean , first , a boly loathing of sin , because it is of the devil , 1 john 3. 8. and because god hates it . and because christ died because of it . 2. to abstain from the act of sin , in desire , word , and deed , as much as possible . god saw their works , that they turned from their evil ways . break off thy sins by righteousness : repent ye therefore and be converted . this is to bring forth fruits meet for repentance . quest . hath man any liberty of will , and any measure of power thus to hate and forsake sin ? answ . 1. by the bounty of god , man hath some liberty and power this way . he is not chained to his sins of necessity . chuse you this day whom you will serve . to day if ye will hear his voice , harden not your hearts . mary hath chosen the good part . 2. man's infirmity in the exercise of this liberty and power is so great , that he is not to depend upon this liberty and power , but upon the strength of god in the use of them , hos . 14. 2. 2 cor. 3. 5. now let any sober christian tell me , how it is possible to make the will of man an imperial majesty out of my words , that is , a majesty that hath no peer ; for no less than such a slander would serve mr. firmin to fix upon us , especially upon my self ▪ for what cause he is so inveterate , i know not . but come , mr. firmin , will the doctrine of a chief man of your own please you ? if so , you and i may agree in his sentence . thus he speaks ; austin as well as pelagius ▪ calvin as well as the arminians ; the dominicans as well as the jesuits , all generally maintain that man hath free-will . origen is condemned by epiphanius , for saying that man had lost the image of god ▪ — this image is two-fold , 1. natural , i. e. reason and free will. 2. qualitative , or ethical , i. e. our holiness , and this is lost , and by grace restored . no man of brains can deny , that man hath a will naturally free ; it is free from violence . — it 's a self-determining principle , but is not freed from evil dispositions ▪ mr. baxter's preface to his call to the vnconverted . i think i need say no more to a wise man : and i am sure , this is as much as any wise man among us will say in this matter . conclvsion . mr. firmin seems displeased at the multitude which will be saved ; if my opinion be true , that all dying infants shall be saved : i will give you his own words . i pray ( saith he ) whose opinion are you of , huberus ? the promiscuous salvation of all . or are you of caelius secundus curio ' s opinion , that the number of the elect and saved is much greater than the number of the reprobate and damned ? whether you , or these , or christ , be truest , ( mat. 7. 14. few find it ) the day of judgment will determine . here , sir , you shew your spirit . but for answer : although i know that god is not willing that any should perish , but that all should come to repentance , 2 pet. 3. 9. 1 tim. 2. 4. yet i see too much cause to fear , that but very few of the many , to whom god is so long suffering to lead them to repentance , will consider his goodness therein : and that the far greater part will despise the riches of god's goodness , and treasure up unto themselves wrath against the day of wrath , and revelation of the righteous judgment of god. and in this very respect , i fear , some old professors , such especially as have been teachers of others , and yet have not learned either civility , or honesty , in treating those who differ from them in opinion . as to the text , mat. 7. 14. blessed be god , infants are in no danger by it , they may all be saved , and so the number of the saved be much the greater by them ; for seeing they none of them are walking in the broad-way which leads to destruction ; they must needs go the way which leads to life , tho as it is a strait way of faith and obedience , and many crosses for christ's sake , they can neither seek nor find it ; yet their redeemer hath found it for them , and has declared their right to heaven , and will therefore in his own time and way , bring them to the enjoyment of that kingdom which he hath prepared for them , as well as others . but here also we see , you are unkind to many dying infants , whilst you are sending them to hell with those who walk in the broad-way . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a41781-e150 * it was not the bp of norwich , for i never saw him , nor did i ever dispute any doctor out of the room , as mr. f. hath both foolishly and falsly reported in print , with no less than six other false and very frivolous tales , in half a page ▪ notes for div a41781-e950 dr. willit hexap . in gen. p. 196 , &c. notes for div a41781-e1670 * you bid me understand what that fallacy ignoratio elenchi is , and here you are fallen into that fallacy your self . notes for div a41781-e3610 * in the book of wisdom , we read , that wisdom preserved the first father of the world , and brought him out of his offence , chap. 10. 1. which is agreeable to the canonical scripture , luke 3. 38. because adam is called the son of god. dr. willit . hexap . in gen. p. 56. see diodat . upon gen. 17. 14. who is also clear in this point . a religious contest, or a brief account of a disputation holden at blyton in the county of lincoln between mr. william fort minister of the perochial congregation at blyton on the one part, and thomas grantham, servant to the baptised churches on the other part : whereunto is added brief animadversions upon dr. stilling-fleet his digressions about infant baptism in his book intituled, a rational account of the protestant religion, &c., in both which are shewed that the generality of the nations now professing christianity are as yet unbaptised into christ : 1. because their sprinkling and crossing the fore-head is not the right way of baptising, 2. because infants ought not to be baptised. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. 1674 approx. 93 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 21 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2009-03 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a41787 wing g1544 estc r39430 18410482 ocm 18410482 107507 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a41787) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 107507) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1634:6) a religious contest, or a brief account of a disputation holden at blyton in the county of lincoln between mr. william fort minister of the perochial congregation at blyton on the one part, and thomas grantham, servant to the baptised churches on the other part : whereunto is added brief animadversions upon dr. stilling-fleet his digressions about infant baptism in his book intituled, a rational account of the protestant religion, &c., in both which are shewed that the generality of the nations now professing christianity are as yet unbaptised into christ : 1. because their sprinkling and crossing the fore-head is not the right way of baptising, 2. because infants ought not to be baptised. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. [6], 34 p. [s.n.], london printed : 1674. special t.p.: brief animadversions upon dr. stillingfleet's digressions about the baptising of infants / by thomas grantham. london : [s.n.], 1674. "epistle to the reader" signed: tho. grantham. errata: p. 34. imperfect : slightly faded, with print show-through. reproduction of original in the british library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities 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areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng fort, william. stillingfleet, edward, 1635-1699. -rational account of the grounds of protestant religion. baptists -england. infant baptism. 2007-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-11 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2008-03 elspeth healey sampled and proofread 2008-03 elspeth healey text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-09 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a religious contest . or , a brief account of a disputation holden at blyton in the county of lincoln . between mr. william fort minister of the perochial congregation at blyton on the one part , and thomas grantham , servant to the baptised churches on the other part . whereunto is added brief animadversions upon dr. stilling-fleet his digressions about infant baptism : in his book intituled , a rational account of the protestant religion , &c. in both which are shewed that the generality of the nations now professing christianity , are as yet unbaptised into christ . 1. because their sprinkling and crossing the fore-head is not the right way of baptising . 2. because infants ought not to be baptised . acts 2. 38. repent and be baptised every one of you in the name of jesus christ for the remission of sins , and ye shall receive the gifts of the holy ghost . mark 16. 16. he that believeth and is baptised shall be saved . london , printed in the year , 1674. the epistle dedicatory , to mr. vvilliam fort and the rest of the brethren and assistants at the dispute holden by his appointment at blyton the 18 day of september , 1673. reverend sirs i do seriously account it a part of my infelicity to see the distractions and divisions among us touching the worship of almighty god , and his holy child jesus , whom i trust we do all love and fear , and therefore it is the greater pitty that we who differ not about the godhead , should at all differ about the things which pertain to his blessed service . may it therefore please god to move upon all our hearts to consider ( laying aside all carnal interest ) where the causes on either side are given . and sith , perhaps we are more quick sighted about each others mistakes then our own , give me leave without offence , to shew briefly what i conceive is really amiss on your part , and i shall as willingly consider what may fairly be objected concerning us against that confideration . first then , when i look upon your reformation from papall errors , i cannot but heartily congratulate the piety and zeal of your martyrs , &c. specially in their being instrumental to bring that sacred institute of the lords table from under manifold corruptions wherewith it had been incumbred in the darkness of popery : but yet withall i must needs condole their shortness in not looking with like diligence to the pristine institution of sacred baptism , by which oversight we which survive them , are the more exposed to our present distractions , and i think i may say in this , as david in another case , because they did it not at the first therefore the lord made a breach upon us . secondly , when i consider the articles of the church of england , i think it very strange that we who agree so firmly in them all save three or four , and differ but in some points touching them neither , should not consider of some expedient to remove what obstructs our intire agreement . may it therefore please your bishops , with their brethren , to admit of a friendly conference with our bishops and pastors , to try if by any means away may be found to bring us to brotherly concord , for whatsoever hath happened in the heat of disputation , or fallen from the pens of passionate writers on eitherside , yet be pleased to know , we are no haters of the pious protestant , but sincere lovers of them and the truths by them maintain'd , as indeed we ought to be of all who love christ , though differing from us in many things . and though it is true we hold a separation from you in our congregations , yet we do this of necessity , because none among your leaders will treat with us about the removal of those things which do offend . i confess , to reform what is amiss on your part touching sacred baptism is a difficult undertaking , yet not more difficult then it was to reform what was amiss in the other sacrament , whether we consider their errors , who for some hundreds of years , gave it to infants , or theirs who by their transubstantiation changed the very nature of the sacrament ▪ but if no endeavouts of this kind must be admitted , then am i out of hopes ever to see christian concord among us , for those coercive ways ( which some incline to ) will but aggravate the breach ( which is too great already ) & render your cause the more suspitious , and consequently more confirm us in our perswasion against your way . now the lord himself direct us all to the way of truth and peace in all things ; so prays ; yours to love and serve you in christ as far as permitted . t. g. the epistle to the reader , shewing the occasion of this disputation . courteous reader . disputation is not more hurtful when needless , then profitable when necessity calls for it . and hereupon our lord christ himself was frequent in disputes about his doctrine . this way went the apostles to try the matter in question about circumcision , acts 15. and paul defended christianity by disputing dayly in the school of one tyrannus acts 19. the occasion of the dispute at blyton ▪ september 18. 1673. was on this wise . a small remnant of baptized christians meeting in that town , it pleased mr. fort minister of the perochial congregation there , to come to their meetings , and to hinder their proceedings , so that they could not edifie one another , as their manner was . and this he did many times , and told them he was resolved they should not meet in that town . and when the baptists endeavoured to maintain their principles , he slighted them , saying they were foolish men not fit to discourse of religion because they understood not the rules of logick , &c. but he bad them find him a man that had brains , and understood the languages , and knew logick and he would dispute with him . they told him they had few that understood these things . but he not ceasing to disturb them they consented to his motion , and a day was appointed , and because the baptists had not a convenient place , mr. fort provided a large room , and sent for them to come thither , where himself with two other ministers and divers of the neighbourhood were met togeth●r . for the account of the dispute it self , take this information that much of it is here reported according to what memory could serve in upon recogitation , but yet be assured of this that for substance it is not altered by this account , the arguments varying very little , or not at all from the very terms wherein they were expressed in the dispute , and mr. fort 's answers , rendred rather more advantagious , then in their first delivery . if it seem strange that a person of such learning and gravity , should answer and argue with no more advantage to his cause , the reader may take notice that god hath said , he will confound the wisdom of the wise , and bring to nought the understanding of the prudent and when he doth this , then where is the scribe , where is the disputer of this world. now whereas in this dispute i have used th● method which the learned do more affect , then other ways of disputing , i desire the reader to take notice , that i do not in any thing that i have said pretend at all to the parts of a scholar , being a person of no education that way , howbeit , having obtained mercy of the lord , to know somewhat of his blessed will , according to his word , i am therefore willing to appear in the defence of his truth when called thereunto . finally , my hearts desire and prayer to god , is , that though our present differences in religion , be matter of infelicity , yet sith we all agree , that christianity is the only true religion in the world , that we therefore may ●ndeavour to maintain the great engag●ment of charity , and m●deration , and then we may expect that the god of truth and peace , will pitty us under our mistakes , and also lead us into the enjoyment of that gracious promise , jer. 32. 39. even to give us one heart , and one way . so be it . tho. grantham . a religious contest , or , an account of the dispute held at blyton the eighteen of september , 1673. the people being come together , mr. fort applying himself to thomas grantham began after this manner . sir , i suppose that you are come hither to defend some unlawful meetings in this place which i have laboured to suppress , now that which i have to charge them with is this : that their meetings are unlawful . 2. that their way of anabaptism is sinful , and 3. i will prove that our way of baptizing infants is lawful . tho. grantham . sir , i came not hither to defend any mans sayings or doings , but to vindicate the truth of the gospel ( as much as in me is ) so far as i am concerned , and for anabaptism i am against it as much as you , nor do i think it needful to dispute about the baptizing of infants till some body be found to baptise them , for i think that there is no man in england that baptiseth any infants . mr. fort. why this is a strange thing ! can any thing be more plain , then that which is de facto , and here the three priests fell a laughing . t. grantham . gentlemen , you have no cause to laugh as yet , for i say ( and shall shew in due place ) that neither you nor any in the world that i can hear of does baptise any infants . mr. fort. i tell you friend we do baptise them and will you deny a thing that is de facto , and here they fell a laughing again . t. grantham . gentlemen , this doth not become the gravity of your persons , did you come hither to make sport ? but because you make this so strange , give me leave to put you in mind of the apostles saying , 1 cor. 11. this is not to eat the lords supper , and yet the corinthians did celebrate the lords supper as they supposed in the bread and wine which they set apart , but going from the institution of christ , the apostle denies it to be the lords supper . i therefore say you do not baptise at all , because you have lost the institution of christ . mr. fort. well , well , but first let me hear what you have to say for these unlawful meetings which i have endeavoured to suppress . t. grantham . i am not so much a stranger to the meetings you speak of , but i think they may be defended , but yet i suppose it the best way to try our principles , for if they be good , our meetings to promote good principles need not offend you , and truly till this day , i did not understand that our meetings should be the subject of our dispute . mr. fort. i perceive those that have informed you have done you some injury , for i did say , that your meetings were unlawful and therefore i opposed them , and seeing you have not premidated this , i will not surprize you , but will consent to dispute their principles . t. grantham . sir i thank you for that , and i desire that the questions may be fairly stated to contain the points in difference about the doctrine of baptism . mr. fort. well , i agree to that , and pray do you state the questions if you please . t. grantham . the questions then may be these , ( viz. ) qu. 1. whether your way of baptising , be the right way of baptising ? qu. 2. whether infants ought to be baptised ? mr. fort. well , let these be the questions , i say our way of baptisi●g i● right , and that infants ought to be baptised , and do you prove the contrary if you can . t. grantham . although you ought to prove what you affirm , yet i will accept your offer , and shall shew , that your pretended way of baptising is not the right way of baptising , and that infants ought not to be baptised , and first i argue thus . arg. 1. holy scripture doth shew what is the right way of baptising , holy scripture doth not shew sprinkling or crossing is the right way of baptising , ergo your way of baptising is not the right way of baptising , mr. fort we do not say that sprinkling or crossing is baptising , neither did i ever sprinkle any in all my life , t. g. then you contradict your brethren , whose constant practice is known to be sprinkling and crossing the fore-head , yea you contradict your own common prayer-book , for there your direction is to sprinkle and cross the infant . mr. fort. i confess our old common prayer-book did use the word sprinkle , but we have now altered it , and it is only baptise in the new common prayer-book . t. grantham , i confess reformation is no error , it seems then by your own grant your first book was faulty , and for your practise it is still the same , and i pray , as you are a schollar tell us plainly , doth the word baptise signifie to sprinkle ? m. fort. no , i do not say it doth the word that signifies sprinkling is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 t. g. in that you say well , and now pray answer to my argument , for it proves sprinkling is not the way of baptising . mr. fort. i have told you we do not say that sprinkling is baptising , neither do we make the cross any part of baptism . tho. grantham . you do certainly make the cross an appurtenance in your baptism , for you will excommunicate such as refuse to use it in baptism , and for sprinkling i appeal to this assembly , who can witness it 's the common practice of your ministry to sprinkle the fore-head , and it is remarkable that you cannot stand by your practice now it is opposed . i desire you to answer the argument . mr. fort. i have answered it for i do not sprinkle , but i always pour water upon those whom i baptise , and for my own part i was dipped , and so according to your own judgement rightly baptised . t. grantham . if you were dipped then you had more done to you then your brethren in that case , and so you are divided in your practice nor is your pouring water on the fore-head baptising and therefore answer the argument . mr. fort. here mr. fort and the other ministers spake together disowning sprinkling , and saying they did not make the cross necessary in baptism , for ( say they ) in private baptism it is not used . t. grantham . you know that the papists allow of midwife to pour water out of a glass upon the infant , which they account a valid baptism yet at other times they make their ceremonies necessary , and so do you the cross , performing in the name of the father , son and holy spirit . mr. fort. that is not so , we do not perform it in the name of the father , son , and holy spirit , therefore you wrong us . t. grantham . this is strange , for either you do it in the name of the lord , or in your own name , if you do it in your own name pray tell us so , but you answer not the argument , therefore i proceed . arg. 2. that which renders the practise of christ and his apostles supers●●ous , ●r ridiculous , is not the right way of baptising . but your pretended way of baptising renders the practice of christ and his disciples superfluous , or ridiculous , ergo. your way of baptising is not the right way of baptising . mr. fort. the minor is denyed our way of baptising doth not render the practice of christ or his disciples superfluous or ridiculous . t. grantham . the minor i evince by this demonstration , he that considers how christ and his disciples were baptised , and did baptise in rivers or places of much water and you on the other side take a little water on your finger ends , or in your hand only , must needs conclude that either they did too much , or you do too little ; now thus it is written , mat. 3 jesus when he was baptized came up streight way out of the water , mark 1. they were all baptized in the river of jordan , confessing their sins . john baptised in enon because there was much water there . phillip and the eunuch went both down into the water . now if your putting a few drops of water on the fore-head only , be sufficient then the other must needs be superfluous , yea ridiculous . mr. fort. this does not prove the minor , for we do not deny dipping , and i pray what do you mean when you say our way renders christs to be ridiculous . t. grantham . i mean a thing to be laughed at , and put the case you had occasion to wash your hands only , would it not be ridiculous to see you go into the river to do it ? even does thus your pretended way of baptising , render the way of christ ridiculous and reflects dishonour on him and his followers , as if they were not so wise as you , to know the best way to be baptized , but we are resolved to follow christ though we differ from you . mr. fort. yes , the word ridiculous doth signifie so much , but yet i deny that our practise doth reflect upon christs , for though in these hot countreys they did dip in rivers , yet it was not necessary in these colder countreys to do so , for christ hath not commanded that . t. grantham . then you confess it was the practice of the first christians to dip in rivers , and i ask you whether they did this by a command or not ? mr. fort. yes , i grant they did it by a command . t. grantham . then you have granted sufficient to overthrow your practice , and to confirm ours , unless you can also shew a command for sprinkling . mr. fort. i have told you i do not sprinkle . t. grantham . the contrary is the known practice of your ministry , and yours is little differing , i proceed to another argument . arg. 3. that which brings unavoidable confusion into the church is not the right way of baptising : but your way of baptising doth bring unavoidable confusion into the church . ergo , your way of baptising is not the right way of baptising mr. fort. our practice in baptising as we do , doth not bring confusion into the church . t. grantham . i shew the contrary thus , your way of baptising admits of as many several ways , as there are parts in a mans body ; for whether the fore-head , the breast , back , hand or foot , or some other part ought to be only sprinkled , or whether any of these may not serve , you can shew no reason , so that you thus bring confusion into the church : mr fort. the head being the most honourable part of mans body , we therefore chuse the head and think that the best . t. grantham this is only your imagination , and if i think otherwise , and so chuse the breast , you cannot shew this to be a greater errour then your own , but i proceed . arg. 4. that which renders all men uncertain whether they do the will of god or not , is not the right way of baptising , but your way of baptising doth render all men uncertain whether they do the will of god or not , ergo , your way of baptising is not the right way of baptising . mr. fort i deny that our way renders men uncertain , whether they do the will of god or not . t. g. god hath not assigned any one part of the body to be baptised , and not another , therefore no man that follows your way can tell whether he do the will of god or not , in following your way : arg. 5. that way which doth not signifie that which ought to be represented in baptism is not the right way of baptising . but your pretended way doth not signifie that which ought to be represented in baptism . ergo. your way of baptising is not the right way of baptising . mr fort. our way of baptising doth signifie the cleansing of the conscience from sin which is the thing that ought to be signified in baptism : t. g. no action of mans devising may be said to signifie the cleansing our conscience● from sin , but my argument refers to the whole signification of baptism , and particularly the burial of christ and others with him , rom. 6 we are buried with him in baptism , and the scripture cannot be broken , therefore baptism must so be performed as to signifie these things : arg. 6. that which agrees not with the native signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is not the right way of baptising . but your way agrees not with the native signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : ergo , your way is not the right way of baptising . mr. fort the minor is denied , our practice agrees with the signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : t. g. i desire you to shew the place which mentions such a washing as you practice , where the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is taken to express the sacred act of baptism : mr. fort. it is said the pharises did wash their cups and beds ; here the word baptizo is used , yet they did not dip them . t. grantham . i call'd for a text wher the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is used to express the sacred act of baptism , and that signifies your manner of washing , and instead of this , you bring me a place which speaks of the pha. rises washing cups and beds , and yet even this place is against you , for they that wash defiled cups and beds do more then sprinkle them , or poure a little water upon them , as you do on the infants fore-head ; and here give me leave to urge some authorities for the sigsiification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to be a dipping of the thing denominated baptized , and first i urge the greek grammer , where the radix is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and rendred , mergo , immergo , to dip or plunge . mr. fort. i will not regard the greek grammar . t. grantham . this is strange ! will you take upon you to correct the greek grammar . mr. fort. yes that i will , i will not believe the greek grammar . t. grantham . i suppose you would correct our bibles too if you could , but till this be done give us leave to believe the grammar which we have for i do not expect a better from you ; my next authority is that of channer , who saith 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 estingo quod fit immergendo portinctionem , & inundationem . mr. fort. i have not seen that author . t. grantham . then i give you another : an brose saith , ergofratres tingi debens 〈◊〉 fonte quo christus . therefore brethren we must be dipped in the same fountain with christ , that we may be one with christ , and to this agree the decrees of some councells . mr. fort. pray assign those counsells that decreed such a thing if you can . t. grantham . the forth toleton counsell ( which is ratified in the decretalls ) saith proter vitandum schismatis scandulum , & ● . wherefore to avoid the scandal of schism ▪ let us in baptism dip but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and saith the counsell of worms ▪ in aquas demersio in infernum est , & rursus ab aquis emersio resurrectio est . mr. fort. well i have told you i was dipped yet i had but my head only dipped , and for my part i do not use sprinkling at all . t. grantham . sir , i have shewed how therein you contradict your brethren and the church of england , and it 's observable that you cannot stand by your way of baptising , and hereby you give this assembly just cause to suspect their baptism , but i proceed . arg. 7. that practice which was innovated long after the institution of baptism is not the right way of baptising . but your way was innovated long after the institution of baptism . ergo , your way is not the right way of baptising . mr. fort. i deny that our way was innovated long after the institution of baptism . t. grantham . i can prove it was innovated long after the institution of baptism by your own doctors . for example , hugo grotius who confesses so much in his judgement on sundry points controverted , also the learned marquess of worcester in his conference with his late majesty confesses that their church ( to wit the papists ) changed baptism from dipping over head and ears to a little sprinkling upon the forehead , and wallridus strabo de rebus ecclesiae , that the first christians were baptized simply in floods and fountains , yea i can prove by our own chronicles that there were about ten thousand baptised in one day in the river swale in york-shire , from all which it appears your way of sprinkling is an innovation . mr. w mr. wright one of the ministers that sat by was very angry and stood up , saying ; you speak all , it is not fit you should speak so much . t. grantham to whom t. g. replyed sir you ought not to be angry ; i do not interrupt mr. fort , and he hath time to speak what he hath to say : therefore blame not me sith i hear as well as speak . mr. fort. pray mr wright be not angry ; i promised it should be a peaceable dispute . t. grantham . because i would give place that mr. fort ●ight have time to prove his practice , i would now proceed to the second question , ( viz ) qu. 2. whether infants ought to be baptized , i am to prove they ought not , which i thus do , arg. 1. holy scripture doth shew who are to be baptized , holy scripture d●th not shew that infants ought to be baptised . ergo , infants ought not to be baptised . mr. fort. holy scripture doth shew that infants ought to be baptised . thomas grantham . if holy scripture doth shew that infants ought to be baptised , then some body can shew where it may be found , but no body can shew us where such a scripture may be found . ergo holy scripture doth not shew that infants ought to be baptised . mr. fort. i can shew where it may be found , and i will prove that infants ought to be baptised , from mat. 28 19. t. grantham sir , you mistake your place , for you are not now to prove , but to answer me , nor doth the text you mention speak of infant baptism at all . mr. fort. the word is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 make disciples in all nations baptising them , but infants are part of the nations that are to be baptised . t. grantham . you do violate the law of disputing , for being my respondent you ought not to argue . now for the text it is read thus 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 &c. now for the explication of the verb 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , i refer you to john the 4 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 here disciples are made such by actual teaching : ergo , infants cannot be made disciples according to mat. 28. 19. mr. fort. i deny , that it is necessary to understand an actual teaching by the w●rd 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 t. g. the very reading of the text gives it against you , for it saith go teach all nations , ●twas an act to be done by the apostles . mr. fort. i tell you infants of believers are disciples and need no act to make them so . t. g. that cannot be , they must be made disciples either by god or man before they can be disciples , however they cannot be disciples according to mat. 28. because that is interpreted by your self to make disciples , ( viz ) by the apostles . mr. fort. but there is no necessity to understand an actual teaching of all that are to be made disciples . t. grantham . it can have no other signification , as i shall shew by your own criticks , who tell us that the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 est disco , to learn or get knowledge and in the hebrew 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 & 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 comes of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 didict and is rendred dicens ab alio , which agrees with the syriack 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the arab. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 this fully accords with mark 16. 16. go preach the gospel to every creature and hence i argue . if those that are to be baptised according to mat. 28. 19. must first be made by actual teaching or learning from another , then no infant ought to be baptised according to this text but the first is true : ergo , so is the latter . mr. fort. i will prove that infants ought to be baptised as being disciples from acts 15. why tempt ye god to put a yoke upon the necks of the disciples ? this is spoken of infants , and therefore they are disciples . t. g. sir , i marvel you should no better observe the law of disputing which i must hold you to , and the rather because you were pleas●d to glory so much over your poor neighbours because of your skill in logick , and now i will shew your mistake of this text by the prosecution of my next argument which is this . arg 2 none ought to be baptised but such as are christs disciples , according to the gospel use of that expression . infants are not christs disciples according to the gospel use of that ●●pression . ergo infants ought not to be baptized . mr. fort. i deny the minor , infants are christs disciples according to the gospel use of that expression . t. grantham . none are christs disciples according to the gospel use of that expression , but such as take up their cross daily and follow christ , but infants do not so . ergo , to this agree the words of christ , luk. 12. mr. fort. this place speaks of persons of years , and not of infants . t. grantham . i grant it , and so doth every text that speaks of christs disciples according to the gospel use of that expression . mr. fort. not so , for i will shew a place where infants are called disciples , acts 15. here such as were to be circumcised after the manner of moses are called disciples and you know infants were circumcised after the maaner of moses . t. grantham . that infants were circumcised after the manner of moses is true , and that the false apostles would have put the yoke upon all the disciples is true , but that every one upon whom they would have put that yoke were disciples is not true ; i will expound this text by another , acts 4. 32. here we are informed that the multitude of them that believed had all things common ▪ yet it doth not follow that all that had part in these common things were believers , for infants had part in common things , and yet were no believers , for it 's said the multitude of them that believed were of one heart , and one soul. mr. fort. that text doth not expound the other . t. grantham . let them be diligently compared , and you will find that a man may as well prove infants believers from the one , as you can prove them disciples from the other , but i proceed . arg. 3. none ought to be baptized but those whose duty it is to be born again of water and of the spirit . it is not the duty of infants to be born again of water and the spirit . ergo , infants ought not to be baptised . mr. fort. i except against the term duty in your argument . t. grantham . why so ? mr. fort. there are four terms in your argument ; t. grantham . this is but an evasion , and no answer , you cannot shew four terms in it . mr. fort. i say infants ought to be born again of water and of the spirit . t. grantham . here you grant that they ought to be born again of water , and of the spirit , and yet deny it to be their duty , this is no good distinction to make the new birth no part of mans duty , but i will prove that whosoever is born again must therein perform duty , i joh. 5. whatsoever is born of god overcometh the world , and this is the victory even our faith : certainly to believe and overcome the world is something of duty . mr. fort , this place speaks not of infants , but of persons which are adult , t. grantham i grant it , but withall i say this text speaketh of whatsoever is born of god , and saith christ , every one that is born of the spirit is like the wind that bloweth so as the sound thereof is heard now can you imagine your infants are born again of the spirit , seeing they give not any demonstration of it ? mr. fort. you still insist upon places which speak of adult persons . t. grantham . i have told you that all the scriptures which speak of the new birth of water and of the spirit , speaks of adult persons , or if any speak of infants pray shew us where they are . arg ▪ 4. no sinners ought to be baptized , but those of whom faith and repentance is first required , faith and rep●ntance are not required of infants . e●go , infants are not such sinners as ought to be baptized . mr. fort. this argument is like the rest , you still insist upon those things wh●●h are the duty of adult persons . t. grantham your conscience tells you that i insist upon those things which are the duty of all that are to be baptised ; yea your vulgar catechism teacheth us that faith and repentance are required of all that are to be baptised , but seeing you answer not , but evade only , i shall proceed . arg. 5. all that ought to be buried with christ in baptism , ought first to be dead with him from the rudiments of the world . infants ought not to be dead with christ from the rudiments of the world . ergo , infants ought not to be baptised . mr. fort. i deny the consequence . t. grantham . no sir , you cannot deny the consequence in a categoricall syllogism , so that you must either distinguish , or deny one of the propositions . mr. fort. well then , i deny your major . t. g. i need but only shew the absurdity of this your denyal , for you say in effect that so●e are to be buried before they be dead , now that all christians in rome and coloss were dead with christ , before they were buried with him in baptism , is evident , rom. 6 , 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , colos . 2. 10 , 11 , 12. and is as true of all other churches , by which it is plain that no infants were then , nor ought now to be baptised . arg. 6. such only ought to be baptised as christ and his apostles did baptise , or appointed to be baptised , but neither christ nor his apostles baptised any infants , n●r appointed them to be baptised , ergo. m. fort. christ did appoint infants to be baptised , and said suffer little children to come unto me and forbid them not , mat. 18. t. grantham , all that can fairly be inferred of this passage is this , that if any desire the prayers of the ministers of christ for their children &c. they may lawfully pray for such blessings as they have need of ; but if any presume to baptise them , they do more to them then christ did , or any other by his appointment . mr. fort. the jaylor and all his were baptised , and how can you think there were no infants in his house . t. grantham . the very reading of this text doth shew , that there were no infants baptised , for first the word was preached to him and to all that were in his house , secondly he rejoyced believing in god with all his house : i desire no better evidence against your infant baptism then the place you bring for it . arg. 7. all that are to be baptised ought therein to worship god in spirit and truth , as also in other general duties of the n●w testament . but infants ought not to worship god in spirit and in truth in baptism , nor any other general duty of the new testainent . ergo , infants ought not to be baptised . mr. fort. what do you mean by the general duties of the new testa ent ? t , g. i mean prayer , hearing the word , and communion at the lords table according to acts. 2. 41. 42. mr. fort this is spoken of grown persons , and not of infants . t. grantham . this is spoken of all that were baptised in the first church , whose pattern we ought to sollow rather then the innovations of men. mr. fort. your way is an innovation not much above two hundred years old . tho. grantham . not so , for our way of baptising began in the days of john the baptist , and for our opposing infant baptism 't is very antient , for as soon as we hear it mentioned we find it opposed by tertullian who lived in the third century : mr. fort. tertullian is conceived to oppose only the baptising of the children of unbelievers : t. g. that is a great mistake , his words are indefinite , for he saith , veniant ergo dum adolescunt , veniant dum discunt , dum quo veniant decentur , fiant christiam cum christum nosse potuerint . mr. w mr. wright who was one of the other priests , stood up and said , let the business be put to that issue , for you only have tertullian for the antients , and he was a mantanists . t. grantham . if he must be lightly looked at because he was in some errour , as that of montanus , then you must lay aside most of the antient fathers who also had their errours , but you are mistaken tertullian was not the only person among the antients that opposed infant baptism , for greg. nazianzene did likewise disswade from it . mr. wright . we have irenaeus before tertullian who speaks for infant baptism for he saith infantes pueris senis . t. grantham , you act his words amiss , for it is not senis but seniores . mr. wright . it is senis , it is senis . t. grantham , you mistake it is s●niores , and beside irenaeus speaks not of baptism , only he useth the words , renascunter in d●um . mr. fort the antients understood by them words to be baptized . t. g. it is inconvenient so to interpret ir●●eus in this place ; for then it would follow that unless infants be baptised they cannot be saved , which is absurd , but i desire you to answer to the argument mr. fort seemed not disposed to give any surther answer : then t. grantham said i have propounded and prosecuted 7 arguments against your pretended way of baptising ▪ and 7 against your infant subject , of what weight they are , and how you have answered them , we are no proper judges ▪ but must leave that to the auditors ; now because i would not take up the whole time , i desire you to be opponent , and i will answer you : i conclude with the words of aug●stine , nec ego te , nec tu me , sed ambo audiamus christi in scrip●●res . mr. fort opponent . i am now to prove our way of baptising to be the right way of baptising , and that infants ought to be baptised . arg. 1. if our way of baptising doth signifie that which ought to be signified in baptism then it is the right way of baptising . but our way of baptising doth signifie that which ought to be signified in baptism . ergo , it is the right way of baprising . t. grantham . if you mean that your way of baptising doth signifie all that ought to be signified in baptism , then i deny the minor , and we have before shewed how short it comes of the true and full signification of baptism . mr. fort. our way of baptising signifies the washing away of sins , and it agrees with the signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is to wash , therefore it is sufficient . t. grantham . the contrary to this hath been shewed and i now deny that every kind of washing agrees with the signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 when used to express the sacred act of baptising , and i desire you to shew one text where that word is taken for a washing the fore-head only when the sacred act of baptising is expressed by it ▪ mr fort. the jaylor was baptised at midnight ; and do you think he had a river in his house ? t. grantham you are much mistaken the jaylor went out to be baptised : mr. fort. you cannot make that appear . t. grantham . yes the reading of the text is plain to that purpose , for it is said he was baptised , he , and all his straightway , and then it follows , and when he had brought them into his house , he set meat before them . mr. fort. that may be meant of carrying them out of one room into another t. grantham . this is contrary to common sence ; you cannot speak your conscience in this . mr. fort. i have shewed our way of baptizing is sufficient , i will now prove that infants ought to be baptised . arg , 2 ▪ if infants are within the covenant of grace then they ought to be sealed with the seal of the covenant , and by consequence to be baptised . but infants are within the covenant of grace and ough to be sealed , &c , ergo , they ought to be baptized . t. grantham . before i answer your argument give me leave to ask you a question ▪ how many seals belong to the covenant of grace , and what be they ? mr. fort. there are two seals of the covenant , to wit , baptism , and the lords supper : t , g. then i deny your minor proposition from your own practice , for you deny infants one of these seals , to wit , the lords supper , though you confess them to be within the covenant , and we by as good reason deny the other seal to belong to infants : mr. fort. yes , we have better reason for the one then you have for the other , for it is said ; let a man examine himself , and so let him eat . t. grantham . 1. it is also said , repent and be baptised every one of you , acts 2. ●8 . if thou believest with all thine heart thou maist . 2. i might answer your instance out of your own mouth , by saying this is meant of persons of years , and not of infants , which as it is true so it shews the weakness of your answers to many of my arguments . mr. fort. i say infants being in the covenant they ought to be sealed with the seal ▪ and i pray tell me plainly whether you hold them in the coven●n● or no ? t. g. i say being in the covenant you mean the grace of eternal life by the death of christ , then i say all infants are so in the covenant of say but if by covenant you mean the duties of the covenant , then i 〈◊〉 infants are not so under the covenant . mr fort. you cannot prove that all infants dying in infancy shall be saved . t. g. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 if it were my business , i could and would prove it , but i am 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 you ▪ mr. fort. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to prove it if you can . t. grantham . then i prove it by the testimony of the apostle , who saith as in adam all dye , so in christ shall all be made alive , and again as by the offence of once the judgement came on all men to condemnation , so by the obedience of one the free gift abounded towards all men to justification of life . mr. fort. these places do not prove that all infants dying in infancy shall be saved ; for he speaks here only of the resurrection of the dead . t. g. these places do shew that what death and condemnation came on infants by adam is made void by the death of christ , and i desire you to answer me this question , whether you believe that any infants dying in infancy shall be damned ; mr. fort. yes i do be●ieve some infants dying in infancy shall be damned , ( here the people gave a general sigh as disliking so harsh a saying . ) t. g. then you are no friend to infants ; shall the lord tell us , the son shall not bear the iniquity of the father , and shall we no● believe him . mr. fort. the lord doth say he will visit the iniquities of the father upon the children unto the third and fourth generation . t. g. yea sir , but it is of them that hate him , but yet i grant in respect of temporal punishments the children do often bear the iniquities of their fathers , yea , all infants do bear the sin of their father adam to this day , but our discourse is of eternal condemnation , in which respect i say infants shall not bear the iniquity of their father , seeing christ saith of infants indefinitely , of such are the kingdom of god. mr. fort well i have shewed that infants being in the covenant ought therefore to be baptized , and it is said 1 cor. 7. that infants are holy and so they are in covenant with their believing parents . t. g : i have answered your argument by distinguishing betwixt the duty of the covenant , and the mercy of eternal life , in the first i say infants are not in the covenant , but in the other i say they are for they shall be saved by christ . and for the holiness the 1 cor. 7. it is expounded by erasmus , and others of your own doctors to be only a legi●timate holiness , and indeed being derived from the unbelievers being sanctified , it cannot fairly be understood of any other kind of cleanness then that which is matrimonial . mr. wright mr. w. interposed saying diodate doth expound that place of a covenant holiness . t. g. i grant he doth so , yet augustine far more antient then he saith , that whatsoever that ho●iness is it is certain it is not of power to make christians or remit sins . mr. e. i marvel you ●…ould deny infants the seal seeing you grant them to be in the covenant . t. g. i do not deny them the seal any more then your self , who deny them the lords supper , which was allowed them in old time for 600 years together . mr. f. what author saies so ? i do not think you can shew that in any good author . t. g. i can shew it from your own doctors in a learned treatise called a scholastical discourse about symbolising vvith anti-christ in ceremonies . mr. fort. infants being in the covenant are in the church , and therefore cannot be denyed baptism , t. grantham . i answer by the former distinction if by being in the covenant and in the church you mean the whole number of the saved : i grant infants to be in the covenant and in the church ; but if you mean those onlie who are in the actual profession of gospel ordinances , as baptism and the like , i say no scripture shews them to be so in the covenant . mr. fort repeating what he said before , rose up to go away , then tho. grantham said . gentlemen , though we differ in opinion , yet i desire we may endeavour to maintain the great duty of charitie towards each other , till god shall rectifie our judgements in these things . mr. w , mr. wright replied , saying it was not meet to place all our religion in these ●hings , but to walk in love one towards another , or to this effect , and thus in a f●iendlie manner the meeting was dissolved & everie man went away in peace . the next day the baptised christians met together to preach the word : mr. fort and mr. wright came to the meeting and i● a very civil manner assaied to discourse with them about the authoritie by which they preach , supposing that they had no ordinarie calling to the ministry , but when it was shewed them that no man was allowed to minister in the baptised churches in the capacity of a pastor or other officer , without due election and ordination by fasting and prayer , with the laying on of hands by the presbiterie , bishops , or overseers of the church ; they then onlie opposed that libertie of prophecie , which we allow , saying that gifted men in the church , as meer gifted christians might not praie , or expound the word in publick assemblies , we on the contrarie alledgd that gifted christians as such might lawfullie speak in the church to exhortation , &c. in a modest and humble manner for the improvement of gi●ts and the profit of the church . quoting to this purpose 1 pe. 4 , 10 , 11 ▪ 1 cor. 14. 31. acts 18. 25 26. we spent about half an hour in friendlie discourse about the meaning of those scriptures , but not agreeing in our expositions , mr. fort took his leave , and we proceeded in our work . finis . brief animadversions upon dr. stillingfleet's digressions about the baptising of infants , in his book intituled a rational account of the grounds of the protestant religion . &c. wherein the insufficiency of his grounds for infant baptism is discovered . by thomas grantham . job . 14. 4. who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean one . isa . 29. 16. surely your turning things upside down shall be esteemed as the petters clay . london , printed in the year , 1674. to the reader . it is not any conceit of my fitness to contend with learned men in the controversies depending about sacred baptism , which moves me to this present undertaking , but the experience i have of the mistake of some persons , who take the things brought by dr. stilling-fleet in favour of infant baptism , to be of greater weight then what hath been done by other men in that question , as also i might by this paper move some abler hand to reckon morefully and methodically with his new devices , if upon consideration they find themselves concerned to do it . but chiefly my aim is , to move , if it may be , the learned authour , to consider how much he injures the cause he manages against the papists , with so much judgement and learning , whilst he endeavours to support his traditional infant sprinkling ( for baptism it is not ) which being allowed , other innovations of popery , or other sects will certainly be supported together with it , as having the same grounds , and in some respect fairer pretences to obtrude upon the church of god , from all which errours let her be delivered , by the protection of the almighty , to whose grace i comit thee . thine to serve thee in christ . tho. grantham . brief animadversions upon dr. stillingfleet's digressions about the baptising of infants . solomon the wise , hath told us , there are many devices in mans heart . the truth whereof is verified in the multitude of devices old and new which men have found out to darken the counsell of god , teaching the sacred institution of the baptism of repentance for the remision of sins . nevertheless the counsell of god that shall stand , and therefore neither shall the devices of dr. stillingfleet prevail , nor be found ●o much as a rational account of the grounds of infant baptism , albeit divers persons are perswaded that he hath out-done others , that have undertaken to defend that innovation . 1. first , therefore we shall consider the two texts , john 3. 5. act. 2. 38 , 39. which he says , according to the interpretation of the fathers and the antient church and the papists themselves do evidently assert infant baptism ▪ it were answer sufficient to tell h●m , that what ever was the interpretation of the fathers , &c. yet , according to the interpretation of the protestants , the grounds of whose religion he presents to give an account off , these texts , doth not hold forth such a necessity of infant baptism , as by some of the antients was imagined , seeing the protestants do not say , as the papists and some before them , no baptism no salvation ; but they more truly teach , that this place is to be understood ( even as some of the fathers also expounded it ) of such as refuse or contemn baptism , and yet saying withall to your confutation , that it is not necessary by water , john , 3. 5. to understand the external rite of baptism . see fulk . ans . to the rhemists annot. john 3. so dr. willit synops . papis . however , it is evident to them that will not shut their eyes that in john 3. 5. christ is shewing the way of life , and the duties of regeneration to such as came to him for instruction , and spea●● nothing there , of the case of infants , who ( as one well observes ) cannot overcome the world , by reason of their natural incapacity to know either good or evil , and therefore are not obliged to the duties of the new birth , to wit , repentance , faith and baptism , for whatsoever is born of god overcometh the world , and this is the victory that overcometh the world even our faith . and hence it is evident that john 3. 5. cannot be understood of infants , who are wholly uncapable of the duties of regeneration . and as eviden● it is , that acts ● 38. 39. intends not infants seeing the persons there to be baptised , even every one of them , are required first to repent ; a duty of which infants are wholly uncapable ; and the promise there mentioned is clearly meant of the gi●ts of the holy ghost or the spirit of promise in a special manner , according to the prophesie of jo●l , the extent of which promise is only to the called of the lord , v●rse 39 ▪ and this interpretation also is avouched by learned protestants , see diodate on the text , and erasmus on the same ; dr jer. taylor in his book of confirmation doth fully expound this place , of the promise of the spirit both to the parents , and to the children , as they are the called of the lord , and not to infants in that capacity . lib. proph●cy . so then the pretended evidence of infant baptism from this place is taken away , because this tr●th is hence very evident , that calling by the word of the gospel regeneration ●y faith and repentance are the true antecedents to the baptism of every sinner . 2. secondly , dr st●lling-fleet states the q●estion between the baptists and the paed●-baptists after this manner . wh●ther our bless●d savio●r hath by a positive precept so determined the subject of baptism , viz. adult persons professing the faith , that the a●teration of the subject , in baptising infants be not a deviation from , a●d a p●rversion off the institution of christ in a substantial part of it ? 〈…〉 short , whether our saviour hath so determined the subject of bapt●sm as to exclude infants . this done he tells us that taking in only the help of scripture and reason , it were no difficult matter to ●rove directly that infants are so far from being excluded baptism by the institution of christ , that there are as many grounds as are necessary to a matter of that nature , to prove that the baptising 〈◊〉 is ●uita●le to the institution of ●hrist , and agreeable to the 〈◊〉 of the church under the gospel . so then , scripture and rea●on ●nly must now deside the controversie , let us hear therefore 〈…〉 st●ll●ng fleet brings from thence , and th●s he speaks . if there were any ground to exclude them it must be either the incapacity of the subject or some express precept and institution of our saviour , but neither of them can be supposed to do it . but i answer , for both these cau●es infants are not to be bapti●ed , and sith their incapacity depends upon the nature of the institution these two reasons are resolved into one ; now the institution of baptism , whether we consider it as delivered by god to his servant john , and by him to us ; or as it is established by precept from christ , for a perpetual ministry in his church to the end of the world ▪ we shall find it delivered by both in such sort , as it is exclusive of infants ; for , in the first place it is deli●ered as the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins ; mark 1. 4. and every sinner who is said to be baptised by him , is said to be baptised confessing their sins , verse 5. which we know is not to be expected of infants . the precept of our saviour for the perpetuity of baptism so expresly requires the making every subject a disciple in order thereunto , and that by actual teaching , or preaching the gospel to them , mat. 28. 19. mark 16 15 ▪ according to christs own example , who so made disciples before they were baptised , that no infant with any shew of scripture or reason can possibly be brought within the reach of baptism according to it's institution ; in a word dr. st●ll●ng-fl●et seems , in so many words , to grant in his first state of the question that to bring infants to baptism , is an alteration of the subject , and therefore not agreeable to the institution of christ , in which to admit of alterations is very dangerous . but saith dr. s. the rule and measure as to the capacity of divine institutions must be fetched from the end of them , for this was the ground ef the circumcision of proselites under the law. answer , that the ground of the circumcision of proselites was fetched from the end of the institution , is not true . and indeed had it been left to that , mens various conceits about the ends of such institutions might have made as ill work , as we see yours do now ▪ wherefore the wisdom of god to prevent those dangers , gave express order in that case as appears , gen 17. 13. compared with exod. 12. 44. 48. and when a stranger shall sojourn with thee , and will keep the passeover , let all his males be circumcised , and verse 49 , one law shall be to him that is home born , and unto the strager that sojourneth among you . thus we see the law is as express for the circumcising proselites and their males , as for israel themselves diodate also expounds the first place by the second ( the servant that is born ) meaning ( saith he ) the proselite who of his own free will shall add himself to the church by the profession of gods true worship . but now , if we admit dr. s. his rule , that the measure as to the capacity of divine institutions , must be fetched from the ends thereof , yet will he be so farr from gaining , that he will quite lose his cause . for , if by the ends of baptism he means the things signified in baptism ( as that he does , for he said they who are capable of the thing signified ought not to be denyed the sign ) then we shall certainly gain one thing out of two and either of them will serve our turn to shew his mistake , viz. either infants are not capable of baptism , becau●e not capable of all things signified thereby , or else that the protestants do violate their own rule in denying infants some other holy signs , as general as baptism , when yet they are capable of some of the things signified thereby , and this shall evidently appear ●y running the parralell between us , as to the grounds upon which you deny infants the priviledge of the lords table , and we deny them baptism . and first . 1 the things signified by the lords table ( as the ends of that institution ) is christ crucified for us , and to c●me again to receive us to him●elf , of these mercies infants are capable , because they shall be saved by the death and comming of the lord jesus , thus they have the thing signified ▪ yet you deny them the sign because they understand not the thing represented by the sign . answerable to this we say , by baptism is signified the death and resurection of christ and our salvation thereby , of this mercy signified in baptism infants are capable but yet the sign is not given to them because they understand not the thing signified thereby . 2. the ends , or things signified by the lords table , on our part are , the profession of our fa●th , the manifestation of our union with the church , &c. of these ends infants are not capable , therefore then do not admit them to the lords ta●le . answerable to this we say , the things signified in baptism on our ●●rt , are the profession of o●r faith , and manifestation of our union 〈◊〉 the saints , &c. of these ends ●nfants are not capable , therefore 〈…〉 them not to baptism . 3. our coming to the lords table holds forth abstainence f●om the levened bread of malice and wickedness , and our feeding upon the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth ; of these ends ( as they are duties ) infants are not capable , therefore you admit them not to the lords table . answerable to this we say , baptism holds forth our death to sin , and the newness of life from our baptism to the end , of these ends of baptism infants are not capable , and therefore we admit them not to baptism , for the rule and measure as to the capacity of divine institutions is to be fetched from the ends of them . the same might be said concerning the imposition of hands with prayer for the spirit of promise , seeing it was practised by the apostles upon the newly baptised indifferently yet you admit no infants to this divine institution , though you suppose them to be baptised , although according to protestant doctrine they are capable of the promise act. 2. 38 , 39. and the benediction signified , and obtained thereby by which your inconsistancy with your own rule is further manifested and hence i infer ( according to your own words ) by a parity of reason built on equal grounds , you ought not to baptise infants because the rule and measure , as to divine institutions , or the capacity of the subjects ther●of are to be fetched from the ends thereof . not from some ends only ( and those too only which we please ) as dr. s doth unadvisedly teach , for so there would be no man , or but very few , but might be brought to baptism , or other ordinances , seeing they are capable of several things signified therein , as the death of christ for the sins of the world and his resurection , by which all shall rise again ; and whether they believe it or no , yet he is the lord that bought them , and a mediator between god and them , that his long-suffering might lead them to repentance wherefore your instance of our saviours being baptised without repentance avails you nothing , unless you were a le to prove a special case to be a general rule for the practise of ordinances , which yet you cannot but know is pernicious many ways , nor can you rationally believe that because christ who was no sinner was baptized without repentance , that therefore you must baptise sinners without repentance also ; if otherwise , then why may not persons be admitted to the lords table without self examination , seeing christ did partake of it without self examination , having no need to do so ? certainly though christ did this it shall never be demonstrated that the members of his church may do it without self examination , and yet thus went the matter in old time for hundreds of years together , so true is the maxim admit one absurdity and more will follow . but to make an end of this , its evident : christ in being baptised did his duty to god , and had he not been baptised he had not fulfilled all righteousness ; let it now be shewed that it●s the duty of infants to be baptised , or that they or any body else commits sin in refusing infant baptism , and then we shall stand upon no further capacity on their part nor oppose this instance as to the end for which it is brought but till this be done we justly reject such argumentation . neither is it true , that what we say of the incapacity of infants &c. reflects upon the wisdom of god in appointing circumcision for infants , for gods command made them fit subjects for it , together with the nature of the covenant which he made with abraham , and his , according to the flesh , which covenant he also ordained to be in their flesh by circumcision , gen. 17. 13. now therefore when it shall appear , that the covenant of the gospel , ( i mean it , as established by christ in his church ) is made with any man and his seed according to the flesh , and that god hath required the gospel covenant should be in their flesh by baptism , and so every infant born of them , or servant bought with money to be baptised we shall then grant that to insist on the incapacity of infants would reflect upon the wisdom of god , but sith this neither is , nor can be done , all these pretended reflections falls really upon dr. s. for denying infants the lords supper , because of their incapacity , who yet were admitted to the passeover , of which they were as uncapable as of the lords table . what the dr. says further of the ends of baptism to represent and exhibit the nature of the grace of the gospel and to confirm the truth of the covenant on gods part : we have considered before , and to what you here add , saying , it instates the partakers of it in the priviledges of the church of god , i answer , that though the dr. speaks right according to the right administration of baptism , yet according to his way of infant baptism it is not so , seeing we all know , infants ( while such ) though sprinkled have no more priviledge in your church then those who are not sprinkled , for the priviledges next following baptism , is to be taught to observe all things whatsoever christ commanded , and to continue in fellowship with the church in breaking of bread and prayer , acts 2 42. ma. 28. 20. now to tell us that infants are instated in these things , and yet whilst infants have nothing at all to do with them is too gross a vanity . for , if you say they are instated in these priviledges upon future contingences , viz. repentance , faith and newness of life according to the gospel , i answer when this comes to pass they are no infants , nor as infants partake of these priviledges , but as those that are now the sons of god by faith , and thus truly all infants are instated in church priviledges as soon as born , seeing by the death of christ they have a right upon the conditions of the gospel when capable to perform them , thus you mislead the world with a specious pretence of instating their infants in church priviledges , when 't is only an empty sound of words . but the jews infants as they were instated in the priviledges of their church , by circumision , so they entred upon the enjoyment of their priviledges in infancy , appearing by gods commandment three times a year in the temple with the offerings accustomed and to partake of the passeover , with the congregation or family where it was eaten . the dr. saith , nothing can seem wanting of the ends of baptism ( in respect of infants ) but that which seems most cerimonial which is the personal restipulation , which yet may reasonably be supplyed by sponsors , &c. that there is much wanting beside this restipulation in your infant baptism is shewed before , and it is unadvisedly said that the restipulation of the person baptised is the most ceremonial thing in baptism , seeing it is the moral and substantial part being indeed our covenanting with god and in truth the external washing is far more ceremonial as appears 1 pet. 3. 21. and for your saying that the personal restipulation in baptism may be reasonably supplyed by godf●thers , is very much below the reason of any christian to affirm ; but is it so ? that sponsors may supply the personal restipulation , which is the greater , then let them also supply the lesser , to wit sprinkling with water , which they can better perform , then the covenant they make for the infant , and then the whole business will appear to have the same reasonableness in every part ▪ viz , wholly unreasonable . thus much touching the capacity of infants ▪ &c. next the dr tells us , that in the institution of baptism there is neither direct nor consequential prohibition of infants to be baptized , and that there is nothing of that nature pretended before the 〈◊〉 comission , mat. 28. 19. but here is a mistake , and its strange he never observed that it hath often been demonstrated that , as when circumcision first appeared in the world , it clearly took in the infants of those to whom it was first given , so , accordingly it was propagated ; but when baptism first appeared in the world , it as clearly left out the infants of those to whom it was first ministred , and accordingly was propagated by the holy apostles ▪ insomuch that of the many thousands , and famous churches , that were baptised , all the world is not able to shew so much as one infant to have been baptised in any one of them , nor one word of precept for so doing , and if this be not so much as a consequential prohibition of infant baptism , i shall never believe that the dr. or any else can shew me so much as a consequential prohibition , of infants receiving the lords supper , the imposition of hands &c. and though the dr. consider never so much what apprehensions the apostles had concerning the church state of such as were in external covenant with god , yet he cannot rationally imagine that they should measure the state of the gospel churches by the reason of the covenant which god made with the jews and their seed according to the flesh . seeing it is expresly said from henceforth , to wit from the vanishing of the old covenant , know we no man after the flesh — but now if any man be in christ he is a new creature . and now men are not to be accounted of the church because they are abraham ▪ s seed , but they are accounted abraham ▪ s seed by being in the church of christ , gal. 3. 29. if ye be christs then are you abraham 's seed , and heirs according to promise . neither is it true that christ commanded his apostles to gather whole nations into churbes , as the dr. affirms , neither did the apostles gather any one whole nation , or city into a church s●ate that we read of , therefore churches consisting of whole nations , men , women and infants , are not apostollical but this the apostles did they taught many nations , 1. v. their sound went through many nations , not that they taught all manner of persons in the nations , for they taught no infants , and the persons by them gathered into the church , were only such as received their doctrine , as appears by those families where their gospel was received , the husband sometimes opposite to the wife , and otherwhiles the wife to the husband servants and masters likewise differing in the same family about christianity , 1. cor. 7. if then the apostles did not gather whole families into a church state unless they did wholly believe , act. 16. how-should any man imagine , they gathered whole nations ? the greatest part whereof by all experience are wicked persons yea in those very nations , which men pretend to have made into churches of christ of which would god england were not so full an evidence as it is this day . the dr. grants that the order of words mat. 28 , 19. ( teach all nations baptising them ) was necessary for those who were then to be proselited to christianity . and we say they are as necessary for the generations following , who have as much need of true faith and repentance ▪ or the first principles of christianity in order to their being christians , as them that went before , and it is a pernitious alteration of the order of christs commission , to out-run it●s direction so , as to make persons to be christians , before they do or can know the least title of christianity . the case which the dr. puts , about going to disciple the indians baptising them , is not at all rational , but upon the pre-supposition , that the person so doing , to have seen or known them , that gives him his authority to baptise infants , and then indeed it 's rational to suppose such a person would not understand that the words , disciple the indians baptising them , would exclude infants . but yet i must also say , that his ground to believe so could not arise from the words themselves but from the practice presupposed . wherefore the apostles having direction to teach all nations baptising them , without the least knowledge of any infants baptized by any baptists which were before them , or from whom they received their authority , here is no place for the drs. suppositions at all . as little cause hath he to think that had any one said to abraham he that believeth and is circumcised shall be saved , it ought so to have been interpreted , as that infants ought to be circumcized . for if this had been all the rule given for circumcision , it must of necessity have been limited to such as believe only , and unless the dr. know how from good ground to satisfie his conscience , that infants are believers of that which is taught or preached according to mark 16. ( which place he aludes unto ) he must so limit the diversion for baptising . but if indeed he take infants to be such believers , then he is answered by dr. hammond in his let. of resol . p. 297. who saith , as for the question whether infants have faith ? i profess my self to be none of those who are concerned in it . i freely confess to believe , faith to be so necessarily founded in understanding , that they that have not understandisg cannot have faith , whethe actual or habitual . the conclusion therefore is , sith in the case you put , the word ( believe ) cannot concern infants , and that they must be deemed capable of salvation , though they believe not , it is every way safe to think them unconcern●d in the other duty , that passage mark 16. 16. or any other like unto it notwithstanding . finally the dr. proposes five considerations about the suitableness of in●ant baptism to the administration of things under the gospel , and first he saith . 1. that if it had been christs intention to exclude infants , there had been far greater reason for an express prohibition then for an express command , if his intention were to admit them , because this was suitable to the general grounds of gods dispensation among them before . answer , here is little said but what hath been answered before , and may be answered by saying , had it been christs intention that infants should not be admitted to the lords table there had been more need of an express prohibition , &c. then of an express command , &c. because suitable to gods dispensations among them before . thus argumentum ad hominem . but i answer further , it is dangerous arguing to our present right to sacraments , from gods dispensations among the jews , seeing the state of the church , and the di●pensation is so much altered as that the former was but carnal , in respect of the spirituality of the other . 2. the dr. saith , it is very hard to conceive that the apostles thought infants excluded by christ , when after christs ascention they looked upon themselves bound to observe the jewish customes , even when they had baptized many thousands , answer , it is ill said that the apostles were bound to observe any such jewish customes because of any suitableness between them and things under the gospel ( which is the mark you ought to hit or you say nothing ) but the reason why they did observe such customes for a time , was the weakness of the jews , and we find the apostles did as speedily put a period to such customes as they could acts 15. 24. to 32. acts 1645. which clearly shews jewish customes was not suitable to things under the gospel , and here circumcision one of the chief of jewish rites , is clearly abolished among the rest , so that a man would think infant baptism should never have been built upon it . 3. the dr saith if admission of infants to baptism were a meer relique of judaism , it seems strange that none of the judaizing christians should be charged with it ; who yet are charged with the observation of other judaical r●tes .. answer , i find no man saying that infant baptism was a relique of judaism , save dr. hammond , and some from him , and he indeed would make believers baptism also a jewish relique whiles he teaches that the jews baptising proselites , and their children was the original , and the baptism ●f the christian church but the coppy , by which device he hath opened a gap to our late n●tionists to deprive the church of sacred baptism altogether , and hath done more to weaken the cause of infant baptism then any other of its favourites , in laying its foundation in jewish ceremonies , for which they had no clear command from god. but great is this truth of believers baptism , and will stand notwithstanding the injury done by dr. hammond , for it was no jewish rite , the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins was from heaven , mat. 21. 25. and the pharisees who ●ere ●ealous enough for jewish rites , rejcted holy baptism , which christ asfi●ms to be the counsel of god lu. 7. 30. and testifies out of the consciences of his enemies , that he that t●aches otherwise denyes john to be a prophet . this then is the thing that truly seems strange , that no mention is made of infant baptism , if indeed it was at all received in the christian church either as a jewish rite or otherwise , but not str●●●e at all that none is charged with it , seeing none can be named that held it . 4. since theie wish christians were so much offended saith the dr. at the neglect of circumcision , acts 21. can we in reason think they should quietly bear their children being wholly thrown out of the church , as they would have been , if neither admitted by circumcision nor baptism . answer , since the false apostles was so earnest to have the christians circumcise their children , it 's strange that none of the true apostles could or would quiet them by saying instead of infant circumcision you have infant baptism if indeed there had been any such thing practiced , for , this way went the apostle paul to still them , vvhen they would have brought the believers themselves under circumsion , col. two . telling the chriffians they vvere circumcised vvith the circumcision made vvithout hands , in putting off the body of the sins of the ▪ flesh by the circumcision of christ , buried vvith him in baptism , vvherein ye also are ●isen with him through the faith , &c. and why might not the jews as qui●tly take the non-admission of infants to baptism , as they so took the non-admission of them to the lords supper seeing they were formerly admitted to the passeover , nor i● it necessary to say , that though they were not admitted to either of these , that therefore they are wholly thrown out of the church ; for , if by church be meant the whole number of the saved , then are infants of the churchs for christ hath told us the kingdom of god belongs to infants , and thus were infants of the church before circumcision was for some thousands of years : but if by church be meant those only vvho are concerned in the actual profession of the gospel , in this respect i grant infants are not of the church , god having no vvhere required this of infants in his gospel . infants are novv as vvell as before the flood , vvithin the covenant of the gospel in respect of the grace of eternal life , but are not under the duties of the covenant , to vvit , repentance , faith baptism perseverance , &c. nor can my calling the whole number of the saved the church , and thus making infants a part thereof offend a protestant who is acquainted with protestant doctrines , seeing mr. rogers cath. doctrine p. 73. upon art. 19. of the church of england , do●h affirm , there is an invisible church , and takes all within the compass of ●his church who are elect , tryumphing or that shall tryumph in heaven dr. field takes into his definition of the church all the elect , of men or angels , caled , or not yet called . l. 1. c. 8. so that according to these defi●itions of the churc● , infants are not thrown out of the church though not of the number of the called , and consequently not that cause for the jews to complain , nor any other which the dr. doth imagine ; unless they be not acquainted with the extent of the covenant of gods grace in christ iesus our lord. five , the doctor lastly tells us , that had it been contrary to christs institution ( to baptise infants ) we should not have had such evidence of it's early practice in t●e church , and here i acknowledge the use of apostolical tradition to manifest this to us . answer , this is altogether unlike a protestant : what are the sacraments so darkly laid down in the scripture that vve knovv not vvhen and to vvhom they belong vvithout tradition ? but vvhen shall vve see this tradition apostolical , i think doctor ta●lor expresly denies there is any tradit apostolical . lib. proph●si . p. 117. 120. but the doctor cannot but knovv there be errou●s ●vhich crept into the church even in the apostles days , vvhich also continued in some of them , notvvithstanding all endeavours to purge them , such vvere circumcision and keeping the lavv. or if we list to reckon vvith records of antiquity , 't is easi● o show some things held by papists and opposed by the doctor are better proved by tradi●ion then infant baptism , for example the lent fast ond prayer for the dead , this is not denyed by mr. perkins demonst . prob . what then shall be gained to the protestant religion by such traditional arguments . it is a notable saying of irenae●s ( according to dr. fulk ) wsen the hereticks are reproved out of the scriptures they ●all to accusing the scriptures as if all is not well in them — and that the truth cannot be found out of them that know not the tradition . and saith tertul , ( according to dr. fulk ) take away those things from the hereticks , which they hold with ethnicks , that they may stay their questions upon scripture only . finis . errata . p. 3. l. 5. r. is right , p. 4. l. 25. r. of a midwife p. 5. l. 34. for these r. those p. 7. l. 27. for others r. overs . a sermon of the baptizing of infants preached in the abbey-church at westminster at the morning lecture, appointed by the honorable house of commons / by stephen marshall ... marshall, stephen, 1594?-1655. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a52051 of text r876 in the english short title catalog (wing m774). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 138 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 33 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a52051 wing m774 estc r876 11875411 ocm 11875411 50201 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a52051) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 50201) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 228:e7, no 21) a sermon of the baptizing of infants preached in the abbey-church at westminster at the morning lecture, appointed by the honorable house of commons / by stephen marshall ... marshall, stephen, 1594?-1655. [4], 61 p. printed by richard cotes for stephen bowtell ..., london : 1644. reproduction of original in thomason collection, british library. eng bible. -n.t. -peter, 1st, iii, 21 -sermons. infant baptism -sermons. sermons, english. a52051 r876 (wing m774). civilwar no a sermon of the baptizing of infants. preached in the abbey-church at westminster, at the morning lecture, appointed by the honorable house marshall, stephen 1644 25036 30 20 0 0 0 0 20 c the rate of 20 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the c category of texts with between 10 and 35 defects per 10,000 words. 2004-10 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2004-12 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-01 jonathan blaney sampled and proofread 2005-01 jonathan blaney text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a sermon of the baptizing of infants . preached in the abbey-church at westminster , at the morning lecture , appointed by the honorable house of commons . by stephen marshall b d. minister of the gospel , at finchingfield in essex . act. 2.39 . the promise is unto you and to your children , and to all that are afarre off , even as many as the lord our god shall call . rom. 11.16 . if the roote bee holy , so are the branches . 1 cor. 7.14 . the unbeleeving husband is sanctifyed by the wife , and the unbeleeving wife is sanctifyed by the husband , else were your children unclean , but now they are holy . london , printed by richard cotes for stephen bowtell , at the signe of the bible in popes-head-alley . 1644. to the reverend and learned the prolocutor , assessors , the commissioners of the church of scotland , and the rest of the assembly of divines , now sitting in westminster . some few of us who are of your number , freely bestowing our labours in the abbey-church , every morning ; we agreed among our selves to instruct our auditors in all the necessary truths of that doctrine , which is according to godlinesse ; one taking for his subject , the articles of faith ; another the ten commandements ; another the lords prayer , &c. my lot of late hath been to handle the doctrine of the sacraments , and comming in order to this point , i indevoured to cleere it as fully as i could in one sermon , and was thereby compelled to borrow a little more time then is usually allotted to that exercise . importunity of many friends , who conceived it might give some light to that which is now made a great controversy , and might through the blessing of god , be a meanes to reclaime some deceived soules , or prevent the deceiving of others , hath brought it thus into publick view . and although i know my selfe the unworthyest , and unablest of many , yet because i am assured that it is gods truth which i have preached , and which hee will blesse , i was the more easily overcome by that importunity ; if it may contribute any thing to the helping forward of the great work now under your hands , and may ease you of any part of that labour which so exceedingly presseth you , therein i shall rejoyce ; and in the opportunity i have by dedicating this to your names , to testify that i am your unworthy brother and servant in the lords work , stephen marshall . a sermon of the baptizing of infants . 1 pet. 3.21 . the like figure whereunto , even baptisme , doth also now save us , ( not the putting away of the filth of the flesh , but the answer of a good conscience towards god ) by the resurrection of jesus christ . in this morning lecture , i have formerly in my course out of severall scriptures handled the doctrine of the sacraments in generall , and then proceeded to speake of the sacraments of the old testament , and therein their number , their agreement and disagreement , with those of the new testament ; and now lately have begun to open the sacraments of the new testament . the first of them is now in hand ; and i have already out of this text , made foure or five sermons , concerning the nature and use of the sacrament of baptisme , wherein i have cleared unto you : first , who was the authour and institutour of it : secondly , who is to bee the 〈◊〉 of it : thirdly , the essence of it , the matter and forme of it ; both the res terrena , and the res coelestis , the earthly , and the spirituall part : and now fourthly , it remaines , that i treat of the subject of it , or the persons who are to be baptized ; and they are of two sorts ; either grown men , who being instructed in the doctrine of christ , and professing their faith in him , and their willingnes and readines to live according to his will , and do desire to bee partakers of this blessed sacrament ; these whether jews or gentiles , male or female , bond or free , are to bee admitted to the participation of this ordinance ; of the baptizing of such as these there is no question . the other sort are infants , of whose right to this sacrament , i shall ( by gods assistance ) treate this day . and concerning these , there are two sorts of questions : first , whether any infants at all are to bee baptized ? secondly , supposing some have right to it , yet it 's greatly disputed , whose infants may bee baptized ? viz. whether the infants of excommunicate persons , of hereticks , of profane men , of meerly civilly righteous ; whether bastards , whether the infants of heathens , who are to bee brought up by christians ; and whether these may not be baptized , with some caution used , thereby to make distinction betwixt the pure and the impure ? i shall for the present baulk all these latter questions , and handle only the former , viz. 〈◊〉 any at all are to bee baptized ? or , as the question uses to bee stated . whether the infants of beleeving parents , the infants of saints , are to be admitted to the holy sacrament ? and here also ariseth another question , who are to bee meant by beleevers and saints , whether only such as have the inward vertue of faith and holinesse , who are really beleevers and sanctifyed ones , or whether by beleevers and saints , may be meant such a faith and sanctity as is outwardly professed , although possibly the inward grace it selfe ( which only god can judge of ) bee altogether wanting ? concerning which question , although for my owne part i beleeve wee are to understand it of that which man may judge of , and that god hath not made that the condition of his servants applying his ordinances , which can be infallibly known to none but himselfe , and that therefore the profession of faith and holinesse , is sufficient to make men passe for beleevers , and saints in the churches judgement , yet i shall at the present baulk the handling of this also , and will take it in the surest sense , in the apostles sense , what the apostle means by beleevers and saints , when he writes unto the churches , that i will take to bee the state of the question : if by beleevers and saints the apostle meane visible professors of faith and holinesse ; then the question is , whether their infants are to bee baptized ; if the apostle by beleevers and saints , mean such onely as are inwardly holy , inwardly beleevers , then the question is , whether their infants are to be baptized : in a word , whether the infants of such as were or might have been stiled beleevers and saints in the apostles daies and writings , are to be admitted to the sacrament of baptisme . this priviledge of the baptizing of such infants the christian church hath been in possession of for the space of fifteen hundred yeers and upwards , as is manifest out of most of the records that we have of antiquity , both in the greek and latine church ; which i the rather mention in the beginning , because many of the anabaptists blush not to say , that the antients , especially the greek church , rejected it for many hundred yeers : justine martyr , who lived about anno 150 ( in a treatise which goes under his name ) question 56. disputes the different condition of those children , who dye baptized , and of them who dye unbaptized . ireneus , who lived in the same century , lib. 2. cap. 29. saith , christus venit per seipsum omnes salvare ; omnes , 〈◊〉 , qui per eum renascuntur in deum , infantes & parvulos & pueros , &c. now it 's well known , say the glossers upon that text , renascentiae nomine , dominica & apostolica phrasi , baptismum intelligi . origen , who lived in the beginning of the third century , in his treatise upon rom. 6. lib. 5. saith , the church received this tradition of baptizing of infants from the apostles : and homily 8. upon leviticus , secundum ecclesiae observantiam , baptismum parvulis dari concedit , hom. 14. in lucam , parvuli baptizantur in remissionem peccatorum : he cals it indeed a tradition , according to the expression of the ancients , who ordinarily called the greatest points of faith , by the name of traditions received from the apostles . traditions being onely such things as are delivered from one to another , whether writen or unwriten . and so did the apostle himselfe , 2 thess. 2.15 . when he charged them to hold the traditions which they had been taught , either by word or epistle . however his calling it a tradition received from the apostles gives us a sufficient proofe , that time out of mind , it had been received in the church , that it was delivered over to the church in his time , and was of antient use in the church before his time . gregory nazianzen , orat. 40. in baptismum , cals baptism signaculum vitae cursum ineuntibus , and commands children to be baptized , though afterward he seemed to restraine it to the case of necessity . cyprian , one of the antientest writers amongst the latines , handles it at large , in epist. 59. ad fidum , upon this occasion ; fidus denyed not the baptisme of infants , but denyed that they ought to be baptized , before the eighth day ; cyprian assures him that by the unanimous consent of 66. bishops gathered together in a councell , baptisme was to be administred to infants , as well as to growne men , and not to be restrained to any time , and proves it by such arguments as these : they are under originall sinne , they need pardon , are capable of grace and mercy , god regards not age , &c. this testimony of cyprians is cited and approved by august . epist. 28. & lib. 3. de merit . & remiss . pecca . cap. 5. & lib. 3. contra pelag. and by hierom contra pelag. lib. 3. of the same judgment was ambrose , lib. 2. cap. 11. de abraham patriarcha , and many other of the ancients , which i relate not to prove the truth of the thing , but onely the practise of it : and indeed , although some in those times questioned it , as august . grants in his sermons , de verbis apostol. yet the first that ever made a head against it , or a division in the church about it , was baltazar pacommitanus in germany in luthers time , about the yeere 1527. and since that time multitudes in germany have imbraced his opinion , who because they opposed paedo-baptisme , were forced to reiterate their owne baptisme , and thence were called anabaptists , and soone proved a dangerous and turbulent sect against that reformation ; not onely working a world of mischiefe about munster and other parts of germany , but have with this opinion , drunk in abundance of other dangerous heresies and blasphemies , and quickly grew into such divisions , and sub-divisions among themselves , that bullenger notes that they were growne to no lesse then fourteene severall sects in his time : which in truth is the common lot of all sectaries ; who when once they have departed from the church , upon every small occasion they come to bee divided againe among themselves , and one from another : as the ecclesiasticall story lets us see in the novatians , macedonians , eunomians , arians , &c. which divisions also opened a way to their totall destruction in the end : their mutuall bickerings among themselves , being as the beating of the waves of the sea one against another , till all were changed , as the historian notes of them . and because this opinion , and divers others which depend upon it , begins unhappily to take place and spread among our selves in this kingdom ; and so the work of reformation ( without gods mercy ) likely to bee much hindred by it ; i shall ( god willing ) handle this question more largely , then i have done any other in this place ; and the rather because of three other great mischiefes which goe along with it . first , i see that all who reject the baptizing of infants , doe and must upon the same ground reject the religious observation of the lords day , or the christian sabbath , viz. because there is not ( say they ) an expresse institution or command in the new testament . verily , i have hardly either knowne , or read , or heard of any one who hath rejected this of infants , but with it they reject that of the lords day : now god hath so blessed the religious observation of the lords day in this kingdome above other churches and kingdomes , that such as indeavour to overthrow it , deserve justly to be abhorred by us . secondly , the teachers of this opinion , where ever they prevaile , take their proselytes wholly off from the ministry of the word and sacraments , and all other acts of christian communion , both publick and private ; from any , but those who are of their owne opinion , condemning them all as limbs of antichrist , worshippers and followers of the beast : and so not onely labour to cast the godly ministers out of the hearts of those people whom they have wonne to christ ; but leave the people whom they insnare without any hope of recovery , whilst they impose upon their consciences to heare none but such as may confirme them in their errors ; an old trick of satan which hee taught the papists long agone , a meere politick device to keep their disciples fast unto themselves : which unchristian course , how prosperous soever it may seeme to bee at the first , cannot bee blessed by god , nor indeed is it , the lord giving them up almost every where , to other most dangerous , vile , and abominable opinions . i deny not but some few who are of this opinion are otherwise minded , but all our experience teacheth us that the generality of them doe runne this way . thirdly , this opinion puts all the infants of all beleevers into the self-same condition , with the infants of turkes and indians , which they all readily acknowledge ; and from thence unavoidably one of these three things must follow . 1. either all of them are damned who die in their infancy , being without the covenant of grace , having no part in christ . or , 2. all of them saved , as having no originall sinne , and consequently needing no saviour ; which most of the anabaptists in the world doe owne , and therewith bring in al pelagianisme , universall grace , free-will , &c. or , 3. that although they bee tainted with originall corruption , and so need a saviour , christ doth pro beneplacito , save some of the infants of indians and turkes , dying in their infancy , as well as some of the infants of christians ; and so carry salvation by christ out of the church , beyond the covenant of grace , where god never made any promise : that god hath made a promise to bee the god of believers , and of their seed , wee all know ; but where the promise is to bee found , that hee will bee the god of the seed of such parents who live and die his enemies , and their seed , not so much as called by the preaching of the gospel , i know not . these men say the covenant of grace made to the jewes , differs from the covenant of grace made with us ; but i desire to know , whether in the one , or in the other , they find any promise of salvation by christ to any infants dying in their infancie , whose parents no way belonged to the family of god , or covenant of grace . the matter then being of such consequence , and many amongst us in such danger of being seduced , further then is easie to imagine , through the subtilty , activity , and diligence of such as with a great shew of scriptures , and under a pretence of zeale , doe creepe into houses ; yea , proclaime these things openly in pulpits : i take my selfe bound upon this occasion to shew you upon what grounds the orthodox church hath hitherto retained this practise , and shall bring all that i intend to speake of it under two arguments , and under them shall indeavour to answer whatsoever i have found of any moment objected to the contrary . my first argument is this , the infants of beleeving parents are foederati , therefore they must bee signati : they are within the covenant of grace , belonging to christs body , kingdome , family ; therefore are to partake of the seale of his covenant , or the distinguishing badge between them who are under the covenant of grace , and them who are not . the ordinary answer to this argument is , by denying that infants are under the covenant of grace ; onely some few deny the consequence , that although they were within the covenant , yet it followes not that they must bee sealed , because ( say they ) the women among the jewes were under the covenant , yet received not circumcision , which was the seale of the covenant ; but this receives an easie answer , the women were circumcised in the males , else could not god have said , that the whole house of israel were circumcised in the flesh , else could not the whole nation of the jewes bee called the circumcision , in opposition to all the world beside , who were called the uncircumcision . but for the better clearing of this whole argument ; i shall indeavour to make good these five conclusions . first , that the covenant of grace hath alwayes for substance been one and the same . secondly , god will have the infants of such as enter into covenant with him , bee counted his , as well as their parents . thirdly , god hath ever since abrahams time , had a seale to bee applied to such as enter into covenant with him . fourthly , by gods owne order the seed , or infants of covenanters before christs time , were to be sealed with the seale of admission into his covenant , as well as their parents . fifthly , the priviledge of such as are in covenant since christs time , are as honourable , large , and comfortable , both to themselves and their children , as they were before christs time : and these five propositions made good , the argument will be strong and undeniable . the first is , that the covenant of grace , for substance , hath alwayes been one and the same , both to the jewes and to the gentiles . which to understand , know , that the new and living way to life was first revealed to adam immediately after his fall , and that blessed promise concerning the seed of the woman was often renewed , and the patriarchs faith therein , and salvation thereby , recorded plentifully in the scripture : but the first time that ever it was revealed under the expresse name of a league or covenant was with abraham ; and therefore we shall need looke no higher then his dayes : who because he was the first explicite covenanter , is called the father of the faithfull ; and ever since clearly hath all the world been divided into two distinct bodies or families ; the one called the kingdome , city , houshold of god , to which all who owne the way to life , were to joine themselves ; and these were called the children of god , the sons of abraham , the children of the kingdome : all the rest of the world , the kingdom of the devill , the seed of the serpent , strangers from the covenant of grace , without god in the world ; &c. now i say that this covenant of grace hath for substance been alwayes the same ; for substance i say , for wee must distinguish betwixt the covenant it selfe , and the manner of administration of this covenant : the substance of the covenant on gods part was , to be abrabrahams god , and the god of his seed , to bee an al-sufficient portion , an al-sufficient reward for him , to give jesus christ to him , and righteousnesse with him , both of justification and of sanctification , and everlasting life . on abrahams part the substance of the covenant was , to beleeve in the promised messiah , to walke before god with a perfect heart , to serve god according to his revealed wil , to instruct his family , &c. the manner of administration of this covenant at the first was by types , and shadowes , sacrifices , &c. and foure hundred and thirty yeeres after the law was added with great terrour upon mount sinai , not as a part of this covenant , but as the apostle saith expressely , it was added because of transgressions , to bee a schoolemaster to whip to christ ; plainly in that giving of the law , there was something of the covenant of workes made with adam in paradise ; yet in order to the administration of the covenant of grace , there was a rehearsall of the covenant of workes , under which all men lie by nature , untill they bee brought under the covenant of grace : and this was delivered with great terror , and under most dreadfull penalties , that they who were prone to seeke justification in themselves , by finding the {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the impossibility of their keeping the law , might be driven to seeke for a better mediator , even the lord jesus christ , as was excellently shadowed out , exod. 20.18 , 19 , 20. deut. 5.24 . when they cryed out to moses ; that they might no more heare this dreadfull voice , which would kill them , but that they might bee spoken unto by a mediator : and god said , they had well spoken , and presently accepted moses for their typicall mediator , and by him gave them the gospel in their tabernacle ordinances . and there was also somthing of the administration of the covenant of grace ; partly , because all the threatning and cursing part of it was intended as a preparative and meanes to fit them for christ ; and partly because the directing part of it , containes that very rule whereby abraham , and all his seed were ordered to walke in obedience towards god . to conclude this , all their externall promises in case of obedience , all outward blessings which were to bee injoyed by them , the land of canaan , and all the good things in it , all outward punishments and threatnings , losse of their countrey , going into captivity , all their sacrifices ▪ their washings , their sprinklings , their holy persons , holy feasts , and holy things , were all of them but so many administrations of the covenant of grace ; earthly things then , were not onely promised or threatned more distinctly and fully , then now they are to them who are in covenant , but were figures , signes , types and sacraments of spirituall things , to bee injoyed both by them and by us ; as might bee cleared by abundance of particulars : take but that one instance of the land of canaan , which albeit in it selfe it was but like other lands ▪ yet was it by the lord sanctified to spirituall ends , where he would have his tabernacle pitched , and temple built , out of which land , when the ten tribes were carried captive , hee is said to have put them out of his sight : the very land being figuratively holy , and a signe of gods presence , the resting of gods people there , a signe of their eternall rest in heaven , into which not moses the lawgiver , but joshua , or jesus , the type of their true jesus was to bring them : neither did the lord promise them entrance into , or continuance in that land , but upon the same conditions upon which hee promiseth eternall life , as true faith in the gospel , with the love and feare of god , and obedience of his commandements : godlinesse having then , as it hath now and alwayes , the promise of good things for this life , and the life to come , of earthly things , then more distinctly , and fully , and typically , but of heavenly things more generally and sparingly ; whereas now on the contrary , there is a more cleare and full revelation and promise of heavenly things , but the promise of things earthly , more generall and sparing : now this externall administration of the covenant is not the same with us , as it was with them , but the covenant is the same ; they were under the same misery by nature , had the same christ , the lambe slaine from the beginning of the world , the same conditions of faith and repentance , to bee made partakers of the covenant , had the same graces promised in the covenant , circumcising of their heart , to love the lord , &c. theirs was dispenced in darker prophecies , and obscurer sacrifices , types , and sacraments , ours more gloriously and clearely , and in a greater measure : the cloathes indeed doe differ , but the body is the same in both . as is apparent , if , first , you look but into the prophecies that were made , jer. 31.33 . isaiah 59.21 . joel 2.32 . and many other places , where the same things are promised to the gentiles , when the gospel should bee preached unto them , which were first promised to abraham , and to his seed ; but more fully , if you looke into the new testament , where you shall find , luke 1.54 , 55 , 69 , 70 , 72 , 73. luke 2.31 , 32. that christ and the kingdome of grace by him , is acknowledged to bee the summe of the oath and covenant , which god had promised to abraham , and to his seed : so matth. 21.41 , 43. the same vineyard that was let to the jewes , should afterward be let to the gentiles ; the same kingdome of god which was formerly given to the jews , should be taken from them , and given to the gentiles : so rom. 11. the gentiles were to bee ingraffed into the same stocke in which formerly the jews had growne , and from which they were now to bee cut off , and into which in the end they should bee ingraffed againe : so gal. 3.8.14.16 . abraham had the same gospel preached to him , which is now preached to us , the same blessing bestowed upon abraham , comes on the gentiles through jesus christ , that they ( as well as he ) might receive the promise of the spirit through faith ; they who receive the promise of the spirit through faith , have the blessing of abraham come upon them : as cleare is that , ephes. 2.13 . to the end of the chapter , the partition wall which severed us from the jewes , is now broken downe , and the gentiles who formerly were afarre off , are now taken in , and made inter-commoners with the jews ; the apostle alluding to the manner of the jewish worship , where beyond the court wherein the jews did worship , there was another court divided from it by a sept or wall , which was called , atrium gentium & immundorum , the court of the gentiles and of the uncleane , nearer then which none of them might approach unto the temple ; but now saith he , the partition wall is broken downe , and wee are no more strangers and forainers , but made felow-citizens with the saints , and of the houshold of god ; and with them grow up unto an holy temple in the lord ; all which shews , that the very selfe same priviledges formerly made peculiar to the jews , are now through christ communicated to the gentiles . and this will yet more fully appeare , if wee consider how st. paul to the galatians , shews that the same seed of abraham , so much spoken of in the covenant made with him , is now found among the gentiles , as 〈◊〉 was formerly among the jews , there you shall find three sorts of abrahams seed : first , christ , gal. 3.16 . the root and stock , the head , and elder brother of all the rest . secondly , all true beleevers are abrahams seed , cap. 3.29 . these onely are made partakers of the spirituall part of the covenant . thirdly , you shall find another seed of abraham , who were onely circumcised in the flesh , and not in the heart , who though they were either borne of abrahams seed or professed abrahams faith , and so were jews facti , though not nati , made though not borne jews , becomming proselytes , yet never came to make abrahams god their all-sufficient portion , but placed their happinesse in somewhat , which was not christ , either by seeking justification by the works of the law , being ignorant of gods righteousnesse , and going about to establish their own righteousnesse did not submit themselves unto the righteousnesse of god , or placed their happinesse , in satisfying the lusts of their flesh , going a whoring after the creature ; and so though they were abrahams seed by profession and outward cleaving to the covenant , yet were to be cast off with the rest of the uncircumcised , of whom ishmael and esau were types , gal. 4.22 . &c. even so is it now in the times of the gospel , we have now jesus christ , the elder brother , the first-born of the covenant , we have also true beleevers , who are brethren and co-heires with him , who are properly the heires by promise , and wee have also some who are onely a holy seed by externall profession , gal. 4.29 . who either with the false teachers , which paul there speaks of , mingle justification by the law and gospell together , or with others , 2 tim. 3.5 . though they have a forme of godlinesse ; yet deny the power of it in their lives and conversations . so much for the first conclusion , that the covenant of grace , for substance , was alwayes one and the same . ever since god gathered a distinct , select number out of the world , to bee his kingdom , city , house-hold , in opposition to the rest in the world , which is the kingdom , city , house-hold of satan , he would have the infants of all who are taken into covenant with him , to bee accounted his , to belong to him , to his church and family , and not to the devils . as it is in other kingdoms , corporations , and families , the children of all subjects borne in a kingdome , are borne that princes subjects , where the father is a free man , the childe is not born a slave ; where any are bought to be servants , their children born in their masters house , are born his servants . thus it is by the laws of almost all nations , and thus hath the lord ordained , it shall be in his kingdome and family ; the children follow the covenant-condition of their parents , if he take a father into covenant , he takes the children in with him ; if hee reject the parents out of covenant , the children are cast out with them ; thus without all question it was in the time of the jews , gen. 17.9 . &c. and when any of any other nation , though a canaanite or hittite , acknowledged abrahams god to be their god , they and their children came into covenant together . and so it continues still , though the anabaptists boldly deny it : act. 2.38 , 39. when peter exhorted his hearers , who were pricked in their hearts , to repent and be baptized for the remission of sins , he useth an argument to perswade them , taken from the benefit which should come to their posterity , for the promise ( saith he ) is unto you and unto your children , and to all that are afarre off , even as many as the lord our god shall call : if once they obey the call of god , as abraham did , the promise was made to them and to their children , whether they who obey this call were the present jews to whom he spake , or were afarre off : whether by afarre off , you will meane the gentiles , who as yet worshipped afar off , or the jews or any who as yet were unborn , and so were afarre off in time , or whether they dwelt in the remotest parts of the world , and so were afarre off in place , the argument holds good to the end of the world , repent and be baptized for the remission of sins , and ye shall receive the holy ghost ; for the promise is made to you and to your children , they shall bee made free of gods city , according to abrahams copy ; i will be thy god , and the god of thy seed . let zacheus the publican once receive christ himselfe , be he a gentile , as some thinke he was , be he a great sinner , esteemed as a heathen , as wee all know he was , let him professe the faith of christ , and the covenant of salvation comes to his house ; for now he is made a sonne of abraham : that is , abrahams promise now reacheth him . neither can the evidence of this place be eluded by saying , the promise here meant , is of the extraordinary gifts of the holy ghost , to speake with tongues , &c. for we all know that all who then beleeved and were baptized , did not receive those extraordinary gifts of the holy ghost , and beside this argument remaines still in force to be used to the end of the world , who ever beleeves and is baptized , shall receive remission of sinnes , and the gift of the holy ghost : which was not true , if by the holy ghost was meant onely those extraordinary gifts . nor , secondly , can it be avoyded by that shift of others who interpret it thus , to you and your children as many of them as the lord shall call , that is ( say they ) whether your selves or your children , or any other whom the lord shall call . if they repent and be baptized , they shall receive the gift of the holy ghost , for it is plaine that the strength of this argument lieth in this , that if they did repent and were baptized , the promise should be made good to them and to their children and what comfortable argument can this be taken from respect to their children , if the apostle must be interpreted as these men would have him ? viz. you and your ch●ldren have hitherto beene an holy seed , but now if you beleeve in chr●st your selves , your children shall bee in no better condition then the rest of the pagan world , strangers from the covenant of god ▪ but if afterward any of them , or any of the heathen shall for their parts beleeve and be baptized , their perticular persons shallbe tooke into covenant , but their children still left out : had this thinke you beene a comfortable argument to perswade them to come in , in relation to the good of their children after them ? the plaine strength of the argument is , god hath now remembred his covenant to abraham , in sending that blessed seed , in whom he promised to be the god of him and his seed ; doe not you by your unbeliefe deprive your selves and your posterity of so excellent a gift . and except in relation to the covenant , there was no occasion to name their children , it had beene sufficient to have said , a promise is made to as many as the lord shall call . as plaine it is out of the 11. of the rom. 16. &c. where the apostles scope is to shew that we gentiles have now the same graffing into the true olive which the jewes formerly had , and our present graffing in , is answerable to their present casting out , and their taking in in the latter end of the world shall be the same graffing in ( though more gloriously ) as ours is now : now all know that when they were taken in , they and their children were taken in , when they were broken off , they and their children were broken off , when they shall be taken in , in the latter end of the world , they and their children shall be taken in , and that because the root is holy , that is , gods covenant with abraham , isaac and jacob , extends yet unto them when their unbeleefe shall be taken away . the root being like nebuchadnezzars tree , the tree hewen downe , and the root bound with a band of yron untill seven times were passed over it , and then the bands should be broken , and the root should spring , and the tree should grow againe : so their present nation , like this tree , is cut downe , and this holy root the covenant made with their forefathers , is suspended , bound with an iron barre of unbeliefe , blindnesse being come upon them , unt●ll the fulnesse of the gentiles be come in , and then all israel shall be saved . and marke that in all this discourse , the holinesse of the branches there spoken of , is not meant of a personall inherent holinesse , but a derivative holinesse , a holinesse derived to them from their ancestors ; the first fruit is holy , the lumpe holy , the root holy , the bra●ches holy , that is , the fathers holy accepted in covenant with god , the children beloved for their fathers sake ; and when the vaile of unbeliefe shall be taken away , the children and their posterity shall be taken in againe , because beloved for their fathers sakes . now then if our graffing in , be answerable to theirs in all , or any of these three particulars , we and our children are graffed in together . ob. but here is no mention made of our infants graffing in . answ. we must not teach the lord to speake , but with reverence search out his meaning , there is no mention made of casting out the jew●sh infants , neither here nor elsewhere : when he speakes of taking away the kingdome of god from them , and giving it to the gentiles who would bring forth fruit , no mention of the infants of the one , or of the other , but the one and the other for these outward dispensations , are comprehended in their parents , as the branches in the root , the infants of the godly in their parents , according to the tenor of his mercy , the infants of the wicked in their parents , according to the tenor of his justice . and yet plainer ( if plainer may be ) is that speech of the apostle in 1 corinth . 7.14 . the unbeleeving husband is sanctified by the wife , and the unbeleeving wife is sanctified by the husband , else were your children uncleane , but now they are holy ; the plaine scope and meaning whereof is this ; the beleeving corinthians , among other cases of conscience which they had sent to the apostle for his resolution of , had written this for one , whether it were lawfull for them who were converted , still to retaine their infidell wives , or husbands : their doubt seemes to arise from the law of god , which was in force to the nation of the jewes ; god had not onely forbidden such marriages to his people , but in ezra's time , they put away not onely their wives , but all the children that were borne of them , as not belonging to the common-wealth of israel ; and it was done according to the law , and that law was not a particular edict which they did agree upon , but according to the standing law of moses , which that word there used signifieth ; and in nehemiahs time , the children who were borne of such marriages were accounted a mungrell kind , whom nehemiah cursed . now hereupon these corinthians doubted whether their children , as well as their wives , were not to be accounted uncleane , and so to be put away according to those examples ; to which the apostle answers , no , they were not to be put away ; upon what speciall reason soever , that law was in force to the jewes , beleeving christians were not in that condition , the unbeleeving wife was sanctified in the beleeving husband , quoad hoc , so farre , as to bring forth an holy seed ; were it with them as when both of them were unbeleevers , so that neither of them had a prerogative to entitle their children to the covenant of grace , their children would be an uncleane progeny ; or were the children to be reckoned in the condition of the worser parent , so that the unbeleever could contribute more to paganisme then the beleever to christianity , it were so likewise ; but the case is otherwise , the beleeving husband hath by gods ordinance a sanctified use of his unbeleeving wife , so as by gods speciall promise made to beleevers and their seed , they were invested , in , and to the most spirituall end of marriage , the continuance of a holy seed , wherein the church is to be propagated to the worlds end : and the case is here in relation to the posterity for spirituall priviledges , as in other marriages , for civill priviledges , as suppose a prince , or nobleman marry with a woman of base or meane birth , though in generall it be true , that the children of those that be base , are borne base , as well as the children of nobles are borne noble , yet here the issue hath honour from the father , and is not accounted base by the basenesse of the mother . this i take to be the plaine meaning of the apostles answer : but because the anabaptists doe very much indeavour to weaken the evidence of this argument , i shall indeavour to cleare it from their exceptions . they utterly deny that this place is meant of any federall holinesse , but of legitimation , which they call civill holinesse , and so interpret the corinthians doubt to bee , whether their marriage with unbeleevers were not now a nullity , and their children thereupon to bee spurious , illegitimate , or bastards , and the apostles answer to bee , that because the unbeleeving wife is sanctified to the beleeving husband , that is , their marriage remaines lawfull , therefore their children are not spurious , but lawfully begotten . but that this cannot be the meaning , i clearly prove by these foure arguments . first , uncleannesse and holinesse , when opposed one to the other , are never taken for civilly lawfull ; uncleannesse indeed , when opposed to cleannesse , may be taken in severall senses , an uncleane vessell , an uncleane cloath , an uncleane garment ; when opposed to cleane , may signifie nothing but dirty or spotted ; but when uncleannesse is opposed to holinesse , it is alwaies taken in a sacred sense , referring to a tabernacle use , to a right of admission into , or use in , the tabernacle or temple , which were types to us of the visible church ; and holinesse is alwaies taken for a separation of persons or things from common to sacred uses ▪ even the meats and drinkes of beleevers sanctified to them , serve for a religious end and use , even to refresh them , who are the temples of the holy ghost ; so that they have not onely a lawfull , but an holy use of their meat and drinke , which unbeleevers have not , to whom yet their meat and drinke is civilly lawfull . and whereas some say , 1 thess. 4.3 , 4 , 5. that chastity a morall vertue found among heathens , is called by the name of sanctification ; let every one possesse his vessell , not in the lust of concupisence , but in sanctification and honour . i answer , chastity among heathens , is never called sanctification , but among beleevers it may well bee called so , being a part of the new creation , a branch of their sanctification , wrought by the spirit of god , a part of the inward adorning of the temple of the holy ghost . so that the meaning cannot be , your children are holy , that is , now they are not bastards ; but rather , whereas before , both you and they were uncleane , and might have nothing to doe with the temple of god , now both you and your children are a holy seed , according as was shewed to peter in his vision , where god shewed him , that the gentiles formerly no better then uncleane beasts , and creeping things , should upon their conversion to christ bee no longer esteemed common or defiled . secondly , this being so , had this beene the meaning , else were your children uncleane , but now they are holy , else had your children been bastards , but now they are legitimate ; the apostles answer had not been true , because then if one of the parents had not been a beleever , and so by his being a believer , sanctified his unbeleeving wife , their children must have been bastards : whereas wee know their children had been legitimate , being born in lawfull wedlocke , though neither of the parents had been a beleever : marriage being a second table duty , is lawfull , ( though not sanctified ) to pagans as well as to christians , and the legitimation or illegitimation of the issue depends not upon the faith , but upon the marriage of the parents ; let the marriage be lawfull , and the issue is legitimate , whether one , or both , or neither of the parents be beleevers or infidels : take but away lawfull marriage , betwixt the man and the woman , and the issue is legitimate , whether one , or both , or neither of the parents are beleevers or infidels : withall , if the children of heathens be bastards , and the marriage of heathens no marriage , then there is no adultery among heathens , and so the seventh commandement is altogether in vaine in the words of it as to them . besides , st. pauls reason had no strength in it , supposing the text were to be interpreted as these men would have it ; their doubt ( say they ) was , that their marriage was an unlawfull wedlocke , and so consequently their children bastards ; now mark what kind of answer they make the apostle give , were yee not lawfull man and wife , your children were bastards , but because the unbeleeving wife is sanctified in the husband , &c. because your marriage is a lawfull marriage , your children are legitimate . what strength of reason is in this ? if this had been their doubt or question , whether their marriage were not a nullity , the apostle by his apostolick authority might have definitively answered , without giving a reason , your marriage is good , and your children legitimate ; but if paul will go about to satisfie them by reason , and prove them to be mistaken , it behoved him to give such a reason which should have some weight in it , but this hath none ; set their doubt ( as these men frame it ) and the apostles answer ( as these men interpret him ) together , and you will easily see the invalidity of it ; we doubt , say the corinthians , we are not lawfull man and wife ; and that therefore our children are bastards . no , saith paul , you are mistaken , and i prove it thus , were ye not lawfull man and wife , your children were bastards ; but because ye are lawfull man and wife , your children are not bastards . is there any argument or proofe in this ? fourthly , according to this their interpretation , the apostles answer could no wayes have reached to the quieting of their consciences ; there doubt was , whether according to the example in ezra , they were not to put away their wives and children , as not belonging to god , as being a seed whom god would not own among his people ; now what kind of quiet would this have given them , to tell them that their children were not bastards ? we know the jewes did not put away their bastards , as not belonging to the covenant of god ; phares , and zarah , and jepthah , and innumerable others , though bastards , were circumcised , and not cut off from the people of god . and whereas some object out of deut. 23.2 . that bastards did not belong to the covenant among the jews , because god there forbad a bastard to come into the congregation of the lord . i answer , that is meant onely of bearing office in the church , or some such like thing , and not of being under the covenant , belonging to the church : as is manifest , not only by what hath been now said of jepthah and others , who were circumcised , and offered sacrifices , and drew nigh to god , as well as any other ; but the very text alledged gives sufficient light , that it cannot be meant otherwayes ; because in that place who ever is an eunuch , or wounded in his stones , hath the same exclusion from the congregation of the lord : and i hope no man will dare to say , that none such are holy to the lord ; if they should , the scripture is full enough against them : that putting away in ezra was of an higher nature then bare illegitimation ; and therefore it behooved the apostle to give another manner of satisfaction to there doubtfull consciences , then to tell them their children were not bastards : therefore i conclude , that this holinesse being the fruits of one of the parents being a beleever , must be meant of some kind of holinesse , which is not common to the seed of them whose parents are both unbeleevers , and that is enough for our purpose . yet there remaines two objections to bee answered , which are made against this our interpretation . first , the unbeleeving wife is here said to bee sanctified , as well as the childe is said to be holy , and the originall word is the same for both , one the verb , the other the noune : if then the childe is holy , with a federall holinesse , then is also the unbeleeving wife sanctified with a federall sanctification , and so the wife , although remaining a heathen , may be yet counted to belong to the covenant of grace . i answer ; indeed there would be weight in this objection if the apostle had said the unbeleeving wife is sanctifyed , and no more , as hee simply says , the children are holy ; but that he doth not say , he saith indeed the unbeleeving wife is sanctified in the beleeving husband , or to the beleeving husband : that is , to his use , as all other creatures are , as the bed he lies on , the meate he eats , the cloathes he weares , the beast he rides on , are sanctifyed to him , and so this sanctifyednesse of the wife is not a sanctification of state , but only of use , and of this use , to be sanctifyed to the beleeving husband ; whereas the holinesse and sanctification that is spoken of the children , is a holinesse of state , and not only a sanctification to the parents use . that holinesse of the children is here meant , which could not bee , unlesse one of the parents were sanctifyed to the other , which is the force of the apostles arguing , the unbeleever is sanctified to the beleever , else were not the children holy , but unclean : but federall holinesse of children may be where the parents are not sanctifyed , one in or to the other , as in bastardy , davids childe by bathsheba , phares , and zarah , judahs children by thamar , the israelites children by the concubines , abrahams son ishmael by hagar , &c. in which cases the children were federally holy , and accordingly were circumcised , and yet the harlot not sanctifyed in or to the adulterer or fornicator , though a beleever . i answer , we must attend the apostles scope , wch is to shew that the children would be unholy , if the faith or beleever-ship of one of the parents could not remove the barre , which lies in the other , being an unbeleever , against the producing of an holy seed , because one of them was a pagan , or unbeleever , therefore the childe would not be a holy seed , unlesse the faith or beleevership of the other parent , could remove this bar . now this can have no place of an argument , in any case , where one of the parents is not an infidell : but this was not the case among the jews ; hagar , and thamar , and the concubines , however sinfull , in those acts , yet themselves were beleevers , belonging to the covenant of god , and that barre lay not against their children , as did in the unbeleeving wife : indeed if a beleeving man or woman should adulterously beget a childe upon a pagan , a heathen , or unbeleever , there this objection deserves to bee further weighed , but here it comes not within the compasse of the apostles argument . before i passe from this second conclusion , let me further shew you why the lord will have the children of beleeving parents reckoned even in their infancy , to belong to him . first his own beneplacitum , his free grace and favour which moves him to shew mercy to whom he will , is a sufficient answer to all : but secondly , he will have it for his owne glory . it is the honour of other princes , that all who are born in their kingdome should be accounted borne their subjects ; and the honour of great masters , that the children of their servants born in their houses should be born their servants : solomon counts it a peece of his glory , that he had servants born in his house . and on the other side , it is a dis-honour to a king not to be able legally to lay claime to those born in his kingdome , but that another king , yea , an enemy might legally challenge them to be his subjects . so is it with the lord , he having left all the rest of the world , to be visibly the devils kingdome , will not for his owne glories sake permit the devill to come and lay visible claime to the sonnes and daughters , begotten by those who are the children of the most high . and thirdly , he doth it both for the comfort and duty of those who are in covenant with him , partly , i say , for their comfort and priviledge , while they may see their children visibly to be provided for by a better father , under a covenant of grace , to whose care , and under whose wing they may leave them , when themselves shall faile ; and partly to be an obligation to bring them up for god , not to themselves , much lesse to the devill , but ever to look upon themselves in the education of their children , to be but nursing fathers and mothers to train them up in the nurture and feare of the lord , unto whose kingdome , family and covenant they thus belong . i have been the larger upon these two first conclusions , because indeed the proving of these , gains the whole cause , if the covenant be the same and children belong to it , then they are to be owned as covenanters , and to be admitted to the distinguishing or discriminating sign betwixt gods people and the devils , and this the most learned of the anabaptists doe professe , that if they knew a childe to be holy , they would baptize it . in the other conclusions i shall be more briefe . the lord hath appointed and ordained a sacrament or seale of initiation to be administred unto them who enter into covenant with him , circumcision for the time of that administration which was before christs incarnation , baptisme since the time of his incarnation ; both of them the same sacrament for the sp●rituall part , though differing in the outward elements ; both appointed to be distinguishing signes , betwixt gods people and the devils people ; both of them the way and means of solemne entrance and admission into the church ; both of them to be administred but once , and none might be received into the communion of the church of the jewes , untill they were circumcised , nor into the communion of the church of the christians untill they be baptized ; none but the circumcised might eat of the paschall lamb , none may , but those who are baptized , be admitted to eat the lords supper , which succeeds in the room of the passeover , and this our lord himselfe taught us by his own example , who was circumcised , as a professed member of the church of the jews , and when he set up the new christian church , he would be initiated into it , by the sacrament of baptisme . of this conclusion there is no great doubt , but because some of the anabaptists doe deny the sacrament of baptisme to succeed in the roome , place , and use of circumcision , be pleased to observe how plaine the apostle makes it , coloss. 2.8 , 9 ; 10 , 11 , 12. where the apostles scope is to disswade the beleeving christians from the rudiments of the world and jewish ceremonies , and observations upon this ground , that we are compleate in christ , and that in him as in the head , the church hath all perfections , and because he would take them wholly off from circumcision , the use wherof ingaged them to the use of the rest of jewish ceremonies , he tels them , that in christ we are circumcised with a circumcision made without hands ( a better circumcision then the jewes was ) in putting off the body of the sinnes of the flesh by the circumcision of christ . and whereas the jewish teachers would be ready to object that the receiving of the inward grace of circumcision , did not make them so compleate as abraham and his seed was , because they also had an outward sensible signe whereby they might be farther perswaded , comforted and confirmed ; to this he answers , ver. 12. that neither is this priviledge wanting to christians who have as excellent and expresse a sacrament of it , being buried with christ in baptisme , the effect whereof he there sets downe , and therefore they needed not circumcision , as their false teachers insinuated , thereby directly teaching that our baptisme is in stead of their circumcision . and the analogy lies betweene two sacramentall types of the same substance [ regeneration ] to both jews and gentiles . and in truth had not baptisme come in the roome of it , the apostle could not have pitched upon a worse instance then that of circumcision , which was so much valued by them , and was so great and usefull a priviledge unto them : nor had there been any reason to have here named baptisme , but that he meant to shew baptism to christians was now in the roome of circumcision to the jews . that by gods owne expresse order , infants as well as growne men were in the time of the jewes to be initiated and sealed with the signe of circumcision : whether jewes by nature , or proselytes of the gentiles , one law was for them al , if they receive the covenant , they and their children receive circumcision : and although , as i touched before , this signe was actually applyed onely to the males , yet the females were virtually circumcised in them , as is apparent both because the whole church of the jewes were called the circumcision , and because by gods expresse order , no uncircumcised person might eate of the passeover , which we are sure the women did as well as the men . and whereas some who see which way the strength of this conclusion bendeth , doe alledge , that though circumcision was to be applyed to their infants , yet it was not as a seale of the spirituall part of the covenant of grace , but as a nationall badge , a seale of some temporall and earthly blessings and proviledges , as of their right to the land of canaan , &c. and that ishmael though he was circumcised for some temporall respects , yet he was not thereby brought under the covenant of grace , which was expresly said to be made with abraham in relation to isaac and his seed . i answer , there is nothing plainer then that the covenant whereof circumcision was the signe , was the covenant of grace ; abraham received circumcision a signe of the righteousnesse of faith , and the jewes received it not as a nation , but as a church , as a people separated from the world , and taken into covenant with god : it is true indeed , that circumcision bound them who received it to conforme to that manner of administration of the covenant which was carried , much , by a way of temporall blessings and punishments , they being types of spirituall things ; but no man can ever shew that any were to receive the sacrament of circumcision in relation to these outward things onely , or to them at all , further then they were administrations of the covenant of grace ; sure i am , the prosolytes and their children could not be circumcised in any relation at all to the temporall blessings of the land of canaan as they were temporall , because notwithstanding their circumcision they were not capable of receiving , or purchasing any inheritance at all in that land , sojourne there they might , as other strangers also did , but the inheritance of the land , no , not one foot of it could ever bee alienated from the severall tribes to whom it was distributed as their possession by the most high : for all the land was divided unto twelve tribes , and they were not any one of them allowed to sell their lands longer then till the yeare of jubilee , levit. 25.13 , &c. yea , i may boldly say that their circumcision was so farre from sealing to them the outward good things of the land , that it occasioned and tyed them to a greater expence of their temporall blessings by their long , and frequent , and chargeable journeyes , to worship at hierusalem . and as for what was alledged concerning ishmael ; the answer is easie , god indeed there declares that isaac should bee the type of christ , and that the covenant of grace should bee established and continue in his family ; yet both ishmael and the rest of abrahams family were really taken into covenant , untill afterward by apostasie they discovenanted themselves , as also did esau afterward , though he were the son of isaac , in whose family god had promised the covenant should continue . fifthly and lastly , the priviledges of beleevers under this last and best administration of the covenant of grace , are many wayes inlarged , made more honourable and comfortable , then ever they were in the time of the jewes administration ; many scriptures speake of the inlargement of their priviledges , not one for the diminishing or depressing , or extenuating of them ; that yoke , that hard and costly way of administration , which neither they nor their fathers were able to beare , is taken off from our shoulders ; our covenant is said to be established upon better promises , the glory of theirs had no glory in respect of ours , they were under the bondage of infants under age , in comparison of our freedome , we as well as they are called a holy nation , a peculiar people , a chosen generation , separated to him from all other people , to whom , as well as to them , belongs the adoption , the covenant , the promises ; we as well as they injoy him to be our father , and with his dearest son our lord , are made co-heires of the kingdome of glory ; we have all these things with advantage , not onely in the clearnesse of the administration , but in some sense in greater extent to persons with us , there is neither male nor female . some indeed goe about to shew , that in some things the jewes had greater priviledges then wee have , as that abraham had the priviledge to be called the father of the faithfull , that christ should bee borne of his flesh ; mary had the priviledge to be the mother of christ , and the whole nation this priviledge , that god will call in their seed againe , after they had been cast off for unbelief many hundred yeers , which priviledges , say they , none of the gentiles have , or can have . answ. but these things have no weight : we are inquiring for priviledges which are branches of the covenant of grace , which every man who is in covenant with god , may expect from god by vertue of the covenant , were he a jew or a proselyte , not for any particular or peculiar favour to a particular man or woman , or family , or tribe : all these forementioned things , and many other of the like kind ( as the ministery of the tabernacle and temple to belong to one tribe , the kingly office to one family ; such and such men never to lack a man of their house to stand before god ) proceeded indeed from free-grace , but were no parts of that covenant of grace which god made to abraham , and all his seed : for could every man in covenant challenge these things at gods hand , and that by vertue of the covenant ? could every one of them promise to himself that christ should be born of his flesh ? or every one of their women that she should be the mother of christ ? could every one whom god owned to be in covenant with him , promise by vertue of the covenant , that their children , if cast off by unbeleefe , should after many hundred yeers be again called in ? we speake only of such priviledges as were universall , and common to all who were in covenant , for which by vertue of the covenant they might relie upon god ; let any man shew out of the scripture where our priviledges under the gospel are cut short in any of these things , and he saith somwhat ; and in particular for the case in hand , concerning our infants right to the covenant of grace , and the seale of it , once we are sure the infant children of all covenanters were within the covenant , and the seale also belonged to them , and by vertue of the covenant ( which is still the same ) we plead their interest in it . let any man shew when and where this was taken away , when the infant-children of beleevers were expunged out of the covenant of grace ; certainly whoever will go about to deprive them of it , to cut off such a great part of the comfort of beleeving parents , must produce cleare testimonies , before they can perswade beleevers to part with either of them , either their right to the covenant , or to the seale of the covenant . for , first , their infants interest in the covenant , next to glory of god , and the salvation of their own souls , is the greatest benefit of the covenant of grace ; even this ( i say ) to have their children belong to gods family and kingdom , and not to the devils : certainly , the greatest treasure of parents is their children , and in them the salvation of their souls : now how uncomfortable a thing were this to parents , to take away the very ground of their hope , for the salvation of their children ? and i dare affirm it , that we have no ground of hope for any particular person , untill he be brought under the covenant of grace . all the world , as i have formerly touched , is divided into two kingdoms , the kingdom of christ , which is his church ; and the kingdom of satan , which is the rest of the world ; now so long as any person is visibly a member of the kingdom of christ ▪ we have no cause to doubt their election & salvation , until they visibly shew the contrary , although we know that there are some reprobate among them ; so on the other side , although we know christ hath many of his elect to be gathered out of the devils kingdom , yet we have no cause or ground to hope that any particular person is any other then a reprobate , being a visible professed member of satans kingdom , untill he give hope to the contrary : now what a most uncomfortable abridgment were this of the covenant of grace , thus apparently to cut off the seed of beleevers from their visible right in the church of christ , and to put them in the visible kingdome of satan ? and , secondly , as really unwilling must they look to find parents , to part with their childrens right to the seale of the covenant ; this their right to the covenant being all the ground of hope that beleeving parents can have that their infants who die in their infancy , are saved rather then the infants of turkes , had need bee sealed , if they live untill they are grown men , and give other signes of grace , they may conceive good hopes of them , though they were not sealed with a sacramentall seale : this therefore is apparent , that the cutting off our priviledges and comfort in these two were a great abridgment of the priviledges of the new covenant , and would put the seed of abrahams faith into a farre worse condition in regard of their posterity , then the seed of his flesh were in : and the jews in acts 2.39 . if this doctrine had been preached to them , might have replied unto st. peter , when he exhorted them to be baptized for their childrens good ; nay , peter , even therefore we will not be baptized , for as yet we are sure our children are in conant with god , and reckoned to his family ; but if we receive your new way , our children must be counted to the kingdom of the devill ; and so might they in coloss. 2. when paul told them they need not be circumcised , because baptism came in the room of it , they might have replied , that though they need not be circumcised themselves , yet they would still circumcise their children , because bap●ism was not to be applied to them according to these mens doctrine . upon these five conclusions , 1. that the covenant of grace is alwayes the same . 2. that the infants of those in covenant are alwayes reckoned covenanters with their parents . 3. that our baptisme succeeds in the room and use of their circumcision . 4. that by gods expresse order , their infants were to be circumcised , as it was a seale of the covenant . and 5. that our priviledges for our selves and our children are at least as honourable , large , and comfortable as theirs were : the conclusion follows undeniably , that therfore the infants of beleeving parents are to be baptized . against this argument the anabaptists object many things . they say the covenant was not the same ; some of them say , the children of the jewes were not under the covenant in relation to spirituall things : they say , circumcision and baptism served not for the same ends and uses : they say circumcision was administred as a nationall badge , and properly sealed temporal blessings : they say , whatever priviledges infants of beleevers had before christs time , they have now none at all ; and many such like things : all which i have so fully cleared in this former discourse , that i suppose i need not adde any more ; the main and only objection remaining , which hath any colour of weight in it , is this , there is no command , no expresse institution , or cleare example in all the new testament of baptizing of infants : and in the administration of sacraments , we are not to be led by our owne reason or grounds of seeming probability , but by the expresse order of christ , and no otherwise . if by institution , command and example , they meane an expresse syllabicall command , &c. i grant that in so many words it is not found in the new testament ; no expresse command in the new testament that they should be baptized ; no expresse example where children were baptized ; but i also adde , that i deny the consequence , that if in so many words it be not commanded in the new testament , it ought not to be done , this is not true divinity , that christians are not tyed to observe that , which is not expresly and in so many words set down in the new testament ; there is no expresse reviving of the laws concerning the forbidden degrees of marriage in the new testament , except of not having a mans fathers wife 1 cor. 8. no expresse law against polygamy , no expresse command for the celebration of a weekly sabbath ; are therefore christians free in all these cases ? yea , in the point of sacraments there is no expresse command , no example in all the new testament , where women received the sacrament of the lords supper ; there is no expresse command that the children of beleevers when they are grown , shoud be instructed and baptized , though instructed by their parents ; expresse command there is , that they should teach the heathen and the jewes , and make them disciples , and then baptize them , but no command that the children of those that are beleevers should be baptized when they are grown men ; nor any example where ever that was done ; will any man therfore say , that christian women are not to be partakers of the lords supper , nor the children of beleevers when growne men be baptized ? i think none will be so absurd as to affirm it . if it be said , though these things be not expressely , and in terminis in the new testament , yet they are there v●rtually , and by undeniable consequence ; i confesse it is true , so have we vertually , and by undeniable consequence sufficient evidence for the baptizing of children , both commands and examples ; for first we have gods command to abraham , as he was the father of all covenanters , that he should seale his children with the seale of the covenant . now this truth all our divines defend against the papists , that all gods commands and institutions about the sacraments of the jewes , bind us as much as they did them , in all things which belong to the substance of the covenant , and were not accidentall unto them : as because circumcision is called a seale of the covenant , therefore our sacraments are seales of the covenant ▪ because circumcision might be administred but once , being the seale of initiation ; therefore baptism being also the seale of initiation , is also to be administred but once . but that circumcision was to be administred upon the eighth day onely , was an accidentall thing , and therefore bindes not us ; the jewish passeover being to be yearely repeated , binds us to have a repetition of the sacrament of the lords supper , which came in roome of it , because this belongs to the substance of the covenant , both of them being sacraments for spirituall nourishment , growth and continuance in the covenant ; ( as the other was for birth and entrance ) but that their passeover was to be eaten in an evening , and upon one set evening in the yeare was accidentall , and so binds not us . the like instance i give in our christian sabbath : the fourth commandement binds us for the substance of it as much as ever it bound the jewes ; there god once for all separated one day of seven to be sacred to himselfe , and all the world stood bound in all ages to give unto god that one day of seven , which should be of his owne choosing . now untill christs time god chose the last day of the seven to be his sabbath , and having by the death and resurrection of our lord jesus , put an end to the saturday sabbath , and surrogated the first day of the weeke in stead thereof to be the lords day , we need no new commandment for the keeping of the lords day , being tyed by the fourth commandment to keep that day of seven which the lord should choose , the lord having chosen this , the fourth commandment binds us to this , as it did the jews to the former : so in like manner i say in the sacrament of baptisme . when god made the covenant with abraham , and promised for his part to be the god of him and his seed , what god promised to abraham , we claime our part in it , as the children of abrahams , and what god required on abrahams part for the substance of obedience , we all stand charged with , as well as abraham ; we as abraham are tyed to beleeve , to love the lord with all our heart , to have our heart circumcised , to walke before god in uprightnesse , to instruct our children , and bring them up for god and not for our selves , nor for the devill , to teach them to worship god according to his revealed will , to traine them up under the ordinances and institutions of gods owne appointment : all these things gods command to abraham charges upon all the children of the covenant , though there were no expresse reviving these commands in any part of the new testament , and therefore consequently that command of god to abraham which bound his seed of the jewes , to traine up their children in that manner of worship which was then in force , bindes the seed of abraham , now to traine up their children in conformity to such ordinances as now are in force . and the same command which injoyned abraham to seale his children with the seale of the covenant , injoynes us as strongly to seale ours with the seale of the covenant , and that command of god which expressely bound abraham to seale his with the signe of circumcision which was the sacrament then in force , pro tempore ; doth vertually binde us to seale ours with the signe of baptisme , which is the sacrament now in force , and succeeds in the roome of the other by his owne appointment . there is one command by cleare consequence , another you shall find , matth. 28. where our saviour bids them goe and teach all nations , baptizing them in the name of the father , and of the sanne , and of the holy ghost . where you have two things : first , what they were to doe ; secondly , to whom they were to doe it . they were to preach and teach all things which he had commanded them , that is , they were to preach the whole gospel , mark . 16.15 . the whole covenant of grace , containing all the promises , whereof this is one , viz. that god will be the god of beleevers , and of their seed , that the seed of beleevers are taken into covenant with their parents . this is a part of the gospel preached unto abraham , and they were to baptize them , that is , to administer baptisme as a seale of the covenant to all who received the covenant . secondly , wee have the persons to whom they were to doe this , all nations , whereas before the church was tyed to one nation , one nation onely were disciples , now their commission was extended to make all nations disciples , every nation which should receive the faith should be to him now , as the peculiar nation of the jewes had beene in time past . in a word , nations here are opposed to the one nation before . now we know when that one nation of the jewes were made disciples , and circumcised their infants were made disciples , ( made to belong to gods schoole ) and circumcised with them , when that nation was made disciples in abrahams loynes , and circumcised , their seed also was the same , when that nation was taken out of egypt , and actually made disciples , their children were also with them ; and we know that in every nation the children make a great part of the nation , and are alwayes included under every administration to the nation , whether promises or threatnings , priviledges or burthens , mercies or judgements , unlesse they be excepted ; so are they in cities , in families , it being the way of the scripture , when speaking indefinitely of a people , nation , city or family , to be either saved or damned , to receive mercies or punishments , expresly to except infants when they are to be excepted , as we see in the judgement that befell israel in the wildernesse , when all that rebellious company that came out of egypt , was to perish by gods righteous doome , their little ones were expresly excepted , num. 14.31 . and in the covenant actually entred into by the body of the nation , neh. 10. it is expresly limited to them who had knowledge and understanding . and the disciples who received this commission knew well , that in all gods former administrations , when any parents were made disciples , their children were taken in with them to appertaine to the same schoole , and therefore it behooved the lord to give them a caution for the leaving out of infants in this new administration , that they might know his mind , if that he intends to have them left out , which that ever he did in word or deed , cannot be found in the scriptures . if it be said , they are not capable of being disciples : i answer , even as capable as the infants of jews , and proselytes were , when they were made disciples : and beside , they are devoted to be disciples , being to be trained up by the parents , who are from their infancy to teach them the knowledge of christ , and at the present , they are capable of his owne teaching : and sure i am in christs owne dialect , to belong to christ , and to be a disciple of christ , or to beare the name of christ , is all one ; and that such infants do belong to christ , and beare the name of christ , i have sufficiently proved already . and i desire it may be seriously weighed whether that expression , act. 10.15 . now therefore why tempt ye god to put a yoke upon the necks of the disciples , do not necessitate us , to give the name of disciples to infants , as well as to grown men : for i reason thus , all they upon whose necks those false teachers would have put the yoke of circumcision are called disciples , and to be called disciples : but they would have put the yoke of circumcision upon infants , as well as grown men : therefore infants as well as grown men are called disciples and to be called so . the major is undenyable , the minor i prove thus : they who pressed circumcision to be in force , according to the manner of moses law , and would put it upon their necks after the manner of moses his law , they would put it upon infants of those who were in covenant with god , as well as upon the necks of those who were grown men , for so moses law required : but these fals teachers pressed circumcision to be so in force , as is apparent , act. 15.1 . another command by good consequence for the baptizing of infants , you shall find in that forementioned place where the apostle exhorted them to repent & be baptized , &c. because the promise was made to them and to their children , which , as i shewed you , clearely proves that the children of such who beleeve and are baptized , are taken into covenant , and therefore by good consequence they also are to receive the seale of the covenant . the text not onely shewing that they are within the covenant , but also that a right to baptisme is a consequence of being within the covenant . thus for commands : for examples , though there should be none , there is no great argument in it , when the rule is so plain , yet we have examples enough , by good consequence , for you shall finde the gospell took place , just as the old administration , by bringing in whole families together ; when abraham was taken in , his whole family was taken in with him ; when any of the gentiles turned proselytes , ordinarily their families came in with them : so in this new administration , usually if the master of the house turned christian , his whole family came in and were baptized with him ; the whole household of cornelius , the first converted gentile , act. 11.14 . the household of stephanus ; the household of aristobulus ; the household of narcissus ; the household of lydia ; the household of the gaoler ; these are examples not to be contemned . and whereas some object against this argument , taken from whole families , that the argument is at least as strong to prove that the jewish infants did eat the passeover , because not only severall families might , but did , and that by gods appointment , eat the passeover . i answer , by denying the consequence , the argument is not so strong , for the one as for the other , because no other scripture shews that the passeover doth belong to infants ; but we have other plaine scriptures proving that baptisme is in the room of circumcision , which belongs therefore to infants , as well as grown men : if any can instance of any families of gentiles who were circumcised , the consequence were good , therefore infants were , if there were any infants , because other scriptures shew that circumcision belongs to infants as well as grown men , but in this case the argument is not good . so much for my first and main argument , they are foederati , and therefore must be signati , they are under the covenant of grace , and therefore are to be signed with the seale of admittance into the covenant ▪ the second argument , to whom the inward grace of baptism doth belong , to them belongs the outward sign , they ought to have the signe , who have the thing signifyed ; the earthly part of the sacrament must be granted to them who have the heavenly part : but the infants of beleevers , even while they are infants are made partakers of the inward grace of baptisme , of the heavenly and spirituall part , as well as grown men : therefore they may , and ought to receive the outward sign of baptism . the major proposition , that they who are made partakers of the inward grace , may not bee debarred of the outward signe , is undeniable , it is peters argument , act. 10. can any man forbid water that these should not bee baptized , who have rece●ved the holy ghost as well as wee ? and againe , act. 11. for as much as god gave them the like gift as hee did unto us , what was i that i could withstand god ? and this is so cleare , that the most learned of the anabaptists do readily grant , that if they knew any infants to have received the inward grace , they durst not deny them the outward signe , and that the particular infants , whom christ took up in his armes and blessed , might have been baptized . and for the assumption or m●nor , that the infants of beleevers , even while they are infants , do receive the inward grace , as well as grown men , is as plaine , not onely by that speech of the apostle , who saith , they are holy , but our saviour saith expressely , mark . 10. that to such belongs the kingdom of god , as well as to grown men : and whereas some would evade it , by saying that the text saith not , to them belongs the kingdome of god , but of such is the kingdome of heaven , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , of such like , that is , such as are graced with such like qualities , who are humble and meek , as children are , and that luk. 18. is parallell to this , in the meaning of it , whosoever doth not receive the kingdome of heaven as a little childe , hee shall not enter therein . but i answer , though it be true that in other places this is one use that christ makes of an infants age and condition , to shew that such as receive the kingdome of heaven , must be qualifyed with humility , &c. like unto children ; yet here it cannot be his meaning , because his argument is , suffer them to come to mee and forbid them not , because of such is the kingdome of god , that is , my church and kingdom is made up of these as well as of others . this was the very cause why the disciples rebuked those who brought the children to christ , because they were little , not fit to bee instructed , and therefore not fit that christ should be troubled about them ; this christ rebukes in them , and tels them that the littlenesse of children , is no argument why they should be kept from him : suffer them , said he , to come , and forbid them not , for of such is the kingdome of god : and what kind of argument had this been , if the text should be interpreted as these men would have it , suffer little children to come unto me , that i may touch them , take them up in mine armes , put my hands upon them , and blesse them , because the kingdom of god belongs to them , who have such like qualities , who resemble children in some select properties ? by the very same ground , if any had brought doves , and sheep to christ , to put his hands upon them , and blesse them , the disciples had been liable to the same reproofe , because of such is the kingdome of god , such as are partakers of the kingdom of god , must be indued with such like properties . beside , what one thing can be named belonging to the initiation , and being of a christian , whereof baptisme is a seale , which infants are not capable of , as well as grown men ? they are capable of receiving the holy ghost , of union with christ , of adoption , of forgivenesse of sins , of regeneration , of everlasting life , all which things are signifyed and sealed in the sacrament o● baptism . and it is further considerable , that in the working of that inward grace , of which baptism is the sign and seale , all who partake of that grace , are but meere patients , and contribute no more to it , then a childe doth to its own begetting , and therefore infants as fit subjects to have it wrought in them as grown men , and the most grown men are in no more fitnesse to receive this grace when it is given them , in respect either of any faith or repentance , which they yet have , then a very little childe , it being the primary intention of the covenant of grace , in its first worke , to shew what free grace can and wil do to miserable nothing , to cut miserable man off from the wild olive , and graffe him into the true olive , to take away the heart of stone , to create in them a heart of flesh , to forgive their iniquities , to love them freely , what doth the most grown man in any of these , more then an infant may do ? being onely passive in them all ; and of this first grace is the sacrament of baptism properly a seale : and who ever will deny , that infants are capable of these things as well as grown men ; must deny that any infants dying in their infancy are saved by christ . against this argument severall things are objected : which i shall indevour to remove out of the way . first , it is said , that although infants are capable of these things , and they no doubt are by christ wrought in many infants , yet may not we baptize them , because , according to the scripture pattern , both of christs command , matth. 28. in his institution of baptisme , where this was injoyned ; and john the baptist , christs disciples , and apostles , they alwaies taught and made them disciples by teaching , before they baptized any . i answer , first , that of matth. 28. is not the institution of baptisme , it was instituted long before , to be the seale of the covenant ; it 's only an inlargement of their commission , whereas before they were to go onely to the lost sheepe of the house of israel , now they were to go unto all the world . and beside , it is no where said , that none were baptized , but such as were first taught , and what reason we have to beleeve the contrary , you have before seen . secondly , it is said indeed , that they taught and baptized , and no expresse mention made of any other : but the reason is plain , there was a new church to be constituted , all the jews who should receive christ , were to come under another administration , and their infants were to come in only in their right , and the heathen nations who were to be converted to christ , were yet wholly without the covenant of grace , and their children could have no right untill themselves were brought in ; and therefore no marvaile , though both john , and christs disciples , and apostles , did teach before they baptized , because then no other were capable of baptism : but when once themselves were instructed and baptized , then their children were capable of it , by vertue of the covenant . if any in the jewish church had received commission , to go and make other cities , proselytes to them , their commission must have run thus , go teach and circumcise , would it therefore have followed , that none might be circumcised , but such as were first taught ? but it is expresly said , that hee that beleeves and is baptized , shall bee saved ; faith in christ is the condition , upon which men may be baptized : and this is the most common objection among the anabaptists : unbeleevers may not bee baptized , children are unbeleevers , therefore they may not bee baptized . we have , say they , cleare evidence , that faith is a condition required in those that are to be baptized , no evidence of any other condition that makes them capable of baptism . others of them adde , that under an affirmative command , the negative is to be included , beleeving is the affirmative , unbeleeving is the negative , therefore where beleevers are commanded to be baptized , unbeleevers are forbidden to be baptized : this objection they much glory in , and some of them dare all the world to answer it . i answer first , but if this argument have any strength at all against the baptizing of infants , it hath much more strength against the salvation of infants ; it is said expresly , he that beleeveth , and is baptized , shall be saved ; but he that beleeveth not , shall bee damned : there yee have both the negative and affirmative set downe , hee that beleeves shall bee saved , hee that beleeves not shall bee damned ; now i frame their owne argument thus against the salvation of infants , all unbeleevers shall bee damned , all infants are unbeleevers , therefore they shall bee damned ; now look at what doore they will goe out , for the salvation of infants , at the same will we go out , for the baptizing of infants ; how ever they will evade the one , we shall much more strongly evade the other , if they say this text is meant of growne men , of the way which god takes for the salvation of grown men , infants are saved another way , upon other conditions ; the same say we of infants baptisme , the text means of the condition of baptizing of grown men , infants are baptized upon other conditions ; if , they say , infants though they cannot have actuall faith , they may have virtuall faith , faith in the seed and roote , the same say we ; if they say , though infants have not faith , yet they may have that which is analogous to faith , the same say we , they have somwhat which hath analogy to faith , and as effectuall to make them capable of baptism , as of salvation . secondly , i answer , it is no where said unbeleevers , ( or rather non-beleevers it should be said ) may not bee baptized ; it is said indeed , hee that beleeveth and is baptized , shall bee saved ; and it is said , that he that beleeveth with all his heart , may be baptized ; it is no where said , that he that beleeveth not , may not be baptized : therfore i deny the consequence , if all beleevers must be baptized , then no unbeleevers , or non-beleevers may be baptized ; these two are not here intended by way of opposition , christ excludes infants neither from baptism , nor from salvation for want of faith , but positive unbeleevers , and such as refuse the gospel he excludes from both : the stone upon which these men stumble , is the ignorance in the opposition in the scripture they bring , which is not betweene beleevers , and their children , but betweene them , and unbeleeving and profane persons who are shut from the lords covenant , baptisme , and salvation . but suppose they are capable of the inward grace of baptisme , and that god doth effectually work it in some of the infants of beleevers , is that sufficient warrant for us to baptize all the infants of beleevers ? if we knew in what infants the lord did work this , we might baptize those infants , say some of them , but that he doth not make known to us , we cannot know of any one infant by any ordinary way of knowledge , that they are inwardly baptized with the holy ghost ; and therefore we may not baptize any of them , but wait to see when and in whom god will work the thing signified , and then apply the signe to them . answ. our knowledge that god hath effectually wrought the thing signified , is not the condition upon which wee are to apply the signe , god no where requires that we should know that they are inwardly and certainly converted , whom we admit to the sacrament of baptism , the apostles themselves were not required to know this of those whom they baptized , if they were , they sinned in baptizing simon magus , alexander , hymenaeus , ananias and saphira , with others : we are indeed required to know that they have in them that condition which must warrant us to administer the signe , not that which makes them possest of the thing signified ; fallible conjectures are not to be our rule in administring of sacraments , either to infants of grown men , but a known rule of the word , out of which rule we must be able to make up such a judgment , that our administration may be of faith , as well as out of charity : in baptizing or grown men , the apostles and ministers of christ administred the signe , not because they conjectured that the parties were inwardly sanctified , but because they made that profession of faith and holinesse of which they were sure , that whoever had the thing in truth , were received by christ into inward communion with himself , and that whoever thus made it ; that christ would have them received into the communion of his church , though possibly for want of the inward work they were never received into the inward communion with iesus christ , indeed when such a confession was made , christian charity which alwaies hopeth the best , and thinketh no evill , bound them to receive them , and think of them , and converse with them , as with men in whom the inward work was wrought , untill they gave signes to the contrary ; but this their charity , or charitable conjecture was not the grou●d of their admitting them to the ordinance , but the profession and confession of the party , made according to the word , which they were bound to rest in ; yea , i greatly question , whether in case peter or paul could by the spirit of revelation have known that ananias or alexander would have proved no better then hypocrites , whether they either would , or ought to have refused them from baptism , whilst they made that publike profession and confession , upon which others were admitted who in the event proved no better then those were . so that i conclude , not our knowledge of their inward sanctification , is requisite to the admitting of any to baptism , but our knowledge of the will of christ , that such who are in such and such condition , should by us be received into the communion of the church : and in this the rule to direct our knowledge , is as plain for infants as for growne men , the rule having been alwaies this , that growne men who were strangers from the covenant of god , unbeleevers , pagans , heathens , should upon their being instructed , and upon profession of their faith and promise to walke according to the rule of the covenant ; bee received and added to the church , and made partakers of the seale of their entrance , and their infants to come in with them ; both sorts upon their admission to be charitably hoped of , untill they give signes to the contrary , charity being bound from thinking of evill of them , not tyed to conclude certainly of any of them , because they ought to know that in all ages , all are not israel who are of israel , and that many are called , but few are chosen . but all who enter into covenant , and receive the seale of the covenant , must stipulate for their parts , as well as god doth for his , they must indent with god to perform the beleevers part of the covenant , as well as god doth to perform his part , as even this text , 1 pet. 3. requires , that baptism which saves us must have the answer of a good conscience to god ; now although it be granted , that infants are capable of receiving the first grace , if god be pleased to work it in them ; yet what answer of a good conscience can there be from infants unto god ? they having not the use of reason , and not knowing what the covenant meanes ? answ. the infants of the jewes were as much tied as the infants of beleevers under the gospel , every one who was circumcised was bound to keepe the law , gal. 5. and these men professe that israelitish infants were within the old covenant , when yet they knew not what it meant , nor could have the same use of it with their parents and others of discretion . looke what answer they will make for the jewes infants , if true , will abundantly satisfie for the infants of beleevers under the gospel . secondly , god seales to them presently , their name is put into the deed , and when they come to yeers of discretion , to be adulti , then in their own persons they stand obliged to the performance of it ; in the meane time jesus christ , who is the surety of the covenant , and the surety of all the covenanters , is pleased to be their surety ; we know when severall parties stand obliged in the same bond , they may seale at severall times , and yet be in force afterward together ; or even a child sealing in infancy , may aguize and recognize that sealing , when they come to yees of discretion ; if then they will renounce it , as done when they understood not , they may free themselves if they please , if they find the former act an inconvenience or burden to them : so is it here , god of his infinite mercy is pleased to seale to infants while they are such , and accepts of such a seale on their parts , as they are able to give in their infant age , expecting a further ratification on their part , when they are come to riper yeers , in the meane time affording them the favour and priviledge of being in covenant with him , of being reckoned unto his kingdom and family , rather then of the devils ; if when they are grown men they refuse to stand to this covenant there is no hurt done on gods part , let them serve another god , and take their lot for time to come . but what benefit comes to children by such kind of sealing as this is ? it seems then ( say they ) by your own confession , that this is but a conditionall sealing on gods part , viz : that they own it , and ratifie it when they come to age , and if they then refuse to stand to it , all is then nullified , were it not therefore better to defer it to their years of discretion , to see whether they will then make it their own voluntary act , yea , or no ? answ. 1. this objection lay as strongly against gods widsome in requiring the jewes infants , even in their infancy thus to seale ; and therefore argues no great wisdome or modesty in men , who would thus reason with god about his administrations . 2. god hath other ends and uses of applying the seale of the covenant to them who are in covenant with him , then their present gaine , it 's a homage , worship , and honour to himself , and it behoves us even in that respect , to fulfill all righteousnesse : when christ was baptized and circumcised , he was as unfit for the ordinance , through his perfection , as children through their imperfection , being as much above them , as children are below them . 3. i answer ; the benefit and fruit of it at the present is very much , both to the parents and to the children ; to the parents first , whilst god doth hereby honour them to have their children counted to his church , to his kingdome , and family , to be under his wing and grace , whilest all the other infants in the world have their visible standing under the prince , and in the kingdom of darknesse , and consequently whilest others have no hope of their childrens spiritual welfare , untill they be called out of that condition ▪ these need not have any doubt of their childrens welfare , if they die in their infancy , nor if they live untill they shew signes to the contrary : god having both reckoned them unto his people , and given them all the meanes of salvation , which an infants age is capable of . secondly , here is much priviledge and benefit to the children , when as ( beside what inward secret worke god is pleased to worke in them ) they being members of the church of christ have their share in the communion of saints are remembred at the throne of grace , every day by those that pray for the welfare of the church , and perticularly in those prayers which are made for his blessing upon his ordinances . and lastly , it 's no small priviledge to have that seale bestowed upon them in their infancy , wch may afterwards plead when they are grown and come to fulfill the condition . but if their being capable of the spirituall part , must intitle them to the outward signe , why then doe we not also admit them to the sacrament of the lords supper , which is the seale of the covenant of grace , as well as the sacrament of baptisme ? and this is urged , the rather , because ( say they ) the infants of the jewes did eate of the passeover , as well as were circumcised ; now if our infants have every way as large a priviledge as the infants of the jewes had , then can we not deny them the same priviledge which their infants had , and consequently they must partake of the one sacrament , as well as the other . i answer , that infants are capable of the grace of baptisme we are sure , not sure that they are capable of the grace signed and sealed in the sacrament of the lords supper , for though both of them are seales of the new covenant , yet it is with some difference ; baptisme properly seales the entra●ce into it , the lords supper properly the growth , nourishment and augmentation of it ; baptisme for our birth , the lords supper for our food ; now infants may be borne againe while they are infants , have their originall sinne pardoned , be united to christ , have his image stampt upon them , but concerning the exercise of these graces and the augmentat●on of them in infants , while they are infants , the scripture is altogether silent , and for what is said concerning the infants of the jewes eating the passeover , to which our sacrament of the lords supper doth succeed , there is no such thing mentioned in all the booke of god , it is said indeed that the severall families were to eate their lambe , if the household were not too little for it , and that when their children should aske them what that service meant , they should instruct them about the meaning of it ; but no word injoyning , nor any example witnessing , that their little children did eate of it . if they say ( as some of them doe ) that those little ones , who were able to enquire concerning the meaning of that service , and capable to receive instruction about it , did eat of the passeover with their parents ; i answer , ( although the scripture speakes nothing of their eating , yet if that be granted ) it is no prejudice to us , because the gospel prohibites not such yong ones from the lords supper , who are able to examine themselves , and discerne the lords body . thus have i according to my poor ability made good this second argument also , and vindicated it from all objections of any weight wch i have met with all to the contrary , it remains that i winde up all , with a briefe application . and first it serves for just reproofe of the anabaptists , and all such as by their rash and bloody sentence condemne infants , as out of the state of grace ; it 's a great sinne to passe sentence upon any particular person for any one act , as was that of eli , concerning hannah , how much more heinous is it to condemne ail the infants of the whole church of christ , as having nothing to doe with the covenant of grace , or the seale of it ? we read of herod the tyrant , that he destroyed all the children in bethlehem , and the coasts thereof from two yeares old and under ; is not this a farre more cruell sentence , to set these in no better state then pagans and infidels , without christ , aliens from the common-wealth of israel , as strangers from the covenant of promise , having no hope , and w●thout god in the world ? can any sober christian thinke this a small fault ? our blessed saviour saith , it is not lawfull to take the childrens bread and give it to dogs , but these men take children , and in their judgement , conclude them for no better then dogs ; baptisme is the bread of the lord , which he would have given to his children , and to deny it to them as none of their right , is to make them no better then dogs . the prophet elisha wept when he looked upon hazael , because he foresaw that he would dash the infants of israel against the wall , and even hazael thought himselfe worthy to be esteemed a dog if ever he should do such a thing . but certainly , thus to dash all infant children of beleevers out of the covenant of grace ( as much as in them lyeth ) & to deprive them of the seale of it , is in a spirituall sense farre more heavy . and i dare appeale to the tender bowels of any beleeving parents , whether it were not easier for them to thinke that their infants should be dashed against the stones , and yet in the meane time to die under christs wing , as visible members of his kingdome , church and family , rather then to have them live , and behold them to have a visible standing onely in the kingdome of the devill : these men know not how much they provoke christs displeasure against themselves ; he was greatly displeased with his owne disciples for forbidding little children to come unto him ; & one day such men will know , that he is much more displeased with them , who with so great violence oppose the bringing of beleevers children unto his holy sacrament , that with unspeakable wrong , injury , and slander , they prosecute all the ministers of christ , who give infants this their due , condemning them for ministers of antichrist , and limbes of the beast ; yea , some of them proceeding so farre , as condemning all the churches of christ , to be no churches , who cast not their children out of the covenant of grace , and the seale of it , and doe cry out upon the baptizing of infants , as one of those great sinnes which bring and continue all our judgements upon us . the apostate emperour julian is justly cryed out upon for his cruelty against the christians , for denying to their bodies humane sepulture ; how much more cruell is it to deny to the souls of infants the just priviledge and benefit of the covenant of grace ? we know he did it out of hatred to christianity , which i am farre from charging upon these men ; but if we compare the sentence and fact of the one with the other , we shall find the latter ( be their principle what it will ) farre more injurious to the church of christ then the other : the lord in mercy give them to see how unjust that sentence , and how heavy that doome is , which they thus passe , not only upon infant children , but upon all the churches of christ ; and seriously to consider , whether the lord , who once in his displeasure threatned to dash their infants against the stones , who had dasht the infants of the children of israel against the stones , will indure it at the hands of any to expunge the seed of the faithfull out of his covenant , and to drive them from his city and kingdom after this cruell manner . secondly , how much may this comfort the soule of every beleeving parent , to behold this great love and goodnesse of god in his covenant of grace to them and their posterity , that not only themselves , but even their infants for their sakes , should be reckoned to the household of god , put into the arke , wrapped up in a covenant of love , brought under the wing of god ? when god had promised to david , that he should have a son to whom god would be a father , and that all his posterity , should after such a gracious manner be regarded , his heart was even ravished with it , o lord god ( said he ) what am i , and what is my house , that thou hast brought mee hitherto ? and this was yet a small thing in thy sight , o lord god , but thou hast spoken also of thy servants house for a great while to come , and is this the manner of men , o lord god ? and even so should christian parents break out into admiration of his goodnesse , in taking their children into that gracious covenant , which is not only the womb and vessell , but also the well-head of so many mercies , which are terminated , not in themselves , but flow down to their posterity from generation to generation . and this is yet more admirable in our eyes , when we seriously consider , how uncleane and filthy , how viperous a brood they are , as proceeding out of our loines , empty of all goodnesse , full of all wickednesse , an uncleane leprosie having bespread them from the crown of the head to the sole of the foot , fit only to be cast into the open field , to the loathing of their persons , in the day that they are born , as all the rest of the world are ; and that god should set his heart upon such as these , to take them thus neere unto himself , when he passes by both parents and infants of all the world beside , now would our hearts melt in his praises , if we could consider these things ? 2. how should this ingage all christian parents to look to the education of their children , to bring them up in the nurture and feare of the lord ? it 's a wofull thing , to consider the wretched carelesnesse of many parents ; yea , not onely carelesnesse , but ungodlinesse of many parents ; who prostitute their children to the devill and his service , after they have consecrated them to christ by baptisme ; train them up in ignorance , profanenesse , &c. to whom god may say , as he did to that harlot , ezek. 16. thou hast taken my sonne and my daughter , whom thou hast born unto mee , and these thou hast sacrificed unto devils . a generation of wretched men , who take more care of their hogs and dogs , then they doe of their infants immortall soules , nourishing the former , murdering the latter ; that we may say of them , as augustus did of herod , that it is better to be herods dog then his son . i have often heard a sad story of a wretched woman , who perswaded her daughter to yeeld to the lust of a rich man , in hope he would marry her , as he had promised to doe ; which she did , and presently after fell sick and died ; the wretched mother hereupon grew distracted , and in her madnesse cryed out , o my daughters soule , my daughters soule , i have damned my daughters soul : verily , thus may many parents cry out upon themselves for murthering their childrens soules ; and their children may wish that they had beene either dogges , or swine , rather then their sons or daughters ; miserable children , of miserable parents ; what will such parents answer god , when he comes to demand his children of them ? suppose a prince or noble man should put a child to nurse unto some mean man , and pay them well for the education of it ; or rather suppose a great man should adopt the child of a poor man to be his own , and should say unto this poore man , as pharaohs daughter said to moses mother , bring up this child for mee , and i will give thee thy wages ; & afterward comming to see this child , should find they had lamed the child ▪ and taught it nothing but to speake evill of them , and to fight against them : thinke i pray you what they would say , or doe to this wretched man . how much more abominable is the sin of many parents , who by their own carelesnesse , and vile example , leaven their children with principles , and lead them in wayes quite contrary to the covenant of grace , tending to nothing , but to dishonour god , and to their own destruction . if any of you have been guilty of it in time past , be deeply humbled for it , crave mercy and pardon ; and for time to come , indeavour to do the part of a nursing father or mother for christ , looking upon thy children as being christs more then thine , yea , as not being thine , but christs , to whom thou hast consecrated them , and therefore ( as wise and loving nurses use to doe ) carry them often to their father for his blessing , and he will blesse them , and reward thee also ; we find in the second of joel , that in the day of their fast , they were to bring their children and set them before the lord , that he might be moved to compassion for the childrens sake whom he used to call his owne ; set thou thy children often before him , intreat him as joseph did his father for his two sonnes , and as they did our saviour , marke 10. that he would put his hands upon them and blesse them ; doe it heartily , humbly , frequently , tell him how deare they are to thee , and the dearer because he is pleased to owne them , tell him their wants , and thy own inability to supply them in any thing , and how easie it is for him to doe it by his spirit and grace ; oh that ishmael might live in thy sight , said abraham ; say thou so also , lord let these children live before thee , thine they are , and thou gavest them me to bring up for thee , oh blesse my labour among them , and make them such as thou wouldest have them to be . and doe not onely pray for them , but discipline them and instruct them , acquainting them with the scriptures , and catechising them in the principles of religion ; as the mother and grandmother of timothy did him , training him up from his infancy , in the knowledge of the holy scripture ; and be assured , if thy children may learne from thee to know their heavenly father , to beleeve in him , to love him , and feare him betimes , that being taught the trade in their youth , they may not forsake it when they are old , they will then more blesse god for thee , then if thou couldest leave them all the world for their inheritance ; it was for this that solomon gloried in his father and mother , prov. 4.2 , 3. and for this will thy children rise up and call thee blessed . thus shalt thou approve thy selfe a true sonne of abraham ; thus shall thy children be blessed with faithfull abraham , thus shall the covenant , the spirituall part and benefit of it , as well as the outward , rest upon thy posterity from generation to generation . thirdly , and lastly , this serves for use to all children whom god honours so farre , as in their infancy to bring thus neare unto himselfe , and to use them thus as his owne , and that three severall wayes ; first , to incourage and comfort them to beleeve in him , and rest upon him , for all the good things which he hath promised in the covenant of grace . the papists , as in some things they give and ascribe too much to baptisme , making it to take away originall sinne , ex opere operato : so in other things they rob gods people of the comfortable use of it , because they say that when once we commit actuall sinnes we make shipwracke of baptism , and then penance must be secunda tabula post naufragium , a cockbot after our shipwrack ; but this blessed sacrament seekes for a more durable and comfortable use , even to be an arke , as my text cals it , to carry to heaven . know then that whensoever thou findest thy selfe at a losse , sensible of thy undone condition , findest thy guilt , and filth , and bondage , through sinne , and flyest unto christ , and thy conscience witnesseth with thee , that thou wouldest walke for time to come , according to the rule of the covenant , in uprightnesse , to make god in christ thy portion , and his word thy guide ; so often i say as thou doest this , maiest thou fly to thy baptisme , and plead it for thy comfort , as we may plead the rainbow in foule weather against the worlds destruction by water . i have often heard a story of a great queen , who gave a ring to a nobleman , while he was her favourite , and willed him to send it to her when he should stand in greatest need of her favour ; who afterward falling into her displeasure , sent the ring , which through the treachery of the bearer was not delivered till it was too late : but it shall never happen so to thee , doe thou in all thy extremity , shew or send by the hand of faith thy seale , which god hath given thee , plead it confidently , and to thy dying day , it may be an arke unto thy soule in all cases of relapse , desertion , temptation , or whatever else may betide thee , upon the renewing of thy repentance and faith in christ jesus . secondly , this great love of god in taking us thus neare into his own family , as his own children , should make many of us blush , to remember our unworthy conversation , in times past ; yea , it might make our very hearts to bleed , and make us not only wish we had been unbaptized , but even unborn , rather then to pollute the holy covenant , and the seale of it , as we have done with our unhallowed lives : can it seem a light thing in our eyes , that when god hath left the greatest part of the world , as strangers from his family and kingdom , to be under satans kingdom , and taken us ( no better by nature than they are ) to be his peculiar ones into covenant with him , that he should sweare unto us , to be our god , and hitherto to train us up under such heavenly ordinances , and we to walk in the meane time as rebels and enemies unto him , like the unbaptized world ? can we think our condemnation not to be greater then theirs ? let me a little reason the case with you , doe you know into what a covenant the lord hath taken you ? what he hath done for you , and expects from you ? have not your ministers and parents instructed you in it ? now tell me what is the reason of your unanswerable conversation , is it because you renounce the covenant , as being made when you understood it not ? if so , that you do indeed renounce it , take your course , serve the god you have chosen , yet tell me ( i beseech you ) what iniquity is in the lords covenant ? what hurt is there in it ? what disadvantage have you met withall ? or where and how do you hope to find better things , then god to be your father , christ jesus to bee your saviour , the spirit to bee your comforter ? to have your sins pardoned and healed , to be adopted , justifyed , sanctifyed , and every way comfortably provided for here , and saved for ever ? doe the gods you have chosen to serve , provide better things then these , that you renounce christ for their sakes ? if you say , god forbid you should renounce christ ; no , you hope to bee saved by christ , as well as any other : then tell me in good sadnesse , doe you expect that christ should stand bound to perform his part of the covenant , and you left at liberty for your part ? that he should love you , and you hate him ? that he should bee your god , and you remain the devils servant ? that he should provide heaven for you , and you walk in the way which leads to hell ? o how much are you deceived ! i tell you he hath sworn the contrary , he hath heaped up tribulation and wrath for every soule which doth evill , for the jew first , for the baptized first ; and you will one day find , that it had been better you had never lived in his house , nor been trained up under his covenant , then thus to profane it , and make the blood of it as an unholy thing . this great priviledge should ingage us all for time to come , to make our baptism a continual motive to an answerable conversation , to live as men who are dead unto sinne , and alive unto god ; to account that it ought to bee as strange , to see a baptized man walke in a sinfull course as to see a spectrum a walking ghost : wee are buried with christ in baptisme ; and how can wee who are dead to sinne live any longer therein ? we are planted into his family , made his children , have his spirit dwelling in us ; yea , thereby made one with christ : all this , we lay claim to , by our baptism , shall not this inforce us to live answerably ? luther tels a story of a gracious virgin , who used to get the victory over satan when he tempted her to any sinne , satan i may not doe it , baptizata sum , i am baptized , and must walk accordingly : so should we argue , let base persons live basely , noble and generous men must live nobly ; let turkes and pagans live wickedly , the holy seed must live holily and righteously : keepe it daily in thy thoughts , what thy baptism ingageth thee unto , and that if thou walk otherwise , it will rise up extreamly to aggravate thy condemnation in the last day . it was a custome in the latter end of the primitive times , that such as were baptized , did weare a white stole ( a humane ceremony , to signifie their purity of life which the baptized was to lead , fulgentes animas vestis quoque candida signat . ) now there was one elpidophorus , who after his baptism turned a persecutor ; muritta the minister who baptized him , brought forth in publick the white stole which elpidophorus had worn at his baptism , and cryed unto him ; o elpidophorus ! this stole doe i keep against thy comming to judgement , to testifie thy apostasie from christ ; doe thou in like manner assure thy selfe the very font wherein thou wast baptized , the register wherein thy name is recorded , will rise up against thee , if thou lead not a holy life : the covenant is holy , the seale is holy , let these provoke thee to study to be holy , yea to draw holinesse from them . consider what i say , and the lord give you understanding in all things . fjnis . errata . p. 22. l. 1. for legitimate , r. illegitimate , p. 39. l. 4. r. had he intended . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a52051e-370 the question stated . the infants of beleevers ought to bee baptized . the primitive church owned it . when the sect of the anabaptists began . niceph. 12.35 niceph. 12.30 and the danger of their opinions . first argument they are under the covenant of grace , and therefore must have the seale of the covenant . this argument made good by five conclusions . 1. conclusion . the covenant of grace alwaies the same for substance . wherein lies the substance of the covenant . gen. 17.1 &c. gal. 3.15 . rom. 4.3 . iohn 8.56 . gal. 3.6 . gen. 17.1 . gen. 18.19 . gal 3.17.19 . though not the same for manner of administration . 2 king. 17.18 . heb. 3.11.4 , 5 , 8. heb. 3.17 , 18 , 19. with 4.2 . lev. 20.2 &c. 26.36 . deut. 10.12.13 . with 11.1.8 , 9 , 22. &c. 1 cor. 10.5 , 6 , 7. the identis of the covenant to jewes and gentiles , proved . jerem. 31.33 . esa. 59.21 joel 2.32 . luke 1 54. &c. luke 2.31 . mat. 21.41.43 . rom. 11. gal. 3.8.14 , 15 , 16. ephe. 2.13 &c. rom. 10.3 . gal. 4.29 . 2 conclusion . infants taken into covenant with their parents . hosea 2.2 exod. 12 48 , 49. act. 2.38 , 39. opened and cleared . luke 19. object . answ. object . answ. 3. rom. 11.16 opened . 1 cor. 7.14 . opened and vindicated . ezra . 10.4 . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} nehem. 13.24 . &c. mal. 2.15 . 1. argument . because uncleannesse and holinesse no where taken for civilly lawfull . 1 tim. 4.5 . object . answ. acts 10. 2. argument . the apostles answer had not contained a truth . 3. argument . nor had the apostles argument had any reason in it , if interpreted as they would have it . 4. argument . nor could have satisfied their doubt . deut. 23.2 . esa. 56.3 , 4. acts 8.27 . object . answer . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} the greek preposition signifying to as well as in . as gal. 1.16 . 2 pet. 1.5 . act. 4.12 1 cor. 7.15 . 2. object . answ. reason why god will have such infants accounted his . eccles. 2 ▪ 7. 3. conclusion . col. 2.11 , 12. opened . gal. 5.3 . 4 conclusiun . gen. 17. exod. 12.48 . object . gen. 17.18 , 19 , 20 , 21. answ. rom ▪ 4.11 . deut. 32.8 . lev. 25.13 . &c. 5 conclusion . heb. 8.6 . 2 cor. 3.10 . gal. 4.1 . &c. object . answ. object . wee want a command and example . answer . though there be no expresse command or example . which is not necessary . yet by good consequence we have command for it . both in the command given to abraham which reacheth us . and in mat. 28 19. opened and explained . fumb. 14.31 nehem ▪ 10.28 . object . answ. math 10 42. mark 9 41. matth. 18.5 . act 2.38 , 39. 2. argument . act. 10.47 . & 11.17 . mark . 10. 1 cor. 7.14 . mark . 10.14 . luk. 18 17. matth 3. 1 cor. 12 13. gal. 3.27 . tit. 3.5 . mark . 1.3 . object . 1. answ. object . 2. answer . mark . 16.16 . object . 3. answ. object . 4. 1 pet. 3.21 . answ. heb. 7.22 . object . 6. answ. exod. 12.3 , 4 ▪ 26 , 27. 1 cor. 11. application . first , for reproof of the anabaptists . 1 sam 1. mat. 2 16. ephe. 2 1● . psal. 131.8 , 9. 2. vse . to parents . first for their comfort . 2 sam. 7. esa. 16. ezek. 16.5 . 2. for their duty to provoke thē to be ashamed ▪ for their carelesnesse , &c. in time past . ezek. 16.20 . psal. 106.37 . exod. 2.19 . and to nurse them up for christ in time to come . praying for them . ioel 2.16 . 2 tim. 1 , 5.3.15 . prov. 4.2 , 3. to all baptitized ones , for comfort when they beleeve and repent . to humble such as walke unworthy of this priviledge . col. 2.12 . to provoke to a holy life for time to come . vindiciæ legis & fœderis: or, a reply to mr. philip cary's solemn call wherein he pretends to answer all the arguments of mr. allen, mr. baxter, mr. sydenham, mr. sedgwick, mr. roberts, and dr. burthogge, for the right of believers infants to baptism, by proving the law at sinai, and the covenant of circumcision with abraham, were the very same with adam's covenant of works, and that because the gospel-covenant is absolute. by john flavel minister of the gospel in dartmouth flavel, john, 1630?-1691. 1690 approx. 195 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 88 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2003-05 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a39697 wing f1205a estc r218689 99830260 99830260 34710 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a39697) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 34710) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 2071:09) vindiciæ legis & fœderis: or, a reply to mr. philip cary's solemn call wherein he pretends to answer all the arguments of mr. allen, mr. baxter, mr. sydenham, mr. sedgwick, mr. roberts, and dr. burthogge, for the right of believers infants to baptism, by proving the law at sinai, and the covenant of circumcision with abraham, were the very same with adam's covenant of works, and that because the gospel-covenant is absolute. by john flavel minister of the gospel in dartmouth flavel, john, 1630?-1691. [28], 140 p. printed for m. wolton at the three daggers in fleetstreet, london : 1690. a reply to: cary, philip. a solemn call unto all that would be owned as christ's faithful witnesses, speedily, and seriously, to attend unto the primitive purity of the gospel doctrine and worship: or, a discourse concerning baptism. copy tightly bound, slightly affecting text. reproduction of the original in the dr. williams' library, london. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng cary, philip. -solemn call unto all that would be owned as christ's faithful witnesses, speedily, and seriously, to attend unto the primitive purity of the gospel doctrine and worship: or, a discourse concerning baptism -early works to 1800. infant baptism -early works to 1800. 2002-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2003-01 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2003-02 john latta sampled and proofread 2003-02 john latta text and markup reviewed and edited 2003-04 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion vindiciae legis & foederis : or , a reply to mr. philip cary's solemn call . wherein he pretends to answer all the arguments of mr. allen , mr. baxter , mr. sydenham , mr. sedgwick , mr. roberts , and dr. burthogge , for the right of believers infants to baptism , by proving the law at sinai , and the covenant of circumcision with abraham , were the very same with adam's covenant of works , and that because the gospel-covenant is absolute . by john flavel minister of the gospel in dartmouth membra laxata inepta sunt ad sua munera obeunda , & gravissimo dolore corpus afficiunt . p. martyr . cum consensu videtur deponi fraternitas . aretius in heb. 13. 1. london , printed for m. wotton at the three daggers in fleetstreet , 1690. a friendly preface to the author of the solemn call , and the more discreet and charitable of the party concerned with him in this controversie . christian friends , when we open our bibles and read that text , 1 cor. 1. 10. we have cause to deal with it , as origen once did by another scripture ; even close the book , and weep over it , in consideration of the weak and feeble influences such melting words , delivered with such a pathos , have upon the hearts of professors this day . now i beseech you , brethren , by the name of our lord jesus christ ; that ye all speak the same thing , and that there be no divisions among you ; but that ye be perfectly joyned together in the same mind , and in the same judgment . i beseech you ] he dips the nail in oyl , that it may drive the easier . i beseech you , brethren ] a compellation breathing sweetness , and affection , and should drop from our lips into each others ears , with the same effect that word once did upon the ears of benhadads servants , my brother benhadad . sirs ( said moses to the striving israelites ) ye are brethren . o when shall the church become a true philadelphia ! i beseech you brethren , by the name of our lord jesus christ ] or as you love jesus christ , ut quantum ipsum amant , tantum studeant concordiae , saith calvin . be as studious of concord , as you are free in professing love to christ. that there be no divisions ] or rents among you , a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 schism , or rent in the church is much the same , and altogether as dangerous as a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or sedition in the common-wealth ; and harder to be cured . for as the lord verulam truly observes , differences amongst persecuting enemies and the church , are like the strivings of the aegyptian with the israelite ; which moses quickly ended , by knocking down the aegyptian ; but dissentions in the church , are like the striving of one israelite with another ; and all that moses can do to quiet and part these , is only by fair , and gentle words ; and reminding them that they are brethren . great is the mischief of divisions among christians , and the less the grounds and causes are , the greater always is the sin and mischief of them . in the primitive church contentions grew fervent about meats lawful , and unlawful ; which did not profit , the meaning is , it greatly damnified them that were occupied therein , heb. 13. 9. practical religion among them grew cold , as disputations about these trifles grew fervent . the readiest way to cool such heats is by discovering the trivial nature of the matter contended about ; as demosthenes appeased the tumult among the people rais'd by a small occasion , by relating to them the story of a man that had hired an ass to carry him a journey , but the sun shining servent , he was forced to quit her back , and betake himself to her shadow ; the owner withstood him , alledging that he had hired the body of the ass , but her shadow was not in the bargain ; and so the contention between them grew as hot as the sun. many such trifles have raised great contentions in the world , witness the great contention betwixt the eastern and western church , about keeping of easter . other points there are of greater moment , about which good men contend ; and yet these oftentimes are magnified much above their true intrinsecal value . so i am sure it is in the controversie before us . mr. cary tells us , that these things will be found at length to be of highest concernment unto us , and must therefore be our most serious practice , pa. 243. if so , then the proper subject of baptism must be one of those that is of greatest weight , and the profession thereof , the very schibboleth to distinguish one person from another in matters of religion . no wonder therefore the fires of contention are blown up to such a vehement heat , even in such an improper season : much like the contentions among the english fugitives at francfort , when their brethren were frying in the flames at smithfield . just so must we be scuffling , whilst thousands of our brethren are bleeding in ireland . had we a true sense of the quality of the subject , or the unseasonableness of the time , it would certainly allay these heats among us . did we see who stand by , and look with pleasure upon our follies , it wou'd quickly allay our heats . tertullian tells the christians of his time , that they were like the funambulones , or men that walk upon ropes ; the least tread awry might be their ruin ; so narrowly did their enemies watch them . sirs , the peace , safety and honour of the dissenting interest , are things of too great value to be hazarded amongst the hands of our common enemies . you may fancy they will neglect the advantage you give them , but if they do , the devil will call them fools for it . mr. herle tells us of a kings fool , who wrote down the king himself in his table among his brother fools , because he had trusted an african stranger with 4000 l. to buy barbary horses . the king asked him how he would make him amends , if the stranger should come again ? why then ( said he ) i 'le blot your name out of my table of fools , and write down the african in your stead . think not our enemies are such fools to neglect the advantage we cast into their hands . 't is a weighty note that of livy , consilia non dant homines rebus , sed res hominibus . men don't counsel things , but times and things counsel men . methink●… the postures of times and affairs giv●… us better counsel than we seem to be go●… verned by in such work as this . divisions of forty years standing and more , about infants baptism , have eaten up the times , wasted the spirits , and alienated the hearts of english professors ; divided them both in society , and love ; by reason whereof gods pleasant plant in this resembles the bramble , which taking root at both ends by reason of the rancounters of the sap ; commonly withers in the middle . your brethren in their narrative from their general assembly , make a sad and sensible complaint of withering in the power of godliness . and truly we as well as they may complain with the church , we do all fade as a leaf : the lord help us to discern the true cause , whether it be not the mis-placing of our zeal , our being cold where we should be fervent , and fervent hot where we should be cool ; & whether the eating up of so much time and study about baptizing of infants , have not kept us these forty years in the infancy of our graces ? i well remember that blessed time , when ours and yours were terms almost unknown among professors in england . when their affections and prayers melted and mingled together sweetly in days of humiliation , and other duties of edifying and heavenly communion ; and then churches began to flourish , and the graces of christians every where floured , and became fruitful . but no sooner did the saints divide in society and affection ; but these pleasant blossoms were nipt by it as by a frosty morning . the church formed it self as it were into two armies , set in battalia against each other . it was now with us much like as it s said of the amphisbena , that hath an head at either end ; of which neither can well move , without the consent of both ; but if each move a contrary way , the body tears in the middle . i doubt not but many that differed from us , belonged to christ , the same head with us ; and yet 't is past doubt , that many who seemed to be of us , were headed by satan ; and quickly discovered themselves to be so by running farther than we first , or you next imagined , even into quakerism , socinianism , ranterism , and the foulest puddle , and sink of complicated errors ; of which an impartial stranger under the name of honorius reggius , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , georgius hornius having heard the report in his own countrey came over on purpose into england for his particular and perfect information , and hath given the foreign churches a full and sad account thereof in a latin narrative , which i have by me ; whereby i find , that if the lord in mercy to us had not let in a third party with the common calamity upon us all , we our selves must in all probability have mutually ruin'd each other . but god saw other hands fitter for such dirty work than ours ; and now it was time to reflect upon former follies , and renew our ancient acquaintance in the common goals . and through the goodness of god this did somewhat allay the heats of good men , and gave us fresh hopes of an hearty , and lasting redintigration . we hoped the furnace might have purged our dross , and melted our hearts into unity , both by discovering the evils for which the lord afflicted us , and the sincerity of the sufferers hearts under those trials . christians ( saith mr. jenkins ) if we must dye , let us dye like men , by an unanimous holy contention against the common enemy ; not like fools , by giving him our sword , and destroying one another by schisms in our own bowels . but alas ! alas ! no sooner is the rod off our backs , and a respit from sufferings given us ; but we are presently sounding an allarm to the battle again , and to my sorrow my self unavoidably engaged therein . friends , i have a witness in many of your bosoms , how peacefully and respectfully i have always carried it towards you ; even to such a degree , as began to bring me under the suspition of some of your party , that i was inclining to their opinion , though i did not openly profess it . but the true reasons of my moderation in this point were , ( 1 ) that i ever did , and still do look upon many of you as christians , sound in the other great doctrines of the gospel . ( 2 ) that there are difficulties in this controversie which may puzzle the minds of well-meaning christians . ( 3 ) i highly valued the peace of the church , and durst do nothing that tended to keep open the breaches upon a controversie of this nature ; you being for purity in doctrine and worship in most other controverted points , as well as we . ( 4 ) i observed how rare a thing it is for engaged parties to give ground . qui velit ingenio cedere , rarus erit . ( 5 ) my head , heart , and hands have been filled with better employments , from which i am extreamly loth to be diverted . if bellarmine turned with loathing from school-divinity , because it wanted the sweet juice of piety ; much more may i turn from such perverse disputes as these : sure i may find as fair expositions of scripture , and as acurate , and legitimate distinctions among the school-men ; as in mr. tombes his examen and apology ; or ( which for the most part is but a transcript of both ) in mr. cary's solemn call. but i see i must not be my own chuser , i cannot now be both silent and innocent ; for in this solemn call i find the great doctrines of gods covenants abused by my neighbour . the book 's dispersed into many families related to me in this place , one of them delivered to me by the authors own hand , with a pressing desire to give my judgment upon it . several objections which i privately and seasonably sent him to prevent the sin and folly of his attempt , pretended to be answered from p. 164. ad p. 183. thus am i necessarily brought into the field of controversie , whither i come not a volunteer , but a press'd man ; not out of choice , but necessity . and now i am here , i resolve to be only adversarius litis , non personae , an adversary in the controversie , not to the person , especially of my friendly neighbour . neither would i have appeared thus publickly against him , if differences could have been accommodated , and the evil prevented in a more private way , in order whereto , i have punctually observed and kept the rules and measures of friendship . 't is possible some may judge my style against him to be too sharp , but if they please to read the conclusion of his call , and my answer ; i presume they will find enough to make atonement for that fault , if it be a fault . 't is from the nature of the matter before me , not from defect of charity to the person , or party , that i am forced to be so plain and pungent as i am . to conclude , i suspect this very preface may be also censured for its plainness , and tediousness . i confess when times are busie , we should be brief ; and i am perswaded a sufficient preface may be contracted into four words , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , without preface , or passions . however , i have a little eased my own heart , by discharging my duty to my differing brethren , and pleased my self , if not them . the god of peace create peace in all the borders of sion , beat our swords into plow-shares , and our spears into pruning-hooks ; i mean our polemicals into practicals , that jerusalem may once more be a city compact , and no more terrible to her self ; but only to her enemies , as an army with banners . this brethren , is the prayer , and shall ever be the endeavour of your friend and servant in christ john flavell . prolegomena . before we enter into the main controversie , it will be necessary to acquaint the reader , why i begin with the middle of the book ; and it is because i there find these three principles , or positions , on which the other parts of his discourse are superstructed ; and these being destroyed , his other discourses are but arenae , sine calce . i properly therefore begin with the foundation . next , i shall shew how far we are greed in the matters here controvert●…d , and where it is in each of these , that ●…he controversie indeed lies betwixt us ; ●…nd as to i position , viz. that the sinai-law is the same with a●…am's covenant of works , made in para●…ice . the difference betwixt us here is not 〈◊〉 . ) whether both these be called co●…enants in scripture ? nor ( 2. ) whether there were no grace at all in both , or either of them : for we are agreed , it is grace in god to enter into covenant with man , whatever that covenant be ; nor ( 3. ) whether the sinai-law be not a covenant of works to some men , by their own fault and occasion ? nor ( 4. ) whether the scriptures do not many times speak of it in that very sense and notion wherein carnal justiciaries apprehend and take it ? and by rejecting christ make it so to themselves ? nor ( 5. ) whether the very matter of the law of nature be not reviv'd and represented in the sinai law ? these are not the points we contend about : but the question is , whether the sinai law do in its own nature , and according to gods purpose and design in the promulgation of it , revive the law of nature , to the same ends and uses it served to in adam's covenant ; and so be properly and truly a covenant of works ? or whether god had not gracious and evangelical ends and purposes , viz. by such a dreadful representation of the severe and impracticable terms of the first covenant , instead of obliging them to the personal and punctual observance of them fo●… righteousness and life ; he did not rather design to convince them of the impossibility of legal righteousness , humble proud nature , and shew them the necessity of betaking themselves to christ , now exhibited in the new covenant , as the only refuge to fallen sinners . the latter i defend according to the scriptures , the former mr. cary seems to assert , and vehemently argue for . 2ly . in this controversie about the sinai law , i do not find mr. cary distinguishing ( as he ought ) betwixt the law considered more largely and complexly , as containing both the moral and ceremonial law , for both which it is often taken in scripture , and more strictly , for the moral law only , as it is sometimes used in scripture . these two he makes one and the same covenant of works ; though there be some that doubt whether the meer moral law may not be a covenant of works ; yet i never met with any man before , that durst affirm the ceremonial law , which is so full of christ , to be so ; and to this law it is that circumcision appertains . 3ly . the moral law strictly taken for the ten commandments , is not by him distinguished ( as it ought to be , and as the scripture frequently doth ) according to gods intention and design in the promulgation of it , which was to add it as an appendix to the promise , gal. 3. 19. and not to set it up as an opposite covenant , gal. 3. 21. and the carnal jews mistaking and perverting the use and end of the law , and making it to themselves a covenant of works , by making it the very rule and reason of their justification before god , rom. 9. 32 , 33. rom. 10. 3. these things ought carefully to have been distinguished , forasmuch as the whole controversie depends on this double sense and intention of the law ; yea , the very denomination of that law depends hereon : for i affirm it ought not to be denominated from the abused and mistaken end of it amongst carnal men ; but from the true scope , design and end for which god published it after the fall : and though we find such expressions as these in scripture , the man that doth them , shall live in them . and cursed is every one that continueth not in all things , &c. yet these respecting the law not according to gods intention , but mans corruption and abuse of it , the law is not thereby to be denominated a covenant of works . gods end was not to justifie them , but to try them by that terrible dispensation , ezod . 20. 20. whether they would still hanker after that natural way of self-righteousness ; for this end god propounded the terms of the first covenant to them on sinai , not to open the way of self-justification to them , but to convince them , and shut them up to christ ; just as our saviour , matth. 19. 17. puts the young man upon keeping the commandments , not to drive him from , but necessitate him to himself in the way of faith. the law in both these senses is excellently described , gal. 4. in that allegory of hagar and sarah , the figures of the two covenants . hagar in her first and proper station , was but a serviceable hand-maid to sarah , as the law is a schoolmaster to christ ; but when hagar the hand-maid is taken into sarah's bed , and brings forth children , that aspire to the inheritance , then saith the scripture , cast out the bond-woman , with her son . so it is here ; take the law in its primary use , as god designed it , as a school-master , or hand-maid to christ and the promise ; so it is consistent with them , and excellently subservient to them ; but if we marry this hand-maid , and espouse it as a covenant of works , then are we bound to it for life , rom. 7. and must have nothing to do with christ. the believers of the old testament had true apprehensions of the right end and use of the law , which directed them to christ , and so they became children of the free-woman . the carnal jews trusted to the works of the law for righteousness , and so became children of the bond-woman ; but neither could be children of both at once , no more than the same man can naturally be born of two mothers . this is the difference betwixt us about the first position ; and as to the ii position . that abraham's covenant , gen. 17. is an adam's covenant of works also , because circumcision was annexed to it , which obliged men to keep the whole law. the controversie betwixt us in this point , is not whether circumcision were an ordinance of god , annexed by him to his covenant with abraham ? nor ( 2. ) whether abraham's ordinary and extraordinary seed ought to be , and actually were signed by it ? nor ( 3. ) whether it were a seal of the righteousness of faith to any individual person ; for he allows ●…t to be so to abraham ? nor ( 4. ) whe●…he it pertain'd to the ceremonial law , and so must cease at the death of christ ? but the difference betwixt us is , whether ●…1 . ) it was a seal of the covenant to ●…one but abraham ? and ( 2. ) whether ●…n the very nature of the act , or only from the intention of the agent it did oblige men to keep the whole law , as adam was obliged to keep it in inno●…ency ? ( 3. ) whether it were utterly ●…bolished at the death of christ , as a condition of the covenant of works ; or being a sign of the same covenant of grace we are now under , it be not suc●…eeded by the new gospel-sign , which is baptism ? mr. cary affirms that it was 〈◊〉 it self a condition of the covenant of works , and being annexed to gods covenant with abraham , gen. 17. it made ●…hat a true adam's covenant of works ●…lso . this i utterly deny , and say , a●…raham's covenant was a true covenant ●…f grace . ( 2. ) that circumcision was seal of the righteousness of faith , and therefore could not possibly belong to the covenant of works . ( 3. ) that as it was applied both to the ordinary and extraordinary infant-seed of abraham , during that administration of the covenant ; so it is the will of christ that baptism should take its place under the gospel , and be applyed now to the infant-seed of all abraham's spiritual children . these are the things wherein we differ about the second position . and lastly , as to the iii position . that neither moses's law , exod. 2●… nor god's covenant with abraham , ge●… 17. can be any other than an adam's cov●…nant of works , because they have each 〈◊〉 them conditions in them on man's part ; 〈◊〉 the gospel-covenant hath none at all , but 〈◊〉 altogether free and absolute . the controversie here betwixt us 〈◊〉 not ( 1. ) whether the gospel-covenan●… requires no duties at all of them tha●… are under it ? nor ( 2. ) whether it requires any such conditions as were 〈◊〉 adam's covenant , namely , perfect , personal , and perpetual obedience unde●… the severest penalty of a curse ; and admitting no place of repentance ? nor ( 3. ) whether any condition required by it , on our part , have any thing in its own nature meritorious of the benefits promised ? nor ( 4. ) whether we be able in our own strength , and by the power of our free will , without the preventing , as well as the assisting grace of god , to perform any such work or duty as we call a condition ? in these things we have no controversie , but the only question betwixt us , is , whether in the new covenant , some act of ours , ( though it have no merit in it , nor can be done in our own single strength ) be not required to be performed by us , antecedently to a blessing or priviledge consequent by vertue of a promise ? and whether such an act or duty , being of a suspending nature to the blessing promised , it have not the true and proper nature of a gospel condition ? this i affirm , and he positively denies . these three positions being confuted , and the contrary well confirmed , viz. that the law at sinai was not set up by god as an adam's covenant , to open the old way of righteousness and life by works : but was added to the promise , as subservient to christ in its design and use ; and consequently can never be a pure adam's covenant of works . and secondly , that abraham's covenant , gen. 17. is the very same covenant of grace we are now under ; and ( 2ly . ) that circumcision in the nature of the act , did not oblige all men to keep the whole law for righteousness . and ( 3ly . ) that the new covenant is not absolute and wholly unconditional ; though notwithstanding a most free and gracious covenant : the pillars on which mr. cary sets his new structure sink under it , and the building falls into ruins . i have not here taken mr. cary's two syllogisms , proving abraham's covenant to be a covenant of works ; because i find my self therein prevented by that ingenuous and learned man mr. whiston , in his late answer to mr. grantham . neither have i particularly spoken to his 23 arguments to prove the sinai law to be a pure adam's covenant , because frustra sit per plura , quod sieri potest per pauciora , i have overthrown them all together at one blow ; by evincing every argument to have four terms in it , and so proves nothing . but i have spoken to all those scriptures which concern our four positions , and fully vindicated them from the injurious senses to which mr. cary ( following mr. tombes ) had wrested them . these things premised , i shall only further add , that if mr. cary shall attempt a reply to my answer , and free his own theses from the gross absurdities with which i have loaded them ; he must plainly and substantially prove against me , ( 1. ) that the sinai law , according to its true scope and end , was promulged by god for man's justification and happiness in the way of personal obedience ; and that the jews that did accordingly endeavour after righteousness by the works of the law , did not mistake its true end and meaning ; or if they did , and thereby made it what god never intended it to be , a covenant of works to themselves ; that the sinai law ought rather to be denominated from their mistake and abuse of it , than from its primary and proper use , and god's design in its promulgation . ( 2. ) he must prove against me with like evidence of truth , that circumcision discovered no more of man's native corruption , nor any more of his remedy by christ ; nor sealed to any person whatsoever the righteousness of faith , than adam's covenant in paradise did ; and that it did in its own nature oblige all upon whom it passed , to the same terms of obedience that adam's covenant obliged him : and , ( 3. ) that there is not to be found , in the new covenant , any such act or duty of ours , as hath been described and limited above ; which is of a suspending nature to the benefits therein granted : and , ( 4. ) that the respective expositions he gives of the several texts by me explained and vindicated , are more congruous to the scope and grammar than mine are , and more agreeable to the current sense of orthodox expositors , and then he shall be sure to receive an answerable return from me , else 't is but labour lost to write again . a reply to mr. philip cary's solemn call. the book i have undertaken to animadvert briefly upon , bears the title of a solemn call ; but i am not so much concerned with the solemnity , as i am with the authority of this call. not how it is , but whose it is . if it be the call of god , it must be obey'd , tho it be to part not only with the priviledges , but lives of our dearest children ; but then we had need be very well assur'd it is the call of god , else we are guilty at once of the highest folly and basest t●…eachery to part with so rich an inheritance , convey'd by god's covenant with abraham , to us believing gentiles , and our seed , at mr. cary's call. you direct your solemn call to all that would be owned as christs faithful witnesses . here you are too obscure and general ; do you mean all that would be owned by you , or by christ ? if you mean that we must not expect to be owned by you , till we renounce infants baptism , you tell us no news ; for you have long since turn'd your back upon our ministry and assemblies ; yet methinks 't is strange , that we who were lately own'd as christs faithful witnesses under our late sufferings , must now be disown'd by you , when we have liberty to amplifie and confirm our testimony in the peaceful improvement of our common liberty . but if your meaning be ( as i strongly suspect it is ) that we must not expect to be own'd by christ , except we give up infants baptism ; then i say it is the most uncharitable , as well as unwarrantable , and dangerous censure that ever dropt from the pen of a sober christian , 't is certainly your great evil to lay salvation it self on such a point as the proper subject of baptism , and to make it articulus stantis , vel cadentis religionis , the very basis on which the whole christian religion , and its professors salvation must stand . i hope the rest of your brethren are more charitable than your self ; but however it be , i do openly profess , that i ever have , and still do own you , and many more of your perswasion , for my brethren in christ , and am perswaded christ will own you too , notwithstanding your many errors and mistakes about the lesser and lower matters of religion . nor need your censure much to affect us , as long as we are satisfied you have neither a faculty , nor commission thus solemnly to pronounce it upon us . but what 's the condition upon which this dreadful sentence depends ? why , it is our attendance , or non-attendance to the primitive purity of the gospel doctrine . sir , i hope we do attend it , and in some respects better than some greater pretenders to primitive purity ; who have cast off , not only the initiating sign of gods covenant , ( this did not abraham ) but also that most comfortable and ancient ordinance of singing psalms ; and what other primitive ordinance of god may be cashier'd next , who can tell ? we have a witness in your bosom , that the defence of christs pure worship and institutions hath cost us something ; and as for me , were i convinced by all that you have here said , or any of your friends , that in baptizing the infants of believers we did really depart from the primitive purity , i would renounce it , and turn anabaptist the same day . but really sir , this discourse of yours hath very much convinc'd me of the weakness and sickliness of your cause , which is forc'd to seek a new foundation , and is here laid by you upon such a foundation as must inevitably ruin it , if your party , as well as your self , have but resolution enough to venture it thereupon . and it appears to me very probable , that they intend to fight us upon the new ground you have here chosen , and mark'd out for them , by the high encomiums they give your book in their epistles to it , wherein they tell us , your notions are of so rare a nature , that you are not beholding to any other for them ; and it is a wonder if you should , for i think it never entred into any sober christians head before you , that abraham's covenant , gen. 17. was the very same with adam's covenant made in paradise ; or that moses , abraham , and all the elect of god in those days were absolutely under the very rigour and tyranny of the covenant of works , and at the same time under the covenant of grace , and all the blessings and priviledges thereof , with many other such rare notions , of which it is pity but you should have the sole propriety . i am particularly concern'd to detect your dangerous mistakes , both in love to your own soul , and care of my peoples , amongst whom you have dispersed them ; though i foresee by m. e's epistle to your book what measure i am like to have for my plain and faithful dealing with you : for if that gentleman , upon a meer surmise and presumption , that one or other would oppose your book , dare adventure to call your unknown answerer , before ever he put pen to paper , a man-pleaser , a quarreller at reformation , and rank him with the papists , which opposed the faithful for their non-conformity to their inventions : what must i expect from such rash censurers , for my sober , plain , and rational confutation of your errors ! as to the controversie betwixt us , you truly say in your title page , and many parts of your book , and your brethren comprobate it in their epistles , that the main arguments made use of by the paedo-baptists for the support of their practice are taken from the covenant of god with abraham , gen. 17. you call this the very hinge of the controversie ; and therefore if you can but prove this to be the very same covenant of works with that made with adam in paradise , we shall then see what improvements you will quickly make of it . ay sir , you are sensible of the advantage , no less than a compleat victory you shall obtain by it ; and therefore being a more hardy and adventurous man than others , put desperately upon it ( which never any before you durst attempt ) to prove abraham's covenant , which stands so much in the way of your cause , to be a meer covenant of works , and therefore now abolished . my proper province is to discover here , that part of the foundation ( i mean abraham's covenant ) whence our divines , with great strength and evidence , deduce the right of believers infants to baptism now . next , to evince the absurdity of your assertions and arguments you bring to destroy it : and lastly , to reflect briefly upon the answers you give in the beginning of your book , to those several texts of scripture pleaded by the learned and judicious divines you oppose , for the justification of infants baptism . ( 1. ) those that plead god's covenant with abraham , gen. 17. as a scripture foundation for baptizing believers infants under the gospel , proceed generally upon these four grounds or principles . ( 1. ) that god's covenant with abraham , gen. 17. was the same covenant for substance , we gentile believers are now under , and they substantially prove it from luke 1. from the 54. to the 74. verse , which place evidently shews the sameness of the covenant of grace they were , and we are now under ; and from matt. 21. 41 , 43. the same vineyard and kingdom the jews then had , is now let out to us gentiles ; and from rom. 11. that the gentile-christians are grafted into the same olive-tree , from which the jews were broken off for their unbelief ; and that the blessing of abraham cometh now upon the gentiles , gal. 3. 8 , 14 , 16. and in a word , that the partition wall betwixt them and us , is now pulled down , and that we , through faith , are let into the self-same covenant , and all the priviledges they then enjoy'd , ephes. 2. 13. ( 2. ) they assert and prove , that in abraham's covenant , the infant-seed were taken in with their parents , and that in token thereof , they were to have the sign of the covenant applied to them , gen. 17. 9. ( 3. ) they affirm and prove , that the promise of god to abraham and his seed , with the priviledges thereof to his children , do , for the substance of them , descend to believers now , and their seed , acts 2. 38 , 39. and though the external sign , viz. circumcision be changed , yet baptism takes its place under the gospel , col. 2. 11 , 12. ( 4. ) they constantly affirm , that none of those grants or priviledges , made to the infant-seed of abraham's family , were ever repealed or revoked by christ or his apostles ; and therefore believers children now are in the rightful possession of them ; and that therefore there needed no new command or promise ; in abraham's command we find our duty to sign our children with the sign of the covenant , and in abraham's promise we find god's gracious grant to our children , as well as his , especially since the apostle directs us , in this very respect , to the covenant of god with abraham , acts 2. 38 , 39. these , sir , are the principles , on which we lay ( as you say ) great stress , and which to this day you have never been able to shake down ; here therefore you attempt a new method to do it , by proving this covenant is now abolished ; and this is your method in which you promise your self great success : three things you pretend to prove ; ( 1. ) that the sinai covenant , exod. 20. ( 2. ) that abraham's covenant , gen. 17. are no gospel-covenants , and that because , ( 3. ) the gospel-covenant is absolute and unconditional . how you come to hook in the mosaick covenant into this controversie , is not very evident , unless you think it were easie for you to prove that to be a covenant of works , and then abraham's covenant gen. 17. being an old testament covenant , were the more easily proved to be of the same nature . i am obliged to examine your three positions above noted , and if i evidence to the world the falsity of them , the cause you manage is so far lost , and the right of believers infants to baptism stands firm upon its old and sure foundation . i begin therefore with your i position . that the covenant made with israel on mount sinai , is the very same covenant of works made with adam in innocency , p. 122. and divers other places of your book the very same . now , if i prove that this assertion of yours doth naturally and regularly draw many false and absurd consequents upon you , which you are , and must be forced to own ; then this your position cannot be true , for from true premisses , nothing but truth can naturally and regularly follow ; but i shall make it plain to you , that this your position regularly draws many false conclusions and gross absurdities upon you , some of which you own expresly , and others you as good as own , being able to return nothing rational or satisfactory in your own defence against them . ( 1. ) from this assertion , that the sinai covenant was a pure covenant of works , the very same with adam's covenant , it regularly and necessarily follows , that either moses and all israel were damned , there being no salvation possible to be attained by that first covenant ; or else that there was a covenant of grace at the same time running parallel with that covenant of works ; and so the elect people of god were at one and the same time under the first , as a covenant of death and condemnation ; and under the second , as a covenant of grace and justification . this dilemma pinches you , to assert , that moses , and all the elect of god under that dispensation were damned , you dare not ; and if you had , you must have expunged the 11th chapter to the hebrews , and a great part of the new testament , together with all your hopes of sitting down with abraham , isaac , and jacob in the kingdom of heaven . the latter therefore ( seeing you cannot avoid ) you are forc'd upon , and in plain words yield it , p. 174 , 175. that moses , and the whole body of the children of israel , without exception of any , were under , yea absolutely under the severest penalties of a dreadful curse ; that the covenant they were under could be no other than a covenant of works , a ministration of death and condemnation ; when yet it is also evident from the same holy scriptures of truth , that at the same time both moses , and all the elect among that people , were under a pure covenant of gospel-grace ; and that these two covenants were just opposite the one to the other ; but to this you have nothing to say , but with the apostle in another case , o the depth ! here sir , you father a pure and perfect contradiction upon the holy scriptures , that it speaks things just opposite , and contradictory the one to the other , and of necessity one part or member of a contradiction must be false ; this all the rational world knows ; but so it is , say you , and fly to the infinite wisdom to reconcile them ; for you say , you know not what to say to it . just so the papists serve us in the controversie about transubstantiation , when they cannot reconcile one thing with another , they fly to the omnipotent power to do it . but sir , i wonder how you hold and hug a principle that runs naturally into such gross absurdities : do you see what follows from hence by unavoidable consequence ? you must , according to this principle , hold , that moses , and all gods peculiar elect people in israel , must during their life , hang mid-way between justification and condemnation , and after death , between heaven and hell. ( 1. ) during life they must hang mid-way between justification and condemnation ; justify'd they could not be , for justification is the souls passing from death to life , 1 john 3. 14. john 5. 24. this they could not possibly do , for the ministration of death , and condemnation hindred . he that is under condemnation by the law , cannot , during that state , pass into life . and yet to be under condemnation is as impossible on the other side ; for he that is justified , cannot at the same time be under condemnation , rom. 8. 1. john 5. 24. what remains then , but that during life they must stick mid-way betwixt both , neither justify'd , nor condemned ; and yet both so and so . justification is our life , and condemnation our death in law : betwixt these two which are privatively oppos'd , there can be no medium of participation , and yet such a medium you here fancy . ( 2. ) and then after death they must necessarily hang betwixt heaven and hell ; to heaven none can go that are under the very rigour and tyranny of the law , a pure covenant of works , as you say they were . to hell they could not go , being under the pure covenant of grace : what remains then , but some third state must be assigned them ; and so at last we have found the limbus patrum , and your position leads us right to purgatory ; a conclusion which , i believe , you your self abhor as much as i. ( 2ly . ) this hypothesis pinches you with another dilemma , viz. either there was pardon on repentance in moses his covenant , and the sinai dispensation of the law , or there was none ; if you say ●…one , you directly contradict lev. 26. 40 , 46. if there were , then it cannot be adam's covenant of works . you answer , pag. 179. that god promiseth pardon for the breach of moses his covenant and of adam 's covenant too , but neither adam 's covenant , nor the jewish legal covenant promised any pardon upon repentance , but rather threatens and inflicts the contrary . reply . either this is a direct answer to my argument , to prove the law at sinai cannot be a pure adam's covenant , because it had a promise of pardon annexed to it , lev. 26. 40. but adam's covenant had none . if your answer be direct , then 't is a plain contradiction , in saying it had , and it had not a promise of pardon belonging to it ; or else it is a meer evasion , and an eluding of the argument ; and your only meaning is , that the relief i speak of , is not to be found in any promise belonging to the sinai dispensation , but in some other gospel-covenant or promise . but , sir , this will not serve your turn ; you see i cite the very promise of grace made to the israelites on mount sinai by the hand of moses ; wherein god promiseth , upon their humiliation , to remember his covenant for their good . now , sir , you had as good have stood to your first answer , which is self-contradictory , as to this which is no less so , as will evidently appear by a nearer and more particular view of the place , and gathering up your own concessions about it ; that this text , lev. 26. 40. hath the nature of a gracious gospel-promise in it , no man can deny , except he that will deny , that gods remembring of his covenant , for the relief of poor broken-hearted sinners , is no gospel-promise pertaining to the covenant of grace : that it was made to the penitent israelites upon mount sinai , and there delivered them by the hand of moses for their relief , is as visible and plain as the words and syllables of the 46th verse are to him that reads them . let the promise then be considered both ways , ( 1. ) in your sense , as a plain direction to the covenant of grace made with abraham for their relief ; for so you say it was , p. 180. or let it be considered absolutely , as that which contained relief in it self , for the penitent israelites that should live towards the end of the world , after they should be gathered from all their dispersions and captivities as you there speak , and more fully explicate in your accommodation of a parallel promise , p. 111 , 112 , 113. first let us view it in your sense as a relative promise to the covenant of grace made with abraham , gen. 12. to which , say you , it plainly directs them ; and then this legal dispensation can never be the same with adam's covenant ; for to that covenant no such promise was ever annexed , which should guide and plainly direct them to christ and pardon ; as that star which appeared to the wise men directed their way to christ. if there be any such relative promise belonging to adam's covenant in paradise , as this which i plainly shew you was made on mount sinai , be pleased to produce it , and you end the controversie but if you cannot ( as you know you can not ) then never say the legal dispensation at sinai , and the covenant of work with adam in paradise , are the very same covenant . secondly , let us consider this promise absolutely in it self , an●… then i demand , was there mercy , relie●… and pardon contained in it for any pen●… tent sinner present , or to come ? ye●… say you , it extends relief to penitent●… after god shall gather them from a●… their captivities at the end of th●… world ; very good. then 't is a ver●… vigorous promise of grace , which no●… only reaches 430 years backward , as fa●… as the first promise to abraham ; b●… also extends its reliefs and comfort●… many thousand years forwards , even t●… the purest times of the gospel , just before christ's coming to judgment ; an●… can such a promise as this be denie●… to be in it self a gospel-promise ? su●… it can neither be denied to be such nor yet to be made upon mount sinai b●… the hand of moses . this dilemma is a●… pinching as the former . perhaps you will say , this promise did not belong to the moral law given at sinai , but to the ceremonial law ; if so , then i should reasonably conclude , that you take the ceremonial law ( of which you seem to make this a branch , page 181. ) to be a covenant of grace , seeing one of its branches bears such a gracious promise upon it . no , that must not be so neither , for say you page 151. the ceremonial covenant is of the same nature with the covenant of works , or law written in tables of stone ; whither then shall we send this promise ? to the covenant of grace we must not send it , unless only as an index or finger to point to it , because it was made upon mount sinai , and delivered to israel by the hand of moses ; to the gospel-govenant we must not therefore annex it ; and to the legal dispensation at sinai you are as loath to annex it , because it contains so much relief and grace in it for poor penitents ; and that will prove , that neither the moral nor ceremonial law ( place it in which you please ) can be a pure covenant of works as adam's was . moreover , in making this the promise which must relieve and comfort the distressed israelites in the purest gospel-times , towards the end of the world , you as palpably contradict your self in another respect ; for we shall find you by and by stoutly denying , that the gospel-promises have any conditions or qualifications annexed to them ; but so hath this which you say relates to them that shall live at the end of the world. if their uncircumcised hearts be humbled , and if they accept the punishment of their iniquities , then will i remember my covenant , &c. but be this promise conditional or absolute , two things are undeniably clear . ( 1. ) that it is a promise full of grace , for the relief of law-transgressors , ver . 40. ( 2. ) that it was a mount sinai promise , ver . 46. and such a promise as you can never shew in adam's covenant . besides , it is to me an unaccountable thing , that a promise which hath a double comfortable aspect , 430 years back , and some thousands of years forward ; should not cast one comfortable glance upon the penitents of the present age when it was made , nor upon any till near the end of the world. what think you sir , of the 3000 jews prick'd at the heart ? acts 2. had they no relief from it , because their lot fell not late enough in time ? were the penitent jews in moses and peter's days , all born out of due time , for this promise to relieve ? o what shifting and shuffling is here ! who can think a man that twists and winds every way , to avoid the dint of an argument , can possibly have a moral assurance of the truth of his own opinion ? ( 3. ) you say , page 134. that through christ's satisfaction there is no repugnancy or hostile contrariety betwixt the law and promise , but an agreement betwixt them , and that they differ only in respect of strength and weakness , the gospel is able to go through stitch with it , which the law cannot do . reply . well then , the law considered as a covenant of works , whose terms or condition is , do this and live , and the promise or gospel , whose condition is , believe and thou shalt be saved , are not specifically different , but only gradually in point of strength and weakness ; and the reason you give , is as strange , that this comes to pass through the satisfaction of christ. good sir , enlighten us in this rare notion . did christ die to purchase a reconciliation betwixt the covenant of works as such , and the covenant of grace ; as if both were now by the death of christ agreed ; and to be justified by works and by faith , should after christ's death make no odds or disserence between them ? if it be so , why have you kept such a coil to prove moses's and adam's covenant , yea , abraham's too , being covenant of works can never consist or mingle with the gospel-covenant ? and then i say , you contradict the apostle , who so directly opposes the covenant of works as such , to the covenant of grace , and tells us , they are utterly inconsistent and exclusive of each other ; and this he spake after christ's death and actual satisfaction : but ( 4. ) that which more amazes me , is the strange answer you give to mr. sedgwick , page 132 , 133. in your return to his argument , that if the law and the promise can consist , then the law cannot be set up as a covenant of works . you answer , that the law and the promise having divers ends , it doth not thence follow , that there is an inconsistence betwixt them , and that the law , even as it is a covenant of works , instead of being against the promise , tends to the establishment of it . and page 133. that by convincing men of the impossibility of obtaining rest and peace in themselves , and the necessity of betaking themselves to the promise , &c. the law is not against the promise , having so blessed a subserviency towards the establishment thereof . here you own a subserviency , yea , a blessed subserviency of the law to the promise , which is that mr. sedgwick and my self have urged , to prove it cannot be so , as it is a pure adam's covenant ; but that therefore it must come under another consideration ; only here we differ , you say it hath a blessed subserviency to the promise , as it is the same with adam's covenant , we say it can never be so as such , but as it is either a covenant of grace , though more obscure , as he speaks ; or though the matter of it should be the same with adam's covenant , yet it is subserviently a covenant of grace as others speak ; and under no other consideration can it be reconciled to the promise . but will you stand to this , that the law hath no hostile contradiction to the promise , but a blessed subserviency to it , as you speak , page 173. where you say , that if we preach up the law as a covenant of life , or a covenant of faith and grace ( which are equipollent terms ) let us distinguish as we please , between a covenant of grace absolutely aud subserviently such ; then we make an ill use of the law ; by perverting it to such a service as god never intended it for , and are guilty of mingling law and gospel , life and death together . reply . here , sir , my understanding is perfectly posed , and i know not how to make any tolerable orthodox sense out of this position : is the law preached up as a pure covenant of works ( that is , pressing men to the personal and punctual obedience of it , in order to their justification by works ) no way repugnant to the promise ; but altogether so , when preached in subserviency to christ and faith ? this is new divinity with me , and i believe must be so to every intelligent reader . don't i oppose the promise , when i preach up the law as a pure covenant of works , which therefore as such must be exclusive of christ and the promise ; and do i oppose either , when i tell sinners the terrors of the law serve only to drive them to christ , their only remedy , who is the end of the law for righteousness , to every one that believeth , rom. 10. 4. ? are works and grace more consistent than grace with grace ? explain your meaning in this paradoxical expression , and leave not your self and others in such a maze . i read gal. 3. 19. for what end god published the law 430 years after the promise was made to abraham , and find it was added because of transgression , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 it was put to , not set up by it self alone , as a distinct cov●… nant , but added as an appendix to the covenant of grace ; whence it is plain , that god added the sinai law to the promise , with evangelical ends and purposes . if then i preach the law to the very same evangelical uses and purposes for which god added it to the promise , do i therein make an ill use of the law , and mingle life and death together ? but preaching it as a pure covenant of works , as it holds forth justification to sinners by obedience to its precepts ; do i then make it blessedly subservient ( as you speak ) to the promise , or covenant of grace ? the law was added because of transgression , that is , to restrain sin in the world , and to convince sinners under guilt , of the necessity of another righteousness than their own , even that of christ ; and for the same ends god added it to the promise ; i always did , and still shall preach it ; and i am perswaded without the least danger of mingling law and gospel , life and death together , in your sense . 't is plain to me , that in the publication of the law on sinai , god did not in the least intend to give them so much 〈◊〉 a direction how to obtain justification ●…y their most punctual obedience to its precepts , that being to fallen man utterly impossible ; and beside , had he promulged the law to that end and purpose , he had not added it , but directly opposed it to the promise ; which its manifest he did not , gal. 3. 21. is the law then against the promise of god ? god forbid . and ver . 18. makes it appear , that had it been set up to that end and purpose , it had utterly disannulled the promise ; for if the inheritance be of the law , it is no more by promise . what then can be clearer , than that the law at sinai was published with gracious gospel-ends and purposes , to lead men to christ ; which adam's covenant had no respect nor reference to ? and therefore it can never be a pure adam's covenant , as you falsly call it ; neither is it capable of becoming a pure covenant of works to any man , but by his own fault , in rejecting the righteousness of christ , and seeking justification by the works of the law , as the mistaken carnal jews did , rom. 10. 3. and other legal justiciaries now do . and upon this account only it is , that paul , who so highly praises the law in its subserviency to christ , thunders so dreadfully against it , as it is thus set by ignorant mistaken souls in direct opposition to christ. ( 5ly . ) and further , to clear this point , the apostle tells us , rom. 10. 4. that christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth . whence i argue , that if adam's covenant had one end , namely , the justification of men by their own personal obedience ; and the law at sinai had a quite contrary end , namely , to bring sinners to christ by faith for their righteousness ; the one to keep him within himself , the other to take him quite out of himself , and bring him for his justification to the righteousness of another , even that of christ ; then the sinai law cannot possibly be the same thing with adam's covenant of works ; but the antecedent is true and plain in the forecited text , therefore so is the consequent . christ is the end of the law for righteousness . take the law here , either more strictly for the moral law , or more largely , as it comprehends the ceremonial law ; still christ is the end of the law. the moral law shuts up every man to christ for righteousness , by convincing him ( according to gods design in the publication of it ) of the impossibility of obtaining justification in the way of works . and the ceremonial law many ways prefigured christ , his death and satisfaction by blood , in our room , and so led men to christ , their true propitiation ; and all its types were fulfilled and ended in christ. was there any such thing in adam's covenant ? you must prove there was , else you will never be able to make them one and the same covenant . ( 6ly . ) it seems exceeding probable from acts 7. 37 , 38. that the sinai covenant was delivered to moses by jesus christ , there called the angel. this is he that was in the church in the wilderness , with the angel that spake to him in the mount sinai , and with our fathers , who received the lively oracles to give unto us . now , if christ himself were the angel , and the precepts of the law delivered by him to moses were the lively oracles of god , as they are there expresly affirm'd to be , then the law delivered on mount sinai cannot be a pure adam's covenant of works : for it is never to be imagined that jesus christ himself should deliver to moses such a covenant , directly opposite to all the ends of his future incarnation ; and that those precepts ( which if they were of the same nature , and revived to the same end , at which adam's covenant directly aimed ) should be called the lively oracles of god : when contrarywise , upon your supposition they could be no other than a ministration of condemnation and death : but that they were lively oracles , viz. in their design and intention , is plain in the text ; and that they were delivered to moses by jesus christ , the angel of the covenant , seems more than probable , by comparing it with the former verses . ( 7ly . ) neither is it easie to imagin how such a covenant , which by the fall of adam had utterly lost all its promises , priviledges and blessings ; and could retain nothing but the curses and punishments annexed to it , in case of the least failure , could possibly be numbred among the chief priviledges in which gods israel gloried ; as it apparently was , rom. 9. 4. who are israelites , to whom pertaineth the adoption , and the glory , and the covenants , and the giving of the law , and the service of god , and the promises . these things considered , with many more ( which the intended brevity of this discourse will not now admit ) i am fully satisfy'd of the falsity of your position , and so may you too , when you shall review the many gross and palpable absurdities with which i have clogg'd and loaded it ; with many more regularly and fairly deducible from it , which i could easily produce , did i not suspect these i have produced have already pressed your patience a littly too far : but if ever i shall see ( which i never expect ) a fair and scriptural solution of these weighty objections , you may expect from me more arguments against your unsound position , which at the present i judge needless to add . to conclude , those premises ( as before i noted ) can never be true , from whence such , and so many gross and notorious absurdities are regularly and unavoidably deducible . for ex veris nil nisi verum , from true premises nothing but truth can regularly follow . had you minded those things which i seasonably sent you , you had avoided all those boggs into which you are now sunk , and been able fairly to reconcile all those seeming contradictions in paul's epistles , with respect to the law at sinai : but however , by what hath been said , your first position , that the sinai covenant is the same covenant of works with adam 's in paradise , vanishes before the evidence of scripture-truth and sound reason . but yet , though what i have said destroys your false position , i am not willing to leave you , or the reader , ignorant wherein the truth lies in this controverted point betwixt us ; and that will appear by a due consideration of the following particulars . ( 1. ) 't is plain and uncontroverted , that adam's covenant in paradise contained in it a perfect law and rule of natural righteousness , founded both in god's nature , and in mans , which in its perfect state of innocency was every way enabled perfectly to comply therewith : for the scripture tells us , eccles. 7. 29. that god made man upright , and his punctual complying therewith was the righteousness by which he stood . ( 2. ) this covenant of works being once broken , can never more be available to the justification and salvation of any fallen man : there was not now a law found that could give righteousness ; the broken covenant of works lost immediately all the blessings and priviledges , which before it contain'd , and retain'd only the curse and punishment ; in token whereof cherubims with flaming swords turning every way , were set to keep the way of the tree of life , gen. 3. 24. ( 3. ) soon after the violation of the covenant of works , god was graciously pleased to publish for the relief of mankind , now miserable and hopeless , the second covenant , which we call the covenant of grace , gen. 3. 15. which is the first opening of the grace of god in christ to fallen man ; and though this first promise of christ was but short and obscure , yet it was in every age to be opened clearer and clearer , until the promised seed should come . after the first opening of this new covenant in the first promise of christ , the first covenant is shut up for ever , as a covenant of life and salvation ; and all the world are shut up to the only way of salvation by christ , gal. 3. 23. it being contrary to the will of god , that two ways of salvation should stand open to man at once , and they so opposite one to another , as the way of works and the way of faith are , acts 4. 12. john 14. 6. gal. 2. 21. ( 4. ) 't is evident however , that after the first opening of the promise of christ , gen. 3. 15. god foreseeing the pride of fallen man , who naturally inclines to a righteousness of his own in the way of doing , was pleased to revive the law of nature , as to its matter , in the sinai dispensation , which was 430 years after the first promise had been renewed , and further opened unto abraham , of whose seed christ should come ; and this he did not in opposition to the promise , but in subserviency thereto , gal. 3. 21. and though the matter and substance of the law of nature be found in the sinai covenant , strictly taken for the ten commandments , yet the ends and intentions of god in that terrible sinai dispensation were two-fold : ( 1. ) to convince fallen man of the sinfulness and impotency of his nature , and the impossibility of obtaining righteousness by the law , and so by a blessed necessity to shut him up to christ , his only remedy . and ( 2. ) to be a standing rule of duty both towards god and man , to the end of the world : but if we take the sinai covenant more largely , as inclusive of the ceremonial with the moral law , ( as it is often taken , and is so by you , in the new testament ) then it did not only serve for a conviction of impotency , and a rule of duty , but exhibited and taught much of christ , and the mysteries of the new covenant in those its ceremonies , wherein he was prefigured to them . ( 5. ) whence it evidently appear that the sinai covenant was neither repugnant to the new covenant in its scope and aim . the law is not against the promise , gal. 3. 21. nor yet set up as co-ordinate with it , with a design to open two different ways of salvation to fallen man , but was added to the promise , in respect of its evangelical purposes and designs ; on which account it is call'd by some a covenant of faith or grace , in respect of its subserviency unto christ , who is the end of the law for righteousness , rom. 10. 4. and by others a subservient covenant , according to gal. 3. 23 , 24. and accordingly we find both tables of the law put into the ark , heb. 9. 4. which shews their consistency and subordination with , and to the method of salvation by christ in the new covenant . ( 6. ) this design and intention of god was fatally mistaken by the jews , ever since god promulg'd that law at sinai , and was by them notoriously perverted to a quite contrary end to that which god promulged it for , even to give righteousness and life in the way of personal and perfect obedience , rom. 10. 3. for they being ignorant of gods righteousness , and going about to establish their own righteousness , have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of god. hence christ came to be slighted by them , and his righteousness rejected ; for they rested in the law , rom. 2. 17. were married to the law as an husband , rom. 7. 2 , 3. and so might have no conjugal communion with christ. however , moses , abraham , and all the elect discerned christ as the end of the law for righteousness , and were led to him thereby . ( 7ly . ) this fatal mistake of the use and intent of the law , is the ground of those seeming contradictions in paul's epistles . sometimes he magnifies the law , when he speaks of it according to gods end and purpose in its promulgation , rom. 7. 12 , 14 , 16. but as it was fatally mistaken by the jews , and set in opposition to christ ; so he thunders against it , calls it a ministration of death and condemnation , and all its appendent ceremonies , weak and beggarly elements ; and by this distinction , whatsoever seems repugnant in paul's epistles , may be sweetly reconciled ; and 't is a distinction of his own making , 1 tim. 1. 8. we know that the law is good , if we use it lawfully . there is a good and an evil use of the law. had you attended these things , you had not so confidently and inconsiderately pronounced it a pure covenant of works . ii position . secondly , you affirm with like confidence , that the covenant of circumcision is also the same , viz. the covenant of works made with adam in paradise . this i utterly deny , and will try whether you have any better success in the proof of your second , than you had in your first position ; and to convince you of your mistake , let us consider what the general nature of this ordinance of circumcision was , what its ends were , and then prove that it cannot be what you affirm it to be , the very same covenant god made with adam before the fall , but must needs be a covenant of grace . ( 1. ) circumcision in its general nature , was ( 1. ) an ordinance of god's own institution in the 99th year of abraham's age , at which time of its institution , god renewed the covenant with him , gen. 17. 9 , 10. ( 2. ) that it consisted ( as all sacraments do ) of an external sign , and a spiritual mystery signified thereby . the external part of it ( which we call the sign ) was the cutting off the foreskin of the genital part of the hebrew males , on the eighth day from their birth . the spiritual mystery thereby signified and represented , was the cutting off the filth and guilt of sin from their souls , by regeneration and justification , called , the circumcision of the heart , deut. 10. 16. and though this was laid upon them by the command , as their duty , yet a gracious promise of power from god to perform that duty , was added to the command , deut. 30. 6. the lord thy god will circumcise thy heart to love him , &c. just as promises of grace in the new testament , are added to commands of duty : ( 3. ) betwixt this outward visible sign , and spiritual mystery , there was a sacramental relation , from which relation it is called the token of the covenant , gen. 17. 12. the sign and seal of the covenant , rom. 4. 11. yea , the covenant it self , acts 7. 8. ( 2. ) next let us consider the ends for which circumcision was instituted and ordained of god , of which these were the principal . ( 1. ) it was instituted to be a convictive sign of their natural corruption , propagated by the way of natural generation . for which reason this natural corruption goes in scripture under the name of the uncircumcision of the heart ▪ 〈◊〉 . 9. 26. ( 2. ) it also signified the putting off of this body of sin , in the vertue of christ's death , col. 2. 11. ( 3. ) it was appointed to be the initiating sign of the covenant , or a token of their matriculation and admission into the church and covenant of god , gen. 17. 9 , 10 , 11. ( 4. ) it was ordained to be a discriminating mark betwixt god's covenanted people , and the pagan world , who were strangers to the covenant , and without god in the world : and accordingly , both parties were from this ordinance denominated the circumcision and the uncircumcision , col. 3. 11. ( 5. ) it was also an obliging sign to abraham and his seed , to walk with god in the uprightness and sincerity of their hearts , in the performance of all covenanted duties , in which duties abraham and the faithful wa●…ked obedientially with god , looking to christ for righteousness ; but the carnal jews resting in , and trusting to those duties and ordinances for righteousness and justification , made it a covenant of works to themselves , and circumcision it self a bond of that covenant . ( 6. ) now for as much as circumcision prefigured christ , who was to come of this holy circumcised seed of abraham , and his death also was pointed at therein , heb. 2. 16. col. 2. 11. of necessity this ordinance must vanish at the death of christ , and accordingly did so . these things duly pondered , how irrational is it to imagine this covenant of circumcision to be the very same with the paradisical covenant ! did that covenant discover native corruption , and direct to its remedy in christ as this did ? surely it gave not the least glimps of any such thing . did that covenant separate and distinguish one person from another as this did ? no , no , it left all under equal and common misery , eph. 2. 3. had adam's covenant a seal of the righteousness of faith annexed to it as this had ? rom. 4. 11. he received circumcision a seal of the righteousness of faith. the righteousness of faith is evangelical righteousness , and this circumcision sealed . say not it was to abraham only , that it sealed it ; for 't is an injurious restriction put upon the seal of a covenant , which extended to the fathers as well as to abraham , luke 1. 72. but you admit however , that it sealed evangelical righteousness to abraham ; but i hope you will not say , that a seal of the covenant of works ever did or could seal evangelical righteousness to any individual person in the world. so then turn which way you will , this truth still follows you , and will fasten upon you ; that the covenant of circumcision was not a pure covenant of works , but a gospel-covenant , which i thus prove . argument i. if circumcision be a part of the ceremonial law , and the ceremonial law was dedicated by blood ; and whatsoever is so dedicated , is by you confessed to be no part of the covenant of works ; then circumcision is no part of the covenant of works , even by your own confession . but it is so , ergo. that it is a part of the ceremonial law , was never doubted or denied by any man : that it was dedicated by blood , and therefore no part of the moral law , you your self not only acknowledge , but vehemently plead for it , page 148. where you blame mr. sedgwick with some sharpness , and unbecoming reflection , for making no distinction betwixt the ceremonial covenant which was dedicated by blood , and the law written in tables of stone ; which was not so dedicated , and therefore could not be the same with the moral law , which you make the covenant of works ; telling him , that this dedication by blood ought to distinguish it from the moral law , or sinai covenant of works , as you say it doth , and ought to do ; how then can circumcision be the same with , and yet quite another thing from the sinai covenant ? was the ceremonial law dedicated by ●…lood ? yes , the apostle ●…lainly asserts it from exod. heb. 9. 18 , 19. ●…4 . 7 , 8. moses took the book ●…f the covenant , and read it in the audience ●…f the people , and took the blood , and sprink●…d it upon the people , and said , behold the ●…lood of the covenant , which the lord hath ●…ade with you concerning these things . but ●…hat kind of covenant then was this co●…enant that was sprinkled with blood ? ●…ou tell us , page 147. it could not possi●…y be the law written in stones ( which ●…ou make the covenant of works ) but ●…as indeed another covenant delivered 〈◊〉 a distinct season , and in a distinct ●…ethod . what covenant then must this ●…e , seeing it could not possibly ( as you ●…y ) be the sinai covenant written in ●…ones ? it must either be the covenant ●…f grace , or none . no , say you , that 〈◊〉 was not neither ; for it was of the same ●…ture with , and is no other than a co●…enant of works , page 151. it was the ●…me , and yet could not possibly be the same . mr. sedgwick , that learned-grave divine , is check'd page 148. for confounding the ceremonial law that wa●… sprinkled with blood , with the mora●… law ( which you call the covenant o●… works ) that was not sprinkled wit●… blood ; and say you , page 147. it coul●… not possibly be the same : and then p. 151 you say , it 's clear , these two , viz. th●… moral and ceremonial law , were both 〈◊〉 the same nature , that is , no other than 〈◊〉 covenant of works . how doth this han●… together ? pray reconcile it if you ca●… you say it is an ungrounded supposition 〈◊〉 mr. sedgwick 's , that that covenant whi●… was so confirmed by blood , must of necessi●… be confirmed by the blood of christ als●… page 148. but sir , the truth you oppos●… viz. that the book of the ceremoni●… law was sprinkled by typical bloo●… and therefore confirmed by the blo●… of christ for the time it was to contin●… shines like a bright sun-beam in yo●… eyes , from heb. 9. 14 , 23. was not t●… blood that sprinkled this law , the 〈◊〉 gure or type of christ's own blood whose blood was it then , if not christ'●… how dare you call this an unground●… supposition ? was not that blood typ●… cal blood ? and what , i pray you , was the antitype but christ's blood ? and did not the holy ghost signifie the one by the other ? heb. 9. 8. i stand amazed at these things : you distinguish and confound all again . you say it could not possibly be the same with the law written in stone , and you say it 's clear both were of the same nature , no other than a covenant of works . at this ●…ate you may say what you please , for 〈◊〉 see contradiction is no crime in your book . argument ii. if circumcision was the seal of the righteousness of faith , it did not per●…ain to the covenant of works , for the righteousness of faith and works are opposites , and belong to two contrary covenants . but circumcision was the seal of the righteousness of faith , rom. 4. 11. he ●…i . e. abraham ) received the sign of cir●…umcision , a seal of the righteousness of faith. therefore it pertains not to the cove●…ant of works , but grace . a man would think it impossible to evade so clear and scripture an argument as this is . the major proposition is even self-evident and undeniable ; the minor , the plain words of the apostle . and what is your reply to this ? certainly as strange a one as ever i met with , page 205. you say , 't is true , circumcision was a seal of the righteousness of faith to abraham , but it was so to him only , in his extraordinary circumstance●… but it was not so to any of his natural s●… in its ordinary use . i cannot deny but i have met with such an assertion before in mr. tombes and i can tell you too , that bellarmine invented it before mr. tombes was born , and that dr. ames fully confuted it in his third tome , page 27. proving that there was no extraordinary cause o●… abraham's account , why god should justifie or seal him more than any other believer ; and that abraham had nothing to glory in before god. but to restrain ▪ as you do , the publick seal of a covenant , that comprehended and equally concerned the whole church and people of god , to one single person , so tha●… neither isaac nor jacob , who were b●… name enrolled in that great charter , ●…hould have any right to the seal of it ; ●…s such a conceit as amazes an intelligent reader . we know abraham was the ●…rst that received it , but utterly deny ●…hat he received only for himself ; but ●…e received it as the father of all them ●…hat believe , whether jews or gentiles , ●…s the very next words tell us , he re●…eived it that he might be the father of ●…ll that believe , that is , for himself , and ●…ll his spiritual children . one half of his sacrament of circumcision you allow , ●…age 205. to the rest that were under 〈◊〉 , viz. to be a sign of the covenant ; but ●…e other half you cut off , and say it ●…as only a seal to him . what good ●…ouchers have you for this exposition ●…f the text ? have you the concurrence 〈◊〉 orthodox expositors ? or is it the rash ●…d bold adventure of your own head ? ●…am sure it no ways agrees with the drift ●…d scope of the apostles argument , ●…hich evidently is to prove , that both ●…ws and gentiles are justified by faith , as ●…braham was ; and that the ground of ●…stification and blessedness , is common ●…th to the uncircumcised gentiles , and ●…cumcised jews ; and that abraham , and all other believers , have but one way of justification and salvation ; and that how great soever abraham was , in this case he hath found nothing whereof to glory , ver . 1 , 2. and is not your exposition a notable one , to prove the community of the priviledge of justification , because the seal of it was peculiar to abraham alone ? rectifie it , and better consider it . argument iii. in the covenant of circumcision ▪ gen. 17. god makes over himself t●… abraham and his seed to be their god or give them a special interest in himself . but in the covenant of works , god doth not , since the fall , make over himself to any to be their god by way o●… special interest . therefore the covenant of circumcision cannot be the covenant of work●… this is so plain and clear , that no●… can doubt or deny it , that understand the nature of the two covenants . a●… now sir , what course do you take 〈◊〉 avoid this argument ? such a one sure , 〈◊〉 no man that ever i met with took before you ; and that 's this , you boldly cut abraham's covenant gen. 17. into two parts , and make the first to be the pure covenant of grace ; which is the promissory part , to the ninth verse , and the restipulation ( as you call it ) page 205. ●…o be as pure a covenant of works . what hard shift will some men make ●…o maintain their opinion ! you say ●…ruly page 205. that at the seventh and ●…ighth verses was their restipulation , why ●…hen do you say , page 224. that at verse ●…he seventh , he proceeds to speak of ano●…her covenant than what he had been ●…eaking of before ? does the promise ●…nd the restipulation make two cove●…ants , or are they just and necessary parts ●…f one and the same covenant ? you ●…lso tell us , that the covenant gen. 17. 〈◊〉 , 2 , 3 , 4. was a plain transcript of ●…veral free promises of the gospel , under ●…e denomination of a covenant . but ●…hy then don 't you take the restipula●…on , verse 7 , 8 , 9 , 10. to be a part of 〈◊〉 ? oh , no , there is something required 〈◊〉 abraham's and his posterities part , ●…ey must be circumcised , and that spoils ●…l . why , but sir , if the requiring of circumcision alters the case so greatly , as to make it a quite contrary covenant , how comes it to pass , that in the covenant to abraham , he himself was first required to be circumcised ? why this is the reason , here is somewhat required on their part as a condition , and a condition quite alters the nature of the covenant . very well , but tell me then , why you say , page 223. and in many other places , that the covenant made with abraham in gen. 12. was a gospel-covenant , and yet there abraham is obliged to walk before god , and be perfect ? does not that also there alter the nature of the covenant , as well as here in the seventeenth chapter ? you also grant the covenant made with abraham , gen. 22. was a pure gospel-covenant , or if you deny it , the apostle proves it , heb. 6. 13. and yet there is more appearance of respect to abraham's obedience in that covenant , than is in submitting to circumcision ; see gen. 22. 16 , 17. by my self have i sworn , saith the lord , for because thou hast done this thing , &c. that in blessing i will bless thee ; and in multiplying i will multiply thee . i will trouble you on this head but with one query more : if the four first verses of the seventeenth of genesis , contain a pure gospel-covenant as you say , and the restipulation in the following verses make a covenant of works , because it thereby becomes conditional : then tell me , if you please , whether what god graciously granted to abraham in the former verses , be not all null'd , and made void again by their restipulation ? does not this seem harsh ? here you have brought abraham , isaac , and jacob , and all the believers of abraham's race , just into the same case you brought moses and all the israelites before , under two opposite covenants , where one cuts off all that the other granted . but there is a stronger reason urged than the conditionality of the covenant , to prove it a covenant of works , and that is , circumcision is made the condition of abraham's covenant ; and that 's the worst of all conditions ; for it obliges a man to keep the whole law , gal. 5. 3. 't is the yoke of bondage , and to whatsoever covenant it be so annexed , it makes it become a bondage legal covenant . if we be circumcised , christ shall profit us nothing . thus it was in the covenant . gen. 17. great use is made of this in many parts of your discourse ; but sir , you are greatly mistaken in applying these texts to the purposes you do . for the apostle all along in that epistle to the galatians argues against the false teachers , who taught and pressed the necessity of circumcision , as a bond obliging them to the strict and perfect obedience of the law , in order to their justification thereby , or at least to joyn it with the righteousness of christ , as a con-cause of justification ; see gal. 2. 4 , 5. and the 3. 1. now against this abuse of circumcision it is that the apostle argues thus , and tells them , that in submitting to it on that account , they made the death of christ of no effect , and obliged themselves by it to the whole law ; for circumcision did not simply and absolutely , in the nature of the work or action , oblige men to the whole law in the way of justification by it , but it did so from the intention of the worker , and the supposition of such an opinion of it , and design in it ; for in it self , and with respect to gods design in the institution of it , it was to be a seal of the righteousness of faith , rom. 4. 11. and so it was an excellent useful instructive ordinance to all believers , as long as the ceremonial law stood ; and even when it was expiring , as the gospel began to open more and more clearly , there was yet some kind of toleration of it , to such as were born of jewish parents : thus paul himself circumcised timothy , his mother being a jewess , acts 16. 1 , 3. but titus being a greek was not circumcised ; and that because of these false teachers , that would make an ill use of that their liberty , gal. 2. 3 , 4. this paul could never have done , in case circumcision , in the nature of the act , had bound timothy to keep the law for justification . by which it appears that the action in its own nature , did not oblige to the keeping of the whole law , but from the intention of the agent ; and therefore as the apostle rightly argues , if a man be circumcised with this design to be justified by it , he would thereby bind himself to the whole law , and frustrate the death of christ to himself ; but it was now to have its funeral with all other parts of the ceremonial law which vanish'd , and were accomplished in the death of christ ; and it falling out that such a vile use was made of it at that time , the apostle thus thunders against it . had this been observed , as also the like abuse of the moral law , you would have known how to have reconciled the apostles encomiums of them both , with his sharp invectives against the one , and the other . but being ignorant of these two great and necessary distinctions of the law , according to gods intention in the promulgation of it at sinai , and the carnal jews sense of it , as a pure covenant of works , against which the apostle so sharply inveighs in the places by you cited , all your 23 arguments from page 183. to page 187. fall to the ground at one stroke , your medius terminus having one sense in your major proposition , and another in your minor ; and so every argument hath four terms in it ; as will easily be evinced by the particular consideration of the respective places from whence you draw them . so in like manner in your arguing here against circumcision , as a bond to keep the whole law ; and as such vacating the death of christ , is a stumble at the same stone , not distinguishing as you ought to have done , betwixt an obligation , arising out of the nature of the work , and out of the end and intention of the workers , and this every learned and judicious eye will easily discern . but we proceed to argument iv. that which in its direct and primary end , teacheth man the corruption of his nature by sin , and the mortification of sin by the spirit of christ , cannot be a condition of the covenant of works ; but so did circumcision in the very direct and primary end of it . this ordinance supposeth the fall of man , points to the means and instruments of his sin and misery ; and also to the remedy thereof by christ. ( 1. ) it singles out that genital part , by which original sin was propagated , gen. 17. 11. psalm 51. 5. to this the sign of the covenant is applied in circumcision , for the remission of sins past , and the extirpation of sin for the future . ( 2. ) therefore it was instituted of god , that men might see both the necessity and true way of mortifying their lusts , in the vertue of christ's death and resurrection ; whereof baptism , that succeeds it , is a sign now , as circumcision was then ; as is plain from col. 2. 11 , 12. in whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands , in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh , by the circumcision of christ , buried with him in baptism , wherein also ye are risen with him , through the faith of the operation of god , who raised him from the dead . 't is clear then , that circumcision directed men to the death and resurrection of christ , as the true and only means of mortifying their lusts ; and if it did so , sure it was not the covenant of works , for that gives fallen man no hint of a remedy . ( 3. ) it was also a discriminating sign or token , betwixt the church and the world. god's people , and the heathens , who were accordingly denominated from it , the circumcision and the uncircumcision , the holy seed and the gentiles . and now under the new testament , the children of abraham by faith , and the children of the flesh. this also shews it cannot be the covenant of works ; for in that covenant all are equally and alike concluded under sin and misery , ephes. 2. 3. and there is no difference made by that covenant betwixt person and person , state and state. if this be not enough to evince , that the covenant of circumcision is a covenant of grace , i promise you many more arguments to prove it , as soon as i shall find these refuted , and your contrary assertion well discharged from the gross absurdities with which it is clog'd and loaded . you see how genuine , natural and congruous to scripture the notion of it as a covenant of grace is , and all the world may see how harsh , alien , and repugnant to scripture your notion of circumcision , as a covenant of works , is . you see into what boggs you are again driven in defence of your opinion . exemp . gra . that circumcision is a part of the ceremonial law , which was dedicated with blood , and therefore could be no ●…art of the moral law or ten commandments , which was ( say you ) the co●…enant of works ; and yet that it is of ●…he same nature ; and that it 's clear 〈◊〉 is no other than a covenant of works . don't you there distinguish and confound all again ? blame and check mr. sedgwick without cause , and commit a greater absurdity presently than you charged him with ? don't you question whether that covenant that was typically sealed by blood , was sealed by christs blood ? pray , sir , consider where-ever god commands typical blood to be applyed , it relates to christs blood spiritually apply'd , or to nothing . are not you forced in defence of your erroneous thesis , to say with bellarmine , that circumcision was extraordinary in its institution , and applyed as a seal to none but abraham himself ? it excluded even isaac the type of christ , and jacob a prince with god. o what will not men venture upon in defence of their darling opinions ! are you not forced for your security from the danger of the third argument to cut one and the same covenant made with abraham just in two , and of the pure promissory part to make a covenant of grace ; and of the other part , which you your self call a restipulation , to make another quite opposite covenant ? don't you magnifie the bounty and grace of god to abraham in the first four verses , and then destroy it all , by putting him at once under a contrary covenant , and so cut off all capacity to enjoy one of those mercies ? don't you make circumcision in its own nature , without respect to the intention of the person , an obligation to the whole law , and that which frustrates the death of christ , and yet must grant , that paul himself took timothy and circumcised him , and yet thereby brought him under no such dangerous obligation to the law ? in a word , you reject all those covenants as legal , that have any conditions in them , or respect to any thing that is to be done by us , and allow gen. 12. and gen. 22. to be pure gospel-covenants of grace ; and yet in the first abraham is bound to walk before god and be perfect ; and in the other god saith , for because thou hast done this thing , surely blessing i will bless thee . and so much for abraham's covenant . iii. of the conditionality of the new covenant . come we next to consider that opinion of yours , which led you into these other gross mistakes and absurdities , and that is this , that the covenant of grace is absolute , and whatever covenant is not so , but hath any condition upon our part , must needs for that reason be a covenant of works . see page 229. it is observable ( say you ) that as the covenants mentioned gen. 2. exod. 20. &c. were all conditional , and therefore legal covenants , requiring strict and perfect obedience , as the condition propounded , in order to the enjoyment of the mercies contained in them , which are all therefore done away in christ ; so on the other hand we see , that the covenant god made with abraham , gen. 12. 2 , 3. and gen. 17. 2 , 3. and gen. 22. 16 , 17 , 18. was wholly free and absolute , and therefore purely evangelical , &c. we will review these things anon , and see if you truly represent the matter ; but in order to it , let me first tell you ( 1. ) what we mean by a gospel-condition . ( 2. ) prove that there are such in the gospel-covenant . ( 3. ) shew you the absurdity of your opinion against it . ( 1. ) what we mean by a condition in the gospel-covenant . by a condition of the covenant , we do not mean in the strictest rigid sense of the word , such a restipulation to god from man of perfect obedience in his own person , at all times , so as the least failure therein forfeits all the mercies of the covenant : that 's rather the condition of adam's covenant of works , than of the evangelical covenant ; nor do we assert any meritorious condition , that in the nature of an impulsive cause , shall bring man into the covenant and its priviledges , or continue him in when brought in . this we renounce as well as you ; but our question is about such a condition , as is neither in the nature of it , an act perfect in every degree , nor meritorious in the least of the benefit conferr'd , nor yet done in our own strength . but plainly and briefly ; our question is , whether there be not something as an act required of us in point of duty , to a blessing consequent by vertue of a promise ? such a thing , whatever it be , hath the nature of a condition , inasmuch as it is antecedent to the benefit of the promise , and the mercy or benefit granted is suspended , until it be performed . the question is not , whether there be any intrinsecal worth or value in the thing so required , to oblige the disposer to make or perform the grant or promise : but meerly that it be antecedent to the enjoyment of the benefit ; and that the disposer of the benefit do suspend the benefit , until it be performed . thus an act or duty of ours , which hath nothing at all of merit in it , or answerable value to the benefit it relates to , may be in a proper sense a condition of the said benefit . for what is a condition in the true notion of it , but * the suspension of a grant until something future be done ? or † as others to the same purpose , the adding of words to a grant for the future of a suspending quality , according to which the disposer will have the benefit he disposeth to be regulated . this properly is a condition , though there be nothing of equivalent value or merit in the thing required : and such your brethren in their narrative , pag. 14. do acknowledge faith to be , when they assert none can be actually reconciled , justifyed , or adopted , till they are really implanted into jesus christ by faith , and so by vertue of this their union with him , have these fundamental benefits actually conveyed unto them , which contains the proper notion of the condition we contend for . and such a condition of salvation we assert faith to be in the new covenant grant ; that is to say , the grant of salvation by god in the gospel-covenant is suspended from all men , till they believe , and is due by promise , ( not merit ) to them as soon as they do truly believe . the notes or signs of a condition given by civilians or moralists are such as these , if , if not , unless , but if , except only , and the like . when these are added in the promise of a blessing , or benefit for the future , they make that promise conditional ; and your grammar ( according to which you must speak , if you speak properly and strictly ) will tell you , that si , sin , modo , dum , dummodo are all conditional particles ; and it is evident , that these conditional particles are frequently inserted in the grants of the blessings and priviledges of the new testament : as for example , mark. 9. 23. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , if thou canst believe . acts 8. 37. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , if thou believest with thy whole heart , thou mayest , &c. rom. 10. 9. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth , and believe with thy heart , &c. thou shalt be saved . matth. 18. 3. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , except ye be converted , and become as little children , you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven . mark 5. 36. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , only believe . mark 11. 26. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , but if ye forgive not , &c. with multitudes more , which are all conditional particles inserted in the grants of benefits . ( 2. ) having shewn what the nature of a condition is , i shall , i hope , make it plain to you , that faith is such a condition in the gospel-grant of our salvation ; for we find the benefit suspended till this act of faith be performed , john 3. 36. he that believeth on the son hath everlasting life ; and he that believeth not the son , shall not see life , but the wrath of god abideth on him . and most plainly , rom. 10. 9. having shewn before what the condition of legal righteousness was , he tells us there what the gospel-condition of salvation is , the righteousness which is of faith , speaketh on this wise , that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the lord jesus , and shalt believe in thy heart , that god raised him from the dead , thou shalt be saved . i ask you , sir , whether it be possible to put words into a frame more lively expressive of a condition than these are ? do but compare mark 16. 16. he that believeth , and is baptized shall be saved , but he that believeth not shall be damned . do but compare , i say , that scripture-phrase with the words of jacob's sons , which all allow to be conditional , gen. 43. 4 , 5. if thou wilt send our brother with us , we will go down ; but if thou wilt not send him , we will not go down ; and judge whether the one be not as conditional as the other : more particularly , argument i. if we cannot be justifyed or saved till we believe , then faith is the condition on which those consequent benefits are suspended . but we cannot be justisied or saved till we believe . ergo. the sequel of the major is evident ; for as was said before , a condition is the suspension of a grant , till something future be done . the minor is plain in scripture , rom. 4. 24. now it was not written for his sake alone , that righteousness was imputed to him , but for our sakes also , to whom it shall be imputed , if we believe . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , qibus futurum est ut imputetur , to whom it shall come to pass , that it shall be imputed , if we believe : and acts 10. 43. whosoever believeth on him , shall receive remission of sins . john 3. 36. he that believeth not , shall not see life , but the wrath of god remaineth on him ; with multitudes more . now , sir , lay seriously before your eyes such scriptures as these , that promise salvation to believers , and threaten damnation to all unbelievers , as mark 16. 16. doth , and then give a plain and clear answer to this question ; either the positive part of that text promises salvation absolutely to men , whether they believe , or believe not , and consequently unbelievers shall be saved as well as believers : and the negative part threatens damnation absolutely to sinners , as sinners ; and consequently all sinners shall be damned , whether they believe , or believe not ; or else if you allow neither to be absolute , but that none can be saved till they believe , nor any damned when they do believe ; is not that a conditional promise and threatning ? argument ii. if gods covenant with abraham , gen. 12. 2 , 3. and that gen. 17. 2 , 3. were ( as you say ) pure gospel-covenants of grace , and yet in both some things are required as duties on abraham's part , to make him partaker of the benefits of the promises ; then the covenant of grace is not absolute , but conditional . but so it was in both these covenants . ergo. the minor only requires proof , for which let us have recourse to the places , and see whether it be so or not . ( 1. ) for the first you instance in as a pure gospel-covenant made with abraham , gen. 12. 2 , 3. . i must confess , as you dismember the text , pag. 229. by choosing out the second and third verses , and leaving out the first , which was the trial of abraham's obedience in forsaking his native country , and his fathers house ; i say , give me but this liberty to separate and dis-joyn one part of a covenant from the other , and it 's easie to make any conditional covenant in the world to become absolute : for take but the duty required , from the promise that is made ; and that which was a conditional , presently becomes an absolute grant. suppose , sir , that abraham had refused to leave his dear native country and nearest relations , as many do ; think you that the promised mercies had been his ? i must plainly tell you , you assume a strange liberty in this matter , and make a great deal bolder with the scriptures than you ought ; and the very same usage the other scriptures hath . ( 2. ) for when you cite your second covenant with abraham , you only cite gen. 17. 2 , 3. and then call it an absolute gospel covenant ; when indeed you made it so , by leaving out the first verse , which contains the condition o●… duty required on abraham's part ; fo●… thus run the three first verses . an●… when abraham was ninety nine years old , the lord appeared to abraham , and said unto him , i am the almighty god , walk thou before me , and be thou perfect , and i will make my covenant between me and thee , &c. here an upright conversation before god is required of him , at god's entrance into this covenant with him ; but that is , and must be omitted , and cut off , to make the covenant look absolute . i am really grieved to see the scriptures thus dealt with , to serve a design . argument iii. if all the promises of the gospel be absolute and unconditional , requiring no restipulation from man , then they cannot properly and truly belong to the new covenant . but they do properly and truly belong to the new covenant : therefore they are not all absolute and unconditional . the sequel of the major is only liable to doubt , or denial , namely , that the absoluteness of all the promises of the new testament cuts off their relation to a covenant ; but that it doth so , no man can deny , that understands the difference between a covenant and an absolute promise . a covenant is a mutual compact , or agreement betwixt parties , in which they bind each other to the performance of what they respectively promise : so that there can be no proper covenant , where there is not a restipulation , or re-obligation of one part , as well as a promise on the other . but an absolute promise binds only one party , and leaves the other wholly free , and unobliged to any thing in order to the enjoyment of the good promised . so then if all the new testament promises be unconditional and absolute , they are not part of a covenant , nor must that word be applied to them ; they are absolute promises , binding no man to whom they are made , to any duty , in order to the enjoyment of the mercies promised : but those persons that are under these absolute promises , must and shall enjoy the mercies of pardon and salvation , whether they repent , or repent not ; believe , or believe not ; obey , or obey not . now , to what licentiousness this doctrine leads men , is obvious to every eye . yet this absoluteness of the covenant ( as you improperly call it ) is by you asserted , pag. 229 , 230. there is ( say you ) no condition at all , 't is wholly free and absolute , as the covenant with abraham , gen. 12. 2 , 3. gen. 17. 2 , 3. thank you , sir , for making them so ; for by cutting off the first verses , where the duty required on abraham's part is contained , you make them what god never intended them to be . and the same foul play ●…s in deut. 30. where you separate the plain condition contained in vers . 1 , 2. from the promise , vers . 6. or if the condition , vers . 1 , 2. be not plain enough , ●…ut you will make it part of the pro●…ise , i hope that after in vers . 10. is too ●…lain to be deny'd . as to the other texts more anon : mean time see how ●…ou destroy the nature of a cove●…ant . object . but , say you , pag. 233. to im●…ose new conditions , though never so ●…ild , is a new covenant of works with me mercy , but not a covenant of race , properly so called . sol. t 's true , if those works or acts ours , which god requires , be under●…od of meritorious works in our own strength and power to perform , it destroys the free grace of the covenant ; but this we utterly reject , and speak only of faith wrought in us by the spirit of god , which receives all from god , and gives the entire glory to god , ephes. 2. 5 , 8. obj. but you will say , if faith be the condition , and that faith be not of our selves , then both the promise and the condition are on gods part ; ( if you will call faith a condition ) and so still on our part the covenant is absolute . sol. this is a mistake , and the mistake in this leads you into all the rest ; though faith ( which we call the condition on our part ●…e the gift of god , and the power of believing be derived from god ; yet the act of believing is properly our act , though the power by which we believe be of god ; else i●… would follow when we act any grace , as faith , repentance or obedience , tha●… god believes , repents , and obeys in us and it is not we , but god that doth al●… these . this , i hope , you will not dar●… to assert : they are truly our works though wrought in gods strength , is●… 26. 12. lord , thou hast wrought all o●… works in us , ( i. e. ) though they be our works , yet they are wrought in us by thy grace , or strength . as for dr. owen , 't is plain from the place you cite in the doctrine of justification , pag. 156. he only excludes conditions as we do , in respect of the dignity of the act , and is more plain in his treatise of redemption , pag. 103 , 104. in which he allows conditions in both the covenants , and makes this the difference , that the old required them , but the new effects them in all the federates . i know no orthodox divine in the world that presumes to thrust in any work of mans into the covenant of grace , as a condition , which in the arminian sense he may , or may not perform , according to the power and pleasure of his own free-will , without the preventing or determining grace of god ; which preventing grace is contained in those promises , ezek. 36. 25 , 26 , 27. &c. nor yet that there is any meritorious worth , either of condignity or congruity in the popish sense , in the very justifying act of faith , for the which god justifies and saves us . but we say , that though god in the way of preventing grace works faith in us , and when it is so wrought , we need his assisting grace to act it ; yet neither this assisting nor preventing grace makes the act of faith no more to be our act : 't is we that believe still , tho in gods strength , and that upon our believing or not believing , we have , or have not the benefits of gods promises ; which is the very proper notion of a condition . argument iv. if all the promises of the new covenant be absolute and unconditional , having no respect nor relation to any grace wrought in us , nor duty done by us ; then the trial of our interest in christ by marks and signs of grace is not our duty , nor can we take comfort in sanctification , as an evidence of justification . but it is a christians duty to try his interest in christ by marks and signs , and he may take comfort in sanctification , as an evidence of justification . ergo. the sequel of the major is undeniably clear , for that can never be a sign or evidence of an interest in christ , which that interest may be without ; yea , and as dr. crispe asserts , according to his antinomian principles , christ is ours ( saith he ) before we have gracious qualifications . every true mark and sign must be inseparable from that it signifies . now , if the works of the spirit in us be not so , but an interest in christ may be where these are not ; then they are no proper marks or signs ; and if they are not , it cannot be our duty to make use of them as such ; and consequently if we should , they can yield us no comfort . the minor is plain in scripture , 1 john 2. 3. hereby we do know that we know him , if we keep his commandments . the meaning is , we perceive and discern our selves to be sincere believers , and consequently that christ is our propitiation ; when obedience to his commands is become habitual and easie to us . so 1 john 3. 19. hereby we know that we are of the truth , and shall assure our hearts before him , ( i. e. ) by our sincere cordial love to christ and his members , as v. 18. this shall demonstrate to us , that we are the children of truth ; and again , 1 john 3. 14. we know that we are passed from death to life ; because we love the brethren . with multitudes more to the same purpose , which plainly teach christians to fetch the evidences of their justification out of their sanctification , and to prove their interest in christ , by the works of his spirit found in their own hearts . and this is not only a christians liberty , but his commanded duty ; to bring his interest in christ to this touch-stone and test , 2 cor. 13. 5. examine your selves , prove your selves , &c. 2 pet. 1. 10. give all diligence to make your calling and election sure , ( i. e. ) your election by your calling . no man can make his election sure a priori , nor can any man make it surer than it is in se , therefore it is only capable of being made sure to us a posteriori , arguing from the work of sanctification in us , to god's eternal choice of us . and as the saints in all ages have taken this course , so they have taken great and lawful comfort in the use of these marks and signs of grace , 2 kings 20. 3. 2 cor. 1. 12. i am sensible how vehemently the antinomian party , dr. crispe , mr. eyre and some others do oppugn this truth , representing it as legal and impracticable ( for they are for the absolute and unconditional nature of the new covenant as well as you ) but by your espousing their principle , you have even run anabaptism into antinomianism , and must by this principle of yours , renounce all marks and tryals of an interest in christ , by any work of the spirit wrought in us . you must only stick to the immediate sealings of the spirit , which if such a thing be at all , it is but rare and extraordinary . i will not deny but there may be an immediate testimony of the spirit , but sure i am his mediate testimony by his graces in us , is his usual way of sealing believers . we do not affirm any of these his works to be meritorious causes of our justification , or that considered abstractedly from the spirit , they can of themselves seal or evidence our interest in christ. neither do we affirm , that any of them are compleat and perfect works ; but this we say , that they being true and sincere , though imperfect graces , they are our usual and standing evidences to make out our interest in christ by . and i hope you and the whole antinomian party will find it hard , yea , and impossible , to remove the saints from that comfortable and scriptural way of examining their interest in christ , by the graces of his spirit in them ; as the saints who are gone to heaven before them , have done in all generations . argument v. if the covenant of grace be altogether absolute and unconditional , requiring nothing to be done on our part , to entitle us to its benefits ; then it cannot be man's duty in entring covenant with god , to deliberate the terms , count the cost , or give his consent by word or writing , explicitly to the terms of this covenant . but it is man's duty , in entring covenant with god , to deliberate the terms , and count the cost , luke 14. 26. to 34. and explicitly to give his consent thereto , either by word or writing , ergo , the sequel of the major is self-evident ; for where there are no terms or conditions required on our part , there can be none to deliberate or give our consent to ; and so a man may be in covenant without his own consent . the minor is undeniable in the text cited . if you say these are duties but not conditions ; i reply , they are such duties , without the performance of which , we can have no benefit by christ and the new covenant , luke 14. 33. and such duties have the true suspending nature of conditions in them . if you say they are only subsequent duties , but not antecedent or concomitant acts ; the 28th verse directly opposes you , let him first sit down and count the cost : and for those overt acts whereby we explicitly declare our consent to the terms of the covenant , at our first entring into the bond of it , i hope you will not say that 's a legal covenant too , isa. 44. 3 , 4. i will pour water upon him that is thirsty , and flouds upon the dry ground ; i will pour my spirit upon thy seed , and my blessing upon thine off-spring , and they shall spring up as among the grass , as willows by the water-courses . one shall say i am the lords , and another shall call himself by the name of jacob ; and another shall subscribe with his hand unto the lord , &c. a plain allusion to souldiers , when they list themselves under a captain or general . what remains now , to reply to these arguments ? but either that the places by me cited and argued upon , do not intend the new covenant under which we are , or that this new covenant hath its conditions , and is not altogether absolute , as you have asserted it to be . and thus sir , you are fairly beaten off ( if i mistake not ) from the new ground you had chosen and marked out to raise your battery upon , to demolish that strong fort which secures the right of believers infants to baptism , and you must return again to the old answers of mr. tombes and others , to our solid and substantial arguments from abraham's covenant , gen. 17. which have been bassled over and over by baxter , blake , sydenham , and many other stout champions for infants baptism . all that i am further concerned about , is to examine so many of those scriptures as you have spoken to , which are by us produced in defence of those four grounds or principles mentioned in the beginning of this discourse , whereon we establish the right of infants baptism ; and to vindicate those scriptures from your strained and injurious interpretations of them . which being done , they will each of them stand in those eminent places of service , where they have been so long useful to the cause we defend . as for your pretended solutions of the incomparable mr. baxter's , and the learned and acute dr. burthogg's arguments ; i admire at your confidence therein ; and let me tell you , without breach of charity , 't is an high piece of confidence in you , to throw the gantlet and bid defiance to two such worthies yet alive , and easily able to detect your folly in the weakness and impertinency of your answers . alas ! my friend , you little know what it is to have such weak and inartificial discourses as yours , brought under the strict examen of such acute and judicious eyes . but — — sic dama leonem insequitur , audetque viro concurrere virgo . nor will i presume to anticipate either of their answers to your discourse , ( if they shall think it worthy of an answer ) but rather briefly reflect upon what you return to the arguments of those eminent divines that are gone to glory , in the faith of that truth you oppose ; and are not capable of defending their solid and regular interpretations of scriptures , against the notions you force upon them , contrary both to the grammar and scope of several of them . and here sir , in the beginning , let me mind you what a learned and judicious person saith , about all interpretations of scriptures . four things ( saith he ) commend an interpretation , and establish it as a king upon the throne , against whom there is no rising up . ( 1. ) if the letter and grammar of the text will fairly bear it . ( 2. ) if the scope and argument of the place will close directly with it . ( 3. ) if the interpretation set up against it , cannot stand before both , or either of the former . ( 4. ) if the judgment of learned , wise and impartial men , be found generally agreeable to it . according to these rules ( whereat you can have no just exception ) i shall briefly , yet i hope clearly and sufficiently , answer some of the replies you make to the arguments of those deceased worthies : and ( 1. ) in page 1. you produce mr. william allen's argument ad hominem against your practice . he tells you your own principle condemns you , for you reject the baptizing of infants ; because there is no example in the new testament for it ; and yet baptize persons at age , whose parents were christians , which is as much without a gospel-president or example as the former . the sum of your reply is , that though it should be granted , that there is no express example for the baptizing of such in scripture , yet there are examples enough concerning the baptism of believers . reply . here you grant all that mr. allen objects , viz. that you are altogether without example or president for your practice ; and object to him and us what neither he nor we ever scrupled or denied , viz. the baptizing of some adult persons upon the personal profession of their faith. i have done it my self , and in like circumstances am ready to do it again . once you clearly yield it , that you have no president nor example for your practice in the gospel . that 's all that he seeks , and what he seeks you plainly grant . as to the precept and examples of baptizing adult believers , whose parents were unbelievers , and themselves never baptized in infancy ; that 's not the point you are now to speak to : nor have we any controversie about it . certainly you are none of the fittest persons in the world , to clamour so loudly against us for want of express presidents for infant baptism , whilst your self confesses you want even one president in the new testament to legitimate your own practice ; and in the mean time are found in the sinful neglect of a sweet and heavenly gospel-ordinance , viz. the singing of psalms , for which you have both precept and president in the gospel , col. 3. 16. james 5. 13. 1 cor. 14. 26. ( 2. ) it is objected against you , page 2. that if the commission matt. 28. excludes none from baptism , but such as are to be excluded by the order therein to be observed , and if baptizing and teaching are to precede or follow one the other , as there named by christ , then these two conclusions will follow . ( 1. ) that infants are not there excluded from baptism . ( 2. ) that a person may be baptized before he be taught ; for there we have first 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . disciple all nations , make them disciples or christians . secondly , we have 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which literally to translate is baptizing-teaching . now then discipling being a general word , that contains in it the two others that follow , viz. baptizing and teaching ; and being the imperative mood , whereas the other two are participles ; it is manifest , that the whole command or commission is given in that , and the mode of execution in these ; and if the mode of executing that general commission be expressed in these , where baptizing is first , and teaching comes after ; what is become of the order the antipoedobaptists have so long talk'd of ? the summ of your answer is , that if baptizing be first , and teaching comes after ; then it will follow , that the apostles understood not their commission aright , for they first preached , and then baptized them that by their preaching believed , acts 8. acts 10. acts 2. with many other places you heap up to the same purpose , and therefore infants must be excluded by that commission , because uncapable of being taught . and therefore let us criticize as we please , upon imperative moods and participles , the case is clear , teaching must go before baptizing . reply . it had been more modest to suspect , that you understood not the text aright , than that the apostles understood not their commission aright . the order of the words ( as this well fortified objection declares , and you cannot deny ) puts teaching after baptizing ; and though we should allow you that they discipled adult persons by teaching , and taught others baptized in infancy , after their baptizing them ; in both they followed their order and commission in discipling the parents by preaching , and teaching their children baptized by vertue of the promise to them , after their baptism : for he declares , acts 2. the promise is to them , and to their children , which gives a right of both unto baptism ; and so teaching , according to the order of this commission , may be an antecedent duty to the parent , and a subsequent duty to him and his baptized children : for if 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 includes teaching before baptizing , why should not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which is put after baptizing , respect the subsequent duty of teaching both the one and other ? ( 3. ) mr. allen's next argument , mentioned by you , pag. 5. is taken from matth. 19. 14. suffer little children to come unto me , and forbid them not , for of such is the kingdom of heaven . whence he argues against your objection of the incapacity of infants for baptism , that if they are capable of interest or membership in the kingdom of heaven , or church , they are equally capable of the sign or cognizance , which is baptism . to this you reply three things : ( 1. ) that it remains to be prov'd , that these little children were infants , and not grown boys or girls , capable of making an actual profession of their faith in christ. ( 2. ) 't is doubtful whether they were for present in the kingdom of god , or were only elected , and so in time should be of his kingdom . and ( 3. ) whatever they were , they were brought unto christ , who himself baptized not ; not to his disciples , who did baptize . reply . your first exception is vain and groundless ; that they were very young and little ones , appears not only by christs taking them in his arms , but from the very notation of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a diminutive word , signifying a little child or infant . so john was call'd when new-born , luke 1. 76. and christ when he lay in the manger , and moses when among the flaggs . and if this be not enough , st. luke gives them another name , luke 18. 15. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , infants , a word given to a child in the womb , luke 1. 41. and for what you object out of piscator , that the same word is us'd of timothy , who knew the scriptures from a child ; 't is an evident mistake , or shift , for the word is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , he knew them not being an infant , but from his childhood or infancy ; that is , when he had past his infant state , in which state th●…se were that were brought unto christ. and ( 2. ) whereas you question their present right in the kingdom of god , or whether it were not future by vertue of their election ? the text will not allow your interpretation , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , of such is , not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , shall be the kingdom of god. their present church-membership asserted by christ , is also a known rule to regulate for the future , the disciples carriage towards them , which was too severe , harsh , and therefore highly displeasing to christ ; but by telling them they were members of the church , or kingdom of heaven ( they being very probably the infants of believing parents , as their bringing them unto christ with such affection , through the frowns and repulses of the disciples , shews ) he gives them a known and plain rule how to distinguish infants , and regulate their carriage towards them , which god's election can never be , that being an unrevealed secret. and ( 3. ) whereas you say christ did not baptize them . i reply , we never urged this scripture to prove he did so , but only to prove their chruch-membership ; which methinks christ asserts as plainly as words can assert it , when he saith , of such is the kingdom of heaven ; and tho you use to quibble at the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , of such , as though it respected not the present infants , but grown persons , resembling them in humble and innocent qualities ; mr. sydenham hath sufficiently baffled that interpretation , by shewing its inconsistence with the scope and argument of the place , and how ridiculous this sense would be , when reduced to a formal argument . ( 4. ) the fourth argument you pretend to answer , pag. 8. is drawn from 1 cor. 7. 14. else were your children unclean , but now are they holy . to this you answer two things . ( 1. ) that the holiness here spoken of , is not a federal , but a matrimonial holiness , namely , legitimacy , and is as much as to say , your children are no bastards , seeing one of you is a believer . reply . if this be true , and the genuine sense of this text , then all the children in the world , not immediately descended from one or both believing parents , must of necessity be all bastards , and their parents , how solemnly soever married , must live in uncleanness ; and what mad work ( think you ) will this assertion make in the world ? and how many millions of persons will it nearly touch , both in point of honour , and inheritance ? ( 2. ) you say , though the holiness here spoken of should be allow'd to be a federal or covenant holiness , yet for want of an express institution , it will not warrant our practice . reply . the holiness of the children being granted to be a covenant holiness , none can deny them to be within the covenant ; how else come they to be holy by covenant ? and if within the covenant , who can deny them the initiating sign , which is baptism ? or how shall they ordinarily be visibly admitted into the visible church without it ? the connection betwixt their federal holiness and right to baptism , will appear plain enough from acts 2. 38. which you come next to speak to . ( 5. ) you attempt to answer mr. allen's argument from acts 2. 38. be baptized , or the promise is unto you , and to your chil●ren , and unto all that are afar off , even ●s many as the lord our god shall call . on this text you know we lay very great stress , for the proof of infants baptism ; and it deserves a remarque , that you wholly suppress our arguments drawn from that text , but however return an answer to them all , such as it is . you first tell us , the promise here spoken of , is not a promise of any external priviledges , but the promise of the gospel , or the grace of god in christ jesus . secondly , that the promise was not to their children as believers seed , nor to them , or any other uncall'd by the lord , but only a promise of remission of sins , and receiving the holy ghost , upon their actual repentance , which infants cannot perform , and therefore cannot here be intended . this is the true and whole sense of your answer . reply . now because you have wholly omitted our argument from this text , ( for which doubtless there was some reason ) i think my self oblig'd to let the world know how we expound it , and what we duly infer from that exposition of it : and then let the reader judge , whether by the forementioned rules of a just interpretation , you or we are in the right . ( 1. ) we observe this famous text to contain the first argument used by the apostle , after christs ascension , to perswade the jews to embrace christianity , by repenting , and submitting themselves to baptism , the initiating sign of it ; and therefore here we justly expect much light about this controverted point ; nor doth the apostle in this text deceive our expectation . ( 2. ) we take it for granted , that the direct and proper scope of this place , is to perswade the jews ( to whom st. peter preach'd ) to repent and be baptized . this you allow , when you say , pag. 10. he uses it as a motive why they and theirs should actually repent and be baptized . in these two then there is no controversie . ( 3. ) we take it for certain , that the promise here referr'd to by peter is that gracious promise , gen. 17. 7. i will be a god to thee and thy seed ; the adjoyning of their children to them ( saith calvin ( and with him runs the general current of expositors ) depends on the words of that promise , gen. 17. 7. if you be not satisfied with this , but rather will refer it to joel 2. 28. you are then oblig'd to answer mr. sydenham's arguments a fortiori , from that reference . but you make no exception at all to this accomodation of it : and then the sense must be this , the promise shall run as before , to you and to your children . ( 4. ) we say , that except it had had relation to the covenant with abraham , there had been no occasion or reason at all here to have mentioned children , as well as parents ; the promise is to you , and to your children : it had been enough , if he had only intended the believing parents , exclusive of their infant seed , to have said , the promise is made to as many as the lord our god shall call . what reason or occasion was there to bring in their children at all ? ( 5. ) we find here the children both of believing jews and gentiles mentioned in the promise , accompanying the precept of baptism , and the precept to them built upon the promise , as that which gave them their title to baptism , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , for the promise is to you and to your children . in the same line that he mentions baptism , he also mentions the promise , upon which their right is founded ; and in the same breath with which he mentions their children , he also mentions the promise ; which he would never have done , had his design been to have excluded their children from both , or either of them ; especially seeing their children had been so long in the possession of both . these things are obvious , natural , and every way agreeable both to the grammar and scope of the text ; whence we argue arg. if the promise be the same to believers under the gospel , that ever it was to abraham , and his natural seed , then the children of believers by vertue thereof , have as good a title to baptism , as abraham's children had to circumcision . but the promise is the same , ergo , &c. next , let us consider your answers . ( 1. ) you say , the promise here spoken of is not a promise of any external priviledges , but the promise of the gospel . reply . your distinction is vain and groundless , for it opposeth promises that contain external priviledges , to gospel promises , contrary to 1 tim. 4. 8. godliness hath promise of the life that now is , and of that which is to come . secondly , circumcision then , and baptism now , which have both their foundation in that promise , contain priviledges in them of both sorts . this no man can deny , but he that thinks it no priviledg to be admitted into the visible church by the external initiating sign , and to be thereby distinguished from the pagan world. you have no warrant therefore to divide those things which god hath united . ( 2. ) you say the promise was not to them as believers seed , nor to any uncalled by the lord. reply . your meaning is , that these words [ as many as the lord shall call ] are a limitation of the promise to them only , whether parents or children , that are actually called ; let this your interpretation be compared with , and examin'd by the scope of the text , which you confessed before to be a motive to perswade them and theirs to repentance and baptism , and see if it can stand before it , as ours doth : for if this be the meaning , then the apostle's argument must run thus : i exhort you , convinced jews , to repentance and christian baptism ; for whereas you and your children have hitherto been an holy seed , and the promise formerly was to them as well as you ; but now the case is alter'd ; if you your selves repent and be baptiz'd , you shall have the benefit of the promise ; but as for your children , they shall be in the self-same case and state with the children of pagans and infidels : indeed , if any of your children shall hereafter believe , they shall have benefit by the promise , but no more than the childen of pagans and infidels , which upon repentance shall be equal with them . repent ye therefore , and be baptized , for the promise is unto you , and to your children . this , and no other , must the apostles motive be , according to your interpretation and limitation of his words . we make the motive or argument to run thus : god hath now remembred his covenant to abraham , in sending that blessed seed , in whom he promised to be the god of him and his seed ; yea , and of all believing gentiles , as well as jews and their children : don't you therefore by your unbelief deprive both your selves , and your dear children , of the mercies and priviledges of so great a promise ? repent therefore , and be baptized , for the promise is unto you , and to your children , &c. let the impartial reader judge both , and the acknowledged scope of the place determine the matter : and as it cannot stand with the scope of the place , so neither ( as mr. sydenham hath plainly evin'd ) with the grammar of the text , nor rules of logick , by which ( according to your exposition ) the word [ children ] must be redundant and superfluous , as being neither comprehended under jews or gentiles , those that are near , or far off ; into which two classes or ranks the text distributes the whole world , but must stand out of the text , as a party by themselves ; though expresly mentioned in it , as those to whom the promise belongs . but enough of this . ( 6. ) having vindicated acts 2. 38 , 39. which confirms our fourth assertion , viz. the identity of the promise the jews were , and we are under : we proceed next to vindicate 2 col. 8. 9 , 10 , 11 , 12. whereby we prove the succession of baptism to circumcision , and vindicate it from that foreign sense you force upon it , to the great injury of the text , as well as of our infants , whom you exclude from any concernment therein . without any representation at all of the grounds on which we proceed , to prove the succession of this ordinance to that , you as rashly as confidently call it a groundless inference ; which , whether it be or no , let the impartial judge , when they shall see the grounds on which we build that assertion . ( 1. ) 't is out of controversie , that the scope of this place is to take off the colossians from circumcision , and other jewish rites and ceremonies , which the false teachers at that time earnestly endeavoured to reduce them to , as appears vers . 4. to be his plain design , and this i say , lest any man should beguile you with enticing words ; and he saith it with great concernment of mind , as appears vers . 1. ( 2. ) 't is as plain that the argument by which he establishes them in the truth of the gospel , and secures them against the danger of returning to those jewish rites , especially circumcision , is drawn from their compleatness in christ without it , vers . 9. & 10. and that whatsoever they had under circumcision , they now enjoy in as compleat and full a measure and manner , as ever abraham and his seed did . and ye are compleat in him , i. e. in christ. ( 3. ) to evince this he instanceth in the very case then under debate , viz. circumcision , vers . 11 , 12. and first distinguishing of a two-fold circumcision , one made with , and the other without hands , which he calls the circumcision of christ : he tells them , as to both of these , namely , inward circumcision of the heart , and the external sign thereof too , both are fully answered in baptism , in whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh , by the circumcision of christ , buried with him in baptism , ver . 11 , 12. that is , look as before inward circumcision of the heart was signified by outward circumcision of the flesh , as the proper , direct and appointed sign of it : so now , the same inward circumcision or regeneration of the soul , is as really and fully signif●…ed to you by the new gospel sign of it , which is baptism : and therefore you are as compleat , in respect both of outward and inward priviledges now , as ever abraham and his seed were . do but convert the proposition , and suppose the apostle's design had been to take them off from baptism , and bring them back to circumcision , and in order to it had said , in whom ye are also baptized with the baptism of christ , being circumcised with him : would not the substitution of circumcision in the place of baptism have been clear ? and why is not this as clear as that would have been ? ( 4. ) we further say , that except he had intended in these words to have placed baptism as an external ordinance , in place and stead of outward circumcision , he could never have pitch'd upon a worse instance than that of circumcision , which was so much valued by them : yea , from the very instance he brings , he had put a strong objection into their months against his assertion , vers . 10. that we are every way as compleat without it , as the jews were with it ; for then their children enjoyed an ordinance of great value , which ours are deprived of , having none under the gospel in lieu of it . hence we argue , argument . if the ordinance of baptism now be appointed to answer the same ends that circumcision did to the jews , and to make us every way as compleat in priviledges , as circumcision did them , then it comes in the place and room of it ; and our children have the same right to this , as theirs had to that . but the antecedent is plain from the scope and argument of the apostle in this text and context . ergo , so is the consequent . the sum of your answer is , ( 1. ) that circumcision in the flesh is neither express'd , nor meant here , but that of christ in his own person . ( 2. ) that if baptism had been intended to have come in the place of circumcision , then it would follow that females must be excluded from baptism . reply . your first answer is manifestly false ; for if the apostle distinguishes of a two-fold circumcision , one made with hands , the other made without hands , then 't is manifest he means circumcision in the flesh , which is now abolished , and all its ends and uses answer'd in gospel-baptism . and whereas you say , the circumcision here spoken of , is no other but the circumcision of christ in his own person ; i would gladly know how the colossians are said to be circumcised in christs personal circumcision only ? and whether the baptism here spoken of , wherewith they are said to be buried with him , be not meant of christs personal baptism too ? and consequently there is no need of the outward ordinance to pass upon them or us ; but especially 't is worth while for you to explain the reason why he calls the colossians circumcision a circumcision of christ made without hands , if he only intends christs personal circumcision ; when we all know that christs personal circumcision was a circumcision made with hands ; and could not possibly be such a circumcisiou as theirs was , consisting in the putting off of the body of the sins of the flesh , or mortification of their corruptions . christ had no sin by propagation to put off or mortifie in his own person . ( 2. ) your second answer is no less absurd , that if baptism , according to our argument , succeeds in the place of circumcision , then females must be excluded from baptism . you had as good have said , that the enlargement of the priviledg under the gospel , is no good medium to prove we are as compleat now under baptism , as they were under circumcision : cannot baptism stand in the place of circumcision , because it answers all its ends , with an advantage ? this to me is a very strange answer ; however it must stand in the place of a better , rather than baptism shall stand in place of circumcision . obj. but if baptism succeed in the room of circumcision , and there be such an analogy betwixt them as you pretend , then it will follow , that you are oblig'd to baptise your children the eighth day , as they circumcised theirs . sol. the objection is frivolous and vain ; no man that i know doubts but the lords supper succeeds in the room and place of the passover . christ was the substance of that as well as this , and that was abrogated by his institution of this , the very same night , as soon as he and his disciples had celebrated the one , the other was instituted , and immediately succeeded it ; and yet christians are not oblig'd to the same month , day , or hour for the celebration of the lords supper : the analogy is betwixt the substantial parts of both , amongst which the spiritual mystery , principal ends , and proper subjects are of principal consideration ; not the minuter circumstances of time and place . in the passover and the lords supper there is a correspondence betwixt the proper subjects of both : no uncircumcised person , or stranger to the covenant might eat of that , exod. 12. 43 , 48. no unbelieving person , uncircumcised in heart , hath a right to this , 1 cor. 11. 27 , 28. so in the other , the infants of god's covenanted people were the proper subjects of circumcision then , and so they are ( say we ) of baptism now ; for the same promise is still to believers and their children , acts 2. 38 , 39. here lies the analogy , and not in the variable circumstances of time . whereas you say , pag. 12. baptism cannot succeed circumcision , because it leaves no character or mark upon the body , as that did . this very objection of yours is borrowed in express words from socinus , that enemy of christ , in disp. de bap. pag. 113. and fully answered by maccovius , loc. com. pag. 830 , 831. object . but it will be further said , that according to our opinion there can be no analogy or correspondency betwixt the very subjects of both ordinances ; for infants at eight days old were the proper subjects of circumcision , but the subjects of baptism were adult believers , from the time of it's first institution . and so the analogy fails in the very subjects . sol. this objection is grounded upon a great mistake , 't is your opinion not ours that destroys it . for with us it lyes fairly in these three respects of it ( 1. ) we find that at the first institution of circumcision , abraham the father , at ninety years old , and all the men of his house , were first circumcised , gen. 17. 25 , 26 , 27. answerably , at the first institution of baptism , parents , masters of families , &c. being adult believers , were first baptized . ( 2. ) after the circumcision of abraham and the men of his house their infant seed were also circumcised , the promise belonging to them , as well as their parents . answerably under the gospel the whole families of believers were baptized , and the promise runs to their infants under the gospel as it did before , acts 2. 39. ( 3. ) as in the days of circumcision , if any stranger that had not been cicumcised in his infancy , should afterwards become a proselyte , and joyn himself to the lord , he was to be circumcised , of what ever age he was : so now , if any infidel shall be converted , he is to be baptized upon his personal profession of faith. and so much for the analogy . as for your correspondency of identity i cannot understand it . i meet with little more in your first part , werein i have any concernment ; only there i find four arguments in mood and figure against the innovation of symbolical rites by humane authority , into the worship of god ; which is certainly the best page in your book . and of them i have nothing to say , but that they are good ware , and i very well know the mark and number of that parcel of goods , and to whom they properly belong . but yet before i dismiss your book i think my self concern'd to vindicate one place of scripture more , viz. rom. 11. 16 , 17. which i alledg'd in the beginning , for the confirmation of our first proposition , viz. that gods covenant with abraham , gen. 17. is the same covenant for substance we gentile believers are now under . if the first fruits be holy , the lump is also holy . and if the root be holy , so are the branches ; and if some of the branches be broken off , and thou being a wild olive were'st grafted in among them , and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree : boast not against the branches , &c. this place is deservedly of great value with us , to prove that we gentile believers , with our infant seed , are invested under the gospel with the same substantial priviledges that the jews and their infants formerly enjoy'd . here without opening one term , you proceed in your wonted manner , confidently to deny the arguments of our learned divines from this place . i shall therefore open this famous text , and regularly deduce the right of gentile believers infants to baptism from it ; and here , keeping to the rules above , ( 1 ) i note that ver . 13 , 14 , 15. give us the true level and scope of the apostles argument , which is to prove the calling in again of the jews , though for the present broken off ; and on this ground to excite himself to all diligence for their conversion , and suppress all glorying and boasting in the gentile believers , as if they were more worthy than those , because they fill their rooms and places . ( 2 ) to prove the calling again of the jews he argues strongly , ver . 16. from the federal holiness derived to the branches from their root or ancestours , namely , abraham , isaac and jacob , with whom the covenant was made , gen. 17. for if the first fruit be holy , the lump is also holy . and if the root be holy , so are the branches , ( i. e. ) abraeham , isaac and jacob being in covenant with god. a federal holiness is from them derived to the branches . and this can be no other than a federal holiness , because those their ancestours were utterly uncapable to transmit any inherent holiness to them ; that being the incommunicable prerogative of god. this federal holiness lying still in the root , ( the covenant with abraham ) will recover the branches again to life , though at present many of them be broken off , as job speaks in another case , job . 14. 7 , 8 , 9. there is hope of a tree though it be cut down , that it will sprout again ; and that the tender branch thereof will not cease though the root thereof wax old in the earth , and the stock thereof dye in the ground ; yet through the scent of water it will bud , and bring forth boughs like a plant . ( 3 ) we affirm by the authority of this text , that all the jewish nation was not broken off , but only a part of it : so the 17th . ver . plainly declares ; and if some of the branches be broken off , &c. not all , but some . for many of them were converted to christ. we read of three thousand at one sermon , acts 2. and multitudes more at other times ; all these converted jews stood in the apostles time , as branches in the true olive , still enjoying all their priviledges : and that which brake off them that were broken off , was nothing else but their own unbelief , ver . 20. well then , because of unbelief they were broken off . for at the promulgation of the gospel , a new article was added to their creed ; namely , that this same jesus whom they had crucifyed , is the promised and true messiah . this some believed , and so stood by faith , still enjoying all their ancient priviledges of the covenant : others believed not , and their unbelief broke them off . ( 4. ) we find in this place two sorts of branches growing upon this root abraham ; some natural branches , namely jews by nature , embracing christ by faith ; others wild and foreign branches , viz. gentiles by nature , but ingrafted by faith , and by their ingrafture growing among the natural branches , and with them partaking of the root and fatness of the olive-tree , vers . 17. that is , the rich priviledges of the covenant , and promise to abraham , gen. 17. i will be a god to thee , and to thy seed . this is the sweet juice or fatness of the olive-tree , which both sorts of branches live upon , vers . 17. some on the external , others on the internal , some on both . ( 5. ) these naturally wild , but now engrafted branches , viz. the believing gentiles , being grafted by faith amongst the natural branches , and with them sucking the fatness of the same root and olive , that is to say , the priviledges , ordinances and franchises of the church ; we cannot but judge it to be a natural , clear and necessary consequent , that the same priviledges the natural branches once had , and the remaining branches , amongst whom the gentile believers were ingrafted , then had ; the very same the gentile believers and their children do now enjoy , by vertue of their interest in the same root ; else we cannot understand how we should be said to partake with them of the root and fatness of the olive : certainly the sap is the same , which the root sends into all the branches , whether they be natural , or ingrafted ones ; and is as plentifully communicated to the ingrafted , as to the natural branches : for the watering of this olive with the more rich and plentiful grace of the gospel , must make the olive-tree as s●…t and flourishing as e●…r it was to supply all its branches , and ●…ore than ever before . seeing then we gentiles have ( 1. ) the same grafting into the true olive . and ( 2. ) that our present grafting in , is answerable to their present casting out . and ( 3. ) that their re-ingrafting in the end of the world , shall be the same for substance that ours now is , and their own first was : for when they were first taken in , they and their children were taken in together ; when they were broken off , they and their children were broken off together ; and when they shall be taken in again , they and their children shall be taken in again . and ( 4. ) seeing all these their expected mercies are secured to them by the covenant with abraham , isaac and jacob , which will extend again to them , when their unbelief shall be taken away : methinks ( as was said before ) nothing can be clearer than this conclusion , that we gentile believers are now invested with the same priviledges they once enjoy'd , and our children have the same federal holiness , or relation to the covenant theirs had , by being grafted amongst them , and living on the same sap they did , and that by the ●…ame promise , acts 2. 39. but you will say , there 's no mention ●…ere made of the grafting in of our children with us . we reply , neither ●…s there any mention here made of the ●…reaking off of their children with them , ●…hich yet was so . nor was there need 〈◊〉 say it , seeing both their infants and ●…urs , are comprehended in the parents , as ●…wigs are comprehended in the branch , 〈◊〉 buds in the graft ; and the one be●…g holy , so is the other : and this fede●…l holiness of the children is not only ●…entioned in this chapter , vers . 16. but also in 1 cor. 7. 14. now are your chi●… dren holy . and the very same promis●… which conveigh'd the fatness of th●… olive to abraham's natural seed , man●… festly extends it self to the gentile be●… lievers seed , acts 2. 38 , 39. and 〈◊〉 men will not shut their eyes , and stud●… evasions , what can be plainer fro●… scripture in this explication and application of this place ! we have with 〈◊〉 the consent of the generality of orth●… dox expositors ; the sense it self is g●… nuine , easie , and unconstrained ; agre●… able with the letter and scope of t●… text ; whether the sense you set 〈◊〉 against it be as probable as this , 〈◊〉 come next to examine . and truly , si●… your answer is as ambiguous as a d●… phic oracle : for ( 1. ) you tell us , pag. 〈◊〉 that the ingrafting spoken of in this place , into the invisible church by election . we s●… it is into the visible church by profess●… of faith ; for we know not how to 〈◊〉 derstand any breaking off from the i●… visible church , nor falling from elec●… on : but 't is like you better consider●… the consequents of that opinion dra●… upon you by mr. sydenham in his 85●… page , and therefore nauseating th●… dregs of arminianism , you speak more orthodoxly to the point , pag. 27 , where you honestly acknowledge , that the church of the jews and gentiles , as to the true essence and inward substance of either , is one and the same ; in which respect the believing gentiles ( according to the apostles metaphor ) are here said to be grafted in amongst them , and with them to be made partakers of the root and fatness of the olive-tree ; and in reference hereunto it 's rightly added by the apostle , that the gifts and callings of god are without repentance . the inward substance of the church and covenant of grace whereon it is founded , being invariable , and which shall for ever remain immoveable , though the outward form and administration be not so . well then , from hence we have gained two things : ( 1. ) that the church of the jews and gentiles are essentially and substantially the same church . ( 2. ) that the jews were not broken off from the invisible church , or from faith and election ; for these you truly say are invariable and immoveable ; and if you had deny'd it , the apostle assures us , that the foundation of god stands sure ; and that the gifts and callings of god are without repentance . but what then was their breaking off , and the gentiles grafting in , which made this great alteration in the church ? can it be any thing else but our ingrafting into the visible church by the profession of our faith , from whence the jews were broken off from their unbelief ? for certainly from the invisible church they were not broken off , and into the invisible church multitudes of professing christians are not ingrafted . 't is evident therefore , by grafting us into the olive-tree , he means the visible church ; and by the fatness thereof , the ordinances and priviledges of that church : though we deny not but all sincere professors are members of the invisible church also , and do belong to the election of grace ; but that 's not the breaking off , or grafting in here spoken of . and now having given up mr. tombes his notion of the invisible church and election , you are again put to your shifts , and must either shuffle , and seek to hide your self in an heap of strange and unintelligible distinctions , or ( which had been much fairer ) honestly have yielded the cause ; and where-ever you met with them , i find a whole troop of distinctions rallied together , for this purpose pag. 23 , 24. this grafting in ( say you ) may be either into the visible , or invisible church ; either by faith , or profession of faith ; or by some outward ordinance . children may be either grown men or infants . the ingrafting ●…n , may be either certain , or probable . certain , either by reason of election , or their natural birth ; being children of believers . probable , as being likely ; either because frequently , or for the most part it happens so : though necessary , and so not certain ; the thing to be prov'd is , that the children of believers are in the covenant of free grace , in christ , and by vertue thereof to be baptized into the communion of the visible church . reply . words enough , and distinctions enough to reduce the text to an indivisible point . but whither doth all this tend ? i will ask you two or three plain qestions , and then make what use you please of your distinctions . ( 1. ) whether the breaking off of the jews and the ingrafting of the gentiles here spoken of , have relation to the invisible church by election , or to the visible church by profession of faith , and some outward ordinance ? ( 2. ) whethether if it were into the visible church by profession of faith , that the gentile believers were grafted in ; as doubtless it was ( and by relinquishing the former sense you here seem to yield it , saying this ingrafture may be certain upon the account of natural birth , being children of believers ; ) then i would fain know why you so state the question , as to make the certainty of believers childrens interest in christ , to be the only ground of their admission into the communion of the visible church ? this ( say you ) must be prov'd , or no baptism for them . alas poor infants , to what hard terms are they here tyed up ! very much harder than the terms any of your one society are tyed to ; and if baptism must be suspended till this point can be clear'd , that the person to be baptized be first in christ , and in the covenant of free grace , as to the saving benefits thereof ; then farewel to all baptism both of infants , and adult prof●…ssours too . for how can you prove that the persons you baptiz●… are all or any of them really in christ ? may they not deceive you as simon magus did peter ? i did not think you had proceeded in this matter upon a certainty , but a probability ; and if you proceed with yours upon the grounds of probability , how come you to tie up the children of believers to a certainty of their interest in christ , as the antecedent suspending condition of their baptism ? we need dispute no more about the proper subjects of baptism , for by this account we have lost the ordinance of baptism it self . we thought , sir , that our childrens title to baptism was derived to them from their believing parents , as the children of the jews was to circumcision , from their circumcised and professing parents ; and that the same promise which conveigh'd their childrens priviledge to them , gen. 17. had conveig'd the right of believers children to baptism unto them also , acts 2. 38 , 39. and that the root being holy , the branches are holy also , that is , federally holy , rom. 11. 16. but to this you make such an answer as astonishes me to read , pag. 26. where allowing abraham to be the root , you say , the holiness here spoken of , is first in respect of gods election ; holiness personal , and inherent in god's intention , ephes. 1. 4. he hath chosen us in him , that we should be holy . ( 2. ) 't is also holiness derivative , but not from any ancestors , but from abraham only ; and that not as a natural , but a spiritual father , wherein he is a lively image or figure of christ ; and is derived from the covenant of grace , which passed in his name to him and his seed . and lastly , it shall be inherent , being actually communicated by the spirit of god , when they shall be actually call'd . reply . here we see into what brakes and pits men run themselves , when they depart from the plain and safe path in explications of scripture . here is such a tripartite distinction of holiness , as i never met with before . ( 1. ) here is personal holiness inherent in gods intention . by this you must either mean sanctification decreed for them , and to be bestowed on them at the time of their calling ; and then it is coincident with the third member of your distinction : or else you mean , that it is holiness inherent in the intention of god , as an accident in its subject ; and then the simplicity of gods nature resists your incongruous notion . but it would be a less crime , to confound the first with the last member of your vain and self-created distinction , than to speak things so repugnant to the simple and uncompounded nature of god. or if your meaning be , that this holiness is in god by way of intention , but in them by way of inhesion ; that will not deliver you out of your confusion neither , but run you into greater ; for then you confound the immanent with the transient acts of god , and make the same thing , at the same time , to be purely in intention , and in execution ; or to be only in gods purpose to bestow hereafter , and yet at present inherent in the persons he intends it for ; so that i must leave your strange notion of personal holiness inherent in gods intention , to be clear'd by a more metaphysical head than mine ; or else to stand among other rare and unintelligible notions , to be admired and applauded by the ignorant reader . but then , when we come to the second member of your distinction , i am as much at a loss to find your sense as before : for there you tell us , the holiness here spoken of is a derivative holiness also , and that from abraham only , and from him not as a natural , but a spiritual father , resembling christ herein . reply . this word derivative is an equivocal word , and may signifie either inherent personal holiness , or federal holiness , for both of them are derived . if you say the former , it looks too black and horrid for me to believe you mean it , though you should say you mean it ; for then you make abraham not only the figure and image of christ ( as you speak ) but christ himself , by attributing to abraham christs incommunicable property and prerogative . then abraham may say to all his children , as christ doth , john 15. 4 , 5. i am the vine , ye are the branches , &c. i am he that sanctifies you : but if you mean the last , ( as necessarily you must , if you mean any thing that hath orthodox sense in it ) then this derivative holiness you speak of is not personal holiness , or internal sanctification , but federal holiness , derived from covenanted ancestors or parents to their children ; and therein you come over to us , and to the true sense of the text. but why must this be squeezed from you with so much difficulty ? and why did you hide this federal holiness under an equivocal term , lest you should seem to yield the controversie with a word ? this is not fair . object . if you say we are too hasty , and triumph before the victory ; for though you do yield it to be a federal holiness , yet it is such as can be derived from no other father or progenitor but abraham only . sol. yes , sir , i hope you will allow isaac and jacob at least to be the root and first fruit as well as abraham , seeing the covenant was joyntly and expresly made with them all three ; and thereby they became the root and first fruit of that holy nation : and if that people be called the seed of abraham , they are also called the seed of jacob ; and if fatherhood he ascribed to abraham , it is ascribed to jacob too , isa. 58. 14. and if abraham be first named in the covenant , so is jacob , see levit. 26. 42. but if you allow these three patriarchs , belike that 's all you will allow ; for you seem to say that no federal holiness can be derived from any other progenitors . good sir , whatever your own private opinion be in this matter , allow us to believe otherwise , as long as those scriptures , 1 cor. 7. 14. and acts 2. 39. stand in our bibles ; for we cannot think but the federal holiness of children results from the immediate parents faith or covenant interest , as well as from the remoter progenitors ; else we cannot understand how the corinthians children should be holy , or how the promise should belong to the children of them that are afar off , viz. the gentiles , who could derive no such thing to their children by a lineal descent from abraham , but only as they became ingrafted branches by faith ; and so suck the fatness of the olive to themselves , and to their buds , or childrn , as the natural branches did . i desire you to consider also how this covenant passed , as you say it did , to abraham and his seed in christs name , if it be the same with adam's covenant ? did that pass to adam in christs name too ? i have now dispatched what i at first promised and intended , viz. the confutation of my friends mistakes about the covenants , and the vindication of those scriptures , by which our arguments deduced from one of them , are confirmed . and now i have no further concernment with mr. cary's solemn call , save only to note his high confidence , rash and most unchristian censures of all his differing friends and brethren with which he concludes his discourse , wherein he calls infants baptism , ( 1. ) a great abuse in the divine worship . pag. 242 , 243. and yet he that so calls it , never looked half way into the controversie , nor is able without manifest shuffling , and contradiction both to the words of god , and his own words , to answer our arguments ; as is here made too evident . ( 2. ) that it is no other , than a change of a divine institution , and making void the commandment of christ , the horrid sin charged by christ upon those hypocrites , the scribes and pharisees , math. 15. 6. with no better than these doth he rank and assiociate the many thousands of gods choice and dear people , who differ in this circumstantial point from him . ( 3. ) he compares it with the sin of nadab and abihu . and with that of israel , with respect to the ark , 1 chron. 15. 13. a sin which provoked the lord to execute judgment by an immediate stroke in fire from heaven upon them . thus mr. cary is ready to call for fire from heaven upon his brethren , alas ! poor man , he knows not what spirit he is of , as christ told the disciples in a like case . 't is well we are not in his hands to execute the wrath , as well as charge the guilt upon us . but i hope all this is but rashness in him . ( 4. ) he affirms it to be no less than a transgressing of the law , a changing of the ordinances ; and a breaking of the everlasting covenant . if it be a transgressing of the law , he should have shewn us in what scripture that law that forbids it is , or where god hath repealed his former grant to the children of his covenant people : and for the changing of the ordinances , i am of opinion 't is he that is guilty of that sin and not we ; for we have proved god setled this priviledge upon the infant seed of his people , that the promise under the gospel continues still to them , and if he exclude them from baptism , he changes the ordinance of god. and for breaking the everlasting covenant , for which he cites isa. 24. 5 , 6. the lord make him sensible of the danger he hath put himself under from that very text he produces against us ; for it 's manifest that the covenant there spoken of , is gods covenant with abraham , renewed with the israelites at sinai , which in that text is truly called an everlasting covenant ; when mean time mr. cary hath pronounced it to be an adam's covenant , and now utterly abolished . who is it sir , that fights against and changes this everlasting covenant , you or we that are for its continuance to us and our children ? ( 5. ) he affirms these things to be of highest concernment to us . if so , then sure it must follow , that repentance from dead works , and faith towards our lord jesus christ , must be inferior things to them ; for nothing can be higher than the highest , or equal with it . and then by making them the chief fundamentals in religion , as that expression doth , ( if it be not a vain and sinful hyperbole ) the salvation or damnation of men depends upon compliance , or non-compliance with them . and then whither must you send all gods people in the world that differ from you ? sir , i find your brethren in the appendix to their confession of faith , pag. 110 , placing one of these which you make of highest concernment , among the other circumstances of religion : and doubtless that is it's proper place . nor do i see how they can free themselves from participation in your sin , 'till they have admonished you for it , and caused you to expunge it out of your book . ( 6. ) that it is a setling of our thresholds by gods threshold . the words you recite from ezek. 43. 8. which speaks of the idolatrous kings of judah and israel , building temples and altars for their idols , in , or near the courts of the temple of god : as the english annotations on the text will inform you , an abomination that defiled gods holy name , a wickedness not to be named , and for which the lord consumed them ; and calls it whoredome in the next words . here sir , you have exceeded all the bounds of society and christian charity ; and made this circumstantial difference about the proper subject of baptism , the grossest heathenish idolatry in the world : and consequently dissolved the bond of christian charity , and broken off all communion with us ; for with such idolaters you ought not to have any communion . your more wise and moderate brethren in the place above cited , tell us , they are loath hereby to alienate their affections or conversations from any that fear the lord , and are willing to participate of the labours of those whom god hath endued with abilities above themselves ; qualified and called to the ministry of the word ; desirous of peace and not of renewed contests hereabout . this is a language of another air. and if they be ( as i dare not suspect but they are ) sincere in that profession , they dare not comprobate such a desperate and unchristian censure as yours is : if they do , then we may easily guess what our lot and treatment shall be whenever anabaptism get the ascendent in england . we may expect as civil usage as is due to gross idolaters , and no better . but i hope better things . ( 7. ) you say , that as these things are of highest concerment , so they ought to be our most serious practice and endeavour , pag. 243. l. ult . good lord , whither hath zeal for an opinion transported you ! our most serious practice and endeavour , sir ! i thought the most serious practice of a minister had been to preach christ , and salvation to the souls of men ; and not to baptize . i am sure st. paul reckned so , christ sent me not to baptize , but to preach . that is , baptism is not my principal work , or main business . and ver . 14th . he thanks god he had baptized none of them , but crispus and gaius . i believe he never utter'd such an expression about his other work of preaching christ. and for all christians , i thought , the secureing of their interest in christ , living in the duties of communion with him , watching their hearts , and mortifying their corruptions , had been the object matter of their most serious practice , and faithful endeavour ; and not the litigations about baptism . but i hope these were only inconsiderate expressions , falling from your pen whil'st you were in a paroxism of zeal , or a transport in the height of a conceited triumph . but whatever was the cause , i am sure you ought to revoke and repent such words . ( 8. ) you wish your testimony rise not up at last as a witness against us . sir , we do not apprehend any cause we have to fear your testimony against us , or severest censures of us , whilst we are satisfy'd , that as you neither have a faculty or commission to be our judge , so neither is there any convincing evidence in your reply to our arguments . but i think you have much more cause to fear , lest those arguments should come in at last as a witness against you , who deny and contemn them ; when mean time you are put to most lamentable shifts , even contradictions , and somewhat worse , to escape the point and edge of them . ( 9. ) to conclude , you tells us we must not expect the special presence of christ to be afforded to us , without our compliance in these points with you . sir , we never yet deserted the judgment or practice of infants baptism , and yet have had ( blessed be jesus christ for it ) great and manifold , sweet and signal proofs and evidences of his presence with us : he hath owned and blessed our ministry to the conversion of many ; and there are some , and those not mean or few , of our spiritual children , now in your societies in england , who have acknowledged us to be the instruments of their conversion : the lord lay it not to their charge , who now desert that ministry in which they first received christ. but as for the departure of his presence , i assure you , friend , i am more afraid of the rents and divisions you now renew so unseasonably among the churches of christ , than of any one thing amongst us beside it . it grieved my soul to see you quiet a movere , awake a sleeping controversie , especially in such a season , when we are little more than half delivered from our enemies and dangers ; you take us by the heel , as jacob did his brother , whilst but yet in the birth . sir , except you return to a more quiet and christian temper than you seem here to be in , i am out of hope that ever you and i shall see those blessed days we have so often with pleasure comforted our selves with the hopes of . ●…wever extend your charity ( if you have any left ) so far , as to believe that i am one notwithstanding all this ) that am studious of the churches peace , and ●…quisitive into the rules of duty , not daring to hold any truth of god in unrighteness ; and yet well satisfy'd i am in the path of my duty , wherein , though we cannot walk together , yet i hope to meet you at the end of our way in our fathers house , where perfect light and peace dwells . and here i had put an end to this debate , had i not received your return to some of these sheets , whilst the last of them was under my hand ; wherein i only find four things in which i am concerned . in general , you tell me , you are not convinced of any error , by what i have said . i am sorry to hear it : but considering the nature of error on one side , and the difficulty of self-denial on the other , you have not much deceiv'd my expectation . more particularly , ( 1. ) you say , as to your hooking the sinai covenant into this controversie , i gave you the first occasion of it ; for when you shew'd me your papers about god's covenant with abraham , i told you that you were best first to try if you could prove the covenant at sinai to be a covenant of works ; forasmuch as our divines are so far from conceiting the covenant with abraham to be a covenant of works , that they will not allow the sinai law it self to be so ; and to convince you of it , i lent you mr. roberts and mr. sedgewick on the covenant , to enlighten and satisfie you about it : but little did i think you had had confidence enough to enter the lists with two such learned and eminent divines , and make them to follow your triumphant chariot , shackled with the incomparable baxter and allen , sydenham and burthogg , like three pair of noble prisoners of war. but whatever was the occasion , ( setting aside your sin ) i am not sorry you have given a fit opportunity to enlighten the world in that point also . ( 2. ) you seem to fancy in your letter , that i was once of your opinion about the moral law , because you find these passages in a sermon of mine upon john 8. 36. if the son therefore shall make you free , then are you free indeed , viz. that the law required perfect working , under pain of the curse ; accepted no short endeavours , admitted no repentance , and gave no strength . but finding me here pleading for the law , you think you find me in a contradiction to that doctrine . the words i own , the contradiction i positively deny ; for i speak not there and here ad idem : for in that sermon , and in those very words you cite , i speak against the law , not as god intended it , when he added it to the promise , but as the ignorance and infidelity of unregenerate men make it to themselves a covenant of works , by looking upon it as the very rule and reason of their justification before god. this was the stumbling stone at which all legal justiciaries then did , and still do stumble , rom. 9. 31 , 32 , 33. in this sense the apostle in his epistles to the romans and galatians argues against the law , and so do i in the words you cite ; but vindicate the law in the very same sermon you mention , as consistent with , and subservient to christ , in the former sense ; and there tell you , the law sends us to christ to be justified , and christ sends us back to the law to be regulated . the very same double sense of the law you will find in this discourse , and from the mistaken end and abuse of the law , which the apostle so vehemently opposeth , i here prove against you , that the law in this sense cannot consist with , or be added to the promise , and therefore make it my medium to prove against you , that the true nature and denomination of the sinai law can never be found in this sense of it , but it must be estimated and denominated from the purpose and intention of god , which i have proved to be evangelical . try your skill to fasten a contradiction betwixt my words in that sermon and this discourse . i know you would be glad to find the shadow of one , to make some small excuse or attonement for the many faults of that nature you have here committed . ( 3. ) your letter also informs me , that you hear you are answered by one hand already , and for ought you know many more may be employed against you , and i for one ; and so we shall compass you about like bees . reply . i have only seen mr. whiston's little book against your brother grantham , wherein he hath baffled two of your principal arguments ; but you only come in collaterally there , and must not look upon it as a full answer to your book , but only as a lash for your folly en passant . and for our compassing you about like bees , methinks you seem to be greatned in your own fancy by the supposition or expectation of a multitude of opponents . you know as well as i , who it is that glories in this motto , unus contra omnes . sir , i think your mind may be much at rest in that matter . of all the six famous adversaries mentioned in your title page , there are but two living ; and you know mortui non mordent ; and of the remaining two , one of them , viz. mr. baxter is almost in heaven , living in the daily views and chearful expectations of the saints everlasting rest with god ; and is left for a little while among us , as a great example of the life of faith : and it is questionable with me , whether such a great and heavenly soul can find any leisure or disposition to attend such a weak and trivial discourse as this . and as for my self , you need not much fear me ; i have not , neither do i intend to vibrate my sting against you , unless i find you infecting or disturbing that hive to which i belong , and to which i am daily gathering and carrying honey ; and then who but a drone would not sting ? ( 4. ) to conclude , in the close of your letter you fall into the former strain of love , assuring me , that the ancient friendship of so many years shall still continue on your part . reply . all that i shall return to this , is only to relate a short story out of plutarch , in the life of alexander ; where he tells us , that whilst he was warring in the indies , one taxiles an indian king came with his company to meet him , and saluting alexander , said , what need you and i to fight and war one upon another ? if thou comest not to take away our water , and the necessaries of life from us , for which we must needs fight : as for other goods , if i am richer than thee , i am ready to give thee of mine ; and if i have less , i will not think scorn to thank thee for thine . alexander highly pleased with his words , made him this reply , thinkest thou that this meeting of ours can be without fighting ? no , no ; thou hast won nothing by all thy fair words ; for i will fight and contend with thee in honesty and courtesie , and thou shalt not exceed me in bounty and liberality . i say with taxiles , i had never armed against you , had you not come to take away our water , and the necessaries of life , i mean , the covenant of god with abraham , which contains the rich charter of the gentile believers children , and make it an abolished adam's covenant , and told us , that we must come up to the primitive purity in these things , that is , in renouncing it as a covenant of grace , and relinquishing infants baptism , as grounded thereon . sir , were my one father alive , i must and would oppose him , should he attempt what here you do . infant baptism with you is not ; singing of psalms , that plain and heavenly gospel-ordinance , with you is not , and will you take away our benjamin also ? what! the covenant of god with abraham and his children in their generations ? all these things are against us . no , sir , we cannot part with that covenant as an abolish'd adam's covenant ; nor will i give it up for all the friendship in the world. and yet i will say with alexander , i will contend with you in friendship and courtesie , even whilst i earnestly contend against you for the truths of god , which you have here opposed , and i have endeavoured to vindicate . one word more before i part with you , i do assure you , and the whole world , that in this controversie with you , i have not knowingly or advisedly misrepresented your sense : if you shall say i did so in my second argument from the words p. 179. i assure you , both my self and others could understand you no otherwise than i did in the papers i sent you ; and when you told me , you meant there was no pardon in either of those covenants , but that it plainly directed to abraham's covenant , you will find i have given you as fair a choice as you can desire , either to stand to your words in the first sense wherin i understood them , ( or which will be the same to me ) to your own sense in which you afterwards explained it to me . and whereas i blame you over and over in my epistle and conclusion , for putting the proper subject of baptism among the highest things in religion : let the reader view your conclusion , and see whether you do or not : if you say you speak of the covenant there as well as of baptism : i allow that you do so ; yet i hope 't is equally as bad , nay indeed and truth , a great aggravation of your fault , to make this article , viz. gods covenant with abraham , gen. 17 , is an abolished adam 's covenant , one of the highest concernments of a christian ; the baptism only of adult believers another . my consequences from your words are just and regular , how startling soever they seem to you . if you think fit to rejoyn to this my answer , i desire you will avoid as much as you can a tedious harangue of words , and speak strictly and regularly to my arguments , by limiting , distinguishing , or denying , as a disputant ought to do : if so , i promise you a reply ; but if i find no such thing , it shall pass with me but for waste paper ; nor will i wast time about it . the lord give us unity in things necessary , liberty in things indifferent , and charity in all things . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a39697-e2970 gal. 3. 18. rom. 10. 3. rom. 2. 17. * conditio est suspensio alicujus dispositionis , tantisper dum aliquid futurum fiat . navarr . enchirid. 482. † est verborum adjectio in futurum suspendentium , secundum quam disponens vult dispositum regulari . dr. crispe 2d vol. of christ exalted . serm. 14. infant-baptism , pag. 45 , 45. a true narrative of the portsmouth disputation, between some ministers of the presbyterian, and others of the baptist, persuasion, concerning the subjects and manner of baptism held in mr. williams's meeting-place there on wednesday, feb. 22. 1698/9. the managers for the presbyterians were, mr. samuel chandler of fareham. mr. leigh of newport in the isle of wight. mr. robinson of hungerford in berks, moderator. for the baptists were, dr. william russel of london. mr. john williams of east knoyle in wiltshire. mr. john sharp of froome in somersetshire, moderator. transcribed from two copies taken at the dispute; the one by mr. bissel town-clerk of portsmouth, and the other by mr. samuel ring. revis'd and publish'd by dr. william russel. 1699 approx. 224 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 45 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2008-09 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a63577 wing t2806a estc r215290 99827205 99827205 31621 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a63577) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 31621) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 2158:19) a true narrative of the portsmouth disputation, between some ministers of the presbyterian, and others of the baptist, persuasion, concerning the subjects and manner of baptism held in mr. williams's meeting-place there on wednesday, feb. 22. 1698/9. the managers for the presbyterians were, mr. samuel chandler of fareham. mr. leigh of newport in the isle of wight. mr. robinson of hungerford in berks, moderator. for the baptists were, dr. william russel of london. mr. john williams of east knoyle in wiltshire. mr. john sharp of froome in somersetshire, moderator. transcribed from two copies taken at the dispute; the one by mr. bissel town-clerk of portsmouth, and the other by mr. samuel ring. revis'd and publish'd by dr. william russel. bissel, mr. ring, samuel. russel, william, d. 1702. [16], 40, 33-60 p. printed for john sprint, at the bell in little-britain, london : 1699. text and register are continuous despite pagination. reproduction of the original in the lambeth palace library, london. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng baptism -early works to 1800. infant baptism -early works to 1800. theology, doctrinal -early works to 1800. 2006-04 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2006-05 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2007-05 ali jakobson sampled and proofread 2007-05 ali jakobson text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a true narrative of the portsmouth disputation , between some ministers of the presbyterian , and others of the baptist , persuasion , concerning the subjects and manner of baptism : held in mr. williams's meeting-place there on wednesday , feb. 22. 1698 / 9. the managers for the presbyterians were , m. samuel chandler of fareham . mr. leigh of newport in the isle of wight . mr. robinson of hungerford in berks , moderator . for the baptists were , dr. william russel of london . mr. john williams of east knoyle in wiltshire . mr. john sharp of froome in somersetshire , moderator . transcribed from two copies taken at the dispute ; the one by mr. bissel town-clerk of portsmouth , and the other by mr. samuel ring . revis'd and publish'd by dr. william russel . london , printed for john sprint , at the bell in little-britain . 1699. to the most honourable governour , major-general erle ; and the honourable colonel gibson , deputy — governour of his majesty's garrison of portsmouth ; this narrative is humbly dedicated , as a grateful acknowledgment of that favour you did us , in your application to his august majesty , to know his pleasure whether you might admit of a disputation betwixt the ministers of the presbyterian and those of the baptist's perswasion , ( of which this is the best account the publisher could obtain ; ) whereupon his majesty , out of his wonted clemency , as an effect of that innate goodness which he hath always manifested towards his dissenting protestant subjects , was graciously pleased to let us have his royal per●●i●●ion , in answer to your request . for which favour , together with the liberty ; we enjoy in the free exercise of our religion , we desire to lay hold on this occasion , to express our thankfulness to god and the king ; praying for his majesty's health and prosperity in this world , and that god would vouchsafe to enrich him with a crown of glory in the world to come . your honours , to my power , william russel . to my much esteemed and beloved brethren in the lord , mr. thomas bowes , messenger and pastor of the congregation of baptized believers at portsmouth ; and mr. john webber , pastor of the church of christ at gosport under the same profession of believers baptism in water . together with the congregations to whom they belong : wishing your increase in grace , and in the knowledge of our lord jesus christ ; and that god would add to your number daily such as shall be saved . honoured and beloved brethren , i have thought meet to make this dedication also to you , because ye were not only eye and ear witnesses of what past in the disputation ; but were privy to all the circumstances with which it was attended , and were the sole cause of my being engaged in it . how it was managed you best know , and therefore are proper judges of the matters of fact related in this narrative . for my own part , i have took much pains , and used great care and consideration in the review of those papers you sent me from those that wrote down the dispute , that i might do no wrong to either party . and herein i have had all the helps i could obtain both from our brother williams , who was engaged with me in the disputation ; from whom i received ( by the hands of mr. sharp , our moderator ) an account of those arguments he offered , and what else he could remember , taken from his own mouth : besides the account i have had by letters from divers other persons that were present . all which i have diligently compared , and have also endeavoured ( so far as those accounts and my own memory would furnish me therewith ) not only to give a true narrative of what was spoken , but also to give our antagonists words their due weight as well as our own . and if there be any thing omitted therein , they must blame themselves , or their own scribe , and not us . for mr. william leddell went to mr. smith their writer , and carried our copy with him , and desired him to compare it with his : he answered , that his was very imperfect , it being the first time he was in a dispute , and he could not take it , but some things were left out ; and said , that it was not as yet wholly written over . mr. leddell waited upon him a second time , but could not obtain a sight of it to compare them together , although he was satisfied it was then finished . now whether he did this of himself , or by advice from them , is best known to himself . however , it leaves us without blame . i know it is not proper for me ( who was principally concerned in it ) to say much concerning the dispute it self : for being made publick , it 's left to every one that reads it to judge for himself . nevertheless , it may not be amiss to make some few remarks upon it ; because it may fall into some hands who may not well understand the grounds of the controversie . 1. it is agreed on both sides , that mr. chandler's sermons were the occasion of that offence taken by you , and of the dispute it self ; as appears by the preliminaries signed by mr. thomas bowes and mr. william leddell on our part , and also by mr. chandler and mr. williams on the part of the presbyterians : as you may see in p. 3 , 4. 2. the objections being made against what mr. chandler preach'd , it had been his proper work to have vindicated the truth of his doctrine against those objections , by the authority of holy scripture . but instead thereof , he puts us upon it to prove the contrary . but as the learned dr. smith did well observe , he that asserts must prove . and their own moderator did declare , that mr. chandler had in his preaching asserted , that infants are the subjects of baptism , but told us we were not to call on him for that then . 3. i would make this farther remark upon it , that the reason why he took this method was , because he was unable to prove what he had asserted : for in one of his sermons he thus speaks ; but that i may proceed with the greater clearness , i shall do these things ; first , prove from scripture the warrantableness of infant-baptism , &c. and to make his assertion good , he cites the commission , matth. 28. 19. for the baptizing the infants of believing parents . and argues upon it , that disciples were to be baptized ; and ( saith he ) we have a plain text that such infants are disciples , see acts 15. 10. and when our saviour saith , go make disciples , baptizing them , it must be understood of such infants . now as to his pretence from acts 15. 10. we did sufficiently enervate that . and as for the commission , mr. leigh doth confess ( as well as mr. chandler ) that it is a command , and that the command is express'd , pag. 27. and farther saith , in pag. 28. we must all confess that jesus christ gave commission to baptize believers when at the age of maturity ; but afterwards the children of those believers . yet when mr. chandler begins to answer my first argument , he affirms , that christ hath no where expresly commanded infants to be baptized . see p. 6. and if so , then infants cannot be intended , either in that commission , or any other place where there is a command in holy scripture for baptism . so that he needs no other confutation than his own confession , in the presence , as is supposed , of about 2000 witnesses . 4. as for their consequences which they were so desirous to have a grant from me that i would allow them to make use of ; it 's very observable , that if they can do any thing that way , it 's yet to be done ; for they did not offer them to us in the disputation , but have reserved them in their own breasts , as the pope doth his unwritten traditions . and how they should think the people should be convinced of the truth of their practice , when they tell them there is no express command in scripture for it , and pretend only they have some consequences to prove it by , and yet refuse to tell what these consequences are , it is beyond my imagination . i can assure them , those that can take up a satisfaction in such empty pretences , are sufficiently prepared to be priest-ridden , with a witness . 5. when they should have proved ( if they had known how ) that infants are capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men , according to christ's commission ; they tell us ( instead thereof ) that children are accounted so when they first enter the school , and call a school-master for their voucher . when the very naming of it confutes themselves , because they are so far from being made scholars by teaching , that they know not one letter of the book , by their own confession . 6. i cannot but observe how strenuously they opposed themselves against our way of baptizing by dipping ; and rejected the authority of their own authors , and divers of the greatest protestant writers since the reformation , who have asserted our practice therein to be agreeable to the etymology of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and the practice of john the baptist , christ and his apostles ; and yet themselves can ( when it is to serve a turn ) practise it the same way , by plunging the person over head and ears in water . an instance whereof , as i received it ( well attested ) from several hands ( and the persons own confession ) take as followeth . to back that instance of mr. williams's about the virgin mary and our saviour in answer to mr. leigh's demand , namely , to give him an instance of one person that was born of a believer , and was baptized when he came to grown years , see pag. 34 , 35. we can give you an account of one whose parent was a believer when he was born , and baptized when adult , by mr. earl the presbyterian minister at gosport , by dipping , being about 40 years of age. and this was done by the advice of several of their ministers , particularly mr. chandler and mr. williams . his name is joseph fox ; he is a near neighbour of ours . and they did it either by the commission , or , without regard to it , i know not which ; that they best know . and by another hand i have this account . we have also thought fit to acquaint you with the person , and his name , who was baptized by the presbyterians at gosport ; which is as followeth : it was mr. joseph fox , living in gosport ; who being ( by our brother duke ) desired to answer him one thing , which was , whether , when he was baptized by mr. earl , it was done by dipping the whole body under water ? and he said , it was ; and that in the presence of four presbyterian minister● thi● was acknowledged by him to our brother duke on the 〈…〉 of 〈…〉 16●6-9 . and we do desire you ( if you think 〈…〉 in some part of the dispute , that the world may 〈◊〉 acquainted with that proceeding of theirs . now by this action of theirs , if they believe it to be according to the commission , then they justify our practice ; if they do it for any by-end , without believing it to be according to god's word , then ( as mr. calvin saith ) the whole action is but a sport. now , that mr. chandler can have no other thoughts of it , doth evidently appear from his own words : for in his sermon preachd at portsmouth nov. 10. 1698. he saith , it is not likely that that god that will have mercy and not sacrifice , would institute an ordinance so prejudicial to the bodies of men : and that it 's very unlikely that dipping , which whenever it is mentioned , is used as a token of god's vengeance , should in this sacrament be used as a token of his mercy . where you read of dipping , you find it mentioned in a way of wrath and vengeance . thus the old world was dip'd and drowned for their sins : god's vengeance followed them , and they sunk as lead in the mighty waters . thus the egyptians were dip'd and drowned in the red sea. thus the lord jesus christ shall come down from heaven , to render vengeance on his adversaries ; cloathed with garments dip'd in blood , rev. 19. 13. [ here mr. chandler hath rendred that word dip'd to inveigh and ridicule our practice of dipping , although he could object against it when i gave it for an instance . ] but he goes on , saying , you find still dipping represents in scripture god's vengeance and displeasure . and so i say it is very unlikely , that what was always used as a token of his displeasure , should in the new testament be used as a token of mercy . so that it is not necessary that dipping be used in baptism . to which i give this for answer . 1. if it be so as he saith , then it was altogether unnecessary that mr. erle ( by his consent ) should dip mr. fox's whole body under the water . 2. that it was not done in mercy to him , thus to baptize him ; but in vengeance , and as a token of god's displeasure . 3. that the baptism practised by john the dipper , and that of christ and his apostles , was not an ordinance instituted of god in a way of mercy , but appointed for the people in a way of wrath and vengeance : for i have given him a cloud of witnesses , that they did administer it by dipping the whole body under the water . 4. by this he doth condemn and ridicule all those learned protestants i have mentioned ; with many others that might be named . and the divines of the church of england ( as well as we ) who appoint dipping as the best way of baptizing ( and sprinkling only in case of weakness ) and was used by them formerly as their frequent practice ; and is asserted by some of their greatest divines , to be the old and best way of baptizing : and is to this day the constant practice of the greek church . i am also well assured from some other hands , that , upon the 25th of febr. last , a few days after the dispute , mr. leigh said in the presence of divers persons , that to satisfy a scrupulous conscience he would administer baptism by dipping . whereupon mr. williams askt him if he would do it to answer a scrupulous conscience without god's word ? and he answered no. and i have reason to conclude that mr. leigh may believe that dipping is the right way of baptizing , whatever he might say in the time of the dispute ; because he did say to divers persons , that if it had been in a private conference , where there had been but a few persons of a side , he should have made several concessions , which he was not willing to make in so great an assembly . and therefore i will not charge those extravagant expressions of mr. chandler's upon him ; i. e. that dipping was always used as a token of displeasure . and surely mr. chandler had mightily forgot himself when he said so : for naaman the syrian was commanded to dip himself , not in a way of vengeance and wrath , but in a way of mercy : and he found it to be so ; for he was perfectly cured of his leprosie thereby . i would advise mr. chandler to read over rom. 2. 1 , 2 , 3. and consider how sharply the apostle reproves such that condemn others , and yet do the same things themselves ; and saith , thou art inexcusable , o man , whosoever thou art , that judgest ; for wherein thou judgest another , thou condemnest thy self ; for thou that judgest , doest the same things . how can he , or any of them , condemn our practice , when themselves can do it to satisfie a scrupulous conscience , or , &c. and especially mr. leigh , who confesses it to be according to the word of god ? and mr. erle hath done it by their consent . i shall now give you an account from another hand written from gosport , in which ( after he hath signified his respects to me , &c. ) he thus saith ; although they look on your arguments to be of little weight , yet we think them to be of too great weight for them to answer with all their cunning. i hope those that were unprejudic'd will receive some light , though they endeavoured ( as much as in them lay ) to darken counsel with their mutinous carriage . but truth will be truth still in spight of all its opposites ; and will shine , though they would cloud it . this was written after that vain boasting advertisement of the presbyterians in the post-man , which was very pleasing to their party at london , and made so great a noise all over the nation , as if they had gotten some great victory ; although in truth it was nothing so : as will evidently appear by this narrative . but my friend proceeds , saying , i hope this account i have herewith sent you , will come safe to your hands ; wherein you may see some of their curiosity , whereby they say they have confounded your sophistry . four things i observed in their proceedings , which ( to me ) condemned their cause . i. the want of so much as one bare instance in scripture to confirm their practice of infant baptism . ii. when they required an instance of a believers child baptized when adult ; and promised when produced they would give us the cause : which instance was given , and yet they persisted in it as before . iii. their appealing to the people to give their assent that they were satisfied with mr leighs argument from matth. 19. 4. of such is the kingdom of heaven , by holding up their hands : and it was observed there were but few that did hold up their hands in comparison of so great a multitude ; supposed by some not to be one in fifty , and by others , a much fewer number : so that they were far from having the opinion of the people on their side by way of approbation , whatever they may say of themselves ; which was not a little mortification to them . iv. when they could not obtain it by right , they would have it be theirs by might . and this was evidenced by their repeated clamours ; which was not ( when duly considered ) to their honour . besides , there have been two concessions made since the dispute by themselves , which were these : 1. that there was credit gained to our cause by this dispute . 2. that there was truth and christianity in it . for my part , i am satisfied in what was said , and so are our friends , &c. sir , this is but some ; and considering the procedure was so clamorons , it may be said to be some of the spoils won in battel , where innocence and rancour encountred . i should be glad to hear of your welfare , and desire an interest in your prayers as oft as you go to the throne of grace . yours , &c. gosport , march 11. 1698-9 . i will give you an abstract of another letter , from a worthy person in those parts , directed to me , who was an eye and ear witness of what past . in which ( after christian salutations ) he saith , i hope these lines will find you in health , after your tedious and uncomfortable journey , which i hope may bring some glory to god , notwithstanding the great rage that the , &c. was in . indeed they had no other shift to save their reputation , but by casting out a flood , acting the part of the serpents hiss amongst the worst . i do understand , several were convinced by their rudeness ; and they are since baptized . i think it may be convenient to take away the cloud from the common people by exposing what was delivered in the dispute ( to publick view ) and by adding that which they would not then hear ; i mean that which relates to the manner of administration . you may consider of it . 't is pity they should glory in their shame , deceiving the world. dear friend , i thank you for all your labour of love. your preaching and behaviour was to me very acceptable , and to all our friends , &c. gosport , march 6. 1698-9 . by these testimonies you may see , that the presbyterians had no cause to publish what they did to the world , except it were to keep up their declining reputation . after the dispute was ended , and i was returned to my lodging , mr. williams told me he would go to his namesake's house to talk with the presbyterian ministers that were there . i desired him to remember my love to them , and let them know , that i could dispute with men and yet love them notwithstanding : but desired him to tell mr. robinson , their moderator , that i took it very unkindly at his hands , that he should transgress so much as he had done against the rules of dispute , and be so abusive as he was , so as to give the lye ( for he said in the midst of the dispute , with a loud voice , that is a lye , and yet could not make any thing out about it ; ) and for his misrepresentation of what i had said , particularly upon that argument about the beasts of the field not being capable , &c. and when mr. williams came to see me before i left portsmouth , he told me that he had delivered my message to them : and that mr. williams the presbyterian minister did acknowledge that mr. robinson had exceeded his bounds : and that he did abuse me in his misrepresenting of me to the people upon that argument . i answer'd , it was well he had acknowledg'd it now ; but it had been better if he had done it before the people . mr. williams the baptist minister was pleased to communicate this account to me by mr. sharp our moderator . feb. 23. 1698-9 . mr. leigh and himself being together at mr. williams's house in portsmouth , there came in mr. erle , mr. bowler , and mr. farrel , three presbyterian ministers ; and there was two other baptists present at the same time . mr. farrel , in the presence of the forementioned ministers , saluted mr. john williams , the disputant , after this manner . mr. williams , i must tell you , and that not as my own sentiments only , but as the sentiments of every one of our brethren , that what credit was gained to your cause , was gained by you . mr. leigh asked mr. williams , whether we did infer from those words . that the ministers had granted out of their own mouths that we had gained the cause ? his reply was , no , all that we infer from it was this ; that it was an implicit concession , that there was credit gained to our cause . mr. leigh said , how much credit did we infer was granted by them to our cause ? mr. williams said , we do not know the quantity of it . mr. leigh replied , truly it was but a little credit that was granted out of our own mouths that was gained to your cause . to which mr. williams answered , that if there was a little credit granted out of their own mouths , then there was credit gain'd to our cause , granted by themselves ; which was no farther denied by mr. leigh . but what was spoken by mr. john williams in the dispute , was abundantly shorter than what dr. russel did then speak . thus far as to mr. williams's account . notwithstanding all this , whilst they were making these concessions at portsmouth , they let fly an advertisement after dr. russel to london , which was printed and published before he got home : for , as mr. williams said , they knew who had hurt them . here follows a true copy thereof . the post-man . feb. 25. 1698-9 . portsmouth , feb. 23. yesterday the dispute between the presbyterians and anabaptists , was held in the presbyterian meeting-house . it began at ten of the clock in the morning , and continued till six in the afternoon , without any intermission . the theme of the dispute was the subjects of baptism , and the manner how baptism is to be performed . russel and williams were the opponents for the anabaptists , and mr. chandler and mr. leigh defendants for the presbyterians . mr. sharp moderator for the former , and mr. robinson for the latter . mr. russel opposed infant-baptism , with all the subtilty and sophistry of the schools ; and was answered with good reason and learning . upon the whole , it was the opinion of all the judicious auditory , the presbyterians sufficiently defended their doctrine , and also worsted their adversaries , when they came to assume the place of opponents . we being silent , and not using the same methods as they did , to squirt out foolish advertisements in common news-papers , these men grew confident ; and upon the 1st of april following , in the flying-post , they publish a long story , full of vntruths , and filly squint-ey'd reflections , not becoming their learning or profession : and all to support a sinking interest . but it appeared so manifestly partial , that there seemed to be little or no credit given to it , except by some few of their own party . for although they were so civil to give themselves the title of master , they grutched to speak so honourably of their opponents . and in the second paper they say , one mr. william ( by some called dr. ) russel of london , &c. all that i shall say to it is this ; as i am a minister of christ and of the churches , i can ( through the grace of god ) bear all the indignity and contempt they can put upon me ; if i , by so doing , can but do good to souls , and bring the least tribute of honour to my lord and master thereby . i thank god that he enabled me to count the cost before i was ordained to the work of the ministry ; and therefore , if reproaches , yea bonds and afflictions , abide me , it is no more than i looked for . but what reason these men have to refuse to give me the civil title of doctor , i know not , neither do i care . but this i know , that many years since , i was not only admitted as master of arts , but took my degree of batchelor in physick , and was after that created a doctor in physick of the famous vniversity of cambridge , and also admitted by universal consent to be a member of the senate there : and that not as some have suggested , as if it had been only ex gratia . yet these men , even whilst i was in portsmouth ( as well as since ) have reported among the people there , that i was russel the mountebank , a man that hath been dead several years . they thought ( perhaps ) by such artifices to lessen the peoples opinion of me . but by making me little , they make themselves the less , in that such giants ( as they would have the people believe them to be ) should not be able to conquer such a pigmy as they have represented me in the eyes of the vulgar . they have also reported , that i am a hackney disputant , and that i refused to come down to portsmouth under thirty guinea's ; but that at last i was prevail'd upon to take twenty . i did not trouble my self whilst i was at portsmouth to confute them in it , because our friends there knew how to do it themselves ; for they knew the report to be altogether groundless and false . but seeing i have this opportunity , i think sit hereby to tell the world , that i did not so much as demand one farthing of them for my journey , neither before nor after . for all that are throughly acquainted with me know , that i do neither preach for hire , nor divine for money , as some of them do : but as i have freely received , so i desire freely to give ; believing that ought to be left to the free benevolence of the people . but that i may do right to our friends at portsmouth and gosport , i do acknowledge that of their own free good will ( without asking ) they did pay my coach hire and bear my charges ; which , as they thought it was the least they could do , so i can truly say , it was the most i ever expected i shall close this epistle , with giving the world an account of the occasion of this publication . there were two things that moved our friends thereto . 1. their noise and clamour they made in the time of the dispute ; which bindred the people from hearing what was said , especially when they were pinch'd upon an argument . for which reason , it was thought convenient to publish it , that what they could not be permitted quietly to hear , they may have the benefit to read without interruption ; and so have leisure to consider it . but 2dly , the principal cause thereof , was those advertisements they sent all over the nation , to misrepresent the dispute , and blind the eyes of the vnthinking about it . whereas this publication will set the matter in a true light , and let all men see that they had neither scripture , nor any good consequences deduced from thence , to prove their practice , either with respect to the subjects or manner . and therefore when the people shall see that they have neither command nor example for their practice , i hope it will be a means to convince them of the vnlawfulness thereof ; and that they will not dare for time to come to practise a humane tradition in the room of an ordinance of jesus christ : remembring what our lord said of the jews of old , in vain they do worship me , teaching for doctrines the commandments of men , matth. 15. 9. and in mark 7. 8. for laying aside the commandment of god , ye hold the tradition of men . and then hear what paul saith , coloss . 2. 20 , 21 , 22. wherefore if ye be dead with christ from the rudiments of the world ; why ; as though living in the world , are ye subject to ordinances ( touch not , taste not , handle not , which all are to perish with the using ) after the commandments and doctrines of men ? now the god of peace , that brought again from the dead our lord jesus , that great shepherd of the sheep , through the blood of the everlasting covenant , make you perfect in every good work to do his will , working in you that which is well pleasing in his sight , through jesus christ , to whom be glory for ever and ever . amen . so prays , your brother and fellow-labourer in the work of the gospel , william russel . the occasion of this disputation : and how dr. russel came to be ingaged therein ; according to the account received from gosport and portsmouth . the occasion was this : the congregation of baptized believers at gosport , were so blessed with success in their ministry , that in a short time they had gathered twenty members , very worthy persons , who were added to them by baptism . many others were amuzed and put upon enquiry . this startled the presbyterian party , because divers of them were of their number , either members or benefactors ; and they began to fear the issue thereof . whereupon mr. sam. chandler , of fareham , about five or six miles from portsmouth , a presbyterian minister , whom they much esteemed for his learning , was procured to come and preach up the contrary doctrine , first at gosport , and afterwards at fortsmouth , upon thursdays , on purpose ( as was supposed ) to put a stop to this so hopeful a beginning amongst the baptists , and hinder their progress therein . and this was managed by him and his admirers in such a manner , as was to the grief of such as truly fear god in those parts . for it was given out , that mr. chandler would not only prove infant baptism from scripture-testimony , and answer all the objections of the baptists against it ; but also sufficiently furnish his hearers with arguments to defend their practice . and in the prosecution of this his design , he took occasion to make his excursions , wherein he spake very diminutively of those in the ministry ; representing them as persons ignorant of , and unacquainted with the holy scriptures . he also ridiculed and mis-represented the manner of their performance of this holy ordinance as it represents a burial and a resurrection , wherein upon rom. 6. 3 , 4. he makes too bold with the manner of our lord's burial , and the apostles application thereof to holy baptism . he might have been pleased to have wounded the poor baptists through the sides of some other person than so great an apostle . he also did greatly extol the practice of infant-baptism , and the use and advantage of it to them , beyond those of riper years ; and did inveigh against their manner of practice with most severe reflections . upon this , the presbyterian party began to triumph over the baptists , and boasted , that what mr. chandler had said upon that point was unanswerable . whereupon , when this last sermon was to be preached , wherein he was to shew his great skill in answering our objections : mr. bowes , and divers other brethren of both the baptized congregations , went and heard him . when he had done . mr. bowes desired leave to speak , and in a modest and christian-like manner , did enter his objection against what mr. chandler had spoken : and upon a meeting betwixt themselves , they did mutually agree , that the points in difference should be publickly disputed at mr. williams his meeting-house in portsmouth ; and that mr. chandler and dr. russel should be the disputants . as touching dr. russel , his being ingaged in it , it did not arise from any desire in himself to be concerned in it ; but from the pressing importunity of his friends . the church at gosport being newly constituted , and being more particularly concerned ( as the thing was circumstanced ) and supposing that all this stir and noise was chiefly designed against them , did first make their application to him for his assistance . and in the name of the church , a letter was sent to him by one of their worthy brethren , wherein they express themselves after this manner . to our esteemed brother russel , we of the church of christ at gosport , send greeting . vve being under a pressure of conscience , having of late had the great ordinance of our lord jesus christ , ( viz. that of believers baptism in water ) inveighed against , and ridiculed by one of the presbyterian ministers ( mr. chandler by name ; ) and being much grieved that the ordinance of christ should be thus triumphed over , and trodden under foot : and hoping you have so far ingaged your self in christ's cause , and that god hath given you abilities to defend it , we don't only beg , but require your personal presence , and desire your assistance to defend that sacred ordinance , &c. he also received several other letters , signed by the ministers , and other private brethren , to press him to it . he did send them word , that it was his opinion , it would be the best way for mr. chandler and himself to exchange some letters betwixt them in the first place , to try the strength and length of their weapons ; and thereby prevent a publick disputation , if possible . but when they let him understand that the matter was too far proceeded in , and so circumstanced , that nothing less than a publick dispute could decide it , he then consented to answer their request therein , because ( as they had signified to him ) the glory of god , the honour of his truth , and the good of souls , was eminently concerned in such a publick defence , especially considering that the presbyterian party had given out , that we were afraid to meet them : but i shall detain you no longer from the dispute it self ; an account of which follows . for the presbyterians . mr. samuel chandler , of fareham . mr. leigh , of newport in the isle of wight . mr. robinson , of hungerford , moderator . for the baptists dr. william russel , of london . mr. john williams , of east-knoyl in wiltshire . mr. john sharpe , of froome , in somersetshire , moderator . an account of the disputation held at portsmouth , february the 22d . 1698 / 9. the disputants going to the place of meeting , between the hours of nine and ten in the morning , having took their places , dr. russel spake to this effect . gentlemen forasmuch as the work we are going to engage in , is a part of religious exercise ; it is my opinion , we ought in the first place ( as is usual upon such occasions ) to be seeking god by prayer ; that his presence may be with us , and his blessing upon our endeavours . the motion being accepted , mr. chandler began the meeting with a short prayer , which being ended , the questions and preliminaries agreed upon , were read , which are as followeth ; whereas by mr. chandler's late preaching on the ordinance of baptism , several persons have taken offence ; and upon desire of satisfaction , it 's mutually agreed between us , whose names are under-written ; that these two points be amicably disputed in the following order , with relation to manner , time , and place ; as hereafter express'd , viz. que. 1. whether according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ , adult believers are only the proper subjects of baptism : and not infants ? que. 2. whether the ordinance of baptism as appointed by christ , is to be administred by dipping , plunging ( or ) overwhelming only , and not otherways ? agreed , the disputation be held at portsmouth in mr. william ' s meeting place , on friday the 10 of february next ensuing ( if god permit ) beginning at nine in the morning . and if in case the providence of god should so order , that either party should fall sick , or any other unavoidable circumstance happen ; that then the time shall be deferr'd to another day , to be agreed on by the parties concern'd , not exceeding a fortnight after ; provided a week's notice be given thereof before the 10th of february . also agreed , the parties disputants be mr. samuel chandler of farebam , and dr. william russel of london ; or any other persons in either of their steads , supposing them ordained ministers ; and each disputant to choose a moderator . the disputation to be managed regularly , with strict regard to the two above recited subjects : and if the moderators shall sce fit , during any interval of the disputants for refreshment , that two other persons go on with the dispute , until they reassume it . portsmouth , december , 23d . 1698. samuel chandler . francis williams . here follows mr. chandler's apology to the people . my friends , it is not out of vanity or pride , i appear in this place upon this occasion at this time : most of you know , and i suppose many of you have heard , that in the course of my lecture in this place , i have discoursed of the great principles of religion ; and having explained the creed , and the lord's prayer , i came to give an account of the two sacrament , of the new testament ; and therein was unavoidably concerned to speak to those truths that are contradicted by these gentlemen here present . those that heard me , know that i was very modest in expressing my self in this controversie : but a bold and confident challenge was given me , which i knew not how to refuse ; unless i would betray the truths i believe in my conscience , or confess my self not able to vindicate them . and accordingly these men have sent for some assistance to oppose us in this matter . i desire these things may be handled with a great deal of calmness ; that we may discourse of things as becomes christians . and as we have the favour of the government both civil and military , so we may give them no occasion to repent of allowing us this liberty . and also i desire that nothing may be done unbecoming this place , where we usually meet together for the more immediate worship of god. and i would have you join with me in this petition ; that god would grant his truth may takē place . he then repeated the questions to be disputed , and said , these are the two articles we are to dispute of at this time. we deny , and they affirm . then dr. russel said , gentlemen , you know i was not present at the drawing up of the preliminaries , and therefore i think it may be necessary , before we enter upon the disputation , to know wherein we agree about the first question , and wherein we differ ; that we may not discourse about those things wherein we are agreed . i do suppose , by the stating of the question , that you do own that adult believers are the proper subjects of baptism . and if you do , i would desire you to declare your selves herein . mr. chandler said , he did own that adult believers were the proper subjects of baptism , but not the only proper : infants were to be baptized also . dr. russel . then you own our practice to be right . mr. chandler . yes , if they have not been baptized in their infancy ; then they are to be baptized upon profession of their faith , when they come to years . dr. russel . you suppose they are to be baptized by virtue of some commission ; and that it is by the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ . mr. chandler . yes , i do so . dr. russel . i suppose you expect i should be opponent first . mr. chandler . yes , that was agreed . dr. russel . if therefore i prove that infants are not the proper subjects of baptism , you will allow that i perform what i have undertaken , we having no other subjects in the question but adult believers , and infants . mr. chandler . yes , we do allow it . dr. russel . then i will undertake to prove , that infants are so far from being the proper subjects of baptism , that they are not the subjects of it at all . and now i would know how we shall dispute ; whether by reading the commission , and making an inference therefrom , and proving that ( if we are not agreed about it ) from some other text ; or what way we shall proceed in . mr. chandler . you must do it syllogistically ; and therefore form your argument . dr. russel . my argument is this . arg. 1. if christ hath no where required any of his ministers to baptize infants , then the baptism of infants is not according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ . but christ hath no where required any of his ministers to baptize infants ; ergo , the baptism of infants is not according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ . mr. chandler . i distinguish here upon your antecedent . if you mean that christ hath not expresly commanded infants to be baptized ; then i deny the consequence of your major . for christ hath no where expresly commanded infants to be baptized . dr. russel . if you will insist upon that , i can easily prove it . for some persons are expresly commanded to be baptized in the commission : infants ( by your own confession ) are not expresly commanded to be baptized either in the commission , or elsewhere : but i have neither the word commanded , nor expresly commanded in my argument ; and you must answer to my argument . for i agree with you , that infants are no where expresly commanded to be baptized . mr. chandler . there is no need of that ; but those of your way will not allow us to prove it by consequence . dr. russel i say , that it 's no where required : if you prove it any way required , it shall suffice . mr. chandler . if you will allow good consequences drawn from scripture . i will deny your minor. dr. russel . then you must suppose that christ hath required some of his ministers to baptize infants . mr. leigh . we distinguish between consequential truths , and express words . dr. russel . so do we : but i hope our lord's commission about holy baptism , is delivered in express words , and not consequential . the term in my argument is very lax , i do not there say commanded , but required ; and if you prove the baptism of infants any where required by christ , it is sufficient . mr. chandler . will you allow genuine consequences drawn from scripture ? mr. leigh . will you allow good scripture consequences in this case , or do you expect plain scripture words ? dr. russel . what need is there of so many words about this ? certainly mr. chandler is bound to fix upon some answer to my argument . i say again , the term i use admits of any proof ; he is not thereby obliged to produce any express command , if he can do without it ; if he prove that christ hath any way required it , it will suffice . mr. leigh . gentlemen , you that are notaries , pray observe how ambiguously he expresses himself . dr. russel . i think i express my self plainly enough , when i tell you , that if you prove it any ways requir'd , i will allow it . mr. robinson , their moderator , saith , will you allow this of consequence , or not ? dr. russel . let us not thus stumble at the threshold , how often must i tell you , that if you can prove it any way required by christ ; prove it either by consequence , or which way you will , if you do but prove it , i will allow it . but you must remember that you are to prove it according to christ's commission , ( for those are the terms in the queston . ) and i believe you will find a difficult task to do that by consequence . for suppose an embassador should declare to the prince to whom he is sent , that his master hath given him authority , by his commission , to negotiate with him about such a particular matter that he shall name , and that he is charged to do this in his master's name and stead . if when his credentials are produced there is no such thing mentioned therein , he cannot expect the prince should give credit to him therein , when he had told him before , it was a part of his master's commission ( which is our case : ) and his alledging only consequential proofs after that , will not serve his turn . but if you think you can do it by consequences , you may try your skill , with all my heart , so you do but prove it required according to christ's commission ; which is the thing in question between us . mr. chandler . what , from the commission ? mr. robinson the moderator cries out to mr. chandler , hold ! dr. russel must prove it by an universal negative . dr. russel . then mr. chandler must deny some part of my argument , which i have not yet been able to prevail with him to do . mr. chandler . i deny the minor. dr. russel . by denying the minor , you say that christ hath some where required some of his ministers to baptize infants . mr. chandler . by good consequence . dr. russel . then i will make good my minor thus : if christ hath any where required any of his ministers to baptize infants , it 's somewhere so recorded in the holy scriptures : but it 's no where so recorded in the holy scriptures : ergo , christ hath not any where required any of his ministers to baptize infants . mr. chandler . what do you mean by being recorded ? dr. russel . i hope you know what the word recorded signifies . i mean any where so written . mr. chandler . to this i answer , by distinguishing again . if you mean by being recorded in scripture , being recorded in express words , i deny your major ; but if you mean by consequence , i deny the minor. dr. russel . if you do but prove it recorded , it is sufficient . mr. chandler . i deny your minor. dr. russel . then you say it 's somewhere so recorded in holy scripture . i therefore argue thus , if it be any where so recorded in holy scripture , mr. chandler , or some other person is able to shew it . but neither mr. chandler , not any other person whatsoever , is able to shew it . ergo , it is not any where so recorded in holy scripture . mr. chandler . i deny your minor. dr. russel . hold sir , it is an universal negative . you must give your instance where it is so written . i appeal to your moderator . mr. robinson . you must prove it still . suppose mr. chandler cannot give an instance , nor no body in the company ; you cannot thence infer that none in the world can . dr. russel . this is in effect to give away your cause , when there are so many men of parts and learning present ; if none of them are able to give us one instance from scripture for infant-baptism , we cannot expect that any body else should . besides , i would desire those honourable persons and others in this assembly that understand these things , to consider that i am not fairly dealt with , and that i am under a great disadvantage , not having other learned persons to assist me as mr. chandler hath , and yet am forced to answer two or three at a time . but to proceed , i do affirm , that it being an universal negative , he ought to give his instance , and i demand it of him ; and till he doth , my argument stands good . mr. chandler . this is only a trick to turn off the opponency . dr. russel . what do you talk of a trick ? i hope you are able to give one single instance of what is your daily practice . mr. leigh . you do this to turn the opponency upon mr. chandler . dr. russel . if mr. chandler will say he can give no instance i will urge it no further . here mr. chandler was going to speak and mr. leigh hindered him . dr. russel . sir , why do you hinder mr. chandler from speaking ? mr. chandler . because you would turn the opponency upon me . dr. russel . i intend no such thing . when you have brought your instance , after i have spoken to it , i will then go on with the opponency . mr. leigh . you can bring no argument can throw the opponency upon him like this . mr. robinson . you must know that according to all the rules of logick you are to prove your proposition . for you universally affirm it , though in form it runs negatively . you say no person can give an instance in scripture whereby we baptize infants : how do you prove this ? dr. russel . i never yet knew that an universal negative was an universal affirmative . this is to say any thing . tho' never so contrary to truth . i wonder at it that you should take the matter upon you thus by turns ; especially that you should take upon you to be a disputant , whose work is only to be a mederator . is this civil treatment to a stranger that comes so many miles to meet you ? mr. robinson . i must not suffer the question to be alter'd . mr. chandler is respondent ; you put the part of an opponent upon him , i must not allow it : do you prove your question . dr. russel . mr. chandler ( i understand ) hath signified to the people in his preaching , that there are plain scriptures to be brought for the proof of infant baptism , and now is the time for him to produce them : i urge it upon him to assign but one instance , and you will not suffer him so to do . mr. leigh . 't is not mr. chandler's sermon ; it is the question before us that you must regulate . dr. russel . if you say you have no scripture proof for infants baptism , i have done . but why must you prevent mr. chandler ? i hope here are some honourable persons and others that understand nature of this controversie , and they may reasonably expect that those who have made such a noise about it , can give some tolerable instance for it ; and if they will do that , we will proceed to examine it . mr robinson there are many here know how that mr. chandler hath asserted and proved that infants are the subjects of baptism ; but you are not to call on him for that now . you did ( by your friends ) undertake to prove the contrary , and it rests upon you so to do . dr russel . i have already proved the contrary , and my argument will stand good till you give your instance . mr. robinson . if you will change sides , mr. chandler , you may admit this trick . dr. russel . can you ( at other times ) boast of so many plain scriptures for your practice , and now you are brought to the test about it , you are not able to produce one ; what will the people think of you ? mr. leigh . i will undertake in any dispute philosophical or divine , in this manner immediately to turn the opponency upon the respondent . when i cannot prove the assertion , i will presently say , if you can bring any solid proof for your practice it is true , if not , false . and i appeal to the moderator , whether it be not his business to keep the disputants to the rules of dispute . mr. robinson . the moderator is to regulate them if they transgress bounds ; but you have grossly transgressed : i appeal to any that understand logick , whether this be sufferable for him thus to turn the opponency upon mr. chandler . then dr. smith stood up and said , if i must speak , then by your leave , according to what i always understood , he that asserts must prove . dr. russel . then they having asserted that infants are the subjects of baptism , they are to prove their practice , especially when they are forc'd upon it by an universal negative . we desire but one single instance , and they will not assign it . mr. robinson . no ; you are to prove your argument . dr. russel . i have done that already , and therefore if mr. chandler will confess he hath no instance to give , i will proceed to a new argument . this mr. chandler refused to do , and yet would not give his instance . dr. russel . if mr. chandler can give no instance , here are divers other ministers , gentlemen of parts and learning : have none of them an instance to produce ? if you thus refuse to produce it , the people will think you have none to give . notwithstanding this , none of them could be prevailed upon to do it , although they were called upon , and challenged to give any one instance ( where it was so written ) if they could . whereupon dr. russel spake to this effect , gentlemen , it may be you think i have but one argument ; if you will say no more to this , i am not willing to tire out the auditory ; i will therefore proceed to a new argument . but take notice ( by the way ) that my first argument stands good , till you give your instance to the contrary . arg. 2. if infants are not capable to be made disciples of christ by the ministry of men , then they cannot possibly be the subjects of baptism intended in christ's commission . but infants are not capable to be made disciples of christ by the ministry of men. ergo , they cannot possibly be the subjects of baptism intended in christ's commission . mr. chandler repeats the argument and then saith , here if you mean by being made disciples , actual and compleat disciples , i deny your major : but if you mean such as are entered into a school and given up to instruction , then i deny your minor. dr. russel repeats his major , and desires mr. chandler to tell him what he denies in it . for ( saith he ) my words are plain , to be made disciples by the ministry of men. mr. robinson . mr. chandler distinguishes between compleat and incompleat disciples . dr. russel . but what then doth he mean by denying my major ? mr. robinson . he denies , that they that cannot be made compleat disciples , are not intended in the commission . i hope the reader will observe how often mr. chandler was at a loss , and mr. leigh and mr. robinson were forced to help him out with their distinctions and equivocable expressions . here dr russel ( seeing they would not be brought to give any direct answer ) turns his hypothetical into a categorical syllogism . whosoever are uncapable to be made disciples by the ministry of men , they cannot be the subjects of baptism intended in christ's commission : but infants are uncapable to be made disciples by the ministry of men : ergo , they cannot be the subjects of baptism intended in christ's commission . now let mr. chandler tell me what he means by being made compleat , or incompleat disciples by the ministry of men ( according to my argument ) if he can . mr. chandler . i mean by compleat disciples , such as are actually capable of learning : by incompleat , such as are entered in such places in order to be taught . we send children to school before they know a letter . dr. russel my argument speaks not of such ; but of those who have understanding , and are capable to be made actual disciples ; which infants are not . mr. chandler . that such as are so capable , are the only subjects of baptism ; you are to prove it . dr. russel . then you deny the major . mr. chandler . yes , as to your hypothetical argument . dr. russel . if you had done this before , you had saved your self and me much trouble . then i prove it thus . if our lord in that commission given for holy baptism , hath commanded his apostles , that were men , to make disciples by their ministry , and after that , to baptize them , then the consequence of the major is true . but our lord in that commission given for holy baptism hath commanded his apostles , that were men , to make disciples by their ministry , and after that to baptize them . ergo , the consequence of the major is true . mr. leigh . i distinguish thus . they may be entered into the church in order for learning , and so they are disciples before baptism : yet in a more visible sense , they are made disciples by baptism . dr. russel . then you suppose infants not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. mr. chandler . not solemnly invested . dr. russel . we are not talking of that ; the question betwixt us is , whether they are capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. will you assert that ? mr. leigh . we assert they are disciples , as children of believers , before baptism . dr. russel . this is nothing to the purpose , but to spin out time. mr. chandler or mr. leigh should have answered to my argument , which neither of them have done . for if infants are disciples simply , as being children of believing parents , before baptism ( as mr. leigh saith ) then it is done , without any ministetial instruction . and therefore is so far from being an answer to my argument , that it is a meer evasion . i therefore argue thus upon them . if infants are not the subjects of teaching , according to christ's commission , then they are not the subjects of baptism by that commission . but infants are not the subjects of teaching , according to christ's commission . ergo , they are not the subjects of baptism by that commission . for what our lord hath joined together , no man ought to separate . but our lord hath joined teaching and baptizing together . therefore no man ought to separate . and it is further manifest , that our lord did not command his father to make disciples by some secret work of his ; but he commanded his apostles ( that were men ) to make disciples by their ministry ; and that is the point you are to answer to . mr. robinson . he denies they are uncapable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. dr. russel . then by the way take notice , that he grants my major to be true ; that unless they are capable to be taught by the ministry of men , they cannot be the subjects of baptism . i shall therefore proceed to the proof of my minor. if infants have no knowledge to discern between good and evil , then they are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. but infants have no knowledge to discern between good and evil ergo , they are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. mr. chandler . you trick all this while . i told you by infants being disciples , i meant their being solemnly invested by baptism . dr. russel . you still mistake , we are not speaking of their investiture , but of the prerequisites of baptism : and it is evident from what i have said , that those that are truly baptized according to christ's commission ( which is the thing we are upon ) must first be made disciples by the ministry of men. for the commission in mark 16. 15 , 16. is a command to his apostles to go into all the world , and preach the gospel to every creature , and that such of them that were made disciples by their preaching , they should baptize . and in matth. 28. 19. they are commanded to disciple all nations , and to baptize such of them whom they had made disciples by teaching . now when i have shewed you , how that infants not being capable thus to be made disciples , they cannot be the subjects of baptism intended in that commission ; then you grant the consequence of the major ; and by denying my minor , you say they are capable . and when i have brought another argument to prove my minor , you then evade it by an indirect answer . sir , you are bound to give a direct answer to my argument . mr. chandler . i deny the consequence of your major . dr. russel . by so doing , you say , though they have no knowledge to discern between good and evil , yet they are capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. how can this possibly be true ? mr. leigh . you will not allow of compleat and incompleat disciples . dr. russel . what is this to my argument ? pray let mr. chandler six on something . mr. chandler i say if you mean incompleat disciples , i deny that they are uncapable to be such . dr. russel . how often must we have this distinction repeated to keep us from the point in hand . we are now upon this , whether infants have knowledge to discern between good and evil ; which is the medium i bring to prove the other by : why do you not answer to that ? mr. chandler . they have no knowledge , yet are capable of being incompleat disciples . dr. russel . if by compleat , you mean perfectly so , i know not of any such christian in the world. but i hope this doth not hinder , but there may be real and actual disciples of christ , made so by the ministry of men , and fitted for holy baptism . but i proceed to the proof of my minor. if the gospel in the ministration of it , was appointed to inform men what is good , and what is evil , and infants have no knowledge to discern betwixt good and evil ( as mr. chandler hath been forced to confess ) then they are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men : but the gospel in the ministration of it was appointed to inform men what is good , and what is evil , and infant have no knowledge to discern betwixt good and evil , as mr. chandler hath been forc'd to confess : therefore they are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. mr. robinson . when mr. chandler hath distinguished , you most put it into a syllogism , else you will still confound it . dr. russel answers , have i not put it into an argument , and you will not suffer him to answer it ? if you think he hath not sufficiently done that already , let him do it again , and tell to what he means by it , if he can . mr. chandler . i mean one designed and given to learning , solemnly engaged to it , dedicated to the work , as a child entered into a school before he understands one letter ; this is incompleat ; compleat is to be made so by learning . here dr. russel would have spoke , but was not permitted , but broke in upon . mr. leigh . i appeal to any , whether a child sent to school to a master , or mistress ; given up by the parents , and accepted by them ; whether the notion of a scholar be not grounded on such a relation ? dr. russel . i speak of actual disciples , made so by teaching ; are these such , who ( by your own confession ) know not one letter of the book ? these are incompleat scholars indeed mr. leigh . i believe there is a school-master here ; let him speak whether such be not immediately scholars . upon this , mr. ridge the school master stood up and said , upon the parents dedication , and the masters acceptation , and the payment of entrance-money , we do look upon him as a scholar . whereupon there followed a general laughter . dr. russel . i appeal to this assembly , whether my argument did not express such that were made disciples by the ministry of men. what therefore is the reason of your making such a noise and stir about such being accounted scholars so soon as they enter the school , before they know one letter of the book . are these made scholars by teaching , when they have never learned , nor cannot learn ; because they have no knowledges to discern between good and evil : and yet this is the case of those little infants you pretend to baptize . mr. chandler . we allow they are not capable of knowledge to discern between good and evil , nor of being made compleat disciples . dr russel . then the consequence necessarily follows , that infants are not at all intended in the commission of our saviour , matth. 28. 19. mr. robinson . put it into a syllogism . dr. russel . there is no need of that , for mr. chandler hath granted every part of my argument . for 1. he hath granted that infants have no knowledge to discern between good and evil. 2dly . that ( according to my argument ) infants are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. and then it must unavoidably follow , they are not intended in christ's commission . mr. leigh . how sirs ! did we say incompleat disciples are not in the commission ? dr. russel . that hath been sufficiently spoke to already ; i shall therefore proceed to a new argument . arg. 3. if the apostle paul did declare all the counsel of god , and kept back nothing that was profitable for the church of god , and yet did never declare the baptism of infants to be a gospel institution according to christ's commission ; then it is no gospel institution , nor any part of the counsel of god , nor profitable for the church of god. but the apostle paul did declare all the counsel of god , and kept back nothing that was profitable for the church of god , and yet did never declare the baptism of infants to be a gospel-institution according to christ's commission . ergo , it is no gospel-institution , nor any part of the counsel of god , nor profitable for the church of god. mr. chandler . your argument is long . dr. russel . not so long , nor so hard to be understood . mr. robinson . such long arguments are never admitted in any disputation . dr. russel . let mr. chandler speak to the argument . upon this , mr. chandler finding himself unable to answer it , notwithstanding he had two or three prompters to instruct him , he quitted the place of a disputant , and mr. leigh desir'd to take it up , which was admitted him , upon condition he would speak to that argument , which he promised to do . mr. leigh . i deny that the apostle paul did never declare infant baptism to be a gospel-institution . dr. russel . then you deny my minor , which i thus prove . if the apostle paul hath so declared it , it is somewhere to be found in the writings of the new testament . but it is not any where to be found in those writings . ergo , the apostle paul did never so declare it . mr. leigh . i deny the sequel of your major ; for the words were spoken to the church at ephesus ; and what do you talk of paul's epistles , he wrote but one that i know of to the church at ephesus . dr. russel . part of the words in my argument were spoken to the elders of the church of ephesus ; but i have neither ephesus , nor church of ephesus , nor paul's epistles in my argument . why do you not answer to the argument . mr. leigh . we have not the whole of the apostle paul's writings in the new testament ; and this that he wrote to the church of ephesus is but a small part thereof . dr. russel . pray speak to the argument : you see i have no such expressions in it as are taken up by you . mr. leigh . i will do it by a simile . you know that paul wrote divers epistles , and in them of different subjects . it is as if a man should write a book of several things , and when he hath finished it , one comes and cuts off six leaves thereof ; and after this , there is a question arises , whether such a man hath writ any thing about such a particular subject . now it doth not follow , that because it is not contain'd in the rest of his book , that therefore it is not in the six leaves that were cut off . dr. russel . if mr. leigh speaks ad rem , as i suppose he thinks he doth , then i thus infer upon him . first , that he doth by this allow , that there is no mention made of infant-baptism in any of those writings of the apostle paul's , that we have bound up with the rest of the holy scriptures . secondly , he supposes there may be something said of it in those six leaves that were cut off after he had finished his epistles . now the assembly of divines tell us , that the scriptures of the old and new testament are the only rule to direct us in matters of worship . but whether mr. leigh be of their mind i cannot tell . mr. leigh . yes , i am . dr. russel . then what you mean by it i know not , but i believe they meant what we have in the bible , and not what is contained in those six leaves that were cut off , or else they designed to put a cheat upon the whole world , which i do not suppose . but as touching those six leaves , i conclude our brethren have them not in their custody , because i never heard them speak any thing in the least concerning it . for my own part , i can speak for my self ; i never saw them , nor heard of them till now ; neither do i know any thing of the matter . but if mr. leigh or his brethren have them in their custody , i desire they would produce them . and when they have so done , if they will please to favour us so far as first to prove that those were the very six leaves that were written by paul , we will take the pains to examine them : and if it then appears that there is any such thing contained in them as mr. leigh speaks of , we will allow it . mr. leigh was angry hereupon , saying , what do you talk of our being the keepers of them ? and what do you talk of all the new testament ? is all the new testament the apostle paul's writings ? dr. russel . i say i do not confine you to paul's epistles , much less pretend all the new testament to be of the apostle paul's writing , as you would insinuate to the people ; but my words are , it 's no where so declared in the writings of the new testament . and do you produce one instance that it is , if you can , for that will put an issue to our controversie . mr. leigh . you would refer what paul saith to the church of ephesus , to the whole new testament . dr. russel . i hope you will own the holy scriptures to be the only rule to direct us in matters of worship . here mr. leigh breaks in upon the doctor , not permitting him to speak what he had to say : but instead thereof , he saith , i will not own that we have all the sermous that paul preached to the church at ephesus , and if we had , he might preach it to some others though he did not to them , for this was spoken to them . dr. russel . i refer you to the scripture . you say that paul might declare some such thing , and yet it may not be recorded in the scripture . the words are plain . i have not shunned to declare to you all the counsel of god , acts 20. 27. and in ver. 20. i kept back nothing that was profitable unto you . and i do not suppose that paul taught one doctrine in one church and another doctrine in another . for in 1 cor. 4. 17. he tells that church , timothy shall bring you into remembrance of my ways in christ as i teach every where in every church . besides , he doth not only tell them that he had so discharg'd his office among them as to be free from the guilt of their blood , but that he was also free from the blood of all men , ver. 21. testifying to the jews and also to the greeks , repentance toward god , and faith toward our lord jesus christ . and i further add , that if paul never taught infant-baptism in the church of ephesus , nor in the church of corinth , nor in any other place , i hope you will then acknowledge it to be no gospel institution , nor any part of the counsel of god , nor yet profitable for the church of god : and there is no record in holy scripture of his so doing . mr. leigh . i say paul's writings are not the hundredth part of what paul preached . we cannot suppose that in those six chapters to the ephesians he could contrive to put down the whole of his preaching to them . dr. russel . sir , you might have spared all thislabour ; for i am satisfied the people will not trouble themselves to seek for it any where else , but only in the writings of the new testament ; and if they will take my word i can assure them 't is not there to be found . and i perceive you think so too , or else you need not referr them to paul's sermons which are not written . i have heard , indeed , of some unwritten traditions that are lock'd up in the pope's ereast , to be delivered out as he finds occasion for the serving of a turn ; but i never knew that the presbyterians were ever intrusted with any such treasure . mr. leigh . you say it is not to be found in the writings of the new testament ; i deny it . dr. russel . then you deny my minor , which is the thing you should have done before , only you were afraid of being brought to give an instance . now by denying my minor , you say it 's somewhere so recorded in the writings of the new testament , that paul did declare the baptism of infants to be a gospel-institution , &c. and , to prove it is not , i argue thus . if it be so recorded in the writings of the new testament , then mr. leigh or some body else is able to shew it . but neither mr. leigh , nor any body else , is able to shew it . ergo , it is not so recorded in the writings of the new testament . sir , i have now brought it to an universal negative , as i did with mr. chandler upon the former argument ; and now it rests upon you to produce your instance . mr. leigh . i will say it is in the commission , all nations . dr. russel . are you of mr. chandler's opinion ? mr. leigh . i will not answer you . dr. russel . then i say it is not written in the commission that paul did ever declare any thing concerning the baptism of infants . but what do you bring this for now ? you might have done it upon the first argument , when we were upon the commission ; but it 's wholly improper now ; for this that we are now upon , is , whether the apostle paul hath any where so declared it . reader , observe these mens trifling . do they not know as well as we , that the commission of our lord for holy baptism was given long before paul's conversion ; and yet they have the confidence to affirm before so great an auditory , that it is written in the commission , that paul did declare the baptism of infants to be a gospel-institution , &c. which is the thing expressed in my argument . upon this , the reverend mr. chandler , ( who had quitted the work before ) began now in a great fury to break silence again , saying , you are a perfect sophister , your arguments are full of fallacies . dr. russel . it is an easie matter for a man to say so , that understands not an argument himself . mr. leigh . then , pray sir , begin again from acts 20. 27. dr. russel . truly , mr. leigh , i did not come so many miles to spend my time thus , to go backwards and forwards after this manner . mr. chandler . you must do so , if you understand the rules of tergiversation . [ this was one of mr. chandler's witticisms ] dr. russel . if i do not understand those rules when i have occasion for them , i will come to you and learn. but to return to mr. leigh , for i have not done with him yet : sir , you have assigned the commission to prove that paul did declare infant-baptism to be a gospel-institution , part of the counsel of god , &c. now it 's impossible that should be written in the commission , as i have told you before : you must therefore shew us where it is so recorded in some other part of the new testament ; and not assign a place where there can be no mention of it . mr. leigh . he says he gives us the latitude of the whole new testament , but will not admit of the commission , because that doth not say that paul hath so declared . dr. russel . and there is very good reason for it , for the apostle paul is now under consideration , as mention'd in my argument ; who solemnly protesteth , that in the discharge of his ministry , he had freed himself from the blood of all men , in delivering to them all that his master had given him in commission . that he had not shunned to declare all the counsel of god , he had kept back nothing that was profitable for the church of god ; but as faithful steward of the mysteries of god , he did dispence the word , as himself declares in 1 cor. 4. 1 , 2. and i verily believe , that paul was as faithful , as eminent , and as laborous a servant as ever christ had upon earth . and therefore the force of my argument depends upon this , that if paul never said one word about infant-baptism , then it can be no part of the counsel of god , nor a gospel institution , nor ever given him in commission by his lord and master . you have denied my minor ; i have proved it by bringing you to an instance by an universal negative . you have assigned the commission ; i have shewed you the impossibility of proving it from thence . i have pressed you to assign some other part of the new testament for an instance . i have not as yet been able no obtain it . here are divers men of parts and learning among you , can none of you produce so much as one instance to prove it ? surely the people must needs conclude you have none to give . i therefore challenge you to produce the place where it is written , that paul ever said one word of infant-baptism . and till that be done , my argument will stand good . mr. leigh . if paul did not declare it , if we have other places apparent and plain , at least consequential , it is sufficient . dr. russel . this is not an answer to my argument , you might have gone here upon the other , but cannot upon this ; why did you not assign some of those places then ? mr. chandler . we deny the consequence , paul might speak of it some where else , though it is not found in his epistles . mr. robinson . you are to prove that , because paul did not shun to declare to the church of ephesus the whole counsel of god , therefore baptizing of infants must be found there , or else it is no part of the counsel of god. mr. leigh . however , we will suppose the thing ( but not grant it ) that paul has not spoken of infant baptism . mr. williams . if you suppose it , we will take it for granted ; if we may not , say so . thus ended their opposition to this argument . dr. russel . i will now proceed to another argument . arg. 4. christ's commission doth shew who are to be baptized . but it doth not shew that infants are to be baptized : ergo , infants are not the subjects of baptism according to christ's commission . mr. leigh . i deny the minor. dr. russel . by so doing , you suppose it doth shew it . i therefore thus argue if the commission doth shew that infants are to be baptized , mr. leigh , or some other person can shew it us in the commission . but neither mr. leigh , nor any other person is able to shew it us in the commission . ergo , the commission doth not shew that infants are to be baptized . mr. leigh . it is included in the word , all nations . dr. russel . i beg your favour ; mr. chandler asserted in his sermon , that it was the infants of believing parents that were to be baptized : and that it was necessary men should repent and believe , otherwise they had no right to this ordinance . and if we were sent ( saith he ) into an heathen nation , we ought to ingage men to repent and believe , before we administer this ordinance to them . here are qualifications required in the persons to be baptized ( by your own confession ) without which you must not administer it . and it is contrary both to your own principles and practice , to baptize jews , turks and heathens , and all their infants , without previous qualifications to fit them for it . mr. leigh . i say it is included in the word , all nations : do you prove it is not . dr. russel . you have brought an instance , and it is your business to make good your own instance ; otherwise my argument stands firm and untouch'd . but if i shew there are some qualifications required in the commission , and prove that those cannot be found in infants ; then infants cannot be included in the word , all nations . i tell you he hath commanded us to baptize some persons , but he hath not commanded us to baptize any infants ; which i thus prove . if those that christ in his commission hath commanded to be baptized , must first be made disciples according to that commission ; then infants are not to be baptized by virtue of that commission . but those that christ in his commission hath commanded to be baptized , must first be made disciples according to that commission . ergo , infants are not to be baptized by virtue of that commission . mr. leigh . i deny your consequence . repeat it again . dr. russel . then i will make it categorical . all those required to be baptized by christ's commission , are disciples : infants are not capable to be disciples , as i have already proved . ergo , not required to be baptized by christ's commission . mr. leigh . i deny your whole argument : that all that christ requires to be baptized , are disciples , and that infants are not capable . dr. russel . if no other but disciples are express'd in the commission , then the major is true . and if infants are uncapable to be made disciples , then the minor is true also . mr. leigh . we say they are implied ; you allowed good consequences but now . dr. russel . but here are disciples mentioned in the commission ; and none but such that are made so by the ministry of men. mr. leigh . you talk of the commission : it is the good consequences i insist upon ; and say , persons are not to be compleat disciples before they are baptized ; nor actually taught before they are disciples . dr. russel . perhaps you mean a man is not a compleat christian , if he hath not attained to the highest perfection he is capable of whilst in this life ; although he hath been a real christian for many years . i speak not of such a completion , but of such that are actual disciples of christ , made so by the ministry of men. mr. leigh . i say there is no necessity of being disciples in your sense , before they are baptized . dr. russel . then i will prove there is a necessity . if our lord in his commission did not require his apostles to baptize any , but only such as they had before made his disciples by teaching ; then there is a necessity they should be actual disciples before they are baptized . but our lord in his commission did not require his apostles to baptize any , but only such as they had before made his disciples by teaching . ergo , there is a necessity they should be actual disciples before they are baptized . mr. leigh . i deny the minor. dr. russel . then i will read the commission . mr. leigh . you need not do that , we all know the commission very well . dr. russel . i will read my master's commission , matth 28. 19. go ye therefore and disciple all nations , baptizing them in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost . this commission is very solemnly delivered , wherein our lord declares , that all power in heaven and earth was given to him . and by virtue of that power — here mr. robinson stops the doctor , and cries out , you are not to preach here , sir. dr. russel . may i not have leave to draw my inference from the text ? mr. leigh . form your argument . the text doth not discover it . dr. russel . is not our lord's commission of as good authority as my argument ? when i have spoken to that , i will then form an argument from it , if you will be silent , and suffer me so to do . i say , that in this great commission , our lord declares his great power . mr. leigh . form your argument . dr. russel . i hope the use of all our syllogisms is to bring us to the commission : and now we are come to it , let us see whether these things are to be found therein , or not . will you pretend that infants are in the commission , and must not the people be suffered to see whether there be any thing mention'd about them , or not . mr. robinson . is this your argument ? bring your argument . and then he bawls very loud , saying , mr. williams , will you suffer him to preach ? mr. williams answers , no , i will not suffer him to preach here . dr. russel . what do you talk of preaching ? are ye afraid of the commission ? i hope it is not so bad with you , as it was with some in times past , whom one of the fathers ( i. e. tertallian ) calls by the name of lucifugae scripturarum , &c. flyers from the light of the scripture ( as bats do from the light of the sun : ) what is the reason , gentlemen , you will not endure to hear the commission opened ? will you fly from the light of the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ ? is it not the subject contained in the question ; and will you ( or dare you ) deny that what i have said is in the commission ? mr. leigh . we say not so . dr. russel . if you should , you would directly oppose mr. calvin . for he saith , there is no mention made of infants in the commission , as it is express'd either in matth. 28. or mark 16. and further saith we may as well apply those words in 2 thess . 3. 10. that if any would not work , neither should he eat : to little infants , and so keep them from food till they starve , as to apply what is said in the commission to them , whereas it belongs only to the adult . mr. robinson . this is not to the purpose , what have we to do with what mr. calvin says ? dr. russel . i did not know but you might have had a veneration for mr. calvin ; but seeing it 's otherwise , i will thus argue from the commission . if there be an express command in our lord's commission for the baptizing of some persons , and there be no express command neither there nor elsewhere , for the baptizing of infants ; then the baptism of infants is not contained in that commission : mr. robinson . we say though — dr. russel . what again mr. robinson ? must i always be thus broke in upon by you ; what is the meaning of it ? when you see you are like to be pinched upon an argument , then you make it your business to hinder me from speaking : doth this become a moderator ? i beg i may have liberty to speak out , and not be thus taken up in the midst of an argument . pray , sir , remember what the wise man saith of such a one , that answers a matter before he hears it . i say , if there be an express command in our lord's commission for the baptizing of some persons , and there be no express command neither there nor elsewhere for the baptizing of infants ; then the baptism of infants is not contained in that commission : but there is an express command in our lord's commission for : the baptizing of some persons , and there is no express command either there or elsewhere for the baptizing of infants : ergo , the baptism of infants is not contained in that commission . mr. leigh . instead of giving his answer to the argument , he shams it off after this manner ; saying , i appeal to the people . though he allowed consequences but now , yet now he requires an express scripture . and yet i say , if nations include infants , they are expresly mentioned . upon this , mr. robinson turns dictator , and says to mr. leigh , you were better deny his consequence . dr. russel saith , pray , mr. leigh , be pleased to change places with mr. robinson , let him be disputant , and you moderator ; for i perceive neither you , nor i are able to please him . this was refused . upon which dr. russel said to mr. robinson , pray sir , do not you thus dictate to him , i have none to dictate to me : pray let him answer my argument . here mr. leigh did as mr. robinson had taught him , and denied the consequence ; and also that an express command was necessary to authorize the baptizing of infants . dr. russel . my argument was , if there be an express command for the baptizing of some persons , you deny the sequel of the major ; and in so doing you say , that notwithstanding there is no express command for the baptizing of infants , neither there nor elsewhere in all the holy scripture ; yet nevertheless they are intended in the commission . mr. leigh . i do so . dr. russel . and i say , if there be an express command for the baptizing of some persons ; but none at all for the baptizing of infants : then they are not at all intended in that commission . mr. leigh . i deny first the sequel of the major , and then i will deny your minor. dr. russel . this seems very strange , that when i have made it appear so evidently from the commission it self , that there is an express command for the baptizing of some persons ; and yet it should not be allowed as a necessary consequence from the premises , that infants are not intended ; when your selves have confessed there is no express command in all the scriptures , for the baptizing of infants . mr. leigh . i deny the sequel . dr. russel . then i will prove that there is an express command for the baptizing of some persons , from the commission it self . mr. leigh . that is not the sequel of the major , it is that i deny . dr. russel . and i bring the commission to prove it . but you say , that notwithstanding our lord hath expresly commanded some persons to be baptized ; although he hath not commanded infants to be baptized , yet they may be some of that number . hath christ two sorts of subjects that he commands to be baptized in that commission ? or , rather , are some commanded , and others not commanded , and yet both to be baptized ; the one by a command , and the other without ? here mr. leigh refuses to answer , and cries out , put it into a syllogism . dr. russel . if no persons are to be baptized according to that commission , but what are there expresly commanded ; and infants are not so commanded ; then the consequence of the major is true : but no persons are to be baptized , according to that commission , but what are there expresly commanded ; and infants , are not so commanded : ergo , the consequence of the major is true . mr. leigh . i deny your minor. dr. russel . by so doing you say there are some to be baptized that are not there expresly commanded . mr. leigh . do you not know your own argument ? dr. russel . i repeat it not for my own knowledge , but for the peoples information . and i prove my minor thus : if the words of the commission are express command to the apostles , to direct them who they should baptize , then the minor is true : but the words of the commission are an express command to the apostles , to direct them who they should baptize : ergo the minor is true . mr. leigh . i deny your minor. dr. russel . if there be no other commission of our lord for holy baptism , but what is recorded in matth. 28. and mark 16. then the minor is true : but there is no other : ergo , the minor is true . mr. leigh . i deny tae sequel of your major . dr. russel . but we are now upon the commission . mr. leigh . we are so : but we say good consequences derived from the commission , are sufficient . dr. russel . so you may if you please ; but i had rather walk exactly according to the commission of our lord , than by such consequences wherein i may be deceived . mr. robinson . i matter not what you had rather do , or what your opinion is . i am for consequences . mr. leigh . i deny the sequel of the major ; that they are to baptize none , but such as they are expresly commanded . dr. russel . thenl thus argue : if there be no manner of allowance given them to baptize any other but what they are expresly commanded , then the sequel of the major is true : but there is no manner of allowance given them to baptize any other but what they are expresly commanded : ergo , the sequel of the major is true . mr. leigh was pleased here to give a general denial , without distinguishing : upon which dr. russel referr'd him to his former argument , wherein he had already shewed , that there is an express command for the baptizing of all such , that they are required to baptize by virtue of christ s commission . mr. leigh . i deny your minor , but distinguish between the command being expressed and the subjects intended . dr. russel . if the words in the commission about holy baptism be a command from christ to his apostles , then the minor is true : but the words in the commission about holy baptism are a command from christ to his apostles : ergo , the minor is true . mr. leigh . upon distinction , we deny that all the subjects are express'd . dr. russel . my argument saith , they have not allowance to baptize any other . i am now therefore to prove that the commission is command to them , if you deny it . mr. leigh . i allow that the command is express'd : but i say the subjects are to be brought in by consequence . dr. russel . then i will prove that the subjects are express'd . if christ did command his apostles to baptize such as believe and are made disciples , then the subjects are express'd : but christ did command his apostles to baptize such as believe and are made disciples : ergo , the subjects are express'd . mr. leigh . i find a fault with your syllogism ; your major should be universal . dr russel . i was to prove there is a command , with respect to the subjects ; and therefore i have form'd the syllogism right . for it is evident that believers and disciples are the subjects they are commanded to baptize . mr. robinson . you must say all the subjects . dr. russel . by yo●r favour , there is no need of that . for mr. leigh denies there is an express command in christ's commission for any subjects . mr. leigh . i hope the people can testifie that i said the command is express'd : but the subjects to be brought in consequentially . dr. russel . is not that the same which i say you said ? i know you allowed there was a command for the thing it self , but not for the subjects . and therefore i have answered rightly , and your opposition is unreasonable . mr. leigh . we must all confess that jesus christ gave commission to baptize believers when at the age of maturity . such as were before jews and greeks , and newly-believing in the lord jesus , were thereupon to be baptized ; but afterwards the children of those believers . dr. russel . it 's said in mark 16. 16. he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved . here is not one word of infants . mr. leigh . and it follows , he that believeth not , shall be damn'd . now if believing be previous to baptism , by the same way of arguing it must be necessary to salvation ; and so you must say , that all not believing are damn'd , and so all infants are damn'd . d. russel . this is a non-sequitur : for infants are not at all intended in this commission , as i have already shewed you ; and as mr. john calvin doth also affirm . but i hope mr. leigh will allow our saviour's words to be true ; that all those his apostles preached to , according to his commission , if they did not believe , they should be damned . for of such it is said , he that believeth not , is condemned already , because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten son of god. but as touching infants , i am far from believing that god hath decreed them ( as such ) to eternal damnation . i will rather believe that all infants dying in their infancy are elected , than conclude that any of them are damned . and i suppose you do not know the contrary . if you do , i desire you would tell the people so . mr. leigh . what do you put that upon us for ? dr. russel . because i think it 's reasonable you should tell the people what your opinion is , seeing you have started it ; for you see i have given my opinion freely about it ; and if you think otherwise , pray tell the people so . for then i conceive that your baptizing their infants will do them no good ; for you cannot alter the decrees of heaven : or if you believe , as the papists do , that grace is conveyed to them barely by the act done , notwithstanding the children are wholly passive in it , pray tell us so . mr. leigh refused to answer to the former , but gave this answer to the latter : no , we deny that . here mr. john williams , baptiz'd minister , offered his arguments . if believers are the only subjects of baptism according to christ's commission , then infants are not : but believers are the only subjects of baptism according to christ's commission : therefore infants are not . mr. leigh denied the sequel of the major ; which was thus proved . if infants are incapable of believing , then they are not the subjects of baptism according to the commission : but infants are incapable of believing : therefore they are not the subjects of baptism according to the commission . mr. leigh said the greek word signified to make disciples ; and i deny that infants are incapable of being made disciples . mr. williams said he did not understand greek ; he must leave that to his brother . then mr. leigh said , i deny the minor. mr. williams proved his minor thus : if the essence of faith consists in the act of the understanding and of the will , then infants are incapable of believing : but the essence of faith consists in the act of the understanding and of the will : therefore infants are incapable of believing . mr. leigh denied the sequel of the major , which mr. williams thus proved . if none can believe on jesus christ , that never heard of jesus christ , then infants are incapable of believing : but none can believe on jesus christ , that never heard of jesus christ : therefore infants are incapable of believing . mr. leigh denied the sequel of the major . but he should have remembred what is written , rom. 10 , 14. how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard ? and how shall they hear without a preacher ? and i do not suppose our antagonists think they are obliged to preach to new-born infants . and yet the administration of baptism is ( by the commission ) restrained to such as are made believers by the preaching of the word . these arguments being sufficient to prove the incapacity of infants believing , the next argument mr. williams offer'd , was ( from thence ) to prove that infants could not be the subjects of baptism according to christ's commission . if the administrator must have an account of the faith of the subject before he baptize him , then infants are not the subjects of baptism according to christ's commission : but the administrator must have an account of the faith of the subject before he baptize him : therefore infants are not the subjects of baptism according to christ's commission . mr. leigh denied the minor. for the proof of which , mr. williams urged two scriptures , acts 8. 36 , 37. and mat. 28. 19. and said , when the eunuch proposed for baptism , philip tells him , if thou believest with all thy heart , thou mayst . the contrary ( that fairly offers it self ) is this ; that if thou dost not believe with all thine heart , thou mayst not . and upon this , the eunuch declared his faith before he was baptized . from whence it 's evident , the eunuch was content to be taught ; philip teaches him ; and yet after this , he must know whether he believes before he baptized him . therefore it follows , they must have actual learning ; and the minister must also know that they have it before he baptize them . and in mat. 28. 19 go disciple to me all nations , baptizing them . from whence i thus argue . if ministers have no commission to baptize any but such as are discipled to christ , then they must have an account of their discipleship before they baptize them : but ministers have no commission to baptize any but such as are discipled to christ : therefore they must have an account of their discipleship before they baptize them . to which was added , that erasmus in his paraphrase upon the new testament , reads the commission thus , go and teach all nations , and when they have learned , dip them . and i further say , if the administrator must have an account of the person 's learning before he be baptized , then a bare going to school is not sufficient to constitute him a disciple . mr. robinson . do you see , sirs ! this gentleman grounds his opinion upon the authority of erasmus . dr. russel . why must erasmus be thus slighted ? here are some honourable persons know very well , that erasmus was a man not to be despised for his skill about the etymology of a greek word . but any thing serves your turn at a pinch . mr. leigh . he quotes erasmus ; and it 's well known he was between papist and protestant . now many of these men , speaking against infant-baptism , will call it popery ; and yet he quotes erasmus for their judgment . now , forasmuch as mr. leigh slipp'd the argument , and only replied to that of erasmus , that he was an inter-papist , &c. mr. williams gave him this answer . sir , you have heard my argument to which you have given no answer . as touching erasmus , i did not quote him as building my faith on his authority , but for his judgment ; it being the translation of a man that understood the original : and although he was not accounted one of the best of men ; yet he was accounted one of the best of scholars in his time. mr. leigh . and now as to the eunuch , he was a proselyte too , and his infants , if he had any , were to be taken in also . philip comes to him and he requires a confession of his faith , because he was a grown man. yet had he had an infant with him , he had had a right to this ordinance after he believed . when by your opinion it must be cast out ; because not capable of actual believing . now i deny that he that administers the ordinance , must always have an account of the person , whether he hath learned , or not . ( i suppose mr. leigh forgot himself , to talk of an eunuch's having children . it puts me in mind of a story i lately heard , of a presbyterian minister that undertook ( in a sermon ) to prove infant-baptism , and to that end chose this text for his purpose , of philip's baptizing the eunuch . and when he had insisted some time upon it , he speaks after this manner to the people : beloved , when you are gone , perhaps you will say , what is all this to the purpose ? here is not one word of infants in the text. it is true , says he , there is not , but i will tell you how that comes in : had he had his wife and children with him , they had then been baptized as well as himself : but they were at a great distance from him ; but as soon as he came home , immediately he baptized them all . i will make no comment upon it , but only this . if these gentlemen know what an eunuch is , then it 's vain babling : if they do not , let them go to the grand senior's seraglio and learn. ) mr. williams . we have plain direction for what i have said ; philip said to the eunuch , if thou believest with all thine heart , thou mayest . and accordingly he took an account of his faith. and in the commission , go disciple all nations , baptizing them . from whence it 's evident , it was those they had made disciples , that they were to baptize . and therefore they must know whether they are disciples or no , before they must adventure to baptize them . mr. leigh . you argue thus , because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , them , is of the masculine gender , it must agree with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , disciples , being of the same gender : and not with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , all nations . but any school boy that hath but learned his greek grammar , can resolve thi● . now mr. williams had told him before , that he did not understand greek ; and so he made bold to vapour with it , when he was responding to him . but mr. leigh might have been so civil to have told the old gentleman his sense of it , and not ( in such a light manner ) to have referr'd him to a school-boy for his information . a school-boy knows ( if mr. leigh doth not ) that the rule in the greek grammar is as follows : relativum cum antecedente concordat genere , numero & personâ . and therefore must give it for mr. williams . but i will refer the reader to a better authority than a school-boy : the late reverend and learned minister of the gospel , mr. john gosnold , in his book entituled , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , pag. 24 who thus saith , the word them ( baptizing them ) hath no reference unto all nations , as is to be seen in the grammar of the text , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , them being of the masculine gender , but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , all nations , of the neuter . this them then must have reference to disciples , to such as are first taught : but mr. williams passes by this trivial flourish ; and proceeds to a new argument . if infants are incapable of denying themselves for christ , then they are incapable of being made disciples of christ : but infants are incapable of denying themselves for christ : therefore they are incapable of being made disciples of christ . mr. leigh denies the sequel of the major . mr. williams proves it thus . if a person cannot be his disciple unless he deny both relative self and personal self , then the sequel is true : but infants are not capable so to do : therefore the sequel is true . mr. leigh . this purely refers to grown persons ; and by the same argument you may say infants must not eat ; because it is said in another place , he that cannot work , must not eat . mr. williams . nay , sir , it is he that will not work , not he that cannot . it is he that is able and will not . for i hope you will provide for your parents , when by reason of age they are not able to work for themselves . mr. leigh . but this purely refers to grown persons , and i deny that believers only are disciples . mr. williams . i proved that thus : those that in matth. 28. are called disciples , are in mark 16. called believers : so that they are the same persons intended . hereupon mr. leigh not being able to give a direct answer , endeavours to shift off the force of those two texts , and his inference from them , by this evasion . mr. leigh . i would know whether infants are not as capable of believing in christ , as of coming to christ ? now they are said to come when their parents brought them . for christ says , suffer little children to come unto me : and it 's most probable they were brought in the arms to christ . why may they not be said to believe , when they do not actually believe ; if imputatively they are said to come when their parrents brought them ? so , why may not they be said to believe imputatively , when their parents devote them to jesus christ , although the children do not actually believe , but only the parents ? mr. williams . i deny the parents faith was ever imputed to the child . prove it if you can . mr. leigh . we talk of believers in foro ecclesiae and in foro dei with distinction . and under this notion , and no other do we account believers are so . and under this notion , i mean in foro ecclesiae , the parents faith may be imputed to their children . mr. williams . we say a person is not a disciple of christ , till he hath learned christ . we do not allow of any such imputation : and mr. leigh hath not offer'd any thing to prove it . dr. russel . it is time to come to some instance ; therefore to force you upon it , i argue thus : if the apostles of our lord did never baptize any infant , then the baptism of infants is not according to christ's commission : but the apostles of our lord did never baptize any infant : ergo , the baptism of infants is not according to christ's commission . mr. leigh . i deny your minor. dr. russel . i prove my minor thus . if there be any account that the apostles did ever baptize any infant , it is somewhere recorded in the writings of the new testament : but it is no where so recorded in those writings : ergo , there is not any account that the apostles did ever baptize any infant . mr. leigh . i deny your minor. dr. russel . i must now force you upon an instance by an universal negative . if there be any such account in those writings , mr. leigh , or some other person is able to shew it us : but neither mr. leigh nor any other person is able to do it : ergo , there is no such account there to be found . here mr. leigh , being wholly destitute of an instance ; to shift it off , he denies the sequel of the major . and saith , it doth not follow it must of necessity be written in the new testament . now although this was contrary to the rules of dispute ; yet dr. russel could not urge him to give any instance ; wherefore he argues upon him thus . dr. russel . if nothing else will do with you , i will prove the sequel of my major , according to your denial . if there be no other rule left to direct us how we are to worship god in this ordinance of baptism according to the gospel but what is contained in the writings of the new testament ; then it must of necessity follow , that it be therein written , if such an account be any where to be found : but there is no other rule left to direct us how we are to worship god in this ordinance of baptism according to the gospel , but what is contained in the writings of the new testament : ergo , it must of necessity follow , that it be therein written , if such an account be any where to be found . mr. leigh . i say it might be practised in those times , though not recorded in the new testament . dr. russel . will you grant that it is not recorded in the new testament ? mr. leigh . we will suppose it ; but not grant it . dr. russel . the reason why you suppose it , is because you cannot prove it : for you are not so free of your concessions . mr. leigh . it is not recorded in the new testament what you practise , that grown children of believers were baptized . i challenge you to give one instance of any one born of believing parents , baptized at age. dr. russel . i have called for one instance from scripture several times , of any one infant that was ever baptized , and you have not been able to produce it . this you now speak of , is besides the matter we are upon : and is used on purpose to divert us from our argument , and lead us to some thing else that is foreign to it . pray do you first shew us where it is so written in the new testament , that any one infant was baptized , if you can ; and then you shall hear what we have to say . mr. leigh . these men talk much of scripture , and call upon us to produce scripture for our baptizing of infants ; as if they had abundance of proof for their practice : now let them give but one instance of what is their practice ; namely , of one person that was born of a believer , and was baptized when he came to grown years ; and i will give them the cause . dr. russel . i will instance in constantine the great , whose mother helena was a christian , and yet he was not baptized till he was considerably in years . besides , i do not remember , that there is any account in history , during the first 500 years , that any one of the fathers , or eminent bishops of the church , that were born of christian parents , were baptized until they were about 20 or 30 years of age. and if any of you know the contrary , i desire you would shew it . mr. leigh . what do you tell us of the fathers ? we are not bound to abide by their testimony . dr. russel . this is the first time i have ever met with this answer from you paedobaptists , to tell us you disown the testimony of the fathers in the point of infant baptism . when you think the fathers are on your side , then we can hear enough of them ; but now you see they are against you , you will not abide by their testimony . you know i do not alledge it to prove the institution , but only matter of fact. but seeing you will not abide by their testimony , i shall leave it to be considered by the people ; for i am well satisfied there are some honourable persons here , know what i say to be true . mr. williams doth then proceed to a scripture instance ; and asks mr leigh this question . was not the mother of our lord a believer , when christ was born ? mr. leigh answers , what do you ask that question for ▪ every body knows that . mr. williams . but do you believe it ? mr. leigh . yes , i do believe it : what then ? mr. williams . then here is an instance for you from scripture , of the child of a believer , that was a believer before he was born ; and yet he was not baptized till he came to years . and this we can prove . upon this the people fell a laughing at mr. leigh , and his countenance changed pale ; and he was under some seeming consternation of mind , so that he could not presently recover himself ; but at last his spirits rallied again , and then he spake to this effect . mr. leigh . our discourse was grounded on the commission . now was this before the commission , or after it ? dr. russel . it is a mistake , mr. leigh , we were not now upon the commission , but upon your question . and i think mr. williams hath given you a pertinent answer , every way suitable to your question , and the challenge you made us : and you are bound to take it . upon this he made no reply ; but addressed himself to us after this manner . now if you please i will become opponent . our answer was , you may , if you think fit , we are contented . mr. leigh . then i argue thus . if infants are visible church-members , then they are to be baptized . but infants are visible church-members . ergo , they are to be baptized . dr. russel . this argument doth not include the point in question for you ought to put in these words , according to christ's commission . mr. leigh refused so to do . upon which dr. russel asked him this question . are you of mr. chandler's mind in this matter ? he says , that baptism is an initiating ordinance . mr. leigh answered , yes , i am . dr. russel . then make sense of your argument , if you can : for it will run thus . if infants are already visible members of the church , then they are to be baptized that they may be made so . it is as if i should say , that because such a man is in this house already , therefore there must some act pass upon him to bring him in , when he is actually in the house before . make sense of this , if you can . however , i will deny the minor ; and say they are not visible church-members before they are baptized . mr. chandler . if there be no precept or example in all the word of god , to warrant us to make any other initiating ordinance into the church but baptism , then visible church-members ought to be baptized . but there is no other initiating ordinance into the church besides baptism : ergo , visible church-members ought to be baptized . dr. russel . what , doth not mr. chandler know the difference between the major and minor ? i deny the minor , and his argument is to prove the sequel of the major ; which i had confute● before . but if this be true that mr. chandler says , it is a full answer to mr. leigh's minor : for then it runs thus ; if there be no other way to bring persons into the visible church but by baptism then they were not visible church-members before they were baptized . which is directly opposite to what mr. leigh hath affirmed . mr. robinson . this argument was brought to prove that visible church-members are to be admitted to baptism . mr. williams . i deny that infants are visible church-member in their infancy . mr. leigh . i will prove that some are so , from matth. 19. 14. suffer the little children , and forbid them not to come unto me : for of such is the kingdom of heaven . dr. russel . do you bring this to prove that these children were baptized ? mr. leigh . no , i do not pretend to any such thing . dr. russel . what then do you bring it for ? mr. leigh . i bring it to prove that infants are visible church-members . dr. russel . if you had brought it to prove that infants had a right to the kingdom of glory , i should have thought you had brought it to a better purpose , and more agreeable to the scope of the place . mr. leigh . i argue thus upon it . those that belong to the kingdom of heaven , that is , the visible church of christ , are visible church-members : but the kingdom of heaven , that is , the visible church of christ , is in part made up of little children : ergo , little children are visible church-members . dr. russel . i might here object against the form of your argument : but to pass that by , i do deny your minor. mr. leigh . i shall prove my minor , by an induction of particulars . there are divers acceptations of the kingdom of heaven in scripture . as , 1. it signifies the laws and promises of the kingdom . 2. the graces of the kingdom , whereby we are enabled to observe those laws . and thus it is set forth by a grain of mustard-seed , by leaven , and the like . 3. it sometimes signifies jesus christ his management of his subjects on earth . 4. and sometimes it signifies the happiness of the saints in glory . 5. and many times it is taken for the visible church militant . and in no other sense but this last , can it be taken in this scripture to make good sense of it ; which i shall prove by an argument of induction . if it be nonsense to say , of such is the laws and promises of the kingdom ; if it be nonsense to say , of such is the graces of the kingdom , if it be nonsense to say , of such is christ's management of his subjects on earth ; if it be nonsense to say , of such is the happiness of the saints in glory ; and it be good sense to say . of such is the visible church ; then the visible church is in part made up of little children : but it is nonsence to apply it to all the other , and it is good sense to say , of such to the visible church : ergo , the visible church is in part made up of little children . dr. russel . there is so much nonsense in this argument . i know not well how to make sense of it : it seems to me little to the purpose . but however , i will deny your minor , and say , it is good sense to say , that little children belong to the kingdom of glory . i pray observe ( by the way ) what sort of subjects mr. leigh ' s church must consist of ; if they have no interest in the graces of the kingdom , nor yet in the glory of the kingdom . mr. leigh . i say it's nonsense to understand it otherwise . and upon this he desired , that all those who were satisfied with what he had said should hold up their hands . and of that great multitude , there was but a very few that did it : so that it was manifest they were not satisfied with what he had said . mr. williams . is it nonsense then to say , that any infants belong to the kingdom of glory ? mr. leigh . yes , while they are in their infant state ; for when arrived to glory , they are perfect as grown men , whatever they were on earth . otherwise we must say that there are infants of two foot long , poor , weak , ignorant things in glory : therefore it must be thus taken , for we must make good sense of scripture . mr. williams . i deny you minor , and shall form an opposite argument thus : if infants are neither members of the universal visible church , nor yet of a particular constituted church , then they are not members of the visible church at all : but they are neither members of the universal visible church , nor yet of a particular constituted church : therefore they are not members of the visible church at all . mr. leigh took no notice of this argument , but said , it did not belong to a respondent to form an argument . to which mr. williams reply'd , my work is to clear the truth ; i will not be ty'd up to your rules of disputation . mr. robinson required an express prohibition of infants church membership . mr. williams reply'd , that is fine indeed ; pray give us an express prohibition of baptizing with cream , and spittle , and salt , and oyl ; and the use of the cross in baptism : ( all which you reject ) and of many things more that might be brought into the worship of god. and to this no reply was made . mr. leigh insisting again upon his argument for excluding infants out of the kingdom of heaven , from matth. 19. affirming , that from thence it was nonsense to say , they were the subjects of glory . mr. williams said , we must distinguish between a title to glory , and the actual enjoyment of glory . elect infants have a title to glory , by virtue of the righteousness of christ imputed unto them ; although they are not actually in it . in the next place mr. williams denied the major , and proved to him from matth ●3 7. that church-membership could not be the ground of baptism ; because those many pharisees and others , that came and offer'd themselves to john for baptism , were church-members : and yet john denied to admit them to baptism . here mr. leigh distinguished between church-members de jure , and such that were only so de facto . mr. williams asked him , whether he did own them to be church-members de facto . his answer was , he did . then mr. williams told him church-membership could not be the ground of baptism . mr. leigh said , they were not so de jure , because they were a generation of vipers , and therefore ought by the law to have been cast out . but when mr. williams did desire him to tell him where that law was written , he could not produce it . upon this dr. russel asked mr. leigh , what relation this argument of his had to the commission ? for he did not know that they were obliged to follow them any longer in answering such impertinencies , that were not at all included in the question . and therefore desired him to produce some argument that was more consonant to the point in question , for this was foreign to it . for we have granted you more than you seem willing to desire , in favour of infants ; namely , that they have a title both to grace here , and glory hereafter , through the merits of christ and his righteousness imputed to them . and yet we cannot allow that they are the subjects of baptism , according to christ's commission ; or , a part of the visible church . nevertheless we have very charitable thoughts towards them , because we believe their salvation is secured to them another way . mr. leigh then proceeds to another argument : if infants are disciples , then they have a right to baptism according to the commission : but infants are disciples : ergo , they have a right to baptism according to the commission . mr. williams denied the minor. in defence of which , they argued from acts 15. 10. after this manner . if those upon whom the yoke of circumcision was imposed after the manner of moses , were called disciples , and the manner of moses was to circumcise infants ; then infants are called disciples . but those upon whom the yoke of circumcision was imposed after the manner of moses , were called disciples , and the manner of moses was to circumcise infants : ergo , infants are called disciples . dr. russel . i both distinguish upon your major , and deny the consequence thereof . for i hope you understand a difference betwixt the manner of performing an action , and the subjects upon whom it is performed . the manner of moses is the thing here spoken of ; which was to cut off the foreskin of the flesh with a knife , a sharp stone , or the like instrument : and this was sometimes practised upon grown persons , and sometimes upon infants . as touching infants , they are neither expressed , nor intended in the scripture you have alledged . for they are called brethren , believing gentiles , such that had an epistle sent to them , and when they heard it read , they rejoyced at the consolation , were establish'd in the faith , and are called churches : which your selves know ( in those times ) consisted of adult persons , multitudes both of men and women . but not of one infant that we read of among them . and indeed , none of those forementioned characters can agree to little infants . mr. leigh . i grant the manner is there spoken of , and the subjects brought in afterwards . but would not the people conclude that infants were intended , if i tell them it must be done after the manner of moses ? dr. russel . it 's no matter what those people conclude , that know not how to distinguish between the subjects , and the manner . but those of whom this was spoken , knew right well , that the false teachers imposed it upon the gentiles that did believe : and they are the subjects here spoken of . mr. leigh . i would form this argument . if those are called disciples who are advised by judaizing christians to be circumcised after the manner of moses , then infants are called disciples : but they are called disciples that are advised so to be circumcised : ergo , infants are called disciples . dr. russel denies the consequence of the major , for it doth not follow that because adult believers who are the subjects there spoken of ( as is already proved ) are call'd disciples ; that therefore infants , who are neither expressed , nor intended , must be so call'd . for mr. leigh hath allowed the distinction betwixt the subjects , and the manner . mr. leigh . read the first verse , and you will find , that there came men from judea , that taught the gentile church that believed , that unless they were circumcised after the manner of moses , they could not be saved , &c. it was the yoke of circumcision here intended . whereupon mr. williams did deny , that barely circumcision was that intolerable yoke , which neither they nor their fathers were able to bear , that is there spoken of by peter . for circumcision , barely considered , children of eight days old were able to bear it , and did bear it . but circumcision , as it obliged to the law in point of justification , was that intolerable yoke , which neither they , nor their fathers were able to bear . for the apostle tells the galatians , that if they were circumcised , christ should profit them nothing ; and that they were bound to keep the whole law. now , altho' circumcision , barely considered , might be imposed on infants ; yet the false doctrine in which that intolerable yoke did consist , together with circumcision , could not be imposed on children . besides , that circumcision , after the manner of moses , did not respect the subjects , but the form. it was the brethren that were the subjects the false teachers would have had to have been circumcised after the manner of moses ; amongst which , children could not be numbred . for , 1st . they were such brethren that had received the holy ghost . 2dly . they had purified their hearts by faith. 3dly . they were such that from among the gentiles were turned to god. then they went off also from this , and said . infants are part of a nation , and therefore might be baptized . mr. williams replied , though children are part of a nation ; yet not of a nation modify'd according to christ's commission . whereupon their moderator said , he thought mr. williams had but little academical learning . mr. williams replied , he was warned by the word , to have a care of vain philosophy . and presently demanded , what was the antecedent to the relative them , in the commission . the moderator making no answer , mr. williams said , it was all nations discipled . and upon this , dr. russel , and mr. williams did both desire them to produce one instance for infant baptism , out of the word of god. and this they did very many times desire of them , but no instance was produced . at length mr. williams desired them , in these words : brethren , i would beg you to produce one instance for infants ●aptism ; it will reflect upon you if you do not . what will all this people say , when they are gone ? so many times one instance desired : so many ministers here , and not one instance produced : they must needs conclude there was not one to be produced . notwithstanding this , the ministers were all silent ; and not a man did reply to it . then mr. leigh said , we might take up the opponency again if we pleased . thus ended their so much boasted of opponency , in that vain-glorious advertisement , published in the post-man , the saturday morning after the dispute , ( either by one of themselves , or of their unthinking admirers ) before dr. russel could return to london , altho' he set forth from portsmouth the next morning after the dispute ; his pressing occasions necessitating him thereto . dr. russel did then , at mr. leigh's request , reassume the opponency , of which mr. leigh seemed to be sick , and was willing to get rid of it . which was a sign they had no mind to inform the people of the grounds upon which they keep up the practice of infants baptism ; when they had so fair an opportunity put into their hands to do it , and made no better improvement of it . but having no scripture proof for it , they were not willing to let so great an auditory know the true cause why they continue such a scriptureless practice ; to say no worse of it . dr. russel . i will therefore prove , that no infants are to be baptized by virtue of christ's commission . if 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hath no other antecedent agreeing therewith but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , then none are to be baptized but such as are first made disciples by the ministry of men , which infants are not capable of . but the antecedent is true ; as is also the consequence ; and therefore no infants are to be baptized . mr. leigh . i deny that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hath no other antecedent but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . dr. russel . if there be another , pray assign it . mr. leigh . i say it is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , all nations . dr. russel . that cannot possibly be ; because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , them , is of the masculine gender , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , all nations , is of the neuter gender . but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , them , doth very well agree with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , disciples , they being both of the masculine gender . to this they gave no solid answer , worthy of noting down , according to my remembrance , or the notaries observation . dr. russel having observed what evasive answers they had given to his own and mr. williams's arguments , was resolved to force them to a direct answer ( if possible ) by retorting their own allegation upon themselves , that they might see the absurdity of it : and this put them into a flame , and great confusion . the argument was this : if infants are capable to be made disciples of christ by the ministry of men , without the use of reason , then the beasts of the field are also capable : but the beasts of the field are not capable : therefore infants are not capable . upon this there was a great disorder among them , and a person in the company cried out , he speaks blasphemy . but one of the ministers that sat by him was so just , as to satisfie him to the contrary ; for which he deserves thanks . but mr. robinson , their moderator , stood up , and threw himself about , making a noise like one in a delirious paroxysm ; and bid the people take notice , that dr. russel had ranked their infants among the brute beasts ; and that if they became of his opinion , they must look upon them as dogs , or cats , or hogs , &c. with much more of the same sort of rhetorick ; endeavouring all he could to enrage the multitude of unthinking persons against him , and put the people into a confusion . upon this mr. sharp , the baptist moderator , stood up , and said , gentlemen hold ! what is to do now ? what , doth colonel self ride lord general in the town of portsmouth to day ? what is the reason of this ? dr. russel . hold , mr. robinson . must i be thus misrepresented to the people , because i say ( that which you all know to be true ) that infants want the use of reason ? i hope you will be quiet a little time , and give me leave to make my defence to the people against your clamorous expressions . i am now put upon a necessity to tell this assembly ( of honourable persons , and others ) what my thoughts are concerning the state of mankind in general , and of little infants in particular . i believe that man , as he came out of the hands of god , was a noble creature , the top perfection of all his creation here below and was substituted lord of this lower world ; was endowed with the image of his maker , both natural and divine . but by his sin he lost the divine image , and brought himself thereby under the curse , and into a state of condemnation , in which his posterity were also involved . but it pleased god , of his infinite mercy , not to leave him in that miserable estate , as he had left the fallen angels . but christ interposed between justice and the sinner , the promise being made before the sentence was pronounced , gen. 3. 15. that the seed of the woman should bruise the serpents head . and this promised seed hath ( through the grace of god ) opened a door of mercy for little infants , who never sinned in their own persons ; as well as for others . and you know , gentlemen , i have already told you how great an esteem i have for your little infants ; that i will rather believe that all infants dying in their infancy are elected , than i will conclude that any one of them are damn'd : and this is more than i could persuade our opposites to confess , although they were urged upon it . so that ( for ought yet appears ) we have a greater esteem for your tender babes than these gentlemen have , notwithstanding mr. robinson's unreasonable clamour against me . and having thus apologized for my self , i do now expect an answer to my argument . mr. robinson what a strange thing is this , to talk of baptizing the beasts of the field ! who ever did so ? dr. russel . i am so far from talking of baptizing the beasts of the field , that my argument is rather to prove the direct contrary . and whereas you affirm that infants have a capacity to be made disciples of christ by the ministry of men ( or else you have been saying nothing to the purpose all this tim● about it ) i bring this to shew you the absurdity of such a no ▪ tion : and you are bound to shew the disparity , or confes● you cannot . sirs , i would put this case to you . suppose there were twenty or thirty new born infants in a room , and you should chuse out the most able and learned person among you to preach to them , in order to make them disciples according to christ's commission ; i believe he would have no better success than st. anthony had ( as the story goes ) when he took upon him to instruct the pigs ; or , as some others have don● ( even popish saints ) who have took upon them to preach 〈◊〉 the fowls of the air , &c. of which i could furnish you with divers instances . but why should mr. robinson think it strange that any body should have such a conceit in their minds ? doth he not know that the church of rome baptize things of an inferiour nature ? for they baptize churches and bells . and if i had compared your practice to theirs of baptizing belle , you had had no reason to complain , for they are both passive in the act ; only if you will give credit to one of the fathers ( viz. augustine ) the bells are upon that account the fittest subjects , for they are wholly passive : but ( saith he ) the little children are not so ; for they shew their resistance by their crying . and now i demand of any of you to take off the retortion , and shew the disparity if you can . upon this they were all silent , and none of them would undertake to shew the disparity : and till they do it , my retortion will remain upon them . then mr. leigh said , it is time to proceed to the other question . dr. russel . i will now enter upon it . the second question is this : whether the ordinance of baptism , as appointed by christ is to be administred by dipping , plunging , ( or ) overwhelming only , and not otherwise ? i take the question in the affirmative , and my first argument is this . arg. 1. the holy scripture shews us the right way of baptizing , as appointed by christ : but it doth not shew us that it ought to be done by sprinkling : ergo , sprinkling is not the right way of baptizing . mr. leigh . sir , you must bring in that dipping is absolutely necessary ( as in the question ) what do you talk of sprinkling for ? dr. russel . sir , i know not of any other way that is practised by you ; nor , i suppose , any of these people : i conclude they have often seen you sprinkle infants ; and mr. chandler hath particularly recommended it in his preaching , as the best way of baptizing : and i hope you are not asham'd of your practice . but if you will disown sprinkling to be the right way of baptizing , i am contented ; i will not then insist upon it . mr. robinson . we are not discoursing of that now ; you are to prove dipping to be the only way ; and you must and shall prove it . dr. russel . must and shall ! must and shall is for the king , and not for mr. robinson . mr. leigh . but we will not admit of this argument , because it hath not the word only in it . you are to prove that your way is the only right way of baptizing . dr. russel . mr. leigh was pleased to make use of an argument of induction , upon the question about the subjects : and why may not i use the same liberty about the manner , and prove it by arguments of inductions ? upon this some of them fell a laughing , and mr. chandler thus exprest himself ; your induction is an induction like the man's covey of partridges . mr. williams ask'd him how many there was in the covey ? mr. chandler said , why there was but one . mr. williams replied , but there was more a hatching . dr. russel . what is the reason of all this ? i tell you i will make it good by arguments of induction : and if you do not understand my meaning , i will inform you ; and shew that it is a good way of arguing , and will answer the end i bring it for . for. i will first argue off your way of sprinkling ; and after that , if you shall assign a third way , that is neither practised by you nor us , i will then argue that off also : and then ( i hope ) i shall fully prove what i design by it ; namely , that ours is the only right way of baptizing . upon this they readily discerned they should be forced to give an instance from scripture for their practice of sprinkling , which they were conscious to themselves they were not able to do ; and therefore utterly refused to answer the argument . dr. russel . if this argument will not be admitted , i will proceed to another . that way which doth not signify that which ought to be represented in baptism , according to christ's appointment , is not the right way of baptizing . but this your pretended way doth not do : ergo , it is not the right way of baptizing . and this i shall make good by the following syllogism . if that baptism which was appointed by christ doth properly represent his burial and resurrection , and ours by him , then it must be done not by sprinkling , but by dipping , plunging , or overwhelming the person baptized into water : but that baptism which was appointed by christ doth properly represent his burial and resurrection , and ours by him : ergo , it must be done not by sprinkling , but by dipping , plunging , or overwhelming the person baptized into water . mr. chandler . i deny the consequence of the major ; that it properly sets forth a burial and a resurrection . it is not for this reason the only way ; and i deny that this way doth only set forth a burial and a resurrection . dr. russel . then i will prove , 1. that it doth truly represent a burial and a resurrection . and , 2. that it is the only right way of practising this ordinance . 1. that it doth represent a burial and a resurrection , i prove from rom. 6. and coloss . 2. in rom. 6. 4. therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death , that like as christ was raised up , &c. coloss . 2. 12. buried with him in baptism , wherein also ye are risen with him , &c. this cannot be understood literally ; for so they were not , could not be buried with him in his sepulchre , neither can we , but the apostle resolves us how this was done , and how they were , and we may , be buried with him , and also rise with him ; and that is by baptism . buried with him in baptism , wherein also ye are risen with him . therefore baptism is to be performed in such a way that represents a burial and a resurrection : which is most aptly represented by dipping , plunging , or overwhelming the person baptized , into the water , and raising him up again out of it . 2. that this is the only right way of performing this ordinance , i prove thus : if there were no other way practised by john the baptist , christ , nor his apostles , but what did represent a burial and a resurrection , then ours is the only right way of baptizing . but there was no other way practised by john the baptist , christ , nor his apostles , but what did represent a burial and a resurrection : ergo , ours is the only right way of baptizing . mr. chandler . you are to prove , that because baptism is significant of a burial and resurrection , therefore it must be done only by dipping . dr. russel . by this mr. chandler grants that baptism doth signifie a burial and resurrection ; and i have already proved that therefore it is the only right way of baptizing that we practise , because there was no other practised in those first times of the gospel . and till he give an instance to the contrary , my proof stands good . but i shall farther prove it by this argument . if there can no instance be given that ever the apostles did baptize other ways than by dipping , then ours is the right way of baptizing . but there 〈◊〉 be no instance given , that ever the apostles did baptize other ways than by dipping : ergo , ours is the right way of baptizing . mr. leigh . i deny the enumeration in your argument : for it doth not follow , that because the apostles did not practise it any other way , that there were no others that did . for there were divers other ministers in those times , besides the apostles , that did also baptize . dr. russel . by this you grant that the apostles of our lord did not practise baptism any other way than by dipping . and to prove that no others did use a different practice , i thus argue . if we have no account in holy scripture , that either the apostles , or any other ministers in those times , did baptize any one person other ways than by dipping , then dipping is the only right way of baptizing . but we have no account in holy scripture , that either the apostles , or any other ministers in those times , did baptize any one person other ways than by dipping : ergo , dipping is the only right way of baptizing . mr. chandler . i can shew there is another way that it might be done , and not by dipping ; and that from the etymology of the word baptizo , for it signifies also to wash . dr. russel . i remember what alstedius saith in his lexicon theologicum . having before been speaking about the etymology of that word ; 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 tantum significat immergere , non lavare , nisi ex consequenti : and therefore it signifies to wash only in a secondary and remote sense , because things that are dip'd , may be said to be wash'd . but the proper and primary signification of baptizo is , to dip ; for it comes from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , mergo , immergo , to dip , to plunge , to overwhelm , to dip into , &c. mr. chandler . i own that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies mergo , immergo . but i can shew great probability , that many , in scripture times , were baptized by pouring a little water on the face : and there is no certainty that dipping was ever used . dr. russel . how doth that appear ? mr. leigh we will argue on a probability . it might be done other ways than by dipping ; and a probability is the most you can pretend to for dipping . i require you to prove that dipping was certainly intended in those places you bring for it ; and then i will prove , that dipping was not intended , but only an application of water to the person . dr. russel . the first instance i shall give is the baptism of our saviour , as it is exprest in mark 1. 9. jesus came from nazareth of galilce , and was baptized of john in jordan . the words are , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which words do certainly signifie , that he was dipped into ●●rdan . mr. leigh . the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies in , as well as into , and is often so translated in the new testament . dr. russel . that it may sometimes so signify where the scope of the place may shew it , i will not contend . but you know very well , that where it is joined with an accusative ( as it is here ) it signifies into . and i can shew that our translators have so rendred it in many places in the new testament . and it would many times be nonsence to understand it otherwise . i will give you some instances of it , in the room of many that might be given . as in john 3. 17. god sent not his son into the world to condemn the world ; but that the world through him might be saved . here 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is rendred into : for the words in the greek are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; and i hope you will not deny that god sent christ into the world. and in 1 tim. 1. 15. christ jesus came into the world to save sinners , &c. there 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is also translated into . and i hope you will not deny , that christ came into the world to save sinners . it 's joined with the same words as in john 3. 17. before recited . and in luke 4. 16. it 's said , he went into the synagogue on the sabbath-day , and stood up for to read . here again it is so rendred ; for the words are , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , into the synagogue , and the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastned on him , ver . 20. which could not have been , had he not gone into the synagogue ; as it 's manifest he did . and i hope you will not deny that christ went into the synagogue : but you may do it with as much colour of reason , as to say he was not dip'd , or plunged of john into the river of jordan . when the same word is used in the same sense . and besides if we do but consider those multitudes that john baptized in the river of jordan , and other places where there was much water ; we have no reason to doubt of the truth thereof . mr. leigh . we allow , that what cannot be now used without being burdensome . might be more commodious in that day , and observed in that hot country of judaea , when there was so many came to john to be baptized : and therefore it may be that they went out to rivers . but i will argue upon a probability . it is well known , in those hot countries the people wore sandals : and they might go into the water a little way to wash their feet . now i offer this fair interpretation : they might step a little way into jordan for ease and refreshment , and then john might pour a little water on them . now allow ●ut the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to signifie to wash , as we can easily pr●●e it is often so taken in scripture ; and i offer to all the company , whether this be not a fair interpretation of the place , that john washed him with water , he going a little way into jordan dr. russel . notwithstanding this flourish of a pretended probability , you know that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doth properly signifie to dip , as all the great lexicographers and criticks do tell us ; and that its proper and native signification is to dip into water , or to plunge under water : and that i could give you many instances of , out of scapula , stephanus , schrevelius , and many others . and they also tell us , that if it be used for washing , it is in a remote sense : and if it be taken in its primary sense , it 's such a washing as is by dipping , or plunging into the water , and being covered therewith . but that you may see i am not singular in my opinion , i will shew you that your own expositors do thus render it , and some of the greatest men among the protestants that ever wrote since the reformation : of which i have made a collection out of their own works , because i would not wrong them . i shall begin with the testimony of those learned and judicious divines of your own perswasion , who were those that continued mr. peol's annotations upon matth. 3. 6. these are their own words , were baptized , that is , dipped in jordan . upon john 3. 22 , 23. there john was baptizing , because this aenon was a brook or river that had much water . it is from this apparent , that both christ and john baptized by dipping the body in the water ; else they need not have sought places where had been a great plenty of water . before dr. russel had read this last sentence wholly out , the presbyterian ministers , even mr. leigh himself , as well as the rest of them , fell a hissing so loud , and set others of their party to make a noise also by their ill example , that altho dr. russel went on with his work , yet the noise was so great , that it wholly drowned his voice , that he could not be heard . whereupon mr. sharp , the moderator , call'd out aloud to still this great noise , and spoke to this effect : what is the reason of this hissing ? gentlemen , are you not asham'd ? you preach to others the doctrine of sanctification and self-denial , and to act thus your selves , i am asham'd to see it . i pray , good people , take no notice of it now . when dr. russel perceived they would not forbear this hissing and uncivil carriage , he forbore to read any farther . and when silence was obtained , he addressed himself to the ministers after this manner : sirs , what is the matter with you ? must i n●● be permitted to recite your own authors , and some of the gre●test men that have written since the reformation ? although their testimony against us is of little value , because they are parties in the controversie ; yet when the clear evidence of truth shall enforce a confession from their pens that we are in the right , it is then a great testimony for us . here is first of all pool's annotators , certain learned and judicious divines , that say in that matter as we do : and they are men of your own party . there is also dr. hammond saith the same . here the doctor was interrupted again , and they cried out , what do you tell us of dr. hammond ? what have we to do with dr. hammond ? dr. russel . why certainly , gentlemen , dr. hammond is not thus to be despised upon his judgment about a greek word . i have also mr. baxter , wollebius , tilenus , the learned perkins , and luther also , who was against sprinkling , and practised dipping ; and so did the rest of the divines at wistenburgh . mr. calvin also , although he did allow a liberty of sprinkling in cold climates , yet he saith as i do as to the signification of the word baptiz● , that it signifies to dip , and was so used in the primitive church . there is also the dutch translators , they do every where render the words that are used to express this ordinance by , as we do ; and they call john the baptist , joannes de dooper , john the dipper . and i know not of any place but it 's so exprest . and these are presbyterians , men of your own religion . upon this , one of the ministers said , what! do you understand dutch ? dr. russel said , yes , he understood it , but he could not speak it readily . they replied , we will try that ; for we have a gentleman here that understands dutch very well . dr. russel . you may ask that gentleman if you think fit : he can satisfie you , that what i say is true . but they had 〈◊〉 discretion than to call the gentleman out to confute themselves . dr. russel i have also the testimony of the dutch annotators , who say the same thing . and these also are men of your own persuasion . and , to add no more , i have also the testimony of the assembly of divines , sitting at westminster : and i hope they may be of some credit with you . but they would not suffer him to proceed in the reading thereof to the people ; but cried out , we are protestants , and will not pin our faith on other mens sleeves . dr. russel . what! not the assembly of divines ? i thought , though you had no regard to my words , you might have had some regard to the assembly of divines . you know i do not wrong these authors : and therefore what must the people think of you , to oppose your selves thus against these great men , and such multitudes of them , that are of your own persuasion ( as many of them are ) and the rest , some of the greatest men since the reformation . surely the people cannot take it kindly at your hands , to reject the authority of these men in a matter of this nature . their answer was , we do reverence these divines , but adhere to what they say no farther than it agrees with the word of god. dr. russel . we say , that in this particular , what they have written doth agree with the word of god. mr. leigh . you have recourse to the prime signification of the word , whereas we must take it according to its acceptation in scripture . and i offer it to the consideration of the learned , whether the prime signification of the word be a sufficient argument in this case ? and here he makes his rhetorical excursions about a mathematician , an angel , a foot-boy that carries a letter , a physician , &c. and concludes thus , but we must go to the scripture acceptation of the word . and i challenge you to bring one place of scripture where it must be understood that it was done by dipping . dr. russel . it is very well , mr. leigh will allow that i have given the people the proper meaning of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and that its prime signification is to dip. now he might have spared all the rest that he hath said ; for we do not lay the stress only upon the etymology of the word , but also upon the concurrent testimonies of holy scripture , that it was so understood and so practised by john the baptist , christ , and his apostles , and so represented by the metaphors made use of ( as a burial and a resurrection ) to set it forth by : as also their choosing places where there was much water to baptize in , as i have already shewed , so far as they would permit me ; and should have made it manifest beyond exception , if i might have been heard . but to answer your demand , i alledge acts 8. 38 , 39. and they went both down into the water , both philip and the eunuch , and by baptized him . and when they were come up out of the water , &c. here we have an account , that both the administrator , and the person to be baptized , went both down into the water : and when they came there , he baptized him . and if philip had not been to put the eunuch into the water , and cover him with it , why should they go down both into the water ? a little of it might have been brought up to them into the chariot , if sprinkling would have served the turn . but it appears manifestly , that nothing less would serve for to answer the commission , but to dip the person baptized into the water , otherwise they did that which was wholly needless , and besides the rule that was given them to practise by . and their coming up again out of the water , doth evidently shew that he was plunged into it , and overwhelm'd with it . mr. leigh replied , that the greek word signified to go down to , and come up from the water . mr. williams replied , that there was two differing words ( as he had been informed ) in the greek text ; as there are two different words in the translation . for it is said , as they went on their way , they came unto a certain water : this was before he proposed for baptism . but when a grant was given him that he might be baptized , it is then said , they went down both of them into the water , and philip baptized him there . now as they are different words in the translation , coming unto , and going down into , even so they are differing words in the greek . dr. russel said , they were two different words ; to which mr. leigh concessed . but after the meeting was over , mr. williams the presbyterian minister , in whose meeting place the dispute was , told mr. williams the baptist disputant , he was in the right , and that they were two differing words in the greek ; one for coming unto , the other for going down into . dr. russel . i then farther argue : if the spirit of god doth never use the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 where the ordinance of baptism is mentioned , but al●ays expresses it by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; then it was performed by dipping , plunging , or overwhelming only : but the spirit of god doth never use the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 where the ordinance of baptism is mentioned , but always expresses it by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; ergo. it was performed by dipping , plunging , or overwhelming only . mr. chandler . i deny the sequel of the major ; because the word doth sometimes signify a washing that is short of dipping . dr. russel . you must then assign your instance . mr. chandler you must know that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 comes from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 tabal . and i will shew that it denotes such a washing as is short of dipping . and in dan. 4. 33. where it is said of nebuchadnezzar , his body was wet with the dew of heaven ; the septuagint render it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : so that it cannot be understood in your sense . dr. russel . that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is used in the stead of tabal , is true . but how do you know that the word was so rendred by the septuagint ? mr. chandler . it is so in that translation that goes in their name . dr. russel . that i deny ; for the word there is ebaphe , and not baptizo . but do you not know what weemes saith in his christian synagogue , that the septuagint translation was burnt , and only some fragments of it remaining , which was made up by others : so that neither you nor i know when we read the septuagint , and when we read other men . but what doth all this signify ? that is but a translation , and i think ours to be much better than that , if it were as you say ; and more agreeable to the scope of the place , to say his body was wet with the dew of heaven , than to say it was dipt with the dew of heaven . but i pray let mr. chandler tell us how it is in the hebrew , which is the language in which it was written . mr. chandler . the word in the hebrew is tabal . dr. russel . that i deny . whereupon an hebrew bible was produced , and handed up to dr. russel . and the book of daniel not being placed in its right order , as in other hebrew bibles , he did not readily find it ; whereupon they cried out , they believ'd he could not read it . the dr. answered , he could read hebrew before mr. chandler was born : and as a demonstration of it , he read a verse or two in the beginning thereof . upon this mr. robinson took the book , and with some difficulty found out the book of daniel and then gave it to dr. russel again , who read the place by them directed to , and told mr. chandler that the word tabal was not there . and then , after all this needless trouble , mr. chandler did confess that it was not : and so all his pretention from thence vanished into smoak . mr. chandler also urged for another instance , to prove that tabal signified a washing less than that by dipping , 2 kings 5. 10 , 14. go and wash in jordan , and be clean . and in verse 14. h● dipped himself in jordan . now this must signifie a washing short of dipping ; because though tabal doth express the act done in ver. 14. yet the command is given by rachatz , which signifies to wash . dr. russel . i do allow that the command is ●xprest by rachatz , and also that it sometimes is used , as we● as cabas , to signifie less than dipping when it is applied to some particular things , or parts of things , which are to be cleansed from filth ; as you know 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the greek is to wash the hands . but where rachatz in the hebrew is used in the sence as it 's here exprest , namely , to wash himself ; it 's always to be understood of such a washing as is by dipping . the jews understood it so , and naaman the syrian understood the prophet in that sence ; for it 's said he dipped himself in jordan seven times . and that he was not mistaken about it , is evident ; for that the spirit of god hath left it upon record , that what he did was according to the saying of the man of god : so that the prophet did not intend by rachatz any other washing than what is performed by dipping of the person so washed into the water . and had this been a derivative , there might have been some doubt raised about it ; but seeing tabal is the root it self , it can signify nothing less than what is the known sence thereof , viz. he dipped . he dipped himself in jordan seven times , according to the saying of the man of god. thus i have cleared this text from your objection , as not intending any such thing as you have brought it for , but the direct contrary . then mr. chandler said , we challenge you to prove , by scripture , that the word baptizo signifies to dip , and that that is intended by baptism . dr. russel . i will prove it from all the places where the ordinance of baptism is spoken of , if you will let me prove it from the greek . mr. chandler . no , you shall prove it from our translation , that it 's there any where so rendred ; but you shall not do it from any of those places where the ordinance of baptism is spoken of . dr. russel . that is unreasonable , that when the use of a word is enquired into , and what was the practice of the first ministers , pursuant to that word by which they are commanded to baptize ; for all those scriptures where it is so mentioned to be excluded out of our enquiry . mr. chandler . i will not allow you to prove it from any of those places where the ordinance of baptism is either exprest or intended . dr. russel . if nothing else will do with you , i will then undertake to prove from divers places in scripture , that either bapto , or its derivatives , is so rendred in our english translation . the first scripture i shall instance in , is , revel . 19. 1● . he was cloathed with a vesture dipt in blood. mr. chandler . this is not bapto . dr. russel . no more is baptizo , baptismos , baptisma , &c. but they are all derivatives from it ; and so is the word that is here used . and this mr. chandler did not deny . dr. russel did then urge the several places in the evangelists about judas dipping with christ in the dish ; as , matt. 26. 23. he that dippeth . mark 14. 20. john 13. 26. when i have dipped it . and when he had dipped , &c. now in all these places you see it 's thus rendred , and the ordinance of baptism not in the least intended . moreover , i will give you one instance more , in which the most minute action imaginable is intended , and yet so much as was put into the water is said to be dipt . luke 16. 24. where the rich man being in hell , desired father abraham to send lazarus , that he might dip the tip of his finger in water , to cool his tongue , &c. by this it appears , that our translators did thus understand the word to intend dipping ; and have never rendred it to sprinkle in all the new testament . i would only add , that when learned men come to have but the same wisdom as the jewish rabbies have , to reduce all doubtful words to their roots and theme from whence they are derived , then much of our present disputes will issue in the knowledge of the truth ; and we shall cease to strive about words to no profit , but to the subverting of the hearers . upon this followed a confused jangling and noise , so that the amanuensis could not take it down , neither did he think it worth the taking . but mr. williams , the presbyterian minister , said , he thought there had been little said to the purpose . upon this dr. russel said , mr. williams , i think there hath been a great deal said more than hath been answered : but if you are not satisfied , we will wave all that hath been said , and i will dispute it over with you de novo . mr. williams shrugged , and answered no ; i am not very well . although he had not been engaged at all in the dispute himself , and the doctor had been fatigued by so long a disputation , yet mr. williams refused to accept his offer . it was at last thought meet by them to put an issue to the disputation . and mr leigh ( after he had made a speech to thank the governour and the mayor for their civility towards them , and the baptists had returned their thanks also ) he then concluded in prayer ; and so dismist the assembly . it was between the hours of six and seven of the clock when the dispute ended . i do now think it proper to give you an account of those learned mens testimonies to justifie our practice of dipping , which dr. russel was then prevented to recite , by reason of the ministers hissing , and the noise and clamour of their party , that would not suffer him to be heard . pool's annotations . matt. 3. 6 were baptized : that is , dipped in jordan . matt. 28. 19. it 's true , the first baptisms of which we read in holy writ , were by dipping of the persons baptized . where it may be we judge it reasonable , and most resembling our burial with christ by baptism into death . john 3. 22 , 23. there john was baptizing , because this aenon was a brook or river that had much water . it is from this apparent , that both christ and john baptized by dipping the body in the water ; else they need not have sought places where had been a great plenty of water . acts 8. 38. in hot countries this was usual , to baptize by dipping the body in the water . rom. 6. 4. he seems here to allude to the manner of baptizing in those warm eastern countries , which was to dip or plunge the party baptized ; and , as it were , to bury him for a while under water . dr. hammond's annotations . matth. 3. john put the persons whom he baptized into the water , dipped them all over , and so took them out again . and in his paraphrase on mark 1. 5. and john's baptism was done in jordan , a river convenient for that purpose . the learned perkins . rom. 6. the ancient custom of baptizing was to dip , and as it were to dive all the body of the baptized in the water ; as may appear in paul , rom. 6. and the councils of laodicea , and neocaesarea . the action of the minister , is his washing of the party baptized with the element of water . of washing there be three parts : the putting into the water , the continuance in the water , and the coming out of the water . perkins's order of the causes of salvation and damnation , cap. 33. pag. 74. vol. 1. and in his comment on golat. 3. 27. vol. 2. pag 257. the dipping of the body signifies mortification , or fellowship with christ in his death : the staying under the water , signifies the burial of sin ; and the coming out of the water , the resurrection from sin to newness of life . and upon matth. 28 19. here ( saith he ) a question may be made , whether washing the body in baptism , must be by dipping or sprinkling ? his answer is this ; in hot countries , and in the baptism of men of years , dipping was used , and that by the apostles : and to this paul alludes rom. 6. 3 , 4. and dipping doth more fully represent our spiritual washing , than sprinkling . ibid. pag. 257. mr baxter , in his paraphrase . matth. 3. 5. we grant that baptism then was by washing the whole body . matth. 3. 6. baptism was in john's time , by washing the whole body . rom. 6. 4. therefore in our baptism we are dipped under the water . coloss . 2. 12. ye are dead and buried with him ; for so your baptism signified , in which ye are put under the water , to signify and profess that your old man , or fleshly lust , is dead and buried with him ; and you rise thence , to signify and profess , that you rise to newness of life . in his third argument against mr. b●ake , he saith , quoad modum , with respect to the manner , it is commonly confest by us to the anabaptists ( as our commentators declare ) that in the apostles time , the baptized were dipt over head in water . and though we have thought it lawful to disuse the manner of dipping , yet we presume not to change the use and signification of it . dr. cave . in his primitive christianity , pag. 320. saith , that the party baptized was wholly immerged , or put under water ; which was the almost constant and universal custom of those times : whereby they did most notably and significantly express the great end and effects of baptism ; for as in immerging there are in a manner three several acts , the putting the person into water , his abiding there for some time , and his rising up again , thereby representing christ's death , burial , and resurrection , &c. dr. nicholson , late lord bishop of glocester . in his exposition of the church-catechism , saith , in pag. 174. and the ancient manner in baptism , the putting the person baptized under the water , and then taking him out again did well set out these two acts , the first his dying , the second his rising again . and in the same page , upon col. 2. 12. he saith , into the grave with christ we went not , for our bodies were not , could not be buried with his ; but in our baptism , by a kind of analogy or resemblance , while our bodies are under the water , we may be said to be buried with him . dr. fowler , present lord bishop of glocester . in his scope of the christian religion , upon rom 6 4. saith , christians being pl●nged into the water in baptism , signifieth their undertaking and obliging themselves , in a spiritual sense , to die and be buried with jesus christ , that so answerably to his resurrection , they may live a holy and godly life . dr. tillotson , late archbishop of canterbury . in his sermon upon 2 tim. 2. 19. saith , anciently those who were baptized put off their garments , which signified the putting off the body of sin ; and were immersed and buried in the water , to represent the death of sin ; and then did rise up again out of the water , to signifie their entrance upon a new life . and to these customs the apostle alludes , rom. 6. 4. dr. jer. taylor , late lord bishop of down . in his ductor dubitantium , lib. 3 cap. 4. saith , the custom of the ancient church was not sprinkling , but immersion , in pursuance of the sence of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , both in the commandment and example of our blessed saviour . and this agrees with the mystery of the sacrament it self ; for we are buried with him in baptism ( saith the apostle ; ) the old-man is buried and drowned in the immersion under water : and when the baptized person is lifted up from the water , it represents the resurrection of the new-man to newness of life . the learned joseph mede . in his diatribe on titus 3. 5. saith , there was no such thing as sprinkling used in baptism in the apostles time , nor many ages after them . mr. daniel rogers . none of old were wont to be sprinkled , and ( saith he ) i confess my self unconvinced by demonstration of scripture for infants sprinkling . it ought to be the churches part to cleave to the institution , which is dipping . and he betrays the church , whose officer he is , to a disorder'd error , if he cleave not to the institution , which is to dip. rogers's treatise of the two sacraments , part 1. chap. 5. the famous reformer luther . luther de baptismo , tom . 1. fol. 71. in the latin edition , printed at wittemburgh , saith , baptism is a greek word ; it may be translated a dipping , when we dip something in water , that it may be covered with water . and although it be for the most part altogether abolished , for that they do not dip the whole children , but only sprinkle them with a little water , they ought nevertheless to be wholly dipt , and presently to be drawn out again . and in tome 2. fol. 79. concerning babylon's captivity . the other thing ( saith he ) which belongs to baptism , is the sign , or the sacrament , which is the dipping it self into the water : from whence also it hath its name . nam baptizo graece , mergo latinè , & baptisma mersio est . for baptizo in greek , is in latin mergo , to dip ; and baptisma , is dipping . and a little after , speaking of rom. 6. 4. he saith , being moved by this reason , i would have those that are to be baptized , to be wholly dipt into the water ; as the word doth sound , and the mystery doth signifie . and when complaint was made to him and other divines at wittemburgh , that a child had been sprinkled at hamburgh , and their advice desired upon it ; he wrote to hamburgh to acquaint them , that their use of sprinkling was an abuse , which they ought to remove . ita mersionem hamburgi restitutam esse . so dipping was restored at hamburgh author joannes bugenhagius pomeranius , in his book printed anno 1542. he was contemporary with , and a successor of luther at wittemburgh . the learned grotius . on matth. 3. 6. mersatione autem , non perfusione agi solitum hunc ritum indicat & vocis proprietas , & loca ad eum ritum delecta , john 3. 23. acts 8. 38. et allusiones multae apostolorum quae ad aspersionem referri non possunt , rom. 6. 3 , 4. col. 2. 12. mr. john calvin . on john 3. 23. baptism was performed by john and christ , by dipping of the whole body in water . and in his institutions , lib. 4. cap. 15. sect . 19. he saith thus , caeterum mergaturne totus qui tingitur , idque ter an semel , an infusa tantum aqua aspergatur , minimum refert : sed id pro regionum diversitate ecclesis liberum esse debet . quanquam & ipsum baptizandi verbum mergere significat , & mergendi ritum veteri ecclesia observatum fuisse constat . here you may see , that although he thinks it a thing indifferent whether it be done by dipping or sprinkling , and that thrice or once only ; and that it 's left to the churches liberty , according to the diversity of countries : yet he comes in at last with his quanquam , notwithstanding the word baptism signifies to dip , and it is evident that the rite of dipping was observed by the old church . the case is so clear ( as a learned writer hath noted ) that calvin up and down his works doth often confess , that the ancient manner of baptism in the primitive times was by dipping the whole body under water . piscator , on john 3 : 23. saith , that baptism was performed by dipping the whole body under water . the dutch translators . matth. 3. 1. joannes de dooper , john the dipper . vers 6. gedoopt in de jordaen , dipt in jordan . vers . 16 ende jesus gedoopt zynde epgeklommen uyt het water . and jesus being dipt , he ( climbed or ) came up out of the water . matth. 28 19. onderwyst alle de volckeren , deselve dopende in den name des vaders , &c. instruct all the people , dipping the same in the name of the father , &c. mark 1. 9. ende wiert van joanne gedoopt in de jordaen . ende terstont al 's by uyt het water opklaem , &c. and was dipt of john in jordan . and straightways as he climb'd up out of the water , &c. acts 8. 36. wat verhindert my gedoopt te worden ? what hinders me to be dipt ? v. 38. ende hy doopte hem . and he dipt him . v. 12. wierden sy gedoopt beyde mannen ende vrouwen . they were dipt both men and women . rom. 6. 3. ofte en wetet ghy niet dat soo vele al 's wy in christum jesum dedoopt zyn , wy in synen doodt gedoopt zyn ? know ye not that so many of us as were dipt into christ jesus , we were dipt into his death ? and the same in coll. 2. 12. and ( according to what i find ) in all other places where this ordinance of baptism is mentioned . dutch annotations . on john 3. 23. and john also baptized in aenon near salim , &c. seeing there were many waters there , that is brooks or rivelets , or much water , because they that were baptized by john , went into the water with their whole bodies . see matth. 3. 16. acts 8. 38. and on rom. 6. 3. we are baptized into his death . the apostle seems here to allude to the manner of baptizing much used in those warm eastern countries ; where men were wholly dipt into the water , and remained a little while under the water ; to shew that this dipping into , and remaining in the water , is a representation of christ's death and burial : and the rising up out of the water , of his resurrection . beza on matth. 3. 11. the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , signifies to die by dipping or washing , and differs from the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to drown , or go down to the bottom like a stone . causabon's annotations upon matth 3. he saith , immerging was the proper rite in baptism , which the word it self sufficiently declares ; which as it signifies not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a going down to the bottom without any ascending ; so not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a swimming like a cork above the water ; but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a going down and coming up again . tilenus , a learned protestant writer , in his disputation , page 886 , 889 , 890. saith , baptism is the first sacrament of the new testament instituted by jesus christ . the outward rite in baptism is three fold . first , immersion into the water . 2dly , abiding under the water . 3dly , a rising again out of the water . and he there shews at large , what a most lively similitude it is of the sorrows of christ which he was plung'd into under divine justice , and of his burial and resurrection , &c. leigh , in his critica sacra . he saith , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is derived from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , tingo , to dip or plunge into the water , and signifieth primarily such a kind of washing as is used in bucks , where linen is plunged or dipt . it implieth the washing of their whole body . the native and proper signification of it is , to dip into water , or to plunge under water , john 3. 22 , 23. matth. 3. 16. acts 8. 38. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , dipping into water , or washing with water , &c. and in his annotations on rom 6 4. he alludes to the manner in which baptism was then administred , which was to plunge them in the water ; the plunging of them into water that were baptized , was a sign of their death and burial with christ . wollebius in his compendium , &c. speaking of their present practise , saith , the action is sprinkling of water , which is usurped in the stead of dipping . and then adds , immersio & emersio illustre symbolum fuit sepulturae & resurrectionis christi . their being plunged into the water , and coming up again out of the water , was an illustrious symbol of the burial and resurrection of christ . daille , on the fathers . lib. 2. p. 148. saith , it was a custom heretofore in the ancient church , to plunge those they baptized , over head and ears in the water ; and cites for his authority , tertullian , cyprian , epiphanius , and others . and this is still ( saith he ) the practice both of the greeks and russians at this day . and cites cassander de baptismo , pag. 193. and yet notwithstanding this custom , which is both so ancient and so universal , is now abolished by the church of rome . and this is the reason that the moscovites say that the latines are not rightly and duly baptized ; because they do not use this ancient ceremony in their baptism . also , in that greek lexicon , published and recommended to all , for the encrease of knowledge ( and explained in english ) by mr. joseph caryll , mr. george cockayne , mr. ralph vening , mr. william dell , mr. matthew barker , mr. william adderly , mr. matthew mead , mr. henry jessey . they render 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to dip , plunge , or drown . in the passive voice , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to be plunged , or overwhelmed . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to dip in , as one doth his finger in liquor . [ from this we may allow , that the presbyterian ministers do baptize their fingers when they dip them into the waters : but cannot be said to baptize the children , because they do not dip them in the water , but sprinkle only a little water upon their faces ] mat. 26. 23. john 13. 26. mark 14. 20. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to plunge , to overwhelm , to wash , to dip , mat. 3. 11. john 1. 25. chap. 3. 26. john 4. 1. 1 cor. 1. 17. john 1. 31. matth. 28. 19. john 3. 22. john 4. 2. chap. 1. 28. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to be plunged , to be baptized , or dipt . by a metaphor , it 's taken for affliction , matth. 20. 22. which is familiarly read in scripture ; whereby afflictions are compared to the gulphs and whirl-pools of water , into which those are plunged , who struggle with the miseries and calamities of this life . yet they are so plunged , that they can lift up themselves again . i might also add , what those several great masters of the greek tongue , us scapula , stephanus , schrevelius , and divers others , have said concerning the etymology thereof . but the learned being so well acquainted therewith , i shall only touch upon it : they confirming what i have already observed from others . they tell us in their lexicons , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , signifies mergo , immergo , submergo , obruo ; item tingo , quod fit immergendo . to dip , to overwhelm , to plunge or dip in , to drown or sink in the water , to overwhelm , to dip , or plunge ; to put under , to cover clean over , &c. and that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , rantizo , is aspergo , to sprinkle : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , aspersio , sprinkling . now these two different words , do signifie two different actions : for he that is only sprinkled , cannot be said to be dipt , or plunged under the water , and to come up again out of the water , ( when they were never in it ) as those are said to do , in acts 8. 38. they went both down into the water , and they came up again out of the water . besides , i challenge all the learned in the world to shew one instance in the new testament , that these words rantizo , rantismos , or rantisma , are ever made use of by the spirit of god , to express that ordinance of baptism by . for they know right well that bapto , and its derivatives are always made use of to express it by . and where they are translated into english , the one is rendred dipping , and the other sprinkling . but if these men will keep up a practise contrary to holy scripture . and the judgment of the most learned lexicographers and criticks in the greek tongue , it 's their own fault , and not ours . the assembly of divines annotations . acts 8. 38. they went both down into the water . they were wont to dip the whole body , or go down into the water , as here , and matth. 3. 16. and upon rom. 6. 4. buried with him by baptism . see col. 2. 12. in this phrase the apostle seemeth to allude to the ancient manner of baptism ; which was to dip the parties baptized , and as it were , to bury them under the water for a while , and then to draw them out of it , and lift them up ; to represent the burial of our old man , and our resurrection to newness of life . the late dr. gabriel towerson , in his explication of the catechism of the church of england , part 4. pag. 20 &c. speaks largely upon it , in vindication of the rite of dipping in baptism ; of which i shall recite some few passages , and refer you to his book for the rest . baptism is intended as a sign , and that in respect of the manner of application used ; i mean the dipping , or plunging the party baptized in it . a signification which st. paul will not suffer those to forget , who have been acquainted with his epistles , for which he quotes rom 6 4. and col. 2. 12. it was performed by the ceremony of immersion , that the person immersed , might by that ceremony ( which was no obscure image of a sepulture ) be minded of the precedent death , as in like manner by his coming again out of the water , of his rising from that death to life , after the example of the institutor thereof . then he puts this question , whether it ought to be performed by an immersion , or an aspersion , & c ? his answer is , it may be a more material question than is commonly deemed by us who have been accustomed to baptize by a bare effusion and sprinkling of water upon the party . for things which depend for their force on the meer will and pleasure of him who instituted them , there ought ( no doubt ) great regard to be had to the commands of him that did so ; as without which there is no reason we should receive the benefit of that ceremony to which he has been pleased to annex it . now what the command of christ was in this particular , cannot be well doubted of by those who shall consider ; first , the words of christ , matth 28. 19. concerning it , and the practice of those times , whether in the baptism of john or our saviour ; for the words of christ are , that they should baptize or dip those whom they made disciples to him ; for ( so no doubt ) the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , baptizontes , properly signifies : though if there could be any doubt concerning the signification of the words themselves , yet would that doubt be removed by considering the practice of those times . for such as was the practice of those times in baptizing , such in reason we are to think our saviour's command to have been concerning it , &c. there being not otherwise any means either for those , or future times to discover his intention concerning it . what the practice of those times were , will need no other proof , than the resorting to rivers and other such receptacles of water for the performance of that ceremony , as that because there was much water there , matth. 3. 5. john 3. 23. and the scripture expresly affirming concerning the baptism of the eunuch , acts 8. 38. that philip and the eunuch went both down into a certain water ( which they met with in their journey ) in order to the baptizing of the latter . for what need would there have been of the baptists resorting to great confluxes of water ; or of philip's and the eunuch's going down into this , were it not that the baptism both of the one and of the other , were to be performed by an immersion ; a very little water ( as we know it doth with us ) sufficing for an effusion or sprinkling . the same is to be said yet more , upon the account of our conforming to the death and resurrection of christ , which we learn from st. paul to be the design of baptism to signifie ; for though that might , and was well enough represented by the beptized persons being buried in baptism , and their rising out of it ; yet can it not be said to be so , or , at least but very imperfectly , by the bare pouring out , or sprinkling the baptismal water on him . but therefore ; as there is so much the more reason to represent the rite of immersion as the only legitimate rite of baptism , because the only one that can answer the ends of its institution , and those things that were to be signified by it ; so especially , if ( as is well known , and undoubtedly of great force ) the general practice of the primitive church was agreeable thereto , and the greek church to this very day : for who can think that either the one , or the other , would have been so tenacious of so troublesom a rite , were it not that they were well assured ( as they of the primitive church might very well be ) of its being the only instituted and legitimate one. i cannot but think the forementioned arguments to be so far of force , as to evince the necessity thereof , &c. for what benefit can men ordinarily expect from that which depends for its force upon the will of him that instituted it ; where there is no such compliance in the least with it , and the command of the institutor ; as may answer those ends for which he applied it . dr. barlow , late bishop of lincoln , in his letter to mr. john tombes , printed in his life-time and owned by him . he saith thus ; i believe and know , that there is neither precept nor practice in the scripture for paedo-baptism ; nor any just evidence for it , for about two hundred years after christ . sure i am , that in the primitive times they were to be catechumeni , and then illuminati , or baptizati : and this not only children of pagans , or pagans converted ; but children of christian parents . nazianzen , though a bishop's son , being not baptized till he was about thirty years of age , as appears in his life . and the like is evident in some others . i have seen what my learned and worthy friend dr. hammond , mr. baxter , and others , say in defence of it ; and i confess i wonder not a little , that men of such parts should say so much to so little purpose : for i have not seen any thing like an argument for it . i shall add no more , but my hearty wishes , that as god was pleased to make the hearing of the dispute , of such use to several persons , that they were fully convinced ( by the grace of god towards them ) of the truth of the doctrine of holy baptism , and did in few days after submit themselves to be dipt in water , upon profession of their faith , according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ , that it may also be of the like use to many others , in the reading of it ; that so there may be added to the church daily ▪ such as shall be saved . and then my design will be answered in its publication ; and i shall count it a sufficient reward for all my pains and labour therein . finis . rich. baxter's review of the state of christian's infants whether they should be entered in covenant with god by baptism ... or whether christ, the saviour of the world, hath shut all mankind out of his visible kingdom ... 'till they come of age? : occasioned by the importunity of mr. e. hutchinson (and of mr. danvers and mr. tombes) who called him to this review in order to his retractation [sic] ... review of the state of christian's infants baxter, richard, 1615-1691. 1676 approx. 142 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 37 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2006-02 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a27008 wing b1372 estc r18045 12395436 ocm 12395436 61144 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a27008) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 61144) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 269:2) rich. baxter's review of the state of christian's infants whether they should be entered in covenant with god by baptism ... or whether christ, the saviour of the world, hath shut all mankind out of his visible kingdom ... 'till they come of age? : occasioned by the importunity of mr. e. hutchinson (and of mr. danvers and mr. tombes) who called him to this review in order to his retractation [sic] ... review of the state of christian's infants baxter, richard, 1615-1691. [8], 64 p. printed for nevil simons ..., london : 1676. first ed. cf. wing. reproduction of original in bodleian library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng hutchinson, edward, 17th cent. danvers, henry, d. 1687. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. infant baptism. 2005-07 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-08 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-10 elspeth healey sampled and proofread 2005-10 elspeth healey text and markup reviewed and edited 2006-01 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion rich. baxter's review of the state of christian's infants . whether they should be entered in covenant with god by baptism , and be visible members of his chvrch , and have any covenant-right to pardon and salvation ? or whether christ , the saviour of the world , hath shut all mankind out of his visible kingdom , and covenant-rights and hopes , 'till they come to age ? and whether he did so from the beginning of the world , or after his incarnation ? occasioned by the importunity of mr. e. hutchinson , ( and of mr. danvers , and mr. tombes , ) who called him to this review in order to his retractation . an impartial reading is humbly requested , of those dissenters who would not be found despisers of holy truth , nor such as judge before they hear . london , printed for nevil simons at the princes arms in pauls churchyard , 1676. reader , i once more stew the world , that is is in the power of other men , if god permit them , to hinder us from greater service to the church , by making things far less in themselves , to become accidentally at that time more necessary ? by which kind of impediments in contentious times , satan frustrateth the better desires and designs of many of the servants of christ , who would fain be better employed ; yea , and useth herein the service of such men , as in other respects are none of his servants . and thus , though scriptures be our general rule , the providence of god , and the great ends of all our life , are the determiners of the circumstances of our duties . the cause of this review is a letter of one mr. e. hutchinson , sent me , very large in considerable oratory , to let me know his contempt of my last ( and former ) book of baptism , and to humble me for the great sin of abusing the world with such frivolous writings , which seem to do something , but prove nothing , and leave mr. danvers , &c. unanswered ; so that it is an answer that he would have : and he vehemently urgeth me to repentance and retraction of what i have written for infants church-membership , covenant and baptism ; as did mr. tombes more than once before him . should i print his letter without his consent , perhaps he might take it for an injury ; and if he would have it done , it 's like he will do it himself . but because it refereth to a printed paper of mr. danvers , against me , called his third reply , which i never saw till his letter informed me of it , i thought that it was more than himself whom he importuned me to satisfie . i have told him here truly , how little the meer difference about the outward baptism of infants doth abate my esteem and love of any godly peaceable men : two sorts of persons called anabaptists i can live in as friendly concord with , as with most i hold communion with : first , those that deny not the covenant-rights , and church-relation of the infants of believers , confessing them to be holy ; but only think that their baptism , being but the solemnization of their foregoing covenant , and the publick investiture of them in their relation , may , as the coronation of an infant king , be deferred till they come to some understanding ; of which minde were tertullian and nazianzene . secondly , those that being in doubt only of the sufficiency or lawfulness of infant-baptism , do receive a second or a third administration ( as some marryed by justices lately , were marryed again by ministers ; and as mr. humphrey pleads for a second ordination , especially if hypothetically done ) to satisfie their doubting consciences , and then live in peace , and orderly communion afterwards with other christians , as knowing that in christ jesus neither circumcision availeth , nor uncircumsion , but a new creature . i say none of these shall be more willing of loving communion with others , than i shall be with them . but 1. if men will deny and scorn our infant-right in the covenant of grace , and in christ , pardon and salvation ; and visible church-relation , and will so far deny the kingdom and grace of christ , as to maintain that he excludeth all mankind from any visible right , or hope of salvation till adult , and hath given such right no more to christian 's children than to heathens ! and if they will make this opinion the measure of their communion , and will divide the church , and unchristen , or unchurch all that are not as unthankful and injurious to christ , and to the holy seed as themselves , it is not i that separate from these men , but they from me , and all sober christians . and i will here add but these two or three notes to the reader ; 1. if he will peruse two short disputations which i have lately published of original sin , ( the primary and secondary ) he will see it fully proved , that both naturally , and by supernatural revelation god hath declared such an interest of parents and children in each other , as is much of the reason of all that i here plead for : and he that will accurately observe the whole current of the scripture herein , shall find this conjunct-interest asserted from end to end . 2. i am past doubt that it is a principal design of satan to mortifie our christendom it self , by keeping parents from that intelligent and serious covenanting with god , in their solemn dedication of their children to him , which the greatness of the work and case requireth ; and to turn our very christening into a ceremony , or lifeless formality : and it is not the least part of my non-conformity , that i dare not deliberately profess my assent and consent , that no parent shall be suffered in the church to enter his own child into the covenant of god , nor to speak one covenanting , promising , undertaking , nor dedicating word ; ( nor must be urged to be so much as present ) but that godfathers and godmothers ; who never give us any cause to believe that one of many thousands of them take the child for their own , nor ever purpose to educate him , or do what there they vow and covenant to do , must be the only covenanting undertakers ; and so that so much notorious false vowing to god , or perfidiousness , must defile our baptism : and now come these anabaptists , and instead of calling the parents to seriousness , and holy fidelity in so great a work , they tell them that it is none of their duty at all . 3. and how light soever some make of unity , i know that it 's even essential to the church ; as the union of the stones and timber is to the house , and of king and subjects to the kingdom ; and of the several parts , to a clock or watch : for the form is relative . and do you think then that they befriend christ or his church , who turn the sacrament of our union into the occasion of our great division ? yea , and unchristen and unchurch all the christian world in infancy ; yea , and a thousand parts to one of the christian church of the adult , because they are not re-baptised at age. passion , and prejudice , and partiality ( when men have espoused the interest of a cause as the best and holyest in their eyes ) may make men swallow such things as these , and think that they serve god in reviling all that are against them . were we agreed against infants covenant-right , when should we ever be agreed at what age it is that they are to be received ? and when a childs profession were valid ? but he that thinketh that 1. all the christian world will ever unite in the renouncing of all infants covenant-rights and hopes . 2. or that without unity , ( in the essentials ) or without love and peace the church , of christ is in a prosperous state , doth not judge as i do upon the most serious thoughts that i am able to exercise , and as i doubt not but i shall judge to the last breath , which is not like to be far off . to mr. e. hvtchinson . sir , when i read you general accusation of my firey discouraging of reprovers , &c. i began to bethink me who they were in all my life time that had to my face reproved me , and been discouraged by any unthankful passionate returns of mine ; and not remembring any one in my life , ( unless you will call my contradicting men in disputation and altercation in case of differences of judgment by that name ) i did read on , in expectation of fuller information , and i perceived that it was not any verbal rejecting any reproof of my present monitors , that you meant , but my published writings against those called anabaptists . i have long had far lowder calls than yours to review my life and writings , and to judge of them as impartially as i can . upon the review i am conscious , 1. that i never meddled at first with mr. tombes , till he unavoidably constrained me , by sending those whom he had prevailed with to me , to tell me , that if i would not answer him , they must lay their change so far on my refusal to satisfie them . we lived to gether till then , without any meddling with the difference by me . 2. i find that when he had ( without my consent ) published these papers which i privately sent him , with his answer , i gave not a word of reply to them , till mr. danvers made it seem necessary to me , though it be above 20 years since they were written . surely my silence was no furious contradiction . 3. i find that when mr. tombes published them so long ago , and they have been in your own hands in mr. tombes his book , neither you nor others till now that i know of , shewed me any such fury in them . and those that i have spoke with say , that there is no such thing , but that his reply is passionate , ( which i leave to others judgment that yet may read them in his book together . ) 4. i find that in 1659. when i endeavoured to perswade mr. lambe and mr. allen to christian concord , that i did not strive against their anabaptistry , but only to satisfie them , that holding that difference , they yet ought to satisfie themselves , in that which they took to be their duty , and to hold loving communion with the churches and christians of the other mind . and when they had renounced their separation , it was not i but their own light , experience and consideration ( by what other helps i know not ) that made them renounce their anabaptistry . 5. when before that , there was a treaty in london for the reconciling of the presbyterians & iudependents , i did first at home to the ministers of worcestershire , mantain by a set disputation , that it was our duty to seek peace and communion with the anabaptists ; and after sent up the terms of that desired concord to london , to mr. allen , who at some meetings for that purpose , told me the business went hopefully on , till the confusions in 1659. disturbed and overthrew all . 6. i have above 20 years in print and pulpit frequently told the churches , that they are greatly beholden to gods providence in permitting the anabaptists to call us so lowd to the serious confideration of of our baptism ; and that if those that were baptized in infancy be not brought to as serious understanding , and resolved a renewing of that covenant , as if they had never been baptised before , yea and pass not out of the state of infant church-membership into that of the adult , by a solemn transltion in owning of their covenant , these church corruptions will be continued which are the scandal and temptation of the anabaptists . and to that end i wrote a treatise of confirmation . 7. i have printed in this last book ( recited by mr. barret in the end of his queres ) such an offer of brotherly concord with the anabaptists , ( supposing our continued difference in that point ) even the very words of such a profession on which both parties may with mutual forbearance live in brotherly love and communion , as never any man did to me accuse either of rigor , unlawfulness , or insufficiency to that end . and if you resolve that you will have no communion with any in the world , but those that are of your opinion against infant-baptism , your communion will be narrower than mine , and such talk as this of yours is never like to draw me to your mind . 8. i have many years insisted more upon the terms ( and improvement ) of our baptismal covenant , as containing that very touch-stone , or state of evidence , by which both our sincere grace , and our right to church-communion must be tryed , than any man that i know of ; of which my family book is a full proof . 9. to the reconciling of men herein , i have oft shewed , that if our childrens part in the covenant of grace upon their parents dedication of them to god , ●nd so their church-membership , were but yielded , the rest ( whether they should actually be baptized with water ) would be much less cause of our distance and alienation , than on both sides it is usually judged . yea , if the anabaptists would but say , [ i dedicate this child to god , as far as he hath given me power , and heartily desire that god may be his father , christ his saviour ; and the holy ghost his sanctifier : ] and did ever any of you prove this to be a sin ? and we are ready on our part to profess that [ infant-baptism will save none at age that consent not to the same holy covenant . ] 10. i have oft told the world that though the ancient churches denyed not their childrens part in the covenant of grace , nor their right to pardon and salvation , and infaut church membership by that covenant , yet the time when children themselves should be solemnly baptized , was left in the churches for above 200 years to every ones free choice ; some ( and the most christians ) usually baptizing them quickly , and others thinking as tertullian , that it would bind them faster if they stayed somewhat longer ; or , as nazianzene thought , till they were three or four years old : even as one that hath right to a crown in his infancy , may have his coronation performed either then , or afterward . 11. i have oft told the world that i would have this liberty and moderation again revived , and that i would have no anabaptist persecuted or excommunicated for that his opinion . 12. i never persecuted any of them , nor perswaded any to do it ; nor never endeavoured to hurt them , nor denyed them any good that i could do them ; ( though i told you truly that even they of mr. t 's . church that had seemed my old friends , sought my life or ruine , by way-saying a man that told them he carryed letters of mine , violently taking them from him and carrying them up to london to the council , to sir h. v. &c. ) this is the account that my reviewing conscience giveth me of my dealing with the anabaptists , with whom to this day i still plead for love and peaceable communion upon terms of mutual forbearance : and whether it be holy patience and humility that takes this for fire and fury , and cannot bear it , consider . but yet fury and folly you copiously exclaim against , and call me to repent : i thank you unfeignedly for that honest wholsome word [ repent ] whether well or ill applyed . but your many scornes at my repentings scarce well agree with the invitation . were i like to have life and leisure for such a work , i would resolve to review all my writings just in the method that austin did , and to tell the readers what i dislike in them ; which having no reason to expect , i have so dealt already with those that most needed it , and corrected others in the later impressions . if you need no repentance , and have written as much as i , and that without any fault , you have been happier than i. and yet i intend not to give over writing , preaching , praying , praising god , or conference with men , because i cannot do any of them innocently , in a manner that needed no repentance . but upon the full perusal of your letter , i must say , i never had a more wordy , windy , empty invitation to repentance , that i remember in my life . i looked still when the fault was told me , and some words at least named that were guilty of the folly or firyness mentioned ; or some of my particular sins proved , that i might be convinced : i looked to find some one argument of my books confuted and proved vain , or fallacious . but it renewed in me that grief and pity , for the strange diseasedness of such dissenters , ( which mr. danvers had before caused ) to find such abundance of rhetorical invectives , without one word of proof : as if you had prevaricated , and had a design to have kept me from repentance , by telling me i had no particulars to repent of that you could shew . what do all your generals of [ no answer ] and tergiversation , and abundance the like signifie , to any man of common sense , unless this be the meaning of them , [ it is mr. danvers his opinion and mine that you are foolish , firey , injurious , frivolous , &c. therefore you must repent of this , though we say nothing that should convince a reasonable man. ] but , i must retract what i have written against anabaptists ; for you invite me to it by a torrent of general accusations , and letting me know that mr. d. and you do think me hetorodox . ] and just so doth mr. pen and the quakers do also : and so do the papists , and with as great confidence and oratory perhaps as yours : and so do the accusers of the non-conformists in many volumes : and so do many other parties : and must i be therefore of all their minds ? or why more of yours than of theirs , if i have nothing from you but confident gnerals , which they can say as well as you ? yea thus do the infidels themselves now use me , and must i therefore yield ? but i have written fierily against mr. danvers ! 1. did i begin with mr. d. or he with me ? 2. have i said any thing offensive to him , besides the detecting of his marvellous audacity in strange heaps of untruths in matters of fact ? and his lamentable injury thereby to the church of christ ? sir , i know you not , and should i tell you what a spirit in your self , your copious outcryes , and extream tenderness of our dissent and contradiction of you , shews , and how unlike to the voice of a sheep of christ it is to cry so loud , as if the knife were at your throat , when we do but tell the church of your errours and injuries to the truth , upon the urgency of your restless importunity : should i tell you what strange partiality you shew in finding meekness , truth , and reason in mr. danvers his books , and folly , fire , and no-answer in mine , i could not expect that you should ever the more be convinced , or repent , but rather take that also for fiery , as taking me for an uncapable monitor . but i desire you only to ask the opinion of the judicious and impartial herein ; for repentance to your self should be no odious thing . and whereas you tell me over and over what all wise men now think and say of me , and of my writings , am not i an unhappy man that never met with one of those wise men , but your self and such professed opposites ( anabaptists , quakers , papists , or such like . ) but what if i be foolish , and you be wise ? cannot you suffer fools gladly , seeing you your selves are wise ? and is your impatient and general invectives , and your self-justifying , an infallible proof of your great wisdome ? brother , upon the deepest search that i am able to make in above 20 years consideration , i am satisfied that you heinously wrong the mercy of god , and the church , and true believers , and their seed , by denying them that part in gods covenant and mercy , which i have proved he hath stated on them in his word : i am fully satisfied that god never had church-laws on earth , whether in innocency , or since the fall , which extended not the priviledge of a covenant and church-state to the infants of the church , if they had such ( on that supposition ; ) and that the church from the dayes of adam till now hath had infants members by gods appointment ; and that christ so found them , and so continued them ; and that it was then a thing that none did controvert : i am satisfied fully , that all that are discipled are by command to be baptized ; and that nations should be discipled , and the kingdoms of the world made the kingdoms of christ ; and christ would have gathered to his church the whole jerusalem , as the hen gathereth her chickens , and none were broken off but for unbelief , and therefore the children of believing jews were not broken off ; and that we are graffed into the same olive : i am satisfied that they that so hardly digested the forbearance of circumcision , would never have silently past over the vnchurching of all the infants , without one word of exception ; nor christ have so far countenanced the excepters , as to be angry with those that would have forbid children comeing to him , because of such is the kingdom of heaven , nor the scripture have talk'd so much of baptizing housholds . i am not hardened enough to reject so plain a text as , [ the unbelieving husband is sanctified , &c. else were your children unclean , but now they are holy . ] nor in that one text to expound sanctifying for lawful marriage , and holyness for [ legitimation ] when the words are never so taken else in the bible , and ma-many hundred times in another sense : nor to say , that all pagans children are holy if they be not bastards . i am satisfied that man must not teach god how to speak , but carefully enquire what he hath spoken ; and if but one text of scripture acquaint us , directly or consequentially of his mind , we must be faithful in observing it : i believe that these are your thoughts as well as mine , and that you verily think that you hold close to the scripture , and that i depart from it : but as i am as willing to understand it as you are , and at as hard a rate of cost or labour , so i well know that one mistake once deeply received , doth let in abundance more , and fights against all the light that would detect and shame it : and he that once accounteth falshood to be truth , will account the defenders of truth to be its enemies . otherwise how could you and such others bring your consciences to wrest and wrangle against such abundance of plain scripture texts ? were it but this one , what could be plainer ? what is wresting scripture if this be not , to force a sense of holyness and sanctification upon one text , which is never found else in any text , and the contary , or different sense neer six hundred times ; is this impartial dealing with gods word ? and do you think that paul mentioneth that as a great and comfortable priviledge of believers , which belongs to heathens equally with them ? why do you not your selves still use that language then , and say , that the children of infidels are holy , when too many will scarce allow the title to any adult christians that are not of your sect , much less to the children of christians , though dedicated by baptism to god ? but being called by you to a review , i am again remembred , that our saviour himself was a church member in his infancy , even the chiefest , that is , the head ; mr. tombes confesseth it : let not your opinions interest draw you to deny it , nor to call my assertion [ rotten dictating . ] if you should , i would ask of you , at what age christ began to be christ , and the churches head , as we ask the socinians , at what age he began to be god ? and if an infant was capable of being the head , king , priest , and prophet relatively , though yet he had never ruled , sacrificed , or taught , then there is nothing in the infant age , which maketh it uncapable of being members , subjects , and disciples of christ : and it is like that irenaeus was not deceived , who saith that he sanctified the state of infancy by being an infant ; and we have reason to judge , that he did thereby give us notice that the infant age is not unacceptable to him , nor uncapable of church relation . truly sir , the serious thought of christs infant relation is a very great confirmation of me against those that exclude all mankind in their infancy from the covenant and church ; even as christs ordinary communion in the synagogues and temple , is an insuperable argument with me against unlawful separations . and god himself calling infants his servants , who do no actual service , levit. 25. 41 , 42. yea and calling them disciples , acts 15. 10. prevaileth more with me , than the words of any one that shall say , they are uncapable of being servants , or disciples . if the infant-age did not render them uncapable of being subjects of christs kingdom , and members of his church ( universal and particular ) before christs incarnation , it maketh them not since uncapable of the like or same relations . and why should i suspect such incapacity ? are not infants members of other societies ? are they not members of families ? and may not a family be sanctified by dedication to god ? are they not members of all the kingdoms in the world ? and is it not the common light of nature , which teacheth all men so to esteem them ? are not infants the kings subjects ? and why may they not as well be christs subjects as the kings ? have they not right of inheritance and honour ; even of crowns , lordships , and lands ? do any nations under heaven level all children , as if the parents communicated neither good or evil to them ? what reason then to suppose that christ obliterateth even natures laws ? and if you deny not original sin , why should you think that god is so unproportionably prone to punish and damn more than to pardon and save ; as that while all infants are made sinful and miserable by their parents , yet not one in the world shall have so much as a part in christs meritorious righteousness , and the free grace and pardon of his covenant , upon the parents dedication of him to god , and entering him by consent into his covenant ? doth sin abound so much more than grace , as that condemnation is passed upon all infants for and by their parents sin , and the free covenant gift doth not pardon any sin to any one infant in the world upon any condition which the parent can perform ( nor any other . ) you never yet by all your words ( for all words are not light and proof ) did convince me that it was no benefit to infants before christs incarnation to be covenant-members of his church ( particular and universal , ) nor that christ came to deprive them all of that benefit : mr. tombes his pretenses that it is a benefit to christians to have all their infants put or kept out of the church state and mercies , is so absurd , against nature , that i am asham'd to say any more against it : if it be our benefit to have no covenant-gift of christ , pardon and life to our children , may you not next say , it is our benefit to have them damn'd ? and if it were so , nature teacheth us to be loath to receive our benefits by such means ; as one would be loath that a physitian should cure his sickness by a draught of the heart blood of all his children . sir , i could the easilyer bear with your delay of external baptism ; if you did not deny all infants their part in the covenant of life . but when you dare not only do that , but reproach our assertion of gods covenant-grace to them , as [ absurd and heretical ] it is no fieryness to say , that i will not follow you . where there is no covenant or promise there is no hope , which we can call divine ; and if we have no hope of the pardon or salvation of our children upon any promise of god , it is no promise of mans that can keep us from despair . we may not then say as david , i shall go to it ] any farther than to the grave . nay do you not do worse than deprive us of our hopes , even lay such grounds as destroy and exclude them , by a sentence of damnation ? for god [ addeth to the church such as shall be saved . ] and if infants be not added to the church , are they not excluded from salvation ? for christ washeth and sanctifieth his church , & he is the saviour of his body only ; and if they are not of his church or body , he washeth them not , nor is their saviour effectively . the same text that saith , he that believeth shall be saved , saith , he that believeth not shall be damned . ] and he that believeth not is condemned already . ] if therefore you allow them no participation in their parents faith , but require personal belief of them , as necessary to their salvation , according to the promise , you must also require the same of them to save them from damnation , by the threatning . did you but leave christians no more hope than you do pagans and turks of their childrens pardon and salvation , i would not be ambitious of the joy of your opinion ; much less if you positively condemn them . and what do you less , if finding them condemned by the violated covenant of innocency , you totally exclude them from the remedying , pardoning , and saving covenant , and from christs body which he doth save . if you say that they may be of his invisible church , which is the saved body ; i answer , 1. what they may be , tells us not what they are . if they be not so much as visible members , who can say that they are invisible ones ? 2. they are by nature visible members of the kingdom of satan , and children of wrath , and visibly under the laws condemnation : therefore 'till we can prove them visibly by grace translated out of this state of nature , their visible condemnation cannot be denyed . and what a jumble make you , if you make a great part of mankind to be at once condemned visible members of the kingdom of the devil , and invisible saved members of christ ? men may be visibly christians , ( hypocrites ) and yet invisibly wicked ; but to be visibly condemned members of the kingdome of darkness , and yet invisible members of christ is strange to me ; especially considering that hypocrites are visibly what they are not really , and invisibly , because they falsely profess what they have not : but a condemned infant doth not deceive men by dissembling , but we actually know that as a child of adam , he is a child of sin and death : it is truly so . therefore we must conclude that as gods word is true , he continueth so , till he be delivered by grace . and the covenant of grace is the conveyance of , and title to our gracious priviledges , as the threatning is of wrath . shall not all that are judged , be judged by gods law ? ( the law which they were under ? ) and what law shall infants then be judged by ? if they are under no covenant of promise that giveth them title to life , how can they have title by it , or be judged by it ? are they justified or not justified ? if not justified , they are condemned certainly ; and shall not be glorified ; for it is the justified that are glorified , rom. 8. 30. but if they are justified , either it is by some justifying promise and covenant , or without : if without , 1. do you not give hope also to all heathens and wicked men , that though they are condemned by the law of innocency , and not justified by any covenant of grace , yet they may be justified without ? 2. and by what means is it ? by any or none ? if by any , by what ? if by none , how know you it ? but if it be by any covenant-grant that they are justified , it must be by that of grace which i am pleading for or none . for we will not now receive another gospel . to talk therefore of meer election , is nothing to any of this that i have said . election justifieth not , nor dissolveth the condemning sentence of the law. god judgeth not men meerly on the grounds of his unreveled election , but by his word , which is the rule . and were it otherwise if unrevealed , none can prove it , and therefore must not affirm it : and were it reveled that god will save some that he promiseth not to save , nor giveth them any antecedent right to it ; yet 1. no man could know by this , whether any one in england or europe , or in the world in his age shall so be saved : nor whether it be many or few , or more than a dozen in the world . 2. and no one can know who any of these be ? and so can have no notice of comfort for any of his own . 3. nor that christians infants shall be saved any more than the heathens . these things , sir , are not to be submitted to by all christians , for fear lest you else revile them , or lest mr. t. sayes , their blood be on their own heads . austin is called durus pater infantum , for too sharp a censure on the unbaptized ; ( though many mistake him . ) but we should be harder , did we leave all visibly condemned without a pardoning word , or any visible remedy and hope . and truly me thinks you too much honour the kingdome of the devil , if you make it visibly contain all the seed of the woman , even of the faithful , till they come to age . it is too great , i will not feign it to be greater . were all the circumcised israelites , and all the holy seed till christ , at once both in the church , and in satans kingdom ? if not , sure it is not so now . sure i am that the scripture tells us of a larger church , and a better covenant , and promises , and greater salvation under the gospel ; and do you bring it down to this , to give us all up to the devils visible kingdom , without any visible remedy , till we come to age ? and he is scarce so like to prove a member of christ at age , who is trained up in the kingdom of the devil till then , as he is that is educated in the houshold of god. there is more of gods blessing to be expected in his own family than in the devils . either it is a mercy or no mercy to be in christs family or church ? if none , why do you value it ? if it be , why should we think that the saviour of the world procureth it to no infants ? nay that he came to leave them out . would you not take it for a mercy if you believed that god in scripture gave it , to all the seed of the faithful dedicated to him ? i think you would . for my part i believe that the seed of the righteous is blessed , psal . 37. 26. and that the children of satan , and the condemned unjustified seed are not blessed : that blessed are they whose sins and iniquities are forgiven and covered , and to whom the lord imputeth not sin , and that this blessing cometh even on the uncircumcised ; but not on them who are unpardoned , and condemned already . i hear many sad mothers lamenting their dead children , for fear lest they are damned : and though i never was a father , i can perceive what the concerns and bowels of parents are . but what would they do , if they were taught to believe , that no infant ever in the world , had any justifying , pardoning promise , nor visible remedy , but all till age are under condemnation , by the undissolved obligation of the law. the antinomians of late years have attempted to perswade men , that secret election justifieth from eternity , and dissolveth the laws obligation , ( before it did oblige , even to non-existent subjects : ) but few believe them , the errour being sufficiently laid open . and yet what other than this feigned antinomian justification do the anabaptists allow to any infants in the world ? but the obligation of a law or covenant to punishment , must according to gods established order , be dissolved by a law or covenant , even by the pardoning law of grace . no doubt but all elect persons , before regeneration are in the visible kingdom of the devil , and heirs of hell , and under the condemnation of the law , as undissolved , and they not pardoned : and is this the case of the best of infants ? had infants church-membership been a meer jewish ceremony , or a meer piece of the mosaical policie , giving no right to any spiritual benefits , nor extended to any other but the jews , we should have judged of it as of the rest : but i dare say that i have given full proof of the contrary in both my books , not here to be recited ; and have produced more than [ rotten dictates ] that from adams dayes infants were esteemed as under the blessing or the curse , as belonging to their parents , & interested in their actions & conditions . besides that any heathen might have brought in his children as proselites into church-membership with the jews ; whereas now you allow not so much to any christians . and it was before circumcision was instituted , that marriage was regulated by god , that there might be [ a seed of god ] mal. 2. 15. ] and i will not be so audocious , as to expound that title , of all the devils children that be not bastards . but still you say , there is no scripture , president , or precept for infants baptism . ] answer , 1. abuse not your selves and others : we are first to agree whether infants may be church members , and under the covenant of grace with their parents ? and then we shall next consider , at what age , and in what manner they should be solemnly invested . confound not differing questions : the first must be first resolved . 2. there is no scripture president for baptizing any kings ; must none therefore be baptized ? 3. scripture tells us not all that was then done , but all that must be done . 4. when baptism was first instituted and practised , the parents must first be converted and baptized . 5. yet over and over the baptizing of housholds is recorded . 6. infants church-membership was a thing that they were before in profession of , and no sort that ever i read of questioned it : therefore what need christ institute it anew , any more than to new make the ten commandments ? 7. if it had ever been his meaning to dispossess them all , he would have told us so in some word of scripture , or some mention sure had been made of it . 8. but certainly he told them that he would have gathered jerusalems children to him , which is the nation that was before gods church . 9. and he took children in his arms and blessed them , and was angry with those that kept them from him , and said , of such is the kingdom of god. 10. and how can we obey mark 9. 36 , 37. and receive children in christs name , and as belonging to christ , if none do visibly belong to him ? 2. but i answer fully , there is a full command for infant baptism mat. 28. 19. go ye disciple me all nations , baptizing them . where note , 1. that it is not the effect that is made their duty , but their endeavour ; else the apostles had sinned when the hearers believed not , and because all nations were not discipled . note that to be disciples and to be christians , acts 11. are made all one ; and to be discipled and to be christened . 3. note that it is not here and there one , but nations , that they must endeavour to disciple : and as the jews are called a holy nation , so it is said , i will give thee the heathen for thine inheritance , psal . 2. and isa . 55. 8. mal. 1. 10 , 11 , &c. the conversion of the nations and heathens is promised : and the word and our experience have both said , the kingdoms of the world are become the kingdoms of the lord , and of his christ . but kingdoms and nations contain infants ; and he discipleth not a nation that discipleth no infants in the nation . the apostles were commanded to discple whole nations : the infants are parts of whole nations : therefore the apostles were bound to endeavour to disciple infants . object . it is only the capable parts : but infants and ideots are not capable parts . answ . i have before [ and else-where fully ] proved infants capable parts , as christ was of being head , and as infants are of societies , and of a part in covenants with men : and ideots having not the use of reason from the birth , are in the same case with infants ; and the distracted , after at age , are nothing to our case , but are capable of being distracted members ; and distraction is not excommunication , nor unchurcheth any . object . 2. they must be made disciples by teaching . answ . 1. if they be made disciples any way , they must be baptized . 2. as a mans hand or foot doth not understand by teaching , and yet is part of a disciple that 's made such by teaching ; so infants understand not , and yet are infant disciples , as being naturally so much appertaining to their parents , that by gods law the parents will goeth for theirs in consenting for their good . they are subjects before they obey , and servants of god before they serve him ( as those were to abraham that were born to him in his house , ) and as christ was a priest before he sacrificed , &c. and so they are disciples before they learn ; and made such by thes teaching which made their parents such , and taught them to dedicate them to god. if the king should send embassadours to perswade the heathens in new england at once to become christians and his subjects ; would any man doubt but when the embassadours prevail with all the adult to become the kings subjects , they do thereby make the nations , and so all infants as dependents on the parents to be subjects also ? and if the same speech of the same men make the parents both christians and the kings subjects , may it not as truly be said that that speech made the infants christians ( when the parents consent ) as subjects when they consent ? 3. if actual learning or believing were necessary to the christianity , or church-membership of all , then whenever any one were mad or distracted , or in an appoplexy ( if not every night while he is asleep ) he should cease to be a christian and church-member . and if infants as part of nations must be made disciples , and all that are discipled be baptized , ( as the investing act ) then here is a plain cmmand to baptize infants : all that must be discipled must be baptized : infants must be discipled : therefore infants must be baptized : what have you more for baptizing kings ? and if men ask for scripture presedent , or fuller proof ; 1. i also require them to give me any one scripture presedent , where ever any one that was the child of a christian , and not at age when the parents were made christians , was afterward baptized when he came to age ? prove that and you will prove something . 2. i ask them whether many points in divinity be not now taken as necessary , or sure , for which not the fourth part so much is produced out of scripture as i have done for the church-membership of infants . and seeing you have so importunately called me to a review ; i will add these few things more , [ i. ] what benefits i perceive cometh by infant-baptism . [ ii. ] what hurt would come if you could prevail against it . [ iii. ] what sin you would draw men to by rejecting it . [ iv. ] and i will tell you what thanks therefore i owe to god for preserving me from your mistakes and way . i. and i cannot but think that all these following are mercies not to be despised . 1. to be gods children , and god to be their god and father . 2. to be christs members , and christ to be their head and saviour . 3. to have the holy ghost in covenant with them , to give them his grace and help as shall be necessary to them upon the further terms on which it is by degrees to be communicated . ( of which more anon . ) 4. to have the pardon of all original sin , as to the damning punishment , and so to have the laws condemnation disabled . 5. to be members of so holy , safe , and honourable a society as the church . 6. to have their love and prayers as members . 7. to have parents obliged solemnly to endeavour to educate and use their children as members of christ , fellow citizens with the saints , and of the houshold of god. 8. to have right to heaven , so dying , by gods gift . 9. for parents and friends to have comfortable notice of all this . 10. and that they are not under the power and kingdom of the devil , as those that are rebels against the covenant , or that are without . ii. should your perswasions prevail against infant-baptism , these evils i think would follow . and whereas you say , that your think is as good as my think , pardon my modesty , and while you follow your own think , give me and others leave to judge of mine , by the evidence at least of probability which i bring . 1. i think that christian parents would want one of their motives to live in thankfulness to god , and to magnifie the grace of the redeemer , if they did beleve that all infants are in the visible kingdom of the devil , and have no promise or covenant-grant of pardon , remedy , or life . 2. the want of this demonstration of divine love would be a disadvantage to their love to god : for where much is forgiven , there will be much love. 3. it would deprive christian parents of all the forementioned comforts for their childrens good , and leave them to mourn for the dead as those that have no hopes , which any promise of god alloweth them . 4. parents would be more negligent in the pious education of their children , than they are ; for their solemn vow and promise is a great additional obligation . 5. young persons would be more bold in sin , when they know that they are under no covenant , vow or promise to the contrary : and they would usually delay their repentance and baptism ; as constantine , and many in those times did ; as thinking that [ all sin is done away when i repent and am baptized ; but it is more dangerous to sin after baptism than before : and so most would think it best to live out of the church , and to die in it ; to live as infidels , and die as christians ; to live after the flesh as do the wicked , and to be regenerate before death , and to die the death of the righteous . 6. these delayes would do [ as delay of repentance now doth to many . ] even drive away gods spirit , forfeit grace , harden the heart , so that few delayers would be converted . 7. by these delayings of repentance and liberty of sins , wickedness would more abound , and so gods judgments against the land be more increased . 8. pagans and infidels would be hardened and encouraged , by the multitudes of the unbaptized , and the paucity of christians . 9. for christians would be but few in comparison of the multitude : just as mr. tombes thinks christ would have it , [ here one and there one . ] 10. and while some delayed their baptism in scruple , ( as many now do the lords supper ) and others to take the liberty of sinning ( which were like to be the common case of youth ) and others in senseless negligence , the baptized and unbaptized would grow ( like our non-conformists and conformists ) into distinct parties , upon distinct interest in point of reputation ; and so the unbaptized become the adversaries ( for the most part ) of the baptized . 11. and the rich , and the multitude being usually the unbaptized party , they would be still the strongest , and the governours of the rest ; and the laws and government would be such as the governours . 12. and hereupon the church would be ( as before the dayes of constantine ) ordinarily under persecution . 13. this persecution would detein the most from looking towards christianity , and so hinder multitudes from comeing in to christ : and woe to them that so offend or hinder such little ones ; it were better a milstone were hanged about their necks and they were cast into the depth of the sea. 14. there would then be no sanctified families dedicated to god , ( except those few that had no children . ) 15. much less would any nation be discipled , or any one kingdom be the kingdom of the lord , and of his christ . this is not the condition that i desire and pray for : if you doubt of all or any of this , look to the easterni parts of the world , and be not worse than those that will learn by nothing but experience . judge whether under the turkish government the greek church be grown better , and whether the christians are more and holyer than heretofore . and yet the turks give liberty of religion , which most unbaptized princes do not . o dreadful case ! that ever religious persons should study , preach , pray , and fervently dispute and write to bring the christian world to this , as for the advancement of religion ! iii. to tell you of sinning , i suppose will be taken for fiery fury ; or a reproach of the godly : but i may tell you why i am not of your mind , and what sin i think i should be guilty of , if i were . 1. god made it a duty for parents solemnly to enter their children , by dedication , into the covenant of god ( as is oft proved . ) and how will men answer the non-performance hereof any more than their not praying for them , or not feeding or cloathing them ? 2. what a sin is it to rob christ of so great a part of his church ? 3. what a sin so to deny the gospel grace and promise , and to hide so much of the love of god ? 4. what a sin so far to confound the state of christians and pagans , as to their childrens blessing ? 5. what a sin so to enlarge and honour the devils kingdom , as to give him all mankind visibly , till they come to age ? 6. what a sin to rob parents of so much of their due comfort . 7. what a sin to deprive so many millions of covenant-pardon , grace and life , by hindering the acceptance and consent ? 8. what a sin thus to change and take from the word , yea from the very covenant of god ? 9. what a sin to vilifie so great mercy , as if it were none , and to preach such ingratitude ? 10. what a sin so to dishonour christ , as if sin abounded so much more than his grace , as that all infants being visibly condemned , not one in the world is visibly pardoned or justified ? 11. yea to make christ so like satan and contrary to himself , as to come into the world to cast or keep all mankind in infancy out of the church and covenant of grace ; and when his name is called jesus , because he saveth his people from their sins , he will take none for his people , till age , nor save any infant visibly from sin , either guilt or habit , and so be no jesus to any but the adult , that we can know of : when yet before his comeing it was otherwise ; and so to make the gospel much harder than the law , and the yoak of christ harder than the yoak of circumcision . 12. yea and to make the gospel church more narrow and unhappy than all the pagan nations were before , whose children might have been proselited with the parents . 13. what a sin is it to teach men to be thus unnatural , and cruel to their off-spring ? 14. what a sin to teach all that are not re-baptized , that they break no baptismal vow or covenant , nor sin against it , because they never were baptized . 15. and is it nothing so to cross our prayers , [ let thy kingdom come ] and to pray and endeavour that christs kingdom may not extend to any of mankind , till they actually at age believe . but the great difficulty which it will be expected that i resolve , is , whether i do not imply , that all the children of true christians dedicated to god , having saving grace in their infancy , many after fall from it , seing experience tells us , that too many prove ungodly . i answer , 1. so much of scripture , and so great and many mercies must not be all denyed , when a difficulty ariseth in the way , which we cannot at the present answer : else what would become of most mens christianity it self ? 2. this was no difficulty to the antient fathers , no not to augustin and his followers , and so to all the known church of christ for a thousand years after the apostles , who commonly held that even of the adult , many fall from true grace , justification , and a state of life ; some appropriating perseverance to the elect , ( as austin ) and some to the confirmed in grace , and some to both . 3. it is hard that they that cannot extricate themselves out of such difficulties , will but reproach those that offer them their help : but this is not the first time that i have ventured upon their ingratitude : i speak of it still as a difficulty ; but what i have said in my [ more reasons for infants church-membership . ] seemeth most probable to me , viz. 1. all christians confess that adam fell from a state of salvation , or right to life , at present . 2. adams grace which he lost , was a power to love god , and obey him , which he could use or suspend . 3. beyond a meer power , there is in the sanctified by the in-dwelling spirit of adoption ; gracious habits of love and obedience : what adam had of this i am not here to determine . 4. beyond meer weak habits , there is in some , such habits as are strong , confirmed and radicated . ( 5. and in heaven above all these , there is full perfection . ) now i apply this , 1. actual and habitual , love and obedience , is in the sanctified adult by the indwelling spirit ; for actual love and obedience is their duty , which the habit is joyned to . 2. vocation giveth faith and repentance in act , with some seminal disposition to the said acts and habits of love and obedience , ( as amesius medull . de orat. ) not yet habits ; and this vocation goeth before sanctification , faith being the condition on which the spirit of adoption and sanctification is promised . 3. so much grace may be given to infants , as was to adam , as to meer power to do what he did not , and as the dominicans call sufficient , or necessary grace ; and perhaps such as is the innitial disposition before full sanctification . and this much may qualifie them for present pardon and justification , for actual love and obedience is not their duty , and consequently not the proper habit , beyond a power and seminal disposition , as of necessity to their first state of grace : and as adam lost this much , so may they . 4. the sanctifying spirit of adoption , is not promised to infants to work such acts in them as they are not yet capable of , nor such habits , as in gods usual order follow such acts ; but he is related to them as their sanctifier , because christ will send the spirit as they come to the use of reason , to help them in holy acts , and so to habits , if they forfeit not his help . which some do ( besides the perfidious neglect of parents ) and so lose that infant-grace . 5. but all gods elect shall certainly have more than this grace of sufficient , necessary , losable power and disposition , and shall at age have actual faith , love , and obedience if they live . 6. what ever infant dyeth in the state of that grace & disposition ( which we call sufficient , & in its nature was as loseable as adams ) shall be perfected in his access to the perfecting glory ( as all imperfect saints are , ) and is one of the elect , and shall by promise be saved : ( allowing degrees of glory : ) if there be no need , or evidence of this solution , and you have any other surer way , then cast this by as [ rotten dictating . ] thus far i have given you an account of my review : but yet i here repeat again ; that if you would be contented your selves , to satisfie your own consciences to be re-baptized , ( as one that doubted whether he were well marryed would secure it by being marryed over again ) and would afterward live peaceably in communion with your brethren , and not appropriate church-communion to your sect. and if you would not deny our infant part in the covenant of grace , the promise of pardon , and life by christ , and our infant church-membership , and only delayed the baptismal investiture , as tertullian desired , for the more solemn inauguration , and obligation ; though i should not be of your mind , i should live in as loving forbearance and communion with you , as with other christians . but if when we are for peace , you are for church-wars , and cannot differ from us without dividing , unchurching , unchristening , avoiding , and even contemning or slandering almost all the christians in this and former ages , in such things i will have no communion with you . the fathers likened re-ordaining , and re-baptizing . if any would satisfie his own conscience with being ordained again for surety , not unchurching , degrading , avoiding , reproaching , persecuting those that are not of his mind , i would break no peace with such a re-ordained person : but if the re-ordaining sectaries will say as you , our way only is right , we only are the true ministers and churches , and turn like to donatists , i am not of their mind . and i here profess , that while i tell you of my dissent from your extream , it implyeth no liking of the contrary extream of those that would confound the christians & the heathens , so far as equally to baptise all their children , if any baptized person will but perfidiously promise that for them , which they never made any intelligent man believe that ever they intended to perform : nor can i love the hypocritical religion of the pharisees , which turneth almost all into ceremony , as if they had to do with none but children ; nor the turning of catechising and confirmation into a lifeless formality , to be instead of a serious profession at age , of the christian covenant , and a solemn intelligent transition to the church priviledges of the adult . i know that it is satans game , first to draw hypocrites to mortifie gods ordinances , and turn religion into an image or a carkass ; and thence to stir up others in several sects , instead of reviving them , to loath and bury them . woe to the world because of offences , and woe to them by whom they come . before i come to my fourth part , which is my application to my self , i must take notice of some more of your applicatory letter in the way : and if i disorderly repeat some things , in following so disordered a leader , you ( at least , whatever others do ) must take it patiently , it being far short of the tedious work which you seem to call for : you would have mr. danvers his letter answered , and you would have better proof for infant baptism . it is not in my power to believe the reasons of my two books , which you generally take for none , to be no sound reasons ; nor to believe mr. danvers his books not to be such a bundle of most gross mistakes and vutruths , as i scarce ever before met with , from a professed christian . if i mistake , it is not in my power to do otherwise , were i to die this hour . and if i have offended the anabaptists by a faithful perswading them to repent of the doleful work which they have made in england , my conscience more accuseth me for doing it no more , than for doing so much . if you take all men for as bad as you describe me , that wish your repentance for such works , and also for our woful church divisions , and differ from you about infant-baptism , and that yet beg for mutual forbearance , and peaceable communion with you , i am not of your spirit or mind , and hope neither to live nor die in so narrow a communion . as for any more answering any of you , those that i converse with , tell me it is needless ; i repent that i have been drawn by contenders so often to interrupt more useful work . if more be needful , let them do it that have leisure , and longer life . you say , that it is now a common question whether ever i will die a martyr ? i am sorry that your acquaintance are hardened , and used to questions that so little concern them , and that are so unmeet for their determination : if suffering be the best state , how happy hath this kingdom been made by the overturners ? do you mean that you doubt whether ever the anabaptists will have power enough to effect it ? they attempting what they did against me too late , just when they and their co-partners were a pulling down themselves and others ? or do you mean , that till we are martyred we are not capable of your good opinion ? ( and are all the anabaptists graceless that are yet unmartyred ? or have more anabaptists than poedobaptists been martyred in our times ? ) or is it only your prognostick on supposition of my tryal ? i have more cause to distrust my self , and beg gods strengthning grace , than boastingly to foretel , though all men deny thee , yet i will not . ] but your talk of [ my flight , and others suffering by proxie for me ] doth but shew that you have not that care of avoiding falshoods in matter of fact , which might invite us to think that you are liker than others to be sound in doctrine . but had you not mistaken , yet i might have admonished you , not to have condemned every anabaptist that hath taken a grosser flight , than a sick mans going for his health into the countrey , when he had neither any flock , nor vndertaking , nor call to hinder him : at least that you mock not at paul for being let down by the wall in a basket , nor at christ for his flight into aegypt , or withdrawing into the wilderness , and into gallilee , &c. nor for saying , when they persecute you in one city , flee to another : or at least pass no hard sentence on your self for being yet alive ; no nor on mr. tombes for writing against separation , and for communion with the parish churches . but in the end you [ beseech me in the bowels of jesus christ , and as i will shortly answer at the great and dreadful tribunal that among my other errata , i would repent of that absurd and heretical position , of a baptismal covenant of grace running in a fleshly line . answ . but 1. just thus the quakers dreadfully adj●re me to repent of all that 's against their way ; and must i therefore do it ? and yet mr. hicks , ives , and other anabaptists treat them far more sharply than cover i did the anabaptists . 2. i have so many years looked for my appearing at the tribunal of christ , that if i should not be true to that light which doth appear to me , i were more unexcusable than yet you think me . but will your word at that tribunal pass for law , or for my justification , if i should contradict the grace and covenant of god , and his church laws and state from the dayes of adam to this day ? how shall i be sure that it is the bowels of christ , and not self-conceitedness , and the zeal of a dividing sect , in which you make this carnest sute to me ? 3. especially when you so unintelligibly recite my supposed errour , and give me not a word of answer against that abundance of scripture proof which i have brought ? this is too unsatisfactory an answering of books , to beseech us to repent of them ? 4. the wisdom from above is pure , & peaceable , and without partiality . is yours so ? ask any impartial man whether you write like one that knoweth himself ? you here call us to repent of a position as absurd and heretical ? did i ever call your opinion heretical . not that i remember ? such writing as this of mine is fiery ; but your large invectives without one word of proof , and your charge of an heretical position , is nothing but christian gentleness . your phrase of a covenant running in a fleshly line , is your own . the words of a position charged as heretical , should have been truly recited . tell me where i ever used such . i refer you to my late two disputations of original sin , besides my two books of baptism , for full proof that god hath taken the children of the godly and the wicked as participants , into promises of love and mercy , and threatnings of punishment , with their parents : how far , i have there opened . your telling me that such reference is to set you the task of sysiphus , shall not so befool me as to tempt me to write the same over again : for by the like reason , others of as great authority as you may call me to write it twenty times . and if i give neer thirty scripture testimonies or arguments for our infant mercies , we that see no reason to invalidate them , will not so despise god and his laws and benefits , as to deny or reject all , because such a man as you require it , and tells us that they are all invalid . if we must take our faith on trust : it were more excusable to take it from councils , than from you . i have told you my judgement herein so often , that it is the more disingenuous in you to give it in such senseless or ambiguous words , as [ a baptismal covenant running in a fleshly line . ] gods covenant as instituted , runs no where ; but is recorded in the scripture , preached , and ministerially applyed by his ministers . mans convenanting act , is absurdly said to [ run in a fleshly line . ] but men that have flesh as well as souls , do accept gods covenant , and enter themselves and infants in the mutual convenant by dedicating both to god. natural generation ( communicating essence ) maketh your children to be naturally yours , which is so neer an interest , that original sin and suffering tells us that god esteemeth not our children naturally guiltless of the parents crimes : and he hath provided a remedy for both , and not for the parents or adult only : and the remedy is a pardoning saving covenant procured by a mediator . this convenant is vniversal to the adult , as offered on the condition of believing acceptance : and is there no promise , no covenant for infants ? why so ? have they no need of pardon , and a saviour ? or are they left remediless as the devils ? or is the promise of their salvation without any condition ? if so , is it to all , or to some only ? if to all , and so all are christs members , then all ( turks and pagans ) children should be church-members . this were to make it run unto a fleshly line indeed ? if not to all , to whom , or to how many ? is it to more than twenty in the world ? or more to christians children than others ? if it be a promise of pardon and life , and neither tell to how many , nor to whom ; 1. this is a strange promise , and is no mutual covenant ? shew us where in scripture we may find it ? 2. this then must be another species of a covenant of grace , distinct from the baptismal covenant ; and to feign and add a second sort of covenant is another kind of adding to the word of god , than adding of ceremonies is . and who can say in all the world , that any child of his hath any part in such a promise ? or that pagans have not as much of it as christians ? all promises of pardon to the adult are conditional , and some means for certain title is prescribed ? is there no means for the certain pardon of our infants ? 2. but if you will say that it is conditional , what is that condition ? that which i have still said is this , the condition is , that they be the children of the faithful dedicated to god : not meerly that they be our fleshly line ; that doth but make them ours , and ( with gods law ) enable and oblige us to dedicate them in covenant to him : but being thus in our power , and our wills for them as their own , it is our dedicating them to god , that is the immediate condition : and every true christian doth dedicate himself , and his children to god , as far as he thinks himself enabled : this dedication is virtually in our own actual sanctification , and actually when we have children , which is solemnized in baptism . what we devote to god by his will he doth accept : and we can shew his promises to the seed of his servants , and will not plead against our mercies . should we apostatize our selves , the mercies promised to the generations of them that love god , would be intercepted , and would not run to a fleshly line : but an infant by believers dedicated to god , is not unclean but holy , and so better than a meer fleshly line . to pour out your clamours against our proof , full and plain proof , of this , from the whole current of the scripture , and to vaunt , and talk with such confidence as you do in the dark , as if all this were un-proved , ( and the very second commandment were again cast out , and gods own proclamation of his name , exod. 34. 6 , 7. ) and to call for more answers , while you cry out of too much ; and to talk against dictating , while you thus obtrude your quaker-like oratory , contempt , & obtestations , instead of argument and answers ; this must not make us unthankful despisers of the promises of god. if you would thus hector men out of their inheritances , or the title of their infants to them , few would think you argued cogently : and should the words of such self-conceited singular persons , which we take to be against the scope of scripture , and consent of christs church , make us give up all infants convenant-title to church-membership , pardon and salvation ? you read frequently in the gazetts , that many set so much by their dogs , as to cry them about , and offer great rewards to those that find them , and will bring them home ; and shall all christians set so little by their children ( and so by all our own infant priviledges ) as to be hector'd out of our hopes , and renounce their great and precious promises , which number them with the houshold of god : and that by such rhetorical canting as a man of equal wit may use , in almost any other controversie ? as cicero wondered at them that pleaded against the immortality of the soul , that ever men would be such enemies to themselves , as to study for reasons against their own interest and hopes ; so i say , though our meer interest prove nothing to be true , it tells us , what we should desire ; and when we find gods word so excellently suited to our interest , let them dispute against it that will , for i will not . let the enemies of mankind or of christians , plead against the interest of mankind and of christians , and not themselves . it 's an unavoidable streight that we are in , between them that silence and ruine us in this world , among such other things , for not professing our assent , that [ it is certain by the word of god , that infants baptized ( none in the world excepted ) and dying before actual sin , are certainly saved ▪ ] not allowing us to preach christs gospel if we cannot say that all this is certain ; ( were it faith in christ himself , the weak in faith should be received ; ) and such as you on the other side , that account us even heretical if we will not be so unthankful to god , as to deny and reject the precious covenant hopes , and church-relation of our children . you know that with what measure you mete it is measured to you again by many ; and that no small number of christians have numbred anabaptists with hereticks ; and yet i that have dealt otherwise with you , am your most fiery adversary ? and why ? any judicious by-stander may see , though you cannot : just as as w. pen lately seemed to think more favourably of me than of others , till in an open dispute i had detected the evil of his cause ; and then [ he had rather be a socrates at judgment , than such a nominal christian as i : so you and your brethren that are like you , because a book or two of mine have cross'd the interest of your party , think i deserve all that you pronounce of or against me ; so powerful is interest with most mens understandings : so far as it is your mistake of the interest of christ that does mislead you , i easily bear it as the infirmity of a weak and prejudiced judgment : but so far as it is the interest of your party which is abused against the publick interest of christs church it is selfish , and such as is described at large in james 3. as for your talk of mr. danvers his words against my heterodoxes in other matters , and your supercilious insulting as if he were unanswered , i say , 1. i take him to be fully answered , and if you do not , that proveth it not to be as you affirm . 2. what more should i answer ? what doth he but recite some scrap of my words ? had he done it truly and fully , had that been any argument against them ? do i need to answer my own words , before any charge against them be proved , or proof once attempted ? was it not enough for me to lay down the contraries to my doctrines , and leave the reader to choose which he seeth best ? dare you not own the contraries , and yet continue your accusation of my words ? would not the world ( whom i blame not if they think that i have written too many books already ) condemn me for a fool indeed , if in the condition that i am in , the cant of such men as he and you , should draw me to write another volumn in defence of a volumn that defendeth it self to all judicious impartial readers , and that against one that proveth nothing in it to be erronious ? and as for those that will not impartially peruse the words accused , i have no reason to think that they will make any better use of a defence if i should write it ? and as i am past doubt that mr. d's quarrels , and your justification of them , are the effect of meer ignorance , self-conceit , partiality , and passion ; so if you prove to be the knowing men , and i the ignorant , i am sure it is not through my neglect of study , nor unwillingness to know or own the truth : and i have no cause to envy you the felicity of your greater wisdom . but if it be a wisdom that tendeth to bitter strife and to confusion , and destroyeth your love to those that differ from you , i will remember that my peace lyeth more on my love to you , than on yours or any mans else to me . as for your talk about my words in my first book that some did then baptize naked , i have given you a true answer . to contradict what i said , were to lie : i know not that you baptize any at all but by report of others ; and so i heard that then of some so credibly as that i am not able now because you call for proof almost thirty years after , to disbelieve it : i undertake not to prove it now ; ( nor that the quakers then used to quake or vomit , seeing now no such thing is seen among them : ) if really it was a misreport , and never any baptized naked in england , nor in other lands , i wish that no man may believe it . but did mr. danvers take this for so heynous an injury , and yet himself in2 books labour to prove , that for many hundred years baptizing naked was the ordinary custome ! o how far will partiality blind men ? was it the custome of all the churches , and yet a reproach to be retracted , to say that at one time divers did so , if fame , not then denyed by any of those anabaptists that i converst with , may be believed ? to conclude , sir , the importunity of mr. danvers and you have not been unprofitable to me : it hath caused me , as you desired , to review my old thoughts of infants church-membership and baptism , and to renew my thanks to the god of mercy , who hath not left all the world in their infancy unredeemed , nor without a promise or covenant of grace ; nor left christian parents to mourn for their dead infants , as those that are without hope of their salvation , and have no promise on which to ground their hope : it hath renewed my sense of the great obligation that lyeth on believing parents , both of gratitude to god , and duty for their children : it tells me that they may now love their children , as the members of the church of christ , and need not , nay must not take them as members of the kingdom of the devil ; nor yet stretch their brains to prove that there is a middle region ( like purgatory , or limbus infantum hereafter ) between the kingdom of christ , and the kingdom of the devil ; and that it is a sad employment for parents to dispute their own children out of the blessings of gods covenant , and to prove them to be in satans kingdom , and not in christs : yea it hath reminded me how much the interest of infants in their parents case is founded by god in nature it self , and to bless god for that inscription in stone of the second commandment , and that marvellous voice from heaven , exod. 34. 6 , 7. i believe that the synod of dort said truly , acts 1. 17. that faithful parents need not doubt of the election and salvation of their children dying in infancy , ( before the violation of the baptismal covenant . ) and seeing god hath pronounced our children holy , and not unclean , and told us that of such is the kingdom of god , it remindeth me how careful parents should be , as thankfully to dedicate them to god , so carefully to educate them according to their covenant , remembering that as the parents consent and dedication of them to god , is the condition of their first right to the covenant benefits , so those parents do promise their pious education ; and if they after prove false in such promises on their part , they must not charge god with unfaithfulness , if it go worse with their children than on supposition of the parents fidelity it had done ; ( though still at age they may be accepted upon repentance and personal belief : ] of which mr. whiston hath written more judiciously than any on that point that i remember . also i have been hereby made thankful that god kept me from the snare of anabaptistry ; for though i lay not so much as some do on the meer outward act or water of baptism , believing that our heart consent and dedication qualifieth infants for a covenant right before actual baptism ( which yet is christs regular solemnization and investiture , ) yet i make a great matter of the main controversie , notwithstanding that i hereticate not the anabaptists for the bare opinion sake , nor would have them persecuted ; for now i better see than ever what god hath thus preserved me from . 1. how much else might i have been led to , that tendeth towards the denying the kingdom of christ , and denying him to be the saviour of the world ; yea how neer might i have been led towards the making him to be the destroyer , or abaddon , as comeing into the world to condemn the world , and to take from them the promises and hopes of salvation : for , 1. i find that all are lost in adam , and that god made an vniversal covenant of grace with fallen mankind in adam after his fall , and renewed it with noah : i find that it is but a small part of the world that had the law of moses , the jews being to the earth , but as one village to england ; and to be king but of a village is not to be king of england . i find that the making of abraham's or moses his covenant was no repeal of the vniversal law of grace ; nor put them into a worse condition than he found them in . and i find that past all doubt infants were church-members , and in the covenant before christs incarnation , not only the circumcised but the uncircumcised females , and all the uncircumcised males in the wilderness , yea and out of the jewish nation , as well as in it , ( though the covenant of peculiarity was proper to them . ) and yet notwithstanding all this , i find , 1. that many now do exclude all the world out of christs kingdom before his incarnation , except the jews , or at least a few rare individuals more , when abraham hoped there had been fifty righteous in sodome . 2. that the same men suppose that since christs incarnation , the old law of grace made to mankind in adam and noah , is repealed , and they that cannot have the gospel are left under the meer law of innocency or none . 3. and that all mankind in their infant state is put or left out of the church of christ , and the covenant of life . and had i been seduced into all this , 1. to hold that for 4000 years christ had a kingdom no bigger than england . 2. that he came to deprive all the world that have not his gospel , of the former law of grace that was made to them . 3. and that he came to cast out of their church-state , or covenant-mercies all mankind while they are infants ; and to leave us no hope that is grounded on his covenant or promise of any infants salvation , or any description or condition whatsoever : alas , what should i have been led to ? and what guilt against christ , and of furthering infidelity , should i have incurred , under the pretense of promoting the purity of his kingdom ? ii. and if god had thus left me , i had been likely ( as i see by others ) to have gone yet farther , and narrowed the gospel church it self so much , as to have confined it to the anabaptists ; or to have thought all the rest of the christian world uncapable of church communion ; i might have come to revile the doctrine of gods gracious promise or covenant to our children , as absurd and heretical ; and when gratitude is the complexion of gospel obedience , this ingratitude might have been mine . iii. and then i should likely have been left to a proud over-valuing of my own opinion , and the singularity of my wisdom and integrity , as quite beyond all the christian worlds that differ from me : and out of a selfish unobserved adherence to my own conceits , to have magnified the sect that was of my own mind , above all others . iv. and then i might have been seduced to have had a hand in all the turnings and overturnings , setting up and pulling down , praying and unpraying , owning and disowning , bloody dayes and thanksgivings for them , that were since triplo heaths-parliament till 1660. and more than so , to have justified them in others , yea and that after gods most remarkable disowning them ; yea and to have abhorred and derided the very name and motion of repentance for them , and to have despised the religious retreat of nath. ward , a wise though jocular interpendent , though repentance be the only plank after shipwrack , and the great and merciful concession of the gospel . v. i might have been drawn hereby to divide christs kingdom , and to set up antichurches , whose employment should be to cry down others , and draw men into odious thoughts of one another , and to destroy christian love and concord in the world . vi. and hereby i might have been one that prepared professors to turn quakers , seekers , or ranters , to have finished the work that i began . vii . i might have been tempted to do all this as in the name of christ , and for his truth , word and church ; and so to have entitled god to all , and put his holy name to these works of darkness , and pretended his own commission for my opposing him . viii . i might have been tempted hereby to write letters as long and vehement as yours , in as or●●●cal and pious a strain , which should have been b●●… birth of my ignorance and self-conceit , and made ●… of hypocrisie ; all along pretending that i am offended with my adversary for want of an answer or proof , when indeed it were the success of his answers & cogent proofs , prevailing with multitudes against my opinion , that was the true cause of my anger : and when partiality had filled my heart with bitterness against my brother for such success , i might have been drawn to cover all from my self and others , by accusing him of fieryness or folly in generals , and by summoning him to repentance and recantation , as the quakers do , by the dreadful tribunal of god , when i cannot resist the scripture evidence which he bringeth . ix . and i might have been tempted when once prepossession , prejudice & interest of reputation had engaged me to so bad a cause , to have studyed all that i can rake together to maintain it ; and to have stretch'd all my wits to have opposed all that is brought against it , and to have made it the chief work and religion of my life , in which my thoughts , affections , time and industry should be laid out to carry on this mistaken and destructive cause , and to keep the churches of christ from loving-unity , communion and peace , till they will all unite against infants church-membership and baptism , which they never did , nor never will do : yea , and i must have taught all christian parents , that though they must love their children as they are their own , ( as heathens do ) yet that they must not love any one infant in the world , as a member of christ , or of his church , and in his covenant . x. and by all this , what a scandal should i have given to the atheists , infidels , papists and profane , to harden them in their contempt of godliness , and derision , or accusations of religious men ; as if all serious religion among us were but pride , contention , humour and hypocrisie , and a cloak for our mala●ies and crimes . yea i might have tempted them to persecution , and quieted their consciences in silencing christs ministers , for the sake of such , whom they think they use not so ill as they deserve . xi . and alass what a distraction and scandal should i have caused to the ignorant and weak , when they see so many wayes , and hear men calling them this way and that way , and terrifying them with gods judgment , and the charge of sin , if they be not of this mind or of that , till poor people ( that have a plain rule left them by christ ) are driven out of all religion , or out of their wits , as not knowing of what side and way to be . xii . and i should have been like enough to have been drawn into the guilt of persecution my self , while i cryed out against persecution . i might have persecuted my brethren with my tongue , and thought it necessary to the promoting of the cause of god , to blast their just reputation , and to make them by falshoods to become despised , lest their names should hinder my design . yea , who knows but i might my self have joyned with those whom you judged the persecuting silencers of the ministers of christ , and ruiners of the churches peace , by endeavouring the continuance of those same impositions , and keeping ministers out of the publick ministry , and depriving them of all the established maintenance , which in the judgment of the sectaries themselves is heynous sin , and all this lest repentance and altering such impositions ( unless they will do it as far as the said persons desire ) should weaken their party , and leave them under greater disagvantages ; and to have thus desired mens impenitent continuance of that which is accounted heynous persecution and devastation of the churches , and starving many thousand souls , and undoing ministers ▪ and their families , might have made all this to be my own by such consent , yea and endeavour ; and the pitiful shift of [ opposing a comprehension , to keep off our own sufferings , or our weakening , and the dividing of the non-conformists . ] might have been an opiate to my conscience for so heynous an iniquity . xiii . yea , who knows but i might have come to that inhumanity , and immodesty as to falsifie publick history , against the common notice of all the learned world ; and to have faced down mankind that the novatians were against infant baptism , and so were the donatists ; and that austin wrote divers books against them , as holding that opinion ; and that the brittains of old were of the same mind , and the waldenses since , and wickliffe also , &c. and if learned men had wondred at my impudence , i might have comforted my self that my followers will believe me : yea and to have furiously calumniated those that detect my sin , and call me to repentance , and to have reproached them as foolish and fiery who will defend the mercies of christ , and their infant hopes and title to pardon and salvation . these and many more evils i might have been seduced into , if i had yielded to those reasonings that would have drawn me to deny the graces of the covenant ; and which in my youth once did cause some doubting in me , till i diligently studyed the point ; my ignorance of the true nature of the covenant and baptism , and the weakness of many writers arguments against the anabaptists , being then my great temptations . and now , sir , i thank you for calling me , in the bowels of christ , as i will answer it at gods dreadful tribunal , to a review of the cause which i was drawn by your brethren to defend : for it causeth me in the review of the nature and reasons of it , to renew my thankfulness to god for my preservation , and that he hath made any use of me to vindicate his covenant , and the mercies given by it to mankind , and for saving me from this fore-described deluge ; and i solemnly protest in his sight , that knoweth my heart , that if i knew , or by study could find out that papists , conformists , separatists , anabaptists , or quakers were in the right , i would quickly and joyfully declare my consent , & be glad before i die , to joyn with them , and recant what i have held , or said , or done against them . but the reasons which i have given in my two books , and which mr. jos . whiston ( above most others ) hath lately given , seem to me unanswerable . and yet i doubt not but mr. danvers or you can answer them all ; there being few causes so clear that a man may not talk against , as long as his talking faculty holds out : but do not expect that i should offend you by replying , to words which i think need no reply , unless the necessities of such as are deceived by you do require it . blessed be that mercy that will shortly reconcile his dark mistaken wrangling children in the world of reconciling light and love , in the perfect vnity , which grace is now preparing us for , and they that live in faith and love , are breathing after : and woe to them who by dead formalities elude and hinder mens solemn intelligent owning of their baptismal covenant at age , and thereby make anabaptists , and make infant-baptism seem a crime . london , decemb. 31. 1675. rich. baxter . mr. danvers his third reply considered , at mr. hutchinson's invitation . before the receipt of mr. hutchinsons letter , i knew nothing of mr. danvers his third reply , which i have now perused : though by his conclusion one would think that he took open rebuke for a tolerable , yea acceptable , friendly office ; yet finding how impatiently he receiveth it , and that the detection of his voluminous untruths doth but occasion him to defend them , and to stir up all his forces to render the reprover odious , and so doth but exasperate his disease , i thought my self disobliged from any farther attempts to bring him to repentance ; and those that yet need more to save them from the belief of his historicall misreports , are persons that i have not leisure enough to satisfie . i again profess , that the experience of these last fifteen years , of the strange incredibility of some men on both extreams , [ the violent and the dividing ] about notorious matters of fact , hath done more to bring me to great unbelief of all mankind , so far as i find them pre-engaged by contention , and by a carnal , or a sideing factious interest , than all that ever i before had read , or heard , or seen : i should once have thought that i had been injurious to humanity it self , if i had thought such men as incredible as some have now declared themselves in print to be : i scarcely now believe any meer humane history any farther than the agreement of men of contrary minds and interests , in matters of common and easie notice , giveth a kind of natural evidence to it , beyond what it borroweth from the honesty of the writer ; or at least farther than the footsteps of very great candor , conscience and unbyassed impartiality shall speak more for my belief , than the authors most confident words or oaths . and herein modest men , and disinterested peace-makers are now believed by me , before all the greatest , the learned'st , and the most zealous contenders in the world . davids saying , that all men are lyars , and pauls [ let god be true , and every man a lyar , ] were too much overlooked by me , till men themselves had told me what they are ; and warned me to cease from man , as vanity . mr. danvers his accusations were partly of such publick parties ( the ancient churches , the novatians , the donatists , the old brittains , the waldenses , the wickliffians , &c. ) and partly of such publick writings ( as augustines and many others ) as one would think any scholar that will read the cited books might soon see whether he or i be the falsifyer , especially about a practical matter , in which their judgments could not easily be hid from all the adversaries about them , no more than from those of their own mind and way . his accusation of the novatians he neither defendeth ( that i see ) nor confesseth to be a slander ; but silently passeth all the matter by . his accusation ( for such it is ) of the rest ( for the most part at least ) he still defendeth . he cannot repent of it ; and i can no more believe him when i have read the books that are our records , than i can if he would as fiercely contend , that the bishops , or church of england are anabaptists , because of his accusation of the now bishop of lincoln . but should i be so injurious to the reader and my self as to cast away precious time in again and again answering his untrue citations and expositions of words which are before our eyes ? and which neither his word or mine can satisfie any reader of , who must know the truth by the books themselves ! when he tells men of my writing for popery , conformity , &c. can his yea or my nay go for proof with any that is in doubt which of us saith true ? must not the perusal of the full words decide the case ? and so it must as to his accusations of the several churches and parties in questions : and if his believers would be perswaded that the welsh tongue is the common language of england , if he do but vehemently affirm it , and revile such as contradict him , i could not help it , nor must i write books about it , as long as he hath leisure , ink and paper to hold on . his exclamations of the unsatisfactories of these general answers , ( or refusals ) shall not tempt me to cast away the little relicts of my time , in numbring and disproving all the vntruths that he hath written , and will write . by what law am i condemned to such a drudgery ? the very first paragraph of this his third reply hath more than one or two . but the chief substance of his book is his reiterated accusation of my words in my first book , that [ many then baptized naked ] for which , as a heynous calumny , i must repent . readers , my conscience telleth me that repentance is such an excellent healing duty , that i shall loath my self so far as i find my self unwilling of it ? but is it possible for a man to repent of all that the several contradicting sects ( papists , quakers , anabaptists , &c. ) call him to repent of , when that is best with one side which is the worst to divers others ? we are openly agreed , 1. that the baptizing naked is not the usual way of the anabaptists in england . 2. that it was not the way of the most of them when i wrote that book . 3. that we heard of none with us in england that for any considerable time continued it . the questions remaining are 1. whether when i wrote those words , the common fame or report of the countrey where i lived took it not for as certain that divers then in some places did it , as the most scriptural way , as that the quakers quaked , and that the ranters swore ? 2. whether ever any anabaptist that then was acquainted with me , yea or any one person denyed it to my hearing or knowledge ? 3. whether mr. tombes denyed it when i wrote it ? all these i will no farther trouble the reader about , than to tell him that he neither doth , or can disprove me , and should i recant what i said of these three questions , i must tell three downright lyes ? and is that a safe way of repenting ? 4. but let the question be whether i did well to believe it ? i answer , i believed it not as a divine revelation , but as a humane report ; which constrained a proportionable belief , which it was not in my power to deny ? 5. but should i not yet disbelieve it ? answer , i am more willing to do it than not , but i am not able : i do believe ( according to the measure of the aforesaid evidence ) that it is a truth ? i cannot believe the contrary : i hear not a word to warrant me to disbelieve it : it is not in my power , and i must not lie , to say that i believe it not . 6. but the next question is , did i not say more , or mean more at least , than that it was but [ at that time ] [ the practise of many but not of most , or their ordinary way ] and that i knew it no otherwise than by uncontradicted fame ? ] answer , either i did say or mean more , or i aid not . if i did , i hereby renounce it , and declare that i wronged them . if i did not , ( as i know i did not ) to say i did were to lie ; and is it worthy his writing a book to tempt a man to lie ? if he will prove that i said more , the words must decide it if ; that i meant more , he is not to be believed of my heart , as if he knew it better than i. but he proveth it ( that i intended them all ) contrary to my most express words . 1. he saith , it is my scope and design ? 2. from my arguments , which take in the whole party ? 3. from the instance , &c. reader , if i were to teach a man to understand my book , before he wrote against it , i should have some little hope of true dealing in his report , how weak soever his arguing were : but when i must deal with a man that understandeth not plain english , because partiality will not suffer him , and will not learn to understand what he doth not , and yet cannot forbear a publick contradicting it , till he understand it , would it not be a slavery to be tyed to write against such a man as long as he would write , should i live so long ? i joyned together , as the mode of their re-baptizing , their doing it in cold water or rivers , some naked , and the rest ( the usual way ) next naked , that is , in a linnen shift , or vest , only to cover them . i took that which in the hotter countreys was safe , to be in our frigid countreys a breach of the sixth commandment ; and can prove , that he that said , [ go learn what that meaneth , i will have mercy and not sacrifice ] would not have plunging over head in cold water , to be the ordinary way with us . i supposed that as among the naked indians , use maketh nakedness a less provocation to lust , than it would be here ; so also in the hotter regions , of the world , their appearing publickly next to naked , in one linnen vest or shift , was less unseemly than it would be here : david might dance so before ark , though michel thought it impudent ; and they might usually were such garments as would not have kept their nakedness from being seen , if they had gone by steps upon the altar ; and such as if it were but turned aside would leave their nakedness as noah's was to spectators : custome is of great signification in such things . but i appeal to common modesty with us in england , whether it would not be a breach of the seventh commandment to come to church , or walk the streets , or appear in assemblies in our shirts and smocks ? now this man first feigneth me to say that it is adultery , because i say it is a breach of the seventh commaadment , as if nothing but adultery were there forbidden ? next to prove that i mean it of them all , that [ they baptize naked ] he alledgeth that i said , that all or most did it , [ naked or next naked ] and , are these all one ? pray doth he not disprove himself ? is it not sure that he that saith , [ some baptize naked , and others next naked ] doth not say of all [ that they baptize naked ] what should one say to such a man as this ? but he saith , that [ some naked and next naked are much at one . ] answer , that 's but another of his untruths , from whom they flow so easily that i may not number them . a grosser and lesser breach of the seventh commandment are not much at one with me . i never said or thought that they were . if i had , is that any thing to the question in hand ? can he prove that i said [ all baptized naked ? ] if i had said , that i took [ next naked ] to be as bad . 2. but de facto , doth he deny the latter ? it seems here that he doth . i profess also that i go in this but by common fame . if they baptize not next naked in one linnen shift , i never heard it denyed till now ? i renounce the mention of it if it be untrue ; but it is not in my power to disbelieve it . but because i never saw it , if he will say that they baptize them all in hats , bands and cuffs , i will not peremptorily deny it . but he will prove that i meant not [ common fame ] because i add [ experience , &c. ] but sure i never alledged my own experience . ] i never saw any of them baptize : i never heard a ranter blaspheme , ( though i have read letters full of it ; ) nor i never saw a quaker quake . if you say that they never did so , i will not prove it . but how shall other mens experiences be known to me , but by report or fame ? and i think that the more common and uncontradicted the report is , it is the more probable . i have not leisure to go on at this rate with such a writer ; i again profess that i had rather retract what i said than not , if i could do it without lying , but i cannot . but , reader , what 's all this to the question , whether our infants are in covenant with christ , or visible members of his church ? is it not a meer diversion ? but the last question is , have i not wronged their cause by wronging the persons , in believing fame , that ever any of them baptized naked ? answer , 1. i have not the books now to peruse , ( men of his spirit , though of another opinion , have disabled me at this time from confuting him by books . ) but i am past doubt , that i have read of their baptizing naked in forreign writers . 2. but , reader , could one that had read this book of his against me , for this passage as injurious , believe if he had not seen his other books , that it is this same man himself , who in his two former books maintaineth it against us , that for many hundred years , baptizing naked was the churches practise ? was this no injury ? or shall the same man take me as injurious for believing the same of some of them for a very little time ? i hope i have almost done with such disputers . as to what he saith of mr. lambes and mr. allens . ( who have left them , ) exceedingly as he hears , blaming me for broaching , much more for defending this slander . ] i answer , 1. his heresay's have quite lost their credit with me : i believe it never the more for his hearing it : they never blamed me to my face : and i think that they are men likely to do it in that friendly way , if any way ; and therefore at least i may hear from them hereafter ; and if so , their reproof shall be willingly considered . if it be true , i suppose it is , because they have mistaken me as he doth , as if i had spoken that of their ordinary practice , which i mentioned only as the practice of some only at that time ; which was as short and confined as the quakers quaking . 2. is it a slander of mr. tombes his citing vossius , or of vossius cited by him , to say that some baptized naked in former times ? 3. is it then no slander of mr. danvers to say , and stiffly defend it , that the ancient churches ordinarily did so ? doth he who so pleadeth for immersion , because it was the first way , now take it for well done in the ancient churches , and an intollerable slander that it should be said to have been done of any of late ? he next cometh to defend his false report of a paper which i read to some people that i preached to : the first hour that ever i spake to them , i openly professed that we met not there as separating from the publick assemblies , but for the necessary instructing of the people , who else had none , nor any publick worship of god : the parish of giles where i lived , and the parish of martins where i preached are supposed to have 1000000. souls or neer : of these it is supposed that not above 6000. can hear in the parish churches at the most ( and the incumbent of one had not officiated at all for many years : ) it grieved me to think that while the king aintainerh a corporation and revenew for propagating the gospel in america , and the jesuites are justly praised for doing so much to propagate it in the east indies , we should sluggishly suffer america and the indies to come so neer whitehall , and so famous and religious a city as this , to be ( to so great a number ) without any publick worship of god , while mahometans are not quite without . therefore to my great cost i preached neer a year over the market-house at st. james's . and when the informers began with me , and accused me to the justices of meeting contrary to the act against conventicles , i gave my reasons to some justices , and others , in word and writing , to prove that neither i , nor such others , might be judged breakers of that act , because we did not meet to worship god with any other manner of worship than what is according to the liturgy and practice of the church of england ▪ for though we did not so much as they , we did nothing but what they do : for we did but read the scriptures , pray freely in the pulpit , and preach the christian doctrine ; and all this the church of england doth : and though i did not read my self , but another did it , it was because i was not able , which if i were , i would do it . and expecting quickly to have the cause come to a tryal , i wrote the sum of this in a paper , and read it openly , and then gave it the clerk , that none might misreport me : and though some able and pious lawyers that perused my large reasons , thought that they were very useful for others as well as me , yet the noise and murmuring of some women first , and such as mr. danvers after , sent abroad my reproaches for it through city and countrey , with so many false additions , and so much displeasure , as added somewhat to my former knowledge of the difference between sectarian and christian zeal . surely these men do think themselves very grear haters of sin , who would render that man odious as a heynous sinner , who doth but speak those words to vindicate himself and others from the accusation of informers , which he verily believeth to be true and useful : when a man hath for about fourteen years , not only preached without pay , but at many score pounds a year charges ; when he hath never taken away one of their communicants from any parochial , or non-conformists church , nor meddled with either sacrament , nor ever set up his own preaching against theirs , but desired to preach to a few of those many thousands that have none at all , nor have any publick worship of god , no not so much as the reading of the liturgy ; and when for endeavouring this in languishing and pains , by great charge and labour , his utter ruine , if not death , shall be unreconcileably endeavoured by one party , and for not hateing that which is good in the liturgy as much as they , or upon every surmise of a diseased brain , shall become the common obloquy of another , ( the sectarians , and the women that are infected by their disease : ) reader , judge whether the true belief of gods acceptance , and better than the hypocrites reward , be not necessary to keep such a one from imitating jonas , and quietly leaving men to their beloved ignorance and sin ? and whether , if we had not many soberer men between them , that are for neither of the extreams , it would not be harder preaching in england than in america ? yet with most hearty thanks to god , i must say , that notwithstanding the opposition of both these extreams , god hath abundantly sweetned his service to me ; by the ready reception and profit of such people , as men so much labour to keep in darkness . i speak all this with reference to mr. danvers his following words also of my preaching in the parish churches . the foresaid paper of mine he published in his last book , as matter of accusation ; and did it , according to his custome , falsely : i briefly mentioned his falsification : he now printeth that copy as received from his bookseller , in one column , and on the other , another , called [ the copy obtained from the original . ] to shew that there is but two words difference that is , his copy spake of my reading the liturgy , and mine spake of my own reading what my assistant read ( the scripture . ) but 1. if this be all one with him , are we not so to judge of his other expositions ? i know one whose oversight in writing usually lyeth in leaving out [ not ] and [ un . ] and what is one syllable ? the kings printer , who as dr. heylin saith , was fined in the star-chamber for printing [ thou shalt commit adultery . ] left out but one poor syllable . but he did not justifie it as mr. danvers doth . 2. if it be his excuse to lay the copy on his bookseller , may we not take it also for his answer , that all the untruths that he hath said of the novations , donatists , brittains , augustine , &c. he had them from — some body of as great authority as his bookseller ; and then all 's well . 3. but , reader , dost thou not expect that at least he should now say true after so much warning , and that this should be a true copy which he saith , without exception , is [ obtained from the original . ] i assure thee on the word of a christian , it is yet so far from being true , that divers lines , even a considerable part of the writing is left out . take heed therefore to thy belief hereafter . believe not every spirit , nor every man that raileth at others as less wise or spiritual than he ; what wonder if he untruly tell us of the opinion of whole parties , novatians , donatists , &c. and tell us of whole books that have not one word of what he affirmeth , but somewhat for the contrary , when he will not only falsifie my own writing , even a few lines , but defend his so doing against my self that have the copy by me , and that by a greater falshood than the first . are this mans citations to be credited ? yet he goeth on and averteth that [ there is not another syllable different ] and he will prove moreover , that ▪ if i meet not on pretense of any religious exercise in other manner , &c. i must accordingly read the common-prayer my self . answer , so said the informers , but were i at the sessions upon my appeal , i would be bold to deny it , and to say that he that saith but the lords prayer , doth not use another manner of worship than the church ? and that to do less , is not to do that which is of another manner . but if i mistake in so thinking , it followeth not that i prevaricate , or mean dishonestly , as he insinuateth . but if he want more matter of reproach , or any such as he , i will voluntarily give him more , so careless am i of such censures : i do therefore tell him that i am no greater an adversary to the liturgy than were the old non-conformists , mr. hildersham , who perswadeth men to come to the beginning of it ; mr. knewstubs that constantly read much of it ; mr. ball , that wrote the tryal of separation ; mr. bradshaw , mr. paget , mr. gifford , and such others that did the like : and that , as before the wars , when i was accounted a non-conformist , i did ( at bridgnorth ) usually read most of the lords dayes part of the liturgy , ( and as in 1660. the ministers of london consented so to do ) to would i do again , on the same terms : and that if my nonconformity did consist only in the contrary , i should have little reason to blame the conformists for the sharp censures which they write against me . he keepeth constantly in his way , and addeth [ — it is confidently affirmed by some , that mr b. hath lately in hartfordshire or buckinghamshire , in order to obtain the pulpit ( where he several times preached in publick ) read the common prayer , or at least some part of it , out of the service book . ] answ . 1. who is it that this man converseth with whose confident reports he published ? are his reporters infected with his disease ? 2. why doth he print this confident report if not to be believed ? and if so , alas , will he put no bounds to this sin , while he thinks that he cryeth down our sin ? i thank god for my time , strength and liberty , i did preach fourteen times in several parish churches of those counties , after thirteen years exclusion from the pulpits of such churches ; and it is not in the power of this mans pen to make me repent of it . but in all those times , i never read either one word of common-prayer , nor one chapter or psalm , save once , when i preached where there was no one to read , i read the scripture as i would have done at home . will not the presence of thousands of witnesses secure a man from the forgery of any unnamed slanderer ? no , it will not : as after our savoy conference untruths were printed against me , contrary to the most notorious evidence of writings and witnesses ; so sometimes where i preach in london , it is not the multitude of witnesses that secureth me from the gross false reports of this kind of auditors , ( who have not so much kindness for their own souls as either to stay away , or forbear their untruths . ) no wonder then if witnesses at 26 years , or 26 miles distance , or neer , be no security against such a one as mr. danvers , or his confident reporters . he adds , [ though it is also said that he hath obtained that publick liberty by vertue of a license he hath from the arch bishop of canterbury : but whether it be one formerly granted by him , when the bishop of london before the act of conformity , ( when by the bishop of worcester he was silenced in those parts ) or since is worthy inquiry ? answ . it 's like you have enquired , and found that it was the former ; if not , i tell you now : but to some it is almost as hard to believe a truth that is against their spleen , as to speak it . he next saith , as the exposition of my sufferings , [ viz. to fly from his place and charge , if not to avoid the cross of christ , and to shun a suffering witness when so loudly call'd thereto ] answ . 1. did you hear his case , or do you judge before you hear it ? 2. these passages are too conformable to the rest . how prove you that it was a flight ? how prove you that it was from my charge ? ( reader , it is fifteen years since i had any charge , of any one congregation , more than over the rest of the land , unless my dwelling made my neighbours become my charge ? i had no charge of any but my family there , unless my great charge in preaching to them for nothing , and paying assistant , &c. and building a place in hope of more such labour , made them my charge ? and if i give an hundred pounds to one man , when i owed him no more than others , doth that make him for the future become my charge ? ) and how proveth he that i was lowdly called to suffer ? or that it was the cross of christ that i avoided ? this man is against dictating ! i would he were more against untruths ! my sufferings have been enough to shew what men are that procured them , but to me so small , that except my restraint from preaching , i account them not worthy of the name of the cross . but yet i will hope that he will so far suspend his custome , as not to say , that any sectarian preacher in england , anabaptist or separatist , ( to go no farther ) that lost not his life , hath lost more of the world , by his meer non-conformity , than i have done ? he sends my conscience here to divers scriptures , 2 cor. 6. 4 , 5 , 6. acts 20. 11 , 12 , 13. mat. 10. 38 , 39. john 10. 12 , 13. mat. 23. 2 , 3 , 4. i am willinger to hear these texts than him . i suppose he meaneth not those that i before minded mr. hutchinson of , of christs early flight into aegypt , or his oft avoiding the jews , in nazareth , and other parts of galile , the wilderness , &c. nor his , bidding us when persecuted in one city flee to another ; nor pauls being let down the wall by a basket ; nor the scattering of the disciples , by the persecution at jerusalem , nor pauls circumcising timothy , non his shaving his head for his vow , nor his appeal from the jews to caesar , nor his crying out that he was a pharisee , nor his denying that he had done any thing against the temple or the law , nor any such like . and if he condemn christ and paul it will be no suffering to them . the first text tells us that paul in much patience bare afflictions , necessities , distresses , stripes , imprisonments , &c. answ . what thence ? is it ergo r. b. did ill to come out of the goal when he was put in ? or that he did ill not to put himself in again ? did paul sin for not scourging and imprisoning himself ? the next text speaketh of pauls preaching till midnight ? ergo r. b. should not preach in the summer in the country ? i deny the consequence . it may be he meant acts 21. 13. paul was ready to be bound or die at jerusalem ! what thence ? ergo he sinned in avoiding suffering oft before ? or , ergo r. b. should not have gone into the countrey either for health or preaching ; yea if it had been in case of danger to have preached to many instead of fewer that had often heard him ? i deny the consequence . the next text tells us that we must take up our cross and follow christ , &c. and what thence ? ergo we must make our own cross , and take up that instead of christs ? or , ergo , christ sinned in avoiding the cross so oft before ? or , ergo , r. b. must go into a prison that he may give over preaching the gospel ? i deny all these . what kin are they to the text ? have all the anabaptists and separatists lived all this while in sin , that lived out of prison ? or that have had maintenance and quietness , while r. b. hath been laid in the common goal , and hunted by one sort , and reviled by the other ? why will not the persecution of your pen or tongue prove a comfortable suffering for the truth , as well as if i pleased your spleen in preferring a chosen prison before a pulpit ? the next text tells us , that the hireling deserts the sheep by fleeing . thus the quakers also talk to me when they call me hireling . but , sir , i am not so much as a hireling ? much less the owner of the sheep ? i would i knew which of these two you judge your selves to be ? for my part i am neither . christ is the owner ? i am not so much as the pastor of any flock : and ( that i may not discourage your contempt , i add ) nor ever , that i remember , called to be such these 13 or 14 years : nor have i so long taken any hire . and did paul flee like a hireling when he went from places of less liberty to other more commodious places to preach ? did not pain , weakness , and want of money for so chargeable a work disable me , my conscience would command me ( by the motive of experience ) to go about preaching from place to place , though every d●g in the streets where i pass , should bark nothing but [ hireling , hireling . ] the last text is against separation ; the scribes and pharisees sit in moses his seat ; all therefore whatsoever they bid you observe , that observe and do , but do not ye after their works , for they say and de not , for they bind heavy burdens , and grievous to be borne , &c. and what from hence ? ergo i should not preach in the parish churches ? or is it , ergo i should have bound heavy burdens for my self ? or is it , that i should not ●ave made such for others ? this is the likest sense ; f●r the best way of expounding authors is by similar passages . and were not this an untruth it would be non-conformable to the rest aforesaid . but ( saith he ) is not this a strange paradoxe that he should suffer at the rate for a non-conformist at london , and yet act the part of a conformist to so high a degree in the countrey ? answ . this is very conformable to the rest . to preach in the parish churches ( for his story of reading the common prayer is like his books ) is the high degree of conformity . this is expository . i now perceive what it is in me to be [ for conformity and against it , for popery and against it , for arminianism and against it , ] as he saith . the equivocation maketh all true . i am for the conformity , and the popery , and the arminianism of preaching christs gospel in parish churches ( which the papists say they sometime said mass in ) and for the conformity and popery of infants part in the covenant of god , for their baptism , and for the reading of gods word , for the creed , the lords prayer , and the ten commandments ; and for the love of brethren , and the unity , peace and concord of christs church ; however i be against that which the world commonly knoweth by the name of conformity and popery . o what a high degree of conformity did the old non-conformists exercise in this mans sense ! i have lived long to little purpose it such a man by the bare names of conformity , popery , or arminianism can frighten me out of my christianity , my honesty , my charity , my min●stry , and my wits . next relating my story with more caution than usual [ with an [ if i be not misinformed : ] ( o that this sentence had been twice or thrice in every page of his books ) with some truth , some mistake , and more omission , he subjoyneth , that [ by proxie ( that 's his fiction ) i suffer imprisonment for a non-conformist in london , and in person out doe all the non-conformists by his publick preaching in the countrey as a conformist . ] answ . 1. reader , by this you may see at what rates we ministers must do our masters work . woe to us if we preach not : and if we do , one sort imprison us , and seek our ruine ; and the other revile us , as if our greatest duty were our greatest sin . 2. you see what abundance of enemies the preaching of the gospel hath , when satan can stir up such men of zeal to take it for a crime . paul might preach even in the jews synagogue : i must not in a parish church . 3. you see how certain it is that the two extreams are much of the same spirit , and that they that most cry out against persecution are oft of a persecuting mind , when such men as this would silence us , or have us give over preaching to the multitude that most need it , as well as others . and so would the quakers . 4. you see what they mean that cry down a comprehension : they would not have us preach in the parish churches to the needy multitude , unless they may have all first altered according to their desire . thus w pen called me cruel for desirng a comprehension as leaving the quakers to the dogs : so that they would have us all silenced , even by those impositions which they themselves account sinful , till they and all such have their will. 5 you see here what a reproach these men would bring on non-conformity , and what strong invitations they give men to conform , by making conformity to be preaching in parish churches . 6. or you see what need you have instead of disputing longer with such men , to pray god to give them tenderer cnnsciences , that may fear to multiply untruths , which thousands of witnesses , ( of whom some were anabaptists and of other sects ) are ready to confute . especially to pray that the churches , and the peoples souls may be delivered from such as would not only unchurch all mankind till they come to age , but make it a sinful conformity than to preach the gospel in the parish churches . finis . pedo-baptism disproved being an answer to two printed papers (put forth by some gentlemen called the athenian society, who pretend to answer all questions sent to them of what nature soever) called the athenian mercury, one put forth november 14, the other november 28, 1691 : in which papers they pretend to answer eight queries about the lawfulness of infant-baptism : likewise divers queries sent to them about the true subjects of baptism, &c. keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. 1691 approx. 134 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 18 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2005-12 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a47602 wing k79 estc r12897 12934347 ocm 12934347 95726 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a47602) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 95726) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 717:5) pedo-baptism disproved being an answer to two printed papers (put forth by some gentlemen called the athenian society, who pretend to answer all questions sent to them of what nature soever) called the athenian mercury, one put forth november 14, the other november 28, 1691 : in which papers they pretend to answer eight queries about the lawfulness of infant-baptism : likewise divers queries sent to them about the true subjects of baptism, &c. keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. the second edition : to which is added twenty sylogistical arguments to disprove infant-baptism. [2], 24, 8 p. printed for the author, and sold by john harris ..., london : 1691. reproduction of original in huntington library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism. 2005-05 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-06 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-07 judith siefring sampled and proofread 2005-07 judith siefring text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-10 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion pedo-baptism disproved ; being an answer to two printed papers ( put forth by some gentlemen called the athenian society , who pretend to answer all questions sent to them of what nature soever ) called the athenian mercury , one put forth november 14. the other november , 28 , 1691. in which papers they pretend to answer eight queries about the lawfulness of infant-baptism . likewise divers queries sent to them about the true subjects of baptism , &c. the second edition , to which is added twenty sylogistical arguments to disprove infant-baptism . london , printed for the author , and sold by john harris at the sign of the harrow in the poultry . mdc xci . price four pence . an answer to the athenian mercury , vol. 4. numb. 14. concerning infant-baptism . with an account of divers questions sent by the author ( and some others ) to the athenian society , which they have not yet answered . gentlemen , who he was that sent you the first questions about infant-baptism , i know not ; whether he was an antipedo-baptist , or a pedo-baptist , is a question : but your calling upon all who had any doubts about it , to send in their objections , argues a great degree of confidence of your ability , of doing more than all before : for 't is strange you should attempt to call for all our objections , when it appears you intended to write but one half sheet of paper in answer to them ; as if you could do that in a few lines , which others , as learned as your selves , could never yet do in great volumes ; this savours ( as some judg ) of great pride , and casts much contempt upon you , and lessens your reputation among wise men who are for pedo-baptism , as well as others . and yet after all the great and mighty noise , you have not so much as in the least touched the chief questions , which , to my knowledg , were sent you near a fortnight before your said mercury came forth . and therefore to shew how disinge●●ous you have been herein , i thought it might not be amiss to spend a few spare hours upon your mercury . 1. the first question you pretend to answer is this , i. e. whether baptism ( as it is commonly taught ) is the proper and natural antitype of circumcision ? reply . as to what you speak of the customs of nations , linguisms , and of men being ignorant of radixes , or original significations in langages , seems remote to the business , and serves for little else than to blot paper , or rather to darken counsel : certainly the ordinance of baptism , one of the two great sacraments of the new-testament , doth not lie so obscure in god's word , either what it is , or who are the proper subjects thereof , that men must be at a loss about it , unless they understand the radixes , or original significations of languages . but to proceed , you would , it seems , have baptism to be the proper antitype of circumcision in some respect , and not in others . first , from the customs of the jews in proselyting the gentiles into their religion : so far you say indeed circumcision was not a type , but a continuance of a custom . now how absurd and ridiculous that is which you affirm upon this account , may appear to all . will you assert and stand by it , that baptism was a jewish custom , and so no pure gospel-institution ? doubtless , if so , the pharisees might have soon given our saviour a ready answer to his great question , viz. the baptism of john , whether is it from heaven , or of men ? mat. 21. 25. certainly there was no baptism of this nature of divine institution , before john received it from heaven . but , say you , if john baptist undertook any now way of proselyting the jews into the gospel , they had not only struggled with the opposition of his new doctrine , but also of his new practice ; therefore ( say you ) it was that this custom was continued , and had the super-addition of the full force of baptism , viz. a consignation or seal of the covenant . reply . as you confess his doctrine was new , so was his baptism no doubt ; for , as our annotators observe , his baptism was part of his doctrine . pray , what was the doctrine he preach'd ? was it not baptism of repentance for the remission of sins ? m●rk ● . 4. moreover , we do not read they were more displeased with his new doctrine , than with his new practice . 2. but what authority have you to affirm , gospel-baptism was but the continuance of a jewish custom , or was a legal rite , or rather indeed a human tradition ? for 't is evident the jews were not required , or commanded of god to baptize their proselytes , or others ; for circumcision was the only rite by which proselytes ( who were males ) were added to the jewish church , as we find god commanded abraham . and if baptism had been so frequently practised amongst the jews , as you assert , wherefore did the pharisees say to john , why dost thou baptize , if thou art not that christ , nor elias ? john 1. 25. moreover , baptism is directly called a principle of the doctrine of christ , heb. 6. 1 , 2. which doctrine our saviour saith he received from his father . if it be a principle of the doctrine of christ , it follows undeniably , he instituted it , and gave it forth . furthermore , if baptism was practised all along among the jews , i argue , either they practised it as a mosaical rite , or else as a tradition of their own : not , say i , as a mosaical rite , because moses never commanded them so to do ; for he speaks nothing of it , and yet declared all things god commanded him ; and did every thing according to the pattern shewed him in the mount. and if it was a human jewish tradition , what is become of one of the great sacraments of the new testament ? must it be look'd upon from henceforth to be nothing else than the continuance of a jewish tradition taken out of their fabulous and erronious talmud ? what kind of poisonous stuff is this you trouble the world with ? what tho the jews , who had made the commandments of god void through their traditions , did practise some such thing ; must you affirm gospel-baptism in its rise and original sprung from their custom ? and because they baptized proselytes both men , women and children , must christians do so too ? sure the custom of the romish church in baptizing of infants , as a human tradition , is every way of as good authority to warrant us so to do , as the custom of the unbelieving jews . but pray take what a learned pedo-baptist , and a son of the church of england , hath said in answer to this vain conceit ; 't is sir norton knatchbull , in his animadversiones in lib. novi testamenti , pag. 313. a● cum videam summi judicii viros in his temporibus ex rabbinis fundamenta petere veritatis , &c. but when i see in these times some men of the greatest judgment to fetch the foundation of truth from the rabbins , i cannot but stick at it : for whence was the talmud sent to us , ( they are the words ( saith he ) of buxtorf in his synagoga judaica ) that we should give so , much credit thereto , that we should believe that the mosaick law either was or ought to be understood therefrom , much less the gospel , to which they are professed enemies ? the talmud is called a labyrinth of errors , and the foundation of jewish fables ; it was perfected and acknowledged for authentick five hundred years after christ , and out of it maimonides drew his doctrine , as all the rest of them ; therefore we cannot acquiesce in such testimony — gentlemen , either answer no more questions about religion , or take more heed to what you say : for your pleading for infant-baptism , from such grounds , all may perceive tends to cast an odium and contempt on the christian religion . therefore i infer , your proof for this practice from the custom amongst the jews about baptizing of proselytes both men , women and children , proves nothing ; you were better , for the authority of it , to urge the decrees of popes and general councils ; a popish innovation is as good as a jewish one . but however , you do allow that our blessed saviour did add something to this pretended jewish custom , and hath not only put it in full force , but also made it a consignation or seal of the covenant ; and this , say you , is further strengthened by several undeniable texts of scripture , which anabaptists themselves can never get clear of ; and ask them , they must either be silent , or give such a paraphrase as we do . the texts are these : first , col. 2. 11 , 12. in whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands , in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh , by the circumcision of christ . buried with him in baptism , &c. the second , that of baptizing the israelites in the red-sea , 1 cor. 10. 2. the last is the saving of noah and his family in the ark , 1 pet. 3. 21. reply 1. but is it so indeed ? did our saviour in instituting gospel-baptism do no more than put a jewish custom to be in full force , and make it a consignation or seal of the covenant ? were you not learned and ingenious men , i should not so much admire at your notions . 2. but the truth is , in the second place , if you had not told us in your next words , to what purpose you mention those scriptures , we should have been at a great loss about it , or not well have understood your intention ; but you , like the ingenious painter , soon inform us , and tell us what 't is — i. e. you tell us , you urge not these things to prove any thing else , but the parallel betwixt circumcision and baptism , or to speak ( say you ) more properly , the necessary continuance of the old manner amongst the jews of continuing their way of proselyting the heathen . 3. was it necessary then , that a human tradition of the jews should be continued ? i am sure the apostle tells you that christ nailed all the jewish ceremonies of the mosaical law to the cross , and that they all ceased when the antitype was come ; and besure had the baptism you speak of been indeed a mosaical rite , i mean appointed or commanded of god , it had vanished with its fellows : but 't is hard christ should abolish all legal customs , or ceremonial ordinances , and yet confirm , with some addition , a custom of the jews own inventing . 4. you do not seem to distinguish between your twofold answer to the question ; i thought you had brought those scriptures to prove baptism the proper antitype of circumcision ; but you urge the former old custom again , so that here 's no scripture nor argument brought by you to prove the thing in hand . as touching what you say of the parallel betwixt circumcision and baptism signifies nothing ; if in some things there should be a parallel , it doth not follow therefore baptism was the antitype of circumcision . what tho circumcision was the initiating ordinance of the male children into the jewish church , and baptism is that initiating ordinance into the gospel-church ; this doth not prove the one the type of the other . 5. but pray , what is it that the anabaptists can never get clear of , or being ask'd the exposition , they must be silent , or give such a paraphrase as you do ? i must tell you , i know no text more full for our practice of baptizing believers , than that in col. 2. 11 , 12. we say from thence , that the proper antitype of circumcision in the flesh , is the circumcision of the heart , and therefore not baptism ; tho 't is granted by us , that in baptism there is a representation of the new birth , and mortification of sin , which circumcision was the express type of : and this cannot weaken nor silence us , but rather strengthen our hands . all that can well be inferred from this text , col. 2. 11 , 12. where the apostle mentions circumcision and baptism , is no more than this , viz. where baptism is administred upon a proper subject , it represents the spiritual and mystical circumcision of the heart , i. e. that the soul is dead to sin , or that he hath put off the body of sins of the flesh by the circumcision of christ ; which may refer to the power of his death in the effects thereof , by the effectual sin-killing operations of the holy spirit on the heart . and as we being dead to sin , we are also buried with christ in baptism , both in the sign , i. e. covered all over in the water , which resembles in a lively figure his burial , and also in signification , i. e. the power and blessed effects of his death , having been the death of the old man , or that body of sin in us● wherein also in like manner we are also risen with him through the faith of the operation of god ; and this is likewise held forth both in sign and signification in true baptism . now if this be not your paraphrase on this text , we cannot help it . i know many learned men who own pedo-baptism , speak to the same purpose ; nor is there any reason for you to say we must be silent , &c. as if we knew not what to say to this text : but what is this for infant-baptism , or to prove baptism the antitype of circumcision ? doth sprinkling represent a burial ? doth the sign or figure of christ's burial appear in sprinkling a little water on the face , and as it is done to infant , in whom faith and regeneration is not wrought ? what doth there appear in signification ? doth not the church of england say , that baptism is the outward sign of an inward spiritual grace ? sure that is but a mock-baptism , where there is neither the sign or figure of christ's death and burial , &c. nor that inward work wrought upon the person baptized , which is signified , or ought to be signified thereby , viz. that the said person is dead to sin , and raised up by the faith of the operation of god to walk in newness of life . but alas , this it seems is not the thing ; 't is not so much to prove baptism to be the antitype of circumcision , as 't is to prove baptism to be the continuation of a jewish custom : for to speak more properly , you intimate , that to this purpose , you mention these things . sure all understanding men , as well pedo-baptists as others , must needs loath your notion ; but i know you are not alone herein , there are some others who have asserted the same thing ; which perhaps incouraged you thus to write : but to correct your rashness , and silence you and them too , consider what i and the fore-mentioned gentleman have said . is it not enough that infant-baptism should be built upon no better a foundation than the tradition of the apostate gentile church , and the decrees of popes and general councils , but that it must also be grounded on the erronious customs of the jewish talmud ? but to proceed , that circumcision may answer , or run parallel with baptism , you bring in the practice of some heathen nations who circumcised their females . we shall have it anon ; the truth is , the proof and explanation of infant-baptism shall be suffciently made out before you have done ; if fabulous and erroneous traditions of jews , heathens , and apostate christians will do it : but if no better authority or proof can be brought for it than what is contained in your mercury , 't is time for all good christians with shame enough to cast it off . should i tell my reader why some heathens circumcised their females , it might greatly expose you . but to close with your first question , take what dr. jer. taylor , la●e bishop of down , hath said upon this conceit , i. e. that circumcision figured baptism ; these are his words , viz. the argument , saith he , from circumcision is invalid upon infinite considerations : figures and types prove nothing , unless a command go along with them , or some express to signify such to be their purpose : for the deluge of waters , and the ark of noah , were figures of baptism , saith peter . if therefore the circumstances of the one should be drawn to the other , we should make baptism a prodigy rather than a rite . the paschal lamb was a figure of the eucharist , which succeds the other , as baptism doth to circumcision : out because there was in the manducation of the paschal lamb no prescription of sacramental drink , shall we thence conclude that the eucharist is to be administred in one kind ? and even in the very instance of this argument , suppose a correspondency of the analogy between circumcision and baptism , yet there is no correspondency of identity ; for tho it be granted , that both of them did consign the covenant of faith , yet there is nothing in the circumstances of children being circumcised that so concerns that mystery , but that it might very well be given to men of reason ; because circumcision left a character in the flesh , which being imprinted upon the in●●nt , did in work to them when they came to age ; and such a character was necessary , because there was no word added to the sign ; but baptism imprints nothing that remains on the body ; and if it leaves a character at all , it is upon the soul to which the word is added , which is as much a part of the sacrament as the sign it self : for both which reasons it is requisite that the party baptized should be capable of reason , that they may be capable both of the word and of the sacrament , and the impress upon the spirit : since therefore the reason of the parity does wholly fail , there is nothing left to infer a necessity of complying in the circumstance of age , any more than in the other annexes of types : then the infant must also precisely be baptized upon the eighth day , and females must not be baptized at all , because not circumcised ▪ but it were more proper , if we would understand it aright , to prosecute the analogy from the type to the antitype , by the way for letter and spirit , and signification ; and as circumcision figures baptism , so also the adjuncts of the circumcised shall signify some thing spiritual in the adherence of baptism ; and therefore as infants were circumcised , so spiritual infants should be baptized , which is spiritual circumcision ; for therefore babes had the ministry of the type , to signify that we must , when we give our names to christ , become children in malice , and then the type is made compleat . thus the worthy doctor hath answered your question , and you too . if circumcision must be a type of baptism , he hath shewed how , and how not , if it be so taken ; but the truth is , all types cease when the antitype is come , the one must give way to the other ; but circumcision did continue in full force some years after baptism was in full force ; for circumcision ended not till christ nailed it to his cross ; therefore it could not be the type of baptism : and how a shadow or sign should be the proper antitype of a shadow i see not . but enough hath been said to this , and i should not have said so much to it , but because your notion seems new to some . as touching the other two scriptures you mention , viz. that in 1 cor. 10. 't is very impertinently cited for your business , to prove circumcision the type of gospel-baptism ; for this text speaks nothing of that in the least , nor no more doth that in peter . suppose the red-sea was a figure of baptism , and so also the water and ark of noah ; what of all this , if you had urged the fathers and children were baptized to moses in the sea and in the cloud , and therefore children may be baptized ? i would have answered you that was but a figurative baptism , and proves nothing ; besides , it would prove unbelievers may be baptized also , because there was a mixt ▪ multitude as well so baptized , as were the fathers and their children ; besides , much cattel were with them in the sea , and under the cloud . quest . 2. what certain indubitable grounds can we have for the practice of infant-baptism . you answer , the certain ground is from the scripture , and first from the words of the commission , matth. 28. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 disciple all nations ; and then follows , baptizing them in the name , &c. from the order of which words ( you say ) infants are not excluded from baptism , as is generally believed by anabaptists ; a person may be baptized before he is taught ; for say you 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mathetusate , signifies , to disciple all nations personally and subjectively ; being a general word , it contains the other two that follow , viz. baptizing and teaching , it being a word of the imperative mood , and the other two only participles ; so that the commission of it is that , and the mood of it these : but in the mood , baptizing them precedes teaching them to observe all things , &c. reply . because there is a teaching follows baptism , doth it therefore follow , according to the order of the sacred commission , there is no teaching indispensibly to go before the person is baptized ? you have cause to tremble for trifling and basely inverting the order of the commission of our . blessed saviour ; what though the greek word discipliz , or make disciples , be a word of the imperative mood ; o strange ! have you found it out ? will this do your business ? doth it therefore contain the other two ? i ask you , whether a man may not be made a disciple , and not be baptized , or , be baptized , and yet not be discipled ? matth. 13. 52. 't is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in matth. 28. 't is disciple ye ; here 't is discipled , instructed , or that is taught , and 't is from the same verb with the other : 't is evident notwithstanding all your flourish , that teaching , according to the order of the commission , goes , and must go before baptizing , though the person baptized is to be taught afterwards ; also , all things that christ commanded his disciples , both as to doctrine and practice , that so they may be faithful followers of christ unto the end . this teaching after baptism indeed the baptists cannot deny , unless they should be so foolish as to say , a baptized believer needs no further teaching , &c. but you know in your consciences , we deny , and that too by the authority of the commission , that any ought to be baptized but such who are made disciples by their first being taught . doth baptism , sirs , make either children or others disciples ? if you do not asfert that , what do you say : and if all nations , or any in the nations , are to be baptized before they are taught or made disciples , why may not a minister , by the authority of the commission , baptize turks , pagans and infidels , with their children , as well as the infants of christian people ? moreover ; if so be baptizing may go before teaching , or persons being made disciples , why did philip answer the eunuch after that manner , when he asked him why he might not be baptized ? the answer is , if thou believest with all thy heart , thou mayest ; intimating , unless he so believed , he might not . also why did christ make disciples first , and then baptize them ? ioh. 4. 1. i must also tell you , that your exposition of the commission in matthew , doth tend to invert the order of the same commission in mark 16. 15 , 16. where our saviour commands his disciples to go and preach the gospel to every creature , and then saith ▪ he that believeth and is baptized , shall be 〈…〉 't is not he that is baptized and the●●●lieveth . but to give divers godly and learned pedo-baptists their due , they i find dare not attempt to invert the order of the holy commission , as you seem to do , though it shakes the foundation of their own practice : see reverend mr. perkins on these words , teach all nations , baptizing them ; saith he , i explain the former thus ; first of all , it is said , teach them , that is , make them my disciples , by teaching them to believe and repent . here we are to consider the order which god observes in making with men a covenant in 〈…〉 ; first of all he calls them by his w●●d and spirit to believe and repent . then in the second place , he makes a promise of mercy and forgiveness . and then thirdly , he seals his promise by baptism . they , says he , that know not , nor consider this order which god used in covenanting with them in baptism , deal preposterously , over-slipping the commandment of repenting and believing , and is the cause of so much prophaneness in the world. much to the same purpose saith mr. baxter , right to baptism , p. 149 , 150. speaking of the order of this commission christ gave to his disciples ; their first task ( says he ) is to make disciples , which are by mark called believers . the second work is to baptize them , whereto is annexed the promise of salvation . the third work is to teach them all other things which are after to be learned in the school of christ . to contemn this order , saith he , is to contemn the rules of order , for where can we find it if not here ? i profess my conscience is fully ▪ satisfied from this text , that ●●ere is one sort of faith saving — that must go before baptism , the profession whereof the minister must expect . your second scipture-ground is that of whole families being baptized . reply ; you cannot be ignorant that this proof hath been often invalidated : how many families are there in this city , in which there is not one infant ? besides , 't is said , paul preached the word to the jailor , and to all in his house : also 't is expresly said , he believed in god with all his house . we have as much ground to believe that in these families there were some servants or children who were unbelievers , as to belie●● there were little babes ; and because whole housholds are said to be baptized , therefore unbelieving servants , sons and daughters , as well as lit●●● children . others may infer ungodly servants and unbelieving children , that were grown up to be men and women , w●●● baptized also in those families . in jailors families now a-days 't is evident there are too many wicked and ungodly ones ; and this jailor was none of the best before converted , 't is plain . besides , whol●●●r all , doth not comprehend always every individual person , as 1 sam. 21. 28. moreover , dr. hammond saith , that to conclude , infants were baptized , because housholds are mentioned so to be , is , saith he , unconvincing , and 〈…〉 demonstration , it being so uncertain whether there were any children in those families : his letter p. 471. sect. 21. your third scripture-ground is that of the promise ( you say covenant ) made to you and 〈…〉 children . reply ; how often have we shewed that this text proves not that any children , quatenus as such , should be baptized , nor , as such , that they are in the covenant of grace , or have the promise made to them ; the promise runs to the jews and to their offspring , and not to them only , but to gentiles also , who were said to be afar off : but prav●observe , 't is to no more of the jews and their children or offspring , and such who were afar off , than the lord shall call or make disciples by the word and effectual operations of the holy spirit . my sons and daughters are as much my children when they are twenty or thirty years old , as well as when babes . dr. hammond also grants , children in this text doth not refer to insants as such , but to the posterity of the jews , p. 490. sect. 81. if ye be christ's , then you are abraham's seed , and heirs according to the promise . the children of the flesh , saith paul , these are not the children of god ; but the children of the promise are accounted for the seed , rom. 9. 8. not if you he the offspring of abraham according to the flesh , or seed of believers . your fourth scripture-proof is , that of such is the kingdom of heaven . reply . this proves no more children ●●●ght to be baptized , than they ought to receive the lord's supper , baptism being a mere positive precept , and only depends upon the will and sovereign pleasure of the great law-giver jesus christ . a thousand such instances prove not they ought to be baptized , except there was a precept annexed , or precedent for it in god's word . besides , of such , &c. ( as one well observes ) may intend such and such that have like qualities , viz. harmless , meek , &c. as children : therefore the anabaptists ( as you call them ) are not uncharitable , who say , infants have no m●re right to baptism than unreasonable creatures ; for what can give them right thereto , but the authority of god's word ? you ask what priviledg the children of believers have above unbelievers ? we answer , they have the advantage of their parents prayers . instruction , godly education , and good example . but , say you , they are holy . answ . we deny it intends federal holiness , such as qualifies children for baptism . we read in mat. 2. 15. of marriage , and that children begotten in lawful wedlock are called a godly seed , in opposition to their being illegitimate . now that it was about marriages the corinthians wrote to s. paul , is evident , they doubting of the lawfulness of abiding with their unbelieving husbands and wives : and to satisfy them about this matter , he tells them , the unbelieving husband was sanctified by ( or rather to ) the believing wife , &c. that is set apart or consecrated to each other in lawful marriage , ( for 't is doubtle●● no other sanctification ) else were your child 〈…〉 , that is , bastards ; but now are they holy , that is , lawfully begotten . and we find divers learned men give the same exposition on these words . ambrose on the place saith , the children are holy , because born of lawful marriage . see melancthon on this text , who asserts the same . erasmus saith , children are legitimately holy , the conversion of husband or wife did not dissolve the marriage . to which i might add camerarius , and divers others . we we read in zachary , that the bells and pots of the lord's house were holy ; may be the papists from thence presume to baptize bells , and they have as much reason so to do , as there is by the authority of god's word for any to baptize infants . as touching what you speak of little children coming to christ , that the original or greek word is the same with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to proselyte , what signifies that ? how often is that word mentioned in other places , to signify any manner of coming to ? &c. 't is a strange way of proselyting persons , and never to teach or instruct them . see these scriptures where the same word is used : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mat. 26. 7. there came unto him . mat. 26. 17. the disciples came ; gr ▪ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mat. 26. 49. forthwith he came to jesus ; gr. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mat. 26. 69. there came unto him ( a girl or ) a damsel ; gr. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mat. 26. 73. and after a while ( or a while after ) came unto him they that stood by ; gr. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but you proceed further to prove infants ought to be baptized , and that from the universal coment of the churches in all countries : for ( as you say ) tortul . de praescripturâ haeret . ch . 28. etquid verisimile , &c. had the churches erred , they would have varied , &c. reply . if you cannot prove infant-baptism from scripture , you are gone for ever ; for this argument of yours to prove it is like that of the papists , to prove their church the true church , viz. universality and antiquity , &c. it was not the practice of the churches first planted by the apostles , that 's plain ; and 't is as evident other errors were as universally received , and some very early too ; besides , you can't be ignorant how the greek church va●ies from the latin. but pray take what dr. barlow hath said to this , a worthy b●shop of the church of england . i believe , and know , saith he , that there is neither precept nor example in scripture for pedo-baptism , nor any just evidence for it for above 200 years after christ ; that ●●●tullian condemns it as an ●●w●rantable custom , and naz●anzen a good while after him dislikes it ▪ sure i am , that in the primitive times , they were catechumeni , then illuminati or baptizati , and that not only 〈…〉 and children of pagans converted , but children of christian parents : the truth is , i do believe pedo-baptism , how or by whom i know not , come into the world in the second century , and in the third and fourth began to be practised , though not generally , and defended as lawful from the text , john 3. 5. grosly misunderstood : upon the like gross mistake , john 6. 53. they did for many centuries , both in the greek and latin church , communicate infants , and give them the lord's supper ; and i confess they might do both as well as either , &c. thus both your arguments from universal consent and antiquity , the learned doctor hath sufficiently answered . and i rather let him answer you , than to answer you in my own words , thinking what he says , may be more regarded by some than what i say ▪ but to prove from antiquity , that infant-baptism was practised in the first , second and third centuries , you say you are able to demonstrate , and that there was never any particular congregation of anabaptists till about three hundred years after christ ; and seem to build much upon these three last arguments . reply . if you had said there were no baptized congregations , i. e. such who only baptized believers , you had asserted a great untruth , sith all the primitive apostolical churches were such , none being admitted to baptism for the first and second centuries , but the adult , i. e. such who professed their faith , as in due time may be sufficiently proved , notwithstanding all your flourish and pretences ; but suppose it be granted there were no congregations till then called anabaptists , what doth that signify ? it was because there were not till about that time any ( as 〈…〉 〈…〉 and divers others say ) who practised pedo-baptism . baptists could not be called anabaptists , or re-baptizers , till there were some who 〈…〉 for infant-baptism ; so that this directly makes against you . moreover , many rites which you disown as human traditions , crept very early into the world , and were practised generally too in the apostacy of the church . quest . 3. whether infant-baptism is to be found in the scripture ? 1. you answer ; not expresly in the letter , but from necessary and unavoidable consequences , as you say you have already shewn . reply . 't is a hard case that one of the great sacraments of the lord jesus should in your thoughts , lie so dark and obscure in the new testament , that it can't be proved from it but by consequences ; but harder that learned men of your way , should affirm that your consequences for it , drawn from those texts you mention , are not natural , and prove nothing ; besides , you can't be ignorant that the first asserters of infant-baptism never undertook the proof of it from such scripture-grounds or consequences , ●●t from the authority and power of the church : for , as you think the church ●●th power to change the act of baptizing unto sprinkling , so they affirmed she had like power to change the subject , and instead of believers , to baptize infants who have no understanding . pray what precept of the mosaical law lay so dark or obscure , that it could not be proved without consequences ? did not moses make every law , precept or command plain , that he that runs might read it ? and yet christ is said to exceed moses , being faithful as a son over his own house , heb. 3. those consequences you have drawn , all impartial men may see prove nothing . moreover , what you speak about those great articles of the christian religion , as if they could not be proved without consequences , must not by any means be allowed ; nor can i take it to be true . cannot we find the doctrine of the trinity in the scripture , and that christ is god and the second person , and that he was born of the virgin , without consequences ? is it wisdom in you in such a corrupt age as this is , to lay down such assertions ? were those things the matter of controversy between you and me , you should hear what positive and plain scripture . proof might ( as you know hath often already ) be brought upon that account . but to pass by this , i affirm the baptism of believers lies plain in god's word , but infant-baptism is not to be found therein . quest . 4. why was not christ baptized before he was thirty years old ? you answer , from the same reason that the jailor , the eunuch , and st. peter's converts were not , viz. there is no adhering to a doctrine before it is instituted or preached ; but , say you , infant baptism was much before our saviour's time , as amongst those of riper years since , and that , you say , is proof enough . reply . it can't be proof enough to answer the question , and as to prove infant-baptism it utterly fails ; but if infant-baptism was much before our saviour's time as an institution of god , there was no want of an institution when he was a babe ; and therefore your reason why he deferred his baptism is gone . was it in being long before , and yet not instituted or appointed by jehovah ? do you not herein implicitly confess that custom amongst the jews was humane ? nor will it serve your turn to say , it was instituted a-new as a gospel-ordinance , because you affirm baptism under the gospel was the continuation of that old custom , with the super-addition of the full force of baptism , viz. a consignation or seal of the covenant . do you not intimate it was not instituted anew , but rather a custom continued ? upon which you ( with that addition , and some others before you ) seem to lay the great stress of your infants baptism . and if some additions were made to the old custom , why might there not be some diminutions also ? and if it were a-new instituted , it is all one as if it had never been in being before ; for the right any have to baptism and manner of administration , and all things appertaining to it , must of necessity wholly depend upon the new institution or law of christ : if therefore gospel-baptism wholly depends on the new institution , then the old custom is gone for ever ( had it been a mosaical rite ) like a legacy bequeathed in a will , made void by the testator's last will and testament ; though some part of the same thing may be repeated in the last will , that was in the first , yet the last must decide the controversy : but in christ's last will and testament , infant-baptism is not to be found , nor was it indeed an ordinance ordained of god before christ's time . see my answer about this in answer to the first question . 2. certainly had it been the will of god , children should have been baptized as such , christ had been baptized when in his infancy ; no doubt god who is a free agent could not want an administrator ; he could have sent john into the world sooner , or have commissionated some other person to have done it . but since the holy ghost in the gospel relates the time of his baptism , and that it was not till he was about thirty years old , it clearly shews us that adult persons ought to be admitted to that ordinance only , and not babes : by which example of his he hath strengthned his commission , or at least wise shewed the congruity or sweet agreement there is between this precept and his own practice . question 5. why sprinkling , and not dipping ? you answer , our church denies not the latter , ( that is , dipping ) but looks upon it as a clear representation of our saviour's descending into the grave , abiding there , and rising up again , &c. but say you , the church has power to dispense with circumstantials and manner of acting , tho not with the act it self , &c. reply . what your church is i know not ; the church of england doth acknowledg , i must confess , that baptism is dipping , but i never heard they have of late times so practised . but how dare you 〈…〉 , the church hath power to dispense 〈…〉 dipping ▪ and change it into sprinkling ? who gave her such power ? where do you read of it ? you call it a circumstantial , but i am not of your mind ; i must say 't is ●●sential ; nay , 't is no baptism at all , if not dipping ; for baptize is to dip , which to confirm i could give you a cloud of witnesses learned in the greek tongue ; therefore 't is not the manner of the act , but the act it self ; to baptize is one act , and to rantize or sprinkle water is another ; the manner of the act of dipping , or baptizing ▪ 〈…〉 to put the whole body into the water backward , or forward , 〈…〉 , of with a swift or gentle motion . 〈…〉 is dipping , and sprinkling sprinkling , which act will never be baptizing whilst the world stands . you say well , dipping or burying the body in the water , is a clear and lively representation of the death , burial and resurrection of christ . and hence 't is said , that such who are indeed baptized , are buried with christ in baptism . to which you might have added , 't is also a sign of our being dead to sin , and of our being raised up with christ by the faith of the operation of god , to walk in newness of life . and hence i infer , infants ought not to be baptized , because there doth not , cannot appear in them that glorious internal work of the spirit which ought to be signified thereby ; and as they for this reason cannot be the proper subjects of baptism : so likewise it cannot be done by sprinkling , because that act cannot represent those signs and gospel-mysteries , which the law-giver intended should be held forth in that holy administration . but why do you say this is a circumstantial thing ? was not nadab and abihu's transgression , and that of uzzah's , more like circumstantials than this is ? and yet their error cost them their lives . or , hath the gospel-church a greater dispensing power in such cases , than the church had under the law ? — suppose the jews should have changed circumcision , or cutting off the foreskin of th● flesh , to the paring the nails of their children , or to cut off a little skin off of the fingers ends ; would that have been circumcision ? no doubt a better circumcision than sprinkling is baptism . gentlemen , will you call any part , or branch , or thing that appertains to a positive precept , a circumstance which the church has power to dispense with ? if you should , whither would this ●ead you ? you may after that notion strangely curtail christ's institutions in other respects . question 6. what think you of those that die in infancy unbaptized ? you answer , of such are the kingdom of heaven . reply . so saith our blessed saviour , but they have , say i , no right thereto , or belong unto the kingdom of heaven , because sprinkled with a little water ; nor would they have any further right , should they be indeed baptized , since there is no command of god for it . quest . 7. if children be saved whether baptized or not , what signifies baptism ? you answer , 't is a padg of christ , an evident note of diffinction from the children of infidels : and as we come to the knowledg of spiritual things by sense , so 't is an evidence of a greater assurance of the favour of god to them , being invisibly introduced into the covenant of grace . reply 't is no badg of christ besure , because he never gave it to them ; and if it be an evident note of distinction from the children of infidels , 't is wholly of man's making . you know what wonderful things are ascribed to chrism by the papists , who use salt , oil and spittle , &c. in baptism , and to other devised rites and ceremonies used by them ; and i have as much ground from god's word to believe what they say , as what you say , who affirm and prove not ; why , do you not say they are thereby made members of christ , children of god , and inheritors of the kingdom of heaven ? pray , what an assurance can that give them of the favour of god , unless he had appointed it , and imparted some spiritual grace thereby to them ? nay , and what arguments do you bring to prove they thereby are introduced into the covenant of grace ? can any outward act bring or introduce people either young or old into the covenant of grace , if they are brought thereby into the covenant of grace ? i hope they shall all the saved that are baptized ( as you call it . ) i hope you are not for falling away , or that any soul who is in the covenant of grace shall perish eternally . moreover , how can they come to the knowledg of spiritual things by sense ? indeed in the case of circumcision , which left a mark in the flesh , they might more probably understand by the sight of the eye , those spiritual things signified by it ; but baptism leaves no such mark : nothing appears to their senses when they come to knowledg that can have any such tendency ; i fear rather it is a great means when they are grown up , to blind their eyes , and cause them to think ( as many ignorant people do ) that they are made thereby christians , and so in a saved state , and never look after the work of regeneration . quest . 8. whether have children faith or no , since faith and repentance are prerequisites to baptism ? your answer is , that you have shewed , that according to the words of the commission , baptizing goes before teaching ; therefore there is not such a prerequisiteness as some dream of . you have said so i must confess from the commission , but have not proved it , but rather made work for repentance , by striving to ●●vert the order of the sacred commission of our saviour , &c. but say you admit faith as pre-requisite to baptism ; we could answer , that children have faith potentia , tho not in actu visibili : as an artist when he is indisposed or asleep , is potentially an artist , ●ho not actually . — reply . strange you should attempt to affirm children have faith potentia ! who to●● you so ? when was thi●●●aginary faith infused into them ? it 〈…〉 either by nature , art , of grace , or else your simily is lost . you are look'd upon indeed to be philosophers , but this is above my understanding , or your own 〈…〉 . but you suppose that passage in matth. 18. doth your business : whereas 't is evident that our saviour speaks there of such little ones who were indeed capable to believe ; it was not such a little one as you would have baptized . we doubt not but god doth oft-times infuse grace very early in the souls of some very young , and calls them to believe , 〈…〉 to the knowledg 〈…〉 truth ; but what is this to all infants 〈…〉 ? but more fully to answer what you say about children having faith , take what dr. taylor hath wrote upon this conceit . whether infants have faith or no , is a question ( saith he ) to be disputed by persons that care not how much they say , and how little they prove . 1. personal and actual faith they have none , for they have no acts of understanding : and besides , how can any man know that they have , since he never saw any sign of it , neither was he told so by any that could tell ? 2. some say they have imputative faith , but then so let the sacrament be too ; that is , if they have the parents faith , or the churches , then so let baptism be imputed also by derivation from them : and as in their mothers womb , and while they hung on their mothers-breasts , they live upon their mothers nourishment ; so they may upon the baptism of their parents , or their mother the church : for since faith is necessary to the susception of baptism , and they themselves confess it , by striving to find out new kinds of faith to daub the matter up ; such as the faith , such must be the sacrament : for there is no proportion between an actual sacrament and an imputative faith , this being in immediate and necessary order to●hat . and whatsoever can be said to take from the necessity of actual faith , all that and much more may be said to excuse from the actual susception of baptism . the first of these devices was that of luther and his scholars ; the second of 〈…〉 and his ; and yet there is a third device which the church of rome teaches , and that is , that infants have habitual faith , but who told them so ? how can they prove it ? what revelation or reason teaches any such thing ? are they by this habit so much as disposed to an actual belief without a new master ? can an infant sent into a 〈…〉 be more confident for christ 〈…〉 when he comes to be a man , than ●●●e had not been baptized ? are there any acts precedent , concomitant or consequent to this pretended habit ? this strange invention is absolutely without art , without scripture , reason or authority , but the men are to be excused unless there were a better . and aga●● to this purpose , pag. 242. and if any man runs for succour to that exploded cresphugeton , that infants have faith , or any other inspired habit of i know not what or how , we desire no more advantage in the world than that they are constrained to answer without revelation , against reason , common sense , and all the experience in the world. as to what you speak as to those young children you mention , it proves nothing ; and some of your stories seem childish , and do not look as if they came from men of such pretended ingenuity . but to close all ; we have the worst of you at the last , wherein you in a very scurrilo●s manner cast reproach upon a great body of godly people ( who differ not from other orthodox christians in any essentials of salvation , no nor in fundamentals of church-constitutions , save in the point of baptism ) and will you by reason of the enormities of some who formerly bore the name of anabaptists , mentioning the old munster story , condemn as such all that bear that name ? in answer to which i ask you , whether the like reflections might not have been cast on christ's apostles , because they had a ju●●● among them ? or on the church of the coritthians , because if the incestuous person ? besides , you know not but it may be a lie raised upon those people by the envious papists , who have rendred cal●● and luther as odious as you do these anabaptists . you would think it hard , if i should ask you what sort they were that ralph wallis used to expose , and fill his carts with ? or of those clergy-men who were pedo-baptists , yet were for filthy crimes executed . to conclude , i wish that all bitterness of spirit was expelled , love and charity exercised towards all , tho in some things we may differ from one another . queries for the athenian society to answer , some of which were formerly sent to them , but were passed by in silence . 1. whether infants are the subjects of baptism . and , 2. whether baptism is dipping or sprinkling . first ; whether there was not a twofold covenant made with abraham , one with his fleshly seed , and the other with his spiritual seed , signified by the bond-woman and the free-woman , and their sons ishmael and isaac ? if so , i query , whether circumcision was an ordinance that appertained to the covenant of grace , and was the seal of it ? 1. because 't is contradistinguished from the covenant of grace , or free promise of god , rom. 4. 2. and 't is also called a yoke of bondage . and , 3. 't is said also , that he that was circumcised , was a debter to keep the whole law. and , 4. because ishmael , who was not a child of the covenant of grace with esau , and many others , yet were required to be circumcised as well as isaac . and , 5. since 't is positively said faith was imputed to abraham for righteousness not in circumcision , how was it imputed then , when he was circumcised , or uncircumcise●● not when he was circumcised , but when he was uncircumcised . rom. 4. 10. secondly ; whether the being the male-children of believers , as such , gave them right to circumcision , or not rather the nicer positive command of god to abraham ; since we do not read of any other godly man's seed in abraham's days , or since , had any right thereto , but only such who were born in his house , or bought with his mony ? thirdly ; whether circumcision could be said to be the seal of any man's faith save abraham's only , seeing 't is said , he received the sign of circumcision , a seal of the righteousness of the faith he had [ mark ] yet being uncircumcisied , that he might be the father of all that believe ; which was the priviledg of abraham ●●ly : for how could circumcision be a seal to children of that faith they had before circumcised , seeing they had no faith at all , as had abraham their father , they being obliged by the law of god to be circumcised at eight days old ● fourthly ; what is it which you conceive circumcision did , or baptism doth seal to children , or make sure ; since a seal usually makes firm all the blessings or priviledges contained in that covenant 't is prefix'd to ? doubtless if the fleshly seed of believers , as such , are in the covenant of grace , and have the seal of it , they shall be saved ; because we are agreed , that the covenant of grace is well ordered in all things , and sure , there is no final falling , therefore how should any of them miss of eternal life ? and yet we see many of them prove wicked and ungodly , and so live and die . if you say it seals only the external part and priviledges of the covenant of grace : fifthly ; i demand to know what those external priviledges are , seeing they are denied the sacrament of the lord's-supper , and all other external rites whatsoever ? if you say when they believe that shall partake of 〈…〉 blessings ; so , say i , shall the 〈…〉 believers as well as they . sixthly ; if the fleshly seed , or children of believing gentiles , as such , are to be accounted the seed of abraham ; i query , whether they are his natural seed , or his spiritual seed ? if not his natural seed , nor his spiritual seed , what right can they have to baptism , or church-membership , from any covenant-transactions god made with abraham ? — seventhly ; whether those different grounds upon which the right of infant-baptism is pretended by the fathers of old , and the modern divines , doth well agree with an institution that is a meer positive rite , depending wholly on the will of the legislator , doth not give just cause to all to question its authority ? 1. some pedo-baptists asserted , it took away original sin , and such who denied it were anathematized . 2. some affirm , that children are in the covenent ; and being the seed of believers , are federally holy , therefore ought to be baptized . 3. another so●● of pedo baptists say , they ought to be bapt●●● , by virtue of their parents faith. 4. others affirm , they have faith themselves , and are disciples , and therefore must be baptized . 5. another sort baptize them upon the faith of the●● sureti● 6. and 〈…〉 of pedo baptists say , it 〈…〉 power and authori●● 7. 〈…〉 that , 〈…〉 affirm ▪ 〈…〉 the word 〈…〉 god 〈…〉 institution , the 〈…〉 divided and 〈…〉 themselves . eighthly ; is it not an evil thing , and very absurd for any to say ▪ baptism is a symbol of present regeneration , and yet apply it to babes , in whom nothing of the things signified thereby doth or can appear ? and also to say , i baptize thee in the name , &c. when indeed he doth not baptize , but only rantize the child ? and to say baptism is a lively figure of christ's death , burial , and resurrection , and yet only sprinkle or pour a little water upon the face of the child ? ninthly ; whether that can be an ordinance of christ , for which there is neither command nor example in all the word of god , no●●● promise ●●de to such who do it , nor th●●●s denounced on such who neglect it or do it 〈◊〉 ? for though there are both promises made to believers baptized , and threa●● denounced on such who neglect it , yet where are there any such in respect of infant-baptism ? tenthly ; whether a pagan , or indian , who should attain to the knowledg of the greek tongue , or of the english , or any other tongue into which the original should be translated , by reading over the new testament a thousand times he could ever find infants ought to be baptized ; if not , how doth it appear the faith of people about pedo-baptism stands in the power of god , and knowledg of his word , and not rather in the wisdom of men , who having endeavoured , with all the art and cunning they can , to draw pretended consequences for it , tho after all they do not naturally and genuinely follow 〈…〉 the premises to which they refer ? 〈◊〉 ; whether christ having 〈◊〉 the qualifications ●● such as 〈◊〉 baptized , viz. actual repentance , 〈…〉 and the answer of a good consci 〈…〉 ▪ doth not thereby exclude all those 〈…〉 not capable of those qualifications ? 〈◊〉 ; whether it doth not reflect up●● the care , wisdom , and faithfulness of jesus christ , who as a son over his own house , exceeded the care and faithfulness of moses , to affirm , infants ought to be baptized , and yet it cannot be found in all the ne● 〈◊〉 an it be 〈…〉 should be a gospe●● recept , nay , a 〈◊〉 , and yet christ speak nothing of it ? or could it be in the commission , and yet the apostlet never to mention it , but contrariwise , require faith●●● all they admitted to baptism ? paul says , he declared the whole counsel of god , and said nothing of it in any of his epistles , nor any where else . how many thousands of children were born to baptized ●●●ievers , from the time of christ's ascension , to the time john ●●●●e the revelations , but not one word of 〈…〉 one child baptized ? thirteen ; whether in matter of positive right , such as baptism is , we ought not ●● keep expresly and punctually to the revelation of the will of the law-giver ? fourteen ; whether the baptism of infants be not a dangerous 〈◊〉 since it tends to deceive and blind the ey●● of poor ignorant people , who think they are thereby made christians , and so never look after regeneration , nor true baptism , which represents or signifies that inward work of grace upon the heart ? fifteen ; whether the ancient church , who gave the lord's supper to infants , as well as baptism , might n●●●e allowed as well to do the one as the other , since faith and holy habits are as much required in those who are to be baptized , as in such who come to the lord's table ? and all such in the apostolick church , who were baptized , were immediately admitted to break bread , &c. and also the arguments taken from the covenant , and because said to be holy , and to belong to the kingdom of heaven , are as strong for them to receive the lord's supper , there being no command nor example for either , and human tradition carrying it equally for both for several centuries . sixteen ; whether nadab , abih● , and 〈◊〉 transgressions were not as much circumstantials , and so as small errors , as to alter dipping in ●o sprinkling ; and from an understanding believer , to a poor ignorant babe ? and whether to allow the church a power to make such alterations , be not dangerous ? see r●● , 22. and doth 〈…〉 open a door to other innovations ? seventeen ; whether there is any just cause for men to vilify and reproach the people called anabaptists , for their baprizing believers , and denying infants to be subjects thereof , seeing they have the plain and direct word of god to warrant their practice , i. e. not only the commission , but also the continual usage of the apostles and ministers of the gospel all along in the new testament , who baptized none but such who made profession of their faith ? and the ch●●●● of england also saith , faith and repentance . are required of such who are to be baptized . we ●●●e not baptize our children , because we cannot find it written ; 't is from the holy fear of god , lest we should offend and sin against him , by adding 〈◊〉 his word . eighteen ; what should be the reason that our faithful translators of the bible should leave the greek word baptism , or baptisma , and not turn it into english , seeing the dutch have not done so , but contrariwise translate , for john the baptist , john the dooper ; and for he baptized , he dooped , or dipped them ? nineteen ; whether those who translate out of one language into another , ought not to translate every word into the same language into which they turn it , and not leave any word in the same original tongue , which the people understand not , and for whose sakes they undertook that work ; and not to translate every word , but also to give the right , literal , genuine and proper signification of each word , and not the remote , improper , or collateral signification of it ? which if our translators of the bible had so done , i query whether the doubt among the unlearned , concerning what the word baptisma signifies , 〈…〉 ? twenty ; seeing the greek church uses immersion & not aspersion ▪ may it not be look'd upon as a great argument against sprinkling , especially seeing they disown the baptism of the latin church , beca●●● they use sprinkling ; for doubtless the greeks best knew the genuine and proper signification of that word , that tongue being their own natural language in which the new testament was wrote ? 21. whether if a minister should administer the lord's supper in one kind only and so doing , it cannot answer the great design of christ the law-giver , i. e. the breaking of his body , and shedding of his blood , would not prophane that holy institution ? if so , whether such , who instead of dipping the whole body , do but sprinkle or pour a little water on the face , do not also prophane the holy sacrament of baptism , since it is not so done to represent in a lively figure the death , burial and resurrection of christ , with our death unto sin , and vivification unto newness of life ? rom. ● . col. 2. 11 , 12. 22. whether all such who have only been sprinkled , ought not to be deemed unbaptized persons , since aspersion is not immersion , or rantizing not baptizing ? for though the greek word baptizo , in a remote and improper sense may signify to wash , yet , as the learned confess , it is such a washing as is done by dipping , swilling , or plunging the person or thing all over in the water . 23. since you say children have faith potentia : i query , whether unbelievers , and all ungodly persons , have ▪ not also the like faith potentia as well as children , and so the same right to baptism ? we grant they may have faith hereafter ; what tho ? there is one assertion and argument laid down by you , that i omitted in my answer ; which as it is new , so it must needs expose you , viz. if god be pleased to radiate or shine upon the souls of children in heaven , and they do behold the face of god , as our saviour says ; then it follows that they have faith in heaven , and why not on earth ? see heb. 11. 27. these are your very words ▪ 〈…〉 reply ; i had thought that in heaven the faith of the adult ceases , i. e. the strong and saving faith of believers : doth not the apostle say , then we come to receive the end of our faith ? and is not faith turned there into vision ? is not faith the evidence of things not seen , and the substance of things hoped for ? heb. 11. 〈…〉 . divines say , faith , hope , &c. cease then , and that 't is only love that continues . what is it they have not received in heaven , which they trust in god for ? nor is your conclusion good , had they faith there , they may have it here . the text you cite , heb. 11. 27. refers to that faith moses had on earth , who saw him that was invisible . god seems so to us here ; but what a sight we shall have of him in heaven , we know not . doth not the apostle say , we shall behold face to face ; and the pure in heart shall see god ? shall that be such a sight that moses had whilst on earth ? questions relating to the fathers , with respect t●●●e controversy about inf●●-baptism . first ; what reason can be given why nazianzen , an eminent greek father , should counsel the deferring the baptism of infants , until the third or fourth year of their age , ( except in danger of death ) , if it were in nazianzen's time , as some suppose it-was , the opinion of the whole church , as also his own , that infants , by an apostolical tradition , were to be baptized as such , that is , as soon as born ? secondly ; whether all the fathers of the third and fourth century , both of the greek and latin church , who have wrote any thing abou●●●nfant-baptism , do not unanimously give this as the reason why infants should be baptized , viz. the washing away original sin , or the putting them into a capacity of salvation ; and some of them , p●●ticularly st. austin , sentencing infants to ●●ernal damnation if not baptized ? thirdly ; if so , whether the fathers might not be mistaken in the right of infants to baptism , as well as 〈…〉 the judgment of most protestants they are , in the reason why they should be baptized ? four other queries . 1. whether god hath allowed or enjoined parents to bring their ●●ttle ●●bes , of two or ten days old , into a covenant with him by baptism , since 't is nor to be found in the sc●●●●ure he either hath allowed or enjoined them so to do ? 2. if it cannot be proved he hath required any such thing at their hands , whether that covenant can be said to b●nd their consciences when they come to ●ge , especially since they gave no consent to it , no● were capable so to do ? 3. if this pretended covenant was not of god's appointment , i query , how these children who refuse to agree to the said covenant when at age , can thereby be guilty , 1. of rejecting christ , 2. of renouncing the blessings of the gospel , 3. and that 't is rebellion continued against their maker , 4. that 't is ingratitude and ●●jury to their redeemer , 5. gross injustice to their parents , 6 , that 't is self-killing crueltie to their own souls , 7. and a damning sin ? 4. i query , whether this be good divinity , not rather a strange doctrine ? and whether unwarrantable articles of faith , taken out of the jewish talmud , or . turkish alcoran , may not by as good authority be put into a christian catechism , as such assertions as these ▪ four queries sent by another hand to the athenian society . gentlemen , i humbly conceive , that no man knoweth what is a duty but by the scriptures : and since pedo-baptism cannot be proved by the word of god , as every man may know , and is generally acknowledged by the most learned assertors of that practice ; it therefore plainly followeth , in my judgment , that infant-baptism is no ordinance of god's appointment , but an innovation . i therefore feriously query ; i. wheth●●●radition ; jewish talmuds , the opinion of private doctors ▪ schoolmen , &c. be a sufficient warrant for the churches to establish such a practice , that hath neither precept nor example in the holy scriptures ? ii. since the pretended foundation of infant-baptism , ( viz. its absolute necessity to salvation ) proving ●o be a mistake of the text , john 3. 5. as is generally acknowledged by protestants , whether the structure ought not to fall with it , as it did in the case of giving the child the eucharist ? iii. whether the faith of the parent , or gossip on the child's behalf , be required of god , or will be imputed to the child by god ? if not , why ventured on , and not rather a waiting for faith in the subject , as required in holy writ , by the apostles and primitive churches , and seemingly by the church of england in her cate●●●sm ? iv. whether the church hath a good warrant that will justify her before god , in changing the mode from dipping to sprinkling ? and whether that alteration doth so well answer the design of the holy god , as that ceremony which himself appointed ? gentlemen , i knew nothing of that gentleman's animadversions , or that he , or any body el●● intended to take notice of your mercury , till i had wrote what i intended to say , tho when it was too late i saw it . postscript . containing some remarks upon the athenian mercury , vol. 4. numb . 18. published saturday , novemb. 28. 1691. gentlemen , just as my answer to your first mercury about infant-baptism was finished , and almost printed off , your second paper on the same subject came to my hand : and tho i was not concerned in the paper called , animadversions on your other mercury ; yet , till a further answer is prepared , i shall make some reflections upon what you have said in your pretended reply to that gentleman , &c. 1. sirs , you go too fast to conclude , you by that paper understand wherein our strength lies , as ( by this time ) you may perceive , nor don 't conclude you have it all yet . 2. what you say about your pretended proof of infant-baptism , from that unscriptural tradition or custom among the jews of proselyting whole families to the jewish religion by baptism , you may see fully answered before i saw your last mercury . have you proved that custom among them was jure divino ? or , if so , that it remained and was continued by christ ? secondly ; what you have said about baptism , being the proper antitype of circumcision , is also answered : nor does what you speak of types and antitypes , not agreeing in every thing , help you . have not we shewed that the proper antitype of circumcision in the flesh is that of the heart ? thirdly ; as to your logical argument , ●● viz. an ordinance once enjoined , and never repealed , is always in force ; but the ordinance of childrens incovenanting , was once in the old testament enjoined , and was never repealed . ergo ) . we answer , if the ordinance of children incovenanting ▪ under the law , was circumcision , that ordinance is repealed ; is no● circumcision repealed ? 2. if you say notwithstanding , children of the flesh , or the natural seed , being once in the covenant , and never cast out , ( by reason that law or covenant , for their incovenanting being not repealed ) is always in force . reply 1. that the old or first covenant , for their incovenanting is repealed is plain ; he took away the first , that he might establish the second . 2. also 't is said , that hagar and her son are cast our , viz. the legal covenant , and fleshly seed , and no new law is added to bring them into the gospel-church by baptism , i. e. the fleshly or natural seed , as such . now is the ax laid to the root of the trees . fourthly ; your citing heb. 8. and jer. 31. to shew what baptism seals to infants , proves nothing . we deny not , but all who are actually in the new covenant , viz. by faith ingra●ted into christ , have right to remission and salvation ; and that that covenant secures and preserves them to eternal life ; therefore the children of believers as such , are not in it : and if they are no otherwise in it than conditionally , that is , if they repent , believe , &c. i ask you what priviledg that is , more than what the children of heathens and infidels have ? 〈◊〉 if they believe and repent , shall they not have the same blessings & priviledges of the covenant also ? as to the adult professors , we say , if they fall finally away , it shews they never indeed were in the covenant of grace . as to adult true believers , the holy spirit seals remission and salvation to them , and they shall be saved : a sign of what is actually in them , is held forth in baptism , there being nothing signified by that ordinance as to a death unto sin , but what they experienced wrought on their souls before baptized ; tho , 't is true , they thereby , for the time to come , covenant to walk in newness of life . fifthly ; as touching the great commission , mat. 28. where you urge baptizing goes before teaching , we have fully answered you in the precedent reply ; we prove , there is a teaching goes before baptism , and yet also a teaching after . why do you attempt to blind the eyes of the unwary reader ? sixthly ; to what purpose do you mention jairus's daughter ? do we deny but that the parents faith and prayer , may procure outward blessings , nay , and spiritual ones too ; and as much perhaps for their poor carnal neighbours and friends ? my servant job shall pray for you . the fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much , but it doth not give right to their friends or children to baptism . seventhly ; as to your syriac translation , that the jaylor and all the sons of his house were baptized : i argue , all his sons , no doubt , were grown up to age , because 't is said , he believed , with all his house . if he had sons grown up , and yet did not believe , then , by your argument , unbelievers may be baptized ; but to this see our answer . eighthly ; as to your proof from that passage , i. e. suffer little children to come unto me . take the words definitely or indefinitely , it proves nothing for you ; for christ baptized no child , for with his own hands he baptized no person at all ; joh. 4. 1 , 2. 't was to lay his hands upon them , not to baptize them . moreover , i have before told you , those little ones mark 9. 42. were adult , whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me : i affirm , our saviour speaks only of such little ones as were grown up to such age , as in very deed did believe in him , and not babes of two or ten day● old . but , you say , we would have no children proselyted , but such as timothy , &c. to which you answer , that according to the original , those children that did 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which word we have shewed signifies any common coming , ( and may be such who come in their parents arms ) . let babes come to christ this way or that , he baptized none of them : i may infer as well , because little children come or were brought to christ , and of such are the kingdom of heaven ; therefore they may partake of the lord's supper , as you infer they may be baptized . ninthly ; tho the gospel did not spread into all nations , &c. yet sure you conclude all were to be baptized in all nations wheresoever the gospel did come , or was preached ; or else , as we say , none in those nations , but such who were made disciples , i. e. did believe and repent : for if but some in those nations ●here the gospel comes , were to be baptized , and not all , and yet more ought so to be ; then such who are discipled first : pray ▪ who are they , or how shall we know them to be included in the commission ? for , as mr. baxter saith , if we have it not here , where have we it ? this being the great rule or charter of the church for this rite , unto which we ought to adhere in this matter . tenthly ; what signifies what some of the ancient fathers believed , i. e. that federal holiness of parents made children candidates for baptism ? they said , other things too that you decry as well as we , many errors being early let into the church : besides , we have tertullian against tertullian , or one father against another , which is ground enough to believe you abuse tertullian , or to doubt of the truth of your history . eleventhly ; you ask whether children have not as much right to their baptism as that of adult females ? for 't is no where said , she that believeth , and is baptized ; where have we one instance of female-baptism ? reply . we ak you whether male and female is not intended in mark 16. 16. he or she ? and so john 3. 3. unless a man be bor● again ; the woman is included ; or , have women no souls ? did you never read of the figure sylepsis , or conceptio , that comprehends the less worthy under the more worthy , indignioris sub dign●ore ? as for example , ●uid tu & soror facitis , 〈…〉 & mater miseri ; perimus●●● & uxor qui ad●●stis testes estote ? and it 's no less true in divinity ; see that full and never to be baffled place , 1 cor. 6. 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 they two shall be one flesh . see gen. 5. 2. and he called their name adam . moreover , do we not read women were made disciples as well as men , and so had the same right to baptism from the commission . but to detect your ignorance of the scripture , pray see acts 8. 12. when they believed philip , preaching the things concerning the kingdom of god , and the name of jesus christ , they were baptized both ●●n and women . also acts 16. 15. 't is said lydia was baptized ; i thought she had been a woman . gentlemen , you shew you are but younger brethren , and will do t●●● edobaptists no service ; shew such a proof for the baptism of infants , and your work is done . but tho children lose no spiritual right by christ's coming , yet they may lose some legal rites . as ministers sons now are not born to the ministry●●s they were under the law as well as their fleshly seed had right , as such , to their jewish church membership . furthermore ; because believers are made holy by the operations of the spirit , are all their children made holy in like manner also ? blush for christ's sake ! the blessing of abraham sirs , only comes upon the gentiles through faith , not by natural generation , as you imagine : as the blessing runs to the parents , viz. through faith , so to their children ; they must believe also if they would be the children of the promise , or spiritual seed of abraham , gal. 3. ult . twelfthly ; as touching what you say further , as to universal consent of the antient churches , it proves nothing . should we believe your histories , as firmly as we do believe there was an alexander the great , or a cato , &c. if there is no infant-baptism in the scripture , 't is utterly gone : ●●t we challenge you to shew from authentick history , that one infant was baptized in the first or second centuries , which we are not able to disprove by as good authority . thirteen ; if ●here was not a congregation called anabapti●●● ●ill 300 years a●●● christ , it signifies nothing , as we have shewed . moreover , we affirm , that all the apostolical primitive churches were baptists , i. e. such who only baptized believers , and so continued till the apostacy . see our further answer of this to your first mercury . we can prove there was a testimony born against infant-baptism before 380 years after christ ; nay , before the end of the third century . see tertul. in his book de baptismo ▪ c. 18. who opposed infant-baptism , 1. from the mistake of that text , mat. 19. 14. suffer little children to come unto me ; the lord saith , says he , do not forbid them to come unto me ; let them come therefore when they grow elder , when they learn , when they are taught why they come ; let them be made christians when they can know christ . he adds six arguments more ; and to confirm this testimony of tertullian , see dr. barlow ; saith he , tertullian dislikes and condemns infant-baptism as unwarrantable and irrational . daillé also saith , that tertullian was of an opinion , that infants were not to be baptized ; the like say divers others , as mr. danvers shews , which his opposers could not refute . so that it appears you are ignorant both of scripture and history too , and do but abuse your selves and the world also in this matter . gentlemen , you were better give over , than a-fresh to blow up ●●● fire and coal of contention . you mistake in your third column , we are not to prove a negative , i. e. that no infant was baptized in those churche● you must prove they were . fourteen ; your reply about our saviour's not being baptized till thirty years old , it was because he was a jew , and proselyted heathens were only baptized when young , is a fig ▪ leaf , still insisting upon the old jewish custom ; to which we have given you a full answer . fifteen ; what you say about dipping , and mention 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and that authors shew that it signifies only a bare and slight washing , and that plunging and washing are very distinct : this word comes from the same verb you say signifies to dip or plunge . and whereas you hint , that beza would have us baptize them , but not drown them ; you are resolved to prevent that danger , who only sprinkle or rantize them . i affirm , dipping or plunging all learned in the greek tongue , and criticks , do generally assert , is the literal , proper and genuine signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; and if it any where refers to washing , 't is to such a washing as is done by dipping or swilling in the water : all sorts of washing are not distinct from dipping ; and that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to baptize , is to wash , unless it be such a washing as is by dipping , we deny : is it not the same with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ? also the septuagint do render the word tabal by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and which all translators , saith a good author , both latin , dutch , italian , french and english , do translate to dip , and always signifies to dip , as 2 kings 5. 14 , &c. grotius saith it signifies to dip over head and ears . pasor , an immersion , dipping , or submersion . leigh in his critica sacra saith , its native and proper signification is to dip into the water , or to plunge under the water ; and that it is taken from a diers fat , and not a bare washing only : see casaubon , bucan , bullinger , zanchy , beza , &c. to close ; have we not cause to affirm you reproach us , to say our ring-leaders come to ill deaths ? what signifies your story of john bocold of leyden , and as if erasmus , &c. had an ill opinion of the anabaptists of his time , does it follow you may vilify the baptists of these times from thence ? they might hold some errors , and so may some so called now adays , as well as some pedo-baptists , who are papists , arians , antitrinitarians , socinians , and what not ; and some of them debauched livers , and made as shameful ends ; these things cannot be unknown to you , but how base it is in you thus to write , let all sober men judg . your pretended zeal will not acquit you from a slanderous tongue , and speaking evil of them you know not . are not the papists pedobaptists , and some of the first and chief assertors of it , and what an erronious crew are they ? do you think we cannot parallel john of leyden amongst some of the pedobaptists . were those stories true of him and others ? — are there not some bad men of every perswasion as well as good ? i exhort you to consider what account you will be able to give , for asserting babies rantism , or infants sprinkling , since 't is not commanded of god , &c. in the dreadful day of judgment : or how dare you affirm we disturb the church of christ with false doctrine , who assert , believers only are the subjects of christ's true baptism , and that baptism is immersion , i. e. dipping , since both lies so plain in the word of god ? we fear not our appearing upon this account at christ's tribunal : and for all your great confidence , your practice we do●●t not in the least will be foun● to be no truth of the gospel , but an unwarrantable tradition . what tho sir tho. more , a papist , was glad he had not proselyted persons to his youthful errors ; must we therefore be afraid to promulgate a positive truth of christ ? is it not said , this sect is every-where spoken against ? if you had called for syllogistical arguments , you might have had them , but you ask for queries ; you may have logical arguments enow if you please , but you had better desist . to conclude with your postscript . i can't see mr. eliot has done the pedo-baptists any service , or that any honour redounds to him for that work of his . how in the gospel-church-state , the promise runs to believers and their children or off-spring , we ●●ve shewed ; and that babes of two or ten days old , are or can be said to be disciples , is without proof , and irrational . what though they may belong to the kingdom of heaven , or be saved , baptism is of a meer positive right ; that argument , i tell you again , will admit them to the sacrament of the lord's supper , as well as to baptism . and as for antiquity , we deny not but that it was received by divers as an apostolical tradition , a little time before nazianzen or austin ; yet that it was preached as necessary to salvation , before austin did it , you can't prove , though we ●eny not but 't was practised before austin's days . see dr. taylor , lib. proph. p. 237. and the truth of the business is , ( saith he ) as there was no command of scripture to oblige children to the susception of it ; so the necessity of pedo-baptism was not determined in the church till the canon that was made in the milevetan council , a provincial in africa , never till then . i g●●nt , ( saith he ) it was practised in africa before that time , and they , or some of them , thought well of it ; and though that is no argument for us to think ▪ so , yet none of them did ever pretend it to be necessary , nor to have been a precept of the gospel . st. austin was the first that ever preached it to be necessary ; and it was in his heat and anger against pelagius , who had so warm'd and chased him , that made him innovate herein . thus far the doctor . as to clemens , ireneus , &c. you make such a stir about , is contradicted by history . clemens asserts who are the right subjects ; and in what order they ought , after due examinations and instructions , to be baptized . see jacob merningus , in his history of baptism , p. 2. upon cent. 2. p. 209. out of clem. epist . 3. also dutch martyrology . ignatius , in his discourse about baptism , asserts , that it ought to be accompanied with faith , love and patience , after preaching ; see h. montanus , p. 45. and jacob dubois , p. 16 , to 22. and dutch martyrology , where ign●●ius's letters are mentioned to polycarp traliensis , and to them of philadelphia . all that we can find of ireneus , is , lib. 2. cap. 39. adv . haeres . that christ did fanctify every age by his own susception of it , and similitude to it , all , i say , who by him are born again to god. in all which is no word of infant-baptism : unless you wiredraw consequences from his words , as you do from the scripture , to support a tottering structure , built on a false foundation . that ireneus , or any other but origen's testimony was in the case , you have dr. taylor , in his dissuasive against popery , p. 1. 18. printed 1667 , one of his last pieces , saying thus , viz. that there is a tradition to baptize infants , relies but upon two witnesses , origen and austin ; and the latter having received it from the former , it relies upon a single testimony , which is but a pitiful argument to prove a tradition apostolical : he is the first that spoke it , but tertullian , that was before him , seems to speak against it , which he would not have done , if it had been a tradition apostolical ; and that it was not so , is but too certain , if there be any truth in the words of ludov. vives , saying , that anciently none were baptized , but persons of riper age. and as to origen's works , there is cause to question , whether they are to be regarded : for mr. perkins and others doubt about them , because no greek copies thereof are extant . and dr. taylor saith , that many of his works are corrupt a●● erroneous , particularly in the point of baptism , and fell into ill hands , &c. to conclude , the learned curcelaeus , instit . lib. 1. cap. 12. thus saith , poedobaptismus duobus primis à christa nato saeculis fuit incognitus , &c. pedo-baptism was unknown in the two first ages after the birth of christ , but in the 3d and 4th it was approved of by a few ; in the 5th and the following ages , it began to be generally received . and therefore ( as afterward he saith ) this rite is indeed observed by us as an ancient custom , but not as an apostolical tradition . the same author , de peccato originis , numb . 56. saith , morem infantes baptizandi non coepisse ante tertium à christa nato saeculum , &c. that the custom of baptizing infants , did not begin till the 3d age after christ ; but in the two former , no footstep of it doth appear . and afterward , ( saith he ) sine ipsius [ christi ] mandato introducta est . it was introduced without the command of christ . now let the reader consider , if our authority is not greater than the bare testimony of zuinglius , a● late prejudiced writer . an appendix to the answer to two athenian mercuries , concerning infant-baptism , containing divers syllogistical arguments to disprove pedo-baptism , and to prove the baptism of believers . gentlemen , since you desire syllogisms , i have gratified you therein . arg. 1. if none are to be baptized by the authority of the great commission of our blessed saviour , matth. 28. but such who are first made disciples by being taught ; than infants , who are not capable to be taught , ought not to be baptized . but none are to be baptized by the authority of the great commission of our blessed saviour , but such who are first made disciples by teaching ▪ ergo , little babes ought not to be baptized . arg. 2. if infant-baptism was never instituted ; commanded , or appointed of god , infants ought not to be baptized . but infant-baptism was never instituted , commanded , or appointed of god. ergo , they ought not to be baptized . as to the major ; if one thing ma●●● practised as an ordinance without an institution or command of god , another thing may also ; so any innovation may be let into the church . as to the minor ; if there is an institution for it , &c. 't is either contained in the great commission , matth. 28. mark 16. or somewhere else . but 't is not to be found in the commission , nor any where else . ergo. the major none will deny . the minor i prove thus . none are to be baptized by virtue of the commission , but such who are discipled by the word , as i said before , and so the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies . if any should say , christ commanded his disciples to baptize all nations , and infants are part of nations , therefore are to be baptized . i answer ; arg. 3. if all nations , or any in the nations ought to be baptized before discipled ; then turks , pagans , unbelievers and their children may be baptized , because they are a great part of the nations . but turks , pagans and unbelievers , and their children , ought not to be baptized . ergo. besides that , teaching ( by the authority of the commission ) must go before baptizing , we have proved ; which generally all learned men do assert : if the institution is to b●●ound any where else , they must shew the place . arg. 4. faith and repentance are required of all that ought to be baptized . infants are not required to believe and repent , nor are they capable so to do . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . the major is clear , acts 2 , 8 , 10 , 16 chapters ; and 't is also asserted by the church of england . what is required of persons to be baptized ? that 's the question . the answer is , repentance , whereby they forsake sin ; and faith , whereby they stedfastly believe the promise of god made to them in that sacrament . the minor cannot be denied . arg. 5. that practice that tends not to the glory of god , nor to the profit of the child , when done , nor in after-times when grown up , but may prove hurtful and of a dangerous nature to him , cannot be a truth of god. but the practice of infant-baptism tends not to the glory of god , nor to the profit of the child when baptized , nor in after-times when grown up , but may prove hurtful and of a dangerous nature to him . ergo. see levit. 10. 1 , 2. where moses told aaron , because his sons had done that which god commanded them not , that god would be sanctified by all that drew near unto him ; intimating , that such who did that which god commanded not , did not sanctify or glorify god therein . can god be glorified by man's disobedience , or by adding to his word ; by doing that which god hath not required ? matth. 16. 9. in vain do you worship me , teaching for doctrine the commandments of men : and that that practice doth profit the child , none can prove from god's word : and in after-times when grown up , it may cause the person to think he was thereby made a christian , &c. and brought into the covenant of ▪ grace , and had it sealed to him , nay , thereby regenerated , for so these gentlemen in their mercury , decemb. 26. plainly intimate , and that infants are thereby ingrafted also into christ's church . sure all understanding men know baptism of believers is not called regeneration , but only metonymically , it being a figure of regeneration . but they ignorantly affirm also , that infants then ▪ have a federal holiness ; as if this imagined holiness comes in by the child's covenant in baptism , which may prove hurtful and dangerous to them , and cause them to think baptism confers grace , which is a great error . how can water , saith mr. charnock , an external thing , work upon the soul physically ? nor can it , saith he , be proved , that ever the spirit of god is tied by any promise , to apply himself to the soul in a gracious operation , when water is applied to the body : if it were so , then all that were baptized were regenerated , then all that were baptized should be saved , or else the doctrine of perseverance falls to the ground . some indeed , says he , say , that regeration is conferred in baptism upon the elect , and exerts it self afterwards in conversion . but how so active a principle as a spiritual life should lie dead and asleep so many years , &c. is not easily conceived . on regen . p. 75. arg. 6. if the church of england says , that faith and repentance are required of all that ought to be baptized , and in so saying , speak truly , and yet infants can't perform those things ; then infants ought not to be baptized . but the church of england says , that faith and repentance are required of all such , &c. and speak truly , and yet infants cannot perform these things . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . object . if it be objected , that they affirm they do perform it by their sureties . answ. if suretiship for children in baptism is not required of god , and the sureties do not , cannot perform those things for the child : then suretiship is not of god , and so signifies nothing , but is an unlawful and sinful undertaking . but suretiship in childrens / baptism is not required of god , and they do not , cannot perform what they promise . ergo. do they , or can they cause the child to forsake the devil and all his works , the pomps and vanities of this wicked world , and all the sinful lusts of the flesh ? in a word ; can they make the child or children to repent and truly believe in jesus christ ? for these are the things they promise for them , and in their name . alas , they want power to do it for themselves , and how then should they do it for others ? besides , we see they never mind nor regard their covenant in the case : and will not god one day say , who has required these things at your hands ? arg. 7. if there be no precedent in the scripture , ( as there is no precept ) that any infant was baptized , then infants ought not to be baptized . but there is no precedent that any infant was baptized in the scripture . ergo. if there is any precedent or example in scripture that any infant was baptized , let them shew us where we may find it . erasmus saith , 't is no where expressed in the apostolical writings , that they baptized children . union of the church , and on rom. 6. calvin saith , it is no where expressed by the evangelists , that any one infant was baptized by the apostles ▪ instit . c. 16. book 4. ludovicus vives saith , none of old were wont to be baptized but in grown age , and who desired and understood what it was . vide ludov. the magd●burgenses say , that concerning the baptizing the adult , both jews and gentiles , we have sufficient proof from acts 2 , 8 , 10 , 16 chapters ; but as to the baptizing of infants , they can meet with no example in scripture . magdeb. cent. l. 2. p. 469. dr. taylor saith , it is against the perpetual analogy of christ's doctrine to baptize infants : for besides that christ never gave any precept to baptize them , nor eyer himself nor his apostles ( that appears ) did baptize any of them : all that either he or his apostles said concerning it , requires such previous dispositions of baptism , of which infants are not capable , viz. faith and repentance . lib. proph. p. 239. arg. 8. if whatsoever which is necessary to faith and practice is left in the holy scripture , that being a compleat and perfect rule , and yet infant-baptism is not contained or to be found therein , then infant-baptism is not of god. but whatever is necessary to faith and practice , is contained in the holy scriptures , &c. but infant-baptism is not to be found therein . ergo. that the scripture is a perfect rule , &c. we have the consent of all the ancient fathers and modern divines . athanasius saith , the holy scriptures being inspirations of god , are sufficient to all instructions of truth . athan. against the gentiles . chrysostom saith , all things be plain and clear in the scripture ; and whatsoever are needful , are manifest there . chrysost . on 2 thess . and 2 tim. 2. basil saith , that it would be an argument of infidelity , and a most certain sign of pride , if any man should reject any thing written , and should introduce things not written . basil in his sermon de fide. augustine saith , in the scriptures are found all things which contain faith , manner of living , hope , love , &c. let us , saith he , seek no farther than what is written of god our saviour , left a man would know more than the scriptures witness . aug. in his 198 epistles to fortunat. theophilact saith , it is part of a diabolical spirit , to think any thing divine , without the authority of the holy scripture . lib. 2. paschal . isychi●●s saith , let us who will have any thing observed of god , search no more but that which the gospel doth give unto us . lib. 5. c. 16. on levi● . bellarmin saith , that though the arguments of the anabaptists , from the defect of command or example , have a great use against the lutherans , forasmuch as they use that ●i●● every where , having no command or example , theirs is to be rejected ; yet is it of no force against catholicks , who conclude the apostolical tradition is of no less authority with us than the scripture , &c. this of baptizing of infants is an apostolical tradition . bellarm. in his book d● bapt. i. 1. c. 8. mr. ball saith , we must for every ordinance look to the institution , and never stretch it wider , nor draw it narrower than the lord hath made it , for he is the institutor of the sacraments according to his own pleasure ; and 't is our part to learn of him , both to whom , how , and for what end the sacraments are to be administred , ball , in his answer to the new-england elders , p. 38 , 39. and as to the minor , 't is acknowledged by our adversaries , it is not to be found in ●●e letter of the scripture . and as to the consequences drawn therefrom , we have proved , they are not natural from the premises ; and though we admit of consequences and inferences if genuine , yet not in the case of an institution respecting a practical ordinance that is of meer positive right . arg. 9. if infant-baptism was an institution of christ , the pedo-baptists could not be at a loss about the grounds of the right infants have to baptism ▪ but the pedo-baptists are at a great loss , and differ exceedingly about the grounds of the right infants have to baptism . ergo , 't is no institution of christ . as touching the major , i argue thus ; that which is an institution of christ , the holy scripture doth shew , as well the end and ground of the ordinance , as the subject and manner of it . but the scripture speaks nothing of the end or ground of pedo-baptism , or for what reason they ought to be baptized . ergo , 't is no institution of christ . the minor is undeniable ; some affirm , as we have shewed , p. 15. it was to take away original sin. some say it is their right by the covenant , they being the seed of believers . others say , infants have faith , and therefore have a right . others say , they have a right by the faith of their sureties . some ground their right from an apostolical tradition ; others upon the authority of scripture . some say , all children of professed christians ought to be baptized ; others say , none but the children of true believers have a right to it . sure , if it was an ordinance of christ , his word would soon end this controversy . arg. 10. if the children of believing gentiles , as such , are not the natural nor spiritual seed of abraham , they can have no right to baptism , or church-membership , by virtue of any covenant-transaction god made with abraham . but the children of believing gentiles , as such , are not the natural nor spiritual seed of abraham . ergo. arg. 11. if no man can prove from scripture , that any spiritual benefit redounds to infants in their baptism , 't is no ordinance of christ . but no man can prove from scripture , that any spiritual benefit redounds to infants in their baptism . ergo. arg. 12. that cannot be an ordinance of christ , for which there is neither command nor example in all god's word , nor promise to such who do it , nor threatnings to such who neglect it . but there is no command or example in all the word of god for the baptizing of little babes , nor promise made to such who are baptized , nor threatnings to such who are not . ergo. that the child lies under a promise who is baptized , or the child under any threatning or danger that is not baptized , let them prove it , since it is denied . arg. 13. if no parents , at any time or times , have been by god the father , jesus christ , or his apostles , either commended for baptizing of their children , or reproved for neglecting to baptize them ; then infant-baptism is no ordinance of god. but no parents at any time or times have been by god commended for baptizing of their children , &c. ergo , infant-baptism is no ordinance of god. this argument will stand unanswerable , unless any can shew who they were that were ever commended for baptizing their children , or reproved for neglecting it , or unless they can shew a parallel case . arg. 14. if men were not to presume to alter any thing in the worship of god under the law , neither to add thereto , nor diminish therefrom , and god is as strict and jealous of his worship under the gospel ; then nothing ought to be altered in god's worship under the gospel . but under the law men were not to presume so to do , and god is as strict and jealous under the gospel . ergo. the major cannot be denied . the minor is clear ; see thou make all things according to the pattern shewed thee in the mount , exod. 25. 40. and levit. 10. 1 , 2. see how nadab and abibu sped , for presuming to vary from the command of god , and uzzah , tho but in small circumstances as they may seem to us . how dare men adventure , this being so , to change baptism from dipping into sprinkling , and the subject , from an adult believer , to an ignorant babe ? add thou not unto his word , &c. arg. 15. whatever practice opens a door to any humane traditions and innovations in god's worship , is a great evil , and to be avoided : but the practice of infant-baptism opens a door to any humane traditions and innovations in god's worship . ergo , to sprinkle or baptize infants is a great evil , and to be avoided . the major will not be denied . the minor is clear , because there is no scripture-ground for it , no command nor example for such a practice in god's word . and if without scripture-authority the church hath power to do one thing , she may do another , and so ad infinitum . arg. 16. whatsoever practice reflects upon the honour , wisdom and care of jesus christ , or renders him less faithful than moses , and the new testament in one of its great ordinances , ( nay , sacraments ) to lie more obscure in god's word , than any law or precept under the old testament , cannot be of god. but the practice of infant-baptism reflects on the honour , care and faithfulness of jesus christ , and renders him less faithful than moses , and a great ordinance , ( nay , sacrament ) of the new testament , to lie more dark and obscure than any precept under the old testament . ergo , infant-baptism cannot be of god. the major cannot be denied . the minor is easily proved : for he is bold indeed who shall affirm infant-baptism doth not lie obscure in god's word . one great party who assert it , say , 't is not to be found ●● the scripture at all , but 't is an unwritten apostolical tradition : others say , it lies not in the letter of the scripture , but may be proved by consequences ; and yet some great asserters of it , as dr. hammond and others , say , those consequences commonly drawn from divers texts for it , are without demonstration , and so prove nothing . i am sure a man may read the scripture a hundred times over , and never be thereby convinced ; he ought to baptize his children , tho it is powerful to convince men of all other duties . now can this be a truth , since christ who was more faithful than moses , and delivered every thing plainly from the father ? moses left nothing dark as to matter of duty , tho the precepts and external rites of his law were numerous , two or three hundred precepts , yet none were at a loss , or had need to say , is this a truth or an ordinance , or not ? for he that runs may read it . and shall one positive precept given forth by christ , who appointed so few in the new testament , be so obscure , as also the ground and end of it , that men should be confounded about the proofs of it , together with the end and ground thereof ? see heb. 3. 5 , 6. arg. 17. that custom or law which moses never delivered to the jews , nor is any where written in the old testament , was no truth of god , nor of divine authority . but that custom or law to baptize proselytes either men , women or children , was never given to the jews by moses , nor is it any where written in the old testament . ergo , it was no truth of god , nor of divine authority : and evident it is , as sir norton knatchbul shews , that the jewish rabbins differed among themselves also about it : for , saith he , rabbi eli●zer expresly contradicts rabbi josh●a , who was the first i know of who asserted this sort of baptism among the jews : for eli●zer , who was contemporary with rabbi josh●a , if he did not live before him , asserts , that a proselyte circumcised and not baptized , was a true proselyte . arg. 18. if baptism ●● of mere positive right , wholly depending on the will and sovereign pleasure of jesus christ , the great legislator : and he hath not required or commanded infants to be baptized : then infants ought not to be baptized : but baptism is of mere positive right , wholly depending on the will and sovereign pleasure of jesus christ , the great legislator , and he hath not required or commanded infants to be baptized . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . this argument tends to cut off all the pretended proofs of pedo-baptism , taken from the covenant made with abraham ; and because children are said to belong to the kingdom of heaven , it was not the right of abraham's male children to be circumcised , because they were begotten , and born of the fruit of his loins , till he received commandment from god to circumcise them . had he done it before , or without a command from god , it would have been will-worship in him so to have done . moreover , this further appears to be so , because no godly man's children , no● others in abraham's days , nor since , had any right thereto , but only his children , ( or such who were bought with his money , or were proselyted to the jewish religion ) because they had no command from god so to do , as abraham had . this being true , it follows , that if we should grant infants of believing gentiles , as such , were the seed of abraham ( which we deny ) yet unless god had commanded them to baptize their children , they ought not to do it ; and if they do it without a command o● authority from christ , it will be found an act of will-worship in them . arg. 19. all that were baptized in the apostolical primitive times , were baptized upon the profession of faith , were baptized into christ , and thereby put on christ , and were all one in christ jesus , and were abraham's seed and heirs , according to promise . but infants , as such , who are baptized , were not baptized upon the profession of their faith , nor did they out on christ thereby , nor are they all one in christ jesus , also are not abraham's seed and hoirs according to promise . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . mr. baxter confirms the substance of the major . these are his very words , i. ● . as many as have been baptized have put on christ , and are all one in christ jesus ; and are abraham ' s seed , and heirs , according to the promise , gal. 3. 27 , 28 , 29. this speaks the apostle , saith he , of the probability grounded on a credible profession , &c. baxter's confirm ▪ reconcil . pag. 32. the minor will stand firm till any can prove infants by a visible profession have put on christ , are all one in christ jesus , are abraham's seed and heirs according to promise . evident it is , none are the spiritual seed of abraham , but such who have the faith of abraham , and are truly grafted into christ , by a saving-faith . if any object , we read of some who were baptized , who had no saving-faith , but were hypocrites . i answer ; had they appeared to be such , they had not been baptized , not had they a true right thereto . arg. 20. baptism is the solemnizing of the souls marriage-union with christ , which marriage-contract absolutely requires an actual profession of consent . infants are not capable to enter into a marriage-union with christ , nor to make a profession of consent . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized . the major our opposits generally grant , particularly see what mr. baxter ●aith , our baptism is the solemnizing of our marriage with christ . these are his words , p. 32. the minor none can deny : no man sure in his right mind , will assert that little babes are capable to enter into a marriage-relation with christ , and to make a profession of a consent : and the truth is , he in the next words gives away his cause , viz. and 't is , saith he , a new and strange kind of marriage , where there is no profession of consent ; p. 32. how unhappy was this man to plead for such a new and strange kind of marriage : did he find any little babe he ever baptized ( or rather rantized ) to make a professioo of consent to be married to jesus christ . if any should object , he speaks of the baptism of the adult . i answer , his words are these , our baptism is , &c. besides , will any pedo-baptist , say , that the baptism of the adult is the solemnizing of the souls marriage with christ , and not the baptism of infants . reader , observe how our opposits are forced sometimes to speak the truth , though it overthrows their own practice of pedo-baptism . arg. 21. if the sins of no persons are forgiven them till they are converted , then they must no● be baptized for the forgiveness of them , till they profess themselves to be converted ; but the sins of no persons are forgiven them till they are converted . ergo , no person ought to be baptized for the forgiveness of them , till they profess they are converted . mr. baxter in the said treatise lays down the substance of this argument also , take his own words , i. e. as their sins are not forgiven them till they are converted , mark 4. 12. so they must not be baptized for the forgiveness of them , till they profess themselves converted , seeing to the church , non esse , and non apparere is all one . repentance towards god , and faith towards our lord jesus is the sum of that preaching that makes disciples , acts 20. 21. therefore , saith he , both these must by a profession seem to be received , before any at age are baptized ; p. 30. 31. and evident it is , say i , from hence none but such at age ought to be baptized . philip caused the eunuch to profess before he would baptize him , that he believed that jesus christ is the son of god. saul had also , saith he , more than a bare profession before baptism , acts 9. 5 , 15 , 17. p. 28. the promise it self , saith he doth expresly require a faith of our own , of all the adult that will have part in the priviledges : therefore there is a faith of our own , that is the condition of our title ; mark 16. 16. p. 16. he might have added by the force of his argument ; therefore infants should not have the priviledges : for i argue thus , viz. arg. 22. if there is but one baptism of water left by jesus christ in the new testament , and but one condition or manner of right thereto : and that one baptism is that of the adult ; then infant-baptism is no baptism of christ . but there is but one baptism in water left by christ in the new testament , and but one condition and manner of ●●ght thereto , and that one baptism is that of the adult . ergo , infant-baptism is no baptism of christ . mr. baxter saith , faith and repentance is the condition of the adult , and as to any other condition , i am sure the scripture is silent ; the way of the lord is one , one lord , one faith , one baptism , ephes . 4. 4. if profession of faith were not necessary , saith mr. baxter , coram ecclesiâ , to church-membership and priviledges , then infidels and heathens would have right ; also , saith he , the church and the world would be confounded . he might have added , but infidels and heathens have no right to church-membership , & c. ergo , t is a granted case among all christians , saith he , that profession is thus necessary , the apostles and ancient church admitted none without it ; pag. 21. and if so , why dare any now adays admit of infants , who are capable to make no professior . he adds , yea christ in his commission directeth his apostles to make disciples , and the ●●baptize them , promising , he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved , mark 16. 16. pag. 27. furthermore he ●aith , if as many as are baptized into christ , are baptized into his death , and are buried with him by baptism into death ; that like as christ was raised from the dead , so we also should walk in newness of life , &c. then no doubt , saith he , but such as were to be baptized , did f●●t profess this mortification , and a consent to be buried , & c. in our baptism we put off the body of the the sins of the flesh , by the circumcision of christ , bring buried with him , and raised with him through faith , quickned with him , and having all our trespasses forgive● , col. 2. 〈◊〉 , 12 , ●3 . and will any man ( says he ) yea , will paul ascribe all this to 〈◊〉 that did no● so much as profess the thing● 〈◊〉 ? will baptism , in the judgment of a wise man , do all this for an infidel , ( or , say i for an infant ) that cannot make a profession that he is a christian ? pag. 31 , 32. he proceeds . arg. 23. the baptized are in scripture called men washed , sanctified , justified ; ●●●y are called saints , and churches of saints , 1 cor. 1. 2. all christians are sanctified ones : pag. 33. now let me add the minor. but infants baptized are not in scripture called men washed , sanctified , justified , they are not called saints , churches of saints , christians , nor sanctified ones . ergo , infants ought not to be baptized ▪ if any should say , why did you not cite these assertions of mr. ba●ter's whilst he was living ? i answer , more then twelve years ago i did recite and print these assertions , and many other arguments of his to the same purpose , to which he gave no answer . arg. 24. if there is but one way for all , both parents and children to be admitted into the gospel-church to the end of the world , and that it is upon the profession of faith to be baptized ; then both parents and children must upon the profession of their faith be baptized , and so admitted , & c. but there is but one way for all , both parents and children , to be admitted into the gospel-church to the end of the world , and that is upon the profession of their faith to be baptized . ergo. arg. 25. that cannot be christ's true baptism wherein there is not , cannot be a lively representation of the death , burial and resurrection of jesus christ , together with our death un●o sin , and vi●ification to a new life . but in the r●●●●ing or sprinkling of an infant , there is not , cannot be a lively representation of christ's death , burial and resurrection , & c. ergo. arg. 26. that pretended baptism that tends to ●ru●trate the glorious ●●d and design of christ in his instituting of gospel-baptism , or cannot answer it , i● none of cl●●st's baptism . but the pretended baptism of infants tends to frustrate the glorious end and design of christ in instituting of gospel-baptism . ergo. the major will not be denied ▪ as to the minor , all generally con●●●● the end or design of christ in instituting the ordinance of baptism , was in a lively figure , to represent his death , burial , and resurrection , with the person 's death unto sin , and his rising again to walk in newness of ●ife , that is baptized , as the sacrament of the supper was ordained to represent his body was broke , and his blood was shed . but that a lively figure of christ's death , burial , and resurrection , appears in sprinkling a little water on the face , i see not ; and as done to an infant , there can no death to sin , and rising again to walk in newness of life , be signified ; and therefore christ's design and end therein is frustrated . arg. 27. if baptism be immersion , as to the proper and genuine signification of the word baptizo , as also of those typical and metaphorical baptisms and the spiritual signification thereof ; then sprinkling cannot be christ's true baptism . but immersion is the proper and genuine signification of the word baptizo , and also of those typical and metaphorical baptisms spoken of , and the spiritual signification thereof . ergo , sprinkling is not christ's true baptism . 1. that the proper and genuine signification of the word baptizo is immersion , or to dip , & c. we have proved , which is also confessed by the learned in that language . 2. the figurative baptism was , 1s● . that of the red sea , wherein the fathers were buried , as it were , unto moses in the sea , and under the cloud . fools annotations on 1 cor. 1● . 2. others , saith ●e , more probably think that the apostle useth this term , in regard of the great analogy betwixt baptism ( as it was then used ) the persons going down into the waters , and being dipped in them ; and the israelites going down into the sea , the great rec●p●acle of water , though 〈◊〉 water at that time was gathered on ●●aps on either side of them ▪ yet they see●●ed buried in the water , as persons in that age were when they were baptized , 〈◊〉 . the ●d . was that of noah's ark. s●e 〈…〉 k●a●e●bull : the ark of noah and baptism , saith he , were both a type and figure of the resurrection , no● the sign of the washing away of sin , though so taken metonymically , but a particular ●●gnal of the resurrection of christ ▪ of this baptism is a lively and emphatical figure , as also was the ark of noah , out of which he returned as from a sepulchre , to a new 〈◊〉 3. metaphorical baptism is that of the spirit and of affliction : the first signifies not a sprinkling of the spirit , but the great effusion of the spirit , like that at pentecost , acts 1. 4 , 5. shall be baptized , &c. on which words casaubon speaks thus : see dr. d●v●il on acts. 2. the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is to dip or plunge , as it were to die colours , in which sense , saith he , the apostles might be truly said to have been baptized : for the house in which this was done , was filled with the holy ghost ; so that the apostles might seem to have been plunged into it as in a large fish-pond . also oecumenius on acts 2. saith , a wind filled the whole house , that it seemed like a fish-pond , because it was promised to the apostles , that they should be baptized with the holy ghost . and the baptism of affliction are those great depths or overwhelmings of afflictions , like that of our saviour's suffering , i. e. no part free ; matth. 20. 22. where you have the same greed word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and like that of david , who saith , god drew him out of great waters . 4. the spiritual signification thereof is the death , burial and resurrection of christ , and of our death to sin , and vivification to a new ●ife . this being so , it follows undeniably sprinkling cannot be christ's true baptism , it must be immersion , and nothing else . and in the last place , finally , to confirm that baptizo is to dip , both from the literal and spiritual signification thereof , as also from those typical and metaphorical baptisms mentioned in the scripture , i might add further , that this evidentl● appears from the practice of john baptist and the apostles of christ , who baptized in rivers , and where there was much water : and also , because the baptizer and baptized are said to go down into the water , ( not down to the water ) and came up out of the water . john baptist is said to baptize them into jordan , as the greek word renders it , which shews it dipping and not sprinkling . would it be proper to say , he sprinkled them into jordan ? the lord open the eyes of those who see not , to consider these things . finis . a discovrse of baptisme its institution and efficacy upon all beleevers : together with a consideration of the practice of the church in baptizing infants of beleeving parents and the practice justified / by jer. taylor. taylor, jeremy, 1613-1667. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a63778 of text r27533 in the english short title catalog (wing t316). textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. the text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with morphadorner. the annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. this text has not been fully proofread approx. 157 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 33 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. earlyprint project evanston,il, notre dame, in, st. louis, mo 2017 a63778 wing t316 estc r27533 09929015 ocm 09929015 44363 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a63778) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 44363) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1369:4) a discovrse of baptisme its institution and efficacy upon all beleevers : together with a consideration of the practice of the church in baptizing infants of beleeving parents and the practice justified / by jer. taylor. taylor, jeremy, 1613-1667. [2], 60 p. printed by j. flesher for r. royston, london : 1653. reproduction of original in the trinity college library, cambridge university. with: treatises of 1. the liberty of prophesying ... / jer. taylor. london : printed for r. royston, 1650. eng infant baptism. baptism -church of england. a63778 r27533 (wing t316). civilwar no a discourse of baptisme, its institution, and efficacy upon all beleevers. together with a consideration of the practise of the church in ba taylor, jeremy 1653 30129 2 335 0 0 0 0 112 f the rate of 112 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the f category of texts with 100 or more defects per 10,000 words. 2005-02 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-02 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-04 john latta sampled and proofread 2005-04 john latta text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-10 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion a discovrse of baptisme , its institution , and efficacy upon all beleevers . together with a consideration of the practise of the church in baptizing infants of beleeving parents : and the practise justified . by jer : taylor d. d. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . suffer little children to come unto me , and forbid them not , &c. london , printed by j. flesher for r. royston , at the angel in ivy-lane . mdcliii . to the reader . bee pleased to take notice , that this discourse was not intended by the author to have been sent abroad thus by it self , but was fitted by him to the ayr and mode of other discourses , wherewith he had designed it to be joyned . but some persons of judgement , to whose perusal it was committed , supposing that if this should be kept in till those other could be finished , some disadvantage might arise to the cause which it asserts , wished and advised it might be published by it self . to whose desires the author ( against his first design ) hath condescended , upon this perswasion , that though it appears thus without some formalities and complements requisite to an intire treatise , yet , as to the thing it self , there is nothing wanting to it which he believed material to the question , or useful to the church . and as for those arguments which in the liberty of prophecying , sect. 18. are alledged against paedobaptism , and in the opinion of some , doe seem to stand in need of answering , he had it once in thought to have answered them : but upon these considerations he forbore , 1. because those arguments are not good in themselves , or to the question precisely considered : but onely by relation to the preceding arguments there brought for paedobaptim , they may seem good one against another , but these in the plea for the anababaptists , have no strength , but what is accidental ( as he conceives . ) 2. because in this discourse he hath really laid-such grounds , and proved them , that upon their supposition all those arguments in the liberty of prophecying , and all other which he ever heard of , will fall of themselves . 3. because those arguments , to his sense , are so weak , and so relying upon failing and deceitful principles , that he was loath to do them so much reputation , as to account them worthy the answering . 4. but because there may he some necessities which he knows not of , and are better observed by them who live in the midst of them , then by himself , who is thrust into a retirement in wales , therefore he accounts himself at rest in this particular , because he hath understood that his very worthy friend dr. h. hammond hath in his charity and humility descended to answer that collection ; and hopes , that both their hands being so fast clasped in a mutual complication , will doe some help and assistance to this question , by which the ark of the church is so violently shaken . a discourse of baptism . when the holy jesus was to begin his prophetical office , and to lay the foundation of his church on the corner-stone , he first temper'd the cement with water , and then with blood , and afterwards built it up by the hands of the spirit ; himself enter'd at that door by which his disciples for ever after were to follow him ; for therefore he went in at the door of baptism , that he might hallow the entrance which himself made to the house he was no building . as it was in the old , so it is in the new creation ; out of the waters god produced every living creature : and when at first the spirit moved upon the waters , and gave life , it was the type of what was designed in the renovation . every thing that lives now , is born of water and the spirit ; and christ , who is our creator and redeemer in the new birth , opened the fountains and hallowed the stream : christ who is our life went down into the waters of baptism , and we who descend thither finde the effects of life ; it is living water , of which who so drinks , needs not to drink of it again , for it shall be in him a well of water springing up to life eternall . but because everything is resolved into the same principles from whence they are taken , the old world which by the power of god came from the waters , by their own sin fell into the waters again , and were all-drowned , and onely eight persons were saved by an ark : and the world renewed upon the stock and reserves of that mercy , consigned the sacrament of baptism in another figure ; for then god gave his sign from heaven , that by water the world should never again perish : but he meant that they should be saved by water : for baptism , which is a figure like to this doth also now save us by the resurrection of jesus christ . after this , the jews report that the world took up the doctrine of baptisms , in remembrance that the iniquity of the old world was purged by water ; and they washed all that came to the service of the true god , and by that baptisme bound them to the observation of the precepts which god gave to noah . but when god separated a family for his own especial service , he gave them a sacrament of initiation , but it was a sacrament of blood , the covenant of circumcision : and this was the fore-runner of baptism , but not a type ; when that was abrogated , this came into the place of it , and that consigned the same faith which this professes : but it could not properly be a type , whose nature is by a likeness of matter or ceremony to represent the same mystery . neither is a ceremony , as baptism truly is , properly capable of having a type , it selfe is but a type of a greater mysteriousness : and the nature of types is , in shadow to describe by dark lines a future substance ; so that although circumcision might be a type of the effects and graces bestowed in baptism , yet of the baptism or absolution it selfe , it cannot be properly ; because of the unlikeness of the symboles and configurations , and because they are both equally distant from substances , which types are to consign and represent . the first bishops of ierusalem , and all the christian jews for many years retained circumcision together with baptism ; and christ himselfe , who was circumcised , was also baptized ; and therefore it is not so proper to call circumcision a type of baptism : it was rather a seal and sign of the same covenant to abraham and the fathers , and to all israel , as baptism is to all ages of the christian church . and because this rite could not be administred to all persons , and was not at all times after its institution , god was pleased by a proper and specifick type to consign this rite of baptism , which he intended to all , and that for ever : and god , when the family of his church grew separate , notorious , numerous and distinct , he sent them into their own countrey by a baptism through which the whole nation pass'd : for all the fathers were under the cloud , and all passed through the sea , and were all baptized unto moses in the cloud , and in the sea ; so by a double figure foretelling , that as they were initiated to moses law by the cloud above and the sea beneath : so should all the persons of the church , men , women and children , be initiated unto christ by the spirit from above and the water below : for it was the design of the apostle in that discourse , to represent that the fathers and we were equall as to the priviledges of the covenant ; he proved that we doe not exceed them , and it ought therefore to be certain that they doe not exceed us , nor their children ours . but after this , something was to remain which might not only consign the covenant which god made with abraham , but be as a passage from the fathers through the synagogue to the church ; from abraham by moses to christ : and that was circumcision , which was a rite which god chose to be a mark to the posterity of abraham , to distinguish them from the nations which were not within the covenant of grace , and to be a seal of the righteousnesse of faith , which god made to be the spirit and life of the covenant . but because circumcision although it was ministred to all the males , yet it was not to the females ; and although they and all the nation was baptized and initiated into moses in the cloud and the sea , therefore the children of israel by imitation of the patriarchs the posterity of noah , used also ceremonial baptisms to their women and to their proselytes , and to all that were circumcised ; and the jews deliver , that sarah and rebecca when the were adopted into the family of the church , that is , of abraham and isaac , were baptized : and so were all strangers that were married to the sons of israel . and that we may think this to be typical of christian baptism , the doctors of the jews had a tradition , that when the messias would come , there should be so many proselytes that they could not be circumcised , but should be baptized . the tradition proved true , but not for their reason . but that this rite of admitting into mysteries , and institutions , and offices of religion by baptisms , was used by the posterity of noah , or at least very early among the jews , besides the testimonies of their own doctors , i am the rather induced to believe , because the heathen had the same rite in many places and in several religions : so they initiated disciples into the secrets of a mithra ; and the priests of cotyttus were called b baptae , because by baptism they were admitted into the religion ; and they c thought murther , incest , rapes , and the worst or crimes , were purged by dipping in the sea , or fresh springs ; and a proselyte is called in arrianus , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , intinctus , a baptized person . but this ceremony of baptizing was so certain and usual among the jews , in their admitting proselytes and adopting into institutions , that to baptize and to make disciples are all one ; and when iohn the baptist by an order from heaven went to prepare the way to the coming of our blessed lord he preached repentance , and baptized all that professed they did repent . he taught the jews to live good lives , and baptized with the baptism of a prophet , such as was not unusually done by extraordinary and holy persons in the change or renewing of discipline or religion . whether iohn's baptism was from heaven , or of men , christ asked the pharisees . that it was from heaven , the people therefore believed , because he was a prophet , and a holy person : but it implyes also , that such baptisms are sometimes from men , that is , used by persons of an eminent religion , or extraordinary fame for the gathering of disciples and admitting proselytes : and the disciples of christ did so too , even before christ had instituted the sacrament for the christian church , the disciples that came to christ were baptized by his apostles . and now we are come to the gates of baptism . all these till iohn were but types and preparatory baptisms , and iohn's baptism was but the prologue to the baptism of christ . the jewish baptisms admitted proselytes to moses and to the law of ceremonies ; iohn's baptisme called them to believe in the messias now appearing , and to repent of their sins , to enter into the kingdom which was now at hand , and preached that repentance which should be for the remission of sins . his baptism remitted no sinnes , but preached and consigned repentance , which , in the belief of the messias whom he pointed to , should pardon sins . but because he was taken from his office before the work was compleated , the disciples of christ finished it : they went forth preaching the same sermon of repentance , and the approach of the kingdom , and baptized or made proselytes or disciples , as iohn did ; onely they ( as it is probable ) baptized in the name of iesus , which it is not so likely iohn did . a and this very thing might be the cause of the different forms of b baptism recorded in the acts , of baptizing in the name of iesus , and at other times in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost ; the former being the manner of doing it in pursuance of the design of iohn's baptism ; and the latter the form of institution by christ for the whole christian church , appointed after his resurrection : the disciples at first using promiscuously what was used by the same authority , though with some difference of mysterie . the holy jesus having found his way ready prepared by the preaching of iohn , and by his baptism , and the jewish manner of adopting proselytes and disciples into the religion , a way chalked out for him to initiate disciples into his religion , took what was so prepared , and changed it into a perpetual sacrament . he kept the ceremony , that they who were led onely by outward things , might be the better called in , and easier inticed into the religion , when they entred by a ceremony which their nation alwayes used in the like cases : and therefore without change of the outward act , he put into it a new spirit , and gave it a new grace and a proper efficacy : he sublim'd it to higher ends , and adorned it with stars of heaven : he made it to signifie greater mysteries , to convey greater blessings , to consign the bigger promises , to cleanse deeper then the skin , and to carry proselytes further then the gates of the institution . for so he was pleased to do in the other sacrament ; he took the ceremony which he found ready in the custome of the jews , where the major domo after the paschal supper gave bread and wine to every person of his family ; he changed nothing of it without , but transfer'd the rite to greater mysteries , and put his own spirit to their sign , and it became a sacrament evangelical . it was so also in the matter of excommunication , where the jewish practise was made to passe into christian discipline : without violence and noise old things became new , while he fulfilled the law , making it up in full measures of the spirit . by these steps baptism passed on to a divine evangelical institution , which we finde to be consigned by three evangelists . goe ye therefore and teach all nations , baptizing them in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost . it was one of the last commandements the holy jesus gave upon the earth , when he taught his apostles the things which concerned his kingdome . for he that believeth and is baptized , shall be saved : but , unlesse a man be born of water and the holy spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven ; agreeable to the decretory words of god by abraham in the circumcision , to which baptism does succeed in the consignation of the same covenant , and the same spiritual promises ; the uncircumcised child whose flesh is not circumcised , that soul shall be cut off from his people ; he hath broken my covenant . the manichees , seleucus , hermias , and their followers , people of a dayes abode and small interest , but of malicious doctrine , taught baptism not to be necessary , not to be used ; upon this ground , because they supposed that it was proper to iohn to baptize with water , and reserved for christ as his peculiar , to baptize with the holy ghost and with fire . indeed christ baptized none otherwise . he sent his spirit upon the church in pentecost and baptized them with fire , the spirit appearing like a flame : but he appointed his apostles to baptize with water , and they did so , and their successors after them , every where and for ever , not expounding , but obeying the praeceptive words of their lord , which were almost the last that he spake upon earth . and i cannot think it necessary to prove this to be necessary by any more arguments . for the words are so plain , that they need no exposition ; and yet if they had been obscure , the universal practise of the apostles and the church for ever , is a sufficient declaration of the commandement : no tradition is more universal , no not of scripture it self ; no words are plainer , no not the ten commandements : and if any suspicion can be superinduced by any zealous or lesse discerning person , it will need no other refutation , but to turn his eyes to those lights by which himself sees scripture to be the word of god , and the commandements to be the declaration of his will . but that which will be of greatest concernment in this affair , is to consider the great benefits are conveyed to us in this sacramnet ; for this will highly conclude , that the precept was for ever , which god so seconds with his grace and mighty blessings ; and the susception of it necessary , because we cannot be without those excellent things which are the graces of the sacrament . 1. the first fruit is , that in baptism we are admitted to the kingdome of christ , presented unto him , consigned with his sacrament , enter into his militia , give up our understandings and our choice to the obedience of christ , and in all senses that we can , become his disciples , witnessing a good confession , and undertaking a holy life : and therefore in scripture {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , are conjoyn'd in the significations , as they are in the mystery : it is a giving up our names to christ , and it is part of the foundation of the first principles of the religion , as appears in s. pauls catechism ; it is so the first thing , that it is for babes , and neophytes , in which they are matriculated and adopted into the house of their father , and taken into the hands of their mother . upon this account baptism is called in antiquity , ecclesiae janua , porta gratiae , & primus introitus sanctorum ad aeternam dei & ecclesiae consuetudinem . the gates of the church , the door of grace , the first entrance of the saints to an eternall conversation with god and the church . sacramentum initiationis , & intrantium christianismum investituram , s , bernard calls it : the sacrament of initiation , and the investiture of them that enter into the religion ; and the person so entring is called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} and {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , one of the religion , or a proselyte and convert , and one added to the number of the church , in imitation of that of s. luke , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , god added to the church those that should be saved ; just as the church does to this day and for ever , baptizing infants and catechumens : {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , they are added to the church , that they may be added to the lord , and the number of the inhabitants of heaven . 2. the next step beyond this , is adoption into the covenant , which is an immediate consequent of the first presentation , this being the first act of man , that the first act of god . and this is called by s. paul , a being baptized in one spirit into one body , that is , we are made capable of the communion of saints , the blessings of the faithful , the priviledges of the church : by this we are , as s. luke calls it , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , ordained , or disposed , put into the order of eternal life , being made members of the mystical body under christ our head . 3. and therefore baptism is a new birth , by which we enter into the new world , the new creation , the blessings and spiritualties of the kingdome ; and this is the expression which our saviour himselfe used to nicodemus , unlesse a man be born of water and the spirit : and it is by s. paul called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the laver of regeneration ; for now we begin to be reckoned in a new census or account , god is become our father , christ our elder brother , the spirit the earnest of our inheritance , the church our mother , our food is the body and blood of our lord ; faith is our learning , religion our imployment , and our whole life is spiritual , and heaven the object of our hopes , and the mighty price of our high calling . and from this time forward we have a new principle put into us , the spirit of grace , which besides our soul and body is a principle of action , of one nature , and shall with them enter into the portion of our inherirance . and therefore the primitive christians , who consigned all their affairs and goods and writings with some marks of their lord , usually writing {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , iesus christ the son of god our saviour ; they made an abbreviature by writing onely the capitals , thus : {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . which the heathens in mockery and derision made {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , which signifies a fish , and they used it for christ as a name of reproach : but the christians owned the name , and turned it into a pious metaphor , and were content that they should enjoy their pleasure in the acostrich ; but upon that occasion tertullian speaks pertinently to this article , nos pisciculi secundum {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} nostrum iesum christum , in aquâ nascimur , christ whom you call a fish , we knowledge to be our lord and saviour ; and we , if you please , are the little fishes , for we are born in water ; thence we derive our spiritual life . and because from henceforward we are a new creation , the church uses to assign new relations to the catechumens , spiritual fathers and susceptors ; and at their entrance into baptism , the christians and jewish proselytes did use to cancel all secular affections to their temporal relatives , nec quicquam prius imbuuntur quàm contemnere deos , exuere patriam , parentes , liberos , fratres vilia habere , said tacitus of the christians : which was true in the sense onely as christ said , he that deth not hate father or mother for my sake , is not worthy of me ; that is , he that doth not hate them prae me , rather then forsake me , forsake them , is unworthy of me . 4. in baptism all our sins are pardoned , according to the words of a prophet : i will sprinkle clean water upon you , and ye shall be clean from all your filthinesse . the catechumen descends into the font a sinner , he arises purified ; he goes down the son of death , he comes up the son of the resurrection ; he enters in the son of folly and praevarication , he returns the son of reconciliation ; he stoops down the childe of wrath , and ascends the heir of mercy ; he was the childe of the devil , and now he is the servant and the son of god . they are the words of ven. bede concerning this mystery . and this was ingeniously signified by that greek inscription upon a font , which is so prettily contriv'd , that the words may be read after the greek or after the hebrew manner , and be exactly the same , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , lord wash my sin , and not my face , onely . and so it is intended and promised , arise and be baptized , and wash away thy sins , and call on the name of the lord , said ananias to saul ; for , christ loved the church and gave himself for it , that he might sanctify and cleanse it , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , with the washing of water in the word , that is , baptism in the christian religion : and therefore tertullian calls baptism lavacrum compendiatum , a compendious laver ; that is , an intire cleansing the soul in that one action justly and rightly performed : in the rehearsal of which doctrine , it was not an unpleasant etymology that anastasius sinaita gave of baptism ; {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} quasi {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , in which our sins are thrown off ; and they fall like leeches when they are full of blood and water , or like the chains from s. peters hands at the presence of the angel . baptism is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , an intirefull forgivenesse of sins , so that they shall never be called again to scrutiny . — — — omnia daemonis arma his merguntur aquis , quibus ille renascitur infans qui captivus erat — the captivity of the soul is taken away by the blood of redemption , and the fiery darts of the devil are quenched by these salutary waters ; and what the flames of hell are expiating or punishing to eternal ages , that is washed off quickly in the holy font , and an eternal debt paid in an instant : for so sure as the egyptians were drowned in the red sea , so sure are our sins washed in this holy flood : for this is a red sea too ; these waters signifie the blood of christ , these are they that have washed their robes , and made them white in the blood of the lamb , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . the blood of christ cleanseth us , the water cleanseth us , the spirit purifies us ; the blood by the spirit , the spirit by the water , all in baptism , and in pursuance of that baptismal state . these three are they that bear record in earth , the spirit , the water , and the blood , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , these three agree in one , or are to one purpose ; they agree in baptism , and in the whole pursuance of the assistances , which a christian needs all dayes of his life : and therefore s. cyril calls baptism {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the antitype of the passions of christ : it does preconsign the death of christ ; and does the infancy of the work of grace , but not weakly ; it brings from death to life ; and though it brings us but to the birth in the new life , yet that is a greater change then is in all the periods of our growth to manhood , to a perfect man in christ iesus . 5. baptism does not onely pardon our sins , but puts us into a state of pardon for the time to come . eor baptism is the beginning of the new life , and an admission of us into the evangelical covenant , which on our parts consists in a sincere and timely endeavour to glorify god by faith and obedience : and on gods part , he will pardon what is past , assist us for the future , and not measure us by grains and scruples , or exact our duties by the measure of an angel , but by the span of a mans hand . so that by baptism we are consigned to the mercies of god and the graces of the gospel ; that is , that our pardon be continued and our piety be a state of repentance . and therefore that baptism which in the nicene creed we profess to be for the remission of sins , is called in the ierusalem creed , the baptism of repentance ; that is , it is the entrance of a new life , the gate to a perpetual change and reformation , all the way continuing our title to , and hopes of forgiveness of sins . and this excellency is clearly recorded by s. paul , the kindeness and love of god our saviour toward man hath appeared ; not by works in righteousness which we have done : that 's the formality of the gospel-covenant , not to be exacted by the strict measures of the law , but according to his mercy he saved us , that is , by gentleness and remissions , by pitying & pardoning us , by relieving and supporting us , because he remembers that we are but dust ; and all this mercy we are admitted to , and is conveyed to us , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , by the laver of regeneration , and the renewing of the holy ghost . and this plain evident doctrine was observed , explicated and urged against the messalians , who said that baptism was like a razor , that cut away all the sins that were past , or presently adhering , but not the sins of our future life ; {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . this sacrament promises more and greater things , it is the earnest of future good things , the type of the resurrection , the communication of the lords passion , the partaking of his resurrection , the robe of righteousness , the garment of gladness , the vestment of light , or rather light it selfe . and for this reason it is , that baptism is not to be repeated , because it does at once all that it can doe at a hundred times : for it admits us to the condition of repentance and evangelical mercy , to a state of pardon for our infirmities and sins , which we timely and effectually leave : and this is a thing that can be done but once , as a man can begin but once ; he that hath once entred in at this gate of life is alwayes in possibility of pardon , if he be in a possibility of working and doing after the manner of a man , that which he hath promised to the son of god . and this was expresly delivered and observed by s. austin . that which the apostle sayes , cleansing him with the washing of water in the word , is to be understood , that in the same laver of regeneration , and word of sanctification , all the evils of the regenerate are cleansed and healed : not onely the sins that are past , which all are now remitted in baptism ; but also those that are contracted afterwards by humane ignorance and infirmity : not that baptism be repeated as often as we sin , but because by this which is once administred , is brought to pass that pardon of all sins , not onely of those that are past , but also those which will be committed afterwards , is obtained . the messalians denyed this , and it was part of their heresie in the undervaluing of baptism ; and for it they are most excellently confuted by isidore pelusiot , in his third book , 195 epistle to the count hermin : whither i refer the reader . in proportion to this doctrine it is , that the holy scripture calls upon us to live a holy life , in pursuance of this grace of baptism . and s. paul recalls the lapsed galatians to their covenant , and the grace god stipulated in baptism : ye are all children of god by faith in iesus christ ; that is , heirs of the promise . and abrahams seed : that promise which cannot be disannulled , increased or diminished , but is the same to us as it was to abraham ; the same before the law and after . therefore doe not you hope to be justified by the law , for you are entred into the covenant of faith , and are to be justified thereby . this is all your hope , by this you must stand for ever , or you cannot stand at all ; but by this you may : for you are gods children by faith ; that is , not by the law , or the covenant of works : and that you may remember whence you are going , and return again , he proves , that they are the children of god by faith in jesus christ , because they have been baptized into christ , and so put on christ . this makes you children , and such as are to be saved by faith , that is , a covenant , not of works , but of pardon in jesus christ , the authour and establisher of this covenant . for this is the covenant made in baptism , that being justified by his grace , we shall be heirs of life eternal : for by grace , that is , by favour , remission and forgiveness in jesus christ , ye are saved . this is the onely way that we have of being justified , and this must remain as long as we are in hopes of heaven : for besides this we have no hopes , and all this is stipulated and consigned in baptism , and is of force after our fallings into sin and risings again . in pursuance of this , the same apostle declares , that the several states of sin , are so many recessions from the state of baptismal grace ; and if we arrive to the direct apostasie and renouncing of , or a contradiction to , the state of baptism , we are then unpardonable , because we are falne from our state of pardon . this s. paul conditions most strictly , in his epistle to the hebrewes ; this is the covenant i will make in those days , i will put my laws in their hearts , and their sins and iniquities will i remember no more , now where remission of these is , there is no more offering for sin ; that is , our sinnes are so pardoned , that we need no more oblation , we are then made partakers of the death of christ ; which we afterwards renew in memory and eucharist , and representment . but the great work is done in baptism : for so it follows ; having boldnesse to enter into the holiest by the blood of iesus , by a new and living way , that is , by the vail of his flesh , his incarnation . but how doe we enter into this ? baptism is the door , and the ground of this confidence for ever : for so he addes ; let us draw near with a true heart , in full assurance of faith , having our hearts sprinkled from an evill conscience , and our bodies washed with pure water . this is the consignation of this blessed state , and the gate to all this mercy : let us therefore hold fast the profession of our faith ; that is , the religion of a christian ; the faith into which we were baptized : for that is the faith that justifies and saves us ; let us therefore hold fast this profession of this faith , and doe all the intermedial works , in order to the conservation of it , such as are assembling in the communion of saints , ( the use of the word and sacrament is included in the precept ) mutual exhortation , good example , and the like : for if we sin wilfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth , that is , if we sin against the profession of this faith , & hold it not fast , but let the faith and the profession goe wilfully , ( which afterwards he cals a treading under foot the son of god , a counting the blood of the covenant wherewith he was sanctified , an unholy thing , and a doing despight to the spirit of grace ; viz. which moved upon these waters , and did illuminate him in baptism ) if we do this , there is no more sacrifice for sins , no more deaths of christ , into which you may be baptized ; that is , you are faln from the state of pardon and repentance , into which you were admitted in baptism , and in which you continue , so long as you have not quitted your baptismal rights , and the whole covenant . contrary to this , is that which s. peter calls making our calling and election sure , that is , a doing all that which may continue us in our state of baptism , and the grace of the covenant . and between these two states , of absolute apostasie from , and intirely adhering to , and securing this state of calling and election , are all the intermedial sins , and being overtaken in single faults , or declining towards vitious habits ; which in their several proportions , are degrees of danger and insecurity ; which s. peter calls , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , a forgetting our baptism , or purification from our sins . and in this sense are those words , the just shall live by faith ; that is , by that profession which they made in baptism : from which , if they swerve not , they shall be supported in their spirituall life . it is a grace , which by vertue of the covenant consign'd in baptism does like a centre , transmit effluxes to all the periods and portion of our life : our whole life , all the periods of our succeeding hopes are kept alive by this . this consideration is of great use , besides many other things , to reprove the folly of those who in the primitive church deferr'd their baptism till their death-bed : because baptism is a laver of sanctification , and drowns all our sins , and buries them in the grave of our lord , they thought they might sin securely upon the stock of an after-baptism ; for unlesse they were strangely prevented by a sudden accident , a death-bed baptism they thought would secure their condition : but early some of them durst not take it , much lesse in the beginning of their years , that they might at least gain impunity for their follies and heats of their youth . baptisme hath influence into the pardon of all our sins committed in all the dayes of our folly and infirmity ; and so long as we have not been baptized , so long we are out of the state of pardon , and therefore an early baptism is not to be avoided , upon this mistaken fancy and plot upon heaven : it is the greater security towards the pardon of our sins , if we have taken it in the beginning of our dayes . 5. the next benefit of baptism , which is also a verification of this , is a sanctification of the baptized person by the spirit of grace : sanctus in hunc coelo descendit spiritus amnem , coelestique sacras fonte maritat aquas : concipit unda deum , sanctámque liquoribus almis edit ab aeterno semine progeniem . the holy ghost descends upon the waters of baptism , and makes them prolificall , apt to produce children unto god : and therefore saint leo compares the font of baptism , to the womb of the blessed virgin , when it was replenished with the holy spirit . and this is the baptism of our dearest lord : his ministers baptize with water ; our lord at the same time verifies their ministery , with giving the holy spirit : they are joyned together by s. paul , we are by one spirit baptized into one body ; that is , admitted into the church by baptism of water and the spirit . this is that which our blessed lord calls a being born of water and of the spirit ; by water we are sacramentally dead and buried , by the spirit we are made alive . but because these are mysterious expressions , and according to the style of scriture , high and secret in spiritual significations , therefore that we may understand what these things signifie , we must consider it by its real effects , and what it produces upon the soule of a man . 1. it is the suppletory of originall righteousnesse , by which adam was at first gracious with god , and which he lost by his prevarication . it was in him a principle of wisdome and obedience , a relation between god and himself , a title to the extraordinary mercies of god and a state of friendship : when he fell , he was discomposed in all , the links of the golden chain and blessed relation were broken ; and it so continued in the whole life of man , which was stained with the evils of this folly , and the consequent mischiefs : and therefore when we began the world again , entring into the articles of a new life , god gave us his spirit , to be an instrument of our becoming gracious persons , and of being in a condition of obtaining that supernatural end , which god at first designed to us . and therefore as our baptism is a separation of us from unbelieving people : so the descent of the holy spirit upon us in our baptism , is a consigning or marking us for god , as the sheep of his pasture , as the souldiers of his army , as the servants of his houshold : we are so separated from the world , that we are appropriated to god , so that god expects of us duty and obedience ; and all sins are acts of rebellion and undutifulnesse : of this nature was the sanctification of jeremy and iohn the baptist from their mothers womb ; that is , god took them to his own service by an early designation , and his spirit mark'd them to a holy ministery . to this also relates that of s. paul , whom god by a decree separated from his mothers womb to the ministery of the gospel : the decree did antedate the act of the spirit , which did not descend upon him untill the day of his baptism . what these persons were in order to exterior ministeries , that all the faithful are in order to faith and obedience , consigned in baptism by the spirit of god , to a perpetual relation to god , in a continual service and title to his promises . and in this sense the spirit of god is called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , * a seal , in whom also after that ye believed , ye were sealed with that holy spirit of promise . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . the water washes the body , and the spirit seals the soul ; viz. to a participation of those promises which he hath made , and to which we receive a title to our baptism . 2. the second effect of the spirit , is light , or illuminations ; that is , the holy spirit becomes unto us the authour of holy thoughts and firm perswasions , and sets to his seal that the word of god is true ; into the beliefe of which we are then baptized , and makes faith to be a grace , and the understanding resigned , and the will confident , and the assent stronger then the promises , and the propositions to be believed , because they are belov'd , and we are taught the ways of godlinesse after a new manner , that is , we are made to perceive the secrets of the kingdome , and to love religion , and to long for heaven and heavenly things , and to despise the world , and to have new resolutions , and new preceptions , and new delicacies , in order to the establishment of faith , and its increment and perseverance , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . god sits in the soul when it is illuminated in baptism , as if he sate in his throne ; that is , he rules by a firm perswasion , and intire principles of obedience . and therefore baptism is called in scripture , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , and the baptized , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} illuminated : call to minde the former days , in which ye were illuminated : and the same phrase is in the 6 to the hebrewes , where the parallel places expound each other . for that which s. paul calls , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , once illuminated ; he calls after , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , a receiving the knowledge of the truth : and that you may perceive this to be wholly meant of baptism , the apostle expresses it still by its synonymas , tasting of the heavenly gift , and made partakers of the holy ghost , sprinkled in our hearts from an evill conscience , and washed in our bodies with pure water : all which also are a syllabus or collection of the severall effects of the graces bestowed in baptism . but we are now instancing in that which relates most properly to the understanding , in which respect the holy spirit also is called anointing or unction ; and the mystery is explicated by s. iohn , the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you , and ye need not that any man teach you ; but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things . 3. the holy spirit descends upon us in baptism , to become the principle of a new life ; to become a holy seed , springing up to holinesse , and is called by s. iohn , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the seed of god : and the purpose of it we are taught by him , whosoever is born of god ( that is , he that is regenerated and entred into this new birth ) doth not commit sin ; for his seed remaineth in him , and he cannot sin , because he is born of god . the spirit of god , is the spirit of life ; and now that he by the spirit is born anew , he hath in him that principle , which , if it be cherished , will grow up to life , to life eternall . and this is the spirit of sanctification , the victory of the world , the deletery of concupiscence , the life of the soul , and the perpetual principle of grace sown in our spirits in the day of our adoption to be the sons of god , and members of christs body . but take this mystery in the words of s. basil ; there are two ends proposed in baptism , to wit , to abolish the body of sin , that we may no more bring forth fruit unto death ; and to live in the spirit , and to have our fruit to sanctification . the water represents the image of death , receiving the body in its bosome , as in a sepulchre . but the quickning spirit sends upon us a vigorous {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , power or efficacy , even from the beginning renewing our souls from the death of sin unto life . for as our mortification is perfected in the water , so the spirit works life in us . to this purpose is the discourse of s. paul ; having largely discoursed of our being baptized into the death of christ , he addes this as the corollary of all , he that is dead , is freed from sin * ; that is , being mortified , and buried in the waters of baptism , we have a new life of righteousnesse put into us ; we are quitted from the dominion of sin , and are planted together in the likenesse of christs resurrection , that henceforth we should not serve sin . 4. but all these intermediall blessings tend to a glorious conclusion , for baptism does also consign us to a holy resurrection . it takes the sting of death from us , by burying us together with christ ; and takes off sin , which is the sting of death , and then we shall be partakers of a blessed resurrection . this we are taught by saul , know ye not that so many of us as are baptized into iesus christ were baptized into his death ? for if we have been planted together in the likenesse of his death , we shall be also in the likenesse of his resurrection . that declares the real event in its due season . but because baptism consigns it , and admits us to a title to it , we are said with s. paul , to be risen with christ in baptism ; buried with him in baptism , wherein also you are risen with him , through the faith of the operation of god , which hath raised him from the dead : which expression i desire to be remembred , that by it we may better understand those other sayings of the apostle , of putting on christ in baptism , putting on the new man , &c. for these onely signifie {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , or the design on gods part , and the endevour and duty on mans : we are then consigned to our duty , and to our reward ; we undertake one , and have a title to the other : and though men of ripeness and reason enter instantly into their portion of work , and have present use of the assistances , and something of their reward in hand ; yet we cannot conclude , that those that cannot do it presently , are not baptized rightly , because they are not in capacity to put on the new man in righteousnesse , that is , in an actual holy life : for they may put on the new man in baptism , just as they are risen with christ : which because it may be done by faith , before it is done in real event , and it may be done by sacrament and design , before it be done by a proper faith ; so also may our putting on the new man be . it is done sacramentally , and that part which is wholly the work of god , does onely antedate the work of man , which is to succeed in its due time , and is after the manner of preventing grace : but this is by the by : in order to the present article , baptism is by theodoret called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , a participation of the lords resurrection . 5. and lastly , by baptism we are saved ; that is , we are brought from death to life here , and that is the first resurrection , and we are bought from death to life hereafter , by vertue of the covenant of the state of grace , into which in baptism we enter , and are preserved from the second death , and receive a glorious and an eternal life : he that believeth and is baptized , shall be saved , said our blessed saviour ; and , according to his mercy he saved us , by the washing of regeneration , and renewing of the holy ghost . after these great blessings so plainly testified in scripture , and the doctrine of the primitive church , which are regularly consigned add bestowed in baptism , i shall lesse need to descend to temporal blessings , or rare contingencies , or miraculous events , or probable notices of things lesse certain : of this nature are those stories recorded in the writings of the church , that constantine was cured of a leprosie in baptism , theodosius recovered of his disease , being baptized by the bishop of thessalonica ; and a paralytick jew was cured as soon as he became a christian , and was baptized by atticus of c. p. and bishop arnulph baptizing a leper , also cured him , said vincentius bellovacensis . it is more considerable , which is generally and piously believed by very many eminent persons in the church , that at our baptism god assigns an angel guardian : for then the catechumen being made a servant and a brother to the lord of angels , is sure not to want the aids of them who pitch their tents round about them that fear the lord : and that this guard and mininistery is then appointed , when themselves are admitted into the inheritance of the promises , and their title to salvation is hugely agreeable to the words of s. paul , are they not all ministring spirits , sent forth to minister to them who shall be heirs of salvation ? where it appears , that the title to the inheritance is the title to this ministery , and therefore must begin and end together . but i insist not on this , though it seeems to me hugely probable . all these blessings put into one syllabus , have given to baptism many honourable appellatives in scripture , and other divine writers , calling it {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , sacramentum vitae & aeternae salutis . a new birth , a regeneration , a renovation , a charret carrying us to god , the great circumcision , a circumcision made without hands , the key of the kingdome , the paranymph of the kingdome , the earnest of our inheritance , the answer of a good conscience , the robe of light , the sacrament of a new life , and of eternal salvation . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . this is celestial water , springing from the sides of the rock , upon the which the church was built when the rock was smitten with the rod of god . it remains now , that we enquire what concerns our duty , and in what persons , or in what dispositions baptism produces all these glorious effects ? for , the sacraments of the church work in the vertue of christ , but yet onely upon such as are servants of christ , and hinder not the work of the spirit of grace . for the water of the font , and the spirit of the sacrament , are indeed to wash away our sins , and to purifie our souls : but not unlesse we have a minde to be purified . the sacrament works pardon for them that hate their sin , and procures grace for them , that love it . they that are guilty of sins , must repent of them , and renounce them , and they must make a profession of the faith of christ , and give , or be given up to the obedience of christ , and then they are rightly disposed . he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved ; saith christ ; and s. peter call'd out to the whole assembly , repent , and be baptized every one of you . concerning this , iustin martyr gives the same account of the faith and practise of the church . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , &c. whosoever are perswaded , and believe those things to be true , which are delivered and spoken by us , and undertake to live accordingly , they are commanded to fast and pray , and to ask of god remission of their former sins , we also praying together with them , and fasting . then they are brought to us where water is , and are regenerated in the same manner of regeneration , by which we our selves are regenerated . for in baptism , s. peter observes there are two parts , the body , and the spirit ; that is , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the putting away the filth of the flesh , that is , the material washing : and this is baptism , no otherwise then a dead corps is a man : the other is , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the answer of a good conscience towards god ; that is , the conversion of the soul to god , that 's the effective disposition in which baptism does save us . and in the same sense are those sayings of the primitive doctors to be understood , anima non lavatione sed responsione sancitur . the soul is not healed by washing , viz. alone , but by the answer , the {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} in s. peter , the correspondent of our part of the covenant : for that 's the perfect sense of this unusuall expression . and the effect is attributed to this , and denied to the other , when they are distinguished : so iustin martyr affirms ; the onely baptism that can heal us , is repentance , and the knowledg of god . for what need is there of that baptism that can onely cleanse the flesh and the body ? be washed in your flesh from wrath and covetousness , from envy and hatred , and behold the body is pure . and clemens alex andrinus upon the proverbial saying , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , be not pure in the laver , but in the minde ; addes , i suppose that an exact and a firm repentance , is a sufficient purification to a man ; if judging and considering our selves for the facts we have done before , we proceed to that which is before us , considering that which follows , and cleansing or washing our minde from sensual affections , and from former sins . just as we use to deny the effect to the instrumental cause , and attribute it to the principal in the manner of speaking , when our purpose is to affirm this to be the principal , and of chief influence . so we say , it is not the good lute , but the skilful hand that makes the musick : it is not the body , but the soul that is the man ; and yet he is not the man without both . for baptism is but the material part in the sacrament , it is the spirit that giveth life ; whose work is faith and repentance begun by himselfe , without the sacrament , and consigned in the sacrament , and actuated and increased in the cooperation of our whole life : and therefore baptism is called in the ierusalem creed , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , one baptism of repentance for the remission of sins ; and by iustin martyr , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . the baptism of repentance and the knowledge of god , which was made for the sins of the people of god . he explains himself a little after , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . baptism that can onely cleanse them that are penitent . in sacramentis trinitati occurrit fides credentium & professio quae apud acta conficitur angelorum , ubi miscentur coelestia & spiritualia semina , ut sancto germine nova possit renascentium indoles procreari , ut dum trinitas cum side concordat , qui natus fuerit saeculo , renascatur spiritualiter deo. sic fit hominum pater deus , sancta fit mater ecclesia , said optatus . the faith and profession of the believers , meets with the ever-blessed trinity , and is recorded in the register of angels , where heavenly and spiritual seeds are mingled ; that from so holy a spring , may be produced a new nature of the regeneration , that while the trinity ( viz. that is invocated upon the baptized ) meets with the faith of the catechumen , he that was born to to the world , may be born spiritually to god . so god is made a father to the man , and the holy church a mother . faith and repentance strip the old man naked , and make him fit for baptism ; and then the holy spirit moving upon the waters , cleanses the soul , and makes it to put on the new man , who grows up to perfection and a spiritual life , to a life of glory , by our verification of the undertaking in baptism on our part , and the graces of the spirit on the other . for the waters pierce no further then the skin , till the person puts off his affection to the sin that he hath contracted ; and then he may say , aquae intraverunt usque ad animam meam , the waters are entred even unto my soul , to purifie and cleanse it , by the washing of water , and the renewing by the holy spirit : the sum is this , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , being baptized , we are illuminated ; being illuminated , we are adopted to the inheritance of sons ; being adopted , we are promoted towards perfection ; and being perfected , we are made immortal . quisquis in hos fontes vir venerit , exeat inde semideus , tactis citò nobilitetur in undis . this is the whole doctrine of baptism , as it is in it selfe considered , without relation to rare circumstances , or accidental cases : and it will also serve to the right understanding of the reasons why the church of god hath in all ages baptized all persons , that were within her power , for whom the church could stipulate that they were or might be relatives of christ , sons of god , heirs of the promises , and partners of the covenant , and such as did not hinder the work of baptism upon their souls . and such were not onely persons of age and choice , but the infants of christian parents . for the understanding and verifying of which truth , i shall onely need to apply the parts of the former discourse to their particular case ; premising first these propositions . part . ii. of baptizing infants . baptism is the key in christs hand , and therefore opens as he opens , and shuts by his rule : and as christ himself did not do all his blessings and effects unto every one , but gave to every one as they had need , so does baptism . christ did not cure all mens eyes , but them onely that were blinde : christ came not to call the righteous , but sinners to repentance ; that is , they that lived in the fear of god , according to the covenant in which they were debtors , were indeed improved and promoted higher by christ , but not called to that repentance to which he called the vitious gentiles , and the adulterous persons among the jews , and the hypocritical pharisees . there are some so innocent , that they need no repentance ( saith the scripture ) meaning , that though they doe need contrition for their single acts of sin , yet they are within the state of grace , and need not repentance , as it is a conversion of the whole man : and so it is in baptism , which does all its effects upon them that need them all ; and some upon them that need but some : and therefore as it pardons sins to them that have committed them , and doe repent and believe ; so to the others who have not committed them , it does all the work which is done to the others , above , or besides that pardon . 2. when the ordinary effect of a sacrament is done already by some other efficiency or instrument , yet the sacrament is still as obligatory as before , not for so many reasons or necessities , but for the same commandement . baptism is the first ordinary current , in which the spirit moves and descends upon us ; and where gods spirit is , they are the sons of god : for christs spirit descends upon none , but them that are his ; and yet cornelius , who had received the holy spirit , and was heard by god , and visited by an angel , and accepted in his alms , and fastings , and prayers , yet was tyed to the susception of baptism . to which may be added , that the receiving the effects of baptism beforehand , was used as an argument the rather to minister to baptism . the effect of which consideration is this , that baptism and its effect may be separated , and doe not always go in conjunction ; the effect may be before , and therefore much rather may it be after its susception ; the sacrament operating in the vertue of christ , even as the spirit shall move , according to that saying of s. austin . sacrosancto lavacro inchoata innovatio novi hominis perficiendo perficitur , in aliis citiùs , in aliis tardiùs . and s : bernard , lavari quidem cito possumus , sed ad sanandum multâ curatione opus est . the work of regeneration that is begun in the ministery of baptisme , is perfected in some sooner , and in some later : we may soon be washed , but to be healed , is a work of a long cure . 3. the dispositions which are required to the ordinary susception of baptism , are not necessary to the efficacy , or required to the nature of the sacrament ; but accidentally , and because of the superinduced necessities of some men . and therefore the conditions are not regularly to be required , but in those accidents . it was necessary for a gentile proselyte to repent of his sins , and to believe in moses law , before he could be circumcised ; but abraham was not tyed to the same conditions , but onely to faith in god ; but isaac was not tyed to so much : and circumcision was not of moses , but of the fathers : and yet after the sanction of moses law , men were tyed to conditions , which were then made necessary to them that entred into the covenant , but not necessary to the nature of the covenant it selfe . and so it is in the susception of baptism : if a sinner enters into the font , it is necessary he be stripp'd of those appendages which himselfe sewed upon his nature , and then repentance is a necessary disposition . if his understanding hath been a stranger to religion , polluted with evill principles , and a false religion , it is necessary he have an actual faith , that he be given in his understanding up to the obedience of christ : and the reason of these is plain , because in these persons there is a disposition contrary to the state and effects of baptism ; and therefore they must be taken off by their contraries , faith and repentance , that they may be reduced to the state of pure receptives . and this is the sense of those words of our blessed saviour . unlesse ye become like one of these little ones , ye shall not enter into the kingdome of heaven ; that is , ye cannot be admitted into the gospel-covenant , unlesse all your contrarieties and impediments be taken from you , and you be as apt as children to receive the new immissions from heaven . and this proposition relies upon a great example , and a certain reason . the example is our blessed saviour , who was nullius poenitentiae debitor , he had committed no sin , and needed no repentance ; he needed not to be saved by faith , for of faith he was the author and finisher , and the great object , and its perfection and reward , and yet he was baptized by the baptism of iohn , the baptism of repentance . and therefore it is certain , that repentance and faith are not necessary to the susception of baptism , but necessary to some persons that are baptized . for it is necessary we should much consider the difference . if the sacrament in any person may be justly received , in whom such dispositions are not to be found , then the dispositions are not necessary or intrinsecal to the susception of the sacrament ; and yet some persons coming to this sacrament , may have such necessities of their own , as will make the sacrament ineffectual without such dispositions : these i call necessary to the person , but not to the sacrament ; that is , necessary to all such , but not necessary to all absolutely . and faith is necessary sometimes where repentance is not , and sometimes repentance and faith together , and sometimes otherwise . when philip baptized the eunuch , he onely required of him to believe , not to repent . but s. peter , when he preached to the jews , and converted them , onely required repentance : which although in their case implyed faith , yet there was no explicit stipulation for it : they had crucified the lord of life , and if they would come to god by baptism , they must renounce their sin : that was all was then stood upon . it is as the case is , or as the persons have superinduced necessities upon themselves . in children the case is evident , as to the one part , which is equally required ; i mean , repentance : the not doing of which , cannot prejudice them as to the susception of baptism ; because they having done no evil , are not bound to repent ; and to repent , is as necessary to the susception of baptism , as faith is : but this shews , that they are accidentally necessary , that is , not absolutely , not to all , not to infants : and if they may be excused from one duty , which is indispensably necessary to baptism , why they may not from the other , is a secret which will not be found out by these whom it concerns to believe it . and therefore when our blessed lord made a stipulation and expresse commandement for faith , with the greatest annexed penalty to them that had it not , he that believeth not shall be damned ; the proposition is not to be verified or understood as relative to every period of time : for then no man could be converted from infidelity to the christian faith , and from the power of the devil to the kingdome of christ , but his present infidelity shall be his final ruine . it is not therfore {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , but {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , not a sentence , but a use , a praediction and intermination . it is not like that saying [ god is true , and every man a lyar ] [ every good , and every perfect gift is from above : ] for these are true in every instant , without reference to circumstances : but he that believeth not shall be damned , is a prediction , or that which in rhetorick is called {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} or a use , because this is the affirmation of that which usually or frequently comes to passe : such as this . he that strikes with the sword , shall perish by the sword ; he that robs a church , shall be like a wheel , of a vertiginous and unstable estate ; he that loves wine and oyle , shall not be rich : and therefore it is a declaration of that which is universally or commonly true ; but not so , that in what instance soever a man is not a believer , in that instant it is true to say he is damned ; for some are called the third , some the sixth , some the ninth hour , and they that come in , being first called , at the eleventh hour , shall have their reward : so that this sentence stands true at the day and the judgement of the lord , not at the judgement or day of man . and in the same necessity as faith stands to salvation , in the same it stands to baptisme ; that is , to be measured by the whole latitude of its extent . our baptism shall no more doe all its intention , unlesse faith supervene , then a man is in possibility of being saved without faith ; it must come in its due time , but is not indispensably necessary in all instants and periods , baptism is the seal of our election and adoption ; and as election is brought to effect by faith , and its consequents ; so is baptism : but to neither is faith necessary , as to its beginning and first entrance . to which also i adde this consideration , that actual faith is necessary , not to the susception , but to the consequent effects of baptism , appears , because the church , and particularly the apostles , did baptize some persons who had not faith , but were hypocrites , such as were simon magus , alexander the coper-smith , demas and diotrephes ; and such was iudas when he was baptized , and such were the gnostick teachers . for the effect depends upon god , who knows the heart , but the outward susception depends upon them who doe not know it ; which is a certain argument , that the same faith that is necessary to the effect of the sacrament , is not necessary to its susception ; and if it can be administred to hypocrites , much more to infants ; if to those who really hinder the effect , much rather to them that hinder not . and if it be objected , that the church does not know but the pretenders have faith , but she knows infants have not . i reply , that the church does not know but the pretenders hinder the effect , and are contrary to the grace of the sacrament ; but she knows that infants doe not . the first possibly may receive the grace , the other cannot hinder it . but beside these things , it is considerable , that when it is required persons have faith : it is true , they that require baptism , should give a reason why they doe : so it was in the case of the eunuch baptized by philip . but this is not to be required of others that doe not ask it , and yet they be of the church , and of the faith : for by faith is also understood the christian religion , and the christian faith is the christian religion ; and of this a man may be , though he make no confession of his faith ; as a man may be of the church , and yet not be of the number of gods secret ones : and to this more is required then to that ; to the first it is sufficient that he be admitted by a sacrament or a ceromony : which is infallibly certain , because hypocrites and wicked people are in the visible communion of the church , and are reckoned as members of it , and yet to them there was nothing done but the ceremony administred ; and therefore when that is done to infants , they also are to be reckoned in the church communion . and indeed in the examples in scripture , we finde more inserted into the number of gods family by outward ceremony , then by the inward grace : of this number were all those who were circumcised the eighth day , who were admitted thither , as the womans daughter was cured in the gospel , by the faith of their mother , their natural parents , or their spiritual : to whose faith it is as certain god will take heed , as to their faith who brought one to christ who could not come himself , the poor paralytick ; for when christ saw their faith , he cured their friend : and yet it is to be observed , that christ did use to exact faith , actual faith , of them that came to him to be cured [ according to your faith be it unto you . ] the case is equal in its whole kinde . and it is considerable what christ saith to the poor man that came in behalfe of his son , all things are possible to him that believeth , it is possible for a son to receive the blessing and benefit of his fathers faith : and it was so in his case , and is possible to any ; for to faith all things are possible . and as to the event of things , it is evident in the story of the gospel , that the faith of their relatives was equally effective to children , and friends , or servants , absent or sick , as the faith of the interested person was to himselfe : as appears beyond all exception in the case of the friends of the paralytick , let down with cords through the tyles ; of the centurion in behalf of his servant ; of the nobleman , for his son sick at capernaum ; of the syrophoenician , for her daughter : and christ required faith of no sick man , but of him that presented himselfe to him and desired for himselfe that he might be cured , as it was in the cure of the blinde men . though they could believe , yet christ required beliefe of them that came to him on their behalfe . and why then it may not be so , or is not so in the case of infants baptism , i confess it is past my skill to conjecture . the reason on which this further relies , is contained in the next proposition . 4. no disposition or act of man can deserve the first grace , or the grace of pardon : for so long as a man is unpardoned , he is an enemy to god , and as a dead person : and unlesse he be prevented by the grace of god , cannot doe a single act in order to his pardon and restitution : so that the first work which god does upon a man , is so wholly his own , that the man hath nothing in it , but to entertain it , that is , not to hinder the work of god upon him : and this is done in them that have in them nothing that can hinder the work of grace , or in them who remove the hinderances ; of the latter sort are all sinners , who have lived in a state contrary to god ; of the first are they who are prevented by the grace of god , before they can choose , that is , little children , and those that become like unto little children . so that faith and repentance are not necessary at first to the reception of the first grace , but by accident . if sin have drawn curtains , and put bars and coverings to the windows , these must be taken away ; and that is done by faith and repentance : but if the windows be not shut , so that the light can pass through them , the eye of heaven will pass in and dwell there . no man can come unto me , unlesse my father draw him ; that is , the first accesse to christ is nothing of our own , but wholly of god ; and it is as in our creation , in which we have an obediential capacity , but cooperate not ; onely if we be contrary to the work of grace , that contrariety must be taken off , else there is no necessity : and if all men , according to christs saying , must receive the kingdome of god as little children , it is certain , little children doe receive it , they receive it as all men ought , that is , without any impediment or obstruction , without any thing within that is contrary to that state . 5. baptism is not to be estimated as one act , transient and effective to single purposes , but it is an entrance to a conjugation and a state of blessings . all our life is to be transacted by the measures of the gospel-covenant , and that covenant is consigned by baptism ; there we have our title and adoption to it , and the grace that is then given to us is like a peece of leaven put into a lump of dow : and faith and repentance doe in all the periods of our life , put it into fermentation and activity . then the seed of god is put into the ground of our hearts , and repentance waters it , and faith makes it subactum solum , the ground and furrows apt to produce fruits : and therefore faith and repentance are necessary to the effect of baptism , not to its susception ; that is , necessary to all those parts of life in which baptism does operate , not to the first sanction or entring into the covenant . the seed may lye long in the ground , and produce fruits in its due season , if it be refreshed with the former and the latter rain , that is , the repentance that first changes the state , and converts the man , and afterwards returns him to his title , and recalls him from his wandrings , and keeps him in the state of grace , and within the limits of the covenant : and all the way faith gives efficacy and acceptation to this repentance , that is , continues our title to the promise , of not having righteousnesse exacted by the measures of the law , but by the covenant and promise of grace , into which we entred in baptism , aad walk in the same all the dayes of our life . 6. the holy spirit which descends upon the waters of baptism , does not instantly produce its effects in the soul of the baptized ; and when he does , it is irregularly , and as he please : the spirit bloweth where it listeth , and no man knoweth whence it cometh , nor whither it goeth ; and the catechumen is admitted into the kingdome , yet the kingdome of god cometh not with observation : and this saying of our blessed saviour was spoken of the kingdome of god that is within us , that is , the spirit of grace , the power of the gospel put into our hearts , concerning which , he affirmed , that it operates so secretly , that it comes not wiih outward shew , neither shall they say , lo here , or lo there : which thing i desire the rather be observed , because in the same discourse which our blessed saviour continued to that assembly , he affirms this kingdome of god to belong unto little children , this kingdome that cometh not with outward significations , or present expresses ; this kingdome that is within us . for the present , the use i make of it is this , that no man can conclude that this kingdome of power , that is , the spirit of sanctification , is not come upon infants , because there is no sign or expression of it . it is within us , therefore it hath no signification . it is the seed of god ; and it is no good argument to say , here is no seed in the bowels of the earth , because there is nothing green upon the face of it . for the church gives the sacrament , god gives the grace of the sacrament . but because he does not alwayes give it at the instant in which the church gives the sacrament , ( as if there be a secret impediment in the suscipient ) and yet afterwards does give it , when the impediment is removed ( as to them that repent of that impediment ) it follows , that the church may administer rightly , even before god gives the real grace of the sacrament ; and if god gives this grace afterwards by parts , and yet all of it is the effect of that covenant which was consigned in baptism : he that defers some , may defer all , and verify every part as well as any part . for it is certain , that in the instance now made , all the grace is deferred ; in infants it is not certain but that some is collated , or infused : however , be it so or no , yet upon this account the administration of the sacrament is not hindred . 7. when the scripture speaks of the effects of , or dispositions to baptism , it speaks in general expressions , as being most apt to signify a common duty , or a general effect , or a more universal event , or the proper order of things : but those general expressions doe not supponere universaliter , that is , are not to be understood exclusively to all that are not so qualified , or universally of all suscipients , or of all the subjects of the proposition . when the prophets complain of the jews , that they are faln from god , and turned to idols , and walk not in the way of their fathers ; and at other times , the scripture speaks the same thing of their fathers , that they walked perversly toward god , starting aside like a broken bow : in these and the like expressions the holy scripture uses a synecdoche , or signifies many onely , under the notion of a more large and indefinite expression ; for neither were all the fathers good , neither did all the sons prevaricate : but among the fathers there were enough to recommend to posterity by way of example ; and among the children there were enough to stain the reputation of the age : but neither the one part nor the other was true of every single person . s. iohn the baptist spake to the whole audience , saying , o generation of vipers ! and yet he did nor mean that all jerusalem and iudaea that went out to be baptized of him , were such ; but he under an indeterminate reproofe , intended those that were such , that is , especially the priests and the pharisees . and it is more considerable yet , in the story of the event of christs sermon in the synagogue , upon his text taken out of isaiah , all wondred at his gracious words , and bare him witnesse . and a little after , all they in the synagogues were filled with wrath , that is , it was generally so ; but hardly to be supposed true of every single person , in both the contrary humors and usages . thus christ said to the apostles , ye have abidden with me in my temptations ; and yet iudas was all the way a follower of interest and the bag , rather then christ : and afterwards none of them all did abide with christ in his greatest temptations . thus also to come nearer the present question , the secret effects of election and of the spirit , are in scripture attributed to all that are of the outward communion . so s. peter calls all the christian strangers of the eastern dispersion , elect , according to the fore-knowledge of god the father : and s. paul saith of all the roman christians , and the same of the thessalonians , that their faith was spoken of in all the world ; and yet amongst them it is not to be supposed , that all the professors had an unreproveable faith , or that every one of the church of thessalonica was an excellent and a charitable person : and yet the apostle useth this expression , your faith groweth exceedingly , and the charity of every one of you all towards each other , aboundeth . these are usually significant of a generall custome or order of things , or duty of men , or design , and natural or proper expectation of events ; such are these also in this very question . as many of you as are baptized into christ , have put on christ ; that is , so it is regularly , and so it will be in its due time , and that is the order of things , and the designed event : but from hence we cannot conclude of every person , and in every period of time ; this man hath been baptized , therefore now he is clothed with christ , he hath put on christ : nor thus , this person cannot in a spiritual sense as yet put on christ , therefore he hath not been baptized , that is , he hath not put him on in a sacramentall sense . such is the saying of s. paul , whom he hath predestinated , them he also called ; and whom he called , them he also justified ; and whom he justified , them he also glorified : this also declares the regular event , or at least the order of things , and the design of god , but not the actual verification of it to all persons . these sayings concerning baptism , in the like manner are to be understood , that they cannot exclude all persons from the sacrament , that have not all those real effects of the sacrament at all times , which some men have at some times , and all men must have at some time or other , viz. when the sacrament obtains its last intention . but he that shall argue from hence , that children are not rightly baptized , because they cannot in a spiritual sense put on christ , concludes nothing , unless these propositions did signifie universally , and at all times , and in every person , and in every manner : which can no more pretend to truth , then that all christians are gods elect ; and all that are baptized , are saints ; and all that are called , are justified ; and all that are once justified , shall be saved finally . these things declare onely the event of things , and their order , and the usuall effect , and the proper design , in their proper season , in their limited proportions . 8. a negative argument for matters of fact in scripture , cannot conclude a law , or a necessary , or a regular event . and therefore supposing that it be not intimated , that the apostles did baptize infants , it follows not that they did not : and if they did not , it does not follow that they might not , or that the church may not . for it is unreasonable to argue : the scripture speaks nothing of the baptism of the holy virgin mother , therefore she was not baptized . the words and deeds of christ are infinite which are not recorded ; and of the acts of the apostles we may suppose the same in their proportion : and therefore what they did not , is no rule to us , unless they did it not because they were forbidden . so that it can be no good argument to say , the apostles are not read to have baptized infants , therefore infants are not to be baptized : but thus ; we do not find that infants are excluded from the common sacraments and ceremonies of christian institution , therefore we may not presume to exclude them . for although the negative of a fact is no good argument , yet the negative of a law is a very good one . we may not say , the apostles did not , therefore we may not : but thus , they were not forbidden to do it , there is no law against it , therefore it may be done . no mans deeds can prejudicate a divine law expressed in general terms , much lesse can it be prejudiced by those things that were not done . that which is wanting cannot be numbred , cannot be effectual ; therefore , baptize all nations , must signify all that it can signify , all that are reckoned in the capitations and accounts of a nation . now since all contradiction to this question depends wholly upon these two grounds ; the negative argument in matter of fact , and the pretences that faith and repentance are required to baptism : since the first is wholly nothing , and infirm upon an infinite account , and the second may conclude , that infants can no more be saved then be baptized ; because faith is more necessary to salvation then to baptism ; it being said , he that believeth not shall be damned ; and it is not said , he that believeth not shall be excluded from baptism : it follows , that the doctrine of those that refuse to baptize their infants is upon both its legs weak and broken , and insufficient . upon the suppositions of these grounds , the baptism of infants , according to the perpetual practise of the church of god , will stand firm and unshaken upon its own base . for , as the eunuch said to philip , what hinders them to be baptized ? if they can receive benefit by it , it is infallibly certain , that it belongs to them also to receive it , and to their parents to procure it : for nothing can deprive us of so great a grace , but an unworthiness or a disability . they are not disabled to receive it , if they need it , and if it does them good ; and they have neither done good nor evill , and therefore they have not forfeited their right to it . this therefore shall be the first great argument or combination of inducements ; infants receive many benefits by the susception of baptism , and therefore in charity and in duty we are to bring them to baptism . 1. the first effect of baptism is , that in it we are admitted to the kingdome of christ , offered and presented unto him . in which certainly there is the same act of worship to god , and the same blessing to the children of christians , as there was in presenting the first-born among the jews . for our children can be gods own portion , as well as theirs ; and as they presented the first-born to god , and so acknowledged that god might have taken his life in sacrifice , as well as the sacrifice of the lamb , or the oblation of a beast : yet when the right was confessed , god gave him back again , and took a lamb in exchange , or a pair of doves . so are our children presented to god as forfeit , and god might take the forfeiture , and not admit the babe to the promises of grace : but when the presentation of the childe , and our acknowledgement is made to god , god takes the lamb of the world in exchange , and he hath paid our forfeiture , and the children are holy unto the lord . and what hinders here ? cannot a creeple receive an almes at the beautiful gate of the temple , unlesse he goe thither himself ? or cannot a gift be presented to god by the hands of the owners , and the gift become holy and pleasing to god without its own consent ? the parents have a portion of the possession : children are blessings , & gods gifts , and the fathers greatest wealth , and therefore are to be given again to him . in other things we give something to god of all that he gives us ; all we doe not , because our needs force us to retain the greater part , and the less sanctifies the whole : but our children must all be returned to god ; for we may love them , and so may god too , and they are the better our own , by being made holy in their presentation : whatsoever is given to god is holy , every thing in its proportion and capacity ; a lamb is holy , when it becomes a sacrifice ; and a table is holy , when it becomes an altar ; & a house is holy , when it becomes a church ; and a man is holy , when he is consecrated to be a priest ; and so is every one that is dedicated to religion : these are holy persons , the others are holy things ; and infants are between both : they have the sanctification that belongs to them , the holiness that can be of a reasonable nature , offer'd and destin'd to gods service ; but not in that degree that is in an understanding , choosing person . certain it is , that infants may be given to god ; and if they may be , they must be : for it is not here as in goods , where we are permitted to use all or some , and give what portion we please out of them ; but we cannot doe our duty towards our children , unless we give them wholly to god , and offer them to his service and to his grace . the first does honour to god , the second does charity to the children , the effects and real advantages will appear in the sequel : in the mean time this argument extends thus far , that children may be presented to god acceptably , in order to his service . and it was highly praeceptive , when our blessed saviour commanded , that we should suffer little children to come to him : and when they came , they carried away a blessing along with them . he was desirous they should partake of his merits : he is not willing , neither is it his fathers will , that any of these little ones should perish . and therefore he dyed for them , and loves , and blessed them : and so he will now , if they be brought to him , and presented as candidates of the religion and of the resurrection . christ hath a blessing for our children , but let them come to him , that is , be presented at the doors of the church , to the sacrament of adoption and initiation ; for i know no other way for them to come . children may be adopted into the covenant of the gospel , that is , made partakers of the communion of saints , which is the second effect of baptism ; parts of the church , members of christs mystical body , and put into the order of eternal life . now concerning this it is certain the church clearly hath power to doe her offices in order to it . the faithfull can pray for all men , they can doe their piety to some persons with more regard and greater earnestnesse : they can admit whom they please in their proper dispositions , to a participation of all their holy prayers , and communions , and preachings , and exhortations : and if all this be a blessing , and all this be the actions of our own charity , who can hinder the church of god from admitting infants to the communion of all their pious offices , which can doe them benefit in their present capacity ? how this does necessarily infer baptism , i shall afterwards discourse * . but for the present i enumerate , that the blessings of baptism are communicable ro them ; they may be admitted into a fellowship of all the prayers and priviledges of the church , and the communion of saints , in blessings , and prayers , and holy offices . but that which is of greatest perswasion and convincing efficacy in this particular , is , that the children of the church are as capable of the same covenant , as the children of the jews : but it was the same covenant that circumcision did consign , a spiritual covenant under a veil , and now it is the same spiritual covenant without the veil , which is evident to him that considers it ; thus : the words of the covenant are these [ i am the almighty god , walk before me , and be thou perfect ; i will multiply thee exceedingly . thou shalt be a father of many nations : thy name shall not be abram , but abraham . nations and kings shall be out of thee . i will be a god unto thee , and unto thy seed after thee ; and i will give all the land of canaan to thy seed , and all the males shall be circumcised , and it shall be a token of the covenant between me and thee : and he that is not circumcised ; shall be cut off from his people . the covenant which was on abrahams part was , to walk before god , and to be perfect : on gods part , to blesse him with a numerous issue , and them with the land of canaan ; and the sign was circumcision , the token of the covenant . now in all this , here was no duty to which the posterity was obliged , nor any blessing which abraham could perceive or feel , because neither he nor his posterity did enjoy the promise for many hundred yeers after the covenant : and therefore as there was a duty for the posterity which is not here expressed ; so there was a blessing for abraham , which was concealed under the leaves of a temporall promise , and which we shall better understand from them whom the spirit of god hath taught the mysteriousnesse of this transaction . the argument indeed , and the observation is wholly s. pauls , abraham and the patriarchs died in faith , not having received the promises , viz. of a possession in canaan . they saw the promises afar off , they embraced them , and looked through the cloud , and the temporal veil , this was not it ; they might have returned to canaan , if that had been the object of their desires , and the design of the promise : but they desired and did seek a countrey , but it was a better , and that a heavenly . this was the object of their desire ; and the end of their search , and the reward of their faith , and the secret of their promise . and therefore circumcision was a seal of the righteousnesse of faith , which he had before his circumcision , before the making this covenant ; and therefore it must principally relate to an effect and a blessing , greater then was afterwards expressed in the temporall promise : which effect was forgivenesse of sins , a not imputing to us our infirmities , justification by faith , accounting that for righteousnesse : and these effects or graces were promised to abraham , not onely for his posterity after the flesh , but his children after the spirit , even to all that shall beleive and walk in the steps of our father abraham , which he walked in , being yet uncircumcised . this was no other but the covenant of the gospel , though afterwards otherwise consigned : for so the apostle expresly affirms , that abraham was the father of circumcision ( viz. by virtue of this covenant ) not onely to them that are circumcised , but to all that believe : for this promise was not through the law of works , or of circumcision , but of faith . and therefore as s. paul observes , god promised that abraham should be a father ( not of that nation onely , but ) of many nations , and the heir of the world ; that the blessing of abraham might come on the gentiles through iesus christ ; that we might receive the promise of the spirit through faith . and , if ye be christs , then ye are abrahams seed , and heirs according to the promise . since then the covenant of the gospel , is the covenant of faith , and not of works ; and the promises are spiritual , not secular ; and abraham the father of the faithfull gentiles , as well as the circumcised iews ; and the heir ef the world , not by himselfe , but by his seed , or the son of man , our lord jesus : it follows , that the promises which circumcision did seal , were the same promises which are consigned in baptism ; the covenant is the same , onely that gods people are not impal'd in palestine , and the veil is taken away , and the temporal is passed into spiritual , and the result will be this , that to as many persons , and in as many capacities , and in the same dispositions as the promises were applyed , and did relate in circumcision , to the same they doe belong , and may be applyed in baptism . and let it be remembred , that the covenant which circumcision did sign , was a covenant of grace and faith ; the promises were of the spirit , or spiritual , it was made before the law , and could not be rescinded by the legal covenant . nothing could be added to it , or taken from it ; and we that are partakers of this grace , are therefore partakers of it being christs servants , united to christ , and so are become abrahams seed ( as the apostle at large and professedly proves in divers places , but especially in the 4. of the romans , and the 3. to the galatians . ) and therefore if infants were then admitted to it , and consigned to it by a sacrament which they understood not any more then ours doe , there is not any reason why ours should not enter in at the ordinary gate and door of grace as well as they . their children were circumcised the eighth day , but were instructed afterwards , when they could enquire what these things meant . indeed their proselytes were first taught , then circumcised ; so are ours , baptized : but their infants were consigned first , and so must ours . 3. in baptism we are born again ; and this infants need in the present circumstances , and for the same great reason , that men of age and reason doe . for our natural birth is either of it selfe insufficient , or is made so by the fall of adam , and the consequent evils , that nature alone , or our first birth , cannot bring us to heaven , which is a supernatural end , that is , an end above all the power of our nature as now it is . so that if nature cannot bring us to heaven , grace must , or we can never get thither ; if the first birth cannot , a second must : but the second birth spoken of in scripture , is baptism ; a man must be born of water and the spirit . and therefore baptism is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the laver of a new birth . either then infants cannot go to heaven any way that we know of , or they must be baptized . to say they are to be left to god , is an excuse , and no answer : for when god hath opened the door , and calls that the entrance into heaven , we doe not leave them to god , when we will not carry them to him in the way which he hath described , and at the door which himself hath opened : we leave them indeed , but it is but helplesse and destitute : and though god is better then man , yet that is no warrant to us , what it will be to the children , that we cannot warrant , or conjecture . and if it be objected , that to the new birth is required dispositions of our own , which are to be wrought by and in them that have the use of reason : besides that this is wholly against the analogy of a new birth , in which the person to be born is wholly a passive , and hath put into him the principle that in time will produce its proper actions : it is certain , that they that can receive the new birth , are capable of it ; the effect of it is a possibility of being saved , and arriving to a supernatural felicity . if infants can receive this effect , then also the new birth , without which they cannot receive the effect . and if they can receive salvation , the effect of the new birth , what hinders them , but they may receive that that is in order to that effect , and ordained onely for it ; and which is nothing of it self , but in its institution and relation , and which may be received by the same capacity in which one may be created , that is , a passivity , or a capacity obediential ? 4. concerning pardon of sins , which is one great effect of baptism , it is certain , that infants have not that benefit which men of sin and age may receive . he that hath a sickly stomach drinks wine , and it not onely refreshes his spirits , but cures his stomach . he that drinks wine and hath not that disease , receives good by his wine , though it does not minister to so many needs ; it refreshes him , though it does not cure him : and when oyle is poured upon a mans head , it does not alwayes heal a wound , but sometimes makes him a chearful countenance , sometimes it consigns him to be a king or a priest . so it is in baptism : it does not heal the wounds of actual sins , because they have not committed them ; but it takes off the evil of original sin : whatsoever is imputed to us by adams prevarication , is washed off by the death of the second adam , into which we are baptized . but concerning original sin , because there are so many disputes which may intricate the question , i shall make use onely of that which is confessed on both sides , and material to our purpose . death came upon all men by adams sin , and the necessity of it remains upon us , as an evil consequent of the disobedience . for though death is natural , yet it was kept off from man by gods favour , which when he lost , the banks were broken , and the water reverted to its natural course , and our nature became a curse , and death a punishment . now that this also relates to infants so far , is certain , because they are sick , and dye . this the pelagians denied not . but to whomsoever this evil descended , upon them also a remedy is provided by thesecond adam , that as in adam all dye , even so in christ shall all be made alive ; that is , at the day of judgement : then death shall be destroyed . in the mean time , death hath a sting and a bitterness , a curse it is , and an express of the divine anger : and if this sting be not taken away here , we shall have no participation of the final victory over death . either therefore infants must be for ever without remedy in this evil consequent of their fathers sin , or they must be adopted into the participation of christs death , which is the remedy . now how can they partake of christs death , but by baptism into his death ? for if there be any spiritual way fancied , it will by a stronger argument admit them to baptism : for if they can receive spiritual effects , they can also receive the outward sacrament ; this being denyed onely upon pretence they cannot have the other . if there be no spiritual way extraordinary , then the ordinary way is onely left for them . if there be an extraordinary , let it be shewn , and christians will be at rest concerning their children . one thing onely i desire to be observed , that pelagius denyed original sin , but yet denyed not the necessity of infants baptism ; and being accused of it in an epistle to pope innocent the first , he purged himself of the suspicion , and allowed the practise , but denyed the inducement of it : which shews , that their arts are weak that think baptism to be useless to infants , if they be not formally guilty of the prevarication of adam : by which i also gather , that it was so universal , so primitive a practise , to baptize infants , that it was greater then all pretences to the contrary : for it would much have conduced to the introducing his opinion against grace and original sin , if he had destroyed that practise which seemed so very much to have its greatest necessity from the doctrine he denyed . but against pelagius , and against all that follow the parts of his opinion , it is of good use which s. austine , prosper , and fulgentius argue ; if infants are punished for adams sin , then they are also guilty of it in some sense . nimis enim impium est hoc de dei sentire justitiâ quod à praevaricatione liberos cum reis voluerit esse damnatos . so prosper . dispendia quae flentes nascendo testantur , dicito quo merito sub justissimo & omnipotentissimo judice eis , si nullum peccatum attrahant , arrogentur , said s. austin . for the guilt of sin signifies nothing but the obligation to the punishment : and he that feels the evil consequent , to him the sin is imputed ; not as to all the same dishonour , or moral accounts , but to the more material , to the natural account : and in holy scripture the taking off the punishment , is the pardon of the sin ; and in the same degree the punishment is abolished , in the same god is appeased , and then the person stands upright , being reconciled to god by his grace . since therefore infants have the punishment of sin , it is certain the sin is imputed to them ; and therefore they need being reconciled to god by christ : and if so , then , when they are baptized into christs death , and into his resurrection , their sins are pardoned , because the punishment is taken off , the sting of natural death is taken away , because gods anger is removed , and they shall partake of christs resurrection : which because baptism does signifie and consign , they also are to be baptized . to which also adde this appendant consideration , that whatsoever the sacraments do consign , that also they do convey and minister : they do it , that is , god by them does it ; lest we should think the sacraments to be meer illusions , and abusing us by deceitful ineffective signs : and therefore to infants the grace of a title to a resurrection , and reconciliation to god by the death of christ is conveyed , because it signifies and consigns this to them more to the life and analogy of resemblance , then circumcision to the infant sons of israel . i end this consideration with the words of nazianzen , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . our birth by baptism does cut off every unclean appendage of our natural birth , and leads us to a celestial life : and this in children is therefore more necessary , because the evil came upon them without their own act of reason and choice , and therefore the grace and remedy ought not to stay the leisure of dull nature , and the formalities of the civill law . 5. the baptism of infants does to them the greatest part of that benefit which belongs to the remission of sins . for baptism is a state of repentance and pardon for ever . this i suppose to be already proved , to which i onely adde this caution , that the pelagians to undervalue the necessity of supervening grace , affirmed , that baptism did minister to us grace sufficient to live perfectly , and without sin for ever . against this s. ierome sharply declaims , and affirms , a baptismum praeterita donare ●●ccata , non futuram servare justitiam : that is , non statim ju●tum facit & omni plenum justitiâ , as he expounds his meaning in another place . vetera peccata conscindit , novas virtutes non tribuit ; dimittit à carcere , & dimisso , si laboraverit , praemia pollicetur . baptism does not so forgive future sins , that we may doe what we please , or so as we need not labour and watch , and fear perpetually , and make use of gods grace to actuate our endevours ; but puts us into a state of pardon , that is , in a covenant of grace , in which so long as we labour and repent , and strive to doe our duty , so long our infirmities are pityed , and our sins certain to be pardoned upon their certain conditions ; that is , by virtue of it we are capable of pardon , and must work for it , and may hope it . and therefore infants have a most certain capaciry and proper disposition to baptism : for sin creeps before it can go , and little undecencies are soon learned , and malice is before their yeers , and they can do mischief and irregularities betimes ; and though we know not when , nor how far they are imputed in every moneth of their lives , yet it is an admirable art of the spirit of grace , to put them into a state of pardon , that their remedy may at least be as soon as their necessity . and therefore tertullian and gregory nazianzen advised the baptism of children to be at three or four yeers of age ; meaning , that they then beginning to have little inadvertencies & hasty follies , and actions so evil as did need a lavatory . but if baptism hath an influence upon sins in the succeeding portions of our life , then it is certain , that their being presently innocent , does not hinder , and ought not to retard the sacrament ; and therefore tertullian's quid festinat innocens aetas ad remissiionem peccatorum ? what need innocents hasten to the remission of sins ? is soon answered . it is true , they need not in respect of any actual sins , for so they are innocent : but in respect of the evils of their nature , derived from their original , and in respect of future sins in the whole state of their life , it is necessary they be put into a state of pardon before they sin , because some sin early , some sin later ; and therefore unlesse they be baptized so early , as to prevent the first sins , they may chance dye in a sin , to the pardon of which they have yet derived no title from christ . 6. the next great effect of baptism , which children can have , is the spirit of sanctification , and if they can be baptized with water and the spirit , it will be sacriledge to rob them of so holy treasures . and concerning this , although it be with them , as s. paul sayes of heirs , the heir so long as he is a childe differeth nothing from a servant , though he be lord of all ; and children , although they receive the spirit of promise , and the spirit of grace , yet in respect of actual exercise , they differ not from them that have them not at all , yet this hinders not but they may have them . for as the reasonahle soul and all its faculties are in children , will and understanding , passions , and powers of attraction and propulsion , yet these faculties doe not operate or come abroad till time and art , observation and experience have drawn them forth into action : so may the spirit of grace , the principle of christian life , be infused , and yet lye without action till in its own day it is drawn forth . for in every christian there are three parts concurring to his integral constitution , body , and soul , and spirit ; and all these have their proper activities and times , but every one in his own order , first that which is natural , then that which is spiritual . and as aristotle said , a man first lives the life of a plant , then of a beast , and lastly of a man , is true in this sense : and the more spiritual the principle is , the longer it is before it operates , because more things concur to spiritual actions , then to naturall : and these are necessary , and therefore first ; the other are perfect , and therefore last . and who is he that so well understands the philosophy of this third principle of a christians life , the spirit , as to know how or when it is infused , and how it operates in all its periods , and what it is in its being and proper nature ; and whether it be like the soul , or like the faculty , or like a habit , or how or to what purposes god in all varieties does dispense it ? these are secrets which none but bold people use to decree , and build propositions upon their own dreams . that which is certain , is , that * the spirit is the principle of a new life , or a new birth . * that baptisme is the laver of this new birth . * that it is the seed of god , and may lye long in the furrows before it springs up . * that from the faculty to the act , the passage is not alwayes sudden and quick . * that the spirit is the earnest of our inheritance , that is , of resurrection to eternal life : which inheritance because children we hope shall have , they cannot be denied to have its seal and earnest , that is , if they shall have all , they are not to be denyed a part . * that children have some effects of the spirit , and therefore do receive it , and are baptized with the spirit , and therefore may with water : which thing is therefore true and evident , because some children are sanctified , as ieremy and the baptist , and therefore all may . and because all signification of persons is an effect of the holy ghost , there is no peradventure , but they that can be sanctified by god can in that capacity receive the holy ghost : and all the ground of dissenting here , is onely upon a mistake , because infants do no act of holiness , they suppose them incapable of the grace of sanctification . now sanctification of children , is their adoption to the inheritance of sons , their presentation to christ , their consignation to christs service , and to resurrection , their being put into a possibility of being saved , their restitution to gods favour , which naturally , that is , as our nature is depraved and punished , they could not have . and in short the case is this : * original righteousness was in adam after the manner of nature , but it was an act or effect of grace , and by it men were not made , but born righteous ; the inferior faculties obeyed the superior , the minde was whole and right , and conformable to the divine image , the reason and the will alwayes concurring , the will followed reason , and reason followed the laws of god , and so long as a man had not lost this , he was pleasing to god , and should have passed to a more perfect state . now because this , if adam had stood , should have been born with every childe , there was in infants a principle which was the seed of holy life here , and a blessed hereafter ; and yet the children should have gone in the road of nature , then as well as now , and the spirit should have operated at natures leisure ; god being the giver of both , would have made them instrumental to , and perfective of each other , but not destructive . now what was lost by adam , is restored by christ , the same righteousnesse , onely it is not born , but superinduc'd , not integral , but interrupted , but such as it is , there is no difference , but that the same or the like principle may be derived to us from christ , as there should have been from adam , that is , a principle of obedience , a regularity of faculties , a beauty in the soul , and a state of acceptation with god . and we see also in men of understanding and reason , the spirit of god dwells in them , ( which tatianus describing , uses these words , {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the soul is possessed with sparks , or materials of the power of the spirit ) and yet it is sometimes ineffective and unactive , sometimes more , sometimes lesse , and does no more doe its work at all times , then the soul does at all times understand . adde to this , that if there be in infants naturally an evill principle , a proclivity to sin , an ignorance and pravity of minde , a disorder of affections ( as experience teaches us there is , and the perpetual doctrine of the church , and the universal mischiefs issuing from mankinde , and the sinne of every man does witnesse too much ) why cannot infants have a good principle in them , though it works not till its own season , as well as an evill principle ? if there were not by nature some evill principle , it is not possible that all the world should choose sin : in free agents it was never heard , that all individuals loved and chose the same thing to which they were not naturally inclined . neither doe all men choose to marry , neither doe all choose to abstain : and in this instance there is a natural incclination to one part ; but of all the men and women in the world , there is no one that hath never sinned . if we say that we have no sin , we deceive our selves , and the truth is not in us , said an apostle . if therefore nature hath in infants an evill principle , which operates when the childe can choose , but is all the while within the sou ; either infants have by grace a principle put into them , or else sin abounds where grace does not superabound , expressely against the doctrine of the apostle . the event of this discourse is , that if infants be capable of the spirit of grace , there is no reason but they may and ought to be baptized , as well as men and women ; unlesse god had expressely forbidden them , which cannot be pretended : & that infants are capable of the spirit of grace , i think it made very credible . christus infantibus infans factus sanctificans infantes , said irenaeus , christ became an infant among the infants . and does sanctify infants : and s. cyprian affirms , esse apud omnes sive infantes sive majores natu unam divini muneris aequitatem . there is the same dispensation of the divine grace to all alike , to infants as well as to men . and in this royall priesthood , as it is in the secular , kings may be anointed in their cradles ; dat ( deus ) sui spiritus occultissimam gratiam , quam etiam latentèr infundit in parvulis , god gives the most secret grace of his spirit , which he also secretly infuses into infants . and if a secret infusion be rejected , because it cannot he proved at the place and at the instant , many men that hope for heaven will be very much to seek for a proof of their earnest , and need an earnest of the earnest . for all that have the spirit of god cannot in all instants prove it , or certainly know it : neither is it yet defined by how many indices the spirits presence can be proved or signified . and they limit the spirit too much , and understand it too little , who take accounts of his secret workings , and measure them by the material lines and methods of natural and animal effects . and yet because whatsoever is holy , is made so by the holy spirit , we are certain that the children of believing , that is , of christian parents , are holy , s. paul affirmed it , and by it hath distinguished ours from the children of unbelievers , and our marriages from theirs : and because the children of the heathen when they come to choice and reason , may enter to baptism and the covenant if they will , our children have no priviledge beyond the children of turks or heathens , unlesse it be in the present capacity , that is , either by receiving the holy ghost immediately , and the promises , or at least having a title to the sacrament , and entring by that door . if they have the spirit , nothing can hinder them from a title to the water ; and if they have onely a title to the water of the sacrament , then they shall receive the promise of the holy spirit , the benefits of the sacrament : else their priviledge is none at all , but a dish of cold water , which every village nurse can provide for her new-born babe . but it is in our case as it was with the jews children : our children are a holy seed ; for if it were not so with christianity , how could s. peter move the jews to christianity , by telling them the promise was to them and their children ? for if our children be not capable of the spirit of promise and holiness , and yet their children were holy , it had been a better argument to have kept them in the synagogue , then to have called them to the christian church . either therefore 1. there is some holiness in a reasonable nature , which is not from the spirit of holiness ; or else 2. our children do receive the holy spirit , because they are holy ; or if they be not holy , they are in worse condition under christ then under moses : or if none of all this be true , then our children are holy by having received the holy spirit of promise , and consequently nothing can hinder them from being baptized . and indeed if the christian jews , whose children are circumcised , and made partakers of the same promises and title , and inheritance and sacraments , which themselves had at their conversion to the faith of christ , had seen their children now shut out from these new sacraments , it is not to be doubted but they would have raised a storm , greater then could easily have been suppressed : since about their circumcisions they had raised such tragedies and implacable disputations : and there had been great reason to look for a storm ; for their children were circumcised , and if not baptized , then they were left under a burthen which their fathers were quit of , for s. paul said unto you , whosoever is circumcised , is a debtor to keep the whole law . these children therefore that were circumcised , stood obliged for want of baptism to perform the laws of ceremonies , to be presented into the temple , to pay their price , to be redeemed with silver and gold ; to be bound by the law of pollutions and carnal ordinances : and therefore if they had been thus left , it would be no wonder if the jews had complained and made a tumult : they used to do it for less matters . to which let this be added , that the first book of the new testament was not written till eight years after christs ascension , and s. marks gospel twelve years . in the mean time , to what scriptures did they appeal ? by the analogy or proportion of what writings did they end their questions ? whence did they prove their articles ? they onely appealed to the old testament , and onely added what their lord superadded . now either it must be said that our blessed lord commanded that infants should not be baptized , which is no where pretended ; and if it were , cannot at all be proved : or if by the proportion of scriptures they did serve god , and preach the religion , it is plain , that by the analogy of the old testament , that is , of those scriptures by which they proved christ to be come , and to have suffered , they also approved the baptism of infants , or the admitting them to the society of the faithful jews , of which also the church did then principally consist . 7. that baptism ( which consigns men and women to a blessed resurrection ) doth also equally consign infants to it , hath nothing , that i know of , pretended against it , there being the same signature and the same grace , and in this thing all being alike passive , and we no way cooperating to the consignation and promise of grace : and infants have an equall necessity , as being lyable to sickness and groaning with as sad accents , and dying sooner then men and women , and less able to complain , and more apt to be pityed and broken with the unhappy consequents of a short life , and a speedy death , & infelicitate priscorum hominum , with the infelicity and folly of their first parents : and therefore have as great need as any , and that is capacity enough to receive a remedy for the evil which was brought upon them by the fault of another . 8. and after all this , if baptism be that means which god hath appointed to save us , it were well if we would do our parts towards infants final interest ; which whether it depends upon the sacrament and its proper grace , we have nothing to relye upon , but those texts of scripture which make baptism the ordinary way of entring into the state of salvation : save onely we are to adde this , that because of this law infants are not personally capable , but the church for them , as for all others indefinitely , we have reason to believe , that their friends neglect shall by some way be supplyed ; but hope hath in it nothing beyond a probability . this we may be certain of , that naturally we cannot be heirs of salvation , for by nature we are children of wrath , and therefore an eternal separation from god , is an infallible consequent to our evil nature : either therefore children must be put into the state of grace , or they shall dwell for ever where gods face does never shine . now there are but two wayes of being put into the state of grace and salvation ; the inward , by the spirit , and the outward , by water , which regularly are together . if they be renewed by the spirit , what hinders them to be baptized , who receive the holy ghost as well as we ? if they are not capable of the spirit , they are capable of water ; and if of neither , where is their title to heaven , which is neither internal nor external , neither spiritual nor sacramental , neither secret nor manifest , neither natural nor gracious , neither original nor derivative ? and well may we lament the death of poor babes that are {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , concerning whom if we neglect what is regularly prescribed to all that enter heaven , without any difference expressed , or case reserved , we have no reason to be comforted over our dead children , but may weep as they that have no hope . we may hope when our neglect was not the hinderance , because god hath wholly taken the matter into his own hand , and then it cannot miscarry ; and though we know nothing of the children , yet we know much of gods goodness : but when god hath permitted it to us , that is , offered and permitted children to our ministery , whatever happens to the innocents , we may well fear left god will require the souls at our hands : and we cannot be otherwise secure , but that it will be said concerning our children , which s. ambrose used in a case like this , anima illa potuit salva fieri , si habuisset purgationem , this soul might have gone to god , if it had been purified and washed . we know god is good , infinitely good , but we know it is not at all good to tempt his goodness : and he tempts him , that leaves the usual way , and pretends it is not made for him , and yet hopes to be at his journeys end , or expects to meet his childe in heaven , when himself shuts the door against him , which for ought he knows is the onely one that stands open . s. austin was severe in this question against unbaptized infants , therefore he is called durus pater infantium : though i know not why the original of that opinion should be attributed to him , since s. ambrose said the same before him , as appears in his words above quoted in the margent . and now that i have enumerated the blessings which are consequent to baptism , and have also made apparent , that infants can receive these blessings , i suppose i need not use any other perswasions to bring children to baptism . if it be certain they may receive these good things by it , it is certain they are not to be hindred of them without the greatest impiety , and sacriledge , and uncharitableness in the world . nay , if it be onely probable that they receive these blessings , or if it be but possible they may , nay unless it be impossible they should , and so declared by revelation or demonstratively certain , it were intolerable unkindness and injustice to our pretty innocents , to let their crying be unpityed , and their natural misery eternally irremediable , and their sorrows without remedy , and their souls no more capable of relief , then their bodies of physick , and their death left with the sting in , and their souls without spirits to go to god , and no angel guardian to be assigned them in the assemblies of the faithful , and they not to be reckoned in the accounts of god and gods church . all these are sad stories . there are in scripture very many other probabilities , to perswade the baptism of infants , but because the places admit of divers interpretations , the arguments have so many diminutions , and the certainty that is in them is too fine for easie understandings , i have chosen to build the ancient doctrines upon such principles which are more easie and certain , and have not been yet sullied and rifled with the contentions of an adversary . this onely i shall observe , that the words of our blessed lord [ unless a man be born of water and the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven ] cannot be expounded to the exclusion of children , but the same expositions will also make baptism not necessary for men : for if they be both necessary ingredients , water and the spirit , then let us provide water , and god will provide the spirit ; if we bring wood to the sacrifice , he will provide a lamb . and if they signifie distinctly , one is ordinarily as necessary as the other , and then infants must be baptized , or not be saved . but if one be exegetical and explicative of the other , and by water and the spirit is meant onely the purification of the spirit , then where is the necessity of baptism for men ? it will be as the other sacrament , at most but highly convenient , not simply necessary , and all the other places will easily be answered , if this be avoided . but however , these words being spoken in so decretory a manner , are to be used with fear and reverence ; and we must be infallibly sure by some certain infallible arguments , that infants ought not to be baptized , or we ought to fear concerning the effect of these decretory words . i shall onely adde two things by way of corollary to this discourse . that the church of god ever since her numbers are full , have for very many ages consisted almost wholly of assemblies of them who have been baptized in their infancy : and although in the first callings of the gentiles , the chiefest and most frequent baptisms were of converted and repenting persons and believers , yet from the beginning also the church hath baptized the infants of christian parents ; according to the prophecy of isaiah , behold , i will lift up my hands to the gentiles , and set up a standard to the people , and they shall bring thy sons in their arms , and thy daughters shall be carried upon their shoulders . concerning which , i shall not onely bring the testimonies of the matter of fact , but either a report of an apostolical tradition , or some argument from the fathers , which will make their testimony more effectuall in all that shall relate to the question . the author of the book of ecclesiastical hierarchy , attributed to s. denis the areopagite , takes notice , that certain unholy persons , and enemies to the christian religion , think it a ridiculous thing that infants , who as yet cannot understand the divine mysteries , should be partakers of the sacraments ; and that professions and abrenunciations should be made by others for them and in their names . he answers , that holy men , governors of churches , have so taught , having received a tradition from their fathers and elders in christ : by which answer of his , as it appears , that he himself was later then the areopagite ; so it is so early by him affirmed , that even then there was an ancient tradition for the baptism of infants , and the use of godfathers in the ministery of the sacrament . concerning which , it having been so ancient a constitution of the church , it were well if men would rather humbly and modestly observe , then like scorners deride it , in which they shew their own folly as well as immodesty . for what undecency or incongruity is it , that our parents natural or spiritual should stipulate for us , when it is agreeable to the practise of all the laws and transactions of the world , an effect of the communion of saints and of christian oeconomy ? for why may not infants be stipulated for as well as we ? all were included in the stipulation made with adam ; he made a losing bargain for himself , and we smarted for his folly : and if the faults of parents , and kings , and relatives , do bring evil upon their children , and subjects , and correlatives , it is but equal that our children may have benefit also by our charity and piety . but concerning making an agreement for them , we finde that god was confident concerning abraham , that he would teach his children : and there is no doubt but parents have great power , by strict education and prudent discipline , to efform the mindes of their children to vertue . joshua did expresly undertake for his houshold , i and my house will serve the lord : and for children we may better do it , because till they are of perfect choice , no government in the world is so great , as that of parents over their children , in that which can concern the parts of this question : for they rule over their understandings , and children know nothing but what they are told , and they believe it infinitely : and it is a rare art of the spirit , to engage parents to bring them up well in the nuriure and admonition of the lord ; they are persons obliged by a superinduced band , they are to give them instructions and holy principles , as they give them meat ; and it is certain that parents may better stipulate for their children , then the church can for men and women ; for they may be present impostors and hypocrites , as the church story tells of some , and consequently are {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , not really converted , and ineffectively baptized : and the next day they may change their resolution , and grow weary of their vow : and that is the most that children can do when they come to age : and it is very much in the parents , whether the children shall do any such thing , or no ; — purus & insons [ ut me collaudem ] si & vivo carus amicis , causa fuit pater his — ipse mihi custos incorruptissimus omnes circum doctores aderat ; quid multa ? pudicum ( qui primus virtutis honos ) servavit ab omni non solùm facto , verùm opprobrio quoque turpi : — ob hoc nunc laus illi debetur , & à me gratia major . horat , for education can introduce a habit and a second nature , against which children cannot kick , unless they do some violence to themselves and their inclinations . and although it fails too often when ever it fails , yet we pronounce prudently concerning future things , when we have a less influence into the event , then in the present case , ( and therefore are more unapt persons to stipulate ) and less reason in the thing it self ( and therefore have not so much reason to be confident . ) is not the greatest prudence of generals instanced in their foreseeing future events , and guessing at the designs of their enemies , concerning which they have less reason to be confident , then parents of their childrens belief of the christian creed ? to which i adde this consideration , that parents or godfathers may therefore safely and prudently promise , that their children shall be of the christian faith , because we not onely see millions of men and women who not onely believe the whole creed onely upon the stock of their education ; but there are none that ever do renounce the faith of their countrey and breeding , unless they be violently tempted by interest or weakness , antecedent or consequent . he that sees all men almost to be christians , because they are bid to be so , need not question the fittingness of godfathers promising in behalf of the children for whom they answer . and however the matter be for godfathers , yet the tradition of baptizing infants passed through the hands of irenaeus , omnem aetatem sanctificans per illam quae ad ipsam erat similitudinem . omnes n. venit per semetipsum salvare , omnes inquam qui per eum renascuntur in deum , infantes , & parvulos , & pueros , & juvenes , & seniores . ideo per omnem venit aetatem , & infantibus infans factus sanctificās infantes , in parvulis parvulus , &c. christ did sanctifie every age by his own susception of it , and similitude to it . for he came to save all men by himself , i say all who by him are born again unto god , infants , and children , and boyes , and yong men , and old men . he was made an infant to infants , sanctifying infants , a little one to the little ones , &c. and origen is express , ecclesia traditionem ab apostolis suscepit etiam parvulis dare baptismum . the church hath received a tradition from the apostles to give baptism to children . and s. cyprian in his epistle to fidus , gives account of this article : for being questioned by some lesse skilfull persons , whether it were lawfull to baptize children before the eighth day ; he gives account of the whole question , and a whole councell of sixty six bishops upon very good reason decreed , that their baptism should at no hand be deferred , though whether six , or eight , or ten dayes , was no matter , so there be no danger or present necessity . the whole epistle is worth the reading . but besides these authorities of such who writ before the starting of the pelagian questions , it will not be useless to bring their discourses , of them and others , i mean the reason upon which the church did it both before and after . irenaeus his argument was this ; christ tooke upon him our nature to sanctifie and to save it ; and passed through the severall periods of it , even unto death , which is the symbole and effect of old age ; and therefore it is certaine he did sanctifie all the periods of it : and why should he be an infant , but that infants should receive the crowne of their age , the purification of their stained nature , the sanctification of their persons , and the saving of their soules by their infant lord and elder brother ? omnis enim anima eousque in adam censetur donec in christo recenseatur : tamdiu immunda quamdiu recenseatur . every soul is accounted in adam till it be new accounted in christ ; and so long as it is accounted in adam , so long it is uncleane ; and we know no uncleane thing can enter into heaven ; and therefore our lord hath defined it , unlesse ye be born of water and the spirit , ye cannot enter into the kingdome of heaven : that is , ye cannot be holy . it was the argument of tertullian ; which the rather is to be received , because he was one lesse favorable to the custome of the church in his time of baptizing infants , which custome he noted and acknowledged , and hath also in the preceding discourse fairely proved . * and indeed ( that s. cyprian may superadde his symbol ) god who is no accepter of persons will also be no accepter of ages . * for if to the greatest delinquents sinning long before against god ; remission of sins be given when afterwards they beleive , and from baptisme and from grace no man is forbidden , how much more ought not an infant be forbidden , who being new born , hath sinned nothing , save onely that being in the flesh , born of adam in his first birth ; he hath contracted the contagion of an old death ? who therefore comes the easier to obtain remission of sins , because to him are forgiven not his own , but the sins of another man . none ought to be driven from baptism and the grace of god , who is mercifull , and gentle , and pious unto all ; and therefore much lesse infants , who more deserve our aid , and more need the divine mercy , because in the first beginning of their birth crying and weeping , they can do nothing but call for mercy and reliefe . for this reason it was ( saith origen ) that they to whom the secrets of the divine mysteries were committed , did baptize their infants , because there was born with them the impurities of sin , which did need material absolution as a sacrament of spiritual purification ; for that it may appear that our sins have a proper analogy to this sacrament , the body it self is called the body of sin : and therefore the washing of the body is not ineffectual towards the great work of pardon and abolition . indeed after this absolution there remains concupiscence , or the material part of our misery and sin : for christ by his death onely took away that which when he did dye for us , he bore in his own body upon the tree . now christ onely bore the punishment of our sin , and therefore we shall not dye for it , but the material part of the sin christ bore not . sin could not come so neer him ; it might make him sick and dye , but not disordered and stained . he was pure from original and actual sins ; and therefore that remains in the body , though the guilt and punishment be taken off , and changed into advantages and grace ; and the actual are cured by the spirit of grace descending afterwards upon the church , and sent by our lord to the same purpose . but it is not rationally to be answered what s. ambrose sayes , quia omnis peccato obnoxia , ideo omnis aetas sacramento idonea : for it were strange that sin and misery should seize upon the innocent and most unconsenting persons ; and that they onely should be left without a sacrament , and an instrument of expiation . and although they cannot consent to the present susception , yet neither do they refuse ; and yet they consent as much to the grace of the sacrament , as to the prevarication of adam and because they suffer under this , it were but reason they should be relieved by that . and * it were better ( as gregory nazianzen affirms ) that they should be consigned and sanctified without their own knowledge , then to dye without their being sanctified ; for so it happened to the circumcised babes of israel : and if the conspersion and washing the doore posts with the blood of a lamb , did sacramentally preserve all the first-born of goshen , it cannot be thought impossible or unreasonable that the want of understanding in children should hinder them from the blessing of a sacrament , and from being redeemed and washed with the blood of the holy lamb , who was slain for all from the beginning of the world . after all this it is not inconsiderable that we say the church hath great power and authority about the sacraments ; which is observeable in many instances . she appointed what persons she pleased , and in equal power made an unequal dispensation and ministery . the apostles first dispensed all things , and then they left off exteriour ministeries to attend to the word of god and prayer : and s. paul accounted it no part of his office to baptize , when he had been separated by imposition of hands at antioch , to the work of preaching and greater ministeries ; and accounted that act of the church , the act of christ , saying , christ sent mee not to baptize , but to preach the gospel : they used various forms in the ministration of baptism , sometimes baptizing in the name of christ , sometimes expressely invocating the holy and ever blessed trinity : one while [ i baptize thee ] as in the latine church , but in greek , [ let the servant of christ be baptized : ] and in all ecclesiastical ministeries the church invented the forms , & in most things hath often charged them , as in absolution , excommunication , and sometimes they baptized people upon their profession of repentance , and then taught them ; as it hapned to the jaylor and all his family ; in whose case there was no explicit faith afore hand in the mysteries of religion , so far as appears ; and yet he , and not onely he , but all his house were baptized at that hour of the night when the earthquake was terrible , and the fear was pregnant upon them , & this upon their masters account , as it is likely : but others were baptized in the conditions of a previous faith , and a new begun repentance * . they baptized in rivers or in lavatories , by dipping or by sprinkling ; for so we finde that s. laurence did as he went to martyrdom , and so the church did sometimes to clinicks , and so it is highly convenient to be done in northern . countries according to the prophecy of isaiah , so shall he sprinkle many nations , according as the typical expiations among the jews were usually by sprinkling : and it is fairly relative to the mystery , to the sprinkling with the blood of christ and the watering of the furrows of our souls with the dew of heaven , to make them to bring forth fruit unto the spirit and unto holinesse . the church sometimes dipt the catechumen three times ; sometimes but once : some churches use fire in their baptisms , so do the ethiopians , and the custome was antient in some places . and so in the other sacrament ; sometimes she stood and sometimes kneeled , and sometimes received it in the mouth , and sometimes in the hand : one while in leavened , another while in unleavened bread : sometimes the wine and water were mingled , sometimes they were pure ; and they admitted some persons to it sometimes , which at other times she rejected : sometimes the consecration was made by one forme , sometimes by another : and to conclude , sometimes it was given to infants , sometimes not : and she had power so to do ; for in all things where there was not a commandment of christ expressed or imployed in the nature and in the end of the institution , the church had power to alter the particulars , as was most expedient , or conducing to edification : and although the after ages of the church which refused to communicate infants , have found some little things against the lawfulnesse , and those ages that used it found out some pretences for its necessity ; yet both the one and the other had liberty to follow their own necessities , so in all things they followed christ . certainly there is infinitely more reason why infants may be communicated , then why they may not be baptized . and that this discourse may revert to its first intention ; although there is no record extant of any church in the world , that from the apostles dayes inclusively to this very day ever refused to baptize their children , yet if they had upon any present reason they might also change their practise , when the reason should be changed ; and therefore if there were nothing els in it , yet the universal practise of all churches in all ages , is abundantly sufficient to determine us , and to legltimate the practise , since christ hath not forbidden it . it is sufficient confutation to disagreeing people to use the words of s. paul , we have no such custome , nor the churches of god , to suffer children to be strangers from the covenant of promise , till they shall enter into it as jewes or turks may enter , that is , by choise and disputation . but although this alone to modest and obedient , that is , to christian spirits , be sufficient , yet this is more then the question did need . it can stand upon its proper foundation . quicunque parvulos recentes ab uteris matrum baptizandos negat , anathema est . he that refuseth to baptize his infants , shall be in danger of the councel . the prayer . o holy , and eternall iesus , who in thy own person wert pleased to sanctify the waters of baptism , and by thy institution and commandment didst make them effectual , to excellent purposes of grace and remedy , be pleased to verify the holy effects of baptism to me and all thy servants whose names are dedicated to thee in an early and timely presentation , and enable us with thy grace to verify all our promises , by which we were bound , then when thou didst first make us thy own portion and relatives in the consummation of a holy covenant . o be pleased to pardon all those undecencies and unhandsome interruptions of that state of favour in which thou didst plant us by thy grace , and admit us by the gates of baptism : and let that spirit which moved upon those holy waters never be absent from us , but call upon us and invite us by a perpetual argument and daily solicitations and inducements to holinesse ; that we may never return to the filthinesse of sin , but by the answer of a good conscience may please thee and glorify thy name , and doe honour to thy religion and institution in this world , and may receive the blessings and the rewards of it in the world to come , being presented to thee pure and spotlesse in the day of thy power when thou shalt lead thy church to a kingdome , and endlesse glories . amen . the end . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a63778e-330 §. 1. §. 2. john 4. 14. §. 3. 1 pet. 3. 21. §. 4. §. 5. umbra in lege , imago in evangelio , veritas in coelo . s. ambr. §. 6. 1 cor. 10. 2. §. 7. §. 8. a tertui . de praescrip. . c. 40. b scholiast. . in ju. sat. 2. l. 1. c o nimium faciles qui tristia crimina caedis tolli flumineâ posse put at is aquâ . §. 9. joh. 4. 14. §. 10. audi quid scripturae doceant : johannis baptisma non tam peccata dimisit , quam baptisma poenitentiae fuit in peccatorum remissionem , idque in futuram remissionem quae esset postea per sanctificationem christi subsequutura . hieronym . adv. luciterian . a vide suprà . sect. 9. n. 1. b acts 8. 16. acts 2. 38. §. 11. §. 12. mat. 28. 19. mark 16. 16. john 3. 5. gen. 17. 14. s. august . haeres . 46. 59. §. 13. §. 14. heb. 6. 1. s. august . l. 2. c. 1. de cate. rudib . just . martyr . apol. 2. acts 2. 47. §. 15. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . cyril . hierosol . catec . 2. 1 cor. 12. 13. acts 13. 48. §. 16. john 3. 5. titus 3. 5. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . damasc. l. 4. orth . fid. c. 10. lib. de c. 1. lib. 5. hist. §. 17. ezek. 36. 25. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . symb. nicen. lib. 1. c. 3. in johan . acts 22. 16. eph. 5. 26. lib. 4. adv. marc. c. 9. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . gr. pro . annon ita credimur quia omne genus peccati cùm ad salutare lavacrum venimus aufertur ? origen . homil. 15. in jesu . ecce quicquid iniquitatum sempiternus ignis excoqucre & expiare vix posset , subito sacro fonte submersum est , & de aeternis debitis brevissimo lavacri compendio cum indulgentissimo creditore transactum est . ambros. l. 1. c. 7. de poen . qui dicit peccata in baptismo non funditùs dimitti , dicat in mari rubro aegyptios non veraciter mortuos . s. greg. m. l. 9. ep. 39. phavorin . l. 2. arator . l. 2. hist. apostal . rev. 7. 14. 1 joh. 1. 7. acts 22. 16. tit. 3. 5. heb. 9. 14. 1 joh. 5. 8. §. 18. titus 3. 4 , 5. theodoret. ep. de divin. decret , cap. de lib. de nuptiis . cap. 23. & tract. 124. in johan . vide salmeron . tom. 13. p. 487. §. 19. gil. 3. 26. verse 29. heb. 10. 16. &c. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , scil. ad fururum respiciens {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . 2 pet. 1. 9. vide part . 2. dis 6. 9. of repentance , num . 9. ad 31. §. 20. paulin. ep. 12. ad serenum . 1 cor. 12. 13. john 3. 5. s. basil. de spir. s. cap. 15. §. 21. * 2 cor. 1. 22. eph. 1. 13. 4. 30. john 6. 27. s. cyril . hieros . catech. 3. §. 22. s. basil. in psal. 28. heb. 10. 32. heb. 6. 4. 1 joh. 2. 20. 27. §. 23. 1 john 3. 3. lib. de spir. s. c. 13. rom. 6. 7. ver. 5. 6. * {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . plutar. vide disc. 9. of repentance n. 46. §. 24. rom. 6. 3. 5. col. 2. 12. §. 25. mark 16. 16. tit. 3. 5. niceph. l. 7. c. 35. socr. l. 5. c. 6. idem lib. 7. c. 7. psal. 34. 7. heb. 1. 14. basil. theodor . epiphan. n azianz . col. 2. 2. cyril . heros . dionys. arcop . aug. l. 2. c. 13. contra crescon. gram. §. 27. mark 16. 16. acts 2. 28. apol. ad anton. caes. 1 pet. 3. 21. tertull. de resur. carn . ad tryphon . jud. dial. eum tryph. lib. 2. adv. parm. clem. alex. lib. 1. paedag. . c. 6. §. 28. notes for div a63778e-5630 §. 1. §. 2. acts 1047. aug. de mor b. eccles. cath. l. 1. c. 35. bern. serm. de coena dom. §. 3. acts 8. 37. acts 2. 38. act. 3. 15. §. 4. s. 5. mat. 9. 28. mark 9. 23. mat. 8. 13. john 4. 50. mat. 9. 28. §. 6. john 6. 44. mark 10. 15. 7. §. 8. luke 17. 20 , 21 luke 18. 16. §. 9. iuke 4. 22. 28. 1 pet. 1. 2. 2 thess. 1. 2. rom. 8. 30. eccles. 1. §. 11. §. 12. §. 13. * §. 25. &c. §. 14. gen. 17. 2 , &c. heb. 11. 13. 14. 15. rom. 4. 11. 7. 12. §. 15. rom. 4. 11 , 12 v. 17. v. 13. gal. 3. 14. 29. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , epiphan l. 1. haeres . 8. scil. epicuraeor . §. 16. tit. 3. 5. §. 17. rom. 5. 17 , 18. vide august . l. 4. cont. duas epistolas pelag. c. 4. l. 6. contr. jur. c. 4. prosper . contra collatorem . cap. 20. orat. 40. in s. §. 18. a lib. 3. adv. pelag. 6. lib. 1. in initio . lib. de c. 18. §. 19. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . dionys. aerop . eccles. hier. cap. 3. part . 3. ut quod perdideramus in adam , i. e. secundum imaginem & similitudinem esse dei , hoc in jesu christo reciperemus . irenaeus lib. 3. c. 30. 1 john 1. 8. ep. ad fiden . lib. 3. cp. 8. s. aug. lib. de pec . mer. & remiss . c. 9. §. 20. §. 21. §. 22. §. 23. §. 24. nisi qui renatus fuerit &c. utique nullum excipit , non infantem , non aliqua praeventum necessitate . ambr. de abrah . patr. lib. 2. c. 11. lib. 2. c. 11. de abrah . patriare . §. 25. §. 26. §. 27. isa. 49. 22. §. 28. §. 39. l. 2. c. 39. vide etlam constit. clementis . {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} lib. 5. ad rom. c. 6. idem homil . 14. in lucam & lib. 8. hom 8. in levitic . §. 30. §. 31. irenaeus . §. 32. tertullian . lib. de anima : c. 39. & 4a s. cyprian epist. ad fidum . cyprian . origen . lib. 5. ad rom. c. 6. §. 33. s. ambros. de abraham patriar. . l. 2. c. 11. * s. greg. naz. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . or. c. 40. in s. §. 3. 4. * non ut delinquere desinant , sed quia desierunt , as tertul. phraseth it . isa. 52. 15. 1 pet. 1. 2. aqua refectionis & haptisms lavacrum quo anima sterilis ariditate peccati ad bonos fructus inferendos divinis muneribus irrigatur . cassidor . m. 23. ps. 2. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , dixit heracleon apud clem. alex. concil. milevit . can. 2. an addition to the apology for the two treatises concerning infant-baptisme, published december 15, 1645 in which the author is vindicated from 21 unjust criminations in the 92 page of the book of mr. robert baille, minister of glasgow, intituled anabaptisme and sundry materiall points concerning the covenant, infants-interest in it, and baptisme by it, baptism by an unbaptized person, dipping, erastianism and church-government, are argued, in a letter, now enlarged, sent in september 1647, to him / by john tombes . .. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. this text is an enriched version of the tcp digital transcription a62859 of text r11324 in the english short title catalog (wing t1794). textual changes and metadata 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a62859) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 49607) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 553:16) an addition to the apology for the two treatises concerning infant-baptisme, published december 15, 1645 in which the author is vindicated from 21 unjust criminations in the 92 page of the book of mr. robert baille, minister of glasgow, intituled anabaptisme and sundry materiall points concerning the covenant, infants-interest in it, and baptisme by it, baptism by an unbaptized person, dipping, erastianism and church-government, are argued, in a letter, now enlarged, sent in september 1647, to him / by john tombes . .. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. [8], 38 p. printed by hen. hills for hen. crips, and lodowick lloid ..., t. brewster, and g. moule ..., london : 1652. reproduction of original in bodleian library. eng baillie, robert, 1599-1662. -anabaptisme. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. -apology or pleas for the two treatises concerning infant baptisme. infant baptism -early works to 1800. a62859 r11324 (wing t1794). civilwar no an addition to the apology for the two treatises concerning infant-baptisme, published december 15. 1645. in which the author is vindicated tombes, john 1652 20461 167 150 0 0 0 0 155 f the rate of 155 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the f category of texts with 100 or more defects per 10,000 words. 2004-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2004-11 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2004-12 john latta sampled and proofread 2004-12 john latta text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-01 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion an addition to the apology for the two treatises concerning infant-baptisme , published december 15. 1645. in which the author is vindicated from 21. unjust criminations in the 92. page of the book of mr. robert baillie minister of glasgow , intituled anabaptisme . and sundry materiall points concerning the covenant , infants-interest in it , and baptisme by it , baptism by an unbaptized person , dipping , erastianism and church-government , are argued , in a letter ( now enlarged ) sent in september 1647. to him , by john tombes . b. d. london , printed by hen. hills for hen. crips , and lodowick lloid , in popes-head alley , t. brewster , and g. moule at the three bibles at the west end of pauls 1652. errata . epist. dedic. edius reade edingh . page 2. line 23. visible r. invisible , p. 3. l. penul . needlesly r. heedlesly , p. 4 l. 18. obhorrency r. abhorrency , p. 5. l. 7. we r. he l. 8 know r. knew , p. 6 ▪ l. 11 examination r. crimination , p. 9. l. 20. divert r. derive , p. 10. in margin all in r. allin , p. 11. l. 10. baptizeter r. baptizetur , p. 12. l. 22 considerately r. considerate , p. 13. l. 4. desire r. devise , p. 18. l. 6. credible r. incredible . l 26. it sufficient r. insufficient , l. 33. right r. rite , p. 25. l. 3. r. nor mr. p. 28. margin design . r. de syn. p. 29. l. 32. all r. ill , p. 32. l 23. a r. no , p. 33. l. 4. refers r. reserves , p. 34 l. 19. scoffical r. scoptical , p. 36. l. 8. no type . r. no less to the right honourable bulstrode whitlock serjeant at law , john lisle esq richard keble serjeant at law , lords commissioners of the great seal of england ; major generall thomas harrison ; edmund prideaux esq atturney general for the state . out of a love to truth , and respect to my engagement by solemn covenant i framed , and out of desire to prevent ( if possible ) the oppression of men , for holding a truth , i printed ( some years since ) two treatises and an append●x to them , and after that an apology for them , with a postscript ; which were presented to some of your hands by me . finding that great hatred is against such as dissent from the assemblies determinations , specially in the two points of baptism , & discipline , ( which this writing treats of ; ) and those that shelter them from violence ; and that a great part of the quarrel between england and scotland is , for not establishing presbyterial government , with rigour , which is thus expressed in the scottish assemblies reply to the 〈◊〉 declaration , edius . 22. julii 1650. sess. 17. that jesus christ be lord over his own house , and that his ministers keep courts and exercise jurisdiction and discipline , and all the censures of the kirk from the lowest to the highest , in his name only , against all that depart from and do oppose the truth ; or that walk loosely as doth not become the gospell : and hoping this writing to one of the chief presbyterians in scotland ▪ may contribute something to discover the unreasonablenesse of their violent proceedings in their way ; and some truths , not commonly discerned ; i have yielded to the publishing thereof , in this sad time of a bloody warre , raised much from the forementioned hatred . such as it is , i humbly present to your honours , in testimony of my thankfulnesse for the favour and pitty to me , vouchsafed by some of your honors in conferring on me , & others in being eminently instrumental in the quiet settling of me in this place ; in which , after plunderings , and many tossings up and down , i have had some abiding : wherein i still endeavour to be serviceable to the publique , and to acquit my self your honours humble and devoted servant , john tombes . ledbury-hospitall in herefordshire sept. 4. 1650. to the reverend the moderator and commissioners in the next nationall assembly of the church of scotland , or the next provincial assembly unto which glasgow in the kingdome of scotland belongs ; the complaint of john tombes presbyter , humbly sheweth , that in pursuance of the solemne covenant taken by me to endeavour reformation in gods worship , according●● the word of god ; i published two treatises about infant-baptisme at london december 15. 1645. and an apology for them in august 1646 . ●●d that in the year 1647. a book intituled anabaptisme was published at london , by robert bayly minister of glasgow : wherein i was wronged by many grievous false accusations : concerning which i have ( as near as i could , ) followed the rule of christ ma● . 18. 15 , 16 , 17. as may be perceived by the close of the letter to mr. bayly himself : for after i had advertised him by mr. henry s●●dd●r , of the injury he had done me , i wrote to him july 22. 1647. which letter was delivered to mr. samuel rutherford sept. 17. 1647. with directions how to send back . and in the year 1649. i wrote a letter to mr. rutherford , to certify me what became of my writing delivered to him ? with desire to know what mr. bayly would do to right me ; yet after so long waiting , i find no remorse or righting of me made by the said mr. robert bayly : and therefore i do devolve the matter into your hands , being taken for the church , to which such complaints should be made , according to the rule mat. 18. 17. and do expect to have right done by you to him and me , as to a fellow-christian , — presbyter , — and covenanter with you , as is meet in such a cause concerning the truth of god , and innocency of your brother . and forasmuch as the charge against him and proof may be evidently seen in this letter to him , and his and my writings , ( which [ if you please to take notice of , ] you may easily come by ; ) i presume you will not expect my personal appearance before you to pursue this complaint : but of your selves examine the matter , as i conceive the rule of christ binds you ; besides the engagements towards a fellow-covenanter in the sixth article of the sol●mne league and covenant : and permit your fellow-servant to attend the work of christ , in the place where he is seated ; who shall pray for your welfare ; and continue your brother and fellow-servant in christ , john tombes . london sept. 24. 1650. to the reverend , mr. samuel rutherfurd professor at st. andrews in scotland . sir , anno 1647. was delivered to you a letter of mine to mr. robert bayly of glasgow your fellow-commissioner , which you undertook as i am told to send to him , and not hearing any thing from mr. bayly in answer to it , anno 1649. i sent a letter to you to i●treate a word from you , what became of that letter with directions to what place in london your letter might be sent for me ; of which likewise i have heard nothing . forasmuch as without publishing something a blot indelible may lie on me and ( which is more ) on the truth i assert for my sake , and that in after ages when mr. bayly's book shall be read , and those false criminations found therein without any vindication of mine , and i perceive by experience that such false reports as have been vented in mr. edwards his gangr●n● ( upon whose credit honorius reggius hath blazed them in a latin writing ) and in mr. bayly's disswasives have made many men undeservedly odious , and such reports vented in pulpits upon their credit have been the bellowes that did blow the fire of warre , which hath to the rejoicing of malignants and grief of godly persons wasted your and our countrey , and mr. cotton of n. e. thought meet to print an apology for himself and the churches there to vindecate himself from mr. bayly's aspersions in one part of his disswasive , i have thought it necessary to vindicate my self in this , and have sent it to you , being one that i conceive cordially affected with the breaches that are among the godly & studious of truth and peace , that you may impart this as you may opportunely to some synod in your countrey , and indeavour , as conscience and covenant i think bind you , in the most prudent way you can to take of the injury of mr bayly ; and which is the chief thing i aim at and humbly desire , that there may be some course taken effectually to prevent such injurious misrepresentations of mens tenents , and practises in pulpits and presses , that so ( if the lord shall vouchsafe such a mercy ) dissenters at last may in a calme and amicable way debate differences to the healing of our breaches : which is the prayer and aime of lemster in herefordshire decem. 4. 1651. your fellow-servant and brother in christ , john tombes . the contents . sect. 1. of the first crimination , that i spoile all infants of all interest in the covenant of grace . sect. 2. of the second crimination , that i make circumcision to the jewes a seale only of earthly and temporall priviledges . sect. 3. of the third crimination , that i 〈◊〉 the jewish infants all right to the new covenant , 〈◊〉 they become ●●●tuall believers , from whence occasion is taken to shew the insufficiency of mr. gerees shift in expounding the words of the directory [ the promise is made to believers and their seed , ] and the insufficiency of mr. marshals proof , of connexion between the seal and the covenant , from gods institution ; and mr. bailies from the nature of the terms . sect. 4. of the fourth crimination , that i give a power to unbaptized persons to baptize others . sect. 5. of the fifth crimination , that i make apologies for the worst of the anabaptists . sect. 6. of the sixth crimination , inveighing against the first reformers . sect. 7. of the seventh crimination , inveighing against the assembly at westminster . sect. 8. of the eighth crimination , inveighing against the church of scotland . sect. 9. of the nineth crimination , inveighing against mr. marshall . sect. 10. of the tenth crimination , of inveighing against mr. thomas goodwin . sect. 11. of the eleventh crimination , of invectives against others . sect. 12. of the twelfth crimination , that i esteem baptisme an unnessary rite . sect. 13. of the thirteenth crimination , that i am carel●sse of my own baptism . sect. 14. of the fourteenth crimination , that i am unwilling to joine with any of the anabaptists churches , and they unwilling to baptize non-members . sect. 15. of the fifteenth crimination , my allowing frequent rebaptization . sect. 16. of the sixteenth crimination , that i make it lawfull for persons unbaptized to partake of the lords supper . sect. 17. of the seventeenth crimination , that i am a compleat erastian , wherein reason is given of my doub● , that in scripture no such juridical excommunication is appointed as is now contended for . sect. 18. of the eighteenth crimination , that i avow , no scand●-lous professor ought to be kept from the lords table . sect. 19. of the nineteenth crimination of me , that i hold no censure of excommunication . sect. 20. of the twentieth crimination , that i hold christ hath not appointed any particular government for his church . sect. 21. of the one and twentieth crimination , that i hold that the government of the church belongs to the magistrate only . sect. 22. of my new way , and boldnesse . sect. 23. of my silence concerning dipping , and of the novelty and insufficiency of sprinkling , instead of baptizing . sect. 24. the conclusion , requiring reparation of the wrong done to me by mr. bayly . to the reverend and worthy master robert baylie , minister at glasgow in scotland . sir , in your book intituled anabaptismi , you charge me falsly in these following accusations chap. 4. page 92. you say , in these following things he flies as high , as any civil and discreet anabaptist i have met with . 1. in spoyling christian infants not only of baptisme , but of all interest in the covenant of grace . and in the margine , and table in the end of your book , you say , he spoyles all infants of all interest in the covenant of grace . 2. in making circumcision a seal to the jews onely of earthly and temporal priviledges . 3. in denying to jewish infants all right to the new covenant , till in their riper years they become actuall believers . sect i. of the first crimination , that i spoile all infants of all interest in the covenant of grace . to prove these accusations which you so expresly charge me with , and tend to make your adversary odious , ( which it seems you made your businesse , and not to clear truth ; ) you referre the reader to the letters a a page 110. where you cite one passage of my apology page 64. which doeth directly deny the first accusation , and where the passage of mr. marshall you alledge for proof of it , ( a most unreasonable way to prove a mans position by his antagonists conceit of it , as , that calvin made god the author of sin , because bellarmin accused him of it , ) is sufficiently answered : yea in my post script to mr. blake in the end of my apology sect. 22. i charge master blake of unjust crimination of me in this , and challenge mr. marshall , mr. vines , mr. calamy , and now your self to make good that charge if you can . and yet you are not asham●d to say , pag. 113. all our adversaries deny to all infants all right in god , all interests in his promises , and covenant , as much as they do to turks , and pagans . and chap. 4. page 89 , 90. after you had charged this accusation on others ; in the close you say , this makes them uncertain what to say of infants dying before conversion . some save them all , ( which is contrary to what you say page 133 ; ) others incline to the damnation of them all ; others professe the uncertainty of the thing , whether infants before their conversion be within the kingdome of satan , or that of god . and for proof of this last you referre the reader to the letter k ; and there you alledge my words in my apology page 64 , 66. which speak not at all of the uncertainty of the thing you were speaking of , to wit , the salvation or damnation of infants dying before conversion , but the contrary , saying expresly , that every infant is either in the visible kingdome of god , or of satan , that is , elect , or reprobate . and for the certainty of the subject , i conceive neither you nor i , nor any on earth are certain what child of a believer is elect , or reprobate . sure i am mr. marshall in his sermon page 48 ▪ saith , charity is not tyed to conclude certainly of any of them , although in the beginning of his sermon page 7. he would ground the salvation of all the infants of believers dying in their infancy , on gods promise , to be the god of believers , and of their seed . besides , my words in my apology page 64 , 66. which you alledge , speak onely of infants belonging visibly to the kingdome of the devil or god ; and i still deny that they belong to either visibly , untill they make their profession , according to the constitution of the visible church of christians , which it behoved you to disprove , and not to misreport my words as you do . sect. ii. of the second crimination , that i make circumcision to the jewes , a seal onely of earthly and temporall priviledges . as for your second accusation , you bring onely mr. marshals words which onely declare his suspicion ; yet so unreasonable and groundless , as one might wonder any man should have the face to draw me into a suspicion of that , the contrary whereof is delivered in my exercitation page 2. and very often in my exercitation and examen of his sermon ; in which i still make the covenant made with abraham gen. 17. which circumcision confirmed , to be a mixt covenant , containing both spirituall and temporal promises . and yet you expresly accuse me of the contrary ; & against my plain words prove your charge , onely by master marshals suspition expressed in this manner ; what your meaning is in this expression , i cannot tell ; it hath an untoward look , as if the meaning were , &c. which was unreasonable in him to raise such a jealousie of me for citing onely a passage in that so approved treatise of cameron that learned scot , de triplici foedere , th. 78. ( which was also much approved at heidelberg ) by the publisher of his works according to an order in a synod of the french churches ; as to be stiled in cameron's icon , accurratissimae theses ; and they are now translated into english by mr. samuel bolton , and printed at the end of his treatise , of the true bounds of christian freedom with this commendation ( too precious to be any longer concealed , or hid under the shell of an unknown tongue . ) and yet these words were cited by me so warily page 4. of my exercitation as that i say , and if we may believe mr. cameron ; yet mr. marshall had so much ingenuity , as to say of me in that place page . 98. of his defence , it is too grosse a thing to imagine of god , and so expresly contrary to the word , that untill you own it , i will not impute it to you : which words you leave out in your allegation against me from mr. marshall , whether needlesly or fraudulently , i leave it to your own conscience to consider . sect. iii. of the third crimination , that i deny to the jewish infants all right to the new covenant till they become actuall believers , from whence occasion is taken to shew the insufficiency of mr. gerees shift in expounding the words of the directory [ the promise is made to believers and their seed ] and the insufficiency of mr. marshals proof of connexion between the seal and covenant from god's institution , and mr. baylies from the nature of the termes . as for the third accusatio● , you bring not a word to prove it , yet you often charge sometimes all your adversaries , as in chap. 5. pag. 133. sometimes the principall of them ( among whom i assure my self , you reckon me ) with it , as when you say , pag. 151. ch. 5. the ground of this reason is granted by the principal of our adversaries , who avow their exclusion of infants from baptisme upon this ground mainely , that they believe they are excluded from the covenant of grace , remission of sins , the saving grace of the spirit , till in the years of d●scretion they be brought actually to believe , which thing i do expresly deny in my exercitation pa. 24. with obhorrency from it , and examen page 150. and page 109. i say , it were a madnesse to go about to put them out of the covenant of grace . you are often told in my examen as page 29 , 38 , 110 , 154. and many more places , that i avow exclusion of infants from baptism upon this ground mainly , that there is no institution of it gathered by precept or apostolical example , and therefore it is will-worship : as for a command of circumcision i conceive it is a brogated , and so can be no rule now about baptism ; and the maintaining that a command of circumcision sti●l binds us ( as mr. marshall doth in his sermon page 35 , 36 , 37. ) is the most manifest heresie of any , as being condemned in the first councel by the apostles , acts 15. 28. & 21. 25. indeed to shew the weaknesse of mr. marshalls argument thus framed , the infants of believing parents are within the covenant of grace , therefore they are to partake of the seale of the covenant , which in mr. marshals language is all one with baptisme : i did say that i did conceive the antecedent of his enthymeme not true , examen part 3. sect. 1. page 39. conceiving that as your practise is , so mr. marshall intended to defend this conclusion ; all the infants born of a believer by profession are to be baptized according to ordinary rule , and so i expressed my selfe in my examen part 3. sect. 15. exercit. page 1. and elsewhere , and then his antecedent must be thus , all the infants born of a believer are within the covenant of grace , or else his argument is manifestly inconcludent ; if we would prove , all infants of believers are to be baptized , because some onely are in the covenant of grace . now i know not how to conceive that mr. marshall meant any other , then the covenant of saving grace ( of which i have given reasons not yet answered by mr. marshall , in my examen page 45. and could adde more if it were needful ) and that the believers infants were in the covenant of saving grace in that god hath made that promise to them . and in this sense i denied this proposition , all the infants of a believer are within the covenant of grace , and disproved it so fully in my examen part 3. sect. 4. that mr. marshall renounceth that proposition in that sense page 116. of his defence , and then betakes himself to this shift , to understand it of the outward covenant as he calls it , in which sense i have proved in my apology sect. 10. his first argument to be meer trifling , and his speeches to be full of equivocation , or ambiguity , which i have also further proved in my postscript in answer to mr. bl●ke sect. 6. mr. geree being inforced to deny that proposition in that sense , and being pressed by me with the words of the directory , [ that the promise is made to believers and their seed ] he shifted it off in his vindiciae paedobaptismi page 13. by interpreting the words of the directory thus , this is to be presumed by men out of charity , till they discover the contrary , that all the infants of believers have the inward graces of the covenant , which i proved could not be the sense of the words of the directory in my apol●gy sect. 9. especially from the term [ made ] which imports gods act , not mans charitable presumption . now what doth mr. geree reply hereto ? in his vindiciae vindic●arum chap. 4. page 16. he alters the words of the directory thus , that the promise is to believers and their seed , leaving out the word [ made ] upon which my argument rested , and then page 18. tells me , the quaery is in what sense and in what respect children of b●lievers are said to be in the covenant of grace , whereas the quaery is in what sense the directory meant these words [ the promise is made to believers and their seed ] not in what sense either in gen. 17. 7. or rom. 9. 4. or acts 3. 25. children of believers are said to be in the covenant of grace . and whereas mr. geree in the same book cha. 10. page 41. complains of my words in the epistle dedicatory of my apology , that the doctrine of the directory is disavowed by two of my most eminent antagonists , meaning himself and mr. marshall , i have , and am further ready to justify that speech , and if many of the assembly have assured him in private , that they intended the expressions questioned by me in no other sense then he expounded them , i would have them know , that either they must alter the words as mr. geree doth , not reading them as they are printed , and as mr. marshall in his defence page 116. mr. geree vindic. paedobap . page 13. reads them , or else those assembly men must make a new dictionary for us to understand their language by afore any man that understands common english will understand them so . and whereas he would have by this one examination men iudge of all the rest , i am contented with it , provided that men by his superficial and shifting dealing in this judge of all the rest . but to returne , as i denyed the antecedent in mr. marshalls enthymeme , so i denied the consequence page 36. and did more then make some v●litatio● , i proved by a just dispute that the proposition is not true , all that are in the covenant of grace must be sealed , and though mr. marshall page 92. of his defence , say somewhat to prove it from gods will gen. 17. 7 , 9 , 10 , 14. yet what is said there is only of circumcision , nothing of baptisme , and the word [ therefore ] upon which mr. marshalls proof rests is in the hebrew {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} which may be and is translated otherwise , as by the tig●r●●es et tu by parreus tu autem , by piscator tu vere , &c. and the proposition is manifestly false in mr. marshalls sense , yea he granted page 92 , 182. that the formal reason of their being circumcised was the command of god , which i truely observed and proved in my apology in the epistle dedicatory and in the apology it self page 90. overthrows his argument from the covenant to the seale , which rests on this , that such as received the initial seal , received it because they were in the covenant , which are mr. marshalls words in his defence page 92. you in your anabaptisme chap. 5. page 132. say , your proposition is grounded on the nature of the terms , which you never go about to prove but dictate thus : the major , [ whoever have right to the chief promises of the new testament , they have right to the first sacrament of the new testament , if the lord have not put some impediment to their participation of that sacrament ] is grounded on the nature of the terms of the preposition the chief promises of the new testament , and the first sacrament , this is the sign and seal , that the thing signified . the reason proceeds not from every thing signified to every sign but from the chief thing signified to the first signe . give me leave to tell you that i seldome meet with a passage that hath more absurdity then this of yours . 1. you set not down right the terms of your own proposition , which are not [ the chief promises of the new testament , and the first sacrament ] but [ having right to the chief promises of the new testament , and having right to the first sacrament , if the lord have not put some impediment to their participation of that sacrament ] as if you had forgotten so soon or could not analyse your own proposition . 2. you tell us [ this is the sign and seale , that the thing signified ] as if this were the nature of the terms . but what an illogical conceit is this ? logicians call a reason from the nature of the terms , when the terms are included , the one in conceptu quidditativo alterius , so as that the one cannot be conceived without the other . now may not the chief promises of the new testament be conceived without the first sign and seale ? did not god make the chief promises of the new and old testament before ever any sign or seale was appointed , much more before baptisme ? did not god make the chief promise {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} tit. 1. 2. which we translate before the world began , most rig●tly as i conceive dr. ●wisse vind● . grat . lib. 1. par . 1. dig . 2. cap. 5. referres to that in paradise gen 3. 15. your own mr. dicksor , either to that or to gods promise to christ afore the world was made , all i meet with make it antecede any first signe or seal of the old or new testament ? now how is there a connexion between terms from the nature of them , whereof one may not only be conceived , but be also existent both de facto and d●iure without the other ? if the terms were [ having the chief promises of the new testament , and having the first sacrament ] yet there is no such connexion from the nature of the terms . innumerable may have , and have the chief promises of the new testament , that have not the first sacrament , et vice versa . else you must hold worse positions then the papists that none but baptized persons have or can have the chief promises of the new testament , and that every baptized person hath the chief promises of the new testament . there is lesse connexion from the nature of the terms between the having right to the chief promises of the new testament , & having right to the first sacrament of the new testament . for if you meane it of right before god , thousands may have right in gods election and covenant with christ , that are not in being , that are in their mothers womb , that are yet among infidels uncalled : have these right to the first sacrament ? if you mean it of right in facie ecclesiae onely , then i grant the proposition is true : but your minor hath clean another sense then your words and proofs import you conceived of it : however this right comes meerly from gods institution , which is to be the rule of the churches judging and administrators action , and that is not from the right to the chief promises , but from profession of faith arising from gods will not the nature of the terms . there is no essential connexion between them constitutive or consecutive , neither is one of the definition or essential property to the other : and god hath much more plainly put a barre against infant-baptisme then infant-communion , not only in that there is neither expresse precept nor example for it in scripture , but also the very in●titution excludes them , appointing it only to disciples mat. 28. 19. putting believing before baptisme mark 16. 16. & in practise requiring it act. 8. 37. besides the image of it in all ages of the church requiring profession of faith of some for them even in the baptisme of infants . but you shew the nature of the terms in these words , this is the sign and seal , that the thing signified . by your logick then if the chief promises of the new testament be to be defined you would define them to be the thing signified by the first sacrament of the new testament : which were to define ignotum per ignotius , and by that which is meerly extrinsecal to it . a promise is an action : the thing signified by the first sacrament is not only something to come but also something past as the death , burial , resurrection of christ in baptisme rom. 6. 3 , 4. col. 2. 12. the thing promised is something we are to have , the promise is gods act , the first sacrament the administrators act . how inept a definition is such a definition in which the genus doth not praedic●●i in quid on the definitum , ●or the whole definition is reciprocal with the definitum , besides other defects ? but it maybe you meant that it is of the nature of the first sacrament to be a sign and s●ale of the chief promises of the new testament . were this so , you should not rightly argue : for then the right to the promises should be derived from the seal , not to the seale from the promise , if the promise be of the nature of the seale , and not e●contra : wher●as you say that your reason proceeds from the chief thing signifyed to the first sign . but how can you or any make this good that it is the nature of the first sacrament only ( for you exclude the second expressely after in these words , nor do we 〈◊〉 but of the 〈…〉 ) to be a signe and seale of the chief promises of the new testament ? is not the second sign as wel a sign and seal of them as the first ? besides what is the term [ seale ] there but a metaphor ? and is it not absurd to make a metaph●r of the nature of a term , which doeth not shew what a thing is but what it is like , contrary to the rule of logicians ? scheibler . ●op . ●a . 30. num . 126. definitio non sit ex verbis metaphoricis . ita aristot. top. lib. 2. cap. 2. sect 4 k● ker●● syst. logi● . lib. 1. sect. 2. cap. 2. &c. yet how absurdly is a seale of the covenant made the genus in the definition of a sacrament being but a metaphor , and books and sermons stuffed with collections of duties and priviledges about the sacraments from a meer metaphor ? a thing i am assured worthy lamentation when i consider the trouble it hath brought to many consciences , and disquiet in the church . but were it granted that the term , signe or seal were of the nature of the first sacrament , how doth it appear that it is the nature of the sacrament to signifie gods promise to us rather then our promise to god ? though i deny not but baptisme signifies and in a sense seales gods promises to us , as may be seen in my former writings , yet so farre as i am able to discern the chief and primary use is to signifie our profession and promise to god , and therefore it is required as our act and duty , and therein we are said to put on christ . and why then should we not rather say , that it is the nature of baptisme to be a sign or seale of our profession , and then we have a better argument from the nature as you speak , from the use , as i would speak , of the first sacrament to prove that infants are not to be baptized , then that they are . the trueth is sacraments are not signes natural but positive , and so have no nature to sign or seale but by institution , and therefore there 's no connexion , or right between the covenant and seal , as they speak , from the nature of the tenns , but by gods institution . and therefore mr. marshall did more considerately ascribe it to gods will , then you do to 〈◊〉 it from the nature of the terms , you miscarry as much in that which followes when you say , the reason proceeds not from every thing signified to every sign , but from the chief thing signified to the first sign : yet before you expressed the nature of the terms thus , the one is the sign , the other the thing signified , and you give no reason why there should be more connexion between the chief things signified , and the first sign , then the not chief things signified , and the second , nor do i know by what rule you proceed in making some promises of the new testament chief , and some not : it follows , some of the blessings which circumcision diaseal belonged to melchizedeck , to lo● to job , and others who were not so farre as we reade circumcised , but the main promise sealed by circumcision , in thy seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed , the messias comming of the posterity of abraham , isaac and jacob , the covenant of grace as it was administred under the figure of the ceremoniall law did belong to the people of israel alone , ●nd to the proselytes who joined themselves to their body . you intimate truly that the reason of circumcising infants was not taken from the common right of believers to the covenant of grace , but from the end god had in signifying christ to come of abraham , which is a good evidence that baptizing infants now hath not the same reason that circumcising of infants had then , and so all your argument from the analogy between infant-baptisme and infant-circumcision from the like reason of both falls to the g●ound : but sure the main promise of the new testament did belong to 〈◊〉 , lot and job as much as to believers now , and if righteousnesse by faith be sealed by circumcision , as you expressely teach page 141. from rom. 4. 11. then the main promise sealed by circumcision belonged to melchizeck , lot and job , and so if there be such a connexion between the chief promise and the first seale they should have been circumcised as well as the jewes : and it is as strange to me how you can make the promise of the messias comming from abraham belonging to proselytes more then to them . but this is enough to give a taste of your manner of disputing . but i must follow you , you go on . sect. iv. of the fourth crimination , that i give a power to unbaptized persons to baptize others . in giving a power to unbaptized persons to baptize others . for proof of this you referre the reader to the letters bb page 111. and there i find one passage of mr. marshall● , which only declares his own conceit , and one passage of mine from my apology page 54. which speaks not at all of that point , but of another , whether in any case an unbaptized person may receive the lords supper . as for that you charge me with , i remember not where i have spoken to it in my printed writings . but for the thing it self . if no continuance of adult-baptisme can be proved , and baptisme by such baptized persons is wanting , yet i conceive , what ma●y protestant writers do yield , when they are pressed by the papists to shew the calling of the first reformers , that after an universal corruption the necessity of the thing doth justify the persons that reforme though wanting an ordinary , regular calling ( which thing i find fully avouched by the ministers sent to oxford in their account given to the parliament page 28 , 29. ) will justify in such a case both the lawfulnesse of a ministers baptizing , that hath not been rightly baptized himself , and the sufficiency of that baptisme to the person so baptized . and this very thing , that in a case where a baptized minister cannot be had , it is lawfull for an unbaptized person to baptize , and his baptisme is valid , is both the resolution of aquinas parte 3. q. 67. art . 5. and lanchius an eminent protestant comment . in ephes. 5. 26. loc. 2. part . 2. cap. 4. num . 21. quaeritu● an is possit baptizare eos quos ad christum convert● , cum ipse nunquam fuerit baptizatus baptismo aquae ? non dubito quin possit , & vicissim curare , ut ipse ab alio ex illis a se conversis baptizetur . ratio est : quia minister est verb : , à christo extra ordinem excitatus : eoque ut talis minister , potest cum illius eccles●olae consens● , symm●stam constituere , & ab eo ut baptizerer curare . whereby you may perceive that this is no new truth , that an unbaptized person ●ay in some case baptize another , and he baptize him being baptized of him . and if you hold it so hainous a positier , you might do well to answer mr. spil●●ry his reasons in his book intituled the sa●nt interest , chiefly page 10. which book you cite in the third and fourth chapters of your anabaptisme , though in your third chapter you mistake , in alleadging words as mr. spilsberie's , which are in the preface to the book made by mr. cox. sect. v. of the fifth crimination , that i make apologies for the worst of the anabaptists . in making apologies for the worst of the anabaptists even those of munster . and in the margin and the table in the end of your book , you say of me , he is a friend to the worst anabaptists , and injurious to all who oppose them . and for proofe of this you referre the reader to the letters cc , where is one passage cited out of my apology page 31. which hath not a word of apology or friendship for , or towards any of the evil practises of the anabaptists ; but you might have read in the next page before , a professed abhorring of their wicked practises , and judging them worse in them , then they would be in others not so baptized . as for the words you alledge , they contain onely a declaration of my suspension of my judgement concerning some things related of them for reasons there alledged . in which suspension i am the more confirmed by your palpably ●●righteous , if not malicious dealing with me in these accusations . and i conceive your , mr. marshal's , and other paedobaptists dealing in mis-reporting of me and others will better serve for their apology , then my words . 't is true , i endeavour to remove that prejudice against the truth of antipaedobaptisme , which your , and other mens bitter writings and preachings create to it in your charging the miscarriages of muncer , and at munster and some others upon the doctrine it self , never considering that now for a long time no such miscarriages are charged upon them justly , they live as peaceably as other men , their doctrine disclaimes them , the like miscarriages have been in removing other evils that are confessed to be such , as in the iconoclasts , antiprelatists , &c. which you would think it to be unrighteous to charge on those that have sought the removing of images , prelacy and ceremonies . why then do you deale so unjustly with others , forgetting that golden rule of christ mat. 7. 12. whatsoever ye would that men should do to you , do you even so to them : for this is the law and the prophets ? whereto let me adde that reading lately in grimstones general history of the netherlands lib. 9. pag. 442. that the inquistion of spain advised the king of spain in these words art . 7. they shall hire at our charge thieves and spoylers of churches and images , whose offences shall be by all the world imputed to the rebells , by some subtil meanes , and so we shall vanquish them . i conceived my speech in my apology page 31. ( which you interpret as very hainous ) considerately , when i said , i do count the story of the anabaptists to contain in it many things , the true reasons of which , and the true knowledge of the circumstances concerning them will not appear till the day of the revelation of the righteous iudgement of god . and i confesse it makes me somewhat suspicious that in these daies by jesuiticall emissaries horrid opinions , and unruly practises are vented ; and attempted to make the party that are for reformation , and truth at this day odious to the world . sect. vi . of the sixth crimination inveighing against the first reformers . and invectives against the best that oppose them ; the first reformers . for proof hereof you referre the reader to the letters dd page 111. where is alledged one passage of my apology in page 32. which hath not a word of invectivenesse against the first reformers , much lesse any invective against the best that opposed the anabaptists at munster , but only in as mild an expression as i could desire , a declaration of my opinion , that the reformed churches have beene to blame that they never yielded to reforme paedobaptisme in a regular way . will not you say the saxon churches have been to blame in not taking away of images out of churches , the english churches in not removing prelacy and ceremonies ? yet you would think he wronged you , that should say , that in that speech you made an invective against those churches . yet this is your dealing with me . sect. vii . of the seventh crimination inveighing against the assembly at westminster . the assembly at westminister . for proof hereof you referre the reader to the letters e e page 111. where is cited one passage out of my apology page 106. which hath not a word of exception against any man , much lesse of invectivenesse against the assembly at westminster : only it contains the expression of my belief that the ablest of the assembly contrived mr. marshalls book , and my wish , that it were declared whether the paedobaptists would stick to it or any other work : which i conceive a reasonable wish , finding the proteus-like inconstancy of paedobaptists in many points of the dispute between us , particularly in the chief argument from circumcision and the covenant gen. 17. to infant-baptism , one forming the argument one way , another another way , one deriving the connexion between the covenant and initial seal from the nature of the terms , another from gods will , one ascribing an interest in the outward covenant only to all infants of believers , another ascribing an interest to them in the inward covenant also according to charitable presumption , another conditionally , another asserting the covenant of grace to belong to them for the most part , one grounding infant-baptisme on the judgement of charity , another denying that sufficient : and requiring a judgement of faith , one stating the question concerning all infants of believers , another concerning some only , one interpreting 1 cor. 7. 14. of federal holinesse , another of real holinesse , one waving the argument from succession of baptisme to circumcision , another avouching it , with many other differences , which tend to the wearying of a disputant and the e●ud●●g of a reader that desires to find truth , and to spend time in examining what is fixed , not to lose it in disputing against that which one will own , but it m●y be most will disclaim . what the assembly have done in this matter doth not yet answer this wish . what is said in the direstory , it may be well doubted whether assembly-men now hold , by that which hath pa●●ed between me and mr. marshal and mr. geree , about the proposition , [ the promise is made to believers and their seed , ] what is said in their ●dvice concerning a confession of faith ch. 28. art. 4. is so farre from satisfying , that it is yet a riddle to me how infant-baptisme can be drawn from ge● . 17. 7 , 9. with gal. 3. 9 , 14. which i remember not alledged by any paedobaptists since i entered on the dispute , save what i heard from mr. herl● now the prolo●utor ; ( which i mention in my apology page 41. ) which he did with so little evidence for his purpose , as i supposed it had been his own peculiar conceit , not the assemblies argument . and for the rest of the texts , if the assembly can say any more the● mr. marsh●ll and others have said for deducing of paedobaptisme out of them , it were fit it should be known , if not , i for my part count my self as much unsatisfyed by the assemblies alledging impertinent texts , as by a private mars doing the same . this i declare to give the reason of that speech of mine in my apology . as for the assembly though i have expressed my jealousie of some defects in them , and perhaps shall not agree with them in all their determinations , yet i have cast no filth in their faces , as mr. 〈◊〉 injuriously accused me , even for my good will to them ; but have 〈◊〉 and spoken respectively of them , as ex●men page 1. studying what i could to prevent those blemishes in their proceedings and determinations , which will in time more appear then yet they do , and am induced to believe that there are so many of them therein that know me so well , as that they would be loath to disclaim me , whatever they do of my opinion . and though mr. 〈◊〉 in his suspension suspende page 21. saith , mr. 〈…〉 is approved by the ass●mbly , and so takes his book to be approved by them ; and you count my words of that book to be an invective against the asse●●ly : yet i do not take it to be approved by the ass●m●ly till they declare it to be so , though i have reason to conceive , that divers of the ablest of the assembly , especially in some part of learning , had their hand in it . sect. viii . of the eighth crimination inveighing against the church of scotland . the church of scotland . for proofe of this you refene the reader to the letters f f page 112. in which you cite one passage of my apology page 93. which doth not so much as mention any church , much lesse the church of scotland , but onely the mannagers of the censure of juridical excommunication , whom however the pap●st : & prelates use to speak , i think you use not to call the church of scotland , nor do i . nor is there a word of invectivenesse aginst any in those wordes , but only a declaration , what i question upon my best intelligence which had lesse reference to scotland , then to other parts of the world . sect. ix . of the nineth crimination , inveighing against mr. marshal . master marshal . for proofe hereof you referre your reader to the letters g g page 112. and there you cite two passages out of my apology : one of which page 57. is this . i find the words of an intelligent man true concerning mr. marshal , that he was apt to mistake , and in the other page 69. i say , that i find him still a confused disputer : which indeed containes some complaint of mr. marshal , much lesse then i had cause : but not any invective , which i take to be an oration against a man to make him odious , such as t●llies philippicks against antonius , and demosthenes against philip , and nazia●zen against julian . sect. x. of the tenth crimination , of inveighing against mr. tho. goodwin . master goodwin . for proofe hereof you referre the reader to the letters h h page 112. and there you cite two shreds of a large passage concerning an accusation of mr. marshal , in which he chargeth me as vilifying mr. thomas goodwin , which charge i there answer , and then use some words which are not invective , but a declaration , what i conceived of his discourse , which if it may not be allowed in dispute the best writers among us will be condemned dr. twisse , mr. gataker , and your brethren mr. rutherfurd , mr. gillespy , your self , and who not ? your own words in the first part of your dissuasive page 119. do come neerer to an invective against mr. thomas goodwin , then any words in my apology or examen ; the former of which the licenser although mr. goodwins tender friend , yet judged mil● . sect. xi . of the eleventh crimination , of invectives against others . and others . for proof of this you referre the reader to h h 2. page 112. where you cite two passages of my apology , the one containing no accusation , no nor so much as a complaint against any one , but onely a mention of my experiment , which i wish the case of doctor twisse ( that i instance in no other ) had not verified ; the other passage is no invective against any but meerly an applying of mr. ley's words to my treatise , which he had avowed of my antagonists writings . sir , i suppose it would better have suited with charity , i living the last summer at the temple not farre from you , if you had in a brotherly way minded me of my flying h●gh , of my in●ivility , or in●is●retion , that i might have seene your love in your reproof , afore i saw your accusation to my disgrace in print . but you add more accusations of me , and say . but in those thing he goes farre beyond all the anabaptists i have met with . sect. xii . of the twelfth crimination , that i esteem baptisme an unnecessary rite . first he esteems baptism so unnecessary a rite that men who are meet to receive it may very well be without it , as constantine , ambrose and others did delay to their old age that sacrament . and in the margine , and table at the end of your book . he makes baptisme a rite needlesse either to young or old , and for proof whereof you referre the reader to the letters ii page 112. and those letters referre to b b suprà , where two passages are cited , one of mr. marshals , which onely declares his own conceit about another point , that supposing infant-baptisme a nullity he cannot understand how any in the world should this day be lawfully baptized , and another passage out of my apology page 54. which is cited by you maimedly as psalm 91. 11. was cited math. 4. 6. leaving out five lines that come between [ perplexities ] and [ for besides ] without any &c. perverting thereby the sense , as if the words [ for besides , &c. ] were a reason of that you cite before , whereas they are a reason of that which i expresse ; but you leave out , that i do not think an unbaptized person receiving the lords supper is either such a new opinion or practise , as mr. marshall made it . and yet in the words as you cite them , there is no proof of that you charge me with . there is no mention at all of ambrose , and that which i mention of constantine is done without any approbation . nor will it follow from my determination , that because i say , if it be stood upon in point of conscience , so as in no case an unbaptized person is to be permitted to partake of the lords supper , it will of necessity make many superstitious perplexities in ministers , and inferre many an unnecessary schisme ; therefore i esteem baptisme a needlesse rite , that men who are meet to receive it may very well be without it . this argument ( and such i take your proof to be ) i would say , if i may use that schoole expression any more , is a baculo ad angulum . and yet a man would think you had need of a strong proof to make men believe that i hold baptisme a needlesse rite , who have suffered and still suffer very much for my opposing infant-baptisme . but my words truly understood do inferre the contrary to that you charge me with , sith they assert baptisme afore the lords supper necessary to be stood upon in point of prudence for right order , and intimate the like in point of conscience except in some cases . when i consider this dealing with me i cannot guesse why you should thus abuse me in this so credible a thing , unlesse you would slily insinuate as if i were of the socainians mind in this , and thereby help to loade me with the most unbrotherly charge of socinianizing begun by mr. marshal in the beginning of his defence , for which the lord forgive him and you . sect. xiii . of the thirteenth crimination , that i am carelesse of my own baptisme . and it seems himself is carelesse to be baptized to this day . for his infant-baptisme according to his arguments must be null , & another baptism as yet it seems he hath not received . here you accuse me of carelesness of my own baptism . but , sir , let me tell you , that unlesse you knew it by my own confession ( which i am sure you did not ) you go beyond your line to judge my secret practises , yea my very thoughts , for carelessenes is a privation of cares which are thoughts . you say , i am a very bold man , but you no where find in me such boldnesse as this to judge a mans thoughts . you might do well to remember what is said mat. 7. 1. james 3. 1. but for the thing you say , my infant-baptisme according to my arguments must be null , and as yet it seems i have not received another baptisme . let it be granted that my infant-baptisme according to my arguments must be null , that is as i understand insufficient for the doing of the duty of being baptized according to christs appointment ( which yet you have not so much as attempted to prove ) and that i have not yet received another baptism , how doth this prove my carelessenesse of mine own baptisme ? for if it were true indeed that according to my arguments my infant-baptisme were null , yet if it did not so appear to me ( as i confesse i was once doubtful , as my words exercit. pag. 22. shew , conceiving the maine use of baptisme being a confirming of my profession of christ , by that right an after profession might ratify a former baptisme though not every way right , though i dare not rest upon that conceit ) and therefore i did not receive another baptisme , that would prove i was not altogether carelesse of my own baptisme . but what ? if i did conceive my infant-baptisme a nullity , and yet doubted whether any could now be rightly baptized , because no unbaptized person can give baptism , as mr. marshall professeth in his defence page 245. or because none can now give the spirit , and therefore received not baptisme yet , this might free me from your charge of carelesnesse of my own baptisme . again if i were resolved that right baptism might be had notwithstanding these doubts , and were resolved to receive it , but either waited to see what the assembly would do about examining the point of paedobaptisme , or the churches of new england , or how i might do my duty to christ with least offence to the state , or to my brethren in the ministery , and with most satisfaction to my own conscience concerning the administrator , administration and other circumstances about it , i might be rather over-careful then carelesse of my own baptism for ought you knew to the contrary , and consequently your accusation of me might be ( as it was ) both rash and false . will you say the ministers about london , that have differred adminstring the lords supper for many years for want of settled discipline are carelesse of the lords supper ? and yet were not you partial i were more excusable in my action about this thing . but i hope your accusation of me shall do me so much good , as to quicken me to a more sp●edy resolution what to do in this great businesse , though i confesse my over-tendernesse to give● offence to my brethren in the ministery who have shewed little or no tender regard of me , but rather have set themselves to make me odious , to keep me under in my credit and estate , and ( which is excessive impiety ) to hinder me in the work of my ministery of the gospel , hath made me somewhat the slacker in resolving and accomplishing what is my duty in this thing . sect. xiv . of the fourteenth crimination , that i am unwilling to join with any of the anabaptists churches , and they unwilling to baptize non-members . for he professeth an unwillingnesse to ●oine himself as a member to any of the anobaptists churches , and i suppose they are unwilling to baptize any , who will not joine in communion with them . and for proof of the former you referre the reader to the letters k k page 112. at which you cite ( not as they are in my book ) some words of my apology page 10. which neither as they are in mine , or your book do prove my unwillingnesse to joine my self as a member to any of the anabaptists churches . for a man may be willing to joine himself as a member to any of the anabaptists churches , and yet not dare to ga●her a separated church , not every one who joins as a member with a separated church being guilty of a schisme , which a gatherer of a separated church may be guilty of . besides a man may not know how to justify at one time the practise of gathering a separated church or joining with it , who may know how to justify it at another time , when there is no hope of reformation , and men are judged hereticks , and excommunicated for holding truth and doing their duty . the seven dissenting brethren in the assembly had subscribed with fourteen more of the ablest of the assembly to certain considerations to disswade from further gathering of churches in that present juncture of time , to which my words you cite had reference , who it may be now would not disswade from gathering churches . but the truth is my not daring to gather a separated church then was my willingnesse to join with any churches of christ ( and i think as much ill will as you bear to them , yet you will not dare to say , that none of the anabaptists churches are churches of christ ) though i was not willing to be a separating member in any church but willing to be a conjoined member with all the churches of christ in general , and each in particular : so farre is your allegation from proving what you charge me with that it proves the contrary . and for that you say , that you suppose the anabaptists churches are unwilling to baptize any who will not joine in communion with them , if you meane thus , they will not baptize any who will not joine in communion with them as fixed members entring into the covenant called church-covenant , and professing the way of discipline called the congregational way as the only way , and separaring from any church of christ that is in any other way of discipline ( for not doing which it seems you conceive them unwilling to admit me to baptisme ) i have cause to think you are mistaken . for having upon occasion of these your words written to an elder of one of their churches intreating him to consult with some others , and to give me resolution in these questions . 1. what joining in communion do you require without which you will not b●ptize any ? 2. whether on my profession of my repentance and ●aith in the lord jesue , and readinesse to hold communion with all the churches of christ in the things of christ , though i do not promise to be a fixed member in any of their congregations , you would admit me to baptisme ? i received this following answer subscribed by three graduates in schooles , godly and learned men in these words : that which we require and without which we will not baptize any is a persons manifestation of himselfe to be a believer in jesus christ , and to desire baptisme according to the revealed will of christ , and in obedience thereunto , we do not baptize any into this or that particular congregation : but only into that one body in general spoken of 1 cor. 12. 13. as touching joining in communion , we in this case require no more , then a manifest readinesse to hold communion with all the churches of christ in the things of christ , and accordingly to shew a real willingnesse to have communion with any particular church of christ according as the hand of god shall give opportunity , and true seasonablenesse of and for the same . thus we judge and practise accordingly . benjamen cox. henry jesse . hanserd knollys . i do testifie the substance hereof to be the professed judgement of that congregation whereto i am joined , and also that congregation , where mr. kiffin , patient , and spilsbery are joined , who did affirm so much to be their own judgement also . the scripture upon which we so practise is that acts 8. 37 , 38. hanserd knollys . sect. xv . of the fifteenth crimination , of my allowing frequent rebaptization . secondly when a man is baptized according to his own minde , he allowes him to be oft thereafter rebaptized , even so oft as he repents for sin , which by the godly is done ( as the least ought to be done ) oftener then once . and in the margin and the table at the end of your book , he allowes a frequent rebaptizing : and for proof you referre your reader to the letters l l page 112. and there you send your reader back to the letter c supr● . now after you had said : but to put the equity of this reproof out of doubt , their great patrons now are come to defend the lawfulnesse of baptisme not onely twice , but if ye will ten times ; yea so oft as you repent for sin , which ought to be oftner , then once a day . so of anabaptists they become hemerobaptists , and more , for proof of this you refer the reader to the letter c , and there you alledge one passage in my examen page 23. and another passage in my apology page 53. and a relation of unnamed eminent divines . it is true , that to shew the unreasonable dealing of those that made rebaptization an heresie , i did intreate one good argument to prove it unlawful in se for a man that hath been baptized rightly to be baptized againe , and to shew the weaknesse of the arguments brought to prove it unlawful in se to rebaptize , i breiefly answered the two chief , the latter wherof seems to be that upon which the assembly rested , in that they alledge , to prove this proposition , the sacrament of baptisme is but once to be administred to any person , onely the text tit. 3. 5. where god is said to save us by the washing of regeneration . advice for confession of faith , chap. 28 , art . 7. and then i added , that if there were as good example for paedobaptisme , as that of acts 19. 5 , 6. for rebaptizing , the controversie concerning paedobaptisme were at an end with me . in which passage i did not assert the proof to be good for rebaptizing ; but compared with the proof for paedobaptisme to be better , that is more probable then the other , and such as if i had had but the like for paedobaptisme i had not moved any more about it . which i wrote , because i knew that very many writers both antient and latter do very probably from expresse words in that place conceive , that paul did rebaptize , whereas there is not any probability , that any infa●t was baptized by the apostles ; nor have the antients ( that i know ) ever gone about to prove it from any example in the acts of the apostles but by tradition . but in all this i did not at all set down my judgement of the thing , whether rebaptizing were lawful or not , but onely questioned the proofes alledged to make it unlawful , whether they yielded good arguments . i know there was another argument from circumcision but once : but i did not think that argument worth answering , nor do i yet , notwithstanding mr. mar●hals esteem of it , nor it may seeme would the assembly build on it by their omitting it in the place before quoted . i still professe , that i reject all arguments drawn since the apostles from analogy of rites or customes of the jewes in meer positive things so as to conclude thence any thing to bind us as uredivino by gods appoinntment . and i conceive they serve for no better purpose , then to cause much wrangling , to fill people with superstitions , and to weary schollers , and that they better fit papists and prelates turns , then independents or presbyterians . and i was sorry to reade in your brother gillespy his aarons rod blossoming book 1 cha. 3. page 15. that from 2 chr. 19. 8 , 10 , 11. the reverend and learned assembly of divines have drawn an argument for ruling elders , hoping they would have discarded all such arguments . but i said also examen page 84. i conceive it true , that there is no necessity of administring either circumcision or baptism above once : but a demonstrative argument to prove it an heresie or unlawfull in it self to rebaptize i yet expect . these passages mr. marshall page 67. of his defence sayes , do clearly discover my itch after new opinions . but this was inconsiderately & uncharitably said , sith my words lead him 〈◊〉 another reason of those passages , though it were but intimated , which is the misery and mischief which comes by mens magisterial determinations of heresies and errors , and binding mens consciences with a pretended jure divino upon topical reasons , it being the cause of many schismes , and much hatred between christians , and is the true cause of 〈◊〉 confusions and warres betweene christians , that arise upon difference of opinion in matters of religion . i said indeed , that mr. marshals reasons were not convincing to me , nor is the holding of rebaptization such a new opinion as he would make it . but how do any passages of my examen page 23. or my apology page 53. prove that which you charge me with , that when a man is baptized according to my own mind i allow him to be oft thereafter rebaptized , even so oft as he repents for sin , which by the odly is done , at least ought to be done every day oftner then once , that i allow of a frequent rebap●ization , that to put the equity of the reproach of rebaptizing out of doubt , i ( whom you dubbe the anabaptists great patron , though indeed a patron of nothing , but truth , and right ) am now come to defend the lawfulnesse of baptisme not onely twice , but if ye will ten times , yea so oft as you repent for sin , which ought to be oftner then once a day , so of anabaptists they become hem●robaptists and more . but you have a tale of some eminent divines to help you out , that in my sermon before the house of commons ( for to whom else [ his ] can refene i see not , there being no other but mr. marshal and my selfe mentioned in that paragraph ) i did avow in terminis , that it is no fault to baptize ten times . now sure those eminent divines , and your self by hearkening to them , and reporting this in print without ever speaking or writing to me about it , though i lived not farre from you or them , do shew that to be true , which is every where complained of , that rigid presbyterians are very apt to receive false reports , and to publish them of any that dissent from them , that they rake into every dunghil to find some filth to throw into the faces of their brethren , and therefore godly persons are very unwilling to come under their yoke . but that you may know the plain truth , i never yet preached a sermon before the house of commons , nor in such sermon did avow in terminis , that it is no fault to baptize ten times . i have enquired about this tale , and it is conjectured by some , that this tale was hatched out of a passage of a sermon of mr. wal●er cradock before the house of commons july 21. 1646. on 1 john 1. 3 , 4. page 28. which was this , when i have communion with a saint i must not looke whether he be of such an opinior , or whether he have taken the covenant , or have been baptized ●nce or twice or ten times , but see if he have fellowship with the father , and with jesus christ , which it 's likely was misreported ; and made him in the margine put these words : i speak not this as if my opinion were for rebaptization , &c. this forwardnesse to misreport things done now , as it discovers much ill affection in mens spirits , and that the presbyterian spirit , when persons grow factious , will run into undue courses as well as the anabaptistick spirit ; so it gives much cause to considerate men to doubt whether many things reported of the anabaptists heretofore , and all taken up in your dragge-net whether true or false ( which are the best pillar you have to uphold the great corruption of paedobaptism or paedorantism as now it deserves to be stiled ) were true as they were reported . sect. xvi . of the sixteenth crimination , that i make it lawful for persons unbaptized to partake of the lords supper . as for that you charge me with when you say , thirdly he makes it lawfull for persons before they be baptized to partake of the lords supper , and referre your reader to mm and thence to bb and chapter 3. pag. 53. when you say , and some of their greatest doctors hold it in no wise incongruous to admit persons to the lords table before they be baptized , and for this you cite my words page 54. of my apology , had you dealt candidly with me , you should have set down my opinion as i propound it , which was that in some case it might be permitted . but neither you nor mr. marshall have dealt fairely with me in this matter . you set not down my opinion rightly , but leave out the limitation which did rightly state my opinion , and mr. marshall pag. 167. of his defence misreports me , that i confesse i find no example of an unbaptized person receiving the lords supper , and neither youn or mr. marshall do take upon you to answer my reasons , which are either in my examen pag. 85. or in my apology pag. 53 , 54. but onely censure me for freaks and outleaps , and a spice of itch after new opinions for propounding my opinion with reasons about a case of conscience , which troubles many , and is of very frequent occurrence , in a place that lead me to speak of it . but it seems neither mr. marshall nor your self are willing to let any thing passe , that may make me odious , or ridiculous , though you do but shew your own inconsideratenesse , and uncharitablenesse , the like dealing you use towards me in the following charges . sect. xvii . of the seventeenth crimination , that i am a compleate erastian , wherein reason is given of my doubt , that in scripture no such juridicall excommunication is appointed as is now contended for . you say , fourthly , to shew how little inclineable he is to joine with the anabaptists , he declares himself a compleat erastian . sir , what i said , and to what end , i expressed plainly enough in my apology page 91. the occasion of printing what i conceived , was a passage in mr. marshalls defence , which he stuffed with all the exceptions he could thrust in against my person , but answered little or nothing punctually in the maine points of the dispute , ( which praevarication , i may perhaps in time discover also , in your dispute ( chap. 5. ) of your anabaptisme ) the occasion of speaking in private conference , was , to shew my sensiblenesse of the misery of the land , by reason of the present differences , upon some speech that was moved by some friend of mine , ( as i remember , ) when the assembly brought into the house of commons , their petitior , desiring power to suspend persons from the lords supper for all scandals , without restriction ; and asserted the presbyterian government , ( unto which they advised the parliament , ) to be jure divino , by the will and appointment of jesus christ . what i spake then , and since printed ; was to shew my compassion of my native countrey like to be ruined , by the violent asserting things disputable , to be ure divino ; and thereby necessitating men to oppose , lest conscience be brought in bondage , according to the apostles warning col. 2. 20. it was not ( as you say ) to shew how little inclineable i am to ●oine with the anabaptists . nor did i declare my selfe a compleat erastian in the words you alleadge at the letters nn out of my apology , as you charge me ; but only expresse my doubts ; much lesse did i declare my self a compleate erastian , that is in your sense one that holds with erastus in all things , wherein he differs from beza in the disputes between them . for whereas there are two main points in difference between them , excommunication , and the mixt presbytery ; concerning this latter , my words in my apology speak nothing against it , but rather for it , when i say , and if any assembly of ministers and rulers be set up , for the better discovery of such as live viciously , or do contrary to the christian faith , or worship , that a person be not charged with those evils upon uncertain reports , i think it agreeable to gods will 1 tim. 5. 19. and whereas mr gillespy in his aarons rod blossoming , page 249. hath these words , eras●us pag. 175. hath not spared to say , that the magistrate may in the new testament ( though he might not in the old , ) exercise the ministeriall functior , of he can have so much leasure from his other imployments , and pag. 315. in very truth the erastians ▪ do oppose not only the institution , but the lawfulnesse and agreeablenesse to the word of god of a church-government distinct from the civill ; yet you cannot shew that i hold either of these positions . i confesse i have read erastus his theses & confirmatio thesium ; but i could not do it so exactly , as i would have done it , if i had had beza's book to compare with it . i have read that which mr. rutherford disputes against erastus but it doth not satisfy me , in that he dictates many things without proof , which are most necessary to be proved ; and proves something by the sayings of authors , that deserve to be examined ; and many times omits in reciting his antagonists words , that which is either most or very material ; and makes not his own answers punctual ; which things mr. mather also chargeth him with , about another point ; besides many incoherent , and imperfect speeches , and inserting things impertinent . besides in this dispute ▪ i conceive , mr. rutherford doth yield that , which overthroweth that which he concludeth for . as when in his divine right of church-government chap. 4. q. 1. page 223. he hath these words , it is evident from the text mat. 18. 15. that christ speaks of such sins in a speciall manner committed against me or a particular brother , which are within the verge of my power or his to pardon , as not being yet publickly scandalous . which if true , then it can be meant onely of personal injuries , which alone a private person hath power to pardon , and so is not an institution how to correct scandals under that notion , which mr. gillespy contends so much for , in his aarons rod blossoming , book 2. chap. 9. page 295. and book 3. chap. 2. as for his a●gument from proportior , christ did appoint this to be done in case of civill in●uries , much more in scandals : it hath no strength to impose a thing as by divine institution upon mens consciences ; yea it is no better then a humane invention when only gathered by such reasoning ; such arguments from proportions being weak probations , as rightly mr. rutherford due right of presbyteries chap. 2. sect. 2. page 37. and all logicians acknowledge that an argument à comparatis is but topical , yea easily overthrown if any disparity be assigned . and this is enough ( though much more may be said ) to shew that mat. 18. 15 , 16 , 17. is impertinently alleadged , though it be one of the chief tex●s urged importunately for church-government by prelates , independents , presbyterians , even the assembly it self advice concerning a confession of faith chap. 30. art . 2 , 4. to prove a power of excommunicating for sins as scandalous , and so all scandals . and for the power of the keyes mat. 16. 19. mr. rutherford chap. 3. q. 1. pag. 236. makes the power of the keyes to belong to church-rulers , that are the stewards of the house , and the d●spensers of the heavenly mysteries , but this may be only preaching the gospel , of which the apostle speaks 1 cor. 4. 1. which place is impertinently alleadged in the assemblies confession of faith chap. 27. art . 4. to prove , neither sacrament may be dispensed by any , but a minister of the word lawfull ordained , the scripture no where calling the sacraments mysteries , but the doctrine of the gospel ; however the greek fathers oft call them so . as for binding , and loosing though i conceive dr. hammond hath more exactly disputed this matter in his book of the power of keyes , chap. 4. then others , yet i conceive it more agreeable to other places in matthew ( leaving mr. selden to justify his explication in his preface to his book of the calender of the jewes out of the talmudists as he conceives fit ) as mat. 23. 4. & 11. 28. besides acts 15. 28. revel. 2. 24. luke 11. 46. to draw the metaphor from binding and loosing burdens , rather then prisoners ; which is confirmed in that the phrase is not [ whomsoever ] but [ what things soever ye shall bind on earth ] mat. 18. 18. and this may very well stand with the coherence , signifying gods ratifying in heaven the commands of the apostles , and the church on earth in the matters wherein they are to be obeyed v. 17. and so the binding and loosing belongs not to vindicative judicature as by excommunication , but to stewardly declarative authority what is to be done or not to be done ; and consequently proves not juridical excommunication . i add that mr. gillespy in his aarons rod blossoming book 3. c. p. 412 , 413. will not have binding and loosing by a dogmatical authoritative declaration of the will of christ here excluded , but proves this sense from mat. 28. 20. acts 15. 28. and from the coherence with the 17. v. as for 1 cor. 5. 5. mr. rutherfurd cha. 9. 4 , 5. page 329. denieth not many learned protestants to conceive , that delivering to satan might be a bodily punishment or conjoined therewith , &c. yea he addeth , and the learned molineus denyeth delivering to satan to be expounded of excommunication , and will have the destruction of the flesh to be some bodily tormenting of his body by satar , and so do sundry of the fathers , especially ambrose , hieronymus , augustinus , and chrysostome , though augustin be doubtful ; which if true it will be hard to prove juridical excommunication now contended for from thence . and for the 13. v. if it be read as it may , and ye shall put away , not , therefore put away & {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , not {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , the evil thing , not the evill person , as it 's said to be in a manuscript copy at saint james , and is the more likely , because it seemes to many learned men , that the apostle tooke these phrases {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , v. 2. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , v. 3. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} or {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , from the greek version , deut. 17. 5 , 7. and 22. 21 , 22 ; 24. it will note , not a command , but an event ; and so it may be either expounded impersonally , as deut. 17. 7. ye shall put away the evil , that is , the evil shall be put away from you , or if it be referred to their action , they may be said to do it , because they mourned that he might be taken away , ver. 2. and it was to be done when they were gathered together , ver. 4. now the phrase of taking away from them , compared with those places in deuteronomy , with the apostles speech ver. 5. is more likely to be meant of killing then excommunicating . and the putting it , ver. 13. in such an abrupt manner like to that , deut. 17. 7. doth give great cause to imagine it hath the same sense . but if it be a command , and be referred to excommunication with the judging them that are withir , ver. 12. yet it cannot be gathered from the text that this was the juridical excommunication contended for , invested in some officers , or the people with the officers as superiour judges : but rather by verses 9 , 10 , 11 , 12. precedent , this judging and putting away belongs to every private christian jointly in a constituted church , or severally by themselves . i have read mr. gillespies aarons rod blossoming , and i think the strength of all is in the 9. chapter of his 2. book : in which i doubt whether any of his 21. arguments will prove such a forensical ecclesiastick government , as he contends for . the argument from two distinct governments , and judicatories to censure vicious manners ( in which mr. gillespy in his first book seemes to be most elaberate ) in the jewish policy to prove the like to be among christians is many wayes faulty . it will hardly be proved the priests had peculiar cognizance of scandalous manners , or that any was kept from the sacrifices for moral uncleannesse , much lesse that the reason is good , men were kept away for legal uncleannesse from the sacrifices , ergo much more for moral , or exclusion for legal pollution typifies exclusion for moral in the christian church . you say truly in answer to mr. cotton first part of your dissuasive chap. 7. pag , 172. there is no argumenting from symbolick types except where the spirit of god in scripture appl●es a type to such a signification and use . nor is the jewish policy a patterne for us . if it were we must have a bishop answering to an high priest , a parliament consisting of bishops and nobles , as they had their synedrium at jerusalem of priests and elders of the people . these arguments cannot stand without asserting that the jewish judicial lawes binde still . i have bin the larger in this , because in some writings especially of your nation , to be an erastian is now counted an high crime , and if the advice of the assembly concerning a confession of faith chap. 30. should be established as a law , assertion of a church-government corrective of manners by censures in a juridical way would be pressed on us as of divine institution distinct from the civil magistrate , which i conceive it concerns the assertors better to prove , then yet appears they have done , or else they will in pressing it on others usurpe dominion over other mens fiath . but sure in many particulars i am not of erastus his minde , and therefore you do ill to terme me a compleate erastian . and though i find not by bullingers and gualther's letters to him , beza's preface to his answer to his theses , philip pareus his relation of his fathers life , and other wayes , but that erastus had the repute of a werthy man , yet i take it all at your hands to be named by any name , but christs , as you , and your fellow-commissioners did take exception at the apologetical narration of the five brethren for calling some churches calvinian . but how do you prove me to be a compleat erastian ? sect. xviii . of the eighteenth crimination , that i avow no scandalous professor ought to be kept from the lords table . you say , that i avow that no scandalous professor ought to be kept from the lords table , and for proof , you referre your reader to the letters n n , where some words of mine are recited out of my apology page 92. which avow not any thing but my doubt , nor that of the thing it self , but of the proofe , and that not out of any scripture whatsoever , but onely the fact of delivering to satan the incestuous corinthian , 1 cor. 5. 5. nor do i expresse my doubt to be how from that it may be concluded , that any scandalous professor ought to be kept from the lords table : but how hence may be concluded any power of suspension from the lords su●per for every emergent scandal so judged by a congregation or congregational presbytery . yea to shew how ready you are to mis-report me , in the very next page of my apology i have these words , and if it happen that any such facts be perpe●rated as are like to that of the incestuous person , i doubt not but the whole church may and ought to disclaime the person so offending , and to exclude him from all brotherly communion , because i conceive so much was done to the incestuous person ; as i gather from 2 cor. 2. 6 , 7. so that my doubt was not of suspension for any , but for every emergent scandal , for which the assembly were so earnest with the parliament . many scandals there are in abuse of liberty in things indifferent , in sins of evil councel , and example which may happen through strength of temptation by infirmity in men not habitually vicio●s , which are not of that hainous nature , as to deserve keeping from the lords table ; nor doth the scripture either prescribe such a thing to be done , or give power to do it . i like not doctor ames his determination lib. 4. de conscientiac . 29. num . 7. proprium & adaequatum ob●e●●um hu●●s censurae est scandalum datum ●fratre , which i imagine was the cause of the assembly's mistake upon which they petitioned . sect. xix . of the nineteenth crimination of me , that i hold no censure of fexcommunication . you further charge me , as avowing also that there is no such thing as any censure of excommunicatior , and for proof you referre your reader to the letters o o , where is cited one or two passages of my apology , page 91. in neither of which do i avow any thing but my doubt , which is of 5. things , whereof one is , whether ever excommunication a sacris , that is ( as i after expresse my self ) ●uridical , forensica , ●●horitative , excommunication by some officers , or the whole congregation as superiou●s that have jurisdiction without special gift as the apostles had , would be proved to be ●ure divino by christs appointment . and i confesse i have still the same doubt , notwithstanding what i have read in mr. rutherford , mr. gillespy or any other . and i should be willing to be resolved , how citing to appear by power of office , keeping courts or assemblies , requiring persons , yea of all sorts and qualities to answer as before judges , examining witnesses , hearing causes , passing sentence , inflicting so great a punishment as excommunication without liberty of appeale ( if by a national assembly of elders ) on ministers and people , even the chiefest , not as arbitrators to whom the parties referre the matter , but as ecclesiastical officers to whose judgement they must stand whether they will or no , will be acquitted from that dominion condemned lu. 22. 25 , 26. mat. 20. 26. mar. 10. 42 , 43 , 1 pet. 5. 2 , 3. as the assertors of the presbyterian discipline expound the texts against the prelates ; & what dominion more like the heathen the prelates take upon them , then such an assembly , and whether the prelates against whom you pleade may not acquit their prelacy which they claime from the dominion you charge them with , out of these texts of scripture as well as you . but in this i do not avow , there is no such thing as any censure of excommunitation , as you accuse me : yea i do expressely grant a social medicinal excommunication by the whole church from all brotherly communion with the whole , and by each member from arbitrary communion with himself , provided they do not rashly or unjustly exclude . and this i gather from 1 cor. 5. 9 , 10 , 11. 2 thess. 3. 6 , 14 , 15. and other places , as in my apology page 93. may be seen . and i think the congregational way in this nearer to the use of excommunication in scripture then the presbyterian , though i think they misse in two things . 1. that they make it an act of superiority and jurisdiction , or , as they speak , of the power of the keyes in the whole church over the person censured . 2. they ascribe this power only to that particular congregation of which the offender is a fixed member , which i conceive common to any other church or brother in another congregation , and is in effect nothing else but the non-communion , which they ascribe to one church towards another . nor do i conceive what other excommunication christians could in the primitive times exercise or did exercise one towards another , when victor bishop of rome would have excommunicated polycrates bishop of ephesus , or the western the eastern church about easter , or stephanus of rome firmilianus bishop of caesarca in cappadocia holding with cyprian about rebaptization of persons baptized by heretiques , then this non-communion . and for the texts mat. 16. 19. mat. 18. 16 , 17 , 18. i am not yet moved from the interpretation i gave in my apology page 91. but rather conceive that i can prove it true , notwithstanding what i have read hitherto to the contrary . sect. xx . of the twentieth crimination , that i hold christ hath not appointed any particular government for his church . you say further , that christ hath not appointed any particular government for his church , and for proof hereof you referre the reader to the letters p p , at which you cite two passages of my apology page 91. 93. of which neither sayes the thing you charge me with , the former onely making two things , according to my conceit , prudencial , to wit , the independency or dependency , and the fixednesse or moveablenesse of pastors , and congregations . in the other i acknowledged a discipline proper to the church , and shewed what it was . and therefore you do manifestly wrong me in saying i avow a particular governmen● , when my words expressely yield the contrary , onely i said , i suppose the manner of doing the thing is left to prudence , that is by whom , when , in what order evils committed should be examined , the persons charged , admonished , avoided , which i think you will not deny . surely you will be hard put to it , to prove out of scripture , the particularities of your , or any other discipline . to tell you my minde yet more plainly , the word government comes from the greeke {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , now {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , saith suidas , he that guides ●●ship by steering it . being applied to men i conceive government is either by counsel , directing , admonishing , reproving in words or actions ( as by shewing favour or dislike , in lookes , embracing or shunning company , &c. giving example , &c. or by giving lawes , and inflicting punishments or giving rewards . i conceive christ hath not left a particular government for his church the latter way , but referres that unto himself , but in the former way he hath in the hands of some officers , whom he hath made as stewards in his house , whose government consists chiefely in declaring the will of christ , convincing gain-sayers , ordaining pastors to teach , and declaring ●alse teachers to be shunned , and such like offices : but for the juridical government mentioned before i find it not appointed them by christ . i like h●●romes expression on tit. 1. that the churches co●muni presbyt●r●●●● consilie , cura , solicitudine ( not imperio ) guvernabantur , and i like salmasi●● his observation in his apparatus de primatu papae pag. 148. 〈◊〉 primatu papae part . 1. cap. 1. that the government of the church is {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ●urati● , over-sight , not potestas , magistracy , empire . and this me thinks best suites with the scriptures , 1 thess. 5. 12. 1 tim. 3. 5. heb. 13. 7 , 17. 1 peter 5. 2 , 3. sect. xxi . of the one & twentieth crimination , that i hold that the government of the church belongs to the magistrate onely . you add further , that i say , that the governing of the church belongs to the magistrate onely , and to such whom he appoints to that service by vertue of a commission flowing from himself . and for proofe hereof you referre the reader to the letters q q page 113. where you cite a passage out of my apology page 93 , which hath not a word of that you charge me with , but onely a declaration of my opinion in point of prudence , that the not devolving so much jurisdiction ( as some desire ) on a presbytery doth not so much disadvantage the church , as some conceive , for reformation of manners , but onely for suppressing the dissenters in opinion , who are for the most part the most consciencious , and right-hearted ; for usually the ruling elders are magistrates , or both teaching and ruling elders are chosen and act according to their minde , and serve their ends . and therefore if the christian magistrate be good , there 's no great losse to the church concerning the reforming of vicious manners , though he presbytery have not such power as some desire : if bad , little is done by the presbytery . and for errors in opinion they are scarce ever amended by bare excommunication , for that ( if there be any number of dissenters ) doth but usually produce a schisme , but by teaching and cleering truth with meeknesse and forbearance one towards another , and a freedome to debate things in synods , which is , i suppose , the proper use of them , and not to determine things and impose lawes the persons censured being never heard . this i said to allay the heate of men in engaging a kingdome to warre upon such a cause . but because this is onely a point of prudence from experience i leave this to be considered by those that are better acquainted with humane affaires then i am . the thing you charge me with is no where asserted by me and therefore in this you also charge me falsely . sect. xxii . of my new way and boldnesse . there are some other things in your book wherein you abuse me , as pag. 91. in your margine and table when you put mr. ●ombes new way , and when you say , that at this time when so many new waies are in hand , i have thought meet to make a hotch-potch of many of them together ; which is a meer reproachful or scoffical calumny , as if what i wrote , i did it out of a designe to make a new way of mine own . whereas what i have said , i was necessitated to it , as i shew in my apology , and was done in pursuance of the covenant , and should have been taken with the right hand by men that are desirous to find out truth especially from one that you term learned , and with all his strength and greater diligence then any before him hath sifted a point . as for my boldnesse , i confesse god hath in mercy to me put more boldnesse and courage into me in this matter , then either agrees with my natural complexion , or the state of my affaires . but if you mean by saying that i am a very bold man , that i am one that is of an audacious disposition to be a ringleader in a faction or an attempter of a desperate designe , or in any other bad sense ( which it 's likely you mean ) you are deceived , it being trueth which makes me bold , which i am the more bold to avouch to be so , because having tryed your strength with my other antagonists , i find , that you defend that which i impugne by meer sleights . sect. xxiii . of my silence concerning dipping , and of the novelty and insufficiency of sprinkling instead of baptizing . you say , that you have marked nothing to fall from my pen for the rite of dipping , or against the custome of sprinkling . and in the margine and the able at the end of your book you say , he is a rigid antipaed●baptist , but not against sprinkling . but this is more then you could infer from this , that i meddle not with this controversy in my writings . but though i say nothing , there 's enough to be found of that innovation of sprinkling , in all sorts of authors . mede in his diatribe , or discourse on tit. 3. 5. i ●dd● , because perhaps some mens fancies are corrupted therewith , that there was no such thing as sprinkling or {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} used in baptism in the apostles times , nor many ages after them ; and therefore it is no way probable that {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} in st. peter should have any reference to the laver of bapt●sm . salmasius appar. ad librum de primatu papae pag. 192. non enim id {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} est quo hodie infantes initiant , non mersio , non t●●ctio , non lot● , non lava●rum , nec {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ut etiam graeci vocant , & vox baptismi graece significat , sed {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} aspersio vel infu●●o aquae . the like is in his epistle ad colvium pag. 669. ancient and later writers do generally avouch john baptists and the apostles and ancients use for many hundreds of yeares to have been by dipping or 〈◊〉 under water : salmasius apparat. ad librum de primatu papae pag. 193. tempore hieronymi omnes ecclesiae hunc morem observ●bant in baptismo ut ter caput sub aqua mergerent quibus id sacramentum dabatur ▪ aquinas 3. part . 〈◊〉 . 66. art . 7. tutius est baptizare per modom immer●●onis , quia hoc habet communior usus . chanier , panstrat . cathol. tom. 4 lib. 5. c. 2. sect. 6. caeterùm in usu●lementi abinitio immersionem fuisse totius corporis : quae vis est {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} : unde joannes baptizabat in flumine : deinde tamen mutatam in asse● sionem : incertum quando ; aut unde●f●cto init●o , &c. the manner of dipping , plunging , or immersion under water is agreeable to the relations , m●● . 3. 16. john 3. 23. acts 8. 38 , 39. it is acknowledged to be alluded to by paul , rom. 6. 3 , 4. by the new annot. there ; by calvin in john 3. 22 , 23. a joanne et christo celebratum baptismum fuisse totius corporis submersione . calv. in act. 8. 38. to tum corpus in aquam mergebart . mr. daniel rog●r●in treatise of two sacraments part . 1. chap. 5. 2. edit. page 77. saith , the greek tongue wants not words to expresse any o●●er act , as well as dipping , if the i●stitution could beare it . and sur . — the lord meant not that the infant should be sprinckled onely ; — but baptizea : which word signifieth the true act of the ministery , to di● , or do●the body , or some part of it into the water . and the 〈◊〉 of baptisme in t●e symbolicalnes of it , urgeth no . — what resemblance of our burial or resurrection with christ is there in sprinkling ? — so that — they loo● more at themselves , then at god therein . and a little before he saith , to dip the infant — i so ave● , as thinking it exceeding material to the ordinance , and no sleigh : thing : yea , which both antiquity ( — ) constantly , and without exception of countreys , hot or cold , witnesseth unto , and especially the constant word of the holy ghost , first and last approveth , as a learned critick ( causanbon ) in mat. 3. hath noted . p●s●at . schol. on rom ▪ 6. 4. diodati anno● . in rom. 6. 4. grot. annot. in rom. 6. 4. &c. and coloss. 2. 11 , 12. acknowledged by beza annot. in col. 2. 11. and gal. 3. 27. davenan . in c●l . 2. 12. &c. by the new annot. on mat. 20. 22. to have been the manner in christs time ; so that keckerman . syst . theolog. lib. 3. c. 8. saies , non possumus diffiteri primam institutionem baptismi immersion , non ver● adspersione constitisse , quod disertè patet ex cap 6. roman . ver. 3. and 4. casaubon . ●nnot . ad mat. 3. 6. {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} ; hic enim fuit baptizandi ritu● , ut in aquas immergerentur : quod vel ipsa vox {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} dclarat satis : quae ut non significat {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} quod est sundum petere cum sua pernicie : it à profecto non est {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . differunt enim haec tri ; {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . unde intelligimus , non esse abs re quod ●ampridem nonnulli disputacunt de toto corpore immerg●ndo in ceremonia baptismi ; vocem enim {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} urgebant . sed horum sententia merito est jampr●dem explosa : quum non in eo posita est mysterii hujus vis et {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . tertullian , who lived within lesse then a hundred years of some of the apostles , frequently calls baptisme , dipping ; and saith the parties were dip● , tincti : ( never sprickled , a●●ers , &c. ) the like phrase hath musculus on mat. 3. &c. the dut●l bibles have it thus mat. 3. 1. johannes de dooper . john the dip●er , ghedoopt inden jordaen ver. 6. he dipt them in jordan . mat. 28. 19. doopende ●nden nam●-dipping them in the name . so in mar. 1. 5 , 9. act. 8. 38 , &c. so mr. thomas goodwin holds out this manner of baptizing fully , in his treatise of christ se●forth in his death , burial — section 3. chap. 7. it was questioned in the third century whether the {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} or sprinkling or powring about of the element , that is , those who when they were sick on their beds and ready to dy , were baptized , were true baptism ? cyprian lib. 4. epis. ad ma●num . after it was questioned , whether a threefold immersion were necessary , or one would suffice ? 〈◊〉 s●ntent . lib. 4. distinct . 3. sect. 9. aqu●n . 3. part . q. 66. art . 8. the jewes , ( from whom this rite is conceived to come , ) took the baptisme wherein the whole body was not baptized , to be void , selden de jure natur . & gent. ●uxta dis●i● . hebr. l. 2. c. 2. the force of the word {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} is so manifest to signifie dipping , plunging , drowning , that pi●●rus in his pythia ode . 2. calls corke swimming {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , upon the face of the waters unbaptized , and plucerch a ship floting on the waters {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} , unbaptized . insomuch that i marvel greatly , that those who hold breaking of bread necessary , if not essential to the lords supper , having but example , use of the word , and allusion for it in scripture ; yea that are so stiffe for a table gesture ; should upon such pretences as these [ that {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} sometimes signifies washing , that our countreys are in a cold climate , or the like , alter so confirmed a 〈◊〉 , and determine that baptizing for the manner of doing 〈◊〉 , is not only 〈◊〉 , but sufficient , and most expedient to be by pouring or spri●klin● on the face of the child , in the directory ; and that dipping of the person into the water is not necessary : but baptisme is rightly administred by pouring or sprinkling water upon the person . advice 〈◊〉 confession of faith chap. 28. 〈◊〉 3. and that so small a vessel should , according to their minds be set up , as that the primitiv● 〈◊〉 cannot be continued by those that would , and perhaps do make conscience of it . sect. xxiii . the conclusion requiring reparation of the wrong done to me by mr. baillee . now sir , i referre it to your self to judge whether any author , papist or protestant , have in so small a compasse as one page of a leafe in 4. and some few lines in another so wronged his adversary , as you have done me in so many false accusations tending to beget prejudice against my writing , and hatred against my person . which i take the worse from you as being done not onely to a fellow-christian , and a fellow-protestant , but also to a fellow-minister of the gospel , whose life and labours are not very obscure ; yea to a fellow-covenanter , and one with whom you ate bread at his and others invitation , out of the desire i had to hold amity with you , and the churches from whence you came : nor do i know that i have done or spoken any thing that might tend to the contrary since : and this have you done in print , whereby it 's likely to spread to many , and to remaine upon record to posterity , without any provocation by me , and without any conference with me by word or writing , which might have satisfied you ; though living not farre from you while you were framing your book ; as i conceive you could not be ignorant from sundry passages in my apolegy . the sin of false accusing is one of the sins , that makes times perilous , 2 tim. 3. 3. from whence the enemy of mankind hath his name , and from whence much of our disunion , and misery comes . i do now write this letter to you being remote from you , as i did write to a neere friend before , to acquaint you with these exceptions against you ; having an eye on the rule of christ , mat. 18. 15. that i may shew my desires of peace , and you may see trueth , and confesse your wronging of me , and may fully right me . if this do not take , i shall some other way endeavour to wash away the dirt cast in my face by you , and remaine your brother and fellow-servant in christ jesus john tombes bewdley in worcestershire . july 22. 1647. june 2. 1650. imprimatur john bachiler . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a62859e-1850 vide ans. of the elders of new ergl ro 32 que . q 21. p 72 , 13 , 74. all in defe of answ. 109 〈◊〉 sit . page 156. selden . l. 1. design . c 8. p 18. codices prisci , optim●que habent {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} {non-roman} . allin defence of ans. to 9 posit. p. 171. in case the fraternity without officers should cast out any , yet it is not altogether the same with that which may be dispensed by the officers thereof it being no officiall act . mr. henry scudder . truth and peace, or, the last and most friendly debate concerning infant-baptism being a brief answer to a late book intituled, the case of infant-baptism (written by a doctor of the church of england) ... whereunto is annexed a brief discourse of the sign of the cross in baptism, and of the use of the ring, and bowing at the altar, in the solemnization of marriage / by thomas grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. 1689 approx. 276 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 50 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2008-09 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a41792 wing g1550 estc r41720 31355824 ocm 31355824 110699 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a41792) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 110699) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1739:20) truth and peace, or, the last and most friendly debate concerning infant-baptism being a brief answer to a late book intituled, the case of infant-baptism (written by a doctor of the church of england) ... whereunto is annexed a brief discourse of the sign of the cross in baptism, and of the use of the ring, and bowing at the altar, in the solemnization of marriage / by thomas grantham. grantham, thomas, 1634-1692. [8], 91 p. printed for the author, london : 1689. imperfect: stained and with print show-through. reproduction of original in the bodleian library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng hickes, george, 1642-1715. -case of infant-baptism. case of infant-baptism. infant baptism -controversial literature. 2007-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-11 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2008-01 judith siefring sampled and proofread 2008-01 judith siefring text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion truth and peace : or , the last and most friendly debate concerning infant-baptism . being a brief answer to a late book , intituled , the case of infant-baptism ; [ written by a doctor of the church of england . ] in which answer is shewed , i. that the covenant of circumcision ( strictly taken ) was not the covenant of grace for the salvation of mankind , many being not bound to observe it . ii. that circumcision was no gospel-ordinance , ( as is affirmed by the doctor ) but a part of the yoke of bondage . iii. that the jews had a tradition to baptize infants , is either a fable , or destructive to the christian baptism , if grounded thereon . iv. the doctor 's five comprehensive questions particularly answered . v. from the whole it is made evident , that the restoration of sacred baptism , in respect of the true subject , and due manner of administration , is the only true method to revive the ancient christian religion in all nations , where it has been corrupted by humane innovation . whereunto is annexed , a brief discourse of the sign of the cross in baptism and of the use of the ring , and bowing at the altar , in the solemnization of marriages . by thomas grantham . the custom of baptizing infants was brought in without the commandment of christ . curcelleus disserta . of orig. sin , n. 56. london , printed for the author , 1689. the preface . that prophecy of st. paul , 2 tim. 4. 4. that men shall turn away their ears from the truth , and shall be turned unto fables , had too much of its verification in the early times of christianity ; and as in other respects , so in the case of sacred baptism , both in respect of the time and order in which it should be performed . 1. from a fear that sin committed after baptism should hardly ( if at all ) be remitted , many did delay their duty , being desirous to have the full remission of their sins near their death . this scandalous delay of baptism proved pernicious to the church of christ , as well as to the persons thus neglecting their duty , and seems to have been the occasion of altering the manner of the administration of baptism . for many of these delayere being surprised with sickness , and afraid to die without baptism , requested that it might be administred to them in their sick beds , which was endulged to them without any warrant from heaven , which in such cases should always be enquired for . yet this custom was so doubtful to them that did allow it , that they required such chinicks , that in case they recovered their sickness , they should be had to the river , and there be baptized . cyprian epist . ad magnum . 2. others did as much outrum the rule of this duty in preposterous haste , even to baptize infants as soon as born , and sometimes before ; and this error sprang from this apprehension , that god had tied the solvation of all flesh to baptism , that even infants dying without it , could not be saved : yea so powerful was this error , that its assertors did anathematize all that held the contrary . the council of afric decreed , that all that affirm young children receive eternal life , albeit they be not by baptism renewed , they are accursed . sure a more unreasonable decree was never made by men. now this leaven of false doctrine has so prevailed , that scarce any but infants came to be concerned in obeying christ in baptism ; nor could poor infants obey him therein ; for austin confesses they did not willingly receive baptism , but strove against it with great crying . so that neither young nor old ( in a manner ) were found in some ages to put on christ in baptism , seeing that cannot be done without the free consent of an heart enlightened by faith ; gal. 3. 26 , 27. acts 2. 40. it is therefore the work and proper business of the restorers of holy baptism to do what they possibly may to remove this stumbling-block out of the way , i mean this doctrine which would damn to hellish torments all infants dying unbaptized . concerning which i have wrote several treatises , and could be content still to be an advocate for all dying infants , as being through the grace of god in our lord jesus christ , discharged of the condemning power of original sin , and having no actual sin , the infirmity of their nature shall not damn them , but the mercy of god shall save them all . and were mens judgments clear in this point , the controversy about infant-baptism would naturally cease , and all men would see it the only safe way to refer baptism to the time wherein through repentance and faith it might , according to the will of god , interess them in the remission of their sins , and in the priviledges of the church of the living god , in order to life eternal . i shall therefore once more endeavour to take away this false covering , which is not of god's spirit , i mean the doctrine of infant-damnation , by proposing a few things to this generation , as an introduction to my reply to the case of infant-baptism . and , 1. seeing it cannot enter into the heart of any christian ( i hope ) that god does create infants on purpose to damn them , and to shew them no mercy ( seeing he is very merciful to the chief of sinners ) if we can find out a just cause for the damning of them , it must be either , 1. from themselves , from their parents , from the devil , or from christ's not loving them , so as to redeem them from the fall which they had in adam . but none of these things can be the cause of infants damnation . 1. they cannot damn themselves by sinful courses , and it is certain our gracious god will ▪ damn none , who do not first destroy themselves by their wickedness . this is evident by his unwillingness to destroy those who had destroyed themselves , hosea 13. 9. o israel , thou hast destroyed thy self , but in me is thy ▪ help . how then can it enter into any christian to think that god should have no pity for innocent babes who never offended him ? is he thus compassionate towards great sinners , and is there no help in him for poor infants ? 2. no man can damn infants , because if any have power to damn his infants , all men have it , it 's no man's peculiar power ( whether good or bad ) to do this ; and if any say , all men have this power , he reflects upon the goodness of god for giving such power to men , and contradicts the word of god , jer. 31. every one shall die for his own iniquity — the son shall not bear the iniquity of the father . this is only true in the case of eternal death : for children , even infants , often die for their fathers sin a temporal death , as in the old world , in sodom , yea and in jerusalem too , lam. 2. 11. yet who can think that our just and merciful god should now after their swooning in the streets , cast them into hellish torments . it was not the iniquity of the infants , but of the grown persons which cried for vengeance . 3. the devil cannot damn infants , because they are out of the reach of his temptations ▪ they know not to chuse them , nor refuse them ; they know not their right hand from the left ▪ they know neither good nor evil ; whom the devil cannot tempt , them he cannot damn . a learned protestant tells us , god will not damn any person for that which they 〈◊〉 help . this sentence must needs be as true in the case of infants as any 〈…〉 world. and indeed the equity of that merciful law , deut. 22. 25 , 26. may suffice to convince any man , that in the judgment of the almighty there is no sin in infants worthy of damnation ; seeing what sin soever is upon them , it was impossible for them to avoid it . they therefore shall not be damned for it . when christ puts the question , how can ye escape the damnation of hell ? he speaks to incorrigible sinners , that the fear of damnation should not overwhelm weak persons ; but never did he speak a word against poor infants . he never told them they were of the devil . satan is not the father of infants . ergo , they are not his children . 4. christ loved and gave himself for all dying infants ; therefore not one of them shall be damned . christ gave himself a ransom for all : he loved , and dyed for the chief of sinners . therefore he loved and died for the poor innocent babes : he bought them that deny him , 2 pet. 2. 1 , 2. how should he despise the helpless infant ? object . if god be so good to all infants , why then is he not so good to let them be baptized . i answer ; god is good to infants in that he accepts them without baptism . and i appeal to any considering man , whether he was not as good to the infants of the righteous before abraham , as he was to the infants of abraham ? and whether god was not as good to an infant in israel of 7 days old , as to an infant of 8 days old ? and whether god be not as good to us , in that he accepts us in the use of a very few ceremonies , as he was to israel , accepting them in the use of many ceremonies ? and whether if he had pleased to accept of us upon repentance and faith without baptism , he had not been as good to us , as now , that together with repentance and faith he does require baptism ? the truth is , baptism is therefore good , because it is commanded . it is not good in it self , no more was circumcision , nor indeed any ceremony . now repentance and faith are good in themselves , it 's absolutely necessary , that those that sin , be humbled for it and forsake it . it 's absolutely necessary for the creature to believe , and to depend upon the creator . now baptism though it be not good in it self , yet heavens authority enjoyning it , and divine mysteries being contained in it , and priviledges conferred by it , it is therefore good to those to whom it is appointed . but where god requires is not , but extends his goodness without it , it is a like vanity in us to give it where he does not appoint it , as it would have been in abraham to give circum●●●●●● to every male child as soon as it was born , or at 6 or 7 days old 〈◊〉 to his females also , because it was a sign of a great covenant 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to whom it did belong by appointment . and therefore i consider further , that as those had no loss of any priviledg that was necessary for them in israel , who by the law were not required to be circumcised [ as in the case of all females ] so neither shall any lose god's favour for not being baptized when he requires it not . the danger lieth on the other side . for had abraham out of a conceit of making infants [ male ] of 7 days old , and all his females also sharers in the covenant , equally with those of 8 days old circumcised them , he had hazarded both his own and their loss of the covenant . in like manner , whoever will ( presumptuously at least ) baptize any person whom god does not require to be baptized , is so far from bringing him into covenant , that he runs the hazzard of losing his own part in the covenant : rev. 22. for i testify unto every man. if any shall add unto these things , god shall add to him the plagues which are written in this book . but , 4. all dying infants are under the blessing of the covenant ▪ of grace , therefore no dying infant shall be damned . this , how strange soever it may seem , must be a truth , or else poor dying infants are the worst of creatures . when therefore we say all dying infants are in the covenant of grace , we mean it , as god hath vouchsafed to interess them in his mercy by christ ; that as condemnation came upon them by adam's sin , so justification of life has abounded towards them by the obedience of christ ; and he himself that best knew god's design concerning them , has declared , without excepting so much as one of them , that to them belongs the kingdom of heaven . and what then is he that should except them , as the manner of some is , and in their cruel judgment send them by millions to hell torments ? now either infants ( even all of them ) are thus in or under the blessing of the covenant through the mercy of god , or they are not concern'd in any covenant at all : for the covenant of pure nature , as made with adam in innocency , concerns not infants , but as the breach of it is imputed to mankind ; but here they are lost . the covenant of works concerns them not , it cannot be said of them , the man that doth these things shall live in them . and to say that infants are under the blessing of no covenant , is to rank them with the vilest of men , yea which the devils themselves , who are therefore most accursed , because there is no saviour , no mercy for them . they are shut up in chains under darkness to the judgment of the great day . now far be it from all christians to have such thoughts of god , whose tender mercies are over all his works . the very devils had a state wherein they might have been happy , but presumptuously fell from it , jude v. 6. but poor babes before they had a being were exposed to condemnation through the offence of another . shall these objects of pitty perish eternally too without remedy ? o god forbid ; let them be pressed with all the inconveniences consequent to original sin , yet either it will not be laid to the charge of infants , so as to be sufficient to condemn them ; or if it could , yet the mercy and absolute goodness of god will secure them , if he takes them away before they can glorify him with a free obedience . dr. taylor . 5. no man is able to prove that any infant ever was or ever shall be damned to hellish torments ; therefore none of them , dying such , shall be damned . we should hold nothing as a point of faith , but upon clear proof , and especially things of so high a nature as this is . some men talk of some infants as if they were little better than devils . but could never yet bring a just charge against any one of that innocent part of mankind . the instance of esau is all that looks like an enemy to infants , but mind it well , there is no such matter in it . god knew that esau should not dy an infant , he knew he would be a bad man , and is judged as such . esau is not to be ranked with dying infants ; and this instance failing , there is not the shadow of any proof that god will damn poor dying infants . but because the doctor , whose book we are to examine , has some kindness for all dying infants , as i conceive , though the quality of his subject does sometimes enforce him to drop such sentences as may seem to deny all mercy to unbaptized infants , yet he corrects all such passages , by saying they may be saved by uncovenanted mercy , &c. a strange speech it is , but there is some kindness to poor infants dying without baptism ; i shall therefore insist no farther at present upon the p●int of infants salvation ; but make my way to the book itself , by premising a few things . our late assertors of infant-baptism seem to me to be ready to yield that christ has not commanded to baptize infants , yea some of them grant it in totidem verbis ; yet they think themselves safe , because ( in their judgment ) infant baptism is not forbidden . and with this apprehension away they go to the jews for relief , who out of their talmud , gemara , and maimonides give them an account of some such vsage among the israelites . and now from dr. hammond ( who has searched much into the rabinical doctrine ) they grow confident that baptism was a jewish ceremony originally , though they grant it was but of humane institution , and that the christian baptism is but the copy , which is taken from that original . yea the learned author of the case of infant baptism does tell us boldly ; that our saviour being obliged to lay by circumcision , consecrated this custom of the jewish church to be the sacrament of initiation into his church . but certainly john's baptism of repentance for remission of sins , which was from heaven and not of men , was more fit to be established by our lord christ , for a perpetual ministery in his church , than such a jewish custom . pitty it is that we should yet be contending about infant-baptism from this supposed humane institution of the jews . when our needful work is to do our endeavour , to prepare our youth ( and many aged persons too ) for an orderly admission to that holy laver for remission of sins , and not to blind their eyes by fabling to them that they were regenerate and born again ▪ as soon almost as they came into the world. we have certainly as much need of good schools to catechise our youth , and to prepare them thereby for the profession of the most sacred religion , as the ancient christians had . this is the way to have our posterity to receive the truth in the love of it , when their judgments are informed to understand it in the beauty and excellency as well as to see the necessity of it . this is the way to have them stand fast under all revolutions , when they have been radicated in the first principles of cathechism , heb. 6. 1 , 2. these principles of christianity are plain and easy to be understood , and yet god knows there are but a few that have a competent vnderstanding of them in this nation . and it is but a bad way to promote christian knowledg in principles of catechism [ as that of baptism is such ] by stories out of the talmud , or other jewish books , which if we had them we cannot understand them , why then are we sent unto them ? is the holy scripture less able to make us wise to salvation than the talmud ? let us take to the good old way , and diligently teach our ▪ youth the rudiments of religion ; so shall goodness and mercy follow us all the days of our life , and we shall dwell ( by our posterity ) in the house of the lord for ever . one main thing in the book now under consideration is the covenant of circumcision , which the doctor will have to be a gospel-covenant , and circumcision a gospel-ordinance . now as all this were true , it would come short of proving it our duty to baptize our infants . for seeing there is a proper time for our participation of all gospel-priviledges , so we must learn what time this is , not from circumcision , ( for then the 8th day must precisely be the time ) but from christ and his apostles , who are our only infallible instructors herein . but that the doctor is mistaken in this thing which he makes a pillar to his building , is ( i hope ) sufficiently made manifest . nor shall it be amiss in this place to give you the judgment of a very learned jew , lately converted and baptized in the city of london , bicause he may rationally be thought to understand the nature of the covenant of circumcision ( being a great student in all jewish , as well as christian theology ) as any other man. and this is the account we have from him of this matter , in his printed ▪ exposition upon the acts of the apostles , chap. 2. 40. the jews ( saith he ) who were circumcised in infancy , before circumcision was abrogated , were here baptized , by the order of peter : from whence it appears that by baptism and circumcision , two covenants altogether differing , were to be sealed , of which the one was with those who by the law of nature were born of the seed of abraham , the other with those who were spiritually reborn by the gift of faith. and whereas one main hinge upon which the doctors discourse for infant-baptism is supported , is the custom of the jewish church , and the custom of the ancient christian church , the said learned jew speaks very well to that plea in these words : the customs of churches ought to submit to the words of christ , not the words of christ to be wrested to the customs of the church ; in regard the words of christ are the foundation upon which all church-customs are to be built , that they may be safe and laudable . whatsoever savours against the words of christ , savours against the truth ; and , as tertullian says , what ever savours contrary to truth , is heresy , though it be an ancient custom . it is in the power of god to pardon those that err out of simplicity ; but because we erred once ▪ we are not always to go on in our errors . the doctor divides his book into a previous discourse , and into the resolution of five questions . in stating and resolving his questions , he repeats much of the previous discourse : i have endeavoured to take his sence , and have set down many of his words ; and my reply to his previous discourse may serve as a supplement to my reply to the resolution of his questions , because the same arguments are handled in both . what i have added about the sign of the cross in baptism , i have collected chiefly from a learned protestant writer , in a book intituled , a scholastical discourse against symbolizing with antichrist in ceremonies . i have intituted my book ( as you see ) the last and most friendly debate concerning infant-baptism . and glad should i be to see an end of the controversy , by an agreement in the truth , or a brotherly condescension in such things on either part , as may be without sin. that i have undertaken this task was , not the fruit of my own choice , but indeed i was particularly desired by letter from some persons of quality and learning to give a brief and distinct answer to the contents of the case of infant-baptism ; which they commend for the temper 〈◊〉 which it is framed , and for that it is very nervous in argument ; insomuch that till it was answered , it was so satisfactory , that more need not be said on their part . and now , i hope , they will do me the justice , as to read me with patience , and to judg without prejudice , knowing that shortly we must all appear before the judgment-seat of christ , and receive from him the things done in the body , whether they be good or bad . the last and most friendly debate concerning infant-baptism . chap. i. that the covenant , gen. 17. ( strictly taken ) was not a gospel-covenant , nor circumcision a gospel-ordinance , as is affirmed by the doctor . the learned author of the book now under consideration , may rationally expect some reply from those whom he calls anabaptists , or else interpret their silence to be either a sullen slighting of his endeavours to convince them , or that they are not able ( in their own judgments ) to shew the insufficiency ▪ of his arguments ; and the rather , because he has more obliged us to consider his writing , by his modest and friendly management of the controversy , than many of his brethren who have bent their stile against us . we shall therefore ( god willing ) with no less modesty and friendly demeanour , shew our reasons , why in our judgment his labours have not only come short of proving the baptizing of infants to be warrantable by god's word , but has rather given us great cause to think , that the case of infant-baptism cannot be made good by all that learning and art can do , it being wholly without divine authority . and to make this good , we will now consider the chief of his strength , in the several pages of his learned treatise . in pag. 1 , & 2. he would have it believed , that the state of the church from abraham to moses , and from moses to christ was parallel'd by the differing state of the christian church from christ to constantine , and from constantine onwards . for ( saith he ) there is ground for this distinction in the reason of the thing , as is evident to any man who is capable of considering the difference betwixt the church christian , before and after its vnion with the empire . but here seems to be a very great mistake in the very entrance of his book , for it is certain that the jewish church from abraham to moses , had very little of the face of a church-state till his time , being as yet destitute of most of her laws , both for constitution and government . abraham himself owning a priest superior to himself , even after he was called of god , and had received the promise both of being that person in whose seed all nations should be blessed , and that to his seed god would give the land of canaan , as will appear to such as shall peruse these scriptures ; gen. 12. 1 , 2 , 3. & 13. 15 , 16. & 14. 18 , 19 , 20. now this covenant which god made with abraham , that in his seed all nations of the earth should be blessed , gen. 12. which was indeed an evangelical promise or covenant , ( and in the faith of which abraham was justified , near thirty years before circumcision had any being in the world ) cannot be called the covenant of circumcision . neither yet when circumcision was instituted , was the seed of abraham formed into a church-state , in contradistinction to all the world beside , for still melchisedec was priest of the most high god , and many righteous men were then living , who outlived abraham himself , and were truly church-members , yea and governors of churches too , as well as abraham , and yet they were not at all concern'd in the covenant of circumcision : and hence it 's evident , they being under the covenant of grace ▪ the covenant of circumcision , and the covenant of grace were then distinct , and not the same covenant , so , but that the one might and did subsist without the other . this then may serve to shew the doctor 's great mistake , in making the church of christ , from christ to constantine , parrallel to the church from abraham to moses , when in truth a greater disparity can hardly be shewed : for though the seed of abraham till moses was in a state of peregrination , as also was the church of christ till constantine , yet the church christian was then not only in her purity , but also both for constitution and government , as compleat as ever she was since , having received from christ and his apostles all the rules of his holy word ( even the whole counsel of god ) necessary to her church-state ; and therewith all the gifts of the holy spirit , in most plentiful manner , by which to stand perfect in all the will of god. and on the other side , the seed of abraham , till the times of moses had neither law , priest-hood , nor sacrifice , in a settled church-way , only they were distinguished by the covenant of circumcision , as a people from whom in time the saviour of the world should proceed , and that they should be separated from the nations , and settled in a plentiful country , with laws and special protection from the almighty till shiloh should come ; and when the messiah was manifested to israel , the covenant of circumcision ceased , and the glorious gospel-covenant was now plenarily to be made known to all nations for the obedience of faith , rom. 16. and here we will take notice of that excellent passage in mr. baxter , the jews ( saith he ) were not the whole of god's kingdom , or church of redeemed ones in the world , but that as the covenant was made with all mankind , so amongst them god had other servants besides the jews , though it was they that had the extraordinary benediction of being his peculiar sacred people . now as this was true all along , so it was more particularly manifest in the times of melchisedec and other holy men that outlived abraham . what the doctor means to compare constantine with moses , is very doubtful : is it to make christian magistrates legislators to the church of christ ? we know indeed moses was a great prophet , and appointed of god to give laws and statutes to israel ; but constantine was not his antitype , but christ only : and whosoever will not hear him shall be cut off , but not by the imperial sword , as god knows since the uniting of the church christian to the empire , viz. the civil and ecclesiastical power for the management of church-matters , there has been a very bloody scene of affairs in most places where such a kind of unity of the church with the empire or worldly government has been found , and for the most part those who held to the truth in the greatest purity and power of it , became a prey to that church who obtained that grandeur and advantage , of which england has of late , as well as formerly , been a terrible instance . another remarkable difference betwixt the church christian from christ to constantine , and that of the seed of abraham from his days to moses , was this , the latter so far as it may be called a church in that time was national , and dependant on the family of abraham , none being permitted to dwell in the same family unless circumcised . but the church christian from christ to constantine was not national , nor dependant on any family , as such , but consisted only of such in any family as feared ged , and wrought righteousness , acts 10. 34 , 35. and this being considered , will shew that the church from abraham to moses was not so spiritual and evangelical , as the doctor would have it , but were rather natural branches of abraham's family , and the greatest part of them grosly ignorant of the evangelical covenant made with abraham before he was circumcised , which plainly appeared , not only in that they understood little of moses , as he foreshewed the coming of christ , but also when christ the true seed , to whom the promise was made , came to accomplish it , they knew him not , nor the voice of their own prophets . the doctor brings gal. 3. 17. & rom. 4. 13. to prove that the jewish church was founded upon an evangelical covenant , for substance the same with that which since is made betwixt god and us through christ . and he gives a paraphrase upon rom ▪ 4. from ver . 9 to 15. & gal. 3. from v. 5 to 10. to prove that faith was the condition of the abrahamical covenant , which being understood of the covenant or promise , gen. 12. of the blessing all nations in the seed of abraham , and the obligation or condition of believing that promise , to extend only to such as had means and ability to believe it , is not denied by us ; nor can it signify any thing to the doctor 's purpose , for sure he cannot bring infants under this condition , which is the thing he drives at . but for a more full answer , let us consider where the stress of the matter lies between the doctor and us : he would have this evangelical covenant to be the covenant of circumcision , gen. 17. we say , 't is the covenant or promise , gen. 12. now in the doctor 's text abraham is promised , that nations shall come out of him , and that he shall be a father of many nations ; but not a word of the blessing which concerns all the nations of the earth . now in our text we have it full , in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed . but the best way is to let st. paul resolve this doubt , even as he is quoted by the doctor , rom. 4. the promise that he should be heir of the world was not given to abraham , or to his seed through the law. and what law was abraham under , but the law or covenant of circumcision ? the apostle adds , but through the righteousness of faith ; and yet more plainly , rom. 4. 10. how was it then reckoned ? when he was in circumcision or in vncircumcision ? not in circumcision , but in vncircumcision . st. paul most clearly refers to the promise made gen. 12. near thirty years before abraham was circumcis'd . now whether circumcision be of the law , or whether it was a gospel-ordinance , is the business to be considered . the doctor does expresly affirm , that circumcision was a gospel-ordinance , p. 24. and we say directly contrary , that it was a legal or jewish ceremony . to prove that circumcision was no gospel-ordinance we argue thus , that which could profit no man , except he kept the whole law , was no gospel ordinance , &c. the apostle proves the minor , rom 2. 25. circumcision verily prositeth if thou keep the law ; but if thou be a breaker of the law , thy circumcision is made vncircumcision . and we argue further from gal. 5. 2. if circumcision bound men to keep the whole law , then it was no gospel-ordinance , &c. the assumption is proved by the text ; i testify again to every man that is circumcised , that he is a debtor to do the whole law. circumcision therefore could never be a gospel-ordinance : for as the gospel frees us from the condemning power , and from the servitude of the law , so every gospel-ordinance holds forth that blessed freedom to all faithful men in both respects . and hence it is clear that howsoever circumcision was a seal of the righteousness of faith to abraham , it could not be so as a gospel-ordinance ( for he was a breaker of the law after this ) any more than his offering his son isaac upon the altar , jam. 2. 21 , 22. in which he was justified by faith. and so was abel in his sacrifice , gen. 4. heb. 11. yea these were evident seals and pledges of their faith , as much as circumcision was to abraham , yet none of those can hence be proved to be gospel-ordinances . for indeed at the rate of the doctor 's arguing , all the sacrifices propitiatory , performed by faithful men in the time of the law , may be proved to be gospel-ordinances as well as circumcision . and by his consequence all that took part in these sacrifices , have a right to participate in all gospel-ordinances which hold forth christ and him crucified , as well as in baptism . and because the doctor builds much upon this topic ▪ we will further try the strength of it ; that which was always in comparison of the gospel , a weak and beggarly element , was never a gospel-ordinance . but such was circumcision . the major is clear , because 't is the property of all gospel-ordinances to represent those that are under them , perfect in christ jesus , gal. 1. 28. so that the gospel-ordinances are neither weak nor beggarly ; but as they are a part of the gospel it self , are said to be the power of god unto salvation . the minor is true , because the ceremonies of the law made nothing perfect ; for if they had , then they had not ceased , heb. 7. 18 , 19. and 10. 1. and it is evident st. paul calls the whole ceremonial law ( a part whereof was circumcision ) beggarly elements , gal. 4. 9. and they are all equally ceased . and seeing upon this ground the doctor boldly affirms the covenant of circumcision to be an evangelical covenant , because circumcision did initiate thereinto , p. 5. my next undertaking shall be to prove that the covenant of circumcision ( strictly taken ) was no gospel-covenant , though called so very frequently by the doctor , as p. 3 , and 4. all which he would make good , because st. paul calls circumcision a seal of the righteousness of faith , and because it signified the circumcision of the heart , deut. 10. 16. and 30. 6. the contrary will appear from the very recital of the covenant it self , as set down gen. 17. from the nature of circumcision being a legal ceremony ( as we have proved ) and chiefly because the covenant of grace was not peculiar to abraham and his , but common to others , though they were not circumcised . to begin with the very expressions of the covenant , gen. 17. from ver . 4 to 15. whoso shall diligently read it , will not find one word of the promise of blessedness to all nations : but that promise of the messiah in whom all the nations of the earth should be blessed was made ( as we shewed ) near thirty years before this covenant of circumcision was made , but it was rather a recital of god's promise to abraham , gen. 13. when abraham and lot parted asunder . and indeed of all the eight times which god spake to abraham , we find the promise of blessing to all nations in the seed of abraham , only expressed in the first time , gen. 12. and in the last time that god spake to him , gen. 22. and yet it is also true that st. paul does include abraham's fatherhood over the faithful in that covenant , gen. 17. 5. and 15. 5. and so circumcision was to him a seal of the faith which abraham had , with respect to the promises made at the former appearings of god to him : but then it is as true that of this faith it could be no seal to any other person , no not to isaac himself , because it was abraham alone that should have this honour to be the father of the faithful . after this manner the ancient christian church seems to have understood the covenant of circumcision , as appears in chrysostom and theophilact as translated by two learned writers in these words : circumcision was called a seal of the righteousness of faith , because it was given to abraham as a seal and testimony of the righteousness which he had acquired by faith : now this seems to be the priviledg of abraham alone , and not to be transferred to others , as if circumcision in whomsoever it was , were a testimony of divine righteousness . for as it was the priviledg of abraham , that he should be the father of all faithful , as well circumcised as uncircumcised , being already the father of all uncircumcised , having faith in vncircumcision : he received first the sign of circumcision , that he might be the father of the circumcised . now because he had this priviledg , in respect of the righteousness which he had acquired by faith , therefore the sign of circumcision was to him a seal of the righteousness of faith. but to the rest of the jews it was a sign that they were abraham ' s seed , but not a seal of the righteousness of faith , as also all the jews also were not the fathers of many nations . and says another learned writer ; it is no ways difficult to conceive that circumcision might have a different respect , according to the differing circumstances and capacity of its subjects ; yea that it had so in another instance , hath been shewed already . it was a seal of the inheritance of canaan to the children of israel , and did ensure the promise thereof to them , and their seed ; but it gave their bond-servants no such right or claim : even so it was to abraham a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had , &c. but this arose from the peculiar and extraordinary circumstances and capacity that he was in . for it is not possible to conceive , that circumcision should be a seal of the righteousness of faith to one that never had faith , nor the relation of a father to all believers , as abraham had . — and it is equally absurd to say that circumcision was a seal to all its subjects of the righteousness of faith , which they had while uncircumcised , as to affirm that it was a seal of a paternal or fatherly relation to all believers , unto every one that received it . again , from st. paul , gal. 6. 15. we may fairly argue thus : if the covenant of circumcision had been the covenant of grace , and circumcision the sign of the covenant of grace ( as the doctor would have it , ) then had all true subjects of it ( as such ) been new creatures in christ jesus . but the true or right subjects of the covenant and sign ( as such ) were not new creatures in christ jesus , &c. this whole argument is proved from the text , which saith , in christ jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing , nor vncircumcision , but a new creature . plainly thus the jews were never the better ( as to a gospel-church-state ) for being the seed of abraham , or circumcised : nor the gentiles never the worse ( as to a gospel-state ) for being not the seed of abraham , and uncircumcised . for there was no other way for either to be brought under the priviledges of the church evangelical , and so to be in christ jesus , but by repentance , faith and baptism , or to be born again ; for if any man be in christ , ( in a gospel-church-way ) he is a new creature , 2 cor. 5. 17. gal. 3. 26 , to the end , and 5. 24. i desire the reader to peruse these scriptures . we have proved already that circumcision was no gospel-ordinance , yet we shall add , it could not be a gospel-ordinance , because moses gave it as an obligation to keep the ceremonial law , or that intolerable yoak of bondage which none was able to bear . for though circumcision was before moses , yet it was given by him , john 7. 22. for this purpose , gal. 5. 2 , 3 , 4. and it self was a part of the yoke of bondage . sacrifices were before moses , as well as circumcision , yet they were given also by moses . and hence when paul opposed circumcision , it was objected that he taught men to forsake moses , acts 21. 21. and circumcision is expresly called the law of moses by christ himself , john 7. 23. and therefore the doctor was not well advised ▪ to affirm it to be a gospel-ordinance . again , the covenant of circumcision , and the sign it self were not evangelical , because the obligation to be circumcised was peculiar to abraham , and his seed or family , in such a sense , as none but they were obliged to be circumcised . men might and did walk with god , and please god , without being concerned in the covenant of circumcision , as we have fully shewed . but all men are equally bound to obey the gospel , and all the ordinances of it , who have means to know them ▪ they do belong to all families , all nations , as much as to any , matth. 28. 19 , 20. mark 16. 15 , 16. rom. 16. 26. so did not the covenant of circumcision . how unlike the covenant of circumcision was to the covenant of grace , ( especially in respect of infants ) might have been perceived by the doctor from his own words , p. 8. where he tells us , god made abraham thus separate the children with their parents from all the world , and look upon them , as a part of his chosen peculiar people , by which they became relatively holy , and differed from the children of vnbelievers ▪ as much as their parents did from vnbelievers themselves . sure this is a cruel sentence against poor innocent babes . but i answer . what separation soever the covenant of circumcision made betwixt abraham's family and the rest of the world ; it is certain it could not separate them , nor any persons in the world , from the covenant of grace ; there was nothing but sin could do that , otherwise it had been a dismal separation indeed . and can the doctor once think that let was now separated from the covenant of grace , because he was not in the covenant of circumcision ? sure he was a righteous ▪ man for all this . yea , and other holy patriarchs were yet living , as heber , salah , sem , and so was melchisedec ( if he were not one of them ) being priest of the most high god. and as these , and doubtless many more , were good men ; so it 's not to be questioned but they had their holy societies and congregations ; melchisedec being then the most eminent type of the son of god , that ever was , as he was king of peace , and priest : in which offices he must needs be serviceable to many , as is well observed by mr. cox on the covenants , p. 154. the doctor is greatly out in making the infants of unbelievers to be in as ill case as the vnbelievers themselves , seeing unbelievers must perish , mark. 16. 16. but it is not revealed yet to be the will of god that so much as one dying infant shall perish . and as to the rest of mankind , mr. baxter says very well ; that as the jews had by promises and prophecies and types , more means to know god than any other nations , so they were answerably obliged to more knowledg and faith than other nations were , that had not , nor could have their means . more proof , p. 95. and why may not this be true , that the effects of the evangelical promise to abraham , to be a father of the faithful in all nations , had very little relation in a gospel-way , to the age in which he lived , nor indeed till the times of the gospel , or till christ the seed to whom the promises were made did come ? and then indeed it was graciously verified , when by the commandment of the everlasting god [ even christ who is here so called ] the gospel was made known to all nations for the obedience of faith , rom. 16. nor shall the doctor 's allegations , p. 7. of the great numbers of divers nations which turned jews , prejudice that which we have said , seeing st. peter affirms , that the mystery of the gospel was hid from these nations and ages , notwithstanding their circumcision . for it is not to be supposed that these who turned jews were better skill'd in the mystery of the new covenant , or covenant of grace , than the jews themselves , who ( god knows ) were generally strangers to the steps of abraham's faith , and therefore little better in our saviour's judgment for being abraham's children , john 8. 37 , 39. nay so ignorant were the believing jews themselves , of the true seed of abraham , according to the nature and extent of the covenant , gen. 12. 3. that when peter preached to the gentiles , they contended with him , as doing that which was not lawful , for they yet understood not that the grace of repentance unto life did belong to the gentiles ; nor did peter , till a miracle convinc'd him , understand this grace himself , acts 10. the great accession therefore of other nations to the jews religion , is no proof that they were in the covenant of grace , or that circumcision was a gospel-ordinance : though there might be many among them that so feared god , and wrought righteousness , as to be ( through his mercy ) accepted of him ; and the like in other nations [ even all nations ] too , acts 10. 34 , 35. yet these accessions did contribute much to the fulfilling god's promise to abraham in other respects ; as to make the name of the god of abraham to be great in the earth ; and also to advance the name of abraham the friend of god. the doctor tells us , p. 3. that faith was the condition of the abrahamical covenant ; that it was made with abraham , as the father of the faithful , and in him with all believers . but considering what we have proved before with respect to abraham's peculiar interest in the covenant , we may well enquire what covenant and faith the doctor means ? seeing it could not be the gospel-grace and faith , which was the condition of the covenant of circumcision , as that covenant belong'd to all that were circumcised : because st. paul tells us , whilst the law was in force ( a part of which law circumcision was , as we have proved ) the time of faith was not yet come . and that the jews were shut up to the faith which was afterward to be revealed , gal. 3. 23 , 25. and that the law ( a part whereof was circumcision ) was added because of transgression , till the seed ( to wit christ ) should come . and shews likewise that there was no law ( as yet ) given which could give life . [ the covenant of grace made with adam , gen. 3. and the promise to abraham , gen. 12. and the renewal of the covenant of grace to noah , between them both , must of necessity be here excepted ] and therefore eternal life could not be had by the covenant and law of circumcision , as made to abraham's posterity , otherwise than as it served ( as a type or figure ) to direct them , to look for the messiah to be born of abraham's seed , according to the flesh . and therefore the promise , so much celebrated , gal. 3. can by no lawful means be referr'd to the covenant of circumcision , strictly taken ; and then all that the doctor has said to make the covenant of circumcision a gospel-covenant , and circumcision a gospel-ordinance , will come to nothing , and consequently his whole book , because it is mainly built upon this foundation . and that the promise mentioned by st. paul , gal. 3. may and ought to be distinguished from the covenant of circumcision , will appear from the date of the promise , which was 430 years before the law , gal. 3. 17. but the covenant of circumcision wants 25 years of this account . this is plain to such as will consider , that that great and blessed promise , that in the seed of abraham all the families of the earth shall be blessed , gen. 12. 3. was at least 25 years before the covenant of circumcision , gen. 17. and this is granted by the learned willit , who in his hexapl. in gen. p. 145. writes thus , from this promise ( gen. 12. ) made to abraham , are we to count the 430 years , which st paul saith , were between the promise and the law , gal. 3 ▪ and hereunto agreeth the computation of moses , exod. 12. 40. that the israelites dwelt in egypt 430 years , not in egypt only , but in egypt and canaan , as the septuagint do interpret the place . now how this promise had its effect in the ages before christ's incarnation , or how all the families of the earth were blessed in this promised seed then , god only knoweth : for though the world had a promise of a saviour from the beginning , gen. 3. 15. yet that he should be born of the seed of abraham , was not revealed till now . and lest any should stumble at this , that the promise here made , gen. 12. was not confirmed till abraham , was circumcised , he is to remember that st. paul expresly teaches the contrary , gal. 3. 17. as i have shewed . and i will add the judgment of a learned writer upon the place who writes thus . that the gospel was preached to abraham , and the covenant of grace revealed to him , we have asserted in such full terms in the context , as none can rationally doubt thereof ; and moreover in verse 17. we have the time of god's establishing this covenant with him , so exactly noted , it was , saith the text , 430 years before the giving of the law , viz. on mount sinai ; now the law was given in a very little time after the children of israel came out of egypt ; and from the beginning of the first promise to abraham , which was , gen. 12. 3. unto that very night in which the children of israel were brought out of their egyptian bondage , is the computation of these years made , as will be evident to him that shall diligently compare the chronologie of those times with the express testimony of moses , exod. 12. 41. and it came to pass at the end of 430 years , even the self-same day , it came to pass that all the host of the lord went out of the land of egypt . from the time of the first promise , to the end of israel's sojourning in the land of egypt was 430 years , though their abode in egypt was not near so long . and hence ( saith he ) we collect , that in the transaction of god with abraham , recorded , gen. 12. he did solemnly confirm his covenant with him ( although moses makes not express mention of the term covenant , until occasion be offered , gen. 15. 18. ) for the promise there mentioned , the apostle-asserts to be the covenant confirmed of god in christ unto abraham . the sum of all that has been said is this , that the covenant of circumcision properly taken , is not the covenant of grace , or a gospel-covenant , nor the sign thereof circumcision a gospel-ordinance , as the doctor maintains and affirms , that circumcision did seal to its subjects the same grace as baptism does now : which cannot stand with reason , because those who had been circumcised , should not then have been baptized for remission of sins , for if circumcision did seal that grace to its subjects , why should it be now conferred in baptism ? they came to baptism not as righteous , but as sinners . the doctor 's long paraphrase on rom. 4. is rather destructive of , than advantagious to infant-baptism . for whilst therein he makes faith , yea such as enables men to walk in the steps of abraham ' s faith , the absolute condition of the covenant , &c. he can never make infants the sons and daughters of abraham by faith ; yet he endeavours to do this by telling us , that the faith and consent of the father , or the godfather , or congregation under which he was circumcised , was believed of old by the jews to be imputed to the child , as his own faith and consent , 1 maccab. 2. 46. they had very good ground , saith he , in scripture for this their opinion , because the infidelity and disobedience of the parents in wilfully neglecting or despising circumcision , was imputed to the children . and to strengthen this jewish doctrine , he brings austin with his , accommodat illis mater ecclesia aliorum pedes , ut veniant , aliorum cor ut credunt , aliorum linguam ut fateantur : to all which very strange doctrines we reply ; by the doctor 's quoting 1 maccab. 2. 46. it appears that the cannonical books would afford no relief for these jewish fables . and he that looks upon the place in maccabees , can find no ground to say that the jews there did circumcise any children upon the faith of parents or god-fathers , for they did not stay for consent of parents , but circumcised them valiantly , or by force , as in the margin , which i take to be a bad precedent to be brought into the christian church , tho god knows they have been too forward in such violent proceedings . and no less strange and unsound is his interpretation of gen. 17. 14. where he would make the sin of parents to be imputed to the uncircumcised infant . in which he is not so well advised as some papists ; and contrary to the doctrine of learned protestants , who both in this case acquit the infant both from sin and punishment . cajetan ( tho a papist ) speaks well , consentaneum est , ( saith he ) it is fit that none should be punished but they which had committed the fault : but infants can commit no fault , therefore the punishment here design'd doth belong only to the grown persons ; for they only are justly punished , who only are justly blamed for the omission of circumcision . and dr. willit , a protestant , speaks to the same sense , it is no good reading ( saith he ) to say the uncircumcised manchild , but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the male ; for the infant of eight days old is of purpose omitted here , though mentioned , ver . 12. hence then is inferred that there was no such absolute necessity of circumcision , that children wanting it should be damned . and saith mr. diodate , this is not to be understood of children , but of those , who by reason of their age were capable of voluntary rebellion , refusing or contemning the use of the sacrament . as for augustin , his church accommodating infants with others feet to come to be baptized , and with the hearts of others to believe , and the tongues of others to confess ; it shews that in his judgment baptism ought not to be given , but where 't is sought for , and where there is faith and confession going before it . but that one may do these things for another , that is , one believe , and another to be baptized , we will answer it , as jerom did another case , non credimus , quia non legimus . we cannot find it ought to be so , neither in the old testament , nor in the new , and therefore we believe it not . and let the doctor consider whether upon such presumptions as these , he may not allow the feet , heart , and mouth of others for the dead , that they also may be baptised , from 2 maccab. 12. 43 , 44. the truth is , should we admit the dictates of the doctor , in this and many parts of his book , it cannot be avoided but that many innovations and superstitions used by the papists and others would obtrude upon us . in page 6 , 7. the doctor tells us , that the gentiles , who were born of gentiles in abraham ' s house , or bought with mony as servants were , and blacks are now among us , were the spiritual seed of abraham , and children of the covenant . and thus also he makes the medes , persians and idumeans to be constituted in the jewish church by regeneration , as the church christian is ; and calls them the spiritual seed of abraham , because they were turned jews , and lived according to the ceremonies of the law. which how uncertain these dictates are , may be seen , when we consider that st. paul says , the law is not of faith ; and that if those that are of the law be heirs , faith is made void , and the promise of none effect . and how christ calls circumcision the law of moses ; and tells the circumcised jews themselves , that they must be regenerated , and born again , or they could not enter into the kingdom , ( or gospel-church ) which shews plainly they were not regenerated in circumcision , and if they were not , then there is little hopes that their slaves bought with mony , as blacks are now by us , had such benefit by circumcision . nay , the doctor is more bold , and tells us , that always it was understood that children were called and elected by god in their parents : which is such a scriptureless doctrine , and of such dangerous consequence , that we cannot but wonder that so wise a man should assert it . does not st. paul expresly teach the contrary , where he saith , the children of the flesh are not the children of god : and that all are not israel , that are of israel : and though they be the seed of abraham , yet are they not all children . how was it possible that he should think that the slaves and their children were elected , only because they were circumcised , when abraham's own posterity are not therefore elected , because abraham was their father , and also circumcised . and will it not follow from the doctor 's opinion , that infants are also reprobated in their parents ? yes , he says no less ( i think ) when he makes the unbelievers infants to differ from those his elect infants , as much as the unbelievers themselves differ from the circumcised ▪ parents whom he calls believers . god be merciful to us , and bless us from such doctrine as this , that his antient way of truth may be known upon the earth , and his saying health among the nations : for job and all holy men , and poor infants too which were not circumcised , might for all that be elected . seven or eight pages the doctor spends mostly to shew how christ did alter the oeconomy of the church in many particulars , which do not directly concern our present controversy , in which there are many dictates unproved , about the reasons why christ made this change. but we shall content our selves in setting down these two , which he thinks moved our lord to lay aside circumcision ; and his first is , because by it the jewish nation was become odious and ridiculous to all other people upon the account of it . but this passage seems to cast a scandal upon god himself , as that he should appoint any thing that should make his people odious . sure other nations had usages far more offensive than this could be , in their idolatrous services , and particularly the burning of their children to moloch . but the true reason why it was laid aside , was , because the distinction which it made between the seed of abraham and other people , as the posterity from whence christ should proceed , was now unnecessary , because christ was born and manifested to the world : and chiefly because the ceremonial law to which it was a strong obligation , and also a part of it was now to be disannulled and taken out of the way , as an handwriting of ordinances , which was against us , and was contrary to us ; heb. 7. 18 , 19. coloss . 2. 14. acts 15. 10. it was therefore meet it should be taken away . his second reason is more tolerable , but yet not true , for though circumcision was a painful ordinance , yet the gospel requires as painful things as that was , of all that will be christians indeed , as the denying a man's self ; and particularly in parting with house , land , wife , children , a right hand , a right eye , a right foot , and our very life , when god calls for them , in service to the defence of the gospel . yea , let me tell the doctor , had he come to baptism it self , after the example of christ , who came from galilee to jordan ( i suppose 60 miles ) and that in the depth of winter , to be dipped in a river , as christ was in jordan , he might possibly have found it as ungrateful to flesh and blood as some have found it to part with their foreskin ; and add to this such repentance as truly qualifies for the reception of baptism , and the whole of it might possibly seem as ridiculous in the eyes of the wise men of this world , as circumcision it self . we conclude then that the wisdom of god was great to try the pride and haughtiness of man , in appointing circumcision in the time of the law , to bring men to legal priviledges . and it is no less his wisdom in appointing baptism , to bring down the pride of the greatest nobles , and most delicate ladies , ( as well as others ) by submitting their bodies under the hands of a poor minister to be dipped in water , at all seasons , as they are found qualified for it by faith and repentance , to admit them to gospel-priviledges . chap. ii. that the story of the jews baptizing infants , is either a fable ; or if they had such a humane tradition , it 's rather destructive of sacred baptism , to ground it on that tradition , than any way advantagious to it . in pag. 18. the doctor says , hitherto i have given the reasons of altering the jewish oeconomy — but then my undertaking obliges me to prove that christ and his apostles did build with many of the old materials , and conformed their new house as much as they could after the platform of the old. this will appear from baptism it self , which was a ceremony by which proselytes both men and women and children were initiated ; yet so much respect had our saviour for the antient orders and customs of the jewish church , that being obliged to lay by circumcision , he consecrated this instead of it ( though it were but a meer human institution ) to be the sacrament of initiation into his church , and a seal of the righteousness of faith. so likewise the lord's supper was certainly of jewish original . answer . this doctrine , that christ and his apostles did build their new house of the old materials of the jewish church , and that they conform'd their new house as much as they could to the platform of the old , seems to hold no agreement with the doctrine and practice of christ and his apostles , whether we consider the subjects , ordinances , or ministery of the church . the doctrine and ministery of john the baptist , is called the beginning of the gospel , mark 1. 1. and he would not admit of one stone ( or member of the old church ) as such , to be laid into the gospel-church . begin not to say within your selves , we have abraham to our father . god is able of these stones to raise up children unto abraham . bring forth fruits meet for repentance . every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down . matth. 3. so great a change do we find , that the old materials , in respect of membership in the new house , would not do , when yet there was but an introduction , to make ready a people prepared for the lord. christ came to fulfil the ceremonies of the law , and to nail them to his cross , as we have shewed , not to establish them in his church . but the truth is , whoever revives them , pulls down his church . and it were the false apostles , that would have conformed the church of christ to the platform of the old jewish church , acts 15. 5. but the true apostles withstood them , and decreed that the new church should observe no such things , but they establish what the light of grace , and the positive law of god had made necessary before to all mankind , acts 15. 23 to 30. gen. 9. 4. thus far were the apostles from building the church of christ with jewish materials : that as the great curcellaeus says , the apostle writ that epistle to let the gentiles know they were freed from moses's law , lest by their hearing him read every sabbath , they might think they were bound to obey his laws . and it is strange that the doctor should now make christ and his apostles anabaptists , as he does , for he will have them to have been baptised as well as circumcised , to initiate them into the jewish church ; and he will have that very baptism consecrated by christ instead of circumcision , to initiate into his church ; sure he has little reason to write against anabaptism , when he is one of the greatest asserters of it that ever was : but more of this pretended baptism anon . st. paul above all the rest , rejects the old materials , and builds all with new ; old things are passed away , behold all things are become new , 2 cor. 5. there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and vnprofitableness thereof , heb. 7. 18. he calls the whole mass of jewish ceremonies , beggarly elements . and is it like that he would build the gospel-church with such materials ? much less with that supposed baptism of jewish proselytes , or of jews themselves , which the doctor knows was at best but of mans institution . let us view the old jewish church , and the new gospel-church in a few particulars briesly . the members of the jewish church were natural , called natural branches , rom. 11. that is , they were the seed of abraham according to the flesh . the members of the christian church are spiritual , grafted contrary to nature into the good olive , and born of god. the circumcision of the jewish church was outward in the flesh , made with hands . the circumcision of the gospel-church is that of the heart , in the spirit , made without hands , in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of christ . their sacrifices were carnal , carnal ordinances , heb. 10. our sacrifices are spiritual , 1 pet. 2. 2 , 3 , 4. their ministers were chosen of one family or tribe , and did succeed by natural descent : and were ministers of the letter . ours are given by christ , as the fruit of his ascension into heaven , and are ministers of the spirit , ephes . 4. their two sacraments served chiefly to seal their right to the land of canaan , and that the messiah should come of the seed of abraham , according to the flesh ; and to commemorate their deliverance out of egypt . ours seal remission of sins by faith in the blood of jesus , and our inheritance in the kingdom of heaven to all eternity . in short , their services made nothing perfect , heb. 10. ours present every man perfect in christ jesus , col. 1. 28. but let us come to this pretended insant-baptism among the jews , which is so much made use of by the doctor , as if it were the very thing that must give life to insant-baptism in the christian church . and indeed dr. hammond ( from whom this doctor seems to borrow much ) makes the jewish baptizing of proselytes the original , and ours but the copy . that our saviour should thus highly approve of a jewish ceremony , as to consecrate it to be the initiatory sacrament into his church , is no way to be believed . for he condemned all such ceremonies of their own devising to be but vain worship , mat. 15. 9. and will he then establish this their tradition ( if indeed they had any such ) ? the baptism of john was that which he established , both by his own submission to it , and divine testimony concerning it , matth. 3. 15. & 21. 25. nor did john take up his baptism from the jews , as many learned men of the church of england do teach of late . for he was a prophet immediately sent of god to baptize with water , john 1. 33. and he that says john's baptism was originally of the jews , as this doctor and dr. hammond do teach , denies john to be a prophet , and does dissent herein from many learned protestant writers , whose testimonies i will therefore here bring against them , who with one mouth bear witness that john's ministry and baptism was evangelical , and not ligal , jewish , or of his own devising . diodate on john 1. 6. divine light being now extinguished , the son of god himself came into the world to light it again by the gospel , whereof john the baptist was the first preacher : and on matth. 11. 13. john's prerogative above the precedent prophets is , they have only foretold and described things to come , but he declared the present salvation , and in him began the evangelical ministery , and the legal and figurative ministery ceased . this could not be true , had he taken his baptism from the jewish church . dr. willit in his synopsis ; john preached the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins , which was all one with the baptism of peter , act. 2. 38. and it is absurd that christ the head , and the church the members should not have the same baptism . and that john ' s baptism was not of john ' s devising , but of god's appointment , dr. fulk on mat. 3. dr. fulk . john by his doctrine and baptism prepared a way to christ , not to the baptism of christ , for he preached not his own baptism , but the washing away of sins by christ . therefore he also was a minister of the baptism of christ . this new device of founding the christian baptism upon jewish baptism is dangerous , opening a gap to the quakers , and other notionists to contemn it as a legal ceremony . yet the doctor boldly tells us , that christ was obliged to lay by circumcision , and consecrated this ceremony ( used by the jews ) instead of it . the enemies of christ durst not say as dr. hammond and this doctor does say , that the baptism of john was of jewish original . they knew such a speech must deny john to be a prophet . and yet these learned men have not learning enough to consider this . we know the pharisees were very zealous for the traditions of the jewish church , but it 's certain they had no zeal for the baptism of repentance , for they rejected it against themselves , luke 7. 20. and here this holy ordinance is expresly called the counsel of god , which shews it was not originally a rite or ceremony of humane institution , or jewish ceremony . but now let us see whether the doctor may not possibly be mistaken in asserting that the jews had such a ceremony as baptism among them before john baptist came . and in this enquiry we will prefer a learned protestant of the church of england , who writes thus : as to their argument who would have our baptism to be derived from the jewish lotions , as there is nothing of certainty in it , so it is so far from being grounded on any authority in scripture , that there are hardly any footsteps to be found thereof in the old testament . they deduce the original of baptism from the hebrew word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which signifies to wash or cleanse . but the rabbins , if i am not deceived , use the hebrew word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which signifies immersion , thereby making it appear that they owe the notion of the word to the greeks , or rather to the christians . for what affinity is there between lotion and immersion ? but the thing is so uncertain , that it cannot be said of the rabbins , that there were not several among them who differed very much about this matter . — for in the very place cited by the forementioned learned men , rabbi eliezer expresly contradicts rabbi joshua , who was the first that i know of , who asserted this sort of baptism among the jews . now to whom shall i give credit ? to eliezer , who asserts what the scripture confirms [ meaning that proselytes were not baptized ] or to joshua , who affirms what is no where to be found in scripture [ meaning this pretended baptism is not to be found in scripture . ] but the rabbins upheld joshua's side , and what wonder was it ? for it made for their business , that is , for the honour of the jewish religion , that the christians should borrow their ceremonies , [ how imprudent then is the author of the book we are answering , to give this advantage to the jews against the christians . ] but when i see men of great learning fetching the foundation of truth from the rabbins , i cannot but hesitate a little . for whence was this talmud sent to us , — that we should give so much credit thereto — ? for the talmud is called a labyrinth of errors , and the foundation of jewish fables . [ this is then a fault in the church of england doctors to fly hither for refuge for infant-baptism . ] it was brought to perfection 500 years after christ . [ this shews the danger of trusting to it , it being so lately confirmed . ] therefore it is unreasonable to rest upon the testimony of it . and that which moves me most , josephus — who was also a jew , and contemporary with rabbi eliezer , who also wrote in particular of the rites , customs and acts of the jews , is altogether silent in this matter . [ he knew no baptising of infants among the jews ] so that it is an argument to me next to a demonstration , that two such eminent persons , both jews , and living at the same time , the one should positively deny , the other make no mention of baptism among the jews . besides , if baptism in the modern sense were in use among the jews in antient times , why did the pharisees ask john baptist , why dost thou baptize , if thou be not christ , nor elias , nor that prophet ? do they not plainly intimate , that baptism was not in use before , and that it was a received opinion among them , that there should be no baptism till either christ , or elias , or that prophet came ? how then there should be so much affinity between baptism and the divings of the jews , that the one should be successive to the other by any right or pretence , is altogether i confess , beyond my faith. it appears from this learned man's discourse , that there is no certainty that the jews had any such baptizing of infants , or others , as the doctor pretends . however , god having appointed no such thing in the jewish church , leaves such a practice ( if they had it ) without any authority to govern christians in their administration of baptism . nor do we who assert the ordinance according to the scripture , need to run for counsel to the jews talmud , gemara , and maimonides . and indeed it looks too much like going to the witch of endur , and to baalzebub the god of ekron for knowledg , as if there were not sufficient instruction in the undoubted word of god , how or to whom to dispence the first ordinance of the gospel to a poor convert . and it is a sure sign that the doctor and all that make such a noise about this rabbinical learning to justify them in the case of infant baptism , are conscious to themselves ▪ that they have no sure footing in god's word for it . and yet so partial are our talmudists , that they will not follow its directions for the manner of baptism , which as dr. hammond shews is commonly expressed by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 immersion , never by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that is , aspersion or sprinkling ; for such as will not be true to the rules given in the holy scripture , how should they be true to any other book ? one thing i marvel at , p. 20. where the doctor tells his reader that the anabaptists endeavour to shift off the force of many good arguments , by saying circumcision under the old testament was a type of baptism under the new. for this i take to be a great mistake of the doctor , i never heard of any , whom he calls annabaptists , who hold circumcision to be a type of baptism at all . but i have met with divers of the church of england , who have affirmed it to be a type of baptism ; so that all that the doctor says upon this mistake about which he spent some pages , is nothing to the purpose . for we own no other antitype of circumcision , but the circumcision of the heart , called the circumcision of christ made without hands . but had he minded well his own book , he might have seen mr. philpot asserting the thing which he would charge upon us , where he saith , the apostles did attemperate all their doings to the shadows and figures of the old testament . therefore it is certain they did attemperate baptism to circumcision , and baptize children because they were under the figure of baptism , for the people of israel passed through the red-sea , &c. where i think he makes both circumcision , and passing through the sea , to be shadows and types of baptism ; which is yet more evident , because ( a little before ) he tells us that paul calls baptism the circumcision made without hands . which though it be not true , seeing all men know , and mr. philpot cannot deny but baptism is made by hands , yet it shews that he looked upon baptism to be the antitype of circumcision . but i shall not fight with dead men , otherwise i might shew his mistake in saying that the apostles did attemperate all their ▪ doings to the shadows and figures of the old testament : but this we have shewed before , to be an unsound speech . the doctor seems to deal unfairly with col. 2. 11 , 12. circumcision ( saith he ) hath nothing in it symbolical of baptism , and denies it to be an umbratical , but areal consignation of the covenant of grace ; quoting the text thus , in whom also they are circumcised , with the circumcision made without hands , in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of christ ; having been buried with him in baptism . does not the doctor by this addition to the text , assert the thing which he would deny , or else denies what paul asserts , for st. paul does make circumcision a shadow or figure of the circumcision of christ made without hands , why else does he call the work of grace in the heart by that name of circumcision , as he also doth , rom. 2. 29 ? but the doctor does refer this circumcision to baptism , having been buried with him in baptism : but then if this be his meaning , circumcision must needs have something in it umbratical of baptism , which yet he denies , and therein contradicts mr. philpot , who affirms even baptism to be the circumcision made without hands . the truth is , this text can never be made serviceable to infant-baptism , as mr. philpot and the doctor would have it ; seeing no more are here said to be baptized , than had put off the body of the sins of the flesh . nor , as we have it , rom. 6. no more are here buried with christ in baptism , than were dead with him . and this alone might serve to shew that god expects not , that infants should be baptized , seeing they can neither die to sin , nor rise to newness of life , and to what purpose they should be buried before they be dead , no good reason can be shewed . here we are told again , that circumcision was a real consignation of the covenant of grace , every way as real and substantial an ordinance as baptism is now . it is only called a seal in the special case of abraham . and if it was every way as real and substantial as baptism is now , to what end were the circumcised baptized also in the jewish church , as the doctor says they were ? and why does paul call it a beggarly element ? and how could it be the yoke of bondage , or the obligation to it , and a seal of the covenant of grace too ? a seal or sign of the covenant of grace frees men from the yoke of ▪ bondage ; and of this , evangelical baptism is a real and substantial consignation , where the subject is qualified for it . had circumcision been such a real and sustantial ordinance to consign the covenant of grace , it would not have ceased , if st. paul's argument hold , heb. 10. 1 , 2. but it is abolished as well as other ceremonies of the law , which is a sign it did not make the comers thereunto perfect , any more than the other legal ceremonies . whereas had it consign'd the covenant of grace , more could not be expected from a ritual to make the subjects of it perfect . and this perfection have the ordinances of the gospel , as we have shewed before , but here the ceremonies of the law failed . chap. iii. wherein the doctor 's first question is answered , viz. whether infants are capable of baptism ? the doctor counts it rashness to deny infants to be capable of baptism , and saith , nothing can reflect more dishonour upon the wisdom of god , and the practice of the jewish church . and the sum of what he brings to prove them capable of baptism , is to repeat what he has said before , about the identity of the covenant of circumcision , and that which is made with us in the gospel ; and concludes , that because infants were admitted to circumcision , therefore they are to be admitted to baptism ; and affirms that circumcision was as spiritual an ordinance as baptism , yea that it was a gospel-ordinance . if therefore i repeat the same things which i have said before , the reader will ( i hope ) hear with that ; for answer then , i say , though we deny not but that the covenant of circumcision did comprehend all those dignities which pertain'd to abraham , for the greatness of his faith , to be the father of many nations ; yet every man that reads and considers the tenor of the covenant ▪ as set down , gen. 17. may easily see these things belonged to none but him , and therefore circumcision could seal the righteousness of faith in those peculiar promises ( whether we consider the numerousness of his seed , or that christ should be born of his seed , and so the nations blessed in his seed ) but to abraham only , because none of these promises were made to any but to him . we have also shewed how and in what respects the covenant of circumcision could not be the covenant of grace , because none but abraham ' s family was bound to keep it ; nor damned , no nor blamed , if they did not enter into it : but the case is otherwise with the gospel : for now god commandeth ( by the gospel ) all men every where to repent , and he that believeth not the gospel ( when made known to him ) shall be damned . can it enter into the doctor 's heart to think that all the world was now left under condemnation without mercy , except abraham and his family ? surely it was not in the days of abraham , as it was in the days of noah , as if god had only found abraham righteous before him in all the earth . no we have proved there were other righteous men , and some superiour to abraham himself : wherefore god's peculiar kindness to abraham , did not argue that god had rejected , and taken the covenant of grace from all the world besides , but it is certainly a presumptuous way of arguing , that because god made infants of eight days old capable of circumcision , by his command to circumcise them , that therefore we ought to take them to be capable of baptism , tho we have no command to baptize them ; and then fly to the identity of the covenants to make it good , when there is no identity at all to be found between them . but to concess a little . let us now suppose ( for argument sake ) that the covenant of circumcision was the covenant of grace , as the doctor would have it ; yet it will not follow that an interest in the covenant of grace does infer an immediate right always , either to circumcision or baptism : and this the doctor must grant , because infants of five , six , or seven days old had an interest in the covenant made with abraham , and yet had no right to circumcision till the eighth day . also the infants of the other patriarchs had an interest in the covenant of grace , yet had no right to circumcision at all . nor could they , nor the patriarchs themselves , be cut off from the covenant of grace , tho they were not circumcised . and all the females of abraham's family had interest in the covenant of grace , but had no right to circumcision ; and the reason was , god did not appoint them to be circumcised . and yet so foolish have some nations been as to circumcise females without any command from god , and therefore it s less strange that men now force on their superstition of infant baptism , without god's command also . but what if all the infants in the world be under the mercy of the new covenant , as it respects the abolition of the condemning power of original sin , and gift of eternal life : as i think whatever the doctor says at some turns , yet he will grant me this ( at least for the substance of it ) for all that die in infancy ; yet he will not say that all infants in the world in abraham's time , who were males , ought to be circumcised , or that all infants in the world since christ's time are to be baptized . and therefore suppose the covenant of grace before , in , and since the law , to be the same , yet it 's clear that an immediate right to the mercy of the covenant , ( in the sense before explained ) does not infer an immediate right to partake of ordinances , but some other particular qualifications ; and god's direction must give immediate right to participate of them , or else we act and do we know not what . let us then calmly consider what were the necessary qualifications for circumcision , and what are the necessary qualifications for baptism , and then we shall soon be able to answer this question , whether infants are capable of baptism . infants qualifications for circumcision were these ; they must be the seed of abraham according to the flesh , or born in his house , or bought with money , or the children of proselytes , and they must be males ; and they must be eight days old , else they could not lawfully be circumcised ; i say , it was not all infants ( as such ) that might lawfully be circumcised , but infants under such circumstances or qualifications . wherefore in the next place let us consider the indispensible qualifications for baptism . and here i shall chiefly make use of that text , col. 2. 11 , 12. so much insisted on by the doctor , with its parallel place , rom. 6. 1 , 2 , 3. from these texts it plainly appears that baptism is a mystical burial ; and therefore every one of the faln race of mankind which are lawfully baptized , are buried with christ in baptism . so then there is an indispensible necessity that all who are to be thus buried , be first dead ; for it is directly against these scriptures , and against all reason and religion , to bury any person before they be dead . the question therefore is what death is here meant . it cannot be a corporal death , for then none but dead bodies should be baptized , which is absurd . nor can it be a death in sin ; for if that did qualify for baptism , then all unregenerate persons were fit subjects for baptism , but that also is absurd : it must therefore be a death to sin , and to the rudiments of the world. and thus does st. paul himself expound it ; how shall we that are dead to sin , live any longer therein , rom. 6. 11. wherefore reckon your selves to be dead indeed unto sin , but alive unto god. col. 2. 20. dead with christ from the rudiments of the world. this is that death which is so absolutely necessary to the baptismal covenant , that the doctor knows it to be granted by the church of england , that repentance whereby we forsake sin , ( which is the same thing which st. paul calls a death to sin ) is required of all that are to be baptized . another indispensible qualification , is , every subject of baptism ought first to be a child of god by faith in christ jesus ; or to be a new creature . hence it is said of the whole church militant , ye are all the sons of god by faith in christ jesus ; for as many as have been baptized into christ , have put on christ , gal. 3. and as every member of this church is said to be buried with christ in baptism ; so they are said therein to be risen with him through faith. and to this also the church of england gives testimony , that faith is required of all that are to be baptized , even such faith as whereby the promises of god made in that sacrament are stedfastly to be believed . and that it 's necessary the party baptized be a new creature , they boldly affirm , when they have sprinkled the infant , ( when perhaps fast asleep ) that he is born of the spirit , &c. and that to be born again , is a necessary qualification for baptism . the word of god is clear , tit. 3. where baptism is called the washing of regeneration . and st. peter calls it the answer of a good conscience . and unto this doctrine all the ancient writers of christianity agree with full consent . and for brevities sake , as also because augustine is thought to be as eminent as any of the fathers that were before him , and more eminent then any that did succeed him , i will content my self with his testimony , who saith , per fidem renascimur in baptismate ; by faith we are born again in baptism , serm. 53. and again , primo fides catholica christiano necessaria est , per ipsum renascimur in baptismate & salutem aeternam impetramus ; first of all the catholick faith is necessary for all christians , by the which in baptism we are born again to obtain eternal salvation . and that infants have not faith , he testifies in these words ; si illis minati essent ipsum baptismum 〈◊〉 susciperent , cui videmus cos cum magnis stetibus reluctari . from these premises i think we may safely conclude that infants are not capable of baptism ; for what man with any truth or fairness of discourse is ever able to bring infants under these qualifications , or to shew that baptism may lawfully be administred to persons of whom we can have no knowledg , nor evidence from themselves , that there is any thing of these prerequisites to holy baptism , but as far as they are able ( augustine being witness ) they do oppose and withstand it . if infants were illuminate , they would gladly receive baptism , which we see them strive against with great crying . now all that augustine , the church of england , or the doctor can say in this case ▪ amounts but to this ; that infants do perform this repentance , and faith by their godfathers , &c. which is so poor an answer , so dellitute of divine warrant , that it is to be lamented , that ever wise men should satisfy themselves with such a speech , as no man can know to be true , but by all experience is found to be false , insomuch that no man could ever yet ( i suppose ) give thanks to god for that faith and repentance ▪ which their godfathers performed for them , nor do the godfathers themselves know that they do the infant any good , in or by any supply the infant does receive from them in respect of repentance or faith. but p. 24. the doctor proceeds thus ; if the relative nature of circumcision , considered as a sacrament , was the same under the law that baptism is under the gospel , it must needs follow that children under the gospel are as capable of this ( supposing no new command to exclude them ) as under the law they were of that . but by the doctor 's favour we do not exclude children from baptism , but bring them to it as soon as lawfully we can , but we must not make more haste than good speed , nor outrun the rule which god has given to direct us . now these words [ exclude infants from baptism ] are rather scandalous than pertinent . does the doctor exclude children from the lord's table , because he does not bring them to communion there in their infancy ? sure he does what he can to bring them to obey god in that ordinance with what speed he lawfully may , and so do we in the case of baptism . as for the relative nature of circumcision , though it was no absurdity to make infants members of the jewish church by it , when god bad them do so ; yet had any man taken upon him to have made them members of the church in the old world by such a sign , it would have been absurd enough . it was no absurdity for abraham to offer up his son isaac , to slay him with his own hand , when god did command it ▪ but it would be absurdity to purpose for us to do so , having no such command ; and yet we are to sacrifice all that 's dear to us , even our own lives , but it must be in such a way as god requireth . this talk therefore of the relative nature of circumcision is very vain ; we say did the lord require us to baptize our infants , and to give them the communion , there could be no absurdity in either , but then he would have diversified the time for participation of these ordinances , as he did in the case of circumcision for the 8th day ; though it was the precise time for the admission of infants , yet it was no rule at all to the adulti . shew now that god has required baptism at a precise day to the younger sort , and prefixed no precise day of age to the elder sort ( for thus he did in the circumcision ) and the dispute will soon end . circumcision did relate necessarily to all servants bought with mony in abraham's house , as members of his house , but the case is not such in baptism . and it was yet never proved that those persons who were thus circumcised , were to be qualified for it by faith and repentance ; but it rather seems to have been done at first in abraham's house , either in obedience to abraham's authority over them , as his bondmen , servants , or child ; or else by plain force : for seeing abraham circumcised all his that very day , they ▪ had little time to have faith and repentance wrought in them ; nor is there one word of abraham's preaching any thing to them . but 't is said , he took ismael his son and circumcised him , and all that were born in his house , and all that were bought with mony — every male — the self ▪ same day . here was bloody work ; and dr. willit thinks the number of the males was so many that abraham could not circumcise them in one day , and that he used the help of others to do it . and what faith and repentance could be expected from ishmael at 13 years of age , especially considering that he was not the child of promise , nor to have the covenant established with him . and who will say that abraham , or the jewish church either , had any commission from god to teach all nations , circumcising them ? this way he never went ; but if he bought any of them , them he would and did circumcise . and where is the new birth made the qualification for circumcision ? no man can give an instance of it . but nothing is more common in the case of baptism : surely the plain truth in short is this : circumcision did relate generally to a carnal seed , and to a terrestrial inheritance ; but baptism relates only to a spiritual seed , and a celestial inheritance . and let not the doctor reflect upon us ( as he does p. 27. ) but we pray the doctor to consider whether god was not as wise , and had as great goodness for , and care of infants , and others too , from adam to abraham , as from abraham till christ's time . and yet the doctor knows there was no outward sign appointed for initiating infants , as the doctor speaks : and wherein does it appear that god was more gracious to infants by or through circumcision , than he was to the infants of the other patriarchs ? the fathers tell us ( as quoted by learned protestants ) that circumcision did not profit the soul of the infant ; nihil animae circumcisionem illum profuisse . chrysost . hom. 39. in gen. and yet the wisdom of god was great in appointing circumcision so early ( seeing it must be the mark to distinguish the family of which christ should be born , &c. ) for the pain was more easy to be born in infancy , than when they attained to manhood . neither is it by any means to be supposed , that god by giving this ceremony to abraham , &c. did neglect all the infants in the world , as to the business of salvation ( which i must mention , because the doctor ever and anon is dropping such passages as may deceive his reader with such apprehensions , though i am sure the doctor does believe no such thing . ) he was still the god of the spirits of all flesh , and all infants were still his offspring ; and never rebelling against him , his gracious nature would not suffer them to perish without remedy , and remedy they could have none by circumcision ; for it was not appointed for them . and indeed to conceit our selves , that our wise and good god should make either circumcision or baptism ( or any other ritual ) necessary to the salvation of poor dying infants , is a poor low conceit of god , and contrary to all rules which he has given to men to extend mercy or justice . for seeing it is not possible for them to have the one or the other , but at the will of ▪ others , god's ways are so ▪ equal that he will never punish them for want of either : but the truth is he required the first but of a few in comparison , and the latter not so much as of one infant : whence then is there such a quoil about infant-baptism ? one great pretence of the doctor for infant-baptism , is taken from the ends of baptism , some of which he will have infants to be capable of , and therefore to be baptized . this is the sum of what he says in a multitude of words in several pages . but upon a right discovery of the ends of baptism , as they are really such , his antecedent will vanish . the ends of baptism ( be they what they will ) are to be considered in such a sense , as that ordinarily without baptism such things cannot be obtained . and of these ends , remission of sins , and eternal life are the principal , acts 2. 38. mark 16. 16. now where ever , or upon whomsoever god calls for obedience in holy baptism , as the way in which these ends are by them to be obtained , there the duty of baptism being refused , these ends are lost ; as appears in the case of the pharisees and lawyers , luke 7. 29. they rejected the counsel of god against themselves , being not baptized . now i deny that remission of sins , and eternal life , are propounded to , or in the case of infants , as the ends of baptism . they have remission ( so far as they need it ) and eternal life , upon other terms , even the free mercy of god in christ , rom. 5. 18. and the good will of god towards them , mat. 18. 14. and if infants are uncapable of these , as they are the ends of baptism , so they will be uncapable of all other things which are annexed to baptism , as the ends of that ordinance . as we will propose two , viz. the washing of regeneration , and incorporating into christ ; infants are capable of neither of these , as they are the ends of baptism . for , baptism is but demonstrative , or a sign of the new birth ; because god will have those that come to be baptized , therein to testify , that they have , and therein symbolically do put off the body of the sins of the flesh , which work had its effect from the word and spirit of god. and , 2. to be incorporated with christ , as it is an end of baptism , does necessarily presuppose , a being taken out of the tree that is wild by nature , or out of our degenerate estate , and planted contrary to that nature , by a willing resignation of soul and body to christ , in that solemn ministration of baptism . and how incapable infants are of this , all men must needs see . to be short , if it could be proved by the word of god , or found true by experience , that infants are capable of any good ; or ▪ that the will of god was wrought by baptizing them , i could yield to the doctor : but the truth is , they are capable of none of the ends of baptism , as god hath annexed them to baptism , and therefore his argument must come to nothing . and how easy were it to turn this argument against him in the case of the lord's supper , but that may be more sitting in another place . but the doctor says , p. 28. that infants are capable of all the ends of baptism , as baptism is instituted for a sign from god towards us , to assure us of his gracious favour , and to consign unto us the benefits of the covenant of grace . now , if this doctrine be true , then either baptism is a sure sign of all these things to all infants , or to some few of them only : the former the doctor will not allow ; and yet he cannot but know , when christ said , teach all nations , baptizing them , he makes no difference between one person and another , all are equally to be taught , and baptized equally upon the same terms . and if the doctor will have some infants only to have an interest in the benefits of the covenant of grace , and therefore but some only have right to baptism , which consigns the covenant of grace , we shall desire him to prove this well , and therewithal to let as know how he knows one sort of these infants from another . he says , indeed , that infants may be members of a church ( their childhood notwithstanding ) as well as of a family , &c. but to be of a family , is equally natural to all infants ; so that if this argument prove any thing , it proves all infants church-members as much as any . nor , saith he , does childhood hinder or incapacitate them for being adopted the children of god , more than the children of any other person . but god is not like man to adopt ( or receive into favour ) some poor infants , and let all the rest perish without favour : we affirm , that god has in mercy taken care of all infants , ( as we have proved ) : but this does not teach us to do that to some of them which he never commanded , and to reject the rest , as if god had no mercy for them . these notions are so partial , and so uncertain , that no solid comfort can be taken from them . and let my infant , ( whom i confess i have not baptized , but only devoted him to god's mercy and protection by prayer ) and the doctor 's infant ( whom he has crossed and sprinkled ) be laid together , i am perswaded the doctor would tremble to say , this infant is an adopted child of god , and in his favour ; that infant is rejected , and out of god's favour : and truly i cannot but think such discourses as these , proceed not from the bottom of the heart , but men please themselves to dream waking , of i know not what favour almighty god has for their infants , above what he has for others . the doctor 's next way is to make use of similitudes , as thus ; should a prince adopt a beggar 's child , and incorporate him into the royal family , and settle a part of his dominions upon him ; and to solemnize and confirm all this , should cut off a bit of his flesh , or command him to be washed with water ; who would count this an insignificant ceremony , or solemnity ? or say , that the child was not capable of the sign , when he was capable of the chief thing signified thereby ? surely such flourishes as this , may soon deceive those that rest upon them . for , 1. here is no qualification in this child , nor any required of it in this case ; but every beggar 's child is as capable of this favour as this child : and consequently this makes no more for the infant of an english man , than of an indian ; god may be as kind to the one as to the other . 2. here 's the king's act of grace peculiar to this child , and to no other . 3. here 's the king's express command , to cut off a bit of the child's flesh , or to wash it with water . and thus the whole of the matter is begg'd ; but not any proof for infant baptism ministred from hence ; for we grant , that the things here supposed to be done , do sufficiently capacitate the beggar 's child for the mercy and favour of the prince ; but then it as much incapacitates other children , to whom the king has extended no such pity , and concerning whom he has given no such order ; for should the doctor now , without any order from the king , fetch all the beggars children in the city and country , and pass all these solemnities upon them , that they all may be received into the royal family , &c. i suppose he would have but little thanks for his labour : even so to cross , sprinkle , or dip all the infants in the world , [ and either all or none have right to it ] and to adopt them thus to be of the family of heaven , without heaven's authority to make them capable of it , and god's direction in the business of the solemnity , will not please god. we therefore content our selves to commit our infants to his mercy and protection , in the way of humble prayer for his blessing ; and for this we have his own son , our lord , to go before us , who thus does suffer little children to come unto him , without rejecting so much as one of them . the doctor 's next similitude proceeds thus ; suppose a prince should send for an attainted traitor's child , and say — you know the blood of this child is attainted by his father's treason ; by law he has forfeited all right to his father's estate — my bowels of compassion yearn upon him , and here i restore him — and before you all wash him with pure water , to signify that he is cleansed — and restored to his birth-right — could any man say that the action was insignificant , because the child knew nothing of it ? now in this similitude , the doctor begs almost every thing in question between us . as , 1. that all that are attainted with original sin , must be washed with water , as a sign that they are cleansed from it . 2. that god vouchsafes the bowels of compassion to such infants only as he intends shall be baptized . 3. that he does not require the party baptized to understand or take notice of any thing , but bids the by-standers take notice of these things . and , 4. this similitude supposes , that all rules about infant baptism are plainly delivered by our heavenly king , when not one of these things are true . but the doctor does very ill to suppose that to be a true gospel-sacrament , which wants the inward and spiritual grace ; as in this similitude there is no knowledg or consent on the part of him that is baptized , but a meer force is put upon him . and yet when the doctor can shew us what infants in particular the bowels of god does yearn towards , and his will that they be cleansed by washing with water , that shall suffice to make them capable of baptism . but before we leave this similitude , let us consider whether the foundation of it be sound . are infants indeed such attainted persons ? sure no ; for whatsoever was their case considered in sinful adam , yet when through christ adam was redeemed ( that is , virtually ▪ by the promise of a saviour , gen. 3. 15. ) all infants ▪ who then were all in him , had the attainder taken off , as much as from adam himself , john 1. 29. so that this attainder of treason against infants , as they proceed from adam , is but a fancy ; and to think that he has left original sin to be washed away by baptism , from poor innocent babes , is another fancy ; and yet these were the grounds on which infant baptism was built at first , and many are yet under the dominion of this mistake . we conclude then , that through the free mercy of god in the gift of christ , the attainder of sin which lay against infants to condemnation , was taken away from the foundation of the world ; and that baptism was not ordained of god to take away original sin , but for the remission of actual sins upon repentance and faith. nor does it appear , in all god's book , that he appointed any ritual , no not circumcision it self , to take away original sin , and he that shall assert it , will be intangled in so many difficulties , as he cannot escape . for what then took original sin from all males that died before the eighth day ? and what became of all females and male infants throughout the world ? did god leave them all under a malady , without any remedy ? and though the doctor insists never so much upon that apochryphal story of infant baptism among the jews , before the coming of john baptist , yet as himself yields , p. 18. it was not of divine institution ▪ so it is looked upon to be a fable by the learned of his own church , who tell us , as we have shewed , that rabbi eliezer denies ▪ that there was any such baptism among the jews , though rabbi joshua does affirm it . to whom shall i give credit , ( saith that learned protestant ) to eliezer , who asserted what the scripture confirms , [ that there was no such baptism among the jews ] or to joshua , who affirms what is no where to be found in scripture ? i am not concerned in their answer , who do prove infants more capable of circumcision than of baptism , because it left a character in their flesh . but i answer , whatsoever makes any person capable of baptism , the revealed will of god to order it so is the chief ; us for example , some infants might be as capable of circumcision on the 7th day , as others on the 8th , yet those of 7 days were not at all capable of circumcision . so that for men to insist upon their conjectures , about infants capacity or incapacity , is but to wander in the dark . it must be the institution of baptism , the commission for the use of it in all nations , and the example of christ and his apostles , and churches by them constituted , that must decide this question , whether infants are capable of baptism ? chap. iv. answereth the doctor 's second question ; whether infants are excluded from baptism ? and here in the first place ( saith the doctor ) i must observe that the question ought to be proposed in these terms , and not whether christ hath commanded infants to be baptized ? for as a good , author observes of the river nile ▪ we ought not to ask the reason why nile overflows so many days about the summer solstice ? but why it doth not overflow all the year long ? but by his favour he is as wife a man that asks the first question , as he that asks the second . and i know but one answer to be given to both , and that is chiefly and before all things ▪ it is the will of god to order it so . now let this be apply'd to the case in hand ; and the will of god shall determine , who are , and who are not to be baptized ▪ and let the doctor here resolve me , whether god excluded infants of 6 or 7 days old from circumcision , when yet there is no negative law , you shall not circumcise them ; and he will soon answer his own question : for his answer must be , seeing god did not appoint infants of 7 days old to be circumcised , therefore he did not admit them to it ; and our answer is the same , christ did not command to baptize infants , therefore he does not admit them to it . and it is observed by some learned men , that tho negative commands do usually exclude , yet it is also true that an institution of god , and an affirmative command does exclude all that is above or besides that command and institution . and they bring levit. 10. 1 , 2 , to justify what they say : for nadab and abihu came to a dismal end . and saith diodate , though the command was not given before , yet it was a sin , in undertaking the contrary before god's mind was known . and so may the doctor find the same acceptance , in going where he has no law to direct him , though there were no negative to forbid him ; however we dare not follow him because we fear the lord , who if we add to his word , will reprove both him and us , prov. 30. 6. but here again the doctor would build his infant-baptism upon that jewish tradition of baptizing the infants of proselytes , though he knows they had no authority from heaven for it . and we have shewed from a learned author in chap. 2. that it's very probable there was no such thing . and it 's very strange that the doctor or others should suffer themselves to be thus deluded from the simplicity of the gospel by the jews talmud , which the learned buxtorf explodes with such indignation ; whence ( saith he ) was the talmud sent to us , that from thence we should think that the law of moses either can or ought to be understood , much less the gospel , which they were prefessed enemies unto ? and yet now this is become one of the chief refuges of this doctor , and of dr. hammond before him , for the support of infant-baptism . and it 's strange that the doctor should hope by such arguments to bring any credit to the cause of infant baptism . he might as well have referred us to the turkish alcoran , where divers washings are also mentioned . page 32 , 33. upon this tottering foundation the doctor builds divers suppositions ; as first , that if christ had not changed the seal of the covenant , but had said , go make all nations my disciples , circumcising them ; i appeal ( saith he ) to any impartial mans judgment , whether the apostles would not have presumed , that it was christs intention that the infants of adult proselites should be circumcised ? and in a word ( saith he ) there lay no obligation upon our blessed lord to lay aside the practice of infant baptism , as being inconsistent either with the free or manly , or universal nature of the christian church . i answer , 1. the case which the doctor puts is not at all rational , but upon this presupposition that the disciples had known the law before given to israel , and their practice in that case : but they knew no such law to have been given to any nation in the case of baptism , so that they must only keep to the words of their commission , and the practice of their master , who made and baptized disciples , and none else , john 4. 1. 2. i must needs tell the doctor that christ was obliged to disapprove and make void the custom of the jews in baptizing infants , ( if they did so ) seeing it was but their own tradition ; and that from the tenor of his own doctrine , matth. 15. 9. mark 7. in vain do ye worship me ; teaching for doctrine the commandments of men. for it was their divers traditional washings which he was here opposing . and seeing the doctor grants their infant baptism was but a humane institution ▪ the pharisees might have replied to our saviour , why dost thou reprove our washings ? dost not thou also allow the doctrine of men in the case of infant-baptism ? teachest thou another , and teachest not thy self ? and now the doctor 's suppositions will tumble down of themselves ; for seeing the apostles knew no such practice , as baptizing infants by god's appointment in the jewish church , and they having heard their master condemn all washings in religion founded only on humane authority , as being but vain worship ; and now receiving no commandment ( as the doctor must also confess ) to baptize infants , matth. 28. 20. they were sufficiently forbidden to baptize any infants by christ's severe censure against the jews for worshipping god after their own tradition . and therefore though the doctor thinks he has given some reason why he stated the question , as you have heard , yet i humbly tell him he was therein very unreasonable , in that he would beg the whole controversy , whilst he will suppose , nay conclude , that infant-baptism had been the immemorial practice of the jewish church , and approved , or not censured by our saviour . and then indeed if this were true , his suppositions might beguile a wiser man than i am : but all this being meer sophistical , beggarly and presumptuous insinuations , it is to me a great evidence against infant-baptism . but now the doctor ( p. 34 ▪ 35. ) will shew that matth. 28. 19. mark ▪ 16. 16. heb. 6. 1 , 2. does not so much as consequentially prohibit infant-baptism . and because we think these places do evidently shew that christ in the two first could not impose any such thing upon his apostles , as to teach infants , and so not to baptize them , because all that he commands them to baptize , he commands them first to teach , or preach the gospel to them . and heb. 6. 1 , 2. shews very plainly that baptism does not go before , but follows repentance and faith , and therefore cannot with any shew of truth or reason from hence belong to infants , but the contrary . i fay , because we thus think and teach from these scriptures , the doctor says , we are grievously mistaken , because these and the like texts do of themselves no more prove that grown persons are the only subjects of baptism , than the words of the apostle , 2 thess . 3. 10. proves that grown persons only are to eat . from whence in their sophistical way it may be argued thus , it belongs only to grown persons to eat , because the apostle requires that persons who eat should first work . but i reply ; the doctor does here greatly wrong both the apostle and us : 1. the apostle does not say , any that does not work shall not eat , for he knew that grown persons who are sick and weak as well as infants , cannot work . but he says , if any would not work , these only are they who shall not eat , i. e. such as are able , and yet being idle , would not work . is this fair for the doctor to pervert the words of the text ? 2. he abuses us , for we do not baptize any grown persons meerly as such . no , all that we baptize are ( or at least profess to be ) new-born babes in christ . now our saviour designing baptism to be the laver of regeneration , must needs prohibit those of whose regeneration no judgment can be made , nor demonstration given by any man whatsoever ▪ surely the doctor has little reason to talk of his discovering the fallaciousness of our arguing . but he says , he will further shew the weakness and fallacy of our argument : let us hear him do that . suppose ( saith the doctor ) there were a great plague in any country , and god should miraculously call an eleven or twelve men , and communicate to them a certain medicine against this plague ; and say unto them , go into such a country , and call the people together , and teach them the virtues of this medicine , and assure them , that he that believeth and taketh it from you , shall live ; but he that believeth not , shall die . vpon this supposition i demand of these dissenters , if the words of such commission would be sufficient — to conclude that it was god's intention that they should administer his revealed medicine to none but grown persons , because they only could be called together , and taught the virtues of it , and believe or disbelieve them that brought it . no certainly this way of arguing would not be admitted by any rational man , &c. i answer ; this similitude is very fallacious and deceitful , supposing what is not to be supposed in our case , no , i think not in the doctor 's own judgment . for 1st . no infant is under the disease or plague here meant or intended by the similitude . for seeing christ has taken off their original pollution , they are just persons that need no repentance , they are to be distinguished from infidels , whoremongers , drunkards , swearers , idolaters , superstitious and erroneous worshippers . the plague of unbelief cannot seize them , therefore the medicine of faith is not applied to them . the disease of transgressing the laws is not upon them , rom. 4. 15. therefore they have not the medicine of repentance appointed to them , and consequently not the baptism of repentance . secondly , this similitude supposes infants cannot be cured of the disease they are under without baptism , which is so contrary to truth and to protestant doctrine , that it is to be exploded . and thus we see this flourish , about which he spends two or three pages , to the amusing his credulous admirers , comes to nothing at all . for no sooner is it looked into , but it vanisheth as a dream when one awaketh . even so , lord , shalt thou despise this false image of the gospel , and all that are like unto it . and like unto this is the next following , p. 36. for tho it be true that considering the previous law of circumcision , gen. 17. it is not to be doubted but that david or solomon would both observe it in any commission which they might give to propagate it . but what is all this to the purpose ? where is the previous law that commanded infants to be baptized ? and such a law as must be supposed according to the similitude , to oblige our david and solomon , even christ himself to observe it ? where ( i say ) is this law to be found ? not in the word of god , the doctor confesses that : where then ? why in the talmud , the gemara , &c. very well . but then this wretched talmud was not finished in our saviour's days , but 500 years after , and so could be no rule to him : nor in the time of his apostles , and so could be no rule to them , and therefore i hope it shall never be a rule to us . the doctor , p. 38. says , we put the greatest stress upon mark 16. 16. but it is plain ( saith he ) that the believing and not believing in that text , is only to be understood of such as are capable of hearing and believing the gospel . now as this is very true , and therefore infants may and shall be saved without believing ; so it is as true also , that infants are not concern'd in the duty of baptism here mentioned , but may and shall be saved without that also . and as the doctor tells us , he has proceeded thus far to shew how inconclusively and absurdly we argue , &c. so i have proceeded thus far too , to shew how little truth or reason he has used to convict our arguments of weakness . but he adds , so weak are all the arguments of the anabaptists , by which they endeavour from scripture to prove that christ hath limited the subjects of baptism to grown persons , &c. even so i reply , that our weak arguments are too strong to be overthrown by such impertinent similitudes as the doctor has brought against them . and for scripture , as he has none , so he has brought none , but 2 thess . 3. 10. which he has also very much perverted , as he doth also the arguments used by us . here the doctor ( p. 39 , 40. ) is pleased to say , that infant baptism is so universal and ancient a practice , that no body knows when and where it began ; or how not being , it came to be the practice of the church , since there was never any church ancient or modern , which did not practise it , it must argue a strange partiality to think that it could be any less than an apostolical practice and tradition . and he brings tertullian saying , had the churches erred , they would have varied , but what is one and the same amongst them all , proceeds not from error , but tradition . here the doctor has left his jewish fort , and takes sanctuary in apostolical tradition ; and indeed , the wisest man that asserts this scriptureless practice , is at a loss where to fix it . nay , the doctor now tells us plainly , that no body knows when , and how , and where infant-baptism came in . and we tell him as plainly , that this is a sign that it is an error , and came in privily , stealing by degrees upon the churches , as false teachers are said to do , gal. 2. 4. but now if the doctor will stand to tertullian's rule , we shall soon prove that infant-baptism is an error . for , 1. all churches have not held or practised it ; no , not so much as one church mentioned in the holy scripture , or during the apostles days . the mother church at jerusalem knew no such practice , for non apparentibus , &c. that which appears not , is not . it 's easy for the doctor to say , all churches held it , but it 's impossible for him to prove it . he confesses , no body knows when it came in , nor how , nor where ; and why then might there not be true churches before it came in , even in his own judgment , and then all churches have not held it . 2. but now this is our argument from tertul. if the churches varied about infant baptism , then they erred in it : but they varied about it , ergo they erred in it . the major the doctor must not deny , because it 's become his own ; the minor i shall prove presently ; first , in tertullian himself , for he was not always the same , even as he is quoted by the doctor , p. 41. for first he brings him in saying , pro cujusque personae conditione , ac dispositione , etiam aetate cunctatio baptismo utilior est , praecipue tamen circa parvulos , &c. it seems then , that tho he speaks favourably of it afterwards ; yet he thought the delay of baptism , especially for little children , to be more profitable . and this also was the opinion of nazianzen : these two great men , who are ( at least the first of them ) as early witnesses of infant-baptism creeping into the church , as can justly be named , shewing so much doubfulness about baptizing infants , is a great sign it had no authority from christ and his apostles ; for what were these men to teach to delay it , if christ had commanded it ? and yet so they did expresly teach , as the words quoted out of tertullian by the doctor do farther shew , because it was his present opinion , that , cun●tatio baptismi praecipue circa parvulos was utilior . he answers , venient dum adolescunt , venient dum discunt , dum quo veniant docentur . yea , he further saith , fiant christiani quum christum nosse potuerint ; but this the doctor left out . and if after this he altered his judgment , as the doctor supposes , ( though some learned men think otherwise ) it shews , that he was contrary to himself in this thing . now that whole churches varied about it , whether we respect the infant subject , or the alteration of dipping to sprinkling , has been abundantly made evident by many ; so that i shall content my self with an instance or two out of the learned du-veil , who from grotius on mat. 19. 13. gives this account : that according to the rule of scripture , and agreeing with reason it self , the most part of the greeks in all ages , even unto this day , retain a custom of delaying infant baptism , till they themselves can give a confession of their faith. he also brings nazianzen , in his 40th oration , treating of those to whom baptism was not administred by reason of infancy . and it is certain , that nazianzen himself , though the son of a christian bishop , about the 4th century , and bred up in the christian religion , was not baptized till he was about thirty years of age. the same is also true of chrysostom , hierom , ambrose , austin , and others . and hence ( saith he ) it does manifestly appear , that the wisest of our fathers in christ did not come to baptism , until they were come to a strong and confirmed age and wit. note here , the wisest of our fathers were not baptized in infancy ; you may be sure then , that the churches did vary about it . i could never read of so much as one of the ancient fathers , for six hundred years after christ , that was baptized in his infancy . the learned curcelaeus , as quoted by du-veil , affirms , that the custom of baptizing infants , was brought in without the commandment of christ , and did not begin before the third age. and the custom of it being brought in , was much more frequent in africa than in asia , and with far greater opinion of necessity . this must needs satisfy , that the churches did vary about infant-baptism at its first creeping into the church . and how christians have varied one from another because of it , is apparent in all ages and nations almost ever since it had a being , has been very largely evidenced , by the care and industry of mr. danvers and others : and , i think , this present age may speak for it self , that there are very many christians , and churches too , who vary about this matter . therefore after the doctor 's rule from tertullian , they have , and do err in this matter on the one hand , or on the other . as the alteration of the subject , so the alteration of the manner of the administration , has caused great discord among christians . how offensive it was to use sprinkling ( which it should seem some were labouring to introduce ) in the year 816 , may be gathered from the synod of celicyth , who gave strict order to dip , and not to sprinkle ; let the presbyters beware , that when they administer the sacrament of baptism , they do not pour water upon the heads of the children , but let them be always plunged in the font , according to the example of the son of god. but directly contrary hereunto , our english synod , in their rubrick , do order the presbyters to sprinkle , in case the child be weak ; and ever since they were all weak that were brought to be baptized , for they do nothing but sprinkle . and so pernicious is this alteration , that the muscovites , and others , do now deny the latins , and other western countries , to be rightly baptized , because they have changed the manner from dipping to sprinkling . i might enlarge my testimonies of this kind out of the learned du-veil and others . and yet the doctor would perswade the world , the churches have not varied about this matter . nor need the doctor wonder that none of the writers in the first age of christianity , are found to detect the baptizing of infants , seeing there are none that yet appear in that age to have held any such thing . and dr. barlow has given testimony , that there is no just evidence of infant-baptism till about two hundred years after christ . the dissenters therefore are not unreasonable ( as the doctor would have them ) in charging those that have altered , or that approve the alterations thus made in the case of sacred baptism , with apostacy , or falling from the simplicity of the gospel , at least in this ▪ that they have now no true baptism . i freely grant , ( saith the doctor ) that no arguments are equal to the scriptures , when the interpretations of them are not doubtful . and certainly the texts which concerns the subject and manner of baptism , are none of the scriptures whose interpretations are doubtful , because it did not comport with the wisdom of christ that they should be so . certainly the rule which god gave about circumcision was plain enough ; and shall we think our saviour did leave us to ambiguities to guide us , in admitting his people to church-priviledges ? what then can we suppose to be plain ? this very thing then that the paedobaptists are constrain'd to confess , ( as mr. baxter and others ) that it 's a very difficult thing to prove infant-baptism , and that ( as the doctor here ) the scriptures which are brought for it are not plain , for if they were , he confesses no arguments are like them ; but being not clear for infant-baptism , tho as clear as the sun for believers baptism , therefore he flies to the harmonious practice of the ancient churches , and the undivided consent of the apostolical fathers as authentical interpreters , &c. but these are mere flourishes , there has been no such harmony , nor such undividedness among churches and fathers in this matter , as we have shewed . he brings many passages out of authors ancient and modern ; but these , especially the most ancient of them , have been so effectually scan'd by many learned pens of those of our way , as tombs ▪ fisher , blackwood , danvers , den , du-veil , and others , that it 's needless to do more . i shall rather endeavour to quiet the clamour about fathers , ancient churches , &c. as if all must be determined by their sentences , by presenting the reader with that grave speech of lactantius , one of these fathers themselves , by which it will appear ▪ that this clamour is unreasonable . thus he speaks , lib. 2. c. 8. div. instit . dedit omnibus deus pro virili portione sapientiam , &c. god hath given wisdom unto all men , according to a competent measure , that they may both find out things unheard of before , and weigh things already found out . neither because they had the start of us in time , doth it likewise follow that they have it also in wisdom ; which if it be indifferently granted to all , it cannot be forestalled by them which went before . it is unimparable , like the light and brightness of the sun , it being the light of man's heart , as the sun is of the eyes . sythence then to be wise , that is , to search the truth , is a disposition imbred in every man , they debar themselves of wisdom , who , without any examination , approve the invention of their ancestors . but this is that which deceives them , they , like unreasonable creatures , are wholly led by others ; the name of ancestors being once set in the front , they think it cannot be , that either themselves should be wiser , because they are called punies ; or that the other should be in any thing mistaken , because they are called ancestors . so that if the doctor had quoted more of the ancients than he has done , yet so long as we have the highest authorities , the holy scriptures , and the reason of men , as well as the ancients , we can only follow them , as we see or know they follow christ . and more than this st. paul does not require of us . the ancient fathers ( saith the doctor ) undoubtedly had well read and considered the history of baptism in the acts of the apostles , but never drew such absurd consequences from them , &c. and did they not as well read the history of communion in the acts of the apostles ; and yet drew these absurd consequences for 600 years together , that infants should be communicated . but to this the doctor tells us , that god might suffer all the church to fall into such a harmless practice as that of infant-communion ; or that the fathers of the church might comply with the religious fondness of the people , as we do , saith he , in bringing them to prayers . now as this may be well guessed , so we likewise may conjecture , and it 's not improbable but infant-baptism came stealing so too upon the churches at the first ; but after these errors had got root , they were both defended by the fathers as if they had been oracles drop'd from heaven . and such a necessity laid upon them , as if infants could not be saved without them . thus did augustine teach , both concerning infant-baptism , and infant-communion . the doctor demands , what account can rationally be given why the jewish christians who were offended at the neglect of circumcision , should not have been much more offended , if the apostles had refused to initiate infants under the new testament ? but we may with more reason demand of the doctor , seeing the jews were so offended at the neglect of circumcision , why did not the apostles quiet this discontented people by telling them , you need not be offended , seeing instead of infant-circumcision you have now infant-baptism ? and if indeed there had been any such thing , it had been the most pertinent means to quiet them , to refer them to that for satisfaction . but seeing the apostles make no use of this argument , it 's clear they had no such thing to argue from , for where they could use it , they did , as in the case of baptized believers themselves , coloss . 2. 11. which is a sufficient argument that infant-baptism had no being in the church in st. paul's time , seeing he never mentions it at all , no not then when he had the greatest occasion for it that could be given . the doctor observes , that the jews always looked upon the children of pagans as common or unclean ; but upon their own as separate and holy. and then he tells us , that st. paul makes the same distinction between them , 1 cor. 7. 14. but this is so expresly against the word of god , that i admire the doctor should write it , was not this distinction between jew and gentile , the one being common and unclean , the other holy , taken quite away . acts 10. 15 , 18. what god hath cleansed , call not thou common : which the apostle expounds thus , ver . 28. god hath shewed me that i should not call any man common or unclean . and why should the doctor so much as think that st. paul should count the infants of jews or gentiles which do not yet believe , common and unclean : the text 1 cor. 7. 14. says not a word to that purpose ; but is an answer to the scruple which some christians had about continuing in marriage-union with their yoke-fellows , who were unbelievers , supposing them to be unclean ; but st. paul perswades them to continue in that relation , for that they were both sanctified to that relation of husband and wife , else saith he , your children were unclean . now this text is greatly abused by poedobaptists , and the learned muscullus , who had abused this text as they do , at last did confess as much . now this place acts 10. 15 , 18 , 28. does so fully explain st. paul , that no man can with any shew of truth or reason make a distinction between a christian's infant , and the infant of an indian , to call the one common and unclean , the other separate and holy ; for if we may call no man ( as such ) common and unclean , much less may we call an infant so . if they be born according to the law of god , they are called by the prophet malachi a seed of god , chap. 2. v. 15. and though this mercy of god towards all infants equally , might perhaps gaul the jews , as it does the doctor and his party , yet it 's evangelical doctrine , and shews evidently that god is no respecter of persons ; and infants being all equally the same , as objects of his pity , he despises none of these little ones : the innocent babes in nineveh were as dear to him , as the innocent babes in the land of israel : and yet for all this it is certain that the children of faithful men have many blessings , which the children of evil men have not ; being children of many prayers , and under early advantages to know the lord , and to cut short the days of iniquity : whilst on the other side the children of unbelievers are in danger by an evil education to be kept from the truth ▪ and brought up in error , and as such they ( as their fathers for the same cause ) become defiled , not by birth , but by sin , tit. 1. 15. for as born according to god's ordinance , they are his offspring , acts 17. 28. and so holy. and to this agrees the sentence of muscullus , vnless marriage were holy and clean , even between vnbelievers ; what other thing would follow , than that all the children are bastards and unclean ? but far be it from us to say so ; they are holy , for they are born of lawful marriage . chap. v. answereth the doctor 's third , question , whether it be lawful to separate from a church which appointeth infants to be baptized ? that the church or people of god ought to be a people separated from them that live in wickedness , and are professed adversaries to the truths of the gospel in things essential to church-communion , will not be denied , i suppose by any christian . now there are two causes , besides that of the want of true baptism , which does warrant the present separation maintained by the present baptized believers , from the parochial church-communion . the first is that great impiety and ungodly living which is every where to be seen in such churches : for the worst of men to be sure will croud into those churches as their sanctuaries ; let the most vigilant magistrates , and the well-minded persons in national churches do what they can , ( in their present constitution ) for there will they be , yea and in places of preferment too . secondly , the many innovations and continual alterations in religion , not to be avoided in national church-constitutions , by reason of the influence of interest , and of the revolutions which national government has always upon them , does necessarily enforce ; at least some distinction in communion , between such churches , and those whose professed principles are constantly to adhere to apostolical institutions only , in all things essential to the constitution and government of the church of god ; which must ever be the same , ( or should be ) however the government of nations do alter or suffer revolutions . and to this agrees that excellent sentence of a divine of the church of england , in his sermon before the court of aldermen , aug. 23. 1674. we have an obligation to the laws of god antecedent to those of any church whatsoever : nor are we bound to obey those , any further than they are agreeable with these — separation from a church is lawful , 1. when she requires of us , as a condition of her communion , an acknowledgment and profession of that for a truth , which we know to be an error . 2. when she requires of us , as a condition of her communion , the joyning with her in some practices , which we know to be against the law of god. in these two cases , to withdraw our obedience to the church , is so far from being a sin , that it is a necessary duty . now this being our very case in the point of baptism , it would justify that distinction which we hold needful , between the church of england , and those of the baptized believers ; but much more when there are some other things as pressing perhaps as this . but now let us hear the doctor . considering ( saith he ) what i have said upon the former questions : this question must be answered in the negative , whether we consider infant-baptism , as a thing lawful or allowable only , or as a thing highly requisite and necessary to be done . and as a foundation on which to build infant-baptism as a thing at least lawful and allowable , he directly denies this principle , that nothing is to be appointed in religious matters , but what is warranted by precept and example in the word of god , accounting this rule an absurdity , and inconsistent with the free and manly nature of the christian . religion — and that it is an impracticable principle , &c. p. 49 , 50. but that this great principle , well understood , should be spoken against by a protestant , is something strange , and especially , that he does not suffer it to take place in that which is essential in a church-state , as who are and who are not to be baptized , is such a case : but he will have infant-baptism to be admitted , as lawful and allowable , tho it be not warranted by precept nor example . to free this principle from abuse , as here suggested against it , we will explain it , as we hold and maintain it . 1. then we do not say that every thing , which is naturally or meerly accidental and circumstantial in the worship of god , must have precept and example in the word of god. 2. nor do we hold that things which are meerly indifferent ( if not imposed as boundaries of communion ) are therefore to be esteemed sinful , because not expresly warranted by precept or example in the word . 3. but we apply this rule always , and so in our present question , to such things as are essential to church-membership , and church-government , as true baptism is to the first ; and cannot be admitted only as a thing indifferent , and as such allowable or lawful only ; for it 's either necessary in the constitution of a church , or it 's nothing : and who are of right , and who are not to be baptized , is of the essence of baptism , and can admit of no lower a consideration . the principle thus explained , is clearly justified by the word of god ; and if protestants part with this principle , they will lose themselves . now thus saith the lord , ye shall not add to the word which i command you , neither shall you diminish ought from it , that you may keep the commandments of the lord your god , deut. 4. 2. what thing soever i command you , observe to do it , thou shalt not add thereto , nor diminish ought from it , deut. 12. 32. every word of god is pure — add thou not unto his words , lest he reporve thee , and thou be found a liar , prov. 30. 6. and it is observable that our lord , as he was sent to be a minister of the gospel , claims no authority to speak of himself , john 12. 5. whatsoever i speak therefore , even as the father said unto me , so i speak . how ought this to put an awe upon all that speak in the name of the lord about religion ? neither does the holy spirit it self [ as sent to supply the personal absence of christ ] take upon himself to give or abrogate laws , but to bring things to the apostles remembrance , john 14. 26. howbeit when the spirit of truth is come , he will guide you into all truth ; for he shall not speak of himself , but whatsoever he shall hear , that shall he speak : and this is the rule also by which the spirit of truth is known , namely by his advancing the things delivered by christ and his apostles , he shall take of mine , and shew it unto you , he shall glorify me . 1 tim. 6. 3 , 4. if any man teach otherwise , and consent not to wholesome words , even the words of our lord jesus christ , he is proud , knowing nothing . 1 john 4. 6. he that knoweth god , heareth us ; he that is not of god , heareth not us : hereby know we the spirit of truth , and the spirit of error . rev. 22. 18. if any man shall add to these things , god shall add the plagues which are written in this book ; and if any shall take away from the words of the prophecy of this book , god shall take away his part out of the book of life . and that this text does establish as unalterable the whole new testament our adversaries do acknowledg : see diodate on the place . and calvin upon deut. 12. 32 : sith they ( saith he ) cannot deny that this was spoken to the church , what do they else but report the stubbornness of the church , which they boast to have been so bold as after such prohibitions , nevertheless to add and mingle of her own with the doctrine of god. and luther doth aver , that no doctrine ought to be taught or heard in the church besides the pure word of god. beza upon levit. 10. 3. speaking in the person of god , i will punish them that serve me otherwise than i have commanded , not sparing the chief , that the people may fear and praise my judgments . mr. borroughs in his gospel-worship , p. 8. all things in god's worship must have a warrant out of god's word , must be commanded ; it is not enough that it is not forbidden , and what hurt is there in it ? but it must be commanded . in a book called , a brief account of the rise of the name protestant , p. 12. printed 1688 , we read thus , protestantism doth mainly or rather only consist in asserting the holy scriptures to be the rule , the only rule , by which all christians are to govern and manage themselves in all matters of religion ; so that no doctrine is to be owned as an article of faith , on any account , but what hath very plain warrant and sound evidence from the scriptures : nor no instance of religious worship to be owned or submitted to , as necessary , nor any thing to be determined as a part of religion , but what the scriptures do appoint and warrant . thus our adversaries themselves do say as much for this principle which the doctor condemns as absurd , as we do . and indeed where this principle is neglected , many innovations are introduced , and many truths are neglected , under as fair shews of antiquity as can be pretended for infant-baptism . the doctor then had little reason to call this a slavish principle , which is indeed the principle which delivers us from slavery , to jewish fables , mens inventions and traditions . pag. 53 , 54. the doctor , to support infant-baptism , tells us , how he builds many points of faith and practice , nor upon certain evidences of the scripture , otherwise than as interpreted so or so , by the catholick church ▪ as 1. that christ is of one substance with the father . 2. that there are three persons in the trinity . 3. that it is necessary for christians to assemble on the lord's day . 4. that the church be governed by bishops . 5. that women have the lord's supper . 6. that infants are to be baptized . and these things he makes necessary , no otherwise , but as the catholick church has interpreted divers scriptures to justify them to be so . sure this is strange doctrine for a protestant . but were a man disposed to trace him in all these particulars , it might appear that the churches in most ages have been divided in all , or the most of these points ; that so that he makes the catholick church ( as it is commonly taken ) so great a foundation of his faith , as he here pretends to make her , will meet with many difficulties to discourage and take off his confidence . and particularly if i desire him to resolve me but this one , what sort of christians are this catholick church ? but he adds , we can prove infant-baptism from the scope and tenor of the gospel , and from many passages of it , as they are interpreted according to the practice of the ancient primitive church . but this is a vain boast , and i demand what church , or what apostle did interpret any part of the doctrine of christ , or of the gospel to such a sense ? the doctor replies , it is unreasonable to presume that the gospel would not extend the subject of baptism , as far as the jewish church extended the subject both of circumcision and baptism . but i answer , if this be granted , yet the doctor gains nothing ; for , 1. the jewish church had no baptism at all of divine institution , and therefore could not extend ▪ that she had not . 2. her circumcision was limited to abraham's family , and perhaps not extended to much above a third part of that family neither , seeing all females , and all males that died before the eighth day were debarred of it : whereas the gospel extends holy baptism to all nations , to the end of the world , to both male and female , as they are qualified for it : thus for his argument from the scope . let us now see his particular passages to prove infant-baptism . p. 55. the doctor gives us these texts ( as interpreted by the catholick church ) for infant-baptism , john 3. 5. mark ▪ 10. 14. 1 cor. 1. 16. acts 16. 15 , 33. 1 cor. 7. 14. 1 cor. 10. 2. good reader look upon these scriptures , and thou wilt not find one word of precept or example for infant-baptism in them all . the first place shews that none can be church-members lawfully under the gospel , except they be regenerate , and have the washing of regeneration by water ; but infant-regeneration is a secret , no man can know it , god will fit them for heaven if they die in infancy : this david knew , for his child which was begot in adultery , and died without circumcision , yet he nothing doubted its salvation . the second text , our saviour pronounceth unbaptized ( yea i say , unbaptized ) ▪ infants to belong to heaven , how unwise then was the doctor to bring it for infant-baptism ? if these very infants which were brought to christ's own person , yet were not by him appointed to be baptized , it can never prove that other infants are to be baptized . and seeing our saviour declares that unbaptized infants belong to heaven , therefore that place john 3. 5. cannot by any means be understood of infants . look well also upon 1 cor. 1. 16. and compare it with 1 cor. 16. 15 , 16. and thou wilt find , tho the catholick church say nothing , that the houshold of stephanus were such as had been converted , and were the first fruits in achaia , and had addicted themselves to the work of the ministry , and then these could be no infants . as for the two housholds , acts 16. it's admirable that wise men should bring them to prove what they do sufficiently confute . for lydia had no husband we read of . and there is no infant found in her house ; but the persons of her family received instruction from paul and silas , acts 16. ult . therefore no infants . and of the jaylor's houshold , it is expresly said , that paul spake the word to all that were in his house ; and that he rejoiced , believing in god with all his house . and they went out about midnight to be baptized . all which being well weighed , no man , no church can honestly interpret this text for infant-baptism . and for that place 1 cor. 7. 14. the doctor does injure it , as he did before , in thrusting in the word common . and it is ill done to make any distinction of common and unclean , from holy , which god has not made , but rather taken away , as we proved from acts 10. 15. no man ( as such ) is now to be called common or unclean , and therefore no infant is to be called common or unclean , but being born according to god's ordinance , they are ( as such ) a holy seed , or a seed of god. see the learned diodate upon the place , mal. 2. 14. marriage ought to be of one with one ; and two in the same flesh . god's chief end in this proceeding was , that the posterity might be sanctified ▪ being born in chaste wedlock , according to his appointment ; whereas it is defiled by all manner of unlawful conjunction . and to concude , i wish that my self , and the doctor , my oppos●●● in this case , be found at last as holy as a dying infant of a jew , or poor indian , and we shall be sure to go to hea-heaven ; for i could never find that it is the will of our heavenly father , that one of these little ones should perish . we come now to his last text , 1 cor. 10. 2. where we find , and the doctor does ingenuously acknowledg , that the baptism here meant was but an vmbrage or shadow of baptism , not a real baptism . nor does the text speak of infants being baptized in this umbratical baptism , it seems as clearly restrained to the fathers in the case of baptism , as the eating and drinking spiritually of christ is restrained to them , ver . 3. so that nothing can be urged from this text for infant-baptism , which will not with equal truth and reason conclude for their coming to the lord's table . read mr. diodate upon this place , he was for infant-baptism , yet does not infer infant-baptism from this text , as indeed there is no reason so to do . for it is certain , that all that passed through the sea , were not baptized to moses , seeing there was a multitude of strangers did go with the israelites ; and they are distinguished from the children of israel , exod. 12. 38. numb . 11. 4. but s. paul appropriates baptism in the cloud and in the sea , to the fathers [ all our fathers , &c. ] now for any to add . [ and all their infants ] is a presumption not to be justified . it is not said , that israel , or all israel were baptized , which had it been so express'd , would have more favoured the notion ▪ and yet we know that the words [ israel , and all israel ] do not include infants in many places ; for example , exod. 14. 31. & 15. 1. deut. 13. 11. josh . 7. 25. much less can they be here called fathers , and such fathers too , as did feed upon christ in manna , &c. as well as were baptized unto moses in the cloud , &c. it must needs be very dangerous to insist upon this miracle at the red sea , as a rule to us to baptize infants ; the cause is weak which needs such arguments to defend it . the doctor sets down many other texts in his margin , which i have also put down in mine ; that the reader may peruse them , and see if he can find any footing for infant-baptism in any of them ; the most likely in the doctor 's own judgment , is psal . 51. 5. and yet we know , that david's infant which was born in adultery , was saved without circumcision or baptism . and the doctor ▪ confesses that the requisite necessity of infant-baptism cannot be demonstrated from these texts , without the tradition of the ancient church . and there is no such authentick tradition to be found , ( whatever is pretended ) for he brings none from the first churches at all . and that there is no such tradition , dr. jer. taylor is a great witness , who in his disswasive from popery , and in his rule of conscience , informs us , there is no prime or apostolical tradition for infant-baptism . that it was not practised till about the 3d century , and judged necessary about the 4th . that children of christian parents were not baptized till they came to vnderstanding in the first ages . that dipping , and not sprinkling , was the vsage of christ and his apostles ; and the constant doctrine and practice of the ancients for many hundred years . see also mr. tombes , 3d part of review . but after all this the doctor is pleased to allow salvation to infants which die unbaptized ; because ( saith he ) we ought not to tie god to the same means to which he hath tied us . it seems then god hath not tied infants to any necessity of baptism , nor can he prove that he hath tied us to baptize them . but now he will try another way to enforce his arguments . suppose ( saith he ) that scripture and tradition stood against infant-baptism , in the same posture as now it stands for it , it would not be unjustifiable for any sort of men to separate from the church for not baptizing infants . let us suppose that christ had said , i suffer not little children to come to me , for the kingdom of god is not of such , — and that we had been assured by the writers of the two next ages to the apostles , that then there was no baptizing infants , i appeal unto them whether it would not be highly unreasonable to separate from all the churches in the world for not allowing infant-baptism against the concurrence of such a text to the contrary , and the sense and practice of the catholick church ? the meaning of the doctor i take to be this , that as it is highly unreasonable to separate from a church , who upon a doubtful or probable ground only , does give baptism to children : so it would be highly unreasonable to separate from a church , who upon a like doubtful or probable ground only , should refuse to baptize infants . i confess this is an odd way of disputing ; for here the churches supposed to err on either side , are yet supposed themselves to be true churches , and only erring about such a doubtful practice as this , on the one side , or on the other . but alas the case is far different between the church of england and us . for she is wholly made up of persons thus doubtfully baptized , nay perhaps not baptized at all , whatever she pretends : and by this doubtful baptism she is disclaiming all other baptism in respect of all her members for some hundreds of years . otherwise i must confess , had i lived in the church in the beginning of the third century , when infant-baptism was creeping in , there was then a church truly baptized , distinct from the infants who here and there might perhaps be baptized , upon such supposed grounds as are mentioned by the doctor ; here ( i say ) a separation would in my judgment have been unwarrantable , it being but an ill principle to separate from a true church , tho incumbred with some error . but should i have lived till this doubtful baptism was forced on with anathema's , till it had overtopped and quite destroyed in such a church all practice of baptizing believers in respect of her members , and that the whole church were now become doubtful to me , whether she had any baptism at all : and therewith that she had apparently left the due form of baptism , which she had formerly observed . then i think no man could blame me , if i left this communion , to sit down with those who did yet retain the ancient , and only undoubted baptism , both for subject and manner of administration ; and this is our very case . now seeing it is impossible for us , or any body else , to hold ample communion with all sorts of christians ( and there are some good folk amongst them all ) why should any one of these parties , whether papists , prelatists , presbyterians , &c. expect that all should come to them ? or why should the doctor think we ought to joyn communion with his party , more than others , unless they could not err as well as the rest ? but seeing that is not to be pretended , we must all satisfy our own souls as well as we can , where to communicate , and where to forbear , for with all we cannot have communion ; let us not then grudg one against another about this necessary christian liberty . page 60. the doctor attempts to prove his tradition , not doubtful , but certain in the case of infant-baptism ; to which purpose he insists on that rule given by vincentius lyrinensis , viz. vniversality , antiquity , and consent . but i have shewed already , that all these being truly taken , are all wanting in the case of infant-baptism ; because ( as for other reasons , so for these in particular ) 1. the churches in the apostles days baptized no infants . and 2. the greek churches to this day do retain the custom of delaying baptism ( which yet is no delay ) to children , till they make profession of their faith : and the doctor confesses a few of the fathers were against it . and there might be more for ought he knows , though not counted among such fathers that might deserve as well as any . and it is known that many very learned and good men have seen cause in this and former ages to reject this tradition , though it has cost them the loss of all that this world could afford them . and the authorities here brought by the doctor are not so ancient ( some of them ) as is pretended even by his own confession , and they have been scan'd and answered by the learned pens of den , tombes , blackwood , fisher , danvers , delaun , duveil , and others . lastly , the doctor says , the anabaptists themselves cannot defend the baptizing of such grown persons as were born and bred in the church from scripture , without tradition and practice of the church . as if our saviour's authority to teach and baptize all nations , or to preach to every creature , and to baptize all that believe to the end of the world , were not a sufficient rule to us to teach our children , and to baptize them , matth. 28. 19. mark 16. 16. we see evidently that jesus christ has given but one rule to us and to our posterity , and therefore it was unadvisedly spoken , to say that we cannot produce one precept for teaching and baptizing our children , when they are grown up , being bred and born of christians , as i suppose that is his meaning , by being bred and born in the church . had the doctor considered that exhortation of the apostle to all christians , ephes . 6. teaching parents to bring up their children in the nurture and admonition of the lord , and to children to obey their parents in the lord : and therewith the example of the children of the elect lady , 2 ep. john , who are found walking in the truth , as the apostle and the lady her self had received commandment from the father , it might have passed for a better precedent in this case , than mans tradition without scripture can possibly be , for infant-baptism . i conclude then , that seeing christ's command is as clear for teaching and baptizing our children , as any other mens posterity ; and that it is the express duty of christian parents to bring up their children in the admonition of the lord ( that is , as chrysostom expounds the place ) to make them christians ; and this advice he gave in opposition to the training up children in prophane literature . and the precedent of this vertuous lady , whose children , whilst under her care and tuition , obeyed the truth , and walked therein according to god's commandment , and not as men received tradition from their fathers , but as the apostle had received commandment from the father ; and so he exhorts them to continue , and to beware of other doctrine , and to have no fellowship with such as should bring any other doctrine than that which had been delivered by the holy apostles . this may suffice to answer the objection . chap. vi. answereth the doctor 's fourth question , whether it be a duty incumbent upon christian parents to bring their children to baptism ? i marvel why the doctor puts not the term [ infant ] into his question , he knows we are for bringing our children to baptism as soon as we can . but how does he prove that christian parents are obliged to bring their infants to baptism ? why this he doth by repeating what he had said under the 3d question : 1. about the lawfulness or allowableness . 2. about the requisite necessity of infant-baptism . and therefore i only refer my reader to what has been answered to these things in the former chapter . and now when the parents may very rationally expect some command from god to bring their infants to baptism ; the doctor tells us , there is no necessity of having a command , or example to justify it , but it is sufficient that it is not forbidden . but he refers them to the orders of the church , and quotes heb. 13. 17. obey them that have the rule over you : but never shews at all , who gave such orders to the church , that parents and proparents should bring their infants to baptism . and therefore all that is here said is meer talk without any good warrant . he quotes acts 16. 4. which shews that the decrees which were ordained at jerusalem ought to be kept . and we allow it , but here 's not a word for to bring infants to baptism in these decrees : but here is a decree against the eating of blood , which is little regarded by the doctor , or however his church does not regard it . yet this text of the decrees , he would make serve for infant-baptism , and indeed , had the apostles had power to make such a decree , this was as fit a time and occasion for it as could be , the question being about infant-circumcision ; and the apostles disannulling their circumcision , would certainly have given some notice that they had or ought to have baptism instead of it ; but seeing they do not in the least mention it , we may be sure there was no infant-baptism in being at that time . the doctor will now shew us the benefits of infant-baptism , and from thence infer for the duty of parents and proparents to bring them to baptism ; and the first is their consecration to god. as if no infants were consecrated to god but those who are baptized . methinks our saviour should know how to consecrate infants to god as well as the doctor , but he did it only by prayer or blessing , not by baptizing them . there is no doubt but such as follow his example in devoting infants to god by prayer , do act warrantably , but he that will do it by baptizing them , acts without a guide , and deprives children of the baptism of repentance , when they come to years , and have need of it . his second benefit is to make infants members of the mystical body of christ . as if it were in mans power to make whom they please members of that body , and that when they are fast asleep too . is not this the plain consequence of this opinion , that all infants unbaptized , being not of christ's mystical body , must perish ? i know the doctor does not hold this ; but it 's hard to avoid this rock when men are entangled in this error , that they can make infants members of christ's mystical body by sprinkling or crossing them with water , and they think they can be made so by no other way . now i demand of any man , whether the whole number of the saved ones be not all of christs mystical body ? not doubting but it will be granted . i desire it may be considered , whether these unbapcized infants whom christ blessed , were of his mystical body ? i suppose this will be granted too ; and then consider also whether all infants of whom christ said , to them belongs the kingdom of heaven , are not of his mystical body , as it contains all saved ones ? i believe none will deny this . the last consideration is , whether christ does speak of infants indefinitely , and as such comprehends them all , and if not , how is it possible for any man to know one sort of these infants from another ? all dying infants then are of the mystical body , as it contains all that shall be saved . the doctor 's third benefit , that the baptized infant by that solemnity , may pass from a state of nature , wherein he was a child of wrath , to a state of adoption of grace , wherein he becomes a child of god , p. 64. but is the doctor sure that infants are now children of wrath , that is , liable to condemnation ? sure whatever their state was in the first adam , yet they are acquitted from damnation by the mercy of god in the second adam : for the lamb which was slain from the the foundation of the world , has taken away the sin of the world from innocent babes , so that they are not the objects of god's wrath , but they are objects of his grace and mercy : see jonah 4. 11. who would think that so wise a man should believe that the adoption of grace is regulated by water-baptism ? or that it must needs wait on him when he sprinkles an infant ? for saith he , by that solemnity they may pass from a state of nature , &c. now we teach and believe thus , that the adoption of grace goes before water baptism . and so taught the apostle paul , gal. 3. 26 , 27. we are all the sons of god by faith in christ jesus . and then it follows , as many as have been baptized into christ , have put on christ . but i think the doctor comes very near the papists opus operatum , in what he here asserts concerning infant-baptism . his fourth benefit , that infants have baptism for a sign and seal that their sins are pardoned , and to confer the right of inheritance unto everlasting-life : that baptism washes infants clean from original sin , and seals the pardon of it , and the assurance of god's mercy unto them ; and being cleansed by the washing of regeneration , from the guilt of that natural vitiosity which they derived from adam , and which made them obnoxious to the displeasure of god , they become reconcil'd to him , and acquire as certain a right to eternal life upon their justification , as any believer in the world. now had the doctor proved all this daintily out of the book of god , i should have thought him the finest man that ever wrote about infant baptism , but when he puts me off with origen , irenaeus , &c. i am displeased , and must only take him for a very bold man , but no certain oracle . however he is pleased to add , ( which was very needful for him in this place ) that he cannot deny but infants may be saved without baptism , by the extraordinary and uncovenanted mercies of god. well , here is some comfort for unbaptized infants : but who can think that the covenant of grace should not reach poor infants in the case of salvation , without baptism ? but if any of them that are not baptized be saved , it must be by extraordinary and uncovenanted ▪ mercy . these are new and strange doctrines , and so let them be . the covenant of grace was made with whole adam , gen. 3. 15. and therefore as infants , without their own consent , or any act of their own , and without any exterior solemnity , contracted the guilt of adam's sin , and so are liable to all the punishment which can with justice descend upon his posterity , who are personally innocent ; so infants shall be restored without any solemnity or act of their own , or any other men for them , by the second adam , by the redemption of jesus christ , by his righteousness and merits , applied either immediately , or how or when he pleaseth to appoint . dr. taylor . his fifth benefit , that infants are by baptism admitted into covenant , and ingrafted into christ's body , to acquire a present right to all promises of the gospel , and particularly unto the promises of the spirit , which is so ready to assist initiated persons . this the primitive christians ( he durst not say infants ) found true by experience , &c. he quotes no scripture for all this , but heb. 6. 4. which how well it agrees to infants , let the reader consider . i am perswaded the doctor was so sensible of the unapplicableness of these things to infants , that he durst not name them , but persons all along : but seeing he must mean infants , the very recital of his sayings , is the confutation of them . for can he give so much as one instance of an infant that received the holy spirit upon its being baptized ? and why then does he presume to speak what neither he nor any man else can ever prove to be true ? nay he tells us in this very page , ( for he is too wise a man i hope to face out a fable ) he confesses that the holy ghost cannot be actually conferred ûpon infants in baptism , by reason of their natural incapacity . and yet being loth to let the cudgles fall , it 's notorious how faintly he goes on in this and the next page , ( 66 , 67. ) at last concludes in a kind of an angry huff , saying , no person of common ingenuity , who hath any sense of honour , or any tollerable degree of conscience within him , can without shame and horror break these sacred bands asunder , by which he was bound to god in infancy . but good sir consider , we do not spurn against the good intentions of our parents in designing us to the service of god , tho we justly disallow the irregular methods which they fell into in so doing . your predecessors had their consecration in infancy by spittle , salt , candles , exufflations , &c. you do not think that they were bound to ratify these follies when they came to years : and truly so neither can we ratify your sprinklings , crossings , gossips , &c. in your consecrations , though so far as you mean well , we may not despise but commond ; and also do now that part of god's will which our parents mistake would have prevented . a due regard to vzzah's case , and david's reformation thereupon , obliges us to this . but now we are to hear from the doctor what profit infant-baptism brings to the church of god. the first , he says , it prevents those scandals and shameful delays of baptism , which otherwise grown persons would be apt to make , &c. to this i must needs say , if any thing without the word of god , would induce me to baptize children , this consideration of the doctor would as soon prevail as any thing ; for god knows this duty is shamefully neglected by many whose duty it is to hasten to it . but we must not do evil that good may come ; we may not do what god does not command , because men will not do what he does command . and tho it be true that men will need as many exhortations to be baptized ( and perhaps more ) than to come to the lord's supper , yet all this must not discourage us , nor force us to innovate methods of our own , and leave what god has prescribed . if the faithful minister labour in vain some times , yet his work is with the lord , isai . 49. 4. but i cannot , as the doctor does , applaud the wisdom of those who to prevent mens delay of baptism , ran into another extream , by which the church , however she may be more numerous , yet by this means the grace of baptism is destroyed , or made unnecessary to baptism , because as the learned bossuit confesses , it is separated from baptism in little infants . were good schools for catechising the youth provided , and a painful ministery to keep such schools , this might be a better way to prevent the delays of baptism than to baptize infants ; for in truth , that proving no baptism at all , proves the greatest delay of all . now for the use of such schools , both the scripture and antiquity would stand by us . for when all is said that can be said , baptism being the washing of regeneration , a mystical and spiritual burial with christ , the church ought to have pious care , that none be admitted to baptism , but such as give some competent account of the work of faith with power in their souls . and hereunto agrees the scriptures with full consent ; what hinders that i may not be baptized , saith the eunuch ? if thou believest with all thy heart , thou mayest , saith philip . they that gladly received the word , were baptized . lidea's heart being opened to attend to the word , she was baptized . when the samaritans believed , they were baptized , & so were the corinthians . the galatians were sons of god by faith , and so baptized . the romans were dead to sin , and so baptized ; and so were the colossians : and so did our saviour order it , that he that believeth , should be baptized : we find none else by him appointed to it . in vain do men strive against such clear evidence of the divine will and authority of heaven , and rest upon , and soar very high upon the wing of humane authorities : what is the chaff to the wheat , saith the lord ? wherefore the doctor 's flourish about his high presumption , that the apostles authorized the practice of infant-baptism , and that it is most agreeable to christ's intention , p. 70 , 71. are but mans breath : christ's intention is not known in this matter , but by his word , or the testimony of his witnesses , from whence no such meaning can with fairness be gathered . and for his talk here again of christ's not repealing the jewish custom of baptizing is but vain : nor does dr. lightfoot's testimony and his own , that there was such a baptism , signify so much , but that the test of the learned sir norton knatchbul , and that learned jew dr. duveil , may serve to ballance them . chap. vii . answereth the doctor 's fifth and last question ; whether it be lawful to communicate with believers , who were only baptized in their infancy ? p. 72. in stating this question , the doctor does little more than repeat what he said upon the second and third questions , and grants , that the stating of this depends upon what he said to them . and therefore what is said in answer to these questions , is referr'd to in this place . he tells us , p. 73. it never entred into the heart of any of the ancient christians , to refuse communion with grown persons who had been baptized in their infancy . but the question is not so much what they did , as what ought to be done in this case : yet i must needs say , their case and ours differ exceedingly , as i shewed in answer to the last question before this . they lived when an error was but creeping in here and there ; and it was not pressed as necessary , till about the fourth century ; and so it may be there was no great division about it , tho it 's more than the doctor can be confident of . but we live in an age , when infants are not baptized , but rantized only ; and the churches allowing such a practice , do not now , as then they did , consist mostly of baptized believers ; but the church the doctor would have us communicate with , have not only no other baptism but the sprinkling of babes ; but have been very fierce against all that have opposed it , and asserted the ancient truth , even to the undoing of them , nay , to the destroying them from off the earth ; so that the separation has been evidently occasioned , by the unreasonable and cruel proceedings of the assertors of infant-baptism . it is famous in the writings of learned men , that the donatists and novatians denied infant-baptism , ( tho some of them might permit it in danger of death ) : and it 's certain these christians were very considerable , both for number and piety , and were more disliked by the other party , for their strictness about their communion ordinarily , than for any thing of heresy they charg'd them with ▪ but the apostolici were more ancient , and they are expresly called anabaptists by the papists , because they looked upon infant-baptism as ridiculous . but now if the doctor will have the question truly stated ; as the case is , in our judgment and conscience , then it must be put into these terms : whether it be lawful for baptized believers to hold communion with such christians as they think are not baptized at all ? and then the doctor is a person of that discretion , that he himself must acknowledg that it must be resolved in the negative , till he or some body else do convince us , that the church of england has some baptism , either true essentially , or false in part and form only , which would alter the case . but we do believe she has none at all : so that communion with her is more difficult . we cannot conceive how infant baptism should be necessary by the presumptive will of christ , as the doctor phraseth it . such language is very uncouth to us , and seems to open a gap for men to presume the will of christ to be whatsoever they please , or what by learning and parts they can make a plausible discourse for . it is a weighty consideration , if it were true , that our opinion does infer that there has been no true church on earth for 1100 years , nor a chruch for 1500 , with whom a christian could communicate without sin. but this cannot be true ; for tho infant-baptism was an error ( in our judgment ) ever since it had a being , yet there was always some churches free of it , and those we have taken notice of before to be many of the greek churches , as learned authors do confess , even such as were themselves for infant-baptism ; and with them are to be reckoned ( in this question ) the apostolici , donatists , novatians , and a great part of the waldenses , as is fully made manifest by mr. danvers and others , of which i shall here give a brief account : 1. but first we must premise , that all the churches mentioned in scripture are ours , being baptized upon profession of repentance and faith. no man being able to this day to shew so much as one infant was baptized in any one of the churches mentioned in the scriptures . 2. in the next age to the apostles ▪ justin martyr gives this account of the practice of the churches ; i will declare ( saith he ) how we offer up our selves to god — those amongst us that are instructed in the faith — being willing to live according to the same — are brought by us into the water , and there , as we were new born , are they also by new birth renewed — and then in calling upon god the father , the lord jesus christ , and the holy spirit , they are washed in water . 3. in the third age , mr. baxter tells us out of tertullian , origen , and cyprian ; that in the primitive times none were baptized without an express covenanting , wherein they renounced the world , &c. and engaged themselves to christ . 4. in the fourth age , basil saith , that none were to be baptized but catechumens , and those that were duly instructed in the faith. 5. in the fifth age , chrysostom saith , the time of grace or conversion was the only sit time for baptism , which was the season in which the three thousand in acts 2. and others afterward were baptized . 6. the african churches ( commonly called donatists ) taught , that none should be baptized , but those that believed and desired the same . 7. the waldensian churches tell us ; that by baptism believers were received into the holy congregation , there declaring their faith , and amendement of life . 8. the churches in germany own'd the same faith and practice . 9. the churches in helvetia asserted the same , and suffered for their testimony . 10. the bohemian churches , by great sufferings , bore witness to the same truth . 11. the churches in thessalonica did the same . 12. the churches in flanders suffered for the same cause . 13. the hungarians did the same . 14. and so did the churches in thessalonica . 15. the churches of the ancient britains did the same , and died for their testimony . here some will be ready to say , we value not mr. danvers , he was mistaken in his quotations . but let me reply ; would men but impartially read his defence , they would see cause to justify him from most of the clamours which have been vented against him . neither do we censure good and pious men in the darker times above us , who perhapps had not opportunity , as we have , to see and avoid the error ; god almighty indulging the oversights of his sincere ones in all ages , as we trust he will do ours in this ; for some may yet come after us to restore some truth which we have not minded , being so much busied , both by writing , preaching , and suffering , in defence of some particular truths which are the controversy of our age. and this was the case of our worthy predecessors , who were called to contest with the spirit of error . and we doubt not but all sincere christians , who have not wilfully opposed themselves to any truth , shall find mercy in the day of christ , and receive a reward according to the infinite goodness of god , who will not suffer any to go without a reward , who have been but so kind to any , because they belonged to christ , as to give them a cup of cold water to drink . and in the mean time , i am for so much communion with all christians , as will do them and my self good . but seeing it is impossible for any to maintain full or ample communion with all sorts , professing the christian name at this day ; there is a necessity either for some powerful party to kill all the rest , that she may be the only church , or else brotherly to agree to permit all to chuse their communion , where they can most comfortably enjoy it ; and i heartily desire that none for any cause but true inward peace , would make use of this liberty . but about this we have more fully treated in the fifth chapter , that here we shall add no more at present , but shall conclude with our humble request to the church of england , to consider how great a pressure it must be upon our conscience , to break up our assemblies , which we believe to be truly constituted churches , and to unite with hers , which we believe to be so defective in her constitution , as to have no baptism at all . now that the baptism of repentant believers is of heavenly original , is granted on all hands , that it stands clear both in scripture , and unquestionable antiquity next to the scripture , is altogether undeniable ; and that this baptism is to be continued to the end of the world , cannot be spoken against . and on the other side , does not even mr. baxter , and other learned assertors of infant-baptism , confess ; 't is a very difficult point to prove by scripture ? and do not the learned papists , and some learned protestants , acknowledg there is no scripture for infant-baptism ? neither precept nor practice in scripture for infant-baptism ? that it was brought in without the commandment of christ ? that it is only a church rite , and not of divine institution ? these things cannot be hid from you , and therefore there is a necessity that some speedy and prudent way be taken by the church of england to restore this holy ordinance to its purity , in respect of the subject to be baptized . for though the church of england does retain the doctrine of baptism , with respect to its precedency to other ordinances , its utility and dignity in the church of god ; yet this is to little purpose still , so long as another thing is substituted in the room of it , both in respect of the subject and manner of administration . concerning the latter , let the church of england be intreated to consider the reflections which have been made upon this alteration of immersion to sprinkling , by the learned bossuet in his book of communion , &c. and the conviction which some learned protestants in france have lately met with upon that occasion . i will set down the words of the learned author who calls himself anonymus , as they are translated by dr. duveil upon the acts of the apostles , p. 292 , 293. it is most certain that baptism hath not been administred hitherto , otherwise than by sprinkling , by the most part of protestants , but truly this sprinkling is an abuse . this custom which without an accurate examination , they have retained from the romish church , in like manner as many other things , makes their baptism very defective , it corrupteth its institution and ancient use , and that nearness of similitude , which is needful should be betwixt it and faith , repentance , and regeneration . this reflection of mr. bossuit deserveth to be seriously considered , to wit , that this use of plunging hath continued for the space of a whole thousand and three hundred years ; that hence we may understand , that we did not carefully , as was meet , examine things which we retained from the roman church ; and therefore since the most learned bishops of that church do teach us now that the custom established by most grave arguments , and so many ages , was abolished by her , this self-same thing was very unjustly done by her , and that the consideration of our duty doth require at our hands , that we seek again the primitive custom of the church , and the institution of christ . — though therefore we should yield to mr. bossuet that we are convinced by the force of his arguments , that the nature and substance of baptism consisteth in dipping , what may he hope for from us , but that the professors see themselves obliged to him by no small favour , and thank him that he hath delivered us from error , when we greatly erred in this thing ? and as we are resolved indeed to correct and rectify this error ; so we desire earnestly with humble prayer of him , that he would correct and amend that error of taking away the cup from the laicks coming unto the holy supper . does monsieur bossuet think that the protestants will have a greater respect of that custom which they have sound to be unlawful , and that by the most weighty and solid arguments , than of the institution of jesus christ , and that to let rome get an opportunity of boldly and freely breaking the laws of christ , by the pernicious imitation of our example . far be that wicked frame of mind from them : they are straiter bound by the authority of their holy master , than to despise his voice when his sound cometh to their ears , my sheep hear my voice ; and again , i know my sheep . none , except wolves lurking under a sheep-skin , refuseth and turneth from it . — there is no place therefore for cogging in these things , for those that pretend the specious title of received custom for the days practice , when jesus and his gospel is not the custom , but the truth . from the beginning it was not so , says the same jesus unto them , who did object unto him the worst and cursed custom of their ancestors . when we shall be presented before the judgment of christ , he will not judg his disciples by custom , but by the lively and effectual word of his gospel . neither should any be taken with a vain hope of framing an excuse from the authority of the church , because all the authority of the church is from christ granted unto her for that intent and purpose , that she might procure a religious obedience to his laws , and heavenly precepts , but not that she might break , repeal and cancel them . — there is in the church no more power of changing the rites in the sacraments , than there is power of changing his word and law , &c. thus far the learned and pious protestant . and shall the religious french protestants be thus awakened and resolved to correct and rectify this error , by the reflections made upon it by an enemy ; and shall the english protestants add yet more slumber , notwithstanding they have not only the very same alarm come amongst them from the same pen ; but their own learned men who stand upon their watch-towers , have given them notice of this baptism-destroying error . and besides this , god has raised up witnesses for his truth in this as well as other particulars , who with great learning and judgment have shown the beauty of this institution both by doctrine , and by the practice of it in the royal city , and in most parts of this land , for many years together ; and yet the church of england does not stir up her self at all , to take hold of plain truth in this matter . and tho i am one of the least of the witnesses which god has raised up in this age and nation in behalf of this truth , yet i shall humbly crave leave to address the church of england after this friendly and free manner , as i did mr. bossuet himself . 1. i beseech her to consider that she has now to do with such christians as are in good earnest for the ancient christian religion , as it was delivered by christ and his apostles ; such as would not have any truth , delivered by heavens authority , to be neglected , nor in any-wise to be corrupted by innovation , change or alteration , but religiously observed and kept , according to the due form and power of godliness . 2. as to the case of infant-baptism , be pleased to consider , that the salvation of our infants are as dear to us as yours can be to you , and therefore you have no reason to think that we would willingly omit any thing which god has appointed as a furtherance thereunto ; and being , as all men know , no less zealous for the ordinance of baptism than your selves , you may be confident we would by no means hinder its due extent , but promote it therein by all lawful means we are able . 3. that our lord jesus has made baptism necessary to the salvation of infants , is not revealed in the holy scripture ; nor that he has made it necessary for them at all ; and therefore , as the african council did ill to anathematize those that denied the first , so you have not done well to anathematize such as cannot in conscience bring their infants to baptism . 4. let therefore our brethren of the church of england return to the truth in the case of holy baptism , that we may return to her ; for when it shall be so with her , she will distinguish between the precious and the vile ; yea that very ministration rightly restored , will naturally lead to a far greater purity in church-communion , than has hitherto been attained . but if she will not be intreated to amend her ways and her doings , the lord will plead the cause of his neglected truth and despised people . the conclvsion . the doctor was pleased to reserve some of our objections ▪ against the paedobaptists for the conclusion of his book . now the reader does understand , that tho we shew like arguments for infant-communion , as they bring for infant-baptism , both from scripture and antiquity , yet we do not therefore hold that they are to be brought to the holy table of the lord ; but we do hereby shew that the poedobaptist is not consistent with himself , as for example : this doctor argues for infant-baptism from 1 cor. 10. 2. that because infants passed through the sea ; and it 's said , all our fathers were baptized unto moses in the cloud and in the sea , therefore infants were baptized to moses , and consequently ought to be baptized to christ . now to shew the fallacy of this argument , we say , all that are said to be baptized , ver . 2. are also said to eat and drink spiritually of christ ; so that this scripture is as strong for infant-communion , as for infant-baptism ; tho in truth it 's no rule for either . for how should it follow , that because god saved israel miraculously from the rage of pharaoh , in the cloud , and in the red sea , and fed them miraculously with mannah and water in the wilderness ; therefore we are to baptize and communicate infants . but we have shewed before that the apostle does limit this baptism , and feeding upon christ , to those of understanding , [ to wit , our fathers ] and so doth augustine , speaking of the latter in these words , quicunque in manna christum intellexerunt , eundem quem nos cibum spiritualem manducaverunt . we shew also from this 1 cor. 10. 17. that all that are baptized into one body , are to partake of one bread at the lord's table : and therefore it will follow that if infants ought to be baptized into the church militant , they ought not to be denied the bread and cup in the communion of that body . when they plead from antiquity , &c. we shew them ( and they know it ) that near the second or early ages of the gospel , infants were brought to the lord's table to communicate there , and that this custom continued 600 years , yet it was laid aside as unwarrantable , and we shew there is equal reason to lay aside the custom of baptizing infants . but we have more particularly shewed these things in our animadversions upon dr. s. his digressions about infant-baptism : wherein also the substance of this book of the case of infant-baptism , is redargued ; and indeed this book seems to have been added as an enlargement upon those short notes of dr. stillingfleet , though done perhaps by another hand . i shall therefore say no more at present to the doctor 's conclusion , nor shall i take notice of mr. philpot's dream ; he was doubtless a good man , yet that he did dream waking , as well as when asleep , is evident enough to all that will consider how extreme weakly he goes about to prove infants to be believers , &c. but let us not trouble the dead , we shall ere long be with them , where all our mistakes will be made manifest , and all our unavoidable infirmities will be pardoned . but if any man sin presumptuously , the same reproacheth the lord : and happy is the man who sincerely seeks for truth , and faithfully walks up to his light , tho through unavoidable weakness he may err in many things . for our god knoweth our frame , and whereof we are made , and remembers that we are but dust , and like as a father pities his [ willing tho weak ] son , even so the lord pittieth them that fear him . to him therefore be glory for ever . amen . an appendix concerning the sign of the cross in baptism . because there is bound up with the case of infant-baptism , a treatise called , the case of the sign of the cross in baptism , we shall take so much notice of it as to ask , ( in tertullian's words , vnde venisti ? ) whence comest thou ? and to this the author seems to give answer , ab antiquitate , from antiquity , tradition , &c. and quotes for it tertullian , origen , basil and cyprian , and gives as good ground from antiquity and tradition for it , as our doctor has done for infant-baptism . and he has a clearer text for it too ( if jerome say true ) than any which has been yet alledged for infant-baptism , viz. ezek. 9. 4. set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh . he tells us that by several of the hebrew versions , this mark is supposed to be by the hebrew 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 tau , which jerome says , was in the samaritan character like our t , and so made the figure of the cross . it seems these two cases , infant-baptism , and the sign of the cross in baptism , stands much upon the same bottom , and will stand and fall together . howbeit we shall not do much more about this case , than to be the remembrancer of this generation with what testimony has formerly been given against this piece of superstition , by learned protestants themselves , even such as were our opposites in the other case , who to this plea of the church of england ; that they receive not the sign of the cross as from the papists , but from the fathers of the primitive church , gives them this answer . 1. the fathers can be no vizard for a rite whereof the pagans , jews , or hereticks were the fathers and first begetters . it was the fault of one alexander , that he sang the psalms of valentinus ; it is ours , that we use his cross . i call it his , because he was the first that used this sign , the very first that made account of it , as appears by irenaeus , lib. 1. c. 1. and he did wrest the scriptures to the crosses commendation . — he termed him crux to shew a purging power in him , because he held the cross a purger of man's sin. — and that he was drawn into this opinion by the same means that papists are drawn into it , by a supposed dedication of it in the blood of christ [ not considering that by this conceit men may adore every thorn-bush , because the holy head of jesus was embrued with blood by that crown of thorns wherewith he was crowned . ] and valentinus does confess his a●on was without a figure , until christ by his death upon the cross gave him one , and till now we never read of any that used the figure of the cross before him , or made any account of it . and therefore he it is ( for ought we know ) even valentinus , that first brought it into request and reckoning . and who then will suffer us to say we borrow it from the fathers , and not from him ? — see we not then , that to say we follow the fathers in the cross , ( valentinus the heretick being the first deviser of it ) we are forced to fly like eutropius to the very same sanctuary , which we have denied and shut up to others . the fathers can be no vizard for a ceremony which has been abused since , or what though from the fathers we take this sign ? this helpeth not till the fathers use be justified , which will never be . — he that readeth the fathers writings will meet indeed with such a chaos , as will make him afraid , ( i say not to fall into it ) but even to behold it . who can brook the efficacy which tertullian gave it ? the flesh is signed , that the soul may be defended . the necessity which cyprian gave it in baptism , vngi necesse baptizatum — baptizati signo dominico consumantur . the fathers call this sign spirituale signaculum , ( to wit ) because it bringeth the spirit , for which one place may serve our turn , sequitur spirituale signaculum , quia post fontem superest ut perfectio fiat , quando ad invocationem sacerdos , spiritus fanctus infunditur . and in the opinion of the fathers the water of baptism is nothing worth without the cross . in the opinion of the fathers , the cross is the terror of the devil , and an impregnable wall against him , so that they used the cross themselves when in any danger . in the opinion of the fathers the cross is insigne regni , et clavis paradisi . last of all in the opinion of the fathers , the cross is so necessary , as that it is to be made , coming and going , sitting and standing , even ad omnem incessum , at every stop ; and ad omnem actum , in every action that we do . and to shew the superstition of the cross from tertullian , take a view of it , as set down by the author of the case of the cross — vpon every motion ( saith he ) at their going out , and coming in , when they put on their garments or shoes , at the bath , or at meals , when they lighted up their candles , or went to bed , whatever almost they did in any part of their conversation , still they would even wear out their foreheads with the sign of the cross . and is not this a sad story ? yet our author brings this in favour of it . mr. hooker is brought in as drawing mr. goulart as it were by the hair of the head , to clear the fathers from the superstition of the cross , which he doth not , save in comparison of the popish merit and enchantment which afterward crept in . as for the operative power which they placed in the oily cross , he flatly condemneth them . and whereas it is said that the cross ( among protestants ) coming after the water ( in baptism ) is an acknowledgment of its subjection to it . my author answers , this ill beseemeth our mouths , who cannot endure the papist when he makes the same excuse . the cross which cometh after the consecration in the lords supper belongeth not to it . we oppose against him : the consecration doth reach to the whole administration , whatsoever sign is administred it cannot but ( at least ) in shew pertain to it . therefore it is a part of the sacrament , saith the canon . so all the while the cross is within the celebration of baptism , it is morally a part thereof : for example , the feast came after the worshipping of the calf ; yet because it pertained to the solemnity , the apostle not only counteth it a part of the idols service but such a principal part as includeth all the rest that went before , 1 cor. 10. if thou hast made a separation , ( between the cross and the water ) thou hast made a fair hand . this very separation maketh the cross to be a sign of a divers species , and so by consequent to be an addition , which is unlawful : and the matter of this separation ( boasted of ) maketh the after-place of the cross yet worse — for what though the cross and the water be divers in matter ? so are the bread and the wine in the supper , [ yet ] they make one refection in christ , and so grow to be formally one : and so may these grow to be one likewise , because they make one investing into the church . and doth not the cross touch the water as near as the wine doth touch the bread ? the postation of the wine doth not prejudice it , therefore the postponing of the cross doth not prejudice it . — as long as the cross and the water [ our cross and the popish ] are seen in the same solemnity of baptism , the separation is insufficient . — is not baptism the seal of the heavenly king ? and can any new print be added to the seal of a king without treason ? do we not cry out upon the dove , let down of old upon the baptized for a sign of regeneration by the spirit ? ( one of which i saw ( saith my author ) at wickham not abolished some 25 years past ) sure , a sign in such manner determined , with state in baptism , we can easily prove to have been abhorred throughout all ages , however in the particular of the cross , the oyl and some other signs , god permitted the ancient fathers to fail in heart to bring in ( through their oversight against their own general ▪ doctrine ) that apostacy from the faith which he foretold . [ thus much concerning the cross as grounded upon antiquity , or as coming from the fathers . ] 2. concerning that text in ezekiel 9. 4. our author saith that some of the authors whom jerom followed understood this sign to be spiritual and not an outward mark , which is also the tenent of our writers : [ dr. fulk against martin . ] if our opposites have found out since the sign of the outward cross in this pla●e , i would they would tell us which way they came by it ? [ and after he has set down various opinions about altering the form of the hebrew characters , he tells us out of baronius , that ezra never changed the hebrew letters , that the old ancient copies of the hebrew bibles were many of them remaining ▪ in ezra's time , and that they are all in one character , to wit , the old and ancient characters of the hebrews . — and that the whole matter is of late brought clearly to light by jo. scaliger , who writes thus , the old hebrew and samaritan letters be all one , and the letter tau in neither of them is like a cross , or the greek or roman t. hierom what he writes of ezras's altering the old samaritan tau , he taketh word by word out of origen , in romanos . origen was deceived by a jew , on whose bare relation he grounded himself , which relation was also false . — we must give the fathers leave to play , according to their own pleasure , not only to fetch the sign of the cross out of this tau , but also out of the two sticks which the widow of sarepta gathered , yea to fetch a cross and a t too out of the 300 souldiers of gideon . and ( as the author of the case of the cross tells us ) they of the romish church can discern the cross in the figure of a mans face , by the placing the nose betwixt the two eyes , and much more in the whole body of man with his arms extended : they can discern it in the sword in paradise , and in the cross stick that noah's dove brought back into the ark. and indeed some of the fathers ( saith he ) bent their imaginations something that way , and would fancy the figure of the cross in moses stretching out his arms while the israelites were sighting with amaleck , and in the paschal lamb when the spit went through it . surely these things may sufficiently inform us , that let men be never so great , or never so much reverenced as fathers , &c. yet god is no respecter of persons , but if they will follow their own fancies , and be adding to his institutions , he will even smite them with stupidity , that the childishness of the fathers may appear to very children ; and that all may fear god , and keep his commandments , without adding to them , or taking from them , according to deut. 12. 32. deut. 4. 2. 3. there is a great pretence that constantine the great had direction probably from heaven to make this sign of the cross in his banner ; because he dreamed he saw such a sign in the firmament with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , in hoc vince , [ overcome in this ] written in it . to this it is answered . it was not the sign of the cross that appeared , but a sight somewhat like it , to wit , a mark of christ's name x o p. after this manner x o , or as lypsius upon the view of ancient copies draws it after another manner more different from the sign of the cross , than the former . the former of these cometh nearest to the description of eusebius , therefore the latter may be some imitation of it . but be this dream or vision what it will , we find not that constantine had any authority to turn it into a religious ritual , much less to make it consecratory to many rites in worship , and particularly in baptism . these are after-inventions : for whatsoever honour hath accrued to the cross ( saith our author ) by this dream or vision , it came either from the alchymie of the bishops in those days who drew a cross out of the sight which constantine saw , or from the sophistry of papists since . the truth is the vision which st. steven saw at his martyrdom , acts 7. and that which st. paul had at his conversion , acts 9. are not only delivered to us by divine testimony , but were nothing inferiour to that of constantine , which whether it were a dream or a vision , is not certain , the story giving it both ways ; yet who so absurd to turn the visions of st. stephen and st. paul into rituals , or to assix them to christ's ordinances ? when men do assume this liberty without divine warrant , many evils do follow upon such doings . how much innocent blood has been shed about this sign of the cross , is not easily to be estimated ? and indeed for the sake of this and other such inventions , christians have hated one another with cruel hatred , as late years have shewed . men more account of those tradions , than of the word of god by far . we have seen it with our eyes . a man might be a common drunkard , and yet permitted to preach in the pulpit . but if he would not use the sign of the cross , and the surplice , away with him . this kind of zeal shews that it 's from beneath , it is not of god. and so long as these things remain , and are forced on by authority , there will be continual strife , contention , and devouring amongst christians : as it was so from the beginning of them , so it will be to the end of them : because an evil plant will bring forth according to its nature . we have more sacred institutions , then we can well observe . why do we seek to burthen our selves or others , in matters of religion , with the commandments and doctrines of men ? all which are to perish ; and god in mercy hasten the time , that god's people may have but one heart , and one way . amen . postscript . sect . i. of the manner of marriages among the baptized believers , and that they are warrantable by god's law. some of the baptized believers having been prosecuted as offenders , for not conforming to the ceremonies of the ring , and kneeling to the altar in the celebration of marriage ; we shall therefore humbly offer our reasons why we dissent from these ceremonies ; and why also our marriages are good in the eye of the law , ( for the substance of them ) the omission of these ceremonies , &c. notwithstanding . but first the reader is desired to take notice , that we are not against , but for the publick solemnization of marriage according to the law of the land , save that there are some ceremonies used therein which we cannot comply with . and because some of the priests will not marry us at all , and others will not do it , unless we conform to all the ceremonies required in the service-book ; this puts us upon a necessity to have it done without them , and the manner thus : the parties to be married being qualified for that state of life , according to the law of god , and the law of the land , as to the degrees , &c. therein limited ; they call together a competent number of their relations and friends : and having usually some of our ministry present with them , the parties concern'd do declare their contract formerly made between themselves , and with the advice of their friends , if occasion require it : and then taking each other by the hand , do declare , that they from that day forward , during their natural lives together , do enter into the state of marriage , using the words , or the substance of them , which are appointed for the words of marriage in the service-book , ( as acknowledging them words to be very fit for that purpose . ) and then a writing is signed by the parties married , to keep in memory the contract and covenant of their marriage , to this effect : these are to testify to all men , that we a. b. of , &c. and c. d. of ▪ &c. have , the day of the date hereof , entred into the covenant and state of marriage , according to a solemn contract heretofore made between our selves , and with the cons●nt of such as are concern'd in order thereunto ▪ and we do now , in the presence of almighty god , and the witnesses hereafter named , ratify the said contract and covenant . act of marriage this day verbally made ; in both which we do , in the fear of god , mutually and solemnly , and for our pares respectively promise , in the strength of god , to live together in the state of marriage , according to god's ordinance , from this day forward , to love each other as husband and wife , and faithfully to perform all the duties to which we are bound by god's law , and the good laws of the land , in that case provided , till the lord by death shall separate us . in testimony whereof we have hereunto set our hands , the day of , &c. then is annexed a certificate of the witnesses , thus : we whose names are subscribed , do testify , that the above-said a. b. and c. d. the day and year above-said , did mutually take each other into the state of marriage , acknowledging the contract and covenant , and ratifying the same by word , and by the subscription thereof as above-said . in witness whereof , we do hereunto set our hands the day and year above-said . after these things , some suitable counsel or instruction is given to the parties ( but no man takes upon him the office to marry any , that being the proper act of the parties themselves ) and then prayer is made to god for his blessing upon the parties married , &c. and now whether marriages thus made , are justifiable by the law of god , is first to be considered . to begin with the institution of marriage , gen. 2. 23 , 24. there we find all that is essential to marriage : for he that had the right to dispose of the woman , was pleased to bring her and give her to adam . and moses tells us , that they who are thus joined together , are one flesh ; and are to forsake all other relations in comparison of that relation . the marriage-covenant is explained by god himself , mal. 2. 14. she is thy companion , and wife of thy covenant , of which he himself ( says the prophet ) had been a witness : for whoever else are witnesses in this case , god is the principal , and will punish such as break their marriage-covenant . and thus it appears , that a marriage-covenant between persons who may lawfully marry , with witness upon it , are the essentials of this ordinance ; which is yet more evident in the case of boaz and ruth , ruth . 4. 9 , 10 , 11. and then we may be sure that god appointed no ceremony in the institution of marriage ; nor do we find any ceremony made necessary to the celebration of marriage in the old and new testament ; for that passage of loosing the shoe , deut. 25. 7 , 9. and ruth 4. 7. pertains not to marriage , but concerns him that refuses to raise up seed in israel to his deceased brother . and as there is no ceremony ordained , so there is no one certain form for the celebration of marriage appointed by the word of god ; but this seems rather to be left to liberty , as appears in the case of isaac , gen. 24. 67. and the marriage of jacob , gen. 29. 21 , 22 , 23. and many others . the chief things to be observed in marriage , since the earth was replenished with inhabitants , are these , that regard be had to religion , that a believer marry not with an infidel ; that the persons to be married , come not within the degrees prohibited in respect of consanguinity and affinity . that the conjunction , and marriage-covenant be between one man and one woman ; plurality of wives is utterly irreconcileable with the institution of marriage , and with the doctrine of the gospel , as appears mat. 19. 8. 1 cor. 7. 2. and because our blessed saviour has taught his followers to discern what corruptions have crept into god's ordinances , by observing the first institution of them , and particularly this of marriage , mat. 19. 8. for here he takes down even a precept of moses , because it could not stand with the purity and simplicity of marriage in the institution of it . we therefore confess , with the learned casuist , mr. hugo grotius , that though the conjunction of male and female , whereby mankind is propagated , is a thing most worthy the care of laws ; yet where god's law is known , it is especially to be consulted , both for matter and form , in the things he hath ordained . and therefore we doubt not , but what rules are given by the law of god in the case of marriage are sufficient , at least so far , as that such as are married according to them have all things that are necessary to justify their marriages in the sight of god and man. otherwise it will greatly reflect upon the wisdom and goodness of god , to say he has made this ordinance for the good of mankind , and yet left it defective in the very essentials of it ; and sure it would magnify man too much to suppose him capable to mend this ordinance , but if god make any thing crooked , it cannot be made streight , and that which he hath not made at all , cannot be numbred [ with his works , or counted a necessary part of them . ] eccles . 1. 14 , 15. and seeing no ceremony in marriage has been imposed by the almighty ( as in some other of his ordinances he has appointed ) let no man judg one another to be unlawfully married , because some ceremonies devised by men are not observed , perhaps it might be as strongly argued retro , that they who have taken upon them to add such their devised toys , ( as dr. willit calls the popish ceremonies ) have not true marriage . but as the first is groundless , so this would be uncharitable . and therefore we deny not but that some decent usages or ceremonies may be appointed by authority for the more convenient celebration of marriage , and that the contempt of them may be justly corrected , for the honour of the power magistratical : but then it is also to be considered , that as in other ordinances of god , so also in this , men , yea authorities in most nations of the world , have grosly abused this liberty , by ordaining things ridiculous and sinful in the solemnizing of their nuptial contracts , as shall be shewed . and therefore when and where such prophanations are found , it is commendable always , and sometimes necessary , for such as god has enlightened to see such corruptions , to endeavour after a modest and prudent manner , to have all the ways of god , and particularly this of marriage , to have them , i say , restored to their purity , by being purged from such things as tend to the profanation of them . and herein the learned of the church of england are our precedents : for when they came to consider the popish ceremonies used in their marriages , they were so far from conforming to them , or judging those marriages to be null which were made without them , that they boldly testify against them , and some laid down their lives among the martyrs in opposition to the papists opinion and practice in the case of marriage , as woodman and benbridg . this is testified by dr. willit , synops . p. 679. and where also he labours much to shew the errors of the papists , both in their doctrine and practice concerning marriage , and their ceremonies used therein , and particularly upon this ground , because they made the celebration of marriage a sacramental , or religious act , and had no word of institution in the scriptures for so doing . this therefore which has been said concerning the essentials of marriage , will ( as we conceive ) warrant our marriage-covenants and contracts , to be according to god's law ; and tho we desire and endeavour to come as near as we can to the custom of our nation in the celebration of marriage , which we confess to be of the nature of moral and civil contracts of the highest degree , and therefore under the cognizance of the power magistratical ; yet when the church of england interposes with her power ecclesiastical , to oblige us to the observance of her ceremonies , which are not of the essence of marriages , nor , so far as we can judg , such as we can answer to god , nor act in with the peace of our own souls , we are then constrained , as in other cases , so in this , to satisfy our selves in a diligent observance of the rules of god's law , both for the substance and celebration of our nuptial contracts ; and in so doing , we suppose both the statute and civil law , as well as the law of reason , will at least so far favour us , as to vindicate us therein to have all things necessary and essential to the solemn ordinance of marriage , which also we shall endeavour to demonstrate in the next section . sect . ii. the law of the land does not null or make void the marriages of the baptized beliivers , but does rather establish them . that this also is no uncertain position , but a clear truth , will appear , if we consider , first , that the chief grounds or prime foundations of the laws of england are clearly for us ; for thus saith a learned lawyer , the first ground of the law of england is the law of reason , which is to be kept in this realm as it is in all other realms , and as of necessity it must be ; and because it is written in the heart , therefore it may not be put away nor changed ; it is never changeable by diversity of place nor time ; and therefore against this law , prescription , statute , nor custom may not prevail : and if any be brought against it , they be not prescriptions , statutes , nor customes , but things void and against justice . doct. & stud. l. 1. c. 5. &c. 2. the second ground of the law of england is the law of god. and upon these grounds ( i suppose ) was that excellent statute made in the case of marriage , wherein we have these words , as they are quoted by a learned man , viz. that no reservation or prohibition ( god's law except ) shall trouble or impeach any marriage , 22 hen. 8. c. 38. will. synop. p. 711. of which statute , bishop hall gives this account , i. e. the statute of 32. hen. 8. c. 38. intending to marr the romish market of gainful and injurious dispensations , professeth to allow all marriages that are not prohibited by god's law : and this law is not yet repealed . and therefore it hence appears that no law was then thought necessary to the essence of marriage , but the law of god. and tho there be a proviso in a certain statute made in the reign of edw. 6. that this statute shall not give liberty to marry without the ceremonies appointed in the service-book , yet it does not null any marriages that had been , or that might after be made with the omission of them , or at least some of them : for marriages we know there have been , and are frequently made by divers ministers of the church of england , without the banes , and some other rites , as well as by licences obtained , which could not be done , if the intent of the said proviso were to make all marriages null and void , which are made without banes , and all the rites appointed in the service-book . but lest this should be taken for my private opinion only , i will here alledg the judgment of such as are esteemed among the best learned in the law , whether we respect the statute or civil law. and first , mr. swingburn , bachelor of the civil law , tells us , that an unsolemn marriage , is not therefore no marriage , because it is unsolemn , the banes perhaps not being published , or the marriage being not celebrated in the face of the church , but privately in a chamber , or some other rite or ceremony being omitted ; but it is nevertheless reputed for true marriage , both in the ecclesiastical courts in respect of the essence or knot of matrimony , and in temporal courts in respect of the wives dowry , and other legal effects . treat . of last will , p. 20 , 21. and to the same effect speaketh espenc . c ▪ 11. clandest . matrinto . consensus facit nuptias , sed eorum qui sui jure sunt ; it is the consent of the parties which make the marriage , they being such as are at their own dispose . and again , si pompa al●aque nuptiarum celebritas omitatur , &c. if the pomps and celebrity of marriage be omitted , nothing is wanting to the firmness and sureness of marriage . cod. l 5. tit . 5. tit . 2. and the canon law tells us ; nuptiarum copula dei mandato perficitur ; the marriage-bond is perfected by the commandment of god. thus we see that ceremonies are not of the essence of marriage , that if the command of god be observed , marriage is perfect . and these testimonies are the more considerable to our purpose , because they are alledged against the papists , by a learned protestant , because they doted more then ordinary upon nuptial ceremonies . willit . synops . p. 713. 740. and so rational and necessary it is , that the ceremonies appointed either by the papists or others , should not be esteemed to belong at all to the essence of marriage , that durandus , an eminent papist , tells us , as he is quoted by dr. willit , that there is neither any outward holy sign , nor [ no minister ] necessary in matrimony besides the parties ; for , saith he , matrimony may be solemnized by a proctor between parties that are absent . so then the presence of a priest is not of the essence of marriage , seeing it may be celebrated without them . and which is yet more ; bellarmine , that so much rennowed cardinal , is alledged by the said dr. willit , saying , that marriage being of the nature of contracts , the parties themselves suffice , and that it may be done in their absence . [ meaning still , that all contracts be witnessed . ] and here the words of mr. diodate are worthy of remembrance upon mal. 2. 15. did not god in the beginning create adam alone , out of whom he framed eve to be his wife , without creating any more women for one man , or more men for one woman ? shewing thereby , that as he appointed matrimony by one only law [ in which to be sure there was no ceremonies ] of lawful conjunction , it likewise ought to be one with one , and two in the same flesh . from all which it is apparent that there may be lawful marriage where there is no ceremonies , much more without the ceremonies of the ring , and bowing at the altar , and the ceremonies are not therefore in any-wise to be made essential to marriage , and that the contract between two persons lawfully qualified for the state of marriage , and their actual taking each other into the relation and covenant of husband and wife , before sufficient witness , is essential , firm , and lawful marriage , and consequently that the marriages made amongst the baptized believers are true marriages in the eye of the law of this land. and to make this yet more evident , i will conclude this section with the united authority of the late lord cheif justice hales , and dr. burnet , who fully express themselves for the sufficiency of marriages as made by the present dissenters . and thus the doctor speaks . he ( that is , judg hale ) was very cautious in declaring their marriage void , and so bastarding their children . but be considered marriage and succession as a right of nature , from which none ought to be barred , what mistakes soever they might be under in the point of revealed religion ; and therefore in a trial that was before him , when a quaker was sued for some debts owing by his wife before he married her ; and the quaker pretended it was no marriage that had past between them , since it was not solemniz'd according to the rules of the church of england : he declared that he was not willing on his own opinion to make their children bastards , and gave direction to the jury to find it special , which they did . — he governed himself indeed ( saith dr. burnet ) by the law of the gospel , of doing to others what he would have others do to him ; and therefore because he would have thought it a hardship , not without cruelty , if amongst the papists all marriages were nulled , which had not been made with all the ceremonies in the roman ritual , so he applying this to the case of the sectaries , he thought all marriages made according to the several perswasions of men , ought to have their effects in law. of how great value the judgment of this worthy man is in all courts of judicature , is also testified by this learned doctor in these words ; his opinion in points of law generally passes as an uncontroulable authority , and is often pleaded in all the courts of justice . so that such as out of a fancy to some unnecessary ceremonies , would null all marriages amongst dissenters , though made as publickly and solemnly as we can , and every way agreeable to the law of god , and the rules of reason , will see themselves concern'd we hope , to be better advised than to throw dirt in the face of this great patriot of the law , as if he should be a publick defender of whoredom ; for so do some of our rash ceremonialists esteem and speak of all marriages wherein their ceremonies are omitted . furthermore ; if in this , or any other nation , god's ordinances should become , or be reputed to be nullities ; when in the observation of them , the ceremonies appointed by the church ( or those that call themselves so ) are omitted , there could be little certainty of a right or effectual enjoyment of any of them : for baptism , confirmation , the lord's table , ordination , excommunication ( and what not ) as well as marriage , has been , and is incumbred with so many of the ceremonies of mens devising , that it 's not easy to number them , much less to observe them . but yet such has been the wisdom of the greatest ceremonialists , as to be afraid to annual an ordinance , tho the ceremonies of the church were omitted , and particularly in the case of baptism , ordination , and marriages . do not the protestants allow of all these among the papists , though many ceremonies be used therein which they dissallow ? yea , there is no doubt but both the church of england , and the church of rome , would admit the baptism of our children for a valid baptism , which was performed upon their personal profession of faith and repentance , and by immersion , and by one whom they esteem a lay-man , because nothing is wanting in our baptism which pertains to the essence of the ordinance , though we reject all their rites , sponsors , crossings , &c. and therefore by a parity of reason , our marriages being warranted by god's law in all things essential to marriage , must be allowed good and honest marriages , tho no priest nor ring , &c. was concern'd in them . i say again , does not the church of england hold the ordination received in the papacy to be valid ? and yet they condemn some ceremonies which they use in their ordinations for superstitious vanities ; neither do they marry those papists a second time who become protestants , but do account their marriages valid and good ; and yet their marriages were not celebrated according to the rites of the church of england , not by their ministers . and why ? surely because neither the law of god , nor the law of the land , do say they are null or void . and then sure i am , if they will be but as kind to us as to papists , they must grant our marriages to be more justifiable of the two . for , 〈◊〉 ours is no where condemned by the law of god , nor the law of the land , any more than theirs . and , 2. we bring not in any roman rites in the celebration of our marriages , as perhaps they do in theirs ; but we keep as near the law of the land in the celebration of marriage as we can , and do undoubtedly keep to the law of god and right reason therein , as much as any , as has been shewed . sect . iii. of the most important question touching the case depending , viz. whether it be necessary that marriages should be celebrated by a minister ? and whether they may be valid and lawful without them ? this is the question propounded by that learned and worthy man bp. hall , in his book of resolut . p. 361. c. 8. whose answer will greatly strengthen that which we have said respecting the law of god , for thus he speaks : it is no marvel ( saith he ) if the church of rome ( which hold matrimony a sacrament , conferring grace by the very work wrought ) require an absolute necessity of the priests hand in so holy an act : but for us who ( though reverently esteeming that sacred institution , yet ) set it a key lower , it admits of too much question , whether we need to stand upon the terms of a ministers agency in the performance of that solemn action ? so then it is a clear case it seems , unless we fall back to the papists to make marriage a sacrament , there is no absolute necessity to have a priest to celebrate marriage , and consequently it may be done lawfully ( by god's law at least ) without them . and assuredly that doctrine which makes a minister of god absolutely necessary to the celebration of marriages can in no wise be true , because it is most unreasonable to impeach all those marriages which all the world over , from the beginning to this day , have been celebrated without them : if then all nations have all things that are essential to marriage , and yet few nations have had god's faithful ministers to celebrate it , it is manifest there may be lawful marriages without a minister in all nations , seeing the essentials of marriage is the same in all nations . but though the bishop be for us thus far , yet he seems to be against us in that which follows , for thus he writes ; that as it is requisite ( even according to the roman constitutions ) that he who is entrusted with the cure of our souls , should besides other witnesses be both present and active in , and at our domestick contracts of matrimony ; so by the laws both of our church and kingdom , it is necessary he should have his hand in the publick celebration of them ; there may then be firm contracts , there cannot be lawful mariages without gods ministers . but ( reserving the honour due to so grave a writer ) i must answer thus ; 1. if there may be firm contracts without a priest , that is , contracts made with consent of parents , &c. and before sufficient witnesses , and firm , that is , such contracts as cannot lawfully be broken ( and less than such he cannot mean ) ; then i see not but that the substance , or all that is essential to marriage may be atained without the priests hand , even in the judgment of this learned bishop . but 2. i answer further , that by the testimonies of divers learned men , both in the roman constitutions , and the law of this land , which we have alledged in the former section ; the bishop is mistaken when he says the law of this kingdom does make the priests hand so necessary , that marriage cannot be lawful without them . sure judg hale understood the law of the kingdom , yet he thought all marriages made according to the several perswasions of men , ought to have their effects in law : and indeed should it be otherwise , that the papists and other dissenters should have their marriages nulled , which were not celebrated by a minister of the church of england , it would cause great confusion in the land : and again they must all be prohibited marriage , who are unmarried among the dissenters , and excommunicated by the church of england , for they pretend they candor lawfully marry persons excommunicated ; and how any church comes to assume power to make such laws , we cannot understand ; only of this we are sure , neither the law of god nor reason ( the prime foundation of all good laws ) does warrant any church in so doing . the proof which the bishop seems most to rest upon as the strength of his opinion , is , because christians do know matrimony to be an holy institution of god himself , which he not only ordained , but actually celebrated betwixt the first annocent pair , and which being for the propagation of an holy seed , requires a special benediction ; and how can we think any man meet for this office but the man of god set over us in the lord ? but sure these premisses are not at all apt to bear this conclusion , that none but a priest may celebrate marriage . the argument seems more naturally to be deduced thus : god the father of adam , ( luke 3. ult . ) who also had the right to dispose of the woman , and to give her in marriage , did celebrate marriage between adam and eve. ergo , the father , or those who have right to dispose of the parties to be married , may lawfully celebrate the marriage , and pray for a special benediction ; see 1 cor. 7. 38. and for this we have some light from the word of god in other places ( as has been shewed ) : but that god's ministers were either in the time of the law , or of the gospel , concern'd ( as god's ministers ) to celebrate marriages , does not appear from any hint in the word of god. and certainly had the apostle been of this bishop's mind , he would have given us direction either by his own practice , or some other way , touching this matter ; but that any of the apostles ever married any body , will never be proved : and though jesus was at a wedding and wrought a miracle there , john 2. yet neither he nor any of his disciples did celebrate the marriage , and then why may we not in reason think marriage may be lawfully celebrated without a priest ? we may be sure that those who called christ and his disciples to this marriage , were such as had a love to him , and being in galilee , the place where he had been conversant , and where also his manner was to perform publick ministerial acts ( luke 4. 14 , 16. ) the persons to be married , or their relations , would as soon have desired his assistance in the celebration of their marriage , as any other minister : but the truth is , neither he , nor any of the priests were imploied in that matter that we read of : and hence we may well conclude there can be no necessity to have marriage celebrated with a priest ; and then it may lawfully be done without them . and though we grant a minister may be as fit , and perhaps more fit than another christian , to give good counsel to , and pray for the new-married couple , yet it is apparent the text , which the bishop seems ▪ to alledg to that purpose , intends no such thing at all , as the place being read , will fully demonstrate , 1 cor. 7. 39. the wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth : but if her husband be dead , she is at liberty to be married to whom she will , only in the lord. now the bishop infers thus ; if all our marriages must be ( according to the apostle's charge ) made in the lord , who so meet to pronounce god's ratification of our marriages , as he who is the profest herald of the almighty ? but the apostle does not at all speak of the person that must celebrate marriage , but of the person with whom a christian may lawfully marry , as diodate and others do fitly expound the place . and though we yield willingly that a man of god is a fit person to declare god's will and authority in the ratification of our marriages , yet it follows not at all , that none but a man of god may be fit to do this , or that none may lawfully do it but a herald of the almighty . but what needs many words ? the bishop answers the question , where he tells us , that though the papists make it absolutely necessary to have a minister's hand in the act of marriage , yet the protestants set it a key lower ; and confesses that it admits of too much question , whether we need to stand upon the terms of a minister's agency in the performance of that solemn action . so then this solemn action of marriage may be done without a minister's agency ; therefore there may be lawful marriages without god's ministers : this being granted , we acknowledg it very commendable to have them present , if they may be obtained . but now it would be considered , whether the persons to be married may not lawfully be satisfied that the person whom they imploy in the celebration of their marriage , is in their judgment a lawful minister , or man of god ( supposing it necessary to have such a man to do the business . ) this seems rational , and if so , i doubt there will be a great difficulty in the case . and to be plain , though we could admit very willingly of the prayer of a sober and pious minister of the church of england in the business of our nuptials ▪ yet , when we are required to kneel before one whom we know to be a wicked drunken person , &c. how should we act faith in his prayer , when god himself tells us , the prayers of the wicked are an abomination to him ? we may not safely conform to such things though the laws of men do require it . and indeed the bishop seems to favour us in such a strait as this : for he saith , the laws of men do not , ought not , cannot bind your consciences as of themselves ; but if they be just , they bind you in conscience to obedience . now to this we do most heartily subscribe , only desiring we may have leave to consider what is just or unjust in this case , and then we doubt not of our duty to obey actively what the law justly requires , or else to suffer patiently what it imposes . now though we can find no ground to believe that to celebrate marriage is a ministerial act ( though a minister may do it ) yet we do not refuse the ministers of the church of england , because such , but because they will not ratify our contracts unless we conform to such things as seem to us to be sinful ( as we shall shew in the next section . ) and if it were a work peculiar to god's ministers , our straits in coming to the priests would be greater than they are , because we know god does not allow wicked men to take his word into their mouths , specially when they hate to be reformed , psal . 50. 16. and besides , we believe and know , we have of those that more fully agree with us in matters of religion , that are ministers of christ . and therefore were marriage ( in the celebration of it ) a ministerial work , we should not fail to have it rightly done by them ; but this is not our perswasion : though we think as reverently of this ordinance as any , yet we believe it most fit to be testified before those who are appointed by the laws of the land , and therefore do what with a good conscience we can to have it so , but being rejected ( as we have shewed ) we know our marriages are not therefore null ; because we have all that is essential to lawful marriage , both in the eye of the law of god , and the law of the land also . for the first , this learned prelate does not deny , whilst he makes not a minister absolutely necessary to the celebration of marriage . and the learned judg hale grants the second , that our marriages ought to have their effects in law. and durand ( a man well skill'd in the roman constitutions ) tells us , there is no holy sign , nor no minister necessary in matrimony , &c. as we have shewed . and besides this , it is fully shewed by this learned bishop , that many christians in all ages have done , and may lawfully do some things , tho they be lay-men , which are most fitly to be done by such as have a ministerial authority thereunto , namely , to catechise , defend and propagate the gospel . such were origen , aristides , hegesippus , justin , and many others ; see his book of resolut . p. 265. chap. 10. those who called themselves catholicks in augustin's time , did allow the baptism and other sacred acts of the donatists , &c. to be valid . it is strange then that the marriages of the present dissenters should be made nullities by the common protestants ; who themselves are esteemed but dissenters in a neighbour nation , and therefore their marriages are as liable to censure there as ours are here ; but these are hardships and cruelties in the opinion of that learned lawyer , the late lord chief justice hale . sect . iv. of the rituals of the church of england concerning marriage , and the reasons why the baptized believers comply not with them . how gladly we should be to see an end of all contention amongst christians about unnecessary ceremonies , we have shewed in our friendly epistle , and our late apology ; wherein also we have professed our earnest desire for concord with all that love the lord jesus , and more particularly with the church of england . but it seems all that we can offer below a full compliance even with the most useless ceremonies , is not thought worth the notice of the present clergy , who now do many of them wonderfully exalt themselves , despising such as dissent from them , and that so much the more as by how much we seek to them for peace . marriage-covenants we confess are things of that nature and importance , that they are worthy the care of the laws of all nations . but such has been the unhappiness of the churches which are national , as to ordain such things in order to the celebration of marriage , which becomes a snare to many ; this the protestants found true by experience , when under the papal yoke , and therefore have exploded part of their ritual , whereof we have an account from dr. willit , and the manner thus . 1. they who are to be joined in matrimony , must be blessed by the priest . 2. oblation must be made for them in the sacrifice of the mass . 3. they are covered with a vail . 4. they are coupled together with a ribbon , partly white and partly blew . 5. they bride giveth to the bridegroom a ring , hallowed first , and blessed by the priest . 6. the priest commendeth them to god in prayer . 7. he admonisheth them to their mutual duties . dr. willit , synops . p. 713. now this use of the ring amongst the papists is condemned by this learned doctor of the church of england , for a superstitious toy , partly for that it must be hallowed by the priest ; and partly for that the man holding the woman by the ring , their fingers a-cross , some inchanting words , says he , are then muttered ; but the words he sets not down . and now because the use of the ring in the church of england , and the kneeling at the altar , and to the priest for his blessing , are very doubtful to us , we shall here take a view of the matter . and , 1. the ring must be laid upon the service-book . 2. the priest must then give the ring to the bridegroom . 3. the bridegroom must put the ring upon the fourth finger of the woman 's left hand . 4. and holding the woman by that finger , must say these strange words , with this ring i thee wed : with my body i thee worship : with all my worldly goods i thee endow . in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost . amen . now these things , so far as we are able to understand them , do look as much like superstition , as any thing which the protestant doctor has to object against the popish use of the ring : for why must the ring be laid upon the service-book , and so pass through the priests hand , before it be fit for the use it is to be made of ? certainly the ring is hereby supposed to be made more fit to wed the woman ; and this it cannot be , unless it be supposed to be sanctified , or if there be nothing of all this , it seems to be wholly superfluous . and for the man to say he weds her ( whom he has married sufficiently before ) with that ring , in the name of the father , &c. is so like a sacramental form of words , as that we are sure none more solemn are appointed to be used in holy baptism : nor can any higher form of words be devised . had almighty god appointed this form of words to be annexed to the use of a ring , all men would and surely might have concluded marriage among christians to be a sacrament as well as baptism : but seeing he hath not done it , it seems to us too bold an attempt ; for any church to impose such a rite or ceremony in so great a name , and therefore in conscience we dare not conform to the church of england in this thing ; for it is dangerous to speak a word , much more to make an institute , in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost , which he hath not commanded . let us consider whence the ring in marriage was derived , that we may the better judg of the matter . 1. then it is reckoned among the heathen roman rites in their marriages , and the manner thus ; the man gave in token of good will ( they say ) a ring unto the woman , which she was to wear upon the next finger to the little finger on the left hand , because unto that finger alone proceeded a certain artery from the heart : here seems to be the radix or spring of the ring in marriage , unless perhaps it might be before this among the superstitious jews ; for thus we read , the wedding-ring among the jews had this inscription , mazal tob , [ which the learned say , is to wish good luck ] and it was given to the bride-wife : and the hebrews called the planet jupiter mazal , whose influence they thought to be of great force for generation . godwin . antiq. of the rom. and jews . now which of these soever was the spring-head , though there seems to be something of superstition or folly in the business , yet i think an impartial man must needs say the ring has attracted more of that kind among the christian nations , than it had among the jews or heathens . the short is ▪ were the ring used only as a civil ceremony , without this seemingly sacred solemnity , we should say nothing . but for christians to adopt either the heathen or jewish superstitious rites into the service of the church , and to make the celebration of them ministerial acts , is the business for the serious and thinking christian to consider . and assuredly till it turn to the lord to encline the hearts of his people with one accord , to restore his holy ordinances ( and amongst the rest this of marriage ) to their native purity and simplicity , there will be continual cause of sorrow , discontents and animosities amongst christians , and occasion thereby given in all christian nations for the more carnal and ceremonious , to persecute the more spiritual and serious sort of christians . and the grave author of the the first part of the naked truth ( not that of mr. h. ) makes those without doubt to be always the weakest and most carnal , who stand so much for ceremonies ; and speaking of the ring , he makes it ( in respect of himself ) as a thing of meer indifferency , to be married with or without it . and were it left to that liberty , we should not much complain ; but alas 't is made so necessary that we cannot be married by a priest without it . 2. we cannot understand how to worship our wives , yet we can understand st. paul , where he bids us give them honour as the weaker vessel . to worship any creature in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost , is very suspicious ; but i say , to worship our wives thus , is a thing we understand not . this seems to be borrowed from the forementioned jews , who had jupiter in such esteem : for the same antiquerist tell us , that the words of their dowry-bill ran thus , be thou unto me a wife according to the law of moses and israel , and i according to the word of god will worship , honour , maintain and govern thee , &c. but where the word of god obliges a man to worship his wife , is yet unrevealed to us . there is indeed a civil worship due to our superiours , or persons of great worth , luke 14. 12. but the law of god and nature has made the man superiour in marriage , and why are we to unman our selves to gratify a ceremony ? in all that i have written i design nothing against the church of england , whom i unfainedly honour , as i do all that heartily love jesus christ , as charity commands me to believe she doth ; yet let me freely say , that the sign of the cross in baptism ( though certainly an errour , because added to a sacred institute of christ , without any allowance from his word , yet ) is much more excusable than this sign of the ring . for if we consider their original , the cross was used in defence of his honour who died upon a cross , and in opposition to the blasphemy both of jews and heathens . but the ring was borrowed from the superstitious rites both of jews and heathens , and so more unfit for any service among christians . again , the cross is not so highly honoured in baptism , as the ring is in marriage ; for the cross is not made or used in the name of the trinity , as we see the ring is . moreover , the sign of the cross may be omitted sometimes , even by the laws of the church of england , ( as in private baptism ) but the ring is not so . that baptism is not doubted to be valid , which wants only the sign of the cross , but ( according to some of our present clergy ) the ring must be one , or else they will not celebrate marriage , and if it be done without the ring , will almost condemn it for no marriage at all . but sure it is not in the power of any church to make laws , ordinances , rites or ceremonies , so necessary to this ordinance of god ( i mean marriage ) as that the omission of them should null god's ordinance , or put a bar against mens having the benefit of that ordiaance , which both the law of god and nature allows them . hath not the church often been not only the least , but also a persecuted people in a nation , and may be so again ; how then can it pertain to her to make laws in cases which concern men as men , and all men in a nation as much as any ? and in which she is bound to observe the laws of these nations ( so far as she may do it without sin ) rather than prescribe ( unless to teach the law of god to them ) what ceremonies they must use in their nuptial celebrations . but forasmuch as marriages are the foundation of families , and that upon the legality whereof the good of posterity does much depend , we therefore conclude , this universal ordinance of god is under the cognizance of the magistrate , whose care is to see that nothing be done herein against the law of god , right reason and common honesty , but that all violation of these rules of government should be corrected , and the contrary encouraged . and herein we chearfully submit our selves to their majesties , and to all that are in authority as in duty bound , most humbly intreating that some prudent care may be taken by our superiours that whatsoever is grievious herein may be removed . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a41792-e230 s. fisher ▪ bap. ●●● . p. 311. notes for div a41792-e1280 mr. cox on the covenants . mr. brouhgton consent of scripture . notes for div a41792-e5320 sir norton knatchbul . notes for div a41792-e10680 rom. 5. psal . 51. 5. rom. 3. 23 , 24. 1 cor. 1. 15 , 21 , 22. 2 cor. 5. 14 ; 15. job 14. 4. notes for div a41792-e12300 acts 8. 46. acts 16. 14. acts 2. 38. acts 8. 12. acts 2. 41. acts 18. 8. mark 16. 16. notes for div a41792-e14700 dr. fulk against saund. c. 13. the baptizing of infants revievved and defended from the exceptions of mr. tombes in his three last chapters of his book intituled antipedobaptisme / by h. hammond ... hammond, henry, 1605-1660. 1655 approx. 325 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 59 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2007-01 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a45397 wing h515a estc r875 11875380 ocm 11875380 50200 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a45397) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 50200) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 533:5) the baptizing of infants revievved and defended from the exceptions of mr. tombes in his three last chapters of his book intituled antipedobaptisme / by h. hammond ... hammond, henry, 1605-1660. [2], 108, [5] p. printed by j. flesher for richard royston ..., london : 1655. reproduction of original in bristol public library, bristol, england. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data 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true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng tombes, john, 1603?-1676. -antipaedobaptism. infant baptism -early works to 1800. 2005-12 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2006-04 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2006-06 john latta sampled and proofread 2006-06 john latta text and markup reviewed and edited 2006-09 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the baptizing of infants revievved and defended from the exceptions of mr. tombes , in his three last chapters of his book intituled antipedobaptisme . by h. hammond , d. d. london , printed by j. flesher , for richard royston at the angel in ivy lane . 1655. the baptizing of infants reviewed and defended . the introduction . having , by gods help , past through many stadia in these agones , and therein paid some degree of obedience to the precept of christ , mat. 5.41 . and withall to s. peters directions of rendring an account of the faith which is in us , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 even to him that most unnecessarily requires it ; there is yet remaining one matter of discourse , wherein some seeming ingagement lyes upon me , occasioned by the resolution of the 4th quaere , concerning infant baptisme ; for to this mr. jo : tombes hath offered some answers in the three last chapters of his book intitled antipaedobaptism . what i have thought meet to return to these , might , i supposed , have been not unfitly annexed by way of appendage to that of festivals ; the treatises of festivals and infant baptisme being so neerly conjoyned in the first draught or monogramme , that the defence of them ( which may in some degree passe for the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) ought incongruity to be contrived into the same table also . but the length of this answer hath disswaded that , and the desire that the reader may have no taskes imposed on him but by his own choice , hath advised the publishing this by it self , with some hope that this may conclude his trouble , and that this new year may not bring me so many occasions of such contests , as the last hath done . chap. i. of baptisme among the jewes . sect. i. probations more and less perfect . the use of circumcision to this question of paedobaptisme . as also of christ's reception of children . childrens coming and believing , mat. 18. children sinners . the foundation of mr. tombes's returns to me he is pleased to lay in some words , which he hath recited out of § . 23. of my resolution of the 4th quaere , where i say , that there is no need of laying much weight on this , or any the like more imperfect wayes of probation , the whole fabrick being sufficiently supported and built on this basis ( the customary baptismes among the jewes ) and that discernible to be so , if we consider it first negatively , then positively . to this he begins his reply with these words , i like the doctors ingenuity in his waving the imperfect wayes of proving infant baptisme , viz. the example of circumcision , gen. 17. of baptizing a whole houshold , act. 16.33 . christs reception of little children , mat. 19.14 . mar. 10.16 . and doubt not to shew his own to be no better then those he relinquisheth . to this introduction of his i shall make some reply in a generall reflexion on the treatise which he undertakes to answer , and begin with disclaiming his good words and approbation of my ingenuity , assuring him that he is wholly mistaken in these his first lines and that i do in no wise relinquish those wayes of probation by him taken notice of , nor shall so far despise the authority and aides of the ancient church writers , who have made use of them , as wholly to neglect the force and virtue of them . and i thought it had been to him visible , that i have made my advantage of every one of them § . 20 , 21 , 22. though i do verily think the foundation of this practice is more fitly laid in that other of jewish baptisme , which belonged to all , both jews , and proselytes children , females as well as males , whereas circumcision belonging to males onely , was in that and some other respects a less perfect basis of it . meanwhile , for the clearing of this whole matter , it must be remembred that probations are of two sorts , either less or more perfect , those i call less perfect , which though they have full force in them , as far as they are used , yet are not of so large an extent as to conclude the whole matter in debate , which others that are more perfect may be able to do . i shall apply this to the matter before us . the instituting of the sacrament of circumcision among the jewes , and the express command of god that the children of eight daies old should by this rite be received into covenant , is an irrefragable evidence that those may be capable of receiving a sacrament , who have not attained to years of understanding the nature of it , that children may be received into covenant with god though they are not personally able to undertake or performe the condition of it , and then that argument will so far be applicable to paedobaptisme , as to evidence the lawfulness and fitness of it among christians , by this analogie with god's institution among the jewes , and so certainly invalidate all the arguments of the antipaedobaptist ( i. e. of mr. tombes ) drawn from the incapacity of infants , from the pretended necessity that preaching should go before baptizing , from the qualifications required of those that are baptized , &c. for all these objections lying and being equally in force against circumcising of infants , it is yet evident to be the appointment of god that every infant of 8. days old should be circumcised , gen. 17.12 . and the threatning of god denounced against them as transgressors in case it be neglected , the uncircumcised manchild shall be cut off from his people , he hath broken my covenant , v. 14. and this the rather , because the apostle compares baptisme of christians with circumcision , col. 2.11.12 . in whom ye are circumcised — buried with christ in baptisme , isidor pelusiote , l. 1. ep. 125. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the jews used circumcision in stead of baptisme , whereupon s. epiphanius styles baptisme 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the great circumcision , and s. augustine to them that require a divine authority , whereby to prove the baptisme of infants , renders this of the * jewish circumcision , ex quâ veraciter conjiciatur quid valeret in parvulis sacramentum baptismi , whereby true judgement may be made what force the sacrament of baptisme may have in infants . and in like manner isidore l. 1. ep. 125. whereupon consideration of the angel coming , to kill moses because of the childs not being circumcised , he concludes , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , let us make haste to baptize our children . yet because what is thus evidenced to be lawfull , and agreeable to divine appointment in the old testament , is not thereby presently proved necessary under the new ( christ might otherwise have ordained , if he had pleased , and from his ordinance onely , as that was understood by his apostles and by them delivered to the church , the necessity of our obedience , and so of baptizing infants , is completely deduced ) therefore it is , that i mentioned this , as a more imperfect way of probation , in respect of the intire conclusion , which i undertook to make , viz. not onely the lawfulness , but the duty and obligation , that lies upon us to bring our infants to baptisme ; which by the way , was much more then was necessary ( the shewing the lawfulness being sufficient , and the example of circumcision being competent ) for the disproving the pretensions of the antipaedobaptist , and so , ex abundanti , an act of supererogatory probation , in relation to mr. t. the same is appliable in some degree to the other waies of probation , which he supposeth to be relinquisht by me , especially to that of christ's behaviour to little children , commanding to suffer them to come unto him ( who yet were no otherwise able to come then as they were brought , and as now they come to the font for baptisme ) and embracing and laying on his hands and blessing them : but this is competently set down , and the force of it , how far t is argumentative , § 22. onely i now adde , that that other place of mat. 18.6 . where jesus speaking of little children , useth these words , who so offendeth one of these little ones that believe in me , it were good for him that a milstone &c. may tend much to give us the full importance and signification both of their coming to christ , and of his commanding not to forbid them ( such as will neerly concern every antipaedobaptist to take notice of ) for as in other places of the new testament , the coming unto god and christ , is believing on him , seeking to receive benefit from him ( as , he that cometh to me shall never hunger , and come unto me all ye that are weary , and if any man thirst let him come unto me and drink ) so , it seems , by this place , that that coming of the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 little infants ( for so they are called in the parallel place luk. 9.47 . ) which they were capable of by the help of their parents or friends , is styled by christ the childrens believing , and so far imputed to them , as that upon that account the sentence is very severe upon those that shall scandalize them , repulse or discourage , or any way hinder them in this their progress to christ , though it be but in the armes of other men . how fitly this is applicable to the state of infants , in respect of the guilt of original sin , under which they are born , and for the remission of which ( and not onely for the entring into the kingdome of heaven ) the fathers defined against the pelagians , that baptisme was necessary for them , i shall not need here to inlarge , having formerly spoken to that head . onely it may not be amiss here to advert , that it was as reasonable for the children to be called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 believers , who yet had no faith of their own , but onely of their parents &c. to bring them to christ , as for the same children to be accounted sinners ( as undoubtedly they are ) which yet never committed any act of sin , which made s. augustine de verb : apost : serm : 4. say , absit ut ego dicam non credentes infantes , god forbid that i should say that infants are not believers , credit in altero , qui peccavit in altero , he believes by another who sinned by another , dicitur , credit , & valet , & inter fideles baptizatos computatur , the susceptors say he believes , and so he is reputed among the baptized believers . and this reputative faith the more reasonably accepted by the church , it being moreover evident by the baptisme of simon magus , and of all hypocrites , that 't is the profession of faith , and not the possession of it , which is required as the qualification which authorizes the church to admit them to baptisme ; and that being performed by the infants proxies in his name , the church after the forementioned example of christ , may very lawfully accept it of those , who can performe no other , in lieu of a personal profession . meanwhile this passage of christ concerning children , though it be a certain evidence again against the antipaedobaptist , as hath been shewed , and i need no more then this one proof , if i were destitute of all others , to refute his pretensions , yet because it contains no relation of christs , or his apostles baptizing infants , therefore i put it in the rank of the more imperfect probations ( in comparison with that other way of probation , which i conceive , deduceth and concludeth the whole matter more intirely ) though , as t is evident § . 22. this was neither waved nor relinquisht by me . to this if i shall now adde , that it was my design in that resolution of the quaere to insist more largely on that way of probation , which i discerned to be lesse considered or insisted on by others , and yet to have perfect evidence in it , if it were duely explained and improved as it was capable , and on the same account thought i might spare to multiply words , where others had often inlarged , and therefore said but little of those common arguments or heads of probation , and yet sufficient to testifie my neither waving nor relinquishing them , it will then abundantly appear , how little i deserved mr. t. his good words , and how justly i renounce that title to ingenuity which he bestowes upon me , being better pleased with his animadversions on my dotages , as he after phraseth it , then these , his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 his liberalities to me by which he designed advantage to himself . sect. 2. the necessity of paedobaptisme depending on the positive part of the probation . the severall sorts of anabaptists . testimonies the onely proof of institutions . before i proceed i must desire the reader to consider two things , 1. that the jewish baptisme is not by me set up as the competent proof , but onely as the ground or foundation ( which taken by its self is always very imperfect in respect of the whole fabrick or building , ) 2. that the perfect proof being set down to consist of two parts , a negative and a positive , the first onely shewing the no incongruity or unlawfulness of baptizing infants , and the second adding thereto duty and obligation , these two must in all reason remain conjoyned in our discourse , and not be so severed , or considered asunder , as if i thought the former way of negative probation sufficient to do the whole work without the assistance of the latter ; this i needed not have said in relation to mr. t. for the bare negative consideration ( that there is nothing in the pattern whence christs baptisme is copied out , nothing in the copie it self , as far as christ's words in the gospel , or the apostles practice extend , &c. ) is perfectly sufficient to refute an antipaedobaptist ( such as he professeth to be ) who undertakes to shew the baptizing of infants to be unlawfull , but cannot pretend to shew it by any other way , but by producing some either law or practice of christ or his apostles to the contrary , which he must be concluded unable to do , if my negative stand inviolate ▪ but i thus interpose ( and do it thus early ) because the positive part , being indeed the principal , especially when it is also added to the negative , doth not onely demonstrate it lawfull , but duty , to offer and receive our infants to baptisme , the judgement and practice of the vniversal church for 1600 years , ( received , as the fathers with one consent testifie , from the apostles , as the will of christ himself ) having this force and authority over every meek son of the church , that he may not without incurring god's displeasure , oppugne or contemne it . and so by this means there is much more performed then was needful , if mr. t. had been the onely adversary foreseen , even that which may convince all sorts of opposers and disputers in this matter , from * peter de bruce and henry his scholar , and the petrobusiani and henriciani that sprang from them , to nicholas storck and john munzer , melchior rinck , balthazar habmaier , michael satelar the switzers , and so on to michael hofman the skinner in the low countries , to vbbo and menno of friseland , and theodorick vbbo's son , and all their followers , which either then lived , and set up in germany , or are now revived , or copied out among us ; this one deduction of this practice ( of baptizing infants ) from the apostles , if it be solid , being abundantly sufficient to make an end of all controversies of this kind , it being highly unreasonable that an institution of christ's , such as each sacrament is , should be judged of by any other rule ( whether the phansies or reasons of men ) but either the words wherein the institution is set down , or ( when they , as they are recorded in the scripture , come not home to the deciding of the controversie ) by the records of the practice , whether of christ , or ( because he baptized not himself ) of the apostles , however conserved or made known unto us . in a word then , the customary baptisme among the jews being first laid onely as the basis and foundation ( which , as i said , must be observed to differ from the whole building , being indeed onely , the first and most imperfect part of it ) and evidently brought home and applied to every branch of the christian baptisme , i desire mr. t. will permit the baptisme of our infants to deduce and evidence it self from the considerations , which are thereunto annexed , both negative and positive , and then make triall how he shall be able to demolish that structure which is thus founded and supported ; meanwhile i shall now consider the severals of his exceptions , having premised thus much in generall . sect. 3. the jewes baptisme of natives as well as proselytes . testimonies of their writers in proof thereof . baptisme among the heathens taken from the jewes . among both from noahs flood . the derivation of christian from jewish baptisme how manifested . christs answer to nicodemus . baptisme 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to the deluge . gr. nazianzen's and macarius's testimonies . the fathers meaning in affirming the christians baptisme to be in stead of circumcision . the lords supper founded in the jewes postcoenium , yet in stead of their passeover . and first he will abbreviate and give the reader the substance of my proof , which he conceives to be this , that the jewes were wont when they admitted proselytes to baptize them and their children . here again at the entrance i must enterpose , that his epitome hath done some injurie to the book , left out one considerable , if not principal part , viz. that which concerned the native jewish children , who were baptized as solemnly , as the proselytes and their children . this must be here taken notice of , because mr. t. makes haste to assume the contrary , that the jewes baptized not iewes by nature , p. 306. that after the baptisme exo. 19.10 . the iews did not baptize iewes but onely proselytes , p. 307. and so makes a shift to conclude , that by my arguing , the children of those that were baptized in infancie ought not to be baptized , and so that no infant of christian race , or descended from christian ancestors , is now to be baptized , p. 308. no infants but at the first conversion of the parent , p. 309. and this i was many moneths before the publication of his book , warned to expect from mr. t. as an irresistible answer to my way of defending infant baptisme , mentioned by him in the pulpit , as ready to be publisht , that by deducing the baptisme of christians from the jewish custome of baptizing of proselytes i had excluded all the children of christian ancestors from our baptisme . but as this was then a great surprise to me , who knew that i had cleared that iudaical baptisme to belong to the children of all native iewes , as well as of proselytes , so now i could not but wonder to find there was so perfect truth in that relation , which i had received , and have no more to say , but to desire the reader to cast his eyes upon that treatise , and informe himself whether i have not as punctually deduced from the iewish writers the customary baptisme of native iewish infants , as i have done the baptisme of proselytes and their children , and indeed mentioned the former as the original from which the latter was to be transcribed , and so as the foundation and groundwork of that other . t is unreasonable to recite here what is there so visible , yet because i see it is not taken notice of , but the contrary assumed for granted , and the chief weight of his 24th chapter laid upon that supposition , there is nothing left me to do in this matter , but to transcribe my words from that 6th § . which are expressely these : first then , baptisme or washing of the whole body was a iewish solemnity , by which the native iewes were entred into the covenant of god made with them by moses , so saith the talmud tr : repud : israel or the israelites do not enter into covenant but by these three things , by circumcision 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and by baptizing , and by peace offering . so in gemara ad tit . cherithoth , c. 2. your fathers , i. e. the iewes of old time did not enter into the covenant 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but by circumcision and baptisme , and in iabimoth , c. 4. rabbi ioshua said , we find of our mother that they were baptized ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) and not circumcised , so maimonides tit : isuribia , c. 13. by three things the israelites entred into the covenant , by circumcision , baptisme and sacrifice , and soon after , what was done to you , to the iewes in universum , ye were initiated into the covenant by circumcision 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and baptisme and sacrifice . all these testimonies there thus set down , and then how could i conclude lesse then there i do , that nothing can be more clearly affirmed by them , i. e. by the jewish writings of the greatest authority among them , the talmud , gemara , and maimonides ? if this were not sufficient , then follows § 11. as a third thing observable in this baptisme among the jewes , that the baptisme of the natives was the pattern , by which the baptisme of proselytes was regulated , and wherein it was founded , and this made evident by the arguing , and determining the question , in the gemara , tit : jabimoth , c. 4. after this manner , of him that was circumcised and not baptized rabbi eliezer said that he was a proselyte , because , said he , we find of our fathers ( abraham isaac — ) that they were circumcised but not baptized ; and of him that was baptized and not circumcised rabbi josua said , he was a proselyte , because said he , we find of our mothers that they were baptized and not circumcised : but the wise men pronounced that till he were baptized and circumcised he was not a proselyte , where the example of the jewes is the rule by which the obligation of the proselytes is measured . and the same is evident by the reason rendred by the jewish writers of their baptizing the proselytes , which is generally taken by them from that command , numb . 15.15 . one ordinance shall be both for you of the congregation , and also for the stranger ( i. e. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the proselyte ) that sojourneth with you , an ordinance for ever in your generations , as ye are , so shall the stranger be before the lord , one law and one manner ( i. e , one 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and one 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 luke 1.6 . one law for moral duties , and one ordinance for rituals or ceremonies ) shall be for you and for the stranger that sojourneth with you . thus the gemara tit : cherithoth , c. 2. foundeth the circumcising and baptizing of proselytes , upon those words , as to you , so shall it be to the proselyte . so maimonides tit : isuri bia , c. 13. in like manner through all ages as oft as a gentile will enter into the covenant , and receive the yoke of the law upon him , it was necessary that circumcision and baptisme should be used for him , beside sprinkling of the sacrifice , and if it were a woman , baptisme and sacrifice , according as it is said ( numb . 15.15 . ) as to you , so also to the proselytes . and yet farther , as to the original of this baptisme among the iewes themselves , the 12. § . out of their writers deduceth it from the time of giving the law in mount sinai , exo. 19.10 . when god , to prepare them for the receiving it , commands moses , go to the people and sanctifie them to day and to morrow , and let them wash their clothes . so saith maimonides isuri bia , c. 13. but baptisme was in the desart before the giving of the law , according as it is said , thou shalt sanctifie them — and that agreeable to what we read of jacob to his household , gen. 35.2 . put away the strange gods that are among you , and be clean and change your garments ( where being clean is answerable to being sanctified or baptized , and changing to washing their garments ) so that as the covenant made with abraham was sealed by circumcision , so the giving of the law which was the covenant made by god with all the people , was thought to be sealed by baptisme , and that the washing , if not of the whole , yet of some parts of the body ( ordinarily called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sanctifications ) and the washing ( or wearing clean ) garments also . and now i may , i hope , assume , that not onely there is perfect truth in what i now affirme , that baptisme among the iewes belonged to their natives as well as to proselytes ( even to all that entred into the covenant , and those evidently were the iewish children as well as men ) but also that this had before been evidenced in that resol : of the 4th quaere , which here mr. t. hath been pleased to examine , and consequently that it was no small injustice , and unkindness in him both to the reader , and to me , that he would omit to take notice of it , but assume and build on it as a thing yielded and granted him by my discourse that the proselytes onely , and not the native jewes were partakers of that jewish baptisme . this sure was a strange infirmity in an answer , and that which must needs have a special influence upon it , in any impartial weighing , even such an one , as will make it very unnecessary for me to consider any of his other considerations which he hath offered in that matter , which must certainly have no force in them , when that which is such a principal part of my arguing is so perfectly omitted , and the contrary supposed by him . however i shall not refuse to attend him in all his motions , and inquire whether there be any particular pitcht on by him , which may deserve our farther consideration , in order to the point in hand , that of infant baptisme among christians . and 1. saith he , baptisme , it seems , was a custome of all nations as well as the jewes , citing grotius for it on mat. 3.6 . and mat. 28.19 . of the truth of this observation i shall raise no question , onely i wonder what he could phansie from thence to conclude for his advantage . certainly he will not hope by that argument to evince the negative , that it was not used among the jewes , for how can the gentiles , using it conclude , against all other evidence , that the jewes did not use it ? nor can he pretend that christ transcribed it from those gentiles , and not from the jewes : for christ preaching , as he was sent , to the lost sheep of the house of israel , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to them first , act. 3.26 . and if not to them onely , yet in a far more eminent manner to them then to any others , and accordingly adapting his reformation to the iewish religion , and lightly deducing so many other customes from the iewes , and none from the gentiles , can with no probability be conceived to deduce this from the gentiles , rather then from the iewes , especially when ( as clement observes , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the heathens borrowed or stole both their learning , and their custome from the iewes , so ) it is very obvious to imagine , that this of baptisme , purgations and lustrations might by those heathens be borrowed from the iewes , at least by both of them be derived from the same common fountain , the sonnes of noah , in remembrance of the deluge , according to that famous verse among the greeks , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the sea sweeps away all the evils of men , to which s. peter alludes in making baptisme the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to noah's stood ( as he hath himself cited it out of grotius , ) and so in like manner some of the fathers , as athanasius , in his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . tom. 2. p. 426. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the first baptisme is that of the deluge for the excision of sinnes . and if neither of these be hence deducible , that it matters little what else he can design to infer from it . and so sure there was some want of answers , when this ( so nothing to the matter on either side ) was thought fit to march in the front of them . under this head of answer , he presently addes , that he doth not know that dr. h. or any other hath alleged one passage in scripture , or any of the fathers , that might evince that the custome of baptizing , or baptizing infants was derived from the iewes initiating proselytes by baptisme . to this i answer , 1. by asking mr. t. whether he be ready to pay that reverence to the authority of the fathers , as to be concluded by their affirmations ? if he be , i wonder why the uniforme consent of them , that infants are to be baptized , should not prevaile with him : if he be not , why doth he mention this as usefull in this matter ? but then 2dly . it must be adverted , that this one containing two quaestions in it , 1. whether this of initiating into the covenant by baptisme were a jewish custome ? 2. whether from thence christ derived this rite of baptizing of christians ? the former of these was that which alone required proving the latter being of it self evident , without farther probation , supposing onely that the fathers testified that to be christ's institution of baptisme , which we find to have been thus agreeable to the practice customary among the jews . as for example , if it were made matter of doubt or question , whether christ derived the censures of his church from the jews , it will sure be a sufficient answer to the question , if wee shall first find in the jewish writers their customes of excommunication , and then from the christian writers find the like records of the christian custome , from the institution of christ , and the practice of his apostles 〈◊〉 down unto us ; for those two things being done , what need we any father's assistance or guidance , to secure us , that christ derived , and lightly changed this custome of ecclesiasticall censures in his church , from what he found in the jewish sanhedrim ? in this matter 't is easy and obvious to object ( as m. t. here doth about baptisme ) that excommunication was a custome among other nations , as well as the jews , the description of it among the druids in cesar's commentaries being so famous and notorious to every man : which yet will not sure prevaile with any reasonable man , or make it necessary to produce the testimonies whether of scriptures or fathers , that christ took it not from the druids but the jewes . the like might be instanced again in the institution of the sacrament of the lords supper in the jews postcoenium , from which it is by light change deduced . and so it is in this matter of baptisme , the jewish custome of baptizing ( not onely proselytes and their children , but the jewish natives ) i thought necessary to clear from the most competent witnesses of their customes , the talmud , gemara , and maimonides , the soberest of their writers ; and so likewise in the second place , the practice of the christian church , as it is from christ and his apostles deduced , and applied particularly to the resolution of our quaere , to the baptizing of infants , i have cleared also from some footsteps of it in the scripture it self , and from the concordant testimony of the fathers of the church . and having cleared these two particulars , wherein all the difficulty consisted , i need not sure inquire of the opinion of antiquity for the dependence betwixt these two , or the derivation of one of them from the other , the very lineaments and features acknowledging and owning this progenie to have come forth from that stock , this stream to have been derived from that fountain , without any testimonials to certifie it . and yet 3dly . after all this , i demand whether christ's words to nicodemus , joh. 3. mentioned § . 18. be not an evidence from scripture it self of this very matter , the derivation of the christian from the jewish baptisme ; when upon christs discourse on that subject , that except a man be regenerate of water and of the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdome of god , and on occasion of nicodemus's objection against this v. 9. iesus answered , art thou a master in israel , and knowest not these things ? discernibly intimating that this his institution of baptisme was so agreeable to the iewish customes of initiating , and receiving into the covenant by baptisme , that a rabbi among the iews could not reasonably be imagined to be ignorant of it . and if the baptisme of the iews had ( as mr. t. cites it out of grotius ) its first original from the memorie of the deluge purging away the sins of the world , then sure that place of s. peter which affirms the christian baptisme to be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the antitype or transcript of noah's deluge , is an express testimony of it also . and this i hope might be a competent account of this matter . and yet after all this , it is also clear , that the fathers in their discourses of baptisme do ordinarily lay the foundation of it in moses , or the baptisme of the iews ; witness gregory nazianzen or. 39. seeing , saith he , it is the feast of christ's baptisme , let us philosophize , discourse exactly of the difference of baptismes , then after this preface entring on the discourse , he thus begins , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , moses , saith he , baptized but in water , and before this in the cloud and in the sea , and then making that ( with s. paul ) a type of the christian baptisme , he proceeds to iohn's baptisme , which , saith he , differed from the mosaical , in that it added repentance to water , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , iohn also baptized , but not iudaically . so before him , macarius hom. 32. having mentioned the circumcision which was under the law foresignifying the true circumcision of the heart , annexes thereto 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the baptisme of the law , which saith he , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is a figure of true things , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , for there that washed the body , but here the baptisme of the holy ghost and of fire purgeth and washeth the polluted mind , and so goes on to the parallel betwixt the legall priest and christ , making the same accord betwixt the one and the other pair , so hom. 47. p. 509. speaking of things under the law , he first mentions the glory of moses face , a type of the true glory under the gospel . 2. circumcision , a type of that of the heart ; 3. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , saith he , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , among them there is baptisme cleansing or sanctifying the flesh , but with us the baptisme of the holy spirit and of fire , that which john preached — the same is intimated again , but not so explicitely set down hom. 26. p. 349. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , peter succeeded moses , having the new church of christ and the true priesthood committed to him , for now is the baptisme of fire and the spirit , and a kind of circumcision placed in the heart , where it seems the iewish baptisme was the figure of the christian , as the j●wish priesthood of the christian , and the jewish circumcision of the circumcision in the heart . so in athanasius's 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : qu : 103. * numbring up seven sorts of baptisme , the first even now mentioned , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that of the flood for the cutting off of sin , the second that of moses , in passing the red sea , which he calls , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , figurative ; the third is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the legall baptisme , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which the hebrews had , whereby every unclean person ( so is every one by nature ) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , was baptized in water , had his garments washt , and so entred into the campe , this it seems the ceremonie of his admission . and then follows the baptisme of john and christ . other examples i doubt not the reader may observe in the fathers writings on this subject , these few may serve 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . and therefore when mr. t. addes that some passages of the fathers shew rather , that they took it as in stead of circumcision , the answer also is very obvious , that the jews custome being to initiate by circumcision and baptisme both , and the former of these being laid aside by christ's reformation , and onely the second continued , and that so improved by christ , as to have more then the whole virtue of both , and to be the onely initial sacrament , the fathers might well learn of s. paul to make this comparison or parallel betwixt the jewish , and the christian sacrament , and so betwixt baptisme and circumcision , and indeed could not properly say that the christian baptisme was in stead of the jewish baptisme being rather the continuance of it , adding some ceremonies and virtue to that which was formerly among them , not substituting somewhat else ( as for circumcision it did ) in stead of it . this is evident enough , and yet if it were not we should have little reason to be moved with this suggestion , knowing that in the other sacrament which christ visibly instituted in the jewish postcoenium , and imitated it in the delivering the portions of bread and wine , the fathers generally lay the comparison betwixt the paschal lamb and that , and not without the authority of s. paul himself , saying that christ our passeover is sacrificed for us , the plain meaning of it being this , that the jewish passeover being abolished , we have now the sacrament of the body and blood of christ ( the true immaculate lamb of god ) substituted in the stead of it , but that copied out not from the jewish manner of eating the lamb of passeover ( for christ did not eat it at that time , being put to death before the hour in which it was to be eaten ) but of the postcoenium or close of the iewish supper , after which he took bread &c. consecrating this ordinary custome of theirs into an higher mysterie , then formerly it had in it . sect. 4. the conceipts of pe : alfunsus and schickard of the iewish baptisme . raf : alphus : mr. t. his conclusion not inferred . the original of the iewish baptisme ( the onely doubt ) vindicated . iacob's injunction to his family . sanctifications exod. 19.10 . differ from washing garments . what he next addes from mr. selden , of some that conceived the iewish baptisme in initiating of proselytes was in imitation of christs example ( and so not christs of theirs ) and of schickard that conceives they added baptisme to circumcision , to difference them from samaritans , is too vain to deserve any other reply , then what he himself hath annext concerning the former , viz. that mr. selden ( naming onely pet. alfansus for this ) doth not give any credit to him in it ( but indeed disproves it , and addes antidotes to that poyson , that without them i should not have thought likely to have wrought on any man. ) and indeed so he doth also in plain terms concerning the latter , de syxed : l. 1. c. 3. fateor me nondum illud aut eâ de re quicquam alibi legisse , he never read that or any thing of that matter any where else . to which i adde , that if the place in schickard be examined , it will acknowledge it to be a singular conceipt and invention of his , and nothing else . in his 5t. chap. de reg. iud. he hath these words , ad differentiam samaritanorum addiderunt baptismum quendam de quo raf. alphes tom. 2. p. 26. & ipse talmud mass . jefamos fol. 47. citing the words at large in hebrew . but in those words , though they are by schickard applied indefinitely , as if they were the testification of the whole foregoing proposition , yet the reader shall find no syllable to that purpose of differencing from samaritanes , more then from all other men , but onely that when a proselyte is received he must be circumcised , and then 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 when he is cured , they shall baptize him in the presence of two wise men , saying , behold he is as an israelite in all things , or if she be a woman , the women lead her to the waters &c. a plain testimony ( to the sense of those which we formerly produced ) of baptizing both jews and proselytes ( for else how could the proselyte , upon receiving this , be said to be a israelite in all things ? ) but no least intimation , that this was designed to distinguish them from samaritanes peculiarly , but as that which was alwayes customarie among the jews , at their entring into covenant with god. and then the premises being so groundlesse and frivolous , i shall not sure be concerned in any conclusion that mr. t. shall inferre from them , which it seems , is to be this , that notwithstanding the doctor 's supposition that the whole fabrick of baptisme is discernible to be built on that basis , the customary practice among the jews , yet many will conceive it needs more proof then the bare recitall of passages out of iewish writers . but mr. t. would be much put to it , to shew in what mode and figure it is , that this conclusion is drawn out of these premisses : certainly none that my logick hath afforded me , for that hath no engine first to draw many out of two ; nor 2. to inferre that those that had mistaken for want of knowledge ( as alphunsus ) or adverting ( as schickard ) of the iewish customes , would need any more then the recitation of clear testimonies out of the soberest iewish writers , to disabuse him : or 3. that they that either through prejudice , or any other principle of obstinacie shall resist this degree of light thus offered them , will be convinced by any other sort of testimonies , whether out of the fathers , or scripture it self , being so well fortified and provided with inclinations , at least if not with artifices , to reject one , or misinterpret the other . but , it seems , after all this , and to evidence to how little purpose he hath said thus much , mr. t. is well enough satisfied , at least as farre as to baptizing of proselytes , that there was such a custome among the latter iewes afore christs incarnation ; all the difficulty , saith he , is concerning the original of it among them , for that either it should begin from iacobs injunction to his household , gen. 35.2 . or from gods command exo. 19 10. for the israelites to wash their clothes afore the giving of the law , he cannot conceive , those places speaking of washing jewes by nature , not proselytes , whereas the jewes baptized not jewes by nature ( as mr. selden saith ) but by profession . here are many weak parts in these few words ; for 1. the original of the custome among the jewes is but an accessarie , wholly extrinsecal to the matter in hand , and in no respect necessary to be defined by us : if the custome be acknowleged , we need ask no more , and mr. t. having acknowleged the custome , grants all that in that matter we require of him , for on that , and not on that particular original of it , it is that we superstruct our whole fabrick , as farre as belong ; to infant baptisme , which is very fitly founded in the jewish custome of baptizing , from whence soever that custome was derived to them , and so that one thing supersedes and answers that whole difficulty , if indeed there were any such in this matter . but then 2dly . for the two originals here set down and both rejected by him , it is a little strange that he should think fit to do so , and not to substitute any third in the place of them ; for t is certain that every custome received universally into a church or society of men , must have some originall or other , and consequently this custome being by mr. t. acknowleged , must not in any reason be left 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , without father , without mother , without any original ; and therefore those two that are alleged for it by the iewish writers , being by him so fastidiously rejected , it was very fit that he should assign some other , and annex his reasons of giving it the deference , upon which it should be prefer'd before them . and when he shall do so , i shall not doubt to imbrace it , and make the same advantage of it which hitherto i have done of either of these . but he is here pleased to be reserved , and gives not the least intimation of any other reason , which is more suitable with his conceptions . t is true indeed he did before out of grotius , mention noahs flood , in memorie of which this custome arose among other nations , but besides that this original of it was not by him deemed sufficient to appropriate it to the iewes , but leaves it common to them with other nations , those other two , iacobs injunction , and gods command before receiving the law ( either one or both ) are perfectly reconcileable with that , and the memorie of the deluge being the more remote and first original , these may be the neerer and more immediate , and so are not prejudged by his pretending , or my yeelding of that . 3dly . for iacobs injunction to his household , gen. 35.2 . it is no where vouched by me as the original of this custome among the iewes , but onely an intimation given , that that other , the command of god before the giving the law , was agreeable to what we read of iacob to his household , and so certainly it is , for as in the one the ceremonie prescribed them to use at the putting away strange gods , was this , to be clean and change their garments ; so in the other they are injoyned to sanctifie themselves and wash their clothes , which is in other words directly the same thing : washing themselves and having clean garments being among the iewes joyned together , and the witnesse of their garments prescribed in baptisme 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ( saith the glosse on gemara babylon , tit ▪ iabimoth ) to receive the presence of the divine majesty ( just as in the christian church the dominica in albis , white or whitsunday was a special day for administration of baptisme ▪ and the persons baptized wore rhetorically styled sometimes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 starres rising out of the waters , sometimes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the bright lilies of the font , as they are joyned together in proclus orat : 12. p. 384. and in s. chrysostome , new lilies planted from the font , hom. 6. de resurr : and accordingly on constantine's great coyne , stampt in memory of his baptisme , was ingraven ( on one side ) a poole of water with a lilie grown out of it ; ( see jos : scal : in opusc : ) and all these but figurative expressions of what chrysostome more plainly sets down by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 their putting on white garments at the receiving of baptisme , tract . de s. pent. for which jobius in photius hath 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 onely . ) and then as jacob vowed a vow to the lord to give him the tenth of all , and accordingly god after instituted the tithes for the levites portion , and so the latter of these was agreeable to the former , but yet the latter , viz. gods institution , the original of the custome of tithing among the jewes ; so iacob might injoyn his household that ceremonie of washing or baptisme , and after that god injoyn it in giving the law , and one of these be agreeable to the other , and yet the custome of baptisme among the iewes be derived onely from the latter , as from the peculiar original of it . 4thly . the command of god , exod. 19.10 . in which baptisme is said to be founded by the iewes , is not ( as mr. t. suggests ) the command to the israelites to wash their clothes ( nothing but the custome of changing their garments can be founded in that ) but the command to moses to sanctifie them ( go unto the people and sanctifie them to day and to morrow ) in the hebr●w notion of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , sanctifications , for washing , either the whole , or some parts of the body , as is shew'd at large , § . 35. and if in stead of this of sanctifying , i. e. baptizing them , mr. t. did unwittingly substitute washing their garments , then i hope , he may now be advised to reforme that mistake , and see more reason then hitherto he hath done , to assign that command of gods , as the most agreeable original of this custome , and no longer imagine that it was a custome of the latter iewes , taken up by themselves without any ground of scripture ; but if formerly he saw this , and was willing to disguise it , and , on purpose to misguide the reader , left out the mention of moses's sanctifying or baptizing them , and onely set down the washing of their garments ( which was not at all proper for the turn ) to be the original of baptisme , wherein , as paulinus tells us , they were rendred nivei , white as snow , corpore as well as babitu , in body as well as garment , i shall not then hope that even this length of words will be sufficient for his conviction . lastly , for his reason against deducing the baptisme of proselites from this original [ because the iewes baptized not iewes by nature but by profession , whereas those places speake of washing iewes by nature , not proselytes ] it will presently appear to be very vain ; for 1. the iewes baptized iewes by nature , and not proselytes onely , as hath been both there and here shewed at large , out of the most creditable of the iewish writers ; 2dly . their baptizing of proselytes was founded in their precedent custome of baptizing of iewes , as hath been evidenced also from the rabbines explication of num. 15.15 . one ordinance shall be both for you of the congregation of israel , and also for the stranger or proselyte . and so t is evident that of exod. 19.10 . being the original of baptizing native iewes , may , and must be the original of baptizing the proselytes . and this in each part being thus manifest , mr. selden's authority ( if it should be , as is pretended ) can be of no force against those evidences which i have here produced , the best he offers us at any time , to prove any thing concerning the iewish customes . and i shall now appeale to the reader , whether mr. t. could well have been expected to have made more misadventures in so few words . sect. 5. mr. selden's notion of the sea. the defence of my notion of it . learned mens affirmations to be judged of by their testimonies . christ's baptizing of iewes as well as gentiles , no argument . christ's vouching iohns baptisme to be from heaven , no argument . no more , the pretended no intimations of it . the no conformity . the proselytes children baptized , continually , not onely at the first conversion . the baptisme of a woman with child , serving for the child also , not argumentative . the canon of neocaesarea about it . next he proceeds to consider the words of the apostle , 1 cor. 10.1 . of our fathers being baptized into moses ( as in the cloud , so ) in the sea. where 1. he tells me that he doth not conceive mr. seldens exposition , that the sea was some vessell of waters — but the red sea ] and i that am as little of mr. seldens mind , but expressely interpreted it , of the red sea , § . 7. and rejected mr. seldens interpretation § . 8. ( although i omitted to name the author of it ) am not , he knows , concerned in that , but have from his rejecting mr. seldens authority , when t is not for his turn , his example for my not thinking my self bound up by it at other times , either in that newly past , where he vouched his name as his onely proof , that the jewes did not baptize jewes by nature , or in other particulars which i find afterwards vouched from him , the truth of which i as little conceive , as mr. t. doth this of the sea not signifying the red sea , which i acknowledge to be unconceiveable . but then 2. he doth not think my exposition right neither ( though i interpret it of the israelites passing through the red sea , as he acknowledges to do ) but what is my interpretation ? why , that their being baptized into moses in the red sea ( as also in the cloud ) signifieth their being initiated into god's covenant under the conduct of moses , as since they are wont to be initiated by baptisme . and why doth he dislike this interpretation ? why , because when it is said , our fathers were baptized , it is not meant were baptized as since proselytes were baptized among the jews , but as christians were baptized . but certainly this is no reason of exception to my interpretation ; for 1. i compare not this baptisme of out fathers in the sea with the baptisme of proselytes among the jewes , but annex it immediately to the baptizing of the native jewes , § . 6. before i proceed § . 9. to the baptisme of proselytes . and 2. i do not lay the comparison of the apostle betwixt the baptizing in the sea , and the jewish custome of baptizing , but acknowledge it to be betwixt the baptisme of the fathers under the law , and the baptisme since christ among christians , all the use i make of the words of the apostle , was to shew that baptisme among the jewes was a ceremonie of initiating into the covenant , and that upon that supposall it was , that the apostle used the phrase of the israelites that came out of aegypt , and entred into covenant with him , under the conduct of moses , god giving them an essay of his receiving them under his wings ( the phrase to signifie reception into the covenant ) by invironing them with the sea . this i thought had been before intelligibly enough set down , i hope now he will no longer misunderstand it . what he addes out of mr. s. that after exo. 19.10 . the jewes did not baptize jewes but onely proselytes , hath already been evidenced at large to have no truth in it , the custome of baptisme continuing to all their posterity , as well as that of circumcision . and whereas this is said to be set down thus out of maimonides and other jewish rabbines , the reader , if he will consult the place in mr. selden de synedr : l. 1. c. 3. will find there is no such matter ; that mr. s. himself so affirmes p. 23 ▪ i willingly acknowledge , but in a matter of antient storie , such as this is , neither he nor any else must be believed farther then the testimonies produced by him out of their writers exact , especially against express testimonies to the contrary . and such he there produceth more then one , p. 34. out of gemara 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 what did our fathers ? truely they entred not into covenant without circumcision and baptisme and sprinkling of blood , and again p. 35. our mothers were baptized and not circumcised , and p. 26. out of victoria porchetus , that our mothers ( though not as he saith , sara and rebecca , referring the custome to a greater antiquity then that of the time of giving the law ) were baptized and not circumcised , and p. 38. out of maimonides , that the israelites entred into covenant by a threefold rite or ceremonie , by circumcision , baptisme , and oblation . and again , p. 39. what was done to you ? ye entred into covenant by circumcision , baptisme , and he sprinkling of the sacrifice , and therefore the proselyte — the custome of baptizing the proselytes founded in that of baptizing the native jewes . all these clear testimonies are by him produced directly to the proof of my position , that the native jewes ( indifferently ) were baptized , and not a word in any other parts of the testimonies to give reason to suspect , that after that one time of exo. 19. the jewes did not baptize . what he hath done in his other book de jure nat. ac gent. i need not apprehend ( and have not commodity to inquire or examine ) supposing that if there he had undertaken the proof of it , he would here , where he affirmes it without proofe , and against expresse testimonies produced by him , have referred ( according to custome ) to that place . and now what force against any pretension of ours is there in mr. t. his observation that christ and his apostles baptized jewes as well as gentiles ? ] for 1. so certainly they might , and yet derive their baptisme from the custome formerly in use among the jewes , for they , we know , baptized native iewes : nay 2. so they might , though the iewes had baptized none but proselytes , for to that it would bear just proportion , that they should baptize both iewes and gentiles , in case both came in as proselytes to christ . for it were a fallacie a little too grosse to deceive any man of common understanding , to argue thus , the custome was to baptize proselytes , and not natives ; therefore christ , if he observed that custome , was not to baptize native iewes ; the answer being so obvious , by distinguishing of proselytes , that they are either such as come in to the iewish religion , or such as came in to christ , and that christ was to baptize all that were proselytes to him , and that the native iewes as many as believed on him , were such , and as believers , i. e. as proselytes to christ , not as native iewes were baptized by him . other reasons he hath chosen to annex for confirmation of his negative , that christ baptisme was not in imitation of , or in conformity with the iewish custome ; for 2. saith he , christ would not have avouched the baptisme of iohn to be from heaven and not from men , if it had been in imitation of the iewish custome . but i wonder what appearance of concludencie there is in that reason ? may not any thing be from heaven or by god's appointment , which is derived from a iewish custome ? may not god in heaven give commission to iohn baptist to preach repentance , after the same manner that others before him , noah and ionah &c. had preached repentance , and to receive all that came in on his preaching , by the ceremonie of baptizing ordinarily used , and known , to initiate men into covenant with god , among the iewes ? i see not the least incongruity in this , or that any obligation of reason can be pretended , why god may not appoint a ceremonie known among men to be used in his service : such sure was imposition of hands , usuall among the iewes in benedictions , which now is made use of by the apostles of christ , in ordaining bishops over the church . and so it may well be in this matter of iohn's or christ's baptisme , which though it were unquestionably from heaven in respect of the commission given to them by god , appointing them to do what they did , yet might the ceremonie of washing used by them be derived from the customes that were already familiar among them . t were easy to instance in the sacrament of the lord's supper , the power of the keyes ( and many the like ) which though brought into the church of christians by christ , and so from heaven , were yet derived and lightly changed from jewish observances , and in that respect from men also . his 3d reason , that it is likely some where or other some intimation would have been given of that custome , as the directorie for christians in the use of baptisme ] is too frivolous to require reply ; for beside that the negative argument were of no force , if it were as is pretended , it already appears that there are in the iewish writers , more then intimations of this custome , and some indications of it even in the scripture itself , as john 3.5.10 . and for any plainer affirmations , what need could there be of them , when both the matter it self speaketh it so plainly , that there was no need of words , to those that knew the iewish customes , as the first writers and readers of the new testament did , and when christ's sole authority , and practice of his apostles were sufficient directorie for the christians in the use of baptisme ? fourthly he addes , that the institution and practice would have been comformable to it ; and so i say , and have made clear that it was , as far as to the controversie in hand we are or can be concerned in it : but saith mr. t. the contrarie appears , adding one main instance of the inconformity , and 14. lesser disparities , the main disparitie , saith he , is in their baptizing no infants of the gentiles at their first conversions , whereas the jewes baptized onely the gentiles infants at their first proselyting , not the infants of those who were baptized in infancie . for the former of these he offers no manner of proof beyond his own affirmation , and therefore it is sufficient to deny it , as he knows we do , and evidently beggs the question in assuming and not offering any proof for the contrary . for the second , that of the jewish practice , he pretends no more then what he had before cited by reference ( but now sets down in words ) viz. the affirmation of mr. selden . but i have already shewed how groundlesse that affirmation of mr. s. was , as to the native jewes children , who were still baptized after the giving of the law. and the same i now adde for the children of those proselytes who had been baptized in infancie , there appears not the least proof of this from the jewish writers , who are the onely competent witnesses in it , but for the contrary i propose these two testimonies taken notice of by mr. s. himself de synedr . c. 3. out of gemara babylon : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 he wants the rite of a proselyte for ever , unless he be baptized and circumcised . here baptisme and circumcision are joyned together , as aequally necessary to a proselyte , and that for ever . and circumcision there is no doubt was to be received by every male , not onely at their first coming to the church of the jewes , at their first proselytisme , but through all posterities , every child of a proselyte that was not circumcised 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 became straightways no proselyte : and then sure this conjunction of baptisme with circumcision on these termes of equality , both of perpetual necessity to all proselytes , must needs extend the baptisme as well as the circumcision beyond the first proselytes and their immediate children , to all their posteritie that shall come from them afterwards , for to all those belonged circumcision . so again in the same place , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and if he be not baptized , he remains a pagan or gentile ; here i shall ask , whether the child of a proselyte who had been baptized in his infancie , were to be a pagan for ever ? i suppose it will be answered , no ; and then by the force of that testimonie of gemara i conclude , therefore it must be supposed that he was baptized , for else he would be a pagan for ever . besides this , two things i farther adde , to remove all possible force of this suggestion ; 1. that if it were granted in the full latitude wherein it is proposed , that the iewes baptized no other infants of proselytes , but those whom they had at their first conversion ; yet this would nothing profit mr. t. for it were then obvious to affirme , that christ who imitated the iewes in that , and so baptized the children of christian proselytes , did make some light change in this , and farther then the pattern before him afforded , baptized all the posteritie that should succeed them , and were born in the church in their infancie also , the reason though not the pattern belonging equally to them as to the children of the first proselytes , and the iewish custome of baptizing their natives infants , being fully home to it . 2dly . that it being by all parts granted , that the children which the proselytes had at their first proselytisme were baptized among the iewes , this is as evident a confutation of the antipaedobaptist , and so of mr. t. as it would if all their infants to all posteritie were baptized : for by that very baptizing of the infants at their first proselytisme , it appears that infants may be baptized , for i hope those proselytes infants are infants ; and if any infants may , and ought to be baptized , then are all their pretensions destroyed , whose onely interest it is to evince , that no infants must or may be baptized . and i hope this will be of some use to mr. t. when he shall have considered it . the onely way m. t. hath to confirme this of the iewes not baptizing any infants of proselytes born after their first conversion and baptisme , is the resolution of the jewes , that if a woman great with child became a proselyte and were baptized , her child needs not baptisme when t is born . and this i had cited , § . 109. out of the rabbines , and so indeed i find it in maimonides , tit . isuri bia . c. 13. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but i cannot think that ( whether true or false ) a sufficient proof to inferre the conclusion ; for the iewish doctors might probably thus resolve upon this other ground , because the mother and the child in her wombe being esteemed as one person , the woman great with child being baptized , they might deem the child baptized as well as the woman , and not account it needfull to repeat it after the birth , which yet ( by the way ) it seems they would have done , if they had not deemed the childe all one with the mother , and consequently they must be supposed to baptize those children which were begotten to the proselyte after the time of his or her first conversion and baptisme . and accordingly the christian doctors in the councel of neocaesarea can. 6. having resolved the contrary to that jewish hypothesis , viz. that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the mother that bears the childe differs from the childe , or is not all one with it , and her confession in baptisme is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 proper or particular to her self , and belongs not to the childe in her womb , give the ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) the woman that is with childe , and is then converted to the faith , leave to be baptized , when she pleases , supposing that the childe which then she carries , shall , notwithstanding her baptisme then , be it self baptized after its birth . which as it is a cleer answer to the argument deduced from the resolution of the jewes in that point , so t is moreover an evidence how little of proof mr. t. had either from his own observation or mr. seldens testimonies , from all which he can produce no other but this , which in the sound is so far from affirming what he would have , and upon examination is found to conclude the contrary . sect. 6. lesser inconformities no prejudice . yet they do not all hold . prayer the christian sacrifice . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . the rule of judging in this matter . baptizing in the name of the father &c. prescribed by christ . so dipping or sprinkling . the pract ▪ cat. misreported . mr. marshals covenanting . this grand disparity then being cleared to be mr. t. his mistake , i shall not need to attend his other instances of disparity , this accord which hath been already mentioned and vindicated , being sufficient to my pretensions , and no concernment of mine obliging me to believe or affirm , that the parallel holds any farther then christ was pleased it should hold , and of that we are to judge by what the scriptures , or ancient church tells us was the practice of him , or his apostles ; for 1. the jewes i doubt not , brought in many things of their own devising into this , as into other institutions of god's , and the latter jewes more , as of the proselytes being so born again in baptisme , that lying with his natural sister was no incest , and the like : and 2. christ , i doubt not , changed the jewish oeconomy in many things , as in laying aside circumcision , in commissionating his disciples to baptize ( and they leaving it in the hands of the bishop , and those to whom he should commit it , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , it is not lawful to baptize without the bishop , saith ignatius ) whereas it was not among the jewes any part of the priests office , any more then circumcision was ; and so in many other particulars . but what prejudice is that to my pretentions , who affirm no more of the accordance betwixt the jewish and christian practice , then eiher by some indications in the scripture it self , or by the christian fathers deductions from the apostles times , appears to be meant by christ , and practised by the apostles ; and then by the jewish writers is as evident to have been in use among them . and this is all the return i need make to his 14 lesser disparities , and all that he hath at large endevoured to infer from them , supposing and granting them all to be such . but yet it is evident that some of them are not such , as when 1. he saith , the baptisme of males must be with circumcision and an offering , t is clear that , though 1. circumcision be laid aside by christ , and 2. when it was used it had nothing to do with baptisme , yet as to the adjoyning of offering , or sacrifice , the parallel still holds , the prayers of the church being the christian sacrifice , and those in the christian church solemnly attendant on the administration of baptisme . so parallel to the court of three israelites , by the confession or profession of whom ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , saith maimonides ) the infant was baptized , we have now not only the whole church , in the presence of whom t is publickly administred , and when more privately , yet in the presence of some christians , who are afterwards , if there be any doubt , to testifie their knowledge to the church , but more particularly the godfathers , and godmothers , being themselves formerly baptized , do represent the church of which they are members , meaning thereby the people of the church , and the minister commissionated thereto by the bishop , represents the church also , meaning the governors thereof . but i shall not proceed to such superfluous considerations , and so i have no need of adding one word more of reply to his 24 chap. ( as far as i am concerned in it ) unlesse it be to tell him that the bishops canons are not the rule by which i undertake to define , wherein the jewish custome must be the pattern , wherein not ; but ( as he cannot but know , if he had read the resolution of the 4th quaere ) the practice of the apostles of christ , by the testifications of the fathers of the church made known unto us , to which as i have reason to yield all authority , so i find the canons and rituals as of this , so of all other churches in the world ( no one excepted ) to bear perfect accoordance therewith , in this particular of infant baptisme ( though in other lesser particulars they differ many among themselves , and all from the jewish pattern ) and this i hope is a competent ground of my action , and such as may justifie it to any christian artist to be according to rules of right reason , of meekness , and sound doctrine , and no work of passion or prejudice or singularity , or ( as mr. t. suggests ) of the doctors own pleasure , as if that were the mutable principle of all these variations from the jewish pattern . of this score t is somewhat strange , which he thinks fit to adde concerning the forme of baptisme , in the name of the father and the sonne and the holy ghost , in this one thing , saith he , which christ did not prescribe , nor did the apostles , that we find , so conceive it , yet , saith the doctor christs prescription must be indisspensably used . in reply to this i shall not spend much time to evidence this forme to be christ's prescription ; if the expresse words at his parting from the world , mat. 28. go ye therefore , and teach , or receive to discipleship , all nations , baptizing them in the name of the father , and the son , and the holy ghost , be not a prescription of christs , and if the universall doctrine and continuall practice of the whole church through all times , be not testimonie sufficient of the apostles conceiving it thus , and a competent ground of the indispensable tinuing the use of it , i shall not hope to perswade with him , onely i shall mind him of the words of s. athanasius in his epistle to serapion tom. 1. p. 204. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . he that is not baptized in the name of all three , receives nothing , remains empty and imperfect , for perfection is in the trinity , no baptisme perfect , it seems , but that . and if this will not yet suffice , i shall then onely demand , whether he can produce so expresse grounds from christ , or the apostles , or the vniversal church of god through all ages , or from any one ancient father , for his denying baptisme to infants . what in this place he addes farther from me , out of the practicall catechisme , that i confesse that by christs appointment the baptized was to be dipt in water , i. e. according to the primitive antient custome to be put under water , is a strange misreporting of my words , i wonder mr. t. would be guilty of it . the words in the pract. cat. are visibly these , by christ's appointment whosoever should be thus received into his familie should be received with this ceremonie of water , therein to be dipt ( i. e. according to the primitive anetint custome to be put under water ) three times , or in stead of that to be sprinkled with it — where 1. all that christ's appointment is affixt to , is , the receiving all that should be received into christ's familie , with this ceremonie of water ; 2. for the manner of that reception by water , t is set down disjunctively , therein to be dipt three times , or in stead of that to be sprinkled with it . these are evidently my words ; no way affirming either the dipping or sprinkling ( one exclusively to the other , to be appointed by christ , but onely the ceremonie of water , whether it be by dipping in it or sprinkling with it , either of which may be signified by the word used from christ by s. matthew , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , baptize yee . what ground the church of christ hath had to disuse immersion , and in stead of putting the whole body under water , only to dip the face , or sprinkle it with water , i shall not now discourse , all that i have to do in this place being to vindicate my self , that i have no way affirmed the putting under water ( used by the primitive church ) to be appointed by christ , exclusively to sprinkling , and that i hope i have already done by the exact reciting of my words , which had been so much misreported by him . and so i have done with his 24th chapter . for as to the objection against mr. m. drawn from his covenanting to performe the worship of god , according to gods word , and admiring that ever mortal man should dare in gods worship to meddle any jot farther then the lord hath commanded , and yet in point of infant baptisme following the talmud , i that am farre from mr. m. his perswasions , as well as practices , am not sure bound to give answer for him , aetatem habet , let him answer for himself ; and when he doth so , 't were not amiss he would consider , whether episcopal government stand not on as firme a basis in the church of god , as infant baptisme is by him vouched to do . chap. ii. of christ's words , mat. 28.19 . sect. 1. the doctors pretended concessions examined . christ's institution of baptisme not set down mat. 28. but necessarily before that time . his 25. chapter is a view of my interpretation of mat. 28.19 . which lyes thus , goe and disciple ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 make disciples , receive into discipleship ) all nations , baptizing them in the name &c. teaching them &c. thereby evidencing that the making or receiving disciples , not supposing any precedent instruction , but looking wholly on it as subsequent , can no way exclude the christians infants from baptisme , when they are thus brought to the church to be entred into the school of christ , and undertaken for that they shall learn when they come to years . and to this a long proemial answer he hath of many lines , which begins thus , though i conceive dr. h. to ascribe more power to the canons of the prelates about the sacraments , then is meet , being one who hath written in defence of the common prayer book , yet by this allegation of mat. 28.19 . he seems tacitely to yield , that if the words there include not infants under the discipled , then there is something in the new testament which excludes infants from baptisme , although he say § 96. i do not believe or pretend that that precept of christ doth necessarily inferre ( though it do as little deny ) that infants are to be baptized . before i proceed to that which followes , 't is not amiss to view in passing , how many incongruities are here amass't together in these few words . for whereas my having written in defence of the common prayer book is made use of as an evidence to inferre that i ascribe more to the canons of prelates , then is meet , it is certain 1. that the common prayer book stands not by the canons of the prelates , but by act of parliament , and consequently if i had been guilty of a confest partiality to the common prayer book , yet were this no evidence of my ascribing any thing ( therefore sure not more then is meet or too much ) to the canons of prelates . 2dly . it never yet appeared , that by writing in defence of the common prayer book , i offended at all ( therefore surely not about either , much less against both the sacraments . ) 3ly . the making my defence of the common prayer book , written long ago , a proof that i oftend now in somewhat else ; viz. in attributing too much to the canons of the bishop , is 1 the connecting together things that are most disparate , concluding quidlibet ex quolibet ; and 2dly a plain begging of the question , for such certainly it is in respect of him , with whom he disputes , and so must be , till he shall offer proof that i have erred in that defence , the same , as if he should conclude , that he who hath once written the truth , were obliged the next time to swerve from it . so when he mentions my allegation of mat. 28.19 . the word allegation must signifie that i produce and so allege that text as a proof of my position : but this he knows i do not ; but only suppose the antipaedobaptist to found his plea in it , and all that i have to do , is to shew how useless it is like to prove to him ; confessing also that to me it is as uselesse , and so never attempting to draw any argument from it . so again , when upon a supposition by him specified he assumes me to grant that which he acknowledgeth me expressely to deny , this sure is very incongruous : t is visible from the words by me produced § . 96. that i deny that that text of mat. 28.19 . can prejudice the baptisme of infants , and the only design i had in considering this text at all in this place , was to evidence the second branch of the negative part of my undertaking , that there appeared nothing in christs institution of baptisme , or commission to his apostles , which was exclusive of infants : how then can it be suggested with any shew of truth , that i seem tacitely to yield , that if the words include not infants under the discipled , there is then something in the new testament which excludes infants from baptisme . t is evident from whence it is that i infer , and positively define christs commission for baptisme to belong to infants , not from these words of christ ( which as i said , i never proposed to that end to prove my position from them , but only to answer the antipaedobaptists objection founded in them ) but from the practice of the apostles signifying their sense and perswasion of christs meaning in his institution of baptisme , which institution we know from john 4.1 . had long preceded the delivering of these words matth : 28. so that whatsoever were the notion of discipling there , yet could not i deem infants thereby excluded from baptisme , whom by another medium , viz. the apostolical practice , i supposed to be admitted to it by christs institution . the short is , infants i suppose may be received into discipleship when their parents bring them , and if so , then they are or may be included in the words mat. 28. but if they might not , and so were supposed not to be comprehended in these words of christ , mat. 28. yet that which is not included , is not presently excluded , he that saith a man is a living creature , doth not thereby deny an angel to be so also : when christ gives his disciples power to heal diseases , mat. 10.1 . he cannot be deemed to withhold from them power of raising the dead , for that we see comprehended in their commission v. 8. and so i could no way be inforced to yield that they were excluded from baptisme , as long as from any other medium i were assured they were admitted to it . and so still 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , here is not the least appearance of truth in this discourse . he proceeds then to some other attempts of proving it necessary for me if i will stand to my words elsewhere , to acknowledge infants excluded by that text , to which end he hath been very diligent in putting together several scattered passages in my writings , in hope to finde some 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and to raise some shew of argument out of my own words , and so from my temerity or inconstancy ( for want of solid proofs ) to conclude that if this precept of christ doth not necessarily infer infant baptisme , then by manifest consequence it doth deny it . the passages he gathers up are these , the doctor saith , § . 55. that christs institution makes dipping or sprinkling with water a sacrament , which institution is mat. 28.19 . and therefore the doctor will have the words there indispensably used in baptisme , and § . 92. he saith baptisme is a sacrament , that sacrament an institution of christs , that institution not founded in any reason of immutable truth , but only in the positive will of christ , and so that there is nothing considerable in this question ( or any of this nature ) but how it was delivered by christ , and § . 94. that which was done by the apostles , if it were not a rule for ever , yet was an effect of such a rule formerly given by christ , and interpretable by this practise to be so . and pract. cat. l. 6. § . 2. he expounding christs institution , saith that the words import that the person baptized acknowledgeth , maketh profession of believing in three , delivers him to three as authors of his faith , and to be ruled by the directions of his master , and this he will have to be meant by baptizing into the name of the father , son , and holy ghost . these are the passages , whence , saith he , i infer that if baptisme be a sacrament , and made so by christs institution , and that institution founded only in his positive will , and the will of christ be , that baptisme be in the name of the trinity , and this is when the baptized makes profession of believing in three , to be ruled by them , and the apostles practice interprets christs rule , no infant that doth not profess faith , is baptized into the name of the trinity , nor was appointed to be baptized by christ , nor did the apostles baptize them , and therefore they are not baptized according to christs institution , and so no sacrament to them . here is a very subtile fabrick ▪ and great pains taken to pro● me to affirm tacitely what i expressely deny : but herein though his pains be great , he hath much failed of the successe , it were too long to shew it at large , yet the reader that will be at pains to survey his processe , will certainly acknowledge it , if he shall but remember these two things . 1. that christs institution of baptisme was not ( nor is ever affirmed by me to be ) set down in those words of mat. 28. that having been long before instituted and practised , as appears by plain words joh. 4.1 , 2. secondly , that though christs will and institution for baptizing infants be not so manifestly exprest in those words mat. 28.19 . as shall be able by the bare force of the words to convince any gainsayer , without any other way of evidence or proof added to it , yet by the apostles practice of baptizing infants ( appearing to us by other means ) it is most evident that they who certainly did not mistake christs meaning , did thus understand and extend his institution and commission . the truth of this is there made evident § . 30. &c. i shall not here repeat it . 2dly . that the infant when he is to be baptized , doth , though not by his own voice personally , yet by his lawful proxies , which the church accepteth in his stead , professe the believing in three , the father , son , and holy ghost , deliver himself up to three , &c. by this clue the reader will easily extricate himself out of the labyrinth there provided for him , if such it appear to be , and discern a perfect accordance in all the passages , which with such hope of advantage were so diligently collected by him . but this is not all , he will yet drive the businesse somewhat higher in these words , yea , if the positive will of christ , be the reason of baptisme , they usurp upon christs prerogative who baptize otherwise then christ hath appointed , and then if the precept of christ doth not necessarily infer infant baptisme ( which the doctor ingenuously acknowledgeth ) it doth by manifest consequence deny it , sith he forbids that to be done otherwise then he hath appointed when he hath determined how it should be done . the doctor when he saith above , the words , [ i baptize into the name of the father &c. ] must be indispensably used , me thinks by the same reason should conceive christs institution should be unalterably used in baptizing those only whom he hath appointed to be baptized . to this the grounds of answer have been already laid also , viz. that they that baptize infants , baptize no otherwise then christ appointed , and the apostles appear to have understood his appointment . by christs appointment , not meaning particularly his words mat. 28 but his will otherwise made known to his disciples , when and in what words soever it was that he instituted baptisme , which must be long before this , even before his apostles took upon them to baptize any , which yet they did in great abundance joh. 4.1 . and of this appointment or institution of batisme by christ , it is most true , that if that precept of christ , whereby he first instituted baptisme , did not indeed comprehend and so necessarily inferre infant baptisme , and was so understood to do by the apostles , it shall consequently be deemed to deny it . but then herein lyes a great fallacie , when from another appointment of christs , viz. that mat. 28. which i acknowledge not to inferre infant baptisme necessarily , he assumes in universum , and reports it as my confession , that christs precept ( indefinitely taken , and so extending to all christs precepts at any time ) doth not necessarily inferre infant baptisme . which is that grand illogical fault in discourse , of inferring an indefinite or universal conclusion from particular premisses . as for the comparison which he makes betwixt the indispensable use of the words of baptisme mat. 28. and the as unalterable observation of christ's institution , in respect of the persons to be baptized , i willingly grant it , on the condition praemised , that he mistake not the text , mat. 28. to be the words of that institution , wherein christ defined , who are the persons to be baptized . those words are a commission to the apostles to go preach to , or disciple all nations , and thus farre extends to point out the persons , viz. that they should ( as disciple so ) baptize gentiles as well as jewes , and again , they are express for the forme of baptisme , that it should be in the name of the father , the sonne , and the holy ghost , but they are not any kind of direction to that other matter of receiving , and admitting infants or not infants . that i suppose sufficiently notified to them before both by the common practice of their ancestors in the jewish religion , by the vulgar notion of baptisme , whilest it was familiarly used among the jewes , both to their own and their proselytes children , and also by christs speciall direction ( though the gospels , which express not at all the words of the first institution of baptisme , do not set that down ) in the time of his preaching among them , some while before that passage of storie related , joh. 4.1 . &c. from both of these , i suppose , the apostles learnt it ( and not from mat. 28. ) and we learn it only from the apostles , as shall hereafter appear . and so much for his prooemial reasoning . sect. 2. making disciples all one with receiving into discipleship . baptizing the act of the baptist . instruction subsequent to discipling . the pretended parallel between mat. 28. and mar. 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 johns discipling by preaching excludes not infants . no more the apostles , mat. 10.5 . the notation of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . mat. 13.52 . act. 14.21 . infants both said to come and to believe . instruction subsequent to baptisme . after this praelusorie 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , he next proceeds to consider , what shift ( as he calls it ) the doctor makes to elude the force of christs institution , mat. 28.19 . but i have already made it evident that that commission for preaching to , or discipling all nations ( as for the baptizing them , and the particularity of the forme to be used in baptisme , &c. ) was not the institution of baptisme , nor any intimation on either side , whether infants should be baptized or not ; and so t is manifest how little need i had to use any shift , or artifice to elude the force of it . however in his view of my discourse some exceptions he must find ; and the first is , that though 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is well rendred , make disciples , yet 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is not well paraphrased by , receiving into discipleship , baptizing them , making this forme of baptisme the ceremonie of receiving them . for by this , saith he , the making disciples is made the same with receiving them , and baptisme the ceremonie of receivers into discipleship , which is as truely an act of the baptized professing , or avouching his discipleship . here is another subtlety of a refined nature , making a difference betwixt making disciples , and receiving into discipleship , or receiving disciples ; as if these two were not perfectly synonymous , and by me evidently used , as such . i shall not dispute of words , when the matter is clear , and when it is equally to my purpose which phrase is used , whether making or receiving disciples . 2dly . when he affirmes of baptisme , which i make the ceremonie of the apostles receiving them , that t is as truely the act of the baptized , this is no subtilty , but grosse and visible enough ; for certainly baptisme in the active sense ( as it is plain i understand it in that place , where i paraphrase , goe and make disciples and baptize ) is not the act of the baptized , but of the baptist ; the coming to baptisme indeed , and the undertaking the vow , and making the profession , is the act of the baptized , either personally , or by his proxy , which in reputation of law , and in acceptation of the church , is his also , but still baptisme , or ( to remove all possible mistake ) baptizing , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , mat. 28.19 . is an act of the baptizer onely , and so the ceremonie of receiving into discipleship , whomsoever they thus duely baptize . i hope i need say no more of this . his 2d branch of exception is to those words of mine wherein i say that the making or receiving disciples , supposeth not any precedent instruction , but lookes wholly on it as subsequent . this i there concluded not from the bare negative , because there was no precedent mention of such instruction , where discipling and baptizing , were both mention'd , but because in that place , on which the antipaedobaptist so much relyes , mat. 28.19 . the [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 teaching ] is expressely mentioned after discipling and baptizing , and so is in reason to be deemed , and lookt on , as subsequent to both , and so the receiving ad discipulatum referre to that then future instruction . and to this sense i there made it manifest , that the definition of baptisme 1 pet. 3.21 . did referre that , baptisme is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , seeking to god , as to the oracle to inquire for the whole future life , no way prerequiring actual instruction , but coming to christ and the church to receive it , and obey it for the future ( and that done in some sort by those that are brought , when they are not able to come , and by the charitie of the church received there ) and this farther illustrated as by the manner of children brought by parents to school , without either knowledge of letters , or choise , or so much as wish of instruction , so by the manner of christ's disciples being received by him , particularly of philip , joh. 1.44 . who was called , and received into discipleship , as soon as ever christ met with him , i. e. before he was at all instructed by him , and so also by the storie of the jewes , exo. 19.8 . who undertook to obey all the commandments of god , which he should give them , which yet were not then , but after given them , v. 20. and so lastly by the nature of proselytisme , which as it is all one with entring into god's covenant and ( in the christian sense ) with coming to christ and being received to discipleship , so t is that which children are known to be capable of , not onely by that text , deut. 29.10 . but by the custome of baptizing infant proselytes among the jewes , and by christ's command to suffer them to come unto him , whensoever they were thus brought . now to this thus evidenced ( and much more largely in that place , § . 26. &c. ) he is pleased to annex some reasons of his dissent , for , 1. saith he , that which is exprest in matthew by , go ye therefore and make disciples all nations , is in marke , go ye into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature , which shewes how they should disciple all nations ; now they who are made disciples by preaching the gospel are made disciples by precedent instruction , ergo , the making or receiving disciples mat. 28.19 . supposeth precedent instruction . but to this i answer , 1. that the words in marke are no otherwise parallel to those in matthew , then as an epitome is parallel to a larger discourse , such we know s. markes for the most part is , an abbreviation of s. matthews gospel , as in many others , so in this particular , some passages indeed there are in s. mark in this place , which are not in s. matthew , as shall a non be shewed , but in the particular now before us , s. mark is , according to wont , more concise ; there is no mention in him of baptizing in the name of the father and of the son & of the holy ghost , nor consequently of discipling , of which that was the ceremonie , as in s. matthew there is . 2dly . that christs appointment 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to preach the gospel , in s. mark , doth no way inferre the precedent instruction of every single person that was received to baptisme : the phrase signifies to proclaime or promulgate the happy tidings brought into the world by christ , grace , and mercy , and eternal felicitie to all that should come into him and take his yoke upon them , and learn of him ; and upon the publishing of this to all the world , to every creature , i. e. to the gentiles universally , as well as the jewes , i suppose t is very possible , that many of them should make all speed to come unto christ , and come out at the apostles preaching , they and their whole housholds together ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as the oracle commanded in homer ) and to bring their infant children with them , as they used to do , that became proselytes to the jewes and then the apostles , knowing their masters mind for the receiving of infants , and that ( as from the institution i suppose them fore-instructed ) to baptisme , receive them all , and ( as many as interposed no voluntary hindrance ) baptize them , and having taken them into the school of christ make good provision for the future instruction of them , as soon as ever they should be capable of it . that thus it was i pretend not ( still ) to deduce from these words , mat. 28. but to infer from another medium , the practice of the apostles , otherwise notified to us : all that i am now to manifest , is , that this passage hath nothing contrary to our hypothesis , but is perfectly reconcileable with it , and this is done by the scheme thus laid : and so t is most visible how no force there is in this first reason of exception . the 2d followes , that such as the making disciples was jo. 4.1 . such is the making disciples mat. 28.19 . for by the doctors confession they are all one . but that was by preaching , as is plain concerning john , mat. 3.1 , 2 , 5 , 6. and concerning the apostles . mat. 10.5 , 6 , 7. ergo. to this i answer , that the account last given is fully satisfactory to this exception also ; for supposing the apostles to publish whithersoever they came , the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the good newes that was come into the world by christ , and the hearers not only to come in themselves , but to bring their whole families , and so their infant children with them , there is no difficulty to imagine , that they that had thus made proclamation , received all , and made all disciples , yong and old , that either came or were brought , and so it being granted that they made disciples by preaching , preaching being the instrument to draw the parents themselves , and to move them to bring their children to discipleship , it is still very visible how children should be discipled , and consequently baptized by them , baptisme being the constant ceremony of discipling . and though i am not able to affirm , how it was actually in johns baptisme , yet this i may say , that as far as can be discerned or inferred from the phrase in either place , ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) thus it very possibly might be both in johns and in the apostles baptizing . first for john , 't is true indeed that his baptisme attended his preaching , yet doth it not thence necessarily follow that none were baptized by him but those who particularly heard and obeyed his preaching ; for 1. why might not those that heard it , divulge it to others , and bring them before they heard him , to desire to be baptized , and upon their confessing their sins , and professing amendment , he baptize them ? 2. why might not those that heard it , or heard of it , give that heed of it , as to bring all that were dear to them of what age soever , by that means to secure them from the wrath to come ; when noah preacht repentance to the old world , and upon the decree of sending the flood upon the world of the ungodly , called all to come into the ark to him to escape the deluge , suppose others besides noahs family had hearkned to his preaching , or suppose he and his sons had had infant children , can we imagine they would have left their infants to that certain ruine , and not have taken them into the ark with them ? and johns baptisme was answerable to that ark , in respect of that approaching ruine on the jewes , styled the kingdome of heaven v. 1. and that evidenced to be a bloody kingdome , explicated by casting into the fire v. 10. and can we imagine the jews that believed john and came to his baptisme , did not bring their children with them to save them from the praedicted evils , and then i professe not to see any reason to render it incredible that john baptist should thus receive and baptize those infants ( though the scripture affirming nothing of it , and tradition , as far as i know , as little , i shall neither affirm nor believe any thing in it ) this only is certain , that among the jewes of that time infant children were known to be capable of entring into covenant with god after this manner , and of being partakers of the benefit of the covenant by that means . and one thing more i may adde , that christ himself , who was by his sinlesness , as unqualified for the repentance which john preacht , as the infants were by their incapacities , did yet come and was received to johns baptisme , v. 13. and then in c●se infants were brought , why might not they be received also ? then 2. for as much as concerned the apostles mat. 10. first , t is there evident that they were sent to the lost sheep indefinitely , and sure that phrase comprehends the lambs also , the infant children being lost in adam as well as the grown men , by the addition of their actual to original sin : and then why should we doubt but the apostles mission extended to them also ? an 2. for their preaching , it is just as johns was , to warn them to beware of the imminent destruction , that vindicative act of gods kingdome v. 7. that all that should give ear and heed to them might hasten to get out of that danger by reformation and new life ; and the ruine being impendent to the young as well as old , even the whole nation , why should not the infant children be rescued from that by their parents care in bringing them to baptisme , and timely ingaging them to fly from the wrath to come , as soon as they should come to understanding , injoying in the mean time the benefit of others charity ? thirdly , after their preaching though there be no mention of baptizing ( and so it was not so fit to be produced to our present business ) yet other things there are appointed to be done , wherein infants were concerned as well as others , as healing of diseases &c. and if being incapable of receiving benefit from preaching should be deemed an obstacle to their being baptized , why should it not to their receiving of cures ? nay i may adde , how should the dead in that place ( who sure were as uncapable of hearing or understanding as the tenderest infant ) be capable of being raised by those apostles , which yet is there affirmed of them , v. 8. and so much for that reason also , and in like manner for the third , which is but repeating the last branch of this second , that the apostles were to disciple all nations by the same way that they discipled the lost sheep of the house of israel , which was , saith he , by preaching and therefore supposed precedent instruction . in what sense , i have now shewed , viz. by preaching , to the nations , and receiving all that came in to the discipleship , whether on their own leggs , or in others arms , whole families at once , the parents , and upon their undertaking their infant children also . his fourth proof is taken from the use and notation of the word , which is so to teach as that they learn , and so , saith he , is used mat. 13.52 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is rendred , [ instructed ] by our last translators , and can be no otherwise rendred than [ made a disciple by teaching ] so act. 14.21 . it is said , having preached the gospel to that city , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and having taught or made many disciples . for the notation of the word we have formerly said sufficient , that it signifies to receive ad discipulatum , as into a school of spiritual instruction , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to make a disciple , and such he is made , who by any motive or means either comes or is brought into the school , this indeed in order to teaching in the master , and to learning in the scholar , and the one so to teach , as that the other learn , but this subsequent to his being made a disciple , the youth we know enters into the school , is admitted into the college and vniversity , before he learns a word there , the instruction or learning is still lookt upon as future , at his entring into discipleship . and this is all the importance of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mat. 13.5 . only some accidental differences may be observed , 't is in the passive , and in the aorist in the preter tense , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 every scribe which is or hath been entred as a disciple unto the kingdome of heaven , who since his entrance hath been instructed and ( as real passives import ) received influence , been really affected and changed by discipleship , still no way supposing that he was instructed in the learning or mysteries of the kingdome of heaven , before he was thus admitted a disciple to it ; after his admission , there is no doubt but he doth ( or ought to ) learn , nay being there 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a scribe discipled , a grown man and learned among the jews , before he came to christ , i doubt not but some knowledge he had of it before he entred himself a disciple ( see baptizing of infants , p. 199. ) but this not by force of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , for still a disciple he may be before he learns , and is therefore obliged to learn , because he hath assumed and undertaken to do so , either personally , or by others susception , by his coming , or being brought to be a disciple . so in the other place act. 14.21 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] signifies no more then having received , or initiated , i. e. ( i suppose ) by this rite of baptisme , made and baptized many disciples , which though it be there set down as a consequent of the apostles preaching the gospel in that city ( for otherwise it were not imaginable that they should receive any disciples there , they must first proclaim admission to all that come , before any can be expected either to come , or be brought to them ) yet may it very reasonably be extended to more persons then those that understood their preaching , viz. to the infant children of their proselytes , brought to them by their parents and dedicated to christ . thus invalid are his attempts from the notation of the word , and by consequence his inference from thence ( which is set down as his fift proof ) that thereby it may appear how the apostles understood the precept of christ to preach the gospel to persons and thereby make them disciples . for although the practice of the apostles be indeed the means by which we may discerne how they understood christs precept ( and those two places cited by mr. t. from mat. 13. and act. 14. do no way belong to that , they tell us not , whether they received infants to baptisme , or not ) yet i may very well ward my self from any inconvenience , which this use of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in other places can threaten , it being already vindicated from all necessity that it should be confined to grown men , and not communicated to infants also . his last proof is by returning to the first again , comparing the words in matthew with the parallel place in mark , whereby , saith he , a disciple and believer will appear to be the same , the disciple to be baptized in mat. being in mark expressed by the believer , which is put before baptism . to this i answer , 1. that that passage in s. mark , he that believes and is baptized shall be saved , and he that believeth not shall be damned , and so on to the end of the gospel , is ( as even now i intimated ) added by that evangelist , to the words , as they are set down in matthew and so being an addition , cannot be looked on , as exactly parallel to the words in matthew , go , and disciple all nations baptizing them — and this we also know is ordinary for one evangelist to set down more fully , what is omitted or more shortly set down in another , and s. mark that in other things was willing to abbreviate s. matthew , doth now visibly in large ; and so the comparison cannot regularly be made betwixt these two evangelists words , something being abbreviated in mark which was more at large in matthew , and something more concisely set down in matthew , and more largely in mark. and then what necessity is there , that mark not mentioning discipling but believing : and matthew mentioning discipling but not believing the discipled and believers should be deemed the same . t is true indeed of grown men , none can in reason be admitted disciples , which are not also believers ( the ground of which i have set down in the resol . of the quaere p. 199. ) but of infant children this is not true , for those , though they cannot come , may yet be brought , and though not upon their own confession , yet by the susception of others , made capable of the churches charity , and so may be disciples without actual or personal belief . nay 2dly if mr. t. his argument had power to infer it , t were that which i might safely avouch , that infants may be comprehended under the style 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , they that believe and are baptized ; so even now we had it in the expresse words of christ , the little ones ( and s. luke specifies them to be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 little infants ) that believe on him : i. e. just as they are said elsewhere to come unto him , when they are as uncapable , for want of bodily strength , of personal coming , as for want of strength of minde or judgement , for personal believing , and yet in respect of others bringing them to christ ( and so to the church in baptisme ) they are by christ himself said to do both of these , to come in one place , and to believe in the other . but then 3dly , i willingly acknowledge that the word [ believe ] in mark , belongs peculiarly to the grown men and women , who are called by the preaching of the gospel , of whom though it be said , that believing and being baptized they shall be saved , and not believing they shall be damned , yet it no way follows , that none but such as thus personally believed , should be baptized , or that being baptized they should not be saved , but lose all the benefit of their baptisme . the later part of the words is considerable ; he that believeth not shall be damned , infidelity is pitcht on , as the thing peculiarly , that incurs the certain damnation , i. e. the voluntary resisting the faith , when it is preacht convincingly to them , and of that none are capable , but those that are arrived to years of understanding . which as it is an indication that that ver . and those that follow in s. mark of believers casting out devils , &c. v. 17 , 18. belong to adulti peculiarly , so it no way hinders but s. matthews words being different from them , and supposed to be precedent to them in christs delivery , may comprehend infants also , as such who are capable of entring into discipleship , and of being brought and presented to the apostles by believing parents , this being the way whereby the faith of the parents may be signally beneficial to the childe , in bringing him thus early into the school , and so to the benediction of christ , the parents together with the infant children , as among the jews so among christians , entring together into covenant with god. in this matter mr. t. is willing to finde a difference betwixt teaching them to observe all things whatsoever christ hath commanded them , mat. 28.20 . and the preaching of the gospel in s. mark : thinking by that means to avoid the importunity of that text in matthew , which evidently sets baptisme before instructing . but this can avail him nothing , for if by the gospel in mark we understand the whole gospel , as in reason we must , for that is it which must be preacht to every creature ( the gentile world ) then is that directly all one with teaching them to observe whatsoever he hath commanded ; but if by preaching the gospel we mean no more then , as mr. t. here saith , that jesus is the christ , i. e. the proposing him as a master , and calling all to come to him as disciples , then this being supposed precedent to mens coming to discipleship , or bringing their infants to it ( for without this they cannot be expected to come themselves , or to bring their infants ) all the rest is left to follow baptisme , and so all particular christian instruction is subsequent , not precedent to baptisme , an effect of their discipleship , attending it , no way necessary to prepare for it , which is the utmost 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which from that circumstance of that text i undertook to demonstrate . sect. 3. discipleship before instruction . what knowledge of the master is required to discipleship . two sorts of disciples , some come , others are brought . his reasons for the disproving of my interpretation of mat. 28. being thus evidenced to have no force or validity in them against our pretensions , and so indeed his whole fabrick demolished , ( that place of s. mat. being the one main ( if not only ) ground of antipaedobaptists structure ) i might well spare the advantages of the 26 , 27 , 28. §§ . to which he makes some kinde of answer in the remainder of his 25 chapter : but there is so little weight in his answers that they will be speedily dispatched . first then to my 26 § . he saith , that were it all granted me , yet it would no whit avail to prove that an infant may be a disciple appointed by christ to be baptized . to this i reply , that the 26 § . being most of it spent for the explaining an hard place 1 pet. 3.21 . concerning baptisme , and for assigning the due notion to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a question , or addresse as to an oracle , for instruction for the future life , i pretended not to conclude infant baptisme from thence , nor any more then this , that baptisme being the entring of a disciple , and not praerequiring actual instruction , but consisting in coming to christ and his church to receive it for the future , 't is certain that by this account children are capable of baptisme , because they may by the care of their parents be thus brought early to christ , and entred into his school by them , before they themselves have faculties either to desire , or know what is done to them , the proportion holding in this betwixt infants and other scholars that are entred by their parents in any school before they know one letter in the book , or have actual willingness to acquire any knowledge ; and this is there illustrated by the example philip , joh. 1.44 . and of the jews , ex. 19.8 . which have again been mentioned , and are clear evidences , that those may be received into discipleship which have not yet had precedent instruction . against this all that he hath to pretend is set down by him in these words , let putting to school be as early as the doctor will imagine , yet none is put to school till he doth know his teacher , and so none is christ's disciple in the scripture language till he know jesus to be christ , and take him for his lord , which infants being not capable of , they are not disciples , nor to be baptized according to christ's appointment . to this i answer , 1. that the example which i had used of children being brought to school by the care of their parents , was designed to shew no more then this , that they may be delivered up to be scholars , who as yet know nothing of what they are to learn , nor have actual willingnesse to acquire knowledge , and consequently that entrance into discipleship referres onely to subsequent , supposes not any precedent instruction . and this is competently evidenced by that example , though it were supposed of the child that goes to school , that he knowes his teacher , this bare knowledge of the person of his teacher , being none of the documents which he comes to school to learn , but the good letters that are profest and taught in the school , nor indeed is it imaginable why a blind child which is brought to school , or put to an instructer , and so cannot be deemed to know the master , before assuetude hath acquainted him with him , should not yet be said , with as full propriety of speech , to come to school , as he that useth his own eyes as well as feet to direct him thither . 2dly . it is as true , that children that are brought to school do not always know their masters before their entrance , no not by the most superficiall knowledge ; many are brought to publick schools , who never so much as saw their masters , till they are by their parents delivered up into their power and discipline ; if this be not plain enough , then change the similitude from the schoolmaster to the parent or guardian , or the very nurse , every one of these are to feed and nourish , and , as he shall be capable , to instruct the child , and so doth christ in a spirituall sense , whosoever is intrusted ( by being brought ) to him in baptisme . and we know god and nature doth thus bring a child to the parent , to the nourse or guardian , when the child knows none of these , nor understands any more of all these transactions , then the infant doth at the font conceive what is done to it there . and so still this evidenceth the vanity of this answer concerning the childs knowing his teacher . but then 3dly . this so imperfect superficial knowledge of the teacher is in no wise worth considering in this matter ; for i shall demand , doth such very imperfect knowledge of christ , as a schoolboy hath of his teacher , the first hour he comes into the school , qualifie him for discipleship to christ , or no ? if it do , then his countrymen and kinsmen , before he revealed himself to be the messiah , and the pharisees , which believed not his miracles , were sufficiently qualified , and then t is evident that those might be admitted to discipleship , which were not believers , and so all mr. t. his hypotheses are destroyed , and then infants may be discipled and baptized , though they be not believers . as for that which he here interposes [ the knowing jesus to be christ , and taking him for his lord ] this bears no proportion with the childs bare knowing of his master , but is farre above it , equal to his making it his own choice to have this master , rather then any other , and promising exact obedience to him , which is much more then is to be found in most young scholars , or indeed in any that are brought by their parents or guardians , who alone are the persons who bear proportion with the infants brought by others to baptisme . so that this reasoning of his is soon salved by distinguishing of disciples , that they are either such as come , or such as are brought to school , proselytes of their own choice , or children under the care of others , of the former sort there are none but such as have some rude imperfect knowledge of christ , upon which they make this choice , and without it would not probably be expected to make it ; but for children which as minors in their guardians hands , have no will of their own , there is no necessity they should have knowledge to move their will , they may very reasonably be acted by the will of others , and by their charity be made partakers of those priviledges which are communicated from christ , in his church to all true members thereof , and to that end be discipled and , baptized , entred by this ceremonie into the church of god , where instruction is to be had , as soon as they are capable of it , and in the mean while partake of those other advantages , of which their condition is capable . sect. 4. the difference of a disciple and proselyte examined . christian as well as jewish proselytes , priviledges of proselytisme , disciples of the pharisees . the holy ghost's not using the word proselyte of christians , concludes nothing . jehovah . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 infants qualified for baptisme . as for entring into covenant deut. 29. gods oath . infants adjured , creples capable of christ's cures . to my 27. and 28. §§ . his answer is brief , that what i say is not right ; and for proof , though he begins with a [ for 1. ] and so by his forme of branching , promises more reasons then one , yet that first hath never a [ secondly ] to follow or back it , and so t is all resolved into that one , viz. that it is not true that a disciple and a proselyte are perfectly all one . to this therefore i must advert , and consider what nice difference he can spring betwixt a disciple and a proselyte , whereupon to found satisfaction for conscience why infants may be proselytes , and as such , come unto christ , and yet cannot be made disciples , or received in baptisme to discipleship . and his reason is , because a proselyte , saith he , notes one that is by birth an alien from the commonwealth of israel , and comes to the israelites to own their god , and be part of their policie , and not to be taught , but enjoy priviledges with other jewes , whether civil or ecclesiastical . but certainly this is no reason of difference , for besides that i , in that § . 27. acknowledged this accidental difference , that a proselyte denotes a coming from some other nation ( as a disciple doth not ) adding that this difference had no place in this matter , where the disciples are specified to be received from all nations ; besides this , i say , it cannot be unknown to mr. t. that i speak of proselytes in such a notion as is equally competible to all of what nation soever they are , that enter into covenant with god. thus do we find a proselyte defined , heb. 11.6 . by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , he that cometh to god , thus doth a jew when he enters into covenant of obedience to him , and thus did a gentile when he undertook the whole law of the jewes , and was therefore 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a proselyte of their covenant , and a proselyte of their righteousnesse , and such is every one whether jew or gentile , that cometh to christ ; and as the two former of these were made partakers of priviledges by this means , particularly allowed freely to enter into the congregation , and infants as well as grown men , were thus among them admitted into covenant ; so it is not imaginable why it should not hold of the christian proselytes also , nor why the christian infants thus received into covenant by christ , after the same manner as jewish and gentile infants were among the antient people of god , i. e. by baptisme , should not as properly be called proselytes of christ , though they neither come from any other nation , nor ever associate themselves with israelites according to the flesh . and whereas he saith of the proselytes coming to the israelites , that they came not to be taught , but to enjoy priviledges , i cannot divine what motive he had to affirme it , for sure the infant child that was baptized , and so received into the congregation of israel did come to learn the jewish religion , into which he was thus early initiated , and that was one speciall priviledge ( the rest of the heathen having not knowledge of these lawes , ) the immediate end of his proselytisme , yet not excluding those other ends of injoying all other priviledges both civil and ecclesiastical thereby . and when he addes , but a disciple of christ is one that ownes christ for his teacher and lord onely for spiritual benefits , i might well acknowledge it , and aske , why then an infant , who hath need of those spiritual benefits , assoon as he is born , should not be hastened to a participation of them ? but it is farther evident , that spiritual benefits being first and principally designed , other even secular advantages may very lawfully be respected , and reaped by them that are thus early brought in , whether as disciples , or proselytes to christ . two sage observations he here addeth , 1. that there is no mention of the disciples of the priests , but of the pharisees and sadduces , and i can very well grant it , who speak not of any lower kinde of disciples , but either of god among the jews , or of christ , among us christians , those being the only discipleships , to which they were admitted by the ceremony of baptisme , the disciples of the pharisees and sadduces being but a subdivision , and notification of several sects among jews , as there are different denominations of christians ( the more the pity ) which divide unity , but use not new baptismes , to discriminate them , i am sure contradict the apostle if they doe . his 2d observation is , that the holy ghost doth not at any time call christians christs proselytes , but his disciples , that , saith he , we might not confound the notions of these terms ; but i answer , 1. that those texts that expresse the christians entring into discipleship , by coming unto him ( of which there are good store ) do in effect call them proselytes , for a proselyte is a greek noun derived immediatly from the verb 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to come unto . and 2dly that if this word , whether in it self , or in the verb from whence it comes , had never been used in the new testament , yet would it not thence follow , that we might not confound the notions of proselytes and disciples : the word jehovah is never used by the holy ghost in the new testament , yet may we not thence conclude , that the notion of jehovah and god are divers : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the known style of the nicene fathers , is never found used by the writers of the bible , yet sure it no way follows thence , that the notion of that word , and of this phrase [ i and my father are one ] are different and may not be confounded . t is pity to lose time on such fictions of scruple , and difficulty as these . what now is further said by him in this chapter , both concerning little ones coming unto christ , and of their entring into covenant , deut. 29.10 . is on both sides but a bare denyal of that which is competently proved in that 28 § . for t is there evident that infant children are and always were accounted capable of proselytisme and so of being entred disciples , and particularly of being entred into covenant with god , and so of being baptized , and there is no reason imaginable , why the infants which were capable of coming to christ , were blessed by him were affirmed by him to be qualified for the kingdome of heaven , should be denyed water to be baptized : the holy ghost being fallen on the gentiles that came with cornelius , peter durst not deny them baptisme ; and with what equity can the christian church do it to those , who are qualified for the receiving pardon of sin , for being blest by christ , for being received into covenant with him , and may afterward be instructed in all things which are needful to be learnt , for that still they are unqualified , till by hearing they own christ as their master , this is a begging of the question , without any the least tender of proof . as for entring into covenant , when by the force of deut. 29.10 . he is forced to yield it competible to infants , yet he will do his best to escape the conviction which it offers him , 1. by modifying the sense , then by invalidating my inference from it . first , though he yield that they may enter into covenant , yet this , saith he , but in some sense , by their fathers act ingaging them under a curse or oath to own god as theirs , in which sense the posterity then unborn did enter into covenant , deut. 29.15 . but if we examine the place , it will be most clear , 1. that the covenant is entred into by the infants , just as by the rest of them , the wives and the strangers or proselytes : on their part , ye stand this day all of you before the lord , that thou shouldst enter into covenant with the lord ; and on gods part , that he may establish thee this day for a people . 2dly here is in the text no mention of any act of the fathers ingaging them under a curse or oath , but only of gods oath which he maketh to them . v. 12. 3dly if they had thus adjured , or laid oath or curse upon their children , yet would this make no difference betwixt their and our entring into covenant ; we by the oath of baptisme which is laid on the childe ( by him to be performed when he comes to ability , unlesse he will forfeit all the benefits of his baptisme ) do in like manner adjure our infants , though whilest they remain such , they hear it as little as the jewish infants did . 4thly whereas from v. 15. he cites that the posterity then unborn thus entred into covenant , there is no such word in the text ▪ no mention of [ posterity ] or of [ unborn ] but of them only , who were not that day with them , i. e. ( i suppose ) were at that time of assmbling absent from the congregation . i wonder why mr. t. should attempt thus to impose upon the reader . as for our inference ( which is this , that by parity of reason , infants may be entred into discipleship , and accordingly baptized , as well as they then might be entred into the covenant of god ) he simply rejects it , without any farther notice of his reason again , save onely this , that in baptisme such a discipleship is injoyn'd as is by preaching the gospel , and they onely are disciples that are believers , and the onely are appointed to be baptized , who in their own persons do enter into covenant and ingage themselves to be christs followers , and this is again but a pitifull petitio principii , a denying our conclusion when the premises cannot be denyed , and so invincibly inferre the conclusion , viz. that those may be brought to and received into discipleship , covenant , baptisme , which in their own persons are not yet able to come to christ , as those criples may be born by others to christ , who wanted strength to addresse themselves , and be as really partakers of his healing miracles , as those who came to him on their own legges . and so much also for the 25th chapter . chap. iii. of the apostolical practice in this matter . sect. 1. the interpretation of 1 cor. 7.12 . vindicated . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . sanctification used to denote baptisme , the use of it in the fathers and scripture . tertullians testimonie : designati sanctitatis . origen . author quaest : ad antiochum . cyprian . chrysostome . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 there , infant children , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the epistles . s. augustines words examined . in his last chapter he proceeds to the view of those §§ . which set down the positive part of our basis , evidencing the opinion and sense , which the apostles had of christ's institution , and of his intention to include , and not to exclude infants from baptisme . the apostles sense must be judged by their own usage ▪ and practice , and that is testified to us two waies , 1. by one considerable remain and indication of it in s. paul , 2. by the practice of the first and purest ages of the church , receiving infants to baptisme , and so testifying the apostolical usage , and farther affirming that they received it by tradition from the apostles . the remain , and indication in s. paul is in the known place of 1 cor. 7.12 . where speaking of the believers children he saith v. 14 ▪ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . but now are they holy , i. e. it is the present practice of the church ( that apostolical church in s. paul's time ) to admit to baptisme the infant chldren of parents , of whom one is christian though not of others . that this is the meaning of [ holy ] is there made evident , as by other arguments , so by this , that the antient fathers who knew the sacred dialect , call baptisme sanctification , eum qui natus est , baptizandum & sanctificandum , in cyprian , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to be sanctifyed when they have no feeling of it , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , let him be sanctified from the infancie , i. e. baptized then , in gregorie nazianzen . to which testimonies , and the rest which is there produced out of the agreement of the jewish style ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sanctifications for baptismes , to which agrees maecarius's saying of the jewish baptisme , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , it sanctifies the flesh , hom. 47. p. 509. ) because the main difficulty of the interpretation consists herein , i sh●ll now adde more , one very antient before any of these ( within less then an 100. years after the death of s. john ) tertullian de animâ , c. 39. where speaking of infants , and saying , ex sanctificato alterutro sexu sanctos procreari , that when either the father or mother is sanctified ( i. e. received as a believer by baptisme into the church , the children are holy &c. ( clear evidences of the notion of the word ) this he there proves by these very words of this apostle , caeterum , inquit , immundi nascuntur , else ( so caeterum in tertullian's style is known to be put for alioqui or the greek 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) were your children unclean , adding in stead of these other words [ but now are they holy ] quasi designatos tamen sanctitatis & per hoc etiam salutis , intelligi volens fidelium filios , hereby willing that we should understand that the children of believers are the designed , or the sealed of holyness ( in the sense , i conceive , wherein they that are baptized are by the antients frequently said 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to be sealed ) and thereby of salvation also : and all this , saith he , thus urged by the apostle , ut hujus spei pignora matrimoniis quae retinenda censuerat , patrocinarentur , that this hope might be a pledge to ingage the believing wife or husband not to part from the unbeliever , and he yet farther addes ( still to the confirming of this interpretation ) alioqui meminerat dominicae definitionis , nisi quis nascatur ex aquâ & spiritu , non introibit in regnum dei , i. e. non erit sanctus . otherwise ( or if this argument of the apostle had not been sufficient ) he would have mentioned the definition of christ , that unless one be born of water and the spirit ( i. e. baptized ) he shall not enter into the kingdome of god , i. e. shall not be holy , shewing still of what holyness he understands the apostles speech , that which the child of the believer is made partaker of by baptisme , concluding , ita omnis anima usque eo in adam censetur donec in christo recenseatur , tamdiu immunda quamdiu recenseatur , every soul is so long inrolled in adam till it be inrolled anew in christ , and is so long unclean till it be thus anew inrolled , which as it supposes every child of adam to be impure , till he be thus by baptisme made a child of gods , a member of christ , so it gives a full account of that uncleanesse , and that holyness of which the apostle speaks the former the state of a child of adam unbaptized , the later of him that by baptisme is initiated and matriculated into christ . and to this agrees perfectly that of origen ( of the same age , a very few years after tertullian ) speaking of the apostles ( from whom , saith he , the church received by tradition that infants should be baptized ) sciebant enim illi quibus mysteriorum secreta commissa sunt divinorum , quia essent in omnibus genuinae sordes peccati , quae per aquam & spiritum ablui deberent , they to whom the secrets of the divine mysteries or sacraments were committed , knew that there are in all the connatural pollutions of sin , which ought to be washt away by water and the spirit , giving us to understand what uncleanness and holyness it is , that children are capable of , the uncleanness of their birth from adam , and the cleanness or sanctity of christian baptisme . so athanasius * quaest . ad antioch . 114. ( or whosoever it is under the name of that antient father ) where the salvation of the baptized infants is concluded by him upon force of those two texts , suffer little children to come unto me ; and , now are your children holy , whereto he there sets parallel , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the baptized infants of believers , as the plain paraphrase of the apostles words . to these i farther adde another passage of * cyprian , together with the 66. bishops that were in councel with him in their epistle to fidus , where speaking of the baptisme of infants and expressely forbidding that any such should be hindred or kept from it , he brings for proof of it the words of s. peter , that the lord had said unto him that he should count none common or unclean , where it appears what was that holy fathers notion of common or unclean , such as might be refused baptisme , and consequently they which are not such , but on the contrary 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 clean or holy ( and such saith paul here are the believers children ) are to be admitted thither . upon which words of s. cyprian * s. augustine speaking saith , he made no new decree , but kept most firme the faith of the church , & mox natum rite baptizari posse cum suis coepiscopis censuit , and he and his fellow bishops resolved that a child might duely be baptized as soon as born . so * s. chrysostome in his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to them that were to be baptized , speaking of the several titles of baptisme , applies unto it that of the apostle 1 cor. 6.11 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , but ye are washed , but ye are sanctified : * and again , of those that were baptized , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the scripture pronounces them not onely made clean but just and holy also . so * gregorie nyssene in like manner , glaphyr : in exod. l. 2. speaking of him that deferres baptisme to old age , saith , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 &c. he is sanctified indeed , i. e. baptized , but brings in no profit to god. and * comm : in is . l. 1. or. 1. speaking of baptisme again , and the sufficiency to wash away sin , he addes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 — but they are once sanctified , i. e. baptized — but i need no more such like suffrages . this i have both there ( §§ . 34 , 35 , 36 , 37. ) and here thus largely deduced , because in this one matter all the difficulty consists , and if it be once granted that this is the meaning of [ now are your children holy ] then here is an evidence undenyable of the apostles practice of baptizing infants , and consequently an irrefragable testimonie of their sense of christs institution , including , not excluding infants . and so this is a short and clear way of preventing all mr. t. his indevours and pains ( so largely taken ) to invalidate my conclusion from this place of the apostle , and i need not now be farther sollicitous for my paraphrase on all those 3. verses , wherein he would fain find out some excesses and defects , some insertions and omissions ; if such there were ( as i doubt not to evidence there are none ) it would be little for his advantage , as long as the interpretation of the last words [ but now are they ( i. e. your children ) holy ] appears to be this , [ but now are your infant children partakers of the priviledge of baptisme ] for this one part of that verse concludes all that i pretend , or he oppugneth : and this i hope is now cleared to be no singular interpretation of mine , but that which ( beside the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the rational importance of the context concluding it ) the style of scripture and the uniforme attestation of the antientest writers assign to it , so that there can be no reason for doubting in it . yet because this is one of the exuberancies objected to my paraphrase ( and the onely one which i can without impertinence take notice of ) that the term [ young children of christians — ] is more then is in the text , which hath onely [ your children ] which saith he , is not restrained to infancie , i shall briefely remove this exception , 1. by the authority of tertullian just now produced , who interpreted it of their infant children , as appeared both by the express words [ sanctos procreari ] and the [ caeterum immundi nascerentur ] and by the occasion of that discourse in that place , which was the immunda nativitas ethnicorum , the unclean birth of heathens children , and the unlawfulnesse of baptizing them , unlesse one of the parents were christian . to which may be added also nazianzens phrase forementioned , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , being sanctified from infancie ( for so sure 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a child before or soon after birth , saith hesychius , and aristophanes the grammarian cited by * eustathius , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a child new born ) which in all probability referres to this place of the apostle , and so renders , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , their children by their infant children . 2dly . t is as manifest by the general doctrine of the fathers , when they speak of the faith of parents profiting their children , meaning alwaies their infant children , brought to baptisme by the faith of their parents , before they are personally capable of having faith themselves . 3dly . by the inconveniences which must follow in case it be interpreted of any other but infant children . for suposing them come to years of understanding , and capacity , they shall then either be supposed to have received the faith or to remain in infidelity : if they have received the faith & then be baptized , t is evident that this benefit comes not to them upon any consideration of the faith of the parent , but upon their own personal profession , and consequently that these cannot be spoken of by the apostle in that place , where he makes the sanctification or baptisme of the children a benefit of the believing parents cohabiting with the unbeliever , and as tertullian saith , patropinium , a plea to move the beleever not to depart . but if they have lived to years and not received the faith , t is then certain that they may not be baptized at all ; and so t is manifest it must be understood of the infant ( uncapable ) children , and none else . t is true that mr. t. also excepteth against the paraphrasing of [ holy ] by [ admitted to baptisme ] affirming this to be a sense of the word , no where else found . but this i hope i have cleared already , both from the usage of the word among the jewish and first christian writers , and might farther do it even by this apostles dialect , who in his inscriptions of most of his epistles to the churches , calls all those to whom he writes , i. e. the baptized christians of those churches , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 holy , rom. 1.17 . and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sanctified , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 holy , 1 cor. 1.2 . and again 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 holy , 2 cor. 1.1 . and eph. 1.1 . phil. 1.1 : col. 1.1 . among whom no doubt there were many who were no otherwise holy or sanctified , then as all baptized christians are capable of that style . but i shall need adde no more of that to what hath been already so largely said . and the parts of my interpretation being thus cleared , that their children ] were their babes or infants , and their being holy ] their being baptized , t is sure i cannot be concerned in his conclusion , that he never read or heard any exposition antient or modern so expounding as this doctor or dictator doth , nor do i think he can shew any ] i hope now he will alter his mind , and acknowledge that it was his own fault , that this interpretation seemed so new and strange to him . as for the one place of s. augustine produced by him ( it should be , l. 2. de pecc . mer. & remiss . c. 26. ) to the seeming prejudice of this interpretation , ac per hoc & illa sanctificatio cujuscunque modi sit quam in filiis fidelium esse dixit apostolus , ad istam de baptismo & peccati origine vel remissione quaestionem omnino non pertinet ] it will easily be reconciled to it , if we but mark what question it is , that there he speaks of , even that which he had then in hand , viz. whether baptisme were necessary to remission of sinnes , and entring the kingdome of heaven . that this was the question in hand appeareth by the words immediately precedent , which are these sanctificatio , catechumen● si non fuerit baptizat●● , non ei valet ad in●randum regnum coelorum aut ad peccatorum remissionem , the sanctification of a catechumenus ( what that is he had mentioned before , catechumenos secundum quendam modum suum per signum christi & orationem impositionis manuum puto sanctificari , that some kind of sanctification which the unbaptized might have by prayer and imposition of hands , of which we sometimes read in the antients , as hath elsewhere been shewed ) profits him not for the entring the kingdome of heaven , or obteining remission of sins , unless he be baptized . and therefore that sanctification of whatsoever kind it is , viz. if it be without baptisme , belongs not , saith he , to the question then in hand concerning baptisme and the original and pardon of sin . here then i suppose is saint augustines meaning . the adversaries with whom he disputes ( the pelagians ) to maintain the no necessity of baptizing infants for the remission of sinnes , made use of that text , and concluded from it the sanctitie of the christian infant birth , before , and without baptisme : to this he answers , without any strict examination of the importance of that text , that whatsoever sanctification it can be imagined to be , that the apostle speakes of , except it be that of baptisme , it cannot avail to the remission of sinnes , &c. some improper kind of sanctification , saith he , he may confesse , secundum quendam modum , in him that is not yet baptized , but that without baptisme non valet ad intrandum , is not of force for entring into the kingdome of heaven , and therefore whatsoever sanctification that is ( viz. whatsoever without baptisme ) it belongs not to his question then before him , and so the apostles words can have no force against him . this i suppose then to be in brief s. augustines meaning in that place , that t is not the holinesse of the christian infants birth , but of their baptisme , which stands them in stead toward the kingdome of heaven : and then that , as it is no evidence on my side , that he interpreted that place to the cor. as i interpret it , so it affirmes nothing to the contrary , but leaves it in medio , having his advantages other wayes against the disputers . however for the substance , his accord with us is evident and his conclusion firme both in that place , and l. 3. de pecc . mer. & remiss . c. 12. illud sine dubitatione tenendum , quaecunque illa sanctificatio sit , non valere ad christianos faciendos , atque ad dimittenda peccata , nisi christiana atque ecclesiasticâ institutione & sacramentis ●ffici 〈◊〉 fidele● . it is to be held without doubting , that whatsoever that sanctification be ▪ it availes not to the making them christians and to the obteining remission of sins , unlesse by christian and ecclesiastical institution , and by the sacraments they be made faithfull . this is all that i can seasonably return for the vindicating of my paraphrase , it would be too immoderate an excursion to take notice of all his pretended objections to the former part of it , which concerns the cohabiting of the believer with the unbeliever , which i assure mr. t. were easy fully to answer , and shew his mistakes in each particular , if the matter of our present dispute did require , or would well bear a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of that length , or if i thought it in the least degree usefull to the reader , that i should farther explain the grounds of my paraphrase , then as they are already laid before him , sect. 31. &c. yet because the reasons which i there tendred for the paraphrase taken from the notations of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , hath been sanctified ] and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ( not to , but ) by the wife ] and by the plain consequents , what knowest thou ô wife , whether thou shalt save thy husband — are by mr. t. examined with an endeavour to confute them , and so to overthrow the whole paraphrase , it may perhaps be thought usefull that i should take a view of those his indeavors , and therefore that i shall now proceed to do , and shall there meet with by the way what was most material in his former exceptions against my paraphrase . sect. 2. the rendring 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 [ hath been sanctified ] defended . s. hieromes testimonie . enallages must not be made use of without necessity . no advantage from it here . feigned instances of enallage . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . first then , to my first evidence taken from the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , hath been sanctified ] referring to some past known examples and experiences , of this kind ( of a wives converting the husband &c. ) he hath a double answer , 1. that as my paraphrase expresseth it , it should signifie not onely that an unbelieving husband hath been sanctified , but also that there is hope they will , and so it should note not only some example past , but also some to come , of which there can be a lesse reasonable account given then of putting it in the present tense in english . 2. that the enallage or change of tense is frequent , c. 11.14 ▪ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the present tense for the future , and here 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and in the next verse 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the preter for the present , and so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 here , not , hath been , but is sanctified , or if in the preter tense , yet that to be understood of a past thing yet continued , as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 joh. 3.18 . notes an act still continued in force . to these two i reply briefely , and first to the former ( the same which he had mentioned before , and excepted against as an excesse in my paraphrase , but both there and here without the least cause ; ) for in my paraphrase , i look upon 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as a verbe of the preter tense , and as such onely adapt the sense to it , referring it not to future hopes but to past experiences or examples ; onely because examples are rhetorical syllogismes , and what hath been frequently experimented may also reasonably be hoped , i suppose that the apostle so meant these examples , as grounds of hoping the like for the future , not making this of the future any part of the sense of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the preter , but explicating the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or rational importance ( which is somewhat more then the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) of the apostles speech , and supposing this conclusion to ly hid under this premisse , as it is ordinary in all discourse to set down the premisses distinctly , leaving the conclusion by every ones reason to be drawn from thence , without setting it down explicitely . wherein that i was not mistaken , i had all assurance from v. 16. where the argument is prest , and the conclusion inferred more explicitly , for what knowest thou , ô wife , whether thou shalt save thy husband — and the like mentioned in the paraphrase from 1 pet. 3.1 . and herein i have the authority of s. hierome ; as for my rendring 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by the woman ( so i find it , per mulierem , in his 7th epist . ad laetam , and so marianus victorius in his scholia assures us , all the copies antient and printed , read it ) so also for this part of my paraphrase , exemplum refert ( saith he on the place ) quia saepe contigerit ut lucrifieret vir per mulierem , vnde & beatus petrus ait , ut siquis non credideret verbo , per mulierum conversationem sine verbo lucrifierent , id est , cùm viderint eas in melius commutatas , cognoscant omnes dei legem ita confuetudine inveterata potuisse mutari , he produceth an example because , saith he , it hath often happened that the husband hath been gained by the wife , according to that of s. peter , that if any man believe not the word , he should without the word be gained by the conversation of the wife , that is , that when they shall see them changed to the better , all may know that the law of god might have been taken in exchange for so inveterate a custome . and so again ep. 7. ad laetam , speaking of the like example , bene , saith he , felicitérque expectavimus ; sancta & fidelis domus virum sanctificat infidelem , we have well and happily expected ( i. e. not mist of our expectation ) an holy and faithfull house sanctifies an unbeliever , adding his conceipt , ipsum jovem , si habuisset talem cognationem , potuisse in christum credere , that jupiter himself if he had had such a kindred , might have been brought to the faith of christ . as for his 2d answer , i acknowledge such enallages to be ordinarie in the hebrew , and sometimes , but more rarely found in the hebraizing greeks , or hellenists , and consequently that where the context will not bear the sense of the tense which is used , there may be place for this grammatical figure , which yet is not to be made use of unnecessarily . accordingly , if there were any convincing reason offered , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the preter tense ] could not be born , i should not then doubt to interpret it by this figure , either in the present or some other tense : but when ( as here it is evident ) there is no such necessity , then 1. i cannot think fit to do so , ( t is dangerous to forsake the literal sense , when it may be commodiously reteined , and fly to either a rhetorical , or grammatical figure ) and having no motive to do so , i am next to consider , what is the properest importance of that phrase in that tense wherein it is used , and then i could not ( i believe ) have fallen upon any thing more natural , then that the preter forme of speech referred to the past experiences , &c. this is a full satisfaction to his answer , yet i may in the 2d place ex abundanti adde thus much more , that the utmost that he can pretend to by the enallage ( whether of the preter for the present , or of the preter understood of a past thing yet continued ) is as commodious for my interpretation , as the preter is : for if it be in the present , then the importance will be , that it is a matter of present daily experience ; if in the past continued , then that it is matter both of past and present experience that the unbeliever is thus wrought upon by the believer , and brought into the church by baptisme , and this a just ground of hope , that so it may be again in any particular instance , and so a competent motive that the believing wife should abide with the infidel husband , and not depart as long as he will live peaceably with her , and this sure was s. hieromes understanding in the words newly cited , exemplum refert , quia saepe contigerit &c. the apostle makes instance , produceth example , that this hath ( and doth ) ordinarily come to passe ; and to that also exactly agrees the 16th verse , for how knowest thou &c. as for mr. t. his instances of euallage , though now i may safely yield them all , and rather gain then lose by them , i shall yet in the last place adde my sense , that no one of them is any way convincing ; that of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is not , c. 1. l. 24. for his passion was now so neer approaching , that it might very fitly be represented as present , and so that be the force of the present tense . that of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is not pertinent for certainly [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] is not for [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , was ] which is the enallage of tenses , nor is there any necessity it should be for [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] ( the enallage of modes ) the rendring is proper , else are your children unclean , and exactly all one with else were , the change of the mode not changing the sense in this matter ; which was the cause why i followed the english rendring , and made no change in that translation . as for his 3d instance 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 v. 15. which he saith is manifestly put in the preter tense for the present , i cannot be convinced of it , the context will well bear the preter tense yet continued [ no law of christ hath or doth thus inslave her ] or the preter tense simply [ she by entring the bonds of marriage hath not thus inslaved her self ] that she should think her self bound to do any thing contrarie to her religion in order to continuing with her husband . as for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , joh. 3.18 . i wonder it could be thought fit to be produced to the prejudice of the preter sense , when the [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , already ] which is present , is an evident proof of the preter sense , and if it be continued as well as past ( he that hath been condemned remaining still under condemnation ) this is still perfectly agreeable to my notion of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the unbeliever oft hath been , and daily is converted , and brought to baptisme by the believer . and so much for all the grounds of his first exception , and his two answers to my inference from [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . ] sect. 3. the rendring 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by the woman ] defended , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 col. 1.23 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 act. 4. ireneus no latine author , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 act. 7. gal. 1.16 . 1 pet. 1.5 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 deut. 28. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , psal . 68. my proof of the interpretation from the context . the 2d concernes the rendring of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which i read , [ by the woman ] but he [ to the woman ] as [ to ] is a note of the dative case , and so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 redundant . and the reason , saith he , that he still adheres to his way , is , be because this seems to him the fairest , easiest , and most congruous sense thus to expound it , the believer may abide with the unbelieving yoke-fellow , for though he be an unbeliever , and in himself unsanctified , yet in or to his wife he is as if he were sanctified , it 's all one in respect of conjugal use , as if be were sanctified . to this reason i have many things to answer , 1. that the very rendring it , is the begging the question , which is onely this ( in this matter ) whether this be the fairest , easiest , and most congruous sense , and must not be here supposed , when it should be proved . 2dly . that if it were the fairest sense , yet if the words bear it not , it must not be affixt to them , if it be more capable of another ; and whether they will bear it or no , is the question again , on occasion of which this inquiry is made into the use of the preposition 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and to suppose again that it will signifie [ to ] in the dative sense , before it is proved it will , is a second begging the question , a paralogisme in stead of a reason . 3dly . the fairenesse of the sense ( simply taken ) is not attempted to be proved , which yet doth stand in great need of it ; for beside the redundance , or unusual sense of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , some other parts of the rendring are none of the fairest , as 1. the believer may abide ] as if it were simply free to abide or not abide , whereas in the present case ( when the unbeliever is willing to abide with the believer ) the believer is by the apostle counselled at least , if not commanded ( and that is more then a liberty , that he may ) to him the apostle saith ( and his sayings have sure authority with them ) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , let him not put away . nay the interdict of christ belonging to all , but that one case of fornication , mat. 5. and mat. 19. it is evident that by force thereof the believing man must not put away the unbeliever , that is guilty of no more but unbeliefe ; and accordingly the preface , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 — but for the rest ( or , for the other questions , v. 1.6.8.10 . ) say i , not the lord ] must be applied not to the immediate consequents , of the believers not putting away the unbeliever , that will stay with him ( for that had been determined by christ in the negative ) but to v. 15. if the unbelieving depart , i. e. if the unbeliever wlll not dwell with the believer , except the believer forsake his , or her religion , what shall be done then ? and to that the apostles counsel is , that mariage inslaves not the believer so far . all which is a competent prejudice to that part of mr. t. his sense , the believer may abide , for if that be it , even when the unbeliever is willing to abide , then she may also depart , if she rather choose , which will be found contrary to christ's precept , and so may not be admitted . 2dly . in this rendring , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is englished ( not by is or hath been sanctified , but ) by [ is as if he were sanctified ] which indeed acknowledgeth that he is not truely ( in any respect ) sanctified , and then sure this will be a strange construction , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the unbeliever ( is not sanctified but ) is as if he were sanctified , when yet literally it must be rendred the unbeliever hath been , or ( to gratifie mr. t. ) is or continues to be sanctified : for what is this but to interpret an affirmative by interposing a negation , he is sanctified , by he is not ? for so assuredly he is not , if he onely be as if he were . with this let any man compare the interpretation i have given , the unbeliever hath been sanctified by the believer , i. e. examples there are of such as have been thus converted from their unbeliefe , and this sense inforced by the interrogation , v. 16. for what knowest thou , ô woman , whether thou shalt save the man &c. and by s. peters aphorisme of daily observation , 1 pet. 3.1 . the husband that obeyes not the word , i. e. the unbeliever , may probably be gained by the conversation of the wife , and then let him impartially passe judgement , which is the fairest and easiest rendring . his 2d reason is , because though the dr. deny it , yet ( saith he ) i averre , that the notion of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for to , as a sign of the dative case , is found more then once in the new testament . the truth of this i must now examine by the proofs offered for the affirmation . and his first proofe , is from mat. 17.12 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , this , saith he , cannot be eluded , because the same speech is mar. 9.13 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and rendred by beza in the former place , fecerunt ei , they did to him , 2. whereas the doctor saith 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is used for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , upon him or against him , it had been meet the doctor should have given one instance at least of such construction , which , saith he , i do not believe he can do . to this i answer , 1. by two ready instances in one verse , lu. 23.31 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; if they do these things ( our ordinary english reades in a green tree , but the sense and propriety directs us to ) on the green tree , what shall be done on the dry ? here is the very phrase that is used in that place of matthew , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and then for s. markes using ( in the parallel place ) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] that proves not that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 was redundant in s. matthew , or that it was a bare sign of the dative case , it being free to s. marke to use any other expression , different from s. matthew , so he reteined the sense , as it is clear in this place he doth , doing injuries to him , being all one in effect with upon or against him , though the phrases are not the same , which no way inferres that when the change of the phrase changes the sense , it were lawfull so to varie it , as in the place we have in hand ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ) 't is on both sides supposed to do . a 2d instance which he conceives cannot be eluded , is col. 1.23 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which was preached to every creature , and this he proves to be the onely rendring ▪ 1. because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to preach , is commonly with a dative case of the object , and though , 1 tim. 3.16 . it is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , yet our translators , and the vulgar , and beza read it unto the gentiles , as if there it noted onely a dative case , and if it were among the gentiles , there , yet here col. 1.23 . it cannot be so , because the object is in the singular number , but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , when it is for among , is joyned still with a noun of the plural : and 2. that which , saith he , puts this out of all doubt , is , that the phrase col. 1. answers mar. 15.16 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . but to all this the answer is ready , by observing the exact notation of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the whole creation ( as we render it rom. 8.22 . ) as that signifies the whole , but especially the gentile world , and accordingly is exprest by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mat. 28. and farther explained by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the whole world , to which in s. mark they are appointed to go , when they were thus to preach the gospel 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , to this whole creation . now of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in this notion it is clear , that though it be in the singular number , yet that hath the power of the plural , as the word [ world ] and the like , which every body knowes , is a noun of multitude , and so is creation , when it is thus taken for the whole created world , meaning this world of men , the nations or people of the world . and then there can be no doubt but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] is most exactly thus to be rendred , preached in , or among the whole creation , as gal. 1.16 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , preach in the nations , or among the gentiles , and so 1 tim. 3.16 . also , though the sense being no way altered by rendring it unto the whole creation , or every creature , and to the gentiles , it matters little though it be promiscuously thus rendred in all these places , which yet must not prescribe for other places , where the sense is so much changed by the divers rendring , as in this case 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] is observable , where therefore the literal rendring being retained , we are not reasonably to conclude any more from it , then that literal rendring will afford us . as for the parallel phrase mar. 16. that doubtless can prove nothing , 1. because the places are not , nor can be thought parallel , 2. because if they were , ( as of mat. 28. and mar. 16. hath been granted ) yet the parallel lying onely in the sense , and that being all one , whether they preacht to or among the gentiles , this no way concludes that the phrases are the same , or the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in one redundant , which is the onely thing for the proving of which this parallel is produced , but of that i have formerly spoken . his third instance is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , act. 4.12 . which he cannot yet conceive , but that it is better rendred , to men , then among men . and his reasons are , 1. because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hath most regularly and consequently a dative case of the person after it . 2. because if it had been among men , it had been to be placed after 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , other , there is no other name among men , given , but being placed after given , it is to be expounded as referred to given , not to other , and so must be read , to men , not , among men . 3. it seems no good sense , nor true , that christ was a name given among men , for though he were among men , yet he was given from above . to all which he addes the judgement of irenaeus , l. 3. c. 12. cited by beza , and a parallel phrase 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , act. 7.44 . to these i answer , 1. that t is true that when 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hath any case of the person following and governed by it , that is constantly the dative , but that is no way applicable to this phrase 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , for there the persons , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 are governed by the preposition 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , not by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . to the 2d. that the construction by among , is very good , placing it after given , there is no other name given among men , i. e. no means of salvation afforded by god , and continued among men . to the 3d. that christ's being given from above , no way prejudges his being given among men , both because the benefit of this gift is as a common donative , distributed among men , and also because this gift is dispenst in forme of humane flesh , christ is become man , and to be found and seen among men . and to the last , for the place of irenaeus , t is strange that neither mr. t. nor beza whom he transcribed , should remember that irenaeus wrote greek , and that as the latine translation [ datum hominibus ] is not written by irenaeus , so there is no question but irenaeus's greek was the same with the text in the acts , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and then the translator ( barbarous enough through that whole book ) is to be reformed by the author , and not the author judged of by the translator ; or if he were , and irenaeus's greek did really read 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , without [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] as the translator doth [ hominibus ] without [ in ] then i must resolve , that the copie of the scripture , which he followed , did so read before him [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] and if so , then what proof can mr. t. have from thence that in other places or phrases , where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is found in all copies , it shall be redundant , and signifie no more , then if it were not to be found there ? as for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , it must certainly be rendred , among the fathers , thus , the tabernacle of witness was among our fathers in the wilderness : t is pity the reader should be exercised and detained with such debates as these , with which yet in obedience to mr. t. i must farther importune him . for a 4th instance he again resumes that of gal. 1.16 . and 2 pet. 1.5 . that gal. 1. where of god the apostle saith , that he was pleased to reveale his own sonne 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and when i had rendred that by , or through me , to others , this exposition , saith he , makes the apostle tautologize ineptly . this strange undecent expression i wish had been spared , for certainly there was little temptation for it : why , i pray , might not the apostle without incurring either part of that censure , say , god was pleased through me to reveal his sonne , and by way of explication , ( and withall to denote the designation of that apostle to his peculiar province , as the apostle of the uncircumcision ) adde , that i might preach the gospel to the gentiles . certainly every explication of an obscurer or narrower , by a clearer or larger phrase , is not inept tantologie , but that which all writers which have desired to speak intelligibly , have always been full of . and yet 2dly the latter part here ▪ of his preaching the gospell to the gentiles ( he being peculiarly the apostle of the gentiles , as peter and john were of the jewes wheresoever dispersed ) is more then was pretended to be said by my rendring and paraphrasing the former part of it ; for in that those others had not been defined , who they were , or limited to the gentiles . this mr t. adverted not in his objection , i desire he will now take notice of it . for that of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , i need adde no more to what i had before said , that it is most fully rendred thus , unto or over and above your faith superadde virtue , or fortitude . two places , he saith , he had formerly produced out of the old testament , deut. 28.60 . and 2 kin. 7.27 . and now addes one more , psal . 68.18 . but besides that three onely places in the whole old testament , would never inferre that so it must be in this place of the new , there being many more to preponderate for the contrary , and there being no pretense of necessity that thus it must be here , besides this , i say , it will be found , that these three will be of no availe to him . of the two former the 2d is not , there be but 20. vers . in that chapter , and therefore no 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the 27th : and for the former we well read it , unto thee , where the 72. reads 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , in the ordinary way of acception of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . and lastly , for his new sprung testimonie , psal . 68.18 . of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , for which saith he the apostle hath eph ▪ 4.8 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which he takes to be more then enough to refute the doctor , t is presently visible that it hath no manner of force in it ; for though those two places are perfectly parallel , as to the matter , yet for the expression t is evidently very different , in one [ thou hast received ] in the other [ he hath given ] and so [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for or among men ] must of all necessity differ from [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to men ] for how could it be sense to fay , thou hast received gifts to men ? yet so it must be , to make good mr. t. his observation , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies to , or is redundant , or the note of a dative case . and so he never had a more improper season for his triumphs ; never lesse cause to tell others of taking ad randum , when he himself was so far removed from all appearance of demonstration . and so much for the grammatical notation of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , very unfit to have exercised us thus long , but that mr. t. would have it so , and words are the meanes of conveighing realities unto us , and mistakes in them ( though minute ) may be of substantiall importance . my 3d proof produced for my interpretation of the first part of v. 14. which to me put it out of all doubt , by comparing it with the reason subjoyned , for what knowest thou , ô wife , whether thou shalt save thy husband ; or how knowest thou , ô man , whether thou shalt save thy wife ? ] he comes next to examine , and hath many exceptions against it , all which ( without losing time in repeating and viewing them severally ) will be soon dispelled by a right understanding of the force of the apostles argument as there i conceive it to ly , thus v. 14. it is matter of ordinary observation , that unbelieving husbands have been brought to the faith and baptisme by the believing wife , therefore i now exhort and counsel the believer not to depart from the unbeliever , in case the unbeliever be willing to stay , v. 13. for this reason , v. 16. because what hath been so oft , may very probably be hoped again , and consequently upon the premises the believer hath ground to hope , that she may in time gain the husband to the faith , and that , being so fair a reward in her view ( the saving or rescuing him from infidelitie , to christ ) may well inforce the counsel of the apostle , not to depart from him , as long as , without sin , she is permitted to stay . by which it appeares that this v. 16. is not a bare explanation of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 v. 14. ( on which mr. t. his exceptions principally depend ) but an application of the argument formerly proposed , but now more signally brought home to them , under the forme of [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for what — ] by this means to reinforce his conclusion of their not departing for the cause of infidelitie : if the reader will but observe what is thus visible , he will want no more help , to get out of the intricacies , and toiles , which mr. t : hath here spred for him in this matter , which is in it self so manifest , as nothing can be added to it , if either the text or my paraphrase may be permitted to speak for it self . sect. 4. mr. t. his mistake of my sense . the argument à genere ad speciem . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . how the husband is said to be baptized by the wife . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 partial washings . the proportion betwixt legal holyness , and baptisme . difference between relative and real sanctification . the testimonies of the antient , for and against my interpretation . his exceptions to the former part of my paraphrase being now ended , i must attend what he hath to say against the latter part of it , that which concernes our matter in hand more neerly ; the words are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , for else were your children unclean , but now are they holy , i. e. upon that score it is that christians children are admitted to baptisme , viz. because by their living in the familie with the christian parent they probably will ( and ought to ) be brought up in the faith — and the church ( requiring and receiving promise from the parents ) reasonably presumes they will , and so admits them to baptisme . this argument of the apostles thus explained in my paraphrase ( or if he yet will have it more plainly thus , the church upon confidence that the believers children will be brought up in the faith , receives them to baptisme when they are infants ; and upon the same grounds of hope , that your abiding with the unbelieving husband may in time convert him ( as by experience it hath oft been found ) i advise you not to depart from him , if he will live with you ; for what knowest thou whether thou shalt save thy husband , &c. ) mr. t. hath made a shift not to understand , and substituted another way of arguing in my name , in stead of it , p. 331. and having done so i must leave him to combate with the shadow of his own creating , no part of his impression lighting upon that , which alone i professe to be my meaning in it ; which i leave him or the reader to see , in the particulars proposed by him , but must not now be so impertinent , as to lose time in the pursuit of them . but the reasons produced for my thus interpreting , he next proceeds to examine , and i must take care to vindicate them . my first reason is , because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , holy , noting a relative holynesse , a setting apart to god , and the lowest degree of that imaginable being the initiating into the church by baptisme , this must in reason be here noted by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 holy , as all visible professors , ezr. 9.2 . are the holy seed , and in the epistles of the apostles , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 holy . to this he answers , that it being all granted , confirmes not the doctors exposition , because t is no good argument à genere ad speciem affirmativè , and because infants are not visible professors . but sure when the species is such , that he that hath not that , hath not any part of the genus , the argument will thus hold very irrefragably : suppose that of the deacon to be the lowest order of officers of the church , and that without which there is no ascending to any higher degree in the ministerie , will not then the argument hold ; he hath some degree ecclesiastical upon him , therefore sure he is a deacon ? thus sure it is in this matter , the relative holyness belongs to no person , that is not baptized , baptisme is the lowest degree of it , and all superior degrees of apostle , prophet , &c. in the christian church are founded in that , therefore if the infant children be holy , the infant children are baptized . so again , baptisme is the lowest degree of visible profession , therefore if these that are said to be holy , are visible professors , then sure they are baptized ; and so there is no force in that whether answer or exception to my first reason . my 2d followes from the notation of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , act. 10.14 . for those that must not be received into the church , as on the other side god's cleansing is god's reputing him fit to be partaker of this priviledge , whereby it appears how fitly , receiving and not receiving to baptisme ] are exprest by [ holy and unclean . ] to this he answers by acknowledging the conclusion , viz. the fitnesse of the expression , all his exception is against my pr●misse , the notion of unclean , act. 10. which , saith he , signifies there not onely one out of the church , but also one that a jew might not go in to , or eate with . to this i reply , that my conclusion being granted , i may safely part with that , which inferred it , as when i am arrived at my journeys end , i have no farther need , or use of my horse or guide that brought me thither : let it be remembred , that [ holy and unclean ] fitly expresse those that are received , or not received to baptisme , and then i am sure i have not offended against the propriety of the words , by concluding from this text , that in the apostles time the believers children were received to baptisme ; and if i have as little offended against the rational importance of the words in that place ( as i hope hath formerly appeared that i have ) then i hope i am perfectly innocent in inducing my conclusion . as for the use of the phrase act. 10. though now i need not contend , yet i may adde , that the notion of not entring to , and eating with , containing under it this other of not baptizing ( for sure he might not baptize those to whom he might not enter ) and the baptizing cornelius ( and not onely entring to him ) being the end for which peter received that vision , i still adhere that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in that places signifies one peculiarly that must not be received into the church by baptisme ; and the holyness , on the contrary , reception to that priviledge . my 3d reason being taken from the use of the hebrew 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to sanctifie , for washing any part of the body , and on occasion of that , mentioning a conjecture that the use of holyness for baptisme might perhaps intimate that the primitive baptisme were not always immersions , but that sprinkling of some part might be sufficient ; he hath a reply to each of these ; to the former , that if this reason were good , then the husbands being sanctified by the wife , must signifie his being baptized or washed by her ; to the latter , that i have in my writings so oft acknowledged the baptisme of the jewes and christians to be immersion of the whole body , that i ought to be ashamed to say the contrary , and that i can hardly believe my self in it . to these i answer , first to the former , 1. that i that affirme sanctifications among the jewes to signifie washings , do also know that it hath other significations , and that that signification is in each text to be chosen , which seems most agreeable in all those respects which are to be considerable in the pitching on any interpretation ; consequently that the wive's baptizing the husband being a thing absurd , and utterly unheard of in the church of god , whether in the apostles or succeeding ages , this sense may not reasonably be affixt to it , whereas the baptizing of infants by the antients affirmed to be received from the apostles , it is most reasonable to understand the words of this , though not of the other ( and so to apply the observation ( as it is visible i did ) to the latter , not former part of that verse . and yet 2. if we shall distinguish of the notion of [ by ] and expound [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by the woman ] of the perswasion , that the woman hath used to bring her husband to baptisme , and not of her mysterie in baptizing , we may very conveniently so interpret the former part of the verse also , that by the woman , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the unbelieving husband hath been brought to baptisme , viz. by being brought to faith , to which this priviledge belongs . as for his 2d exceptions to my conjecture , founded in the use of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sanctifications for partial not total washings , 1. i answer , that i mention it only as a conjecture , with a perhaps , and lay no more weight upon it : 2. that for christian baptisme i no where affirme that it was onely by immersion , nor on the other side that it was always by sprinkling , but disjunctively , either by one or the other ( as by the words cited by him from prac : cat : l. 6. sect. 2. is clear ) supposing indeed that christ's appointment was not terminated to either , and so satisfied by either . my last reason is taken from the effect of the legal uncleannesse , contrary to those their sanctifications , viz. removing men from the congregation ; agreeable to which it is that those should be called holy , who in the account of god , stood so , that they might be received into the church ; to this he answers , that it is said without proof that the uncleanness excluding from , and sanctification restoring to the tabernacle are proportionable to the notion here given of the children being excluded or included in the church , asking , why cornelius should be counted out of the church , being a devout man. but to this i reply , that that which is so manifest needed no farther proof , for what two things can be more proportionable , or answerable the one to the other , then the jewes calling those unclean , and holy , who were excluded from , and restored to the tabernacle , and the christians calling them unclean , and holy , that were excluded from , and received into the church , the exclusion and reception being the same on both sides , as also the uncleanness and holyness , and the proportion lying only betwixt the jewish tabernacle and the christian church , which surely are very fit parallels as could have been thought on . as for his question of cornelius , it is most vain , the whole discourse being not of real but relative sanctification , and the difference most visible betwixt that sanctity which was truely in him in respect of his devotion , fearing , praying &c. and that outward priviledge of admission into the congregation of the jewes , which alone was the thing which in the account of god , or sober men was denyed cornelius . these be pitifull sophismes , and in no reason farther to be insisted on , and therefore it was but necessary that to amuse the reader , he should here adde by way of close that augustine aid disclaim this interpretation , hierome and ambrose gave another , and so did tertullian de anima , c. 39. the three former of these we must , it seems , take upon his word , for he cites not the places where they give that other interpretation , nor pretends he that they gave that to which he adheres : but for tertullian the most antient of these , by the place here cited , i am assured what credit is due to his citations , having set down the words at large from that c. 39. de animâ and found it perfectly to accord to my interpretation . the like hath appeared of s. hierome in part ( for the former and more difficult part of the verse ) the man hath been sanctified , exemplum refert , saith he , quia saepe contigerit , just according to my paraphrase of the place . for s. augustine also , l. 2. de pecc . mer. & remiss . c. 26. ( which i suppose the place he means ) i have already accounted . and for the annotations on the epistles , which go under s. ambrose's name , as i have not commoditie to examine them , so they are known and universally acknowledged to be none of s. ambrose's writings ; and then it is competently evident how little he hath gained by this unseasonable appeal to testimonies . the designe , i suppose , was to prevent the force of my allegations , for in that place as an appendix to the use of the word , holy , among the jewes , i had added the acception of it among the antient christian writers , s. cyprian , ep. 59. eum qui natus est baptizandum , & sanctificandm , and the two places out of gregory nazianzen , of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , being sanctified when they are not ( through want of years ) sensible of it , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , sanctified from infancy . and before he chooses to take notice of these , he brings forth his names of fathers too ; with what success , we have seen , and shall not need farther to consider . at length he descends to take notice of my testimonies , and to them he hath two answers , 1. that for the antients of the third or fourth century , especially for the latine doctors , he thinks the doctor knows them better then to assert that they knew certainly the sacred dialect , adding that few of them had skill in hebrew or greek . 2. that if those fathers knew the sacred dialect , then not holy but sanctified , must be as much as baptized , and then the sense is , that the unbeleeving husband is baptized by the wife . this latter answer was even now satisfied to the full , to the former then i reply , 1. that of the two antients cited by me , the former was crowned a martyr within 160 yeers after the apostles age , and the latter flourished about 110 yeers after him , and so that in respect of their time they are no way incompetent to testify what was the sacred language , the writers whereof were so lately gone out of the world . 2dly . that one of these being a greek doctor , and he agreeing exactly with the other ( and more of the same kind i have now produced in this rejoynder ) there can here be no pretense for mr. t. either to prejudice the latine doctors skill in this matter , or to say they had no skill in greek . 3dly . that the notion that they had of the word , being the very same , that the hebrews were so lately shown to have had of it , there was as little colour , or temptation from the matter in hand , to except against their skill in hebrew . 4thly . that either of these antient doctors knew as much ( the one much more ) of greek as any of the four whom just now mr. t. had vouched for the interpreting of the place ; and for the hebrew s. hierome , who alone was better skilled in that , concurred with me in the main part ( and basis ) of my interpretation . lastly , the text to the corinthians beeing in greeke , certainly gregory nazianzen was as great a master in that language , as any that can be pretended fit to be confronted against him , and with that concurrence , which i have shewed he had of origen , and others , both greek and latine , may be thought worthy to be heeded by mr. t. for a matter of no greater weight then his , the interpretation of word , especially when mr. t. himself hath so lately joyned his suffrage in these plain words , i deny not the fitness of the expressing [ receiving to baptisme ] by the terme [ holy . ] and so much for those exceptions against the latter part of my paraphrase of that verse , and my reasons for it . chap. iv. an answer to mr. tombes's view of my conclusion and therein the sense of antiquity in this question . sect. 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , 1 cor. 7. infant children . the jewes practice . their notion of [ holy ] baptisme a priviledge of believers children , yet is communicated to others whose guardians are believers . the several sorts of holyness all vainly mentioned by mr. t. his denyals of the conclusion . the place in tertullian vindicated . s. hieromes answer to paulinus . institutionis disciplina in tertullian . candidati damoniorum . a 3d denyal of the conclusion . the use of baptisme to regenerate &c. no prejudice to the founding it in the jewish practice . his art of diversion to put off answering of testimonies . the way of testimonies insisted on . after this examination of my paraphrase of this text to the corinthians , he proceeds to the conclusion which i deduce from thence , which is no other then my premisses , viz. my confirmation of that interpretation , had regularly inferred , that the infants of christian parents were by the apostles received to baptisme . but to this he will object also , not onely by referring to his former performances in validating the premisses ( to which i shall not need to now advert , having refuted his answers , as they were produced ) but by denying the consequence in case my interpretation were granted , and that upon these accounts , 1. because it is not clear that [ your children ] are [ your infants ] the corinthians having ( for ought yet hath been shewed ) other children besides infants , and the jewes baptizing proselytes , children females under 12. and males under 13. years old , not according to their will , but of the father or court. 2. because if the apostle should by [ holy ] mean a priviledge whereupon they were baptized he should conceive otherwise then the jewes did , who conceived all unclean whom they baptized , till by baptisme they cleansed them , and made them holy . 3. because there is no priviledge attributed by the apostle to the christians infants , which would not belong to the infants of heathen , or if there were yet it might not be baptisme . to the first of these i have incidentally answered already , by making it evident , not that the corinthians had no other children beside infants ( i have no want of such ridiculous evasions ) but that the children which are there spoken of were infant children , as appeared both by the express words of tertullian , and the author of answers ad antiochum , and the agreeableness of nazianzen's expressions , by the general doctrine of the fathers in this matter , and by the inconveniences which were consequent to the interpreting it of any other but infant children , meaning by them such as are either strictly infants , new born , or such as are proportionable to these , having not arrived to maturity of understanding , and capacity of professing personally for themselves . for this i must refer the reader to that place and for the practice of the jewes , which i acknowledge to be as is here suggested , not to baptize any proselytes children by their own wills or professions , till they be , the female at the full age of 12. the male of 13. years , sure it makes nothing against me , for they that thus baptized the proselytes children , all under that age , by the profession of others , did also baptize their infant children in the same manner , and all that i pretend from that place is , that the believers infants were admitted to baptisme , if infants they were , not doubting but if they were of greater years they were baptized also , if before they were fit to profess for themselves , then by their parents or the churches , but if fit to answer for themselves , then by their own profession . to the 2d i say , that by [ holy ] the apostle means the priviledge of admission to baptisme , because in baptisme they were received into the church , and so made relatively holy ; and the very same was the jewes notion of holyness , when they called baptismes , sanctifications , and conceived those that were unclean to be made holy by that means , this holyness is the terme of the motion in both their usages of the word . to the 3d , 1. i suppose it evident by my interpretation , that the holyness which belonged to the believers children was a priviledge , and that not common to the unbelievers children , unless they were by the charity of the church or some member thereof ( having power , and assuming to make use of that power , to bring them up in the knowledge of their baptismal vow ) brought to baptisme , and then those supplied the place of the parents , and the children equally received the same benefit by that charity , as if their own parents had done it for them ; and there being no reason here offered to the contrarie , but a reference to another place , which i have not commodity to consult or examine , there is nothing that exacts any farther reply from me . the same will satisfie the latter part of this last suggestion , for to prove that if there were a priviledge , yet it might not be baptisme , he produceth this reason , that baptisme according to the fathers opinion and practice belonged to unbelievers children also , if they were brought : which being willingly granted , & so the matter cleared , that the children of believers were to be admitted to baptisme , when the very unbelievers children , if brought & assumed for by others , which were not their parents were to be admitted , it certainly followes not from thence , that the believers children were not admitted , or that their admission was not a priviledge of believers children , for so still it was , though by parity of reason , and by the charity of the church it was communicated to some others : viz. those that were brought by friends or guardians , though not by parents , for so still this priviledge belonged not to those unbelievers children , who lived in their parents power , & were not thus undertaken for by believers . the short is , baptisme was a priviledge of the believers infants undertaken for by their parents , and by analogie communicated to those who were undertaken for by others , whose charitie and pietie supplyed the place of believing parents , but was not communicated simply or indifferently to all children of unbelievers , and herein the priviledge consisted . as for the other imagined priviledge , which he names , belonging to infants , if it be that of real , actual , inward holyness , i discern not mr. t. hath any kindnesse to it , ( nor can he without destroying his own hypotheses ) and therefore it matters not what others imagine ; if it be federal external holynesse , that i suppose to be the same with baptismal holynesse , baptisme being the entrance into that covenant , and for holynesse in hope and expectation , 1. that cannot denote actually holy ( as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 here notes ) unlesse by holy we mean in the relative sense , consecration or designation to holynesse , and then it is all one with baptisme again , the solemnity of that consecration . before he leaves the survey of my conclusion , he will again resume what he had said without all degree of truth in the beginning , and yet doth it with great incitation , first , saith he , it is false that christ founded his institution in the jewish practice . but this i suppose in mr. t. to be no other then a mentiris bellarmine , or that most inartificiall thing , the denying a conclusion which had been inferred by competent premisses . and for the reason added to his negation , that it would utterly overthrow all baptisme after the first conversion of progenitors , that hath been largely answered here , and grounds laid for it in the resolution of the quare , by the jewish practice of baptizing the children of natives , as well as of proselytes , and so of those that are born never so many ages after the first conversion . and i must not again so often repeat the same thing . in the same causelesse fit of incitation , he farther goes on , 2dly . saith he , it is false that there is any evidence in the apostles words , 1. cor. 7.14 . of such a custome of baptizing christians and their children . but that i humbly conceive , is the denying my conclusion again , having all this while laboured to clear this evidence in the tract , and here vindicated it from all objections , which seemed to have the least force in them : and whereas he here addes no other reason to his negation , but his own not thinking that ever any of the fathers did interpret the apostles words as this doctor doth , adding that tertullians words de anima , c. 39. are not an exact parallel to the apostles speech ( which i must suppose i have now shewed it is ) that ambrose and hierome interpret them of legitimation in birth , augustine what way soever , not to baptisme ( of each of which i have spoken already also ) all that i shall need adde , is onely this . 1. that still if this argument were exactly true , yet it is but a negative argument à testimonio , which never was availeable in any dispute : 2. that if the fathers do not fully interpret this place as i now do , yet i have brought some suffrages and other competent grounds out of the fathers for my way of interpreting it : 3. that what he hath said for the invalidating the testimonie out of tertullian , hath certainly no force in it , as shall now briefely appear by this view of what he saith . it is this , 1. that the termes candidati sanctitatis , or designati sanctitatis , or candidati fidei in hieroms epis . 153. to pauliniu , do note not that they were baptized , but that they were in designation of being believers and baptized , intended to be holy by the parents , to be bred up to the faith and so baptized . 2. that what the doctor talkes of tertullian as saying they were holy , i. e. baptized , ex seminis praerogativâ , it is a manifest mistake , for 1. the holynesse he ascribes to believers children was not onely by prerogative of birth but also ex institutionis disciplinâ by the discipline of their instruction which is afore baptisme . 2. the prerogative of birth the very words of tertullian shew to be no more but this , that believers children were born without those idolatrous superstitions which were used in the birth of infidels children , which he there principally recites . to this i answer by degrees , 1. by viewing the place in s. hierom , to which he referres me for the explication of the phrase , candidati or designati sanctitatis . that epistle to paulinus is hastily written in answer to two questions of paulinus his proposing . to the later , being this , quomodo sancti sint qui de fidelibus , i. e. baptizatis nascantur ( which plainly referres the matter to these words of the apostles , how the children born of believing parents are holy ] he gives a very short solution , being taken off by the hast of the post and the multitude of other letters , he had to write . all that he is permitted to say is this . de secundo problemate tuo tertullianus in libris de monogamiâ disseruit , asserens sanctos dici fidelium filios quòd quasi candidati sint fidei , & nullis idololatriae sordibus polluantur . simúlque considera quòd & vasa sacra in tabernaculo legimus , & caetera quae ad ritum ceremoniarum pertinent , cum utique sancta esse non possint nisi ea quae sentiunt & venerantur deum . idioma igitur scripturarum est ut interdum sanctos pro mundis & purificatis & expiatis nominent , sicut & betsabee sanctificata dicitur ab immunditia sua , & ipsum templum sanctuarium nominatur . of your second probleme tertullian hath discoursed in his books de monogamia , affirming the children of believers to be called holy , because they were as it were candidates of faith , and not polluted with any of the filth of idolatrie . withall consider that also we read that the vessels in the tabernacle are holy , and the other things which belong to the rite of ceremonies , when yet nothing can ( really ) be holy but what have sense , and worship god. it is therefore an idiome of the scriptures to use the word holy for those that are clean , and purified and expiated , as bathseba is said to be sanctified from her uncleannesse and the temple is called the sanctuary . and so he is abruptly broken off , meaning to have said much more on that subject , this , as he solemnly protests ( testis est mihi conscientiae meae deus ) being but the procinctus & exordium , the preparation and beginning of his interpretation . if he had gone on to have perfected his answer to paulinus's quaere , he would probably have more perfectly cleared the whole difficulty . as it is , here is nothing in the least wise to our prejudice , nor to the proving that which mr. t. undertakes , that tertullians words de anima do not affirme the baptizing of the believers children . for 1. this of tertullian is not the place that s. hierome referres to , but some other in his bookes de monog . that one book which we now have under that title affording us no such discourse on that subject , as s. hierom mentions . 2dly . all that s. hierom cites out of that ( not this ) place of tertullian , is very reconcileable with what tertullian saith in this place , and with his opinion that the infants of christians were baptized , for , saith he , they were quasi candidati fidei , as it were candidates of faith , candidates were they that stood for any office qui candida sumptâ veste consulatum ▪ praeturam &c. postulabant , who putting on white garments sued for any office , and so candidates of faith , they that sue , for this condition in the church of god , that of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 believers , to which by baptisme they are assumed , and accordingly were to be brought to the font , like such candidates , in white garments as they that were to be sanctified , i. e. baptized , among the jewes , exod. 16.10 . were also to wash their clothes or put on clean garments . again when he saith of them that they were holy as the vessels of the temple were holy , though they had no sense , this is the clear laying of a ground , whereby children may be deemed capable of this relative holynesse , which is to be had by baptisme , though as yet they are not capable ( for want of understanding ) of inherent holynesse . lastly , when he mentions it as an idiome of scripture to call them holy , who are cleansed , purified , expiated , speaking of those legal lustrations or purifications , this gives an account of s. pauls using the word in the christian church for the christian lustration , purification , expiation , i. e. for baptisme . and by the way , it appears by s. hierome that he useth promiscuously sancti and sanctificati , and so that gives us authority to interpret [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] in the end of the verse , in the same sense in which [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] is used in the beginning , for those that are brought and received to baptisme . all which are farre enough fom serving any of mr. t. his interests , and might have inclined him to have omitted that testimonie of s. hieromes , if he had more maturely considered of it . nay 3. i must adde , that mr. t. his rendring of candidati and designati sanctitatis , and candidati fidei , by being in designation of being believers and baptized , intended to be holy by the parents , to be bred up to the faith and so baptized , is a most groundlesse inconvenient interpretation : for if by holynesse and faith be meant inherent holynesse and faith , then baptisme it self is the ceremony of consecrating and designing them to this , and so precedent to that holynesse ( not subsequent to it , as mr. t. sets it ) and accordingly in the church writings the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 believers , is never bestowed on any , though of mature age and knowledge , till after they be baptized , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 illuminate and believers being all one , promiscuously used for those that have received baptisme , in opposition to catechumeni , those that have not yet attained it : but if holynesse and faith be the relative holynesse , then infants being as capable of that as vessels in the temple , they might be presently designed and consecrated to that , and not first bred up in the faith , before they were partakers of it . the children of believers , i willingly grant , are presumed to be by them intended to be bred up to the faith , but it that intention of theirs bring forth no present effect , if they do not bring them thus early , and enter them into the church by baptisme , why should that bare intention of the parents give them the style of holy or sanctified , or how should these infant children , which may dy before they come to those years , receive any present priviledge or benefit , by that which is thus farre removed from them ? now for the 2d part of this suggestion , that what i say from tertullian , that they were holy , i. e. baptized in seminis praerogativâ , is a mistake , i must answer by viewing of the proofs of his assertion , first , saith he , the holynesse was not onely by prerogative of birth , but ex institutionis disciplinâ . this sure is a strange proof , it is not so , because it is not onely so , t is certain that tertullian saith they are holy ex institutionis disciplina , and as certain that they are as much so by prerogative of their birth , the words are most clear , tam ex seminis praerogativâ quàm ex institutionis disciplina , and i that never denyed the second , could not be mistaken in affirming the first . some difficulty i suppose there may be , what tertullian ( who did not excell in perspicuity of expressions ) meant by institutionis disciplina . my opinion ( gathered from the observation of his language in other places ) is , that he meant the doctrine of baptisme instituted by christ in his church ; for by this it is that baptisme was allowed to those that were ex alterutro sexu sanctificato procreati , born of parents of which either of them was christian . thus in his book de bapt. c. 12. he uses a like phrase tingi disciplinâ religionis , to be sprinkled with the discipline of religion , meaning evidently being baptized . by this interpretation of that phrase , the whole place will be most clear , in reference to the antecedents , thus , the birth of all men by nature brings impurity into the world with them ; the children of heathens have this mightily inhansed to them by the superstitions that are used before and at , and soon after their birth , inviting the devil to come and take possession of them ( who is himself very ready to catch them ) and so making them as soon as born , candidatos daemoniorum , candidates of the devils , ambitious to be admitted thus early into their service ; thus every one hath his genius , i. e. his devill assigned him from his birth , and so no birth of any heathen can choose but be polluted , hinc enim apostolus — for from hence , saith he , it is that the apostle affirmes that whosoever is born from either parent christian , is holy both by prerogative of seed , and by discipline of institution , i. e. hath one priviledge by nature , by his very seed ( by being born of a christian , not an heathen ) that he is not so polluted by their idolatrous ceremonies , and so is in some degree holy , in that respect , not so polluted as heathen children are ; another priviledge he hath by the orders and rites , which christ instituted and left in his church , viz. that of reception to baptisme , whereby he is consecrated to god , whereas heathen children are desecrated to devils , and in that respect also they are called holy by the apostle , citing that place , 1 cor. 7. caeterum , inquit , immundi nascerentur , else were your children unclean , but now are they holy , adding that the apostle in those words means , that the children of believers are designati sanctitatis , that sure must signifie that they are initiated into christ by the christian rite or sign or ceremonie of baptisme , as those which had the heathenish ceremonies used upon them , were candidati daemoniorum , candidates of the devils , in the former , thus early admitted and initiated into their sacra . how farre now this is from intimating any discipline of their instruction ( the word their is clearly inserted by mr. t. and institutio rendred instruction , and so christs institution turn'd into their instruction ) i shall not now need farther to declare , nor to adde ought concerning his other reason taken from the idolatrous superstitions , without which they that are born are said to be holy , for how farre that hath here place , i have already manifested also . in this fit of incitation he yet farther proceeds , 3. saith he , it is false that the jewish practice in baptizing proselytes and their children , laid the foundation of infant baptisme : but as this is like the former , a meer denying of my conclusion , and so against all rules of discourse , in the first place , so is it not attempted to be proved , save onely by the negative argument à testimonio , neither the scripture , saith he , gives any hint thereof , nor any of the antient christian writers , no nor any of those the doctor cites , ever derives it from the jewish practice . but certainly this is of no force ; for 1. so long as none of all these deny it , to be so derived , and when the matter it self speaks it and the agreement between what we find in the christian church with what we find among the jewes , there is no want either of truth or sobriety in my assertion , that christs institution of baptisme was founded in the jewish practice of baptizing their natives and their proselytes , and that their custome being to baptize infant children , christs institution also being by the apostles understood to belong to the infant childrens baptisme was in that respect also conformable to the jewish copy , and so still the jewish practice the foundation of the christian . what he addes from several antient testimonies , shortly pointed at , that they shew that the fathers took the baptisme of infants not to have foundation in the jewish practice , but in the conceit they had that baptisme did regenerate , give grace and save , and was necessary for them to enter into the kingdome — hath nothing of weight in it , for 1. their conceiting that baptisme had this force from christs institution , no way prejudges christs founding his institution in the foregoing jewish practice . t is as if he should thus argue , the fathers conceived the sacrament of the lords supper to be usefull for the confirming of our faith , therefore they took that sacrament not to be sounded in the postcoenium of the jewes . they conceived imposition of hands to conferre a character on those that were thus ordained to holy orders , therefore this was not founded in the jewish custome of receiving doctors into the sanhedrim by laying on of hands . the foundation of the institution is one thing , and the benefits of it being instituted is another , and yet both these are found to belong to the same thing . 2dly . their very opinion that baptisme did regenerate , and was necessary to enter into the kingdome , as it is taken by the fathers from the words of christ to nicodemus joh. 3. except a man be born again , v. 3. and that of water — v. 5. ( by baptisme ) he cannot enter into the kingdome of god , so was that speech of christ , taken from the customary doctrine of the jewes , among whom baptisme was said to regenerate , and to enter into the church , as that was the portal to the kingdome of god , and accordingly when nicodemus seems not to understand it , christ appeals to the jewish doctrine or tradition , art thou a ruler , a master in israel and knowest not these things ? and therefore again those perswasions of the fathers are far from unreconcileable with that which i have affirmed of the founding the christian in the jewish baptisme . nay 4. that the fathers in their discourses of baptisme do ordinarily lay the foundation of it in moses or the baptisme of the jewes ( and so might as well found the baptisme of christian infants there , the jewes baptisme , as hath appeared , belonging to such ) hath formerly been evidenced from gregorie nazianzen , orat. 39. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 — and so from others also . what he now addes of womens baptizing among papists and the allowance thereof formerly among us , of private baptisme , of the use of propounding questions to the infant which he is pleased to style ridiculous , of the sureties answering in the childs behalf , and expressing their desire to be baptized into the faith recited , of the custome of baptizing onely at easter and whitsontide , of sprinkling or powring water on the face , of a confession in the pract. cat. that all men were instructed antiently before they were baptized , is all amast together , if it might be , to make up one accumulative argument , but is utterly insufficient to do so . all that he concludes from the mention of all these , is but his own resolution not to answer the testimonies which i had alledged from the fathers , to prove that infant baptisme was an apostolical tradition . his words are these , upon the mentioning of those particulars ▪ [ and therefore for the present i shall put by the answering of the stale and rotten allegations out of the fathers for infant baptisme brought by the doctor , because having said so much . here indeed by his [ therefore ] i am told the reason why he was willing to mention those other particulars so causelesly and unseasonably , viz. by way of diversion ( as dextrous persons are wont to do for the removing of difficulties ) to put by the answering of the allegations out of the fathers . but i must not thus farre complie with mr. t. the main issue of the whole dispute must divolve to this , the doctrine of the antient church in this matter , for. 1. baptisme being instituted by christ long before his crucifixion , and 2. the forme wherein he instituted it being not set down in the gospels , and so 3. the apostles practice being our onely guide for the resolving such difficulties as these , whether infants were admittable or no to baptisme ( the foundation thereof among the jewes visibly belonging to infants , but it being still possible that this might be changed in christs institution ) it is not now imaginable what way should be open to us of this age ( 1600 years after those times ) to discern christs institution in this matter , but by the words or actions of ( or some kind of intimation from ) the apostles , how they understood christs institution . of this one place we have 1 cor. 7. which comes in incidentally , speaking to another matter , and notifies the apostles sense by their practice visibly enough , and defines for the baptizing of infants in those dayes ; but to them that will not acknowledge this sense of those words , how fair and easy soever , there is but one possible method remaining in this , as in all other questions of fact ( as evidently this is , whether in the apostles times and by their appointment children were received to baptisme or no ) viz. to appeal to those that could not be ignorant of this matter , who by succession and tradition , the one from the other , had the apostles practice , the interpreter of their sense of christs institution , conveyed and handed down unto them , and are to us , their late posterity , the only competent witnesses of this matter of fact , and so are in all reason to decide the controversie , and give a final conclusion to the debate between us . this therefore being the last part of my method in the positive part of the resolution of that quaere , i professe to have laid the most weight upon it ( according to the grounds set down in the first quare concerning the deciding of such controversies ) and consequently must still insist upon it , and not be put off by mr. t. his dexteritie , and that in this matter i may not fail of giving the reader some evidence , i shall again resume it , and give him a competent series of testimonies , some formerly mentioned , and now put more into forme of evidence , and others added to them , so as to inferre an uniforme concordant tradition of all the ages of the church of christ even since the apostles times unto this day , for the receiving infants to baptisme ; and that shall be the last part of this replie to mr. t. and the antipadobaptist whose pretensions are the contrary , that infants must not be thus admitted . sect. 2. a catalogue of testimonies of the first ages for infant baptisme , and the apostolicalness thereof . first then i begin with the words of the apostle so long insisted on , and vindicated from mr. t. his exceptions , and by so antient a writer as tertullian &c. applyed to this matter . and that first epistle to the corinthians being written at the end of his three years stay in asia act. 20.31 . i. e. an. chr. 54. i shall there place my first testimonie . in the middle of the first centurie s. paul delivered these words , now are your children holy , i. e. your children new-born ( as appears by the context and tertullian ) are sanctified , as that signifies baptized , in the style of the new testament and the antient church , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 they are vouchsafed the good things that come by baptisme , saith the author of the respons : ad orthod : whether that were justine the martyr , who suffered anno 163. or another very antient writer under that name ; and this of that apostle is an evidence of the practice of the first , or apostolical age , soon after christ , and is not contradicted by any that wrote in that age . in the next age after the apostles flourished s. irenaeus , said to be martyred at lyons ( the seate of his bishoprick ) the 5 t of severus , an. chr. 197. he had been an auditor of polycarpe bishop of smyrna ( styled by that church an * apostolical and prophetical doctor ) and is by * s. hierome lookt on as a man of the apostolical times , and by * tertullian as a most accurate searcher of all doctrines , and so is a most competent witnesse of the apostolical doctrine and practice ; and thus he speaks l. 2. advers . har . c. 38. omnes venit christus per semet ipsum salvare , omnes inquam qui per eum renascuntur in deum , infantes , & parvulos , & pueros , & juvenes , & seniores ▪ christ came to save all by himself , all i say who are born again unto god by him , infants and little ones , and children , and young men and older men , where it is evidently his affirmation , that infants ( expressely ) are by christ regenerate unto god , and that must be in baptisme , that laver of regeneration , and so they are not , in his opinion , excluded from baptisme . and so this is a testimonie of the second century , not found or praetended to be contradicted by any other of that age . immediately after irenaeus followed tertullian in the end of the 2d , and beginning of the 3d century , a man of great learning , and a diligent observer and recorder of the customes and practices of the most antient church . and he lib. de animâ c. 39. affirmes it from the apostle , ex sanctificato alterutro sexu sanctos procreari , that when either parent is sanctified or believer , i. e. baptized , the children that are born from them are holy , and this tam ex seminis praerogativâ , quàm ex institutionis disciplinâ , both by praerogative of their seed , and by the discipline of the institution , i. e. ( as hath been shewed ) by baptisme , adding from the same apostle that delivered those words , 1 cor. 7.4 . that his meaning was that the children of believers should be understood to be designati sanctitatis ac per hoc salutis , and evidencing what he means thereby , by the following words , of christ's definition , joh. 3. vnlesse a man be born of water and of the spirit , he shall not enter into the kingdome of god , i. e. non erit sanctus , shall not be holy , where baptisme is manifestly the thing by which these children are said to attain that sanctity ; and more he addes in the beginning of the next chapter to the same purpose . and so he is a competent witnesse for the beginning of that third age , and is not found contradicted by any other passage in his works , or by any of his time ; but on the contrary , origen , who died at tyre , an. chr. 254. hath three most irrefragable testimonies for it ; first on luke hom. 14. parvuli baptizantur in remissionem peccatorum , little ones are baptized into the remission of sins ; and quomodo potest ulla lavacri in parvulis ratio subsistere , nisi juxta illum sensum de quo paulò autè diximus , nullus mundus à sorde &c. how can the account of baptizing little ones bold , but according to that which before was said , none is clean from pollution , no not if he be but a day old , and per baptismi sacramentum nativitatis sordes deponuntur , propterea baptizantur & parvuli , by the sacrament of baptisme the pollutions of our birth are put off , and therefore little ones are baptized . secondly , on leviticus hom. 8. requiratur quid causae est cum baptisma ecclesiae in remissionem peccatorum detur , secundum ecclesiae observantiam etiam parvulis baptismum dari — let it be considered what the cause is when the baptisme of the church is given for the remission of sins , that baptisme should according to the observation ( or custome ) of the church be given to little ones . thirdly , on the epistle to the romans , l. 5. ecclesia ab apostolis traditionem suscepit etiam parvulis baptismum dare — the church hath received tradition from the apostles to give baptisme to little ones also , such little ones still ( as by the former words appears ) as those of a day old and the like . and so here is a full concord of testimonies both for the practice of the church , and tradition received from the apostles for baptizing of infants , and so is a farther evidence of the doctrine of the third age , not contradicted by any of that time . about the same time , or without question soon after , wrote the author ( under the name of dionysius areopagita ) de eccl. hierarch . for , as by * photius it appears , theodorus presbyter about the year 420. debated the question , whether that writer were dionysius mentioned in the acts or no. and of this no doubt hath been made but that he was a very antient and learned author . he therefore in his * 7. chap of eccles . hierarch . proposeth the question , as that which may seem to profane persons ( i. e. heathens ) ridiculous , why 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 children which cannot yet understand divine things are made partakers of the sacred birth from god , i. e. evidently of baptisme ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 concerning the baptizing of infants , saith maximus his scholiast ) adding to the same head also , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , others in their stead pronounce the abrenunoiations and divine confessions , and his answer is , 1. that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 many things which are unknown by us why they are done , have yet causes worthy of god , 2. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that we affirme of this the same things which our divine officers of the church , being instructed by divine tradition , have brought down unto us , and again , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 — our divine guides ( i. e. the apostles , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , saith maximus ) considering this , appointed that infants should thus be admitted according to the sacred manner , nothing can be more clear then that the apostolical tradition is by this antient and elegant writer vouched for the baptizing of infants , as a sufficient account of that matter , against the reproaches and scoffes of profane , or heathen men , who deemed it unreasonable . and so there is a most convincing testimonie for that time , wherein that author wrote , which must needs be in the fourth century before theodorus presbyters debating the question concerning him , but most probably more antient , and so to be placed in this third age . in the midst of this third age , an. chr. 248. was s. cyprian made bishop of carthage , and ten years after he suffered martyrdome , i. e. 158 years after the age of the apostles . in the year 257 he sat in councell with 66 bishops ( see justellus in his preface to the african canons p. 21. ) and their decrees by way of synodical epistle are to be seen in his ep. 58. ad fidum fratrem , which is now among his works . pamel . edit . p. 80. the councell was in answer to some questions about baptisme , and accordingly ▪ he there sets down his own opinion , together with the decrees of that councell of 66 bishops which were assembled with him ; and so this , as it is an antient , so it is more then a single testimonie , that of a whole councell added to it ; and yet farther , to increase the authority of it , s. augustine cites this epistle * more then once , and sets it down almost intire , as a testimony of great weight against heretikes , and so t is cited by s. hierome also , l. 3. dial . contr : pelag. in this epistle the question being proposed by fidus , whether infants might be baptized the 2d or 3d day , or whether , as in circumcision the 8th day were not to be expected , he answers in the name of the councel , vniversi judicavimus , t was the resolution or sentence of all , nulli hominum nato misericordiam dei & gratiam denegandam , that the mercy and grace of god was not to be denyed to any humane birth , to my child , though never so young , ( by that phrase [ mercy and grace of god ] evidently meaning baptisme , the rite of conveighing them to the baptized ) adding , that t is not to be thought that this grace which is given to the baptized , pro atate accipientium vel minor vel major tribuitur , is given to them in a greater or lesse degree in respect of the age of the receivers ; and that god as he accepts not the person , so nor the age of any , confirming this by the words of s. peter act. 10. that none was to be called common or unclean , and that if any were to be kept from baptisme , it should rather be those of full age , who have committed the greater sins , and that seeing those when they come to the faith are not prohibited baptisme , quanto magis prohiberi non debet infans , qui recens natus nihil peccavit , nisi quòd secundum adam carnaliter natus contagium mortis antiqua primâ nativitate contraxit ? qui ad remissam peccatorum accipiendam hoc ipso faciliùs accedit , quòd illi remittuntur non propria sed aliena peccata , how much more ought not the infant to be forbidden , who being new born , hath no sin upon him , but that which by his birth from adam he hath contracted as soon as he was born , who therefore should more easily be admitted to pardon , because they are not his own , but others sins which are then remitted to him . concluding that as none were by the decree of that councel to be refused baptisme , tum magis circa infantes ipsot & recens natus observandum atque retinendum , so this was the rather to be observed and retained about infants and new born children . thus much and more was the sentence of that antient father and that councel , and as the occasion of that determination was not any antipaedobaptist doctrine ( there had no such then so much as lookt into the church , that we can hear of ) but a conceit of one , that it should be deferr'd to the 8th day , which was as much infancy as the first ( and so both parties were equally contrary to the antipaedobaptists interests , the condemned , as well as the judges ) so that it was no new doctrine that was then decreed , or peculiar to s. cyprian ( who had one singular opinion in the matter of baptisme ) appears also both by the concurrence of the whole councel that convened with him , and by the expresse words of saint augustine ep. 28. ad hieronym : beatus cyprianus non aliquod decretum condens novum sed ecclesiae fidem firmissimam servans — mox natum rite baptizari posse cum suis quibusdam coepiscopis censuit , blessed cyprian , saith he , not making any new decree , but keeping the faith of the church most firme , decreed with a set number of his fellow bishops , that a child new-born might fitly be baptized . which shewes it the resolution of that father also , that baptizing of infants was the faith of the church before cyprians time , not onely the opinion , but the faith , which gives it the authority of christ and his apostles . in the next or fourth century , about the year of christ 370. flourished gregorie nazianzen , and dyed in the year 389. who though he be by mr. t. affirmed to dissuade from it but in case of necessity by reason of apparent danger of death , will yet give an evident testimonie of the doctrin of the church of that age in this matter . in the * 4th oration written on this subject of baptisme having gone through all the ages of man ( to demonstrate a proposition premised by him , * 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that it belongs to every age and sort of life ) he at length comes to the consideration of infancy , in these words , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . if thou hast an infant , let not iniquity get time , * let it be sanctified ( certainly baptized ) in infancy , let it in the tender age be consecrated to gods spirit , and whereas the heathens use amulets and charmes to secure their children , * 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , do you give it the trinity ( the fathers the sonne and the holy ghost in baptisme ) that great and good phylacterie , or preservative . a plain testimonie of the churches doctrine at that time . afterwards in the * same oration he returns to this matter again , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , what , saith he , will you say concerning those that are yet children , and neither know the losse nor are sensible of the grace of baptisme , shall we also baptize them ? and his answer is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , yes by all means , if any danger presse , t is better they should be sanctified ( baptized ) when they have no sense of it , then that they should dy unsealed , uninitiated , adding for proof of this the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 circumcision on the eighth day , which was , saith he , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 an initial seal , and yet 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , used to those that had no use of reason , and ( in a lower degree ) the anointing of the posts , which were insensible also , was yet a means of saving the first-born . after this , t is true that he proceeds to consider those children , that are not in any danger of death , and of them he gives his opinion ( 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , in the style which s. paul useth , when he speaks his own sense , as that is other from the revealed will of christ ) that staying about three years , at which time they may be taught to answer somewhat , though they understand it not perfectly , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , by this means they may be baptized , souls and bodies , by this great sacrament of initiation . but of this , 1. it is is clear that it no way prejudges the doctrine and practice of the church formerly set down , and approved by him , that infant children , indefinitely considered , might be baptized , and if danger approched , must , how young soever they were ; which is as contrary to the antipaedobaptist , and so to mr. t. as any thing . 2dly . that it is but his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or private opinion pretending not so much as to any part of the church of that , or former ages to authorize it . 3dly . that the state of children being so weak and uncertain , that t is hard to affirme of any that they are not ( for the first three years ) in any danger , his counesl for deferring will hardly be ever practicable to any . 4thly . that the deferring , of which nazianzen speaks , is most probably to be understood of those whose parents are newly converted , and themselves doubt whether they shall be yet baptized or no , for to such he speaks in that place from p. 654. a. lastly , that the deferring till three years old , if it were allowed , would no way satisfie the antipaedobaptists praetensions , and so still the former passages ought be of force with all , and no heed given to the whispers of mr. t. and others , as if this holy father dissuaded baptisme in any age unlesse in case of danger , when he clearly saith , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , let him in the tenderest age be baptized and consecrated to the spirit . in the same century s. ambrose must be placed , being a writer about the year 380. he in his 10th book , ep. 84. ad demetriad . virg. speaking of those that made adams sin no otherwise hurtfull to posterity , then by the example ( exemplo non transitu no●uisse ) he presseth it with this principal absurdity , hinc evacuatio baptismatis parvulorum , this evacuates the baptisme of infants , which should then be capable of adoption onely , but not of pardon . and in like manner on luke , by jordans being driven back , saith he , are signified the mysteries of baptisme , per quae in primordia naturae suae qui baptizati fuerint parvuli à malitia reformantur , by which the little ones that are baptized , are reformed from their malignity to the first state of their nature . in the beginning of the next or fift age , flourished s. chrysostome , that famous bishop of constantinople whose death is placed in the year of christ 407. he in his homilie to the neophyti hath these words , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for this cause ( i. e. because there be so many benefits of baptisme , there recited , ten in number ) we baptize children , though they have not sins . which words are the more worth remembring , because they had the hap to be made use of by the pelagians , and consequently vindicated by s. augustine , the pelagians urged them in this forme , hac de causa etiam infantes baptiz●mus , cum non sint coinquinati peccato , for this cause we baptize infants , when they are not polluted with sin , understanding it of original sin , but s. augustine appealing to the greek , shewed that the right rendring was , quamvis peccata non habentes , although they had not sins , i. e. propria , their own or actual sins , of which these infants were not supposed to have any . so in his * 4th homilie on genesis , speaking of baptisme as of the christian circumcision , among other things he affirmes of it , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , it hath no determinate time but 't is lawful both in the first age ( the childhood , so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies , with him , * else where applied to the time of circumcision on the 8th day , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 — ) and in the middle , and in old age it self , to receive this circumcision made without hands . in the same centurie , very few years after , if not before chrysostome , s. hierome must be placed , born in the year 342. and deceased in the year 420. and he in ep. 7. to laeta telling her that whilest the child was yong and not come to pythagoras's y. the bivium or two wayes , the knowledge of good and evil , tam bona ejus quàm mala parentibus imputantur , his good or evil deeds are imputed to the parents , addes that this must needs be acknowledged , nisi forte existimas christianorum filios , si baptisma non receperint , ipsos tantùm reos esse peccati , & non etiam scelus referri ad eos qui dare noluerint , maximè illo tempore quo contradicere non poterant qui accepturi erant , sicut è regione salus infantum majorum lucrum est . vnlesse , saith he , you believe that christians children , if they receive not baptisme , are the onely persons that are guilty of the sin , and that the offence is not charged on them which would not bring them to baptisme , at that time especially , wherein they that were to receive could not contradict , as on the other side the salvation of infants is the gain of the elder , adding that the parent which was thus to prepare his child for the kings i. e. christs embraces , si negligens fuerit , punietur ; shall , if he be negligent therein , be punished . words of no very conformable aboad to the opposers of paedobaptisme , i wish mr. t. who thinks fit to make use of s. hieromes name ( it now appears how luckily ) would be at leisure to consider them . so lib. 3. contr : pelag. the question being asked by crito , quare infantuli baptizentur , why infants are baptized , the answer is made by atticus , vt eis peccata in baptismate dimittantur , that their sins may be pardoned in baptisme , and again , qui parvulus est , parentis in baptismo vinculo solvitur , the infant is freed in baptisme from the band of adams sin . paulinus , we know , was his contemporarie , and from him we have this testimonie , ep. 12. inde parens sacro ducens de font● sacerdos , infantes niveos corpore , corde , habitu — the priest brings the infants out of the font white as snow in body , in heart , in habit . next to these succeeds s. augustine , who died in the 30th year of this 5 t age , and was the great champion of the church against all the invaders of the depositum committed to it . his passages on this subject are to many to be enumerated , and some of them have already been set down in the resol . of the quaere p. 217. making it the perpetual doctrine of the whole church of all ages before him , and expressly including that of the apostles . so de bap : contra donat. l. 4. c. 23. quod traditum tenet universitas ecclesiae cum parvuli infantes baptizantur , qui certè nondum possunt corde credere ad justitiam , & ore confiteri ad salutem — & tamen nullus christianorum dixerit eos inaniter baptizari . this is held as tradition by the vniversal church , when little infants are baptized , which are sure yet unable to believe with the heart or to confesse with the mouth , and yet no christian will say that they are baptized to no purpose : ( a severe sentence again for the antipaedobaptist ) adding the ecclesiastical rule by which to judge of apostolical tradition , and evidencing the benefit of infant baptisme by the example of circumcision , that as in isaac , circumcised the eighth day , the seal of the righteousnesse of faith preceded , and the righteousnesse it self followed in his riper age by his imitating his fathers faith , ita & in baptizatis infantibus praecedit regenerationis sacramentum , & si christianam tenuerint pietatem , sequitur in corde conversio , cujus mysterium praecessit in corpore , so also in baptized infants the sacrament of regeneration praecedes , and if they hold fast christian piety , conversion in the heart followes , the mystery whereof had been formerly received in the body . so de verb : apost . serm. 14. being come to handle this subject of the baptisme of infants , he begins thus , sollicitos autem nos facit non ipsa sententia jam olim in ecclesiâ catholicâ summâ authoritate fundata , sed disputationes quorundam — the doctrine it self gives us no trouble , being long since founded in the catholike church by the highest authority ( that sure must be by christs and the apostles ) but the disputings of some men — and again , non enim quaestio est inter nos & ipsos , utrum parvuli baptizandi sint , baptizandos esse parvulos nemo dubitat , quando nec illi hinc dubitant qui ex alterâ parte contradicunt — the question betwixt them and us is not , whether infants are to be baptized ; let no man make doubt of this , seeing neither do they doubt of this which contradict us in the other question concerning the benefit of it . and again , in a farther process with those disputers , dic mihi , obsecro te , parvulis baptizatis christus aliquid prodest , an nil prodest ? necesse est ut dicat prodesse , premitur mole matris ecclesiae . doth christ profit infants that are baptized , or doth he not ? he must needs say that he doth profit , he is prest with the weight of the church our mother . and again , authoritate reprimuntur ecclesiae , si enim dixerint christum nihil prodesse baptizatis infantibus , nihil aliud dicunt quàm superfluè baptizantur infantes . they are represt by the authority of the church , for if they say that christ profits not infants baptized , they plainly affirme that infants are superfluously baptized , but this those very heretikes ( the pelagians ) dicere non audent , dare not say , and so were faine to secure their hypothesis by another evasion , viz. that they were baptized not for salvation but for the kingdome of heaven . and yet farther , hoc habet authoritas matris ecclesiae , hoc fundatus veritatis obtinet canon , contra hoc robur , contra hunc inexpugnabilem murum quisquis arietat ipse confringitur . fundata ista res est , ferendus est peccator errans in aliis quaestionibus — non tantum progredi debet , ut & fundamentum ipsum ecclesiae quatere moliatur . this the authority of our mother the church is possest of , this the grounded canon of truth holds fast ; against this fort , this invincible wall whosoever makes assault , is broken to pieces . this is a grounded thing : hee is to be born with who erres in other questions , but he must not proceed thus far ( as the antipaedobaptist certainly doth ) as to indeavour to shake the very foundation of the church , i. e. certainly a doctrine laid by the first planters of the faith , christ and the apostles themselves . so ep. 89. non est superfluus baptismus parvulorum , ut qui per generationem illi condemnationi obligati sunt , per regenerationem ab eâdem liberentur . the baptisme of infants is not superfluous , that they who by their birth are bound to that condemnation which came by adam , should be freed from it by regeneration , and more to the same purpose in that place . so in enchirid. c. 42. à parvulo recens nato usque ad decrepitum senem , sicut nullus prohibendus est à baptismo , ita nullus est qui non peccato moriatur in baptismo . from the infant new born to the decrepit old age , as none is to be kept from baptisme , so there is none who dyeth not to sin in baptisme . which words are soon after transcribed by leo ( ad episc . aquileg : ) who was advanced to the papacie about the year 440. about this time was the epistle of the councel of carthage written to innocentius ( made bishop of rome about the year 400. ) in which these words we find by way of decree , quicunque negat parvulos per baptismum christi à perditione liberari & salutem percipere sempiternam , anathema sit . whosoever denyes that infants are by the baptisme of christ freed from perdition and receive eternal life , let him be anathema . about the same time , whilest innocentius lived ( and to the same purpose ) was the milevitan canon , at which s. augustine was present , a bishop in that councel . this hath been set down in the resol : of the quaere , p. 219. and is an evident testimonie that this doctrine was such as ecclesia catholica ubique diffusa semper intellexit , the catholike church every where diffused , alwaies understood and asserted , and so it is that councels witness of the apostolicalness of it . to these it were easy to adde theodoret also , and leo ( already cited ) soon after him , both falling within the former part of that fift centurie , and in every age after this , store enough . but the question is not , and in any reason cannot be extended to those times , the clear definitions through all those first ages , being all that could be required to decide the controversie concerning the matter of fact , whether it were practised or not practised by the apostles . and having so largely deduced them , it is not imaginable what should be now wanting to the completing of the evidence , when i have onely added , that there is no one testimonie of dissent , either pretended or producible from the writings of all those first ages , nor consequently the least appearance of obstacle , why the receiving of infants to baptisme should not be resolved the doctrin and practice of the first and purest ages of the church , avouched and testified to be delivered to them by the apostles of christ , who could not mistake his meaning in the institution . what artifices the antepaedobaptist can make use of to cast a mist before our eyes , in the midst of so much light , i can no way divine : sure i am that the prejudices which mr. t. hath in few words indevoured to infuse ( as that some are counterfeit authors , some suspected , some misinterpreted ; that some maintained infant baptisme but in case of danger of death , that others which avouched this , avouched either rebaptization or communion of infants also ) are all of them unjust and causeless , and have severally and punctually been prevented in one or both of these discourses , and so there remains not the least scruple of difficulty , that i can foresee in this matter , to adde to the bulke of this vindication . god assist it with his blessing to the disabusing those that are seduced , and regaining them to the waies of peace . the end. errata . page . line . read. 13 8 then it 17 21 alphes 20 32 the whiteness 28 ult . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 32 17 continuing   21 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 40 25 of receiving 42 35 in to 44 11 heed to 48 21 of pers : 61 13 so cyrill in   18 they that 64 20 infants 67 15 crediderit 79 36 after infants adde being 80 5 ministry 83 3 then this 84 24 now to 91 2 but if 102 34 to be the contents of the severall chapters and sections contained in this book . chap. i. of baptisme among the jewes . page 2 sect. 1. probations more and less perfect . the use of circumcision to this question of paedobaptisme . as also of christ's reception of children . childrens coming and believing , mat. 18. children sinners . page 2 sect. 2. the necessity of paedobaptisme depending on the positive part of probation . the several sorts of anabaptists . tistimonies the onely proof of institutions . page 6 sect. 3. the jewes baptisme of natives as well as proselytes . testimonies of their writers in proof thereof . baptisme among the heathens taken from the jewes . among both from noahs flood . the derivation of christian from jewish baptisme how manifested . christs answer to nicodemus . baptisme 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to the deluge . gr. nazianzen's and macarius's testimonies . the fathers meaning in affirming the christians baptisme to be in stead of circumcision . the lords supper founded in the jewes postcoenium , yet in stead of their passeover . page 8 sect. 4. the conceipts of pe : alfunsus and schickard of the jewish baptisme . raf : alphes : mr. t. his conclusion not inferred . the original of the jewish baptisme ( the onely doubt ) vindicated . jacob's injunction to his family . sanctifications exod. 19.10 . differ from washing garments . page 17 sect. 5. mr. selden's notion of the sea. the defence of my notion of it . learned mens affirmations to be judged of by their testimonies . christ's baptizing of iewes as well as gentiles , no argument . christ's vouching iohns baptisme to be from heaven , no argument . no more , the pretended no intimations of it . the no conformity . the proselytes children baptized , continually , not onely at the first conversion . the baptisme of a woman with child , serving for the child also , not argumentative . the canon of neocaesarea about it . page 23 sect. 6. lesser inconformities no prejudice . yet they do not all hold . prayer the christian sacrifice . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . the rule of judging in this matter . baptizing in the name of the father &c. prescribed by christ . so dipping or sprinkling . the pract. cat. misreported . mr. marshals covenanting . page 30 chap. ii. of christ's words . mat. 28.19 . pag. 34 sect. 1. the doctors pretended concessions examined . christs institution of baptisme not set down mat. 28. but necessarily before that time . page 34 sect. 2. making disciples all one with receiving into discipleship . baptizing the act of the baptist . instruction subsequent to discipling . the pretended parallel between mat. 28. and mar. 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . johns discipling by preaching excludes not infants . no more the apostles , mat. 10.5 . the notation of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . mat. 13.52 . act. 14.21 . infants both said to come and to believe . instruction subsequent to baptisme . page 40 sect. 3. discipleship before instruction . what knowledge of the master is required to discipleship . two sorts of disciples , some come , others are brought . page 50 sect. 4. the difference of a disciple and proselyte examined . christian as well as jewish proselytes . priviledges of proselytisme . disciples of the pharisees . the holy ghost's not using the word proselyte of christians , concludes nothing . jehovah . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . infants qualified for baptisme . as for entring into covenant deut. 29. gods oath . infants adjured . criples capable of christ's cures . page 53 chap. iii. of the apostolical practice in this matter . pag. 58 sect. 1. the interpretation of 1 cor. 7.12 . vindicated . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . sanctification used to denote baptisme , the use of it in the fathers and scripture . tertullians testimonie : designati sanctitatis . origen . author quaest : ad antiochum . cyprian . chrysostome . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 there , infant children . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the epistles . s. augustines words examined . page 58 sect. 2. the rendring 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 [ hath been sanctified ] defended . s. hieromes testimonie . enallages must not be made use of without necessity . no advantage from it here . feigned instances of enallage . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . page 66 sect. 3. the rendring 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by the woman ] defended , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 col. 1.23 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 act. 4. ireneus no latine author . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 act. 7. gal. 1.16 . 1 pet. 1.5 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 deut. 28. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , psal . 68. my proof of the interpretation from the context . page 69 sect. 4. mr. t. his mistake of my sense . the argument à genere ad speciem . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . how the husband is said to be baptized by the wife . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 partial washings . the proportion betwixt legal holyness , and baptisme . difference between relative and real sanctification . the testimonies of the antient , for and against my interpretation . page 77 chap. iv. an answer to mr. tombes's view of my conclusion and therein the sense of antiquity in this question . pag. 84 sect. 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , 1 cor. 7. infant children . the jewes practice . their notion of [ holy ] baptisme a priviledge of believers children , yet is communicated to others whose guardians are believers the several sorts of holyness all vainly mentioned by mr. t. his denyals of the conclusion . the place in tertullian vindicated . s. hieromes answer to paulinus . institutionis disciplina in tertullian . candidati damoniorum . a 3d denyal of the conclusion . the use of baptisme to regenerate &c. no prejudice to the founding it in the jewish practice . his art of diversion to put off answering of testimonies . the way of testimonies insisted on . page 84 sect. 2. a catalogue of testimonies of the first ages for infant baptisme , and the apostolicalness thereof . page 96 books written by h. hammond d. d. a paraphrase and annotations upon all the books of the new testament by henry hammond d. d. in fol. 2. the practical catechisme , with all other english treatises of henry hammond d. d. in two volumes in 4º 3. of fundamentals in a notion referring to practise , by h. hammond d. d. in 12o. several books of controversies relating to the present times , by the same author in two large volumes in 4 to viz. 1. dissertationes quatuor , quibus episcopatus iura ex s. scripturis & primaeva antiquitate adstruuntur , contra sententiam d. blondelli & aliorum ▪ authore henrico hammond , in 4o. 2. a vindication of the dissertations concerning episcopacy from the exceptions offered against them by the london ministers in their ius divinum ministerii evangelici in 4o. 3. an answer to the animadversions on the dissertations touching ignatius epistles and the episcopacy in them asserted , subscribed by iohn owen servant of jesus christ , in 4o . 4. of schisme . a defence of the church of england , against the exceptions of the romanists , in 12º 5. a reply to the cathol . gent : answer to the most materiall part of the book of schisme , together with an account of h. t. his appendix to his manuall of controversies &c. 4o. 6. a letter of resolution of six quaeries , in 12o. 7. an account of mr. cawdreys triplex diatrio . concerning superstition , will-worship , and christmass festivall . new. the end . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a45397-e130 * de bapt. contr : donat : l. 4. c. 23. * see g. cassan . in praes . ad duc. jul. cliv . ex nichol. blusdick de orig sect. anabapt . * tom. 2. p. 426. p. 41. see §. 12. e● : ad smyrn : edit : voss : p. 6. l. 6. §. 2. in rom. l. 5. * tom. 2. p. 377. d. * ep. 59. edit . pam. p. 80. * ep. 28. ad hieron . * edit . savil. tom. 6. p. 854. l. 16. * ibid. l. 19. * tom 1. p. 27.31 * tom. 2.18 . c. * in iliad . basil . ed. p. 944. p. 333. * ep. eccl. smyr . ap . euseb . l. 4. c. 15. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . * hieron . ep. 29. apostolicorum temporum vir . * doctrinarum omnium accuratissimus explorator . tertul. advers . valent. * biblioth lod . 1 * edit . morel . p. 233. p. ●19 . p. 234. * ep. 28. ad hieron . l. 3 de pec● . mer. & remis . c. 6 , 7 , 8 , 9. l. 4. contr . duas ep. pelag. c. 3. l. 2. contr . julian . c. 3. p. 339. * paris edit . tom. 1. p. 648. * p. 647 , d. * ( just as tertullian de ani. had observed . ) * p. 643. c. * p. 658. a. * edit . eton. tom. 1. p. 328. l. 5. * t. 1. p. 322. l. 11. so again . p. 327. l. 42. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vindiciæ vindiciarum, or, a vindication of a late treatise, entituled, infant-baptism asserted and vindicated by scripture and antiquity in answer to mr. hen. d'anvers his reply : to which is annexed, the right reverend dr. barlow (now bishop-elect of lincoln) his apologetical-letter : also an appeal to the baptists (so called) against mr. danvers, for his strange forgeries, and misrepresentations of divers councils and authors, both antient and modern / by obed wills. wills, obed. 1675 approx. 290 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 82 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2005-12 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a66526 wing w2868 estc r38662 17882180 ocm 17882180 106704 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a66526) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 106704) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1110:13) vindiciæ vindiciarum, or, a vindication of a late treatise, entituled, infant-baptism asserted and vindicated by scripture and antiquity in answer to mr. hen. d'anvers his reply : to which is annexed, the right reverend dr. barlow (now bishop-elect of lincoln) his apologetical-letter : also an appeal to the baptists (so called) against mr. danvers, for his strange forgeries, and misrepresentations of divers councils and authors, both antient and modern / by obed wills. wills, obed. barlow, thomas, 1607-1691. appeal to the baptists against henry d'anvers, esq. [8], 154+ p. printed for jonathan robinson ..., london : 1675. errors in paging: p. 66-68, 70-71, 74-75, 78-79 misnumbered 50-51, 61, 54-55, 58-59, 62-63 respectively. imperfect: "an appeal to the baptists against henry danvers, esq." lacking. reproduction of original in the union theological seminary library, new york. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng wills, obed. -infant-baptism asserted and vindicated by scripture and antiquity. danvers, henry, d. 1687. -innocency and truth vindicated. infant baptism -controversial literature. baptism -early works to 1800. 2005-03 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-04 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-05 judith siefring sampled and proofread 2005-05 judith siefring text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-10 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion vindiciae vindiciarum ; or , a vindication of a late treatise , entituled , infant-baptism asserted and vindicated by scripture and antiquity . in answer to mr. hen. d'anvers his reply . to which is annexed , the right reverend dr. barlow ( now bishop-elect of lincoln ) his apologetical-letter . also an appeal to the baptists ( so called ) against mr. danvers , for his strange forgeries , and misrepresentations of divers councils and authors , both antient and modern . by obed wills , m. a. he that is first in his own cause , seemeth just ; but his neighbour cometh and searcheth him . prov. 18. 17. london , printed for jonathan robinson , at the golden-lion in st. pauls church-yard , 1675. the preface . the wise man tells us pro. 17. 14. that the beginning of strife is as when one setteth out water , therefore leave off , saith he , contention before it be medled with . the original is big with an emphasis , and is rendred by arius montanus , [ aquas aperiens , or qui aperit aquam ] that is to say , opening the bay , or making a gap in the banks for the water to run out ; so that at first , though the matter may seem inconsiderable , yet the waters widening their passage , become impetuous , grow stronger and stronger , carry all before it , drown the country , and cause great devastations : in like manner from small beginings of controversy , breaches are enlarged , animosities fomented , the world filled with variance , noise , and clamour : so that he that first starteth the same , without being compell'd thereunto , especially if it be about theological points , and those circumstantials and punctilio's , shews himself to be a man of little judgment , and less affection to the churches peace . for though disputes about religion are sometimes necessary , yet are they alwayes dangerous , too often emptying the heart of christian charity , and filling it with carnal zeal , and passion : upon which account few there are to be found , who are fitly qualified to manage such undertakings , which are usually carried on with more heat than any other subject . for that besides reason , learning , reputation , confidence of verity , and interest , which warm men in other polemical encounters , they are in this inflamed with a zeal for god , and the impulse of conscience to appear in his cause , and for his truth impugned . the concurrence of all which , or some of them , have perhaps induced mr. danvers to appear once more upon the stage , and thereby given the ansa , or occasion of another duel , between him and me , who both being of no great strength , might well have given place to others , as fitter champions for the truth , on which side so ever it be . i must therefore acquaint thee , reader , that my antagonist having formerly published a treatise for the baptism of believers only , i presumed to declare my dissent from him , and in my preface to the answer have expressed the reasons that obliged me thereunto . and besides my endeavours to refute all his arguments against infant-baptism , i did more especially detect his failings in the historical part of his discourse , and how extreamly culpable he was in his collections , and in perverting the sense of authors , contrary to their intentions : and though some thought it was impossible for him , not to be convinced of the offence he had done antiquity , yet instead thereof , and an ingenuous acknowledgment of his aberrations , he hath attempted to vindicate himself , and by all artifices imaginable to cover or guild over his defects ; and for a pretext to hide them , hath as much as in him lies , insinuated a disesteem of my labours , making use of the politick engine of repercussion , retorting and bandying back the charges which i bring against him , with a sufficient talio , and large requital . herein much resembling verres , who when tully framed an oration against him for thievery , he knew no better way to discountenance the same , than by accusing tully , a true man , that he was a thief . but this will prove but a poor salvo ; for when the vanity and injustice of such a procedure appears , will not his face be covered with redoubled shame ? i am sorry he hath obliged me to consume more precious time with him , and am not willing to say any thing that may disturb the tranquillity of his soul , and that because he is deeply touch'd at what is past ; for however he pretends to patience , and suffering , 't is easy to observe in him the marks of a great animosity and discomposure : and can any man blame him ? since he ( as he tells us ) had formed his treatise in a new method for the benefit of this age , and consequently might expect it should have been a standing-book for the whole nation , to be universally received without contradiction . but instead thereof , to have the mummery discovered , the mask and vizard pluckt off , to have his darling child , his first born in this kind , anatomized , it 's unsoundness and rotten parts laid open , and exposed to shame , censure , and loathing , this must needs exasperate a great spirit . this was such a provocation , that his fancy hath been more busily imployed in inventing charges against me , then in clearing himself . he hath mainly improved his study ( in conjunction with what help he could get from the wits of his party ) to disparage my book , vilify my person , and to render both odious , and to be suspected . and what a noise doth he make in the preface , with the remarkable exaggerations of my curtilations , misquotations , mistranslations , misapplications , when all this while he looks upon what i have written through the multiplying-glass of prejudice , taking mole-hills for mountains , and peccadillo's and little escapes for unpardonable crimes ; and what is wanting in weight , he makes up in number . never did any momus more industriously set himself to carp ; and some of his accusations are so trivial , that they may be brought against the exactest writer living . and yet after all these exclamations , having compared notes with him , and examined quotations , i find my self little more concerned , then in the mistake of a name , a century , and a passage of cassander . and since my antagonist hath the confidence to refer matters in debate between us to the tribunal of the reader , i willingly joyn issue with him , not doubting ( if he hath honesty and ability to judg ) but that he will find me innocent , and this accuser a delinquent . there is no way to try our metal , but to bring it to the touch-stone of the original authors , from whom we pretend our authorities . there are some things in debate ▪ that they who understand only their mother tongue , cannot possibly be competent judges of which side the truth lieth : some other things are obvious to the unlearned , and they that have read only p. perin in english , and mr. foxes book of martyrs have wondred at mr. danvers errors . in respect of these i have the less need to vindicate my self from some of his charges . and truly if the satisfying some mens importunity , that i would endeavour to disabuse credulous souls , had not been more important than any fear of suffering my reputation by this satyrist , i should have been altogether silent : for though it be certain , there is nothing so far from truth , which a craftily composed discourse cannot make to appear probable , yet my private thoughts were , that i might have saved this labour : since the learned are well satisfied of the truth of what i have written , and the more illiterate that are paedobaptists are not over-forward to believe what mr. danvers saith , and for his own party , many of them will boast still . partiality and prejudice will not suffer them to believe what is said in opposition to him , and from them i must expect no milder penalty , then what i suffered for the first piece , viz. to be looked upon with a squint-eye , and wounded in reputation . but methinks there should have been so much nobleness in mr. danvers , being a gentleman , and a christian , as to have forborn his invectives , and instead thereof , have attacqued some of our arguments for pedobaptism , against which he hath brought no other weapons than what every zantippe can afford , viz. the sword of the tongue , and the arrows of bitter words . but i must expect an after-clap of thunder , for he saith he hath much to reckon with me for mistakes in the doctrinal part . i would advise him rather , first to take off the exceptions i have made against his historical part of baptism , which he cannot but be convinc'd of , unless he wink hard . let him clear his accounts with me in respect of that , before he enters upon new work ; or rather , which is most ingenuous , let him publish a retractation of his errors , and so desist : for experience at tests the truth of that maxim , veritas non quaerenda in cristicis . moreover he cannot be ignorant that the nation hath taken a surfeit of these baptismal-controversies ; there is more said already pro and con , than we are able to speak , and few have patience to read any more , and if we fall to it again , doubtless our books will prove waste paper . and i must further acquaint mr. danvers that he having treated me with so much rudeness in what is past , i have little heart to have any more to do with him , ( unless i see better cause ) and do hereby promise him security , as from me , from all contradiction , when-ever he lets fly . there is no gaping i find before an hot-oven ; and silence is accounted the best answer to such as super-add contumacy to their mistakes : for when men are grown so tenacious of an opinion which once they have espoused , as never to admit of a divorce , though by conviction they find it adulterate , all disputing is to no purpose : such were anciently condemned , quos non persuadebis , etiamsi persuaseris . if mr. danvers be not to be numbred amongst them , i should be glad ; for what ever he hath said of my malignity against his person ( altogether unknown to me ) i here declare before all men the contrary , and that i love him as a brother , though erring , and had mu●h rather convince , than shame him , heartily advising him to cease tossing the ball of contention ; to be humble and loving to all christians ; to mortifie his passions , and follow peace with all in every place that call on the name of the lord jesus . mr. danvers's defence from the charge of prevarication , falshood , and perverting the testimonies of the ancients , found insufficient ; and the same further made good against him . in the 20th page of his reply , entituled innocency and truth vindicated , he tells us , that he doth not quote the sayings of the ancients as if they had been anabaptists , or to prove , that believers baptism is the only baptism of those centuries ; for , he saith , that would have been madness and contradiction : and indeed to quote them for such an end had been little less ; and i presume , if that were not his design , he will be hardly put to it , to give any rational account why he produced them , and not be found at last to contradict himself : for in his treatise of baptism edit . 1. ( which was the book i answered ) next to the preface we have the contents of his book , consisting of two parts : the first proving believers , the second disproving ( as he tells us ) that of infants-baptism , under these two heads . 1. that the baptising of believers is only to be esteemed christ's ordinance of baptism . 2. that the baptising of infants is no ordinance of jesus christ. the first of these he attempts to prove in seven chapters , and the last is from the testimonies of learned men in all ages since christ , witnessing to it . witnessing to what ? why , to the truth of his first assertion , viz. that the baptism of believers is the [ only ] true baptism : had he said no more than a true baptism , he had been safe . and again , in his 7th chapter of the same treatise , p. 56. he thus expresseth himself : not only scripture , but even antiquity it self ( of which they so much boast ) is altogether for believers , and not for infants-baptism : now whether these sayings of his , compared with that above-mentioned , that he doth not quote the ancients to prove that believers baptism is the only baptism of those centuries , be not pro and con , and evident contradiction , i will not say madness ; and whether he hath not shamefully relinquished his thesis , yea whether he doth not prevaricate to free himself from the charge of prevarication , is submitted to the judgment of the reader . and although it must needs be obvious to every impartial eye , that mr. d. is herein found tardy ; yet , as one that hath quite forgotten himself , he doth also in the third page of his reply tell us , that he hopes it will be acknowledged he doth not prevaricate and pervert the testimonies in the three first centuries , and that believers baptism was the only baptism for near 300 years , flatly gain saying what he hath in the 20th pag. of the same book , as we have above mentioned . thus , proteus-like , he often changeth shapes , and being so wavering and fickle , as we have noted , it is a shrewd sign he will also faulter in making good what he pretends to as to the 3 first centuries ; namely , that he hath not prevaricated or perverted the testimonies thereunto belonging . which whether it be so or not , we cannot come to know but by making some reflections upon the 7th chapter of his treatise of baptism , where he begins with the first century , thus — the magdiburgenses in their excellent history do tell us , that as to the subject of baptism in the first century , they find they baptized only the adult or aged , whether jews or gentiles . how well mr. danvers doth excuse himself for adding the word only , we shall hereafter see . we are now upon the trial of prevarication ; which is a concealing or letting pass that which ought to have been declared , on purpose to deceive ; and this i charge him with : for though the magdiburgs do say ( what every one knows ) that we have examples of adult persons both jews and gentiles that were baptized , but as touching infants there are no examples recorded , exempla annotata non leguntur ; yet they add in the very next line , that origen and cyprian affirm , that even in the apostles days infants were baptized , & since these fathers lived in the next century after the apostles , they may very well be thought to understand what the apostles did . in the 2d century , mr. danvers quotes from the magdiburgs some of justin martyr's words in his apology to antoninus pius , where mention is made of instruction and fasting , and prayer before baptism , but withal conceals what in the same place the magdiburgs tell us , that this was the method which was used in reference to aliens upon their conversion to christianity ; for these are their words — cum qui ad fidem christianam conversus esset sat instructus &c. that is , when any one was converted to the christian faith , he was sufficiently instructed before baptism . in the 3d century he doth egregiously prevaricate in telling us , that the magdiburgs say , as to the rites of baptism they have no testimony of alteration : for hereby he doth suggest to the reader , that in this age as well as in the former there was no baptism owned but that of the adult : whereas , 1. those words [ as to the rites of baptism they have no testimony of alteration ] are his own words , and not the magdiburgs , who say only this , viz. baptizandi ritus in ecclesiis asianis observatos hoc seculo , quia omnium ferme doctorum asiaticorum scriptis destituimur , commemorare non possumus ; that is , we cannot rehearse the rites of baptizing observed in the asiatick-churches , because we want for the most part the writings of the asiatick [ doctors . ] 2. he silently passeth by what they do expresly say was in use in this age , namely , that adult persons of both sexes , and also infants , were baptized ; baptizabantur in utroque sexu , adulti simul et infantes , cent. 3. c. 6. p. 124. 3. further : under this head he perverts the sence of mr. baxter's words , and carrys them quite off from the intent and scope of his discourse , as you may see in his saints rest , part 1. c. 8. sect . 5. for what is there spoken from origen and cyprian of an express covenanting before baptism , is meant of adult strangers ; nor is mr. baxter treating there of baptism , but something else . and at this rate what author can be secure from the violence of his interpretations ? and if he had thought on it , he might have urged for adult baptism that of the magdiburgs , cent. 3. c. 6. p. 124. where having said as before , that persons of both sexes , both aged and infants , were baptized ; the words immediately following are these , adultorum autem aliquandiu antequam baptizabantur , fides explorabatur , i. e. but as touching the adult , they enquired after faith and repentance before they were baptized . thus much for the 3 first centuries , wherein as you see mr. danvers is sufficiently faulty ; and yet as if he were most innocent , he doth ( in the preface to his innocency and truth ) most confidently address himself to the reader , and complements him in a high strain , saying , that at his bar the matter is now brought betwixt me and him ; and all that he asks , is only to do themselves and the truth in question so much right , as to afford the common justice of an open ear ; that having heard the recrimination ( he means crimination ) they will also attend to what is said for vindication . but the specious title of a book , or daring preface , will never blind an intelligent reader , who will judg of things not by a parcel of confident words , but secundum allegata & probata , according as things are alledged and proved . in the next place we come to the 4th century , concerning which mr. danvers saith , i make a great cry ; though i know no such vociferation , but only a just censure made against him , by reason of the authorities of this age which he hath so much abused . for in his treatise of baptism in both editions he thus speaks — in this age they [ the magdiburgs ] tell us , that it was the universal practice to baptize the adult upon profession of faith : if he quotes it not to shew that it was the practice to baptize only the adult , it is impertinent ; but his grand assertion both in his treatise of baptism and in his reply , p. 4. that adult baptism was only practised in the 4th century , denotes in what sense we are to understand him . now for mr. danvers thus to father on the magdiburgs what they never spake , and also to pervert what they did speak , renders him chargeable with falshood and prevarication ; for , 1. they say no such thing , that it was the universal practice to baptize only the adult upon profession of faith. but of this in its proper place , when we shall make good the charge of falshood against him in divers other things as well as this . 2. they do indeed tell us , that in the churches of asia the baptized were for some time first instructed , and were called catechumens ; wherein then lies the prevarication ? why , 1. because the instances there given by the magdiburgs were aliens : for they tell us of some jews ( taking it from athanasius ) that being newly converted to christianity , prostrated themselves at the feet of the bishop , and desired baptism . narrat de judeis berythi athanasius in lib. de passione domini , quod ad episcopi ejus urbis genua advoluti baptisma petierint , quos ipse cum clericis suis suscipiens per dies multos in doctrina christianae pietatis , erudierit ; which jews , after they had been for many days instructed in the doctrine of christian piety , the said bishop with his clarks baptized . 2. because a little before in the same chapter the magdiburgs have these words — baptizabantur autem aquâ publicè in templis cujuscunq ▪ sexus aetatis et conditionis homines ; men of all ages , sexes and conditions were baptized publickly in the temples , ( how could this be by dipping ) and lest it should be thought children were not comprehended under those universal terms , they say in the same chapter — de asianis ecclesiis nazianzenus loquens infantes baptizandos esse ait &c. nazianzen speaking of the churches of asia saith , that children were to be baptized . and note here by the way , reader , that because in my answer i have not gone on with the following words of nazianzen , si aliquid immineat periculi , that is , in case any thing of danger happen , mr. danvers doth in his preface exclaim against me for curtailing that father : but the judicious reader may understand ▪ that he quarrels at me without a cause ; for my business was to prove , that infants baptism was owned in that century , as to matter of fact , and not to discourse the ground of it , or to enquire in what cases it was done , and therefore he might have spared his frivolous charge about that matter . it is truely observed by one of the anabaptists party , that my antagonist is so tenacious that he will stand in a thing , although all the world gainsay it : for though the baptism of infants in this 4th century , be so frequently attested by the magdiburgs , yet he will not receed from his former position ; but hath invented a threefold evidence ( as he calls it ) to prove , that adult baptism was only practised in this age. 1. from the sayings of the fathers and great men of this century , both in africa , asia , and europe . 2. from the positive decrees of the three eminent councils of this age. 3. from the pregnant instances of the most eminent men that were not baptized till aged , though the children of christian parents in this century . 1. he begins with the sayings of the african doctors , athanasius and arnobius , two of the most eminent of this age , who ( saith he ) do positively affirm , that teaching , faith , and desire , should , according to christs commission , preceed baptism ; whereby it appears that no other than adult baptism was practised in the churches of africa . to this i answer , that having searched after the doctrine of athanasius in the 4th century of the magdiburgs , i find not any thing of him mentioned about baptism , but only one saying contra arrianos sermone tertio , viz. that the son is not therefore commemorated in baptism , as if the father was not sufficient , but because the son is the word of god , and the proper wisdom and brightness of the father , with a passage or two more concerning christ's divinity . nor is there any word concerning baptism to be found in athanasius his life , cent. 4. c. 10. from pag 1027 to 1053 , for so far it reacheth . but suppose this father hath something of that import elsewhere , according as mr. danvers reports of him in his treatise of baptism , namely , that our saviour did not slightly command to baptize ; for first of all he said , teach , and then baptize , that true faith might come by teaching , and baptism be perfected by faith . will this think you do the business ? will this prove that he owned no other baptism but that of believers in opposition to that of infants ? no such matter : for , as hath been shewn in our answer , the commission it self for baptism doth not exclude infants that priviledge , as appears by the consideration of the condition of the persons to whom christ sent his apostles who were aliens ; and of such ought we to interpret the sayings of athanasius , because of the instance before-mentioned from him , viz the jews at berythrum , who being proselyted to the faith of christ craved baptism of the bishop , and they were made catechumens , and instructed & fasted 3 days , & baptized by the bishop . but mr. cobbet in his just vindication , examining a book called a well-grounded treatise &c. takes notice of this very passage mentioned by mr. d. from whom i suppose he therefore had it . and page 219 , 220. mr. cobbet demonstrates that athanasius's words are wrested to another sense than the scope of his discourse tended , and some words left out which served to declare his meaning , and other words so palpably mistranslated , that the reader is grosly abused thereby as well as the author . the next is arnobius upon the 146 psal. it is very strange to me that when mr. danvers had rejected origen upon the romans . as spurious , though perkins only tells us , it was not faithfully translated by ruffinus ; he should quote arnobius upon the psalms for his own opinion , which is altogether spurious ; being ( as perkins saith ) of a far more modern forge . it seems it is lawful for mr. danvers to quote spurious authors , though not for the pedobaptists . but i hope the judicious reader will hereby be satisfied that this testimony doth not prove his assertion , that no other than the adult-baptism was practised in the churches of africa in the 4th age. he also adds a saying of optatus milevit . out of the magdiburgs , cent 4. p. 237. namely , that none deny but that every man by nature , though born of christian parents , is unclean , and that without the spirit he is not cleansed ; and that there is a necessity of the spirit 's cleansing before baptism ; so that the house must be trimmed and fitted for the lord , that he may enter in and dwell in it . but this authority signifies as little as the other : for suppose this passage rightly translated , as it is not , yet the quotation is very insignificant to prove that for which he brings it , viz. that no other than adult-baptism was practised in the churches of africa in the 4th cent. for optatus presently adds , hoc exorcismus operatur , exorcism doth this ; which mr. d. knows an infant as capable of as the adult , and which was equally practised on both ; and therefore he did discreetly to leave it out , but how honestly , is left to the reader to judg , and to his own conscience . but indeed the whole sentence is miserably mistranslated , as all scholars may see by the latin which runs thus : [ neminem fugit quod omnis homo qui nascitur quamvis de parentibus christianis nascatur , sine spiritu mundi esse non possit , quem necesse sit ante salutare lavacrum ab homine excludi & separari . hoc exorcismus operatur , per quem spiritus immundus depellitur & in loca deserta fugatur . fit domus vacua in pectore credentis , fit domus munda , intrat deus & habitat , apostolo dicente , vos estis templum dei , et in vobis deus habitat . ] another by this true translation viz. [ every one knows that every man that is born , though of christian parents , cannot be without the spirit of the world ( the unclean spirit he means ) which ought to be cast out and separated from a man before baptism . this exorcism doth , by which the unclean spirit is driven away and flys into desert places . the house is made empty in the breast of a believer , the house is made clean , god enters and inhabits there according to the apostle , ye are the temple of god , and in you he dwells . ] and is it not strange that mr. danvers who in his preface charges me with the notorious abuse of authors in curtilations and mistranslations , should be thus notoriously guilty of both himself ? qui alterum accusat moechum , seipsum intueri oportet . 2. thus having travelled through africa , we shall now set footing in asia , where mr. danvers would have us believe , that it was the faith and practice of the churches , to baptize the adult , in opposition to that of infants . and this he saith appears by the like sayings of bazil , gregory nazianzen , ephrim syrus , epiphanius . reader , thou must know that mr. danvers cuts out work for me that i am not concerned to take notice of ; for my business was to answer his first treatise of baptism , and these two last men are not therein mentioned , but brought in since , as auxiliary forces : nevertheless i shall not wave them . 1. for bazil , the passage which mr. danvers quotes from him and inserts in both his tratises of baptism is this , viz. must the faithful be sealed with baptism ; faith must needs preceed and goe before . contra eunomium . in answer to which , 1. i deny that any such sentence is to be found in bazil , for i have perused all that he saith in reference to baptism in his 3 tomes , nor have the magdiburgs any such saying of his where they repeat his doctrine and sayings , contra eunomium ; they mention only this against eunomius , that baptismus est sigillum fidei , baptism is the seal of faith , cent. 4. c. 4. p. 234. 2. there is a great absurdity in the words , as they are placed by mr. danvers . for the interrogation is , must the faithful be sealed with baptism ? and the answer is , faith must needs preceed and go before ; and how absurd is it ? for it supposeth that the faithful could be without faith. but what can be said to that which is further urged from bazil ? that none were to be baptized but the catechumens , and those that were duly instructed in the faith. i answer , that those words are not to be found in terminis in any part of his discourse about baptism : but do not the magdiburgs say thus , bazilius ait non alios quam catechumenos baptizatos esse ; bazil saith none but the catechumens were to be baptized ? but when i tell mr. danvers that cyprian held infants baptism an apostolical tradition , as the magdiburgs inform us , he replyes , that is just as much as if mr. wills should so affirm except some authentick authority be produced for the same , pag. 91. of his innocency &c. and may not i be bold to assume the same freedom , and retort , that if we cannot find the afore-mentioned words in bazil , though the magdiburgs tell us so , 't is just as much as if mr. danvers should so affirm . but suppose bazil had said it , what will it amount to ? surely no convincing testimony : since whether the non alii quam catechumeni , no other than the catechumens doth exclude the infants of believers from baptism , we are yet to seek ; for that passage may very well be interpreted that no pagans were baptized till first they were made catechumens or instructed ; so that it is left to the reader to judg whether from that speech of bazil ( if it were his ) it may groundedly be concluded , he was against infants . baptism , which that he was not , i shall give you reasons shortly . the next is nazianzen , who was very positive and express for childrens baptism , as shall be demonstrated when we come to discover the weakness of our antagonists cavils against it . the third man is ephrim syrus , the monk , whom the magdiburgs so much blame for ascribing such wonders to the cross , that ( if you will believe him ) the devil flys and is not able to stand before it , as the other said of baptism ( strange anabaptists as ever the world heard of ! ) this ephrim termed the cross daemonum expultrix , et paradisi reseratrix ; that which routs devils , and opens heavens-gate , and therefore adviseth all christians to cross themselves in divers places of their bodies , which will notably fortify and preserve them from the devil . madg. cent. 4. c. 4. p. 302. this is a witness that seems to be spit out of the popes mouth , for he is for praying to the martyrs and saints departed , and helps us to some pretty little forms , as , pro nobis miseris peccatoribus interpellate ; pray for us miserable sinners . and , o gloriosissimi martyres dei me miserum vestris juvate precibus ; o ye most glorious martyrs of god help me a miserable wretch with your prayers . but it may be said what of all this , he may not withstanding his superstition be an authentick witness of what was in his day as to matter of fact : it may be so : what then is his testmony as to baptism ? why , this : those who were to be baptized did profess their faith before many witnesses , & renounce the devil and all his works , &c. as it is in the church-catechism . and ambrose that was so much for infants-baptism , and lived in the same century with ephrim , speaks his very words , as the magdiburgs inform us from his 3d book of the sacraments . chap. 2. confessos baptizandos scribit &c. ambrose writes there , that those who confest were to be baptized , where he recites , how that the baptized declared , he renounced the devil and all his works ; and then withal in the same place tells us , that in his 84 epistle of his 10th book of epistles , he is for infant-baptism , cent. 4. p. 239. which clearly makes this quotation of ephrims very insignificant as to his purpose ; because he might say that , and yet be for infant-baptism as ambrose was . but mr. d. quotes his 3d orat. of baptism for this passage ; which i presume is a manuscript , as not being to be found among his printed works . and if so , i hope mr. d. will discover himself such a friend to the common-wealth of learning , as to bless the world with its publication . but i am afraid at last it will appear that mr. danvers is every whit as guilty in mistaking nazianzens 3 orations of baptism for ephrims book de paenitentiâ cap. 5. as i was for mistaking bazil for nazianzen . and it is as much a making an authority . 3. mr. danvers tells us , it was the universal practice of the western or european churches , as appears from hilary , ambrose , jerom , and marius-victorinus , to which i reply more generally . 1. that in this he doth designedly go about to delude the reader , for these four ancients were contemporaries , and flourished in the 4th century ; and they are all put together by the magdiburgs in one chapter , where they give us their saying from their several works . one of them speaks of baptism upon profession , and there is no sentence quoted from him in reference to infants , whereas they give the words of all the rest of these fathers concerning profession before baptism , and withal divers passages of the same men asserting infants-baptism ▪ which being so , mr. danvers can never be excused for his partiality and falshood , in saying as he doth , that it was the universal practice of the western churches to baptize the adult , that is , only such , which is the point prae manibus . 2. particularly . 1. for hilary , he doth very ill in saying as he doth expresly , treatise of baptism , edit . 1. that all the western-churches did only baptize the adult , quoting hilary lib : 2. de trinitate ; whereas hilary hath no such saying there , but is for infants baptism , as appears in his 2d epistle to austin . then for ambrose , he is large for it in his 2d . book of abraham , chap. 12. which the magdiburgs have amply set down , cent. 4. c. 5 : p. 239. and in the same chapter nazianzen is mentioned for it , whom we shall suddenly vindicate , and evince , that he was absolutely of our side , notwithstanding the frivilous distinction whereby mr. danvers would render him otherwise . 2. marius victorinus speaks nothing about infants . but lastly , as for jerom , the magdiburgs give his testimony for infants baptism in words at length , and not in figures , cent. 4. c. 5. p. 239. hieronimus quoque lib. 3tio dialogorum adversus pelagianos critobulo sic scribit : jerom also ( having spoken of ambrose just before ) in his 3d book of dialogues against the pelagians writes thus to critob . tell me , i pray , and resolve the question , why are infants baptized ? attic. that their sins may be done away in baptism . critob . but what sin have they commited ? is any one loosed that is not bound ? attic. dost thou ask me the question ? the evangelical trumpet or dr. of the gentiles , that vessel that shineth throughout all the world will answer thee — death reigned from adam unto moses , even over them that have not sinned after the manner of adams transgression , which is the figure of him to come : but all men are guilty either in respect of themselves , or adam ; qui parvulus est parentis in baptismo vinculo solvitur : he that is a child , is freed in baptism from the bond of his parent [ that is , original sin , or guilt contracted from them ] . 2. his second medium or argument , to prove that adult baptism was only practised in the 4th century , is the positive decrees of the 3 eminent councils of this age , viz the garthaginian , laodicean , and neocesarean ; which , he saith , do positively decree that teaching , confession , faith , and free-choice ought to preceed baptism . we omit speaking to these councils for the present , intending to do it in a more convenient place . 3d argument that adult baptism was the only approved baptism of this age , is , his ten remarkable instances in this century , that were not baptized , though the children of christian parents , till they were able to make profession of faith , viz constantine , basil , gregory , nazianzen , ambrose , chrysostom , jerom , austin , nectarius , valentinian , and theodosius . here mr. danvers ( and others of his party , as i hear ) triumphs over me , because in my answer i speak not to every one of these , and besides i am upbraided by him for excepting only against 4 of the ten testimonies of the fathers , viz athanasius , bazil , ambrose , and nazianzen , who , as i told him in my answer , were for infants baptism . to which he replys ; 1. that if but four of the ten be excepted against , then he hath six more stands good , besides the former ( viz. 15 not excepted against as perverted ) . but really i have endeavoured to understand his account , but cannot : and therefore either he is very confused , or i am very dull . 2. the four that i lay claim to , viz. athanasius , bazil , ambrose , nazianzen , he will not grant me , being , as he saith , full in their testimonies for adult baptism ; he begins with bazil's saying , that faith must preceed baptism . to this i have already reply'd , that notwithstanding this he might be as much for infants-baptism , as ambrose , who spake the same words ; and moreover , i shall now give you some reasons from whence we may conclude , that bazil was for infants-baptism . 1. because two of the most eminent greek fathers his contemporaries , were for it , viz. as nazianz. appears in his oration in sanctum lavacrum , madg. cent. 4. c. 6. p. 417. likewise chrysostom in his homilies ad neophytos , besides those eminent latin fathers , as ambrose , jerom , and others that were such zealous assertors of infants-baptism who lived in the same age with bazil . 2. because in all the three tomes of bazil , there is not one word to be found against infants-baptism ( though he be very large in his discourses about baptism ) and certainly he would have said something against it , had he deem'd it an errour , for as much as it was practised not only in the age wherein he lived , but in the churches of asia , where he was bishop . nazianzen speaking of the churches of asia , saith , infants were to be baptized . mag. cent. 4. c. 6. p. 461. because nazianzen his most intimate friend and fellow-student was for infants-baptism . the magdiburgs say there was so great an endearedness between these two fathers , that they had as it were but one soul. nazianzen is called animae bazilii dimidium , the half of bazils soul , if in them both , say the magdiburgs , there was not una prorsus atque eadem anima . they further tell us that from the time of their first acquaintance there was such a conjunctio animorum et studiorum , such a conjunction of spirits and studies that they continued in most entire friendship ever after . cent. 4. c. 10. p. 939 , 940. 4. we do not find that in any of their epistolary entercourses , any thing that may argue them to be of different judgments in this point ; hence i suppose it may be rationally concluded , that as nazianzen was for baptism after preparation and confession , and condemns those that enter upon it rashly , magd. cent. 4. c. 6. p. 417. and yet in the fore-going page tells us , the churches of asia owned infants-baptism in case of danger , and declares his own judgment absolutely for it , without respect to danger . orat. quarta ad baptismum , as you shall hear more anon ; so might also bazil be notwithstanding he hath any-where said , faith should preceed , or go before baptism . 5. t is no wonder we read not of bazils insisting upon infants-baptism , for such was the errour , and superstition of those times wherein he preached , ascribing such virtue to baptism to do away the guilt of sin , that they would delay the taking up that ordinance , till they thought they should dye , that so they might depart with pure souls ; so that , as far as i can find , bazil had much ado to perswade his hearers to be baptized , and spends abundance of his pains in quickening them to take up baptism , without longer delay : as appears in his exhortation to baptism , where he doth most sharply inveigh against procrastinating the same . if mr. d. would but weigh these things without prejudice , i doubt not but 't would abate much of his confidence that bazil is on his side . nor will he allow me athanasius , but concerning him we shall speak in another place . then for ambrose he saith , that he is full also , that the baptized should not only make profession but desire the same . but then ( as conscious of prevarication ) he adds , that if any of them should contrary hereto say , they would contradict themselves and the practice of the age : but this is meer shuffling . since the practice of the age , as to profession , had respect to pagans as we have often told him , and in this sence we are to understand ambrose ; and whereas in my infants-baptism asserted , i prove ambrose was for us from those words of his lib. 2. de abraham . c. 12. being these — because every age is obnoxious to sin , therefore every age is fit for the sacrament ; to this he replys , that this is no proof that he was for infants baptism . first , because circumcision is hereby meant . secondly , if baptism , then those of every age that are fit for that sacrament , must not be supposed , viz. those that are capable to confess faith , and desire baptism , otherwise not only children but all good and bad , being obnoxious to sin are to be esteemed fit subjects for baptism . neither will this evasion serve mr. danvers turn to put by this our testimony ; and i wonder , he should labour thus to darken truth , and delude the reader ; for 't is true , those words before-mentioned were spoken of circumcision , but he knows it was by way of introduction to the baptism of infants ; and therefore that he may not impose upon the reader , i will give the whole sentence of ambrose from the magdiburgs , cent. 4. c. 5. p. 240. the law commands the males to be circumcised when newly born , and as soon as they begin to cry ; because as circumcision was from infancy , so was the disease [ sin ] : no time ought to be void of a remedy , because no time is void of sin — neither the old man that is a proselyte , nor the new-born infant is excepted ; then comes in those words , because every age is subject to sin , every age is fit for the sacrament ; and the very next words are these , eadem ratione baptismum asserit pervulorum , lib. 10. epistolarum , epistola 84. that is , by the same reason he asserts infants-baptism in the eighty fourth of his 10th book of epistles . whether now mr. danvers hath not weakly opposed and dealt sophistically with this quotation of ambrose , and whether it be not a pitiful shift in him to say , the being fit for the sacrament of which ambrose speaks , must be supposed to be meant of those only who are capable to confess faith , is submitted to the judgment of the impartial reader . as for what he objects that if every age be fit for the sacrament , in regard every age is obnoxious to sin , then infidels are fit subjects of baptism : i answer that the foregoing words of ambrose , viz. neither the old man that is a profelyte , nor the new-born infant is excepted , shew , that he speaks of those who are within the church . the last man that we bring for infants-baptism , and excepted against by mr. danvers is nazianzen ; and 't is observable , that he confesseth what we urge from him hath most in it : it seems then i was mistaken , for i thought what we bring from chrysostom and ambrose , had altogether as much in it , as what is re-urg'd from nazianzen . the words quoted from this father are out of his 40 oration , viz. hast thou a child ? let it be early consecrated 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 from its infancy . to which he replyes , that i impose a fallacy upon the reader , for translating the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , infants , thereby concluding him absolutely for infants-baptism , and that because , saith he , the word signifies a state of childhood , as 2 tim. 3. 15. and therefore nazianzen must be understood by his early consecration to mean , not in the cradle , but as he explains himself , so soon as they are able to understand mysteries , except in case of death : and when i pray according to nazianzen were they capacitated for the understanding mysteries ? the magdiburgs inform us from his 3d oration , it was about the age of three years : extra periculum , triennium aut eo plus minusve expectandum esse censet , cent. 4. c. 6. p. 416. that is , if there be no danger of death , his judgment was , they should stay till they are about 3 years old or something less , and so be baptized ; nevertheless , say they , in some other place of that oration nazianzen declares , omni aetati baptisma convenire , that baptism is fit for every age , comporting herein with ambrose as before : but whether i or mr. danvers do impose a fallacy , let the reader judg by what follows . 1. nazianzen was for baptizing children in case of danger , though as young as the children of the jews that were circumcised the 8th day , as appears by the reason which he gives for their baptism , viz. it is better to be sanctified ( by which he means baptized ) without knowledg , than to die without it ; for , saith he , it happened to the circumcised babes of israel , upon which vossius hath this note , in his thesis of baptism , non igitur nazianzenus &c. nazianzen was not against infants-baptism , and his judgment will be taken as soon as most mens . 2. though [ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ] should be taken for a state of childhood , yet in that place of nazianzen we mention , it is not to be taken so largely ( that is , children of some understanding , ) as mr. danvers doth suggest , because of the instance of circumcision given by the father . 3. nazianzen being a greek-father , intends the word according to its proper signification , and as it is generally taken in the new-testament as well as in prophane authors , and that is a state of infancy ; for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies an infant , saith mr. leigh , crit. sac. and is properly spoken de partu recens edito , of a child newly born , quoting beza on luke 18. 15. who saith , the word properly is taken for infantes teneri nimirum , & adhuc ab uberibus pendentes parvuli , ( i. e. ) sucking babes , such as are carried in arms . the same word is given to christ , when the wise-men found him in swadling-clouts , luke 2. 12. and we have it again for a new-born babe , 1. pet. 2. 2. as new-borne babes desire the sincere milk of the word &c. but mr. danvers hath not done with nazianzen yet , and therefore frames an objection for us and answers it himself thus . it is not manifest that in case of death , he would have an infant baptized ? to which he answers , it is true , but that was not quà infant , but as a dying person . we see by this acute distinction that our antagonist is not only a critick , but that he hath some logick too , in which he saith he owneth little skill ; but that little , i suppose , is in that part which they call sophistry , or the abuse of logick . but that the weakness of this distinction may appear , consider , 1. that it is true nazianzen would not have an infant baptized quà infant . 2. it is untrue , that nazianzen would have an infant baptized quà a dying person ; for if they were to be baptized under either of these considerations , then had he been for the baptizing all infants , and dying persons promiscuously . 3. but nazianzens judgment was to have them baptized because they were the children of christians in iminent danger of death ; they were such as were capacitated for that ordinance on the account of god's covenant ; else why doth he speak of circumcising children in the very place which is now under debate ; melius est enim nondum rationis compotes sanctificari quam non signatos et initiatos vitâ excedere , nazianz. orat. 40. it is better , saith he , they should be consecrated without their knowledg , than to die without the seal , and not be initiated , idque nobis designat octavum diem circumcisio illa , itaque fuit figurale signaculum ac propter irrationales introducta : for so it happened to the circumcised babes of israel . but let the account be what it will upon which nazianzen would have children baptized , it is not material ; since he owned their baptism in some case , which is sufficient , if we had no more to overthrow mr. danvers's position , that the baptism of adult persons was the only baptism owned in this age ; and it is excentrical to the question to talk of the consideration on which they were baptized but to give mr. d'anvers full measure , pressed down , and running over , we shall acquaint him with some other place of nazianzen , where he is for the baptizing children absolutely without respect to dying state , and that is in his 4th oration , p. 648. edit . lutetiae par. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . 1. it belongeth to all degrees of ages , to all kinds and manners of life . wherefore it should be carried through all : art thou a young-man ? then 't is of use against the turbulent motions of the soul : so he speaks of its conveniency for old age. then he comes to infants , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , &c. hast thou an infant ? let him be sanctified [ baptized ] from his infancy , let him be dedicated to the spirit , lest wickedness should take occasion , &c. and then he concludes , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . art thou afraid of the seal ( mr. d'anvers will not have baptism to be a seal ) because of the tenderness of his nature ? 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; thou art a pusillanimous mother , and of a weak faith. as for that jeer with which he concludes , that we may as well bring protogenes for an authority , that pretended to baptize children in this age to cure diseases , as gregory nazianzen to save their souls ; i shall retort what i find in his friend haggar , in his book called the foundation of the font discover'd , pag. 94. where he thus speaks i can boldly say with a good conscience , in the presence of god to his glory , i have known many weak and sickly before , that have recovered health and strength afterwards ( that is , after being dipt ) and some immediately in a few days , yea and that when they have been so ill , that all doctors have given them over . a good encouragement to proselyte credulous souls to their way , and to augment their churches apace ; for if dipping prove usually so medicinal and succesful , even in desperate cases , it will undoubtedly impair , if not render altogether useless , the practice of physick . but whether this story of haggar be not as fabulous as that of protogenes , i leave to the reader to judge . 2. mr. danvers in the next place comes to the decrees of the three councils , to prove that it was the universal practice of this age to baptize upon the profession of faith. to which i gave this answer : 1st , that we have ten-times three for infants-baptism , and if we must go by number of councils , we shall carry it . 2. i told him that the 3 councils , which he mentions for adult baptism , had respect only to pagans ; to which he gives this answer , it is granted i think ( as i have made it ready to his hand ) he may quote the canons of thirty councils for infants-baptism in the following ages ( and a stout argument no doubt for it ) : but what are such decrees saith he to this 4th century , which are for believers-baptism on profession , and free choice , and 't is impossible to produce one for infants-baptism till after this century . to this i reply : 1st , mr. danvers boasts too much in saying he made the 30 councils ready to my hand for infants-baptism ; and he is too vain-glorious to confess who made them ready to his hand ; but , without disparagement to his reading , i think verily 't was baronius or vossius , or some other . 2dly , he confesseth that we have 30 councils for infants-baptism ; what then is become of his stout assertion in his treatise of baptism ? chapt. 7. p. 56. that not only scripture but antiquity it self , which ( saith he ) hath been so much boasted of , is altogether for believers and not for infants-baptism . 3dly , let it be further noted , that we can produce 30 for it , and he not one against it ; but he tells us 't is impossible for us to produce one for infants-baptism till after the 4th century . but 4thly , mr. danvers hath forgotten himself ; for we have an african council about an age before his three councils , consisting of 66 bishops ( where cyprian was present that flourished in the year 250 ) who determined , that children might & ought to be baptized , before the eight day . cent. 3. cap. 9. p. 205. synodus africana de infantibus baptizandis , and to which synod jerom refers for the antiquity of infants-baptism , mentioning cyprians epistle to fidus , as the magdiburgs have it , cent. 4. c. 5. p. 239. nor is that to be slighted which austin speaks concerning this synod , cyprianus non novum aliquod decretum condens , sed ecclesiae fidem firmissimam servans &c. cyprian was not devising any new decree , but followed the most sure faith of the church , aug. epist. 28. ad hieronimum . but if infant-baptism was owned in the 4th century why is it not mentioned in any of those three eminent councils which were then held , the carthaginian , the laodicean , and neocesarean ? they speak not a word of it , but positively decree that teaching , confession , faith and free choice , ought to preceed baptism . i answer , that as it is certain that almost all the canons of those councils are taken up about discipline , and have hardly any thing of doctrine in them ; so it is to be observed that councils do not mention all things controverted in one age , but rather are concerned in resolving the doubts which troubled the church when such councils were convened ; since therefore there is no canon in those three councils before-specified for infants-baptism , it may well be thought the reason was , because in those dayes none did scruple it ; which we may the rather believe because it was in practice before those councils and in the same century also , as is before fully shewn . but since mr. danvers glories so much in these councils , and prefers them before all those many ones that follow after , it will not be amiss to examin what they are that he stands so much upon ; for certainly if we must give them the preheminence , it must be upon account of their purity , whereas truly we shall find if they are not altogether as corrupt as those that follow , yet certainly in some things as gross for error and superstition , as the popish councils themselves . the 4th council of carthage , which is that mr. danvers intends , and it is the 85th article , those who are to be baptized , must give in their names , and abstain for a long time from wine and flesh , and after often examination may receive baptism . the 7 and 90 canons owneth exorcism , or conjuring out the devil . though , if mr. danvers is to be believed , exorcism was added to the former filthy customs in the 9 cent. as he tells us in his 2d ed. p. 11 , 7. the 74 , 75 , 76 , canons are for penance . also the 76 canon is for pouring in the eucharist into mens mouths that are upon the point of dying . but notwithstanding mr. d's . confidence , it is very clear that that 85 canon was not intended by the council to exclude infants from baptism , because augustin , who was ( as mr. d. tells us 2d ed. p. 108 ) a great patron and defender of infants-baptism , subscribed all the decrees of this council : so that only the adult are herein intended . next for that of laodicea , the 2d canon is for penance according to the quality of the sin. the 26th owneth exorcism , the 48th for anointing with oyle after baptism ; the 59th contains the canon of scripture , and rejects the revelation , and what then will become of mr. danver's theopolis , or discourse made upon some part of it , which is in print ? but what doth this council say against infant-baptism ? why , that the baptized should rehearse the articles of the creed ( 2 ed. p. 59 ) but do they say that none must be baptized but such ? and why may not this intend only the adult as well as that above ? let mr. danvers render a satisfactory reason against it if he can . synodus neocaesariensis , lastly the neocaesarean council , upon which mr. danvers lays so much stress , determines in the 6th canon , that a woman with child might be baptized ; because the baptism reached not her womb , for in the confession made in baptism each ones free choice is shewed ; hence mr. danvers from mr. tombes concludes against infants-baptism . to this i answered in my infants-baptism asserted &c. that the canon respected pagans , as mr. marshal notes from balsamon the glossator , who saith , such women as went with child , and come from the infidels ▪ and what is this to the question which is about children born in the church , of believing parents ? and balsamon himself upon this canon , saith with respect to these , they may be said to answer by such as undertake for them . but mr. danvers out of self-opinion that he is still right in his baptismal notions , and that no gloss can be good that thwarts with him , rejects it , and tells us we do miss the case . but what thinks he of dr. hammon : he may be thought to hit the case as likely as mr. danvers . the said dr. speaking of this cannon brought against the baptizing the children of christians , saith , is it far enough from it , for as for the words of the latter part of the canon : each ones will or resolution , which is professed or signified in the confession , or profession , ( for so he words it in his translation of the greek ) it imports no more than that the confession or ) profession of a woman that being with child is baptized , doth only belong to her self , not to the child , and consequently that her baptism belongs only to her self ; [ so as the child cannot be said to be baptized because the parent is ] . and all , saith he , that can be concluded from hence , is , that the child of such a parent that was baptized when that was in her womb , must when it is born have a baptism for it self , and the baptism of the parent not be thought to belong to it . and this , as he observes , in opposition to the conceit of the jewish rabbies , who say , si gravida fiat proselyta , adeoque lavacro suscipiatur , proli ejus baptismo opus non est ; that is , if a woman great with child become a proselyte , and be baptized , her child needs not baptism . but if this will not satisfie mr. danvers , i must tell him that the magdiburgs do question ( if i understand them aright ) whether that council ever made this canon . canon concilii neocaesariensis ( si unquam fuit ) permittit , &c. and certainly those excellent historians ( as mr. danvers calls them ) would never have put such an if to it , if they had wanted ground for so doing . and mr. d. cannot be ignorant how usual it hath been , to have canons foisted in by others that were never thought one by the councils themselves . nay , i think i have more reason to deny the very being of this council , than mr. danvers hath that of cyprians 66 bishops . for neither eusebius , nor socrates , nor theodoret , nor sozomen , nor evagrius , those ancient ecclesiastical historians , make any mention of it , that i can find ; nor our modern collector of the councils , sympson : but however suppose there was such a council , and that they made such a canon , just as mr. danvers words it ; there is nothing positive against infant-baptism , ( which certainly there would have been , had their judgments been against it ) : and mr. danvers only gathers it by consequence , because they say , that confession and free-choice was necessary to baptism . but this is not sufficient ; for our saviour tells us , that he that believes not shall be damned ; which is as much against the salvation of infants , as these words of the council against their baptism . and yet mr. d. will not deny but that some infants are saved . and why may not the other expression be as well taken in a limited sense ? but suppose not ; mr. d. must remember that he tells us in his second ed. p. 65 that austin saith , that none without due examination , both as to doctrine and conversation , ought to be admitted to baptism ; and yet austin was for the baptizing of infants . and why may not this council be supposed to be as inconsiderate ? certainly they were corrupt eonugh in mr. d's . judgment , to take up such an antichristian error ( as he is pleased to call it . ) for the 1st . canon is against ministers marriage . the 2d . is for penance . the 3d. against often marriages , and penance for the same , &c. thus far we have tried mr. danvers his strength , and let the reader judg upon the whole , whether he hath any ground to conclude himself free from prevarication both in councils as well as fathers : for after all this clutter , and great noise of councils and fathers , he hath not produced so much as one man that denyed , and condemned the practice of infants-baptism , nor one canon that ever was discharged against it . thirdly , in regard i except only against four of those eminent men before-mentioned , as not baptized till aged , though born of christian parents ( as mr. danvers will have it ) and they are , constantine , nazianzen , chrysostom , and austine , he therfore triumphs , and saith ▪ he hath six other unperverted authorities unexcepted against , who were not baptized till they could make confession of faith , which he conceives , is a substantial argument , that believers baptism was the baptism generally owned in this age. to this i answer . 1 that for to say believers baptism was generally owned in this age , comes short of his former assertion , that it was the only baptism owned ; 2. and that it was generally owned because of those six mens not being baptized till aged , is a non-sequitur ; and the quite contrary may be much more rationally argued : for , if upon his inquisition through asia , africa , and europe , [ that is , all the world where christianity was professed ] he can find but six persons born of christian parents remaining unbaptized , till they were able to make a profession of their faith , will it not follow , that the baptizing of believers children in their infancy , was generally owned in that age ? especially if we consider , upon what suspicious grounds baptism was retarded in those days ; sometimes to the very point of dissolution , concerning which we have spoken before . but i shall not contend with mr. danvers about the grounds , why the baptism of all those ten was delayed , since neither of us , without great presumption , can absolutely determine ; and unless we are instructed by a sure light , from the records of antiquity , when all is said that we can say , we shall but impose upon the reader our uncertain guesses . but having a good foundation in history for what i have formerly said , concerning constantine and austine not being baptized till aged , which was their fathers being infidels at their birth , and so continuing ( for ought we can learn to the contrary even to their death . i conceive mr. danvers cannot clear himself from perverting their testimonies , being unserviceable to his purpose : for , 1st . for constantine , we have told him ( in our infant-baptism ) from mr. marshal , that it doth not appear that his mother helena was a christian at his birth ; and for his father , constantius , every one knows that is acquainted with history , that he was none , although he favoured the christians , and grew into a good esteem of their religion , especially towards his latter end . mr. danvers hath only this to say against it , that good historians are of another mind , and that helena was a christian , before the birth of constantine , quoting grotius and dailly for it : but if this were so , what hath he to say for constantius his father ? why , the magdeburgs give this account of him from eusebius , that constantine was bonus a bono , pius a pio ; a good man from a good man , a holy man from a holy man. to this i reply ; 1. that constantius his being denominated a good man , doth not argue him to be a christian , but only morally good , as many other heathens were ; nor is pius always taken for a holy man though sacer be : for antoninus , the pagan emperor , ( to whome justin writ an apology for the christians as mr. danvers notes , ( treatise of baptism . p. ) was called pius for his clemency , and modest behaviour , having raised no persecution against the christians , and putting a stop to the same , when moved , by sending edicts into asia , prohibiting all persecution , meerly for the profession of christianity . fox act. & mon. v. 1. p. 37 , 38. but if it could be proved that constantius was at any time a christian , yet that would not serve our antagonists turn , unless it could be made out , that he was such at constantine's birth , which no man will affirm . neither is it likely he was a christian , when constantine was grown up ; for then how could he have permitted his son to be educated in the court of that tyrannical pagan emperor , dioclesian ; so that it is no wonder constantine was not baptized till aged , especially if it be considered , that he continued a pagan sometime after the imperial crown was put upon his head. for socrates in his first book and first chapter , tells us at large , qua ratione constantinus imperator ad fidem christianam se contulerit , by what means constantine the emperour became a christian ; and the story is to this effect , viz. that when he heard how maxentius ruled tyranically at rome , he was resolved to go against him , and as he was marching with his army thither , he considered with himself ( being not without some fear of maxentius , by reason of his sorceries and devilish arts ) quem deum sibi adjutorem ad bellum gerendum advocaret , what god he should invoke for his assistance in the war ; and being in doubtful deliberation , he saw a pillar of light representing the effigies of a cross. and for the more credit of this apparition , eusebius in the first book of the life of constantine witnesseth , that he hath heard constantine himself oftentimes report it to be true , and that not only he , but his soldiers saw it . at the sight of which being much astonished , and consulting with his men upon the meaning thereof , it so happened that in the night-season , in his sleep christ appeared to him , with the sign of the same cross which he had seen before , bidding him to make the figuration of it , and to carry it in his wars before him , and he should have the victory . where by the way , let us observe what mr. fox saith concerning this story : it is to be noted , saith he , that this sign of the cross , and these letters added withal , in hoc vince , that is , in this overcome , was given to him of god , not to induce any superstitious worship , or opinion of the cross , as though the cross itself had any such power or strength in it , to obtain victory : but only to bear the meaning of another thing , that is , to be an admonition to him , to seek and aspire after the knowledg and faith of him , who was crucified upon the cross ▪ for the salvation of him and all the world , and so to set forth the glory of his name ; as afterward it came to pass . fox act. and mon. lib. 1. p. 77. 2. that austin had christian parents mr. danvers cannot prove by any antiquity , but recommends us to dr. taylor , and mr. baxter , who have , it seems , said somthing to that purpose , when in the mean-while he makes no reply to what i alledg to the contrary , in my infants-baptism asserted &c. part 1. p. 21. where i prove from austin's own pen that his father was an infidel , when he was grown up to understanding , and he relates how he came afterward to be converted : aug. confess . lib. 2. c. 6. and though dr. taylor and mr. baxter may be of another mind , yet dr. owen , who is not inferior in learning to either , tells us in his late book of the spirit , p. 294. sec. 11. that the reason why austin was not baptized in his infancy was , because his father was not then a christian . by this time i suppose the reader may guess how well mr. danvers hath purged himself from the charge of prevarication , and proved his grand assertion , that believers baptism was the only baptism for the four first centuries . for if he reflects upon the whole that hath been hitherto disputed between us , he shall find that as to the first century , the magdiburgs ( from whom we have our light in the history of baptism ) tells us , that origen and cyprian affirm , that infants were baptized in the apostles days . in the 2d century , he perverts the words of justin martyr by applying that which was spoken of baptizing pagans against the baptizing of believers children , as appears by what the magdiburgs say in that very place . in the 3d century , he suggests that no baptism was owned but that of the adult , when they tell us plainly , both persons grown up , and infants of both sexes were baptized . and for the 4th century , mr. danvers is so bold as to say , that the magdiburgs tell us it was the universal practice to baptize the adult upon profession of faith ; treatise of baptism , edit . 1. p. 64. when they say otherwise , namely , that persons of all ages were baptized in the temples , and cite nazianzen for baptizing of infants in the churches of asia , to which also we have added the testimonies of hillary , ambrose , jerom , chrisostom , austin , all of the 4th century : and for infants baptism , lastly he brings the canons of the 3 councils of carthage , laodicea , and neocaesaria , which have not a word in them against infants baptism , and what is decreed about confession before baptism relates to strangers , as i presume i have made it appear beyond all doubt in the two last of them ( if that of neocaesaria ever had a being . ) but i must proceed on , and follow mr. danvers , for he tells us he is not alone in his opinion , and therefore brings in divers authorities to confirm it ; that only the adult upon confession of faith were the subjects of baptism in the first times , p. 14 , 15. he begins with strabo , that saith , in the first times baptism was wont to be given to them only that could know and understand , what profit was to be gotten by it . but it seems by the story , that strabo his first-times go no higher than austins days ; for he instanceth in his being baptized at age , when-as we have testimony that childrens baptism was in use in the church above a hundred years before austin was born . and austin ( that lived about four hundred years nearer the primitive times than strabo ) affirms , that the church always had it , and always held it . besides , the testimony of strabo ) is not to be valued , being condemned by vossius and others for a false historian : we have formerly in our answer given instances thereof , and particularly we noted that gross mistake of his , that sureties ( called god-fathers , and god-mothers , were first invented in austin's days , when tertullian speaks of them , above a hundred years before . next follows beatus rhenanus , rupertus , boemus , dr. hammond , and mr. baxter ; the eldest of whom lived but in the 12th cent. according to mr. danvers , and had no other way of knowing what was don in the first times than we : and therefore let them affirm what they please , unless they can prove it by the records of those times , it signifies no more than if mr. danvers told us so . and the contrary to what he asserts is apparent from antiquity . but because mr. danvers shall not say i slight his authorities , i shall particularly examine them . and as for b. rhenanus ( who lived in 15. cent. ) what mr. danvers makes him say is very impertinent to his purpose . for his business is to prove , that only the adult were then baptized , which his quotation affirms not : and what then doth it signifie , but to help to swell his book ? but i shall make it appear that mr. d. hath shamefully mistaken rhenanus's sense , and thereby exceedingly abused him . for b. rhenanus in his annot. upon tertullian's corona militis , on those words , aquam adituri , saith thus , p. 500. baptizandi ritum ostendit , qui in usu veterum fuit , de quo consuetudo quaedam mutavit . nam tum adulti regenerationis lavacro tingebantur , quotidie externis e paganismo ad nostram religionem confluentibus . siquidem id temporis ubique reperire erat ethnicos christianis admixtos . postea statis temporibus nempe bis in anno celebrari baptismus caeptus , ejus enim rei nullam hic facit mentionem , alioqui non omissurus . qui mos antiquus etiam per tempora caroli magni et ludovici augusti servatus est . judicant hoc leges ab illis sancitae , quibus cavetur ne quemquam sacerdotes baptizent ( excepto mortis articulo ) praeterquam in paschate & pentacoste . that is , he ( tertullian ) shews the rite of baptising that was in use among the ancients , from which a certain custom hath made a change . for then for the most part the adult were baptized , strangers daily flocking from paganism to our religion : because at that time heathens were every-where to be found mixed among the christians . afterwards baptism began to be celebrated at stated times , to wit , twice in the year , for of this thing [ the two stated times of baptism ] he [ tertullian ] makes no mention here ; otherwise [ had it been in use ] he would not have omitted the mention of it . which ancient custom [ to wit of celebrating baptism at two stated times of the year ] was also observed in the days of charles the great , and ludovick the emperor , as appears by the laws made by them , whereby care is taken that the priests baptize none ( except those at the point of death ) but at easter and whitsontide . by this it is apparent ( 1st . ) that by the adult he means only heathens newly converted , and ( 2. ) by the ancient custom ▪ baptizing at the two stated times of easter and whisontide ; and not the baptizing those that were come to their full growth , as mr. d. saith . and to assure him infants are not hereby excluded , rhenanus presently adds , hoc sic accipiendum ut sciamus infantes post pascha natos ad baptismum pentacostes reservatos , et natos post pentacostem , ad paschatem festum diem bapismo offerri solitos , excepta , seu dixi , necessitate , una cum adultis catechumenis qui de externis nationibus danorum , &c. & similium populorum , christianae religioni initiabantur . that is , this is so to be understood that we may know that these infants that were born after easter were reserved to the baptism of whitsontide , and those that were born after whitsontide to the easter following , except in case of necessity , &c. and now i perswade my self mr. d. for very shame , will take no more notice of this quotation , unless it be to acknowledg his inadvertency in producing it . his next author is rupertus in his 4th book of divine offices , c. 18. here mr. d. is guilty of most notorious forgery . for in his second edition , p. 73. he hath the same quotation , and there he tells us rupertus saith , that in former times the custom was that they administred not the sacrament of regeneration but only at the feast of easter and pentecost . and here in his reply , p. 15. he alters the words and makes him say , that they administred but only to the catechumens , &c. if mr. d. must have the liberty thus to deal with authors , i confess there is no standing against him . but i hope the reader will hereby be satisfied , that this signifies no more as to his purpose , than the former , but deservedly renders him unworthy of belief in his quotation of authors . boemus follows who lived in the 16 cent. ( though m. d. brings him into the 12th ( 2. ed. p. 73. ) and he tells us there , that he saith , that in times past the custom was to administer baptism only to those that were instructed in the faith , and seven times in the week before easter and pentecost , catechised . suppose this to be a right translation , it makes no more against the baptizing of infants than the other of rhenanus : for it clearly appears that by in times past , boemus intended then when persons were appointed to be baptized at easter and pentecost ; at which very time rhenanus tells us infants were baptized . and it is most certain that baptizing of infants was before then , because cyprian , origen , tertullian , do all mention it , who lived before that custom was brought into the church . dr. hammond is the next ; and i need not search to see whether he is rightly quoted ; for he makes the dr. say nothing but what all the paedobaptists acknowledg , viz. that all men were instructed in the fundamentals of faith anciently , before they were baptized . but how doth this prove that only the adult . were then the subjects of baptism ? i wonder mr. d. is not ashamed to quote authors at this rate . his last is mr baxter . and he tells us that tertullian , origen , and cyprian do all of them affirm that in the primitive times none were baptized without an express covenanting . but this falls out very unluckily for mr. d. for those three fathers being every one of them for infants-baptism could intend no other than heathens converted to christianity ; which all acknowledg ; and it is plain mr. baxter so intended it , because he hath written largely to prove that none are to be baptized but such , and the children of such . and after this manner doth mr. d. prove his assertions . but i am confident it will prevail with none that have not given themselves over to an implicite faith. his next testimonies for it ( beginning with particular persons ) are from duch authors : we shall speak with them in due time and make it appear , how grosly they erre in their relations of divers things , as particularly about cresconius ; but of this when we come to examine his pretended witnesses . then we have faustus regiensis named , who said , that personal and actual desire was requisit in every one that was to be baptized , which that it was meant of adult pagans , needs no other proof than this , that he was a pelagian , and they were for the baptism of children by the confession of mr. tombes , and i presume mr. d. will not persist in denying it . concerning alban that suffered for opposing infants baptism in the 6th century , i cannot give credit to the dutch martyrology which it seems affirms it , because there is nothing to be found in the century-writers , nor any martyr of that name noted , but only st. alban the first ( as mr. fox tells us ) that ever suffered martyrdom in this island ; but that was under dioclesian , and not for opposing infants-baptism , but refusing to offer sacrifice unto devils . i cannot find the swermers under the 6th century in the magdiburgensian history , as suffering under justinus , or justinianus for being anabaptists : nor in sympsons history of the church , nor in any other authors as i have met with . and certainly , if indeed they had convinced the imperial council to leave off childrens baptism , as mr. d. mentions it twice in the compass of twelve lines , all historians would have taken notice of so remarkable a story , which yet i can find mentioned by none . as for peter bishop of apamen , and zoaras the monk , we told him formerly that the magd. told us , they were for rebaptization ; but that did not prove them against infants-baptism : their words are these . cent. 6. c. 5. de anabaptis . anabaptismum defendisse petrum apameae syriae episcopum , et zoaram monachum cyrum , scribit nicephorus . but saith mr. d. in his reply , p. 106. the late century-writers calling them anabaptists in a modern sense [ that is , for those that deny infants-baptism ] we have no reason to doubt it . but how doth m. d. prove this ? because they say nicephorus writes they defended anabaptism [ that is re-baptizing ] risum teneatis amici ! but let mr. d. take them and make the best of them he can ; i shall not envy him such patrons . for the magdeburgs tells us in the same place , out of niecphorus , that they owned but one nature in christ : and were guilty of most wicked obscenities . another which mr. danvers quotes is adrianus bishop of corinth . i granted in my answer that this man was against infants-baptism , where-as since i have understood from a learned divine , well-read in church-history , that adrianus was falsly accused to have turned away children from baptism ( for that was the charge ) when-as in truth his fault was only his remisness , not taking care in his diocess for the timely baptizing of them , whence it happened that many died unbaptized , which was judged dangerous . nor should i have granted hincmarus to be of mr. danvers party , who is brought in next to adrianus , for refusing infants-baptism . i was told of the mistake ( though led into it by what i found in the magdiburgs , who represent him as accused by his enemies for denying childrens baptism ) by the afore-mentioned learned person : and having since met with sympsons history of the church , i find this following account of hincmarus under century 9. and in pag. 566. edit . 3 that in the council of acciniacum in france , hincmarus , bishop of rhemes , accused his own nephew hincmarus bishop of laudum , a man disobedient to his metropolitan , and a man who for private injuries had excommunicated all the presbyters of his church , debarring them from saying mass , baptizing infants , absolving the penitents , and burying the dead , and was condemned of petulancy and deprived of his office. judg reader by this , whether this man be to be lookt upon under the notion of an anabaptist by the character yet given . but ( to go on with what sympson saith afterwards ) he was restored to his office by pope john the ninth , and that because he made his appeal from his metropolitan , and the synod of his own country to be judged by the chair of rome . a pure anabaptist indeed ! there are three other of mr. danvers's witnesses yet behind , ( and had there been but one more it would have made a compleat jury ) but those three speak nothing at all of infants ; so i let them pass . the dutch-martyrology ( mr. danvers's common-place book ) name also smaragdus : but he hath the wit now to leave him out , though he is in his treatise of baptism , edit . 1. under cent. 10. but i minded him in my answer with those words of smaragdus , that little children are to be baptized , grounding it upon mat. 19. 15. suffer little children to come unto me &c. thus reader thou hast heard what mr. danvers's witnesses can say , and what exceptions i have made against them ; they all stand at thy bar , and i hope thou wilt give righteous judgment , and dost by this time see , that my antagonist hath no need to complain , that i allow him but two witnesses , viz. hincmarus , and adrianus , having been too liberal in that . 2. in the next place he produceth another parcel , that he saith denyed infants-baptism ; but as the donatists , waldenses : but how false this is we shall hereafter shew . and as for those of germany we are contented he shall have them , some of which he may be ashamed to own . as for what he saith of the churches of helvetia , flanders , bohemia , hungaria , poland , france , and silvania ; as i take it , those of them who were really anabaptists , are of no higher antiquity than luthers days : and for his pretending to the ancient britains , i shall reckon with him for that in its proper place ; so for the lollards , they are of the same stamp with the waldenses , whose confessions will confute mr. danvers . for the wickliffians ; the council of constance that accused wicklif for other things and condemned him , never charged him with denying infants-baptism ; and walden that writ against him shews from his own works , that he was for it . lastly , since henry the eight's time , there hath been of this sect here in england . but what dangerous errors some of them held in that kings reign , and in queen elizabeths , we have shewn in our infants-baptism asserted , part 2. p. 90 , 91. to which mr. danvers saith nothing in his reply . and really i wonder he should not publiquely disown munzer , john of leiden , phifer , knipperdoling with their comragues ; i hope he reckons not those synagogues of sathan into the number of the churches of christ , though 't is to be feared , since he is so much their advocate . but concerning the anabaptists of this age here in england i have sufficiently published to the world , that i believe many amongst them are persons truly fearing god. 3. mr. danvers brings testimony for adult-baptism from paedobaptists ; and it seems a strange design to all that i have spoken with about the same , that he should offer to bring chrysostom , austin &c. against infants-baptism , so making the fathers to contradict themselves , and for which i rebuke him in my answer . but he takes much pains to vindicate himself , in which undertaking i find him so full of meanders and tedious circumlocutions , that i judg it not worth while to follow him , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , step by step ; and there is no great reason i should take notice of it . since he confesseth , 1. the sayings of those men [ pedobaptists ] are expresly for his opinion , though it may be [ o sad is it but a may be ? ] not intended so , and therefore saith he , i have done them no injury . 2. he saith , he quotes them not to prove believers-baptism was the only baptism of those centuries : why then did he quote them ? why , to shew how they contradicted themselves , and likewise his dexterity , how well he can beat them with their own weapons . o prodigious self-conceitedness ! what doth he think he can see ( having washt his eyes so profoundly ) the folly of contradiction in the sayings of such a numerous company of fathers , and learned godly divines ? and yet he is so blind as not to see in how many things he contradicts himself . i shall give you a catalogue of some of them before we part . mr. danvers might have forborn his wrangling , and attended to the distinction which we gave in our answer of ecclesia colligenda and collecta , which serves very well for the reconciling the fathers , and modern divines to themselves : for when they speak of teaching , confession and examination , requisite before baptism , they intend it of the way that is to be taken in the first planting of a church , when pagans are brought into the faith of christ ; and when they speak of the right of infants , it is in a church already gathered , of which infants being a part they must not be denied baptism . but this mr. d. likes not , and therefore , hath invented a way to reconcile the seeming difficulty ( as he calls it ) and what is that ? why all the sayings of the later doctors and learned men ( why not of the ancient ones too ? ) wherein confession and profession is required , are to be understood , not , saith he , as mr. wills would have it , to intend onely adult persons and pagans , but infants also , because they hold infants to repent and believe by their sureties . which he conceives he hath sufficiently proved by the instance which he gives from the catechism of the church of england , just before mentioned , which ( after his usual manner ) he doth pervert . for it being said in the catechism , that faith and repentance , is required in persons to be baptized ; the question is , why then are infants baptized , when by reason of their tender age , they cannot perform them ? to which mr. danvers makes the catechism give this answer , they do perform them by their sureties ; as if that was all the answer they gave : whereas indeed the answer in the catechism runs thus ; they perform them by their sureties who promise and vow them both in their names ; which when they come to age , themselves are bound to perform . and as if the bishops foresaw that such as mr. danvers would cavil at the word perform ; in the last edition of the common-prayer book , they have left it out , and only say , because they promise them by their sureties , which promise when they come to age , themselves are bound to perform . so that it appears , the sense of the answer in the catechism is to be understood , according to what we find mentioned by the magdiburgs , cent. 4. c. 6. p. 422. neque enim hoc ille ait , ego pro puero abrenunciationes facio , aut fidei sacramenta profiteor ; sed ita puer renunciat et profitetur , id est , spondeo puerum inducturum cum ad sacram intelligentia venerit , sedulis adhortationibus meis , ut abrenunciet contrariis omnino , profiteaturque &c. which in english is to this effect ; the sponsor doth not say , i do renounce the devils works &c. and profess faith for the child , but promises , when the child comes to understanding , he will exhort him to renounce the devil , and world &c. but mr. danvers conceives that the sayings of the doctors and learned men , when they speak of profession before baptism , is not by them intended of adult persons , and pagans , but of infants also : otherwise it would be , saith he , to make two baptisms and necessitate two commissions ; one for the adult , and the other for infants . to this i answer , there is no such need of two baptisms , for the baptism of adult persons and infants is one and the same , as to the matter , both being baptized with water , and so also , as to form , in the name of the father &c. nor doth it necessitate two commissions , one will serve the turn very well , and comprehend both parent and child ; and to make this clear , i will give the judgment of some of our modern doctors and learned men as to the sense of the commission for baptizing , differing toto caelo from mr. danvers's fancy . perkins upon mat. 28. 29. go teach all nations baptizing them : in these words , saith he , the baptism of infants is prescribed , and the apostles by vertue of this commission , baptized whole families , as knowing in gods former administration to his people , the children were taken into covenant with the fathers . as the nation of the jews , were first taught , and then they and their infants being confederates were circumcised ; so saith our saviour , go disciple the nations , and baptize them . paraeus upon matth. 3. 7. hath those words : ad eos [ infantes ] etiam pertinet universale christi mandatum , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; nec obstat , quod infantes doceri nondum possunt : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 enim christo proprie non est docere ( ut vulgo redditur ) sed discipulos facere , sicut exponitur , joh. 4. 1. in christi enim mandato , doctrina etiam sequitur baptismum , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , facite discipulos baptizando et docendo , &c. non quod doctrina non debeat praecedere baptismum in adultis , sed quod debeat etiam sequi in infantibus baptizatis . 1. the general command of christ ; go , disciple all nations , appertains to infants ; neither doth it hinder because infants can not be taught , for the greek word doth not properly signifie to teach as it is commonly rendred , but make disciples as it is expounded joh. 4. 1. according to christ's command teaching doth follow baptism : for it is baptizing them , and then teaching them to observe . make disciples by baptizing and teaching &c. not that teaching ought not to go before baptizing in the adult , but that it ought also to follow in baptized infants . spanhemius in his dubia evangelica , tells us that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which we render [ teach ] signifies to make disciples , which is done , saith he , by baptizing and teaching ; and he gives this reason for this his analysis ; because , if 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 should signifie only to teach , there would be found a tautologie in christ's words . thus , go , teach all nations , baptizing them , teaching them : the sense therefore ( saith he ) of christs words , is this , goe ye , make disciples to me out of all nations by baptizing and teaching , and the former way of making disciples , infantibus etiam aptari poterat , may be applyed to infants . 4 i think i could bring some scores that understand the commission in this sense , and therefore argue against the anabaptists thus — the gospel is to be preached to every creature : all nations must be discipled ; but infants are a part of this creation , are included in all nations ; therefore they must be made disciples also : for [ them ] in the commission , must refer to nations , or else it relates to nothing , for it hath no relative besides to answer to , and therefore infants being a part of the nation , where the gospel is preached , must be baptized . thus we see hitherto mr. danvers cannot discharge himself of the charge of prevarication , and perverting the authorities produced by him , but like a discontented man , is angry with every body he meets with , that crosseth his humour , and therefore falls a skirmishing with the lutherans , calvin , baxter , and concludes bitterly against me with an appeal to the reader , whether it can be supposed , i did read his book , and answer it with consideration , and so whether i ought not to be esteemed a person extreamly void of reason and conscience . and let the reader likewise judge whether this be suitable to the title of his book , a sober reply to mr. wills , against whom i may rightly object that of ambrose on the 119 psal. quem veritate non potest , lacerat convitiis secondly , concerning the falsehood chargedu pon mr. danvers which is fully proved in what follows . page 30. after some scornful jeers which he is pleased to cast upon me , as that i profess my self a solid grave person , a minister of the gospel , a master of arts and a learned man , and one that hath spent much time in the university ( which is more than ever i profest or pretended to ) he thinks it not enough to render me ridiculous , but wicked also , and therefore insinuates , that i have a peculiar malignity against his person ( whom i never saw ) as well as against the truth . to which i shall only say , that mr. danvers hath cause to repent of his great uncharitableness , especially because i have exprest my charity towards him , declaring in my infant-baptism asserted , part 2. page 224. that i hope he is a godly-man , and i appeal to the searcher of hearts in this matter ( who knows that he wrongs me ) that i look upon him rather as an object of pity than hatred . and for that other which is much worse , that i have a malignity against the truth , i can speak it in sincerity , ( my conscience bearing me witness ) that i can do nothing willingly and knowingly against the truth , 2 cor. 13. 8. wherefore i desire him to search his own heart , whether the malignity be not there , and so i shall leave him to our great master , whose prerogative it is to judg , and who i hope , may in time convince him 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , jude 15. of all his virulent speeches . mr. danvers having thus discharg'd his stomach , offers to joyn issue with me , in order to the speedy trial , at whose door the falshood lies . he hath made a good beginning , hath he not ? and 't is very like we shall have as good an end . 1. first i charge him with falshood , for saying the magdeburgs tell us , that in the first century the apostles baptized only the aged ; i told him the falsehood lay in this , because he addeth the word only , which is not spoken by them . and how doth he clear himself of this ? why , by inveighing against me suo more , and telling the world , that i am an injurious man , and charge on him a falsehood of my own making ; how so ? since , saith he , my words are thus ; as to the subjects of baptism the magdeburgs tell us , that in this age they find , they baptized only the adult or aged , i do not say , saith he , that they tell us , that in this age they baptized only the adult : risum teneatis amici ! reader , i think thou art hard put to it , to find how i have injured him ; for it seems by his own confession , they tell us they baptized only the adult , but i wrong him , for not putting in his other words [ that they did find it ] ; but it is to be supposed that whatever they did tell us , they did find it . but i must tell mr. danvers that they do not say that they find , they [ only ] baptized the adult . this is all they say , baptizatos esse adultos exempla probant , de infantibus baptizatis exempla quidem annotata non leguntur . examples prove that the adult were baptized , and as for the baptizing of infants , we read not any examples upon record . now for to say that the magdeburgs tell us , they find , they baptized only the adult , is ( as he brings it in ) a subtle insinuation to deceive the reader ) for the words being placed in that order by themselves , do import , as if the magdeburgs did not look upon infants-baptism as apostolical , or that any such were baptized in the apostles days ; whereas their very next words are : nevertheless origen and cyprian tell us , that even in the apostles days infants were baptized ; and that it is evident from the apostles writings , that infants were not excluded from baptism : which words being concealed by mr. danvers , shew him ▪ to be as guilty of substraction in this latter as of addition in the former . had mr. d. said , they only find they baptized the adult , i should have let it pass ; because there are no particular examples thereof upon record ; but there is a vast difference between that , and they find they baptized only such : the first leaves room for infants-baptism , for a non dicto ad non factum , nonꝰvalet consequentia , but the latter is totally exclusive thereof ; could mr. d. find it ; but he is as unable to do that , as to prove the magdeburgs said so . and yet he would have his reader believe , it is most manifest that i am an injurious man in charging this falshood of my own making upon him , there being no such words in his book , though but three lines after he fully acknowledges what i charged him withal ; as may be seen p. 31 of his reply , where he saith , my words are expresly thus , that in this age they find they baptized only the adult . and now let any sober man in his senses ( to use mr. d's own words ) judg whether indeed i have done him injury in charging this upon him , or those ministers he informs us of , who said upon the reading thereof , he wanted morality in so dealing with authors . a second falshood for which i censure him is for saying the magdeburgs tell us , that the custom of dipping the whole body in water , was changed into sprinkling a little water in the face , in the first century ; whereas they say no such thing in this century , nor any of those that follow . so that i charge him with a double falshood . 1. for representing them , as if they asserted the ceremony of baptism was only by dipping , which they do not , but the contrary . 2. in affirming that the rite was changed in that century from dipping into sprinkling . let us now observe , how mr. danvers vindicates himself as to this . 1. he saith , the magdeburg's own words will clear him for dipping , and refers us to cent. 1. c. 6 p. 148. where they speak nothing at all of this matter : indeed i find in cent 1. lib. 2. c. 6. p. 497. we have these words ; as to the place of baptism , it was as occasion was offered , in rivers and fountains , and the manner was thus ; minstrum baptismi in aquam baptizandos immersisse seu lavasse in nomine patris &c. probat verbum 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; which mr. danvers thus translates , the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , signifying immersion or dipping in watter [ thus far he is right ] proves that the minister of baptism did dip the baptized , washing them in the name of the father ; which is a very corrupt translation of the words , as all scholars know : for it ought to have been translated , the minister of baptism doth dip or wash them , according to the genuine signification of the word , as they give it us , cent. 1. lib. 1. c. 4. p. 152. vocabulum baptismus significat tinctionem seu lavationem a graeco verbo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , so mar. 7. 4. say they ; for it is taken a judaica l●tione , the jews washing which [ was otherwise besides dipping ] : the words of mark are ; the yeat not except they wash . how now can mr. danvers justifie himself to represent them , as restraining the word only to dipping , when they give us to understand , it signifies any kind of washing , rinsing , or cleansing , as a man will wash his hands , as well by pouring water on them , as by dipping , 2 king. 3. 11. here is elisha which hath poured water on the hands of elijah , being his servant , as 't is noted in the margent . 1. the other falshood is for saying that the magdeburgs tell us , that the custom of dipping the whole body was changed into sprinkling in this century : let the reader judge , how lamely he comes off here ; for he saith , those words of changing the custom were his own , not the magdeburgs : but what had he to do , to interpose his own words , when he undertakes to tell us what the magdeburgs say as to the manner of baptizing , when he repeats their words all along , and then concludes , which said custom of dipping the whole body was changed into sprinkling a little watter in the face . there is no man living but would have taken those words , to have been the magdeburgs as well as the rest , being all joyned in the same sentence , and one and the same character . see his treatise of baptism edit . 1. pars 1. p. 58. surely in this any ordinary reader may see , we have found mr. danvers faulty , nor will any evasion serve his turn for an excuse ; yet hath he still something to say for himself , and that is , that in the 2d . impression of his book , he did for the better distinction ( that all men might know those words of altering the custom of dipping the whole body into sprinkling a little water in the face , were his own , not the magdeburgs ) put them into a different character ; and then saith , that prejudice blinded my eye , my business being to make a hole if i could not find one . what unparalelled confidence is this ! but be it known unto him ; ( and his eye might have seen it in my preface to infants-baptism asserted , that my business was to answer his 1st edition , and he knows very well , ( by a good token which i shall forbear to mention ) that my book was printing , when his 2d edition came forth ; which is sufficient , ( i doubt not ) with an impartial reader to clear me from blame in not taking notice of his different character , had he really made it . but when upon examination the reader will find no such thing , to convince him of mr. d. care in this particular ; ( there being only a semi-colon between , and not the least distinction to make it possible for the most intelligent reader so much as to suppose it ; ) i presume he will wonder at it , that a good man should talk at such a rate . but if he did indeed on purpose put those words in this fifth head into a different character , left they should be supposed not to be his own ; why did he not do so in the 2d . head , the four last lines being his own ? nor in the 3d. head where the three last are his own ? nor in the 4th head where the last is his own ? as the reader may see ed. 2d . p. 46. certainly if he had so honest a design , as he pretends , he would have done so throughout , and , i appeal to his conscience whether he ever thought of such a thing as a different character before he saw my answer to his book . a third falshood , which i lay at his door , is for saying , the custom of dipping was changed into sprinkling in the third century . to this mr. danvers answers p. 36. of his reply , i do him manifest injury : how so ? why , because he tells us , he saith only this , viz. many were the corruptions about baptism , that were creeping in , some whereof he confesseth , he mentions , and amongst the rest , altering the form from dipping to sprinkling . where then is the manifest injury ? i know not , unless it be because i say he changed and altered : and being it seems pincht with this charge , he calls me unfaithful man : and though as above , he confesseth , that he said among other corruptions that was one , the altering the form from dipping to sprinkling ; yet he denies it again presently with a severe increpation , and wonders that i am not ashamed to assert , that he saith the custom of dipping the whole body was changed into sprinkling in the third century . i suppose reader , thou hast seldom met with the like ridiculous contradiction in any author ; i assure thee some have set their wits on work to find out the injury i have done him , and cannot hit upon it , unless it be because i have asserted that he saith the custom of dipping the whole body when he only names dipping : i thought indeed when ever people are dipt it had been the whole body , and i borrowed the form of expression from himself , p. 57 , 58. of his first edition ; so that he is the man that hath cause to be ashamed , and is found very unfaithful , in speaking thus forward and backward at his pleasure , yea that which is manifestly false , and then denying it in the same breath , so adding one falshood to another ; which is a sorry way of vindication . but he would say something if he knew what , to clear himself ; but 't is very confused , and impertinent , as that he did not quote p. 125 , 126. for that , but for the superstitious rites , and did thereby only intend , &c. with more such stuff which i let pass , and think it necessary to give the reader an account of the whole that he hath upon this matter in his treatise of baptism 1 edit . p. 113. 2 edit . p. 101 , 102. and so he will be the better able to judg , whether i have wronged him , or he me . thus he speaks there verbatim . [ many were the corruptions about baptism , that in this age were creeping in , as the confining baptism ordinarily to be performed by a bishop ] quoting magd. cent. 3. p. 123. limiting the time to easter and whitsontide , p. 129. altering the form from dipping to sprinkling ; ( there 's that for which i accuse him ) and the place from rivers and fountains to baptisterions ; with divers superstitious rites , as p. 125 , 126. the 4th . falshood i charge him with is for fathering several things upon the magdeburgs respecting the 4th . century , when not a word of it is to be found in them ; as 1. that they tell us it was the universal practice to baptize the adult upon profession of faith ; and how he clears himself of this , let the reader observe : all the reply , that he makes to it , is , that he doth not say , that the magdeburgs do say in so many words , that it was the universal practice of this age , to baptize the adult upon profession of faith , as he saith , i would insinuate . but for this , let mr. danvers's own book decide the business . i confess i wonder he should deny it when there are a thousand witnesses to prove it ( for so many books were the first impression as they say ) . for my part i have exprest the very syllabical words without altering one tittle , as the reader may see if he please to look on mr. danvers's treatise of baptism , edit . 1. p. 64. under century the 4th these are his words , — in this age they tell us , that it was the universal practice to baptize the adult upon profession of faith , and for which they give us several authorities , out of the learned fathers , and councils at that time , some whereof you have as followeth . if mr. danvers can excuse himself no better than he hath done in this , it had been more for his credit to have been silent . and whereas he excepts against the two instances i bring from the magdeburgs that baptizing of children was owned in the eastern-churches . the 1st was nazianzen : mr. danvers puts this off easily , telling us : he hath answered that already , and refers the reader thereto , and so do i , to the reply i make him , where is manifested the vanity of his distinction that nazianzen was not for baptizing children quà children , but as dying persons . the other instance given by me from the magdeburgs is , that of athanasius question to antiochus , which they bring for infant-baptism , used in the african churches : the words are , quod et in africanis ecclesiis receptum fuisse athanasius testatur , quest. 124. ( 1 ) athanasius doth witness in his 124. question , that it was received in the african churches . and for quoting this mr. danvers is in a pet , and saith , i produce a spurious piece [ is the magdeburgensian history such ? ] why then doth he call it an excellent history ? and further addeth , that i was not ignorant of this , but went on purpose to abuse the world . this is very harsh , but i will not be moved , but only tell him , he does very ill thus to load me with undeserved calumnies ; for , 1. i took up the quotation from the magdeburgs : cent. 4. c. 6. p. 419. where they produce it for a testimony for infants-baptism in the african-churches . 2. they give not the least hint in that place , of its being spurious , but introduce it , with other testimonies that are authentick , without the least censure . 3. i never understood that it was reputed spurious ( as mr. danvers presumptuously saith i did ) for , i never read the life of athanasius , till after i received this severe correction ; who also saith , i did , out of meer design , fall in with the wicked cheat . this is more of mr. danvers's charity and sobriety , and another of his great charges in the preface , saying , that i abused the reader with a supposititious testimony of athanasius , &c. but is this so great a crime in me as to deserve such severe reprehensions ? certainly not from mr. d. who is equally guilty with me in this particular : for in his 1. ed. p. 66. p. 2. ed. p 56. he quotes arnobius upon the psalms for his opinion , which perkins tells us is spurious . now if i should have told mr. d. that he was not ignorant of this , but went on purpose to abuse the world ; and that he did of meer design fall in with the wicked cheat , and abused his reader with the supposititious testimony of arnobius ; how would he have liked it ? i believe he would have called me the most disingenuous person in the world ; when yet i took mine out of the magdeburgs ( his excellent history ) where i think his is not to be found ; though his expressions would induce us to believe he had it from them . a fifth thing charged upon him is the curtailing and leaving out part of a sentence quoted by bazil , vix . must the faithful be sealed with baptism ? faith must needs preceed . and i do in my answer censure him for stopping there , when he should have proceeded with what follows , which is this : what then say you of infants , which neither know good nor evil ? may we baptize them ? yea for so we are taught by the circumcision of children . now how doth mr. danvers clear himself of this ? why by telling us there are no such words to be found in bazil : and i do freely confess my mistake of a name , and fathering upon bazil the words of nazianzen : but withal i must tell mr. danvers that he in his treatise of baptism 1 edit . cent. 4. pag. 66. 2 edit . p. 56. fathers upon nazianzen that which he never spake , viz. that the baptized used in the first place to confess their sins , and to renounce the devil and all his works before many witnesses ; and that none were baptized of old but they that did so confess their sins : and for which he quotes no place , where we may find it in that father , which put me and another to some trouble in perusing all that nazianzen hath writ upon the subject of baptism ; so that i can confidently affirm those words ; that none were baptized of old , but they that did confess their sins , are coin'd by mr. danvers and none of nazianzen's . and i am apt to think he cannot find in nazianzen , that the baptized renounced the devil and all his works before many witnesses ; because the magd. have no such quotation out of him as i can find ; but they tell us indeed ephrim said so . by which it appears to me that mr. d. is as guilty in making an authority of his own as i am . for he saith pag 47. of his reply , it is true the words i find to be exactly the words of gregory nazianzen : and then withal let me mind him that nazianzen's authority for infants-baptism in the 4th century is altogether as good as bazil's being of as great repute in in the church as he ; and what pregnant grounds we have to believe that bazil was for infant-baptism likewise you have heard before . to conclude this , although it be not possible for any unprejudiced man to conceive otherwise of my naming bazil instead of nazianzen , than that it was an innocent mistake ; yet doth mr. danvers ( according to his accustomed charity ) declare his fear that i did knowingly impose upon the reader , and that it was not lapsus calami , but mentis , not a sin of ignorance or a meer mistake , but a wilful mistake . but in these his uncharitable surmises he is very injurious to me , but most of all unto himself who is more guilty in this very particular . a sixth falshood he is censured for is for bringing in the waldenses as witnesses against infants-baptism , &c. but as for this , he tells us he will examine it in his 3d chapter whereto he refers the reader , and so do i to my reply to him under that head , where is sufficiently discovered his falshood and weakness . the seventh charge is for dealing craftily with mr. baxter and traducing his sayings , quoting divers of his arguments to mr. blake , as though he had been only for believers baptism , when in the same place he so fully explains himself , that as for infants right to baptism he takes that for granted , upon the account of their parents , and that the dispute is wholly managed with respect to adult , not infants-baptism . now as to this mr. danvers hath nothing to say , but that mr. baxter contradicts himself , as before he hath said of the fathers and doctors of the church , and all our learned and godly divines , according to the verdict of his modest intellect . the eight and last i charge him with is that of delusion , which he endeavours to fasten upon the reader in reference to dr. taylor , by improving that argument which he hath in his liberty of prophesie as though he were against infants-baptism ; when the dr. himself saith , his design in that piece was only to draw up a schem of the anabaptists arguments , and to represent their fallacious reasonings , and declares , that he conceives them to be in an error , and that he was for infants-baptism . to this mr. danvers replyes , in way of vindication , that what-ever the drs. judgment or end was in writing , yet god's wisdom and power in it the more appears , if an enemy , to bring forth such convincing arguments from his own mouth , to witness to his despised truth . to all which this may suffice for answer . 1. god is infinite and unsearchable in his wisdom and power , and hath made even satan himself to bear witness to the divinity of christ ; but whether mr. danvers's opinion be a truth sub judice lis est , is the thing in controversie . 2. as touching his argments , how convincing they are , we do not deem mr. danvers a competent judg . 3. the dr. himself who hath so much discust the point , and examined what can be said pro and con is more likely to give a right judgment , and to penetrate into the strength of the arguments on both sides , and he hath declared himself fully for infants-baptism , and given us his arguments for the same , in a book entituled the consideration of the church in baptizing the infants of believers ; the which he published since his liberty of prophesy . but notwithstanding all this mr. danvers takes much pains to make the world believe , that the dr. in his liberty of prophesy , spake his own judgment as well as theirs . and in his preface to his treatise of baptism , edit . 1. says , surely dr. taylor had the reputation of a person of more integrity , conscience and honesty , than so egregiously to prevaricate in the things of god. but what prevarication is it in him when he gives us to understand he doth but personate an anabaptist , and tells us he will draw a scheme of what they can say for their opinion , which he looks upon as erroneous , and in the same place positively declares himself for infants-baptism ? and whereas dr. hammond hath answered that collection of antipaedobaptistical arguments put forth by dr. taylor , mr. danvers tells us dr. hammond hath rather confirmed than answered them : but i hope not all of them ; for that had been a strange way of answering indeed : there is one of his mediums to prove infants-baptism by , which mr. danvers saith i much glory in , and which he is pleased to except against ; the rest , it seems are not worthy of his notice , and that is the drs. argument taken from the use of baptism amongst the jews , as a kind of initiation ( of which mr. ainsworth gives divers testimonies upon the 17. gen. ) and saith he , the institutions of christ ( who came first messias to that people , was born of that nation , lived regularly under their law , and observed their customs ) were by him drawn from their former practices in the old testament , and so were lightly changed , and accommodated to his own purposes . and after that he had instanced in divers things , he pitcheth upon the lords-supper instituted and taken from their post-caenium , and cup of blessing , solemnly used by them at the close of a festival , and from thence passeth on to that of baptism , or washing , a known rite solemnly used among the jews as a form of initiation into the covenant of god , and so into the congregation : and shews out of the talmud , that the way of entering into covenant was by circumcision and baptism , and then comes to improve the argument thus : that as the natural jews were thus entered , so were the proselytes ; and as the proselytes of age , so also were their infant-children . from which it appears that the jewish ceremony of baptizing , was accommodated by christ to the right of our initiation of the profession of christ , whereof , saith the dr. we have as little reason to doubt , as that a picture was taken from that face which it resembles to the life , and from whence we have , as he conceives , no obscure ground for our practice of baptizing , not only those who make profession of faith , but also their children with them . in answer to which mr. danvers refers us to the animadversions of sir norton knatchbul where we have such censured , that fetch the foundation of truth from the rabbies , and no doubt deservedly . but as for infant-baptism , the foundation thereof is laid in the covenant of god's grace that takes in the child as confederate with the parent , and consequently the child must not be denied that seal , which under the gospel-administration , is baptism . but that baptism was a way of initiating the proselytes of age with their little ones , we have it several ways attested . see godwin of the jewish antiquities , c. 3. p. 10. quoting moses kotsen , moses aegyptius , drusius de trib . sec. p. 102. who saith , that to the making of males proselytes were required circumcision , and purification by water ; and for the females , only purification by water . from whence mr. godwin concludes thus ; hence we may observe that a kind of initiation by water was long in use among the jews ( having before found it to be as high as davids time ) though , as he saith , it was not sacramental till christ his institution : yea therefore it may seem to have been used by them , because they expected it at the coming of the messias , as appeareth by their coming to john , questioning not so much his baptism as his authority : by what authority he baptized , joh. 1. 15. but what need more be said to this ? when mr. tombs himself ( to whom i hope mr. danvers will subscribe ) acknowledgeth , examen p. 89. that it is well known , baptism was in use among the jews , in the initiating proselytes , for many years together with circumcision . chap. ii. wherein mr. danvers pretends to shew that infants-baptism hath neither foundation in scripture , nor antiquity , with an answer thereto . § 1. the arguments used in his treatise of baptism , we have again in this his reply thus . that if infants-baptism had been any appointment , or ordinance of jesus christ , there would have been some precept or example ; but the scripture is wholly silent as to either , &c. to which i gave this answer , in my infants-baptism asserted &c. first , a thing may be said to be commanded in scripture two ways : 1. expresly , or litterally and syllabically , that is , totidem verbis , in so many words : thus we acknowledg infants-baptism is not commanded ; it is no-where said , go baptize infants , if it had there would have been no controversie . 2. a thing may be commanded in scripture implicitly , and by good consequence ; and what is thus commanded is as valid and obliging , as if it were in so many letters and syllables , and thus we affirm infants-baptism is commanded . there are in scripture clear grounds and principles , from whence by just and warrantable consequences it may be deduced , that beleivers children ought to be baptized ; for if they belong to the covenant and are holy , if they are members of the visible church &c. then they have right to baptism with more to this purpose , infants-baptism asserted , pars 1. p. 36. to which mr. danvers says nothing in his reply , but plays the sophister , mangles my discourse , picks up words scattered in my book about a hundred pages each from other , and spoken upon different accounts , and withal foisteth in some of his own with them , and then falls a-skirmishing with the man of clouts which he hath made . to give you some instances of his disingenuity herein . 1. he represents this to be my argument for infants-baptism , viz. that as there is no scripture expresly commanding , so neither is there any scripture excluding infants from baptism , nor any scripture that saith there was no infants baptized , and then refers the reader to p. 36. 38 , 101 , 131 , 132 , where note , what a compass he fetcheth to glean up words and then patcheth them togetther for an argument : and after all this , the words are not to be found in those pages , but are more his than mine : i have told you before , what is asserted by us , namely , that infants-baptism is implicitly , though not expresly commanded in scripture : pag. 36 , and pag. 38 , i speak thus — to say , infants-baptism is no ordinance of christ because we have no examples in scripture , of any that were baptized , is a pittiful argument : for we have no examples of most of the apostles that they were baptized , and shall we say therefore they were not baptized ? pag 101. which is another of my places that mr. danvers turns the reader to ; i shew , that the want of an express command makes not against the lawfulness of it , and that the anabaptists want an express command or example ( there being neither to be found in the book of god ) to plunge men head and ears under water , as they use to do ; nor have they any precept or example , to baptize people with their cloaths on . and in p. 131. and 132 , the last of my pages he refers to , i thus express my self , that there is nothing in christs commission that is against childrens baptism ; for the teaching that is therein required , excludes not the children of believers ( if 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , be restrained to teaching ) as appears by the consideration of the conditions of the persons to whom christ sent his apostles to baptize who were aliens , and though believing goes before baptism in mark it doth not exclude infants ; because the same condition , that is required there to preceed baptism , is required to precede salvation : so that if the sense be that infants must not be baptized , because they cannot believe , it will as directly follow they must not be saved , because they cannot believe . the way of answering one answers both , by the same distinction the salvation of infants may be maintained , their baptism may . thus reader , i have given thee the whole which mr. danvers improves into an argument against me , as before ; but how justly i shall leave to thy consideration . and i must crave leave to say that this argument : infant-baptism is lawful because no-where forbidden in scripture , nor nowhere told where it was not done , is a brat of his own begetting , which he would fain lay at my door . next follow some passages quoted from divines that are pedobaptists ; as , first from dr. owen in his book called innocency and truth vindicated ( by which name mr. danvers hath baptized his book , though little of either is found in it ) ; who lays down this position , that no part of gods worship , either in the old or new-testament , was lawful , but what had some express warrant from his word for the same ; in opposition to what dr. parker asserts , that what is not forbidden may be lawful : to this i answer that i humbly conceive , that his position of express warrant is to be understood with some limitation : for i have learned from mr. ger●● , and some other divines , that there is a great difference between an ordinance it self , and some particular circumstances or the subject to which that ordinance is to be apply'd : for the ordinance it self , as the setting up baptism as a sacrament of the gospel-covenant , renewed by christ , it requires express warrant in the word of god : but when we have such warrant for the ordinance it self , to whomsoever we find by grounds or principles in scripture that it doth of right belong , there we may apply it though we want express testimony for it , if we have none against i● . and that this is the doctor 's meaning is clear from what he tells us in his exposition of heb. c. 1. p. 86. viz. that it is lawful to draw consequences from scripture-assertions , and such consequences rightly deduced are infallibly true , and de fide : nothing will rightly follow from truth , but what is so also , and that of the same nature with the truth from whence it is derived ; so that whatsoever by just consequence is drawn from the word of god , is it self also the word of god , and of truth infallible . and if mr. d. will please to ask the doctor what he intended by express warrant , i am confident he will find him exactly of bucers mind who thus expresses himself on rom. 6. lex dei perfecta est , docet que quibus totam vitam ad voluntatem dei instituere licet , quare contineri in scripturis necesse est certa , & non expressa nominatim , oracula , de omnibus quaecunque afillis dei , sive publice , sive privatim suscipi convenit . mr. danvers hath pickt up another saying of mr. collins before his vind. minist . evang. viz. that in things relating to the worship of god nothing ought to be done without express warrant in the gosple . this assertion of mr. collins's in that latitude as it is laid down is liable to exception ; for there are many circumstances relating to gods worship , as time , place , and order , that are not so expresly set down in the word , which nevertheless may lawfully be prescribed by the church , provided that it agrees with the general rules set down in the word : and i find this was written in opposition to souldiers that took up the practice of preaching without ordination : and his endeavouring to make the bow straight might make him bend it a little too much the other way . but i am confident if he was to explain what he meant by those words , mr. d. would find them very little for his purpose . but to come more closly to the matter , what express command have we for the observation of the christian sabbath ? for want of which , many anabaptists ( notwithstanding the apostles met on the first day of the week ) own not the morality of it . again , what express command , or example have we , for womens receiving the lords-supper ; good consequence there is for it , but no express mention of it . but this satisfies not mr. danvers , for he is for express scripture , to prove women received the lord's supper ; as you have it in his reply to mr. blinman : who very rationally and truly argues against mr. danvers that the words upon which he lays the stress of womens receiving the lord's supper are in express terms against him , it being these [ all that beleived were together ] and as he argues rightly , the greek phrase is expresly of men and not of women , viz. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the article 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , being masculin expresly limits it to men and not to women , &c. mr. danvers replies very confidently , that the exception of mr. blinman seems to be as defective in grammar as in divinity [ and why in divinity , since mr. blinman holds that women received the lords-supper , and this is not the thing disputed ] and then he paedagogue-like , sends the reverend learned man to his grammar to learn what syllepsis means : which is nothing to the purpose but to make a noise . to gather up then the discourse , we grant all this is good by consequence , that the first-day ought to observed as a christian sabbath , that women ought to receive the lord's-supper , but we cannot prove either by express terms . to conclude then , how injurious and no less ignorant a spirit appears in those words of mr. danvers ; that mr. blinman trifles in the things of god , and plays with words to pervert the truth , when he only tells him ( being challenged thereunto ) that as much might be said for infant-baptism as womens receiving the lords-supper , there being no express command for either , but only implicit , and both warranted by consequence . there is a third author quoted by mr. danvers , viz. dr. hammond , who saith , that an institution of christ , such as each sacrament is , should not be judged by any other rule , than either the word wherein the institution is set down , or the records of the practice of christ or his apostles . a sound position , but such as toucheth not the case before us , for we judg of the sacrament of baptism as belonging to the infant-seed of believers by the word wherein the institution is set down , as before is shewn . thus we have manifested the sophistry and weakness of mr. danvers's arguings together with the impertinency of his quotations . nevertheless he concludes , as if he had done some great thing . by all this evidence it appears that mr. wills is so heterodox in his positions , that he hath neither scripture reason , antiquity , or the learned protestant-writers to stand by him , and wherein if he persists , he gives up not only the independent , but whole protestant cause ( as if all the protestant cause depended upon the sayings of those three men before mentioned , or on my opposing him for wresting and misapplying the same against infant-baptism ) . but what should make him fancy the protestant cause depended upon the sayings of this triumviri , i cannot imagin , unless it be because one is an independant , the other a presbyterian , and the third man an episcoparian , and protestantism is only found among the men of these professions , the anabaptist being not concerned in it . and truly if we consider what mr. danvers hath said of the protestants in some parts of his discourses , we had need of much charity to believe , it would be at all grievous to him , if the protestant cause miscarried ; for we are all in his esteem a company of erroneous persons , not of the church of christ , having no true ministry or baptism , antichristian enemies to the truth , as well as to them , and ever and anon linkt by him with the papist , as conspiring togethher in upholding the tradition of infants-baptism , and therein grounding all our christianity , and against which he bids defiance ; and declares against all possibility of communion with us , whilest we adhere thereto , as may be seen in his preface to his treatise of baptism , edit . 2. but will mr. danvers allow of no consequences , or are not implicit commands obligatory ? you have his judgment in what follows . 1. he tells , us he will allow of consequences when there is express scripture for the thing else-where , as in the case of the resurrection , else not : and i pray , who now is heterodox ? no thanks to him for his grant , for we have no need of consequences to be drawn , where the thing is set down in express terms : it seems if the doctrine of the resurrection had not been delivered in scripture plainly in so many words , all consequential arguings from the infinite power and justice of god requiring it , would little have avail'd with him . but he might have learned from mr. sydenham ( with whom he is acquainted ) that to deny consequences to have the strength of commands is to leave very few duties to be practised , or sins to be avoided : expound the ten-commandments without consequences , and very few will be found literal transgressors , but most deplorable debaucht persons . and since the bible is but a short system of religion , every place is fitted to expound each other , and this must be done by rational , spiritual , comparisons and inferences : and how doth mr. danvers prove that those of his way , must be covered when baptized , have they any express word , or example for it ? doth he not fly to rational inference ? how doth he know baptizing is by plunging ? hath he any other way for it than consequential reasonings ? it must be so , he conceives , for the word signifies it ; see his reply , p. 34. 2. he saith , he will admit of plain consequences , which mends the matter very little . for now we shall want some supreme judg to determine , which are plain , which not ; must we go to him and his party for resolution ? certainly it must be so according to his mode of arguing , for though he will admit of plain consequences he presently adds , therefore we deny the inferences usually drawn from circumcision under the law for baptism under the gospel to be either plain , proper , or true : how blind was nazianzen , jerom , austin , and the rest of the fathers , to infer infants-baptism from circumcision ? and how irrational are the deductions of such an innumerable company of doctors and learned divines ? had they lighted their candles at mr. danvers's torch , they might have seen what had been plain , proper and true inferences ; but the vanity of his discourse in this kind , we have shewed in our infants-baptism asserted , part 1. 116 , 117. and answered their objections against our arguments for infants-baptism drawn from circumcision . in the next place he saith , that as to the antiquity of infants-baptism , with its impious concomitants of salt , oyl , spittle , chrism , exorcism , it was not about 400 years after christ , in the milevitan and carthaginian council , and that according to my own grant . to this i answer , that here mr. d. doth impose : for in the 106 page of my infant-baptism ( the place which he intends ) i do not calculate the antiquity of infant-baptism , from those councils 400 years after christ ; nor is there any thing there spoken of salt , oyl , spittle , &c. this trumpery is an addition of his own , to render infant-baptism odious , although he knows it was used also in the baptizing of grown persons in those days . 2. what is there spoken of infants-baptism is from dr. taylor , and no grant of mine , about the necessity of infant-baptism not determined till the canon of the milevitan council . 3. he makes me to say positively , that the reason why it was not enjoyned sooner was , because the lawfulness of it was rarely , if at all questioned before , and then glories that i have confirmed his witness against infants-baptism ; whereas all that i say amounts but to a conjecture , and that upon a supposition of the truth of dr. taylors speech concerning the time when infant-baptism was established by canon ; for these are my words : belike the reason why it was not established sooner by council , under an anathema , was , because it was rarely , if at all , questioned or opposed till then . it was indeed determined in cyprian's council about a hundred and fifty years before , that infants might be baptized before the eight day , but no anathema was made about this point of baptism so early . 4. observe reader what an idle inference my antagonist draws from the pretended grant of mine ; then saith he , if it be so , that the canons in the milevitan council , and inforcing infants-baptism [ with thirty more councils doing the same ] were only made upon the occasion of those that denied , or opposed it . we have then , saith he , our witnesses throughout all ages confirmed by himself , the reader must needs see how precarious he is in his reasoning , and if he hath no more to say for his witnesses in all ages than this , i am sure he will never carry it at the bar of an impartial judg : he must seek elsewhere for his witnesses than in my writings , or he is never like to find them , and if i had argued at the rate as mr. danvers doth in this thing , i might justly have deserved his censure for folly , and falshood . lastly , he concludes that till any instance be produced of any child that was baptized , as an ordinance of christ , within the first 300 years , he is yet unreprovable in his assertion , and very safe in what he hath said . i answer , 1. that this is very weakly spoken , in as much as he confesseth just before from the magdeburgs , that the records of antiquity say nothing of the particular persons , either infants or adult , that were baptized in the third century , but only ; there is mention made of one family baptized , in which there was a young man named symphorianus , magd. cent. 3. c. 6. p. 1. 25. 2. what though we have not the particular names of children ( having not the church-registers ) it is sufficient that we are informed in general that it was then the practice of the church to baptize children , as we have it in the same place before-mentioned , p. 125. significat cyprianus in epistola ad fidum , etiam osculum infanti a ministro baptizante dari solitum , that is , cyprian in his epistle to fidus doth likewise intimate , that the minister used to kiss the child when he baptized it : let mr. danvers's friends judg , whether this be not enough , if no more could be said , to confute all his discourse about antiquity . add hereunto this consideration , that in this century tertullian perswading to defer both the baptism of children , and others who are of age , doth thereby intimate that it was the custom of the church at that time to baptize the one as well as the other ; otherwise there was no reason why he should desire that they would defer the one as well as the other . concerning tradition , which mr. danvers saith , is the principal ground that hath been urged for infants-baptism , with an answer thereto . sect. 2. to make out this he quotes austin , who calls it an apostolical tradition ; to which i said in my answer , that anciently the greatest points of faith were by the fathers named 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; so they are called by the apostle , 2 thes. 2. 15. which is all one with divine doctrines or ordinances , for so the word is rendered , 1 cor. 11. 2. and to make this more fully appear , the magdiburgs tell us , that bazil calls the manner of baptizing in the name of the father , son and holy ghost , a tradition , by which he means the doctrine of the lord christ. magd. cent. 4. c. 4. p. 235. egregie & basilius hâc de re scribit , lib. 3. contra eunomium , baptismus noster est secundum traditionem domini in nomine patris , &c. that is , our baptism is according to the tradition of the lord , in the name of the father , &c. again bazil in his book de spiritu sancto , by tradition means the scripture , as hermannus hamelmannus observes de tradit . apost . & tacitis . p. 355. certum est quod basilius per vocabulum traditionis , aliquando scripturam intelligit ; it is certain that bazil doth sometimes understand by the word tradition , the scripture ; for so he speaks to amphilochius in his 10th chapter of the above-mentioned book of the holy-spirit . hanc traditionem quae me perduxit ad lucem ac dei cognitionem largita est , &c. if austin then means the same that bazil doth by tradition , viz. the scripture , he says true , when he tells us that infants-baptism were not to be believed , unless it were an apostolical tradition , and although he intends the word otherwise in that famous speech of his in his 4th book against the donatists , chap. 24. ( which mr. danvers doth ill in curtailing ) namely , that if any do inquire for a divine authority for the baptizing children , let them know , what the universal churh holds , nor was instituted in councils , but always retained , is most rightly believed to have been delivered by no other than by apostolical authority ; to which this is added in the next words ▪ tamen veraciter conjicere possumus quid valeat in parvulis baptismi sacramentum , ex circumcisione carnis quam prior populus accepit , that is , nevertheless , we may conjecture how much the sacrament of baptism is available to children , by the circumcision of the flesh which the former people received . his next instance is from bellarmin , that it is an apostolical tradition , &c. but mr. danvers is not ignorant that bellarmin saith , satis aperte coll●gitur ex scripturis , to which purpose we have him , tom. 3. lib. 1. c. 8. de sacrament . it is clearly gathered from scripture . a third passage mr. danvers brings from dr. field in his book of the church , chap 20. where speaking of the several sences in which the word tradition is taken he saith , that infants-baptism is therefore called a tradition because it is not delivered in the scripture that the apostles did baptize infants , or that they should do so : and is it fair dealing for mr. danvers to stop here , when the following words would have cleared the point , which are these ; yet is not this received by bare and naked tradition , but that we find the scripture to deliver unto us the grounds of it , lib. 4. p. 375. and the more inexcusable is our antagonist being formerly minded of this unfaithfulness in our infant-baptism asserted , &c. and when i shewed to a friend that hath a great respect for the anabaptists , how he had served dr. field , the said person presently said , certainly mr. danvers is either weak or wicked . the last instance is from the convocation at oxford , and he deals unfairly with them likewise , by altering , and disordering their words ; for he quotes them thus . that without the consentaneous judgment and practice of the universal church they should be at a loss when they are called upon for proof in the point of infant-baptism : whereas they are expressed in another strain , and less advantageous to mr. danvers's purpose , being thus . that the consentient judgment and practice of the universal church is the best interpreter of scripture in things not clearly exprest ; and then they say , that without it they should be at a loss in sundry points of faith and manners , believed and practiced when by socinians and anabaptists , they are called upon for proofs , instancing in the trinity , and coequality of persons in the godhead : baptizing infants , ●●e observation of the lords day , and even the canon of the scripture it self , &c. mr. danvers having as he thinks cleared his position , proceeds to draw a parallel between papists and protestants , to shew that there is no great difference between them , after the manner as i have represented the protestant sentiments in the point . to which i reply , 1. that the papists hold many things that are orthodox and sound , especially in doctrinals , but are very corrupt in discipline , and abominably unsound in the point of tradition , for they equal it with scripture : and the council of trent determined that tradition was to be entertained pari pietatis affectu , with the like affection as the scripture , &c. the protestants abhor this , as may be seen at large in the afore-mentioned author hamelmannus in his book of traditions , where disputing against staphilus , and cassander , and speaking particularly of infants-baptism , p. 818. he saith non nobis satisfaeceret , nisi peteretur probatio paedobaptismi ex scripturis ; tradition would not satisfie us unless we had scripture-proof for it . now for his parallel . 1. do the papists , saith he , maintain that the ecclesiastical tradition of infants-baptism , as it is gathered from the scripture , and appointed by the church , is of equal authority with scripture it self ? so , saith he , doth mr. wills assert for protestant doctrine , that the tradition of infants-baptism , proved by consequential arguments from the scripture , ought to be esteemed as firm and good , as the scripture it self ; and to prove that i say so , mr. danvers refers the reader to p. 117. of my book , where there is nothing spoken of tradition ; but only a position quoted from mr. baxter's scripture-proof , viz. that evident consequences , or arguments drawn by reason from scripture , are as true proof as the very words of a text. and is there any hurt in this ? can any man that is rational deny it ? doth not dr. owen positively assert it ? nay , doth not mr. danvers himself tell us we admit of plain consequences ? reply p. 69. though he will not grant infants-baptism to be of the number of them . but what saith mr. baxter in the forementioned place ? if i prove , saith he , that all church-members must be admitted by baptism , and then prove that infants of believers are church-members , is not this as much as to prove they must be baptized ? what thinks mr. danvers of that passage of nazianzen in his 5th book of theology ? quae colliguntur ex scripturis sacris , perindè habenda sunt , ac si in illis scripta essent : those things that are gathered out of scripture are to be of like esteem with us , as that which is written in scripture . without doubt mr. danvers look's upon this as a popish saying in nazianzen . the rest of his parallel is so frivolous , that i will not trouble my self , nor the reader with it . and truly if one were minded , how easy is it to retort upon him , and shew the vanity of his discourse in such a manner ? as for instance . doth mr. danvers say that the promise gen. 17. 7 , pertains not to the carnal seed of abraham , but to the spiritual ? so doth estius the jesuit against calvin , about which mr. danvers committed so great a mistake , that if i had done the same he would have said i had belyed calvin , and abused the world. doth mr. danvers say , circumcision was only a seal to abraham , not to believers and their seed ? so saith cardinal bellarmin , in his first book of the sacraments , and after him other papists , affirming that circumcision is not said to be a seal universally to any faith , but only a seal of the individual faith of abraham . doth mr. danvers say , it could not be a seal to an infant that had no faith ? bellarmin speaks the same ; if it be a seal , saith he , ( in that baptism comes in the place of circumcision ) it is in vain to baptize infants , because they have no faith : so that it seems , his sentiments about these points are the same with the papists also . mr. danvers exceptions against our testimonies for infants-baptism from the ancients , examined and confuted . his first exception is against that passage we bring from justin martyr in his dialogue with triphon , part . 2. propos . 3. where he saith , it was lawful for all to receive the spiritual circumcision , which was done by baptism : from whence we argue , that if it was lawful for all to receive it ; then infants who were the subjects of the legal circumcision , for they must be part of the all , and not excluded . to this mr. danvers saith two things . 1. that it is a meer impertinency , and nothing to the purpose , why so ? 1. because there is not one wo●d of infants , nor of infants-baptism , nor its apostolicalness : and what of that ? doth he not know that omne universale continet in se particulare , every universal contains within it self the particular ? and doth not justin say it was lawful for all to receive the spiritual circumcision , which is baptism ? nor do we stand in need of a word for its apostolicalness here , since the only end for which the quotation is urged is to prove that justin was for infants-baptism . 2. he tells us it is not only impertinent , but absurd , to interpret the word [ all ] to be all men , for then it must comprehend wicked as well as good , unbelievers as well as believers . but this is a shift ; for i say , [ all ] is here to be limited to those who are within the church , for to them only appertained the legal circumcision under the law , of which justin speaks , and by proportion to such only , the spiritual circumcision [ baptism ] now under the gospel . as to what he further objects , that justin in this very dialogue tells us , that by the word and baptism regeneration was perfected in all mankind : as it is more than the magdiburgs say , for their words are , per aquam et fidem regenerationem fieri humani generis ; so it makes nothing at all against us , because this is added by the magdiburgs in the same place ( speaking how they baptized in justin's time ) de adultis paenitentiam requirunt &c. they required repentance of the adult before baptism . if mr. danvers had set this down , he could not have framed his objection . just thus he deals with mr. baxter's treatise of baptism , ch. 7. p. 49. 2d edit . where he quotes mr. baxter as rendring some part of justin martyr's apology in these words in his saints rest , ch. 8. sect. 5. viz. [ i will declare unto you how we offer up our selves to god after that we are renewed by christ &c. where if you will compare , you shall see both how considerably he varies it in the words from mr. baxters words , and likewise how he leaves out that which would have shewn the quotation nothing to his purpose , viz [ justin martyr speaking of the way of baptizing the aged . ] in the next place he excepts against what we urge for infants-baptism , from irenaeus , who lived in the same century with justin , in the age of those that saw the apostles , and so must needs know their practice : it is a passage of his in lib. 2. advers . haeres . c. 39. where discoursing of christ that came to save all ages , he specifieth particulars , as infantes et parvuli , infants and little ones , as well as pueros et juvenes , et seniores ; boys , young men , and old men : and then concludes , omnes inquam qui per eum renascuntur in deum ; all , i say , who by him are born again unto god. where , by infants being born again unto god , must needs be understood , after the scripture-notion and sence , and as the ancient fathers usually took the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that is , baptism . for as mr. mede observes , that by the washing of regeneration , tit. 3. 5. none will deny is meant baptism : and vossius , upon that scripture saith , that to call baptism renascentia , [ regeneration ] is usitata veteribus loquendi forma , an usual form of speaking among the ancients . and to put this out of all doubt , justin martyr , in his apology before-mentioned , speaking of the manner how they were baptized , saith , the party was brought to the place where the water is , and regenerated in the same manner , wherein we were regenerated . to this mr. danvers hath little to say , and if i mistake not , very little to purpose , as , that it is impertinent as before and far-fetched , and that there is not a word of infants-baptism in it , or apostolicalness : which is just the 2d part of the same tune which was sung but now : and further he adds , that as the interpretation upon which it is founded is fallacious ; so neither scripture nor justin , doth call baptism , regeneration absolutely [ who saith they do ? ] but only the symbol of regeneration . and this is very true , and which no body denies but i must tell mr. danvers that this is altogether impertinent , and far off from the matter we are upon . but his confidence doth not abate , for he tells us , 't is manifest these authorities are to little purpose , yea wholly insignificant , and nothing to the purpose [ do not only tell us this story , but give us reason for it , or say nothing ] and that they failing , as he concludes they do , there is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 pedobaptismi , a fearful tumbling down of the whole fabrick of infants-baptism , repl. p. 79. and to help after , he presents us with a pretended saying of dr. barlow , but he doth not point to any book or page where we shall find it . the words which mr. danvers saith the doctor speaks are , these ; viz. i believe and know that there is neither precept nor practice in scripture for pedobaptism , nor any just evidence for it for above two hundred years after christ. reader , thou must understand that mr. danvers hath made mention of this reverend and learned mans name , above twenty times in his treatise of baptism , edit . 1 , 2. and in his reply , as if he had spoken much in derogation of the antiquity of infants-baptism . for in the 1st edition of his treatise of baptism p. 74. we have him thus , dr. b. late doctor of the chair , a person of great learning and eminency , hath these words in a letter i have seen in print ; i do believe , and know , there is neither precept nor example in scripture &c. as before : and for as much as i questioned the truth of this , [ that is , that the doctor was of this opinion ] and being desirous to know his judgment , and whether he owned any such printed letter , i did therefore write to him , and received this following letter from him , viz. dr. barlow's letter . sir , i understand by your letter ( and the books you mention , which i have since read ) that some late writers have made use of my name , ( giving me the title of dr. of the chair in oxon ) and cite ( as they say ) a printed letter of mine , wherein i declare my judgment against infant-baptism . you desire to know of me , ( who should best know my own opinion ) whether or ( how far ) those things are true which they say , and cite in my name ? and therefore out of that respect , which is due , and i owe to truth and you ; and that i may undeceive others , and give you that satisfaction which you so civilly desire , i shall crave leave to tell you ( and all whom it may concern ) these few things . 1st . that 't is a great mistake , to call me doctor of the chair in oxon , when it cannot be unknown to any who know that university , that a very reverend and far more worthy * person possesseth , and ( with great learning and general approbation of all ) performs the duties of that great place . 2dly . that never any thing of mine was printed ( by any knowledg or permission of mine ) against the received doctrine or practice of paedo-baptism , as it is warranted and approved by the church of england . 3dly . that ( about twenty years ago ) mr. tombes writ to a then reverend ( since a right-reverend ) person of the university , desiring himꝰ to examine , and give him the true meaning of certain places in tertullian , and some of the ancient fathers , which were usually produced for infant-baptism . that reverend person , whom i was bound ( for many reasons ) to obey , commanded me ( who had more time , though less ability ) to examine those quotations , and return an answer to mr. tombes : which i did , in a letter then sent him : and ( as mr. baxter † truly sayes ) this is that secret letter which they are pleased to cite . 4. i acknowledg that such words as are cited by mr. * danvers ( and such others , spoke and writ then , with more confidence than judgment or discretion ) are in that letter , which had been secret still , if some had not betrayed that trust which was reposed in them . 5. lastly , it is to be considered , that that letter was † writ about twenty years ago , ( when i talk't more , and understood less ) and yet what-ever doubts or objections i had then against infant-baptism ; i never thought them so considerable , as to warrant any division , or schismatical disturbance of the peace of my mother the church of england : and therefore i did then , and since , and ( when i have a just call , god willing ) ever shall baptize infants , according to that form and those rites , which our church has prescribed in her sacred office for infant-baptism . in short , mr. baxter's candid and charitable * answer for me , [ that 't is not likely that i , who have subscribed the articles and liturgy of the church of england , will be against infant-baptism ] i shall endeavour to make good . i have ( with assent and consent ) subscribed our liturgie and articles : and ( god willing ) never shall practise , or print , or say any thing in contempt of , or contradiction to the doctrine , or those innocent ceremonies contained in them . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . t. b. oxon apr. 13. 1675. our 3d testimony is origen , who in divers places of his works , as in his homilies upon rom. 6. saith , the church received a tradition from the apostles to give baptism to little children : the same we have again in his homilies and luke 14. to this mr. danvers objects . 1. that of dr. taylor , that origen is but one single testimony . 2. that his writings are notoriously corrupt , and particularly in the point of baptism . 3. many of his works , and particularly those that treat of baptism , fell into ill hands . in answer to the first ; let dr. taylor in his later discourse of the consideration of the church in baptizing the children of believers , answer dr. taylor in his former book of the liberty of prophesy , where he saith , that origen is but one single testimony . in his later discourse ( put out since ) he cites justin and irenaeus , saying positively , that the tradition of baptizing infants passed through irenaeus his hands . so then he , by this acknowledgeth that we have more than the single testimony of origen : and if he hath put forth any thing else since in contradiction to it , i may say his words are not much to be credited , for we know not where to find him . 2. origen's writings ( saith he ) are corrupt : who denies it in some things ? so are tertullian's , so are all the fathers . to which mr. danvers vauntingly replyes , let both origen and tertullian go together , only i shall thereby have the better bargain ; for mr. wills in parting with origen parts with all , but i have many more to witness for me besides . to which i only say , i wish i could see them , or if it were possible to speak with them face to face , as i lately did with dr. barlow , 't is very like i should have the same account of their judgments , as i had of his ; and let mr. danvers know , that one word of solid reason , hath more weight in it , and is more taking with the judicious , than all his thrasonical boasts and calumniating reflections ? 3. his works fell into ill hands ; which is true of some , yet not all of those that treat of baptism : for i tell him in infant-baptism asserted p. 135. that origen's homilies on the romans and luke , are translated by jerom , and to be esteemed authentick , quoting erasmus for it : and for this mr. danvers falls foul on me , this being another of his great charges in his preface , that i abuse erasmus , who saith quite contrary to what he saith i father on him . as 1. that the translation of the homilies on the romans appeared to him to be ruffinus's and not jeroms . 2. that the preface to the translation which represents it as jerom's was a cheat of the bookseller , as erasmus notes . to this i answer , 1st . that erasmus doth not say that the homilies upon the romans , set forth as translated by jerom , were ruffinus's homilies , and not origen's . 2. the magdeburgs reckoning up the legitimate works of jerom in the story of his life , do mention that of translating origen on the romans to be one , and that according to the judgment of erasmus , cent. 4. cap. 10. p. 1218. extant inter origenis opera latinè facta quaedam quorum interpres fuit hieronimus , erasmi judicio : that is , among the works of origen , some are translated into latin by jerom , in the judgment of erasmus ; and then they nam which they are , as follows . as the homilies upon jeremy , which have jerom's preface to them , the homilies upon ezekiel , the 39. homilies upon luke cum praefatione hieronymi , with jeroms preface , and ten books of origen's comments upon the romans . [ there 's that which will clear me against all mr. danver's reproaches ] cum ejusdem praefatione , with jerom's preface . i appeal now to the reader , whether i had not good authority for what i said , that according to erasmus's judgment jerom translated origen on the romans . you see from whence i had mine information , the magdeburgs affirm that both translation and preface too were jerom's , and mr. danvers knew it to be so , for in my answer i directed him to the century and page in the magdeburgensian history , from whence i had it . and therefore 't is a sorry trick , of him to slur me as he hath done in this thing , and make such an exclamation against me . what credit is to be given unto mr. wills let all men judg ! he might rather have said what credit is to be given to the magdeburgs ( and their excellent history as mr. d. calls it ) let all men judg ! for if i was deceived , they deceived me . 3. i have yet further to say , and that is that i have another to speak on my behalf , dr. hammond ( of no small note for his knowledg in antiquity , and perhaps not inferior to erasmus ) who tells us in his letters of resolution , p. 215. that though we have not origen upon the romans in greek , yet being translated by jerom , and so owned by him in his epistle to heraclius , prefixt before the commentary , we have his authority to secure us that the words [ about infant-baptism ] were origens . and let it be supposed that jerom did not translate those on the romans , and that the homilies themselves are spurious , and none of origens ; yet those on luke pass for current without controul , and there the point of infant-baptism is as fully asserted , as in the other place on the romans . against this also mr. danvers hath borrowed a scrap from mr. tombes ( who finding nothing in erasmus censures ) hath yet by good hap hit upon a word in erasmus comment on luke 1. 3. the words of erasmus are [ for so he seems to think , whosoever he was , whose commentaries are extant upon luke under the title of admantius ] which shews ( saith mr. tombes ) that erasmus took them not to be origens , or at least doubted thereof . it is very remarkable that mr tombes should spy out this passage , much more that he should comment thus upon it . for what erasmus speaks of origen upon luke , might as well be said of every book ; nor can any man say posatively these are the books written by justin martyr , or tertullian ; so that to interpret that passage of erasmus for a doubt is but a meer cavil . but that he doubted not that jerom translated origen on luke , take his own clear word for it in his censure , homil. in lucam , dubium non est quin 39 homilias in lucam verterit hieronimus , quod ipse palam in praefatione profitetur . there is no doubt to be made of it , saith he , that jerom translated the 39 homilies on luke : and if jerom translated them ( as there is no doubt according to erasmus ) then we need not doubt but he did it from the original copy of origen . judg now reader what mr. d. hath got in this business , notwithstanding all the clutter he hath kept with his boastings and defamings : we see by what is said , that we have infants-baptism owned as from the apostles by origen on luke [ whatever becomes of that on the romans , ] and translated by jerom , of which erasmus doth not in the least doubt ; so that the fabrick stands yet upright never like to be demolisht by mr. danvers , what-ever great exploits he hath done heretofore in the days of his colonelship . our last testimony is from cyprian against whom also he hath something to say , though methinks that of vossius is enough to silence all cavils , viz. that the testimony of cyprian , for infants-baptism both in his time and before , is beyond all exception . and grotius speaks to the same purpose , viz. that the epistle of cyprian to fidus maks the matter plain that there was then no doubt of infants-baptism . against this he gives in three exceptions , in his treatise of baptism , presented again in his reply ; as first , infants-baptism is not urged by cyprian for an apostolical tradition , nor upon any authority of scripture , but upon his own , and bishops arguments ; though if he should have said it was an apostolical tradition , his word , he saith , would have no more been taken than when he tells us chrysm was so . to which i replyed , in my answer , that though cyprian did not say it was apostolical ; yet it follows not he did not own it as such : yea , to put it out of doubt , the magdeburgs tell us he did own it as apostolical , cent. 1. l. 2. c. 6. p. 496. but what though the magdiburgs tell us so ( saith he ) that 's no more than if mr. wills had said it : strange ! that such venerable persons as those famous divines were , that have written such an excellent history , as mr. danvers else-where terms it , should be of no more credit with him than my self , whom he so much vilifieth ? but hath he not forgotten what he speaks just before , that cpyrian held chrysin to be an apostolical tradition ? and is it not strange ! that he should not hold the same of pedobaptism ? but whether he did or not , is not material to the point which is now before us ; for we are inquiring de facto , what was done in cyprian's time , as to the baptizing children ; not de jure , upon what ground they did it , or whether 't was esteemed apostolical : if the practice was owned 't is as much as we need to put by mr. danvers's cavil ; and that it was so , mr. tombes his great tutor , had never the face to deny , but confesseth plainly , that it was a truth , that cyprian assured fidus , that by the unanimous consent of sixty-six bishops gathered together in a council , baptism was to be administred to infants , as well as grown men . tombes examen , page 11. and since cyprian flourished in 250 according to perkins , and usher placeth him in 240 , what is become of mr. danvers proposition , that believers baptism was the only true baptism for near 300 years after christ , page . 3. of his reply ? mr. tombes himself doth lend us his helping hand to pluck down this rotten fabrick . i am not willing to let any thing pass , that may blind the weaker sort of readers , and therefore shall go on with him : if cyprian ( saith he ) should have said infants-baptism had been an apostolical tradition , his word would have been no sooner taken , than when he tells us , chrysm was so . this crambe we had in effect long since by mr. tombes in his exercitation : there were many other things ( saith he ) went under the name of a tradition , which were but meer humane inventions : what then ? ergo infant-baptism , which went under the name of a tradition , is also human invention . shall i shew ( saith mr. marshal ) the natural face of this argument in a glass ? such and such men , who went under the name of honest men , were knaves , ergo all that go under the name of honest men , are knaves : 't is true ( saith he ) many things in those days went under the name of apostolical tradition which were but humane inventions ; and 't is as true , [ as before is fully shewn ] that many points of faith went in the same ages , under the name of tradition . but to proceed , his second exception is , because it is questionable , whether there were ever such a council . this is to lay the ax to the root of the tree . but to this i answer : 1. the magdiburgs do not question it , but own it as authentick , as any of the rest of the councils , cent. 3. c. 9. p. 203. 2. mr. tombes was so wise as never to question it , in all the contest he had with mr. marshall , and others that ever i observed . but why should we question it ? why ? because ( saith he , ) there is no place mentioned where that council was kept . what if i say 't was at carthage ? no doubt mr. danvers would then give me the lye : and yet dr. featly calls it the council of carthage ; and well he might , because cyprian was bishop of that place . and for his further satisfaction , that he might not cavil against the being of this council , i reckon up in my infants-baptism divers of the ancients that make mention of it with high esteem ; as nazianzen , crysostom , [ greek fathers ] ambrose , austin , jerom , of the latines . so that i conceive mr. danvers is very perverse to question it . and as much weakness follows , in that he saith ; it was no argument , it was a decree of such a council , because so many had a good esteem of it , for the same fathers esteemed very well of chrysm , &c. but when i speak of an esteem of it , my meaning is , that they did not judg it a fictitious council , but a real one , which is obvious . i wonder mr. danvers should not apprehend it . but since he is not a man of that sagacity as i thought him , but runs on upon a falle scent , i shall leave him . a second reason of his doubt , is because the grounds brought by cyprian for infant-baptism are weak : and because i gave no answer thereto in my infant-baptism , mr. d. taxeth me , and it is one of the charges in his preface to the reply , that i am notoriously partial in my answers all the book through , replying to what i judg weak , and leaving other unanswered . whenas i profess , i let many things pass because of their weakness , and have even wearied my self out with making answers to his impertinencies . i could have given him the same answer , which mr. marshall did to mr. tombes near 30 years since , when he objected the weakness of cyprian's grounds , viz. if what cyprian spake was weighed in the ballance of his judgment , it would not be found light : and even mr. tombes himself confesseth , that jerom and austin , relyed upon that epistle for the proving of baptizing infants : which acknowledgment ( saith mr. marshall ) strengthens my opinion of the worth of cyprians grounds ; for two such eminent men would not have relyed on that which had no weight in it . but what are the weak grounds which mr. danvers mentions ? 1. because he and his council held , that baptism was simply necessary to salvation . but is not this more than mr. danvers can prove ? i do not find the magdiburgs mention it ; although mr. tombes saith , tossanus notes it for cyprian's error , that infants should be baptized ne pereant , lest they perish . 2. that it washeth away original sin , so as it is never to be imputed . this is the judgment of many learned protestant divines , especially the famous dr. davenant in his epistle speaks positively , omnes infantes baptizati , ab originalis peccati reatu absolvuntur . others are not so general , but conceive it to be a truth with respect to elect infants : and they judg they have good reason to conclude , that since they must be discharged from the guilt of original sin , or cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven , god doth apply the blood of his son to them , in the use of that ordinance of baptism . 3. because the grace of god is to be tendred to all , therefore all children should be baptized . i see no such weakness in this ; for though it be laid down in such general terms , that grace is to be tendred to all , and none hindred from coming to christ ; yet , as mr. marshal observes , what he saith , ought to be understood of the church , because he speaks of such as god hath cleansed , or purified ; and 't was concerning such , that fidus stood in need to be informed , as to the time of baptizing ; and the magdeburgs conjecture , that fidus episcopus ad cyprianum scripserat , he had written to cyprian about it . 4. because children have lesser sins than others . this is harsh : but you must know , this is mr. danvers's dress . the magdeburgs express it otherwise , thus ; si quid hominem impedire a baptismo , potius adultos , peccata sua arcere deberent , quam infantes , qui nihil peccaverunt , nisi quod ex peccato originis vitia trahant ; which is to this effect : grown persons should rather keep off from baptism by reason of their sins , than infants , which have contracted no guilt but that which is original . i hope there is no great hurt in this . 5. because in their first birth they do nothing but pray , crying , and weeping . well said mr. danvers ! the words are these ; because in their first beginning ( or birth ) crying and weeping , they can do nothing but call for mercy : which ( what ever ignorant people may think of it ) is a high strain of rhetorick in cyprian , importing only , that children are objects of mercy . 6. because the soul that is not baptized is lost . this is to the same purpose with the first : but the magdeburgs have it not , nor dr. taylor , who translates the epistle to fidus out of the greek , at the end of his consideration of the practice of the church of baptizing infants . therefore mr. danvers must find it elsewhere , or else he split the first reason into two ; cujus est dar● , ejus est disponere . there are two other things which he brings as reasons why he questions this council , which are very frivolous ; as that tertullian , cyprian's master , was against infants-baptism ; which is not so absolutely , for he was for it in danger of death : and the other is , that many things were fathered on cyprian which were none of his . if i should let but this one pass , mr. danvers would cry out against me for partiality . but , why should he fancy that this of infants-baptism , was one of those things fathered upon cyprian ? when the council is owned by the magdeburgs , the fathers greek and latine , and even by mr. tombes himself , as before . his third reason i have spoken to already , being co-incident with the latter part of his first . one thing i had almost forgotten , and that is ; whereas in my infant-baptism asserted , i tell mr. danvers , that his pretended witness tertullian was as corrupt as cyprian , and that the magdeburgs inform us that he was the first inventor of chrysm , and that cyprian belike took it up from him ; he retorts in his reply thus , that if tertullian was the first inventor of chrysm , which cyprian calls an apostolical tradition , what credit then ( saith he ) is to be given to his testimony that dare to avouch so fearful a lye ? a rude speech ! altogether unfit to be uttered against so glorious a martyr as cyprian was ; but any thing is good enough to be spoken in contempt of those who are for infant-baptism . but i assure the reader , that as there is no good manners , so neither is there truth in that passage of mr. d's : for i cannot find that cyprian held chrysm an apostolical tradition ; it being not reckon'd amongst his naevi , which after the magdeburg's account are six , and the last is , sumpsit ceremonias , ex traditionibus montani a tertulliano , consecrationem & unctionem post baptismum ; that is , he took up the ceremonies , viz. consecration and unction , ( that is , chrism ) from tertullian out of the traditions of montanus . here 's nothing of apostolical tradition . and hamelmannus shews what traditions cyprian held , that he took up the ceremonies of consecration and unction from tertullian , but not a word of calling it an apostolical tradition . there is nothing in this section more , but only that mr. danvers doth endeavour to vindicate himself from a mistake about austin's words , which i charged upon him ; but it is so intricate and dark , that i do not very well understand him . also there is some disparagement cast by him upon that blessed martyr of jesus christ , mr. philpot , and a fling against the new-england way of baptizing the children only of in-churched parents , with some other reflections which i let pass as futilous , having no mind to spend time in such small matters . chap. iii. wherein mr. danvers endeavours to vindicate his witnesses against my exceptions , and the same examined and found insufficient . 1. he begins with particular persons ; but first minds me , with my penuriousness in my preface to infants-baptism , where i allow him from the first century to the end of the twelfth only two persons against infant-baptism , viz. adrianus , and hincmarus . but what will he think of me now ? for i have denied him those two also , as before ; and have shewed the ground of the mistake why they have been looked upon under the notion of antipedobaptists . the first witness mentioned is tertullian , who ( saith mr. danvers ) opposeth it in six arguments . we shall inquire into them by and by . mr. danvers saith true , that i acknowledg tertullian hath divers passages seemingly against infants-baptism : but , according to his humor , he is catching me up before i am down : for he calls upon the reader to take notice , that his witness is owned by me . and is it not a very great owning indeed , to say , he hath divers passages that seem to be against it ? but in the 38 page of my infant baptism , i give a reason why it 's more than probable that tertullian was for infant-baptism ; in the 41 page , that he was no more against their baptizing , than of grown persons baptizing ; and in the 43 page , we shewed that the reason why he would have infants-baptism delayed , was , not because he judged it unlawful , but inexpedient ; for he was for it , rather than the child should dye unbaptized . and now i tell mr. danvers further , that as for those seeming passages against infant-baptism , they are spoken in reference to the children of pagans , not believers , according to the judgment of estius and other learned men : for ( as mr. marshal observes ) tertullian in that book of his de baptismo c. 18. speaks of the baptism of such as were not born of christian parents , and therefore desires the baptism of such infants should be deferred till they come to years , and be able to make confession of their sins , and profession of faith , their parents being infidels , and their sponsors mortal . and that this is the meaning of the place , seemed evident to him , because in the 39 chap. of his book de anima , tertullian acknowledgeth that the children of believers had a priviledg tam ex seminis praerogativa , quam ex institutionis disciplina ; a prerogative by their birth , besides that of their education . and by this time me thinks mr. danvers should be sick of his witness tertullian , as mr. marshal said to mr. tombes in the same case . as touching the reasons which tertullian urgeth for the delay of the baptism of infants , and which mr. danvers undertakes to vindicate as proper and good , against those who would make those words , suffer little children to come unto me , to be a coming to baptism , i shall only remind him with two or three things . 1. with what we have from the magdiburgs cent. 3. c. 4. p. 83. sentit tertullianus in libro de baptismo , mira opinione , pueros non tam cito baptizandos osse , atque ad illud matthaei 19. nolite parvulos prohibere &c. tertullian ( say they ) is of a strange opinion to disswade the baptizing of children by such reasons as he gives in his paraphrase upon the 19 of matthew . 2. none that ever i heard of , have brought this text of coming to christ , as a full and direct proof for baptizing of children , or have urged that the coming there was a coming to christ for baptism , who never baptized any ; nevertheless it proves two points , which lay a good foundation for infants-baptism . 1. that the kingdom of god is made up as well of infants as grown persons . 2. that infancy is no bar or exclusion of any from coming to christ and receiving a blessing . infants are capable of receiving benefit by christ , though they do not actually believe ; though they cannot lay hold on christ , yet christ can lay hold on them , and bless them . object . but baptism is not concerned in the text , except it can be made out that blessing was baptizing . to this i replyed in my former answer , that it 's true , blessing is not baptizing , but 't is something more ; and christ in blessing them , vouchsafed that to them , which usually was as an ordinance administred after baptism , and which is of an higher nature , and so we may argue from this to baptism inclusively , or à majori , from the greater to the less . 2. and further , though blessing be not baptism , yet in as much as they were of the kingdom of heaven whom he blest [ let it be meant if you will of the kingdom of glory , it supposeth that they must be first of the kingdom of grace , and were of the visible church , and so it comes all to one ] it follows , they were qualified subjects for baptism . for , grant to children a church relation ( as i have proved it is their right ) , and their right to baptism will unavoidably follow upon it . mr. danvers might have done well to have shewn us the weakness of our arguings from this text , as containing in it a good foundation for infants-baptism , instead of undertaking to vindicate tertullian's paraphrase thereon , grounded on a mistake , as if pedobaptists made the word come in the text , to be a coming to baptism . and for tertullian's reasons against childrens coming to baptism , i shall not scruple upon second thoughts , to say they are childish ones , and the magdeburgs wonder at their silliness . for , 1. ( saith he ) children cannot come till they are elder , till they know & are taught why they come ; and may not the same be as well urged against the circumcising children of old ? let them stay till they are older , till they can know what the ordinance meaneth . 2. and then for the weightiness of the ordinance , in which regard he would have them forbear ; were there not also many deep mysteries wrapt up in circumcision ? as that it was a seal of the covenant . did it not shadow forth the mortification of sin , regeneration , and redemption by the blood of christ ? and was it not a ridiculous reason which he gave why young men , and those who were newly married , and young widows should delay baptism ? namely , that the lust of concupiscence should be first extinguisht . one would rather have supposed , that the ordinance might have proved a remedy against such violent passions as they were supposed to be subject to : for the more temptation any state is obnoxious to , the more need it hath of helps , specially such as do not only lay ingagments , but contribute strength , as mr. geree speaks . most of the rest of his reasons , as our divines observe , do argue that his words for the putting off infants-baptism , are to be expounded of aliens ; as that about not giving holy things to dogs ; and that of the inconveniency by reason of the mortality of sponsors , or sureties , for in that chapter he is speaking of infidels as we have shewed before . but mr. danvers being willing to make the most of a little , will not by any means part with this witness ( such as it is ) and therefore brings in dr. barlow to confirm it , that tertullian disliked infants-baptism , as unwarrantable and irrational : but the doctor having now declared his judgment , i hope mr. danvers will for the future forbear quoting him as he hath done . then we have daille , scultetus , and the magdiburgs &c. but we have told you before , from learned men , that it is to be understood of the children of pagans ; to which we may add , the judgment of junius ( that famous expositor ) concurring with them . as for the testimony he brings from b. rhenanus of the ancient custom of baptizing those of full growth , we have spoken to it already , and shewed how grosly mr. danvers did mistake him . and for the rest of his regiment , vincentius , victor , heribertus , cresconius , fulgentius , regienses , albanus , the swermers , arnoldus , henricus , &c. we shall confer with him about these , or the most of them , very shortly ; and when this is over , he wil have no need to complain of my silence ( which he saith gives consent to the whole ) or of my unfair and disingenuous dealing . lastly , he endeavours to clear himself from some exceptions , which i have made against some of his witnesses , saying they are frivolous ; which whether it be so , i leave to the reader to judg . 1. i tell him berinus is nothing to his purpose : because it is evident that his sayings have respect to pagans : but that he conceives will not do , because berinus saith , baptism ought not to be administred to any without instruction . but i must tell mr. danvers , that bede saith no such thing , lib. 4. c. 16. nor anywhere else that i can find . indeed l. 3. c. 7. bede tells us of berinus , that britanniam perveniens , ac primum genissorum gentem ingrediens , cum omnes ibidem paganos inveniret , utilius esse ratus ibi potius verbum dei praedicare , quam ultra progrediens eos quibus praedicare deberet requirere : itaque evangelizante illo in prefata provincia , cum rex ipse catechizatus fonte baptismi cum sua gente ablueretur &c. but what is this to mr. d's . purpose ? berinus herein did as all pedobaptists would have done : and if mr. d. can gather from hence that berinus affirmed that baptism ought not to be administred to any ( be they within the church or without ) without instruction , i think he will go far beyond either t. aquinas or mr. baxter in the profoundness of his speculation , and subtilty of his distinction ; there being none , i am confident besides himself , able to perform such an undertaking . 2. next i blame him for bringing in durandus for believers baptism in opposition to that of infants , when he expresseth himself positively for infants-baptism , and most severely against the anabaptists . for this he hath nothing to excuse himself , but that durandus is in his index , but he doth not know how , put in among the witnesses . 3. i charge him with another falshood , in b●inging in the bishop of apamen among his witnesses : because , though he were for rebaptization of such as he conceived were not rightly baptized , yet was he not an anabaptist , as the word is now taken , for being against infants-baptism . of this he would excuse himself if he could , by telling us the late century-writers do call him so in a modern sense ; which is notoriously untrue . 4. i charge him for abusing peter bruis , having nothing to evidence that he denyed infants-baptism but the lying stories of abbots : but he saith he produced three or four evidences more to prove it . but i can find only two , treatise of baptism , edit . 1. in the 290 page . the first is that of the magdeburgs , cent. 12. p. 843. where they tell us nothing but what they take from cluniacensis , and so name his hypotheses , or opinions , quoting that abbot for every thing : but withal manifest their suspicion that he wronged him with an utinam vero ipsius petri scripta extarent , ex quibus multo rectius facere judicium liceret , quam ex illis , qui in defensionem pontificiarum abominationum conspirarunt : would to god the writings of peter bruis were extant , for out of them we might give a truer judgment , than from them who have conspired to defend the popish abominations . and then again ( say they ) non est certum &c. it is not certain , that they were for the rebaptization of children baptiz'd in their infancy , when they come to be of age , nam malevoli quaedam commentiti sunt , p. 836. they feign some things , & then fasten them per vitiosas consequentias , by vicious consequences . the other is osiander , & he takes it up at second hand from the magdiburgs ; & saith withal , that what peter bru●● and others are charged with , 't is from their enemies ; and 't is uncertain whether they held those things : for the papists did charge them with gross things , because they inveighed against their idolatry ; osiander cent. 12. l. 3. c. 3. and when i read these passages in the century-writers , i could not but wonder mr. danvers should have no more conscience of what he writes ; and thus go about to delude the reader , by telling him he quotes others besides those lying abbots in this matter . 5. i accuse him for traducing wickliff , he having no ground at all to say he denyed infants-baptism ; and when i discoursed with dr. barlow , i told him this story that mr. danvers confidently reports that wickliff was of their way : to which he presently said , i have wickliff by me , and could never observe any such thing in him . but how doth mr. danvers make good what he affirms of wickliff ? why , he tells us he hath produced much evidence to prove it pag. 283 : even to 289 of his treatise of baptism edit . 2. demonstrating not only that believers were the only subjects of baptism , but withal , that children were not sacramentally to be baptized . to this i replyed in the recapitulation at the end of my answer , that the name of wickliff being famous , mr. danvers would fain get somthing out of him for his turn . but i must tell mr. d. that all that he hath produced to prove wickliff against infant-baptism , is very insufficient to prove him so . his asserting , that there are only two sacraments ; and that believers are to be baptized in pure water , thô they have received the baptism of the spirit , is very insignificant to his purpose . his 3d assertion indeed is considerable , if mr. danvers can prove he ever said so , viz : that believers are the only subjects of baptism ; as appears ( sayes he ) in his 11 chap-trial : where he saith , that persons are first to be baptized with that he calls the first or insensible baptism , viz. in the blood of christ , before they are baptized in water ; without which their baptism in water profits not . one would think this was certainly so , because mr. danvers is so free as to give us wickliffs own words , which he subjoyns to his translation . but it thereby appears he hath so grosly perverted the sense , that i cannot conjecture the reason of his so doing , unless he presum'd his quoting the original would satisfie the reader he had rightly translated it , and so supersede any further examination . if that was his design 't was boldly done ; but the discovery doth not advance his reputation . for wickliff doth not say that persons are first to be baptized with the insensible baptism , as mr. d. would make us believe , but only this , that one without the other avails not to salvation . and how doth this prove believers the only subjects of baptism ? the rest of his proofs are just like these , that is , very insignificant ; because indeed wickliff was for infant-baptism , as i could plainly demonstrate from his own words . but mr. baxter hath saved me that labour , having done it so substantially already in his answer to mr. d. ( see his more proofs for infant-baptism , lately printed ) p. 354 , &c. as must needs satisfie all impartial readers , and convince mr. d. himself of his mistake , if he is not resolved to stand out against the clearest evidences : to him therefore i refer them both . but suppose wickliff had not been so very express in his words as to this point ; yet his making an apparent difference between the children of believers and others , in his saying , quod definientes , not , desinentes ( as mr. d. ) parvulos fidelium sine baptismo sacramentali , decedentes non fore salvandos in hoc presumptuosi et stolidi . and that ample testimonial which the university of oxford gave him , is enough ( if we had no more ) to confront mr. d. although he had the confidence to print them both in his treatise of baptism , from whence the reader hath ground enough to infer ( unless he first supposes wickliff considered not what he wrote , and the whole university were anabaptists ) that he was not against infants-baptism . and give mr. d. as good ground to expunge wickliff out of his index of witnesses as durandus . in the last place , he complains of another piece of injurious dealing in me , and that is for fathering so notorious a fallacy upon the reader , and abuse upon him ; because i charge him for bringing in a great bed-roll of witnesses against infants-baptism , when those men were so firmly for it , as austin , chrisostom , &c. and that mr. danvers is blame-worthy for so doing ( nowithstanding his equivocation ) appears by this : for though he would excuse himself , by saying they were not in his catalogue , yet they are found in his 7th chapter of his treatise of baptism , edit . 1. which serves to prove that believers baptism is the only true baptism ; and that i do not wrong him , let the reader judg , when he hath lookt upon the contents of the same just ▪ after the preface , as also the 56 page of the first edition chap. 7. his pretended witnesses the waldenses , found not to be against infants-baptism , but for it , and what is said to the contrary , answered . that the waldenses were against infants-baptism he labours to prove by a four-fold demonstration . ( 1 ) from their confessions of faith : ( 2 ) the witness thereto by their most eminent men : ( 3 ) from the decrees of councils , popes , and emperours , against the body of the people for the same : ( 4 ) from the footsteps thereof they have left in the several regions , and countries where they have been dispersed . to which i replyed in the first place : ( 1 ) that there are no such confessions to be found ; infants-baptism asserted p. 46. ( 2 ) that the quite contrary appears by their confessions of faith , witnessing how firmly they did assert infants-baptism , p. 40. and 64. of the same book . to both which mr. danvers makes reply , ( viz ) that it may be manifest to the reader that their confessions do exclude infants from baptism , and witha gives in a parallel betwixt what their confessions say , and what ( as he words it ) i make them to say , and so leaves it to the reader to judg , how fairly i have dealt therein ; and truly 't is my desire also that the reader compare us with the confessions , and see which of us hath dealt most fairly or foully with them . there are five confessions of the waldenses , besides some passages out of a treatise , to which mr. danvers hath recourse for information touching their faith and practice about baptism . there are two things , to be observed in us , in reference to these confessions . 1. what mr. danvers picks out of them for his purpose as he conceives . 2. whether i have offered any violation , by mangling the confessions , or leaving out any thing that is material against infants-baptism , which i desire the reader the more diligently to note , because this is another of his great charges against me in his preface . 1. the first confession that is quoted by mr. danvers in his treatise of baptism bears date 1220 , of which this is the 13 article ( viz. ) they say we acknowledg no other sacraments but baptism , and the supper of the lord. i have not left out a word of this ; and i told him in my answer , that to bring this article , was rather a witness of his own weakness than against infants-baptism , and therefore upon second thoughts this is cashier'd , for we have it not in the reply . the next is the 28 article of another confession , that god doth not only instruct us by his word , but has also ordained certain sacraments to be joyn'd with it , as a means to unite unto , and to make us partakers of his benefits , and that there be only two . in my answer , i left out the begining of this article , that is , [ that god instructs us by his word ] which i am sure containeth nothing in it against infants-baptism ; and also the latter part of the article , which runs thus [ belonging in common to all the members of the church , under the new-testament ( viz ) baptism and the lords supper . ] another ancient confession of faith hath this , artic. 7. we do believe that in the sacrament of baptism , water is the visible and external sign , which represents unto us that ( which by the invisible vertue of god operating ) is within us , the renovation of the spirit , and mortification of our members in jesus christ , by which also we are receiv'd into the holy congregation of the people of god , there professing and declaring openly our faith , and amendment of life . here was left out a parenthesis ( viz ) ( by the invisible vertue of god operating ) and the last clause , by which also we are received into the congregation &c. and with respect to this article , i have this saying in my answer , namely , that there is a harmony between all the protestant churches in the world , and the waldenses ( in this article . ) the next is out of vigniers history , where the words are thus : they expresly declare , to receive the canon of the old and new testament , and to reject all doctrines which have not their foundations in it , or are in any thing contrary to it : therefore all the traditions and ceremonies of the church of rome they condemn and abominate , saying she is a den of thieves , and the apocalyptical harlot . this confession mr. danvers hath left out in his reply , and i know not the reason , unless it be beeause i have every word of it exactly , and it would have hurt his parallel if it had been set down . in their ancient confession , artic. 11. we esteem for an abomination and antichristian , all humane inventions , as a trouble & prejudice to the liberty of the spirit . and in their ancient catechism thus ; when humane traditions are observed for gods ordinances , then is he worshipped in vain , and which is done when grace is attributed to the external ceremonies , and persons enjoyned to partake of sacraments , without faith and truth . i have also set down every word of this , and made this paraphrase on it in my answer . this is a good testimony against humane traditions , but doth not in the least touch infants-baptism , as also against the popish error , that baptism confers grace ex opere operato , from the work done : for that 's the meaning of attributing grace to the external ceremony here mentioned . in their ancient treatise concerning antichrist they say , that he attributes the regeneration of the holy-spirit unto the dead outward work of baptizing children into that faith , [ that faith was omitted ] and teaching that thereby regeneration must be had : the words are , [ baptism and regeneration , must be had ] i left out [ baptism ] because it seems to make it nonsense , as it is there placed . also the conclusion of the sentence was pretermitted , which is [ grounding therein all his christianity , which is against the holy-spirit . ] upon this article i have thus paraphrased in my answer . here at last , by good hap , we have the word children named , but not a jot serving mr. danvers his design , for they do not hereby except against childrens-baptism , but only against the corrupt ends that antichrist hath in it ; for whether it be in children or grown persons , it is an antichristian , or popish tenent , to ascribe regeneration to the dead outward work of baptism ; and this is that before mentioned , that baptism confers grace , ex opere operato . and because the waldenses did deny that it did thus conser grace , the papists , did accuse them that they denied gratiam baptismi : and for refusing to have their children baptized with the superstitious rites of salt , oyl spittle , &c. they charg'd them with denying insant-baptism . this is the judgment of bishop usher in his succession of the church , where he treats of the waldenses , and their faith at large . if i had been mistaken in my paraphrases upon the above-mentioned confessions , mr. danvers should have rectified me , and forborn the out-cry which he makes in his preface , for abusing the consessions of the waldenses ; and some that look no further into a book than the preface will suppose me to be guilty of a notorious crime . but as to this also i freely submit my self to the judgment of the reader , and refer it to his consideration , whether innocency and truth be not by him rather abused , than vindicated . he chargeth me deeply of unfaithfulness in misrepresenting their confessions in many material and considerable parts ; but i perswade my self an impartial eye cannot discern it ; but 't is easily observed how unfaithful he is at the same time in misrepresenting my words , and fathering that on me , which is not mine , but his own invention , on purpose , forsooth , that he might have a substratum for his following queries ; for he makes me to say , that there was a harmony betwixt all the protestant churches in the world , ( in those articles ) and the waldenses , because all that are for infants-baptism believe the same . had i said those words in reference to every article , it had been truth ; whereas i do only speak it with respect to one of them , and that is to the third ; and what is spoken by me , with respect to one of them , he represents as spoken of all , the better to accommodate his quibling queries . it is sad to see how much he doth abuse those confessions , how he doth wire-draw them ; as if they were homogeneal with anaxagoras his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 upon aristotle's record ; how he draws quidlibet ex quolibet , every thing out of any thing . never was any confessions in the world so prostituted to a corrupt fancy ; for thus he begins : 1. do all the pedobaptists believe that baptism and preaching the word are joyn'd together to instruct the baptized parties , and that thereby they have union with christ , and partake of his benefits ? observe how mr. danvers stumbles at the threshold , how he preverts the article . for look back upon the article , and you will find it doth not say that baptism and preaching are joyned together to instruct the baptized party ; baptism is not mentioned in the article , though it be included in the word [ sacraments ] ; afterward the article speaks thus , that we are instructed by the word , and then that god hath ordained the sacraments to be joyned with it , as a means to unite us to him . 2. do they indeed , saith he , believe the lord's supper to belong in common with baptism to all the members of the church ? why then do not infants partake of one as well as the other , since it belongs to them in common , if members of the church ? why , if mr. danvers would know the reason , it is this , because though the child has a right as a member to all the ordinances , yet he is not in a capacity to enjoy his right , thus ; that persons may have a right to ordinances , and yet in no capacity to enjoy them , appears in such as are sick , or those that lose their reason , that are church-members . 3. do paedo-baptists indeed with the waldenses believe , that water in baptism is the usual sign , representing to the subjects thereof the invisible vertues of god operating in them , ( viz. ) the renovation of the spirit , and mortification of their members ? and can it be truly said it is so to an infant that is not capable to put forth any act of faith , repentance , or mortification , or discern the least sign in the water ? yes , it may be said , it is so to an infant , very well , and that upon as good a ground , as circumcision shadowed forth mortification of sin , regeneration , though the israelitish babes understood none of this . but mr. danvers doth ill again in altering the article , as you may perceive by looking back , for it is not as he represents it : the article runs thus ; we believe that in the sacrament of baptism , water is the visible and external sign ( which represents to us ) [ not representing to the subjects ] for unless i mistake , as it is so worded , it serveth more to his purpose . 4. we agree with the waldenses in the 4th article ; for we have told mr. danvers formerly that baptism it self is a real , though implicit , profession of faith , and the express verbal confession of the parent is reputed by god to be the childs , and so it was under the law , when the parents humbled themselves , and confessed their sins , and brought their little ones with them , even they also are said to be humbled before the lord. 5. the 5th query is precarious , taking that for granted , which we utterly deny , and that is , that the baptizing children , is an antichristian humane invention . 6. do they believe , saith mr. danvers , that antichrist grounds all christianity , and religion in the baptizing of children , attributing regeneration to the outward work done contrary to the holy-spirit , why then , saith he , do they baptize children , which as acknowledged is the basis and foundation of the false church , and contrary to the spirit , and for which there is nothing but the doctrine of popes , and antichristian councils , to warrant it ? not to say any thing of these unworthy reflections , let the reader once more take notice how he hath also perverted this article , look back , and you will see what a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 he makes of it , and metamorphoseth the article into another thing ; for do but observe , ( 1. ) they do not say antichrist grounds all christianity in baptizing children ; but if they had spoken it , it had not been against infants-baptism , but against placing too much in it . ( 2. ) they say antichrist attributes regeneration to the dead outward work of baptizing children , and that regeneration must be had thereby , and herein they say , he grounds all christianity . ( 3. ) it is extreamly scandalous and false for mr. danvers to say , that there is nothing for infants-baptism , but the decrees of popes and antichristian councils , when we have so fully proved the use of it some hundreds of years before the coming of the pope , in the sense that the word is commonly taken , ( viz. ) for oecumenical bishop , challenging to himself , and usurping authority over the whole church : have we not before told him , of cyprian , and nazianzen , and chrysostom , &c. and was there not a canon for it in the milevitan council , and that before the pope came in , or any of his decrees ? so that now , upon consideration of the premises , i suppose the unprejudiced reader may be confirmed that the waldenses were for infant-baptism , by those very confessions which mr. danvers cites against it ▪ we shall now give you some account of some of their confessions , which speak them expresly for it . there is an ancient confession that we meet with in dr. ushers succession of the church . c. 8. p. 242. made by the waldenses about the year 1176. as he takes it from jacobus gretserus his proleg . in script . edit . contra waldenses . c. 1. and hovenden's annal. fol. 329. the words are , nos credimus unum deum trinum & unum patrem , & filium , & spiritum sanctum , &c. and in the body of the confession there is this article , credimus parvulos salvari per baptismum , we believe children are saved by baptism : which though it speak error according to the darkness of those times , being about five hundred years since ; yet it proves they were for infant-baptism , for gretserus saith they were waldenses that made this confession , and not as is falsly suggested , that it was the inquisitors confession ; for it was made before the inquisitors , to purge themselves from the arrian and manichean heresies , of which they were accused . another confession , is that published by balthazar lydias , which was presented to uladislaus king of hungary , where after they have given an account of their faith in other points , they come to that of baptism , and having spoken of adult baptism , they add , professio ista nostra etiam in pueros extenditur , our profession concerning baptism extends also to children , but against this mr. danvers objects , that this confession said to be made by the waldenses in bohemia to king uladislaus , were not waldenses , as they themselves acknowledg in the preamble . and further tells us out of osiander , that they were a mixt people of calextines that separated from rome in the business of the cup : hussites that went further than they ; thaborites that were more thorow for reformation , and under these were comprehended the brethren , or picards , many of whom did oppose infants-baptism , whereas dr. burigenus that writ their apology speaks otherwise , and gives this title to it , apologia verae doctrinae eorum , qui vulgò appellantur waldenses , vel picardi , qui retinuerunt johannis hus doctrinam ; ( i. e. ) the apology of the true doctrine of those , who are commonly called waldenses or picards , who have retained the doctrine of john hus : so that this differs quite from the tale which mr. d. hath told us again and again . and whereas he speaks of the title of the confession , whereby it appears they disclaim'd the denomination of waldenses , he might have done well to have quoted some authour where we might find it : but in defect thereof , i shall bring you an author , that gives the title without any hint thereof , and that is orthuinus gratius in fasciculo rerum expetendarum , &c. thus. nos homines depressi ac vestrae majestati humiliter subjecti , contemptibili quoque nomine amicti , &c. burigenus that translated into latin their confession from a bohemian copy , mentions this article concerning baptism , iam baptismus christi aeque ad pueros , qui ex fide illi offeruntur & consecrantur , atquè ad adultos attinet : the baptism of christ doth as well belong to children , who are offer'd up in faith , and consecrated to him , as unto grown persons . in the history of the waldenses lib. 1. c. 4. p. 15. so cent. 6. p. 43. the waldenses purge themselves from the charge of denying infants-baptism , and shew the reason why for a long time they forbore it , namely , because they could not endure to have it done in the corrupt popish way : and in the third part of the aforesaid history , we have their doctrine set down thus ; and whereas baptism is administred in a full congregation , and for this cause it is that we present our children in baptism , which they ought to do to whom the children are nearest , as parents . but mr. danvers objects against the confessions of provence , so full to the point , that they were in a declining condition , that some of them went to mass : what then ? were they against infant-baptism before they declin'd ? and did they take up the practice with the mass ? i believe mr. danvers doth not think it : and he knows very well they recovered out of this apostacy , after they had received those godly admonitions from oecolampadius and bucer , and were confirmed in the truth , and gave proof thereof by their sufferings , in the violent persecution , which happened soon after , and was more raging than ever . there is one confession more which mr. danvers's invention will not serve him to say any thing against , and therefore silently pretermits it , and it is that of angrogne in the year 1535. where an assembly of the waldenses , from all the valleys met , and there they signified what they understood of their brethren of provence and dauphine , namely , that they sent into germany their pastors , to confer with oecolampadius and bucer touching the belief they had time out of mind , where saith perin in his history of the waldenses lib. 2. cap. 4. pag. 57. when they had read certain letters of encouragement sent from oecolampadius to those of provence , concluded on certain articles as being conformable to the doctrine which hath been taught from father to son for these many hundred years out of the word of god : and art. 17 is for infants-baptism , thus , touching thematter of the sacrament it hath been concluded by the h. scriptures that we have two sacramental signs , the which christ jesus hath left unto us , the one is baptism , the other the eucharist , which we receive to shew what our perservance in the faith is , as we have promised when we were baptized being little ones . this expression , as we have promised when we were baptized being little ones , mr. danvers tells us , 2d ed. pag. 313. is foisted into the article , though impertinent and nonsensical , because an infant is not capable to make a promise . but i don't judg mr. danvers the fittest in the world to determine what is impertinent and nonsensical . and as wise-men as he , or any of his party , have affirm'd the same , and therefore that doth not prove it to be foisted in . for instance , the assembly in their larger catechism tell us , that , baptism is a sacrament , &c. whereby the parties baptized are solemnly admitted into the visible church , and enter into an open and professed engagement , to be wholy and only the lords . and in their very next answer , tell us , the infants of believers are to be baptized . and dr. manton in the supplement to the morning exercise serm. 10. tells us , that baptism is an open and real profession of christ crucified , and that we must personally and solemnly own the covenant made with god in infancy . and many more i could produce , if need were , speaking ▪ after this manner ; that yet understood themselves as well as mr. danvers . and why may we not suppose these waldenses to be guilty of as much impertinency and nonsensicalness as the assembly and dr. manton ? 2. his 2d . demonstration ( as he calls it ) is from particular eminent persons amongst them , which he would have us believe deny'd infants-baptism . as berengarius in the 11th . cent. peter bruis , henricus , and arnoldus in the 12th . 1. for berengarius he goes about to prove that he denied infant-baptism from lanifrank , by cassander out of guitmond , by a council called by h. 1. of france , and by thuanus , and then saith , that i except against none of these , but have this only for a reply , that there were several councils in which berengarius was persecuted for the real presence , but no mention made of his denying infants-baptism . seeing this general reply doth not give mr. danvers satisfaction , i shall now be more particular ; and convince him he had better have taken that answer , than thus forced me to a more particular examination ; by which i have made a further discovery of his guilt in abusing authors . he begins with launifrank to prove beringarius against infant-baptism , and he tells us ( 2. ed. p. 241 , 242 ) out of the magdeb. cent. 11. cap. 5. p. 240 , 243. [ that beringarius did publickly deny transubstantiation , and infant-baptism under five heads ; which launifrank in his book called scintillaris answered at large . and as for his denying infant-baptism , he answers ( that is , launifrank ) by saying , he ( that is , beringarius ) doth thereby oppose the general doctrine and universal consent of the church . ] and this is all mr. danvers hath from launifrank to prove beringarius against infant-baptism . but this is a shameful mistake , and the magdeburgs say no such thing . they give us his hypotheses de caenâ domini : and his 6th argument against transubstantiation , and launifrank's answers to each : and tell us that ad quintum & sextum , ( that is to beringarius his 5th and 6th arguments against transubstantiation , ( not against infant-baptism ) launifrank answers , opposuit doctrinam perpetuam & consentientem ecclesiae dei : so that this authority is quite cashier'd ; and mr. danvers must have an unparallel'd confidence to attempt the retrieving him . the next is cassander out of guitmundus , who saith , that with the real presence , he denied baptism to little-ones , though the latter not so publickly as the former : but guitmund and cassander say , quem tamen errorem in publicum non produxit ; that is , he never publickly denied infant-baptism . mr. d. translates it not [ so ] publickly , because else it might be presently queried , how then could guitmund tell ? and rather than lay such a stumbling-block in the way , he thinks it expedient to make bold with his authors , and abuse them , than by telling truth , undeceive his reader . this might be a sufficient answer ; but to give mr. d. fuller satisfaction , i shall make a more particular inquiry into this business . and as for guitmundus the magdeburgs tell us , ait eum ( beringarium ) de baptismo infan : & de conjugio non recte docuisse . which proves him as much against marriage as against infant-baptism . but bp. usher tells us in his book de successione , cap. 7. § 37. that deoduinas leodiensis , took it upon common fame that bruno and beringarius did quantum in ipsis erat baptismum parvulorum evertere . and adds , deinde ex leodiensis fide refert guitmundus , so that guitmundus took it from leodiensis , who had it from common fame ; which indeed arose from their denying it to be necessary to salvation . as clearly appears , by walden , charging wickliff to deny it , who yet was so positive in the point as mr. baxter hath proved . and usher also tells us that , in tot synodis adversus beringarium habitis nullam de anabaptismo litem illi intentatam invenimus . which further proves it . and whereas mr. danvers insinuates ( 2 ed. pag. 243 , 244. ) that beringarius recants this opinion against infant-baptism , and then recanted his recantation ; there is not a word of infant-baptism in his recantation . he produceth also thuanus to prove beringarius and his followers were great asserters of baptism after faith ( 2. edit . pag. 73. ) and in his reply pag. 116. he quotes his preface to his history to prove that the arch-bishop of triers did persecute the beringarians for denying infant-baptism ; it is true he tells us that the arch-bishop did eos diocesi sua expellere , because illius doctrinam populis disseminarent ; but that thuanus should say he did it because they denyed infant-baptism , is one of mr. danvers's mistakes , there being not the least syllable of any such thing in that preface , or in the whole history that i can find . his last evidence to prove it , is a council called by h. 1. of france , to suppress the heresies of bruno and beringarius for denying transubstantiation and infant-baptism : for which he quotes bibliotheca patrum pag. 432. but i can't find either in bibl. pat. or the councils , or any where else , ( but in mr. danvers's book ) that that council ever charged beringarius with denying infant-baptism . let mr. danvers prove it if he can . and just after this rate doth he prove his matters . but suppose these authors had affirmed what mr. d. would make us beleive they did , yet it falls short of sufficient proof because the same sort of men charged luther and calvin to be against infants-baptism , and this we have acknowledged from mr. danvers's own pen in his innocency and truth vindidicated , p. 127. the next of his witnesses are peter bruis , henricus , arnoldus ; but of this i have spoken already that even the magdiburgs and osiander ( who relates what peter cluniacensis and bernard say of them ) do question the truth of what their wicked adversaries lay to their charge , to which i refer the reader , and shall only add what mr. marshall says to mr. tombes : the truth is , saith he , these two men did for 20 years together so much spread the doctrine of the waldenses , and so plague the bishops mitre , and the monks bellies , that i wonder not though they charged any thing upon them , that might make them odious to the people . he that reads the railing book of cluniacensis will find , that he acknowledgeth most of what he layeth to their charge to be upon the report of others : he lays this to their charge , that children that die before they could actually believe were damn'd , and that they did not altogether believe the apostles , prophets , no nor christ himself . by their corrupt consequences , say the magdiburgs , they would make them hold any thing , as before ; to deny chrisme , and oyl , and spittle in the baptizing of children was all one with them . and if mr. danvers believes cluniacensis did slander them in the other things , he must excuse us if we believe he did also in this about infant-baptism : one thing i shall mind the reader with , and so pass on , and that is , the good intelligence mr. danvers holds , since almost all the testimonies that he brings through-out all his book , are borrowed either from monks , abbots , jesuits , inquisitors , or some cankered popish priests that make no conscience of loading the professors of the truth with all manner of calumnies . but , saith he , cassander witnesseth the same in his epistle to the duke of cleave ( viz. ) that peter bruis , and henricus denyed baptism to little ones , affirming that only the adult should be baptized . 't is true , he saith so : and withal tells us [ cum baptismo & fide etiam salutem et regnum dei infantibus ademerunt , quod ad credentes tantum et baptizatos pertinere sensuerunt ] with baptism and faith they took salvation also from infants , as judging it belonged only to believers that were baptized : but how comes cassander by this good intelligence ? why , the abbot of cluni told him so ; and if mr. danvers will not believe they damned all infants , though the abbot affirms it , why should we believe they denyed them baptism for which he can produce no better proof ? but if cassander is a person of such credit with mr. danvers , i hope he will no longer reckon peter bruis and henricus among the waldensian barbes ; because he tells us in this very epistle , that the waldenses were for infants-baptism . dr. prideaux is also introduced to confirm it , how that they were condemned in the second lateran council , for rejecting infants-baptism : it is common for the popish councils to condemn men for that which they never held . but mr. baxter tells us there is not the least proof of any such matter medled with in that council . i let pass also vice-comes , because he writes palpable lyes ; how that luther , calvin , beza , denyed infants-baptism ; and why ? because ( as mr. danvers say's truly in his reply , page 127 ) they did oppose and neglect to do it as the church of rome ordained it , without the ceremonies of their church , which was all one to them , as if it was not practised at all . we are much engaged to mr. danvers for this , he hath as it were spoken all in a word , given us a key to open the mystery of the business , and rightly to understand why beringarius , peter bruis , arnoldus , were charged for denying infants-baptism . i must now prepare my self with patience , for mr. danvers is come to his paroxysme , and would even move a stoick . i perceive he is strangely transported with passion , and makes proclamation against me . know , saith he , that hence you have a further discovery of his unfaithfulness , and want of conscience , for daring thus to abuse the world with a cheat , and that which he knows to be a mere forgery of his own — the flame is not yet extinguished , but spreads into two pages more , and is rather increased . he hath injuriously belyed osiander , belyed cluniacensis , belyed peter bruis , belyed the truth , which by this forgery he would cover ; abused the world , belyed and abused me , and much to be feared his own conscience , by this piece of folly and falshood . now what shall i say to all this ? shall i implore an increpation from above , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ? jude 14. or shall i bespeak mr. danvers in the language of craesus to solon in lucian's dialogues 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 good words o man ? would any one have expected such polluted feet of clay , with which he kicks at me , should be attendants to that head of gold , i mean those christian words in mr. danvers's preface , i will not render railing for railing , it being ever judg'd the sign of a bad cause , for persons to betake themselves to such courses , and thereby supply the want of matter with , rage , clamour and noise . who would not have judg'd mr. d. by those lines a person able to command his passion , yea a second moses ? parsons the jesuit , notwithstanding he wanted nothing but a glass to view the effigies of a railer , yet he censureth the practice as unworthy . but to speak something for vindication from these foul , and shamefully-invective accusations : first , i confess my inadvertency in mistaking the century , and from hence it was that i related things , charged upon the albigenses of the 12 cent. and applyed them to peter bruis , and henricus of the 11th ( though i find all of them joyned together by the magdiburgs under cent. 12th . ) the occasion of this mistake was a cursory reading of dr. homes his answer to mr. tombes ( the book being lent only for a day or two ) where the said doctor reckons up about 20 errors charg'd upon the albigenses , as he hath it from osiander . i profess , that i speak the truth , i had no design to misrepresent mr. danvers's pretended witnesses , and to cast a slur upon it ; and i hope this is enough to satisfie the ingenuous reader , and may also work some conviction in mr. danvers of his uncharitableness of spirit , and the intemperancy of his pen in such frequent judgings of my heart and conscience , that i did knowingly and out of design , go about to deceive the reader : and what should tempt me hereunto ? was it to cast dirt on his witness ? how blind a thing is prejudice ! mr. danvers is not ignorant , that if that ▪ had been my aim , i might have furnished my self with sufficiency of that nature even from cluniacensis and bernard : but he saith , i did it knowingly and went on purpose to deceive ; why so ? because i picked only five particulars out of those twenty articles that were laid to the charge of the albigenses : a convincing argument ! no doubt , though no body can fathom the mystery of the policy in so doing , unless i open it , which plainly is this . the reason why i transcribed no more out of dr. homes was , because i do not judg it commendable to write whole pages and more out of authors , and to conceal their names , as mr. danvers useth to do ( 2 ) it was done out of design , as he saith , because i knew osiander saith , these things are not reported by cluniacensis and bernard , but by others ; whereas i never read those things in osiander , until mr. danvers's reply came forth . ( 3 ) it must be so he concludes , because i neither mention century , book chapter , or page ( for the greater blind no doubt ) as he saith i use to do in other quotations out of osiander ; whereas i have not mentioned , so much as one chapter or page out of osiander in all my answer to him . thus reader , thou see'st what this mighty charge amounts to , and which is one of these heinous crimes i have committed , mentioned in the preface to work prejudice against me : and if i were now given to revenge , i could presently ballance accounts . he knows i have advantage enough against him for that shameful mistake of his in saying calvin interprets that promise gen. 17. 7. to be understood of the spiritual seed of abraham , when it was estius the jesuit , and calvin doth most expresly say the contrary ( viz ) that 't is meant of the fleshly and natural seed ; and estius declares his judgment against him . and if i were addicted to such billings-gate language , i could retort upon him ; he belyes calvin , he belyes the truth , which by that forgery he would cover and hide , he abuseth the world with a cheat , and much more fear his own conscience by this piece of folly and falshood . 3. as for his 3d demonstration , that the waldenses were against infants-baptism , fetcht from the catholique emperours , and popes councils , and the rest of the tribe that follows , monkes , abbots , inquisitors , i shall believe it as much as that of vice-comes , who saith not only peter bruis &c. was against infants-baptism , but also calvin , luther ; nor will that serve mr. danvers turn to tell us that they were so reputed , because they did oppose , and neglect to baptize children as the church of rome ordained and practised , unless he can give us some assurance that the waldenses were not accused and condemned by these councils upon the same account . moreover he tells us , rainerius the inquisitor in his book contra waldenses , saith , de baptismo dicunt quod ablutio quae datur infantibus nihil prosit , &c. concerning baptism they say that that which is given to little ones profits nothing . and this evidence mr. danvers would have noted , because i do positively deny , that rainerius in the catalogue of their errors gives the least hint of any such thing , that they denyed infants-baptism . this is another of his great charges against me in his preface , where he saith rainerius tells us totidem verbis ( i e ) in so many words they denyed it . for vindication of my self , let the reader ( 1 ) know , that in my infants-baptism asserted p. 96. i quote dr. featly's roma ruens for what i have said ; who gives us a catalogue of the errors which rainerius charged the waldenses with in his book contra waldenses , chap. 4. and this of denying infants-baptism is not amongst those which he recites . ( 2 ) i must tell mr. danvers that the words he quotes don 't prove , rainerius charges them with denying infants baptism , for by nihil prosit , they intend only ad salutem . but can mr. danvers find any-where in rainerius where he positively saith , the waldenses were against the practice of baptizing infants ? this i confess would be something to his purpose ; but till then i perswade my self the impartial reader will acquit me from having abused this author , though mr. danvers will not . next he brings favin the french-chronologer testifying that in those times ( viz ) 12 and 13 centuries the albigenses did deny infants-baptism esteeming it superstitionus ; no doubt as we have often made appear , their refusing those superstitious additions of chrism , oyle , spittle , annexed to the sacrament by the papists , is the ground why they are by all popish writers represented to deny infants-baptism . those two abbots cluniacensis and bernard of the 12 cent. gave favin this information ; but osiander says well , hi autem articuli petro bruis ab adversariis adscribuntur ; the articles were charged by adversaries : and then he adds , whether those tenents were theirs , or no , non satis certum est , it is not enough certain . we are now come to another of mr. danvers's charges , which will appear to be a strange mistake ; so that i may truly say of him , if he cannot find a hole he will make one , to his own shame . in his calumniating preface he falsly represents me to have quoted vice-comes , to prove that the doctrine of opposing the baptizing infants of believers , was no ancienter than the anabaptists of germany , and to make this good , he ( with great confidence ) turns the reader to page 60. of my infants-baptism asserted , as if he should be sure to find it there : whereas any body that will but peruse the page shall see , i quote vice-comes to shew what a false account he gives of luther , calvin , beza , as if they denied infants-baptism ; and besides , his name is only in one place , in the margent of my book , and that borrowed from mr. marshal , who also quotes him for the same end , as is signified ( viz. ) to shew what little credit is to be given to proofs from popish-writers against the waldenses for denying infants-baptism , when they are so impudent , as to charge luther , and calvin with the same ; who , ( saith he ) did in a special manner oppose this error , and then he concludes thus : unless some one dothout of their own confessions give better evidence , i shall believe that this doctrine of opposing of the baptizing of the infants of believers is an innovation no ancienter than the anabaptists of germany . and now let any man judge whether mr. danvers doth not deal very unworthily , in accusing me , that i have abused the reader by a quotation from vice-comes . but how can the opposing the baptizing the infants of believers be an innovation no ancienter than the anabaptists of germany when we are otherwise informed by vice-comes in the same place where he accuseth luther , calvin , beza , for being anabaptists . for vincentius , victor ( two witnesses made of one mans name ) hincmarus of laudum , the henerici and apostolici ( in bernard and cluniacensis time ) john wickliff in his 4th book of trialog . walfrid , strabo , ( another dichotomic making two of one man , an excellent way to encrease the number of mr. danvers's witnesses ) ludovicus vives witnessed against it . in answer to these ; as for vincentius victor i shall presently shew when i speak of the donatists , that he was not against infants-baptism . for hincmarus of laudum , we have more than once vindicated him from this blot : the same we have done in the behalf of the henricians , or waldenses . and for wickliff we have brought sufficient evidence to satisfie any rational man , that he is so far from speaking a word in derogation of infants-baptism , that he is expresly for it . as for strabo he was highly for infant-baptism , and therefore when he saith none were anciently baptized , but those who could profess their faith , he intended only none that were adult : but however we have given sufficient reason , why his word is not to be taken , being a false historian and a heedless writer , condemned by vossius , and others . lastly , for ludovicus vives , who is yoked to the former , hear what mr. marshal speaks of them both . must we ( saith he ) take the bare word of vives , a man of yesterday , or of strabo in matters of fact , in things done so many hundred years before they were born ? and that against the express witness of so many worthy men , who lived a hundred years before them ? and i conceive he speaks to the purpose . for any indifferent man will acknowledg , that austin ( who saith the church always had , and always held infant-baptism ) was more likely to know what was done in the primitive times , than strabo , who lived 400 years remoter from them , or than ludovicus vives that was above a thousand years further off from the times of which he witnesseth , than that ancient father was . 4. in the last place he attempts to prove the waldenses denyed infants-baptism , by the foot-steps found thereof , in those respective regions and places where they had heretofore imprinted it , as germany , switzerland , flanders , holland , bohemia , hungaria , transylvania , poland , england , &c. but as to this , i said in my infants-baptism asserted , that for mr. danvers to tell us that the opposers of infants-baptism , in upper and lower germany , ( and in those other countries ) were the remains of those the waldenses had before instructed , was his own private conceit , forreign to all history and hath no foundation in reason or truth ; and whether i have not ground for that assertion , let the reader judg , when he hath perused what i have written in my book from page 69 , to 112. to most of which mr. danvers saith nothing at all , and therefore i conceive he is drain'd dry ; only 't is true he persists in his former endeavours to palliate the horrid actings of the german anabaptists , and asperseth me for my reflections upon the story of thomas munzer , and john of leyden . lastly he presents us with further testimony from a novel peice the dutch martyrology , that the waldenses and albigenses , were against infants-baptism ; concerning which i only say : 1. that herein mr. danvers produceth more testimony than the university of oxford doth afford ; for this book is not to be found in the publick or private libraries , or the booksellers shops . 2. it being it seems not yet translated into the english-tongue , though he hopes it may be in good time ; if i could have met with it , i should not have understood , whether he relates things truly for want of an interpreter . 3. therefore we must take mr. danvers's word for all ; both that there is such a book , and that the passages he presents us with from thence , are truly translated . 4. we dare not say of it , as the papists do of mr. foxe's book of martyrs , that it is a book of lyes ; but this we say with confidence , that divers of those testimonies mr. danvers takes from thence , are notorious untruths ; and that jacob merning and sebastian franck , are not to be credited having abused the world with such palpable falsehoods : neither is twisk ( another of them ) found to be a true chronologer , all which we shall suddenly make appear , when we come to shew their aberrations . 5. yea , some are of opinion that this dutch martyrologie wherein we have such a collection of pretended martyrs for anabaptism , is designedly calculated for the meridian of anabaptistery , which whether it be probable , i leave to the reader to judge , when he hath pondred the meaning of one passage , which mr. danvers hath quoted in his treatise of baptism , edit . 2. p. 232. ( viz. ) sebastian frank ( one of the principal authors frequently named in the martyrologie ) saith , that about the year 610 childrens-baptism was held in many places , of little esteem , by the learned endeavours of adrianus , and others , and therefore the popes set themselves to uphold it by the braceren-council : that the vanity and falshood hereof may appear , let it be considered . 1. that there is nothing of adrianus extant against infants-baptism , in the century-writers ; but only the magdeburgs say , he was complained against by gregory , to john bishop of larissa , that he turned away young children from baptism : but we have shewn before , that he was not against their baptism , but only remiss in looking after the same in his diocess ; so that many children died unbaptized , which was then judged dangerous , and from hence he was reported to have turned them away from baptism . 2. there is none else in this age , so much as suspected against the baptism of children , mentioned by the century-writers ; and how grosly then is it said , of sebastian frank , that the practice thereof was of little esteem in this century ? 3. how weakly and falsly , is that said that the popes set themselves to uphold infant-baptism in the braceren council [ in the 7th century ] because it was of so little esteem when the magdeburgs make mention of so many for it in this century ? as maxentius gregory , and bishop of larissa ; else gregory would not have complained to him about adrianus : and besides particular persons they mention the council of matiscons , 3 canon for it , cent. 6. c. 9. p. 613. and by this we see what a false historian sebastian frank is , and jacob merning , whom mr. danvers brings as avouching the same , quoting the 204 pag. of the dutch martryology for it . and as for sebastian frank , osiander cent. 16 p. 121. tells us in plain terms , he was a ringleader of the anabaptists , from whom his followers were called frankists ; and they taught , omnia in sacris literis incerta , dubia , & contradictoria esse ; that is , all things in the holy scriptures are uncertain , doubtful , and contradictory , which is a most horrid blaspheming of the holy scriptures ; but may be true when applyed to his own history . having thus found these dutch authors so tardy , we shall leave them for the present , and conclude with what we find related from our own country-man , the famous bishop usher , in his succession of the church , chap. 7. sect. 23. p. 196. being a saying of windelstinus , qui hodie dicuntur protestantes , novi sunt waldenses ; they who at this day , are called protestants , are new waldenses , which is confirmed by another saying of poplinerus , who tells us , that albigensium religionem parum admodum ab ea discrepasse , quam hodie profitentur protestantes , &c. the religion of the albigenses doth very little differ from that which the protestants at this day profess ; as appears by the fragments and monuments of history written in their ancient language ; and then he further saith , that it appears by very ancient manuscripts , that their articles of faith are doctrinae protestantium usquequaque conformes . tout conformez a ceux des protestans , altogether agreeing with the protestants , usher succession , chap. 10. sect. 19. p. 308. mr. danvers's pretended witness born by the donatists against infants-baptism confuted . mr. danvers is full of complaints of the great injuries he hath received ; and amongst others this is one , that i tell him he hath nothing in his treatise of baptism , to prove that the donatists were against infants-baptism , but his ipse dixit ; whereas he saith he hath given us divers authorities for it . and the reason of my saying so , was , because the magdeburgs that do in a particular manner set before us what the donatists held from point to point , do not charge them with antipedobaptism ; nor do any of the church-historians , eusebius , socrates , theodoret , sozomen , or evagrius , mention it . neither do any of our modern writers give any hint of it . further i told him in my answer that danaeus ( who gives us the sum of their tenents , and of all austin's disputes with them , in his opusculum ) mentions not one word of their denying infants-baptism . neither doth zanchy who treats of them , and shews what they held in divers places of his works , nor mr fox in his act. and mon. nor mr. clark in his martyrology ( where there 's a great story of them ) speak any thing of their being against infants-baptism ; no nor any other that ever i could hear of , but only mr. danvers , and therefore i said as i did . and if our antagonist had not been extremely tenacious of his opinion , this had been ( as is conceived ) enough to have taken him off from his mistaken conceit . but all the thanks i have for endeavouring to rectifie him , is still more and more reproaches . mr. wills , saith he , deals according to his wonted manner very disingenuously with me ; but wherein i pray ? 1. that i , saith he , having given so many authorities and of such antiquity to prove it , he yet tells me [ as before . ] to which i answer ; i must needs say the same still , being not in the least convinced by mr. danvers's reply . for whereas he saith he hath given many authorities and of great antiquity , to prove it ; most of them mentioned not only in the treatise but reply , are but of yesterday . viz. seb. frank , jac. merning , and twisk , ( if i mistake not , three german anabaptists ) vicecomes , spanhemius , osiander , fuller , and bullinger . as for the three first , it is sufficient to say concerning them , istis authoribus non stamus , we own them not ; because they speak falsly in many things , and that which none of the ancient writers do affirm . as for instance , mr. danvers tells us , seb. frank , and twisk , affirm that donatus taught that no infant should be baptized , but only those that believed and desired it , which is false ; and neither they nor mr. danvers can prove it out of austin or any ancient writer . but suppose donatus himself had been against infant-baptism ; yet una hirundo non facit ver ; one swallow doth not make a spring ; it will not follow that the rest of the donatists were so likewise ; no more than because mr. tombes the head of the anabaptists doth conform , therefore all the anabaptists of england do conform . again , jac. merning saith , that cresconius opposed austin in that point , viz. of infants-baptism . but in the whole dispute between austin and cresconius , i can find nothing like it . and vicecomes is as false as them ; for he tells us , luther , calvin , beza , &c. were all of them against infants-baptism ; and that fulgentius a learned donatist did deny , ( if mr. danvers mistakes him not ) infants-baptism , and asserts only that which was after faith. whereas fulgentius himself ( de fide ad petrum cap. 30. ) expresly tells us , that baptism is sufficient to take away original sin from infants ; and mr. danvers hath so branded spanhemius ( in his reply , ) as a very partial and unfaithful writer , one guilty of lying fictions and chimeras , that 't is strange to me he should produce him . and what do osiander , fuller and bullinger say ? why , that the donatists and our modern anabaptists were all one . but do they say in all things ? i have already told mr. danvers that they were one in regard of their concurrence in very many things , and drew the paralel between them . and we say denominatio sumitur a majori . and indeed the rigid anabaptist does symbolize with the donvtists in nothing more than in confining the church of christ to their party , so no true church out of mr. danvers's party . and if we will not renounce infants-baptism and be dipt after their way , he bids defiance to all overtures of union and communion ; for he saith in his preface to his treatise of baptism , that whilst such a foundation of antichrist is held fast , all exhortations to union , viz. in church-fellowship and communion , will signifie little . his other authorities i confess are more significant to wit ; austin , tho. walden , eckbertus and emerieus ; and therefore i shall a little examine his quotations out of them . ( 1 ) he tells us , reply 134 [ that austin against the donatists , tom. 7. l. 3 , 4. c. 23. doth with much zeal and fury manage the argument for infants-baptism against them , bitterly cursing them that oppose it . ] but i cannot find that austin takes the least notice of infant-baptism throughout the whole 3d book ; wherein yet ( if mr. d. may be believed ) he manages that argument with much zeal and fury : nor in the 4th book , till he comes to the 23d chap. and there ( as mr. baxter hath already informed him ) he is so far from controverting infants-baptism with the donatists , that he makes use of it as a medium in his arguing against them . ( 2. ) he tells us , that austin in his epistle to marcellus ( it should be marcellinus ) tom. 7. c. 6. p. 724. opposed himself against them ( the donatists ) for denying infants-baptism . a great mistake ! for all he saith of marcellinus there as touthing infant-baptism , is this , viz. octavum errorem fuisse de infantibus , qui priusquam renascantur in christo praeveniuntur occiduo , scriptum esse , raptus est ne malitia illius intellectum mutaret . sap. 4. that is , his eight error was concerning infants that dye before they were baptized , that they were taken away lest malice should change [ corrupt ] their understanding , quoting the 4. wisdom in the apochrypha for it . and let the reader judg whether this is to deny infant-baptism . ( 3. ) he tells us that austin and walden do both affirm , that vincentius victor a donatist , denied baptism to little ones : austin in his third book de anima c. 14. and walden in his book de sacrament . tit. 5. c. 33. fol. 118. as for austin , there is not the least syllable to be found of any such matter in that 14 chap. nay , so far is austin from charging vin. victor with denying infant-baptism , that in the preceding chapter he tells you , his opinion was that only those infants that dyed baptized went immediately to heaven ; and as for others , they continued in paradise till the last resurrection , and were not till then admitted to the happiness of heaven . haec verba tua sunt ( saith austin to vincentius ) ubi te confiteris consentire dicenti , quibusdam non baptizatis sic temporarie collatum esse paradisum ut supersit illis in resurrectione praemium regni caelorum , contra sententiam principalem , qua constitutum est non intraturum in illud regnum qui non renatus fuerit ex aqua & spiritu sancto . quam sententiam principalem timens violare pelagius , nec illos sine baptismo in regnum caelorum credidit intraturos quos non credidit reos . tu autem & originalis peccati reos parvulos confiteris , & tamen eos sine lavacro regenerationis absolvis , & in paradisum mittis , & postea etiam regnum caelorum intrare permittis . and walden ( in the place mr. d. quotes ) saith the same directly . vincentius dixit eos ( scil . infantes ) trahere originale peceatum , sine baptismo tamen duci posse in regnum caelorum in resurrectione finali . as for eckbertus the monk and emericus , i can find no such matter in the magdeb. that they likned the waldenses in the 12 cent. to the donatists . and yet i deny not , but it might be so , because , as perin saith , the popish priests did reproach them with the odious name of cathari , because they prest after purity ; by which name the donatists were heretofore called , because they held a sinless state of perfection attainable in this life . and this may serve as a sufficient answer also to mr. d's . last argument to prove the donatists against infant-baptism , because they and the novatians were the same in principle with the waldenses . it being only a foul aspersion cast upon them by their malicious adversaries . posterior aetas ( saith danaeus ) ad praegravandam bonam evangelii causam , homines vere evangelicos infami catharorum nomine calumniata est . thus reader , it is left to thy judgment ( as mr. danvers speaks ) whether he hath sufficiently justified his sixfold testimony , that the donatists did deny infants-baptism . i hope ( whatever mr. danvers may say to the contrary ) i have sufficiently invalidated all that he hath brougat for that end , and that thou wilt acquit me from the charge of disingenuity in condemning his witnesses without cause . so we are come to his last witnesses the ancient britains ; which may well be called his , because no man ever before him affirmed they were against infants-baptism . of the witness pretended to be born against infants-baptism by the ancient britains . mr. danvers is singular in his opinion ; for never did any anabaptist that i have read of hit upon this topick , to prove the antiquity of their way ; no not mr. tombes ( whose invention is admirable for arguments , in that part of his anti-paedobaptism which i have lying by me , which consists of above 260 pages in quarto being part of the 1500 which mr. danvers says in his preface was never yet replyed to . and 't is no wonder that no body hath undertaken it ; for as the author of the history of the popes nephews speaks , the jesuits are politick in writing large volumns , on purpose to discourage the protestants from answering them . mr. danvers gives four arguments that the ancient britains that inhabited wales , when austin the monk was sent by pope gregory into this island to preach the gospel about the year 604. did bear their testimony against infants-baptism . 1. because mr. fox out of bede tells us , they refused to baptize after the manner of rome , which fabian particularly explains to be in the point of infants-baptism . in answer to this i did ( in my infants-baptism asserted ) 1. except against fabian's paraphrase upon the words , which bede gives us from austin ; and that for these reasons , 1. because in the preface to fabian , we there read that what he relates of these matters is taken from bede's ecclesiastical history , in which there is no mention of the britains denying to give christendom to children , for all that he saith is in his second book , and the words are , — in as much as you do contrary to our custom , yea to the custom of the universal church , nevertheless if you will obey me only in these three things , soil . that you keep your easter in its proper time ; administer baptism , whereby we are born again to god , after the manner of the holy church of rome ; and the apostolical church , and preach the word of god together with us unto the english nation , we will patiently bear all other things which you do , although contrary to our customs . but they answered they would do none of these . mr. fox relates it thus , that they would not agree , refusing to leave the custom which they so long time had continued without the assent of them all which used the same . fox . act. mon. 1. book , p. 107. 2. because fabian is not lookt upon as a faithful historian , and therefore mr. fox in the aforesaid book suspecteth him of divers mistakes , and follows not his relation of giving christendom to children in this story , as it is set down by him ; for he gives us it in the words of bede , viz. that they refused to baptize after the manner of rome . 3. none of the other ancient historians , as cretensis in polychron . huntington , &c. mention their refusing to give christendom to children ; they only speak generally of refusing to baptize after the manner of rome . some other reasons were given which i let pass , having already said enough to shew on what a sandy foundation mr. danvers builds this his peculiar assertion , that the ancient britains denyed infants-baptism , he having nothing for it but fabians conjecture , wherein he differs from all other historians in the world. but saith mr. danvers , fabian hath fully hit bede's meaning : why ? 1. because austin tells the brittish christians , that among many things , wherein they were contrary to the custom of rome , and to the universal church , one was in this particular of baptism ; and this he conceives must needs be in their refusing to baptize children : and his reasons are ; 1. because as to the baptizing the adult they were not contrary to the church of rome . i answer , though they were not contrary to them , as to the subject of baptism , viz. the adult ; yet they might be , and were so ( if so pure as mr. danvers represents them ) in regard of the adjuncts which the church of rome annext to baptism , viz. those superstitious additions of chrysm , oyl , &c. they both baptized the adult , but not after the same manner : and this was that which austin stood upon , he would have had them baptize after their manner : but mr. danvers objects , 2. it could not respect the mode of baptism , that 's strange ; for doth he not tell us just before , p. 38. of his reply , from mr. fox , who takes it from bede , that they refused to baptize after the manner of rome ; and can he tell wherein the difference lies between mode and manner . but let us weigh his reasons ( which are as light as a feather ) why it could not respect the mode of baptism . his first is , because the custom of the church of rome was not universal , but opposed by the greeks and eastern churches , & not at all to be made out to be apostolical . he says true indeed , though it be not ad rhombum , and though the church of rome was not so universal , neither could be made out to be apostolical ; yet they are so proud as to term it so , and say what we can to the contrary , they do still arrogate as much to this day . 3. therefore , saith he , it must needs respect infants-baptism ; whether this be intended as an argument , or a conclusion , who can tell ? it is brought in as a third argument , and then it is idem per idem : it must needs respect infants-baptism , because it must needs . but he wheels about again after a confused manner , and comes in with five other arguments . 1. because the church of rome had particularly enjoyned , and imposed it to beget infants to regeneration , and therefore must intend the substance and not the ceremony . to which i reply ; 1. it is very strange , that mr. danvers's mind should thus run altogether upon childrens baptism , when the work which austin would have had them gone upon , was to baptize the adult pagans , such as the saxons then were , and to preach the gospel to them , and we reade not ( unless i mistake ) of any children that he baptized at all , nor any of his company , although he sent to gregory to know how long the baptizing of a child might be deferr'd , there being no danger of death . 2. how came the canon of the church of rome into mr. danvers's mind , of childrens being born of god by regeneration ? for austin spake not of this ; but only exhorts the britains to administer baptism , whereby , saith he , we are born again , as holding that grown persons are born again to god as well as children , according to the judgment of the church of rome , as well as the ancient fathers . doth not just in martyr say the same , speaking of the manner how the christians were baptized : they go ( saith he ) to the water and are regenerated , as we our selves were regenerated , &c. so that these are but childish cavils against childrens-baptism . 2. he urge● another , and that is , because infants-baptism was universally received in this seventh age , in other parts of the world for this end . this is such an argument that i know not well what to say to it , unless it be that since infants-baptism was so universally received in other parts of the world , it 's altogether improbable it should be shut out of wales . the third and fourth arguments make but one , which is , because infant-baptism was received , and enjoyned as an apostolical practice , and it had been childish and ridiculous to have said baptism in general was apostolical . mr. danvers says true , it had been indeed ridiculous for austin to have said baptism in general was apostolical , and therefore he speaks of the manner of baptizing , which he would have the britains observe as they did , that is , to do it in that superstitious way with chrysm , oyl , &c. which is held by the church of rome to be apostolical . and whereas i say the britains did no more reject infants-baptism , than they did preaching to the saxons . he thus replys ; true , having as much reason to reject the one , as the other . a strange assertion ! for though infants-baptism be in his account unlawful , yet the preaching of the gospel , one would think , should be lawful , and more reason there is to preach the gospel , than to baptize either the adult or infants . but what makes mr. danvers judg otherwise as to these britains ? it is because he conceives , by preaching here must be understood authoritatively , by being ordained by them , and not as a company of lay-men , or mechanicks . it seems than this gentle-man is for mechanicks preaching ; but that which is remarkable is , to see how much he hath overshot himself in the heat of disputation : for the britains , to whom austin addrest his speech , were not lay-men or mechanicks , but seven bishops and an arch-bishop , as mr. fox informs us , act. mon. 1. book , p. 107. although 't is true they admitted not romes supremacy over them , which was the main quarrel , as mr. fox tells us out of cluniacensi , who gives this reason why they would not comply with austin , because they would not admit of the bishop of romes supremacy over them , ex pet. cluniacensi ad bernardum . reader , thou must know that mr. danvers gave five other reasons in his treatise of baptism to confirm his former position ; and because i said in my answer they were trifles , he tells me in his reply that that is an excellent way of answering , & next to bellarmin , thou lyest . but i must tell mr. danvers , i did not only say they were trifles , but proved them such . and because he doth so cunningly insinuate the contrary , i shall now repeat my answer to his reasons , adding a little , and submit it to judgment . 1. his first argument , that the britains were against infant-baptism , was , because they kept themselves both in discipline and doctrine expresly to the scripture . before i speak to this , know , that he hath altered his note ; for his first argument in both his treatises of baptism was this , because the britains received the christian faith , doctrine and discipline from the apostles and asiatick churches , who had no such thing as baptizing children . now this being more than he can tell , and a negative argument as to matter of fact , is not valid , as i told him in my answer : and besides , i minded him with that of the magdeburgs , who expresly tell us that infants-baptism was in use in the asiatick churches , cent. 3. c. 6. p. 124. he is so ingenious as to wave that argument . but to the 1st , as it is here in the reply , which is , because they kept themselves in discipline and doctrine expresly to the word . this he thinks will effectually do the business , that is , casheer infants-baptism from them . to this i answer . 1. to say they kept themselves expresly in discipline and doctrine to the word , is more than mr. danvers can prove , and it is more than jeffery monmouth speaks , from whom he hath his intelligence . this therefore , that they keep to the express word is his own dictate . 2. it is not true what he saith , nor can i apprehend how mr. danvers should believe himself ; for no anabaptist believes episcopal government to be so expresly set down in the word , and mr. fox tells us as before , that no less than seven bishops and an arch-bishop came out of wales at austin's summons ; who were also so proud , that wanting some ceremonious observance at their first coming to austin they took such offence , that in disdain and great displeasure they went away . and observe , reader , the sense of mr. fox upon this their carriage ; i profess , saith he , i cannot see but both austin and them were to be blamed , who so much neglected their spiritual duties in revenging their temporal injuries , that they denied to joyn their helping hand to turn the idolatrous saxons to the way of life and salvation , in which respect all private respects ought to give place , and be forgotten , and for which cause he conceived the stroke of god's punishment did light upon them afterward . the business of infants-baptism never entered into this good-mans mind , as if they refused to comply with austin on that account , nor is it like that ever the britains thought of it . 2. his next argument is , because they were zealous impugners of tradition . but by the story we find no such zeal unless it was against austin for not honouring them : and besides , this argument of mr. danvers is altogether precarious ; for we have shewed before that though austin held infants-baptism a tradition , yet withal it was in his opinion grounded on circumcision , and the papists ( as bellarmine ) affirm the warrantableness of it may be collected from scripture . but to make short work with it , i deny that they were such impugners of tradition , if the discpline of arch-bishops , and the observation of easter be traditions ( as mr. danvers judgeth them to be ; ) for as the difference between austin and them was not about the subject of baptism , but the ceremony ; so they differed not about keeping easter , but only as to the circumstance of time , when it was to be kept . that the britains and picts kept easter , though not at the same time as the romish church did , see mr. fox act. mon. page 111. where mention is made of a synod in which the controversie about keeping easter was debated before king oswie , alfrid's father ; and 't is said coleman then bishop of northumberland , followed not the custom of rome , nor of the saxons , but the picts and britains in celebrating easter from the 14th day of the first month , till the 28th of the same , against whom wilfrid replied , — the easter we keep , we have seen at rome , — the same is used in italy and france , and finally all the world over , save only by these here present , with their accomplices the picts and britains . 3. reason is , because constantine the son of christian parents was not baptized till aged , so in his treatise of baptism ; but in his reply , 't is , not baptized in this island . but we have shewn constantius his father was no christian at constantine's birth , and in all likelyhood lived and dyed a pagan , though he had much respect for christians ; and even constantine himself was a pagan for sometime after he was emperor . 4. another of his reasons is , because the custom of the britains was to baptize after confession of faith , being in union and communion therein with the french christians ; and i told him this was a good argument to prove they were for infants-baptism , because the french christians afterward called waldenses were for it , and had used it so many hundred years ; witness the confession at angrogne . nor will mr. danvers his old salvo serve his turn , which is , that the ancient waldenses were against infants-baptism , though he cannot but grant the more modern were for it . for we have met with something of late that must needs convince him , and that is , that infants-baptism was practised in the country where the waldenses do inhabit , near twelve hundred years since . for the famous french historian , john de serres , in his history of france translated into english , tells us , p. 12. that anno christi 500 , clovis the great king of france , then an heathen , desired to marry clotilde daughter of chilperic brother of gondebault , king of the burgundians , ( whose seat was then at arles in provence ) gondebault denyed clovis , because of the difference of religion : clovis to remove this , promised her liberty of conscience , so the marriage was concluded . and ( saith the author ) although clovis were a pagan , yet he was no enemy to the christians , sitting himself to the humour of the gauloys , who generally followed the christian religion : he suffered his wife likewise to baptize her children . so it 's plain the burgundians ( from whence the waldenses sprang ) were for baptizing infants ; and belike it was also at that time the universal practice of the gauls . 5. the last of mr. danvers's arguments , that the britains were against infants-baptism , is , because austin himself was so raw and ignorant in the rite , that when he came into britain , and the question was here put to him ( i know not by whom ) how long a child that was in danger of death might stay unbaptized ? he was fain to send to rome for solution . this is so raw an argument indeed to prove the britains were against infants-baptism , that instead of an answer , it deserves to be laught at . for at this very day wherein infants-baptism is so generally practised , some take a liberty to delay longer than others who are for the speedy administration thereof . and if this argument doth import any thing , it is , that austin himself was not so well studied as he ought to have been as to the time when children should be baptized . what in the last place he speaks of hilary , that none were baptized in the western churches but the adult , is confronted in the beginning , where we have shewn that he hath no such saying in lib. de trinitate , the book referr'd to , and how he himself was for infants-baptism from his 2d epistle to austin . as for his other witnesses , munzer and john of leyden , with the rest of that faction , though he doth pertinaciously persist against the clearest evidences , in palliating or rather denying the horrid crimes laid to their charge , and withal ( very disingenuously ) reflects dishonour upon those of the reformation , i shall not be at so much expence of time and paper as to expose his gross aberrations herein , but quietly permit him to injoy the comfort and honour of such witnesses . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a66526-e180 preface to the reply . notes for div a66526-e1070 synodus 4tae carthaginensis cent. 4. cap. 9. pag. 873. laodicens . concilium cent. 4. cap. 9. p. 833. common-prayer book last edit . dipt by washing is nonsense . notes for div a66526-e14040 * dr. richard allestree , the worthy provost of eaton-colledg . † in his book entit . more proofs of infants church-membership , pag. 343. * in his treatise of baptism . london , 1674. pag. 65 , 66. † anno. 1656. * pag. 343. of his book before cited . ☞ ☞ notes for div a66526-e20620 ☜ ☜ [the ax laid to the root, or, one blow more at the foundation of infant baptism and church-membership containing an exposition of that metaphorical text of holy scripture, mat. 3, 10]. keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. 1693 approx. 173 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 29 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a47399) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 64346) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 213:2) [the ax laid to the root, or, one blow more at the foundation of infant baptism and church-membership containing an exposition of that metaphorical text of holy scripture, mat. 3, 10]. keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. 2 v. printed for the author, and are to be sold by john harris, [london : 1693] written by b. keach. cf. bm. errata leaf at beginning of v. 2. reproduction of original in british library. imperfect: vol. 1 is lacking on film; t.p. information supplied from nuc pre-1956 imprints. (from t.p. of pt. 2) mr. john flavel's last grand arguments in his vindiciarum vindex, to prove circumcision a gospel covenant, are answered -a brief reply to mr. rothwell's late treatise, intituled, paedo-baptismus vindicatus -some short reflections by way of confutation of a book newly published by mr. joshua exell, intituled, a serious enquiry into, and certain producing of plain and express proofs, that john baptist did as certainly baptize infants as the adult. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng flavel, john, 1630?-1691. exell, joshua. john, -the baptist, saint. rothwell, edward, d. 1731. infant baptism -early works to 1800. 2002-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2002-12 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2003-01 john latta sampled and proofread 2003-01 john latta text and markup reviewed and edited 2003-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion the ax laid to the root : containing an exposition of that metaphorical text of holy scripture , mat. 3.10 . part ii. wherein mr. iohn flavel's last grand arguments in his vindiciarum vindex , to prove circumcision a gospel-covenant , are answered . also a brief reply to mr. rothwell's late treatise , intituled , paedo-baptismus vindicatus ; as to what seems most material . to which is added ●ome short reflections by way of confutation of a book newly published by mr. ioshua exell , minister of the gospel — intituled ; a serious enquiry into , and certain producing of plain and express proofs , that john baptist , did as certainly baptize infants as the adult . job 6.25 . how forcible are right words , but what doth your arguing reprove ? ●●ndon , printed for the author , and are to be s●●●●y iohn harris at the harrow in the poultrey ●●●● errata . pag. 2 line 39. r. disprove . p. 4. line 26 for ordinal r. original . p. 4. l. 32. for the law r. this . p. 11. l. 12. for ( 12. ) r. 2. p. 13. l. 14. for rite r. right . in p. 29. l. 33. for circumcision r. commission . p. 13. l. 28. for usurb'd r. absurd . p. 16. l. 2. blot out against . p. 20. l. 12. a false point . r. covenant-holy : blot out the interrogation point , and put a colon after holy : p. 24. l. 29. for abraham r. god. p. 34. l. 12. for rite r. right . p. 34. l. 34. for rite r. right . p. 38 l. 10. for rom r. from . p. 39. l. 10. for weighty r. mighty . p. 41. l. 39. for prophaned r. prophane . p. 39. l. 40. for prophaned r. prophane . p. 43. l. 5. for penitent r. penitents . p. 43. l. 6 for must r. might . p. 46. l. 25. for internals r. internal . p. 47. l. 37. blot out truth . p. 48. l. 26 ▪ blot out the. the ax laid to the root , &c. sermon iii. part . ii. mat. iii. ver . 10. and now also the ax is laid to the root of the trees , every tree therefore that bringeth not forth good fruit ; is hewn down and cast into the fire . beloved , i have already opened the scope and coherence of this place of holy scripture , as also the parts and terms , and then took notice of one or two points of doctrine . that which i have largely prosecuted , is this , viz. doct. now the dispensation is changed , to be of the natural root , viz. of the national church of the iews , the seed of abraham , or children of believers , according to the flesh , is no ground for church-membership , 't is no argument to be admitted into the gospel-church , or to gospel-baptism . we have proved , that there were two covenants made with abraham , ●ne with him and his natural seed as such , signified by agar , the bond●oman ; the other made with him and his spiritual seed as such , signified 〈◊〉 sarah , the free woman ; and also , have clearly made it appear , that ●●e covenant of circumcision did not appertain to the covenant of ●race , but that it was a rite of the legal covenant . we shall now proceed to answer the other objections , having the last day only insisted upon one. 2. obj. circumcision was the type of baptism . 1. answ. if the circumcision of the heart was the antitype of circumcision in the flesh , then certainly baptism was not , could not be the antitype thereof ; but this the holy ghost fully intimates , was the antitype of it , see 1 col. 2.12.13 . rom. 2.29 . see dr. taylor , as recited in rector rectified , p. 9 , 10 , 11. 2. if baptism , and circumcision were both in force together for some time , then baptism is not the antitype of , nor did it come in the room of circumcision , but that they were both in force together for some time , i shewed before . iohn , and the disciples of christ , baptized . ioh. 4.1 , 2. sometime before circumcision was nailed to the cross , or did cease . can one thing come in the room , or place of another , till the other is actually , and legally removed , and took away ? why , now since these two rites had a being together , i affirm ( as i have formerly done ) one could not be the type of the other . a type can abide no longer , then till the antitype is come ; therefore circumcision was not the type of baptism . 3 dly , and lastly , ( as to this ) i see not indeed , how one thing , that was a figure , could be the proper shadow , or type of a figure ; sure no wise man has reason so to think ; all may see , that baptism it self , is called a figure , 1 pet. 3.21 . and this is sufficient to remove the second objection . 3. obj. the third objection i mentioned , is this , viz. infants were once in covenant , and never cast out , therefore they are in still : see mr. rothwell's paedo-baptism . answ. i answer , tho' infants were in covenant under the law , in the legal church of the jews , and that by god's appointment . gen. 17.7 . which is not denied : yet , what of this ? their being once members of the iewish church , doth not prove them to be members of the gospel church : they had then many outward privileges , which we , under the gospel , have not ; they went all off when the ax was laid to the root , i. e. when the old covenant was ab●ogated , and the old church state cut down , then their old church members fell likewise : the branches cannot stand , when the tree is cut down , or rooted up . 2. we have proved the covenant ; for in covenanting of infants , under the law , was no gospel covenant ; and therefore this objection hat● nothing in it to hurt us , unless it can be proved , they were taken a-new into the gospel church , or gospel covenant , which we positively deny and they can't disprove : for , according to that maxim , omnis privati intimat babitum , ( you know ) that every dispossession ; implyeth a possess●●on : infants therefore , cannot be cast out of the gospel covenant , or go●●pel church , unless they had been first received into it ; therefore they mu●● prove , if they can , they are in the time of the gospel , taken in as me●●bers ; if so , i will not undertake to prove them cast out , but i am sure at the dissolution of the national church of the jews , they lost their right of church membership ; and god hath not constituted another national church , under the gospel , to bring in the carnal seed again , but the church is now purely congregational . god's spiritual temple , is built up with spiritual , and lively stones , 1 pet. 2.4 , 5. ye also , as lively stones , are built up a spiritual house , an holy priesthood , to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to god , by iesus christ. obj. 4. circumcision was part of the ceremonial law. thus i find mr. iohn flavel , expresses himself in his vindiciarum vindex ( in answer to mr. philip cary ) pag. 214. viz. if circumcision be part of the ceremonial law , and the ceremonial law was dedicated by blood , and whatsoever is so dedicated , is by you confessed no part of the covenant of works , then circumcision can be no part of the covenant of works , &c. but it is so , ergo. answ. 1. i answer , it argues these men are hard put to it , since they are forced to fly to such an argument as this , to prove circumcision to be a gospel covenant , i shall not now enter upon the debate , whether the ceremonial law , was a part of the covenant of works , or not ? tho' i must say , i judge it was an appendix to it ; and that it appertained to the first covenant , the apostle affirms , heb. 9.1 . they are to clear up this , viz. how the ceremonial law is part of the first covenant , and yet no part of the covenant of works . 2. yet their work lies not so much in that neither , as it doth in this respect , viz. they are to prove , that the ceremonial law was part of the covenant of grace , which , as yet none of them ( that i ever heard of ) have attempted to do ( tho' we grant it was a shadow of it ) when they have proved , that they have in the 3. third place , another task , viz. to prove , that circumcision was ● part of the ceremonial law ; for tho' it was a figure , or a sign , yet it may be doubted of , whether it was a part of that law , or not — yet 4. it might be a part of , or appertain unto the sinai covenant : for ( 1 ) t is called a covenant , that 's evident ; but , where is the ceremonial law ●o called ? ( 2. ) it gave the children of israel an assurance of the sinai ●ovenant , and that the apostle calls , the great , and chiefest adv●ntage ●hey had by it . ( 3. ) it also was of the same nature and quality , and had ●e like promises annexed to it , upon their obedience , and the same ●hreatning upon their disobedience . ( 4. ) it obliged those , who were cir●umcised , to keep the said law. gal. 5.3 . it was , i have proved , of the ●●me nature and quality , i. e. a conditional covenant , and like promise ●f earthly blessings , and like threatnings annexed to it . secondly , was not the ceremonial law , a part of that law st. paul ●alls , the hand-writing of ordinances that was against us , which was contrary 〈◊〉 us , and took it out of the way , nailing it to his cross ? col. 2.14 . if cir●●mcision was part of this law , sure it did not appertain to the gospel , or ●ew covenant , much less the seal of it ; for then it could not be against us , but for us , not contrary to us , but agreeable to us , as a choice blessing . 2. and if the covenant of circumcision was a part of the ceremonial law , 't is evident that covenant is abolished ; and if the covenant be cancelled , or abolished , what good will the seal do them ? 3. that the ceremonial law was part of the first covenant , 't is evident , heb. 9.1 , 2. then verily , the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service , and worldly sanctuary . the old covenant comprehended not only the sinai ministration , as a covenant of works , ( do this , and live ) but also the whole mosaical oeconomy , and aronical priesthood , sacrifices , and all manner of shadowing rites and ordinances whatsoever , amongst which old covenant rites , or legal ordinances , circumcision was one of the chief ; so that this makes against them . 4. all the holiness and sanctification of the ceremonial law , only appertained to the flesh , and therefore , no part of the new covenant , heb. 9.13 . what tho' it was dedicated by blood , it was but typical blood , blood of bulls , and goats , that could not take away sin , purge the conscience , nor make any thing perfect . mr. elton on colossians , speaking of col. 2. ver . 14. puts forth this question , viz. quest. how were the legal ceremonies of the jews a hand-writing of ordinances . answ. i answer ( saith he ) they were so , in regard of their use to the jews , who , in using them ( as it were ) subscribed to their own guiltiness of death and damnation . — in using circumcision , they made known they had ordinal sin , and were guilty of it ; their washings shewed , they were exceeding filthy in god's sight , and so guilty of the curse of the law , and so did their sacrifices . hence god , in infinite mercy , sent his son to pay our debts ; and he has satisfied divine justice , and so has cancelled this hand-writing , that witnessed our guiltiness , and bound us over to punishment . — what good will it do them , to grant that circumcision was part of the law , i know not , these things considered . for they , evident it is , were bound exactly to keep all the laws , statutes and ordinances , of that law ; ( which , i think a learned man says were more then 300 ) nay , and if they continued not in doing all these things , they were cursed when they sate down , and when they rose up , whe● they went abroad , and when they came home : see deut , 27.20 , to 26. gal. ●● 10. cursed is he that continueth not in all things that are written in the book of t●● law to do them . mind it well , all things in the whole book of the law● not only the ten precepts , but all things contained in the ceremonial la● also . 6. therefore , tho' the blood of bulls , goats , and heifers , are called , th● blood of the covenant , yet it was not the blood of the new covenan● but of the old ; neither the first covenant was dedicated without blood , heb. 9.18 . true , the blood of the old covenant , figured the blood of the new , yet that doth no more prove the ceremonial law , was part of the new covenant , then the shadow can be proved to be the substance ; and therefore , tho' those sacrifices pointed to christ , yet that law was part of the covenant of works , i. e. no life by it : in those sacrifices , god's soul had no pleasure . 7. nor could they see , or look beyond those things , which are abolished : see 2 cor. 3.13 . from hence i argue , if the ceremonial law , was a hand-writing , i. e. a bond , or obligation of conviction , accusation , and condemnation to the jews , binding them farther to the curse of the moral law , it was no part of the covenant of grace ; but the former is true , ergo , therefore , whatever gracious design god had in it , or however useful to the elect , yet in it self , it was a law of works , tho' given in subserviency to the gospel law , as the sinai law was . 6. obj. god gave himself to abraham to be his god , and the god of his seed , in the covenant of circumcision , or made over himself by way of special interest to them in it ; ( so mr. flavell positively affirms . ) therefore it was the covenant of grace . answ. i answer , this i am persuaded , is the grand cause of their great boldness and mistake , in affirming the covenant of circumcision was the covenant of grace ; and therefore , ought the more carefully to be examined , considered , and answered ; for if mr. flavel , and the rest of our brethren , are right in this assertion , i. e. that god gave himself in circumcision to abraham , and to all his seed , to be their god , by way of special interest , they say a great deal , but this we deny . 1. as to abraham , god gave himself to him to be his god , yea , gave him special interest in himself ; but it was before he gave him the covenant of circumcision . this they cannot deny , nay , and not only to himself , but to be the god of all his true spiritual seed , and that also , before he entered into the said covenant of circumcision with him , and his natural seed ; see gen. 12.3 . gen. 15.1 . i am thy shield , and thy exceeding great reward ; see ver . 5. and then 't is said , he believed in the lord , and it was accounted to him for righteousness , ver . 6. — therefore , 2 dly , 't is for ever to be noted , that this special interest in god , he obtained through faith , in the free promise ( which is the covenant of grace god made with him ) and the apostle plainly shews , in rom. 4.9 , 10. that this blessedness , he ( in the negative ) received not in the covenant of circumcision , but in uncircumcision . how was it then reckoned , when he was in circumcision , or in uncircumcision ? not in circumcision , but in uncircumcision , ver . 10. i cannot but wonder at the darkness of those men , who affirm , that abraham received special interest in god , in the covenant of circumcision ; whereas the holy ghost positively denies it , or affirms the contrary . his main business being there to take them off of circumcision , and so to distinguish between circumcison , and the covenant of faith ; but , in direct opposition to the apostle's design , these men go about to magnifie circumcision by ascribing it to that . 3. and let it also be noted , that the same apostle excludes abraham's natural seed as such , ( with whom the covenant of circumcision was made ) from this special blessing of special interest in god , in rom. 9.5 . not as though the word of god hath taken none effect , for they are not all israel , which are of israel ; neither , because they are the seed of abraham , are they all children : ( that is , by way of special interest in god , so as to have god to be their god , by vertue of the covenant of grace made with abraham ) but in isaac shall thy seed be called , ver . 7. that is , they which are the children of the fl●sh , these are not the children of god ; but the children of the promise , are counted for the seed , ver . 8. none can deny , but that those , whom the apostle calls the children of the flesh ( whom he denies to have any interest in god as such ) the covenant of circumcision did belong unto , and was made with , as well as it was made with the true spiritual seed ; therefore i may from hence , with the greatest boldness imaginable , affirm , that in the covenant of circumcision , god did not make over himself to be abraham's god , so as to give him , or to his seed , special interest in himself . obj. but 't is positively said , that god did promise in the covenant of circumcision , to be a god to him , and to his seed after him , in their generations , when he promised them the land of canaan , gen. 17.8 , 9 , 10. answ. i do not deny it , but not by way of special interest ( that is , the thing we differ in ) so he was not the god of his seed as such , according to the nature of the covenant of grace , and that for the reasons before urged ; therefore it behoveth us to consider , in what respect we are to understand the holy ghost . i do not say neither , that ever god made himself over to men , to be their god , by way of special interest , upon the terms of the sinai covenant , that was impossible for them to answer , ( nor can i believe , notwithstanding what mr. flavel has affirmed , that my reverend brother , mr. philip cary , will assert any such thing ) the inheritance was not by the law. 1. therefore we are to consider , that god may be said to be the god of a people , in a covenant way , two manner of ways . 1 st . by the free promise , or covenant of grace in a spiritual gospel sense , which gives special and soul-saving interest in him , as all abraham's spiritual seed , i. e. true believers have ; or , 2 d. god may be said to be the god of a people , by entering into an external , legal covenant with them : and thus he gave himself to be the god of abraham , and his natural , or fleshly seed , i. e. he took them into a visible external covenant church-state , and separated them from all other people and nations in the world , to be a peculiar people ( in that covenant ) unto himself ; and , in this sense , he was said foederally , or by covenant , to be married to the whole house of israel , as so considered , and to be an husband to them : see ier. 21.31 . god there makes a promise to israel and iudah , that he would make a new covenant , not according to the covenant i made with their fathers in the day that i took them by the hand , to bring them out of the land of egypt ( which covenant they break , although i was an husband to them saith the lord ) ver . 32 in this covenant god gave them their church state , and many external or earthly blessings , laws and ordinances , and they formerly struck hands ( as i may so say ) with god , and promised obedience , exod. 24.3 , 7 , 8. and he took the book of the covenant , and read in the audience of the people , and they said , all that the lord hath said , will we do and be obedient : and thus god became as an husband to them , i. e. he fed them , and took special care of them , and to lead them with great bowels in the wilderness , and bestowed the land of canaan upon them , with other temporal blessings , according as it was promised to them in the covenant of circumcision : like as a husband cares for , and provides for the wife , so did god care and provide for them and preserved them , so long as that law ( i mean the law of their husband ) did continue : but that law is now dead , rom. 7.4 . and god now is no longer such a husband to them , nor hath he married in that sense any other external nation , or people of the world ; but now god , in the gospel covenant , is an husband indeed ; to them he was but a typical husband , and their god in an external faedoral relation : and thus he was the god of all abraham's natural off-spring ; for , in him , he first espoused them as a national church , and people , and gave them the covenant of circumcision , as the sign , or token thereof , with many ecclesiastical and civil rites . and this is further confirmed by a reverend and learned writer : howbeit from the strict connexion of this 7th . verse with the 6th . and the assurance here given , that god will establish his covenant with abraham's seed , to be their god : it is evident ( saith he ) that the number of abraham's carnal seed and the grandeur of their civil state , is not all that is promised , nor yet the principal blessing bestowed on them therein , but rather the forming them into a church state , with the establishing of the ordinances of publick worship among them , wherein they should walk in covenant relation to god , as his peculiar people : understand it still ( saith he ) of the old covenant , wherein they had their peculiar right and privilege , no less can be intended in this , i will be a god unto them , in their generations ; and it is also made more evident by the following account that is given of this transaction , with respect to isaac and ishmael , gen. 17.18 , 21. when the lord had promised unto abraham a son , by sarah , whose name should be called isaac , he thus prayed , o that ishmael might live before thee ! which the chaldee paraphraseth thus , i. e. might live and worship before thee . no doubt , his prayer was , that ishmael might also be an heir of the blessing of this covenant ; but that was not granted to him ; for the lord would have his covenant seed called by isaac only : with him god would establish his covenant , having appointed and chosen him alone , to be the heir thereof , who was to be the child of the promise , and son of the free woman ; and yet for ishmael , in special favour with abraham , whose seed he was : thus much he obtained , i. e. that he should be made fruitful , and multiply exceedingly , twelve princes , or heads of great families , should spring of him ; which imports some analogy to the twelve tribes of israel after the flesh , and god would make him a great nation ; and yet , all this fell short of the blessings of abraham's natural off-spring , by isaac , from which ishmael was now excluded : it is plain therefore , that the privilege of the ecclesiastical , as well as the flourishing of the civil states of israel , did arise unto them out of the covenant of circumcision . we conclude therefore ( saith he ) that notwithstanding the carnal seed of abraham , could not as such , claim a right in the spiritual and eternal blessings of the new covenant , because of their interest in the covenant of circumcision , yet their privileges , and advantages in their church-state , tho' immediately consisting in things outward and typical , were of far greater value and use , than any meer worldly , or earthly blessings , as to giving them choice means of the knowledge of god , and setting them nearer to him , than any nation in the world besides . thus far this learned author . dr. bates also , in his sermon preach'd at mr. baxter's funeral , shews , that god may be said to be the god of a people , several manner of ways . 1. upon the account of creation : thus he is our god and father o lord thou art our father , we are the clay , and thou art our potter , and we all are the work of thy hands , isa. 64.8 2. upon the account of external calling , and profession , there is an intercurrent relation of the father and son , between god and his people : thus the posterity of seth , are called , the sons of god , gen. 6. and the entire nation of the jews are so styled : when israel was young , i called my son from egypt , hos. 11. and all that have received baptism , the seal of the holy covenant , and profess christianity , in this general sense , may be called the children of god. thus he clearly confirms what i have said ; but observe , in this sense , god is not said to be the god of a people by way of special interest . but 't is not ( saith he ) the outward dedication , entitles men to saving interest in god , unless they live according to that dedication . there are baptised infidels , as well as unbaptised , &c. then say i , some infants baptised , are in his opinion , but in an external covenant with god , and so have no special inte●est . — moreover sure none can deny , but , by gross idolatry , the israelites broke this covenant ; and yet , when they , in ezekiel's time , became guilty of vile abominations , the lord still claimed an interest in their children , by vertue of this covenant . moreover , thou hast taken thy sons and thy daughters , whom thou hast born unto me , and these hast thou sacrificed unto them to be devoured : is this of thy whoredoms a small matter , that thou hast slain my children , ezek. 16.20 , 12. the children they begat in a natural way , when by cursed idolatry , they had apostatized from god , ( by vertue of this covenant ) god calls his children , which could not have been , if their covenant interest had been as our brethren affirm , i. e. suspended on the good abearing , or faith of immediate parents : but , as the apostacy of parents could not hinder their children from that external covenant interest they had in god , and god in them , so the faith and holiness of parents , could not interest their children in the special blessings of the covenant of grace . lastly , 't is remarkable , that when god gave the sinai covenant , exod. 20.1 , 2. where he pleads interest in them as his people , he mentions expresly , upon what account he so owned them ; read the text , i am the lord thy god , which brought thee out of the land of egypt , out of the house of bondage , thou shalt have no other gods before me . i am jehovah , and thy god , having chosen you to be a people to my self above all people ; as 't is said elsewhere , not that as they were thus his people , and a chosen nation , they had special interest in god by eternal election , and peculiar adoption , no , but a few of them ( as it appears ) were in that sence , his people : but their god , by vertue of that legal and external covenant he made with their fathers , and now again with them , and so bestowed temporal blessings upon them ; therefore 't is added , that brought thee out of the land of egypt , not land of spiritual darkness , nor house of spiritual bondage , but literal bondage , &c. in the covenant of works , ( saith reverend mr. cotton ) the lord offered himself , upon a condition of works ; he bid them obey his voice , and provoke him not ; for i will not pardon your transgressions . — but , in the covenant of grace , he will do this , but not in the covenant of works ; all is given upon condition of obedience . the lord giving himself , &c. tho' it be but to work , yet he is pleased to receive them into some kind of relative union expressed , ier. 32.32 . which my covenant they break , as though i was an husband unto them . he was married to them in church-covenant ; he was their god , and they were his peculiar people , and yet the lord cast them off from this marriage-covenant , from this union . thus mr. cotton on the covenant . p. 39.40 . so much shall serve to the answering this grand objection . obj. 6. sixthly , circumcision was a seal of the righteousness of faith. if circumcision was the seal of the righteousness of faith ( saith mr. flavell ) it did not appertain to the covenant of works : for the righteousness of faith and works , are opposite ; but circumcision was the seal of the righteousness of faith , rom. 4.11 . ergo , pag. 220. 1 answ. we answer first , that the text they bring , doth not call circumcision the seal of the righteousness of faith : as 't is such , or in common to all that were circumcised , pray let us read the words ; and he received the sign of circumcision , a seal of the righteousness of the faith , which he had them yet being uncircumcised : that he might be the father of all men that believe , though they be not circumcised ; that righteousness might be imputed to them also : rom. 4.11 . first , observe circumcision is directly , here called a sign , and so it was in it self : 1. a sign , or token of god's making good his covenant to abraham's natural seed , that from his loins christ should come by isaac . 2. a sign , or token , that the promise of all these blessings granted to them , either ecclesiastical , respecting their national church state , and civil state , and temporal blessings , with their possessing of the land of canaan . 3. of the circumcision of the heart , for that it was a sign of . 2. but it is not called any more a seal to abraham , of the righteousness of that faith , he had before he was circumcised , then it was of his being the father of all them that believe now since it was principally called a seal to him , of that peculiar privilege , and prerogative , of being the father of all true believers , which none had ever granted to them besides himself , why should they suppose , that circumcision is here called , a seal of the righteousness of faith to all , as well as to abraham himself ? i desire this may be considered ; for mr. flavel passes it by in silence , and speaks nothing to it . 3. but thirdly , to put the matter out of doubt , it could be a seal to no other person , or persons , but to abraham only . because it was a seal of that righteousness abraham had , being yet uncircumcised , and such a righteousness , none of his seed ever had actually , as he had it ; ( neither of his fleshly , nor spiritual seed ) for first , isaac had no such faith before he was circumcised , because circumcised when but eight days old , and so were generally all his seed , except you will mention such , who neglected to circumcise their children , and so transgressed the command of god , or mention adult proselites . but that will not help the matter ; they must carry it to be a seal to all that the covenant of circumcision belonged to , or else to none but to abraham only : but to all , it could not be a seal , as it was to abraham , it being positively said , not to be a seal of the righteousness of their faith , they should have after circumcised , but of that faith abraham particularly had , being yet uncircumcised . 4. the scope and drift of the holy ghost , proves it to be thus as we say ; for else , there 's no need for the apostle to mention it , as a seal of that righteousness of faith , he had before circumcision , if others might have it in circumcision , viz. the righteousness of god , as 't is contained in the covenant of grace : ( for that they must say , or they say nothing ) and it farther appears by what the apostle speaks , viz. that he might be the father of them that believe , that were not circumcised . if it had been in circumcision , or after circumcision , what argument would there have been in the case , i. e. that abraham should be the father of those that believe , that are not circumcised . therefore , in direct opposition to what dr. ames speaks , as cited by mr. flavel , i must say , the main drift and scope of the apostle's argument from the coherence of the text , is to take off the jews from seeking any spiritual benefit from circumcision , or the law , but by faith , only seeing ; abraham was justified , and received the righteousness of christ , by faith , before he was circumcised , or without circumcision ; and his receiving circumcision , sealed not only the righteousness of faith to him , which he had , being uncircumcised , ( and so to none else ) but also , his being the father of all that believe , whether circumcised , or not circumcised . 5. but again , it must be granted to belong to abraham , only as a seal , because st. paul , speaking of circumcision , rom. 3.12 . says , the chief advantage , or privilege , they had thereby , was , because that unto them was committed the oracles of god. certainly , he would not have called that the chief , if circumcision had been given in common , as a seal of the righteousness of faith : however , when he is a treating of the privileges that come by circumcision , surely he could not have forgotten this , viz. that it was a seal of the righteousness of faith. 6. let not men mistake themselves any more , for evident it is , that circumcision , as 't is called a seal to abraham , so it did not seal to him something , which he then had not , but might have ; but it did seal , really , and truly , the righteousness of that faith , which he at that time had : if therefore you baptize children , who before they are baptized , do truly believe ; no body will be dispeased with you , or if you can prove , your infants have really and truly such a faith as abraham had , and that their baptism doth seal that faith to them for righteousness , which circumcision sealed to abraham , you do your business : but sirs , pray what blessings of the covenant of grace , doth baptism now seal to your infants ? o , says one , the covenant is theirs , it belongs to them , and shall we deny them the seal ? what , not let them have a bit of wax ? but stay a little , you must first prove the covenant of grace , doth indeed belong to believers children as such , before you talk at such a rate as you do . a seal , all men know , makes firm and sure all the blessings to the person , to whom it is sealed , which are contained in the same covenant , to which it is fixed : therefore , take heed you do not blind the minds of people , and deceive them , by making them think they are in covenant , when indeed it may be no such thing . 7. besides , if circumcision was the seal of the covenant of grace , then it would follow , that the covenant of grace made with abraham , is abrogated ; for the breaking off the seal , all men know , cancells the covenant , and makes it of none effect : and that circumcision , which you call the seal of the covenant of grace , that was made with abraham , is broke off , or torn off by the death of jesus christ , is evident ( and this proves , if it was a seal of the sinai covenant , which i say , not but only a sign ) that covenant is gone , because the seal is broken off . 8. circumcision was so far from being a seal of the covenant of grace to all , to whom it did b●long , that it sealed not all those outward blessings to the bond-men , or such who were bought with money , and so were admitted to dwell in abraham's family ; for it did not seal to them all the outward and external privileges of the commonwealth of israel ; for they only belonged to those who were natural israelites . now , from the whole , it seems to me to be a strange thing , which is lately asserted , viz. that the infant seed of believers , ( during their infancy ) have all of them a certain interest in the covenant of grace : by vertue of which , they are compleatly justified before god , from the guilt of original sin , both originans , and originations ; and yet , when they come to years of discretion , may ( yea must ) by their actual closing with , or refusing the terms of the covenant , either obtain the continuation , and confirmation of their covenant interest , or be utterly , and finally cut off from it , and so perish eternally in their ignorance of god , and rebellion against him . answer , to which i must say , that they seem to make the covenant of grace , such a conditional covenant , that renders it in nature and quality , like the sinai covenant , or covenant of works , i. e. if they perform the righteousness required , they shall live ; if they obey not , or make not good , this pretended covenant of grace , they shall dye , or be cut off : let our brethren , who are sound in the doctrine of free-grace , consider this . 2. and as the promises of the new covenant , will admit of no such partial interest , ( saith a learned author ) so neither can this opinion consist with the analogy of faith , in other respects ; for either the stain of original sin , in these infanrs is purged , and the dominion of concupiscence in them destroyed , when their guilt is pardoned , or it is not ; if it be , then the case of these infants , in point of perseverance , is the same with adult persons , that are under grace , by actual faith ; and then a final apostacy , from the grace of the new covenant , must be allowed to befall the one , as well as the other , notwithstanding all provisions of that covenant , and engagement of god therein , to make the promise sure to all the seed , rom. 4.16 . but this the author will not admit : if he say , that their guilt is pardoned , but their natures are not changed , or renewed , nor the power of original corruption destroyed , so as that sin , shall not have dominion over them ; it will be replyed , that then , notwithstanding their supposed pardon , they remain as an unclean thing , and so uncapable of admission into the kingdom of god. thus this worthy author . 3. to which let me add , certainly if divine habits were in those infants , they would immediately be manifested ; or be sure when they are grown up , would appear in them by gracious operations flowing from thence : but since those acts , or products of such a gracious habit , appear not in them , 't is evident , they never had them infused . 4. all that are in the covenant of grace , ( if they live ) the fruits of faith and holiness , will flow naturally from those sacred habits , god hath by his spirit planted in them , as heat and light doth from the fire , when 't is kindled on the hearth . the truth is , such who are united to christ , and have faith in him , and so are actually in the covenant of grace , are also washed and purged from sin , and pollution , see ezek. 16. rom. 5.14 . act. 15.10 . none can have union with christ , but by the in-dwelling of the holy spirit ; and wheresoever the spirit of christ is , it applies , the blood of the covenant , not only for pardon , but also for the purging the conscience from dead works , to serve the living god : and therefore , ( as the same learned author observes ) as certain as any derive a new covenant rite from christ for pardon , they also receive a vital influence from him , for the renovation of their natures , and conforming their souls to his image : therefore , to assert , that the grace of christ , is applied to some , for remission of sins only , or that the guilt of any sin , can be pardoned to any person , and yet that sin retains its dominion over them , is a doctrine , i understand , not to be sound , or agreeable to the doctrine that is according to godliness . 5. to conclude with this , 't is evident , these men must , by their notion , make every believing parent to be ( considered in respect of that covenant made with abraham ) a common head and father , not only to his own natural seed , but to all believers also , as abraham was , and then it would follow , that there are as many common fathers , like as abraham was so called , as there are believing men in the world , and so a knowing , or knowledge of men still after the flesh , which the apostle disclaims , 2 cor. 5. 17. besides , the thing is usurp'd in it self : therefore , let all know , that a believers right to the blessings of the covenant of grace made with abraham's , or by vertue of that promise made with him , do relate to such a seed as do believe , and not as co-ordinate with him , in covenant interest ; they are not each one , by this covenant , made the father of a blessed seed , as abraham was the father of the faithful , neither can they claim the promise for themselves , and their seed , according to the tenour of abraham's covenant , as he might , ( as this author observes ) but they must believe as abraham did , or have a faith of their own : for if ye be christ's , then are ye abraham 's seed and heirs according to the promise , gal. 3 29. this the same author notes . obj. 7. the covenant of circumcision , was an everlasting covenant , therefore it was the covenant of grace . answ. i answer , 't is not unknown to our opponants , that the hebrew word , for everlasting , sometimes signifies no more then a long continuance . of time . — and so extensive was the promise of god's peculiar favours to the natural seed of abraham , and the original of their claim there-from that the severity of that law afterwards given to them , was so far restrained , as that ( notwithstanding their manifold breach of covenant with god , and forfeiture of all legal claim of their right and privileges in the land of canaan thereby ) that they were never utterly cut off from that good land , and ceased , to be a peculiar people unto god , untill the end or period of that time , determined by the almighty , was fully come ; which was the revealation of the messiah , and the setting up his spiritual temple , under the dispensation of the gospel ; and thus far , the word everlasting doth extend . 't is said , god promised to give the land of canaan to abraham , and to his seed for ever ; and again , gen. 17.8 . for an everlasting inheritance ; whereas it is evident , they have for many ages , been dispossessed of it : nor may this seem strange , if we consult other texts , where the same terms are used with the like restriction ; for the priesthood of levi , is called an everlasting priesthood , numb . 25.13 . and the gates of the temple , everlasting doors , psal. 24.6 . so the statute , to make an atonement for the holy sanctuary , and for the tabernacle , and for the altar , and for the priests , and for all the people of the congregation , is called , an everlasting statute , levit. 16.34 . and this shall be for an everlasting statute , &c. so that from hence 't is very clear , that the word everlasting is to be taken sometimes with restriction , and referrs to the end of that dispensation , to which the law , statute , or covenant did belong ; and when christ came , as all mosaical rites ended , so did the covenant of circumcision also . god never said , he would be the god of abraham's natural seed as such , as he gave himself to him , and to all his true spiritual seed ; for to them he gives himself , or an interest in all god is , or has ( so far as communicative ) even for ever and ever , or to all eternity ; the covenant of grace , being ordered in all things , and sure , 2 sam. 23.5 . 't is impossible this covenant , and covenant blessings , which is comprehensive of all grace here , and glory hereafter , should referr to a certain period of time ; and since he was not thus in covenant with abraham's carnal seed as such , 't is evident , the covenant of circumcision , ( tho' called , an everlasting covenant ) was not the covenant of grace . and so much to this objection . 8. obj. there was never but one covenant of works , and that god made with adam , and in him with all his post●rity ; therefore the covenant of circumcision did not appertain in the covenant of works : see mr. flavel . answ. first , our controversie , lies not so much about , the covenant of works , as given to adam , but about the nature of sinai covenant , since circumcision appears to be of the same nature with that : i do not say , in every respect , there is no difference between the covenant of works made with adam , and that made with the peop●e of israel ▪ though the● differ not essentially in substance , 't is all one and the same covenant , viz. requiring compleat and perfect righteousness . 2. therefore , tho' there is but one covenant of works , yet there was more than one addition , or administration of the said covenant : this is evident , although given upon a different end , purpose , and design , by the lord. adam's covenant , i grant , had one end and design , and the sinai covenant of works had another ; yet , may be , both , as to the essence and substance of them but one and the same covenant : which , doubtless , is all mr. cary intends . 1. adam's covenant had happiness , and justification in it , by his perfect obedience thereto ; and he being able , in the time of his innocency , to keep it , he was thereby justified . 2. but the second edition , or ministration of the covenant of works , given to the people of israel , tho' in its nature and quality , it was a covenant of works , and one with the former , yet it was not given for life or to justifie them , nor was it able so to do , by reason of their weakness through the flesh , rom. 8.3 . but it was added because of transgression . 1. to restrain sin , ( or as i said before ) to regulate their lives under those external covenant transactions of god with them , as his people , as before expressed . 2. to make sin appear exceeding sinful . 3. to discover to them , what righteousness it is god doth require , in order to the justification of the soul in his sight . 4. to make known to them thereby , what a righteousness man , originally , in the first adam , had , and lost ; and 5 thly , it did discover their woefull condition to them , and might put ●hem upon seeking relief and justification , by the promised seed , and so be as a school-master , to bring them to christ. 6. that in their conformity to it , to their utmost power , to continue ●ll those outward blessings , and privileges to the house , or church of israel , as god promised to abraham upon that account ; for 't is evident , the promises made to them , upon their obedience , were earthly and temporal promises , and not spiritual . hence the apostle saith , the new covenant is established upon better promises . — and now , that the sinai covenant was a covenant of works , ( as considered ●n it self ) notwithstanding the end and design of god therein , ( i find many of our sound protestant divines do affirm ) tho' given with a merciful and gracious intention ▪ or in subserviency to the gospel . 1. it commanded , or did require perfect or compleat obedience . 2. on these terms , do and live. 3. it gave no strength , nevertheless , to perform what its just demands were : hence the strength of sin is called , the law ; it did condemn , but could not save . 4. nor was there any pardon , or remission of sin , by that covenant , for any soul that broke it ; for , he that despised against moses's law , dyed without mercy , under two or three witnesses , heb. 10.28 . — moreover , 5. it cursed all that did not continue in all things that were contained in the whole book of the law to do them , gal. 3.10 . 6. the holy ghost calls it the old covenant , in contra distinction , and direct opposition to the covenant of grace , or gospel covenant . the law is not of fait● : but , the man that doth those things , them shall live in them , gal. 3.12 and tho' moses was the mediator of that covenant , yet he was but a typical mediator , and stood between god and them , to plead for the blessings of that covenant , and to prevent the threatnings of temporal judgments ; for there was never but one mediator between god and us , upon a spiritual account , i. e. to stand between eternal wrath and us , or to make peace with god for our souls . — take what the learned bishop usher hath said about the law , as a covenant of works , viz. quest. how doth this covenant ( i. e. the covenant of grace ) differ from that of works . answ. his answer is much every way , for first , in many points , the law may be conceived , by reason ; but the gospel , in all points , is far above the reach of man's reason . secondly , the law commandeth to do good , and giveth no strength ; the gospel enableth us to do good , the holy ghost writing the law in our hearts . thirdly , the law promised life only , the gospel righteousness also . fourthly , the law required perfect obedience , the gospel , the righteousness of faith. fifthly , the law revealeth sin , rebuketh us for sin , and leaves us in it , but the gospel doth reveal unto us remission of sins , and freeth us from the punishment belonging thereunto . sixthly , the law is the ministration of wrath , condemnation , and death ; the gospel is a ministry of grace , justification , and life . seventhly , the law was grounded on man's own righteousness , requiring of every man , in his own person , perfect obedience , deut. 27.26 . and in default , for satisfaction , everlasting punishment , gal. 3.10 , 12. but the gospel is grounded on the righteousness of christ , admitting payment and performance in another , in behalf of so many as receive it , gal. 3.13.14 . bishop usher's summ and substance of christian religion , p. 159. a multitude of protestant writers , i might produce , who all assert the same doctrine . and if the sinai covenant was not a covenant of works , why do all our brethren say , as it was a covenant of works , 't is done away ? and , why doth the apostle say , christ is the end of the law , as touching righteousness ? it is not abolished , or done away , as 't is a rule of righteousness , for as so it abides , as a perpetual rule and law to us . therefore , i wonder at mr. flavel's out-crys against mr. cary , as if it was impossible for the saints to be under the covenant of works , under the former dispensation , and yet in the covenant of grace ; for i would know , whether or not , they were not , at that time , under the ministration of that covenant ? but what , tho' no sooner did they believe in christ , the promised seed , but they were delivered from the curse of the law. nor is this any strange thing , for are not all now , in these days , under the dispensation of the gospel ? yet , untill men and women believe in christ , they abide still under the curse of the law of the first covenant ; for christ is not the end of the law to all the world , ( so as some erroneously assert , i. e. all are justified in god's sight , from the curse of the law ) but he is only the end of the law , touching righteousness to every one that beleiveth , to them , and to no other adult person : therefore men might be under the outward dispensation of the law of works , and yet through faith , be justified ; and also , others may be , and are now , under the dispensation of the gospel ; and yet , for not believing in christ , be condemned , and under the curse of the law : for the gospel is not the cause of our sickness , but our cure ; none believing , is the refusal of the medicine : so that there 's no reason for him to say , ( because we assert this ) that the godly , under that dispensation , hung mid-way , betwixt life , and death , justification , and condemnation ; and after death , mid-way betwixt heaven , and hell , p. 180. therefore , as all that lived under the dispensation of the law , or covenant of works , were saved by faith , in the promise of christ , or by the covenant of grace , abraham ( saith our saviour ) saw my day , and was glad , so without faith , or interest in christ , such that live under the dispensation of the gospel , cannot be saved ; nor are they delivered from the curse of the law , or covenant of works . therefore , ( to conclude with this , ) 't is evident , the covenant of works , though but one , ( as to the substance of it ) yet there was several ministrations of it ; as it was given also upon different ends , and designs by the lord : and therefore , because the said covenant of works was first given to adam , ( by vertue of which he was accepted , and justified in his innocency ) could not god give forth a second addition , ministration , or transcript of his righteousness , and holy law , requiring perfect obedience , though not to justification , yet to aggravate their sin , and so to their just condemnation ? and doth not the apostle assert the same thing ? rom. 3.19 , 20. compared with rom. 7.13 . gal. 3.19 . but saith bishop usher . quest. doth not god wrong to men , to require of him , that he is not able to perform ? answ. he answers no ; for god made man so , that he might have performed it ; but he , by sin , spoiled himself , and posterity of those gifts . therefore , to proceed ▪ i do affirm , that always , generally , when the apostle speaks of the old covenant , or covenant of works , he passes by , in silence , the covenant made with adam , and more immediately , and directly , applies it unto the sinai covenant , and to that of circumcision , as all careful readers , who read the epistles to the romans , galatians , and to the hebrews , may clearly find . and farther , to evince the truth we contend for ; 't is evident , that although there is ( and ever was ) but one covenant of grace , yet nothing is more plain then that there were several distinct additions of it , altho' we say , the promise or gospel covenant , was one and the same , in all ages , in respect of the things promised , with the nature and quality thereof ; which is a free and absolute covenant , without works , or conditions of foreseen acts of obedience , or righteousness done , by the creature whatsoever , rom. 4.5 . the substance , and essential part of this gospel covenant , as to the promises of it , is christ , faith , a new heart , regeneration , remission of sins , sanctification , perseverance , and everlasting life : yet , this evangelical covenant , had divers forms , additions , or transcripts of it , which signified those things , and the various sanctions , by which it was given forth , and confirmed . to adam , the promise of it was under the name of the seed of the woman , bruising the head of the serpent . to enoch , noah , &c. in other terms . to abraham , under the name of his seed , in whom all the nations of the earth should be blessed . to moses , by the name of a great prophet among his brethren ; and it was signified also unto him under dark shadows , and sacrifices . unto david , under the name of a successour in his kingdom . to other prophets , more clearer still made known , unto as a child is born ; a woman shall compass a man ; a new covenant i will make , &c in the new testament , in plain words , we all , with open face , beholding , as in a glass , the glory of the lord , 2 cor. 3.18 . but now , because there were so many additions , or ministrations of the gospel , or new covenant , doth it follow , there are so many new covenants ? this being so , mr. flavel hath done nothing to remove mr. cary's arguments , but they stand firm : for he says not , that the sinai ministration of the covenant of works , was ordained to justifie mankind ; nor was it possible it could , after a man had sinned ; and yet in its nature , an absolute covenant of works , or do for life , or perish . the man that doeth these things , shall live in them . obj. 9. circumcision could not oblige the iews , in its own nature , to keep the whole law , because paul circumcised timothy : if , in the very nature of the act , it had bound timothy to keep the law for iustification , how could it have been paul's liberty so to do ? saith mr. flavel , which he asserts it was , gal. 2.3 , 4. p. 226. answ. 1. that circumcision did oblige the jews to keep the whole law , is evident , gal. 5.3 . and , as i hinted before , our learned annotators , on the said place , speak the same thing positively . take more largely their very words : they were obliged to one part of the law ; they must be obliged to all other parts of it ; besides , that circumcision was an owning , and professing subjection to the whole law , &c. obj. but did not the fathers then , by being circumcised , acknowledge themselves debtors to the law ? ( he answers ) yes , they did acknowledge themselves bound to the observation of it , and to endure ( upon the breaking of it ) the curse of it ; but they were discharged from that obligation , by believing in christ , who was made a curse for them , that he might redeem them from the curse of the law. thus pool's annotations . 2. but , as to paul's circumcising timothy , it was , when he knew circumcision was abolished ; and therefore , it could not oblige him , paul well knew , to keep the law. sith no law , in its own nature , can oblige any person , according to the nature , and quality of it , when 't is abrogated and in no force , tho' he saw it was his liberty , for some reasons to do it : but those christians , corrupted by false teachers , did not believe , that circumcision , and other legal rites , were abolished , but that they were in full force as ever ; and therefore , he tells them , ( granting it was , as they believed ) if they were circumcised , they were obliged to keep the whole law , tho' his great design was to take them off from seeking justification by works . therefore , 3. 't is evident , paul did not circumcise timothy , in obedience to the law given by the lord ; but for other politick reasons , in complying with the weakness of some jewish christians : after the same manner he submitted to some other rites also , of the ceremonial law , as shaving the head , and purifying himself , which was then also abolished , tho' not deadly , say expositors , then though those ceremonies , were dead , and so nothing in them , act. 21.24 . circumcision was , alas ! dead , and this paul knew , therefore could not hurt timothy : but those , to whom he wrote , thought it was alive ; and therefore , it would not only hurt , but destroy them , or be destructive to them , upon the account of the obligation it lay them under , if it was as they conceived . this being so , what is become of mr. flavel's argument , which he makes such boast of , as if unanswerable ? pag. 231. obj. 10. the root is holy , therefore the branches ; that is , as abraham was holy , so were all his seed ; and as believers are holy , so are all their children ; and as the natural branches of abraham was broken off for their unbelief , so the gentiles are grafted in , in their stead , and succeed in their privileges , and so their seed are holy , with an external relative covenant holiness , rom. 11.16 . and therefore , may be baptized , and have right to church membership . * answ. there is a two fold holiness spoken of : 1 st . an external foederal holiness . 2 d. a true spiritual inherent holiness . now the children of believing gentiles , are not holy with an external relative foederal holiness nor have they a right to baptism , nor church membership , for two reasons : first , because baptism is of mere positive right , nothing but a command , example , or some well grounded authority from christ , that can give them a right thereto . secondly , because the gospel church is not constituted , as the jewish church was , 't is not national , but congregational ; it consisteth not of the carnal seed as such , but only of the spiritual seed , i. e. adult persons who believe . where do we find , in all the new testament , that the children of believers as such , were baptised , and taken into the church , as being in an external relative covenant ? holy mr. tho. goodwin ( as i find him quoted by a learned writer , in a book called two treatises , p. 6● . ) saith , in the new testament , there is no other holiness spoken of , but personal , or real , by regeneration ; about which , he challenged all the world , to shew to the contrary . i have shewed you , the ax is laid at the root of all external , relative , foederal , holiness , which qualified under the law , for jewish ordinances , and church membership . — but 3 we will now come to examine this text of holy scripture , rom. 11.16 . there are various interpretations of what is meant by the root in this place . 1. some understand it of the covenant . 2. some of christ. 3. some of abraham , isaac , and jacob. 4. some of abraham only . i now agree with the last , and say abraham is the root spoken of here : but pray observe , as he was a two-fold father , so he was a two-fold root : first , the father , or root of all that believe , secondly , the father , or root of all his natural seed as such ; but this place referrs to him as he was the root of all his true spiritual seed ; and if so , the holiness of the branches is real , spiritual , and internal ; ( and not external foederal holiness ) for such , as is the holiness of the root ( as meant here ) such is the holiness of the branches ; but abraham was believingly , personally , spiritually , and internally holy , ergo , such are all the branches spoken of here . and indeed , for want of faith , and spiritual holiness , that was in the root . were many of the natural branches broken of , from being any more a people , in an external covenant relation with god ; for this is the covenant i have shewed , the ax is now laid at the root of , viz. the external covenant . the jews were broken off , or cut down by their unbelief ; their old church state , and covenant being gone , they not believing in christ , and so united to the true olive , and the gentiles by faith , were grafted in ; they having obtained the fatness of the root , o● faith , and righteousness of abraham , and of the covenant of grace made with him , who is called , the father of all that believe . a learned writer says , 1. the holiness here meant , is first , in respect of god's election , i. e. holiness , personal and inherent in god's intention . 2. it is also a holiness , derivative , not from any ancestors , but abraham , not as a natural father , but as a spiritual father , or father of the faithfull ; and so derived from the covenant of grace made with abraham . from hence it appears , there is nothing in this illustrious scripture , for what these men bring it , who think hereby to prove a holiness , which the new testament knows nothing of ; applying , the holiness and insection to outward dispensation , only in the visible church , which is meant of saving grace , in the invisible , and make every believing parent , like root to his posterity with abraham , to his seed ; which we deny . let therefore the jews covenant , standing before they were broken off ( from being any more a covenant people ) be what it would , i am sure no gentile is graften into christ , nor jew neither , but by faith ; nor can any be grafted into the gospel church , without the profession of such a faith. the jews , 't is true , were broken off by their unbelief , and were also now no more a church ; nor is there ( as i said once before ) any such kind of church , constituted under the gospel dispensation , as theirs was , viz. a national one : for they , amongst the jews , who were true believers , ( or the spiritual seed of abraham ) who receiving jesus christ by faith , were planted a new into the gospel church ; and between them , and gentile believers , there is no difference , since the middle wall of partition is broken down , eph. 2.14 . jew , and gentile , stand now by faith , and not by external , relative covenant holiness . thou standeth , ( saith paul ) by faith : o believer ! ( mark it ) not by birth , privileges , but by by faith ; ( as worthy mr. gary observes ) thy standing is by faith , yet not thy seed by thy faith , but thou thy self by thine ; and they , by their own faith ▪ faith is that , by which ( thou standing , and not thy seed ) hast right to stand in the church , and not thy seed ; but if thy seed have faith , and thou hast none , then they have right in this church , and thou shalt be excluded . and , although under the law , we deny not , but that the natural seed , or progeny of abraham , were all holy , with an external , ceremonial , typical holiness ; and consequently , they were then admitted to an external participation of church privileges ; yet now 't is otherwise , old things are passed away , and all things are become new ; now we know no man after the flesh , 2. cor. 5.16 , 17. that old church state is dissolved , and manner of admission into it , by external birth , privileges , or ●●●●●ive covenant holiness ; and 't is very evident this was effected by the death of christ : see eph. 2.14 . for he is our peace , who hath made both one , and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us ; having abolished in his flesh , even the law of commandments , contained in ordinances , for to make in himself , of twain , one new man , so making peace , vers . 15. the legal external covenant made with the jews , whilst it abode , was a wall of separation , or partition between them , and the gentiles , and caused enmity in them both , in the jews , because they contemned the gentiles , as a people unclean , and abominable ; not being circumcised , they hated them : and the poor gentiles , they seeing themselves out of the covenant , and so deemed strangers and foreigners , and without god in the world , they envied the jews : but now jesus christ has broken down this wall of partition , and slain the enmity that was between them , which was the ceremonial law , and covenant of circumcision , and all other external privileges , as they were god's peculiar covenant people , and these being abolished , and gone , now both jew and gentile are made one in christ , and become one new body , or church , viz. a christian gospel church : and hence he adds , and , that he might reconcile both unto god , in one body by the cross , ver . 16. that is , the outward wall of jewish rites , and privileges being gone , christ thereby designed , to bring both jew , and gentile ( viz. all the elect ) unto god , and both into one church state , no person , nor people now , having any external privilege above others , by the gospel covenant : and if the jews external birth-privileges , were a wall of partition between them , and the gentiles , let men take heed how they set up another like wall of partition among them , who are believers , and their seed , and unbelieving gentiles , and their seed , lest that prove a ground and cause of like enmity between believing , and unbelieving gentiles , as the old rites , and covenant privileges did , between jews , and gentiles . but to open that text , rom. 11.16 . a little more fully , as i have formerly done , 't is evident the apostle , in the 9th . and 10th . chapters to the romans , is treating of the election of grace , and of the covenant of grace , god made with abraham : these were his people which he had not cast away , chap. 10.1 . and of this sort , god had 7000 in elias's days , ver . 4. even so , saith he , at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace , ver . 5. hence he says , what , then israel hath not obtained , &c. but the election hath obtained , and the rest were blinded , ver . 7. he farther shews , that abundance of the natural seed of abraham , were broken off , how were they broken off ? why , for their unbelief ; they not receiving christ , but rejected him , and the gospel : and the new church state were broken off ; but that the gentiles might not boast over them , the apostle shews , there is ground left , to believe , all those that belong to the election of grace , shall , in god's due time , be brought in again , and so partake of the blessings of the gospel covenant , or promise of grace made to abraham's spiritual seed ; and to prove this , he in ver . 16. lays down an argument ; for , if the first-fruits be holy , the lump is also holy , and if the root be holy , so are the branches . by the root , i understand ( as i said before ) abraham , is meant , root , and father , signifying here the same thing ; abraham being counted the root , or father , as god represents him , ( not only of his own natural off-spring ) but of all that believe , or the root of all his true , holy , and spiritual seed , and so intended here . by the first-fruits , may be meant , isaac , iacob , and all the holy patriarchs , for they were given to abraham , as the first-fruits of the covenant of grace , or free promise of god to him ; and these were holy , with a true , spiritual , personal , and inherent holiness : also , thirdly , by the lump , may be meant , ( and doubtless is ) the whole body of the elect , or spiritual seed of abraham , from the time the first fruits were given to him , untill the gospel days , or whole lump of god's true israel , who also were all holy as the root , and first-fruits , were holy. fourthly , by the branches , he means , the true spiritual seed of abraham , or the elect seed , that then were living at that present time , as ver . 5. even so then , at this present time also , there is a remnant , according to the election of grace . and these were holy likewise , even as all the rest , both as the root ; first-fruits , and lump , or whole body were holy ; that is , all the the spiritual seed of abraham , were like himself , viz. holy , in a gospel sense , with a personal and inherent holiness . now observe , he speaks of some branches that were broken off , these seemed to be branches , or children of abraham : and so they were according to the flesh ; ( but were like those branches in christ , who bear no fruit , joh. 15.2 , 3 , 4. and therefore taken away ) he alludes , to the natural seed of abraham , to whom he stood , not , as a spiritual father , or root , but as a natural , and legal father , as they were a national church , and sprang from him as such , to whom the external legal covenant was made ; and these as such , for rejecting of christ , were broken off , ( 1. ) not broken off from the election of grace , for to that they did not belong . ( 2. ) nor were they broken off of the gospel church , for they never were grafted into that : but ( 3 dly , ) they were broken off from being any more a church , or people , in covenant with god , the whole old church state , and constitution , being gone , by the coming in of the gospel dispensation , and they not closing in with christ , in the covenant of grace , and gospel church , but utterly rejected him , and the new church state : for this they were broken off as a lost people , because not re-planted , or implanted into jesus christ , and the true gospel church , the old being gone , quite rased , and taken away : they have now no root to stand upon , having lost their legal standing , and privileges , as abraham was their father , upon that very foot of account , and they not appearing to be the true branches , or seed of abraham , as he was the father of all the faithful , or of all the elect seed , they must , of necessity , from hence be broken off , from being the people of god , or belonging to any common head , or root , in any covenant relation to god , at all : the dispensation being changed , the old house pulled down agar , and her son , cast out . old things past away , and all things being now , become new. but this new state , new blessings , and new church privileges they rejected , and so were the natural branches broken off , and the gentiles ( who were wild by nature , that is , never were in any visible covenant state with god , nor , in any sense , related to abraham , as a root ) were grafted into the true olive , jesus christ , and into the gospel church and so partakers of the sap and fatness of the root , and of the olive , that is , of the spiritual blessings of christ , and of the covenant of grace made with abraham , and privileges of the gospel church ; and this they received , and partook of us , as being first grafted by saving faith in christ , and so united to his mystical body . but since there are a great number of the natural branches , that are beloved for their father's sake , that is , for their father abraham's sake , as the root , and father of all the elect seed , they shall , in due time , be grafted in again , and so become a people visibly owned of god , and in covenant with him , as the true seed now actually are , and formerly were . and if this be considered ▪ what doth this text do , to prove the natural seed of believers are in the gospel covenant , or are externally , relatively , and foederally holy ; for if the natural seed of abraham can lay no claim , nor have any right to gospel precepts , or privileges as such , but are broken off , what ground is there for us , to think within our selves , that we , or our natural off-spring , as such , should be taken in , and so another wall of partition , and cause of enmity , set up between believing , and unbelieving gentiles , and their seed as such ? the apostle speaks , not of branches , or of being holy with an external , relative covenant holiness , but of such a spiritual gospel holiness that was in the root , viz. abraham , who believed in god , and it was counted to him for righteousness : and thus , all his true spiritual seed , who are actual branches and in covenant are holy , and also , all the elect of abraham , not yet called , are discretively holy , or in god's sight so , who calls things that are not , as if they were ; they are all holy in his account , and beleved for their father's sake , with whom the covenant of grace was made for himself , and all his spiritual seed : and 't is from this argument , the apostle argues , for the calling of the iews , and grafting them in , who belong to the election of grace . — therefore , there is no ground for infants church membership , or baptism , from hence ▪ and those who make every believer a common head , or root of their natural off-spring , as abraham was , either way , know not what they affirm , nor what they say : see rector rectified . moreover , the jews , who were broken off , are still the natural seed of abraham ; and if therefore , this holiness was an external , relative , foederal holiness ▪ they are still in that sense holy , as far forth as any child of believing gentiles as such , can be said to be ; but , 't is evident , this is not that holiness , of which the apostle speaks , nor is there any such holiness , under the gospel dispensation , spoken of , as to that text , in 1 cor. 7.14 . else were your children unclean , but now are they holy — this is so fully answered in that late treatise entituled , the rector rectify'd , &c. that i shall speak nothing now to it ; for from the scope of the place , 't is evident , the apostle speaks of matrimonial sanctification , and of the holiness of legitimation , see pag. 134. to 140. so that there mr. rothwell hath his arguments answered , touching infants faedoral holiness under the law , &c. obj. 11. if the children of believers , as such , are not now under the gospe● in covenant with them , and so to be admitted members of the church as formerly , then the privileges of the gospel covenant ( and membership ) are straitned , and fewer than they were under the law , mr. r's . paedo-baptismus pag. 2.3 . answ. 't is not once to be supposed , but that the external or temporal privileges of the iews under the law , were more and larger ( as well as church-membership ) than those we have under the gospel dispensation , since their church was national , and their promises and privileges consisting in earthly blessings : ( as they were a people considered in that old covenant relation ) for the jewish teachers or priests of god had many external privileges , which no gospel minister can once pretend unto . minister's sons had all a right to the ministry , they had a right to the tenths of all their brethren's increase and first fruits , and a multitude of other advantages besides , viz. they had a civil government of their own , power to punish capital offenders with death ; their temporal rulers were among themselves , but christ hath not set up such a gospel political church-state , nor given such power and such a government to his church under the gospel : what will be in the kingdom of christ in the last days we know not . they had a lovely and fruitful land given to them for their inheritance , that flowed with milk and honey , they were promised outward peace , riches , and gathering of much wealth , so are not we ; they had a glorious external temple , and what not ; also all their natural off-spring , were born members of their church . but none of these privileges can we lay claim unto ; all that are to be admitted into the gospel-church , have only a right by regeneration ( by the second birth ) and not by the first birth , we are to expect persecution and trouble in the world , and not peace and prosperity ; poverty and want , and not riches or earthly fulness : yet our privileges are better and greater under the gospel , than theirs were under the law , the gospel covenant being established upon better promises : our children when grown up , sit under the clear and glorious light , and preaching of the gospel ; which they , and theirs had then held forth , but in dark shadows , moreover the par●ition wall being now broken down , the gospel church is not confin'd to the one people or nation only , but now all , in all nations of the world , who believe and embrace christ by saving faith ; whether iews or gentiles , are joint-heirs together , and have interest in like spiritual blessings , now greater infusions of the spirit . alas ! what privileges had the poor gentiles under the law , and their children ? is not the matter well amended with us ? sir , this being so , what is become of your rational arguments , for infant baptism ? p. 2 , 3. obj. 12. circumcision in the very direct and primary end of it , teached man , the corruption of his nature by sin , and the mortification of sin ; therefore 〈◊〉 covenant of works , or condition of it . ( to this purpose mr. flavel speaks , pag. 231. answ. i answer , though it should be granted , that circumcision had such an end , yet that , that was the direct and primary end of it , he proves not ; for the direct and more immediate end and design thereof ( we have proved ) was something else , although we grant it was a dark sign , type or figure of that they speak of , viz. to discover the corruption of nature by sin , and the mortification thereof , and so also did most of the ceremonies of the law : but doth it therefore follow , those ceremonies ( and so circumcision ) did not appertain to that ministration of the covenant of works god gave by moses to the people of israel , which is abrogated and done away . must the shadow or sign be part of the substance , or belong , or appertain to the substance ? wherefore , ( as mr. cary well saith , ) until they can prove the sinai covenant and ceremonial law , &c. not to be in their own nature a covenant of works , this which they object here , has nothing in it ; since sacrifices , the passover , &c. as well as circumcision , were types of christ , and other gospel-mysteries likewise : and indeed mr. flavel seems to me to run upon a mistake all along in his answer to mr. cary , as if the latter makes no distinction between adam's covenant of works , and those after administrations of the same old covenant : for mr. cary , i am satisfied , means no more than what i have said , viz. that they agree in nature and quality , tho' adam had life and justification by his own perfect obedience unto that law or covenant , while he stood , and it was given to him to that end ; yet god gave not the sinai covenant , which required perfect obedience , to the end man might be thereby justified ; nor was it possible he could , since he had sinned , and lost his power to obey : but that law contains a clear transcript of the first law , and so of the holiness of god , and of that righteousness man originally had , and lost ; and of the impossibility of his being justified , without such a compleat and perfect righteousness : but the law as written in the two tables , was given in mercy ( upon the score or account i have mentioned ) to israel , in subserviency to the gospel , and to it was annexed the ceremonies , to shew that a plenary satisfaction must be made for the breach of god's holy law , and that this must be by blood , tho' not by blood of bulls or goats , but they might have understood , that by them , the sacrifice and blood of christ was figured , could they have seen to the end , or purport of them . therefore the true distinction lies here , viz. both are the first covenant of works ; both shew man must live , and sin not , if he would be justified in god's sight : the first in man's innocency , answered the end of a covenant of works ; the second administration thereof could not give life , nor was it given to that end , but it answered the end for which god gave it : and so much to this objection . obj. 13. you cannot deny , but circumcision sealed the righteousness of faith to abraham , and how can you prove a seal of the covenant of works can be applied to such a use and service ? thus mr. flavel , p. 234. answ. 1. i answer first , who of us say that circumcision was a seal of the covenant of works ? there is a great difference between a seal of a covenant , and that which was given as a sign or token of that legal and external covenant god made with all abraham's natural seed as such , a●d that circumcision was such a sign we have before shewed ; as also of their having the covenant or law of mount sinai , and land of canaan given to them , &c. 2. but that circumcision was a seal of that faith abraham himself had , ( not being yet circumcised ) and that he should be the father of all that believe , paul possibly affirms , rom. 4.16 . and yet it might well be of use to him also , as a sign or token of those other covenant rights and blessings granted to his natural off-spring , is evident . 3. and from hence we have proved , that circumcision could not be so , a seal of the righteousness of faith to any other person or persons , none having the like faith before they were circumcised , as abraham had ; nor were they made common fathers to all true believers , whether iews or gentiles . obj. 14. where the covenant of circumcision is by the apostle contra-distinguished to the covenant of faith , rom. 4.13 . the law in that place , is put strictly for the pure law of nature , and metatypically signified the works of the law , p. 235. answ. 1. i suppose no man besides mr. flavel , ever asserted such a thing as this is : i would know how circumcision ( a meer positive precept ) came to be a part of the pure law of nature ? for 't is evident , that the law paul contra-distinguisheth from the righteousness of faith , had circumcision in it , or else the same apostle needed not to have taken such pains to have distinguished between circumcision and the righteousness of faith ; and had circumcision appertained to the righteousness of faith , or been a gospel covenant , why doth he exclude it with the law from being so counted ? read v. 10 , 11 , 12 , 13. 2. the law therefore , of which the apostle speaks , is that ministration of the law given to israel , of which circumcision was part , and so of the like nature and quality with it ; and both contra-distinguished to the covenant of grace , or to the righteousness of faith. and that the law here is put strictly for the pure law of nature , is wholly without reason , proof ▪ or demonstration ; what law doth the apostle speak of in the preceding chapters , and also in this , see chap. 3.1 , 2. is it not that he calls the oracles of god , or lively oracles , act. 7.38 . given on mount sinai ? the law of nature , and the written law contained in the two tables ▪ are all one and the same law ; as to the substance of them , they are materially the same , tho' not formally ; both convinced of sin , both bring sinners under guilt and condemnation , and so that all mouths may be stopped , and all the world become guilty before god , rom. 3 19. both are a rule to walk by , both witnesses for god , but neither of them can give life , nor justifie the sinner in the sight of god , v. 20. therefore neither of them are any part of the covenant of grace , for if one of them is a part of it , both of them are ; if the law of nature be not so , the law written in the tables of stone was not so : yet the iews had the advantage of the gentiles , because their law was wrote in far more legible characters than the dimm law of nature , rom. 3.2 . as well as in many other respects . obj. the denying baptism to infants , hinders the progress of the christian religion . 1. that principle which hinders the progress of the christian religion , can be no christian doctrine ; but the denying baptism to infants , hinders the progress of the christian religion ; therefore such a principle can be no christian doctrine , this is mr. rothwell's main argument , pag. 2 , 3. to prove the minor thus he argues , ( viz. ) 2. that principle which makes the covenant of grace less beneficial and extensive than the covenant of works , hinders the propagation of the christian religion : but the former principle does so . ergo , to prove the minor of this argument , he adds another , viz. that principle which allows not as great immunities , benefits and privileges to the covenant of grace , as to the covenant of works , makes the covenant of grace less beneficial and extensive than the covenant of works ; but the principle that denies baptism to infants , does so , ergo. answ. 1. this gentleman calls these rational arguments ; but i have nothing but his own word for it : but to proceed , he should have shewed what those immunities and benefits were in the covenant o● works , which we by denying infants baptism , render the privileges of the covenant of grace to be less than those were : but , do you not intimate hereby ▪ that circumcision belonged to the covenant of works ? and if so , in vain do you urge circumcision as a privilege ; and also since the covenant of works is abrogated , what is there in your arguments for the baptizing of infants ? for all iewish rites and privileges may be forced upon the christian world by this argument of yours , or else we may say , the privileges of the gospel are less than the privileges of the iews under the covenant of works ; which i have already answered . 2. his mentioning that passage of calvin , is remote to his purpose , he speaks of the covenant of grace made with abraham , not of the covenant of works , which we say is not curtail'd by christ's coming , but is every way as extensive now , as it was from the beginning : but we have proved that there was a two-fold covenant made with abraham , and that circumcision did appertain to his natural seed as such , and so part of the legal covenant . obj but the commission , mat. 28.19 . ( you say ) is as full , or rather more beneficial and extensive than the covenant of works ; and consequently , that the baptizing of infants is a christian duty ; for had there been as general a commission given by moses to twelve elders of israel , as the blessed iesus gave to his disciples , and it had been said to them , go teach all nations , circumcising them ; this had been no prohibition to circumcise the iewish children , &c. ans. 1. is this that the mountains have brought forth ? we were big in expectation by your title page , wondering what new notion or arguments you had found out , from the commission , mat. 28.19 , 20. or what your different method should be to prove infant baptism — but truly sir , the log is still too heavy , you cannot lift it up — i see nothing new in your whole tract , nor any thing but what has been answered ; but this being the main pin upon which all hangs , i shall give a brief reply to you . 1. i thank you for your plain and just concession ; i see you conclude and grant circumcision did belong to the covenants or works : i doubt not , but you are right so far ▪ and with that , your cause is gone , and calvin and all that came after him , have said nothing in calling circumcision a gospel covenant . 2. but sir , suppose the people of israel had never been commanded by the lord to circumcise their children till moses came , and moses had given such a commission that you mention , viz. to teach all nations , circumcising them ; do you think they would have had ground from thence to have circumcised their infants ? whereas his circumcision required the teaching of all nations first , before they were circumcised , of which infants were not capable . 3. 't is evident , that our saviour in his great commission , enjoineth no more to be baptized , but such who are first taught or made disciples , and this agrees with his own practice , joh. 4.1 . he made and baptized more disciples than john : he first made them disciples , and then baptized them ; nor were there any baptized in the new testament , but such who first professed faith in the lord jesus . see our answer to mr. burkit , ( which i sent you . ) also our answer to the athenian society , this is there fully spoken unto . 4. if the commission be so extensive , as you intimate , why do you not go , ( or stir up some ministers to go ) into all heathen , and pagan nations , and baptise them , and their children ; and so that way , make them all christians : you may teach them the christian doctrine , i. e. faith and repentance , afterwards , as you do your children ; but the truth is , there is no need to teach them afterwards , the way of faith , and regeneration , ( if your doctrine be true ) because the chief thing they received in baptism , you say , is divine grace , viz. regeneration , adoption , and a title to the inheritance of eternal life , p. 20. sure those divine habits can never be lost . reader , take what this man says farther on this respect . obj. but you say , we neither regard , nor consider the chief thing in baptism , viz. the testification , or witness of the divine benevolence , taking them into covenant protection , and patronage , and conferring , and bestowing grace upon them ; for , in baptism , the chief thing is divine grace , which consists , and stands in the remission , pardon , and forgiveness of sins ; in adoption , or sonship , and in a right , and title to the inheritance of eternal life , of which grace , infants stand in need , and are as capable as the adult , &c. p. 20. answ. this is such doctrine , that few paedo-baptists , besides your self , do assert , or believe ; but , what proof do you give us to confirm it , from god's word ? you say right , we do not regard it indeed — doth baptism do all this ? — 't is wonderful : how ! conferr grace , and give pardon , and eternal life ! — you ministers of the church of england , if this be so , can do as strange things , as the popish priests in transubstantiation ; you can , by sprinkling a little water on the face of a babe , it appears , change the evil , and vitious habits , form christ in the soul , raise the dead to life , and of a child of wrath , make a child of god. it grieves me to think , a man called a minister of the gospel , should teach such corrupt doctrine , and deceive the ignorant . for , as it is without scripture-evidence , nay contrary to it ; for god's word , that tells us , baptism washes not away the filth of the flesh , that is , the corruption of depraved nature ; so 't is contrary to reason , and without any rational demonstration , as reverend stephen charnock , ( tho' a paedo-baptist , ) shews , many men ( saith he ) take baptism for regeneration : the ancients usually give it this term ; one calls our saviour's baptism , his regeneration . this conferrs not grace , but engageth to it ; outward water cannot convey inward life . how can water , an external thing , work upon the soul , in a physical manner ? neither can it be proved , that ever the spirit of god , is tyed by any promise , to apply himself to the soul , in gracious opperations , when water is applyed to the body . if it were so , that all that were baptised , were regenerated , then all that were baptised , should be saved , or e●se the doctrine of perseverance falls ●o the ground — and again he says , that some indeed say , that regeneration is conferred in bapti●m , upon the elect ; but how so active a principle , as a spiritual life should lye d●a● , and sleep to lo●g , even many years , which intervene between baptism and conversion , is not easily conceivable . charnock on regen . p. 75. sir , do but prove what you here affirm , and i will write no more against infant-baptism ; and till that 's done , all you say is nothing , in my judgment . but to proceed : such a commission you speak of , would not , in your sense , authorize those twelve elders of israel , to go , and teach , and circumcise the jews , and their children only , but all others , in all nations of the world ; this would be an easie way of making people christians : but , sir , the gospel , whatsoever you think , according to our doctrine , is more extensive , then was the law to the jews ; for that was restrained to that people . he sheweth his word unto iacob , his statutes , and judgments to israel : he hath not dealt so with any nation , for his judgments they have not known them , psal. 147.19 , 20. but the gospel is not restrained , or limited to any one particular people , or nation , but it is to be preached to all the world ; and , whosoever are made disciples , i. e. do believe , and are baptised , shall be saved , mark. 16.16 ( not that we suppose , men can't be saved without baptism ; for that makes no person a christian , or a disciple of christ , neither young , nor old , though 't is the duty of believers , to submit thereto . ) we doubt not , but that the same spiritual , and eternal blessings , which the jewish dying infants had , by the death , and merits of christ then , the dying infants of christians have now , according to the election of grace : but as touching the legal and external privileges of the jews , we have proved ( in this tract , and elsewhere ) that they had many more , in divers respects , under the law , than those , we christians , and our children , have under the gospel . as to those great advantages , blessings , and privileges of the covenant of works , which you talk of , i wonder what they were ; for the covenant of works could not give life , no justification , nor righteousness ( that could ) save by that covenant , no pardon of sin ; but , contrarywise , death , wrath , and the curse , is denounced upon every soul of man , for the breach of it . how vain then are your arguments ? in the gospel is life , is justification , is pardon of sin , to every man that believeth ; to the iew first , and also to the gentiles , rom. 1.16 . time would fail me , to sh●w how absurd your notions are , to what almost all our learned protestant divines , have wrote about the covenant of works . — the jewish infants received no soul spiritual , and eternal advantage by circumcision : ( what the chief advantage , or profit was which they h●d thereby , st. paul tells us , rom. 3.1 , 2. ) tho' it was commanded of god , for the ends , and designs , i have already mention●d ; and if so , what benefit can any infant receive by baptism , ( or rather rantism ) which is a mere humane innovation ? you confess , it was instituted by the church , as a needful thing , p. 37. and the church hath instituted it , because it is needful ; it was indeed never instituted , or appointed by our lord jesus : and , as to that custom among the jews , ( you speak of ) p. 7 , 8 of their baptising proselytes , i have fully answer'd it , in my treaty , called , the rector rectified , p. 24 , 25. and in my answer , to the athenian society . sir , you go upon a mistake all along , taking it for granted , that circumcision , and other legal rites , were great spiritual privileges ; for 't is no such thing : it was a yoke of bondage , not to be born ; and a great mercy it was to them , that they were delivered from it , act. ●5 . and therefore the jews , did they believe in christ , and see the nature of , and tendency of circumcision , would never speak after that manner as you mention , in p. 9. ( viz ) obj. i will rather be a iew , then a christian , because , as soon as i own , and profess their faith , my child , after such a declaration , is in covenant , as well as my self , and hath a right to the sign , &c. answ. sir , the jewish childrens right to circumcision , was not deferred , till their parents made a profession of faith ; but as they were the natural seed of abraham as such , it was the command of god to abraham , that gave them that right , and nothing else . obj. so , that by this account , it plainly appears , that denying infants baptism , is an hindrance to the progress of the holy gospel . answ. true , if infant-baptism doth make them christians , you say right , it must follow , that the denying them baptism , hinders the progress of the gospel ; but this is false which you assert : baptism makes them not christians ; we say , none but christ , by his spirit , can regenerate the souls of men , or make them christians : true , you may thereby give them the name of christians , but can't give them the nature of christians ; you may deceive them , and make them believe they were so made christians , and thereby undoe them eternally , by relying upon a mere cheat and delusion : this is a way to make false christians , counterfeit christians . what a christian is he , whose vile nature was never changed ? you would do well to get a great number of ministers , if baptism does make christians , ( as i said before ) to go into the heathen nations , and baptise them , and so make all the world christians ; but if you know no other way , for the progress of the gospel , then this , of making christians by baptism , god deliver the world , from your way of christianing the nations . you will not see , that the gospel church is not national , but only congregational ; the jewish church , in that , differ'd from the christian● : for , what is more clearer than this ? christ's church , is called , a garden inclosed ; christ's flock , is a little flock : those who were added to the church were separated , either from the jewish people , or heathen nations , were commanded to separate themselves , and not to touch the unclean thing . ye are not , saith christ , of the world. — you would make whole nations the church , and from the commission , inferr such a false conclusion . i have consider'd what you have said in p. 10 , 11. sir , when all the pagan world are instructed , and believe in christ , we will say , they have a right to the sign , i. e. baptism — but not till then , hath one soul a right thereto : prove what you say , if you can , i. e. that the children of christians as such , are christians , as the children of iews , were iews : or , that baptism makes any , either old , or young , true christians , or regenerates their souls : 't is not your bare assertions , or your saying it , that is worth any thing : what authority have you from god's word to affirm such things ? you give no more proof for what you assert , than the papists do for their vain traditions and popish ceremonies ; grace must be implanted in the soul before baptism , or the person has no right to it , 't is an outward sign of an inward spiritual grace , as your church asserts : baptism is not grace , nor conveys grace , if you can prove it does , i will say no more , but submit and acknowledge my mistake : but if you err in saying it does , do not go about to deceive your people any more . — you plead for making false christian , nominal christians : christianity is another thing than what you seem to imagine , the way is narrow , and the gate is straight , — regeneration is a difficult work , it requires the mighty power of god to be put forth on the soul ; nay , the same power that god wrought in christ , when he raised him from the dead , ephes. 1.19 , 20. as to infants being capable of the blessings of the gospel , so are heathens and pagans , when god calls them , and infuses grace into their souls : i have answered all you say upon that account , in my answer to mr. burkit . the commission in the largest extent , comprehends no more than such that are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 disciplized by the preaching of the gospel in all nations : the parents must be discipled , and the children must themselves in their own persons be discipled , as well as their parents ; and as their parents were before baptized ; and when a whole nation , both parents and children , are by the word and spirit , made christ's true and holy disciples , and as such baptized , then all the nation may be look'd upon to be christians : but we know what sort of christians you make , and your national church does consist of , that are made so by baptism , to our trouble ; if god does not make your members better christians than your sprinkling , or baptizing them ( as you call it ) hath done ; none of them , ( as it appears from christ's own words , ioh. 3.3 . ) can enter into the kingdom of heaven . in my former books you may read mr. perkin's , and mr. baxter's expositions of the commission they talk ; not at such a rate as you do ; tho' pedo-baptists . and tho' in your late letter to me , you seem to boast , as if some admire your book , and that your arguments are invincible , or unanswerable : yet that is not my conceptions concerning it ; and had your antagonist so judged of it , i doubt not but he would attempted your strongest fort before this time ; for i know very well his ability to defend this cause : indeed i wonder at his silence . but if you do proceed to provoke a farther answer , you may have it ; — this which i have done , was occasioned by my preaching on this text ; not intending a particular reply to every thing you have said , nor is there any need ; for you are fully answered already in our late treatises : yet i think the controversie much concerns you of the church of england , and such who are for a national church . as for our brethren , called congregational , i cannot tell what they mean by contending for the practice of paedo-baptism , nor do i well know what their sentiments are about it : they agree ( as i do understand ) with us ( and other christians ▪ ) that baptism is an initiating rite or ordinance ; now if their infants are in covenant with themselves , and are made visible church-members by baptism in infancy , and until by actual sins they violate their rite and privilege , abide members thereof . ( 1. ) then i would know whether they have their names in their church-book , or register , as members ? and ( 2 dly , ) whether they ever excommunicate ( or bring under any church censure ) such of their children who fall into scandalous sins , or actual transgressions , or not ? ( 3 dly , ) if not , what kind of polluted churches must thir's be , who have not purged out such corrupt members ? the truth is , i see not how infant baptism is consistent with any church state , unless it be national ; and no doubt , the first contrivers or founders of it , devised that way for the progress of that they call the christian religion , and so opened a door , that christ shut , when he put an end to the national church of the iews . — therefore i wonder at our strict independants , considering their notions , ( knowing how their principles differ from ; and their understanding or knowledge of gospel-church constitution exceeds others ) for baptism does not initiate into their churches , it seems by their practice ; unless their children , when baptized , were thereby made members with them . it is evident , that under the law , when infants were members of the jewish church , they were born members thereof , tho' the males were to be circumcised on the eighth day ; nor was the case difficult to know the right , infants had to circumcision : it was not from the faith of immediate parents ; but it was their being the true natural seed of abraham , according to the flesh , or being proselytes , &c. which gave them a right to circumcision , by vertue of god's positive command to abraham : — but now if the infant 's rite arises only from the true and real faith of their parents , the child , when grown up , may doubt if its parents , or father or mother were not true believers , whether they had a right to it or not ; or may see cause to question , whether either of them were in truth in the covenant of grace , or no ; ( for who knows who are in a true spiritual sence in covenant with god , ) especially if their parents should fall away , or apostatize , and become vicious ; which may demonstrate , they were not true believers ▪ and so not the elect of god themselves : and if so , their children had no more right to baptism , than the children of open and prophane unbelievers children have . the truth is , what i have said in these sermons , may serve to reprove such , who set up a new wall of partition , ( like that which christ abolished by the blood of his cross ) and so cause enmity to rise between the seed of believing gentiles , and the seed of unbelieving gentiles ; by making the children of ungodly ones to say , our parents were wicked , and not in covenant with god ; and tho' we were baptized , yet had no right to it : we cannot but envy your privilege , you are the children of believing parents , and are in covenant , &c. nay , and it may cause too , to trust to that birth-privilege , and so destroy their souls , by looking out for no other regeneration , but that which they had in baptism in their infancy . some reflections on mr. exell's new treatise , entituled a serious enquiry into , and containing plain and express scripture-proofs , that john baptist did as certainly baptize infants , as the adult . reader , just as i had closed with all i intended to have added to this short tract , a gentleman brought me another book newly published ; called , plain scripture-proof , that john baptist did certainly baptize infants , as the adult : — this book is written by one mr. exell , who calls himself a minister of the gospel : but with what good conscience a man of his function can give a book such a title , i know not : for if there is such plain scripture proofs , that iohu the baptist did baptize iufants , as he positively asserts ; 't is strange none ever saw , nor found out those proofs : neither paedo-baptists , nor antipaedo-baptists till now : — but i will appeal to all thinking and impartial persons , whether or no , this new and bold attempt of this man's , does not give cause to all people to doubt of all the former pretended arguments and proofs for paedo-baptism ? since new ways are thought necessary to evince it ; but such who read over this man 's plain scripture proofs , &c. will certainly conclude , that his title contains a grand untruth ; ( to speak no worse ) it argues these men are strangely left to themselves , or to blindness , that shall undertake to affirm for doctrine , without scripture demonstration or solid reasons , such things , which are nothing but their own fancies ; but those who are willing to be mistaken or deceived , let them be deceived : but to undeceive them , i shall make some short reflections upon his proofs , and if any of my brethren think it worth their while , to answer either of these two new asserters of paedo-baptism , let them do it . — the texts he builds all his proofs from , are these , viz. and there went out unto him , all the land of judea , and they of jerusalem , and were baptized of him in the river of jordan , mark , 1.5 . then went out to him jerurusalem and judea , and all the regions round about jordan , and were baptized , confessing their sins , mat. 3.5 , 6. from hence he inferrs , ( if i can gather up his sense ) 1. that by all , every individual person , both men , women , and children in ierusalem , and in the land of iudea , went out to be baptized of iohn . or , secondly , some of all sorts , sexes and conditions , and then some infants , as well as some adult . p. 9. 2. he labours to prove , that by ierusalem is meant all , both young and old. answ. put does it follow , because all sometimes doth include every one , both young and old ; or else some of all sorts , sexes and conditions of people , that therefore all must be so taken in all places , and consequently so here . i am sorry he shews no better skill in scripture rhetorick , where frequently by a synecdoche , a part is put for the whole ; and sometimes the far lesser part also : — 't is said , all the cattle of egypt dyed , exod. 9.6 . that is , all that were in the field , as famous glassius and other tropical writers note ; so christ is said to die for all , yet we know he dyed ( in a proper and true spiritual sence ) but for a few , i. e. for none but the elect. christ says , when he was lifted up , he would draw all men unto him , joh. 12.32 . doth that import every man ? or some of all degrees or sorts of men ? see the late learned annotators on that place : it signifies no more than many or some of all nations : see these scriptures , exod. 32.3.26 . ier. 6.3 . 1 cor. 10 , 7. so isa. 2.2 , 3. mark. 9.23 . ioh. 10.8 . act. 2.5 . phil. 2.21 . for all seek their own , &c. mat. 10.22 . ye shall be hated of all men for my sake . gen. 24.10 . all the goods of his master was in his hand : these and many other scriptures are to be taken synecdoccally , and so is this ; see glassius ill●ricus ; also philol●giae sacra , and our annotators on mat. 3.5 . the term all ( say they ) here is twice repeated , is enough to let us know , that it is often in scripture significati●e no further than many : — for it cannot be imagined , that every individual person in jerusalem , and the regions round about jordan went to h●ar john the baptist , but a great many , joh. 3.26 . behold the same bap●●th , and all m●n came to him , that is , to jesus christ. if iohn baptized them all , and jesus baptized them all , then they were all re●baptized ; all iudea and ierusalem come to iohn , and all men ( are here said to ) come to christ to be baptized ; in both places it is meant but some , or it shews many came to them ; nor can it be supposed , any that iohn the baptist baptized , were re-baptized by christ's disciples ; and yet the disciples of christ baptized more disciples than iohn , joh. 4.1.2 . when the lord knew how the pharisees had heard , that iesus made and baptized more disciples than john , tho' iesus himself baptized not , but his disciples , &c. he did it not personally with his own hands ; and this shews he baptized no infants , and then not those he laid his hands upon : for if he baptized none , he did not baptize them ; from thence i inferr , that there is no ground to conclude from these scriptures , mr. exell has reason to affi●m , that by all ierusalem and iudea , &c. must be intended either every individual person , both men , wemen and children ; or some of all sorts , degrees , sexes and conditions : but only it shews that multitudes came to hear iohn baptist , and many of them were baptized by him . 2. i would have him consider , tho' all ierusalem may sometimes intend every individual , yet 't is when the matter spoken of does equally referr to , and concern all ; as when the famine was in that city , no doubt the children were as much concerned in that matter , as the adult ; ( of which passage he would fain make great improvement ) but when the holy ghost gives an account of a great prophet preaching god's word in the wilderness of iudea , and of multitudes going forth to hear him , it is ridiculous to imagine , there went , or were carryed little children to hear him , or to be baptized by him ; unless , either directly or indirectly the scripture gave us any ground to believe the latter ; ( i am perswaded , this man from his arguments will not make any proselytes ) or confirm people in the practice of infant-bap●ism . 't is said , paul preached christ to the iayler , act. 16. and to all that were in his house ; can any suppose that he preached christ to his in●ants ? ( if he had any ) do people carry their infants to hear god's word ? ( if some poor women do bring such with them , 't is because of necessity , i. e. they can't leave them at home : ) therefore , there seemeth not the least shadow of reason , as far as i can see , to believe that children went , or were carried to hear iohn baptist , tho' it 's said all ierusalem and iudea went out to hear him , and were many of them baptized of him in the river iordan : the ministration of the word belong not to infants , — when god spoke to all israel , deut. 11.1 . by moses , that they should love and keep his iudgments and commandments always , he adds vers 2. and know you this day , for i speak not with your children , which have not known , and which have not seen the chastisements of the lord your god. — what tho' circumcision belonged to infants , under the legal church of i●rael , so did the passover , &c. and if infants have from thence a right to baptism , they have also as much right to the lord's supper : great part of your book is answered in these preceding sermons . but to proceed . 2. is it not said he preached the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins , mark 1.4 . do you suppose he did not require of such that came to his baptism , first to repent , or that he would baptize them , for remission of sins , without manifesting their repentance ? nay , and did he not refuse to baptize such he found , who did not bring forth fruits meet for repentance , or works , that were the proper product of true repentance , mat. 3.8 . you would ( with your brother rothwell ) have persons be first made christians by baptism , and then afterwards bring forth fruits of repentance : but this , 't is evident ▪ was not the doctrine , nor practice of iohn the baptist , nor of christ , and his apostles . if thou believest with all thy heart , thou mayest , act. 8. he that truly repented , and did believe might , nay ought to be baptised , and none else . obj. may be , you will say , that respects the adult . answ. i answer , there is no account given of any infant that was baptised , no precept , no president ; and that is forbidden which is not commanded ; or , for the practice of which , there is no ground , or rule ●rom god's word ; for all humane innovations , and inventions of men are forbid , and sinful : i doubt not , but if a man would try his wit , he might say as much for infants to receive the lord's-supper , as you have said , for the baptising of them . pray consider what you your self speak in p. 1. and if all must be acccepters , or rejecters , then all , and every individual pers●● are under , and must have as great express , particular and authoritive command ▪ to accept and receive christ , and every thing of christianity , in its right , order ▪ and manner , as another , p. 1. tho' you bring this for to prove infants must be baptised , and so receive jesus christ , — yet , i must tell you , it quite overthrows all you strive to do . — for , 1. where is there an express , particular , and authoritive command for them , to receive christ by baptism , or any ordinance , or principle of christianity , whilst infants ? and where is there any rule , or order in all the new testament , that the adult must first believe , and then be baptized ; but infants must be first baptised , and then believe : sir , god's word knows nothing of the last , and the right of baptism only depends upon christ's positive precept , and example of the apostolical church . 2. i affirm , that infants cannot be said , as such , to be receivers of christ , nor rejectors of him , because they are capable to do neither ; nor is there any other way taught in the gospel of receiving christ , but by faith. he that is baptised , who hath no grace , no true grace , true faith , is but a baptised infidel . obj. you object infants have the the habit of faith , or the habit of grace . answ. we deny it ; see how you can prove it , i. e. that infants as such , have the habit of faith. who is able to know that ? what , tho' god may change the hearts of some dying infants , or some who did live , were sanctified in the womb , doth it from thence follow , all infants in common , or as such , ha●e their hearts changed , or are so sanctified ? 2. you are to prove , that sacred habits , infused by the holy ghost , may be utterly lost ; for , 't is evident , infants that live , when grown up , tho' baptised , have no other habits , then such have , who never were baptised . how can you prove , there can be the divine habits of grace in infants , and yet those habits lie still , as dead in them , for so many years , as 't is from the time they are baptised , to their conversion ? a sacred habit , is a principle of divine life ; yea , a most active , and lively principle . can the weakness of nature hinder the operations of the holy ghost , in infants , when the power of the devil can't , in the adult ? when god works , who can let ? can there be fire , and no heat ? sure , such a mighty cause would have like weighty effect on the souls of children , were it as you suppose . obj you say p. 10. we must prove no infant is converted or else grant some infants to be there ; that is , john did baptise infants . answ. you mistake , your work it is to prove what you affirm : we are not to prove a negative ; yet i shall now , prove that iohn the baptist did baptise no infants , but only the adult . arg. 1. if iohn baptist required repentance of all those that came to be baptised by him , and infants are not capable to repent , then he did not baptise any infants . but iohn baptist did require repentance of all such that came to be baptized of him . ergo , he bad them repent : repentance was his grand doctrine ; and , he also exhorted them to bring forth fruits , meet for repentance , mat. 3.8 . arg. 2. if the being the seed of abraham as such , or the off-spring of believers , would not give the jews a right to iohn's baptism , then iohn baptised no infants : but the former is true . ergo , i have proved largely , in this treatise , that the covenant made with abraham's natural seed as such , would not give any of his off-spring right to gospel baptism . think not to say within your selves , ye have abraham to your father . if you answer this argument , you must answer this small treatise . arg. 3. if the covenant for the external in-covenanting of infants as such is abrogated , and the fleshly seed cast out , by the establishing the gospel covenant , then iohn baptist baptised no infants : but the former is true . ergo , this argument is largely proved in the precedent discourse . arg. 4. if infant-baptism does them no good , there being no promise of blessing made to them in their baptism , then iohn baptist baptised no infants : but infants baptism does them no good , there being no promise of blessing made to them in their baptism . ergo. if it does them good , or there is a promise of blessing made to them , in their baptism , prove it , since 't is deny'd : but to proceed . arg 5. if the baptism of the adult , who have no faith , no grace , doth them no good , nor can convey grace to them , then it cannot do infants as such , any good : but the former is true . ergo , what good did simon magus his baptism do him , or iudas's , who , no doubt , was baptised ? if you can prove baptism conveys grace to infants , or makes them christians do it ; for i utterly deny it , and have a cloud of witnesses on my side , among found protestant writers . consult with mr. rothwell , on this point . arg. 6. if all those iohn baptist baptised , confessed their sins ; and infants can't confess their sins , then iohn baptist , baptised no infant● : but the former is true . ergo , this argument you endeavor to answer , p. 36.37 . you would know what confession it was , which they made of their sins , whether verbal , or moral . 't is said , with the heart man believeth , and with the mouth , confession is made to salvation . therefore , say i , it was verbal . obj. you intimate , that some may want speech , or weakness , which may be an impediment to them , &c. answ. if they can any ways signifie , or make it known to the understanding of the administrator , they are true penitents : 't is , no doubt , sufficient if it be by writing , 't will do ; but man knows not the heart . what appears not , is not . your arguments , in p. 37. about their being in abraham's covenant , i have fully answered already : that will do you no good . iohn baptist denies that plea , when he said , think not to say within your selves , we have abraham to our father . do you think baptism turns people to the lord ? for so you intimate at the close of your 37. pag. prove it , 't is denied . obj. 4. you say , such a confession would overturn the constitution , or institution of god by moses and casting infants out of that floor . answ. i have shewed you , that the gospel dispensation has overthrown the mosaical constitution , or legal church of the jews ; and that christ has thrown out the fleshly seed , as such i. e. no infant is to be a member of the gospel church ; and i have given my reasons why i have so said , which you may answer if you please . 7 thly , because it was repugnant to the end , and grand design of iohn's ministry , to receive and basptise every body , even men , women , and children , without distinction ; his ministry being most strict , and severe , ( as 't is acknowledged by all men. ) his ministry of preaching , and baptising was held forth by the prophet , in these words , mal. 4.1 . the day shall come , which shall burn as an oven . he lays the ax at the root ; he preached no such easie way of making men christians , nor church members , as these paedo-baptists speak of ; his ministry seemed like to fire ; in him was the spirit of burning kindled , as mr. cotton , on the covenant , observes ; p. 21. the lord also prepared his people by a spirit of burning , which , as a spirit of bondage , he doth shed abroad into the hearts of men : this we read of mal. 4.1 . it is spoken of iohn the baptist ; which did burn as an oven against the scribes , and pharisees , and left them neither the root of abraham's covenant , nor the branch of their own good works : he cutteth them off from the covenant of abraham , mat. 3.9 . think not to say within your selves , we have abraham to our father ; and so , by cutting them off from the root , he leaveth them no ground to trust to . but this man renders iohn's ministry , to be of a quite contrary nature , even the most easiest , flesh-pleasing doctrine that ever was preached . if he received all to his baptism : certainly he has made sad work for repentance , for abusing the ministry of this great and holy prophet . arg. 7. if iohn the baptist was to prepare christ's way , i. e. fit persons , as proper materials , for christ's new , and spiritual temple , which consisteth only of living stones , viz. believing men , and women , then iohn did not baptise carnal persons , nor ignorant infants : but the former is true . ergo , arg. 8. iohn , upon their unfeigned repentance , baptised all that he did baptise , for the remission of sins ; and no persons have remission of sins , without such repentance . ergo , can baptism it self give remission of sins ? or , is thete any promise of pardon , without unfeigned repentance ? by this man's reasoning , all the carnal people of the jews , that were willing to be baptised , iohn was to baptise ; and he did baptise them , as well unbelievers , as ignorant babes ; for all his arguments are as strong to prove that , as for iohn's baptising of infants : which , if so , all pagans and infidels in the world , are to be baptised , and by baptsm , be made christians , and members of the gospel church . o , what a doctrine does this man preach ! do but see what work he would fain make of that confession of sins , which was required of all those that came to iohn's baptism , in pag. 37 , 38. to p. 50. i. e. it was such a confession that excludes no ungodly , or unbelieving person , that was willing to be baptised , so far as i can see . all that were of the church of israel , or in the legal covenant god made with abraham , he intimates , might be baptised ; nay , he tells us , in pag. 44. a confession made when iohn baptised , was not a commanded duty . men , after this rate , may even say what they please . arg. 9. if iohn the baptist baptised all the people of ierusalem , and iudea , and all those of the regions round about , then he baptised unbelievers , prophaned and impenitent persons , as well as penitent persons ; but he did not baptise unbelievers , prophaned and impenitent persons : therefore , he did not baptise all the people of ierusalem , and iudea , and all those of the regions round about . arg. 10. if iohn the baptist baptised all the people of israel , ( as before mentioned ) then he left none for christ , nor his disciples to baptise ; but iohn did leave some ; nay , more people for christ or his disciples to baptize , than he baptized : ergo , he did not baptize all the people of israel , or all of ierusalem and iudea ? that iohn left some ; nay , more people to christ and his disciples to be baptized , than he baptized ; is expresly asserted by the holy ghost , john 4.1 . when iesus knew how the pharisees heard that iesus made and baptized more disciples than john , &c. see john 3.26 . and they came unto john , and said unto him , rabbi , he that was with thee beyond jordan , to whom thou bearest witness , behold the same baptizeth , and all men come to him : how ! did iohn baptize all and yet all come to christ to be baptized ? this is strange , what people were these , and where dwelt they ? if iohn baptized all the people of ierusalem and iudea , &c. arg. 11. if iohn's baptism , and the baptism of christ , was but one and the same baptism , as to the nature , quality , and subjects thereof ; then he baptized none but such who were first made disciples , or who were first taught to believe and repent : but the baptism of iohn , and the baptism of christ was but one and the same baptism , as to the nature , quality , and subjects thereof : ergo , he baptized none but such who were first made disciples , &c. that the nature , quality , and subjects thereof , were one and the same , all generally affirm : i know no difference , but that after christ was dead and risen , they that were then baptized , were baptized into him that was come : dead , buried , and raised again ; but iohn baptized them , as such that believed in him , that was to die , &c. christ having then not actually suffered . 't is evident , that christ's commission impowers his disciples to baptize only such who were discipled , or such who did believe , is plain , mat. 28.19.20 . mark 16.16 . and this was his practice , iohn 4.1 . arg. 12. if iohn baptized all the people of ierusalem , &c. then how was the ax laid to the root of the tree ? and how was the chaff sanned-away out of the floor ? 't is evident , his ministry was to separate or sever the wheat from the chaff , the good from the bad , the carnal seed from the spiritual , and not to continue them together : for his ministry , and the ministry of christ was the same , tho' christ had the precedency , or the far greater glory : yet the design of iohn's ministry was the same with the ministry of jesus christ. obj. but , saith mr. exell it can be intended of no other confession , than what would consist with john's excluding or casting of none cut , or purging of none out of 〈◊〉 floor , or cutting of no tree down : for that he did not that , but threatned them with christ's doing of it , mat. 3.9 , 10.12 speaking of that confession the people made to iohn . answ. this man would have us believe , that the doctrine and work of christ , and that of iohn's , were not consistent , or of one and the same nature ; but directly or repugnant contrary one to the other , viz. iohn receives all , baptized all , both good and bad ; and lets every tree stand and grow as it will , on its own natural and evil root : he gathered all into the garner , even both the wheat and the chaff too : but christ quite overthrew and destroyed when he came , all this that iohn did , i. e. christ lays the ax at the root , and cuts sinners down ; all must be true penitent , all must believe , or christ will receive them not , baptize them not : and he so purges his floor , that no chaff must be received into his garner , i. e. into his gospel church , for this the man's words implies : let the paedo-baptists view the strength of this champion . doth not iohn tell the people when they came to his baptism , now the ax is laid to the root of trees ? his doctrine is laid to the root , and tended to purge out the chaff , as palpably as did the ministry and doctrine of christ ; tho' 't is true , 't is christ's work to make all iohn preached , or any other minister , effectual : iohn preached , saying , repent , &c. christ preached the same doctrine , saying , repent , for the kingdom of heaven is at hand : john is the voice of one crying in the wilderness , prepare ye the way of the lord , make his paths streight , mark 1.3 . the jews had made the way to heaven broad and easie ; but iohn strives to undeceive them , and to shew the way was narrow , and the gate streight , like as christ himself speaks , because streight is the gate , and narrow is the way that leadeth unto life , and few there be that find it , mat. 7.14 . but this man intimates that iohn preached not this doctrine , but one quite different ; he makes the way so broad , that all ierusalem , iudea , and all the multitudes round about , might come and walk in it ; which if so , instead of prepairing of christ's way , he obstructed and hindered christ in his way , and made him more work to do , even to undoe all that iohn had been a doing . but pray be pleased to take his answer to one of our arguments brought against what he affirms , that iohn baptized infants , viz. all those that iohn baptized , confessed their sins , but infants could not confess their sins ; ergo , iohn did not baptise infants . obj. says he , we are not to believe any other confession here intended , than what was consistent with the promise and covenant made with abraham , &c. so that if it must give no right to the participation of the ordinance , [ that is , a confession must give no right , ] for then ( saith he ) the promise and covenant must be put an end to , and they must have no right by them , p ▪ 37. answ. 1. doth not iohn positively deny , that the covenant made with abraham's natural seed as such , did give them a right to his baptism ? for this we have proved to be the proper purport of that expression of his : think not to say within your selves ; we have abraham to our father : and mr. cotton asserts the same as i have shewed . 2. we have also proved , that the legal covenant , made with abraham's natural seed as such , is put an end to , by the establishment of the gospel dispensation . obj. 2. it is not to be taken as intended of any other confession , than what would consist with the capacity of them that were represented to john to be the objects of his ministry , which were parents and children , mat. 4.6 . luk. 1.17 . if there should have been any other confession than what would consist with these ; how should john turn them to the lord , unless they might be as well turned without a confession , and without baptism , as with it , p. 37. answ. 1. if the confession consisted with the capacity of those that heard his ministry , then infants , were excluded , because they , were not capable to make any confession at all , but 't was so ; ergo , 2. what tho' 't is said iohn was to turn the people to the lord , and the hearts of children to the fathers : was he able to change the hearts of infants ? or were infants hearts turned from their fathers , that they need , whilst iufants to have their hearts turned to them ? are not my sons and daughters my children , when they are 20 , 30 , or 40 , years old , as well as they were my children when but two days old ? obj. 3. it cannot be taken to be any other confession , than what would consist with all the people , being then the visible church of god , &c. p. 38. answ. then it appears by this man , all the whole church of the jews , both parents and children , were by iohn baptist to be taken into the gospel church by baptism ; for else , saith he , all the whole church must be overturned . and so i have proved it is ; even the whole jewish church , and church-membership . obj. 4. no such confession can be intended as would exalt natural strength or number of years , or acquired abilities , as necessary , qualifications ; for this is contrary to scripture , 1 cor. 1.27 . p. 41. answ. if it be a confession of sin , it must be made by such , who are at such an age , as are able to confess sin , and without natural abilities : what person is able to make such a confession ? can an infant consess sin ? 2. tho' all boasting is excluded by the gospel , i. e. of our own natural or acquir'd parts and abilities ; yet we may glory in the lord , and in his rich grace bestowed upon us : will this man say gracious abilities to confess sin , are excluded ? then all confession of sin is excluded . obj. 5. no other confession can be intended , than what would consi●● with all the regions , jerusalem , all judea , all the people , and all the multitudes answ. that is , i suppose , all the people , one or another ; who could speak or say they were sinners , might be baptized , and upon that confession , their children also ; who could make no confession at all : if so , all the world by this argument may be baptized , for no doubt , there were many thousand families that lived either in ierusalem , iudea , or in the regions round about that were not jews ; broad is the way to heaven , if this man's doctrine be true , or into the church at least . the man's mistake lies here , i. e. because great multitudes went out either to see , or hear iohn baptist ; he therefore concludes iohn baptized them all , because 't is said he baptized them , not observing the severe doctrine he preached , and what a holy sight and sence of sin and godly repentance he enjoyned on all those he admitted to baptism : for they he baptized , confessed their sins , i. e. their hearty sorrow for sin , and were turned to the lord ; for that was his work , and the grand purport of his ministry , — and evident it is , that there were but a few comparatively baptized by iohn , because christ by the hands of his disciples baptized more disciples than he , ioh. 4.1 . and 't is said , christ's flock was but a little flock ; and after christ's resurrection , the whole number of his disciples , were about one hundred and twenty , act. 1.15 . tho' may be some few more there might be in some orher places . mr. baxter , tho' a great asserter of paedo-baptism , contradicts this man , iohn baptist , saith he , received and judged of the profession of his penitents before he did baptize them , baxt. confirmat . restor . p. 68. it was such a confession that iohn required of those that he baptized , that gave him ground to believe they had right to remission of sin , for he baptized with the baptism of repentance , for the remission of sin ; read the late annotators on luk. 3.3 . the summ of iohn's doctrine , ( say they ) was the necessity of repentance and faith in christ , in order to the remission of sin : his pressing faith in christ , is most clearly declared by the evangelist iohn : matthew , mark , and luke insist more upon his preaching the doctrine of repentance for the remission of sins ; baptism was an evidence of it : — iohn did not preach that baptism was repentance , or that remission of sin was infallibly annexed to it ; but that the way to obtain the remission of sins , was by repentance ; and baptism was an external sign and symbol of it . it was , no doubt , such a confession that philip required of the eunoch , act. 8.37 . see here is water , what doth hinder me to be baptized ? philip answered , if thou believest withal thine heart , thou mayest . this man would render iohn baptist less faithful than any ordinary pious minister ; i believe saith gullespy , no consciencious minister would adventure to baptize , any who hath manifested infallible signs of unregenerations , gil's . aaron's rod. blossom . obj. but , saith mr. exell , to conclude that this confession mentioned , mat. 3.5 . was a confession with the mouth or tongue , without considering any thing of the words ? when there is no such discovery in the text , is somewhat too quick and too bold ; for what is expressed , is expresly asserted of all the regions , and all judea and jerusalem , and those called multitudes — and these general expressions contain and comprehend . men , women , and children , &c. answ. i must needs say , 't is a hard case you dare so boldly affirm all , both men , women , and children , were baptized by iohn ; whereas , 't is positively said , that they he baptized confessed their sins : you conclude against the express words of the text , and assert plain scripture proof , that iohn baptist did certainly baptize infants , and yet give neither scripture , nor reason , to demonstrate what you say is true : you can draw consequences to build an ordinance upon that which naturally rises , not from the texts you refer to ; nay , which is more , when the text is expresly against such a conclusion : 't is said , they that gladly receive the word were baptized : you may say , that some of them were infants , as well as to affirm some of these iohn baptized were such ; for infants are as capable to receive the word , as to confess their sins : nay , when 't is said , acts 20. the disciples came together to break bread ; you may affirm , that infants came then , with others together , to break bread , or to eat the lord's supper , for you know how to prove them to be disciples , no doubt on 't ; if you have not been too quick in asserting what you with boldness have asserted , i am greatly mistaken . you make baptism a very insignificant sign , what good can baptism do that parson that has no grace ? if you can prove what your brother rothwell affirms do ; viz. that baptism does regenerate infants , or is a converting ordinance : certaintly , but very few of that great multitude , you suppose iohn baptized , received any spiritual benefit by their baptism ; and i challenge all the world to prove if they can , that ever one infant received any kind of internals , spiritual or eternal advantage , by being baptized as you call it ; or external , either ; by the word of god. he adds an induction of twenty particulars , to shew what a confession it was not , that those iohn baptist , baptized , made ; but they need no further reply being all remote to the purpose brought for : then he proceeds into ten more , to shew it could not be a verbal confession of actual faith and repentance ; the most of them follow here . obj. there is nothing of a command requiring such a confession , neither declared by john , nor revealed by any other messenger of god : this contains his two first . answ. did not iohn require it when he said , bring forth fruits meet for r●pentance , &c ▪ a confession is a fruit of repentance ? and did not philip require it of the eunuch ? is not faith required ? and as a man believes with his heart , so a confession is required with the mouth , to make known that faith , unto salvation . obj. if such a confession was commanded , it must be gained by their own personal obedi●cence , and so the gospel is a covenant of works : 2. if commanded , then it was not voluntary ; 3. if commanded , then it must not be to shew the gr●ce they had , but their obedience ; these are three more of them , pag. 44. 1. answ. i answer , if , what god commands us to do ; those vertues so commanded , are gained or merited by our own personal obedience ; then all our evangelical duties must be meritorious , and the gospel is a covenant of works indeed : for that the gospel doth command many duties is evident . can't god give grace , and then command us by the assistance of his spirit , to cause those graces to appear in exercise to the praise of his own glory ? 2. or cannot that which god commands us to do , be done freely and voluntary by us ? or , doth free grace destroy the noble faculty of the will , because it over-powers its vitious habits , and strongly inclines it to that which is good ? do not saints freely and voluntarily by the help of the spirit and grace of christ , will that which is good and well-pleasing to him ? or , is a confession of sin not good , or an evangelical duty ? 3. do we not by our obedience to god shew forth his grace in us , as well as our duty of obedience to him ; what new divinity is this ? wonder , o heavens ! obj. if commanded , then the performance of it externally could not make a change upon their state and relation towards god , any more than the performance of any other duty : much less could it , when not commanded : pag. 45. 1. answ. because a confession of sin can't make a change upon our state , or relation to god : must we not make an external confession of that which god's spirit hath wrought internally upon our souls ? or , must an external confession of sin make a change , and so all other duties , or else not be performed by us ? 2. it seems to me by your unfound expressions , as if you conceive , that an external confession could make a change upon our state and relation to god ; whereas that makes no change , but only discovers , or makes known what a blessed change the grace of god hath wrought , or made on the soul : besides , it is not universally true , i. e. because a thing is commanded it can't make a change ; for sometimes a command is attended with power to change the soul , &c. iohn 6.28 . obj. if this , say you , had been a commanded duty ( viz. a confession of sin ) to qualifie them for baptism ; then they must not be admitted upon the account of their being the children of abraham , nor as the children of the promise , but the promise ceases , which is notoriously false , rom. 15.8 . pag. 45. 1. answ. we do not say a bare verbal confession qualifies any person for baptism ; but inward grace or truth , faith in the lord jesus christ ; this is the only qualification which ought to be in all the subjects of baptism ▪ and this faith must be made manifest by the confession of the mouth , and the holy fruits of the life : hence iohn required not only a bare verbal confession , which might hold-forth or signifie their repentance ; but also saith he , you must bring forth fruits meet for repentance : don't think to say you have sinned , or barely to acknowledge your iniquities is all i look for ; no , your lives must make it manifest to me , you are changed , or regenerated ; if you would , as true subjects , partake of my baptism : for of such my master's kingdom is to consist of , whose way i am come to prepare ; i. e. to make ready such a people for him , to build his chnrch with . 2. as to your other reason , viz. if a confession be necessary , then their being the children of abraham , and children of the promise was made to cease , &c. you hit it in that , for their being the seed of abraham according to the flesh , could give them no right to gospel baptism . iohn plainly told them the very same thing ; for the gospel has put an end to the jewish covenant right of admission of church-members ; the text you mention , rom. 15.8 . ( where 't is said , christ was a minister of the circumcision ; ) you strangely mistake the place , christ did not confirm circumcision , nor infants right to church membership ; the holy ghost means no more then that christ was a minister of the jews , as well as of the gentiles , or of the circumcision , as of the uncircumcision , and so speak our annotators on the place ; and as to the promise ceasing , see what st. paul saith , rom. 9.6 . tho' the carnal seed of abraham , as such , are now rejected , yet the promise of god is not made of none effect . for ( saith he ) they are not all israel which are of israel ; neither , because they are the seed of abraham , are they all children , v. 7. that is , they which are the children of the flesh , these are not the children of god ; but the children of the promise are counted for the seed , v. 8. can't you see from hence who are the seed of the promise ? even none else , but such who are begotten and born of the spirit , or are in christ , gal. 3.29 . so that , what you say is notoriously false . your 9th . reason is the same with the part of your 8th . obj. you say in the tenth and last place then , the command of christ that infants must come to him , was and must be null and void , mark 10.13.14.15 . or be a fresh warrant for their coming to him , if john had cast them out pag. 45. 1. answ. we deny there was ever any command of christ for infants to be brought , or to come to christ to be baptized . 2. that text in mark 10.13 , 14. proves no such thing as you conclude it doth , they were brought to christ , 't is true , that he might put his hands upon them ; which was the way he used when he healed people of their bodily diseases ; therefore you say right , since iohn , or rather jesus christ , hath cast out the natural seed of abraham , and the old covenant too , as well as the old covenant-seed ; infant church-membership is made null and void , unless there had been a fresh warrant for their admission , i. e. they must be brought in and made members by an appointment of christ , or by a new institution , or they must not be admitted at all ; for the old covenant-right ( we have proved ) is gone for ever . as to what you speak in pag. 32. about the habit of grace : is nothing to the purpose , these are your words ; viz. obj. and if the habit cannot constitute us members , the acts or exercise of it , can never do it . answ. you do not attempt to prove infants as such either before baptism , or in being baptized , have the habit of grace : i have shewed in my answer , to mr. rothwell , that it can't be proved that infante as such , have the habit of faith or of grace , neither before nor in baptism ; if they had , doubtless those habits would appear some way or another , but they do not appear ; therefore they have no such habits infused into them ; all are born in sin , and are children of wrath by nature ; and baptism doth not convey grace , nor infuse any sacred habits : what tho' god in a miraculous manner , hath sanctified some infants in the womb , and may sanctifie such infants that die , who are in the election of grace ; do's it from thence follow , that all infants as such , or all infant of believers as such , are so sanctified ? — we read of one animal that spoke , must all animals speak therefore ? if you could prove infants had grace in the habit , or that it appears they are regenerated , you had said something to excuse their inability , or disability to make a verbal confession , tho' not so much as you think ; 't is the act of faith that must demonstrate the habit to us , or the fruits , or product of grace , that those habits are in those subjects christ commands to be baptized , non apparentium & non existentium eadem est ration ; they must act , must believe , must repent , or must be actually discipled , that baptism doth belong unto ; tho' i deny not but that where the habit of one grace ●s , there is the habit of every grace , and 't is as certain those habits can never be lost , 't is the seed that remains , of which the apostle iohn speaks ; ●or can those pretended habits lye still , or asleep , in persons , so long as your notion clearly doth imply — 1. he goes on to shew what the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which the learned he says ) tells us , signifie to confess and give thanks : what of this ; yet 't is by a ●erbal confession of sin , if that should be signified in it . 2. he says , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies to do it together : that would be confession . sir , 〈◊〉 not the genuine signification of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , alike ? similies a-like , do speak a-like , 〈◊〉 the same things : see schrevelius's greek lexicon , where you will find ●●e so defines the word . 3. no doubt 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies to speak out , they made an audible confession , ●nd not to whisper in iohn's ear. 4. again , he says , the word signifies a confession of known faults , no doubt of 〈◊〉 ; and therefore such a confession be sure that no infants are concerned in ; ●●nners have known faults enough , to confess when god opens their eyes , 〈◊〉 works grace in their souls . 5. and that the word comes from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which signifies to confess , or profess , ●●d is to be so translated , which signifies a confession by practice and actions . ●●g . 49. answ. this does not help the matter ; for 't is evident , the practice and actions of the lives of true penitents , more loudly declares or makes known that blessed change that is wrought in them , than a verbal confession can ; but infants are no more capable to do the one , than the other . moreover , he would have it to be such a confession that infants must be included , for else , saith he , — obj. they are excluded from the number that john turned to the lord ; or else it proves , that baptism was not a means to turn them to the lord , or bringing them to christ , p. 49. 1. answ. did iohn turn any children in their infancy to the lord ? we read of no miracles which he did , but sure this would have been no small miracle , if he had changed the hearts of infants . 2. we see you positively conclude , that baptism is indeed a converting o● soul-changing ordinance : you are of mr. rothwells judgment it appears , and i suppose a true son of the church of england ; but when you write again , do but prove this , and you do your work in a great measure . 3. but 't is strange , you should attempt to confute all the learned ; nay , and your own church too , for she requires a verbal confession of such that are baptized : and since infants can't do it , she causes others to do it for them : unless you suppose that iohn baptist ordained the rite of god. fathers and god-mothers ; for there is as plain scripture-proof for that , a● there is that he baptized infants . dr. du veil quotes grotius , who says , it plainly appears by the rite of baptizing in the popish church , that baptism is to be asked , before the person is baptized , which the surety does in the infant 's name , a clear distinct confession of faith is required , — i. e. renouncing the world , its pomps , the flesh and the devil : dr. du veil on act. 8. p. 282. the sam● does the church of england require ; yea , such a confession that attends regeneration ; for as such , she baptizeth them ; tho' they answe● by proxy , she baptizeth , not infants as such , but as they are believers . eun●mius speaketh thus , ziz . baptism is the seal of faith , faith is th● confession of the god-head ; 't is necessary we should first believe , an● and then be sealed in baptism , p. 278. of the same book . hierom saith , the lord commanded his apostles first to instruct an● teach all nations , and afterward should baptize such who were instruc●●ed into those great mysteries of the faith : for it cannot be ( saith h●● that the body should receive the sacrament of baptism , till the soul h●● received the true faith : see rector rectified , where there are divers of 〈◊〉 fathers cited , p. 129. to p. 237. t the same purpose . baptism ( saith mr. baxter ) is said to save us , and therefore , they 〈◊〉 will be baptized , must profess the qualifications necessary to be saved , — as many as have been batized into christ , have put on christ , and are all one in christ jesus , &c. and are abraham's seed and heirs according to the promise ; therefore saith he , it is clear , a profession was pre-supposed . our baptism is the solemnizing of our marriage with christ ; and 't is a new and strange kind of marriage , where there is no profession of consent . baxt. on confirmation , &c. p. 32. ' we find , saith the same baxter , that when iohn baptist set up his ministry , ( 1. ) he caused the people to confess their sins , mat. 3.6 . and if we confess our sins , god is faithful and just to forgive us our sins , 1 john 1.9 . and whereas some say ( saith he ) that iohn called them a generation of vipers : i answer , we will believe that , when they prove it . ( 2. ) if he baptised them , it was not till they confessed their sins ; and and it seems by his charge , not till they promised to bring forth fruits meet for repentance , mat. 3.8 . confirmat . p. 24. as to those in act. 2.37 . it is plain , they made an open profession ; — ( 3. ) it is said , they that gladly received the word , were baptized : we may not imagine , that peter was god , or knew the hearts of those thousands ; and therefore , he must know it by their profession , p. 25. he says in p. 26. the constant practice of the universal church confirms the same , i. e. that an express profession or confession of faith and repentance is necessary , before persons are baptized : he adds , the commission christ ( saith he ) directeth his apostles to make disciples , and then baptise them ( and this say i , excludes all infants : ) how was it known the samaritans believed philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of god , &c. but by , their profession ? saul had more than a bare profession before baptized , pag. 27 , 28. the converted gentiles , act. 13.28 . shewed their belief , and glorified god openly ; the same may we say of the iaylor , saith he , and crispus , act. 18.8 . p. 29. ' the believing ephesians confessed , and shewed their deeds , thus far mr. baxter . obj. a confession could not be of such concernment as to exclude all , from any right to baptism ; for then the pharisees and lawyers could not have been guilty 〈◊〉 such sin , in their being not baptized of john , luk. 7.30 . p. 49. answ. such arguing i never met with before ; doth if follow , that a con●ession of sin was not necessary , because 't is said , the pharisees and lawyers ●ejected the counsel of god , in not being baptized of john ? was that their great●st evil ? or did not their horrid evil rather lie in their impenitency and unbelief , which excluded them from having a right to baptism , or in ●heir not receiving iohn's doctrine of repentance for the remission of ●ins and bringing forth fruits worthy of amendment of life ? see our la●●●●notators on the place , they tell you in that lay their great sin , and th●●● not submitting to baptism , as a testimony of such a repentance : 〈◊〉 say they , the baptism of iohn in scripture , signifieth his whole administration , or the doctrine he preached , as well as the ordinance of 〈◊〉 by him administred ; and so must be interpreted , where our saviour ask'd the pharisees , whether the baptism of john was from heaven or of men ? and they durst not say from heaven , lest christ should have ask'd them , why then do ye believe him not ? they were not baptized of him , is the same thing with they would be none of his disciples ; they did then , like as some ungodly persons do now ; reject the counsel of god against themselves , in not partaking of the ordinance of the lord's supper : yet their bare rejection of that , is not so much their sin and guilt , as their not believing , repenting , or imbracing of jesus christ , or obtaining those previous and antecedent qualifications required of all such who ought to come to that sacred ordinance . obj. it is said , the people ask'd him , what shall we do ? and whether were it some , for all ? or every individual , who can tell ? and if the adult did speak , and the children could not , were not the parents to take care that they might have the means to flye from wrath to come , as well as themselves ? and to be taught to take god's way as well as themselves ? it being after baptism , and was there any question to be made ? but they would take care about this , if they were truly awakened ? and especially when the children's names were as expresly in john's commession as the parents ? and if they did not take care about them , was it not their sin ? and their grievous sin too ? against the express declared will of god concerning them , luke 1.17 . mal. 4.6 . if he that provideth not for the bodies of his children , hath denyed the faith , and is worse than an infidel , wh●● notorious monsters had these people been , if when they were awakened to see the wrath of god in the fire of hell coming in upon them , should not take care th●● it might be prevented from their children , as well as from themselves , — pag. 50. answ. such blindness is enough to afflict the soul of any enlightned person ; 't is evident , this man concludes the external rite of baptism , o● a bare subjection to that ordinance , was the very means to escape the wrath of god , and eternal burning in hell ; and not only for infants but the adult likewise : whereas , i find no sound and understanding protestant of his judgment ; nor doth he produce either scripture or solid reason for what he asserts : could he prove that to baptize childre● or the adult , would save their souls from god's wrath , or hell-fire ; ce●●tainly , all would be notorious monsters , that would not endeavour to pe●●swade all heathens , turks , and pagans in the world , to be baptized , or n●● take care to baptize their infants : but alas ! we know that for 〈◊〉 person to be baptized , who is not regenerated , it will avail him nothing , 〈◊〉 no more than simon magus his baptism did him : 't is not circumcision av●●●ed , nor uncircumcision , but a new creature . answ. 2. but before he had gone so far as to assert the great profit of i●●fant-baptism , and the dreadful danger and sin of parents in not baptiz●● them ; he should have proved , that god doth enjoin or command 〈◊〉 thing of parents , viz. to see their children baptized : for , where there 〈◊〉 law , there is no trransgression : another man may argue , that the ordidinance of the sacred supper of our lord , is a means or way for our children to escape the wrath of god , and so charge parents to bring them to that sacrament , as well as to that of baptism . sir , the fault and sin of parents lies not where you place it , but in that , when they are grown up , they neglect to teach them their duty of looking out for a changed heart , or to get faith and repentance , or to obtain an interest in jesus christ , for there is no other way to escape the wrath of god for our selves , nor our children when grown up , but by christ alone , as he is received through faith : and whosoever do not so take care of their childrens souls , are greatly guilty before god ; but to baptize them , since there is no warrant for it , no command from god , no president , or example in all the sacred scripture ; that would but bring great guilt upon their own heads : add thou not , to his words , lest he prove thee , and thou art found a liar . answ. 3. you abuse that holy text , mal. 4.6 . luke 1.17 . iohn had no infants in his commission , tho' he was to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children , and the hearts of the children to the fathers ; yet children there doth not mean infants , for it must be such children , whose hearts were turned from their parents , and who were capable to hear , and and understand iohn's doctrine ; and so to be convinced of their evil , in having their hearts set against their parents : the meaning is , that iohn was to preach both to young and old , who were arrived to understanding , and to turn them to the lord , and one to another . obj. if their confession was a confession of true penitents , then this repentance was wrought in them before the holy ghost was poured upon them , or before they were baptized with the holy ghost by christ , and how could that be ? pag. 51. answ. 1. doth this man think that there was no true conversion wrought by the preaching of iohn baptist , nor by christ himself , or his apostles , until the extraordinary gifts of the spirit were given , which was not till after the resurrection and assension of our blessed saviour ? he that will heed such a writer , let him ; for by this argument , the holy apostles were not true penitents , until they were baptised with the holy ghost , and yet did not christ tell them they were clean ? tho' not all , ioh. 13.10 . and that they who then believed in him , had everlasting life , ioh. 5. according to this man's notion , christ had no disciples indeed , or no true penitent and sincere disciples , until after his ascension . answ. 2. 't is evident , that the baptism of the holy ghost did not re●ferr to the saving graces of the spirit , which are in all believers ; but to those visible , miraculous and extraordinary gifts of the holy ghost , which were only given to some persons in the primative time , to confirm the gospel , and to discover the glory of jesus christ , upon his ascension into heaven : the baptism of the spirit , signifies that great effusion of the holy ghost , like that at pentecost , act. 21.2 , 3. casaubon speaking of that text , act. 1.45 . ye shall be baptized wit●●● holy spirit , &c shews that the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is to dip or pl●●● as it were to die colours ; in which sence , saith he , the apostles ●●● be truly said to have been baptized ; for the house in which this ●●● done , was filled with the holy ghost ; so that the apostles might ●●● to have been plunged into it , as in a large fish-pond ; all were not ●●● the apostles days baptized with the holy spirit , let this author shew ●●● he can , that the word baptizo , signifies to sprinkle with the spirit , or pro●●● that the weakest christian in grace can be said to be baptized with th●●● holy spirit , — ye shall be baptized with the holy ghost not many days henc● &c. is not applicable to every particular believer , but to the apostles , t● whom principally our saviour spoke those words , and to some others , ●●● whom those extraordinary gifts should be given afterward . obj. but this would argue , that then those that john baptized , were ●●● penitents , which is contrary to christ's own words , mat. 11 . 2.7.1● to 25. answ. there appears in those texts he cites no such thing that he affirm● but he takes a liberty to say any thing so far as i can see : no doubt , ●●● iohn took great care to baptize only such who were true penitents ; sin●● he required so severely fruits meet for repentance , of such that came to ●●● baptism ; tho' no doubt , he might be mistaken in some of them , as p●●● was in simon , act. 8. tho' he sent some of his disciples to jesus to be f●●●ther confirmed in the certain belief , that he was the true messias that ●●● to come . nor doth christ's words imply as this man signifies in p. 53. that ioh●● disciples had bad ends in going out into the wilderness to see and he●● him : tho' some of the multitude might probably go out of curiosity , ●● for other ends , &c. how mr. exell , or any other man can rationally deny a confession ●●● necessary ? or doubt whether such a confession was required before baptism , viz. of that faith and repentance they then had i see not : for he ●●●poseth that iohn baptized them , tho' ungodly , and without faith , or the ●●● thereof appearing : telling them , they should afterwards believe in ●●● that was to come : whereas 't is evident , he required faith and repentance immediately of them , as antecedent to baptism , but i shall proceed no further . o! when shall this controversie cease ? doubtless , none have just cause ●● blame us to defend that which we believe to be a precious truth of chri●● when so many still appear to deny it , and write against it . the lo●● open their eyes , and send love and union amongst all t●● lord's people . amen . finis . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a47399-e630 * i am forced to repeat this answer again ; also you have is at large in rector rectified , in answer to mr. burket , pag. 108 , 109 , 110. an impartial account of the portsmouth disputation with some just reflections on dr. russel's pretended narrative : with an abrigdment of those discourses that were the innocent occasion of that disputation / by samuel chandler, william leigh, benjamin robinson. chandler, samuel. 1699 approx. 300 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 63 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2003-11 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a31663 wing c1933 estc r24745 08454317 ocm 08454317 41362 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a31663) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 41362) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1249:21) an impartial account of the portsmouth disputation with some just reflections on dr. russel's pretended narrative : with an abrigdment of those discourses that were the innocent occasion of that disputation / by samuel chandler, william leigh, benjamin robinson. chandler, samuel. leigh, william. robinson, benjamin, 1666-1724. [15], 23, 85 p. printed for john lawrence and abraham chandler, and are to be sold by a. baldwin, london : 1699. reproduction of original in the union theological seminary library, new york. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng infant baptism. 2003-07 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2003-08 spi global keyed and coded from proquest page images 2003-09 emma (leeson) huber sampled and proofread 2003-09 emma (leeson) huber text and markup reviewed and edited 2003-10 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion an impartial account of the portsmouth disputation . with some just reflections on rvssel's pretended narrative . by samuel chandler , william leigh , benjamin robinson . with an abridgment of those discourses that were the innocent occasion of that disputation . london : printed for iohn lawrence at the angel in the poultry , and abraham chandler over-against the white hart-inn in aldersgate-street ; and are to be sold by a. baldwin at the oxford-arms in warwick-lane . 1699. to the honourable major general earl , governor ; colonel john gibson , lieutenant governor , of his majesties garison of portsmouth : and the worshipful henry seager , esq mayor of portsmouth . honourable sirs , with hearts full of loyalty and thankfulness to our rightful sovereign king william , we humbly lay these papers at your feet , who procur'd for us a grant from his majesty , publickly to vindicate the common cause of the reformed churches , and settle the wavering among us in the belief and practice of those truths , which tend very much ●o the advancement of early piety and reli●ion . we appeal to you , the honourable go●ernour and worshipful mayor , as to disin●erested persons , and most proper judges of ●he truth and impartiality of our account ; ●hich is , what was taken by the pens of the ●cribes , without any material alteration . we ●hankfully acknowledge your condescending goodness , in honouring us with your presence and preventing disorders , during the time of disputation . may you still continue maintainers of justice and discipline in your respective posts : may your names be transmitted to posterity , as glorious reformers of a corrupt and degenerate age , in conformity to the injunctions and example of our gracious king : may others be excited and influenc'd by your example : may these hopeful beginnings be carry'd on , that there may be no prophane swearers or debauchees in your streets , and vice and wickedness may be put out of countenance and not able to shew its head : this is , and shall be the constant prayer of , your honours oblig'd humble servant , samvel chandler to all the pious and sober amongst them that deny , or doubt of infant baptism . brethren-in our lord , the matters in difference betwixt you and us , are not so great , as the angry and uncharitable on either side wou'd make 'em seem ; there may be some ( we doubt not ) both with us and you , that do hereticate and damn each other on the account of their disagreeing judgments about baptism : ( nor is it to be wonder'd at ▪ if those who are strangers to all serious religion , should put the respective differing opinions in the place and stead of it : ) but we were willing here to let the world see , there are with us , and ( we charitably hope ) with you also , those that are both of a sounder judgment and of a much better spirit . we are perswaded , there are many amongst you , who ( tho you do dissent from us in some lesser matters , yet ) are agreed with us in the most important and concerning things . wherever there are real christians on both sides , in any controversie , ( as we make no question but there are in this ) it is most certain , the things wherein they are agreed , are greater , far greater , than any wherein they can differ . when all the great substantials of christianity are out of doubt , both with you and us , that which shall afterwards remain as a disagreed , or doub●ed thing on either side , must needs be comparatively very small , and not worthy of the heat and zeal too commonly laid out upon it . and we must profess for our own parts , ( tho wherein we differ from you , we are verily perswaded , the truth is on our side , yet reckoning it to be only truth of an inferior nature ) it has not been without regret , that we have been engag'd in this contention . the disputation it self was not what we sought , or was forward to ; it was not we that gave the challenge : nor when given , would we have accepted it , had it not been so circumstanc'd , as that our refusal wou'd most probably have redounded to the detriment and dishonour of what we believe to be the truth : many , especially the more injudicious part of the auditory , before whom the challenge was given , not being likely to judge otherwise , than that what we maintain wou'd not bear a publick hearing , shou'd we have declin'd a disputation , which we were so publickly provok'd to . and for this publication of it , 't is what we are alike passive in : the world shou'd have had no after-trouble about that disputation , might we have been the choosers : but since your dr. russel has abus'd the world with a most false and unfair account of that matter ; we are necessitated in our own defence , as well as that of the truth , to publish the ensuing papers . we wou'd not therefore , that either what was said by us at the disputation , or is further added in these our reflections shou'd be misunderstood by you : this is not work that we take pleasure in , but what we have been constrain'd to : and if any reflections shou'd occur that may seem too severe ; we wou'd here declare , they proceed not from displeasure against the whole body of those whose sentiments agree with yours , nor against any one barely for that reason : but we cou'd not but manifest a just indignation against the egregious falsehood and uncharitableness of him that publish'd the late ( pretended ) narrative : and we desire , that no one of the pious and sober amongst you , wou'd apply to your selves , what was only intended as a rebuke to him , or those who are too like him . nor will the rest of you ( we hope ) take it ill from us , that we expose , as it deserves , that which is so base , tho' it be found with a person that pretends , in the present controversie , to fall in with you . you will not , you cannot once imagine , that his concurrence with you in this point of baptism , will hallow or excuse all that deceit and falsehood that appears in him : nor can you your selves like it , that he shou'd endeavour to support your cause with lies . this being premis'd , we are in hopes , the following papers , if they shou'd do no good amongst you , may at least be look'd into without doing hurt . so far as they report matters of fact , we can boldly , and without fear of being put to shame , appeal to the all-knowing-god , and to the numerous assembly , who were witnesses , that they are undisguised truths : and so far as they contain matters of opinion on one side or other , we leave you and all others to judge for themselves . yet ( as we have already intimated ) we wou'd not that the matters contended about in these papers , shou'd be over-magnified on either side : or that it shou'd be suppos'd we differ further than we do : and 't is a much greater pleasure to us , to offer any thing that may tend to narrow and lessen , than to enhance the differences there are betwixt you and us . after we had been tir'd with an unpleasing contention , we therefore ( as a refreshment to our selves ) undertook this more delightful service ; here to attempt , so far as may be , ( notwithstanding little differences ) to reconcile , and bring nearer to each other the pious and sober on both sides . to which end we shall , first , mention to you how far , and wherein we apprehend we are agreed : and thence manifest in the second place , how inconsiderable the things are , about which we differ . i. we are agreed , ( without doubt ) in every thing that is of absolute necessity to salvation : this is as certain as that there are christians ( that are truly such ) on both sides ; that there are those that shall be sav'd on both sides : nothing that does essentially constitute christianity is controverted betwixt us : and even with reference to this very point of baptism , we are verily perswaded , there is a nearer agreement betwixt the truly pious and serious on both sides , than is commonly consider'd . particularly , ( 1. ) it is , it must needs be agreed by all such , that there is no possibility of salvation , for any soul in our apostate world , but only in and thro' christ , act. 4.12 . ( 2. ) 't is also agreed , that the covenant of grace does fix the terms , upon which christ will be a saviour to any : that thence only it is to be known , whom he will save , and whom he will not be a saviour to . ( 3. ) 't is also undeniably plain , and what cannot but be agreed amongst us , that according to the constitution of that covenant christ will be the saviour of none , but such as are sincerely devoted to god : he never was , nor will he ever be the saviour of any others ; but such he has alw●ys b●en a saviour to , ier. 31.33 . psal. 119.38 . heb. 7.25 . upon these principles it is , that every serious soul does devote it self to god in hope . and we doubt not , but you are also agreed with us . ( 4. ) that such who are sollicitous about their own salvation , cannot be unconcern'd about the state of their infants . every pious parent will ( under the apprehension of that guilt and corruption which they inherit with their nature ) with enlarged affections yearn over their tender little ones , and earnestly cry to god for 'em , and gladly lay hold upon ●●y word of hope concerning ' em . those amongst you who are parents , feel and know what is the heart of a parent towards its child : and however you are ( as all that are truly christians are ) unf●ignedly concern'd for , and desirous to promote the common salvation ; yet for your infants , that are so near you , that are ( as it were ) parts of your selves , you feel yet another kind of con●ern : you cannot with any satisfaction die from 'em ; you can't , when they are dying , part with 'em , unless ●ou hav● some ground of hope concerning 'em ▪ nor can any thing afford you encouragement to hope ; without som● word of promise . nor is there any word of promise , only to such as are devoted to god and i● coven●nt wi●h him , in and thro' christ : to be with●ut christ , without hope , and without god in the w●rld , is represented as the case of such as are out of covenant with him , strangers to his covenant , eph. 2.12 . w●erefore , ( 5. ) ●e d●ubt not but you are also agreed with us , that we shou'd do all that in us lies , that our infants may be in c●venant ●ith g●d : you do desire ( as well as we ) t●●t they may be so ; and we are persw●ded , you will do whate●●r you are satisfy●d is your d●t● , in order to it . you w●ll ( nay , we doubt not but you do ) pray earnestly for ' e● ; and 〈◊〉 ●is promise with him , that he will b● your ●od ; and the god of your seed ; and depen●ing upon this promise , you do actually surrender and devote 'em to him ; and look upon your selves as oblig'd to educa●● and train 'em up for him , &c. this is what those that are seriously religious amongst you , do , and dare not but do : nor is any part of this a controversie betwixt you and us . now here is the internal and most excellent part of baptism , in which we are agreed . — after which , 't is somewhat to be wonder'd at , that there shou'd be any remaining difference , as to this matter : however , that which can after such agreements remain a controversie , must needs be concluded to be of an inferior and less concerning nature . which we now therefore come to speak to . ii. the things in which we differ ( from what has been already said ) appear to be no fundamental ones : which will also yet farther be manifested , if the things themselves be particularly consider'd . that which is the subject of the ensuing papers , and which is commonly agitated betwixt you and us , may be reduc'd to these two heads , viz. ( 1. ) whether we may , and ought to devote our infants to god in the ordinance of baptism ? and , ( 2. ) whether in the administration of it , we be oblig'd to dip the person wholly under water ? as to both which , it must be own'd , we are yet disagreed : you judging the ordinance of baptism , which we apply to infants , not to belong to 'em : and while we apprehend sprinkling it self , especially pouring a little water upon the face of a person , or dipping his face alone in water , to be lawful in the administration of this ordinance ; you suppose we are ob●ig'd to dip , or plunge the person wholly into water . and while there is a difference in our apprehensions , it must also be concluded , that on one side or the other , there is cert●inly a mistake : but tho' there be a mistake , suppose it to be on your side , or on our's , 't is far from being a damning one . 1. we will first ( as we think we have just reason ) suppose the ●istake to be with you ; yet we dare not , nor do a●count it a fatal , or undoing one . those of your way , that agree with us as above ( and all the pious and sober p●rt ●f you , we take it , for granted , do ) do only differ from us in a circumstance . you agree with us , that your infants are to be enter'd into covenant with god in christ , and seriously devoted to him , &c. you only doubt , whether it may be done in this ordinance : now tho we are perswaded , that they shou'd not only be enter'd into covenant , but also that this solemnity of baptism shou'd accompany , and add force to the surrender we make of 'em to god : yet we do not account it so absolutely necessary , as if the salvation either of the parent or child were suspended on it . we read indeed that baptism saves us , 1 pet. 3.21 . but the apostle to prevent mistake , immediately explains himself , and tells us , he does not intend it of the external ceremony , but of the answer of a good conscience : our unfeigned consent to the baptismal covenant for our selves and for those that we have power to consent , and accept it for ; and our sincere devoting our selves and them in that covenant to god in christ , is indeed necessary to theirs , and to our own salvation ; and this is that answer of a good conscience , which the apostle calls for : but where this is found , tho' the external ceremony shou'd be omitted ( whether thro' the mistake of the parent , or thro' the absence of a minister ) we don't think god will , nor are we any of those who dare , pass a sentence of death in such a case . and for the point of dipping , we reckon it to be yet much less material : the necessity of it we do indeed oppose ; and doubt not but the ordinance of baptism ( so far as concerns this controversie ) is lawfully administer'd , if water be apply'd to a person , in any other way or manner ; so it be done with the awful and solemn mention of the name of the father , son , and holy ghost : but yet , supposing it be so order'd , that the life of the person be not hazarded by it ; nor any breach made upon the rules of modesty , we do not condemn the practice of dipping : and in those two cases , all that are truly pious amongst your selves , must ( upon deliberation ) needs disallow it , as well as we . 2. and now we will suppose the mistake to be on our part : we make no difficulty of it , to own that we are fallible : as wise and good men as we are , nay , far wiser and better than we , have been mistaken ; and 't is no wonder if in many things we be so ; nay , we doubt not , but in some things at least , we are so , because we are men : tho' we do not know , that in any principle of religion we are so , for that we dare not knowingly err : wherein soever we are convinc'd of a mistake , we do , and we are willing to retract it : but we may be in an errour , and may not know it : and we will for a while suppose ( tho' we have never yet seen reason to grant ) that , as to the matters in difference betwixt you and us , we are under a mistake : yet neither can the mistake on our side endanger the foundations , supposing we shou'd be mistaken . for , as to the point of infant-baptism , if it shou'd prove to be a mistake , 't is only a circumstantial one , a mistake as to the time of administration : this is the worst that can be made of it , if we shou'd be mistaken : and where is the damage , supposing we shou'd be too early laid under the most-solemn bonds to be the lords ? tho' by the way , we see not how this can be done too soon . we do not , we dare not rest upon our having been baptiz'd in infancy , as if that wou'd of it self save us : we do indeed reckon it to be valid baptism , and that we do not need to be baptiz'd again , when we become adult ; but we don't think our infant-baptism will stand instead of regeneration , or exempt us from the necessity of faith , repentance , or a life of serious holiness , when we are adult ; nay , we look upon our selves ( by vertue of that baptism ) to lie under unalterable bonds and obligations hereunto . and now , tho' it shou'd be suppos'd , we are under a mistake , as to the time , when this ordinance shou'd be administred ; yet can it have no hurtful influence upon us , or upon any of those great , and important principles of christianity in which we are agreed . or again , if you suppose us also mistaken as to the manner of application , while we do not ( as you ) dip , or plunge the person baptiz'd wholly under water , but only apply a small quantity of water to 'em , most commonly by pouring it upon their faces : yet neither can this surely , ( if a mistake ) be by you accounted a very dangerous one : no part of serious religion can be thought to be endanger'd by it . the kingdom of christ does not consist in dipping ; so as that he that is dipp'd shall be sav'd , and he that is not dipp'd shall be damn'd : you your selves dare not lay so great a stress upon it . what! shall a soul that is truly penitent , and with serious actings of faith and love , gives up it self to god in christ , a soul that resolvedly lies at his foot , that will not wickedly depart from him ; can you think such a soul shall yet be rejected by him , meerly because in their baptism they were not dipp'd under water ! this is what upon serious deliberation , we are perswaded , none of you dare avow . iii. now then , since it appears , that the matters in contest betwixt you and us ( at least amongst the pious and sober on both sides ) are so inconsiderable and comparatively small ; we wou'd make it the matter of our earnest request to you , that they may accordingly be own'd and look'd upon by you , do not enhance or over-rate the value of 'em : by this means , a happy ●utual agreement might most probably be effected , however all the ill effects of our remaining disagreements wou'd be prevented or rem●v'd . ( 1. ) no way more likely than this to promote an agreement amongst us : apprehensions that the differences are greater , and the mistakes more dangerous than they are , do naturally influence both si●e to ●ook with strangenest upon each other , and prejudice 'em against what is , or may be offer'd on either side : but were it rightly consi●er'd , how little the difference is , it wou'd yet tend to ●ake it less ; by softening minds on each side , and preparing 'em with greater impartiality to entertain whatever convincing evidence is laid before ' em . or , ( 2. ) if it wou'd not remove our differences themselves , it wou'd ( at least ) prevent all the ill effects of 'em : for instance , why might we not love , and live like christians ( notwithstanding the remaining differences in our opinions ) ? wh● might we not pray with , and for each other ? wh● might we not , according to the rule of the gospel , look favourably upon each others mistakes , and receive each other to love and communion , avoiding doubtful disputations , rom. 14. throughout the chapter . we solemnly declare , we are ready thus to receive you ; we dare not but receive all whom we are perswaded , our lord himself will receive : let there not be a breach maintain'd on your part , while we impose no sinful , or so much as suspected term of communion on you . or , supposing upon one or other mistake , you shou'd think fit to separate your selves from us , from our assemblies , yet , at least , we beg , you wou'd in your distinct assemblies see to it , that the great and uncontroverted principles of christianity may be ordinarily , and with greatest warmth and earnestness insisted on ; and let not your heat and zeal be laid out upon the little things in which we differ : let your endeavours be rather to make men christians , than to make 'em antipaedobaptists ; and shew that you prefer the interests of our common lord , before those of your particular party . for a close , we would leave those words of the apostle with you , phil. 3.15 , 16. nevertheless , wherein we have already attain'd , let us walk by the ●ame rule , let us mind the same things : and if in any thing ye ●e neve● 〈◊〉 minded , god will reveal even this unto you . b. robinson , s. chandler , w. leigh . an introduction . must i again , be call'd out to engage in this irksome and unpleasing controversy ? who had much rather spend my time in healing differences , and provoking all christians to love one another . i have often read with some pleasing satisfaction , those expressions of arch-bishop tillotson , ( that great good man , and national loss . ) i know not ( says he ) whether st. paul , who had been taken up into the third heavens , did by that question of his ; where is the disputer of this world ? intend to insinuate that this wrangling work hath place only in this world , and upon this earth , where only there is a dust to be raised ; but will have no place in the other . but whether st. paul intended this or not , the thing it self i think is true , that in the other world all things will be clear and past dispute ; to be sure among the blessed , and probably also among the miserable , unless fierce and furious contentions , with great heat , without light , about things of no moment and concernment to them , should be design'd for a part of their torment . i had much rather be dressing my own soul for eternity , and preparing others for those calm and peaceable regions , where perfect charity and good will reign for ever : than in fomenting and increasing those divisions among christians , which are too unmeasurably wide already . my charity is not confin'd to any particular sect , or party of christians ; but i bear a hearty good will to all that agree in the essentials of religion , notwithstanding their distant opinions , in matters of an inferior nature . a reform'd catholick christian , is a name that pleaseth me better , than any of those distinguishing titles which the contentions of men have occasion'd in the christian church . tho' i was urg'd by many serious christians , before the disputation , to print my sermons on this subject , which were manag'd rather in a practical than controversal way ; yet so averse was i to foment or increase differences , that i willingly forbore . and if dr. russel had only printed the imperfect notes of his own scribes , perhaps we should still have been silent ; and left the world to judge between us : but seeing he hath been guilty of so many notorious falsehoods and misrepresentations , both on his side and ours , we are unavoidably constrain'd to vindicate the truths of christ , the common cause of the reformed churches , and our own reputation , against the bold insolence of a scandalous libeller : the true occasion of my being engag'd in this matter is this : i was invited some years ago , before any anabaptist meeting was set up at gosport , to preach a lecture once a fortnight at portsmouth ; which i have continu'd ( i bless god with no small success ) ever since . in the course of my lecture , i thought it most adviseable to give my hearers a true and orderly scheme of the christian religion . having therefore explain'd the creed and lords prayer ( mr. williams undertaking the ten commandments ) i did without any importunity from others , but purely in the method i had laid down , explain the doctrine of the sacraments : here i largely explain'd the nature of baptism , and could not do right to my subject , without defending our own practice as to infants right , and the way of administration . dr. russel himself knows how falsely he hath publish'd to the world , that i inveigh'd against the poor baptists ( as he calls them ) with most severe reflections : seeing he hath read those notes which mr. ring took of my sermons . the very hardest expression in those notes , is the title of mistaken brethren . these sermons mr. samuel ring , who , tho' of that perswasion , usually attends our lecture , pen'd down in short hand , and afterwards wrote out at length ; with an innocent design ( as he himself professeth ) to shew them to some of his brethren . farmer bows , a pretended messenger of the churches , hearing of this , appli●s himself to mr. ring for a sight of these sermons , and having read them , us'd words to this effect . shall we bear this ? if we suffer mr. chandler thus to go on , it will prejudice our cause . mr. ring reply'd , mr. chandler takes but the same liberty in his own congregation , to defend his own practice , that we do in ours . but this was not satisfactory . mr. bows goes over to gosport , to mr. john webber , pastor of a congregation of particular anabaptists , as they are call'd , opposite in their iudgments , in many great points of religion , to those in portsmouth . mr. webber ( as he told me himself ) was willing to live in peace , and did not desire to be engag'd : but mr. leddel , and some others , men of heat without light , were very urgent , and willing even to accept of matthew caffen for their champion , whom mr. bows propos'd : a man that denies both the divinity and humanity of christ , and is justly protested against , by many of his brethren , and particularly by dr. russel . mr. webber justly refus'd to own matthew caffen , as a christian , or a brother . and therefore , since they would have a dispute , rather propos'd dr. russel . accordingly , december 21 ▪ 98. mr. bows , mr. webber , and about twenty of their party came to my lecture boldly to confront me , when i was answering the anabaptists objections . at the conclusion , farmer bows stands up , and in the name of the rest challenges me with preaching doctrines false and wholly untrue , and desir'd i would admit of a publick dispute with an ordain'd minister of the gospel : this bold challenge i accepted , provided they would procure a man that understood the regular laws of disputation , and preliminaries were first settled . accordingly the next day , preliminaries were settled and papers interchang'd , between thomas bows and william leddel , as asserters of the two questions on the one part : and francis williams , and samuel chandler , as deniers of the two questions on the other part. this dr. russel perfectly conceals , in his account of the preliminaries , pag. 4. because it would have confuted his slander upon the learned dr. smith , as if he design'd , by saying , he that asserts must prove , that the proof lay upon us ; but this is accounted for elsewhere . mr. webber afterwards declares his utter dislike of the dispute , and wish'd i● had never been : and before my self and mr. smith , deny'd that the letter in the name of the church at gosport , narr . p. 2. was wrote with his knowledg or consent . therefore we impute not the falshood of the matter , as if mr. chandler had inveigh'd against and ridicul'd their practice ; nor the false grammar in that letter to him . mr. ring express'd his hearty sorrow by letter ( as well as otherwise ) in these following words — ( after having sent me the notes of my sermons , and delivered a copy of the disputation to mr. smith . ) — i am troubled at the sad effects of the disputation . i mean the difference it hath rais'd among those , that i hope are all the people of god : and the grief it may have occasion'd to any of his faithfull ministers : and most of all that i have contributed any thing towards it : tho' it hath been by accident and no otherwise : and as i pray god forgive me , so i beg your pardon , and crave a share in your prayers . i always respected you , as a minister of christ iesus ; have pray'd for the success of your ministry , and have heard you with a great deal of satisfaction , and i hope have profited by it ; and shall continue to do so , and so attend your ministry without the le●st p●ejudice , and i hope with better success than formerly . i am , sir , yours in all christian service . samuel ring . portsmouth , may 29.99 . this is the true copy of mr. ring 's letter to me , who according to his promise usually attends our lecture at portsmouth , now let the world iudg whether my prejudice against the growth of the church at gosport , could put me upon this work ; or whether i ever inveigh'd against them ; many of them can testify to the contrary , to whom i have , and shall bear an hearty love and good will ; own them as excellent servants of christ , and be very willing to contribute my assistance , to help them forward in their way to heaven . but alas ! 't is mr. bows and his party that are afraid of the growth of mr. webbers congregation : and therefore did suspend from their communion , one isaac harman by name , a ioyner in portsmouth , for bearing mr. webber : this the young man told me himself , and ask'd my advice about it ; and mr. bows told me himself before mr. francis williams , that if he could believe that our doctrine of original sin , he should think infants had need of baptism : and wonder'd the people of gosport should scruple the practice of infant baptism , and yet maintain the doctrine of original sin. this man it seems wants not express command or example , but only to be feelingly acquainted with the universal corruption of humane nature ; and then would readily embrace our practice . i pray god open his eyes , and convince him of this great truth , which is of far greater weight than this of baptism . an abridgment of those sermons that were the innocent occasion of the disputation . here i must unavoidably dip my pen in the watry controversy : i love not to meddle with matters of dispute , especially where sober and good men are at odds : but i cannot do right to my subject , without mentioning the grounds of our practice , both as to the subjects of baptism , and the manner of its administration . i shall according to the order o● the disputation , first , mention what i offer'd , as to the subjects of baptism . 1. i shall prove from scripture , 〈◊〉 ●arrantableness of infant baptism , or of the baptizing the infants of believing parents . here i shall not burden you with many scriptures , that might be produced : but only mention some few that i think most clear . first from mat. 28.19 . go , disciple all nations baptizing them . from hence i thus argue . 1. the infants of believing parents are disciples , and therefore ought to be baptiz'd . now we have a plain text that these infants are disciples , in act● 15.19 . why tempt ye god to put a yoke upon the necks of the disciples , which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear ? this yoke was that of circumcision , a very painful ordinance . administred to infants of 8 days old ; this yoke these false teachers would impose not only on the gentile christians but their infants too , and therefore st. paul was acus'd by them , that he taught , they should not circumcise their children nor keep the customs of moses , acts 21.21 . now when our saviour says go , disciple all nations : the apostles must need understand , that such as were disciples in the jewish state , should be admitted to this ordinance in the christian church . 2. infants are a considerable part of a nation , and therefore we cannot suppose , they should be excluded , except they were excluded by name or good consequence . 3. all nations , is here put in opposition to the one nation of the jews . as if our saviour had said , whereas the jews have hitherto been the peculiar people of god , and admitted to peculiar priviledges , now i admit all nations to the same priviledges , the jews only enjoy'd before ; eph. 2.12 , 13. now it was a great priviledg among the jews , that their infants were dedicated and devoted to god , and admitted into his church , and covenant , in their early years ; therefore the apostles must needs understand , when our saviour said , all nations should be discipled , that the gentiles , and their children should be admitted to the same priviledges the jews enjoy'd before . 4. our saviour must needs intend infants unless he had excluded them . if he would not be any longer a god in covenant with them , he would have raz'd out their names . suppose the words had run thus : go , disciple all nations , circumcising them ; the apostles must have understood that their infants were intended , and why not the same , when only the rite is alter'd ? or suppose it had run , go , disciple the iews , baptizing them ; they must needs admit infants that were admitted before . so that whereas our mistaken brethren call for an express scripture for infant baptism , we have reason to answer , there needs express scripture to revoke that priviledg and covenant interest which infants injoy'd before . if it had been christs intention to have excluded infants from the church , there must have been a positive law , where such an intention of christ should have been express'd : for nothing can make that unlawful , which was a duty before , but a direct and ' express prohibition from the legislator himself ; * who alone hath power to rescind , as well as make laws . you know there was a great controversy , whether circumcision should continue or not , acts 21.21 : and certainly there would have been a far greater , if , upon their coming to christ , their infants had been excluded the church , and ranked with heathens ; but seeing we find no objections made about this matter , nor that our saviour ever revok'd this priviledg , we may be assur'd they still enjoy it . 5. the practice of baptizing infants was customary among the iews ; those that have but dip'd their fingers in the iewish writings know , that not only proselytes ( as mr. tombs acknowledgeth ) but native iews themselves , were admitted into the church by circumcision , as an initiating ordinance ; by baptism , as a purifying ceremony , to wash them from legal uncleanness , which they might ignorantly contract ; and by sacrifice to expiate their sin ; and that this was not a corrupt tradition , but grounded on those many texts , that require washing from uncleanness : and therefore this practice is grounded on , gen. 35.2 . exod. 19.10 . by the gemera talmud , and maimonides . now therefore seeing infants were thus admitted by baptism , and our saviour was pleas'd to adopt this custom into a christian sacrament , we have reason to believe that infants are admitted now as before . 2. another scripture is in acts 2.38 , 39. repent and be baptized , for the promise is to you and to your children ; and to those afar off , even as many as the lord our god shall call . the apostle peter doth in this place perswade those he had convinc'd , of the greatness of their sin , in murdering the lord of glory , penitently to return to god , and then incourages them to hope , they should again be receiv'd into favour with god : and , says he , the promise will be made good , not only to you but to your children too : and to the gentile world also , even to as many as the lord our god shall call . thence i argue . 1. this promise , was the great promise to abraham . some pretend it is only that promise in ioel 2.8 . gods giving extraordinary gifts of the spirit ; that their sons and daughters should prophecy . but this cannot be , because that promise was not fullfill'd to all afar off . have all the gifts of tongues ? do all prophecy ? the promise signifys the great promise 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to abraham , i will be a god to thee and to thy seed , gen. 17.17 . therefore this is call'd the promise gal. 3.14 . that the blessing ' of abraham might come upon the gentiles , thro' iesus christ , that we might receive the promise of the spirit , thro' faith. the blessing of abraham : that great blessing that god would be a god to him and his seed . now if this great blessing come to the gentiles , then they and their seed ought to receive the token of the covenant ; the children of the promise ought to have the seal affixed to it . 2. the apostle useth these words to comfort the iews , that had imprecated divine vengeance on themselves and their children , infants as well as others ; a curse that lies on the unbelieving iews to this day : his blood be upon us and our children ; no doubt , but many of those , that were prick'd at the heart at peters sermon , joyn'd with the rabble in that loud cry ; crucifie him , crucifie him , and were concern'd not only for themselves but their children too ; therefore the apostle uses this argument , if you penitently return to god by faith in christ , the curse shall be taken off from you and your children , you and yours shall be admitted again , and not only so , but those that are afar off , the gentile world , when call'd . 3. if the words were to be restrain'd , only to those that believe and repent themselves , and concern not their infants ; this would be an argument to perswade the iews , to continue in the synagogue still , rather than to come into the christian church . while synagogue worship stood before christs coming , god had promis'd happy priviledges , to themselves and children ; but now if afterwards their children must be cast off , and look'd on as no other than heathens , and strangers to the covenants of promise , this would incline them rather to continue in the synagogue , than enter into the christian church . a third scripture is in rom. 11.15 , 25. in those verses , these following things are containd . 1. the apostle speaks of breaking off from and grasfing into the visible church ; that the unbelieving iews were broken off from that visible church , to which they were related before , by their positive unbelief , and rejecting christ ; and that the gentile believers were graff'd in , and so partook of those priviledges , from which the gentiles were broken off . 2. some only were broken off , the rest that believ'd , injoy'd the same priviledges they did before , v. 17 th . now this was a great priviledg , that god would be a god to them and to their seed : therefore they still injoy'd the same . 3. what priviledges the iews left , the whole body shall be restor'd to when the fulness of the gentiles shall come in , v. 25. therefore their infants shall be restor'd to the same priviledges th● injoy'd before . 4. the believing gentiles are admitted to the priviledges the iews injoy'd before , gra●fed into the same olive-tree , v. 24. s●eing iewish infants w●re interested in the church and covenant of god , the inf●●ts of believing gentiles are also in covenant , and consequently ought to have baptism , the seal , applyed to them . 4. a fourth scripture is in 1 cor. 7.14 . else were your children unclean , but now are they holy . hence i argue , if the children of believers are holy , then this ordinance ought to be administer'd to them . the only difficulty here , is to understand what is meant , by holiness in this place . 1. internal holiness cannot be ascrib'd to all the infants of believers . because we find by sad experience , that many of them shamefully apostatize from god , and thereby plainly shew , the seed of grace was never in them , 1 iohn 3.9 . 2. neither can it be understood of bare legitimacy , as our mistaken brethren pretend . for , 1. the word is never us'd in this sense , in all the scripture . 2. the children of heathens , if begotten in lawful wedlock , are legitimate , as well as of believers ; therefore this can be no distinguishing mark , as in this place . 3. the apostle's argument would be weak and unconcluding , if he should only prove that they were lawful man and wife , because their children were lawfully begotten . the question propos'd to the apostle was this . supposing a believing wife marry'd to an unbeliever , or e contra , whether the believer should dwell with the unbeliever , or part one from another . the apostle answers , if the unbeliever be willing to abide , let them do so , for the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband , and else were ●our children unclean , but now are they holy. because one parent is a believer , therefore their children are peculiarly related to god , and in covenant with him . now if bare legitimacy were intended , then the argument would run thus : you have no reason to question , whether you are man and wife , because your children are lawfully begotten . can any believe any could question the one , and yet grant the other ? 4. this would not answer the corinthians scruple : they did not question , whether co-habiting with unbelievers , expos'd them to fornication ; but , whether it would expose them to irreligion , or at least , great temptations . now , says the apostle , how knowest thou , o man , but thou may'st save thy wife ? however , your children are holy , because one is a believer . 3. by holiness is meant relative or federal holiness . that the children of believers are separated to god , enter'd into a new relation to him , by vertue of his covenant . thus the israelites are said to be a holy people , because separated to god as his peculiar treasure , deut. 14.2.26.19 . the infants of believing parents are thus holy , as related to god and enjoying distinguishing marks of favour , therefore ought to have this distinguishing ordinance apply'd to them ? 2. what priviledges are the infants of believers invested in by baptism ? 1. they are solemnly admitted into the visible church ; no longer strangers to the covenants of promise , but more nearly related to god , than the infants of heathens . 2. peculiarly interested in the churches prayers ; we are bound indeed to pray for all men , but more peculiarly for the church of god , gal : 6.16 . 3. have a title to gods peculiar care . god gives his angels a charge over them , mat. 18.10 . 4. they stand nearer to , and are the more especial objects of the promises of grace , is. 44.3.59 . infants are call'd by gods name , therefore tho' gods grace is free , yet we have more reason to hope , the promises will be made good to them than others . the vein of election frequently runs in the channel of believing parents , and their seed . 5. they are put into a new covenant relation . as abraham receiv'd the sign of circumcision , as a seal of the righteousness of faith , to himself and seed , rom. 4.11 . so this ordinance of baptism , shall be a seal of the righteousness of faith , to believers and their seed . 6. if they dye during their infant state , they shall be saved . our saviour useth this argument for the proof of the resurrection . i am the god of abraham , mat. 22.32 . now for god to be the god of any , is to distinguish them from others by his rewards ; he did not do thus for abraham , and his family , in this world , therefore there is another , heb. 11.16 . now when god is said to be a god to believers and their seed , the meaning is , he will be a rewarder of them ; therefore if they dy in their infant state , they have a promise to rely on , that god will receive them to salvation . whereas others must leave their children to the unfathomable depths of divine mercy , as they do the heathen world. 3. the practical uses of infant baptism beyond that of years . this i do the rather , to take off the common objection , that infant baptism is an useless ordinance . 1. by baptizing our infants we practically own our original pollution . those baptiz'd at r●per years own themselves sinners by practice ; but do not necessarily own , that there is a fountain of sin within : but when we offer our children to be baptiz'd , we acknowledg that we have been instruments of conveying polluted natures to our infants ; and that they need washing by the blood and spirit of christ. thus the prophet sets forth our sinful state , by the pollutions of a new born infant , ezek. 16.4 . 2. hereby we practically acknowledg the necessity of gods free grace in order to our recovery . as an infant cannot contribute to his baptism , but is purely passive ; so we can contribute nothing , by any work or merit of our own , towards obtaining the grace of god , and regenerating influences of his spirit . it is not in him that willeth , nor in him that runneth , but in god that sheweth mercy , rom. 9.16 . 3. hereby we practically own christs universal headship , that he is lord of all , of all ages , sexes , and conditions . those that deny their children , to be in covenant with god , hereby deny them to be visible members of christ ; and thus rob him of a great part of his subjects , and indeed rob themselves of that comfort they might enjoy : they look upon their infants , as in the same case and state , with the heathen world. if christ save them , it is by a prerogative of mercy , and not as his members or covenant children ; but for this cause christ both died , ●●d rose , and reviv'd , that he might be the lord , of the dead and living . rom. 14.9 . and as christ whilst an infant himself , was head of the church , so he is pleas'd to admit of infant members , in covenant with him . 4. infant baptism lays stronger obligations on parents , to train up their children for god. certainly t is a mighty obligation on a parent to consider . 1. i have solemnly devoted my child to god. solemnly promis'd , before the minister , and in the face of a great congregation , that i will endeavour by hearty prayers , serious instructions , and a religious example , to train up my child for god ; the vows of the lord are upon me , and i shall add perjury to the rest of my sins , if i neglect them . the prophet makes it , a great agravation of the israelites sin , that they had taken their sons and daughters that they had born unto god , and sacrafic'd them to idols . ezek. 16.21 . and it follows , thou hast slain my children . god calls them his children , as born in his family , and solemnly devoted to him . so the sin of christians will be highly aggravated , if they bring up their children for the destroyer , and neglect those parental instructions , they have oblig'd themselves to . 5. infant baptism engages children to acquaint themselves , with the terms and tenour of the covenant . when children are told by their parents , how solemnly they were enter'd into covenant with god , this engages them to enquire betimes , what they are by nature , what they may be by grace , and to understand all the principles of religion , in order to that end . 6. infant baptism engages us against sin betimes . we are prepossess'd with a happy prejudice against sin , in our early years ; and this is a great advantage . when hannibal was but 9 years old , his father made him la● his hand upon the altar , and swear , that he would be an irreconcilable enemy to the romans : and this was the reason he would never admit of any peace with them . my friends , we were engaged for god against sin , and the devil , as our irreconcilable enemies , not at 9 years old , but in our infant state ; and this obliges us to maintain a constant enmity against them for ever . 7. infant baptism is a great encouragement for faith in prayer , with respect to our children . those that have dedicated their children to god in baptism , may pray to god , with larger measures of faith and hope , than such as have neglected this duty . they may say , lord i have resign'd them up unto thee ; brought them to thine authoriz'd representative to be listed into thy family ; consented for them , to the claims of thy covenant ; and the token of thy covenant , hath been apply'd to them ; let the promises of thy covenant be made good to them . they are call'd by thy name , do thou receive them : they are visible members of thy church . oh give them the favours that belong to thy children . a visible relation to god is a good encouragement for faith in prayer . we are call'd by thy name : thou bearest not rule over them . ier. 14.9 . those that have not thus dedicated their children to god , can only say , lord be merciful to them , tho' they are not call'd by thy name , and make them thine . but we have a better plea ; and can say , lord they are call'd by thy name . 8. infant baptism adds to the parents comfort . they may comfortably hope as to their living seed , that if they are faithful in training them up for god , he will according to his promise , is. 44.3 . pour out his spirit and blessing upon them : and as to those that die in an infant state , they have reason to believe and hope , that they are happy , because god hath promis'd to be a god to them , and to their seed : whereas those that neglect this ordinance have no more reason to hope for the salvation of their infants , than the heathens ; must only leave them , to the unfathomable depths of gods goodness , having no promise to rely upon . 4. i shall answer some principal objections against this truth . 1. there is no precept nor example for infant baptism , in all the new testament ; this is a common objection , and therefore deserves a distinct answer , 1. to this i answer : what express command or example can they produce for previous examination of persons that offer themselves to be baptiz'd ; for stated prayer , before and after this ordinance ; or for dipping or plunging the whole body under water ? all these things must be deduc'd by consequence ; for no express scripture can be produc'd for them . i may add , what express command have they for singing psalms in rhime and metre , which is the practice of the most orthodox anabaptists at this day ? i mention this the rather , to convince mr. webber and his adherents , what a doughty champion they have chosen for themselves . for this dr. russel hath written some animadversions on his brother allen's essay , on singing psalms ; wherein he advances the very same arguments , against their practice of singing psalms , that he doth against ours for infant baptism ; and therefore hath prov'd himself a hackny disputant , that hath one constant road , and train of arguments , upon all occasions . perhaps i may be so dull of apprehension , as not to be able to answer them , therefore must cry , men of israel help . the arguments of russel against allen , pag. 9. if it doth not appear from scripture , or any authentic . history , that the psalms of david were translated into rhime or metre till the 16 th century , then it is impossible any church could so sing them , as our brethren now do ; the major is undeniable , the minor i thus prove . if it be so recorded , you or some other are able to show it . further , if singing in rhime or metre was never practic'd in any church , till the 16 th century , then it was , because our lord jesus had not commanded it so to be . if our lord had commanded it ▪ his apostles would have so taught the churches . if the apostles were faithful in the discharge of their ministry , and kept back nothing , that was profitable to the churches , but declar'd to them the whole councel ●● god , then they did teach the churches all that the lord jesus commanded . if the apostles did teach the churches to sing in rhime and metre , then it is somewhere so recorded in the new testament . thus argues this mighty man of logick ; but as he cannot distinguish between rhime and metre , ●o i can see ▪ neither rhime nor reason in his discourse : these were the arguments for want of better , he ●rif●ed w●th at portsmouth ; but mr. webber ( to whose civility i am indebted , for a sight of this curious peice , ) must either renounce his beloved rhimes , or comply with the practice of infant baptism , notwithstanding the wonderful arguments of his champion to the contrary . but to return from this digression . 2. those truths that were establish'd in the old testament , are rather suppos'd than positively express'd in the new ; but the grounds and foundations upon which infant baptism stands , were establish'd in the old testament . infants were then admitted into the covenant and church of god : except therefore christ had blotted their names out of the covenant , and rolls of the church ; they are to be continued there , under the new testament . thus a magistracy was setled under the old testament , but there is no precept for it under the new ; the lawfulness of war was then setled , but suppos'd , not expres● under the new. the forbidden degrees of marriage , were setled under the old testament : no need of mentioning them again under the new. 3. ans. there are many virtual and general commands for the baptizing of infants in the new testament , which were mention'd before . 4. ans. there was no need of an express command , because it was the constant practice of the church , when the scripture was written , in conformity to the practice of the iews , for many ages before . i cannot here express my self better , than in the words of the learned lightfoot * if baptism and baptizing of infants had been as strange and unheard of a thing , till iohn baptist came ; as circumcision was ●till god appointed it to abraham ; there would then no doubt , have been an express command for baptizing infants , as there was for circumcising them . but when the baptizing of infants , was a thing commonly known and us'd , as appears by uncontestable evidence from all their writers ; there need not be express assertions , that such and such persons were to be the objects of baptism , when it was as well known before the gospel began , that men , women and children were baptiz'd , as it is to be known that the sun is up when it shines at noon day . 5. there would need a positive command , to exclude infants , who were admitted into covenant before . the iews were extremely tender of their priviledges , and you know there was a great dispute among them , whether their children should be circumcis'd , acts. 21.21 . now if their children were wholly cast out of covenant , this would have enrag'd them much more ; seeing therefore , there is not one word in scripture , that once mentions the unchurching of infants , not one apostle , that once questions or discovers it , the believing iews did not once scruple it , nor the unbelieving once charge it on christ ; nor the councel in acts 15. reveal it , tho they that taught infants should be circumciz'd , did suppose they were church-members . i say seeing all these things are true , infants are church-members still , and consequently ought to be baptiz'd . 6. there are examples of whole housholds that were baptiz'd in scripture , and we may well conclude , as abrahams children , in luk. 19.9 . christ saith to zaccheus , salvation is come to this house , for that he also is the son of abraham . zaceheus was a publican , and a gatherer of the roman tribute , and perhaps a gentile , but upon his faith in christ , he becomes a spiritual son of abraham , and salvation comes not only to himself , but his house ; god becomes a god to him and his . so when we read of so many housholds baptiz'd , upon the parents and masters believing , we have reason to conclude their infants were baptiz'd , as abraham and his were circumciz'd . 7. there is no instance of any christian child , whose baptism was defer'd still he came to years . there was great reason that they who had been iews or heathens before , should upon their undertaking christianity , be baptiz'd at years : as abraham at the first institution of circumcision was circumciz'd , when he was old ; but we may well suppose , their children ( as abrahams , ) were baptiz'd with them , and afterwards in their infant state. now it is utterly unaccountable , that in that long tract of time , between st. mathews gospel and the revelations , when many christian infants were grown adult , we should read of none that were baptiz'd , but only of iews and heathens , i say this is unaccountable , and therefore supposeth they were baptiz'd in infancy . obj. 2. infants are uncapable of performing the duties prerequir'd to baptism . of confessing their sins , mat. 3.6 . of repenting , acts 2.38 . of gladly receiving the word , acts 2.41 . of believing , mar. 16.16 . 1. infants are admitted on the account of their parents faith . as the infants of believing iews , so are the infants of christians ; nor is this at all unreasonable . for as infants contract guilt from their parents , why may they not also partake of mercy , on account of their parents ; except god be more inclin'd to acts of justice , than mercy ▪ as many were heal'd of their bodily diseases , by the faith of their parents , math. 15.28 . so why may they not be admitted into gods church on the same account ? as the iewish infants , covenanted with god , in and by their parents , deut. 29.11.12 . so why may not christian infants covenant in and by them ? as children are said to come to christ , being brought in the arms of their nurses or parents , luk. 18.15.16 . so why may they not be said spiritually to come to christ , in the arms of their parents faith ? as parents enter their childrens names in leases and covenants , and the children are oblig'd to stand to these covenants , and do injoy these priviledges , when they come to years : so why may they not enter their childrens names into the covenant , and church of god , tho' at present they are uncapable of personally engaging themselves ? 2. infants are oblig'd to these duties as soon as they are capable ; and their early engagements in baptism , lay the more strong and forcible obligation upon them to do so . if afterwards they revolt from god , their sin will be more highly aggravated , as adding perjury and apostacy to the rest of their sins : and this may be one reason why , sometimes , the children of believers are worse than others , because they sin against greater light and love , and stronger engagements than other men , and therefore justly provoke the holy spirit to forsake them . the levites of a month old are said to keep the charge of the sanctuary , because they were devoted to this office , and bound to it when capable , num. 3.28 . so the infants of believers are devoted to the service of god : and bound to believe , repent , confess their sins , and gladly receive the word , as soon as capable . 3. these texts therefore only shew what was requir'd of grown persons , when baptism was first appointed in the christian church . those persons were either iews or heathens before , and therefore must renounce their former errors , and profess the christian faith ; but this is no prejudice against infants who are to be admitted with them . as when abraham was circumciz'd , he first believ'd in god , and submitted to this ordinance , but afterwards the infants of the iews were circumciz'd in their infant state● : so if we were to preach to the indians , we must first perswade them to believe and repent before baptism ; but when once they had believ'd , their infants would have the same right with themselves . 4. as to mar. 16.16 . because many are apt to insist on the order of the words , and argue that faith is put before baptism , and therefore ought to preceed it , i answer : the order of the words is not always to be exactly regarded . for confessing ●f sin is put after baptism● matth. 3.6 . besides , this would condemn all infants ; for , if , because they cannot believe , they ought not to be baptiz'd , then for the same reason they must all be damn'd . 't is not positively said he that is not baptiz'd shall be damn'd ; baptism is not of absolute : necessity to salvation : but it is positively said , he that believeth not sh●ll be damn'd . if the latter part of this verse be interpreted of grown persons , so also must the● former . as for grown persons , faith must go before baptism : but it doth not follow , that infants are hence excluded from baptism , no more than ▪ from salvation . our saviour doth therefore here , only give a general direction to his apostles , to preach the gospel to every creature , and admit the gentiles to the same priviledges with the iews , and shews them the issue of the execution of their commission ; that those iews , or heathens that would renounce their former idolatry , and be●●eving y submit to the ordinance , as a solemn entrance into the church , should be saved ; bu● those that wilfully persisted in unbelief , shou'd be damn'd . so that this is no preju●ice to infants , who are still in covenant with god thro their parents faith , and were never cast out . i proceed to the 2d general question . after what manner , the outward element in baptism , ought to be apply'd , whether by dipping or plunging the whole body under water , or whether pouring water on the face be not sufficient ? to which i answer , 1. it is not absolutely necessary that this ordinance should be administred by dipping or plunging the whole body under the water . there are many mistaken brethren lay too great a stress on this ; but it proceeds from their ignorance of the scriptures . 1. the holy ghost , never uses 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , which most frequently fignifys to dip , but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : now why should the holy ghost consecrate a new world for this ordinance ; if dipping had been the only way of administring it ? now 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is always us'd where dipping is signify'd . mat. 26.23 . ioh. 13.26 . he that dippeth with me in the dish . luk 16.24 . dip his finger . rev. 19.13 . with garments dip'd in blood. 2. the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is us'd in a differing sense in scripture . thus you read , mar. 7.4 . the pharisees eat not except they wash oft . now the way of washing among the iews , was this ; a servant was ready to p●ur water , on his masters hands , hence elisha is thus describ'd . 2 kings 3.11 . here is elisha that pour'd water on the hands of his master eli●ah . so we read of washing of cups and pots , brasen vessels , and tables or beds . mar. 7.4 . the greek word is baptizo . surely they did not carry them out to a river and dip them there , but pour'd water on them , and so made them clean . again , heb. 9.10 . we read of divers washings ; baptisms in the greek . now what were these baptisms but v. 13.21 . moses's sprinkling the book and all the people , with the blood of calves and goats and water . so that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signify the same thing . let not injudicious people therefore pretend , that ours is only rantism , when we find in scripture that rantism ; and baptism are us'd promisc●ously for the same . 3. there is no certainty that dipping was ever usd in scripture times . all those scriptures that are commonly urg'd to this purpose , may be easily apply'd another way . if we begin with iohn the baptist , he is said to baptize not in , but with water , as christ with the holy ghost and fire . luk. 3.16 . now how did christ baptize with the holy ghost and fire ? but at the day of pentecost when the holy ghost was pour'd on them . acts. 10.45 . i know the learned casaubon's witty criticism that in acts 2. when the holy ghost came upon them it is said ; there came a ●ound from heaven as of a rushing might● wind , and it fill'd the house . so that they were as in a fish pond overwhelm'd with the holy ghost . but to this i answer , it was the sound that fill'd the house , and not the cloven tongues of fire , which were the emblems of the holy ghost , and sure they were not overwhelm'd wi●h these ; but that promise was made good . i will pour out my spirit . acts 2.17 . now the pouring out of the spirit , is frequently represented by pouring out water , is. 44.3 . but several scriptures are pretended for dipping ; the most material are these . 1. mat. 3.16 . iesus went up out of the water . i answer , he might acording to the practice of those times , go into the water to wash his feet , foul with travelling , and iohn might pour water on his face ; but the greek word may be render'd , he went up from the water . the like answer may be given to mar. 1.9 . iesus was baptiz'd of iohn in iordan . it doth not prove his whole body was plung'd there . nay 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 frequently signifys to , and if we compare this place with mat. 3.13 . iesus came from nazareth of galilee to iordan to be baptized of iohn . so here we may read the words with a parenthesis ▪ and iesus came from nazareth of galilee , ( and was baptiz'd of iohn ) to iordan 2. another scripture is ioh. 3.23 . iohn baptized in enon , because there was much water there . i answer , much water may be meant not of depth but length , many streams and rivulets , where iohn and his disciples might conveniently together baptize or pour water on the multitudes . 3. another scripture is acts 8.38 . where philip and the eunuch are said both to go down into the water ; whence some would infer that the eunuch was dip'd . i answer , they might only go down to , and come from the water . so the greek may be render'd , the water running in the valleys . b●t if men will insist on the letter of the text , phillip must dip himself as well as the eunuch ; for they both went down . or they might go ankle deep , and philip might pour water on his head or face : either of these interp●etations are probable , and therefore it cannot necessari●y be prov'd he was dipt ; besides the unlikelihood that he was dipt on a journey , when perhaps he might have no cloaths to change . 4. the principal scripture they boast of , is rom. 6.4 . being buried with christ in baptism . whence they argue b●p●ism must represent a burial , therefore the whole b●dy must be cover'd with water . this text we have given a distinct answer to , in our reflections on dr : russel , chap. 2. refl . 12.13 . therefore thither i refer the reader , and shall only say here , 1. it is no where said that baptism represents christs burial , but only that we are oblig'd to conform our selves thereby to christs death , burial , and resurrection , to die to sin , and rise again to newness of life : this we do whatever ri●e be us'd . 2. in our way ( if that will satisfy ) there is a representation of christs death ▪ the pouring out of water denoting the pouring his blood or soul ; of his burial , as the face the principal part of the body , is put under the water ; of his resurrection when the child is taken up and deliver'd again to its parents or o●●erers . 3. if they will keep strictly to the significancy of a burial ; the person to be baptiz'd , must not walk into the water , but be taken up by the baptizer and cast down into it : for indeed the difference between our way and theirs is only this , we baptize the face and they baptize the head and shoulders too . 4. metaphors must not be stretched too far , and let our brethren take heed , how they stretch this expression so , as to justify the practice of others , that differ from them ; you read v. 6. our old man is crucify'd with christ. h●●ce the romanists infer the necessity of crossing in ba●●ism ; let not the metaphor therefore be stretch'd too ●ar . 5. there are many more scriptures , that have an allusion to sprinkling or pouring water on the face : thus we r●ad is. 44.3 . i will pour water on him that is thirsty , &c. which is interpreted of gods pouring out his spirit , and blessing on the seed of believers . so heb. 10.22 . having your hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience , and your bodys wash'd with pure water : and many other places . so that our way most fairly represents the death , burial and resurrection of christ , together with the application of his blood , and spirit ; and the anabaptists of amsterdam are so sensible of this , that they generally baptize by pouring water upon the head. 4. there is great probability , ( if not certainty ) that many were not dip'd in scripture times . particularly acts 2.41 . we read of 3000 baptiz'd in part of a day . and this was at ierusalem where there were no rivers , but only the brook cedron . besides these were either dipt naked , or with their cloaths ; if naked , this would be an unseemly sight , and look as if they were full of new wine indeed , tho' ( by the way ) i think that part , that is baptiz'd , ought to be naked , to represent our nakedness before god : if with their cloaths this would be as strange , for it cannot be expected , they brought cloaths with them at that juncture , and it would have been very unseemly , to see so many persons come out of the water in such a condition ▪ and go down to their houses , which might be at a great distance ; not to mention that it was hardly possible , for the 12 ap●s●les , if we should add the 70 disciples to them ( 〈◊〉 y●●●he text mentions not ) to dip 3000 in so sho●t a time , they had need have brawny arms and an here●●●an strength to do this . again we read a●ts 9. ● . 18 . that saul after 3 days fasti●g w●s baptiz●d by ananias , we read not that he wen● out of the ho●●e ; nor is it probable , that god ( who will have mercy and not sacrifice , ) would at that time require , he should be plung'd in cold water , which might prejudice his health o● life . again acts 16.33 . the jaylor and all his were baptiz'd at midnight . 't is unlikely they went to a river at that time . 5. it is not the quantity of water , but the quality that is significant . as in the other sacrament we are commanded to eat bread and drink wine in remembrance of christ ; so in this to be wash'd in the name of the father son and holy ghost : and as in the other , it is not said what quantity of bread we shall eat , or wine we shall drink ; so neither in this , after what manner the water shall be apply'd , whether by dipping , sprinkling or pouring water on the face . it might be equally pretended , that we must eat and drink plentifully at the lords table , because this best sets forth a feast , as it is call'd 1 cor. 5.8 . or eat a whole loaf to represent our partaking of christs fulness , and receiving from him grace for grace : there is as much necessity for this , as for dipping , to represent our burial with christ. but as a small bit of bread , and moderate draught of wine , doth significantly represent the death of christ ; so a little water doth as significantly represent the cleansing virtue of christs blood. 6. it is very unlikely that dipping , which when mention'd in scripture , is generally us'd as a token of gods vengeance , should in this sacrament be us'd as a token of his mercy . thus the old world was dip'd and drown'd for their sins , gods vengeance follow'd them , and they sunk as lead in the mighty waters : but noah and his family , whose entrance into the ark , was a type of baptism , as that is an entrance into the christian church 1 pet. 3.21 . they were only wet with the rain they met with in their passage . thus the egyptians were dip'd and drown'd in the red-sea , but the israelites were baptiz'd unto moses , in the cloud and the sea , 1 cor. 10.2 . by the dewings of the cloud , and dashing of the waves . thus the lord jesus shall come down from heaven , to render vengeance on his antichristian enemies , with garments dipt in blood. rev. 19 , 1● . i know the usual objection of naaman the syrian , of whom it is said 2 kings 5 , 14. he dip'd himself in the river iordan , seven times , according to the say●ng of the man of god. but this objection i took off in the disputation it self not according to the fa●se represen●●tion of the narr●●ive , but thus : the prophet bids bim . v. 10 go and wash in iordan seven times ; and he washed himself , as the h●●rew●ay ●ay be rendred , according to the saying of the m●n of god as when our saviour commanded the blind man ●o w●n the pool of siloam , iohn 9.7 . he had 〈◊〉 need to dip himself , but only to wash his eyes ▪ so n●aman the syrian had no need to wash any part of his bod● , b●t only where he was affected w●th leprosie : and therefore till it can be prov'd , that n●aman was a lep●r ●ll over , this objection is of no force . this was my answer then , which perfectly silenced russel . this argument i ●s'd n●t to prove the a●solute unlawfulness of d●pping ; for i lay n●●tr●ss at all on the mode of administration ; ●nd tho dipping be u●'d in these places , as a token of vengeance , y●● it may be app●y'd in a way of mercy . but i h●nce argue , it i● very unlikely , that this way , and no other must be us'd in baptism . and this may be a sufficient answer to all tha● little story about mr. fox in the preface , and the t●ifling querys upon it . 2. sprinkling , or pouring water on the face , in this sacrament , is most significant . we pour wate● on the face , the noblest and chiefest part of man that part we pour water on is naked to represent our nakedness before god ; and this is sufficient , and significantly represents , 1. the blood of christ , whereby we are cleans'd from the guilt and fi●th of sin. to this , there are particular allusions made in many places of scripture , heb. 10 , 22.12.23 . 1 pet. 1 , 2. 2. it fitly represents the communications of the spirit . the spirit of god is promis'd to us under this metaphor , is. 44.3.52.15 , ezek. 36.25 . thus in this ordinance is signifyd the pouring out of the spirit , to cleanse ●s from that pollution we have contracted . 3. pouring water on the face , doth most aptly represent the grace of god apply'd to us , rather than dipping , whereby it may seem , as if we first apply'd our selves to him . in dipping , the body is apply'd to the water ; in pouring , water is apply'd to the body . this most fitly represents , that god is the first mover in our conversion ; that regeneration and sanctification is his work : whereas the other way , inclines us rather to think that we cleans● and purify our selves . it is no wonder , that they who mag●ify the power of nature , and think by their own free will they change and convert themselves , are for this way ; but as for those that better understand the scriptures , and their own weakness , and acknowle●g ●hat it is not in him that willeth , nor in him that runneth , but in god that sheweth mercy , rom. 9 , 16. and that god works in us both to will and to do , according to his own good pleasure , phil. 2 , 13. it seems very unreasonable for them to use such a practice , that intimates as if man had power to change and convert himself . mr. chandler's prologue . my friends , it is not out of pride or vanity , that i now appear in this place , upon this occasion . most of you know ; and i suppose many of you have heard , that , in the course of my lecture here , i have been discoursing of the principles of religion : and having explain'd the creed and the lord's prayer , did undertake to treat of the doctrine of the sacraments , particularly that of baptism . those that then heard me know , that i spake with a great deal of modesty , calling those who deny infant-baptism , by no harder name than mistaken brethren ; when i was unavoidably engag'd in this disputation by a bold and confident challenge given me , which i knew not how to refuse , unless i would betray that truth which i believe to be the truth of the gospel . they themselves not being able to answer the arguments i then used , have cryed out , men of israel , come and help ; and therefore have sent for this gentleman from london . now i desire that all things may be managed with the greatest fairness and ▪ calmness , that we may debate of these matters as christians , that nothing may be done that is tumultuous or disorderly : and , as we have the favour of the government both civil and military , so , that we may give them no occasion to repent of giving this liberty . and i hope we shall all of us be willing to submit to the truth , as it is revealed in the gospel , and lay our selves open to conviction . i have no more to add , but desire all of you to joyn with me in this one request , that god would grant that truth may prevail . chand . the questions to be disputed of are these in order : q. 1. whether , according to the commission of our lord iesus christ , adult believers only are the proper subjects of baptism , or their infants also ? q. 2. whether this ordinance of baptism , as appointed by christ , be to be administred by dipping , plunging , overwhelming only , and not otherwise ? we deny , and they affirm . russel . i do suppose it 〈◊〉 be necessary to understand , how much of this , that we affirm , mr. chandler owns , that we may not dispute about those things wherein we are agre●d ; whether you do own , that adult believers are the proper subjects of baptism ? chand . if they were not baptized in infancy , they ought to be so at age. rus. you do suppose then that they are to be baptized by vertue of some com●ission , and that , the commission of our lord jesus christ. chand . yes . rus. then with respect to the first question , whether adult believers only , or whether infants also may be admitted to baptism ? and i suppose you do expect that i should be opponent . chan. yes , that was agreed . rus. well then , i shall endeavour ( god assisting ) to prove , infants are not , according to christ's commission , the proper subjects of baptism . arg. if christ hath no where required any of his minister to baptize infants , then the baptism of infants is not according to the commission of our lord jesus christ. but christ hath no where required any of his ministers , &c. ergo. chan. i distinguish here upon your antecedent . if you mean by christ's requiring , his requiring infants expresly , and by name , there is no need of it : but i● by req●iring , you mean either expresly , or by just consequence ; then i deny your mi●or . rus. then you suppose that christ hath no where required it . chan. no. distinguish between express words and good consequential proofs . rus. it 's necessary the peop●e should know w●at mr chandler means ; and therefore — robinson . it 's fit indeed they should know what he means ; but it 's also fit he should explain his own meaning . you must not be permitted to e●plain mr. chandler's meaning in your own words . your business is to prove what he denies . rus. i do hope , gentlemen , that you will not thus break in upon us . rob. i do stand here on purpose to prevent irregularity in the disputants . leigh . this gentleman is our moderator . rus. pray what is your name ? rob. my name is robinson . rus. now if you will be silent , and mr. chandler be pleased to tell me what part of my argument he denies , i shall proceed in the defence of i● . chan. repeat your argument then . rus. if christ hath no where required any of his ministers to baptize infants , then the baptism o● infants is not according to the commission of our lord j. c. but christ hath no where required , &c. ergo. chan. here , i say , as to the major : if you mean by requiring , christ's expresly requiring in so many words , that infants shall be baptized , then i deny the consequence ; but if you mean , that by genuine consequence it cannot be drawn from scripture ; i deny the minor. rus. the term is very lax . i do not say , that he hath no where commanded it , but no where required it . if it be any where required , it 's enough . give a direct answer . leigh . vvill you allow good scripture consequence to be proof in this case ; or do you expect scripture words expresly ? let us not dispute in the dark . gentlemen , you that are notaries , pray observe how ambiguously mr. russel expresseth himself . he will not say whether he 'll allow just scripture consequence for sufficient proof . rus. i think i give my sense in as plain words as i can . l. will you have it in express words , or good consequence ? williams . no reason for such a distinction , because our brother hath said * any way . rus. it 's all one to me , so you prove † the thing : prove it any way . chand . i deny your minor. rus. i prove it thus . only i would let the people know what you say , viz. that christ hath * somewhere required his ministers to baptize infants . leigh . either expresly , or by just consequence . rus. if christ hath any where required any of his ministers to baptize infants , then it is somewhere so recorded in the holy scripture . but it is no where so recorded in the holy scripture . therefore . chand . this i answer by distinguishing again ; if you mean by being so recorded in holy scripture , its being there in so many express words , then i deny your consequence ; but if you mean that it 's not so by good consequence , i deny your minor again . rus. let us not confound the people with so many distinctions , but plainly deny what part you please * . leigh . i will make it appear , that there is that recorded in scripture , which by just consequence will prove what you deny . rus. if you can prove it so recorded , 't is enough . ⸫ rob. pray mr. leigh — mr. russel must prove , that it is not so recorded . this is what lies upon you , sir * . rus. i would know what part mr. chandler denies . chan. i deny the minor. rus. then you say , it 's somewhere so recorded in the holy scriptures . chan. it 's your business to prove the negative . rus if it be somewhere so recorded in scripture , then mr. chandler , mr. leigh , or some other person is able to shew it . but neither mr. chandler , mr. leigh , or any other person is able to shew it . therefore . chan. i deny the minor. r●s . it 's a universal negative , you must prove it . i appea●●o the moderator . rob. this ought not to be put upon the respondent . you must prove it still . supposing that neither mr. chandler , nor mr. leigh , can give you an instance , you can't prove that none else can . if you can , we desire you would . will. you are but moderator , let the disputants alone . rob. but mr. russel appeal'd to me . rus. i would have these honourable persons here present , to consider that i am under great disadvantage — you are to give an instance . rob. this is your popular argument to shift the opponency and turn it upon the respondent . rus. if mr. chandler can give an instance , why do you hinder him ? i say it 's an universal negative , and i demand only an instance to the contrary . leigh . offer him the commission — all nations . robin . no reason for it to be allow'd ; but if mr. chandler , is pleased to take the part of an opponent upon him , now he may . — i suppose , mr. russel you must needs know , since you have been so often engaged in such work as this , that , according to all rules of logick , you ought to prove the negative . you do universally affirm this proposition , tho' in form it runs negatively , that no person can give one instance in any record of holy scripture , from whence we are obliged to baptize infants ! how do you prove this ● it lyes upon you to prove it . otherwise we must suppose mr. russel is a confident man , and asserts what he cannot prove . will. mr. moderator keep your place . rob. sir i am in my place . i must not suffer the disputants to break order : mr. chandler i● respondent and you are opponents , and therefore pray keep your p●ace . rus. i would take no●ice of one thing . mr. chandler hath preach'd to the people , that there is a plain command for infant baptism in scripture , and i argue upon him to give but one instance , and you will not suffer him to do it . leigh . it 's not mr. chandlers sermon , but the question , which we now argue upon . rus. i hope that there are some honourable p●●sons here that do understand the nature of this contro●●●sy ; and , i suppose , they will think it reasonable , that those who have made such a noise about this practice ought to bring some colourable proof for it . no , not one instance hath mr. chandler given . i am sure according to the rules of dispute mr. chandler must prove the negative . rob. i desire that the persons here present would take notice , that however mr. chandler have asserted in this place , and very clearly proved the baptism of infants from the commission of our ld. i. c. yet you are not now to call upon him for proof , you having undertaken to prove the contrary . mr. chandler gives an answer ; he deny's your assertion , and therefore you must prove it , and not sit down and say , do you prove the contrary , or else i 'll take it . — but if you can carry this argument no farther , it 's time to proceed to another . rus. so i design , if there be no answer given . chan. here is an answer . i deny the minor. rus. i have prov'd it , according to the judgment of all present . leigh , according to the judgment of those that understand the rules of disputation , you ought to prove the negative . but we will undertake to prove , that there is that recorded in scripture which will prove by just consequence what you deny . rob. if you will change sides you may . rus. this is no changing sides : for i do not design to quit the opponency , only let him bring an instance . * leigh . i would beg one favour , i. e. the offering a few words . i 'll undertake in any disputation , philosophical or divine , by this method , to turn the opponency on the respondent . i 'll but make him bring one proof of what he says , and this way , immediately turn the opponency on him . — and as for this , here 's a gentleman that understands the rules of disputation . — i desire , sir , you would declare whether mr. russel , be not oblig'd to prove the negative hē hath asserted . dr. smith . according to the rules of disputation . negantis non est probare . * rus. well , what must i do ? rob. sir , you are to prove your proposition . here is this worthy gentleman of the same mind . rus. how do you mean prove ? the whole current of scripture sufficiently proves it . the total silence of scripture in this matter is proof ; what is not in scripture , &c. rob. if you can proceed no farther upon this , then it 's time you go on . arg. 2. rus. if infants are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men , then they cannot possibly be the subjects of baptism intended in christ's commission . but they are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men. therefore , &c. chan. here if you mean by disciples , actual and compleat disciples , then i deny your major . but if you mean incompleat disciples , such as are entred into a school in order to be instructed , and given up in order to learn there , i deny the minor rus. the major is this . if infants are not capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men , then they cannot possibly be the subjects of baptism . chand . well then . as to your major . that they that are not capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men , are not capable subjects of baptism . distinguish between compleat and incompleat disciples . * rus. what doth he mean by denying my major ? rob. mr. chandler distinguishes between compleat and incompleat disciples . if you mean compleat disciples , he denys the major . if you mean incompleat disciples , he denys the minor. rus. well , come , tell me what he means by compleat and incompleat disciples , by the ministry of men ? chand . i mean by compleat disciples , such as are actually capable of learning ; by incompleat , such particularly , as are enter'd into the school of christ in order to their future learning , as we send children to school before they are capable of learning one letter . rus. i do not talk of that , i speak of their being actually capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men. chand . i deny that those , that are capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men in your sense , are the only subjects of baptism . that 's what you are to prove . * rus. well , if that be the thing you deny , you deny the consequence . and i prove it thus . if our lord in the commission which he hath given for holy baptism hath required h●s disciples and apostles , who were men , to make those disciples by their ministry who were to be baptized , then my consequence is true . but our lord in the commission hath , &c. therefore . chand . i deny the minor. he hath not commanded all that were to be baptized by the apostles , first to be made disciples by their ministry in your sense ; i think here ought to be a distinction . persons may have a right to publick visible entrance into the church of god , before they are compleat disciples ; that , we say , infants have before baptism , and so in a more imperfect sense are disciples , but in a more perfect sense are made so by baptism . rus. we are talking whether infants are capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men. leigh . we say , that as they are the infants of believers , so they are in a more imperfect sense really disciples before baptism . and it 's nothing , to talk of their being made such by the ministry of men. will. if they are such , then it is by the ministry of men. leigh . that i deny , knowing that you ground your assertion upon the position of teach before baptize , mat. 28.19 . rus. our saviour hath joyn'd discipling and baptizing together . they are commanded first to make disciples , and then to baptize them . therefore , i say , if infants are not capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men , they are not , according to this commission , to be baptized . chan. prove that * . rus. if infants have no knowledge to discern between good and evil , then they are not capable to be made disciples by the ministry of men . but they have no knowledge , &c. therefore , &c. chan. here you trick all this while . i told you , by disciples i meant incompleat ones , and such as are given up in order to be instructed in the school of christ. i require you to prove that these ought not to be baptized , because not capable of instruction by the ministry of men. rus. what do i care what you mean : we are speaking of the commission of christ. will. the scripture says they must be disciples according to the commission . rus. we are talking of the prerequisites to baptism : therefore it 's plain , according to what i have told you , and the argument is express and full , according to the words of the text , that they must be made disciples by the ministry of men , if they be to be baptized : for in mark christ commissioneth to go into all the world , and preach the gospel to every creature . in mat. 28. they were to disciple all nations , and then to baptize them . now if infants be not capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men , then they are not capable subjects of baptism . now you denied this consequence of the major , which i proved thus * . if infants have no knowledge to discern between good and evil , then they are not capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men . but , &c. rob. by his former distinction he denies both antecedent and consequent . chan. i deny your consequence with my former distinction † . rus. then you say , tho they have no knowledge , yet still they are capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men * . chan. i only desire a syllogism . rob. you industriously seek to hide your meaning . if you mean by disciples such as are so in the fullest and compleatest sense , prove that all must be made such , in order to their being baptized . but if you mean disciples in the lowest sense , as it intends such as are given up in order to be instructed in the school of christ , prove that infants are not capable of being made such disciples . this mr. chandler's distinction puts upon you . we do not know what you mean. rus. the argument is so plain , that i doubt not but any body of understanding may know what i mean ; therefore it 's strange that mr. chandler , leigh , robinson , do not understand me . leigh . we know there is a double sense of the word , and accordingly we deny either antecedent or consequent . chan. you will not allow the distinction of compleat or incompleat disciples , nor yet shew it to be groundless . rus. fix upon something . chan. i told you before , if in your argument , by disciples you mean incompleat ones , i deny your minor. but if compleat ones , i deny the consequence of your major . leigh . give a direct answer according to this distinction ; i. e. either prove that infants are not incompleat disciples , or that they are not to be baptized , because but incompleat ; i. e. not capable of instruction by the ministry of men . rus. have infants any knowledge ? chan. no , not in actual exercise . rus. then i proceed . if the gospel , in the ministration of it , was appointed to inform men what is good and what is evil , and infants have no knowledge to discern between good and evil , then infants are not capable of being made disciples by the ministry of men * . leigh . you ought to add ( incompleat ) . rus. what doth he mean by incompleat disciples ? here mr. chandler is forc't to explain his distinction , as before . rus. you forget we are speaking according to the commission . chand . no i don 't . i say , &c. as before . rus. then by compleat you mean such as are actually disciples . leigh . a compleat disciple is one actually capable of learning . an incompleat , is one given up as aforesaid in order to learn . and we appeal to the whole auditory , whether or no , a child of two years old thus devoted to learning by the resignation of the parent and acceptation of the master , is not justly in an imperfect sense deem'd a schollar ? rus. infants schollars ! very mean schollars indeed , not capable of learning one word . leigh . i believe here is a gentleman who teaches school . sir , i would fain know whether no one may be accounted a schollar , but he that is actually capable of learning ? mr. ridge school-master . i take all to be disciples in my school , provided entrance money be paid , * whether they learn or not . rus. i must appeal to these honourable persons , whether or no i did not tell mr. chandler , compleat disciples , such as are made by the ministry of men ? what 's the meaning of all this noise about such little children , do you think ? rob. prove what mr. chandler deny's . rus. let me know , what mr. chandler deny's . you say that they have no knowledge , and that they are not compleat disciples , the consequence then is , that they are not intended in the commission , mat. 28. mar. 16. * chand . put it into a syllogism . rus. there 's no need of putting it into a syllogism : for you have granted all the parts of my argument . yes , every part. you have granted . ( 1. ) that infants have no knowledge to discern between good and evil . you have in the ( 2. ) place granted , that according to my argument they are not capable of being made compleat disciples by the ministry of men. the consequence then is , that they are not at all intended in the commission . * rob. it 's a most false thing you insinuate to the people , and what you your self cannot but know to be false . for that the consequence , which , you would perswade the people , mr. chandler allows , is what he hath all along deny'd . and if you can't prove it , pray proceed to another argument . arg. 3. rus. if the apostle paul did declare all the councel of god , and kept back nothing that was profitable for the church of god , and yet did never declare the baptism of infants to be an institution of christ , then infant baptism is not according to the commission of our lord jesus christ. but the apostle paul did declare all the councel of god , and kept back nothing . &c. and yet did never declare the baptism of infants , &c. therefore , &c. leigh . your argument is very long . i deny that the apostle paul never spoke of infant baptism , which is part of your minor. prove that the apostle paul never did declare the baptism of infants . rus. if the apostle paul hath so declared it , then it 's some where to be be found in the writings of the new testament . but it 's no where to be found in the writings of the new testament . therefore &c. leigh . i deny the consequence of your major . for paul might declare it , tho' the new testament should not discover that he did ; the text you quote relates to the church of ephesus . and we have not the whole of the apostles sermons to them , no , not the hundredth part of them , he being among them for the space of two years . now you must prove that this refer's to that epistle he hath left upon record to the ephesians . this being all that is left to posterity in holy writ of several hundred sermons that he preach'd to that church , wherein he might speak often of infant baptism , tho' it be not mention'd in this short epistle . rus. you then acknowledge , that it 's no where recorded in the new testament . leigh . i deny that the apostle did write the whole new testament . and then , would you confine what paul is there said to have declared to the church of ephesus , to what is left on record , viz , that particular . epistle we find inscrib'd to them ? he had spoken to the church of ephesus all the councel of god , but we cannot suppose all that he deliver'd to them in 2 years to be contain'd within the compass of one short epistle , containing but six chapters . rus. is all the councel , that the apostle paul wrote , in the new testament ? is there any commission for infant baptism in the whole new testament ? do you think you speak any thing to me ? i hope you 'll own that the scriptures of the old and new testament are the only rule to direct us how we may serve and glorify god. leigh . yes , that i will. rus. i refer you to that scripture and you run to a certain sort of supposition , &c. * — i am not talking of any sermons that are not in the scripture , but of what is in the scripture . the words are plain , acts 20.20 . i have kept back nothing that was profitable for you , and v. 27. i have not shunned to declare unto you the whole councel of god. and again , 1 cor. 4.17 . he declares , that his ways in christ were such as he taught every where in every church . i do not suppose that the apostle paul taught one doctrine at one place , and another at another . now if he never taught this doctrine to the church of ephesus , nor to none else , i hope that then you 'll acknowledge ( since it 's not to be found in the writings of the new testament ) that he never declared the baptism of infants . leigh . i utterly deny it , because in the writings of the new testament , are not all the sermons that paul preached . rus. i say this , if you 'll declare before this people , that there is no account that paul did ever declare this in any of the writings of the new testament , it 's sufficient ; supposing the thing granted , that pauls epistles are not the whole of what he preached . that 's nothing to us , i suppose the people will not look any where else . if paul so declared it , then it 's * somewhere to be found in the writings of the new testament . but it 's no where to be found , &c. leigh . i utterly deny the consequence . rus. then if it be any where in the new testament , mr. chandler , mr. leigh , or some other person is able to shew it . but neither , &c. * leigh . i say , 't is included in the words , all nations , mat. 28. the commission . * rus. is mr. chandler of your mind . i tell you in my argument , that it 's not any where recorded in the new testament , that paul had thus declared the baptism of infants . and i deny that the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ , tells you , that paul did declare it . leigh . i answer , that paul might have declared the baptism of infants an hundred times over , and yet it might not be left on record in his epistle to the ephesians , nor any part of the new testament that he did so . rob. that 's the consequence you are now to prove . because it 's not left on record in his epistle to the ephesians , that therefore he never declared it to the church of ephesus . rus. i have neither ephesus nor pauls epistles in my arguments , yet you tell me . — here was a general murmuring at the drs. evasions , the weakness whereof was obvious to the auditory leigh . i 'll beg a little silence . and first read what this gentleman quotes , ( acts 20. ) — the apostle tells the church of ephesus , he had not shunned to declare to them the whole council of god. from hence he concludes , ( without proof ) that all that paul had declared to them was written and left on record ; and because the baptism of infants doth not stand on record , as being part of what he declar'd to the church of ephesus , therefore that he never did declare it . remember . to the church of ephesus he speaks . now of all the whole councel of god , which he is said to have declared to them , there is but one epistle containing six short chapters left upon record . can this short record contain all the sermons that he preached to them in two years ? or dare any say , that he never declared to them the baptism of infants in two years sermons and discourses , because it 's not contained in this short record ? and so i have done . rus. but i have not done with you , the apostle paul is the person under consideration , and mention'd in my argument , as one that did declare the whole councel of god , and kept back nothing that was profitable for them . * leigh . the church of the ephesians . pray remember that . rus. the question under consideration and my argument is of one that did declare the whole councel of god. and that the apostle paul did so , i prove , acts 20.20 . compared , with v. 27. i have kept back nothing that was profitable for you , but have shewed you and taught , &c. testifying to iews and greeks , &c. v. 26. he doth not only say , that he was pure from the blood of these ephesians , but from the blood of all men. for v. 27. i have not shunned to declare to you . i do say , that in this text , paul doth solemnly declare that he had declared all the councel of god , and i do say , that paul was faithful . i believe paul was as faithful , as laborious a servant and steward of jesus christ , as ever christ had in the world. and i argue . if paul did never declare the baptism of infants to be a gospel institution , then , i tell you , there can be no such thing . the major is proved from the words of the text. the other i prove by a syllogism , that if he declare it , it is somewhere so recorded in the new testament . but it is , &c. * chand . i deny both your antecedent and consequent . leigh . here , pray observe it gentlemen , greeks and iews were in corinth , ephesus , and various places where paul planted churches . and [ all men ] very often signifies all sorts of men. and paul speaks still to these ephesians , among whom were jews and greeks , all sorts of men. and tho' it be a certain truth that paul was pure from the blood of all men , yet all may here be understood with limitation , and so it may not be evident from this text. rus. did paul ever speak one word of infant baptism . chan. if paul did not , in what is on record to the ephesians , what then ? we deny the consequence of the argument . that because paul says he had declar'd the whole councel of god to the church of ephesus , among whom he preached for 2 years , and yet doth not mention infant baptism in his epistle left upon record to them , that therefore he did never speak of it to them , nor none elsewhere . rus. i am bound to answer here . if there are any other writings of paul that are not contain'd in the new testament , and you can produce them , then you say something to the purpose . rob. because this is what mr. respondent puts upon you to prove , unless you prove that you prove nothing : that , tho' paul did not shun to declare the whole council of god ; and did not declare infant baptism in his epistle to the church of ephesus , therefore he did not declare it in his sermons to them . arg. 4. rus. christ's commission doth shew who are to be baptized . but it doth not shew that infants are to be baptized ; therefore infants are not to be baptized according to the commission of our lord. chan. i deny your minor. that it doth not shew that infants are to be baptized . rus. if the commission of our lord doth shew that infants are to be baptized , then mr. chandler , mr. leigh , or some body else is able to shew it . but neither mr. chandler . &c. therefore &c. chand . it 's included in the words , ( all nations . ) rus. i prove it against you that infants are not included in the words ( all nations ) for if infants then all infants would be so . but you only allow infants of believing parents . leigh . the force of this argument is this . that unless we will baptize all of all nations we must baptize none of any nation . rus. no it it is not . leigh . i say they are included in the words ( all nations ) you must prove that they are not . and first of all , gentlemen , i will appeal to you , is it , in a religious sense , improper to say , the whole nation ( suppose ) of palestine are mahumetans , and so consequently , that their little children are young mahumetans . chan. you must prove that all infants are excluded from the words ( all nations . ) rus. would you have me then shew you that there is a limitation in the words ( all nations . ) leigh . the point ly's here . if he will invalidate my answer , he must shew , that , because all nations are to be baptized and infant are included in the words all nations , therefore it follows , that all infants are to be baptized . rus. therefore , if i shew there is a limitation i take away the force of the argument , and this i do , by mr. chandler's confuting himself . * leigh . i deny your minor , that christ hath not included infants in this commission . rus. if those that christ hath commanded to be baptized must be disciples , then infants are not included in this commission . but those , &c. therefore . leigh . i deny your consequence . rus. i prove it thus . if there are no others express'd in this commission , then they are not included . but no others are express'd . therefore . leigh . they are implyed . the good consequence of the commission i insist upon . i say there is no necessity for all the subjects , included in this commission , to be disciples in the fullest and compleatest sense . rus. all those that are required to be baptized by christs commission are disciples . but infants are not capable to be made disciples . therefore &c. leigh . i deny your whole argument , and first your major . rus. if there are no other express'd in christs commission , then my major is true . leigh . they are imply'd . you know you allowed good consequence but now . rus. we are talking of a commission , good sir. leigh . i hope we are talking of good consequence from a commission . that which i assert is this . that all are not to be compleat disciples , before baptized , or , that they are not to be actually taught . rus. i know not what you mean by * compleat disciples ; a person may be a disciple twenty years before he be a compleat one . if our lord requires none to be baptized by the commission , but such as he commands to be made disciples before he commands them to be ba●●●zed , then what i say is true . but our lord requires 〈◊〉 &c. therefore , leigh . i deny your minor. rus. i 'll read the commission , mat. 28.18 , 〈◊〉 . and jesus came and spake to them saying , all powe●'s given unto me in heaven and earth . ●o ye therefore and teach all nations , baptizing them , &c. teaching them to observe all things , &c. this commission is very solemnly given , &c. in this commission our lord doth first of all declare the great power that was , &c. here the dr. was going on with a large harangue . rob. pray mr. russel , do not preach us a sermon , but bring us an argument from the words . rus. i thought mr. leigh had brought the commission for an instance , we are now coming to examine , &c. leigh . pray form your syllogism . chand . pray do . rus. i say , in this commission our lord doth first of all declare , &c. he is going on again with his harangue . rob. it 's not a sermon , but an argument from the commission , &c. rus. what , will you not allow me to read my masters commission ? here in spight of us all , he would go on with his tedious dictates . rus. i argue thus from this commission . if there be an express command for the baptizing some persons in christs commission , and there be no express command , neither there nor elsewhere in the holy scriptures , for the baptizing of infants , then the baptism of infants is not contain'd in this commission . but there is an express command , &c. therefore , leigh . pray observe it , whereas good consequence was but now allowed with great difficulty , now it 's deny'd . he requires an express command . to this i answer . if nations do include infants , then there is a plain command . chand . we deny the consequence of your major , and then we deny your minor. rus. my argument was this . * if there be an express command in christs commision , &c. they deny the sequel of my major , and by thus denying do say , that , notwithstanding there be no express command for the baptizing of infants , neither in the commission , nor any where else in the holy scripture , yet they do tell us by this denial , that they may be included in the commission . rob. here is a sophism ; says he , if it be neither in the commission , nor any where else in the holy scriptures , then it is not in the commission . rus. if there be an express command for the baptizing of some persons in christs commission , and there be no express command for the baptizing of infants , then infants are not at all intended in christs commission . but , &c. therefore , &c. leigh . first , i deny the sequel of the major , and then i deny the minor. rus. it seems very strange , that you do deny this , and i will endeavour to prove it . here is an express command for some persons to be baptized , here is no express command for the baptizing of infants ; is it not then a necessary consequence that they are not included in the commission ? * leigh . i deny both parts , and first your major . rus. i shall prove it thus . * that there is an express command for baptizing some persons , the commission it self proves . leigh . it 's the sequel of the major i deny . pray prove that . rus. then you do say , that , notwithstanding our lord hath expresly commanded some persons to be baptized in the commission , and hath not expresly commanded infants , yet they may be some of the number . hath christ two sorts of subjects , one that he doth expresly command to be baptized , and another that he doth not command ? leigh . put your proof of the sequel of the major into a syllogism . rus. we are upon the commission . leigh . i say , prove the consequence of your major . rus. if no person be to be baptiz'd but what is expresly required to be so by christ's commission , then the consequence of the major is true ; i. e. that the baptism of infants is not contained in the commission . but no person is to be baptized , &c. therefore . leigh . i deny your minor. rus. that which i am to prove is this , that there are no persons to be baptized but what are expresly required in the commission . i prove it thus . if the words of the commission are an express command to the apostles of our lord , to direct them whom they should baptize , then the minor is true . but the words of the commission are , &c. therefore , &c. leigh . i deny your minor. rus. if there be no other commission of our lord and saviour j. c. for holy baptism , but what is recorded mat. 28. mar. 16. then the minor is true . but there is no other , &c. therefore , &c. leigh . i deny the sequel of the major . rus. we are now upon the commission . leigh . that we are ; and we say , that whatever by good consequence is fairly deducible from the commission , is the true sense of it . rus. they are not to baptize any but such as they are expresly commanded so to do . leigh . i deny it . rus. if there be no manner of allowance given them to baptize any other than whom they are expresly commanded , then the consequence of the major is true . but there is no manner of allowance , &c. therefore , &c. leigh . now i deny your minor. rus. i f●ll recur to my former argument . if there be an express command in the commission to the apostles , for the baptism of all such as they are required to baptize by vertue of that commission , then my minor is true . but , &c. here follows a vacancy in the notes of our scribes . r. if for all those they are to baptize by vertue of the commission , they are to have an express command from christ so to do , then there is no allowance in the commission to baptize any other person . but for all those they are required to baptize , &c. therefore , &c. chand . i deny the minor. leigh . i distinguish between the command 's being exprest , and the subjects of it . chand . prove that all the subjects are exprest . rus. if the words in the commission , about holy baptism , be a command of christ to the apostles * , then my minor is true . but they are a command , &c. therefore . leigh . we allow it 's a command , but deny that all the subjects are exprest . i say , i allow the command to be express , but deny that all the subjects are exprest ; some are taken in by good consequence . rus. if christ hath commanded his apostles to baptize such as do believe and are made disciples , then such are to be baptized . but &c : therefore &c. l. i find , in the first place , a fault with your syllogism . the major ought to be universal . whereas it is , such as do believe are the subjects of baptism ; it ought to be , such are the only , or all the subjects of baptism ; and thus , in the second place , i deny the sequel . w●●l . then i am to prove that believers only are intended . if believers are the only persons that are included in the commission , then no other persons are . but believers are the only &c : therefore . l. i deny your minor. w. i will prove it in mark 16. last . he that believeth is baptized , &c. hence i argue that believers are the only subjects to be baptized . l. to this i answer , first . if previous actual believing be made universally necessary to baptism , it is much more so to salvation , and consequently no infant can be saved , for the following words are be that believeth not shall be damned . rus. i do not affirm any such thing , i would rather say that all infants dying in their infancy are elect , and so saved , the contrary to which i believe mr. chandler ' cannot prove * . l. yes , we know your opinion about this well enough . i have your confession in my ecclet . but if you will assert that actual believing is necessary to baptism , then 't is so to salvation ; for it follows , he that believeth not shall be damned . wil. if believers are the only subjects of baptism , according to the commission , then infants are not the subjects of baptism : but believers are the only subjects , &c. therefore , &c. l. i deny your minor. wil. then pray shew me where any others are in the commission . l. in the words ( all nations ) . wil. in the words ( all nations ) ? no , say i , it 's all nations so modified . it 's all nations discipled . l. i deny it . this is not evident from this text. wil. go , disciple unto me all nations , baptizing them . the word them is relative to all nations , discipled . if therefore there be none but believers , and such as are taught in the commission , then infants are not in the commission . but there are none but believers , &c. l. i deny your minor. wil. if infants are not capable of being taught , then they are no disciples . but they are not , &c. therefore . l. i deny it , i. e. the sequel . wil. if infants are uncapable of learning jesus christ , then they are uncapable of being discipled unto christ. but , &c. l. i deny the consequence of your major ; that because they are uncapable of learning christ , therefore they are uncapable of being discipled to christ. will. i say , if infants are not the subjects in the commission * , neither are capable of being taught and instructed , then they are not the subjects of baptism . but , &c : therefore , &c. l. i deny that they are not the subjects . and the greek word signify's to make disciples . i deny that they are uncapable of being made disciples , because not capable of learning . wil. if to be a disciple of christ is to be a schollar of christ , then infants that are uncapable of learning christ can be no disciples . but , &c. therefore , &c. l. i deny still the sequel of the major . will if he that hath learn't nothing is no schollar , then because they are not capable of learning jesus christ , they are no scholars of christ. but , &c. therefore &c. l. i appeal to all here present , whether they do not count that child an incompleat schollar , that is resigned by the parent and accepted by the master , tho' it hath not learn'd any thing . and now i deny your minor. wil. tell me where christ's school is for teaching infants , and who is christ's school-master ? l. jesus christ himself is the school-master . wil. jesus christ is the great school-master , but his ministers are appointed to make disciples by teaching . now you say a child is a disciple as soon as he goes to school . l. i say , the resignation of the parent , and the acceptation of the master , constitutes the relation . wil. if he that hath been at school , and taught by his own consent , must appear to be a scholar of christ by his having actually learn'd , before he be baptized , then infants that are entred , according to your saying , must not be baptized . but he that hath been at school , &c. therefore . l. i deny your consequence . wil. i prove it thus . the eunuch was content to be taught * ; philip teacheth him : yet afterward he must know whether he believed , before he baptized him . therefore infants , entred according to your saying , must not be baptized , because they are not content to be taught , &c : and erasmus , tho' he was none of the best of men yet he was accounted a great schollar in his day , he reads it , when they have learned dip thou them . l. here are two things that this old gentleman argues from , the first is , the instance of the eunuch . the second is , the authority of erasmus . will. not from his authority , but judgment * . rob. did erasmus write in english ? you say , you do not understand latin. wil. in english. here the people brake out into a great laughter . rus. is erasmus in your esteem so mean a schollar , that there must be such laughing at the old gentleman's mentioning the name of erasmus ? * l. well , but as to the first thing ; you argue from the instance of the eunuch ; the eunuch was a proselyte of the gate , and a grown person , and therefore philip deals with him as such . now , according to the iewish law , a proselyte's infant was to be taken into their church , as the infant of an home-born inhabitant * . and because philip requires of him a profession of his faith , suppose he had had an infant in the chariot , must that be denied baptism , and so lookt upon as the infant of a pagan , and be shut out of visible church-membership , which he enjoyed before ? did his parents faith deprive him of church-membership ? then as to erasmus , he was an interpendent between a papist and protestant ; and many of these gentlemen , in their great zeal against infant-baptism , will call it a peice of popery , and yet can make use of the name of an half-papist when it serves their cause . wil. if the administrator must have an account of the subjects learning , before he be baptiz'd , then infants are not the subjects of baptism . but he must , &c. therefore . l. i deny your minor , that he that administers the ordinance must always have an account of the subjects learning . vvil. i will prove it first by that of philip : if thou believest with all thine heart , thou mayest . the contrary whereunto is , if thou dost not , thou mayest not . again , mat. 28. go teach all nations , baptizing them , &c. the word is relative to all nations discipled . they must have an account whether they are disciples or not . this is the antecedent . l. all nations ? wil. nay , all nations discipled . l. so you say . but prove it . what! perhaps you think that all nations cannot be the antecedent to them ; because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is the neuter gender , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is the masculine . rus. yes , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is of the masculine gender , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is of the masculine gender , and agrees with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . rob. i thought 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 had been a verb. rus. i answer to what he says ; he says that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is of the masculine gender , and i say so , and that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is of the same gender , and agrees with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . l. i suppose mr. russel thinks he is got among his hebrew verbs . they , notwithstanding , refer each to other , tho 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be of the neuter , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of the masculine gender . for a boy of 12 years of age , that hath lookt into the greek , can tell you that such a synthesis is frequently to be met with in the greek . vvil. if infants are uncapable of denying themselves for christ , then they are uncapable of being disciples to christ. but , &c. therefore , &c. l. i deny the sequel of the major . will. i prove it out of luke 14. if he doth not deny himself , he cannot be christ's disciple . l. this purely refer's to the adult . and i will argue ab absurdo . * if any work not let him not eat , but infants cannot * work , therefore they must not eat . but both one text , and the other refer to the adult p●●ly . rus. what 's all this ? we do say , that infants are not at all concerned in the commission , mat. 28.19 . because they cannot perform the prerequisites , faith and repentance , therefore are not capable of baptism . now if you 'll say , that incapable persons are intended in the commission , then i hope , you may put that upon your selves ; then you must argue , infants must be starved to death because they will not work . i demand of any of you to give an instance of any one scripture , that speaks of baptism in the new testament , that doth respect any other but adult persons . * will. if the essence of faith consist in the acts of the understanding and will , then infants are incapable of being disciples . but , & o. therefore , &c. l. i deny the sequel of the major , viz. that infants are uncapable of being disciples . vvill. if a disciple and a believer be the same thing , then the sequel of the major is true . but a disciple and believer are the same thing . therefore , l. i distinguish upon the minor. it 's not universally and in all respects the same thing . those may be disciples that are not actual believers . vvill. he that is a disciple of christ according to the commission , is a believer . but infants are not capable of believing . therefore . he that is a believer in mark , is a disciple in matthew . l. this i deny , and answered it before . it 's not vniversally true . vvill. if the essence of faith consist in the act of the understanding and will , then infants are uncapable of believing , but , &c. l. i acknowledge , the act of faith consists in the act of the understanding and the will , and that infants are uncapable of actual believing , but not of being disciples in an imperfect sense * but i would fain know if infants are not as capable of believing imputatively , as of coming to christ when brought in the arms of other persons . * vvill. they can do both alike , as well come to christ as believe in him ; by believing i mean actual believing . this i acknowledge . l. why cannot children be said in a spiritual sense to come to christ imputatively , as well as to come to christ corporally when only brought in others arms. coming to christ and believing are the same . tho' he that is brought in the arms of the parents faith cannot be 〈◊〉 actually to believe , yet imputatively he may . vvil. how could they come to christ when they were brought ? l. and yet they are expresly said to come to christ. and may they not as well be said to be capable of spiritual as of corporal coming when they were brought to him ? why can they not come spiritually by imputation , as before ? will. they cannot come spiritually unless they actually believe 〈◊〉 child cannot thus come to christ without a sight of christ and also of himself . l. i do own in a proper and strict sense , none can be said thus to come to christ but adult persons ; yet in a more large sense , they may as well be said to believe on christ imputatively when their parents believe and devote them to christ , as to come to christ corporally when brought in their arms. you know christ says , suffer little children to come to me . it 's most probable these were brought in arms to christ. why may they not be said imputatively to believe , as well as imputatively to come ? wil. i deny that the parent's faith was ever imputed to the child . l. you know the distinction of believers , in foro dei , & in foro ecclesiae , which i suppose you 'll allow . and under the notion of believers in foro ecclesiae , the parents faith may be imputed to their children . vvil. we do say that a person is not a disciple of christ before he have learned christ * . l. then do we send children to school because they have learned , or that they may learn ? rus. i think we should now see whether we can possibly by force of argument bring you to give an instance therefore i argue thus . arg. 5. if the apostles of our lord never did baptize any infants , then the baptism of infants is not according to the commission of our lord jesus christ. but the apostles of our lord never did , &c : therefore . chand . i deny the minor. rus. if the apostles did baptize any infants , it is some where to be found in the writings of the new testament . but it 's no where to be found , &c. l. i deny your major . rus. if there be no other rule to direct us concerning holy baptism than what is in the new testament , then , because it 's no where to be found in the writings of the new testament , the apostles did never baptize any infants . but there is no other rule &c : therefore &c. l. you are come from an example to a rule . i say it may not be recorded in the writings of the new testament , and yet the apostles might baptize infants . but this is not granted , only supposed , that it 's not recorded . it is not recorded in the new testament ( what you practise ) that grown children of believers were , when adult , baptized . i challenge you to produce one instance of any , born of believing parents , baptized at age. rus. that 's no business of ours . don't think to sham off the business so . we have called for your instance several times of an infant baptized , and you have not been able to give it . l. it 's the custom of these persons to baptize grown persons tho' baptized before , and yet there is no scripture for it . they talk much of our having no scripture for infant baptism , and of their having abundance for their practice . now let them give one instance of what is their practice , viz : of one person born of a believer baptized at years , and i 'll give them the cause . wil. give your instance for infant baptism , or else i hope the people will go away , and conclude you have none . l. give your instance to prove your practice , or else i hope , the people will go away satisfy'd you have none to give . it was by the computation of the learned from the death of christ to the death of st. iohn the apostle near sixty years , in which time many thousands of the children of believing parents became adult , yet we challenge you to produce one instance in all that time of any of their children baptiz'd , when adult . rus. the emperour constantine was born of a christian parent , and yet not baptized till adult . l. but not because they then thought the children of believing parents had no right to baptism , but because they thought that sins committed after baptism were unpardonable ; therefore , they oftentimes defer'd it till death . * besides , this is not to the purpose , because a scripture instance was call'd for . vvill. we are able to produce several instances where grown believers were baptized , but you not one of infant baptism . l. that was at the first planting of the gospel : give an instance of a grown person , descending from believing parents , that was baptized when adult . rus. if this were any thing to the purpose , i would then say something to it . but i wonder you should talk thus , when it was practised a great many years in the church to give the lord's supper to infants * l. was it ? then ( ad hominem ) they were baptized , because they were not to receive that ordinance before they were baptized . we demand an instance of any child of a believing parent that was baptized when adult . give this , and we will give you the cause . wil. was the mother of our lord jesus christ a believer ? l. yes . wil. well then , there 's the son of a believer baptized at age * here the anabaptists fell a laughing , and some cry'd out , it 's done , it 's done . and , for a while , mr. leigh attempting several times to speak , could not be heard . l. i thought our discourse had been grounded on the commission . was this before or after the commission ? here the people laugh'd again . rus. what do they laught at ? not at what the old gentleman said , but at what mr. leigh says * the old gentleman gave a right instance . rob. it 's not at all to the purpose . rus. mr. williams's instance was sufficiently to the purpose ; for that mr. leigh called for an instance of the child of a believing parent , baptized at grown years . the virgin mary was a believer . rob. tho mr. leigh did express himself in such general terms , yet the whole strain of the discourse sufficiently manifests , he meant the child of such a believer as was properly christian. the virgin mary was undoubtedly a believing member of the jewish church ; but this is not to our purpose ; for we want an instance of the child of a christian parent , after baptism was instituted by our lord , that yet was baptized at grown years . the instance of our saviour doth not agree to such a case as this is . for that christianity , as distinguished from iudaism , had not then a being , and the virgin mary was not in this sense christian , nor was baptism it self then instituted by our lord ; and therefore this instance can signify nothing to the case in hand . will. i have given an instance of the child of a believing parent , baptized at age. give us an instance of any infant that was baptized . l. as for that . our lord jesus christ is not to be imitated in that particular . rus. no ? vvill. do you prove he was not . l. if he were , then there is no person to be baptized till 30 years of age , nor baptized at all , unless circumcised at eight days old . and thus their scripture instance , with their triumph upon it , vanished . vvill. i demand an instance of an infant that was baptiz'd . l. i demand an express prohibition . vvill. i demand an express prohibition of salt , cream , oyl and spittle . l. i answer , ( 1. ) the case is not parallel . you speak of the substance , we of the subjects of baptism . ( 2. ) infants are included in the words , all nations . but salt , cream , oyl , &c. are not in the word disciple , or baptize . rob. what need of an instance when we have a rule . now , mr. chandler , if you please , you may take the part of an opponent . and prove our practice to be agreeable to scripture . mr. chandler turns opponent . arg. 1. chand . visible church members ought to be baptized . but some infants are visible church members . therefore some infants , &c. rus. adult believers may , but not infants . rob. what 's this to the purpose we are upon ? which of mr. chandlers propositions do you deny ? rus. let him repeat his argument . chand . visible church members ought to be baptized , according to christ's commission . but some infants are visible church members ; therefore , &c. rus. i deny the major . * chand . that all visible church members are to be baptized , according to christs commission , i prove thus . if there be no precept or example in all the word of god , since christ ordain'd baptism , that makes any other ordinance the visible means of encring a person into the visible church , then visible church members ought to be baptized , but there is no , &c. therefore . rus. this is to say . because they are members , therefore they are to be made members . chand . no. because they are members , they ought to be solemnly recogniz'd as members : like the coronation of a king. he is a king before he is crown'● but he is crown'd that he might be own'd as king. vvill. if baptism be the initiating ordinance into the church , then they were not church members before . chand . i say , baptism is the solemn investing sign . rus. that baptism is an initiating ordinance , i grant . rob. this argument was brought to prove that visible church members ought to be baptiz'd . vvill. i deny that infants are visible church members in their infancy . * l. i 'll prove that some infants , are church-members in their infancy ; suffer little children to come unto me , for of such is the kingdom of heaven , mat. 19.14 . hence i argue : those that belong to the kingdom of heaven , i. e. the church-militant here upon earth , are visible church-members . but some infants belong to the kingdom of heaven , i , e. the church-militant here on earth . therefore , will. i deny the minor. that text proves it not . l. if the kingdom of heaven cannot be taken any otherwise in this text to make good sense of the text , then it must be so taken , i. e. for the church-militant here on earth . but it cannot be taken any otherwise to make good sense of the text. therefore &c : and this i prove by an induction of particulars . there are various acceptations of this expression , [ the kingdom of heaven ] in the word of god. sometimes it signifys , the laws and promises of the kingdom ; it doth also signify the graces by which we observe those laws and believe those promises . thus it 's represented by a grain of mustard-seed . sometimes the kingdom of glory . and sometimes it signifies the church-militant . hence therefore i thus argue . if in this place it can neither signify the laws and promises of gods kingdom , nor the graces by which we observe those laws and embrace those promises , nor the kingdom of glory ; then it must signify the church-militant here upon earth . but it cannot signify either of the former . therefore it must signify the last , viz. the church-militant . will. i deny the minor. i say it signifys the kingdom of glory . l. if it be nonsense so to understand the words then they are not so to be understood . but its nonsense , &c : for then the kingdom of glory must consist in part of poor little weak things , such as infants are : whereas after death all are perfect in the kingdom of glory , whatever they are here on earth . will. i thought it had been , to such belongs the kingdom of heaven . chand . mat. 19.14 . in the greek it is , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , of such is the kingdom of heaven . l. that is ; of such it consists in part . if we mention the kingdom of england or france , and say , of such is the kingdom , &c. it 's to be understood , in part it consists of these . will. i deny that the visible church in part consists of these . if they are neither members of the universal church , nor of a particular church , then the church doth not in part consist of these ; but , &c : therefore , &c. * l. i answer . now you relinguish my medium . but farther , if they are members of the church at all , then they are members of the universal church visible . but they are members of the church . therefore , &c. vvill. i deny the minor , i. e. that they are visible members of the church . l. there are two sorts of members of the universal church . there are members in foro ecclesiae , and members in foro caeli . in which of these senses do you deny they are members of the church ? vvill. if by the church , you mean the visible church , i deny your minor. here for about four or five lines , there is great confusion in what our scribes have written . but this i take to be the sense of it . l. if they are members of the church in any sense then they are members of a particular or the universa● church , and if of a particular then of the universa● which includes it ; and therefore they are members of the visible church . but they are members of the church in some sense , and for proof hereof i return to my argument which you have not been able to answer ; of such is the kingdom of heaven , i. e. the church militant . vvill. i distinguish , as to the kingdom of heaven : it 's there meant of the kingdom of glory . l. if of the kingdom of glory , then it 's nonsence . but , by the way , the kingdom of glory either is put for the happiness or subjects of the kingdom of glory . if the happiness , then the words must run thus . of such little children is the happiness of the kingdom of glory . if the subjects , then thus . of such little children are the subjects of the kingdom of glory . now neither of these is sense ; therefore cannot be meant : but my first interpretation stands good still . vvill. i distinguish between a right title and possession . here is a vacancy — three things . it 's true , faith gives a right to baptism according to the commission , a profession of that faith gives a right to the administration of that ordinance , and it 's the commission that authoriseth the administrators . rus. this text you produce hath no relation at all to the commission , nor is baptism in the least intended in the text. l. mr. russel , i 'll propose this question to you . whether , both what christ said and did , together with what the apostles said and did , be the best explication of christs commission ? and then , whether , i may not argue from christs own words , for visible church membership and so for baptism ? rus. i do allow that what christ said and did , and what the apostles said and did , is a very good interpretation of the commission of our lord. and i do say , that only adult persons are intended in the commission ; and that the apostles never did baptize any other than adult believers . * l. then i hope , we may argue from christs own words . did he speak pertinently or impertinently ? if pertinently , how comes he to say , of such is the kingdom of heaven , unless he meant the visible church , which alone makes sense of the text. but is this an answer to my question , to say that adult believers are only intended in the commission ? rus. yes , if your question relate to water baptism . l. if the kingdom of heaven in part consists of infants , then infants ought to be baptized . but , &c. therefore , &c. rob. pray mr. russel , which of mr. leighs propositions do you deny ? l. give me an answer directly . rus. i demand an exposition . what do you mean by the kingdom of heaven ? * l. i mean the church and kingdom of god here on earth . rus. i deny your minor. l. i prove it from the forecited scripture . if by the kingdom of heaven , mat. 19. is signified the church visible here on earth ; then infants do in part make up the church . but &c : therefore &c. rus. i deny your minor. l. if we must make good sense of scripture then it must so signify . but &c. rus. i deny the consequence of your major . l. if the kingdom of heaven cannot be taken in any other signification to make good sense of it in that place , then it must so be taken . but it cannot &c : therefore . rus. i deny your minor. l. if you can produce no other good interpretation that can make good sense of that scripture , then &c. rus. i deny the consequence of your major . it doth not follow because i cannot do it , that therefore it cannot be done . l. then i say if neither you , nor any other person can produce any other good interpretation that can make good sense of that scripture , then &c. rus. is this a good way of arguing ? if it be , then it was so in me as well as you . rob. mr. leigh . it was not fair , therefore not allowed them . you must not put the proof upon the respondent . leigh . i was not driving them to proof , but going to prove my assertion by an induction of particulars , as i have already done and that i shall do again . if the kingdom of heaven here signifys neither the laws nor promises of the kingdom , nor graces by which these laws and promises are observed and embraced , nor jesus christ's management of his kingdom , nor the glory of heaven , nor the subjects of glory , then it must signify the church-militant here upon earth . but it signifys neither of the former . therefore the last . * rus. i deny the minor. l. i prove it by a recapitulation of those particulars . of such little children are the laws and promises of the kingdom , of such are the graces by which we observe and embrace them , of such is christs management of his kingdom , of such is the kingdom of glory , of such is the happiness or subjects of glory . now is there any good sense in all this . rus. it s meant of the kingdom of glory . l. by the kingdom of glory you must mean either the happiness or subjects of the kingdom . if it be taken for the happiness of the kingdom of glory , then i ask whether little children are the happiness of heaven ? if for the subjects ; then i ask whether of such consists the subjects of the kingdom of glory , when every one belonging to that kingdom , i.e. as distinct from the church-militant , immediately upon his expiring is compleat , even an infant 3 days old ? rus. this is very uncharitable , to exclude infants from heaven . i would rather incline to say , and i am sure the contrary to it mr. leigh can never prove , that all infants belong to the kingdom of glory , than that none do . l. yes we know your judgment of that matter well enough . but you wilfully misrepresent my sense . i do not say that none who dy infants go to the kingdom of glory , but that none are infants when they come there . but the text says , of such is the kingdom of heaven . this therefore is what i assert , that it is absurd to say that the kingdom of glory is , in any part of it , made up of weak imperfect things as little infants are ; and therefore that the kingdom of heaven , here spoken of , must mean the church-militant here on earth which is in part made up of such , here mr. russel was silent for a considerable time . * rob. what mr. russel have you no reply to make to all this ; pray , if you have any thing to say , let us hear it ; otherwise , be so kind as to tell the people , you can give no answer , that we may go on to some what further . rus. my answer is this . that whereas you have undertaken to prove that infants are the subject● of baptism , according to christs commission , you bring a text for it that hath neither the word baptism in it nor the commission of our lord. * l. very well then . if we prove from any text of scripture the right of infants to baptism , it must not be allowed , unless we find it in the close of the evangelists , where is what you call the commission ; or unless the word baptism be in it . rob. mr. russel . they are not obliged to have the mention either of baptism or the commission of our lord in the conclusion of every syllogism . they had it in the first . they then told you ; that such as were members of the church-militant on earth were to be baptiz'd according to the commission of our lord. and this was the case of some infants . you denyed any infants were members of christs kingdom , or church-militant here on earth , and to prove this they brought that text. and i suppose the whole company was satisfy'd that it doth sufficiently prove what it was produced for . and now you dare not deny the major ; if you do i doubt not but they are ready to prove it . vvill. if church members have been denyed baptism , then church-membership is not the ground of baptism , but &c. * l. i deny the minor. vvil. if church-members came to iohn to be baptized , and were denyed , then church-membership is is not the ground of baptism . but &c. l. i deny the minor. vvill. i prove it , mat. 3. when he saw the multitude and many of the pharisees and sadduces come to his baptism , he said to them ; o generation of vipers , &c. l. i deny that they were de jure , church members whatever they were , de facto . their being a generation of vipers is sufficient to prove , they were not church members , de jure ; and we are speaking of rightful church members . vvill. i have proved that church members were denied baptism . l. i deny it and distinguish between church members , de jure & de facto . will. i will not meddle with your distinctions . rob. and can you think that the word church-members cannot possibly admit of more senses than one ? l. i say , they were not church members , de jure . vvill. were they denied any priviledges ? rob. according to what you said just now , they were deny'd baptism , was that no church priviledge ? * vvill. such as are visible members of the universal church , are qualify'd with a work of grace , &c. l. i deny it , viz. that they are always so . vvill. it is in the judgment of charity so . l. such as were a generation of vipers were not qualify'd with a work of grace , and so were not church members , according to your own assertion . rob. especially such as were known to be a generation of vipers . vvill. if our lord jesus did disciple such as were church members before they were baptiz'd , then church membership is not the ground of baptism . but , &c. l. we distinguish between the jewish church and the christian church . and then i distinguish between infant church membership ; and adult church members . now christian church membership is a ground of baptism . sharp . the anabaptist moderator . you say infants are church members ; church members upon their apostacy ought to be excommunicated : when were any admitted into church membership in their infancy , excommunicated upon their apostacy ? rob. there is with us as with the jews anciently , a two fold excommunication , excommunicatio major , and excommunicatio minor : as to the first , which is a solemn cutting off from the vniversal church , i question , whether our laws gives us the liberty of practising it ; and as to the second , which is a suspension from the lords supper ; i do not see that to be needful in the case before us . leigh to mr. sharp ; we are not now talking about the management of church members , but who are the persons which ought to be esteemed so ? farther , it is needless ●● exclude those from adult church-membership who never offered themselves to it . it 's as if we should shut our doors against a person , who never attempts an entrance . to this mr. sharp made no reply . vvil. ministers are to baptize none , but those that are discipled by the words of the commission . * chand . here 's the consequence of it . vvil. no here is no genuine consequence . the commission mentions no more but disciples and believers . and if you can find one person more besides disciples and believers , do it ? * rus. it doth appear by all that hath been said , that our practice is allow'd . rob. not your practice . l. we do not allow your practice , unless to such as have not been baptized . * vvill. we agree , that those that are not baptized ought to be baptized . you are bound to baptize none , but such , as you are bound to preach to . l. i deny it . rus. have infants the use of reason ? chand . no. * rus. if infants , without understanding , are capable of being made disciples , by the ministry of men ; then may the beasts of the field . but the beasts of the field may not , &c. therefore . l. i appeal to all present . is it as proper to take pigs and dogs to school , as little children of a year and half old ? are those so capable of the parent 's resignation and master's acceptation as these ? if infants might keep the charge of the sanctuary from a month old and upward , they may be esteemed believers and disciples . but &c. rus. i wonder you will maintain ●he●hing upon such silly foundations . * l. pray answer the last argument . rus. there is nothing of christs commission in it . l. unless we can prove infant baptism in the close of one of the evangelists ; no proof is to be allowed . will. i thought it was to be argued according to the commission . * but i see , &c. rob. if you be of mr. russel's mind , then you may turn your children out to the dogs and pigs , and beasts of the field . it is most insufferable ; i never heard such an expression in my life . but you may see what the principles of anabaptists naturally lead men to . here the anabaptists being shamefully nonpluss't , mr. leigh apply'd himself to the mayor and governour , in this manner : you see they are not able to answer our first argument , but are entirely gravell'd . the rules of disputation oblige us to go no farther in the opponency . yet we will be at your command . we have six arguments more at hand ; if you please , we will proceed to offer them : or , if you please , we will proceed to the second question . sharp . anabaptist moderator . let us have a precept or an example . rob. a precedent we need not give , here is a precept brought and yet no answer given to it . rus what precept ? rob. that which by undenyable consequence obliges us to it tho' there be not , in express words , a requirement that we baptize infants . — one would have thought , mr. russel should have allowed , tho' they are not capable of dutys , yet they are capable of the priviledges : here an answer to our last argument was again and again call'd for , but none given . rob. pray mr. chandler , let no more time be lost , but proceed to another argument . arg. 2. chand . if some infants be the disciples of christ , then , according to the commission of our lord , some infants are to be baptized . but some infants are disciples . therefore &c. rus. i deny your minor. chand . those that the holy ghost in scripture calls disciples , are disciples . but the holy ghost in scripture calls some infants disciples ; ergo they are disciples . rus. i deny your minor. chand . i prove it from that text : acts 15.10 . now therefore , why tempt you god , to put a yoke upon the necks of the disciples ? upon infants the yoke of circumcision was laid , they are call'd disciples . rus. i deny that text proves it . chan. if this yoke were laid upon the neck of the disciples , then infants are disciples . but &c. : therefore &c. rus. ● deny that there is any such thing in the text either 〈◊〉 or intended . chand . the dispute was occasion'd by some false teachers , that had said , except christians were circumcised , a●●●●p● the law of moses , they could not be saved . now says the apostle , why do you lay a yoke upon the neck o● the disciples &c : this yoke was the yoke of circumcision , which was laid on the neck of some infants . rus. no infants can be here intended , for those , who are called disciples in this verse , are called brethren and believers in the 9 th verse . and therefore it could not intend infants . l. we will read verse the first . except ye be circumcised after the manner of moses . now i ask you what was the manner of moses ? rus. to cut the foreskin of their flesh. l. suppose we were to teach this people , as the judaizing christians did them ; except you are circumcised after the manner of moses you can't be saved , no doubt but they would understand the manner of moses to intend , not only all the circumstances of it , but , that their children must also be circumcised , this being after the manner of moses . here i will form this argument . if those are called disciples who were to be circumcised after the manner of moses , then infants are disciples . but , &c : and so ought to be baptized . now they themselves allow that disciples ought to be baptized . rus. it 's the gentile believers that are there called disciples . chand . it is all upon whom the yoke of circumcision was laid , which neither they nor their fathers were able to bear . will. they could bear the yoke of circumcision . chand . they were not able to bear it . the holy ghost says so expresly ; which signifys the painfullness and troublesomeness of that ordinance . l. what you say of moment is this . that children are able to bear the yoke of circumcision , therefore that yoke is not there intended , but the whole ceremonial law. we allow the ceremonial law was included , but circumcision was here chiefly intended . will. if circumcision was binding to keep the whole law , then this is not the yoke that neither we nor our fathers were able to bear . but it was so , gal. 5.3 . l. thus far i think the old gentleman is in the right , that the apostles are here and in the epistle to the gal. endeavouring the same thing , driving them off from the observation of the ceremonial law. but herein he is mistaken , he would leave out circumcision , one of the prime and most painful parts of this law , and so would leave out those infants whom th●se iudaizing christians advised to be circumcised . rus. prove that infants are there intended . l. if the context do oblige us to take in infants , then they are there intended . but the context , &c. ergo. it is a reproof of , or reasoning with , those that were inclined to impose circumcision on the necks of the disciples , and with it the whole law of moses , v. 5. they were strictly observant of moses's law , nothing is more plain and obvious to one observant of moses's law than to circumcise infants at eight days old . and consequently nothing would they urge more on these disciples . rus. if they be such as * had their hearts purified by faith , brethren , &c. l. that 's not necessary . their being barely the infants of these disciples was enough . if i were to act the part of a judaizing christian , and were to perswade all these gentlemen that they were to observe circumcision according to the law of moses ; and did call those disciples , who were so circumcised ; would they not take it to be sufficiently plain , that their infants were intended as well as themselves . and therefore , that i called their infants disciples . rus. if you bring a text , and i shew you several weighty considerations , why it should not be understood in your sense . i expect not such ●tories as these . rob. is it not enough , if mr. leigh shews that this text will admit of no other sense ? will. if so be , that children were brought in , it would not follow that they were disciples , for those that were circumcised were not disciples . l. you say , the qualification was , they must be believers and have their hearts purified by faith . i answer . these judaizing christians would perswade them to circumcise after the manner of moses , and so to take the yoke not only themselves , but also on their infants . now all these , without distinction , on whom this yoke was about to be laid are called disciples , and therefore their infants . vvill. after the manner of moses● th●e relates to the form , not the subjects . here again is a vacancy in the notes of our scribes . rob. here hath been a great deal of time spent about this argument . the substance of what was said on both sides is this : mr. chandler and mr. leigh have urged , that such as are disciples of christ ought to be baptized , and that some infants are disciples of christ. this mr. russel deny's ; and they have proved it from this , that some infants are call'd disciples by the spirit of god. this also mr. russel hath deny'd ; so that the whole question result's to this head : whether any infants be in scripture call'd disciples ? now this hath been , i think , sufficiently clear'd from this text , act. 15.10 . where the persons call'd disciples are those , upon whom the judaizing christians would have imposed the yoke of circumcision . the doctrine , they taught the christian gentiles , was , that their christianity would avail them nothing , it was to no purpose tho' they did believe in christ ; unless they were also circumcised according to the law of moses , they could not be saved . you all know what the law of moses doth prescribe and command in this case , not only , that they themselves , but that every male child among them should be circumcised . rus. it is not according to the law of moses , but after the manner of moses . rob. mr. russel , it 's true ; it 's after the manner of moses in the first verse , but if you look forward into the chapter , you will find express mention of the law of moses . you must be circumcised and keep the law of moses . v. 5th . i suppose you that have so oft read this chapter , could not but be sensible that such an expression was there , tho' not in the first verse ; and therefore the distinction you will pretend to make between the law of moses and the manner of moses , was but a meer evasion , and in this case a distinction without difference . the one explains the other . that which is call'd their being circumcised after the manner of moses , in one place , is called their being circumcised and keeping the law of moses in the other place . they must be circumcised as moses did order , so that his law might be observed and fulfilled in the doing of it ; which it could not be , tho they themselves were circumcised never so regularly , unless their infants were so too . and yet the whole body of those on whom the pharisees would have imposed the yoke of circumcision , are here expressly call'd disciples ; this whole body of adult and infants are therefore in common included under this name , which was all that we had to prove . and we are now willing to refer it to the people , whether what hath been said be not sufficient proof . if you please therefore , we will now proceed to the second question . pray mr. chandler , let the company understand what it is . reader , here observe . we were ready ( as before mention'd ) to offer several other arguments , but no tollerable answer being given to those two , neither the rules of disputation did oblige us , nor the company 's patience , and the approaching evening allow us to do it , unless the second question were wholly excluded . q. 2. whether , according to the commission of our lord , baptism be to be administred by dipping , plunging , or overwhelming only , and not otherways . it lies upon you to prove , that it is by dipping , plunging , overwhelming only . rus. the holy scripture shews the way of baptizing . but it doth not shew that sprinkling is the way . therefore , &c. * l. this argument doth not prove , that it is by dipping , &c. only . rob. conclude with the words of the question . rus. i understand you own , it was in use in our saviours time . here the dr. spake several impertinencies , which our scribes thought not worth the writing . l. i deny all this . rob. bring it into an argument . rus. i put it into a syllogism . i say , if the holy scriptures do shew us the right way of baptizing , according to christ's appointment , and yet do not shew us that sprinkling is the way of baptizing , then sprinkling is not the right way of baptizing . but &c : therefore &c. rob. there is not one word of sprinkling in the question . it is , whether it be to be administred by dipping , plunging , overwhelming , only . rus. i argue thus then . if the holy scriptures — he goes on as before . rob. pray mr. russel . rus. what ? can't i begin to speak , but you must still be interrupting me . i don't speak to you . i speak to mr. chand . if the holy scriptures shew us the right way of baptizing and yet do not shew us that sprinkling . — rob. if you would but observe order , you should have no interruption from me . but you both must and shall conclude your argument with the words of the question , before mr. respondent shall take any notice of it . rus. must and shall mr. moderator ? rob. yes mr. russel you both must and shall . otherwise it were fitter you should call me mr. cypher , then mr. moderator , if in this case i cannot moderari . rus. if chat baptism which is appointed by christ and doth properly set forth his burial and resurrection is the only right way of baptizing , then it must be performed by dipping , plunging , overwhelming only and not otherways . but that baptism , &c. is the only right way , &c. therefore , &c. chand . i first deny the consequence of the major . and then i deny the minor. rus. then you do suppose , that it doth represent the burial and resurrection of christ , yet it doth not thence follow , that this is the only right way of baptizing . my argument hath two parts which i shall prove . first , that it doth set forth the burial and resurrection of jesus christ. secondly , that therefore it is the only , right way of baptizing . first , it doth set forth the burial and resurrection of jesus christ , rom. 6.4 . col. 2.12 . buried with christ in baptism , wherein also you are risen with him through the faith of the operation of god. and , i do say that , buried with christ in his sepulchre we cannot possibly be , but the apostle says , we are buried with him in baptism , which doth properly represent the burial and resurrection of christ , now i proceed to the next , to shew that therefore it is the only right way . if there was no other baptism instituted by christ , nor practised by the apostles and first ministers of the gospel , but what doth represent the burial and resurrection of christ ; then dipping only is the right way of baptizing . but , &c. therefore , &c. chand . this is not the consequence of the major . you are to prove that , because baptism is significant of the burial and resurrection of christ ; therefore it must be by dipping only . rus. therefore i argue thus . if this was the only way practised in those times , then it must be by dipping only . * chand . i deny the minor. rus. if there be any other way , then you or some other person is able to shew it . but , &c. chand . i can shew you another way — i can shew that the word signifies washing , and there is great probability that many had water poured on them . rus. give an instance in the new testament , that any was baptized any other way . l. we argue upon a probability , it might be otherwise than by dipping ; there is no necessity of dipping . if you 'll grant that , we will go upon somewhat else , viz. that it must be in our climate according to our way . but if not ; you must prove that there is no probability , that it might be done any other way than by dipping . rus. let us hear then what the scripture says in this matter . l. prove that those texts where you render [ baptism ] by dipping , do truly and necessarily signify dipping . take what text you will. rus. i chuse that of our saviour , mar. 1.9 . he was baptized of iohn in iordan . the greek preposition is , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . into . and to say , he was washed of john into jordan is not sense ; therefore it ought to be render'd thus , he was dipped of john into jordan . l. the preposition , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , signifies [ in ] in the new testament , as well as into ; so here , he was baptized of iohn in iordan , is the true sense of the greek . now we will allow thus far . that what was commodious and usually practised on other occasions without any burthen , in that warm country , might be observed in baptism . it is said , that all iudea and the country round came to iohn and were baptized of him in iordan . in those hot countreys the custom was to go bare leg'd , in sandals . now they might go into iordan a little way , and then have water pour'd upon them ; and if so , allowing that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies to wash , they might be said in this manner to be washed in jordan , without the least necessity of dipping . i will offer it to the company whether this be not a fair interpretation of those words , mar. 1.9 . christ came to iohn and was baptized of him in iordan , i.e. he went a step into the water , and was washed of him , in the manner aforesaid . rus. i will not allow your signification of the word . i say the word , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies more than , in ; so christ is said to come into the world , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 * 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , 1 tim. 1.15 . he went into the synagogue , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : and so into iordan , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 † 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . this doth imply , that he was baptized or dipt into jordan , as those other texts , that he came into the synagogue , &c. l. this gentleman produceth three places where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifys into , and i can produce three times three , where it cannot signify into , but must signify * in. the force of your argument lies upon 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which you would have render'd into , where it signify's in. then , add this to what i offer'd before , as a probable interpretation contrary to yours , it 's evident that there 's no necessity of dipping , from this text. rob. there can be nothing beyond a probability asserted on our side or yours . chand . well , prove that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifys abluo , to wash frequently in scripture . thither we will go , that 's our tale . rus. according to all lexicographers the primary signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is , mergo , immergo , to plunge , overwhelm . l. but by the way , you prove your practice from the prime and native signification of the word . suppose it were mergo , to plunge , and not abluo , ( which yet we deny ) you cannot argue from the native signification of a word , with any force , when the scripture acceptation of it is different . rus. i did urge the commission of our saviour : chand . you are to prove that dipping is the only way . if the word will bear the sense of washing or pouring water , then dipping is not the only way . l. you argue from the prime and native significatiof the word . i 'll appeal to the learned . if this be a good way of arguing ; then the mathematics must include all kind of learning . because it come's from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to learn. then every youth that is skill'd but a little in physicks , may be call'd a physician , because it comes from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . nay , and every foot-boy , sent with a letter , maybe called an angel , because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies messenger . to know therefore the sense of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in this ordinance , we must consider in what sense the word is usually taken in scripture . and to say it signify's to dip , where the ordinance is mention●d , is plainly to beg the question , to assert the thing without proof ; therefore , rightly to understand the sense of the word , we must have recourse to those places where the word is used , and the ordinance not intended . now i require one such place of scripture where the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signify's to dip necessarily . rus. no there is no need of producing such a place . i shall prove it from the story of the eunuch and philip. he commanded the chariot to stand still , and they both went down into the water , and then , when he had put him under water , * they both came out of the water . l. i deny that the word [ baptize ] signifys to dip in any place of scripture , or to put under water . i. e. necessarily . rus. mat. 3.6 . they were baptized , i.e. dip't of iohn in iordan . l. how doth it appear that they were dip'd ? rus. the assembly , the continuators of pool , calvin , dr. hammond allow it . chand . that 's nothign to us . i defye you to prove that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in any text of scripture signify's to dip . rus. what then ? you deny what dr. hammond , the assembly , the dutch annotations have said . l. we cannot say they have said so . we have not their books at hand to turn to . besides , suppose they should , that 's no proof . we are no papists , to pin our faith on other mens sleeves . in the next place . whereas mr. russel hath brought the passage of philip and the eunuch , that they went down into the water and came up out of the water . it might as well be render'd , they went to and came from the water * . now if they came by a river's side , they might go down out of a chariot to the water , and when the eunuch was baptized , they came up from the water . is not this a fair sense of these words ? they went to and came from the water * . again if you argue from the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , i can tell you of seven places , where the word is used and not applyed to the ordinance , and you cannot prove that it signify's to dip in any of them . i argue then . if there are several texts of scripture , where the word cannot possibly bear this sense ; then it doth not necessarily bear it . but &c. rus. i deny the minor. l. i prove it by some instances ; mark. 7.4 . except they wash , they eat not : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 except they be baptized . but can it be imagined that they were plunged over head and ears every time they went to meals ? rus. the word is sometimes render'd dipping in our english translation , as , he that dippeth with me in the ●ish . l. the word is there 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; besides , this would avail your cause but little , for can you suppose that he dip't himself over head and ears in the dish ? a gentleman in the company . i 'm sure he would be foul and fawcy then . rus. but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is a diminutive from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a gentleman said to his neighbour . because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is a smaller word , be thinks it must be its diminutive . * l. i find the word to signify no more then 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , mark. 7.4 , 5. and so naaman is said to observe the prophets word , which was 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , yet he went , and ; as we read , dipped . now since he observed the command of the prophet , it is plain that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doth not necessarily signify any thing but washing . rus. what is the word in the hebrew ? chan. there are two words , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : and the prophet commanded him , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; and it is added , according to the word of the prophet , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , where it is plain the words are used promiscuously ; and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies no more than 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . so also we may observe , christ commanded the blind man to wash in the pool of siloam . must it be said , that he was dipt there ? or can it be proved that naaman was dipt , because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . nay , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is so far from always signifying to dip , th●● 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 it self , tho 〈…〉 in this sense , yet sometimes signifies only to 〈…〉 . thus dan. 4.33 . nebuchadnezzar 〈◊〉 with the dew of heaven . the septuagint renders it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . rus. but the hebrew is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . chan. what is it then ? here is an hebrew bible , if you 'll see . here the hebrew bible was handed to him , of leusden's 2d edit . and mr. russel kept it turning from place to place above 〈◊〉 a quarter of an hour , and could not find out the book of daniel , upon which the people fell a hissing . than the hebrew bible was handed to mr. robinson who 〈◊〉 the leaf down at the place , and handed it back again to mr. russel , who stood with his spectacles on his nose , a while longer , poring on it , but could not read it . but he said , he understood hebrew before mr. chandler was born , * and to satisfy the auditory that he did so , turn'd to the first chapter of genesis , where he read some part of a verse , or verses . and then again turned to daniel , and could not read the words yet . after some time more , mr. russel pretended to read some words , but with a low voice . chand . we come not here , mr. russel , to know whether you understand hebrew , only tell us what the word is in this place . which he could not do . l. we can produce several other texts of scripture , where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 cannot signify dipping , as where we read of their washing beds or tables , the word is baptize according to the greek . rus. i deny it . chand . there is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , — l. what wash beds , or tables , by dipping them under water ? or must it be by pouring water on them & c. ? upon the whole , the application of a little water in baptism , especially in these cold climates , is grounded upon what christ quotes . i will have mercy and not sacrifice . now it being not necessarily implyed in scripture that dipping was the ancient practice , we say , that having a fair and probable way deducible from scripture , we must rest therein , having recourse to that general rule . davids hunger was a fair excuse for eating the shew-bread , which is call'd most holy , and lawful only for the priests to eat . therefore , if dipping in cold weather , and cold climates , do tend to the prejudice of a person 's health , yea to endanger life , and it be not certainly fixt in scripture , as the only way of administring the ordinance , we may use our own may , as , in general , most agreeable to the word of god. rus. they think , tho' they transgress a rule , god will have mercy and not sacrifice . l. no. this is not so . we observe the rule , a moral precept , which take's place of a ritual , when opposite ; much more is it obligatory when it 's not evident that any ritual one doth oppose it . chand . if in those hot countrys they had dip't , or been obliged to dip , this would not hold in such climates , and at such seasons of the year wherein the life of a person would , this way , be manifestly exposed to danger . mr. russel here attempted to read several quotations , that he had collected out of the assemblies annot. pool , dr. ham. &c : which had been before disowned . and therefore the people refused to hear him , as being nothing to the purpose , however he spake to this effect . rus. i hope the people will observe , that you are forc'd to differ from the revd. assembly of divines , &c. chand . the bible , the bible is our religion . rob. mr. russel , we are not ashamed to own our selves protestants , with whom it is a fundamental principle , that the greatest and best of men are fallible ; and therefore our assent is not concluded by the meer words of one or other name how great soever . we pay a just deference to the very worthy names you mention'd , but we cannot think our selves obliged to believe every thing they say . if you have any solid reasons to offer , or the clear evidence of any text of scripture , to determine this point , pray let us hear it before we close up the day . nothing being said , he , applying himself to the people , added . rob. a great deal of loose discourse you have heard , upon this last question . mr. russel was obliged by all the laws of disputation , to prove , that according to the commission of our lord , baptism was to be administred by dipping , plunging , overwhelming , and no otherwise . some attempts he made towards it , of the weakness of which , i doubt not but , you are all sensible ; and therefore ( which yet they were not obliged to ) mr. chandler and mr. leigh undertook to prove that it was not necessarily to be so administred . for the clearing of which , they have manifested that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the greek as well as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the hebrew doth not , necessarily , signify any thing more than only to wash , or , to apply water to a person , without determining whether it shall be by dipping a person into water , or pouring water upon him , or any other way ; so that water be applyed , it is all that can necessarily be concluded from the words . of this they have given clear evidence both from the old testament and the new. and now upon the whole , we are willing to refer it to your own judgments , whether you will be perswaded to account your own baptism a nullity , because it hath not been administred in the way of these persons . if you can without any solid reason , or without so much as the evidence of one single text of scripture , be satisfyed , you may then take what our adversaries have said for satisfaction . but , since it hath been fully proved , that christ hath only required that persons be solemnly entred into his church by baptizing or washing them in the name of father , son and spirit , and hath not determined , so far as doth appear , whether this washing shall be performed this way or that , we are willing , i say , to refer it to the judgment of you all , whether our way of admistration be not the most commodious : finis . i have compar'd this copy with the original , viz. mr. maltby's and my own , and find it exactly agreeable thereto . witness , my hand , this 10th day of iuly , 1699. w. smith . some iust reflections on dr. russel's pretended narrative . 't is with great regret , that we are again diverted from more p●easing and useful studies , to dip our pens in this watry controversy , and undertake this invidious service . as we were necessitated by the anabaptists challenge to the disputation it self , so had they not ( by publishing a false account , ) laid us under a like necessity to vindicate the truth and our selves , the world had never more heard of this matter . in these our reflections , we shall manifest the author's egregious falshood , in some parts of his narrative , his trisling impertinencys in others , and the uncharitable principles that have drop'd from him . the narrative is pretended to be transcrib'd from mr. bissel's and mr. ring 's copy's . now we can assure the world , that mr. bissel's copy was like a lawyer 's breviate , containing only hints for memory , and may be all contain'd in 3 or 4 pages , and hardly one word of it in this narrative . as to mr. ring 's , we have taken the pains to compare it with this account , and find several hundred falshoods , additions , alterations and omissions . it is an ill omen thus to stumble at the threshold ; and what begins with a falshood , we have reason enough to mistrust . but to the narrative it self , we shall ( as to some parts ) shew it's egregious falshood as to matters of fact , and that by its omissions of some , and misciting other particulars , as well as positive false assertions . 1. it is egregiously false by reason of its omissions . not that every omission of a word or sentence , ( perhaps ) would have render'd it so ; but such omissions as alter the very state of the disputation , and make it look like an●ther thing , than it truly was , are undoubtedly to be call'd falshoods . should any one pretending to report the psalmists sense , ps. 14.1 . leave out the first words , and assure the world he said , there is no god ; would not this be call'd a notorious falshood ? tho the falseness of it lies , in not relating the whole sentence . from whence it may be collected , that it is not only asserting what was never said , but also the omission of something that was said , may bring an historian under the guilt of falsifying . and whether it be not so in the present case , we shall leave the world to judge , in these few instances . mr. leigh , upon their frequent pressing for an instance from scripture , of our practice in baptizing infants , happily retorted the argument upon themselves , and challeng'd them to produce one instance of their practice , as theirs differs from ours . for all that know us , know we also baptize such as are adult , upon the profession of the christian faith , that were not baptiz'd in infancy : nay , that we should refuse to baptize the child of an heathen , or other notorious infidel , ( unless adopted by some christian ) till he become adult , and make a credible profession of christianity . mr. leigh therefore press'd them for one scripture instance of a believing , meaning a christian parents child , whose baptism was delay'd till adult . and withal , told them , that from the death of christ to the death of st. iohn , according to the computation of the learned , was about 60 years , in which compass of time , multitudes of christians children were become adult . dr. russel mention'd constantine the great as a scripture-instance , which was justly ridicul'd : mr. williams , as he acknowledg'd to us afterwards , thought it not of any force , and by the intimation of his son , alledges the instance of our lord , as born of a believer , of the virgin mary . to which mr. leigh reply'd , i thought we had been speaking of the commission ; now this was before the commission . intimating , that the instance was not pertinent , relating to a baptism that preceeded the commission of our lord ; and therefore our disputation was no way concern'd in it . notwithstanding this , dr. russel would have it a pertinent answer , christ being the child of a believer . and to this he reports no answer , but makes mr. leigh seek to be opponent upon it , as if confounded with this instance , pag. 35. whereas , immediately upon the reply of dr. russel , mr. robinson , our moderator , adds , tho mr. leigh express'd himself in so general terms , yet the whole strain of the discourse did sufficiently manifest that an instance of the child of a believer , properly christian , was call'd for : now the virgin mary was a iew , and not then a christian : nor was christian baptism then instituted . with more to the same purpose . mr. leigh also further replyed , that christ was not to be imita●ed in that , because then no person : ought to be baptized till 30 ; not except circumcis'd at 8 days old , as the reader may set in the foregoing narrative . after which dr. russel offer'd nothing . now we appeal to all the world , whether when so large and distinct a reply was made , both by mr. robinson and mr. leigh , this man hath fairly represented our cause , when he takes no notice at all of it . but if this gentleman , or any of his friends , can yet produce one scripture-instance of the child of a christian parent , baptiz'd at grown years , it will be somewhat to the purpose ; and they may ha●e the confidence to call for instances from us , and to pretend that theirs ( as distinguish'd from ours ) is the scripture-way , and most agreeable to the commission of our lord : but till then how unreasonable is it for them to expect instances of our way , when they have none to produce for their own ? again he hath omitted to tell the world , ( what all that were present well remember , ) that he was put to silence by what was urg'd from mat. 19.14 . to prove infant members of the church-militant upon earth . insomuch that after a long silence , mr. r●binson call'd to him , and ask'd if he had no reply to make and beg'd of him that if he had any thing to say he would speak ; otherwise tell the people that we might proceed . to which dr. russel made a very weak reply ▪ that in this text there is not a word of baptism , or the commission ; and mr. w. instead of answering took the oppenancy , as in the narrative . but not one word more from that argument could be got from dr. russel . besides tho' he hath conceal'd yet he cannot ( himself ) ha●● forgotten , that the 2d . argument on our pa●t , where he was again silence● was sum'd up by mr. robinson in the words o● our narative : then we refer'd i● to the gentlemen present , whether we should offer any more argument on the 1st question , and ●● was thought wholly needless . mr. robinsons closing speech on the 2d . question , is also whol●y omitted . we forbear to mention here , how he hath omitted such passages as did sufficiently expose his ignorance to the learned part of the company : such a● were his telling us once and again , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 was ●f the masculine gender , agreeing with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 when greek verbs admit not of genders , tho' hebrew do ; and his saying 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as if it had been with an omega and i consonant . so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . faults for which a school boy would deserve the lash . and when he was not allow'd to conclude his first argument ▪ on the 2d . question , otherwise than with the word of the question , it will be remember'd ( tho' his narrative hath not told us , ) with how great difficulty he form'd his syliegism , and how many attempts he made before he could bring the words of the question , into the conclusion : insomuch that our moderator offer'd him his assistance . these and several other particulars which quite a●ter the face of the disputation , were by no means to be omitted : neither can that be call'd a true narrative , that suppresseth ●he truth in such instances as these . 2. this narrative is false , in regard of its strange misplacing some particulars : on which account the reader can form no true idea of the disputation . so , for instance , wh●● h●●ays concerning 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 page 34. ( 〈…〉 is true ) should have come in in the midst of mr william's rambling discourse , betwixt dr. russel's 4th and 5th arguments ; and that about the beasts of the field , should have had its place betwixt the 1st and 2d argument on our part for infant baptism ; when mr. williams and russel were both rambling again . and had they been found in their proper places , as in mr. ring 's copy , which narrative russel pretends to transcribe , they would only have serv'd to expose the weakness of him that brought them . but as he hath plac'd them here , they serve to hide the shameful baffle they and their cause had by the arguments on our side . for , as was said before , they never re-assum'd the opponency on the fi rst question , after the closing up the argument from infants discipleship . tho dr. russel brings in these two arguments , as if they went off with triumph , to the 2d question . which yet every judicious auditor knows to be false . lesser slips we pass by . 3. he hath forg'd several downright falshoods ; one of which is just under our eye , with relation to what is immdiately before said , and therefore ( tho a little out of its place 〈◊〉 mention it here . he 〈◊〉 tells the world , that 〈◊〉 said , they might take up the ●●ponency again , if they pleas'd : and again , that be re-assum'd the opponen●y again , at mr. leigh ' s reque●t of which h● was sick . with much of the same sort , page 34. which is the meer figment of his own brain , and not one sy●●able of it true. the omission of 〈◊〉 things that were ●aid , tho' it alter the face of the disputation , might be impu●●d to a weak imperfect copy : but this must nee●s be a contriv'd and deliberate falshood ; nor hath he a right to be believ'd in any thing , that dare forge and publish such an untruth . but because the preface is almost one continued falshood , we shall particularly take notice of it . 1. he declares mr. bows and mr. webber were the sole cause of his being engag'd in the disputation , whereas mr. w●bber hath declar'd to mr. smith and mr. chandler , that he utterly , disliked the dispute from the beginning , and was only thus far concern'd ; seeing they would engage he advis'd rather to dr. russel than mathew cassin , whom mr. bows had pitch'd upon . a man that denys both the deity and humanity of christ , against whom dr. russel hath printed an honest protestation . and this man tho' overturning the fundamentals of christianity is hugg'd by mr. bows : because he agrees with him , in the darling notions of believers baptism by dipping ; which , he told the worshipful the mayor of portsmouth , was a fundamental of religion . thus uncharitably doth this man shut us all out of heaven , and confine religion to his own party , while a denyer of christs deity and humanity hath been since , as well as before the disputation , admitted into his pulpit , while he , as a messenger of the churches , was travelling busily to spread false reports against us . 2. another falshood which is indeed from the wrong information of mr. leddell , ( that man of heat , which much water cannot quench , ) is this ; that he should twice go to mr. smith to compare copys and he refus'd to do so , altho' his copy , was then finish'd . this is a downright falshood as appears by the annexed testimonial . to convince the world of the falseness of what is said in the 2 page of the first leaf of dr. russel's dedication , with respect to my self ; i do declare , that mr. william leddel never came to me but once , wh● he ask'd me whether i had transcrib'd what i wrote at the disputation i told him i had not , but intended to do it . he farther said if i had , when i had done it , he desired to have it to read over ; and i sho● have mr. samuel rings coppy which was transcribed ; to which answered , that i had but an imperfect account of the matter , which i believe is the most that any scribe who wrote at the dispute , could truly say of what they wrote , it being so full of confusion occasion● thro' the anabaptists lo●se and shuffling way of arguing . mr. le●del des never intimated to me any design they had to prim the disputation nor did i think they really intended any such thing ; because not long● fore , in my own and several other persons hearing , mr. leddel did 〈◊〉 tell against printing it . i had not when he came to me transcribe one word from my copy , neither was it finished till about 14 day since ; had i known their design of printing i would have gotten my 〈◊〉 ready for them : which might have prevented dr. russel from 〈◊〉 so many untruths to the world. witness my hand the 10 day july , 1699 . william smith the truth of the above relation , i do attest ; being present when mr leddell came to mr. smith , and knowing what is said about the time of transcribing his coppy to be true. witness my hand the day and year above said . william wallen . 3. it is false that mr. chandlers sermons were the occasion of the dispute , and much more , that this is agreed to by us . as he asserts pr. pag. 2. we are all of opinion , mr. bow 's impudent cha●l●ng was the occasion of it , tho' mr. chandlers sermons were the innocent occasion of that challenge . so that according to the proverb , he might as well have said tenterden steeple was the cause of goodwin sands . 4. it is false that it lay upon us to prove our practice , when in the preliminary● they that made the challenge undertook to be asserters , and dr. russel took the opponency upon himself : he hath also abus'd dr. smith , who told him as he was assertor he must prove , but negantis non est probare . 5. it is false that as he says pr. pag. 8. mr. robinson should in the midst of the dispute give him the lye , and yet could not make any thing out about it . this sentence contains as many falshoods as can possibly be crowded into so narrow a compass . that mr. robinson speaks with a loud voice , is what all that know him , know to be false . yet this gentleman ventures to say pag. 13. he bawl'd very loud ; again pag. 35. mr robinson stood up , made a noise like one in a delirious paroxysm . what doth the man mean to write at such a rate as this ? surely he thinks loud lies will do no hurt . and that mr. robinson ever did in the disputation give him the lye , ( as far as can by himself or freinds be recollected , or be made appear by any copys then taken ) is wholly untrue ; and 't is strange ( if this dignify'd dr. so well remember it ) that he could find no place for it in his narrative ; that so the circumstances that attended it , might have assisted our memories . yet ( that we may not wrong him , ) mr. leigh owns the words as his : that without a complement it was a lie in him , to insinuate to the people , as if mr. leigh would have all infants excluded from heaven . besides he intimates , upon giving him the lie , there was a challenge made to the party to prove it , and yet he could make nothing out about it . whereas there was never any such challenge given , and we are ready to prove to his face , that in the disputation it self he told more lies than one ; tho' he should not have had that coarse complement from any of us , had he but behav'd himself like a scholar or a gentleman ▪ 6. it is false that mr. 〈…〉 said that mr. robinson exceede● the bounds of a 〈…〉 or abus'd dr. russel in 〈…〉 who le that mr. francis willia●s said was 〈…〉 iohn ●iliiams complain'd that 〈…〉 , he reply'd ; if he did so , 〈…〉 but , as to mr. robinson's abusing 〈…〉 never said or thought any such thing . 〈…〉 said under this head , but th● unexpected 〈…〉 of o●d mr iohn williams , restrained our 〈…〉 god he ●● gone to give his account , and we shall 〈◊〉 of 〈◊〉 is grave . 7. it is a false misrep●ese●●ation , that m● farr●l should acknowledge they gain'd any credit to their c●use by the disputation , as appears by the following extract of a letter from him . i solemnly appeal to the great god , who ●est knows what were my words , that to the best of my remembrance , i spake to mr. williams after this manner . mr. williams , i must tell you , and that not as mine own sentiment only , but ( i believe i may speak it , ) as the sentiments of the rest of my brethren , that whatever credit ( not your cause ) but ye may have gain'd , is wholly owing unto you . to which mr. williams rep●y'd , don't sir put that upon me . i answer'd , i will speak it , for you argu'd with more simplicity , and less subtilty , than russel , and so were the fairer dispu●ant . these words thus in civility spoken , had a plain reference , not to the cause disputed , but persons disputing ; not to the strength of argument ▪ but form and manner of arguing , ( many things mr. farrel offers that shew this was his sense , which we think it needless to repeat , b●cause the words thus circumstanc'd carry their own evidence with them , ) he concludes his letter thus — i now leave , it to the judgment of the ingenuous , whether it can be fairly deduc'd from my words , that we were conscious of any credit gain'd by them to their cause , or whether they are not conscious their cause was wounded , and interest sinking , when they readily catch at so vain a shadow to support their cause and reputation . i will add no mo●e , but that having perus'd the narrative , find it so full of fraud , partiality , falshood , and misrepresentation ; that this instance may serve as a specimen , if not of the whole , yet of the greatest part . attested by george farrel . 8. it is false , that the advertisement in the post-man was ours . and we cannot but stand amaz'd at the confidence of the man who dares say any thing . it was well known to old mr. iohn williams , before he left gosport , that the honourable colonel gibson sent up that advertisement . he generously allow'd us to mention him as the author of it , and hath given the annex'd testimonial in confirmation of it . by colonel iohn gibson , lieutenant governour of portsmouth , &c. i do hereby certify all whom it may any way concern , that the advertisement put in the printed paper commonly called , the post-man , upon the 25th day of february , in relation to the debate betwixt the presbyterians and anabaptists , held at the presbyterian meeting-house at portsmouth , upon the 22d day of february ; i say , the said advertisement was inserted , as above , by my direction . i do also own , i was then , and am still of the same opinion as mentioned in the above-said advertisement . witness my hand at portsmouth , june 9th . 1699. j. gibson . this we are well assur'd dr. russel knew , as being told so , by some of mr. chandlers friends at the coffee-house in alderjgatestreet : when he gave the honourable lieutenant governour such scurrilous names , as we will not foul our paper with . notwithstanding this , this man hath the impudence , to dedicate his false narrative to him ; indeed with a diminutive title as if he were not lieutenant governour , receiving an immediate commission from the king , but only deputy govenour , deputed by major general earl. this he should have enquir'd into , before he had dedicated his book to him . this noble gentleman is aspers'd and ridicul'd as one of our unthinking admirers nar. pag , 7. and a squirter out of poolish advertisements , words that need no other invective than the bare relation , pag. 10. what he adds further , that we would not give him the civil title of dr. that he took his degree at cambridg , admitted as a member of that honourable senate , and that not ex gratia ; is partly false . that he was created a mandamus dr. by king iames in 1688. we understand , and with how great a price this tool bought that priviledg , we leave the world to jndg. but what he means by a senate at cambridg , is beyond our understanding . that he was not regularly chosen as one well furnish'd with the learned qualifications requir'd , his ignorance in greek we think to be a sufficient evidence . we could also inform him to whom he apply'd himself for the better understanding of the latine tongue . that he also kept a coffee-house in bartholomew-close , is well known to the neighbourhood there . but supposing he he had been a regular dr. in physic , as he stiles himself , this may no more qualify him for a divinity disputation than being a coffeeman . so that why he should insist on his title , in this case , we know not . here we shall also take notice of another falshood , that this bold gentleman hath publish'd amongst and by his friends in london . tho' he have not adventur'd it into his narrative ; one of us hath been assur'd by a person that had it , from the mouth of an anabaptist of considerable note in london , that dr. russel , to put it out of doubt , that he and his friends had carry'd the day at portsmouth , added , the bishop of salisbury had received a letter from colonel gibson , wherein he applauded their i. e. the anabaptist's performance . that such a report hath spread abroad we are well assur'd . but that it is most egregiously false , that right reverend person whose name he hath made use of , hath given us leave to assure the world ▪ he doth indeed own he had a letter from colonel gibson , his near kinsman , relating to the disputation . but to a purpose quite opposite to what this falsiefier reports ; and adds , that not only the letter he receiv'd , but one directed to the ld. a. bi● of casterbury , did represent the disputation as much to our advantage as could be desir'd . to this sense his lordship was pleas'd to express himself to mr. robinson our moderator , ( who waited on him on this occasion ) and generously allow'd us to make use of his name , for the undeceiving the world in this matter . 9. it is false , what he intimates pr. pag. 11. that when we were pinch'd upon an argument , we made a noise and clamour that hindred the people from hearing what was said . whereas all that were present , we doubt not , well remember , the first disturbance we had of that kind , was that mention'd in the narrative , pag. 35. when the anabaptists ( upon the mention of our saviour , as an instance of the child of a believer , not baptiz'd till adult ) rudely enough set up a shout . and mr. webber ignorantly cry'd , 't is done ! 't is done ! tho' the triumph was but short liv'd , for so soon as mr. leigh reply'd to the instance , the body of the people return'd 'em their civility , and set up another shout at them . besides which , there was no further noise or interruption of that nature , till that rude comparison of children and beasts of the feild , of which more afterwards . the last interruption was when russel would have put us off with a bundle of humane testimonys , instead of proof , and we had once and again protested against them , and given our reasons viz. that we had not the authors at hand , to try the truth of his quotations ; besides that should they have said what he would have them , their testimony would not necessarily engage our assent , they being but fallible men . when after this he yet would trouble us with his impertinent long quotations , the people refus'd to hear him , and continu'd to hiss till he gave over reading ; but what was said at the closing up of that head by us , doth sufficiently manifest no human testimony can pinch us : it was the ridiculous weakness and not the force of the argument couch'd in his testimonies that occasion'd that noise . and if there was any thing in it , that was a grievance to him ; let him thank his anabaptist friends that gave the first example . 10. it is false , that mr. fox was dip'd by mr. williams's advice , who was not then in the country , nor did mr. earle know him . that it was done by mr. chandlers advice , is also false ; for he was then at london . but that none of us would refuse to dip a person in such a case , is true . we never pleaded against dipping as one way , but as the only way ; not against ' its lawfulness , but necessity . so that this instance is brought in to no purpose ; and brother duke should have inform'd himself better in the circumstances of this story , before he had convey'd it to london . nay he was dip'd not at gosport but havant . we shall purposely wave the falshoods in the narrative it self , because our own account doth sufficiently manifest them . we shall only add that the conclusion of the book is as false as the rest . for he says p. 59 , 60. that god was pleas'd to make the hearing of the dispute , of such use to several persons ; that they were fully convinc'd — and did in few days after , submit themselves to ' be dip'd in water ; whereas we can hear of no unprejudiced persons , who were any way inclin'd towards anabaptism , by any thing that was offer'd in the disputation . and we challenge them to name us one person so convinc'd . those that were fix'd in their prejudices , might perhaps take their weak arguments and trifling answers for a sufficient confutation , of infant baptism : but we provoke them to name one unprejudic'd person that did so . and do offer , for one such person so na●●'d by them , we will , if they demand it , tell them the names of several who did strongly incline to anabaptism before , who by that disputation were set right and fully satisfy'd , that the anabaptist cause sloth rest on weak unscriptural principles , how loudly soever they pretend to scripture . chap. ii. having thus far manifested , how little regard the anabaptist dr. had to truth in his narrative , this were enough to be offer'd by way of reply ; nor need there any thing more to discredit an history , than to shew that it is false . but we shall so far condescend to the weakness of injudicious persons ; as to animadvert also on the trifling impertinencies , his narrative abounds with . 1. all the arguments they offer'd were trifling cavils . the first was design'd to turn off the opponency upon us . the 2 d supposes what was never granted them , that the only commission and universal directory for baptism is contain'd in mat. 28.19 . mar. 16.16 . for indeed if this were christs only commission . then his disciples did baptize ioh. 4.2 . without his commission ; for this command was not then deliver'd : again , if th●s command were design'd as an universal directory , then previous examination , discourses of the significancy and obligation of this sacrament , stated prayer before and after , are besides the commission . nay , the apostles did deviate , from the commission , when they baptiz'd only in the name of the lord jesus or of the lord , acts 10. vlt. 19.5 . this is therefore no other than extending the commission to the gentile world ; supposing that the practice of it both as to manner and subjects was well known before , only then con●●ed to the lost sheep of the 〈◊〉 of is●●el . so that infants may be baptiz'd if we can bring good proof for it out of the other parts of holy writ , tho it could not be prey'd from christ's command : for the whole scripture is the will of christ ; and his will discern'd in this matter , is his commission . but supposing ( not granting ) this to be an universal directory , we distinguish'd between disciples , that are compleat or incompleat . incompleat may be made by the ministry of men. 1. as by the preaching of men , parents may be converted and constrain'd to give up all they have and are to god , and so their infants thus consider'd in their parents , they are remotely made disciples by the ministry of men. 2. they are immediately made disciples by the ministry of men ; by the parents devoting them to god ; and bringing them to his ministers to be solemnly dedicated to him . russel's vain attempts to take off this distinction , may be taken notice of in the foregoing narrative , to which we ●re●er the reader , as also to observe the little arguments they further us'd , and weak answers they gave to our arguments . 2. his reflections in the time of the disputation it self and what he hath added , are equally trifling and insignificant . for instance . 1. what he insinuates p. 6. as if in effect we gave away our cause , because we refus'd ( at that time ) to give an instance , where there was any thing recorded in scripture , that did oblige us to baptize infants , whereas it then lay on them to prove the contrary : our business ( who were the respondents ) was to attend their proof , the time was not yet come for us to produce our own . it was agreed that they who had reflected on the doctrine of infant baptism as false and wholly untrue ; should prove that it was so . yet this trifler when he had undertaken to prove , that infants are not the subjects of baptism , at the very first would have put it upon us to prove they were so , and would perswade the company we gave away our cause , unless we did as he directed . this was doctor like truly ! and one would not grudge , ( however he came by it ) to give him the title , who does so powerfully carry all before him . you have his whole sense in these few words . gentlemen , if i prove that infants are not the sublects of baptism , you will allow i perform what i have undertaken , pag. 5. now this i 'll make so plain , you shall not be able to answer or evade the force of my argument . thus i argue ; if they be the subjects of baptism , mr. leigh , mr. chandler or some body else is able to prove it . but therefore they are not so : and now i have effectually done your business ; for if you say you can prove it , let 's hear it ; if not , you give away your cause . to this sense doth this mighty man of logic flourish at the entrance , and wonderful feats no doubt he thinks he hath done in it : but such egregious trifling is hardly found among any pretending to the least degree above common sense . and it was fitter to have been hiss'd out , than so soberly reply'd to as it was . 1. what! do you prove that infants are not the subjects of baptism , by putting us to prove that they are . wonderful ! this 't is to be a dr. and to know more than all the world besides . for till this dr. came upon the stage , these 2 things were always very differing ( to make proof of a thing , and put another to prove the contrary . ) this gentleman undertook to prove p. 5. but ( as if he repented of his rash undertaking ) he very courteously invites us to change sides with him , and thereby free him of a burthen that was too heavy for him . 2. nor is every thing untrue , the contrary to which we cannot prove true . we cannot prove that this narrative , russel ever was at cambridge , or took his degrees there ; but would he have us therefore take the contrary for certain truth ? yes , we must , according to his method . if one boldly assert against us , that he never was at cambridge , we desire they would prove it before we give credit to ' em . in his way they 'll prove it too , and then we must needs grant it . well , we wait only for the proof . thus it is . you cannot prove that he ever was at cambridge , or took any degree there . therefore , behold , he was not . the strange effects of logick ! 3. nor if we can prove it , doth it follow we needs must ? especially when he had undertaken the opponency . we that stood upon our defence ( as respondents ) were only to attend to what they had to offer , and show the invalidity of it ; but were by no laws of disputation , that ever yet were publish'd to the world , oblig'd to change sides with them and take the proving part on us . tho' this we declare we were ready to do in due time but it was no way fit to be done at the beginning of the disputation , unless this doughty dr. had said in plain words ( as he did in effect in his first argument , ) gentlemen , i have undertaken more than i can do . and therefore tho' i cannot prove that infants are not the subjects of baptism , i should take it kindly if you would please to prove the contrary . 4. and as to his pretence , that his proposition was an universal negative ; therefore we were oblig'd by it to give our instance : it is a great mistake , and contrary to all the uncontested rules of disputation , nor could any order possibly be observ'd , if it should be admitted . for how easy were it for an opponent in any case , thus to oblige the respondent to change places with him — which what confusion it would create , any one that hath an insight into these things , will easily imagine . that rule hath therefore ( as far as we can find ) universally obtain'd . neuter disputantium alterius partes suscipiat , neque ; opponens in partem respondentis involet , aut contra ; and consequently a very principal part of the work of a moderatot lies , in keeping each within their proper limits . regimen praesidis in eo consistit , ut diligenter attendat , utrum opponens & respondens suo officio fungantur necne : si utrumque aut alterutrum ab officio suo recedentem conspexerit , eum sui muneris admoneat , & intra limites contineat , ne extra oleas ( uti dici solet ) evagentur . 5. nor will that known rule negantu non est probare , and asserenti incumbit probatio , mention'd by dr. smith at all avail our anabaptist champion : as indeed it never was intended by that worthy person to any such purpose , as he hath allow'd us to assure the world : and as did plainly enough appear to all the judicious part of the company , when he spoke those words : his design was ( as the design of the rule it self , at least when apply'd to logical disputations ) that the proof lies not on the respondent , who only denies , or distinguishes upon his adversary , but upon the opponent , who is the asserter , whether his arguments run in an affirmative or negative form. but thus much is more than sufficient to expose his ridiculous trifling under that head. 2. he next reflects upon mr. chandler , as if he was at a loss , so that mr. leigh and mr. robinson were forced to help him out with their distinctions and equivocable expressions , page 11 , whereas , if , mr. leigh did offer any distinctions , 't was what belong'd to him , as an appointed disputant with mr. chandler : and that they spoke promiscuously , is owing to a proposal made by the anabaptists , that the disputants might be allow'd it ; which accordingly was agreed before we went to the place of disputation . so that 't is ridiculous trifling for him , from mr. leigh's sometimes speaking , who was allow'd equal liberty with mr. chandler himself , to infer that mr. chandler was at a loss , and mr. leigh forc'd to help him out . and it is somewhat more than trifling , and should be inserted among the falshoods , what he asserts , p. 16. that mr. chandler finding himself unable to answer , quitted the place of a disputant , and mr. leigh desired to take it up , which was admitted upon condition , &c. whereas it was mov'd the night before the disputation , when the anabaptists came in a body to us at mr. williams's house , that we would admit the principal and his second to speak promiscuously . the reason given was , because dr. russel , or mr. john williams , had an infirmity that sometimes disabled him from speaking for a considerable time vogeb●er . we took till the morning to consider of the proposal , and then at the hour and place prefix'd we gave that liberty to them , provided the same might be allow'd to us , which was consented to . upon which it was resolved on both sides , that the disputants should be allow'd to assist each other , as they saw occasion . with what face now can this man insinuate to the world , that mr. leigh , in the midst of the disputation begg'd leave to speak , and could not be admitted but upon terms : and all this only to set off that false lie , viz. that mr. chandler quitted the place of a disputant . but to return to what we were upon : mr. leigh help'd out mr. chandler with his distinctions . we grant he was helpful to him , and was chosen for that purpose , and was not mr. williams also to the best of his skill helpful to dr. russel ? but mr. leigh helped out mr. chandler , and mr. williams did his best to help out dr. russel , tho thro the badness of the cause , he neither did , nor could help him out . but mr. robinson helpt too with his distinctions . 't is false ; and his own narrative ( as it happens ) will manifest it to be so ; for that distinction there mention'd by mr. robinson , is there mentioned not as his own , but chandler's ; and it was only mention'd to shew the no occasion he had to spend time in proposing such frivolous questions ; a sufficient answer to which he had already had from mr. chandler . there only remains under this head , mr. leighs and mr. robinsons helping out mr. chandler with their equivocable expressions . but this ( equivocable ) like the ( senate at cambridge , ) is a word of the famous d●s . own coining , and therefore he best knows the meaning of it . equivocal we have often heard of , but equivocable we know not what to make of , unless by this , added to the hebrew and greek instances of his learning , we be left to collect that ( as he says ) he was created a dr in the most proper sense ex inhabili materia . doctor ex non docto . yet if he intend equivocal expressions , tho he charge them upon us , they are his own peculiar talent . perhaps few iesuits herein equal or exceed him at that sort of weapon . if any thing said by us , was grievous to him , it was not that we us'd equivocal expressions of our own , but that we repeated and distinguish'd upon his . 3. how impertinently doth he trifle , when he over-loaded his 3d argument with a multitude of propositions ? tho mr. leigh deny'd first , that the apostle paul did never declare that infant-baptism is a gospel institution : yet could he never have it prov'd . suppose he did ( which yet he neither did nor can ) prove that paul never declar'd it in his writings , yet how will he ever prove that he never declar'd it at any time by word of mouth ? which yet if he assert , he must prove . and how frivolously doth he afterwards talk of our having in our custody any such unwritten tradition ? we never did assert , the apostle paul did declare any such thing by word of mouth that is not written , only said , he might do it , and put this wonderful man to prove he did not . and how insufferably weak and trifling are all 〈◊〉 reflections he hath under this head cast upon us ! while this was the sum of what was said to his minor or antecedent . but afterwards we deny'd also his major or consequent ; that unless paul declar'd the baptism of infants , ●t was no part of the counsel of god , which ( by his own account ) he never prov'd ; nor is it indeed capable of proof , unless what paul declar'd must stand instead of the whole scripture to us . and tho the apostle tells us , he had not shunn'd to declare , yet he never tells us that he had actually declar'd the whole counsel of god , acts 20.27 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . the word intimates he did not prevaricate with them , or fraudulently keep back any truth , that in the course of his ministry among them , he had a call from god to deliver to them : he he did not do as peter faultily did gal. 2.12 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , who with-drew , sought subterfuges thro' a mean and timorous spirit , conceal'd the truth when it was most especially to be own'd by him ; and for which the apostle rebuk'd him v. 11. now ( says he ) i did not from any such mean or base principle , suppress or hide from you , or misrepresent to you any part of the mind of god ; but have freely and boldly declar'd to you , so far as i had opportunity , and there was any occasion for it , the whole counsel of god. not that we can imagite the apostle had any opportunity to declare the whole of what god had at any time , by any messenger , reveal'd of his counsel . nor was there occasion he should spend his time among them upon such points with which they were well acquainted before ; especially while he had himself immediate revelations from heaven to communicate to them . if therefore it could ( as it never can ) be prov'd that paul never said a word of infant baptism to them , it would by no means follow that it is no part of the counsel of god : but only , that it was no part of what was immediately reveal'd from heaven to himself , nor any thing that he needed to insist upon among them , who might otherways and sufficiently be instructed about it . we might therefore ( when we had deny'd the consequence ) with just reason say as p. 21. suppose but not grant that paul had not spoken a word of infant baptism , yet they cannot in the least advantage their cause by it . and so our opposition stands good against that argument ; even as he himself doth represent the closing of it . 4. his reflection upon us especially upon mr. robinson , for refusing to admit him to harrangue the people upon the words of the commission is ( if possible ) yet more trifling . was he not not allow'd to argue from the commission ? and was not that all that was fit to be allow'd him ? was he interrupted in reading the text ? what would the man have ! why verily he wanted to illuminate us and our hearers with his preach●●nt upon the text. poor ignorant souls ! he perhaps apprehended we could not understand the commission without his help . in the presence of so many ministers and particularly of him that had the right of the place ; he might have had the civility to have ask'd leave , or to have forborn till invited to it . besides he knew our company came together , not to hear a sermon especially from him , but to attend a disputation : the man must by all means preach and having nam'd a text , he begins , this commission is very solemnly deliver'd , wherein our lord tells us , that all power in heaven and earth is given to him , and by vertue of that power . — and here he takes it ill to be interrupted . — and we must be reflected on as lucifugae scripturarum , bats and owls that are afraid of the commission , and fly the light of the scripture , because we would not suffer him to go on with his impertinent harangue : as if it was all one to refuse to hear a text of scripture read , to as hear his comment upon it : how excessively doth this man dote on his own labours ! 5. how egregiously doth he trifle p. 24. when because our moderator would not suffer mr. calvins authority to stand for an argument , he reflects as if he had no esteem for him . whereas there are few names since the apostles days , for which he hath so great a veneration . what ? is it impossible , in this dr's opinion , to have a veneration for a person , unless we take his , ipse dixit , and swallow down all he says without chewing . but doth mr. calvin any where say , that the whole of the commission is expressed in mat. 28.19 . mar. 16.16 . and tho he say , infants are not expresly mention'd in this command , yet we are sure his comment on the place ( which will best discover his judgment ) says , that god includes infants in speaking to their parents ; and so that baptism , when apply'd to infants , is not separated● from faith and teaching . and this he speaks in opposition to the anabaptists , who made a great noise against infant-bapti sm , upon this pretence . see his own words , harm . evang. in mat. 28.19 . verum quia docere prius jubet christus , quam baptizare ; & tantum credentes ad baptismum vult recipi , videtur non rite administrari baptismus , nisi fides praecesserit : arque hoc praetextu multum tumultuati sum anabaptistae contra paedo-baptismum ; solutio tamen non difficilis est . and so goes on to answer this argument . wherein he hath these words , quae olim iudaeis data fuit promiss● , inter gentes quoque 〈◊〉 hodie , necesse est . ero deus tuus & semi●is tui , gen. 17.7 . b●eos qui side in ecclesiam dei ingressi sunt , videmus cum sua sobole censeri in christi membris , & in salutis hereditarem simul vocari . nec vero separ●tur hoc modo baptismus a fide vel doctrin● , qu●a licet puerī infantes nondum per ae●atem percipiant dei gratiam , deus tamen eorum parentes compellans ipsos etiam complectitur . if this famous dr. hath not yet attain'd so considerable a proficiency in the latin tongue , as to construe this , there are many worthy doctors of the colledge will assist aim . let the judicious consider whether calvin's judgment and this gentleman's be the same concerning this command ; and what a vain flourish it is to bring in calvin on this occasion . what he soon after adds , p. 24. to reflect on mr. robinson , as interrupting him , is as little to the purpose . he that pretends to learning , and needs 〈◊〉 hear any more of an hypothetical syllogism , than the major , or consequent , is none of solomon's wise men . 't was as well known to mr. robinson what would follow as to dr. r. the speaker . how is it then that he insinuates as if he answered a matter before he heard it ? 6. as to what he says p. 30. about erasmus's skill about the etymology of a greek word , 't is most ridiculously impertinent . mr. williams had a little before , very honestly acknowledg'd , that for his part , he neither knew what belong'd to greek or latine and yet presently quotes erasmus as reading the commission . go teach all nations , and when they have learn'd dip them . mr. robinson remembring what he had said before , admir'd to hear him quote erasmus : and therefore ask'd him whether erasmus ever wrote in english ? or how he knew that he so read the commission ? but there was not a word said by any one about erasmus's skill in the etymology of a greek word , but he must still be trifling . 7. the story of the eunuch p. 31. is like all the rest ; for mr. leigh said not that the eunuch had children , but if he had had one or more , they must not be look'd on as the children of a pa●an : he consider'd him not as an eunuch but as a christian. besides might he not have adopted ones ? nay , might he not have children , and be afterwards made an eunuch ? beside ; all this we will tell the dr. what he never knew before , and what is better worth his learning than o●● womens fables . and that is , that the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is equivalent to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , and signifys not only eunuchus eviratus , but princeps , minister regius . thus potiphar is call'd an eunuch or officer of pharaoh , tho' he had a wife if not children . gen. 39.1 . so gen. 40.2 . the chief butler and baker are call'd eunuchs or officers . ier. 29.2 . the nobles and princes of iudah are call'd by this same name in the hebrew and greek , and it is not probable they were all evirati . words have a different signification in differing ages ; and tho' this word bear an infamous sense in this age , yet formerly it had a more honourable signification . it would be we think profane and grating to christian ears , for any to call the sweet ordinance of singing psalms , by the name of ballad singing , as this dr. doth in his animadversions upon his brother allen's essay on that subject . tho' he justify's himself from the old translation that calls the song of songs , the ballad of ballads ; he might as well say paul was a knave , because the same . translation calls him the knave instead of servant of jesus christ. to apply this to our purpose , the word eunuch tho' now us'd in an infamous , was once us'd in an honourable sence , and the most learned critics tell us that this noble man had no such infamous character , but was high treasurer or chamberlain to queen candace . a lapide , menochius , lud. de dieu in loc. so that all the dr. here hath said is nothing but vain babling : and methinks what he says of the turks s●raglio , is too luscious for a man of his gravity . but if ever he had been entred in that academy , the world had never rung with such scandalous reports turpia-dictu , concerning him . 8. another trifle you find , p. 32. that them cannot agree with nations , because them is masculine , and nations neuter ; but relativum cum antecedente concordat genere , numero & persona . alas , poor dr. ! did you read this in your latin or greek grammar ? not in your greek certainly ; for there you might have found somewhat better for the purpose . that by the figure synthesisquandoque relativum ad intellectum seu sensum non ad vocem conformatur . and you have a scripture-instance for it , gal. 4.19 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . nay , had you been able to read your greek testament you might have met with instances as to this very word , acts 15.17.21.25.26.17 . rev. 2.26.27.19.15 . in all which places 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 agrees with 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . so that had we not a rule in the grammar to this purpose , it would have been highly fit to have substituted one for this very occasion , rather than all these text s should be accounted false greek : and this we hope is a solid answer worthy noting down , tho' the dr. reciting it five leaves after forgot himself , and said we had no such answer . but the dr. hath recourse to mr. gosnold for his assistance , who tells him that the antecedent must be not the verb , as he said in the dispute , but the noun 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but where is this to be found ? it is not in the text , unless the verb be the noun . but if the dr. had been as well acquainted with his greek grammar , as with that beloved book of m● 〈◊〉 , he might have prevented our trouble and the discovery of his own ignorance . 't is as ridiculous to abuse his dear friend , and prefix false greek as a title to his book , when at least in that edition we have seen there is only a plain english title , of the doctrine of baptisms ; calling it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , but there he may think himself safe , in keeping to the letter of the scripture● for the letters are the same , heb. 6.2 . from when● the titl● is taken . as the dr. before could not distinguish between a verb and a noun , so here he is not so great a c●i●ick a● to distinguish between the nominative case and genitive , but enough of this stuff . 9. how impertinently did he alledg . p. 35. constantine the great , as a scripture instance of a believers child baptiz'd at grown years ? what dr. skip 200 years at once , wh●● you are pinch'd ! sure this nimble man was a merry andrea before he commenc'd , dr. it was a ●criptu●e instance we cal●'d for , and an instance of one born in the latter end of the 3d or beginning of the 4 th century , is given . besides● the father of constantine was a pagan , and it can't be prov'd that his mother helena was a christian in her sons infancy as to his flourrish of the fathers of the first ages ; we remember not that it was mention'd in the disputation , nor is it in any of the copys ; tho' we remember the dr. pretend●d that for the first 600 years , infants were admitted to communion in the lords supper , upon which one of us reply'd ; then by your own confession , they were baptiz'd , otherwise the other sacrament would not be administred ●o them ; which silence● the dr. and we heard no more of the fathers that day . but if the dr. dare be so hardy , as ●o abide by the tes●●●ony of the fathers , we will joyn issue with him here , whensoever he pleases . 10. how impertinently doth he harangue , ( by way of apology chiefly ) pag. 35.36.37 , for his having se● our infants upon a level with brutes . 〈◊〉 all that he can say , can neve●●xcuse that beastly comparison . nay , to make the matte● 〈◊〉 , after he had thought of it again at london , where he d●●w up the greatest part of this apology , as we suppose , for we h●● little of it at portsmouth ; yet still he hath the face , to challenge us to shew the disparity if we can : as if it was his fix'd opinion , that there is no difference between our children and our dogs . we must confess we said little to it , as thinking it rather deserv'd stripes than an answer . and the honourable colonel gibson did profess to us , ( the day after the disputation ) that he was so offended at it , that he would thereupon have quitted the place , had not some gentlemen near him prevail'd with him to stay , telling him if he went off , there was danger , the provok'd multitude would do him some mischief . and truly an higher 〈◊〉 cannot be put upon any parent , than to make his infants no better than brutes . but h● bears us in hand , he hath a might , esteem for our infants , even a greater than we have , for he hat●●ver and over given it as his opinion , that they are all 〈◊〉 die in i●fancy . now the infants of believing parent● 〈◊〉 the compass of a promise . god will be their god 〈…〉 their seed . gen. 17.7 . so far therefore we may safely 〈◊〉 but seeing god hath not told us , how he deals with the infants of others , we dare not pretend to enter into his secrets , or to tell what we do not know . 't is enough for us , t●at god ●●ll accept the dying infants of such as have sincerely devoted 'em to him . and for others , they are not concern'd how god will deal with them . that man can never be truly concern'd about the salvation of his child , that never was solicitous about his own . but after all what strange kind of salvation , what befor e unheard of heaven hath this gentleman discover'd for creatures , between whom and beasts there is no disparity ! what! no difference , no unlikeness at all ! for we hope he may have learning enough to know the english of di●paritas . well! ( whatever this dr. can satisfy himself with , ) we do both for our selves and dear babes , wait and pray for such a salvation and such a heaven , out of which are excluded all dogs and hogs , and all of beastly capacities and inclinations , whether you take the word brute in a natural or moral sense . yet left this man should think his retortion , as he calls it , unanswerable , we add , there is a vast disparity between beasts and the youngest infants . for ( as was hinted● in the time 〈◊〉 the disputation , ) ( tho' this narrative not only omits but deny's it , ) supposing them utterly uncapable of the dutys , yet no one can deny but they are capable of the blessings and priviledg●s o● the baptismal covenant . they are capable of being pardon'd , justify'd , sanctify'd and clerified , and is it so with brutes ? but further , infants are capable of being oblig'd to the duty of the covenant , tho' they be not in a present capacity to discharge them . thus the 〈◊〉 infants by circumcision were oblig'd to the dutys of that covenant , tho' during their infant state they could not actually discharge them . if they had not been thus oblig'd how could they upon their after-forsaking god , be call'd covenant● breake● , as we fin● they are ezek. 16.8.59 . and oft elsevvhere . their circumcision made them debtors , brought them under obligation to the law , gal. 5.3 . lastly , infants have a fundamental and remote capacity , to discharge the dutys of the covenant ; tho' they have not an immediate capacity for ●it . they have a principle of reason , tho' they have it not perhaps in present exer●ise : now is there vet no disparity between them and beasts ? tho' so soon as they have a being , they are capable of the blessing of the gospel covenant ; and as to the dutys of the covenant which is all that remains to be consider'd in it , they have such a reasonable understanding nature , as doth remotely capacitate them for the discharge of these dutys , and that doth most nearly and immediately capacitate them to come under obligations thereto : so that infants ( as uncapable as any of ours , ) have been all along ( ●ver since there was a sacrament appointed for that purpose , ) solemnly enter'd into covenant with god , tho' we never find that any brutes were . 11. what an impertinent trifler doth this man shew himself again , pag. 37. when instead of proving that dipping is the only way of baptizing , he would have put us to prove that sprinkling is the way . that 't is not the only way we grant ; that it is not a lawful way he can never prove . but the question was not whether that was 〈◊〉 way : but whether dipping , plunging , overwhelming was the only way ? and when we held him to the proof of that , he knew not how to alter the argument , so as to bring the words of the question into the conclusion of his syllogism : we then perceiv'd him to be clericus in libro ; and that , when put out of his road , he was lost . however that he might seem to say somewhat he told the company , his argument was an induction . it should be remembred , that he had lately been confounded by mr. leigh's induction : and many reasons concur , to make it probable , that he scarce ever heard so much as ●he name before . but with them that understood t he thing as little as himself , a hard word would make it look as if he had somewhat to say . this therefore must be an induction . but his argument he brought being only level'd against one particular thing , ( which the nature of an induction doth not admit , ) mr. chandler told a pleasant story from the late bishop of worcester , of a covey of patridges which yet was but one . adding , here we have as wonderful a thing , an induction of one . what he adds afterwards is what we suppose he may have learn'd since his return to london , for we remember nothing of it . nor is it in any of the copys , whether on our side or theirs . 12. his argument from rom. 6.4 . pag. 38.39 . is very frivolous : because we are said to be buried with christ in baptism , therefore it must necessarily be by dipping . this was distinctly answer'd by mr. chandler in his sermons : but because the main stress of the anabaptists cause in this pointlys upon it , we shall not satisfy our selv●s ●o have gravel'd them in the disputation , whe● we deny'd bo●● parts of the argument as they form'd it ; neither of which they were able to prove : but for the help of such as need 〈◊〉 , shall set this matter in a clear light ; in order ●o which let it be consider'd , 1. it is one thing for us t● be ●uried with christ in baptism , and another ●●ing for baptism to rep●esent a burial . the former the apostle says : the ●●ter only dr. russel and his brethren . we are ( as the apostle largel● t●at . rom. 6.3.4.5.6 . ) baptiz'd into christs death , buried , resu●rection . that is , we are solemnly enter'd into the christian covenant , which is founded in , and secur'd by , 〈◊〉 death● bu●●● , and resurrection of our lord ; which thereupon most strongly obliges us to die unto sin , rise to , and walk in , new●ess 〈◊〉 life : but where doth he say a syllable to intimate that our baptism must represent these things ? our baptism is to oblige us hereto● and is accordingly urg'd by the apostle , for that purpose , throughout this context : but we would beg any one to shew us any intimasion , that our baptism is to represent these things . 2. and if baptism must represent these things , it must represent all as well as any of them . there is at least as great if not greater evidence from the context , that the death of christ , the manner and likeness of it , as that the manner of his burial should be represented in our baptism . for besides that we are said to be baptiz'd into is d●ain , v. 3. we are also said to be planted in the likeness of is death . v. 5. whereupon v. 〈◊〉 it follows , our old man is crucify'd with him . but we are no where said to be planted in the likeness of his burial . now what is there in your administration , that doth represent the likeness of christs death , his crucifixion ? by the same reason that you would prove dipping necessary in baptism , a papist or any other person may prove crossing necessary too , and therefore the same answer will inva●dat● both : i. e. that neit●er of them are requir'd to be represented . 3. 't is as trifling , what he adds pag. 39. where he says mr. chandler grants that baptism doth signify a burial and resurrection . mr. chandler only suppos'd , did not grant it : besides if he had granted it , it would not thence follow , that it must necessarily be by dipping . for , 1. in our way , by pouring water on the face , we represent christs death ; the pouring out of his blood and soul : his burial ; the face , the principal part of man being put under-water , or having water poured on it , as earth is poured on a dead body : his ressurrection ; when the child is taken up and deliver'd again to its parents or offerers . this is a sufficient allusion in christian sacraments , which are commemorative of what is past ; and there needs not a more exact resemblance . na● , it is as significant as breaking bread , and pouring out wine , to represent the sacrific'd body and blood of christ. 2. if they will keep strictly to the significancy of a burial , the person to be baptiz● must not walk into the water , but be taken up by the baptizer , and cast down into it . for indeed there is only this difference between our way and theirs : we baptize the face , and they baptize the head and shoulders too : unless the person going down into the water , may be said to baptize himself . and then there are more se-baptists among them than we ever understood before . 3. the anabaptist● in holland●●e ●●e to sensible of the no necessity of dipping , that the general way among them at amsterdam is to baptize by pouring water upon the head. we need not send dr. russel cross the sea● ( as he would us to the turks seragllo ) , but to a place better known , the amsterdam coffee-house , to enquire into the truth of this . we would only here ask the dr. these two civil questions , 1. whether he might not have spar'd all his dutch ? seeihg doope in that language signifies only to wash , and is us'd when they only pour on water ? 2. whether his anabaptist friends at amsterdam do practice a right baptism ? if not , whether he would baptize them again , or exclude them from the church of christ , as he doth us in his closing prayer of which more anon ? if he owns their baptism lawfull , then why such a c●amour and noise about a circumstance ? if their way is justifiable , so is ours . 13. how egregiously doth he trifle , when he tells us that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 when it is joyn'd with an accusative case signifys into . all that we can know from thence , is ( what we well knew before ) that tho' this man pretends to be a dignify'd dr , yet he hath not the learning of a common school boy . when 't is joyn'd with an accusative — why pray dr. what other case doth it any way admit ? we had thought 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 soli accusativo jungitur , had been a rule no one could have missed , that had but once cast his eye on the common grammar ? well sir : if you have any regard to your reputation , we would advise you never more to pretend to greek , and do not make too great a noise about your degrees , it will but expose you to the greater contempt : you had better do as mr. williams did own your ignotance , and not ambitously gape after the name and honour of a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . 14. as to his humane testimonys , they are of little value with us , for the reasons given in the disputation : and it was an evidence of the wretched weakness of his cause , that these must stand instead of an argument with him . these testimonys he hath chiefly borrow'd from danvers , and how imperfectly and lamely they are quoted may be seen in mr. wills and mr. baxters answers to him . so that to wast time and paper about them is but actum agere : we shall therefore only put these following querys to him . 1. will you stand by the authority of these men in other matters ? if not , why would you have us in this ? 2. do any of these say that to wash is not the new testament sense of the word baptize ? or do any answer those places we brought ? or prove us in the wrong ? or how many places can any bring where it necessarily signifys to dip ? we take not mens opinions upon trust , but trial. 3. how few are there of those learned authors , who have not adher'd to that in mat. 12.7 . i will have mercy and not sacrifice , to justify their baptizing with a little water in these cold countreys ? 4. will not the opinion and practice of your brethren in holland , argue as strongly against you , as the opinions of these men , ( had their practice been dipping also ) do against us ? 5. will not the opinion and practice of so many thousand men , great for learning and piety at this day , argue more strongly for us ; than these mens opinions only , without their practice do against us ? 15. we have another trifle pag. 45. they had pleaded philip and the eunuch went both down into the water . it had been reply'd that the word only signify'd they went down to the water . but mr. iohn williams ventures upon a greek criticism , and tells us , he was inform'd there were 2 differing words in the greek text , where 't is said v. 36. they came unto a certain water , and v ▪ 38. they went into . this dr. russel confirm'd and thereupon , ( as they represent the matter , ) mr. leigh concess'd . there is a word for you . 't is well we understand a little latine : otherwise this man would quite silence us . but to the point : who ever told them there were 2 differing words in the greek , told them true . and we are very ready to concess , or ( as we would chuse to speak , consent and yeild to truth . the words are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ; and the true reading of v. 36th is , as they went on their way , they came by , near to , or over against , a certain water : 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , with an accusative , well admits such a reading . and v. 38. they went both down out of the chariot unto this water . how well do these 2 verses answer each other ? and where 's the difficulty this wonderful critic hath left upon us ? but , what need of going down to the water , unless he were to be dip'd ? a little might have been brought up into the chariot if sprinkling would have serv'd the turn . in answer to which we say . 1. his going down to , or into the water , doth no more prove that the eunuch was dip'd , than that philip was ; for both went down . 2. 't is improbable he was dip'd , being then on a journey , and having no cloths to change . and if you still ask why they went down ? 3. 't is not certain , they were provided with a vessel to fetch up water in . 4. there was not convenient room in the chariot for the performance of the action , and what was to attend it . 't is not to be doubted , but it was attended with prayer : your selves , we hope , would not administer baptism without prayer , before , or after , or both . but what room could there be in a chariot , for these two persons to place themselves in a praying posture ? it would neither admit them , ( at least if of the modern form ) to stand nor kneel without uneasiness — which alone might be a sufficient reason , for their coming down out of the chariot , if there were no other . 16. how he trifled about the hebrew bible , and how fasly he represents that matter appears by our narrative . mr. ring had given over writing long before this , and mr. bows and mr. webber were asham'd of their goliah , and therefore about this time basely deserted and left him alone . the true account in short is this . mr. chandler told dr. russel that baptizo was so far from always signifying to dip , that bapto it self sometimes signifys to wet or wash ; and mention'd that text. dan. 4.33 . nebuchadnezzar was wet with the dew of heaven , in the greek it is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . to which russel reply'd the hebrew is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to which mr. chandler return'd the greek word we were then inquiring into . however , to try his skill in hebrew , who had so shamefully falter'd in the greek , he was ask'd what the hebrew word was . he said , if he had an hebrew bible he could tell . mr. chandler handed his , being athias's 2 d edit . amstel . 1668. with the books in latine letters , plac'd after the same order with other hebrew bibles . he could not find the place , but read gen. 1.1 . which he also falsly pronounced . mr. chandler return'd : sir we come not hither , to inquire whether you can read hebrew , but what the hebrew word is in this place . then mr. robinson folded down the place for him : on which he mutter'd something to himself , which his nearest neighbours could not hear ; and said the word was not there . but he hath not told us to this day what the word is . hebrew bibles are all misplac'd with him ; for we hear from good hands that at havering in essex , he was confounded with the same place , and could not find the prophecy of daniel . now we would befriend him against he ●●ngages in the next heckny prize , and inform him of a great secret ; that daniel is mostly chaldee and the word there is not tabal but zavang 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a word of the same import . and this mr. chandler understood , not before he was born , but before the creation of dr. russel . chap. iii. by this time it appears how unregardable both this pretended narrative is , and it's pretended antho●●● a pamphlet stuff'd with such notorious falshoods , 〈…〉 happens to speak truth , trifling so egregiously , with what contempt doth it deserve to be treated by the world ? but there is yet one thing further , that may help to discover the man , and that , is the narrow and uncharitable principles , that have drop'd from him ; and these we shall briefly animadvert upon . 1. in the very first page of the narrative , speaking of mr. chandler's thursday lectures at portsmouth , he tells you they were manag'd , so as was to the grief of such as truly fear god in those parts . why ! what was the offence ? he tells you it was given out , that mr. chandler would not only prove infant baptism from scripture ; but also furnish his hearers with arguments to defend their practice . why ! we cannot imagine how this should grieve any that truly fear god. to have a truth prov'd , a truth about which so many good men differ , to have it clear'd from scripture testimony , to have the oracles of god unfolded about it : 't is strange this should be grievous to any : yes ( says he ) it was to the grief of them that truly fear god in those parts . we are at a loss to know the reason why it should be grievous to any such , and here he will not help us out . however ( say we , ) was it to the grief of such as were perswaded of this truth ! were they griev'd to have it clear'd up and be furnish'd with arguments for the defence of it ? this can't be his meaning . every one is pleas'd to see what he believes to be the truth , set in a clear light — those that were for the baptism of infants could not be griev'd at it : no , that he doth not say , but those that fear god , that truly fear him , were grieved at it . so that ( with him ) none that are for infant baptism in those parts will be allowed truly to fear god. not one besides the poor baptists , as he calls them , pag. 2. here 's charity with a witness ! all the regular members of the conforming and non-conforming congregations , are censur'd as destitute of the true fear of god! pray dr. your reason for this ! will you condemn us and not tell us why ? what is there in the notion of infant baptism that is inconsistent with the fear of god ? why may not a person be of opinion , that he ought with the greatest seriousness to devote and consecrate his children to god ; and enter them by baptism into his covenant , and bring them under early bonds to him , and yet for all this god! nay the rather do it , because he truly fears god ? 2. that he may shew it is not an unwary expression , but his deliberate judgment ; he doth in the very last paragraph of his pamphlet lay the same stress on the point of dipping . his concluding prayer is , that as god had made the hearing of the dispute of such use to several persons , that they were fully convinc'd , and did a few days after submit to be dipt — so it may be of like use to many others in the reading — that so there may be added to the church such as shall be say'd . such a prayer scarce ever before appear'd in print , made up of falshood and uncharitableness . it is amazing to us that a man dare venture into the presence of god with a 〈◊〉 in his mouth , and such uncharitableness in his heart . the ●●lshoo● we have animadverted upon , cap. 1. paragraph 10. the uncharitableness we are now to take notice of . he prays that as several 〈◊〉 hearing , so many others by reading , may be 〈◊〉 and submit to be dip● ; ha● so there may be added to the church such as 〈◊〉 be sav'd . what apprehensions must thi● man have of those that never were dipt ? why they are not yet added to the church . no not to the anabaptists church ! but we dou●●●ot , but 〈…〉 are added to the church of 〈…〉 . yet whatever we think , his charitable ma● will not allow they can otherwise 〈…〉 the church , and consequently no othe●wise sav'd , 〈…〉 it consists in de●●ying infant baptism , and 〈◊〉 the necessity of dipping . if you agree with him in these and according 〈…〉 be dipt , you are ( 〈…〉 as we can find , ) added to the church 〈…〉 of faith , re●enta●ce , obedience , toward 〈…〉 being dipt ●on water upon profession , is with 〈◊〉 instead of all these ; but tho' you be regenerate and sanctify'd through 〈…〉 , soul and spirit , walk humbly with god , and unblamably before men ; yet if you were baptiz'd only in your infancy , or ●f when adult , not by dipping : there is no 〈◊〉 for you if this man were to be your judg● but blessed be god we are to be try'd at an an●ther bar. and therefore with us it is a very small matter to be judg'd by him or of mans day , 1 cor. 4.4 . knowing that he that will judg 〈…〉 the lord. to whose righteous judgment we appeal , and for which we wait in hope . but let this mans notions of religion be never so narrow and uncharitable , we declare our religion is of no less compass than christianity it self . all that hold the essentials of religion , we account to be of the same religion with us : tho' they differ from us in some inconsiderable matters . we will not be perswaded to look upon the english episcopal , or the foreign presbyterian . the congregational , or anabaptists themselves , to be of a differing religion from us ; to be destitute of the true fear god , or shut out of christs church , religion consists in tha● which is common to the pious and sober of all these partys , and not in any thing that distinguisheth them from each other . — we abominate such a narrow strait-laced principle , as would place religion in being for or against liturgies , for or against this or that form of church-government , for or against infant baptism , or this or that mode of administration . these things are none of them great enough , to be the terms of eternal life : the final sentence will not proceed upon them : we believe with st. peter that god is no respecter of persons , but in every nation , and among every party of men , that hold to the head christ jesus : he that feareth god and worketh righteousness , shall be accepted of him . acts 10.34 , 35. and with st. paul : the kingdom of god is not meat and drink , but righteousness and peace and joy in the holy ghost , and he that in these things serves christ is acceptable to god and approv'd among men. whether he be for or agai●st these things we have nam'd , or any of the like kind . rom. 14.17 , 18. finis . the most material errata , observ'd in a review are world for word , p. 17. l. 20. word for world , p. 58. l. 15. sub●ects for subjects , p. 67. l. 31. which with any others of the like nature , can create no difficulty to an intelligent reader . there are indeed several letters dropt out in working , for which tho room is left , yet they disappear : but they may be easily supply'd . for instance : the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is dropt in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , p. 17. and the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , p. 49. and the letter ● twice , a line or two after in the same page , in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . and if any who are fond either of the greek accents , or hebrew points , complain of their omission in those original words that here occur , they may charge it par●● on the different inclination of the corrector , and partly on the difficulty of bringing our common printers to any exactness in what lies out of their usual road. to the latter of which ●is also to be ascrib'd , that ●o many of the hebrew letters are needlesly dagesch'd . notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a31663-e1560 tillotson , pres. to six ser. on family religion , pag. 3. notes for div a31663-e2310 * stilling-fleet iren. pag. 7. * lightfoots harmony on joh. 1 25. notes for div a31663-e5740 * any way ; before , the words were any where . † he is attempting to shift the opponency . * somewhere . the word is again altered from any way to somewhere . * the dr. now seems unwil●ing again to allow scripture consequence . ⸫ here mr. leigh was willing ( tho the respondent ought not to prove ) to offer pr●of for the peoples satisfaction . * mr. robinson will keep him to the opponency . * the drs. design even now was to turn the opponency on us , as i can prove from a letter of mr. jo. williams . but now he will not quit the opponency , and yet expects from us a scripture proof for infant baptism . * or , asserenti incumbit probatio . * here we expected that the dr. should either have shewn that this distinction is groundless , or that he should have brought it into his ne●t syllogism . but he doth neither . * we seeing that the dr. wav'd distinctions , and grounded his discipleship by the ministry of men upon the word teach , mat. 28.19 . and that because it goes before the word baptizing . therefore we denied the major . * mr. chandler calls for a proof of the consequent , a●● the dr. goes upon the proof of the ante●●dent . * here the dr. blunders again , confounding antecedent and consequent . † i. e. because they are not capable of instruction , or compleat discipleship by the ministry of men ; therefore that they are not to be baptized . * here is not a word of the consequence , which is still deny'd ; but be goes on upon the antecedent . * he takes no notice at all of the distinction , but goes on to prove that infants can't be compleat disciples by the ministry of men. * here followed a general laughter . * this is the consequence that hath been still deny'd , and no proof offer'd . * but the dr. ought to have proved , either , that there are no incompleat disciples , or that they are excluded from the commission for bap●●● because they have no knowledge , &c. * here the dr. neither deny's that paul did declare the baptism of infants in his sermons , nor asserts that all kc preached is left on record . * this word it 's may either refer to pauls declaration , or to baptism . and this ambiguity caus'd some confusion afterwards . * here the dr. was to prove the consequent , and he goes on to prove the antecedent . * the dr. would ramble and we rath●r follow than leave him . and gave the words ( all nations ) supposing by the word ( it ) he meant baptism . * who doubts this , and what is it to the purpose ? * remember he doth not mention any here to whom he had declared the councel , &c. but the ephesians . he mentions jews and greeks , because there were greeks or hellenists at ephesus , and many other places up and down , as well as jews . and we don't question but he did declare the whole councel , &c. and therefore infant baptism ; but say it 's not necessary to be left on record , as preach't by paul , especially to these ephesians , when there is other good scripture proof for it . but the dr. makes a long harangue only to bring over his own argument again , which he could not make good . * here our scribes were imperfect and i cannot remember what ought to be inserted . but the force of the argument is not removed . * how many times hath the dr. been told what we mean by compleat disciples ! * and thus to spend time , he will have his long argument over again . * an excellent proof , i. e. turning the conclusion into a question . * observe , he falls upon the minor. not a word of the major . * here the dr. waves the distinction , that he may wrap up himself and the auditory in confusion . * here the dr. se●ms willing to turn off the disputation , to original sin , with those of his profession d●n● . * here 's a fallacy ; he will now suppose his own conclusion , and the sum of what we deny'd before . * he was here to prove the consequence , and he brings an instance to prove the antecedent and but barely asserts the consequent . * what is a man's authority in this case but his iudgment ? * the people laughed not because erasmus ' s name was mentioned , but because he said erasmus wrote in english. * mr. leigh since the disputation , hath acknowledg'd himself guilty of a mistake , in calling the eunuch a proselyte of the gate ; whereas he was probably of the church , and such a ones infants were accounted church-members . but the dr. had not the sense to discover this mistake . * 2 thes. 3.10 . * mr. leigh mistook●● word is would not . but it comes to the 〈◊〉 , for infants have power and will both alike . * reader , observe the argument from luk. 14. is ●● opt . and what mr. rus. here says farther , had been answered before in the words , all nations , usque ad nauseam . * the contrary whereof , hath not yet been proved . * mat. 19.14 . * here is no notice taken of the distinction , only the old thing asserted . * besides , constantine's father was a pagan , and constantine had a desire to be baptiz'd in jordan , because christ was . * the dr. allow'd it to be the first 600 y●●rs , as i remember . * observe , by believers was before understood a christian believer , by themselves , wherever they spake of believing as necessary to baptism : neither was the word when in any other sense . besides , it was granted before , that iew ; and pagans ought not to be baptiz'd till adult ; and both christ and his ●●●●●r were iews at the time of his birth . * indeed the people laughed both ways . * mark that . the dr. denies that visible church members ought to be baptized . * the major is dropt , and he denies the minor ; after a while , you will find the major silently taken up again . * he answers not my argument by mak●●●●ood sense of the 〈◊〉 ●ny other way . 〈◊〉 now brea●'s rule 〈◊〉 ●●ns opponent . * here he takes no notice of the second part which is the main of my question . * here the dr. could not tell what to say , and therefore will have all over again . * reader , to repeat all this is nauseous , but because the dr. could do nothing else be would force us to it . * and thus to no purpose but to spen● time mr. russel would have the same over again . * this poor dry evasion , you see , he hath before , and i● beholden to his old friend danvers for . * here he shifts the respondency and turns opponent , which we give way to , because they could do nothing else . * here he drops his argument , to prove that church membership is not the ground of baptism . * observe how he leaves his argument , and runs to what had been worn thredbare before . * the poor man runs again from consequence ●o express words , tho consequence was allowed before . * remember , this refers to the subjects only , not the m●in●●● . * now you see the dr. very plainly takes the opponency , because he could do nothing else ; contrary to his most false assertion in his narrative . * a wise answer from a silly doctor ; is it not ? * this was fully answer before , therefore it was tedious for scribes to write it . * here is a vacancy in the notes of our scribes . * here observe again . dr. russel would shift the opponency on us . * reader . observe , that the dr. grounds his practice upon two arguments link'd together , viz. the resemblance between dipping and a burial . and primitive practice . mr. chandler , denies this resemblance between dipping and burial , to conclude for dipping . and he ought to have proved that it doth ; but instead thereof , he insists upon his second argument drawn from primitive practice . hereupon there was no room ( without contention ) to urge any thing more against their first argument . but you have it sufficiently answered in the brief confutation . * excellent greek . † good greek still . * here we were going to read , but they gave no room . * the text ac. 8 , 38. hath not a word of putting him under the water . * so the greek prepositions often signify . * where is dipping to be found in this text ? * this whole passage hath been attested by the person that spake the words . * we have good intelligence that the dr. puzzl'd thus on the same word , at a publick disputation sometime before . præcursor, or, a forerunner to a large review of the dispute concerning infant-baptism wherein many things both doctrinall and personal are cleared, about which mr. richard baxter, in a book mock-titled plain scripture-proof of infants church-membership and baptism hath darkned the truth / by john tomes. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. 1652 approx. 302 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 56 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a62870) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 44370) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 1369:11) præcursor, or, a forerunner to a large review of the dispute concerning infant-baptism wherein many things both doctrinall and personal are cleared, about which mr. richard baxter, in a book mock-titled plain scripture-proof of infants church-membership and baptism hath darkned the truth / by john tomes. tombes, john, 1603?-1676. [4], 102 p. printed by h. hils and are to be sold by h. crips and lod. lloid, t. brewster and g. moule, london : 1652. reproduction of original in the bodleian library. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng baxter, richard, 1615-1691. -plain scripture proof of infants church-membership and baptism. infant baptism. 2004-11 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-02 apex covantage keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-04 john latta sampled and proofread 2005-04 john latta text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-10 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion praecursor : or a forerunner to a large review of the dispute concerning infant-baptism ; wherein many things both doctrinall and personal are cleared : about which mr. richard baxter in a book mock-titled [ plain scripture-proof of infants church-membership and baptism ] hath darkned the truth . by john tombs b. d. london , printed by h. hils , and are to be sold by h. crips and lod. lloid in popes-head ally , t. brewster and g. moule at the three bibles at the west end of pauls , 1652. to the right honourable bulstrode whitlock , richard keble , serjeants at law , john lisle esq lords commissioners for the great seal of england , major general thomas harrison , edmund prideaux esquire , atturney general for the state of england , denis bond esquire . through the influence of the favour of many of you as instruments of the lord for my liberty to preach the gospel and peace at the temple in london , i enjoyed sundry years in the late tempestuous times an unexpected calm , until a new storm arising by reason of the violence of men bent to bear down dissenters from the determinations of the assembly of divines at westminster , by reason of the publishing my examen of mr. marshals sermon for infant-baptism , i was necessitated to leave the harbour i had at the temple , and to remove a great distance from london , to the place of my nativity , in which i hoped for a setlement , which i found not . for partly by the states selling my lands out of which my maintenance there arose , and partly by reason of the alienating of mens spirits from me through the distance between me and the antagonist i here answer , i was in a great measure frustrated of my hopes . but it pleased the lord nevertheless to order things so , that by the means of some of you as patrons , and others as helpers , i enjoy a comfortable supply for my maintenance , together with that which is dearer to me , the liberty of holding forth the truth of the gospel , where i laboured many years heretofore . in testimony of my thankful acknowledgement of that ample favour which it pleased some of you to vouchsafe me by your appearing for me , and bounty to me at the temple , and testimonial of me at my departure thence , the readiness of you all either to invest , or to setle me in the maintenance i now enjoy , & that there may be something in your hands to vindicate me from injurious aspersions , under which my self with the truth i avouch do suffer much , i humbly presume to present this writing to your hands , and praying that you may honor god in your places who hath raised you up to do him service , i subscribe my self your honours humble and real servant , john tombes . lemster , december 26. 1651. to the dearly beloved , my auditors formerly the inhabitants of bewdly in worcestershire . the fame of the dispute between mr. baxter and my self at your chappel , jan. 1. 1649. was at first spread over the land by mr. bs abusive passage in his epistle before his book of the saints everlasting rest : to which i opposed an answer in my farewell-speech to you , and that it might be communicated to the nation printed it with some additions in my antidote , which i intended in the first place for your use . after this mr. b. printed a large book for infants-baptism , framed in manner of a sermon as intended , and accordingly tendred in an epistle to you . in which how injuriously he hath dealt with me , and how weakly he hath opposed the truth i taught you , will appear in part by reading this forerunner to the rest of the answer that is to come after . i did presently upon my first reading of mr. bs. book in a set speech briefly shew you mr. bs. grounds , and the reason why they were unsatisfying . yet neither my antidote nor that speech do i find much regarded by many of you : nor perhaps will this writing take much with you . however i have conceived it necessary to tender this writing to you , that it might thereby appear , how vain the excessive boastings of mr. bs book have been ; how justifiable their receiving the truth , who have yielded to it is ; and how inexcusable they are that persist in mr. bs. way . what ever you think or speak of me , yet i do , and shall study your good , and committing my labours for you and among you , to the blessing of the lord , i rest , your loving countrey-man and servant in christ , john tombes . lemster oct. 1. 1651. the contents . sect. i. of the necessity and occasion of this present writing . sect. ii. that the title of mr. baxters book , is a mock-title . sect. iii. mr. baxters citations from fathers , advantage him not . sect. iv. mr. baxters citations from my writings , advantage him not . sect. v. mr. baxter unduly suggests many things in his epistles . sect. vi. the chief points of mr. baxters book are very briefly touched . sect. vii . many personal occurrences are cleered : by relating of which mr. baxter hath ( in his history ) sought to create prejudice against me . sect. viii . more personal matters , which the history of mr. baxter hath made crooked , are set straight . sect. ix . in my alleging peter de bruis and others as antipaedobaptists 500. years ago , is no untrath . sect. x. that mr. baxters charge of accusing and of disputing my children out of the church and covenant of christ , is vain ; and some inquiry is made , how they are in covenant . sect. xi . about mr. baxters 4. texts , urged impertinently to prove infants visible church-membership . sect. xii . that mr. baxter unjustly chargeth me to be a sect-master . sect. xiii . that it is not a right way to judge of the truth of doctrine , by strange accidents , though wonderous . sect. xiv . that mr. baxter doth not rightly expound christs rule , mat. 7. 15 , 16. nor is unholiness of men a note to know fals doctrine by . sect. xv. mr. baxters insinuations of the wickedness of anabaptists , is calumniatory , and vainly alleged to condemne their doctrine of antipaedobaptism : anabaptists , and with them my self , are vindicated from charges of schism , neglect of the lords day , &c. sect. xvi . the ground of my opposing infant-baptism , is confirmed by mr. baxter himself . sect. xvii . the gross absurdities , to which mr. baxter vaunted i was driven in the dispute . sect. xviii . the gross untruths mr. baxter chargeth me with , are not such . sect. xix . the 6. imagined errors charged on me by mr. baxter are cleered from his censure . sect. xx. many learned men ( with the oxford convocation ) of former & later times , take infant-baptism only for an unwritten tradition . sect. xxi . many things are cleared about my conformity , anabaptists necessity to be baptized , the manner of dipping used by them ; their standing to their confession of faith , &c. sect. xxii . the speech [ that no one countrey is gathered into christs visible church ] containes no malignancy to-christ , but is a manifest truth . errata . page 2. l. 13. debare reade debate , p. 4. l. 14. specially r. speciously , p. 5. l. 3. after r. afore , p. 7. l. 7. contrary r. century , p. 13. l. 9. way r. man , p. 14. l. 18. conceive r. convince , p. 15. l. 15. wickedness r. weakness , p. 16. l. 15. weari . r. wari . p. 19. l. 27. 1649. r. 1646. p. 20. l. 36. alteration r. altercation , p. 21. l. 18. r. is con . p. 22. l. 29. and r. i , p. 26. l. 23. r. i been , l. 35. d. likely is , p. 30. l. 9. 3 , 4. r. 314. p. 31. l. 24. singularly r. singularity , p. 32. l. 11. hot r. not , p. 33. l. 18. overlasting r. overlashing , p. 37. l. 37. mysteriis r. mysticis , p. 38. l. 25. l. it . is as , l. 28. scoffically r. scoptically , p. 42. l. 19. 1. r. 10. p. 44. l. 2. eternally r. eventually , l. 20. r. act act. p. 45. l. 2. r. this is , p. 49. l. 3. r. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 l 4. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . l. 28. absolutely r. resolutely , p. 51. l 33. they r. them , l. 35. accident r. antecedent , p. 53. l. 1. 9. r. 8. p. 57. l. 15. r. knew them , p. 58. l. 18. me the d me . but what r. that , p. 60. l. 38. notions r. motions , p , 62. l. 35. r. ampsing . p. 63. l. 17. alteration r. altercation , p. 65. l. 1. in r. i , p. 71. l. 7. r. come to me , p. 72. l. 11. r , if he , l. 14. el r. all , l. 25. tras . r. trans . l. 31. any r. my . mr. richard baxter in the 2. edition of the saints everlasting rest , part . 1. chap. 8. sect . 5. pag. 1795. in the margin , hath these words . and in the primitive times none were baptized without an expresse covenanting , wherein they renounced the world , flesh and devil ; and engaged themselves to christ , and promised to obey him ; as you may see in tertul. origer , cyprian , and others at large . i will cite but one for all , who was before the rest , and that is justin martyr ; speaking of the way of baptizing the aged , saith , how we are dedicated to god , we will now open to you . as many as being penswaded do believe these things to be true which we teach , and do promise to live according to them , they first learn by prayer and fasting to beg pardon of god for their former sins ; our selves joining also our prayer and fasting . then they are brought to the water , and are born again ( or baptized ) in the same way as we our selves were born again . for they are washed with water in the name of the father , the lord and god of all ; and of our saviour jesus christ ; and of the holy ghost — then we bring the person thus washed and instructed , to the brethren , as they are called , where the assemblies are ; that we may pray both for our selves and the new illuminated person , that we may be found by true doctrine and by good works , worthy observers and keepers of the commandments , and that we may attain eternal salvation . then there is brought to the chief brother , ( so they called the chief minister ) bread , and a cup of wine ( washed ; ) which taking , he offereth praise and thanksgiving to the father by the name of the son and holy ghost . and so a while he celebrateth thanksgiving . after prayers and thanksgiving , the whole assembly saith amen . thanksgiving being ended by the president ( or chief guide ) & the consent of the whole people , the deacons as we call them , do give to every one present , part of the bread and wine , over which thanks was given ; and they also suffer them to bring it to the absent . this food we call the eucharist , to which no man is to be admitted but onely he that believeth the truth of our doctrine , being washed in the laver of regeneration for remission of sin ; and so liveth as christ hath taught : apol. 2. this then is no new overstrict way you see . praecursor , or a forerunner to a large review of the dispute concerning infant-baptisme heretofore mannaged by the author . sect . i. of the necessity and occasion of this writing . it is the observation of solomon prov. 18. 19. ( as we now reade it ) that a brother offended is harder to be won then a strong city , and their contentions like the bars of a castle , which being strong will neither bow , nor yield , say our late annotations on the place . which thing as it is true of natural brethren , when they contend about civil affaires , so it is too often found true among christian brethren , yea even in the ministery of the gospel , when they contend about the things of christ whether out of faction , or conscience . we need not go far for instances to prove it : this last age hath verified it too plainly in the contentions between the lutherans & calvinists in germany , remonstrants & contraremonstrants in belgia , prelatist ; & non-conformists , independents and presbyterians in england . among others the providence of the lord hath made me a man of contention , as the prophet complaines of himself , jerem. 15. 10 , and that which is most grievous to me with my brethren in the ministery and faith of christ , with whom . i hoped for a brotherly conjunction in the work of christ , the yoke of prelates being removed , and about that ordinance of baptisme , which should be a bond of union between us , ephes. 4. 5. i with others asserting infant-baptisme to be a corruption of the ordinance of baptisme , others avouching it as of god , and the countrary a pernitious error . the season in which i appeared in this matter , the spirits of men in old , and new england being very thirsty after reformation in worship according to the word , humane inventions every where cried down , this being taken for a maxime against papists , and prelates , that in gods worship we must keep close to the institution , and an assembly called to that end , and the parliament with them engaged in solemne covenant , . i taking the way approved by protestant writers afore i vented any thing in publique to debare the matter with learned ministers , and after to present my exceptions against paedobaptisme to a committee of the assembly , gave me hopes of a facile and speedy way for clearing the point . but whether it were that mens resolutions were pitched on the patternes of other churches , or swayed with prejudice , or fear or something else , i quickly found my hopes deceived , my very dissenting from them though in this candid manner begetting enmity towards me , and notwithstanding my reasons presented to them , paedobaptisme established in the directory , and the not practising of it , and gainsaying of it made penal ; which things necessitated me to print my two treatises , and this drew down on me a storm of writers , by whom mens spirits were exasperated against me , whereby i was enforced to print my apology , afore i could review the dispute as i intended . but my apology not preventing my removal from that place where i had better opportunity to write , and print then sithence , yet as soone as i could settle my self and family in any sort i applied my self to review the dispute according to the order of the examen of mr. marshals sermon , which i had gone through unto the third conclusion , and had some purpose of printing a part of it by it self , because of the difficulty in printing and sale of large things : yet afore i did it by reason of the neighbour-hood of mr. b. i imparted some sheetes about 1 cor. 7. 14. to him , out of which he took notes as he pleased , and quickly returned them to me without animad versions on them , which i hoped he would have done of his own accord , as the manner of schollers of acquaintance is in such cases . after some of my auditors beginning to enquire after the duty of being baptized , it was propounded by one to have recourse to mr. b. and by me , if they did so , to get his arguments in writing for infant-baptism : but our endeavours not succeeding ; i yielded to a dispute though much against my mind , presaging from the knowledge i had of mr. baxters quicknesse and my own slownesse in answering an argument not under my eye , the favour of the most to mr. bs. tenet , and a verseness from mine , and other accidents ; mr. b. likely to gain the fame of a victory , and to put back the work of reformation of that corruption , yet hoping mr. b. would after have imparted to me his arguments in writing , that i might as dr. raynolds permitted hart , mend my answers afore printing . but mr. b. denying it , and venting the passage in his saints everlasting rest , wherein he speaks of grosse absurdities i was driven to , i was forced to print my antidote , since which he hath printed a large book in which he hath raised much dust to darken the truth , and to asperse my person : which i am necessitated to answer , and to stay or order the review of the dispute between my self , mr. m. and others as there shall be cause . sect . ii. that the title of mr. baxters book is a mock-title . mr. bs. book is intituled plain scripture-proof of infants churchmembership and baptism : which is true only 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : to the contrary , and might have been moretruly intituled , no plain scripture-proof for infants baptism . let any man but view his texts which are these : mat. 28. 19. acts 15. 10. levit. 25. 41 , 42. luke 9. 47 , 48. with mat. 18. 5. mark. 9. 41. rom. 11. 17 , 19 , 20 , 24 , 25 , 26. mat. 23. 37 , 38 , 39. revel . 11. 15. heb. 8. 6. & 7. 22. deut. 29. 10 , 11 , 12. rom. 4. 11. exod. 20. 6. josh. 7. 25 , 26. deut. 13. 12 , 13 , 14. exod. 20. 5. num. 31. 17. dan. 6. 24. deut. 20. 16 , 17. deut. 28 4 , 18 , 32 , 41. mal. 2. 15. 1 cor. 7. 14. mark 9. 36 , 37. & 10. 13 , 14 , 15 , 16. being not prepossessed with his chymical extractions , but using his own wit or ancient commentators , yea or modern except about three or four of these texts , and i should as soon expect he should conclude a new world in the moon as infant-baptisme from them . the very first and only text which speaks a word of baptism is so plain against infant-baptisme , that paedobaptists in their commentaries and disputes think it enough if they can avoid the force , of it against them . yea is not mr. bs. own confession contradictory to the title of his book ? page 3. posit . 1. he tells us of some things plainly determined in scripture , others have no such determination . and saith , such is the case of infant-baptisme . and page 301. if the very baptisme of infants it self be so darke in the scripture , that the controversie is thereby become so hard as we finde it , &c. and if it be so dark in scripture , and found so hard by him , me thinks that he might not be thought to delude people ; he should have altered the title , and forborne to talke as he doth in his book of bringing plain scripture-proof to them that call for them . if i might be allowed to passe my censure on him as he doth on me , i would not stick to say , that laying aside his rhetorick , his exclamations , interrogations , admirations , expostulations , misapprehensions of my actions and answers , invectives against anabaptists , and two or three quirkes of wit , there 's as little matter to his purpose that hath the likenesse of solidity in his book as i have met within a book so specially set forth , and so much cried up , and that he doth onely magno caenatu nugas agere , endeavour much to trifle much ; and that he had done better with the oxford convocatior , mr. bedford ( as he cites him page 301. ) with many others to have rested on tradition unwritten , then to bring such impertinent texts as he hath done for infant-baptisme . but i must remember i am an antagonist . he saith he was constrained thereunto unavoidably by my importunity . answer , ti 's true i was importunate to have his arguments in writing : but never that he should print them , much lesse print my answers taken onely from my mouth either relying on anothers pen or his own memory . doctor rainolds dealt not so with hart the jesuit : nor will i think an ingenuous scholler conceive his dealing candid , who knowes the difference of answering in verbal conference , and writing where the argument is before the respondent . if i were so importunate he might have conceived it was for my satisfaction , which he denies to have been manifested to him page 281. or if it were onely for my neighbours there had been some love in it if we had had them without printing them , specially with such asperity and foule descirptions of me as he makes . but now he hath printed let 's look upon them . sect . iii. mr. baxters citations from fathers advantage him not . after he comes to the arguments which were desired , 20. leaves in quarto are spent in sentences , epistles , and history , and 5. more in a very small letter in 10. positions and 3. propositions to usher in his arguments with state , or rather to prepossesse his reader . first he sets down 2. texts , which are alleadged in his 26. argument to prove his 2d . main argument , and there i shall meete with them . then sundry of the ancients speeches . the first of origens is examined in my examen part . 1. sect 5. and my answer vindicated in my apology sect . 16. page 81. the speech of augustin de bapt . cont . donat. l 4. c. 23. ( it should be 24. ) shewes he found no divine authority for infant-baptisme , but the conceit he had that what the universal church holdeth came from apostolical authority , and circumsion of infants . the former is no good rule , as appeares by the tenets of the ancients about episcopacy , easter , millenary opinion , infant-communion . i will recite some speeches of men very eminent , salmas . appar . ad libr. de prim . papae page 86. eutychio idem usu venit , quod omnibus fermè scriptoribus ecclesiasticis craecis , latinisque , ut dum morem sui temporis spectant à principio sic semper fuisse existimârint : molin . vates lib. 2. c. 13. page 133. d●nique satan jampridem orsus primula initia mysterii iniquitatis tam densas tenebras offudit historiae ecclesiasticae primi seculi sub apostolic , & post apostolos super is additos , ut baronius fateatur vix quicquam certi posse statui . chamier . panstr . cath. tom . 3. lib. 24. c. 16. sect . 50. ( quasi vero , inquam , non cyprianus quum rebaptizari vellet tincto : apud haereticos non plenis buccis occlamaret it à semper observ itum fuisse in ecclesia . the latter is the common mistake about cicumcision , which hath been often answered in my exercit. exam. apology page 85. as for the place of august . tom . 7. de peccat . mer. & remis . l. 3. c. 5. that all antiquity held , that believers infants do receive remission of original sin by christian baptisme , mr. b. doth not rightly translate the words . for the words are not as mr. b. translates [ believers little ones , fidelium parvulos ; ] but [ fideles parvulos , believing little ones . ] and what he meanes by little ones believing , he shewes lib. 1. de peccat . mer. & remiss . cap. 27. quis autem nesciat credere esse infantibus haptizari , non credere autem non baptizari ? who knowes not that to infants to believe is to be baptized , not to believe is not to be baptized ? so that with austin all baptized infants are believers , unbaptized unbelievers : and yet lib. 4. de bapt . contra donat. cap. 23. he saith , that certe nondum possunt parvuli infantes corde credere ad justitiam , & ore confiteri ad salutem , certainly they cannot yet believe with the heart unto righteousnesse , as the pious thief on the crosse , but do withstand by crying their baptism . but how vain austins judgement was about infant-baptism is shewed in my examen part . 1. sect. 8. and may be seen by considering how he maintained a like antiquity and necessity of giving infants the lords supper both in the passage cited by me in my apology out of the first book de pecc . merit . & remiss . cap. 24. pag. 82. and lib. 3. de pecc . mer. & remiss . c. 4. next to that which mr. b. cites which mr. b. doth not rightly cut off page 162. of his book ; whence i gather that mr. b. is not to be too easily trusted in his citations of authors . the words he cites out of justin martyr his epistle ad zenam prove nothing that is denyed . the testimony of cyprian epist. 59. is answered in my examen pa. 1. se. 7. to mr. b. his question whether a whole councel , and all the church be ignorant whether infants were wont to be baptized 100. years before , when some of themselves or their fathers were those infants ? i answer , they might be ignorant , it being either not at all or very rarely in that time ; nor is it known of what age the 66. bishops of that councel were when that epist. was written , nor whose children they were , whether believers or infidels ; nor in the whole epistle is any thing historical set down about the ancient use of infant-baptism : but their determination of the lawfulnesse of it afore the eighth day , which epistle because hierom , augustin and others do so much alleadge as their prime testimony for baptizing infants for remission of original sin , and i am taxed for calling it in my ex. p. 1. s. 7. an absurd epist. & mr. f. rous in his late abridgem . of the 1. fathers hath left out that which was chiefly to have been inserted as the reason of the councels determination , which austin lib. 3. d'peccat . merit . & remiss . c. 5. and elsewhere recites ; i have therefore translated the whole epistle into english , and printed it in the end of this writing , not to shew the nakednesse of that father , as i am accused but to clear the truth about the antiquity of infant-baptism . but there is one testimony higher then cyprian which mr. b. urgeth with much earnestnesse as if he did triumph in it : and it is that of pope hyginus , who lived about the year 150. or 140. and ordained something about gossips at infant-baptism , which must needs shew the apostles baptized infants . to which i answer , 1. the decree in the epistle as osiander epit. hist. eccl. cent . 2. lib. 2. c. 5. cites it out of gratian to a word mentions not infant-baptism , though it speak of gossips which were at other times then infant-baptism . 2. mr. b. might have taken notice , that scultetus med . patru . part 1. lib. 11. cap. 10. saith , of all the epistles of the first popes , no man that reads them attentively , but acknowledgeth them to be forged . the contrary writers cent . 2. c. 7. judge the same , osiander epitome eccl. hist. cent. 2. lib. 2. cap. 5. calls the author personatum hyginum , and ( as i remember ) rivet , cook , james passe the like censure . perkins preparative to the demonstration of the problems . these epistles decretal , which passe under the names of clement , evarist , telesphorus , hyginus , & e. are all forged , and that for six reasons : yea doctor prideaux ( whom mr. b. alleadgeth for him ) in his nineth oration de pseudoepigraphis sect. 3. censures the decretal epistles of the ancient popes as counterfeit . lastly , doctor rainolds in his conference with hart chap. 8. divis . 3. hath so fully proved in a large discourse the bastardise of them , that i could hardly have imagined any learned protestant would ever have thus alleadged so notoriously forged a writing . so that i need not answer mr. bs. allegation of this testimony as by currant consent of historians assuring us , and his questions thereor , but by telling him he hath reason to be ashamed of abusing men with this forgery after so much eviction of it by learned men , being more like to a brazen fac'd allegation , then that he so censures me for without cause : he next addes a speech of tertullian de pudic . cap. 9. and translates it into english. transgression in interpretation is not lesse then in conversation : which i know not why he adds but to shew the evil of my sin in interpretation , as i imagine , of scripture : which had he demonstrated he had done more then yet hath been done by him , mr. m. or any other . that interpretation i give of 1 cor 7. 14. had sundry godly and learned protestants , melanchthor , musculus , camerarius , &c. for it ( whose words are printed in my exercit. ) before me , nor do mr. b. his arguments or others take me off from it , but are answered in their place . of my interpretation of mat. 28. 19. mr. b. pag. 14. saith he will stand to most that i said of it . what i said of rom. 11. 17. deut. 29. 10 , 11 , 12. i intend to vindicate in its place . my way and course of interpreting scripture hath been known where i have preached , at oxford , worcester , lemster , bristol , the temple in london , bewdley . if i make conscience of any thing , it is how i interpret scripture . mr. b. his interpretations of texts in this book are too grosse , as of mat. 28. 19. acts 15. 10. revel . 11. 15. mat. 23. 37. &c. so farre as i am able to discern by his writings , sermons and conference , his skill is better in reasoning and amplifying then interpreting scripture , which i think he had need study better then i can yet perceive he hath done . he takes notice page 191. of an interpretation ( as he is told ) of mine of mat. 11. 28. which he censures for a foule interpretation . he saith , sure it is the guilt of sin , and accusation and condemnation of the law with which persons are said to be weary and heavy laden . but i look for better assurance then mr. bs. word . i confesse i finde nothing in the text for that sense : but the coherence with ver . 25 , 26 , 27. shewes ver . 28. to be an invitation to come to christ as a teacher , and ver . 29. is an expression of the end of coming to him , to take his yoke on them , that is , his doctrine and commands , which is expounded by learning of him : which is confirmed by the motive ver . 30. which is , that his yoke is easie and burden light : which can be understood of no other then his doctrine and commands , parallel to 1 john 5. 3. as our translators , beza , new annot. pareus , piscator , grotius , &c. conceive . and he useth sundry arguments to draw them . 1. from the burdens on them , which i conceive to be rather meant ( the whole context leading thereto ) of such burdens as are mentioned , mat. 23. 3. then of sins which are not named . 2 from his mecknesse and low linesse , such as should be in a teacher , 2 tim. 2. 24. opposed to harshnesse , superciliousnesse , disdaine , &c. which is propounded rather as an encouragement to them to learne his doctrine , then ( as mr. b. and others ) learn to be meek by my example . 3. from the rest they should find : to their soules , contrary to distraction and disquietnesse by pharisaical doctrine . 4. from the ease of his commands , contrary to the rigorous impositions of those doctors . and this interpretation seemes to me to be no foule interpretation , but so faire as that i can discerne no other in the words . sect . iv. mr. bs. citations from my writings advantage him not . after the speech of tertullian he filles a whole page and more with passages out of sundry of my writings , and in the beginning gives this terrible title to them [ mr. tombes self condemnation ] and [ ad hominem ] as if he had an argument from my self against me . the first passage is out of my treatise of scandals pag. 323. where i reckon anabaptists among hereticks and grievous wolves . to which i answer , 1. mr. b. knowes i deny my self to be an anabaptist , though not my own baptisme after believing or baptizing of believers , which christ injoyned me , mat. 28. 19. mark 16. 16. with preaching the gospel : nor doth mr. b. or ever will prove that for this i am to be termed an anabaptist , or that the pretended baptism of infants is a discharge of that duty christ requires of being baptized into his name common to all christians , ephes. 4. 5. 2. mr. b. himself pag. 10. yields me an absolution in these words [ on the one side some think it no lesse then heresie to deny infant-baptism , and to require rebaptizing ; not that the generality of sober divines ( among which i hope mr. b. reckons me ) do so , but for the rest of the errors , which almost ever do accompany it ] which mr. b. might have imagined to have been my mind in the passage he cites , having been my answer in a sermon at bewdley to this very objection of the parson there in the pulpit , of which i can hardly think mr. b. to have been ignorant . other considerations of the time of printing that book might have occasioned m. b. to have put that construction on my words , were he or any of my antagonists willing to give my words or actions their due interpretation . the other passages condemne me not till i be proved an agent for separation , seedesman of tares : which mr. b. cannot prove , though he tells me pag. 188. he hath as good evidence that i am a sect-master as that i am a christian , because i preach , dispute , talke , and endeavor as zealously to promote my opinion as i do for the christian faith. to which i answer , my opinion is no other then the command of christ , and if we speak according to scripture , to preach for baptisme of believers is to preach for christian faith . 2. yet i deny that i preach with a like zeal for that particular point as for greater points of repentance from dead works , & faith towards god in christ incarnate , dead , risen , ascended , to come again , &c. my bewdley auditors besides others will i doubt not witnesse against this calumny . 3. but were it true that i did preach so zealously for my opinion , yet sith my actions tend not to make a party to follow me , but only endeavour to reform a corruption like those our saviour opposeth mat. 23. mark 7. there is no shew of making a sect in my actions , though i were mistaken in them . the passage from the same treatise pa. 103. concerning an hypocrites falling foully , doth not justify his exposition of mat. 7. 16. it proves we oft know an hypocrite by his actions , it is nothing at all to prove a false prophet by his evil manners . the other two passages yield him no advantage for his proving infants disciples from acts 15. 10. but are against him . for his prooflies on this , that the yokew as put on infants , and nothing was put on them but circumcision : but those passages speak of the ordinances of the jewes , and with circumcision all the legal ceremonies . if mr. b. mean more by the yoke , acts 15. 10. as the doctrines and commands , sure the teachers did not put that on them till they taught them , which was not in infancy . and therefore my words will not help him as will appear in the examining his first argument . all hitherto produced by him , though by his placing it in the forefront he seems to have made account of it , is but paper-shot , brutum fulmen , a crack without force . i go on to the epistles . sect . v. mr. b. unduely suggests many things in his epistles . as for the epistle to the people of kederminster , i rejoice with him in their unity , excepting wherein they agree against the truth ; i think if they will use their understandings , as they should , they will find more reason to be unsettled in the point of infant-baptism , by mr. bs. book then to be settled by it , and that they had little cause of a solemne thanksgiving for mr. bs. mannaging the dispute . my exceptions against his aphorismes of justification are communicated to him . i wish his life may continue to gods glory , and the good of his people , and particularly that he may undeceive whom he hath deceived by his dispute and this book . in his epistle to the people of bewdley he mentions a flame of error and discord at bewdley blown by my breath , and that he came to quench it by the importunity of their magistrate , minister , and many of their people . and his words are often enforced with such aggravating expressions , as make people specially afarre off imagine , that at bewdley there is a great schisme and discord made by my preaching ; whereas there was no such discord as i know of : yea i think afore the dispute the godly did walk together in publique hearing , publique and private prayer , and conference while i was with them and since , as lovingly as in any other places . and though all do not joine in breaking of bread , some going to the parson , others declining him as a stranger to the private meetings of the godly , and an adversary to such godly preachers as from time to time they had gotten for the chappel , and a temporizer with the kings party while the town was under their power went to mr. b. to kederminster , others being baptized have joined with me : yet all of them meet together for repetition and conference , and when i am with them i think in greater number then in my absence , and do embrace my doctrine with lesse breaking out into antinomian , familistical , ranting errors or practises then at kederminster . the discord of most note hath been between two men and their wives , who were by consent or connivence of their husbands baptized , and brake bread with us , till mr. bs. book came forth : which charging us with schism for reforming our selves , and affrighting people with the danger of our way as leading to error they are kept from our society ; which is a manifest separation to avoid an imaginary , of which mr. b. is the chief author ; and i may truly say if there be any such flame of discord at bewdley , as mr. b. meanes , it is blown by mr. bs. breath , not mine , who am conscious to my self of being as studious of unity ( as i can , with preservation of truth . as for my kindling errour ) i fear i have done lesse then i should have done , not meddling with the point of antipaedobaptisme , but as it fell in my way in my cursory exposition on gen. 17. wherein i only vindicated my self from mr. robert bayly his false criminations of me about the covenant there , and overthrew the suppositions of paedobaptists from thence about the covenant and initial seale , and once or twice more on the by , till by occasion of the motioned dispute between me and mr. b. i saw it was fit i should in some sermons open the controversy , which was not till decemb. 1649. presently after which my return to lemster was concluded . the magistrate a stranger to the meetings of the godly in their houses , the minister ( such as he is ) for his credit , and others of somewhat a like stamp it is likely did invite mr. b. to oppose me as they had done their schoole master to make use of their abilities to uphold their dagon of infant-sprinking : but mr. bs. abuse of scriptures so palpably impertinent , his mannaging the dispute with reasonings of wit , and other camal waies do assure me he had no call from god. his alleadging gal. 2. 11 , 14. to justifie his sharpnesse in dealing with me is invalid to that end there being no such dissimulation used by me , nor error maintained by me ; mr. bs. opinion comes neerer peters judaizing then mine . sect . vi. the chief points of mr. bs. book are very briefly touched . the chief points in mr. bs. book he would have observed , in their places shall be ( god willing ) fully examined : for the present only thus much . my confession that all should be admitted church-members by baptisme , was meant of such as by their profession are visible , not of such as are visible in mr. bs. way without profession . the repeal of the law or ordinance for infants visible church-membership will be easily proved when the law or ordinance is shewed . as yet i can find no such law or ordinance save what is injoyned concerning circumcision ; which if it stand in force , we must keep the whole law , gal. 5. 3 his first challenge is answered by another challenge to shew what one church had infants visible church-members besides the jewes . his second is answered by shewing till abrahams time there is nothing said about any church-frame ; from abrahams time till christs the jewish church-frame stood : in christs time and the apostles no other are reckoned to belong to the visible church , then professors of faith . and so it continued till infants were admitted to baptism to save them , which out of the case of danger of present dying was disswaded by tertullian and gregory nazianzen . afterwards their baptisme was more frequent through austins urging it so much against the pelegians , as strabo rightly observed long since , & together with it infant-communion was common , yet not without the continuance of the old form of putting the question to infants , after which at first profession was declared , & catechizing mostly afore they were baptized at certain seasons of the year till ignorance and confusion overspread the churches . but when god began to stirre up any to reform other corruptions , there were that sought to reform this 500. years ago , according to truth , notwithstanding mr. bs. mr. ms. or doctor ushers allegations : of whom i perswade my self many may be met with in heaven notwithstanding m. bs. confident expressions to the contrary . yet were all mr. b. sayes true , if i put mr. b. to the like , as to shew me since the apostles , one that questioned keeping of an easter , lent fast , infant-communion , monkish profession , &c. till the last age he will be hard put to it . his considerations depend upon the points in dispute : in examining of which it may appear how frivolous his questions are . infants church-membership i find no where but in the peculiar national policy of the jewes , no universal law or ordinance , for it ; the jewish policy is taken away both de facto by the providence of god , and de jure of right by the declaration of christ and his apostles in the n. t. and by altering the way of church-gathering and constitution . the jewes were hainously offended at the taking away of circumcision , not because he took away churchmembership of infants , but because of the taking away of the law of moses , the temple , priesthood , &c in which they gloried , acts 21. 20 , 21. acts 6. 13 , 14. if it be true , that it was a known trueth , that infants were visihle church-members , and to be admitted disciples , and the apostles did not admit them , mat. 19. 13 ( which mr. b. supposeth ) then the challenge is answered , name me away from the creation till 200. years age , who did once question infants church-membership ? for after mr. bs. dictates the apostles did so . let men turne over their bibles , they will finde enough in them against infants visible church-membership in the n. t. he askes , why the speech , marke 16. 16. which excludes infants from baptisme , should not also exclude them from salvation for want of believing ? to which i answer , it is not doubted but that infants belong to the invisible kingdome of the elect rom. 9. 11. mat. 19. 14. but how they attain salvation is not so certain : if by a seed of faith or holinesse without actual exercise , the thing is more easie to conceive : if by actual exercise extraordinarily and immediately wrought by the holy spirit , then the speeches , he that believeth not , shall be damned , and the like , do exclude infants from salvation if not believing actually ; if by vertue of election without any work on them , if by vertue of the covenant their parents believing ( which some assert , but i professe to know no such covenant ) then the speeches , he that believeth not , shall be damnned , with the like , must be understood with this limitation , he of those to whom the gospel is preached that believeth not shall be damned . for my part , i do much in cline to that opinion , which conceives marke 16. 16. john 3. 18. and such like , to be understood of belief & unbelief of those of years , who have the gospel preached to them because the course of the context leads thereto . which being premised , i answer to the question , that infants are excluded from baptisme from mat. 28. 19. marke 16. 15 , 16. compared together , because these texts shew that according to christs institution , they that are to be baptized are to be disciples or known professed believers , and baptisme belongs onely to whom christ appoints it . yet these texts do not exclude infants from salvation , because either it excludes professed unbelievers , not non-believers negatively from incapacity , or it excludes unbelievers that are in no sort believers , neither in the seed nor fruite , neither byordinary , nor by extraordinary operation ; in one of which wayes infants are or may be believers , and so not excluded by that text , if belief and unbelief comprehend all these wayes in that place . to his question , what great comfort would follow this conclusion [ that all your infants are out of christs visible church ] that men should bend their wits so to prove it ? i answer , the question might be retorted , what great comfort would follow this conclusion [ that all our infants are by nature children of wrath ] that men should bend their wits so to prove it ? 2. the answer i suppose mr. b. would give to the one will fit us , that whether it be matter of comfort or discomfort , we must maintain truth . to another passage of his supposing , that to be visibly in the church is all one as ( to our judgement ) to belong to christs kingdome , i answer by denying it , and doubt not to shew how this mistake hath much misled mr. b. when i examine the 27. chap. of the first part of his book . we can prove that christ will save his elect though no christians in appearance , nor disciples by profession , nor visibly subjects of his kingdome . mr. b. talkes vainly of the judgements of gods ministers and churches in all ages of the world , when as their judgement is proved by my writings to have been , and to be at this day so various about infant-baptisme ; i have little hope to conceive mr. b. by my writings , which he sleights so much as to say , that the best part of my bookes is ink and paper . men not inferiour to mr. b. and one i am sure farre beyond mr. b. in disputes , judged otherwise . were not mr. b. mounted to an height of disdainful pride , me thinks he might have spied the clearing of some scriptures , and other things more worth then the ink and paper . it is his uncharitable conceit of me , if he imagine i write to have the last word : it is to shew his grosse a buse of scripture , and his fallacies of reasoning . if he out-live this answer i now am making , any time he may have the last word if he will for me , who am weary with meddling with such a distemper'd writer . i blame not mr. b. for printing : but for printing my answers afore i had fitted them to his arguments in writing , as doctor rainolds dealt with hart , which ( saith he in his preface to his conference with hart ) learned men have thought to be most fit for trial of truth , not by extemporal speaking , but writing with advise the question argued of , the arguments , the answers , the replies set down , and sifted of both sides till each had fully said ; in fine , the whole published , that the churches and the faithfull all may judge of it . such a rule was followed also in the conference at the hague , and in all other profitable colloquies about points in controversie ; to all which mr. bs. dealing with me hath bin altogether unlike . nor is he excused by telling me he had a copy of my sermon , and had conference with me . for besides other exceptions this excuse takes not away , it is very apparent that neither in the dispute nor in that conference his judgement about infants discipleship and church-visibility , and other points in his book could be discerned so as to know determinately what to oppose . which makes me glad of the publishing of his book however , though for the present i suffer much by it , nothing doubting but i shall be able to shew the wickednesse of his writing , so as that all that are willing may see , that whosoever leanes on his arguments to justifie their infant-baptisme , rests on a broken reed that will run into his hands . sect . vii . many personall occurrences are cleered by relating of which mr. b. hath in his history sought to create prejudice against me . next to the two epistles followes the history , in which his designe seemes to be to vindicate himself from my accusations , and to recriminate me . i shall here very briefly answer him about personal matters in the history and elsewhere , that the readers may onely have to do with arguments , and answers when they come to them . he spends some leaves to prove he did not incosiderately and rashly take up his opinion , as i accuse him . whereas i do not remember , that any where i accuse him of rashnesse , but antidote sect . 7. of inconsideratenesse and haste in that passage wherein he names anabaptists in the plural , meaning me onely . which whether he did or no it 's not material : nor worth while to make reply to the descant of his corrective on that passage in my antidote . the next thing in his history to which i am to answer is , that he chargeth me with both there , and in his answer to my valedictory oration page 209 , 210. with falsehood , in telling them in the pulpit , that i could never know his arguments till the dispute , that he hid his weapons till he meant to strike , that i was set upon at a sudden , that i had the arguments concealed from me aforehand : the contrary whereof was manifest in that he had urged the same argument at col. taylors house in london , that i bad seen some notes of his in which the first was that which he urged at the dispute , and therefore that i spake not truth , and it 's an evidence his arguments are good in that i gave such feeble answers to them . to which i say , i do not think i said i could never know his arguments till the dispute : i confesse the conference at col. taylors house 1646. and the reading of his arguments ( as was said ) 1647. but the conference being not written , nor the notes then in my hand , there were left onely some imperfect and obscure apprehensions of them in me , which in respect of giving a distinct answer were all one as if i knew them not at all : by reason of which i was very desirous to get his arguments in writing , that i might be the better able to answer them , and satisfie others ; which mr. b. not yielding to , i could not give answer , but on the sudden without premeditation the arguments being gone from me , like nehuchad-nezzars dream , and i did imagine , and accordingly used these words in a letter , it was said , you would hide your weapon till you were to use it ; in which opinion his taking hold of so many indirect ways for advantages to possesse mens minds with his opinion , and to hinder a free examination of what is said on both sides do confirme me . and that things may be apprehended nakedly as they were , i do acknowledge , that it is my disposition , be it dulnesse or wearinesse , to pause on a new argument whether in reading or conference , so that i cannot oft-times give a clear answer to an argument i have not bin used to on a sudden , no nor many times to an argument i have been versed in , when it is not under my eye , when other matters possesse my memory , when fear of speaking ineptly doth benumme me and hinder my elocution , when i have some obscure notion of a fallacy which at present i cannot readily discover . which knowledge of my self made me unwilling to come to a publick dispute or extemporal conference with mr. b. whom i had found in conferences i had with him to be quick in apprehension and expression , various and copious in multiplying arguments and expressions , captious of advantages , ready to expose even to contempt , with shew of disdain , those that speak not according to his mind , which made me conceive i should neither well remember , nor weigh his arguments afore i must answer , nor clear truth , nor satisfie my self or others , but occasion glorying in mr. b. and settling people in his error . neverthelesse presaging by his declining to argue by writing and his words in his letter sept. 6. [ if i should refuse a conference ( called before an open verbal dispute ) on such advantages i should think it were almost to yield my cause naught ] that it would be taken as if i did confesse i could not answer him , after much endeavour in vain to get his arguments in writing that i might consider of them before the dispute , i yielded to be ready to justifie my doctrine openly or privately by word or writing , as should be judged convenient . whereupon mr. b. having drawn me to agree upon jan. 1. 1649 without any agreement about stating the question , order or rules of the dispute , notaries on both sides to set down what was said people being gathered together from other places by his party , and a place in state prepared for him with his abettors , schollers and others on both sides him , i my self alone without any notary or assistant was forced to answer him prepared in this unexpected manner , lest i should have endammaged the cause by seeming tergiversation ; yet presuming that i should have found such dealing after by communicating to me in writing his arguments afore printing , or at lest forbearing to print my answers till i had viewed and rectified them , that might have repaired what seeming disadvantage the truth had by my present answers : in which i found my selfe extreamly deceived , my motion of having his arguments in writing after the dispute being answered by quarrelling with me about things on the by , and in a subdolous and indirect way filling the land with conceits as if his tenet and arguments were unanswerable , and i a person pertinarious without reason . by this true relation the truth of my intimation of the suddenness of the assault , my ignorance of his arguments , my speeches concerning his concealing his arguments , provoking me to dispute are verified , the reasons of my desiring his arguments in writing , the cause of varying my answers at the dispute , and why to so weake arguments no fuller answers were then given , and why i said at bewdley ( which i still think ) i preached nothing but truth to them , are assigned : about all which mr. b. hath endeavoured to misrepresent me and my proceedings in his history of the conception of his treatise . as for mr. bs. inclination now to think me a very proud man however he thought heretofore , and that i have higher thoughts of my self then was meete , because of my dissent from so many churches and god'y divines , and because of my answer in private to him about the reason i gave why the error of infant-baptisme being easie to be discerned was not discerned through wilfulnesse or negligence , i say 1. my dissent is not singular , nor my reasons and writings such but that such a one as my self might be allowed to hold my tenet without imputations of selfe-conceitednesse , arrogance , &c. mr. b. varies from churches and learned men about justification and faith in his aphorismes : what he can say for himself why he should not be censured as he censures me may perhaps be my plea. i cannot alter my own judgement or others but by arguments , nor dare i say i do see what i do not . 2. as for my speech in private ( which me thinks it was somewhat against the lawes of friendship for him thus to publish ) i know not what better answer yet to give , but to ascribe it to prejudice , or faction or some such like cause that men are so wilful or negligent as not to examine and discerne the errour of infant-baptism so manifestly discernable by applying to it their own rules and positions in reformation of popish and prelatical corruptions . and i do conceive the same or like answer would be given about the lutherans holding consubstantiation , images to be retained in temples , ubiquity of christs body , conditional predestination , and sundry the like tenets : which may be a just censure without pride . that which mr. b. saies , [ and lest my touching that controversy though at a distance might irritate him to fall upon it , i never spake one word ( to my best remembrance ) in my congregation of it to this day , for fear of giving any occasion of difference page 209. i never preached one sentence before the dispute , nor since to his hearers or mine that i can remember on the question . page 281. i never spake one word against his opinion in my pulpit to this day ] shewes his memory retaines not all he printed in his saints everlisting rest , preached on the lecture-dayes at kederminster . as page 534. we should see the promises made good to our seed , and the unthankful anabaptists , that will not confesse , that the children of the saints are any nearer to god or more beholding to him then pagans , so much as for the favour to be visible churchmembers , should by sweet experience be convinced of their errour , and be taught better how to understand that all our children are holy . page 518. he calls the disputes about baptism perverse and fierce , which did so directly touch the controversy as might irritate me to fall on it at bewdley , and make those that told me think he did gird at me , which he denies pag. 166. he mentions a speech of mine to mr. d. whom he terms a godly man [ that truth is not to be suspended for peace ] and saith , when the times changed ( which his words page 220. interpret to be meant , when the ordinance against heresies and errors ceased to be in force ) i spake against infant-sprinkling , prest them to be baptized again , mentioned in sermons mr. m. mr. blake , and himself , when my doctrine prevailed not ( though since i have gotten above 20. rebaptized disciples , whom i often visit and confirm ) that i charged them with hypocrisy , with their blood on their heads , that m. ms. plea from circumcision for infant-baptism is heresie , that by my definition of heresy independants must be judged hereticks , that i sought his arguments in writing to put them in my review of the dispute with mr. m. and to ing age him in the controversy ; whence he gathered i was unpeaceable , set to carry on my opinion , and to make my self a party . to all this i reply . 't is true some conceiving mr. b. in his speeches had a fling at me , and it seeming likely to me , i did speak to the purpose mr. b. saies i did , not imagining that a speech upon a conference in a shop without its limitations and cautions should have been ( as it is by mr. b. ) published and refuted as my error : but indeed willing only that mr. b. should know , that in my case i was not to suspend my asserting of truth for fear of losing of peace , as i alleadge in my apology sect . 3. and i professe i wonder that such as mr. m. mr. b. and others that were so earnest against bishops and ceremonies though warres did follow , and had a great hand in putting them on , should now , the warres being so well abated , be so impatient that infant-sprinkling is questioned . it is untruely surmifed that the change of times was the cause of my opening my self fully in the congregation at bewdley . my first meddling with it was when mr. bayly had so unjustly charged me in his anabaptisme chap. 4. page 92. with spoiling infants of all interest in the covenant of grace , making circumcision a seale to the jewes only of earthly priviledges , denying to the jewish infants all right to the covenant till in their riper years they become actual believers . which with other fals accusations about twenty in that one page i intreated by letter my dear father-in-law mr. henry scudder to advertise him of : after that i might stand right in the thoughts of that worthy man mr. william hopkins of bewdley ( now with god ) i shewed him how he wronged me , and then cleared my self in my cursory exposition on ger. 17. brought his book with me into the pulpit , and read a passage of mr. ms. defence part . 3. page 98. for my vindication , which was presently sent up to london . but mr. bayly doing nothing to right me , i wrote to mr. bayly , and because mr. rutherford had my letter to send to him , i wrote since to him to know what became of my letter , but have had no answer . after this i was moved to preach what i did ( which was but little till december 1649. ) when i found my tenet on the day of fast to be humbled for blasphemies and heresies ( which was as i remember march 10. 1649. ) reckoned as by others so by mr. obadiah sedgewick in his sermon before the lords among heresies , ( with which i found afterwards the censure of 52. ministers about london to concurre stigmatizing me by name as holding four pernicious errors in my examen ) and when the ordinance against blasphemy and heresie was published ; which mr. boraston though not required , yet published at ribsford ( to which bewdley chappel relates ) that he might proclaime me an heretick . which necessitated me to speak what i did , not the change of times ( it 's known i spake as much in the hardest times to my opinion as since ) nor unpeaceablenesse in me , as mr. b. surmised . what i preached was in no clamourous manner ( as mr. b. would intimate , calling it exclaiming ) but in a way of proof and answer as sober divines do in the like case . my na ming any was when i recited their words : for which though i was reviled once in london when refuting doctor crisp i named him , and mr. b. in a letter to me , and since in print reckons as no small fault , yet i ever did , and do still think it to be necessary , when the books are in mens hands , and the auditors are not likely otherwise to know we recite their opinion truly , nor whose error we refute . i do not believe i used those words mr. b. sets down as mine [ let them budge at it , &c. ] though it 's likely i might say , it 's one of the chiefest signes of sincerity to embrace every truth , and hypocrisy not to receive it for carnal respects ; not out of anger that men were not of my mind , but to justify my self after i had fully handled the point about baptism ( which i think was either after or immediately before the dispute ) i used the apostles words , act. 20. 26 , 27. nor do i deny that sith our lord christ doth , mark 16. 16. make baptisme some condition of salvation , i think those that are taught that infant-sprinkling is not the duty christ requires of being baptized , and that water baptisme of men at years upon profession of faith is a necessary duty ( which i had sufficiently proved at bewdley ) and yet neglect it , do hazzard their salvation living in disobedience to a manifest duty , yea the prime duety whereby they ought solemnly to engage themselves to be christs disciples . i have gotten no disciples to me , and though more then 20 in bewdley have bin baptized after profession of faith since my removal from them ( whom with the whole town i think my self bound by many ties as often as i may to visit and confirm ) yet not rebaptized . it is true to shew how unreasonable the accusation of my tenet as heresy is , i have sundry times said that mr. ms. position in his sermon page 35. [ that all gods commands and institutions about the sacraments of the jewes bind us as much as they did them , in all things which belong to the substance of the covenant , and were not accidentall unto them ] is one of the most manifest heresies being condemned , acts 15. for it expressely asserts that the gentile christians are still bound to some rule of circumcision , contrary to the apostles determination . nor did i frame a definition of heresie to make good what i said of mr. ms. tene , though i deny not the definition i gave with some explication of my meaning : of which what mr. b. hath in his corrective page 259 , 260. is not much short . mr. bs. inference thereupon that by my definition independents are heretick , followes not . for though they erre , yet that they make a party for their error is unknown to me : although weary of alteration with mr. b. as acquainted with his temper i replyed not . if i desired mr. bs. animadversions on my writings , that i might see all worth answering and put it in my review , it was no more unreasonable in me to desire then in mr. b. to desire the like afore his reprinting his aphorismes , nor any more folly in him to have gratifyed me then , then in othersto gratifie him with the like ; but had been a very friendly & neighbourly part in him to one , who was very glad to gratify him or his neighbours in any thing meet for me , as i deny not ( excepting this ) he and his neighbours were to gratify me . after his denial of his animadversions i think i came to his lecture sundry times though not so often as formerly , because of my much absence from bewdley . to conclude , mr. b. found me not adverse to the churches peace , but only his uncharitable surmises imagined me so . and i desire the reader to take notice that in all this he chargeth me with , there is no one act of separation from whence he should conclude so hardly of me as he doth . sect . viii . more personal matters which the history of mr. b. hath made crooked are set straight the next part of the history is about the occasion and mannaging of the dispute , to most of which an answer may be gathered out of my letter to him sept. 10. of which so much as is needful is printed at the end of this writing . to call being baptized in the name of christ apostasie , contrary to the ancients language , and in effect to call white black . divisions that happen , if the saddle be put on the right horse , are to be charged on them that oppose the reformation of the corruption of infant-sprinkling . i think i answered mr. bs. letter sufficiently in mine of sept. 10. 1649. if i had a designe to answer his arguments in my review it had been an honest designe , and hansomer then mr. bs. printing my answers to his arguments afore he had them from me in writing . sith mr. b. is unwilling to be put in the crowd among the rest he shall have an answer ( so far as it is fit ) by himself , that he may not complain of being sleighted by being yoked with the vulgar . my dealings with mr. m. were such as none can justly expcept against . personal things were fully answered in my apology : the dispute it self at large i reserved for the review : onely sect . 15. i gave arguments to prove rom. 11. 17. &c. to be meant of ingrasfing by giving faith into the invisible church , and sect . 16 , 17. pointed at some of the chief things wherein mr. ms. d●fence was defective . i professed not a full answer to mr. blake , but gave short advertisements in my postscript with reasons why i did so , which i yet count sufficient for answer to that piece , however mr. b. imagine of it . i slubber'd over nothing ( as mr. b. and one mr. george milward in a letter to one capt. freema charge me ) . if i do not write so quick as m. b. mr. m. &c. it is from my unsettled condition , ministeriall imployments , the multitude of them that write against me , though i earnestly intreated that i might see the strength of all together , ( which motion had been fit for them that were desirous to have truth take place , and not make use of advantages to hinder the cleering of it ) the difficulty and charge of printing , which mr. b. can easily perhaps have done , people being averse from the truth i hold , and willing to sell or buy or reade any thing against me , but not what is for me . that in my sermons at bewdley i culled out the weakest arguments , is most false : to the best of my skill i produced the best arguments i met with in their strength , and as much as i could in the authors words . mr. cobbets book being a loose discourse for the most part , having many passages , and expressions proper to the way of n. e. filled with dictates unproved , much of it against f. s. h. d. &c. whose speeches and arguments i am not engaged to maintain , i do not bind my self to answer . if i might be allowed to passe my judgement freely , notwithstanding mr. cottons , mr. thomas goodwins , and mr. bs. conceits of it , i should say , that i do not perceive in the matter of it any such strength as needs much answering , and that the method and expressions are such as that it cannot well be answered without lopping off many superfluous branches , enquiring into his meaning in many of his expressions which are cloudy ( which would be extreamly tedious to the answerer and reader , and liable to much exception ) and reducing it into a more scholastical forme ; were it by himself shaped into a succinct treatise like mr. nortons to apollonius , and should be willng to answer it , if i found any thing in it , which i had not answered before : but i would not have the reader expect me to answer that again , which in some of my writings is formerly answered , and in which he might by reading heedfully satisfie himself : yet i did answer the chief of his arguments in those sermons , and i intend to answer what else i meet with in them , that is opposed to my examen , and what ever else i shall conceive is necessary to be answered . i little expected to satisfie mr. b. who i found had prejudice in him , which was not denied by him . mr. bs. name was used with respect onely in citing his words in his aphorismes , which i never dreamt would be taken for an injury . his censuring mens writings and confuting them in pulpit without naming them or citing their words as it is lesse offensive , so it is lesse edifying . mr. bs. prosperity and my conceived failings at the dispute ( which will appear to be mr. bs. mistakes in the answer of his arguments in print ) were ordered by the almighties providence for humbling me , and discovery of mr. bs. spirit then ( which must be refereed to the judgement of the hearers ) and since ( which readers may perceive ) yet i hope according to the strange-windings of his providence , as in josephs case , for the advancement of the truth he opposeth . the ministers about mr. b. at the dispute were all of mr. bs. party sent for up and down all the countrey , such as they were , if they may be reputed ministers , or men that mind the things of christ : of whom no marvel mr. b. was cried up , i taunted with dulnesse , it serving for their ends to keep up their esteeme : one or two of better account sate further off , yet of mr. bs. judgement . that i did not bearken to mr. borastons motion for mr. bs. preaching , it was because i knew it would be likely to stirre up passion , and settle prejudice in the people ( in which i find by that he hath printed chap. 1. 2. especially in the very beginning i was not mistaken ) and i hoped to bring the dispute to writing , which is the best way to clear truth , and i suspected ( as i had cause ) mr. borastons and the then magistrates , and those reputed godly persons devices and motions , which were then by many conceived to be contrived for the parsons endes , the continuing his power and profits by keeping up that rite which ingratiates the profane and formal persons to him . whereunto that mr. b. hath been subservient is the grief of many , and might well befit mr. b. to repent of . when i saw i could not get mr. bs. arguments in writing , i got what notes i could of the dispute from others writing or my own memory ; and knowing that vauntes were given out of mr. bs. victory , i did as well as i could summe up his arguments , and answer them jan. 20. and after went to him upon his motion jan. 25. to confer with him , which was friendly on both sides ; yet that which i hoped and i conceived he promised , that though he would not send me his arguments in writing ( which i again moved ) yet he would transcribe them for such as should come to him to be resolved in that point , after sundry puttings off was not obtained : but instead thereof in march the weeke afore i removed from bewdley i met with the passage in his epistle dedicatory to the people of kederminster , to which i after opposed my valedictory oration in bewdley chappel march. 17. 1649. and printed the same in effect in my antidote in may following . now mr. b. alleadgeth he had reason for his not sending his arguments to me to keep me from erring they being not desired , for my self , but my people , i remained very confident of my self , that when i sent to him i heap'd so many untruths about matters of fact i knew , that he durst not answer me lest the very naming my untruths might cause me to say , he reproached or railed , that his conference was with me in private , because he thought my pride of spirit would not permit me to confesse truth openly , that he wrote the passage in his epistle to kederminster out of zeale for god , compassion to mens souls , my opinion and preaching being like to do more hurt against the church of god , then drunkards and whoremongers , and therefore he had cause to be bitter in his writing . to all which speeches i reply , he had reason to conceive i desired satisfaction for my self by my desiring his animadversions , and by my letter to him sept. 10. if not , yet to have given them in writing , which he had as he saies before , at coventrey preached and were ready by him , had been a neighbourly part to men that were his frequent hearers . but his prejudice against my opinion and uncharitable conceit of my pride ( as heretofore mr. m. and mr. ley interpreted my most equal motion in humility of spirit in the end of my examen to be the challenge of a braving goliath , so now any opposing what 's determined by synods and leading writers must be condemned as comming from pride ) are a sufficient reason not to gratify me , but to do what he can against me , and this must be counted zeale for god , and his insolent bitternesse justifiable , as being in pretence against a pernicious sin not yet proved , but indeed against a truth discovering an error , whereby the prime ordinance of christianity is miserably corrupted . he speaks of a fearful passion a feaver of passion i was in when i first read the passage in his epistle against anabaptists , such as he would not be infor all my revenues , if i had not a free vent for my spleen in pulpit and presse he doubts it might have spoiled me . 't is true when i first read it unexpectedly in mr. ds. house , i was stirred in my spirit out of the sense of the wrong done to me and the truth by it , and not meeting with the book before , i wrote out the passage : but that by word or carriage i shewed such passion as he speaks of i am certain is his tale-tellers addition , whose conscience may perhaps one day tell him of his ill offices in opposing truth , and nourishing differences between me and mr. b. mr. b. hath a jerke at my revenues , by which he would have the world believe it is very great , and such as were desirable for himself : whereas his outward estate considering his being an unplundered , or not much plundered single young man heir of a good estate in land , besides his sequestration is more likely to suffice his uses then my estate my uses , though i blesse god it is better with me through the favour of some eminent persons sensible of my hard usuage , then it would have been if the party opposite to me had prevailed , and i could reasonably hope ; when for no other cause but the publishing of my examen my remove from the temple in londen with my wife and children above a hundred miles in the middest of winter was necessitated . not content with this jerke about my revenewes page 202. he tells me in print of being parson of rosse , vicar of lemster , preacher of bewdley , master of the hospital of ledbury , besides meanes of my own , and yet complaining of want i and my family might be put to in my bookes , and he addes , you made so light of having no lesse then four market-townes to lie on your shoulders as if it were nothing , and then sath pious sober men think it his duty to say what he did . to which i reply . mr. m. is taken for a pious sober man , yet in his defence of his sermon page 3. he accused me most deeply of a socianian plot of questioning all conclusions inferr'd by consequence from scripture ; the injury of which i shewed in my apology sect . 11. yea his own words in his defence pag. 205. you neither there nor here deny this argument from a consequence to be sufficient for practice of some things in the worship of god , which are not expressely laid down in the n. t. refute this calumny , yet to this day i never found that he did any thing to right me . the like may i say of mr. robert baillee of glasgow in scotland notwithstanding his false criminations before mentioned , and my writing to him about them . how mr. geree used me is shewed in my apology sect . 6. yet his vindiciae vindiciarum was presently after published without any shew of remorse of conscience for what he did . and now mr. b. tells me , pious and sober men advise him to say that which as he puts it down is false and exceeding injurious to me , to wit , that i had foure market-townes on my shoulders , which every one will interpret to be 4. beneficial places under my charge together , besides meanes of my own , and yet complain in my bookes of want i and my family may be put to . whereas the truth is , there are no words that have a shew of complaint ( which yet indeed are not querulous but onely narrative ) but those in the close of my examen and apology , and neither of them , when i enjoyed any thing at lemster , bewdley , rosse or ledbury ; but the former was anno 1644. when all my estate was in the enemies power , and my small stipend at eanchurch withdrawn by reason of my not practising infant-baptisme ; the other when i was to leave the temple for publishing my examen anno 1646. when the counties to which i had relation , were but newly reduced to the obedience of the parliament . and then i assayed to returne to lemster , where i had been almost totally plundred anno 1642. and yet so great was the antipathy of some men against me , that i could neither get reparation for my losses , nor allowance for building the ministers house , nor any augmentation , but onely kept the bare title till the end of the year 1649. 't is true some pittying my condition gave me the rent of the rectory of rosse anno 1646. which having a vicar endowed , and the rectory leased out with the rectors house , they gave it me with expectation of preaching only some sermons there as i could ; but being invited to bewdley i accepted of the invitation , and though the maintenance were but finall , and the years dear , and my charges great in refurnishing my house and study , yet i rested contented therewith till the deane and chapter of worcesters landes being to be sold , out of which the best part of my maintenance did arise , the providence of god cast on me the mastership of the hospital of ledbury , which doth not tie me to the charge of soules , much lesse puts the market-towne on my shoulders . and then presently i yielded up my interest in rosse though some of the godly there were very unwilling i should . and when my pay ended at bewdley the lord opened a way for my returne to lemster , and provision was made for me there . by which it may appear , that it is most injuriously suggested as if i had 4. beneficial places together , yea 4. market-townes on my shoulders , and those that know not the truth imagine me very covetous , and my revenues very great , not knowing my condition what it is and what my losses have been . me thinks when the people of bewdley , rosse , lemster , were all satisfied ( so farre as i could discerne ) with the equity of my actions , mr. b. and those other he meanes might have been so likewise , and possibly had been an assembly-man it would have beene no disparagement to me to have been a master of a house in the university , to have had a lecture at london , a sequestration or presentation in the countrey , besides pay for sitting in the assembly at the same time : but might have in mr. bs. bookes bin stiled neverthelesse a learned , holy , experimental , iudicious , humble , heart-piercing preacher . i cannot but be sensible of the great wrong i receive in my name , and perhaps in my estate by mr. bs. calumnies ; and therefore am necessitated to write this which i conceive had been fitter for private audience . i do not take on me to know mr. bs. heart : but i wish mr. b. would consider of what spirit he was , when he vented his jerk at my revenues , and whether the phrases of offering a sacrifice to mars , and keeping holy-daies for killing the saints in his epistle to the people of kederminster likely is a most profane , and bitter passage . his quip . pag. 67. members of this kingdome , or ( to please you ) common-wealth pag. 136. of baptizing naked maides in bewdley pag. 245. your feete will take cold or your heart heat , &c. savour not more of an heathen satyrists vain wit , then a christian preachers zealours spirit . he saith that he perceives by one passage in my antidote pag. 21. i am offended at him for diminishing my esteeme : for i complain , &c. but the words there are no complaint , and if i imagined amisse i am sorry that i did so surmise . sect . ix . in my alleading peter de bruis and others as antipaedobaptists 500. years ago , is no untruth . but there is a foule sin mr. b. chargeth me with when he saith in his history my reports are untruths , and page 176. he chargeth me with very many palpable grosse untruths which i either knew or might to be so . two he hath selected as most remarkable : the first is , that the lying papists do accuse the albigenses and waldenses ( our first reformers ) to be witches , buggerers , sorcerers , and to deny infant-baptisme , &c. now what doth mr. t. but perswade the world , that the papists accusations of these were true in this , &c. is it railing to say , that this dealing is starke brazen-faced and unconscionable : and after he stiles it horrible foulnesse of dealing with other words , he that dare do thus what dare he not ? &c. and page 201. a most unconscionable jesuitical trick to seduce poor ignorant soules . to which i answer , my words examen part . 2. sect . 2. tend to prove , that there were some that opposed infant-baptisme 500. years ago , who were both godly men , and had godly societies joined with them : nor do i see cause to recede from the same opinion notwithstanding what either doctor usher , mr. m. or mr. b. have said to the contrary . i do no where charge the waldenses , but onely cite in my examen part . 2. sect . 2. cassanders , and osianders words in my exercit . of the albigenses . but let us consider what is brought to the contrary , 1. for berengarius , deodrinus , leodiensiis took it up as a common fame . 2. it is not found charged in synods against him . 3. that it appears to doctor usher , they who were charged in those dayes to hold that baptisme did not profit to salvation held nothing but this , that baptisme doth not conferre grace by the work wrought . yet durandus leodicensis in the 3d. tome of the bibliothica patrum the last book in his epistle to henry king of france makes it such a fame as filled all their eares , praiseth the king of france for calling a councel against him and bruno by reason of it . nor are doctor ushers words as mr. m. recites them , that it appeared to him , but nec aliud videntur negavisse , &c. which is lesse then to say it appeared to him . and for his conjecture it may be answered by another conjecture , that it seems rather berengarius did at first discerne the vanity of infants baptisme as arising from austins errour about the necessity of it , and not much used till after his daies : yet finding the opposition of the corporal presence in the eucharist too hard a businesse being forced to recant by pope nicholas , it 's likely he concealed his opinion of infant-baptisme ; to which conjecture cassanders conceit in his preface to the duke of gulick and cleve before his testimonies for infant-baptisme is somewhat like , that though he overthrew baptism of little ones , yet he brought it not into publique , because as guitmund saies , he knew , that the eares of the worst men would not brook that blasphemy . i also related a speech of the same cassander concerning the albigenses , besides which in my exercitation i alleadged the words of lucas osiander accusing the albigenses as agreeing with anabaptists . and to shew that there was some reason for what i averred , to wit that there were others that made head against infant-baptisme before baltasar pacimontanus , i alleadged bernard serm. 66. in cantica . epis. 240. to hildefonsus earle of st. giles , petrus cluniacensis his epistle to three bishops of france , and in my antidote sect . 9. eckbertus schovangiensis his seventh sermon adversus catharos in auctario biblioth . patrum tom . 2. against these allegations mr. m. excepts and mr. b. le ts flie at me as before : neither deny that i rightly cite the authors . but 1. that the authors were lying papists . 2. that no impartial authors so charge them . 3. that they did bely them in other things 4 that upon report these with other things were charged on them . 5. that the councels charge them not with this . 6. that other historians charge not the waldenses . 7. that their confessions acquit them . 8. that i do but joine with malicious papists to take up any the falsest slander to defend my cause by it . for answer hereto i will not return railing for railing , but this i say and leave it to indifferent men ( if there be any ) to judge between us whether of us be in the right . cassander was never accounted , that i ever read , one of those railing lying papists mr. b. mentions ; but as impartial a man as any papist living in his time . maximilian the second emperour who favoured protestants more then any emperour prized him . his study was reconciliation and a middle way , which mr. b. professeth to be his . mr. b. page 261. saith , he spake the best of all parties that he might displease none . bernard is by mr. b. himself page 265. stiled a pious man. petrus cluniacensis was though a zealous papist , yet thought fit by illyricus to be reckoned among witnesses of truth in his catalogue . they are as impartial authors ( specially bernard ) as that age yielded ; if these be not taken for witnesses of things in their times , i know not how protestants will make up their catalogue of witnesses for them in all ages . protestant writers do frequently alledge these very authors for other things . mornay in his mysterie of iniquity progress . 46. cites these very writings against papists . i conceive mr. m. mr. b. think they said true , when bernard charged them that they derided prayer for the dead , invocation of saints , purgatory : and cluniacensis that they excepted against altars , adoring of crosses , the masse , chanting inquires , praying for the dead . if they be to be believed in so many , why not in this , which they put first ? lucas osiander epit. hist. eccl. cent. 12. lib. 3. cap. 3. anno christi 1158. cites cluniacensis for the same thing . eckbertus saith when he was canou at bon he with his companion bertoly did often speak with them whom he refutes , sayes in his sermon that they alleadged against infant-baptisme mat. 28. 19. mark. 16. 15 , 16. though i make no question but that they bely them at least some of them in other things , some upon report , as cluniacansis , that they denyed some of the scripture , it may be saith osiaander , because they denyed the apocryphal writings , or perhaps because they denied arguments valid from the rites of the old testament ; some upon false inferences , which is a frequent thing in writers to make the consequences they gather from their writings the tenets of the authors they impugne ; some it may be out of that abuse of charging those tenets and practises upon all of the same profession , which is too true of some , as that all christians did lewd practises , because the gnosticks did so , that all anabaptists are wicked because those of munster , copp , and some others proved so , in which way mr. b. walkes page 138. &c. ( for which the lord forgive him ) yet it seemes utterly unlikely to me , that in this petrus de bruis and henricus and their followers should be belied , when so many of chief account in their time from several places charge them with denying infant-baptisme , and rebaptizing , petrus cluniacensis writes to 3. bishops of france , and bernard to the earle of st. gyles of purpose against them for this reason , bernard and cluniacensiis put it for their prime error , petrus cluniacensis and eckbertus produce , and take on them to answer their allegations against infant-baptisme , but not so ( as i remember ) any allegations against the scriptures or marriage , which they charge them to deny , and therefore it 's likely they wrong them in these , not in that . as for the albigenses and waldenses , it might be true that some might be against infant-baptisme , yet others not , some following peter de bruis , others waldus ; as it was in the reformation , when some followed luther , others zwinglius in the points of the eucharist , images , &c. or it may be that they all at the beginning held so , but after left it , which seemes to be the conceit of cassander ubi suprà . and yet in the old book wherein their doctrince is cited by illyricus in his catalog . test . verit . printed argentinae 1562. pag. 3 , 4. there are some speeches , which illyricus is faine by glosses to free from the opinion of antipaedobaptisme : but whether the waldenses were antipaedopatists or no what i did alleadge was rightly done , not with a brazen face or seared conscience , or out of a desire to take up any slaunder or joine with any party to defend my cause , as mr. b. doth most unbrotherly insinuate , yea in my examen part . 2. sect . 2. before i cite bernard and cluniacensis , i have these words : now although he charge them with denying marriage & abstaning from meates , yet you may smell out of his own words that this was but a calumny : but because by the reasons given i am induced to conceive notwithstanding mr. ms. and mr. bs. allegations that peter de bruis and henricus , and other godly persons and societies were 500. yeares ago antipaedobaptists ; yea i conceive as good a catalogue of antipaedobaptists may be made almost in all ages as may be made for protestants against many popish corruptions , and better then antiprelatists can make against episcopacy . and this i dare still to do , and marvel mr. b. dare bring such railing accusation , to which i onely returne , the lord rebuke him . the other untruth if not malice mr. b. chargeth me with , is concerning my dealing with himself , when i had in my valedictory sermon and antidote shewed how impertinently the 2. monsters in new england were brought as evidences of gods judgements against anabaptists i added in my sermon , one of the errors condemned in new england is the 21. [ to be justified by faith is to be justified by works ] which i moved to be considered whether it were not near mr. bs. doctrine aphorisme 73. of justific . and in my antidote sect . 8. page 24. said it is near to it . hereupon mr. b. adjudgeth this dealing so grosse , as he never found in any jesuite , a shamlesse charge , and page 190. the vile ebullition of rancor and malice in a most evident falshood , that hath left no roome for blushing . and then cleares himself from the sense in which the antinomists held it , and then addes . now what doth mr. t. but bring this as the same tenet with mine ? when it is even directly contrary . to which i answer , mr. b. page 189. in these words [ your language about the absolutenesse of the covenant is too like many of the tenets of the antinomists in n. e. ] useth the same dealing with me , which he chargeth me with towards himself . for he doth or might know when i say with many divines the covenant is absolute , i meane it as they do in respect of the first promise , heb. 8. 10. i will write my lawes in their hearts , which doctor twisse and many other prove must be absolute or else the grace of god must be given according to mans desert as the pelagians held , which thing i expresse plainly in my examen page 164. whereas the antinomians make it absolute in respect of justification , in which i am assured that mr. b. knew by conferences with me that i was against them , and yet he chargeth me with symbolizing with them . but recrimination is no purgation . 2. it is not true that i bring it as the same tenet with mr. bs. but neare it : which is so true , that however their in tent and his were contrary , yet their words are the same . for mr. b. aph. 76. and in the first edition of the saints everlasting rest page 11. saith , doubtlesse the gospel takes faith for obedience to all gospel-precepts , of which the workes , james 2. 16. of giving food or clothing to a brother are a part : which if true , he that is justified by faith is justified by works , and so mr. bs. proposition is the same with the antinominians , however he used it to a contrary end : it 's the same medium though mr. b. prove one conclusion by it , and the antinomians another , and i think is condemned by the censure of them of n. e. in mr. bs. sense as well as the antinomians . but mr. b. goes about to clear himself from error in it and singularly , and then saith , how can mr. t. have ground to think that no minister in england is of my judgement ? and then challengeth me to confute the doctrine of his book , or leaves to judge whether i be not a meere empty calumniator . and addes , that these words of mine [ i am sure in his letter to me , he saith he was hissed at from all parts of the kingdome ] are a relation like the rest from a bitter roote so most falsely , when i had his letters , which might have directed me to speak truth , that the words [ from all parts of the kingdome ] are my addition , which is become ordinary with me . then mentions the occasion of the passage in his letters , my offer of help to him for dividing ends , but he thought he had no need of my help , and was resolved not to engage with a renter of the church . to which i answer , 1. my exceptions against his doctrine in his aphorismes have been sent to him afore his death , though not to answer his challenge , yet at the motion of his postscript . i conceive he erres , 1. in making justification by faith to be onely in law title . 2. in making a first and after continued justification . 3. in making it , a continued , not instantaneous act . 4. in making obedience to all gospel-precepts an essentiall part of justifying faith , and not a fruite onely . 2. i did no where say that i thought no minister in england is of his judgement , though i said i thought he had not made one minister of his judgement . 3. to the crimination of my speaking falsely i will set down his own-words in his letter to me , [ that pamphlet of justification i well knew was likely to blast my reputation with most divines , and the issue hath answered my expectation : i am now so hissed at by them , that i feele temptation enough to schisme in my discontents ] . i had hot his letter by me when i spake those words not out of a bitter roote but to answer the prejudice against me as conceived singular . but there was no falshood in my speech [ by most divines ] and [ from all parts of the kingdome ] being equipollent . and if this be to adde falsely , our lord christ will be found to adde falsely mat. 15. 8 , 9. &c. my offer of helpe to him in what we agreed was not for dividing ends , but because of his complaint of weaknesse of body and want of time for study . it seemes he accounted me a renter of the church afore my preaching at bewdley the many sermons on mat. 28. 19. against infant-baptisme , for discovering of the error of it in my bookes without other practises . it appeares thereby that even then when he seemed to be most friendly he had hard thoughts of me , and however he protest of his love , yet his misinterpreting so many of the things i have done or said to him , and at last casting up his accusations in his book in charging me with frequent untruths , schisme , pride , worse then the devil in accusing my own children , with bitter scoffes , and insulting tauntes , with other aggravations and expressions beyond brotherly and neighbourly respects , yea i may i think say , a sober minde are undeniable evidences of want of love to me , and candour towards me , if we may judge what is in a man by his deedes rather then by his words . as for his pretence of zeale for god , the peace of the church , and the duty of brotherly reproof , were he never so much in the right , and i never so much in the wrong for my judgement , yet these could not justifie his carriage to me . and if other ministers deale with me as mr. b. mr. m. mr. baillee , mr. geree have done without doing me right after their false criminations of me , i shall have temptation to think that they have learned a principle like the jesuites , to think it no sin to say as bad as may be against a supposed anabaptist for the paedobaptists cause . sect . x. that mr. bs. charge of accusing and disputing my children out of the covenant of christ is vaine ; and some inquiry is made how they are in the covenant . i have now gone through mr. bs. epistles and history , vindicated my self and the truth from many objections . there are many other things which are scattered in his answer to my valedictory oration and corrective of my antidote which are somewhat besides the dispute it self , which i shall rather point at then insist on because many are scarce worth the taking notice of , but for the esteem mr. b. and his book have gotten with men . page 165. what he speaks of my exceeding high and passionate disposition was but his misdeeming likely upon misinformation , neither my words nor carriage shewed it . page 166. what the supposed girds were is set down before out of his now printed book , whereby it seems my few disciples ( as he miscalls them ) are at least excused , and no notorious falshood chargeable on them : that which he saith , i forced him to the disputation i conceive is not right ; how it came to passe is shewed above ; that there were thousands of people there i think is overlasting : the tale of the dispute is made to prepossesse men with prejudice . i told him before that such a dispute was not fit to satisfy , and i gave him my reasons , and i propounded the way used at the conference at the hague , judged best by dr. raynolds : but the way mr. b. took he liked best , and his carriage of it looks like an artifice cunningly contrived to please the common sort of schollers and others of which few can discerne between sleight and solid proofs . but i doubt not my answer will prove mr. bs. arguments to be meer trifles . the untruths charged on me page 167. are upon his mistake of the words written before him . i said not [ to be used by mr. b. ] but by others mentioned next before . that his passage was like to be the beginning of a schism among those of bewdley was no jest , but a conjecture which the event hath proved true : how he misrepresents my words of charging their blood on them , and hypocrisy to them is before shewed : it 's not true i had been long time working a fearful schisme , unlesse by accident , it being true which mr. allen and mr. shepherd say advertisement to the reader , pag. 27. scarce truth or error can now adaies be received but in a way of schisme . his lines were likely to be the beginning of a schisme , in that it was taken as if anabaptists and with them my self were adjudged hereticks by him : which if it were an untruth , yet it is so like a truth , that i think he that shall read in one period what mr. b. sayes of hereticks , that they end in wicked lives , and in the next find the instance in anabaptists , and after me named as one of them will conceive he called them and me hereticks . and however he protest he doth not , yet his asserting me a sect-master page 188. and his inclining to vossius , &c. their definition of an heretick page 171. and his words page 259. make me think he comes not much short of counting me an heretick . to his allegations of my speeches concerning mr. m. and independents i have answered before . i may say the doctrine was one of the first heresies , yet not censure the men that hold it as heretical ; it 's one thing to be formally an heretick , and another thing materially , to hold that which denominated a party heretical . in my examen i tell mr. m. and now mr. b. that i think none of those glorious lights mentioned held mr. ms. position . i do not judge all hereticks that be against my opinion , but that they may be more justly stiled heretiques then my self . mr. bs. quicknesse in replying afore he weighed my speeches or perhaps my scantnesse in expressions out of warinesse what i said to him ( whom i found very captious ) hath i perceive created me these hard censures . that which mr. b. saies page 172. he dare say of me i dare say is false . the inference which he calls strange is none of mine : the passage and time of writing it do still prevaile with me to conceive that he wanted a spirit of love through ill surmises of me . page 174. infant-sprinking or pouring water on them will not be proved baptisme . i shall not ease sinners that own their infant-sprinkling as baptism by my assertion : that i tell them they never sinned against their baptisme and engagement is a fiction of mr. b. in which he hath a pretty art . i said not mr. b. gave us a title to make us odious , but [ that might make us odious ] which imports the term might make us odious , not that mr. b. had that purpose in using it . page 175. he hath a discourse from the end of the accuser and the opposition of justification to accusation and condemnation to prove , that it is proper language to say he accuseth another , who denies a supposed priviledge to be due to him . by the same reason the accusers accusation may be said to be condemnation , and execution too , for that is the end of the accuser . i had thought [ accusation ] noted the accusers act , not his end ; that justification is opposed to accusation and condemnation shewes they are distinguished , the one being the charging with a fault , the other passing sentence . i must confesse i yet understand not his language of accusing without charging with a fault , nor do i think any law-dictionary doth so define accusation . i do not think the non-visible churchmembership of infants is poenal , or deprivation of a mercy now , it being only by the alteration of the church-frame . whether the not acknowledging infants visible churchmembership be a denying a mercy reall or imaginary , whether there be injustice , scorne , or any error in my tenet about it , is to be examined in answering his book . what i do hold i do it not without natural affection to my children , out of conscience of maintaining truth . the very same he chargeth upon me for denying infant-baptisme might mutatis mutandis by the same reason be charged on him for denying infant-communion . i do judge this rhetorical or satyrical passage of mr. b. to be a meer trifling in a serious matter . that which is said page 176. of my disputing my children out of the church by denying them to be visible church-members is mr. bs mistake in defining visible church-membership as i shall shew in examining the 27. chap. of the first part of his book . it 's not true i deny all infants to be in covenant with the lord their god , or that title to salvation which upon promise they have in point of law . mr. bs. conditional covenant gives no title till the condition be put , which he will not say is true of any infants but the elect , who alone are children of the promise in the apostles language , rom. 9. 8. pag. 177. he saith , i do all i can to keep infants out of the visible church , but i deny that to hinder their baptisme is to keep them out of the visible church , or that to baptize them is to bring them in . if it be , why have they not the communion according to that which we reade , 1 cor. 12. 13 ? are janizaries who were baptized children of greek christians therefore visible members of the christian church ? mr. b. though he had the copy of my sermon , yet misrepresents my words . i said not , that it is the devils part to say that the infants of believers are members of the visible church , but my words were [ it being an error , and such pernicious effects following , that people think therefore they are christians because baptized , ( which opinion of theirs is confirmed by mr. bs. words . for they are visible christians that are baptized into the name of christ , if they have not since by word or workes renounced him ) and rest therein , and are thereby held in carnal presumption , we ought rather to think those that maintain infant-baptisme play the devils part ] which expressions of mine being added , the vanity of mr. bs. arguings will appear . that which he hath page 178. [ that it is no more thankes to me then to satan , that i keep not god from making promise to his people ] which intimates i would do it if it were in my power ( for if there be no more thanks to me then satan , it is because there 's no more hindrance in me from doing it then in satan̄ , and so the same will ) is a suggestion that exceedes all moderation , as if mr. b. were bent not onely to rake up all the dirt he can to cast in my face , but also to put an ill construction on all i say . my answer was a faire answer to a virulent charge . in 2. senses i conceived it might be said that infants are disputed out of the covenant of christ : the one as if my dispute made christ not covenant to them , the other as if it made them not covenant to christ. i said , neither was true . what saies mr. b. ? 1. election is not a covenant . nor did i say it was . and then addes [ nor are they in covenant because elected ] which speech is most false , contrary to rom. 9. 8. where [ the children of the promise ] is all one with [ the elect ] as the analysis shewes , as may be seene in the authors cited by me in my examen part . 3. sect . 4. besides whom more may be produced . i will add two now . mr. rutherfurd in that piece of his which is the exactest of his workes . exercit . apol. 2. c. 2. num . 7. soli electi dicuntur in scripturis foederati , filii & haeredes promissionis , rom. 9. 8. the elect alone are said in the sctiptures to be in covenant , children , and heires of the promise , rom. 9. 8. and mr. norton in resp . ad apollon . c. 2. pag. 30. objectum foederis gratiae sunt soli electi . the object of the covenant of grace are the elect alone . next he saith , that i deny that god covenanteth with our infants to be their god in christ , and to take them to be his peculiar people , which is the covenant he formerly made with infants , and which he now affirmes . what he affirmes distinctly i cannot well tell : he doth so confusedly expresse himself in his bookes . he distinguished between an absolute and a conditional covenant of grace . the absolute he saies belongs onely to the elect , but this he will not be thought to meane when he speakes of infants of believers being in covenant , or baptism's sealing of it : yea he blames me often for so conceiving of him , and page 223. he disputes against that tenet as my fifth error . the conditional is a covenant of justification and salvation upon-condition of faith : this he saith is sealed by baptisme , not the other , and this he makes belonging to all the posterity of adam , elect and reprobate . and this it seemes most likely he meanes , when he speaks of infants of believers being in covenant , because it is that which baptisme seales , and they that are in covenant are to be sealed thereby . but according to this conditional covenaat either all are in covenant with god whether elect or reprobate , infants of believers or unbelievers , or else none till they performe the condition , which is faith , and so not all infants of believers . [ mr. b. in his additions to the saints everlasting rest , part . 3. sect . 3. prop. 2. a conditional promise puts nothing in being , till the performance of the condition ; nor gives any certainty , but of such performance . ] as for any covenant of god or christ besides these containing onely the promise of visible church-membership , or such like imagined priviledges in the new testament to infants of gentile believers i take to be a phantasme , and when i come to examine mr. bs. opinion of infants visible church-membership ( which i could not do till i had his book ) i doubt not to make it appear to be so , that not one text he hath brought proves such a promise , and that he hath not proved more to belong to infants by promise then i acknowledge , and yet neither visible church-membership , nor right to baptisme in infancy ordinarily will follow thereon . as for that he saith in general termes , that i deny that god covenanteth with infants of believers to be their god in christ , and to take them to be his peculiar people , is said like a calumniator , my words being so plaine to the contrary in that very place . in a word , i have said that the covenant or promise of regeneration , sanctification , forgivenesse of sins , adoption , and eternal life is not made to all the natural children of the most godly believers , no not of abraham himself , or to any barely because they are their children , but because elect , or believers in their own persons , which mr. m. and mr. geree in their answers to me confesse to be true , as being expresly delivered , rom. 9. 8. and by the streame of protestant writers maintained . but i deny not that many infants of believers are in the covenant of grace : nor dare i say that no infants of unbelievers are in the covenant of christ in this sense : i onely say i neither know which of the one or the other are thus in the covenant of grace . as for the arguings that he that denies infants baptisme doth deny them to be in the covenant of grace , they are built on these fancies that to be a seale of the covenant of grace is of the essence of baptisme , that there is a certain connexion between being in the covenant of grace and right to be baptized : which with other hypotheses of paedobaptists i shall examine in my review . mr. b. addes , that i flatly deny infants covenanting with god , whereas my words were farre from such flat denial being onely these [ for my part i know not how any person should covenant with christ till he promise , &c. ] which were not such a peremptory or flat denial as mr. b. saies they are , and they are true , it being against all experience , that infants do so covenant : but on the contrary when they are baptized cry and shew their unwillingnesse , as august . lib. 1. de remiss . et mer. pecc . c. 23. flendo et vagiendo cùm in eis mysterium celebratur ipsis mysteriis vocibus obstrepunt . then mr. b. saies , i disswade parents from so engaging their children in covenant , and promising in their names , which yet they ever did in the church before christ , and it was their duty to do , as deut. 29. and other places shew . but in which words i perswade parents not to do ( as he saies i do ) he doth not shew , my words are there all assertory of what i conceive infants cannot do in their own persons , not a word of perswasion or disswasion to the parents or any other . and for that which is added [ then it seemes you know not how a father should engage his child by covenanting in his name ] and after [ you would have no parents to engage their children solemnly to god in christ by covenanting in their names ] there is not a word of it in that place . 't is true in my sermon intituled fermentum pharisaeorum , i gave a little touch against the use of sureties at baptisme according to the doctrine of the catechisme in the common prayer-book , that they did promise that they should believe , &c. which i conceived onely belongs to christ as surety of the better covenant , heb. 7. 22. but i never denied , that the elders of a nation may engage solemnly the posterity even the unborne to take the lord for their god ( but this i rather take to be an adjuration under a curse if they do not , then a promise for them that they shall ) nor that a parent may engage his child by a promise of his own endeavour that he shall ; and that the child is engaged thereby : but not by vertue of the fathers promise , but by vertue of the obligation of the thing promised , the fathers promise is an incitement to do it the rather , but makes not the child bound to do it of it self , but onely because the thing is a duty , which he were bound to did the father promise for him or not . but i deny , that this makes a visible church-member , or that in nature or law as his childs act according to the gospel for his being admitted a visible church-member . now mr. b. hastily answering me jumbles things together , and as one impatient of considering what i say , chargeth me with what i avow not , and then concludes scoffically , and i pray you how well do you free your self from this charge ? should i imitate him i should cry shamelesse foul dealing , &c. but i am resolved to examine his writing , not to follow his fashion pag. 179. he saies , i did not distinguish of disciples , or yield infants disciples in any sense , & if i acknowledge them disciples in any sense , i should speak out . to which i say , i put in those words in my sermon in that sense , christ appointed disciples to be baptized , to intimate that i did not deny , but infants might be disciples by the immediate secret work of gods spirit , though not in the ordinary & mediate way of preaching the gospel , about which the rule mat. 28. 19. is set . as for mr. bs. sense of a disciple of christ without learning christs doctrine , of a servant of god without service actively or passively , a disciple remotely by the fathers being a disciple it is nothing like the use of the word [ disciple ] in the new testament or the terme [ servant of god ] as equipollent to [ a disciple ] and no marvel i should mistake mr. b. who used termes in a sense i never met with in the new testament , and i still conceive to be a piece of new gibberish . and when he saith , he took servant , and disciple according to their relative formal nature , and not either with the accidental consideration of active or passive , it is no marvel i should be at a stand what to answer him using termes in such an uncouth non-sense acception as i never met with before . ( for if the trumpet give an uncertain sound , who shall prepare himself to battel ? ) and it seemes to me a grosser absurdity which mr. b. hath in those words , then any of those he chargeth me with , to take disciple and servant in their relative formal nature without learning or service active or passive ; whereas mr. b. himselfe page 92. where he saies , the relation of a servant , disciple , souldier , husbandman , trades-man remaines when the act ceaseth for a time , yet expressely saith , the relation and so the denomination is from the act of service , learning , &c. and yet he would have infants to be denominated disciples and servants of god without their act of learning or service , or capacity of actual learning or service in an ordinary way : and he is not ashamed to call learning or service actively or passively accidental to the title or denomination of a disciple or servant . which is a monstrous absurdity to make a denomination without the forme denominating , yea to count it accidental to conceive a relation without the foundation , which is all one as to call one a father without begetting , a lord without dominion , a signe without signification , not unlike the riddle vir non vir , percussit non percussit , avem non avem , lapide non lapide , super arbore non arbore , or rather absurdorum absurdissimū oppositum in apposito . and yet this notion of a disciple never proved is the ground work of mr. bs. first . argument , and therefore if i may use mr. bs. words , they are very tractable soules that are led by his notions . page 180. he thinks strange that a man of my parts should know of no separation to god but by election or calling , he questions whether election be proper separation , he saies that the jewes first-borne were seperated by a law , and men now by dedication separate goods to god , that he meanes separation neither by election nor extraordinary or ordinary call , but by the law or covenant of god. to which i reply , mr. b. still abuseth me by leaving out my words [ as the case now stands ] which were put in as remarkable , to exclude that way of separation to god , whereby the first born , priests , goods , &c. were holy as separated to god. election is , alwayes with seperation , that is , differencing one from another , and as election is said to be according to purpose , rom. 9. 11. so likewise separation , paul was separated from his mothers wombe , gal. 1. 15. according to gods pleasure and purpose , that is by his election : and with this separation infants may be said to be sanctified , as jeremiah ch . 1. 5. and so the terme [ holy ] is applied , rom. 11. 16. to the jewes then unborne , who were after to be called ver . 24 , 25 , 26 , 27. and called saints is used 1 cor. 1. 2. as for infants of believers whether elect or reprobate outward federal holinesse i know no such , there 's no law or covenant separates every child of a believer to god. according to mr. b. the covenant sealed by baptisme is conditional , and that belongs to all the sons of adam till persons are severed by believing , and unbeliefe : this covenant therefore of it self without putting the condition doth not separate any to god , and so not infants till they be believers : the absolute is onely to the elect , and according to it , and so onely the elect are separated , which are not all , perhaps but a few of the children of believers , but an isaac of all abrahams children , rom. 9. 6 , 7 , 8. a law or covenant of god separating all infants of believers barely for their parents faith to be visible members of the christian church is mr. bs. dream , as i shall shew with gods assistance in examing his second argument . sect . xi . about mr. bs. 4. texts urged impertinently to prove infants visible church-membership . page 183. he saies it is a palpable untruth which i say , he four texts in his epistle levit. 25. 41 , 42. deut. 29. 11 , 12. act. 15. 10. 1 cor. 7. 14. with rom. 11. 19. were all he concluded any thing from , meaning in the dispute at bewdley , and saies the hearers know it and is to be seen before . but to my best remembrance with search into the notes i took after , and the notes which were communicated to me it is no untruth . mat. 28. 19. i think he alluded to , but i remember not it was urged or any other text besides the forenamed as a medium from which to conclude any proposition to be proved . then he saies , i have been fully answered before , but yet addes concerning levit. 25. 41 , 42. 1. the jewes infants , were infants , and the dispute between us was of the species . answ. 1. though mr. b. and before him mr. cobbet usually call the sort or ranke of men that are infants the species ; yet other logicians usually call [ man ] the lowest species or kind , and say , age and sex make not another kinde . 2. but allowing mr. b. and mr. cobbet their language , i say , the dispute is not about the species or kind , to wit , infants as infants , but infants of believers , who are particular persons , and the question as it was rightly stated between me and mr. m. was , whether the infants of believers were to be baptized with christs baptisme by a lawfull minister according to ordinary rule without extraordinary revelation or direction ? and if paedobaptists will maintain their practise , they should make good this proposition , that all the infant-children of professed or inchurched believers are to be baptized with christs baptisme by the law full minister according to ordinary rule . though mr. baillee and mr. b. for some advantage set down this as their proposition to be proved , that some infants are to be baptized . m. b. saies he had proved our priviledges greater then the jewes , and that i deny it not , and that this ( to wit , to be gods servants ) was not peculiar to them . whereas i had proved the contrary from ver . 55. and the whole chapter is about lawes peculiar to the jews , and ver . 38 , 39 , 40. going before , shew plainly that this law was peculiar to the jewes , that they and their children should return from servitude under which they were for poverty , at the year of jubilee , and ver . 45 , 46. plainly restraines it to the children of israel , allowing them to take the children of strangers so journing among them , and therefore proselytes , as an inheritance . and therefore in whatever sense it is meant that they are gods servants , it is meant onely of hebrews , as exod. 21. 2. is expressed . i do not conceive , nor any interpreters that i meete with do expound this of a proselyte , but onely of an hebrew borne . if cornelius had children they had not been gods servants in the sense there meant : which is clearly this , that they were his servants in this respect only in that place , in that they were to be disposed of not as men would , but as he onely would , who had right to them by his purchase in bringing them out of egypt , and therefore none can get soveraigne dominion over them ( no not by their voluntary selling themselves ) to prejudice his , as deodat . annot . in levit. 25. 42. whence i infer , that it is a most grosse abuse of this scripture in mr. b. to urge it to prove that the infants of gentile believers now are servants to god , related to him as a peculiar people , separated to himself from the world : which is spoken meerly in respect of the hebrew children , and their corporal servitude , which was to be at gods disposing by reason of his redemption of them out of egypt . when he tells me of my accustomednesse to mistakes , it is more true of himself ( as i have often shewed ) yea though the words were written before him . and in this very thing he calls my mistake that he argued thus , whosoever is called gods servant may be baptized , whereas he might have seene if he had taken any care to set down my words rightly , that my words were as his own notary took them , and he hath printed them [ if this be a good argument infants are called servants of god , therefore they are disciples , and must be baptized ] which was his argument either in words or substance . as for the conclusion and argument as he sets it down page 182. i think it was not urged in the dispute , and i have proved that levit. 25. 42. is meant onely of hebrew children , not of gentiles , nor in the sense mr. b. would prove that they are relatively separate to god from the world in the sense as [ god 's servants ] . is equipollent to a disciple of christ. page 184 he calls my answers to his allegation of deut. 19. 11 , 12 vain , senselesse reavils , and then breaks out into words of pitty to people that take their opinions on my word . to which is i say , that my answers are not vaine , senselesse cavil , will appear in my reply to mr. b. about that text . and as he pitties them that take their opinion on my word , so i pitty them that take their opinion on his word ; or any meer mans word contrary to christs priviledge , mat. 23. 1. page 184. in my words [ adoption ] is printed for [ doctrine ] page 185. he repeates his frivolous charge of our accusing our children as no disciples of christ , and therefore no christians , and therefore no ground to believe or hope they are saved : thus calumniating me , when i have often said they may be both disciples and christians invisibly , and so have salvation ; and we have great reason to hope they are in gods election by reason of the general indefinite promises of the scripture and gods usual dealing with his people , though there is no certainty either from mr. bs. grounds or mine , sith mr. b. will not say that every visible church-member is saved . all the difference between us is about their visible church-membership , whether the denying that takes away ground of hope of their salvatien : mr. b. saith it doth , because there 's no hope of that persons salvation that doth not seeme to be of the invisible church ; but he that is not of the visible church doth not seeme to be of the invisible . ergo ; but the minor is not true , as he takes the word [ seem ] and by gods assistance i doubt not to shew , when i examine ch . 27. of part . 1. his mistake concerning the terme [ visible ] as if it were as much as to appear such in the judgement of probability though not descernad by sense , by which defini-nition the opposite termes [ visible and invisible ] may be confounded , and the terme [ visible ] is used contrary to the common use of writers , whereby he misleades himself and others . then he addes , but mr. t. will say , i believe that it is better that infants are no christians , then that they were . but believe him that list for me . to which i say , i will not do as he often deales with me , charging me as playing the devils part , and worse , but this i say , i know not what to conceive of these words , but that either by gods judicial act of leaving him to himself , out of addictednesse to calumniate , or extream ill opinion of me , or which i much feare notwithstanding all his protestations out of disdainfulnesse of his antagonist and delight in satyrical quips he vented this passage . he cannot shew where ever i used such an impious speech : all i have said is onely this , it is a mercy that our children are not visible church-members as the jews were , because it brought a heavy bondage , and the christian church-constitution of voluntiers is better , nor do our children lose any thing by defect of such visible church-membership . yet if i had said so , that i would say so for the time to come who can say but god ? might i not have repented and altered my speech ? then he goes on to answer my arguing against his allegation of act. 15. 10. to prove infants disciples , and calls it silly grounds , insipid arguing , according to his usual rhetorick , whereas the sillinesse ( if any ) is in his own inconsideratenesse of the strength of it . that text serves not mr. bs. turne unlesse it could be proved , that the very act or action which these false teachers did were the cutting with a knife the little skin of the privy member , for no more was done to infants in actual circumcision , nor were they passive subjects of any other action . now mr. bs. argument is from what was done to infants by false teachers that infants are meant by [ disciples , act. 15. 10. ] but it is manifest that the false teachers did not cut off that little skin , but the parents of the infants as mr. bs. text shewes , act. 21. 21. and the same text ascribing the contrary to paul to that which the false teachers did , shewes it was teaching that was their putting on the yoke : which is more apparent from act. 15. 1. where what is said v. 10. they put the yoke on the necks of the disciples , is ver . 1. they taught the brethren : the disciples then are the brethren , and the putting on the yoke is the teaching them . my argument is this , that the false teachers did no other thing but teach , now the act there is ascribed to the false teachers onely , not to the parents of infants , none are blamed but they , they are spoken of and to , not the parents ; therefore the putting on of the yoke was not actual circumcision , which was the parents act , not the false teachers : they neither did it , nor by any instrument attempt to do it themselves , though the one might follow on the other . and i dare still appeale to any that are of common understanding , whether that which the false teachers , did act. 15. 10. were to infants or parents . and for mr. bs. exceptions , to the first , mr. b. mistakes my confession , i confessed they did not put the yoke eternally , but onely endeavoured it , because though they taught them the necessity of circumcision , yet their doctrine was not received , but i never said to my remembrance , that the phrase of putting on the yoke noted barely their intent or attempt , but the act they did though sine effectu on the disciples : my words are plaine as they are printed , in which it is manifest the putting on of the yoke was by the teaching of the false teachers . as for mr. bs. instances they serve better for me then himself . he that teacheth people to be subject to the turk , though thereby he inslave their infants by consequent , yet the subject recipient of his act are onely the people taught , nor doth any man in that speech understand the infants ; and so it must be said of moses subjecting the children of israel to his law , though by consequent infants were circumcised , yet in this speech moses subjected ( by teaching or commanding ) the children of israel to his law . the terme [ children of israel ] notes onely , or as logicians speake supponitly parents onely . the act of gods calling christ out of egypt is a complex act , noting the sending the angel ; the command to joseph , his carrying christ , whereof christ was the object or terminus , not onely of the command . but the false teachers act. 15. 10. was formally the single act of teaching not circumcision , they neither acted it nor attempted it in their own persons , and therefore could have no other subject recipient , but those that were taught , not infants . page 187. he calls my speech [ that i think mr. b. cannot shew in any one place where the word [ holy ] is taken in his sense for a state or person ( i do conceive i said for the state of a person ) separated to god in that way he would have a person separated to god neither by election nor outward calling , nor any other way that i know of in which holinesse is used for a state separated to god ] a new crotchet of the nature of the rest , and answers it with a quaver , and a jest . his quaver is , is it not enough that i prove it alwayes taken for a separation to god , but i must shew that the word signifies a separation by this or that way or meanes effected ? his jest follows , a man was out of love with his wife , &c. and is not this the same kind of reasoning with yours ? to which i reply , it is not enough . for 1. mr. b. sayes , that holinesse is alwayes taken for a separation to god. 2. i am sure that it is taken for chastity , 1 thess. 4. 3 , 4. and mr. b. denies it not page 255. onely saies it is a part of sanctity , though ver . 3. beza translates it , id est , ut abstineatis à fornicatione , which shewes the holinesse there is no other then chastity , or at least chastity in the first place , which is plain from ver . 4. where it is , to possesse the vessel , that is , the body in holinesse , that is , chastity , which the opposition to the lust of concupisence , ver . 5. and uncleannesse , ver 7. do shew . and this acknowledged by illyricus in his clavis script . on the word sanctus , piscator in his scholie on 1 thess. 4. 4. and others which i shall produce in my review . 3. then it must needs follow according to mr. bs. position , that to be chaste is to be holy in a state of separation to god. but i suppose mr. b. will not say every chaste person is in a state saparated to god which may intitle him to baptisme , therefore it is not enough for mr. bs. purpose to prove a person any way holy or in a state separated to god , that thereby he be intitled to baptisme : but he must shew the way how he is holy , and that this intitles to baptisme . the jewes hereafter to be called are holy , rom. 11. 16. by election . mr. cobbet just vindic . chap. 3 sect . 1. page 37. the jewes yet to come were in pauls time holy federally , rom. 11. 15 , 16. not actually , but intentionally , yet not then baptizable : the mede● , sai . 13. 3. are called gods sanctified ones , yet not to be admitted visible church-members . i further add , that in his general sense [ legitimate ] might also signifie a state separate to god , as being that onely posterity he allowes of according to his institution of marriage , mal. 2. 15. which is very frequently called holy by divines . and therefore letting passe his jocular tale , my exception or answer to his reasoning from 1 cor. 7. 14. deserves a better refutation then he hath yet given . then he makes me say , that no scripture speakes of holinesse in his sense , whereas my words ( as above ) were more wary , mr. b. i think cannot shew , &c. and then tells me , that the jewes infants are called the holy seed , and that by covenant or law , which is his sense , and then chargeth me with laying by conscience and common modesty , having little tendernesse of conscience in accusing his will in charging him with a grosse falshood , that he was willing to carry things in generals , and not to tell distinctly how infants are holy and in a state separated to god , whereas he told me he meant holy by law or covenant . notwithstanding which i may yet conceive him willing to carry things in generals , sith this very explication is in generals , the law or covenant , as he calls it , being not distinctly named and shewed where it is , and upon what conditions that state of separation to god which infants have is ascertained , whether upon their own act or parents , and if upon parents whether immediate or mediate , whether to the truth and reality or profession , nor wherein that state of separation to god consists , or what is the benefit of it : all or of some which perhaps i apprehend mr. b. rightly in now , yet not till i had read over his book again and again , and pickt out his meaning by comparing many passages together : which because he did not then , nor since in his printed writings put together as others do in their theses they maintaine . i guessed he was willing to carry things ▪ in the general , and if i did say so ( which mr. b. and i must take on his scribes word ) in my sermon without any caution , mr. b. might have imagined that i meant it with this caution ( which is ordinarily allowed in constructions of such speeches , where thematter leades us to conceive them intended ) that i conceived him unwilling : which might be the more allowed to me in that speech which i had not a word written when i spake it ; which of all other mr. b. is least fit to except against me for , having in print offended in this way in worse manner , page 185. but to the matter now we conceive his meaning , i still say the same , that i think he cannot shew one place , where [ holy ] is taken for separated to god in his sense . he alleadgeth that the jewes infants are called the holy seed : though he name not the text , ( which had been fit ) yet i guesse by his words page 83. he meanes ezra 9. 2. in which place onely and isaiah 6. 13. i find this terme in scripture . but ezra 9. 2. doth not speak of infants , but such a holy seed as mingled themselves with the people of the land , which was in marriage , which will not be said of infants ; nor is [ holy seed ] there meant of a state separated to god in mr. bs. sense by covenant promising it to believers , that their infants should be visible church-members : for this holinesse was a state of difference or separation onely by legal descent from israel , not by the faith of next parents , and it did intitle them to a peculiar priviledge of being reckoned in the genealogy of israel , or in full communion with the common-wealth of israel in respect of inheritance , marriage , &c. though they fell to idolatry , as jeroboam , ahaz , manasseh , &c. did . but proselytes though believers were not the holy seed there meant , they were not forbidden to marry the daughters of the people of the land . yea the children of the holy seed begotten upon prohibited women , as the daughters of the nations there mentioned , were with their mothers to be put away as unholy according to the law , ezra 10. 3. contrary to the resolution af the apostle , 1 cor. 7. 12 , 13 , 14. which evidently shewes that the jewes are called the holy seed by their descent according to the law of moses , and that the term [ holy seed , ezra 10. 2. ] is all one with [ legitimate ] and if the apostle did allude to that place in ezra it serves more for my sense then mr. bs. and the sense may be conceived this , if the unbelieving husband were not as sanctified to his wife so as that they might lawfully live together , then the children should be unclean , that is illegitimate , as those in ezra : but now , that is it being determined that the law of moses concerning prohibiting marriage with some people is voided , and unequal marriage is not dissolved , your children are holy that is legitimate . his evasion page 188. about a judgement of charity will be found insufficient to avoid my exception against his exposition , which is mistaken by him ; nor will it at all smite me , my exception being not as he imagines , that upon a judgement of charity concerning the sincerity of a persons profession he is not to be taken for a real believer : but that mr. b. determining that the unbeliever is sanctified onely to the believer , who is not onely such according to the judgement of charity , but also really such before god ; and the apostles consequence including this proposition according to his exposition , that the children of such onely are holy , that is , after mr. b. visible church-members and baptizable , of necessity all other by his exposition are prohibited to be baptized ; and therefore of necessity he that will follow the rule according to mr. bs , exposition must know the reality of the parents faith , which being impossible to be known without special revelation , he may baptize none without it . now mr. b. answers not at all to the main thing , how by his exposition a man can go upon certainty that he doth his duty : but how without respect to his exposition a man may take a person for a sincere believer , and so baptize him . but this serves not his turne in this case . for it is the duty of the baptizer to baptize onely visible church-members : this mr. b. will not deny : now of infants who can make no profession , their visible church-membership is known onely by their parents believing ; but according to mr. bs. exposition of the apostle , those infants onely are visible church-members whose parents are real believers before god : no hypocrite if mr. b. rightly expound the apostle can make his infant a visible church-member , and baptizable , for his children are uncleane . but it is not possible for a baptizer to know the parent to be a real believer before god without special revelation , and therefore without it he cannot be certain he doth his duty according to mr. bs. suppositions ; yea he may be certain he doth not his duty : for he may be certain he cannot observe the rule of baptizing onely the infants of those that are real believers before god , it being certain some in the visible church are hypocrites , and he is not to baptize the infants of such , if mr. b. rightly expound the apostle , they being unclean , that is , no visible church-members , nor baptizable , and therefore he may be certain in baptizing promiscuously infants of visible professors that he doth not his duty , if mr. bs. exposition be good , but sins against the apostles determination , in baptizing those that are not baptizable by the apostles determination as mr. b. expounds him , and if he be intelligent against his own light : but cannot be certain he doth his duty , because he cannot know which are baptizable , those infants being onely baptizable according to the apostles resolution as expounded by mr. b. who are the children of believers not onely so accounted in the judgement of charity , but also really such before god , which he cannot know without special revelation . sect . xii . that mr. b. unjustly chargeth me to be a sect-master . to his virulent and most unrighteous speech of me page 188. that he hath as good evidence that i am a sect-master , as that i am a christian ; i have replied before sect . 4. and now i say further , that my conscience acquits me from the guilt of making any sect ; and my proceedings at first with my brethren in the ministery manifested in my examen and apology , in my applying my self to the assemby and mr. m. do fully clear my aime , to have been reformation with peace and concurrence in the work of christ with them : ( which course mr. b. approves pag. 246. ) and if my writings had been fairely examined , it is very probable they had not bin printed . what i did , i was necessitated to , by their sleighting the thing , aed determining contrary to my positions , in a magisterial manner , notwithstanding my writings ; whereby it became poenal to hold my tenet ; which enforced me to print . and yet neither then did i meddle with the practise till mr. baillee awakened me , by telling me , my infant-baptisme must be null , by my principles . nor have i baptized ( save one nearely related to me , ) but where i was chosen a preacher ; where i conceived my self bound to baptize ( by christs rule , mat. 28. 19. ) those disciples to whom i preached : nor did i joine any in communion , till i saw that those that did their duty in being baptized , were rejected and made odious , with ministers and people , whereby they are necessitated to join in communion by themselves . and if any others do not joine with them , it is partly because notwithstanding i am for my own particular much inclined to unite in the communion , those that differ in judgement about infant-baptisme , according to my judgement expressed in my apology sect . 12. and mr. jesseys determinations in his book intitled a store-house of provision to further resolution in sundry cases of conscience ; yet because it is manifest from acts 2. 41 , 46. 1 cor. 10. 1 , 2 , 3. & 12. 13. persons were baptized afore they brake bread together , and justin. martyr . apolog . 2. ad antoninum hath these words , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that is , this food is with us called the eucharist or thanksgiving : of which it is not allowed for any other to partake , but him that believeth those things to be true which are taught by us , and is washed with that washing which is for the forgivenesse of sins and unto new birth , and that lives so as christ hath delivered , which passage is alleadged by mr. b. page 156. though maimedly . and augustin . tom . 7. de pecc . mer. et remiss . lib. 1. cap. 20. adsacramentum mensae domini nemo ritè nisi baptizatus accedit . and lumb . sent . l. 4. dist . 8. hoc coeleste manna non nisi renatis praestari debet . and the generality of popish and protestant divines hold so . mr. b. page 342. we have no warrant by word or example in all the new testament , to admit any member into the church , without baptisme ; and therefore the taking any without baptisme to the lords supper , will but strengthen men in their opinion , that their infant-sprinkling is sufficient ; and partly , because by mr. bs. book and other meanes men are so possessed with the restoring of baptisme , as if it were an error , schisme , a practise accursed by god , that consciencious timorous men do of themselves shunne us , and others furiously oppose us ; therefore i see a necessity of desisting from that enterprise , yet resolved to join with other christians of different judgement in what agreement & communion i can with a good conscience in prayer , preaching , disciplin , &c. and i speak unfeignedly notwithstanding all the injuries done me by mr. m. mr. geree , mr. baillee , and now beyond all the rest by mr. b. yet my heart is towards them to promote with them the work of christ according to the solemn covenant , & i think mr. b. & others are not ignorant that i have as absolutely and diligently opposed , if not so happily , the popish , arminian , antinomian , familistical ; socinian errors now broached as other men . what i said in my apology sect . 20. i say still , i seek unity with truth , and i am certain that mr. b. hath most injuriously accused me as unpeaceable , whether it hath come from others suggestions or his own misconceits of me . to that which is from pag. 189. to 169. is answered before . sect . xiii . that it is not a right way to judge of the truth of a doctrine by strange accidents , though wonderous . page 197. he drives on more furioso , having recited my words concerning unsafenesse to judge of doctrine by such accidental strange things as mrs. dyers and hutchinsons monstrous birthes in new england , and alle adged an example of determining that god was against the marriage of priests by the falling of a house , and added , we are to judge god may order accidents for stumbling blocks , he flies out thus , will not this man rather fight against heaven , and dispute against miracles then let go his error ? and then in his pathetick rhetorick insinuates , as if this speech of mine were weakening the credit of gods testimony in wonderous providences , not farre from the blasphemy against the holy ghost , that i am fallen so farre as freely to sacrifice gods glory to my fancies , and then brings in exceptions against me in four things , 1. that i call them onely strange accidents . 2. compare it to the falling of a house . 3. that i disswade from judging of doctrine by such accidents . 4. yea rather would have men think that they are stumbling blocks that men should not receive the truth . and then discourseth that the monsters in new england were the extraordinary directing finger of god , and addes : would mr. t. have us so carelessely regard gods judgement &c. yea and rather judge the contrary ? it seemes if he had seene the wonders of egypt , he would not onely have been hardned as pharaoh , but judged god laid them as stumbling blocks . who would not tremble to hear the holy god to be accused by man , as if he led his people into evil by his wonders ? and then sets down two propositions , 1. that true miracles are never to be distrusted , but believed what ever they teach , that they are gods testimony , john 15. 24. 2. that some wonders that are not proper miracles in their nature , may yet have a plain discovery of the finger of god in the ordering of them , and so when they are not against scripture but according to it , should exceedingly confirm us , and such he conceives those monstrous births were , and that the forgetting them among us is no small aggravation of our sin . to which passage i am nccessitated to answer , being so deeply charged upon such mistaken grounds , 1. that i hope the lord hath ordered this shimei-like loosenesse of his pen to discover two things for his own good and the good of them that doate on him and his book , 1. his extreame bitternesse or uncharitablenesse towards me and those he termes sectaries . 2. his hasty , inconsiderate , rash and immoderate censures , misconstructions and determinations . for wherein do i fight against heaven , and dispute againstmiracles rather then let go my error ? in which words did i either weaken the credit of the testimony of god ? or sacrifice freely gods glory to my fancies ? or regard so carelessely gods judgement ? or rather judge the contrary to gods judgement ? whence may it seeme i would have been hardened as pharaoh , and judged god laid his wonders as stumbling blocks ? or accused god as if he led his people into evil by his wonders ? let mr. b. prove any of these without his childish exclamations and vaine rhetorick , and i will confesse my self worthy to be held an anathema : if not let him be dealt with lege remniâ , or rather lege divinâ , deut. 19. 18 , 19. were i minded to retort i might take up some of mr. bs. rhetorick , and apply it to the author of the passage in the epistle to the church at kederminster , in which in all likelihood the thanksgiving daies for victories against the scots are termed offering a sacrifice to mars , and keeping holy-daies for killing the saints . in this manner , will not this man fight against heaven ? weaken the testimony of god ? sacrifice freely gods glory to his own fancies ? regard carelessely gods judgement ? judge the contrary to gods judgement ? &c. who dare ascribe those glorious workes of providence in giving victories to a weake , and farre smaller army brought into a great streight , over an army double the number , when solemne appeales to god were made on both sides to shew whose cause he owned , to chance of warre and call the thansgiving for that victory offering a sacrifice to mars , using though a preacher of the gospel such a heathenish profane censure and language concerning the actions of praise to god enjoined by a christian state , and performed by holy christians , who had by prayer obtained such a signal mercy ? but i forbeare any more of this , and proceed to examine what mr. b. saies , 1. that i call them onely strange things . answ. if they be referred to [ miracles wrought by god ] which is in the next period , and in grammer construction should be the accident , then it is false , that i call them onely strange accidents , and not miracles : if to the monstrous births in new england , i do call them onely strange accidents in that place , being willing to use a general terme abstracting from miracles and wonders , which are differenced by mr. b. himself in his saints everlasting rest pa. 2. c. 4. s. 1. yet using a terme that signified they were from remarkable providence . even mr. b. himself i do not find to terme those accidents in new england miracles , but the extraordinary directing finger of god , the evident hand of god , wonders of providence , which i also freely acknowledge . 2. he saith i compare it to the falling of the house , which might easily come from a naturall cause . answ. 1. he changeth [ them ] into [ it ] and so leaves it doubful what he meanes that i compare with the falling of the house : but i imagine he meanes the monstrous births , because he addes that the falling of the house might easily come from a natural cause . but the truth is , i did not make any comparison between the one and the other accident as if the one were no more observable then the other , but onely gave an instance to prove , that it is not safe to determine of a doctrine whether pleasing god by an accident : sith that accident in appearance to them was as evident a providence of god as could be , that while they were debating the matter it should then fall on one side where married priests were , and not on the other side , where were monkes . and in respect of the time it was in shew a more likely evidence of gods disproving marriage of ministers , then the monsters in new england of disproving mr. wheelwrights doctrine , they not happening at the time of his preaching , or the assemblies sitting at cambridge in new england , august 30. 1637. or the courts proceeding against them , oct. 2. 1637. but at another time and place though near them , and not in so open a manner to publique view as that was , though after evidenced sufficiently at the taking up of mrs. dyers child . and though the fall of a roome might come from a natural cause , yet it falling at such a time on one part , and not on another , i believe if mr. b. had been then present he would have been apt to take it as an extraordinary providence of god against married priests , as doctor gouge in his priented sermon , and many others did the fall of the house at blackfriers on drury , redyate popish priests , &c. oct. 26. 1623. against the papists . 3. that i disswade from judging of doctrine by such accidents . to which i answer , my words are plain , i conceive no safety of judging what doctrine is true or fals , but by going to the law and testimony , and trying thereby , and therefore bid men take heed how they follow mr. b. in his direction , and of so adhering to the voice of god in monsters or other providences as barely upon them to judge a doctrine to be false . and this i still think good advice , 1. because the scripture is the sufficient and onely rule which now we have to judge doctrines by whether they be true or false 2 tim. 3. 16 , 17. 2. it is the command of god , deut. 13. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5. notwithstanding the doing of a signe or wonder , yet to look to the doctrine of a prophet . the like is isai. 9. 20. luke 16. 29 , 31. yea john 5. 39. christ referres them to the scriptures notwithstanding his miracles . 3. because though true miracles are never to be distrusted , yet christ hath foretold us , mat. 24. 24. there shall arise false christs and fals prophets , and shall shew great signes and wonders , insomuch that ( if it were possible ) they shall deceive the very elect , and the like is foretold , 2 thess. 2. 9 , 10. revel . 13. 13 , 14. 4. because true miracles themselves do not testifie immediately concerning the doctrine , but the person that he is sent of god , and consequently of his doctrine , john 3. 2. and then they are wrought by the person himself . as for other providences or real wonders if not wrought by the person , but on him , though they should be dreaded and observed as gods workes , and when we have examined the doctrine by scripture they have great influence on us either to confirme or unsettle in an opinion , yet they are rather discoveries of gods judgements of men and their practises , then their opinions ; and yet therein we may mistake thinking gods judgement may be against one when it is against another , and thinking them worse then others contrary to our saviours doctrine , luke 13. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5. and in the relation of such accidents there is not alwayes that certainty that may settle a person as appeares by the mistakes of many , and many such are invented and related with much art and confidence so as to deceive credulous people frequently . in a word , i conceive mr. b. himself saith in effect as much as i say , i know wonders that are not miracles are not to be interpreted or trusted to contrary to the word , for satan by gods permission may performe them , and antichrist may do lying wonders . 4. he excepts against me that i say , god would rather have us judge that they are stumbling blocks , that people should not receive the truth , and most of his invectives are against this answ. nothing is so well said but may be depraved when a mans words are misinterpreted . my words are , we may think we ought to determine , that god may order accidents so , as to become stumbling blocks , that people should not receive the truth rather then by any accidents to determine a truth to be an untruth . which are different from that which mr. b. sets down as my words , 1. he recites my wordes thus [ they are ] as if they spake of the accidents next mentioned , whereas my words are [ god may order accidents so ] which note onely accidents possible . 2. whereas my words were comparatively spoken to this purpose , that accidents are so far from being a rule to determine of truth , that god sometimes orders them to become stumbling blocks , which is the same with that of moses , deut. 13. 3. the lord your god proveth by signes and wonders of the false prophet , to know whether you will keep his coommandments . mr. b. recites them thus [ we are to judge they are ( meaning such accidents ) stumbling blocks that people should not receive the truth ] as if i had spoken positively of those particular accidents forementioned , that god did order them to that end , whereas i onely to give reason of my advise of warinesse set down my observation comparatively , and spake of accidents that might be not of what were . which being thus stated , mr. bs. exceptions are answered , and shew either his inconsideratenesse in what he saies , or proneness to misconstrue what i speak . that which he puts in by the way of his opinion concerning the sin against the holy ghost , as if it did lie much in an infidelity against the convincing testimony of miracles , and of the not believing true miracles , and of gods ordering some wonders , and the accidents in new england , may be allowed him , yet makes nothing to prove that remarkable providences of god are a safe rule by which to judge what doctrine is true , and which is false . as for his words of me [ that it seemes if i had seen the wonders of egypt , i would not onely have been hardened as pharaoh , but judged god laid them as stumbling blocks ] i leave others to judge what spirit they proceed from , and do resolve that though he paint me as an incarnate devil or worse . i shall take him for a saint though a very distemper'd one . page 198. the scribe hath written in my words [ or none of them ] in stead of [ or to them onely . ] sect . xiv . that mr. b. doth not rightly expound christs rule , mat. 7. 15 , 16. nor is the unholinesse of men a note to know false doctrine by . page 199. he would vindicate his interpretation of mat. 7. 15. from my exception , and saith christ tells them how to discerne whole parties of false prophets , and not how to descerne every particular man that is such . but this is onely his saying , and the contrary is proved by these reasons , 1. those false prophets christ saies we shall know by their fruits , whom he bids us beware of : but they are not onely whole parties of them , but also every man that is such , ergo. the major is plaine by the term [ them ] which referres to the false prophets ver . 15. the minor i think mr. b. will not deny . 2. they are known by their fruits , which did come to them in sheepes clothing , but inwardly were ravening wolves ; for [ them ] ver . 16. relates to such . but these are particular men as such , and not onely whole parties ; otherwise christ should not bid beware of one false prophet , nor censure such a one as a wolfe , but onely whole parties of them : which had been very imprudently done so to expose his disciples to be a prey to single wolves , and onely warne them to take heed of a company of them together . then he askes me , but what real horeticks can mr. t. name that had holy lives ? it is hard to answer his question , because of the difficulty to determine who is a real heretique , some onely making him an heretique that holds an error against the foundation , others any error against the doctrine of christ , some make it necessary that it be held with pertinacy , some with a party , some against self-conviction . mr. bs. speeches shew he is not fully resolved . nor is it easie to determine who erres , nor what degree of holinesse is necessary to a holy life , or how it may be known . but i told mr. b. in my antidote pelagins , a●minius and some others have been reputed heretiques , and to have been of holy , and so have many zealous papists and others . but however ( saith mr. b. ) the best have made nothing to sacrifice the unity and peace of the church to their fancy , and rent it in pieces to strengthen their party : whence mr. b. seems to infer they had not holy lives , but were wicked . i answer , if any man of purpose do so , i cannot think him to live holily ; i know the wisdome from above is peaceable , jam. 3. 17. yet holy men thinking their fancy to be gods truth , may out of zeal to their opinion rend the church , and yet be holy men . mr. b. saith in his epist. dedic . to the saints everlasting rest direct . 5. that independency which gives the people to governe by vote , is the same thing with separation , which comes from pride and ignorance , and directly leades to the dissolution of all churches . then they that hold it hold their fancy , and rend the church by it , and so by mr. bs. rule none of them were of holy lives . if mr. b. censure so mr. atnsworth , mr. robinson stiled by rivet . explic. dec. exod. 20. praec . 4. vir pius , a godly man , &c. he will vent a more arrogant speech , then any he chargeth me with . mr. bs. opinions about faith and justification are by some counted fancies ; if he should by them make a breach in the church ; yet i durst not deny his life to be holy . he calls it my reproach , that i think it may be safely said , that there are proportionably as many unholy paedobaptists as of the opposites : to refute which he referres us to that said before , where i shall in its place examine it , and shew that he hath done much wrong to antipoedo baptists in two things , 1. in charging them with the evils of sundry who were never of their society . 2. in charging the evils of some few apostates upon all the churches , though they expressely rejected the persons , and declared even publiquely in print against their wicked principles and practises , yea have been the first and almost the onely men who have so declared , though many more then ever were of their churches have fallen into the wicked ranting wayes besides copp , and some others termed anabaptists . he tells me , lay aside the common people , and compare each party that are carried to it in judgement and in conscience , and experience will confute me , and then bids me shew who came to the height of cop , or those in germany . to which i say , who are carried to one side or other in judgement and conscience , it 's impossible to determine , and therefore such an estimation as mr. b. propoundes is not feasible : it 's known many have been wicked on both sides : copps and his followers madnesse is disclaimed by the churches in london under baptisme in their heart-bleedings for professors abominations , and therefore by austins rule should not be charged on the churches . whether hacket or any other were as wicked , who knowes but god ? the evil carriages of the men have risen from their opinion of high enjoyments of god in the spirit , when they left ordinances , as was observed in the levellers , not while they kept to baptisme and church-communion . mr. weld observed in his story of the antinomians page 40. that conceit of special revelations was the original of mrs. hutchinsons miscarriage , and the like is conceived of the anabaptists in germany , and the like tragedy was neare acting in new england as there . mr. b. i still judge does ill to aggravate so farre the actions of those in germany and some in england , as if no miscarriages of others were comparable . i am sure it is no rule to judge a doctrine false by this , that the professors miscarry , but only to make men wary and fearful . if it be , he must judge the same doctrine false by reason of some mens miscarriages , and true because of others godly living . page 200. he excepts against my logick , for saying it is not idem per idem to know a false prophet by his false doctrine . for what is a false prophet but one that preacheth false doctrine ? i answer , a false prophet is one that is not sent by god , as a false apostle , 2 cor. 11. 13. is one that is not an apostle of christ , and it is no trifling repetition of the same , but the sure note that christ gives , to say a false prophet is known by his false doctrine . ball trial of grounds for separation chap. 13. page 312. if we look into the scriptures of the old and new testament , we shall never find the prophets called true or false in respect of their outward calling , but in respect of their doctrine . when mr. b. interprets [ likely ] by [ ordinarily , or for the most part , or usually ] as our ordinary sense of that phrase , i think he mistakes in the meaning and use of the word , and that [ probably ] doth better answer to it then [ usually . ] however , sith he dare not say that constantly all false doctrines end in wicked lives , christs direction as he makes it [ to know false prophets by their wicked lives , which ordinarily though not constantly they end in however they begin otherwise ] is a very blind one for his people of kederminster to make use of , sith they cannot by it discerne an antinomian or anabaptist to be a false prophet to beware of them , till they have observed the end of a whole party proving wicked , which perhaps will not be till they are dead that are tempted by them . sect . xii . mr. bs. insinuations of the wickednesse of anabaptists is calumniatory , and vainly alleadged to condemne their doctrine of antipaedobaptisme : anabaptists and with them myself are vindicated from charges of schisme , neglect of the lords day , &c. page 201. to deterre his hearers from anabaptistry mr. b. had said , where hath there been known a society of anabaptists since the world first knew that proved not wicked ? a direct answer to this question thus propounded can hardly be made , nor is it necessary . it can hardly be made , it being a question that depends partly upon much reading of histories in former times both about the doctrine and manners of men comparatively obscure and contemned . whereas historians speak little but of eminent societies , and occurrences that make a remarkable change in the affaires of their time : and of things done in those ages in which historians are but few , and not of the best note , when greatest darknesse was on the church , and hardest censures of the best : partly upon an exact intelligence of the affaires of the present churches of so called anabaptists in many countreys , who have been so depressed by the opposite party as that it is somewhat hard to learne where they be . all the intelligence i can get of them is by bookes for the most part of them that are their adversaries . besides , it is very difficult to passe a censure upon a society , which is not a consistent but a flowing body , some members coming in , some cast out , some dying , same sound , some rotten , some removing dwellings , subject to change of ministers , opinions , &c. whether in the end they have proved wicked or not , it being usual that some in such societies do prove wicked , and others prove well . and what man is there that wants not either age to see the beginninig and end of such a society , or opportunity to know the state of all or most of such a society , or judiciousnesse to conclude whe her they proved wicked or not , it being certain that men may fall foully and yet die in christ , and there being no fixed rule for us to judge who dies wicked , who not . the wisest divines do advise caution in judging the final estate even of selfe-murtherers that have died with horrible speeches in their mouthes not long before their death . i thinke god onely fit to judge of mens final estate , and therefore think him fit onely to resolve mr. bs. question . if i should aske mr. b. where hath there been known a society of antiprelatists , that have not in the end proved wicked , i think it would be as hard a thing for mr. b. to give answer to it , as for me to give answer to his question . when men speak of men they speak as they are affected , some magnifying whom others debase , some counting that wicked which others count pious , he 's canonized as a saint , a martyr by some who is judged a traitor , malefactor by others . they that passe such a censure must trust much to informations , which whether they be partial or impartial , true or false who can tell ? nor is it necessary to answer mr. bs. question . for to what end ? is it thereby to conclude against me the doctrine they held ? but what may be known by the certain rule of scripture without this uncertain sign . and therefore i conceive of this question not unlike the artifice of the jesuites to deterre people from the plain doctrine the protestants hold by calling for catalogues of protestants in all ages , demanding where was your church before luther ? as if we must not own a manifest truth we find in scripture , unlesse we can produce teachers of it in former dayes , and societies of professors of it that were not wicked . yet i gave for answer some instances of some societies now in londor , 500. years ago in france , and some later in germany . as for those now in london , mr. b. saies , 1. they are not yet come to the proof ; when they have reached to the end of what they are tending to , then it will be seen what they will prove , if they do not return and repent . answ. what he meanes by the end of what the societies in london under baptisme ( i mean ) are tending to i know not . if he mean levelling , or ranting , or universal grace , they have as much for their number and quality opposed them as any other in london ; if he know any other dangerous end they aime at , it were fit it should be named , that their designe may be prevented : if not , who can interpret this speech of mr. b. but as from a man out of a settled hatred to the opinion unwilling to hope well of the persons , against the rule of charity , 1 cor. 13. 7. which hopeth all things in them for the future whom he knows not for present to be desperately bad , which he wil not say of the churches of anabaptists in germany , holland , england , of whom mr. b. in his book against mr. bedford page 310. saith thus : yea what will you say to all the churches of the anabaptists in germany , holland , england , &c. have none of them grace till baptized ? are you sure so many thousands are all unpardoned , or that god is not wont to pardon them and give them grace ? i dare not think so uncharitably of them . and after who dare think that it is ( of the anabaptists ) such an error as excludeth them from grace ? there have been societies of them for a great while , though somewhat latent afore these times , and of them many of the leaders are fallen asleep in the lord , many remain unblameable in respect of their faith and life . and therefore why mr. b. should so forebode as he doth the wicked end of the societies remaining i know no reason but his ill opinion of them . but should god in his just judgement let it fall out so that they should prove wicked , as some churches , yea the most famous , as the seven in asia have done , which have begun well and ended ill , it is no certain evidence against their doctrine , sith their miscarriages may come from other causes , whereof here and examen part . 2. sect . 5. some are assigned by me , and are such as have befallen others as well as they . 2. saith mr. b. it is hard with your cause when you cannot name one society of them that ever lived in the world that proved not wicked , except those now alive whose ends we yet see not . answ. 1. it were not hard with our cause though we name no society or person before our selves that were antipaedo baptists as long as we have the scripture for it . 2. if i could not name one society , yet there may be many , we have but obscure intelligence of many churches in the east and other places . the georgians children or the christians children of cholcis say heylin in his geography in the description of armenia , out of brerewood , alex. rosse in his censure of religio medici , &c. are not baptized till they be eight years old : how they live , what they be we have no clear intelligence probably honest though poore christians . the certain state of them in london is not known to many , much lesse the state of those farre off . 3. we have seen the ends of many of the societies to have been blessed : and how otherwise we now alive should see the end of a successive society , i do not well conceive , until is be quite dissolved . mr. b. addes . 3. if i were never so able to answer this , yet as the world goes it is not safe to speak all or half the wickednesse of the anabaptists now living , which the history of this age will speak to posterity . answ. 1. why it should not be safe for mr. b. to speak half the wickednesse of the anabaptists now living , i cannot divine , except it be , because if he or others speak of them while they live they may be convinced of lying , as beza did the tale of his dying a papist . they are not so many , nor so formidable in power , or so spiteful in spirit that it should be unsafe for mr. b. to tell the worst he knowes of them . however me thinks of any man mr. b. being according to his declaration of himself in such expectations of death as neare , and so resolute to speak truth , should not be moved by the unsafenesse of speaking truth . yea if mr. b. should speak all he could , i think he should not more exasperate them then he hath done part . 2. chap. 14. those that sit at the sterne i cannot yet learne have such hard thoughts of them as mr. b. and he that reades mr. edwards gangraena , mr. baillee his anabaptism , and other writings , may imagine that if there were worse matters to charge them with , they would not be spared in this age , especially by those that are out of their reach . after-historians may relate as partially as the present , and therefore i shall not think it lawful to condemne them upon such dark intimations as this , but think the better of them till their wickednesse be laid open . 4. saith mr. b. yet if you had named that society that are not guilty of schisme and demolishing the church by division and contempt and reproach of the godly . ministery and disobedience to those in government , further then they please them , and covenant-breaking , and neglect of the lords day , &c. you would credit the particular society if you make it good . in the meane time i see them rolling down the hill so fast that i think many have but one step lower to go . answ. schisme was imputed to protestants by papists , for their not joining in their corruptions with them , by prelatists to non-conformists , for not yielding to ceremonies of bishops . covel in his preface to his answer to burges , accused the most moderate of them as making a rent in the church , and breaking from the bishops ( even in that where in they were very passive ) choosing rather to for sake their function and calling then to yield conformity to the ceremonies of the church . allen and shepherd answer to mr. ball page 27. advert . to the read. say truly : scarce truth or error can now adaies be received but it is maintained in a way of schism . i confesse it is too true , that it is hard to name any society of anabaptists or infant-baptists that are not in a schisme , and commonly both parties guilty of making the breach . i am conscious to my selfe of using what meanes i could for reformation without schisme , if possible : but i find ( it as mens spirits are ) impossible : yet mr. b. is not ashamed to tell the world in print , that he hath as good evidence that i am a sect-master , as that i am a christian. i made to mr. m. in the epilogue of my examen as faire notions as i could devise , yea such as a holy sweet-spirited man and understanding did much rejoice to reade , and blessed god for it afore i sent it to mr. m. yet mr. m. and mr. ley interpreted them as the challenge of a braving goliath . i was desirous to see mr. bs. arguments in writing . he would not , but prints in a way that proclaimes to the world , that he loo es on me and all the societies of antipaedobaptists as persons intolerable . infant-baptisme we see to be a manifest corruption , we know it hath no precept or example expresse or virtual in scripture , that it with infant-communion began some ages from christs birth upon the conceit of necessity to save an infant from perishing : we know it is a duty to be baptized , yea by christ made a concurring requisite to salvation with believing , marke 16. 16. and so a fundamental by mr. bs. rule in his addition to the preface of the second part of his saints everlasting rest , where he defines fundamentals those things which god hath made the conditions of salvation . infant-baptizers will not baptize believers , yea they inveigh , abhorre both the opinion and practise we conceive a necessary important duty . we can scarce come to their meetings , but we must heare the truth bitterly declaimed against , persons that hold it reviled , error published , infant-baptisme practised ; if we be silent we are judged to consent , if we speake it makes an uproare : we are painted out so deformed as that men are almost afraid to have speech with us , or to hear us , or to joine in communion with us . magistrates are by writings and sermons incited against us . i know not what we can do lesse then be baptized as christ appoints , and receive the lords supper . mr. b. page 341. counts the error of the old and new socinians denying the continuance of baptisme as a standing ordinance in the church , nothing so bad as my opinion , upon a frivolous pretence as if i made void the end of baptisme in that where in the true end of baptisme is preserved , which is that the baptized engageth himself to be christs disciple . so that even as the rigid lutherans for their consubstantiation had rather joine with papists then calvinists , mr. b. is more willing to comply with that antichristian , and i had almost said atheistical way of living above ordinances , then favour anabaptists . in this case if there be schisme in our practise , let all the world judge whether we be not passive rather then active , and whether the true cause of it be in us , or mr. bs. and others invectives and actings against us . we make not schisme , but suffer it : mr. b. by this last book hath done more to promote it then any anabaptist i know , and how farre the wayes of other antagonists have been from peace , the intelligent will perceive though i be silent . contempt and reproach of godly ministers by men of opposite parties , is very frequent and mutual . i have often endeavoured , but cannot expresse it : yet that societies of anabaptists as they are a body do so i do not find . as for obedience to governours further then they please them , the moderne so called anabaptists in england and holland may vye with their adversaries . the accidents of this year in england which i am unwilling to mention , may serve to wipe away the reproach of anabaptists in this respect . covenant-breaking till instance be given wherein is so general a charge that an answer cannot be given . i know men are taken to break covenant who conceive they keep it . neglect of the lords day i think cannot be charged on the societies of anabaptists , however it may be on some members . some of the leaders of them appear sound in this point . mr. blackwood apostol . bapt . the jewish sabbath being put to an end , col. 2. 16. we observe the lords day from the apostles example , and the morality of the fourth com. which requires one day in seven . mr. edward harrison paedobapt . oppugned page 4. makes the rule for one day in seven moral and natural , and the altering the day simply evangelical from apostolical example , which having not meerly temporary reason is enough to prove an institution from christ , which sort of proof we have , acts 20. 7. 1 cor. 16. 1 , 2. mr. b. knowes the protestant churches beyond-sea more guilty of loosenesse in opinion and practise about the lords day then english anabaptists ▪ when mr. b. speaks of their rolling down the hill so fast in placing their religion in full mouth'd oathes and blasphemies , &c. it is very hard for mr. b. to charge that upon them , which is the act of some particular persons whom they condemne , and warne others of , and whereof not a few have been of other societies then theirs . my second instance 500. years ago i have vindicated before . my third instance is of societies at this day in the low countreys , and mr. b. answers about them , of whom bullinger and others wrote who were dead afore they were borne , which is not to the businesse . yet mr. b. might consider that it is confessed that even then menno simonis detested muncer , & becold , as becman . exercit. theol. 21. page 359 , 362. acknowledgeth , that even then there were aliqui innocentiâ vitae commendabiles , commendable for their innocency of life , as heresbachius relates histor. anabapt . monast . c. 8. and those at this day it 's likely are not guilty of much scandal in practise , when cloppenburg . gangr . anabapt . disput . 148. ampliug . dial . thesi . 2. mr. paget defence of church-govern . part . 1. ch . 4. who lived neare them , make it their fault that they are strict in excommunicating for small matters , and cloppenburg . in the epistle dedicatory to his gangrene saith , the troopes of anabaptists that dwelt in friesland after the commotions at munster , although they trouble not the common-wealth having cast off corporal weapons , yet they suffer not the more pure reformed churches to be edified without daily conflicts . from whence i gather that their conversation there is as other mens , saving for their rigid discipline and different opinions : in the most whereof whether truly or falsly charged on them by cloppenburgius , they are not owned by those in england whose confession is extant . to mr. bs. charging of me of untruths , and covetousnesse , and malice , and contempt of my brethren page 202 , 203. there is an answer made before and after where speeches and practises to prove these are objected . he chargeth me with pride in my usual way of putting off the authority of their arguments and judgements with a contemptuous smile , or wonder at the sillinesse of them . but therein there is no despising of their persons , but onely of their arguments : which if i know to be weak i dare not make shew as if i counted them strong : that were to put darknesse for light , and if i do shew dislike with a smile or wonder ( though others rather say i do reject them with anger mistaking my earnestnesse in speaking for that passion ) this is usually lesse offensive then alteration of wordes . and if i use wondering at their sillinesse , i am sure mr. b. is not behind me in this book , whose frequent exclamations of sillinesse , &c. are to be seene where he had little or no cause but the defect of his own apprehension , as shall appear in the examining his book , and therefore if for this i be judged proud mr. b. should do well to search himself who differs from the most learned and godly in the world in more things then i do , and i imagine with more peremptorinesse and lesse evidence then i bring from my adversaries own confessions . perfidiousnesse he chargeth me not with : it is a great question in this age whether it be a sin . answ. i think it is no question whether breaking of covenants and oathes be a sin : but whether the not setling uniformity according to the advice of the assembly at westminster , the not conjoining with the scots , the engagement to the present government , &c. be perfidiousnesse or no wherein if mr. b. hold the affirmative , it 's very probable there will be found some to encounter with him , when his arguments are seen in writing . what he tells me , that my not reproving the prophaning the lords day , and excusing my self from resolving the question concerning its morality hath no good savour , is a charge which i imagine comes from some tale brought mr. b. whereby he is abused . i have spoken against prophaning the lords day as i have judged meet in the places i have preached : my judgement about its morality is succinctly set down examen part 2. sect . 8. at bewdley i did often in my prefaces before i began morning-exercises at the chappel on the lords day presse them to the observation of it , and in my cursory exposition of the three first chapters of the revelation on publique fast-dayes , and of genesis on the lords day , delivered my self more fully in opening gen. 2. 3. revel . 1. 10. and when the question was propounded in the weekly meeting we had to edifie one another , whether the observation of every first day of the week as a sabbath , be of divine institution ? i resolved it at the next meeting affirmatively . and after i had in one or two lectures ( for so i may call my dictates at bewdley in resolving their hard questions ) cleared the termes , 1. concerning the measure of the first day of the week , examining whether precisely 24. houres , and when to begin , and when to end , are necessary for the account of the time , resolving it to be measured for observation as we do other dayes for working , allowing time for necessities . 2. concerning the observation of a sabbath , what is requisite thereto ; wherein i resolved that it is to be observed by rest and holinesse , about both which i resolved many cases . at the next time i drew the substance of my proof into this one syllogisme . if solemne worship of god in full congregations be required of god , and fixed dayes be necessary thereto , and observed by all or most nations even heathens , nor belongs it to any but god to appoint it to his service , and god appointed a seventh day sabbath from the beginning , and commanded it in the fourth commandement a mong the morals , and the apostles distinguished from other dayes the lords day by title , precept and example , as appropriate to god , and christians with common consent so took it , and used it after their dayes the jewish sabbaths being abrogated , then the observation of every first day of the week as a sabbath is of divine institution . but solemn worship of god , &c. ergo. the sequel of the major i stood not long in proving , supposing some morality of a sabbath being infolded in the first institution and the fourth commandement and the apostles fixing that on the lords day , is a sufficient declaration of gods mind to have it observed . but the minor i proved by parts . and after i had proved the two first propositions , by reason first of the failing of the meeting through some sad accidents , and then the removing of my dwelling & books , and my seldome being with them , i did not prosecute it till one moved that i would resolve them about that question , whether it were to tempt me or otherwise they know who had a hand in it . i told them what i had done already , and that of what i had begun i had not any breviate about me , but i conceived that in my study i had , and therefore i desired their respite till my next comming to them , that i might by reviewing what i had done and adding some further reading fit my self to resolve them : in which they seemed to rest , but it 's likely some or othertold mr. b. of this , who i perceive wanted not tale-bearers , and he in imagine sticks not to interpret this my respite ( which he calls an excuse from resolving the question concerning the morality of the lords day , though i had long before resolved it , but had not fully confirmed my argument ) as having some ill savour of licentiousnesse , though about a moneth after i repaired to them , and so fully confirmed the other seven propositions , that the company ( who were as many of the best-affected and intelligent there as the roome could hold ) declared themselves satisfied thereabout . mr. b. also page 258. saies of my exceptions against one story in the book of gods judgements on sabbath-breakers , he is jealous lest it be from no good will to the doctrine of the morality of the christian sabbath , as being against the scope of the book , though the occasion shew it was onely to prove the uncertainty of relations , that men may not rest on them as proofes of a truth . but i perceive as mr. b. is very prone to have hard thoughts of me , so both he and mr. m. seek advantage to create prejudice against me about this point of the lords day , which makes me more full in my clearing my self in this thing , and in other things , not so much regarding my own personal esteeme , as desirous to prevent that indirect way of wounding the truth through my sides . i would have no man adhere to my tenet because it 's mine , nor would i have any to reject it because it is mine . i know too much evil by my self , yet not in the things in which i am accused , at least not in that degree in which mr. b. accuseth me . mr. bs. telling me in print this manner of crimes not proved , but imagined is no whit justified by the rules and examples he brings : his ranking me with seducers i defy , and know that i shall better be able to prove it against him , then he against me . sect . xvi . the ground of my opposing infant-baptism is confirmed by mr. b. himself . page 205. he tells me all the ministers and schollers that he can meete with , that heard my disputes , did think i had silly grounds to build my confidence in : and though i boast much of my answers by writing , he thinks my writings have little to be boasted of . answ. i have some experience of ministers and schollers , and i sind few fit to judge of controversies , and of those few not many willing to search impartially into a point that 's against the streame , and likely to expose them to hard measure : some that talk much study little , nor is it a new thing to find some that wrangle in dispute for such a sense of a scripture as when they are out of the heat of dispute they themselves expound otherwise . the ministers and schollers at the dispute , such as they were , weigh but little with them that know them best . my writings are not boasted of by me , yet men equal to mr. b. or any auditors of the dispute have said more of them then i am willing to speak of . my imployment in this argument seemes to me to be part of my work god hath allotted me , though i am known not to be idle in other work . what mr. b. calls fallacies passing from me , will be proved verities . my arguments from mat. 28. 19. marke 16. 15 , 16. are to be found in my exercit. sect . 15. examen part . 4. sect . 1. to which mr. ms. replies are insufficient as i shall shew in my review . in the worship of god it was wont to be accounted a certain rule , that gods worship should be observed according to his appointment and no otherwise . and so protestant divines argue from 1 cor. 11. 28. selfe-examiners are appointed to eate , ergo no infants or younglings , though young ones ate the passeover . yea mr. b , himself page 221. if christ never sent any but ministers to baptize then no others may do it . if there be no example of any but ministers that have baptized ( though parenrs did circumcise ) then no others may do it : ( for the apostles established the church according to gods mind ; and the scripture is a sufficient rule ) page 222. if there be no command or example in scripture of any but ministers administring the lords supper then no others may do it . page 342. if we have no warrant by word or example in all the new testament ( since the solemne institution of baptisme , mat. 28. ) to admit any member into the church without baptisme , but both percept and example of admitting them by it : then we must not admit any without it ( ordinarily ) i take his own medium mutatis mutandis , and thence inferre , if we have no warrant by word or example in all the new testament ( since the solemne institution of baptisme mat. 28. ) to admit any member into the church by baptisme but believers by profession , but both precept and constant example of admitting them by it , then we must not admit any without it ( ordinarily ) i use his own words and texts . but the antecedent is evident , john 4. 1. acts 2. 38 , 41. and 8. 12 , 13 , 16 , 36 , 38. and 9. 18. and 10. 47 , 48. and 16. 15 , 33. and 18. 8. and 19. 3 , 4 , 5. rom. 6. 3. &c. the consequent is undoubted to those that take the word for their rule . if mr. b. will stand to his own argument he must make good my arguing from . mat. 28. 19. marke 16. 15 , 16. unlesse he have some such strange shift as mr. cotton puts in the mouth of silvanus ( who personates himself ) in his book intitled , the grounds and ends of baptisme in the preface page 3. where he intimates that the urging against childrens baptism this main principle of purity and reformation , to wit [ that no duty of gods worship nor any ordinance of religion is to be administred in the church but such as hath just warrant from the word of god ] is from satan , but from god when it is urged against the prelatists and papists : so mr. b. thinks his medium good against socinians , but not ( though it be the same ) for the anabaptists . he addes , all your confident words shew me not the least ground for your conclusion no more then thus : scripture requireth faith to justification , therefore none but believers are justified : which is false , yet like yours , if i know what you would thence deduce . answ. he now i hope knowes what and how i deduce , or rather how mr. b. deduceth my conclusion from mat. 28. 19. marke 16. 15 , 16. not onely in my words , but also his own ( though i had often long before deduced my argument in the places before quoted , and elsewhere in my writings ) of the validity of which deduction i am the more confident , because it is in mr , bs. own words justly brought by me against himself . if the scripture requireth saith of all to justification , then it is not false that none but believers are justified . yet infants may be justified by habitual faith or actual by operation in an extraordinary way : but the scripture requires profession of faith afore any be baptized ordinarily . as for what may be done extraordinarily elsewhere i have expressed my self , and have vindicated my self from the wrong inferences made thence postscript sect . 15. and elsewhere . page 206. the people of kederminster did not heare from my mouth in the dispute jam. 1. how little anabaptists could say in the hardest point of baptisme : for i used no such wordes , nor any thing i said or omitted to say can infer it : and when they have read my answer me thinks they should believe i could say more then i did say then , and see the reason why no more was said then . it is a meere calumny that he saith , i chose out the weakest arguments or urged some that were strong in a way of my own , and then triumphed and answered as weakely in my sermons . to my best understanding i chose out the best arguments i found in mr. m. mr. g. dr. h. m. drew , mr. blake , mr. cobbet , and some others , and that for the most partin their own words , which that i might not mistake i read in the pulpit , & therefore what ever my answers were , i am sure it is an untruth that i chose out the weakest arguments , and urged some that were strong in a way of my own . when i threatned mr. b. with the danger he went in or opposing me , unlesse it were from god for opposing truth i know not , and therefore take this supposed threatning of mine to be either his , or his tale-tellers fiction . sect . xvii . the grosse absurdities to which mr. b. vaunted i was driven in the dispute , were not so as he imagined . page 207. he makes a catalogue of my absurdities at the dispute , to which ( being the chief thing he charged me with in the epistle to the people of kederminster ) i answer . the first and second will be shewed to be no absurdities in examining the first part of his book chap. 6. the third is no absurdity , understanding it of visible membership by profession of their own , in which notion i said in the dispute i understood visible church-membership , as commonly protestant divines do . upon what occasion the fourth and many other of them were spoken by me ( if they were spoken by me ) i cannot remember , nor what limitations or explications i then used , but this i conceive was my meaning , that infants of the jewes were not visible church-members in the wildernesse in that manner they were when they had circumcision , that is , by their visible particular note or mark , and yet then they were visible in the lump , the whole congregation being then gods visible church : in which sense they were then visible , and so the women too who were not circumcised . and when i said no infant can be said to be a visible church-member without some act of his own : i meant it of visibility according to the note of visibility in the christian church . which things being rightly understood , there was neither absurdity , nor contradiction in my speeches , nor any thing against conscience , nor deserving such derision as was in mr. b. and his collegues , though perhaps through distraction of thoughts chiefely occasioned by mr. bs. concealing the notion in which he used the terme [ visible ] which i often in vain assayed to understand from him , or forgetfulnesse , or scantnesse of words i did not expresse my self clearly . this is answer sufficient about the fourth , fifth , sixth , seventh , eighth , nineth , sixteenth pretended absurdities . the tenth a candid man would have conceived rather to have been lapsum linguae , a flip of speech , then errorem mentis , a fault of mind , and that however a mistake might slip from me ( a thing very incident to the most learned in the heat of dispute , yea sometimes in preaching , conference and writing ) yet i meant [ visibility ] to be the adjunct , and the persons visible to be the subject . the eleventh , twelfth , thirteenth i conceive no absurdities , the church-visibility of infants then being from that imperfect church-frame , which was to continue onely till christ came , and was clogged with many burdens , which by christs coming all were mercifully freed from , as , to go up to jerusalem thrice a year , &c. without any losse of mercy to infants , though it were for a time a mercy to them : which will be morefully cleared ( god assisting ) in answering mr. bs. argument p. 1. chap. 6. the fourteenth is no absurdity , as i then to my best remembrance expressed it , though mr. bs. juvenility thought fit to make sport with it , that the elect people of the jews were natural ( not as mr. b. sets it down naturally ) that is according to nature , in that they were descended from abraham ( the roote of the church of believers ) by natural generation , and so natural branches , yet not by nature , that is , natural abilities or works of their own , but by grace as the efficient cause , rom , 11. ver . 5 , 6. to conceive it , the olive there notes a race of men who were the church of believers , which because after abraham the roote it was first in the jewish nation , is called their own olive : ver . 24. of which abraham is ver . 16 , 18. made the roote bearing two sorts of branches , some ingraffed who were the gentile believers , some natural the jewes , and he is a roote under a double habitude , one as a natural father , and another as father of believers . both sorts of branches are by the apostle made to stand in abraham the roote as branches of the church of believers or the invisible , the one natural in that they were not proselyted or ingraffed , but came of abraham by natural generation , the other proselyted or ingraffed by believing 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , besides the natural way of descent from abraham , yet both united in abraham the common roote of believers , and in the olive-tree the church of believers , as particular branches thereof : yet neither by nature , that is , by vertue of natural generation , as the apostle determines , rom. 9. 8. but by election of grace , rom. 11. 5 , 6. and whereas mr. b. tells me , rom. 11. 24. sayes both , he is mistaken . for 1. it is not said that any was a branch of the roote abraham by nature , but that the ingraffed branches were antecedently to their ingraffing in the olive wild by nature : nor is it said of the branches from the roote that are called natural , that they were branches in the true olive by nature , as mr. b. would have it to prove them of the visible church by nature : but that they were branches of that olive or race of men who were not wilde by nature , that is gentiles bringing no fruit to god , but of that olive which was descended from abraham by natural generation , which was the church of god till broken off . 2. whereas the translation turnes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ver . 21 , 24. by [ natural ] and once ver . 24. [ by nature ] yet it is the same terme 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in all . 3. it is not true that the jewes in the translation of ver . 24. are said to be branches by nature . and for the fifteenth absurdity it is no absurdity : they are called natural onely in respect of their descent as men from abraham , but not as branches in the olive-tree . and this is clear . for the ingraffed branches can be said to be no otherwise 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 besides nature , but in that they were not descended from abraham by natural generation , and therefore on the contrary the jews are natural branches , not as believers , but as men descended from abraham by natural generaration . the seventeenth absurdity is a relation of a speech of mine that mr. b. cannot finde one author expounding 1 cor. 7. 14. of infants covenant-holinesse in his sense before luther , and zuinglius ; and then askes , is this irue ? i answer , i think it is , and if he can produce any one , me thinks he should have done it in his book . if he do , he will do more then mr. ms. friend better versed as i conceive in antiquity then mr. b. hath done , though attempting it page 21. of mr. ms. defence of his sermon . two places ; he cites ; one in tertullian , which i have answered in my apology page 85. the other in athanasius qu. 114. ad antiochum , as teaching infant-baptisme by vertue of federal holinesse from 1 cor. 7. 14. but , 1. the author is confessedly spurious , by rivet . critic . sac . l. 3. c. 6. scultetus part . 2. medul . patr. l. 1. c. 42. perkins preparat . to the demonstr . of the probleme . the works falsely imposed on athanasius are these . the book of divers questions of the holy scripture unto king antiochus ; for therein great athanasius is cited . yet mr. m. or his friend hath these words ubi supra . these wordes then which are safe and sound , grounded upon tho same scripture which i have much insisted on are read in the works of athanasius : where the question is about infants dying requiring a resolution , that might clearely set whether they go to be punished or to the kingdome . the answer is , seeing the lord said , suffer little children to come unto-me , for of such is the kingdome of heaven . and the apostle sayes ; now your children are holy ( observe the gospel-ground the same that i build upon ) it is manifest that the infants of believers which are baptized do as unspotted and faithfull enter into the kingdome . this assertion is owned by all the reformed churches ] but had mr. m. or his friend recited the words fully then it would have appeared how impertinently the words are alleadged to prove the baptizing of infants by vertue of federal holines from 1 cor. 7. 14. & that none of the reformed churches would own the doctrine of that author , being built on no gospel-ground , but popish opinion of limbus infantum . for the entire words are these qu. 114. ad antiochum , whither go dying infants to punishment or the kingdome ? and where are the infants of believers dying unbaptized disposed , with the believers or unbelievers ? answ. the lord saying , suffer little children to come : for of such is the kindome of heaven , and again the apostle saying , but now are your children holy , it is manifest that the infants of believers baptized go into the kingdome as unspotted and believing : but the unbaptized and heathenish neither go into the kingdome nor into punishment : for they have done no sin . which answer plainly determines that infants of believers if baptized enter into the kingdome : but neither the unbaptized infants of believers or heathens enter into the kingdome or punishment : for they have done no sin . not a word of federal holinesse , but the plain popish doctrine that infants dying unbaptized go to limbus infantum , but the baptized into the kingdome of heaven : which is the same with the doctrine father'd on fustin martyr . qu. 56. ad orthod . now this is contrary to what the reformed churches assert even from 1 cor. 7. 14. that the children of believers are federally holy afore baptisme , and go into the kingdome though they die unbaptized . nor doth the alleadging 1 cor. 7. 14. prove that the author observed the gospel-ground ( more truly antievangelical or jewish ) which mr. m. buildeth on . for the holinesse in that author is meant either of holinesse in possibility in being likely to be baptized , because believing parents would likely breed them up in christianity and they be baptized , in which sense tertull. de anima c. 39. expoundes the apostle as calling them holy not in act barely by descent from a believer , but because designati sanctitatis , or as hierome epist. 153. ad paulinum alledging , tertullian de monogamia , quod candidati sint fideiet nullis idololatriae sordibus polluantur , which erasmus in his glosse on hierom , renders thus , quodvelut ambiunt et exspectant baptismum ; or else of actual holinesse in being baptized , believers being wont to baptize their infants when neare danger of death not by reason of covenant-holinesse , but the giving of grace by baptisme , and the necessity of it to save an infant from perishing . i am still confident that neither father nor interpreter preceding the sixteenth century did interpret 1 cor. 7. 14. of holinesse of separation to god as visible church-members by gods covenant to them : nor doth chamier panstras . cathol . tom . 4. l. 5. cap. 10. bring any though he purposedly sets down the various opinions about the holinesse there meant , and sayes omnes complecti conabor & examinare sententias . sure i am augustin . tom . 7. l. 2. de pecc . mer. & remis . c. 26. saith , ac per hoc & illa sanctificatio cujuscunque modi sit quam in filiis fedelium esse dixit apostolus , ad istam de baptismo & de peccati origine vel remissione omnino non pertinet : nam & conjuges infideles in conjugibus fidelibus sanctificari dicit eo ipso lo●o , &c. unto which i think good to adde , that whereas mr. m. in his defence page 10. 58. brings in the pelagians acknowledging that infants were baptized secundum sententiam evangelii , which he imagines to be the gospel-ground ( as he calls it ) of federal holinesse from the covenant to the believer and his seed in aug. tom . 7. l. 2. contra pelag. & coelest . c. 5. that he hadadded the next words [ quia dominus statuit regnum coelorum non nisi baptizatis posse conferri ] it would have appeared , that the gospel he meant was john 3. 5. which with rom. 5. 12. was elleadged in those dayes as a reason of the churches tradition of infant-baptisme , and no other reason can i finde for infant-baptisme , nor in any the exposition of 1 cor. 7. 14. in mr. ms. or mr. bs. sense till zwinglius his dayes . the eighteenth absurdity is , that i said the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is taken many hundred times for authority , and askes is that true ? to which i answer , this was spoken in the dispute , when i had not time or means to collect the number of times wherein 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is used for authority in scripture , and therefore spake at adventure , and if i did hyperbolize it might be neitheir absurdity nor untruth so to speak , as is frequent in speakers & writers without imputation of falshood . nevertheless i find it used above an hundred times in the new testament , in matthew 10. and 6. of them it is traslated authority , and in most places where it is translated power , it might be translated authority , and if it be used for liberty in any of these places , yet it is no where used for a veile but one , 1. cor. 11. 10. and i doubt not but it is used for authority , or power , or liberty many hundreds of times in the lxx greek of the old testament , though i have not a greek concordance of the old testament , to number them by , and therefore there is neither absurdity , nor untruth in any speech any more then in that john 21. 15. though i conceive there is scarce need of an hyperbole to verifie it , but am sure mr. b. trifles in putting this into the score of my absurdities to which i was driven . to the nineteenth i do not remember i said , the corinthians doubted whether their living together were fornication . my resolution and exposition of the apostles words will be made good against this exception , in answering mr. bs. fifth argument c. 29. of the first part , which i intend to fit for the presse with as much speed as i can . to the twentieth i have in my examen of mr. ms. sermon , exercit. antidote and review shewed a ground of necessity to take the apostles words , 1 cor. 7. 14. in my sense , not in mr. bs. the reply to which made by mr. b. will appear to be insufficient upon the examination of chap. 29. of the first part of his book . the one & twentieth absurdity which mr. b. would fasten on my arguing as most absurd , and like a right anabaptist ( in his scoffing language ) is meerly from his mistake of my expression , as if by present prayer i meant prayer coexistent and continued during the use of the thing sanctified : whereas my meaning was to exclude an habit of prayer without the act , and actual prayer interrupted in its course , through lapse into such sin as davids adultery , in which time things are not sanctified to real believers till repentance restore their sanctifying exercise . and so the two and twentieth and four and twentieth absurdities which mr. b. makes so horrid , are also answered , nor was the three and twentieth an absurdity . mr. b. himself page 98. limits the speech [ all things are pure to the pure ] that is , all things good and lawfull ; and is not this all one as to say [ some things are pure ; ] nor is it unusual to limit such universal termes , as the matter requires , as 1 cor. 13. 7. & 10. 23. &c. the twentiefith and twentiesixth were no absurdities , but fit answers to so trifling arguments . for the terme [ disciple ] importing one that hath learned , it is but trifling to argue [ infants of believers are disciples ] without proving they have learned ; and the reason why they have not learned is because they are untaught ; and if mr. b. had further asked why they are not taugh , i would have answered , because ordinarily uncapable , and god both not extraordinarily shewn them this mercy : but because i perceived he was about to leave the plain way of proving them disciples , by shewing that the notation and use of the word disciple ( which himself page 92. confesseth to come from the act of learning ) did agree to them , never imagining that ridiculous sense in which he takes the word [ disciple ] page 14. as a relation without a foundation without actual learning for the present , or so much as an assay , intention or capacity to learn , and making actual learning the end of an infants being a disciple , who hath no thoughts of it , and that he sought to winde about an intangling discourse about gods mercy to infants , which though it were but frivolous in respect of the thing to be proved , to wit , the appliablenesse of the word [ disciple ] to infants , yet being popular and pausible , would be taking with the auditors ( which i quickly perceived he affected ) . i conceived on the sudden the answers i gave fittest , and so still do think . the last in number is no absurdity , but if mr. b. put in [ actual ] used by him in the dispute , and understand it of circumcision as acted barely , not as taught , and put in the terme [ yoke ] it is mr. bs. absurdity to maintain the contrary as is proved above . and for the latter part it is no absurdity , nor seemed to grot. annot . in mat. 11. 29. jugum mandata singnificat . it à vox ista sumitur , act. 15. 10. & johannes hunc locum explicans pro jugo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 dixit , 1. epist. 5. 3. to like purpose pareus in mat. 11. 30. where he useth the terme jugum doctrinae , the yoke of doctrine , applied to the gospel in opposition to the yoke of the law , acts 15. 10. so the n. annot. on mat. 11. 29. acts 15. 10. 1 john 5. 3. pisc. sch . on act. 15. 10. the yoke ] to wit , the law of moses by comparing it with verse 5. deod . on mat. 11. 30. calls it the rigorous yoke of the law unsufferable without christ , and therefore unsufferable not so much for the labour in observing it , as the imperfection to quiet the conscience , and the condemnation it bound to for not keeping it , on acts 15. 10. my arguing to prove the repeale of infants church-membership was onely lamentable , in that it met with such a contemptuous respondent , who judgeth that idem , per idem , which was rationally thus . the repeale of church-membership was proved from the altering the church-state from jewish national to christian personal , this proved from the different call , this proved from the different way god took to gather his church in the new testament from the old , by preaching not authority of superiors as when he brought the family of abraham , and the jewish nation into covenant . what the ministers ( so called ) which sate next mr. b. judged i passe not . they were much deceived in their judgement about my arguing , and my being mated and puzzled then . what ever puzzling i had was in the beginning , when i was almost at a stand what to answer , and therefore varied my answers by reason of my not understanding where that ordinance of infants visible church-membership unrepealed mr. b. speakes of is , and in what sense mr. b. called them visible church-members and disciples under the goipel , which then i understood not , nor did he explaine so as that i could clearly understand him , nor so fully since by his book , but that by much diligence i am fain to pick it out by comparing one passage and expression with another . it is untrue that not knowing what to say i was resolved to say something , lest if i were silent the people should think i were worsted , or that i requested him to name my absurdities : or that by private confessions or by my own confession i was conscious of absurdities i was driven to . sect . xviii . the grosse untruths mr. b. chargeth me with , are not such . page 209. mr. b. chargeth me with six grosse untruths , though my words were not assertions , but intimations : neverthelesse i conceive not any untruth in them . for , 1. however the motion was not sudden , nor the yielding to it sudden , yet the assault was sudden , without any rules for orderly mannaging the dispute , or notaries on both sides to take it , &c. which i imprudently ommitted , not expecting such a solemne meeting as i found , and because of the opinion i had of mr. b. as more candid in taking my answers , and explaining himself , and yielding to other things which might sift the truth , then i found him . 2. it is not true , i forced mr. b. to the dispute . the words of my letter dated december 27. 1649. foure dayes before the dispute were these . sir , my message was this , sith i intend on the next lords day to prosecute what i have begun in examining the hypotheses , upon which the argument from circumcision for infant-baptisme ( which is the paedobaptists achilles ) is built , i was willing to invite you to be a hearer , and if you judged it meet to oppose what you should think good in a logick way without rhetorick : yet if you choose to come over either munday or tuesday , i shall be ready to justifie my doctrine openly , or privately by word or writing as it shall be judged convenient . mr. b. choosing tuesday jan. 1. a seat was provided for him with some kind of state , ministers and schollers ( such as they were ) sent for over the countrey , placed on each side mr. b. which with mr. bs. carriage in the beginning to propound that question ( which i had not then meddled with in my sermons or printed books ) about the manner of baptizing , and in that manner as served for no other purpose but to create prejudice , besides his fallacious disputing in the beginning , did cause apprehensions in me of the designe of bearing down me and the truth by indirect wayes , which before i dreamed not of : which if mr. b. were not privy to yet was he instrumental to promote , which i confesse did not a little perplex me and streightned my thoughts and expressions . 3. that mr. b. did conceale his arguments me thinks he should not deny , who denies not that he would not give me animadversions on my written notes , nor let me have his arguments in writing . to the rest of his questions answer enough is already given . 4. it is no untruth that i had scarce time afforded me to repeale his arguments : yea at first it was expressely denied me till mr. good informed mr. b. that it was the rule of schools the respondent should repeat the arguments . and it was once confessed ingenuously that mr. bs. syllogismes were so long as that they could not be easily repeated : which was very true of some of them , contrary to the use of schools being hypothetical syllogismes to prove an hypothetical proposition . it is true that mr. b. would open his termes , viz. the chief terme [ visible church-member ] when i asked him by what note he meant infants were discernable as visible church-members , he did not tell me his note to my best remembrance , and when i did distinguish of visible by profession , or some other way , because i did not express the other member of the distinction ( though i could not do it till he explained what other way he conceived as being a visible church-member besides profession ) he derided me . 6. it is true also that he checked me with satyrical quips , as that he could not help my memory , when i did not repeate rightly his long syllogisme , hat he came not to be catechized , when i asked him of his meaning about the terme [ visible ] . his speech of my defying the armies of israel , and calling , give me a man to dispute , &c. for my uncircumcised opinion is conservant with mr. m. and mr. ley their unjust and false charges of me to which i answered in my apology sect . 7. and mr. bs insulting speech thereupon is not without shew of vain glory . page 211. he blames me for desiring his arguments in writing , though not denying the validity of any one of his reasons against writing , many mens writings being yet unaswered by me , my answer to mr. ms. defence being weak , that i have done him great injury in forcing him to write . answ. the desire i and others had to see his arguments in writing , was because we could not otherwise well judge of them , which he might easily have done being those as he saith he preached at coventrey , and had written in his book at the dispute , and therefore might have been easily communicated to us . his reasons against writing i took to be excuses of his unwillingnesse to gratifie us in our request , and that they were meer excuses his printing proveth , to which he was never ferced by me , as he falsely pretends in his title page , and if he be injured it is by himself , whose own minde , or some others designe using him as their instrument , carried him to it ; and though i am glad to see his arguments in writing , yet i take it for the greatest injury that ever i received from man , that he hath so unworthily abused me and the truth , ( which i pray god forgive him ) expecting also if he live both righting me and the truth . of answering mr. cobbet i have said enough already , mr. church , and mr. rutherfords are in effect the same with mr. ms. and others : by overthrowing in my sermons the hypotheses of the covenant , seal , baptismes succession to circumcision they were answered . mr. drew's main argument page 23. though his book by the author of the lawfulnesse of obeying the present govenrment be judged to be written with sharp reasons and mild language , yet either there are foure termes in it , or else it concludes we are to circumcise . the dispute of mr. baily had been shewed to be very fallacious , if my letter to the press had found one willing to print it . i desired to have mr. bs. arguments in writing besides these , because he was better known to those of bewdley . i compare not my self with men excellent in writing , nor do i think i used the terme [ silly people ] though mr. bs. notary so wrote it , page 212. how unseemly mr. bs. language was i have said afore . i conceived it necessary mr. b. should explain his termes to satisfie the people , who could not judge of his proof without knowing his meaning , which might have been done , and yet strict disputing observed : which mr. b. denied , though this were or should have been the end of the dispute , and the occasion of it led him to it . if [ for peace ] and [ for fear of scandal ] be equipollent ( as i take them to be in these speeches ) then [ truth must not be lost for fear of scandal ] and [ no truth is to be concealed so as to be lost for peace ] differ not as much as truth from a most destructive falsehood , as mr. b. saith page 215. austin i think hath the words i cited in that sermon , my book of scandals page 273. and in my apology page 5. though perhaps i am mistaken , and the speech be gregories , whose words in his seventh homily on ezech. are thus cited by aqu. 2. 2. q. 43. art . 7. si de veritate scandalum sumitur ut tilius nasci permittur scandalnm quam veritas relinquatur . my traducing mr. b. in my pulpit , mentioned page 217. was nothing but citing his words , which was not frequent , nor is it , if rightly done , any injury when the book is published . what is of me and not of god i pray with him may perish : of schism or zeal for it i am not conscious : that truth i avouch will stand when mr. bs. rotten pillars fall to the ground . to many questions and charges in sundry pages 213. &c. an answer may be gathered from what is said before . sect . xix . the six imagined errors charged on me by mr. b. are cleered from his censure . mr. b. addes a confutation of six of my pretended errors . the first was onely a speech of mine in conference on occasion of mr. bs. words in a sermon which were taken to be a fling at me , and my meaning was this , that the truth i maintained and such like being about a thing of frequent practise , so that by reason of ignorance sin will be committed , were not to be concealed when if it be it is like to be lost for the peace of the church , that is to prevent differences in opinion and the breaches in communion that by reason thereof do by accident from the corruption of men fall out . mr. b. opposeth it , as if i meant a man must not suspend any truth of the scripture , no not though a total breach bringing bloodshed , ruine , &c. follow ; yea by his last argument he would insinuate , as if it would follow on my tenet , that every one that doth but think it is a truth that christ is not god , that there is no god , &c. that he will think himself bound to reveale it to the world , though it turne all to confusion , and after his satyrical veine saith , he that had rather see the church in this case then his doctrine of anabaptistry should be concealed , is good for nothing but to make an anabaptist of that i know . to which i answer , my meaning in that speech of mine was this , that no truth of god that a person is certain is such , and can demonstrate so to be , which concernes the faith or practise of christians , through concealing of which they shall erre and sin , is to be concealed when a person may perceive by circumstances , that if he conceale it at such a time the contrary will be established , and so truth be lost in the eye of reason , though much trouble follow thereon . and this i resolved heretofore in my book of scandals chap. 4. sect . 20. not that i know of excepted against by any ground on pauls words , gal. 2. 5. avouched by many divines , and without which the waldenses , hussites , protestants will be condemned for opposing the monkish profession , halfe communion , &c. though warres followed thereon . and our present and former non-conformists will be deeply guilty of sin in opposing the prelacy , ceremonies , canons , &c , which hath been one cause of the great troubles of the land , which have proved greater then any raised by the anabaptists . and so far as many prudent men can discerne , many of the presbyterian ministers of the land , do as little regard the peace of this land at this time , through discontent that they want the establishment of discipline after their mind , as any anabaptist heretofore did . and i presume they that sit at the sterne do find the so called anabaptists as faithful to the publique cause as their opposites . as for the two next errors about others then ministers baptizing and administring the lords supper , mr. b. delivers as much himself as the errors pretended affirm in these words page 221. in a case of necessity ( as if people were in the indies ) where no ministers can be had , if any fay that it is better a private man baptize and adminster the lords supper then wholly omit them , i will not deny it ; and he gives two reasons . but faith he , mr. t. speaks it in reference to our ordinary case in england . concerning which i answer , that for baptizing it is true i speak in reference to the case in england ; all or most of the ministers ordained being against baptizing of persons of years sprinkled in infancy , and there lying upon them that see infant-baptisme a corruption a necessity to be baptized upon profession of faith , there is a necessity that they be baptized by persons not ordained by laying on of hands of the presbytery , though i do conceive laying on of hands an ordinance in force from 1 tim. 5. 23. and 4. 14. act. 13. 3. heb. 6. 2. nor do i like the argument from numb . 8. 10. to prove that non-preaching elders may lay on hands conceiving no mosaical ordinance concerning any positive ceremonial rite belonging to the jewish service is a rule to us now , and therefore do wish there were either by authority or consent of churches some way of restoring it ; till which i see a necessity that persons not ordained yet preachers of the gospel do baptize . but for administring the lords supper though i acknowledge it most fit in many respects it should be received some minister ordering it , not so much for the consecrating of the elements ( as they call it ) by vertue of office , as for the comely and edifying dispensing of it by prayer and exhortation , the ordinance being holy , and to be performed with much reverence , to which none are so fit as a minister that is set apart for the word and prayer : yet whereas it is claimed as a part of the ministers office to be minister of the sacraments , or ( as they call them ) seales , and it is aggravated as if it were the sin of uzzah or uzziah for any else to do it , and too much i think is ascribed not onely by papists , but also by others to the power of order , and many require it as a ministers duty to give them the sacrament , and if mr. bs. doctrine be good in his treatise of the saints rest page 651. their being baptized persons or members of the universal church , is sufficient evidence of their interest to the supper , till they by heresie or scandal blot that evidence , ministers cannot deny it them without instustice , and hereupon many perplexities are in ministers about giving the lords supper , and perplexities in receivers from whom they receive it , it being taught that they do justifie their ministery , and own them as their ministers , who receive the lords supper from them ; and it is taught that ministers have a power to deny some the seals , and this is made a chief part of their government , i have i confesse said and i think it still true , that a company of believers though they have no minister ordained in case of want of an ordained minister may some one or more in holy and seemely manner by giving thanks , praying , and declaring the end and use of that rite , and guiding the action , remember the lords death in breaking bread , and this may be truly a sacrament as it is called , and acceptable to god if performed with a holy heart . and my chief ground is , because whereas it is made one of the chief disorders in eating the lords supper at corinth , 1 cor. 11. 20 , 21. that in eating every one took his own supper before other , this could not have happened if they had been wont to receive it from a minister that distributed to all ; and when the apostle to rectifie the abuse sets down what he received of the lord , ver . 23. he speaks not a word of a ministers duty to regulate them , or of christs appointing it as a part of his office to distribute it , nor gives any direction to that end : but only ver . 33. that they tarry one for another , and not eat till they came together , whereas if it did then belong to the minister to distribute , the direction should have been given to him not to distribute till they came together . if it be said ( as saravia against beza ) that there were then presbyters at corinth , though i conceive it not likely , but the contrary rather manifest from 1 cor. 1. 7. & 6. 4. & 12. 28. & 14. 29. yet it serves the more to confirme my opinion , that then it was not counted the ministers office to deliver the lords supper , and that it might be without a minister ordained , sith they did receive it then , 1 cor. 10. 16. yet i acknowledge that it is very antient that the minister called the president did order the lords supper , as i gather from justin martyrs apolog. 2. ad antoninum where he sets down the order of the christian service in his time . and i am against the altering it because of the antiquity of the use , and the confusion likely to follow on the alteration . but being urged by mr. b. and others in the manner abovesaid , it is necessary that the point be examined . mr. b. argues thus , 1. he that administreth the lords supper ( in breaking the bread , delivering it to all , bidding them take , eate , &c. ) must represent the lord jesus , who did all this at the institution . but onely ministers and no private men are persons who should represent the lord jesus in church-administrations . therefore onely ministers and no private men may administer the lords supper . to which i answer , 1. [ in church-administrations ] in the minor is added which was not in the major , and so there are four termes , and the argument faulty . 2. but waving that exception , because it may be quickly rectified , i deny the minor understanding as mr. b. doth by a minister a presbytery ordained by laying on of hands . for to speak of the ruling elders church-administrations , or the preaching of persons not in office ( of which anon ) it is certain that deacons have church-administration , who are not presbyters ; yea it is manifest out of antiquity , that the deacons did deliver the elements in the lords supper , and rogers on article 23. of the church of england , prop. 3. saith , at geneva the elder ( a lay-man ) ministreth the cup ordinarily at the communion , and therefore ministers did and might represent christ at least in that part of church-administration . but mr. b. goes about to prove the minor thus . ministers onely are called his embassadors , stewards of his mysteries , and beseech in his stead , &c. answer , 1. i think that those mentioned act. 8. 4 , 5. of whom philip was then onely a deacon , as many of the antients hold , not onely apollos but also aquila and priscilla acts 18. 26. frumentius that converted the indians , and the captive maid that brought the iberians to the faith , were embassadours of christ , and stewards of his mysteries , and might beseech in his stead . 2. but were it granted that ministers only are called christs embassadours , &c. how is it proved that they onely should represent christs person in breaking the bread , delivering it to all , bidding them take , eate , &c. doth the embassage of christ , dispensing of his mysteries , beseeching in his stead , &c. consist in breaking bread , delivering it , bidding take , eate , & c ? if it do , then a non-preaching minister who doth these things may yet be an embassadour of christ , and steward of his mysteries , then the breaking bread , &c. is a converting ordinance , as mr. pryn held , which mr. gillespy and mr. rutherford deny . for my part i think to be an embassadour of christ , and to beseech in his stead , 2 cor. 5. 20. to be a steward of the mysteries of god , 1 cor. 4. 1. are all one as to preach the gospel , and that the assembly did misallege the text 1 cor. 4. 1. as they have done the other , to prove that neither sacrament may be dispensed by any but a minister of the word lawfully ordained , confession of faith chap. 27. sect . 4. for mysteries of god never signifie sacraments in scripture , but the gospel , ephes. 6. 19. rom. 16. 25. chamier panstrat . cath. tom . 4. l. 1. c. 4. sect . 9. in scripturis 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 usurpari pro ipso rei sacrae signo profectò imposturaest . but mr. b. tells me . it is a silly answer of mr. t. that sacraments are not called mysteries of god. for the word preached neither is not the mystery it self , but a revealing and exhibiting that mystery , and so are the sacraments . the one revealeth them to the eare , and the other to the eye . answ. sure if the answer be silly , the refutation is no better . for if the word preached be not the mystery it self , then neither is the sacrament , much lesse the breaking the bread and delivering it , and so to be steward of the mysteries of god is not to be breaker and deliverer of the bread and wine in the lords supper . but however mr. b. grants that though the word preached be not the mystery it self , yet it is the revealing and exhibiting of the mystery , and that the sense undoubted of 1 cor. 4. 1. stewards of the mysteries of god , is revealers of the mystery of god by preaching the word . but then saith mr. b. the sacrament revealeth the mystery of god to the eye . i reply , mr. b. saith so , but not one text of scripture saith so : nor is it true . the mystery containes not onely the thing done by christ , but the end , use , reason of it : but this is perceivable onely by the understanding , and the sacrament abstractively from the word declares it not , no not so much as a picture : and therefore the sacramental actions of themselves are not revelations of the mystery of christ , nor ever so called in scripture : and therefore i conclude , that the text 1 cor. 4. 1. doth not prove that it is the peculiar office of an ordained presbyter to minister the lords supper by breaking bread , delivering it to all , bidding take , eat , &c. and though the title of minister of the gospel be used in the new testament , yet the title of minister of the sacraments is a made title . 2. saith mr. b. if there be no command or example in scripture of any but ministers administring the lords supper , then no other may do it ; but there is no command or example in scripture of any other doing it ; they that say there is , let them shew it . answ. i find this command , 1 cor. 11. 28. let a man examine himself , and so let him eat of that bread and drink of that cup , and this example 1 cor. 10. 16 , 17. the cup of blessing which we blesse , is it not the communion of the blood of christ ? the bread which we break , is it not the communion of the body of christ ? for we being many are one body and one bread : for we are all partakers of that one bread . but for command or example that an ordained presbyter onely should administer the lords supper by breaking bread , &c. let them that say there is , shew it . mr. b. goes on . but by this time you may see whither mr. t. would reduce the ministerial office , 1. others may baptize . 2. and administer the lords supper . 3. and then preaching is all or almost all that is left ( for he gives them far lesse in government than i do . ) and how well he defended the ministerial privilege of publique preaching in his disputes with captain bray is too well known . and what need the people allow so much of their meanes then to maintain ministers ? is not this next to the utter extirpation of them acoording to the doctrine of their learned martin-marpriest . answ. pastors and teachers or presbyters to teach and govern the church of god i am assured are a divine institution , and a very merciful gift of christ , ephe. 4. 11 , 12 , 13. 1 cor. 12. 28. acts 14. 23. 1 tim. 3. 1. tit. 2. 5. to whom people should yield obedience , heb. 13. 17. and yield maintenance liberally , 1 cor. 9. 14. gal. 6. 6. 1 tim. 5. 17 , 18. if any go about to extirpate them let him be accursed as an enemy to christ and his church . the railing bookes of martin-marpriest , and such like on the one side ; and the slanderous books of mr. edwards , mr. baillee , &c. on the other side i abhorre . yet i fear more danger to the ministry by the pragmaticalnesse of the ministers , especially their meddling with state matters , then either by martin-marpriests libels , or my assertions . would ministers keep to their studies and the work of christ in preaching in season and out of season , it would better establish their maintenance and ministry , then the asserting such a juridical government and power of dispensing the seales ( as they are called ) as they do . i ascribe as much to the ministry as the scripture gives them . though the office of preaching whether publique or private be proper to the minister so as to be his constant imployment , and he ought not to be hindred in it , sith he is to be accountable to god for it : yet publique or private preaching i do not annex to ordained presbyters as a peculiar priviledge to them , so as none else may be said to be sent or called of god to preach in scripture sense but they . notwithstanding what mr. thomas hall in his pulpit guarded , or my quodam scholar and worthy friend mr. giles workman , in his better temper'd book intitled private men no pulpit men , have said , i still conceive that not onely for trial of expectants , but also upon other occasions persons not ordained may be permitted , yea desired to preach in the pulpits . i find these words in bilsons difference between christian subjection and antichristian rebellion , part . 4. strangers also if they were in place were suffered both to teach and blesse in the church , as well as others that were tied to their cures , by reason that many were sent by the apostles and by the holy ghost to visite the churches and comfort the christians as they travailed , and such were according to their knowledge and gift not onely permitted , but also desired to exhort the people , and to give thanks to god in other mens charges , grot. annot . in mat. 4. 23. mansit is mos aliquandiu in ecclesia christiana ut concessu episcoporum scriptur as interpretarentur non presbyteri tantum aut diaconi , sed & 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . vide eusebium qui origenis aliorumque exemplo probat 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 spectant quae leguntur 1 cor. 24. 19. neverthelesse i am against the courses of many souldiers and others , who against the denial of able teachers to whom the teaching of the people is committed , love to get into the pulpits of the ablest men to vent their peculiar conceits , and oft-times their pernicious errors , not reguarding to preach to the ignorant the clear truths of faith and a holy life in places where they have no preacher , but to new converts to pervert them , and withdraw them from their able teachers , and to disquiet them and their congregations by frivolous exceptions . and for this reason i was unwilling captain bray should preach at bewdley when i was there , and when he would preach and bent himself to assert a liberty to all that had gods sanctifying spirit , and could expresse their minds , to take upon them to teach publiquely what 's the meaning of the scripture , and what doctrines are true and what false , without any skill in arts , yea though he taught error , i did oppose him . which if it were not so skilfully and happily done as mr. b. better acquainted with such mens way might have done , yet me thinks my good will might have been accepted . but i see very little i do is well taken , and therefore see it necessary to wait patiently on god till my words and actions though intended for the furthering of reformation and good of the ministry , in my examen part . 2. sect . 7 in my apology and elsewhere , be better resented and considered . the fourth and fifth error mr. b. chargeth me with as dangerous , and the root of my error about baptism , will more fitly come into the body of the dispute , in which i doubt not but i shall shew that both himself and mr. blake ( however he esteem his writings ) do recede from the scripture and other approved authors in their making the new covenant common to elect and reprobates , in making reprobates interest in the covenant a fruit of christs death , denying the absolute promise to be most fitly called the covenant of grace , hold that a person may not be baptized that is not known to belong to the covenant of grace , that god actually seals the covenant of grace to reprobates , with sundry other mistakes about sacraments in general , as if their essence were in being seals of the covenant of grace , and deriving thence a right to baptism for believers infants , though the covenant be conditional and common to all . the fith error of mine he confutes is about the magistrates not being an officer of christ as mediator . and he excepts against me for saying in pulpit at bewdley it was of dangerous consequence which he held , though he named not me at any time , and he wrote to me , and i would not dispute it with him . to which i answer , it is true , preaching on mat. 28. 18. the argument leading me to it , i did oppose that doctrine , that the magistrate is an officer of christ the mediator , and because mr. bs. book was in some of my auditors hands , did reade the passage in his aphorismes page 273. and said it was of dangerous consequence . and indeed i think it so still . for i think it will follow , that except a magistrate can shew his commission from christ , that he is an usurper , and then none is bound to him but to suppresse him , then no infidel is a lawfull magistrate who denies christ , and it will be questionable whether this will not extend to a non-churchmember or an excommunicate person , then a magistrates doing of right to an infidel against a believer , or to one believer against another , as putting him to death , is an act for christ as mediator , and if because all power is given to him in heaven and in earth therefore magistracy , so as that all power must be derived from christ as mediator , then a fathers power over his child , but sure that is in a father by nature , nor do i think it any part of the curse ; then ruling presbyters should do the acts of civil magistrates as having plain title to rule under christ. nor do i think mr. b. hath answered these arguments or the rest , but that however he proves magistracy to be from christs appointment , and to be subordinate to his laws , and accountable to him , and ought to act for him , yet not that the commission of every lawful magistrate is from him as mediator . i think it will follow if mr. bs. position be true , that supposing christ had not been mediator , there had been no lawfull magistrate , and that dominium fundatur in gratia , which was heretofore denied . and sith christ is heir of all things , and believers onely are christs , and all theirs , 1 cor. 3. 22 , 23. it would be considered whether by parity of reason the saints might not intitle themselves to all power , and all mens estates , which was charged on anabaptists at munster . but i find i digresse , and therefore stop till more liberty draw me to a fuller handling of it . sect . xx. many learned men ( with the oxford convocation ) of former and later times take infant-baptisme onely for an unwritten tradition . mr. b. proceeds to answer my antidote , termes it a corrective for a circumforaneous antidote : but the antidote will appear to be good if taken , notwithstanding his disgraceful term of corrective without vertue . page 299. he prints two passages of dr. whitakers for the late oxford convocation to reade , and referres to the like in davenant . but whatever doctor whitaker thought , yet that the antients did take baptism of infants to have been an apostolical tradition unwritten seemes to me , from that which is said in my examen part . i. sect . 5. not avoided by mr. ms defence . in the council of basil in the oration of the cardinal of ragusi it is asserted , item nusquam legitur in canone scripturae s. quod parvulus recenter baptizatus , qui nec corde credit ad justitiam , nec ore confitetur ad falutem , inter fideles & crudentes computetur . et nihilominus ecclesia it a determinavit et statuit , &c. and , in principip hujus sacramenti baptizabantur solum illi qui per se sciebant fidem interroganti respondere . to which purpose walafridus strabo many hundred years before , and vives about that time , whose words are alleged in my exercitation , the title page and sect 17. erasmus resp . archiep. hispal . ad artic . object . 61. sunt et alia innumera quae prisci non ausi sunt definire , sed suspensae pronunciatione venerabantur , quod genus est an parvuliessent baptizandi . and commonly the learnedst papists do instance in infant-baptism as an unwritten tradition in force ; and whereas it is objected that bellarm. and others do bring scripture for it , becan . manual . lib. 1. c. 2. sect . 24. answers , aliqua possunt probariex scriptura quando constat de vero & legitimo scripture sensu . so he saith it is concerning infan-baptism , which is proved from john 3. 5. but that the sense whereby to prove it is onely manifest by tradition . which is confirmed in the canon law and schoolmen , an infants-baptism was not reckoned perfect , till the bishop laid on hands , which act was called confirmation , to wit , of the imperfect baptism in infancy . molinaeus in his vates l. 2. c. 7. cites the canon dist . 5. de . consecratione , as determining that without the sacrament of confirmation no man is a full christian. can. omnes , et can. ut jejuni . thomas 3. parte summae , q. 72. art . 9. dicit hoc sacramentum esse perfection●m baptismi : innuens baptismum esse imperfectum nisi accesserit confirmatio . lumb . l. 4. sent . dist . 7. a. omnes fideles per manus impositionem episcoporum post baptismum accipere debent in confirmatione spiritum sanctum ut pleni christiani inveniantur . bellarm. tom . 3. de sacr . confirm . c. 12. confirmatio est complementum & perfectio baptismi . lib. 2. de effec . sacram. c. 8. est confirmatio quaedam perfectio & consummatio baptismi . jewel defence of the apolog. page 218. allegeth it as caistans tenet , that an infant , for that he wanteth instruction in faith , therefore hath not perfect baptism . consonant hereto is the conceit of the common people , that they have not their full christen dome all they be bishopped . but that it may appear even learned protestants speak near the same , i will cite some of their speeches ; among which i will forbear to recite the speeches of the lord brook and mr. daniel rogers alleged by me in my exercit. sect . 18. and cleered in my apology from mr. rogers . his latter glosse , nor the opinion of mr. bedford , who judged with the romanists , that the scripture gives us proof onely of the reasonableness of infant-baptisme , as i gather by mr. bs. i answer to him page 305. dr. field of the church , fourth book chap. 20. the fourth kind of inadition is the continued practise of such things as are neither contained in the scripture expressely , nor the examples of such practise expressely there delivered , though the grounds , reasons , and causes of the necessity of such practise be there contained , and the benefit or good that followeth it . of this sort is the baptism of infants , which is therefore named a tradition , because it is not expressely delivered in scripture that the apostles did baptize infants , nor any expresse precept there found that they should so do . yet is not this so received by bare and naked tradition , but that we find the scripture to deliver unto us the grounds of it . doctor , prideaux fasci . controv. theol. loc . 4. sect . 3. q. 2. paedobaptism rests on no other divine right then episcopacy . doctor jeremy taylor in his liberty of prophesying sect . 18. num . 34. after he had ventilated the point on both sides saies , there is much more truth then evidence on our sides , meaning paedobaptists . to all which i will adde the words of theophilus philakyriaco loucardiensis , that is mr. young , as i am informed , an eminent man in the late assembly , and mr. marshals friend that holp him in the first part of his defence , in his dies dominica lib. 1. c. 10. page 54. where he confesseth ingenuously thus . anabaptistas paedobaptismo oblainantes apertis testimoniis ferire non possumus , vesaniam his teles comprimimus , 1. ex parallelo praecepto de circumci sione . 2. ex praxi apostalica : quae quum aliquanda fit obscurior , consuetudinem totius ecclesiae à primaevis & historicis temporibus adjicimus : juae ; licet praefractos anaboptistas non movebunt ; apud prudentes , morigeros , & aejuos renum aestimatores valebunt . so that according to him , the main weight lies on the custome of the church , which is falsely imagined to have been from the apostles , as in some measure is proved in my examen part of the first , not yet shaken by mr. ms. friend with all his insight antiquity . from which i inferre , that the antients and learned afore zuinglius did account infant-baptism to have been an unwritten tradition , having reason from scripture , not evident of it self , but to be received for the determination of the church , and that because it was not fully perfect , therefore confirmation was added , which was retained in the english liturgy as necessarily previous to the lords supper ; nor do many of the best learned protestants speak much otherwise out of the heat of dispute against anabaptists . they are farre from mr. bs. audaciousnesse to assert it as having plain scripture proof for it . the very hesitant resolution of the most learned and considerate is enough to represse his vain attempt , and to awaken those that depend on his proofes , and rest on their infant-sprinkling , and neglect the practise of being baptized after profession of faith , being so expressely enjoyned in scripture as a prime important duty for their salvation . sect . xxi . many things are cleered about my conformity , anabaptists necessity to be baptized , the manner of dipping used by them , their standing to their confession of faith , &c. page 241. he saith , i begin with a complaint of my sufferings , whereas my words were a gratulation for the change of my condition , and for my sad complaints mr b. makes them more then they were , and misrepresents me in the time and reason of them . i let passe his jerkes about my health , and my grievance of removing from bewdley , his way to heaven and mine . mr. b. page 242 would vindicate his passages i cite in the epistle to the people of bewdley : but he passeth over that which goeth before in my epistle , and makes no answer to any of these three things , 1. that he assignes no sufficient note whereby to discerne the visible church-membership of infanrs of which he speaks . 2. that there is no connexion between his visible church-membership of infants and the initial seal , without institution of the rite to be so used . 3. that in the positive rites of the new testament , there 's no reason to be a rule to us , but the appointers will in some precept or practise . and to shew the precept to be against him his own words are alleged and that rightly , however he interpret or interlace them . his interpretation agrees not with his own passage appendix page 56. which saith , neither are the seals usefull till the accepting and entring of the covenant , where he placeth accepting before entering the covenant , and in both his passages speakes of accepting and entering with consent , which infants cannot do , page 243. he saith , i seem to speak as if i had some of my old episcopal ceremonious spirit , though he hoped and believed verily that i did not turn meerly to the times , though with the times . to which i answer . mr. b. was a stranger to me till a little afore these times , and therefore is not fit to charge me with an episcopal ceremonious spirit . were it worth while to trouble the world with it , i could shew how i examined , as well as at those years , i could the points in difference about which i was to subscribe and conforme , and however i was carried away with the stream , yet my subscription was according to doctor burges his explication , and my conformity upon mr. spruits grounds , i was no promoter of either , and in the worst time i think none can say but i stuck fast to the main , the propagating the gospel and conjunction with the godly . and my opposing the bishops began with the soonest afore this parliament began , as soon as ever i deprehended the bishops to be wholly for their own rule , and adversaries to the preaching of the gospel . and for my non-conformity , reasons were given with some of the first in a sermon at a visitation at lemster , november 24. 1641 since printed . and what i said the ceremonies were more excusable then paedobaptism is true , 1. they were not at first urged otherwise then as indifferent things , paedobaptism is urged as of divine appointment , and yet the chief principle of non-conformists doth more strongly plead against it then the ceremonies . 2. paedobaptism not withstanding the palliating salves of mr. m. mr. b. i find farre more pernicious then the ceremonies ; it being , 1. the great occasion of the soul-destroying presumption whereby a great part of men perish , and the genuine hinderance of the reformation of the lords supper and church-communion . 2. it quite perverts the end and use of baptism , which the ceremonies did onely in some sort disorder . i justifie not the ceremonies , and therefore i need not answer the men he names , but their writings yield strong arguments for me against paedobaptism , and better for me then for themselves . mr. bs. questions page . 243. are upon a mistake , as if i counted all pedobaptists meer formal teachers : whereas what i speak was in tendernesse to bewdley , lest they out of averseness to my doctrine should rest in a meer formal teacher , which i had reason to fear was the aime of some , whom perhaps mr. b. may find ( though i wish he may not ) he hath mistaken for godly men . who perhaps might tell him what was not true , that the power of godliness is much diminished since my comming to them , and their profitable converse turned into heart-burnings , jealousies and fruitlesse contendings . his argument pag. 244. is vain : for were it supposed that infants of believers were church-members ( which his whole book proves not ) and it were true that baptizers cannot otherwise have knowledge when those that are piously educated begin to be church-members , yet the practise of baptizing the children of christians ordinarily at years of discretion overturnes not the true end of baptism . for whether the true ( to which he addes principal in a parenthesis , as if true and principal were all one ) end of baptism be to be christs sign for solemn admission of church-members or disciples , or to be an engaging seal as elsewhere ; yet both these ends are preserved if they be baptized many years after their being disciples . it is untrue , that it is my usual artifice to work on the affections , of people when i mistrust my strength to work on mens understandings ; it may be more truly said of himself , who usually fills up the vacuity of proofs with childish exclamations , admirations , &c. what i said and preached from acts 3. 23. is right , people do indanger their being cut off from gods people , who disobey christ , in not being baptized when their duty is told them , as the pharisees and lawyers rejected or made void the counsel of god against themselves , being not baptized of john luke 7. 30. i preach against popish necessity of baptism , and yet hold a necessity of precept for believers to be baptized , yea and an ordinary necessity of means according to christs doctrine , marke 16. 16. i threaten no man for not yielding to my opinion , but not yielding to a plain command of christ , mat. 28. 19. and his apostle , act. 2. 38. &c. acknowledged by all my antagonists ( except socinianized ) from which mr. bs. observations concerning the backsliding of some cannot acquit him . were my words of any weight with him , i should advise him , more seriously to consider whether this his writing be not a perverting the right wayes of the lord. page 245. that mr. b. did not at least mainly direct the passage of his epistle against me , he will hardly believe that takes notice of the passage , the time when , the texts produced , the accusation it self , the naming me , yea or his own words so often in his book , as page 167. that he used the speeches to preserve his friends from the danger of my error , that being a dying man he might have no opportunity after to warne his people , that a fire being at bewdley he had reason to provide for kederminster . and what though it were intended against all that take my course , yet it might be directed mainly against me , whom he singled out for commendation , but yet in such a manner , as i may say with king james in his answer to cardinal perons oration , i defie the prayses that ascribe ability and moderation to me , and charge me not only with grosse absurdities , but also with little tender conscientius fear of erring , playing the devils part , besides other imputations , which if not directed against me solely , yet he might have conceived would be taken as chargeable upon me with others . by officiating priest i meant not any other then meer reading ministers , by whom most were baptized , and it was not scornfully used by me , nor like the language of martix-marpriest ( which i abhorre ) but to in imate that in that respect , as well as the manner of sprinkling and defect of profession of faith , the anabaptists so called had reason not to content themselves with infant-baptism . it is true , our english prelatical divines do account baptism sufficiently administred that is so done , yea though it were by a popish priest or a midwife , and i think presbyterians and independents do agree with them : for they do not question their baptism , nor seek any other , though it 's likely many have been so baptized . yet i find spondanus in his auctar. chronol . ad annum 1604. reporting that in france , at vapincum in the daulphinate , a synod wherein famous chamier was president , determined according to a former synod at poictiers , that baptism administered by expectants of ordination was of no value , and to be iterated by ministers themselves . whether this relation be true or not , yet my end in my expression being to give reason why anabaptists content not themselves with their pretended infant-baptism , mr. b. doth ill to interpret my words as scornfull . i do now professe as i did not long since at coventrey to mr. william swayn ( who i perceived since upon his misconstruction hath also alleged this passage in the end of mr. stephens book intitled a precept for baptism of infants out of the new testament , ) that i do reverence many paedobaptists as godly ministers of the gospel farre beyond my self . yet still i say , that they most injuriously inveigh against anabaptists for being baptized at years of discretion , and thereby necessitate them to associate themselves , when the baptism of infants is confessed by the most considerate not to have cleer proof without help of tradition unwritten ; which yet learned men contradict , the sprinkling they have received is not baptism , nor appointed by christ , nor the person adminstring it to many infants a preacher of the gospel , and many learned men have made baptisme of infants imperfect without confirmation , and churches have thought it necessary to retain it , yea mr. b. would have something like it ( which but for the dipping in cold water is to the same purpose as rebaptizing ) page 119. 120. which to me discovers the imperfection and insufficiency of infant-baptism to its end ; and though mr. b. in answer to mr. bedford holding baptizing but once onely a tradition unwritten , undertakes to prove it fully from scripture page 305. ( whose performances i find very short of his undertakings ) yet theophilus philokyriaces in the book forenamed page 54. sayes , sacrum baptismum non repetendum semper statuit ecclesia : de quo tamen interdicto in sacris tabulis nihil occurrit , and therefore unless i will speak against my conscience , i must needs say that it is ignorance or wilfulness holds ministers and people in their stiffe asserting and practise of infant-baptism , and the violent opposition they make to their practise who are baptized or baptize believers upon so great reason . he tells me it is an untruth that he said [ dipping in cold water is murther and adultery ] about which i not contend , whether he used those very termes onely , but so farre as my memory retaines , and the notes i could get relate , those words were used by him without addition of [ the ordinary practise ] or [ naked . ] but my meaning in my denial of his speech , was to justifie dipping as used by those termed anabaptists , whose baptizing so farre as i have known it , hath been seemly with coverings fit to be quickly put off when they come out of the water , and with meet provision for the health of persons , not tying persons to cold water in the open aire or any other inconvenient thing to health and modesty , but onely requiring the person to be under water resemhling christs burial and resurrection according to rom. 6. 3 , 4. col. 2. 12. as the stream of the expositors do conceive the allusion . and therefore i cannot be of opinion that the ordinary practise of baptizing by dipping the whole body in cold or warme water openly or privatly is either a breacb of the sixth or seventh commandment , unless he condemne christ and his apostles as appointing and practising a rite contrary to gods commands , and be of an opinion , which is refuted by frequent experience of aged weak persons men and women baptized in cold stormy times in the open aire in cold running water without detriment to their health to mine one knowledge . neverthelesse were it that any person did conceive , that he ought to be baptized naked , as vossius thes. theol. and hist. disp . 1. de baptismo thesi 6. 7. 8. shewes in the first ages men women and infants were , yet he may find there how provision was made against immodesty and murder , & i wonder that either mr. b. or any other considerate man that knows how persons go into bathes frequently , should imagine so evil of a persons going into the water but once in course habit in a penitent form not without grave company , not staying a minute in the water , that it could not be performed without such danger as mr. b. would possesse people with , in the second part of his book chap. 12. 13. his satyrical i had almost said scurrilous quips i let passe . i did not charge mr. b. with endeavours to drive me or others out of the land , or destroy us , but i think the instigators to the ordinance against heresies , have had such minds . and whereas he saith page 247. i tell him of his danger and elsewhere that i threaten him , is a suggestion that i cannot yet ghesse whence it should arise . the citation out of his book sect . 3. of my antidote was to shew m. b. paraphrased mat. 28. 19 , to like purpose as i do . that the untruths he chargeth me with page 248. 252. were not such is shewed before . the matter of the fourth , fift , sixt , and seventh sections being argumentative , is to be referred to the first part of his book . page 257. mr. b. applies that to one term of calling some sects which i said of the rest of his discourse , especially the accusation of societies proving wicked , that it hath a manifest tincture of reviling . he chargeth my conscience as having a flaw for insinuating that he called all independents a sect , and that for denying the power of a synod to excommunicate , whereas he plainly limited his speech to that independency which gives the people to govern by vote , which is the same with separatism . to which i reply , i took it , and do still , that in the books of independents it is their received tenet , that excommunicating however it be not without officers , yet is in the people , from mat. 18. 17. but that whence they are named independents by mr. her'le and others , is from denying superiority of synods in governing , and appeales to them , and if a sect then from thence as their distinguishing tenet . however for the tenet of the peoples governing by vote , i know no reason why they should be called a sect rather then their opposites . the excommunication which the scripture speaks , of so farre as i discern , is no where made a part of government , or of the elders office any more then the peoples . in antiquity it 's apparant out of cyprian , &c. that the people had a great hand in elections , excommunications , absolutions . nor is a person a separatist for that tenet , but for dividing practises : other things in that section are answered before ; to that page 259. of my logick , i say he is mistaken in it . i know this water to be cold because i feel its coldnesse , this person to be a false teacher because i hear from him false doctrine . the subject is not the suppositum as a substance but as a substance with its adjunct . i prove not a wall to be a wall by its whitenesse seen , but a white wall , and this is not idem per idem . the apostle shews the evil lives of hereticks for better prevention of their practises , not to prove them hereticks [ a ravening wolfe ] signifies neither error of doctrine , nor visiousnesse of life , but the effect or end of the persons described , to wit , destroying souls , often also lives and estates . that the false prophets have sheepes clothing , that is , fair shews , though inwardly are ravening wolves , overthrows mr. bs. interpretation he pleades so much for , except he think they can have sheeps clothing , that is fair shewes of a good life , who are openly wicked , so as by the fruits of their wickedness they may be known , which me thinks comes near a contradiction . mr. b. often sayes , he takes me not to be an heretick nor a meer anabaptist except they divide the church . but he taking me for a divider of the church , for my error must of necessity take me for an heretick if he stand to the descriptions he there saith he likes , so that i cannot nor any anabaptist or independent long look to be out of his black roll of hereticks . page 260. mr. b. saith , i make his question an affirmation , and so doth he himself that tells us it speaks what a rarity it is according to his reading that any society of anabaptists hath not proved wicked . but i make it a peremptory determination , where as it is neither omnino dubitantis , nor yet determinantis , but provo cantis . nor did i say it was a most peremptory determination , but , no man will i think take his interrogation for any other then a most peremptory determination , which i think is true , the words carrying a plain shew of a peremptory determination , and being written to the people of kederminster were not likely to be a provocation of anabaptists to look over their own intelligence , but a resolute assurance , that there hath not been known a society of anabaptists since the world first knew them , that proved not wicked . and therefore i put no false sense on his words , as he falsely chargeth me , nor do i as he saith , call him dog , i onely say , like a right-english mastive he flies in the face , &c. not comparing him to a dog , but his bold act to the manner of english mastives boldness , whereby he is no more called dog , then christ is thief , when he saies , i come as a thief , revel . 3. 3. to that which he saith page 261. of my cheat , i have answered . to his question , did no body contradict infant-baptism for so many hundred years ? and yet is it an innovation . i answer yes : and i think mr. b. will say of keeping an easter , lent-fast , infant-communion , monkish profession , episcopacy , at least some of these are innovations not contradicted for so many hundred years . for his testimonies page 262 , 263 , 264. for the antiquity of infant-baptism , to the chiefest of them answer hath been made , that the eldest of them is not till the third age , that they onely urge it and practise it in case of evident danger of present death to save from perishing ; that the conceit of peculiar privilege to infants of believers is a late innovation : some of them are meerly impertinent without mr. bs. vain infernece , some heathenish rites of expiating infants are unseeming mr. b. to allege , they being from satan . my testimonies page 264. of bernard , petrus cluniacensis , eckbertus , are vindicated before , strabo doth not say that afore austins time , infant-baptism was not , but onely , in the first times , nor is it likely that he did mistake austins age 10 years . that the copies put 25. for 35. nor do i think he was mistaken in the reason of austins deferring his baptism , but that the reason he gives was one though not the sole reason of it , and the testimony of walafridus strabo though later then augustine , yet he giving himself to search out and to write of antient rites , is of more credit concerning the antiquity of infant-baptism then augustines , who as i shew apology . sect . 6. and elsewhere , did often inconsiderately call that an apostolical tradition , which was commonly observed in his dayes within the compass of his acquaintance . cyprians speech if it be rightly brought by mr. b. will prove all still-born infants to be lost , being not of the visible church catholick . that which mr. b. page 266. saith , fully satisfies him , part of it is false , the rest so frivolous , that i can impute his satisfaction to no other cause then his inconsiderateness . the very same or like plea will serve for communion of young children in which yet mr. b. is not satisfied . but to me it is very good satisfaction that baptizing of infants is but an innovation , neither agreeing with the institution of christ , nor the apostles practise , nor known till it began to be conceived necessary to give grace and to save from perishing , yet then disswaded and not practised but in case of iminent danger of death , nor maintained on any other ground till zuinglius his dayes . what the churches of anabaptists so called have done in london that mr. b. should so much lament , till i know what it is i take to be a calumny . that anabaptists have been in danger by the instigations of preachers and writers it is a marvel to me , that mr. b. should not understand , who can hardly be ignorant whence the ordinance against blasphemies and heresies came . that any of my antagonists are turned out of house and home is unknown to me , surely not for non-conformity to rebaptizing , most certain , that if any such thing hath been done it was never by my procurement , nor i think any of the churches of anabaptists . that which mr. b. page 267. saies , that the same men that subscribe the anabapiists confession have many of them written other kind of doctrine elsewhere . i doubt whether it be true , i find him onely naming paul hobson page 147. and citing some passages of his , of which that which is most liable to exception mr. b. himself gives us this excuse in his saints evelasting rest part . 2. chap. 1. sect . 2. page 169. not understanding that they affirm and deny the same thing in several expressions : so that however his expressions be dangerous , yet it is probable he held not the socinian opinion , which he contradicted in the subscription to the confession , but onely discovered his weakness . and yet mr. b. i think is not ignorant , that so holy & learned a man as m. pemble near the beginning of his vindicae gratiae hath a like conceit of gods never hating the elect , but being reconciled from eternity , taking reconciliation for an immanent act in god : which as i imagine mr. b. would excuse in mr. pemble , so might he with a like charity excuse the other in paul hobson . what he cites out of cyprian i wish mr. b. had englished it , and that both anabaptists and their opposites would learn it . page 268. he saith if my book of scandals were read , men may perhaps receive a preservative from my own hand from the danger of my opinion , to which i say , i wish my book of scandals were more read , nor do i fear that my doctrine will be the lesse embraced for reading it , if my interpretation of my own words justified even by mr. b. be received , as i shew before . page 269. he tells us the levellers were anabaptists , but i cannot yet learn of any of them he names except den that was so : though i deny not but there might be sundry of them such , likely of the free-willers disclaimed by the seven churches in london , and that they were but few in comparrison of the rest : by the newes-books i gather the levelling businesse was carried on by such as were in no gathered church , but lived above ordinances . as for mr. bs. dark criminations i can give no answer to them , unlesse i could plow with his heifer and find out his riddle : but my hope is those great instruments of god to break the enemies of those that are termed sectaries , though mr. bs. words seem to forebode and misdeem evil of them , will and do prove better then he discribes them , though i imagine they be not anabaptists . nor do i like mr. bs. obscure satyrical criminations , they having some shew of a malevolent mind . whatever mr. b. may conceive of the danger of the anabaptists way in other things , i am sure if they would keep themselves onely to this to be baptized upon profession of faith , they should be in a safe way , even in the way of christ. sect . xxii . the speech [ that no one countrey is gathered into christs visible church ] contains no malignancy to christ , but is a manifest truth . most of that which is in mr. bs. answer to the last section of my antidote hath either been replied to before or in some other part of my writings , or will fall into the main of the dispute , wherein i doubt not but i shall fully vindicate my argument against the visible church-membership of infants , from the different cause of the jewish and christian church , though the thing be so manifest , to wit , that the christian church was otherwise gathered then the jewish , that i see nothing but meer wrangling in the questions mr. b. propounds . and to his words page 279 , 280. sir , if you were my father , i would tell you that when you say , christ makes no one city , countrey , tribe , his disciples , you speak most malignantly , and wickedly against the kingdome and dignity of my lord jesus . i answer , i meet so often with mr. bs. high charges , upon palpable mistakes and weak proofs , that i fear his misguided zeal or natural distemper hath brought him to an habit of ill-speaking . my words were not as mr. b. sets them down , but thus [ no one countrey , or city , or tribe together , were gathered by the apostles or other preachers into the christian visible church , but so many of all as the lord vouchsafed to call by his word and spirit ] which hath neither wickedness nor malignancy against the kingdome and dignity of the lord jesus ; but a manifest truth expressely taught in the holy scripture as congruous to the glory of god and the lord jesus , 1 cor. 1. 26 , 27. 28 , 29. not many wise men , &c. ergo not the whole nation , revel . 5. 9. out of every nation , ergo not the whole nation , as he did the jewes in the wilderness . the relations in the gospel and acts of the apostles plainly prove it true , that by john baptist , christ , the 12. and 70. disciples was no entire nation , city , countrey or tribe gathered into the visible church-christian , but parts of them , and those fewer then the adversaries , who in every place were so numerous ( when the christians are counted at some few thousands ) as that even at jerusalem and elsewhere they prevailed to disperse christians by persecution . nor do mr. bs. questions prove , that into the christian visible church any one whole countrey , city or tribe , young or old , men and women , are gathered by the apostles and other preachers , as moses did gather together the jewish nation , exod. 19. deut. 29. but saith mr. b. 1. hath he noi commanded to disciple nations ? i answer , yes : to make disciples of all nations by preaching the gospel to every creature , as it is , marke 16. 15. but no where by civil authority to gather a whole city , countrey or tribe , and to draw them into a national or city covenant together , old and young , but to offer christ and to baptize so many as are willing to embrace him . 2. saith mr. b. hath not the father promised to give the heathen or nations for his inheritance , and the uttermost parts of the earth for his possession , psal. 2. and that nations shall serve him ? answ. he hath , and it is fulfilled , but not in mr. bs. sense , as if one whole nation , city , countrey or tribe were gathered together in the manner moses brought into covenant all the jewish nation , but as the apostle speaks by ministring the gospel , rom. 15. 16. the gentiles , that is believers among them , are an offering to god , glorifie god , ver . 9. praise him , trust in him , ver . 11 , 12. so as it was foretold in abraham all nations should be blessed , which is expounded gal. 3. 7 , 8 , 9. rom. 4. 17 , 18. believers of all other nations as well as jews . 3. and that the kingdoms of the world shall become the kingdomes of the lord and his christ ? ans. i reade those words rev. 11. 15. but i find the time of fulfilling to be when the seventh angel hath founded , which some say is not till the world to come . so mr. seager of the world to come , part . 1. sect . 8. and this is not improbable from ver . 18. and revel . 10. 6 , 7. the new annot , faith thus , antichrist is weakened , and christ hath begun to take the kingdome out of his hand , and shall have a visible church like an empire in all the known world , and that to the end , but that it is not yet ▪ 4. and do you not see it fulfilled before your eyes ? are not bewdley , kederminster , &c. and england ( till of late ) as fully christs disciple , and so church-members , as the jews were in covenant with god , and so church-members ? answ. if by [ it ] be meant the prophecies psal. 2. 8. and 72. 11. i see them fulfilled , though not in mr. bs. sense : but the prophecie revel . 11. 15. i see not yet fulfilled . i see at bewdley , kederminster , in england , people who generally are called christians , but i do not see that all , old and young , are disciples or church-members , or ought to be so accounted , or that they were ever brought into such a covenant as the jews , or-ought to be accounted . church-members by vertue of such a covenant . there is not a word in my writings to that effect . mr. b. chargeth me [ that i would not have princes and masters do what abraham and moses did , in bringing the people of israel into ' covenant with god ] but i say , that should they do so , yet the infants are not thereby to be accounted visible church-members in a christian church . the commission to gather the christian church was not given to the emperour , but apostles . the apostles , it is true , were sent to proselyte them that were no chuch-members , and yet . they were sent to proselyte , or in the phrase of scripture to disciple , the visible church-members of the jewish church as well as the gentiles . what i said , i still say , that the different church-call of the jewish and christian churches is enough to shew a different church-state , and consequently the argument is not good from the jewish infants visible church-membership to ours . if mr. bs. judgement be not so commandable , as to assent to what i say , it is so much the lesse commendable . the speech of mr. herle , and the jest out of matthiolus are misapplied . when he saith , why may we not write plainly against one anothers judgement by a loving consent ? he may know that it was my desire it should have been so , that it was not so , was from himself . he that believes he hath shewed love in this his writing , is very credulous . for the rest , if mr. b. will have the patience and indifferency of judgement which is meet , he may see an answer to his allegations about gods mercy to infants , and the repeal of their visible church-memship . if he remain in his opinion ( which i much fear , knowing him sowell as i do ) and i in mine , we must leave our writings to others to judge , & especially to that day which shall declare every mans work being revealed in fire . in the mean time ( sleighting his vain curse , which is page 217. ) my prayer for him as my self is , that we may do nothing against the truth , but for the truth . finis . cyprian , and the other collegues which in the council were present , to the number of 66. to brother fidus greeting . most dear brother , we have read thy letters , in which thou hast signified concerning one victor a presbyter , that therapius our collegue in a time not ripe , and with overmuch haste , hath granted him peace , before he had done full penance , and satisfied the lord god , against whom he had offended . which thing hath enough moved us , that he hath departed from the authority of our decree , that before the allowed and full time of fatisfaction , and without the asking and privity of the common sort , no infirmity urging , nor necessity compelling , peace should be granted to him . but upon counsel weighed long with us , it was enough to chide therapius our collegue in that he rashly did this ; and to have instructed him ; that for hereafter he do no such thing . yet we have not thought , that the peace however once granted by a priest of god should be taken away ; and for this cause we have permitted victor to use the communication granted to him . but for what belongeth to the cause of infants , whom thou hast said should not be baptized within the second or third day in which they were born ; and that the law of antient circumcision is to be considered , so as that thou shouldest not think him that is born should be baptized and hallowed within the 8. day ; it seemed farre otherwise to all in our council . for unto this which thou thoughtest should be done , none of us have agreed , but all have rather judged that the mercy and grace of god is to be denied to none that are born of mankind . for when the lord in his gospel saith , the son of man came not to destroy mens souls , but to save them , as much as in us lies if it may be , no soul is to be lost . for what is wanting to him , who is once formed in the wombe by the hand of god ? for to us and in our eyes they which are born do seem to receive growth according to the course of secular dayes : but what ever things are made by god are perfected by the majesty and work of god the maker . lastly , the faith of divine scripture declares to us , that there is one evenness of the divine gift to all , whether infanrs or elder in age . when helisaeus upon the infant son of the shunamite widow which lay dead so laid himself when he prayed to god , that head was applied to head , & face to face , & the members of helisaeus spread over were joyned to each of the members of the little one , and the feet to its feet ; which thing if it be thought on according to the quality of our birth and body , an infant cannot be equalled to a person grown and come to full stature , neither could he close and fit little members to greater : but their divine and spiritual evenness is expressed , that all men are even and equal when they are made by god , and our age may have difference in increase of bodies according to the world , not according to god : unless if the grace also which is given to the baptized be given lesse or more according to the age of receivers : where as the holy spirit is equally given to all , not by measure , but out of tendernesse and fatherly indulgence . for god as he accepts not a person , so neither doth he accept of age , sith he affordes himself alike to all with a ballanced equality for the obtaining of heavenly grace . and for what thou hast said the footstep of an infant made in the first dayes of his birth is not clean , because every one of us as yet is afraid to kiss him , neither do we think this to be a hindrance to the giving of heavenly grace : for it is written , all things are clean to the clean ; neither ought any one to be afraid to do that which god hath vouchsafed . for although the infant is yet new from the birth , yet it is not so that one in giving grace and granting peace ought to be afraid to kiss him , sith in the kiss of an infant every one of us according to his religion ought to think of the very hands of god as yet fresh , which we in some : sort kiss in man now formed and newly born , when we embrance that which god hath made . for as for what was observed in jewish carnal circumcision the 8. day , is a sacrament foregoing in a shadow and in an image , but is now compleat in the truth , christ being come . for because the day in which the lord should rise and quicken and give us spiritual circumcision was the 8. day , that is , the first after the sabbath , this 8. day , that is , the first after ▪ the sabbath and the lords day went before in an image , which image ceased , the truth after ●●●ing upon it , and the spiritual circumcision being given us . for which reason we think none ought to be hindred from obtaining the grace of christ , nor that the spiritual circumcision ought to be hindred by the carnal , but that every man altogether is to be admitted to the grace of christ , sith peter also speaks and sayes in the acts of the apostles , the lord hath said to me , none is to be said to be common and unclean . but if any thing might hinder men from the obtaining grace , more grievous sins might hinder grown men and commen to full stature & elder in birth . but moreover , if to most grievous offenders , and those that sin much before god , when after they believe remission of sins is given , and no man is withheld from baptism and from grace , how much more ought not an infant to be withheld , who being new born hath sins no whit , but that being born according to adam carnally he drew on him in his first nativity the contagion of death of old : who in this respect doth more easily come to receive remission of sins , because not his own sias but anothers are forgiven him ? and therefore most dear brother , this was our sentence in the council , that none by us ought to be prohibited from baptism , and the grace of god , who is mercifult and kind and tender to all . which as it is to be observed and held concerning infants themselves and newly born , who in this respect do deserve more of our help and ' divine mercy , because in the first beginning their birth presently crying and weeping they do nothing else but pra we wish to thee most dear brother alwayes health . for mr. richard baxter at kederminster . sir , some of my neighbours conceived it would be their best way to resolve their doubts about baptism to know what arguments you could bring for infant-baptism , and against their being baptized , notwithstanding the pretended baptism they had in infancy . whereupon with my privity one came to you , upon whose relating to me your answer , i wrote to you , and upon receipt of your letter to me think good to let you understand , that i said not , i utterly refused open dispute , but that i affected it not , it being fit for schools , and not common auditors , entered into usually with animosities and eagernesse to obtain a supposed victory , mannaged with heat and multitude of words , with answers and replies not so delibrate as were requisite to settle any ones judgement , they being misapprehended by auditors who commonly take him to have the better who speaks the most , ending usually in wrangling or something like it , followed with misreports , accompanied w●●● disorders and inconveniencies insomuch that except in case of betraying truth by declining a dispute , i can hardly bring my self to yield to it . and howsoever you conceive of my advantages , you may if you will , and perhaps do know , that you have such advantages in your ready wit and speech , and the favour and general acclamation to any thing that is said for the superstition of infant-baptism as to bring things so to passe , that the event shall be crying down truth and disgrace of my person . nor have your disparaging speeches of my writings without animadversions on them communicated to me , or your carriage at or not long after the receipt of my letter , encouraged me to hope for all candour from you in this matter . for preaching , sith it belongs to you to maintain the divine institution of infant-baptism , i shall be willing to examine what you say , when you have said what you think good for it if i may obtain a copy of your sermon which you will own ; and if it satisfie me , i shall confesse it , if not in a sermon in the same place or elsewhere i shall give a distinct and plain answer to it . fo● writing ( which i like best ) i desire not to put you to any tedious or volu●●nous way , but in the most compendious way of syllogisms , yea if it may ●● , that you put in one medium the strength of all you can . of the sho●●●ispatch you desire , you may assure your self who are to be the opponent in ●●●oint , my answer will be as short as your argument will permit , and ●●●●●e you conttact it keeping to the point , the more satisfactory it wil 〈◊〉 i am yours in our lord john tombes bewdley , sept. 10. 16 notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a62870-e1490 tertullian . l. de baptismo laicis jus est baptizandi . gold refin'd, or, baptism in its primitive purity proving baptism in water an holy institution of jesus christ ... : wherein it is clearly evinced that baptism ... is immersion, or dipping the whole body, &c : also that believers are only the true subjects (and not infants) of that holy sacrament : likewise mr. smythies arguments for infant-baptism in his late book entitled, the non-communicant ... fully answered / by benj. keach ... keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. 1689 approx. 366 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 136 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2005-12 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a47535 wing k68 estc r17190 13155070 ocm 13155070 98169 this keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the early english books online text creation partnership. this phase i text is available for reuse, according to the terms of creative commons 0 1.0 universal . the text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. early english books online. (eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a47535) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 98169) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 423:8) gold refin'd, or, baptism in its primitive purity proving baptism in water an holy institution of jesus christ ... : wherein it is clearly evinced that baptism ... is immersion, or dipping the whole body, &c : also that believers are only the true subjects (and not infants) of that holy sacrament : likewise mr. smythies arguments for infant-baptism in his late book entitled, the non-communicant ... fully answered / by benj. keach ... keach, benjamin, 1640-1704. [8], 183, [1] p. printed for the author, and are to be sold by nathaniel crouch ..., london : 1689. pages 16-17 are stained; p. 25 has print obliterated and p. 179-end are torn in filmed copy. beginning-p. 35 and p. 170-end photographed from union theological seminary library copy and inserted at the end. advertisement: p. [8]. reproduction of original in british library. marginal notes. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng smythies, william, d. 1715. -unworthy non-communicant. baptism -early works to 1800. infant baptism -early works to 1800. 2005-04 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2005-05 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2005-06 jonathan blaney sampled and proofread 2005-06 jonathan blaney text and markup reviewed and edited 2005-10 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion gold refin'd ; or , baptism in its primitive purity . proving baptism in water an holy institution of jesus christ , and to continue in the church to the end of the world. wherein it is clearly evinced , that baptizo , or baptism , is not aspersion or sprinkling , or pouring a little water upon the face , or any other part of the body : but that it is immersion , or dipping the whole body , &c. also that believers are only the true subjects ( and not infants ) of that holy sacrament . likewise mr. smythies arguments for infant-baptism in his late book , entitled , the non-communicant , ( and all other objections ) fully answered . by benj. keach , author of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , a key to open scripture-metaphors . isa. 1. 22. thy silver is become dross . london , printed for the author , and are to be sold by nathaniel crouch , at the sign of the bell in the poultry . 1689. the epistle to all that love our lord jesus christ in sincerity . it may possibly be a little wondred at , that i should write at this time any thing upon this subject , which may seem to revive the controversie , of which little has been written of late years ; it may therefore seem necessary i should speak something by way of apology for my self . first of all , i must tell you , that this treatise was wrote the last summer , altho it had no birth till now , and many know what provocations i had about that time to write in behalf of our practice in respect of baptism : having heard how a worthy minister ( whom i respect and honour ) who liveth not far off from me , had publickly preach'd up the baptizing of little babes , bearing very hard upon those of our perswasion ; and could i have had a friendly conference with him , 't is like this had not seen the sun. besides , we were challeng'd to dispute the point with some ministers of the church of england much about the same time , not far from london : but tho they had rendred us as odious as they well could ( and as if we had nothing to say for our practice , viz. for baptizing men and women ) yet when all came to all , none of them would appear to defend what they had spoken , which caused some to conclude it did behove me , or some other to write something about it . moreover , a godly friend ( of some eminency in london ) sent for me to his house ( who , tho a baptist , yet walks with our brethren called independents ) and desired me that i would be pleased to write a sheet or two upon baptism , chiefly to shew what it was , sith he perceived many good people were mistaken therein , and did , as he conceived , take that to be baptism , or baptizing , which was not the thing , he having examined what the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 baptizo did signify , and found by lexicons , and by conferring with scholars , it did not signify aspersion , sprinkling , nor pouring , nor any other washing than immersion , or total dipping of the body in water ; and therefore did conclude it necessary this thing should be further opened , and would have me to conser with one able person who well understood the greek tongue about it , which i was willing to do : nay , and besides all this , when we wrote our key to open scripture-metaphors , we promised the reader we would write something concerning this very matter , as you may see if you read pag. 38. part 2. which , though it be above six years ago , we never performed till now . all these things considered together , with that great impulse of spirit i found to do it , i thought i had a sufficient call to undertake the work , altho i know it has been more effectually managed by far abler pens some years since , yet i conclude ( with others ) a short tract of a small price might come into more hands than bigger volumes would do . moreover i must confess , i have not a little wondred to see so many eminent fathers , and famous divines , both ancient and modern , speaking so clearly as to the literal , proper and genuine signification of the word baptizo , and yet finding so many wise and learned men of late so strangely contradicting themselves by their own practice . i am sure if prejudice and partiality were laid aside , and men would deal faithfully with their own consciences , they must confess our practice of immersion ( or dipping believers in water in the name of the father , &c. ) must of necessity be congruous both with the literal and spiritual signification of the word baptism , and practice of the apostles and primitive church ; and so it will be found one day , and that they have no just cause given them to reproach or charge us as they do : who laying the foundation of their own house false , or not according to the patern ; and not contented so to do neither , but vilifie and reproach them who build exactly according to the direction of the master-builder : we marvel how they can satisfy themselves to keep up that practice of theirs of rantism , since there is nothing to be said in the defence of it from god's word ; and if once it was laid aside ( with the wrong subject ) as an unwarrantable rite , and they would cleave to the primitive institution and practice , what a glorious reformation in point of church-constitution and discipline would there be ! and what a sweet harmony and vnion would follow amongst us ! for there has been no one thing that hath caused like contention in the church for many years , as this of infants-sprinkling hath . if our brethren would but lay this seriously to heart , i can't but think it would put them to a stand or pause about it . it had need lie clear in the word of god , since so great a stress as the foundation of their church in such an eminent manner ( in respect of its constitution ) is laid upon it , and it being that main thing that obstructs and hinders that blessed vnion and fellowship amongst so many good christians as it doth , who hardly in any other things differ at all in any article of faith or practice . and whereas our brethren seem to fly for refuge to that indirect and remote signification of the word baptizo of washing , yet how apparent is it , that it means no other wa●●● but such as is by dipping , swilling , or total wet●●●● that thing , part , member , or person all over ●it . water , that is said to be baptized ; for tho all dipping or baptizing may be called a washing , yet all washing is not dipping , &c. in a proper sense the word baptize , wilson in his dictionary saith , is derived from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , tingo , to dip , or plunge into the water , and signifieth primarily such a kind of washing as is used in bucks where linnen is plunged and dipt , &c. but how evident it is , that sprinkling , or pouring is no such washing , viz. baptizing . ainsworth upon lev. 15. 5. says , to baptize , or wash his flesh , as is expressed ver . 13 , 16. meaneth his whole body ; likewise ( saith a great author ) the hebrews affirm in every place , where it is said in the law of bathing the flesh , and washing the cloaths of the unclean , it is not meant but of baptizing the whole body , &c. but if the greek word would bear sprinkling or pouring , yet that will not justify men thus to baptize , because not according to the vsage of the primitive church ; nor doth it answer or reach the signification of this ordinance , which is the death , burial , and resurrection of jesus christ , together with our death to sin , and rising with him to walk in newness of life ; to represent which great mystery , it was ordained , as you will find if you read this treatise . i have been the larger upon this , because if baptism is nothing less , nor more , nor any other act than immersion , or total dipping the whole body , &c. than abundance of godly christians must seek after true baptism ; neither can infants , it appears from hence , be the subjects of it , sith their tender bodies can't bear it in these cold climates , without palpable danger of their lives , as our opposites confess , and formerly , by woful experience , found to be so . jesus christ never appointed an ●●●●nance to destroy the lives of any of his creatures . ●ut why will not our brethren keep to the great insti●ution , and exact rule of the primitive church ? must we content our selves with that light which the church had in respect of this and other gospel-truths at the beginning of the reformation , — since god hath brought forth greater ( to the praise of his own rich grace ) in our days ? and why should a tradition of the antichristian state , be so zealously defended ? the church will never certainly appear in its primitive glory , till this rubbish be remov'd ; which is nothing less than to take a stone of babylon , and lay it in sion for a foundation . besides , it doth not a little reflect upon the honour of the lord jesus , thus to derogate from his holy law , who is appointed heir of both worlds ; who hath settled in his church that religion , and every ordinance thereof , which must remain unalterable to the end of time , or consummation of all things . he ( as our annotators well say ) is the builder of god's house , propagating a holy ( not a fleshly ) seed for himself ; and hath appointed , and fixed on the matter and form thereof , as seemed good in his own sight , who is the brightness of the father's glory , and express image of his person , &c. and what an account our brethren or others will be able to give to him , for presuming to do any thing contrary to the apostolical constitution , when he comes to judg the quick and the dead , i know not . as touching that great argument for infant-baptism , taken from the covenant made with abraham , tho something is here said in answer , and enough hath been said by others formerly , yet i must acquaint the reader , there is a most excellent treatise prepared , written by a very worthy and judicious person ( and ready for a timely birth ) wherein that grand objection , and all ●thers are answered ( beyond what any i think have ●itherto do●● . ) but if we should grant all they say of abraham's fleshly seed , and foe●● holiness , yet that will not prove children to have a right to baptism , because baptism ( as well as circumcision was ) is a meer positive law , and wholly depends on the will and pleasure of the law-giver : which is in this treatise opened and asserted again and again , and not without good reason . but lest i should keep the reader too loong at the door , i shall conclude this epistle with my hearty prayers , that god would be pleased in mercy to open our brethrens eyes , or ours , wherein either they or we lie short as touching any part of god's will , and let us strive to live in love and concord together , wherein we do , or can agree . 't is truth i contend for , and that truth which was once delivered to the saints , and shall , i hope , whilst i am in the body , who now ( as well as formerly ) subscribe my self thy servant for jesus sake , aug. 6. 1688. benj. keach . advertisement . if any desire to be furnished that excellent book , written some times since by mr. william kiffin , proving no unbaptized person ought to be admitted to the lord's table ; may have them at mr. nath. crouch's , at the sign of the bell in the poultry , or at the authors house in southwark : gold refin'd ; or ; baptism in its primitive purity . chap. i. wherein the baptism of water is proved to be that intended in the commission , and so a standing ordinance till the end of the world. i having for many years last past observed with what strength of argument some worthy christians have laboured to defend the sacred ordinance of baptism ; and how they have endeavoured to refine it from all human mixtures , to the great satisfaction and establishment of many persons in the land ; yet notwithstanding , finding how that still a multitude of gracious people remaing very ignorant about it , and other● very obstinately and reproachfully do slight and contemn it , casting very scandalous and scurrilous reflections upon those who practise it according to the primitive institution , both from the pulpit and the press : i have been put upon writing something further in the defence of our selves and practice herein . and that i may the more regularly proceed in this work , i shall endeavour to prove baptism in water to be that baptism which is intended in the commission ; and therefore to abide as an undoubted and standing ordinance of the lord jesus christ until his second coming , or the end of the world. first of all , it may be necessary to shew you , that this ordinance was instituted and ordained by our lord jesus , and given forth by him soon after he rose from the dead , and a little before he ascended into heaven ; see mat. 28. 18 , 19 , 20. mark 16. 16. and jesus came , and spake unto them , saying , all power is given unto me in heaven and in earth . go ye therefore , and teach all nations , baptizing them in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy spirit : teaching them to observe all things that i have commanded you : and lo , i am with you alway even to the end of the world. the lord jesus first of all asserteth his power and authority . secondly , he delegates a power to his disciples . thirdly , he subjoyns a gracious promise to them . 1. the power and authority which he asserteth to himself is , all power in heaven and earth ; power to institute and appoint laws and ordinances , how and after what manner god ought in gospel-times to be worshipped ; power to give repentance and remission of sins ; power to congregate , to teach , and govern his church as the supream lord , head , and ruler thereof ; yea , and power to give eternal life to whomsoever he pleaseth . this was inherent in him as god blessed for ever , given to him as our mediator , given to him when he came into the world , but more especially confirmed to him and manifested to be given him at his resurrection , and ascension into heaven . and having declared himself supream lord and law-giver , he 2. delegates a power to his disciples , go ye therefore and teach all nations , baptizing them ; the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 make disciples , that must be by preaching the gospel to them , instructing them in the principles of the christian faith , teaching them to observe all things whatsoever i have commanded you ; and lo , i am with you alway to the end of the world , that 's the promise . these are the words of the great commission , which contains part of the last will and testament of the ever blessed jesus , the glorious testator of the new covenant , wherein baptism is found and expresly given forth , and with as great authority , and in as solemn a manner as ever was any precept or ordinance that we read of in all the book of god. object . but 't is not said , baptize them in water , it may therefore intend the baptism of the holy spirit . answ . to which we answer ; as 't is not said baptize them with water , so 't is not said baptize them with the holy spirit : they were commanded to baptize , that 's evident ; and that it was water our saviour did require them to baptize with , and not the spirit , we prove , first , because the baptism of the holy spirit was never by our saviour or his apostles commanded , it was never injoyn'd as a precept or duty to be done , but was always mentioned as a promise , he shall baptize you with the holy ghost and with fire . and again , ye shall be baptized with the holy ghost not many days hence : it argues great weakness , or else wilfulness , that men should see no better how to distinguish between a baptism that was commanded as a duty to be done , and a baptism promised , which was never injoyned as a duty . secondly , it cannot mean the baptism of the holy ghost , because the disciples of christ ( nor no man under heaven ) had ever any such power delegated or given to them , as to baptize with the holy ghost ; 't is strange persons should be so blind and bold to think ( much less to assert ) that meer men can give the holy spirit , or administer that baptism , as if the holy ghost was at the disposal of the will of man , or that men know whom to give it to , which indeed only lies hid in the breast of god himself , who bestows it to whom and in what manner he pleaseth . and therefore , thirdly , we do affirm from the authority of god's word , that to baptize with the holy spirit is the peculiar prerogative royal of jesus christ , and that he did never impower any disciple of his to give it , he shall baptize you with the holy spirit . the father by him , and he immediately by himself in his own person distributes or gives forth of the spirit according to the good pleasure of his will , without imparting with this sovereign prerogative , or peculiar power to any other . now since christ's disciples could not baptize with the spirit , and yet are commanded to baptize , it follows clearly it must be water . object . doth not the apostle shew that men had power to give the spirit ? what else is the meaning of these words , he therefore that ministreth to you the spirit ? it appears that persons who preached ministred the spirit . answ . by the spirit is meant the gospel , or word of christ : as the law is called the letter , so is the new testament called the ministration of the spirit , 2 cor. 3. 6. the words that i speak unto you , saith christ , are spirit , &c. doth god ( as if the apostle should say ) concur with our ministry , and give the spirit to those who hear it , and help us to work miracles to confirm it ? and is this done by our preaching the law , or by the hearing of faith , that is , the word of faith , viz. the gospel , see vers . 2. or by preaching the word of christ ? fourthly , the baptism in the commission cannot intend that of the holy ghost ; because the spirit 's baptism signifies the miraculous effusion , or extraordinary gifts thereof ( and not the saving influences , graces , and operations of it ) which but a few , and those too in the primitive time , did partake of ; but the baptism in the commission is injoyned on all that are made disciples in all nations , and in every age , even to the end of the world. fifthly , it must be water-baptism , because our saviour joyneth it with repentance and believing . now all along in order of practice these two went together both before this time and also afterwards . you may be sure had it been any other baptism , it would never have been thus joyned together in order of words , with that baptism that was so united in order of practice with repentance and faith , without the least intimation of any thing by our saviour to the contrary . sixthly , because 't is a baptism that is to be administred in the name of the father , of the son , and holy spirit , how can any with the least shadow of reason , suppose it should be meant of the baptism of the holy spirit , sith it is to be administred in the name of the holy spirit ? were any ever baptized with the holy spirit in the name of the father , son and holy ghost ? the spirit was that with which they were baptized ; and therefore not baptized in the name of the spirit . seventhly , the only way further to remove this objection , is to observe what the practice of the disciples was after the ascension of christ in the execution of this great commission : what was it they baptized with ? see acts 8. 36. and they came to a certain water ; and the eunuch said , see , here is water . vers. 28. they went both down into the water , and philip baptized him . acts 10. 47 , 48. can any man forbid water , that these should not be baptized ? — and he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the lord jesus . that baptism which in the commission the lord jesus commanded his disciples to baptise with , was the baptism which they after his ascension did baptize with ; and that it was water the scriptures we have now cited do evidently shew ; certainly the apostles well understood what baptism it was their blessed master did command them to administer . eighthly , besides , were it not the baptism of water which was given to them in the commission , matth. 28. 19 , 20. they did that in his name , i. e. by his authority , which they had no authority to do , for other commissions they had not , this being the only place where water-baptism is mentioned , as being instituted and given in commission to them to administer , and to all other disciples and ministers of christ to the end of the world. now , secondly , that this holy ordinance of baptism doth continue to the end of the world is evident , first , because whatsoever is given forth by jesus christ , is given forth by him as he is king , and mediator of the new covenant , and as part of his last will and testament ; and his last will and testament , i hope , all will grant stands in full force and virtue , and every part and branch of it unalterable to the end of the world : though it be a man's covenant , or testament , yet if it be confirmed , no man disannulleth , or addeth thereto * . how much more dangerous then is it for any to disannul , alter , add to , or diminish from the last will and testament of the lord jesus the son of god , who received commandment from the father what he should say and speak † ; and was faithful to him that appointed him , as a son over his own house | ? secondly , the arguments that men bring against the continuation of baptism , tend to root out all other ordinances of the lord jesus as well as this . why may they not deny preaching to continue , as well as baptizing , since teaching is commanded by no other authority than this ? are they not both expresly given forth and joined together by our saviour in this his last and great commission ? may i not argue thus ; if teaching continues to the end of the world , baptism continues ? but teaching none denies to continue , ergo baptism continues . do but observe the conjunction between teaching and baptizing in the commission , go , teach all nations , baptizing them ; and again , teaching them , &c. baptism is fenc'd in on both sides , 't is secured , one would think , ( as our lord jesus has placed it ) from all force and violence whatsoever ; and that such must be impudently bold as dare attempt to raze it out , or seek to disannul it , and make it of none effect . thirdly , the promise that is subjoined in express words , in the commission , clearly proves the continuation of this ordinance ; and lo , i am with you always to the end of the world ; not to the end of that age only as some affirm . see our late annotators on these words , i am , and i will be with you ; and those who succeed you in the work of the ministry , being called of me thereunto , i will be with you , protecting you in that ordinance , and blessing you , and all other my faithful ministers , that labour for making me and my gospel known , with success to the end of the world ; not of this age only , but till the end of the world — or till the world shall be determined , and the new heavens and the new earth shall appear . fourthly , the practice of the apostles and disciples of christ , after his ascension into heaven , clearly proves , that the baptism of water doth continue ; for how frivolous is that objection that some make against it , viz. it was to abide no longer than till the baptism of the spirit ( which say they was christ's baptism ) took place , seeing it is so evident and plain in the acts of the apostles , and in divers other places , that it was both taught and practised , after that great effusion , or pouring forth of the holy spirit , which was the baptism promised , and was first of all made good to the apostles and saints of god at jerusalem ; when the day of pentecost was fully come , and they were all with one accord in one place * ; by the help and power of which spirit st. peter preached to those jews that had put christ to death : at the hearing of which sermon , many of them being pricked in their hearts , cried out , what shall we do ? then said peter , repent , and be baptized every one of you in the name of jesus christ , for the remission of sins , and ye shall receive the gift of the holy spirit . now the baptism here enjoined on these penitents , could not be that of the spirit ; for how absurd would that render the reading of the words , repent , and be baptized with the spirit , and ye shall receive the gift of the holy spirit . fifthly , but to make it appear yet more fully , that baptism in water continued after the coming of the spirit , or great effusion of the holy ghost , see , acts 10. 't is said , while peter yet spake these words , the holy ghost fell on all them which heard the word , ( that was on cornelius and those with him ) . and they of the circumcision , which believed , were astonished , as many as came with peter , because on the gentiles also was poured out the gift of the holy ghost , vers. 45. for they heard them speak with tongues , and magnified god. then answered peter , vers . 46. can any man forbid water , that these should not be baptized , which have received the holy ghost as well as we ? vers . 47. and he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the lord , vers . 48. here the very persons who were baptized with the holy spirit , were commanded in the name ( that is , by the authority ) of the lord jesus , to be baptized in water ; and it was a thing that no man did or ought to deny to be their indispensable duty ; so that the highest gifts or endowments of the holy ghost , cannot excuse or exempt any persons from this blessed ordinance of baptism in water ; and how bold and daring must that man needs seem to be , who shall adventure to say , 't is a low and carnal thing , and i forbid it to such who have the spirit 's baptism . i would to god this were laid to heart , for such men are certainly grown to a great degree of pride and arrogance , as well as it argues palpable blindness , infidelity and disobedience , and that they have lost their way , and go astray in untrodden paths , who shall speak at such a rate . object . but say some , the baptism mentioned by you in both these places , was done in the name of the lord jesus , and not in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost , and so not according to the commission , and therefore not the same baptism . answ . to be baptized in the name of jesus christ , is to be baptized as christ instituted , commanded , and ordained ; and as a learned person saith , these words , in the name of christ , signifies no more that baptism was administred only in the name of christ , not of the father and the holy ghost , than these words , paul a servant of jesus christ , argues , that he was a servant of christ only , and not of the father and holy ghost also : or as if those words of paul to the keeper of the prison , believe on the lord jesus christ , should be thought to free him from a necessity of believing in the other two persons : for as he that believes aright in jesus christ , believes also in the father and holy spirit ; so he that is baptized in a right manner , is baptized in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy spirit . but because the lord jesus more immediately , and as our soveraign lord , law-giver and mediator , instituted and gave forth this command , they are said to be baptized in his name , meaning , they were baptized by his authority . peter , saith cyprian , makes mention of jesus christ ; not as if the father were to be omitted , but that the son might be joined to the father , &c. and st. austin saith , they were commanded to be baptized in the name of christ ; and tho the father and holy ghost were not mentioned , yet we understand they were not otherwise baptized , than in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost . why dost thou not apprehend , when it is said of the son , all things were made by him , that the holy ghost also , though not mentioned , is there likewise understood ? to be baptized into christ jesus , ( saith eulogius ) signifies , to be baptized according to the precept of christ , that is , into the father , son , and holy ghost . and that other [ into his death ] is typically representing his death in baptism . the same patriarch , in the same place , a little before saith thus , what is said in the acts , of those that had received the baptism of john , that they were baptized in the name of the lord jesus , denotes , that they were baptised according to the institution and doctrine of the lord jesus ; that is to say , they were baptized into the name of the father , son , and holy ghost . for so the lord jesus christ taught and commanded his disciples to baptize , mat. 28. 19 , 20. object . notwithstanding what we have said yet , saith the objector , john baptist opposeth his baptism to the baptism of christ ; which could not have been done , if the baptism with water was an inseparable companion of christ's doctrine ; how could john say , verily , i baptize you with water , but he shall baptize you with the holy ghost ? &c. moreover , if christ had been commanded to baptize with water as well as john , the words would have run thus , verily , i baptize you with water only , but he shall baptize you also with the 〈◊〉 . answ . thus to distinguish the baptism of water , and that of the spirit , into john's and christ's , and oppose these two one to the other , as if the one of these were distructive to the other , as if that of john's were his own , and none of christ's , is very ridiculous , and argues great darkness in the understanding of these opposers of water-baptism , for 't is undeniably evident , that this of water ( as well as that of the spirit ) was given forth by christ himself , and as part of his last will and testament , to abide together with teaching , believing and repenting to the end of the world. these men would fain have us believe , that the baptism of water was the baptism of john's , and none of christ's , but as if john had instituted it , and not christ , and as if john were the author of it , and christ the finisher ; whereas nothing is more clear that christ , ( consider'd as god ) was the author , and the first that ordained , appointed and instituted it to be administred by john ; and after john's decease , yea , and after his own death , and resurrection too , gave order to its continuance . and for the observation of it amongst all nations , our late annotators also on mat. 3. 5. agree with us exactly herein , he ( that is , john ) was sent to baptize in water ; so as from this time ( say they ) the institution of the sacrament of baptism must be dated . nothing can be more evident , than that the baptism with water was christ's baptism ; and howbeit it is called john's , as john was the first minister and messenger from christ to begin it , for , behold , i send my messenger , and he shall prepare my way before me , saith christ , mal. 3. 1. it was christ's appointment in whose name , and not in john's , it was begun and dispensed always even in that juncture wherein john himself was living ; and one would think men could not be so blind to suppose it ceased in john , fith our lord jesus after his death and resurrection , gives special command for the continuation of it , in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost , in all nations to the end of the world : and in regard also that the apostles after christ's ascension into heaven preached the same doctrine of repentance , and commanded such who were discipled to be baptized in water * , in the name of the lord jesus , which signifies , as we have already shewed , nothing less than according to the institution of christ , and that glorious commission they had received from him . therefore john baptized only as christ's servant , and it was from heaven he received commission to baptize ; and our lord's submission to it himself as administred by john , to fulfil all righteousness , ( that is , as one observes , the righteousness of his own law , i. e. the gospel , to be an example to us , and the father's glorious approbation of his son in his obedience herein , by a voice from heaven at the time of his coming out of the water ) one would think might put an end to these foolish objections . jesus christ we say , owned water-baptism to be his ordinance , by subjecting himself to it , tho administred by his servant john ; and the father ratified it also , as well as the holy ghost , the one by that voice from heaven , saying , this is my beloved son , in whom i am well pleased ; and the other in coming down , or descending ( in a visible manner ) like a dove , and lighting upon him * and certainly had not this ordinance been to abide , our saviour would not have given such a commission a little before he ascended into heaven for the continuance of it to the world's end . nay , if it had been to cease , he would doubtless have given some hint of it , and have told his disciples plainly when at jerusalem , they should be anointed with power from on high , they should go and preach the gospel to all the world , or make disciples of the nations , but not baptize them any more , for that the way of repentance and faith , and the spirit 's baptism , was all the baptism they should teach and instruct the people in . moreover , had peter known this to have been the mind of his blessed master , he would doubtless have said to them , act. 2. ( when they asked what they should do ? ) repent , and believe in christ for the remission of your sins , but in the name of jesus christ be not baptized in water never a one of you , as some while since every penitent was required to be , for that was a dispensation and baptism of john , and had its time for a while , meerly to prepare the way of christ , but now is abolished and out of date ; ye must forsake john's old administration of water-baptism , that being a carnal and low thing , and look wholly to a higher and more sublime baptism , i. e. that of the holy ghost : and had he known this to be the mind of his master , would not he rather have said concerning cornelius , and those with him , acts 10. ( instead of saying , who can forbid water ? ) who can require water , that these persons should be baptized , who have received the holy spirit as well as we ? no doubt had water-baptism ceased , or been abolished , we should have had some discovery of it as well as we have of the ceasing of circumcision and other rites of the mosaical law ; for the apostles , we find , were as ready , and as careful to make known the cessation of such rites , as carnal ordinances that were not to abide in the church , as they were in establishing and confirming all those precepts they knew were to continue to the end of the world. if therefore , i say , water-baptism must not have remained , or if it were not , according to christ's will and testament an inseparable companion of his doctrine , we should have had some hint or intimation of it , either by christ's own mouth , or by the mouths of his apostles , who were to deliver and command nothing to people , but what they had received of the lord jesus , or what was commanded them of the lord as concerning the cessation of that service , or any toleration of any one person to omit it , but as we find it given forth by christ , and practised by his apostles and primitive saints , even from the beginning of it , which was in john's baptizing in water . so we find it , ad jure , to continue as part of his mind and testament , amongst other things , not a tittle of which testament is yet annihilated , nor shall , till he come to take an account of all men in respect of their obedience or disobedience , as to the preceptory part of his will contained therein . but furthermore , whereas these objectors seem to intimate , that jesus christ was not commanded , or commissionated from the father to baptize with water as john was , because 't is said by john , i verily baptize you with water , but he shall baptize you with the holy spirit ; as if christ had nothing to do to meddle with the baptism of water as any ordinance of his , or to give any order about it , or had any more power to dispence or enjoin it , than john had power to meddle in , or take upon him to baptize with the spirit , which peculiarly belong'd to christ , as that of water peculiarly belonged to john. to what they speak upon this account , we must say , and tell them , that jesus christ had command and commission from the father , as mediator , to give forth and enjoin water-baptism , though he committed the actual administration of it to his disciples ; for sith he commanded them to do it , and so baptized , saith an eminent writer , per alios at least , if not per se ; read john 3. 22. and after these things came jesus and his disciples into the land of judea , and there he tarried with them , and baptized . and john also was baptizing in enon near salim , &c. vers . 23. which is more fully explained , chap. 4. 2. when therefore the lord knew how the pharisees had heard that jesus made and baptized more disciples than john , though jesus himself baptized not , but his disciples . now if he had not received command from the father thus to do , his testimony is not true ; which to say , as the same author observes , were blasphemy ; for ●ote , what he affirms , john 12. for i have not spoken of my self , but the father which sent me , he gave me a commandment what i should say , and what i should speak — whatsoever i speak therefore , even as the father said unto , me , so i speak . wherefore since he did , by the hands of his disciples , baptize in water in judea , and made and baptized more disciples than john , he did it by command from his father : and indeed 't is evident that the people generally flock'd to him for the administration of water-baptism at last , and left john , insomuch as he in his ministry , even of water-baptism , increased , and john decreased , john 3. 26 , 27. those words of john , in answer to the jews , do plainly intimate no less , but that this very thing was intended by those expressions of his , though there might be more than this meant , and they came to john , and said unto him , rabbi , he that was with thee beyond jordan , to whom thou bearest witness , behold , the same baptizeth , and all men come to him . john answered , a man can receive nothing , except it be given him from above . vers. 28. ye your selves bear me witness , that i said , i am not the christ , but i am sent before him . — he must increase , but i must decrease , vers . 30. doth he baptize ? as if john should say , that is a sign he is sent of god : and do all men come to him ? do they rather go to him to be baptized than come to me ? why 't is no more than what i have told you , he shall increase , but i must decrease ; he and his ministry must and shall flourish , or increase in honour , and dignity , and reputation in the world ; he is the rising sun , to give you notice of which , i was but as the morning star ; he must shine every day more and more . i have had my time , and near finished my course , but do not think that the baptism of water shall cease with me ; for as he baptizeth , and riseth more and more in esteem and honour ; so he will do , and his ministration of this very ordinance will increase and be magnified in his hands , more than it has been in mine . i hope none will think it absurd to understand john's words after this manner , for it must necessarily be taken in this sense , in any solid understanding , i verily baptize you with water only ; as if he should say , but he shall baptize you also with the holy spirit . he is impowred to dispense higher matters to you than water only , with which he baptizeth ( as you tell me ) as well as i , though not himself , but his disciples ; i can go no further than to that outward administration of water , but he shall baptize you with the holy ghost . in which words john doth not oppose his baptism to the baptism of christ , as if that which is called his , were none of christ's , but rather that john might magnify the person of christ above himself ; as who should say , i can but dispense with the bare outward sign , but christ , who though he came after me , yet is preferr'd before me , in whose name , and not in my own , i baptize , and whose the baptism is that i dispense , and not my own ; he is able , besides the sign , to vouchsafe you the very thing signified . the baptism then of water , in the name of christ , together with repentance from dead works , and faith in his name , john baptist was the first minister to begin , in which respect it was called sometimes his ; but he left it , after a while , to christ himself and his disciples to carry on , who all , till christ was actually crucified , preach'd and practised the self-same things that john did , as did the disciples after his resurrection . all the difference between the administration of baptism , as dispensed by john and the disciples of christ , before christ's death and resurrection , and the administration of it afterwards were only in some circumstantials ; which briefly take as follows . 1. the baptism in water which was christ's , and of which john was but a minister , together with christ's other disciples before christ's death , &c. was then the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins by christ , who was to come , i. e. e're long , to suffer death , be buried , and rise again . 2. but after christ had suffered , it is the baptism of repentance , and faith , for the remission of sins by christ that is already come , hath died , was buried , and is risen again for our justification ; they baptized into christ to suffer ; now we are baptized into christ who hath suffered . 3. neither can this seem strange to any man , sith the doctrine which john , christ himself , and his disciples , preached before our saviour suffered , differed in the same respect also , for they all then preached repentance , faith and salvation by christ , to suffer . but had john lived till christ had suffered , he would have preached repentance , and faith , and administred baptism as we now do , viz. in and by christ , who hath suffered ; and this is all the difference , i say , that i know of , ( which is only circumstantial ) between the preaching the gospel , and baptizing , before the death of christ , and that after his death ; wherefore the word of the gospel under john , and after christ's death and resurrection , is called the very same word ; and the word that peter preached to cornelius and his house , is said to begin from john's baptism , as the same word which john came preaching ; so that the baptism with which john came baptizing , continues still , and was preached and practised by command from christ , by the mouth of peter , on disciples believing , in that very place acts 10. and this not in honour of john , as some frivolously affirm , but as a thing which ought to be done , as in force a-new from the lord jesus , in whose name peter administred it , and not without warrant from christ so to do ; he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the lord. object . but doth not paul positively affirm , he was not sent to baptize , but to preach the gospel , 1 cor. 1. 17. and that he thanked god he baptized no more of them than crispus and gaius , and the houshold of stephanus ? answ . paul cannot mean , christ sent him not at all to baptize ; or , that the gospel he was commanded to preach , had not baptism enjoyned to be preached and practised , as an inseparable companion of it , ( because his lord and master , as we have shewed , hath joyned preaching and baptizing together in his great commission ) mat. 28. 19 , 20. and so to continue to the end of the world. moreover , teaching and baptism , faith and baptism , repentance and baptism were always preached and practised together : but he means this of baptizing was not his chief business ; nor did christ require him absolutely to the actual dispensing of the ordinance of baptism with his own hands , but to preach the gospel , in which baptism as well as repentance and faith were contained , and as a sacred ordinance thereof , which he was sent to preach as well as any other gospel-institution , and that he did preach it , otherwise he could not have said as he did , acts 20. that he had not shun'd to declare the whole counsel of god , and so , that it was done too by himself or some other , but it was not in his commission , that he must administer it in but his own p●rion ; for it is evident , the administration or act of baptizing was not tied up to the apostles , or to the more ordinary ministers , but that any faithful gifted-disciples might administer it as well as they ; nor doth the efficacy of baptism depend in the least upon the quality of the person administring of it , whether it be paul , apollos , or cephas , or any other disciple much inferiour to them in capacity or office , it is no matter ; for ananias , a private disciple , baptized ; and philip , who was no other than a deacon , or over-seer of the poor , baptized many in the city of samaria , act. 8. so that we find in the primitive times the simple act of baptizing was a work inferior , servile and subservient to that of preaching the gospel , or doctrine of repentance , faith and baptism in christ's name for remission of sins , which was the great work the apostles were more especially sent to do , yet baptize they sometimes did , ( when probably it was desired of them , or when the multitudes to be baptized were so great that it required their help with others to do it ; ) nor is it rational to believe that peter himself and the eleven did baptize all the three thousand , act. 2. without the hands of the 120 ; though at that occasion the apostles might baptize some likewise , there is no reason to doubt . when therefore paul says , christ sent him not to baptize , he intends not , that that ordinance was none of those things he had in commission to meddle with ( for had it been so , he went beyond his commission in baptizing those few he did baptize with his own hands , which were absurd to think , sith he was so faithful a servant of jesus christ , and positively affirms , that he would not dare to speak of any of those things which christ had not wrought by him ) to make the gentiles obedient by word or deed : the words [ not sent ] do not import not at all , as appears by these scriptures , john 6. 27. 1. tim. 2. 14. ephes . 6. 12. therefore he must mean not chiefly , or only sent to baptize , but to preach the gospel ; or not sent personally to do it , as i might further make appear in respect of christ himself , who , as mediator of the new testament , ( as hath been proved ) received command from the father to baptize ; but yet in the like sense it might be said , he was not commanded to baptize , i. e. personally to dispense the ordinance himself , for had he received such a commission , he had not fulfilled it ; for howbeit , it is said he baptized more disciples than john , yet he himself dispensed baptism to none with his own hands , john 4. 1 , 2. but by the hands of his disciples . if what we have said here in answer to this objection were well considered , it will appear to confute such who object against the practice of baptism , for want of a due and lawful minister or administrator , indued with an extraordinary call and power to work miracles . sith the act of baptizing is a more inferior thing than that of preaching the gospel , and that any gifted disciple may baptize ; all that is recorded of ananias's fitness or qualification ( who baptized paul ) is , that he was a disciple , acts 9. 10. and there was a certain disciple at damascus named ananias ; and there is no cause to doubt but many such disciples were imploied in baptizing those 3000 converted by peter's sermon , acts 2. so that there is no reason to tie up this administration to ordinary ministers or pastors of churches , much less to the great apostles , or such who have an extraordinary mission , sith paul saith he was not sent to baptize , intimating , as you heard , that that work was not limited to the apostolical office , or that it must be done by men extraordinarily qualified and called forth , and none else . moreover , whereas 't is said by some , that he who takes upon him to baptize , ought to have power to work miracles as the apostles did ; this seems very strange , seeing the text saith expresly , that john the baptist , the first and most eminent baptizer , did no miracle , yet the people made no objection against him , or his power to baptize notwithstanding . quest . but had not john an express commission to baptize ? answ . that his baptism was from heaven , or that he did receive command to baptize , 't is evident ; yet we read not when or how he received such commission ; but let his commission be what it would , and never so full , it could not be fuller or more plain than the commission we have lest us jesus christ , mat. 28. 19 , 20. go , teach all nations , baptizing them — and lo , i am with you always , to the end of the word . now as this commission authorizes the disciples of jesus christ to preach to the end of the world , so it equally impowers them to baptize ; and the same argument that is brought against baptizing , viz. not having an extraordinary mission , holds as strong against preaching , and the practice of all ordinances whatsoever as well as that ; therefore how dangerous a thing is it for any to plead for the non-continuance of baptism in the church , or to say it ceased when the extraordinary gifts ceased , sith there is no other commission that injoyns christ's disciples to preach , &c. but that which as well injoyns them to baptize those who are discipled by the word . object . but since the practice of baptism in water was lost in the apostacy , how could it be restored again without a new mission ? answ . that makes against the restoration of other gospel-ordinances . which were lost as well as baptism , in respect of the purity of them , as practised in the primitive times : but as the children of israel had lost for many years the ordinance of the feast of tabernacles , yet by reading in the book of the law there was such a thing required , they immediately revived it and did as they found it written without any new mission , or extraordinary prophet to authorize them so to do ; even so ought we to act , god's word being a warrant sufficient to justify us in so doing . chap. ii. shewing what baptism is from the literal and true genuine and proper signification of the word baptism . in shewing the signification of the word baptism , we will , with all impartiality , give the judgment of the learned ; 't is a greek word , therefore let us see what the learned in that tongue generally have , and do affirm to be the express signification thereof : and such hath been our care and pains , together with a friend of mine , ( some time since deceased * , who was several months in my house ) as to examine the writings of divers eminent men upon this account , amongst which are scapula and stephanus , pasor , minshew , and leighs critica sacra ; grotius , vossius , casaubon , selden , mr. daniel rogers , mede , chamiers , dr. taylor , dr. hammond , dr. cave , hefychius , budaeus , beza , erasmus , buchanan , luther , illyricus , zanchy , glassius , &c. who with many other learned men , nay all indeed who are impartial , agree with one voice , that the primary , proper , and literal signification of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , baptiso is mergo , immergo , submergo , obr●o , item tingo quod fit immergendo , that is , in english , to immerge , plunge under , overwhelm , as also to dip , which is done by plunging . true in a less proper or remote sense , because thing that are washed , are commonly dipped or covered all over in water , it is put for washing , luke 11. 38. heb. 9. 10. mark 7. 4. and we dare modestly assert , that no greek author of any credit , whether heathenish or christian , has ever put baptizing for sprinkling , or used those words promiscuously ; the greeks have a peculiar word to express sprinkling , viz. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , rantizo , which as a learned * author observes , is ever used in scripture by the holy spirit , when he speaks of such a thing as 〈…〉 yea , 't is used three times in one chapter , viz. heb. 9. 13 , 19 , 21. and is always translated sprinkling : neither is there , saith he , any one place of scripture , wherein the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is rendred to baptize , or used to signify baptizing : neither is there one scripture wherein the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , baptizo , is rendred sprinkling , or used to signify such a thing as sprinkling . this being so , and certainly so it is ; how strangely hath the world , and many godly christians , been deceived , thinking they have been baptized , when in truth they never were to this day , but only rantized . we have had many long and tedious disputes , and perplex'd controversies , about the true . form or manner of baptizing , whereas the thing in difference , is properly not the manner or form of baptizing , but what baptism is ; for , as one observes , a man may ride many ways , viz. east , west , &c. backward , forward , apace , or slowly , &c. yet all this is riding still , whilst the man moves to and fro on horse-back , because the very formality of that action of riding , consists is being carried by a beast ; but while he moves upon his own legs up and down , you cannot at that time denominate him riding . in like manner a man may be baptized [ anglicè , dipped ] or put under the water many ways , viz. forward , backward , sideway , towards the right hand or left , with a quick or slow motion , and yet all the while be baptized ; if he is put under the water , for in such respect the form or manner of baptizing , i.e. dipping , doth consist : the manner of baptizing is one thing , and the manner of rantizing is another : sprinkling is sprinkling , let it be done how you please , but it never was , nor never will be baptizing . and that baptism is any thing else than dipping , or washing , which is by plunging or dipping , we do utterly deny ; for as the cutting off a little bit of the foreskin of the flesh , and not the twentieth part round , is not circumcision ; so sprinkling a little water on the face is not baptism : as it would be ridiculous , and very absurd to call that circumcision , so it is as false and ridiculous to call sprinkling , baptizing . if accidentals , or meer accessaries , be wanting unto baptism ( saith one ) there may be right baptism notwithstanding , but abstract the absolutely necessaries , 't is not only none of the baptism of christ , but truly not any baptism at all . object . but the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , though it signifies not to sprinkle , yet not only to dip and overwhelm in water , but also to wash , and so 't is rendred in the lexicons , as must be acknowledged by you . answ . if the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 do signify to wash , yet it is a real total washing , only such a washing as is by dipping , plunging , or swilling the subject in water , and that signification is far off from sprinkling : can any thing be said to be truly wash'd , that hath only a little water sprinkled upon it ? the best lexicons , and most eminent criticks , as well as the holy scripture , do most plainly decide the controversy , as mr. danvers and others observe . scapula and stephens , two as great masters of the greek tongue as most we have , do tell us , in their lexicons , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , signifies mergo , immergo , obruo ; item tingo , quod sit immergendo , inficere imbuere , viz. to dip , plunge , overwhelm , put under , cover over , to die in colour , which is done by plunging . grotius says it signifies to dip over head and ears . pasor , an immersion , dipping , or submersion . vossius says , it implieth a washing the whole body . mincoeus in his dictionary , says , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , is in the latin baptismus , in the dutch doopset , or doopen baptismus or baptisme , to dive or duck in water ; and the same with the hebrew tabal , which the septuagint , or seventy interpreters , render by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , baptiso to dip , as these texts in the old testament shew , gen. 37. 31. exod. 12. 22. lev. 4. 6. and 17. 14. deut. 33. 24. num. 16. 18. 2 king. 5. 14 , &c. this , saith casaubon , was the rite of baptizing , that persons were plunged into the water , which the very word baptizo sufficiently demonstrates . which as it does not extend so far as to sink down to the bottom , to the hurt of the person , so is it not to swim upon the superficies — baptism ought to be administred by plunging the whole body in water . also i find our late famous , learned , and reverend dr. du-veil , in his literal explanation of the acts , chap. 1. vers . 5. citing the same author in these words , the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , says casaubon , is to dip or plunge , as if it were to dye colour . leigh in his critica sacra , saith , its native and proper signification , is to dip into the water , or to plunge under water , mat. 3. 6. acts 8. 38. and that it is taken from a dyer's fat , and imports a dying , or giving a fresh colour ; for which also he quotes casaubon , bucanan , bullinger , zanchy , spanhemius : he saith withal , that some would have it signify washing ; which sense erasmus , he saith , opposed , affirming that it was not otherwise so , than by consequence ; for the proper signification was such a dipping or plunging , as dyers use for dying of clothes . salmasius saith , that that is not baptism which they give to children , but rantism . beza , on mat. 3. 11. saith , the word baptizo signifies to dye , by dipping or washing . selden saith , that the jews took that baptism wherein the whole body was not baptized , to be void . mr. daniel rogers saith , that the minister is to dip in water , as the meetest act the word baptizo notes it , for the greeks wanted not other words to express any other act besides dipping , if the institution could bear it . what resemblance of the burial and resurrection of christ is in sprinkling ? all antiquity and scripture confirm , that it was dipping . if you would , saith dr. taylor , attend to the proper signification of the word , baptism signifies plunging in water , or dipping with washing . in the synod of celichyth , where wolfred arch-bishop of canterbury presided , as 't is cited by dr. du-veil , it was ordered that the presbyters should take heed , that when they administred the sacrament of baptism , they should not do it by pouring water , but always by plunging , according to the example of the son of god , who was plunged in the waters of jordan . the same learned author affirms , this was the constant practice of the universal church , till the time of clement the 5th , who was crowned pope , saith he , anno 1305 , under whom first of all the second synod of ravenna approved the abuse introduc'd into some churches , about an hundred years before that baptism , without any necessity , should be administred by aspersion . hence , saith he , it came to pass , that contrary to the analogy , or intended mystical signification of this sacrament , all the vvest , for the most part in this age , they use rantism , that is , sprinkling instead of baptism , as zepper speaks , to the great scandal of the greeks and russians , who to this day plunge into the vvater those they baptize , and deny any one rightly baptized , who is not plung'd into the vvater , according to the precept of christ , as we may find in sylvester , sguropalus , and cassander ; the custom of the ancient church was not sprinkling , but immersion , in pursuance of the sense of the word baptizo in the commandment , and of the example of our blessed saviour , saith dr. taylor . the greek word baptein , ( saith salmasius ) ftom which the word baptizein derives , signifies immersion ; nor did the ancients otherways baptize . mr. joseph mede saith , that there was no such thing as sprinkling or rantism used in baptism in the apostles days , nor many ages after : he had spoke more proper if he had said , there was no rantism used in the apostles days but baptism , than to say no rantism used in baptism , sith he could not be ignorant but that they are two distinct actions , and it cannot be baptism at all if it be only sprinkling or rantism as is now used , dipping or immersion being the very thing , not an accident , but an essential , so absolutely necessary , that it can't be the thing without it . the ancient vse of baptism , saith chamier , was to dip the whole body into the element , therefore did john baptize in a river . neither is it amiss to give you what dr. hammond speaks upon this account in his annotations upon john 13. 10. where he saith , that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies an immersion , or washing the whole body , and which answereth to the hebrew word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 used for dipping in the old testament , and therefore tells us upon matth. 3. 1. that john baptized in a river , viz. in jordan , mark 1. 5. in a confluence of water , as aenon , john 3. 23. because 't is said there was much water ; which he further makes out by the name by which the greeks called the lakes where they used to wash ; also the ancients , he says , called their baptisterions , or the vessels containing their baptismal water , columbethras , viz. swimming or diving-places , being made very large with partitions for men and women . to all these famous authors , it may do well to add our late annotations , begun by the learned mr. pool , newly printed , see what they say on mat. 3. 6. a great part of those who went out to hear john were baptized , that is , dipped in jordan , and on mat. 28. 20. say they , it is true , the first baptism of which we read in holy writ , were by dipping the persons baptized . the dutch translation , according to their language , reads dipping . matth. 3. 20. jesus ge doopt zijnde , is terstont opge-klommon uit het water . and when jesus was dipp'd he came out of the water ; hence they , for john the baptist , read john the dipper ; and for he baptized them , he dipp'd them . why our translators , who have been so faithful and exact generally in all things ( as is acknowledged by all learned godly men in the translating the holy bible ) should leave the word baptism ( it being a greek word ) and not translate it into our language , as the dutch have done into theirs , i know not , unless it were to favour their own practice of bantising or sprinkling , which the word baptize will in no wise bear , as is confest by a whole cloud of witnesses . mr. ball in his catechism renders it washing by dipping . see also dr. ames in his marrow of divinity . mr. wilson in his dictionary saith , to baptize , is to dip into the water , or to plunge one into the water . also in the common-prayer-book dipping into the water is given as the proper and primary signification of the word . we will leave this to the consideration of all thinking men , it being so , i. e. that baptism is dipping or plunging the body all over in water , whether infants can be the subjects of it , sith their tender bodies cannot bear being plunged thus into the water in cold climates , without palpable danger of their lives . chap. iii. proving that baptism is dipping , plunging , and covering the body all over in water from the practice of the primitive times . certainly no better course or way in the next place we can take to find out what baptism is , than to examine the scripture , and see what the thing was which the saints practised in the primitive time , where we read they did baptize , or were baptized : for as the jews in circumcision all along were to practise that rite , as it was commanded , and practised by abraham ; and keep the passeover as it was given to them from the lord by moses , together with all other ordinances and services whatsoever , it behoved them to observe the first or primitive institution and practice of every particular duty , and were not to derogate from thence in any thing whatsoever ; and for their adulterating any of the ordinances of god , they brought themselves under the wrath of god , and many heavy judgments from him , as the old testament doth sufficiently witness ; so it behoveth us , i say , to see to the first or primary institution and practice of baptism in the gospel-time , that being a pattern or rule to us , and to all christians to the end of the world , in respect of every gospel-ordinance ; and if we derogate from that rule , we must expect to meet with sharp rebuke from the almighty first or last . now that that ordinance which is called baptism , is immersion , dipping , or plunging into water , will appear , if we observe the practice of john the baptist , who was the first that was sent by christ to baptize ; read mat. 3. 6. he 't is positively said baptized in a river , viz. in the river jordan . diodate on this place in his annotations , saith he plunged them in water ; and our late annotators say he dipp'd them in jordan . moreover 't is said that john was baptizing in aenon near salim ; the reason is given , because there was much water . now if it had not been dipping or covering the body in water , this could be no reason , for a little water would have served to sprinkle thousands , as cornelius à lapide notes . piscator on this passage saith , that baptism was dipping the body in water . also our late annotators * upon the place say thus , viz. it is from hence apparent , that both christ and john baptized by dipping the body in the water , else they need not have sought places where had been a great plenty of water . they say well , and less they could not speak unless they would stifle their consciences , or offer violence to their reason : but if they had from hence said , it is apparent that christ and john baptized , and not rantized persons , they had come off better , and had undeceived the people . secondly , 't is said when our blessed saviour was baptized by john in jordan , he went up straightway out of the water , &c. and philip and the eunuch 't is said went both down into the water , and that they came up out of the water . the assembly in their annotations on this text , say , they were wont to dip the whole body ; and piscator on the place ( as i find him quoted by a worthy divine ) saith , the ancient manner of baptism was that the whole body was dipp'd into the water . certainly it had been a vain and weak thing for them to have gone down into the river to be sprinkled with a little water . there is no ground to think they would ever have done so , if sprinkling or rantism had been the ordinance required of them , the manner was not to apply water to the subject , as some do , but the subject to ( nay into ) the water . in mark 1. 9. 't is said , jesus was baptized of john in jordan : now , saith one on this place , it had been non-sense for mark to say that jesus was baptized in jordan , if it had been sprinkling , because the greek reads it into jordan , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , could jesus be said to be sprinkled into jordan ? 't is proper to say he was baptiz'd , that is , dipp'd into jordan , and that was the act and nothing else , as all the learned acknowledg . moreover , philip needed not to have put that noble person , who was a man of great authority under candace queen of the ethiopians , to the trouble to come out of his chariot ( if sprinkling had been baptism ) and to go into the water and dip him ; or if sprinkling might have done as well as dipping , sure philp would on this occasion have dispensed with immersion , and let rantism have served , considering he was a great man and on a journey ; he might have fetch'd a little water in his hand and have sprinkled him in the chariot . but as philip had preach'd baptism to him , so there is like ground to think that the eunuch very well understood what it was , and readily submitted to it ; but if sprinkling would not excuse them , i know not how any christian can think it may excuse us in these days ; we have no reason to think christ jesus , or his apostles , did do or teach any thing in vain , yet so we must conclude , if he went into a river to receive no more than sprinkling ; and so we must think of philip and the eunuch also . but to proceed , here i cannot well omit that which mr. daniel rogers , a most worthy english writer , hath said in a treatise of his , it ought ( saith he ) to be the churches part to cleave to the institution , which is dipping , especially it being not left arbitrary by our church to the discretion of the minister ; but required to dip or dive : and further saith , that he betrays the church , whose officer he is , to a disorder'd error , if he cleave not to the institution , which is to dip. what abundance of betrayers of the truth and church too have we in these days ? how little is the institution or practice of the primitive christians minded amongst many good men ? and where is the spirit of reformation ? and doubtless that famous author , and learned critick casaubon was in the right ; will you have his words ; i doubt not , saith he , but , contrary to our churches intention , this error having once crept in , is maintained still by the carnal ease of such as , looking more at themselves than at god , stretch the liberty of the church in this case deeper and further than either the church her self would , or the solemness of this sacrament may well and safely admit . — afterwards further saith , i confess my self unconvinced by demonstration of scripture for infants sprinkling . but oh! how hard is it to retract an error which has been so long and generally received , especially when there is carnal ease and profit attending the keeping of it up , and when the contrary practice , i mean dipping , is look'd upon so contemptible a thing , and those who do it are daily , by the ignorance of foolish men , reproached and vilified , as it is now as well as in former days . acts. 8. 38. — and they went both down into the water , both philip and the eunuch , and he baptized him . we may see , saith calvin , what fashion the ancients had to administer baptism , for they plunged the whole body into the water : the use with us is now , saith he , that the minister casts a few drops of water only upon the body , o● upon the head. and upon john's baptizing in aenon near salim , joh. 3. 23. saith the same calvin , from this place we may gather that john and christ administred baptism by plunging the whole body into the water . the learned cajetan upon mat. 3. 5. saith , christ ascended out of the water ; therefore christ was baptized by john , not by sprinking or by pouring water upon him , but by immersion , that is , by dipping or plunging into the water . moreover , musculus on mat. 3. calls baptism dipping , and saith , the parties baptized were dipped , not sprinkled . object . but it is still objected , sprinkling is baptizing , say you what you will ; and baptism signifies sprinkling as well as dipping . answ . to this we always answer , and again say and testify , that the greek word to sprinkle , is , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , rantizo ; and that the translators themselves never so much as once , in all the new testament , render baptism , sprinkling ; and where is the man that affirms the word signifies sprinkling ? object . but the word baptizo will bear vvashing . answ . vve answer then , 't is such washing as is done by dipping ; so much as is baptized , or washed , is dip'd , and your rantism is no washing ; and we also say , and that too with good authority , that though the word baptizo doth sometimes allow of that acceptation , yet it is not the direct , immediate , genuine , and primary signification of it , for that is to dip , or plunge , as you see in the lexicons . but at the best 't is but indirectly , collaterally , by the by ( as one observes ) so meant , or improperly and remotely , that it so signifies : and we ask , whether when we try any matter by the signification of the word as 't is in the original , we shall go to the direct , original , prime , and proper , or to the occasional , remote , indirect and improper signification to be tried by ? your practice it seems is built only upon the indirect , improper and remote acceptation of the word , and therefore is at best only an uncouth , indirect , improper and far-fetch'd practice ; and indeed , as the word is found in scripture , respecting christ's ordinance of baptism , it is evident to all what it signifies . object . but the pharisees , mark 7. 4. held the washing of hands , vessels , cups , pots , and beds , &c. and there vvashings are called baptism . answ . yea , and what then , for , saith mr. wilson , to baptize , is to dip or plunge primarily , and signifies such a washing as is used in bucks wherein linnen is plunged and dip'd ; and thus they wash'd their vessels , hands , and cups , viz. they swilled , rinsed , cleansed , and totally washed , dip'd , or wetted them all over with vvater , or else you may be sure it could never be said they baptized them . but , sirs , who-ever washes hands , cups , pots , or beds , by sprinkling a few drops of vvater upon them ? there is no washing by such a kind of sprinkling . o that you would give over such arguing , since the practice of baptism in the primitive times doth , as you have heard , evidently shew that the baptized were always dipped all over in vvater ; certainly 't is no baptism at all , if not so administred . object . doth it follow that we must baptize so now ? that was in a hot country ; but we live in a cool climate , and when children were dipt , some of them died ; and god will have mercy , not sacrifice . answ . ought you not to make god's vvord your rule ? have you a dispensation to make the commandments of god void by your traditions ? vve conclude , the institution of christ and the practice of the primitive church , ought to be followed in all things as near as we can . but you say this is a cold climate : pray , sirs , did not christ , when he gave forth his commission to his apostles , to teach and make disciples , and baptize , bid them go into all the world , and into all nations ? vvere they not to go into cold countries as well as hot ? and , were they not to teach the same doctrine , and administer the same ordinances alike where-ever they come ? or , did he tell them they should baptize those in hot countries that were disciples , and rantize such who received the word in cold countries ? unless you can prove this , i am sure all you say is nothing . certainly you were as good never pretend to baptize , but wholly deny it , and cast it off as a low and carnal thing , as some do , as to do another thing in the room of it , which christ never commanded , and call it his ordinance ; which we do declare and testify , by the authority of god's vvord , and a great cloud of vvitnesses , who all understand the greek tongue , ( may be better than some of you do ) that 't is no baptism at all , but a thing of man's devising brought in , in the room of christ's baptism , and unjustly fathered upon him . sirs , how dare you , in the name of the father , son , and holy ghost , say , i baptize thee , &c. when you do but rantize the person ? for you neither dip the person , nor wash him . has the holy trinity given you any authority so to do ? for god's sake , for time to come , use the names of those persons by whose authority it was first set on foot and given forth , till you can shew you have authority from jesus christ to sprinkle , or pour a little vvater upon the face of a poor infant , or an adult person . nor is it any marvel , when they did dip poor children in vvater , that some of them died , sith they are not the true subjects of baptism ; if they had , no doubt god would have preserved them , as well as he did those babes whom once he required to be circumcised . can any believe god would command any such thing to be done , that should endanger the life of a child ? that was doubtless a just re●uke for the prophanation of christ's blessed ordinance ; he will one day , i fear , say , who hath required this at your hands ? nay , and who knows what judgments and vvrath may come upon this land for the abominable abuse of the sacred institution of baptism . god many times shews men their sin , by the punishment he brings upon them , if you are so fond of humane traditions and innovations . object . but why must the whole body be dipp'd ? may not the head be sufficient , that being the principal part ? answ . i must confess , in a late discourse i had with a minister of the church of england , he pleaded for this , seeing he could not defend rantism . but to give a direct answer , pray consider whether it be the person , ( viz. the man or woman ) or part of the person that christ commanded to be baptized ; if not the whole body , why might it not serve only to wash or dip the hands ? but if it were the hands only , or the feet , or the head only that was to be baptized , i. e. dipped , a small vessel of water would have served , and no need for christ or john to have gone into rivers and places where there was much vvater , to baptize . 2. it is not said , john baptized him , i. e. our blessed saviour , not part of him : but as the blessed virgin bore him in her vvomb , and brought him forth , and laid him in a manger ; so john baptized , or dipped him , that is , his whole body into jordan , or in the river jordan . moreover , 't is said , acts 8. 12. they were baptized , both men and women , ( that is , the bodies , the whole bodies of those men and women ) and not some part or members of them : if this be not granted , we shall be run into many strange absurdities almost every where in reading the scriptures . 3. to put this out of doubt , 't is evident the whole body ought to be dipp'd or baptiz'd , because ( as we shall shew in the next chapter ) baptism is a figure of the burial and resurrection of jesus christ , nay , called a burial . now a person is not said to be buried , that is not totally covered in the earth ; no more can a man be said to be baptiz'd , except he be covered all over in the vvater . 4. vve have shewed how all the learned agree , and positively assert , that baptism was administred in the primitive times , by a total dipping the body in vvater . and indeed at first , when this innovation of rantism came in , they used to sprinkle the body all over , being sure it was not one part , but the whole body that was to be baptized , and so they rantiz'd the whole body . but you are gone here too , for you in ( your practice , and in your own sense ) baptize but the face only ; so that all your people are unbaptized persons , as evident as any thing can be , take it how you will , if it should be granted . i mean , that sprinkling is baptism . chap. iv. proving that baptism is dipping , plunging , or burying the whole body in water , in the name , &c. from the spiritual or metaphorical signification of this gospel-ordinance or administration . to make it appear yet more fully , that baptism is not sprinkling , pouring , nor any other thing , than dipping , plunging , or covering of the body in vvater , we shall proceed to examine what it was ordained for by our lord jesus christ , to hold forth , or to be a sign or representation of ; for like as in the holy sacrament of the supper , it behoveth us to know , what the breaking of the bread , and pouring forth of the vvine signifies , or are figures of ; so in like manner we ought ( with as great care ) to endeavour to know what is held forth , or represented to us , as the holy signs of the blessed sacrament of baptism ; for as all true christians readily do confess and agree with us , that the ordinance of the lord's supper is not , cannot be rightly nor truly administred , if the great ends and design of jesus christ , in the institution of it , are not answered thereby , or ▪ what it was ordained and appointed to signify , plainly held forth and represented in its administration ; but it is contrarywise a great abuse and prophanation of it ; and from hence we , and all true protestants , always say , let us keep to the exact words of the institution , and manner of its first celebration , that so the great things signified , both by the breaking the bread , and pouring forth the vvine , may clearly appear , and be represented in the administration thereof . now then , this is that which we affirm , viz. that as the sacrament of the lord's supper was ordained to hold forth the breaking of christ's body , and the pouring forth of his blood ; so in like manner the sacrament of baptism was instituted and appointed , to hold forth christ was really dead , buried , and that he arose again for our justification . and that this is so , we shall not only prove it from the plain authority of god's vvord , but by the joint testimony of almost all famous vvriters and divines we have met with , ancient or modern . and indeed we cannot but be much affected with the great love and goodness of our blessed saviour in the institution of these two great ordinances , it being his gracious design and condescention , hereby to hold forth , or preach , as i may say , to the very sight of our visible eyes by these fit and proper mediums , the glorious doctrine of his death , burial , and resurrection , which in the ministration of the vvord , is preached or held forth to the hearing of our ears , that so we might the better and more effectually be established and grounded in the sure and stedfast belief thereof ; which is indeed absolutely necessary to salvation , as the apostle doth plainly testify , 1 cor. 15. 1. 2 , 3 , 4. moreover , brethren , i declare unto you the gospel which i preached unto you , which also you received , and wherein you stand , vers . 1. by which also you are saved , if you keep in memory what i preached unto you , unless ye have believed in vain , vers . 2. for i delivered unto you first of all , that which i also received , how christ died for our sins , according to the scripture , vers . 3. and that he was buried , and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures , vers . 4. this being so , let none blame us for contending so earnestly for this ordinance according to the primitive purity , or its original glory , wherein , according to the gracious design of jesus christ we daily receive , in beholding the administration of this sacrament , ( as well as in the lord's supper what is represented to us ) such a blessed establishment in the truth of the doctrine of christ's death , burial , and resurrection , as well as in many other respects , the profit and use appears to us , no ordinance being more significant , or ordained upon more weighty and glorious purposes and designs : for certainly , if we consider the grand errors and heresies of the present age , so boldly maintain'd amongst us , ( by those deceived people who cry up the light within to be the true christ ; or that the light or power in that person , called jesus of nazareth , distinct and apart from the body that was crucified , &c. is all the christ they own ) it will clearly convince us how gracious christ was to appoint this ordinance , besides the word to confirm us in the belief , that the true saviour was a man , and that he did die , and was buried , and rose again , which we see in a figure represented before our eyes , in the administration of this ordinance , and that this is signified in baptism , we shall now prove ; first , from the scripture . secondly , by the consent and agreement of a cloud of witnesses . 1. the first scripture is rom. 6. therefore we are buried with christ in baptism : he seems , say our late annotators , to allude to the manner of baptizing in those warm eastern countries , which was to dip or plung the party baptized , and as it were to bury him for a while under water . cajetan , upon this place , saith , we are buried with him by baptism into death . by our burying he declares our death by the ceremony of baptism : because he that is baptized is put under water , and by this carries a similitude of him that was buried , who was put under the earth now , because none are buried but dead men — from this very thing that we are buried in baptism , we are assimulated to christ buried , or when he was buried . the assemblies annotations on this place of scripture say likewise thus , i. e. in this phrase the apostle seemed to allude to the ancient manner of baptizing , which was to dip the party baptized , and as it were to bury them under water for a while , and then raise them up again out of it , to represent the burial of the old man and our resurrection to newness of life : the same saith diodat ? tilenus , a great protestant writer , speaks fully in this case ; baptism , saith he , is the first sacrament of the new testament , instituted by christ , in which there is an exact analogy between the sign and the thing signified ; the outward rite in baptism is threefold . 1. immersion into the water . 2. abiding under the water . 3. a resurrection out of the water . the form of baptism , viz. internal and essential , is no other than the analogical proportion which the signs keep with the things signified thereby ; for the properties of the water in washing away the defilements of the body , do in a most suitable similitude set forth the efficacy of christ's blood in blotting out of sins ; so dipping into the water doth in a most lively similitude set forth the mortification of the old man , and rising out of the water , the vivification of the new man : the same plunging into the water , saith he , holds forth to us that horrible gulf of divine justice , in which christ , for our sakes , was for a while in a manner swallowed up — abiding under the water ( how little time soever ) denotes his descent into hell * even the very deepest of lifelesness , which lying in the sealed or guarded sepulchre , he was accounted as one dead ; rising out of the water , holds forth to us a lively similitude of that conquest which this dead man got over death — in like manner , saith he , 't is therefore meet that we being baptized into his death and buried with him , should rise also with him , and so go on in a new life . — st. ambrose saith water is that wherein the body is plung'd to wash all sin away , there all sin is buried : we suppose he means 't is a sign of this , to shew that all sin is buried . many other of the ancient fathers speak to the same purpose , as is observed by the famous sir norton knatchbul in his learned notes printed at oxford , 1677. ( cited by dr. du viel ) the sense and meaning of peter ( saith he ) that baptism , which now saves us by water , that is , by the assistance of water , and is antitypical to the ark of noah , does not signifie the laying down the filth of the flesh in the water , but the covenant of a good conscience towards god , while we are plung'd in the water , which is the true use of water in baptism , thereby to testify our belief in the resurrection of jesus christ ; so that there is a manifest antithesis between these words by water , and by the resurrection ; nor is the elegancy of it displeasing . as if he should say , the ark of noah , not the flood , was a type of baptism , and baptism was an antitype of the ark , not as baptism is a washing away the filth of the flesh by water , wherein it answers not at all to the ark , but as it is the covenant of a good conscience towards god by the resurrection of chrst , in the belief of which resurrection we are saved , as they were saved by the ark of noah : for the ark and baptism were both a type and figure of the resurrection ; so that the proper end of baptism ought not to be understood as if it were a sign of the washing away of sin , altho it be thus oftentimes taken metonymically in the new testament , and by the fathers , but a particular signal of the resurrection by faith in the resurrection of christ , of which baptism is a lively and emphatical figure , as also was the ark out of which noah returned as from the sepulcher to a new life , and therefore not unaptly called by philo , the captain of the new creature : and the whales belly out of which jonas , after a burial of three days , was set at liberty : and the cloud and the red-sea in which the people of israel are said to have been baptized ; that is , not washed , but buried ; for they were all types of the same thing as baptism , viz. not the washing away of sin , but of the death and resurrection of christ , and our own ; to which the apostles , the fathers , the scholasticks , and all interpreters agree . the thing is so apparent as not to need any testimonies . but because there are not a few who do not vulgarly teach this doctrine , it will not be superfluous to produce some of these innumerable testimonies , that i may not seem to speak without book ; and first let us begin with st. paul , know ye not that so many of you that have been baptized into christ , were baptized into his death ? therefore we are buried with him in baptism into death , &c. else what shall they do that are baptized for the dead , if the dead rise not at all ? as if he had said , if there be no resurrection , why are we baptized ? in vain does the church use the symbol of baptism if there be no resurrection . the like testimonies frequently occur among the fathers — * that believing in his death we may be made partakers of his resurrection by baptism . baptism was given in memory of the death of our lord ; we perform the symbols of his death and resurrection in baptism . we know but one saving baptism , in regard there is but one death for the world , and one resurrection from the dead , of which baptism is an image . here paul exclaiming , they pass'd through the sea , and were all baptized in the cloud , and in the sea † ; he calls baptism the passage of the sea ; for it was a flight of death caused by the water . to be baptized , and so plunged , and to return up , and rise out of the water , is a symbol of the descent into the grave , and return from thence . baptism is a pledg and representation of the resurrection ‖ ; baptism is an earnest of the resurrection ; immersion is a representation of death and burial . innumerable are the testimonies which might be added . but these i think sufficient to prove that baptism is an image of the death and resurrection of christ , ( from hence we acknowledg the mystery of our religion , his deity and humanity ) and of all the faithful who are baptized in his faith , from death to sin , to newness of life , which if they lead in this world , they have a most assured hope , that being dead they shall hereafter rise to glory with christ : — which things if so , what affinity is to be seen between a burial and a washing , that christian baptism should be thought to draw its original from jewish lotions ? for if it were true that the end of our baptism were to signify a washing , or ablution ; or if it were true , that the jews of old did admit their children or proselytes into their church , by the administration of any diving , as it is asserted by many learned persons of late days ; yet to prove that our baptism is indeed an image of death , and resurrection , not of washing , enough hath been said . thus far sir norton knatchbul . and indeed , what this great man hath asserted , and clearly demonstrated , doth fully detect our brethren , who argue for their childish rantism , affirming , though dipping was the baptism that was practised in the primitive time ; yet it doth not from thence follow , that dipping is essential to baptism ; they are the words of our late annotators on mat. 3. 6. the reason they give is , because , the washing of the soul with the blood of christ , the thing , say they , signified by baptism , being expressed by sprinkling , or pouring water , as well as by dipping , or being buried in water . in answer , we say with st. bernard , viz. immersion is a representation of death and burial . but saith the famous dr. du-veil , to substitute in the room of immersion , either sprinkling , or any other way of applying water to the body to signify the same thing , is not in the power of the dispensers of god's mysteries , or of the church , for that , ( saith he ) as thomas aquinas excellently well observes , it belongs to the signifier to determine what sign is to be used for the signification ; but god it is , who by things sensible , signifies spiritual things in the sacrament . to which let me add , shall frail and silly man seek out , or contrive new rites , or signs , having other significations than ever the great lawgiver appointed or intended , and call them by his name , viz. ordinances or sacraments of christ ? will god , i say , ever , think you , suffer any man , to invent , out of his own brains , new signs or symbols of divine gospel-mysteries , and father them upon him ? what ordinance hath he ordained to signify the sprinkling of the blood of christ ? this cannot cer●ainly stand with his care , wisdom , and faithfulness ; you may as well , no doubt , and be as far justified , to contrive some other proper and fit signs or figures of other gospel-mysteries , and call them sacraments of christ , as to change his holy institution of immersion , or dipping , designed and ordained by him , chiefly as it most clearly appears to represent his death , burial , and resurrection into sprinkling , or pouring , and make it represent washing in , or sprinkling with the blood of christ , and then say , and not blush , it may serve as well . object . but do you not acknowledg baptism to signify our being washed in the blood of christ ? answ . in answer to this , we do say , in a more remote sense , baptism doth hold forth our being washed or bathed in christ's blood , which we doubt not but is signified in that of titus 3. 5. by the washing of regeneration ; and in heb. 10. 22. yet certainly sir norton knatchbul is in the right , the proper end of baptism , saith he , ought not to be understood , as if it were a sign of the washing away of sin , although it be often-times taken thus metonymically in the new testament . this therefore , we say , washing is not at all the main or principal thing , or such as is immediately , or primarily , but only remotely , and secondarily signified thereby . but the death , burial , and resurrection of christ , which is the rise and root , the original and meritorious cause of all the good we partake of , is the principal thing signified hereby . but what advantage is it to you that are only for rantism , for us to own washing is signified by baptism , sith sprinkling can , as you use it , in no proper manner represent washing ? but suppose it did answer in that , yet it cannot be baptism , because it cannot , nor does it in any respect represent the death , burial , and resurrection of christ ; nor our death to sin , and rising again in a figure , to walk in newness of life ; which baptism we have shewed was appointed to do , and therefore can be no other but immersion , dipping and plunging , or covering the body in water , which doth resemble , and most lively hold forth the things signified thereby to our sight . yea these matters , viz. christ's death , burial , and resurrection , are the cardinal or great things to be considered ; for as in the lord's supper remotely many things may be signified to us , yet all the things cannot plainly be represented to our eyes ; but such things that are the more immediate significations of it are the proper cause of all the rest , viz. christ crucified , and our feeding on him by faith , or the breaking of his body , and the pouring forth of his blood , are most lively set forth and represented to our visible sight : so in baptism likewise , the main and more immediate significations , which are the death , burial , and resurrection of our blessed saviour , with our death unto sin , and vivification to a new life , is clearly resembled , though the fruit of his death , and remission of sin , and purging , &c. are consequently gathered from it also . calvin saith , baptismum esse sepulturam , in quum nulli msi jam mortui mortuo tradendi sunt ; i. e. that baptism is a form or way of burial , and none but such as are already dead to sin , or have repented from dead works , are to be buried . also learned zanchy , i find , writes thus on col. 2. 12. of regeneration , saith he , there are two parts , mortification and vivification , that is called a burial with christ , this a resurrection with christ ; the sacrament of both these , saith he , is baptism , in which we are overwhelmed or buried , and after that do come forth and rise again : it may not be said truly , but sacramentally , of all that are baptized , that they are buried with christ , and raised with him , but only of such as have true faith. now we may appeal to all the world , whether zanchy doth not clearly and evidently testify the same thing which we assert , viz. that baptism is and can be no other than immersion , or dipping , sith sprinkling , all must confess , doth not represent , in a lively figure , the burial and resurrection of christ , nor our dying , or being dead to sin , and vivification to newness of life , saith he , sacramentally , i. e. analogically ; and in respect of the near resemblance , yet truly to be buried with , and raised with christ . this , we say , cannot be said of them that are sprinkled only ; for if in respect of mortification , and vivification , they may be denominated , buried , and raised with christ , yet that outward rite and ceremony cannot of it self denominate them so much as sacramentally buried and raised with christ , for there is not so much as any likeness of such things in it . but in true baptism , viz total dipping the body in water , and raising it again , it is in a lively figure held forth to our sight . moreover chrysostom saith that the old man is buried and drowned in the immersion under water ; and when the baptized person is afterwards raised up from the water , it represents the resurrection of the new man to newness of life , and therefore concludes ( saith my author ) that the contrary custom , being not only against ecclesiastical law , but against the analogy and mystical signification of the sacrament , it is not to be complied with . it has been too long , god grant men light to see their error , and do so no more . also dr. cave saith that the party baptized was wholly immerged , or put under the water , which was the almost constant and universal custom of those times , whereby they did most notably and significantly express the great ends and effects of baptism ; for , as in immerging there are in a manner three several acts , the putting the person into the water , his abiding under the water , and his rising up again , thereby representing christ's death , burial , and resurrection ; and in our conformity thereunto , our dying to sin , the destruction of its power , and our resurrection to a new course of life . by the person 's being put into the water , was lively represented the putting off the body of the sins of the flesh , &c. by his being under it , which is a kind of burial into water , his entring into a state of death , or mortification , like as christ remained for some time under the state or power of death ; therefore it is said , as many as are baptized into christ , are baptized into his death , &c. and then , by his emersion , or rising up out of the water , is signified his entring upon the new course of life ; that like as christ was raised by the glory of the father , so we should wal● in newness of life . we are said ( saith paraeus ) to die , and to be buried with christ in baptism — and further shews , that the external act of being buried in water in baptism , is a lively emblem of the internal work of regeneration . this , saith augustin , speaking of these things , is by a sacramental metonimy , and the meaning of it is , not that one thing is changed really into another , but because the sign doth so lively resemble the thing signified . thus all men may see how the learned agree with us , that these scriptures do hold forth baptism to be a lively resemblance of christ's death , burial and resurrection , and not of the spiritual things signified only , viz. our mortification of sin , and rising to holiness in a way of likeness to christ's death and resurrection , but also the outward rite or form of administration of the sign it self — to be done in a way of likeness or lively resemblance to them both ; so that either our brethren and other pedo-baptists must deny the apostle speaks here at all of the ordinance of baptism , or else confess they have no baptism ; i mean none of christ's sacrament of baptism , their 's not answering nor representing any such things that baptism was appointed to do , and still does among those christians and churches who have it according to the primitive institution restored to them , and practised by them . we are , saith mr. leigh [ buried with him in baptism unto death : ] baptism , saith he , is an instrument not only of thy death with christ , which is the killing of sin , but also of thy burial with him , &c. he alludes to the manner in which baptism was then administred , which was to plunge them in water ; the plunging of them into water which were baptized , was a sign of their death and burial with christ . dr. jer. taylor , late bishop of down , in his plea for the baptists saith , this indeed is truly to be baptized , when it is both in the symbol and in the mystery ; whatsoever is less than this , is but the symbol only , a meer ceremony , an opus operatum , a dead letter , an empty shadow , an instrument without an agent to manage , or force to actuate it . chap. v. proving baptism to be immerging or dipping , from those typical and metaphorical baptisms spoken of in scripture . that we might remove every stumbling-block out of the way , if possible , we shall shew you what those metaphorical baptisms spoken of in the scripture do hold forth . 1. we read of the baptism of afflictions or sufferings , mat. 20. 22 , 23. mark 10. 38. luk. 12. 50. i have a baptism to be baptized with , and how am i straitned till it be accomplished ! from the literal signification of the word baptizo , viz. drown , immerge , plunge under , overwhelm , great afflictions come to be called baptism , and signifies , as vo●lius shews , not every light affliction , but that which is vehement and overwhelming , as there are waves of persecution and tribulation mention'd in scripture ; so such as are drown'd and overwhelm'd by them may seem in a mystical way to be baptized ; the reason of the metaphor is taken from many deep waters to which calamities are compared ; he drew me out of great waters , saith david , psal. 32. 6. i am come into deep waters where the floods overflow me , psal. 69. 1 , 2. and hence great afflictions are called waves , or compared to the waves of the sea that overflow , t●y waves and thy billows are gone over me , psal. 42. 7. christ spake of his suffering , who was as it were drowned , or drenched , or overwhelmed in misery , no part free : every suffering is not the baptism of suffering , but great and deep afflictions , suffering unto blood and death , in opposition to a lesser degree or measure of them , being dipp'd and plunged into afflictions . mr. wilson on the baptism of affliction renders it to plunge into afflictions or dangers as it were , saith he , into deep waters ; so that it appears also from this metaphorical notion of baptism , to baptize is to dip , or overwhelm , or cover the body in water . see what our last and best annotators positively affirm on matth. 20. 22. to be baptized , is to be dipped in water , say they , metaphorically ; to be plunged in a●flictions . i am , saith christ , to be baptized with blood , overwhelmed with sufferings and afflictions ; are you able so to be ? &c. 2. we read of the baptism of the holy ghost and fire : i indeed baptize you with water , saith john , but he shall baptize you with the holy spirit and with fire . now the question is , what we are to understand to be meant by the baptism of the holy ghost ? whether the sanctifying gifts and graces of the spirit are intended hereby , which all the godly receive ? or those extraordinary gifts or miraculous effusions of the holy ghost only , which many received in the primitive times ? i know some are ready to make use of the baptism of the spirit to justify their rite of sprinkling or pouring , because god is said to pour the spirit upon his people , and to sprinkle them with clean water , which we do grant does intend the graces of the holy spirit . but certainly if they did consider the ground and reason why persons were said to be baptized with the spirit , they would soon perceive this argument would utterly fail them likewise , or stand them in no stead . for we do affirm that every believer who hath the holy spirit , cannot be said to be baptized with the spirit ; like as every one that is under afflictions and sufferings , cannot be said to be baptized with sufferings , as we have shewed . but in the first place , it is necessary to understand the difference between the baptism commanded and the baptism promised ; the baptism commanded is that of water , the baptism promised was that of the spirit . our saviour after his resurrection gave forth his commission to his disciples , to teach and baptize , and then being assembled together with them , commanded them that they should not depart from jerusalem , but wait fo● the promise of the father , which , said he , ye ha●● heard of me , acts 1. 4. what was that ? why 't is exprest in the fifth verse , ye shall be baptiz'd with the holy ghost not many days hence ; and this was made good to them on the day of pentecost , acts 2. 1 , 2 3. which was no other than the spirit in an extraordinary manner , or the miraculous gifts thereof ; these the apostles and believing jews received first , and in the tenth chapter of the acts the same extraordinary gifts , or baptism of the spirit , the believing gentiles received , i mean cornelius , and those with him , for they spoke with tongues and magnified god : and peter saith , chap. 11. and as i spake unto them , the holy ghost fell on them , as on us at the first ; then , saith he , i remembred the word , &c. ye shall be baptized with the holy ghost , ver . 15 , 16. now no other gifts of the spirit than these great , and extraordinary , and miraculous effusions of the spirit we do conclude is or can be intended or meant by the baptism of the holy ghost . and that you may see we are not alone in this opinion , see what dr. du veil saith on acts 1. 4 , 5. shall be baptized , the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , says casaubon , is to dip or plunge , as if it were to dye colours ; in which sense , saith he , the apostles might be truly said to have been baptized ; for the house in which this was done was filled with the holy ghost ; so that the apostles might seem to have been plunged into it , as in a large fish-pond . hence oecumenius on acts 2. saith , a wind fill'd the whole house , that it seem'd like a fish-pond , because it was promised to the apostles , that they should be baptized with the holy ghost . to the same effect , saith another , as is noted in our book of metaphors , baptism is put for the miraculous effusion of the holy spirit upon the apostles , and other believers in the primitive church , because of the analogical immersion or dipping , for so baptizo signifies ; for the house where the holy spirit came upon the apostles was so filled that they were ( as it were ) drowned in it ; or the reason of the metaphor saith he may be from the great plenty and abundance of those gifts in which they were wholly immerg'd , as the baptized are dipp'd under water . and it appears by what mr. del●un hath written and translated out of tropical writers , that glassius and others assert the same things . and so likewise mr. gosnold , a worthy and learned man , understood it , speaking of those scriptures ; we have here cited , saith he , these places diligently compared together , evidently shew that the baptism of the spirit is a distinct baptism from that of water , and hath no reference at all to the inward sanctifying graces of the spirit ; but notes out the most extraordinary gifts of the spirit that ever were given to the sons of men , therefore called the baptism of the spirit . object . but yet this baptism however was by a pouring forth of the spirit , and why may not baptism be administred so ? answ . 't is evident 't was not by a sprinkling or dropping of the spirit , and therefore no ways for your turn ; and though it was by a pouring out , or a pouring forth of the spirit , yet in such sort that the house in which they were is said to be filled , and so they immerg'd or baptized with it : but however , all confess this was but a metaphorical baptism , and therefore your argument from hence at best is but far fetched , and signifies nothing , for 't is a strange way to go to the metaphorical notion of a word to prove a practice that is contrary to the literal and proper signification thereof . moreover , if this be granted which we have hinted here , it may serve to detect the error of some men who own no other baptism than that of the spirit , and think that the ordinary gifts and graces of the spirit is the baptism of the spirit , which there is no ground , as i can see , to believe ; nor was there any other baptism to continue to the end of the world , but that of water without doubt , sith the baptism of the holy spirit was given only to the apostles and saints in the primitive time for the confirmation of the gosp●l , as these scriptures shew , mark 16. 16 , 17 , 18 , 20. heb. 2. 3 , 4. therefore let such take care who say they have the true baptism , and are baptized with the spirit , left they are found liars , and to be indeed without any baptism at all ; for though the saints before that great effusion of the spirit , nay before christ was manifested in the flesh , had the holy spirit , and some of them in a glorious manner ; yet , as some learned men observe , they were not said to be baptized with it : so likewise believers in these days have the spirit of christ in the ordinary gifts and graces thereof , yea and the promise of christ is , that the blessed spirit the comforter shall abide with us for ever , yet are not we , nor any now baptized with it , nor have any ( as i humbly conceive ) since those miraculous and extraordinary gifts ceased in the church . thirdly , there is another typical or metaphorical baptism spoken of , viz. the children of israel , or the fathers are said to be baptized to moses in the cloud , and in the sea , 1 cor. 10. some have of late intimated , that the rain that fell from the cloud , sprinkled them as they past through the sea , and from hence would have baptism to be sprinkling : truly , if that was a baptism , viz. it raining upon them , the people may save their mony , and never go to priest ●or minister more to christen their children , for 't is but to carry them abroad when it rains , and they will be so baptized ; and it will be as true a baptism , no doubt : for the using the name of the father , &c. doth not make baptism , though true baptism cann't be warrantably administred without mentioning the names of the sacred trinity . but we must conclude , there was something else than that which these men suppose in that case , which caused the apostle to say , our fathers were baptized unto moses , in the cloud , and in the sea. it was doubtless a type and plain figure of gospel-dipping , or burying in water ; for they were overwhelmed , 't is evident , as it were , in the cloud , and in the sea. and we must give our late annotators their due at this turn also , for they speak much the sense of the spirit of god in that place ; pray take their own words , after they have given the sense of divers learned men upon the text ; this they fix upon us to be most probably the meaning of the scripture ; others , say they , most probably think , that the apostle maketh use of this term , in regard of the great analogy betwixt baptism , ( as it was then used ) the persons going down into the waters , being dipped in them ; and the israelites going down into the sea , the great receptacle of water , though the waters at that time were gathered on heaps on either side of them ; yet they seemed buried in the waters , as persons in that age were when they were baptized . — a very plain figure doubtless , they having the water on each side of them ; and to which they might have added , the watery cloud over them , whether it broke down upon them or no , they were , as it were , buried in the cloud and in the sea ; so that this notion of typical baptism makes nothing for sprinkling . and thus we hope we have fully evinced , and clearly proved , to all unbyass'd men , what baptism is you have heard . first , it is immerging , or dipping into the water , from the proper , literal , and genuine signification of the word baptizo . secondly , from the manner of baptizing in the primitive times . thirdly , from the spiritual signification of the holy ordinances of baptism , together with the great design and end of christ in the institution of it . fourthly and lastly , from the typical and metaphorical baptisms we read of in the scriptures . we shall now proceed to speak of the persons who are the true subjects of baptism in the next place . chap. vi. proving believers , or adult persons , only to be the subjects of baptism , from christ's great commission , mat. 28. we having clearly evinced and proved what baptism is , and that rantism is not the ordinance , 't is clearly another act ; nor is baptism any other thing than immerging , dipping , or plunging the body all over in water : and this being so , we may from the whole infer , that all those who have been only sprinkled , whether as children , or adult , are all unbaptized persons , and will certainly be so found in the day of the lord ; let their teachers affirm or say what they will for their calling it baptism , does not make it to be so : for suppose the jews , or the off-spring of abraham , to whom god commanded circumcision , instead of doing that act , should have devised some other thing in the room of it , as the pairing off the nails of their children at eight days old , and have given that act the name of circumcision , would that have made it circumcision ? and truly , they might have as good a plea , no doubt , for such an invention , considering how dangerous and grievous a thing circumcision was to little children , as the first inventers of sprinkling a little water on the face of a babe could pretend unto , in changing baptism into rantism . now , in the next place it behoveth us to enquire , who or what kind of persons they are , that our lord jesus christ hath required to be baptized ; and there is no better way certainly to know this , than to go to the great commission , matth. 28 19 , 10. all power , saith christ , is given to me in heaven and earth . go ye therefore , teach all nations , baptizing them , &c. 1. first observe , that this commission was given forth by christ , just as he came out of the grave , or rose from the dead . certainly what he said at other times , should with all care be minded , he being the son of god ; but much more now at this time . if god should have sent a saint from the dead , to let us know what we should do , would we not give all diligent heed to him ? but much more to jesus christ . 2. in the second place , especially considering the power and authority he testifies the father had given to him as mediator , viz. to be head and chief governour of his church ; or king and lawgiver in all spiritual things and matters over the souls and consciences of men , all power to dispose of all things in heaven and earth , or power over men and angels , i. e. power to make and give forth laws , statutes , and ordinances , how , and after what manner god ought by us to be worshipped in gospel-days , a power that is given to him alone , whose laws and appointments none have any power to dispense with , nor change or alter the administration of to the end of the world ; go ye therefore , teach all nations , baptizing them , &c. 3. observe what is antecedent to baptism , teach all nations ; there must be teaching , they must be first taught , or made disciples , for the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , as is well known and confess'd by all , doth signify , to discipulize , or make disciples , and next baptize them . and this also we find was his own practice , first to make disciples , and then to baptize them ; john 4. 1 , 2. jesus ( 't is said there ) made and baptized more disciples than john ; it is not rantize them , and then teach or make disciples of them , as the manner of some now-adays is , and for a long time has been . lord , that ever men should be so bold and presumptuous , as once to attempt to alter or change any thing of this holy or great commission , or adventure to do things contrary to what is given forth here by jesus christ , as king and law-giver of the new testament . what will they say when god rises up ? what will they answer him when he visiteth them ? job 31. 14. 4. note the extent of the commission here given by christ to his disciples , go teach all nations , baptizing them , go into all nations ; or , as mark has it , into all the world , east as well as west , north as well as south , into cold countries as well as hot , and make disciples where-ever you come , and baptize them , &c. not rantize them ; not dip them in hot climates , and sprinkle them in cold. 5. observe in whose name they are required to baptize , viz. in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy ghost ; into the name , so the greek : in the name doth not only import the naming of the names of the father , son , and holy spirit , but in the authority , and into the profession of the blessed trinity , of the one divine being , dedicating the persons baptized ( saith our annotators ) to god the father , son , and holy ghost . but how dare any presume to rantize a babe that is uncapable to be taught or made a disciple by teaching ? in the name of the glorious trinity , can they say and prove it , christ hath given them any such authority ? i am sure they have no warrant nor authority so to do , from this blessed commission of jesus christ — it was by dipping of adult persons then — but it was in an hot country , say our late annotators , where at any time , without the danger of persons lives , it might be so done . doth not our blessed saviour's words immediately following fully answer this objection , and , lo i am with you always to the end of the world ? has not christ power to preserve , protect , and uphold all such persons which he commands to be baptized ? nay , can we think christ would institute an ordinance to destroy the lives of any persons ? besides , we know he has preserved thousands in this cold climate ; nay , and never did i hear of any one person that received the least hurt or damage by being baptized according to the commission of christ ; though some have gone into the water in the time of the great frost , and at other times of bitter frost and snow ; nay , and persons very aged , and of both sexes , and some that have been very weak and sickly — though our adversaries have falsly reported to the contrary . but can they be so 〈◊〉 left to themselves , to think this will be a good 〈◊〉 for them , for changing this ordinance of jesus christ , when he comes to call all men to an account ? certainly they will find themselves deceived . but say our late annotators , where it might be , we judg it reasonable , and most resembling our burial with christ , by baptism into death , but we can't think it necessary , for god loveth mercy rather than sacrifice . answ . sirs , wherefore do you judg it reasonable , and not necessary ? is it not necessary for you to do what christ hath commanded , and when at no time there is any danger of the lives of persons ? if you will follow your master's command , and only baptize such who are made disciples , viz. believing men and women ; is it not necessary for you to do christ's work , as christ has required ? is it necessary you should alter any of his holy laws , and make void one of the great sacraments of the new testament by your traditions ? i pray , my dear brethren , consider more seriously of it . from hence it is evident , that those who ought to be baptized , are disciples , and none else ; and that a disciple is one that is a believer , one that is taught , or has learned of christ ; the disciples were first called christians in antioch , acts 11. 26. not only , say our annotators , as scholars were called amongst the greeks from their masters , viz. platonists , pythagor●ans , to teach us whom we profess to learn of , and be instructed by , but to mind us of our unction , for christians are anointed ones , 1 john 2. 2● . such disciples are the true subjects of baptism . yea , christ ( saith mr. baxter ) in his commission , directeth his apostles to make disciples , and then baptize them , promising , that he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved . and in another book of his , speaking of the same commission , this , saith he , is not like some occasional mention of baptism , but is the very commission it self of christ to his disciples , for preaching and baptizing , and purposely expresseth their several works , in their several places and order . their first task is , to make disciples , saith he , which are by mark called believers . the second work is , to baptize them ; whereto is annexed the promise of salvation . the third work is , to teach them all other things , which are after to be learned in the school of christ . to contemn this order , ( saith he ) is to contemn all rules of order : for where can we expect to find it , if not here ? i profess my conscience is fully satisfied from this text , that there is one sort of faith even saving , that must go before baptism , the profession whereof the minister must expect : what can any baptist say more ? let mr. baxter tell us what difference there is between contemning that order christ hath left in his great commission , and a direct derogating from it , or acting quite contrary to it : and is not this so , viz to rantize or sprinkle , instead of baptize and sprinkle first , before they are taught or made disciples ? nay , and such too , who are not capable to be taught or made disciples of : is no● this to flight , is not to contemn christ's order in his commission ? for sith christ appoints such , that by teaching are made disciples to be baptized , he excludes all other the institution of christ in this his commission , being doubtless a perfect rule ; and those who do otherwise , follow their own inventions . i find mr. danvers cites mr. perkins , ( i have not that book of mr. perkins ) speaking to this purpose , on the words of the commission , teach all nations , baptizing them , &c. i explain these terms , saith he , thus : mark , first of all it is said , teach ; that is , make disciples , by calling them to believe and repent . here we are to consider the order which god observes in making with men a covenant in baptism . first of all he calls them by his word , and commands to believe , and to repent . in the second place , god makes his promise of mercy and forgiveness . and , thirdly , he seals his promise by baptism . — they , saith he , that know not , nor consider this order which god used in covenanting with them in baptism , deal preposterously , over-slipping the commandment of repenting and believing . it appears to me as if god will sometimes make men speak the truth whether they will or no , and confirm his own blessed order , though they contradict their own practice thereby . paraeus ( the same person saith ) upon mat. 3. 5. shews , that the order was , that confession as a testimony of true repentance go first , and then baptism for remission of sins afterwards . what commission our brethren have got , who sprinkle children , i know not , let them fetch a thousand consequences , and unwarrantable suppositions for their practice , it signifies nothing , if christ has given them no authority or rule to do what they do in his name . natural con●sequences from scripture we allow , but such which flow not naturally from any scripture we deny ; can any think christ would leave one of the great sacraments of the new testament , not to be proved without consequences . for i am sure there is no baptism to be administred before the profession of faith in the commission , nor no where else in christ's new testament ; and that faith is required in the second place as pre-requisite unto baptism , is very plain from mark 16. 16. they must be believers , none are fit subjects of baptism , but they that believe , and are capable to believe ; he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved , &c. not he that is baptized , and then believes . take heed you do not invert christ's order ; and if there is no baptism to be found in the new testament to be practised before faith , much less sprinkling or rantism is there required . chap. vii . proving believers to be the only true subjects of baptism , from the apostles doctrine , and the practice of the primitive churches . we read that the apostles , according to the commission christ gave them , preach'd the gospel of the kingdom , having received the spirit from on high , and began at jerusalem as he had commanded them , and so endeavoured to make men and women disciples , i. e. bringing them to the sense and sight of their sins , and knowledg of their lost and miserable condition by nat●●e , as being unconverted and without christ ; and in acts 2. where peter preached the first sermon that was preached after the ascension of the lord jesus , and when they heard this ( the text saith ) they were pricked in their hearts , and sai● unto peter and the rest of the apostles , men and brethren , what shall we do ? then said peter , repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of jesus christ , for the remission of sins , and ye shall receive the gift of the holy ghost , &c. and then they that gladly received the word , were baptized ; and the same day there was added to them about three thousand souls . pray observe the footsteps of this flock , i mean the manner of the constitution of this church , it being the first church that was planted in the gospel-days , it was the church at jerusalem , and indeed the mother-church ; for evident it is , all other gospel-churches sprang at first from this , and hence some conceive the apostle calls this church jerusalem above , * , being the mother of us all , said to be above , not only because she was in her constitution from heaven , or by divine and evangelical institution , but also might be said to be above in respect of dignity or priviledg , being first constituted , and having the first fruits of the extraordinary gifts of the spirit poured out upon them ; and besides , having all the great apostles at first as members with her ; and hence 't is that all other churches were to follow the church of god that was in judea , and were commended in so doing , and certainly 't is the duty of all churches so to walk unto the end of the world. but to proceed , acts 8. we find philip , being by the providence of god cast into samaria , he preaches jesus christ to them , and when they believed philip , preaching the things concerning the kingdom of god , and the name of jesus christ , they were baptized both men and women : not till they were disciples , and did believe , were any baptized : [ men and women , ] not children , not them and their little babes ; if philip had so done , he had acted contrary to his master's commission . in the same chapter we find he preached christ to the eunuch also , and they came to a certain water ; and the eunuch said , see , here is water , what doth hinder me to be baptized ? ver . 37. and philip said , if thou believest with all thine heart , thou mayst . and the eunuch answered , and said , i believe that jesus christ is the son of god : and they both went down into the water , both philip and the eunuch , and he baptized him . there must be faith or no baptism , thou mayst or thou oughtest , 't is lawful , or according to christ's law , i. e. his commission . a verbal profession is not sufficient , say our late annotators on this place . philip in god's name requires a faith as with all the heart , and not such as simon magus had , who is said to believe , and be baptized , vers . 13. this was ( say they ) the only thing necessary , either then or now if rightly understood . how was it known , saith mr. baxter , but by their profession , that the samaritans believed philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of god , and the name of jesus christ , before they were baptized both men and wome ▪ and , saith ●he , philip caused the eunuch to profess before he would baptize him , that he believed that jesus christ was the son of god. moreover , in the tenth of the acts we find cornelius and those with him were first made disciples by peter's preaching , and the spirit 's powerful operation , and then were baptized ; who can forbid water ( saith he ) that thest should not be baptized , who have received the holy ghost as well as me ? and he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the lord jesus ; that is , by the authority of christ according to the commission . so in acts 16. when the poor trembling jaylor was made a disciple , i. e. did believe with his whole house on the lord jesus christ , he was with his whole house baptized ; so lydia believed and was baptized , acts 16. 14. the like in acts 18. crispus believing on the lord , and many of the corinthians hearing , believed , and were baptized . the chief ruler believed with all his house and were baptized , he believed , his house believed , the jaylor believed , all runs in their believing , all must by believing be made disciples , or not be baptized . luther saith that in times past , the sacrament of baptism was administred to none except it were to those that acknowledged and confessed their faith , and knew how to rehearse the same , and why are they now ? see mr. baxter in his sixteenth argument against mr. blake , if there can be no example given in scripture of any one that was baptized without the profession of a saving faith or any precept for so doing , then must we not baptize any without . but , saith he , the antecedent is true , therefore so is the consequent . 1. i have , saith he , shewed you , john required the profession of true repentance , and that his baptism was for remission of sins . 2. when christ layeth down the apostolical commission , the nature and order of the apostles work , it is first ●o make them disciples , and then to baptize them in the name , &c. that it was saving faith that was required of the jews and profest by them , acts 2. 38. is plain in the text. the samaritans believed , and had great joy , and were baptized , &c. the condition upon which ( saith he ) the eunuch must be baptized was , if he believed with all his heart . paul was baptized after conversion , acts 9. 18. the holy ghost fell on the gentiles before they were baptized , acts 10. 44. lydia's heart was opened before she was baptized , and was one the apostle judged faithful , acts 16. 14. so he goes over with all the scriptures we have mentioned , proving they were believers , and none else , that all along in the new testament were baptized ; 't is strange to me that the man should have such clear light and plead for the commission , and the practice of the primitive christians , and yet dare attempt to sprinkle children , having neither a command from christ , or a precedent from the apostles for any such thing . object . i know 't is objected baptism was administred only to believers in the apostles time , but that was the infancy of the church . answ . i am not a little troubled to hear any man to argue after this manner ; for though it be granted in the apostles days the church was newly constituted , and so might be said to be new born ; yet to say that was the infancy of the church , ( as infancy imports in our common acceptation , weakness or imperfection ) is a false and foolish assertion . 1. because that was in truth the time of the churches greatest glory , perfection and beauty , and very soon after the apostles fell asleep , the church , though she grew older , yet she decayed , and corruptions crept in ; the church might in that respect be compared to a glorious flower , that as soon as ever it is blown and quite put forth it is in its glory , and let it stand a while and it soon fades , and loses much of its lustre and beauty ; even so did the church of god : and it was foretold also by the apostles , it would so after their departure come to pass , by the entring in of grievous wolves who should not spare the flock , i. e. the church ; nay , the spirit of antichrist , ( paul saith , ) or mystery of iniquity , did even then work in the apostles days . and st. john speaks to the same purpose , little children , it is the last time : and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come , even now are there many antichrists , whereby we know that this is the last time : and indeed all generally believe the church continued not a pure virgin to christ much longer than one hundred years after his death ; now then shall any presume to say that was the infancy of the church , as if the church arrived to clearer light , strength , and glory in after-times . but , 2. had not the gospel-church in that age the extraordinary apostles with it , like to whom never any rose after to succeed them ; nay such who were conversant with the lord jesus after he rose from the dead , and spake to him mouth to mouth , and did eat and drink with them ? as peter saith , acts 10. 3. had not the church then extraordinary gifts , nay , such an infallible spirit and presence of christ with her , that her sons could clearly discern spirits , and know when they speak , and when the spirit spake in them ? now speak i , not the lord. 4. was not that church set up to be a patern , or perfect copy , after which all succeeding churches were to write ? can we think that others ever attained to the like , much less to greater light and knowledg than they ? these things considered , fully shew the folly and weakness of this assertion and objection . but if believers were the only subjects of baptism in the primitive time , and this was according to the commission of christ and practice of those days , how came this order and administration to be altered and changed , i mean by whose authority ? nay , and which is worst of all , if that infant-baptism may be deem'd to be a divine rite , or an ordinance of god , sith 't is not recorded in the scripture , nor practised in the apostles time , it renders not only the gospel-church weak and imperfect , but christ himself unfaithful , or less faithful than moses , who was but the servant , and yet lest nothing dark or unwritten which god commanded him , but did do every thing exactly according to the patern shewed him in the moun● . nay , and by the same argument ( since infant-baptism was not instituted by christ , no● practised in the primitive church ) and yet may be admitted as a divine ordinance of christ , and so practised by christians ▪ why may not all , or many other rites and sacraments owned and maintained in the romish church , be admitted also ? but , object . i have heard some say , is it my where forbid ? answ . to which i answer , where are such things as crossings , salt , spittle , and sureties , &c. forbid ? at this door what inventions and innovations may not come in , or be admitted , of such a dangerous consequence is this , that it would undo us all ! object . but say you at that time , i. e. at the first preaching the gospel and planting churches , adult persons were baptized only because they were before they believed either jews or heathens ; but when they believed and were baptized , their children had a right to baptism likewise . answ . this is soon said , but hardly , nay not at all to be proved . for it cannot be their childrens right without authority or command from christ : for if we should grant all our brethren say concerning abraham's seed , and of their childrens being in covenant , this will not justify their practice of baptizing them , if they argue thus till dooms-day , except christ hath left them a precept , or his church a precedent so to do ; for abraham's seed , though they were such a thousand times over , had no right to circumcision until he received the word of command to circumcise them from the great god. nor had lot , and other godly men in that day , any right to that ceremony who were not of abraham's family , because god limited his command to himself , his sons , and servants , or such who were bought with mony , and so came into his house . secondly , we des●re it may be considered that the history we have of the gospel-church in the apostles days from the first planting of the church at jerusalem , till st. john received his revelations , contains more than ●ifty years , and there was no ●ewer than three thousand persons baptized at once in that first church ; so that we may conclude there were many thousands of believers who doubtless had many children born unto them during the time of the gospel 〈◊〉 in the history we have recorded in the new testament , and yet we read not of one of their children upon the account of federal holiness , and their parents covenanting with god , baptized ; and can any be so blind as to think the holy god would have left this thing so in the dark without the least hint or intimation , had it been any of his mind or counsel that believers seed should be baptized ? i am sure they cannot say it , without reflecting upon the faithfulness , care , and wisdom of god. chap. viii . proving believers the only true subjects of baptism from the special ends of this holy sacrament . what the special end and use of baptism is , comes next in order to be considered , wherein it will more fully and clearly appear that no infant in non-age ought by any means to be baptized . first of all , it was ordained to be a sign 〈…〉 the baptized of some inward 〈…〉 viz. of the person 's death unto 〈…〉 to a new life buried with 〈…〉 i. e. christ doth certainly 〈…〉 ●mmediately ( if not wholly ) in 〈…〉 scripture to that outward sign 〈…〉 that in which there is a plain representation of the mystery and inward grace , we are said to be buried and risen both in signification , and also in lively representation of the inward and spiritual burial and resurrection with christ . secondly , here is mention made of the sign , and of the thing signified . and as for that which is spoken of under this expression , buried in baptism , 't is delivered as a m●dium ( saith one ) whereby , as a motive whereunto , and as a reason wherefore , as an image and representation , wherein we are both to read , and remember , and also practise and perform that other ; for , do but mark , how shall we that are dead to sin , ( i. e. should be ) live any longer therein ? know ye not , that as many of you as were baptized into christ , i. e. into , or in token of an interest in him , and of a oneness and fellowship with him by faith , are baptized into his death ? i.e. in token of such a communion with the power of his death , as to kill sin , and crucifie the old man , so that henceforth we should not serve sin ? therefore hence it is , saith he , that in baptism , ( i. e. the outward sacrament ) we are buried with him , i. e. outwardly , visibly , bodily in water into his death , i. e. in token and resemblance of our dying unto sin by virtue of his death ? that we should be ever practically mindful of this , that like as christ rose again after he was dead , so we should rise to a new life ; for if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death , ( i. e. signally in outward baptism , spiritually , and really in the inward work of death unto sin , &c , performed by the spirit upon the soul ) we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection . thirdly , this burial and resurrection that is immediately expressed by these words , buried with him in baptism , wherein ye are also risen with him , is made a motive , argument , and incitement to the spiritual death and resurrection ; for therefore are we perswaded to die to sin and live righteously , because in baptism we are buried in water , and raised again , in token that we ought so to do ; and to this end are we baptized , and buried , and raised therein , and so interested into all the other benefits of christ's death , remission of sins , and salvation , viz. that we should die to sin and live holily , and to the end also that we may thereby be put in mind so to do . now if this death and burial in baptism be to this end , viz. to teach us , and shew us how we must die to sin : then i infer two things , first , that the burial in baptism , here spoken of , is not the death to sin ; for the motive , and things we are moved to do , are two ; and so are the sign , and the thing signified . secondly , that infants are not capable subjects of baptism : for this sacrament calls for understanding , and judgment , and senses to be exercised in all that partake thereof , or else the whole work will be altogether insignificant . therefore , saith one , to carry a poor babe to baptism , is as much as to carry it to hear a sermon . — a sign , as pareus observeth , is some outward thing appearing to the sense , through , which some inward thing is at the same time apprehended by the understanding . therefore , saith mr. perkins , the preaching of the word , and the administration of sacraments are all one in substance ; for in the one the witness of god is seen , and in the other heard . secondly , another end of baptism is , that it might be a signal representation of a believers union with christ , hence called a being baptized into christ , and a putting on of christ . as many as have been baptized into christ , have put on christ , and are all one in christ jesus , saith mr. baxter , and are abraham's seed , and heirs according to promise , gal. 3. 27 , 28 , 29. this speaks the apostle of the probability grounded on a credible profession , &c. and further , saith he , our baptism is the solemnizing of our marriage with christ , and 't is a new and strange kind of marriage where there is no profession of consent . now if this be true which mr. baxter affirms , and i see no cause to doubt of it ; ( most worthy men , as well as scripture , agreeing in this case with him ) how absurd and ridiculous a thing is the invention of infant-baptism , sith all men know they are not capable to signify their consent of marriage with christ ; if any thing in the world cuts in pieces the very sinews of infants baptism 't is this ; for there is a contract made between both parties before the solemnization of marriage ; and how can a babe of two or ten days old do that ? 't is a strange marriage if it be not done , though more strange indeed without the other . but may be some will say 't is a marriage by proxy or sureties , as princes sometimes are married . answ . sometimes there has been some such like action done i must confess : but does not the prince actually consent so to be married ? but all this while , who has required any thing of this at our hands ? are not sureties in baptism a meer human invention ? and have not our brethren cast it away as such ? the third end of baptism , as mr. perkins observes , is this , viz. 't is a sign to believers of the covenant on god's part of the washing away of our sins in the blood of christ ; we see , saith lie ▪ what is done in baptism , the covenant of grace is solemnized between god and the party baptized ; and in this covenant something belongs to god , and something to the party baptized . are infants capable thus to covenant with god ? though we doubt not but it is so in some good sense between the almighty and a believer , who is the only subject , i. e. there is indeed a mutual stipulation on both parties in that solemnity , but an infant can do nothing herein . baptism , saith bullinger , is an agreement or covenant of grace which christ enters into with us when we are baptized , &c. fourthly , baptism is called the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins ; one end of this ordinance therefore is this , viz. to testify the truth of our repentance , and to engage us thereby to bring forth fruits meet for amendment of life . as their sins are not forgiven them , saith mr. baxter , till they are converted ; so they must not be baptized for the forgiveness of sins , till they profess themselves converted , seeing to the church non esse & non apparere is all one . repentance towards god , and faith towards our lord jesus christ , is the sum of that preaching that makes disciples , acts 20 , 21. therefore both these must by profession seem to be received , before any at age are baptized . and that no other , say i , besides them at age ought to be baptized , by this very argument is very clear and evident . bullinger , as he is quoted by mr. baxter , i find speaketh thus , viz. to be baptized in the name of our lord jesus christ , saith he , is by a sign of baptism , to testify that we do believe in christ for the remission of sins : first , mark , it is not only an ingagement to believe hereafter ; but the profession , saith he , of a present faith. secondly , and that not a common faith , but that which hath remission of sin. farewel to infant baptism ; a present faith is required of such that are to be baptized , nay , and more , a present profession of it too . infants have neither faith , nor can they profess it , ergo they are not to be baptized . fifthly , another end of baptism is , ( as one well observes ) to evidence present regeneration ; whereof , saith he , it is a lively sign or symbol — hence 't is called the washing of regeneration ; what signifies the sign , where the thing signified is wanting ? baptism is frequently called the lave● of regeneration , it being a sign or figure of it to the person baptized . christ hath instituted no baptism , saith mr. baxter , but what is to be a sign of present regeneration ; but to men that profess not a justifying faith , it cannot be administred as a sign of regeneration . therefore he hath instituted no baptism to be administred to such . does not this argument make void the baptism of infants , as well as adult unbelievers , by the ancients ? let mr. baxter take it again , but with a very little alteration . christ hath instituted no baptism but what is to be a sign of present regeneration ; but to little babes that profess not a justifying faith , it cannot be administred as a sign of present regeneration , therefore he hath instituted no baptism to be administred to infants . the stress of the argument lies in the institution of christ , in that no baptism is instituted and commanded by christ , but what is a sign of present regeneration , not future ; therefore infant-baptism can be no baptism of christ . sixthly , baptism is called , an answer of a good conscience , by the resurrection of christ from the dead ; or the covenant of a good conscience by the resurrection of christ , ( as saith sir norton knatchbul , in his learned notes printed at oxford , 1677. ) in the belief of which resurrection we are saved , saith he , as they were saved by the ark. but now infants cannot covenant thus , nor witness thus in baptism by a belief of the resurrection , ( which saith the said famous learned man ) baptism is an emphatical figure , or a particular signal of , to the person baptized . see what our late annotators speak upon the place ; in baptism , say they , there is a solemn covenant , or mutual agreement between god and the party baptized , wherein god offers , applies , and seals his grace , stipulating or requiring the parties acceptance of that grace , and devoting himself to his service ; and when he , out of a good conscience doth ingage and promise this , which is to come up to the terms of the covenant , that my be properly called the answer of a good conscience — it seems , say they , to be an allusion to the manner of baptizing , where the minister ask'd the party to be baptized concerning his faith in christ ; and he accordingly answered him , dost thou believe ? i believe , &c. acts 8. 37. now , are children capable to do any of this ? can they covenant with god ? can they answer a good conscience , by believing the resurrection of christ ? or can baptism appear to be a symbol of it to them ? no , nor indeed can rantism be so to any other , i mean to the adult . seventhly , baptism hath another end and use assigned to it , viz. that the party baptized may have an orderly entrance into the visible church , and so have a right to partake of all other ordinances and priviledges thereof , as breaking of bread , &c. this hereafter i shall make fully appear ; nor is it any other thing than is generally owned by christians , and eminent men ; but infants cannot be admitted to those priviledges , viz. to the sacrament of the lord's supper , &c. and therefore ought not to be baptized ; for he that has right to one , cannot be denied the other , by any ground or authority from god's word . chap. ix . containing several other arguments , proving , why not infants , but believers only , are the true subjects of baptism . if there is no word of institution , or any thing in the commission of christ for baptizing infants , but of believers only , then not infants but believers only ought to be baptized . but there is no word of institution , or any thing in the commission of christ , for baptizing infants , but of believers only ; ergo , not infants , but believers only are the subjects of baptism . the major proposition is undeniable : for if infants may be baptized in the name , &c. without any authority from christ , or word of institution , or the least intimation of it in the great commission , what innovation can we keep out of the church ? this is enough to cause any protestant to renounce his religion , and cleave to the romish communion , who asserts the church's power is such , that without a word of institution , she may do the lord knows what . — nor do they , as far as i can find , assert infant-baptism from the authority of the scripture ; but from the power christ has left in the church , in which they seem more honest than some protestants , that pretend to maintain this rite , by plain scripture-proof , without the least shadow or intimation of any such thing , to the palpable reproach of the christian religion . as to the minor , 't is evident , and owned by the learned , that those who are enjoined to be baptized , in the commission , matth. 28. are first to be taught , or made disciples : but infants cannot be made disciples , being uncapable of teaching ; therefore there is nothing in that commission of infant-baptism : if they have any other word of institution or commission , let them produce it , we profess we know of none . object . christ commanded his disciples to baptize all nations ; children are part of the nations , therefore may be baptized : thus you see we have authority to baptize children from the great commission . answ . let me have the same liberty to argue , and see what will follow , viz. christ commanded his disciples to baptize all nations ; but turks , pagans , and infidels , with their children , are part of the nations , ergo , turks , pagans , and infidels , and their children , may be baptized also . sir , i will appeal to you , is not this inference as good and as justifiable as yours ? come put it to your consciences ; can you suppose any should be baptized by virtue of the words of christ in the commission , but disciples only ? object . well , what though that be so ? yet we affirm , that infants are disciples , and therefore may be baptized . answ . what if we shall grant you that infants are disciples , ( which we can never do , it being utterly false ) yet they are not such disciples that christ in the commission requires to be baptized ▪ because they were to be made disciples , by being taught ; and that infants cannot be said to be , we are sure . the lord jesus hath plainly excluded infants in his commission from this administration , according to ordinary rule ; for in that he commands the them to baptize disciples , upon preaching first to them , it follows , that none but such who are so taught , and so by teaching made disciples , are by virtue of the commission , to be baptized ; infants , after an ordinary rate are uncapble of understanding the gospel , when preach'd , and therefore are uncapable of being made disciples thereby , and there is no other way , according to ordinary rule , of being made disciples but by that means : and this the apostles could easily understand , as knowing that under the term disciple , in common speech , and in the whole new testament , those only are meant , who being taught , professed the doctrine preached by such a one as john's disciples , christ's disciples , and the disciples of the pharisees , &c. and accordingly the apostles administred baptism . and in that christ appoints , these to be baptized , we say , he excludes all others ; for the institution , commission , and commandment of jesus christ , is most certainly the only rule , according to which we are to administer the sacrament of baptism , and all other holy things ; and they that do otherwise , open a door to all innovations , and follow their own inventions , and are guilty of will-worship . if you should say , infants are disciples seminally in and by their pa●ents : as if believers could beget believers , ●or disciples of christ by natural generation , is absurd and ridiculous , the christian church being not made up of persons by meer humane birth , but spiritual regeneration . and to say that infants are born disciples by the relation to the covenant , and so have the seal set on them , without any precedent teaching , is but an unapproved dictate ; as if a title to baptism were in its nature a seal of the covenant , which the scripture no where affirms ; nor is there any rule for baptizing of persons because of relation to the covenant , sith baptism wholly depends upon a positive institution . object . but you further argue , that infants are called disciples , act. 15. 10. because the yoak laid upon the necks of the disciples , was circumcision ; and circumcision belonged to infants , ergo , infants are disciples . answ . to this we answer , that there is no colour of ground or reason of giving the name of disciples from that text to infants : for tho true , they are called disciples , upon whose necks the false brethren would have put that yoak of circumcision ; yet what 's this , sith adult believers of the gentiles also were required by the jews to be circumcised , as timothy , act. 16. 3. and tho it be granted that they would have had infants , as well as the converted gentiles , to be circumcised , yet the putting the yoak of circumcision , is not actual circumcision in the flesh ; for that the jews , as well as their children , were able to bear for many ages . but the yoak of circumcision is the necessity of it upon mens consciences , and therewith to oblige them to keep the whole law of moses , or they could not be saved ; and this was not that which they would have put upon children , but upon the disciples , i. e. the faithful brethren in christ jesus . if faith and repentance be required as prerequisite of all them that are to be baptized ; then none but believers ought to be baptized — but faith and repentance is required of all such ; ergo , &c. the major proposition cannot be denied , without a palpable violation of christ's precept , and by the same rule that infants may be baptized , notwithstanding this absolute prerequisite , unbelievers may , invalidate the rule of christ , or render it defective , and you give all away to the enemy . the minor has been sufficiently proved . if thou believest , thou may'st , else he might not ; that it seems was absolutely necessary , repent , and be baptized every one of you , act. 2. 36 , 37. and , those of the church of england say the same thing . in the rubrick , what is required of persons that are to be baptized ? that 's the question . answer , repentance , whereby they forsake sin ; and , faith , whereby they stedfastly believe the promise of god made to them in that sacrament . if there be no precedent in the scripture , ( as there is no precept ) that any besides such who professed faith and repentance , were baptized ; then none but such ought to be baptized : but there is no precedent that any besides such who professed faith and repentance were baptized ; ergo , none but such ought . had infant-baptism been any appointment or institution of christ , we should certainly either have had precept or example in the scripture to warrant the same ; but in as much as the holy scripture is wholly silent therein , there being not one example , or the least syllable to be found for any such practice , we may be sure it is none of christ's ordinance . if our brethren have any precedent or example for it , let them shew it , for we declare and testify , there is none as we know of . and that there is neither precept nor example for infants baptism , we have it confessed by many of them who were for it . erasmus saith , it is no where expressed in the apostolical writings , that they baptized children . and again , upon rom. 6. baptizing of young infants was not , saith he , in use in st. paul's time. calvin also confesseth , it is no where expresly mentioned by the evangelists , that any one child was baptized by the hands of the apostles . ludovicus vives saith , none of old were wont to be baptized but in a grown age ; and who desired it , and understood what it was . the magdeburgenses , as i find them quoted by mr. danvers , do say , that concerning the baptizing of the adult , both jews and gentiles , we have sufficient proof from the 2d , 8th , 10th , and 16th chapters of the acts ; but as to the baptizing of infants they can meet with no example in scripture . dr. taylor saith , it is against the perpetual analogy of christ's doctrine to baptize infants ; for besides that , christ never gave any precept to baptize them , nor ever himself , nor his apostles ( that appears ) did baptize any of them : all that either he or his apostles said concerning it , requires such previous dispositions to baptism , of which infants are not capable , and those are faith and repentance . and not to instance in those innumerable places that require faith before baptism there needs no more but this one of our blessed saviour : he that believeth and is baptized , shall be saved ; but he that believeth not , shall be condemned : plainly thus faith and baptism will bring a man to heaven ; but if he hath no faith , baptism shall do him no good : so that if baptism , saith he , be necessary , so is faith much more ; for the want of faith damns absolutely , it is not said so of the want of baptism . if paul declared the whole counsel of god unto the churches and primitive christians , and yet never declared or made known to them infants baptism . then infants baptism is none of the counsel of god. but paul did declare unto the churches and primitive christians the whole counsel of god , but never declared any thing to them of infants baptism . ergo. the major proposition can't fairly be denied : and as to the minor , see acts 20. 27. for i have not shunned , saith he , to declare unto you all the counsel of god. it appears by the context , that he concluded he could not be pure from the blood of all men , if he had not been faithful in this matter , i. e. in making known all the whole will of god to them . paul was the great apostle of the gentiles , and he spake these words to a gentile church , viz. the church at ephesus , and therefore it is the more remarkable , god hath by his mouth made known all things that are necessary for us to know or understand of his counsel , or our duty . see our late annotators on this verse . god's decree to save all that believe in christ , or the whole doctrine of christianity , as it directs to an holy life ; whatsoever ▪ god requires of any one in order to a blessed eternity : this is that which ( say they ) the pharisees rejected , luke 7. 30. and so do all wicked and ungodly men , who refuse to take god's counsel , or to obey his command . now baptism is that part of god's counsel which the pharisees rejected against themselves . moreover in chap. 19. it appears he opened and explained that great ordinance to those christians at ephesus , at the first plantation of the church there , but not a word of their duty to baptize their infants ; nor was there any reason he should , it being none of god's counsel . if whatsoever is necessary to faith or practice , is left in the written word , or made known to us in the holy scripture , that being a compleat and perfect rule , and yet infant-baptism is not contained or left therein , then infant-baptism is not of god. but whatsoever is necessary to faith or practice , is left in the written word , or made known to us in the holy scripture , &c. and yet infant-baptism is not contained therein . ergo , infant-baptism is not of god. that the holy scripture contains in it all things that are necessary for us to believe and practice in order to eternal life , is acknowledg'd by all worthy men both ancient and modern ; and that infants baptism is not contained in the holy scripture we have proved . the holy scriptures , saith athanasius , being inspired from god , are sufficient to all instructions of truth . isychius saith , let us which will have any thing observed of god , search no more but that which the gospel doth give unto us . all things , saith chrysostom , be plain and clear in the scripture ; and what things soever be needful , are manifest there . if there be any thing needful to be known or not to be known , we shall learn it by the holy scriptures ; if we shall need to reprove a falshood , we shall fetch it from thence ; if to be corrected , to be chastened , to be exhorted , or comforted ; to be short , if ought lack , that ought to be taught or learned , we shall also learn it out of the same scriptures . augustin saith , read the holy scriptures , wherein ye shall find fully what is to be followed , and what to be avoided . and again he saith , in these therefore , which are evidently contained in the scriptures , are found all things which contain faith , manner of living , hope and love. let us seek no farther than what is written of god our saviour , lest a man would know more than the scriptures witness . luther saith , there ought no other doctrine to be delivered , or heard in the church , besides the pure word of god , that is the holy scriptures , let other teachers , and hearers , with their doctrine be accursed . basil saith , that it would be an argument of insidelity , and a most certain sign of pride , if any man should reject any things written , and should introduce things not written . let this , saith calvin , be a firm axiom , that nothing is to be accounted the word and will of god to which place should be given in the church , but that which is contained in the law and prophets , and after in the apostolical writings . it is , saith theophilact , the part of a diabolical spirit to think any thing divine , without the authority of the holy scripture . bellarmine saith , that though the arguments of the anabaptists , from the defect of command or example , have a great force against the lutherans , for as much as they use that rite every-where , having no command or example theirs is to be rejected ; yet is it of no force against catholicks , who conclude the apostolical tradition is of no less authority with us than the scripture ; for the apostles speak with the same spirit with which they did write ; but this of baptizing of infants is an apostolical tradition , &c. and lastly , to close with this argument , take what mr. ball saith , we must for every ordinance look to the institution ( saith he ) and neither stretch it wider , nor draw it narrower than the lord hath made it ; for he is the institutor of the sacraments , according to his own pleasure , and 't is our part to learn of him both to whom , how , and for what end the sacraments are to be administred ; in all which we must affirm nothing but what god hath taught us , and as he taught us . if this worthy man speak truth , as be sure he did , and his doctrine be imbraced , certainly our brethren must never sprinkle , nay baptize , one child any more . if no man or woman at any time or times were by the almighty god , jesus christ , nor his apostles neither commended for baptizing any one child or children , nor reproved for neglecting to baptize such ; then infants baptism is not of , nor from god. but no man or woman was at any time or times either commended by the almighty god , &c. for baptizing any one child or children , nor reproved for neglecting to baptize such . ergo , infants baptism is not of , nor from god. this argument remains good and unanswerable , unless they can shew us that there is some gospel-ordinance and universal duty injoyned on men , that no man or woman was ever commended for doing it , nor reproved for neglecting it : when they can shew that , this argument will be invalid . that doctrine that reflects upon the honour , care and faithfulness of jesus christ our blessed mediator and glorious law-giver , or renders him less faithful then moses , and the new testament in one of its great ordinances , nay sacraments to lie more dark and obscure in god's word than any law or ordinance of the old testament did , cannot be of god. but the doctrine of infants baptism reflects upon the honour , care , and faithfulness of jesus christ , &c. or renders him less faithful than moses , and the new testament in one of its great ordinances , nay sacraments to lie more dark and obscure in god's word than any law or ordinance of the old testament . ergo , infants baptism cannot be of god. the major certainly none will deny . the minor is easily proved : can any thing reflect more upon the honour of christ , &c. than this ? as if he should neglect to speak out his mind and will to us plainly , or be so careless about it , that sorry man is forc'd to try his wit to supply what is defective and wanting in this matter in christ's word ; for he is strangely left of god and benighted , who will not confess infant baptism to need much of humane craft and cunning to make it out from christ's new testament ; and when he has done all , he leaves it as doubtful as he found it in the judgment of indifferent persons . did moses deal thus with the children of israel ? no , no. how careful was he to deliver every law , statute , and ordinance exactly , particularly the law of the passover ! do but read how careful and circumspect he was in that , in all respects and matters relating to it . nay , and the wisdom of god was such , to leave nothing then in the dark , but gave order that all things might be made plain , that he that run might read it , and he that did read , might know the duty , i. e. the statu●e or ordinance , ( tho in many things they might need instruction how in a right spirit to be found in it , and what it signified . ) but i dare affirm , no man who reads the new testament , from the beginning of matthew to the end of the revelations , a thousand times over , shall ever from that holy word , or any place or part of it , find it to be his duty to baptize his child ; the word of god is powerful in convincing men of their duties , as well as of their sins ; but in this it fails , it has no power to convince mens consciences . the faith of persons must stand in the wit and subtilty of men , in respect of infant-baptism , and not in the power of god , and efficacy of his blessed word . let some shew us the person , who only by reading the new testament was convinced of infant-baptism ; though , 't is true , divers by reading of the writings of learned men , and their subtil and sophistical arguments , ( for so i must call them ) have been perswaded to believe it to be of god. — yet , after all , some of them have plainly signified the great ground and argument they build upon , is this , viz. because such and such learned , godly , and wise men , assert it to be a truth of christ . so that it appears very clear , they build their faith herein , not upon the authority of god's word , but upon the credit and authority of men. but certainly it must needs , as i said , reflect upon the honour and faithfulness of christ , to conclude infant-baptism to be of god : for can any think the lord jesus would leave so great an ordinance , or sacrament , of the new testament , so obscure and dark in his sacred word , had it been his mind that believers should baptize their children , since the apostle magnifies christ's faithfulness , who is the son , above that of moses , who was but the servant ? and moses verily was faithful in all his house as a servant , for a testimony of those things which were to be spoken after , hebr. 3. 5. but christ as a son over his own house , &c. ver . 6. and therefore was counted worthy of more glory than moses , ver . 3. besides , do but consider what darkness and confusion the asserters of infant-baptism seem to be in , about the proof and right they say children have to it . 1. some of them say , it depends wholly upon the authority of the church . 2. others dare not baptize them , but as believers and disciples , and therefore affirm they have faith , &c. 3. others can't believe this ; and therefore though they likewise baptize them as believers , yet get sureties to stand for them . 4. others say , they have a right by the faith of their parents : some are for baptizing all children , others none but the children of believers . 5. one says , if either of their parents are believers they may be baptized ; some say both father and mother , both must be godly persons and in the covenant of grace , or else the child has no right to be baptized . no marvel when men have lost their way , they are thus lost in a wilderness . that ordinancé god has made no promise to persons in their obedience thereto , nor denounced any threatning or punishment on such who slight , neglect , and contemn it , it is no ordinance of god. but god has made no promise to persons who baptize their children , nor denounced no threatning or panishment on those who slight , neglect and contemn it . ergo , infant-baptism is no ordinance of god. let any such who assert infant-baptism , shew us a promise to the obedient herein , or a threatning denounced against the disobedient thereto , and we will say no more . there are promises made to believers in their being baptized , that 's evident ; and punishments threatned on such who reject the counsel of god in that respect , the like there is in respect of any other gospel-ordinance , but none of this in the case of infant-baptism . chap. x. wherein the great arguments , and pretended scripture-proofs for infant-baptism , concerning the covenant circumcision , and infants church-membership , are examined , and answered . one main and great argument the pedobaptists bring for that practice is this , viz. children of believers are in covenant , as well as their parents . the covenant made with abraham was the covenant of grace , or gospel-covenant , to which the seal of circumcision was annexed ; and as circumcision belonged to the children of the faithful under the law , so baptism belongs to the children of the faithful under the gospel , or else the priviledges under the gospel would be less than those were under the law. answ . there hath been enough said , over and over , by mr. tombs , mr. danvers , and many others , to detect and utterly vanquish the weakness of this argument . as , first , it hath been proved , that the covenant of grace made with abraham and his seed , doth not intend his carnal seed according to the flesh ; but his spiritual seed , or such who had the faith of abraham . and one would think the apostle might be believed in his expounding that text , viz. to abraham and to his seed were the promises made , gal. 3. 16. he saith not , and to seeds , as of many , but as of one , and to they seed , which is christ . compare this with v. 29. if ye be christ's , then are ye abraham's seed , and heirs . according to the promise and again , in rom. 9. 7 , 8. he saith , neither because they are the seed of abraham , are they all children ; but in isaac shall thy seed be called . that is , they which are the children of the flesh , these are not the children of god : but the children of the promise are counted for the seed . could the apostle in plainer words have detected the error of these men , if he had met with them in his day ? 't is true , he did meet with some , viz. the jews , or abraham's natural seed , who were so blind as thus to argue from the covenant made with abraham ; and concluded , they were the true seed and children of god , because they were the off-spring of abraham according to the flesh . but as john baptist first endeavoured to undeceive them , when he saw the scribes and pharisees coming to his baptism — by saying , think not to say with in your selves , ye have abraham to your father , &c. so in the next place , our blessed saviour himself , in john. 8. likewise shewed them their great error and mistake herein , and that they might be the children of the devil , notwithstanding they were the seed of abraham according to the flesh , and thought themselves safe as being in that covenant made with him . the covenant of grace there made with abraham and his seed , extends to none but the holy and elect seed , to none but the spiritual seed , to such who are christ's , or true believers in christ only . now if the covenant of grace comprehends none of abraham's carnal or fleshly seed , but the spiritual seed only , to what purpose is there so many sheers of paper printed by mr. baxter , mr. sidenham , &c. to prove the carnal seed of believers to have right to the seal of the covenant ? their business is to prove all believers children to be in the covenant in the first place , or all they say is nothing . but , secondly , if they could prove all the children of believers to be in that covenant made with abraham , yet it doth not from thence follow neither , that therefore their children may be baptized , unless they can shew the lord jesus hath injoined them so to be , because baptism wholly depends upon the authority of christ's institution , or positive prescription . 't is not enough for any to say , if children are in covenant , they may be baptized . who tells them so ? hath christ any where required it ? doth he say they ought , or that it belongs to them ? had it been abraham's duty to circumcise his children , because they were in covenant with him , before god gave him a positive law so to do ; certainly , had he done it without any command of god , and have called it god's ordinance , he had ceas'd being called any more faithful abraham . come , sirs , your consequences and conclusions you have so long made a noise of , will make no gospel-precept , nor hold equal weight with the ballance of the sanctuary . for , thirdly , pray consider , were there not divers in the covenant of grace , i. e. in that spiritual , or gospel-covenant god made with abraham , in that very day and time that the law of circumcision was given forth ? and yet they were not , from that ground , to be circumcised , nor were they at all circumcised , because god did not command them so to be ? was not lot a godly man , and in the same covenant of grace ? together with melchisedec and others i might mention ? these were in covenant , and yet without the seal , as you call it ; we do not read they were circumcised . and do you not think that many of the females of abraham's off-spring were in that covenant of grace ? yet they had no right to circumcision , the seal ( as you called it ) of the covenant , because none but males were required or commanded to be circumcised . suppose abraham should have gone without a command or word from god , and have circumcised his females , and have reasoned after the rate you do , viz. my female children are in covenant ; and since the covenant belongs to them , the seal of the covenant belongs to them , which is , circumcision , therefore i will circumcise them also ; would god have allowed him to do any such act , think you ? you will reply , i am sure that god would never have born with abraham in doing any such thing , because he must have done it without a command . and , pray , how can you think he will bear with you in baptizing children of believers , sith you have no more command from god so to do , than abraham had to circumcise his female children ? you reply , they are in covenant , and therefore to them belongs the seal of the covenant ; even so say we , his females might be in the same covenant , and yet you would have condemned such an act in him , though grounded upon the very same foot of an account , which you stand upon your own justification in , and acknowledg no fault , but contrarywise blame , nay , reproach us for holding an error , because we cannot do and practice as you do in this case , without any authority from god's word . 4ly . to prove further , that the right of circumcision wholly depended upon the absolute will , pleasure , and soveraignty of god , as baptism now doth ; and that his will , and not ours , nor any consequence that may be drawn from being in the covenant , can give a person a right thereto , without his command or allowance ; 't is to be considered , that there were those commanded to be circumcised , who were not ( as there is probable ground to believe ) in that holy and blessed covenant of grace , god said his covenant should not be established with ishmael , but with isaac , yet he was circumcised , gen. 17. 20 , 21 , 25. gal. 4. 29 , 30. the same might be said of esau , and thousands more of abraham's carnal seed : it was , it appears from hence , god's soveraign will and pleasure that gave right to circumcision , and not being in the covenant . quest . but was not circumcision a seal of the covenant of grace under that dispensation , as baptism is now a seal of the same covenant under this dispensation ? answ . no , for circumcision was only a seal to abraham's faith , or a confirmation of that faith he had long before he was circumcised ; but so it could not be said to be to any infant that had no faith. it was indeed a sign put into the flesh of infants ; but a sign , and seal too only to abraham , witnessing to him that he had a justifying faith ; but to the truth of the promises , there was 'tis evident , a two-fold covenant made with abraham , 1. that he should be the father of many nations , and that the land in which he was a stranger should be given to his seed ; these promises seem to relate to his carnal seed . 2. that he should be the father of the faithful , rom. 4. 11. heir of the world , rom. 4. 13. and that in him , and in his seed all the families of the earth should be blessed , that is , jesus christ , gal. 3. 16. now none could receive circumcision as such a seal to them , but abraham , because none before circumcised had such a faith , which intitled them to such singular promises : the apostle in the fourth of the ro●ans shews , that abraham was not justified by works , nor by circumcision , but by faith , which he had long before he was circumcised ; and so but a seal or confirmation of that faith he had before , and to assure him of the truth of the promises made to him and to his carnal and spiritual seed . you ought not therefore to call circumcision a seal to any but to abraham , neither ought you to call it a seal of any other thing to him than what the scripture calls it a seal of , viz. and he received circumcision a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had being yet uncircumcised , rom. 4. 11. and that you may see we are not alone in this matter , see what chrysostom and theophilact , as i find them quoted by mr. danvers ; it was called a seal of the righteousness of faith , because it was given to abraham as a seal and testimony of that righteousness which he had acquired by faith. now this seems to be the priviledg of abraham's alone , and not to be tranferred to others ; as if circumcision in whom ever it was were a testimony of divine righteousness ; for it was the priviledg of abraham that he should be the father of all the faithful , as well uncircumcised as circumcised , being already the father , having faith in uncircumcision , he received first the sign of circumcision , that he might be the father of the circumcised . now because he had this priviledg , in respect of the righteousness which he had acquired by faith , therefore the sign of circumcision was to him a seal of the righteousness of faith ; but to the rest of the jews it was a sign that they were abraham's seed , but not a seal of the righteousness of faith , as all the jews also were not the fathers of many nations . moreover , it is evident a seal is a confirmation of that which a person hath made over to him , and it doth insure him of it . now to call circumcision a seal of the covenant of grace , 't is all one as to say all that were circumcised , were assured of all the blessings of that covenant , then must all that were circumcised be pardon'd and saved ; and so also would it follow in the case of baptism , were that acknowledged to be a seal to all those that are baptized of the new covenant . but in a word , we know nothing called a seal of the new covenant , but the holy spirit , which the saints were said to be sealed with after they believed , ephes . 1. 13. & 4. 30. unto the day of redemption ; god by setting his seal upon us assures us that we are his , and that we shall have eternal life . baptism is called a figure , but no where a seal and a sign or figure proper only to such who have understanding to discern the spiritual things and mysteries that are represented thereby , and wrought in them . object . say what what you will , the promise and covenant of grace was to abraham and his natural off-spring . answ . why do you not believe the apostle who tells you the quite contrary , and that he said not of seeds as of many , but to thy seed , which is christ ? but it you will have it as you say , see what absurd consequences will follow and arise from your notion : and first take what calvin saith , 't is manifest , saith he , that the promise understood of spiritual blessings pertaineth not to the carnal seed of abraham , but to the spiritual , as the apostle himself saith , rom. 4. 8 , 9. for if you understand the carnal seed , saith he , then that promise will belong to none of the gentiles , but to those alone who are begotten of abraham and isaac according to the flesh ; by this it appears you go about to shut out your selves and children too from having any part in that covenant made with abraham . secondly , if god made the covenant of grace with abraham and his carnal or fleshly off-spring , and so with all believers and their children , then all their off-spring must have saving grace bestowed upon them and a new heart , because these things are some of the chief blessings contained in the new covenant . now do you see that all the children of believers have the grace of god bestowed upon them , so that they are new creatures ? certainly no , for as abraham had his ishmael , and isaac his esa● , and david his absolom , so have most or many believers wicked and ungodly children , and so they live and die to the great grief of their souls : you can't think that god fails in his promise , and that the covenant of grace is not so firm and sure as the scripture declares it to be , one of them will follow , or you must conclude your selves mistaken in your notion : but certainly they cannot miss of grace if mr. blake is right ; for , saith he , christianity is hereditary ; that as the children of a noble-man are noble , the child of a free-man free , of a turk a turk , and of a jew ; a jew so * the child of a christian is a christian . we will grant him they are so called , but withal must tell him , the children of christian people are by nature the children of wrath as well as others . fourthly , this would render grace to be a birth-priviledg , as mr. danvers observes , and regeneration tied to generation , contrary to the scripture and all good doctrine ; as if a believer doth not only beget a child in natural generation , but a saint also . fifthly , then the apostle spake not true in saving the children of the flesh , these are not the children of god , i. e. of the promise , rom. 9. sixthly , and it also would follow , that all the whole off-spring of believers shall be saved , without you will assert the doctrine of james arminius , that there is a falling away from grace . seventhly , and would it not follow also , that all the children of believers know god , and need not be taught , saying , know the lord , for ( you know who saith ) they shall all know me , from the least of them to the greatest of them ; that is , all those who are in the new covenant , which you say all believers children are , even in the same covenant of grace made with abraham . eighthly , and then it follows also that the covenant of grace and spiritual blessings made with abraham , is tied up to believers and their seed only ; and if so , what will become of all poor unbelievers and their perishing off-spring ? object . but does not baptism come in the room of circumcision , the one being a figure of the other ? answ . there is no ground so to believe , since the scripture gives not the least hint of any such thing . 1. for first , if it had , then when baptism came in and was in force , circumcision must have ceased immediately : but after baptism was commanded and administred , we find circumcision in being , and was not disannull'd till the death and resurrection of our saviour . now it would have vanquish'd , as shadows do , as soon as baptism the antitype came in force , had it been a type or figure of baptism , or come in the room of it . 2. if baptism had come in the room of circumcision , then the church of god under the gospel would have been just like the national church of the jews , viz. made up of the fleshly seed ; but the apostle shews thè contrary , it consists of lively stones , that is , a spiritual and not a carnal seed . 3. then males only and no females would have been baptized ; because none but male children were to be circumcised , as god commanded . 4. circumcision was administred on abraham's natural seed without any profession of faith ; but none are to be admitted to baptism but by a profession of faith , repentance and regeneration . the first birth , or being born in a fleshly way by carnal generation , gave abraham's natural seed a right to circumcision ; whereas the spiritual birth or regeneration gives a right only to baptism according to christ's commission , as we have proved . 5. 't is evident circumcision figured forth another thing , viz. the destruction of the body of sin by jesus christ , and the circumcision of the heart , and therefore not baptism , &c. very full and most excellently you have to this point dr. taylor , who saith , that the argument from circumcision is invalid upon infinite considerations : figures and types prove nothing , unless a command go along with them , or some express to signify such to be their purpose ; for the deluge of waters , and the ark of noah were a figure of baptism , said peter ; and if therefore the circumstances of the one should be drawn to the other , we should make baptism a prodigy rather than a rite . the paschal lamb was a type of the eucharist , which succeeds the other , as baptism doth to circumcision ; but because there was in the manducation of the paschal lamb , no prescription of sacramental drink , shall we thence conclude that the eucharist is to be administred but in one kind ? and even in the very instance of this argument , supposing a correspondency of the analogy between circumcision and baptism , yet there is no correspondency of identity ; for although it were granted , that both of them did consign the covenant of faith , yet there is nothing in the circumstance of childrens being circumcised that so concerns that mystery , but that it might very well be given to children , and yet baptism only to men of reason , because circumcision lest a character in the flesh , which being imprinted upon infants did its work to them when they came to age ; and such a character was necessary , because there was no word added to the sign ; but baptism imprints nothing that remains on the body , and if it leaves a character at all , it is upon the soul , to which also the word is added , which is as much a part of the sacrament , as the sign it self : for both which reasons it is requisite that the parties baptized should be capable of reason , that they may be capable both of the word of the sacrament , and the impress made upon the spirit ; since therefore the reason of this parity does wholly fail , there is nothing left to infer a necessity of complying in this circumstance of age any more than in the other annxes of the type ; then the infant must also precisely be baptized upon the eighth day , and females must not be baptized , because not circumcised : but it were more proper if we would understand it right to prosecute the analogy , form the type to the antitype by way of letter , and spirit , and signification . and as circumcision figures baptism , so also the adjuncts of the circumcision , shall signifie something spiritual in the adherences of baptism ; and therefore as infants were circumcised , so spiritual infants shall be baptized , which is spiritual circumcision ; for therefore babes had the ministry of the type , to signify that we must , when we give our names to christ , become children in malice , and then the type is made compleat , &c. thus far the doctor . quest . but why may ●ot infants be baptized now as well as children were circumcised heretofore ? answ . you may as well ask , why nadab and abihu might not have offered strange fire , or why might not the priest ? carry the ark in a cart. — the reason why they ought to do neither of those things were , because god commanded them not so to do . in like manner , say we , children must not be baptized , because god hath given no command to do it . circumcision was expresly commanded , both as to the subject , time , age and sex , which was as you have heard , the male children at eight days old , with a severe penalty of the parents disobedience . but there is not one hint , or the least colour of ground for the baptizing of infants in all the new testament , as hath been proved ; and yet the gospel is , as one observes , as express in the matter of baptism , as first , touching the subject men and woman : secondly , as to the time , viz. when they believe : thirdly , as to the qualifications of baptism , i. e. faith and repentance : fourthly , as to the end and use of it , to signifie the death , burial , and resurrection of christ , with our death unto sin , and rising again to newness of life . can any think the servant should be so careful to give directions from god in every case about the circumcising of children under the law , and the son of god not to be as express in all parts of instituted worship and our duties under the gospel ? this can't be thought ; see what the apostle saith , which we before hinted , heb. 3. 5 , 6. quest . but children were members of the jewish church as well as adult persons , sith mr. smythies , and so say other pedo-bap●isto , as 〈◊〉 ba●ter , and many more ; and since they were comprehended with their parents in that church-state 〈◊〉 are so still ▪ under the gospel , and therefore to 〈…〉 . answ . that children were then admitted members of the jewish church is granted , and 't is as evident that god hath now quite pulled down that house of his , ( i mean that national church-state ) and broke up house-keeping , and turned the bond-woman and her son , ( i. e. the fleshly seed , servants and infants ) all out of doors ; the natural branches are broken off , and god hath now built him a new , a glorious , and more spiritual house , into which he admitteth none as his houshold-servants to dwell in his spiritual family , but believers only , or such as profess so to be : ye also ( saith peter ) as lively stones , are built up a spiritual house , &c. and that the old house , the jewish church-state , with all the appurtenances , rites , and priviledges of it , is pulled down , and a new one built , into which infants are not to be admitted , is very evident from what the apostle speaks , heb. 7. 12. for the priesthood being changed ; there is made of necessary a change also of the whole law , which must needs include circumcision with all the appurtenances and priviledges belonging to it . and therefore as infants church-membership came in with the law of circumcision , so it went out and was disanull'd with it ; they were , 't is true , of the houshold of old , but it was by a positive law : shew us the like now and you do your business , or else you say nothing ; for evident it is that what priviledges soever are given to any persons by an act of parliament , which said law was to continue in force for so long a time and no longer , when that time is expired and another parliament makes a new law , wherein many things are contained that were in the first , but those certain priviledges given to those persons in the former law , are left out in this latter act , it would 〈◊〉 be a solly for any of them to 〈◊〉 those priviledges by virtue of a law that is gone , and now not in force . or if a man should have a legacy bequeathed to him by the will and testament of his friend , and yet afterwards his friend sees cause to make another will , which is his last will and testament , and in the last will leaves him quite out and gives him no such legacy , it would be a foolish thing for him to sue for the legacy left him in the first will , which is void in law by his friends last will and testament . just so it is here ; there was an old law wherein infants were admitted to the priviledges of being members of the national church of the jews , and so also it was in the old or former will and testament ; but that law was to continue but till christ came , and now he has made a new law wherein infant-church-membership is quite left out , and the lord jesus has made another will , his last will and testament , wherein the old priviledg is not be queathed to infants : now is it not folly in you to plead for that old priviledg that was in the former testament ? you must find your infant-church-membership in the new testament , as must also the seventh-day-sabbath-men the old jewish sabbath * , or else they and you too say nothing , but render your selves weak and strangely be-clouded : and certain i am , there is now no institution , no law , no prescription , no rule , no example for keeping the seventh-day-sabbath in the new law , in the new and last will and testament of jesus christ ; nor no institution , no law , no precept , no example contained therein for infant-church-membership , no not the least hint or intimation that infants should be fellow-citizins with the saints , and of the houshold , of god , neither are they so to be accounted till they believe , and are to do service in the house : for though we account our children of our family notwithstanding they can't do any service therein , yet that is no argument they may be members of god's church , unless by any law or institution god has made them so to be . the houshold of god is called the houshold of faith , or a family that consisteth of believers ; therefore unless you can prove infants to be believers , they are not of this house ; for all that are to have admission there must be believers , or profess themselves so to be , as mr. baxter acknowledges , or else no place for them there , which infants cannot do . object . but it is still objected , that as the jews and their children were broken off , so the gentiles and their children are ingrafted in their room , as rom. 11. 20. because of vnbelief they were broken off , and thou standest by faith , &c. answ . we answer , that the reason why the jews and their children were broken off , was not because they had not believing parents , for abraham , isaac and jacob were still the parents of them all , they were abraham's seed , according to the flesh , when they were broken off as well as before ; but the true reason was , because the terms of standing in the church were now altered : for before the gospel-dispensation came , they stood members of the old jewish church , though as much unbelieving for many generations , as they were when they were broken off ; but now abraham's church-state is at an end , and all the priviledges and immunities cease , the jewish church must give way to the gospel-church , the messiah being come , and about to build him up a new and more glorious and spiritual house , into which none are of right to enter but such as are profest believers ; for the old house or jewish church-state was not intended to abide for ever , but only until the time of reformation , and then the law must be changed , yea the covenant changed , which they not believing , nor closing in with , were broken off , they being willing to abide in the old house still , and to remain church-members upon the account of a meer fleshly and natural birth , crying out , abraham is our father , and we are his seed , and are free , and never were in bondage , wherefore they were broken off , and that whether they would or not , by reason of their unbelief ; that is , because they would not believe christ was the true messiah , and that the old covenant and all the priviledges thereof were flying away , the substance and true antitype of all those shadows being come , viz. the lord jesus christ . so that thus they were broken off by unbelief , and thou and thine , o gentile believer , stand by faith , mark it , thou standest by faith ; not by virtue of any birth-priviledg whatsoever , but by faith , thy standing is by faith ; yet not thy seed by thy faith , but thou thy self by thine , and they by their own ; faith is that by which ( thou standing and not thy seed ) hast right to stand in the church , and not they ; but if thy seed have faith , and thou hast none , they have right in the church , and thou shalt be excluded . most certain it is , that under the law the natural seed or progeny of abraham , were all holy with an external , ceremonial , or typical holiness , and consequently they were then all admitted to an external participation of church-priviledges . but remarkable to this purpose is that passage of the apostle , 2 cor. 5. 16. wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh ; it seems then , that heretofore there had been a knowledg taken of persons after the flesh ; and 't is as plain there was , that becuase the jews were of the natural or fleshly seed of abraham , they were therefore all of them admitted to the priviledg of an external church-membership , while others were exempted . but we see the apostle resolves henceforth to disclaim any such cognizance of them , or any others upon the account of a meer fleshly descent : and to this very purpose immediately subjoyns in the following verse , therefore if any man be in christ , he is a new creature : old things are past away , all things are become new ; the old church , and old church-membership , rites , ordinances and priviledges , and a new church-state , new ordinances , a new seed , and new way of introduction unto the participation of the priviledge of church-membership now under this new and more glorious dispensation , viz. the gospel : nothing but a new creature will serve the turn ; for god expects that they that worship him , do now worship him in spirit and is truth ; the priviledg of being admitted into god's house , and to stand before his presence in the actual celebration of gospel-ordinances , being now entailed only upon the spiritual seed , even such who as lively stones are built up a spiritual house , a holy priesthood to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to god by jesus christ ; 1 pet. 2. 3 , 4 , 5. or such at least as make a visible profession thereof . and therefore , when this new and more spiritual dispensation was about to be actually introduced and established , john who was the harbinger of it gives sufficient notice thereof ; and to this purpose deals plainly with the jews , i. e. the pharisees and sadduces that came to be baptized of him , and tells them upon this account , mat. 3. 9 , 10. think not to say within your selves , we have abraham to our father : for i say unto you , that god is able of these stones to raise up children to abraham . and now also is the ax laid unto the root of the trees : therefore every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit , is hewn down , and cast into the fire . it cannot be denied but that they had abraham to their father as much now as before , only the terms of their standing in that church was now changed ; so that every tree now of whatsoever natural stock or external production , that bringeth not forth good fruit , must be hewn down ; and the reason is rendred for that , now the ax is laid to the root of the trees , mark it , now 't is so ; it was not so before , the ax was never till now laid thus unto the root of the trees : which must needs be understood in reference to that birth and fleshly priviledg spoken of before , which they had so long boasted of , as the whole context shews . but now god is resolved to make other manner of work of it under the gospel-dispensation than he did before . now the root of the trees are struck at , a bar put , natural descent or extraction from a religious root , ( i.e. godly parents ) will not now serve turn , as in time past it did , to give any true right or title to church-priviledges . moreover , if god now will not suffer any of the natural branches to abide on their own natural stock , viz. abraham , be sure he will not admit any gentiles , that are not natural branches of abraham , to be grafted into the good olive , without faith and regeneration . object . but if children may not be baptized , this makes the priviledg of believers children under the gospel less than was theirs under the law ; for their children were admitted members of the visible church by circumcision ; and we cannot but conclude , that our priviledges for our selves and for our children , are at least as large , great and comfortable as theirs , and therefore our infants are to be baptized . answ . to this we reply , that we do not doubt but that our priviledges , in respect of the covenant of grace , and all spiritual blessings are as great and comfortable as theirs were ; but the covenant of grace , the blessings and divine priviledges thereof , were neither made to the jews natural posterity , nor to ours ; and although circumcision was a priviledg in some respect to the jews above what the heathens had , yet it is termed by the apostle an intolerable yoke ; now therefore why tempt ye god to put a yoke upon the necks of the disciples , which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear ? their children were not circumcised as children of believers , and so sealed with a new covenant-seal , as being made new covenant-children thereby ; circumcision did not confer grace , nor make them heirs of the kingdom of heaven , it was therefore no more than an external priviledg to the natural lineage and seed of abraham , as a typical and shadowy thing , whereby his posterity was to be mark'd , to distinguish them from all the nations of the earth , and to keep that line clear , from whence christ according to the flesh was to come , and to be a sign in their flesh to put them in mind that god would perform the promise of the messiah made to abraham , and also to oblige them to keep the law ; for he that was circumcised was a debtor to keep the whole law. hence it was the jewish christians , instead of looking upon circumcision to be a priviledg upon a spiritual account , could not but acknowledg it a great mercy they were delivered from it ; and hence 't is the apostle exhorts the saints to stand fast in that liberty in which christ had made them free , and not be intangled again in the yoke of bondage . neither ought such a thing ( as mr. danvers observes ) to be any more esteemed the loss of a priviledg than our not injoying literally a holy land , city , temple , a succession of high-priests , and priesthood , by generation or lineal descent . ( for you know their children were priests successively in their generations , a levite begat a priest or minister , as well as they and other tribes begat church-members . ) now though all these outward priviledges are gone , yet our priviledges being more spiritual , are greater both to our selves and off-spring ; they look'd for christ to come as held forth under many dark types and shadows , we are assured he is come and has accomplish'd what was foretold of him , we behold in the glass of the gospel as with open face the glory of the lord ; all those types are explained and spiritualized to us , viz. circumcision , the worldly sanctuary , tabernacle , the candlestick , table , shew-bread , cherubims , mercy-seat , &c. which things and many more were figures for the time then present , and were shadows of good things to come , but the body or substance of them is christ , who hath put an end to them , and must we now needs find out some other carnal or external rites to come in the room or stead of these or some of these , or else think our priviledges are less than theirs ? whereas indeed our priviledges it appears are inlarged , and far greater than theirs were , and hence they longed many of them to see those things that we see , &c. instead of being a fleshly nation we are a holy 〈◊〉 , a holy city , a spiritual and holy temple , a royal priesthood , and holy ( not carnal ) church-members ; church-members by regeneration not by generation , not by the first birth , but by the new and second birth ; if we and our children have not the same priviledges don't let us complain , whereas god hath been more rich and bountiful to us , we and our children sit under the clear and glorious revelation and ministration of the gospel , can we or ours be losers by this change ? alas ! as far as christ excels moses and aaron , the gospel the law , the antitype the type , the spiritual birth the carnal , the extent of all nations the confines of judea ; so far , saith one are we better and not worse , and our priviledges not lesser but far greater ; our children have great advantages in having such parents and ministers to instruct them , to pray for them , and to set before them a good example ; besides , as soon as capable , they with others have the gospel preached clearly to them , and grace offered and tendered universally to all far and near , with ho , every one that thirsteth , come ye to the waters , &c. isa . 55. 1. the spirit also is in a glorious manner communicated , to inable them and others to believe now in the gospel-days . the law was hard , do this , and live ; and circumcision laid them under a bond to do and keep all that god in his law required , yea and under a curse if they continued not in all things that were there injoyned , which brought them into miserable bondage and captivity ; but now 't is but to believe , and thou shalt be saved : the spirit saith , the scripture was not yet given — to wit , in that manner nor measure as afterwards , because christ was not yet glorified . so that it is no absurdity to grant that the jews might have priviledges in some things more than we ; and yet our case and condition with our children , to speak simply , better than theirs , tho the covenant of grace is not enlarged nor lessened in respect of the substance of it ; the promises of grace are still belonging to the elect , to those that were given to christ , to believers , and to no other , nor never were ; but the priviledges we have above them do abundantly recompence the defect of those priviledges of theirs , whether real or supposed : and the truth is , priviledges are so arbitrary and various , depending so much upon the soveraignty of god , that he gives them as he thinks good , and oft-times takes them away without assigning any special reason of it ; so that no arguments can be drawn safely , as our brethren do , viz. god gave such a priviledg to the jews , therefore we must have such a priviledg too , except we can prove it is god's will it should be so . this argument therefore is of no force , without an institution , here we are again , and here we will stand ; circumcision wholly depended upon a positive law ; 't is in vain therefore to attempt to prove , that because the jews had a priviledg to circumcise their children , therefore we must have a priviledg to baptize our infants , sith they had a command to do what they did , and we have none ; besides , we have shewed there is no scripture that proves the baptism of infants is a priviledg granted by the lord in lieu of circumcision , it being indeed no duty or priviledg at all . lastly , before i close with this , take what mr. danvers says , if it should be taken ( saith he ) for granted , that circumcision was a seal of the new covenant belonging to all the children of israel ; then would not the baptizing of the children of believers answer it , neither amount to so great a priviledg , nor be equivalent to it for these reasons : 1st , there were all the families and tribes of israel ( and all proselyted strangers ) with their children , without distinction of good or bad , to be circumcisied : but here only one of a city , and two of a tribe ; for believers are but thin sown , and the children of unbelievers and wicked men are to receive no such benefit in the judgment of many . and , 2dly , you would be very short in another respect , as being at an utter uncertainty when you have a right subject ; for if the parent is an hypocrite , or no elect person , which is out of your reach to understand , you cannot know whether the child be fit for baptism ; for the seed of a wicked man you must not meddle with by any means ; whereas there was not the least doubt or scruple in israel as to the subject , for the father being one of abraham's seed and circumcised , it was an infallible mark they were right . and , 3dly , neither can the child when he is grown up have any certain knowledg that such a ceremony had past upon him in infancy , he having no infallible mark thereof ; whereas the circumcised infant had an infallible character and mark in his flesh , to assure him that he had received that rite . object . but what hope can we have of our infants if they must not be admitted unto christian baptism , nor reputed as members of the common body and church of the faithful ? answ . we answer ; first , if the hope of the parent for the child's salvation be grounded upon the administration of an external rite or ordinance in infancy , then neither had the patriarchs for above two thousand years any hope of their children , sith they had neither circumcision , baptism , nor any other external rite , which we find otherwise by noah's prophecy , gen. 9. 26 , 27. secondly , we ask , whether god hath left it in the power of the parent to save or destroy the soul of his child , which your doctrine doth import ? thirdly , we demand what hopes are intended , and by what scriptures the same are annexed to the administration of an ordinance in infancy ? fourthly , we do say there is a ground of hope in believers in behalf of their children , which is grounded upon plain scripture without baptizing them . fifthly , doth baptism confer grace or regenerate the child ? though some have ignorantly asserted that , yet we find many of you of another mind . sixthly , this argument seems to carry in it this conclusion , i. e. that christian people by infants baptism are assured according to gospel-grounds of the salvation of their children : but there is no proof for it , it is but a fancy , and we suppose 't is not received as a truth by many that oppose us in this point . chap. xi . wherein many other pretended scripture-poofs and arguments for the baptizing of infants are answered , as that , suffer little children to come unto me , &c. and , except a man be born of water and of the spirit , he cannot see the kingdom of god , &c. the next main proof that is brought for infant-baptism , is taken from mat. 19. 14. suffer little children , and forbid them not to come unto me : for of such is the kingdom of heaven . object . the kingdom of heaven belongs to infants , which is the greater ; therefore , say you , baptism belongs to them also , which is the lesser . answ . 1. that the kingdom of heaven belongs to little children we have no cause to doubt : but that they have a right to baptism therefore , is deny'd ; may not our brethren infer from the greater to the lesser thus as well , viz. infants belong to the kingdom of heaven , which is the greater ; thererefore to them belongeth the lord's supper , which is the lesser : and sure we are , that those who are fit subjects of baptism ought not to be deny'd the sacrament of bread and wine . how often must we tell you that baptism wholly depends , as to subject , time , end , and manner of administration , on the words of institution ? 't is a positive law , we must go to the pleasure , and will , and design of the law-maker : what may not men infer after this sort ? 2. were these little children be ye sure the children of believers ? if you can't prove this , what signifies all you say ? and how this can be made appear i see not ; for though christ was then in the coast of judea , yet that they were children of godly parents is a great question . 3. if it should be granted they were believers children , yet it doth not appear how little these children were , we have no account of their age. and as the learned observe , the greek work doth not always signify a little child or infant , as appears by 2 tim. 3. 15. where the same word is used , they might be such who might be capable of teaching as far as we know . but since dr. jer. taylor , bishop of down , hath so fully answered this objection , pray take what he saith upon the place . from the action of christ's blessing infants , saith he , to infer that they were baptized , proves nothing so much , as there is a want of better arguments : for the conclusion would with more probability be derived thus , i. e. christ blessed children and so dismissed them , but baptized them not , therefore infants are not to be baptized . but let this be as weak as its enemy , yet that christ did not baptize them , is an argument sufficient , that he hath other ways of bringing them to heaven than by baptism ; he passed an act of grace upon them by benediction and imposition of hands . and therefore although neither infants , nor any man , in p●ris naturalibus , can attain to a supernatural end without the addition of some instrument , or means of god's appointing , ordinarily and regularly ; yet where god hath not appointed a rule nor an order , as in the case of infants we contend he hath not , the argument is invalid . and as we are sure god hath not commanded infants to be baptized ; so we are sure god will do them no injustice , nor damn them for what they cannot help , viz. if the parents baptize them not . many thousand ways there are , by which god can bring any reasonable soul to him ; but nothing is more unreasonable than because he hath tied all men of years and discretion to this way , therefore we of our own heads shall carry infants to him that way , without his directions : the conceit is poor and low , and the action consequent to it is bold and venturous ; let him do what he please with infants , we must not . thus far the doctor . a second scripture brought formerly by doctor featly , and of late by divers others , is that in joh. 3. 5. except a man be born again of water and of the spirit , he cannot enter into the kingdom of god. object . there is no other way to regenerate and save infants but by this of baptism , and so to add them to the church , therefore they ought to be baptized . in some , saith mr. isaac ambrose , the new birth is wrought before baptism , as in the eun●●h , &c. in others is the new birth wrought in baptism , 〈◊〉 indeed is the sacrament of the new birth , and sea● of regeneration , but howsoever in pedo-baptism , we see the outward seal , yet we seel not the manner of the inward working , for this also is the secret of the spirit . answ . there is no pretended proof for infant-baptism brought by the asserters of it , that i wonder at more than this , especially considering how fully and excellently they are detected by several able men of their own party , yet notwithstanding it seems to abide as a standing doctrine in the national church , as witness their catechism — baptism , wherein i was made a member of christ , a child of god , and an inheritor of the kingdom of heaven . pray see how excellently the late famous stephen charnock detects this error ; it is not , saith he , external baptism ( speaking of regeneration ) many men take baptism for regeneration , the ancients usually give it this term : one calls our saviour's baptism his regeneration — this confers not grace , but engageth to it : outward water cannot convey inward life . how can water , an external thing , work upon the soul in a physical manner ? neither can it be proved , that ever the spirit of god is ty'd by any promise , to apply himself to the soul in a gracious operation , when water is applyed to the body . if it were so , that all that were baptized were regenerated , then all that were baptized should be saved , or else the doctrine of perseverance falls to the ground . baptism is a means of conveying this grace , when the spirit is pleased to operate with it ; but it doth not work as a physical cause upon the soul as a ●rge doth upon the humours of the body : for 't is the sacrament of regeneration , as the lord's-supper is of nourishment . as a man cannot be said to be nourished without faith , so he cannot be said to be a new creature without faith : put the most delicious meat into the mouth of a dead man , you do not nourish him , because he wants a principle of life to concoct or digest it . faith only is the principle of spiritual life , and the principle which draws nourishment from the means of god's appointment . some indeed say , that regeneration is conferred in baptism upon the elect , and exerts it self afterwards in conversion ; but how so active a principle as a spiritual life , should lie dead and asleep so long , even many years , which intervene between baptism and conversion , is not easily conceivable . thus far mr. charnock : others we find to agree with him herein . amesius saith , outward baptism cannot be a physical instrument of infusing grace , because it hath it not in any wise in it self . our late annotators agree directly with these ; nay , dr. owen saith , that the father of lies himself could not well have invented a more pernicious opinion , or which might pour in a more deadly poyson into the minds of sinners . if baptism were meant here , then no man can be saved without being baptized . but none does the business better than the learned bishop taylor ; for , saith he , the water and spirit in this place , signifies the same thing ; and by water is meant the effects of the spirit cleansing and purifying the soul , as it appears in its parallel place , christ's baptizing with the holy ghost and with fire : for although this was literally fulfilled in the day of pentecost ; yet morally there is more in it ; for it is the sign of the effect of the holy spirit , and his productions upon the soul : and you may as well conclude , that infants must also pass through the fire , as through the water . and that we may not think this a trick to elude the pressure of this place , peter saith the same thing : for where he saith that baptism saves us , he adds by way of explication ( not the washing away of the filth of the flesh , but the answer of a good conscience towards god ) plainly saying that it is not water , or the purifying of the body , but cleansing of the spirit that doth that which is supposed to be the effect of baptism . but to suppose it meant of external baptism , yet this no more infers a necessity of infant-baptism , than the other words of christ infer a necessity to give them the holy communion , joh. 6. 53. except ye eat the flesh of the son of man , and drink his blood , ye have no life in you ; and yet we do not think these words a sufficient argument to communicate with them : if any man therefore will do us justice , either let them give both sacraments to infunts , as some ages of the church did , or neither : for the wit of man is not able to shew a disparity in the sanction , or in the energy of its expressions . and therefore they were honest that understood the obligation to be parallel , and performed it accordingly ; and yet because we say they were deceived in one instance , and yet the obligation ( all the world cannot reasonably say but ) is the same they are honest and reasonable that do neither : and sure the ancient church did with an equal opinion of necessity give them the communion , and yet now adays men do not ; why should men be more burdened with a prejudice and a name of obliquity for not giving infants one sacrament , more than you are disliked for not affording them the other ? thus far dr. taylor . if what these great men say is not sufficient utterly to invalidate this pretended proof of infant-baptism , we know not what to say . a third proof they bring to prove the baptizing of babes , is taken from those places that speak of the baptizing of whole housholds , as the jaylor and his house , lydia and her house , &c. object . whole housholds we read were baptized , therefore some children were in the primitive time baptized . answ . to which we answer , that the consequence is not natural from the antecedent , unless you can prove there were no whole housholds but in which were some little babes ; make that appear , and this is the best argument you can bring . — but the contrary is very evident ; for how many hundred housholds or families are there in this city in which there are no little children , but all adult persons ? which being so ▪ how uncertain is your inference ? secondly , but suppose there were children in those housholds ( for usually in scripture by a figure which is called syn●●doche ) the whole is put for part , or a part for the whole . hence we read jerusalem , and all judea , and all the regions about ●ordan went out to be baptized of john ; that is , many of those places in jerusalem , judea , and in those regions . so 't is said , 1 sam. 1. 21 , 22 , 23. that elkanah , and all his house went up to offer unto the lord yearly sacrifice , &c. yet , vers . 22. 't is as expresly said , that hannah and her child went not up , who were part of his house , yet 't is said all his house ( or houshold ) went up . exod. 9. 6. 't is said , all the cattle of egypt died , that is , all that were in the field , see chap. 14. 26 , 28. and chap. 9. 26. i could give you many other examples of the same nature wherein the whole is taken but for part ; and from hence 't is that dr. hammond grants , that no concluding argument can be deduc'd from the baptizing whole housholds , to baptize children ; and therefore , in his judgment , arguments drawn from hence are better wav'd , than made use of by the defenders of infant-baptism . and certainly the doctor judges but rationally therein ( saith a worthy and learn'd man ) because a clear word of institution ( or plain precedents ) ought to be the ground of the practice of all gospel-ordinances , especially in the case of baptism , one of the great sacraments of the new testaments . thirdly , we will see in the next place what the holy ghost hath left on record concerning those whole housholds that are said to be baptized . first , the jaylor's houshold , acts 16. 33. he was baptized , and all his . whether he had any children 't is a great question ; [ his ] may refer to his wife , servants , and domestick friends and relations , &c. however , 't is expresly said , that paul and silas spake unto him the word of the lord , and to all that were in his house ; certainly they did not preach to little babes : and , vers . 34. 't is said , he rejoiced , believeng in god with all his house . observe , ( 1. ) he and all his house had the gospel preached to them . ( 2. ) he and all his house believed : and ( 3. ) he and all his house rejoiced ; as well as 't is said , he and all his were baptized . can there be any reason given , saith mr. gosnold , why [ his ] vers . 33. should be larger than [ all his house ] vers . 32 , 34. these two verses being a key to the 33d verse , ( saith he ) and this houshold a key to all the other ? the second houshold is that of crispus , acts 18. 8. and crispus the chief ruler of the synagogue , believed in god with all his house : and many of the corinthians , hearing , believed , and were baptized . all that is said of his houshold , is , that they believed ; besides , the scope of the text shews , none were baptized , but such who first believed ; and they , we say , and none but they , are true subjects of baptism , that believe . the third houshold , is the houshold of stephanus ; i baptized , saith paul , the houshold of stephanus , 1 cor. 1. 16. and , he saith , the house of stephanus was the first fruits of acaia , and that they had addicted themselves to the ministry of the saints , which little children were not capable to do , chap. 16. 15. the fourth houshold is that of lydia , acts 16. 14 , 15. whether this good woman was a maid , widow , or wife , is uncertain : if she had been a married woman , 't is much there is no mention made of her husband : besides , she is reckon'd the head of the family [ her ] houshold ; which would not have been , saith mr. gosnold , if at this time she had a husband . grant , saith he , she were a widow , yet she might have no children ; or if any , they might be grown up ; and to such children we deny not baptism upon profession of faith. besides , she was at this time from her own dwelling , and that many miles distant , for she was of the city of thyatira ; but now was at the city of philippi , where she was a merchandizing , being a seller of purple . grant she had children , how unlikely a matter is it , saith he , that she should carry them about with her , trading so many miles distant ? but , finally , to resolve the doubt , the last verse of this chapter , calls them of the house of lydia brethren ; they entred into the house of lydia ; and when they had 〈◊〉 the brethren , they comforted them , and departed . who now can conclude rationally , that any children were in any of these housholds ? 't is a ha●d case men are forc'd to fly to such weak and unlikely grounds to prove their practice ; but as the proverb goes , a poor shift is better than none at all . the next proof they bring to prove infant-baptism , is from acts 2. 39. the promise is to you , and to your children , &c. the pedo baptists would sain have this promise to be a promise of external priviledg , and such as gives children of believers a right to baptism : but that there is no such thing in the least to be proved from this place , we shall make appear by opening the text. first , 't is evident that peter preach'd this sermon to the jews , and to many of them who had a hand in mur●hering the lord of life and glory : and this he laid home , and prest upon their consciences very close ; and they being prick'd in their hearts , cried out , men and brethren , what shall we do ? if it be thus , we are lost men and undone . no : as if peter should say , do not dispair , upon your repentance there is mercy for you . then said peter unto them , repent , and be baptized every one of you , for the remission of sins , and ye shall receive the gift of the holy spirit — for the promise is unto you . ay , this is good news indeed , they might say ; but what will become of our children , our off-spring ? for we have wish'd that his blood might not only be upon our selves , but also upon our children . well , what tho ? let not this terrify you , neither as to drive you into despair ; for the promise is not only to you who repent , &c. but to your children , or off-spring also ; your posterity shall not be lost , for the promise is unto them as it is to you , viz. if they repent ; and not only to them of your race or posterity , but also to all that are afar off , meaning the gentiles , who were said to be sometimes afar off . but now if they would know who of their children , and those who were afar off , the promise was made unto : in the close of the verse , he resolves them in these words , even to as many as the lord our god shall call . the promise therefore here evident , is that of the spirit , and all the divine graces and blessings of it , which was promised , and first tendered unto the jews and their off-spring , upon unfeigned repentance , and turning to god ; or being effectually called and brought over , to close in with the tenders of mercy ; and then to the gentiles , who in like manner should be wrought upon , or effectually called : this promise was not made to their children , as believers seed , nor to them , or any other , uncalled by the lord , but with this express proviso , even so many as the lord our god shall call . which calling , or effectual work of grace upon their souls , made them capable subjects of baptism : nor are the words , to you and your children , mentioned as an acknowledgment of a priviledg to them above others , being abraham's seed according to the flesh , but by reason doubtless of their wish . mat. 27. 25. his blood he on us , and on our children . nor is there the least intimation given of a right to baptism to them , or their children , as the children of believers , but as an exhortation to them and theirs , to repent , and be baptized , as their duty , for their benefit and soul-advantage , the promise being not mentioned ; as though of it self it gave a title to baptism , either to them or their off-spring , without repentance . but as a motive , why both they and their children should actually repent , and be baptized , i. e. because in so doing , they would be in the way of obtaining remission of sin , and receive the holy spirit , the two grand branches of the promise here mentioned . which duty of repentance little children being not capable of performing , are not therefore according to this direction of the apostle the proper subjects of such an ordinance . by children , here saith , a learned man , is not meant their infants , but the posterity of the jews : and so dr. hammond grants it , and therefore confesseth this place a very unconcluding argument for infant-baptism . and , says he , though by children be here meant the posterity of the jews , yet not the natural or carnal seed neither , but the spiritual ; as appears by the last words in the verse , viz. even to as many as the lord our god shall call . so that it is very evident , that this text is grosly abused , by such as infer from hence a title to baptism , for children of believers , by virtue of a promise to them as such ; whereas it is manifest from the whole scope of the context , that it is only an incouragement to the jews against dispair , by reason of their crucifying the son of god , letting them know that yet there was hope of mercy and pardon for them and their children , upon the respective repentance of both , or either of them . and to the same purpose our late annotators i find give it , speaking of this text. a fifth pretended scripture-proof for infant-baptism , is taken from 1 cor. 7. 14. else were your children vnclean , but now are they holy. object . from hence 't is asserted , that the children of believers are holy with a federal or covenant-holiness , and therefore to be baptized . answ . to this we answer , that the same sort of holiness which is ascribed to the children , is to be understood in reference to the unbelieving husband , or the unbelieving wife , who are both said to be sanctified by their respective yoke-fellows ; which cannot be meant of a federal or a covenant-holiness , but that which is matrimonial : for if we must understand it of a covenant-holiness , then it will follow , that the unbelieving wife , or unbelieving husband may , upon the same ground lay claim to baptism as well as their children , which yet your selves will not grant . besides , it is evident from the words themselves , in which the term husband and wife are twice used , which shews , that the holiness is from the conjugal relation , and cannot be meant of any other than legitimation . and the term vnbeliever is also twice used , and said to be sanctified , which can have no other sence but this , that the unbelieving yoke-fellow is sanctified , or made meet in respect of conjugal use , to his or her yoke-fellow : and so though the one be an unbeliever , yet they might comfortably enough live together in lawful wedlock . see our late annotators ; i rather think ( say they ) it signifies brought into a state that the believer , without offence to the law of god , may continue in a married estate with such a yoke-fellow ; for else , saith the apostle , your children were unclean , that is , would be accounted illegitimate . but now this being determined , that the husband is thus sanctified to the wife , and the wife to the husband , though the one be an unbeliever , hence it follows , that your children are holy ; that is , lawfully begotten , which is the only sense opposite to the determination , ver . 12 , 13. it was , 't is plain , about this matter those saints at corinth wrote to the apostle , and therefore according to the scope of the place it cannot intend any thing else . and as for the use of the word holy for legitimate , that it is in this sense used else-where in the scripture is evident from mal. 2. 15. where a seed of god , or a godly seed , can be understood in no other sense than that of a lawful seed , in opposition to those born by polygamy . neither ought any man to infer federal holiness to be intended here , unless he can prove from some other text in the new testament any such holiness to be in children , i. e. because parents are believers and in the covenant of grace , their natural seed must therefore be so esteemed , and have the like right to gospel-baptism as the children under the law had to circumcision , which is no where to be found in all the new-testament , but the quite contrary , as has been proved ; and therefore this interpretation ought not to be admitted , but utterly to be rejected in regard of what the apostle peter asseres . how false and ridiculous therefore is that which mr. smythies hath lately affirmed : whensoever , saith he , god enters into covenant with the parent , he enters into covenant with the children of that parent ; that is , the children were included in the covenant , and the blessings of that covenant belonged to the children as well as to the parent . they that will build their faith upon such kind of men deserve to be deceived , who speak what they please , and prove nothing ; as if this was so because mr. smythies says it . i must charge it upon him as false doctrine , ( 1. ) as being quite contrary to the nature of the gospel-dispensation and constitution of the new testament-church , wherein the fleshly seed are rejected and cast out in respect of church-priviledges and ordinances . ( 2. ) what is this but to intail grace to nature , and regeneration to generation ? in opposition to what our saviour saith , john 3. 3. and paul , ephes . 2. 1 , 2. ( 3. ) it also contradicts all mens experience . how palpable is it that godly men have wicked children now adays as well as in former times ? what , wicked children , and yet in the covenant of grace ! or , were they in it , and are they now fallen out of it ? what a covenant then do you make that sure and everlasting covenant of grace to be ? besides , we have many learned men and commentators of our mind upon this text , as mr. danvers observes and ●uotes them . austin saith , it is to hold without doubting ; whatsoever that sanctification was , it was not of power to make christians and remit sins . ambrose upon this place , saith , the children are holy because they are born of lawful marriage . melancthon in his commentary upon this same text saith thus , therefore paul answers , that their marriages are not to be pulled asunder for their unlike opinions of god ; if the impious person do not cast away the other ; and for comfort he adds as a reason , the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the believing wife . meat is sanctified ; for that which is holy in use , that is , it is granted to believers from god ; so here he speaks of the use of marriage to be holy , and to be granted of god. things prohibited under the law , as swines flesh , and a woman in her pollution , were called unclean . the connexion of this , if the use of marriage should not please god , your children would be bastards , and so unclean : but your children are not bastards , therefore the use of the marriage pleaseth god : and how bastards were unclean in a peculiar manner the law shews , deut. 23. camtrarius in his commentary upon this place also saith , ( for the unbelieving husband hath been sanctified , an unusual change of the tense , that is ) sanctified in the lawful use of marriage ; for without this , saith he , it would be that their children should be unclean , that is , infamous and not legitimate , who so are holy , that is , during the marriage are without all blot of ignominy . erasmus saith likewise , infants born of such parents as one being a christian , the other not , are holy legitimately ; for the conversion of either wife or husband doth not dissolve the marriage which was made when both were unbelievers . what reason now had dr. featly and others to contemn this exposition of the text , considering what we and so many learned men have declared as touching this matter ? for a more fuller answer read mr. danvers , p. 166 , 167 , 168 , 169. but after all , should it be allowed that the holiness in this text is indeed to be taken for a faederal or covenant-holiness , yet we cannot therefore grant that this is a sufficient proof for infant-baptism ; for let the holiness be what it will , whether moral , faederal , or matrimonial , neither of these is any where assigned to be a ground of baptizing infants ; the institution , commission , and practice of the apostolical church being that alone that can warrant the same : 't is god's word only , not mens reason , conceited grounds and inferences , that can justify a practice , or make a gospel-ordinance ; if all therefore was granted which you affirm of the covenant made with abraham of circumcision and faederal-holiness , yet infant-baptism is gone , unless you can prove god hath from this ground commanded you to baptize your children , or that they were for this reason admitted to baptism in the apostles time ( for all your arguments from thence prove as strongly , that your infants may partake of the lord's-supper , &c. ) but that any thing less than a profession of faith and repentance is or can be a sufficient ground for baptizing any person , young or old , we do deny , sith the new testament is the only rule or perfect copy , by the authority of which we ought to act and perform all duties of instituted worship , and administer sacraments , &c. which are m●re positive precepts , and depend only upon the will and pleasure of the law-maker . so much to this pretended proof of infant-baptism . a sixth proof of infant-baptism is grounded upon mark 16. 16. he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved ; but he that believeth not , shall be damned . now they affirm that infants are believers , and therefore are to be baptized . mr. smythies says , infants are believers in a sense , or else they could not be saved , nor have right to the promises of christ in the gospel ; and if they are in any sense such believers as are intitled to salvation , they are such believers as have a right to baptism ; if the estate belongs to a child in the cradle , the indentures and seals of that estate belong to him likewise : the child of a believer may as well be called a believer , as the child of a proselyte was called a proselyte : if god gives children but the denomination of believers , it is sufficient to entitle them to baptism . thus mr. smythies . but how does it appear that infants are believers in any sense ? is there any argument or scripture brought by this man to prove them so to be ? if he can prove they have faith and do believe in christ , he will do more than all the men that ever lived on earth could do , i mean children , as such in common and in an ordinary way , to be believers . true , nothing is too hard for god to do : he that can make an ass to speak , can as well cause a babe to believe : but how does it appear god has given them either the habit of faith , or the act of faith , or faith in any sense to render them to be believers ? but 't is intimated they are believers by their parents faith : why may not their parents baptism serve as well as their parents faith , and they receive the lord's supper for them in their names also , and that be imputed to the children by virtue of their parents faith ? and what though the estate belongs to the child in the cradle , together with the indenture and seals of that estate ; is it required the child in the cradle should therefore set his seal to the indenture ? is that requisite , or would it make the estate the more firm or sure to him ? but when you can prove grace and salvation to be hereditary , and that the father's being a believer and a godly person , all his children must needs be such too , you do your business . secondly , but why do you say children must be believers , or else they can't be saved ? who told you so ? because faith in adult persons is required as necessary in them , if they are saved . can't god save poor infants without they also do believe ? has god told you he cannot , or will not save them except they believe ? i must confess i wonder at your ignorance and daring boldness : god , as dr. taylor observes , may have many ways to magnify his grace through jesus christ to them which we know not of ; and what have you to do with the secrets of god ? who made you one of his privy-council ? you may as well say , unless they repent they cannot be saved from christ's words , luk 13. 3 , 5. and that they must be obedient and take up the cross , for these things are required of adult persons that would be saved as well as believing . thirdly , prove that god has given children the denomination of believers ; or if it was granted he hath , would it therefore ●ollow they may be baptized ? certainly no , for we read of many who were said to believe * , they had some kind of faith , and so in some sense had the denomination of 〈◊〉 , and yet had no right to baptism , for such ought to have 〈◊〉 faith , or to believe with all their hearts , 〈◊〉 philip said to the eunuch , act. 8. who are fit subjects of that ordinance , or have a sufficient title to it : and would not that believing ( in any sense ) you speak of , that entitles them to salvation , give them as good a right to the lord's-supper as to baptism ? come , sir , you can't infer a right to an ordinance from what grounds you please . baptism depends wholly , i say again , upon the authority of a positive law , and express words of institution * ; and none but such who are made disciples by preaching , or who do actually believe , ought from thence to be baptized . i wonder what faith 't is you suppose to be in infants ? is it the faith of the church , as tho. aquinas asserts , which is intailed upon all within the pale thereof ? or is it an imputitive faith from the parents in covenant , as musculus and others maintain ? or , is it the faith of the gossip or surety , as many of your church say , i. e. others believe for them ? have they a justifying faith , as mr. baxter intimates ? or a dogmatical faith only , as in mr. blake's sense ? some , as mr. danvers observes , say 't is a physical , some a metaphysical , and some a hyperphysical faith. some say they are born believers , others say they are made believers by baptism . now when you tell us what faith they have , we shall the better understand you , and give you an answer . a personal and actual faith , saith dr. taylor , they have not , for they have no acts of understanding ; besides , how can any man know they have faith , since he never saw any sign 〈◊〉 , neither was he told so by any that could tell . secondly , saith he , some say they have imputative faith : but then so let the sacraments be too , that is , if they have the parents faith or the churches , then so let baptism be imputed also by derivation from them : and as in their mothers womb , and while they hang upon their mothers breasts , they live upon their mothers nourishment ; so they may upon the baptism of their parents , or their mother the church : for since faith is necessary to the susception of baptism ( and they themselves confess it , by striving to find out new kinds of faith to daub the matter ; ) such as the faith , such must be the sacrament : for there is no proportion between an actual sacrament , and an imputative faith , this being in immediate and necessary order to that . this saith the bishop . we know there are some argue stifly for infants having habitual faith ; but as the said doctor saith , are there any acts precedent , concomitant , or consequent to this pretended habit ? this strange invention , saith he , is absolutely without art , without scripture , reason , or authority . but the men are to be excused , unless they had any better arguments to defend their practice ; they are forc'd to confess the truth in the main , viz. that faith is required of persons to be baptized , and therefore they do what they can to prove infants do believe . but i will conclude this with what the said doctor further saith , and if any man runs for succour to that exploded cresphugeton , that infants have faith , or any other inspired habit of i know not what , or how , we desire no more advantage than that they are constrained to answer without revelation against reason , common sense , and all the experience in the world. chap. xii . containing an answer to several other arguments brought for infant-baptism . object . 1. though there is no plain scriptures for infant-baptism , yet it may be proved by consequences ; you , it appears , deny direct consequences from scripture to be mandatory , and so obliging , and of divine authority . answ . we affirm , that in all positive or instituted worship ( such as baptism is ) which wholly depends upon the meer ▪ will and pleasure of the law-giver , it is absolutely necessary there should be an express command , or plain and clear examples , tho in other respects we allow of natural deductions and consequences from scripture for the confirming and enforcing of duties , and for the comfort and instruction of god's people . but as there is neither express command nor example for infant-baptism ; so it can't be proved by any consequence or inference , that naturally and 〈◊〉 r●●s from any scripture , as we have proved , nor does draw any such consequences to prove it . object . 2. but there is nothing in all the new t●stament against infant-baptism , saith 〈◊〉 ▪ smythies . if indeed our saviour had declared that infants should not be baptized , or if we had read of the apostles refusal of them ; then , &c. there is no hint from any express word dropt from christ , saith mr. sidenham , or his apostles , nor any phrase which doth forbid such an act. answ . we will answer with tertullian : for this is a certain rule , saith he , if it be said 't is lawful because the scripture doth not forbid it ; it may equally be retorted , it is therefore not lawful , because the scripture doth not command it . that which is done in the worship and service of god without any express word dropt from christ or his apostles , nor any phrase which doth signify it is his will and mind it ought to be done , is unlawful and no better than will-worship . must christ forbid infant-baptism ? must he declare in plain words they ought not to be baptized , or else may they , ought they to be baptized ? is this good divinity with mr. smythies ? certainly this man can't long keep out of the romish communion : hath our saviour declared indeed that you shall not have crucifixes , beads , altars , and that you shall not use salt , spittle , oil , or chrism in baptism ? that ye shall not go on pilgrimages , nor pray for the dead ? hath christ , i say , or his apostles , as you read , forbid these things , and many more of like nature ? or , did god forbid nadab and abihu to offer strange fire , who were destroyed for doing it ? levit. 10. 1 , 2. did god forbid abraham to circumcise his female children , or forbid him to circumcise his male children on the ninth day ? and might he therefore do these things — because god did no where tell him he should not do so ? the like might be said concerning bowing at the naming of the name of jesus , cross in baptism , surplice in reading the service , kneeling at the sacrament , set forms of prayer ; you do these things because not forbidden , and why not admit of other rites and innovations as well as these ? moreover , what express word against infants receiving the sacraments ? besides , are bells forbidden to be baptized ? hath christ said indeed , ye shall not baptize bells ? is it therefore lawful to baptize them ? you will object , may be that bells are not ●it nor capable subjects of such an ordinance ? but why are they not ? wherein are they uncapable ? can you not sprinkle a little water upon a bell , and use the words of institution in as solemn a manner as you do when you sprinkle a child ( baptize it as you say ) ? but are they uncapable because there is no word of institution , nothing from the mouth of christ or his apostles , to justifie such a practice ? we say the same in respect of your baptizing children ; and if you say , bells are not capable of the use and end of baptism ; we have proved the like concerning infants . if god had pleased , he could have made them by an institution capable of some sacred usefulness , yea capable of relative holiness or consecration , as aaron's bells ; nay , and since we read of bells of the horses that should be holiness to the lord , zech. 14. 20. why may not that text be a proof that bells in churches should be baptized , and so made holy likewise ? there are those you know who plead for that practice ( and have baptized them for many ages ) and they say there is as much ground from scripture to do that , as there is to 〈◊〉 children , both depending , as they will tell you , upon the authority of the church . sad it is that such a gap as this should be opened to all or any inventions or traditions of men : remember who it was that said , add thou not to his word . that god has in all ages testified his abhorrence of will-worship , and that from this very reason , because he commanded them not : 't is evident they have built the high places of tophet , &c. which i commanded them not , neither came it into my heart . for this cause god threatned judgments upon israel ; they have set their threshold by my thresholds , and their post by my posts , wherefore i have consumed them . god discovers his severe displeasure against them , not for neglecting any part of his worship that he had commanded them , but for their presumption in adding other things thereto , calling them his ordinances , which he had not appointed nor commanded them . will-worship ( sir ) is an horrible sin , when he who is to perform the duty shall dare to appoint the laws : implying a peremptory purpose of no further observance , than may consist with the allowance of his own depraved judgment and self-interest ; whereas true obedience must be grounded on the authority of that power that commands not the liking or approbation of the subject . some men will obey so far as it consists with their interest , and alter , add to , or diminish from , as they see good . 1. this savours of horrible pride : shall man prescribe unto god ways how he shall be worshipped ? 2. moreover , this of will-worship was that very sin that overthrew the nation of israel ; see isa . 24. 5 , 〈…〉 the ordinances , &c. 3. and it also is said to wound the heart of god , ezek. 6. 9. namely , their superstitious and corrupt mixtures in his worship . and , 4. this renders the service of men abominable , when they make void the commands of god by their traditions , and all they do to be in vain , for so saith our saviour , in vain they worship me , teaching for doctrine the commandments of men. object . 3. but is it to be imagined , saith mr. smythies , that our saviour , who took little children up in his arms , should allow no ordinance for them by which they should be admitted into his church ? answ . must he needs baptize them because he took them up in his arms ? and because he blessed them , must he receive them into his church ? we have proved that they are not capable subjects of gospel-church-membership , neither did our saviour baptize any with his own hands , joh. 4. 1 , 2. therefore not those children he took up into his arms ; nor is this any proof in the least , i. e. that christ must allow them an ordinance , because he shewed them the favour to take them up into his arms. 't is said he look'd upon the young man , and loved him ; must he therefore make him a member of his church , whether he was sitly qualified for it or no ? christ shewed many great favours unto divers persons , that we do not read he admitted into his church . he may shew one favour to you , and yet deny you another which you may not be capable of receiving . young children , saith luther , hear not , nor understand the word of god , out of which faith cometh ; and therefore if the commandment be followed , children ought not to be baptized . besides , they might be children able to receive instruction as far as you know , for such we take some times up into our arms. tertulllan , speaking of this place , saith , indeed the lord said , do not ye hinder them to come unto me , let them come therefore , while they grow to years , let them come while they learn , and while come , let them be taught ; let them become christians , when they are able to know christ : why doth innocent age hasten to the remission of sins ? men will deal more w●rily in worldly assairs ; so that they who are not trusted with an earthly inheritance are trusted with an heavenly one ; let them ask for salvation that thou mayst appear to have given it to him . see our further answer to this text , coap . 9. object . 4. but infants were commonly baptized before . how can we , saith mr. smythies , imagine that our saviour sent to baptize nations in which infants before had commonly been baptized , and yet intend they should be excluded ? answ . this is a new kind of argument , but proves nothing . for first , 't is denied that infants by any command of god were ever baptized in any nation , no not amongst the jews , much less among the gentile nations ; but if they had been baptized before , he might as well have in●erred ( and much better ) infants right to the sacrament of the lord's supper , and have said , can we imagine christ would have excluded them from that , considering they were before admitted to the passeover ( which there is no great cause to question . ) but secondly , we reason thus ; if they were before baptized , either they were baptized as it was a jewish rite and custom , or else as an heathenish one : if baptism of infants before was a jewish rite , it was either appointed of god , or else a tradition of their own : if it was a tradition of their own , can you suppose our saviour would go about to own and establish a jewish innovation , or one of their human traditions ? and if it were an appointment of god , it is very much that no man ever found it out before in all the old testament . but thirdly , if there had been any such legal ordinance , it had been abrogated , with all other jewish ceremonies , which stood ( as the apostle shews ) in meats and drinks , and divers washings , and carnal ordinances imposed on them until the time of reformation . all those divers washings that were under the law it is evident ceased in the establishment of the new testament ; and therefore how abominable false is that which mr. smythies says concerning gospel-baptism ? object . 5. our saviour , ( says he pag. 88. ) took this ordinance from the custom of the jews , who were wont to baptize those who forsook heathenism and embraced the true religion . and whensoever they made proselytes , they did not only baptize the parent , but the child likewise . answ . did any man assert till now the baptism of christ to be a legal rite , or rather that it sprung from human tradition ? for 't is evident the jews were not required to baptize them by any appointment of god : for circumcision was the rite by which proselytes ( who were males ) were added to the jewish church . besides , doth not our saviour plainly intimate , that john's baptism was directly from heaven , and not of men ? and if baptism had been so frequently practised amongst the jews , wherefore did they say to john , why dost thou baptize , if thou art not that christ , nor elias ? joh. 1. 25. but doth not christ say , that the doctrine he taught , he received from the father who sent him ? not from moses nor the jews : i have not spoken ( saith he ) of my self ; but the father which sent me , gave me commandment what i should say , and what i should speak . now baptism is positively called a principle of his doctrine , it was he that instituted it and gave it forth , mat. 28. 19 , 20. as a pure gospel-ordinance , as the alone soveraign lord and law-giver of his church . moreover , if all those divers washings and carnal ordinances amongst the jews are abolished , as you heard before ; how came this supposed jewish rite to escape ? these things considered , we may perceive 't is ignorance through tradition that makes a pedo-baptist , or rather a no-baptist , and not ignorance ( as he affirms ) through length of time that makes an anabaptist ( falsly so called ) pag. 91. but 't is the knowledg of god's word , through the help of the spirit , by which they , whom he so calls , come to cast off that unwritten tradition of babes rantism , and to own no baptism but that which christ hath commanded , and was practised in the apostolical church . and whereas he affirms the baptizing of children was all along used in the primitive church by the holy martyrs , &c. we answer , it was never practised till the church came to adulterate the holy institutions of christ , and fell away to error and superstition . for , saith curcellaeus , in the two first centuries after christ , infant-baptism was altogether unknown ; but in the third and fourth it was allowed by some few ; in the fifth and following ages , it was generally received into custom . and if the custom of the church is enough to justify infant-baptism , it will oblige us as to receive many other traditions or ceremonies likewise . object . 6. but there are divers very learned men who hold infant-baptism . answ . and are there not many very learned men who are against baptizing them ? who say 't is an invention of men and no ordinance of jesus christ ? besides , were not the pharisees and lawyers learned men , who rejected the counsel of god against themselves , being not baptized ? god's purpose is to confound the wisdom of man. if learning once comes to be made an idol of , god may leave those learned men to themselves , and let them grope in mid-day as in the night , notwithstanding all their light , knowledg , and learning . besides , there are learned men of all opinions , many learned cardinals , priests , and jesuits in the church of rome , yet you will not make that an argument to believe transubstantiation , and other errors maintained by them . object . 6. but there are many very holy and pious men , yea pastors of churches , that are for the baptizing of little infants ▪ nay , and why should so few learned men be of your way if it were a truth , for most speak against those of your perswasion ? answ . 1. the more cause of grief . but what though i must tell you god's word is to be your guide , and not men : every man must give an account to god for himself . moreover , some godly men who have had great light , and were glorious reformers too in their day , yet lay short of some great things and duties ; as jehosaphat , &c. who did not remove nor pull down the high places . 2. light and knowledg of divine truths have broken forth gradually . when reformation first begun , those godly men laboured to restore the doctrinal part of the gospel , and yet great corruptions remained in point of discipline ( which errors god hath since by degrees discovered . ) 3. had the best and late reformers ( for such you will find at last the baptists to be in point of the administrations of god's house and holy temple ) been generally learned men , 't is very like this truth would have been more readily received among such ( i mean learned persons ) than we see now it is , so hard a thing is self-denial . 4. moreover , the base reproaches cast upon the true way of baptizing , hath doubtless laid a great many of good men under temptations , there being hardly any one truth that has been rendered more odious and contemptible than baptizing , ( i e. dipping of men and women in water ) tho 't is generally acknowledged by all , that no other action then that was practised in the gospel-days in the administration of this ordinance . 5. some say those errors or unsound principles ( as i look upon them to be ) maintained by divers baptists ( who i doubt not are godly christians ) have likewise hindred the reception and promulgation of this blessed gospel-institution among many worthy persons , and kept them may be from indeavouring their satisfaction herein ; tho 't is strange that should be a stumbling block to any , sith there were many christians in the apostles times , who in many things did dissent and differ ( in as great matters ) one from another : besides , there are men almost of all perswasions that hold those very principles . 6. others think the remisness of some of the baptized churches about taking care of their ministers hath contributed something to it also : for nothing lies more clear in god's word , than that those who preach the gospel , should live of the gospel ; yea , have a comfortable maintenance , i. e. that they may be wholly sequestred to the work of the ministry ( and be in a capacity to give to others , and so shew themselves examples in hospitality ) ; and that their poor wives and children after their decease , may not be exposed to want and poverty . but i am glad to see it , our churches are now daily enlightned into this indispensable duty , and do endeavour to reform accordingly ; and would they also labour to follow the primitive saints in singing of psalms , and hymns , and spiritual songs * , i do not doubt but it would add to their comfort and glory , and many more than now do would joyn with us † . 7. but to proceed : be sure the examples of the best men under heaven will never be a plea sufficient for any in the day of judgment , in doing any thing in god's worship that he has not commanded ( or given grounds for the observation of ) or in their neglecting doing of that which he hath expresly required . shall any be allowed at the last day to plead thus , viz. such and such good men and able ministers did say this was a truth and my duty ? surely no. 8. when reformation is required of men in so great a case as this , viz. that which tends to the razing the whole constitution or standing of their church , which has been also of such a long continuation ; it calls for great resolution , courage , and self-denial , which is hard for some men to arrive at ; considering also what great persons and reformers have been on their side ; and they not seriously minding the words of the wise man , where he says , that the path of the just is as a shining light , that shineth more and more to the perfect day ; the church as it was then look'd out of the wilderness but as the morning , and but as fair ( comparatively ) as the moon ; but since ( blessed be god ) greater light hath broken forth , yea to such a degree that now she seems to be come forth as clear as the sun , &c. and sad it is to see men content themselves to walk only in that light those worthy christians had in the morning of the reformation , and refuse to follow and embrace a higher and more clear , and sun-sshining glory . they might be accepted then , since their day did not afford greater manifestations of truth in those respects ; but it may not excuse our brethren , nor may they be accepted in following them , sith truth is broke forth more perspicuously in these latter times . object . the people called anabaptists lie under great reproaches , as if you baptiz'd people naked . answ . 't is no more than our saviour foretold should befal his own people and faithful followers , they shall speak all manner of evil● against you falsty for my name sake , &c. i am not ignorant what odious lies and reproaches have been cast upon us in respect of baptizing men and women naked : whereas 't is notoriously known to be utterly false and abominable , which thousands can testify to the contrary , who are of different perswasions to us , who daily see persons of both sexes baptized by us , always in very comely and decent garments , provided on purpose upon that account . object . you have been formerly stigmatized and accused , as if you were against magistrates , or refuse to obey kings , and such as are in authority ; and refuse lawful oaths : what say you to the munster-story ? answ . these things our enemies know to be false and vile slanders , our confessions of faith from time to time do witness the contrary ; what people plead for subjection to government and magistrates which god has set over us , more than we always do ? and as touching that old munster-story of john of leyden , &c. they that read the best histories of that business , may find many things to be false which are charged against those anabaptists : besides , the story of them was either written ( as some have very well observed ) by the malicious papists , their old mortal enemies ; or else by envious protestants , who are willing to take up any base reports , and improve tho●e s●●ries to blast the reputation of the whole party . alas , i could here soon recite some writings of inveterated spirits , who have in as base a manner vilisied and calumniated the episcopals , nay and the presbyterians , and independents also , giving instances both in respect of their vile principles and practices . certainly 't is a shame for any good men to take up a charge against so great a party of godly christians from the venemous pens of such shameless persons . but suppose the munster-story as to matter of fact were true , and that some of those anabaptists were very ill men , and guilty of several immoral actions , and held great errors , yet how unreasonable and uncharitable a thing is it to render all those people of that perswasion in those times , and also since to be as bad and as like guilty ? especially considering that the principle and practice of baptizing believing men and women in it self is so harmless a thing , and no ways tends to lead persons to such evils ? for by the same rule might not the best and most holy church and people in the world , or ever were in the world , be censured and reproached , and neither the church of the jews , nor the gospel-church in the apostles days escape , sith in the first there were very ill persons , as chora , dathan , and abiram , and many others , and in the last a judas , a diatrophes , an incestuous person * , who was guilty of worse or more shameful fornication then what was amongst the gentiles , as the apostle affirms ? besides , as mr. danvers observes , those of the same opinion in former times are acknowledged to be godly and good men , or have an honourable character given them , and this too by the ample and authentick testimony from their greatest enemies ; he cites rai●trus , the bloody inquisitor of those in france , and baronius , and cassander of those in germany ; nay , and mr. baxter● himself , who , though he has been found free enough in his reproaches , yet to give him his due , is pleased to witness to our innocency in this nation , take his own words : saith he , that anabaptists are godly men that differ from us in a point so difficult , that many of the papists and prelatists have maintain'd , that it is not determined in the scripture , but dependeth upon tradition of the church : and i know as good and sober men of that mind , as of theirs who are most against them , &c. and again he saith , that augustin , and many children of christians were baptized at age ; and that the controversie is of so great difficulty , that if in all such cases none that differ be tolerated , we may not live together in the world or church , but endlesly excommunicate or prosecute one another . but blessed be god we need not the testimony of men , having the testimony of our own consciences ( which is our rejoycing ) as the apostle saith , that in simplicity and godly sincerity , not by fleshly wisdom , but by the grace of god , we have had our conversation in the world. tho there may be some of our communion who may be under guilt and gross enormities , and mistaken principles and notions , to our great grief and sorrow ( as well as amongst other communities of godly christians ) but charity will cover a multitude of faults . object . 8. but you lay too much stress upon baptism ? answ . what some may do , i know not , but i am sure generally , we lay no more stress upon it than we ought ; we say , it is a duty incumbent upon all believers — a holy ordinance of christ , one of the great sacraments of the new testament , and they that reject it , do reject part of the counsel of god. yet we do not lay such stress upon it , as some do upon infant baptism . we do not say , men cannot be saved , unless they be baptized ; provided they do not sin against their light and clear convictions of their own consciences . 't is evident there are those who have asserted , that infants that die unbaptized , shall not , cannot be saved ; which certainly is abominable to affirm : for were it our duty to baptize our children , yet can any think , that the omission of our duty to them herein , can exclude them the kingdom of heaven ? but 't is evident it is not required , they are not the subjects of it . object . 't is no where said , that women received the lords supper , yet 't is given to them : why may not infants be baptized as well , tho there is nothing mentioned of their being baptized in the scripture . answ . to this we answer , that there is ground enough from the scripture , for women who are baptized believers , to receive the lord's supper ; let a man examine himfelf , and so let him eat , saith the apostle , viz. man or woman . for so the greek word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifies . there is one mediator between god and man. is not woman as well as man intended there ? if there come into your assembly a man having a gold ring , &c. a double-minded man is unstable in all his ways . are not women as well as men , comprehended and meant in those places as well as men , tho not expressed ? 2. were not women as well as men ( who believed ) baptized ? were not women disciples , and commanded to be made discipline by the preaching of the gospel in the commission , as well as men ? and are not males and femals all o●● in christ jesus ? is not this a meer trifling vanity , and nought but a piece of foolery and deceit , to darken counsel with words without knowledg ? women were baptized ; we read of lydia , an honourable woman that was baptized . and when they heard this , 't is said , they were baptized both men and women . and they that were required to be baptized , and did partake of that ordinance , continued together in the apostles doctrine , and in fellowship , and in breaking of bread and prayer . this sufficiently proves women received the lord's supper . when shall we see the like proof for babes baptism ? were not women members of the chur●● ▪ and does not the holy supper belong to all ●●●●lar members thereof ? this objection seems to represent these men like a person almost drown'd , who catches hold of any little twig , or flag , to help him : but , brethren , these things will never do your business . object . if we have no scripture-example to baptize infants : no more have you for the baptizing such persons as you do baptize , viz. those of age , whose parents were baptized and educated from their youth in the christian religion ; for evident it is , those we read of in the new testament who were baptized , were such who were newly converted either from judaism , or paganism , to christianity . answ . what tho we have no example in the scripture of any besides such you speak of that were baptized , ( that ●eing the very beginning of that gospel-admini●●●ation ) yet is not the commission a perfect rule to succeeding ages , as well as it was to that present age ? evident it is that by virtue of the commission , none were to be baptized but such as are discipled , or first taught , before admitted to that ordinance . if the person be a believer , we have no ground to refuse him , because his parents were jews or heathens ; so we have no reason to receive others at all the more , because their parents were christians . 2. can you prove that difference as to the state of the parents ( in respect of what you speak of ) doth give you a warrantable ground to act contrary to the order and nature of the great commission ? matth. 28. 19 , 20. by the authority of which , the apostles did baptize ( and all ministers ought to administer the same ordinance to the end of the world. ) the nature and order of the commission cuts this objection to pieces : for if the person be a disciple , a believer , he is to be baptized , let his parents be jews , heathens , or christians , 't is all one . if you had the like grounds to baptize infants , we should contend no longer with you . 3. when you can prove the faith of the parents , or their subjection to the external rite of baptism , adds any spiritual advantage to their children , or such as gives them a right to baptism , we will give up the controversie . — object . but whereas you say , baptism was always done by dipping the body all over in water , how can that be , since some were baptized in houses ? answ . i answer , that is a fancy , a thing asserted without the least shadow of ground , tho no less men than our late worthy annotators seem to affirm this very thing ; for notwithstanding the jaylor , and those of his , were baptized the same hour of the night , &c. yet can any suppose they could not go out of the house so late ? might there not be a pond , or some river near ? whithersoever they went , or wheresoever it was done , it is no matter , they were baptized ; which has been sufficiently proved to be immersion , or dipping the body in water . object . but say what you will , the baptism of infants is of god ; for there was a multitude of children of old baptized to moses in the cloud , and in the sea. answ . we have shewed you that was but tropically called baptism ; and also that baptism is a pure new-testament ordinance ; tho 't is like that ( as some learned men have said ) might be a type of this ordinance , they being as it were buried or overwhelmed in the sea , and under the cloud . but if that may justifie infant baptism , it will allow you to baptize unbelievers also ; for there was a multitude of mixt people who went through the sea with israel , besides much cattel , and a mixt multitude went up also with them , and flocks , and herds , even very much cattel , exod. 12. 38. all these were doubtless baptized metaphorically and typically , as well us children under the cloud , and in the sea ; therefore this can be no proof for infant-baptism . chap. xiii . shewing the evil consequences , absurdities , and contradictions , that attend infant-baptism , as 't is asserted and practised . object . bvt what harm is there in baptizing of children ? is it not an innocent thing ? can it do the child any hurt ? answ . the harm will be to the parents and ministers , who do that in christ's name , which they have no authority from him to do . if it do any harm to infants , 't is not till they are grown up , and then it may be a means to blind their eyes , and cause some of them to conclude , they in baptism became the children of god , were regenerated , made christians , members of christ , and heirs of the kingdom of heaven ; and cause others to think they were then rightly baptized , and so to look after no other baptism . whereas , poor souls , they are all unbaptized persons , having never had any baptism at all but rantism . pray see what mr. danvers hath said upon this respect . 1. but is it no harm to alter christ's order in the commission , who requires faith and repentance to precede , or go before baptism ; or first to make them disciples by teaching , and then to baptize them ? and for men to invert this order as to baptize them , & then teach them repentance and faith , sure it must be an evil and hurtful thing so to do . 2. is it not an evil thing to change the true subjects of baptism , who are believing and understanding men , to ignorant babes , who neither know good nor evil ? 3. is it not an evil thing to frustrate the sacred and spiritual ends of baptism , which are many , as you have heard ; and by administring it to poor babes , render it wholly an insignificant thing ? 4. is it not an evil and a shameful thing to change baptism into rantism , from dipping the whole body , to sprinkling or pouring a little water upon the face , and to pronounce an untruth in the name of the lord , saying , i baptize thee in the name of the father , of the son , and holy spirit , you not doing the thing ? nor have any authority so to do , nor to baptize children at all , much less to sprinkle them . 5. is it not an evil and harmful thing , and a great error to say , baptism takes away original sin ? whereas nothing can do that , ( nor actual sin neither ) but the blood of christ . 6. is it not a foolish thing and a lye , to say , children have faith , and are disciples , who are not capable of understanding ? to assert a thing that no man has any ground to believe , nor can't , without offering violence to his reason ? 7. is it not a weak thing , to open a door into the church , which christ hath shut up ? 8. is it not weak and an absurd thing to say , that infants can't be saved except they be baptized , partly because christ saith , except a man be born again , he cannot see the kingdom of god , baptism , as some of you say , taking away original sin ? as if it were in the power , and at the will of the parents to save or damn their children . for this is intimated by this notion of yours ; if the parents or friends baptize the child , it shall ( if it die in its infancy ) be saved ; but if they , nor no other , indeavour to get it baptized , the child is lost , and must perish . — how can outward water , saith mr. charnock , convey inward-life ? how can water , a material thing , work upon the soul in a physical manner ? neither can it be proved , that ever the spirit of god is tied by any promise , to apply himself to the soul in its gracious operations , when the body is applied to the water . ( he says , water applied to the body . ) because the adult person ( who sat under the preaching of the word ) cannot be saved without regeneration . can't god save poor dying infants , unless the same change by the spirits operations pass upon them ? is not god a free agent ? may he not do what he pleases , and magnifie his grace to poor dying infants , through the blood of his son , in other ways than we know of ? do not secret things belong to him , what vanity is there in the minds of some men ? 8. has god ordained baptism to be an ordinance to save the souls of any persons , either the adult or infants ? is the opus operatum of baptism , think you , a likely way or means to beget or bring forth children to christ , or make disciples of them ? baptism signifies no thing ( it being but a sign ) where the inward grace signified by it is wanting . 9. is it not strange that you should say , that none but the children of believers ought to be baptized ? and that baptism is absolutely necessary to church-communion , or an initiating ordinance ? and yet commonly take into your churches , such persons ( that are converted ) whose parents were very wicked and ungodly persons as any in the parish , and so lived and died ( as far as you know ) ; and yet do you not account their baptism to ●e sufficient ? 10. is it not an hurtful and evil thing , to defile and p●lute the church , by bringing in the fleshy seed which christ hath cast out ? 11. is it not an evil and dangerous thing to lay a foundation of ignorance and prophaneness , and to confound the world and church together , which ought to be separated ? and to make the church national , which ought to be congregational ? 12. is it not an harmful and evil thing to establish human traditions , and make them of equal authority with christ's sacred institutions , and reproach them who will not against their consciences , do the same things ? 13. is it not an evil and harmful thing to plead for in●ant baptism , or rather rantism , and make it a bone of contention amongst christians , and so ●inder the unity of churches and godly christians ? for was that rubbish gone , what a glorious harmony would follow , even such a day as would make all our souls rejoyce ? for he is blind who can't see that that relick is the cause of our sad divisions ▪ 14. is it not an evil and false thing to say , persons may have grace and regeneration before they know god , or are called by his word and holy spirit ? 15. is it not a strange thing to say , persons may be visible and lawful members of the gospel-church before conversion ; and to deny them one sacrament , and yet give them another ? 16. is it not a false thing to say , persons may believe and be saved by the faith of others ? 17. is it not an evil thing and a contradiction to say , baptism is a symbol of present regeneration , and yet apply it to ignorant and unconverted babes , wholly uncapable of regeneration , in whom none of the things signified thereby , do , or can appear ? 18. is it not a false thing and a contradiction to say , that baptism is a lively figure of christ's death , burial , and resurrection , and yet do nothing but sprinkle , or pour a little water upon the face ; by which act , all must confess nothing of such things can thereby be represented ? 19. is it not a strange and foolish thing to say , baptism is an ordinance of the solemnization of the souls marriage with christ , and to say , 't is a strange marriage where nothing is professed of a consent ; and yet administer it to babes wholly uncapable so to do ? 20. is it not a foolish thing to cry out against traditions , and all inventions of men , and yet strive to uphold and maintain them ? and doth not these things hinder that glorious reformation we all long for , and encourage papists ? 21. is it not strange men should say , all the children of believersare in covenant , and that there is no falling from a state of grace ; but that the new covenant is so well ordered in all things , and sure , that it will secure all that are indeed in it unto eternal life ; and yet many of these children , who they say , were in this covenant , perish in their sins , dying unregenerate ? 22. we will conclude this chapter , as mr. danvers does with the words of dr. taylor . and therefore , saith he , whoever will pertinaciously persist in his opinion of pedo-baptism , and practise it accordingly , they pollute the blood of the everlasting covenant ; they dishonour and make a pagentry of the sacrament ; they ineffectually represent a sepulchre into the death of christ , and please themselves in a sing without effect : making baptism like the fig-tree in the gospel , full of leaves , but no fruit. and they invocate the holy ghost in vain , doing as if one should call upon him to illuminate a stone or a tree . chap. xiv . proving baptism a great and glorious ordinance , and that 't is initiating or an in-let into the church . the last thing i shall do , is to prove believers baptism a very great and glorious ordinance , though much despised by men , nay by many professors of this age. first of all , 't is a principle of christ's doctrine , nay , a foundation-principle , viz. of a true gospel-church-state ; so that according to the apostolical and primitive-institution , a church cannot be truly gathered without it . secondly , it appears to be a great ordinance , if we consider the commission of christ . 1. consider with what authority our saviour gave it forth ; all power is given to me in heaven and earth : go ye therefore , teach all nations , baptizing them , &c. 2. in that it was one of the last things he gave in charge to his disciples before he went to heaven . and , 3. in that he joyns it to teaching , expressing no other gospel-ordinances besides , though he gave other commandments to them , act. 1. 4. in that no ordinance is to be administred in a more solemn manner than this is , viz. in the name of the father , and of the son , and of the holy spirit . we are hereby obliged to believe in , adore , and worship the whole trinity . thirdly , no ordinance in all the new-testament was ever so grac'd , nor honoured with such a presence as this was at the baptism of christ ; the three persons manifest their presence at this solemnity , the heavens were opened , and a voice heard , saying , this is my beloved son , in whom i am well pleased ; 1. the father seals it and honours it . 2. the son is there , and subjects to it , shewing what an honourable respect he has to it ; nay and came many miles upon no other business but to be baptized ( as we read of . ) 3. the spirit also descended like a dove , and rested upon him ; the holy ghost puts his seal upon it , and in a glorious manner owns it . and then our saviour saith , it became him to be obedient to it ; 't is , it seems , a becoming ordinance , it became the master , and doth it not become the servant to submit to it ? it was not too low for him , and is it too low for thee ? he said also it was a fulfilling of all righteousness ; that is , it became him to fulfil all the commands of his father , or do his whole will , which it appears he could not have done unless he had been baptized . and in that of being a patern or example to us , those who neglect it , neglect a most righteous thing , and do not fill up after their master . fourthly , 't is called a justi●ying of god , and our disobedience herein a rejecting the counsel of god , luk. 7. 29 , 30. fifthly , it appears a great ordinance , in that the highest , nay the extraordinary gifts of the spirit can't exempt a person from his obedience hereto , as appears in cornelius's case . nay , the greater gifts and graces a person hath , the more fit a subject he is of this ordinance ( as peter's words do import . ) sixthly , consider the great things and mysteries held forth hereby , viz. the death , burial , and resurrection of christ , and our dying to sin , and duty to walk in newness of life , it preaches the gospel to our very sight in a very lively figure ; and therefore a great ordinance . seventhly , 't is a badg of christian profession ; and an ordinance , as mr. baxter observes , of the solemnization of the souls marriage-union with christ . eighthly , consider the great promises made to those who are obedient to it , amongst other things , lo , i am with you always , even to the end of the world. and again , he that believeth , and is baptized , shall be saved . if a prince shall offer a rebel his life in doing two things , would he neglect one of them , and say this i will do , but the other is a trivial thing , i 'll not do that ? surely no , he would not run the hazard of his life so foolishly . and then in act. 2. 38. repent , and be baptized every one of you for remission of sin , and ye shall receive the gift of the holy spirit : see what great promises are made to believers in baptism . ninthly , nay , and cornelius was warn'd from heaven to send for peter , and , saith the lord , he shall tell thee what thou shalt do . now one thing that is exprest , and i think 't is all that pet●r told him he should do ( besides believing on the lord jesus ) was to be baptized . certainly these things demonstrate baptism to be a great ordinance ; 't is miraculously confirmed from heaven ( as it were ) so to be . tenthly , and lastly ; baptism is an initiating ordinance , no regular or orderly coming into the church of god but at this door ; and this we shall make appear , therefore a great ordinance . first , 't is said they that gladly received the word , were baptized ; and the same day there were added to them about three thousand souls : those who were added unto this church were first baptized ; and observable 't is , that as this was the first gospel-church that was gathered after the ascension of christ : so it is set forth as a patern to all other churches ; for as others were injoyned , so they were commanded for following the church of god that was in judaea . secondly , all along in the new testament , where we read of the first plantations of the churches , we find that all those who became members respectively , were first upon their profession of faith baptized before they were received as members thereof ; as act. 8. act. 10. act. 16. and act. 18. thirdly , we read of none that were received into the fellowship of any church that were not first baptized . fourthly , because those who were baptized , were said to be baptized into christ ; know ye not that so many of us as were baptized into christ , &c. rom. 6. 3. that is , into his church or mystical body , as our late annotators intimate , incorporated , ingrafted or planted into christ , and so to be made members of his mystical body by baptism . by one spirit we ( are said ) all to be baptized into one body , 1 cor. 12 , 13 , by one spirit , that is , by the authority and appointment of the spirit , and by the guidance , conduct , and leadings of the spirit ; not that all that are true members of the church are baptized with the holy spirit , sith the baptism of the spirit denotes ( as we have elsewhere proved ) the extraordinary gifts or effusion of the holy ghost , which was received in the apostles days , and which continued not in the church . and have been all made to drink into one spirit . in these words he alludes to the ordinance of the supper , which you may as well say , is a spiritual eating and drinking only , as so to speak of baptism ; because 't is said by one spirit we are all baptized , 't is not said with one spirit . besides , should any assert that the apostle means the baptism of the spirit , and that the ordinary gifts and graces of the spirit is the baptism of the holy spirit ; then it would follow that there are two baptisms left in the church , which seems to be contrary to what paul saith . fifthly , because the lord jesus hath joyned faith and baptism together in the commission , and both were taught as beginning or fundamental principles of his doctrine , or part of those first rudiments that belongs to every babe in christ , or christian man and woman , heb. 5. 12. & 6. 1 , 2. and all those six principles , as our late annotators affirm , are initiating , and so they must be ; for if they are fundamentals , they must either be fundamentals of salvation , or else of church-communion : now baptism cannot be a fundamental of salvation , therefore of church-communion , how necessary 't is to lay a sure foundation no man can be ignorant . object . it is objected from rom. 6. 3. that but some only of the church of the romans were baptized , because the apostle saith , as many of● you as were baptized , &c. from thence they would conclude some of them were not . answ . did the whole church of the romans reckon themselves , think you , to be dead to sin , and bound to live no longer therein ? if so , then baptism , which was a symbol of those things , belonging to them all ; as many as are baptized into christ , were baptized into his death , &c. i. e. in token of it : and that they all should become new creatures , it is as if he should reason thus ; as many of us as are baptized , must know this , that we were baptized into christ's death , and therefore must die to sin , and live a new life . but we have all been baptized or buried with christ in baptism into his death ; therefore we must all die to sin , and live a new life . did the apostle intend hereby , do you think , to press them all to die to sin , and live to god ? if so , that argument he uses ( you may assure your selves ) reached them all , which it could not do if they had not all been baptized . sixthly , baptism is an initiating ordinance , appears , because the way of inchurching disciples , or men and women , was one and the same in all the churches of the saints ; if some were not received till baptized , there were no unbaptized persons ever received at all . but some were not received till baptized , ergo. the reason is not only , because the way and order of the administration of that ordinance were one and the same in every church , and so confusion avoided ; but also because there is the like parity of reason , why all should and ought to be baptized , as there is for some , sith the ordinance is initiating , and so a great priviledg , and all have right to the thing signified thereby : besides , those who believe , are required and commanded to be baptized ; and that which is the duty of one disciple as a disciple , is the duty of every disciple ; and by that argument you may excuse one man from one sacrament , viz. baptism , you may excuse another from the lord's table , upon a pretence he doth not see it to be his duty , and yet admit him , and continue him a member . and that baptism is an initiating ordinance , we have all christians of all perswasions one with us , they generally assert the same thing . justin martyr , speaking of the lord's supper , saith , this food we call the eucharist , to which no man is admitted , but only he that believeth in the truth of our doctrine , being washed in the laver of regeneration for remission of sins , and liveth as christ hath taught . that is , none were admitted to the lord's supper , but such who were first baptized . the same is hinted by a late famous writer concerning cyprian , and other eminent fathers , about the 2d & 3d centuries , viz ▪ no unbaptized persons were admitted to the communion of the church . let them , saith austin , ( that is , the catecumens ) pass through the red sea ; that is , be baptized : and let them eat manna , that is , the body and blood of christ . this shews the practice of the church in his days . vrsinus saith , baptism is a sacrament of entrance into the church , whence it cometh , that the supper is presented to none except first baptized . dr. cave , speaking of the lord's supper , saith , from this sacrament are excluded all unbaptized persons , and such who live in any known sin , &c. baptism is , saith dr. ames , a sacrament of initiation . elton on col. 2. 11. saith also , that baptism is the sacrament of incision , or engrafting into christ , sealing up our setting into christ , which is only once done , never after to be done again , &c. mr. strong says , baptism is a sacrament of initiation , and the ordinance of visible admission into the church : and as it is a sin , saith he , to keep them out whose right it is ; so it is a sin also to admit them that have no right , because the ordinance of christ is abused and misplaced . the assembly say in their catechism , that baptism is a sacrament of the new testament , ordained by jesus christ ; — for the solemn admission of the party baptized into the visible church , &c. every soldier that must be admitted into an army , saith mr. baxter , must be admitted , by listing , as a solemn ingaging sign — so every one that hath right to be solemnly admitted into the visible church , must orderly be admitted by baptism . and again he saith , we have no precept or example of admitting visible members any other way ; therefore all that must be admitted visible members , must be baptized . i might write a book of things of this nature , as touching the sentiments of worthy writers , being generally all of the same belief and practice ; howsoever in other things they may differ from us , and one from another ; nor will those of the church of england , presbyterians , or independants , admit any as members into their communions , as to partake of the lord's supper , except they have been baptized in their sense , they calling sprinkling , or pouring , baptizing ; which we deny to be the ordinance . object . how dare you deny a man admittance into the church , who is truly godly , and hath a lively faith ? if he hath a right to christ , who is signified in the lord's supper , may be be denied the sign , because he is not baptized ? answ . how dares any man , who fears god , attempt to do any thing contrary to the holy pattern left in christ's new testament ? if baptism was appointed to be an initiating ordinance into god's house , 't is not only a man's piety that will serve the turn , he must come into the church at the door christ hath ordained , or not come in at all . if lot should have offered himself to come into abraham's family , ( which was then god's church ) do you think abraham would have admitted him , ( though he was a righteous man ) unless he would first consent to be circumcised ( which was an initiating ordinance at that time ) ? certainly , no ; though he should say he was not convinced of circumcision , yet that would not have excused him : god's laws are not to be dispensed with to gratify the ignorance of men. 't is a question whether vzzah knew he ought not to put forth his hand to support the ark : yet for doing that thing , god smote him with death . ignorance will not be a sufficient plea for doing god's work , in other manner than he has appointed . how dares any man , who loves and desires to honour the lord jesus , violate his holy and great commission , matth. 28. or act and do contrary thereto , who requires all disciples to be baptized ? derogating from the rule in one thing , opens a gap to other disorders , and it renders christ's institution a petty and indifferent thing : you may as well dispense ( with the neglect , or ) with the ignorance of men in the lord's supper , as well as so to do in respect of baptism ; and let them abide members who refuse to break bread with the church , and yet would continue members , pretending ignorance ; perhaps they will tell you , they can answer the end of that ordinance in breaking their common bread , &c. object . but doth not the apostle say , such as are weak in the faith , receive you , &c. 1. it cannot be meant received into the church , because they that the apostle there speaks of , were in the faith , or visible profession of the gospel , and were members of the church , tho they were weak ones , or but babes in christ . 2. the weakness there meant , was about eating meats , and observing days , &c. which were in themselves but indifferent things : and will you render the great sacrament of baptism like to them ? it was no sin to eat , or not to eat , but so it is not to be subject , or not subject to christ's ordinances . 3. the receiving there intends doubtless no more than this , to let them abide in their affections , or receive them as poor weak children to nourish and pity them , and not to censure and judg hardly of their doubtful thoughts . but to conclude , since my honoured friend and brother , mr. william kiffen , hath but lately wrote so excellent a book upon this very subject , i shall say no more to it , but refer the reader for his further satisfaction to that treatise . but to proceed to a little improvement : if baptism be so great an ordinance as it seems it is , this may reprove all such who slight and dispise it , and may stir up all to an honourable esteem of it , and to move such who are convinc'd of it , speedily to submit thereunto . let me conclude all with one use of caution to my brethren , that are baptized as believers , and yet take liberty to walk in communion with such churches as dissent from them , in respect of this ordinance , and sprinkle babes . i am more concerned about you , than any other people ; because you seem to pull down with one hand , that which you build with the other . our brethren with whom you walk , may be more excusable than you can be , because they are faithful ( i would hope ) to their light ; they will not have communion with any persons , whom they judg in their consciences are unbaptized ; but you believe those who have been only sprinkled in infancy , are all unbaptized persons , or otherwise why were you baptized afterwards ? who can justifie you in this practice ? i am persuaded our brethren cannot , will not do it , if they rightly consider the light or dictates of your consciences in this matter : 't is not what they are in their own sense , but what they are in your judgment . speak , are they baptized ? or , is not that they call baptism , in your consciences a nullity ? nay , worse , a tradition of men ? nay , a prophanation of the sacrament of baptism ? how then can you justify your selves in such a practice ? i have as much charity for our brethren , i hope , as most of you have , and love and honour them , yet dare not transgress or invert christ's holy laws , and gospel-order ; and therefore take heed what you do . if there were no baptized churches with whom you might have communion , somewhat might be said in your justification . ( for upon a case of necessity that may be lawful , or be permitted to be done , which otherwise is utterly unlawful . ) besides , i hear some of you ( daily confess ) they believe they are not such orderly churches as the baptized congregations are , ( and that is the sum of what i say and believe concerning them ) why then do you chuse to have fellowship with them ? ought you not to follow the best and highest reformation , and clearest discovery of god , and to be in the most perfect and compleat order of the gospel you are able to arrive to the knowledg of ? yet are not you contented to lie short in doing this according to the sentiments of your minds and understandings ? is this the way to that longed-for reformation ? is not truth and righteousness to be joyned with peace and love ? nay , and doth not my love run out to our brethren in a cleaner channel than yours , ( who resolve my affections shall never pilot my judgment or understanding ? ) i have as great reason to love and honour some of the congregational way , as any one man this day in england ; it pleasing god to work upon my soul , i hope , effectually , when very young under the ministry of one that is of that persuasion , who is yet living , and none of the meanest ministers , now preaching near this city ; whose name is dear to me , and one i do honour , ( and ever shall ) as long as i live in the world. yet nevertheless , my blessed lord and saviour , and his truth , lies nearer my heart . i speak the more upon this account , not only to deliver your souls from temptations , and disorderly walking ; but also , because i know it grieves many very gracious persons , and weakens the hands of those who carry on the work of god amongst us ; and seems to me to obstruct the further glory and reformation of the church . yet i am for such communion with our brethren , as we may warrantably promote , as to pray and preach together , and to love and encourage grace and holiness in one another . i 'll say no more , i have done ; only remember that excellent saying of the apostle , now i pray you , brethren , that ye remember me in all things , and keep the ordinances as i delivered them to you . would to god i could say so of you . 't is not enough to keep the ordinances of christ , but so to keep them as at first delivered to the saints . let us go forward , and not decline , or seem to draw back in our zeal and testimony for the truth . let us walk as we have attained ; god may bring our brethren to see wherein they come short , as well as wherein they know they are got before others . i hope , what i have written will be received in good part , and none will be offended ; for i can appeal to god , the searcher of all hearts , i have done all that i have done or writ in this treatise , in the integrity and uprighness of my heart , and in sincere love to christ and his dispised ordinances , and to discharge my conscience ; hoping a blessing will attend it , and that it will redownd to his glory , and the profit of his church ; and if so , i matter not what censures i lie under : for , my record is on high , and my witness is in heaven . i am contented to be any thing or nothing , ( if i know my own deceitful heart ) that god may be all in all ; to whom be praise and glory , by jesus christ , now and for evermore . amen . finis . the table of the contents . chap. i. baptism of water only intended in the commission , proved , by eight reasons , from page 1 , to p. 6. water-baptism to continue to the end of the world , from p. 7 , 8 , 9. baptized in the name of christ , proved to be according to the commission , p. 11 , 12. the objection , that the baptism in water was john's baptism , answered , p. 12 , 13 , 14 , 15 , 16. object . that paul was not sent to baptize , answered , p. 20 , 22 chap. ii. opening the true genuine , literal , proper signification of the word baptizo , p. 24 , 25 , 26 chap. iii. baptism is dipping , &c. proved from the practice of the primitive church , p. 32 , 33 , &c. chap. iv. baptism , dipping , or plunging , proved from the spiritual signification of the ordinance , p. 42 , 43 , &c. chap. v. baptism proved immerging or dipping , from the typical and metaphorical baptisms , spoken of in scripture , p. 56 , 57 , &c. chap. vi. believers the only subjects of baptism from the commission , p. 63 , 64 , &c. chap. vii . baptism of believers proved the only subjects of it , from the practice of the primitive church , p. 76 , 77 , &c. chap. viii . believers the only subjects from the ends of baptism , p. 78. seven ends of baptism , p. 80 chap. ix . containing eight arguments , proving believers the only subjects , p. 86 , to p. 99 chap. x. the arguments for infant-baptism , answered , p. 100 , to 124 chap. xi . other objections and pretended proofs for pedo-baptism , answered , p. 125 , 126 , &c. chap. xii . answer to several arguments , p. 146 chap. xiii . shewing the evil consequents of infants-baptism , p. 165 , 166 , &c. chap. xiv . baptism a great ordinance , and initiating , p. 171 , 172 , &c. notes, typically marginal, from the original text notes for div a47535-e830 water baptism an institution of christ . water baptism an ordinance of christ to the end of the world. * gal. 3. 15. † joh. 12. 49. | heb. 3. 5. continuation of pool's a●not . on ●at . 28 : 1● , 20. * acts 2. 1 , 〈◊〉 , 3. jewel b. of sal. sect. 9. in conf●t . harding . cyprian epist . 73. ad jubaian . augustin . lib. 3. against maxim . bp. of the arrians , c. 17. eulogius of alexandria l. 2. contra novatian , apud photium in bibliotheca . see mr. s. f's baptism before or after faith. mat. 3. 1. * act. 2. 39. & 8. 16. & 10. 47. * mat. 3. 16 , 17. acts 10. 36 , 37 , 38 , 39 , 40 , 41. rom. 15. 18. joh. 10. 41. neh. 8. 14 , 15. notes for div a47535-e4000 * mr. delaune . * s. fisher . circumcision , ● cutting the fore-skin round about quite off . danvers treatise of baptism , 2d . edit . p. 182. grotius . pasor . vossius . mincaeus . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 casaubon . dr. du-veil . liegh . de prim . papae , p. 193. beza . de jure nat. &c. l. 2. c. 2. treatise of sacr. par . 1. c. 8. p. 177. rule of conscience , l. 3. c. 4. an. d. 816. conc. flor. §. 9. c. 9. & lib. of infant baptism , p 693. ductor dubit . l. 3. c. 4. reg. 15. num. 9. st. martins life , n. 16. diatribe on titus 3. 2. pan. cathol . tom. 4. l. 5. c. 2. annotat. on john 13. mat. 3. pool ' s annotat. ball. book 1. cap. 40. wilson . notes for div a47535-e6160 diodate annotat. pool's annotat. joh. 3. 23. see mr. gosnold's doctrine of baptism , pag. 20. * pool ' s annot. on joh. 3. 23. mat. 3. 16. acts 8. 38 , 39. rogers in his treatise of the two sacraments , part 1. chap. 5. casaubon on mat. 3. 11. calvin on act. 8. 38. cajetan on mat. 3. 5. muscul . on mat. 3. notes for div a47535-e7870 pool's annotat . cajetan . assemblies annotat. tilenus in his disput . p. 886 , 889 890. on rom. 3. 4● * or grave . ambrose . see dr. du veil on acts 2. rom. 6. 3 , 4. col. 2. 12. 1 cor. 15. 29. * ignat. epist . ad tral . id epist . ad philadelp . justin martyr . basil the great . † basil of seleucia . chrysostom . ambros . ‖ lactant. bernard . see continuat . of pool's annotat . on mat. 3. 6. st. bernard . dr. du-veil , on acts 2. 38. p. 78. aquinas . calvin . l. 4. c. 16. zanchy . chrysostom . prim. christianity , p. 320. paraeus upon ursi● , p. 375. austin . annotat. on rom. 6. 4. dr. taylor , in his book of proph. p. 242. notes for div a47535-e9560 woy great afflictions are called baptism . see continuation of mr. pool's annotat. on mat. 20. 22 ▪ mat. 3. 11. mark 1. & luk. 3. 16. what it is to be baptized with the spirit . mat. 28. 20 act. 10. 46. dr. du veil on act. 1. 4 , 5. oecumenius on acts 2. 2. see key to open script . metaphors , lib. 4. p. 36. philologia sacra , p. 190. treat . of bapt. p. 62. see continuation of m r. pool's annotat. on 1 cor. 10. 1 , 2. notes for div a47535-e10620 mark 16. 15. object . answ . pool ' s annotat . on mat. 28. 20. pool ' s annotat . on acts 11. 26. baxter on confirmation and restauration , pag. 27. see mr. tomes's book , call'd felo de se . baxter's dispute of right to sacraments , p. 149. see danvers on baptism , p. 2 , 3. danvers book of baptism , p. 3 , 4. perkins . paraeus . notes for div a47535-e11750 * gal. 4. 26. act. 8. 12. act. 8. 36 , 37. pools annotat . on . act. 8. 37. baxter on confirmat . p. 27. act. 10. 45 , 47 , 48. acts 16. 31 , 32 , 33. acts 18. 8. luther , tom. 3. fol. 168. cited by mr. danvers , p. 8. on baptism . baxter's 2d disputation , p. 149. acts 20. 2 thess . 2. 7. 1 john 2. 18. acts 1. 3. act. 10. 41. 〈…〉 notes for div a47535-e13190 rom. 6. 3 , 4 , 5 , 6. pareus . perkins case of consc . p. 177. baxter on confirm . p. 32. bullinger upon acts 2. 38. baxter on confirm . p. 30 , 31. bullinger on act. 2. 38. tit. 3. 5. baxter in his disput . with mr. blake , p. 117. as quoted by mr. danvers . 1 pet. 3. 21. pool ' s annotat . on tit. 3. 5. notes for div a47535-e14400 1. argument . arg. ii. acts 8. arg. iii. vnion of the church . 4th book of instit . c. 16. de civit. dei , lib. 1. cap. 27. magdeb. in cent. 1. l. 2. p. 496. lib. proph. p. 239. arg. iv. pool's annotat . on act. 20. 27. arg. v. athanasius against the gentiles . isychius lib. 5. 6. 16. on levit. chrys . on 2 thes. & 2 tim. 3. aug. to the brethren in the wildern . lib. 2. of christian doctrine , c. 3. in his 198 epistle to fortunat. luther upon gal. 1. 9. basil in his sermon de side . calvin . l. 4. instit . c. 8. sermon 8. theoph. lib. 2. paschal . bellarm. in his book de bapt. l. 1. c. 8. mr. ball in his answer to the new-england elders , p. 38 , 39. arg. vi. arg. vii . arg. viii . notes for div a47535-e16490 i. argument from the covenant made with abraham . mat. 3. 7 , 8 , 9. chrysost . theophilact . pag. 117. calvin on gen. 17. 7. estius . anno gen. 17. 7. agr. blake , p. 6. * if he had said , those who are born of the spirit are spiritual , he had spoke truth . jer. 31. 34. 1 pet. 2. 4 , 5 , 6 , 7. dr. taylor bishop of down , p. 228. levit , 10 , 1 , 2. gen. 17. 10 , 12 , 14. mr. smythies vnworthy communicant , p. 88. 1 pet. 2. 5 ▪ * for tho a time for the worship of god is moral , yet the seventh day of the week was a meer positive law , given only to the people of israel . baxter on confirmation . rom. 8. act. 15. 10. gal. 5. 1 , 2 , 3 , 4. 2 cor. 3. 18. joh. 7. 39. danvers on bapt. p. 180. besides , they are at a loss to know what to do if the father only , or the mother only is a believer . notes for div a47535-e20080 christ blessed little children , 't is not said he baptized them : nay , 't is said he baptized not any with his own hands , joh. 4. 1 , 2. therefore no infants . dr. taylor , p. 230. ambros. new birth in p. 13. charnock on regener . last sol . p. 75. amesius in bell. enervat . tom. 3. l. 2. c. 3. pool's annotat. on joh. 3. 5. dr. owen in his theol. l. 6. c. 5. p. 477. dr. taylor 's liber . of proph. p. 231. the proof from whole housholds examined . the second whole houshold . the third whole houshold . the fourth houshold . the promise is to 〈◊〉 and to 〈…〉 act. 2. 3● . 〈◊〉 act. 2. 37. eph. 2. 13. pools annot . on act. 2. 39. the proof for infant-baptism — ( else were your children unclean , &c. ) answered . pool's annotat. on 1 cor. 7. 14. 2 pet. 1. 20. smythies non-communicant , p. 88. mr. danvers treat ▪ of bapt. p. 165 , 166. ambrose . melanct. camerar . erasmus . baptism only a positive law ; who the subjects of it , are depends wholly upon the will of god , &c. mr. smythies argument , that infants are believers . faith nor baptism is not required of infants , yet they may be saved . dr. taylor , p. 230. * see joh. 2. 23 , & cap. 8. 30 , 31 , 44. * i am forc'd to repeat this often , because there is the like occasion given , and it is a full answer to all such inferencse . what confusion is here among the pedo-baptists ? dr. taylor . dr. taylor , p. 242. notes for div a47535-e23480 mr. sidenham's treatise . jer. 7. 31. ezek. 43. 8. ●uther in post●l . tertullian in his book of bapt. ●ap . 18. heb. 9. 10. john 12. heb. 6. 1 , 2 , 3. curcellaeus ●nstitut . relig. christian . l. 1. c. 12. for the doctrine of free-will ; falling away totally from a state of true grace , &c. are not look'd upon as capital errors , viz. such as will exclude men out of the kingdom of heaven . 1 cor. 9. 7 , 8 , 9 , 10 , 11 , 12. matth. 10. 10. luk. 9. 3. * eph. 5. 18 , 19. col. 3. 16. † some good christians are not willing to take up one ordinance , and so joyn in with the baptists , and thereby lose another which they believe is as great , and a most sweet and soul-consolating one . prov. 4. 18. cant. dr. featly and mr. baxter formerly contracted no small guilt and shame to themselves upon this respect ; see dipper ▪ dipped , writ by featly . * 1 cor. 5. 1 , 2. baxter in his book principle of love , p. 7. 2 cor. 1. 12. act. 8. 12. mat. 28. 19 , 20. acts 8. 12. acts 16. 23. notes for div a47535-e26170 mr. danver's book of baptism , p. 212 , 213 , 214. heb. 9. 12 , 13. 1 joh. 1. 7. joh. 3. 3. charn . on regenerat . p. 75. dr. taylor lib. proph. p. 244. notes for div a47535-e26740 mat. 3. 16. act. 10. 47. mark 16. 16. acts 2. 1 thess . 2. 14. gal. 3. 27. pool's annotat . on rom. 6. 3. eph. 4. 5. pool's annotat . on heb. 6. 1 , 2. second apology to ant. pius the roman emperor , c. 8. §. 5. august . ursin . in his catechism . antiq ▪ christianae , p. 374. marrow of div. p. 181 elton on col. 2. 11. p. 291. discourse of the covenant , p. 226 assemb . catechism . plain . scripture ▪ proof , p. 24. 2 sam. 6. 6 , 7. rom. 14. 1. truth prevailing against the fiercest opposition being a vindication of dr. russel's true narrative of the portsmouth disputation ... also, a sermon upon mat. 28. 19. by mr. john williams ... as also an answer to the presbyterian dialogue, by another hand / published by mr. john sharp ... who was moderator at the disputation in portsmouth. sharp, john, of froome, somersetshire. 1700 approx. 373 kb of xml-encoded text transcribed from 93 1-bit group-iv tiff page images. text creation partnership, ann arbor, mi ; oxford (uk) : 2008-09 (eebo-tcp phase 1). a93044 wing s3005 estc r217599 36282440 ocm 36282440 150284 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(eebo-tcp ; phase 1, no. a93044) transcribed from: (early english books online ; image set 150284) images scanned from microfilm: (early english books, 1641-1700 ; 2239:12) truth prevailing against the fiercest opposition being a vindication of dr. russel's true narrative of the portsmouth disputation ... also, a sermon upon mat. 28. 19. by mr. john williams ... as also an answer to the presbyterian dialogue, by another hand / published by mr. john sharp ... who was moderator at the disputation in portsmouth. sharp, john, of froome, somersetshire. williams, john, minister. 184 p. 15 cm. printed, and sold by m. fabian ..., london : 1700. "sermon on mat. 28. 10. by mr. john williams" has special t.p. imperfect: stained. reproduction of original in the william andrews clark memorial library, university of california, los angeles. created by converting tcp files to tei p5 using tcp2tei.xsl, tei @ oxford. re-processed by university of nebraska-lincoln and northwestern, with changes to facilitate morpho-syntactic tagging. gap elements of known extent have been transformed into placeholder characters or elements to simplify the filling in of gaps by user contributors. eebo-tcp is a partnership between the universities of michigan and oxford and the publisher proquest to create accurately transcribed and encoded texts based on the image sets published by proquest via their early english books online (eebo) database (http://eebo.chadwyck.com). the general aim of eebo-tcp is to encode one copy (usually the first edition) of every monographic english-language title published between 1473 and 1700 available in eebo. eebo-tcp aimed to produce large quantities of textual data within the usual project restraints of time and funding, and therefore chose to create diplomatic transcriptions (as opposed to critical editions) with light-touch, mainly structural encoding based on the text encoding initiative (http://www.tei-c.org). the eebo-tcp project was divided into two phases. the 25,363 texts created during phase 1 of the project have been released into the public domain as of 1 january 2015. anyone can now take and use these texts for their own purposes, but we respectfully request that due credit and attribution is given to their original source. users should be aware of the process of creating the tcp texts, and therefore of any assumptions that can be made about the data. text selection was based on the new cambridge bibliography of english literature (ncbel). if an author (or for an anonymous work, the title) appears in ncbel, then their works are eligible for inclusion. selection was intended to range over a wide variety of subject areas, to reflect the true nature of the print record of the period. in general, first editions of a works in english were prioritized, although there are a number of works in other languages, notably latin and welsh, included and sometimes a second or later edition of a work was chosen if there was a compelling reason to do so. image sets were sent to external keying companies for transcription and basic encoding. quality assurance was then carried out by editorial teams in oxford and michigan. 5% (or 5 pages, whichever is the greater) of each text was proofread for accuracy and those which did not meet qa standards were returned to the keyers to be redone. after proofreading, the encoding was enhanced and/or corrected and characters marked as illegible were corrected where possible up to a limit of 100 instances per text. any remaining illegibles were encoded as <gap>s. understanding these processes should make clear that, while the overall quality of tcp data is very good, some errors will remain and some readable characters will be marked as illegible. users should bear in mind that in all likelihood such instances will never have been looked at by a tcp editor. the texts were encoded and linked to page images in accordance with level 4 of the tei in libraries guidelines. copies of the texts have been issued variously as sgml (tcp schema; ascii text with mnemonic sdata character entities); displayable xml (tcp schema; characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or text strings within braces); or lossless xml (tei p5, characters represented either as utf-8 unicode or tei g elements). keying and markup guidelines are available at the text creation partnership web site . eng russel, william, d. 1702. -true narrative of the portsmouth disputation. infant baptism. 2007-03 tcp assigned for keying and markup 2007-03 aptara keyed and coded from proquest page images 2007-07 jonathan blaney sampled and proofread 2007-07 jonathan blaney text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs batch review (qc) and xml conversion truth prevailing against the fiercest opposition . being a vindication of dr. russel's true narrative of the portsmouth disputation . wherein those unjust reflections cast upon divers ministers , and others of the baptist perswasion , in that partial account published by the presbyterians , are disproved , and their false accusations detected and refuted . also , a sermon upon mat. 28. 19. by mr. john williams , late minister of the gospel ; with his letter to mr. leigh concerning the dispute . as also an answer to the presbyterian dialogue , by another hand . published by mr. john sharp , minister of the gospel , and pastor of the church of christ at froome in somersetshire ; who was moderator at the disputation in portsmouth . london , printed , and sold by m. fabian at mercers-chappel in cheapside . 1700. the epistle to the reader . we were engaged about a year since in a publick disputation at portsmouth upon these two questions , viz. 1. whether , according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ , adult believers are only the proper subjects of baptism , and not infants ? 2. whether the ordinance of baptism , as appointed by christ , is to be administred by dipping , plunging ( or ) overwhelming only , and not otherways ? the occasion of that disputation appears from the preliminaries signed on their part , by mr. samuel chandler , and mr. francis williams , two presbyterian ministers , in the following words , whereas by mr. chandler's late preaching on the ordinance of baptism , several persons have taken offence ; and upon desire of satisfaction , it 's mutually agreed between us , whose names are under-written , that these two points be amicably disputed , &c. so that mr. chandler 's sermons were the cause of the offence , and their desire of satisfaction the occasion of the disputation : and as for dr. russel , he knew not of that agreement till afterwards , so that he could not possibly be the aggressor . when the dispute was over , the doctor having extraordinary occasion ( by reason of his wife's illness , and other pressing affairs ) return'd for london the next morning ; but before he could reach home , an advertisement was printed in the post-man ( supposed to be procured by their importunity ) giving an unfair and biassed account thereof to the world. and some time after they published another advertisement in the flying-post , full of vntruths , as i have formerly told them . and this , together with the noise and clamour they made in the time of the dispute , by which the people were hindred from hearing what was spoken , were the reasons why it was thought meet to make it publick ; of which they had a particular account in the dedication : and whatever be the consequence , they must not throw it upon us , but take it to themselves . as touching our narrative , we think it may deserve the title of a true narrative ; for it was published with all faithfulness , as to what was there delivered , according to the best account we could get either from our own memories , or the copies we could procure : and if they had been minded to have inform'd us of any thing further , they should not have refused us a sight of their copy when desir'd . but after all this noise of omissions and alterations , &c. if they can say no more , nor give any better demonstration of what they have said than what doth yet appear , we must needs tell them that our narrative will stand good , notwithstanding all their clamor against it ; and theirs will appear to be ( not an impartial , but ) a partial account . and this we may further assure them , that as they have manag'd it , they have been so far from giving us any further light or satisfaction therein , that they have wholly frustrated the great expectation of divers of their friends : for , when they saw those advertisements they published from time to time complaining against our narrative , and that certificate they sent into the west , wherein they boast of their great victory over us , which they saw was stuff'd with such great swelling words of vanity , at the same time charging our narrative to be full of palpable notorious falshoods ; and desiring them to suspend their judgments till they had a view of their answer : it made their own people to abuse us , and reflect upon us by their over credulity ; and filled them with an expectation of some great things to be discovered when theirs should come out into the world. but at last ( after six months time ) when it came to their view , they found their expectations frustrated : for , instead of giving them a more clear account , they had so torn and mangled it , that it seems to them to be in a most mishapen form , scarcely intelligible : and not so much as one of those vast numbers they boasted of could be procured to testify to the truth of what they had certified under their hands . this made divers presbyterians to own the truth , and submit to holy baptism upon profession of faith , as several had done upon the disputation : for when they saw there was railing instead of reason , and pretended : probabilities in the room of solid arguments ; and a false abstract of mr. chandler's old patch'd up sermons , taken out of other mens works , instead of those new arguments they were in expectation of ; and not one single scripture testimony either where it was commanded , or any example of any one infant that was baptized , either by john the baptist , christ or his apostles , or any other primitive minister whatsoever ; it was sufficient to convince any considerate judicious persons , that they had been hitherto misled by these blind guides , and that they had no design ( let their pretences be what they will ) that this gospel-ordinance should be restored to its primitive purity , and first institution , according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ , which they know to be agreeable to our practice , and have confest it so to be . for , mr. chandler in the sermon he preach'd nov. 24. 1698. on 1 cor. 12. 13. saith thus . i come to the fifth thing proposed , to show the subjects of baptism , who are qualified for the receiving of this ordinance . here we are to consider , either who are qualified in the sight of god , or who in the sight of the church : that is , to whom god will apply the inward grace signified in this ordinance , and who men may admit to baptism , as not being able to judg of the heart . first therefore in the sight of god , repenting believers are to be baptized , they have an undoubted right to this ordinance . god hath been graciously pleased to order it , that all those that turn to him by faith in christ , with resolution of subjection and obedience to him , should be admitted to this ordinance , wherein he signifies and seals he will give them remission of sin , adopt them into his family , and give them right and title to heaven . these were the subjects of baptism when the ordinance was first instituted and appointed . then it was necessary men should repent and believe , otherwise they had no right to this ordinance . while men remained in a state of judaism or heathenism , till they give up themselves to christ , submit to the lord jesus , they had no right to this ordinance : therefore you read , repent and be baptized ; and , if thou believest with all thy heart , thou mayst . so that if we were sent into an heathen nation , we ought to engage them to repent and believe before we administer this ordinance to them . 2. in respect of the church , profest believers are to be baptized . god , he doth not give the inward use of this ordinance to any but those that actually repent and believe : but the church cannot see the heart : where men therefore make a solemn profession of faith and repentance , there they are to be admitted to this ordinance . where men have a competent understanding of the principles of christian religion , and solemnly profess to devote themselves to the lord jesus christ , and contradict not this profession by notorious ungodliness , or an openly wicked life , these we ought to admit . would not any man that had been a stranger , and heard mr. chandler preach such doctrine , have taken him for a baptist preacher , and not a presbyterian ? but pray how doth he acquit himself from being 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , condemned in himself ? his answer is this , if any through mistake , or neglect of the parents , have not been baptized , they ought to submit to this ordinance , as thereby professing they give up themselves to god. the same with what he said at portsmouth in our very entrance upon the dispute , viz. he did own that adult believers were the proper subjects of baptism . dr. russel said , then you own our practice to be right . mr. chandler said , yes , if they have not been baptized in their infancy . dr. russel replied , you suppose they are to be baptized by virtue of some commission , and that it is by the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ . mr. chandler answer'd , yes , i do so . by all this it appears these presbyterians own that christ hath commanded adult believers to be baptized , and they are the proper subjects intended in our lord's commission : so that at best , if infants are the subjects of baptism , they are but improperly so . but ( by his confession ) if infants are not at all intended in that commission , then those that we baptize upon profession of faith are the only proper subjects of baptism ( according to christ's commission ) and infants are not the subjects at all . and till he answers like a logician to dr. russel's first argument , and produces his instance upon his universal negative , and shews us where it is written , that christ hath required any of his ministers to baptize any one infant , the controversy is fairly issued , and it 's we , and not they that have obtained the victory ; or rather , that truth is strongest , and hath prevailed . these men are just like the pharisees , &c. in our saviour's time , who acknowledg'd that the fifth commandment did oblige the israelites to honour and relieve their parents in their necessities : but by an invention of their own , by putting a false gloss upon the words , as appears by their talmud ( treating of vows ) chap. 10. a man is bound to honour his father and mother , except he vow the contrary . this our lord takes notice of in mat. 15. 4 , 5 , 6. mark 7. 10 , 11 , 12 , 13. by the name of corban , a gift . in pool's annotations you have these words : as touching this word corban , the most free and unconstrained sense seemeth to be this : the pharisees were a very covetous generation , and had a share in the gifts that were brought unto god for the use of the temple , or otherwise ; thence they were very zealous and diligent in perswading the people to make such oblations : and when any pretended the need that their parents stood in of their help , they told them , that if they told their parents it was a gift ( i. e. ) that they had vow'd such a portion of their estate to a sacred use , that would before god excuse them for not relieving their parents , &c. and that they were not obliged by that precept to honour and relieve them any longer . thus he tells them that by their traditions , under pretence of a more religious expounding the divine law , they had indeed destroy'd it , and made it of no effect at all . in like manner , if you ask these presbyters , whether jesus christ gave commission to his ministers to baptize believers ? mr. leigh shall speak for them ; his words are these , we must all confess , that jesus christ gave commission to baptize believers when at the age of maturity . but if this question were put to the pharisees , whether such jews were obliged by that command of god to honour and relieve their parents , who had said to their father or to their mother , corban ? their answer was , he is free , and they suffered him no more to do ought for his father or his mother . in like manner , if you ask these presbyters , whether such persons are obliged by that command of christ to be baptized in his name when they come to years of maturity and do believe , who have been baptized in their infancy ? their answer is ( as the pharisees of old ) they are freed from that obligation , and they will not suffer them to be rightly baptized according to christ's commission : whereas mr. chandler confesses they ought so to be , if they had not been baptized in their infancy . now forasmuch as there is no other authority for infant-sprinkling , but what the pharisees had for their corban , i. e. the command or tradition of men , why may not we apply the words of our saviour ( to the pharisees ) unto these presbyters ? thus have ye made the commandment of christ for holy baptism of none effect by your tradition of infant-sprinkling ; and thereby render'd the word of god of none effect : and that it 's vain worship that is taught by the precepts of men , you must be forced to acknowledg , or deny the words of our saviour : and if will-worship , vain worship , mens-commandments , and human traditions be not forbidden in the word of god , there is nothing forbidden ; but men are then at liberty to do what they please in the worship of god. why you ( that are of this opinion ) should keep up a separation from the church of england , unless it be for humour and interest , i cannot imagine . but to proceed . these learned annotators say , that altho the jews did for some tract of time keep to the divine law , yet in process of time they abused that text , deut. 4. 14. to found a new invention upon it : that besides the law written in the five books of moses , god delivered to him in the mount divers things which were not written , which he delivered only by word of mouth to the sanhedrim , which are to them as much a rule of judgment as any part of the law which was written : by which means they gained themselves a liberty of making the law of god what they pleased . from whence we also may observe , that they did not deny this to be written that is recorded in the fifth commandment , but that the other was also intended and included in it , which they endeavoured to perswade the people to believe , by their false glosses upon the text : for they confess it was not expresly written in the law , but that it might be intended , tho not exprest : and that it was delivered by word of mouth , tho it be no where so written in all the word of god : for they call'd it a tradition of the elders . whether covetousness ( as in the pharisees ) lies at the root of this practice of infant-sprinkling , themselves are the best judges : but this they confess , that it is not expresly commanded in the word of god : but they endeavour to perswade the people that it is intended therein ( altho they can't produce one instance of any infant that was baptized ) and by their corrupt exposition of some passages in holy scripture , and their false glosses ( like those of the pharisees ) they prevail upon their ignorant and unthinking admirers to believe it upon their word , altho there is not one syllable of it recorded in the holy scriptures . but when this will not do , they tell them it was the practice of the church for many ages , and they have reason to believe that it was taught by the apostles , altho there be no mention of it in holy scripture . for in p. 13. of their own account they say , that paul might declare it , tho the new testament should not discover that he did . and in p. 15. paul might have declar'd the baptism of infants an hundred times over , and yet it might not be left on record in his epistle to the ephesians , nor any part of the new testament that he did so . i therefore demand of these presbyters , that if they be not of the papists opinion , that infant-baptism is an unwritten tradition , what moved them to use their very language ? had they not a fit opportunity to produce a scripture-instance if they had been able ? but it seems all the skill they have , with all their pretences to learning , is not sufficient to inable them to find it out ; and therefore we must still charge it upon them as a scripture-less practice , and a mere human invention , without the least shew of either precept or example to be found for it in all the word of god : and consequently we must reject it as an unwritten tradition , and will-worship ; and ( as such ) forbidden by the holy scriptures ; and that from the pens of the most learned pedo-baptists , in their expositions of the second commandment . and seeing these men grant this practice of theirs is not exprest in the writings of the new testament , let them tell us the reason of this total silence therein ? why did not our lord command it if he intended it should be practised ? why did not the apostles set it down in their writings ? what can be the reason why those holy men should not make some mention of it in the many books they have purposely written for our instruction ? why did the four evangelists conceal it ? the acts of the apostles make no mention of it when they set down in writing so many thousands of men and women that were baptized ? how comes it to pass that the apostles peter , james , john and jude , who wrote such excellent epistles , should not say one word about it ? but above all , the apostle paul , who wrote fourteen admirable epistles , and speaks in them so often of this holy ordinance of baptism , who professes he did declare all the counsel of god , and kept back nothing that was profitable to be known , and praises them for keeping the ordinances as they were delivered to them , and declares , that as he received them of the lord , so he had delivered them ; does not in all his epistles make the least mention of infant-baptism . is not this alone a great argument against your practice ? i pray consider it : for the apostle saith , let every man prove his own work. you assert it , and therefore it lies upon you to prove it . but to evade this , you make use of the same method against us , as the papists do against the protestants , when they demand of them to give some formal passage in scripture that doth expresly and by name deny what they affirm , viz. where it 's said expresly that there is no fire of purgatory , and that the pope of rome is not the head of the universal church , and that the mass is not a propitiatory sacrifice . now this method of disputation is accounted in the papists an unjust caviling to demand such unreasonable proof , or else to pretend the protestants cannot answer them . the turks may as reasonably demand of the papists , where there is to be found any formal passage in scripture that saith expresly that mahomet is not a true prophet , &c. and then pretend the papists cannot answer them . and surely if it be unjust caviling in their own esteem , when demanded of them , it must be the same in themselves when they demand it from the protestants . just so you presbyters serve us . it belongs to you that impose this opinion of yours upon us , and oblige others to believe it , to make the truth of it appear from holy scripture . for no one is bound to believe that which cannot be prov'd to be true . you say that the infants of believing parents ought to be baptized ; but we deny it . it 's not our business to prove our denial by shewing some formal passage in scripture where it 's said in terminis that infants are not to be baptized ; it 's enough for us to ●●ll you that there is neither command nor example for 〈◊〉 in all the holy scripture : and till you give your instance where it is so written , we shall neither believe nor practise it : for till that be done , the controversy betwixt you and us is at an end : and ( in my opinion ) you had better have forbore ingaging in it at first , seeing you have so little skill to manage it . there was one present at the dispute who wrote thus to his friend in london , sir , we have seen the gross abuses of the dispute printed by mr. chandler , &c. who makes lies his refuge , &c. to favour his bad cause . but as a minister of the church of england said , if chandler and the rest had no better proof for their separation from the church , or arguments to defend it , they were grand schismaticks ; for they proved nothing . another minister of the church of england that was also at the dispute , told a friend of mine , that he had seen our printed narrative , and did declare that it was a very good account of the disputation . also a doctor of divinity , who came to give me a visit , told me that a country parson of his acquaintance who heard the dispute , did declare to him his great dissatisfaction against the presbyters both for their weak and ill management of themselves in that dispute ; and did also declare to him that the baptists were too hard for them . and this was no mean man among the clergy that gave him this account . i thought meet to put this in print , to put a stop to their vain-boasting . as touching their account of the dispute , if it had been sutable to their title , the world had heard nothing further from us about it ; for we desire no other but that it may be truly known what past therein on both sides : and if they had not given such severe and uncharitable reflections upon divers persons of our perswasion , both ministers and others , upon the dead as well as the living , and so forc'd us to write in our just defence , they had not received any harsh language from us ; for we do not think that an advantage to any cause : but what we have done of that kind , we may say with the apostle , they have compell'd us to do : for we have not used this method out of any prejudice against their persons , but to defend our selves from their unjust reflections , and to vindicate that truth they oppose , and which we believe in our consciences to be the mind of god , in opposition to that human invention practised by them . we have also took care to publish the testimonials sent to us by particular persons , according to their direction ; leaving out some things we thought might too much expose mr. chandler and mr. robinson ; for which i am sure we deserve their thanks . if what is contain'd therein be not delivered with that accuracy as some may expect , let them consider it 's not every man's talent so to do ; neither do matters of fact always require it . whereas we have caused to be printed an answer to their dialogue , written by a friend to that truth we profess , who lives in the country , and gave it to mr. sharp when he came to london , with liberty to print it , if he saw good : and altho ( for some prudent reasons ) his name is not thereunto affixed , he will not be wanting to vindicate what be hath written , when a just occasion shall present . the reasons for its brevity are these . 1. because he himself had but little time to prepare for it . 2. the reason why i made no inlargement , was because i never saw their dialogue till after mr. sharp shew'd me the answer to it . 3. our time together was very short , and we did not think fit to alter another man's copy . 4. mr. sharp being moderator , he did not think it so fit for him to engage in it ; and if the author had not been refer'd to , they should have had no answer from him . as for mr. sharp , he desired me to make an apology for him with respect to his brevity , &c. but as i know not of any need there is for me to do it , so my limits in this epistle will not permit me to inlarge . as for that new-fashioned way of burying with a turf only on the head , which those dialogue-makers seem to be so pleased with , as i know not any that practise it , so i shall leave it to themselves as i found it , without any remarks upon it ; not supposing the reader will be fond of the invention . but any whi●●fical conceit serves these presbyters to imploy their wits upon in ridiculing our practice of the holy ordinance of baptism , as commanded and submitted unto by the son of god. if it be so grievous in their eyes , why do they not answer what their own learned authors have said for our manner of baptism , before they thus reflect upon it ? for , as one of their own ministers hath told the world in print ( since the portsmouth disputation ) that their excusing themselves from that manner of administration we use ( by dipping the person under water ) because of the coldness of the climate , is in his opinion but a cold plea. and notwithstanding their outcry against us , themselves could practise it upon mr. fox , to serve a turn . there are so many errors in their account , that i shall not trouble my self any further about them , for my leisure will not permit me : and there 's so much said in the book it self to prove theirs to be what it is , i. e. a false and scandalous account , that i need not add any more . as for mr. john williams's sermon upon the commission , we were not willing the world should be deprived of it , not only because he hath deserved well of the publick , but because they are the words of a dying man ; and we hope the reader will not see cause to repent of that additional charge he is thereby put to in the price of the book ; for we are perswaded it will more than compensate that small charge . i shall conclude with what i did before ( notwithstanding their perverse construction of it ) that the great jehovah , from whom we receive all blessings , would make our endeavours herein successful to his glory and the good of souls , that so there may be added to the church daily such as shall be saved . william russel . directions for the more ready finding out the particular matters treated of in this book . mr. sharp's animadversions begin page 17. mr. bowes's letter , p. 45. another testimony from the principal brethren of the church against mr. chandler , to prove him a false accuser , p. 49. mr. leddel of gosport's vindication , p. 50. an account of those falshoods they charge on dr. russel , p. 56. dr. russel's observations upon their dedication , p. 65. his observations upon their account of the dispute , p. 71. truth vindicated , or an answer to their dialogue , p. 93. dr. russel's animadversions upon their epistle , p. 94. a sermon preach'd by mr. john williams from the commission , mat. 28. 19. to which is prefix'd his letter to mr. leigh , after the dispute , p. 128. mr. isaac marlow's letter to dr. russel , about the etymology and use of the dutch word doop , &c. p. 178. mr. isaac harman's postscript , to prove the notorious falshoods and lies contain'd in mr. chandler's postscript to their second edition , p. 181. errata . page 28. line 17. for wherei nour , read , wherein our . p. 34. l. 25. f. you , r. them . p. 90. near the bottom , for understand , r. understands . p. 161. l. 34. f. alter , r. altar . and if there be any others that have escaped our notice , the reader is desired to correct them . here begins the animadversions of mr. john sharp , minister of the gospel , and pastor of the church of christ at froome in somersetshire , who was moderator at the disputation in portsmouth . it may be thought strange that i should appear in this nature to the world , in the matter relating to our opposers disputation and controversy with dr. russel ; it is not as tho the said doctor had any need of my assistance ( and therefore i intend no long apology ) but only for these reasons following . 1. because it is the cause of god , wherein his truth is eminently concerned . 2. because our opposers have condemned our narrative in that which they allow in themselves in their own narrative . 3. because brother williams is dead , who was able to have vindicated what he then offered ( tho he is now brought in as one then rambling in his discourse . see their narrat . p. 59. ) 4. because it is fit that the world should be informed how unfairly they dealt by us , both at the dispute , and now since in their narrative . in these my short notes i shall not strictly tie my self to this or that particular method , but shall begin first to take notice of their declaring publickly , in the appendix to their narrative , p. 64. that we made the first disturbance ; whereas all that were present may remember how they acted towards us , making the first disturbance themselves : and therefore i do assure all , where-ever the narrative may come , that it was not as they relate it ; and i am ready to think they themselves might forget it , by having so much business upon their hands , or else it must be to make those that are at a distance believe how well they carried it towards us , tho i was forc'd to reprove the people and them too , which i should not have done had they not acted towards us in that manner as they did . i am ready to give my testimony before a magistrate , if required , that they themselves did make the first disturbance . how this might be improv'd against them , i will leave themselves and others to judg , if it were managed by their own pens . let them but remember their deportment towards mr. williams when he quoted erasmus , and seriously reflect upon it . also i would not have mr. leigh forget , when he was charged afterwards with hissing , and he denied it , saying , he did not hiss : mr. williams being present , said to him , sir , you did hiss ; he the said mr. leigh answer'd and said , it might be an interjection , making as if it was but a small thing . and tho mr. williams is dead , there are those that were present that can give evidence of this ; and i my self can give it more fully , as i received it from mr. john williams , if there shall be need . but i would beg of you , mr. leigh , if you come to read this , that you would not be in an heat , as you were then ; for , if you are , much water will not quench it , if i may say by you as you said ( nar. p. 60. ) by mr. leddel , you being , as i suppose , concerned in drawing up your narrative . but must this be your way of ridiculing the ordinance of christ ( as by us pleaded for ? ) i did think we should have been better treated at your hands . i mention not this out of any disrespect to you , but that you may be sensible that it is true what is said before , and that you were in the mistake . our opposers may also remember how ready mr. robinson was at all times to make disturbance , saying to dr. russel , if you know not how to form your argument , i will tell you : which the doctor had no need of , for he offered more than they did know how by any fair and due method to evade , or than ever they will be able to answer . i never perceived that he was at a loss at any time to form his argument , or to give them an answer . but mr. robinson was so often in this abusive work , that mr. bissel said , gentlemen , ye do not fair by dr. russel , ye ought to give him liberty to offer his arguments , and when he hath done , then to make the best of them . and , i suppose , it was for this piece of service , that his copy was by them afterwards look'd upon to be but as a lawyers breviate , containing only hints for memory , as they slight it . append. to nar. p. 56. next , when they would have set mr. williams and the doctor at a difference about their different opinions , dr. russel replied , if i am not of his opinion , i am of yours , sir , ( speaking to mr. robinson . ) then mr. williams said , if you say an hundred times as much more as you do , you shall not set the doctor and i together by the ears : and here they fell a laughing , shewing their rudeness . again , when dr. russel gave them the liberty of the whole new testament to prove infant sprinkling was any part of the counsel of god , i said , they might take it any where , from genesis to the revelation , if they could but prove it . hereupon mr. robinson rudely said , what , sir , the new testament in genesis ? but mr. williams replv'd , yes , sir , the new testament is in genesis : to which he made to answer . and here i will take notice of their words , pag. 66. so that infants may be baptized , if we can bring good proof for it out of the other parts of holy writ . here these gentlemen forgot that there was given them such large liberty to prove their practice out of any part of the written word : but , as they did nothing then , so they have done nothing since by their printing , to bring any good proof for their infant-sprinkling out of any part of the old or new testament ; and therefore i must conclude they cannot find it in holy writ : for they have been in their studies before and since , and they knew what they were to be engaged in ; and if they had not been prepared before the dispute , they should have taken better care since . also there was much said upon mat. 3. 7. and luke 3. 7. between mr. robinson and my self ; and if any of their notaries have taken it ( or any thing else that will serve their turn ) let them bring it out if they please , yet so as not to wrong me : for i do deny that my reply , which they have put down , p. 40. was to mr. leigh , for it was to mr. robinson , and i never spake the words as they are there put down to my wrong ; it was so much of it that i did then speak , that i do not remember all that i said to him , but yet this i do remember of the words , that all that appear to be a visible generation of vipers ought to be cast out of the church , that is to say , without they repent . he did confess that they did suspend them for a time : and i replied , by the rules of christ such ought to be excommunicated , and they did not act according to rule , if they did not do it . further , when upon acts 15. 10. i spoke , they need not stand so long upon the former part of the chapter , the 9th verse would clear who were the subjects , and repeated the words : mr. robinson interrupted me , saying , sir , where are you now ? i replied , if i have transgressed the rule of a moderator , i would ask the peoples pardon . thus neither i nor those of us that were to speak in the dispute could speak , but he was ready to interrupt us ; tho all there present may remember that we acted towards them very soberly : but had we done otherwise , i do not question but you would have heard of it before now . they made an apology of their not being willing to have a publick dispute before the people ; and i having heard something of that the night before , told it to some of our people there : they told me that they would have disputed them in private , if they would have discoursed it according to the scripture . when they were thus making their apology , i replied , that they might have had it in private , if they would have discoursed it according to the scriptures , and that they had been offered it before we came thither : this they could not deny , and alledged no further ; and yet they would plead their innocency since on purpose to blame us . mr. leigh offered to argue it with me , but i replied , i thought dr. russel and mr. williams were able to manage their own arguments , and therefore there was no need of that : yet i have been heartily sorry since , that i did not offer then to change a plain proposition with any of those our opposers , it being so fair an opportunity to bring you to the scripture , by which means the people would have had more light into the truth . and when the arguments on our part were brought to bear , and were back'd by the scriptures , i desired our opposites to grant , or deny , or distinguish , or give another sense of the scriptures , but they would give none . when mr. robinson was giving the aforesaid unfair representation to the people , i desired he would forbear , if not , i would oppose him ; and yet he went on ( as he used to do in the dispute ) and gave a further account to the people . i desired him again to desist , and if he would not , i could not , nor would forbear him : but , if he would give the doctor leave to speak for himself , i would forbear ; and so with much ado i did get him to forbear . when i was called upon to conclude in prayer , and it was said it was my place , mr. robinson would not leave off , but as he began , so he did continue to the end , and said it would be but vain repetitions if he should : i replied , i would offer no vain repetitions for them ; i hop'd i made conscience of the duty of prayer as much as they did elsewhere , and i would not do it there for them . and now i would not have them talk too much of their copy , and condemn others ; i would have them to remember , that mr. smith was not capable to repeat one of the doctor 's arguments when he was call'd upon to do it , after that mr. liegh had denied one part of it , and the doctor desired him to repeat it , and he could not do it , which the doctor improv'd upon him , and said , do you not know what you deny ? and if he fail'd in the present , i know not what he might do afterwards : but i do not question their abilities to help him out . and as for mr. ring 's copy , they pretend in their narrative to find a multitude of falshoods , additions , alterations and omissions in it ; but nevertheless it is judged that he is as good a writer as the other ; and as for their narrative , it will be particularly examined by the doctor himself ; and how many such faults he will find there , our opposers may judg themselves , that have gone so large as they have done . they have made them speak on our side as mean as ever they can , and as full for their own . but i believe that all who look into the nature of the management of the matter and the arguments , will fall in with those that are most agreeable to the word of god , and are fairly drawn from thence . for , i hope , all persons will consider , that if our opposers had arguments offered them by such mean men as they have represented the old gentleman to be ; what would they have done if they had had men that had been thorowly furnished for that work ? the less they make us , i think they make themselves the more mean. could they not much easier have overturned their arguments without so many reflections ? can they think that will credit their cause , or make them look greater ? doth this agree with that character which the post-man gave of the doctor , as opposing infant-baptism with all the subtilty and sophistry of the schools ? surely that doth not agree with this diminutive description they now give of him : they could know little of his abilities in the sacred languages , for they did not discourse much at that time out of any of them ; and if they had , what advantage would it have been to them to have known one anothers abilities in the languages , unless they could have convinc'd him by their abilities ? but tho they profess to have them , neither he nor others that wanted conviction from them , had it by their giving us one instance of precept or precedent for their practice of sprinkling infants , instead of baptizing or dipping them when adult believers , that it was either commanded or practised by christ or his apostles : for i my self should have been glad to have received conviction then or now by their writing , i● it have any foundation in the word of god ; and yet it seems they would have us believe it without and blame us for not believing it upon their word we could easily believe it , if it was as easy for then to prove and maintain it , as commanded or grounde● in the revealed will of god , to be observ'd an● practised by them and us . but until i receive such convincing light and satisfaction from them out of the word of god as the rule for our practice in this matter , i shall , notwithstanding their abilities in languages , and for all what they have said as yet in the dispute , or written since in their account of it , continue in the same mind , and the same practice , when those that believe do tender themselves to be baptized , according to the practice of the apostles . if you , gentlemen , that are our opposites , or any of you can still convincingly prove , that your practice has any precept or precedent in the word of god , i will own it to be of divine institution : in the mean while this plain argument for our contrary faith shall satisfy me . if infant-baptism hath neither precept nor precedent in the word of god , then 't is not of divine institution : but infant-baptism hath neither precept nor precedent in the word of god ; therefore it is not of divine institution . when you have prov'd your practice as we have done ours , then you will have a great many more of your side ; and till then , you ought to deal more kindly and fairly by us than you have hitherto done , especially in the dispute , as i have partly shew'd : and i must needs say , i am afraid you will not hereafter deal so kindly and fairly by us as you should , since you charge the dead with that which is false , and yet pretend to tread softly over his grave , pag. 62. for immediately in the next words you give us mr. farrel's misrepresentation against mr. williams ( now dead ) there are two witnesses that were with him , and they wrote it down as mr. farrel spake it : and i my self had it from the old gentleman 's own mouth in the presence of several witnesses , together with his arguments , and carried them to dr. russel ; and i have sufficient reason to believe it is true , and that he has abused neither mr. francis williams nor mr. farrel in what he has said of them ; and all that knew him , did know he was as able as most men to retain what he had heard , and to give an account of it , but more especially , when others with him took such particular care to put it down in writing , that they might not be mistaken in any thing afterwards . i believe that poor story had never come into print , had old mr. john williams been living . furthermore , i would have the world judg between us ( or at least those that are both judicious and unprejudiced , and so able to judg between us and our opposites ) how that pag. 66. they condemn our arguments by wholesale , speaking in these words , all the arguments they offer'd were trifling cavils . now i would have you , readers , to consider , is not this a very easy way of refuting to condemn all , when they are not able to answer one of them ? ye may see from hence whether it be they or we that did trifle : for in the next foregoing page you may see how they do particularize the matter , and say it is false ( tho what of it is so , those that are concerned in it may look to it , as in the case of brother duke . ) now in that passage ( pag. 65 ) this is to be minded ( to observe how well it does agree with what they say elsewhere ) ; they say in these words , but that none of us would refuse to dip a person in such a case , is true : we never pleaded against dipping as one way , but as the only way ; not against its lawfulness , but necessity . and yet presently after they tell you , that the anabaptists cause does rest on weak unscriptural principles , how loudly soever they pretend to scripture . now i must say , if our cause , viz. of dipping believers , be weak and unscriptural , they ought then to plead against it , and refuse the doing of it , which it seems they do not do by their own confession aforementioned , but on the other hand they in plain words grant its lawfulness . now if it be lawful , that is , consistent with , and agreeable to the command of god and christ , and the practice of the apostles , then it cannot be unscriptural , nor our principles so weak as they would make them in the eyes of those who are for our cause , and own our principles , tho these men make so loud , a noise against them as weak and unscriptural . we oppose the principle and practice of our antagonists as unscriptural , weak , and unlawful , in so far as it is neither commanded by god or christ , nor implied as so commanded by any scriptural precedent . but if they will evade our arguing , and say , as they seem to do in their forecited words , that our principles and practice of baptizing or dipping believers is scriptural indeed , but it is not the only scriptural way , but there is a second scriptural way , viz. of dipping those that do not believe , as infants do not , by the preaching of the word ; and also a third , of sprinkling those that do believe , together with infants that do not believe : and that these other ways are intended in the command of christ , and implied by this or that precedent as commanded , and consequently are as well scriptural ways , as that of dipping believers is ( for this is the question now between us ) i say , if they can prove these other ways as distinct or different from ours , to be also scriptural , i. e. intended in the command of christ , and implied by some precedent in scripture , let them produce it if they can do it , for they have never done it yet : if they cannot , then theirs shall be their own darling notion , and they have no reason to charge ours as our darling notion , unless they can prove that their bare ipse dixit , or say-so , is sufficient proof against us that deny it . and indeed we need do no more than to deny this their darling and unscriptural practice and notion , till they are able to prove it : because he that will not only affirm , but also convince another of his principle and practice as commanded in scripture , ought in all reason to prove it to be so , ' ere he can blame another that denies it , that he hugs a darling notion in his bosom . set the case some papists should blame these gentlemen that are our antagonists for disowning the baptism of bells as being unscriptural , would it not be sufficient for them to say , that it is no where commanded in scripture by any express command , or any practice that implies such a command ? and if the other should demand a prohibition or command to the contrary , or else they would continue to blame them as hugging a darling notion , a weak and unscriptural principle , would our opposites not think this very unreasonable and weak ? well then , i do not question their ability in making the application in our case : for , if it be good in them , it 's so in us . further , how do these their reflections aforementioned , and the introduction to their narrative agree together ? for in the beginning of that introduction ( which i suppose was penn'd by mr. chandler ) are these words , must i again be call'd out to engage in this irksome and unpleasing controversy ? who had much rather spend my time in healing differences , and provoking all christians to love one another ; and then follow some expressions of arch-bishop tillotson . but o! had he or they taken dr. tillotson for their pattern , to write after his copy indeed , i am perswaded we should have been more fairly and charitably treated by them , or by this prefacer in particular than we are . for , we have a passage cited by the doctor , p. 59. where that great man dr. tillotson does say , antiently those who were baptized put off their garments . now this saying is so far from ridiculing us or our practice uncharitably , that it makes for us ; for he does not say they exposed their modesty by putting off their garments ; nor does he there trifle as they do about the eunuch , p. 81. and whereas in the said introduction there follows these words , i had much rather be dressing my own soul for eternity , and preparing others for those calm and peaceable regions , where perfect charity and good-will reign for ever , than in fomenting and increasing those divisions among christians which are too unmeasurably wide already ; i do wish with all my heart all of them had put this desire in execution : i for my part would not have hinder'd them , nor do i know any that would that are concerned on our side in this controversy , wherein our antagonists have not only not pressed after that charity and good-will the introduction speaks of , but also ( i think ) have laid a foundation for a greater division , unless god by his power and providence over-rule our spirits on both sides : for they have exposed us and the truth wherein we differ from them , as very ridiculous and trifling : however , the truth which we believe we cannot part with , we are to buy the truth and sell it not ; and instead of making us to part with it , they have rather given us more ground to believe it to be truth . mr. chandler , p. 2. begins the abridgment of his sermons thus , here i must unavoidably dip my pen in the watry controversy : i love not to meddle with matters of dispute . it is a sign he does not ( if i may say so ) or else he had not lov'd to meddle with the matter of the controversy which dr. russel had with mr. allen about singing ; i suppose neither was at his sermons , and what should make him bring their controversy in thither , i do not well see , unless he loved to defame dr. russel . he says indeed there , p. 12. that he mentions it to convince mr. webber and his adherents , what a doughty champion they have chosen for themselves . but you may see thereby the charity and good-will he has towards us and dr. russel in special , notwithstanding his pretence that he aim'd at some conviction , tho he might very well know that this exposing dr. russel behind his back so publickly about the point of singing , and drolling upon him as a hackny disputant , at a time when it did become mr. chandler to be more solid and serious , would signify nothing at all for any conviction in the point of baptism . if dr. russel had been out in that point , it will not follow he is in this . however , if mr. chandler had not only mentioned dr. russel's arguments in that point , but also had taken off the strength of his arguments , mr. allen perhaps would have had reason to have given him thanks for it . to slight them as mr. chandler does there , p. 13. by saying , these were the arguments for want of better he trifled with at portsmouth , was not to answer them : for , tho mr. chandler says in the page before , that dr. r. advances the very same arguments against the practice of singing psalms , which he does against theirs for infant-baptism ; yet he may know in his conscience there were more , and they were all in my opinion so good against his practice of infant-sprinkling , that he was not able to answer them as he should , nor any of the other that were present to help him . but by reason i have told him so before , i needed not to have told it him now again , but that there was some occasion for it ; and i might have added , that i think he and his helpers had rather need to cry to others , come and help us ( as in that 12th page he has the like words ) for the help he has had already , does him little service to overthrow our cause , and to convince mr. webber , and his adherents ( as he calls them ) out of it * . but if others are called to assist him , it may do him perhaps more service , to wit , to moderate him , and make him write more fairly and handsomly of his mistaken brethren , as he counts us . i wish he had kept to that language , and then we had not had all that railery , reflecting , and trifling that was and is used by him . mr. chandler , who was it that trifled with incompleat disciples , you or we ? who gave mr. ridge's matter a full account , you or we ? i know , and am satisfied , that the doctor has given a true account of it , and in his own words , as near as words can be spoken . i heard a gentleman say that mr. chandler was a fool , and deserved to be knocked about the ears ; he ought to have accepted the argument , and given his instance , which himself would have done if he had been there . whatever m. , chandler may suppose , i am sure his refusing to give an instance upon an universal negative ( when so often prest to do it ) neither made for his own credit , nor yet for the credit of his cause : for , it made others conclude he could not do it , and that if he could , he would have condescended to have done it in so publick an assembly , if he had been furnished with any to have given . but the plain truth is , as he could not then give us so much as one single instance for his practice , so he hath not been able to do it since : for if he could , we should have had it . for , in a point of that moment it is a shame for him now to excuse it with this or that nicety in disputation , which ( whatever he may think ) rather shews , that he aims at and strives more for mastery in controverting , than that he himself doth heartily believe his own practice to be scriptural ; for , if he had so done , he would have condescended to any method to clear up that which he preaches for truth , and pretends to have such a hearty desire to convince us of . there was another said , he did not understand what was an incompleat disciple of christ ; and yet he is one that understands an argument ( in my opinion ) as well as mr. chandler , tho he did not then walk with us , nor the other neither . his incompleat disciples are such as the scripture never taught him to call so ; and ( i think ) mr. chandler is grosly mistaken to suppose he has by this trifling distinction salv'd the credit of his absurd way of vindicating his practice , and thereby evaded the strength of our arguments : for , they that are serious and judicious christians can easily discern it to be a fallacious and evasive shift , to cast a veil over the minds of those that are ignorant of this controversy , and do not allow themselves the liberty to examine it : for it is wholly unscriptural , and groundless , and impertinent , as it is applied by him in the case under consideration . but further : what a stir do these men make about the word equivocable : if there were two letters added at the press , or ( to suppose the worst ) that it were wrong spelt , it had been the corrector's place to have mended it . it was very much there had not been more than one error in mispelling in the doctor 's narrative ; for it 's too common a fault in printing . and it is to be observ'd , that there is no errata made to the doctor 's , there being few or no faults in it . but they were forced to make an errata at the end of their own book , which ( by their own confession ) hath more errors in it than they have noted , which they excuse by saying , they can create no difficulty to an intelligent reader : and they also tell us of several letters dropt out in working , &c. which if any complain of , they may charge it partly on the different inclination of the corrector , and partly on the difficulty of bringing our common printers to any exactness . if by a corrector of a different inclination they mean a baptist , the doctor saith he doth not believe it ; for ( if he be not misinformed ) he is a man of their perswasion in the point in controversy : but this he is certain of , that the gentleman who corrected his copy when at the press , is a zealous member of the church of england , and ( to his knowledg ) a contender for infant-baptism ; and yet he must give him this character , that he was very faithful to the trust reposed in him . but an oversight may be by the best of men : but he is under a disadvantage about it where to charge it , because the written copy was never returned . but it is so insignificant a trifle to what ( they confess ) is in their own , that it 's not worth contending about : and certainly it deserved no such ridiculous and base descanting on it , as to call it a word of the famous doctor 's own coining , with other expressions which they in their spleen have vented against him . is this their charity and good-will towards us ? surely , a little charity would have serv'd to have excused so inconsiderable a fault ; especially , when they only guess that he was chargeable with it ; not knowing but it might be an error of the press , seeing there were so many in their own which they boldly charge upon the corrector and printer . but they have not yet done with it ; for they say , if he intend equivocal expressions , they are his own peculiar talent : perhaps few jesuits herein equal or exceed him at that sort of weapon . i cannot but wonder ( gentlemen ) that you should thus proceed in this manner , what can it be that thus moves you to speak against the doctor ? doth this agree with that charity you speak of ( to those you call mistaken brethren ) in the beginning of your book ? can you think that he deserved that character from you ( when you call to mind with what coolness of spirit , and evenness of temper he behaved himself , during the whole time of the disputation ) i appeal to your own consciences whether you think he deserved such an uncharitable insinuation and severe reflection ? doth this also agree with mr. chandler's short request , p. 2. that god would grant that truth may prevail ? surely , this doth not shew you had any design it should prevail upon the doctor , and upon us , either then or since ; for your practice contradicts your expressions hitherto . i know not what you may do for time to come : but if you go on as you have begun , i fear you may give the government occasion to repent of allowing the liberty you speak of : at least you may have cause to repent of allowing your selves such a liberty as ye do against us . who was it that trifled about the mother of our lord being a believer , you or we ? and who fairly improved it to the world , you or we ? what reason had mr. leigh to allow the eunuch to be a christian , and consider him as such , altho ( as he faith ) he was but a proselyte of the gate ? and yet in p. 31. to deny ( in his sense ) the virgin mary to be a christian , and represent her a jew , distinct from that of a christian , and that christianity in that sense had then no being . there were many believers in christ throughout the several ages of the world , both before the jewish oeconomy , as well under it , witness enoch the 7th from adam , who prophesied of him , jude 14 , 15. and were not abraham , isaac and jacob , with all the rest mentioned in heb. 11. with many others , true believers in christ ? this you know is not to be denied . and are not all true believers in christ real christians ? and shall the mother of our lord be denied this appellation ? when the holy scripture calls her a believer in christ , luke 2. from v. 30 , to v. 35. where it is thus written , and blessed is she that hath believed : and mr. leigh then confessed it . the answer therefore mr. williams gave to your demand was good and proper , altho you thus trifle with it since , and change the word from what was then spoken : for , by what hath been said you may see that if it had been the word christian , as it was not , yet if she was a believer , then a christian ; for all true believers in christ , whether jews or gentiles , are disciples ; and you know the disciples were called christians . and altho that name was first given at antioch , yet they had the thing before the name was brought into use , and imposed upon them . and altho they then offered , upon giving you such an instance , to give us the cause : yet i do not think they were willing either then or now to give it us , for they have no mind to part with their practice ; for , if they had , they would not have used such poor shifts as they have done to support it . and amongst other artifices they have made use of , this was one , to send a certificate ( before their book was printed ) down to froome by the hands of thomas smithwick and hugh wats ; and i doubt not but the men are so honest , that they would not bring such a thing , if it had not been given them so to do : and the world shall have it in the same words as i had it delivered to me in my own house . mr. chandler's and mr. leigh's certificate . these are to certify all whom it may concern , that dr. russel's narrative of the portsmouth disputation is full of palpable notorious falshoods , and that there are many alterations , additions and omissions , even from mr. samuel ring 's own copy which he hath honestly given to us . we can procure the hands of vast numbers both of the church of england and dissenters , and some anabaptists themselves , that will acknowledg we obtain'd an intire victory . the governor and mayor have promised their testimonials , but being both now at london , we cannot send them at present , but shall publish with all convenient speed a full answer to dr. russel's book , with the attestations of the principal gentlemen present : therefore we humbly desire all persons would suspend their judgment of this matter till they have a view of our answer . signed by sam. chandler , will. leigh . portsmouth , june 1. 1699. and now i hope , reader , that mr. chandler and mr. leigh will not be angry for spending our judgment upon their narrative , themselves giving us that liberty , as ( i suppose ) is implied by this certificate : for , altho it was sent to their own friends , yet it being directed to all whom it may concern , i have reason to think it concerns me . but i am sure it did concern them to make it appear that the doctor 's narrative was such as they have represented it to be , which i am certain they have not yet done . had they procured those vast numbers both of the church of england and dissenters , and also some anabaptists ( as they are pleased to call us , tho they know we disown both the name and the thing thereby signified ) that would have acknowledged under their hands , that our antagonists had obtained an intire victory ; and if upon examination they had been found to be persons of credit and reputation , such as they promise by their certificate , then they would have gained more by that , than they have done by all those undue reflections they have cast upon us : for , such a course of procedure serves rather to convince the sober and judicious , that they have taken this method to blast our reputation , because they knew not how otherwise to evade the force of our arguments against them , nor to justify their own practice of infant-sprinkling : for that had been their proper business , if they could have done it . they say in their certificate , the governor and mayor have promised their testimonials . the mayor's we have not , nor yet the governor 's , to any thing more than what relates to that first advertisment that was put into the post-man ; and i expected they would have done as they promised . gentlemen , will you thus adventure to charge the governor and mayor with promise-breaking ? i think that to be worse than to give his honour a diminutive title ( as you phrase it ) and to give the mayor a title that is thought ( by some ) to be above him . that will not repair the damage he may sustain in being represented by you as a promise-breaker . but i think he is more a man than to do such a thing as that , notwithstanding what you say in your certificate . as touching colonel gibson i do , and shall thank his honour for staying till the dispute was ended ; and also those gentlemen that perswaded him to it , if that which is said be true , that they told him , if he went off there was danger lest the provoked multitude should do dr. russel some mischief : but this ( like other things ) depends upon their bare affirmation , and how much credit may from thence be given to it , we must leave to the reader to consider . for my own part , i have so much charity for the church-of england people there present , that i cannot think , by any thing i could observe , that they had the least inclination to do the doctor any mischief . and as for our own people , i am sure they had no cause for it , if we take the doctor 's argument as it is in it self , separate from mr. robinson's perverse misconstruction and misrepresentation of it . but as the doctor did , so ( we hope ) we also know better things than what mr. robinson hath abusively put upon the doctor 's words : for we can and do make a difference between the nature of our children , and that of pigs and dogs . but it is their business , and mr. robinson's in particular , to make a difference between what god can do in an extraordinary manner by his immediat operation upon infants ; and what can be done for , and upon them mediately , by the ministry of men , and that before they have the use and exercise of reason : for they know his argument was this , if infants are capable to be made disciples of christ by the ministry of men , without the use of reason ; then the beasts of the field are also capable . but the beasts of the field are not capable : therefore infants are not capable . now , as i may appeal to the judgment of all sober , judicious and unprejudiced christians about this argument , without supposing that any of them will put such a construction upon it as mr. robinson hath done , that it carries with it a full comparison without exception , betwixt the human nature of infants , and the beastly nature of brutes ; when they do but consider that it was used by way of retortion only : so i may also appeal to the consciences of mr. robinson and his assistants , whether they could possibly imagine from hence , that the honest intent and meaning of dr. russel's argument was such as they represented it to be , in pag. 75. of their book : as having thereby set our infants upon a level with brutes , and that there is no difference between our children and our dogs ; and this to be his fixed opinion , as they express it : and this after he had declared himself so fully to the contrary in his printed narrative . for , altho they might pretend to have forgot what he said about it in the dispute ; or , their passion might have hinder'd their understandings from being imployed as they ought in their attendance upon it ; yet when they had it before them in print , wherein he hath vindicated himself from such a misconstruction , i cannot see but they must needs know his true intent and meaning therein . and , for my part , i believe all that read this argument , and consider what the doctor hath said about infants , will be of my mind : especially if they consider what mr. williams said concerning infants , that they had a right and title to glory by the free grace of god , and the righteousness of christ . and let me add but one thing , that they are made meet for it by the work of the spirit , which ( to us ) is altogether secret . but it never came into our hearts to imagine any such priviledges to be intended as a donation for the beasts of the field . and if after all this , these men shall still persist in it , and charge either the doctor ( or any of us ) as they do him in their narrative , that it is our fixed opinion , that there is no disparity , no difference , no unlikeness at all between our infants and the beasts of the fields , notwithstanding all that hath been said by us to the contrary , how can we help it ? but this i desire the reader to observe , that in pag. 76. where these words are , there are also words which they cite out of his apology , that will testify in their consciences that he allowed a disparity : and that the parity implied in his argument was only in a certain respect , as hath been already mentioned . but what may not uncharitableness and ill-will do , when such men are resolved to pervert the words of him they contend with ? and altho you talk never so highly of your charity in the beginning of your book , yet your words and actions to the contrary make it appear to be no other than an empty sound . for , a small measure of true christian charity would have enabled you to discern that gross uncharitableness and ill-will against the doctor , which you have so often discovered in your reflections on his narrative . what mischief therefore it should be supposed the multitude should do the doctor ( as you intimate , pag. 75 , 76. ) i know not ; nor yet from whom it should come , unless from your own party : for the rest of the people were very civil to us , they made no disturbance at our going off , nor any attempts when we were in the street ; altho all the thanks they have from you is , to call them the provok'd multitude . whereas , if it had been true , the blame must have lain upon mr. robinson , who did use his endeavour to provoke them ; but as it was altogether without cause on our part , so it proved to be without success with respect to the people , who departed in a quiet and peaceable manner . the church of england hath less reason to be offended with us than with you : for , we deny nothi●● to their children , that we allow our selves to do for our own . if their children are sick , we pray for them , if desired , &c. but it is you that put an affront upon those of that communion by your practice : for , whereas you say you baptize the children of believers , consider'd as such ; and yet some of your party have made some scruple of baptizing those whose parents are not members with you ( as i have been inform'd ) do you think that all parents in the church of england are unbelievers ? and altho you profess to have a large latitude , it may be more than others of your brethren ; yet you do not often baptize their children , which gives some seeming intimation , as if you made such a distinction betwixt your children and theirs . for our parts , we look upon our children to have no more from us by generation , than the children of others have from them . and i dare not say ( as you intimate in your book ) that the line of election runs to the believers seed . for , i know many that have been converted , and yet their parents ( to all visible appearance ) were unconverted . nay , the children have been instrumental in the hand of god , for the good of their parents : and ( on the contrary ) some godly parents have had very ungodly children , to the great grief and sorrow of their souls . now therefore , if there was any cause for the multitude ( as you call them ) to be offended , it is most likely to be at what you said ( and not what the doctor then said ) that you should look upon them as unbelievers ; for so you do by your practice and writing , tho other things are pretended by you . i would not have any think i am against the doctrine of election , i hope i own it as a truth : and when your children and mine come to be regenerated , it is a sure character they were elected . and whereas you talk of the parents faith being imputed to their children ; i must tell you plainly , i have heard of the righteousness of christ being imputed , but never that the faith of the parent was imputed to the children before . it may be you will say , you do but suppose it ; or , why may it not be so ? it 's the same method indeed that mr. chandler takes in his sermons : but in my judgment , it is a way to make men turn atheists and deists , and to ridicule all revealed religion , to make the holy scriptures a nose of wax , to serve your turns . i beg of you for time to come , to leave off such ways and methods , and to argue upon a firm and more certain foundation . but you proceed further in your certificate , and say you will give a full answer to dr. russel's book . if you had perform'd your promise herein ( as you have not ) i do believe i should have been of your mind . neither have you been so good as your word in giving us the attestations of the principal gentlemen then present at your intire victory , unless by them you mean mr. smith , mr. maultbey , and mr. will. wallen , whom you produce as witnesses in your book : and if so , how can these be the principal gentlemen present ? and if they are , where be the attestations under their hands , that you obtained an intire victory at the dispute ? or , is there any else hath done it ? we find no such in your book . i would have you that are so rigid in charging dr. russel's narrative as false , by reason of some omissions ( as you say ) in it ; ( whereas he was not willing , if he could have done it , to trouble the world with all those passionate expressions that past from mr. robinson , or others , that were of little concern to the world , lest he should have made it swell into too great a volume ; even as i my self think it not convenient to make this my writing swell with the several remarks that might be made on many other passages of your book , lest it be made too chargeable for the purses of our poor people . ) i would , i sav , have you and others consider whether the same objection doth not fall as heavy upon your selves , seeing you have not performed your promise under your hands , but have omitted to give us those testimonials : but i suppose you were not able to obtain such a testimony from those gentlemen , or else we should have had it in your book . but there is one thing i would remark , which is this , that in p. 70. of your narrative , you use this expression , that false lie. now altho i do not allow your charge to be true , yet suppose it had , could not you , by all your learning and skill , have found out an expression less liable to exception ? pray , sirs , when did you ever read or hear of a true lie , that you tell the world this is a false lie ? are there any lies that are not false ? now i think this deserves as much notice as that of the addition of a letter , and much more . and yet how strangely did you improve that against the doctor : but i shall not deal so by you . thus , reader , i hope i have made it appear how our antagonists have no reason to boast so boldly as they have done of a victory at the dispute . but whereas on the other hand , they charge it as an egregious falshood on dr. russel , p. 64. as if he had boldly published amongst and by his friends in london ( tho not in his narrative ) that he , to put it out of doubt , and his friends had carried the day at portsmouth , added , the bishop of salisbury had received a letter from colonel gibson , wherein he applauded our performance . now for the undeceiving of the world i think good further to add , that i charged the doctor with this report ( for which his said enemies call him in the place aforecited , a falsifier of reports ) but he told me he never said so , nor thought so , and therefore it must rest upon the asserter , till he can bring forth his evidence that the doctor said so , and that it was from thence that such a report has spread abroad . however , this may serve as another instance of their spleen and virulency against him , and how eager they are to snatch at any thing to asperse him , and to render him little , yea to degrade him in the highest manner . and hence it is that they cannot forbear to trifle with his being a graduate , as in the last quoted page : wherefore for the satisfaction of some persons that may have read their reflections on him and his degree , i shall here add the certificate following , together with some other certificates that i have lately procured , or have been sent to me out of the country . whereas it is render'd doubtful by the presbyterian ministers in their account of the portsmouth disputation , whether william russel be a graduate doctor in physick of the famous university of cambridg : these are to certify whom it may concern , that we whose names are under-written have seen his diploma , with the seal of that university thereunto affixed ; and concluding with these words , dat. cantabr . in senatu nostro . given in our senate at cambridg , june 11. 1688. witness our hands , william salmon , francis salmon , john wells , james halsey , edward jarvis , john sharpe . i have also seen a book , entituled , a register of the doctors of physick in our two vniversities of cambridg and oxford , printed anno 1695. diligently and carefully collected out of the registers of both those universities ; beginning at 1659. and ending with 1694 inclusive : with the names of those that were created doctors in physick during that time ( which is 35 years ) placed both in an annual and alphabetical order . in both which i find dr. william russel's name inserted in its due place and order . from whence it is evident that dr. russel is in the right , and themselves in the wrong : and also it serves to discover another mistake of theirs , which they ( through their ignorance ) charge upon him , viz. for saying the senate at cambridg , which they call a word of his own coining , and do greatly ridicule him for it ; whereas it appears by his own diploma , that the vice-chancellor , doctors and heads of colleges , &c. ( when assembled ) do call themselves a senate . besides , the doctor doth assure me that the king's letter was thus directed : to our trusty and well-beloved , the vice-chancellor of our university of cambridg , to be communicated to the senate there . so that it appears to me it is the common appellation given to them ( as that of convocation else-where ) altho these men are so ignorant as not to know it , or so malicious against the doctor , as not to allow it him . it therefore gives cause of doubting , whether either of them ever saw ( in a true and proper sense ) the inside of any university in their lives . here follows mr. bowes's letter , wherein he hath vindicated himself from mr. chandler's unjust and scandalous reflections . from stubinton , sept. 29th , 1699. much honoured and beloved brother russel , to whom grace , mercy and peace be multiplied , through our lord jesus christ . these lines come from your brother in the faith of our lord jesus , thomas bowes , and are to inform you of the horrid falsities that are inserted in mr. chandler's pretended narrative , which he would fain have the world believe is impartial , tho indeed it is no such thing : which i hope will evidently appear to all men who are not prejudiced , especially when the falseness of what he hath writ concerning me and others is made manifest . for if he will adventure so grosly to belie his neighbours , who can disprove him , and have opposed him to his face ; no wonder if he belie the dispute it self , and the disputants , rather than hazard his own interest , which seemeth to lie at stake . i shall now give you an account of those things in particular concerning me , which may be found in his book , that are most notoriously false . and take them as followeth , viz. in his introduction near the latter end , he is bold to assert , that i and my party did suspend from our communion one isaac harman a joyner , for hearing mr. webber , which is horridly false : for there was never any such-thing acted by me and my party in this world towards that young man , nor any other person , for going to hear mr. webber . this man hath but little regard to truth it self , that he can boldly charge this notorious falshood upon me and my party , without being able to produce his author for it , when it was required of him . he hath indeed confidently asserted , that the young man told him so himself . but the truth of this is like some of the rest of his impartial narrative . for the young man went himself , with one of our friends with him , to the meeting where mr. chandler had been preaching , and there charged him with the falsness of what he had written , to his face before many of his hearers ; and did then offer to attest upon oath , that he never had one word of discourse with him in all his life time , neither about that nor any thing else . and mr. chandler did consess before those then present , that he could not say he had . yet so unchristian-like was their carriage to him , that at his first appearance mr. williams , the presbyterian minister , bawl'd out , and said , where is this man that fears neither god nor devil ? to whom the young man replied , that he had a soul to be saved as well as mr. williams , and did fear god as well as himself . but that well qualified man mr. chandler , did in his fury lay hands on him in such sort , that his own hearers cry'd out , pray mr. chandler do not strike him . but alas ! this great flood of heat was soon turn'd into the cold ebb of dissimulation , when they saw that way of stirring made them stink . for the next evening mr. williams sent one of his hearers to isaac harman , and desired him that he would come to his house , and have some talk with him in a moderate way ; and did acknowledg he was sorry that he should carry himself in such a passionate way to him the night before . to this the young man complied , and went to his house , where mr. williams treated him with many hollow compliments . now it was , mr. harman : but the night before he cried out , that he neither feared god nor devil . but when he saw he could not obtain his end by flattery , he told the young man he would have him put into the post-boy . but i wonder mr. chandler should be so forward to ride post , since the baseness of his horse , and his own infirmities have so often brought him to the ground . but again , in his introduction he is pleased to charge me with no less than four more as great lies as is possible for any man to pen. for , 1. he asserteth , that i applied my self to mr. ring for a sight of those sermons which he had writ ; which is utterly false . 2. he is bold to say that i read them , which is a horrid falshood ; for i never read them in all my life time . 3. he saith , i having read them , spake words to this effect , viz. that if we suffer mr. chandler thus to go on , it will prejudice our cause . but this is as false as any of the rest : for i never spake those words to mr. ring , no , nor to that effect ; which mr. ring must witness , if he be not biass'd , and will but speak the truth : but if he will not , they that were with me at that time will justify that i spake no such words , nor to that effect . and it is as false that mr. ring replied , mr. chandler takes but the same liberty in his own congregation that we do in ours ; for he never replied so to me . but ( perhaps ) mr. ring will give him leave to bely him and the truth it self , rather than by opposing him hazard his own interest , and the loss of a place at his lecture . but i shall not give him leave so to bely me , tho indeed he hath the confidence to take it . 4. and lastly ; ( tho indeed these are not all the lies he is guilty of concerning me ; yet , i hope , it will be the last time he will venture so grosly to abuse me , and so greatly to sin against god ) mr. chandler doth also tell the world , that i was a man dissatisfied , and went over to gosport to mr. webber , which is a notorious lie ; for i never went to mr. webber , nor ever sent to him about the disputation first nor last : yet this man would have the world believe that what he hath written is truth , and so deceive himself and them too ( in the end ) that hearken to him : for nothing can be more false concerning me , than what he hath writ for truth ; and therefore i shall charge those lies upon mr. chandler as some of his own inventing , till he doth produce his authors , which ( i believe ) is as hard to bring forth , as the young man that told him he was suspended , and asked his advice about it ; for as yet he is invisible . and i cannot imagine where he will find authors for such forgeries , unless he bespeak them . for i can attest upon oath that all those things are utterly false and groundless , and therefore ought not to be called mistakes unless there had been something in them . again , he is also pleased to say , that if i could believe the doctrine of original sin , as they believe it , i should think infants had need of baptism : and , that i wonder'd that the people at gosport should be against it . now whatever i did say , i can safely declare that i never spake what mr. chandler hath written : and so i told him to his face , and did offer to make my oath of it . for if i had said what they have written , i should have wronged my own conscience , in saying that which i did not then believe , nor do yet believe ; but i am sure that he hath wronged himself and me also , in saying and writing that which i did not , nor could not speak . but alas ! any thing that does but drop from the goose-quill of this man ( tho it be never so false ) is good enough to please those that follow him ; with whom i leave him till the judgment day of the great god , where he and i must give account of all things . but if he in the mean time hath any thing to object , i am his neighbour , and shall be ready to make good what i have charged upon him , by more than a single testimony . witness my hand , thomas bowes . here follows a further testimony , signed by the principal brethren of the church at portsmouth , to prove mr. chandler a false accuser in what he hath printed about isaac harman . we whose names are under-written do testify , that isaac harman was not suspended from our communion for hearing mr. webber preach , nor for any thing else . witness our hands , thomas bowes , isaac harman , edward fishbourn , james goodeve , william oakely , walter addis , george kelley . mr. william leddel of gosport's vindication . here follows an account of those mistakes and falshoods they have presumed to charge mr. leddel with , and his vindication of himself therefrom . sir , having received your letter , i can do no other than reply for my self . i was willing to contradict that prophetick remonstrance of being charged to be a man of heat without light. and should i at first sight have declared my thoughts of their proceedings , i might ( perhaps ) have written passionately , considering how they have endeavoured to cloud that which ( through providence ) hath so many evidences to the contrary . i believe truth will have its time to be made apparent . i shall not say much as to what past in the disputation , but rather endeavour to acquit my self from forgery , which i am charged with , especially with relation to what mr. smith hath said in his certificate , or testimonial , which he hath inserted in the 60th page of mr. chandler's , mr. leigh's , and mr. robinson's impartial account ( as they call it ) of the portsmouth disputation . blame me not for putting him last who should have been first , because not nominated in the preliminaries , and mr. leigh comes in by chance . but as to what mr. smith hath there declared to the world , some of it was then said , but not in that form , nor at all to that purpose , except that clause wherein he now lets the world know he had an imperfect account . for having accidentally met with mr. smith at his own habitation , he was pleased to thank me for putting his name in print , which i then took as an ironical speech . i then discovered to him the place where the words were spoken , but could not perfectly remember the day of the month ; whereupon he concluded , that if i did , he had forgotten it ; but i hope his forgetfulness is not argument sufficient to prove i did not . and this i can say , that altho there was but one time that i so directly desired the sight of his copy to compare it with that i had , yet both before and after i desired the sight of his ; and at that time i told him the reason thereof , which he also in his certificate or testimonial denies : yet altho he hath forgotten the other times wherein i desired him to let me see his copy , or see it when it was done , this does not prove it a lie , or that he was never spoken to about it : for if it had been so , what cause was there for that needless excuse of mr. leigh , that it not being transcribed was not fit to be compar'd , because i might take advantage therefrom ; and that such things ought not to be communicated to an enemy ? as if it could not be compared with the copy that i had , nor to such a person whom they knew was adverse , and would improve what was there related to their advantage . i must ingenuously confess i did not tell him it would be printed ; but i then told him , i knew not but it would be printed , tho i was not then positive my self . now if mr. smith would but recollect his memory , he might call to mind that i spoke oftner to him than that time in his shop . it 's true , that about two or three days after the disputation i was willing ( for peace sake ) the whole should have been buried . but to return to mr. smith , i cannot but wonder what should protect him in giving the world that account of the anabaptists loose and shuffling way of arguing , which gave such interruption to the better taking of what past in the dispute . i cannot but retort this upon him ; the anabaptists ( so called ) might have had as civil treament among heathens . but that mr. smith should insinuate that he retorted this to me , and received no answer , it must be supposed i was not so hot a man as their learned rabbins have reported me to be . but i cannot find fault if i have no light : and since they have all the light , there can be none left for me . their opponents are also accounted by them blockheads and dunces , as they then gave out , and have upon occasion still asserted . i am not willing to bring names into question , only i can't but reflect upon those great trophies of art , and profound academics , which were the great maintainers of that unscriptural , not to say antiscriptural notion of infant-baptism : altho i might , seeing their elevated profundity hath not so much as taught them good manners ; calling ( at least ) their fellow-creatures , if not their equals in all good science , fools , blockheads , liars , and sophisters . how incongruous these titles are , tho they had been never such learned academicks , may appear to those who have but only common sense . they seem agreed to carry on their contracted conspiracy , tho it be against the declaration of heaven . but further , pray , worthy sir , must your forgetfulness be charged as my lie ? why may not you be under a mistake in this , as well as you are in that clause of your certificate , where you pretend the imperfection of the account was occasioned by the anabaptists loose and shuffling way of arguing . for don't you know , when brought to the test , your party could not be kept within bounds ? nay , hath it not been defended by the pastor you sit under , ( mr. john earl by name ) that we deserv'd no better treatment at your hands ; and yet say we occasioned the obstruction of an intelligible account to the world ? pray , sir , the next time you get one to abet your cause , be so kind as to instruct him better in what you would have him say . for w. wallen to attest he was present when i came to you , and yet not know any more what passed then , is strange ; or , if he did , why was he no fuller in his relation ? as to what he says that relates to the time of transcribing your copy , as it 's little to the purpose , so it looks as if he had been your minute companion , and had known i had never spoken to you but once . and notwithstanding his attestation , i remember that you told me , that tho it were not done , yet you had begun it , and should make an end of transcribing it in a little time ; yet never was so kind to let me see it , till it was calculated to your own meridian . but among other things , i wonder you should be so unhappy , as to discover your own weakness to the world , in upbraiding others of fallaciousness , and yet could not keep your self clear . for to pretend you had compared this with mr. maltby's and your own , which you call originals , and that you found it exactly agreable thereto ; and that the one should not stoop lower , nor the other be raised higher ; i can't but fear you have conspired together in a lie : and have not only endeavour'd to insinuate it to be a truth among your own friends , but also to the universe ; for it seems to me no less than a miracle . but what shall i say , when men care not what they say , nor whereof they affirm ; since 't is well known that mr. smith knows little of the greek , if any , and less of the hebrew , whatever mr. maltby does : and that your copy should so exactly agree to a tittle both with mr. maltby's , and what is printed , i must leave the world to judg . but since nothing can be taken for granted but what we have time , and place , and witness to : it will teach me for the future to take a witness when i shall have occasion to treat with mr. smith , or any other of them upon such occasions . for as to the proof of this , it depends upon my yea , and his nay ; i not thinking in the least this would have been so material , as to have given them such an occasion to ground their cause upon , which was so lamely defended . this seems to be but like a man that is in danger of being drowned , who will catch at a feather , which when caught can give him no support . upon what i have remark'd , there is reason enough undoubtedly to shew , that mr. smith's certificate ( by which he would convince the world ) is fallacious . and as to what mr. chandler , mr. leigh , and mr. robinson speak about this matter , neither the annexed testimonial , nor yet what is in the second side of dr. russel's dedication , saith any such thing ; but saith , tho it was desired , could not be obtained . and i william leddell do here attest that it was compared with another copy , whose it was is yet unknown to me to this day , but was acknowledged by mr. leigh as before : and that acknowledgment does not want witness , mr. james goodeve being present at the delivery of a letter sent to mr. leigh by mr. walter addis . now what occasion there should be for a concealment , tho in the character it was written , besides the reason alledg'd by mr. leigh , i know not . sir , i think it not meet to animadvert upon all their reflections and opprobrious speeches with reference to my self , i not being academically learned ; but i desire to learn more of christ , and to concern my self less with those persons who are in a sphere too high for me , that count themselves great , and all others shrubs , because they have not attained to a like stature in human literature . and let this pass as my reply to what they have said in reference to me , not being in so great a heat but a little water may cool it , provided it be not foul . william leddell . but , sir , since i thought i had done , casting my eye upon the third page of mr. chandler's introduction , i saw as absurd a passage under my name as any passed in the whole book , contrary to an account that i gave him my self touching matthew caffin : altho then mr. chandler's business was ( as he pretended ) to know the truth , that he might not err in what he was going about , with reference to matthew caffin's lying under such a report of denying the humanity and divinity of christ . but i having no light , and mr. chandler having such eyes as to see where none is ; he is , for ought i perceive , creating light out of darkness . for he saith , that i and some others , men of heat without light , were very urgent to accept of matthew caffin for their champion . for i give this as my testimony , that i my self ever refused matthew caffin to have any hand in it . but what spirit actuates mr. chandler i know not , that he should not care what he saith . and when i see so many untruths couch'd in one paragraph of his introduction , it 's a plain indication of those many that follow , for there they are crowded in heaps . but if mr. chandler had told me who were my companions , we might then have gon to isaac harman , whom he recites ( tho falsly ) to have led us to him , to have borrowed some light from him , as he ( falsly ) says isaac harman did . now , sir , pray be so kind to your self , as to conceal your paths ( for they are dark ones ) and let not blind men tread on your heels . i hope you will be more careful for the future , and not let men with no light ( tho as yet you have found but one of them ) see into the very crannies of your wilful and woful mistakes . as to the truth of my refusing matthew caffin , i could bring many witnesses : and i never knew but one person who was for him , which mr. chandler hath happily mist , and is never like to know for me . this is all at present from your brother in christ , william leddell . here follows an account of some of those falshoods they charge upon dr. russel , in their pretended impartial account of the portsmouth disputation , and his answers thereunto . brother sharp , forasmuch as you have taken in hand so good a work , as to vindicate the truth of that narrative i supervised and published concerning that disputation at portsmouth , wherein our well-beloved brother williams and your self were also engag'd ; i thought meet to send you this following account , to free my self from those calumnies , the publishers of that false and abusive account of that disputation have undeservedly cast upon me . 1. in pag. 57. they say that i mention'd constantine the great as a scripture instance . i answer ; this they know to be false : for at the same time i refer'd them to the history of the first five hundred years , and alledged it only to prove matter of fact from the testimony of the fathers ; which mr. leigh accordingly understood , or else what made him give this answer , what do you tell us of the fathers ? we are not bound to abide by their testimony . see p. 35. of my true narrative . 2. in pag. 61. they say , it 's false that mr. chandler's sermons were the occasion of the dispute , and much more that this is agreed to by them . to this i answer : i have no more to do than to confute them by their own pens . my words are these . it is agreed on both sides that mr. chandler's sermons were the occasion of that offence taken by you ( speaking to mr. bowes , mr. webber , and the churches to whom they belong ) and of the dispute it self , as appears by the preliminaries , &c. now that this is true , appears from their own pens . for in the title page of their own account they have these words : an abridgment of those discourses that were the innocent occasion of that disputation . and in pag. 2. an abridgment of those sermons that were the innocent occasion of the disputation . now in both these places they confess what i say to be true . for i only say they were the occasion thereof , without so much as telling them whether it were an innocent or nocent occasion . but , 2. i can prove it under the hands of mr. chandler and mr. williams of portsmouth : and for that i refer you to the preliminaries themselves , which were read publickly before all the people , and assented to by both sides , as you have them truly printed in my narrative , pag. 3 , 4. but omitted in theirs , which begins thus . whereas by mr. chandler's late preaching on the ordinance of baptism , several persons have taken offence ; and upon desire of satisfaction , it 's mutually agreed between us whose names are underwritten , that these two points be amicably disputed in the following order , &c. samuel chandler , francis williams . i had that very paper delivered to me in mr. williams's meeting-house at the time of the dispute , which they signed with their own hands , and have it still by me to witness against them . and strange it is , that these men should have the confidence to deny what is so solemnly delivered under their own hands . but perhaps they thought i had lost that paper , and should not have been able to detect their false accusation any other way . and this seems to be the true cause why they were so unjust as to omit putting down the preliminaries in their printed account , that they might not confute themselves under their own hands . 3. in the same page 61. they say it 's false that mr. robinson should in the midst of the dispute give me the lie. 1. pray observe : this is a falsifying of my words , which are these . he said in the midst of the dispute with a loud voice , that is a lie. but i did not tell them he said so to me : and under this subterfuge they might suppose to shelter themselves in their denial . but , 2. i do know that he did say as i have printed it : and if my word may not pass for it , i have divers to testify for me . mr. webber , pastor of the church at gosport , being with me in london , sept. 6. last past , i asked him about it , and he affirms it to be true , that mr. robinson did give me the lie , and that there were witnesses enough could testify that ; for he being mounted in the pulpit at a distance from the rest of his brethren , there could be no mistake about it . see the truth of this well attested in mr. sharp's account . 3. they confess that mr. leigh did give the lie. now i did not accuse him , but mr. robinson only ; and ( i hope ) mr. leigh's confessing that he gave the lie , doth not prove that mr. robinson did not : but it doth prove that they were a couple of ill-bred , unmannerly presbyters , to say no worse of them . 4. i must now charge them with a notorious falshood which they have printed against me , in these words . this bold gentleman hath published amongst and by his friends in london ; dr. russel to put it out of doubt , that he and his friends had carried the day at portsmouth , added , the bishop of salisbury had received a letter from colonel gibson , wherein he applauded their , i. e. the anabaptists performance . to this i answer . 1. that i never heard of any letter at all sent to that bishop by colonel gibson , till i read it in their printed account . 2. i never said so to any person whatsoever : and i challenge them to produce their evidence , for till then it must be charged upon themselves . 3. i neither knew nor thought that colonel gibson had been such a zealot for their cause , to trouble himself to send letters to two bishops ( as they say he did ) in favour of them , till i read it in their printed account ; whereas , had he not been extremely biass'd , he might have known better than to have sent up such an advertisment as they say he did to put into the post-man . but mr. robinson confesses that he was the informer , who waited on the bishop to tell him this false and malicious story . and whereas he saith , that his lordship generously allowed them to make use of his name for the undeceiving the world in this matter : and whereas it plainly appears it was to deceive the world , i hope his lordship will for the future have a care how he gives credit to one that hath thus imposed upon him in such a confident manner , with such a notorious invented story of his own making ; and by that means give occasion to have his name printed , in their false and scandalous account . 4. this may well give his lordship ( and all others ) a just occasion to suspect the narrative they have published ; for if they can allow themselves such a liberty to print such notorious falshoods as these are about matter of fact , what reason is there to believe them in any thing they say ? and if mr. robinson will but be so just , as to present his lordship with my true narrative ; upon comparing both together with our vindication , i doubt not but he will have other sentiments of that disputation , and be sufficiently convinc'd of their partiality and prevarications . 5. they charge me for abusing mr. gosnold in these words : 't is as ridiculous as to abuse his dear friend , and prefix false greek as a title to his book ; when at least in that edition we have seen , there is only a plain english title , of the doctrine of baptisms . 1. 't is they that abuse me : for the very first words in his title are , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , in that edition published by himself . if others that reprinted it since his death have left it out , 't is their fault , not mine . 2. it 's true and proper greek , as they themselves confess , unless the apostle paul wrote false greek ; for they say the letters are the same heb. 6. 2. so that they must not charge mr. gosnold with it , but the apostle paul. are not these bold men , to charge paul with writing false greek ? 3. their pretence is false : for that learned man mr. john gosnold did know how to distinguish between the nominative and genitive case , and so do i. but they must throw this reflection upon our translators of the bible , and upon paul himself , or rather take it to themselves as a false accusation , to whom it properly belongs . 4. mr. gosnold doth not treat of the baptism of water alone , but of all the three baptisms spoken of in scripture , viz. that of water , ( which is a real baptism ) and that of the spirit , and also that of affliction , as metaphorical baptisms . and as the greek is true , so the title of his book is the most proper that could be thought of , the doctrine of baptisms . 5. as to that for which this charge is brought , they pretend they gave the answer there recited in the time of the dispute ; whereas they know 't is an invented answer of their own , made on purpose to sham off the matter to which it relates . but that is a small thing with them , for they have done so throughout their pretended account of the disputation ; wherein they have most egregiously abused the world. 6. in pag. 75. they let us know their memories are short with respect to what i set down in pag. 35. of my narrative , where i say , i do not remember that there is any account in history , during the first five hundred years , that any one of the fathers , or eminent bishops of the church , that were born of christian parents , were baptized until they were about twenty or thirty years of age : and if any of you know the contrary , i desire you would shew it . upon which mr. leigh answered , what do you tell us of the fathers ? we are not bound to abide by their testimony . and notwithstanding i then made a full reply thereto , yet these men tell the world , they do not remember that it was mentioned in the disputation . but the thing they could not remember was , to find out an instance to the contrary : for that they have not given us , neither then nor since , which they would certainly have done if they had known how . but they pretend to remember that which was never said nor thought by me , viz. that for the first six hundred years infants were admitted to communion in the lord's-supper . and this i must charge upon them as utterly false , and an invention of their own . but it is true , that from austin's time for the space of five or six hundred years the supper was given to infants ; and both that and baptism contended for as necessary to salvation : for which austin had that name given him of pater durus infantium . and this is so well known to the learned , that these men will but discover their ignorance in denying it . 7. they have wholly altered the state of the case , as to what mr. chandler said upon dan. 4. 33. for whereas he asserted that the word in the septuagint translation was baptizo ; i denied it , and told him it was ebaphe : but that if it had been as he said , it was nothing to his purpose , because it was not originally written in greek . upon which he said , baptizo comes from tabal . i asked him then , how it was in the hebrew in that place ? he answered it was tabal : which i denied . and after i had seen the place , i told him it was not there . see p. 54. of my narrative . and at last mr. chandler confest it was not . and they all allow it in print . nevertheless in their own account , p. 82. they say , that to try my skill in the hebrew , who had so shamefully faulter'd in the greek , i was asked what the hebrew word was , and that i said , if i had an hebrew bible i could tell . now this i must charge upon them as an invention of their own : and his friend mr. ring can testify that i had made my observations upon that place in dan. 4. 33. and sent them to portsmouth in a letter , and received an answer from him before i came down to the dispute ; and had examined the place upon the occasion of a passage upon it in mr. chandler's sermon , upon the word tabal , and therefore knew what mr. chandler said was false before i came from london : so that i did not stand in need of a hebrew bible to examine that in the time of the dispute . but i have cause to suspect that mr. chandler had not examined it himself , but made use of some other , who did not rightly inform him : for altho it be in v. 33. in the english bible , it is not so in the hebrew , but in v. 30. and altho i knew it , i was no more obliged to teach him that , than i was to instruct him in the difference between the hebrew and chaldee words in the book of daniel . but it was my business to force him to acknowledg before all the people , that what he said was false ; which accordingly he did , and hath since done in print . and as for that silly sarcasm of theirs , that hebrew bibles are all misplaced with him ; for we hear from good hands ( they should have said from lying hands ) that at havering in essex , he was confounded with the same place , and could not find the prophecy of daniel . i answer ; first , i had but one dispute at essex , and that was in the parish-church at avely , with mr. pomfret and mr. yaylor ; and there was no mention made of this place in daniel , either by them or me . 2. there was no hebrew bible produced , nor was there any occasion for it : so that i must return this story to the father of lies , from whence it came . and that the world may see that what i say is true , i shall insert the following certificate , written by persons of known integrity and ability , who were present at that dispute ; which was obtained by your self , and sign'd in your presence . we whose names are under-written do testify , that at the dispute at avely in essex , between dr. william russel and mr. samuel pomfret , concerning the baptizing of infants , there was not any mention made of hebrew words , nor any hebrew bible spoke of , nor produced , for there was not any occasion for it , their dispute being more about the subjects than the manner . witness our hands , john lowke , joseph jackson , cornelius denne . octob. 13. 1699. there are several other things that deserve to be remarked , but because they will occur in my observations upon the dispute it self , and their reflections upon it , i shall take notice of them as they occasionally present themselves in my following observations . some observations upon their dedication . by dr. william rvssel . they dedicate their scandalous pamphlet to the honourable major general earl , governor ; colonel john gibson , lieutenant-governor of his majesty's garison of portsmouth ; and the worshipful henry seager esq mayor of portsmouth . 1st . these men quarrel with me for calling colonel gibson deputy-governor , when themselves acknowledg that major-general earl is governor . is not deputy-governor as honourable a title as lieutenant ? if they think i speak too diminutively of him , can they suppose they have mended the matter in presuming to yoke their worshipful esq henry seager , who drives that common trade of a baker in the town of portsmouth , with such honourable persons as the other two ? is this all the respect and honour they can afford to give them ? 2dly . they say , we humbly lay these papers at your feet . surely they have reason to trample upon them in disdain , when they find themselves intituled to such a false and scandalous pamphlet . 3dly . they say , who procured for us a grant from his majesty , publickly to vindicate the common cause of the reformed churches . 1. infant-sprinkling is the thing you must intend . how then came you to decline the vindication thereof , and refuse to give so much as one single instance for your practice , altho you were often call'd upon to do it ( in the time of the disputation ) both by mr. john williams and my self ? 2. how comes infant-sprinkling to be appropriated ( by you ) to the reformed churches ? surely there are others in the world practise that , besides those of the reformed churches . are you so ignorant , as not to know that all the papists in france , spain , portugal , germany , poland , italy , and rome it self ( the seat of the whore of babylon ) do practise infant-sprinkling as well as you ? how then have you the confidence to tell these honorable persons , and the whole world , it is the common cause of the reformed churches ? whereas it is notoriously known , that it is the common cause both of papists and those you call reformed . 3. if it be appropriated peculiarly to either , it must be to the church of rome ; for you know that the reformed churches did receive it from her , and have retain'd it as one of her relicks to this day . for they have no scripture authority for it . 4thly . they say it tends very much to the advancement of early piety and religion . 1. if they believe themselves , why were they guilty of so great a sin of omission , as not to vindicate their practice when they were so often prest to it , and yet could not be prevailed upon to give any scripture instance for it : and would not so much as try their skill ( when so fair an opportunity was put into their hands ) to prove their own practice , and thereby settle those that are wavering among them ; notwithstanding they pretend it was the thing for which those honourable persons procured for them a grant from his majesty ? but , 2. how the sprinkling a little water upon the infants faces , and calling that baptism , should be to them an occasion of early piety and religion , is sooner said than proved . it seems to me rather to have a contrary tendency , especially your telling them when they come to years of understanding , that by their baptism they are put into a new covenant-relation , that you have dedicated them to god , that they are in a state of salvation ; that those who neglect it , have no more reason to hope for the salvation of their infants than the heathens ; but they must only leave them to the unfathomable depths of god's goodness , having no promise to rely upon , p. 11. that they are solemnly admitted by baptism into the visible church ; ( how this agrees with mr. leigh's argument from mat. 19. he would do well to consider ) that they are the more special objects of the promises of grace ; that the vein of election frequently runs in the channel of believing parents , and their seed ; and that if they die during their infant-state , they shall be saved , pag. 8. add to this what is said in their preface , that the covenant of grace does fix the terms upon which christ will be a saviour to any ; that thence only it is to be known whom he will save , and whom he will not . now unless these men will deny the doctrine of final perseverance ( as held by the calvinists ) they do rather give those children an occasion from hence to neglect the most important duties of the gospel . for , why should they repent and be baptized in the name of jesus christ for the remission of their sins , if they are baptized already , and their sins all pardoned , and this pardon sealed to them by sprinkling a little water on their faces ? why should they believe in christ , that through him they might have an interest in eternal life and glory , if it be secured to them already another way ? why should they work out their own salvation with fear and trembling , if it be secured and sealed to them already , by what you call baptism , without any possibility of miscarrying ? for they say , that if such die in their infancy , they shall be saved . now , do they not hereby do all that in them lies to perswade such persons , that if they had died in their infant-state , they should have been saved by being in the covenant of grace , and in the line of election ? and can they ( after all this ) sin themselves out again , and become reprobates ? i thought you presbyters had been of another mind . can you put them ( whilst infants ) into the covenant of grace , and turn them out again ( when they come to be adult ) as you think fit ? i cannot imagine you do believe your selves when you thus write ; nor can you ever think to gain us to your party by such inconsistences as these : for we know that the decrees of god are immutable , and it is not in the power of any creature to alter them . and we also know , that you cannot ( from your own principles ) be at any certainty who are elected , and who are not ( whilst in an infant-state ) till such time as they come to be effectually called . and seeing you do not believe that all infants dying in their infant-state shall be saved ; because you tell us , that you leave such as die unbaptized to the unfathomable depths of god's goodness , there being no promise to rely upon : i must now needs discern the cloven foot , notwithstanding your sham pretences to cover it : for unless you did think that the sprinkling of infants is necessary to salvation ( notwithstanding those deceitful expressions in your preface ) or ( at least ) did doubt within your selves , whether any unbaptized infant could be saved , all this you talk of is but insignificant trifling . and you had better deal plainly with the world ( as one of your brethren did ) to let them know , that if he must baptize no infants but what he knew to be of the number of the elect , he must not baptize any ; for he did not know what infants were in the covenant of grace , and in the line of election , and what were not : for , i believe you know as little of the matter as he , altho you seem so unwilling to confess it . but if you neither baptize them , as knowing them to be the elect of god , nor yet in the covenant of grace , how can you say they are in a state of salvation , and that if they die in their infancy they shall be saved ; except you did conclude ( as austin did ) that the baptism of infants is necessary to salvation , and that they are actually brought into the line of election thereby , and made the children of god , and heirs of glory ? and if so , then free your selves from the papists opus operatum , if you know how . is this the way to early piety ? surely no. for if they were not sprinkled in their infancy , and afterwards told by you ( or others ) that it was a sufficient baptism ( altho in truth it is no baptism at all ) they might then be easily prevailed upon to submit to the baptism of christ . and when they are taught that repentance from dead works , and faith towards god were to precede baptism , and to fit them for it : and that baptism is an initiating ordinance , without which they cannot be true members of the visible church of christ : and that they must be dead to sin , before they were buried with christ by baptism : and that after they were baptized , they must walk in newness of life . this were a more probable way to incline them to that great duty of remembring their creator in the days of their youth ; and to promote and advance early piety and true religion in their hearts and lives . but so long as you shall tell them that they are made disciples of christ as soon as they are born ; that they were made christians , members of the church , and enter'd into the new covenant by what you did for them when you sprinkled them with water : this hath a direct tendency to lull them asleep in security , and make them draw this false conclusion , that they were thereby made christians indeed , and so deceive their own souls . for , it is found by woful experience , that many of them who are poor , ignorant , impenitent , and wretched si●●ers ; yet they will be exceeding angry if you do but question their being ( really and indeed ) christians . what ( say they ) were not we baptized in our infancy , and thereby made christians , members of christ , children of god , and heirs of the kingdom ; and do you question our christianity ? now if you will but seriously consider how far you have been the unhappy instruments of the ruin of these poor creatures , by hardning them against the truth , as it is in jesus ; and making them ( like the pharisees and lawyers of old ) reject the counsel of god against themselves by that deception you have put upon their understandings , you would certainly discern that you have made work for repentance , and cannot acquit your selves therefrom , until you do renounce that scriptureless practice of infant-sprinkling , and submit to that holy ordinance of believers baptism , as appointed by jesus christ , and provoke others thereunto . 5thly . but further , in their dedication they appeal to the honourable governor , and to the worshipful baker , as to disinterested persons , and proper judges . as for henry seager the baker , he is no disinterested person , unless this proves him to be such , because when he was mayor , he carried the mace to the presbyterian meeting , and hath gone to it both before and since the dispute , and been a benefactor to them for several years , as is certified from thence . now i can as little suppose him to be a proper judg , as a disinterested person ; because i am well satisfied he is unskill'd in the controversy , and incompetent as to parts and learning to fit him for it : but being worshipful , he would serve their turn to make a noise with in other parts where he was not known , to give a faint colour to a fading cause . 6thly . but the most amazing passage in it is this , that they should have confidence to tell the world , that their account ( they give of the dispute ) is true and impartial : that it is what was taken by the pens of the scribes , without any material alteration : whereas they know in their consciences it is not so , as may be made appear in due place . 7thly . and whereas they talk of disorders in the time of the dispute ; they also know there was nothing of that kind committed by us ( notwithstanding their repeated provocations ) but all of it by themselves , and their own party . themselves were certainly , guilty o● great incivilities in giving the lie , in their missing , and making such a noise that we could not be heard : which was so far from being a sign they were willing that truth should take place , that it was an evident demonstration of the direct contrary . i now come to make some observations upon the account they give of the dispute it self : by which it will appear that it is a false and partial account . 1. they have left out the speech i made in the beginning . 2. given no account of mr. chandler's beginning with prayer . 3. the preliminaries agreed upon , and read publickly , they have wholly omitted . 4. mr. chandler's apology to the people , which he calls his prologue , they have alter'd : for i have carefully examin'd mr. ring 's copy , and i find it there verbatim as i have put it down in my narrative . for , 1. he puts pride before vanity . 2. adds doctrine . 3. leaves out the new testament . 4. there is a transposition and omission of other words , which i pass by . 5. mr. chandler hath alter'd the words of the first question to be disputed . as first , he hath left out and saviour , hath put only before are . and instead of and not infants , he hath put in these words , or their infants also ; which alters the state of the question . and in the second question he hath put in this instead of the , and wise instead of ways ; and it is the more remarkable , because it differs not only from mine , but from that written copy signed by mr. williams and himself : so that it must either be a heedless or a wilful act. 6. the speech i made upon mr. chandler's repeating the questions , is part of it left out , and the rest alter'd . 7. in what follows they have left out a whole sentence , and put down words of their own framing ; and have wholly omitted what i say about the manner of disputation . 8. they put down my first argument by halves , leaving out these words and saviour in the major ; and have not expressed either the subjects or baptism in the minor ; and also left out the conclusion . is this your impartial narrative ? 9. in his first answer to this argument he leaves out commanded , and in the room thereof he puts in expresly , and by name , which is not in mr. ring 's copy . 10. he leaves out my whole reply to him , which contains nine lines ; and is as pertinent a reply as any in the dispute : but i suppose the reason was , because the whole synod of presbyters that met to contrive this account , were not able to answer it . but to hide that from the reader , he makes a reply of his own framing , as if then spoken by me ; which is directly contrary to what mr. ring hath in his copy , as spoken by me , when mr. chandler denied my minor . so that it must be wilful , because they had mr. ring 's copy by them : for i spoke affirmatively , as mr. ring truly saith , and not negatively , as they say . the words i spake , as you may see in my narrative , pag. 8. beginning , are these . by denying the minor , you say that christ hath some where required some of his ministers to baptize infants , which agrees with mr. ring 's account . but the words in their printed account are these . russel , then you suppose that christ hath no where required it . what can be more contrary ? 11. mr. chandler is brought in giving a negative answer , when it was not he , but mr. leigh that gave the answer ; and i have put it down verbatim in my true narrative , as it is in mr. ring 's copy , viz. mr. leigh , we distinguish between consequential truths , and express words ; whereas they have brought in mr. chandler saying , no , &c. is this fair dealing ? to change both the person and the words also : yet this they have done . 12. they have also transposed and altered much that follows in that page , and have left out about twenty lines ; particularly that parallel i made between an ambassador and a minister of christ , with relation to our lord 's great commission , which they have wholly omitted . 13. they have left out mr. chandler's words in answer to mine . what , from the commission ? and yet these words are in mr. ring 's copy , altho omitted by them . 14. they also omit mr. robinson's words to mr. chandler , who cries out , hold ! dr. russel must prove it by a universal negative . and this they know is in mr. ring 's copy . 15. they also omit my answer to mr. robinson , viz. then mr. chandler must deny some part of my argument , which i have not yet been able to prevail with him to do . this also is noted in mr. ring 's copy , but they take no notice of it . 16. here again they repeat my argument partially , leaving out that part of it which should give the common reader the greatest light , and best information about it . 17. here ( i am well satisfied ) they abuse the dead : for they bring in old mr. williams , saying that which is neither in mr. bissel the town clerk's copy , nor in mr. ring 's , nor in the old gentleman's ; whereas it 's evident , it was long after that before mr. john williams did engage in the dispute . the words they note as said by him are these , any way . but why must this be done , and marked with an asterisk ? why this seems to be the motive , that they might make their observation upon it ( in a break made on purpose ) before the words were , any where . a wonderful observation ! but more of this hereafter . 18. they bring me in speaking thus , it 's all one to me , so you prove the thing , prove it any way . upon this they observe in a break made on purpose ( that which is utterly false ) viz. he is attempting to shift the opponency . where were these mens wits when they made this observation ? pray observe ; this was before ever mr. chandler had so much as fixt upon any direct answer to my first argument , as appears by their own printed account . and in the following words they bring him in saying , i deny your minor . from whence the reader may perceive that i was so far from shifting off the opponenc● , that i was pressing him with all my might to give his answer ; and that i gave him all the scope he could desire : for i allowed him to do it by consequence , or any other way , which way he pleased . but you see the impertinency of these men , that when i was opponent , and he respondent , they must trifle away so much time to know of me how i would allow them to prove infant-baptism ( according to the stated question agreed upon on both sides long before ) when they should take upon them the opponency : for till then it was no part of their business , but a mere shuffle to spend time , lest they should ( by a universal negative ) be forced to assign an instance for their practice from scripture , which they knew was impossible for them to do . 19. they bring me in saying , i prove it thus , only i would let the people know what you say , viz. that christ hath some where required his ministers to baptize infants . their note upon it marked with an asterisk , is this : somewhere . the word is again alter'd from any way to somewhere . a worthy observation for a classis of presbyters ! but this was not my answer , but an invented one of their own : for my answer was this , by denying the minor , you say , that christ hath somewhere required some of his ministers to baptize infants . and this i did , that i might give those people to understand what we were then upon , who did not know what was the difference betwixt the major and minor , and without which they might have been ignorant of what we had intended in our way of arguing . 20. when i called for a plain denial of ( any ) one part of my argument , even what part he pleased ( as themselves word it ) their observation in a break is this , the doctor now seems unwilling again to allow scripture-consequence . this is to abuse their reader : for it was not mr. chandler , but my self , that was opponent ; and therefore there was no room for him to urge consequences till it came to his turn . 21. yet in the next words they bring in mr. leigh undertaking the opponency , which they confess he ought not to have done . but he only talked of it , but did not do it , for he knew it was a task too heavy for him , and so waved it . now there is not one word of all this in mr. ring 's copy , nor in mr. bissel's , nor in mine : and i am well satisfied there was not one word spoken by mr. leigh at that time . 22. upon mr. chandler's denying the minor of my universal negative , they have falsified my answer , and made it quite another thing . for , whereas i say to him , hold , sir , it is an universal negative , you must give your instance , &c. which are the words in mr. ring 's copy . they bring me in , saying , it 's an universal negative , you must prove it . now i did not call upon mr. chandler to prove my argument , as they do slily and disingenuously insinuate ; but i call'd upon him to give his instance where it was so written in holy scripture , that christ had required any of his ministers to baptize infants ; which i then told him ( and do still affirm ) he ought to have done , otherwise we might argue ad infinitum . and this mr. leigh knew right well ; and therefore he bids mr. chandler offer me the commission for an instance , as themselves have confessed in their printed account . but mr. robinson ( they tell you ) opposed it : for he knew there was no such thing exprest in the commission , and did in effect give away the cause of infant-baptism at once : for his words are these , ( as recited both in mr. ring 's copy , and my true narrative . ) mr. robinson , you must prove it still . suppose mr. chandler cannot give an instance , nor no body in the company , you cannot thence infer that none in the world can . 23. this also they have falsified , and set down in their printed account a fancy of their own invention . they have put in mr. leigh , who was not then mentioned by mr. robinson , and have left out these words , nor no body in the company . now they know it was urged upon them all , and desired that if any one of them could give an instance , they would please to do it : and yet none of them could be prevailed upon so much as to attempt it . surely the new testament is not so large a volume , but either mr. chandler , or some other of those ministers that were present ( whose number was said to be about five and twenty or thirty ) might have been supposed to have read it all over , and to have known where such an instance had been written , in case any such thing had been contain'd therein . what , are they all so ignorant of the holy scriptures , that not one of them can tell what is written in the new testament about holy baptism ? how then can they be fit to teach others their duty concerning it ? i must therefore once more take the liberty to tell them , that when there were so many men of parts and learning together ( as there then were ) if none of them are able to give us one instance from scripture for their practice of infant-baptism , we cannot expect that any body else should . it 's much to me , that instead of mr. chandler's old sermons , pick'd out of other mens works , they had not tried their skill to have attempted some instance from scripture for their practice , seeing they sat brooding upon their narrative so long , as not to suffer it to come abroad till more than six months were past after the dispute . surely they might have found it out in all that time , if it had been so written in the new testament . if therefore mr. chandler's sermons are esteemed by them as their ne plus ultra , we must conclude they have nothing of that kind to produce , and therefore must cease for time to come ever to expect it from them . 24. here they have thrust in matter never spoken , and transposed and mangled what was spoken , and have formed it according to their pleasure , without any regard had to truth or justice . for , ( 1. ) they have made a speech for mr. robinson that he never spake , and another for mr. john williams , p. 5. and i appeal to mr. ring 's copy , for there is not one word of either of them there , nor in any one of the other copies i ever saw . ( 2. ) they leave out ( almost ) a whole sentence of mine , and use their art and skill to deceive the reader by making a stroke , as if it were left out by the scribes : whereas in that part they recite , they had mr. ring 's copy to inform them , and therefore must know that they did not put it down right ; and so have wilfully misrepresented me to the world. their words are as follows . rus . i would have these honourable persons here present to consider that i am under great disadvantage — you are to give an instance . what my words are you may see in pag. 8. of my narrative at the lower end ; they are too long to recite : for my whole answer to mr. robinson contains twelve lines , and theirs is contained in two lines and a half . is this agreable to their title , an impartial account ? ( 3. ) their transposing and altering . for my next words ( which agree with mr. ring 's account ) are these : mr. chandler , this is only a trick to turn off the opponency . dr. russel , what do you talk of a trick ? i hope you are able to give an instance of what is your daily practice . but instead thereof they put down this false account . rob. this is your popular argument to shift the opponency , and turn it upon the respondent . 1. here is a change of persons , rob. for chandler . 2. they proceed as they began , and make a speech for me at their own pleasure : and thus they go on till they come to the next page . this is a practice they have great cause to be ashamed of , when ( at the same time ) they pretend to give an impartial account . 25. in pag. 6. they bring me in , saying , i am sure , according to the rules of dispute , mr. chandler must prove the negative . this i must charge as another falshood upon them : for my words are these ; if you say you have no scripture-proof for infants baptism , i have done . but why must you prevent mr. chandler ? i hope here are some honourable persons , and others that understand the nature of this controversy ; and they may reasonably expect that those who have made such a noise about it , can give some tolerable instance for it : and if they will do that , we will proceed to examine it . it is therefore evident , that here is not any thing like what they report ; so that if i charge them with down-right forgery , they must bear with it , for they knew that my words were according to mr. ring 's copy , and that they had abused both him and me . 26. they have again alter'd mr. robinson's next answer , and framed words for him that were not then spoken , as appears by mr. ring 's copy , which i have truly recited in my narrative , to which i refer you . 27. here they give an invented answer again ; rus . so i design if there be no answer given : whereas my words are ( as mr. ring hath noted ) i have proved it , till you give your instance ; which they know to be the true sense of what i have put down in my narrative . 28. chand . here is an answer , i deny the minor . now hear what mr. ring saith . robinson . if you will change sides , mr. chandler , you may admit this trick . in this they have both changed the words , and the persons speaking . 29. they have also invented an answer for me , directly contrary to mr. ring 's copy . 30. they have invented a speech for mr. leigh , of which there is not one word in mr. ring 's copy . 31. here they have transposed mr. robinson's words , and left out the one half of them , as they are in mr. ring 's copy . 32. here they have brought me in answering mr. robinson thus : this is no changing sides ; for i do not design to quit the opponency , only let him bring an instance . whereas i have truly represented the answer i gave in p. 9. of my narrative , according to mr. ring 's copy , where you will find that the answer was given in other words ; and not to mr. robinson , but to mr. chandler . 33. but why must this be put in here ? they tell ' you , the doctor 's design even now was to turn the opponency on us , as i can prove ( saith he ) from a letter of mr. john williams : but now he will not quit the opponency , and yet expects a scripture-proof for infant-baptism . to this i answer . ( 1. ) that no man in the world could have known this , if i had so designed , for i never said so : and it 's god only that knows the heart . ( 2. ) i do now tell all the world ( as i then told you ) that i had no such design . ( 3. ) what you say of ( the deceased ) mr. john williams is utterly false : for he hath not so written in his letter to mr. leigh , altho he hath the confidence to tell the world that he can prove it from mr. john william's letter . for i have a copy of his letter writ by himself , and signed with his own hand , and there are not those words , that i designed to turn the opponency upon you , as you say . the genuine sense of his words is , to let you know what you might have done to have shewed your parts in the vindication of your beloved practice , if you had given an instance when i run you upon it by an universal negative , and said you ought to have done it according to the rules of dispute : and that the world may be satisfied herein , both mr. john sharp and mr. williams his sons have caused it to be printed , as containing such things in it as are of use to the publick with relation to the disputation . 34. they have introduced mr. leigh making a formal speech , of which there is not one word in any of the copies i have seen . but in mr. ring 's copy , mr. robinson is the speaker , which agrees with my narrative . but why is this done ? the reason seems to be this , 1. to darken the peoples understandings , that they might not discern their fallacy . 2. to throw the reflection off from themselves , and cast it ( as much as they can ) upon dr. smith ; for which he hath no reason to thank them . the question ( they say mr. leigh put ) was this : i desire , sir , you would declare , whether dr. russel be not obliged to prove the negative he hath asserted ? now , as i do not know any thing of it , so there is not one word in mr. ring 's copy , neither of that nor any thing else that mr. leigh spake at that time . but if mr. leigh had so spoken , there had been as little sense in it as was in mr. robinson's words , when he called a negative an affirmative . but any thing serves to veil over a bad cause . for , to set this in a clearer light , i will give the reader a view of the first argument , and shew him how i brought them to that issue upon it : and i might have forbore to have argued with them any longer , unless they had given their instance . arg. 1. if christ hath no where required any of his ministers to baptize infants , then the baptism of infants is not according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ . but christ hath no where required any of his ministers to baptize infants : ergo , the baptism of infants is not according to the commission of our lord and saviour jesus christ . mr. chandler , after divers shifts and evasions about the major , says thus , i deny your minor . my answer to him was , by denying the minor , you say that christ hath somewhere required some of his ministers to baptize infants . this being by them allowed , i did proceed to make good my minor thus . if christ hath any where required any of his ministers to baptize infants , it 's somewhere so recorded in the holy scriptures . but it 's no where so recorded in the holy scriptures : ergo , christ hath not any where required any of his ministers to baptize infants . upon this ( after a question put , and a distinction upon it ) mr. chandler said , i deny the minor : my answer was , then you say it 's somewhere so recorded in holy scripture . i therefore argued thus . if it be any where so recorded in holy scripture , mr. chandler or some other person is able to shew it . but neither mr. chandler , nor any other person whatsoever , is able to shew it : ergo , it is not any where so recorded in holy scripture . whereupon mr. chandler said , i deny your minor . now by denying my minor , i appeal to all that understand an argument , whether in so doing he doth not assert , that he or some other were able to shew where it is recorded in holy scripture , that christ hath required any of his ministers to baptize infants . and this is to go their own way . but i told him it was an universal negative , and therefore he must give his instance where it is so written , but could by no means bring him to it ; and the reason was because he had none to give ; and till he doth , my argument will stand good , as i then told him : for otherwise we may argue ad infinitum , and never bring any thing to an issue . and i do once more challenge them to produce one single instance for their assertion . after a tedious discourse upon it , mr. robinson said , i appeal to any that understand logick , whether this be sufferable for him thus to turn the opponency upon mr. chandler ? then dr. smith stood up and said , if i must speak , then by your leave , according to what i always understood , he that asserts must prove . whereupon i answer'd , then they having asserted that infants are the subjects of baptism , they are to prove their practice , especially when they are forced upon it by an universal negative : we desire but one single instance , and they will not assign it . 35. but when they pretend to recite dr. smith's words , they deal as unworthily by him as they had done by me : for they bring him in saying , according to the rules of disputation , negantis non est probare ; or , asserenti incumbit probatio . he said the one , or the other , they tell you : but they do not so much as pretend he said both . what must the reader conclude from hence ? but that they did not , or would not know what he did say . for by the same rule they say it was this , or that , and are not certain which it was , it might as well be neither ; but only what i have said according to mr. ring 's copy . and thus after they have wracked their brains to evade the force of this argument , on purpose to shift off the giving an instance out of holy scripture for their unscriptural practice , they have only fulfilled the old proverb , parturiunt montes , nascitur ridiculus mus . for , if he had said , negantis non est probare , he that denies is not bound to prove , as they would perswade us he did , what advantage would it have been to them ? i was upon the negative , and had issued my first argument by a universal negative , which can never be invalidated without an instance : certainly then ( according to that ) i was not obliged to prove my denial ( but the● to give their instance ) for i had proved that before by such arguments as they were not then , nor yet since have been able by all their learning to confute . but themselves are doubtful whether dr. smith said so , and therefore tell us , if he did not say that , he said , asserenti incumbit probatio , which is the same with what mr. ring 's copy saith : he that asserts must prove . but i do not believe he said either of them in latin ( not that i doubt of his ability so to do , for i have heard a good character of him from a physician , who said he knew him in the university ) for , as i my self know not any such thing , so mr. ring , who hath several times took notice of the greek words spoken both by me and them , only sets down dr. smith's words in english : and whoever observes my answer , must needs know that i understood it so , by telling them , that they having asserted infant-baptism , ought to prove their practice , by shewing us where it was so written in the holy scriptures ; we demanding of them but only a single instance , by which the controversy would have been at an end . so that they have labour'd in vain , and spent their strength for nought ; leaving the multitude ( as they call them ) as wise as they found them , and so they are like to remain ( so far as i can perceive ) if they expect satisfaction from them . for they that want light themselves , cannot impart it to others . 36. here they sham a forgery upon me , bringing me in saying , well , what must i do ? as if i had been at a loss what to say , and must ask them to direct me ; whereas they know in their consciences , i did not use to be at a loss to answer them , when three or four of them have very uncivilly fallen upon me at once ; but it pleased god to keep me in a composed frame of spirit , and to assist me under it beyond what i could have expected . but suppose i had been at a loss , can the reader think i would have told them so , and ask'd their advice what to do ? this is as improbable a story , as mr. chandler's lying invention about isaac harman , wherein he was disproved to his face before divers of his hearers . but however , he is unwilling to be brought to confess the truth , but instead thereof ( in their second edition ) seems only to make a weak excuse , by saying a silly woman told him so ; when he had reported the story in print as a thing of his own knowledg : and to close his story , he tells us he shall no more trouble the world with personal matters , but give pilate's surly answer to all such , what i have written , i have written . but to come to the matter in hand , i know what they have said here to be utterly false , and contrary to mr. ring 's copy , as they also know : but i perceive they are resolved to say any thing , tho never so untrue , and against their knowledg , to avoid the shame ( if they could ) of being baffled in their cause at the disputation . 37. again , they bring in another invented story , and make mr. robinson to speak what he did not speak , and dr. smith to be of his mind . i must here vindicate dr. smith again : for , if their own story ( as i have before observed ) be true , that mr. leigh should ask him this question , whether dr. russel be not obliged to prove the negative he hath asserted ? and he should answer as they say , negantis non est probare , he that denies is not to prove ; with what fairness could he tell the world that gentleman was of his mind ? and this they doubted would be discovered , and therefore they did not only put the words in latin , but leave an excuse if they should be detected , by declaring , if he did not say so , he said otherwise , as is before noted . 38. he doth also misrepresent my words in telling the world i said , how do you mean prove , & c ? i have no such words , nor any thing like them . but seeing they have invented a reply for me , i desire they would answer it also . they say , the total silence of scripture in this matter is proof . if i had said so , there had been no reason to have denied it : for i acknowledg the assertion to be true , tho not then spoken by me . but it may now be expected they should make some answer to it that might inva●idate it ; but they only set it down , and then run away from it . sirs , i desire you seriously to consider , what you have said herein against your own practice : is it not a part of divine worship ? is it not that holy ordinance of baptism as instituted by christ , that is the matter ( in general ) of our disputation ? and is it not about the subjects in particular that we were then speaking of ? and were not you called upon with great earnestness , and pressing importunity , to give us but one instance where it was found written in the holy scriptures , that christ had required any of his ministers to baptize infants ? and do you ( after all ) tacitly acknowledg that there is a total silence of scripture in this matter ? surely it is time then for you to quit your practice , if the scripture says not one word about it . and if mr. robinson's supposition be allow'd , it must needs be so . suppose ( saith he ) mr. chandler cannot give an instance , nor no body in the company ; you cannot thence infer that none in the world can . to which i answer'd , this is in effect to give away your cause , when there are so many men of parts and learning present ; for if none of them are able to give us one instance from scripture for infant-baptism , we cannot expect that any body else should . and yet all the answer they gave , was , to tell us this is only a trick to turn off the opponency , notwithstanding i told them the direct contrary . surely this is no better than tricking in them , thus to fence against those solid reasons and arguments that none of them are able to answer ; and yet have the confidence to tell the world in print , p. 66. that all the arguments we offer'd were trifling cavils . is this your impartial account ? 38. here they have left out several things that past betwixt me and mr. chandler ; which they have past over with a total silence , because they did not make for their cause , but against it . is not this great partiality ? 39. they bring in mr. robinson saying , if you can proceed no farther upon this , then it 's time you go on . now this is also untrue ; neither is there one word of it in mr. ring 's copy . but the words he saith i told them , are these ; if you will say no more to this , i will proceed to another argument . and they know , right-well , that i urg'd this , that if mr. chandler would confess he had no instance to give , i would then proceed to a new argument . and further , that upon his refusal so to do , i did challenge the rest of them to give an instance ; and provok'd them to it , telling them , that if they refused to do it , the people would think they had none to give . and yet none of them could be prevail'd upon to do it . whereupon i spake to this effect , gentlemen , it may be you think i have but one argument ; if you will say no more to this , i am not willing to tire the auditory , i will therefore proceed to a new argument . but take notice ( by the way ) that my first argument stands good till you give your instance to the contrary . and all this they wholly omitted in their printed account , because ( perhaps they thought ) it would have been sufficiently evidenced how shamefully they had been baffled and put to silence before the people , for want of one single instance for their practice . here i desire the reader to take notice , that i am not yet fully advanced so far as three leaves and a half in their printed account of the disputation ; and having discover'd so many errors in so little a compass , it amazes me to think what was become of these mens-consciences , who could contrive an account to publish to the world , with so small regard to truth and fidelity ; when at the same time they send it forth with that plausible pretence of an impartial account . what may the reader expect to find in the whole body of it , if there be so many faults in the very entrance ? but i have other business , than to attend to the remarking of all they say of this kind : for , if i should do that , i must write a much bigger volume than is proper upon this occasion , there being so many errors committed by them throughout the whole of their book . in p. 65. they confess , that mr. fox was baptized by dipping . he was dipp'd ( say they ) not at gosport , but havant . it is not said by mr. duke that he was dipp'd at gosport , that observation therefore was needless : but that he was dipp'd , they confess , which is the thing asserted by him . but they say 't is false that it was done by mr. chandler's advice , for he was then at london : now it doth not follow that mr. chandler did not give such advice , because he was ( as he saith ) then at london ; for i have receiv'd a testimony to prove it , under the hands of two witnesses . mr. leddell writes thus , i shall further annex one testimony touching mr. fox , which was spoken ( the same day the preliminaries were made ) out of mr. chandler's own mouth , which take as followeth . we being enquiring , why they should deny our practice , and yet practise it themselves ? we then had , and several times since have had this concession from them ; that to satisfy a scrupulous conscience , they could dip any adult believer upon profession of faith. and mr. chandler did there confess , that mr. earle had advice for the so baptizing of mr. fox , in a letter from him from london . and this ( tho it may not be in the very words ) is the substance of the matter then spoken in our hearing , who were present at mr. williams's house in portsmouth , the 23d of december 1698. william leddell , edward fishbourn . i would further note , that they might have spared their reflection upon our brother duke , if they had but minded these words in my dedication , and by another hand i have this account . and after all , they thus express themselves in their own printed account , pag. 65. but that none of us would refuse to dip a person in such a case , is true ; we never pleading against dipping as one way , but as the only way ; not against its lawfulness , but necessity . how doth this agree with what mr. leigh saith in pag. 51. i deny that the word baptize signifies to dip , in any place of scripture ? but seeing mr. sharp hath already spoken to it , i shall pass it by . i shall remark one thing more , and that is , that these gentlemen are pleased to reflect upon me about speaking false greek : as they have also done upon mr. john gosnold , by saying , i abuse him in it , when they are his very words i recite , and the same words used heb. 6. 2. so that rather than i shall escape their lash , the apostle paul ( whose words they are ) must also be whipt till he learn better , if he come under the tuterage of their unmannerly pedagogue . what , do these men think no body understand greek but themselves ? but after all , tho they do not charge me with printing any false greek in my narrative ( as i perceive ) yet they would perswade the world , that i have got an art to form greek letters in the air , so that they can discern them , when i express them with my voice . and in order to convince their reader , they have put down those greek words wrong in their narrative , which are printed truly in mine , but falsly in theirs . but any thing to render me ignorant and ridiculous , serves these mens turn , tho never so false in it self . but if i were really as ignorant as they represent me to be , as mr. sharp hath already told them , i had been the more easily confuted . i shall therefore commit what i have written to the judgment of the learned and impartial reader , declaring to the world , that my narrative is much more impartial than theirs , and the best i knew how to publish ; which they have only marr'd , and not mended . to conclude : seeing this is so , why doth mr. chandler , p. 19. say , that if we will keep strictly to the significancy of a burial , the person baptized must not walk into the water , but be taken up by the baptizer and thrown into it ? for indeed we baptize the face ( saith he ) and they baptize the head and shoulders too . and ( a little after he saith ) they had need have brawny arms and an herculean strength to do this , speaking of the apostles baptizing three thousand in one day with the help of the seventy disciples ; and endeavours to render the thing impossible . as for the possibility of it i refer you to the learned dr. du-veil's answer to this objection , in his explication upon the place . but as touching the manner of baptizing by dipping , why do you thus quibble about it , and make as if it could not be perform'd aright , if the subject were not taken up by the administrator , and thrown into the water ? it 's confess'd by your selves in print that mr. fox was dipp'd ; and in the account which i have received it appears , that when mr. fox was ask'd this question , whether , when he was baptized by mr. earl , it was done by dipping the whole body under water ? he said , it was ; and that in the presence of four presbyterian ministers , which they do not deny in their printed answer , but say that he was dipp'd . and did mr. earl indeed baptize mr. fox by dipping , as you confess , by saying , he was dipp'd at havant ? i hope he did not take him up and carry ( or throw ) him into the water to dip him ; if so , we may know where to have a man that hath brawny arms and herculean strength . but we do suppose he went with him into the water ( as we do ) and when they were both in the water , mr. earl did then baptize him by dipping , as our constant practice is ; and this they call dipping . and we do not find that any of those four ministers present did object against it , as not being the right manner of performing it . nay , these gentlemen in their printed account do not deny the lawfulness of it , &c. as hath been observed . and why ( after all this ) they should quarrel with us , we cannot understand , when they practise it after the same manner as we do , and call it dipping . i will add the testimony of a learned man to vindicate our practice . lucas brugensis upon mat. 3. saith , the party baptized went into the water as deep as his thighs , or navel ; the rest of his body was dipp'd , not sprinkled . and mr. john calvin saith upon john 3. 22 , 23. that john and christ administred baptism by plunging the whole body into the water : and he confesses the church hath assumed to her self this liberty of sprinkling . but having given them such a cloud of witnesses in the dispute , i shall not here recite them . truth vindicated : being an answer to a dialogue between a pedo-baptist and an anti-pedo-baptist , published by samuel chandler , and william leigh , by the advice of their brethren from divers parts . written by one , who was refer'd to the account of the dispute at portsmouth , &c. for his conviction , but hath since separated from the presbyterians , and now is a member of a baptist congregation . with dr. russel's animadversions on their epistle , prefix'd . printed in the year 1700. some brief animadversions by dr. russel , upon their epistle to the reader . the first thing they begin with is wholly false : for they say , because dr. russel , or some friend of his , did a while since disgrace the press with some scraps of their narrative , stuff'd with nonsense and partiality ; nay , and by its title did delude the vulgar with an imagination , that it contained the true state of the portsmouth disputation ; and the same , how unjust soever , being cheap , hath been scatter'd throughout most parts of this kingdom , &c. to this i answer , that neither dr. russel , nor any of his friends did ever publish any such paper , nor any other paper about the dispute at portsmouth , besides their true narrative , but only an answer to monsieur berault , wherein they are scarcely so much as named . but this paper they speak of ( to use their own words ) was pirated into the world with my name affixed to it , without my knowledg or consent , therefore i am not chargeable with any dafects or imperfections therein , tho they are pleased unjustly to cast it upon me . but any thing will serve your turns to reproach me with , tho never so false and uncharitable : your rage against me , is a plain demonstration of your being baffled at the disputation , tho you have not humility enough to acknowledg it to the world. may not i with as much justice charge the abstract of your account upon you ? but i have more charity than to think so . and whereas you have put an advertisment into the post-man , nov. 7. 1699. to disown it , and say , whereas a twopenny paper hath been pirated into the world bearing our names , and called , an impartial account of the portsmouth disputation , we declare it was printed without our knowledg or consent . and this being the first opportunity we have to print upon this occasion , we have told the world the same that you do ; and therefore those silly reflections of yours might have been spared . there are some such ill men belonging to the printing trade as will abuse any body's works , by contracting and mangling them to get a penny by ; so that the best of authors cannot escape being abused : and if you had but minded your own advertisement , you might have known that without giving me the trouble of this publick way of informing you . as for those needless and vaunting expressions about the strength of the arguments in your dialogue , the reader must be judg of that ; and therefore i shall not anticipate by making any reflections thereupon ; but desire him to consider the answer this gentleman hath given ; and then i doubt not but he will see you had no reason to boast of your strength , before you had obtained so much as a seeming victory . i shall therefore conclude in your own words : we request of them that they would weigh it in the balance of scripture and sanctified reason ; and the lord give them vnderstanding in all things , which is the desire of him , who is a lover of the souls of all men , and of his antagonists in particular , being in charity with them , tho they are not so with him . william russel . truth vindicated . being an answer to mr. chandler's and mr. leigh's dialogue . the first argument ( say they ) the anti-pedo-baptist offers is this . arg. 1. no infants can be made disciples by the ministry of men ; therefore no infants can be the subjects of baptism , according to christ's commission , mat. 28. 19. go teach , &c. ( or disciple ) all nations , &c. in p. 5. the answer they give to it is as follows , i deny your whole argument . in the portsmouth dispute they distinguished on the word disciple , some were compleat , others incompleat ; i perceive the gentlemen are ashamed of their former defence , and it seems to me they are conscious of its weakness ; and now they will be mad in earnest , and deny the whole argument . they assert , 1. if they could not be made disciples by the ministry of men , yet this text would not exclude them from baptism ; but with what reason do they do this ? none at all truly ; and therefore observe how this bold assertion wi